"\u003C!DOCTYPE html\u003E\u003Chtml xmlns:xlink=\u0022http://www.w3.org/1999/xlink\u0022 xmlns:xsi=\u0022http://www.w3.org/2007/XMLSchema-instance\u0022 xmlns:mml=\u0022http://www.w3.org/1998/Math/MathML\u0022\u003E\n  \u003Chead\u003E\n    \u003CMETA http-equiv=\u0022Content-Type\u0022 content=\u0022text/html; charset=utf-16\u0022\u003E\n    \u003Cmeta name=\u0022viewport\u0022 content=\u0022width=device-width, initial-scale=1\u0022\u003E\n  \u003C/head\u003E\n  \u003Cbody style=\u0022font-family:sans-serif; font-size:100%;\u0022\u003E\n    \u003Cdiv class=\u0022HpsHansard\u0022\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000001\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsProceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u0022b3ab188d90c440e8b3ab5cecfcc2f347\u0022\u003EThursday, 7 November 2013\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000003\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u0022ddf6feb0e1ca423f8cd6b87e133b8bff\u0022\u003EThursday, 7 November 2013\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000002\u0022\u003EMr Speaker took the Chair at 2 p.m.\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000004\u0022\u003EPrayers.\u003C/p\u003E\n    \u003C/div\u003E\n    \u003Cdiv class=\u0022HpsHansard\u0022\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000005\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsProceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u00229184a020ea30446f900a1f5fc97b60a7\u0022\u003EBusiness Statement\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000007\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u002234de1fb4f31f43f58f8b5ed0dee1e4b6\u0022\u003EBusiness Statement\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022 data-id=\u002208a8dd914e944492a5c1f2855df3fbd2\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000006\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002208a8dd914e944492a5c1f2855df3fbd2\u0022\u003EHon GERRY BROWNLEE (Leader of the House):\u003C/span\u003E When the House resumes on Tuesday, 12 November the Government intends to progress the Members of Parliament (Remuneration and Services) Bill, the Health and Safety (Pike River Implementation) Bill, and the New Zealand International Convention Centre Bill. Wednesday is a members\u2019 day. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022 data-id=\u00224a17bf6e56ac4ba5a2c10e2e2b616e69\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000008\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00224a17bf6e56ac4ba5a2c10e2e2b616e69\u0022\u003EGRANT ROBERTSON (Labour\u2014Wellington Central):\u003C/span\u003E I wonder whether I can inquire of the Leader of the House whether he has any intention to introduce a bill in the coming couple of weeks around the reform of the Teachers Council. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022 data-id=\u002259ab8186ed404929ab46fbfeedfbc9a6\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000009\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002259ab8186ed404929ab46fbfeedfbc9a6\u0022\u003EHon GERRY BROWNLEE (Leader of the House):\u003C/span\u003E I have not seen that bill in the legislative process, but that does not mean that it may not be coming up in the next 2 weeks. I am sorry I cannot be more specific.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n    \u003C/div\u003E\n    \u003Cdiv class=\u0022HpsHansard\u0022\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000010\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsProceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u002270f6517da7834d79921cdcaccf10d782\u0022\u003EQuestions for Oral Answer\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000011\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u00228a3ff0c768244227b102b1d1940d3e62\u0022\u003EQuestions to Ministers\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000012\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u0022a1ce50208e3341199c10b6d534345334\u0022\u003ECanterbury, Recovery\u2014Offer on Red Zone Properties\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002247c29b78-eee0-4c91-afdf-7b07be780e1a\u0022 data-id=\u0022024174d21aba43b0ae55fa1d8cfbdcbd\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000013\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002247c29b78-eee0-4c91-afdf-7b07be780e1a\u0022\u003E1. \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022024174d21aba43b0ae55fa1d8cfbdcbd\u0022\u003EDENIS O\u2019ROURKE (NZ First)\u003C/span\u003E to the Minister for Canterbury Earthquake Recovery: Is he satisfied with progress on all aspects of the Canterbury earthquake recovery?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022 data-id=\u0022b6d69c46d324450eb75f5c4bf77c7399\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000014\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022b6d69c46d324450eb75f5c4bf77c7399\u0022\u003EHon GERRY BROWNLEE (Minister for Canterbury Earthquake Recovery):\u003C/span\u003E No. Although there are many good things happening, there are also many things that could progress more speedily.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000015\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002247c29b78-eee0-4c91-afdf-7b07be780e1a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022195fa91f55ed45809b977080f8a8805e\u0022\u003EDenis O\u2019Rourke\u003C/span\u003E: How can he be satisfied, if he is, or not, when the court has found that his Government\u2019s residential red zone land clearance offers were unlawful on grounds of improper process?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000016\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022c8ca35c3d49b4899a2b1f89885fff135\u0022\u003EHon GERRY BROWNLEE\u003C/span\u003E: It is an interesting question, given my answer, so I will repeat it for him. No. Although there are many things that are going well, there are others that could be progressing more speedily.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000017\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002247c29b78-eee0-4c91-afdf-7b07be780e1a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022ef425f0fbcf74d02b3681433da3af23a\u0022\u003EDenis O\u2019Rourke\u003C/span\u003E: How could he be satisfied when the result of the red zone land\u2014[Interruption] \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000018\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e4b09a29-dfd3-42c0-8585-11463bd6077b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022b3ce860a87694f3c818fbeb5ba4b1fef\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Order! The member has every right to ask his supplementary question. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000019\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002247c29b78-eee0-4c91-afdf-7b07be780e1a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002270a5583c8b094da899bfd474acb30502\u0022\u003EDenis O\u2019Rourke\u003C/span\u003E: It is good to hear that there is so much\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000020\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e4b09a29-dfd3-42c0-8585-11463bd6077b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00222f87669f372843c18e3f4df3c09f06fe\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Order! Just ask it.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000021\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002247c29b78-eee0-4c91-afdf-7b07be780e1a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022cf217fc403ec4d49920497c8e916a8c3\u0022\u003EDenis O\u2019Rourke\u003C/span\u003E: How could he be satisfied when the result of the red zone land clearance process, using an outdated and hit-and-miss 2007 rating valuation, gave a few red-zoners a windfall but many more of them such large losses that they could not afford to buy another home?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000022\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022b6e058c2aa064498ac99f06cb81a3100\u0022\u003EHon GERRY BROWNLEE\u003C/span\u003E: Of the more than 7,000 flat land red zone clients, well over 6,900 have entered into sale and purchase agreements with the Government, and many others are in that process. I think that speaks for itself. Those people were in a dreadful position. They have been given an opportunity to move on with their lives.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000023\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002247c29b78-eee0-4c91-afdf-7b07be780e1a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022caed9a070f78498dbda8ad5fbce9341c\u0022\u003EDenis O\u2019Rourke\u003C/span\u003E: How could he possibly be satisfied when the Government\u2019s inexplicable decision to offer only 50 percent of the outdated 2007 rating value to owners of residential bare land and to uninsured property owners has also been declared unlawful by the court because the Government did not use the powers or follow the process required by the Canterbury Earthquake Recovery Act, as required and as intended by Parliament?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000024\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022e794dd1a815142cb8a2772de399676c3\u0022\u003EHon GERRY BROWNLEE\u003C/span\u003E: That is a matter that is currently before the courts, so I do not think it would be in the public interest for me to engage in a discussion of what at the end of the day is Mr O\u2019Rourke\u2019s own opinion.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000025\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002247c29b78-eee0-4c91-afdf-7b07be780e1a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002268759c5111aa48a99a7eb20fc41d95e3\u0022\u003EDenis O\u2019Rourke\u003C/span\u003E: How could the Minister be even remotely satisfied with the deeply unpopular and badly performing Earthquake Commission, especially when it gerrymanders its survey results by marking 31,000 out of 154,000 claimants with \u201Cdo not survey\u201D tags?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000026\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00229c0b3f748ccb497e8fdad81df3ebf804\u0022\u003EHon GERRY BROWNLEE\u003C/span\u003E: I clearly said that there were some things I am not satisfied with, and I have today asked the State Services Commissioner to conduct a full review of that particular issue so that we can have confidence in the surveys of the Earthquake Commission.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000027\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002275a05f96-2474-4c90-a6ea-cf7b5798e03e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022bf98a64f3ec84bacbedf58bff510a6e3\u0022\u003EHon Ruth Dyson\u003C/span\u003E: Has the Minister asked for or received any advice on an alternative to red zone financial settlements for those who are still waiting for the Port Hills zoning review decisions, which were due before Christmas last year; if so, will he do something\u2014anything\u2014to fix the situation for them?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000028\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002226b79301f0594413a5e46650bb1b19d5\u0022\u003EHon GERRY BROWNLEE\u003C/span\u003E: There are 511 households on the Port Hills that are in review. We had hoped to make an announcement about that, but the Quake Outcasts decision would have meant that we were pursuing an offer that has for the time being been determined as inappropriate. That would put us in contempt of court until we have gone through the appeal process. There is not a lot that can be done at the present time. I am deeply distressed by this, I have to say, and I do find it extraordinary that someone can sit on the bench of a court in this country and inflict such injustice on so many people.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000029\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002275a05f96-2474-4c90-a6ea-cf7b5798e03e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022f67c6f6d445c480eab3e01167c905287\u0022\u003EHon Ruth Dyson\u003C/span\u003E: I raise a point of order, Mr Speaker. [Interruption] \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000030\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e4b09a29-dfd3-42c0-8585-11463bd6077b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00225013cce52819469686c4d20d2d0cafd3\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Order! This is a point of order and it will be heard in silence.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000031\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002275a05f96-2474-4c90-a6ea-cf7b5798e03e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022f824beeafa294b7aa5f57226df7e274a\u0022\u003EHon Ruth Dyson\u003C/span\u003E: I understand the issue that the Minister is faced with in terms of the Quake Outcasts decision, which is why my question specifically asked about financial settlements as alternatives to red zone offers.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000032\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e4b09a29-dfd3-42c0-8585-11463bd6077b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a3ea29e2e7654919b8c6219c93181f02\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: I listened carefully to the question and to the Minister\u2019s answer. On this occasion I believe the Minister addressed the question. If the member is not satisfied, the way to advance this issue is to ask further supplementary questions.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000033\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f5d71749-ae91-4af7-b2bd-77260398912a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022f40bb42465504e9aa593aae481f8b36f\u0022\u003EHon David Parker\u003C/span\u003E: I raise a point of order, Mr Speaker. The Minister, in his answer, denigrated the judiciary for the decision that it has brought down against his decision.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000034\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022d58dc2037a38482092c27266c876e921\u0022\u003EHon GERRY BROWNLEE\u003C/span\u003E: No, I did not.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000035\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f5d71749-ae91-4af7-b2bd-77260398912a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022cb74915a64ad4190ab9a4feecd960cce\u0022\u003EHon David Parker\u003C/span\u003E: Yes, he did\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000036\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e4b09a29-dfd3-42c0-8585-11463bd6077b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022da9b21458c704108ad5914cb6ce0593b\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: I am hearing a point of order.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000037\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f5d71749-ae91-4af7-b2bd-77260398912a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022013aeb602f2f42f5babfbc0d097afdb6\u0022\u003EHon David Parker\u003C/span\u003E: \u2014and I would have thought that for him to, on the one hand, refuse to answer a question from the primary questioner on the ground that this is before the courts, and to then take a slap at the judge for laying down a lawful decision would be outside the Standing Orders.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000038\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e4b09a29-dfd3-42c0-8585-11463bd6077b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022495685b9a47b4d22ab9cafd22ca143f4\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: No, I do not believe in any way that the issue was outside the Standing Orders. It was for the Minister to be responsible for the answer that he gave. He gave the answer and he bears responsibility for the way he answered the question.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000039\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00224e2bdcc146b9423cab5eec8c6d4d503b\u0022\u003EGrant Robertson\u003C/span\u003E: I raise a point of order, Mr Speaker. I am sorry to belabour the point, but Standing Order 114 does read: \u201CA member may not use offensive words against the House or against any member of the judiciary.\u201D I think Mr Brownlee was right up against Standing Order 114 in what he said there. There are, obviously, rules around the separation of powers here, and I think Standing Order 114 is very clear in its nature.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000040\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f5d71749-ae91-4af7-b2bd-77260398912a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002201a530158fcc41c7ae435186fcd07e23\u0022\u003EHon David Parker\u003C/span\u003E: Speaking further to that, the second point to be made is that Standing Order 112 says: \u201C(1) Matters awaiting or under adjudication \u2026 may not be referred to \u2026\u201D. For the Minister to say that that was the reason he could not answer Mr O\u2019Rourke and to then put pressure upon the judiciary by criticising it, effectively, in the way that he did seems to me to be entirely inconsistent, and, therefore, his later comment must be out of order.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000041\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e4b09a29-dfd3-42c0-8585-11463bd6077b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022078d55e99dd54638aa1027f77d011c92\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Again, I thank both members for their contributions. I think Grant Robertson used words like \u201CIt was right up against the boundary\u201D, or words to that effect. I think that is a fair comment, but on this occasion the Minister has answered that way, the statements have been made, and I am not going to rule them out of order. The Minister has to accept responsibility for the answer he gave.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000042\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002275a05f96-2474-4c90-a6ea-cf7b5798e03e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002228686a7fc6c541c0922098864d03195e\u0022\u003EHon Ruth Dyson\u003C/span\u003E: Will he take up the offer from the recently elected Mayor of Christchurch, Lianne Dalziel, to work better together and get agreement between the Canterbury Earthquake Recovery Authority red zoning and the Christchurch City Council\u2019s section 124 notices so that people in green zoned but red-stickered homes can get their lives back?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000043\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00224d0b589bcf4842d5b08dde81dafe88ff\u0022\u003EHon GERRY BROWNLEE\u003C/span\u003E: Yes.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000044\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u00222078ed825bd74d93806913eb27031a14\u0022\u003ESexual Assault Allegations\u2014Confidence in Police Investigation\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022 data-id=\u0022256647d8ea44407083223bfbd468a734\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000045\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022\u003E2. \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022256647d8ea44407083223bfbd468a734\u0022\u003EJACINDA ARDERN (Labour)\u003C/span\u003E to the Minister of Police: Does she have confidence in the Police investigation of alleged sexual violation against young women and underage girls in West Auckland?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022977cccaf-581d-4f48-924e-32bf6c54a93d\u0022 data-id=\u0022d8de9439e7334ddbacdf50a55b7b4bed\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000046\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022977cccaf-581d-4f48-924e-32bf6c54a93d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022d8de9439e7334ddbacdf50a55b7b4bed\u0022\u003EHon ANNE TOLLEY (Minister of Police):\u003C/span\u003E I have confidence in the police. Although the Police Commissioner has provided me with assurance that the police investigation has been thorough and appropriately managed, a number of questions have been raised about this investigation. That is why I have written to the Independent Police Conduct Authority this morning, asking it to undertake an inquiry into this matter and to provide me with an independent assurance that police have conducted this investigation to the highest standard. The public of New Zealand needs to have confidence that police take allegations of sexual assault extremely seriously and that they will do all they can to ensure that perpetrators are held to account. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000047\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022b498983a5302460493eb787d20c17108\u0022\u003EJacinda Ardern\u003C/span\u003E: Why on Monday did she state that victims needed to come forward in order for their cases to progress when it has been revealed now that several young women and girls did exactly that, as long as 2 years ago?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000048\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022977cccaf-581d-4f48-924e-32bf6c54a93d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002270ade7ca6cc2454380d85a3c3d498d75\u0022\u003EHon ANNE TOLLEY\u003C/span\u003E: Simply because the information that I had on Monday and again on Tuesday was that although girls had been spoken to, they had not made formal complaints. What was revealed last night was, in fact, that a young girl had made a complaint. Neither the commissioner nor I was aware of that. That is one of the questions that has been raised and one of the reasons I have asked the Independent Police Conduct Authority specifically to investigate the investigation of this young girl\u2019s complaint\u2014who was 13\u20142 years ago. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000049\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00226035727a8cce42e0ae854b774c4af357\u0022\u003EJacinda Ardern\u003C/span\u003E: Why was neither she, nor the Waitemat\u0101 district commander, nor the Police Commissioner properly briefed on this case at the very beginning?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000050\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022977cccaf-581d-4f48-924e-32bf6c54a93d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00229fa8a1d013364c65bb9ae393d3d7bf7d\u0022\u003EHon ANNE TOLLEY\u003C/span\u003E: I have expressed my disappointment this morning to the commissioner that that has been the case. He is extremely disappointed that that has been the case. My understanding is that he is conducting, with the district commander, an inquiry into why that information was not available to them. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000051\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022d5e0a5b2458b42daa228ae4ed1437225\u0022\u003EJacinda Ardern\u003C/span\u003E: Is it her expectation that a person who makes a complaint of sexual violation and gives information about their clothing at the time of the incident would then have it implied that what they were wearing could influence the case?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000052\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022977cccaf-581d-4f48-924e-32bf6c54a93d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00226a420126c32d4bd087dc96b9f6936f6e\u0022\u003EHon ANNE TOLLEY\u003C/span\u003E: I really think that we should stop jumping to conclusions. [Interruption] \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000053\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e4b09a29-dfd3-42c0-8585-11463bd6077b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002255a6bd5f678144f2a6e0ab461a2113a8\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Order! [Interruption] Order! This was a legitimate question. It is a serious matter, and I want to hear the answer. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000054\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022977cccaf-581d-4f48-924e-32bf6c54a93d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022cadb9f096e314624ace1437970576cfc\u0022\u003EHon ANNE TOLLEY\u003C/span\u003E: The police have very strict protocols around the investigation of sexual assault charges and allegations. It is my expectation that police will adhere to those. They have done a tremendous amount of work over the last years to raise their performance to focus it on the needs of victims. I would be extremely disappointed if they had not lived up to those standards. That is one of the reasons I have taken this so seriously that I have taken the unprecedented step of referring this to the Independent Police Conduct Authority for investigation. I caution this House that the investigations are ongoing and we should be very careful that we do not say anything that might prejudice bringing some of these young men to account. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000055\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223facbb72-b3b0-464b-b24d-e6de0616f323\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00227cff81df9c794ab5aba8c4ede28e22de\u0022\u003ECarol Beaumont\u003C/span\u003E: What efforts were made by the police over the last 2 years to warn young women in west Auckland of the actions of this group, given its predatory nature and well-signalled plans to target young women and to increase the number of young men involved in its activities?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000056\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022977cccaf-581d-4f48-924e-32bf6c54a93d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00225d60118111e6414f827f3cf89bb521c9\u0022\u003EHon ANNE TOLLEY\u003C/span\u003E: I am assured by the commissioner that this has been a thorough and enthusiastic investigation by the police. They have been\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000057\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022b6df5b96df534fe0bc3a82740c927983\u0022\u003EGrant Robertson\u003C/span\u003E: Enthusiastic?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000058\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022977cccaf-581d-4f48-924e-32bf6c54a93d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002229026aa3f39a4858883b86ff6a3b6c31\u0022\u003EHon ANNE TOLLEY\u003C/span\u003E: Yes, the police are very enthusiastic to bring these young men to account. It is my understanding that the police have interviewed the young men on numerous occasions and have spoken to their schools and the principals of those schools.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000059\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022d9002684c1ca459a82c7ec1006abce05\u0022\u003EGrant Robertson\u003C/span\u003E: What about the girls\u2019 schools?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000060\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022977cccaf-581d-4f48-924e-32bf6c54a93d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022c809ae5663d7466ebb267da43301c8e4\u0022\u003EHon ANNE TOLLEY\u003C/span\u003E: That is the information that the commissioner has given me. But I repeat: the Independent Police Conduct Authority will investigate the entire investigation from 2 years ago, and it is important that politicians do not get involved in that investigation, because it is a police operational issue. The Independent Police Conduct Authority is the only one that can go through it minute by minute.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000061\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223facbb72-b3b0-464b-b24d-e6de0616f323\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00225b3bb11c954e4e1c93c85336246cdadd\u0022\u003ECarol Beaumont\u003C/span\u003E: I raise a point of order, Mr Speaker. I actually asked what efforts\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000062\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e4b09a29-dfd3-42c0-8585-11463bd6077b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022f383a35e3d2e4c18a3020bd6f4e004d9\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Order! I heard the question, and on this occasion I invite the member to repeat the question to the Minister.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000063\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223facbb72-b3b0-464b-b24d-e6de0616f323\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022eceae4308e1d40108eec61806935ceb7\u0022\u003ECarol Beaumont\u003C/span\u003E: Thank you very much. What efforts were made by the police over the last 2 years to warn young women in west Auckland of the actions of this group, given its predatory nature and well-signalled plans to target young women and to increase the number of young men involved in its activities?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000064\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022977cccaf-581d-4f48-924e-32bf6c54a93d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022874d8b1650e94bde886651359fff4799\u0022\u003EHon ANNE TOLLEY\u003C/span\u003E: Well, I thought I had just addressed that. The commissioner has advised me that the police went to great efforts to track down these young men and speak with them and their families, and went and talked with their schools. The police also talked with the parents of the girls, but without any evidence, they cannot make unsubstantiated accusations about young people.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000065\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223facbb72-b3b0-464b-b24d-e6de0616f323\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002256ca10dc4d9c4feb93262849e7fead1b\u0022\u003ECarol Beaumont\u003C/span\u003E: I raise a point of order, Mr Speaker. I still do not believe that answers the question about warning young women in west Auckland.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000066\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e4b09a29-dfd3-42c0-8585-11463bd6077b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002264218895fb3a49e3a7c6e2f15a9b7469\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Order! On this occasion, the Minister included the statement that they had talked to the schools, etc., which obviously would have been\u2014[Interruption] I have determined that on this occasion the Minister has addressed the question. It may not be to the member\u2019s satisfaction. The way forward is for the member to ask more searching questions if she wants to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000067\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u00228d5e2f1055944f6aa6c7fc53eedd94b3\u0022\u003EEconomic Programme\u2014Progress\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002253f86481-33c1-48b2-893b-c11cc0bd673d\u0022 data-id=\u00222bf8930904d34f0b849e8e6ac91c3b2e\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000068\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002253f86481-33c1-48b2-893b-c11cc0bd673d\u0022\u003E3. \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00222bf8930904d34f0b849e8e6ac91c3b2e\u0022\u003EPAUL GOLDSMITH (National)\u003C/span\u003E to the Minister of Finance: What progress has the National-led Government made in building a more productive and competitive economy capable of supporting more jobs and higher incomes for New Zealanders?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00224a244152-977c-48d2-bf53-4f3a369a27a9\u0022 data-id=\u00228dbff3864b044b7288d3ff204d8acfa6\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000069\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00224a244152-977c-48d2-bf53-4f3a369a27a9\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00228dbff3864b044b7288d3ff204d8acfa6\u0022\u003EHon STEVEN JOYCE (Associate Minister of Finance)\u003C/span\u003E on behalf of the Minister of Finance: The National-led Government was elected 5 years ago tomorrow, and I am pleased to report that very considerable progress has been made in that time. In fact, on just about every score the economy is in much better shape than it was in late 2008. Back then the economy had been shrinking for four quarters. In the past year the economy grew by around 2.5 percent, one of the highest rates in the OECD for that year. This is helping to push business and consumer confidence to their highest level in many years. Businesses are indicating strongly that they plan to invest more and hire more staff over the coming year. This was confirmed in the employment data issued yesterday.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000070\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002253f86481-33c1-48b2-893b-c11cc0bd673d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00226b8a7174a8334482a09f6ab576a5d77e\u0022\u003EPaul Goldsmith\u003C/span\u003E: What other indicators confirm that the economy is in better shape than it was 5 years ago?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000071\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00224a244152-977c-48d2-bf53-4f3a369a27a9\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022403b28c4260245dfa05cd794f46dd725\u0022\u003EHon STEVEN JOYCE\u003C/span\u003E: Well, there are many of them, and perhaps you could let me run through just a few of them. Before our first Budget, Treasury told us that if we continued with the previous policies, we would run deficits for ever and net debt would soar to over 60 percent of GDP by 2023 and never come down. Under this Government\u2019s responsible economic and fiscal management we are now on track to a surplus in 2014-15. Net debt is expected to peak at below 30 percent of GDP despite the $15 billion expected cost to the Crown of the Canterbury earthquakes. On the subject of debt and deficits, back in 2008 the current account deficit was almost 9 percent of GDP and New Zealand\u2019s net external debt had blown out to 84 percent of GDP. Now the current account is 4.3 percent of GDP, less than half of what it was 5 years ago, and net external debt is 71 percent of GDP.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000072\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ec266512-9fe8-47da-883e-48f046ee5059\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002264ede8a87d244def9e681f8a079e4a8b\u0022\u003ETe Ururoa Flavell\u003C/span\u003E: T\u0113n\u0101 koe, Mr Speaker. Kia ora t\u0101tou. What confidence does he have that the decline in the rate of youth who are not in employment, education, and training, which was announced yesterday as falling to 11.4 percent, is an indication that our young people are being actively employed or are in study; and is a similar decline being experienced by M\u0101ori?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000073\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00224a244152-977c-48d2-bf53-4f3a369a27a9\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00224a3cd4636bac4086917a1583f1d7e3bc\u0022\u003EHon STEVEN JOYCE\u003C/span\u003E: Yes, the household labour force survey showed yesterday the \u201Cneet\u201D rate for 15 to 24-year-olds falling to 11.4 percent, which is the lowest level since the December quarter in 2008. That is great to see. The number of \u201Cneet\u201D M\u0101ori was flat this quarter, but the Government has a range of initiatives that are improving M\u0101ori employment and education outcomes\u2014for example, M\u0101ori and Pasifika trade training, Youth Guarantee, vocational pathways, and a focus on M\u0101ori and Pasifika attending university, with domestic tertiary enrolments for M\u0101ori students at 21 percent in 2012, up from 19 percent 5 years ago. I was pleased to see that, overall, M\u0101ori employment has increased by nearly 5 percent over the last year and that unemployment has dropped by 2.9 percent at the same time.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000074\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002253f86481-33c1-48b2-893b-c11cc0bd673d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022ce2062a6966f413b8c20e71da355d3fc\u0022\u003EPaul Goldsmith\u003C/span\u003E: How have families benefited from the Government\u2019s economic programme over the past 5 years?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000075\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00224a244152-977c-48d2-bf53-4f3a369a27a9\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00227f58a02e51134ce39a9de0e6e89bf5ac\u0022\u003EHon STEVEN JOYCE\u003C/span\u003E: Five years ago annual inflation for consumers was running at more than 5 percent; it has now fallen to a little over 1 percent. In 2008 food prices alone jumped 11 percent; they have gone up by only 1.2 percent in the last year. Floating mortgage interest rates averaged almost 11 percent in 2008; they are now less than 6 percent, although forecast to rise somewhat next year. New Zealand superannuation payments have increased by 25 percent over the past 5 years. The tax system has been made more progressive, reducing the proportion of net income tax paid by those on lower incomes. Taken together, these positive indicators are helping New Zealand families get ahead after several challenging years. This Government has a busy agenda to ensure that this progress continues.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000076\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00228633c816954b4609b4b1ec28a79e8883\u0022\u003ERt Hon Winston Peters\u003C/span\u003E: If things were positive, would not even the most obsequious National MP know that? So how does he explain the endless, repetitive questions in the Goldsmith vein, or the interminable time he has taken\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000077\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e4b09a29-dfd3-42c0-8585-11463bd6077b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002212bada076b3f4d3a9f61c545accf9d88\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Order! Could the member just ask a supplementary question that is consistent with the Standing Orders.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000078\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00226aff0ee6a5b6407db4bb27b422671221\u0022\u003ERt Hon Winston Peters\u003C/span\u003E: Well, I have and I am.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000079\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e4b09a29-dfd3-42c0-8585-11463bd6077b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00220bb29f4d778841f1b26445c5e5b46116\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: No, the member has not. I will give the member one more chance; otherwise\u2014[Interruption] Order! If the member wants to remain in the Chamber for question time, I will give the member one more opportunity to ask a supplementary question that is in line with the Standing Orders.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000080\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022f5bddbcc5cd14d7c8fcb0bc28d2b58e0\u0022\u003ERt Hon Winston Peters\u003C/span\u003E: I raise a point of order, Mr Speaker. Would you please tell me what was wrong with the question I was asking.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000081\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e4b09a29-dfd3-42c0-8585-11463bd6077b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022fcd73f45f69e4046a65cd702c64cf9e1\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: It was unnecessarily long, it was very hard for me to even decipher what the question was, and it was derogatory of some National members of this House. Would the member\u2014[Interruption] Order! If members want to be leaving this Chamber before the end of question time today, they will be. I invite the Rt Hon Winston Peters to ask a supplementary question.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000082\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00228f24d1d7f1ce4c74beaa77b62c88cb15\u0022\u003ERt Hon Winston Peters\u003C/span\u003E: All right. If things were positive, would not even the most obsequious MP, party unnamed, know that; and how, therefore, does he explain the endless, repetitive questions in Mr Goldsmith\u2019s vein, or the interminable time he is taking to try to convince his nervous backbench colleagues that something positive is happening?