"\u003C!DOCTYPE html\u003E\u003Chtml xmlns:xlink=\u0022http://www.w3.org/1999/xlink\u0022 xmlns:xsi=\u0022http://www.w3.org/2007/XMLSchema-instance\u0022 xmlns:mml=\u0022http://www.w3.org/1998/Math/MathML\u0022\u003E\n  \u003Chead\u003E\n    \u003CMETA http-equiv=\u0022Content-Type\u0022 content=\u0022text/html; charset=utf-16\u0022\u003E\n    \u003Cmeta name=\u0022viewport\u0022 content=\u0022width=device-width, initial-scale=1\u0022\u003E\n  \u003C/head\u003E\n  \u003Cbody style=\u0022font-family:sans-serif; font-size:100%;\u0022\u003E\n    \u003Cdiv class=\u0022HpsHansard\u0022\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000001\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsProceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u002288677d9d91e848d9be9f50cad8d5d876\u0022\u003ETUESDAY, 9 December 2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000003\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u002244b70ab238ae44898e6dc0b20fddde5f\u0022\u003ETUESDAY, 9 December 2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000002\u0022\u003EMr Speaker took the Chair at 2 p.m.\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000004\u0022\u003EPrayers.\u003C/p\u003E\n    \u003C/div\u003E\n    \u003Cdiv class=\u0022HpsHansard\u0022\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000005\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsProceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u0022650f79fcf8ef47968856a977e8a7f788\u0022\u003EOral Questions\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000006\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u0022bda4b49365ed4232996e15b9d3860bb9\u0022\u003EQuestions to Ministers\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000007\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u002279333d51968040239b9e7a5ae377514b\u0022\u003EFinancial Systems\u2014Stability\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00225634618f-04f4-4f2c-a4bb-6ec0edeb2bf5\u0022 data-id=\u0022cce766176a454255b7bc0498e0b85fad\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000008\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225634618f-04f4-4f2c-a4bb-6ec0edeb2bf5\u0022\u003E1. \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022cce766176a454255b7bc0498e0b85fad\u0022\u003EJONO NAYLOR (National)\u003C/span\u003E to the Minister of Finance: What reports has he received about the stability of New Zealand\u2019s financial system?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022bb158206-360b-4757-8d72-f7d0994e1fb3\u0022 data-id=\u0022c3eba9e0f07448c39c4478fbf10330e3\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000009\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bb158206-360b-4757-8d72-f7d0994e1fb3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022c3eba9e0f07448c39c4478fbf10330e3\u0022\u003EHon BILL ENGLISH (Minister of Finance):\u003C/span\u003E The Reserve Bank recently issued its 6-monthly Financial Stability Report, which I am sure all members have read. It concluded that New Zealand\u2019s financial system remains sound according to a range of measures. The banking system is well capitalised, funding and liquidity buffers are above required minimum levels, and non-performing loans continue to fall, which is good news because it means fewer businesses and people are defaulting on their loans. The Reserve Bank stress tests of all the major banks\u2019 portfolios over the past 6 months demonstrated that each bank has the capacity to manage a range of significant events.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000010\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225634618f-04f4-4f2c-a4bb-6ec0edeb2bf5\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00220c4f8f5bbc40413c9cd088ab2134d649\u0022\u003EJono Naylor\u003C/span\u003E: According to the Reserve Bank, what are some of the ongoing risks and challenges facing New Zealand\u2019s financial system?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000011\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bb158206-360b-4757-8d72-f7d0994e1fb3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022feb64e7bb1f14b1cbb4b1d1108cb5df3\u0022\u003EHon BILL ENGLISH\u003C/span\u003E: The Reserve Bank talked about four ongoing risks: imbalances in the housing market, which is really about the constraints on supply that are putting pressure on prices; high levels of indebtedness in the dairy sector, which has seen significant falls in global prices; the potential effects of a slow-down in the Chinese economy; and the banking sector\u2019s continued, although lesser, reliance on offshore funding. The bank says that these are the same risks it noted 6 months earlier, but that it regards the financial system as sufficiently sound to be resilient to the realisation of these risks.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000012\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225634618f-04f4-4f2c-a4bb-6ec0edeb2bf5\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a12fa903bcaf4382abbae026b955f182\u0022\u003EJono Naylor\u003C/span\u003E: What did the Reserve Bank say in its Financial Stability Report about the international economic environment and its possible impact on New Zealand?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000013\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bb158206-360b-4757-8d72-f7d0994e1fb3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022f6ca827b8b3f4a82bda4a7f9ab94ea87\u0022\u003EHon BILL ENGLISH\u003C/span\u003E: Part of the Reserve Bank\u2019s job is to assess the risks in the global economic environment. It noted that growth is firming in the US, prompting a gradual removal of monetary policy stimulus and, possibly, rising interest rates there. However, monetary policy is seen as remaining accommodating in Europe and Japan, both of which face weak outlooks for growth, if not recession, and it notes that in China a slowing housing market and tighter credit conditions have moderated growth. Overall, the global outlook is somewhat mixed, but our banking system and financial system are in good shape to handle any negative impacts from these risks.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000014\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225634618f-04f4-4f2c-a4bb-6ec0edeb2bf5\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022296b3c044edd427a970bd62b5b15c775\u0022\u003EJono Naylor\u003C/span\u003E: What other reports has he received regarding the better management of the financial system, and what impact will they have on New Zealand?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000015\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bb158206-360b-4757-8d72-f7d0994e1fb3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00227f7d491871564158999994fc0321d83c\u0022\u003EHon BILL ENGLISH\u003C/span\u003E: Over the weekend the Australian Financial System Inquiry reported. It made a number of recommendations to reduce financial system risk. For instance, it recommended that the four big Australian banks\u2014all of which have subsidiaries in New Zealand\u2014improve their capital ratios as a way of improving the resilience of these banks. It is worth noting that the capital requirements for New Zealand banks are already at, or above, the levels recommended by the Australian Financial System Inquiry. Our requirements are relatively conservative when compared with banks from other countries. That means that steps that may be taken by the Australian Government to strengthen its banking system further will help to reinforce the strength of the New Zealand banking system.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000016\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022f6ebaa99e3d9414caf165b240b1c67ef\u0022\u003ERt Hon Winston Peters\u003C/span\u003E: Is it not a fact that Mr English, the Minister of Finance, has been holding out that the surplus is imminent for years, but in reality all he has ever done as the Minister of Finance is deliver deficit after deficit?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000017\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bb158206-360b-4757-8d72-f7d0994e1fb3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022b89599a6c9dd472ca3c7740e0931dd48\u0022\u003EHon BILL ENGLISH\u003C/span\u003E: As is often the case with Opposition parties, they want you to get to surplus very quickly without cutting expenditure or putting up revenue. The Government has taken a very reasonable approach. Yes, we have had 6 years of deficits, including financing a recession and the Christchurch earthquake recovery. But if the member can just be patient, we will get to surplus.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000018\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022202017ae38c94457a17921f72c186f6f\u0022\u003ERt Hon Winston Peters\u003C/span\u003E: Will he, as the Minister of Finance, tell the New Zealand public the complete and unadulterated truth about the state of our public finances [Interruption]\u2014I know it is a laughing matter to them\u2014as a country, instead of using the \u201Coff again, on again, off again, on again\u201D deficit as a way of detracting from the truth?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000019\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bb158206-360b-4757-8d72-f7d0994e1fb3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002204be88af3b144e11aa95aabb5e809e7b\u0022\u003EHon BILL ENGLISH\u003C/span\u003E: Yes, on 16 December, at I think about 1 p.m. The member should look out for it.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000020\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002299c7f403d3d14066bff2351d23a748da\u0022\u003ERt Hon Winston Peters\u003C/span\u003E: Is it his intention to draw the attention of the public to the \u201Con again, off again, on again, off again\u201D deficit and away from the scary numbers like, for example, the $150 billion of liability that we owe the rest of the world, or the really serious figure: Government debt is up to $65 billion, which is over six times higher than the amount he inherited as Minister of Finance?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000021\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bb158206-360b-4757-8d72-f7d0994e1fb3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022111ff9cc3fb34eee85c76b6a2bce2752\u0022\u003EHon BILL ENGLISH\u003C/span\u003E: Unlike that member, I do not underestimate the New Zealand public. I think the New Zealand public has a very good understanding of the challenges that the Government has faced in managing its books. In fact, it has been remarkably resilient, tolerant, and forward-looking in supporting the policies of this Government that are enabling us to get back to surplus.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000022\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u0022564b85ef1c50421aa585e0f6c61459d1\u0022\u003EGreenhouse Gas Emissions\u2014Treasury Forecasts\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022eb49ee66-7ca7-472d-a4a1-b099fd594dfa\u0022 data-id=\u002201a2b41c6f344d9a97745378d1693ca8\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000023\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022eb49ee66-7ca7-472d-a4a1-b099fd594dfa\u0022\u003E2. \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002201a2b41c6f344d9a97745378d1693ca8\u0022\u003EDr RUSSEL NORMAN (Co-Leader\u2014Green)\u003C/span\u003E to the Minister of Finance: Does he have confidence in Treasury\u2019s economic projections?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022bb158206-360b-4757-8d72-f7d0994e1fb3\u0022 data-id=\u00229561316a0dfa4ccbaeaf782a249e48c5\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000024\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bb158206-360b-4757-8d72-f7d0994e1fb3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00229561316a0dfa4ccbaeaf782a249e48c5\u0022\u003EHon BILL ENGLISH (Minister of Finance):\u003C/span\u003E Yes. However, I note that all projections are subject to uncertainty and, in some cases, considerable uncertainty\u2014for instance, the Greens\u2019 projections about the very large vote that they would get in the 2014 election\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000025\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e4b09a29-dfd3-42c0-8585-11463bd6077b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00228f136c608c3e4b66b4247f131124ac2c\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Order!\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000026\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022eb49ee66-7ca7-472d-a4a1-b099fd594dfa\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022854678e84e884ebbbe6f68d3dfa42c00\u0022\u003EDr Russel Norman\u003C/span\u003E: Does he accept Treasury\u2019s projection in its briefing to the incoming Minister released just last month that continued failure to reduce New Zealand\u2019s greenhouse gas emissions could result in a bill to the Government of up to $52 billion?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000027\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bb158206-360b-4757-8d72-f7d0994e1fb3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00229470f407309145e7b0dd37770e9ab2cd\u0022\u003EHon BILL ENGLISH\u003C/span\u003E: No, because that was not Treasury\u2019s projection.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000028\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022eb49ee66-7ca7-472d-a4a1-b099fd594dfa\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00228800163e619645ecaa89be3be253dd85\u0022\u003EDr Russel Norman\u003C/span\u003E: Does he understand that Treasury is advising him in this briefing to the incoming Minister that the Government will have to buy up to $52 billion in carbon credits on the international carbon market to cover the projected increase in New Zealand\u2019s greenhouse gas emissions if he continues down the current path?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000029\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bb158206-360b-4757-8d72-f7d0994e1fb3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a1d0dc5885144dbe8fad2c69b3eaac76\u0022\u003EHon BILL ENGLISH\u003C/span\u003E: No, I do not accept that. The projection the member is using is not Treasury\u2019s projection. All matters related to climate change are subject to considerable uncertainty. For instance, 3 years ago Treasury projected we would be collecting around $1 billion in revenue from the emissions trading system, and I think this year we are going to collect pretty much nothing. So it was at least $1 billion out just over that 3-year period\u2014the main reason being that the world carbon price has come way down because emissions have dropped much faster than Treasury expected.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000030\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022eb49ee66-7ca7-472d-a4a1-b099fd594dfa\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00225076164e1aae4933b7e0166f13936acf\u0022\u003EDr Russel Norman\u003C/span\u003E: Does he think Treasury got it wrong in the briefing to the incoming Minister released just 1 month ago when it told him that if we continue down our current path, there is a huge cost to pay by the taxpayer if we do not reduce our greenhouse gas emissions?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000031\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bb158206-360b-4757-8d72-f7d0994e1fb3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022636e3a7dc7fb402d926b32f1d0befc83\u0022\u003EHon BILL ENGLISH\u003C/span\u003E: It is implicit in an emissions trading system that if the carbon price rises, that puts a further impost on households and businesses. That is why we have an emissions trading system\u2014precisely to send that kind of price signal, but exactly what that price is going to be is a subject of great uncertainty. As I said, no one really predicted as recently as 3 years ago that the current carbon price would be close to zero.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000032\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022eb49ee66-7ca7-472d-a4a1-b099fd594dfa\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022c906635e24cb488a92a7565c69cdd752\u0022\u003EDr Russel Norman\u003C/span\u003E: Does the Minister not understand that in Treasury\u2019s briefing paper on page 8, where it is referring to the forecast price for carbon prices, it is not referring to the domestic price; it is referring to the international price, because New Zealand will be 315 million tonnes over its target and it will have to buy carbon credits on the international market to cover 315 million tonnes, and if the price is $10 a tonne it is over $3 billion?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000033\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bb158206-360b-4757-8d72-f7d0994e1fb3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002224733b4398b04e549fff06c758295806\u0022\u003EHon BILL ENGLISH\u003C/span\u003E: No, I do not agree with that because there are a whole lot of assumptions involved in it. If the Greens are worried about us getting into a hole, then I think the leader of the Greens should follow his members\u2019 advice from the beach campaign in Timaru, where his members went down to the beach and one of them said: \u201CI put a plastic bag in the hole so I did not get sand in my ears.\u201D That might be very useful advice for him.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000034\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022eb49ee66-7ca7-472d-a4a1-b099fd594dfa\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00222c1f66f05c8c4d7e8b27f1d14335bc4f\u0022\u003EDr Russel Norman\u003C/span\u003E: Instead of making jokes\u2014[Interruption]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000035\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e4b09a29-dfd3-42c0-8585-11463bd6077b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00222b9763e2608246b0aa268b064abbc324\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Order! The member has a right\u2014[Interruption] Order! The member has a right to ask his question.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000036\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022eb49ee66-7ca7-472d-a4a1-b099fd594dfa\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00221ef7e75ffe774972867fb7d12b682348\u0022\u003EDr Russel Norman\u003C/span\u003E: Has he seen this graph from the Ministry for the Environment, his own Government graph, in which the blue line is going up because the blue line\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000037\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022569a2b9914834970b22bc4e2b787cb0d\u0022\u003EHon Members\u003C/span\u003E: Yay!\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000038\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022eb49ee66-7ca7-472d-a4a1-b099fd594dfa\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002206c932bac0644c0f88923d8d53378abe\u0022\u003EDr Russel Norman\u003C/span\u003E: It is our greenhouse emissions, you idiots\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000039\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e4b09a29-dfd3-42c0-8585-11463bd6077b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022dd78ab7c85684ab296aaae1100d33f3d\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Order! Order! As I have just risen to my feet earlier and said, the member has a right to ask his question and he certainly has a right to use a visual aid if that is helpful to him in asking that question. I want less interjection from my right-hand side. I invite the member to repeat his question.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000040\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022eb49ee66-7ca7-472d-a4a1-b099fd594dfa\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00225a05f2ea321c4a9baedd7d6a6786997d\u0022\u003EDr Russel Norman\u003C/span\u003E: Has the Minister seen this Ministry for the Environment graph that shows New Zealand\u2019s projected emissions going up\u2014the blue line, that is right\u2014and big increases in New Zealand\u2019s greenhouse emissions under this Government\u2019s policies; the green line, of course, being our target to reduce our emissions, and the gap between the two will have to be covered by buying carbon credits on the international market, a cost that his own Treasury says will be up to $52 billion on the taxpayer?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000041\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bb158206-360b-4757-8d72-f7d0994e1fb3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002274546ab247184007a3443d2c9cafe51f\u0022\u003EHon BILL ENGLISH\u003C/span\u003E: Yes, I have seen the graph. The Government is fully aware of the implications of the emissions trading system. However, we are not as certain as the member is about the projections, as indicated by the ways extrapolated\u2014the costs mentioned by Treasury. New Zealand has a pretty enviable track record in high levels of renewable energy and investing in technology to reduce agricultural emissions, and we remain pretty optimistic that we will continue with the relative success we have had in recent years with our contribution to reducing climate change.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000042\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022eb49ee66-7ca7-472d-a4a1-b099fd594dfa\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00221ebda59fdd244cbf8a417db570ac01e6\u0022\u003EDr Russel Norman\u003C/span\u003E: Does he think it is responsible economic management to expose the New Zealand Government to a carbon bill of up to $52 billion for the period 2021 to 2030, as Treasury is projecting, and does he believe it is responsible environmental management to increase New Zealand\u2019s net greenhouse gas emissions by 50 percent over the next decade?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000043\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e4b09a29-dfd3-42c0-8585-11463bd6077b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022cfdaef68bedb4fa997588852da007b0c\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: The Hon Bill English can answer either of those two supplementary questions.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000044\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bb158206-360b-4757-8d72-f7d0994e1fb3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002264c0790be6e04bc487bde7ed7f632a6e\u0022\u003EHon BILL ENGLISH\u003C/span\u003E: I just do not agree with the assertions that the member has made. Certainly, as a responsible Government we would not want to expose New Zealanders to such large-scale liabilities if we believed that was the case, and we do not.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000045\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u00220bfb6d4a97e34861a11e5b7ef468ac33\u0022\u003EState Services Commissioner\u2014Management of Harassment Complaint\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022 data-id=\u0022bff685320fb34280943028dea6be543c\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000046\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003E3. \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022bff685320fb34280943028dea6be543c\u0022\u003EANDREW LITTLE (Leader of the Opposition)\u003C/span\u003E to the Prime Minister: Does he stand by his statement that Iain Rennie made a \u201Cserious miscalculation\u201D over the handling of a sexual harassment complaint against former Canterbury Earthquake Recovery Authority boss Roger Sutton?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00220083bcaa-f44d-4b70-97de-d091a209b88c\u0022 data-id=\u002280d270dd61184a6c9c080cd3da58f9b4\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000047\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220083bcaa-f44d-4b70-97de-d091a209b88c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002280d270dd61184a6c9c080cd3da58f9b4\u0022\u003ERt Hon JOHN KEY (Prime Minister):\u003C/span\u003E Yes.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000048\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00225340364e9bf84425a57e8e45dc5e6a4f\u0022\u003EAndrew Little\u003C/span\u003E: Was it a serious miscalculation for Iain Rennie to hold a joint press conference with Roger Sutton, after receiving advice against it from his own communications staff?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000049\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220083bcaa-f44d-4b70-97de-d091a209b88c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002236a02aca88dc4118acec89323c26d10e\u0022\u003ERt Hon JOHN KEY\u003C/span\u003E: In my opinion, yes.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000050\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00228d167b72e78443458eb61d200a0879f0\u0022\u003EAndrew Little\u003C/span\u003E: Does he accept that the head of his own Department of the Prime Minister and Cabinet made a serious miscalculation by appearing at the joint press conference and embracing Roger Sutton at the end?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000051\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220083bcaa-f44d-4b70-97de-d091a209b88c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002230f8f44304584bd7ae76ff04782e906c\u0022\u003ERt Hon JOHN KEY\u003C/span\u003E: I do, although that should not be taken as a marriage proposal.