"\u003C!DOCTYPE html\u003E\u003Chtml xmlns:xlink=\u0022http://www.w3.org/1999/xlink\u0022 xmlns:xsi=\u0022http://www.w3.org/2007/XMLSchema-instance\u0022 xmlns:mml=\u0022http://www.w3.org/1998/Math/MathML\u0022\u003E\n  \u003Chead\u003E\n    \u003CMETA http-equiv=\u0022Content-Type\u0022 content=\u0022text/html; charset=utf-16\u0022\u003E\n    \u003Cmeta name=\u0022viewport\u0022 content=\u0022width=device-width, initial-scale=1\u0022\u003E\n  \u003C/head\u003E\n  \u003Cbody style=\u0022font-family:sans-serif; font-size:100%;\u0022\u003E\n    \u003Cdiv class=\u0022HpsHansard\u0022\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000001\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsProceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u0022985465859fa04628b08100a3e5cc9dff\u0022\u003EWednesday, 22 September 2010\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000003\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u0022df3292daccf440ce8ad906cc18162f05\u0022\u003EWednesday, 22 September 2010\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000002\u0022\u003EMr Speaker took the Chair at 2 p.m.\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000004\u0022\u003EPrayers.\u003C/p\u003E\n    \u003C/div\u003E\n    \u003Cdiv class=\u0022HpsHansard\u0022\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000005\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsProceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u00223e0e84dc980a44fea4e70e8377d08d24\u0022\u003EBusiness of the House\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000007\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u0022adec65273a89451394809abf5b661006\u0022\u003EBusiness of the House\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022c437bda8-4741-4ac5-89ab-b0818e1ab9fa\u0022 data-id=\u0022c4fa659ed5284b63bbd3d7c46112cc85\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000006\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c437bda8-4741-4ac5-89ab-b0818e1ab9fa\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022c4fa659ed5284b63bbd3d7c46112cc85\u0022\u003EHon DARREN HUGHES (Senior Whip\u2014Labour):\u003C/span\u003E Subject to Standing Order 350(2), I seek the leave of the House for the member for Mana, the Hon Luamanuvao Winnie Laban, to make a valedictory statement on Tuesday, 12 October at 5.30 p.m. I have consulted the Leader of the House about this time, and it suits the Government as well as the Hon Winnie Laban.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000008\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ac169d29-4849-42c2-a4a7-f344fd416503\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022f16630c9eaee4b79bf10bbe3f00c2229\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Leave is sought. Is there any objection to that course of action? There is none.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n    \u003C/div\u003E\n    \u003Cdiv class=\u0022HpsHansard\u0022\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000009\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsProceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u0022cef9be7ec0784d929561e59e26c8aff4\u0022\u003ESpeaker\u2019s Rulings\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000010\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u0022665c7f09491b48a4846da2988d32505a\u0022\u003EPrime Ministerial Responsibility\u2014Confidence in Ministers with Party Roles\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022ac169d29-4849-42c2-a4a7-f344fd416503\u0022 data-id=\u0022c07bbbba37d34a7e994876a6c3919654\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000011\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ac169d29-4849-42c2-a4a7-f344fd416503\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022c07bbbba37d34a7e994876a6c3919654\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Yesterday I indicated that I would give further consideration to the acceptability of questions to the Prime Minister concerning confidence in Ministers, where those questions had a party connection. The Leader of the Opposition\u2019s primary question asked the Prime Minister whether one of his Ministers had shown good judgment and had his support, to which the Prime Minister replied \u201CYes.\u201D A supplementary question put a particular circumstance involving the Minister to the Prime Minister, and asked how that was good judgment. The circumstances related to the actions of the Minister. It had a party connection, but the Speaker does not rule a question out of order simply because it has a party connection. I refer members to Speaker\u2019s ruling 147/1. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000012\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ac169d29-4849-42c2-a4a7-f344fd416503\u0022\u003EThe supplementary question did not ask the Prime Minister to take responsibility for a party matter. It did not ask for party information or seek a party opinion. In effect, it asked for the Prime Minister\u2019s opinion of a judgment made by a Minister, a matter that may be relevant to the Prime Minister\u2019s confidence in a particular Minister. Had the supplementary question been a primary question, it may well have required authentication. But in the House the Speaker must make an instantaneous judgment. There is no time for analysis. Where there is doubt, the practice of Speakers is to allow the question, rather than taking the initiative in ruling it out. Having considered it further, I stand by my judgment to allow that supplementary question. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000013\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ac169d29-4849-42c2-a4a7-f344fd416503\u0022\u003EThat said, where a question does contain a party connection it will undoubtedly have implications for the reply. A Minister is under no obligation to address the party connection part of a question in his or her reply. The Prime Minister gave a reply to the supplementary question. Clearly, it did not satisfy the member who asked the question, and I myself had some concerns. I have reflected on that situation. The question, in effect, asked for an opinion, and it contained a party connection. In such circumstances the Speaker cannot judge the adequacy of the reply. It is up to the member to clarify the reply through further supplementary questions. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000014\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ac169d29-4849-42c2-a4a7-f344fd416503\u0022\u003EThe basic rule in respect of questions to Ministers is set out in Standing Order 369. Questions must relate to public affairs with which the Minister is officially connected. In practice a wide view is taken of the concept of ministerial responsibility. The scope for questioning Ministers and, in particular, the Prime Minister is broader than simply the administrative or ministerial responsibility of the Government. In the same way that Ministers may be asked about the general conduct of their departments, the Prime Minister can be asked about the conduct of his Ministers. Although the Prime Minister is not answerable for statements or actions taken purely in a non-ministerial capacity, such as those taken as a party leader or in a personal capacity, the Prime Minister can be asked about how such actions or statements may or may not affect his view of a Minister\u2019s judgment and his confidence in a Minister. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n    \u003C/div\u003E\n    \u003Cdiv class=\u0022HpsHansard\u0022\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000015\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsProceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u0022c20c32393b0f4b2ba4ac7346b00f55ee\u0022\u003EQuestions for Oral Answer\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000016\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u0022b225c7cbc376484cbdb0934d9a3cbb3b\u0022\u003EQuestions to Ministers\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000017\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u0022432d5cdc209a4bee816735a321fbb4cf\u0022\u003ETax System Changes\u2014Tax Calculator\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00226e1ead03-bf7f-496a-a02f-ce52859c58c1\u0022 data-id=\u002245e5c5ff7fee4c898fda0dc501666161\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000018\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226e1ead03-bf7f-496a-a02f-ce52859c58c1\u0022\u003E1. \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002245e5c5ff7fee4c898fda0dc501666161\u0022\u003EHEKIA PARATA (National)\u003C/span\u003E to the Minister of Finance: How much demand has there been for the tax calculator taxguide.govt.nz, and what are some of the benefits it confirms from the tax changes on 1 October?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022bb158206-360b-4757-8d72-f7d0994e1fb3\u0022 data-id=\u00223f1ef4ce933840db909c2c288ffbb4df\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000019\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bb158206-360b-4757-8d72-f7d0994e1fb3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00223f1ef4ce933840db909c2c288ffbb4df\u0022\u003EHon BILL ENGLISH (Minister of Finance):\u003C/span\u003E I am pleased to confirm that the website taxguide.govt.nz has been popular since the Budget, and demand is increasing. As of this morning, the calculator has received almost half a million page views. Clearly, New Zealanders are keen to see the effect of the Government\u2019s tax package for themselves. The website confirms that the GST income tax switch on 1 October will leave the average family about $25 a week better off, the average worker about $15 a week better off, and a couple on New Zealand superannuation about $11 a week better off. It is no wonder the tax guide is popular, and I hope more New Zealanders will follow the example of the Opposition and spend a good deal of time looking at it.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000020\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226e1ead03-bf7f-496a-a02f-ce52859c58c1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00226197118d0be04e629cfe37edadb7eb1e\u0022\u003EHekia Parata\u003C/span\u003E: How will the Government\u2019s tax package leave an average household better off?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000021\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bb158206-360b-4757-8d72-f7d0994e1fb3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002256d2fc3dbe364bb9bd043ef997e44c19\u0022\u003EHon BILL ENGLISH\u003C/span\u003E: If we take the case of a couple in their early 40s who jointly earn an average household income of $76,000 a year\u2014one working full-time earning $50,000 and the other part-time earning $26,000\u2014have two children, receive Working for Families, and pay $300 a week in mortgage repayments, under the tax changes that household gets a tax cut of $45.85 a week and pays an extra $21.14 in GST. So, overall, that household is $24.71 a week ahead, or nearly $1,284.92 a year better off.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000022\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e0192ed9-5715-4f6c-bd52-8db4f3466087\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00228a6ec2f32a12458ca24b6869412fac22\u0022\u003EHon David Cunliffe\u003C/span\u003E: Does the calculator confirm the analysis by the New Zealand Institute of Economic Research that half of all households will be worse off, as their tax cut is wiped out by rising food prices, GST, and other one-off charges?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000023\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bb158206-360b-4757-8d72-f7d0994e1fb3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00220172cc3574804c1eacd5aea0b89b522c\u0022\u003EHon BILL ENGLISH\u003C/span\u003E: No, it does not confirm that. What it confirms is that comparing the GST increase with the tax cuts, the vast majority of New Zealanders will be better off. As I pointed out to the member yesterday, real after-tax incomes will in fact rise between October and December by 1.2 percent, according to Treasury.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000024\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226e1ead03-bf7f-496a-a02f-ce52859c58c1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022d51034c736b847baae925a137882b862\u0022\u003EHekia Parata\u003C/span\u003E: How will the Government\u2019s tax package leave an average wage-worker better off?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000025\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bb158206-360b-4757-8d72-f7d0994e1fb3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00226ddfb0b88cf44ced8298b2b09f75cc10\u0022\u003EHon BILL ENGLISH\u003C/span\u003E: If we take the example of a plumber earning $50,000 a year\u2014the average full-time wage\u2014paying $120 in rent and saving $50 a week, under tax changes that person receives a tax cut of $29.42 a week and pays $13.51 more in GST. So, overall, they are $15.91 a week, or $827.32 a year, better off. But I remind the House that these tax cuts are not just about the hip pocket, they are about the vital need to rebalance our economy away from consumption and borrowing and towards investment, exporting, and saving.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000026\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e0192ed9-5715-4f6c-bd52-8db4f3466087\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022471c1e9f9f69483787fbc54efa551852\u0022\u003EHon David Cunliffe\u003C/span\u003E: How will the 160,000 people currently unemployed be better off when the consensus is that unemployment will remain at high levels for the next 2 years while food prices, rents\u2014and I do not know where he found a figure of $120 for rent because it certainly was not in Auckland\u2014and power prices continue to rise?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000027\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bb158206-360b-4757-8d72-f7d0994e1fb3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002201ed7473db3b40ebae31aed8d334ae38\u0022\u003EHon BILL ENGLISH\u003C/span\u003E: All those people who are on a benefit will be compensated on 1 October, and the longer-term benefit is simply that if we continue on an economic track where all growth is funded by borrowing, and people spend too much, then none of those people without jobs will get proper jobs. With the kind of rebalancing assisted by this package they have the hope of getting a real and sustainable job.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000028\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226e1ead03-bf7f-496a-a02f-ce52859c58c1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002252516084e4784ae090e13c4be7daf571\u0022\u003EHekia Parata\u003C/span\u003E: How will the Government\u2019s tax package leave a couple receiving New Zealand superannuation better off?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000029\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bb158206-360b-4757-8d72-f7d0994e1fb3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022b7c415a1d2314a1ea1a30b93dee78a77\u0022\u003EHon BILL ENGLISH\u003C/span\u003E: Let us take the example of a married couple who are retired and receiving New Zealand superannuation with no investments but who own their own home, which is fairly typical. Under the tax changes they get a tax cut of $11.52 a week, plus a $10.12 increase in their New Zealand superannuation payments because of the impact on tax cuts on the average wage, and they will pay an extra $10.87 a week in GST. Overall, the retired couple will be $10.77 a week better off, or $560 per year better off.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000030\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u002215eea9d1a2924a5d8d2916f4a7a875c3\u0022\u003EFreshwater Management Reform\u2014Proposed National Policy Statement\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022eb49ee66-7ca7-472d-a4a1-b099fd594dfa\u0022 data-id=\u00229c6aa6dec64246f3af4ef649e8970b97\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000031\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022eb49ee66-7ca7-472d-a4a1-b099fd594dfa\u0022\u003E2. \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00229c6aa6dec64246f3af4ef649e8970b97\u0022\u003EDr RUSSEL NORMAN (Co-Leader\u2014Green)\u003C/span\u003E to the Minister for the Environment: Will he recommend the adoption of the board of inquiry\u2019s proposed national policy statement on freshwater management now that the Land and Water Forum has reported back; if so, when?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022 data-id=\u002280da4423cc79422c909836c5cf57e12c\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000032\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002280da4423cc79422c909836c5cf57e12c\u0022\u003EHon Dr NICK SMITH (Minister for the Environment):\u003C/span\u003E The Land and Water Forum, involving 58 diverse organisations with an interest in water, has recommended the adoption of a national policy statement on fresh water, but it also recommended that we amend the one recommended by the board of inquiry. I have been further advised by officials and stakeholders that the version recommended by the board of inquiry is ultra vires\u2014that is, it goes beyond what a national policy statement can do under the Resource Management Act. That is why the Minister of Agriculture, David Carter, and I have asked officials from the Ministry of Agriculture and Forestry and the Ministry for the Environment to work on a revised national policy statement, taking on board the recommendations of the Land and Water Forum. If any significant changes are made from the board of inquiry report, the law requires that there be a process of consultation publicly.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000033\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022eb49ee66-7ca7-472d-a4a1-b099fd594dfa\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022bb6cd4f6281a4115a652cf9c6451fbe2\u0022\u003EDr Russel Norman\u003C/span\u003E: In light of his answer that he accepts the recommendation of the Land and Water Forum that we need a national policy statement, does he also accept its recommendation that we need it quickly, and what does he understand by the word \u201Cquickly\u201D?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000034\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002287a02fd044b7438689895d60593451f9\u0022\u003EHon Dr NICK SMITH\u003C/span\u003E: Firstly, I want to make it plain that the Government has made no decisions on the Land and Water Forum report. We hugely welcome it. The fact that we have organisations like Federated Farmers and the Royal Forest and Bird Protection Society coming to a consensus around the way forward on freshwater management is, the Government thinks, a huge step forward. We have received the final report only today. We want to get advice from officials, but it is the Government\u2019s view that we have been treading water\u2014excuse the phrase\u2014for a long time on freshwater policy and we need to make progress.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000035\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022eb49ee66-7ca7-472d-a4a1-b099fd594dfa\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022ec1f5db222c74176b5c9b43ce34af891\u0022\u003EDr Russel Norman\u003C/span\u003E: Does he agree with the Environmental Defence Society\u2019s chairperson, Gary Taylor, that it is crucially important that we have the national policy statement as soon as possible, and that other issues can be dealt with separately; if so, when will we have the national policy statement?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000036\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00220cd5a194de894c35aece0ec94efaeff7\u0022\u003EHon Dr NICK SMITH\u003C/span\u003E: I certainly agree that we have over 53 recommendations to consider from the Land and Water Forum\u2019s report. I do not think the Government\u2019s response will be a single measure. It will be a package that will take some time\u2014likely, a number of years. I certainly accept that there is a need to get on and resolve the issues around the national policy statement, but the Government has not yet decided on that programme, particularly given the advice from officials that the board of inquiry version will need to be amended in order for it to be consistent with the Resource Management Act, and given that the law itself requires a process of public consultation on any changes.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000037\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022eb49ee66-7ca7-472d-a4a1-b099fd594dfa\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022ac17df7594654e7ebe44737a76347b0e\u0022\u003EDr Russel Norman\u003C/span\u003E: I raise a point of order, Mr Speaker. I have asked this question in three separate ways now, seeking some kind of time frame. I appreciate that the Minister cannot give an exact time frame, but I ask you to ask the Minster to give some kind of time frame for when we will have the national policy statement. Currently, we do not have anything out of him about a time frame.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000038\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ac169d29-4849-42c2-a4a7-f344fd416503\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022834fef97cf2e4921ab26aa326efc7737\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: I hear the honourable member, but I ask him to reflect on the last supplementary question that he asked. If he had asked specifically: \u201CWhat is the time frame?\u201D, it might have been possible for me to insist on a more precise answer, but the member actually asked whether the Minister agreed with a statement by someone called Gary Taylor, if I remember the question correctly. The Minister answered that perfectly correctly. He said he agreed with some aspects of what that person said, so the remedy is in the member\u2019s own hands. If he wants to receive a precise answer, he has to ask a precise question.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000039\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022eb49ee66-7ca7-472d-a4a1-b099fd594dfa\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022748fa42c79394b038483e287c1138be5\u0022\u003EDr Russel Norman\u003C/span\u003E: I raise a point of order, Mr Speaker. If you read the primary question, you will see that it does say \u201Cwhen\u201D. I was giving the Minister the benefit of the doubt, as obviously there is an extended time frame, but I was trying to get a more specific time frame\u2014and the primary question did say \u201Cwhen\u201D.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000040\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ac169d29-4849-42c2-a4a7-f344fd416503\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00226dc7100d0d6641fbb383fb9e5dbf0c9c\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: The member has further supplementary questions. He can chase that matter up very precisely with the Minister, given that he is not satisfied with the answers so far.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000041\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002267aa5137-7503-4a8f-bde1-1811615598e2\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00220e4adf8869a3489d8df5f91404d56634\u0022\u003EBrendon Burns\u003C/span\u003E: Given that the Land and Water Forum\u2019s laudable report suggests it will take considerable time to develop the environmental and economic tools necessary to maintain the quality of water emerging from new storage schemes, will he now advise the Prime Minister to abandon his goals of seeing new water allocations in place in Canterbury next year?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000042\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002213cbdf854b6a4eb6875a5d04359c358f\u0022\u003EHon Dr NICK SMITH\u003C/span\u003E: Firstly, what I think is hugely encouraging in the Land and Water Forum\u2019s report is that we have key environmental organisations like Fish and Game New Zealand, the Royal Forest and Bird Protection Society, the Ecologic Foundation, and the Environmental Defence Society recognising the economic opportunities that go with storage, and, equally so, organisations like Federated Farmers recognising the need to lift the game around water-quality standards. I think that is a huge step forward. I do not recall the Prime Minister saying any storage facility would be built next year. I know he is a tremendous Prime Minister, but I do not think he can do it quite as quickly as that. Members opposite should not doubt this Government\u2019s view that fresh water is an incredibly important resource. There are economic opportunities that go with it, and we want to advance those economic opportunities but ensure that they are met with fundamental environmental bottom lines.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000043\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022eb49ee66-7ca7-472d-a4a1-b099fd594dfa\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00220c62a1adcb0349829eadf4e4aaf7a7ac\u0022\u003EDr Russel Norman\u003C/span\u003E: When will he recommend the adoption of the board of inquiry\u2019s proposed national policy statement for freshwater management?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000044\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00220ae5ca277f574db6abfdeca578873069\u0022\u003EHon Dr NICK SMITH\u003C/span\u003E: We received the Land and Water Forum\u2019s report just today, and Cabinet has not had the opportunity to consider any of the recommendations. I and my colleague David Carter have asked for officials\u2019 advice on the amendments that would come from the recommendations in the forum\u2019s report. I hope we will have those by the year\u2019s end. We have also given commitments, quite strongly, to the M\u0101ori Party and to the Iwi Leadership Group that we will consult them on such decisions. I think this is an issue that we should make progress on next year.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000045\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002267aa5137-7503-4a8f-bde1-1811615598e2\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022db695284418a4f2ab3b46df55f3c8a7d\u0022\u003EBrendon Burns\u003C/span\u003E: Can he give a commitment to this House that major new schemes to store and allocate water that come into effect before the recommendations of the Land and Water Forum are acted upon will be subject to the sorts of environmental rules that the forum\u2019s 58 stakeholders signed up to?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000046\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002237437f3081ca4ad8a0eee347558e7980\u0022\u003EHon Dr NICK SMITH\u003C/span\u003E: It is certainly the Government\u2019s view that if we are to have expanded irrigation in New Zealand\u2014and large economic opportunities would come from it\u2014we need to make sure that that is matched in parallel by good environmental standards that will ensure that water quality is not compromised by taking advantage of those economic opportunities. There is a huge amount of work to do in response to this report, and that work begins today.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000047\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022eb49ee66-7ca7-472d-a4a1-b099fd594dfa\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002230a4964703ca405db27457706dd11ff6\u0022\u003EDr Russel Norman\u003C/span\u003E: Is it not the case that adopting the proposed national policy statement would be the swiftest way to immediately set rules for clean water, so that we can get on with cleaning up our degraded waterways; if so, does he believe that simply making progress on it next year is really fast enough?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000048\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a93c2cdc95134e2a8adc91b2e7e59497\u0022\u003EHon Dr NICK SMITH\u003C/span\u003E: I draw the member\u2019s attention to exactly what the Land and Water Forum, representing 58 organisations like the Royal Forest and Bird Protection Society, Fish and Game, and the Ecologic Foundation, said, which was that the current draft is a basis to work from. They are not recommending that the Government immediately adopt the Land and Water Forum\u2019s report.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000049\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00221ed12b024a9241428e0ea51236b7b21a\u0022\u003EHon Member\u003C/span\u003E: What\u2019s the Government doing?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000050\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00228764ba6209074c31bd63b880b8369752\u0022\u003EHon Dr NICK SMITH\u003C/span\u003E: I hear the Labour member\u2019s interjection. What I would like to know is what the previous Government did in 9 years about freshwater management.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000051\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022eb49ee66-7ca7-472d-a4a1-b099fd594dfa\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00224d54356877ee4a2d831b46f501d74b9b\u0022\u003EDr Russel Norman\u003C/span\u003E: Will he give this House a guarantee that the proposed national policy statement will not be weakened when he finally recommends it?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000052\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022c3fe23b7197440408f77804b494735ec\u0022\u003EHon Dr NICK SMITH\u003C/span\u003E: What the Government will do is consider, alongside the board on inquiry report on the national policy statement, the advice that we have received from the Land and Water Forum. I have already indicated to the member that I and David Carter have indicated to both the Ministry of Agriculture and Forestry and the Ministry for the Environment that we want advice from those officials, so that we can put a robust national policy statement in place.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000053\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022eb49ee66-7ca7-472d-a4a1-b099fd594dfa\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022c087a47738e444a99e1abf534770a6eb\u0022\u003EDr Russel Norman\u003C/span\u003E: I raise a point of order, Mr Speaker. It was a very simple question; it asked whether it would be strengthened or weakened\u2014whether he can guarantee that it will not be weakened. He did not address that part of the question\u2014that was the only part of the question, actually.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000054\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ac169d29-4849-42c2-a4a7-f344fd416503\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022d463aa2dd97c40979ced863673cb5dca\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: I think the member has to be realistic. He cannot expect the Minister to give exactly the answer that he might want to hear, because there may be no yes or no answer. What does \u201Cweakened\u201D mean? The Minister explained to the House what would happen and what has to be considered in dealing with the report. The member who asked the question may consider some of those matters to strengthen or weaken it, but those are matters of opinion. I cannot insist on a Minister giving a precise answer to that kind of question, because there is no precise answer to that kind of question.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000055\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002267aa5137-7503-4a8f-bde1-1811615598e2\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002271dd8fb452894a0aa08044f62d4c60af\u0022\u003EBrendon Burns\u003C/span\u003E: I raise a point of order, Mr Speaker. I seek your guidance, Mr Speaker. The Minister said he did not recall the Prime Minister talking about new storage being built in Canterbury next year\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000056\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ac169d29-4849-42c2-a4a7-f344fd416503\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022de738012dafc4b2a827698d0b1b6dbc9\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: That is not a matter of order. The member seems to be litigating the answer given by the Minister, and he cannot do that by way of a point of order.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000057\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002267aa5137-7503-4a8f-bde1-1811615598e2\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022c0eaf05c97024ccda8dba877859053bb\u0022\u003EBrendon Burns\u003C/span\u003E: Point of order.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000058\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ac169d29-4849-42c2-a4a7-f344fd416503\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002257357132e8da473f96350254e044fe43\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: I must hear what the issue of order is.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000059\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002267aa5137-7503-4a8f-bde1-1811615598e2\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022b7fe46ed2d044480885c2338f24f0896\u0022\u003EBrendon Burns\u003C/span\u003E: I seek leave to table a written answer to a parliamentary question.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000060\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ac169d29-4849-42c2-a4a7-f344fd416503\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002230d18a0735a14be6af6d0ece3b16f84d\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Leave is being sought to table what?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000061\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002267aa5137-7503-4a8f-bde1-1811615598e2\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00221b751132757a4d88993a6d6994fd2769\u0022\u003EBrendon Burns\u003C/span\u003E: A written answer to a parliamentary question.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000062\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ac169d29-4849-42c2-a4a7-f344fd416503\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002205ad733557bd4da9af9141699a58aa21\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: No, we do not table written answers to written questions; they are available to all members already.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000063\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u002212eefc03fa94434988a5c853ce677a41\u0022\u003EMinisters\u2014Compliance with Cabinet Manual\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022c699e7c6-53b9-470c-a14a-378cb6fc8a04\u0022 data-id=\u002286c0aec59bcf49c492b7f163a7688f33\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000064\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c699e7c6-53b9-470c-a14a-378cb6fc8a04\u0022\u003E3. \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002286c0aec59bcf49c492b7f163a7688f33\u0022\u003EHon PHIL GOFF (Leader of the Opposition)\u003C/span\u003E to the Prime Minister: Does he believe that all his Ministers have met the requirement of the Cabinet Manual to behave in a way that upholds, and is seen to uphold, the highest ethical standards in their ministerial capacity, their political capacity and their personal capacity; if so, why?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00220083bcaa-f44d-4b70-97de-d091a209b88c\u0022 data-id=\u002288c93147fab840c9912cb09353a7cb0b\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000065\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220083bcaa-f44d-4b70-97de-d091a209b88c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002288c93147fab840c9912cb09353a7cb0b\u0022\u003ERt Hon JOHN KEY (Prime Minister):\u003C/span\u003E Yes, because as far as I am aware they have.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000066\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c699e7c6-53b9-470c-a14a-378cb6fc8a04\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022f5280b296eb54d55b6b152e07a27f416\u0022\u003EHon Phil Goff\u003C/span\u003E: Does he believe that his Minister Rodney Hide upheld the highest ethical standards in his personal and in his political capacities when he did not disclose but covered up his law and order spokesperson\u2019s criminal act in stealing the identity of a dead child?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000067\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220083bcaa-f44d-4b70-97de-d091a209b88c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00226d78750a40c34ae08f9811e34b603759\u0022\u003ERt Hon JOHN KEY\u003C/span\u003E: Firstly, I am not responsible for either the selection of candidates or the background of candidates in partners that the Government has a confidence and supply agreement with. Nor would there be any reason for me to question the backgrounds of those members. In no time prior to the public statement made in this House by David Garrett had I ever had a discussion with Rodney Hide about that issue. Therefore he could not have misled me, because he did not.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000068\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c699e7c6-53b9-470c-a14a-378cb6fc8a04\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022d950f14a55cf480ab90d2fce1ded7782\u0022\u003EHon Phil Goff\u003C/span\u003E: What has he done to hold Mr Hide, his Minister, accountable for his failure to meet what most New Zealanders would regard as an ethical standard, given the Cabinet Manual requirement that Ministers are accountable to the Prime Minister for their actions in a personal and a political capacity?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000069\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220083bcaa-f44d-4b70-97de-d091a209b88c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002209719413b2494e629d27a7e732ba472d\u0022\u003ERt Hon JOHN KEY\u003C/span\u003E: I think it is important here to understand the difference between judgment and ethical behaviour. The Cabinet Manual clearly states that Ministers are responsible to me for their ethical behaviour, not for their judgment. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000070\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c699e7c6-53b9-470c-a14a-378cb6fc8a04\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00221962fadf5ce64c33bb2dbe0422a4a643\u0022\u003EHon Phil Goff\u003C/span\u003E: What does the Prime Minister have to say about accountability for good judgment and high standards to the mother of the dead baby, who says that she has suffered huge stress and anxiety as a result of this criminal action, yet she still sees Mr Hide drawing a ministerial salary and the Prime Minister getting right in behind him and supporting him?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000071\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ac169d29-4849-42c2-a4a7-f344fd416503\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022fe70fae5d2fe4576a3e2d6d748742ce4\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Although I have stressed today that questions to Ministers can be quite wide in relation to the wider responsibility of Ministers for public affairs, that question, which referred to matters relating to someone totally unconnected with Parliament, would need rewording to bring it within the Standing Orders. I do not believe that the Prime Minister can be answerable for how another person might feel about something. I do not want the member to lose a supplementary question; I invite him to reword his question.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000072\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c699e7c6-53b9-470c-a14a-378cb6fc8a04\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00223d77f3eec5054816a226642f3b6d2cdf\u0022\u003EHon Phil Goff\u003C/span\u003E: Has the Prime Minister seen reports about the distress suffered by the mother of the dead baby caused by the criminal act of her child\u2019s identity being stolen and the involvement of a member of Parliament, supported by his leader who covered up that story, and how does he think that she feels about that?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000073\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220083bcaa-f44d-4b70-97de-d091a209b88c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002263dc229fbe444325b5b3dd8fedfa7b70\u0022\u003ERt Hon JOHN KEY\u003C/span\u003E: Mr Speaker\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000074\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ac169d29-4849-42c2-a4a7-f344fd416503\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00224fa2e149fc6e436591767978c422ff71\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: If the Prime Minister is happy to answer the question I am happy for him to do so, but I stress that the Prime Minister is not answerable at all for how a person outside this Parliament might feel about something. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000075\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c437bda8-4741-4ac5-89ab-b0818e1ab9fa\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022eb8dcb63657d4260801cedd4489e5cdb\u0022\u003EHon Darren Hughes\u003C/span\u003E: I raise a point of order, Mr Speaker. I want to make just a brief contribution to say that the style of questioning that the Leader of the Opposition used was identical to the one used by Rodney Hide yesterday when he asked whether the Prime Minister had seen reports that related to Mr Goff. When you listen to the wording used by Mr Goff, I think you will find that it was in order for a question that was asked yesterday.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000076\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ac169d29-4849-42c2-a4a7-f344fd416503\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022ae822afea162447d9b5e475a9000f6df\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: We do not need to take more time on a point of order like that. I invite the member to go back and have a look at the Hansard of the Hon Rodney Hide yesterday. It was a somewhat different situation as it referred to a report he had written to the Prime Minister himself, and the Prime Minister answered in relation to that report. The first part of the Leader of the Opposition\u2019s question seemed fine. He asked whether the Prime Minister had seen a certain report. That is fine. But then the question asked how he thought someone outside Parliament, totally disconnected from this place, might feel. I do not want to prevent the Prime Minister from answering a question should he wish to do so, but I cannot ask him to answer the question given the way last part of it was worded. I am in some difficulty here. I am prepared to give the honourable Leader of the Opposition a third go at this because I do not want him to lose a supplementary question, but the Prime Minister is clearly not answerable for how someone\u2014[Interruption]; I am on my feet\u2014outside of this place might feel about something.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000077\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c699e7c6-53b9-470c-a14a-378cb6fc8a04\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a4ff2875d11e4d178744fa5c69cb9efa\u0022\u003EHon Phil Goff\u003C/span\u003E: Has the Prime Minister seen reports about the distress suffered by the mother of the dead child whose identity was stolen, and is he prepared to relieve that distress by holding the person accountable who covered up the theft of that child\u2019s identity?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000078\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220083bcaa-f44d-4b70-97de-d091a209b88c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022fa9397257a554aa0acc2b88a20326221\u0022\u003ERt Hon JOHN KEY\u003C/span\u003E: Yes, I have seen reports. That is why I think Mr Garrett\u2019s behaviour was unacceptable\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000079\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c437bda8-4741-4ac5-89ab-b0818e1ab9fa\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022d7e770a91c3c419bbb9b0fdf125d7a7c\u0022\u003EHon Darren Hughes\u003C/span\u003E: What about the Minister?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000080\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f9c512a8-d532-4ef9-ad51-0fe8d752a893\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022c51e43a204a04972aed0267389f7058e\u0022\u003EHon Clayton Cosgrove\u003C/span\u003E: What about the guy who covered it up?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000081\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220083bcaa-f44d-4b70-97de-d091a209b88c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002278e74c5397fc44aea02c6fae05337346\u0022\u003ERt Hon JOHN KEY\u003C/span\u003E: Let me finish. That is why I believe it is wholly appropriate that Mr Garrett should resign from Parliament. As to the latter point, I am not responsible for whom political parties select as their candidates. I simply make this one point: the Cabinet Manual clearly says that in all these roles and at all times Ministers are expected to act lawfully. I make the point that this matter was covered by a suppression order.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000082\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c699e7c6-53b9-470c-a14a-378cb6fc8a04\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022bc3c0ebed6e843f389ee6cc78f9ab456\u0022\u003EHon Phil Goff\u003C/span\u003E: I seek leave to table the relevant part of the Cabinet Manual because it not only requires the Prime Minister to be accountable for lawful behaviour but also\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000083\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ac169d29-4849-42c2-a4a7-f344fd416503\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022e389928e2b364a3989a0f12bfb6a502a\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: The member cannot add that last bit. Leave has been sought to table part of the Cabinet Manual. I accept that it is not readily available to all members. Is there any objection to that? There is no objection.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000084\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ac169d29-4849-42c2-a4a7-f344fd416503\u0022\u003EDocument, by leave, laid on the Table of the House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000085\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c699e7c6-53b9-470c-a14a-378cb6fc8a04\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a3622706ce7a413c8e8d1def53ddecc9\u0022\u003EHon Phil Goff\u003C/span\u003E: When the Prime Minister said yesterday that Mr Hide had complied in every respect with the high standards that he had set, was he confusing high standards with double standards?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000086\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220083bcaa-f44d-4b70-97de-d091a209b88c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022c254a6806619488bae87cf7034cd756d\u0022\u003ERt Hon JOHN KEY\u003C/span\u003E: No, and I can say about Mr Hide that as a Minister he has conducted his affairs in his portfolio to a high standard, and that in all of my dealings with him as a Minister he has been honest and trustworthy with me.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000087\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c699e7c6-53b9-470c-a14a-378cb6fc8a04\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00220a26b2cda2db44a8b470e45e03e281c7\u0022\u003EHon Phil Goff\u003C/span\u003E: The Prime Minister says that Mr Hide has conducted his ministerial capacities to a high standard, so does he also agree that Mr Hide has conducted his personal and his political capacities to that same high standard, for which the Prime Minister is also accountable?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000088\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220083bcaa-f44d-4b70-97de-d091a209b88c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00225a1811e0e212481e88e9c24b55f08982\u0022\u003ERt Hon JOHN KEY\u003C/span\u003E: Mr Hide has carried out his affairs in a personal and private capacity to a high ethical standard. But I am not responsible for whom he might hire as an MP. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000089\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c699e7c6-53b9-470c-a14a-378cb6fc8a04\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022f15a977484204654bde6565f1e515053\u0022\u003EHon Phil Goff\u003C/span\u003E: Does the Prime Minister accept that he is the only person in the country who believes what he has just said?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000090\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220083bcaa-f44d-4b70-97de-d091a209b88c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022e4259e8807644865a6235d8c23b4f585\u0022\u003ERt Hon JOHN KEY\u003C/span\u003E: No.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000091\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bc1e9f65-e08b-4939-867c-22ef093e2a4e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002231d368abbc0f465bb8f1b8a7e66d69ed\u0022\u003EHon Rodney Hide\u003C/span\u003E: Would the Prime Minister consider it acceptable in his interpretation, as Prime Minister, of the Cabinet Manual for a Minister to sign a painting that the Minister had not painted, and then to arrange to have the evidence of that painting destroyed before it could be investigated?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000092\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c437bda8-4741-4ac5-89ab-b0818e1ab9fa\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00221bb916ac4480498b801f35228ff553f6\u0022\u003EHon Darren Hughes\u003C/span\u003E: Point of order\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000093\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ac169d29-4849-42c2-a4a7-f344fd416503\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022aa13eeb989aa49418def99eb23d003ec\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: I say to both sides of the House: this carry-on during a point of order will cease immediately. A fair question was asked; a point of order has been called. I want to hear what this point of order is about.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000094\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c437bda8-4741-4ac5-89ab-b0818e1ab9fa\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00228c3d91b55b94433a9764244f87363661\u0022\u003EHon Darren Hughes\u003C/span\u003E: I raise a point of order, Mr Speaker. My point of order is that the question that is being asked by Rodney Hide is not only hypothetical but about a third person who is not in Parliament. You have previously ruled that there cannot be questions put to the Prime Minister about\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000095\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ac169d29-4849-42c2-a4a7-f344fd416503\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002208db5d9dc7a4463b8f8f144c377d0291\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: The member has jumped to conclusions. I never heard any member or person named. It was hypothetical, indeed, and hypothetical questions are allowed.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000096\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220083bcaa-f44d-4b70-97de-d091a209b88c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00225bbbc6ce55a24d6694adf08dfc9159d9\u0022\u003ERt Hon JOHN KEY\u003C/span\u003E: No, I would not think that that would meet the standards of the Cabinet Manual, and I think that raises a very interesting point about when a member or a Minister is acting as a Minister, as opposed to when a Minister is acting as a member of\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000097\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ac169d29-4849-42c2-a4a7-f344fd416503\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022ee579e6ce87948bca075f131e6fd361c\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: I apologise to the Prime Minister. The Labour front bench may not like the answer the Prime Minister is giving. The deputy leader of the Labour Party will not interject while I am on my feet if she wishes to stay in the Chamber. The members may not like the answer the Prime Minister is giving, but he has a right to give an answer to what was a perfectly fair question within the terms of the Standing Orders. I could not hear the answer; I could not hear it at all, and I must, as Speaker, be able to hear the answer. The right honourable Prime Minister may carry on the part of the answer that I just could not hear, if he can determine what part that is.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000098\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220083bcaa-f44d-4b70-97de-d091a209b88c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022da65acaf50684909974909a52f7162b8\u0022\u003ERt Hon JOHN KEY\u003C/span\u003E: The answer is no, and if the member wants to ask a question about other Ministers in the previous Labour Government who did not fit within that category of the Cabinet Manual, then this party will need to lend his party some supplementary questions, because he will not have enough to ask them individually.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000099\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u0022252f4ec56b374652b43bb8cd97530430\u0022\u003EEconomic Growth\u2014Reports\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022fbe3f87c-849c-4eee-84cc-119edeb1a681\u0022 data-id=\u0022c2c56bd8922e4a869ec7e594673bc5ba\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000100\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022fbe3f87c-849c-4eee-84cc-119edeb1a681\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022c2c56bd8922e4a869ec7e594673bc5ba\u0022\u003EAARON GILMORE (National):\u003C/span\u003E My question is to the Minister of Finance [Interruption]\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000101\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ac169d29-4849-42c2-a4a7-f344fd416503\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00227ea0faec8fb1464191e5da668132e611\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: I apologise to Aaron Gilmore but again both front benches will cease interjection; the previous question has been dealt with. Members will show some courtesy to the member seeking to ask question No. 4, Aaron Gilmore.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022fbe3f87c-849c-4eee-84cc-119edeb1a681\u0022 data-id=\u00228a2588ab360c43d4b2e01ac828508fda\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000102\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022fbe3f87c-849c-4eee-84cc-119edeb1a681\u0022\u003E4. \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00228a2588ab360c43d4b2e01ac828508fda\u0022\u003EAARON GILMORE (National)\u003C/span\u003E to the Minister of Finance: What reports has he received on New Zealand\u2019s economic growth?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022bb158206-360b-4757-8d72-f7d0994e1fb3\u0022 data-id=\u00225f5cb8e0c64d4af18b4261f3154e9b37\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000103\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bb158206-360b-4757-8d72-f7d0994e1fb3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00225f5cb8e0c64d4af18b4261f3154e9b37\u0022\u003EHon BILL ENGLISH (Minister of Finance):\u003C/span\u003E The lift in growth is becoming apparent through the balance of payments statistics, which show that both profits and imports are rising. Statistics New Zealand today published the balance of payments data for the June quarter 2010, which show the current account deficit for the year ended June of $5.6 billion, or 3 percent of GDP. This compares with deficits averaging about 8 percent of GDP over the previous 5 years. Despite this lift in growth, the outlook for the current account is improving. The Reserve Bank forecast shows the deficit averaging about 4 percent of GDP over the next 3 years, or about half of the average of the recent past.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000104\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022fbe3f87c-849c-4eee-84cc-119edeb1a681\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a0506101d1674631acde0f5b554e52a8\u0022\u003EAaron Gilmore\u003C/span\u003E: What does today\u2019s data reveal about external debt?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000105\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bb158206-360b-4757-8d72-f7d0994e1fb3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022234b19ed522b47028c780edf5c0ebddb\u0022\u003EHon BILL ENGLISH\u003C/span\u003E: The news on New Zealand\u2019s external debt is less encouraging. These liabilities have risen by almost 40 percent to $164 billion over the past 5 years, which is something of a measure of the mismanagement of the economy. Net international liabilities are now 87 percent of GDP, which is one of the higher ratios in the developed world. It is not apparent that New Zealand has acquired good-quality assets as a result of this big upsurge in debt owed overseas. One consequence is that the annualised balance on investment income is, again, more than $10 billion in deficit, despite interest rates falling, and that will be a permanent drag on New Zealand incomes. The data reinforced the need for New Zealand to tilt the economy towards savings, exports, and investment, and away from excessive borrowing, excessive debt, and excessive Government spending increases, which characterised the economic management until 2008.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000106\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022fbe3f87c-849c-4eee-84cc-119edeb1a681\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00220510df843a3f4841a5c5c1647ddb88d8\u0022\u003EAaron Gilmore\u003C/span\u003E: What steps is the Government taking to address New Zealand\u2019s current account problems?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000107\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bb158206-360b-4757-8d72-f7d0994e1fb3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022436a3412ac3c41029dbefc45221a6e41\u0022\u003EHon BILL ENGLISH\u003C/span\u003E: New Zealand needs to raise exports and save more. Government policy is aimed precisely at those needs. Next week on 1 October the tax system changes in ways that will encourage savings and productive investment, and will discourage consumption and tax-driven speculation. Although the vast bulk of taxpayers will be better off, the real gains will be in the longer term as the changes help to change the incentives in the economy. At the moment, we also have the Savings Working Group undertaking some important thinking about how to further improve savings performance in New Zealand.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000108\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220fc05f1c-47b0-4fb0-8298-2f347adae4e3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00225b55ee5c750b4caea692e0f9c71072b2\u0022\u003EHon Sir Roger Douglas\u003C/span\u003E: Can the Minister explain how a reduction in productive employment in primary and manufacturing industries of 11 percent and 5 percent respectively, offset by increases in public administration and social assistance employment of 21 percent and 26 percent respectively, over the last 6 years helped grow the economy?