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000083\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e4b09a29-dfd3-42c0-8585-11463bd6077b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022f016acb7eb8b4a53aa9dcb942c6433e3\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: I invite the Hon Steven Joyce to answer that question if there is much ministerial responsibility.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000084\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00224a244152-977c-48d2-bf53-4f3a369a27a9\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022bf2a701177db4554a4a08a939cfb89dc\u0022\u003EHon STEVEN JOYCE\u003C/span\u003E: I appreciate that the member is obsessed with the politics of this place, but, actually, New Zealanders outside of this House of Representatives are very interested in hearing about the progress of the New Zealand economy. The member may be bored because he has been here for so long, but, actually, the rest of the world is very\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000085\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002213cdecb180784368bebbf131a4e9f83d\u0022\u003ERt Hon Winston Peters\u003C/span\u003E: I raise a point of order, Mr Speaker. He cannot possibly be allowed to get away with that, given your restraints against my asking the question.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000086\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e4b09a29-dfd3-42c0-8585-11463bd6077b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00228698617926ff4f3c92963fce1e323787\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Order! The member will resume his seat. [Interruption] The member will resume his seat. Otherwise he will not be remaining in the House in question time. The member can reconsider his question in light of a question that I think was very, very marginal. He has every right to receive the answer he is getting from the Hon Steven Joyce.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000087\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002253f86481-33c1-48b2-893b-c11cc0bd673d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a4d2412f311e4372b1ca665f1bdb6157\u0022\u003EPaul Goldsmith\u003C/span\u003E: What new policies is the Government undertaking to continue the positive economic momentum?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000088\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00224a244152-977c-48d2-bf53-4f3a369a27a9\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00229df57b61e24d49768251ce831db0a865\u0022\u003EHon STEVEN JOYCE\u003C/span\u003E: Here is an opportunity to explain to the House, including the elderly member opposite, that I am pleased\u2014[Interruption] \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000089\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e4b09a29-dfd3-42c0-8585-11463bd6077b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00225fff6d14eeb44ca0ae484149fc79b53b\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Order! On this occasion\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000090\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002257973b96a6c84cfb9e89d9d0cabc25c1\u0022\u003ERt Hon Winston Peters\u003C/span\u003E: I raise a point of order, Mr Speaker. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000091\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e4b09a29-dfd3-42c0-8585-11463bd6077b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022f9f42b711e5946d4aeb54a87baa3051f\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Order! Order! I am on my feet. I am on my feet. On this occasion, I can anticipate the point of order. The Minister will repeat his answer without any reference to the age of any member in this House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000092\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00222d2018f48b55462084b51e6ae1e9ab90\u0022\u003ERt Hon Winston Peters\u003C/span\u003E: That is not my point of order.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000093\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e4b09a29-dfd3-42c0-8585-11463bd6077b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00226ab0db8e9e64491bb908ca8187de9e4e\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Then I will hear the point of order, provided it is\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000094\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00222137b4438e354ef4999c25270f343a75\u0022\u003ERt Hon Winston Peters\u003C/span\u003E: The Standing Orders give me a right to raise a point of order, particularly when an ageist inference like that one there has been slung across the House\u2014particularly when he is the one who has got no hair on his head.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000095\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e4b09a29-dfd3-42c0-8585-11463bd6077b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002214f9076abb36442c8eb410e87238e49f\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Order! I have just addressed that point of order\u2014[Interruption] Order! I will not put up with another spurious point of order being raised by the Rt Hon Winston Peters in this question time. The Minister will recommence his answer without any reference to the age of any member in this House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000096\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002243684a4d-fb40-469a-8e63-cdd1e354b387\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022518077b208034f148555b2b5803adb4d\u0022\u003EBrendan Horan\u003C/span\u003E: I raise a point of order, Mr Speaker. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000097\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e4b09a29-dfd3-42c0-8585-11463bd6077b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00228da18ef5adf54ea385f5092ee1bbd4b0\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Order! Let me just make it clear: if members from the Government side of the House want to stay for the balance of question time\u2014this is a point of order, and it will be heard in silence.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000098\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002243684a4d-fb40-469a-8e63-cdd1e354b387\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022905ce061abc849c6bddd9eb8eec1ad5f\u0022\u003EBrendan Horan\u003C/span\u003E: In the past 3 days, that member has got away with slinging insults at members in this House\u2014the type of insults that you would not tolerate from the newest member of this House. Yet again, that member gets another warning\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000099\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e4b09a29-dfd3-42c0-8585-11463bd6077b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00229fd24485353546e8ac24ecdde3b54d77\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Order! I have not had an opportunity to phone the member. There was an insult cast yesterday that I think was unparliamentary. The member Mr Horan took objection to it. I had not heard it, but after reading Hansard the member makes a good point. If I was to hear such an interjection and the member was offended, I would deal with it appropriately. At this stage, the matter has now passed. I now invite the Hon Steven Joyce to answer the question.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000100\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00224a244152-977c-48d2-bf53-4f3a369a27a9\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022835b0ecad1dd4fa2a974bc41f5974fec\u0022\u003EHon STEVEN JOYCE\u003C/span\u003E: I am slightly hurt at the reference to my high forehead. I am pleased to advise that the initiatives keep on coming. A sample of announcements that the Government has made in just the last few weeks include progress on work on the Transmission Gully road, which is very important, of course, in the Wellington region; the new technology incubators to speed up company start-ups, which was announced last week; new social housing developments for Auckland, to grow the private provision of community housing; $260 million to support the rebuild of the University of Canterbury; the launch of the New Zealand Story, to help firms leverage off a strong narrative about New Zealand\u2019s uniqueness; proposals to bring down the cost of building materials to support our housing supply programme; a new direction for Te Puni K\u014Dkiri and economic development; $30 million to develop new schools; policy changes to attract more international students to New Zealand; and a record $59 million in Marsden Fund grants for top researchers. As I said, this is just a sample of our announcements within the last couple of weeks. There are plenty more to come as the economy improves. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000101\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f5d71749-ae91-4af7-b2bd-77260398912a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022cd6c1a5103ec4966b83c7848d60b52ec\u0022\u003EHon David Parker\u003C/span\u003E: I raise a point of order, Mr Speaker. We were willing to listen to such a long diatribe as long as Chorus was listed in there somewhere.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000102\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e4b09a29-dfd3-42c0-8585-11463bd6077b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00220fcefade4d2148c1b6cdc809dfbaf78e\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Order! That member, as a very senior member of the Opposition, should also stand on his feet and raise points of order that are legitimate.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000103\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002253f86481-33c1-48b2-893b-c11cc0bd673d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002242e4da33f554470f8fa9df5a65a1ca2a\u0022\u003EPaul Goldsmith\u003C/span\u003E: What alternative approaches would put progress in building a more productive and competitive economy at risk?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000104\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00224a244152-977c-48d2-bf53-4f3a369a27a9\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022e731fc1d68054acfae82d6fa27e643b0\u0022\u003EHon STEVEN JOYCE\u003C/span\u003E: I have given this quite a bit of thought, and there are some alternative approaches that would put our good progress at risk, and that would cost jobs, push up interest rates, and depress incomes. We know what those alternative approaches are, because they have been tried in the past and they have failed. They include high and wasteful Government spending, more costs and more taxes on households and businesses, more State control of the economy, and politicians running everything from the electricity market to risky insurance businesses and monetary policy. This Government rejects all these nutty old ideas that are coming from the Greens and Labour by the day.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000105\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u0022148712fc30304d8682de7a453f75e7f0\u0022\u003ESexual Assault Allegations\u2014Confidence in Police Investigation\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022fc8ab326-1806-41d3-8c41-cd58c95dcb45\u0022 data-id=\u002265c0c475d79c4da8bf33b035db8d8000\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000106\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022fc8ab326-1806-41d3-8c41-cd58c95dcb45\u0022\u003E4. \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002265c0c475d79c4da8bf33b035db8d8000\u0022\u003EMETIRIA TUREI (Co-Leader\u2014Green)\u003C/span\u003E to the Minister of Police: When was she first advised that Police had received a complaint from a girl who alleged she had been raped by members of a group calling themselves the Roast Busters?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022977cccaf-581d-4f48-924e-32bf6c54a93d\u0022 data-id=\u00228e63eb686aa04ba2ab95f2a90140d5ce\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000107\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022977cccaf-581d-4f48-924e-32bf6c54a93d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00228e63eb686aa04ba2ab95f2a90140d5ce\u0022\u003EHon ANNE TOLLEY (Minister of Police):\u003C/span\u003E My office was advised in a phone call from Police National Headquarters at about 5.55 last night. I was advised by my office just after the start of the 6 o\u2019clock news.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000108\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022fc8ab326-1806-41d3-8c41-cd58c95dcb45\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00224e57d2fb9dc7486394263d7f97734949\u0022\u003EMetiria Turei\u003C/span\u003E: Does the Minister share the confidence of the Prime Minister regarding the police response to this case, that \u201CIf there is criminal wrongdoing that they can follow up on and take action, then I\u2019m absolutely confident that they will do their job and do it \u2026 thoroughly professionally.\u201D, given that she has now referred the police response to that case to the Independent Police Conduct Authority?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000109\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022977cccaf-581d-4f48-924e-32bf6c54a93d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022f2ceedabf370485d964f1e6e2b1eba77\u0022\u003EHon ANNE TOLLEY\u003C/span\u003E: I have made it clear in this House today that I do have confidence in the police, but there are enough questions over this case, partly because information has literally dribbled out this week, that have prompted me to ask the Independent Police Conduct Authority to conduct a full investigation into it. It is really important that the public have confidence in the police processes around serious sexual assaults.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000110\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022fc8ab326-1806-41d3-8c41-cd58c95dcb45\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022e1c36ba2a87747c4a8021e2734d90377\u0022\u003EMetiria Turei\u003C/span\u003E: What reasons have the police given the Minister for waiting days to correct the statement that was made on Sunday, that \u201CNone of the girls have been brave enough to make formal statements to us so that we can take that to a prosecution stage or even consider a prosecution stage.\u201D?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000111\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022977cccaf-581d-4f48-924e-32bf6c54a93d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022f80e40831397430cba5f4a38bc9ea2c1\u0022\u003EHon ANNE TOLLEY\u003C/span\u003E: I have made it clear today how disappointed I am that neither I nor the commissioner nor even the district commander knew that a formal complaint had been lodged by a 13-year-old girl 2 years ago, but the commissioner does assure me that that formal complaint was very thoroughly investigated and did not produce enough evidence to take a case to court.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000112\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022fc8ab326-1806-41d3-8c41-cd58c95dcb45\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00223d84a3cc2f8841a3951acec1433a1a1c\u0022\u003EMetiria Turei\u003C/span\u003E: I raise a point of order, Mr Speaker. I am not trying to make a political point, but I did ask what reasons the police gave for failing to provide the accurate information in a timely way, and that was not answered.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000113\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e4b09a29-dfd3-42c0-8585-11463bd6077b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00220369c25a98354e47b93a4d3fd04f54c8\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: No, I think it was. As I interpreted the answer, the question has been asked and they are still trying to find out the reason. The commissioner did not know, and he was just as concerned. The way to tease this out is by further supplementary questions.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000114\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022fc8ab326-1806-41d3-8c41-cd58c95dcb45\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00223badcd97863f455d8c3a31a4ad01c4c6\u0022\u003EMetiria Turei\u003C/span\u003E: Does the Minister consider that the police\u2019s apparent failure to act in this particular case is likely to be isolated; if she does think so, why?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000115\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022977cccaf-581d-4f48-924e-32bf6c54a93d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00220926067340084268ae09df567512a3fc\u0022\u003EHon ANNE TOLLEY\u003C/span\u003E: Again, I am assured by the commissioner that the police conducted a thorough investigation into the formal complaint that was laid by the 13-year-old girl and did not produce enough evidence to take a case. But the very fact that there are still questions about the handling of this case is why I have referred it to the Independent Police Conduct Authority to give both me and the public the assurance that the way that the police handle these serious sexual assault cases is thorough and is in line with the new protocols, and to give us all an assurance that this is an isolated case.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000116\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022fc8ab326-1806-41d3-8c41-cd58c95dcb45\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a43efe581a494943bc85cd2c063d1c6f\u0022\u003EMetiria Turei\u003C/span\u003E: What advice has the Minister sought on removing the systemic barriers that prevent the police from taking complaints to trial, which lead the police to wait for more assaults on young girls to occur, as has happened in this case, for some years before they believe they have sufficient evidence to take the case to trial?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000117\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022977cccaf-581d-4f48-924e-32bf6c54a93d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00226a9a1e2a2b364529b9ccd888eda49643\u0022\u003EHon ANNE TOLLEY\u003C/span\u003E: Again, the commissioner assures me that there has been a very thorough investigation, and that that investigation has been ongoing for 2 years, trying to put together enough evidence to meet the requirements to take a case to court. As recently as 2 weeks ago, the other three girls were approached by police to try to get a formal complaint from them. In two cases their mothers refused, and, again, the commissioner advises me that the third girl has also refused. No one underestimates the difficulties for these young girls in making a formal complaint, but the police have done an enormous amount of work, and I refer the member to the protocols that were tabled by the Minister of Justice in the House earlier this week. They were worked through with Louise Nicholas, who was involved in a very notable case. She has worked very closely with police from a victim\u2019s perspective. What I want to be able to assure New Zealanders, through an Independent Police Conduct Authority report into this investigation, and, in particular, into the investigation around the case of this young 13-year-old girl, is that all those protocols were followed, the victim was at the centre of the investigation, and New Zealanders can have confidence in the police in order to come forward and make these complaints.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000118\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022fc8ab326-1806-41d3-8c41-cd58c95dcb45\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022902225ac7a6a47d69ecb6f894b7bf89b\u0022\u003EMetiria Turei\u003C/span\u003E: Will the Minister support the urgent development of a specialist sexual violence court and an alternative process for sexual violence offence cases, both of which have received very strong support from judges, lawyers, sexual violence support services, and the public, given the difficulties that victims have bringing their complaints to the police, the difficulties the police have in dealing sensitively and responsively with those complaints, and the police\u2019s reluctance to take sexual violence cases to trial?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000119\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022977cccaf-581d-4f48-924e-32bf6c54a93d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022f35d496c13164b87b817e358b9dd9dec\u0022\u003EHon ANNE TOLLEY\u003C/span\u003E: First of all, I have no ministerial responsibility for the development of such a policy, but I have discussed it with the Minister of Justice, who addressed it in this House earlier this week. These cases are extremely complex. One of the difficulties is trying to separate out a particular set of charges around these assault cases in order to try them in a different way from some of the other aspects of that case, in which case you would be putting your victims through the process twice, which is a difficult enough process anyway without revictimising a person and making them go through two lots of courts. It is ongoing. The Minister of Justice has made it clear that she is willing to talk with the police and her department about some ways of easing the process for these young women, but these are very difficult cases to take to court and to prove.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000120\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022fc8ab326-1806-41d3-8c41-cd58c95dcb45\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022aba39a7fb4264df29355f34a8bae442b\u0022\u003EMetiria Turei\u003C/span\u003E: Will the Minister commit to leading a cross-party working group to build both a political consensus and also political urgency for the reforms of the court and police processes, such as a specialist sexual violence court and changes to police process, to better deliver real justice to the victims of sexual violence offences, particularly children\u2014as in this case\u2014and better justice for their families and New Zealanders?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000121\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022977cccaf-581d-4f48-924e-32bf6c54a93d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022abb1285112dd4794a05a5fb0b6f3d9a2\u0022\u003EHon ANNE TOLLEY\u003C/span\u003E: Again, I repeat that I have no ministerial responsibility. I cannot make that guarantee. But what I have said, to try to explain to this House today, is that the police have made enormous changes to the way that they deal with sexual assault cases, and victims in particular. I would like the Independent Police Conduct Authority to investigate this case to give me reassurance, and to give the public reassurance, that as much as we can do\u2014and will continue to do\u2014has been put into practice by the police in this instance. But if the member and her party have any suggestions about how we can ease this process while still retaining the need to have evidence to take to court, I would be delighted to hear it.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000122\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u00221e525a58aa7840f58943fe5d9d797457\u0022\u003EBroadband, Ultra-fast\u2014Infrastructure Pricing and Contract with Chorus\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022f5d71749-ae91-4af7-b2bd-77260398912a\u0022 data-id=\u00222cd1412ed1584ce3aa0ca8f1f40d28f0\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000123\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f5d71749-ae91-4af7-b2bd-77260398912a\u0022\u003E5. \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00222cd1412ed1584ce3aa0ca8f1f40d28f0\u0022\u003EHon DAVID PARKER (Deputy Leader\u2014Labour)\u003C/span\u003E to the Minister for Communications and Information Technology: Will the Government enforce its broadband contract with Chorus?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022dc6c0f88-e781-476d-bca1-d1bf9b69302b\u0022 data-id=\u002236459b2226f945bf9536a1f701ff42c3\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000124\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dc6c0f88-e781-476d-bca1-d1bf9b69302b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002236459b2226f945bf9536a1f701ff42c3\u0022\u003EHon AMY ADAMS (Minister for Communications and Information Technology):\u003C/span\u003E As I have previously stated, the Government expects all parties to fulfil their contractual obligations with the Government. The contract with Chorus contains a number of enforcement options if it were to fail to meet its obligations. The concern for the Government is ensuring that New Zealanders get ultra-fast broadband to deliver high-quality, high-speed, world-leading telecommunications. That is our focus in this issue, and our consideration of options will be guided by the best way to achieve that.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000125\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f5d71749-ae91-4af7-b2bd-77260398912a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00220ab4a60ae9be43a3a24fcbb12540160c\u0022\u003EHon David Parker\u003C/span\u003E: Why was an independent review of the financial viability of Chorus not undertaken prior to awarding the broadband contract to Chorus?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000126\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dc6c0f88-e781-476d-bca1-d1bf9b69302b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00220c05331b2b1c4f959fc379cc70b40911\u0022\u003EHon AMY ADAMS\u003C/span\u003E: Although I would take issue with that, I can assure the member that considerable due diligence was done through the contract negotiations into the capability of parties to undertake the obligations. What we have said consistently through this is that although there was an understanding that the copper price may well fall, nobody expected a price drop of this level and none of the pricing methodologies, therefore, would have worked through such an unanticipated drop. I would point out that that failure to anticipate such a drop was shared by members of the Labour Party who, as I recall, actively predicted that the copper price would rise under these arrangements.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000127\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f5d71749-ae91-4af7-b2bd-77260398912a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00222d81b9719ec143a096e7071842017b9f\u0022\u003EHon David Parker\u003C/span\u003E: Will this latest review examine the role of Mr Joyce, the former Minister for Communications and Information Technology, in crafting the legislation and awarding the contract to Chorus?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000128\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dc6c0f88-e781-476d-bca1-d1bf9b69302b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022863f03ceadb04639a12b33c22f2ebd07\u0022\u003EHon AMY ADAMS\u003C/span\u003E: The independent stream of advice that I have asked for today is about ensuring that the Government and the wider community have good information as to whether or not having the copper price set at this level would seriously undermine and threaten New Zealanders\u2019 ability to get ultra-fast broadband. That is certainly the indication that we have had, but some people, including some members in this House, have suggested that that is not right. We need good information to back up whether or not\u2014as we suspect, and as the advice we have had says\u2014that would put it at risk. That is what this review is about.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000129\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f5d71749-ae91-4af7-b2bd-77260398912a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00228a935bcd94de4d2aa53043aecafa8c1b\u0022\u003EHon David Parker\u003C/span\u003E: I raise a point of order, Mr Speaker. That is all very interesting, but it was not my question.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000130\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e4b09a29-dfd3-42c0-8585-11463bd6077b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00223596d5410b7e4f56af00f2d2bdcc52d7\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Order! I heard the question. The difficulty I had was actually in hearing the answer accurately because of the noise coming from Opposition benches here. If the member has further supplementary questions, that is the way to get the answer he wants.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000131\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f5d71749-ae91-4af7-b2bd-77260398912a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022b6d4dbd8e594470ca499b65de658b627\u0022\u003EHon David Parker\u003C/span\u003E: I raise a point of order, Mr Speaker. If the Speaker could not hear the answer and therefore could not judge whether the question was addressed, the Speaker should have brought the House into order. My point of order was that I did hear the answer and my question was not addressed.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000132\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e4b09a29-dfd3-42c0-8585-11463bd6077b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00222c694c0d30b6422abfcc0cf009b9827d\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: In the bits of the answer I heard, because it was difficult to hear, I believe the question was addressed\u2014maybe not to the member\u2019s satisfaction. But it would certainly assist if the deputy leader of the Labour Party could ask for his party to support him so that when he asks a question, the question can be answered without a level of interjection [Interruption]\u2014Order! [Interruption] There is not much point in looking behind yourself. It would certainly be assisted if we had a level of interjection that was substantially less than what is occurring on this particular day, mainly from the Labour Opposition benches.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000133\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f5d71749-ae91-4af7-b2bd-77260398912a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022ea8badbbe167488e8bfd916e99d2f6cd\u0022\u003EHon David Parker\u003C/span\u003E: I raise a point of order, Mr Speaker. I have some difficulty in being told that my point of order is out of order because the Speaker could not hear the answer to assess whether the question was addressed, and then be told that that is my fault.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000134\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e4b09a29-dfd3-42c0-8585-11463bd6077b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022c0a4ad95ac414595a3ccbd44786fc289\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Order! The member maybe misheard me or maybe misunderstood me. I said I did not hear all of the answer because of the level of interjection. I asked for the member\u2019s assistance with his colleagues to try to minimise the level of interjection. I then said that although I did not hear all of the answer, what I did hear of it led me to believe that the question had been addressed. I accept that it may not be to the satisfaction of the member, but the way forward is not to raise a point of order saying that the question has not been answered the way the member wanted it to be answered. The way forward is for the member to rise to his feet and ask a further searching supplementary question.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000135\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00222aa0b524-c38d-45aa-bd5b-99c5927085f4\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a51227c8286d4c4d97020664283b56ae\u0022\u003EClare Curran\u003C/span\u003E: Will her review announced today include examination of whether any private or other assurances were given to parent company Telecom and/or Chorus during the demerger and ultra-fast broadband tendering processes that led them to believe that there would not be a fall in copper prices; if not, why not?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000136\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dc6c0f88-e781-476d-bca1-d1bf9b69302b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002221444de8ef7c4ac9a62de7973f3e6379\u0022\u003EHon AMY ADAMS\u003C/span\u003E: The review is not my review. I have asked for an independent review to be provided to the Government, which I have indicated I will release to the public. What that will look at is whether Chorus is reasonably able to be expected to complete its contractual obligations to provide ultra-fast broadband. That is what it will look at. It will not go into any Opposition conspiracy theories.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000137\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00222aa0b524-c38d-45aa-bd5b-99c5927085f4\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a29751df5bc04b0b98b8197ddd660302\u0022\u003EClare Curran\u003C/span\u003E: How has her decision to undertake a narrow, specific, and possibly illegal review of the 2011 amendment to the Telecommunications Act 3 years before it was due\u2014bypassing the Commerce Commission\u2019s legal process of reviewing copper broadband pricing\u2014created more certainty; and is it not so that her tactics between last December and now have failed, resulting in greater uncertainty about the future of both Chorus and the Government\u2019s flagship ultra-fast broadband process?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000138\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dc6c0f88-e781-476d-bca1-d1bf9b69302b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00222f54102cd2d64b68a7912aee23106c36\u0022\u003EHon AMY ADAMS\u003C/span\u003E: Well, firstly, I reject most of the allegations in that member\u2019s question, and, secondly, no and no.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000139\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f5d71749-ae91-4af7-b2bd-77260398912a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a4829f8c6e1642af87387217cb25c62d\u0022\u003EHon David Parker\u003C/span\u003E: Why is the Government creating investment uncertainty for other investors in telecommunication companies, and what measures has she put in place to ensure that the review is not just a snow job to justify more corporate welfare or higher copper broadband prices?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000140\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dc6c0f88-e781-476d-bca1-d1bf9b69302b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022bfb570985e454dc8b96d3876794fcb53\u0022\u003EHon AMY ADAMS\u003C/span\u003E: Well, it seems to me that just yesterday the Opposition was demanding an independent look into the affairs and numbers of Chorus. Actually, that is something that I signalled 2 days earlier that we were going to do. That is what we are now doing. So is it the Opposition\u2019s position that we should not actually ask independent questions? Regardless, we make decisions\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000141\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022badb0a39-849c-462a-b32f-77fc017c9fc2\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002298bcdcece3bf4ccaaa7522efa68eda57\u0022\u003EHon Simon Bridges\u003C/span\u003E: Yeah, nah, yeah, nah.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000142\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dc6c0f88-e781-476d-bca1-d1bf9b69302b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00222542a8d4df5442bc9c9c2cc4911ae548\u0022\u003EHon AMY ADAMS\u003C/span\u003E: That is right. We are not the \u201CYeah, Nah Party\u201D on this side. We make decisions based on information and analysis. Where that information is challenged and we think it is a matter of significant public interest, as this is, we are happy to get further independent analysis and we are happy to release that publicly. This will help inform the debate and get New Zealanders focused on the question of whether this copper price\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000143\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e4b09a29-dfd3-42c0-8585-11463bd6077b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022b907336a500e4c9cb9110371952b3800\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Order! The answer is now getting a bit long.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000144\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u0022726e682c0e6d402b8991c2031c88d675\u0022\u003EFreshwater Management\u2014Reform\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022ed550fc2-879f-4560-affa-d35858308ad4\u0022 data-id=\u00222540b01abb284680903d241871eb8381\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000145\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ed550fc2-879f-4560-affa-d35858308ad4\u0022\u003E6. \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00222540b01abb284680903d241871eb8381\u0022\u003ECLAUDETTE HAUITI (National)\u003C/span\u003E to the Minister for the Environment: What announcements has the Government made in relation to the national policy statement for freshwater?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022dc6c0f88-e781-476d-bca1-d1bf9b69302b\u0022 data-id=\u00229fb1886dc7cd45029130a2a54c0d4e43\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000146\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dc6c0f88-e781-476d-bca1-d1bf9b69302b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00229fb1886dc7cd45029130a2a54c0d4e43\u0022\u003EHon AMY ADAMS (Minister for the Environment):\u003C/span\u003E Today my colleague the Minister for Primary Industries, Nathan Guy, and I released proposals for improving the way New Zealand manages its fresh water, including science-backed national water standards, which were a key recommendation of the Land and Water Forum. Ensuring that we protect and improve water quality now and for the future is one of our most critical challenges. The discussion document we have released seeks feedback on a national framework to support communities setting freshwater objectives, explicit recognition of tangata whenua values for fresh water, ecosystem and human health as compulsory values in regional plans, bottom lines for those values, and requiring councils to account for all water takes and all contaminant discharges into water bodies.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000147\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ed550fc2-879f-4560-affa-d35858308ad4\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00229d8077137ce84c4692ded34a5ae7e4d1\u0022\u003EClaudette Hauiti\u003C/span\u003E: What is the purpose of the national objectives framework?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000148\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dc6c0f88-e781-476d-bca1-d1bf9b69302b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022cda9eea907324a84a4bbd1b6aa9e035f\u0022\u003EHon AMY ADAMS\u003C/span\u003E: The national objectives framework will provide regions with both a process and a scientifically informed basis for the difficult communications and conversations that communities are having to have on water quality. When combined with the Government\u2019s already announced collaborative planning process option and better water accounting, it is our hope that the framework will result in more informed discussions in communities about the trade-offs, and reduce the arguments in councils and in courts over the science that sits behind regional plans and resource consents.