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000052\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002283a8788728b7482ba9c171172218cd44\u0022\u003EAndrew Little\u003C/span\u003E: Does he accept that the behaviour of Iain Rennie and Andrew Kibblewhite indicates an \u201CI\u2019ll scratch your back if you\u2019ll scratch mine\u201D culture of unaccountability at the top of the Public Service?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000053\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220083bcaa-f44d-4b70-97de-d091a209b88c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022db11332ee226492d8a7ef9d78f173110\u0022\u003ERt Hon JOHN KEY\u003C/span\u003E: I do not. I think that is what the unions were doing when they voted that member in.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000054\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00227a814ac0d8f748b98265f82bf87af324\u0022\u003EAndrew Little\u003C/span\u003E: Is it a serious miscalculation that his own Department of the Prime Minister and Cabinet has just 15 percent women in top roles, even though women make up half of the staff employed in that department?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000055\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220083bcaa-f44d-4b70-97de-d091a209b88c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022f16595eea5ac4f3d8f8816b256d3661a\u0022\u003ERt Hon JOHN KEY\u003C/span\u003E: My understanding is that those numbers, on the advice I have had from the chief executive, will be improving. One of the issues for the Department of the Prime Minister and Cabinet is that it includes Government House within its staff numbers, and that has some impact on skewing quite a lot of the data that it records.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000056\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022065bec75c86a4fb38414f67bba03bf7a\u0022\u003EAndrew Little\u003C/span\u003E: Why is he doing nothing at all about the serious miscalculations that Iain Rennie and the head of his own department made in mishandling the Roger Sutton case?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000057\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220083bcaa-f44d-4b70-97de-d091a209b88c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022b83f8a39d9454448b6c4e8f9998d0d4a\u0022\u003ERt Hon JOHN KEY\u003C/span\u003E: I do not think it could be characterised as doing nothing, but the State Services Commissioner has statutory independence and that needs to be preserved. I have made it clear, both publicly and, in the case of Mr Kibblewhite, privately\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000058\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002209a5b71a-ca7e-4e7c-9e09-f9e63f18aa12\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022b8a98b07a83e4e1bab20c57e94ec2888\u0022\u003EHon Annette King\u003C/span\u003E: You\u2019ve made it a joke. You\u2019ve turned it into a joke.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000059\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220083bcaa-f44d-4b70-97de-d091a209b88c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022949d3e351ebc45ddb456844d078cef78\u0022\u003ERt Hon JOHN KEY\u003C/span\u003E: \u2014you are a joke\u2014that I am disappointed in their behaviour.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000060\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022b7ff71e1da654d08be63e1b618971c6c\u0022\u003EAndrew Little\u003C/span\u003E: Why does he still have confidence in Iain Rennie?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000061\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220083bcaa-f44d-4b70-97de-d091a209b88c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022f68e46e4fc964def8229858416e0aac5\u0022\u003ERt Hon JOHN KEY\u003C/span\u003E: Because Iain Rennie has been around the State services and the State sector for nearly 30 years. Over that period of time of 30 years he has, I think, conducted his leadership roles very successfully. He was appointed under a Labour Government and reappointed under a National Government, and although he would accept that he made a mistake in terms of the joint press conference, I think it is fair to say that for the most part the rest of his performance has been good.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000062\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u002281ec0dad3acf48c2960e092009c27700\u0022\u003EInvesting in Educational Success Programme\u2014Progress\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022758dcaf3-9976-43ac-8593-79f66ee4da22\u0022 data-id=\u00221b5ab65c05f54d2a8a76518908d257fd\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000063\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022758dcaf3-9976-43ac-8593-79f66ee4da22\u0022\u003E4. \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00221b5ab65c05f54d2a8a76518908d257fd\u0022\u003EJOANNE HAYES (National)\u003C/span\u003E to the Minister of Education: What recent announcements has she made about progress in the Government\u2019s $359 million Investing in Educational Success initiative?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00226e1ead03-bf7f-496a-a02f-ce52859c58c1\u0022 data-id=\u0022a461fd48648945b8b4c40d530cb6c8c4\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000064\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226e1ead03-bf7f-496a-a02f-ce52859c58c1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022a461fd48648945b8b4c40d530cb6c8c4\u0022\u003EHon HEKIA PARATA (Minister of Education):\u003C/span\u003E Yesterday I was delighted to announce that I have approved the first communities of schools as part of Investing in Educational Success. Eleven communities will begin from term 1 of next year, covering nearly 38,000 students from primary through to intermediate and on into secondary schools. Schools will be working together in a way that has not been seen before to lift the achievement of their students. This is a big win for our kids.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000065\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022758dcaf3-9976-43ac-8593-79f66ee4da22\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022d1538079e9684c1aa6324e5c9f1a1799\u0022\u003EJoanne Hayes\u003C/span\u003E: How will these communities of schools help lift educational achievement?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000066\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226e1ead03-bf7f-496a-a02f-ce52859c58c1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002218691060e780400ea9e121153101de01\u0022\u003EHon HEKIA PARATA\u003C/span\u003E: These communities of schools will have agreed and shared achievement goals, and will be sharing and collaborating around expertise and best practice in leadership and teaching. The communities also form clear pathways for kids as they transition through their education from day one through to senior schooling. Boards of trustees, principals, teachers, and parents around the country see the real potential this has for their children, and we are backing them to win.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000067\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00223d1ae531b17049808e5d50d5cac7c69f\u0022\u003EChris Hipkins\u003C/span\u003E: If she is satisfied that the Investing in Educational Success initiative is gaining the support it needs to succeed, why is the Ministry of Education spending taxpayer funding on an online advertising campaign to promote it, including on the Whale Oil website?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000068\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226e1ead03-bf7f-496a-a02f-ce52859c58c1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002204a4f9799b0146ef8bb69dd49a277ae3\u0022\u003EHon HEKIA PARATA\u003C/span\u003E: It is a very positive policy, and we want to ensure that every community across the country is aware of the opportunity to participate.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000069\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002217df59d8249d4adf91351b30b3da332c\u0022\u003EChris Hipkins\u003C/span\u003E: I seek leave to table the screenshot of the Ministry of Education\u2019s advertisement on the Whale Oil website. [Interruption] \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000070\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e4b09a29-dfd3-42c0-8585-11463bd6077b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022169625ed7cbc4995aa6becddbc8d5ffb\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Order! The member will resume his seat. If it is as freely available as the member has alleged in his supplementary question, then any member can go and grab it.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000071\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022e60787cba3d6499899a2624f5a4aef01\u0022\u003EChris Hipkins\u003C/span\u003E: I raise a point of order, Mr Speaker. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000072\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e4b09a29-dfd3-42c0-8585-11463bd6077b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002233ea9e72c1da494786fe78fc5a0e6141\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Is the member questioning the decision I have just\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000073\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022d380819bc6af4f9b9efa801268b98c46\u0022\u003EChris Hipkins\u003C/span\u003E: No, I am going to explain, as a matter of clarification.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000074\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e4b09a29-dfd3-42c0-8585-11463bd6077b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00223db2b31a53764852a99e836ca068da96\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: I will hear from the member on this occasion.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000075\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022c7df3715f6304321b384124501baea4b\u0022\u003EChris Hipkins\u003C/span\u003E: Website advertising is dynamic advertising. It means that if one person accesses the website, they might not get the same advertisement that somebody else gets, which is why we use screenshots to demonstrate that an advertisement has actually run.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000076\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e4b09a29-dfd3-42c0-8585-11463bd6077b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022cd244bd1b44c48cab5be3d76d5d24ed0\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: I think it is a very thin line the member is arguing, but in a Christmas gesture I will put the leave and it will be over to the House to decide. Leave is sought to table this particular screenshot. Is there any objection to it being tabled? There is.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000077\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u00225586a6ba4d22490a9d0395fc12e95666\u0022\u003EPublic Transport, Auckland\u2014City Rail Link\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002258f935f1-6646-40ab-9d99-17029396850c\u0022 data-id=\u002262896cf050ac486a8dd479de2844cbbf\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000078\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002258f935f1-6646-40ab-9d99-17029396850c\u0022\u003E5. \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002262896cf050ac486a8dd479de2844cbbf\u0022\u003EJULIE ANNE GENTER (Green)\u003C/span\u003E to the Prime Minister: Does he stand by all his statements?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00220083bcaa-f44d-4b70-97de-d091a209b88c\u0022 data-id=\u0022acd3903380094bcc99f4d785f046f48a\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000079\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220083bcaa-f44d-4b70-97de-d091a209b88c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022acd3903380094bcc99f4d785f046f48a\u0022\u003ERt Hon JOHN KEY (Prime Minister):\u003C/span\u003E Yes.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000080\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002258f935f1-6646-40ab-9d99-17029396850c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022bb22790479bb492ca8ccb026ef06a582\u0022\u003EJulie Anne Genter\u003C/span\u003E: If he stands by his statement \u201CThe Government\u2019s direction on transport in Auckland is clear\u2014we want to accelerate vitally needed projects and get on with the job.\u201D, will he commit to funding to start the City Rail Link next year?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000081\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220083bcaa-f44d-4b70-97de-d091a209b88c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00220699c557597f46a384a881d43ecd9772\u0022\u003ERt Hon JOHN KEY\u003C/span\u003E: No.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000082\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002258f935f1-6646-40ab-9d99-17029396850c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00220df20e2a6aef4625ac942c9c5bcc7f65\u0022\u003EJULIE ANNE GENTER\u003C/span\u003E: If he will not commit funding to start the City Rail Link, why not?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000083\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220083bcaa-f44d-4b70-97de-d091a209b88c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002251f8e1180f224686ae534aa0d10fb350\u0022\u003ERt Hon JOHN KEY\u003C/span\u003E: We brought forward the construction of the central business district rail link by a decade. I might note that the Auckland City Council is going through the process of actually wanting to delay its overambitious start date of 2016 to 2018-19. The Government set clear conditions under which it would look at an accelerated start earlier than 2020 and those conditions have not been met.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000084\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002258f935f1-6646-40ab-9d99-17029396850c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00222b7c845409984744835e97779c3a3edc\u0022\u003EJulie Anne Genter\u003C/span\u003E: I seek leave to table the patronage statistics, which show that rail patronage is on track to reach 20 million trips by\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000085\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e4b09a29-dfd3-42c0-8585-11463bd6077b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022d3b76c1f76d6486a9665c2f04ebdf153\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: The source of the document please.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000086\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002258f935f1-6646-40ab-9d99-17029396850c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022681bb97f441d4709a3a8a2ac5478b155\u0022\u003EJulie Anne Genter\u003C/span\u003E: It is Auckland Transport. It is in the board\u2019s agenda.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000087\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e4b09a29-dfd3-42c0-8585-11463bd6077b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022d7379e8f803447c99084f030dc17371d\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: On the basis that it is not freely available to members I will put the leave. [Interruption] Order! The member has every right to deny leave if he wants rather than interject when I am speaking. Leave is sought to table those particular statistics. Is there any objection? There is.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000088\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002258f935f1-6646-40ab-9d99-17029396850c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002223bc14eecdaa4d4f9ab710dbc7efd1bd\u0022\u003EJulie Anne Genter\u003C/span\u003E: Is he telling Aucklanders, who are already standing on packed peak-hour trains, that the rail link is not needed urgently when the city cannot put on any more trains until the rail link is built?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000089\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220083bcaa-f44d-4b70-97de-d091a209b88c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022760bef20c41a407eb6271f48eb5ea77f\u0022\u003ERt Hon JOHN KEY\u003C/span\u003E: The Government has spent about $1.7 billion on rail infrastructure in recent years. It has committed to everything from double-tracking, to electrification, and to new rolling stock, and it is committed to a 2020 start date on the central business district rail link. At the same time we are spending about a billion dollars a year, I think, in Auckland on roading and other motorway networks. I think the Government is investing very heavily in Auckland. If the member wants to continue to hold up pictures of trains that indicate people who are off to a National Party conference when we held it recently, I can only congratulate her on doing that.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000090\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u002245a5f1507a8a4258ae0dc9746f4443c6\u0022\u003EGovernment Financial Position\u2014Return to Surplus, Christchurch Rebuild, and Other Policies\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022 data-id=\u0022135eba20df6e4e98a9b9bf50f179c9a5\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000091\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003E6. \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022135eba20df6e4e98a9b9bf50f179c9a5\u0022\u003EGRANT ROBERTSON (Labour\u2014Wellington Central)\u003C/span\u003E to the Minister of Finance: Does he stand by his statement that he is not going to do \u201Canything sort of random and unpredictable with government spending\u201D in order to get to surplus in 2014/15?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022bb158206-360b-4757-8d72-f7d0994e1fb3\u0022 data-id=\u002297894f941371437fb9507178da16058c\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000092\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bb158206-360b-4757-8d72-f7d0994e1fb3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002297894f941371437fb9507178da16058c\u0022\u003EHon BILL ENGLISH (Minister of Finance):\u003C/span\u003E Yes. In particular I stand by my full statement, which was: \u201Cwe believe the strength of the economy and constrained government spending can deliver a surplus when the final accounts are published late next year. The Government has a track record of sticking to our spending plans to protect the most vulnerable and to provide certainty for public services. We won\u2019t be changing that approach.\u201D\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000093\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00225d899ea7392f4cbaab21fe5058dcc16c\u0022\u003EGrant Robertson\u003C/span\u003E: If he is not on track to make surplus in 6 months\u2019 time, what will he do that is not random and unpredictable to fulfil his promise to post a meaningful surplus in 2014-15?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000094\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bb158206-360b-4757-8d72-f7d0994e1fb3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002299f4f531d00a4fde8b462d9d7cafc2f0\u0022\u003EHon BILL ENGLISH\u003C/span\u003E: The member will just have to wait and see how much on or off track we currently are. But I can reassure the member that if a forecast, for instance, showed that we might not reach a surplus, we are not going to overreact to that forecast and do what he would like us to do, which is go around cutting services to people who really need them.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000095\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022f71dfff6b4dd4b939bfed38ce7780eae\u0022\u003EGrant Robertson\u003C/span\u003E: Is it random and unpredictable to hike up ACC premiums simply to achieve a surplus on paper, and will he rule out doing that again, as he did in Budget 2014?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000096\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bb158206-360b-4757-8d72-f7d0994e1fb3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022ace74713aaa7446cbef7b458a0ce1ea9\u0022\u003EHon BILL ENGLISH\u003C/span\u003E: Actually, ACC levies have dropped. I think that in the next 12 months we will collect about a billion dollars less than 3 or 4 years ago. Every New Zealand business and taxpayer benefits from that, and given the progress we are making both with ACC and the Government books, there is potential for further reductions over the next 2 or 3 years. We look forward to the opportunity to deliver those.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000097\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002234abcbf228d447d28b3393de67861cc7\u0022\u003EGrant Robertson\u003C/span\u003E: Is it random and unpredictable to include in the Budget an unprecedented loan for a major transport project simply in order to give the impression of a surplus in the Government\u2019s books, and will he rule out doing that again, as he did in Budget 2014?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000098\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bb158206-360b-4757-8d72-f7d0994e1fb3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022830635c3697c468092848ea1bfe44fcf\u0022\u003EHon BILL ENGLISH\u003C/span\u003E: I am not exactly sure what the member is referring to, but there have been some financing arrangements entered into with the New Zealand Transport Agency precisely to enable the kinds of projects that the member, the Labour Party, and the Greens want to see happen, and we will certainly continue with our programme of investment and infrastructure. I know it is frustrating to the member, but even under quite tight fiscal constraints, the Government has been able to deliver a very extensive infrastructure investment programme, more schools and hospitals, and better value for public services, and we expect to keep doing that.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000099\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002275a05f96-2474-4c90-a6ea-cf7b5798e03e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022ed4819e55a594752a20322a5166b099f\u0022\u003EHon Ruth Dyson\u003C/span\u003E: Is it random and unpredictable to remove $500 million from the original allocated budget provision for horizontal infrastructure rebuild in Canterbury, and does he now accept that there is not sufficient funding for the required work?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000100\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bb158206-360b-4757-8d72-f7d0994e1fb3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022f261246b1daa4daa92026746095f60ca\u0022\u003EHon BILL ENGLISH\u003C/span\u003E: Again, on the detail of that matter, the Minister for Canterbury Earthquake Recovery could fill it in. There has been ongoing discussion about what it was going to cost for the horizontal infrastructure, because at the start you could not see what damage had been done. We now have a growing understanding of the finances of Christchurch City Council, and we will continue negotiations, which are bound to be tense, between the Government and Christchurch City about a fair share of the burden. I might say that the taxpayers\u2019 contribution to the earthquake recovery has now reached $16 billion, which has been generous and effective, and we want to make sure that Christchurch City can come through this whole process in sound financial shape. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000101\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002275a05f96-2474-4c90-a6ea-cf7b5798e03e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00223963d3158a394926acf3847bda84b4c2\u0022\u003EHon Ruth Dyson\u003C/span\u003E: What business case, if any, has been made to him for the anchor projects in the central business district of Christchurch City, and when will they be made available to the public?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000102\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bb158206-360b-4757-8d72-f7d0994e1fb3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00224af5381c47c641a5b25fbd77e715d06d\u0022\u003EHon BILL ENGLISH\u003C/span\u003E: Again, I could not be specific about where each one is in the pipeline, but I can say that the Minister and the Canterbury Earthquake Recovery Authority are prosecuting, as quickly as they can, the process of getting the facilities in the central business district rebuilt, and the Government will consider those business cases as they come forward. We are certainly trying to move as fast as is reasonable to get Christchurch rebuilt, but also ensure that we follow good process because it is taxpayers\u2019 money that is involved. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000103\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u0022c6c80ba2cd07499a96869bc895011f9d\u0022\u003EEmployment and Skills Training\u2014Progress and Government Initiatives\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022a6c42c44-3622-4c9c-98b8-793fb5ec15cc\u0022 data-id=\u00229d06c42906f945509f02353cd6c06532\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000104\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a6c42c44-3622-4c9c-98b8-793fb5ec15cc\u0022\u003E7. \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00229d06c42906f945509f02353cd6c06532\u0022\u003EIAN McKELVIE (National\u2014Rangit\u012Bkei)\u003C/span\u003E to the Minister for Tertiary Education, Skills and Employment: What reports has he received on the progress of improving New Zealanders\u2019 skills and employment?