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000109\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bb158206-360b-4757-8d72-f7d0994e1fb3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00229f6ef2c199c4409fa9e5025a619e3f69\u0022\u003EHon BILL ENGLISH\u003C/span\u003E: I agree with the member\u2019s analysis. Too many of the new jobs that were created since about 2004 were, essentially, either funded by Government spending increases that turned out to be unsustainable, or by excessive borrowing, which equally turned out to be unsustainable. The number of jobs in the export sector of the economy actually shrank; in fact, there have been no net new jobs in our export sector since 2002. That is why the Government needs to manage Government spending much more tightly and reduce back-office expenditure where it can. The Government must also make sure that resources move from the sheltered parts of the economy\u2014essentially, Government, domestic housing and so on\u2014into the export and trading part of the economy, because in the next 10 years we have to earn it before we spend it. In the last 10 years, we spent it well before we earned it.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000110\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022fbe3f87c-849c-4eee-84cc-119edeb1a681\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00229a54f6b53d934755b1a0426b058bfd26\u0022\u003EAaron Gilmore\u003C/span\u003E: What alternative economic policies would lower growth and leave the economy poorly positioned for the future?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000111\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bb158206-360b-4757-8d72-f7d0994e1fb3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002258327fedac114e91847dbdc7d85cdd18\u0022\u003EHon BILL ENGLISH\u003C/span\u003E: There is a steady stream of suggestions about different ways to manage the economy, which includes increasing personal income taxes, borrowing more, fiddling with the GST system, increasing Government spending irresponsibly, and meddling with the Reserve Bank tool kit. All of those suggestions have come from the Opposition, and they are the same policies that got New Zealand into trouble. That is why we are changing them.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000112\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u00225842b63fb92b43b1a488c9df9b824daa\u0022\u003EFreshwater Management Reform\u2014Strategies for Sustainable Reform\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022e2e2ee61-b3b9-4a89-bcc3-5b7be76c5825\u0022 data-id=\u0022e83ae6d36a4d4389801d18dfb0ed0b6c\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000113\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e2e2ee61-b3b9-4a89-bcc3-5b7be76c5825\u0022\u003E5. \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022e83ae6d36a4d4389801d18dfb0ed0b6c\u0022\u003ERAHUI KATENE (M\u0101ori Party\u2014Te Tai Tonga)\u003C/span\u003E to the Minister for the Environment: Does he agree with the Fresh Start for Freshwater report that sustainable reform must reflect the values and interests of both Treaty partners, and what strategies does he have in mind to recognise this?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022 data-id=\u002241479558875444f5aabba81552eba961\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000114\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002241479558875444f5aabba81552eba961\u0022\u003EHon Dr NICK SMITH (Minister for the Environment):\u003C/span\u003E The Government is very mindful of the huge interest from M\u0101ori in issues regarding fresh water. That is why we initiated, in consultation with the M\u0101ori Party, a separate process of engagement with M\u0101ori through the Iwi Leadership Group. I met with the group yesterday; during the meeting we received the sad news regarding Sir Archie Taiaroa. We agreed out of respect to defer our discussions on the Land and Water Forum report until November. I note, though, that the iwi leaders indicated to me a strong level of support for the report.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000115\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e2e2ee61-b3b9-4a89-bcc3-5b7be76c5825\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00226991db5e3893478bbe78b57fad2e854b\u0022\u003ERahui Katene\u003C/span\u003E: What guarantee can the Minister give to iwi that a national land and water commission will be established in co-governance with iwi, as recommended by the forum?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000116\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00227474423e5b114e33930139b80f7b7621\u0022\u003EHon Dr NICK SMITH\u003C/span\u003E: That is one of the 53 recommendations of the Land and Water Forum. The Government received the final report only today and has not had the opportunity to consider that or the other recommendations. I am keen to firstly have a dialogue with New Zealanders through public consultation on the report. We are keen to have direct dialogue with the Iwi Leadership Group, and I also welcome a dialogue with parties in this Parliament, including the M\u0101ori Party.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000117\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e2e2ee61-b3b9-4a89-bcc3-5b7be76c5825\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00222d29659eeee34c698f374f9f5562f0cf\u0022\u003ERahui Katene\u003C/span\u003E: Does the Minister agree that the transition to any new system of water allocation should proceed hand in hand with Crown-iwi discussions on iwi rights and interests in water management; and what progress can he report on discussions with iwi about water rights and interests?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000118\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002210120445c6fd4779aa14f0834c373030\u0022\u003EHon Dr NICK SMITH\u003C/span\u003E: In discussions on Waitangi Day and many other discussions the Government has had with iwi leaders, their huge interest in water has been repeatedly highlighted. I also say that in the discussions I have had with the Minister of M\u0101ori Affairs, he too has made the claim that water is a very significant issue for iwi. The Government specifically has established and worked with the Iwi Leadership Group on water policy. Those discussions have progressed very constructively, and we have scheduled a further meeting in November to specifically consider the recommendations of the Land and Water Forum.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000119\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u002219e58bad454a4acf89289207c416075a\u0022\u003ESuperannuation\u2014Compensation Available from 1 October\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002209a5b71a-ca7e-4e7c-9e09-f9e63f18aa12\u0022 data-id=\u0022867767b1730f4251a49af00f3c7586ee\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000120\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002209a5b71a-ca7e-4e7c-9e09-f9e63f18aa12\u0022\u003E6. \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022867767b1730f4251a49af00f3c7586ee\u0022\u003EHon ANNETTE KING (Deputy Leader\u2014Labour)\u003C/span\u003E to the Prime Minister: Does he stand by his statement that \u201CWe are boosting New Zealand Superannuation and Veterans\u2019 Pension to fairly compensate for the GST rise\u201D?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00220083bcaa-f44d-4b70-97de-d091a209b88c\u0022 data-id=\u002271faf1ac56c94c349508b9c9f9b31aba\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000121\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220083bcaa-f44d-4b70-97de-d091a209b88c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002271faf1ac56c94c349508b9c9f9b31aba\u0022\u003ERt Hon JOHN KEY (Prime Minister):\u003C/span\u003E Yes, because that is what the facts clearly show. After 1 October superannuation rates will immediately be increased by 2.02 percent to compensate for the price effects of raising GST. In addition to this, superannuitants will get the benefit of lower income tax rates, which will increase the amount of superannuation they receive in the hand. As a result of both these increases, superannuitants will be more than compensated for the rise in GST.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000122\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002209a5b71a-ca7e-4e7c-9e09-f9e63f18aa12\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022627e3aa9d76a43d49de4a0c5534ac1a0\u0022\u003EHon Annette King\u003C/span\u003E: When he told single superannuitants living alone that they would be $15 a week better off from 1 October, did that mean that superannuitants will have $15 extra a week after they have paid for the increase in GST on all goods and services, other Government charges such as accident compensation, the cost of the emissions trading scheme, and inflation; if not, what did he mean?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000123\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220083bcaa-f44d-4b70-97de-d091a209b88c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022b818b0bb7c114d61805d67f064689c23\u0022\u003ERt Hon JOHN KEY\u003C/span\u003E: The first thing I should have told them is they were right to vote National, because the emissions trading scheme would have been twice as expensive under Labour. I would tell them the same thing that every Government has told superannuitants since New Zealand superannuation was brought in: general increases in the overall cost base are met with the CPI adjustment that takes place on 1 April every year.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000124\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221368ba6c-25be-40f6-a2a0-8f81e1f78b79\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022402ba5cf320044bf976acdd96a41c0f1\u0022\u003EChris Tremain\u003C/span\u003E: How much more will superannuitants receive in the hand after 1 October?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000125\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220083bcaa-f44d-4b70-97de-d091a209b88c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00225a9c08be2156426a8679a5456c904cbc\u0022\u003ERt Hon JOHN KEY\u003C/span\u003E: The Minister of Finance earlier used an example of a married couple who are retired and receiving superannuation. Under the 1 October tax changes they will get a tax cut of $11.52 a week, plus an increase of $10.12 a week as a result of GST going up. That makes a total of $21.64 a week. It is worth noting that since 2008, tax cuts and ongoing price adjustments have meant that that couple would have seen their superannuation payments go up by a grand total of $71.26 a week, or just over $3,700 a year.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000126\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002209a5b71a-ca7e-4e7c-9e09-f9e63f18aa12\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022be9cf3fe82f54f27bb57094596d8494c\u0022\u003EHon Annette King\u003C/span\u003E: Has he received correspondence from single superannuitants pointing out that after paying the increased cost of power, telephone, rates, bus fares, doctors\u2019 bills, insurance, and groceries, they will be worse off, and does he think that they are incapable of working out the tax switch that affects their back pocket?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000127\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220083bcaa-f44d-4b70-97de-d091a209b88c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022337cddbb475940d09ea00db7ca3218ca\u0022\u003ERt Hon JOHN KEY\u003C/span\u003E: I do not see all the correspondence that comes into my office, but if letters of such a nature came in, I would go back to those superannuitants and say this. First, they will be better off absolutely as a result of the GST tax switch. Secondly, any changes that affect the overall price base\u2014electricity and the like\u2014will under our Government, as they were under previous Governments, be updated on 1 April of each year. Thirdly, I point out that this Government has been running an inflation rate that has been substantially lower than under the previous Government because we have good economic management skills.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000128\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002209a5b71a-ca7e-4e7c-9e09-f9e63f18aa12\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022ed50a00e450f458da8f536bc447e2e4e\u0022\u003EHon Annette King\u003C/span\u003E: Does he consider that spending over $250,000 to send a letter to all superannuitants in New Zealand\u2014which fails to tell them how much GST they will pay and what impact the emissions trading scheme and other increases in Government charges and increased inflation will have on their tax switch\u2014is a good use of taxpayers\u2019 money?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000129\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220083bcaa-f44d-4b70-97de-d091a209b88c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00223e194d805061425db625dc1bc3f05d46\u0022\u003ERt Hon JOHN KEY\u003C/span\u003E: Firstly, I cannot confirm how much the letter I sent out cost, because I genuinely do not know. But I do know that every dollar of taxpayer money spent on that letter was a better dollar invested than those spent on the one sent out by that mickey mouse party yesterday, which did not even convince a scuba-diver that 15 percent GST was the responsibility of this Government.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000130\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002209a5b71a-ca7e-4e7c-9e09-f9e63f18aa12\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002262a04f3ae7784b18a214a687be8de670\u0022\u003EHon Annette King\u003C/span\u003E: Has anyone explained the meaning of double standards to him, given that he criticises Labour\u2019s GST pamphlet, which cost a fraction of the $250,000 he has spent on a letter to superannuitants that did not tell them the whole truth about what will be left in their pockets after 1 October?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000131\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ac169d29-4849-42c2-a4a7-f344fd416503\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002249c1ee5930a74da485941c0da4210ec7\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: I apologise to the honourable member. I say to National members that I struggled to hear the member asking the question. I encourage them to be a little more reasonable in their interjections. I invite the Hon Annette King to repeat her question so that I can hear it.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000132\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002209a5b71a-ca7e-4e7c-9e09-f9e63f18aa12\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022c7a3fbac6d3d4ed482c8e0890ccb2b29\u0022\u003EHon Annette King\u003C/span\u003E: Has anyone explained the meaning of double standards to him, given that he criticises Labour\u2019s expenditure on a GST pamphlet that cost a fraction of the $250,000-plus that he spent sending a letter to superannuitants that fails to tell them what will be left in their pockets after 1 October?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000133\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220083bcaa-f44d-4b70-97de-d091a209b88c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00227242968fb1f446c291e1e1dcfa00dee5\u0022\u003ERt Hon JOHN KEY\u003C/span\u003E: No, but I managed to watch the TV3 news last night, which pointed out that hundreds of thousands of New Zealanders will get a brochure from the Labour Party that is nothing short of a lie.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000134\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ac169d29-4849-42c2-a4a7-f344fd416503\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022c5fc3b2235fa41348e074e546a225b2e\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: I say this again to National members. Their own senior whip is seeking to ask a supplementary question, and they would be advised to show their senior whip some courtesy.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000135\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221368ba6c-25be-40f6-a2a0-8f81e1f78b79\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022227bcfe223b242f0830081116fb30b63\u0022\u003EChris Tremain\u003C/span\u003E: Can the Prime Minister name just one other country in the world with GST at 15 percent or higher that exempts fresh fruit and vegetables?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000136\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220083bcaa-f44d-4b70-97de-d091a209b88c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022195f668fbbc14316999f09cc38813032\u0022\u003ERt Hon JOHN KEY\u003C/span\u003E: I thank the member for re-asking Phil Goff\u2019s question, and I say that he did it better than Phil Goff did yesterday. I am advised that 23 OECD countries have GST or VAT rates of at least 15 percent. Of those 23 countries, only Mexico and the UK have no GST or VAT on fresh fruit and vegetables.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000137\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221368ba6c-25be-40f6-a2a0-8f81e1f78b79\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002239a3777756144bd1b07f308ebecbdc85\u0022\u003EChris Tremain\u003C/span\u003E: Has the Prime Minister seen any reports on exempting certain goods from GST?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000138\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220083bcaa-f44d-4b70-97de-d091a209b88c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00226ba32a25414341eaaa32a7e4c99a5b24\u0022\u003ERt Hon JOHN KEY\u003C/span\u003E: Yes. The issue of exempting certain basic necessities from GST was discussed in the Tax Working Group\u2019s report earlier this year. The Tax Working Group rejected this idea, stating: \u201CHowever, narrowing the GST base would substantially reduce the efficiency of the tax and increase compliance and administration costs, while having limited impact on equality. For example, removing food from the base makes almost no difference to the distribution of tax across income levels, but loses 20% of GST revenue. This fall in revenue would then need to be recovered by higher rates of GST, or increasing other taxes.\u201D There was a time when the Labour Party knew that the GST system we had in New Zealand was the right one\u2014that was a time when it was not desperate.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000139\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002209a5b71a-ca7e-4e7c-9e09-f9e63f18aa12\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022bfb3fe9fbe824cc4981fabcba8762a29\u0022\u003EHon Annette King\u003C/span\u003E: Did he promise before the last election not to increase GST?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000140\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220083bcaa-f44d-4b70-97de-d091a209b88c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022dab89ae87647422dade1b507fca92be6\u0022\u003ERt Hon JOHN KEY\u003C/span\u003E: I said that I had no intentions of raising GST to cover the deficit, and we are not doing so. You see, that is the reason\u2014[Interruption]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000141\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ac169d29-4849-42c2-a4a7-f344fd416503\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00227abf92fc025c4c54a2ae0ad1a865364f\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: I want to be able to hear the Prime Minister.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000142\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220083bcaa-f44d-4b70-97de-d091a209b88c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022148b135893f349e4a54bbf1a70d06146\u0022\u003ERt Hon JOHN KEY\u003C/span\u003E: That is the reason I will make this prediction: we will not go into 2011 with Phil Goff reversing this policy. Why not? Because when New Zealanders get their $4 billion of personal tax cuts, they will not want Phil Goff and his bunch of muppets to take them away.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000143\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u0022d8ab45d7d1f04ec4a2138eb41f4fdee0\u0022\u003EFreshwater Management Reform\u2014Progress\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022a68928ea-9dd8-4a30-8e2c-a0f49dfc8bea\u0022 data-id=\u0022e2034e1794d144809f21499af8d89bd0\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000144\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a68928ea-9dd8-4a30-8e2c-a0f49dfc8bea\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022e2034e1794d144809f21499af8d89bd0\u0022\u003ELOUISE UPSTON (National\u2014Taup\u014D):\u003C/span\u003E My question is to the Minister for the Environment\u2014[Interruption]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000145\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ac169d29-4849-42c2-a4a7-f344fd416503\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022838bc0f5676d465eab3ab6b845bcf6a4\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: I know there is a bit of excitement and passion around some of these issues\u2014I understand that\u2014but I have called Louise Upston, and the unhelpful interjections should cease.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022a68928ea-9dd8-4a30-8e2c-a0f49dfc8bea\u0022 data-id=\u0022a1808d47f15d427da9fd34d8bffe926b\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000146\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a68928ea-9dd8-4a30-8e2c-a0f49dfc8bea\u0022\u003E7. \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022a1808d47f15d427da9fd34d8bffe926b\u0022\u003ELOUISE UPSTON (National\u2014Taup\u014D)\u003C/span\u003E to the Minister for the Environment: What progress has the Government made on improving freshwater management in New Zealand, and the collaborative process outlined in National\u2019s 2006 Bluegreen Vision document and 2008 election policy?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022 data-id=\u0022b3e68bf41c294ed1a17818fa381e618e\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000147\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022b3e68bf41c294ed1a17818fa381e618e\u0022\u003EHon Dr NICK SMITH (Minister for the Environment):\u003C/span\u003E Today we marked a significant milestone, with 58 diverse organisations with an interest in water coming to an agreed way forward on water reform. This milestone is as significant as the Forest Accord that was struck in the 1980s on the vexed issue of indigenous forests. It is significant that organisations as diverse as Federated Farmers, the Royal Forest and Bird Protection Society, Fish and Game, and Fonterra are recommending a way forward on how to progress better management of fresh water.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000148\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a68928ea-9dd8-4a30-8e2c-a0f49dfc8bea\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022ff84e9931d0f4e09893fe6d06d791580\u0022\u003ELouise Upston\u003C/span\u003E: Does the Minister accept that proper measurement of water takes is an important part of improving management; if so, what steps is the Government taking to ensure that water takes are measured?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000149\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002250ef4ab631274c0d9043281f73235444\u0022\u003EHon Dr NICK SMITH\u003C/span\u003E: We cannot manage what we do not measure. That is why the Government has moved to provide for\u2014[Interruption] Members opposite are interjecting; I think it is out of embarrassment that in 9 years Labour\u2019s programme of action on water went absolutely nowhere. Only 31 percent of water takes by volume were measured. The new regulations coming into effect in November will ensure that 98 percent of water takes by volume will be measured by 2016.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000150\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a68928ea-9dd8-4a30-8e2c-a0f49dfc8bea\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002241e829d4ca3642bb95e3a542a6d997b0\u0022\u003ELouise Upston\u003C/span\u003E: What financial commitments has the Government already made to improving water quality in New Zealand, and how does this compare with spending over the past decade?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000151\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002276b642af9d454e028d94430af6cc8356\u0022\u003EHon Dr NICK SMITH\u003C/span\u003E: This Government is investing $94 million in the 5 years from 2009 to 2014 in initiatives to clean up some of New Zealand\u2019s iconic waterways\u2014places like Lake Rotorua, the Waikato River, and Lake Taup\u014D. The $94 million over 5 years compares with just $16 million, or one-fifth of that amount, spent in the previous 5 years. I think that shows the level of commitment that members on this side of the House have to improving New Zealand\u2019s freshwater quality.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000152\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u002292122fe705d44643814fec5a69fad25c\u0022\u003ETax System Changes\u2014Tax Calculator\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022e0192ed9-5715-4f6c-bd52-8db4f3466087\u0022 data-id=\u0022231d8c944a7e4b039bc92bea2d0e8301\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000153\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e0192ed9-5715-4f6c-bd52-8db4f3466087\u0022\u003E8. \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022231d8c944a7e4b039bc92bea2d0e8301\u0022\u003EHon DAVID CUNLIFFE (Labour\u2014New Lynn)\u003C/span\u003E to the Minister of Finance: Does the Government\u2019s tax calculator still omit the effect of inflation when attempting to establish whether members of the public will gain or lose from his Budget 2010 tax switch; if so, why?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022bb158206-360b-4757-8d72-f7d0994e1fb3\u0022 data-id=\u00229db440af85cd498c89f88a2154d65eea\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000154\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bb158206-360b-4757-8d72-f7d0994e1fb3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00229db440af85cd498c89f88a2154d65eea\u0022\u003EHon BILL ENGLISH (Minister of Finance):\u003C/span\u003E Yes; because the calculator correctly provides information on the effects of the switch between income tax and GST as it affects taxpayers on 1 October. As I said yesterday, even when all forecast cost of living increases are taken into account\u2014and the calculator is not designed to take into account all forecast cost of living increases\u2014real after-tax wages are forecast to rise by 1.2 percent in the 3 months to 31 December 2010. This means that the increase in wages will more than offset the effect of inflation, and that 1.2 percent increase in those 3 months compares somewhat favourably with the 3 percent increase in real after-tax wages over 9 years under the Labour Government. Those calculations are based on the same data series used to calculate annual adjustments to national superannuation.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000155\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e0192ed9-5715-4f6c-bd52-8db4f3466087\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022025fcbbbe1be4c75ae76f58674290e6c\u0022\u003EHon David Cunliffe\u003C/span\u003E: Can the Minister confirm that the 500,000 New Zealanders whom he said had dialled into the online tax calculator have been effectively misled not only because it has still omitted inflation but because the numbers that he has quoted account for Labour\u2019s 2008 tax cuts under National\u2019s real income growth figures? \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000156\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bb158206-360b-4757-8d72-f7d0994e1fb3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022655dead5f7d649beb61a4057bee0b5d3\u0022\u003EHon BILL ENGLISH\u003C/span\u003E: I can confirm that 500,000 people have looked at the tax guide, which is a lot more than the number of people who signed up to go to Mr Cunliffe\u2019s speech in Rotorua today at lunchtime, which I understand was two, and that is why he cancelled it. [Interruption] \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000157\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ac169d29-4849-42c2-a4a7-f344fd416503\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002215b28286f26249fbb65aa0a8e45cecf4\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: I do not believe that a serious attempt was made to answer that question, at all. I invite the Hon David Cunliffe to repeat his question, if he would like to. He does not have to. If he would rather go on, he is welcome to. I give him the choice.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000158\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e0192ed9-5715-4f6c-bd52-8db4f3466087\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022c4797106657148619db03630e1fd42cc\u0022\u003EHon David Cunliffe\u003C/span\u003E: I would be delighted, Mr Speaker. I could do it again and again. Can the Minister confirm that the 500,000 people whom he said had dialled into his tax calculator were effectively misled not only because it continues to omit the effects of inflation but because the figures that he has quoted include Labour\u2019s 2008 tax cuts under National\u2019s so-called net income increase?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000159\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bb158206-360b-4757-8d72-f7d0994e1fb3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00222770a930fcb948269b8f4538ae265a05\u0022\u003EHon BILL ENGLISH\u003C/span\u003E: As I have explained to the member any number of times, the tax calculator is exactly the same as the tax calculators that were used by the previous Government. It is designed to show the impact of the increase in GST on 1 October versus the reduction in income taxes, and it shows that most New Zealanders will, in fact, be better off. As I have also explained to the member, although the effects on 1 October are important to people and they will be interested in them, the real benefits of these tax cuts are about the long-run rebalancing of the economy. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000160\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e0192ed9-5715-4f6c-bd52-8db4f3466087\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022050278c50a4e456dbf18cf2e5a38acbd\u0022\u003EHon David Cunliffe\u003C/span\u003E: Can he further confirm that he has based his estimates on a data set that pre-dated the 2008 election, and that if that and the tax cut anomaly are corrected, there is far higher real income growth under the previous Government than under the current one?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000161\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bb158206-360b-4757-8d72-f7d0994e1fb3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a63fd0a95f604eb5af5f712e8d4672b1\u0022\u003EHon BILL ENGLISH\u003C/span\u003E: The member is trying to conflate two different sets of numbers: one is the tax calculator and the other is a calculation of real after-tax incomes, and they set out to measure quite different things.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000162\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e0192ed9-5715-4f6c-bd52-8db4f3466087\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00225dbdf11fd4dc44eebf333003111ec5cd\u0022\u003EHon David Cunliffe\u003C/span\u003E: I raise a point of order, Mr Speaker. At no stage in that supplementary question, as opposed to the previous two, did I mention the online tax calculator. The Minister began his response to a question I did not ask\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000163\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ac169d29-4849-42c2-a4a7-f344fd416503\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00225ba7b172ae9d4653bb5e65e6cf49c37c\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: I think the member should give the Minister a chance to answer the question. On this occasion, I believe that the Minister was attempting to answer the question in a pretty genuine way. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000164\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bb158206-360b-4757-8d72-f7d0994e1fb3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00227eecf90c680840b0929f5f79b1b3c040\u0022\u003EHon BILL ENGLISH\u003C/span\u003E: I stand by my point. The primary question was about the tax calculator, and the member is trying to mix up those calculations with calculations of real after-tax wages. I guess the test will be whether Labour believes this tax switch makes New Zealanders worse off. If so, I look forward to seeing Labour members campaigning in 2011 on reversing the tax switch. Then I will believe that Labour members seriously believe what they are saying about these changes making New Zealanders worse off. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000165\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022eaf79431-1033-44f1-a633-22633da52c0d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00221a660ec703ca4c919c0f9d84a4b1b63a\u0022\u003EDavid Bennett\u003C/span\u003E: What reports has he seen on previous tax cuts and inflation?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000166\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bb158206-360b-4757-8d72-f7d0994e1fb3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022f16b53552fcb44b18697d8cb25565e24\u0022\u003EHon BILL ENGLISH\u003C/span\u003E: I have seen reports that confirm that tables explaining tax cuts in October 2008 did not include the impact of inflation, which at the time was running at 5.1 percent in the final months of the dying Labour Government, and that is with no GST increase. So it was actually right about that\u2014with a tax calculator, it does not make sense to include inflation. After the tax cuts on 1 October this year, real after-tax wages, even accounting for all cost of living increases, will have increased very significantly since late 2008, but, more important, the tax changes will help rebalance this economy away from excessive consumption and debt, and towards savings, exports, and sustainable jobs. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000167\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e0192ed9-5715-4f6c-bd52-8db4f3466087\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002201fb6cd217c641b48bc999b23b95b0bc\u0022\u003EHon David Cunliffe\u003C/span\u003E: Were his revised net income estimates assisted by forecast revisions to the inflation track, which itself reflects the faltering recovery, loss of confidence, reduced GDP growth, and high unemployment; and will he now concede that he has just proven to New Zealanders beyond all doubt that his Government lacks a plan for jobs and growth?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000168\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bb158206-360b-4757-8d72-f7d0994e1fb3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002262a5d0549f0c459db2ef5d6e7bab83af\u0022\u003EHon BILL ENGLISH\u003C/span\u003E: No. We do not follow Labour\u2019s \u201Cmuppet-nomics\u201D, as it has been called. The fact is that the member cannot have it both ways: he cannot claim that New Zealanders will be worse off because inflation is too high, and then turn round and say that the economy is failing because inflation is low. He needs to make up his mind which story he is telling.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000169\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e0192ed9-5715-4f6c-bd52-8db4f3466087\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00221212fcff0faf466faecf72e3522119c3\u0022\u003EHon David Cunliffe\u003C/span\u003E: I seek leave to table Statistics New Zealand figures indicating that the Minister has misled the House in his response\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000170\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ac169d29-4849-42c2-a4a7-f344fd416503\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00229828e89271564fb19cfe79b8d13cce96\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: The member cannot allege that. The member is seeking leave to table a document. He cannot allege, in doing that, that anyone has misled the House. He must simply identify the document that he is seeking leave to table.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000171\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e0192ed9-5715-4f6c-bd52-8db4f3466087\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022fb7826eb7f60458b9f3300efc2c013f7\u0022\u003EHon David Cunliffe\u003C/span\u003E: I seek to table Statistics New Zealand figures that show that for the last 5 years the current account deficit was not 8 percent on average\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000172\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ac169d29-4849-42c2-a4a7-f344fd416503\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022087e5b940c0646f3a5eea75c6689babf\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: I do not believe that that is a proper description of any Statistics New Zealand document. The document will either be a series relating to New Zealand\u2019s current account or it will be a document relating to a standard Statistics New Zealand release, and that is what the member should describe to the House, not his interpretation of what it shows. I am still none the wiser as to what the document is.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000173\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e0192ed9-5715-4f6c-bd52-8db4f3466087\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022cce68f00cc5e4764ad9295f8b58ff659\u0022\u003EHon David Cunliffe\u003C/span\u003E: I seek leave to table from Statistics New Zealand the balance of payments fifth edition ratios, quarterly for March, June, September, and December, for the current account balance from the 2005 second quarter to the 2010 second quarter, at minus 6.9 percent of GDP, which indicates\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000174\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ac169d29-4849-42c2-a4a7-f344fd416503\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002265a3fb0b315e42e7a4dfb61966c35ba9\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: I am very grateful. Leave is sought to table that document. Is there any objection?\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000175\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e0192ed9-5715-4f6c-bd52-8db4f3466087\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022242c8fb523f143dd8b4046215824b3fe\u0022\u003EHon David Cunliffe\u003C/span\u003E: \u2014not minus 8 percent as claimed by the Minister.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000176\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ac169d29-4849-42c2-a4a7-f344fd416503\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022da2f3af7f6eb4957a69400371e3718da\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: The member will resume his seat immediately. The member is trifling with the Chair. I accept that he gave a very accurate description of the document, and I am grateful for that, but the bit he added at the end is totally out of order. He cannot use leave to table a document to tell the House about the document. He must only identify the document. He did that\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000177\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e0192ed9-5715-4f6c-bd52-8db4f3466087\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00221ce2eae7354d497f8e2bc2eb3472c1ed\u0022\u003EHon David Cunliffe\u003C/span\u003E: I raise a point of order, Mr Speaker. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000178\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ac169d29-4849-42c2-a4a7-f344fd416503\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002298b2c5e94e204d2a817196575206341a\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: I am going to seek leave for the document to be tabled. Leave is sought for that document to be tabled. Is there any objection? There is objection.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000179\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e0192ed9-5715-4f6c-bd52-8db4f3466087\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022874c1437e81f46019c6c14fcd4804787\u0022\u003EHon David Cunliffe\u003C/span\u003E: I raise a point of order, Mr Speaker. I seek your guidance because that appears to have left us in a difficult position. The Minister has, quite clearly, either deliberately or accidentally, made an error\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000180\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ac169d29-4849-42c2-a4a7-f344fd416503\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022f5bdfe038c114d69bbb7069bd7f0859a\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: The member will sit down immediately. The Hon David Cunliffe is in grave danger because he is a senior member of the Opposition and he knows that he cannot litigate an answer by way of a point of order. He must not do that.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000181\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u00228cc084cb577a44e2894e675a74299083\u0022\u003ERugby World Cup\u2014Accessibility of Broadcasts for Deaf Community\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00220ee528dc-7870-4553-95ed-5ec0cab60f07\u0022 data-id=\u002265774e339a8b41b58b216ce84145f924\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000182\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220ee528dc-7870-4553-95ed-5ec0cab60f07\u0022\u003E9. \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002265774e339a8b41b58b216ce84145f924\u0022\u003ECATHERINE DELAHUNTY (Green)\u003C/span\u003E to the Minister of Broadcasting: Will he ensure accessibility to Rugby World Cup television broadcasts for the Deaf community by requiring captioning on all public channels; and will he remind all broadcasters of their obligations to provide reasonable access for the Deaf community under the United Nations Convention on the Rights of Persons with Disabilities?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022603ae58e-47c4-46f9-bfc8-8355a48988ad\u0022 data-id=\u00222b299a76178e4751867a9411054d6496\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000183\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022603ae58e-47c4-46f9-bfc8-8355a48988ad\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00222b299a76178e4751867a9411054d6496\u0022\u003EHon Dr JONATHAN COLEMAN (Minister of Broadcasting):\u003C/span\u003E Television New Zealand (TVNZ) is the only New Zealand broadcaster that has the ability to carry out the live captioning of matches. It is broadcasting seven Rugby World Cup games live, including the final, semi-finals, the bronze final, two quarter-finals, and the opening match, and all seven will feature live captioning.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000184\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220ee528dc-7870-4553-95ed-5ec0cab60f07\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022abe825d0135247ed8cc115eb1a7d513a\u0022\u003ECatherine Delahunty\u003C/span\u003E: Will he extend captioning beyond the Rugby World Cup, given that the United States of America has had captioning of all sports games on television since 1982?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000185\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022603ae58e-47c4-46f9-bfc8-8355a48988ad\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022d4cde0267178449eb03f733b7d44cfd4\u0022\u003EHon Dr JONATHAN COLEMAN\u003C/span\u003E: As I said, only TVNZ has the ability to do live captioning. The Government spends $1.9 million a year on captioning for the Deaf community, and in consultation with its members has decided how the money will be spent. So 240 hours a week of prime-time television is broadcast with captioning, and I think that is a pretty satisfactory result.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000186\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002218f9e3ea-81c5-4414-af48-d6bb843a9227\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022708c819274f34631981fefcddfd4e328\u0022\u003EMelissa Lee\u003C/span\u003E: What reports has he had of calls for greater expenditure on public services in addition to public broadcasting services?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000187\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022603ae58e-47c4-46f9-bfc8-8355a48988ad\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022ac31f1c77dff4aa09794316ada39fa19\u0022\u003EHon Dr JONATHAN COLEMAN\u003C/span\u003E: I have had reports of a party that wants there to be greater expenditure on a range of public services. Surprisingly, it is the same party that is deeply opposed to free trade, mineral surveys, Resource Management Act reforms, tax reforms, and road building\u2014in fact, just about anything\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000188\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ac169d29-4849-42c2-a4a7-f344fd416503\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00226d41e513d4c74a84a6d271488c63859d\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: I look at the primary question, and I struggle to see how the Minister is telling the House about anything to do with the primary question. The primary question was around accessibility to Rugby World Cup broadcasts for the Deaf community. The member who asked the supplementary question tried to extend that to a question about parties calling for more public expenditure. I accept that the Minister, in his answer, mentioned what the Government spends via TVNZ on captioning, but I do not believe that that is a sufficient reason\u2014I am happy for the member to ask specifically about that issue, but to extend that to a wider question around what other parties might be calling for in terms of wider expenditure simply stretches the Standing Orders too far. I invite Melissa Lee to reword her question.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000189\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002218f9e3ea-81c5-4414-af48-d6bb843a9227\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022fddbad87caab408c95a30b7b5ff1bcbd\u0022\u003EMelissa Lee\u003C/span\u003E: What reports has he had of calls for greater expenditure on public services in addition to public broadcasting services like captioning?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000190\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ac169d29-4849-42c2-a4a7-f344fd416503\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022071113e574ad42229fee39f44b235894\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: I cannot see how the Minister of Broadcasting has any responsibility\u2014well, let me not presume. The Minister of Broadcasting is welcome to answer that question in terms of the portfolios for which he is responsible.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000191\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022603ae58e-47c4-46f9-bfc8-8355a48988ad\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00226212d900c1c646a4b5693deeaca82cff\u0022\u003EHon Dr JONATHAN COLEMAN\u003C/span\u003E: The point is that that member is calling for there to be more expenditure on public broadcasting, but there is absolutely no plan to pay for it, and that seems to be a consistent theme. That is the answer.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000192\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220ee528dc-7870-4553-95ed-5ec0cab60f07\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022e9aa34c46d294325b37def775bd47e76\u0022\u003ECatherine Delahunty\u003C/span\u003E: I raise a point of order, Mr Speaker. At no point in my question did I call for public expenditure.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000193\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ac169d29-4849-42c2-a4a7-f344fd416503\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00220c1c849192344b3f88d79ee0f24e0b94\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: I believe that the matter has been dealt with. The question was asked, and the Minister answered it. That is the end of that matter.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000194\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u00222bd6e1abea50487ca3603aa00df28aaf\u0022\u003EOverseas Investment\u2014Sale of Crafar Farms\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022f5d71749-ae91-4af7-b2bd-77260398912a\u0022 data-id=\u002262c7a5d9a070442d93d3b6d9cf8d12b5\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000195\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f5d71749-ae91-4af7-b2bd-77260398912a\u0022\u003E10. \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002262c7a5d9a070442d93d3b6d9cf8d12b5\u0022\u003EHon DAVID PARKER (Labour)\u003C/span\u003E to the Minister for Land Information: When does he expect to announce the decision on the sale of the Crafar farms?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00224a11ce4e-9fb3-4738-b0be-5a9f81d975da\u0022 data-id=\u00226836b8eca5d441cea2f10314c4bbab73\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000196\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00224a11ce4e-9fb3-4738-b0be-5a9f81d975da\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00226836b8eca5d441cea2f10314c4bbab73\u0022\u003EHon MAURICE WILLIAMSON (Minister for Land Information):\u003C/span\u003E The Overseas Investment Office is continuing to assess the application by Natural Dairy (NZ) Holdings Ltd to purchase the Crafar farm interests against the requirements of the Overseas Investment Act 2005. I have been advised that the Overseas Investment Office has written to Natural Dairy seeking further information and has yet to receive its response. When the assessment made by the Overseas Investment Office has been completed it will provide a recommendation to the decision-making Ministers. To date no recommendation has been made. I have further been advised that the application is extremely complex, and that the Overseas Investment Office cannot be specific as to when Ministers can expect its recommendation.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000197\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f5d71749-ae91-4af7-b2bd-77260398912a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022ebae79de65664954bbd2dc19b4ea2516\u0022\u003EHon David Parker\u003C/span\u003E: Without commenting about the specifics of the Crafar farm application\u2014I understand that would be difficult for the Minister\u2014does he think New Zealand farm owners should be able to sell their farms to the highest bidder irrespective of whether that bidder is from New Zealand or overseas?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000198\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00224a11ce4e-9fb3-4738-b0be-5a9f81d975da\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022241c3688e0614ed1a6100fb17ac03161\u0022\u003EHon MAURICE WILLIAMSON\u003C/span\u003E: That is a very difficult question to answer, because every case has to be treated on its merits. That is why we have an Overseas Investment Office, why every one of the applications is processed, and why, finally, Ministers make a decision based on those merits.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000199\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f5d71749-ae91-4af7-b2bd-77260398912a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00224870690a8bfd4331a26f40258e312825\u0022\u003EHon David Parker\u003C/span\u003E: Does the Minister believe that opposition by New Zealanders to overseas ownership of farmland is substantially caused by prejudice about the ethnicity of buyers, or has the Prime Minister changed the Minister\u2019s mind?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000200\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002241146229-4d11-415b-a4ac-f4e2b923e95d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002260170a92e2864689accc0fc6bdca54c2\u0022\u003EHon Christopher Finlayson\u003C/span\u003E: I raise a point of order, Mr Speaker. The primary question is very narrow. It relates to a decision on the sale of Crafar farms, and now we are venturing far and wide into general policy issues about overseas investment.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000201\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f5d71749-ae91-4af7-b2bd-77260398912a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00223f36164e8e1b45b59929f6edbf207ff0\u0022\u003EHon David Parker\u003C/span\u003E: It has been a matter of public record that the Minister has said he thinks opposition to purchases by Chinese interests is caused by their ethnicity.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000202\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ac169d29-4849-42c2-a4a7-f344fd416503\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022aeff50842b8f4cbbb281178071b605ba\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: That of itself would not necessarily bring the question within order, but in answering the primary question the Minister emphasised that these matters need to be treated on their merits, and then there was a supplementary question, and I believe that the Minister expanded things somewhat in his answer. That is why I believe that the question is not unreasonable, given the answers that have been given. So I invite the Hon David Parker to repeat his question but be mindful to try to keep it within the scope of the primary question.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000203\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f5d71749-ae91-4af7-b2bd-77260398912a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00223f0ed20eb9734ce098f6e71939d9ba8c\u0022\u003EHon David Parker\u003C/span\u003E: I will repeat it word for word: does he believe that opposition by New Zealanders to overseas ownership of farmland is substantially caused by prejudice about the ethnicity of buyers, or has the Prime Minister changed the Minister\u2019s mind?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000204\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00224a11ce4e-9fb3-4738-b0be-5a9f81d975da\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022e7792a81c65f409e9f2c6addac118555\u0022\u003EHon MAURICE WILLIAMSON\u003C/span\u003E: No.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000205\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f5d71749-ae91-4af7-b2bd-77260398912a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00222ddc3ecf41ab4c41af7873933c2b282f\u0022\u003EHon David Parker\u003C/span\u003E: Again without commenting on the specifics of the Crafar farms application, what outcomes for New Zealand other than economic matters does he think are relevant to decisions to allow or reject applications for foreign investment in New Zealand land?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000206\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00224a11ce4e-9fb3-4738-b0be-5a9f81d975da\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00229006ff27e5a84fa7a8cee051182a20f0\u0022\u003EHon MAURICE WILLIAMSON\u003C/span\u003E: The criteria are very clearly set out in the Overseas Investment Act 2005. The Overseas Investment Office lays out its advice based on each one of those, I think, 17 criteria, and then the final recommendation is made to Ministers. That is how it has always been done, even when Labour was in power and sold off very large tracts of our farmland to overseas investors.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000207\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f5d71749-ae91-4af7-b2bd-77260398912a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00224c0d5db75c62438b820efc69b445a41e\u0022\u003EHon David Parker\u003C/span\u003E: Does the Minister accept that in the changing world economic environment stricter controls on the sale of rural farmland to overseas buyers are appropriate?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000208\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00224a11ce4e-9fb3-4738-b0be-5a9f81d975da\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022ed93c653e39f4526919eb5b96c5f8ba6\u0022\u003EHon MAURICE WILLIAMSON\u003C/span\u003E: What I do accept is that any Minister making these decisions has to be mindful of what the Act says and work within that Act. That is why, as one of the two Ministers making decisions on a number of these applications as they come through, I am very mindful to stay within the law.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000209\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f5d71749-ae91-4af7-b2bd-77260398912a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00224f72896fe7784516963009f2f7c42493\u0022\u003EHon David Parker\u003C/span\u003E: I raise a point of order, Mr Speaker. My question was not about what the law is. I asked for the opinion of the Minister as to what the law should be. That question has not been addressed.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000210\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ac169d29-4849-42c2-a4a7-f344fd416503\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002296d7495732824a928ef414ffca52fa85\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: An opinion was sought, and the Minister gave his opinion. I think his opinion is that the law should be upheld, and that is a perfectly fair answer when an opinion is sought.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000211\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u00224965065be7f741119e5b79d136764100\u0022\u003EPublic Transport, Auckland\u2014Commuter Rail Network\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002219bcf2ff-a193-4361-9072-813a4e36683c\u0022 data-id=\u00228deddeb0940a417e950ed10e7c96ccb5\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000212\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002219bcf2ff-a193-4361-9072-813a4e36683c\u0022\u003E11. \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00228deddeb0940a417e950ed10e7c96ccb5\u0022\u003EPESETA SAM LOTU-IIGA (National\u2014Maungakiekie)\u003C/span\u003E to the Minister of Transport: What progress has been made on developing the commuter rail network in Auckland?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00224a244152-977c-48d2-bf53-4f3a369a27a9\u0022 data-id=\u00220f323870802b46fea522f6ebc835a3a4\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000213\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00224a244152-977c-48d2-bf53-4f3a369a27a9\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00220f323870802b46fea522f6ebc835a3a4\u0022\u003EHon STEVEN JOYCE (Minister of Transport):\u003C/span\u003E Another milestone was passed on Saturday when I and my good friend Mike Lee opened the Onehunga branch line, which includes the three new stations of Penrose, Te P\u0101papa and Onehunga. This $13.6 million investment will provide 49 weekday services between Onehunga and Britomart, offering an easy 25-minute trip. Modern and efficient transport corridors across all modes are vital to ensuring that as Auckland grows, its productivity and its economy grow even faster.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000214\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002219bcf2ff-a193-4361-9072-813a4e36683c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022f3fda123cb03474687649cdda1af1ef6\u0022\u003EPeseta Sam Lotu-Iiga\u003C/span\u003E: How does the investment in Onehunga fit into the wider commuter network investment?