"\u003C!DOCTYPE html\u003E\u003Chtml xmlns:xlink=\u0022http://www.w3.org/1999/xlink\u0022 xmlns:xsi=\u0022http://www.w3.org/2007/XMLSchema-instance\u0022 xmlns:mml=\u0022http://www.w3.org/1998/Math/MathML\u0022\u003E\n  \u003Chead\u003E\n    \u003CMETA http-equiv=\u0022Content-Type\u0022 content=\u0022text/html; charset=utf-16\u0022\u003E\n    \u003Cmeta name=\u0022viewport\u0022 content=\u0022width=device-width, initial-scale=1\u0022\u003E\n  \u003C/head\u003E\n  \u003Cbody style=\u0022font-family:sans-serif; font-size:100%;\u0022\u003E\n    \u003Cdiv class=\u0022HpsHansard\u0022\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000001\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsProceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u002268f2161a941d46749962f846c55b40f5\u0022\u003EThursday, 12 March 2009\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000003\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u00220999cb73e5ff4a62b3f635f103c13d67\u0022\u003EThursday, 12 March 2009\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000002\u0022\u003EMr Speaker took the Chair at 2 p.m.\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000004\u0022\u003EPrayers.\u003C/p\u003E\n    \u003C/div\u003E\n    \u003Cdiv class=\u0022HpsHansard\u0022\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000005\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsProceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u0022a465cebef6694d06845d2fcb54a04349\u0022\u003EBusiness Statement\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000007\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u00220b94b066d95f44d2ae3f8c87a0a2e2e2\u0022\u003EBusiness Statement\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022 data-id=\u00222a6363fe4ea44ae18c1e8b8d7170bfb5\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000006\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00222a6363fe4ea44ae18c1e8b8d7170bfb5\u0022\u003EHon GERRY BROWNLEE (Leader of the House):\u003C/span\u003E Next week the House will be in adjournment, although select committees will continue their business. When the House resumes on Tuesday, 24 March, it is the Government\u2019s intention to progress the Taxation (Business Tax Measures) Bill, the Criminal Proceeds (Recovery) Bill, and other first readings of bills that are to be introduced or that are currently on the Order Paper. That will include the Appropriation (Financial Review) Bill, which will be read a first and second time, with the financial review debate set down for 7 April. Wednesday, 25 March will be a members\u2019 day. However, on that day the general debate will be set aside so that the House can debate the Budget Policy Statement.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00227f8c14fb-b919-46ef-866b-8db68cfa4cf0\u0022 data-id=\u00225f6c9084057445b492418d89bc58e480\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000008\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227f8c14fb-b919-46ef-866b-8db68cfa4cf0\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00225f6c9084057445b492418d89bc58e480\u0022\u003EHon Dr MICHAEL CULLEN (Labour):\u003C/span\u003E I thank the Minister for that information. Could he indicate, given what he told the Business Committee, whether it is the Government\u2019s intention to allow the members\u2019 day to occur on the Wednesday, or whether the Government is considering taking urgency for the introduction and first readings of any bills; if so, which bills?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022 data-id=\u0022fd0bb35f164147efbb24f3ac2716139d\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000009\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022fd0bb35f164147efbb24f3ac2716139d\u0022\u003EHon GERRY BROWNLEE (Leader of the House):\u003C/span\u003E That is a fair inquiry. The Budget Policy Statement debate will take 2 hours, as is set down under the Standing Orders. A members\u2019 day in the normal course would follow that.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n    \u003C/div\u003E\n    \u003Cdiv class=\u0022HpsHansard\u0022\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000010\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsProceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u00221bc7656eff47420e9cff496c56dea151\u0022\u003ESpeaker\u2019s Rulings\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000011\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u00226463a3b8ff294f40bb03be1c494feac4\u0022\u003EQuestions for Oral Answer\u2014Ministerial Responsibility\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022ac169d29-4849-42c2-a4a7-f344fd416503\u0022 data-id=\u00224d15aad960764b58bdf96230c48d2cc7\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000012\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ac169d29-4849-42c2-a4a7-f344fd416503\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00224d15aad960764b58bdf96230c48d2cc7\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Yesterday a question to the Minister of M\u0101ori Affairs was lodged and accepted. The question related to the review of the Foreshore and Seabed Act. Subsequently the Minister of M\u0101ori Affairs advised the Clerk\u2019s Office that he had no responsibility for the review. The question was reworked to ensure that it related to the Minister\u2019s area of responsibility\u2014advice he had received from Te Puni K\u014Dkiri about the membership of the review group. In the House supplementary questions were asked that related to reports the Minister had received about the review of the Foreshore and Seabed Act. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000013\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ac169d29-4849-42c2-a4a7-f344fd416503\u0022\u003EI have reviewed the Hansard and, on reflection, those questions were out of order. Where a question asks about reports received, those reports must relate to a matter for which the Minister has responsibility. The Minister had advised the Clerk that he had no responsibility for the review. Had I immediately ruled those questions out of order, many of the subsequent points of order could have been dealt with much more expediently, and, in fact, may not have even been necessary. I apologise to the House for not dealing with those supplementary questions at the time. However, I intend to follow the practice of previous Speakers in taking a wide view of ministerial responsibility. Unless on the face of it there is no ministerial responsibility, I propose to allow supplementary questions; I will not take the initiative in ruling them out. It will be, as Speaker Burke ruled in 1987, incumbent on the Minister to challenge the validity of such questions.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00227f8c14fb-b919-46ef-866b-8db68cfa4cf0\u0022 data-id=\u00224ba759c1c4a7443abee1c20d88f97090\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000014\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227f8c14fb-b919-46ef-866b-8db68cfa4cf0\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00224ba759c1c4a7443abee1c20d88f97090\u0022\u003EHon Dr MICHAEL CULLEN (Labour):\u003C/span\u003E I raise a point of order, Mr Speaker. Speaking to your ruling, I want to raise a related matter arising out of it. As you stated, the Minister of M\u0101ori Affairs informed the Clerk\u2019s Office that he did not have ministerial responsibility for the Foreshore and Seabed Act, the review thereof, or information contained in any report on the review thereof. I think that raises an interesting issue. Does this mean that it is sufficient for the Minister to inform the Clerk\u2019s Office that he or she has no responsibility for a matter for that to be determinative, or in the end is it a matter for you\u2014because the Clerk\u2019s Office is acting on your behalf in accepting or rejecting questions\u2014to consider? Clearly, Ministers will otherwise find it very easy to avoid questions by simply saying that it is not their responsibility, even though it patently may well be. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000015\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227f8c14fb-b919-46ef-866b-8db68cfa4cf0\u0022\u003EThe related issue is particularly the case in terms of the Ministry of M\u0101ori Affairs and the other so-called \u201Cpopulation ministries\u201D. These ministries have a very wide policy brief. They cover all matters of Government policy relating particularly to the population group with which they deal. So for M\u0101ori Affairs, Te Puni K\u014Dkiri will report to its Minister on matters with any particular relevance to M\u0101ori. The Minister will be expected within Cabinet\u2014or in the Cabinet committee, in this case\u2014to advance views on behalf of that population group in the general discussion. It seems to me that it will be very hard to consider that the Foreshore and Seabed Act does not, in one way or another, have particular relevance for M\u0101ori. It would be hard to imagine a general piece of legislation that is more closely related to the interests of M\u0101ori than that particular Act, because it relates to the issue of how to deal with customary rights claims. Despite one portion of the Act, the reality is that almost certainly only M\u0101ori can make an assertion of customary rights claims in the foreshore and seabed area. It seems to me that we are now in the position where the Minister of M\u0101ori Affairs has a very narrow brief in terms of his accountability to Parliament, and we will find it almost impossible to hold him to account. He may find this satisfactory, but I doubt that the general public will find it satisfactory.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022 data-id=\u002243ca6996132f400796f2cf3ee5b6d84d\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000016\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002243ca6996132f400796f2cf3ee5b6d84d\u0022\u003EHon GERRY BROWNLEE (Leader of the House):\u003C/span\u003E The points raised by the shadow Leader of the House are valid inasmuch as the Minister of M\u0101ori Affairs does have a very wide brief. However, it is not uncommon for different aspects of any particular ministry to be wound up inside some form of Government consideration outside of that particular Minister\u2019s purview. That is quite normal. I note that in the last Parliament questions relating to the foreshore and seabed were not accepted by the Minister of M\u0101ori Affairs but, rather, were referred to the Attorney-General, who, at the time, was Dr Michael Cullen. It is not unusual for Governments to make those choices, and given that answers given need to be consistent with the public good and interest, it surely is for the Government to decide who the best Minister is to represent the Government\u2019s position on a particular issue. All Ministers receive a lot of general advice about matters in other ministries that may overlap their own portfolio responsibilities, yet no one would assume that they have the total responsibility for answering for the Government on those particular issues.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022ac169d29-4849-42c2-a4a7-f344fd416503\u0022 data-id=\u002272428848a96f4d2ca6ef4160037f1ace\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000017\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ac169d29-4849-42c2-a4a7-f344fd416503\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002272428848a96f4d2ca6ef4160037f1ace\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: I do not intend to take more time on this issue today, because matters will be dealt with as they arise. All I have done is pay the House the courtesy of explaining why a difficulty arose yesterday, so that, in the future, should that situation arise, I do not out of the blue rule out of order a member\u2019s question about reports in an area where a Minister has no responsibility. I simply wanted to pay members the courtesy of alerting them to the fact that where the Minister has no responsibility, I should not allow questions relating to reports. In the future, I shall not allow those questions. I am purely today extending the House that courtesy.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000018\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ac169d29-4849-42c2-a4a7-f344fd416503\u0022\u003EI have made it clear that I will take a wide interpretation, as has been the practice in the past, but I make the point that the Speaker does not allocate ministerial responsibilities; the Government does. The Speaker cannot be the judge during question time of whether a Minister has responsibility in a particular area, and that is why it is important that the Speaker does not try to do it. The Speaker cannot determine for every Minister what all his or her responsibilities are, and, at the end of the day, the Ministers in the Government have to advise us if they do not have responsibility in the area. But, as was pointed out yesterday, where a Minister has advised that he or she has no responsibility, then questions are out of order if they seek to ask about reports in an area where the Minister has no responsibility.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000019\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ac169d29-4849-42c2-a4a7-f344fd416503\u0022\u003EI do not intend to pursue this matter further today. It will, obviously, come up as the business of the House goes on. I am merely today extending to the House the courtesy of showing how I intend to treat such situations in the future.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00227f8c14fb-b919-46ef-866b-8db68cfa4cf0\u0022 data-id=\u0022cd196389f1bc46caa5860a28eb2b8dac\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000020\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227f8c14fb-b919-46ef-866b-8db68cfa4cf0\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022cd196389f1bc46caa5860a28eb2b8dac\u0022\u003EHon Dr MICHAEL CULLEN (Labour):\u003C/span\u003E I raise a point of order, Mr Speaker. Can I draw to your attention the important factual matter in relation to this. Mr Brownlee has repeated the statement he made yesterday. In fact\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000021\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ac169d29-4849-42c2-a4a7-f344fd416503\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002277d13b70f9c543b7863bfe2b2eb01401\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Matters that the member considers to be fact are not matters of order, and the member knows that.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00227f8c14fb-b919-46ef-866b-8db68cfa4cf0\u0022 data-id=\u0022533eaf10b6e74846aa7c1618cbedd3aa\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000022\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227f8c14fb-b919-46ef-866b-8db68cfa4cf0\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022533eaf10b6e74846aa7c1618cbedd3aa\u0022\u003EHon Dr MICHAEL CULLEN (Labour):\u003C/span\u003E I raise a point of order, Mr Speaker. In considering your responsibility as Speaker to determine whether a question on the matter of the foreshore and seabed is in order, you might care to take into account, for example, Hansard, Volume 616, at pages 11820 and 11870, and at least eight other references in the 2002-05 Parliament, where questions on the foreshore and seabed matter were put to, and answered by, the Minister of M\u0101ori Affairs.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000023\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ac169d29-4849-42c2-a4a7-f344fd416503\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002248ecd50344474ea6a621406f5f4e30c9\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: I take the member\u2019s point.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n    \u003C/div\u003E\n    \u003Cdiv class=\u0022HpsHansard\u0022\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000024\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsProceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u00227a0b5763aff64fa5b650c1ba070a0e09\u0022\u003EQuestions for Oral Answer\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000025\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u002257eb7529a24a403cb86b245374475289\u0022\u003EQuestions to Ministers\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000026\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u002276e561df32ab44e6bbd40897e95e7696\u0022\u003EEconomy\u2014Recent Developments\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000027\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022659f6556-09a1-4ead-bc52-05cbdb4eaab8\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002223124181f4f84d46b91a844652f6b374\u0022\u003E1. CRAIG FOSS (National\u2014Tukituki)\u003C/span\u003E to the Minister of Finance: What recent developments have occurred that may boost the New Zealand economy?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022bb158206-360b-4757-8d72-f7d0994e1fb3\u0022 data-id=\u0022d44cf02c473249a6aa30a9505750506f\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000028\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bb158206-360b-4757-8d72-f7d0994e1fb3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022d44cf02c473249a6aa30a9505750506f\u0022\u003EHon BILL ENGLISH (Minister of Finance):\u003C/span\u003E This morning the Reserve Bank reduced the official cash rate by 50 basis points, to, now, 3 percent. Two major banks have already reduced their lending rates by a similar amount. This is the lowest level since the official cash rate was introduced 10 years ago. Along with tax cuts on 1 April, this move will provide significant stimulus to the economy and assist in protecting people from the sharpest edge of recession.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000029\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022659f6556-09a1-4ead-bc52-05cbdb4eaab8\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022787717ef20c64ab6bbc4464c0b0f18c8\u0022\u003ECraig Foss\u003C/span\u003E: What previous reports on the outlook for the economy has he seen?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000030\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bb158206-360b-4757-8d72-f7d0994e1fb3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022cbe980bb8e5e4f1f9088cd56c81275f2\u0022\u003EHon BILL ENGLISH\u003C/span\u003E: Prior to the Reserve Bank forecasts today, which confirm that the economic outlook is consistent with the pessimistic views of Treasury before Christmas, I saw one comment from Dr Cullen in September. He was quoted as saying that the worst was over now and he was very confident the economy would start to pick up in December.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000031\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227f8c14fb-b919-46ef-866b-8db68cfa4cf0\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022fa9884c4480542b4ae5e5ecbaba403e7\u0022\u003EHon Dr Michael Cullen\u003C/span\u003E: I raise a point of order, Mr Speaker. You may recall your ruling previously, that Ministers are not responsible for any comments they made before the election. It is hard to see, therefore, how they can be responsible for comments that I made before the election\u2014even less so.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000032\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bc1e9f65-e08b-4939-867c-22ef093e2a4e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00222e9c62349d1f470dbd12101696bd09f8\u0022\u003EHon Rodney Hide\u003C/span\u003E: I am certain it is obvious, and I am certain the Minister of Finance would not want to be responsible for those comments. He was not claiming responsibility for the comment. What he was asked was whether there were any reports that he had seen. This is a report that he has seen. It is a particularly nonsensical one, but he has seen it, none the less.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000033\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227f8c14fb-b919-46ef-866b-8db68cfa4cf0\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022c0f90fe368774d17a220c733dc48d4f8\u0022\u003EHon Dr Michael Cullen\u003C/span\u003E: I have a feeling that we must make sure we have very even approaches to some of these matters, after your recent ruling. If we were to ask whether the Minister of Finance has seen comments that \u201CNew Zealand does not have a debt problem.\u201D, made by him and Mr Key before the election; and, if so, whether he agrees with that comment, you would not rule that question out of order?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000034\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ac169d29-4849-42c2-a4a7-f344fd416503\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002283a1609d82eb46e989d1cdbf25781e53\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: I am very happy to rule on this matter because I think the matter is quite clear and I do not want to take more time in the House. The Minister has responsibility in that area, there is no question about that, and therefore he is able to comment on reports relating to that area. That is the crucial issue: it relates to his area of responsibility. I invite the Minister to continue his reply.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000035\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bb158206-360b-4757-8d72-f7d0994e1fb3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00222dfb12c83394485bbd22744b31bd5109\u0022\u003EHon BILL ENGLISH\u003C/span\u003E: I am aware that Dr Cullen does not want to take responsibility for comments he made, but in September he was quoted as saying, in respect of the outlook for the economy: \u201CThe worst is over now.\u201D and that he was \u201Cvery confident\u201D that the economy would start to pick up in the December quarter. Sadly, those predictions were premature at best. However, Dr Cullen was correct in one important respect: we have had the election since then and, in that respect, the worst is over.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000036\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e0192ed9-5715-4f6c-bd52-8db4f3466087\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002280fe84e3cad94490b160f105fff5700f\u0022\u003EHon David Cunliffe\u003C/span\u003E: Does he agree with the New Zealand Herald and the Wall Street Journal that his Prime Minister, John Key, is taking a unique approach to this recession that is \u201Ccavalier\u201D, and \u201Cat odds with the rescue policies being carried out in Washington, Tokyo and Canberra.\u201D?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000037\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bb158206-360b-4757-8d72-f7d0994e1fb3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00229fbc325ac6214137b01a0e9083a05cb8\u0022\u003EHon BILL ENGLISH\u003C/span\u003E: I think the Wall Street Journal has misunderstood the Government\u2019s strategy. In fact, I am told its journalists decided what the story was before they got here. The fact is that the Government is following a two-pronged strategy. The first is to provide stimulus to the economy in the short term\u2014to protect people from the sharp edge of recession. The second is to deal with New Zealand\u2019s chronic longer-term economic problems so that we can get this economy in top gear as it comes out of the recession.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000038\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e0192ed9-5715-4f6c-bd52-8db4f3466087\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022970dba63e484407dbe46b59cb2527953\u0022\u003EHon David Cunliffe\u003C/span\u003E: To that end, has the Minister read on page 10 of the Reserve Bank\u2019s report today that the aggregate stimulus in the G20 is around 10 percent of GDP? How does that compare with the Government\u2019s 5 percent of GDP, of which 4.5 percent, by the Minister\u2019s earlier admission, came from the previous Labour Government, and 0.5 percent from this National Government, just like the Wall Street Journal said, when 10 percent is the average around the world?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000039\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bb158206-360b-4757-8d72-f7d0994e1fb3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002230a94806ae2e49eeaf4ad76fc085538e\u0022\u003EHon BILL ENGLISH\u003C/span\u003E: The use of an aggregate stimulus measure is misleading. New Zealand is not in the position\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000040\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e0192ed9-5715-4f6c-bd52-8db4f3466087\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022b6edec0d37c344af83ebee9dd1bba919\u0022\u003EHon David Cunliffe\u003C/span\u003E: I raise a point of order, Mr Speaker. I seek clarification through you of the Minister. Is he accusing me of misleading the House\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000041\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ac169d29-4849-42c2-a4a7-f344fd416503\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022409d4526972b47ecbfbf0e55e3d5b9ca\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: The member will sit down. The member knows that is not a point of order.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000042\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bb158206-360b-4757-8d72-f7d0994e1fb3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00222ee423273bee45589361d606741f4f2f\u0022\u003EHon BILL ENGLISH\u003C/span\u003E: Yes, the use of an aggregate stimulus measure is not appropriate for New Zealand, because that includes countries that are spending trillions on rescuing their banks. On a normal measure of stimulus, New Zealand is similar to other countries, and along with dropping interest rates the tax cuts will put cash in people\u2019s pockets, which will help protect this economy from the worst edges of recession.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000043\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u00225c5de77f46bb4f098ee853c8eaacdedf\u0022\u003EJob Support Scheme\u2014Wage Replacement\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000044\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002209a5b71a-ca7e-4e7c-9e09-f9e63f18aa12\u0022\u003E2. \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002276811ab042a242d68bec36ca622a6d17\u0022\u003EHon ANNETTE KING (Deputy Leader\u2014Labour)\u003C/span\u003E to the Minister for Social Development and Employment: Does she agree with the Prime Minister\u2019s statement that \u201CIt\u2019s more likely that we would fund training than wage replacement,\u201D; if so, why did the 9-day fortnight package announced yesterday not include a training element and instead included a $60 wage replacement?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002263776108-58dc-4cab-baf1-95282c61d0de\u0022 data-id=\u00223657fb27098d4f47a7cea9cdb42ad505\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000045\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002263776108-58dc-4cab-baf1-95282c61d0de\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00223657fb27098d4f47a7cea9cdb42ad505\u0022\u003EHon PAULA BENNETT (Minister for Social Development and Employment):\u003C/span\u003E The member is mistaken. The Job Support Scheme does not include a $60 wage replacement; the Government is providing an allowance of up to $62.50 a fortnight.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000046\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002209a5b71a-ca7e-4e7c-9e09-f9e63f18aa12\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00225672095cb6314181a8ae7aae5fafcb90\u0022\u003EHon Annette King\u003C/span\u003E: Has she seen the Prime Minister\u2019s comments that he hopes that firms will top up the difference in wages; if so, is she aware that a firm paying employees $20 an hour that wants to lay off 10 workers would have to spend an additional $10,000 a fortnight to take up her scheme and provide the top-up? If so, why would any employer provide such a top-up?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000047\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002263776108-58dc-4cab-baf1-95282c61d0de\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022f5628f84a7414f0e99827d58ce1e1c9c\u0022\u003EHon PAULA BENNETT\u003C/span\u003E: I am aware that there is choice in this scheme. It is about employers and employees coming to an agreement to help save jobs in their workplace, and this Government is supporting that choice.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000048\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002260200136-9d63-4a82-b4f5-c00411adb1fd\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022e1ca8978770e406fb60c22878c980bbe\u0022\u003EJo Goodhew\u003C/span\u003E: What can employees do on the 10th day, when they are not in work?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000049\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002263776108-58dc-4cab-baf1-95282c61d0de\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00223b3c5dcf89dc43bf93278c3a7cc91709\u0022\u003EHon PAULA BENNETT\u003C/span\u003E: On the 10th day employees can have an extra day for their own purposes, which is a benefit to many people, according to Alistair Thompson of the Employers and Manufacturers Association. Training will be a feature of the scheme in some workplaces, and we encourage that. The entire scheme is voluntary, and it is for businesses and employees to find an arrangement that works for them. Our focus is on keeping people in jobs.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000050\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002209a5b71a-ca7e-4e7c-9e09-f9e63f18aa12\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022be145e16d5db4bcea4b805c27ca2d7e2\u0022\u003EHon Annette King\u003C/span\u003E: Will the flow-through from employers to employees be treated as taxable income for employees; if so, could an employee receive as little as $4.57 net an hour for an 8-hour day?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000051\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002263776108-58dc-4cab-baf1-95282c61d0de\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002265becc1e3b4f4589adf36633c2c52d58\u0022\u003EHon PAULA BENNETT\u003C/span\u003E: The scheme is voluntary, so businesses and employees will come up with what suits them. The Government will pay a top-up allowance of $12.50 for up to 5 hours per fortnight. What happens for the other 5 hours is up to businesses and their employees. The 5-hour subsidy from the Government is taxed.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000052\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227f8c14fb-b919-46ef-866b-8db68cfa4cf0\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022238c54b84a51468e9640cec16dac6388\u0022\u003EHon Dr Michael Cullen\u003C/span\u003E: I raise a point of order, Mr Speaker. The first part of that question was extremely simple: will the payment that flows through from the employer to the employee be taxable in the hands of the employee? That is a very simple question, and all that fluff about choice has no relevance, because tax is not a matter of choice\u2014at least for workers.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000053\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002263776108-58dc-4cab-baf1-95282c61d0de\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022472943c2eb554ec0af18acd0f894dfaf\u0022\u003EHon PAULA BENNETT\u003C/span\u003E: What happened there was the member was so interested in jumping up to raise his point of order that he did not hear the end of it.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000054\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ac169d29-4849-42c2-a4a7-f344fd416503\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022bcaa706317c74db8b8c00f94a0c92941\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: The member may not use that kind of language in a point of order or make any reflection on another member in a point of order. I think there is a public interest issue here about whether certain payments are taxable. As the member making his point of order pointed out, tax is not a matter that is voluntary. I invite the Minister to respond and to reply to the question, which was whether the payments will be taxable in the hands of the recipient.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000055\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00225f8fa99573cc4f4eac0318125c3f3c29\u0022\u003EHon Gerry Brownlee\u003C/span\u003E: I raise a point of order, Mr Speaker. She did respond and\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000056\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ac169d29-4849-42c2-a4a7-f344fd416503\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022b43ad179f2ec4bc48b1015bcbbf865c3\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: The member will resume his seat. Clearly, those asking the question did not hear that answer, and I have to confess neither did I. I invite the Minister to clarify it.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000057\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002263776108-58dc-4cab-baf1-95282c61d0de\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022dd85ab8d39054a9dbf8de5a9eea3b558\u0022\u003EHon PAULA BENNETT\u003C/span\u003E: Yes.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000058\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002209a5b71a-ca7e-4e7c-9e09-f9e63f18aa12\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022f55bc65a14da4d3a9b2e5a072ecdca48\u0022\u003EHon Annette King\u003C/span\u003E: Is the Minister aware that the Tai R\u0101whiti District Health Board is cutting the number of its employees by 3 percent in response to the effects of the global recession? How does she reconcile that with her comments made on Morning Report this morning about the exclusion of the public sector from the Job Support Scheme because the sector was not affected by the global economic situation?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000059\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002263776108-58dc-4cab-baf1-95282c61d0de\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00223adb90f9546c4b6aabd4d1d606857ea2\u0022\u003EHon PAULA BENNETT\u003C/span\u003E: What is quite clear is that this scheme is for businesses that are having a drop in productivity. That is where this focus is. That is the area where this scheme has been introduced, and that is what it will introduce.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000060\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e0192ed9-5715-4f6c-bd52-8db4f3466087\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00220b1b2d52573f4356b4bfdd2ca67357c3\u0022\u003EHon David Cunliffe\u003C/span\u003E: When the Prime Minister has trumpeted this idea as the most major outcome from the over-hyped Job Summit, why is the Minister being hung out to dry for defending a trivial programme of some $20 million that, at best, will save 2,000 jobs when we are facing 80,000 extra unemployed this year alone?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000061\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002263776108-58dc-4cab-baf1-95282c61d0de\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002203218f3f9a894368941ce086d26eb607\u0022\u003EHon PAULA BENNETT\u003C/span\u003E: Unlike that side of the House, we do not think that saving jobs is trivial; we take it really seriously. I can say that with the $20 million that is possibly being spent on this scheme, $30 million is being saved in potential unemployment benefit numbers, which is a positive thing, as well.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000062\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e0192ed9-5715-4f6c-bd52-8db4f3466087\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002247acb1622ad14dddb0b83cea9d6cc5ef\u0022\u003EHon David Cunliffe\u003C/span\u003E: Does the Minister agree with what John Key told the Wall Street Journal, which is that National\u2019s real formula for prosperity is a return to privatisation, liberalisation, supply-side monetarism, and\u2014God forbid\u2014Rogernomics, or is that not just so 1980s?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000063\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002263776108-58dc-4cab-baf1-95282c61d0de\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022d6f75f95473c4f48b68a9b767787dedf\u0022\u003EHon PAULA BENNETT\u003C/span\u003E: I think that says more about the member\u2019s own credibility than this Government\u2019s.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000064\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e0192ed9-5715-4f6c-bd52-8db4f3466087\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00227ee5c838b7884af5b449a8dfc9bb8e0b\u0022\u003EHon David Cunliffe\u003C/span\u003E: I raise a point of order, Mr Speaker. Do you consider that that answer constitutes addressing the question, which covers a number of core elements of economic policy?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000065\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ac169d29-4849-42c2-a4a7-f344fd416503\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022794cc287219e4cd188d7f9ed49b4c7d2\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Yes, I do.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000066\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bb158206-360b-4757-8d72-f7d0994e1fb3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022e1ee673cd576498f8216d34166fa31c7\u0022\u003EHon Bill English\u003C/span\u003E: I raise a point of order, Mr Speaker. The deputy leader of the Labour Party used a term that was unparliamentary. I ask that she withdraw the comment.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000067\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002276b5a87b1e1e4840ad4b169a3b883b47\u0022\u003EHon Trevor Mallard\u003C/span\u003E: The term might have been ironic, but it was not unparliamentary.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000068\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ac169d29-4849-42c2-a4a7-f344fd416503\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00224df8c7cc06fc44efa2127fde886fa0c2\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Because I did not hear it, I invite the Hon Annette King to indicate whether she did say something that was unparliamentary. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000069\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002209a5b71a-ca7e-4e7c-9e09-f9e63f18aa12\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022d0247df2753e49d1a83d8b970f219a73\u0022\u003EHon Annette King\u003C/span\u003E: I don\u2019t think it was unparliamentary.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000070\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ac169d29-4849-42c2-a4a7-f344fd416503\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00223f4389e62fcb4726ac3c2f2e3c9dc731\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: If she says that she did not, I accept her word.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000071\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022187e4099-cc16-4bb8-8379-82c881af1724\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022c043fa880c1044bfa1bcfded956cee50\u0022\u003EDavid Garrett\u003C/span\u003E: How does the 9-day fortnight package increase productivity or save one job?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000072\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002263776108-58dc-4cab-baf1-95282c61d0de\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022715b21a3bf294d58b5318465b736e57a\u0022\u003EHon PAULA BENNETT\u003C/span\u003E: This package gives those employers who are going through a temporarily tough time because of the global economic situation, a bit of breathing space and a reduction in their wage bill so that they can keep more workers on in their jobs.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000073\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u0022da01e746e39f4e80b81e9fc47af7f6cd\u0022\u003ESchools\u2014Property Projects\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000074\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ed2d10c1-43b7-41d9-9f5c-0c313f70e625\u0022\u003E3. \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00225ed66d1abe134fad8409ffb79e4e6444\u0022\u003ENIKKI KAYE (National\u2014Auckland Central)\u003C/span\u003E to the Minister of Education: What steps has the Government taken to fast track school property projects?