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00224a244152-977c-48d2-bf53-4f3a369a27a9\u0022 data-id=\u00229c42358ca37e4a6c8d63ccf03a2b999d\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000105\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00224a244152-977c-48d2-bf53-4f3a369a27a9\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00229c42358ca37e4a6c8d63ccf03a2b999d\u0022\u003EHon STEVEN JOYCE (Minister for Tertiary Education, Skills and Employment):\u003C/span\u003E I have received a number of reports, all of which indicate good progress as we approach the end of another year. On skills, more Kiwis hold tertiary-level degrees than before, and we have had big increases in M\u0101ori and Pasifika enrolled at Bachelor\u2019s degree levels and above, in particular. The number of qualifications completed across all levels of study is up by 54 percent for M\u0101ori students in the last year and 88 percent for Pasifika students. That is since 2008. At 5.4 percent, the unemployment rate is the lowest it has been since March 2009 and trending down, and the most recent figures show that on average New Zealanders are receiving wage rises each year ahead of the cost of living, which is helping them to get ahead. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000106\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a6c42c44-3622-4c9c-98b8-793fb5ec15cc\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00223b1c8fcf50484748a7801d3e2f23d7f2\u0022\u003EIan McKelvie\u003C/span\u003E: What is the Government doing to build New Zealand\u2019s skill base to meet the ongoing needs of the economy?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000107\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00224a244152-977c-48d2-bf53-4f3a369a27a9\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00220c67e69971fe4bd0b6d31d0eaa3b0f4d\u0022\u003EHon STEVEN JOYCE\u003C/span\u003E: The Government is working hard right across a range of areas to deliver the skilled workforce necessary to drive our growing economy in the years ahead. For example, we are investing an additional $40 million over 4 years for more engineering places in universities and polytechnics to raise the proportion of students graduating with engineering qualifications. We are responding to the need for more skilled information and communications technology workers by launching information and communications technology graduate schools next year in Auckland, Wellington, and Christchurch, and we are increasing the number of M\u0101ori and Pasifika trade training places over the next few years from 3,000 to 5,000. With 72,000 new jobs created in the past year and the Government on track to meet its target of 171,000 new jobs by mid-2015, these initiatives will help ensure that we have the right skills for a productive and competitive economy. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000108\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u00226bd7f601de77438a8065abfb36e89c31\u0022\u003ECorrections, Department\u2014Management of Phillip John Smith Case and Spring Hill Corrections Facility\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022802874a3-deca-48b7-9d33-9087058892f5\u0022 data-id=\u0022b8070dda71c148d69a3249bf8f1fbcb3\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000109\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022802874a3-deca-48b7-9d33-9087058892f5\u0022\u003E8. \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022b8070dda71c148d69a3249bf8f1fbcb3\u0022\u003EKELVIN DAVIS (Labour\u2014Te Tai Tokerau)\u003C/span\u003E to the Minister of Corrections: Does he agree with all the findings of the Summary of the review of the failure to return from temporary release of prisoner Phillip Smith?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002219bcf2ff-a193-4361-9072-813a4e36683c\u0022 data-id=\u0022af4d3032964d46388cd05623d8e68f15\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000110\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002219bcf2ff-a193-4361-9072-813a4e36683c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022af4d3032964d46388cd05623d8e68f15\u0022\u003EHon Peseta SAM LOTU-IIGA (Minister of Corrections):\u003C/span\u003E Yes.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000111\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022802874a3-deca-48b7-9d33-9087058892f5\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022e805f1bf02c24c14bceca04086ca5234\u0022\u003EKelvin Davis\u003C/span\u003E: What steps is he taking to improve the management of Spring Hill Corrections Facility given that the report found senior management \u201Cdid not act with sufficient urgency\u201D and the \u201Cescalation process beyond the prison was inadequate\u201D, yet it made no recommendations on this?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000112\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002219bcf2ff-a193-4361-9072-813a4e36683c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002281f8a32b75594bd79c1d84a09216ef4a\u0022\u003EHon Peseta SAM LOTU-IIGA\u003C/span\u003E: The review covered 13 recommendations and dealt with how prisoner Smith escaped from custody. So, in terms of the communication between officers, the recommendations in the review dealt with having a multidisciplinary approach to the assessment of temporarily released prisoners, and that is in recommendation 2.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000113\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022802874a3-deca-48b7-9d33-9087058892f5\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022f034415c0e514df7bb85570af7e42274\u0022\u003EKelvin Davis\u003C/span\u003E: I raise a point of order, Mr Speaker. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000114\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e4b09a29-dfd3-42c0-8585-11463bd6077b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022274ea0c7d12c4fadbf80cca2aa2cbb2c\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Order! Can I just clarify before the member raises a point of order whether it is effectively saying that the question was not answered.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000115\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022802874a3-deca-48b7-9d33-9087058892f5\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022efbde708128249298617cdde2b61b867\u0022\u003EKelvin Davis\u003C/span\u003E: Yes, it was not answered. The Minister referred to the recommendations. I was referring to a point where no recommendations were made and asked what he was going to do about it\u2014given that no recommendations were made. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000116\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e4b09a29-dfd3-42c0-8585-11463bd6077b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022adb080e703cb4e1faebe10af437422ad\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: That sounds like an additional supplementary question the member now wants. [Interruption] Order! In my mind there is some doubt about whether the question was actually asked. No, that has not been raised by the member, so I will allow him an additional supplementary question.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000117\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022802874a3-deca-48b7-9d33-9087058892f5\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022b8fbdf1fce1b43be905ba8f5c9a742b4\u0022\u003EKelvin Davis\u003C/span\u003E: What steps is the Minister going to take to improve the management of Spring Hill given that the report did not make recommendations on Spring Hill?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000118\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002219bcf2ff-a193-4361-9072-813a4e36683c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022660142468fac479d800edbb21ce443ef\u0022\u003EHon Peseta SAM LOTU-IIGA\u003C/span\u003E: I will say it again. The report did not actually review the operation of Spring Hill; it reviewed temporary releases in terms of Phillip Smith escaping from custody. And those 13 recommendations dealt with issues that relate specifically to Spring Hill but also to other prisons across the country.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000119\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022802874a3-deca-48b7-9d33-9087058892f5\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002246e8521b53554140873d6d147c6296ef\u0022\u003EKelvin Davis\u003C/span\u003E: Why was no recommendation made around reviewing the development of offender plans, given that Phillip Smith\u2019s plan wrongly identified that he was suitable for release to work in minimum security?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000120\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002219bcf2ff-a193-4361-9072-813a4e36683c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002285367217f77240dd99aa195939aec3e1\u0022\u003EHon Peseta SAM LOTU-IIGA\u003C/span\u003E: Recommendation No. 2 refers to how multidisciplinary teams will deal with temporary releases. In terms of the plan, we know that it was overly optimistic and we know also that it was misinformed. So recommendation No. 2 deals specifically with that issue.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000121\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022802874a3-deca-48b7-9d33-9087058892f5\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022dd9880124f0a47f5bfa6c513edf3bf1c\u0022\u003EKelvin Davis\u003C/span\u003E: How many other prisoners like Smith\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000122\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e4b09a29-dfd3-42c0-8585-11463bd6077b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022d8f6ca184fc14534a478995ba9865bbd\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Order! I am just going to ask the member to start again; I am having trouble hearing it.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000123\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022802874a3-deca-48b7-9d33-9087058892f5\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002241c4aac31a1c49e485b2e9456f5eb2bf\u0022\u003EKelvin Davis\u003C/span\u003E: How many other prisoners like Smith have been released into the community on temporary releases without the Department of Corrections checking that the Parole Board was likely to release them in the near future?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000124\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002219bcf2ff-a193-4361-9072-813a4e36683c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022892e8ec034164b0a99ca2bdb8cfc4411\u0022\u003EHon Peseta SAM LOTU-IIGA\u003C/span\u003E: I do not have that figure to hand, but if he would like to place that question as a written question, I am happy to answer it.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000125\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022802874a3-deca-48b7-9d33-9087058892f5\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00223c70d30ce01e443a81c6ec28af0af19c\u0022\u003EKelvin Davis\u003C/span\u003E: How will it be checked whether offenders are safe to be returned to the community before releasing them, now that temporary releases are limited to 12 hours?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000126\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002219bcf2ff-a193-4361-9072-813a4e36683c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002205039455701846c79b15033ec12e763a\u0022\u003EHon Peseta SAM LOTU-IIGA\u003C/span\u003E: Sorry, I missed that. Could the\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000127\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e4b09a29-dfd3-42c0-8585-11463bd6077b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002266ec8b52a62343bdb4278d15aa42f206\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Order! I invite Kelvin Davis to repeat that question.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000128\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022802874a3-deca-48b7-9d33-9087058892f5\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00225b5d3cde72284b999a08bb14f8f70b88\u0022\u003EKelvin Davis\u003C/span\u003E: How will it be checked whether offenders are safe to be returned to the community before releasing them, now that temporary releases are limited to 12 hours?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000129\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002219bcf2ff-a193-4361-9072-813a4e36683c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002281c0ebed580d493b8817b6aa169afef4\u0022\u003EHon Peseta SAM LOTU-IIGA\u003C/span\u003E: The fact that they are limited to 12 hours is actually irrelevant to the issue of how you assess prisoners for release. As I have already said, one of the recommendations was that the multidisciplinary teams\u2014whether it is the police, Child, Youth and Family Services, the psychologists, or various other professionals\u2014will come together and give a holistic approach to how prisoners will be released. Whether they are released for 12 hours or not is actually irrelevant.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000130\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u0022de9605576bbc4666a6a2aa88fdbdf367\u0022\u003EEbola\u2014Deployment of New Zealand Volunteers\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002298dbeffa-e059-49d5-8bbf-579cbaead9a3\u0022 data-id=\u0022a16017f132e242f3a78dadeb3a90a811\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000131\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002298dbeffa-e059-49d5-8bbf-579cbaead9a3\u0022\u003E9. \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022a16017f132e242f3a78dadeb3a90a811\u0022\u003ESCOTT SIMPSON (National\u2014Coromandel)\u003C/span\u003E to the Minister of Health: What response has the Government received to its call for volunteers to help combat Ebola in affected countries?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022603ae58e-47c4-46f9-bfc8-8355a48988ad\u0022 data-id=\u002240b9fd174a1e42f4a24e81ba3b79a879\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000132\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022603ae58e-47c4-46f9-bfc8-8355a48988ad\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002240b9fd174a1e42f4a24e81ba3b79a879\u0022\u003EHon Dr JONATHAN COLEMAN (Minister of Health):\u003C/span\u003E On 17 November the Government announced that it would be deploying up to 24 volunteers to travel to West Africa as part of the international response to help combat the spread of Ebola. This is part of a $2 million contribution towards an Australian-flagged Ebola treatment centre in Sierra Leone. Registrations of interest closed on Sunday and I am pleased to announce that there has been a fantastic response, with 82 New Zealanders registering an expression of interest to be a volunteer.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000133\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002298dbeffa-e059-49d5-8bbf-579cbaead9a3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002218061245bd9548d4b7821c134b8c1b71\u0022\u003EScott Simpson\u003C/span\u003E: What systems are in place to ensure the safety of these volunteers?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000134\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022603ae58e-47c4-46f9-bfc8-8355a48988ad\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022395944752dba4772bbbea0ecae0b1bee\u0022\u003EHon Dr JONATHAN COLEMAN\u003C/span\u003E: New Zealand volunteers will receive the best possible pre-deployment training, and the Ministry of Health will be monitoring their progress and welfare before, during, and after their deployment. The Government has ensured that our people will have access to a British National Health Service - standard facility in Sierra Leone in the unlikely event that they should become unwell, as well as guaranteed medevac to Europe.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000135\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u002288e5f7030caf4b0ba8fcc122dc0b2ff1\u0022\u003ESchool Buildings\u2014Hato P\u0113tera College\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022530ce0c4-c977-40cb-90fb-754f54931ff1\u0022 data-id=\u00224262639be8b8409b9117dfdc467136db\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000136\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022530ce0c4-c977-40cb-90fb-754f54931ff1\u0022\u003E10. \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00224262639be8b8409b9117dfdc467136db\u0022\u003ETRACEY MARTIN (Deputy Leader\u2014NZ First)\u003C/span\u003E to the Associate Minister of Education: What reports has she received about Hato P\u0113tera College buildings and property?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022ed2d10c1-43b7-41d9-9f5c-0c313f70e625\u0022 data-id=\u00226e28305af13f44fdb7f3c5bcf6d0ad17\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000137\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ed2d10c1-43b7-41d9-9f5c-0c313f70e625\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00226e28305af13f44fdb7f3c5bcf6d0ad17\u0022\u003EHon NIKKI KAYE (Associate Minister of Education):\u003C/span\u003E Although I have not received any formal reports on Hato P\u0113tera College, I did receive a verbal briefing today. Hato P\u0113tera College is a State integrated school, and the buildings and the property are the responsibility of the Roman Catholic Bishop of the Catholic Diocese of Auckland. However, I do understand that officials from the Ministry of Education have been working closely with the proprietor of the school over the last month and are meeting again tonight to discuss matters raised in the recent Education Review Office report on the school.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000138\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022530ce0c4-c977-40cb-90fb-754f54931ff1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00229fa2ba43e03c47e0a1c5fec6210c2da9\u0022\u003ETracey Martin\u003C/span\u003E: In light of that answer, has the Minister read the 2012 and the 2014 Education Review Office reports that identify Hato P\u0113tera College as a \u201CSpecial character Roman Catholic M\u0101ori\u201D State school, and, therefore, the Ministry of Education has the ultimate responsibility for ensuring a safe physical environment is provided; if not, why not?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000139\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ed2d10c1-43b7-41d9-9f5c-0c313f70e625\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002285670f95da964bb79e62505be6565fb9\u0022\u003EHon NIKKI KAYE\u003C/span\u003E: Although I have not specifically read that report, I can clarify for the member the way that our system works in terms of overall responsibility in property in this area. We fund about $66 million around State integrated schools. A large chunk of that money is allocated to the diocese. It then allocates that to schools. The issues are, really, with the diocese and the school at the moment. However, I am aware of the issues that have been raised around the hostel, and it is my expectation that there is better quality. That is why the ministry will be ensuring that there is an inspection of that hostel in the next couple of months.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000140\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022530ce0c4-c977-40cb-90fb-754f54931ff1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022afef33cb812e4968aaa082fb992aed61\u0022\u003ETracey Martin\u003C/span\u003E: In light of the fact that the Education Review Office in its 2014 report identified Hato P\u0113tera College as a \u201CSpecial character Roman Catholic M\u0101ori\u201D State school\u2014not an integrated school\u2014is the Minister confident in the verbal briefing she received this morning that the school has been appropriately identified?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000141\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ed2d10c1-43b7-41d9-9f5c-0c313f70e625\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022b4af6f467e094211ae94f9525cee60f4\u0022\u003EHon NIKKI KAYE\u003C/span\u003E: Again, I am operating on the information that I have. What I can say to the member is that on the previous information that I gave in answer to the last question around how our system works, it is very clear to me from the information I have been given that it is the responsibility of the diocese to allocate that money. There are regulations under the Education Act around hostels and there is a responsibility for that school to meet those regulations, and there has previously been an inspection. But, as I said before, there are issues that have been raised in that Education Review Office report and it is my expectation that there will be another inspection.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000142\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022530ce0c4-c977-40cb-90fb-754f54931ff1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00226efb276be97c404b9c8bca59001ab803\u0022\u003ETracey Martin\u003C/span\u003E: In the 2012 Education Review Office report in which Hato P\u0113tera College hostel caregivers and school staff were commended for promoting a safe emotional environment and supporting the learning of these priority learners, no mention was made\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000143\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e4b09a29-dfd3-42c0-8585-11463bd6077b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022aa66fff8fdca464d91dd122b35ca7190\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Order! Can we have the question, please.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000144\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022530ce0c4-c977-40cb-90fb-754f54931ff1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002252910a7f0c6c452bb1600230d490b8c6\u0022\u003ETracey Martin\u003C/span\u003E: \u2014certainly\u2014of any maintenance issues; and does this concern the Minister that 2 years later it is suddenly a matter of urgency?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000145\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ed2d10c1-43b7-41d9-9f5c-0c313f70e625\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00221f68ce9d0ad345a082436f7c18e4b27d\u0022\u003EHon NIKKI KAYE\u003C/span\u003E: Well, look, there are 2,500 schools in New Zealand, so obviously I have not read that report in detail. What I can say to the member is that there is a range of hostels around New Zealand. All that we can do is do what we can with the report that we have got now, which is that there are quality issues around that hostel and that the responsibility lies with the school and the diocese. We are raising those issues with them and it is their responsibility to sort out any issues of quality.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000146\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022530ce0c4-c977-40cb-90fb-754f54931ff1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002236b2cecd45c9460092101f7f8ff6143f\u0022\u003ETracey Martin\u003C/span\u003E: Will the Minister accept that the $11 million of taxpayers\u2019 money spent on the ACT Party\u2019s Aspire Scholarship subsidies for private schools would have been better spent on State special character schools such as Hato P\u0113tera College and the priority learners they support?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000147\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e4b09a29-dfd3-42c0-8585-11463bd6077b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002269cea3cdd94547daa848472f5066c064\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: That question is a long, long one. I am going to allow it to stand because I am sure that the Minister can handle it, but the question has to relate to the supplementary. I call the Hon Nikki Kaye, if she chooses to answer.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000148\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ed2d10c1-43b7-41d9-9f5c-0c313f70e625\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022f7b69ddda3d843e685b871dd5b5af13c\u0022\u003EHon NIKKI KAYE\u003C/span\u003E: No, and I am very proud that under our National Government, every year that we have been in office we have increased the education budget. It is a tribute to Minister Parata. Well done.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000149\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c3d9fd88-4715-419d-be08-e1c4eda7d09e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022695ad026058f4547bec6bb559c7871c8\u0022\u003EMarama Fox\u003C/span\u003E: What reports has she received about the impact of Te Umanga Oranga, a specialist health sciences academy on site, utilising Hato P\u0113tera College buildings, to advance educational excellence for M\u0101ori seeking to enter the health sector?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000150\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ed2d10c1-43b7-41d9-9f5c-0c313f70e625\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022b29c67bb7a054f279c79146b0b554c7a\u0022\u003EHon NIKKI KAYE\u003C/span\u003E: Although I have not received any formal reports, I have got information and I understand that it has been extremely successful in raising student achievement. The programme provides years 11 to 13 students with leadership development and education support, and engages people in e-learning and mentoring, and I am also aware that it has been so successful. I think it is important for us to acknowledge in this House that they have another academy coming, specifically around the armed services.