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000215\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00224a244152-977c-48d2-bf53-4f3a369a27a9\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00221bdb4e197065494382aacc59fd0c0a7b\u0022\u003EHon STEVEN JOYCE\u003C/span\u003E: Thirty-seven years after commuter services to Onehunga ceased, it is once again open for business, thanks to the Government\u2019s overall $1.6 billion investment to upgrade and electrify Auckland\u2019s urban rail network. I thank the finance Minister. However, I must caution that there remains further work to ensure this new network is financially sustainable in terms of fair revenue and subsidies from ratepayers and the New Zealand Transport Agency. This is very important before new projects to further extend the network could be sensibly considered.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000216\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c437bda8-4741-4ac5-89ab-b0818e1ab9fa\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00228376943be7104a7187c582fc95f31df7\u0022\u003EHon Darren Hughes\u003C/span\u003E: Given that he boasted with great conviction in a recent speech that \u201Cthere has been plenty of progress in this area. Over the past 18 months I have attended many project sod turnings, and station and line openings and I look forward to attending a few more as projects near completion.\u201D, how many of those projects were approved and had funding started on his watch, and if the answer is none, does he not think it is time to give just a little bit of credit to the previous Labour Government, which got these projects going?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000217\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00224a244152-977c-48d2-bf53-4f3a369a27a9\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002281ffce851d5247d0a012414e17ef006d\u0022\u003EHon STEVEN JOYCE\u003C/span\u003E: I think it is fair to say that transport projects are proceeding much faster under the current Government. I fully expect the trains over time to arrive on time, the cars to depart on time, and other such positive improvements. I can confirm, for example, that the electrification of the Auckland railway network has been voted by the current Government, and that is heading on towards a $1 billion investment.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000218\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u00223d2bd1efb2cf4fffa65a5ef89199b73f\u0022\u003EEmployment Relations Amendment Bill (No 2)\u2014Minister\u2019s Statements\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022a40f5af7-f9b0-4b44-9669-9e63be1c3ced\u0022 data-id=\u0022663b519af7d948f99d87d73bac567960\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000219\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a40f5af7-f9b0-4b44-9669-9e63be1c3ced\u0022\u003E12. \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022663b519af7d948f99d87d73bac567960\u0022\u003EDARIEN FENTON (Labour)\u003C/span\u003E to the Minister of Labour: Does she stand by all statements that she has made and that have been made on her behalf in relation to the Employment Relations Amendment Bill (No 2)?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00224a244152-977c-48d2-bf53-4f3a369a27a9\u0022 data-id=\u0022e636a75ff9f5400fa256df3eecb60ebe\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000220\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00224a244152-977c-48d2-bf53-4f3a369a27a9\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022e636a75ff9f5400fa256df3eecb60ebe\u0022\u003EHon STEVEN JOYCE (Minister of Transport)\u003C/span\u003E on behalf of the Minister of Labour: Yes.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000221\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a40f5af7-f9b0-4b44-9669-9e63be1c3ced\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022604858aca1d54eb6a0d295f8b0da7c32\u0022\u003EDarien Fenton\u003C/span\u003E: Does she stand by the statement made on her behalf in relation to the 90-day scheme on 16 September 2010 that \u201CThe Government has always said that the good-faith requirements to be communicative and responsive with employees \u2026 imply and include telling employees why a trial period has not worked out.\u201D?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000222\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00224a244152-977c-48d2-bf53-4f3a369a27a9\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00229cdac86dc9ce45bcb141d1a17b05b941\u0022\u003EHon STEVEN JOYCE\u003C/span\u003E: Yes.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000223\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a40f5af7-f9b0-4b44-9669-9e63be1c3ced\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022ed0d68b2549d41799fcbdd802ea781c7\u0022\u003EDarien Fenton\u003C/span\u003E: What sanctions apply to an employer who refuses to give a reason for dismissal under the 90-day scheme, and what remedies does an employee have available under her proposed law?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000224\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00224a244152-977c-48d2-bf53-4f3a369a27a9\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00220ccecc7fa4394b5187e3b1d025331748\u0022\u003EHon STEVEN JOYCE\u003C/span\u003E: The Government made sure there were adequate protections in the bill in a number of areas in terms of the trial period.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000225\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022383e3079a1184739830e96dfa187a9b3\u0022\u003EHon Members\u003C/span\u003E: Name them.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000226\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00224a244152-977c-48d2-bf53-4f3a369a27a9\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022ef9a3a9a09e6404abb31f13eee12653d\u0022\u003EHon STEVEN JOYCE\u003C/span\u003E: Requiring any trial period to be entered by written agreement; allowing the trial period only for new employees; retaining good faith, which is the aspect the member refers to; protecting employees against discrimination; and ensuring employees on a trial period are treated the same as all other employees regarding leave, wages, and other entitlements.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000227\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a40f5af7-f9b0-4b44-9669-9e63be1c3ced\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022aacbbf5b138f4487a24969a03b2a91b3\u0022\u003EDarien Fenton\u003C/span\u003E: What remedies are available to an employee who is dismissed under the 90-day scheme and given no reason, given that section 113 of the Employment Relations Act says: \u201CIf an employee who has been dismissed wishes to challenge that dismissal or any aspect of it, for any reason, in any court, that challenge may be brought only in the Authority under this Part as a personal grievance.\u201D, yet section 67B says that a person dismissed under the 90-day scheme \u201Cmay not bring a personal grievance or legal proceedings in respect of the dismissal.\u201D?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000228\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00224a244152-977c-48d2-bf53-4f3a369a27a9\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002212c155182bd244718bce5a86efb03fe0\u0022\u003EHon STEVEN JOYCE\u003C/span\u003E: I have to say that my detailed knowledge does not quite extend to all of the matters raised in that supplementary question by the member. In fact, I could not possibly remember them all. If the member would like to put her question in writing, I am sure that the Minister of Labour will answer it for her.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n    \u003C/div\u003E\n    \u003Cdiv class=\u0022HpsHansard\u0022\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000229\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsProceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u0022510b3c63d6cf482da3043846fc93fe76\u0022\u003EGeneral Debate\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000231\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u0022de42cc654fd34172a07a7bd4fe4aa794\u0022\u003EGeneral Debate\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022c699e7c6-53b9-470c-a14a-378cb6fc8a04\u0022 data-id=\u0022f16a0561492943d18ed74e92ec3759f4\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000230\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c699e7c6-53b9-470c-a14a-378cb6fc8a04\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022f16a0561492943d18ed74e92ec3759f4\u0022\u003EHon PHIL GOFF (Leader of the Opposition):\u003C/span\u003E I move, That the House take note of miscellaneous business. The Prime Minister absolutely stunned this House and the country this afternoon by defending Rodney Hide\u2019s cover-up of the theft of a dead child\u2019s identity as being ethical. Then he stunned the country again by condemning his predecessor\u2019s action in signing the back of a painting that was a donation for a fund-raising effort at a kindergarten. The actions of Mr Garrett, Mr Hide, and Mr Key in the cover-up of the theft of that dead child\u2019s identity caused immense distress to the mother and to the siblings of that child. The actions of Helen Clark were an altruistic step towards helping children, but Mr Key was prepared to condemn Helen Clark\u2019s action, which caused no harm\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000232\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f9c512a8-d532-4ef9-ad51-0fe8d752a893\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022cac1b0058dec400b9e3c121a83ac6f3a\u0022\u003EHon Clayton Cosgrove\u003C/span\u003E: I raise a point of order, Mr Speaker. I am sorry to interrupt my colleague, but could you do something about Melissa Lee and other members screaming as they left the Chamber. They were not even interjecting from their seats, but screaming like banshees, as they left. I do not think that is appropriate.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000233\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ac169d29-4849-42c2-a4a7-f344fd416503\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00220f4d92866d804aca94144f023c1098be\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: The member should not say that members were screaming like banshees. But if any member is interjecting while leaving the Chamber and it comes to my notice, I will be hauling them back very promptly. I apologise to the member that I missed that. I say to members still in the House that the level of noise is just unreasonable. There is nothing wrong with some interjections, but when the level of noise gets as high as that it is just impossible to hear the speaker. The general debate is held so that we can hear what members have to say about issues of public importance.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000234\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c699e7c6-53b9-470c-a14a-378cb6fc8a04\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022b15d9dde45684d30b53368b58f636c0c\u0022\u003EHon PHIL GOFF\u003C/span\u003E: There will be no sympathy amongst ordinary Kiwis for a Prime Minister prepared to defend the cover-up of an appalling crime, but then ready to condemn his predecessor, a decent person who committed no crime, did no harm, and acted with good intent. That is double standards, and it brings no credit on this Prime Minister. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000235\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c699e7c6-53b9-470c-a14a-378cb6fc8a04\u0022\u003EMr Key must be the only person in this country still prepared to defend the actions of Rodney Hide in the cover-up of that passport fraud and the stealing of a dead baby\u2019s identity. One thing that New Zealanders hate, more than anything else, is hypocrisy. That is what we saw in the ACT Party\u2019s actions\u2014the party that was against name suppression but was prepared to have it apply to the criminal offending of its own law and order spokesperson, the party that opposed clean-slating minor convictions but wanted to clean-slate the actions of its law and order spokesperson without any formal judicial process, and the party that apparently defended the rights of victims but effectively was happy to see the gagging of the family of that child, who had to watch the hypocrisy of people who said one thing but did something totally different. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000236\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c699e7c6-53b9-470c-a14a-378cb6fc8a04\u0022\u003EThis ACT Party is the party that brooked no excuses for the criminal actions of offenders in this country, but were more than happy to find plenty of excuses for Mr Garrett. What this issue is about is that Mr Hide knew about those actions, and he knew about the hypocrisy of saying one thing and doing another. But he was happy for that to happen, provided the public did not know about it.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000237\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c699e7c6-53b9-470c-a14a-378cb6fc8a04\u0022\u003EI say that under the Cabinet Manual Mr Key has an obligation to hold his Ministers to account if they do not show the highest ethical standards. Mr Hide\u2019s actions were anything but ethical. Not only has Mr Key not held Mr Hide to account but also he has protected him. He has kept him on as a Minister notwithstanding the double standards on perks, notwithstanding the allegations by a former Minister about Mr Hide being a menacing bully, and notwithstanding the despicable cover-up of Mr Garrett\u2019s actions. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000238\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c699e7c6-53b9-470c-a14a-378cb6fc8a04\u0022\u003EMr Key demeans his position as Prime Minister. He has put politics ahead of the public interest. He keeps Mr Hide on, despite breaches by Mr Hide of ethical standards, for one reason and one reason alone. He wants the five votes of the ACT members. He tries to make MMP the issue, but the issue is a lack of ethical standards by Mr Hide and a lack of leadership by Mr Key. Mr Key should have stripped ACT of its ministerial positions. National is tarnished by a party that the public sees as scandal-ridden and unworthy. It is time that Mr Key stopped his defence of that unacceptable behaviour.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022e2e2ee61-b3b9-4a89-bcc3-5b7be76c5825\u0022 data-id=\u0022dd58f66cd9094d898933286f86227f3c\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000239\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e2e2ee61-b3b9-4a89-bcc3-5b7be76c5825\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022dd58f66cd9094d898933286f86227f3c\u0022\u003ERAHUI KATENE (M\u0101ori Party\u2014Te Tai Tonga):\u003C/span\u003E T\u0113n\u0101 koe, e te Mana K\u014Drero; t\u0113n\u0101 koe e te Whare miere. Tuatahi, he mihi aroha, he mihi mamae ki a Jim Nicholls r\u0101ua ko Sir Archie Taiaroa. Moe mai k\u014Drua i te Atua. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000240\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e2e2ee61-b3b9-4a89-bcc3-5b7be76c5825\u0022\u003E[Greetings to you, Mr Speaker, and the House. But firstly, a loving and painful greeting to Jim Nicholls and Sir Archie Taiaroa. Rest there in the presence of God, you two.] \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000241\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e2e2ee61-b3b9-4a89-bcc3-5b7be76c5825\u0022\u003EIt seems appropriate today as we mourn the loss of these two great men, and in particular the loss of Sir Archie Taiaroa, to acknowledge the distinctive legacy of Sir Archie Taiaroa in some of the fundamental issues impacting on tangata whenua. At midday the Land and Water Forum presented its report. It demonstrated that water is regarded as a taonga of paramount importance. Throughout the report we are acutely aware of the obligation of iwi to be responsible for the well-being of the landscape, including our water and waterways. We think of the pivotal role that Sir Archie has played in the Whanganui River claim, upholding the mana of Te Awa Tupua as an essential expression of the people. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000242\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e2e2ee61-b3b9-4a89-bcc3-5b7be76c5825\u0022\u003ESir Archie was a leading figure in M\u0101oridom, a statesman in this nation, and an influential ambassador for tangata whenua both at home and across the world. We honour him today and we pay tribute to the guidance and leadership he gave to this Parliament and this Government, particularly through the relationship with the Iwi Leadership Group. It is absolutely right that we pay homage to him as we turn to the Marine and Coastal Area (Takutai Moana) Bill. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000243\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e2e2ee61-b3b9-4a89-bcc3-5b7be76c5825\u0022\u003EI place on record the utter appreciation and admiration of the M\u0101ori Party for the leadership expressed by the wh\u0101nau, hap\u016B, and iwi in the development process leading up to this bill. On the front page of the bill there is a statement: \u201CThe Bill recognises the mana tuku iho of iwi and hap\u016B, as tangata whenua, over the foreshore and seabed of New Zealand,\u201D. It states further that the bill \u201Ccontributes to the continuing exercise of that mana by giving legal recognition, protection, and expression to the customary interests of M\u0101ori in the area.\u201D These are critical words, and they represent the advice and the strategic wisdom of our finest iwi leadership. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000244\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e2e2ee61-b3b9-4a89-bcc3-5b7be76c5825\u0022\u003EThe M\u0101ori Party went into the process of seeking the repeal of the 2004 Foreshore and Seabed Act with a clear intent in mind, and that was to ensure that the door was open to enable hap\u016B and iwi to be at the table with the Crown. Our focus was first and foremost to legally restore the rights that the 2004 Act extinguished, as if the Act had never been passed. We did that, but in the process we have been able to achieve so much more than we ever anticipated. We see the critical role that tikanga plays in any application that can be made before the court. Clause 97 of the Marine and Coastal Area (Takutai Moana) Bill will allow the High Court to refer questions of tikanga to the M\u0101ori Appellate Court, or to obtain the opinion of a court expert on the question. This is a distinctively indigenous solution. Another significant feature of the bill is the introduction of the shared burden of proof. The Court of Appeal in the Ng\u0101ti Apa case challenged Parliament to recognise that the onus of proving extinguishment lies on the Crown, and the purpose must be clear and plain. In this bill, specifically clause 105, the Crown\u2019s responsibility is made explicit\u2014another distinguishing feature of the bill. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000245\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e2e2ee61-b3b9-4a89-bcc3-5b7be76c5825\u0022\u003EI want to make some remarks about the role of the M\u0101ori Party in getting this bill up. We are quite clear that the M\u0101ori Party does not own the takutai moana. It is not for us to settle this issue. The ultimate goal of M\u0101ori is to have mana and tikanga in the takutai moana duly recognised in the law. Putting it another way, recognition of customary rights is a matter between the Treaty partners\u2014that is, tangata whenua and the Crown. This bill creates a pathway for negotiations. It does not resolve the issue of customary rights, but it opens the door that was slammed shut in 2004. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000246\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e2e2ee61-b3b9-4a89-bcc3-5b7be76c5825\u0022\u003EThroughout this process we have been privileged to learn from the leadership of iwi for the benefit of all New Zealanders. It was iwi leadership that advocated for non-nationalised minerals to be removed from Crown ownership, and it was our wh\u0101nau, hap\u016B, and iwi that insisted that mana be recognised as enduring, inalienable, and including the right to development. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000247\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e2e2ee61-b3b9-4a89-bcc3-5b7be76c5825\u0022\u003EThe bill achieves two key things. It repeals Crown ownership of takutai moana and it gives iwi the right to make claims for custom to court. It simply restores the rights of tangata whenua to argue their case. That is the challenge before us now: to ensure that the M\u0101ori Affairs Committee is the place in which all the k\u014Drero is had and where the negotiating points are debated. We urge all New Zealanders to contribute to this debate, and in doing so to truly give value to the intrinsic value of the marine and coastal area for every person in this land.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022bb158206-360b-4757-8d72-f7d0994e1fb3\u0022 data-id=\u0022f363c4e820fd40138a5f4434e5f81d23\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000248\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bb158206-360b-4757-8d72-f7d0994e1fb3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022f363c4e820fd40138a5f4434e5f81d23\u0022\u003EHon BILL ENGLISH (Minister of Finance):\u003C/span\u003E At the end of next week we will see the implementation of one of the more significant tax reform packages in New Zealand for quite some time. It is an important measure in assisting the rebalancing of the New Zealand economy. The changes on 1 October will reward effort. They will reward work, savings, and investment, and they will help Kiwi families get ahead. Just as importantly, the package as a whole will help to deal with the consequences of the appalling mismanagement of this economy through the term of the previous Labour Government. This tax package will openly favour savings, investment, and exports. It is designed to increase the disincentives to consume too much, to borrow too much, particularly for property speculation, and to exacerbate the imbalances that built up in this economy over the first decade of this century. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000249\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bb158206-360b-4757-8d72-f7d0994e1fb3\u0022\u003EI think a number of New Zealanders will be very familiar with the idea that GST will rise from 12.5 to 15 percent\u2014not from 0 percent to 15 percent, as the Labour Party is putting in its pamphlets. When it comes to misleading numbers and implications, there is not much that could be more misleading than that. But New Zealanders are probably not quite expecting the reduction in income taxes, and it will take a couple of pay\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000250\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f9c512a8-d532-4ef9-ad51-0fe8d752a893\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002238f482be15c34374aa24b74f4e69d2d7\u0022\u003EHon Clayton Cosgrove\u003C/span\u003E: You\u2019re a fool.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000251\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bb158206-360b-4757-8d72-f7d0994e1fb3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00224e54bedcfa454be688293dcfdf74841e\u0022\u003EHon BILL ENGLISH\u003C/span\u003E: Oh! The member for Waimakariri is really struggling.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000252\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f9c512a8-d532-4ef9-ad51-0fe8d752a893\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022ef0e93cc262e4eb19e02317b6fc2213c\u0022\u003EHon Clayton Cosgrove\u003C/span\u003E: I raise a point of order, Mr Speaker. I raise it in goodwill. I was certainly not calling Mr English a fool; I was calling Mr Quinn a fool.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000253\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ac169d29-4849-42c2-a4a7-f344fd416503\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022954a7284bf454ea1b5309bdfe4dbbad9\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Members should not do that to interrupt us. We will not have this ongoing interjection. Members should not interrupt speeches for trivial reasons, so I apologise to the Hon Bill English.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000254\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bb158206-360b-4757-8d72-f7d0994e1fb3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022f762e550025445c8a4bb66168b26eaca\u0022\u003EHon BILL ENGLISH\u003C/span\u003E: That intervention just shows why the member for Waimakariri is doing so well in the Labour Party. That is his most insightful and thoughtful contribution in this term of office. He is lost without Mike Moore, as he has been for about 15 years. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000255\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bb158206-360b-4757-8d72-f7d0994e1fb3\u0022\u003EI am sure people will believe the income tax cuts when they actually see them, but here is just one figure: after 1 October, 72 percent of New Zealand earners will have a top statutory tax rate of 17.5c. The lower 72 percent of New Zealand earners, the lowest earners, will have a top statutory tax rate of 17.5c because we believe that incentives matter across the board. One of the features of this package is that when we take account of the range of tax increases that are occurring\u2014because this is a roughly neutral package; tax cuts are offset by other tax increases\u2014we see that the impact of those tax changes is broadly even across the income groups. The Government took the unprecedented step in the Budget of producing a number of measures on the equity impact of the tax cuts. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000256\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221fb8d8db-3e96-49c7-ab1c-b7916a50e30e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022e496c1ae719f4ea683bfb32d99309b8b\u0022\u003EHon Steve Chadwick\u003C/span\u003E: Deceiving the community.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000257\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bb158206-360b-4757-8d72-f7d0994e1fb3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022c8c97e570b5449699f3f3cebdc01d3fd\u0022\u003EHon BILL ENGLISH\u003C/span\u003E: It does not do that. New Zealanders can, like the Opposition, go to www.taxguide.govt.nz, put in the figures that reflect their own circumstances, and calculate just how well they come out ahead from the tax changes\u2014or otherwise. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000258\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bb158206-360b-4757-8d72-f7d0994e1fb3\u0022\u003EThere has been a bit of discussion about inflation. As I pointed out in question time, the Reserve Bank forecast for inflation actually showed that the forecast for inflation is now lower than it was a number of months ago. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000259\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e0192ed9-5715-4f6c-bd52-8db4f3466087\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002292418380be4543f68525ad1edc12674d\u0022\u003EHon David Cunliffe\u003C/span\u003E: That\u2019s because there\u2019s no recovery.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000260\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bb158206-360b-4757-8d72-f7d0994e1fb3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00222d8837298f1941c98b54ab357ac078ee\u0022\u003EHon BILL ENGLISH\u003C/span\u003E: The Opposition cannot have it both ways. Those members either have to argue there is high inflation in a growing economy, or, if the economy is failing, they have to accept that there will be lower inflation because of a slower-growing economy. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000261\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bb158206-360b-4757-8d72-f7d0994e1fb3\u0022\u003EThe fact is that even with the GST rise, the one-off inflation rate will get to a bit over 5 percent. That is about the same rate as it was when Labour left office, with no GST increase and no one-off price increase. Of course, New Zealanders are wearing the consequences of a number of Labour\u2019s decisions. For instance, the increase in accident compensation levies is directly attributable to the reckless, incompetent management of the taxpayers\u2019 single largest asset. It is taking us 2 or 3 years to clean up that mess. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022f9c512a8-d532-4ef9-ad51-0fe8d752a893\u0022 data-id=\u0022931bb940f8814f9dba423f97f0c91988\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000262\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f9c512a8-d532-4ef9-ad51-0fe8d752a893\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022931bb940f8814f9dba423f97f0c91988\u0022\u003EHon CLAYTON COSGROVE (Labour\u2014Waimakariri):\u003C/span\u003E There is a M\u0101ori proverb that says \u201CTo utter the name is to invoke the presence\u201D or, to put it another way, \u201CTo steal the name is to steal something precious from a family\u201D. My heart goes out to the family who suffered the crime of identity theft\u2014members opposite may not like it, of course; they treat it with disrespect\u2014perpetrated by a representative in this House, covered up by a Minister of the Crown, and protected by the highest office holder holding a seat in this Chamber as of today, the Prime Minister. The perpetrator was protected by him. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000263\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f9c512a8-d532-4ef9-ad51-0fe8d752a893\u0022\u003EAs the Prime Minister wrapped his arms around Mr Rodney Philip Hide, did anybody believe Mr Hide\u2019s story that he did not know the detail of Mr Garrett\u2019s crime\u2014that he did not know the detail that Mr Garrett stole a dead baby\u2019s identity, and that he did not know there was a permanent suppression order? The argument that he did not know is false, and the falsehood lies in the fact that Mr Hide covered it up. The only reason Mr Hide covered it up is that there was a permanent suppression order in place. If there had not been a permanent suppression order in place, Mr Hide would have said to Mr Garrett that he would not be a member of Parliament in ACT\u2014well, he might have.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000264\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002267431f57-e958-4c83-b438-7da8061d479e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00222cceb25403a84f778fe72c1d22216f20\u0022\u003EPaul Quinn\u003C/span\u003E: Aided and abetted.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000265\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f9c512a8-d532-4ef9-ad51-0fe8d752a893\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00224aa45eda4cae497795b5f84bfa31fb9a\u0022\u003EHon CLAYTON COSGROVE\u003C/span\u003E: But I suspect that Garth McVicar stands charged as a hypocrite today because, to use Mr Quinn\u2019s term, he aided and abetted a man to get off a conviction with a reference. He aided and abetted a man to get permanent name suppression. As Phil Goff said, I wonder whether Garth McVicar and David Garrett were complicit in all this with Rodney Hide\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000266\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002267431f57-e958-4c83-b438-7da8061d479e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00220f8e30e7f77045d284a8155336fe3f6b\u0022\u003EPaul Quinn\u003C/span\u003E: I raise a point of order, Mr Speaker. I am a bit confused. I understand the speaker is accusing me of aiding and abetting\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000267\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ac169d29-4849-42c2-a4a7-f344fd416503\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00225e1416acea9e450c9123797fc20c7fde\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: The member knows that that is not a point of order. If the member is concerned about something the member in debate is speaking about, he can take the next call. National has further calls. I apologise to the Hon Clayton Cosgrove.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000268\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f9c512a8-d532-4ef9-ad51-0fe8d752a893\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00225c3b2b45ef5f48e397fc5796d23bcd50\u0022\u003EHon CLAYTON COSGROVE\u003C/span\u003E: They were aided and abetted by Rodney Hide. Did any of those gentlemen\u2014hear no evil, speak no evil, see no evil; Hide, Garrett, and McVicar\u2014ever consider that in putting in place, assisting, and standing up for permanent name suppression, which they all railed against in public, they had gagged a 93-year-old woman and her family from ever speaking out on this crime? Did they consider that they had tortured that family day after day, year after year, as that 93-year-old woman had to watch Mr Hide, Mr McVicar, and Mr Garrett gallop around the country calling for zero tolerance? They railed against suppression orders. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000269\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f9c512a8-d532-4ef9-ad51-0fe8d752a893\u0022\u003EWhat Mr McVicar said is very interesting, because he stands charged with utter hypocrisy. He said, on 13 January 2007: \u201CWe are here for the victims, a voice for them,\u201D. I ask Mr McVicar whether he has rung up the 93-year-old woman and asked her to join the \u201Csensible sentencing club\u201D\u2014which, to quote him, no one wants to be a member of\u2014given that she is a victim at his hands and his best mate\u2019s hands of a crime that was covered up by Mr Hide and protected by the Prime Minister. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000270\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f9c512a8-d532-4ef9-ad51-0fe8d752a893\u0022\u003EMr McVicar said the public was sick of watching as well-known defendants appear to use their position to get lighter sentences. He also said, on 15 December 2007: \u201CIf a role model goes off the tracks, the court should be sending a deterrent message.\u201D I wonder what Mr McVicar says today, and what the Sensible Sentencing Trust thinks of him. He never revealed the fact that he gave a character reference to get Mr Garrett off a conviction, and that he provided an excuse and character reference for permanent name suppression. I wonder what he says to the Sensible Sentencing Trust. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000271\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f9c512a8-d532-4ef9-ad51-0fe8d752a893\u0022\u003EHe sent me an email on the night the \u201Cthree strikes\u201D legislation was passed, reminding me that he stands up for victims. Well, he stands accused of hypocrisy, and I invite him to go and meet those victims. I invite him to reconvene the victims\u2019 conference he had in this Parliament, and explain himself to those who were there, because he is still wrapping his arms around Mr Garrett. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000272\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f9c512a8-d532-4ef9-ad51-0fe8d752a893\u0022\u003EI look at Mr Hide\u2019s statements and I see a man whose truthfulness and factual statements are all over the place. On 15 September he told One News that obtaining the fake ID was a prank. Later, on Close Up, he was asked whether he had said it was a prank, and he said that, no, it was horrific. On 15 September Rodney Philip Hide told Close Up that he had known the circumstances of this case before Mr Garrett became a candidate. He reiterated that in the New Zealand Herald on 15 September. But on 17 September he said to Mr Garner that he could not remember whether Garrett had told him he had stolen a dead infant\u2019s identity: \u201CI don\u2019t know what level of detail I knew.\u201D\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00224a11ce4e-9fb3-4738-b0be-5a9f81d975da\u0022 data-id=\u0022517eb7fa889e4341bb17edbd248b7ce7\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000273\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00224a11ce4e-9fb3-4738-b0be-5a9f81d975da\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022517eb7fa889e4341bb17edbd248b7ce7\u0022\u003EHon MAURICE WILLIAMSON (Minister for Building and Construction):\u003C/span\u003E Before I start, I join with a number of other people in passing on my sincere condolences on the death of Sir Archie Taiaroa. I worked with Archie a lot in the early 1990s on M\u0101ori broadcasting and the establishment of M\u0101ori radio, and as recently as last year I worked with him on the issue of the \u201Ch\u201D in the spelling of Wanganui. He was a man amongst men; he was a legend. He was spectacular, and I will always feel richer in this life for having known him and worked with him. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000274\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00224a11ce4e-9fb3-4738-b0be-5a9f81d975da\u0022\u003EOn 1 October this year a great event will occur. It is an event that is in line with what I have wanted as a politician for the entire time that I have been in this House. It is a move away from taxing incomes and a move towards taxing spending. This is a spectacularly good move, which the Minister of Finance, Bill English, brought in in the Budget this year. It comes into effect on 1 October, and it will be one of the most important things to stimulate our economy. It is a tax shift away from taxing earnings, because earnings are a good thing, and towards taxing spending, especially consumption-type spending, because spending is a bad thing, in my view. If people choose to go out and buy plasma screens and splash out on all sorts of consumer luxuries, that is fine, but that is where people should be paying tax, and I absolutely congratulate Bill English on this rebalancing. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000275\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00224a11ce4e-9fb3-4738-b0be-5a9f81d975da\u0022\u003EThis change does a number of things that are just fantastic, which Mr English referred to in his speech. The first one is that nearly three-quarters of all taxpayers will pay a maximum tax rate of 17.5c in the dollar. That is outstanding. I remember times in this country\u2019s history when the marginal tax rate was 66c in the dollar; people kept a third of what they earned and the Government took two-thirds. Now Mr English has rebalanced the taxation system and got it to a point where most taxpayers\u2014three-quarters of them\u2014will pay a maximum of 17.5c in the dollar. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000276\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00224a11ce4e-9fb3-4738-b0be-5a9f81d975da\u0022\u003EYes, there is an increase in GST. I find it interesting that Labour is so opposed to that, because I remember a couple of things. First of all, GST came in at 10 percent. I was around in those days, in the mid-1980s, and I am sure a lot of members of this House were in politics then. Do members know what happened? There was not a mutter, not a murmur, and not a whisper of GST until Labour got into power. Was it in Labour\u2019s manifesto? No. Was it mentioned on the hustings? No. Was it canvassed with anybody at all? No. Suddenly Labour got into Government, and it did not increase GST by 2.5 percentage points, as this measure does, but it slammed it in as a brand new tax at 10 percent, saying \u201CHere, take that\u201D. There was no consultation; it was a done deal. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000277\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00224a11ce4e-9fb3-4738-b0be-5a9f81d975da\u0022\u003EOne might think I was criticising Labour for that, but I am not. I think introducing GST at a rate of 10 percent was a very good first step, and I congratulate Labour on doing it. But not long after that, again with no compensation and with no discussion, Labour put the GST rate up from 10 percent to 12.5 percent. That is a 25 percent increase\u20142.5 percent on 10 percent is a 25 percent increase. We have not done even nearly that, because our 2.5 percent increase is on the 12.5 percent. Yet Labour did that with no compensation to income earners, no compensation to superannuitants, and no compensation to people on lower incomes. And guess what! That was all OK. It was perfectly acceptable for Labour to do that. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000278\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00224a11ce4e-9fb3-4738-b0be-5a9f81d975da\u0022\u003ENow Bill English has come out with a complete rebalancing package, where people will get a lot more of their income in their hands to keep. Let me give members a couple of examples. The average wage earner will be about $15 a week better off, even after paying the increased GST. Did that happen when Labour did its increase? No, it did not. The average family\u2014so this is not the average income earner; we are going to the family level\u2014in New Zealand, based on their circumstances and spending, will be $25 a week better off under this package than at present. Here is the question: who would reverse that? I guess the question is whether the Labour members will get up in the House today and say that if they back get into Government, which I do not think will be for a very long time, GST will go back down to 12.5 percent. Not on your nelly! Labour thinks this is a great idea, and it is just posturing on this issue.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002275a05f96-2474-4c90-a6ea-cf7b5798e03e\u0022 data-id=\u0022024f296a64194904b674ba3470a29729\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000279\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002275a05f96-2474-4c90-a6ea-cf7b5798e03e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022024f296a64194904b674ba3470a29729\u0022\u003EHon RUTH DYSON (Labour\u2014Port Hills):\u003C/span\u003E I begin my contribution to the general debate this afternoon by acknowledging with considerable sadness the passing of Sir Archie Taiaroa, and I extend my sincere condolences to his family, his friends, his colleagues, and his admirers throughout the country. He is one of the few people of whom we can say that he truly has left our country in a better state for his being a citizen of it. I want to pay the highest possible tribute to him. I know that many colleagues will be paying their respects in person to his family. I will not have that opportunity, but it is a rare privilege to be able to do that in this House. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000280\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002275a05f96-2474-4c90-a6ea-cf7b5798e03e\u0022\u003EThe last few days have been quite extraordinary in terms of this Parliament. I think that the Prime Minister, John Key, is the last remaining New Zealander who is prepared to stand up for Rodney Hide, for the ACT Party, and for David Garrett. Rodney Hide came into this House a lot larger and a lot louder than he is now, saying that he was going to stop the perk-busting of politicians. He was not a politician. He was elected as a new breed of people in this Parliament, and he was going to stamp out perk-busting. Not long after that, he was exposed, not just as a person not able to stop perk-busting but as a perk-taker himself. As long as it was done under the radar and as long as people did not know about it, he said that was all right. I recall John Key saying nothing about that at that time. He did not stand up for him, but certainly did not give him any penalty or punishment. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000281\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002275a05f96-2474-4c90-a6ea-cf7b5798e03e\u0022\u003EDavid Garrett came into this House with even stronger principles, if one looked at it from the outside without any knowledge. He has now broken every single principle that he has ever campaigned on, and he did not campaign quietly. He railed against people having name suppression\u2014absolutely railed against it. Yet he had his own name suppressed. There is a word for that. He is being charged of hypocrisy by people up and down this country. That is the charge that is in front of David Garrett at the moment. He campaigned for openness and transparency, and at the very same time he was denying the truth about his own life to the public of New Zealand. He rallied against criminals and their excuses. He said that there is no excuse for any bad behaviour, but suddenly he has found a huge number of excuses for his own behaviour, his own deceit, and his own hypocrisy. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000282\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002275a05f96-2474-4c90-a6ea-cf7b5798e03e\u0022\u003ERodney Hide, the leader of the ACT Party, knew about David Garrett\u2019s actions before he came into this Parliament. But he did not worry about it, because he never knew that those actions would become public. At the very same time, and this is the worst aspect of this disgraceful behaviour, the family of the dead baby whose identity was stolen by David Garrett had to watch him deceive the country about openness and transparency, about never giving criminals any excuses, and about his \u201Cthree strikes and you\u2019re out\u201D position. They were not able to ever raise the disgust that they felt, knowing that he had stolen the identity of their dead baby and was now parading up and down the country with exactly the opposite view, because Mr Garrett had been given name suppression\u2014something that he opposed for other people. So for that family this Parliament should hang its head in shame. Rodney Hide should personally visit them and apologise for his support of David Garrett when he knew the facts of the situation. This behaviour cannot be passed off as a youthful prank. It was a considered theft of a dead baby\u2019s identity. I do not think that very many other actions can be held in such low regard. I do not understand why John Key is backing Rodney Hide. He is the last-standing New Zealander to defend him.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00226e1ead03-bf7f-496a-a02f-ce52859c58c1\u0022 data-id=\u00223d6ad25ad5b8423490aa3b430cedc8f8\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000283\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226e1ead03-bf7f-496a-a02f-ce52859c58c1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00223d6ad25ad5b8423490aa3b430cedc8f8\u0022\u003EHEKIA PARATA (National): \u003C/span\u003ET\u0113n\u0101 koe, e te Mana Whakaw\u0101; huri noa i t\u014D t\u0101tou Whare, t\u0113n\u0101 t\u0101tou katoa. Ko te kupu tuatahi, he poroporoaki t\u0113nei ki a T\u0101 Archie Taiaroa, ki a Jim Nicholls hoki. Ki a r\u0101ua tahi, haere, haere, oki atu r\u0101. Hoki mai ki a t\u0101tou, t\u0113n\u0101 t\u0101tou katoa.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000284\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226e1ead03-bf7f-496a-a02f-ce52859c58c1\u0022\u003E[Greetings to you, Mr Speaker; and to us throughout our House, greetings to us all. The first statement is this farewell tribute to Sir Archie Taiaroa, and to Jim Nicholls as well. To both of them, I say, depart, farewell, rest there. I come back to us, so greetings to us all.] \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000285\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226e1ead03-bf7f-496a-a02f-ce52859c58c1\u0022\u003EI just wanted to pay my short respects regarding the passing of Sir Archie Taiaroa and Jim Nicholls, both of whom are being mourned across the nation today.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000286\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226e1ead03-bf7f-496a-a02f-ce52859c58c1\u0022\u003EIn turning to this general debate this afternoon, I am delighted to have the opportunity to join with this team on the Government benches to talk about the great story we have to tell in terms of our economic plan. This morning in the Mana electorate I attended two events that, in parenthesis, tell the kind of story that this Government is interested in supporting and growing. The first was about how we deal with young people whose lives are going off-track and how we help them to rehabilitate and restore themselves to the opportunity of being positive participants in society. This meeting took place between Waitangirua and Cannons Creek in the Mana electorate. Then, just down the road, I attended the graduation of the Computers in Homes programme, where 57 individuals and their families had completed a 9-week course. As a result of that, they have the opportunity to get a job or improve the job they have. This Government is interested in providing incentives and support for people to get into work.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000287\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226e1ead03-bf7f-496a-a02f-ce52859c58c1\u0022\u003EEarlier this week I also attended a very vibrant and dynamic meeting of women in business in the northern end of the Mana electorate. These women have started their own businesses or are growing their businesses. They remain confident about, and feel very buoyed by, the strong structural platform that this Government has put in place and the kind of direction we are going in.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000288\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226e1ead03-bf7f-496a-a02f-ce52859c58c1\u0022\u003ETomorrow, the Venus Club, another club for women in business, will be launching in Porirua, which is in the central part of the Mana electorate. Again, we have actual, practical examples on the ground of people who have become more and more confident about the economic plan that this Government has put in place.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000289\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226e1ead03-bf7f-496a-a02f-ce52859c58c1\u0022\u003EI want to tell a fuller story about the area from Porirua to Paraparaumu, which are the two boundary ends of the Mana electorate. We so often are condemned to hearing the most negative exceptions about those areas, and I want to try to put the narrative in place that tells us a fuller story. Yes, there are some dire situations that individuals and families are experiencing in terms of their housing and health conditions. Those situations are directly related to the shameful deferral of maintenance that that Opposition, the Labour Party, oversaw during its 9 years in Government. When we had the best of economic conditions, it failed those people as the State landlord. The Mana electorate is reaping the consequences of those irresponsible and shameful behaviours. This Government is determined to turn that round, not only in that area directly but also in terms of how we can assist families in the Mana electorate through the tax cuts that are coming into being on 1 October.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000290\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226e1ead03-bf7f-496a-a02f-ce52859c58c1\u0022\u003EI can tell this House that in 2009, the worst of economic times in this country, the Porirua City economy outperformed the Wellington region and New Zealand. [Interruption] If the yabbering members opposite are interested in facts rather than their versions of stories, they might take the time to listen. Porirua City is very proud of the achievements it has made economically. It is very proud that the real value-added GDP growth in Porirua was 2.1 percent, while in the Wellington region it was 0.1 percent. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000291\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c186d0a2-99f4-408b-9b4d-d484cf19724d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022765557af812d479d82abcb83bbec6ed3\u0022\u003EHon Lianne Dalziel\u003C/span\u003E: What a load of nonsense.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000292\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226e1ead03-bf7f-496a-a02f-ce52859c58c1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00220fcad38f84e94ae8b973a78fe669902a\u0022\u003EHEKIA PARATA\u003C/span\u003E: I will not be shouted down by members who are naysayers and who want to cast the most negative version across Porirua and the wider Mana electorate. Employment growth there has been 3.7 percent, while in the Wellington region it has been 1.9 percent. There has not been very much growth in the small-business units, but more staff have been taken on. The introduction of tax cuts on 1 October will benefit a wide range of families in the Mana electorate.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002270dd644d-8bcf-40dc-998a-887d62d24a76\u0022 data-id=\u0022664da1164c454999b398b58e6b3c3d95\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000293\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002270dd644d-8bcf-40dc-998a-887d62d24a76\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022664da1164c454999b398b58e6b3c3d95\u0022\u003EMOANA MACKEY (Labour):\u003C/span\u003E I do not know which electorate the previous speaker, Hekia Parata, has been campaigning in, but that is certainly not the message that we have been getting on the streets in Mana at all. I would like to start by joining my parliamentary colleagues in recording the passing of Sir Archie Taiaroa. He was truly a great leader. Many people have been shocked since his sudden illness on the weekend, and his death is truly a loss for our country. I would also like to put on the record my commiserations to his wh\u0101nau on the loss of a truly great New Zealand leader. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000294\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002270dd644d-8bcf-40dc-998a-887d62d24a76\u0022\u003EI think many New Zealanders today, after question time, will be asking themselves what it will take for Prime Minister John Key to lose confidence in his Minister Rodney Hide.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000295\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002275a05f96-2474-4c90-a6ea-cf7b5798e03e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00220a1f62870efd42b8a3f1f2e1a753d8a7\u0022\u003EHon Ruth Dyson\u003C/span\u003E: What more could he do?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000296\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002270dd644d-8bcf-40dc-998a-887d62d24a76\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022dbe1bb53204f4c07964e103b0b41fa5b\u0022\u003EMOANA MACKEY\u003C/span\u003E: What more could Mr Hide possibly do to lose the confidence of the Prime Minister? Today the Prime Minister said in question time that he believed that Mr Hide was acting ethically. Mr Hide covered up a heinous crime, committed by one of his own MPs, and gave that member the law and order portfolio. It is a true slap in the face to the victims of Mr Garrett\u2019s crime and it has caused great pain to the victims of that crime. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000297\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002270dd644d-8bcf-40dc-998a-887d62d24a76\u0022\u003EHow can the Prime Minister stand in this House and say that behaviour is ethical? How can he defend that behaviour?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000298\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002267431f57-e958-4c83-b438-7da8061d479e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022182a1e3b779c49bf979e146e93b39d58\u0022\u003EPaul Quinn\u003C/span\u003E: Helen did; she who must be obeyed.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000299\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002270dd644d-8bcf-40dc-998a-887d62d24a76\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022ee2c5f8965ed48f1aeaaf48acb465393\u0022\u003EMOANA MACKEY\u003C/span\u003E: Apparently Mr Quinn thinks that signing a painting for charity is the same thing as stealing a dead baby\u2019s identity. Well, I tell the member that is it not.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000300\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002267431f57-e958-4c83-b438-7da8061d479e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002261b7560c3cf44f5790e54fcf7462f986\u0022\u003EPaul Quinn\u003C/span\u003E: No, Taito Phillip Field.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000301\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002270dd644d-8bcf-40dc-998a-887d62d24a76\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022dfeb894dc12242efa61e367d810d85b9\u0022\u003EMOANA MACKEY\u003C/span\u003E: I tell Mr Quinn that Taito Phillip Field is in prison. If Mr Quinn and Prime Minister John Key think it is OK to have a Minister in their Government who covered up the identity theft of a dead baby, then this is a sad day for the Parliament of New Zealand. This Prime Minister promised higher standards would be set by Ministers. He said his executive would be different from previous ones, but what has happened has been nothing short of a disgrace. Mr Hide should be relieved of his ministerial portfolios. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000302\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002270dd644d-8bcf-40dc-998a-887d62d24a76\u0022\u003EThis is not an isolated incident. We can look back at a pattern of behaviour from Minister Rodney Hide, and this behaviour has been raised in the House many times. He went on TV and encouraged people to break the law, but that was OK with Mr Key. He charged people $45 to come and hear him speak in his capacity as the Minister of Local Government, but it was OK with Mr Key for a Minister to charge the people of New Zealand, who pay the Minister\u2019s salary, to hear him speak. Mr Key thought that was all right. Mr Hide then went to a function and bad-mouthed Mr Key, saying he does not do anything and has no principles. That was also all right with Mr Key; he forgave that. The great perk-buster, Mr Rodney Hide, then took his partner on a taxpayer-funded trip round the world, for which he then had to pay money back, but that was all right with Mr Key. Mr Hide breached Cabinet Manual rules by endorsing a company when he was a Minister, but that was all right with Mr Key. Mr Hide was all right when David Garrett was accused of sexually harassing a female staff member.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000303\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c186d0a2-99f4-408b-9b4d-d484cf19724d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00221770d75942aa450792229e36098bd038\u0022\u003EHon Lianne Dalziel\u003C/span\u003E: And there\u2019s more of that to come out, too.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000304\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002270dd644d-8bcf-40dc-998a-887d62d24a76\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022e649679f5f154a22b37f66742480d652\u0022\u003EMOANA MACKEY\u003C/span\u003E: There may be more of that; I do not know whether that is the case. But apparently that was also all right with Mr Key. That behaviour was considered to be appropriate and ethical for a Minister. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000305\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002270dd644d-8bcf-40dc-998a-887d62d24a76\u0022\u003EWhen Mr Garrett made some particularly repugnant comments on sterilisation, Mr Key thought it was all right that Mr Hide defended Mr Garrett in that case. There was the appalling treatment of Heather Roy, the bullying of one of Mr Hide\u2019s own colleagues. That was all right with Mr Key. He thought that Mr Hide did a good job of handling that, as well. There was the way that Mr Hide has handled the Auckland super-city legislation. It was anti-democratic not to give Aucklanders the right to decide on how their local government would be run. Apparently, that was all right with Mr Key. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000306\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002270dd644d-8bcf-40dc-998a-887d62d24a76\u0022\u003EBut the worst thing of all is that Mr Key is defending a Minister who has covered up the identity theft of a dead child. Well, the Labour Party says Mr Key is now the only person who is defending Mr Hide. Mr Key is the only person who thinks that Mr Hide deserves to keep his Cabinet position.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022a744a9a7-a2e8-401b-abfb-aec22a3818c8\u0022 data-id=\u0022c2256794330d4d52a41eaa718455c365\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000307\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a744a9a7-a2e8-401b-abfb-aec22a3818c8\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022c2256794330d4d52a41eaa718455c365\u0022\u003EKATRINA SHANKS (National):\u003C/span\u003E It is my pleasure to take a call in the general debate this afternoon. We are seeing probably the biggest tax reforms this country has had in the last two decades. This Government is sending out a clear message with these reforms, and that clear message is quite simple: we will reward hard work. We will reward the people who go out there and work hard, by reducing their personal tax rates. We will reward people if they go out and invest and if they go out and save, because we want New Zealanders to think about what they are doing with their money and about how well they can do with it. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000308\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a744a9a7-a2e8-401b-abfb-aec22a3818c8\u0022\u003ENew Zealand is renowned for being a country of spenders. We are very good at spending everything we have and we are very good at borrowing to spend money we do not have, as well. Part of the reason why we are in a recession in New Zealand now is that people have borrowed to spend money on consumables. They have borrowed against their mortgages to spend money on increasing their personal assets, like a car. Instead of saving to do that, they have borrowed on their mortgage or they have run up credit on their credit cards. So this Government is sending some clear messages out there: let us work hard, let us invest, let us save, and let us get ahead. If the reason that people are borrowing for investment properties is to get ahead through tax advantages, then they will not be able to do that any more. If people want to go out and spend every single cent that they earn on consumables, then they will be paying a portion of that spending on GST. We have made a whole range of reductions in personal tax and we have increased GST to 15 percent. We have not made GST 15 percent; we have increased it by 2.5 percent to 15 percent. In effect, we have given a $4 billion tax cut to New Zealand, and we have taken some money back by increasing GST to the value of $2 billion. New Zealanders, overall, will be $2 billion better off. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000309\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a744a9a7-a2e8-401b-abfb-aec22a3818c8\u0022\u003ELast night I went to a Wellington kindy association AGM held in Johnsonville, in \u014Chariu. When one looked around at the parents, the mums and dads, at that AGM, one could see that they work hard. They want to get ahead and they want these tax cuts. Those parents do not measure their success by measuring how well this Government does with regard to GDP; they measure their success by their real wages, by their real salaries, by how much they take home at the end of the day, by how much they have to play with, by how much they can spend on groceries and clothing, and by how much they can spend on taking their kids on a holiday. That is how they measure their success right here, right now. This Government is delivering a tax cut to those families on 1 October.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000310\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a744a9a7-a2e8-401b-abfb-aec22a3818c8\u0022\u003EIt is interesting that we talk about what families in New Zealand want. They just want to be left alone to get on, to get ahead in life, and to do their thing, without having the Government coming back and saying that if they reach this much when they are earning, then it will take this benefit away from them for doing that. Those families want to work hard and earn money, take it home, and decide in their own home how they will spend that money. That is not too complex. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000311\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a744a9a7-a2e8-401b-abfb-aec22a3818c8\u0022\u003EIn fact, we see that these tax cuts are quite significant when we look at a couple of the income brackets. I will talk members through those, because people talk about this in concept but not many people actually get the changes. If people earn up to $14,000 a year, their tax rate changes from 12.5 percent to 10.5 percent. If people earn between $14,000 and $48,000 a year, their tax rate moves from 21 percent to 17.5 percent. That is quite a big drop. If people earn between $48,000 and $70,000\u2014we are talking now about people like teachers, police officers, and nurses\u2014their income tax rate drops from 33c to 30c in the dollar. If people are lucky enough to earn over $70,000, their income tax rate drops from 38c to 33c in the dollar. What does that mean in terms of what people take home at the end of the day? If we include the increase in GST, the average wage earner in New Zealand who earns about $50,000 will be about $15 a week better off. The average family in New Zealand will be $25 a week better off. A retired couple receiving only New Zealand superannuation will be $11 a week better off.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00228e686b62-8dc4-4f03-a7b6-2d0f9c874e9a\u0022 data-id=\u0022142aafec290a455eb06ebf1ab0a990c2\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000312\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00228e686b62-8dc4-4f03-a7b6-2d0f9c874e9a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022142aafec290a455eb06ebf1ab0a990c2\u0022\u003EHon GEORGE HAWKINS (Labour\u2014Manurewa):\u003C/span\u003E I join with my colleagues in expressing my sympathy over the passing of two great leaders of the M\u0101ori community. I am sure that all members in the House will join with us in that. Sir Archie Taiaroa was a great New Zealander. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000313\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00228e686b62-8dc4-4f03-a7b6-2d0f9c874e9a\u0022\u003EI will talk today about what is happening in Auckland. Next week many local government workers will find out whether they have their jobs. Many will not have their jobs. Of course, the Public Service Association (PSA) has worked for these people and they have redundancy packages. I think that is good\u2014ordinary workers with decent redundancy packages. But there comes a time when things will be hard for all New Zealanders. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000314\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00228e686b62-8dc4-4f03-a7b6-2d0f9c874e9a\u0022\u003EWhat is surprising is the amount of rumour going around about some of the eight chief executives and what will happen to them. People are saying that they are getting a golden handshake. Some of them will get a six-figure sum. Some of them will get a substantial six-figure sum. These people are at the moment on six-figure contracts. They are being paid that amount of money, yet they will get an additional payment. These people are on fixed-term contracts. I challenge Rodney Hide to tell the people of Auckland what is going on. When one is earning more a year than the Prime Minister, I ask whether one should be getting a huge payout. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000315\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00228e686b62-8dc4-4f03-a7b6-2d0f9c874e9a\u0022\u003EPeople will find out next week what has happened to their jobs, and they will get a redundancy package that has been negotiated. The PSA has done a good job, but people will see that some of those chief executives are doing all right. They are already paid large sums, which means that they are required to do the extra yard\u2014go out and do the overtime, work on weekends\u2014but now they will get extra rewards. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000316\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00228e686b62-8dc4-4f03-a7b6-2d0f9c874e9a\u0022\u003EI say to the local government Ministers that people in Auckland need to know what is going on. I know that John Carter is busy working as the Minister of Civil Defence, and I do not want to distract him from that. But the Minister of Local Government, Rodney Hide, must know all about this matter. I ask who will pay these six-figure sums. Well, elderly people who own their own homes will have to go into their purses to get some money to pay for these huge redundancy handouts, golden parachutes\u2014call them what we will. Those people want answers.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000317\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00228e686b62-8dc4-4f03-a7b6-2d0f9c874e9a\u0022\u003EHow accurate are the rumours? The challenge for Mr Hide is to tell people exactly what is going on. He should not keep it secret. Mr Hide has a background of keeping things secret, but the people of Auckland, of course, want answers. People are looking around and seeing how unfair the system is. Chief executives might get close to half a million dollars when they clear their desks, close the door, and walk out of their offices, and they will be quite happy. Council workers, who do the ordinary jobs that are so important, will look at what the PSA has for them. They think that is fine. But when they start to do the comparison, they will wonder. They can say to themselves that they worked hard. Many of them went the extra yard. But in the end those people need answers.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00221368ba6c-25be-40f6-a2a0-8f81e1f78b79\u0022 data-id=\u00229573ff6eec6a4b2bb6848b7cf24607e3\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000318\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221368ba6c-25be-40f6-a2a0-8f81e1f78b79\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00229573ff6eec6a4b2bb6848b7cf24607e3\u0022\u003ECHRIS TREMAIN (National\u2014Napier):\u003C/span\u003E From 1 October New Zealand will introduce the biggest tax reform package that this country has seen in a generation. This tax cut package is the commitment that the National Party made to the electorate when it went to the polls at the last election, and the National Government is delivering upon it. The tax cut package puts a whopping $4 billion into the back pockets of hard-working Kiwis. Yes, GST will rise, providing $2 billion, but the net benefit to Kiwis will be positive. It is projected that the average family on $70,000 will be $25 per week better off after accounting for the GST increase. This has to be good for New Zealand. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000319\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221368ba6c-25be-40f6-a2a0-8f81e1f78b79\u0022\u003EFrom 1 October Kiwis will see significant increases in their wage packets, and will have the choice to spend that money or to save it. Importantly, real after-tax wages are forecast to rise by 1.2 percent in the last 3 months of this year. This is an excellent result. I am confident that we will look back on this initiative in many years\u2019 time and say that this was a pivotal point for the future of New Zealand\u2019s prosperity. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000320\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221368ba6c-25be-40f6-a2a0-8f81e1f78b79\u0022\u003EThere is an inconvenient truth for the Labour Party in this package. Many high-income property investors will now face higher taxes, as depreciation is removed from commercial and residential property. The Labour Party wants to paint this package as tax cuts just for the rich. How far from the truth can that be? In fact, many property investors will now be paying higher taxes. Previously, property owners have been able to claim losses through the non-cash accrual of depreciation, but they will now face paying tax on their property investments. Given that most investment properties generally rise in value, not fall, this is a sensible move. This is part of the rebalancing of the economy, and it will help to change investment decisions from non-productive investment in residential property, towards productive investment in the production engine of the economy. That rebalancing needs to take place, and this Government is delivering upon it. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000321\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221368ba6c-25be-40f6-a2a0-8f81e1f78b79\u0022\u003EWe throw lots of different statistics around this House, in a game of ultimate one-upmanship. We are all guilty of this, as we attempt to manoeuvre our political chess pieces in an effort either to regain or to retain the Treasury benches. Of all the statistics that have been thrown around this House since I have been an MP for some 5 years, it is the ability of a Government to lift the wages of its constituents above the rate of inflation that I believe is most important. Real wage growth is the genuine measure that indicates whether a Government has been able to improve the lot of its citizens. This should be the focus of any Government, and particularly for those parties that claim to represent low-income earners. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000322\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221368ba6c-25be-40f6-a2a0-8f81e1f78b79\u0022\u003EThe previous Labour Government achieved real wage growth over the 9-year period it was in office, but it achieved real wage growth of just 3 percent. That is an annual real wage growth over that 9-year period of 0.3 percent per annum. It is absolutely appalling. It is unbelievable. The interesting point is that most of that wage growth was achieved in the first 4 years of that regime. Throughout the period when we had some of the highest-ever surpluses in the economy of this country, of $6 billion and $8 billion, the previous Labour Government achieved virtually zero real wage growth for cleaners, for factory workers, for the people whom it claimed to represent. That is an indictment of the worst kind. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000323\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221368ba6c-25be-40f6-a2a0-8f81e1f78b79\u0022\u003EThere were three failings at the nub of this result: firstly, a failure to control inflation, and we heard today that towards the end of the term of the previous Labour Government, inflation was over 5 percent; secondly, the fact that many Kiwis were continually being pushed into higher and higher marginal tax brackets; and, thirdly, a philosophical opposition to allowing taxpayers to keep more money in their back pockets. Even when Michael Cullen was forced into adjusting the level of marginal tax rates, he reneged. He reversed them. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000324\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221368ba6c-25be-40f6-a2a0-8f81e1f78b79\u0022\u003EIt was not until the death knell of the previous Labour Government that Labour finally accepted that the workers of this country deserved to be rewarded. That last-minute decision was far too late to impact upon its record of real wage growth of just 3 percent. Let me say that again\u2014Labour achieved 3 percent real wage growth over 9 years. What sort of record is that for the cleaners and the production factory workers of this country? It is abysmal. Thank you.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022eaaad191-62cf-43e8-a772-63a71dbf4d4a\u0022 data-id=\u0022ba68d03f39ca41749acadbf5fd713f72\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000325\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022eaaad191-62cf-43e8-a772-63a71dbf4d4a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022ba68d03f39ca41749acadbf5fd713f72\u0022\u003ESUE KEDGLEY (Green):\u003C/span\u003E On behalf of the Green Party, I pay my respects to Sir Archie Taiaroa. I acknowledge what a great leader he was and I convey our condolences to his wh\u0101nau. Today is a members\u2019 day, and my member\u2019s bill, the Animal Welfare (Treatment of Animals) Amendment Bill, was to be debated in the House. However, I have delayed its consideration because I want the vote on the bill to be a personal, or conscience, vote. Animal welfare is, above all, an ethical and moral issue. I wrote to the Speaker requesting that MPs be allowed to exercise a personal, or conscience, vote. It was considered by the Business Committee yesterday and supported, as I understand, by the Labour Party, the Green Party, and the M\u0101ori Party. But National argued that animal welfare was an economic issue, not an ethical or moral one, and that MPs should not be allowed to vote with their conscience on this issue. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000326\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022eaaad191-62cf-43e8-a772-63a71dbf4d4a\u0022\u003EI have written once again to the Speaker, requesting that he reconsider my request. The simple fact is that animal welfare is an ethical and a moral issue. Some farmers may wish otherwise. They may wish that it was just an economic issue, and that it was left up to them to decide whether they consider it profitable to treat animals humanely. The reason that so many New Zealanders feel passionately about animal welfare, the reason there were protests outside Parliament today about animal welfare, and the reason a petition on animal welfare was presented to Parliament today is that it is an ethical and a moral issue. It revolves around questions such as whether animals have an intrinsic value and should, therefore, be treated with compassion and respect, or whether they are just the property of humans and can be manipulated and treated in whatever way farmers want, as long as it makes them more efficient sources of cheap meat, milk, and eggs for humans. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000327\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022eaaad191-62cf-43e8-a772-63a71dbf4d4a\u0022\u003EThese ethical and moral issues are particularly important when we consider an animal such as a pig. Pigs are highly sociable, intelligent, and very curious. Professor Stanley Curtis, who spent his career studying pigs, taught them to play computer games using joysticks, which they were able to move with their snouts or by holding them in their mouths. He said that pigs are one of the most intelligent animals on earth, and that they far surpass the mental capacity of dogs. They communicate with each other constantly, and given a choice they will live in families or small groups. They love to root around in the soil and forage for food, and socialise. They have a strong mothering instinct, but when they are cramped together for long periods of time or locked in cages their social skills break down. They become aggressive and frustrated, and engage in infighting. Imagine how these sociable animals feel when they are locked in cages, unable to exercise, search for food, be part of a family, socialise, or build a nest for their young.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000328\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022eaaad191-62cf-43e8-a772-63a71dbf4d4a\u0022\u003EThis begs the question, a moral and an ethical question, for this Parliament: do we have a right to require highly intelligent animals like pigs to live miserable lives of suffering, just to satisfy our desire for cheap meat, especially when we can farm it perfectly well in humane, free-range conditions where pigs are able to express normal patterns of behaviour? Parliament needs to consider whether it is ethical to treat animals in a way that would be considered torture if it was carried out on humans or even companion animals. Why is it a crime to keep animals such as dogs in a cage for long periods of time, but perfectly acceptable to keep other animals, such as pigs and hens, in cages for prolonged periods? These are ethical and moral issues that this Parliament has to consider and debate when it considers my bill. We cannot have one law for companion animals and a completely different law for farm animals. Animal cruelty, surely, is animal cruelty whether it happens to a pig or a dog. I acknowledge that there are economic issues that we need to consider, but ultimately I want my bill to be a conscience vote.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000329\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022eaaad191-62cf-43e8-a772-63a71dbf4d4a\u0022\u003EThe debate having concluded, the motion lapsed.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n    \u003C/div\u003E\n    \u003Cdiv class=\u0022HpsHansard\u0022\u003E\n      \u003Cp\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsProceedingHeading\u0022\u003EBills\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000330\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u00226cd697f882fb4c2fb9b7576c8187d725\u0022\u003EChrist\u2019s College (Canterbury) Amendment Bill\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000331\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u00226aa79e997a5a494cac4a0daaf66e7211\u0022\u003ESecond Reading\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002292824476-4e66-4052-8435-b049833d8b83\u0022 data-id=\u0022006c6340543946dd80b14147300591fa\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000332\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002292824476-4e66-4052-8435-b049833d8b83\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022006c6340543946dd80b14147300591fa\u0022\u003ENICKY WAGNER (National):\u003C/span\u003E I move, That the Christ\u2019s College (Canterbury) Amendment Bill be now read a second time. I thank the members of the Government Administration Committee and its chair, the Hon David Parker, for dealing with this bill so quickly and efficiently. The select committee reported back to the House on 10 September and recommended that the bill, with amendments, proceed. This was good news for the board of governors of Christ\u2019s College and for the school itself, as it cleaned up after the 4 September earthquake. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000333\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002292824476-4e66-4052-8435-b049833d8b83\u0022\u003EChrist\u2019s College, which was established in 1855, is one of the oldest schools in New Zealand and has a cluster of beautiful heritage buildings in the centre of Christchurch. Luckily they have sustained only minor to moderate damage. Like many heritage buildings in Christchurch, the damage has been mostly to chimneys and the gable ends of buildings. The school had done substantial earthquake strengthening in the past, and the boarding houses, which have been strengthened to 67 percent of the building code, were undamaged. Several buildings will need further earthquake-strengthening work but that had already been planned, and specialist workmen are now busy restoring some of the most intricate stone and slate work. The school is fully insured and will continue the repairs until all the buildings are restored. The boys, although evacuated after the earthquake, have returned to school and it is now functioning as normally as possible. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000334\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002292824476-4e66-4052-8435-b049833d8b83\u0022\u003EThe Christ\u2019s College (Canterbury) Amendment Bill seeks to amend the Christ\u2019s College (Canterbury) Act 1910 to remove difficulties in administering trust funds invested in the college. Over the past 155 years the college has received numerous bequests from various donors. The terms of some of those bequests require that the annual income generated by the funds be applied to specific purposes\u2014for example, the provision of prizes for certain subjects or sports, or the provision of scholarships for pupils who meet those criteria. Accordingly, the school holds the funds on trust, to be applied for those specified purposes. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000335\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002292824476-4e66-4052-8435-b049833d8b83\u0022\u003EHowever, over the years the stated objects of a number of the trusts have become largely redundant. Also, some of the trusts receive income that is either in excess of, or insufficient for, their needs. The board of governors\u2019 submission to the select committee advised that of the 148 mostly small trusts that the board administers, approximately 28 could not be administered because of changed circumstances. In the past, when problems of implementation had occurred the board had engaged directly with the original donors to agree to a variation of purpose. In many cases, variations had been agreed but nowadays many of the original donors have already passed away, and even some of the agreed variations are in need of amendment. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000336\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002292824476-4e66-4052-8435-b049833d8b83\u0022\u003ETrustees can apply to the High Court, under the Charitable Trusts Act 1957, to approve a new trust purpose in certain circumstances. The new trust purpose must be as close as possible to the original one. The process involves the submission of a trust variation scheme to the Attorney-General, who will report on the scheme to the court. There is also a public notification and objection process. However, the college would need to make a separate application to the High Court for each trust variation, and the board estimates that it would cost approximately $50,000 each time. That is not practical when we consider that many trusts are small. One example is the Balfour Divinity Prize, which was established in 1880, with a bequest of $100 for a gold medal to be awarded to the boy who passed the best examination in divinity in the four Gospels and Acts of the Apostles\u2014in Greek! Other examples of bequests with redundant purposes include the 1919 gift to the college to provide bursaries for the sons of soldiers. They include the sons of those who had fallen or suffered as part of the New Zealand Expeditionary Force, and the sons of members of various forces of the British Empire, or who had served in the Great War. Another estate was left in trust to educate orphans from named Christchurch orphanages, which no longer exist. Funds can now no longer be distributed from those trusts and are just accumulating, to the benefit of no one. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000337\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002292824476-4e66-4052-8435-b049833d8b83\u0022\u003EThe select committee found that the amendment bill was generally consistent with the law related to charitable trusts, and reported that the issues, as described in the preamble, were proved to its satisfaction. Similar problems have been identified by other organisations and have been addressed in legislation such as the Methodist Church of New Zealand Trusts Bill 2009, which was recently passed in this House. The select committee suggested that the Christ\u2019s College (Canterbury) Amendment Bill use the wording from the Charitable Trusts Act, which has an established body of case law supporting it. It recommended that clause 5, which proposes a new subsection to vary the proposed purposes of charitable trusts in certain circumstances, be rewritten. It also suggested inserting a new subsection 4A in clause 5, which would allow the governing body to use, for another purpose, excess income from trusts that generate more than necessary for the donated purposes. That is consistent with the Charitable Trusts Act. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000338\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002292824476-4e66-4052-8435-b049833d8b83\u0022\u003EFinally, the committee was not comfortable with the term \u201Cfor the benefit of the college\u201D, in case the functions of the college changed over time, and then trust funds could perhaps be applied to non-charitable purposes. The committee therefore recommended amending new section 5(3) in clause 5 to require that trust funds be used for charitable purposes, and that new section 5(4B) require that any new purpose be as close as reasonably possible to the purpose for which the property was given. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000339\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002292824476-4e66-4052-8435-b049833d8b83\u0022\u003EThe board of governors has always made it clear that the college wishes to and, as a trustee, must ensure that to the fullest extent possible the objects of the trust continue to be met and that the board\u2019s approach to any variation of purpose would be as sympathetic to, and consistent with, the original purpose as possible. The board of governors has also assured the select committee that before exercising this power to vary the original purpose, it will complete a detailed review of the trust to ensure that the original purposes cannot continue to be met fully. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000340\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002292824476-4e66-4052-8435-b049833d8b83\u0022\u003EAgain, I thank the select committee for its thorough and thoughtful work. The bill, as amended, will solve the problems of dealing with numerous small trusts administered by the college. It contains enough checks and balances to protect those trusts, and the Attorney-General still maintains his role as the protector of charities. He will still have general oversight and will be able to inquire into the trusts if he believes that the trustees, at any stage, overstep their powers. The committee has done an excellent job in reshaping this bill. It is good legislation, and I commend it to the House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002267aa5137-7503-4a8f-bde1-1811615598e2\u0022 data-id=\u00225058e1d824734fb7a118f69fb065a5de\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000341\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002267aa5137-7503-4a8f-bde1-1811615598e2\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00225058e1d824734fb7a118f69fb065a5de\u0022\u003EBRENDON BURNS (Labour\u2014Christchurch Central):\u003C/span\u003E I am very pleased to support the second reading of the Christ\u2019s College (Canterbury) Amendment Bill, and to note, firstly, how important it is that Christ\u2019s College, one of the great, important fa\u00E7ades and institutions of my electorate of Christchurch Central, has come through the quake with only modest damage. It is important to know that an institution like that is up and operating. That is important for Parliament and for the nation to know. Of course even though Christ\u2019s College has had some earthquake strengthening, that was no guarantee that it would come through a force 7.1 quake.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000342\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002267aa5137-7503-4a8f-bde1-1811615598e2\u0022\u003EI note that the Catholic Cathedral of the Blessed Sacrament, which has had $700,000 spent on it in the last 3 or 4 years, is still closed and may be closed for another year. Many other churches, in particular, and other buildings across our city centre have suffered much worse than Christ\u2019s College has.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000343\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002267aa5137-7503-4a8f-bde1-1811615598e2\u0022\u003EChrist\u2019s College is an independent school finely led by the headmaster, Simon Leese. The purpose of this bill is to acknowledge that changes are required to the trusts that have been supporting the college from its founding days in the 19th century. There have been changes in the nature of those trusts and this bill acknowledges that. This bill is parallel to another bill that I brought through the House last year for the Methodist Church, which is also headquartered in the Christchurch Central electorate, and which similarly faced trusts that were out of date. The process to take change through the High Court was enormously difficult, complex, and expensive. This bill seeks to assist that issue.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000344\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002267aa5137-7503-4a8f-bde1-1811615598e2\u0022\u003EWe, the Labour Opposition, support this bill, but I note that through the course of the Government Administration Committee process changes were made, and those changes were quite important. They were on the issue of what the college\u2019s trustees were able to do in introducing new purposes for a trust. There were concerns about that; we wanted to ensure that those purposes would still be charitable purposes. I understand that those changes are recognised and accepted by the Christ\u2019s College Board of Trustees; that is appropriate and was in the legal advice to them. That issue reflects similar concerns about the Methodist Church of New Zealand Trusts Bill. It is a very important principle that when a trust is established, albeit that could have been a century ago or thereabouts, the people setting up that trust have very clear intent about what they want it used for. Although we as a Parliament want to change a trust\u2019s purpose where it is no longer appropriate at all, we do want to generally ensure that the moneys still are directed towards the kind of intent that the people who founded the trusts envisaged a considerable number of decades ago.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000345\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002267aa5137-7503-4a8f-bde1-1811615598e2\u0022\u003ESo the Labour Opposition supports the second reading of the bill and its progress through Parliament. Thank you.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00224a25943b-cb3b-49c3-bd10-74316fae17f1\u0022 data-id=\u0022741c3fb00b3b4baebc06b60ef938ba81\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000346\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00224a25943b-cb3b-49c3-bd10-74316fae17f1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022741c3fb00b3b4baebc06b60ef938ba81\u0022\u003EJACQUI DEAN (National\u2014Waitaki):\u003C/span\u003E The Christ\u2019s College (Canterbury) Amendment Bill, which was brought to the House by MP Nicky Wagner, has had a thorough scrutiny in the Government Administration Committee. I commend my colleagues in that select committee because we gave this bill the scrutiny it needed. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000347\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00224a25943b-cb3b-49c3-bd10-74316fae17f1\u0022\u003EI will tell members why I felt the bill needed a bit of scrutiny. A number of years ago, over a period of years, families throughout Canterbury, South Canterbury, North Canterbury, and, indeed, the length and breadth of New Zealand made bequests to Christ\u2019s College traversing matters such as scholarships for tutelage, for sons and grandsons of soldiers, and for the purposes of a sporting activity such as fives. A number of trusts were set up and kind donations were made into those trusts, but over the years the funds are no longer needed, the activity is no longer appropriate, or the sport is no longer played. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000348\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00224a25943b-cb3b-49c3-bd10-74316fae17f1\u0022\u003ESo the proprietors of Christ\u2019s College found themselves in the position of holding on to sums of money for which they had no good purpose. As they told us in the select committee, the sums of money served no use. There is no use having funds accumulating in various accounts for which there is no purpose, so the select committee looked at the provisions of the bill. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000349\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00224a25943b-cb3b-49c3-bd10-74316fae17f1\u0022\u003EThere are a number of precedents for the circumstances surrounding this bill: the Methodist Church of New Zealand Trusts Act was recently passed in this House and dealt with the same problem of funds given by bequest for a purpose that no longer exists. There is also the Anglican Church Trusts Act 1981, the Presbyterian Church Property Act 1996, and the Roman Catholic Bishops Empowering Act 1997. So we can see that this is not an uncommon problem, and it was one that we were happy to deal with. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000350\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00224a25943b-cb3b-49c3-bd10-74316fae17f1\u0022\u003EI must credit Nicky Wagner MP for bringing this bill to the House and providing such a good link. I think it is really important for a good local MP to provide a good link between the promoters of a bill and the select committee\u2014and, indeed, this Parliament. Nicky Wagner has done a particularly good job in this instance in keeping the connections going between the promoters and Parliament. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000351\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00224a25943b-cb3b-49c3-bd10-74316fae17f1\u0022\u003EThis bill amends the Christ\u2019s College (Canterbury) Act 1910. Members can see, without even my comments prefacing this part of my speech, that the legislation is well and truly out of date. What the bill seeks to do\u2014and I think we have achieved this in the select committee\u2014is to remove difficulties in administering trusts and property that have been invested in the college. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000352\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00224a25943b-cb3b-49c3-bd10-74316fae17f1\u0022\u003EThe select committee needed\u2014and wished\u2014to tighten up a couple of the aspects of the bill as it was presented to us by the promoters. We recommended replacing the wording in the original bill as presented to the House with words from the Charitable Trusts Act. It was felt that aligning the words of that Act with those in this bill provided certainty to the intention set out in this bill. I think the promoters accepted the suggestion of the select committee to do that and were very happy to have those words put in. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000353\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00224a25943b-cb3b-49c3-bd10-74316fae17f1\u0022\u003EAnother concern raised by members of the select committee was that the wording in the bill was a little bit loose. Some of the sums of money sitting in redundant trusts were intended for the benefit of the college, yet if we go back to each individual trust we see that some of those monies were given for quite specific purposes. So it was the select committee\u2019s wish, with the agreement of the promoters, that a new purpose be as close as reasonably possible to that for which the property was given to, or vested in, the college. If the bequest was to advance sporting interests then it was the intention and wish of the select committee that the wording in the bill reflected that. So, in time to come, when the proprietors of Christ\u2019s College decide to use a bequest fund it will be for a purpose as close as possible to that which was intended in the first place. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000354\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00224a25943b-cb3b-49c3-bd10-74316fae17f1\u0022\u003EI was particularly happy as a committee member to see the tightening up of the wording in the bill. We did not want to see a bequest made many years ago by the family of a fallen soldier to go to something quite unrelated to that bequest, because maybe the family would not have liked that. In a bequest associated with the family of a soldier or soldiers\u2014because a number of boys, of course, of Christ\u2019s College fought for our country\u2014I felt that we needed to keep the purpose as close as possible to the original intent. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000355\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00224a25943b-cb3b-49c3-bd10-74316fae17f1\u0022\u003EThe bill as returned to the House for its second reading keeps the spirit of the bill introduced to the House by the promoters of the bill and, indeed, by Nicky Wagner, who brought it before us. We have also managed through the select committee process to keep the spirit of bequests as close as possible to the original intention of those people who made the bequests. With those words, I commend this bill to the House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022 data-id=\u0022afc5b7518f6b4af8b019ee611f1f1ba0\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000356\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022afc5b7518f6b4af8b019ee611f1f1ba0\u0022\u003EGRANT ROBERTSON (Labour\u2014Wellington Central):\u003C/span\u003E I beg your indulgence, Mr Assistant Speaker Roy, at the start of my contribution and say that on behalf of all members of the House who reside south of the Bombay Hills, we wish you all the best for tomorrow evening in Invercargill. I think I can speak on behalf of most members. [Interruption] There may be a few noises from north of the Bombay Hills, but I hope that things work out well in Invercargill.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000357\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002267431f57-e958-4c83-b438-7da8061d479e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022d4fca04cf62d4db78ef8b2a08b08fc75\u0022\u003EPaul Quinn\u003C/span\u003E: Until Wellington goes down.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000358\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002223b5a61d4adf425dbef8254c43fb1ba1\u0022\u003EGRANT ROBERTSON\u003C/span\u003E: That is right; that is precisely the point. Mr Quinn has totally blown my cover. Here I am, congratulating the member for Invercargill and Paul Quinn blows my cover. I am sorry, Mr Assistant Speaker, this week you can hang on but after that we want the shield back. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000359\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003EIt gives me pleasure to rise and speak in the second reading of the Christ\u2019s College (Canterbury) Amendment Bill. The bill was referred to the Government Administration Committee, and the member who has just resumed her seat, Jacqui Dean, reflected on the discussions that took place at the committee. I think it was a good example of a private bill coming to the House. Generally speaking, I think most members think that is fine\u2014the particular organisation needs to be able to do what it needs to do to continue to operate, and we should just let the bill go through and it will be fine. However, I think that what the select committee process drew out was the importance of select committee scrutiny. This is not a bad mark on Christ\u2019s College, at all. The college governors have been entirely cooperative with the committee, but I think it draws out the importance of every bill getting the scrutiny it needs in this House, and not bypassing the process and thinking it does not matter. This certainly was a situation where the select committee, I believe, has added significant value and has ensured some consistency and\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000360\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00224a25943b-cb3b-49c3-bd10-74316fae17f1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022550324b8a6c540b9a543af46c62f6502\u0022\u003EJacqui Dean\u003C/span\u003E: It\u2019s a great select committee.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000361\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022963554b93c304611affd167fb44db615\u0022\u003EGRANT ROBERTSON\u003C/span\u003E: Well, it is a great select committee, and it is chaired by the Hon David Parker. Mr Gilmore\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000362\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00224a25943b-cb3b-49c3-bd10-74316fae17f1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00220aa1b56c88a747df8f2ec43fe5e5b245\u0022\u003EJacqui Dean\u003C/span\u003E: Who\u2019s the deputy chair?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000363\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00229aea53c0cfa64f32bb183f4f24700574\u0022\u003EGRANT ROBERTSON\u003C/span\u003E: The deputy chair is Jacqui Dean. While we are at it, let us name all the members\u2014there are not that many. On this side of the House we are very proud of our chair, David Parker. He led the Government Administration Committee through its often trying and difficult work programme so that it was able to come up with a good result with this bill. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000364\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003EI want to pick up on what Jacqui Dean was saying about the fact that all of us on the committee understood what the preamble of the bill means. For many organisations, including Christ\u2019s College, when they are dealing with trusts that are based in the past and with bequests that are from long ago, it is difficult for them to be always able to continue the exact purposes of those bequests and trusts. We understand that the administrative burden that can fall on organisations when they want to vary a trust can be very hard. A school has education purposes and it would like to see as much money as possible go directly to that; it is certainly not in our interests to put a further administrative burden on those organisations. We can understand why Christ\u2019s College instigated the bill, and why it wants the changes to be made. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000365\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003EHaving said that, I point out that when the committee came to analyse the bill a number of concerns were raised about the exact wording. Again, other speakers have referred to this. Firstly, it is a question of any inconsistency between the wording here and the wording in the Charitable Trusts Act. The Charitable Trusts Act does try to operate across a range of very different trusts, but the point is that charitable purposes are what should lie behind any situation where the Act comes into play. Therefore, the committee recommended changing the language so that it is consistent with the Charitable Trusts Act, and the board of governors at Christ\u2019s College was happy to go along with that. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000366\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003EAnother area where the committee wanted an amendment was to allow the governing body to use for another purpose excess income from the trusts that generate more than is necessary for their donated purpose. We were comfortable that this was consistent with the Charitable Trusts Act, but we needed to make sure that the language was correct. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000367\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003EThe area that I think concerned the committee the most, as Jacqui Dean alluded to, was the more general language about being able to extend a new purpose for the trust for the benefit of the college generally. Again, this is no black mark on the college itself; it was merely trying to create an environment in which it felt it could manage the bequests and the trusts in a way that was beneficial to the college. But we felt that it could spread things too far, particularly around the notion that perhaps the college may be undertaking activities that are not for educational purposes. They may be doing different kinds of activities that support the wider purposes of the college and the board of governors. We wanted to be able to keep some kind of management that was close to the idea of a charitable purpose. That is why we have inserted an amendment that requires trust properties to be used for charitable purposes. This is an area where it would have been easy for the committee to simply let that pass, but we wanted to make sure that these trusts are used, as closely as possible, for the purposes for which they were originally put forward. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000368\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003ESo following on from that, the committee is also inserting a requirement for the purpose of the trust to be as close as reasonably possible to the purpose for which the property was given. I do think that is important. Jacqui Dean has alluded to cases involving soldiers who died in the war, where money came from their families, and to trying to make sure there is a way of reflecting that. More broadly, we want to make sure that, particularly, the educational purposes of these trusts are kept in mind. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000369\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003EOn this side of the House we are obviously acutely aware that one of our former members, Dr Michael Cullen, has in this House expressed his gratitude to some people who helped him get his scholarship into Christ\u2019s College. Perhaps he did not express his gratitude in a way that noted just how grateful he was, but he certainly did note the people who had paid for his education through Christ\u2019s College. There was a scholarship that had a particular purpose, to allow someone like Michael Cullen, who would not otherwise have been able to afford to attend Christ\u2019s College, to be able to be there, and what great benefit the country has had from that scholarship. I am sure those farmers in the South Canterbury area, whom he alluded to, are very pleased they were able to put him through Christ\u2019s College. It is an important example of the fact that there are a lot of different trusts and scholarships go through Christ\u2019s College, and it is obviously important that in the future, if there is a need to make change, Christ\u2019s College will make that change and it will be as close as possible to the purposes of the original trust. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000370\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003EWe are happy to support the bill with those amendments. We think that this has been a good exercise in drawing the attention of the select committee and the House to the fact that we will need to amend private bills from time to time to ensure there is consistency. The governors of Christ\u2019s College have been helpful and have worked with the committee to ensure that we now have a workable situation whereby they can deal with trusts and the property of those trusts and can make changes, but that when they do make those changes it will be done for charitable purposes. Any changes will ensure that the property is used for a purpose that is as close as reasonably possible to the original giving of that trust. For all those reasons the Labour Party is very happy to support the second reading of this bill.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00220ee528dc-7870-4553-95ed-5ec0cab60f07\u0022 data-id=\u0022261cef88555b4a60901dc7196590e9dd\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000371\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220ee528dc-7870-4553-95ed-5ec0cab60f07\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022261cef88555b4a60901dc7196590e9dd\u0022\u003ECATHERINE DELAHUNTY (Green):\u003C/span\u003E I will start, as others have today, with a mihi to the wh\u0101nau, hap\u016B, and iwi of Sir Archie Taiaroa of Te \u0100ti Haunui-a-P\u0101p\u0101rangi, Ng\u0101ti T\u016Bwharetoa, Ng\u0101ti Apa, Ng\u0101ti Wairiki, and other iwi, and to the wh\u0101nau wh\u0101nui of Hauraki for the loss of Jim Nicholls, who was one of the rangatira of the area in which I live. I recognise those rangatira. What they have brought to this nation is very important to the Green Party. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000372\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220ee528dc-7870-4553-95ed-5ec0cab60f07\u0022\u003EI turn my attention to the Christ\u2019s College (Canterbury) Amendment Bill. The purpose of the bill is to change the trust deed of Christ\u2019s College. It is reasonably innocuous. It hardly caused a flood of submissions; in fact, there was only one, I believe, which was from the college itself. The Green Party voted against the bill at its first reading because we thought the manner of amending the trust deed lacked the checks and balances that other legislation involving trust deeds has upheld. However, the Government Administration Committee recommended that some changes be made to the wording, particularly in relation to new trust purposes. It is important to us that resources created for charitable purposes can be modernised without losing the overarching charitable purpose. We are in favour of the clauses amended as a result of the select committee\u2019s work, notably new section 5(3), inserted by clause 5, which requires that trust property be used for charitable purposes. I think it has been quite well explored. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000373\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220ee528dc-7870-4553-95ed-5ec0cab60f07\u0022\u003EAs we understand it, some major issues have been addressed, so the Green Party is happy to change its vote. That is why the select committee process is valuable. It allows us to do such things and to hear in depth the detail of legislation that can be improved. Then we can review whether we are voting the right way. Select committees provide an opportunity to improve badly drafted legislation and bring it into line with best practice. We all put together bills in haste, and it is great when they are brought into line with best practice. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000374\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220ee528dc-7870-4553-95ed-5ec0cab60f07\u0022\u003EWe are pleased to see that the select committee reported issues about the circumstances in which charitable trusts can be varied and a new trust purpose begun. We are pleased that these changes have been accepted by the instigators of the bill. We still have some concerns about the lack of independent oversight of the trust changes, such as churches have had in their deeds when that legislation came through the House. But we recognise that if we want to, we can make suggestions by way of an amendment during the Committee stage of the bill. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000375\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220ee528dc-7870-4553-95ed-5ec0cab60f07\u0022\u003EWe are pleased to be able to support this member\u2019s bill now that it has been tidied up without losing its original intent. We have no problem with varying trust deeds if they are done properly, and we will continue to seek improvement. As a smaller party we cannot be on the all the select committees, but we deeply value their work when they are able to improve a bill.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000376\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220ee528dc-7870-4553-95ed-5ec0cab60f07\u0022\u003EAs the education spokesperson for the Greens, I am much more concerned about the resourcing and development of the public school system and kura kaupapa for the benefit of all than I am about some of the wealthier schools in the country. I am deeply concerned about national standards, public-private partnerships, and special education in the public system. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000377\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220ee528dc-7870-4553-95ed-5ec0cab60f07\u0022\u003EHowever, we are focusing on the Christ\u2019s College bill, and the Green Party is happy to say that it can support it at the second reading debate. We look forward to the Committee stage as an opportunity to introduce amendments if we think they are needed. We recognise the effort that the member Nicky Wagner and the select committee have put in to improving this bill. Kia ora koutou.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022e2e2ee61-b3b9-4a89-bcc3-5b7be76c5825\u0022 data-id=\u0022faae6aa20cdb47e58015ca5b63eaf532\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000378\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e2e2ee61-b3b9-4a89-bcc3-5b7be76c5825\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022faae6aa20cdb47e58015ca5b63eaf532\u0022\u003ERAHUI KATENE (M\u0101ori Party\u2014Te Tai Tonga):\u003C/span\u003E I come to the Christ\u2019s College (Canterbury) Amendment Bill today as the MP for Te Tai Tonga, recognising the changed context between when this bill came before the Government Administration Committee and this point, the second reading. Between then and now\u2014this will be news to members\u2014a massive earthquake struck, which caused damage to the older buildings of this high school.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000379\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022426d7d1021e344f7853105f3ce0a441e\u0022\u003EGrant Robertson\u003C/span\u003E: Really? Why didn\u2019t anyone tell us?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000380\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e2e2ee61-b3b9-4a89-bcc3-5b7be76c5825\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00227c4c9958d62241388217a14a7bddf632\u0022\u003ERAHUI KATENE\u003C/span\u003E: Look, it is just completely missing from the media. I am sorry, but it has happened! Christ\u2019s College is one of New Zealand\u2019s oldest schools, being over 160 years old, and it was clearly distressing to witness the damage that happened when the chimneys tumbled down into the dining hall below. But like so many communities and families affected by the quake, it is not the damage to the bricks and mortar than have stood out in the response to this natural crisis. The spirit of generosity, indeed the expression of manaakitanga, has been very humbling to observe. I make reference to the support that Christ\u2019s College has offered, for example, to ULearn. It has opened additional classrooms to ULearn in order to replace the old Cranmer Centre, which is now no longer able to be used. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000381\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e2e2ee61-b3b9-4a89-bcc3-5b7be76c5825\u0022\u003EThe ability of Christ\u2019s College to think outside itself and adapt to circumstances is actually at the foundation of this bill, which is being presented for debate by the local member, Nicky Wagner. Specifically, this legislation enables the trustees to change the purposes of the original trusts. The change is required to remove difficulties in administering trusts vested in Christ\u2019s College that can no longer be applied in accordance with the original intentions of donors. There is, however, a commitment that trust property should still be applied for educational and charitable purposes, or near enough to that. But just as Christ\u2019s College opened its gates to consider the needs of ULearn during the aftermath of the earthquake, in this bill the college has recognised that the purposes and intentions of donors in the earlier days are no longer relevant to modern times. As Nicky Wagner has pointed out, outdated bequests to left-handed rifle shooters, sons of World War I and II soldiers, and pupils from orphanages really no longer fit the times, just as the prizes for sporting events that are no longer run and subjects that are no longer taught no longer fit the times. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000382\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e2e2ee61-b3b9-4a89-bcc3-5b7be76c5825\u0022\u003EThe bill allows trustees to vary the purposes of charitable trusts in certain circumstances. It will also allow the governing body to use for another purpose any excess income from trusts that generate more than is necessary for their donated purposes. That is consistent with the Charitable Trusts Act. The college\u2019s board of governors has assured Parliament that before exercising the power to vary the original purpose of a trust, it will complete a detailed review of the trust to ensure for the avoidance of doubt that the original purposes cannot continue to be met fully. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000383\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e2e2ee61-b3b9-4a89-bcc3-5b7be76c5825\u0022\u003EThe M\u0101ori Party is happy to support the college in updating the framework upon which its bequests and assets have been given over the years. This bill modifies the 1910 Christ\u2019s College (Canterbury) Act, seeking a law change that will enable the school to use the funds it has been privileged to receive in a way that is appropriate for this century, rather than the last. We have read the advice of the Government Administration Committee on the bill, and we are happy to extend our support for the further progress of a bill that is very much along the lines of providing a necessary and useful update.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022fbe3f87c-849c-4eee-84cc-119edeb1a681\u0022 data-id=\u0022c574abdf572f400ca4d87fe7debf1c00\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000384\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022fbe3f87c-849c-4eee-84cc-119edeb1a681\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022c574abdf572f400ca4d87fe7debf1c00\u0022\u003EAARON GILMORE (National):\u003C/span\u003E Unlike some families, in seven generations there has never been a Gilmore to have blessed the grounds of Christ\u2019s College as a student, and I suspect that in the next seven generations there probably will not be one, either. I think that in the 160-year history of Christchurch, Christ\u2019s College has represented all the things that are good and bad in Christchurch. In my own little world, I attended a school on the other side of town called Shirley Boys High School. We had constant battles against Christ\u2019s College on the rugby field and occasionally on the cricket field. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000385\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022fbe3f87c-849c-4eee-84cc-119edeb1a681\u0022\u003EIt gives me great pleasure to stand here today and support the further progression through this House of the Christ\u2019s College (Canterbury) Amendment Bill. Christ\u2019s College has an enviable reputation in Canterbury and in New Zealand, and this bill will help to enhance that. I just heard someone say jokingly before that left-handed rifle shooters will no longer receive scholarships. As a left-handed shooter, I am a bit devastated by that, I must say! I believe this bill puts into place in the legislation a tidy-up and a change of intention that I believe the people who made those bequests would be very happy about. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000386\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022fbe3f87c-849c-4eee-84cc-119edeb1a681\u0022\u003EI have had the pleasure of working on similar bills to this one that have been before this House\u2014in particular, the tidying-up of similar trusts relating to Anglican and Catholic societies, which had large numbers of trusts with small amounts of money. This bill in a very similar way goes towards tidying up uncertainties that may exist and applying them to things that make sense. It was good to see the Government Administration Committee put forward some of those tidy-up changes with regard to the Charitable Trusts Act. The same problems existed with regard to the Anglican and Catholic bills that came before the House. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000387\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022fbe3f87c-849c-4eee-84cc-119edeb1a681\u0022\u003EIt is also good that this bill has been brought to the House by the wonderful member Nicky Wagner, who I know has spent many years living in the area close to Christ\u2019s College. The land and the issues around the college have been very close to her heart. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000388\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022fbe3f87c-849c-4eee-84cc-119edeb1a681\u0022\u003EI will share a little story about Christ\u2019s College that I remember vividly. I had the misfortune of playing a game of cricket there a number of years ago. It was a two-innings game. In the first innings I was out first ball, which was very embarrassing. But I had the very great fortune\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000389\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022f5cf88bcabc8445fa1a6e88ae813266e\u0022\u003EHon Member\u003C/span\u003E: No kidding.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000390\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022fbe3f87c-849c-4eee-84cc-119edeb1a681\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002262159674e56f4327813a0ae2de6821ad\u0022\u003EAARON GILMORE\u003C/span\u003E: Yes, that was very embarrassing, but in the second innings of the game I managed to get 100 not out. I always remember that story about Christ\u2019s College and remember what a great school it is. The person who bowled me out with the first ball ended up playing cricket for New Zealand, and he was one of the great players from Christ\u2019s College. The reason I did not get out in the second innings was that he tore a ligament and could not bowl in that innings, so I was very happy about that. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000391\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022fbe3f87c-849c-4eee-84cc-119edeb1a681\u0022\u003ENow I have a 7-year-old son. We constantly drive past Christ\u2019s College, and he always calls it the Harry Potter school. Some members may know the grand hall that exists in Christ\u2019s College. It is very similar to the grand hall that is used in the Harry Potter movies. The fact that it survived the earthquake, which Rahui mentioned earlier on, is an interesting example of how great that school is and of how well it was built. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000392\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022fbe3f87c-849c-4eee-84cc-119edeb1a681\u0022\u003EThe funds discussed in this bill could be applied to the school in future to send students there to get the benefit of the great education that the school provides. I look forward to more good students coming out of that school. It has been pointed out that Dr Michael Cullen was an ex-pupil, as was Robbie Deans, one of the great Cantabrians, who has been lent to Australia to basically ruin his career and blot his copybook before he comes back and takes the Canterbury Crusaders to another Super 15 title, which is what I think will happen. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000393\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022fbe3f87c-849c-4eee-84cc-119edeb1a681\u0022\u003EOne of the interesting things about the bequests and changes is that a number of very wealthy former students of Christ\u2019s College have not been touched on. They may be able to donate their own funds in future to this school or to some of the trusts. There are people like Bill Hamilton, the founder of HamiltonJet. He was one of New Zealand\u2019s great business people. That gentleman was an former pupil, and he did a lot of good things not just for the school but also for the community of Christchurch and New Zealand. Another great former pupil of the school is Sam Neill, a famous New Zealand actor. I suspect that he will also donate handsomely to the school, and maybe even to some of the trusts and organisations. That may occur with these changes. The school has had some other great former pupils, like Sir Charles Upham, New Zealand\u2019s only VC \u0026amp; Bar. The spectrum of politics, sport, and business shows us of the breadth of students who have come from this fine institution. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000394\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022fbe3f87c-849c-4eee-84cc-119edeb1a681\u0022\u003EThis bill, in terms of where we are in its second reading, goes only to help enhance the quality of students in the future, and not just so that we may have left-handed shooters, or the situation where one scholarship was awarded to the person who came second in the under-15 hurdles, as Mrs Wagner just informed me. I say good on the person who had that scholarship put into an enactment, but this legislation\u2019s tidy-up will mean that many other students will benefit from it for many years to come. I think that is a good thing. Thank you very much.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022 data-id=\u0022db982f4b071649759bf7d9fc07175253\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000395\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022db982f4b071649759bf7d9fc07175253\u0022\u003ECHRIS HIPKINS (Labour\u2014Rimutaka):\u003C/span\u003E It is always privilege to follow a speaker as eloquent as Mr Gilmore. I reassure him, despite what he may think, that the college was not named after him. However, I was impressed at the way in which he managed to work Harry Potter into his speech. I want to recap on what a good job the Government Administration Committee did on this bill\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000396\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022e8f950c22f014905b2db02f098b4c229\u0022\u003EGrant Robertson\u003C/span\u003E: Great committee.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000397\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002203f687f662e64437a575ef16c0f1dedf\u0022\u003ECHRIS HIPKINS\u003C/span\u003E: The all-powerful Government Administration Committee is chaired by the Hon David Parker, who did a sterling job. The committee is very ably deputy chaired by Jacqui Dean from the National Party, and she is accompanied by Mr John Hayes, who is always a beacon of light and hope. He is a bit like the Waldorf to Allan Peachey\u2019s Statler; he always brings joy to the room whenever he arrives at the Government Administration Committee.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000398\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022fbe3f87c-849c-4eee-84cc-119edeb1a681\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022aec7e689867c4b99866a7c1b751d5040\u0022\u003EAaron Gilmore\u003C/span\u003E: That was actually funny.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000399\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002253c14b34c71f498f871fda059b321c84\u0022\u003ECHRIS HIPKINS\u003C/span\u003E: I thought it was quite good. I enjoyed the hearings on this bill. The Government Administration Committee took it very seriously, as we do all of the legislation referred to us. Not very much gets referred to the all-powerful Government Administration Committee and it is always a privilege to have a piece of legislation that we can actually do something with. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000400\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003EWe raised a number of concerns throughout the hearings on this legislation. The first concern was whether there was any justification for the wording in the bill being different from the wording in the Charitable Trusts Act. I put that question to the college. The college lawyers, who appeared before the committee several times, could not really give us a good quality reason why it needed to be different from the Charitable Trusts Act. They had drafted the bill in such a way that it did not link to what the Charitable Trusts Act said, and I thought there may have been a reason for that. They were unable to give us that reason, so we thought that in terms of the legal situation it was probably safer to go back to the wording of the Charitable Trusts Act so that if at any point there is a dispute about what this bill is intended to achieve, the courts will have a body of case law already there. There is a strong body of law already around the Charitable Trusts Act, and we wanted to make sure that that was not overridden simply by the minor wording changes that the original draft of the bill contained. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000401\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003EThe committee also recommended inserting a new section to allow the governing body to use for another purpose excess income from trusts that generate more than is necessary for the donated purpose. I think that is quite important, and it is consistent with the provisions in the Charitable Trusts Act. We saw no reason why those trusts should continue to grow unnecessarily, simply because the purpose does not require the amount of money that trusts are able to generate, so that was a fairly pragmatic and sensible thing to do. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000402\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003EThe committee was concerned about what some of the more redundant trusts involved and whether it would be fair to say they were redundant, and we had robust discussions with the college about this. One trust that was listed in the schedules we were given by the college related to providing financial support to a student experiencing hardship. The committee put some pretty tough questions to the college as to why it needed to change that trust deed. To this day I do not believe that the college could seriously put its hand on its heart and say that there are no students experiencing financial difficulties and therefore it could not dispense that money somehow. The college gave us a variety of reasons, and in the end, after we had quite a long discussion about it, I was satisfied that there was justification for rearranging the trust as part of the wider rearrangement of the trusts it is doing. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000403\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003EWe were concerned that the bill as introduced was too general in describing a purpose for a trust as for the benefit of the college. \u201CFor the benefit of the college\u201D could have included renovating the grand hall that Aaron Gilmore talked about before and which he likened to the grand hall in the Harry Potter books. We thought that although that would certainly be for the benefit of the college, it would probably be inconsistent with what the money was gifted to the college for in the first place. We wanted to make sure that it was for charitable purposes, not simply for the benefit of the college, and that was one of the changes we made by inserting a requirement for trust property to be used for charitable purposes. Again, I think that was a fairly sensible amendment. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000404\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003EThe committee also recommended inserting a requirement for a new purpose of a trust so that it is to be as close as reasonably possible to the purpose for which the property was given. In the case of the example I mentioned before\u2014supporting students who might otherwise be in financial hardship\u2014if there were reasons why the trust as it stood could not practically be used for that purpose, we wanted to make sure that it was applied in such a way that it was as close as possible to that purpose. For example, it could be that a number of very small trust funds could be grouped together and a common purpose found for them that was as consistent as possible with the original trust funds, but accumulating a more substantial sum of money so that it could be a more meaningful grant, and so on. I think that is very sensible. We did not want the college to be able to simply say \u201CWell we don\u2019t think this is important any more so we\u2019re going to focus on our priorities.\u201D, potentially against the wishes of the people who had donated the money. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000405\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003EI think it is really important, when we are talking about bequests and donations, that we show good faith towards the people who make those kinds of donations and bequests. I think that if we create a situation whereby somebody cannot be certain when giving money to any kind of trust that it will be applied to the purpose that they wish it to be, they will be more reluctant to do so. We need to tread very carefully to ensure that we do not create a precedent that allows a college such as Christ\u2019s College to apply the funds in such a way that was never intended by the donor. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000406\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003EWe did look at the Anglican, Presbyterian, Catholic, and Methodist Churches and at the way in which they had brought similar legislation before the House. We modelled a lot of our discussion around the provisions in that legislation to ensure that it was consistent. I will be interested to look at the Supplementary Order Paper that the Greens will put forward. I understand that they want to put forward a Supplementary Order Paper that strengthens some of the checks and balances in a similar sort of way as the Methodist Church of Australasia in New Zealand Act does. At the moment the bill, even as reported from the select committee, does not contain quite as fulsome a checks and balance process as the legislation regarding the Methodist Church does. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000407\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003EGenerally speaking, the Labour Party is comfortable with this bill. We put some pretty tough questions to the college during the course of the hearings on the bill. I was pretty comfortable that the college answered the concerns and the questions we raised. I acknowledge Nicky Wagner. She sat through all of the committee\u2019s deliberations on this legislation. It was a test of stamina and I was impressed that she had the perseverance. I acknowledge her contribution and that of the other committee members. Overall it is good legislation and I commend it to the House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022749d97b8-a772-4227-83da-b5e264c37bc0\u0022 data-id=\u0022c73b5989119f45b3b290f317a4b57f28\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000408\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022749d97b8-a772-4227-83da-b5e264c37bc0\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022c73b5989119f45b3b290f317a4b57f28\u0022\u003EALLAN PEACHEY (National\u2014T\u0101maki):\u003C/span\u003E It is interesting that I have been given an opportunity to speak on the second reading of the Christ\u2019s College (Canterbury) Amendment Bill. I am not from Christchurch and I am certainly not an old boy of Christ\u2019s College. In fact, my schooling probably could not be any more different from what one would have had at Christ\u2019s College. Ruapehu College is a long way from the august, historic grounds of Christ\u2019s College. In fact, I suspect that for the first time ever Ruapehu College and Christ\u2019s College have been mentioned in the same sentence\u2014and it happened in this Parliament. There are certainly no Ruapehu College amendment bills on the books that I am aware of. I doubt whether I will ever have the privilege, unlike my fine colleague Nicky Wagner, of bringing such a bill to the House. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000409\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022749d97b8-a772-4227-83da-b5e264c37bc0\u0022\u003EPerhaps the most enjoyable part of the debate this afternoon has been hearing of Mr Gilmore\u2019s experiences of playing cricket on the hallowed green grounds of Christ\u2019s College, and noting that he made a duck. I once made a duck in an interschool cricket match. It was against Taihape College. I remember it well. It was 45 years ago and it was my first game as the captain of the Ruapehu College first eleven.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000410\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a7184b9d2b76487cb70c237fd2633d43\u0022\u003EGrant Robertson\u003C/span\u003E: There were only 10 players.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000411\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022749d97b8-a772-4227-83da-b5e264c37bc0\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00226e9c0498818a4335ba5e9bcdda7a483a\u0022\u003EALLAN PEACHEY\u003C/span\u003E: We always struggled to have 11 players; I can tell Mr Robertson that I think my sister filled in. I remember it well. We arrived at the ground in Taihape and the first thing we had to do was clear the sheep off the paddock. It was on a school day, so classes were in. We had to mop up the droppings, mark our own wicket, get changed behind the tree, and proceed to play the game. But it was very character-building, I am bound to say. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000412\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022749d97b8-a772-4227-83da-b5e264c37bc0\u0022\u003EThis is a very simple bill. It amends the Christ\u2019s College (Canterbury) Act 1910 to remove difficulties in administering property vested in the college. I suppose we could say it is legislation for pulling things into the 21st century. I have been very impressed during the debate by all the great talk of the Government Administration Committee\u2014is that what it is called?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000413\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00229efe3af456144374835cfde70a479a87\u0022\u003EGrant Robertson\u003C/span\u003E: That\u2019s right.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000414\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022749d97b8-a772-4227-83da-b5e264c37bc0\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022fd842486c57f49088bd94310898c00fb\u0022\u003EALLAN PEACHEY\u003C/span\u003E: I had never heard of it before. But clearly it plays a very important role in this Parliament, because it gives Chris Hipkins something to do. It gives the young man some purpose in life, so all credit for that to Nicky Wagner. I commend the committee for tightening up the provisions of the proposed bill, and for calling on the wording of the Charities Act. I think it shows the value of having a committee like that, and of the select committee process generally. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000415\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022749d97b8-a772-4227-83da-b5e264c37bc0\u0022\u003EI conclude my brief remarks by paying tribute to the member whose name this bill is in. Nicky Wagner is a very fine representative of Christchurch. She works very hard for the people of Christchurch. I have spent time with her in central Christchurch and know how widely recognised and appreciated is the work that she has done. It is to Nicky Wagner\u2019s credit that the bill has come for its second reading. In the great tradition of Ruapehu College I wish Christ\u2019s College well, and commend the bill to the House. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022ffff330f-1757-41d6-9973-25244f0fdada\u0022 data-id=\u0022609c097abb3c4353a96a86c7d49433b2\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000416\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ffff330f-1757-41d6-9973-25244f0fdada\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022609c097abb3c4353a96a86c7d49433b2\u0022\u003ECOLIN KING (National\u2014Kaik\u014Dura):\u003C/span\u003E It is a pleasure to speak during this second reading of the Christ\u2019s College (Canterbury) Amendment Bill, and I must pay my respects to all those who have spoken before me. I also recognise those families in North Canterbury, which is the bottom end of the Kaik\u014Dura electorate, who still\u2014to this very day\u2014seek out such colleges to send their children to. No doubt they include families whose bequests have brought about the situation we are now confronted with, with regard to this particular bill. I also thank the Government Administration Committee members for their diligence, and there is no doubt that their advice, which was taken and applied to new section 5(4), inserted by clause 5, of this legislation, is very appropriate. If we just turn our minds back to clause 4, earlier in the legislation, about the purpose, we understand just how important it is to tie in things in a seemly way, and I am quite confident that the integrity of the trustees, principal, and teachers at Christ\u2019s College will ensure that. One has to marvel at the strength of the old boys\u2019 network that emanates out of Christ\u2019s College. No doubt there will be a very strong connection with families to ensure that the provisions of this particular bill will not be abused. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000417\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ffff330f-1757-41d6-9973-25244f0fdada\u0022\u003EWhen one thinks about the time that Christ\u2019s College has been in existence, one might think that some 100,000 pupils had gone through that college, but in fact about 13,000 pupils have gone through. Today there are some 660 students at that college: 220 boarders who live there, and no doubt travel from all over the country to get there, and 440 day boys, as they are described. As a college it certainly measures up well with regard to any other schools throughout the country. The school is a product of the Anglican settlement of Canterbury in the 1850s, and in fact when we look around the Parliament building that we have here today, we see that the college dates from the very beginning of our democracy. So there is great history in Christ\u2019s College, and it is one that we are particularly proud of. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000418\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ffff330f-1757-41d6-9973-25244f0fdada\u0022\u003EWhen we look at the structure of the philanthropy that has been displayed towards Christ\u2019s College, we understand that the solution we are dealing with here will be sensible and pragmatic. There are 28 trusts. If we consider the Charitable Trusts Act 1957, we find a provision there to seek a variation from the original trust deed, but that would require trustees to go to the High Court for that approval, not just once for all the 28 trusts but for each variation to each trust deed. One would be required, effectively, to seek 28 High Court decisions to get the changes that are necessary. It is with great pleasure that I see Dr Hutchison arriving, and on that basis I have great passion and enthusiasm for the Christ\u2019s College (Canterbury) Amendment Bill to proceed. Thank you very much.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000419\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ffff330f-1757-41d6-9973-25244f0fdada\u0022\u003EBill read a second time.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n    \u003C/div\u003E\n    \u003Cdiv class=\u0022HpsHansard\u0022\u003E\n      \u003Cp\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsProceedingHeading\u0022\u003EBills\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000420\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u00228866ee9b9a544cb283816309b5b4b1a7\u0022\u003EFranklin District Council (Contribution to Funding of Museums) Amendment Bill\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000421\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u00221cdacefb158a4ab0a9a25830a7db96a0\u0022\u003ESecond Reading\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022cfdabe42-521a-4dca-afab-3e781731a130\u0022 data-id=\u0022d79ebc071bca458fbd2b96ccbace8b0d\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000422\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cfdabe42-521a-4dca-afab-3e781731a130\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022d79ebc071bca458fbd2b96ccbace8b0d\u0022\u003EDr PAUL HUTCHISON (National\u2014Hunua):\u003C/span\u003E I move, That the Franklin District Council (Contribution to Funding of Museums) Amendment Bill be now read a second time. I firstly pay tribute to my colleague Colin King for making an excellent speech in his last contribution. He certainly saved my skin. I note that the Local Government and Environment Committee has advised against passing this bill, due to the restructure of the councils in the Auckland region. It is not often that a bill such as this is enthusiastically and unanimously supported in Parliament in its first reading, but, due to a twist of circumstances, is likely to be voted down today. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000423\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002241707445160744bcb0dec7542861c018\u0022\u003EGrant Robertson\u003C/span\u003E: No reflection on the member. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000424\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cfdabe42-521a-4dca-afab-3e781731a130\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002270264bdb7b834b9ab87430a507c1b666\u0022\u003EDr PAUL HUTCHISON\u003C/span\u003E: There is no reflection, whatsoever. The purpose of the Franklin District Council (Contribution to Funding of Museums) Amendment Bill is to amend the Auckland War Memorial Museum Act 1996 and the Museum of Transport and Technology Act 2000 to ensure that the levies for the museums are calculated only on the basis of the population of the Franklin District that is contained within the boundaries of the Auckland region, and not that contained within the boundaries of the Waikato region.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000425\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cfdabe42-521a-4dca-afab-3e781731a130\u0022\u003EUndoubtedly, this bill was initiated to right a wrong, whereby people living in that area were inappropriately being given a double levy\u2014firstly, from the Auckland museums, and, secondly, from Environment Waikato. In other words, it was a double whammy. Those people are very fine people; they come from a wonderful part of New Zealand: Glen Murray, Port Waikato, Limestone Downs, Onewhero, and the Waik\u0101retu Valley. They are all magnificent parts of our fine country, and it is indeed right and proper that this anomaly is righted.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000426\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cfdabe42-521a-4dca-afab-3e781731a130\u0022\u003EIt is also interesting to note that the Franklin District Council by land mass is two-thirds in the Waikato area, but by population two-thirds live across the river in the Auckland area.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000427\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cfdabe42-521a-4dca-afab-3e781731a130\u0022\u003EThe main provision of the bill amends both Acts by inserting a new definition of \u201Cdistrict\u201D. Clauses 5 and 7 insert into both Acts the following definition of \u201Cdistrict\u201D: \u201Cdistrict, in relation to the Franklin District Council, excludes any part of the district of the Council that is not within the boundaries of the region of the Auckland Regional Council.\u201D\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000428\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cfdabe42-521a-4dca-afab-3e781731a130\u0022\u003EIn terms of background, as I said before, this bill was to right an anomaly. I must emphasise that both of those two museums\u2014the Museum of Transport and Technology and the Auckland War Memorial Museum\u2014are iconic institutions and deserve support, but those living in the Waikato part of the Franklin District were perhaps being unfairly treated. The computation of the levies is based on the population living in the Auckland region.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000429\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cfdabe42-521a-4dca-afab-3e781731a130\u0022\u003EIn terms of the Auckland governance reforms, the Local Government and Environment Committee considered that because they were going to happen anyway, the bill would be put aside until it could be sorted out. In some ways it is a bit of a shame that the bill did not go straight through, because, as I said, it was enthusiastically and unanimously embraced by this House. I think there were certainly a lot of unknowns about how long it would take to put the royal commission\u2019s recommendations into law, and, as we all know, the new Auckland Council will come into being on 1 November of this year.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000430\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cfdabe42-521a-4dca-afab-3e781731a130\u0022\u003EI remind the Opposition that it was really interesting when Phil Twyford and a team from Labour came to Pukekohe and pointed out that they supported splitting Franklin at the river, as was recommended by the royal commission.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000431\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cfdabe42-521a-4dca-afab-3e781731a130\u0022\u003EThe provisions in the Local Government (Auckland Transitional Provisions) Act 2010 make the intent of this bill redundant, because the Act repeals the definition of contributing authorities and replaces it with a definition of Auckland Council. This means that from 1 November the boards of the two museums may levy the Auckland Council only for 2011 and subsequent years. Those levies will be subject to maximum values calculated on the basis of capital value and population within the territory of the new Auckland Council. Local authorities and ratepayers outside the boundaries of account of the Auckland region cannot be liable for those levies.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000432\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cfdabe42-521a-4dca-afab-3e781731a130\u0022\u003EIt is important to point out that the Franklin District Council acknowledges that the intent of the bill is met by the Local Government (Auckland Transitional Provisions) Act. However, it had interpreted that the relevant provisions would come into effect on 1 July rather than 1 November. Therefore, the Franklin District Council had not raised the necessary levies from properties within the Environment Waikato part of its district from 1 July this year. The council told the committee that, as a result, there will be a deficit of approximately $280,000\u2014about $198,000 for the Auckland War Memorial Museum and $82,000 for the Museum of Transport and Technology\u2014once its assets are transferred to the new Auckland Council. In a convoluted sort of way, that seems a little bit equitable, because at least this year people in the Waikato part were not rated. However, the rates have been taken out of a reserve fund that the Franklin District Council has, and that will mean that its contribution at the wash-up of the new Auckland Council will be less than it would be otherwise.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000433\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cfdabe42-521a-4dca-afab-3e781731a130\u0022\u003EAs I mentioned, the Franklin District Council requested that the committee recommend that the bill be enacted with a retrospective commencement date and then repealed when the provision in the Local Government (Auckland Transitional Provisions) Act came into effect. The committee was advised that the Acts pertaining to the two museums required their boards to fix the amount to be levied against each of the contributing councils for the 2010-11 financial year by 30 April. So enacting the bill with a commencement date of 1 July would, therefore, not resolve the matter. The committee said furthermore that it was greatly concerned that this problem has arisen and that the ratepayers and the museums could be affected, but that it did not believe it was Parliament\u2019s role to resolve the issue. It also said that retrospective legislation of this kind in a local bill could set an undesirable precedent, so, therefore, it recommended that the bill not be passed.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000434\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cfdabe42-521a-4dca-afab-3e781731a130\u0022\u003EThis afternoon I spoke to Sally Davis, the chief executive of the Franklin District Council, and she expressed her concern that the residents of Franklin have not been treated well. I think a message for the new mayor and the council of the Auckland City is that they should ensure that the rural parts of the new Auckland super-city are promoted and not forgotten. I hope that message will be supported throughout this House, because the rural parts of the new Auckland region, mainly composing Franklin and Rodney, are about 75 percent of the land mass of the new city but will have only two representatives on the new council of 21. So it is vital that the new council supports both Franklin and Rodney and the rural sector in terms of its action over the years ahead. So thank you, Mr Speaker, for the opportunity to speak on this bill. It is appropriate that it be discharged.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00221fb8d8db-3e96-49c7-ab1c-b7916a50e30e\u0022 data-id=\u00221c7cbe83ed4e432eace64ac0e2b402fd\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000435\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221fb8d8db-3e96-49c7-ab1c-b7916a50e30e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00221c7cbe83ed4e432eace64ac0e2b402fd\u0022\u003EHon STEVE CHADWICK (Labour):\u003C/span\u003E I am sure that the good member for Hunua, Dr Paul Hutchison, has represented his electorate very ably in the issue of the Franklin District Council (Contribution to Funding of Museums) Amendment Bill, but this issue has simply been superseded. It has been superseded by the decisions made by Rodney Hide, which were really about fast tracking Auckland governance. He left the great fight that the member Paul Hutchison was fighting for the good people of Hunua in the slipstream.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000436\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002270dd644d-8bcf-40dc-998a-887d62d24a76\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022cca789edc2774f2eb395e98938b8c4fc\u0022\u003EMoana Mackey\u003C/span\u003E: Collateral damage.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000437\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221fb8d8db-3e96-49c7-ab1c-b7916a50e30e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022495eb2a87db04e7c9578704fc8d1a370\u0022\u003EHon STEVE CHADWICK\u003C/span\u003E: A bit of collateral damage; he fought the good fight well. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000438\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221fb8d8db-3e96-49c7-ab1c-b7916a50e30e\u0022\u003EWhen we began the process of looking at Auckland governance, we began it very moderately. It began in 2006 and everybody agreed with a memorandum of the mayors of Auckland that it was a very good idea to start looking at regionalisation and the prospect of a super-city. Labour actually initiated that process. It moved along at a moderate pace with the royal commission report, until the findings of the royal commission report when this Government came into office and gave the whole power to organise and reorganise the Auckland super-city to a Minister in another party. What a shambles has ensued from that time! \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000439\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221fb8d8db-3e96-49c7-ab1c-b7916a50e30e\u0022\u003EI pick up on a couple of points that the member for Hunua raised. The good people of Hamilton, Rodney, and Franklin all enjoy the amenities of the Museum of Transport and Technology and the Auckland War Memorial Museum. When we are looking at regionalisation of iconic institutions like the Auckland War Memorial Museum, we do not want to be quite so parochial about who contributes to the long-term future of the Auckland Museum and the Museum of Transport and Technology. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000440\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221fb8d8db-3e96-49c7-ab1c-b7916a50e30e\u0022\u003EIt was Labour, again, that brought in the Auckland Regional Amenities Funding Bill, which we all supported; I was on the Local Government and Environment Committee. National supported the legislation only in the dying hours of the election campaign. Only then did it say that it was a great idea and it would be a vote loser if National did not support it, so National decided that it was all in favour of it. It certainly was not in support of it right through the select committee process, until the end. National decided that the Auckland Regional Amenities Funding Bill was great, and that it would keep afloat iconic institutions like the Auckland Art Gallery, the Museum of Transport and Technology, Coastguard Northern Region, and some of the wonderful institutions of Auckland. What a great initiative that was, too. For pure popular demand National decided that it would hop on board and support it. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000441\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221fb8d8db-3e96-49c7-ab1c-b7916a50e30e\u0022\u003EWe are trying to encourage all regions of New Zealand to support these icons. There is a big anniversary coming up for the Auckland War Memorial Museum that I am sure all of New Zealand will enjoy. The 100th anniversary of the beginning of the Great War is not far away; the planning is all under way.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000442\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221fb8d8db-3e96-49c7-ab1c-b7916a50e30e\u0022\u003EThe principle of this bill was about apportioning the amount of rates from Franklin that would have to be involved in the Auckland regional amenities legislation. It has simply been superseded, and for that reason alone, we are not passing this bill. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000443\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221fb8d8db-3e96-49c7-ab1c-b7916a50e30e\u0022\u003EIt is interesting that I hear in the mayoralty campaigns in Wellington Mayor Kerry Prendergast saying that Wellington needs a regional amenities funding bill, so we can work much more closely with all the outlying district councils. Those districts enjoy the benefits of some of the wonderful icons of Wellington like the International Festival of the Arts, the opera, and the Vector Wellington Orchestra, which is under a great threat at the moment from Creative New Zealand\u2019s reorganisation of funding lines. As a regional orchestra, it is saying that it has no long-term certainty for funding, at all. That is a Wellington issue. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000444\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221fb8d8db-3e96-49c7-ab1c-b7916a50e30e\u0022\u003EIt is the same sort of issue that we heard in Auckland about the Auckland Philharmonia Orchestra; I am sure the good member opposite has gone to enjoy the Auckland Philharmonia Orchestra. I am sure he does not see that it belongs only to the good people of Auckland; in fact, people from the Bay of Plenty, Rotorua, Hamilton, and Rodney all come into Auckland to enjoy these amenities and their benefits. A proportion of rates had to be fairly apportioned to the councils that came under that Auckland Regional Amenities Funding Bill. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000445\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221fb8d8db-3e96-49c7-ab1c-b7916a50e30e\u0022\u003EI think the process under the super-city restructure for the arts and for iconic institutions like the Auckland Museum has been really poorly managed by Rodney Hide in the Auckland super-city legislation. I have been to meet the staff of the Auckland War Memorial Museum and the Auckland Art Gallery, and they are saying that they are not really sure where they fit. They feel like third-tier organisations in the Auckland super-city and that they will actually come under an Auckland events centre. They are really worried about that generic management of great institutions like the Auckland War Memorial Museum. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000446\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221fb8d8db-3e96-49c7-ab1c-b7916a50e30e\u0022\u003ERodney Hide certainly has not got right the Auckland super-city restructuring in terms of arts and valued institutions. There will be problems. In fact, there may need to be legislation when the Auckland super-city restructuring all shakes down. What impact will it really have on the Auckland Museum and on the Museum of Transport and Technology? There may need to be legislative changes that people have not even anticipated. It is definitely a shambles up in Auckland at the moment for the arts community. That is simply because of the speed with which this Government was determined, with Rodney Hide in charge, to get a tick in the book and get this all implemented, tickety-boo, by this election. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000447\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221fb8d8db-3e96-49c7-ab1c-b7916a50e30e\u0022\u003EWe would have taken a much longer and more measured approach to looking at what would be the effect of this change, instead of this rapid and rather hasty implementation without people having a say. I have met people in Auckland who do not even understand what district they are in in the super-city. They do not even know which ward to vote for, because they have not participated or been made aware, until the billboards went up, which part of Auckland they belong to. The consultation with the good people of Auckland has been simply shabby. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000448\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221fb8d8db-3e96-49c7-ab1c-b7916a50e30e\u0022\u003ELabour will be opposing this bill because we agree with the Local Government and Environment Committee that it has been superseded. All the efforts in the past that caused such stress to the people of Waikato, Franklin, and Hunua about whether they were in or out have been superseded. They had to sit and wait, then get on the streets and have a petition signed by 10 percent of the electors of each of the regions\u2014140,000 from Auckland, 40,000 from Waikato, and 6,000 from Franklin were unsure about the boundaries. These are good voters. These constituents were totally confused about the boundaries in the super-city. Now those people do not need to worry any longer, apparently, because this bill is not going to happen. Those people will not have to contribute to the Auckland regional amenities fund.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022749d97b8-a772-4227-83da-b5e264c37bc0\u0022 data-id=\u0022e7e03e5a28fb46c29718984a1274aee7\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000449\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022749d97b8-a772-4227-83da-b5e264c37bc0\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022e7e03e5a28fb46c29718984a1274aee7\u0022\u003EALLAN PEACHEY (National\u2014T\u0101maki):\u003C/span\u003E I commend the member for Hunua, Dr Paul Hutchison, for the logic, reason, and structure that he took in his introductory speech on the Franklin District Council (Contribution to Funding of Museums) Amendment Bill. I contrast that with the irrelevance of the speech from the Labour list member, Steve Chadwick. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000450\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022749d97b8-a772-4227-83da-b5e264c37bc0\u0022\u003EI wonder whether I can continue with the theme of my speech about Christ\u2019s College and devote the next 5 minutes to the governance of Ruapehu College. Maybe in 5 minutes time I will have achieved my objective for the day in getting the name of my old school mentioned in Hansard more often than that fine school in Canterbury. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000451\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022749d97b8-a772-4227-83da-b5e264c37bc0\u0022\u003EI seem to recall that I spoke in the first reading of this bill in favour of it being referred to the Local Government and Environment Committee. I now find myself speaking in support of the select committee\u2019s recommendation that this bill not be passed, because of the restructuring of governance in the wider Auckland area. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000452\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022749d97b8-a772-4227-83da-b5e264c37bc0\u0022\u003EThe need for this bill came about in the first place because of two pieces of legislation, the Auckland War Memorial Museum Act 1996 and the Museum of Transport and Technology Act 2000. They required the Franklin district to make a contribution on the basis of population to the running costs of both of those institutions. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000453\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022749d97b8-a772-4227-83da-b5e264c37bc0\u0022\u003EThe select committee came to the view, as I have said, that this bill is no longer required. I note with interest and empathy Dr Hutchison\u2019s very strong support for the area and his sense of representing his community in this House in the very best possible way. He has done that, and all credit to him for it, but it really is a simple matter: since this bill was introduced, there has been a major restructuring of the governance of the Auckland region.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000454\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022749d97b8-a772-4227-83da-b5e264c37bc0\u0022\u003EI think the elections for the new council have started. I seem to recall that my ballot papers arrived on Monday. I will no doubt exercise my democratic right, cast my vote, and ensure that as many candidates as possible who identify with the left of politics in New Zealand do not get elected. I guess that was one of the great things about going to Ruapehu College\u2014that the school was always represented in an electorate that returned a National member year after year after year. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000455\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022749d97b8-a772-4227-83da-b5e264c37bc0\u0022\u003EIn conclusion, I say that this bill will not be passed. There is no longer any necessity for it to be passed, and I think it can now be dispatched reasonably quickly. Thank you.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022cbc37df2-57ae-4536-94ed-a2e39eecd585\u0022 data-id=\u0022beb9b57fedec4dc9b13491564469bfbf\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000456\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cbc37df2-57ae-4536-94ed-a2e39eecd585\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022beb9b57fedec4dc9b13491564469bfbf\u0022\u003EPHIL TWYFORD (Labour):\u003C/span\u003E I want to pay tribute to the member for Hunua, Dr Paul Hutchison, who is coming to the end of a fine political career. He was highly regarded by the people in the Hunua district. The member for Hunua stood up\u2014briefly\u2014and articulated the fears and concerns of his constituents. He did it once, then he was steamrollered by the National Party. Since then he has been very, very quiet about how the people of Hunua feel about the super-city. This bill we are debating tonight, the Franklin District Council (Contribution to Funding of Museums) Amendment Bill, reflects the concerns and the fears that the people in that member\u2019s electorate have about the way the National-ACT Government has shafted democracy in Auckland. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000457\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cbc37df2-57ae-4536-94ed-a2e39eecd585\u0022\u003EIf there is one man whom Dr Paul Hutchison has to blame for the impending finale of his political career, it is Rodney Hide. Rodney Hide was set up by this Government to do its dirty work. It gave him the job of restructuring Auckland governance because it thought that he would be able to do this very dangerous, high-risk job, and he would attract all the political flack, then when things got out of hand the Prime Minister would be able to shrug and say: \u201CThat\u2019s just Rodney Hide, not us.\u201D But Rodney Hide\u2019s credibility as the Minister of Local Government, who is the Minister responsible for creating the Auckland super-city, is so utterly tarnished and damaged not only because of what he has done to Auckland democracy but also because of a list of things as long as your arm that have destroyed the credibility of the Minister of Local Government. I am not going to detail that full list, because I think the House and New Zealanders who are listening will know that he is the most damaged man in New Zealand politics.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000458\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cbc37df2-57ae-4536-94ed-a2e39eecd585\u0022\u003EThe consequence of the damage to Rodney Hide\u2019s credibility has been that the Auckland reforms are completely tarnished in the eyes of Aucklanders, and Rodney Hide\u2019s political carcass is hanging around the neck of this Government. The people of Franklin\u2014the people who asked for this bill to be brought to the House\u2014regret it. They regret that they were dragged, kicking and screaming, by Rodney Hide into the Auckland super-city, and the belated and rather modest attempts that Dr Paul Hutchison made to express their concerns did not make the slightest bit of difference. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000459\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cbc37df2-57ae-4536-94ed-a2e39eecd585\u0022\u003EThe people of Franklin, like the people of Rodney and like the people right across the Auckland isthmus, are disillusioned and disenchanted, and there are plenty of reasons why. It is not just because they were roped into paying a certain amount every year through their rates for institutions like the Museum of Transport and Technology or the Auckland War Memorial Museum, which is what this bill initially attempted to deal with; it is because they have lost their democratic voice in local government. Through the setting up of council-controlled organisations by the National-ACT Government, 75 percent of local government has been corporatised. [Interruption] The member Steven Joyce was responsible for insisting at Cabinet, against the advice of Treasury and two other Government departments, on corporatising transport, and that is the very thing that the people of Franklin resent, because it has been imposed on them. He insisted on having an undemocratic corporate model for the Transport Agency, which is going to spend more than half the rates of the people of Franklin. What democratic say will they have over his corporate jack-up of a super-city? They will have very little say, and that is why the people of Franklin are concerned. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000460\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cbc37df2-57ae-4536-94ed-a2e39eecd585\u0022\u003EThe other reason they are concerned is that they are worried they will lose their voice and that they will lose the identity of the region of Franklin in this super-city. They have good reason to be afraid, because this ACT-National Government has taken away the powers of local communities. It has set up these toothless local boards, which have no ability to make by-laws. Steven Joyce\u2019s Transport Agency has the ability to make by-laws, and it is run by a bunch of hand-picked corporate directors. For the people of Franklin, their local board under this super-city will not even have the ability to make a by-law. They will have to get on their knees and beg the Auckland Council to make a by-law for the region of Franklin. Well, how democratic is that? It is no wonder they are ticked off. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000461\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cbc37df2-57ae-4536-94ed-a2e39eecd585\u0022\u003EWhat else are the people of Franklin concerned about? They, like the majority of Aucklanders who have said this in recent opinion polls, believe that their rates will go up because of the Rodney Hide - John Key super-city, and we imagine that they would have good grounds for their concern about that. Rodney Hide has been going around town saying that the user charges will go down, under his super-city. The cost of having one\u2019s dog registered under the new Auckland Council will be $70. Well, the people of Franklin currently pay $60 to have their dog registered. Rodney Hide is going around boasting that building inspectors will cost $110 an hour in the new Auckland super-city. Well, I have news for members. In Franklin, I say to Dr Hutchison, people pay no more than $112, but it is often as low as $73 for a building inspector. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000462\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cfdabe42-521a-4dca-afab-3e781731a130\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022b0bfe307fe27459a99593963776e5429\u0022\u003EDr Paul Hutchison\u003C/span\u003E: It\u2019s a great area.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000463\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cbc37df2-57ae-4536-94ed-a2e39eecd585\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002252b476032fb5495e8ed331fd7ecc2a20\u0022\u003EPHIL TWYFORD\u003C/span\u003E: Well, the member will have to go a long way to convince the people of Franklin that they are getting a good deal under the super-city. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000464\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cbc37df2-57ae-4536-94ed-a2e39eecd585\u0022\u003EThe other thing that the people of Franklin are concerned about is their water rates. Rodney Hide has gone around for the last couple of weeks saying that\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000465\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022893adc11-ce4e-419c-a079-08f04b3d75f5\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00228370e149e78c44b29db5c1dc171a4d39\u0022\u003EMr DEPUTY SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: We are a long way away from museums.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000466\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cbc37df2-57ae-4536-94ed-a2e39eecd585\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022b35e36687bc7444990fba412fcb3e4f2\u0022\u003EPHIL TWYFORD\u003C/span\u003E: The people of Franklin are concerned about the costs that they will have to pay under the super-city, which is what this bill originally set out to address. It was intended to address the costs that they would pay through their rates for being part of wider Auckland. We know that it is the policy of this Government and of Citizens and Ratepayers, the National Party proxy in Auckland, to roll out user-pays charges for waste water. That is what people are concerned about. They are worried that their waste-water charges will go through the roof, and the people in Franklin are extremely concerned about that. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000467\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cbc37df2-57ae-4536-94ed-a2e39eecd585\u0022\u003EWe know that recent polls tell us that a solid 50 percent of Aucklanders do not want the super-city. They do not like it; they do not trust it. Well, the last poll that was done in Franklin showed that 90 percent of people, I say to Dr Hutchison, do not want the super-city\u201490 percent. That is almost twice as much as the number of people in Auckland who do not want it. I think that the member for Hunua will have a very hard job explaining to his electors how he went into bat for them and represented their democratic interests, when the next election comes around. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000468\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cbc37df2-57ae-4536-94ed-a2e39eecd585\u0022\u003EThe other issue that really grates on people in Franklin is not only the fact that the people on the Waikato side of the old boundary had to pay a share of the contribution to the museums, but also those people care about their publicly owned assets, like the Ports of Auckland, and they care about vital infrastructure. This Government is obviously setting up those assets to be privatised, and we saw that when the third super-city bill removed the democratic right that Aucklanders have to approve it in a referendum before the Ports of Auckland can be sold off. Well, this Government legislated that right away, because it does not care about people having the right to make a decision about whether their assets are privatised. That is why in the local body elections that are currently going on, the people of Franklin are expressing their concern. They want to vote for candidates who will save the assets from privatisation and will not flog them off to overseas owners. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000469\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cbc37df2-57ae-4536-94ed-a2e39eecd585\u0022\u003EWe have recently seen the kind of shonky, behind-the-scenes decision-making that Aucklanders and the people of Franklin have come to fear with this super-city. We have seen this Government putting in a new computer system for the Auckland super-city, which is costing $62 million, and which the Government did not put out to tender. This is exactly the kind of concern that the people of Franklin have about the way their rates are being spent. It is what motivated them to ask for this bill to be brought to the House, and what do we see? We see shonky, mates\u2019 rates behaviour from the hand-picked mates of National who have been put in place to run the new Auckland Council. What did they do? They let a contract for computers for $62 million without putting it out for tender. I predict that this is the kind of behaviour we will see more of. It is exactly what the people of Franklin feared. All the way along, it is not only the fact that the people of Franklin have been forced to pay for these museum levies but also the people of Franklin, like the people of wider Auckland, were never given a say on the super-city. They were never given any choice, they were not listened to, and they were treated with contempt by this Government.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022ffff330f-1757-41d6-9973-25244f0fdada\u0022 data-id=\u002218c3d1e2c7864ccca67c3bda5fc7721d\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000470\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ffff330f-1757-41d6-9973-25244f0fdada\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002218c3d1e2c7864ccca67c3bda5fc7721d\u0022\u003ECOLIN KING (National\u2014Kaik\u014Dura):\u003C/span\u003E It is a pleasure to join Dr Paul Hutchison in speaking to the Franklin District Council (Contribution to Funding of Museums) Amendment Bill. We have a situation where the bill has effectively been overtaken by events that have been led by this Government in combining a number of rather fractured and dysfunctional aspects of our major city, Auckland. This bill was originally introduced on 13 August 2008. As we know, in November 2008 New Zealand had an election. The people of New Zealand voted in a John Key - led National Government, supported by the ACT Party, and National also appreciates the support we get from the M\u0101ori Party.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000471\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ffff330f-1757-41d6-9973-25244f0fdada\u0022\u003EHowever, I draw members\u2019 attention to the fractious nature of libraries and museums. Even down at the Hurunui District Council, we have problems with distance and the ratings of libraries and museums. At the last local body elections down there, the people of Cheviot were particularly concerned about not having access to the library in Amberley. When we stop and think of those distances, we realise they are rather short, but that is the nature of funding. I think one can see that originally there was a lot of merit in bringing forward this bill.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000472\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ffff330f-1757-41d6-9973-25244f0fdada\u0022\u003EDr Paul Hutchison, a very good member, took this bill up to ensure that those historical wrongs were put right. However, with the speed and the agenda of this Government in working towards having the greater Auckland City go to the local body elections to choose one mayor and one council\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000473\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cfdabe42-521a-4dca-afab-3e781731a130\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00221c4f1cd5df0a4e60b971bea3335fbc35\u0022\u003EDr Paul Hutchison\u003C/span\u003E: One plan.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000474\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ffff330f-1757-41d6-9973-25244f0fdada\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a6a06c9879be4fc4a308e83a0e19c66d\u0022\u003ECOLIN KING\u003C/span\u003E: \u2014to have one agenda, one plan, is very important. I believe that the structure that will now affect the Auckland War Memorial Museum and the Museum of Transport and Technology will be a better one.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000475\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ffff330f-1757-41d6-9973-25244f0fdada\u0022\u003EIt is appropriate that the Franklin District Council wrote to the Local Government and Environment Committee and acknowledged that the bill was redundant, in the sense that the events in Auckland had overtaken it. From my point of view, the select committee\u2019s recommendation is appropriate. National will vote that this bill does not proceed. On that basis, I will say that the bill should not progress, and I will sit down.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022 data-id=\u0022e4501f2ab0f8457fbb56c66e9b08f75b\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000476\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022e4501f2ab0f8457fbb56c66e9b08f75b\u0022\u003EGRANT ROBERTSON (Labour\u2014Wellington Central):\u003C/span\u003E It is an honour to follow Colin King, who had such an authoritative ending to his speech. Both sides of the House agree that the Franklin District Council (Contribution to Funding of Museums) Amendment Bill should not proceed. Obviously, as the Local Government and Environment Committee noted, the bill should not proceed because the Local Government (Auckland Transitional Provisions) Act has superseded it. It is important to reflect on the process by which that Act came into being while reflecting on this bill, because we have to set the context.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000477\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003EI think it is worth noting, firstly, the excellent work that the select committee did on the bill. Would it not have been good if all of the legislation regarding the change to Auckland governance had found its way to a select committee? Perhaps if that had happened, the people of Auckland might have had a true opportunity to be listened to. What we have seen, with the change in Auckland governance, is the activities of one Minister, Rodney Hide\u2014the tail wagging the dog of the National Government. Now, perhaps, National members might be looking across at Rodney Hide, who is the Minister responsible for the legislation that superseded this bill, and asking whether they want to be associated with that man. Do they really want the public of New Zealand to think that Rodney Hide is leading the strategy for the National Government for our biggest city and for the biggest change in local government in New Zealand\u2019s history, certainly since the 1989 reforms? Do they really want the National Government to be led by Rodney Hide? He is a man whose credibility has been destroyed, a man who has covered up the most despicable of acts, and as a Minister he now has no credibility to be leading a process that this bill has now been superseded by. National members have to ask themselves that question. Rodney Hide has clearly got it wrong in Auckland, and my colleague Phil Twyford has talked about that.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000478\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003EOf course there was a need for change in Auckland governance. Of course there was a need to bring together the people of the Greater Auckland region in a way that would benefit transport and those issues that cut across different parts of the city. But the way that the National Government has put forward the reforms for Auckland governance has been unacceptable. It has overridden democracy. It has put in place people who will enforce the agenda of Rodney Hide and others in vitally important organisations.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000479\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003EWhen I look at this bill, which refers in particular to the Auckland War Memorial Museum and the Museum of Transport and Technology, I wonder whether part of the $62 million computer system that the Auckland super-city is putting in place might one day find itself at the Museum of Transport and Technology. When people visit the museum and look at it, they will say: \u201CGosh, $62 million. That was a lot of money to spend on a computer system. It\u2019s unbelievable that it didn\u2019t go out to tender.\u201D It is absolutely incredible that a project as important as that, as important for Auckland and its future, did not go out to tender. Once again, that is an example of the way in which the process of the Auckland governance reforms, which superseded this bill, have been railroaded through, have not been subject to due process, and, in fact, are a black mark on this Government. The Government needs to reconsider whether it is appropriate that those reforms continue in this way.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000480\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003EOne of the interesting aspects of this bill is that it cuts to the question of regional amenities. Obviously the people of Auckland and the people of Franklin have had some difficulty ironing out exactly where the boundaries lie, and that is the reason why this bill came forward. I speak here as a member representing the Wellington region to say that this issue is vexing many of the councils in this area. The Wellington City Council, which oversees a number of excellent facilities in the region, has been looking to other councils to ask if it can sustain these facilities without the support of people in the region. As we know, the Auckland War Memorial Museum and the Museum of Transport and Technology are visited by people from the Franklin area, and they are visited by people from a number of other regions nearby. The question automatically arises: what should be done about that?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000481\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003EThe Auckland Regional Amenities Funding Act was passed, and it enables the Auckland region to look at things on a regional basis. As a Wellington member of Parliament, I am certainly well disposed to the idea of something similar to that happening in Wellington. Obviously in Wellington we have a great deal of important artistic and cultural institutions, such as Te Papa, the International Festival of the Arts, the National Opera, the Royal New Zealand Ballet, the New Zealand Symphony Orchestra, the New Zealand School of Dance, and the New Zealand School of Music. These are all vitally important parts of our cultural infrastructure here in the Wellington region. We need them to be sustainable, because, quite frankly, people in Wellington will look and say that now we have this very powerful entity in Auckland, will we be able to continue to hold on to these regional amenities in the Wellington region? I think the answer is that obviously we want to hold on to them, and we need to make sure that the whole region can look towards cooperating on that. I look forward to the end of the local body elections, when we will find out who will be representing those Wellington councils. Certainly as a Wellington MP I will want to work with them on that.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000482\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003EThis bill has, indeed, been superseded by the process that has occurred in Auckland. From Labour\u2019s point of view, that process has not been acceptable. It has not been democratic. It has shown up the Government in a very poor light. The connection with ACT leader Rodney Hide in this regard is something that the people of Franklin I am sure will remember, and the people of Auckland generally will remember. Although this bill will be discharged tonight after its second reading, it is fair to say that it reminds us of the stain on this Parliament of the way in which the National - ACT Government has forced on the people of Auckland a structure and a process that they have not had a proper say in. The Government lost a great opportunity to put in place a truly democratic Auckland governance structure, which could have gotten over some of the problems that have bedevilled Auckland for many years, but still kept a democratic process in place. That is something that Parliament needs to reflect on very seriously as this bill is discharged.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022a68928ea-9dd8-4a30-8e2c-a0f49dfc8bea\u0022 data-id=\u0022fb433f53e8ee41c6bdfdadf3a94104f6\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000483\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a68928ea-9dd8-4a30-8e2c-a0f49dfc8bea\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022fb433f53e8ee41c6bdfdadf3a94104f6\u0022\u003ELOUISE UPSTON (National\u2014Taup\u014D):\u003C/span\u003E I rise to speak on the Franklin District Council (Contribution to Funding of Museums) Amendment Bill, which was brought before the House by the very hard-working National member of Parliament for Hunua, Dr Paul Hutchison. I believe that he has represented his constituents very well in bringing forward this issue, which is concerned with a rating anomaly. Members on the other side have gone into a variety of rants about changes to the Auckland super-city that are not relevant to this legislation. This bill arose because of a rating anomaly associated with two Acts of Parliament that allowed for levies to be raised for the Auckland War Memorial Museum and the Museum of Transport and Technology on the basis of the population of the Franklin District. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000484\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a68928ea-9dd8-4a30-8e2c-a0f49dfc8bea\u0022\u003EWe have had quite a wide-ranging discussion on the super-city. It was interesting to hear Labour members criticise the Government for the decisions that were made about Franklin. I can understand that Franklin has had a period of uncertainty and now a period of change with the super-city, but I want to put on record that Labour did not support Franklin\u2019s decision to have a unitary council, which was its preference. Labour is suggesting that it would have been fully behind Franklin, but it was not fully behind that proposal and did not support it. In effect, Pukekohe and the rest of Franklin would have been divided by the Waikato River boundary. Anyway, we are not talking about the super-city; we are here to talk about the challenge the Franklin District has with funding. The hard-working Local Government and Environment Committee came to the conclusion that this problem could not be solved by Parliament. When the bill was introduced in 2008, clearly a problem existed. However, times have moved on.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000485\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a68928ea-9dd8-4a30-8e2c-a0f49dfc8bea\u0022\u003EThis Government is very effective in getting things done in partnership with the ACT Party and the M\u0101ori Party. We are firm believers in delivering for New Zealanders and the changes in Auckland are but one example of that. In effect, those changes mean we are not in a position to support this bill. There has clearly been a major restructuring of local government since its introduction. We do not believe that it is Parliament\u2019s role to resolve the issue of the levies in this particular instance. I recognise the local member\u2019s support, encouragement, and representation of his constituents.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000486\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a68928ea-9dd8-4a30-8e2c-a0f49dfc8bea\u0022\u003ESitting suspended from 6 p.m. to 7.30 p.m.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022ec266512-9fe8-47da-883e-48f046ee5059\u0022 data-id=\u0022137a95e18fa94e8ea8388aeca164010e\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000487\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ec266512-9fe8-47da-883e-48f046ee5059\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022137a95e18fa94e8ea8388aeca164010e\u0022\u003ETE URUROA FLAVELL (M\u0101ori Party\u2014Waiariki):\u003C/span\u003E Mr Assistant Speaker, kia ora t\u0101tau. Kei te k\u014Drero t\u0101tau m\u014D t\u0113tahi pire e p\u0101 ana ki a Waikato, n\u014D reira, n\u0101 runga i t\u0113r\u0101 whakaaro me huri ki te titiro ki te \u0101huatanga ki a Te P\u014D Nui, a Jim Nicholls e takoto mai r\u0101 i roto o Hauraki, i waenganui i t\u014Dna iwi i t\u0113nei p\u014D. \u0100p\u014Dp\u014D, ka tukuna atu ki te k\u014Dp\u016B o Papat\u016B\u0101nuku. E aroha atu ana ki a ia, ko au t\u0113r\u0101 i mahi nei i tana taha. Kei te takoto a ia i runga i t\u014Dna marae i M\u0101taiwhet\u016B i roto o Thames, o Hauraki. Ko \u014Dna iwi ko Ng\u0101ti Maru, Ng\u0101ti Whanaunga, Ng\u0101ti Hako, me k\u012B, ko Pare Hauraki, a Tainui waka, \u0113r\u0101 e tangi ana. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000488\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ec266512-9fe8-47da-883e-48f046ee5059\u0022\u003EN\u0101, ko Jim te Tiamana o te Kaunihera Kaum\u0101tua o Hauraki, t\u014D r\u0101tou m\u0101ngai hoki i runga i te Poari Kaitiaki M\u0101ori o Hauraki, t\u0113r\u0101 Poari o t\u014Dna iwi, ka mutu, ko ia te tiamana tuarua a te Kaunihera M\u0101ori o Aotearoa. N\u014D reira, e tika ana i t\u0113nei w\u0101 kia t\u012Bmata ake waku k\u014Drero hei w\u0101w\u0101hi ake i taku k\u014Drero, \u0101, me te poroporoaki i a ia. Kai te p\u0113nei tonu au n\u0101 runga i te mea, ko t\u0113nei pire e h\u0101ngai tonu ki a Waikato. N\u0101 reira, whakaaro ake ki a r\u0101tou kua ngaro atu ki te tirohanga kanohi. Ko ia t\u0113r\u0101, an\u0101 tae atu ki a Te Atawhai Taiaroa, t\u0113r\u0101 o ng\u0101 pou o roto o Aotearoa. N\u014D reira, \u0101 k\u0101ti, waiho r\u0101tou ki a r\u0101tou kia moe, anei t\u0101tau e k\u014Drero nei m\u014D te take nei. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000489\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ec266512-9fe8-47da-883e-48f046ee5059\u0022\u003EI a au e whakaaro ake nei, kei te rere tonu ng\u0101 whakaaro m\u014D te hunga utu r\u0113ti, me k\u012B, o roto o Ng\u0101ti Maru, Ng\u0101ti Paoa, Ng\u0101ti Tamater\u0101, Ng\u0101i Tai me \u0113tahi atu w\u0101hi o roto o Waikato. Ko t\u0113nei pire, t\u0113tahi o ng\u0101 take kua roa, me k\u012B, e w\u0101nangatia ana i roto i ng\u0101 K\u0101wanatanga i ng\u0101 tau kua hipa. E ai ki t\u0101ku e m\u014Dhio nei, ko te Franklin District Council (Contribution to Funding of Museums) Amendment Bill i tae mai, i t\u012Bmata mai ai i te 13 o Here-turi-k\u014Dk\u0101, ar\u0101, o \u0100kuhata i te tau 2008, \u0101, ka mutu, ka tukuna ki te komiti wh\u0101iti, ar\u0101, ki te select committee i te 4 o Pout\u016B-te-rangi, M\u0101ehe i te tau 2009. E ai ki t\u0101ku e m\u014Dhio nei, e rua ng\u0101 w\u0101hanga o te pire nei, me k\u012B, ko t\u0113r\u0101 e p\u0101 ana ki te Auckland War Memorial Museum Act i te tau 1996, me te Whare Taonga the Museum of Transport and Technology Act i te tau 2000. Ko te tikanga o t\u0113nei, me k\u012B, r\u0101wekeweke i t\u0113nei pire, me k\u012B, ko te \u0101ta whakatau i te utu m\u014D ng\u0101 whare taonga, me k\u012B, kia kautehia n\u0101 runga i te tokomaha o te tangata e noho mai r\u0101 i roto o Franklin, otir\u0101, te hunga kai roto i te rohe o T\u0101maki-makau-rau, kaua ko r\u0101tou kei roto o Waikato. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000490\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ec266512-9fe8-47da-883e-48f046ee5059\u0022\u003E\u0112ngari, i a au e k\u014Drero ana ki aku hoa ki a Hone Harawira, ki a Pita Sharples, i puta te m\u0101ramatanga ka mutu, ko t\u0113nei take e h\u0101ngai tonu ana ki a Waikato, me k\u012B, kua whakaara ake a Waikato i t\u0113nei take \u0113tahi o ng\u0101 iwi, ng\u0101 t\u0101ngata o Waikato i t\u0113nei take o roto i t\u0113nei pire. N\u014D reira, he pai t\u0113nei kia tae mai \u0113nei momo pire, me ng\u0101 tono \u0101 t\u0113n\u0101, \u0101 t\u0113n\u0101, \u0101 t\u0113n\u0101, \u0101 t\u0113na. Ka m\u014Dhio tonu te P\u0101remata, \u0101e, he take nui t\u0113r\u0101 kai roto i te hapori. N\u014D reira, anei an\u014D t\u0113tahi huarahi hei whakaara ake i te iwi i \u014D r\u0101tou whakaaro. Me k\u012B, he m\u0101m\u0101 noa iho te tikanga o t\u0113nei pire, he mea hai whakatau i ng\u0101 moni ka utua ki te Franklin District Council, ki te Auckland War Memorial Museum, me te Museum of Transport and Technology. Kai reira tonu t\u0113tahi w\u0101hanga o te Rohe o Franklin. He uaua te whakam\u0101rama ake t\u0113nei take i roto i te reo M\u0101ori n\u014D reira, t\u0113r\u0101 pea me huri ki te reo P\u0101keh\u0101 m\u014D te w\u0101 poto. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000491\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ec266512-9fe8-47da-883e-48f046ee5059\u0022\u003E[Greetings to us, Mr Assistant Speaker. We are addressing this bill that relates to Waikato, and because of that I turn to look at the situation concerning Te P\u014D Nui, Jim Nicholls lying in state tonight in Hauraki among his people. He will be buried in the womb of mother Earth tomorrow. I sympathise as I have worked with him. He lies upon his marae at M\u0101taiwhet\u016B in Thames and Hauraki. His tribes are Ng\u0101ti Maru, Ng\u0101ti Whanaunga, Ng\u0101ti Hako of the Hauraki Gulf and of the Tainui canoe. They are grieving there. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000492\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ec266512-9fe8-47da-883e-48f046ee5059\u0022\u003EJim was the chairman of the Council of Elders of Hauraki, their representative on the Hauraki M\u0101ori Trust Board, his people\u2019s board, and deputy chair of the New Zealand M\u0101ori Council. So it is fitting at this time that I preface my address by bidding him farewell. I have done this because this bill relates directly to Waikato. My thoughts are therefore with those who are no longer to be seen, including Te Atawhai Taiaroa, one of the pillars in New Zealand. So enough, leave them to rest there as we debate this matter.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000493\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ec266512-9fe8-47da-883e-48f046ee5059\u0022\u003E As I ponder here, my thoughts immediately go to the ratepayers of Ng\u0101ti Maru, Ng\u0101ti Paoa, Ng\u0101ti Tamater\u0101, Ng\u0101i Tai, and of other places in Waikato. This is one of those bills that have been the subject of prolonged discussions within Governments over past years. According to what I know, the Franklin District Council (Contribution to Funding of Museums) Amendment Bill arrived on 13 August 2008 and was referred to a select committee on 4 March 2009. I understand there are two parts to this bill. One refers to the Auckland War Memorial Museum Act 1996 and the other to the Museum of Transport and Technology Act 2000. It was to amend this legislation so that specific contributions could be made for the museums based on the population of people residing in Franklin, particularly those in the Auckland region but excluding the ones in Waikato. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000494\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ec266512-9fe8-47da-883e-48f046ee5059\u0022\u003EBut it was while I was discussing this with fellow colleagues Hone Harawira and the Hon Dr Pita Sharples that I realised that this matter did indeed relate to Waikato, because some of them raised this issue in this bill. So it is good that these kinds of bills come here with submissions from different individuals. Parliament will then know that, yes, that is an important issue in the community. So here is another way for people to express their views. This bill is simply the instrument whereby contributions are determined from the Franklin District Council to the Auckland War Memorial Museum and the Museum of Transport and Technology. One part of the Franklin District is still there, but it is difficult to explain in M\u0101ori, so I will turn to English for a short time.]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000495\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ec266512-9fe8-47da-883e-48f046ee5059\u0022\u003EAs others have said\u2014and it is a bit difficult to explain clearly in M\u0101ori\u2014the bill seeks to ensure that in calculating the levies payable by the Franklin District Council to the Auckland War Memorial Museum and the Museum of Transport and Technology, any part of the district of the Franklyn District Council that is not within the boundaries of the Auckland Regional Council is excluded. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000496\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ec266512-9fe8-47da-883e-48f046ee5059\u0022\u003EMy colleagues have told me of the frustration that many Franklin citizens shared with them as to why their hard-earned rates should go into Auckland facilities that do not have any direct relationship to their community. We noted the view of the North Shore City Council that this issue should be dealt with as a part of the Government\u2019s comprehensive governance reform process for Auckland. At this stage of the reform process, it sees no reason to have interim or separate measures enacted. That might be all very well on paper, but the M\u0101ori Party has no confidence that the special interests of those within the boundaries of Franklin district will be addressed simply by leaving it to chance. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000497\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ec266512-9fe8-47da-883e-48f046ee5059\u0022\u003EKei te tino tautoko ake i t\u0113nei pire n\u0101 runga i tana aronga ki t\u0113nei momo uauatanga i roto i te pire i t\u0113nei w\u0101. We are pleased to support this bill as it addresses an apparent anomaly in the current legislation that covers the method of calculating the levies relating to the Auckland War Memorial Museum and the Museum of Transport and Technology. We note too that Federated Farmers view the present arrangements as inequitable on farmers and other rural landowners in the southern part of the Franklin district. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000498\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ec266512-9fe8-47da-883e-48f046ee5059\u0022\u003EWe believe it is vital that that local government authority has acknowledged mana whenua. Our policy preference is that local government will enhance the development of local and regional business; commercial partnerships between local and regional authorities; industries and business; and local wh\u0101nau, iwi, and hap\u016B. In order to do that, councils must know who is in their specific territorial region and who sits outside. For all those factors, and most particularly because of the wishes of the people, the M\u0101ori Party is happy to support the bill at its second reading. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000499\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ec266512-9fe8-47da-883e-48f046ee5059\u0022\u003EMotion not agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n    \u003C/div\u003E\n    \u003Cdiv class=\u0022HpsHansard\u0022\u003E\n      \u003Cp\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsProceedingHeading\u0022\u003EBills\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000500\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u0022c3d9e6c9b41047e2bbae6f418d282240\u0022\u003ERoyal Society of New Zealand Amendment Bill\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000501\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u00228823b9f4b4c048c7918f3fbf594d1f38\u0022\u003EFirst Reading\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022 data-id=\u002204ee1d093c6e4ac88a2de9ed33736503\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000502\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002204ee1d093c6e4ac88a2de9ed33736503\u0022\u003EGRANT ROBERTSON (Labour\u2014Wellington Central):\u003C/span\u003E I move, That the Royal Society of New Zealand Amendment Bill be now read a first time. At the appropriate time I intend to move that the bill be considered by the Education and Science Committee. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000503\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ffff330f-1757-41d6-9973-25244f0fdada\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00223d306a3b1bdd41e5a021e6b36748feeb\u0022\u003EColin King\u003C/span\u003E: A very good committee.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000504\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022c2c9461d191b47b68b759758240e0de5\u0022\u003EGRANT ROBERTSON\u003C/span\u003E: It is an excellent committee; I agree with the member. The Royal Society of New Zealand Amendment Bill is a private bill, which is promoted by the Royal Society of New Zealand. The society is a body corporate that has operated in New Zealand since 1867 and is currently based in the great electorate of Wellington Central. The object, functions, and structure of the society are set out in the Royal Society of New Zealand Act 1997. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000505\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003EThe current object of the society is the advancement and promotion of science and technology in New Zealand. That, in turn, leads to the functions of the society. The first current function is to foster in the New Zealand community a culture that supports science and technology, including\u2014without limitation\u2014the promotion of public awareness, knowledge, and understanding of science and technology, and the advancement of science and technology education. The second function is to encourage, promote, and recognise excellence in science and technology. The third function is to provide an infrastructure and other support for the professional needs and development of scientists and technologists. The fourth function is to establish and administer a code of professional standards and ethics in science and technology for members. The fifth function is to provide expert advice on important public issues to the Government and the community. The final current function is to do all other lawful things that the society considers are conducive to the advancement and promotion of science and technology in New Zealand. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000506\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003EThis bill seeks to amend the Royal Society of New Zealand Act to incorporate the humanities into the object and functions of the society. It will also make several other minor changes that I will outline shortly. The society has approached me to be the member in charge of this bill as I am the member of Parliament for the electorate in which the society\u2019s head office is located. As I have said, the main purpose of the bill is to amend the Royal Society of New Zealand Act to incorporate the humanities into its objects and functions. This means, for example, that the functions of the society will be expanded to include the functions of fostering in the New Zealand community a culture that supports the humanities and of encouraging, promoting, and recognising excellence in the humanities. The definition in clause 5(2) of the bill says that the humanities include: \u201CEnglish and other languages, history, religion, philosophy, law, classics, linguistics, literature, cultural studies, media studies, art history, film, drama, and American studies\u201D. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000507\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003ESpecifically, the bill adds to those functions that I read out earlier: \u201Cto foster in the New Zealand community a culture that supports the humanities: to encourage, promote, and recognise excellence in the humanities: to establish and administer for members a code of professional standards and ethics in the humanities: and to do all other lawful things which the Council of the Society considers conducive to the advancement and promotion of the humanities in New Zealand:\u201D. The incorporation of the humanities into the objects and functions of the society will mean that many people involved in the humanities may be admitted as members of the society, and that people who have achieved distinction in research for the advancement of the humanities will be able to be elected as fellows of the Royal Society. The society will obviously also be required to establish and administer a code of professional standards and ethics in the humanities, as it currently does in relation to science and technology. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000508\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003EThe society\u2019s decision to expand the objects and functions of the society to include the humanities was based on three main factors: a desire to integrate the structure and function of research in New Zealand; a recognition of the need to build on and integrate the complementary knowledge provided by different disciplines; and the fact that academies of scholars in other countries such as Canada and Scotland have academies that also range across the disciplines. It is fair to say that in recent times there has been a growing awareness among the pure scientific community\u2014I defer to my colleague Moana Mackey, who comes from that community\u2014to work more closely with the social science community. Many members of the House will be familiar with the work of Professor Sir Paul Callaghan and Bill Manhire at Victoria University, who have worked very hard to try to draw together what they call the \u201Cparallel universes of writers and scientists\u201D. It is a little bit like that. For those of us from a social science background, it is fair to say that the pure scientists sometimes have some difficulty in understanding where we are coming from\u2014and, no doubt, vice versa as well.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000509\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221c818ce2-6ca3-4c4a-9e6a-2e3a67d070e1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022c1008a805e9149929fefc35113cf95cb\u0022\u003EShane Ardern\u003C/span\u003E: Venus and Mars.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000510\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00229842a4dc2d0047ea8ad80e1f72654593\u0022\u003EGRANT ROBERTSON\u003C/span\u003E: Scientists are from Venus and social scientists are from Mars; I thank Mr Ardern for that. It is true that the work that Bill Manhire and Paul Callaghan have done has been excellent and is mirrored in many other parts of our research sector. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000511\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003EBefore I came into this House, I worked very closely with an organisation called the Centre for Sustainable Cities, which is based at Otago University\u2019s medical school. It brings together people from the pure sciences\u2014such as physics and energy research\u2014right through to people in the social sciences, particularly those in the public health area and those who do research into housing. It is a very good way of being able to draw together and create an inter-disciplinary approach within our broad research communities. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000512\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003EI think it is very timely that the Royal Society has chosen to come to the House to amend its functions to reflect the fact that the humanities are having an increased role and increased importance in the research community. It is only right, too, that it does this following on from consultation with the Council for the Humanities. A memorandum of understanding was signed by the society and the Council for the Humanities on 9 February 2010 to incorporate the humanities into the society. As is the nature of a body such as the Royal Society, which is governed by statute, this bill has come to the House now to get our endorsement for that process. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000513\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003EAs I mentioned at the start, there are a couple of other elements to this bill that I would like to note. The first is that another purpose of the bill is to rename the academy council of the society the academy executive committee. This will be a matter of great interest to members in the House. The reason for this change is to avoid confusion between the academy council, which was established to contribute to the achievement of the objects of the society by recognising and encouraging excellence and outstanding achievement in science and technology and contributing to the intellectual leadership role of the society, and the overall council of the society, which has a governing role. This means that the academy council of the Royal Society will, after this bill has passed, be called the academy executive committee, and any potentially confused social or pure scientists will know the difference. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000514\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003EThe bill also amends the standard for the election of companions of the society to put greater focus on leadership and also to include the humanities now that they are part of the society\u2019s wider functions. The final purpose of the bill relates to changes that were made to the council\u2019s structure in 2008 by way of a wash-up provision to make sure that all of the constitutional changes that have been made are now reflected in the law. In particular, the bill amends the election process for councillors of the society so that the process is consistent with a new council structure, and it clarifies processes for councillors appointed by regional constituent organisations. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000515\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003ETo achieve the purposes of this bill, we need to amend the Royal Society of New Zealand Act. This is a bill that should not generate too much controversy. I hope that pure scientists in the Chamber will be able to accept the arrival of the social scientists and see that they will now all be able to work together in harmony and ensure that we can support those research endeavours that are taking place right around New Zealand in many universities and other research institutions. I think this bill will make for a stronger Royal Society, and I commend it to the House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022749d97b8-a772-4227-83da-b5e264c37bc0\u0022 data-id=\u00225291eb63ff5842728442b6f591027fea\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000516\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022749d97b8-a772-4227-83da-b5e264c37bc0\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00225291eb63ff5842728442b6f591027fea\u0022\u003EALLAN PEACHEY (National\u2014T\u0101maki):\u003C/span\u003E I am pleased to be able to join my colleague the member for Wellington Central in supporting the first reading of the Royal Society of New Zealand Amendment Bill and supporting its referral to the Education and Science Committee, which I have the honour of chairing and to which the member for Wellington Central is an occasional, but very, very positive, contributor. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000517\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022749d97b8-a772-4227-83da-b5e264c37bc0\u0022\u003EI will not cover the ground that he has covered; he gave an excellent outline of the purpose of the bill in its various provisions. But I want to make a few comments about the Royal Society of New Zealand. It is a long-established body; it was established in 1867 and known until 1933 as the New Zealand Institute.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000518\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002275a05f96-2474-4c90-a6ea-cf7b5798e03e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022c022df545e264a4ea0fa1593e61deecc\u0022\u003EHon Ruth Dyson\u003C/span\u003E:How old were you then, Allan?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000519\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022749d97b8-a772-4227-83da-b5e264c37bc0\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00228e75718f316e4170a31be1b9d63bbdd4\u0022\u003EALLAN PEACHEY\u003C/span\u003E: I had not quite started school.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000520\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022ed18e8a9896e43fda8ef81e5a9004b08\u0022\u003EGrant Robertson\u003C/span\u003E: Ruapehu College.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000521\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022749d97b8-a772-4227-83da-b5e264c37bc0\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00227bcc44b1c3634ae2a222e87e1034d521\u0022\u003EALLAN PEACHEY\u003C/span\u003E: It was Ruapheu College\u2014I thank the member. I am getting closer to my objectives tonight, and there will be a couple more opportunities before we have finished. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000522\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022749d97b8-a772-4227-83da-b5e264c37bc0\u0022\u003EThe Royal Society was set up as a mechanism to bring together a number of research and science organisations around the country that did not have the resources to publish the papers that were being delivered them, to keep records of their meetings and their activities, and that sort of thing. The Royal Society of New Zealand Act, which was passed in 1997, currently legislates for the provision of the Royal Society. The society\u2019s primary purpose has been to foster in the New Zealand community a culture that supports science and technology, including the promotion of public awareness, knowledge and understanding of science and technology, and the advancement of science and technology education. So the Royal Society is responsible for the distribution of public funding, for scientific research and public education, for the publication of a number of journals, for holding meetings and seminars, for awarding medals like the Rutherford Medal and the Pickering Medal, and for science education. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000523\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022749d97b8-a772-4227-83da-b5e264c37bc0\u0022\u003EIt is on that note that I would like to take a moment to acknowledge the role that the Royal Society plays in this Parliament each year. In conjunction with Science New Zealand, the Royal Society sponsors a series of lectures known as the Speaker\u2019s Science Forum, which as chair of the Education and Science Committee I get the honour to chair. This year we have had maybe a dozen lectures on a Tuesday night, over the dinner break, from some very eminent New Zealand scientists. Some of us, like me, do not have a scientific background. It was my misfortune to attend Ruapehu College and to be in the fifth form in 1965 and sitting School Certificate, when the teaching of science was particularly weak. In actual fact, that year it was a disgrace. I do not blame Ruapehu College for that, but I do blame a particular teacher whose name is well known in this House, but I had better not mention it. Ruapehu College was a great school for me, by the way. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000524\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022749d97b8-a772-4227-83da-b5e264c37bc0\u0022\u003EI have the privilege of hosting the Speaker\u2019s Science Forum, and as one of the members of the Royal Society said to me one evening after a particularly successful and enjoyable occasion, where else in the world, in any Parliament, would we have one-quarter of the members of Parliament in one room during their dinner break listening to a lecture about science? I commend these lectures to those members of the House who have not yet attended any of them. Members have missed the last one for this year, as it was held a week or so ago, but I commend them to members next year. Not only do we get to hear from an outstanding New Zealand scientist and learn about an aspect of science or technology that is current in New Zealand, but we also get to enjoy the fellowship of members of the Royal Society, of Science New Zealand, and of our own colleagues. For goodness\u2019 sake, I have even been known to share a dinner table, after the lecture, with members of the Labour Party! I humbly apologise to my colleagues on this side of the House for that dreadful breach of protocol, but I believe those members benefit from that sort of company from time to time. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000525\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022749d97b8-a772-4227-83da-b5e264c37bc0\u0022\u003EThe purpose of the Royal Society of New Zealand Amendment Bill is to enable the Royal Society to incorporate the humanities into its work, and I welcome that. I think that is a great step forward. If the Royal Society can\u2014and I sure it will\u2014bring to the humanities what it has brought to science and technology, it will be great for this country, and particularly for those who have studied the humanities and take a leading role in their fields. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000526\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022749d97b8-a772-4227-83da-b5e264c37bc0\u0022\u003EThe Royal Society resolved in November 2008 that there was a need to expand its activities. Something else happened in November 2008.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000527\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a68928ea-9dd8-4a30-8e2c-a0f49dfc8bea\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002227fd2367ef904b8a858e95063c74a266\u0022\u003ELouise Upston\u003C/span\u003E: What was that?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000528\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022749d97b8-a772-4227-83da-b5e264c37bc0\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00222f930913dfc74f88a890ccee9384cc34\u0022\u003EALLAN PEACHEY\u003C/span\u003E: What was it? Something else very significant for this country happened in November 2008. Oh, that is right; the Labour Government got thrown out of office. So two great things happened in New Zealand in November 2008. But enough of that. In the spirit of the bipartisanship in which the Education and Science Committee operates, I am sure that the committee will enjoy holding what I assume will be a limited number of hearings on the bill. That committee has had a very heavy workload this year, and it continues to have a very heavy workload. It has had to deal with some pretty challenging issues. I think members will find dealing with this bill a particular pleasure. I commend the bill to the House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002270dd644d-8bcf-40dc-998a-887d62d24a76\u0022 data-id=\u0022fd81f50a50e149489af6ba9289409e57\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000529\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002270dd644d-8bcf-40dc-998a-887d62d24a76\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022fd81f50a50e149489af6ba9289409e57\u0022\u003EMOANA MACKEY (Labour):\u003C/span\u003E I think it is a testament to the transformative power of science that it has facilitated the breaking of bread between Allan Peachey and the evil socialists on this side of the House. I am happy to stand in this House as a member of the Labour Party and a member of the Royal Society of New Zealand to speak on the Royal Society of New Zealand Amendment Bill. I thank my caucus colleagues and my whips, who apparently think I am some kind of science snob and thought it would be amusing to put me on the speaking list on a bill that introduces the humanities into the Royal Society. They thought it would be character-building. They will be very disappointed, because I wholeheartedly support the introduction of humanities into the Royal Society.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000530\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002285ec30d4-6394-433a-a12e-2c4def705dd0\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002275128cb328d74033961452d1f0edc1f0\u0022\u003EHon Judith Collins\u003C/span\u003E: Really?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000531\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002270dd644d-8bcf-40dc-998a-887d62d24a76\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002243ba6a1593d3448e83d814534f9d9348\u0022\u003EMOANA MACKEY\u003C/span\u003E: I do; it is called personal growth. Look how far I have come.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000532\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002270dd644d-8bcf-40dc-998a-887d62d24a76\u0022\u003EI was genuinely hurt that my good friend and colleague Grant Robertson would insinuate that I would think that his qualification is any less than mine, although I do note, with absolutely no judgment, that his particular qualification is not on the list. But that is all right; I am sure that is something that can be amended at the Education and Science Committee. I am sure it is a mere oversight.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000533\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002285ec30d4-6394-433a-a12e-2c4def705dd0\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00227dc97f6b96ea490caa150520296e8e7d\u0022\u003EHon Judith Collins\u003C/span\u003E: What is it, Moana?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000534\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002270dd644d-8bcf-40dc-998a-887d62d24a76\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00229e1625da0e7141faa46afd880f538c35\u0022\u003EMOANA MACKEY\u003C/span\u003E: His politics degree. It is not on the list. But this is something that will be debated at the select committee.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000535\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002270dd644d-8bcf-40dc-998a-887d62d24a76\u0022\u003EIn all seriousness, this bill is very important. One of the goals of the previous Labour Government was to facilitate more multidisciplinary approaches to research. We did this through the centres of research excellence, of which there are a number around the country now, which bring together a number of disciplines under the banner of particular areas of research. They have had enormous success in bringing the private sector, the universities, and the Crown research institutes to work together so that we are not doing overlapping research but are, in fact, coordinating that research.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000536\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002270dd644d-8bcf-40dc-998a-887d62d24a76\u0022\u003EThe multidisciplinary approach has often been the Holy Grail. Sometimes it is difficult, and we make jokes about the hierarchy of the scientific community, but it is actually very true\u2014there is a hierarchy, a pecking order, and sometimes it is difficult to get around that. But when we can, the outcomes are outstanding. I recently visited the centre for the study of agriculture, food and environment at Otago University, which is not a centre of research excellence but a multidisciplinary group. It brings together economists, sociologists, geographers, physicists, marine biologists, and statisticians. All these groups work on areas of public policy.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000537\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002270dd644d-8bcf-40dc-998a-887d62d24a76\u0022\u003EI think it is a shame that more MPs do not know about this group, because some of the areas it works on are absolutely key to what we do here. The group looks at the gap between what the Governments try to do and what the public want and how they feel about it. It uses the example of renewable energy, which New Zealanders overwhelmingly support. Then it looks at what happens whenever we try to build a wind farm or to develop tidal energy. So much expense is added because of the public backlash. The group says that sometimes politicians do not do that work, and there are things it is working on now that can be put in place to make sure that when these projects come up, we can save time and money and all the angst that often goes with them. This group is a very important unit. It looks at the areas of fisheries, agriculture, and right across the board. I recommend that members of Parliament visit this group.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000538\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002270dd644d-8bcf-40dc-998a-887d62d24a76\u0022\u003EOne of the problems is that its funding is now uncertain. With this new approach to funding research in New Zealand, which is that everything has to be business-based, this is a group that will save us money and will have public benefit for the country, but because it cannot absolutely quantify exactly how much money that will be, its funding is now uncertain.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000539\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221fb8d8db-3e96-49c7-ab1c-b7916a50e30e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002237f9a1f83a6148c89958e559003a32e3\u0022\u003EHon Steve Chadwick\u003C/span\u003E: Crazy.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000540\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002270dd644d-8bcf-40dc-998a-887d62d24a76\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a4c5c21ac31b46bb94b5dd06f3ebef88\u0022\u003EMOANA MACKEY\u003C/span\u003E: It is. I think all members of the House would think it is crazy. So I think this is a very timely bill from the Royal Society. It promotes the multidisciplinary approach, which should make all members of this House think very carefully about the expectations we put on the scientific community and on the research community. Sometimes there is truth to that adage about the cost of everything and the value of nothing. I think that sometimes the scientists and the researchers in our universities and our Crown research institutes find it frustrating that politicians and parliamentarians really do not understand exactly their needs and the value they can contribute to our society. I hope that this will be part of the debate on this bill.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000541\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002270dd644d-8bcf-40dc-998a-887d62d24a76\u0022\u003ELabour supports an evidence-based approach to policy. Clearly, the social sciences and the humanities have a big role to play in that. I think all parliamentarians should adopt an evidence-based approach and when we are spending taxpayers\u2019 money we should be able to point to the research that says it will work, and if it will not work we should justify, for example, why we are spending so much money on boot camps when every single bit of research says they will not work.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022ffff330f-1757-41d6-9973-25244f0fdada\u0022 data-id=\u0022c7108d1e32724092bb770a31066fbe24\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000542\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ffff330f-1757-41d6-9973-25244f0fdada\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022c7108d1e32724092bb770a31066fbe24\u0022\u003ECOLIN KING (National\u2014Kaik\u014Dura):\u003C/span\u003E It is a pleasure to speak on the Royal Society of New Zealand Amendment Bill. I take on board all the glowing comments made by previous speakers about the value of the humanities, the social sciences, and such like. When we look at the functionality of this bill, we see that it is structured in a way that will advance collectively not only the fundamental sciences but also the humanities. I have to confess that although science may not have been a great subject at Ruapehu College when the chairman of the Education and Science Committee was there, I had to do a bit of research to find out what humanities were. I would say that a lot of people in New Zealand would need to go to Google or something like that and inquire as to what humanities are. It is quite interesting that humanities are described as academic disciplines that study the human condition using methods that are primarily analytical, critical, and speculative, as distinguished from the mainly empirical approaches of the natural and social sciences. So I learnt something there. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000543\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ffff330f-1757-41d6-9973-25244f0fdada\u0022\u003EWhen we sit down at the Education and Science Committee and go through this bill, I am sure that there will be a fair amount of collegiality on it. I am certainly looking forward to that. I certainly can attest, too, to what the chairman was saying before about the Royal Society of New Zealand\u2019s sponsored lectures in Parliament, the Speaker\u2019s lectures. They were a great series and they certainly covered an enormous range. It surprised me just how broad the Royal Society of New Zealand was in its context, so it will be very interesting to see what comes out of the humanities\u2019 involvement with the society and their incorporation into it. We look forward to this bill coming to the select committee. I am sure that it will not take too long for us to go through the process and take advice on board. On that basis, I support the bill and look forward to receiving it at the select committee.