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022977cccaf-581d-4f48-924e-32bf6c54a93d\u0022 data-id=\u0022298e612f0d8042c7b57edd4127676f68\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000075\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022977cccaf-581d-4f48-924e-32bf6c54a93d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022298e612f0d8042c7b57edd4127676f68\u0022\u003EHon ANNE TOLLEY (Minister of Education):\u003C/span\u003E The Government has today announced the names of 81 schools that will be receiving funding to get new or expanded buildings through the first allocation of property funding to schools under the Government\u2019s jobs and growth plan. Many of these schools would normally have waited until the end of the year to receive approval and funding. Because of this announcement, they are getting approval to begin work at least 6 months earlier. Seventy-four schools will receive $30 million to extend existing buildings, and seven schools will receive $11 million to replace buildings that are no longer economically viable to maintain.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000076\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ed2d10c1-43b7-41d9-9f5c-0c313f70e625\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00223683af16eb704f49bfa7a42647f2e5ce\u0022\u003ENikki Kaye\u003C/span\u003E: Does today\u2019s announcement deliver on the promises made when the fast tracking of school building projects was announced in February?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000077\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022977cccaf-581d-4f48-924e-32bf6c54a93d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022b969e49d7c6549c4bc2c8113f12cd6ea\u0022\u003EHon ANNE TOLLEY\u003C/span\u003E: Yes, it does; in fact, it more than delivers. In February we promised that the $30 million to have better administration buildings, halls, and libraries would be distributed to 64 schools. The announcement today will see 74 schools given funding for those purposes. That is 10 more schools and communities than we originally promised to help to upgrade their buildings and keep jobs in the community. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000078\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b398827c-6bf5-403e-90dc-ff03205302a5\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022aad5db07af9e47329158938ab4fa4bfb\u0022\u003ESu\u2019a William Sio\u003C/span\u003E: Will the Minister confirm that she has frozen $9 million of funding that would have provided nine preschool facilities for 16,000 children under 5 years in Manukau who currently have no access to early childhood education; and how is it that depriving 16,000 children of access to preschool education would not be OK for the leafy suburbs, but is somehow OK for Manukau City?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000079\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022977cccaf-581d-4f48-924e-32bf6c54a93d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00225313647d818642288315bfa029a7d0ca\u0022\u003EHon ANNE TOLLEY\u003C/span\u003E: No, I have not frozen it. In fact, there was not $9 million there. This Labour Government promised and hoped. There is $2.6 million available, and instead of coming down to Wellington and building something and hoping that children would come, I have met with the City of Manukau Education Trust, with Manukau City Council, and with principals and asked them what they think will work for their communities. We do not dictate to communities what is good for them; we ask them for the answers.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000080\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00228f186e9d5ceb4ecc92f5b10b4af89e60\u0022\u003EChris Hipkins\u003C/span\u003E: How can the Minister claim that her Government is fast tracking school property funding projects, when the schools in Upper Hutt have heard nothing from her or her ministry, despite her promise some time ago that they were to receive an extra $30 million in funding, and despite their repeated inquiries about how much they will each receive and when they will get it\u2014or is she just making it up as she goes along, and not doing the hard yards to deliver on her promises?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000081\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022977cccaf-581d-4f48-924e-32bf6c54a93d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022e5105eec1e414fe5808ca5bcde81bd67\u0022\u003EHon ANNE TOLLEY\u003C/span\u003E: I share that member\u2019s concern about the Upper Hutt schools and the disgraceful way that his Labour colleagues froze the capital for those schools for 6 or 7 years. Three Labour Ministers of Education froze the capital for those buildings, and I know that that member is concerned about that, because I understand that he was advising those three Ministers at the time. However, I am delighted to assure the member that this Government will be delivering to those schools in the very near future.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000082\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u0022fd6b01d8b918418cb281398508b8fd73\u0022\u003EAccident Compensation\u2014Claims Liability\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000083\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f5d71749-ae91-4af7-b2bd-77260398912a\u0022\u003E4. \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a84f1232ba8a46689cc4331667aadb5e\u0022\u003EHon DAVID PARKER (Labour)\u003C/span\u003E to the Minister for ACC: Does he agree with actuary Jonathan Eriksen that \u201CAll this talk of liabilities being blown out is complete nonsense. It\u2019s ill-founded and smacks of scaremongering, which, given the current economic picture, is the last thing people need to be told.\u201D; if not, why not?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022 data-id=\u00223a53294ddcaf4669b496c716f01083b7\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000084\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00223a53294ddcaf4669b496c716f01083b7\u0022\u003EHon Dr NICK SMITH (Minister for ACC):\u003C/span\u003E No, and nor do other actuaries I have spoken to. I am advised that Mr Eriksen tendered for the actuary work of accident compensation against PricewaterhouseCoopers, and was rejected. I stand by the actuary valuations provided by PricewaterhouseCoopers, which show that accident compensation liabilities over the last year have increased by $3.9 billion to $22 billion.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000085\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f5d71749-ae91-4af7-b2bd-77260398912a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022b009ba201dc9419c849609d289c342a4\u0022\u003EHon David Parker\u003C/span\u003E: Does the Minister agree with Brian Fallow that \u201Cit is downright irresponsible \u2026 to use terms like \u2018insolvent\u2019 and \u2018going down the gurgler\u2019 \u2026 because there are people who depend on [accident compensation] to keep body and soul together and will do for the rest of their days.\u201D; if not, why not?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000086\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00220bf7bff8591f4f5684c11249c925340f\u0022\u003EHon Dr NICK SMITH\u003C/span\u003E: Accident compensation has a serious problem, because costs have been rising at a very fast rate. Although the discount rate may go up and down\u2014and it did both over the term of the previous Government\u2014the fact is that those liabilities grew by $16 billion under the term of the previous Government, and that is why this Government has to make changes to get costs under control.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000087\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c83012b4-3939-4753-80fc-1956a3e2bd1e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00223eae0c0ef202497cb5d13d233c0c1074\u0022\u003EMichael Woodhouse\u003C/span\u003E: What did the MartinJenkins report say about the primary reason for the increase in accident compensation liabilities?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000088\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00222f38376cb8ce48b99cbbacfefff42426\u0022\u003EHon Dr NICK SMITH\u003C/span\u003E: The ministerial inquiry showed that although the discount rates had gone up and down, during the mid-years of this decade they had masked the very substantial increase in costs. Now that the discount rate has fallen, as have returns from investments, the underlying problem of cost extension and cover entitlement extensions has been exposed, and that problem now leaves accident compensation in a position where change is required.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000089\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f5d71749-ae91-4af7-b2bd-77260398912a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002236a7dd85983e4548b390d63c119fe510\u0022\u003EHon David Parker\u003C/span\u003E: Does the Minister agree with Vernon Small that this is a \u201Cmanufactured crisis\u201D and \u201Cprincipally caused by the global recession and its impact on lower interest rates \u2026 and falling equity prices.\u201D; if not, why not?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000090\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022d15aa1a871894a37be6dd10eec7d4e7a\u0022\u003EHon Dr NICK SMITH\u003C/span\u003E: I did not create the situation where, before I even got my ministerial warrant, Department of Labour officials sought an urgent appointment with me to deal with a $300 million shortfall that we now know was a breach of the Public Finance Act. I did not create that situation; members opposite did.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000091\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022187e4099-cc16-4bb8-8379-82c881af1724\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022e9d893b172004b3db84fe0e0c95b5d9b\u0022\u003EDavid Garrett\u003C/span\u003E: Does the Minister think it is fair that hard-working New Zealanders have to pay higher levies in order for the accident compensation scheme to subsidise criminals who injure themselves while breaking the law?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000092\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022612063fab32740d5af265a6bbef6eed4\u0022\u003EHon Dr NICK SMITH\u003C/span\u003E: The member raises a legitimate question about how far accident compensation entitlements should go. ACC has raised with me concerns about the issues the member has raised. In the process of reviewing accident compensation entitlements, that is one of the issues I wish to look at. In my view, we need to get right the balance between ensuring accident victims get proper care and taking into account the costs on levy payers.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000093\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f5d71749-ae91-4af7-b2bd-77260398912a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00223c23d4dd589d4ff089010d28e0e692a2\u0022\u003EHon David Parker\u003C/span\u003E: Why, for the first time in memory, did neither the chair of the ACC board, the former chair\u2014and still a current board member\u2014Mr Wilson, the deputy chair, nor any other member of the board of ACC appear at the select committee\u2019s financial review of ACC this morning?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000094\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00222d91ea60b95c4878adc1e7e025fd5801\u0022\u003EHon Dr NICK SMITH\u003C/span\u003E: I advised the chairman of the select committee on Tuesday that there had been a change in the board chair, which I had announced on Monday, and that the new board chair, Mr John Judge, was unavailable this week. Given the change that I am making to the board, the chairman of the select committee agreed that I should come along to the meeting. I have said to\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000095\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022b787e7ca2abe4686bd8ba6559300c72d\u0022\u003EHon Member\u003C/span\u003E: How ridiculous!\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000096\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022b07ed629c63747dcbe94a9438218a15c\u0022\u003EHon Dr NICK SMITH\u003C/span\u003E: Usually, members are upset because Ministers will not come along to select committee meetings. Mr John Judge, the chair of the ACC board, is more than happy to come along to the select committee, and I understand that that is the chair\u2019s intent.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000097\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f5d71749-ae91-4af7-b2bd-77260398912a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002295414c5b086343cbb70dafc60dd30370\u0022\u003EHon David Parker\u003C/span\u003E: I raise a point of order, Mr Speaker. The member puts me in a difficult position in that he says that the chair of the select committee wants the current chair of the ACC board to come along, yet I am prevented from commenting\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000098\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ac169d29-4849-42c2-a4a7-f344fd416503\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022bf7e167baf604a3fbc4605a9128047bb\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: The member knows that is not a point of order. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000099\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f5d71749-ae91-4af7-b2bd-77260398912a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022edff6687908f4ddfaf8501dad0da07e0\u0022\u003EHon David Parker\u003C/span\u003E: Why, after gagging the board over recent months then gatecrashing the financial review himself\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000100\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00221dd8847993d840e2867429b2b77a2ad7\u0022\u003EHon Dr NICK SMITH\u003C/span\u003E: I raise a point of order, Mr Speaker. The accusation that I have gagged the board or done anything different is quite inappropriate. That is not the way that Standing Orders require members to ask questions.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000101\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ac169d29-4849-42c2-a4a7-f344fd416503\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00225d888855cf85456c992c7c8bbe42c47e\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: I thank the honourable member. He is quite right with his point of order. Members cannot make such allegations in supplementary questions. I invite the member to reword his question. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000102\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f9c512a8-d532-4ef9-ad51-0fe8d752a893\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002298d597a71066419f97585685ef8bbb1d\u0022\u003EHon Clayton Cosgrove\u003C/span\u003E: I raise a point of order, Mr Speaker. I might be in the difficult position of incriminating myself here, but I have said on many, many occasions\u2014and you have never ruled it out, Mr Speaker\u2014that the Minister of Corrections had gagged her chief executive officer. I have said it in this House, and you have never ruled it out, so how can you rule out that member saying it?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000103\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00221eb523d2ee484e1e835a9e67ae3dedfc\u0022\u003EHon Gerry Brownlee\u003C/span\u003E: In his case, no one was listening.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000104\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227f8c14fb-b919-46ef-866b-8db68cfa4cf0\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002232f1e70babbf492ea35f9ddec366fa40\u0022\u003EHon Dr Michael Cullen\u003C/span\u003E: A further point of order, Mr Speaker.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000105\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ac169d29-4849-42c2-a4a7-f344fd416503\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00228b122b318f8c4228bf5edb6a74ddeb9f\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: No, I will not take any more points of order on this matter. That was not a point of order; I accept that absolutely, and I did not need that kind of assistance from the Hon Clayton Cosgrove. I have ruled on the matter in respect of the Hon David Parker. He is not losing a question. I have invited him\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000106\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227f8c14fb-b919-46ef-866b-8db68cfa4cf0\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022e960a846b38e46d7b33cd65307c8b3d9\u0022\u003EHon Dr Michael Cullen\u003C/span\u003E: I raise a point of order, Mr Speaker.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000107\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ac169d29-4849-42c2-a4a7-f344fd416503\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022ae2daad6749c400ea86ce60f13d91d1b\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: I happen to be on my feet, Dr Cullen. I have invited the member to reword his question. He is not losing a question. I believe that is perfectly fair. If I have missed noticing that members have done this in the past, I apologise for that, but when a Minister takes objection, a member cannot make allegations in a supplementary question. The Standing Orders are absolutely clear on that point. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000108\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227f8c14fb-b919-46ef-866b-8db68cfa4cf0\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022b16f053d4f5d4400a8c59d39f54a2e2b\u0022\u003EHon Dr Michael Cullen\u003C/span\u003E: I raise a point of order, Mr Speaker. You did not give a chance for anybody to comment on the first point of order from Dr Smith. Dr Smith, of course, did not deny that he had told the board not to make public comment last year. It is a matter of public record\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000109\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ac169d29-4849-42c2-a4a7-f344fd416503\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022696101af1943442698e02c8ac04ccdc7\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: I have indicated my considerable respect for the member\u2019s knowledge of the Standing Orders, on a number of occasions, but what he is demonstrating here is that he is trying to step beyond the Standing Orders. The Standing Orders are not about debating matters that are considered to be fact; the issue is that the Standing Orders are very clear on what can be included in a supplementary question. Supplementary questions cannot contain allegations; that is totally out of order. There is no discretion about it whatsoever. I have not cost the member who made the allegation a supplementary question; I have invited him just to reword it.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000110\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002298e5ece7c8754483bff58d0c4ad244db\u0022\u003EHon Trevor Mallard\u003C/span\u003E: I raise a point of order, Mr Speaker. What we are getting to now is what is an allegation as opposed to what is a fact.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000111\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ac169d29-4849-42c2-a4a7-f344fd416503\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00226b9004db46a24293ba5243cd85cb02d4\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: I am on my feet, and I invite the member to sit down. The Speaker is the sole judge of these matters. Objection was taken, and the Standing Orders are absolutely clear. I have no discretion on the matter. I invite the member to ask his\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000112\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002292702eea3c4749d29769ea49d628457a\u0022\u003EHon Trevor Mallard\u003C/span\u003E: I raise a point of order, Mr Speaker.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000113\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ac169d29-4849-42c2-a4a7-f344fd416503\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022dbd9f877bb1a454cab288826f9c45bcd\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: I am on my feet.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000114\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022ebca651691a841518f1d160f4105becf\u0022\u003EHon Trevor Mallard\u003C/span\u003E: You dip sometimes.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000115\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ac169d29-4849-42c2-a4a7-f344fd416503\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a2ec8fef43a6472989639570ab11db6e\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: I have not dipped one little bit, and if the member is not careful, he may be dipping himself.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000116\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00220d49f27b299c4c419f789ba0c83b6a77\u0022\u003EHon Trevor Mallard\u003C/span\u003E: Point of order, Mr Speaker.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000117\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ac169d29-4849-42c2-a4a7-f344fd416503\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002218406f7fa4f84ce9a6c50274da33c02b\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: I am on my feet. And that member will resume his seat. The House has been quite noisy today, and that is fine. It has been quite robust today, but members will comply with the Standing Orders. I have ruled on this matter, and I will not tolerate\u2014because the Standing Orders do not allow\u2014any discretion in this matter. I invite the member to be careful.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000118\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e0192ed9-5715-4f6c-bd52-8db4f3466087\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00223a3e5fc3885049f790581df9fc3e65c3\u0022\u003EHon David Cunliffe\u003C/span\u003E: I raise a point of order, Mr Speaker. Without challenging your ruling, I invite your reflection on certain matters in Hansard. If my memory serves me correctly, when I was the Minister of Immigration I faced extended questioning from another member who made extensive use of supplementary questions that contained allegations against another member of this House, Taito Phillip Field.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000119\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ac169d29-4849-42c2-a4a7-f344fd416503\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022dfa96343b362400f968b00967adc7e6e\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: I perceive the member to be questioning my ruling. I have made it very clear: an allegation of gagging was made, objection was taken, and I have no discretion in that matter. The Standing Orders are absolutely clear on it.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000120\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f9c512a8-d532-4ef9-ad51-0fe8d752a893\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00225a0d6d6c123444199e63859f1f5e2c66\u0022\u003EHon Clayton Cosgrove\u003C/span\u003E: Point of order.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000121\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ac169d29-4849-42c2-a4a7-f344fd416503\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022732538c4b0f34ab3b40d87aadeeb4ed7\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: I am on my feet, Mr Cosgrove. I warn the member that I have ruled on this matter.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000122\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227f8c14fb-b919-46ef-866b-8db68cfa4cf0\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022b4444e9f4f65472bad1cd322cd85b0c5\u0022\u003EHon Dr Michael Cullen\u003C/span\u003E: I raise a point of order, Mr Speaker. To be clear, so that we can frame our questions incredibly precisely and carefully, are you saying that if the member were to ask: \u201CDid the Minister tell the board that it was not to make public comment on certain matters?\u201D, you would not object to that? In common language, it would be the word \u201Cgagging\u201D, but am I to assume that it would not be an allegation? I think we have a real problem here. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000123\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ac169d29-4849-42c2-a4a7-f344fd416503\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00226d14b4eb44cc4c8db6ae4422bffd2359\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: I have ruled on this matter. Offence was taken, and the Standing Orders make it very clear that members cannot inject into supplementary questions those kinds of things. I have ruled on the matter, and there has been no penalty to the member who made the allegation. I have invited him simply to reword his supplementary question. I believe that that is totally fair.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000124\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f5d71749-ae91-4af7-b2bd-77260398912a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a8e72d7d90d9441ea369f56fee042ad2\u0022\u003EHon David Parker\u003C/span\u003E: Why, at the select committee this morning, did the Minister stop the chief executive from answering some of the questions posed by members of the Opposition, and pass notes to the chief executive to intervene in her answers to other questions?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000125\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00225f5c6fc4c59e4e71a79bf32f8c1648d6\u0022\u003EHon Dr NICK SMITH\u003C/span\u003E: Firstly, I did not pass a single note to the chief executive. There were questions from members that related to policy. For instance, there were questions about the setting of the motor vehicle levy. That is done by the Government, not by the chief executive. I say to the member opposite that during the period of questioning at the select committee, I think 90 percent of the answers were given by the chief executive, and I think it was a helpful interchange. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000126\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u00225e04d2d2b97f465298b670fa3a4a02db\u0022\u003EWater Quality\u2014Dairying and Clean Streams Accord\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000127\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002281e8ca24-8b1d-4558-9ef9-c9418df2b3c0\u0022\u003E5. \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00220e48e8e301ff4e758caaef6d3aaf41b2\u0022\u003EKEVIN HAGUE (Green)\u003C/span\u003E to the Minister of Agriculture: Has the Dairying and Clean Streams Accord achieved its aim of \u201Cclean healthy water, including streams, rivers, lakes, ground water, and wetlands, in dairying areas.\u201D; or, does he agree with the Hon Dr Nick Smith\u2019s statement of October 2008 that there has been a \u201Cdeterioration in water quality,\u201D?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022e4b09a29-dfd3-42c0-8585-11463bd6077b\u0022 data-id=\u002239a551ef21774b818149e4ce2a4dcb81\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000128\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e4b09a29-dfd3-42c0-8585-11463bd6077b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002239a551ef21774b818149e4ce2a4dcb81\u0022\u003EHon DAVID CARTER (Minister of Agriculture):\u003C/span\u003E The Dairying and Clean Streams Accord is well down the track of achieving its key aims, and it is ahead of schedule in many areas, although more work is clearly needed. The member needs to understand that the accord is not expected to achieve its full aims until 2012. I agree with the statement from the Hon Dr Nick Smith. In many parts of New Zealand water quality has deteriorated under 9 years of a Labour-Green Government, and that is why National is intent on achieving better outcomes. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000129\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002281e8ca24-8b1d-4558-9ef9-c9418df2b3c0\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022be5f356f3f3742d7a8d6f1a916be73eb\u0022\u003EKevin Hague\u003C/span\u003E: How can the Minister expect Kiwis to believe that the Dairying and Clean Streams Accord is working when the highest priority target\u2014and the only target with any teeth\u2014which is for all farms to immediately comply with resource consents, is nowhere near being met, with more than one in 10 dairy farms significantly in breach of cowshed effluent disposal rules?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000130\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e4b09a29-dfd3-42c0-8585-11463bd6077b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00220fadd724824b44848f4bf55cad062e31\u0022\u003EHon DAVID CARTER\u003C/span\u003E: As I mentioned today at the launch of the Dairying and Clean Streams Accord: Snapshot of Progress\u20142007/08, some farmers are not playing the game, and it is the intention of the Government, in conjunction with local government and Fonterra, to deal with those farmers. The Green member ought to acknowledge what the snapshot clearly shows: the great majority of farmers have done a very credible job. It is time the Green Party acknowledged the work done by the great majority of New Zealand farmers, instead of bagging farmers on every occasion.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000131\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dc6c0f88-e781-476d-bca1-d1bf9b69302b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022e9aa769af0d140fe8618d7e54d455a69\u0022\u003EAmy Adams\u003C/span\u003E: What initiatives are under way in the primary sector to improve water quality?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000132\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e4b09a29-dfd3-42c0-8585-11463bd6077b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022e90da711fdc84c63bb45df92925607e6\u0022\u003EHon DAVID CARTER\u003C/span\u003E: There are many, aside from the Dairying and Clean Streams Accord. Local councils, farmers, industry-good organisations, and Government are actively cooperating on a range of initiatives aimed at lifting the performance of the sector. Some of these initiatives include the Primary Sector Water Partnership, the dairy sustainability assurance scheme, and the Dairy Industry Strategy for Sustainable Environmental Management. There is much work under way, and the vast majority of the sector is demonstrating a clear commitment to being effective guardians of our vital waterways. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000133\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002281e8ca24-8b1d-4558-9ef9-c9418df2b3c0\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00226d2115772ffd439bbb596ebabadfdd12\u0022\u003EKevin Hague\u003C/span\u003E: Does the Minister accept that, even based on the report\u2019s own numbers, at least 750 dairy farms are seriously breaking the law; if so, does he really expect Kiwis to agree that these are small numbers?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000134\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022cd766eba1ccf414cba97af9018c70868\u0022\u003EHon Trevor Mallard\u003C/span\u003E: I raise a point of order, Mr Speaker. I apologise to my colleague, but that is the first example of an allegation since your recent ruling. That supplementary question contains an allegation. It is also a fact, as reported in a particular report. But it is an allegation of people breaching the law, and I ask you, consistent with your previous rulings about allegations not being allowed in supplementary questions, whether this is an appropriate supplementary question to continue with. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000135\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bc1e9f65-e08b-4939-867c-22ef093e2a4e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002255f723bb4f104d069cf725c2f1b64e46\u0022\u003EHon Rodney Hide\u003C/span\u003E: This picks up on the point that was made in response to the Hon Clayton Cosgrove. The difference is that it is the Minister\u2019s taking objection that alerts your interest. If no one is particularly offended by it, then I think the position is that we carry on. We do that quite often for the smooth running of Parliament. As you pointed out in your ruling, it was actually once a Minister had taken objection to the question that your hands were tied.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000136\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ac169d29-4849-42c2-a4a7-f344fd416503\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022b8b493b972fb438d9b9b3ff90a8bc401\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: I thank the honourable members. I ask the Minister whether he recollects the question and is able to answer it.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000137\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002209278070-a54a-41e9-8a27-45166301277e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022e29b2d2dc1d7426d86a952db4d4c4675\u0022\u003EJeanette Fitzsimons\u003C/span\u003E: Speaking to the general point made in the Hon Trevor Mallard\u2019s point of order, if statements of fact taken directly from a Government report are not to be allowed in supplementary questions if a Minister should take exception to them, I think we are getting into quite dangerous territory. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000138\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ac169d29-4849-42c2-a4a7-f344fd416503\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022cc3b726812f9415ca689d72ac1f1b5dc\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: The member does not need to be concerned. I was about to call the Minister to answer the question. I do not consider there is a problem with the question. I invite the honourable Minister to answer the question.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000139\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e4b09a29-dfd3-42c0-8585-11463bd6077b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00227790f9d2bfe14892896f5b44904bf4ee\u0022\u003EHon DAVID CARTER\u003C/span\u003E: Thank you, Mr Speaker. The report certainly identifies some farmers who are not complying. Some of the non-compliance is of a technical nature; some is quite serious non-compliance. If the member had been at the launch today, he would have heard both the Minister of Agriculture and the Minister for the Environment being critical of that small number of farmers who continually fail to comply and who wilfully pollute. Those farmers risk bringing the whole of the New Zealand industry into disrepute. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000140\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002281e8ca24-8b1d-4558-9ef9-c9418df2b3c0\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002292d641397a5d464d8a91078688c43872\u0022\u003EKevin Hague\u003C/span\u003E: Does the Minister agree with Bryce Johnson, the chief executive of the Fish and Game Council, that \u201CThe Accord has always been a stop-gap programme and fundamentally incomplete, is voluntary not mandatory, \u2026 has no riparian buffer zone requirements, doesn\u2019t deal to small streams, only includes Fonterra suppliers, and never focused on measurable improvements in water quality.\u201D; if not, why not?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000141\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e4b09a29-dfd3-42c0-8585-11463bd6077b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00228c6b42968c864606858d039dd4d6d4c4\u0022\u003EHon DAVID CARTER\u003C/span\u003E: I agree with Mr Bryce Johnson to the extent that the accord is voluntary. I note that three press releases have been put out today criticising the progress: one by the Royal Forest and Bird Protection Society, one by the Fish and Game Council, and one by the Green Party. It looks to me as though all three press releases were written by one and the same person.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000142\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002281e8ca24-8b1d-4558-9ef9-c9418df2b3c0\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022d8b139ee3ef54964abb37818128bdec4\u0022\u003EKevin Hague\u003C/span\u003E: Is the Minister aware\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000143\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022067c495ec49943d8b0696f7197b48b90\u0022\u003EHon Trevor Mallard\u003C/span\u003E: I raise a point of order, Mr Speaker. Again, I apologise for interrupting, but I think a very serious allegation has been inferred in that reply\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000144\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ac169d29-4849-42c2-a4a7-f344fd416503\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022e382ab5e668240b1a5c415de80507cca\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: I have heard enough from the member. The member will resume his seat. Thank you.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000145\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022fc8ab326-1806-41d3-8c41-cd58c95dcb45\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00227bc6b149265646b1805de6566f9997fc\u0022\u003EMetiria Turei\u003C/span\u003E: Point of order.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000146\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ac169d29-4849-42c2-a4a7-f344fd416503\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022c7dc0ee7aed7472fa51adcda789fb4da\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Metiria\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000147\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c437bda8-4741-4ac5-89ab-b0818e1ab9fa\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002259e3ae69351746d1addc8c985932a0ec\u0022\u003EHon Darren Hughes\u003C/span\u003E: Point of order.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000148\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ac169d29-4849-42c2-a4a7-f344fd416503\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00223d60d618ca054c46a58df61d7b8cd800\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Darren Hughes.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000149\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c437bda8-4741-4ac5-89ab-b0818e1ab9fa\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002216fb379c52b949e5bbaa2623b1c6661a\u0022\u003EHon Darren Hughes\u003C/span\u003E: I raise a point of order, Mr Speaker. The Opposition notes that earlier, when the Hon Dr Nick Smith took a point of order and when the Leader of the House took a point of order\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000150\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022fc8ab326-1806-41d3-8c41-cd58c95dcb45\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022487b9c57db764b8da84588b534c26b13\u0022\u003EMetiria Turei\u003C/span\u003E: Point of order, Mr Speaker!\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000151\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ac169d29-4849-42c2-a4a7-f344fd416503\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022edda4b9017ed406dbbdd9de185f6b6cd\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Metiria Turei.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000152\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c437bda8-4741-4ac5-89ab-b0818e1ab9fa\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022fdf9ebad433a4f24aa563ee6e83be51b\u0022\u003EHon Darren Hughes\u003C/span\u003E: I am on a point of order.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000153\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022fc8ab326-1806-41d3-8c41-cd58c95dcb45\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022c1ed7814052847b1b9a1c41ba3ce917d\u0022\u003EMetiria Turei\u003C/span\u003E: Sorry; I was called.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000154\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ac169d29-4849-42c2-a4a7-f344fd416503\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00224df2029399e04916b142e0bcad986df6\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: I apologise. It appears that Metiria Turei called a point of order first, and I did not hear it. I apologise to the honourable member. Out of courtesy I should take the member who called first.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000155\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022fc8ab326-1806-41d3-8c41-cd58c95dcb45\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022f3b77bb65d194628a9c986a0938f02c4\u0022\u003EMetiria Turei\u003C/span\u003E: I raise a point of order, Mr Speaker. I raise the issue that an allegation like that being made in a reply to a question is none the less still an allegation that would, according to your ruling, be out of order under the Standing Orders. The rules in the Standing Orders\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000156\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ac169d29-4849-42c2-a4a7-f344fd416503\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002287f868313cfd4162ba19c68eae19edb6\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: The member will sit down. I am on my feet. I think that this issue is getting quite ridiculous, because what the Minister said in his reply was hardly an offensive allegation, whatsoever. I invite the House to come back to the business. I believe that Kevin Hague was asking a supplementary question.