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000149\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022073496a0-73b7-426f-97f8-916bd542b0fa\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002289a197f275d44902aa8f57821aacb25b\u0022\u003EMeka Whaitiri\u003C/span\u003E: Kia ora, Mr Speaker. Why does her Proposed amendments to the National Policy Statement for Freshwater Management contain incomplete standards and standards lower than current levels, when the lack of clear bottom-lines was a core issue highlighted by the Land and Water Forum?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000150\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dc6c0f88-e781-476d-bca1-d1bf9b69302b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022b04275b2e5624ce0b82fc8fb27451f6f\u0022\u003EHon AMY ADAMS\u003C/span\u003E: We have been very clear that the work around completing the table and the values to be attributed for each attribute is ongoing. The science work is still being completed, but the scientists have been very clear, as has the reference group, that we need to start with the information we have. We are not going to wait an interminable number of years, as the Labour Government did. We are going to start to improve water quality today, and I can assure this House and the member who asked the question that the level at which those bottom lines have been set\u2014and they are bottom lines; they are not targets\u2014is the level at which 60 of New Zealand\u2019s top scientists agreed was the appropriate place to set them.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000151\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ec266512-9fe8-47da-883e-48f046ee5059\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00221a695bdd46384e7dbb6eb2bedc1d2507\u0022\u003ETe Ururoa Flavell\u003C/span\u003E: T\u0113n\u0101 t\u0101tou. How have the rights and responsibilities of Ng\u0101ti Kahungunu as tangata whenua in Hawke\u2019s Bay been recognised, given that both the National Policy Statement for Freshwater Management and the Ruataniwha Dam project have been dealt with by the Government at a national level and not at a regional or local level?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000152\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dc6c0f88-e781-476d-bca1-d1bf9b69302b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00224eaaea8a69114acb83bfd0df8bb86ac5\u0022\u003EHon AMY ADAMS\u003C/span\u003E: To the best of my recollection, in the instance of the Ruataniwha Dam application it was the regional council of that area that requested that the application be dealt with through a national Environmental Protection Authority process. So that has come from the region. The other point I would make to the member is that, of course, that determination is being made under the current framework, and this is about how we improve that going forward. I can certainly advise the member that one of the key messages we took from community consultation was the integration of tangata whenua values within the national objectives framework. Te mana o te wai is a core principle of the document. You will see values such as the mahinga kai use of water and w\u0101i tapu clearly reflected in the framework. When you combine that with the increased and enhanced integrated role of iwi in the planning process, I think Ng\u0101ti Kahungunu and other iwi can be satisfied that they will have a much greater level of involvement in such decisions in the future.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000153\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u0022f14fe63debac410ea1efb5abe0026b22\u0022\u003EHousing Market\u2014Impact of Reserve Bank Intervention\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022cbc37df2-57ae-4536-94ed-a2e39eecd585\u0022 data-id=\u0022b43186d254c24cfa8d88906dbfc385fc\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000154\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cbc37df2-57ae-4536-94ed-a2e39eecd585\u0022\u003E7. \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022b43186d254c24cfa8d88906dbfc385fc\u0022\u003EPHIL TWYFORD (Labour\u2014Te Atat\u016B)\u003C/span\u003E to the Minister of Housing: What reports has he received on the effect of loan-to-value restrictions on the housing market?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022 data-id=\u002260db119a858c4c2181e9644aec187840\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000155\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002260db119a858c4c2181e9644aec187840\u0022\u003EHon Dr NICK SMITH (Minister of Housing):\u003C/span\u003E I have not received any formal reports, and the advice from my officials is that after just 1 month it is too early to draw firm conclusions on the effect of the loan-to-value ratio restrictions on the housing market. I have noted three reports from other sources. The first is from Statistics New Zealand on building consents. It showed a 22 percent increase in new dwelling consents, as compared with the same month last year; the highest build rate in Canterbury in 37 years; and the highest build rate for New Zealand in 5 years. I also note the latest real estate figures on house prices, which show a slowing in house price increases, and a report from the ASB showing a dip in house price expectations. The final report I note states: \u201CWe do support Loan to Value Ratios\u2026we\u2019ve been calling for them for ages,\u201D. This report was from Mr Phil Twyford.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000156\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cbc37df2-57ae-4536-94ed-a2e39eecd585\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002271e156bb60aa4356b32c5eecfa5dbdca\u0022\u003EPhil Twyford\u003C/span\u003E: Is he concerned that Master Builders said that inquiries for new builds have dropped off by 30 percent since loan-to-value ratios were introduced, and that because of the time lag it will not be until next year that we see the drop-off in new builds; if so, is this not just more evidence that the Government\u2019s housing policy has collapsed?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000157\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022fbb5ecbd761147f7b4035cc2903b9143\u0022\u003EHon Dr NICK SMITH\u003C/span\u003E: It is hard to say that it has collapsed when we have got the highest rate of new building consents in 5 years, when we have got the highest rate of building in Canterbury in 37 years, and when this Government has got work under way on materials, on land supply, and on infrastructure costs\u2014all opposed by members opposite, who somehow pretend that they want to help New Zealanders to get access to affordable houses.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000158\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cbc37df2-57ae-4536-94ed-a2e39eecd585\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a540ca4312614149bda53f9b339f18e9\u0022\u003EPhil Twyford\u003C/span\u003E: Has he seen the comments by Quotable Value research director Jonno Ingerson, who said today that loan-to-value ratios may have more impact in provincial areas outside of Auckland and Canterbury; and given that 95 percent of house price inflation is taking place in Auckland and Canterbury, and that in a number of parts of provincial New Zealand house prices are either static or declining, will he concede that the Government really did not think through the implications of loan-to-value ratios before it signed off the agreement with the Reserve Bank?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000159\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e4b09a29-dfd3-42c0-8585-11463bd6077b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022fcc08a23cbbe4cce9970d9f0bc4d7c1a\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: The Hon Dr Nick Smith, in so far as he has ministerial responsibility.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000160\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002219bf0f00874d4d6d8f02bd816b1caf51\u0022\u003EHon Dr NICK SMITH\u003C/span\u003E: The first point is that the loan-to-value ratio policy has been implemented by an independent Reserve Bank, under legislation that members opposite actually support, I thought\u2014an independent Reserve Bank. The part that makes the member\u2019s question even more stupid is that he has said on the public record that he has been calling for loan-to-value ratios for years and welcomed them when they were introduced.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000161\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a68928ea-9dd8-4a30-8e2c-a0f49dfc8bea\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022659cdcef3a72405084b94de8fa77cf8e\u0022\u003ELouise Upston\u003C/span\u003E: What has been the average house price increase over the past 5 years and how did it compare with the increase over the previous 5 years?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000162\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00224bf965078d2543e488a8d0b1acf62692\u0022\u003EHon Dr NICK SMITH\u003C/span\u003E: The average price increase in New Zealand over the last 5 years has been 3.6 percent per year, or 20 percent over those 5 years. It is interesting to note that in the previous 5 years it increased by an average of 12 percent per year, or 76 percent in just 5 years, and I note that during the previous 5 years the Labour Government did absolutely diddly-squat about house price affordability. In contrast, we are making great progress in all the areas like land supply, infrastructure costs, and materials, and, ironically, members opposite are opposing every one of those measures.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000163\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cbc37df2-57ae-4536-94ed-a2e39eecd585\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00226812b857ca0b4a7a8b89079b04b0011e\u0022\u003EPhil Twyford\u003C/span\u003E: When he compared our mortgage market with that of the United States, which saw \u201Cmillions of Americans left with mortgages in excess of the value of their properties.\u201D, what advice has he had to back up his claim that Auckland is in a housing price bubble and that it is in danger of bursting, wiping out the equity built up by homeowners?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000164\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a490f117b55e4a8eb2ef4a2ebd4d8ed9\u0022\u003EHon Dr NICK SMITH\u003C/span\u003E: I do think that this country needs to learn the lessons from both North America and Europe, where, for all the enthusiasm there may have been from the building industries, those house price bubbles did enormous damage to those economies. I cannot believe the attitude of members opposite, which is to completely ignore the lessons of history and not want to take a cautious view around financial stability in the way in which our Reserve Bank is administering those responsibilities.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000165\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cbc37df2-57ae-4536-94ed-a2e39eecd585\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022c816f1caa5904cb1a4ed390f6025b334\u0022\u003EPhil Twyford\u003C/span\u003E: I raise a point of order, Mr Speaker. I referred the Minister to a direct quote from his own statement and I asked him what advice he has received on that matter. He did not address that.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000166\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e4b09a29-dfd3-42c0-8585-11463bd6077b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002269c948b9e1f645b2a819fb74ffde8f56\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: To make progress, I am going to invite the member to ask his question again. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000167\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cbc37df2-57ae-4536-94ed-a2e39eecd585\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022e99f8ef13602408ca78982c7c8cc5756\u0022\u003EPhil Twyford\u003C/span\u003E: When he compared our mortgage market with that of the United States, which saw \u201Cmillions of Americans left with mortgages in excess of the value of their properties.\u201D, what advice has he had to back up the claim that Auckland is in a housing price bubble and that it is in danger of bursting, wiping out the equity built up by homeowners?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000168\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022b501ffab58ec471c989128303e5a046b\u0022\u003EHon Dr NICK SMITH\u003C/span\u003E: It is an absolute matter of public record, with numerous reports, that New Zealand\u2019s house prices are grossly out of step with incomes. The most recent report was yesterday, from the OECD. We could look at the reports from Labour\u2019s period in Government, when house prices more than doubled\u2014grew by over 100 percent\u2014at the same time as incomes went up by only 30 percent. We could look at the report of the Productivity Commission, which was comprehensive in its advice around the concern about ongoing house price increases, and that is why this Government is addressing the fundamentals of land supply, infrastructure costs, and materials costs to make sure that New Zealanders get access to more affordable housing.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000169\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002243684a4d-fb40-469a-8e63-cdd1e354b387\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002254cee19291cf451ba9e41caded26cfc8\u0022\u003EBrendan Horan\u003C/span\u003E: Is the Minister aware of a collapse in the number of first-home buyer inquiries in Tauranga and Nelson since the loan-to-value restrictions came into force; and did he foresee this, or is it an unintended consequence?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000170\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022999fd91ce5484fd2a96d1cb525d79922\u0022\u003EHon Dr NICK SMITH\u003C/span\u003E: On 1 October this Government actually increased the support for first-home buyers. We did that by expanding the KiwiSaver scheme, which was particularly advantageous for people in Nelson and Tauranga, where the house price limit was lifted by over $50,000. We have trebled the number of Welcome Home Loans, which are limited to first-home buyers and provide them with an exemption from those loan-to-value limits from the Reserve Bank, and those changes to Welcome Home Loans are particularly helpful for communities like Tauranga and Nelson, because the previous limits meant that very few families had access to those Welcome Home Loans.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000171\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cbc37df2-57ae-4536-94ed-a2e39eecd585\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002261d69ec703d34786892b0b4c9bd8d799\u0022\u003EPhil Twyford\u003C/span\u003E: Does he have the same attitude to the plight of first-home buyers shut out of the Kiwi dream by high loan-to-value restrictions as that of the Prime Minister, who told them in the New Zealand Herald today: \u201C\u00A0\u2018yeah, okay, well fine\u2019. That\u2019s the way it goes.\u201D?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000172\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022b31c03ee6ae64f49a0b4d1e77774357f\u0022\u003EHon Dr NICK SMITH\u003C/span\u003E: The Prime Minister has been absolutely committed to first-home buyers. That is why this Government, as I have just said, trebled the number of Welcome Home Loans and doubled the number of people who will be eligible for the KiwiSaver first-home deposit subsidy, and it is why the Prime Minister is such a strong supporter of this Government\u2019s very ambitious agenda to get house prices under control after a period of Government under Labour, where those house prices more than doubled.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000173\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u0022b9f08aedb1c54942bbe903299564b0c2\u0022\u003EBeneficiaries\u2014Statistics\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022cbb83aab-9566-44c4-9029-8bda4aaca7f2\u0022 data-id=\u0022505229236ec84390953445c6d355c3c9\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000174\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cbb83aab-9566-44c4-9029-8bda4aaca7f2\u0022\u003E8. \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022505229236ec84390953445c6d355c3c9\u0022\u003EHon PHIL HEATLEY (National\u2014Whangarei)\u003C/span\u003E to the Minister for Social Development: What reports has she received about the number of people receiving benefits?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002263776108-58dc-4cab-baf1-95282c61d0de\u0022 data-id=\u0022fe487ef2e4964b97922c2b12f752ee69\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000175\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002263776108-58dc-4cab-baf1-95282c61d0de\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022fe487ef2e4964b97922c2b12f752ee69\u0022\u003EHon PAULA BENNETT (Minister for Social Development):\u003C/span\u003E I have received a report that shows that at the quarter ending in September, the number of people on a working-age benefit has reduced by 16,500 people over the last year. To put this in context, at the height of the global financial crisis in January 2010, there were more than 347,000 people on a benefit. There are now just over 304,000.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000176\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cbb83aab-9566-44c4-9029-8bda4aaca7f2\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00227bd015eec09e4c3585892a366f8e8a5b\u0022\u003EHon Phil Heatley\u003C/span\u003E: What does the report to the Minister show about long-term welfare dependence, though?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000177\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002263776108-58dc-4cab-baf1-95282c61d0de\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a07e8ffeee824dff8e81ab677ee281ac\u0022\u003EHon PAULA BENNETT\u003C/span\u003E: The investment approach is beginning to tackle the issue of long-term dependence on welfare and it is also one of our Better Public Services targets. The report shows that 87 percent of the people who came off the benefit in the year ended September 2013 had been on a benefit for longer than a year. This is crucial because, of course, the longer you are on a benefit, the more you are likely to become dependent in the long term.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000178\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cbb83aab-9566-44c4-9029-8bda4aaca7f2\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002278b99bfdedde494e9974ff3cc408040c\u0022\u003EHon Phil Heatley\u003C/span\u003E: How is Work and Income better assisting those at risk of long-term welfare dependence?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000179\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002263776108-58dc-4cab-baf1-95282c61d0de\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00228ce2deca42cb4b4d8cdcc32950e0554c\u0022\u003EHon PAULA BENNETT\u003C/span\u003E: We have more staff, who are able to help more people. To give you an example, before the introduction of these welfare reforms they saw an average of about 2,000 people per week. They are now working with more like 15,000 people per week. That means we can get the support in earlier, look at beneficiaries\u2019 barriers to work, and, of course, see outstanding results for New Zealanders.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000180\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u002273694a1ecc224e2fb1f5e19166b5503c\u0022\u003EIndustry Training\u2014Under-representation of Women\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00223facbb72-b3b0-464b-b24d-e6de0616f323\u0022 data-id=\u002235cd02a07f3943c6bd6c2fbf26329782\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000181\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223facbb72-b3b0-464b-b24d-e6de0616f323\u0022\u003E9. \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002235cd02a07f3943c6bd6c2fbf26329782\u0022\u003ECAROL BEAUMONT (Labour)\u003C/span\u003E to the Minister for Tertiary Education, Skills and Employment: How does women\u2019s participation rate of 1 percent in building and construction industry training assist with the Christchurch rebuild?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00224a244152-977c-48d2-bf53-4f3a369a27a9\u0022 data-id=\u002242581f036ab74ac18a9d01047ab27417\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000182\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00224a244152-977c-48d2-bf53-4f3a369a27a9\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002242581f036ab74ac18a9d01047ab27417\u0022\u003EHon STEVEN JOYCE (Minister for Tertiary Education, Skills and Employment):\u003C/span\u003E I think all participation is helpful in the rebuild. It would, of course, be good to see more women involved in building and construction in Canterbury. There is, of course, no practical limit on the number of female building and construction trades apprenticeships. There are places available right now and I would welcome more women to consider taking up those career opportunities. It is worth noting that the proportion of female industry trainees has been trending upwards over the last 7 years. It was 31 percent in 2012. The proportion of female trainees in the five key building, construction, and infrastructure industry training organisations is also trending upwards around the country, including in Canterbury, although it has to be said that this is off a low base. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000183\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223facbb72-b3b0-464b-b24d-e6de0616f323\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022ad9cced99ac64ebda286e610d0c18c6e\u0022\u003ECarol Beaumont\u003C/span\u003E: How does a woman\u2019s participation rate of 4 percent in the boatbuilding industry, 5 percent in the infrastructure industry, or 7 percent in the electrical supply industry help with the Better Public Services goal of increasing the number of people with advanced trades qualifications?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000184\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00224a244152-977c-48d2-bf53-4f3a369a27a9\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022085cc4e0f9954d439aeebf79e1313ba1\u0022\u003EHon STEVEN JOYCE\u003C/span\u003E: It is true that in some areas women have less participation in training; in other areas the rates are higher\u2014for example, in the area of universities and tertiary education generally more women are involved than men. You cannot say that that is necessarily a bad thing, but there are initiatives that we can take. It is good that the member raises the Electricity Supply Industry Training Organisation. The organisation has got more initiatives. One is called Ultimit and encourages women to apply for trade and technical roles in their sector. There are things like the Top Female Trade Student Award at Christchurch Polytechnic Institute of Technology, which was announced today too. That is also designed to raise the profile of women in trades. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000185\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223facbb72-b3b0-464b-b24d-e6de0616f323\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022ded8fc0191624ac7b581852e14201ba4\u0022\u003ECarol Beaumont\u003C/span\u003E: What initiatives has he put in place to lift the participation rate of women in industry training, which has decreased from 30 percent in 2010 to 28 percent in 2013, noting that he conveniently talked only about 2012?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000186\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00224a244152-977c-48d2-bf53-4f3a369a27a9\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022d84b8fbfb3b64fceb28580e58c140aac\u0022\u003EHon STEVEN JOYCE\u003C/span\u003E: My records here are 31 percent in 2012. But the member makes a very interesting point. I do think it is fair that we consider more policy options, because as well as trying to lift the participation of women, we could perhaps restrict the participation of men until the participation of women gets to the same level. I think that is what is colloquially known as a man ban. I think that could be a way in which we could achieve\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000187\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e4b09a29-dfd3-42c0-8585-11463bd6077b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002299c251a92041437c9af4799c0a89efa2\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Order! [Interruption] Order! That answer is not going to help you. [Interruption] Order! Is there a supplementary question?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000188\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223facbb72-b3b0-464b-b24d-e6de0616f323\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022fc2c391c8c98482f95680f38ad0a84f4\u0022\u003ECarol Beaumont\u003C/span\u003E: Getting back to the matter in hand\u2014[Interruption]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000189\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e4b09a29-dfd3-42c0-8585-11463bd6077b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022d534f4cd1dd44d4183d2b010a2e75665\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Order!\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000190\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223facbb72-b3b0-464b-b24d-e6de0616f323\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022c14c98eae6364f68b96f92547991b21e\u0022\u003ECarol Beaumont\u003C/span\u003E: How successful does he believe the initiatives he has worked on with the Ministry of Women\u2019s Affairs, like the research project showing there is a pool of women available to assist in the Canterbury rebuild or the research following nine women\u2014that is right, nine women\u2014in the electrical supply industry, have been in lifting women\u2019s participation?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000191\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00224a244152-977c-48d2-bf53-4f3a369a27a9\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00222873bcf7f02b494f8242f8225936f554\u0022\u003EHon STEVEN JOYCE\u003C/span\u003E: Well, they have had some success, but I stand by my view that there are perhaps more policy options that we could consider. But I think it is important that if we did consider those policy options, they were of a bipartisan nature, because some of those are quite challenging. So, for example, if we decided to introduce, let us say, a man ban\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000192\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e4b09a29-dfd3-42c0-8585-11463bd6077b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00220ba28219e3de4dfb8187b97dc40380ed\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Order!\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000193\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022fd69efb26c4444aca726293592faf07f\u0022\u003EGrant Robertson\u003C/span\u003E: I raise a point of order, Mr Speaker. The Minister is diverting from the answer. He was asked about\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000194\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00224a244152-977c-48d2-bf53-4f3a369a27a9\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002235d3891202b7472c98b6da6ad7f2ba49\u0022\u003EHon STEVEN JOYCE\u003C/span\u003E: No, I am not. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000195\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022ca5b5ca042b44188ae08b029214d0223\u0022\u003EGrant Robertson\u003C/span\u003E: No, he is. He is diverting from the answer. He is not addressing the question. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000196\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e4b09a29-dfd3-42c0-8585-11463bd6077b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00225ce72049fd8941cdacc3cb2c71f4cd50\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Order! I do not need any assistance. No, the Minister was not diverting from the answer until the very moment the member rose to his feet, so he has got supernatural powers to know that the words \u201Cman ban\u201D were about to be used. At that stage I said to the Minister the answer was concluded. We are in agreement, but on this occasion the member was almost too quick on his feet.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000197\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00224a244152-977c-48d2-bf53-4f3a369a27a9\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022f0b91b4457c84165be8273a1549d5002\u0022\u003EHon STEVEN JOYCE\u003C/span\u003E: I raise a point of order, Mr Speaker. I do think it is entirely fair. If you are dealing with gender equality issues, one option is such a thing as a man ban. Many organisations have considered that. It is quite a genuine policy option. I was debating it in this House as an answer to a question. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000198\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e4b09a29-dfd3-42c0-8585-11463bd6077b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00225b1d731ac6604bceace610017019c30e\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: The member has a right to raise a point of order. I will determine whether it is a point of order, and on that matter I do not need assistance from this side of the House. The question was about how successful the Minister\u2019s initiatives have been, and the Minister answered that by saying that there has been some success.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000199\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223facbb72-b3b0-464b-b24d-e6de0616f323\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022b429ddf004c1470d9ae3eb827947b2a8\u0022\u003ECarol Beaumont\u003C/span\u003E: I raise a point of order, Mr Speaker. The Minister did not answer the\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000200\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e4b09a29-dfd3-42c0-8585-11463bd6077b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022b4fad10789264eb595f6950b19d20e03\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Order! I have\u2014[Interruption] Order! I have only just finished ruling that the Minister did address the question that the member asked. I invite the member, later on today, to have a look at her question and the answer. It was without doubt addressed by the Minister.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000201\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022ae7cb7c61e724094bbbdd032f6381366\u0022\u003EGrant Robertson\u003C/span\u003E: I raise a point of order, Mr Speaker. I am not contesting the last ruling that you have made, but I do note the difference in your response to Carol Beaumont challenging your ruling and Steven Joyce, who was allowed to speak for some time before you stood up. That is an issue for us on this side of the House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000202\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e4b09a29-dfd3-42c0-8585-11463bd6077b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022d51a5e25dfbd4ee1a3a6a67bf5f83e74\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: I appreciate that point but when I have just finished ruling that the question was addressed and I used that in an answer to addressing the point of order raised by the Hon Steven Joyce, it is absolutely fruitless and pointless for the member to stand and then say that the question had not been addressed when I had just returned to my seat having said it was.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000203\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f44431ef-b505-4e94-9f57-a60b0a569bf7\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022edf128d4ba0b4f009357c03b69232429\u0022\u003EHon Shane Jones\u003C/span\u003E: I raise a point of order, Mr Speaker. I think the point we are seeking to make without creating any further trouble is that when you shout, it brings disorder to the House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000204\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e4b09a29-dfd3-42c0-8585-11463bd6077b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022eb0253dce78643d38d20801312814314\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: I thank the member for his incisive point of order. When the member continues to shout, as he has done throughout question time, that also assists in bringing disorder to the House. Both the Hon Shane Jones and I need to be more careful in not raising our voices.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000205\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u00222d06be3d40f941b88791b6ba0f844795\u0022\u003ETeachers\u2014Awards, Development, and Council\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00228cf0fb6b-0b8f-4327-983d-73e1166c220e\u0022 data-id=\u0022819167a397c542e2ba14770741b864bf\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000206\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00228cf0fb6b-0b8f-4327-983d-73e1166c220e\u0022\u003E10. \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022819167a397c542e2ba14770741b864bf\u0022\u003EDr CAM CALDER (National)\u003C/span\u003E to the Minister of Education: What recent announcements has she made to strengthen the status of the teaching profession?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00226e1ead03-bf7f-496a-a02f-ce52859c58c1\u0022 data-id=\u0022cd82f1526b764b63b3088289e38b44cb\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000207\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226e1ead03-bf7f-496a-a02f-ce52859c58c1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022cd82f1526b764b63b3088289e38b44cb\u0022\u003EHon HEKIA PARATA (Minister of Education):\u003C/span\u003E T\u0113n\u0101 koe, Mr Speaker. Today I was delighted to launch the inaugural Prime Minister\u2019s Education Excellence Awards, which aim to recognise, value, and celebrate the teaching profession. The awards will recognise and celebrate groups of New Zealand educators and parents partnering for a better education for our children and young people. The four categories are teaching, leadership, community engagement, and governance. These awards aim to acknowledge these people and practices that are delivering a better education to our children and young people, and to help raise the bar for the profession by identifying and showcasing quality teaching.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000208\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00228cf0fb6b-0b8f-4327-983d-73e1166c220e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00223bea5ca779604efbad6e87a0cac18a34\u0022\u003EDr Cam Calder\u003C/span\u003E: What other announcements did she make to highlight best practice among educators?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000209\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226e1ead03-bf7f-496a-a02f-ce52859c58c1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00226d96bd07cf7849fa9ba12245b8ad3f95\u0022\u003EHon HEKIA PARATA\u003C/span\u003E: Today I also announced a series of education festivals to be held next year in March, which will complement the International Summit on the Teaching Profession in New Zealand. The education festivals will be held in Auckland, Wellington, and Christchurch around the time of the summit, and will share best practice amongst educators and will bring the best in the education system to the wider community. Holding the international summit, holding the festivals, introducing the excellence awards, and establishing the new professional body, the Education Council of Aotearoa New Zealand, EDUCANZ\u2014not \u201CEdu-can\u2019t\u201D\u2014are all part of acknowledging the importance of the teaching profession, working with the profession to raise its status, and recognising the critical contribution that the highest levels of achievement by our children and young people make to the future prosperity of this country.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000210\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022c5ee83081eac454fb72207e3b190a07f\u0022\u003EChris Hipkins\u003C/span\u003E: Why does she believe that the new education council she announced last week will be able to act as a professional voice for the teaching profession, given that its members are being appointed exclusively by the Minister rather than selected by those whom the council ultimately seeks to govern?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000211\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226e1ead03-bf7f-496a-a02f-ce52859c58c1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022114cd8e2c90b43f09fa7fddbfcb616f9\u0022\u003EHon HEKIA PARATA\u003C/span\u003E: It is worth noting that the Minister already appoints the majority of the New Zealand Teachers Council. Why do I think it? Because the proposal is to make the new education council statutorily independent, unlike the current status of the New Zealand Teachers Council. Secondly, the proposed nine members will have publicly advertised the critical skills and competencies that will be required in the final selection. Thirdly, there will be an opportunity for anyone, including the members opposite, to make nominations. It is expected that a majority of those nine will be from the profession and it will be seasoned by other experience that is also in the interest of the public, and, of course, education is high on that list.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000212\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00229957c95b07f4425fa3cf23df0dbd06cc\u0022\u003EChris Hipkins\u003C/span\u003E: Why does she believe that the teaching profession will have any confidence in the independence of the new education council given her statement: \u201CThe Government\u2019s key lever to manage its interest in the teaching profession will be through the Minister\u2019s power to appoint the members of the governing board.\u201D, and is that the reason why she has already selected a National Party office holder to be one of the first members of the board?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000213\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226e1ead03-bf7f-496a-a02f-ce52859c58c1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022dd90107ecd52422989c08186b887368c\u0022\u003EHon HEKIA PARATA\u003C/span\u003E: It is not a matter of my belief; it is a fact of the constitutional democracy of New Zealand that statutory independence means independence. It is also my view that given that we have advanced significantly in terms of what the proposed new council is expected to do, it will indeed strengthen the profession in order to enable it to meet the 21st century education challenges. Moreover, it has taken 3 years of conversation. Thank you.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000214\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002243684a4d-fb40-469a-8e63-cdd1e354b387\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002202758289248d47d497f9e3a293fc633a\u0022\u003EBrendan Horan\u003C/span\u003E: Is the Minister concerned that teachers were formerly respected and valued members of the community, yet over the passage of time, and certainly under her tenure, teachers have been unpaid and feel unappreciated, and over Christmas many will be unemployed?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000215\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226e1ead03-bf7f-496a-a02f-ce52859c58c1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002280abc3581e7b4f1799ce16e4c9432e0f\u0022\u003EHon HEKIA PARATA\u003C/span\u003E: I certainly celebrate the teaching profession and the contribution that teachers make to New Zealand and have made over many generations, including my own parents. The announcements that I have made today seek to strengthen that status and the value that the profession is held in by all New Zealanders.