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022e959f20f-3de7-4f54-8577-8ea78d72c3dd\u0022 data-id=\u0022926b14a2968d4361a6585d23d3816acf\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000544\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e959f20f-3de7-4f54-8577-8ea78d72c3dd\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022926b14a2968d4361a6585d23d3816acf\u0022\u003EDAVID CLENDON (Green):\u003C/span\u003E Kia ora koutou. The introduction of the Royal Society of New Zealand Amendment Bill brings us a step closer to fulfilling a commitment made by the Royal Society of New Zealand in February this year, when its memorandum with Te Wh\u0101inga Aronui, the Council for the Humanities, agreed to bring the two organisations closer. The Green Party is very happy to support this bill, as seems to be the mood tonight. As a person who did an arts degree at undergraduate level and then went on to do a postgraduate science degree, I will feel somewhat less divided in my membership of the Royal Society of New Zealand given that it is\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000545\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221fb8d8db-3e96-49c7-ab1c-b7916a50e30e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022fe1cdc0cb29b4b79861e8af01b58a45a\u0022\u003EHon Steve Chadwick\u003C/span\u003E: You\u2019re an expert on this.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000546\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e959f20f-3de7-4f54-8577-8ea78d72c3dd\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022dc1648c434274cc6861e63274908ef25\u0022\u003EDAVID CLENDON\u003C/span\u003E: Yes, it is a very interesting place to be when one is moving between these two fundamentally different disciplines or approaches.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000547\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221c818ce2-6ca3-4c4a-9e6a-2e3a67d070e1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00228efb664df0584f66bba3209f05958d54\u0022\u003EShane Ardern\u003C/span\u003E: Dangerous ground, I\u2019d say.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000548\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e959f20f-3de7-4f54-8577-8ea78d72c3dd\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a0355c4aafc14b9ab7f68c4474bdcd9a\u0022\u003EDAVID CLENDON\u003C/span\u003E: Quite right. To an extent this returns the Royal Society of New Zealand to its roots, back to the Royal Society in the UK. That society came together in the 1640s as a college of natural philosophers, who were delving into this then new model of observation and experimentation that in time became the empirically based science that we understand now. Clearly, this reintegration with the humanities is, as I say, coming back to the roots of that organisation. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000549\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e959f20f-3de7-4f54-8577-8ea78d72c3dd\u0022\u003ENatural philosophy was a branch of philosophy, a theoretical branch coming from an ethical base endeavouring to understand nature as it was then comprehended\u2014dare I say it, what we would now refer to as the environment. Clearly, there is a long history to the evolution of natural philosophy through to the scientific method, objective observation and the like. The downside, I guess, of the scientific method, which is clearly incredibly powerful and has been a very productive approach, was the degree of hubris or pride and the disallowance of indigenous forms of knowledge, investigation, understanding, and interpretation of the natural world. In the Western context, the reaction to the success of the reliance on the scientific method were the more extreme forms of postmodernism. We are finding that pendulum swinging back closer to a centre point, to acknowledge the value of both the scientific method and of a humanities or an arts-based approach to advancing knowledge and research. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000550\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e959f20f-3de7-4f54-8577-8ea78d72c3dd\u0022\u003EIn the modern age, if you like, back in the late 1950s, CP Snow, in his lecture The Two Cultures and then his book The Two Cultures and the Scientific Revolution, described the predicament very well when he observed that academics in schools of the arts were not only unwilling to talk to the scientists and vice versa but effectively unable to. They were almost unable to communicate with one another. Clearly in the 20th and the 21st centuries that degree of division within our academic and our research bases would be simply unacceptable and would not advance us, at all. In my own discipline of resource management it was clear that it was critical that resource management decisions are best made when they are not only based on good scientific understanding, geology, ecology, earth science, and all the other scientific disciplines, but also within the cultural context established by law, history, and economics. It is only with people who are trained and who understand the powers, weaknesses, limitations, and strengths of all of those sub-disciplines that we arrive at very good management decisions, like how to deal with our natural world, how to manage in the interests of our communities, and how to get good economic outcomes. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000551\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e959f20f-3de7-4f54-8577-8ea78d72c3dd\u0022\u003EIn short, we believe this is a good bill. It is timely. We are very pleased to see the society and the council coming together in the firm belief that the new organisation will, over time, become much stronger than the sum of its parts. Kia ora koutou.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022ec266512-9fe8-47da-883e-48f046ee5059\u0022 data-id=\u002279664cda82bd4e0eb94674e492636d7d\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000552\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ec266512-9fe8-47da-883e-48f046ee5059\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002279664cda82bd4e0eb94674e492636d7d\u0022\u003ETE URUROA FLAVELL (M\u0101ori Party\u2014Waiariki):\u003C/span\u003E T\u0113n\u0101 koe, Mr Assistant Speaker. Kia ora an\u014D t\u0101tou. \u0100, ko te tikanga o t\u0113nei pire e ai ki t\u0101ku e kite nei he \u0101hua m\u0101rama ana. He whakawh\u0101nui i te wh\u0101inga, me ng\u0101 mahi o te society nei, kia t\u0101pirihia atu ki te mahi rangahau \u0101-tangata, ar\u0101, ko te humanities. E tika ana ki te \u0101ta rangahau i te society nei, i te mea mai i t\u014Dna t\u012Bmatanga i te tau 1867, k\u0101ore an\u014D t\u0113tahi kia t\u014D mai me k\u012B, i te r\u014Dp\u016B nei ki te ao h\u014Du. Ko te mate k\u0113, koinei anake te mea e whakaarohia nei e te Royal Society ki te t\u014D mai i te hunga nei ki te ao h\u014Du, ar\u0101 ko te humanities t\u0113r\u0101. Ehara i te mea he huarahi m\u0101m\u0101 t\u0113nei. Kua puta te pire nei i muri mai i ng\u0101 mahi a ng\u0101 p\u016Bkenga o K\u014Dtimana, me K\u0101nata, me t\u0113tahi kirimana i waenganui i te society nei, me Te Wh\u0101inga Aronui m\u014D ng\u0101 humanities. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000553\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ec266512-9fe8-47da-883e-48f046ee5059\u0022\u003EKua kaha whakapau te Royal Society ki te kupu kotahi. Ar\u0101, ki t\u0101 te P\u0101ti M\u0101ori, me huri k\u0113 ki ng\u0101 kupu e wh\u0101: Te Tiriti o Waitangi. N\u0101, ko te wh\u0101inga nui o te pire nei, he hiahia n\u014D r\u0101tou ki te \u0101ki, ki te whakanui, ki te whakarangatira i t\u0113nei mea ko te humanities. He mea pai t\u0113r\u0101. N\u0101 reira, me p\u0101tai i te p\u0101tai p\u0113nei \u0101 \u0113tahi atu: he aha t\u0113nei mea ko te humanities? Ar\u0101 an\u014D ng\u0101 momo reo, ng\u0101 momo tuhinga, ng\u0101 momo ture, ng\u0101 h\u012Btori, ng\u0101 momo kaupapa here, ng\u0101 momo tikanga \u0101-h\u0101hi, tae atu ki ng\u0101 mahi \u0101-r\u0113hia. Me k\u012B, technology, anthropology an\u014D hoki cultural studies, te mea, te mea. Ar\u0101 an\u014D he k\u014Drero m\u014D te \u0101huatanga o te tangata. Ko te mate k\u0113, kaua ko te tangata M\u0101ori, kaua ko te tangata whenua r\u0101nei. Karekau he paku k\u014Drero i roto i te ture, ar\u0101 te Royal Society of New Zealand Act 1997, ki te Tiriti o Waitangi. Ki a m\u0101tou, me whai w\u0101hi te tiriti i roto i t\u0113nei momo ako. Me whai w\u0101hi an\u014D hoki t\u0113nei mea te cultural competency. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000554\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ec266512-9fe8-47da-883e-48f046ee5059\u0022\u003EI te mea \u0101 k\u014D ake nei ka puta te p\u016Brongo o te Wai 262, me titiro wh\u0101nui t\u0101tou. Ko te tirohanga wh\u0101nui e k\u014Drerohia ana ko t\u0113r\u0101, me k\u012B i roto i te reo P\u0101keh\u0101, me k\u012B ko t\u0113tahi k\u014Drero kua k\u014Drerohia nei. Anei te k\u014Drero tino rangatiratanga and kaitiaki by the claimants over indigenous flora and fauna and other taonga, and also over m\u0101tauranga M\u0101ori, M\u0101ori traditional knowledge. Ana ko t\u0113r\u0101 k\u014Drero kua roa e k\u014Drerohia ana i roto i te Wai 262. N\u014D reira koinei te tikanga o taku k\u012B atu, me titiro wh\u0101nui t\u0101tou ki \u0113nei \u0101huatanga katoa, kaua ko te humanities me tana titiro wh\u0101iti nei, me whakawh\u0101nui tonu te titiro. Ka mutu, kei te titiro an\u014D hoki p\u0113nei i t\u0101ku e k\u014Drero nei, kei te titiro m\u0101tou ki te \u0101huatanga o te piringa o te Tiriti o Waitangi, ki t\u0113nei pire. N\u0101 runga i te aha? N\u0101 runga i te mea ko te Tiriti o Waitangi i t\u014Dna wh\u0101nuitanga, he titiro an\u014D r\u0101 ki ng\u0101 rawa o Tangaroa, ki te whenua e takoto nei, ki te taiao, me k\u012B ng\u0101 momo rangahau, \u0113nei \u0101huatanga katoa. N\u014D reira ko t\u0101 m\u0101tou ko te k\u012B atu, me titiro an\u014D hoki ki a ng\u0101i M\u0101ori, me te \u0101huatanga o te noho o te tangata me tana m\u014Dhio ki te Ao M\u0101ori, me ng\u0101 mea o iwi k\u0113. Koinei te \u0101huatanga o t\u0113nei mea. Te t\u016Bmanako ia ka tautoko t\u0113nei r\u014Dp\u016B i te whakaputanga o M\u0101taatua, tae atu ki te whakaputanga o te ao, ar\u0101 i te reo P\u0101keh\u0101, Declaration on the Rights of Indigenous Peoples. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000555\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ec266512-9fe8-47da-883e-48f046ee5059\u0022\u003EN\u014D reira he paku whakaaro noa ake \u0113nei, kua puta i a m\u0101tou i te p\u014D nei m\u014D t\u0113nei pire. Kei te tautoko ake te P\u0101ti M\u0101ori i t\u0113nei pire i t\u014Dna p\u0101nuitanga tuatahi, me te t\u016Bmanako ia ka k\u014Drerohia wh\u0101nuitia \u0113nei take i te komiti wh\u0101iti.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000556\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ec266512-9fe8-47da-883e-48f046ee5059\u0022\u003E[Greetings to you, Mr Assistant Speaker, and to all of us once again. The purpose of this bill appears fairly simple: to expand the objective and functions of the Royal Society to include the humanities. One would think it both logical and necessary that a society that has been operating since 1867 actually becomes updated. Believe it or not, all that the Royal Society thinks is necessary to meet the contemporary need of our communities is to add one word: humanities. It is not as easy as one might think. This bill has come about only after the analysis of scholars from Scotland and Canada, and as a consequence of this society signing up to a memorandum of understanding with Te Wh\u0101inga Aronui / the Council for the Humanities. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000557\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ec266512-9fe8-47da-883e-48f046ee5059\u0022\u003EBut if the energies of the Royal Society have gone into just one word\u2014 humanities\u2014the M\u0101ori Party wants to encourage a wider focus on just four words: Te Tiriti o Waitangi. What exactly do we mean by humanities? Examples of the disciplines of the humanities are ancient and modern languages, literature, law, history, philosophy, religion, and the visual and performing arts. Other disciplines include technology, anthropology, and cultural studies. They are about the human condition, but not about M\u0101ori humans, or tangata whenua. There is no reference in the Royal Society of New Zealand Act 1997 to the Treaty of Waitangi. It is our view that the Treaty should be included in these areas. The development of these areas should occur within an environment of cultural competency. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000558\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ec266512-9fe8-47da-883e-48f046ee5059\u0022\u003EAs the report on the Wai 262 claim draws near, we should be aware of the broader vision of that claim. Basically, that vision is one that promotes tino rangatiratanga and kaitiaki by the claimants over indigenous flora and fauna and other taonga, and also over m\u0101tauranga M\u0101ori, M\u0101ori traditional knowledge. That stance has been long discussed around the Wai 262 claim. And that is why I said we should take a broad view in terms of these matters, as opposed to the narrow view of the humanities. In subsequent phases of this bill we will be looking for the connection between the Treaty of Waitangi, natural resources, the environment, the economy, the arts and culture, and research, science, and technology. We would also like to see a greater understanding between M\u0101ori and non-M\u0101ori cultures, and support for indigenous declarations such as the M\u0101taatua declaration and the Declaration on the Rights of Indigenous Peoples. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000559\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ec266512-9fe8-47da-883e-48f046ee5059\u0022\u003EThese are our views expressed tonight about this bill. The M\u0101ori Party will support this bill at its first reading, and looks forward to further debate on these matters in the select committee.]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022a68928ea-9dd8-4a30-8e2c-a0f49dfc8bea\u0022 data-id=\u0022ddb4a95de2f74af5815380f1cff973fe\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000560\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a68928ea-9dd8-4a30-8e2c-a0f49dfc8bea\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022ddb4a95de2f74af5815380f1cff973fe\u0022\u003ELOUISE UPSTON (National\u2014Taup\u014D):\u003C/span\u003E I am pleased to stand in support of the Royal Society of New Zealand Amendment Bill in the name of Grant Robertson. He was so disappointed I did not continue my speech on the Franklin District Council (Contribution to Funding of Museums) Amendment Bill that I wanted to rise and make sure that he was able to hear some more of what I have to contribute to the House. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000561\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a68928ea-9dd8-4a30-8e2c-a0f49dfc8bea\u0022\u003EI acknowledge the clarity with which the member for Wellington Central explained the purpose of this bill, so I will not go into a lot of the detail, other than to say that it is tidy-up legislation at the request of the Royal Society of New Zealand. I think one of the interesting things is that in effect this bill brings the humanities, or the social sciences, into the world of the Royal Society of New Zealand. We have heard about the potential that could occur with such a blend. I think one of the members of the House referred to it as the difference between coming from Venus and coming from Mars. It might also be seen as blending oil and water, depending on one\u2019s perspective. But I do not think anyone will disagree with me that this is an important step forward for the development of the Royal Society, with the inclusion of the humanities and social sciences, in its strive to foster another wing of science in New Zealand. I believe that it will enhance the work that the society already does in terms of excellence in research and science. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000562\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a68928ea-9dd8-4a30-8e2c-a0f49dfc8bea\u0022\u003EI also agree with Allan Peachey, the chair of the Education and Science Committee and former student of Ruapehu College, that we will have a good discussion when the bill gets to the select committee. I shall look forward to seeing whether there are any additions that Mr Robertson might want to put forward in terms of aspects of the humanities that might be extended to be included. This is a bill that I believe we will all support. It is important to note that $500,000 from Vote Research, Science and Technology goes to the society each year to support its objectives and functions. This is a Government that supports science and technology, and I am proud to support this bill.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022 data-id=\u00223b998243d6dc41638cb6c02b272e068f\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000563\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00223b998243d6dc41638cb6c02b272e068f\u0022\u003EGRANT ROBERTSON (Labour\u2014Wellington Central):\u003C/span\u003E This is just a brief call in reply to thank members for their support of the Royal Society of New Zealand Amendment Bill in its first reading. It has been fascinating to hear of the qualifications and scientific expertise of members across the House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000564\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003EI did not attend Ruapehu College; I went to a high school in Dunedin. I did not take science classes for very long, and it is much to my regret that I did not because it is a subject that I greatly enjoy. I am a graduate in the humanities, and I look to my fellow graduate in the humanities across the House, the Hon Judith Collins, for support. I have an honours degree in political science. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000565\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003EPolitical science is not on the current list of humanities subjects in the bill. Obviously when the bill finds its way to the select committee we may need to discuss that matter, although I do note that the bill states \u201Cincludes\u201D those subjects. Perhaps it is simply taken as read that political science is one of the leading humanities subjects. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000566\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003EIn all seriousness, I take on board the comments made by Te Ururoa Flavell. I am sure that the Royal Society of New Zealand will be listening to this debate and they may well contact Mr Flavell to discuss his suggestions. I am sure that the committee will be interested to talk about them. I thank colleagues for their support for the bill and I look forward to its quick progress through the House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000567\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003EBill read a first time. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000568\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003EBill referred to the Education and Science Committee.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n    \u003C/div\u003E\n    \u003Cdiv class=\u0022HpsHansard\u0022\u003E\n      \u003Cp\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsProceedingHeading\u0022\u003EBills\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000569\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u00228ca0e79056e945e8b1f46b301ae4f0a8\u0022\u003ESale of Liquor (Objections to Applications) Amendment Bill\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000570\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u0022070e3cf7fd654d97bbefbc998617f489\u0022\u003ESecond Reading\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00228e686b62-8dc4-4f03-a7b6-2d0f9c874e9a\u0022 data-id=\u00221bbec078cf5f4aee952b84b9882702dd\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000571\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00228e686b62-8dc4-4f03-a7b6-2d0f9c874e9a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00221bbec078cf5f4aee952b84b9882702dd\u0022\u003EHon GEORGE HAWKINS (Labour\u2014Manurewa):\u003C/span\u003E I move, That the Sale of Liquor (Objections to Applications) Amendment Bill be now read a second time. First, I acknowledge most people in this House for the way in which this bill got to the House in the first place. I must acknowledge people like Judith Collins who helped me get the bill in without having to go through a ballot. I also acknowledge Pita Sharples, the leadership of the Green Party at the time, and, especially, my own Labour colleagues. This bill has been completely successful and even if it falls tonight it will have done the job it set out to do. I acknowledge that this bill went to the Social Services Committee on 2 July 2008\u2014in the last Parliament. The report back from the select committee states: \u201CWe note recent announcements by the Government that it will introduce legislation that will address the issues covered by this bill.\u201D I think that when one has a member\u2019s bill accepted by the Government through the select committee process, one has to be pleased. I have been kept up to date by the chairwoman of the committee, Katrina Shanks, and I thank her. I also thank Simon Power, with whom I have talked about the bill. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000572\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00228e686b62-8dc4-4f03-a7b6-2d0f9c874e9a\u0022\u003EThis bill is about something we looked at even before the time when Mr Singh, who owned a liquor store in Randwick Park, was shot. But that highlighted the issue. I had been working with a young Manukau city councillor, Daniel Newman, over the issue of the explosion in the number of liquor outlets in South Auckland. But this bill is not just about South Auckland. It is about the number of liquor stores exploding all over the place and into neighbourhoods, and we see the results of that. Young people can get a dozen cans of ready-to-drink liquor for less than $20. It is a real problem; it is a huge problem. When I have people like Daniel Newman working with me to get a bill before the House, it is really worthwhile. When the bill came into the House it passed its first reading by 113 to 2. The two members against the bill at the time were Rodney Hide and Heather Roy. They were like mountaineers roped together and they did not want the bill because, I think, they thought it dealt just with South Auckland, which it does not. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000573\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00228e686b62-8dc4-4f03-a7b6-2d0f9c874e9a\u0022\u003EWe see booze outlets on every street corner. Dairies sell more alcohol than milk. We have seen the explosion in the availability of liquor in supermarkets. Of course, we have also seen the explosion that runs parallel with the increasing availability of liquor\u2014the increase in domestic violence. Domestic violence, alcohol, and crime are all partners that are a scourge on our communities. I think that the cooperation across the House is Parliament at its best. It is very good that people support this measure. There will be a vote at the end of this debate, and, whether or not the bill goes any further, it has done its job and that is what is important. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000574\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00228e686b62-8dc4-4f03-a7b6-2d0f9c874e9a\u0022\u003EThe Law Commission has come out with a huge book\u2014a report. Some people might use the report for a doorstop, but I suggest to them that they read it very carefully. I have changed my mind quite a bit over liquor. I used to be one of those people who thought that there should not be an age limit for the purchase of liquor, and I voted for 18 as the age limit. I have changed my mind; I think it should be 20. I am not going to go for the 18-20 split, 18 for licensed premises and 20 for off-licence premises, but so be it. But this bill has given people an opportunity to think about what is going on. My only disappointment is that because of the Law Commission\u2019s report, it is going to take some time before a bill gets into the House. I see that as being necessary; I am not seeing that as a criticism. But it is unlikely that we will have new liquor laws in the term of this Parliament. We may do; maybe there will be cooperation where people want to see liquor laws changed dramatically. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000575\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00228e686b62-8dc4-4f03-a7b6-2d0f9c874e9a\u0022\u003ELet us look at what has been happening. The key features of my bill really give local communities far more say. If people apply for a liquor licence, they will have to do a social impact report, and I think that is hugely important. The public will have more time to put in objections. At the moment, it is 10 working days. I think that should be lengthened, but however long the Government decides it should be, so be it. But we also want to have organisations like schools, churches, and kindergartens being able to say what the impact will be on them; at the moment they cannot. I think that when people start thinking about this, they will realise that communities are trying to take hold of the issue themselves. Yes, we have had people who have been hand-wringers, and who think this bill is likely to fall at this hurdle. Well, that is not a problem. We have people from the Labour Party, my very good colleagues from the National Party, the M\u0101ori Party, and the Greens all very sincere in their belief of what should happen. No one in New Zealand actually thinks that the law does not need to be changed. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000576\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00228e686b62-8dc4-4f03-a7b6-2d0f9c874e9a\u0022\u003EWhy did this bill cover only a small area? Well, I have been here a long while\u2014some people say too long.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000577\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022f25284ce6e5646a9aa5bfecbf5217709\u0022\u003ECam Calder\u003C/span\u003E: No, never!\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000578\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00228e686b62-8dc4-4f03-a7b6-2d0f9c874e9a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002222c6826e78394843b9ea24091a733612\u0022\u003EHon GEORGE HAWKINS\u003C/span\u003E: Thanks. The member from the North Shore is yelling out that he wants me to stay longer. When we see things changing in a society and the law tries to catch up with that later, I think feelings are fairly intense. When we can look around at many off-licences and see a dozen ready-to-drink beverages for $20\u2014and they taste so sickly sweet that young people think they can swallow them down like nobody\u2019s business\u2014of course there are consequences to that. Alcohol makes a huge difference to the work of the police. Any moves that we can make to help the police combat liquor with better laws will be to our advantage.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000579\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00228e686b62-8dc4-4f03-a7b6-2d0f9c874e9a\u0022\u003ELater on I will move that there be a personal vote on this bill, but I invite people to have a close think about the bill. I realise that many people will think this bill has done its job completely, and will vote for it to be ended. There will be others who think that getting the bill into the House may keep the Government a little more honest. I conclude by thanking all those people who have helped with what is a very serious proposition. Thank you.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022a744a9a7-a2e8-401b-abfb-aec22a3818c8\u0022 data-id=\u0022ef4fe7fe7105430dbc213da40630b796\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000580\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a744a9a7-a2e8-401b-abfb-aec22a3818c8\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022ef4fe7fe7105430dbc213da40630b796\u0022\u003EKATRINA SHANKS (National):\u003C/span\u003E It is my pleasure to take a call tonight on the Sale of Liquor (Objections to Applications) Amendment Bill. First of all, I congratulate the member George Hawkins on bringing this member\u2019s bill to the House in 2008. This member has a huge heart. He saw an issue in his patch and wanted to make a difference. He saw the destruction that liquor was causing where he is, in South Auckland, so he brought a bill to the House to try to address that. The bill is quite narrow; it is in relation to licences and the number of outlets there can be in an area. The number of outlets that have appeared, popping up all over the place like mushrooms, is a concern for all New Zealand. George is absolutely right when he says that one can walk down the road, especially in the area where he comes from, and on every corner one can see liquor outlets that are selling liquor, in one form or another, and selling it very cheaply. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000581\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a744a9a7-a2e8-401b-abfb-aec22a3818c8\u0022\u003EThe Social Services Committee, which I chair, looked at this bill and we decided that we would not support it or recommend that it be passed by the House, for the simple reason that times have moved on a little bit. Liquor reform has come into place, and we have had the package that the Government has put out. It adopted 126 of the 153 recommendations from the Law Commission, and these recommendations cover the bill that George brought in. The select committee voted down this bill before its return to the House, for the reason that there will be legislation later on that New Zealand will debate that will cover these issues, and many other issues as well. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000582\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a744a9a7-a2e8-401b-abfb-aec22a3818c8\u0022\u003EWe all know that liquor and alcohol issues are not isolated just to liquor outlets. There is a much bigger discussion, which this country has already had, and we have had some clear signs from the people in this country that they are not happy with what we do with our liquor and alcohol, or with the way in which we drink in New Zealand. In fact, I have been out and about in \u014Ch\u0101riu on that issue. I held a public meeting at which a cross-section of people in the community talked to me about what they saw were the issues with alcohol in their patch of \u014Ch\u0101riu. It was interesting that one of them was a bar owner in the city\u2014he owns a number of bars\u2014but he was one of the biggest advocates for tightening up the opening hours. He said that he was happy for bars to be closed at 2 a.m., because after that time bars in the city make no money. He was happy to say that we should raise the drinking age to 20, because he did not want 18-year-olds in his bars and clubs. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000583\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a744a9a7-a2e8-401b-abfb-aec22a3818c8\u0022\u003EIt was really interesting. Where we thought we would have opposition, there was none. It was the sector itself that was sending clear messages back to me, in \u014Ch\u0101riu, that people are happy for the provisions to be much tighter. There was a real cross-section of people at that meeting. We had a great discussion about demand and supply, and I feel that a lot of this legislation is hitting the supply side of the issue: restriction of the number of licences, restriction of the hours for drinking, liquor bans, and a restriction on the purchase age\u2014the whole area to do with liquor and supply. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000584\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a744a9a7-a2e8-401b-abfb-aec22a3818c8\u0022\u003EBut if we want to talk about our drinking issues, we can see that it is not just a matter of supply but demand. It is the way we are drinking, the culture of drinking, and the way we accept binge drinking as acceptable. A couple of months ago I went out with the police in Wellington. They picked me up at midnight and dropped me off at 4.30 in the morning\u2014it was a bit like a date. They showed me exactly what is happening in the city, in Wellington, in the early hours of the morning. It was pretty appalling, and we have to see it to believe it. At 3 o\u2019clock in the morning people are still queuing to get into clubs; their night is still going, and they have another club to go to after the current one. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000585\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a744a9a7-a2e8-401b-abfb-aec22a3818c8\u0022\u003EI saw the way in which girls, particularly, were drinking on the streets: falling over, feeling hilarious that they were all so drunk, and throwing up into rubbish bins\u2014it was a great blast. Well, it is not a great blast. Actually, when we are doing that and we think it is really funny, then something is going wrong. And something is going wrong out there, with the way our youth in particular think it is great to drink like that. But it is not just a youth issue: it is a generational issue. I know that within my own age group, we still see people going out and getting wasted. But what signal is that sending to the youth of New Zealand? Not a very good signal, at all. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000586\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a744a9a7-a2e8-401b-abfb-aec22a3818c8\u0022\u003EAfter having been out with the police and holding a public meeting, I am now on a crusade around my schools. I am going into social studies classes at my secondary schools and talking to students about drinking. I ask them what their views are on drinking, and I find they are really interesting. They are 14 and 15-year-olds, and some of them are already going out drinking, which is really interesting but a bit distressing. But the consensus coming out of those classes is that we have to do something about the way we are drinking. The students in the classes at the schools that I visited were OK with the drinking age being raised. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000587\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a744a9a7-a2e8-401b-abfb-aec22a3818c8\u0022\u003EIt is interesting to see that there is a lot of support for change in the way we are drinking and support for the alcohol and liquor reforms. Therefore, I am looking forward to seeing legislation come to the House in relation to the liquor reforms. I thank George Hawkins for the work he did in bringing this issue to the fore, back in 2008, when he was really concerned about what was happening in his communities. That is a sign of a very good local MP. So I say congratulations to him, and I thank the House for allowing me to speak tonight. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022802874a3-deca-48b7-9d33-9087058892f5\u0022 data-id=\u00223584be5cd67b46c9992d256caad996ed\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000588\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022802874a3-deca-48b7-9d33-9087058892f5\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00223584be5cd67b46c9992d256caad996ed\u0022\u003EKELVIN DAVIS (Labour):\u003C/span\u003E Te mea tuatahi m\u0101ku hei t\u012Bmata k\u014Drero, he tuku atu i ng\u0101 whakaaro ki w\u0113r\u0101 ng\u0101 t\u014Dtara o te Ao M\u0101ori kua hinga atu, ar\u0101, ko T\u0101 Archie Taiaroa r\u0101ua ko Jim Nicholls. N\u0101 reira e kourua, haere, haere, haere atu r\u0101. Ka oti. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000589\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022802874a3-deca-48b7-9d33-9087058892f5\u0022\u003E[To begin with, the first thing for me to do is to convey condolences to those t\u014Dtara of M\u0101oridom who have passed away: Sir Archie Taiaroa and Jim Nicholls. So to you two, depart, farewell, journey on. It is done.]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000590\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022802874a3-deca-48b7-9d33-9087058892f5\u0022\u003EAbout 2 months ago my brother was sworn in as a District Court judge at our marae, and his first week on the job was down in Wellington at the court around the corner from Parliament. On the Wednesday evening after 3 days on the job we had dinner at Parliament. Of course, I asked him about his impressions of his first 3 days on the job. He said to me that it was very sad, but if it were not for alcohol, he would be redundant. He said that 80 to 90 percent of the cases that he had seen in those 3 days were the result of alcohol-related incidents. I think we really need to reflect on the fact that a District Court judge is basically saying that he would be redundant if it were not for alcohol. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000591\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022802874a3-deca-48b7-9d33-9087058892f5\u0022\u003EI am on the horns of a dilemma, because I am also Labour\u2019s spokesperson on tourism, and the tourism industry and the alcohol industry are comfortable bedfellows. We have to realise that tourists come here and enjoy a drink\u2014they enjoy the wine, the bars, and that whole scene\u2014and it is an important part of tourism. We do not want to be killjoys. I was talking to a person in the tourism industry who said to me on the whole alcohol issue that I had to remember exactly who I am the spokesperson for. I am the spokesperson on tourism. I said to him that was right, but he had to remember that long before I was the spokesperson on tourism, long before I was a member of Parliament, and, in fact, for all of my life, I have been M\u0101ori. I have to balance up the effect and the impact of alcohol on M\u0101ori. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000592\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022802874a3-deca-48b7-9d33-9087058892f5\u0022\u003EI will quote a few things from the Alcohol Advisory Council of New Zealand\u2019s M\u0101ori action plan 2009-12. It said that 66 percent of M\u0101ori youth aged between 12 and 17 years identified themselves as drinkers. These people are not even legally allowed to drink, yet 66 percent of M\u0101ori in that age group already identify themselves as drinkers. Thirty-six percent of M\u0101ori surveyed were binge-drinkers, with M\u0101ori adults reporting that they had consumed on average 8.9 standard drinks on the most recent occasion they drank alcohol\u2014so 9 standard drinks. Some people would have had one or two, and others would have had 15, 16, 18, or 19 standard drinks on the most recent occasion. Thirty-one percent of M\u0101ori adult drinkers reported getting drunk on the most recent occasion, with 16 percent reporting that they had intended to get drunk on that occasion. Worse still, 45 percent of M\u0101ori youth aged 15 to 17 reported getting drunk the most recent time they drank alcohol, with 25 percent\u2014a quarter\u2014reporting that they had planned to get drunk. Sixty-six percent agreed that it is acceptable to get drunk at parties; we just heard the member Katrina Shanks talking about how people go to Courtenay Place and deliberately get drunk. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000593\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022802874a3-deca-48b7-9d33-9087058892f5\u0022\u003EThis vulnerability of our intoxicated youth worries and concerns me. Most M\u0101ori drinkers reported having experienced some form of harmful or regrettable experience from their drinking in the previous 12 months. Added to that, Te Rau Hinengaro: The New Zealand Mental Health Survey also identified that the most common lifetime disorders among M\u0101ori were anxiety disorders, at 31 percent, followed by substance use disorders, at 26 percent. I would say that the anxiety disorders were contributed to in no mean way by the substance use. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000594\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022802874a3-deca-48b7-9d33-9087058892f5\u0022\u003EThe facts that I have just read out from that report are supported by my experience up in Kait\u0101ia as an educator. I recall having a conversation with a policeman who told me that on Thursday, Friday, and Saturday nights the police go around picking up and dragging up intoxicated school-age students\u2014primary school age, intermediate school age, and college age\u2014from the alleyways and the car parks of Kait\u0101ia. He told me how they have to drag them into the police car and half the time the kids vomit in the back. The police get them home to the parents, knock on the door\u2014the parents do not know where they have been\u2014and basically give the children to the parents, telling them to make sure they do not choke on their vomit. That is the reality of the situation in Kait\u0101ia. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000595\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022802874a3-deca-48b7-9d33-9087058892f5\u0022\u003EThis policeman told me about one particular girl, who went to the school where I was principal, whom he had to pick up one night when she was totally comatose. I said that that girl\u2019s family could not afford to buy alcohol and did not have the money for it. I asked how she got the money to buy the alcohol. He said to me that she does not buy the alcohol. She gives favours to the guy at a particular liquor store, and that is how she gets her alcohol. We have to be mindful. At the time this girl was 12 or 13 years of age, she was giving favours in return for alcohol. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000596\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022802874a3-deca-48b7-9d33-9087058892f5\u0022\u003EThe Law Commission report Alcohol In Our Lives: Curbing the Harm said: \u201CThere is little scope under the present Act for communities to have a say in licensing decisions.\u201D The Sale of Liquor (Objections to Applications) Amendment Bill, which George Hawkins has brought to the House, changes that. It gives communities the chance to have a say in alcohol licensing decisions. The report also says: \u201CA common theme in the consultation was the disempowerment many people feel because the existing legal framework effectively discounts the views of the local community when making decisions about where and how alcohol is sold. Several people told us the category of people who can object to a licence application needs to be widened, but the real concern of many was that even though they lived in the neighbourhood there was no basis on which they could object to a licence application other than in relation to the suitability of the applicant.\u201D This bill changes that. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000597\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022802874a3-deca-48b7-9d33-9087058892f5\u0022\u003EThe report says: \u201CThat the community had alcohol-related problems and locals did not want any more liquor outlets in the area was no basis for an objection. Community groups are increasingly expressing their concerns about alcohol and its impacts, as our consultation demonstrates. They want more say in decisions about where and how alcohol is sold, supplied and consumed in their neighbourhoods.\u201D The bill that George Hawkins has brought to the House does exactly that. It gives the communities more say on where and how alcohol can be sold. Also, the bill \u201Crequires an applicant for an on-licence or an off-licence to carry out an evaluation of the social impacts on the community.\u201D I ask how one carries out an evaluation of the social impact on a 12 or 13-year-old girl who has to give favours to somebody in exchange for alcohol. The social impact on her life and her family\u2019s life into her future is immeasurable. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000598\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022802874a3-deca-48b7-9d33-9087058892f5\u0022\u003EWe as M\u0101ori have a bit to answer for ourselves. I was just talking to my colleague Stuart Nash about when our marae dining hall was opened in 1990 up north and we had 50 kegs of beer. We got through only 38 of them that night, which because of our attitude at the time we laughed about. That illustrates the attitude that we have towards glorifying alcohol. As I stand to speak now, I am embarrassed by that attitude from us as M\u0101ori, which allows alcohol to become such a big part of our lives. Hopefully this bill will go some way to changing that attitude, but it certainly gives communities the power to make decisions regarding alcohol within their communities. Thank you.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00225f1453f8-c44e-4ce6-b699-64d600322276\u0022 data-id=\u00228ae9ce651a084ff3adabd1385bc21517\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000599\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225f1453f8-c44e-4ce6-b699-64d600322276\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00228ae9ce651a084ff3adabd1385bc21517\u0022\u003ECHESTER BORROWS (National\u2014Whanganui):\u003C/span\u003E The Sale of Liquor (Objections to Applications) Amendment Bill had its genesis in good, sound common sense. It is an attempt to overturn a jandal-slapping sort of sale of liquor bill from a previous decade. The fact is that the sale of liquor has been the subject of dog\u2019s breakfasts of legislation for many, many decades, as people have sought to liberalise and somehow change New Zealand\u2019s drinking culture and turn it into something it is not. Members who were involved in politics years ago will remember the votes that tried to turn the New Zealand drinking culture into something sort of cultural. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000600\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002267431f57-e958-4c83-b438-7da8061d479e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022ab2d0a942cb1409e96f7dda870aa7007\u0022\u003EPaul Quinn\u003C/span\u003E: The French.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000601\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225f1453f8-c44e-4ce6-b699-64d600322276\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022c66c4d4f42de42f19dcfb6b4282f3dda\u0022\u003ECHESTER BORROWS\u003C/span\u003E: Apparently we all needed to be drinking like the French. We know that the French drink all day at various times. They start at a young age and they carry on until they fall over. No one seemed to remember that they have a high rate of alcoholism in their country. But we sought to move the drinking culture within New Zealand away from something that was confined by hours, age, legislation, and occasion and turn it into something where anything goes. Our drinking culture certainly needed to be changed but, boy, some dumb stuff was done. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000602\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225f1453f8-c44e-4ce6-b699-64d600322276\u0022\u003ENow people are seeking to march the sale of liquor legislation back about 30 years, forgetting that 30 years ago one was not allowed to have liquor in the vicinity of a dance hall, for instance. That meant there would be about 50 guys standing around the boot of an old Vauxhall with a couple of crates in it, sharing 10 flagons. In those days it was a totally different world from the one we find ourselves in today, and now, thankfully, the member George Hawkins has, quite rightly, brought before the House a bill that says it is time we had a bit of balance. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000603\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225f1453f8-c44e-4ce6-b699-64d600322276\u0022\u003EPrevious Parliaments wandered off down the track of liberalising everything. We took the age down to 18, and we took off any constraints on new products, like the ready-to-drinks that were spoken about. We tend to give some credence to people who make their money out of the liquor industry, and we listen to their lobbying. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000604\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225f1453f8-c44e-4ce6-b699-64d600322276\u0022\u003EWe decided that a supermarket was something that sold alcohol, and we did not think that every corner dairy would also seek to sell alcohol. We thought that a supermarket that was acres and acres in size was better and more careful than any other vendor of alcohol. What quickly happened was that those big supermarket chains moved as fast as they could to sell as much alcohol as they could as cheaply as they could at any hour of the day that they could. They did a really good job of it, to the effect that today 70 percent of all alcohol consumed in this country is sold by supermarkets to people who may or may not enjoy too many drops. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000605\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225f1453f8-c44e-4ce6-b699-64d600322276\u0022\u003EThe point is that as far as the retail side of it is concerned, supermarkets are probably the most compliant of any alcohol retail outlet. It is much harder to buy alcohol from the supermarket when one is drunk or underage than it is to buy it from anywhere else, but that does not mean we do not have a problem with supermarkets selling alcohol, and the new legislation that is coming before the House will restrict that. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000606\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225f1453f8-c44e-4ce6-b699-64d600322276\u0022\u003EThe ready-to-drink concoctions that have become so popular with people, especially young people wanting to get into drinking alcohol, are being marketed to young people as alcohol that does not even taste like alcohol. They sell it by the pallet-load, and it has alcohol per volume of somewhere between 4 percent and 20 percent. The proposed legislation will reduce the alcohol per volume to no more than 5 percent, and that is a good thing. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000607\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225f1453f8-c44e-4ce6-b699-64d600322276\u0022\u003EObviously, the House is looking quite strongly at the split-age option whereby people over the age of 18 can buy alcohol in hotels and on licensed premises but people must be 20 years of age to buy alcohol at an off-licence. The purpose of that, of course, is to raise the de facto drinking age, which at the moment is somewhere around the early to mid teens. We need very much to do something about that. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000608\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225f1453f8-c44e-4ce6-b699-64d600322276\u0022\u003EThe thrust behind the Hon George Hawkins\u2019 bill is about giving local people the ability to impact on local decisions as to who can sell alcohol within their communities. We have ridiculous situations where dairies opposite secondary schools are selling alcohol at $1 per can or $1 per ready-to-drink. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000609\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225f1453f8-c44e-4ce6-b699-64d600322276\u0022\u003EAn 18-year-old student can wander across the road at lunchtime and legitimately buy alcohol in lots of one or two, because that is the way the vendor is prepared to sell it. Vendors are not allowed to sell cigarettes in ones and twos, but they can sell cans of alcohol in ones and twos and some of them are up to 20 percent proof. Students can drink that alcohol in the school grounds as part of lunch\u2014or maybe it is lunch\u2014and then head back to the classroom for a snooze before heading home after school and picking up a bit of alcohol to knock off when they get there. It is absolutely ridiculous. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000610\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225f1453f8-c44e-4ce6-b699-64d600322276\u0022\u003EThe gap in the current legislation means that no good-minded citizen is able to object to a new consent being granted on the basis that there are already enough liquor outlets in the community, or on the basis of their proximity to schools or other venues around the community. That is fundamentally wrong. Mr Hawkins\u2019 bill seeks to change that and allow local people to have some input. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000611\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225f1453f8-c44e-4ce6-b699-64d600322276\u0022\u003EWe know that there will be a national alcohol plan, and that district councils will be encouraged to have district alcohol plans, and part of that planning process will be consultation with communities. Any application for consent\u2014not just for new premises but also the reinstatement of an existing consent\u2014will be up for members of the public to object to on a whole range of sensible bases, and good on them. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000612\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225f1453f8-c44e-4ce6-b699-64d600322276\u0022\u003EI thank the member for bringing the issue before the House. I believe that in many ways it has been a catalyst for the Law Commission and parties on both sides of the House to look at the issue and to give back to the communities the ability to object to local consents, which are the very mechanisms people are using to have a negative effect on our children and our communities. Thank you.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022eaaad191-62cf-43e8-a772-63a71dbf4d4a\u0022 data-id=\u0022e316ae9d72d04591a39ff09ada469be7\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000613\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022eaaad191-62cf-43e8-a772-63a71dbf4d4a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022e316ae9d72d04591a39ff09ada469be7\u0022\u003ESUE KEDGLEY (Green):\u003C/span\u003E We would like to congratulate George Hawkins on his Sale of Liquor (Objections to Applications) Amendment Bill, which is tremendously worthwhile, and will give communities some say over where liquor licences should be granted. We will certainly be voting to support the bill.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000614\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022eaaad191-62cf-43e8-a772-63a71dbf4d4a\u0022\u003EI remember when I was a Wellington city councillor, back in the 1990s\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000615\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a83ea07a-806c-45ad-95bb-eb2c481cd0e2\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022d0f88d645c4c4455bdcc704118053891\u0022\u003EHon Tony Ryall\u003C/span\u003E: Oh, the 1990s.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000616\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022eaaad191-62cf-43e8-a772-63a71dbf4d4a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00221fc8c5a35f864e4498bfdd6f19de6385\u0022\u003ESUE KEDGLEY\u003C/span\u003E: \u2014yes, it was a long time ago\u2014somebody decided to set up a bar right next to a school in Strathmore. It was also right next to where a whole lot of people lived, along with the school, in a very densely populated residential area. The whole community was totally opposed to it. Nobody wanted the bar, which was going to have gambling machines in it, to be established at that particular location. So the entire community came together. It was probably the biggest meeting ever held in the history of Strathmore. The whole community rallied around the cause and passed a resolution that it did not want that liquor outlet in its community, right next to the school and the community church. In the end, despite the whole community being unanimously opposed to the liquor outlet, there was nothing the community could do. It realised after many months of trying to stop the liquor outlet, with the help of me and other councillors, that basically it was completely powerless. The Sale of Liquor Act 1989 had relaxed conditions for obtaining a liquor licence to such a point that someone could set up a liquor licence anywhere in New Zealand, and the community was completely powerless.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000617\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022eaaad191-62cf-43e8-a772-63a71dbf4d4a\u0022\u003EWhen this legislation was being considered at the Social Services Committee, a submitter said that it had got to the point in New Zealand where the only things that people needed in order to get a liquor licence were a car park and a urinal, and away they went; they could sell alcohol, and the local community had virtually no say and no input. I was horrified by that personal experience, and I wondered why this Parliament had allowed it to happen. I ask why this Parliament allowed liquor outlets to be established in just about any community in New Zealand, and the conditions to be relaxed to such a point that communities had absolutely no say in whether or not a bar or liquor outlet could be set up right next to a school or a church. What was Parliament thinking in 1989, when it passed the Sale of Liquor Act and allowed that to happen? The same legislation allowed liquor to be sold in any supermarket in New Zealand, and in our dairies, and now supermarkets sell 70 percent of all the alcohol sold in New Zealand. I guess that there are members of Parliament who were here and who voted for the Sale of Liquor Act, which liberalised the sale of liquor to such an extent that we have had this proliferation of liquor outlets all over New Zealand.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000618\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022eaaad191-62cf-43e8-a772-63a71dbf4d4a\u0022\u003EAt the Health Committee a few years ago, the Public Health Association made an interesting submission. It presented a map of New Zealand that showed where the most liquor outlets were in New Zealand. The most liquor outlets were in low-income and poor areas, of Auckland in particular, but that was the case for all over New Zealand. In every low-income area, there was a vastly increased number of liquor outlets, liquor stores, fast-food outlets, and gambling outlets. It was completely predatory. We could see that the people setting up the liquor stores and gambling outlets were literally targeting the low-income areas of New Zealand, whereas areas like Remuera and so forth had very few outlets, at all. So it is completely predatory.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000619\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022eaaad191-62cf-43e8-a772-63a71dbf4d4a\u0022\u003EWe congratulate George Hawkins on this bill, which will give communities a say in alcohol licensing decisions; it is very, very long overdue. It will mean that there will have to be an evaluation of the social impact on the community. For example, once this bill is through, the people of Strathmore, who helplessly tried to stop the liquor outlet from opening there all those years ago, will be able to have an evaluation of the impact. They will be able to say that they believe a liquor outlet will have a disastrous impact on their community and that they oppose it.