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000157\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e4b09a29-dfd3-42c0-8585-11463bd6077b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022922e1e0e0c2d4f6187b689ed59f46553\u0022\u003EHon DAVID CARTER\u003C/span\u003E: I raise a point of order, Mr Speaker. If my comment upset some people in the House, then I am only too happy to withdraw it.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000158\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022fc8ab326-1806-41d3-8c41-cd58c95dcb45\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00220581b1518c054da7b51b893c7da385c2\u0022\u003EMetiria Turei\u003C/span\u003E: I raise a point of order, Mr Speaker. I take exception to the Minister\u2019s comment, and I ask that the Minister be required to withdraw and apologise for it.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000159\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ac169d29-4849-42c2-a4a7-f344fd416503\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022c8c961fb985c4662a6ce57fa8fcd11d4\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Would the Minister please withdraw and apologise.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000160\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e4b09a29-dfd3-42c0-8585-11463bd6077b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00224a1fa2485cb44621ac7a0687ab865891\u0022\u003EHon DAVID CARTER\u003C/span\u003E: I withdraw and apologise.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000161\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ac169d29-4849-42c2-a4a7-f344fd416503\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002238eb0053da2240e5ba3a9b1ff61e08c9\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: I thank the Minister.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000162\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c437bda8-4741-4ac5-89ab-b0818e1ab9fa\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00225e13080e240d44348036fbbf88eab456\u0022\u003EHon Darren Hughes\u003C/span\u003E: I raise a point of order, Mr Speaker. The point I was going to raise was that it seems that when Government members have taken points of order this afternoon they have been allowed to complete their point of order before you comment or rule on it, but on several occasions when Opposition members have taken points of order, before they have been able to get to the point they are trying to make you have stood up and shut them down. In the case of the Hon Trevor Mallard, you did not even comment on the point he was making; you just said that you had heard enough and then proceeded to the next item of business. We want to be able to make our points of order and take them to a complete end before you then give your ruling to us and\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000163\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ac169d29-4849-42c2-a4a7-f344fd416503\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022c6eed0b462524079a1bf34a626b15eb1\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: The member will resume his seat. I hear what he is saying; I hear his point of order. It is the Speaker\u2019s judgment as to how he deals with points of order. Where I assess that the point of order is not genuine, I will tend to sit members down, because otherwise the House would get into endless disorder. I have taken on board the point the member made, and if I have created that impression, then I apologise, because I do not want to create that impression. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000164\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ac169d29-4849-42c2-a4a7-f344fd416503\u0022\u003EBut the business of the House is important, and where points of order become trifling, it is not in the interests of the business of this Parliament and it is not in the public interest. I think that we should just think today about the issues. It all stemmed from an allegation in a question that was objected to and was found offensive by the Minister being asked it. I think that it was reasonable to require the question to be reframed so that it did not cause offence, and where offence was taken from the Minister\u2019s answer, again the Minister withdrew and apologised for that. I think the House should move on with its business. But I note the point the member made, and I certainly do not want to create that impression.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000165\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227f8c14fb-b919-46ef-866b-8db68cfa4cf0\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00224f159087eb4446d5ae58e76d4ce9da0f\u0022\u003EHon Dr Michael Cullen\u003C/span\u003E: I raise a point of order, Mr Speaker. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000166\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ac169d29-4849-42c2-a4a7-f344fd416503\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022abb9cdb3ae97499c82aad24fbfa0249b\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: I just alert the member to the fact that I have not even sat down yet.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000167\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227f8c14fb-b919-46ef-866b-8db68cfa4cf0\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022cfb1a793ed4c4e0faea7291f48f59500\u0022\u003EHon Dr Michael Cullen\u003C/span\u003E: I am sorry, Mr Speaker. You have a tendency to stop and look as though you are sitting down, which is why people then rise to a point of order. We are not trying to be discourteous; we are actually just trying to keep things flowing along. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000168\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227f8c14fb-b919-46ef-866b-8db68cfa4cf0\u0022\u003EI want to pause for a second, if we possibly can. I think we are getting into trouble here, and I do not like being in the situation where there are endless points of order. I remind you of a conversation we had. I offered the advice that playing the advantage rule is the best move for a Speaker, rather than continued involvement in rulings. When a Minister takes objection, then in general terms the appropriate thing is for you to seek a withdrawal and apology or ask the member to rephrase the question, as you did. It is not an absolute requirement upon you. Sometimes people take objection when there are no particular grounds for that objection. We cannot rule everything out just because we take objection to it. But when you proceed with a statement that any allegation is out of order, you are inviting us to be very, very pernickety from there on about every question and every answer, because, I am afraid, the same comments apply to answers. Either we are to have a reasonably free-flowing question time, or we will revert to the worst period of my parliamentary career in terms of question time\u2014from 1985 to 1987\u2014when on one famous occasion we ended up at the end of question time with only one supplementary question having been in order. I do not think that that contributes to the good flow of parliamentary business.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000169\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002284b34547e6ea4d0cb5e65c429b45bb55\u0022\u003EHon Gerry Brownlee\u003C/span\u003E: I support the comments made by Dr Cullen. I think they are very, very useful. If you look at the clocks, Mr Speaker, you will see that we are only on question No. 5 after 55 minutes. For many people watching this process, and for those who\u2014God love them\u2014may even read the Hansard of this process, it will look as though we have wasted an enormous amount of time on relatively pedantic points. I think that as we progressively put ourselves in a straitjacket, the tendency is to try to break out of it. That is largely what I think has happened with some of the frustration expressed by the Hon David Parker, and, similarly, responded to by the Hon Nick Smith and various others. So perhaps we should take on board the comments of Dr Cullen and look to that advantage rule, which, by and large, serves this House reasonably well.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000170\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ac169d29-4849-42c2-a4a7-f344fd416503\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002207122c5d5dff4a8d8bf1642fe139d2ef\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: I take on board the honourable members\u2019 points. It is worth viewing the replay of question time. I do so every day to try to ensure fairness.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000171\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002281e8ca24-8b1d-4558-9ef9-c9418df2b3c0\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022834e68777f7a44cba9cefb20dc03e5e3\u0022\u003EKevin Hague\u003C/span\u003E: Is the Minister aware that one cow defecating in a river is equivalent to 14 humans defecating in a river and that therefore\u2014as in this picture I am holding\u2014nine cattle in the Manawat\u016B River is equivalent to all the members of this House going down to the local stream and defecating simultaneously; and would that be acceptable to the Minister?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000172\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e4b09a29-dfd3-42c0-8585-11463bd6077b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00224301025644ff4c18835614f72e2cd05e\u0022\u003EHon DAVID CARTER\u003C/span\u003E: I was not aware of that amazing statistic. I thank the member for that information today, but I say to the member that when I read his press release, when I read the press release from the Royal Forest and Bird Protection Society, and when I read the press release from Fish and Game New Zealand, I see that too much time is spent criticising the farmers who are not complying. The great majority of farmers are doing a very good job, and instead of criticising our primary industries and our image, that member would do a lot better to appreciate the good work that is occurring in this regard.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000173\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002281e8ca24-8b1d-4558-9ef9-c9418df2b3c0\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022e86c7d77b37248be9342cca2b4c737b5\u0022\u003EKevin Hague\u003C/span\u003E: Will the Minister\u2019s Government commit to cleaning up our rivers and lakes so that they are safe for our kids to swim in; if so, by when?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000174\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e4b09a29-dfd3-42c0-8585-11463bd6077b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022ef96bfae028b499e96e65335ed4133ae\u0022\u003EHon DAVID CARTER\u003C/span\u003E: This Government is committed to cleaning up our waterways. I note for the member that the previous Government, the Labour-Green Government, had a programme of action that became known by the bureaucrats as the programme of inaction. This Government is intent on doing something, not ignoring the issue as was the case for the last 9 years.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000175\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002209278070-a54a-41e9-8a27-45166301277e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022f827b8c308b841c59cd761118435681b\u0022\u003EJeanette Fitzsimons\u003C/span\u003E: I raise a point of order, Mr Speaker. I take offence at the previous Government being called a Labour-Green Government. The Greens have never been a part of the Government.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000176\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ac169d29-4849-42c2-a4a7-f344fd416503\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022212253b2d73841fe82eaa383ffa02a85\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Is the member asking for that comment to be withdrawn and apologised for?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000177\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002209278070-a54a-41e9-8a27-45166301277e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022df77d96131e94f138db60ba9fcb7ae79\u0022\u003EJeanette Fitzsimons\u003C/span\u003E: Yes.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000178\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ac169d29-4849-42c2-a4a7-f344fd416503\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00222d42f73e82cd4239a140aec48b8dfa41\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: The member has taken offence.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000179\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e4b09a29-dfd3-42c0-8585-11463bd6077b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00220ed9d12c6d644f00a1dec0dee9c3d418\u0022\u003EHon DAVID CARTER\u003C/span\u003E: I withdraw, and apologise to the Greens.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000180\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ac169d29-4849-42c2-a4a7-f344fd416503\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00226272873e05dd40db9ad84993dc2efca4\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: I thank the Minister.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000181\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e4b09a29-dfd3-42c0-8585-11463bd6077b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002217d928fb56b84989b42968de524ebd1d\u0022\u003EHon DAVID CARTER\u003C/span\u003E: I also withdraw, and apologise to the Labour Party.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000182\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002281e8ca24-8b1d-4558-9ef9-c9418df2b3c0\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a0adb0eebdce48c9a1537bd2d6274152\u0022\u003EKevin Hague\u003C/span\u003E: Is it not blindingly obvious to the Minister that this completely hopeless voluntary and industry-controlled accord was only ever an excuse to avoid regulation; and given its complete failure to date, will he commit to setting quality standards for clean water?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000183\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e4b09a29-dfd3-42c0-8585-11463bd6077b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002281f12e644a0e45af9320b85f9a01d6d4\u0022\u003EHon DAVID CARTER\u003C/span\u003E: I do not accept that the accord has been a complete failure. We are ahead of the great majority of targets, which were set some time ago, in 2003. We are on track to achieve those targets by 2012.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000184\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002281e8ca24-8b1d-4558-9ef9-c9418df2b3c0\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022b2b744e1ebc64436bb23dd2e02d59a29\u0022\u003EKevin Hague\u003C/span\u003E: I seek leave to table a document. It is a photograph from March 2008 of cattle in the Manawat\u016B River.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000185\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ac169d29-4849-42c2-a4a7-f344fd416503\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00227fd7a1e8ab9549a58876ea64299bf435\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Leave is sought to table the photograph. Is there any objection? There is objection.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000186\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002292557bd5-0e66-473c-a6df-7d108e7822e3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00222c6580dec4564d7c9f6426ba10edaae0\u0022\u003EDr Kennedy Graham\u003C/span\u003E: I seek leave to table a document displaying a photograph from a book published in 1999 showing the Mayor of Stockholm, Sweden drinking a glass of water from Lake Malaren, just outside the city hall\u2014a goal that the Mayor of Rotorua could strive to emulate.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000187\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ac169d29-4849-42c2-a4a7-f344fd416503\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022c6a93e76d25d443286d02f28b2333f90\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Leave is sought to table a photograph, I believe. Is there any objection? There is objection.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000188\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u00222b0f1dbf89e84ad485e3a07f8d2641b9\u0022\u003EJob Support Scheme\u2014Reports\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000189\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a744a9a7-a2e8-401b-abfb-aec22a3818c8\u0022\u003E6. \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00228623bef26fa94b9e8cec17451a9adf48\u0022\u003EKATRINA SHANKS (National)\u003C/span\u003E to the Minister for Social Development and Employment: What reports has she seen that support the introduction of the Government\u2019s Job Support Scheme?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002263776108-58dc-4cab-baf1-95282c61d0de\u0022 data-id=\u0022f91a4795cb904cfe8db0886bd4051796\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000190\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002263776108-58dc-4cab-baf1-95282c61d0de\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022f91a4795cb904cfe8db0886bd4051796\u0022\u003EHon PAULA BENNETT (Minister for Social Development and Employment):\u003C/span\u003E There has been broad support for the first stage of the Government\u2019s Job Support Scheme. Gareth Morgan, economist, said: \u201CI think it\u2019s quite well-thought-out.\u201D Peter Townsend, Canterbury Employers Chamber of Commerce chief executive, said it is a step in the right direction. Vernon Small, in the Dominion Post this morning, called it a \u201Cwin-win when most of the economic news is lose, lose, lose.\u201D We promised action from the Job Summit, and we have delivered it.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000191\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a744a9a7-a2e8-401b-abfb-aec22a3818c8\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022bed15b10cf904e52bfb21f8560bf7aa7\u0022\u003EKatrina Shanks\u003C/span\u003E: How is work progressing on developing the new scheme for smaller companies that are having trouble keeping staff?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000192\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002263776108-58dc-4cab-baf1-95282c61d0de\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00226297e85952bf42da8832ee2806d8f030\u0022\u003EHon PAULA BENNETT\u003C/span\u003E: Just today I have come from a meeting with Workstream 1 from the Job Summit, which is meeting to design a completely new programme for small to medium sized employers, recognising that their needs are far more diverse than those of big employers and it is more complicated to design a programme to suit them. We will be announcing something in weeks, not months.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000193\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a744a9a7-a2e8-401b-abfb-aec22a3818c8\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022543bdc87ccec459db07ebe0951448605\u0022\u003EKatrina Shanks\u003C/span\u003E: What initiatives did the previous Labour Government put in place to support small companies?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000194\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002263776108-58dc-4cab-baf1-95282c61d0de\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022800fc148a43d4958bf8f6fac87dff71a\u0022\u003EHon PAULA BENNETT\u003C/span\u003E: That is a good question. I have been unable to find anything that the previous Government put in place to help to prevent any redundancies and to save those jobs. The previous Government was not able to put together a Job Summit. In fact, when the Hon Lianne Dalziel was Minister for Small Business, she received a report from the Small Business Advisory Group saying the best thing the Government could do to help business would be to introduce a 90-day trial period. I am incredibly proud that this Government delivered on that.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000195\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002209a5b71a-ca7e-4e7c-9e09-f9e63f18aa12\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00228c3a7df942fc4c25b2d4fb42f6bec12a\u0022\u003EHon Annette King\u003C/span\u003E: Has she also seen reports from the country\u2019s biggest private sector union, describing the Government\u2019s 9-day fortnight as a miserable subsidy that will be rejected by workers?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000196\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002263776108-58dc-4cab-baf1-95282c61d0de\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022c9de9afd361e4059a06e8767af30d946\u0022\u003EHon PAULA BENNETT\u003C/span\u003E: I have seen reports from the current Labour Party president complaining about the scheme. But I have also seen a report from Peter Conway, Secretary of the Council of Trade Unions, who says it benefits the workers, the company, and the country as a whole.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000197\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002209a5b71a-ca7e-4e7c-9e09-f9e63f18aa12\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022158ec315f8a64f96a09417e99a6ebe66\u0022\u003EHon Annette King\u003C/span\u003E: Has she noted the conflict between finance Minister Bill English, who said that some people are expecting wage subsidies, but that is probably unreal, and the Prime Minister\u2019s comments that he wants employers to provide such a subsidy; if so, whose side is she on?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000198\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002263776108-58dc-4cab-baf1-95282c61d0de\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00224fd0fd79644245a6b3f521d2f68ea2b0\u0022\u003EHon PAULA BENNETT\u003C/span\u003E: There is no conflict. What this Government has done over the last 3 months while it has been here has been to discuss the best way forward in terms of saving jobs. Many ideas have been thrown out there. This Government is proud to say some of the good ideas have come from outside Wellington, and we will back the good ones.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000199\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u0022dd70ccfa47d6434ea59ea189f1a2b98b\u0022\u003EPolice\u2014Public Safety\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000200\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f9c512a8-d532-4ef9-ad51-0fe8d752a893\u0022\u003E7. \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022e85db46ed30c46519f877086b0517464\u0022\u003EHon CLAYTON COSGROVE (Labour\u2014Waimakariri)\u003C/span\u003E to the Minister of Police: Does she agree with the Prime Minister\u2019s statement that \u201CNational believes protection of the public should be the most important consideration\u201D, and is that her most important consideration as police Minister?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022803002d1-e810-4bd8-b8e7-2e97d0d6f626\u0022 data-id=\u0022946a94d5e4f447309de1ffbb5280cc6a\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000201\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022803002d1-e810-4bd8-b8e7-2e97d0d6f626\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022946a94d5e4f447309de1ffbb5280cc6a\u0022\u003EHon SIMON POWER (Minister of Justice)\u003C/span\u003E on behalf of the Minister of Police: Yes.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000202\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f9c512a8-d532-4ef9-ad51-0fe8d752a893\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022b90ffca2d9c34d50847b812051d0ea54\u0022\u003EHon Clayton Cosgrove\u003C/span\u003E: What actions will she be taking to assure the public that when an alleged rapist applies for bail, the police do their job properly in that they check whether the proposed address is appropriate, that it is not close to schools and criminals, and, most important, that it is acceptable to the alleged victim\u2014in this case, a 15-year-old\u2014and, further, that this critical information is conveyed to the judge by the police prosecutor, given that these things were not done in the alleged rape case reported in this morning\u2019s Dominion Post?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000203\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022803002d1-e810-4bd8-b8e7-2e97d0d6f626\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00223fc0dad9423a4d05a141a9d8db2e97de\u0022\u003EHon SIMON POWER\u003C/span\u003E: Police prosecutions accept that they did not follow correct procedure, because they did not carry out adequate inquiries prior to the hearing and therefore did not alert the court to the proximity of the alleged offender in that case to the victim. The incident is unacceptable. I have been informed that this morning the police and the alleged offender\u2019s counsel have been working to find an alternative address for the offender to be bailed to by tomorrow. This is when the change in bail conditions would have taken effect from. How and why this occurred will be the subject of a review.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000204\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002225f8c78b-f301-4aca-a936-366f00a26bc9\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022861753f18f054a6f9e815c844a5d2e04\u0022\u003ESandra Goudie\u003C/span\u003E: What actions has the Government taken to make protection of the public the most important consideration within its first 100 days?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000205\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022803002d1-e810-4bd8-b8e7-2e97d0d6f626\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a2b2362ee277420196ddb0b0a04455ca\u0022\u003EHon SIMON POWER\u003C/span\u003E: In the first 92 days of the new Government, we passed legislation to make it harder to get bail and make crimes against children an aggravating factor in sentencing, and introduced bills to further protect victims of family violence, target gangs, expand the collection and use of DNA samples, impose a victim\u2019s levy on offenders, and remove parole for the worst repeat offenders. I think that stacks up pretty well against the first 100 days of Clayton Cosgrove\u2019s tenure as Associate Minister of Justice, which our records indicate resulted in one press release.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000206\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f9c512a8-d532-4ef9-ad51-0fe8d752a893\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002273cb06f4056b4a2a91a59323e78ada72\u0022\u003EHon Clayton Cosgrove\u003C/span\u003E: Does the Minister also agree with the comments of justice Minister, Simon Power, with regard to the Government\u2019s Bail Amendment Bill, that: \u201CThe overriding principle in taking these swift actions is the need to put public safety first.\u201D, and does she think this incident is a good example of the Government\u2019s swift actions in achieving public safety?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000207\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022803002d1-e810-4bd8-b8e7-2e97d0d6f626\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022354662cb2097432c800077a5447d9efc\u0022\u003EHon SIMON POWER\u003C/span\u003E: Yes, on behalf of the Minister of Police, I agree with the Minister of Justice. I am advised that the problem in this case was not with the law but that the police failed to follow the correct procedure laid down in the law on operational guidelines. I would also like to note that the member\u2019s party voted for the changes in the bail law prior to Christmas\u2014and the Government is grateful for that.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000208\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f9c512a8-d532-4ef9-ad51-0fe8d752a893\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002207036745e61a429481902e30fb19107f\u0022\u003EHon Clayton Cosgrove\u003C/span\u003E: Is the Minister not aware that under the watch of the Minister of Police there has been a litany of failures: the stabbing of a teacher at Avondale College, two escapes from police custody, large-scale gang confrontations in Gisborne, the killing of a young man after a tangi at Murupara, a police officer putting public safety at risk by allegedly driving drunk, and now\u2014of course\u2014this latest incident, and I could go on. When is she going to stop simply making excuses, wringing her hands, and start doing her job to ensure that public safety is her first priority?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000209\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022803002d1-e810-4bd8-b8e7-2e97d0d6f626\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022d6575c5dc00c43cc8c804a0cc857f5d8\u0022\u003EHon SIMON POWER\u003C/span\u003E: Action has been taken in respect of those sorts of matters. A lengthy list of legislation that has been passed through this House through the first 100 days shapes up pretty well compared with the one press release that the member put out about party pills in his first 100 days as Associate Minister of Justice.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000210\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u00223a7b6ada7ce54daeab8a59b3847bdd61\u0022\u003EAccident Compensation\u2014Cost Increases and Inflation Rate\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000211\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002218f9e3ea-81c5-4414-af48-d6bb843a9227\u0022\u003E8. \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00229c778483b198492ea27a100864526e9e\u0022\u003EMELISSA LEE (National)\u003C/span\u003E to the Minister for ACC: What has been the rate of cost increases at ACC and how does this compare with the rate of inflation?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022 data-id=\u00223e43eabfdf63425d8f00f8114c706b38\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000212\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00223e43eabfdf63425d8f00f8114c706b38\u0022\u003EHon Dr NICK SMITH (Minister for ACC):\u003C/span\u003E Claim and administration costs are this year projected to increase by $451 million on last year\u2014an increase of 15.6 percent. The increase for the 3 preceding years was 12.3 percent, 13.6 percent, and 10.4 percent. The average rate of inflation over that period has been 2.5 percent.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000213\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002218f9e3ea-81c5-4414-af48-d6bb843a9227\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022d00589a5064a4a4d9743c0453724f271\u0022\u003EMelissa Lee\u003C/span\u003E: Has the cost in administration of accident compensation exceeded the cost paid out in claims?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000214\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00224981f0d719724379bcd6a0eb22f54eab\u0022\u003EHon Dr NICK SMITH\u003C/span\u003E: Yes, administration costs have increased by 148 percent as compared with claim cost increases of 32 percent and inflation of 33 percent over the same period. This Government wants the focus to be on services to the public at the front line, and addressing the issue of the very large increase in administrative costs will be one of the priorities for the new board.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000215\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f5d71749-ae91-4af7-b2bd-77260398912a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002291af770067a849bc8e383671713b8773\u0022\u003EHon David Parker\u003C/span\u003E: Does the Minister accept that labour cost increases in recent years caused by better pay for doctors, nurses, and care workers were a significant part of the accident compensation scheme\u2019s overall cost increases, and that the low inflation environment that we are now in will see those pressures ease?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000216\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00227dc06cbad8f94bd1b2f02955c589f34d\u0022\u003EHon Dr NICK SMITH\u003C/span\u003E: The advice I have received about the projections of future cost increases is that they will be still very high and considerably above the rate of inflation. I say to this House quite honestly that anybody who thinks that ongoing cost increases in accident compensation of 15 percent per year in a recession are appropriate are, I really think, on the wrong side of the debate.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000217\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002218f9e3ea-81c5-4414-af48-d6bb843a9227\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002225bbbe6ff1dd43d688e1cd7ff5831318\u0022\u003EMelissa Lee\u003C/span\u003E: What advice has the Minister received on the impact of reduced rehabilitation rates and an increasing pool of long-term claims on accident compensation costs?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000218\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022fec39d0d3a3f4fcda8e1940a1c6197ea\u0022\u003EHon Dr NICK SMITH\u003C/span\u003E: Rehabilitation rates have, as measured at the 3-month, 6-month, and 12-month rate, all declined over the last 3 years and this is adding significantly to accident compensation costs. The latest 3-month rate of rehabilitation is the lowest that has ever been recorded. The long-term weekly compensation claims have also been increasing since 2005 and these too are having an adverse impact on the scheme\u2019s finances.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000219\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f5d71749-ae91-4af7-b2bd-77260398912a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022e6c071f7efc24088b35edba51e9a2dea\u0022\u003EHon David Parker\u003C/span\u003E: How can the Minister complain that the accident compensation scheme is unaffordable when it is so much cheaper than the Australian equivalent, and to quote Brian Fallow of the New Zealand Herald again, it is a \u201Ccivilised and cost-effective approach to dealing with the injured. Why undermine confidence in the scheme, unless you plan to undermine the scheme itself?\u201D.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000220\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022d9ace5312e024493b9b45248676ed070\u0022\u003EHon Dr NICK SMITH\u003C/span\u003E: I have made it absolutely plain that I am committed to the Woodhouse principles of accident compensation. When the member makes comparisons with Australia, for instance in relation to the work account, he needs to note that motor vehicle costs are not included in New Zealand\u2019s work account but are in Australia\u2019s. Those significant differences need to be noted when making comparisons but the member can be reassured that this Government is about securing the future of the accident compensation scheme and managing costs better.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000221\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u002258c683ffd8354a2f8e2844bfbfb0f7c5\u0022\u003EResource Management Act, Reforms\u2014Consultation with M\u0101ori Party\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000222\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221fb8d8db-3e96-49c7-ab1c-b7916a50e30e\u0022\u003E9. \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022c634dbe93a36450fac1448dd6c47e3c9\u0022\u003EHon STEVE CHADWICK (Labour)\u003C/span\u003E to the Minister of Conservation: Did he discuss the proposed removal of the Minister of Conservation\u2019s powers to make the final decision on applications for restricted coastal activities under section 119 with the M\u0101ori Party before agreeing to remove this power from the Resource Management Act?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022 data-id=\u0022c1c35e820813433daba853a802e7a9d9\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000223\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022c1c35e820813433daba853a802e7a9d9\u0022\u003EHon Dr NICK SMITH (Minister for the Environment)\u003C/span\u003E on behalf of the Minister of Conservation: No, the Minister did not have any direct discussions with the M\u0101ori Party, but he was advised by the Minister for the Environment that there were extensive discussions with the M\u0101ori Party on all aspects of the resource management reform bill.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000224\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221fb8d8db-3e96-49c7-ab1c-b7916a50e30e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00227ef76782ef614cc686c1f5cb69a6d0bf\u0022\u003EHon Steve Chadwick\u003C/span\u003E: Did the Minister raise with the Minister for the Environment any of the concerns raised in the Department of Conservation\u2019s submission to him on the Resource Management (Simplifying and Streamlining) Amendment Bill; if not, why not?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000225\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00226e3b89f1990f4aefbed17b16c2e8d167\u0022\u003EHon Dr NICK SMITH\u003C/span\u003E: The Minister of Conservation had an extensive discussion with the Minister for the Environment about the veto on restricted coastal activities that was provided by the Minister. It is my view that the veto used by the previous Government completely discredited the process, and I think most New Zealanders welcome the fact that future decisions will be made by the Environment Court, and not by Ministers of the Crown, on individual consents.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000226\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221fb8d8db-3e96-49c7-ab1c-b7916a50e30e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00227cbe7fce416b4412b49200ceb667566e\u0022\u003EHon Steve Chadwick\u003C/span\u003E: Does that confirm that the Minister made no effort to protect his statutory responsibilities as the final decision-maker on restricted coastal activities, which enable him to fulfil his role as an advocate for the preservation and protection of New Zealand\u2019s natural and historical resources, because discussion between Ministers went in a different direction?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000227\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022d8a039824d9d45399f00a3f2c4c24cb2\u0022\u003EHon Dr NICK SMITH\u003C/span\u003E: I note that the member, who is the previous Minister of Conservation, did not change one single decision on restricted coastal activities.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000228\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002275a05f96-2474-4c90-a6ea-cf7b5798e03e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00223d1aaf866e2c4ad8aae3da7d8c1ed5b3\u0022\u003EHon Ruth Dyson\u003C/span\u003E: What\u2019s that got to do with the answer?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000229\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022095d77afc581424391318f6f241b8f78\u0022\u003EHon Dr NICK SMITH\u003C/span\u003E: Well, it is very important. Let me tell members why it is important. Why would we want to hold up consents for months and months when the court has decided that the powers that the Minister holds, which the member is making such a big deal of, are very, very narrow and it would be only in extreme circumstances that a Minister could overturn a decision of the Environment Court?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000230\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221fb8d8db-3e96-49c7-ab1c-b7916a50e30e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022b0faa2719be24bb094807d007980fa15\u0022\u003EHon Steve Chadwick\u003C/span\u003E: I seek leave to table a paper to the Cabinet economic growth and infrastructure committee on 16 February on the Resource Management (Simplifying and Streamlining) Amendment Bill, with the comment \u201CDiscussion amongst Ministers went in a different direction.\u201D\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000231\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ac169d29-4849-42c2-a4a7-f344fd416503\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022d5e67714378f4150b476f1d8aee1afdf\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Leave is sought to table that document. Is there any objection? There is no objection.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000232\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ac169d29-4849-42c2-a4a7-f344fd416503\u0022\u003EDocument, by leave, laid on the Table of the House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000233\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u0022fa2adbc109da4323a87aad1831cea82e\u0022\u003EWater Supply\u2014Funding\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000234\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ec266512-9fe8-47da-883e-48f046ee5059\u0022\u003E10. \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022bf9c2f68640a4798a9ddb59fedfdcc04\u0022\u003ETE URUROA FLAVELL (M\u0101ori Party\u2014Waiariki)\u003C/span\u003E to the Minister of Local Government: What funding is available from central government for small communities to upgrade their water supply?