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000216\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u0022962d74fdb8cc4bc98e502f0c02934388\u0022\u003EDrinking-water Supplies, Canterbury\u2014Nitrate Levels in Groundwater\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022e122e0e6-61c6-4d17-9a79-6ad2ac7d127e\u0022 data-id=\u0022f8e1d7ae214d4740a3121f0c6e68e878\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000217\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e122e0e6-61c6-4d17-9a79-6ad2ac7d127e\u0022\u003E11. \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022f8e1d7ae214d4740a3121f0c6e68e878\u0022\u003EEUGENIE SAGE (Green)\u003C/span\u003E to the Associate Minister of Health: Does she agree with the Canterbury Medical Officer of Health that increasing nitrate levels in Canterbury groundwater are a health risk, particularly for pregnant women and babies; if not, why not?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002260200136-9d63-4a82-b4f5-c00411adb1fd\u0022 data-id=\u00223be20e63116f4ab5b3346951dddfd879\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000218\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002260200136-9d63-4a82-b4f5-c00411adb1fd\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00223be20e63116f4ab5b3346951dddfd879\u0022\u003EHon JO GOODHEW (Associate Minister of Health):\u003C/span\u003E I thank the member for the opportunity to talk about the actual magnitude of health risk currently faced in Canterbury due to nitrate levels in water. Firstly, there are no community drinking-water supplies in Canterbury that have unsafe levels of nitrate. Secondly, in Canterbury the concerns are for people on their own individual household bores, and the community and public health advisory committee is encouraging people to test their supplies for nitrate, as there may be some that are of some risk to some people. The medical officer of health and his colleagues are working with lead maternity carers to make sure that pregnant women and families with babies know to have their water checked if they are on individual bore water.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000219\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e122e0e6-61c6-4d17-9a79-6ad2ac7d127e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022b62d522d302c429a9fb79534628f4837\u0022\u003EEugenie Sage\u003C/span\u003E: Although the Associate Minister says that there are no community water supplies that are unsafe, is she concerned that there are at least eight community drinking-water supplies in Canterbury that now have to be monitored because their nitrate levels are more than half the maximum acceptable value as determined by the World Health Organization, compared with only two community water supplies that were in that position in 2010-11?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000220\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002260200136-9d63-4a82-b4f5-c00411adb1fd\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022eeb0602ed9414eec8785d2f7c368b1ec\u0022\u003EHon JO GOODHEW\u003C/span\u003E: I think the point the member makes is that these particular supplies are being monitored, and I would agree that that is, in fact, where we should be. These particular supplies are at 25 milligrams, or a little more, per litre. That is the level of nitrate in the drinking water that triggers the monthly monitoring. It is, in fact, the essence of the issue\u2014that we are monitoring them. None of these particular water supplies is above the maximum allowable value, and that is the point to make.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000221\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e122e0e6-61c6-4d17-9a79-6ad2ac7d127e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022c972794370eb46dca846946a9fbfd5de\u0022\u003EEugenie Sage\u003C/span\u003E: Does the Associate Minister think it is acceptable that Canterbury midwives have to advise expectant mothers to test their drinking water because her Government has failed to stop the pollution of our groundwater through agricultural intensification?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000222\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002260200136-9d63-4a82-b4f5-c00411adb1fd\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00229ba8686116a74dbc97592a46fea35daf\u0022\u003EHon JO GOODHEW\u003C/span\u003E: I absolutely reject the assertion of the member. It is under this very Government that, in fact, we are working to clean up fresh water. The announcement of the Minister for the Environment today certainly underlines that at long last Governments are grasping difficult issues. In the meantime I think it is entirely responsible that midwives are giving correct and timely advice to women who are pregnant, so that the women can make sure they understand any risk that occurs for them.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000223\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e122e0e6-61c6-4d17-9a79-6ad2ac7d127e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00226b957f4d0b6647c08cea9eeb3bd67ca4\u0022\u003EEugenie Sage\u003C/span\u003E: How many more wells and community drinking-water supplies will need to have elevated nitrate levels before her Government reconsiders its promotion of large-scale irrigation and intensification of agriculture, which causes nitrate leaching and pollutes our drinking water?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000224\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002260200136-9d63-4a82-b4f5-c00411adb1fd\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022366e64f46c0a47bea9ec55b2b736ca0a\u0022\u003EHon JO GOODHEW\u003C/span\u003E: It is absolutely important that as a public health measure we continue to monitor nitrates and other things that are in our drinking water. That is the action this Government is taking. The member is perhaps being a little creative to suggest that only agriculture is causing the nitrate levels.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000225\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u0022c06039a90c134a548ce78411d38c859f\u0022\u003EInequality, Economic and Social\u2014Measures to Address\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00227883c85e-a5bb-4a12-9962-80df55af0ecd\u0022 data-id=\u00227769579ad348405fa9052ae296c6afbb\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000226\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227883c85e-a5bb-4a12-9962-80df55af0ecd\u0022\u003E12. \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00227769579ad348405fa9052ae296c6afbb\u0022\u003EHONE HARAWIRA (Leader\u2014Mana)\u003C/span\u003E to the Minister of Finance: What is his budget plan, if any, to immediately address growing poverty in New Zealand, which has got so bad that charitable organisations have today said they are expecting an influx of more than 40,000 struggling families for Christmas dinner because they can\u2019t afford to put food on the table?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00224a244152-977c-48d2-bf53-4f3a369a27a9\u0022 data-id=\u00226c08b93006084bf6a8715939a5bcee8d\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000227\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00224a244152-977c-48d2-bf53-4f3a369a27a9\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00226c08b93006084bf6a8715939a5bcee8d\u0022\u003EHon STEVEN JOYCE (Associate Minister of Finance)\u003C/span\u003E on behalf of the Minister of Finance: The Government has a very strong track record in protecting the most vulnerable New Zealanders. It is worth noting that the inequality gap, as measured by the annual Ministry of Social Development household incomes report, has narrowed in recent years after peaking around 2004. This year\u2019s Budget included more than $900 million to help vulnerable families, through a significant investment in a range of programmes: $189 million to assist people from welfare into work; $377 million to build 3,000 new State house bedrooms and 500 new two-bedroom homes; $100 million over 3 years for the Warm Up New Zealand programme; the KickStart breakfast, which was expanded to five mornings a week in decile 1 to 4 schools; $21 million over 4 years for rheumatic fever prevention; $15.7 million for the Children\u2019s Action Plan; $172 million in new investment in early childhood education; and $7 million to increase the coverage of B4 School Checks on health and development. Nobody is saying it is easy for those who are in vulnerable positions, but the Government is doing its bit by investing in services to support those who need them.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000228\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e4b09a29-dfd3-42c0-8585-11463bd6077b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002201075dca67c84ae0927c038b7135b1bb\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Before I call the member for his supplementary question, can I ask the interchange between my right-hand side and my left-hand side to cease.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000229\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227883c85e-a5bb-4a12-9962-80df55af0ecd\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022ca9edd69865241d5a66c7d119c463c6c\u0022\u003EHone Harawira\u003C/span\u003E: Will the Government use any surplus funds to reduce the crippling unemployment figure of 150,000, plus the 4,000 people who lost their jobs last month, by initiating a comprehensive Government job creation programme to put Kiwis back to work in their communities until such time as the private sector has picked up the slack, or is it the Government\u2019s intention to use such surpluses to simply continue to subsidise the likes of Rio Tinto, banks, finance companies, Skycity Casino, Warner Bros, and wealthy property developers?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000230\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00224a244152-977c-48d2-bf53-4f3a369a27a9\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00223f36f5a1bde9452ab1622235f889164e\u0022\u003EHon STEVEN JOYCE\u003C/span\u003E: Actually, the unemployment rate\u2014the member may not have noticed\u2014dropped again yesterday, and employment is growing.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000231\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f44431ef-b505-4e94-9f57-a60b0a569bf7\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00223d6f4e966c0f4c788027427ebc35d59b\u0022\u003EHon Shane Jones\u003C/span\u003E: Not in Kait\u0101ia.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000232\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00224a244152-977c-48d2-bf53-4f3a369a27a9\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022e3ea48f9226542f3ab2e6416f018a856\u0022\u003EHon STEVEN JOYCE\u003C/span\u003E: The other member raises a point about Northland that I think is very important. Both of those members could be of assistance to the Government as we seek to increase job opportunities in Northland. For example, they could support the exploration of minerals in Northland, which I know that Mr Harawira does not support. They could support and encourage the resolution of Treaty settlements to make assets available for iwi in Northland. That has been very successful in creating economic activity and job growth elsewhere. They could also perhaps assist with the primary sector productivity work being undertaken by my colleague the Hon Nathan Guy. They could also support the P\u016Bhoi to Wellsford road, which would provide a huge amount of access to that Northland area from the biggest city in New Zealand to its south. All of those things would support employment and job creation opportunities in Northland.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000233\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f44431ef-b505-4e94-9f57-a60b0a569bf7\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022360c2184d1ae460298d776e1875d4017\u0022\u003EHon Shane Jones\u003C/span\u003E: I raise a point of order, Mr Speaker. I realise we are at the end of question time\u2014going on for 3.30 p.m.\u2014but can you please ponder as to why it has been necessary to castigate this side of the House in terms of the length of questions, and yet you have let the Minister get away and take responsibility for my views on mining, which are already well-known.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000234\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e4b09a29-dfd3-42c0-8585-11463bd6077b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002219b3565c3693496f9807a6058c45c0e1\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: I can certainly ponder the point that the member is making. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000235\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227883c85e-a5bb-4a12-9962-80df55af0ecd\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002297da406a2b614ebf87d56d1fef934eb6\u0022\u003EHone Harawira\u003C/span\u003E: Will the Government use surplus funds to support a living wage for the nearly 50 percent of Kiwis earning less than $25,000 a year, or to feed the 270,000 children still registered as living below the poverty line, or is it the Government\u2019s intention to simply throw another $40 million after the $80 million already squandered on a yacht race for the greedy and the gluttonous?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000236\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e4b09a29-dfd3-42c0-8585-11463bd6077b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022554711ae20314efe9ff2b8631716085b\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: The Hon Steven Joyce, in so far as he has ministerial responsibility.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000237\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00224a244152-977c-48d2-bf53-4f3a369a27a9\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022bb2f6c0cb5954f7b87438f014a10169d\u0022\u003EHon STEVEN JOYCE\u003C/span\u003E: With the greatest respect to the member, if he actually made more effort in assisting with job creation in Northland, then we would actually have a lot better outcomes rather than just sitting here bagging people who are interested in job creation for New Zealanders, including all the companies that he has mentioned so far. In relation to the living wage, I would draw his attention to the Treasury report that points out that the living wage would have very little impact on inequality or poverty measures, and that most people affected are actually those who are single adults or couples with no children, and not the families earning below a so-called living wage of $18.40 an hour.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n    \u003C/div\u003E\n    \u003Cdiv class=\u0022HpsHansard\u0022\u003E\n      \u003Cp\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsProceedingHeading\u0022\u003EBills\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000238\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u0022913a32bd1faf42dfbf58b9633822ba3f\u0022\u003ENew Zealand International Convention Centre Bill\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000239\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u002278e776deacd24924b27ef7ec32257fa6\u0022\u003EIn Committee\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000240\u0022\u003EDebate resumed from 6 November.\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000241\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u0022110ab8e827c84bad91d3b821efc85c96\u0022\u003ESchedule 1\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002270fa4cbd-9380-4916-9f2a-78da059d220e\u0022 data-id=\u0022e6fdb06ef2d34d13ab823c980169eb02\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000242\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002270fa4cbd-9380-4916-9f2a-78da059d220e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022e6fdb06ef2d34d13ab823c980169eb02\u0022\u003EThe CHAIRPERSON (H V Ross Robertson)\u003C/span\u003E: Good afternoon, honourable members. The House is in Committee. Kia ora t\u0101tou, n\u014D reira e te Whare, e ng\u0101 iwi, e ng\u0101 reo, e ng\u0101 hau e wh\u0101. T\u0113n\u0101 koutou, t\u0113n\u0101 koutou, t\u0113n\u0101 koutou katoa.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000243\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f44431ef-b505-4e94-9f57-a60b0a569bf7\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002277101cd23aa64314b99ae838a1b6090d\u0022\u003EHon Shane Jones\u003C/span\u003E: Kia ora.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000244\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002270fa4cbd-9380-4916-9f2a-78da059d220e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00228617b2fa67454c0cb0f1489a698b24c4\u0022\u003EThe CHAIRPERSON (H V Ross Robertson)\u003C/span\u003E: Kei te pai. Honourable members, the House is in Committee for further consideration of the New Zealand International Convention Centre Bill. When we were last considering the bill in Committee last evening, we had reached a vote on schedule 1.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000245\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022d3de339a586743f08f79d461f7bce105\u0022\u003EHon Member\u003C/span\u003E: No.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000246\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002270fa4cbd-9380-4916-9f2a-78da059d220e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a2d9324135654496a1a190247c4c0206\u0022\u003EThe CHAIRPERSON (H V Ross Robertson)\u003C/span\u003E: This is what I have in front of me\u2014is that not correct? The question is that schedule 1 stand part. All those in favour please say Aye, to the contrary No. A party vote has been called for. [Interruption] Party vote\u2014a personal vote has been called for? Can I just advise that this one here is just a procedural matter. It is not a substantive vote.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022fc8ab326-1806-41d3-8c41-cd58c95dcb45\u0022 data-id=\u00225fa50493778e4649aa0ca7630a5ea45c\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000247\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022fc8ab326-1806-41d3-8c41-cd58c95dcb45\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00225fa50493778e4649aa0ca7630a5ea45c\u0022\u003EMETIRIA TUREI (Co-Leader\u2014Green):\u003C/span\u003E I raise a point of order, Mr Chairperson. I just want to seek clarification on what the procedural motion is that we are voting on. Is it for the debate to occur\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000248\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002270fa4cbd-9380-4916-9f2a-78da059d220e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022cfee64e28f1e4695a309b9d1bc6c77f1\u0022\u003EThe CHAIRPERSON (H V Ross Robertson)\u003C/span\u003E: No.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000249\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022fc8ab326-1806-41d3-8c41-cd58c95dcb45\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022ba5af8db920a42358e8fd7d2b50a9fd7\u0022\u003EMETIRIA TUREI\u003C/span\u003E: \u2014or is it for the vote to be held on schedule 1? The reason why I ask this is that these schedules\u2014schedule 1, for example\u2014set out the text for the regulatory concessions, which have a direct connection to gambling because they are the concessions that remove Skycity from the Gambling Act. So I am not sure whether we will have another opportunity to vote on schedule 1 and the content of schedule 1. I guess that is what I am asking.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002270fa4cbd-9380-4916-9f2a-78da059d220e\u0022 data-id=\u002217695d89296d4f72b439db97570cdc25\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000250\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002270fa4cbd-9380-4916-9f2a-78da059d220e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002217695d89296d4f72b439db97570cdc25\u0022\u003EThe CHAIRPERSON (H V Ross Robertson)\u003C/span\u003E: If I might inform the Committee that during the course of debates, the schedules are part of those debates. I would just like to put this into the record for the Committee. The schedules to the New Zealand International Convention Centre Bill provide extracts from the agreement between Skycity and the Crown that is implemented by this bill. The extracts contain the specific requirements that have already been agreed upon by the parties. These requirements are given statutory force of law by clauses 6 and 7 of the bill in the context of existing gambling law. Personal votes were held last night on amendments relating to clauses 6 and 7 and to Part 2 standing part. The conscience issues have, therefore, already been addressed. The schedules do not create legal rights or obligations in their own right. The votes on the schedules simply confirm the extracts of the contracts standing part for the purposes of clauses 6 and 7. Therefore, the schedules do not by themselves directly and significantly affect the ability to gamble.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022fc8ab326-1806-41d3-8c41-cd58c95dcb45\u0022 data-id=\u002234dd6ca7e82e4533a1d5e0c9c568abed\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000251\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022fc8ab326-1806-41d3-8c41-cd58c95dcb45\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002234dd6ca7e82e4533a1d5e0c9c568abed\u0022\u003EMETIRIA TUREI (Co-Leader\u2014Green):\u003C/span\u003E I raise a point of order, Mr Chairperson. I would ask you to consider that given there were personal votes on clauses 6 and 7 because they did concern gambling and the Gambling Act, or at least the concessions that removed it, and, now, the schedules in relation to clauses 6 and 7 also specifically identify increased gambling opportunities that are related directly to the Gambling Act, therefore, schedule 1 and the vote on it ought to be also a personal vote, it being the specific content concerning gambling concessions, on which there has traditionally been a personal vote in the New Zealand Parliament.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002270fa4cbd-9380-4916-9f2a-78da059d220e\u0022 data-id=\u0022100e4f83b4cc44a78e0c748e9d318e2d\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000252\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002270fa4cbd-9380-4916-9f2a-78da059d220e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022100e4f83b4cc44a78e0c748e9d318e2d\u0022\u003EThe CHAIRPERSON (H V Ross Robertson)\u003C/span\u003E: Well, I am advised that the votes on the parts already include the schedules, and, therefore, we are dealing purely with a procedural motion. So the question is that schedule 1 stand part.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca id=\u00224cc952b69b254da2aa3594912f1be942\u0022 name=\u0022division\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EA party vote was called for on the question, That schedule 1 be agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EAyes 61\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand National 59; ACT New Zealand 1; United Future 1.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENoes 59\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand Labour 33; Green Party 14; New Zealand First 7; M\u0101ori Party 3; Mana 1; Independent: Horan.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ESchedule 1 agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000253\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u0022adf13701aced49a1a3565455ef45e1f8\u0022\u003ESchedule 2\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca id=\u00229588c71807c141b39082185a90a62d1f\u0022 name=\u0022division\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EA party vote was called for on the question, That schedule 2 be agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EAyes 61\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand National 59; ACT New Zealand 1; United Future 1.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENoes 59\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand Labour 33; Green Party 14; New Zealand First 7; M\u0101ori Party 3; Mana 1; Independent: Horan.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ESchedule 2 agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000254\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u00226a2c63729ee94976ab31251657ab25af\u0022\u003ESchedule 3\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca id=\u0022c1256489cbf2431d885039936aea9dd3\u0022 name=\u0022division\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EA party vote was called for on the question, That schedule 3 be agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EAyes 61\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand National 59; ACT New Zealand 1; United Future 1.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENoes 59\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand Labour 33; Green Party 14; New Zealand First 7; M\u0101ori Party 3; Mana 1; Independent: Horan.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ESchedule 3 agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000255\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u00220079dd9e33b14381bc3d72599901c180\u0022\u003EClauses 1 and 2\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022 data-id=\u0022c762cef4c5cd4d018ec4a99d4322dcd3\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000256\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022c762cef4c5cd4d018ec4a99d4322dcd3\u0022\u003EGRANT ROBERTSON (Labour\u2014Wellington Central):\u003C/span\u003E This bill is the innocuously named the New Zealand International Convention Centre Bill. It sounds like a lovely idea, except it is not the right title. The correct title here is the \u201CSkycity Crony Capitalism (Looking After Their Mates by the National Party) Bill\u201D, because that is what this bill should be called. We have just been voting through the schedules\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000257\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c699e7c6-53b9-470c-a14a-378cb6fc8a04\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022f2af07ccdf784cfabae31691b98d6d86\u0022\u003EHon Phil Goff\u003C/span\u003E: That\u2019s a long title.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000258\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022f78f8653c4c44838b3916ada964cde15\u0022\u003EGRANT ROBERTSON\u003C/span\u003E: That is a long title. Long titles also were got rid of 20 years ago, Mr Goff. But if we were actually to look at the schedules that we have just been voting on, we would see that they contain the guts of what is in this agreement. It is important, in what I suspect will be one of my final contributions on this bill, to actually remind members of the public what it is that is being given away here. What is being given away here is a massive extension out to 2048 to the licence for Skycity. Within that period the two reviews required under the Gambling Act are dispensed with. Secondly, we have an additional 230 single terminal gaming machines. We have an additional 240 automated gaming table terminals. We have an additional 12 further gaming tables. We have the introduction of cashless gaming machines. We have the ticket-in, ticket-out provisions, which have been put up by the officials as having the possibility of allowing for money-laundering. Those are the concessions. Those are the things that in this bill mean that the title is inappropriate because they directly contradict the Gambling Act. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000259\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003EThey are the things that make this bill not about an international convention centre, but about crony capitalism\u2014about one firm, one company in New Zealand, being treated differently from the rest of the companies in New Zealand. That started on the very first day. That started when the Prime Minister wrote on top of the officials\u2019 briefing note \u201CCover off the Skycity angle.\u201D At that moment the crony capitalism button was pushed and the Government\u2019s officials went off into a separate line of negotiations with Skycity. Skycity then got more information about the process than other bidders did. It was invited to put in proposals that other bidders were not invited to put in place. At that point the process was rorted, the process was wrong, and that was at the direction of John Key, the Prime Minister\u2014the crony capitalist in chief, John Key\u2014who came across the top of a process to build an international convention centre in Auckland, and did a deal. He did a dodgy deal. He is up to his neck in it, and that should be reflected in the title of this bill. So that is the first step at which things went wrong. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000260\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003EThen the legislation to do this was introduced in the House, and I spoke about it last night. In clause 6(2) of this bill we have the sight of the National Government deciding to override the laws of this land via its dodgy, backroom deal. The Gambling Act and associated gambling legislation is ridden roughshod over by this law. This is no ordinary piece of law coming to this House; it is a law that justifies the Government\u2019s dodgy backroom deals. It rides roughshod over other legislation, and it puts in place concessions that go against the Gambling Act. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000261\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003EThere is no doubt whatsoever that gambling harm will be increased by this legislation. The Government has actually acknowledged that, by not amending the Gambling Act where its purpose is to reduce gambling harm. It cannot do that, because this bill increases gambling harm. Up to 5,000 extra problem gamblers will be created as a result of this, with all the flow-on effects through our communities, through families and through people who face the horrible addiction that is class 4 gambling, in particular, on the pokie machines. This is a bill that has the potential to increase money-laundering through Skycity. It introduces types of gambling that across the world have seen increases in problem gambling. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000262\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003EThis bill should not be before this House. This bill goes against the principles that New Zealanders believe in\u2014about how laws should be made and that a Government will actually look after its citizens. The Government is not here to do deals with its mates; the Government is here to protect New Zealand citizens and ensure that they can go about their daily lives, knowing that the Government is there for them. We might not agree with every single thing that the party opposite does, but what we expect is that it will bring legislation to this House that supports and protects the rights of New Zealand citizens. That is not what the Government has done here. It has brought a piece of legislation to this House that favours one company, and that goes against the values of New Zealanders. It is a shameful piece of legislation.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022fc8ab326-1806-41d3-8c41-cd58c95dcb45\u0022 data-id=\u002201d859058d6a4c5f845dd29f9e90620e\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000263\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022fc8ab326-1806-41d3-8c41-cd58c95dcb45\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002201d859058d6a4c5f845dd29f9e90620e\u0022\u003EMETIRIA TUREI (Co-Leader\u2014Green):\u003C/span\u003E T\u0113n\u0101 koe, Mr Chairperson. T\u0113n\u0101 koutou e te Whare. This legislation, the New Zealand International Convention Centre Bill, is before the House only because the Government needs to exclude Skycity from the Gambling Act. Do you remember that the Gambling Act expresses an absolute prohibition on the creation of any further casinos and on the expansion in any way of existing casinos? Skycity has, for some decades now, been fighting the Gambling Commission on its decision to refuse Skycity further licences to expand its business. What Skycity has done through this deal is find an alternative way to get round the gambling law, because the gambling law has stopped it from expanding as it would like. It is not like Skycity does not make a huge amount of money\u2014it makes huge profits, in any event. It is just greed, frankly. This legislation should not be called the New Zealand International Convention Centre Bill, at all. It is the \u201CSkycity Greed Bill\u201D. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000264\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022fc8ab326-1806-41d3-8c41-cd58c95dcb45\u0022\u003EIt is the \u201CSkycity (Third-largest Casino in the Country Delivery Device) Bill\u201D. That is what this actually is. I do not know whether people will remember in the past, around the time of the smoke-free - tobacco inquiry, that cigarettes were described as \u201Cnicotine-delivery devices\u201D. I do not know whether you remember that\u2014nicotine-delivery devices are what cigarettes are. That is why this legislation and this Skycity deal is essentially a casino-delivery device to Skycity. There would be no legislation in this Committee if there were not this deal, which funds the building of a convention centre through the gambling concessions, and if there were not the need to get round the Gambling Act. Part of the reason why this bill is structured as it is\u2014rather than amending the Gambling Act, for example\u2014is simply that the Government did not want to have the public understand clearly enough and openly that the whole point of this deal was to give Skycity a legislative way of avoiding the constraints and the public health regulations in the Gambling Act. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000265\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022fc8ab326-1806-41d3-8c41-cd58c95dcb45\u0022\u003EThere are, what, 23 pages of words in this bill, but if you took out all of those parts that are related to the Gambling Act and the concessions, you are talking about only five provisions\u2014maybe a few more; maybe seven provisions\u2014that are at all related to the convention centre itself because very little of this deal requires any legislative changes. There is a little bit around the flags\u2014the Flags, Emblems, and Name Protection Act\u2014and there is a little bit around the name of the convention centre, but essentially this entire bill is designed to give Skycity a mechanism to get round the Gambling Act. That is because Skycity has wanted for years to significantly expand its business, and now it can. Now what it has is the third-largest casino being delivered to it by John Key. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000266\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022fc8ab326-1806-41d3-8c41-cd58c95dcb45\u0022\u003EThe Green Party constructed for members of Parliament and their policy people, on the Tuesday just gone, an almost life-sized replica of the extra 230 pokie machines, 240 automated gaming terminals, and 12 gaming tables out here on the parliamentary lawns, so that when MPs came to vote this bill and exercise their consciences, they would understand exactly what they were voting for. They are not voting for a convention centre. It does not need legislation. They are voting for the reality that that cardboard casino confronted MPs with. It was huge. It took up almost the entirety of the grass out the front of Parliament. The pokie machines had messages from Aucklanders written on them saying: \u201CPlease do not pass this bill. Please do not cause my family and friends and my community any more harm.\u201D\u2014genuine pleas to members of Parliament, who have a choice on whether to deliver the third-largest casino to Skycity or not. Part of that choice will be made today in the votes that each individual MP will cast. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000267\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022fc8ab326-1806-41d3-8c41-cd58c95dcb45\u0022\u003EThe concessions that have been granted have been laid out. They are extraordinary. We are talking about nearly one extra problem gambler being created as a result of every single pokie machine that will be established, so there will be around 200 extra problem gamblers, an estimated 8,000 being individuals affected by that problem gambling, and an extra 6,500 children being affected by that problem gambling. The impact of this legislation\u2014which is gambling legislation, make no mistake\u2014is that a significant proportion of New Zealanders will be harmed. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000268\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022fc8ab326-1806-41d3-8c41-cd58c95dcb45\u0022\u003EWhat we know from all of the papers that have been released so far\u2014and, frankly, not every piece of advice has been released\u2014is that the economics of this do not stack up. So the Government\u2019s argument that somehow Skycity is entitled to the extensive, third-largest casino in the country because somewhere else down the track it will contribute to economic development in New Zealand has been proved false. The only independent report that has been done on any of the economics of this issue showed that there will be a net creation across the country of 18 jobs\u2014just 18 jobs. Although there may be lots of arguments around why a convention centre is good in Auckland, even if it is another kind of convention centre\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000269\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b4a597dd-ed8b-42b8-975b-40c6e0cdaee1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00222d679c32cc474073bdc45375f999316c\u0022\u003ELouisa Wall\u003C/span\u003E: Let the market pay for it.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000270\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022fc8ab326-1806-41d3-8c41-cd58c95dcb45\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002211e339e9355d4cb5be1a80bf21d08557\u0022\u003EMETIRIA TUREI\u003C/span\u003E: That is right. Even if a convention centre does provide limited economic development, is it, none the less, a wise thing to have for other parts of the economy, and why do we not all make a contribution to that? Why does the Government not choose an ethical means to fund the building of a convention centre in Auckland? If the Auckland Council thinks it is a good idea, it should put in some money. If the Government thinks it is a good idea, it should put in some money. If the tourism industry thinks it is a good idea, it should put in some money. There are lots of different ways of funding this thing that do not require the cost of it to be borne on the backs of problem gamblers. Maybe that is what we should call this bill\u2014this is the \u201CProblem Gamblers Pay for the New Zealand International Convention Centre Bill\u201D. Maybe that would be a more honest title for this legislation, because if it were not for the fact that Skycity is getting the concessions as a result of this deal, we would not have this legislation before us today. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000271\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022fc8ab326-1806-41d3-8c41-cd58c95dcb45\u0022\u003EMost of it could be done by an agreement by the Government in a public-private partnership, whether we like it or not. You know, it would not be the end of the world if the Government was doing a deal with Skycity and it was an economic deal that did not give Skycity these concessions. We might not like it, but at least it would be ethical and at least it would be morally explainable. But at the moment what we have here is morally contemptible. It is a morally contemptible piece of legislation that every single MP will be putting their name to if they vote for it. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000272\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b4a597dd-ed8b-42b8-975b-40c6e0cdaee1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022e84ed828dd924ee5bf2934c5e722b378\u0022\u003ELouisa Wall\u003C/span\u003E: Only them.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000273\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022fc8ab326-1806-41d3-8c41-cd58c95dcb45\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022ce2c70c29afc4ac586c3002c061a69be\u0022\u003EMETIRIA TUREI\u003C/span\u003E: That is right. If you vote for this legislation, you are voting for morally contemptible legislation. You are voting for more children being left in the Skycity car park. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000274\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c699e7c6-53b9-470c-a14a-378cb6fc8a04\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002259769a579ce44e08b73c29252018689e\u0022\u003EHon Phil Goff\u003C/span\u003E: That presumes there\u2019s any morality on that side of the Chamber, and that\u2019s a big presumption.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000275\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022fc8ab326-1806-41d3-8c41-cd58c95dcb45\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022ba92770c49a34e579e2d75a95e80c63a\u0022\u003EMETIRIA TUREI\u003C/span\u003E: That is a presumption, Mr Goff, but I am an eternal optimist and I want to believe in the best in people. I want to believe that the Parliament to which I contribute and that is supposed to serve me as a citizen of this country will make decisions based on rational argument, evidence, and the best interests of the people of this country and, more important than anything, the children of this country, who will inherit it after we are gone. So, yes, I ask for MPs to take a moral stance, to consider the impact of this legislation\u2014which is only about casino gambling and only about Skycity Casino\u2014and to choose to say no to it. There are ethical options available to us. There are other ways of developing a convention centre. There are other economic development options available to the people of Auckland to create jobs and stimulate their economy. There are other ways of providing for the public health needs of families in Auckland. There are ways of supporting Auckland businesses other than putting them at risk of the fraud and theft that will undoubtedly result out of this legislation\u2019s passing. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000276\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022fc8ab326-1806-41d3-8c41-cd58c95dcb45\u0022\u003EWe could call this bill all sorts of things. I have tried to call the whole deal some names in the past, actually, for which I have got into some trouble. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000277\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dfa851f0-ef7b-4834-bc41-1b3b645a3495\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022e9bbd1037f28431983bc36a37ffc8ad0\u0022\u003EDavid Shearer\u003C/span\u003E: Just stay there.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000278\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022fc8ab326-1806-41d3-8c41-cd58c95dcb45\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a4d23309013d4877b6c1d2ffb871ea3e\u0022\u003EMETIRIA TUREI\u003C/span\u003E: Yes, maybe I should stop now. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000279\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022490ccdbf-7c22-4e12-98f2-f3aa08f8e676\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00226c1b4c989c464172afb4b25b9ce50a55\u0022\u003EIain Lees-Galloway\u003C/span\u003E: You didn\u2019t try to call it sleazy, did you?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000280\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022fc8ab326-1806-41d3-8c41-cd58c95dcb45\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022673a8bdbf5a84792b587e2f1ec30277e\u0022\u003EMETIRIA TUREI\u003C/span\u003E: I could not possibly comment on that word. At the end of the day, it is our job as members of Parliament to act in the best interests of our whole community, and to not provide a financial boon to one company when we all know that in doing so we cause harm to families and children. It really is that simple a calculation. It requires MPs to genuinely examine their consciences to consider what they are prepared to put their names to, and what they are prepared to have their kids and their family accept that their loved ones have contributed to\u2014that they are part of a process that will cause harm, and not prevent harm. I urge all MPs to vote against this legislation.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022dfa851f0-ef7b-4834-bc41-1b3b645a3495\u0022 data-id=\u0022c60114e8545943238b45a85a3d0044cb\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000281\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dfa851f0-ef7b-4834-bc41-1b3b645a3495\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022c60114e8545943238b45a85a3d0044cb\u0022\u003EDAVID SHEARER (Labour\u2014Mt Albert):\u003C/span\u003E I just want to carry on from where my colleague from the Greens, Metiria Turei, left off because I completely agree with her. The New Zealand International Convention Centre Bill is a bill that is improperly named. It should be the \u201CLook After Your Mates (Sleazy Convention Centre) Bill.\u201D I hope I am able to stay in the Chamber after saying that title. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000282\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dfa851f0-ef7b-4834-bc41-1b3b645a3495\u0022\u003EAt the end of the day, this whole bill is built solely around the fact that we have to bring in changes to our gambling laws in order to get this convention centre up. If it was just a simple convention centre, we would not have to be doing this. If it was a simple deal that did not involve a shonky deal, we would not have to be doing this either. As the Deputy Auditor-General said, it was flawed, it was not transparent, and there were deficiencies on the part of Ministers and their officials. When the Prime Minister said that he was totally vindicated by her report, she said: \u201CNo, that isn\u2019t the case at all.\u201D In fact, she said: \u201CYou don\u2019t have to spend time writing 40 or 50 pages of an Auditor-General\u2019s report if he was going to be totally vindicated.\u201D\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000283\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dfa851f0-ef7b-4834-bc41-1b3b645a3495\u0022\u003EThis was a deal that was shonky from the beginning because of the way it was carried out. It was done over dinner. It was done through a whole bunch of secret meetings between the Prime Minister\u2019s office and Skycity. It cut out completely the other four tenderers that wanted to have a look in to this bill as well. They did not get a good look in. Instead, we had Skycity and, instead, we had to amend massive amounts of legislation in order for Skycity to get the cosy deal that it ended up with. Otherwise we would not have needed to do it. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000284\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dfa851f0-ef7b-4834-bc41-1b3b645a3495\u0022\u003EWhat sort of deal did Skycity end up with? Well, the current 110 gambling tables will go up by 40\u2014by 40. And listen to this: Skycity has 1,657 pokie machines currently\u20141,657 currently in operation\u2014and it is going to lift that by 230 more. But here is the kicker in this\u2014here is the kicker: what Skycity will get out of this is not just the extra pokie machines but also 359 of those pokie machines will have their limits lifted from $20 to $100. They will have in-out cards, so you do not actually have to put any money in whatsoever. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000285\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dfa851f0-ef7b-4834-bc41-1b3b645a3495\u0022\u003EThis is designed to fleece those people who cannot afford to put their money in these pokie machines in the first place, faster than they have ever done before. It will increase gambling harm much more than has occurred in the past. This is a bill designed to give Skycity an enormous shot in the arm. I asked a former employee of Skycity whom I spoke to before this came forward about what sort of deal this would be, and he laid out what he thought it would be. He was surprised\u2014he was surprised that Skycity got such a great deal. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000286\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dfa851f0-ef7b-4834-bc41-1b3b645a3495\u0022\u003EThis will not enhance New Zealand\u2019s reputation. It will not be the economic development miracle that Steven Joyce said it would be. It will pull money out of people who can least afford that money and it will put money in the pockets of those people in New Zealand who have already got that money. This is wrong. It will do nothing for New Zealand except provide the knowledge that our convention centre is being built on the backs of people who can least afford to pay for it. We, the taxpayers, will be paying the bill for all of those thousands of New Zealanders, their families, and their kids who will be poorer as a result of this shonky piece of legislation. Here we are in this Chamber on a Thursday afternoon debating a bill that should never have come to this House because we should have had a proper process that would have enabled other companies to have a fair look in to the situation.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002270fa4cbd-9380-4916-9f2a-78da059d220e\u0022 data-id=\u0022ffdb2e8be6fc478ab6f86ea56a1f1dcd\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000287\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002270fa4cbd-9380-4916-9f2a-78da059d220e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022ffdb2e8be6fc478ab6f86ea56a1f1dcd\u0022\u003EThe CHAIRPERSON (H V Ross Robertson)\u003C/span\u003E: I call the honourable member Philip Goff.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022c699e7c6-53b9-470c-a14a-378cb6fc8a04\u0022 data-id=\u0022646091bfe6d646c1aa68b07838f9ccfd\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000288\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c699e7c6-53b9-470c-a14a-378cb6fc8a04\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022646091bfe6d646c1aa68b07838f9ccfd\u0022\u003EHon PHIL GOFF (Labour\u2014Mt Roskill):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Mr Chairman. A very wise choice.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000289\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022490ccdbf-7c22-4e12-98f2-f3aa08f8e676\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022b4d479897c454ea5850f4665d52a31e9\u0022\u003EIain Lees-Galloway\u003C/span\u003E: Nobody else does.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000290\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c699e7c6-53b9-470c-a14a-378cb6fc8a04\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022df452e46aa9c484baaed1a4d9fa93c44\u0022\u003EHon PHIL GOFF\u003C/span\u003E: There is a question that my colleague is referring to\u2014that any profession that demands the title \u201Chonourable\u201D is probably anything but, but I will not go there. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000291\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c699e7c6-53b9-470c-a14a-378cb6fc8a04\u0022\u003EThe title of this bill, the New Zealand International Convention Centre Bill, in clause 1 is actually a deceptive title. It is a title that does not reveal anything about what this bill actually represents. So I am suggesting to the Committee that a more honest title would be the \u201CConvention Centre (Dirty Deal Implementation) Bill\u201D. That might sound a little unusual to you, but it is actually reflective of what this bill is about. Was this a bill simply to implement the result of a competitive tender to build the convention centre? No, it was not. There was no tender. There was no competitive bidding. This is a deal where John Key sat down and was wined and dined by Skycity and gave it a gold-plated deal. This is the wide boy, currency trader way of reaching a deal. It has nothing to do with the propriety of public sector tendering. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000292\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c699e7c6-53b9-470c-a14a-378cb6fc8a04\u0022\u003EThere were other tenderers out there: Vector and Ng\u0101ti Wh\u0101tua. They were reputable tenderers, which might have designed a convention centre that could be funded in an above-board way without the dishonesty and the dirty dealing that this bill represents. But that process never happened. John Key had two personal meetings. He told his officials to stop the process involving the other tenderers. That comes close to criminal activity. It is utterly inappropriate. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000293\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c699e7c6-53b9-470c-a14a-378cb6fc8a04\u0022\u003EThe Auditor-General looked at this and thought: \u201CI\u2019d better consider what has happened here. It doesn\u2019t seem right.\u201D Just before she was due to report, John Key came out and said that the report would totally vindicate him. That was another piece of deception. This report from the Auditor-General did not totally vindicate John Key. It did exactly the opposite. The Auditor-General, who is the watchdog of how this Government should be behaving, said that there were deficiencies on the part of Ministers, deficiencies on the part of officials. In fact, she said this about it: \u201Cwe do not consider that the evaluation process was transparent or even handed.\u201D That was the considered language of an Auditor-General. Anybody else would have said that that was straight cronyism. It lacked transparency. It lacked openness. It lacked honesty. It was a dirty deal. I agree with Metiria Turei. It is a shonky, sleazy deal\u2014a sleazy deal. That is not reflecting on the people who did the deal\u2014much. It is a sleazy deal. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000294\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c699e7c6-53b9-470c-a14a-378cb6fc8a04\u0022\u003EI want to say this. The title I suggested is an alternative title\u2014the \u201CConvention Centre (Dirty Deal Implementation) Bill\u201D\u2014but there is another title that would be more honest than what this Government is hiding behind. It is the \u201CIncreasing Harm from Gambling Bill\u201D, because how was the Government going to fund this convention centre? Was it going to fund it by saying: \u201CAnybody who sets up a business should be funded by the market, and if there is not a market for it, do not come to the public for a subsidy.\u201D? The Government could have done that or it could have done it a different way. It could have said: \u201CWell, the tourism industry benefits from this. Maybe the tourism industry could fund this deal?\u201D. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000295\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c699e7c6-53b9-470c-a14a-378cb6fc8a04\u0022\u003EWhat has the Government actually done? It is funding this by increasing the concessions to Skycity to put another 230 gambling machines in place, when the Gambling Act 2003 requires a sinking lid on the number gambling machines. Why does the Gambling Act do that? Why did the Labour Government pass that Gambling Act? Because the regulatory impact statement from the officials for this bill said that this kind of gambling is most associated with harm in terms of problem gambling. Every member in this Chamber has seen the people who sit on the stools in front of those pokie machines\u2014machines designed to drag as much money as possible out of the person who is playing them, machines that are designed to make a profit for the house at the expense and the misery of the people who operate them\u2014and this Government says that this convention centre should be built on the misery of the people who are playing these gambling machines. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000296\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c699e7c6-53b9-470c-a14a-378cb6fc8a04\u0022\u003EWhat we find from the regulatory impact statement is that the Department of Internal Affairs says that another 8,000 people will be affected because of the problem gambling associated with these extra 230 machines. There will be 8,000 people, and, as my colleague has rightly suggested, according to the Department of Internal Affairs, 6,500 of them will be children. I say to those National members who have got their heads dropped in shame, who will not take the call, and who will not justify what their Government is doing that those same members will come back into this Chamber and condemn the people who suffer from gambling addiction when they are feeding this addiction because they are increasing the gambling machines in Skycity by 230\u2014another 8,000 family members. There will be more kids who will be deprived because their mothers or their fathers suffer from gambling addiction promoted by the machines that are promoted by this Government in order to get the convention centre. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000297\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c699e7c6-53b9-470c-a14a-378cb6fc8a04\u0022\u003EI will try one third and last title that this bill should be called, and that is the \u201CDodgy Deal (Lacking Cost Benefit Analysis) Bill\u201D, because that is exactly what it is. You know, the Commerce Committee is set up to examine the bills that come before this House, and its members have the right to call in officials from the Ministry of Health, from the Department of Internal Affairs, and from Treasury to find out what this bill really does. The chairman of that committee denied the select committee the right to have those officials before it, and no wonder, because when we read what those departments say, we find that this is not a good deal for New Zealand. This is what Treasury says. It \u201Chas strong concerns that the private benefits to SkyCity will exceed public benefits to New Zealanders.\u201D \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000298\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c699e7c6-53b9-470c-a14a-378cb6fc8a04\u0022\u003EOf course, this bill is a gold-plated deal for Skycity to make money until 2048. Most of us will be dead by that time, but the bill will have locked in privileges that will enable Skycity to take more and more money every year out of the gambling population, and it will not be touched by the law that is set up to control gambling. That is a disgrace. It is unprecedented. This National Government will go to no ends to protect and enhance the position of its cronies. The legislation is a disgrace. It should not proceed. It is damaging to New Zealand, it looks after the cronies, and the process that this National Government has followed in pursuing it is, frankly, a disgrace.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022cc9c47c0-4409-44ca-ad2f-498707f27d69\u0022 data-id=\u0022edb6bf8e64fb41fba9f56c12aa83b26e\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000299\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cc9c47c0-4409-44ca-ad2f-498707f27d69\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022edb6bf8e64fb41fba9f56c12aa83b26e\u0022\u003EJONATHAN YOUNG (National\u2014New Plymouth):\u003C/span\u003E I move, That the question be now put.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002270fa4cbd-9380-4916-9f2a-78da059d220e\u0022 data-id=\u0022398430c4259d484d95204de3f10012c6\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000300\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002270fa4cbd-9380-4916-9f2a-78da059d220e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022398430c4259d484d95204de3f10012c6\u0022\u003EThe CHAIRPERSON (H V Ross Robertson)\u003C/span\u003E: I am going to recognise the honourable member Denise Roche, and I am doing so because she has sought the call several times.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00222df33ee5-23d6-441c-a9ba-6495aa69f9fd\u0022 data-id=\u00222b1a9f59afaf4127adec9591b92a512b\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000301\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00222df33ee5-23d6-441c-a9ba-6495aa69f9fd\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00222b1a9f59afaf4127adec9591b92a512b\u0022\u003EDENISE ROCHE (Green):\u003C/span\u003E I have put a bit of thought into considering what the New Zealand International Convention Centre Bill means. I have listened very closely to my colleagues on this side of the Chamber, and I agree with their assessment of what the bill is. As a consequence, I believe that this bill is badly named, so I have put together a few alternative names that this Committee might like to consider. The first one is the \u201CNew Zealand International Convention Centre (Maximisation of Problem Gambling) Bill\u201D. It is more accurate because with the concessions that have been negotiated\u2014the 230 pokie machines, the 12 automated tables with 20 seats at each, as well as the 40 new gambling tables\u2014we are looking at approximately 8,000 people who will be harmed by problem gambling, and we are looking at about 6,500 children who will also suffer directly from problem gambling as a result of this bill. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000302\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00222df33ee5-23d6-441c-a9ba-6495aa69f9fd\u0022\u003EWe know that the only reason we have this bill and we have these concessions around gambling is to fund the convention centre off the profits of problem gambling, because 40 percent of those profits that Skycity will make from all those machines will be from people who have no control over their behaviour. For a Government to say that this is how we will fund a public benefit for our economy, as it suggests, through the misery of others, is morally bankrupt. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000303\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00222df33ee5-23d6-441c-a9ba-6495aa69f9fd\u0022\u003EI have also thought that maybe to be more accurate, to more accurately reflect the impact of this bill, we should call it the \u201CStealing Little Kids\u2019 Lunch Money to Build a Convention Centre Bill\u201D, because that is what happens to children who live in homes where one of their parents has a gambling problem. Maybe we should be asking Skycity whether it could actually extend its creche facilities, which are otherwise known as the parking lot, because that is where a lot of those kids will be. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000304\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00222df33ee5-23d6-441c-a9ba-6495aa69f9fd\u0022\u003EI am also thinking that we could be calling this bill the \u201CWe Welcome Money-launderers and Loan Sharks International Convention Centre Bill\u201D, because if you look at how Skycity will be increasing its profits, and if you look at the concessions, particularly the concessions around ticket-in, ticket-out technology, which actually gets rid of real money for gambling, we are looking at a big, huge welcome to loan sharks. They love this kind of thing. That is how they launder the money, and that is how the P cooks suddenly have an income that they can declare. But at least, as I have said before, the police will know where to find them. They will be in the casino. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000305\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00222df33ee5-23d6-441c-a9ba-6495aa69f9fd\u0022\u003EWe could also be calling this bill\u2014and I think we should be\u2014the \u201CDodgy Dealing and Tainted Decision-making International Convention Centre Bill\u201D. If you think about the tender process that was aborted halfway through, or even before it started, really\u2014if you look at that, these other dodgy characters have entered the fray. They include members of this House who may have a kind of tainted attitude towards Skycity because of the implications around them keeping their job as an MP, because they have allegedly taken money from Skycity during their mayoral campaign. The conflict of interest there is that that member has to rely on the evidence of the chief executive officer of Skycity to maintain his job as an MP, and Skycity relies on the vote of that member to pass this legislation where it will dramatically increase its profits. The $403 million that it will cost to build this convention centre is chump change. It will have recouped that within 4 years because of the concessions that this Government is allowing with this piece of legislation, which totally undermines the Gambling Act, as others have said. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000306\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00222df33ee5-23d6-441c-a9ba-6495aa69f9fd\u0022\u003EWe could also say that another title for this bill could be the \u201CNew Zealand is a Pushover in Negotiations International Convention Centre Bill\u201D. Honestly, we are a laughing stock internationally. We have allowed one corporate citizen to negotiate with this Government for\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00226dc89bbf-c2ef-45c9-89e4-d2b5952d8d16\u0022 data-id=\u002212e5bc9922a24fa490b8e3a430fcff2a\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000307\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226dc89bbf-c2ef-45c9-89e4-d2b5952d8d16\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002212e5bc9922a24fa490b8e3a430fcff2a\u0022\u003EKANWALJIT SINGH BAKSHI (National):\u003C/span\u003E I move, That the question be now put.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca id=\u0022c09da0eb693b4e1aa98c7fe7f356ad83\u0022 name=\u0022division\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EA party vote was called for on the question, That the question be now put.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EAyes 63\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand National 59; M\u0101ori Party 2; ACT New Zealand 1; United Future 1.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENoes 56\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand Labour 33; Green Party 14; New Zealand First 7; Mana 1; Independent: Horan.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EMotion agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002270fa4cbd-9380-4916-9f2a-78da059d220e\u0022 data-id=\u002279d3f210a0ba45489b009d1d43bc663f\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000308\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002270fa4cbd-9380-4916-9f2a-78da059d220e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002279d3f210a0ba45489b009d1d43bc663f\u0022\u003EThe CHAIRPERSON (H V Ross Robertson)\u003C/span\u003E: The question now is that clause 1 stand part. All those in favour please say Aye, to the contrary, No. The Ayes have it\u2014a party vote is called for. The Clerk will please conduct a party vote.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000309\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022490ccdbf-7c22-4e12-98f2-f3aa08f8e676\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00223c1bd5db882d415d87abefee36438daf\u0022\u003EIain Lees-Galloway\u003C/span\u003E: No, a personal vote\u2019s been called for.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000310\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002270fa4cbd-9380-4916-9f2a-78da059d220e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00224f04db78fe884a9fae1db41788c69a46\u0022\u003EThe CHAIRPERSON (H V Ross Robertson)\u003C/span\u003E: No, we cannot have a personal vote on this. I am going by the Speaker\u2019s ruling. He has decided that provisions that directly and significantly affect the ability to gamble should be treated as conscience issues. Clause 1 and clause 2 are not policy provisions. Therefore, there will be party votes.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022490ccdbf-7c22-4e12-98f2-f3aa08f8e676\u0022 data-id=\u002288d788f91f3f49c8ba6b35258ad1b163\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000311\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022490ccdbf-7c22-4e12-98f2-f3aa08f8e676\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002288d788f91f3f49c8ba6b35258ad1b163\u0022\u003EIAIN LEES-GALLOWAY (Junior Whip\u2014Labour):\u003C/span\u003E I raise a point of order, Mr Chairperson. The commencement clause is essentially the clause that allows the Act to be brought into force. Therefore, the vote on the commencement clause is essentially a judgment on the bill as a whole. The bill as a whole has been deemed a conscience vote, so when members vote on the commencement clause they are expressing their view on the bill as a whole. Therefore, the commencement clause should be a personal vote.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002270fa4cbd-9380-4916-9f2a-78da059d220e\u0022 data-id=\u002296a8e31ff04f4a0dbfcfd914ad6f05d5\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000312\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002270fa4cbd-9380-4916-9f2a-78da059d220e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002296a8e31ff04f4a0dbfcfd914ad6f05d5\u0022\u003EThe CHAIRPERSON (H V Ross Robertson)\u003C/span\u003E: Well, I am not sure I need that, because we are actually on the title clause, and the only conscience matters were issues covered in clauses 6, 8, 9, 10, and 11 in Part 2 of the bill. Given the Speaker\u2019s ruling and that clauses 1 and 2 are not policy provisions, I am prepared to rule that this be a party vote. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022490ccdbf-7c22-4e12-98f2-f3aa08f8e676\u0022 data-id=\u0022fbb43629e1b1436c9fb103b52c1c4a94\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000313\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022490ccdbf-7c22-4e12-98f2-f3aa08f8e676\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022fbb43629e1b1436c9fb103b52c1c4a94\u0022\u003EIAIN LEES-GALLOWAY (Junior Whip\u2014Labour):\u003C/span\u003E I raise a point of order, Mr Chairperson. Could you direct us to the Speaker\u2019s ruling that deems clauses 1 and 2 to be not a conscience matter?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002270fa4cbd-9380-4916-9f2a-78da059d220e\u0022 data-id=\u0022e309f0236967418a9e433d5c6cddc6f2\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000314\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002270fa4cbd-9380-4916-9f2a-78da059d220e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022e309f0236967418a9e433d5c6cddc6f2\u0022\u003EThe CHAIRPERSON (H V Ross Robertson)\u003C/span\u003E: I have been advised that they are not policy provisions, and I have the Speaker\u2019s ruling in front of me that went to the party whips.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00228a1cb04e-8a86-44d1-9004-6e158e220339\u0022 data-id=\u00223862f3ec62eb4e40b2bd96dabdbd6602\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000315\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00228a1cb04e-8a86-44d1-9004-6e158e220339\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00223862f3ec62eb4e40b2bd96dabdbd6602\u0022\u003ETIM MACINDOE (Junior Whip\u2014National):\u003C/span\u003E I wonder whether perhaps the confusion is because of that term \u201CSpeaker\u2019s ruling\u201D, when, in fact, what you are referring to is the letter from the Speaker that arises from the decision of all parties in the Business Committee this week, in which agreement was reached on this matter. I want to point out that these are the title and commencement clauses that we are voting on. In fact, we have already had a large number of personal votes on the individual clauses that relate to gambling in this bill, and I ask you to uphold the direction of the Speaker arising from that letter, which, as I say, reflects the view of all parties this week at the Business Committee.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022490ccdbf-7c22-4e12-98f2-f3aa08f8e676\u0022 data-id=\u0022deed7bd6995c48658297fe30f9dfaae4\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000316\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022490ccdbf-7c22-4e12-98f2-f3aa08f8e676\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022deed7bd6995c48658297fe30f9dfaae4\u0022\u003EIAIN LEES-GALLOWAY (Junior Whip\u2014Labour):\u003C/span\u003E Speaking very briefly, further to that\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000317\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002270fa4cbd-9380-4916-9f2a-78da059d220e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022d8f8ec9b24ac4e859b311d57bd910b7e\u0022\u003EThe CHAIRPERSON (H V Ross Robertson)\u003C/span\u003E: Speaking very briefly, Iain Lees-Galloway.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000318\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022490ccdbf-7c22-4e12-98f2-f3aa08f8e676\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00225a23cdfbda034c0cb053450abae1dce9\u0022\u003EIAIN LEES-GALLOWAY\u003C/span\u003E: The letter does indicate which clauses of the bill the Speaker believed were policy matters, but ultimately it is over to you, Mr Chairperson, to rule which matters are conscience votes and which are not. I simply put it to you that when we come to the commencement clause it ought to be a personal vote, for the reasons I have already outlined.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002270fa4cbd-9380-4916-9f2a-78da059d220e\u0022 data-id=\u00229480edad3f1e481b9093bbcd2abd0d39\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000319\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002270fa4cbd-9380-4916-9f2a-78da059d220e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00229480edad3f1e481b9093bbcd2abd0d39\u0022\u003EThe CHAIRPERSON (H V Ross Robertson)\u003C/span\u003E: Well, to me, clauses 1 and 2 are not policy provisions, so in that case I am going to declare that we will have party votes on those clauses.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca id=\u002223b708ba671c48cd9596589984a80e08\u0022 name=\u0022division\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EA party vote was called for on the question, That clause 1 be agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EAyes 61\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand National 59; ACT New Zealand 1; United Future 1.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENoes 58\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand Labour 33; Green Party 14; New Zealand First 7; M\u0101ori Party 2; Mana 1; Independent: Horan.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EClause 1 agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca id=\u002222d10649ca9e48208492943d6bf22bd4\u0022 name=\u0022division\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EA party vote was called for on the question, That clause 2 be agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EAyes 61\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand National 59; ACT New Zealand 1; United Future 1.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENoes 58\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand Labour 33; Green Party 14; New Zealand First 7; M\u0101ori Party 2; Mana 1; Independent: Horan.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EClause 2 agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000320\u0022\u003EBill reported without amendment.\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000321\u0022\u003EReport adopted.\u003C/p\u003E\n    \u003C/div\u003E\n    \u003Cdiv class=\u0022HpsHansard\u0022\u003E\n      \u003Cp\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsProceedingHeading\u0022\u003EBills\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000322\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u002278e08a12019242999e64e5c9f87dff6a\u0022\u003ESocial Housing Reform (Housing Restructuring and Tenancy Matters Amendment) Bill\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000323\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u0022a45437a054874b0da155a7597c3c05c9\u0022\u003ESecond Reading\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022 data-id=\u0022f7c010e9bdc14bb3bca5682a3eb3630e\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000324\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022f7c010e9bdc14bb3bca5682a3eb3630e\u0022\u003EHon Dr NICK SMITH (Minister of Housing):\u003C/span\u003E I move, That the Social Housing Reform (Housing Restructuring and Tenancy Matters Amendment) Bill be now read a second time. I am proud to commend this bill to the House. This Government stands for better and smarter public services. If we are to balance the Budget and live within our means but at the same time deliver better social outcomes, we need innovative approaches to issues like social housing. This bill is based on best international practice. The UK and Australia are well down the path of having a more diverse approach to social housing. But it is also based on careful, solid policy-making for New Zealand, and I again want to acknowledge the authors of the Vision for Social Housing report, who are very much the architects of the changes in this bill. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000325\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003EThe bill moves us from having a frame of thinking around State housing to one of social housing, where we encourage, where we fund, and where we grow a wide range of social housing providers. It enables a wider range of tenants to have access to income-related rents. It helps ensure that our social housing is focused on those people in New Zealand who have the greatest need. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000326\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003EThe bill sets up the regulatory framework to both grow and manage the more diverse social housing sector. It enables the transfer of housing assessment from Housing New Zealand Corporation to the Ministry of Social Development, recognising that for families, housing is just one of the needs and the merits of a more integrated approach.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000327\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003EI want to acknowledge the hard work of the Social Services Committee and the changes that have been made by it. I particularly want to acknowledge and thank the chair of the committee, Sam Lotu-Iiga, and note the sad passing of his father this week. Sam Lotu-Iiga\u2019s and the committee\u2019s thoughtful and meticulous work on this bill lays a great foundation for the growth of the New Zealand social housing sector. I also want to acknowledge the hard work of Housing New Zealand Corporation, the Ministry of Social Development, and the Ministry of Business, Innovation and Employment in preparing this bill and for their ongoing work with the select committee. I would like to make a particular mention of the hard work of the Parliamentary Counsel Office in preparing the changes made during the select committee consideration.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000328\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003EI want to thank and acknowledge the wide range of organisations that made very constructive submissions on this bill. The committee received 380 submissions\u201443 of these were quite unique and had substantive material with them, and 20 of those submissions were presented orally. It is interesting to note that the vast majority of those submissions were very supportive of the reforms in this bill. Submitters were pleased to see the expansion of income-related rents to community housing providers, and the transfer of the housing needs-assessment function to the Ministry of Social Development. The feedback from submitters was insightful. It came from many of the players in the sector and it has enabled us not only to improve the bill but actually to help work on the regulations and help to get the officials lined up to make these reforms successful. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000329\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003EA number of specific issues in the bill were raised by submitters, which have been responded to with changes. One of the first changes is a new provision that has been inserted in the bill allowing ministerial directions on the timing and targeting of the review of ongoing eligibility for social housing. This will enable the Minister for Social Development and the Minister of Housing to jointly identify people who are to be excluded from the reviewable tenancies. In response to submitters\u2019 feedback about the proportionality of the intervention powers included in the bill, we have got a new tiered regulatory framework, which is very much modelled on what I saw operating very successfully in Australia with its regulatory system. This will mean that community housing providers in receipt of the income-related rent subsidy only, and not capital grants or stock transfers, will not be subject to all of those intervention powers. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000330\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003EA number of amendments have also been made around those intervention powers, which now apply to only those community housing providers that are receiving those capital grants or stock transfers. These changes are about the ministerial direction on the use of intervention powers, where they will be mandatory. A regulator can now make only minority appointments to the governing board of a community housing provider. An appeals body is to be established to give community housing providers the opportunity to appeal decisions that are made by the new regulator.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000331\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003EThe changes also mean that regulations can be made outlining the types of providers that may or may not receive that all-important income-related rent subsidy. This will give the Government the flexibility required to respond to the changes in demand for social housing. For too long, Government policy around housing has come down to a simplistic argument about whether there are more State houses. That is about as much sophistication as the argument had. The new model works a lot better and will result in those families who are most in need getting access to housing. It will make sure that our houses are properly maintained. That is something members opposite should hang their heads in shame about\u2014the lack of investment and the poor quality of the State house estate that they left. That view has been backed by the Housing Shareholders\u2019 Advisory Group, which has provided the foundations for this reform. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000332\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003EThis bill focuses on improving the quality of social housing by creating a new social housing model that can better respond to the circumstances of families living in social housing, requiring them to be provided with high-quality, suitable housing. In the Budget this year the Government announced $2.9 billion of investment in Housing New Zealand to improve the quality of the Housing New Zealand stock. That is more than double what the previous Government invested in any 3-year period in our own Housing New Zealand and puts to bed any accusation that this bill is about reducing the Government\u2019s role in providing housing. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000333\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003EAlongside that has been the huge investment that is going on in Christchurch in repairing our housing stock. Project 324\u0026amp;5 is realigning our own Government\u2019s housing to better meet the needs of more diverse families. There are tens of thousands of State houses that we have successfully insulated\u2014and I remind the House of the Government\u2019s commitment to make sure that every Housing New Zealand house that can be insulated will be insulated by the end of this year, that by the end of next year every house that is earthquake-prone will be repaired, and that by the end of 2015 every one of those 5,000 houses that was damaged in the earthquakes will be fixed. That shows the level of the commitment of this Government to improving the Government\u2019s own housing stock. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000334\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003EI commend this bill to the House. It is a well-thought-through reform. It has both good international context for the changes that we are making and been very well put together by the group. It involved a very diverse group of people involved in social services, and particularly in social housing. This is a bill that, as I said at the beginning, makes huge improvements to the way in which the Government delivers social housing. I commend it to the House. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022cbc37df2-57ae-4536-94ed-a2e39eecd585\u0022 data-id=\u002207abf880b99c454e859171898bdda0f1\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000335\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cbc37df2-57ae-4536-94ed-a2e39eecd585\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002207abf880b99c454e859171898bdda0f1\u0022\u003EPHIL TWYFORD (Labour\u2014Te Atat\u016B):\u003C/span\u003E First, let me begin with some comments generally about the Minister of Housing\u2019s stewardship of the housing portfolio. Two words come to mind: utter shambles. We have seen in the last few weeks and the last few days, one after the other, aspects of the Minister\u2019s portfolio that are in absolute disarray. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000336\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cbc37df2-57ae-4536-94ed-a2e39eecd585\u0022\u003EThe most recent is the loan-to-value ratio spending limits where it is blatantly clear to everybody that the Government has mismanaged the portfolio and this issue. It failed to take into account the impact on first-home buyers. It failed to consider that it would depress new builds and the imperative of increasing supply. It failed to properly consider the implications for provincial New Zealand. House prices in Auckland, the most overheated property market, are up 17.9 percent over the last 12 months. In Canterbury the Government is in denial. It insists that there is no housing crisis in Canterbury when people are paying hundreds of dollars a week to live in sleepouts and caravans and rents are up 25 percent in the last year. Government agencies are routinely referring people to live in campgrounds, and interest rates are heading north of 10 percent. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000337\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cbc37df2-57ae-4536-94ed-a2e39eecd585\u0022\u003EThose are the true key performance indicators of Nick Smith\u2019s stewardship of the housing portfolio. There are numerous problems that are out of control but the Minister behaves like a jack-in-the-box, popping up every few days with the media in tow to announce the fitting of a new door handle in some house somewhere around the country. He is desperately trying to convince the New Zealand public that the Government is not to blame for the housing crisis. He is running around like a jack-in-the-box, desperately trying to convey the impression that the Government has got a handle on the housing crisis. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000338\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cbc37df2-57ae-4536-94ed-a2e39eecd585\u0022\u003EThis bill that we are debating this afternoon, the Social Housing Reform (Housing Restructuring and Tenancy Matters Amendment) Bill, is more busywork from the Minister. He will not do the obvious thing in the worst housing crisis, the worst housing shortage, in living memory. He will not do the obvious thing and increase the amount of State and social housing. All he is willing to do is shuffle the pack. That is all he is willing to do. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000339\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cbc37df2-57ae-4536-94ed-a2e39eecd585\u0022\u003ELet me explain. Only 4 percent of the New Zealand population is currently housed by State and social housing\u2014only 4 percent. That is woefully low by international standards. It is. The Minister is shaking his head but he knows that I am right. What does this bill do? It shifts housing stock out of the hands of Housing New Zealand into the community housing sector. This is something that I will go on to explain Labour is perfectly comfortable with in principle. It accepts all of the key arguments why it is a good thing for New Zealand to grow and empower the community housing sector. However, this Minister insists on slicing up the pie in different ways, but he utterly refuses to grow the pie. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000340\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cbc37df2-57ae-4536-94ed-a2e39eecd585\u0022\u003ESecondly, he wants to make all State house tenants subject to insecurity of tenure. Again, we will talk in more detail about this. Under this legislation all State house tenants will be subject to reviewable tenancies. Instead of building more State and social housing, the Minister wants to more ruthlessly move tenants through those properties. He is only shuffling the last few cards in the pack. That is all he is doing. He refuses\u2014or perhaps it is his Cabinet colleagues whom he has been unable to convince, because they absolutely refuse\u2014to consider actually increasing the stock of social and State housing. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000341\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cbc37df2-57ae-4536-94ed-a2e39eecd585\u0022\u003ELabour will not vote for a bill that gives Nick Smith the power to throw 80-year-olds out on the street simply because there are not enough houses. Labour will not support it even though there are some aspects of this bill that it supports. The fundamental objection Labour has is that this bill gives Nick Smith the power to throw 80-year-olds out on the street because there are not enough houses. That is politically and ethically bankrupt. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000342\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cbc37df2-57ae-4536-94ed-a2e39eecd585\u0022\u003EWe believe that this provision in the bill will create needless stress and anxiety. As expert submitters told the Social Services Committee, it will actually pose a public health risk by piling that needless stress, insecurity, and anxiety on some of the people who are least able to cope with that. Only National would announce with great pride and fanfare in the Budget speech that its goal, its objective, is to kick 3,000 State house tenants out of their houses. That is National\u2019s idea of a State housing policy. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000343\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cbc37df2-57ae-4536-94ed-a2e39eecd585\u0022\u003EI want to quote the Productivity Commission, because that organisation is that Minister\u2019s touchstone.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000344\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002221447bed2703442da14a86a7c1a30ec1\u0022\u003EHon Dr Nick Smith\u003C/span\u003E: You called it an \u201Cideological burp\u201D.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000345\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cbc37df2-57ae-4536-94ed-a2e39eecd585\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022d148973298d246e0af806ba4c3cfe6a9\u0022\u003EPHIL TWYFORD\u003C/span\u003E: It is that Minister\u2019s touchstone. The Productivity Commission\u2019s report on affordable housing is the bible that Nick Smith reaches for whenever he is in doubt. I have referred to the commission in this House as ideological dinosaurs because I believe that is what it is. But I am going to quote the report, because the Productivity Commission is Nick Smith\u2019s bible. On this issue of reviewable tenancies this is what Nick Smith\u2019s intellectual mentor had to say. It said that \u201Cmoving people through state houses [on the basis of reviewable tenancies] undervalues the stability needed for sustainable improvements in social outcomes \u2026 social housing is best thought of as a contribution to a complex set of social needs that typically occur in clusters. The current approach to reform\u201D\u2014that is, the imposition of reviewable tenancies\u2014\u201Cis not always in harmony with the desires of communities for stability and continuity, which are often essential for addressing the needs of families requiring social assistance.\u201D \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000346\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cbc37df2-57ae-4536-94ed-a2e39eecd585\u0022\u003EWell, Minister, I suggest you go back to your intellectual mentors at the Productivity Commission and consider for a moment what they have to say about one of the most important provisions in this bill. They do not support reviewable tenancies. They are advising you to do the opposite of what you are doing in this bill.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000347\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002268d32965899e4bc692700007cf375402\u0022\u003EHon Dr Nick Smith\u003C/span\u003E: No, they\u2019re not.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000348\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cbc37df2-57ae-4536-94ed-a2e39eecd585\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a5f1e8fda86e4adeaaf1a4705d3b7960\u0022\u003EPHIL TWYFORD\u003C/span\u003E: Yes, they are. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000349\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cbc37df2-57ae-4536-94ed-a2e39eecd585\u0022\u003EI want to refer to the submission from an excellent organisation that is part of Otago University\u2019s Wellington campus. The name of the organisation is He Kainga Oranga, the housing and health research programme. It is headed up by Professor Philippa Howden-Chapman. This organisation is the gold standard when it comes to matters of housing and public health. It has carried out a pile of world-class public health research on this issue. It has won the public argument and established without any doubt that overcrowding and poor-quality homes are directly attributable to the appalling statistics we have in this country in the hospitalisation of children for respiratory diseases. What Philippa Howden-Chapman said to the select committee was that the Minister\u2019s insistence on applying insecurity of tenure to all State house tenants would pose a public health risk. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000350\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cbc37df2-57ae-4536-94ed-a2e39eecd585\u0022\u003EI look forward, when we debate this bill in more detail, to going into the detail of the evidence that the Otago University academics presented to the select committee on this issue. What they showed us at the select committee was that taking away security of tenure from some of the most economically and socially vulnerable people in New Zealand would pose a public health risk to those people. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000351\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cbc37df2-57ae-4536-94ed-a2e39eecd585\u0022\u003EThe second thing that this bill does is enable the transfer of State housing stock to the community housing sector. Labour supports growing the community housing sector for all of the reasons that are commonly expressed. However, we oppose the winding-down, the cutting-back, the de-powering of Housing New Zealand. That is exactly this Minister\u2019s intention. This bill is a means towards his vision of remaking Housing New Zealand as just another tenancy manager. We may as well get Barfoot and Thompson to manage the State housing stocks, because that is the Minister\u2019s vision\u2014that Housing New Zealand will be just another landlord competing in a quasi-contestable market for tenants and subsidies. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000352\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cbc37df2-57ae-4536-94ed-a2e39eecd585\u0022\u003EThe Minister does not see a future for a strong, capable, Government-delivered social housing provider, just as Housing New Zealand is today. Labour does not support the Minister. It does not believe that growing the community housing sector by chopping up Housing New Zealand into little bits and divvying it out to the NGO sector is the way to do it. Labour believes that putting a roof over the heads of some of the most vulnerable New Zealanders is a core responsibility of the Government. In this bill Nick Smith is stepping away from that responsibility. We will not be voting for this bill.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002218f9e3ea-81c5-4414-af48-d6bb843a9227\u0022 data-id=\u0022284d5639ebe24f208f610163581bdc0d\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000353\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002218f9e3ea-81c5-4414-af48-d6bb843a9227\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022284d5639ebe24f208f610163581bdc0d\u0022\u003EMELISSA LEE (National):\u003C/span\u003E It is a great pleasure to rise in support of the second reading of the Social Housing Reform (Housing Restructuring and Tenancy Matters Amendment) Bill. I would like to reflect on the speech from the previous speaker from the Opposition, Phil Twyford, on the bill. What a contribution that was. That was really rich, coming from that member who belongs to a party that could be classed only as the slum landlord that did nothing for this sector for 9 years on the Treasury benches when it was in Government. As we all know, the old model of massive State housing estates does not actually work. That is why we need to make changes to this model. We should not be putting all of our eggs into one basket, but that is precisely the problem with the way housing assistance has been delivered to those people who need it most in this country. We need to diversify the way we deliver housing assistance, and we are going to be providing the best service to New Zealanders. That is what this bill is actually addressing. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000354\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002218f9e3ea-81c5-4414-af48-d6bb843a9227\u0022\u003EThis bill is going to make fundamental and welcome changes to the way the Government delivers housing assistance to those who actually need it, by letting community housing providers play a bigger role. We have seen worldwide how community housing providers do a better job meeting those needs because they provide a wraparound service for their clients. Just take a look internationally\u2014New Zealand is lagging in the community housing sector. We have less than 5 percent of social housing provided by the community sector. Compare this with Australia, where it is actually about 20 percent. Compare it to the UK, where it is actually about 60 percent of social housing. That is precisely why I am excited by this social housing reform bill, which will make a substantive shift in the Government\u2019s housing assistance from a State housing to a social housing model. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000355\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002218f9e3ea-81c5-4414-af48-d6bb843a9227\u0022\u003ELet us talk a little bit about the detail of the bill. Before I get along, I would like to talk about the misinformation that Mr Phil Twyford was actually talking about. I think he mentioned something about how Labour cannot support a bill that turfs out 80-year-old people from their homes. I mean, what a bunch of hogwash. It is a complete misconception. It is complete misinformation because the Social Services Committee made a number of technical and substantive amendments to the bill. The committee recommended allowing the Minister of Housing to identify people who will not be subject to reviewable tenancies. It specifically mentions vulnerable elderly tenants and disabled tenants. What this really means is that the bill allows the Government to clarify regulation so that vulnerable tenants, such as the elderly\u2014they are the ones whom Mr Twyford talked about\u2014would not get their tenancies reviewed. So the idea that they are going to be turfed out, the idea that Labour actually talks about, is utter rubbish. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000356\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002218f9e3ea-81c5-4414-af48-d6bb843a9227\u0022\u003EThe main objective of this bill is to improve access to social housing for those who really need it and to support people to become independent of State housing when their situations actually improve. Contrary to the Opposition\u2019s deluded views, this bill is not about kicking out tenants, as I said. It is called the Social Housing Reform (Housing Restructuring and Tenancy Matters Amendment) Bill, and that is exactly what it is about\u2014reforming social housing in New Zealand. This bill is going to change the way assistance will be given. Once this bill comes into effect, the level of assistance will not be dependent on whether the house is actually State owned but on the real needs of the family, on their income, and on the quality of the house. This is all part of the Government\u2019s promise to deliver a better public service. This is something our Government has shown great commitment to\u2014way better than the housing stock that the previous Government left behind, which was not even insulated and where people were living in cold conditions and getting sick. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000357\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002218f9e3ea-81c5-4414-af48-d6bb843a9227\u0022\u003EThis bill is also about facing up to facts such as that we have got more than 4,000 State housing tenants paying market rents, some of whom are on high incomes. We are actually doing something about that. It is about being fair. It is not fair that there are currently 2,100 families\u2014about 6,000 people\u2014on the Housing New Zealand waiting list with a serious need for a State home while there are tenants who can actually afford to find a decent house with their high incomes, but who happen to be living in State homes. It is also part of this Government\u2019s commitment to better services for Kiwis. To deliver better services we will be making a record investment of $2.9 billion in Housing New Zealand for the next 3 years to improve access to social housing and to develop a pathway for New Zealanders in social housing to get independent. This matters to us because delivering housing assistance to Kiwis who need it the most is where we ought to be concentrating. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000358\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002218f9e3ea-81c5-4414-af48-d6bb843a9227\u0022\u003EAs I mentioned in the first reading of the bill, this facilitates housing in the right places, getting the right size and conditions, and getting it where it is the most in need\u2014more targeted and efficient use of our resources. It also means getting results where we need to see them the most. It will not change the fact that housing will always be available for those people who need it, and for the duration of the time that they actually require it. Quite frankly, this bill will address the very issue that Labour did not have the appetite to actually fix. Let us not forget that when the Opposition members were in Government they did not do anything substantive to ease the housing issue. There was not even any review of the criteria for placement of people into housing, meaning that taxpayers\u2019 money that could have gone to target those in need was used ineffectively. This did not help Kiwi families then, and it is certainly not helping them now. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000359\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002218f9e3ea-81c5-4414-af48-d6bb843a9227\u0022\u003ELet us not forget the Opposition\u2019s poor track record with leaky homes. It was our National Government that actually tackled this issue. Once again, it is this current Government that is tackling the big issues. I wholeheartedly support this bill and I commend it to the House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002209a5b71a-ca7e-4e7c-9e09-f9e63f18aa12\u0022 data-id=\u0022abf12e0982d7487ba643bfbba57e8926\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000360\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002209a5b71a-ca7e-4e7c-9e09-f9e63f18aa12\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022abf12e0982d7487ba643bfbba57e8926\u0022\u003EHon ANNETTE KING (Labour\u2014Rongotai):\u003C/span\u003E It was interesting listening to Melissa Lee read out the research notes. What I got from that is that she thinks that if you tell a lie often enough, people might believe it. The lie that I thought was being told was that for 9 years Labour did nothing in housing. Well, that member was not around, I believe, during that time, but I can tell her that we spent 9 years fixing up after the great State house fire sale undertaken by the previous National Government. Maybe she was not aware of that. Maybe nobody told her that the previous National Government sold off 13,000 State houses and replaced very few of them. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000361\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002209a5b71a-ca7e-4e7c-9e09-f9e63f18aa12\u0022\u003EShe then went on to say that it is not about kicking people out of houses\u2014that that is not what it is about. Well, I suggest that she might like to read the regulatory impact statement, which says this: \u201CAs at 31 January 2013, HNZC had 63,867 total tenancies of which 54,520 were identified as having been entered into prior to 1 July 2011.\u201D\u2014that is an important date, 1 July 2011\u2014and: \u201CAbout 80 percent of these are likely to qualify for desktop review.\u201D This desktop review is to see whether they should be kicked out. The criteria for that are going to be very interesting indeed. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000362\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002209a5b71a-ca7e-4e7c-9e09-f9e63f18aa12\u0022\u003EYou see, this Social Housing Reform (Housing Restructuring and Tenancy Matters Amendment) Bill is about three things. It is about the income-related rent subsidy being extended to all social housing providers. I have no problem with that. It is a very good idea. But why have they not included local government\u2014one of the biggest providers of social housing in New Zealand\u2014in this? If you counted local government as a social housing provider, I suspect it would be more than 5 percent. If they are counting local government in the 5 percent, then why are councils not eligible in the extension of the income-related rent subsidy? That is a very good question, and I would like to put that to the Minister of Housing when I get an opportunity.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000363\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002209a5b71a-ca7e-4e7c-9e09-f9e63f18aa12\u0022\u003EHere in Wellington, it is the local authority\u2014it is Wellington City Council\u2014that provides the largest number of social houses in this city. In fact, it is the biggest provider in New Zealand. Why would it not qualify for the income-related rent subsidy? It is providing very good accommodation after the previous Labour Government put in over $200 million in partnership with them\u2014$200 million, Melissa Lee, that we put into a partnership with the local authority\u2014to renovate those houses and those apartments to make them livable for many, many low-income Wellingtonians. That is the sort of thing that the previous Labour Government did. So I do not have a problem with income-related rent subsidy being provided to social housing providers. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000364\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002209a5b71a-ca7e-4e7c-9e09-f9e63f18aa12\u0022\u003EI do have a problem with the reviewable tenancies of all State housing tenants. When you read the small print, yes, they are going to be concerned about people with disabilities and people who are unable to physically move, but where in this bill does it talk about the elderly? It is the older New Zealanders, who have often lived in the same State house for many years\u2014and it is their home. It is not just a place where they lay their head. It is a place where often they have brought up their children. They have made it their home, they have put in the gardens, often they had to put in the paths, they put in the drapes, they put in the carpet, and they made it their home. These people are some of those who are going to be asked to move on when they have had their tenancies reviewed.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000365\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002209a5b71a-ca7e-4e7c-9e09-f9e63f18aa12\u0022\u003EThe third area is that this bill is supposed to make Housing New Zealand more effective and more efficient. Well, poor old Housing New Zealand underwent a big effectiveness and efficiency change under the previous Minister, Phil Heatley, so it was supposed to have already been made more effective and efficient. Some of us remember how that happened. The Government closed all the Housing New Zealand offices. That is how they became more efficient. So if you wanted to go and see somebody in a Housing New Zealand office, you rocked up to the door, and the door was shut. You could not even get an appointment to get into the office, because you had to ring the toll-free 0800 number to get an appointment if you were going to get through the door, and if they would open it. But people sat for hours and hours trying to get through on the 0800 number. It was the 0800 Nowhere number. So, talk about more efficiency in Housing New Zealand! \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000366\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002209a5b71a-ca7e-4e7c-9e09-f9e63f18aa12\u0022\u003EThere are three areas in this bill. I have to say we are not going to support it, because although there are some good things in it, it is going to have a detrimental effect on many, many New Zealanders who need certainty and security in their housing. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000367\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002209a5b71a-ca7e-4e7c-9e09-f9e63f18aa12\u0022\u003EOne last thing: we already have a mixed model of housing. We have homeownership, we have State housing, and we have community and social housing. We could add to that, but you do not need to do that at the expense of State house tenants.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022fc8ab326-1806-41d3-8c41-cd58c95dcb45\u0022 data-id=\u0022909560122a5a4bf69ca770d7b1366764\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000368\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022fc8ab326-1806-41d3-8c41-cd58c95dcb45\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022909560122a5a4bf69ca770d7b1366764\u0022\u003EMETIRIA TUREI (Co-Leader\u2014Green):\u003C/span\u003E The Green Party will maintain its opposition to this legislation, the Social Housing Reform (Housing Restructuring and Tenancy Matters Amendment) Bill. I want to acknowledge the work of Holly Walker, who is currently on maternity leave, the Green Party MP who holds our housing portfolio, for her work on the Social Services Committee and particularly for the drafting of the minority report that is attached to the bill. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000369\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022fc8ab326-1806-41d3-8c41-cd58c95dcb45\u0022\u003EI just want to go through some of the provisions and issues that she has raised in that minority report, and also to remind the country that just earlier this year, less than 12 months ago, the Green Party released a significant housing policy that was designed expressly to deal with the issues of affordability. It is not a build programme; it is a programme of support and affordability, to increase and improve the affordability for families to purchase their own home, to improve the quality of New Zealand\u2019s homes, and to improve the security of tenure for New Zealanders living in homes. That proposal, called Home for Life, included three provisions. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000370\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022fc8ab326-1806-41d3-8c41-cd58c95dcb45\u0022\u003EOne of them was the progressive ownership policy, which is very similar to a UK Government - sponsored scheme over there. The Minister of Housing referred to UK examples of housing in his speech on this legislation. Progressive ownership is a shared-equity scheme where the Government, in partnership with other organisations\u2014iwi, community organisations, and social housing organisations\u2014build homes and continue with a persistent and consistent home-building programme in New Zealand. Some of those homes are set aside for State housing, some of those homes are set aside for management in social housing, and some of them, for example under Labour\u2019s scheme, might be sold directly to New Zealanders, but a proportion would also be set aside for the progressive ownership scheme where people could slowly, over time, buy their own home. They would enter into an agreement with the Government agency that manages that. They would pay a small amount\u2014effectively, pay a rent\u2014to pay for the cost of the capital for the building of that home, and every week pay a little bit extra. So every week they are paying a little bit extra to purchase a home. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000371\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022fc8ab326-1806-41d3-8c41-cd58c95dcb45\u0022\u003EIt is kind of like the old Department of M\u0101ori Affairs home loans and State Advances Corporation loans. Many of us were raised in homes where our parents bought those homes by capitalising on the family benefit. It is very much that kind of scheme, where the Government is building an investment. It is investing in families, and it is passing on to New Zealand families its own low costs of borrowing, so that all New Zealanders can have access to that. It is a way for people to build their own homes. In the UK those homes continue, through the affordability scheme. They are re-used for families, just like those first families, if they eventually want to move on. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000372\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022fc8ab326-1806-41d3-8c41-cd58c95dcb45\u0022\u003EThese are the kinds of policy ideas that need to be incorporated into New Zealand\u2019s housing law and regulations, but they are completely ignored by this Government because the Government\u2019s sole intention, and it is represented here in this bill, is to remove itself from social housing. It is not to facilitate social housing, and it is not to increase social housing or improve social housing. The Government\u2019s sole intention is to retreat from social housing, and it is doing so in a way that is full of spin. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000373\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022fc8ab326-1806-41d3-8c41-cd58c95dcb45\u0022\u003EThis legislation that we are discussing today sets up a system whereby State housing, which the State currently manages, will be slowly moved over into the community sector. Instead of building a collaborative relationship between Government and the community sector, or Government and iwi\u2014a collaborative relationship between all of the players\u2014where more affordable housing is built, the Government is building a competitive environment where organisations will have to compete with each other for access to resources to improve housing affordability and build more houses. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000374\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022fc8ab326-1806-41d3-8c41-cd58c95dcb45\u0022\u003EThis is at a time when we have a housing crisis. We know that there are at least 90,000 too few homes for the population in this country, and that number is getting bigger as the population grows and fewer homes are being built. We know that more and more New Zealanders are unable to buy their homes. Actually, do you know what? Those New Zealanders tend to be the middle class. The poor have always had real difficulty owning their own homes, but the homeownership rates for the middle class are plummeting, and they are plummeting because supply is so restricted. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000375\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022fc8ab326-1806-41d3-8c41-cd58c95dcb45\u0022\u003EInstead of building a collaborative relationship between the State and community and iwi, this Government is building a competitive one so that it can get out of the market because the Government does not believe it has any responsibility for this core piece of infrastructure. The Green Party believes that housing is core infrastructure. It is no less core infrastructure than the roads we drive on, the telephone wires we use to communicate, and the water pipes that bring us clean, fresh water. Housing is a human right. A decent society, a wealthy society like our own, a First World society like our own should have as one of its core principles that every single family in this country will be decently, safely, warmly, and affordably housed. That is not an outrageous principle to have.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000376\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225db0a23e-1579-44c6-9194-76e34cf5ae99\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00222d1b9c8559bc4b46b214870b2f82cd41\u0022\u003EDr Rajen Prasad\u003C/span\u003E: Fat chance with this lot.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000377\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022fc8ab326-1806-41d3-8c41-cd58c95dcb45\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022014a9b74ca92447a98ba89cc31991be5\u0022\u003EMETIRIA TUREI\u003C/span\u003E: I am afraid so, Mr Prasad. I am very disappointed that that is the case\u2014that such a basic principle, that every family in this country is entitled to be decently, warmly, and safely housed, is somehow a principle that the National Government will not accept. It does not believe in this principle. That is why the Government is retreating from social housing, why it is, through this legislation, removing from Housing New Zealand Corporation all social responsibility for housing, why it is building a competitive model for affordable house-building, and why it is refusing to deal with the core issues that most affect housing affordability in this country and housing supply. A capital gains tax is one of those issues that this Government has absolutely refused to consider, even though it knows that it is one part of an economic tool that needs to be put in place if we are to improve housing affordability for New Zealanders. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000378\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022fc8ab326-1806-41d3-8c41-cd58c95dcb45\u0022\u003EOne of the major issues in this legislation is the reviewable tenancies. A few years ago the Government put in place reviewable tenancies, where new State housing tenants would be subject to a 3-yearly review of their tenancy. It has not yet been 3 years. It has not yet been tested to see whether the renewable tenancy programme already in place is making any beneficial difference to those families who are the most vulnerable and the most in need of social housing. Yet, despite the complete lack of evidence about this and the effect of it\u2014whether it is good or whether it is bad\u2014the Government is intending to roll it out to all State house tenants across the country. What this does is it creates fundamental instability for the housing of families.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000379\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022fc8ab326-1806-41d3-8c41-cd58c95dcb45\u0022\u003EI have a case myself at the moment of a family who are in very vulnerable circumstances, where he suffers from a serious illness that will eventually kill him, she has been working, but just recently lost her job\u2014she was made redundant\u2014and they have a Child, Youth and Family child whom they care for and two children of their own, one of whom has a severe disability. These are the families that we should be prioritising. They are vulnerable families and they are doing their very best. We are very hopeful that with some intervention we may be able to make sure that she has a decent house. But why should she have to rely on the intervention of a member of Parliament to get what she is entitled to\u2014decent housing\u2014as a member of our community and as a member of our family? She should not have to struggle. But if she gets a State house, in 3 years\u2019 time she is going to have her tenancy reviewed. She will have no security that she will have a home to live in, to raise her kids and to take care of her husband for the time that she needs it. Why should she not have that? Why should she not be entitled to that security and that decency? The Government wants to spend all its money on building motorways not homes. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000380\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022fc8ab326-1806-41d3-8c41-cd58c95dcb45\u0022\u003EWe will continue to oppose this legislation. There are serious reforms that could be made to improve housing affordability for New Zealanders, particularly for our most vulnerable families. This legislation will drive more and more of those families into the ground, and more and more of those families into poverty and insecurity. We are opposed to this bill. Thank you.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022cbb83aab-9566-44c4-9029-8bda4aaca7f2\u0022 data-id=\u00227175e4c1eb1144bbaa79238923a66f27\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000381\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cbb83aab-9566-44c4-9029-8bda4aaca7f2\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00227175e4c1eb1144bbaa79238923a66f27\u0022\u003EHon PHIL HEATLEY (National\u2014Whangarei):\u003C/span\u003E I rise to support this legislation, the Social Housing Reform (Housing Restructuring and Tenancy Matters Amendment) Bill. I do so because it is part of a suite of initiatives that the National-led Government is working on\u2014and has actually begun work on the ground for\u2014to deal with housing issues right across New Zealand. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000382\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cbb83aab-9566-44c4-9029-8bda4aaca7f2\u0022\u003EFirst of all, of course, people will be aware of the changes we have made to the Building Act to ensure that builders are up to par and able to deliver better housing, with their qualifications, and also changes to the structural rules around the construction of those houses. The Resource Management Act has had changes to consenting to streamline that consenting process so that developments can get under way sooner. We have also, as part of the suite of options, looked at land supply, making sure that not only is there new greenfields land for housing around metropolitan areas and some of our cities across New Zealand but also where housing is already built on large sections, those people can easily subdivide their quarter-acre and half-acre sections to provide more housing within city limits. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000383\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cbb83aab-9566-44c4-9029-8bda4aaca7f2\u0022\u003EInterestingly, the Greens hate the expansion of housing out to green, sort of rural areas, and they push hard for densification, but the minute you try to do it\u2014even in State housing, where you bowl an old, cold, mouldy State house on a half-acre section in order to create three sections and three houses\u2014the Greens are right there opposing it, alongside Hone Harawira. That is pretty interesting. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000384\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cbb83aab-9566-44c4-9029-8bda4aaca7f2\u0022\u003ERegarding building materials, Nick Smith has announced his concerns and his programme to address the issue of costly building materials in New Zealand. Of course, we have the upgrade of State housing; those State houses that were not insulated through the decades that Labour was in Government\u2014those old, cold, mouldy houses\u2014are now being insulated. Today we are talking about this proposition, which forms another initiative to address the issues in housing and the social housing sector. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000385\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cbb83aab-9566-44c4-9029-8bda4aaca7f2\u0022\u003EThere are some things that Labour did not do. You will recall that Labour never dealt with gangs in State houses. Do you remember the methamphetamine-producing gangs? Do you remember the gangs that would grab the pales from the white picket fences of their State houses and beat up the neighbours next door? Labour ignored the gangs in State houses. You will remember Labour ignored all those State house tenants who were subletting State houses\u2014those shonky schemes that it never jumped on top of. You will remember Labour never insulated State houses. I believe Nick Smith is going to see the last State house in New Zealand that can be insulated, insulated this year, and I congratulate him on it. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000386\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cbb83aab-9566-44c4-9029-8bda4aaca7f2\u0022\u003EYou will recall Labour supported the idea\u2014and it still supports the idea\u2014of the State house for life. You can get a State house with four bedrooms\u2014because you have three children\u2014you can live in it for 20 years, they can all leave home, and you can sit in that State house by yourself, at 55 years of age, and in a job, with three empty bedrooms and a half-acre section, and not be required to make way for a family who is desperate for housing. How crazy is that? Labour ignores the fact that you are earning $100,000 a year\u2014you can stay in your State house. It ignores the fact that there are three empty bedrooms\u2014you can stay in your State house. It ignores the fact that you are on a half-acre section\u2014you can stay in your State house. It even ignores the fact that you might want to shift into a smaller State house\u2014it still will not shift you. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000387\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cbb83aab-9566-44c4-9029-8bda4aaca7f2\u0022\u003EI support this legislation and I support what Nick Smith has done here. It is all common sense to those people out there who believe you should not have gangs cooking methamphetamine in State houses, you should not have someone in a State house for 50 years if they are earning $100,000, and you need to support the community housing sector. Congratulations to Nick Smith.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002247c29b78-eee0-4c91-afdf-7b07be780e1a\u0022 data-id=\u0022b89752484338424383d66e15fec44225\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000388\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002247c29b78-eee0-4c91-afdf-7b07be780e1a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022b89752484338424383d66e15fec44225\u0022\u003EDENIS O\u2019ROURKE (NZ First):\u003C/span\u003E The Social Housing Reform (Housing Restructuring and Tenancy Matters Amendment) Bill is one of the most objectionable and patently stupid bills this Government has produced. It is an utterly misconceived and completely inadequate response to the intensifying New Zealand housing crisis\u2014a crisis that the Government watched develop for 5 long years. Its priorities are saving money and reducing the size of State services, rather than ensuring that the needs of people\u2014especially those at the lower end of the socio-economic spectrum\u2014are adequately met. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000389\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002247c29b78-eee0-4c91-afdf-7b07be780e1a\u0022\u003ENew Zealand First is committed to the provision of a genuine social housing service by the Government as a fundamental responsibility, in order to ensure that people are able to buy a home, or for people for whom homeownership is inappropriate to have a fair rental related to their income and to have the stability in their lives that they deserve. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000390\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002247c29b78-eee0-4c91-afdf-7b07be780e1a\u0022\u003EThe social housing deficit in New Zealand is now huge. More and more Kiwis are unable to afford a home; many will never be able to afford one. Their need is for options for long-term rental housing, which in this country only the State can reliably provide for low-income people. National has never really understood social housing, and this bill proves it. Its legacy of social housing stuff-ups always has to be remedied by later more-enlightened Governments. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000391\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002247c29b78-eee0-4c91-afdf-7b07be780e1a\u0022\u003EThere are two categories for New Zealand First\u2019s total opposition to this legislation: first, the abdication of responsibility for social housing provision to non-Government providers as a matter of social policy, and, second, the reviewability of tenancies in the heartless and socially destructive way proposed in this awful bill. The laying-off of social housing provision to such a large range of community housing organisations and to such a large extent as the 20 percent targeted by the Government will not solve our housing needs. It is unrealistic and it is risky, both socially and economically, and it is wrong in principle as a proper application of taxpayers\u2019 money. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000392\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002247c29b78-eee0-4c91-afdf-7b07be780e1a\u0022\u003ENew Zealand First\u2019s policy is that taxpayer-funded social housing must be met in these three ways: first, directly by the Government, through Government agencies\u2014especially Housing New Zealand, not just as a landlord but as a full-responsibility social agency\u2014to provide a comprehensive rental housing service, not just buildings. There are too few houses already to meet the need for rental properties generally, and especially for low-income people in the main centres. New Zealand First\u2019s policy is to make rental housing affordable and accessible to these people, and to offer a range of options to meet all social needs. New Zealand First believes that it is unwise to confuse social objectives with property investment objectives in both the State sector and non-governmental organisations. The outcome would be risky, uncertain, and unlikely to be acceptable in practice. The State would be better to provide social housing directly and not rely so much on the NGO sector. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000393\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002247c29b78-eee0-4c91-afdf-7b07be780e1a\u0022\u003EThe second way is by local government, which should be capitalised with loans at very concessionary interest rates by the Government, so that there would be no burden on rates, to help provide a social rental housing service and also to provide public rental housing units to complement Housing New Zealand. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000394\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002247c29b78-eee0-4c91-afdf-7b07be780e1a\u0022\u003EThe third way is by a few well-qualified non-government providers that can prove the need for them and their ability to meet the need. There is a place for some of those organisations, such as those that provide refuges for women. There are others, too, such as Habitat for Humanity and the Salvation Army. But these are a discrete and relatively small area of need\u2014nowhere near the 20 percent proposed by the Government. Some of these NGOs give little confidence. One in Queenstown recently lost its charitable status and others run at a loss. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000395\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002247c29b78-eee0-4c91-afdf-7b07be780e1a\u0022\u003EThe Government\u2019s social housing policy reduces the scope of the operation of Housing New Zealand. It will transfer large sums of money to community housing organisations. But what about their competency? Can they be relied upon in the long term? Will they become a nightmare to monitor? Those organisations will own the housing funded or gifted by the Government, but how do we know it will be well spent and managed? There will be no State asset in return. What happens if a recipient organisation fails? Where do the assets go? How transparent and accountable are the processes for allocating funds to community providers? What safeguards and risk management have been put in place for the funds allocated to non-property community providers? Will they have enough competence in the housing market, when private investors have lost many millions of dollars in the building and property market themselves? \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000396\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002247c29b78-eee0-4c91-afdf-7b07be780e1a\u0022\u003EThese are just a few of the questions left unanswered by this bill. The bill also contains new provisions for moving people out of State houses if they are financially able to do so. That should not be an objective in itself. Three-yearly reviews for new and existing tenants will lead to significant social problems as health, education, and community well-being suffer. There are good reasons for people, especially the elderly, to choose to remain in State house rentals, even if they are assessed as able to move elsewhere. People who have good reasons to stay are likely to be nudged out of State rentals, when it is not their best option. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000397\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002247c29b78-eee0-4c91-afdf-7b07be780e1a\u0022\u003EThe bill will allow Housing New Zealand to forcibly obtain information from people. Will it become the housing police? This is utterly objectionable policy. All this stress, especially for the elderly and for other vulnerable people, cannot be done in the lenient way asserted by the Government. I have heard some speeches by members opposite saying there will be no problem in this respect, but very few people out there in the world of rental housing actually accept that, for one moment. We in New Zealand First certainly do not. There is so much wrong with this bill and its whole worthless underlying philosophy that New Zealand First will certainly vote No.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022695678cf-542a-4616-9e0a-86990caec192\u0022 data-id=\u002281f84b68b9bc413d9704f22111efd685\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000398\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022695678cf-542a-4616-9e0a-86990caec192\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002281f84b68b9bc413d9704f22111efd685\u0022\u003EALFRED NGARO (National):\u003C/span\u003E You know when Opposition members are still in Halloween mode because they are getting out there with their bogeyman masks trying to scare ordinary Kiwis with their trick-or-treat speeches. Here is a little bit of the truth that they might like to hear, especially Mr Phil Twyford, who is a great member of the Lyndon Baines Johnson fan club. I am sure that people will know about that. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000399\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022695678cf-542a-4616-9e0a-86990caec192\u0022\u003ELet us get to the point. Here is the point. There is just one point I want to make. The member Denis O\u2019Rourke has just read his speech\u2014and that is the tragedy, when people who have not been a part of the select committee and all the deliberation just read their speeches. The issue is about this: the third sector\u2014the third sector. We have the Housing Shareholders\u2019 Advisory Group, led by Dr Alan Jackson. But guess what? Here are some other members you might like to know of: Diane Robertson from the Auckland City Mission, Major Campbell Roberts from the Salvation Army, Brian Donnelly from the New Zealand Housing Foundation, and Paul White from iwi development. Here is what they said. In 2010 they had a report. They had 16 recommendations. One of them was about the importance of ensuring that they had a third sector that met the needs of the social sector market. That is what they said\u2014that is what they said. These are recommendations that have come from them. They said that there is no one silver bullet or magic bullet that will solve the problems. New Zealand must come up to international standards. That is the reason why they made the recommendations. There is the third sector, the housing sector, which truly can make a difference to the sector as well. Here is why it is really important. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000400\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022695678cf-542a-4616-9e0a-86990caec192\u0022\u003EThe second thing members opposite did was talk about income-related rents. Annette King talked about the 61,000 State house tenants, and, yes, there are 4,800 who pay market rents. But do we know the number of people who are on a priority listing\u2014those who come to our constituency offices, those who see us with absolute need? The number is 3,851. So tell me this. If you are concerned about the needs of those who are most in need, why would you not want to provide for them? For those who can, they should. That is what this review is doing. That is what this Social Housing Reform (Housing Restructuring and Tenancy Matters Amendment) Bill is doing. This is a bill that is absolutely meeting their needs. It has consulted and it has engaged with those who absolutely know. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000401\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022695678cf-542a-4616-9e0a-86990caec192\u0022\u003EWe support this bill. We support this bill because it is a good bill, which the Minister of Housing has put forward. I recommend this bill to the House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00225db0a23e-1579-44c6-9194-76e34cf5ae99\u0022 data-id=\u0022fd2b7e50e87f40699d4d270c2da33318\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000402\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225db0a23e-1579-44c6-9194-76e34cf5ae99\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022fd2b7e50e87f40699d4d270c2da33318\u0022\u003EDr RAJEN PRASAD (Labour):\u003C/span\u003E There is so much here that two or three members opposite have talked about that I could spend the next hour taking each one of those things apart. In speaking to this bill, the Social Housing Reform (Housing Restructuring and Tenancy Matters Amendment) Bill, I start with this question: why did Phil Heatley lose his job? Why did he lose his job? Because he was no good. He was no good, and today he reminds us about gang members in State houses.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000403\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225b6b1d74-9e5e-42ba-a922-85b0ea7f5ab6\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00229f1d603e59504af1a1635df9af1d546b\u0022\u003ESimon O\u2019Connor\u003C/span\u003E: I raise a point of order, Mr Speaker. I believe he is trying to huff and puff and blow the House down. I just wish he would quieten a bit for the hearing\u2019s sake. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000404\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f4112fc5-c53f-4aa9-bf6d-5a05ce6252cf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002284bf1e12d0d94455a0ad18daaa83b79f\u0022\u003EMr DEPUTY SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Order! That is not helpful. It is not a point of order. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000405\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022badb0a39-849c-462a-b32f-77fc017c9fc2\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022c52784d4b1084d548978f540af517d59\u0022\u003EHon Simon Bridges\u003C/span\u003E: Oh, this is the best speech!\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000406\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225db0a23e-1579-44c6-9194-76e34cf5ae99\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00222ce281bb90144d6486db6011a837a261\u0022\u003EDr RAJEN PRASAD\u003C/span\u003E: Well, that member is never helpful. And neither is that other\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000407\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f4112fc5-c53f-4aa9-bf6d-5a05ce6252cf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00223d49a4eee74c47d3b981d6498f870b1c\u0022\u003EMr DEPUTY SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Order! \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000408\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225db0a23e-1579-44c6-9194-76e34cf5ae99\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00225c6181eb4aa64c4186b8411c034a3440\u0022\u003EDr RAJEN PRASAD\u003C/span\u003E: I am sorry, Mr Speaker.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000409\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f4112fc5-c53f-4aa9-bf6d-5a05ce6252cf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002255f372d228184f6f97ee96eaf30ca343\u0022\u003EMr DEPUTY SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Members should not assume things. I now call Rajen Prasad.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000410\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225db0a23e-1579-44c6-9194-76e34cf5ae99\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022442b3155292c4df380a54e9233668fe2\u0022\u003EDr RAJEN PRASAD\u003C/span\u003E: On this side of the House, Mr Speaker, we are just so good at anticipating, so my apologies. I want to ask the Hon Annette King this question: where are those gang people whom Phil Heatley tried to eject? They are still in the State houses. They have not left. That is where they are. Phil Heatley was the Minister of Housing, and what he tried to do was very interesting. He was the person who said the Labour Government was a slum landlord. That was his entire housing policy\u2014his entire housing policy\u2014and it is no wonder he got the sack. Then he said: \u201CWell, let\u2019s put some more light bulbs in.\u201D and things like that; not \u201CLet\u2019s build houses\u201D\u2014nothing like that. There was no real appreciation of the problem of those who are not housed. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000411\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225db0a23e-1579-44c6-9194-76e34cf5ae99\u0022\u003ESo Phil Heatley was the Minister of Housing, and then he was gone. Then the Hon Annette King, as the Opposition spokesperson on housing, and the wonderful Phil Twyford began to really develop a housing policy that had some resonance. It was a housing policy about which people out there began to say: \u201CLook, this makes sense. This is what we need to do.\u201D All of a sudden the Government fired Phil Heatley and brought in the next spin merchant, the current Minister of Housing, and that is all that that Minister has been doing.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000412\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002209a5b71a-ca7e-4e7c-9e09-f9e63f18aa12\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00225418154c5ac54a8e9dfd49ce014e4dea\u0022\u003EHon Annette King\u003C/span\u003E: He\u2019s going to go.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000413\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225db0a23e-1579-44c6-9194-76e34cf5ae99\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022967e7174d288443e8b1d87f914e25e47\u0022\u003EDr RAJEN PRASAD\u003C/span\u003E: He is going to go\u2014absolutely. It must be his time to go. But I want to remind those three National members who spoke and are still in the House, including the last person who spoke, my friend Melissa Lee, that it was National that sold 13,000 State houses in the 1990s\u201413,000 State houses in the 1990s. It did not build; it just sold. That is the curse of that particular ideology that that side of the House internalises. So, really, when it comes to housing and a housing programme, it is about building, it is about working with other people, and it is about make sure that we actually give people a home. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000414\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225db0a23e-1579-44c6-9194-76e34cf5ae99\u0022\u003ENow, all of a sudden, the Government is interested. Of the two bills it brought to the House, one was to bully the councils, particularly Auckland Council, about accords. \u201CIf you don\u2019t do it, we will make you do it.\u201D, is what the Government said. So here is\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000415\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221368ba6c-25be-40f6-a2a0-8f81e1f78b79\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022b3fb1d34e0854289a710e193b038f8c6\u0022\u003EHon Chris Tremain\u003C/span\u003E: How are you going to push through 10,000 houses a year? I hope you don\u2019t have to bully the council.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000416\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225db0a23e-1579-44c6-9194-76e34cf5ae99\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022f8bd9261cc674f8c905fa57838cf71df\u0022\u003EDr RAJEN PRASAD\u003C/span\u003E: Well, I tell you, it is the Auckland Council\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000417\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221368ba6c-25be-40f6-a2a0-8f81e1f78b79\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00227757de3caefb486da07584950deea8a4\u0022\u003EHon Chris Tremain\u003C/span\u003E: How are you going to push 10,000 houses through a year without bullying the Auckland Council?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000418\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225db0a23e-1579-44c6-9194-76e34cf5ae99\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00228c461c7914f349b29d75c90f60c92f3f\u0022\u003EDr RAJEN PRASAD\u003C/span\u003E: I ask the Hon Chris Tremain to go back and read the bill, because there is an override provision. That is how that bill would override the council. The Government would bully them. It is called the override provision, Mr Tremain. I do not think that that member knows the other Act that was passed, because if he did, he would not be raising those rather inane points. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000419\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002209a5b71a-ca7e-4e7c-9e09-f9e63f18aa12\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00227b3b71be89274a39b4f52c18fd8bf3cb\u0022\u003EHon Annette King\u003C/span\u003E: He\u2019s gone.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000420\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225db0a23e-1579-44c6-9194-76e34cf5ae99\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022192d9b2789eb4c22a0cca2109e36fb60\u0022\u003EDr RAJEN PRASAD\u003C/span\u003E: He has gone. He has gone too. Well, he has definitely gone\u2014honourable retirement, I think it was. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000421\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225db0a23e-1579-44c6-9194-76e34cf5ae99\u0022\u003EThe other point I want to make is about renewable tenancies. Renewable tenancies sound very good, and if they were that good they would be widely supported. I tell members opposite to be very cautious with renewable tenancies, because the system that is designed in this bill, the Social Housing Reform (Housing Restructuring and Tenancy Matters Amendment) Bill, is a blunt instrument\u2014[Interruption]\u2014Mr Ngaro. It is a blunt instrument and the member should recognise it, because that member\u2019s own people will suffer as a result of what this particular bill is going to do. It will be the most vulnerable who will be assessed every year, and who will they be? They will be the vulnerable and they will be the elderly, and these are easy pickings, Mr Ngaro.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000422\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022e733d99962d041f6a29a794ae22d36ae\u0022\u003EHon Member\u003C/span\u003E: Easy targets.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000423\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225db0a23e-1579-44c6-9194-76e34cf5ae99\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002242e5d2b8b9254df3850d206b7c1ae168\u0022\u003EDr RAJEN PRASAD\u003C/span\u003E: Easy targets. Of course, this Government does not have any development plans. It really goes just for the easy targets. This is another version of its punitive approach to welfare. That is what it is. If the Government was really concerned that there are a number of people who are taking advantage of the housing system, it would come up with a well-thought-out proposal that could really begin to say: \u201CWell, let\u2019s go and have a look at those. Let\u2019s see who they are, and let\u2019s see whether we can enable them to buy the house, get into a home, etc.\u201D We on this side of the House would not object to that at all, because that would mean people being housed in their own homes. That is what a decent society does, Mr Ngaro. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000424\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225db0a23e-1579-44c6-9194-76e34cf5ae99\u0022\u003EThere is so much I could go on about in this particular bill. That side has not made the argument. This is another punitive piece of legislation. Of course, when we are in Government\u2014after November next year; almost a year from today\u2014we will have to fix these things up, Mr Ngaro. As I said, that is what we will have to do. On that note, I will finish. Thank you.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022721a14ca-e9d5-4c2e-b3ef-03d03e4fea07\u0022 data-id=\u0022ed1236a8ef2c44cbbaf4f29d545e9e5b\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000425\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022721a14ca-e9d5-4c2e-b3ef-03d03e4fea07\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022ed1236a8ef2c44cbbaf4f29d545e9e5b\u0022\u003EMIKE SABIN (National\u2014Northland):\u003C/span\u003E It is very hard to follow such a commanding performance from my Social Services Committee colleague Dr Rajen Prasad, but I will not trifle with the House as much as he did and waste the time of this very, very important place of parliamentary business. But I will recognise the work of the Hon Nick Smith and the work of a National Government, which actually is prepared to tackle the issues.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000426\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022721a14ca-e9d5-4c2e-b3ef-03d03e4fea07\u0022\u003EThere are lots of protestations and there are lots of hand-wringing over a glass of chardonnay or two from those in this House who are quick to throw stones but not that quick to bring solutions forward. This situation with housing\u2014in particular, in areas like Auckland\u2014has been in the making for some significant amount of time. But the difference between this National Government, this National Party, and the Labour Party and the opposing parties, the parties that oppose this legislation, the Social Housing Reform (Housing Restructuring and Tenancy Matters Amendment) Bill, is that we act. We act in a measure that brings a suite of opportunities to the fore. There is no one single solution to the crisis\u2014if we can call it that\u2014that is confronting the community. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000427\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022721a14ca-e9d5-4c2e-b3ef-03d03e4fea07\u0022\u003EWhen push comes to shove, what the New Zealand public have recognised\u2014try as those members might to manufacture a crisis and to jump up and down like Turkey Lurkey, saying that the sky is falling down\u2014and what they find when they look at the polls is that not much has actually changed since the 2011 election. Not much has changed at all. The reason for that is that Kiwis have woken up to the difference between do-ey and hui. There is a whole lot of talk and not a lot of walk coming from the Opposition. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000428\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022721a14ca-e9d5-4c2e-b3ef-03d03e4fea07\u0022\u003ESo I commend the work that has been done by the Minister. I also want to acknowledge all select committee members. Although we did not necessarily agree, we worked through this legislation. It is a good piece of legislation. It is a good step and a good measure amongst many that this National Government is bringing in to deal with this problem.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022b2567d3e-a09c-47b4-bd50-2f5bb4049762\u0022 data-id=\u002220e56d5c062545a78e2a4c6ff0d170bd\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000429\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b2567d3e-a09c-47b4-bd50-2f5bb4049762\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002220e56d5c062545a78e2a4c6ff0d170bd\u0022\u003ESUE MORONEY (Labour):\u003C/span\u003E It is a pleasure to rise to speak to the Social Housing Reform (Housing Restructuring and Tenancy Matters Amendment) Bill, only in order to give the position of the New Zealand Labour Party, which has had a very long, strong track record of actually developing and improving our social housing in New Zealand, and just to place on record that every single time it is the National Government that starts to undermine the fabric of our really important housing sector. I do want to draw a bit of an analogy around some things that have happened in the past that are a little similar to this, because it is a warning that I want to make sure people hear. It is related to the history of things that were once State provided, then becoming run by very well-meaning non-governmental organisations\u2014very well-meaning but under-resourced non-governmental organisations\u2014then ending up in private hands. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000430\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b2567d3e-a09c-47b4-bd50-2f5bb4049762\u0022\u003EThe example I want to share with the New Zealand public, when we think about this issue, is actually what has happened in the rest home sector in the last 25 years. Once upon a time, right here in New Zealand, rest homes were, by and large, owned and operated by the State. That is right. It was actually the Government that owned and operated those important institutions that take care of some of the most vulnerable in our society. At a point in time\u2014I think it was probably in the 1980s that this started\u2014very well-meaning non-governmental organisations, mainly religious and welfare organisations, put their hands up and said they would like to be involved in providing that care. The Government of the day said: \u201CThat\u2019s great. We will gift you, pretty much, without any cost to you, these rest home buildings as long as you run the services. We are going to give that over to you.\u201D That seemed like an entirely reasonable and rational thing to do at the time, although some of us protested it at that stage. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000431\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b2567d3e-a09c-47b4-bd50-2f5bb4049762\u0022\u003EBut what happened next was what some of us had predicted for some time, which was that these very well-meaning organisations did not actually have the capability and the capacity to do the job in the way they really wanted to. Because they were religious and welfare organisations, they really wanted to take care of the vulnerable and the elderly to a very high standard. And when they found that they were not able to do that, many of them actually got out of providing rest home care. What did that mean? It meant selling to the private sector. So in a very short period of time, we had what were once upon a time State-owned and State-operated rest home facilities changing hands to become almost entirely privatised. And that is the state of that sector today. Why am I talking about that with regard to this piece of legislation?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000432\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022badb0a39-849c-462a-b32f-77fc017c9fc2\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002224e216709878423dadca0c61a5bf1785\u0022\u003EHon Simon Bridges\u003C/span\u003E: I don\u2019t know.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000433\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b2567d3e-a09c-47b4-bd50-2f5bb4049762\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a150a72ad30746b2aa3cff6356ebe421\u0022\u003ESUE MORONEY\u003C/span\u003E: Simon Bridges cannot understand the analogy. I am just going to join the dots for Mr Bridges now. It is because that is exactly one of the things that is being proposed in this piece of legislation. What is being proposed is that Housing New Zealand properties can actually now become transferred into the non-governmental organisation sector. That seems like that might work very, very well. I know that those organisations had the best interests of their community at heart. They did when they started owning and operating rest homes, yet they found that over a period of time they could not sustain it in a way they wanted to. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000434\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b2567d3e-a09c-47b4-bd50-2f5bb4049762\u0022\u003EHere is my prediction. I made a few predictions yesterday on the Melbourne Cup and they did not come true. I hope these ones may not either. My prediction is that these same organisations will struggle to provide social housing to a standard that they actually feel good about. That could mean that this social housing ends up in the hands of developers. In fact, I have been pointing out exactly this situation recently in Hamilton, where the Hamilton City Council has basically sold\u2014not gifted but sold\u2014pensioner housing, once owned and operated by the ratepayer, to a very good non-governmental organisation, a very good community sector. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000435\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b2567d3e-a09c-47b4-bd50-2f5bb4049762\u0022\u003EI would actually support that if it was adding to the housing stock, and what I am really opposed to is when we have housing stock that already exists passing hands from being taxpayer owned and operated to the third sector and eventually ending up in private hands. That is a pathway to the privatisation of our important assets, but, more important, it is the handing on of these really important community commodities that help keep vulnerable people safe and healthy in our communities into the hands of corporates. It is never a good result when that happens. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000436\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b2567d3e-a09c-47b4-bd50-2f5bb4049762\u0022\u003EThe other reason why Labour is opposing this bill is that the bill will extend reviewable tenancies, which will see 3,000 people kicked out of their homes in the next 3 years\u20143,000 people\u2014despite the Government\u2019s promise that this will not apply to elderly or disabled New Zealanders. But how is the Government going to ensure that that is not going to happen? I cannot see in this piece of legislation how it can make sure that that is not going to happen to those 3,000 people. How is it going to ensure that those people are not going to be elderly or disabled New Zealanders? I do not believe that the bill addresses that at all. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000437\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b2567d3e-a09c-47b4-bd50-2f5bb4049762\u0022\u003ESo although this bill is good in parts, Labour cannot vote for a bill that will see senior citizens ejected from their homes. We cannot support a bill that will see some of the most vulnerable in our society ejected from their homes. Provisions to extend reviewable tenancies to all tenants will create needless stress, needless anxiety, and suffering for older New Zealanders, who are the people who least deserve such treatment and are less able to cope with it. We have seen no evidence that the Government has considered the likely health and social impacts of this provision. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000438\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b2567d3e-a09c-47b4-bd50-2f5bb4049762\u0022\u003ETenants in social housing are an extremely vulnerable group, who need a well-run social housing sector. A well-run social housing sector creates benefits for all New Zealanders, as we see the costs of homelessness and poverty on society reduced, but that is actually something that a Government should hold itself responsible for. Certainly, we here on the Opposition benches are absolutely determined to hold the Government accountable for ensuring that it looks after the most vulnerable in our society, but, sadly, what we see\u2014and this bill will contribute to it\u2014is the gap widening in New Zealand between the haves and the have-nots. The inequalities on a day-by-day basis are increasing in New Zealand, and it is through policies like this that those inequalities are increasing. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000439\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b2567d3e-a09c-47b4-bd50-2f5bb4049762\u0022\u003EThe Government seems to be in denial that there is even a housing crisis in parts of New Zealand. It does not seem to take this issue seriously. We had the Minister of Housing, Nick Smith, on his feet today in question time saying: \u201CWhat housing crisis?\u201D. Actually, he said that there were more houses being built than ever before. Never mind that most of them are replacing homes that have been wrecked by an earthquake\u2014homes that do not actually add anything to the housing stock in New Zealand at all; they are simply replacing that homes that were wrecked in a natural disaster. So here we have a Government whose head is in the sand about the housing crisis. Its head is in the sand about the needs of some of the most vulnerable New Zealanders in our community, and it has come up yet again with a bill that falls well short\u2014in fact, it has some very dangerous elements in it\u2014and could well make matters worse. I am proud to be part of a Labour Party that is opposing this bill.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022a68928ea-9dd8-4a30-8e2c-a0f49dfc8bea\u0022 data-id=\u00225734d7cc91ea47ac8c34cc35870d817d\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000440\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a68928ea-9dd8-4a30-8e2c-a0f49dfc8bea\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00225734d7cc91ea47ac8c34cc35870d817d\u0022\u003ELOUISE UPSTON (National\u2014Taup\u014D):\u003C/span\u003E The member Sue Moroney, who has just resumed her seat, has clearly misunderstood the clear intent of this piece of legislation, the Social Housing Reform (Housing Restructuring and Tenancy Matters Amendment) Bill, because she talked about the potential for 3,000 people to be removed from their houses. Well, the fact of the matter is that these are State houses, which are funded by taxpayers. It is the Government, it is this side of the House, that is tackling the real issue of making sure that the people who are the most vulnerable in our community have the right-sized house in the right place and in the right condition, which is more than members on that side of the House ever did. I am proud to support this bill.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca id=\u0022209573153c224a598a7ddba2c012c365\u0022 name=\u0022division\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EA party vote was called for on the question, That the Social Housing Reform (Housing Restructuring and Tenancy Matters Amendment) Bill be now read a second time.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EAyes 63\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand National 59; M\u0101ori Party 2; ACT New Zealand 1; United Future 1.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENoes 56\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand Labour 33; Green Party 14; New Zealand First 7; Mana 1; Independent: Horan.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EBill read a second time.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n    \u003C/div\u003E\n    \u003Cdiv class=\u0022HpsHansard\u0022\u003E\n      \u003Cp\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsProceedingHeading\u0022\u003EBills\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000441\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u0022bd0c43642d144e3782b559b9b72eb4ea\u0022\u003EInsolvency Practitioners Bill\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000442\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u0022c9b91f3f848b44e5b8d13a0280d70f9e\u0022\u003ESecond Reading\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000443\u0022\u003EDebate resumed from 15 October.\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022cc9c47c0-4409-44ca-ad2f-498707f27d69\u0022 data-id=\u00225da78072d7544750b0769ea6bcd665a8\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000444\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cc9c47c0-4409-44ca-ad2f-498707f27d69\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00225da78072d7544750b0769ea6bcd665a8\u0022\u003EJONATHAN YOUNG (National\u2014New Plymouth):\u003C/span\u003E The Insolvency Practitioners Bill has been through the Commerce Committee and is now here in its second reading, and I am very pleased to stand and speak on it. Insolvency practitioners are very important to our world of commerce, especially when a company hits the skids and things turn belly up. It is important that we have qualified, competent, trustworthy people of integrity who are going to work with that company and with the creditors to ensure that everything that can be recovered is recovered, especially for the sake of the creditors, who have money or stock, or whatever, owed to them by the company that gets into difficulty. In spite of their important role, insolvency practitioners are presently not required to be licensed or registered by a regulatory body, nor are they required to meet minimum qualifications, and we see this as something that needs to be changed. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000445\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cc9c47c0-4409-44ca-ad2f-498707f27d69\u0022\u003EWe know, of course, that the National-led Government has been focusing on boosting growth, creating jobs, building our economy, and bringing confidence back into the area of commerce and capital markets. It is important that we have the right regulation, and good-quality regulation, for these particular areas. It is important in this area that when companies become insolvent, when they get into trouble and they need to bring in an insolvency practitioner\u2014a liquidator\u2014this person is somebody who meets the standard. They should work in the interests not of the debtors, company directors, shareholders, or themselves but of the creditors, whom insolvency laws exist to serve, so they can recover as much money as possible. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000446\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cc9c47c0-4409-44ca-ad2f-498707f27d69\u0022\u003EI want to just briefly touch on a couple of areas that the Commerce Committee looked at. One of them is around the appointment of family members. You would think that this is a very strange thing, but it has happened in the past that a family member is appointed as the liquidator. That seems to be such an apparent conflict of interest that we have put in this bill an amendment that would disqualify from appointment as a liquidator a relative of a person who has been a shareholder, director, promoter, auditor, or receiver of the company or a related company within the 2 years immediately before the commencement of a liquidation. The term \u201Crelative\u201D would cover family members as defined by section 2 of the principal Act, the Companies Act, including in-laws and siblings. A similar amendment in the Receiverships Act would impose the same restrictions on receivers. There are other things, of course, in the bill that the Commerce Committee and members here today will speak on, but I think I have just touched on the points that I would like to today. Thank you. I commend this bill to the House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00222aa0b524-c38d-45aa-bd5b-99c5927085f4\u0022 data-id=\u002280e4f6fcc7b64c5d9e467638e1803000\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000447\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00222aa0b524-c38d-45aa-bd5b-99c5927085f4\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002280e4f6fcc7b64c5d9e467638e1803000\u0022\u003ECLARE CURRAN (Labour\u2014Dunedin South):\u003C/span\u003E There is no doubt that everyone in this House would agree that it is important to have people providing corporate insolvency services who can be trusted. We have provisions and legislation to ensure that the appointment of people who are providing other important services\u2014such as legal services, accountancy services, and certain financial services\u2014has a body of legislation underpinning it. So it is with those people who provide insolvency services. We need to ensure that we have measures in place and not act as the ambulance at the bottom of the cliff, trying to patch up a situation that has gone bad. We need to actually have some preventative measures in place to ensure that the people providing these services are of good character and of the appropriate skills, and that there are regulations and rules in place to ensure that this happens. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000448\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00222aa0b524-c38d-45aa-bd5b-99c5927085f4\u0022\u003EThat is what the Insolvency Practitioners Bill is about, and it is critical legislation. One of the reasons it is critical legislation is that there are so many insolvencies happening in this country. I think that is another point that is worth noting as context to this piece of legislation, because the supposedly wonderful economic environment in which we are operating is actually exposed as somewhat of a fallacy when you look at the number of insolvencies in New Zealand since 2008. They have actually increased dramatically under this Government. Therefore, having a piece of legislation in place to ensure that we have got an appropriate insolvency regime is even more critical. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000449\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00222aa0b524-c38d-45aa-bd5b-99c5927085f4\u0022\u003EBefore I get into the substance of this bill and actually what changed in the Commerce Committee, it is important to note how long it has taken for this piece of legislation to get to this point in the House. It is another example of important legislation, particularly in the commerce area, that has been languishing on our books for far too long. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000450\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00222aa0b524-c38d-45aa-bd5b-99c5927085f4\u0022\u003EThis bill was first introduced on 27 April 2010. Its first reading was on 24 August 2010. The select committee reported back, after doing very good work, on 9 May 2011. But the bill\u2019s second reading was first started on 26 September 2013. Today it is\u2014what is it? The seventh?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000451\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225db0a23e-1579-44c6-9194-76e34cf5ae99\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002256f881c2139a4aed88fa4bc7f9882a34\u0022\u003EDr Rajen Prasad\u003C/span\u003E: 7 November.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000452\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00222aa0b524-c38d-45aa-bd5b-99c5927085f4\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00226690908b870f45c79da2e4b0fb9e04e7\u0022\u003ECLARE CURRAN\u003C/span\u003E: It is 7 November, and we are back into the second reading. That is 3 years. That is an extraordinary amount of time for a piece of legislation like this\u2014particularly, as I said, in that environment where there have been so many insolvencies\u2014to come back to the House. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000453\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00222aa0b524-c38d-45aa-bd5b-99c5927085f4\u0022\u003EOur view is that this is just one of many bills that have not made it through all of their readings in the House in this commerce area, particularly bills around consumer legislation, of which this is one. This fits in with the stable of consumer protection laws that are just not being taken seriously enough by this Government. I do want to make that point in a very serious manner. I do hope that those on the other side of the House are paying attention to that. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000454\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00222aa0b524-c38d-45aa-bd5b-99c5927085f4\u0022\u003EThe other point that needs to be made is that the bill that has come back to this House is quite different from the bill that was actually originally introduced. There are some very good reasons for that. It is important to just outline what the reasons were. The bill, when it was originally introduced, proposed a negative licensing regime for insolvency practitioners\u2014essentially a blacklist. So if you were a dodgy insolvency practitioner\u2014never you, Mr Deputy Speaker. That was a much wider sort of concept of the\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000455\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223facbb72-b3b0-464b-b24d-e6de0616f323\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00220e7f5585fe55467da2b07bcab8ec9d38\u0022\u003ECarol Beaumont\u003C/span\u003E: More like Jonathan Young was, perhaps. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000456\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00222aa0b524-c38d-45aa-bd5b-99c5927085f4\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00221237dff2b6fe4d80aad3b80724a20d32\u0022\u003ECLARE CURRAN\u003C/span\u003E: No, no, no\u2014I would not like to cast aspersions on anyone in this House, and certainly not you, Mr Deputy Speaker, being a person of high integrity and all that. But, hypothetically speaking, if there did happen to be a dodgy practitioner in the area of insolvency, then this bill would have created what is called a negative licensing regime for liquidators, receivers, and voluntary administrators who did not meet the required standard of competence. They then would have been banned or placed under supervision. That sounds like a sensible set of measures. That would have empowered the Registrar of Companies to maintain a publicly accessible electronic register of people who have been banned or placed under supervision. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000457\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00222aa0b524-c38d-45aa-bd5b-99c5927085f4\u0022\u003EOn the face of it that seemed like the sensible approach to take but as soon as this Insolvency Practitioners Bill got before the Commerce Committee there was a range of submissions and in-depth discussion, which both sides of that committee took part in. There was robust discussion, and it was constructive discussion. Ultimately that report has come back, and this is where the legislation is at. It has been found that it would be much more preferable to prevent practitioners. So \u201Cprevent\u201D is the important word here, Mr Deputy Speaker, just in case you are interested. It would prevent those practitioners who would be restricted or prohibited from providing a corporate solvency service before they undertake those insolvency duties. So they actually have to be certified as being of good character, as having the required skills, and as being appropriate to act and to provide insolvency services before they actually offer those services, instead of waiting for the damage to be done. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000458\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00222aa0b524-c38d-45aa-bd5b-99c5927085f4\u0022\u003ESo it is a proactive set of measures, as opposed to a reactive set of measures. That makes a lot more sense, and I think everybody, pretty much, agreed with that. That is why Labour is supporting this bill. But I want to make the point that that work\u2014and it is important to make this point because a lot of the good work of this Parliament does go on in select committees. There are times when much better laws get made because there is robust and constructive discussion amongst all parties. It would be great if those sorts of processes were on display more to the public. I note that there is a trial being undertaken at the moment in our Parliament in two of our select committees, where the workings of those select committees are being webcast to the public. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000459\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00222aa0b524-c38d-45aa-bd5b-99c5927085f4\u0022\u003EI fully support that, as one of the members who has advocated for that, along with, actually, my Green counterpart Gareth Hughes and National counterpart Nikki Kaye. We advocated for there to be more public viewing of select committee processes. This is one that may not seem to be a sexy piece of legislation that is being negotiated, but this is one example where the public would have been able to see how some of that good work is being done in the select committee. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000460\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00222aa0b524-c38d-45aa-bd5b-99c5927085f4\u0022\u003EWe certainly support this legislation. We note that it has been rewritten, pretty much, at the select committee. We also note, and criticise quite strongly, the length of time that it has taken to come back to this House, and hope that it will proceed with some rapidity through its final stages. We certainly think that the legislation has merit, that it needs to get passed into law, and that it needs to be put into practice.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022e959f20f-3de7-4f54-8577-8ea78d72c3dd\u0022 data-id=\u0022ff4047cc85634bd69ed53d37a5195a76\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000461\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e959f20f-3de7-4f54-8577-8ea78d72c3dd\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022ff4047cc85634bd69ed53d37a5195a76\u0022\u003EDAVID CLENDON (Green):\u003C/span\u003E I would just like to begin by echoing our Labour colleague Clare Curran\u2019s comments about the rather leisurely progress of this bill, the Insolvency Practitioners Bill, through the House. Some 3\u00BD years ago it was introduced and had its first reading. I was on the Commerce Committee at the time. I have to say that there was a sense of urgency in that this was one of a raft of pieces of legislation that were seen as being important and needing to be passed. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000462\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e959f20f-3de7-4f54-8577-8ea78d72c3dd\u0022\u003EI think that credit for this bill belongs to the former Minister of Commerce, Mr Power\u2014he has now left this Chamber, of course\u2014and, if my memory serves, it is one of a series of bills that Simon Power put in place to put some regulation around the finance sector generally. We saw what happens when finance sectors remain unregulated. We all paid an enormous cost\u2014some more than others. Lots of people lost money when they ought not to have done. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000463\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e959f20f-3de7-4f54-8577-8ea78d72c3dd\u0022\u003EMr Power, to his credit, put in place a raft of bills to put some reins onto the finance sector. I think it is fair to say that this is one of those bills, so one would hope that we will see this bill through all its readings and passed before its fourth birthday. It will become enacted into law and enable a sensible regime to go into place around this reasonably important, albeit small-scale, area of finance\u2014the insolvency practitioners. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000464\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e959f20f-3de7-4f54-8577-8ea78d72c3dd\u0022\u003EThe Greens opposed this legislation at its first reading because it created a negative licensing system. It was the classic example of parking an ambulance squarely at the bottom of a cliff, the idea being that we would wait until people offended, until they failed to provide good service, inevitably at some considerable cost to the stakeholders in an insolvency, be they the creditors, the owners, or whomever. The idea was that when they were proven to be incompetent, dishonest, or whatever it might be, they would go on a blacklist and would be either obliged to practise under supervision or banned from practising for some longer or shorter period of time. We, frankly, did not see the sense in that. The argument was that a negative licence system was appropriate, because to create a positive registration model would be inappropriate, given that at the time it was believed that there were fewer than 100 practitioners, and that there would be costs involved in creating and managing a register and all of these things. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000465\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e959f20f-3de7-4f54-8577-8ea78d72c3dd\u0022\u003EWe saw then that the notion of short-term cost savings certainly did not compensate for the long-term risk that it would impose on people needing the service of these practitioners; the almost inevitability that at least some of them would lack the experience, the competence, and the integrity to do a good job for their client, for their customer. So we opposed this legislation in the belief that what we actually needed was an upfront and positive accreditation or registration system. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000466\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e959f20f-3de7-4f54-8577-8ea78d72c3dd\u0022\u003EI am very pleased to say that in the course of the Commerce Committee\u2019s consideration of the bill the logic of that position became acknowledged by all parties. What we see now is a piece of legislation that does establish an upfront accreditation model, where people will be obliged to demonstrate their skills, and the correct attitude, the competency, and the integrity that really we need to see. I mean, it would be odd if we allowed auditors or accountants, or even real estate agents or tradespeople, to operate without some form of accreditation, and we saw no reason why insolvency practitioners should be any different. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000467\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e959f20f-3de7-4f54-8577-8ea78d72c3dd\u0022\u003ESo I am pleased to say that given the almost 180-degree shift that has occurred in the drafting of the model that is now proposed in this bill, the Greens, from now on, will be quite happy to support this legislation. We will oppose what we think is bad legislation. As I said, the select committee did a good job. It listened to the overwhelming majority of submitters who said: \u201CHey, why are we doing it this way? Why not do a positive accreditation model?\u201D. We have gone to that, and for that reason the Greens are very happy to support the bill from here on in, through later readings. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000468\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e959f20f-3de7-4f54-8577-8ea78d72c3dd\u0022\u003EIn terms of the substance of the bill, I probably need not dwell too long on that this late on a Thursday. It is a fairly straightforward piece of legislation now, and it does create a process for accreditation, for recognition, of practitioners. It also creates a process for removing the accreditation of those people if there is malpractice, or a lack of integrity or honesty, or whatever it might be. Their registration can be cancelled, and, of course, that is entirely appropriate. There are appropriate penalties put in place. So without dwelling on that any further, I am pleased to say that the Greens will support this bill, and I commend it to the House. Kia ora.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00226dc89bbf-c2ef-45c9-89e4-d2b5952d8d16\u0022 data-id=\u0022c4dce43207604a549be8cda1f387cb3b\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000469\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226dc89bbf-c2ef-45c9-89e4-d2b5952d8d16\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022c4dce43207604a549be8cda1f387cb3b\u0022\u003EKANWALJIT SINGH BAKSHI (National):\u003C/span\u003E I will take a short call on the Insolvency Practitioners Bill, another piece of legislation that is helping the business community\u2019s confidence. It is the intention of the Government to progress this bill as soon as possible. I commend this bill to the House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022 data-id=\u00228a3955b4de4b4f96ad57ed985753ef9b\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000470\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00228a3955b4de4b4f96ad57ed985753ef9b\u0022\u003EGRANT ROBERTSON (Labour\u2014Wellington Central):\u003C/span\u003E I am going to take just a very brief call on the Insolvency Practitioners Bill, to echo the comments made by my colleague Clare Curran, firstly to make the point that there has been very slow and sluggish progress from the Government in terms of putting this bill through its stages. As David Clendon has just said, the Commerce Committee did a very good job with the bill, and the Government could have got on and passed this significantly more quickly than it has, and it is unfortunate that it did not. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000471\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003EMore broadly, on the substance of the bill we do support the initiatives to tidy up issues in the insolvency area. Nobody likes to see the kinds of dodgy practices that have bedevilled the finance industry in recent times, particularly regarding people whose life-savings have gone down the gurgler as a result of the actions of people who do behave outside the law. Anything we can do to improve practice in that area and ensure that people know that their finances are secure is something that we should all support. I also commend the bill to the House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00225bbd9f26-fdb0-4b85-a836-0fc46e1bba3c\u0022 data-id=\u00227ba084a7cb904dd5a9498025e55a0367\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000472\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225bbd9f26-fdb0-4b85-a836-0fc46e1bba3c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00227ba084a7cb904dd5a9498025e55a0367\u0022\u003EDr DAVID CLARK (Labour\u2014Dunedin North):\u003C/span\u003E I am keen to speak to the Insolvency Practitioners Bill because it goes back to the brilliant work done by Lianne Dalziel when she was Minister of Commerce. She is, of course, now in another office. She finds herself down in Christchurch sorting out some of the mess down there. The unfortunate thing, I guess, about this bill is that we find ourselves in a position where 2 years, 4 months, and 18 days, I am told, after the bill was reported back, it is receiving its second reading.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000473\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225db0a23e-1579-44c6-9194-76e34cf5ae99\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022f211bdba03854173be542d3dec9c368f\u0022\u003EDr Rajen Prasad\u003C/span\u003E: How many hours and minutes?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000474\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225bbd9f26-fdb0-4b85-a836-0fc46e1bba3c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022b607fb5fe04d452aa0f494a5eebdb092\u0022\u003EDr DAVID CLARK\u003C/span\u003E: I am not clear on the number of hours and minutes, which my colleague is asking about. The current Minister of Commerce has five bills on the Order Paper that were introduced before 2012, and here we are, again doing something that we will support because we think it is good progress, but it is very slow progress. That is a sign, I think, of a Government that is distracted. It is busy worrying about scandals in the police, it is worrying about the Chorus copper pricing, it is worrying about Skycity deals, and it is worrying about getting the Government Communications Security Bureau legislation and the Telecommunications (Interception Capability and Security) Bill through.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000475\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225db0a23e-1579-44c6-9194-76e34cf5ae99\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00224151e2c1ba7e4d2898b9aa5c5b5fb17c\u0022\u003EDr Rajen Prasad\u003C/span\u003E: Simon Bridges.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000476\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225bbd9f26-fdb0-4b85-a836-0fc46e1bba3c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00223946fda5ff78467bb36f0bf8b9f4a260\u0022\u003EDr DAVID CLARK\u003C/span\u003E: It may well be worried about Simon Bridges and his media appearances. That is probably beyond the scope of this bill, but only slightly\u2014only slightly. It is only slightly beyond the scope of this bill.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000477\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022f7afb219eac4467d82b2329ddd740bef\u0022\u003EGrant Robertson\u003C/span\u003E: He\u2019s nearly insolvent.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000478\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225bbd9f26-fdb0-4b85-a836-0fc46e1bba3c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022dae288c80eed45b085945e83099dd4f1\u0022\u003EDr DAVID CLARK\u003C/span\u003E: My colleague suggests he might nearly be insolvent. This bill is to restrict or prohibit certain individuals from providing corporate insolvency services. We would support appropriate measures in that area. These are common-sense steps, and obviously this legislation has a long history in coming to this point. The new system will apply to liquidators, administrators, and receivers, and will target those practitioners who lack the requisite skills and knowledge to undertake insolvency work competently or who perform badly in this field of work. It is very hard to disagree with that proposition. Why would you want these people operating in this area? \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000479\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225bbd9f26-fdb0-4b85-a836-0fc46e1bba3c\u0022\u003ESupporting the new system, there will be tighter statutory disqualification criteria and wider court powers to replace a practitioner who has a conflict of interest and lacks independence in a particular insolvency case. The reforms will enhance transparency and accountability. Those are values that we on this side of the House take very seriously. We do question whether these values could not be applied perhaps a little more consistently by the other side of the House. I am reminded of the recent debate on the New Zealand International Convention Centre Bill, where transparency was very much a secondary consideration in that tender process, and we have seen a very poor outcome for taxpayers. I am sure that we will see more than one or two insolvencies result from that legislation, in which the burden of the Skycity Casino rebuild is paid for off the back of problem gambling. That is something that many of us on this side of the House opposed\u2014in fact, I think all of us did. It was a conscience vote, but, as far as I am aware, people on this side of the House opposed it universally, because we believe that decisions made in that way and decisions around funding new initiatives\u2014convention centres, be what they will\u2014should be done in a transparent way. They should not be deals done behind closed doors, and they should be done transparently and with accountability. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000480\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225bbd9f26-fdb0-4b85-a836-0fc46e1bba3c\u0022\u003EWe do praise the Government for undertaking reforms that are aligned with transparency and accountability in this respect. It should be praised when it gets things right. Goodness knows, on this side of the House, we see that there are rich pickings for a Government that wants to do deals with the likes of Chorus, Skycity, and other big interests. We on this side of the House prefer transparency and accountability, and we will continue to fight for that.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000481\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225b6b1d74-9e5e-42ba-a922-85b0ea7f5ab6\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002268c2f52e29eb4dac903737968305980e\u0022\u003ESimon O\u2019Connor\u003C/span\u003E: You do deals with the unions, Dr Clark.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000482\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225bbd9f26-fdb0-4b85-a836-0fc46e1bba3c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00220a390504dae5412f8c66608c9b89008e\u0022\u003EDr DAVID CLARK\u003C/span\u003E: The member opposite suggests deals with the unions. That is really getting off track. It has nothing to do with this particular bill. I am sure the member is coming from somewhere, but just where that is, is a mystery to those of us over here\u2014his own special place. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000483\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225bbd9f26-fdb0-4b85-a836-0fc46e1bba3c\u0022\u003EThe investigation and enforcement of the new Register of Insolvency Practitioners will be managed by the Registrar of Companies. Again, that is a sensible step. The Registrar of Companies will also be able to take action against an insolvency practitioner who has not behaved appropriately. Again, there is little to disagree with in that. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000484\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225bbd9f26-fdb0-4b85-a836-0fc46e1bba3c\u0022\u003EThe bill as originally introduced proposed a negative licensing regime for insolvency practitioners, liquidators, receivers, and voluntary administrators. Insolvency practitioners who did not meet the required standard of competence would have been banned or placed under supervision. It would have empowered the Registrar of Companies to maintain a publicly accessible electronic register of people who had been banned or placed under supervision. The Commerce Committee report found that it would be preferable to prevent practitioners who would be restricted or prohibited from providing corporate insolvency services before undertaking insolvency duties, instead of waiting until the damage is done. Effectively, then, the bill was completely rewritten in the select committee. The bill that we have before us does seem to achieve those basic aims.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000485\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225bbd9f26-fdb0-4b85-a836-0fc46e1bba3c\u0022\u003EI return to the point, though, that it is a long time since it was introduced. It does not seem to be a priority for this Government to address these measures, which are about accountability and transparency. Indeed, on this side of the House we would strongly favour decisions that were a little more often taken in line with accountability and transparency. So with those concluding comments, I wish to say that Labour will support this bill through its second reading, and wish you a very good weekend, Mr Deputy Speaker, when you get there.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000486\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f4112fc5-c53f-4aa9-bf6d-5a05ce6252cf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022c16467c56be64f9e8c1e7c905e90722c\u0022\u003EMr DEPUTY SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Thank you.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000487\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f4112fc5-c53f-4aa9-bf6d-5a05ce6252cf\u0022\u003EBill read a second time.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n    \u003C/div\u003E\n    \u003Cdiv class=\u0022HpsHansard\u0022\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000488\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsProceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u00222193c87ca1374101bdef5aa4c6293b96\u0022\u003ESittings of the House\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000490\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u00223ade5bf365e94bebbe24ecc7530289bf\u0022\u003ESittings of the House\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022f4112fc5-c53f-4aa9-bf6d-5a05ce6252cf\u0022 data-id=\u002266d8812037484e50990328d0b538d11b\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000489\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f4112fc5-c53f-4aa9-bf6d-5a05ce6252cf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002266d8812037484e50990328d0b538d11b\u0022\u003EMr DEPUTY SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: As Government order of the day No. 4 is for the House to go into Committee, and we have passed the time of reporting, it only behoves me to declare that the House will stand adjourned until 2 p.m. on Tuesday, 12 November 2013. May you all have a good weekend.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000491\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f4112fc5-c53f-4aa9-bf6d-5a05ce6252cf\u0022\u003EThe House adjourned at 5.55 p.m.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20131107b32304f53da24407b7f9227de63cbe4d000492\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f4112fc5-c53f-4aa9-bf6d-5a05ce6252cf\u0022\u003E\u003Cbr\u003E\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n    \u003C/div\u003E\n  \u003C/body\u003E\n\u003C/html\u003E"