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000620\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022eaaad191-62cf-43e8-a772-63a71dbf4d4a\u0022\u003ENo doubt, the reason the Sale of Liquor Act went through, which so liberalised the sale of alcohol in New Zealand, was the influence of the liquor and hospitality industries. Their influence resulted in such an extraordinary liberalisation in New Zealand and the taking away of the rights of communities to have a say on where liquor outlets should be. We will see, and we are seeing now, the same influence of the liquor and hospitality industries on the debate on liquor legislation in New Zealand. We had the Law Commission report, which was a very far-reaching report, but immediately the Government decided that it would back away from the critical areas that Sir Geoffrey Palmer said need to be dealt with\u2014namely, the issues of price, marketing sponsorship, and advertising. I ask why the Government is ducking for cover over those issues, and why it refuses to deal with those issues when it has been told that they are the most significant issues that have an impact on liquor in New Zealand. Everyone in this House knows that it is because of the power of vested interests\u2014the power of the liquor industry, the hospitality industry, and the food industry. Those industries will have more say and more sway over this Parliament and what it agrees to than all of the submissions made by all of the people of New Zealand\u2014and there is overwhelming support from the people of New Zealand.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000621\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022eaaad191-62cf-43e8-a772-63a71dbf4d4a\u0022\u003EPeople are clamouring and saying that this is a once-in-a-generation opportunity for this Parliament to get it right and clamp down on the proliferation of liquor outlets all over New Zealand and on the absolute saturation of marketing sponsorship and advertising of liquor. We have this opportunity, and that is what the people of New Zealand are clamouring for. Unfortunately, the ghastly reality is that the influence of lobbying from the liquor and hospitality industries will cause this Government to fail to take the action that is needed, because it does not want to get offside with those industries. That is why we have the problem we have today, and I fear that the influence of those industries will prevent us from taking up any comprehensive set of policies, as the Law Commission has recommended.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000622\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022eaaad191-62cf-43e8-a772-63a71dbf4d4a\u0022\u003EI do not know how many members saw Close Up last night, but there was a discussion about why the Government would not lower the blood-alcohol level. An expert from Australia was saying that it was an embarrassment. He said that, quite simply, the power of the liquor and hospitality industries was the reason it was not happening. Bruce Robertson, chief executive of the Hospitality Association, had said on his website that the reason it was not happening was due to lobbying by the hospitality industry and the liquor industry. So those industries admit it. They admit that their lobbying is preventing the Government from taking the action that is needed, and I think that is a tragedy.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000623\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022eaaad191-62cf-43e8-a772-63a71dbf4d4a\u0022\u003EI offer George Hawkins our congratulations. It is a fantastic bill. We will be supporting it, and we just wish that the Law Commission\u2019s very comprehensive report was being implemented by this Parliament, and that we could finally start to undo the harm unleashed by the Sale of Liquor Act 1989. Thank you.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022ec266512-9fe8-47da-883e-48f046ee5059\u0022 data-id=\u002226170efeb7bc4345a5df8fcb330f646c\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000624\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ec266512-9fe8-47da-883e-48f046ee5059\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002226170efeb7bc4345a5df8fcb330f646c\u0022\u003ETE URUROA FLAVELL (M\u0101ori Party\u2014Waiariki):\u003C/span\u003E Mr Assistant Speaker, me mihi r\u0101 ki te mema ki a George Hawkins i t\u0113nei p\u014D. Kei te whakaae atu au ki t\u0101 te mema nei, \u0101, m\u014D tana whakaaro nui ki te whakatakoto i t\u0113nei pire ki mua i te aroaro o te P\u0101remata. Me mihi r\u0101 ki a ia, ko te t\u016Bmanako ia ka eke ki te taumata e wawatatia ana. Tata ki te kotahi rau tau kua hipa, i puta \u0113nei k\u014Drero i t\u0113tahi o ng\u0101 rangatira o taua w\u0101. Ko T\u0101 Apirana Ngata t\u0101ku e k\u014Drero nei. He k\u014Drero e p\u0101 tonu ana ki t\u0113nei o ng\u0101 pire. Anei tana k\u014Drero: \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000625\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ec266512-9fe8-47da-883e-48f046ee5059\u0022\u003E[Mr Assistant Speaker, I congratulate the member George Hawkins tonight. I support the member and his great foresight in bringing this bill before Parliament, and hope that what he is seeking is fulfilled. Close to a century ago, one of our finest leaders of that period, Sir Apirana Ngata, gave a frank account relevant to this bill, and I quote: ]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000626\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ec266512-9fe8-47da-883e-48f046ee5059\u0022\u003E \u201Cthere can be no question as to the amount of damage liquor has done to the people of my race \u2026 Whether the Maori will in a generation or so become a hardened and seasoned drinker, like the incoming Europeans, I do not know \u2026 My position is clear-cut; and that is, so far as the supply of liquor to Maoris is concerned, from my youth until now I have and shall oppose it everywhere.\u201D\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000627\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ec266512-9fe8-47da-883e-48f046ee5059\u0022\u003EKoinei t\u0101 Apirana Ngata. He nui taku p\u016Baroha m\u014D taua whakaaro. Ko ng\u0101 tatauranga e k\u012B ana, tokotoru o ia wh\u0101 tangata neke atu i te tekau m\u0101 waru tau te pakeke, kua tohungia he kaiinu waipiro, \u0101, hautoru o aua t\u0101ngata, kua tohungia he tino kino t\u0101 r\u0101tou inu waipiro. N\u0101 \u0113nei tatauranga m\u0101tou e tino \u0101wangawanga ana. E tino \u0101wangawanga ana m\u0101tou m\u014D ng\u0101 \u0101huatanga inu a ng\u0101 rangatahi, me te \u0101huatanga whakatairanga o t\u0113nei ng\u0101ngara. E p\u016Bmau tonu ana m\u0101tou ki te whakapono, he nui ng\u0101 huarahi whakam\u0101m\u0101 ake i ng\u0101 t\u016B\u0101huatanga kino kua puta i t\u0113nei mea te waipiro, e p\u0101ngia ana e Ng\u0101i M\u0101ori. Ko t\u0113tahi huarahi kua kitea e m\u0101tou, ko te mahitahi \u0101-wh\u0101nau nei. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000628\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ec266512-9fe8-47da-883e-48f046ee5059\u0022\u003EN\u014D reira, ki te hoki ki t\u0113nei pire, ko t\u0101 t\u0101tou in\u0101ianei, he r\u0101hui i te tuku raihana hokohoko, i raro i te pire Sale of Liquor Act 1989. Me k\u012B p\u0113nei, e noho \u0101huareka ana m\u0101tou ki te wh\u0101nuitanga o ng\u0101 whakaaro puaki kua whakatakotohia. I t\u0113r\u0101 wiki i mea atu te Kaunihera Waipiro, ar\u0101 te Alcohol Advisory Committee, ki te Komiti m\u014D ng\u0101 Take M\u0101ori, me p\u0113r\u0101 te tirohanga o te K\u0101wanatanga ki te kaupapa waipiro, ki t\u0113r\u0101 o te tupeka. E ai ki a Gilbert Taurua, kaiwhakahaere, strategic operations general manager, me whai t\u016Branga teitei ake ng\u0101 take waipiro ki te taha hauora. E ai ki ng\u0101 tauira inu, nui tonu te waipiro ka unumia i roto i t\u0113tahi w\u0101 roa. He k\u014Drero whai tikanga t\u0113nei. N\u0101 te iti o te utu, ng\u0101 \u0101huatanga whakatairanga, me te \u0101huatanga inu i roto i ng\u0101 hapori, kua noho k\u014Dhatu t\u0113nei ng\u0101ngara me \u014Dna kino katoa. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000629\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ec266512-9fe8-47da-883e-48f046ee5059\u0022\u003EN\u014D reira i te putanga o te p\u016Brongo e k\u012Ba nei, ko te Alcohol in Our Lives: Curbing the Harm, harikoa ana m\u0101tou i te mea i tohungia ng\u0101 huarahi \u0101whina ki te whakakore i te \u0101huatanga inu waipiro. Tautoko ana m\u0101tou i ng\u0101 momo huarahi p\u0113r\u0101 i te whakaheke taumata inu waipiro in\u0101 e taraiwa ana t\u0113tahi, te whakapiki i te tau inu, otir\u0101 te r\u0101hui hoki i ng\u0101 whakatairanga, i ng\u0101 p\u0101nui hoki m\u014D te waipiro. E whakapono hoki ana m\u0101tou, me werohia ng\u0101 kamupene waipiro, e p\u0113hi kino ana i w\u0101 t\u0101tou hapori. I te ao tika, i te ao pono me k\u012B, ka kore e kite i te waipiro i waenganui i ng\u0101 hapori. Engari, i t\u0113nei ao kikokiko nei, me aro t\u0101tou in\u0101ianei ki te \u0101whina i w\u0101 t\u0101tou wh\u0101nau, hapori hoki, ki te tiaki i a t\u0101tou an\u014D, \u0101-hauora, \u0101, ki te whakam\u0101m\u0101 i ng\u0101 kino o te waipiro. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000630\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ec266512-9fe8-47da-883e-48f046ee5059\u0022\u003EM\u014Dhio tonu ahau i te whakatau a te komiti m\u014D t\u0113nei r\u012Bpoata, in\u0101 ko t\u0101 r\u0101tou, k\u0101ore he take ki te tautoko i ng\u0101 mahi e k\u014Drerohia ana i roto i t\u0113nei r\u012Bpoata i te mea, e ahu p\u0113r\u0101 tonu ana te k\u0101wanatanga. Hoi an\u014D, kua whakatak\u0113tia te kaupapa a Minita Power i te mea, k\u0101ore ng\u0101 huarahi p\u0113r\u0101 i te t\u0101ke t\u0101piri e whakamahia ana ki te whakaiti i te inu waipiro. \u0100, kua whakatak\u0113tia an\u014D hoki te K\u0101wanatanga m\u014D te k\u014Drero noa iho m\u014D t\u0113nei mea te r\u0101hui i ng\u0101 h\u0101ora mahi o ng\u0101 toa hokohoko waipiro. N\u014D reira, te \u0101hua nei k\u0101ore ng\u0101 ture h\u014Du m\u014D te waipiro i te eke ki te taumata e tika ana, e ai ki te t\u0101 te tirohanga a \u0113tahi. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000631\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ec266512-9fe8-47da-883e-48f046ee5059\u0022\u003EN\u014D reira, ka tirohia an\u014Dtia e m\u0101tou te aronga o t\u0113nei pire, ar\u0101 ki te r\u0101hui i te tuku raihana hokohoko i raro i te Sale of Liquor Act 1989. E rata ana m\u0101tou ki te tikanga, ar\u0101, kia tuku arotakenga ia kaitono, tuatahi m\u014D te p\u0101nga o t\u0101 r\u0101tou tono ki ng\u0101 hapori, otir\u0101 te p\u0101nga \u0101-moni nei, a aha r\u0101nei ki te rohe e tohungia ana. Ka rua, ko ng\u0101 t\u0101ke m\u014D te utu, me te p\u0101nga o te waipiro ki taua rohe. Ka noho ng\u0101 arotakenga nei hei mea kitenga m\u014D te rahinga. Otir\u0101, e tautoko ana m\u0101tou i t\u0113nei \u0101huatanga i te mea, ka kitea ng\u0101 nekenekehanga o ng\u0101 hapori ki te whakatau, me ahu p\u0113hea r\u0101tou. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000632\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ec266512-9fe8-47da-883e-48f046ee5059\u0022\u003EHai k\u014Drero whakamutunga, nei au e noho whakah\u012Bh\u012B nei, i te mea, i tae mai a Toi Te Ora, n\u014D roto i t\u014Dku rohe o Te Waiariki, ki t\u0113tahi hui o te komiti wh\u0101iti. He r\u014Dp\u016B hauora a Toi Te Ora. Ka \u0101whina t\u0113nei r\u014Dp\u016B i ng\u0101 t\u0101ngata toru rau mano, neke atu, i roto o Waiariki, me Waikato hoki, i Tauranga, i Whakat\u0101ne, i \u014Cp\u014Dtiki, i Kawerau, i Rotorua, tae atu ki Taup\u014D. Ko t\u0101 Toi Te Ora ki te komiti, i tautoko r\u0101tou i te w\u0101hanga h\u014Du, 9A, m\u014D ng\u0101 tono \u0101-raihana. E whakam\u0101rama ana i ng\u0101 painga me ng\u0101 utu, me whakam\u0101rama ng\u0101 raihana nei i ng\u0101 p\u0113hitanga o te waipiro, \u0101-moni, \u0101-t\u0101ngata nei i te takiw\u0101, \u0101, me tuku i \u0113nei k\u014Drero ki te marea. N\u014D reira, n\u0101 runga i te \u0101huatanga o \u0113nei k\u014Drero, otir\u0101, \u014Dku ake wheako hoki, me te hiahia o te P\u0101ti M\u0101ori ki te r\u0101hui i te waipiro, ki te manaaki i te oranga me te hauora o w\u0101 t\u0101tou wh\u0101nau, e tautoko ana m\u0101tou i t\u0113nei pire i t\u014Dna p\u0101nuitanga tuarua.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000633\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ec266512-9fe8-47da-883e-48f046ee5059\u0022\u003E[That is what Apirana Ngata said. I have great sympathy for Sir Apirana Ngata\u2019s view. According to statistics, approximately three in every four M\u0101ori over 18 years of age identify as drinkers, with about one-third of those identifying themselves as binge drinkers. These are statistics that concern us greatly. We are especially concerned about harmful drinking amongst youth, and heavy promotion of products designed to appeal to young people. We believe that much can be done to reduce alcohol-related harm experienced by M\u0101ori. We have found a method: it is a collective wh\u0101nau approach.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000634\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ec266512-9fe8-47da-883e-48f046ee5059\u0022\u003ESo we come back to this bill. What we should do right now is to restrict the granting of on-licences and off-licences under the Sale of Liquor Act 1989. I have to say we are interested in the scope of the proposals. Last week the Alcohol Advisory Council told the M\u0101ori Affairs Committee that the Government should take a similar approach to alcohol as it does to tobacco. Strategic operations manager Gilbert Taurua said the harm caused by alcohol needs to be a higher priority in the health sector. He said M\u0101ori drinking patterns show that a large amount of alcohol is drunk over a long period of time. This was an important message. The prevalence of alcohol, its low cost, and relentless marketing have created a permissive environment in which excessive drinking has become normalised, bringing with it undue harm to our communities. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000635\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ec266512-9fe8-47da-883e-48f046ee5059\u0022\u003ESo the M\u0101ori Party welcomed the release of the report Alcohol in Our Lives: Curbing the Harm, which gave a very clear indication of the range of measures that could be initiated to address ways to help change the drinking culture. We support various measures, which include lowering drink-driving limits, lifting the purchasing age, and limiting liquor promotion and advertising. We also believe that an alcohol industry that has had an inappropriate influence on our communities needs to be challenged. In a perfect world, alcohol would not feature in our communities, but the reality is that it does, so we now must strive towards enabling our wh\u0101nau and communities to take control of their health and limit the damage that alcohol can do in their community. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000636\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ec266512-9fe8-47da-883e-48f046ee5059\u0022\u003EI know that the rationale of the select committee members in determining their report was to say that they thought this bill overlapped the Government\u2019s work programme on alcohol reform, and as such they did not see it as needing to be supported. However, the package announced by Minister Power has been heavily criticised for failing to use devices such as excise tax to reduce alcohol consumption. There has also been criticism that the Government is merely tinkering around the edges with regard to restricting opening hours. Quite frankly, it appears to some that the alcohol reforms are a disappointment.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000637\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ec266512-9fe8-47da-883e-48f046ee5059\u0022\u003E So we look anew at the aim of this bill to restrict the granting of on-licences and off-licences under the Sale of Liquor Act 1989. We are satisfied that every application for an on-licence must be accompanied by an evaluation carried out by the applicant\u2014firstly, for the likely social impact relating to monetary and non-monetary costs on the area to which the application relates; and, secondly, taxing the costs and impact of liquor consumption in that area. These evaluations will be available for public inspection. Indeed, we support this because communities can determine with greater transparency what is in their best interests. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000638\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ec266512-9fe8-47da-883e-48f046ee5059\u0022\u003EIn conclusion, I am really proud that Toi Te Ora from my electorate of Te Waiariki came to a select committee hearing. Toi Te Ora is a health organisation that helps approximately 300,000 people in the Bay of Plenty and Waikato regions\u2014Tauranga, Whakat\u0101ne, \u014Cp\u014Dtiki, Kawerau, and Rotorua, including Taup\u014D. Toi Te Ora told the committee that it supports new section 9A for applications for on-licences to include an evaluation of benefits and costs. This evaluation should include the likely social impact of liquor consumption, and monetary and non-monetary costs to the area to which the application relates, and that these must be made available for public inspection. Based on this address, my personal experiences, and the desire of the M\u0101ori Party to be more vigilant in restricting alcohol use in order to take care of the well-being and health of our families, we support this bill at its second reading.]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00228cf0fb6b-0b8f-4327-983d-73e1166c220e\u0022 data-id=\u002280e0853228f142dbbd65f4fec1a9b2cb\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000639\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00228cf0fb6b-0b8f-4327-983d-73e1166c220e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002280e0853228f142dbbd65f4fec1a9b2cb\u0022\u003EDr CAM CALDER (National):\u003C/span\u003E It gives me great pleasure to rise and speak on the Sale of Liquor (Objections to Applications) Amendment Bill proposed by my honourable colleague George Hawkins, \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000640\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00228cf0fb6b-0b8f-4327-983d-73e1166c220e\u0022\u003EMP for Manurewa. I am privileged to be the National MP based in the vibrant and diverse electorate of Manurewa, and I have to report that there is a strong, united voice asking for help in reducing the ravages of alcohol there.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000641\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00228cf0fb6b-0b8f-4327-983d-73e1166c220e\u0022\u003EI have listened to residents\u2019 views at many public meetings and sporting clubs, when visiting the RSA, and at the Sunday markets. It is a common theme. Responses to my recent surveys are clear. The pendulum has swung too far towards the liberalisation of alcohol laws. The residents of Manurewa know the statistics all too well. Many of them have suffered, directly or indirectly, alcohol-related harm. Alcohol is estimated to contribute to up to 1,000 deaths a year, and is a major driver of crime. Police say that alcohol is implicated in 30 percent of all recorded offences, 34 percent of all recorded family violence incidents, and 50 percent of all homicides.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000642\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00228cf0fb6b-0b8f-4327-983d-73e1166c220e\u0022\u003EThis National-led Government is committed to reducing the level of alcohol-related harm in all our communities. We are listening to public concerns. The Government\u2019s package for alcohol law reform is the first stage in our response and adopts in full or in part 126 of the Law Commission\u2019s 153 recommendations. Our package aims to achieve three things: less alcohol-related harm, including deaths, family violence, drunken disorder, and accident compensation claims; a reduction in our binge-drinking culture, especially among young people; and a reduction in the number of alcohol outlets and their trading hours.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000643\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00228cf0fb6b-0b8f-4327-983d-73e1166c220e\u0022\u003EA key feature that has proved very popular with the residents of Manurewa whom I have spoken to, and I am sure with my colleague the Hon George Hawkins, is that the proposed legislation will give the local Manurewa community the right to decide how many outlets there are, where they are, and how long they are open for. When a decision is made to grant a licence, the objective of our law must be considered as well as the provisions of the local alcohol policy, and, crucially, whether the amenity of an area would be lessened should the licence be granted. We are giving local communities the choice to determine the outcome in their area. We will be giving parents more tools to manage their children\u2019s access to alcohol, and requiring more parental and individual responsibility for supply to minors.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000644\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00228cf0fb6b-0b8f-4327-983d-73e1166c220e\u0022\u003EAs my colleague Chester Borrows pointed out earlier, those ready-to-drink alcohol mixes that we call RTDs will be restricted to 5 percent for its alcohol content. I am delighted at this initiative. They taste like soft drinks, but they pack a hell of a punch. Ready-to-drink products will be required to be sold in containers limited to holding no more than 1.5 standard drinks. We will investigate a minimum pricing regime by giving retailers a year to provide sales and price data. If they are not forthcoming, then the Government will consider regulatory options.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000645\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00228cf0fb6b-0b8f-4327-983d-73e1166c220e\u0022\u003EI applaud my colleague George Hawkins for bringing this bill to the House some years ago in an effort to get the then Labour Government to address this huge problem of alcohol-related harm. As I have outlined, the National-led Government\u2019s package of reforms is comprehensive and, in the opinion of the Social Services Committee, the package of reforms has actually overtaken this bill. The select committee has recommended that this bill not be passed, as far more comprehensive legislation is imminent. It is for this reason I concur with the select committee that this bill should not be passed.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022bbded2ec-ac25-4a73-a380-3f4d87693084\u0022 data-id=\u00223487dc5ca80d4889b136218e45721c02\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000646\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bbded2ec-ac25-4a73-a380-3f4d87693084\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00223487dc5ca80d4889b136218e45721c02\u0022\u003ESTUART NASH (Labour):\u003C/span\u003E Before I start my speech, Mr Assistant Speaker, could you please indulge me when I say \u201CGood evening, sir.\u201D to Barry Goggin. On the 9 September Barry retired as one of the parliamentary gallery staff after 17 years\u2019 service. He is a fine chap, a very good bloke, and I hope he is enjoying his retirement, because it is well deserved. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000647\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bbded2ec-ac25-4a73-a380-3f4d87693084\u0022\u003EI stand in support of the second reading of the Sale of Liquor (Objections to Applications) Amendment Bill. The previous speaker, Cam Calder, who said he is based in Manurewa\u2014even though he lives on the North Shore\u2014has decided to vote against the bill. I am quite astounded by that, because he stood up and outlined the real problems faced by people in the electorate of Manurewa, and then proceeded to say he was speaking against the bill. That is not a good stance. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000648\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bbded2ec-ac25-4a73-a380-3f4d87693084\u0022\u003EIn my time tonight there are only two questions that I will pose, and then answer. First of all, I ask what sort of society we want to live in, and, secondly, I ask what sort of message we, as members of Parliament, want to send to our communities about alcohol. But before I discuss those questions, I compliment my colleague the Hon George Hawkins on bringing this member\u2019s bill to the House. Mr Hawkins is an example of a Labour MP who understands his communities, who talks to his constituents, and who acts on the recommendations of those who come to visit him and offer their counsel. I congratulate George. He has undertaken wide and varied consultation on this bill. I congratulate him on seeking to amend the Sale of Liquor Act 1989. When George decides to leave this House\u2014and I know he has a few more terms left in him yet\u2014he will be sorely missed by his constituents, and he will leave huge shoes to fill. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000649\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bbded2ec-ac25-4a73-a380-3f4d87693084\u0022\u003EBut I remind the House that this bill does not relate just to Manurewa; it relates to the whole country. [Interruption] I raise a point of order, Mr Speaker. I understand that under the Standing Orders a member is not allowed to barrack in the way that Mr Quinn is doing, without sitting in his actual seat. If he really wants to interject in that manner, he should go to the back of the Chamber. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000650\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002203bc0052-6dd8-4807-998a-4768a4732e0b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022c878da58e0e743b48b84d2eec030d36e\u0022\u003EThe ASSISTANT SPEAKER (Hon Rick Barker)\u003C/span\u003E: I say to the member\u2014and I presume he has heard me say this on a number of occasions\u2014that, yes, the rules, according to Speaker\u2019s rulings, are that members may not shift their seat for the purpose of interjecting. However, I note that the member has shifted because members do drift down to this end of the House, and there is interjection. It helps to make, shall I say, a more engaged place. The interjections were light and friendly, but were a little lacking in humour, I might say. I did not think they interfered with the member\u2019s speech, and I just invite the member to continue with it.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000651\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bbded2ec-ac25-4a73-a380-3f4d87693084\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a3f7a50128cc4853979ef09fb7c8366c\u0022\u003ESTUART NASH\u003C/span\u003E: I will provide an answer to the first question I posed, about the sort of society that we want to live in. As politicians, we have a unique opportunity to help to define the types of communities that we live in and our children grow up in. We have opportunities to send messages about the sort of society we want to create for our families and friends, and for the country\u2019s citizens. For me a number of messages are important in terms of creating safe and secure communities. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000652\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bbded2ec-ac25-4a73-a380-3f4d87693084\u0022\u003EThe first message is that it is not acceptable to have a liquor store or a store advertising and selling alcohol on every street corner. We have enough problems with alcohol in our communities, and more advertising in dairies, where children buy their sweets, is hardly the type of message we want to send to young children who are growing up. This bill deals with that problem. Alcohol causes more harm than almost any other drug in society, and we need to send the message that drinking to excess is not normal, healthy, or acceptable, and will not be tolerated by the wider community. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000653\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bbded2ec-ac25-4a73-a380-3f4d87693084\u0022\u003EThe second message is that in a fully functioning and democratic society we need to have laws that respect the views of all who participate in the health and wealth of our communities. Let us be honest: alcohol sales affect many more people than those involved in the actual transaction. Alcohol, for example, is often drunk near to, or at, the point of sale. So we should let those who may be impacted by the drinking of alcohol comment on where and when a retailer can be located. This bill deals with that problem. It does so by granting any person the right to object to the granting of either on-licence or off-licence applications, provided the objector can produce evidence that he or she would be adversely affected if the application were successful. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000654\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bbded2ec-ac25-4a73-a380-3f4d87693084\u0022\u003EThe third message is that this bill requires that a report on the social impact of granting a liquor licence must be provided by a person who applies for a licence. Again, that forces applicants to take responsibility for their proposed actions. This measure is a sea change. It is long overdue, and it is most welcome. If the evaluation shows there will be harm to the community, I have no doubt that under this legislation the application will be turned down. This bill is an example of democracy as it should be practised: with the input of all citizens, and the applicant showing responsibility. It is about time we had that, I say. It makes absolute sense, and I fully support the ability of those in the community to have a say on activities that have an adverse impact upon them. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000655\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bbded2ec-ac25-4a73-a380-3f4d87693084\u0022\u003EMy second question asked about the sort of message that we want to send, as members of Parliament, to our communities about alcohol. This year the Law Commission, chaired by Sir Geoffrey Palmer, put out a huge volume entitled Alcohol in Our Lives: Curbing the Harm. The report was tabled in Parliament. I will read out a couple of points that make very disturbing reading. Members probably know about them, but they are some of the elephants in the room that we just do not like to mention. Well, the time has now come for us to be absolutely aware. The report states: \u201CNew Zealand has a pervasive culture of drinking to excess. National drinking surveys consistently show that around 25 percent of drinkers\u2014the equivalent of 700,000 New Zealanders\u2014typically drink large quantities when they drink. Despite the incontrovertible evidence linking intoxication to a range of serious harms, as a society, we have developed a dangerous tolerance for drunkenness. The latest drinking survey shows \u2026 Ten percent, or the equivalent of 224,000 adults, consumed enough to feel drunk at least weekly. \u2026 for a large sector of the population there is a dominant pattern of heavy, intermittent drinking episodes, the worst pattern for the drinker\u2019s own health outcomes, and the worst for damage to those around them.\u201D Is this the sort of society we want to create and leave for our children? \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000656\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bbded2ec-ac25-4a73-a380-3f4d87693084\u0022\u003EIn the report a section entitled \u201CWhat\u2019s the problem?\u201D states: \u201CAlcohol is the backdrop to so many issues. Issues which New Zealand is not addressing very well, issues like obesity, suicide, sexual health, injuries and so on. \u2026 for a significant number of young people today, drinking is not merely an adjunct to their social lives but the focal point, drunkenness is not an occasional by-product of drinking, but an end in itself.\u201D Is that the sort of society that we want to create? \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000657\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bbded2ec-ac25-4a73-a380-3f4d87693084\u0022\u003EThe report further states: \u201CResearch suggests that a discernible relationship between a high concentration of outlet numbers (usually referred to as high outlet density or outlet \u2018clustering\u2019) and alcohol consumption at a neighbourhood level. \u2026 The Committee pointed in particular to an apparent relationship between outlet clustering and the extent of underage drinking.\u201D \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000658\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bbded2ec-ac25-4a73-a380-3f4d87693084\u0022\u003EI say this is the sort of harm that the Hon George Hawkins has witnessed in the Manurewa electorate, this is the sort of harm and the sort of behaviour that the Hon George Hawkins does not want to see all around this country, and this is the reason for this bill. Earlier, I posed two questions. The first was about the sort of society that we want to live in. The answer to that is a society where all citizens have a say. George Hawkins\u2019 bill allows for that. The second question I posed was about the sort of message that we, as members of Parliament, want to send to our communities about alcohol. The answer is a new message: responsible drinking is the only way forward. Drunkenness is simply not cool; in fact, it is downright stupid. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000659\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bbded2ec-ac25-4a73-a380-3f4d87693084\u0022\u003EI congratulate the Hon George Hawkins. I think this is a wonderful bill. It does a hell of a lot to address the concerns that many people in New Zealand have about the state of drinking in our society and about the prevalence of alcohol outlets in our communities. I commend this bill to the House, and I hope that all 122 members will vote for it. Thank you very much.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022cfdabe42-521a-4dca-afab-3e781731a130\u0022 data-id=\u0022d7caf2bb1a1b4abfaf4850401c25bf29\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000660\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cfdabe42-521a-4dca-afab-3e781731a130\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022d7caf2bb1a1b4abfaf4850401c25bf29\u0022\u003EDr PAUL HUTCHISON (National\u2014Hunua):\u003C/span\u003E I rise to speak on the Sale of Liquor (Objections to Applications) Amendment Bill, which is in the name of the Hon George Hawkins. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000661\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cfdabe42-521a-4dca-afab-3e781731a130\u0022\u003EI understand that this bill was first introduced in 2008. There were 53 submissions and 34 submitters who wished to be heard. Ten of them were heard in the previous Parliament before the change to the most excellent National Government under John Key. Since that time the Social Services Committee has kept in close touch with the Hon George Hawkins. Its members were well aware that Sir Geoffrey Palmer\u2019s Law Commission report was due to be presented, so they put the bill on hold pending that very comprehensive report.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000662\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cfdabe42-521a-4dca-afab-3e781731a130\u0022\u003EI must agree with previous speakers that the pendulum has swung too far in New Zealand. Alcohol is now a $5 billion industry\u2014a $5 billion industry. One of my concerns about alcohol is the effect it has on our children, and, in fact, on our unborn children\u2014the effect of alcohol on children in utero and the number of children born with foetal alcohol spectrum disorder. The Law Commission report estimated that some thousands of children a year were affected by the disorder. This is an extremely worrying concern because those children will never have a chance to achieve their full potential. Often mothers and fathers have no idea of the implications of their drinking, which impacts on literally thousands of New Zealand children. So there is no doubt that the importance of this subject is enormous. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000663\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cfdabe42-521a-4dca-afab-3e781731a130\u0022\u003EI congratulate the Hon George Hawkins on bringing in this member\u2019s bill, which is generally focused on local communities having a say. There is no doubt that members of the South Auckland community have been particularly strong in their concerns about liquor outlets in their area. The Hon George Hawkins has listened to them. Their concerns were manifested in a march and rally at the Manukau City centre about 6 weeks ago. Representatives from all parties were there on that particular occasion, but I must admit that I do not think the Hon George Hawkins was there. [Interruption] He was there! I thought he was campaigning for the local board of Manurewa, but\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000664\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a83ea07a-806c-45ad-95bb-eb2c481cd0e2\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022d5a6954390e74931ad15eace8c76bb17\u0022\u003EHon Tony Ryall\u003C/span\u003E: Manurewa Action!\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000665\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cfdabe42-521a-4dca-afab-3e781731a130\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022b7f38b2c21ed4fc5811dcfeca3c421a8\u0022\u003EDr PAUL HUTCHISON\u003C/span\u003E: Manurewa Action Team, yes, but conscientiously he was marching\u2014he was there\u2014and so was my excellent colleague Dr Cam Calder, who is doing a tremendous job down there in Manurewa. He is obviously the natural successor of George Hawkins, but, of course, that will be after George Hawkins has become a board member for that area. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000666\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cfdabe42-521a-4dca-afab-3e781731a130\u0022\u003EBut the point is that on that march the local community was very strong about the adverse effects of alcohol in South Auckland, the huge number of outlets in that area, the violence associated with it, and the sorts of examples we have heard from other speakers of alcohol outlets being close to schools. The message from that rally was absolutely crystal clear: they wanted to have a say as to how alcohol was sold and distributed in South Auckland. That message reflects the attitudes of the whole country. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000667\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cfdabe42-521a-4dca-afab-3e781731a130\u0022\u003EThe good news is that the National Government is responding in a very comprehensive way to Sir Geoffrey Palmer\u2019s Law Commission report. It is responding in 126 ways to the 153 recommendations. The basis of that response with regard to local communities is that licences will be harder to get and easier to lose\u2014harder to get and easier to lose. That is a very, very important message and one that George Hawkins certainly supports very strongly. Local communities will have the power to decide how many alcohol outlets are in their communities, where they are, and at what times they are open. That very much encapsulates what the Hon George Hawkins\u2019 bill is all about. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000668\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cfdabe42-521a-4dca-afab-3e781731a130\u0022\u003EIt was very interesting to hear the rhetoric from Labour members. The Social Services Committee recommended to Parliament that, at this stage of events, the bill should not be passed, and instead the comprehensive package that is to be put into place by the National Government should come forward. The National Government, undoubtedly, has already made a great series of interventions in terms of policing and enforcement. There are 300 more police in areas like South Auckland and 600 throughout the country. But, more important, there will be tougher alcohol laws in this comprehensive package, and, in particular, and in response to this bill, local communities will have much great say on how alcohol will be dealt with in their communities. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000669\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cfdabe42-521a-4dca-afab-3e781731a130\u0022\u003EIt is right and proper that Parliament follows the guidance of the Social Services Committee recommendations that, at this stage, the bill is not passed and that the comprehensive recommendations of the National Government are accepted.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00228a1cb04e-8a86-44d1-9004-6e158e220339\u0022 data-id=\u00223b7873210c5846d5979fa228fec9e50d\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000670\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00228a1cb04e-8a86-44d1-9004-6e158e220339\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00223b7873210c5846d5979fa228fec9e50d\u0022\u003ETIM MACINDOE (National\u2014Hamilton West):\u003C/span\u003E I am delighted to endorse and echo the fine comments and conclusions of my colleague the member for Hunua and, as other members have done at the outset, to acknowledge the considerable work of the member for Manurewa, the Hon George Hawkins, on this issue. I would also like to acknowledge my predecessor as the MP for Hamilton West, Martin Gallagher, who also demonstrated a determination during his time in this House to confront the problems caused by alcohol abuse in our communities. As some members will know, Martin is currently a candidate in our local body elections and looks likely, I should say, to bolt in. He has been a Hamilton city councillor before and, in fact, was deputy mayor before he was first elected to Parliament. I welcome the prospect that he will be back on our council and I look forward to working with him in our respective roles.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000671\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00228a1cb04e-8a86-44d1-9004-6e158e220339\u0022\u003EMartin and I both welcome this Government\u2019s decision to implement the vast majority of the Law Commission\u2019s alcohol reform recommendations, and it is very good to have his endorsement of the Government\u2019s lead in this area. We are both especially pleased at the powers that will be given to councils to implement local alcohol plans. That is a very important measure that my constituents, our civic leaders, the police, our health providers, social agencies, and many others warmly welcome. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000672\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00228a1cb04e-8a86-44d1-9004-6e158e220339\u0022\u003EIn light of those comments, and as we have heard from one or two members tonight, there may be some people watching or listening to broadcasts of Parliament this evening who are puzzled that this bill will be voted down tonight. So I want to stress, as other members have, that it is neither a slight on the member for Manurewa nor a signal that members are taking these issues lightly. On the contrary, it is because the problems the bill addresses are about to be presented to the House in a much more comprehensive measure, and for that reason only, the Social Services Committee, with Mr Hawkins\u2019 agreement\u2014it was good that he came to a select committee meeting recently and talked to us\u2014is recommending that this bill should not proceed at this point. I commend the member for Manurewa for concluding that events have overtaken this bill and that his work is done. It is a sensible and pragmatic decision in the circumstances. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000673\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00228a1cb04e-8a86-44d1-9004-6e158e220339\u0022\u003EI look forward to discussing the measures in this bill, and many other related issues, when the Government\u2019s response to the Law Commission\u2019s report is introduced to the House in a few weeks from now. I agree with my colleague Chester Borrows that there are some ridiculous arrangements governing the sale of liquor in our communities at the present time and that we have major problems as a consequence. Almost unfettered access to alcohol is certainly contributing to our binge-drinking culture. In turn, it is exacerbating a major health problem that is a special concern of mine\u2014I did not know that my good colleague Dr Hutchison was about to mention it as well, but I am delighted he has done so\u2014and that is our nation\u2019s significant incidence of foetal alcohol spectrum disorder. I try to raise awareness of that serious health concern in my electorate whenever I can, especially when I talk to school groups and younger audiences. It is a tragic fact that hundreds of babies are conceived each year to mothers who have consumed too much alcohol. In many cases, in fact, probably in most, the mother has no intention of becoming pregnant and drinks dangerously for some time before and after conception, in complete ignorance of the dangerous risk she is taking. It is a lethal error. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000674\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00228a1cb04e-8a86-44d1-9004-6e158e220339\u0022\u003EFoetal alcohol spectrum disorder is a lifelong disability that can have severe physical and intellectual consequences. It is a tragedy that we hear so little about it and that so few young people in particular are aware of the serious risk they take in drinking regularly and heavily while being sexually active. I hope and expect that the more comprehensive bill we will start considering in the House later this year will provide an opportunity for members to promote much greater awareness of foetal alcohol syndrome and a raft of other alcohol-related concerns. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000675\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00228a1cb04e-8a86-44d1-9004-6e158e220339\u0022\u003EThere is certainly a strong desire in Hamilton for vastly improved alcohol legislation, and that is why I say to members opposite, who have been interjecting regularly throughout the evening, that it is important that the Government has taken the considered approach that it has. We have given officials the time they needed to convert the huge array of legislative reforms into workable legislation that will come before the House. The idea that we should rush the measure is likely to be a recipe for the mistakes that Parliament has made in the past when alcohol reform legislation has been too ad hoc and has dealt in a piecemeal fashion with parts of the problem. It is right that we tackle this problem comprehensively. That is what the Government\u2019s response will be all about when the legislation comes before this House, and I look forward to debating those measures when it does. I certainly am committed to ensuring that we get it right this time and that we take a major step in the right direction to tackle our alcohol-related problem in New Zealand. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000676\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00228a1cb04e-8a86-44d1-9004-6e158e220339\u0022\u003EI conclude\u2014I think I am the last speaker before the member has a chance to sum up\u2014by commending the member for Manurewa once again for his work on this issue, and for his pragmatic decision in relation to this bill at this time. I look forward to all members of this House participating in a very positive fashion towards the implementation of a really improved liquor control regime later on this year. Thank you.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002212f01718-dc1f-4307-b0b3-451098ab73df\u0022 data-id=\u0022f30cc4f821b542d987f315f13f5cfae7\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000677\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002212f01718-dc1f-4307-b0b3-451098ab73df\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022f30cc4f821b542d987f315f13f5cfae7\u0022\u003EDr ASHRAF CHOUDHARY (Labour):\u003C/span\u003E I am really disappointed, particularly with those two doctors, Cam Calder and Paul Hutchison, on the other side of the House. They spoke so passionately about the Sale of Liquor (Objections to Applications) Amendment Bill because they know at heart the damage that alcohol does to adults, children, and unborn babies. Anyone who has anything to do with drinking knows the harm it does. I am really disappointed in Cam Calder particularly, who pretends that he lives in Manurewa. He does not live in Manurewa. He opened an office there recently, but only George Hawkins, who is the local MP, and I actually live there.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000678\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00225c5d10e469fc4b35aca8c34c2bc3afa7\u0022\u003EHon Member\u003C/span\u003E: He doesn\u2019t live there, either.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000679\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002212f01718-dc1f-4307-b0b3-451098ab73df\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022f11ef4acb83546e9ae83e64914429a7f\u0022\u003EDr ASHRAF CHOUDHARY\u003C/span\u003E: That is probably right; I am probably the only one who lives there. But George Hawkins is a good member for Manurewa and I am delighted that he has taken leadership in promoting this bill. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000680\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002212f01718-dc1f-4307-b0b3-451098ab73df\u0022\u003EI am probably the only MP here who does not drink. I am not aware of anybody else who does not. I do not drink. In the past I have not taken a lot of interest in these sorts of bills, and because I do not drink people might think I oppose anything to do with alcohol. But tonight I am very keen to speak, because this bill was introduced by my very good friend George Hawkins, who is forever very conscious of the work he does in the community. In Parliament he reflects the aspirations of, and is conscious of problems in, that community. A couple of weeks ago he spoke in the House on his Manukau City Council (Regulation of Prostitution in Specified Places) Bill, a local bill.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000681\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002212f01718-dc1f-4307-b0b3-451098ab73df\u0022\u003EVery clearly, my background is one in which any drug or substance that impacts on and impairs one\u2019s faculties is banned. My people, for the last 1,500 years, have not drunk. Now that we know the harm this drug has done to our society, they were probably right in not drinking. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000682\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002212f01718-dc1f-4307-b0b3-451098ab73df\u0022\u003EThis bill should be called the \u201CEmpowering Communities Bill\u201D, because that is really what it is all about. Basically, it is empowering local communities to make sure that any new liquor outlet is not opened without their consent and without consultation with them. One could also call it the \u201CHarm Minimisation Bill\u201D, because that is what it is supposed to do. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000683\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002212f01718-dc1f-4307-b0b3-451098ab73df\u0022\u003EI have a couple of statistics. For example, in 1990 there were eight licences per 10,000 people in New Zealand. That included on-licences, off-licences, and club licences. By the year 2006 there were 35 licences per 10,000 people. That is almost more than a 400-fold increase in the number of outlets. In a place like Manurewa, South Auckland, that has done a lot of damage to the community, particularly in relation to crime. We know that a lot of those crimes are committed against minorities. I know a lot of Indian people, and one should never forget Navtej Singh, who was killed because some people wanted to steal alcohol from his dairy. Similarly, a number of other crimes have been committed because of alcohol. As we know from police reports, 90 percent of crimes happen after 11 o\u2019clock at night and are often related to the consumption of alcohol. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000684\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002212f01718-dc1f-4307-b0b3-451098ab73df\u0022\u003EThis bill is important. Labour members and, in particular, the M\u0101ori Party have been promoting anti-smoking bills, and so has the Green Party. Alcohol is a substance that harms not only the person who consumes it but also the people around that person, because of the effect on driving and because of people going around drunk. Cigarettes often have bad effects on the consumer. Alcohol often impacts on family relationships, on unborn babies\u2014as has been said before\u2014and on the wider community. So, for the life of me, I personally cannot understand why we need more outlets and why we have loosened regulations. That is something that, for me at least, I cannot understand. It is something that causes so much harm in the community and it is being allowed so openly and so much. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000685\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002212f01718-dc1f-4307-b0b3-451098ab73df\u0022\u003ECorner dairies have been mentioned. There are a couple of issues there. I personally do not believe that dairies should be allowed to sell alcohol, but, at the same time, I have to say that some of my Indian friends have said that there has to be a level playing field. We cannot target just the dairies. If outlets like dairies have to stop selling alcohol, why not the big supermarkets? If we are going to look at the hours of opening of these outlets, there has to be a universal rule. Whether it is a dairy, a small shop, an RSA, or a supermarket, the rules must be similar. I have been approached by a number of dairy owners who are very concerned about some of the issues discussed in the Law Commission report on alcohol by Geoffrey Palmer. They are concerned that they might be targeted. We have to make sure that small corner dairies\u2019 interests are taken into account when we are considering this bill. But I personally do not believe that dairies should sell alcohol, because they are supposed to be selling food and other items that are useful for the community. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000686\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002212f01718-dc1f-4307-b0b3-451098ab73df\u0022\u003EAll in all, I support this bill. But I am really surprised tonight to hear members on the Government side of the House all telling nice stories about how bad alcohol is but still not supporting this bill. That is very disappointing. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000687\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002212f01718-dc1f-4307-b0b3-451098ab73df\u0022\u003EOnce again, I commend George Hawkins, my friend and colleague, who has brought this bill to the House, and the effort he has put in behind this bill. I know that on our side of the House most of us, if not all of us, will be supporting this bill. I am delighted that the Green Party and the M\u0101ori Party will be supporting this bill, as well. With those few words, I commend this bill to the House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000688\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002203bc0052-6dd8-4807-998a-4768a4732e0b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a773ee027f624468aaeffb8c674a8bdf\u0022\u003EThe ASSISTANT SPEAKER (Hon Rick Barker)\u003C/span\u003E: The question is that the Sale of Liquor (Objections to Applications) Amendment Bill be read a second time. Those who are of that opinion will say Aye\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000689\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00228e686b62-8dc4-4f03-a7b6-2d0f9c874e9a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00221d35a0e3697a44fe8f0b97d898703930\u0022\u003EHon George Hawkins\u003C/span\u003E: I raise a point of order, Mr Speaker. I request a personal vote be taken.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000690\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002203bc0052-6dd8-4807-998a-4768a4732e0b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022572a003037cf471d9cddd1da9042f4b8\u0022\u003EThe ASSISTANT SPEAKER (Hon Rick Barker)\u003C/span\u003E: You can do that once I have put the question. I want to get the sense of the House\u2014that is the process. The question is that the Sale of Liquor (Objections to Applications) Amendment Bill be read a second time. Those who are of that opinion will say Aye, the contrary No. The Ayes have it. [Interruption] The Noes have it?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00228e686b62-8dc4-4f03-a7b6-2d0f9c874e9a\u0022 data-id=\u002292a6862cc28e4113958bc11b6bf27ace\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000691\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00228e686b62-8dc4-4f03-a7b6-2d0f9c874e9a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002292a6862cc28e4113958bc11b6bf27ace\u0022\u003EHon GEORGE HAWKINS (Labour\u2014Manurewa):\u003C/span\u003E I raise a point of order, Mr Speaker. I request a personal vote be taken.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000692\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002203bc0052-6dd8-4807-998a-4768a4732e0b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022921a5bb971414ba0a836e965ee3b7158\u0022\u003EThe ASSISTANT SPEAKER (Hon Rick Barker)\u003C/span\u003E: OK, let us have a personal vote.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca id=\u00222211747396b74ae2a6b1000c72f3b525\u0022 name=\u0022division\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EA personal vote was called for on the question, That the Sale of Liquor (Objections to Applications) Amendment Bill be now read a second time.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EAyes 53\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cdiv 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 \u003C/div\u003E\n    \u003Cdiv class=\u0022HpsHansard\u0022\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000693\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsProceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u0022ec579bd2de9e4f8d88a39fa63b4147b6\u0022\u003ESittings of the House\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000695\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u00221676e081bf434cb2bdeeed57ceacf62e\u0022\u003ESittings of the House\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002260200136-9d63-4a82-b4f5-c00411adb1fd\u0022 data-id=\u002223a8969f8faf483496e56b7cd17e337f\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000694\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002260200136-9d63-4a82-b4f5-c00411adb1fd\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002223a8969f8faf483496e56b7cd17e337f\u0022\u003EJO GOODHEW (Junior Whip\u2014National):\u003C/span\u003E Given that we have made excellent progress, I seek leave for the House to now rise until next sitting day.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000696\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002203bc0052-6dd8-4807-998a-4768a4732e0b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00229f3ddcf7fc5c4346be9963229912de8a\u0022\u003EThe ASSISTANT SPEAKER (Hon Rick Barker)\u003C/span\u003E: Leave is sought for that purpose. Is there any objection? There is none.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20100922527ea35e3737411c93b1f25663f578d1000697\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002203bc0052-6dd8-4807-998a-4768a4732e0b\u0022\u003EThe House adjourned at 9.56 p.m.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n    \u003C/div\u003E\n  \u003C/body\u003E\n\u003C/html\u003E"