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022bc1e9f65-e08b-4939-867c-22ef093e2a4e\u0022 data-id=\u00223eee4eb1336c4b0787770a290aa7aaad\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000235\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bc1e9f65-e08b-4939-867c-22ef093e2a4e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00223eee4eb1336c4b0787770a290aa7aaad\u0022\u003EHon RODNEY HIDE (Minister of Local Government):\u003C/span\u003E I am advised by my department that the Ministry of Health runs a Drinking-water Assistance Programme, which was started in 2006, with approximately $136 million available over 10 years. The programme provides technical and capital assistance for communities of fewer than 5,000 people to enable them to get safe drinking-water. I am advised that factors that affect the level of the subsidy provided are the size of the community and its assessed level of deprivation.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000236\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ec266512-9fe8-47da-883e-48f046ee5059\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022c7bda3874f804aa585cb89d9a3559112\u0022\u003ETe Ururoa Flavell\u003C/span\u003E: Is the Minister aware that some residents of Bridge P\u0101 have been out of water since December 2008\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000237\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227f8c14fb-b919-46ef-866b-8db68cfa4cf0\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022b864c4e7d2e1469b81c77c05b841bb88\u0022\u003EHon Dr Michael Cullen\u003C/span\u003E: I raise a point of order, Mr Speaker. I have an interesting question here, given our previous discussions about the responsibilities of the Minister of M\u0101ori Affairs. We learnt from the Minister that a funding programme is available through the Ministry of Health, and that it was put in place by the previous Labour Government. If that is so, then, consistent with your previous rulings, this question can scarcely be answered by the Minister of Local Government. He is dealing with it because it is a general policy matter relating to local government, you have ruled that general policy matters relating to M\u0101ori cannot be dealt with by the Minister of M\u0101ori Affairs, and it seems to me these are now on all fours. Are we to assume that there is one rule for the P\u0101keh\u0101 Minister of Local Government and another rule for the M\u0101ori Minister of M\u0101ori Affairs?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000238\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ac169d29-4849-42c2-a4a7-f344fd416503\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022e596321efd894bec9489f320ef04ea38\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: No, there is not. I invite the member to continue his question. [Interruption] If members want me to get trifling and pedantic, I can, but it will not be in the Opposition\u2019s interests. I consider that the point made by the Hon Dr Michael Cullen was not a well-made point, because the Minister of Local Government has responsibility for matters to do with local government, and that is the determining factor. I invite the member to carry on with his question.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000239\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227f8c14fb-b919-46ef-866b-8db68cfa4cf0\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022698b7c9978884ee6aeb95d8fd2d53b61\u0022\u003EHon Dr Michael Cullen\u003C/span\u003E: I raise a point of order, Mr Speaker. Do we take it from that ruling that the Minister of M\u0101ori Affairs does not have responsibility for matters to do with M\u0101ori?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000240\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ac169d29-4849-42c2-a4a7-f344fd416503\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022134664f098334230bfec2bb1747e7973\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: I invite the senior member\u2014the shadow Leader of the House\u2014to be careful. He knows that the Minister of M\u0101ori Affairs has responsibility for M\u0101ori affairs\u2014that portfolio. It is not my role as Speaker to judge what should fall within it. Te Ururoa Flavell is asking a supplementary question.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000241\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e0192ed9-5715-4f6c-bd52-8db4f3466087\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00221787e404ab414936aad721e1f82b2578\u0022\u003EHon David Cunliffe\u003C/span\u003E: I raise a point of order, Mr Speaker. I do not wish to detain the House, but we all share an interest in ensuring that our questions are within the Standing Orders and within your rulings. I believe that the point of order made by the Hon Dr Michael Cullen was a fair and serious point of order. No, I am not challenging your ruling, but I am seeking your guidance on how we should deal with the issue of Ministers who have direct portfolio responsibilities for programmes\u2014and both the Minister of M\u0101ori Affairs and the Minister of Local Government do; that is all agreed\u2014and also have statutory responsibilities for general issues that fall within their bailiwick. The problem is that you have ruled out a question to the Minister of M\u0101ori Affairs that fell within one but not the other, and you have ruled in a question to the Minister of Local Government that specifically related to a programme funded by the Ministry of Health.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000242\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ac169d29-4849-42c2-a4a7-f344fd416503\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002287d6a5eb52734b9382fcc522c043c976\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: I have heard the member\u2019s point sufficiently. I invite members to have a look at the statement I made at the commencement of today\u2019s sitting. In fact, I was acknowledging in that statement that the points made by Dr Michael Cullen yesterday were actually very valid points, and that when I reflected on my rulings on them and looked at them very carefully, I was troubled by some of them. That was why I apologised to the House. And I pointed out that it was not Dr Cullen\u2019s supplementary questions that I should have ruled out; in fact, in my view\u2014when I listened to the tape and looked at Hansard\u2014the questions of Te Ururoa Flavell and the Hon Chris Finlayson were out of order yesterday. I invite the member to read the statement I made, because in many ways it was consistent with the points that Dr Michael Cullen was making. For the good order of the House, I invite Te Ururoa Flavell to continue with his supplementary question.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000243\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e0192ed9-5715-4f6c-bd52-8db4f3466087\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022b9968cf4793b4be3b9ea572b6b1b43f2\u0022\u003EHon David Cunliffe\u003C/span\u003E: I raise a point of order, Mr Speaker. I appreciate very much your clarification of your earlier ruling, and we will give it careful consideration to ensure that we comply with it. But can we take that your point, as confirmed now, that the questions from several Government members and Ministers were out of order implies that you wish to be consistent about the narrow construction\u2014which is perfectly in order, it would seem\u2014that only those matters within the direct portfolio responsibility are relevant. If that is true, then I am afraid we come back to the question to the Minister of Local Government; it was about a Ministry of Health programme, and that Minister sought to answer it as Minister of Local Government. How does that fit within your considered ruling?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000244\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ac169d29-4849-42c2-a4a7-f344fd416503\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022ed38b0d8ac0b4cd7a070b5a4b7e08a5c\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: The issue I clarified today was the issue relating to the situation where a Minister has made it clear that he or she does not have responsibility. In that case, supplementary questions should not ask about reports in relation to that area. That was, in my view, where I erred yesterday. So I am acknowledging to the House that in my view I erred yesterday. We should not be petty about this. I have also made it clear today that I will take a wide view of ministerial responsibilities, as has been the practice, and that the approach I plan to take is similar to that taken by Speaker Burke in the 1980s. I think he handled this area very well. It has got rather more difficult since then, because of the great number of parties in the House. It is more difficult, but I still think we can deal with it sensibly. I put it to the member that we need to deal with this matter sensibly. I was not happy with some of the rulings yesterday, and that was why I sought to clarify them this morning. I pointed out that it was not the Opposition\u2019s questions that I was most concerned about, on reviewing the tapes and Hansard; it was some other supplementary questions that I think actually complicated the situation very significantly. The Minister of Local Government is being questioned on local government matters. I will listen very carefully to the question, to make sure he is being questioned on local government matters.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000245\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ec266512-9fe8-47da-883e-48f046ee5059\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022d2be53bf4f2d41479441e306a3415c91\u0022\u003ETe Ururoa Flavell\u003C/span\u003E: Is the Minister aware that some residents of Bridge P\u0101 have been out of water since December 2008, and could he give assistance, by way of advice or otherwise, to the local bodies, so that a reticulated water system can be installed to support the Bridge P\u0101 community?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000246\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bc1e9f65-e08b-4939-867c-22ef093e2a4e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002207da7ddb391e4070a25e4a06e1273e7c\u0022\u003EHon RODNEY HIDE\u003C/span\u003E: I thank the member for raising this question with the Minister of Local Government. I note that the future supply of water to this community is the responsibility of the community and, indeed, the local council. I am aware that, like many New Zealand communities, the residents of Bridge P\u0101 rely on individual household bores for their water supply. I understand that during the very dry conditions experienced in the area, some bores have run dry. Decisions about the future water supply of this community rest with the community and with the local council. I understand that on 8 March 2009 three proposals to address the issue were presented to the community. These were two proposals to connect Bridge P\u0101 to the Hastings town supply, and one proposal to put in a stand-alone supply. I also understand that the Bridge P\u0101 community is considering seeking funding for the local marae trust to operate a reticulated supply. Ministry of Health officials will be presenting information on the Drinking-water Assistance Programme to an inter-agency hui of representatives from all interested parties tomorrow. I understand that the Hon Tariana Turia is also going to Bridge P\u0101 tomorrow to discuss this matter.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000247\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ec266512-9fe8-47da-883e-48f046ee5059\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022f4caa1fc2e8c4a4fbf2477dc462fbd46\u0022\u003ETe Ururoa Flavell\u003C/span\u003E: Is the Minister aware that a recent Hastings District Council door-to-door survey revealed that 35 houses in the village are without water, and that some have been without it for as long as 6 weeks; and how can such a dire water shortage exist when just down the road plans are being made to install a 50,000 cubic metre lake?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000248\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ac169d29-4849-42c2-a4a7-f344fd416503\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00227ec13a8712614c65b92d912fbe6520bc\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: The Hon Rodney Hide\u2014rather more briefly.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000249\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bc1e9f65-e08b-4939-867c-22ef093e2a4e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002293174e1243fb4cd987ede029518616a8\u0022\u003EHon RODNEY HIDE\u003C/span\u003E: I am advised that the Hastings District Council first found out about the problem only on 11 February 2009.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000250\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c186d0a2-99f4-408b-9b4d-d484cf19724d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00226b13b7baafad4256885d4143b1cb5f65\u0022\u003EHon Lianne Dalziel\u003C/span\u003E: You\u2019re remarkably well briefed for a question you didn\u2019t write.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000251\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bc1e9f65-e08b-4939-867c-22ef093e2a4e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022d9aa0bc747124ea7bc7c31392155f895\u0022\u003EHon RODNEY HIDE\u003C/span\u003E: It is great to be criticised by the Opposition for being well briefed. Those members are not used to Ministers who know how to do their job, are they. I understand that the Hastings District Council has been providing emergency relief to the community. As I have previously advised, decisions about the future water supply of this community are for the council or the community to make, and I am very pleased that our colleague Tariana Turia will be at Bridge P\u0101 tomorrow.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000252\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f44431ef-b505-4e94-9f57-a60b0a569bf7\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a2d9c482d2d94c5b84b6af074635235e\u0022\u003EHon Shane Jones\u003C/span\u003E: When will the Minister share with the M\u0101ori Party that his agenda is to privatise the delivery of water to residents as he is currently doing by secretly trying to privatise the port of Northland, aided and abetted by Mr John Carter?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000253\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bc1e9f65-e08b-4939-867c-22ef093e2a4e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022993dd107d81f44bdb8980de3f1092405\u0022\u003EHon RODNEY HIDE\u003C/span\u003E: Interestingly, the residents of Bridge P\u0101\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000254\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022bea13fc69c704c6a9b10f145cbd59398\u0022\u003EHon Trevor Mallard\u003C/span\u003E: I raise a point of order, Mr Speaker. Again, I am very reluctant to do this when it is one of my own team asking the question, but how can it be possible that \u201Cgagged\u201D is ruled out, but \u201Caided and abetted\u201D is allowed?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000255\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ac169d29-4849-42c2-a4a7-f344fd416503\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002206f2d5c9d12f4bcc8adde94f4d7567cc\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: The Minister does not appear to have taken any objection to it. I invite the Minister to answer the question.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000256\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bc1e9f65-e08b-4939-867c-22ef093e2a4e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00223ccbd4b516ee4092b1a8b5daf5d40c3a\u0022\u003EHon RODNEY HIDE\u003C/span\u003E: Interestingly, the water supply for Bridge P\u0101 is currently privatised. That was the point, and if the member had listened to the supplementary question, he would have realised that the people of Bridge P\u0101 had their own bores. This Minister of Local Government is working with the M\u0101ori Party to assist Bridge P\u0101 to get water. I would have thought that was something the Labour Opposition would be interested in doing.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000257\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002267aa5137-7503-4a8f-bde1-1811615598e2\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002203824c590562445280d58d7f30b46289\u0022\u003EBrendon Burns\u003C/span\u003E: Can the Minister advise what the impact on improving the quality of the water of communities like Bridge P\u0101 would be if the advice from the Job Summit to impose a moratorium on meeting water-quality standards was taken?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000258\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bc1e9f65-e08b-4939-867c-22ef093e2a4e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022b6eada3a3db241e59fed3c89a65c3f93\u0022\u003EHon RODNEY HIDE\u003C/span\u003E: None whatsoever. The advice I have received is that the drinking-water standards put in place by the previous Government would put tens of millions of dollars on some communities to meet standards that those communities do not want or need.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000259\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u0022d7801458e8f84bca85e125df2ce94da7\u0022\u003ECopyright Act\u2014Section 92A\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000260\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00222aa0b524-c38d-45aa-bd5b-99c5927085f4\u0022\u003E11. \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002241fe8ff0c42c46adaa4035b21b0b2503\u0022\u003ECLARE CURRAN (Labour\u2014Dunedin South)\u003C/span\u003E to the Minister of Commerce: Will the Government support the policy of amending section 92A of the Copyright Act 1994 as set out in my Copyright (Internet Service Provider Account Termination Policy) Bill; if not, why not?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022803002d1-e810-4bd8-b8e7-2e97d0d6f626\u0022 data-id=\u00228e935398fcaf4df09814c17d2cd95a20\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000261\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022803002d1-e810-4bd8-b8e7-2e97d0d6f626\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00228e935398fcaf4df09814c17d2cd95a20\u0022\u003EHon SIMON POWER (Minister of Commerce):\u003C/span\u003E No, not as set out in the member\u2019s bill. The Government\u2019s policy is to give Internet providers and right-holders 1 month to come up with a code of practice. That time frame has yet to expire, and although there are some challenges I am not prepared to prejudge the outcome. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000262\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00222aa0b524-c38d-45aa-bd5b-99c5927085f4\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002297648fe1dc564373b39c61e2788bcc5c\u0022\u003EClare Curran\u003C/span\u003E: How does the Government expect section 92A of the Copyright Act to be able to come into force given that TelstraClear has vetoed the code of practice being developed by the significant stakeholders?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000263\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022803002d1-e810-4bd8-b8e7-2e97d0d6f626\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022bac3795716c247f19aeb9e1fc4f9ad8b\u0022\u003EHon SIMON POWER\u003C/span\u003E: I am advised that the rest of the Telecommunications Carriers Forum, the Recording Industry Association of New Zealand, and other right-holders are making real progress on the code of practice. If TelstraClear wants to be excluded from the arrangement, that is its choice. I met with right-holders as recently as 7 o\u2019clock this morning, and according to the member\u2019s press release yesterday, her bill requires ministerial approval of any code before section 92A comes into force, meaning that it still relies on the parties coming to an agreement first. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000264\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00222aa0b524-c38d-45aa-bd5b-99c5927085f4\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00222cc1d0b4a8d94e00ae29c5f4b65a0f43\u0022\u003EClare Curran\u003C/span\u003E: Will the Government establish an independent adjudicator to resolve copyright disputes; if so, who; and if not, why not?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000265\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022803002d1-e810-4bd8-b8e7-2e97d0d6f626\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022896391d08e92446c8a415d375394d492\u0022\u003EHon SIMON POWER\u003C/span\u003E: I am not prepared to prejudge the outcome of the negotiations that are continuing at the moment. I find the Labour Party\u2019s position on this issue rather confusing. The member wants to keep section 92A but amend it; the former Minister, Judith Tizard, said that it should come into force as it is, explaining that it was left deliberately vague as \u201Cat no stage did I think \u2026 I had the answer to the process\u201D; and the Labour candidate for Hunua, Mr Jordan Carter, is the contact for yesterday\u2019s press release from InternetNZ that said that section 92A should be dumped. Maybe Labour needs its own code of practice.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000266\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u002266ba5d9f26384dff9e867eab729cd0f9\u0022\u003EForeshore and Seabed Act\u2014Review\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000267\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002267431f57-e958-4c83-b438-7da8061d479e\u0022\u003E12. \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002220ea808c667a44b19ee7dd088144eb36\u0022\u003EPAUL QUINN (National)\u003C/span\u003E to the Attorney-General: Why is the Government reviewing the Foreshore and Seabed Act 2004?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002241146229-4d11-415b-a4ac-f4e2b923e95d\u0022 data-id=\u00223c9c562a621c4678b7a646ecc072fd8f\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000268\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002241146229-4d11-415b-a4ac-f4e2b923e95d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00223c9c562a621c4678b7a646ecc072fd8f\u0022\u003EHon CHRISTOPHER FINLAYSON (Attorney-General):\u003C/span\u003E It is doing that for a number of reasons. First, it fulfils a term of the supply and confidence agreement between the National Party and the M\u0101ori Party; it is an example of the constructive engagement that characterises our relationship. The Act has been controversial since it was passed in 2004, and that leads on to the second reason\u2014the review will consider, among other things, whether the Act effectively recognises and provides for customary and public interests in the coastal marine area, and allows for the enhancement of mana whenua. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000269\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002267431f57-e958-4c83-b438-7da8061d479e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022e469a6c58be648dc8472d6bae2aef9d0\u0022\u003EPaul Quinn\u003C/span\u003E: How does this Government\u2019s approach differ from that of the previous Government?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000270\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002241146229-4d11-415b-a4ac-f4e2b923e95d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022d8ca4aae7b004353a50df20c8c7e93ba\u0022\u003EHon CHRISTOPHER FINLAYSON\u003C/span\u003E: The Government will engage constructively and in good faith with interested parties. The review panel will hold a series of hui and meetings for all New Zealanders, M\u0101ori and non-M\u0101ori, throughout the country.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000271\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c437bda8-4741-4ac5-89ab-b0818e1ab9fa\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022c213f95a9f93432e9ad4c104bb65ed60\u0022\u003EHon Darren Hughes\u003C/span\u003E: Before they get sacked.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000272\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002241146229-4d11-415b-a4ac-f4e2b923e95d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022102b75ab3bec4f79bae2da61b8e5fb38\u0022\u003EHon CHRISTOPHER FINLAYSON\u003C/span\u003E: If I may say this to Mr Hughes, that stands in contrast to the previous Government, which ignored a 40,000-strong delegation of New Zealanders who marched on Parliament, preferring instead to meet with a sheep, and which described Dr Pita Sharples, a man who has dedicated his life to empowering M\u0101ori through education, as a \u201Chater\u201D and a \u201Cwrecker\u201D.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000273\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002267431f57-e958-4c83-b438-7da8061d479e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00228cd33028df81455a98ad32f7bbea0268\u0022\u003EPaul Quinn\u003C/span\u003E: What support has the Minister seen for constructive engagements in the review of the Foreshore and Seabed Act?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000274\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002241146229-4d11-415b-a4ac-f4e2b923e95d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002217b07509fb914d2789c5c5708f647d83\u0022\u003EHon CHRISTOPHER FINLAYSON\u003C/span\u003E: I have seen a press release from the Hon David Parker, saying that \u201CLabour will constructively engage with the Government over the review of the Foreshore and Seabed Act.\u201D, and that \u201CThe last thing New Zealanders need is for this issue to be used to incite disharmony again and we won\u2019t go there.\u201D This contrasts with the disappointing comments of the Leader of the Opposition, who called the review \u201Cextremely divisive\u201D, and publicly called for the review not to proceed\u2014echoes of Winston Peters.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000275\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227f8c14fb-b919-46ef-866b-8db68cfa4cf0\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002258fcafa4a11444a79cbf463c9c2d23a7\u0022\u003EHon Dr Michael Cullen\u003C/span\u003E: Does the Minister, in the light of that last answer, recall seeing billboards in relation to the foreshore and seabed that said \u201CIwi/Kiwi\u201D; and which side is he on now?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000276\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002241146229-4d11-415b-a4ac-f4e2b923e95d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022549cd33b010f49788c72ef0697ecd753\u0022\u003EHon CHRISTOPHER FINLAYSON\u003C/span\u003E: The member does recall seeing those signs; times have moved on. We are attempting to deal with an issue for the benefit of all New Zealanders. I must say that I am increasingly disappointed in that member\u2019s petty and catty comments, because I think he is better than that. What we are trying to do is constructively deal with this issue for the benefit of all New Zealanders. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000277\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002267431f57-e958-4c83-b438-7da8061d479e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022bbb1a34e4abe49b3948c482072c6f616\u0022\u003EPaul Quinn\u003C/span\u003E: How has the Government engaged with its support parties in undertaking the review?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000278\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002241146229-4d11-415b-a4ac-f4e2b923e95d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022219c5a9c3f9749dabce1e53024be9506\u0022\u003EHon CHRISTOPHER FINLAYSON\u003C/span\u003E: Very constructively. As the Minister responsible for the review, I am very pleased to report to the House that there has been a great deal of constructive engagement and consultation with the co-leaders of the M\u0101ori Party and the new member for Te Tai Tonga, Rahui Katene. The M\u0101ori Party has made an important and valuable contribution\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000279\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f44431ef-b505-4e94-9f57-a60b0a569bf7\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a55198e8655142a5af04bac4b13e2a56\u0022\u003EHon Shane Jones\u003C/span\u003E: Hey\u2014Harawira doesn\u2019t agree.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000280\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002241146229-4d11-415b-a4ac-f4e2b923e95d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00220c1a60d9363345ea955caffcada2fa5a\u0022\u003EHon CHRISTOPHER FINLAYSON\u003C/span\u003E: \u2014to the review, and I for one am very much looking forward, I tell Mr Jones, to receiving the report of the review, and then moving forward in the interests of all New Zealanders. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000281\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227f8c14fb-b919-46ef-866b-8db68cfa4cf0\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022af4aec64bf7b4bef8b485027779eb65c\u0022\u003EHon Dr Michael Cullen\u003C/span\u003E: Has the Minister seen a press statement from the Minister of M\u0101ori Affairs, Dr Pita Sharples, yesterday, saying that the Foreshore and Seabed Act \u201Cconfiscated\u201D the foreshore and seabed from M\u0101ori; and does he accept the implication that M\u0101ori own all the foreshore and seabed?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000282\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002241146229-4d11-415b-a4ac-f4e2b923e95d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022eddb2598e4f54287995748d90779f1ff\u0022\u003EHon CHRISTOPHER FINLAYSON\u003C/span\u003E: I must confess I have not seen that comment; I have seen a number of comments from the Minister. I simply say to the member that we are awaiting the outcome of the review. Let us await the outcome of the review and then deal with the issue in the light of the very statesmanlike qualities of Mr Parker\u2014who stands head and shoulders above other lawyers in his caucus\u2014for the benefit of all New Zealanders.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n    \u003C/div\u003E\n    \u003Cdiv class=\u0022HpsHansard\u0022\u003E\n      \u003Cp\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsProceedingHeading\u0022\u003EBills\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000283\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u002269a038181d194c0d82c7c7fa2c087e92\u0022\u003ETaxation (Business Tax Measures) Bill\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000284\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u00224af6de54b0714ef0b1ee82990edc3ad9\u0022\u003ESecond Reading\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022803002d1-e810-4bd8-b8e7-2e97d0d6f626\u0022 data-id=\u0022f5943e02e4214ade8064e3b67ba7b860\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000285\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022803002d1-e810-4bd8-b8e7-2e97d0d6f626\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022f5943e02e4214ade8064e3b67ba7b860\u0022\u003EHon SIMON POWER (Associate Minister of Finance)\u003C/span\u003E on behalf of the Minister of Revenue: I move, That the Taxation (Business Tax Measures) Bill be now read a second time. The main purpose of the bill is to ease the burden of taxes on firms\u2019 cash flows, and to make paying tax easier by reducing tax compliance costs for businesses. It is a clear fact that in the current climate many businesses are experiencing pressure on their cash flows\u2014none more so than the smaller businesses that make up more than 96 percent of New Zealand\u2019s business community. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000286\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022803002d1-e810-4bd8-b8e7-2e97d0d6f626\u0022\u003EThe Government recognises the impact that the current economic climate is having on these businesses, and has responded with a $480 million suite of compliance-free measures. Many of these measures are contained in this bill. Others, such as reducing the rates of use-of-money interest for underpayments and overpayments of tax, have already been progressed by Orders in Council.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000287\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c437bda8-4741-4ac5-89ab-b0818e1ab9fa\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00221714e02a019247e9841399985c532919\u0022\u003EHon Darren Hughes\u003C/span\u003E: I raise a point of order, Mr Speaker. I know the Minister is taking the Bill Birch imitation the whole way, but there is a lot of noise in the House at the moment while he is trying to deliver his speech and it is just impossible to hear him. The Leader of the Opposition has his back to you, Mr Deputy Speaker, and is conducting a meeting with the M\u0101ori Party. There is a lot of disorder in the House, and we cannot hear this fine Minister\u2019s contributions. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000288\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022893adc11-ce4e-419c-a079-08f04b3d75f5\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022338830caebdd4fc5aa597bab5c6eeae4\u0022\u003EMr DEPUTY SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: I thank the member for that. I would ask members, please, who are not participating in the debate and who wish to have discussions to have them out in the lobbies and not within the House. Thank you for that point of order.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000289\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022803002d1-e810-4bd8-b8e7-2e97d0d6f626\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022e9e4c63f6c5442b997e1fc8647e5ee85\u0022\u003EHon SIMON POWER\u003C/span\u003E: I am grateful for the intervention of the senior Opposition whip, and I know that he is always watching my back. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000290\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022803002d1-e810-4bd8-b8e7-2e97d0d6f626\u0022\u003EThe proposals in this bill cover a range of provisions to allow businesses to hold tax moneys longer, and to lower the cost of doing business by reducing the amount of form-filling they have to do, and the calculations and payments they have to make.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000291\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022803002d1-e810-4bd8-b8e7-2e97d0d6f626\u0022\u003EThe first of these changes is the removal of the 5 percent uplift in the calculation and payment of provisional tax. Currently, payers of provisional tax who use this method must use the previous year\u2019s income tax and add 5 percent to the total in order to calculate the amount of provisional tax they must pay in the coming year. That extra 5 percent, or uplift factor, is based on the assumption that income will grow over the new income year. In today\u2019s economic climate that assumption is no longer clear-cut. The bill therefore allows the uplift of the provisional tax calculation to be reduced for the current and next income years. This should help relieve some of the pressure that small businesses are facing, by reducing the amount of provisional tax payments that businesses must make, and, in turn, this will free up much-needed cash-flow for those businesses. A further proposal makes it possible for a greater number of individual taxpayers to reduce their exposure to use-of-money interest. This change was previously part of the omnibus taxation bill introduced last July, but has been included in this bill to ensure its speedy enactment. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000292\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022803002d1-e810-4bd8-b8e7-2e97d0d6f626\u0022\u003EOther changes in the previous tax bill have been significantly enhanced in this bill, which also introduces some important new measures. These measures are designed to lower costs for many businesses by reducing the number of returns they have to complete, the number of calculations they have to make, and, ultimately, the number of tax payments they have to make. For example, the GST payments threshold will be raised from $1.3 million to $2 million. This will give more businesses the cash-flow advantages of accounting for GST when payment from an invoice is actually received, rather than when the invoice is issued. In addition, the income threshold over which the GST registration is mandatory will be raised from $40,000 to $60,000. This will allow businesses that earn less than $60,000 to opt out of the GST system should they wish, so they no longer have to bear the compliance costs associated with accounting for GST. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000293\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022803002d1-e810-4bd8-b8e7-2e97d0d6f626\u0022\u003EThe turnover threshold under which businesses can make GST returns 6-monthly instead of 2-monthly will also rise from $250,000 to $500,000. This move will be especially welcomed by businesses with seasonally based income, such as the horticulture industry. The PAYE once-a-month filing threshold will be raised from $100,000 to $500,000, to allow more employers to file PAYE returns and pay PAYE once, rather than twice, a month. The threshold under which businesses may file fringe benefit returns annually is also being raised from $100,000 to $500,000. Similarly, the value of minor fringe benefits that employers can give their employees without attracting fringe benefit tax will rise from $15,000 to $22,500 a year per employer, and rise from $200 to $300 per quarter per employee. This means fewer employers will have to account for fringe benefit tax in relation to minor benefits they may provide to their employees. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000294\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022803002d1-e810-4bd8-b8e7-2e97d0d6f626\u0022\u003EFinally, the bill introduces a new $10,000 threshold for business-related legal expenditure. This means that if a business\u2019 total bill for business-related legal fees in a given income year is $10,000 or below, the entire amount will be tax deductible, without having to identify which amounts relate to non-deductible capital expenditure and which amounts are deductible revenue expenditure. Together these provisions present a package of assistance to smaller businesses that will help them to save time and money, and to weather the current economic climate. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000295\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022803002d1-e810-4bd8-b8e7-2e97d0d6f626\u0022\u003EIn bringing the bill to its second reading, the Finance and Expenditure Committee has recommended a small number of minor drafting changes of a technical nature. On behalf of the Minister of Revenue, I wish to express my sincere thanks to the members of the committee for the cooperative and constructive way in which they have progressed this bill, which I now have great pleasure in commending to the House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022e0192ed9-5715-4f6c-bd52-8db4f3466087\u0022 data-id=\u00220f6d963f82da49698b5f2a9aab6de5b6\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000296\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e0192ed9-5715-4f6c-bd52-8db4f3466087\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00220f6d963f82da49698b5f2a9aab6de5b6\u0022\u003EHon DAVID CUNLIFFE (Labour\u2014New Lynn):\u003C/span\u003E The Opposition notes with some regret that on the very day that the Taxation (Business Tax Measures) Bill reaches its second reading, the Performance of Manufacturing Index has reached its lowest point ever. Today is also the day when the Reserve Bank has dropped the official cash rate to 3 percent\u2014one of its lowest levels for many, many years\u2014in view of the deepening and worsening recession that will hit small business hard. I know that out there beyond the confines of Parliament many small-business people are worrying about meeting their payroll each week, and people are fearing the loss of their jobs. It might be said that people are taking very little comfort in their small businesses because they are not covered by the 9-day fortnight idea. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000297\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e0192ed9-5715-4f6c-bd52-8db4f3466087\u0022\u003EAgainst that background we are here to discuss a tax bill that is good as far as it goes and that we will be supporting. But this bill was largely written by the previous Government in about August last year\u2014before the global recession was really felt and before we had the opportunity to take stock and drive the bill further. I echo the comments made by the Associate Minister of Finance, Simon Power, on behalf of the Minister of Revenue, in thanking all members of the Finance and Expenditure Committee and acknowledging its chair, Craig Foss, and his colleagues. Members of small businesses would be encouraged by the level of cooperation around the House on getting this bill through. We have worked together to identify measures where the bill could be extended, and they are written in the committee\u2019s report. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000298\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e0192ed9-5715-4f6c-bd52-8db4f3466087\u0022\u003EI give notice today on behalf of the Opposition that in the Committee stage of the bill the Opposition will introduce a series of amendments. All of these amendments are taxpayer-friendly and will take the bill further, as we would have done if confronted by this situation in Government. Further, we formally indicate to the Government that we would be happy to cooperate with the Government in a bipartisan way and see those amendments introduced in a Supplementary Order Paper rather than through an Opposition amendment, should the Government wish to cooperate in the interests of giving small business an even greater tax remission in this way. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000299\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e0192ed9-5715-4f6c-bd52-8db4f3466087\u0022\u003EIn many respects, therefore, this is a good bill, and it largely implements ideas that we worked on earlier. But it is also a missed opportunity. National has come to office and simply lifted ideas that were around or in process, or in Labour\u2019s manifesto. Of the 13 substantive elements of the bill, nine of them fall into the category of matters previously legislated or for which work streams were already under way. National has no broad-based plan to give New Zealand\u2019s public confidence that this Government has taken the action necessary to tackle the gravity of this recession and to protect the most vulnerable, or to prepare New Zealand for the opportunity of taking advantage of the inevitable upturn. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000300\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e0192ed9-5715-4f6c-bd52-8db4f3466087\u0022\u003EAs many international commentators have started to work out\u2014and as, I think, New Zealanders are starting to recognise\u2014this Government is becoming isolated in international terms. It is one of the very few that is committed to a conservative approach although the global recession demands robust action. Even in the best spirit, one could hardly call this small bill robust. Where is the plan? Where is the stimulus? New Zealanders have watched an American President take office and take action, passing a NZ$1.5 trillion stimulus bill. They look across the Tasman, and they see a Government prepared to move heaven and earth with a NZ$67 billion stimulus package. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000301\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e0192ed9-5715-4f6c-bd52-8db4f3466087\u0022\u003EThis is the greatest financial crisis the world has faced since the Great Depression. It is the first time that the whole world economy has gone backwards since World War II. The International Monetary Fund chief economist has advised world Governments to commit whatever it takes to avoid a depression, and, above all, to adopt clear policies and act decisively. It is better to do too much than too little\u2014so says the International Monetary Fund. The US Secretary of the Treasury in the Obama administration, Tim Geithner, has warned that, given the scale of this economic crisis, \u201Cthe policy response has to be comprehensive and forceful. There is more risk and greater cost in gradualism than in aggressive action\u201D. Not two days ago, the World Bank\u2014no less\u2014revealed that the global economy will shrink this year for the first time since World War II. Only today, President Obama called for other nations to enact similar stimulus packages to that of the US. So where is New Zealand\u2019s National Government? According to the Wall Street Journal, looking from the United States, it is a global outlier taking a fiscally conservative, deregulatory approach to a recession that was caused in the first place by a lack of adequate regulation and supervision over financial markets. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000302\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e0192ed9-5715-4f6c-bd52-8db4f3466087\u0022\u003EUp to now, the National Party has got by through copying and pasting measures that the outgoing Labour Government already had in the works. That is exactly what this bill represents.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000303\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002223de6bd3-0482-495d-88f4-7cc3f75d8442\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00224fb1b5a460674d9381122e1e78c64ce6\u0022\u003ENathan Guy\u003C/span\u003E: You\u2019re voting for it, so you agree with it.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000304\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e0192ed9-5715-4f6c-bd52-8db4f3466087\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002215dd98ed4a4c4ac1835fc92bb699a5bf\u0022\u003EHon DAVID CUNLIFFE\u003C/span\u003E: I am voting for it because we wrote it\u2014surprise, surprise for the senior Government whip. We are voting for it because we wrote most of it. The question is what the Government has done in the 6 months since the bill was written. Where is the Government\u2019s insight? Where is the Government\u2019s robust approach to tax legislation? Why does it take the Labour Opposition to drive further to introduce amendments appropriate to the scale of the recession in order to make our tax law even more business-friendly? \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000305\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e0192ed9-5715-4f6c-bd52-8db4f3466087\u0022\u003ELabour supports this bill so far as it goes, but it does not go far enough. As a tangible demonstration of good faith with the struggling small and medium sized businesses of New Zealand\u2014the 99.5 percent of all businesses that employ fewer than 100 people; the 99.5 percent of all businesses that are excluded from participation in Government funding of the 9-day fortnight; and the 99.5 percent of businesses that will be vitally interested in the contents of this bill\u2014we urge the Government to retarget its tax cut programme. It makes no equity sense and no economic sense to shift the bulk of tax cuts from people who need them, who will spend them, and who have below-average incomes to people on above-average incomes. It is not needed there, and it will have no substantial effect on our economy. The Government is nickel-and-diming small business: the measures in this bill are worth only a few hundred million dollars\u2014far less than the cancellation of the research and development tax credits and far less than the income tax cut to upper-income earners. There will be precious few upper-income earners amongst small businesses, which this bill was originally designed to help. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000306\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e0192ed9-5715-4f6c-bd52-8db4f3466087\u0022\u003EI say again that this is not a bad bill; we will be voting for it. We wrote most of it. But members opposite can bet their bottom dollars that if Labour had been in Government since last August when these ideas were mooted, we would be seeing a whole lot more content and substance in this bill than we are seeing today. That is why the Labour Opposition will introduce substantive amendments\u2014unless the Government wishes to adopt them\u2014at the Committee stage. We welcome the Government taking up the amendments as Supplementary Order Papers and working on them.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000307\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221368ba6c-25be-40f6-a2a0-8f81e1f78b79\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002217dafb932c7d436b8b779ff65a34943d\u0022\u003EChris Tremain\u003C/span\u003E: That would be more unfunded amendments. Or are these ones allegedly unfunded?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000308\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e0192ed9-5715-4f6c-bd52-8db4f3466087\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00222cd72e3de72b4a329c08226ee3f37433\u0022\u003EHon DAVID CUNLIFFE\u003C/span\u003E: I call on Mr Tremain, who is seeking to interject, to rise above politics and to help the small businesses of the Hawke\u2019s Bay, a province he loves. I call on him to help small businesses, to rise above politics, and to introduce the amendments by way of Supplementary Order Papers. Labour does not need to own the amendments, just like it does not need to own the rest of this bill. We wrote most of it; we are happy to vote for it. Those members opposite can bet their bottom dollars that the bill would have been a lot more substantive if we had known that the global recession would be as big and bad as it is. We would have spent the last 6 months putting more taxpayer-friendly measures in this bill. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000309\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e0192ed9-5715-4f6c-bd52-8db4f3466087\u0022\u003EIn conclusion, this bill is good as far as it goes. Labour appreciates members\u2019 cooperation on it. We will be voting for it. We will be introducing amendments to take it further, and we would welcome cooperation from the Government to introduce those amendments by way of Supplementary Order Papers so that the struggling small businesses\u2014the people who are feeling unprecedented pain, and the people who are represented by today\u2019s historic low in the Performance of Manufacturing Index\u2014will get the help they need.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022659f6556-09a1-4ead-bc52-05cbdb4eaab8\u0022 data-id=\u00227dd5069710a64d9d9abe9ab8b9acb4dc\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000310\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022659f6556-09a1-4ead-bc52-05cbdb4eaab8\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00227dd5069710a64d9d9abe9ab8b9acb4dc\u0022\u003ECRAIG FOSS (National\u2014Tukituki):\u003C/span\u003E Good grief, what a difference an election defeat makes! Suddenly we have members on the other side of the House in favour of tax cuts. The cuts are maybe not big enough, wide enough, or deep enough at the moment, but those members are in favour of giving back\u2014or at least not taking, in the first place\u2014the excess revenue that while they were in charge they did not need to take in the first place. But now that we are in a recession they are actually trying to expand the measures. So I do welcome that road to Damascus experience. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000311\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022659f6556-09a1-4ead-bc52-05cbdb4eaab8\u0022\u003EI would also just like to note that the previous speaker, David Cunliffe, talked about some mythical place called \u201Cthe Hawke\u2019s Bay\u201D. It is \u201CHawke\u2019s Bay\u201D\u2014full stop. It is \u201CHawke\u2019s Bay\u201D, not \u201Cthe Hawke\u2019s Bay\u201D.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000312\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e0192ed9-5715-4f6c-bd52-8db4f3466087\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00222ae401e83f814fe9b158904357c2f8dd\u0022\u003EHon David Cunliffe\u003C/span\u003E: That\u2019s pedantic, even for this House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000313\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022659f6556-09a1-4ead-bc52-05cbdb4eaab8\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002281b3b02e046d4f8c913d201f4db1133c\u0022\u003ECRAIG FOSS\u003C/span\u003E: It is pedantic, I know, and I will come to other pedantic matters in a minute. But I note that we are on the second reading of the Taxation (Business Tax Measures) Bill, and I will refer to what I said in my first reading speech. I noted that there had been cross-party support indicated for this bill, and I am very pleased to acknowledge that that was followed through on. The Minister, the Hon Simon Power, also alluded to that. I freely and totally acknowledge the full cooperation of the members of the parties involved on the Finance and Expenditure Committee, not only for facilitating the process of getting the bill quickly back into the House for its second reading but also for the way in which all members enabled the committee to work through the process. We all, across the parties, recognised the urgency of getting some cash flow back into the economy, and I am more than happy to be on record as saying that. I thank members again for following through on their early indication of support for the bill.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000314\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022659f6556-09a1-4ead-bc52-05cbdb4eaab8\u0022\u003EThe bill has been reported back without any substantial amendments. There had been robust discussion about the bill and various parts in it, but most debate and discussion was about whether particular rates should be higher, or thresholds lower, etc. Again, I acknowledge that there was good and fulsome cooperation, and very good advice from officials on the way through, to get the bill to the stage we have now.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000315\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022659f6556-09a1-4ead-bc52-05cbdb4eaab8\u0022\u003EBut there was some discussion in the committee that I am sure the previous member who spoke, David Cunliffe, will be very interested in. He just talked about being pedantic, and there is a clause in the bill that gave rise to strong, robust debate\u2014clause 21 in Part 1, under which section RZ5 is replaced. There was very strong discussion\u2014and it was an interesting point\u2014around the words \u201Cinstead of\u201D in new section RZ5(3)(a). The use of the words \u201Cinstead of\u201D was quite controversial\u2014and I tell members I am looking at the track-changes version of the bill. There were various discussions about the words \u201Cinstead of\u201D, and members were quite interested in the knowledge of some on the committee about those words. It was originally alleged that the words had never been seen in any other bill or other legislation, but the committee did in fact discover, or become aware of, another bill in 1959, and numerous bills since, containing those words. I do not mean to be facetious, but the word pedantic was talked about a minute ago. However, I will stop there and allude again to the good intent of everyone on the committee.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000316\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022659f6556-09a1-4ead-bc52-05cbdb4eaab8\u0022\u003EI note that the previous speaker talked about some other measures Opposition members perhaps will want to discuss at the Committee stage. We will wait with interest to see what they might be. I suggest that if members go through the commentary they will probably get a good clue as to the direction that other members might be suggesting for different improvements. Members made the point that one thing talked about in the commentary\u2014and I will talk to this\u2014is that many of the measures here formed part of the larger Taxation (International Taxation, Life Insurance, and Remedial Matters) Bill, which was introduced in July last year. But in the commentary we note that, yes, it is acknowledged that a number of initiatives in this bill reflect proposed changes in previous legislation, or in Inland Revenue work streams or discussion documents\u2014and, as we know, the previous administration was very, very good at those. That is the key difference between the previous administration and this new Government; we are focused on action not words, on implementing not discussing, and on not having another review.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000317\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022659f6556-09a1-4ead-bc52-05cbdb4eaab8\u0022\u003EActually, this particular bill did not form part of our 100-day plan, but it may well have. Again, I appreciate the fact that members opposite are voting for it, but it took their getting into Opposition to expedite the bill and to try to make the tax-friendly parts of it even more so, and it took them 9 years to even get around to thinking about it. A National Government that had gone through the period of economic, commodity-driven growth the Labour Government had gone through would have brought these measures in, probably, as a matter of fact. In fact, if these measures had been in place sometime in the last 9 years at the height of the commodity-driven surpluses, businesses in New Zealand right now would be in a much better position to work their way through the current recession, which, unfortunately, we did go into a year or so ago. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000318\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022659f6556-09a1-4ead-bc52-05cbdb4eaab8\u0022\u003EOther members have talked about the recession. Even since the introduction of this bill a month or so ago, global and domestic conditions have deteriorated\u2014unfortunately. But this example and a suite of other measures are part of the programmes the National Government is bringing in to help us through the recession, and they are but small steps to a greater whole. I just want to touch base on some of those other measures, because this bill particularly targets small to medium sized enterprises, at the smaller end. But personal tax cuts were announced and put in legislation prior to Christmas, and a programme was announced yesterday to particularly help larger enterprises with 100-plus employees. Personal tax cuts, which formed part of our plan, have been implemented. Infrastructure spending on housing, schools, and roads has formed part of our plan, and is being implemented. The Minister of Education has announced about $41 million, I think, of new spending, or sped-up spending in the education sector today\u2014there is action and activity, not just more discussion papers. A part of this plan, also, has been the introduction of amendments to improve the Resource Management Act, which are mostly just to reduce compliance costs and speed up the process. There is the ReStart package, which was announced prior to Christmas, to help people through redundancy. We have also had the plans announced in the last few days, by the Hon Paula Bennett, about the 9-day fortnight, and the issues around that. These things must all be looked at as a whole; they are but part of our solution and our measures to be put in place to help New Zealand weather its way through the sharpest edges of the recession. We do not just want to discuss, to have discussion papers, and to have proposals, as the previous Government did. The 100-day plan also had many, many actions that will assist small businesses to get through this recession.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000319\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022659f6556-09a1-4ead-bc52-05cbdb4eaab8\u0022\u003EIt was very interesting to hear Dr Bollard today speak on the Monetary Policy Statement, and to hear his comments around the official cash rate reduction. He acknowledged, as many other forecasters and commentators have now acknowledged, the seriousness of the current state of the books of New Zealand\u2014of what this Government inherited. Putting aside for the moment the debacles in and around the accident compensation scheme, housing\u2014and the list goes on and on\u2014the bottom line is that the underlying costs and liabilities are up across the board and the tax revenue is down. But Dr Bollard noted today that the fiscal impulse, the stimulus measures coming from the lower interest rates, the fiscal actions and stimulus that this Government has put in place\u2014not just talked about putting in place\u2014plus the official cash rate announcements today, and a lower currency, mean that he is very hopeful that New Zealand will start to lift its way out of this recession in early to mid-2010. That is fantastic news, because this Taxation (Business Tax Measures) Bill brings in measures that will assist New Zealand to come out of recession quicker, sooner, and better than many, many other countries around the world. I congratulate my colleagues and the Minister of Revenue on bringing in this bill. I am looking forward to voting for this bill. Thank you.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022f9c512a8-d532-4ef9-ad51-0fe8d752a893\u0022 data-id=\u002202e24d947cf24ad7801c79d89d427678\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000320\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f9c512a8-d532-4ef9-ad51-0fe8d752a893\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002202e24d947cf24ad7801c79d89d427678\u0022\u003EHon CLAYTON COSGROVE (Labour\u2014Waimakariri):\u003C/span\u003E The previous speaker, Craig Foss, made an interesting point. He tried to illustrate the difference between the National Party in Government and the Labour Party when it was in Government, but the truth about that is simply this: there was a huge difference. The difference is that when we were in Government we had a plan, as my colleague David Cunliffe has said. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000321\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f9c512a8-d532-4ef9-ad51-0fe8d752a893\u0022\u003EFor instance, unlike the National crew, we had announced, had costed, and\u2014had the election had a different result\u2014would have provided New Zealanders who were made redundant with 12 months\u2019 funding. That was to have been given regardless of their collective household income circumstances or those of their spouse, to enable them to retrain and, therefore, redeploy into the workforce, perhaps in a different sector, within 12 months. The biggest idea that has come from the National crew over there is that those people might get, what is it, $62 a fortnight\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000322\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e0192ed9-5715-4f6c-bd52-8db4f3466087\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00228bcb0676ef4a4b63a086c4adbd227eb6\u0022\u003EHon David Cunliffe\u003C/span\u003E: $4.27 an hour.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000323\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f9c512a8-d532-4ef9-ad51-0fe8d752a893\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00228926fecb01014c6392a6534ffd08361d\u0022\u003EHon CLAYTON COSGROVE\u003C/span\u003E: \u2014$4.27 an hour, which might go towards some form of training. That is a nice, sneaky way of gutting 10 percent of the pay of workers in New Zealand. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000324\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f9c512a8-d532-4ef9-ad51-0fe8d752a893\u0022\u003EWe had a plan, you see, and we had budgeted for it, despite what members opposite might say. We had a plan to invest $1 billion in respect of home insulation. We had a plan, and we would not have gone to lie on the beach for 3 months. We would have had a mini-Budget before Christmas last year, and it would have identified a whole series of projects. Those would not have been the infrastructure projects that have been brought forward by 3 months\u2014one has been brought forward, I think, by a year. No; we would have had a proper mini-Budget\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000325\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226984d661-9f65-4ed6-b29c-3285b598582d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022ab15887d98e543e7804354306c91927e\u0022\u003EHon John Carter\u003C/span\u003E: Was it popular?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000326\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f9c512a8-d532-4ef9-ad51-0fe8d752a893\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002281cf0dd861f2412a8e76f52b3f0b74fa\u0022\u003EHon CLAYTON COSGROVE\u003C/span\u003E: The Minister John Carter asks whether it would have been popular. Here is the deal with leadership: some of the things one has to do in Government are not very popular, but that is the essence of real leadership. One has to make some tough decisions in order to look after and protect people, and often those decisions are not popular. Often they are not popular, I say for Mr Carter\u2019s edification, but that is the essence of real political leadership. It is very nice and easy for a leader to go around, as John Key does, like a sort of smiling assassin, grinning and laughing. Maybe he is being accepted as a nice bloke, but he does not actually have a plan and is not effectively protecting people\u2019s jobs. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000327\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f9c512a8-d532-4ef9-ad51-0fe8d752a893\u0022\u003EWe were told in this House by Mr Joyce that the entire infrastructure package\u2014putting aside the political argument over whether it is new money; we know that it is not\u2014would generate and save in the order of 2,000 jobs. Before Ms Bennett says that Labour members do not care about saving jobs, I will note that 2,000 jobs would be saved. That is a good thing; I am sure all colleagues would agree with that. But it is a pebble on the beach, or a drop in the ocean, when we know from Treasury advice that we have already lost over 10,000 jobs and we are losing a thousand jobs a week\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000328\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e0192ed9-5715-4f6c-bd52-8db4f3466087\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022073b7915829d402cb18523677407d81e\u0022\u003EHon David Cunliffe\u003C/span\u003E: At least.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000329\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f9c512a8-d532-4ef9-ad51-0fe8d752a893\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002280a11d3aa85f4fdbbec7a2ddeb103af5\u0022\u003EHon CLAYTON COSGROVE\u003C/span\u003E: \u2014at least, for the next 15 months. The political tactic from National is to adopt a bill that we authored, such as this Taxation (Business Tax Measures) Bill, which we will support\u2014as my colleague said, nine of the key 13 elements were authored by the previous Government, as there was no plan from members opposite\u2014or to abolish programmes that the previous Government put in place, then to reinvent them and say there is a great victory in, for instance, housing. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000330\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f9c512a8-d532-4ef9-ad51-0fe8d752a893\u0022\u003EThe Government abolished our housing programme, with the many hundreds of houses that we were either to refurbish or build, and then announced that it will build 69 houses. What a ripper that is! I talk to people in the construction industry who ask how 69 houses will save their jobs as painters, joiners, carpenters, or the other jobs in all the ancillary services that go along with that industry. And Mr Heatley announced that as a great political victory! \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000331\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f9c512a8-d532-4ef9-ad51-0fe8d752a893\u0022\u003EThen, of course, a key element of our plan was the research and development tax credit, was it not? We constructed it, we put it in place, and the National Government butchered it. I ask whether any member on the other side of the House, such as that genius Mr Foss, a member of the Finance and Expenditure Committee and our resident expert on tax returns and other extraneous matters, can get up and give us a rationale as to why this Government would not support businesses that elaborately transform our economy, such as manufacturers and others that do research and development. If ever there was a time when we needed our manufacturing sector and others to be doing research and development in order to create new products and services and new jobs, hey presto, it is now. So Mr Foss should tell us why those members got rid of that tax credit and destroyed it before businesses had even put their first returns in. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000332\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f9c512a8-d532-4ef9-ad51-0fe8d752a893\u0022\u003EAustralia has had such a measure for many years. National members see Australia as a nirvana; that is what they said when in Opposition. They saw it as a land of milk and honey, and thought that everything was better if it was in Australia. Let me tell Mr Foss and other members opposite that the Australians have had a research and development tax credit system for many years. We introduced one, and those members abolished it. That was our plan. It would have saved\u2014not saved, actually; it would have created\u2014many, many jobs.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000333\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e0192ed9-5715-4f6c-bd52-8db4f3466087\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00220b8601e89fa54c619c9f745bf4759fd0\u0022\u003EHon David Cunliffe\u003C/span\u003E: Yeah, thousands.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000334\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f9c512a8-d532-4ef9-ad51-0fe8d752a893\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022609314a12f56400db9b0ca375a91c293\u0022\u003EHon CLAYTON COSGROVE\u003C/span\u003E: Thousands of jobs would have been created. It is not only that, but new industries would have been created. There are manufacturers in my patch and, I suspect, in all members\u2019 electorates around the country that are full of innovative, entrepreneurial Kiwis. Manufacturers will now say that if they can get a tax credit in Australia, they will do the research and development there, and that if they do the research and development there, then it would make logical sense to take the whole operation there.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000335\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f9c512a8-d532-4ef9-ad51-0fe8d752a893\u0022\u003EBut, oh no! Oh no! The National Government\u2019s plan was to simply get rid of the research and development tax credit. Its plan was simply to get rid of insulation money. Its plan was simply to ditch all the housing and construction work. Its plan was to re-announce and repackage it\u2014dressed up like an old Christmas present that has been wrapped up again and given to two or three people\u2014and to hoodwink people with it. And the plan is to build 69 houses\u201469 houses. Would any member care to get up and tell the House how many jobs that will create and save, when we are losing a thousand jobs a week? Would any member care to get up and tell the House whether there will be a major impact on our economy by spending a couple of hundred million dollars on infrastructure, dusting off the projects that we had already identified, and bringing them forward by 3 or 4 months, knowing that only 2,000 jobs will be saved when a thousand jobs are being lost weekly? Would any member like to crawl up from behind his or her desk and tell the New Zealand people how one can justify that? \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000336\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f9c512a8-d532-4ef9-ad51-0fe8d752a893\u0022\u003EI will tell members the danger with National\u2019s approach. The danger, as my colleague David Cunliffe pointed out, is that every other robust economy in the world is hitting this economic tsunami head-on. New Zealand now has an outlier economy. Whether we are talking about the economy of Australia, the United Kingdom, or the United States, we find the relevant Government knows the tsunami is coming towards it. Those Governments have had warning of that, and they have launched their plan. We have a Government, a Minister of Finance, and a Prime Minister who have put politics before the interests of the country. The rolling maul of a drip-fed announcement here, there, and everywhere is not an economic strategy; it is a political strategy. It allows the Government to make an announcement, a little press release every week, where it says: \u201CAren\u2019t we good little boys and girls in Government, because we are announcing another little drop in the ocean, a pebble on the beach, as a project?\u201D. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000337\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f9c512a8-d532-4ef9-ad51-0fe8d752a893\u0022\u003EKevin Rudd launched his economic package, hit it head-on, and said it was not good enough. He launched another package, and executed it. This crew over here see the economic tsunami coming towards them. They do not have a plan. They have had a warning, though. Mr Key and Mr English will stand on the beach and wait to see how high the water level will get, and whether it will be over the heads of the Kiwi people or whether it will be just below that. But we know that economic tragedy and impact is on its way soon. I do not celebrate that. I think it is terrible, because every day one sees people in one\u2019s electorate losing their jobs. This crew over here was elected, and they told everybody they had a plan. Now we know from their Job Summit\u2014and I saw Miss Bennett get up and speak\u2014that their plan was to get a lot of people, most of them were a captive audience, into a room and ask to be told what to do. It was not to go to that audience and say: \u201CWe were elected, we have a plan, and we want the business sector and the commercial sector to sign up to it.\u201D It was a case of asking to be given an idea, please. That was only 3 to 4 months after National was elected, and it stands in comparison with what Obama did, when he jawboned his package through even when he had no constitutional levers to pull. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000338\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f9c512a8-d532-4ef9-ad51-0fe8d752a893\u0022\u003EThe Government went to the Job Summit and asked for a plan. It came out of the Job Summit, and what is the plan? The plan is to build a cycleway. I can see Gerry Brownlee on a penny farthing\u2014well, I may not be able to see the penny farthing. The Job Summit\u2019s plan is to build a cycleway. Can members imagine what the media would have done to us if we had announced that the biggest economic hit we were to have in order to solve the biggest economic crisis in our history was a cycleway? What a cracker! The next plan was to have a 9-day working fortnight. That might work if the Government would back Kiwis, but it has proved that it does not.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002281e8ca24-8b1d-4558-9ef9-c9418df2b3c0\u0022 data-id=\u0022fb1dcfeb2b4b4221be275017a84887a5\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000339\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002281e8ca24-8b1d-4558-9ef9-c9418df2b3c0\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022fb1dcfeb2b4b4221be275017a84887a5\u0022\u003EKEVIN HAGUE (Green):\u003C/span\u003E When I spoke in the first reading debate on the Taxation (Business Tax Measures) Bill I offered the Green Party\u2019s support for it. I thank the Finance and Expenditure Committee for its work, which has been expeditious, and I indicate now that the Green Party will continue to support the bill. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000340\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002281e8ca24-8b1d-4558-9ef9-c9418df2b3c0\u0022\u003EI note that the select committee did have to make a number of technical amendments to the bill. In the first reading debate I registered my and the Green Party\u2019s objection to the bill\u2019s introduction under urgency. I expressed our commitment to healthy politics where urgency is used strictly only when it is required. One cannot help but wonder whether the technical errors in this bill could have been avoided if some more time had been taken in the first place. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000341\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002281e8ca24-8b1d-4558-9ef9-c9418df2b3c0\u0022\u003EI agree with my colleague Craig Foss that the Government\u2019s package to deal with the economic crisis needs to be taken as a whole. When one does that, it becomes absolutely clear that the package totally lacks coherence, as I have mentioned in a previous speech on this bill and in speeches on other bills. The Government\u2019s response to the economic crisis is incoherent, but it also fails to understand that the best approach to addressing the economic crisis is to do so concurrently with other crises we are experiencing, both in the environment, particularly in terms of climate change, and in the area of energy. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000342\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002281e8ca24-8b1d-4558-9ef9-c9418df2b3c0\u0022\u003EThe example I previously used of the Government\u2019s lack of coherence and policy is the withdrawal of the research and development tax credit. On the one hand the Government is saying \u201CHere\u2019s a hand-up with this tax relief.\u201D, and on the other hand it is pulling out the rug from under small businesses with the withdrawal of this reward for innovation in research and development. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000343\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002281e8ca24-8b1d-4558-9ef9-c9418df2b3c0\u0022\u003EYesterday the Government, with its package to support workers in large businesses and for a 9-day working fortnight, provided another example of the lack of coherence in its economic package. Some 20,000 to 25,000 people are expected to benefit from the measure. But what about the very much larger number of people working in small businesses? Will the devastation of unemployment be any easier to cope with because a person used to work in a smaller workforce? Of course not. There is no difference in the needs of the workers in smaller and larger businesses and therefore no sound and rational basis for the Government\u2019s distinction.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000344\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002281e8ca24-8b1d-4558-9ef9-c9418df2b3c0\u0022\u003EWhat is more, the Government\u2019s failure to extend a helping hand to workers in these small to medium sized businesses is a kick in the teeth not only for those working people but also for the businesses that employ them. It is one step forward with this bill but another step back with the failure to support the employment relationships within small businesses that are stressed by the economic situation. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000345\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002281e8ca24-8b1d-4558-9ef9-c9418df2b3c0\u0022\u003EWhat else has the Government been doing to support small businesses? The Minister of Finance, in his first reading speech on the bill, said the Government would be looking at the recommendations of the Small Business Advisory Group, which I supported at the time. I mentioned a couple of that group\u2019s more recent recommendations. It recommended that \u201Cpublications be produced that give practical and implementable advice and support for small to medium sized enterprises, to improve their environmental performance and to derive business benefit from the recognised or certified environmental sustainability of their products and services.\u201D \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000346\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002281e8ca24-8b1d-4558-9ef9-c9418df2b3c0\u0022\u003EThis is something the Government could easily have moved on. It could have funded the Sustainable Business Network, for example, to produce exactly such resources. One month on, there is nothing. The Small Business Advisory Group recommended that \u201Call foodstuffs sold in New Zealand be required to be labelled with the country of origin of the defining component or the most significant component of the foodstuff.\u201D One month on, there is nothing. Small and medium sized businesses must surely have noted that despite all the rhetoric about urgency and pragmatism, nothing besides this modest tax relief has been done to lend them a hand while the rug is being firmly and rapidly pulled out from under the feet of many. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000347\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002281e8ca24-8b1d-4558-9ef9-c9418df2b3c0\u0022\u003EI spoke in the first reading, perhaps a little obscurely, about bees. I likened the Government\u2019s dogged and robotic fixation on continuing to try to run the economy on the same unsustainable basis that caused this economic crisis in the first place to bees trying to find their way home and being trapped by a building lying in their path. The inability to consider other possibilities leads to disastrous consequences, both for the bees and for our nation under this Government. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000348\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002281e8ca24-8b1d-4558-9ef9-c9418df2b3c0\u0022\u003EThere are some positive signs, and I take issue with the comments of my colleague Clayton Cosgrove. The national cycleway is a great first step, and I commend the Government for it. It will bring in sustainable tourism dollars, will assist in reducing greenhouse gas emissions by encouraging people in some major urban centres to ride bikes instead of using motor vehicles, and will produce health gains, but it will also create jobs. Yesterday the New Zealand Contractors Federation called the cycleway \u201Ca vital boost for small and medium sized contractors.\u201D Those members who have cycled the Otago Central Rail Trail or the Little River Rail Trail, for example, or similar cycle routes overseas, such as the Sustrans network in Britain, will know that this kind of cycling facility provides the lifeblood of many small businesses and indeed whole rural communities. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000349\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002281e8ca24-8b1d-4558-9ef9-c9418df2b3c0\u0022\u003EI remember on one of the occasions when I rode the Otago Central Rail Trail, another group of riders staying in the Lauder Hotel with us\u2014a business that probably would have closed by now, if it had not been for the trail\u2014consisted of the Minister of Finance, Mr English, and a large family group. He will certainly have seen the profound impact the cycleway has had on the local economy. I hope he may begin to agree that it is possible to deal with more than one crisis at a time. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000350\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002281e8ca24-8b1d-4558-9ef9-c9418df2b3c0\u0022\u003EThat is an example of how it is possible to address the twin crises in environment and economy by taking action to transform the economy to one that has a sustainable basis\u2014what the Green Party and many world leaders have dubbed the Green New Deal. Early Green jobs visionary Van Jones has just been appointed a special adviser for green jobs enterprise and innovation at the White House Council on Environmental Quality. When the Green Party has asked in this Chamber about the Government\u2019s intention to create green-collar jobs, the Prime Minister has indicated that he neither knew nor cared. I guess that is another way John Key is not like Barack Obama. I am starting to keep a list. There is another list on ways John Key is not like Nelson Mandela. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000351\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002281e8ca24-8b1d-4558-9ef9-c9418df2b3c0\u0022\u003EThe new American President absolutely seems to get it. We are facing multiple crises right now. It simply is not possible to say we are going to choose just one. If it is possible to create jobs and help to move the economy towards long-term sustainability at the same time, then why on earth would we not do that? If it is possible to create jobs and help protect or, better still, restore the environment, then why on earth would we not do so? If it is possible to create jobs and ensure the entitlement of New Zealanders to the fundamentals of life, such as affordable healthy food, warm and safe housing, and effective and efficient public transport, then why on earth would we not do so? \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000352\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002281e8ca24-8b1d-4558-9ef9-c9418df2b3c0\u0022\u003ELet us see the jobs in insulating homes, retrofitting homes and offices for energy efficiency, installing solar water heating on every State house, riparian planting, native reforestation, cleaning up toxic sites, enhanced public transport services, communities growing food locally, and distributed electricity generation. Out of the teeth of these multiple crises it is possible to snatch the opportunity to shift New Zealand on to a new path that will ensure a future worth having for our children and grandchildren. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000353\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002281e8ca24-8b1d-4558-9ef9-c9418df2b3c0\u0022\u003EWe urge the Government not to blow it, and we offer our support and assistance. The nature of the Green New Deal incorporates an inclusive society moving towards this positive common purpose. I will close by quoting Van Jones in this book The Green Collar Economy: How One Solution Can Fix Our Two Biggest Problems. \u201CAnd now we stand at our own crossroads, looking out upon two futures: one with rising temperatures, rising oceans, and rising violence on a hot and strip-mined planet and another with expanding organic harvests, growing solar arrays, and deepening global partnerships on a green and thriving Earth. Given those choices, we know in our hearts what our parents\u2019 generation\u2014and our grandparents\u2019 generation\u2014would have done for us. Come, then, let us go forward together with our united strength\u2014and win that better future for the generations to come.\u201D Thank you.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002277ec6495-df45-43ac-aaa1-a03b5dd4c128\u0022 data-id=\u0022655b8f564a084f31872e16c89d30b407\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000354\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002277ec6495-df45-43ac-aaa1-a03b5dd4c128\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022655b8f564a084f31872e16c89d30b407\u0022\u003EJOHN BOSCAWEN (ACT):\u003C/span\u003E I rise in support of this Taxation (Business Tax Measures) Bill. The ACT Party will be voting for this bill. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000355\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002277ec6495-df45-43ac-aaa1-a03b5dd4c128\u0022\u003EI will start by saying that this is the first experience I have had of sitting on a select committee\u2014the Finance and Expenditure Committee\u2014and speaking following its deliberations. I congratulate the chairmanship of Craig Foss and I also congratulate the bipartisan support that this bill has received from the Labour members on that committee, including the deputy chairman, David Cunliffe. I also acknowledge the support of the officials and, in particular, the submitters. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000356\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002277ec6495-df45-43ac-aaa1-a03b5dd4c128\u0022\u003EWe received only six submissions, but one was a detailed submission from the Institute of Chartered Accountants of New Zealand. Members of the institute made an oral submission and, as a new member of Parliament, I noted that it reflected on the amount of work that these groups do for the good of the people of New Zealand. Only yesterday we heard submissions from a number of legal and accounting firms on the new international tax bill. Two of those submissions totalled 150 pages each. So a huge amount of work is done freely for the benefit of New Zealanders. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000357\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002277ec6495-df45-43ac-aaa1-a03b5dd4c128\u0022\u003EThis bill makes a number of changes. It is designed to support small to medium sized businesses by easing the pressure of taxes on their cash flow and compliance costs. When the Minister of Justice was speaking on behalf of the Minister of Revenue, he outlined some of those changes, so I do not propose to go into them in a great deal of detail. But I will say that they lift the thresholds for a number of issues to do with GST and fringe benefit tax. For example, the threshold for having to register for GST is lifted from $40,000 to $60,000, which enables a number of smaller enterprises that might otherwise have had to register for GST and be subject to those compliance costs to be exempt. Similarly, larger organisations with a turnover in excess of $200,000 that might have had to file 2-monthly GST returns can now file their returns every 6 months, under the provisions of this bill, as long as their turnover is less than $500,000. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000358\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002277ec6495-df45-43ac-aaa1-a03b5dd4c128\u0022\u003EIt was also interesting that we received during the course of the select committee submission process a very detailed submission on the taxation of patents. I think it is fair to say that it was not an issue that many members of the committee had given a great deal of thought to. Once again, that was a benefit of being involved in the process of hearing submissions. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000359\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002277ec6495-df45-43ac-aaa1-a03b5dd4c128\u0022\u003EIn rising to speak on this bill, the deputy chairman of the select committee, the Hon David Cunliffe, talked about the deepening and worsening financial crisis that this country faces and about the fact that people fear the loss of their jobs. He noted that the Governor of the Reserve Bank reduced the official cash rate by 0.5 percent today, and he also said that the world was going backwards. The issues that David Cunliffe raised are all very true. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000360\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002277ec6495-df45-43ac-aaa1-a03b5dd4c128\u0022\u003EBut I would comment that although this bill is aimed at small to medium sized businesses\u2014and we heard earlier that the relief available under the 9-day working fortnight is available only to employers with more than 100 employees\u2014another group in society is also very much affected by the recession the country is in. This group does not get a lot of air time in this country. This group is what I call the people who save. They are the people who save, who go out to do their work, and who, rather than spend $1.10 or $1.15 for every $1 they earn, spend 95c and put something away for saving. The issue of saving is very, very important. Although we always look to the lowering of the official cash rate, which has been good for those of us with mortgages, the reality is that it actually reduces the income of our savers. They are mainly, but not exclusively, elderly people. It is very easy to ignore the effect of a reduction in interest rates on those savers. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000361\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002277ec6495-df45-43ac-aaa1-a03b5dd4c128\u0022\u003EI stood in this House yesterday and said that I would raise at the Commerce Committee this morning the issue of an inquiry into the activities of various finance companies and into the issues associated with the failure of finance companies. I was very heartened to have the support of the chair of that committee, the Hon Lianne Dalziel, who said she has a very open mind on this issue. She has offered her assistance to me in drawing up a draft terms of reference for that inquiry, and I shall be very pleased to have her help. I should also say that I have the full support of the ACT caucus in calling for that inquiry. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000362\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002277ec6495-df45-43ac-aaa1-a03b5dd4c128\u0022\u003EMy inquiry is made even more relevant by the submission given to the Commerce Committee this morning by Jane Diplock, the chairperson of the Securities Commission. Jane Diplock appeared before the committee during the course of the committee\u2019s annual review of the commission\u2019s activities, and she raised a number of issues of public policy. These are very serious issues, and I do not believe that they can be swept under the carpet. It is very easy to look at what will benefit small to medium sized businesses and at what will affect big business, but we cannot afford to forget the ordinary New Zealanders\u2014the savers in society. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000363\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002277ec6495-df45-43ac-aaa1-a03b5dd4c128\u0022\u003EI will start by looking at the issue of trustees. For the benefit of members of the House, I inform them that a trust is a commercial relationship, if you like, between a trustee company or a trustee organisation and the directors or owners of a finance company. Jane Diplock pointed out that it is competitive; it is a business. We have seen over the last 3 or 4 years that trustee companies have been bidding against each other to get business. They have brought down their fees, they have offered to do the work for a lower and lower price to gain the business, and this has probably resulted in a lower quality of supervision of management. Jane Diplock pointed out that the trustees are not entitled to demand under the trust deed a number of things that they might like to do. Lianne Dalziel said that it was an issue of their own making because, when they enter into a contract with a finance company to provide a trustee relationship, they are negotiating a fee to do a certain package of duties, and that, therefore, they have brought this issue upon themselves. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000364\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002277ec6495-df45-43ac-aaa1-a03b5dd4c128\u0022\u003EJane Diplock raised a number of issues of conflict of interest, which I thought were very interesting. If a finance company is likely to fail, or looks like it is close to failing, one option is for the trustee to appoint a receiver. If a receiver is appointed to the finance company, the receiver will go into that company and may find some failure on the part of the trustee. One of the receiver\u2019s options is to bring a civil action against the trustee, because until recently no criminal proceedings could be brought against a trustee. There is a conflict of interest, because the receivers get their business from the trustees. Which receiver will dob in\u2014to use Lianne Dalziel\u2019s words\u2014the trustee that is likely to give it its work? \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000365\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002277ec6495-df45-43ac-aaa1-a03b5dd4c128\u0022\u003EWe also have the issue of moratoria. Under a moratoria the company\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000366\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a8cf180b983f49c0ae16e5f7f356aa55\u0022\u003EHon Trevor Mallard\u003C/span\u003E: A moratorium.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000367\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002277ec6495-df45-43ac-aaa1-a03b5dd4c128\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002292c8f8347cb6423ca7beaf1a2db3eed7\u0022\u003EJOHN BOSCAWEN\u003C/span\u003E: A moratorium\u2014that is right; I thank Mr Mallard. Under a moratorium the company is kept running under its current management, and it is unlikely that the management will bring an action against the trustees. Once again, there is a conflict of interest. The trustees have motivation, if you like, to support a moratorium rather than a receivership, because, if there is a receivership, it lays open the opportunity for the receivers to make a challenge of that trustee. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000368\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002277ec6495-df45-43ac-aaa1-a03b5dd4c128\u0022\u003EThe other issue that Jane Diplock referred to was related party transactions. She said that a finance company can put out a prospectus and call for funds, and as long as the prospectus meets the Securities Commission\u2019s legal requirements, there is nothing the commission can do. The commission does not act as an arbiter on the quality of that prospectus. It does not act as referee. What has happened is that a number of finance companies have used money they had raised for purposes other than were laid out in their prospectus. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000369\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002277ec6495-df45-43ac-aaa1-a03b5dd4c128\u0022\u003EFinally, I also attended the briefing of the Governor of the Reserve Bank to the Finance and Expenditure Committee this afternoon. When asked, he made the point that when this country comes out of the recession, what will be important are savings. This country has relied on a bigger and bigger quantity of the cheap savings of foreigners, and we will need to save for ourselves. If we are to create a savings environment, then we need to look at why finance companies fail and at the conflicts of interest.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022e2e2ee61-b3b9-4a89-bcc3-5b7be76c5825\u0022 data-id=\u0022201283d437d14a8383e1cc53f632da35\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000370\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e2e2ee61-b3b9-4a89-bcc3-5b7be76c5825\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022201283d437d14a8383e1cc53f632da35\u0022\u003ERAHUI KATENE (M\u0101ori Party\u2014Te Tai Tonga):\u003C/span\u003E The Taxation (Business Tax Measures) Bill represents one of the more unusual moments in this House, whereby the rapid passage of legislation is acceptable. Indeed, I would go so far as to say that this bill should earn the unqualified support of the entire House, because it is very much a product of the unique set of circumstances of the time. The Taxation (Business Tax Measures) Bill aims to improve the business environment for small and medium sized enterprises by easing the pressure of taxes on business cash flows and reducing business tax compliance costs. It responds to a call that was heard by a new Government with an eye to smoothing the inevitable rough journey ahead in the impending recession. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000371\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e2e2ee61-b3b9-4a89-bcc3-5b7be76c5825\u0022\u003EWe know, from the expert advice of organisations such as the Federation of M\u0101ori Authorities, that the arena of tax laws and business compliance costs for small and medium sized businesses is an area full of challenge. The federation has consistently promoted the view that the whole area of business tax needs urgent review. Its view is that tax laws need to be adjusted to allow businesses to grow and develop wealth for the whole nation. If the business tax laws are amended to support the growth of small and medium sized businesses, the logical flow-on effects will be seen in employment, higher wages, investment, research development, and innovation. We know that M\u0101ori small businesses would particularly benefit from early intervention and the opportunity to undertake a process of being managed through difficulties. The advice, again of those in the field, is that such support would assist many to either stay afloat or, if need be, finish up with the minimum of administration and expenses. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000372\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e2e2ee61-b3b9-4a89-bcc3-5b7be76c5825\u0022\u003EI said earlier that this bill is a product of its time, and to persuade the House just how timely it is I bring attention to the initiative established by my colleague the hard-working Minister of M\u0101ori Affairs, the Hon Dr Pita Sharples. My colleague is an action man. Dr Sharples moved fast, hosting a very successful M\u0101ori economic workshop on 28 January 2009\u2014a mere 7 parliamentary sitting days after he was appointed the Minister. I have it on very good authority that the world was created in 7 days. My colleague Dr Sharples was clearly setting out to follow that precedent. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000373\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e2e2ee61-b3b9-4a89-bcc3-5b7be76c5825\u0022\u003EAt the M\u0101ori economic workshop held in January there was considerable interest in this whole area of the nature of the assistance that would be useful to support small and medium sized enterprises facing difficulties in the current economic climate. Participants at the hui thought it was important to look at ways of reducing both the amount of regulation affecting business and the costs of complying with regulations. Specific concerns raised at the forum were to do with tax legislation, and some of the suggestions proposed included tax relief for small and medium sized enterprises. Another proposal mooted at the M\u0101ori economic workshop was the deferral of provisional tax to small and medium sized enterprises over the next 3 years. A range of initiatives to support small and medium sized enterprises were proposed, including developing an overarching organisation and investment fund, to assist such enterprises to access finance. The thinking was that this could act as a clearing house to pool small and medium sized enterprise investment opportunities. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000374\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e2e2ee61-b3b9-4a89-bcc3-5b7be76c5825\u0022\u003EM\u0101ori small and medium sized enterprises need to be positioned, through advice and other support, to take advantage of opportunities presented by the recession and future economic trends. I share some of these good points\u2014OK, brilliant ideas\u2014with the House to make the point that M\u0101ori are investing in creative enterprise and applying their full entrepreneurial talents to create workable solutions to address the current economic climate. This therefore provides a very fertile ground for receiving the number of measures proposed in this bill. In fact, when I consider that only six submissions were received, and just 1 day was dedicated to hearing from interested groups and individuals, I think the House should be very appreciative of the feedback I have been able to provide from these key stakeholders\u2014the movers and shakers of the M\u0101ori business world. Indeed, it is very good news for the M\u0101ori business community to be able to look over the host of amendments to current and proposed tax laws that are included in this bill. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000375\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e2e2ee61-b3b9-4a89-bcc3-5b7be76c5825\u0022\u003EThe aims of the bill are to reduce business compliance costs for small and medium sized businesses by raising reporting thresholds on PAYE, fringe benefit tax, and GST, and by introducing simplified rules for deducting legal expenditure. These are, in fact, initiatives that reflect much of the k\u014Drero that was laid down at the M\u0101ori economic hui. There was unreserved support from all participants at the hui to invest in job and business retention and stabilisation as the key short-term priorities. Change to reduce the tax liability faced by small and medium sized businesses was seen as a targeted measure to achieve the aspiration for job security and stabilisation. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000376\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e2e2ee61-b3b9-4a89-bcc3-5b7be76c5825\u0022\u003EOne of the particular strategies proposed by the small to medium enterprises cluster group was that tax relief should be provided for small and medium enterprises, such as goods and services tax and pay-as-you-earn tax. Another proposal was grouped around the relaxation of penalties for late payment, or staggered payment of compliances such as those related to Accident Compensation Corporation levies or GST. We believe that the Government could play a useful role in this period of transition, through the means of tax relief and investment to maintain small and medium enterprise employment and cash flow. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000377\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e2e2ee61-b3b9-4a89-bcc3-5b7be76c5825\u0022\u003EAnother aspect of this taxation bill is related to instalments. Like Mr Boscawen, I am a new member of the Finance and Expenditure Committee. The committee\u2019s view on instalments, in the context of difficult times, was that it would be useful if taxpayers were able to enter into instalment arrangements with the Inland Revenue Department regarding tax payments This thoroughly good idea was shared with officials from the Inland Revenue Department, and we were told that some new initiatives are being investigated to do exactly that. We in the Maori Party believe this initiative could be thoroughly relevant for providing assistance against the sharp edge of recession, so we will be keenly looking forward to any updates from the Inland Revenue Department to this effect. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000378\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e2e2ee61-b3b9-4a89-bcc3-5b7be76c5825\u0022\u003EWe will be supporting this bill, because we support any initiatives and interventions that allow businesses to grow. We support the reduction in business compliance costs; we support changes to reduce the tax liability faced by small and medium sized businesses; and we most particularly support the great initiatives taken by the Minister of M\u0101ori Affairs in bringing to the debate the perspectives of M\u0101ori in business, of wh\u0101nau, hap\u016B, and iwi, and of the greater M\u0101ori population about how to achieve growth and well-being while at the same time facing the current economic climate. I say to members that they should watch this space, because very soon there will be more announcements to come regarding opportunities for M\u0101ori economic development. Kia ora.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00221368ba6c-25be-40f6-a2a0-8f81e1f78b79\u0022 data-id=\u0022942ed38b4231427b8e07be5cf7cacd5a\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000379\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221368ba6c-25be-40f6-a2a0-8f81e1f78b79\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022942ed38b4231427b8e07be5cf7cacd5a\u0022\u003ECHRIS TREMAIN (National\u2014Napier):\u003C/span\u003E It is a pleasure to rise to speak after my M\u0101ori Party colleague Rahui Katene. She finished her speech by saying that the M\u0101ori Party supports any initiative that allows small businesses to grow. I could not agree more. It is absolutely fantastic that this evening we are introducing yet another key piece of National\u2019s plan to blunt the edges of this recession and prepare our country to be in the best space to grow as a nation as we go forward. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000380\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221368ba6c-25be-40f6-a2a0-8f81e1f78b79\u0022\u003EIt was interesting that a couple of the leading acolytes in the race for the Labour Party leadership took the first calls on the bill for Labour tonight.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000381\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022ad690ffa850b48cbbc8c8d7d23d68cd4\u0022\u003EHon Trevor Mallard\u003C/span\u003E: Oh! I didn\u2019t speak.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000382\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221368ba6c-25be-40f6-a2a0-8f81e1f78b79\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00225d55eddb1b68406a875b8a0cacaf7817\u0022\u003ECHRIS TREMAIN\u003C/span\u003E: Mr Mallard has not spoken yet, but I am sure he would echo the same wish. Both Mr Cosgrove and Mr Cunliffe stood up and asked where National\u2019s plan was, so it gives me great pleasure to be able to enunciate and talk about that plan tonight and to expand on where it is at. This debate is a great platform on which to do that. We came into office just over 100 days ago and we have had a huge rollout of economic policies. I will go through some of them tonight. Firstly, we said we would introduce and pass National\u2019s tax package into law before Christmas for the tax cuts beginning on 1 April. Did we do that?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000383\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022d89e0c5f163444518352e5a8bdcf9294\u0022\u003EHon Members\u003C/span\u003E: Yes!\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000384\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221368ba6c-25be-40f6-a2a0-8f81e1f78b79\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00223297084bca714fc69001f036cdff4415\u0022\u003ECHRIS TREMAIN\u003C/span\u003E: Yes, we did. Secondly, we said we would appoint a Minister for Infrastructure and begin implementing our infrastructure plans. Did we do that?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000385\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00228a12a97158ef4c39b42a3172c1d4c9e0\u0022\u003EHon Members\u003C/span\u003E: Yes!\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000386\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221368ba6c-25be-40f6-a2a0-8f81e1f78b79\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002217dec5d10ee8470e83b65239d328db64\u0022\u003ECHRIS TREMAIN\u003C/span\u003E: Yes, we did. Thirdly, we said we would introduce a Resource Management Act reform bill to reduce the cost of delays and the uncertainties in the Act. Did we do that?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000387\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00226654cb9cbc5545a9a9f25ffc57dc28ea\u0022\u003EHon Members\u003C/span\u003E: Yes!\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000388\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221368ba6c-25be-40f6-a2a0-8f81e1f78b79\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002240df4d8c55df4f0a894b2715b38a7cb8\u0022\u003ECHRIS TREMAIN\u003C/span\u003E: Yes, we did. Fourthly, we said that we would introduce and pass National\u2019s transitional relief package into law in order to offer extra assistance to Kiwis who are worst hit by redundancy. Did we do that?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000389\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022ce349f45aa5b4c889bbdd75516935b25\u0022\u003EHon Members\u003C/span\u003E: Yes!\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000390\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221368ba6c-25be-40f6-a2a0-8f81e1f78b79\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00221fc21a09074b4f789fcacb1dd3b30b70\u0022\u003ECHRIS TREMAIN\u003C/span\u003E: Yes, we did, and a number of my own constituents have been able to benefit from that as I have already put them on to that plan. We said that we would call in the Public Service chief executives and instruct them to undertake a line-by-line review of their departments\u2019 spending. Did we do that?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000391\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00229de023f60c434b2bbf26a61361e56f13\u0022\u003EHon Members\u003C/span\u003E: Yes!\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000392\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221368ba6c-25be-40f6-a2a0-8f81e1f78b79\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022715b17a614e34b528000af11a8006132\u0022\u003ECHRIS TREMAIN\u003C/span\u003E: Yes, we did, and we are seeing that roll-out as we speak\u2014despite the cries of the Opposition members. We said that we would establish a Cabinet expenditure control committee. Did we do that?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000393\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002235f888e605a14825867e88ca5b1deea7\u0022\u003EHon Members\u003C/span\u003E: Yes!\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000394\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221368ba6c-25be-40f6-a2a0-8f81e1f78b79\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022edc3689e77794abcacfff11281f5af87\u0022\u003ECHRIS TREMAIN\u003C/span\u003E: Yes, we did. The seventh thing we said we would do is begin a regulatory review programme to identify and remove inefficient and superfluous regulation. We have done that. But what is even better is that we have a number of other parts to our plan rolling forward. We said that we would continue to build on our jobs and growth plan to combat the global recession with action and action ideas. Over 20 ideas came out of that plan and a range of work streams are progressing out there. Already the Minister for Social Development and Employment, Paula Bennett, has rolled out the 9-day fortnight package, which is a fantastic package that will help employers to stay in business and keep jobs going. It amazed me today when members opposite criticised that package and said it was not good enough. The fact of the matter is that that package will save companies, keep them in business, and keep jobs in place. It is a fantastic package. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000395\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221368ba6c-25be-40f6-a2a0-8f81e1f78b79\u0022\u003EWe are also going forward by cutting personal taxes on 1 April. We are doing that. As part of the rolling maul of packages in our plan, we said that we would implement the tax changes in our small-business package, and that is happening right now with the Taxation (Business Tax Measures) Bill. That is excellent. We also said we would begin to fast track infrastructure projects to upgrade State highways, build new State houses, and improve schools. In my own electorate of Napier, and in the wider region of Hawke\u2019s Bay, we have heard two announcements in terms of the southern expressway extension and the bringing forward by 9 months of the Matah\u014Drua Gorge project. Again, that will bring jobs to that part of the region. I have to say that that is a tough part up there, on that Napier-Wairoa road, but those projects will bring jobs to that region and help our local economy there. That is absolutely fantastic stuff. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000396\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221368ba6c-25be-40f6-a2a0-8f81e1f78b79\u0022\u003EIt defies logic for anyone to stand there and say that there is no plan, or that we are not taking this country forward in tough and difficult times. There is a plan, and this bill is only just part of it. I am not going to go through the education things we have rolled out, the health things we have rolled out, the electoral law reform, and the law and order provisions. They are all part of the wider plan that we have rolled out in a very short space of time since we have been in Government. It has been excellent. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000397\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221368ba6c-25be-40f6-a2a0-8f81e1f78b79\u0022\u003EAs I said earlier, the goal of the Government has been to blunt the edge of this recession and to put us in the best position to grow quickly following the recovery. We saw that today, actually\u2014the first signs of that\u2014with Governor of the Reserve Bank, Alan Bollard, giving the Monetary Policy Statement. He started, interestingly, to predict a recovery for us somewhat sooner than for other nations around the world. Clearly, that was a gutsy call given the uncertainties in the wider global situation, but on page 3 of that statement we can read that in the first quarter of this year we have already started to see a real rise in the growth of the country, and that we will see up to 4 percent potential growth leading into the 2010 year. The strong V-shaped recovery profile that will come thereafter is absolutely fantastic. Combined with the official cash rate reduction\u2014a drop of over 525 base points over the last period\u2014and inflation pressure abating really rapidly, monetary policy is now \u201Cvery stimulatory\u201D. Those are the governor\u2019s words\u2014\u201Cvery stimulatory\u201D. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000398\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221368ba6c-25be-40f6-a2a0-8f81e1f78b79\u0022\u003EAcross the House, Mr Cunliffe was saying that we are not doing enough. Well, when we questioned Mr Bollard at the Finance and Expenditure Committee today he said that we were in a very good position, and that we were in a great position to take the economy forward as long as we rolled out the things we had already promised. We will also see further lending rate reductions in the pipeline, we can expect to see banks helping in the recovery, and we are seeing a combination of monetary and fiscal policy stimulus\u2014particularly with the NZ$1 going down. That is absolutely helping our economy to recover. I was at a summit back in Hawke\u2019s Bay last Friday, with Mr Nash from across the House and Craig Foss, my colleague who heads up the Finance and Expenditure Committee. It was very good to hear where a number of the business sectors were at in the wider economy. There was not the doom and gloom that those Labour members over there predict\u2014like Mr Cosgrove, the doomsayer. We heard a number of businesses up in Hawke\u2019s Bay say that it is not easy and the going is still tough. But they are consolidating and they are looking forward into the future, looking at where markets will be, and looking at those free-trade agreements that Labour started and that National is driving forward. I think we are actually in a great position going forward. Those businesses were comfortable to consolidate going forward; they were in good shape in that regard. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000399\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221368ba6c-25be-40f6-a2a0-8f81e1f78b79\u0022\u003EI come back to the detail of this bill as part of our plan, because I have clearly covered the fact that we have a strong plan going forward\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000400\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002263776108-58dc-4cab-baf1-95282c61d0de\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022f53377a3bcfd46cf94e93e2ca2d49007\u0022\u003EHon Paula Bennett\u003C/span\u003E: Strong!\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000401\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221368ba6c-25be-40f6-a2a0-8f81e1f78b79\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022f6b28eb25389472db0bbe34621490fe9\u0022\u003ECHRIS TREMAIN\u003C/span\u003E: \u2014a very strong plan. We have rolled out a significant amount of it, or are in the process of rolling it out as some of these bills come through select committees. In this particular bill we see some really good initiatives for small businesses like that 5 percent uplift rate on provisional tax, which is absolutely excellent; the increase in the GST threshold rate, so that compliance costs are reduced for small businesses; the raising of the PAYE once-a-month filing payment threshold from $100,000 to $500,000; and the raising of the fringe benefit tax annual filing threshold from $100,000 to $500,000, again reducing that threshold for small businesses in terms of having to get in there and do fringe benefit tax returns. These are all positive initiatives, and are all part of a wider plan to blunt the edge of this recession and put New Zealand in the best place to go forward. I am confident that with a John Key - led Government we will take this nation forward, deliver on the forecasts of the governor, and, by the end of this financial year, be on the way to recovery. Thank you very much.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022bbded2ec-ac25-4a73-a380-3f4d87693084\u0022 data-id=\u002204aaf86cfdc24b728e43cdda3cca9874\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000402\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bbded2ec-ac25-4a73-a380-3f4d87693084\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002204aaf86cfdc24b728e43cdda3cca9874\u0022\u003ESTUART NASH (Labour):\u003C/span\u003E Members who wanted to know about the Taxation (Business Tax Measures) Bill would have had no idea what Mr Tremain was talking about, because I think he mentioned it only once.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000403\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bbded2ec-ac25-4a73-a380-3f4d87693084\u0022\u003EI stand in support of the Taxation (Business Tax Measures) Bill, because the Labour Party supports small businesses. In fact, Labour supports all New Zealand businesses in a positive and proactive way, as no other political party does. First of all, let me say that I think all parties need to work together in this time of economic crisis to do what is best for the country. That is why I support this bill. Does it go far enough? No, and Labour would have taken it further.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000404\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022eaf79431-1033-44f1-a633-22633da52c0d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022e3518ac308e941bba24f7680ab907821\u0022\u003EDavid Bennett\u003C/span\u003E: In your dreams, mate\u2014in your dreams. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000405\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bbded2ec-ac25-4a73-a380-3f4d87693084\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00225da6b165f699473d8987956a444f085c\u0022\u003ESTUART NASH\u003C/span\u003E: However, members of the Finance and Expenditure Committee all agreed on a bipartisan approach\u2014did we not, I ask Mr Bennett\u2014to immediate economic reform in a way that does not allow for political interference, and at a time when the country\u2019s best interests need to be considered. In line with the country\u2019s best interests, Labour will be putting forward amendments that we feel will considerably improve the bill, and we hope that they will be received in the same bipartisan spirit of support that we have provided to date, in pursuit of the nation\u2019s economic health. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000406\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bbded2ec-ac25-4a73-a380-3f4d87693084\u0022\u003EThis bill is targeted at the 96 percent of Kiwi businesses that are classed as small to medium sized enterprises. The New Zealand definition of a small to medium sized enterprise is a business with 19 employees or fewer. Such businesses employ approximately 60 percent of the country\u2019s workforce, and without a question of a doubt they are the backbone of the New Zealand economy. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000407\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bbded2ec-ac25-4a73-a380-3f4d87693084\u0022\u003EWhat does this bill set out to achieve? First and foremost, there is recognition from all parties that this economic recession the country now finds itself in is hurting New Zealand businesses and industries. I was speaking to an importer of petrochemical derivatives just yesterday, and he was saying that business is terrible. For most of his clients now, it is just a matter of survival. These are the manufacturers who often see the signs of destruction first, because they are producing for the retailers and wholesalers, who then onsell to the customers and consumers. If business is hard for those at the back end of the supply chain, then it will be reflected in the environment and conditions at the front end. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000408\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bbded2ec-ac25-4a73-a380-3f4d87693084\u0022\u003EIf we who are resident in this House can help in any way to mitigate the effects of this crisis, and therefore alleviate the suffering in the manufacturing sites and shop fronts of New Zealand\u2019s towns and cities, as well as in the living rooms of the nation\u2019s homes, then we as elected representatives charged with the mandate of securing this wonderful country\u2019s future must act in a manner that delivers the optimal benefit in a timely manner. This bill is but a start. I ask Mr English where the rest of the plan is. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000409\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bbded2ec-ac25-4a73-a380-3f4d87693084\u0022\u003EThis bill could have been bolder and should have been stronger. Now we must accept the substance of this bill, which we in the Labour Party will help to improve through the Supplementary Order Paper process. We must then provide the Government agencies responsible for delivering its outcomes with the resources needed to implement it in the way intended by Parliament. I hope that Mr Dunne has advised the Inland Revenue Department in advance that it has a very important and proactive role to play in the easing of the economic and financial woes of many good New Zealand citizens. From what I have seen of the performance of Inland Revenue Department staff while in my role as a Finance and Expenditure Committee member, I have formed a view that they are hugely competent and highly committed to doing what is right for the people of New Zealand. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000410\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bbded2ec-ac25-4a73-a380-3f4d87693084\u0022\u003EI go back to my original question. What does this bill seek to achieve? Well, four new measures have been introduced by the coalition Government. First, there is the reduction of the provisional tax uplift rate to apply from 1 April 2009. This rate drops from 105 - 110 percent to 100 - 105 percent. This uplift rate is essentially the rate at which companies are allowed to estimate their tax for the following year, based on previous earnings. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000411\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bbded2ec-ac25-4a73-a380-3f4d87693084\u0022\u003ELabour argued that this rate should have been lowered even further. One submitter who presented to the Finance and Expenditure Committee suggested that this rate should have been dropped to 80 percent, given the dire economic climate and the pain that many businesses are feeling. It was acknowledged by all that 80 percent was perhaps too low, and Labour argued that it should have been closer to 100 percent, while still acknowledging that even this may have been optimistic considering the economic times and the hardship that many companies are facing. I doubt that many companies today will be predicting the same level of taxable earnings as they were 12 months ago. But this measure is a start and a move in the right direction. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000412\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bbded2ec-ac25-4a73-a380-3f4d87693084\u0022\u003EThere is an increase in GST payment thresholds, from $1.3 million to $2 million, which will apply from 1 April 2009. There is the introduction of the new threshold of $10,000, below which all business-related legal expenses are fully deductible, which will apply from the 2009-10 income year. There is an increase in the threshold under which the fringe benefit tax (FBT) is not required to be accounted for with regard to minor benefits provided to employees. This increases from $15,000 per year and $200 per quarter per employee, to $22,500 per year and $300 per quarter per employee. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000413\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bbded2ec-ac25-4a73-a380-3f4d87693084\u0022\u003EThen there are eight proposed measures that are either directly from the Labour Party manifesto or are slightly altered but are still Labour Party policy. I guess the old clich\u00E9 is true\u2014imitation is the greatest form of flattery. If so, we in the Labour Party blush and tip our hats, because this bill is very similar to one that we would have introduced, only not as robust, forward-thinking, or stimulatory. Dr Cullen should take a bow, because in essence and form, if not substance, this is his bill. For example, the enhanced Labour measures include the increase in pay-as-you-earn, once-a-month filing and payment threshold, from $100,000 to $500,000; the increase in the FBT annual filing threshold, from $100,000 to $500,000; and the increase in the GST registration threshold, from $40,000 to $60,000. All these measures apply from 1 April 2009. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000414\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bbded2ec-ac25-4a73-a380-3f4d87693084\u0022\u003EIf we look at the five measures that have been directly lifted from Labour Party policy, we see the increase in low-value stock trading thresholds, to apply from the 2009-10 income year; accounting for financial arrangements, also to apply for the 2009-10 tax year; the extension of FBT annual filing to include closely held businesses whose FBT liabilities are restricted to one or two vehicles used by owner-employees, regardless of their annual PAYE deduction; the increase in provisional tax use of the \u201Csafe harbour\u201D threshold, to apply from the 2009-10 tax year; and an increase in the GST 6-monthly return filing threshold, to apply from 1 April 2009. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000415\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bbded2ec-ac25-4a73-a380-3f4d87693084\u0022\u003EThat is nice, but perhaps I was a little hasty in asking the good doctor to take a bow, as I would not want the honourable member\u2019s fine legacy to be associated with a bill that he would have substantially changed to better reflect the dire economic mood at the time of final drafting. These were Labour ideas before the full force of the economic crisis was at least recognised, if not its true magnitude fully understood. Dr Cullen would have gone a lot further. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000416\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bbded2ec-ac25-4a73-a380-3f4d87693084\u0022\u003EWe know that the Labour Party is the party for small business\u2014we all know this.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000417\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022eaf79431-1033-44f1-a633-22633da52c0d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022352131044440411d820f5f98e05adc0f\u0022\u003EDavid Bennett\u003C/span\u003E: Come on!\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000418\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bbded2ec-ac25-4a73-a380-3f4d87693084\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022ca98a9f4ab9342f98c08bbe6be66d2af\u0022\u003ESTUART NASH\u003C/span\u003E: I say to Mr Bennett that one has only to look at the statistics to see that this is true. Mr Tremain\u2019s firm in Hawke\u2019s Bay did a hell of a lot better under Labour than it has ever done under National. Let me give members just one statistic. Annual business growth in the time of the last National Government was between 5 and 8 percent. In the first 6 years of the previous Labour Government that growth was between 15 and 18 percent. The economy actually grew by over 25 percent under the stewardship of Helen Clark and Michael Cullen. What a legacy Messrs English and Key have to follow! [Interruption] I say to Mr English that if this bill is anything to go by, he is not even close to \u201CLabour-lite\u201D; his legacy may be more of a brown colour. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000419\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bbded2ec-ac25-4a73-a380-3f4d87693084\u0022\u003EThe last great recession took a war to fully solve, and we certainly do not want to go through that even though, globally, geopolitical issues will become salient as the forces of nationalism begin to rear their ugly heads. In New Zealand the last great recession was expertly managed by a Minister of Finance, who was, I am proud to say, a giant when compared with the member who is currently occupying that portfolio. With those words, I support the bill\u2019s passage through the House. We will be voting for it. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022eaf79431-1033-44f1-a633-22633da52c0d\u0022 data-id=\u002293bf56c92ca545b7b404edbb7b510e67\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000420\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022eaf79431-1033-44f1-a633-22633da52c0d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002293bf56c92ca545b7b404edbb7b510e67\u0022\u003EDAVID BENNETT (National\u2014Hamilton East):\u003C/span\u003E How the Labour Party\u2019s spots have changed. This is a Labour Party that now says it is there for small business. Nobody in his or her right mind would believe that. People know that the Labour Party is not there for small business; the Labour Party is there only for itself. All those Labour members want is to get back into power. All those members were doing before the election was trying to get back into power. That is all the Labour Party has ever thought about. Those members do not think about their supporters, the workers of New Zealand. They do not think about small business. They do not do that. The Labour Party has one goal, and that is self preservation and power. That is the Labour Party\u2019s mantra. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000421\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022eaf79431-1033-44f1-a633-22633da52c0d\u0022\u003EI say to the new member Stuart Nash, so bright-eyed, innocent, and fresh, who came into this House and said that the Labour Party is all about small business: \u201CTake a history lesson.\u201D Let us look through the history of the Labour Party. What did the Labour Government do for small business in the last 9 years? Year after year after year it kicked small business in the guts. At the Finance and Expenditure Committee, David Cunliffe made it quite clear that his whole line of questioning was about Labour Party policy. For everything that comes out of the select committee now, Labour members have to say: \u201CThis is what Labour thought of many years ago.\u201D It is all right to say that Labour members thought about it, but why did they not actually do it? Why cannot Labour do something for small business? Why do Labour members just think about doing something for small business, instead of actually doing something for small business? \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000422\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022eaf79431-1033-44f1-a633-22633da52c0d\u0022\u003EThe reality is that those members do not care about small business. At this point in time, the Labour Party is trying to backtrack\u2014big time. Labour members are trying to go back through any little document from the last 10 years and say that it was their idea, when it was not their idea. The reality is that the ideas being passed here are National ideas, because the National Government is passing them. If they were Labour ideas, they would have been passed by the Labour Party during its 9 years in Government. It did not pass those ideas. It is pretty rich of Labour members to come into this House and say that they are their ideas, that they have ownership of them, and that they should take credit for them. The reality is that they do not have ownership of them, they cannot take the credit for them, and the public and especially the small-business community of New Zealand know that. They are very sure that the Labour Party is not there for small business.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000423\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bbded2ec-ac25-4a73-a380-3f4d87693084\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00225c56f1c4108e4f698bb9330bbfaffcda\u0022\u003EStuart Nash\u003C/span\u003E: There was no recession during that time.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000424\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022eaf79431-1033-44f1-a633-22633da52c0d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022b8346c2f8544497ead550430e85d53e1\u0022\u003EDAVID BENNETT\u003C/span\u003E: The new member is telling us how great the Labour Party is for small business and how great it is for the economy. Let us look at what the Labour Government left for the New Zealand economy before the world recession. What did Labour leave for New Zealand, before a world recession? It left it as the only Western country in recession. It made New Zealand a recessionary country, before the rest of the world.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000425\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c437bda8-4741-4ac5-89ab-b0818e1ab9fa\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002293c6e097e7034c2abfdaed4bfdc402bc\u0022\u003EHon Darren Hughes\u003C/span\u003E: Wrong\u2014the United States. Don\u2019t you count America?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000426\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022eaf79431-1033-44f1-a633-22633da52c0d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022cd8846ceacf145fbacc2603aa5a6f19a\u0022\u003EDAVID BENNETT\u003C/span\u003E: The member who lost his seat in Levin is telling us that the United States was in recession before us. That is not true. New Zealand was in recession before the United States, but the member would not know that, because Labour members do not know anything about business. Those members have never had to run a business. In fact, all they do is stand in the House and try to spend business people\u2019s money. That is all they want to do. They just want to keep it churning around, and say that they are the great people who look after everyone. That is not the reality. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000427\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022eaf79431-1033-44f1-a633-22633da52c0d\u0022\u003EThe reality is that small business needs help. The National Government gives help to small business, and the National Government is here for the New Zealand economy. The Labour Party is here only for itself, it always has been here only for itself, and it only ever will be in this House for itself. That is why Labour did not win the last election, and why its members cannot go around saying that they are there for small business or that they have the best interests of New Zealand at heart. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000428\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022eaf79431-1033-44f1-a633-22633da52c0d\u0022\u003EWhen we look at all these measures, we see that they are not rocket science. We are not saying that these measures are rocket science, but they have been sitting there and they could have been carried out by the Labour Party. All that was missing was the will to do them. The will was not there, amongst those members. They did not want to do them. They can come around now and say that they are supporting these measures, but how can they change their spots at this late stage just because they know that public opinion is against them? They needed a general election to tell them where to go with small business. They did not need to hear it from small-business owners. Labour members would not go around small-business owners and listen to what they said they wanted, and then actually do it. They waited until the general election told them what small-business owners wanted, and now Labour members are trying to take the credit for something that Labour did not do. That is not the New Zealand way. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000429\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022eaf79431-1033-44f1-a633-22633da52c0d\u0022\u003EIn New Zealand, we do not take credit for things we do not do. That is the Labour Party way. That is the general equality of their world\u2014that everybody is the same, and nobody can make a decision to do the right thing for this country. But that is not the way the National Government views it. National members say that they will go out there, they will listen, they will take the concerns of their people, they will make constructive decisions, and the National Government will pass legislation that will give the results the community deserves. That is what this bill is about. It is basically the National Party listening and delivering. It is action. That is the way the National Party is different from the Labour Party. National is a party of action. It is delivering, and it is taking constructive action to deliver solutions at a time when New Zealand needs them the most. National is a party of action; it is not a party of ideas that never come to fruition. National is not a party whose members come back 6 months later and say \u201CWe could have done it, but we never actually did.\u201D National is a party that does it. National has the support of this House, because the House knows that these are the best measures that can be passed at this point in time. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000430\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022eaf79431-1033-44f1-a633-22633da52c0d\u0022\u003EI think we also need to have a look at what happened today when the Reserve Bank governor came and talked about the growth that could potentially come to the New Zealand economy if we come out of this downside equation more quickly than the rest of the world. I think it offers opportunities for New Zealand, and I think New Zealand businesses and individuals are looking at a John Key - led Government and seeing that opportunity. They see a man of action. They see a Government that is actually making the right decisions and is providing the stimulus for New Zealand. This Government is looking forward and making simple but effective decisions. Its members are not out there, trying to tell the world how to live its own life, and we are not out there trying to change the way that people have to live their social lives. We are out there building a stronger economy so that New Zealanders can deliver a prosperous future for their children. That is what the National Party is doing. We have it right, the public knows we have it right, and it is not for the Labour Party to now change its spots and for its members to come into this House and say that they support this bill and that it was their idea. It was not their idea. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000431\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022eaf79431-1033-44f1-a633-22633da52c0d\u0022\u003EI say to the public of New Zealand that we are not standing for the Labour Party trying to take over these ideas and say that they are theirs, when they are not. These ideas are the National Party\u2019s ideas because the National Government is passing them. Labour members had their chance when in Government, but they did not pass them, so they cannot now say that they are their ideas. There is a whole raft of reforms in the Taxation (Business Tax Measures) Bill that are very important for small business. The reforms of GST, fringe benefit tax, and PAYE are all measures that small-business owners have been looking for, and they will get them in a timely way. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000432\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022eaf79431-1033-44f1-a633-22633da52c0d\u0022\u003EThe National Government is different from the previous Labour Government, in that it will not wait until year 3 to deliver these reforms. It will implement these reforms as soon as it can. If the Labour Party had its way, it would wait until year 3, just before an election, and then try to put these reforms on a pledge card, which the people of New Zealand would have paid for. Labour members would not go out and try to make constructive decisions at an early point in the electoral process, because they are not like that. Labour members cannot think of things. When they do think of things, they have to save them up so that they still have them at the end of the election cycle, and they can then say they actually did something. But Labour members could not think of anything they had done during the last 3 years, so they went into the last election not knowing what they had done, and that showed in the election results.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000433\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e4b09a29-dfd3-42c0-8585-11463bd6077b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022c7d98e061554413f98e81bd026af6a35\u0022\u003EHon David Carter\u003C/span\u003E: They hadn\u2019t done very much.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000434\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022eaf79431-1033-44f1-a633-22633da52c0d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00223adf6ff7a1b04f6397f2528b4cacab19\u0022\u003EDAVID BENNETT\u003C/span\u003E: No, they had not done anything. There are some home truths that the New Zealand public needs to know. The first is that the National Government is there, taking constructive actions and making decisions for the New Zealand public. That is the first point New Zealanders need to know. The second point is that these are not Labour Party ideas. They are National Party ideas, because the National Government is passing them. The third point the public needs to know is that the National Party has a vision. It has a dream for this country that will take us beyond the mediocrity that the Labour Party tries to incite amongst New Zealanders. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002267aa5137-7503-4a8f-bde1-1811615598e2\u0022 data-id=\u00226a65c9d7eec94b52bc522740fc390d09\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000435\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002267aa5137-7503-4a8f-bde1-1811615598e2\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00226a65c9d7eec94b52bc522740fc390d09\u0022\u003EBRENDON BURNS (Labour\u2014Christchurch Central):\u003C/span\u003E I am very pleased to speak on the Taxation (Business Tax Measures) Bill, and to follow the preceding speaker, David Bennett, whose rather screwball analysis suggested that National supports small business. Actually, National was the party that voted against business tax cuts and axed the research and development tax cut, which would have been very helpful to businesses, particularly small and medium-scale ones. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000436\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002267aa5137-7503-4a8f-bde1-1811615598e2\u0022\u003EThe Labour Opposition supports this bill. Indeed, despite the previous speaker\u2019s claims, most of the measures contained within it were proposed by Labour. The bill eases tax pressures and compliance costs on business. Although we are supportive of this bill and what it does to assist business, particularly small to medium sized enterprises, it is simply not enough. That applies most especially at this time. I have to say, as a new member of the Finance and Expenditure Committee, that I was surprised and concerned that this is, in fact, the first bill that the committee has reported back to the House. Given the scope and scale of the world recession, I had imagined that we would deal with some legislation and Government actions that were representative of big and bold ideas\u2014a mini-Budget or a pre-Christmas economic summit and the major ideas and stimulus packages flowing from it. Instead we are at the second reading of a technical and modest bill that, although we welcome it and acknowledge that it will be helpful to business, is hardly a new deal. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000437\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002267aa5137-7503-4a8f-bde1-1811615598e2\u0022\u003EThe adhockery of the Government is illustrated by this bill, and it is also illustrated by some of the Government members\u2019 responses\u2014such as they have made. I note, for instance, in housing that the first commentary was that there would be no new State houses. That changed overnight after a TVNZ report showed people in South Auckland living in garages. Suddenly we were going to get new State houses. Then we learnt that the total number of new State houses was 69. On that basis, I will be lucky to see one new State house in my electorate of Christchurch Central. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000438\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002267aa5137-7503-4a8f-bde1-1811615598e2\u0022\u003ESo, really, this bill, and the Government\u2019s response in toto, indicates that it is business as usual despite the world\u2019s worst economic forecast in our lifetimes\u2014in just about anybody\u2019s lifetime. We are seeing another missed opportunity at a time when this country needs real leadership and a real response. What we are getting is a rolling maul, and contained within it are Labour\u2019s ideas repackaged and re-presented to the New Zealand public as a stimulus plan. The relief for small to medium sized enterprises is ours, the tax cuts are ours, and the proposals for infrastructure are a rehash of our proposals. There is, regrettably, no broad-based plan that gives New Zealand\u2019s public confidence that this Government understands\u2014really understands\u2014the scale of the crisis, and that it is taking the action that is truly necessary, particularly to help vulnerable New Zealanders, and also to reposition New Zealand so we are ready to take advantage of the upturn, whenever it comes. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000439\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002267aa5137-7503-4a8f-bde1-1811615598e2\u0022\u003EToday the Governor of the Reserve Bank appeared before the Finance and Expenditure Committee. He recognises the scale of the issues that he faces. He today reduced the official cash rate to 3 percent. None of us in this House can remember when the official cash rate was last at that level. He recognises the scale of the issues. He also recognises that inflation is no longer public enemy No. 1 as far as the economy is concerned. Yet, at the same time as the Governor of the Reserve Bank is saying that to the Reserve Bank and to the nation through the Monetary Policy Statement, we learn that the Prime Minister is telling the Wall Street Journal that his biggest fear is rising inflation on the back of rising money supplies. That fear is not shared by the Governor of the Reserve Bank, nor by anybody else. The expectation in today\u2019s Monetary Policy Statement is that inflation through to 2010 and beyond will be well contained within the targets as outlined by the Governor of the Reserve Bank. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000440\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002267aa5137-7503-4a8f-bde1-1811615598e2\u0022\u003ESo we come back to the question of where the plan is. What stimulus from this Government can New Zealanders look towards? We look, by way of contrast, to the United States, which has a NZ$1.5 trillion stimulus package. I look across the Tasman to our friends in Australia, who have a NZ$67 billion stimulus package. Those responses are taking place because the Australians and the Americans acknowledge and recognise that we are facing the most severe financial crisis since the Great Depression. The International Monetary Fund chief economist is advising Governments around the world to commit to taking whatever steps they can to avoid a depression. The advice is to be bold and decisive; we are ignoring it. Today US President Barack Obama called for other nations to enact stimulus packages such as the one the United States has enacted. He obviously wants to see the world attempt to deal with these issues. We are an interdependent world yet New Zealand stands aside, as indicated by the interview the Prime Minister gave this week to the Wall Street Journal. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000441\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002267aa5137-7503-4a8f-bde1-1811615598e2\u0022\u003EWhat is the National Government\u2019s plan? Well, it goes back to such things as scrapping the research and development tax credit, to gutting KiwiSaver, and to trashing the Fast Forward Fund, which would have created $2 billion of expenditure for our primary sector, as has now been represented by the Minister of Agriculture. We are seeing cuts to the contribution to the Superannuation Fund that will endanger future superannuation entitlements. We are seeing a crisis manufactured around the Accident Compensation Corporation so that a board can be sacked, other people can be lined up, and New Zealanders can be told that they can no longer have the accident compensation entitlements that they once relied on. In the area of broadcasting, for which I have Opposition responsibilities, the Minister of Broadcasting is demanding a dividend from Television New Zealand (TVNZ) at the very time that TVNZ is saying that it may need to shed as many as 150 staff. Within 1 week of the Job Summit, TVNZ is being told to go ahead and cut the staff, and to pay the dividend. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000442\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002267aa5137-7503-4a8f-bde1-1811615598e2\u0022\u003EThen we have a tax cut programme that simply will not deliver as it should to those most in need\u2014to those who would have spent every last cent of their tax cuts if they had been implemented as they were to have been under Labour\u2019s programme. We urge the Government to retarget those tax cuts. They are essential for New Zealand. We need to make sure tax cuts are focused on those who need them and that discretionary spenders get them. It is not just Labour that is advocating that; Air New Zealand\u2019s chief executive, Rob Fyfe, got it right when he said that this crisis is so big that \u201Call the bets are off \u2026 We need to stimulate this economy and there are more effective ways than broad-brushed tax cuts.\u201D That is the big picture; that is the kind of approach we need. I say good on Rob Fyfe for those comments. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000443\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002267aa5137-7503-4a8f-bde1-1811615598e2\u0022\u003ELabour has been very clear to the select committee and to this Government that we are quite prepared to support this bill. It will provide some small measure of assistance to business. It will be supported by this Opposition party, but we want to make sure that some changes are made, and we will be recommending some amendments as the bill proceeds. The report from the select committee acknowledges that, as a result of earlier initiatives, some changes were taking place in the Inland Revenue Department that will assist. We will be proposing some technical amendments, which my colleagues have already outlined in part. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000444\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002267aa5137-7503-4a8f-bde1-1811615598e2\u0022\u003EOne thing I will touch on is the whole issue of tax deductibility of patent costs. A submission was made to the select committee by the Manufacturers and Exporters Association. At the moment New Zealand takes 20 years to wipe out the costs incurred in building a patent to protect intellectual property against world challenge. We would like to see that moved back to the world average of 10 years. It makes much more sense. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000445\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002267aa5137-7503-4a8f-bde1-1811615598e2\u0022\u003EIn conclusion, Labour will support the Taxation (Business Tax Measures) Bill. It was largely a Labour bill that was inherited by the new Government; it is not a key measure in National\u2019s package. It is a modest technical bill that will take some of the pressure off businesses, particularly small to medium sized enterprises. However, as recently as this afternoon the Governor of the Reserve Bank appeared and it was clear that he was outlining at least a tough year ahead for this nation. His forecast for the period beyond next year was an optimistic one. He suggests that we could be out of the decline by about this time next year. We in Labour hope that Dr Bollard is right; we note that there are some gloomier prognoses. Dr Bollard correctly notes that stimulating the economy is the key factor in the United States, Europe, and New Zealand. I think that he is as mystified as anybody else as to why the Prime Minister continues to identify inflation as being of major concern. He should tell that to the thousands of New Zealanders a week who are losing their jobs, because inflation is not an issue for them. Holding on to their jobs is what is important. They need a stimulus package. This bill is a very small step, but it ain\u2019t a stimulus package in any sense, at all. Thank you.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00226e1ead03-bf7f-496a-a02f-ce52859c58c1\u0022 data-id=\u002287cfa7ac30e846dab85555e9f03f20d0\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000446\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226e1ead03-bf7f-496a-a02f-ce52859c58c1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002287cfa7ac30e846dab85555e9f03f20d0\u0022\u003EHEKIA PARATA (National):\u003C/span\u003E T\u0113n\u0101 koe e te Mana Whakahaere huri noa i t\u014D t\u0101tou Whare t\u0113n\u0101 koutou katoa.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000447\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226e1ead03-bf7f-496a-a02f-ce52859c58c1\u0022\u003E[Greetings to you, Mr Deputy Speaker, and to you throughout our House, greetings to you all.] \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000448\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226e1ead03-bf7f-496a-a02f-ce52859c58c1\u0022\u003EI am pleased to stand in support of this Taxation (Business Tax Measures) Bill. I am delighted that it has cross-party support, despite the Opposition damning it with faint praise. That seems to suggest little understanding of how meaningful, how practical, and how responsive this suite of measures is to people who are engaged in small to medium sized enterprises. Nevertheless, I am pleased to know that the bill enjoys cross-party support, because the sooner that we can get it passed and apply it, the sooner that small to medium sized enterprises will be able to experience the relief intended by this legislation.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000449\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226e1ead03-bf7f-496a-a02f-ce52859c58c1\u0022\u003EThe bill has specific measures to assist small to medium sized enterprises, which are the bulk of business participants across the New Zealand economy. These people invest their own money, their own time, and their own creativity into making a success of their particular enterprise. These people lie awake at night and decide whether they can afford to upgrade their information and communications technology. These people have to decide whether they can continue to employ the people they have on their payroll. These people have to decide whether they need to downgrade the amount of space of the business area they occupy. These people have to make courageous decisions every day about whether to continue to invest for their future. These are the people for whom this technical, albeit modest, suite of measures will go a significant way towards lifting the burden of compliance, and allowing a greater cash flow to remain within their businesses. Having been a small-business owner myself, and having wrestled with these very issues, I stand in support of this bill so that others who are engaged in this type of business can feel this relief. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000450\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226e1ead03-bf7f-496a-a02f-ce52859c58c1\u0022\u003EThe bill contributes to National\u2019s overall jobs and growth plan. It is not to be read in isolation, although, as I have said, within and of itself it offers significant assistance to small and medium sized businesses. It is but one part of an overall, comprehensive approach that this National-led Government is taking to the challenges that face us. In meeting these challenges we have two main objectives. The first is to soften the edges of the recession, and the way that New Zealanders are experiencing it, and the second is to prepare our economy for recovery. Although we have inherited the legacy of being the first in the developed world to go into a recession, we would like to work very hard to be the first in the Western World to go into a recovery. This bill is part of the measures that we think will assist, across the economy, to restore confidence, to give greater certainty, and to assist small to medium sized business owners to continue with their plans confidently, to retain their employees, and to continue with their everyday operational realities.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000451\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226e1ead03-bf7f-496a-a02f-ce52859c58c1\u0022\u003EThis bill is about achieving balance, as is so much of what this National-led Government is focused on. It is about achieving balance between leaving as much cash flow as possible in businesses, and simplifying the compliance regime they must attend to, while at the same time maintaining the tax base that we rely on to continue to offer the services that this National-led Government is committed to offering. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000452\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226e1ead03-bf7f-496a-a02f-ce52859c58c1\u0022\u003ESo what are these measures? I do not propose to rehearse all of them, but I do wish to speak about one in particular, which, as a previous small-business owner, I was constantly alert to providing for\u2014that is, the 5 percent uplift rate that businesses pay on provisional tax instalments. As we all know, in a successive year business people base their tax provisions on what they paid the previous year, and add 5 percent. The supposition, of course, is that they are improving their business growth each year. But we are in a recession. We know that there are many challenges to our economy, and we know that it is very unlikely that many businesses will be looking forward to a 5 percent increase on what they earned in the previous year. So the bill provides the ability to remove that provision for the 2008-2009 and the 2009-2010 tax years, which means that there will be better tax cash flows for the next 2 years for small to medium sized enterprises. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000453\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226e1ead03-bf7f-496a-a02f-ce52859c58c1\u0022\u003EWe also see within this bill the provision that business-related legal expenditure of $10,000 or less will be able to be fully deducted. That is a very great leap forward for a number of small businesses, because when they retain legal advice they fully understand that those giving the legal advice are also in business and need to meet their expenses. But legal expenditure has been a particularly onerous expense for small to medium sized enterprises, and the opportunity for it to be deductible will be greeted with great relief by many small businesses around the country. Similarly, the PAYE requirements\u2014whereby payments will be filed once a month instead of twice a month, and the payment threshold will move from $100,000 to $500,000\u2014will allow more employers to file fewer PAYE returns. Again, these requirements have been very onerous but necessary for small to medium sized enterprises, and the changes are ones that will be, and are being, greeted by many businesses around the country with great relief.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000454\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226e1ead03-bf7f-496a-a02f-ce52859c58c1\u0022\u003ENational is committed to making it easier for small and medium sized companies to operate their businesses effectively; this package of relief measures is aimed at doing that. It recognises that there are no silver bullets to all the challenges that face us in this time of economic recession, but that it is one way of contributing to those businesses that form the bulk of the New Zealand economy, in order to simplify their tax compliance regimes while also leaving cash flow within their businesses. I have had significant feedback from business people around the country who do not minimise the contributions that these measures will make to their businesses. The Opposition has described the measures as modest and technical, but it has nevertheless said that it will support them. However, others around the country who are engaged every day in these businesses, see these measures as opportunities to get their heads above water, to conduct their business in a much more simplified way, and to have that cash flow available to them so that with greater confidence and certainty they can continue to operate those businesses.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000455\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226e1ead03-bf7f-496a-a02f-ce52859c58c1\u0022\u003EThis package of measures is what the National-led Government is committed to; it is part of an overall jobs and growth plan. It meets our dual objectives of softening the hard edges of the recession while also contributing to preparing our economy for recovery. I am delighted to support this bill, and I commend it to the House. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000456\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226e1ead03-bf7f-496a-a02f-ce52859c58c1\u0022\u003EHeoi an\u014D r\u0101 e te Mana Whakahaere o t\u0113nei Whare t\u0113n\u0101 koe, otir\u0101, ki a t\u0101tou katoa, ng\u0101 mihi nui.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000457\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226e1ead03-bf7f-496a-a02f-ce52859c58c1\u0022\u003E[So greetings to you once again, Mr Deputy Speaker of this House, and much greeting to us all.]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000458\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226e1ead03-bf7f-496a-a02f-ce52859c58c1\u0022\u003EBill read a second time.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n    \u003C/div\u003E\n    \u003Cdiv class=\u0022HpsHansard\u0022\u003E\n      \u003Cp\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsProceedingHeading\u0022\u003EBills\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000459\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u002238be24aa19ea4e9a875464816cb64f81\u0022\u003EInsolvency Amendment Bill\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000460\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u0022e302cf8908824ac795819895783c3bdf\u0022\u003EFirst Reading\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022803002d1-e810-4bd8-b8e7-2e97d0d6f626\u0022 data-id=\u0022f5973787f9344a198ac8d525fa4f336b\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000461\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022803002d1-e810-4bd8-b8e7-2e97d0d6f626\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022f5973787f9344a198ac8d525fa4f336b\u0022\u003EHon SIMON POWER (Minister of Commerce):\u003C/span\u003E I move, That the Insolvency Amendment Bill be now read a first time. At the appropriate time, I intend to move that the Insolvency Amendment Bill be referred to the Commerce Committee for consideration, that the committee report finally to the House on or before 12 May 2009, and that the committee have the authority to meet at any time while the House is sitting, except during oral questions, during any evening on a day on which there has been a sitting of the House, and on a Friday in a week in which there has been a sitting of the House, despite Standing Orders 187 and 190(1)(b) and (c). \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000462\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022803002d1-e810-4bd8-b8e7-2e97d0d6f626\u0022\u003EThis bill amends the Insolvency Act 2006 in order to address a small number of significant issues that have arisen since it came into effect in December 2007. Unfortunately\u2014and hence the shortened time frame for the select committee to consider this matter\u2014these changes have become even more pressing in the light of the expected impact of the current economic downturn on rates of insolvency. Having said that, by introducing changes designed to preserve the integrity of the personal insolvency processes\u2014namely, the new no-asset procedure and bankruptcy\u2014this bill is also timely because it aims to provide more protection for creditors and potential creditors.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000463\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022803002d1-e810-4bd8-b8e7-2e97d0d6f626\u0022\u003EThe no-asset procedure, or \u201CNAP\u201D, was introduced as an alternative to bankruptcy in December 2007, as part of the new Insolvency Act. Debtors may be eligible for a no-asset procedure if they have no realisable assets that can be sold to pay their creditors, they have not entered into a no-asset procedure or a bankruptcy process before, and they have debts of between $1,000 and $40,000 with no other means to repay them. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000464\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022803002d1-e810-4bd8-b8e7-2e97d0d6f626\u0022\u003EBy enabling individual debts of up to $40,000 to be written off, the intention of the no-asset procedure was to grant financially distressed people relief from liabilities that were incurred contractually. However, the Act does not explicitly exclude the discharge of fraudulent debts, leaving open the possibility that debts such as fraudulent social welfare payments could be wiped under this regime. Rewarding dishonesty was never the intention of the Act, and clearly contravenes the fundamental policy objectives that underpin insolvency laws. The changes proposed in this bill stop fraudulent debts from being written off, and will apply retrospectively to debtors who were in the no-asset procedure process when this bill was tabled in the House 3 days ago\u2014a slightly unusual step, but a necessary one\u2014and to those who have entered no-asset procedures since them. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000465\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022803002d1-e810-4bd8-b8e7-2e97d0d6f626\u0022\u003ETo further protect the integrity of the no-asset procedure, the bill also proposes to empower the official assignee to extend the period of discharge under a no-asset procedure by a maximum of 25 working days. This allows more time for the official assignee to investigate any new information or creditors\u2019 objections that are received at the eleventh hour in relation to a person\u2019s eligibility for the no-asset procedure. When the no-asset procedure allows someone to forgo up to $40,000 in debts, it is essential that any new information that may relate to concealed assets or debts can be brought to the attention of the official assignee right up to the day that person is discharged\u2014hence the change. Such information could lead to the no-asset procedure process being terminated if an entrant is found to be concealing assets or debts from the official assignee.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000466\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022803002d1-e810-4bd8-b8e7-2e97d0d6f626\u0022\u003EThe bill also proposes to restore the official assignee\u2019s ability to recover gifts made by a bankrupt prior to his or her bankruptcy. The insolvent gift provisions in the Act were inadvertently weakened in the 2006 insolvency law reform, making it difficult for the official assignee to deal with gifts made to a third party in the period leading up to a person\u2019s bankruptcy. The changes proposed in this bill will ultimately ensure that creditors are not out of pocket as a result of those gifts being made. The bill will allow contingent liabilities to be included in the assessment of the bankrupt\u2019s insolvency at the time of making the gift, and will cancel any gifts that are made in the 2-year period prior to a person\u2019s bankruptcy. This 2-year time frame is consistent with the longstanding presumption that an individual is technically insolvent for a period of time before he or she files for formal bankruptcy proceedings. It is often within this period that those individuals shift assets, set up trusts, etc., to avoid paying creditors. The bill shifts to the recipients of gifts the onus of proof of a debtor\u2019s solvency for the purpose of gifts made in the 2 to 5-year period before he or she was adjudicated bankrupt by the official assignee.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000467\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022803002d1-e810-4bd8-b8e7-2e97d0d6f626\u0022\u003EFinally, the bill proposes to increase the length of time a debtor\u2019s information is kept on the no-asset procedure public register. Currently, someone under the no-asset procedure regime remains on the register only for as long as the no-asset procedure lasts, which is 1 year. The bill increases the time period on the register to 5 years from the date of entry. I will be interested in the select committee\u2019s views on that matter. Furthermore, where a person has been through multiple insolvencies, it is proposed that his or her information will be permanently retained on the register. This information will be publicly available, enabling credit-rating agencies and providers of credit access to make informed decisions about doing business with these individuals. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000468\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022803002d1-e810-4bd8-b8e7-2e97d0d6f626\u0022\u003ECosts incurred by businesses that transact with bad debtors become a drain on the economy, particularly as these costs are eventually passed on to everybody else. The changes proposed in the bill will strengthen New Zealand\u2019s personal insolvency laws. I commend this bill to the House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022c186d0a2-99f4-408b-9b4d-d484cf19724d\u0022 data-id=\u0022ee1283734aec41c0ab2c67ab43c2e339\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000469\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c186d0a2-99f4-408b-9b4d-d484cf19724d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022ee1283734aec41c0ab2c67ab43c2e339\u0022\u003EHon LIANNE DALZIEL (Labour\u2014Christchurch East):\u003C/span\u003E I am happy to follow the Minister in speaking on the Insolvency Amendment Bill and to confirm to him that the Opposition will be supporting the referral of this bill to a select committee. But I cannot give an assurance beyond the referral to the select committee. This is not because of the first three items that the Minister identified in respect of this bill, but because of the fourth. I will run through them. I downloaded the Cabinet paper off the Internet before I came to the House, just to make sure that I had got it right in terms of the nature of these amendments in the bill.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000470\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c186d0a2-99f4-408b-9b4d-d484cf19724d\u0022\u003EThe first amendment is the provisions that were identified in the Cabinet paper as preventing the discharge of fraudulent debts under the no-asset procedure, and we are very happy to see that addressed in the bill. The second amendment is to allow the official assignee to extend the no-asset procedure period when an objection is received just prior to a debtor\u2019s expected date of discharge from the no-asset procedure. There is no problem with that. It is a very good strengthening of the existing law. The third amendment protects the interests of creditors of bankrupts by strengthening the ability of the official assignee to void gifts made by a debtor in the 5 years leading up to his or her bankruptcy. Again, I am very happy with this.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000471\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c186d0a2-99f4-408b-9b4d-d484cf19724d\u0022\u003EIt is a strengthening of the provisions in the legislation. These all obviously have come from the Ministry of Economic Development. The ministry obviously has provided advice to the Minister stating that these matters need to be addressed. I can see that the first provision needs to be addressed as a matter of urgency, which is why the Government has taken the position that it will apply from the day that the bill was introduced to the House, which was, as I understand it, on Monday or Tuesday of this week. In that way, it will stop fraudulent debts from being discharged from this day forward.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000472\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c186d0a2-99f4-408b-9b4d-d484cf19724d\u0022\u003EBut what I am concerned about, though, is the fourth provision. It is described in the Cabinet paper in a positive way, without highlighting the negative potential of it, and that is what disturbs me. The fourth provision is to provide improved access to the public register on the no-asset procedure and bankruptcy, in order to enable informed lending decisions to be made. That provision cannot have been generated off the concern that the ministry had in relation to the implementation of the legislation, because this issue was debated at some length when we introduced the Insolvency Act. The no-asset procedure was probably the most debated part of the legislation, being a very new procedure. The issue was whether we should have a strong separation between the bankruptcy provisions and the no-asset procedure to make it very clear that the no-asset procedure was a one-off, once-in-a-lifetime opportunity for somebody who had otherwise acted in good faith, had come across a very poor set of circumstances and hardship in his or her life, and was able to get a fresh start. That fresh start included the ability to carry on a business and the ability to travel overseas, which are prohibited under the bankruptcy provisions.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000473\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c186d0a2-99f4-408b-9b4d-d484cf19724d\u0022\u003EThe third amendment was not to have this on the record, as it were, for any longer than the no-asset procedure. The public register\u2019s relation to bankruptcy has been 7 years for many years now, and that was not adjusted when we looked at the Insolvency Law Reform Bill. So the 7 years remains for bankruptcy. But the suggestion that we now increase the time for having the no-asset procedure on the record, not for the 1 year that the no-asset procedure is in place, but for 5 years, creates a real concern. I am deeply concerned about the way that it has been publicly released by the Government. It is almost as if this has been added as an extra measure to a technical bill that Labour would have supported completely\u2014100 percent. For the first three items alone we would have said there was no problem. We could whisk the legislation through the committee\u2014it is a very good committee\u2014and get the legislation back to the House well within the time frame as proposed by the Minister. But this inclusion of another item that is clearly coming from the credit agencies, not from the Ministry of Economic Development, worries me. Nowhere in the entire Cabinet paper could I find out where anyone in the credit industry had been consulted, yet the suggestion has obviously come from there. The fact that the credit industry had been consulted was not mentioned. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000474\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c186d0a2-99f4-408b-9b4d-d484cf19724d\u0022\u003EThe other people who had not been consulted were those in the budget advisory services. I have seen Raewyn Fox\u2019s comments in the media in response to this bill, saying there are concerns about people coming into budget advice services and asking for assistance to fill out the forms for a no-asset procedure. That is not what budget advisers do. Budget advisers do not help people just to fill out forms for a no-asset procedure. On the ground, they have been using the fact that there is a no-asset procedure to approach the creditors of people in dire straits, and working through arrangements that are outside the summary instalment order regime and outside the no-asset procedure, so some commitment is made to repaying what is owed under the circumstances. I think the no-asset procedure has ended up being quite a useful tool. It is one that did not exist before, in terms of providing a realistic bargaining tool with a number of creditors in order for them to accept less than the full 100 percent return. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000475\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c186d0a2-99f4-408b-9b4d-d484cf19724d\u0022\u003EWhen we change the provisions around the no-asset procedure, it will change the number of people who want to contemplate that as an option. Will that change then weaken its ability to be used by budget advisers as a negotiating tool? I think it could, and that is the sort of thing I want to spend some time on at the select committee. Quite frankly, if we do not get the opportunity to seriously consider this issue, then I think the bill itself will become an abuse of process. I would much rather carve out this provision if we are not able to deal with it within the time frame. As a responsible chair, I will do what I can, but I also want very much to have on the record our concern about the way this has been included in the bill, which will mean that we have to take some serious consideration over it. In many respects it is a bit unfortunate, because if this provision had not been included in the bill, we could have made an absolute assurance about getting the bill back to the House in the time frame concerned.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000476\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c186d0a2-99f4-408b-9b4d-d484cf19724d\u0022\u003EThe regulatory impact analysis is perfectly legitimate under the circumstances, because secrecy had to be afforded to one of the provisions in the legislation, and that is preventing the discharge of fraudulent debts under the no-asset procedure. I quote from the Cabinet paper where it says: \u201CAny publicity at this stage would unnecessarily draw attention to the loophole that allows fraudulent debts to be cancelled under the NAP process, which has the possibility to reward individuals for their dishonesty. This may encourage such dishonesty, therefore I am proposing that no publicity be given to this matter until a bill is introduced to Parliament.\u201D That is perfectly appropriate for that provision, but not for the fourth one. The fourth one needs to be properly consulted. The Privacy Commissioner has raised serious concerns about the inclusion of this provision in the bill. I think we are going to have to talk to the commissioner and get a very clear steer on a matter that I know she is currently undertaking a review of. I have a real concern about that fourth element being included, but I am confident that we are able to address all of the other matters that are contained within the bill. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000477\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c186d0a2-99f4-408b-9b4d-d484cf19724d\u0022\u003EI will close by expressing my disappointment at the inclusion of that element, which clearly was not driven by a Ministry of Economic Development expectation but by the interests of those in the credit lending business.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002219bcf2ff-a193-4361-9072-813a4e36683c\u0022 data-id=\u0022cdd204df2b9e4a298c13de7123d7c273\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000478\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002219bcf2ff-a193-4361-9072-813a4e36683c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022cdd204df2b9e4a298c13de7123d7c273\u0022\u003EPESETA SAM LOTU-IIGA (National\u2014Maungakiekie):\u003C/span\u003E I rise to speak in favour of the Insolvency Amendment Bill. This bill amends the Insolvency Act 2006, as has been said earlier, to address a small number of significant issues that have arisen since that legislation was passed. The bill, as has been stated, preserves the integrity of the no-asset procedure, by preventing the discharge of fraudulent debts and of bankruptcy by restoring the official assignee\u2019s ability to recover those gifts made by a person prior to bankruptcy. The bill also amends public register provisions to better enable creditors to make informed lending decisions, by ensuring a public record of people who have been discharged from the no-asset procedure is available for an appropriate period of time.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000479\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002219bcf2ff-a193-4361-9072-813a4e36683c\u0022\u003EThat period is yet to be finalised. It also provides for permanent public records where the offender has had multiple insolvency events. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000480\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002219bcf2ff-a193-4361-9072-813a4e36683c\u0022\u003EThe bill makes two amendments to the existing no-asset procedure and one amendment to the current bankruptcy process. The fourth amendment is the one that may be contentious. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000481\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002219bcf2ff-a193-4361-9072-813a4e36683c\u0022\u003EThe no-asset procedure has been described as the soft bankruptcy procedure. It applies to debtors who have not previously gone through the no-asset procedure or been declared bankrupt, and it remains in place for only 12 months. After 12 months the debtor is discharged from the debts that were owed at the start of the period. We know that the debts are between $1 and $40,000, and that entry into the no-asset procedure can be refused only by the official assignee. The procedure provides a one-off opportunity for financially distressed individuals to avoid the stigma of bankruptcy and to rebuild their financial lives, as well as their personal lives. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000482\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002219bcf2ff-a193-4361-9072-813a4e36683c\u0022\u003EThe changes to the no-asset procedure are significant, in that they close a current loophole around fraudulent debt. We seem to have cross-party support for closing that loophole. The changes also allow for further investigation of a person who is undergoing the no-asset procedure. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000483\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002219bcf2ff-a193-4361-9072-813a4e36683c\u0022\u003EI will turn to the four amendments to the Act. The current Act does not explicitly exclude fraudulent debt under the no-asset procedure as it does for bankruptcy. An example is where someone racks up a fraudulent debt where maybe a benefit has been obtained under false pretences from a Government department. The changes stated will prevent fraudulent debtors from avoiding their legal obligations to repay a debt. That is a good thing. It is about personal responsibility, accounting for one\u2019s mistakes, and putting right what has been done wrong. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000484\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002219bcf2ff-a193-4361-9072-813a4e36683c\u0022\u003EThe second change I refer to is a reversion to the provisions in the Insolvency Act 1967 around gifts made in the 5 years prior to someone becoming a bankrupt. Those provisions put the onus of proving that the debtor was solvent at the time of the gift on the recipient, rather than on the official assignee. This is in line with the longstanding presumption that debtors are technically insolvent for a period of time before they file for formal insolvency and that gifts during that time are given for the purpose of avoiding payments to creditors. For example, if a husband is insolvent and gifts a number of items to his spouse or children, then that is deemed to be captured by the legislation. In my view, this not only reduces the workload of the official assignee but also clearly puts the onus on the debtor to discharge that duty before he or she is absolved of that debt. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000485\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002219bcf2ff-a193-4361-9072-813a4e36683c\u0022\u003EThe third amendment allows the official assignee to extend the period of time a debtor is under the no-asset procedure by a maximum of 25 working days. This allows for the investigation of any late objections or information received about the termination of a debtor\u2019s entry to the no-asset procedure. In my view it is a common-sense provision. It allows the official assignee the requisite time and eases the workload so that the right decision is made in the right circumstances. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000486\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002219bcf2ff-a193-4361-9072-813a4e36683c\u0022\u003EThe fourth amendment\u2014probably the most contentious point that the former Minister of Commerce and the current chair of the Commerce Committee, Lianne Dalziel, pointed out in her representations before me\u2014is around extending the period of time a debtor\u2019s name remains on the no-asset procedure and bankruptcy public registers. Currently, a debtor\u2019s name remains on the no-asset procedure register only until the debtor is discharged from the no-asset procedure process, which is up to 12 months. This prevents future investors, lenders, and credit-rating agencies from accessing that information once the debtor has been discharged. That information, once that time period has expired, cannot be accessed by lenders, credit agencies, and future investors. That is a very important and crucial point.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000487\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c186d0a2-99f4-408b-9b4d-d484cf19724d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00225e001ae16e8840fcb92f53043a5d6541\u0022\u003EHon Lianne Dalziel\u003C/span\u003E: It\u2019s a decision we made 2 years ago.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000488\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002219bcf2ff-a193-4361-9072-813a4e36683c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a84fc41ae61b49ef93bb62eef80184ca\u0022\u003EPESETA SAM LOTU-IIGA\u003C/span\u003E: It is a decision that the former Minister made 2 years ago, but that we are about to\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000489\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c186d0a2-99f4-408b-9b4d-d484cf19724d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00221dd5dd96612e46ee944f49a3093f0e1c\u0022\u003EHon Lianne Dalziel\u003C/span\u003E: No, Parliament.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000490\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002219bcf2ff-a193-4361-9072-813a4e36683c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00227575be7f61c04cc1aa13dd645f577fff\u0022\u003EPESETA SAM LOTU-IIGA\u003C/span\u003E: It is a decision that we are about to debate at future select committee meetings. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000491\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002219bcf2ff-a193-4361-9072-813a4e36683c\u0022\u003EA bankrupt debtor remains on the public register for a minimum of 7 years. After a bankrupt debtor is discharged, investors, lenders, and credit agencies cannot access that bankruptcy information. So there is a discrepancy there. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000492\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002219bcf2ff-a193-4361-9072-813a4e36683c\u0022\u003EThere is a difference between bankruptcy and the no-asset procedure, which we will investigate. Under the current legislation an accurate credit history cannot be compiled. As the Minister of Commerce alluded to earlier, that presents, in itself, an increased business risk. Although I accept the argument made by the Hon Lianne Dalziel that we may have a person who acts in good faith and who becomes bankrupt during the normal course of his or her business career, we also have to balance that consideration with the needs and desires of investors, lenders, and credit agencies. They require up-to-date and accurate information as to a person\u2019s financial risk. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000493\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002219bcf2ff-a193-4361-9072-813a4e36683c\u0022\u003EThis is a critical point and it is one we will get into serious discussions over. As the deputy chairperson of the Commerce Committee, I would be happy to hear representations and to listen to the submissions of the Privacy Commissioner and other parties from the business area and from across the board, even from those who may have been made bankrupt under the no-asset procedure and have experienced a revival in their fortunes. I think it is important to hear submissions from across the board. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000494\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002219bcf2ff-a193-4361-9072-813a4e36683c\u0022\u003EThis bill is about delivering for businesses. It is about delivering for individuals who have made errors, but it is also about delivering on the rule of law. The rule of law states that one should not profit from one\u2019s own dishonesty, fraudulent behaviour, or other lack of probity in one\u2019s business transactions. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000495\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002219bcf2ff-a193-4361-9072-813a4e36683c\u0022\u003EThe amendments are required to maintain the integrity of the personal insolvency processes. They also promote confidence in the official assignee\u2019s ability to administer these processes effectively. As I said earlier, these changes will prevent fraudulent debtors from avoiding their legal obligations to repay debt. The bill also removes the potential for a dishonest person to be rewarded. In my view it is consistent with the overriding policy objectives of the personal insolvency legislation. I reiterate that I support this bill. I look forward to the vibrant discussions during the select committee process. That is my submission.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002259e9efe2-6dea-4eeb-869a-ef5b3e48a5b5\u0022 data-id=\u0022192e80975e504ca88db2d3bda4ceb6d2\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000496\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002259e9efe2-6dea-4eeb-869a-ef5b3e48a5b5\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022192e80975e504ca88db2d3bda4ceb6d2\u0022\u003ECHARLES CHAUVEL (Labour):\u003C/span\u003E I would like to make a brief contribution to the debate in the time that remains this evening. As has been said, the legislation makes a number of changes to insolvency law.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000497\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002259e9efe2-6dea-4eeb-869a-ef5b3e48a5b5\u0022\u003EFirst, in relation to insolvent gifts, the rules have changed. There are four sets of rules that entitle the official assignee to cancel certain things done by a debtor before bankruptcy that reduce the assets available to creditors\u2014for example, giving money to a spouse or a family trust. This is what we might refer to, these days, as the Madoff exception.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000498\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002259e9efe2-6dea-4eeb-869a-ef5b3e48a5b5\u0022\u003EThe Insolvency Act 1967 stated that gifts given within 2 years before the adjudication of bankruptcy were voidable\u2014as was said in those days\u2014against the official assignee. This meant that the assignee could cancel the debts if the assignee wished to do so without having to prove whether the debtor could pay them at the time. And gifts within 2 to 5 years before the adjudication were voidable, unless the party claiming under the gift proved that the donor was able to pay all his or her debts without the aid of the property comprised in the gift. This meant that the onus of proving that the debtor was solvent when he or she made the gift fell on the recipient of the gift.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000499\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002259e9efe2-6dea-4eeb-869a-ef5b3e48a5b5\u0022\u003ENow, the law in section 204 of the Insolvency Act passed in 2006 is that the gift by a bankrupt to another person may be cancelled by the assignee if the bankrupt made the gift within 5 years immediately before adjudication, and the bankrupt was unable to pay his or her due debts immediately after making the gift. But the effect of section 205 is that the onus of proving that the debtor was solvent when the gift was made falls on the recipient of the gift if the gift was made within 2 years of the adjudication, and on the assignee if the gift was made between 2 and 5 years before it.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000500\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002259e9efe2-6dea-4eeb-869a-ef5b3e48a5b5\u0022\u003EThis Insolvency Amendment Bill provides a new set of rules, so that gifts made within 2 years of the adjudication may, again, be cancelled entirely at the assignee\u2019s discretion. For gifts made between 2 and 5 years before adjudication, the onus of proof will no longer lie with the assignee; it will shift to the recipient of the gift. The time at which the debtor must be proven to be able to satisfy the solvency test will shift. Instead of being immediately after making the gift, it becomes either then or at any time up to the adjudication. For example, if the debtor wins Lotto between making an insolvent gift and becoming bankrupt, the debtor may be able to avoid the gift being cancelled\u2014and that is obviously a sensible provision.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000501\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002259e9efe2-6dea-4eeb-869a-ef5b3e48a5b5\u0022\u003EWhen proving solvency, account is to be taken, again, of debts that have not yet fallen due\u2014for example, contingent liabilities. The 2006 Act would have provided, on that point, that the solvency test would look only at due debts. So, as Lianne Dalziel said, the first part of the legislation\u2014as far as changing the insolvent gifting regime\u2014makes a lot of sense, as do most of the changes mooted to the no-asset procedure, which speakers, including the previous speaker, have detailed and which I will not repeat.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000502\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002259e9efe2-6dea-4eeb-869a-ef5b3e48a5b5\u0022\u003EClearly, we are in a position in our history where insolvencies are on the rise. I refer to an article that appeared in the New Zealand Herald in November last year, in which comparison was made between the 3,938 insolvencies in the 10 months to October that year and the 2,963 insolvencies in the same period the year before. So, we saw a 33 percent rise in insolvencies, and in the 4 months prior to that article there had been a 46 percent rise.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000503\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002259e9efe2-6dea-4eeb-869a-ef5b3e48a5b5\u0022\u003EClearly, as we head into more difficult times we will be facing further insolvencies. Anything this Parliament does to strengthen the alternatives\u2014like the no-asset procedure, so that it is a proper avenue for people who really need that relief\u2014is a good thing. As Lianne Dalziel said, we will support that.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000504\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002259e9efe2-6dea-4eeb-869a-ef5b3e48a5b5\u0022\u003EWe have a real concern, however, about the provisions relating to the retention of information on the register. We need to take proper account of what the Privacy Commissioner said about this area. In fact, the whole area of information around insolvencies needs a proper look. Veda Advantage wrote to me some time ago and made the point that at the moment it is very easy to obtain someone\u2019s negative credit-rating in New Zealand, but it is an expensive and cumbersome process to get information on whether that person has a positive credit-rating.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000505\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002259e9efe2-6dea-4eeb-869a-ef5b3e48a5b5\u0022\u003EI urge the Commerce Committee, when it looks at the information provisions in this legislation, to take a proper look, in the round, at those requirements, to look at the Privacy Commissioner\u2019s concerns about the 4-year requirement in this particular case, and to also look at the wider issues about whether, for example, it would be a good thing to be able to get positive credit-ratings on people rather than just the negative ones that exist at the moment.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000506\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002259e9efe2-6dea-4eeb-869a-ef5b3e48a5b5\u0022\u003ESo with those words, I repeat that Labour supports the bill\u2019s going to a select committee, but in respect of the information provisions, we have serious reservations and would like to see a proper consideration of them.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002277ec6495-df45-43ac-aaa1-a03b5dd4c128\u0022 data-id=\u002208379eee78124d1fb035b274c4b339a6\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000507\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002277ec6495-df45-43ac-aaa1-a03b5dd4c128\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002208379eee78124d1fb035b274c4b339a6\u0022\u003EJOHN BOSCAWEN (ACT):\u003C/span\u003E It is 1 minute to 6pm, but let me very briefly say that the Minister of Commerce, Hon Simon Power, gave a very detailed summary of the Insolvency Amendment Bill\u2019s provisions. He was followed by the Hon Lianne Dalziel giving her very detailed knowledge of the circumstances that gave rise to the original Insolvency Bill being passed just 2 years ago. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000508\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002277ec6495-df45-43ac-aaa1-a03b5dd4c128\u0022\u003EThis is a bill that the ACT Party will be supporting for referral to the Commerce Committee. I do not propose to go into the details of the bill. But I would like to talk about the issues of insolvency and saving, because insolvency is an issue that I personally know something about. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000509\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002277ec6495-df45-43ac-aaa1-a03b5dd4c128\u0022\u003EDebate interrupted.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20090312912be7a6b4734ec9b50df71abc2496ed000510\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002277ec6495-df45-43ac-aaa1-a03b5dd4c128\u0022\u003EThe House adjourned at 6 p.m.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n    \u003C/div\u003E\n  \u003C/body\u003E\n\u003C/html\u003E"