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000151\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u00220a2c31c29cea49f3a77a3ea3b401f4b5\u0022\u003EChristchurch Recovery\u2014Recovery Plan Blueprint\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002229c236aa-2283-4690-9a84-aa865404bb61\u0022 data-id=\u00227aea415ee2f7469e841040eb21930e90\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000152\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002229c236aa-2283-4690-9a84-aa865404bb61\u0022\u003E11. \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00227aea415ee2f7469e841040eb21930e90\u0022\u003ENUK KORAKO (National)\u003C/span\u003E to the Minister for Canterbury Earthquake Recovery: What reports has he received about international recognition for the Christchurch Central Recovery Plan\u2019s blueprint?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022 data-id=\u0022b7251737c01d477fa2d63e676ec60cae\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000153\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022b7251737c01d477fa2d63e676ec60cae\u0022\u003EHon GERRY BROWNLEE (Minister for Canterbury Earthquake Recovery):\u003C/span\u003E I have received reports that the consortium that developed the blueprint for the development of central Christchurch has been named joint winner of the World Architecture News urban design award. There were more than 1,300 entries in the awards, and 80 entries were shortlisted in the category that these people have won. The judges said they were blown away by the scale of the proposed framework for central Christchurch. This is a prestigious international honour and it is well deserved for the people who put it together. It is recognition of the vision that is now being realised for Christchurch.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000154\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002229c236aa-2283-4690-9a84-aa865404bb61\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002280a72bdc85d64e21828a0132d7c8fad1\u0022\u003ENuk Korako\u003C/span\u003E: How has the blueprint plan contributed to confidence in the recovery?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000155\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022dedd3a25be5f42a58ef5f83eb9a18d46\u0022\u003EHon GERRY BROWNLEE\u003C/span\u003E: The blueprint has provided a strong and clear direction for the city\u2019s future. It has been a positive counterfoil for the negative people who have wanted to drag the city down and suggest that it could not make a future for itself. Certainty about the shape of the city and the location of key buildings and projects has given investors confidence to return to the central city, and it is undoubtedly driving the city\u2019s economic confidence. Those people who are making investments in the centre of Christchurch should be commended, not vilified.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000156\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u00224dd910db44e6420c85e0cb00a4688cb5\u0022\u003EPacific Island Affairs, Ministry\u2014Spending\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002290ea1538-43e8-4257-bd80-df3ccd1e5f27\u0022 data-id=\u0022543e2be7bedf43efbca6980fdabe3699\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000157\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002290ea1538-43e8-4257-bd80-df3ccd1e5f27\u0022\u003E12. \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022543e2be7bedf43efbca6980fdabe3699\u0022\u003EKRIS FAAFOI (Labour\u2014Mana)\u003C/span\u003E to the Minister for Pacific Peoples: Does he have confidence in his ministry?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002219bcf2ff-a193-4361-9072-813a4e36683c\u0022 data-id=\u00228f718f1055a9493aba4b5dd86c265b97\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000158\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002219bcf2ff-a193-4361-9072-813a4e36683c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00228f718f1055a9493aba4b5dd86c265b97\u0022\u003EHon Peseta SAM LOTU-IIGA (Minister for Pacific Peoples):\u003C/span\u003E Yes.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000159\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002290ea1538-43e8-4257-bd80-df3ccd1e5f27\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022c1f93235faa14658945ac9b43c4935f3\u0022\u003EKris Faafoi\u003C/span\u003E: Does he think that taxpayers in the Pacific community will see an 850 percent increase in spending to \u201Cstaff the Minister\u2019s office\u201D between the past 2 financial years as acceptable, reasonable, and legitimate?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000160\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002219bcf2ff-a193-4361-9072-813a4e36683c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002219e48542a0e24a5cbbddbc36d33c3900\u0022\u003EHon Peseta SAM LOTU-IIGA\u003C/span\u003E: Ultimately, staffing matters are the responsibility of the chief executive, but what I can say is that I expect my ministry to spend taxpayers\u2019 money prudently. I have sought reassurances that the chief executive and the State Services Commissioner were spending money for legitimate ministry work and that it was consistent with the ministry\u2019s policies and procedures.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000161\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002290ea1538-43e8-4257-bd80-df3ccd1e5f27\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022557889eff8704dfeb7a468dcb5edf03f\u0022\u003EKris Faafoi\u003C/span\u003E: Given that answer, how does he explain an eightfold increase for air travel for \u201Cstaffing the Minister\u2019s office\u201D from $2,500 in 2012-13 to over $21,000 in 2013-14? Is that a reasonable and acceptable increase?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000162\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002219bcf2ff-a193-4361-9072-813a4e36683c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00225f1609af532443378a493a514ca931ee\u0022\u003EHon Peseta SAM LOTU-IIGA\u003C/span\u003E: As I said, I expect the ministry to spend taxpayers\u2019 money more wisely. That is why when I became the Minister for Pacific Peoples the person in question whom you are referring to was transitioned out of my office, and a more suitable Wellington replacement was found.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000163\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002290ea1538-43e8-4257-bd80-df3ccd1e5f27\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022958bec1915884c959387da1e8316e80d\u0022\u003EKris Faafoi\u003C/span\u003E: Given that answer, does he think it is acceptable and reasonable that the bill went from zero to $17,000 for an apartment to \u201Cstaff the Minister\u2019s office\u201D in the last financial year?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000164\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002219bcf2ff-a193-4361-9072-813a4e36683c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022568044d822fb497eb3d3df5161bda8bd\u0022\u003EHon Peseta SAM LOTU-IIGA\u003C/span\u003E: As I have said in this House, when I became the Minister I transitioned out of my office the person whom you are referring to, and a more suitable Wellington replacement was found. Hence those expenses will come down.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000165\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002290ea1538-43e8-4257-bd80-df3ccd1e5f27\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00229f9a257d56544cf689966d758c394aa0\u0022\u003EKris Faafoi\u003C/span\u003E: Does he think it is acceptable and reasonable that the taxi bill has gone from $324.57 to nearly $9,500, and the bill for incidentals and meals to staff his office went from zero to $9,605 between 2013 and 2014?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000166\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002219bcf2ff-a193-4361-9072-813a4e36683c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022aac582b672be40d2a04ad18f1e16be88\u0022\u003EHon Peseta SAM LOTU-IIGA\u003C/span\u003E: As I have already said in answer to this question, in terms of the person whom he is referring to who staffed my office, as soon as I became the Minister that person was transitioned out of my office and a more suitable Wellington replacement was found. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000167\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002290ea1538-43e8-4257-bd80-df3ccd1e5f27\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022648ebe29b3034a48afec86218d01367b\u0022\u003EKris Faafoi\u003C/span\u003E: I seek leave to table an Official Information Act response showing the increase in costs of staffing the Minister\u2019s office went from\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000168\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e4b09a29-dfd3-42c0-8585-11463bd6077b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00228aca54fb09404d149540a21f41d37ebf\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Order! The document has been described\u2014a particular Official Information Act document. Leave is sought to table it. Is there any objection? There is none. It can be tabled. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000169\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e4b09a29-dfd3-42c0-8585-11463bd6077b\u0022\u003EDocument, by leave, laid on the Table of the House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n    \u003C/div\u003E\n    \u003Cdiv class=\u0022HpsHansard\u0022\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000170\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsProceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u00227c2a79040c57462993eb5ebc6e4b21bb\u0022\u003EVoting\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000171\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u0022587d868133c149d5a226dde26328ee79\u0022\u003ECorrection\u2014Public Safety (Public Protection Orders) Bill\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022e4b09a29-dfd3-42c0-8585-11463bd6077b\u0022 data-id=\u0022635afab7592d406f8615ca1e3afe0204\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000172\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e4b09a29-dfd3-42c0-8585-11463bd6077b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022635afab7592d406f8615ca1e3afe0204\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: On 2 December, when the Committee of the whole House was considering Part 1 of the Public Safety (Public Protection Orders) Bill, the result of the vote on the question that the question be now put was incorrectly announced as Ayes 96, Noes 25. The correct result is Ayes 107, Noes 14. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n    \u003C/div\u003E\n    \u003Cdiv class=\u0022HpsHansard\u0022\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000173\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsProceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u00225355af140124435cb2db2020e3198a1a\u0022\u003EUrgency\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000175\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u00225aa8676d566d445a93f43da55666a7d3\u0022\u003EUrgency\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022 data-id=\u0022c691732296754df898e9eb5fa7f8a81e\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000174\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022c691732296754df898e9eb5fa7f8a81e\u0022\u003EHon GERRY BROWNLEE (Leader of the House):\u003C/span\u003E I move, That urgency be accorded the passing of the remaining stages of the Countering Terrorist Fighters Legislation Bill and any bills into which it may be divided. The bill contains proposals that will strengthen the Government\u2019s ability to deal with evolving threats. The legislation contains measures that add to the safety and security of New Zealand in the short term. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000176\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003EIt is the Government\u2019s intention that the legislation be passed before the House rises for Christmas so that we are in a stronger position to deal with threats that our agencies are currently seeing. Furthermore, a more comprehensive legislative review of all these settings will occur in a broader intelligence review, which is required under the law by the middle of next year. It is envisaged that a full select committee process will take place at that time. I believe that these are compelling reasons for the House to adopt urgency to pass these measures. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca id=\u0022745a39ec0811474c8145a9edbd1c897c\u0022 name=\u0022division\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EA party vote was called for on the question, That urgency be accorded.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EAyes 62\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand National 60; ACT New Zealand 1; United Future 1.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENoes 59\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand Labour 32; Green Party 14; New Zealand First 11; M\u0101ori Party 2. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EMotion agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n    \u003C/div\u003E\n    \u003Cdiv class=\u0022HpsHansard\u0022\u003E\n      \u003Cp\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsProceedingHeading\u0022\u003EBills\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000177\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u0022743b1a5b954f48a5b96d4dde0a3d6aa9\u0022\u003ECountering Terrorist Fighters Legislation Bill\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000178\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u00224ddc01f875d24fe4a826c15d65ab656b\u0022\u003ESecond Reading\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002241146229-4d11-415b-a4ac-f4e2b923e95d\u0022 data-id=\u0022df5bfba7462243f2bd9eb5060bb3e596\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000179\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002241146229-4d11-415b-a4ac-f4e2b923e95d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022df5bfba7462243f2bd9eb5060bb3e596\u0022\u003EHon CHRISTOPHER FINLAYSON (Minister in charge of the NZ Security Intelligence Service)\u003C/span\u003E on behalf of the Minister for National Security and Intelligence: I move, That the Countering Terrorist Fighters Legislation Bill be now read a second time. This is an omnibus bill that responds to the rapid evolution of the threat posed by those who want to commit terrorist acts, both overseas and in New Zealand. I want immediately to thank the Foreign Affairs, Defence and Trade Committee and the officials for the very good job they have done. I particularly acknowledge the work of the chair, Mr Mark Mitchell, and the extremely helpful contributions of Messrs Shearer and Goff.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000180\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002241146229-4d11-415b-a4ac-f4e2b923e95d\u0022\u003EMembers of the committee who speak this afternoon\u2014[Interruption] \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000181\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e4b09a29-dfd3-42c0-8585-11463bd6077b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00223be238159e374c22b9e32108fc28a2fd\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Order! This is a serious debate, and I want the level\u2014[Interruption] Order! I do not expect an Opposition whip to interrupt when I am on my feet. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000182\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002241146229-4d11-415b-a4ac-f4e2b923e95d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a0b0058f9bca4f36a6cd6b5cf68b6d32\u0022\u003EHon CHRISTOPHER FINLAYSON\u003C/span\u003E: Members of the committee who speak this afternoon will address the individual changes that the committee has recommended be made to the legislation. I think these changes greatly improve the bill. It was always intended to contain a targeted set of measures, and I believe those measures are even more targeted now than they were before the committee considered them.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000183\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002241146229-4d11-415b-a4ac-f4e2b923e95d\u0022\u003EWhat I want to do is use this second reading speech to address a couple of issues that still appear to concern some people. First, the question has been raised about whether the term \u201Cforeign fighter\u201D requires a definition. The Government\u2019s view is that the term does not need a specific definition in the bill. The bill does not create a stand-alone piece of legislation, and the definition of \u201Cterrorist act\u201D in section 5 of the Terrorism Suppression Act already provides the definition required. That definition is the core concept on which this legislation relies; adding a definition of \u201Cforeign fighter\u201D would be superfluous.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000184\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002241146229-4d11-415b-a4ac-f4e2b923e95d\u0022\u003EWe are targeting people by behaviour or intended behaviour, not by a label. The bill targets people who want to carry out a terrorist act either here in New Zealand\u2014whether one calls them foreign terrorist fighters, as the UN did, or other violent extremists, or something else. The actions of the people popularly referred to as foreign terrorist fighters\u2014i.e., people who want to go and fight for the Islamic State of Iraq and the Levant (ISIL)\u2014are just the latest manifestation of the terrorist acts already envisaged by, and defined in, the Terrorism Suppression Act.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000185\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002241146229-4d11-415b-a4ac-f4e2b923e95d\u0022\u003EThe second question that has arisen\u2014and I think the Greens and others have asked it\u2014is whether environmental activists could be caught by this legislation. The answer to that is no. Once again, I refer to the definition of a \u201Cterrorist act\u201D in section 5 of the Terrorism Suppression Act. An action by an activist would have to fall within the definition of one of the specified terrorist acts, and I particularly refer members to section 5(5) of that legislation, which is an \u201Cavoid doubt\u201D clause and states: \u201Cthe fact that a person engages in any protest, advocacy, or dissent \u2026 is not, by itself, a sufficient basis for inferring that \u2026\u201D the person\u2019s behaviour falls under the Act. On top of that, the layers of oversight we now have, not least the significant powers\u2014the greatly strengthened powers\u2014of the inspector-general, ensure this could not be the case.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000186\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002241146229-4d11-415b-a4ac-f4e2b923e95d\u0022\u003EThe third issue\u2014and I think this is Mr Shearer\u2019s\u2014is whether the changes proposed in the bill still allow a person to go home to Kurdistan, for example, to defend his or her home. The first point I would make is that this legislation does not change the existing legal situation of a person in that position. Section 8A of the Passports Act 1992, which was inserted into the Act in 2005 by the previous Labour Government, already allows the cancellation of a passport on the grounds that a person is a danger to the security of New Zealand because he or she \u201Cintends to engage in, or facilitate,\u2014 \u2026 a terrorist act within the meaning of section 5 of the Terrorism Suppression Act\u201D. That section defines a terrorist act as an act that occurs \u201Cin any 1 or more countries,\u201D\u2014and I emphasise that phrase. So this bill really is a clarification of the existing situation. In fact, the only new procedure introduced by this bill is the ability to suspend New Zealand travel documents temporarily for up to 10 working days.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000187\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002241146229-4d11-415b-a4ac-f4e2b923e95d\u0022\u003EThe second point is that any person whose passport was to be cancelled would need to be intending to carry out, or assist in, one of the terrorist acts specified in section 5 in line with the purposes outlined in that section. As I said on the weekend, the same principle applies to anyone who is planning to go overseas to engage in, or facilitate, a terrorist act as defined by section 5.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000188\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002241146229-4d11-415b-a4ac-f4e2b923e95d\u0022\u003EThe third point is that this bill does not go anywhere near as far as the Australian legislation, which seeks to ban Australian citizens from even travelling to certain areas unless they have lawful excuse. This legislation does not prevent New Zealanders from travelling to these areas, although obviously we would strongly advise against it. As I said, in order to have a passport cancellation occur, the Minister must be satisfied that the person intends to engage in, or facilitate, a terrorist act. That is the core concept to which all these provisions apply.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000189\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002241146229-4d11-415b-a4ac-f4e2b923e95d\u0022\u003EThere are a number of difficulties posed by any suggestion that we amend the definition of \u201Cterrorist act\u201D to exempt, for example, a person returning to Kurdistan to fight ISIL. Firstly, as I have said, the bill targets terrorist acts. We do not want to equivocate on that matter. We do not want New Zealanders getting caught up in this conflict in general, and we would not want any New Zealander committing any terrorist act on any side.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000190\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002241146229-4d11-415b-a4ac-f4e2b923e95d\u0022\u003ESecondly, the passport cancellation system is a system under ministerial control. It requires ministerial discretion. The Minister will have to take a number of factors into account when making a decision. Thirdly, amending the definition of \u201Cterrorist act\u201D in the way proposed could put the Minister making a decision regarding a passport cancellation in the difficult position of having to assess who is fighting for whom. That may be a more straightforward task when one considers ISIL and the Kurds, but this is a chaotic and fast-developing situation. The distinction may not be so clear when considering individual areas of Syria. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000191\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002241146229-4d11-415b-a4ac-f4e2b923e95d\u0022\u003EI do not think we want a Minister having to decide whether an intended terrorist act may be excusable or not given the circumstances, making specific legislative carve-outs in the Terrorism Suppression Act. I think that would undermine the purpose of the legislation, but it could also create a dangerous precedent. The main point is we do not want New Zealanders getting involved. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000192\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002241146229-4d11-415b-a4ac-f4e2b923e95d\u0022\u003EThey were the three issues that I wanted to address. As I said, I am sure members of the committee who are speaking this afternoon will address particular matters that arose in the course of the hearings. The final point I want to emphasise is that this is temporary legislation\u2014there is a sunset clause. We have a comprehensive review coming up of all security legislation, and this must begin no later than June 2015. Any changes recommended in that review and passed into law will supersede what we are debating today. If new legislation is not enforced by the time the sunset clause comes into operation, the provisions we are debating are going to lapse. The legislative product of that review will have a full select committee hearing, and I am sure that some of the issues we have debated over the past few weeks will get another airing then. Once again, I thank the Foreign Affairs, Defence and Trade Committee for its excellent work, and I commend the bill to the House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022 data-id=\u0022e008c47d29da4fcf9e5df0baa2d0d77e\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000193\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022e008c47d29da4fcf9e5df0baa2d0d77e\u0022\u003EANDREW LITTLE (Leader of the Opposition):\u003C/span\u003E I acknowledge the contribution of the Minister in charge of the NZ Security Intelligence Service to this debate on the Countering Terrorist Fighters Legislation Bill. I acknowledge from the outset that the Labour Party will support the legislation, but I want to take a moment to explain the basis on which we do so. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000194\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003EThe Minister acknowledged that this bill is about meeting a UN mandate for nation States to take measures to restrict the movements of people travelling to become foreign terrorist fighters, as the UN describes them. The original bill provided for greater and more intrusive powers for the Security Intelligence Service\u2014and, specifically, surveillance on private properties, in the original bill, for up to 48 hours\u2014and also access to Customs Service information that hitherto the SIS had not had. The original bill also provided for longer cancellation of passports of persons suspected of being a danger to security, and also the suspension of passports even while such a person was overseas. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000195\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003EIn considering its stance on a bill of this nature\u2014that is, one dealing with the safety and security of New Zealanders and also providing for greater powers of intrusion\u2014the Labour Party has considered a number of factors. Firstly, is there a safety and security threat or risk that this legislation meaningfully addresses? If not, we would not support it. Secondly, if there is a legitimate threat or risk, what is the minimum level of additional intrusive powers necessary to deal with the threat or the risk? \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000196\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003EBefore we even get into these considerations, we also have to consider the process this legislation has taken. On that score, there is no other description for it: the process has been appalling, it has been shoddy, and it has deprived many New Zealanders of their legitimate right to have a say on the legislation. As the vote just now shows, the process for this bill is in the hands of the Government. The Government has the majority. It can do what it wants with this bill. But just having the required majority\u2014having the power\u2014is never an answer to concerns about legislation that erodes citizens\u2019 rights and freedoms. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000197\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003EOur New Zealand Bill of Rights Act acknowledges that there will be times or circumstances when the long-cherished, although not yet fully protected, basic civil and human rights in that Act will be proscribed, or, to use the words of the Act, \u201Cthe rights and freedoms \u2026 may be subject only to such reasonable limits prescribed by law as can be demonstrably justified in a free and democratic society\u201D. But when we are faced with legislation that erodes basic rights and freedoms, even in limited circumstances such as this bill sets out, it is vital as a matter of public confidence that it is exposed to the fullest possible public scrutiny. That has not happened here. I urge that Minister and, indeed, all the Government to make sure it does not happen again. Let me make it clear: Labour\u2019s support for the substance of the legislation cannot be taken as support for a process that has shut many New Zealanders out of their basic democratic right to have a say on legislation that could affect them. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000198\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003ELet me turn to the substance of the bill. For our part, we accept there is a security threat today that is new. It was not present 10 years ago. That threat relates to the internationalisation of religious extremism and fanaticism. It has its expression in networks that spread throughout the world, and we accept we are not immune. Accepting there is a security threat of a nature we may not have experienced before, we turn to what is needed to deal with it, bearing in mind the solemn proviso of the New Zealand Bill of Rights Act. The starting point whenever there is a claim to restrict rights and freedoms is to be sceptical. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000199\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003EThrough Labour\u2019s representatives on the Foreign Affairs, Defence and Trade Committee, David Shearer and Phil Goff, to whom we all\u2014this House and New Zealanders\u2014owe a huge debt of gratitude, we challenged the need for the length of time for warrantless surveillance. It has been reduced to 24 hours, which is a realistic time in which to obtain a warrant under security legislation, knowing that to obtain one under that legislation is a more complex exercise than obtaining a standard police warrant for search or surveillance. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000200\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003EMore important, I think, in the context of this legislation are the safeguards that have now been built into any approval of surveillance without a warrant. The Minister has acknowledged those. First is the fact that the exercise of the power is confined to what is necessary to deal with an actual, potential, or suspected terrorist act, knowing also that that term, \u201Cterrorist act\u201D, is defined in the Terrorism Suppression Act, which is referred to in the New Zealand Security Intelligence Service Act. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000201\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003ESecondly, the Inspector-General of Intelligence and Security has close oversight of occasions on which warrantless surveillance is conducted. The present incumbent in that role, I have to say, has proven the genuine independence of the role, and that should provide some reassurance to us all. Amongst her powers and the further safeguards in this bill is the fact that warrantless surveillance must be reported to her. She has the power to investigate any exercise of the power of warrantless surveillance. Even where a warrant is subsequently successfully applied for, she has the power to investigate the circumstances in which that warrant has been given and whether or not it is justified. Then she has the responsibility to report on the occasions on which the warrantless surveillance power has been exercised. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000202\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003EIn addition to the powers around warrantless surveillance, there is also the power to cancel passports for an extended period and to suspend passports. We are reassured that there is a proper and sufficient appeal and review process, certainly when it comes to the cancellation of passports, such that those who have been improperly deprived of their passports and therefore potentially deprived of the opportunity to travel can seek an appeal or review in a timely manner so that they are not subject to what would effectively be a 3-year arbitrary loss of that right. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000203\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003EWe believe, on balance, that this bill strikes the right balance in these difficult circumstances. It is correct that there is a sunset clause. A further achievement of David Shearer and Phil Goff is to bring back or curtail that sunset clause to 2017 so that it expires within the life of this Parliament and is not pushed out to the next Parliament. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000204\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003ENew Zealanders expect this House to take their safety and security seriously, and we do that. It is a difficult balancing exercise that we have to undertake, but we are satisfied, on balance, that this bill achieves that\u2014that it strikes the right balance, and that it will ensure the greater safety and security of New Zealanders. But once again I urge the Government: please do not put this House in the position again during the life of this Parliament, when it has the numbers, of rushing through legislation that curtails the rights and freedoms of citizens and does so in a way that is hurried, that is hasty, and that deprives New Zealanders of the right to have a say. That is not the way to deal with legislation that is so important, that is so serious, when it has that impact on people. Notwithstanding that caution and that concern of ours, we will support this bill.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002248a02a21-c1ac-4159-8789-485ad614bd01\u0022 data-id=\u0022e093f4a1052e4153af351a4c973c93ad\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000205\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002248a02a21-c1ac-4159-8789-485ad614bd01\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022e093f4a1052e4153af351a4c973c93ad\u0022\u003EMARK MITCHELL (National\u2014Rodney):\u003C/span\u003E I want to open by just saying that I support everything the Minister in charge of the NZ Security Intelligence Service said. Of course, I want to highlight the fact that it became very clear to me during this process exactly why the Prime Minister has entrusted our security services to the hands of Minister Chris Finlayson. I want to acknowledge the Foreign Affairs, Defence and Trade Committee members: my deputy chair, Shane Reti; Lindsay Tisch, David Bennett, Jian Yang, and Jami-Lee Ross; and, of course, David Shearer, Phil Goff, Kennedy Graham, and Fletcher Tabuteau. David Shearer and Phil Goff\u2014without a doubt there was a spirit of cooperation and working together. I think everyone on the committee understood that when it comes to national security matters, we should be working together in the spirit that we are going to deliver the result that is best for the country. It was apparent as we got moving through the select committee process that everyone had agreed with and bought into that concept. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000206\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002248a02a21-c1ac-4159-8789-485ad614bd01\u0022\u003EI also want to acknowledge Mr Little. I had a conversation with him during the process, and it was apparent that he too saw the need for haste, which brings me to comment on a point he made about the process being shoddy. I accept the fact that the process was truncated, and I made a statement during it saying that it may not be a perfect process but it is not a perfect world, and sometimes we have to react quickly to a changing security environment. In this case, we did have to react quickly. Our threat level was changed from very low to low, which is a good thing\u2014it means we still are at the lower end in terms of the threat we face. However, it also meant we had to make some changes. Of course, it was also incumbent on us to recognise and make the changes in relation to the UN resolution that was passed. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000207\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002248a02a21-c1ac-4159-8789-485ad614bd01\u0022\u003EWe heard from the Director of Security. I personally was extremely impressed with her. I know we have a world-class director, who definitely is working in the best interests of our country. Without a doubt, I want to acknowledge her and her team. They are often subject to criticism, but they are working hard out there day and night to make sure we maintain security and are not subjected to a terrorist attack, regardless of the scale. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000208\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002248a02a21-c1ac-4159-8789-485ad614bd01\u0022\u003EI just want to share a couple of my own experiences. One thing that became apparent during the select committee process was that it is very difficult for people and submitters to understand exactly what we are dealing with when we cannot speak openly about what the threat is. Obviously, some of the evidence we heard was heard in secret, so it is incumbent upon all of us that we are unable to actually talk about it in public. However\u2014and maybe Mr Shearer may take the same opportunity to speak\u2014in a previous life I was able to see personally some of the threats we face. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000209\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002248a02a21-c1ac-4159-8789-485ad614bd01\u0022\u003EThere is one story I have related previously in this House about a situation in Iraq. It is going back a few years now, but it is certainly still relevant to our situation today. A supply convoy was attacked in Iraq. During the attack, a satellite phone was taken. It was taken by al-Qaeda terrorists, and they made several calls while they had the phone. In fact, they made well over 200 various calls around the world. What was significant was that, I cannot remember the exact number now, but I think it was about 15 or 16 calls were made from Iraq by an al-Qaeda terrorist cell to New Zealand. So we would be naive to believe we are somehow inoculated or, because of our geographic location, we are insulated from these types of threats and there is no exposure. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000210\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002248a02a21-c1ac-4159-8789-485ad614bd01\u0022\u003EAnother example I want to use is some information that was shared with me in the last week. There was actually a list that was recovered from the Islamic State of Syria and the Levant fighters. It had a lot of information on it including call signs, operation orders, and also nationalities of fighters who were expected to be or who were already on the ground fighting with them. They were from the Netherlands, the UK, and also Australia. But also on that list was New Zealand. This is information that is fresh\u2014within about a week. So I hope it is clear we did actually have to move quickly. We did have to act quickly. We have now got another layer of protection wrapped around us a nation as we move into Christmas and our festive and holiday season. I feel very proud of the fact that as a House we have been able to move the process through the select committee. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000211\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002248a02a21-c1ac-4159-8789-485ad614bd01\u0022\u003EJust very quickly, one commitment the committee made was this. Every submitter who wanted to appear and make an oral submission to the committee was given the chance to do that. The committee agreed to work long hours and into the weekend to make that happen. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000212\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002248a02a21-c1ac-4159-8789-485ad614bd01\u0022\u003EFinally, I just want to acknowledge our advisers and our secretariat staff who were with us every step of the way. They provided us with great support and advice\u2014the support we needed to actually make this happen and get this bill back into the House. Thank you.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022dfa851f0-ef7b-4834-bc41-1b3b645a3495\u0022 data-id=\u002226f75f0c094b4071a3375da8ef00cc02\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000213\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dfa851f0-ef7b-4834-bc41-1b3b645a3495\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002226f75f0c094b4071a3375da8ef00cc02\u0022\u003EDAVID SHEARER (Labour\u2014Mt Albert):\u003C/span\u003E As has been said, Labour will be supporting the second reading of this bill. The bill that is before us today is quite a bit different from what started out at the first reading, and that is a result of a pretty painstaking process that people have spoken about and a reasonable amount of cooperation across the Foreign Affairs, Defence and Trade Committee. The issue for us was really to attain a balance\u2014a balance between the safety and security of New Zealanders on the one hand and the protection of their privacy and their human rights on the other. I believe, on balance, that we have attained that balance in what we are presenting back to the House today. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000214\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dfa851f0-ef7b-4834-bc41-1b3b645a3495\u0022\u003EWe were able to hear about some of the risks that New Zealand faces. We were able to have the SIS speak to us in secret, and we called it back to get further clarification as well. I do not want to over-egg the pudding on the risks to New Zealand. There has been a lot of talk\u2014I think wrongly\u2014about beheadings in the street and that sort of thing, but there is no doubt that the number of incidents and the threatening environment has changed. We have gone from a domestic threat level of very low to low, so let us get it in context. That is not extreme as it is in the UK or high as it is in Australia\u2014it has gone from very low to low. Nevertheless, the risks that we heard about and the growth in those over the past few months are the underlying context in which this bill has come through. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000215\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dfa851f0-ef7b-4834-bc41-1b3b645a3495\u0022\u003EOn the basis of that, our approach in the Labour Party was very much to be narrow and conservative in terms of what we wanted to change. We did not have the luxury of a big review. We therefore had to confine ourselves to what we had heard in terms of a potential terrorist threat that may come to New Zealand. With that approach, we looked at constraining the legislation as it stood in making the changes that we needed to make. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000216\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dfa851f0-ef7b-4834-bc41-1b3b645a3495\u0022\u003EAndrew Little has talked about the process. The process was farcical. That was one area that I do not agree with the other side on, in terms of the way those members saw the process. We accelerated this bill through in 2 days. The people who wanted to make submissions\u2014and there were 600 people who made submissions\u2014had to do that in the space of 2 days. We knew that this threat was emerging well before the election, and yet this Government did not do a review before the election that would have enabled the legislation to be put in place straight after the election. I think that was a mistake. Nevertheless, we heard as many people as we could. We do not know how many people would have liked to make a submission but did not hear about it or could not. But, nevertheless, we worked right through the night on Thursday, Friday, and Saturday morning in order to be able to do that. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000217\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dfa851f0-ef7b-4834-bc41-1b3b645a3495\u0022\u003EI believe that there is an issue that still deserves a greater degree of focus, and that is the plight of our Muslim community. We have about 46,000 Muslims in New Zealand. They appeared in front of our select committee and made submissions. Their basic message was: \u201CWe are the people on the front line. We are the people within this Muslim community from which some of these threats might emerge. When we hear about these it is in our interests as New Zealanders and as New Zealand Muslims to ensure that they get picked up on.\u201D, and I think what they were saying was: \u201CYet we are not listened to sufficiently.\u201D \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000218\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dfa851f0-ef7b-4834-bc41-1b3b645a3495\u0022\u003ESam Lotu-Iiga, the Minister for Ethnic Communities, and the Prime Minister have yet to meet the Muslim community or accept an invitation to actually meet with them. As the community said, when it comes to halal butchery and slaughtering techniques, which New Zealand earns hundreds of millions of dollars a year from, they are feted and they are accepted and they are listened to, but when it comes to something like this where their community is at possible threat, they are not. I think that we need as a matter of urgency to acknowledge and bring those people in. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000219\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dfa851f0-ef7b-4834-bc41-1b3b645a3495\u0022\u003EIt has been talked about that this is an ad hoc piece of legislation. It is on the books only from now until April 2017. I think that is appropriate. It was going to be there until 2018, but we brought that back to this term of Government. It is pending a much wider review in which we hope there will be\u2014certainly it is envisaged and the Government has said this pretty clearly that it wants to have it\u2014a much broader examination of the issues in front of us. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000220\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dfa851f0-ef7b-4834-bc41-1b3b645a3495\u0022\u003EThere were three or four major areas where there was change. I want to mention a couple of these. The first was warrantless surveillance. This was a step, on principle, that all of us, I think, found objectionable\u2014that you would have surveillance without a warrant even though the warrant would be being sought in parallel with the surveillance. The argument for it was on the basis that sometimes things have to move quickly, and we were given two or three examples of where that might be used. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000221\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dfa851f0-ef7b-4834-bc41-1b3b645a3495\u0022\u003EI believe that what we have done with enabling that to go ahead is we have brought back the warrantless surveillance period from 48 hours to 24 hours. We have ensured that the Commissioner of Security Warrants, and the Minister obviously, get told about that immediately. We have brought the Inspector-General of Intelligence and Security in on every single occasion where surveillance pending a warrant happens, and even if that surveillance does not proceed through to a full warrant, that information will still be passed to the Inspector-General of Intelligence and Security. The inspector-general will look into that and ensure that any information that was gathered is destroyed. Lastly, the SIS is obligated to publicly report every 6 months on the number of occasions that warrantless surveillance occurs so that we ensure the public knows what is going on as well. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000222\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dfa851f0-ef7b-4834-bc41-1b3b645a3495\u0022\u003EThe second issue was about visual surveillance. The police are able to conduct visual surveillance, but their threshold is much more fixed and much more contained, and it relates to very serious offences that carry a penalty of up to 16 years\u2019 imprisonment. The SIS operates in a much, much different way. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000223\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dfa851f0-ef7b-4834-bc41-1b3b645a3495\u0022\u003EWe had a long period of debate around the ability to allow the SIS to do visual surveillance. In the end, we brought it back to what we were doing with this bill, which was to look at and counter the issue of terrorism and the threat of terrorism. We did not want this bill to be the back door by which the SIS was able to conduct surveillance more generally, so now in the bill it is confined to where there might be terrorist activities and, obviously, still on the basis of a warrant. There is the ability for the SIS to access the Customs Service database. Again, that is under very strict scrutiny. The access is to only the parts of the database that are appropriate, and the Inspector-General of Intelligence and Security has the ability to monitor where each of those selected individuals might be going. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000224\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dfa851f0-ef7b-4834-bc41-1b3b645a3495\u0022\u003EOn the issue of extending the cancellation of a passport from 1 year to 3 years, we disagreed with the Government. We did not understand why that needed to be extended out to 3 years. There are additional safeguards around somebody who has their passport withheld because they are believed to be a foreign fighter going off to fight in a terrorist organisation. That will give us more comfort that the bar that needs to be attained is a very high one. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000225\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dfa851f0-ef7b-4834-bc41-1b3b645a3495\u0022\u003ELastly, I want to thank the Minister for the clarification on the difference in definition between a freedom fighter and a terrorist. We wanted to ensure, for instance, that if you wanted to go off and fight in the Spanish Civil War, you were still entitled to do that. What we sought and got from both the Department of the Prime Minister and Cabinet and the SIS was that the bill was going to constrain only those people who were going to carry out terrorist acts or fight with a terrorist organisation, and as long as that is the case, we are pleased about that. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000226\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dfa851f0-ef7b-4834-bc41-1b3b645a3495\u0022\u003ELastly, can I just say that all of us, I think, were very impressed with the role of inspector-general, the powers she has, and the way that she is approaching her job. I think that is something for the review in the future\u2014that we look at that role and even enhance that role, because I believe that that will give New Zealanders greater confidence about the way that our intelligence agencies operate and are able to be overseen.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022861a1798-a396-4a6c-b9e2-7d2f15d4a001\u0022 data-id=\u002270ac99b7ec154a2c81268823f2e55acd\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000227\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022861a1798-a396-4a6c-b9e2-7d2f15d4a001\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002270ac99b7ec154a2c81268823f2e55acd\u0022\u003EDr SHANE RETI (National\u2014Whangarei):\u003C/span\u003E Firstly, I would like to acknowledge the Foreign Affairs, Defence and Trade Committee under the guidance of its chair, Mark Mitchell, and collaboration with colleagues from across the House. At this reading I would like to speak to the process that has been highlighted, and then the content of this bill. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000228\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022861a1798-a396-4a6c-b9e2-7d2f15d4a001\u0022\u003EThe case has been made that the time frame was challenging, and we have accepted that, and we would like to sincerely thank all the submitters. But we should note that there is a precedent for the process, and against that precedent this is a good outcome. Let me explain. On this bill the committee heard 63 oral submissions. A similar bill in 2011, the Video Camera Surveillance (Temporary Measures) Bill, was also seeking to balance privacy and freedoms with security, and on a similar time frame the select committee concerned heard 20 submissions. This committee heard 63. Further, a bill with much similar content, the 2012 Search and Surveillance Bill, had its first reading on 4 August 2009, and submissions to the Justice and Electoral Committee closed 1 year later, on 3 September 2010. One year later, 29 submissions had been heard; this committee heard 63. Of course, that is not everyone\u2019s voice, and that is not the case I am making; rather, that on precedent the best was made of a challenging time frame. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000229\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022861a1798-a396-4a6c-b9e2-7d2f15d4a001\u0022\u003EI would like to speak to the safeguards in this bill, and there are at least three. The first safeguard concerns warrantless surveillance. Many submitters talked about their concerns about warrantless surveillance, and this is and always will be a legitimate concern. However, this bill does not introduce warrantless surveillance for the first time in New Zealand. This is not new functionality. Section 48(1) of the Search and Surveillance Act states: \u201CAn enforcement officer who is in any 1 or more of the situations set out in subsection (2) may use a surveillance device for a period not exceeding 48 hours from the time the surveillance device is first used without obtaining a surveillance device warrant,\u201D. So warrantless surveillance is already in legislation. The difference is that in the Search and Surveillance Act the permission is for gathering information about a crime, and in this bill the permission for warrantless surveillance is for the gathering of intelligence. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000230\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022861a1798-a396-4a6c-b9e2-7d2f15d4a001\u0022\u003EThe second safeguard is around passport cancellation. Passport cancellation already exists under the Passports Act, and we need to be clear that cancelling a passport does not cancel citizenship. These are unrelated, not linked, and not part of this bill. If people have their passports cancelled while travelling, the Passports Act states that they will receive travel documents to return to New Zealand. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000231\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022861a1798-a396-4a6c-b9e2-7d2f15d4a001\u0022\u003EThe third safeguard measure is that there are, I believe, satisfactory criteria that must be met before actions in this bill can be undertaken and many independent review and reporting measures that support this bill. This includes review by the Commissioner of Security Warrants and the Inspector-General of Intelligence and Security. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000232\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022861a1798-a396-4a6c-b9e2-7d2f15d4a001\u0022\u003EAlso, the penultimate sunset clause defines the intent of this bill as temporary. Much was done in the select committee to address the legitimate issues raised by submitters and committee members in this regard. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000233\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022861a1798-a396-4a6c-b9e2-7d2f15d4a001\u0022\u003ESo, much of the logistics of this bill are already in legislation, such as warrantless surveillance and passport cancellation. What this bill does, then, is extend the application, and it is my belief that this bill is a good outcome for the process and the security needs we have. I commend it to the House. Thank you.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002292557bd5-0e66-473c-a6df-7d108e7822e3\u0022 data-id=\u0022a97458d05a7d42d2a17fc4cd15490276\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000234\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002292557bd5-0e66-473c-a6df-7d108e7822e3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022a97458d05a7d42d2a17fc4cd15490276\u0022\u003EDr KENNEDY GRAHAM (Green):\u003C/span\u003E The Foreign Affairs, Defence and Trade Committee has now reported back on the Countering Terrorist Fighters Legislation Bill. The Green Party will have something to say in the Committee stage about the drafting. Let me address the issue of substance now, to the extent that it was considered by the committee. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000235\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002292557bd5-0e66-473c-a6df-7d108e7822e3\u0022\u003EThe Green Party had opposed the introduction of the bill, not simply its draft content. We alone voted against it in the first reading. Like all other parties we entered the committee\u2019s work open to persuasion, but, unlike most others, we were listening for the fundamental reasons for the bill in the first place. The committee received, as has been mentioned, 588 submissions; it heard 63. The other 525 remained essentially unread by the committee during the hearing process because of the perversely truncated time it was allowed to perform its democratic function of listening to the people. The very passage of the bill impugns the democratic standards it is designed to protect. We were briefed twice by the Director of Security to gain an appreciation of the need, as claimed, for the expanded State powers. Nothing we heard persuaded us that our initial underlying concern with the bill was misplaced. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000236\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002292557bd5-0e66-473c-a6df-7d108e7822e3\u0022\u003EWe do not deny that the world is a dangerous place. We are not oblivious to the rise of the Islamic State of Iraq and the Levant (ISIL). We are aware of United Nations Security Council Resolution 2178. But the primary case for the legislation according unprecedented State powers to not just the police but the SIS has not been made, and the political foundation for the legislation is weak. UN member States have an obligation under the Charter to maintain international peace and security. This includes measures to combat international terrorism. Collective action to this end, however, is not new. As long as four decades ago, the United Nations General Assembly invited member States to take all appropriate measures at the national level with a view to the speedy and final elimination of international terrorism. Concerns over the 2015 Cricket World Cup cannot be higher than those that stemmed from the 1972 Munich Olympics, yet New Zealand had the wisdom not to overreact then. The strategic decision after September 2001 to regard terrorism as an issue of international peace and security rather than of global and domestic crime has had fateful consequences for political judgment everywhere ever since. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000237\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002292557bd5-0e66-473c-a6df-7d108e7822e3\u0022\u003ENew Zealand, as the smallest fast follower among the \u201CFive Eyes\u201D espionage network, has suffered the most in loss of clarity regarding its role as a responsible global citizen. Through pure contagion it has imported a vicarious threat level from its four partners that is inappropriate to its own geostrategic position and its distinctive political culture. In calibrating its response, the Government is unduly influenced by its \u201CFive Eyes\u201D espionage partners, which have attracted higher threat levels, and it has not had sufficient regard for the other 188 member States. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000238\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002292557bd5-0e66-473c-a6df-7d108e7822e3\u0022\u003EThe rise of ISIL in 2014 raises the threat level, but the change is not qualitatively different from before and does not therefore justify the expansion of State powers of the kind proposed. In making the political case for the legislation, the Prime Minister has described how our risk and threat profile is changing. Much of that, he explains, is due to the rapid rise of ISIL, which has seized substantial territory, decreed national borders between Islamic States to be invalid, and used brutal methods. The ability of ISIL to motivate Islamic radicals, as well as its ambition, resources, and methods, make it a brutal threat to stability not only in the Middle East but regionally and locally too. The rise of such a well-resourced, globally focused terrorist entity that is highly skilled in recruitment and social media is a game-changer for New Zealand, the Prime Minister says. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000239\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002292557bd5-0e66-473c-a6df-7d108e7822e3\u0022\u003EISIL has successfully recruited New Zealanders to its cause, and there is a watch-list of about 40 foreign fighters plus an equivalent number in or from New Zealand who are participating in extremist behaviour. Some have been fighting in Syria. Some are attracted to carrying out domestic attacks in New Zealand of the type recently prevented in Australia and successfully carried out in Canada. Should they return to New Zealand fully radicalised and with fighting skills, they would represent a significant threat to the safety of New Zealanders. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000240\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002292557bd5-0e66-473c-a6df-7d108e7822e3\u0022\u003EIn light of all this, the Prime Minister concludes there is \u201Can immediate threat to national security\u201D. This justifies, he thinks, the Government\u2019s response: expansion of intrusive powers by the State and a resulting erosion of privacy and civil liberty, longer cancellation of passports, SIS access to Customs Service data, visual surveillance by SIS hitherto confined to the police, and 24-hour SIS surveillance without a warrant. These changes, he says, will \u201Cstrengthen our national security settings\u201D. The Prime Minister\u2019s \u201Cimmediate threat to national security\u201D is not matched by the official change in New Zealand\u2019s threat level, which has increased only from very low, or highly unlikely, to low, or possible but not expected. There is some cognitive dissonance between the excitable political narrative and the official judgment. The case is advanced for an unprecedented expansion of intrusive State powers in response to a possible terrorist act that is not expected. The case is not made. The bill is an overreaction to the true content of United Nations Security Council Resolution 2178. That resolution requires member States to ensure that their laws are sufficient to combat the threat, leaving it to their discretion to judge what those might be, consistent with international human rights, refugee, and humanitarian law. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000241\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002292557bd5-0e66-473c-a6df-7d108e7822e3\u0022\u003EThe political foundation for the legislation is weak. The day the bill was introduced, the independent Inspector-General of Security and Intelligence released a report with findings on actions by the SIS and the Prime Minister\u2019s office in 2011. These included disclosure of incomplete, inaccurate, and misleading information; significant errors in considering media requests; a failure to safeguard political neutrality; a lack of trust and confidence with the Leader of the Opposition; and an insufficiently rigorous and careful approach in handling security intelligence. Separately, staff of the Prime Minister\u2019s office had disclosed to the media for political purposes information supplied by the SIS. The report recommended that SIS staff be trained in the release of information and that published guidance be developed on their political neutrality obligations. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000242\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002292557bd5-0e66-473c-a6df-7d108e7822e3\u0022\u003EIt is in the context of these shortcomings\u2014corrosive of public trust in the most sensitive areas of State power\u2014and the need for guidance and training of the SIS that the Prime Minister asks the people of New Zealand to accept an expansion of its powers. The timing of this bill could not be less opportune. There is a need for proven rectification of the shortcomings in both the SIS and the Prime Minister\u2019s office and a consequent restoration of public trust in these institutions before any such bill could even be contemplated. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000243\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002292557bd5-0e66-473c-a6df-7d108e7822e3\u0022\u003EAs I said, we shall speak to the drafting of the bill in the Committee stage, but our fundamental opposition to the bill is this. Under legislation designed to combat foreign terrorist fighters engaged in the Middle East, the New Zealand SIS will have the power in respect of all New Zealanders to access Customs Service data and covertly plant cameras anywhere in their homes, including without warrant. The justification for expanded State powers is ISIL terrorism in the Middle East, but those powers extend to \u201Clocal extremists\u201D\u2014undefined\u2014carrying out serious environmental or economic damage in New Zealand. This is wrong and unacceptable.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022 data-id=\u00225f0bd37ee4e14a5a84c1fa7ecd2981de\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000244\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00225f0bd37ee4e14a5a84c1fa7ecd2981de\u0022\u003ERt Hon WINSTON PETERS (Leader\u2014NZ First):\u003C/span\u003E As has been the case since New Zealand First was created over 21 years ago, the core principle of our party is one of love for our country. We in New Zealand First are proud of New Zealand and we believe we have a duty to protect it from all enemies. We believe there is a historic obligation to protect our culture and our heritage, and this obligation requires every member of our party to advocate in the strongest possible terms for a strong defence force, for the rule of law, and for safe and secure borders. Only when these requirements are met can the country develop according to the will of the New Zealand people. We have a unique culture and heritage and we as a party believe that it must be preserved and strengthened, no matter what the cost. We believe that the primary concern of any responsible political party is national security, and we take national security seriously all of the time and on all policies. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000245\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022\u003ENew Zealand First opposes this bill for a number of reasons. First, we agree with the concerns on this bill raised by the New Zealand Law Commission, and we note that although improvements have been made at the Foreign Affairs, Defence and Trade Committee to some areas identified by the commission, many areas leave much to be desired. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000246\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022\u003ESecond, this Parliament, in 2007, removed from the Crimes Act the crime of sedition. There was one party, and one party alone, that opposed this repeal and voted against it. That party was New Zealand First. The crime of sedition is still needed now. It simply must be a crime\u2014as it was when we had sedition on our books\u2014\u201CTo incite, procure, or encourage violence, lawlessness, or disorder; or \u2026 To incite, procure, or encourage the commission of any offence that is prejudicial to the public safety or to the maintenance of public order;\u201D. Its repeal was ill-considered and ill-founded by the very people who stand up today and say: \u201CTrust us. We are your sentries and guardians and protectors.\u201D What is their record? Many of those responsible for repealing it are right here in this House. We will move in the Committee stage to reintroduce the crime of sedition. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000247\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022\u003EThird, we do not have enough confidence or trust in the Security Intelligence Service, given some of its recent offences and serious shortcomings, to allow this organisation such widely increased powers of surveillance. Let us not forget the case of Rajesh Singh. Mr Singh is a former Fijian Government Minister, democratically elected by the people of Fiji. His Government was overthrown by Frank Bainimarama in the military coup of 2006, and he\u2014Mr Singh\u2014fled to Auckland. In 2012 his premises were raided by the SIS and police. The pretext was that he was about to engage in a foreign, offshore terrorism act. What is interesting about this case is that as he was about to be raided, he received a text message from a senior army officer in Fiji telling him that he was about to be raided. I have seen that text message. How on earth could a senior army officer in Fiji know that the New Zealand SIS was about to conduct a raid on Mr Singh, who was lawfully living in New Zealand? \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000248\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022\u003EThe subsequent actions of the SIS and the police during the raid are cause for grave disquiet, as is the case of Mr Tony Fullman. Mr Fullman had his passport cancelled by the Department of Internal Affairs on the advice of the New Zealand SIS on 17 July 2012. Why? Because he also was alleged to be about to partake in a foreign act of terrorism. The claim was without any merit, and within a year the Government back-pedalled on its decision and wrote to Mr Fullman to say that he could now have his passport back, and said\u2014because it has always been very charitable, this Government\u2014that he would not have to pay for the application replacement fee. [Interruption] Does that not make you feel good? \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000249\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022\u003EThen, of course, there is the case of the Government Communications Security Bureau (GCSB) and Kim Dotcom. How on earth could the GCSB not know that Dotcom was a New Zealand resident, or the Prime Minister not know that he was living in his electorate? And when exactly was the Prime Minister made aware of Dotcom and the GCSB raid? He has never admitted foreknowledge at all. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000250\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00226b866679423f455bb555f02717e1ee7d\u0022\u003EHon Dr Nick Smith\u003C/span\u003E: He didn\u2019t know.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000251\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022fda34739087c44e9ae6fba69e3219e09\u0022\u003ERt Hon WINSTON PETERS\u003C/span\u003E: Oh, he did not know. Here he goes again\u2014\u201Cknow nothing - ism\u201D from the expert of \u201Cknow nothing - ism\u201D, Nick Smith. There is a smell around this, but let us be frank. What this bill is really about is much wider surveillance powers, and the Prime Minister has been covert about it all the way until just after the election. In June it was no worries, no engagement, no concerns, a long election campaign\u2014one of the longest we have seen in modern times\u2014and he never mentioned it. But he has been running around offshore making promises to all and sundry, and now he is being deliberately evasive with the New Zealand public. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000252\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022\u003EThe Government and others say that they are all concerned about security. We have seen time and time again the problems that uncontrolled immigration policies create, but what was their response? To never do a thing about it. From Paris to London, and even to Stockholm, we have seen riots in the streets, honour killings, terrorist attacks, and terrorist plots. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000253\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022\u003EIn 2005 I asked the Minister of Immigration about the case of one Asha Ali Abdille, a Muslim refugee from Somalia. I asked the Minister: \u201CIs he confident that Asha Ali Abdille, the refugee sickness beneficiary whom he ordered an inquiry into last year, and who has a string of criminal convictions, is not a threat to the New Zealand community; if so, why?\u201D. He said she was not. Then, 3 years later, she tried to hijack Flight 2279 from Blenheim and attempted to get the pilots to fly to Australia. They refused and bravely fought back, along with other passengers on the plane, and eventually subdued her. But in her attempt to hijack the aircraft at knifepoint, she wounded both pilots and one passenger. She was sentenced to 9 years, at the New Zealand taxpayer\u2019s cost. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000254\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022\u003EThis sort of repetitive behaviour, and the \u201Cknow nothing - ism\u201D about whom we are bringing here, we in New Zealand First are sick of, and we are not going to have those people get up in this House and all of a sudden be the new sentries and guardians of our society. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000255\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022\u003ENo one in this Parliament or in the media can possibly say that New Zealand First is not tough on security for our national defence.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000256\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022163d0b68-eb0e-4094-9bed-99e184f063e1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00224f51b6d954db42b7a4c58b9636dad4f0\u0022\u003EJami-Lee Ross\u003C/span\u003E: Weak.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000257\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00220ce68cb91be748f1b87eebf539ec1d3b\u0022\u003ERt Hon WINSTON PETERS\u003C/span\u003E: Oh, \u201CWeak.\u201D, he says\u2014\u201CWeak.\u201D, he says. He has got no idea whom he has brought in from the Middle East. Those members encourage them to come here in their thousands, and there is Jami-Lee Ross sitting over there saying we are weak. Look, ignorance is not bliss. Ignorance, Mr Jami-Lee Ross, is not bliss, and the fact is that no one is going to believe you. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000258\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022\u003EWe in New Zealand First take the issue of terrorism\u2014and the Islamic State of Iraq and Syria (ISIS)\u2014very seriously all of the time and on all policies. We have known all year\u2014not just after the election; we have known all year\u2014about ISIS. Do those people not watch the international broadcasts, the media, and all the advice coming out of the Middle East? Or is the blind ignorance in the research unit all that they rely on, or is it the Prime Minister\u2019s assurances? We have known all year about this threat, and we know that radical Islam is a growing threat as well. We have known that for a decade, so what is so new now? \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000259\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022\u003EThe fact is that we want our immigration system tightened up. We want our border security tightened up. I do not want to hear that we have got 20,000 overstayers\u2014give or take 2,000\u2014here in a modern, computerised age. I do not want to hear that we do not know what is going on. I do not want to hear that I am the only guy who could find a person who was the former agrarian Minister who had come out of Iraq and that none of the lawful authorities in this country could find him\u2014nor, for that matter, could any of these people now posing today. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000260\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022\u003EThe PM cannot be trusted. The SIS was caught playing dirty politics, spying on the most senior Opposition MP. The PM is still not being honest about the imminent deployment to Iraq of our armed forces. We know that our troops have already been told that by the end of February-March they will be off. He is still denying it, and the Minister of Defence is denying it in this House as well. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000261\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022\u003EMore seriously, the Government has put up this law at breakneck speed, with the fastest change I have ever seen in this House on a matter so serious. It has rammed it through the select committee and it thinks we are going to comply. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000262\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022\u003EThere may be parties in this Parliament at the moment that look alike and sound alike on this matter and that have got the same record, but it is not our record. It is not New Zealand First\u2019s record. We know that this bill came about as a result of a review that we were never briefed on. A law review is coming next year\u2014no doubt, we will have new law then\u2014and in the meantime we are asked to cry havoc and let loose the dogs of Nazism when it comes to people\u2019s homes. The surveillance\u2014when you have got video surveillance, is it 50 metres or 500 metres? All these people are swept in, and too many people are supporting this legislation without knowing just how technically wide and unfair it could possibly be.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022eaf79431-1033-44f1-a633-22633da52c0d\u0022 data-id=\u002240000039343f41c684eaffdfd6d3d9ae\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000263\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022eaf79431-1033-44f1-a633-22633da52c0d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002240000039343f41c684eaffdfd6d3d9ae\u0022\u003EDAVID BENNETT (National\u2014Hamilton East):\u003C/span\u003E That was a disgusting speech from a party that should not be proud to be in this House. New Zealand is a country made up of people from different religions, different races, and different cultures, and people have come to this country at different times. They are all New Zealanders, and how dare that party over there say that it holds up New Zealand\u2019s security when all it wants is the 1950s. New Zealand First wants to return to the 1950s\u2014that is all that party wants to do. It does not stand for protecting New Zealanders, and let nobody in this country ever take the garbage from that party that it actually believes in New Zealanders. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000264\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022eaf79431-1033-44f1-a633-22633da52c0d\u0022\u003EWe sat in the Foreign Affairs, Defence and Trade Committee. Members sat there and they heard from the Muslim community, and David Shearer rightly acknowledged that in his speech. Fletcher Tabuteau should have been speaking on this bill. It became just an attempt by his leader to take it over as an immigration speech, and that is disgusting from that party. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000265\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022eaf79431-1033-44f1-a633-22633da52c0d\u0022\u003EThis bill is good for New Zealanders. It protects New Zealanders. We had to do it at this time. It is something that, as a Parliament, we have to deal with at this time. Dealing with the immediate, pressing concerns is not something we could leave till next year. It is something that came to New Zealand\u2019s attention in recent times. We are not England or Australia, which have not had to go through a general election and lose that period of time when they could have made legislation. This bill does not even attempt to go as far as the English and the Australian legislation, which is already embedded in their parliaments. This gives new powers to our security agencies, but they are powers that are needed to protect all New Zealanders, and not the 1950s clich\u00E9 that Mr Peters wishes to represent.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022\u0022 data-id=\u0022ab62cb07b28344cb92f824bf207b2f59\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000266\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022ab62cb07b28344cb92f824bf207b2f59\u0022\u003EMr DEPUTY SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: I call Catherine Delahunty\u20145-minute call.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00220ee528dc-7870-4553-95ed-5ec0cab60f07\u0022 data-id=\u0022bd05beac1c564117be9af2de9c880276\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000267\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220ee528dc-7870-4553-95ed-5ec0cab60f07\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022bd05beac1c564117be9af2de9c880276\u0022\u003ECATHERINE DELAHUNTY (Green):\u003C/span\u003E T\u0113n\u0101 koutou e te Whare. Before I talk about some of the aspects of the bill in this second reading in terms of human rights and civil liberties, because human rights is my portfolio, I want to ask some questions. The reason why the Green Party is not supporting the bill is that the questions have not been answered to our satisfaction. I recognise there has been work done and answers given, but they are not to our satisfaction at this stage. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000268\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220ee528dc-7870-4553-95ed-5ec0cab60f07\u0022\u003EThe first one is: is there an immediate threat? I think it is hard to argue that the world is safe, or has been safe, for a very, very long time. In fact, ever since September 11 and our participation in the Afghani issue, our country has been unsafe to some degree, but not to a very high degree, and I think it is hard to argue that we are more unsafe than we have been for quite a while. We have sided with the \u201CFive Eyes\u201D in various wars, either directly or indirectly, which has created a level of risk. That is a choice that has been made by Governments, not by the Green Party, and we are yet to be convinced that there is an immediate threat that means that rather than wait until June 2015 for a full security review, it is necessary to introduce this legislation under urgency, and I will talk about the process for the public in a minute. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000269\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220ee528dc-7870-4553-95ed-5ec0cab60f07\u0022\u003EDo we have police powers already to address serious criminal acts? Yes, we do. That is my understanding\u2014we really do. Is the SIS neutral, and have we forgotten what happened on the very day this bill was introduced, in terms of the SIS\u2019s relationship to an abuse of power and a lack of neutrality? Many people in the public have not forgotten, and the Green Party has not forgotten. How do we actually stop recruitment to terrorism: through more violence and surveillance, or by making an investment in communities where that risk could possibly arise? How do we support the Muslim community, for example\u2014although this bill is much broader than that\u2014to be treated with respect, and how do we assist it to be part of a process of de-radicalising people who might be at risk? Why can we not wait until next year? Also, what is the definition of \u201Cextremist\u201D? There is a considerable debate about the word \u201Cextremist\u201D, the word \u201Cterrorist\u201D, and about what they actually mean, and where does that sit? \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000270\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220ee528dc-7870-4553-95ed-5ec0cab60f07\u0022\u003EWe would have to know what those things are before we could possibly vote for this bill, because warrantless surveillance, visual surveillance, etc., are all serious issues for people who could be categorised as terrorist or extremist and whose actions have been associated with guerrilla warfare, liberation struggles, or even non-violent action in this country. What was once a small but progressive country making a huge global contribution could now possibly be one of the most conservative in this regard, particularly in the way in which this bill has been forced through. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000271\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220ee528dc-7870-4553-95ed-5ec0cab60f07\u0022\u003ESo I just want to talk a little bit about the 525 or more submissions not heard in person, and also the many people who could not submit because they did not even know that there were only 2 days available. I want to pay credit\u2014total credit\u2014to the Kiwi citizens who actually showed the Government up and made thoughtful, informed, and committed submissions on this issue. I acknowledge that the Foreign Affairs, Defence and Trade Committee did a huge amount of work to hear them, and I support every word that my colleague Dr Kennedy Graham said when he talked about this process. I would like to thank the civil liberties and human rights groups. Many thanks go to those submitters who are Muslim New Zealanders for their vital reminder to the select committee about the impact of this legislation, including the increase in personal abuse that has occurred since the Prime Minister started justifying this extension of spy powers and creating more fear and more paranoia towards the Muslim community. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000272\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220ee528dc-7870-4553-95ed-5ec0cab60f07\u0022\u003EThe modifications in this bill were predictable. There is more oversight of the SIS, which is a good thing, and the change to the time frame for video surveillance without a warrant was a predictable change. It was always built in that the Government could gain the Labour Party\u2019s support by backing off on those issues. That was entirely to be predicted, but, actually, it does not make much difference\u201424 hours or 48 hours with no warrant is still an unacceptable trade-off that we cannot live with. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000273\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220ee528dc-7870-4553-95ed-5ec0cab60f07\u0022\u003EThe biggest problem we in the Green Party have is this bill\u2019s rationale and the barely explained urgency that is forcing it through this House. Why have we rushed to push the panic button? Who is telling us we must do this? If we are so concerned about foreign fighters, why does the bill create broad powers? From where we sit this looks like broad powers to allow for some giant fishing expeditions for some fish who may be very, very small or very, very large but who will not have the basic rights that citizens of this country ought to have and who will be subjected to surveillance. I want to quote just briefly from Amnesty\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022\u0022 data-id=\u00220a536a9e380b4f8cb0e2a299ba10bbbf\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000274\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00220a536a9e380b4f8cb0e2a299ba10bbbf\u0022\u003EMr DEPUTY SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: I am sorry to interrupt the member. Her time has expired. Marama Fox\u2014a 5-minute call.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022c3d9fd88-4715-419d-be08-e1c4eda7d09e\u0022 data-id=\u00223029ebc8c6fb49a3bf92fd3ca7415e0e\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000275\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c3d9fd88-4715-419d-be08-e1c4eda7d09e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00223029ebc8c6fb49a3bf92fd3ca7415e0e\u0022\u003EMARAMA FOX (Co-Leader\u2014M\u0101ori Party):\u003C/span\u003E Kia ora e Te Mana Whakaw\u0101, \u014D t\u0101tou mate takitini e takoto mai r\u0101 i runga i \u014D t\u0101tou marae maha, i runga i \u014D t\u0101tou papa k\u0101inga, i roto i t\u014D t\u0101tou Whare, kua \u016Bhia r\u0101tou ki ng\u0101 taumata k\u014Drero e tika ana hei poroporoaki i a r\u0101tou. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000276\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c3d9fd88-4715-419d-be08-e1c4eda7d09e\u0022\u003E[Thank you, Mr Speaker, and in regards to the myriads of our deaths lying there upon our many courtyards, home settlements, and in our House, fitting tributes of farewell have been accorded and cast over them.]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000277\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c3d9fd88-4715-419d-be08-e1c4eda7d09e\u0022\u003EThe M\u0101ori Party stands at the second reading to oppose the Countering Terrorist Fighters Legislation Bill. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000278\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c3d9fd88-4715-419d-be08-e1c4eda7d09e\u0022\u003EIf I was to take a walk just 5 minutes down the road to the Wellington Railway Station, I would see the impressive bronze statue of Mahatma Gandhi. At the statue\u2019s unveiling in 2007, Mr Ernest, the Indian High Commissioner, said: \u201COn India\u2019s part, the gifting of the statue is an expression of our deep appreciation and acknowledgment of the commitment of the people of New Zealand for setting an example to the world of a tolerant, open and inclusive society\u201D. How is this relevant to the bill on countering terrorism? It has everything, and nothing, to do with this legislation. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000279\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c3d9fd88-4715-419d-be08-e1c4eda7d09e\u0022\u003EThe major concern for the M\u0101ori Party is that the bill seeks to change the law to allow the New Zealand SIS to conduct surveillance activities without a warrant \u201Cin situations of emergency or urgency\u201D. It then allows the Director of Security to authorise surveillance activities to be undertaken \u201Cin situations of emergency or urgency\u201D. So how does this connect to Gandhi? The statue immortalises our nation for its tolerant, open, and inclusive society, yet it is noteworthy that our champion of peace Te Whiti o Rongomai is not honoured similarly with a statue of his own.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000280\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c3d9fd88-4715-419d-be08-e1c4eda7d09e\u0022\u003EAnd where is the link to this legislation? Where it is explicit is that Te Whiti o Rongomai was the leader of Parihaka, a M\u0101ori village in Taranaki. Te Whiti was one of those great leaders alongside Mahatma Gandhi, Martin Luther King, and Nelson Mandela, and yet his story is relatively unknown in our official histories. His story dates back to 1880 and the West Coast Settlement (North Island) Act, by which any M\u0101ori in Taranaki could be arrested without a warrant and jailed for 2 years with hard labour. Te Whiti was arrested and then held under the West Coast Peace Preservation Act of 1882, without warrant, charge, or trial, and jailed for 3 months. These two Acts are a precedent for the legislation that will be passed today\u2014a bill that will pass into law measures to introduce surveillance without warrants.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000281\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c3d9fd88-4715-419d-be08-e1c4eda7d09e\u0022\u003EWarrantless surveillance is warrantless surveillance, whether it is for 48 hours or 24 hours. It makes no substantive difference. We have been here before. We have brought into law legislation that does away with basic human rights through the initiative of warrantless search and surveillance. Although we welcome the fact that the amended bill has cut back the time frame for the Security Intelligence Service to conduct surveillance without a warrant from 48 hours to 24 hours, it is the principle at stake. Our constituents have clearly told us they do not trust the authorities with such extraordinary powers. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000282\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c3d9fd88-4715-419d-be08-e1c4eda7d09e\u0022\u003EOf course, we are as concerned as any party with the increased threats, and we accept the need for robust measures to be in place to ensure that spy agencies can respond rapidly to terrorist threats, hence the reason we disagree with the urgency under which this legislation is being considered. But with the shameful history of this nation and its disproportionate treatment of M\u0101ori under a questionable surveillance regime, we cannot willingly allow the rule of law to be cast aside to increase opportunities for spying on New Zealanders. Te Whiti o Rongomai and Tohu K\u0101kahi in the 1880s, the alleged Operation Leaf in 2004\u2014which supposedly gathered political intelligence on M\u0101ori though wire-taps and computer hacking\u2014and, fast-forward to 2007, the people of Ru\u0101toki and T\u016Bhoe, and Operation Eight. Just to be clear: we do not believe that a warrantless search can be justified under any circumstances. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000283\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c3d9fd88-4715-419d-be08-e1c4eda7d09e\u0022\u003EWe appreciated the changes made by the Foreign Affairs, Defence and Trade Committee, and we are gravely concerned about the rapidly evolving threat of terrorism both locally and internationally, but we truly believe that the capacity and capability of our safety and security measures can be increased without compromising on basic citizen rights\u2014compromises that, with overtones of racial profiling, may well infringe the rights of M\u0101ori, just as has happened in the past. Although there are considerable changes, the bill has not been subject to a full process of public scrutiny and still poses a number of issues. We therefore continue to oppose it.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022163d0b68-eb0e-4094-9bed-99e184f063e1\u0022 data-id=\u002282699440d1984e97b57d254bd96714e0\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000284\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022163d0b68-eb0e-4094-9bed-99e184f063e1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002282699440d1984e97b57d254bd96714e0\u0022\u003EJAMI-LEE ROSS (National\u2014Botany):\u003C/span\u003E It is common, when members on this side of the House rise to speak, to say that it is a pleasure to take a call on the bill. It is an often overused phrase that we use on this side of the House, and possibly one that is not quite appropriate on this bill. It is not a pleasure to have to be talking in the House about increasing powers for surveillance because our country is under threat. But the very fact that there are threats out there that are emerging in this world, and emerging at quite a fast pace, leads us to the situation where we do have to be talking in this House about an issue like this. Members and the public have already acknowledged that this bill is making its way through Parliament at quite a fast pace. We accept that. We also accept and understand that there is a need for this bill to be progressing at the pace that it is. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000285\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022163d0b68-eb0e-4094-9bed-99e184f063e1\u0022\u003EThe Foreign Affairs, Defence and Trade Committee members worked very well together over the past week or so to ensure that this bill came back to the House in the best possible manner in which it could. I do wish to join my colleagues in acknowledging the select committee staff and officials who supported us. I also want to acknowledge the bipartisan approach that the committee took as well. We National members did work extremely well with the Hon Phil Goff and David Shearer. We also worked very well with Kennedy Graham, who ultimately ended up opposing the bill, and we always knew that would happen. We also worked very well with Fletcher Tabuteau. I think that if the speech from New Zealand First had been given by Fletcher Tabuteau, we would have had a far more informed speech on the bill, not one of the general rants that Mr Peters has. We would have had a very informed speech, and Mr Tabuteau did make some very good contributions in the select committee that did help to improve the bill. Those contributions from members to improve the bill came from all sides of Parliament. We did genuinely work very well together to try to improve the bill. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000286\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022163d0b68-eb0e-4094-9bed-99e184f063e1\u0022\u003EWe heard submissions about the need to reduce the warrantless surveillance time from 48 hours to 24 hours. Some called for less; some called for that power to not be inserted at all. New Zealand actually already does have warrantless surveillance power, in extraordinary circumstances, for the police. This is simply a change to our statutes that would allow the SIS to have that warrantless surveillance power as well. It is an extreme power. It would be used very rarely, but it is going to be put in the legislation for those emergency situations that the country might find itself in. To understand the reason why the warrantless surveillance power is needed, you have to remember that to get a warrant under normal circumstances for surveillance requires the Minister and the commissioner to sign off on it. You can probably imagine quite easily circumstances where the country\u2019s security would be at risk if those two individuals were not available in an emergency situation, and that is why this power is needed. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000287\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022163d0b68-eb0e-4094-9bed-99e184f063e1\u0022\u003EWe also received submissions around the need to tighten the scope for which surveillance can be undertaken; we did that. We received submissions around reducing the time frame for which the bill would operate from 3 years to 2 years; we did that. We also received submissions about increasing the fine if surveillance information that was acquired is not properly destroyed when it is required to be, and we have made changes to that provision as well. The select committee members worked very well together to improve this bill as much as we possibly could. We have a much better bill now before Parliament and I hope it continues to enjoy wide support in the House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022c699e7c6-53b9-470c-a14a-378cb6fc8a04\u0022 data-id=\u0022bc92fa4b4c564f94a7e00c32fb4af399\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000288\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c699e7c6-53b9-470c-a14a-378cb6fc8a04\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022bc92fa4b4c564f94a7e00c32fb4af399\u0022\u003EHon PHIL GOFF (Labour\u2014Mt Roskill):\u003C/span\u003E If substantial changes had not been made to this bill by the Foreign Affairs, Defence and Trade Committee I would not be standing up here, prepared to support it through its second reading and remaining stages, and nor would the Labour Party. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000289\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c699e7c6-53b9-470c-a14a-378cb6fc8a04\u0022\u003EFrankly, the process by which this bill has been handled was an absolute travesty, and I say that with due respect to Jami-Lee Ross\u2019s comments about the way that the select committee members cooperated. They did cooperate and they did get a better bill out of it. But to bring in a bill and in 2 weeks take it from first reading through to the final reading, which will happen this evening, is not good enough. It is against the democratic process of this House and against the right of New Zealanders to be properly consulted on and participate in legislation. The very worst type of process to ram through in those circumstances is a piece of legislation that gives substantial powers to a body that operates in secret because of its very nature. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000290\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c699e7c6-53b9-470c-a14a-378cb6fc8a04\u0022\u003EWhat we should be doing in this House is not only going through legislation comprehensively and thoroughly and maximising the public\u2019s right to participate but we should be building up the public\u2019s confidence that the powers that we give to organisations are properly put in place. When you have 2 days\u2014just 2 days\u2014for the public to prepare and present submissions, it is not the way that a democratic process should operate. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000291\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c699e7c6-53b9-470c-a14a-378cb6fc8a04\u0022\u003EIronically, normally we would have advertised this bill across a range of newspapers and it would have been less high-profile than it was. It was the Government\u2019s decision to act in this way that got it on Television One and TV3. The submissions flooded in. We got just under 600 of them, and we would have had more submissions but for the fact that that the web went down under pressure on a couple of occasions. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000292\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c699e7c6-53b9-470c-a14a-378cb6fc8a04\u0022\u003EI have got to say that there was one thing in common amongst all the submissions that were made on this bill. Whether it was the lofty New Zealand Law Society with a submission prepared by 10 of our most eminent jurists in the country, or whether it was by the New Zealander who was making his or her first ever submission to a select committee, they all said one thing. They said: \u201CThis process is wrong. It stinks. You can\u2019t expect us to respond in 48 hours and do the job that we need to on this legislation.\u201D \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000293\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c699e7c6-53b9-470c-a14a-378cb6fc8a04\u0022\u003EThis legislation should never have gone through in this time frame. If it were not for the fact that we worked extraordinary hours to hear everybody who was capable of getting to the committee and for the fact that the Government relented on its determination to push through things under urgency that were not justified to be pushed through under urgency, we would not be supporting it. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000294\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c699e7c6-53b9-470c-a14a-378cb6fc8a04\u0022\u003EI have to say that one of the downsides of the way that we dealt with the legislation was the way in which the community that feels that it is the most targeted and affected by it was not engaged as thoroughly as it should have been\u2014that is, the Muslim community. David Shearer and I met with members of the Muslim community early on, when this bill was first being talked about. They expressed their concerns to us about it and they expressed their concerns to the select committee. Their concerns were of a number of different natures. One was that they said they are New Zealanders: \u201CWe are not Muslims in New Zealand; we are Muslims from New Zealand. This is our country. Why is it that we cannot get to talk to the Prime Minister about something that we think will intimately affect the lives of our community? We cannot even get to talk to the Minister for Ethnic Communities. They did not have time.\u201D\u2014they did not have time. They said to us: \u201CIt is funny that when it was about halal killing of export meat, when the markets were closing and the Government desperately needed the help of the New Zealand Federation of Islamic Associations, the Ministers were over us like a rash. But when it is about us and the impact that this is having on us, they are not to be seen.\u201D \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000295\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c699e7c6-53b9-470c-a14a-378cb6fc8a04\u0022\u003EThey said\u2014and there were a number who made this point\u2014that because this awful organisation called Islamic State of Iraq and Syria (ISIS) or Islamic State of Iraq and the Levant misuses the name \u201CIslamic\u201D, the more the community hears the name \u201CIslamic State\u201D, the more it thinks that people who look different because they have a beard or wear a head shawl must be terrorists. What we were getting from the Muslim community were comments that they were being abused in the streets, and they said it did not help when the Prime Minister talked about beheadings. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000296\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c699e7c6-53b9-470c-a14a-378cb6fc8a04\u0022\u003EI have got to say to my colleagues in New Zealand First that it does not help when your leader, Winston Peters, talks about how we should not be bringing these people in from Muslim countries\u2014if I heard it right. I have got an electorate full of people who have come from the Middle East to escape oppression and have come here for a better life for their families. They are decent New Zealanders. They are hard-working. They are so grateful for the chance to have a decent and peaceful life in this country. I have got to tell you that when there is a problem in the Muslim community because some hothead or idiot talks about doing terrorist acts, they are the first to come down on those individuals and put them in their place. If they cannot do it themselves, they are the first to go to the authorities and report it. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000297\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c699e7c6-53b9-470c-a14a-378cb6fc8a04\u0022\u003EIf we want to know what will protect us most against terrorist acts in this country, it is not just this piece of legislation\u2014it is mainly not this piece of legislation. It is about the fact that we have developed in New Zealand, by and large, a harmonious and an inclusive community; it is about the fact that the people in our Muslim community are decent people and moderate people; and it is about the fact that through not engaging in the Iraq war in 2003, which was built on a lie, and because we are fiercely independent about being a nuclear-free New Zealand, the world sees New Zealand as an independent country and a decent and a fair country. Those are the things that most protect us against terrorism. If we lose those things, then we are at greater danger. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000298\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c699e7c6-53b9-470c-a14a-378cb6fc8a04\u0022\u003EThere is a role for security services in New Zealand. There are people in this country who are alienated and who are personality disordered\u2014that is the kindest way I can describe them. When they get a twisted philosophy such as the ISIS philosophy that tells them\u2014online, all the time\u2014that they should be out there committing terrorist acts and they will be rewarded with martyrdom and life for eternity because they do it, that is a risk to New Zealand. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000299\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c699e7c6-53b9-470c-a14a-378cb6fc8a04\u0022\u003EI do not want to exaggerate the risk. Our threat level, set by the Government, is low. \u201CLow\u201D means \u201Ca terrorist attack is possible but not likely\u201D. It is ironic, because in Australia, across the Ditch, it is at a high level. In the United Kingdom, it is at an extreme level. We are at a low level, but it could still happen. Sensible powers given to security intelligence organisations that use those powers within the law and do not abuse the powers are a sensible precaution. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000300\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c699e7c6-53b9-470c-a14a-378cb6fc8a04\u0022\u003EI am aware that the Security Intelligence Service does not always use its powers sensibly. I am a product of a misguided effort by the Director of Security to engage in a smear campaign through the Prime Minister\u2019s office to tell lies about me. But this is not about utu; this is about New Zealand and doing the right thing. We are doing the right thing in supporting this bill, but I want to say that the safeguards that we put in are critical. The narrowing of the scope, which would have given these intrusive powers to the SIS right across the scope of its activities, has been brought back, narrowing to the point that might possibly justify the legislation. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000301\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c699e7c6-53b9-470c-a14a-378cb6fc8a04\u0022\u003EI want to say one final thing to the Minister because it is an important point. I am in favour of stopping people leaving New Zealand who wish to contribute to an organisation that commits crimes against humanity and war crimes. I am not in favour of stopping New Zealanders who go to fight for a cause that they believe in. It might be the Kurdish people in my electorate who want to support their family in Kobani against ISIS, or it might be the Syrian families in your electorate or my electorate who want to fight for democracy against the oppressive regime of al-Assad. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000302\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c699e7c6-53b9-470c-a14a-378cb6fc8a04\u0022\u003EWe were assured at the select committee that these people would not be affected by this legislation, so I was a little concerned when I heard the Minister on Q\u002BA suggesting otherwise. I would like, in the Committee stage, an assurance from the Minister that people who go to fight for what is right will not have the freedoms that they are guaranteed under our New Zealand Bill of Rights taken away from them. Yes\u2014an end to those who are going to fight for terrorist organisations committing crimes against humanity, but not an end to people who want to fight for what they believe in to protect their families and do the right thing. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022656487fe-e0a2-485c-8dc2-fe61b9aec128\u0022 data-id=\u002235ccdb2fdd3e4a248c36e5270235fc74\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000303\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022656487fe-e0a2-485c-8dc2-fe61b9aec128\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002235ccdb2fdd3e4a248c36e5270235fc74\u0022\u003EDr JIAN YANG (National):\u003C/span\u003E I take a very short call on this Countering Terrorist Fighters Legislation Bill. I would like to thank the Foreign Affairs, Defence and Trade Committee chair, Mark Mitchell, and the other committee members, including Opposition members like David Shearer, the Hon Phil Goff, and Dr Kennedy Graham, for their contribution to this bill. They made a number of constructive suggestions that have been adopted. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000304\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022656487fe-e0a2-485c-8dc2-fe61b9aec128\u0022\u003ENew Zealand is known for its peace and harmony. At the same time, we realise we are not isolated from the rest of the world, and therefore we need to react to what is happening in other parts of the world. We are a loyal supporter of the UN Security Council, and, of course, we have responsibilities in responding to or implementing UN resolutions. This bill ensures that New Zealand fulfils its obligations in relation to UN Security Council Resolution 2178, so I commend the bill to the House. Thank you.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000305\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022656487fe-e0a2-485c-8dc2-fe61b9aec128\u0022\u003EThe question was put that the amendments recommended by the Foreign Affairs, Defence and Trade Committee by majority be agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca id=\u00228033e2071ab34263930c2c0146b78bc0\u0022 name=\u0022division\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EA party vote was called for on the question, That the question be agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EAyes 94\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand National 60; New Zealand Labour 32; ACT New Zealand 1; United Future 1.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENoes 27\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EGreen Party 14; New Zealand First 11; M\u0101ori Party 2. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EQuestion agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca id=\u0022816c5d5a3601414aabf9eaf443d164d7\u0022 name=\u0022division\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EA party vote was called for on the question, That the Countering Terrorist Fighters Legislation Bill be now read a second time.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EAyes 94\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand National 60; New Zealand Labour 32; ACT New Zealand 1; United Future 1.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENoes 27\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EGreen Party 14; New Zealand First 11; M\u0101ori Party 2. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EBill read a second time.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000306\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u0022052de5ccd61f4e7c9c397e9fdfbd90ae\u0022\u003EInstruction to Committee\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022 data-id=\u0022aed8e1b633af4b36b1b62603dbebe6a2\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000307\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022aed8e1b633af4b36b1b62603dbebe6a2\u0022\u003ERt Hon WINSTON PETERS (Leader\u2014NZ First):\u003C/span\u003E I move, That it be an instruction to the Committee of the whole House on the Countering Terrorist Fighters Legislation Bill that it have the authority to consider and, if it thinks fit, adopt the amendments in my name set out on Supplementary Order Paper 43. In the second reading I referred to the fact that in 2007 a great number of the members of this House thought it was wise to get rid of the sedition laws in the Crimes Act. Back then one party said that this was a very foolish move and that it was naive in the extreme, and we\u2014and we alone\u2014opposed it. For the interest of some of the members of this House who today want to appear as paragons of virtue in respect of the defence of their nation, it begs the question: what were you doing back then? \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000308\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022\u003EI want to make it very clear that this country has become terribly naive when it comes to securing and protecting its citizens, and that is what the Crimes (Repeal of Seditious Offences) Amendment Act did in 2007. All sorts of weak-kneed decisions have led to this country having very bad border control. Incidentally, we never said we were opposed to Muslims coming this country; we said we were opposed to people not being carefully screened as to whether they appreciated the need when they came here to have some respect for our laws, our traditions, our values, and those things that make New Zealand what it is. That is what I said. I am not having New Zealand First misquoted by johnny-come-latelys who, whenever they are politically embarrassed, do not want to own up to their naivety and stupidity, but rather would try to say\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000309\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002219a96fb6a9854225a9bbc33fe2875a93\u0022\u003EThe ASSISTANT SPEAKER (Hon Trevor Mallard)\u003C/span\u003E: Order! I would just like to remind the right honourable member\u2014because this is a process that is relatively rarely followed\u2014of Standing Order 176 and also, in particular, Speaker\u2019s ruling 81(1), which make it clear that this is a very narrow debate that cannot go to the substance of the amendment, just whether the Committee should debate it. It certainly cannot go to the history leading up to it. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000310\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002277a1e3edb7e442db84c195d4d0216d16\u0022\u003ERt Hon WINSTON PETERS\u003C/span\u003E: Thank you very much for giving me that warning after I have had a chance to repeat it. This is a debating chamber, of course, and we are talking about provisions to do with this country\u2019s security, whether it be the major bill that we are looking at, decisions we have taken in the past, or an alternative. We in New Zealand First are saying that there is in our law, and throughout the law of the Commonwealth\u2014probably one of the finest systems of law in the world, the British system of law\u2014a rising problem. We had this safeguard that could be used. We did away with it naively. We are saying that with one simple amendment we could reintroduce it and have some real security in the future, rather than panic measures to please commitments we have made offshore without telling the New Zealand people.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002241146229-4d11-415b-a4ac-f4e2b923e95d\u0022 data-id=\u00222daf4c9bafbf46b789bfca00cefbad42\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000311\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002241146229-4d11-415b-a4ac-f4e2b923e95d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00222daf4c9bafbf46b789bfca00cefbad42\u0022\u003EHon CHRISTOPHER FINLAYSON (Minister in charge of the NZ Security Intelligence Service)\u003C/span\u003E: There are two reasons why this is a dopey motion. First, it is out of scope\u2014there is a very limited set of amendments that we are seeking to debate here. Second, as I said some weeks ago at the first reading\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000312\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002267545152e01d439283d962947b78d7a6\u0022\u003EThe ASSISTANT SPEAKER (Hon Trevor Mallard)\u003C/span\u003E: Could I just sit the member down? I know he is not deliberately criticising the Chair, but if it was totally out of scope, then of course I would have ruled it out.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000313\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002241146229-4d11-415b-a4ac-f4e2b923e95d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022865c0654c8df4d4c999c201a7ca2c2d1\u0022\u003EHon CHRISTOPHER FINLAYSON\u003C/span\u003E: Thank you for your wisdom, Mr Assistant Speaker. The second point is that next year there is going to be a substantive review of Part 5 of the Crimes Act, where sedition was before it was rightfully repealed in 2007, and there will be ample opportunity to look at those substantive propositions in a careful and considered way. That is why what he suggests is\u2014not surprisingly\u2014dopey.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca id=\u002237a3dafd8ccb4a6baf8efedccf3a14ba\u0022 name=\u0022division\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EA party vote was called for on the question, That the motion be agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EAyes 11\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand First 11.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENoes 96\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand National 60; New Zealand Labour 32; ; M\u0101ori Party 2; ACT New Zealand 1; United Future 1.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EAbstentions 14\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EGreen Party 14. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EMotion not agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000314\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u002257332d012f164c08886184565cd40874\u0022\u003EIn Committee\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022893adc11-ce4e-419c-a079-08f04b3d75f5\u0022 data-id=\u00227beb624a5ff84e509d73ed1c130c9e44\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000315\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022893adc11-ce4e-419c-a079-08f04b3d75f5\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00227beb624a5ff84e509d73ed1c130c9e44\u0022\u003EThe CHAIRPERSON (Lindsay Tisch)\u003C/span\u003E: In accordance with a determination of the Business Committee, the provisions of this bill will be debated as one question, with the questions put separately at the conclusion of the debate.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000316\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u00225ecefd7722b44872b0e108cd6a95ecd6\u0022\u003EParts 1 and 2, schedule, and clauses 1 and 2\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002241146229-4d11-415b-a4ac-f4e2b923e95d\u0022 data-id=\u0022dcd0bc633a19431bbdc24b0454df4fc5\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000317\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002241146229-4d11-415b-a4ac-f4e2b923e95d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022dcd0bc633a19431bbdc24b0454df4fc5\u0022\u003EHon CHRISTOPHER FINLAYSON (Minister in charge of the NZ Security Intelligence Service)\u003C/span\u003E: It may be helpful if I just make some preliminary comments on a couple of key aspects of the bill. What the bill does is make targeted amendments to enhance powers to monitor and investigate and to restrict and disrupt the travel of foreign terrorist fighters and other violent extremists. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000318\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002241146229-4d11-415b-a4ac-f4e2b923e95d\u0022\u003EThe first set of amendments deals with amendments to the Passports Act. The amendments are subject to a sunset clause, so that clause expires on 1 April 2017. That was amended by the Foreign Affairs, Defence and Trade Committee from 1 April 2018. The purposes of the changes to the Passports Act are to improve its operation and take into account the United Nations Security Council Resolution 2178, which asks States to restrict the movements of foreign terrorist fighters, including their onward travel if outside their home country. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000319\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002241146229-4d11-415b-a4ac-f4e2b923e95d\u0022\u003ELet us take a look at what is proposed. First one goes, under the current Passports Act, to section 8A. Travel documents can be cancelled if a person is a danger to the security of this country because they intend to engage in, or facilitate, a terrorist act. At the same time when one is looking at that, one needs to bear in mind section 5 of the Terrorism Suppression Act 2002, which defines what a \u201Cterrorist act\u201D is. So it allows the cancellation of a passport of a suspected foreign terrorist fighter, and, as I said, section 5 of the Terrorism Suppression Act sets out what a terrorist act is. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000320\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002241146229-4d11-415b-a4ac-f4e2b923e95d\u0022\u003EWhat we seek to achieve under the amended proposal is to clarify and make it explicit that a passport or travel document can be cancelled on the grounds that a person is a danger to a country other than New Zealand because they intend to engage in or facilitate a terrorist act. I say this immediately\u2014I thought I had said it in my second reading speech\u2014and I emphasise to Mr Goff, who asked some questions of me, that those of his constituents who want to go and defend or provide help to their families in the circumstances he outlined would not engage the cancellation proposals here, provided, of course, that they are not engaging in terrorist acts. From the way he described it, they certainly would not come under that category. What we are not seeking to do is what the Australian legislation does\u2014that is, declare an entire region of the Earth off limits to our citizens. But it comes back time and time again to that definition of a \u201Cterrorist act\u201D. I hope that clarifies it for the honourable member.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000321\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002241146229-4d11-415b-a4ac-f4e2b923e95d\u0022\u003EThe second thing relates to the duration of a cancellation or refusal to issue. Under the current legislation\u2014I refer to section 8A(2) of the Passports Act\u2014passports can be cancelled or refused for a period of 12 months. In this bill, there is a default cancellation or refusal period of 12 months, but it authorises the Minister of Internal Affairs to specify a period of up to 36 months if the Minister is satisfied that the person would continue to pose a danger to New Zealand or any other country. I will not go through the safeguards on the exercise of this power, including rights of appeal to the High Court judicial review and so on. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000322\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002241146229-4d11-415b-a4ac-f4e2b923e95d\u0022\u003EI do not intend, unless honourable members have questions for me, to go through the particular changes to the Customs and Excise Act and the Immigration Act. What I do want to do is say something about the proposed amendments to the New Zealand Security Intelligence Service Act 1969, set out in Subpart 2 of Part 2. The first deals with visual surveillance. Under the 1969 legislation the SIS cannot obtain a warrant to conduct visual surveillance. The police have this power, and that was provided in the Search and Surveillance Act 2012. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000323\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002241146229-4d11-415b-a4ac-f4e2b923e95d\u0022\u003EThe proposals will mean that the SIS will be able to obtain a warrant to conduct visual surveillance, subject to the same conditions and safeguards as intelligence warrants. The warrants will be available only for the detection, investigation, or prevention of any actual, potential, or suspected terrorist act or facilitation of a terrorist act. I emphasise those phrases because the limitation was inserted by the select committee and, frankly, I think it is a very good limitation. The strengthened office of the Inspector-General of Intelligence and Security will provide external oversight of the warrants, and the bill requires the Director of Security to provide a copy of the warrant to the inspector-general as soon as practicable after it is issued. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000324\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002241146229-4d11-415b-a4ac-f4e2b923e95d\u0022\u003EThe second set of amendments deals with surveillance in situations of emergency. Under the current legislation, the SIS cannot act without a warrant in situations of emergency or urgency, though the police have the power to conduct surveillance for up to 48 hours without a warrant in such cases. Under these proposals, the director will be able to authorise surveillance activities to be undertaken in situations of emergency for a period of up to 24 hours. As is clear, that was reduced from 48 hours by the select committee, and we are perfectly happy with that. After that, a warrant must be obtained to continue surveillance. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000325\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002241146229-4d11-415b-a4ac-f4e2b923e95d\u0022\u003EI thought the select committee inserted a number of very sensible safeguards, including that the director must be satisfied that the threshold for issuing a warrant is met. Authorisations can be granted only for specific purposes. Supplementary Order Paper 39 makes it clear that only the director can issue the authorisation. The director must notify the Minister, the inspector-general, and the Commissioner of Security Warrants immediately. The Minister and commissioner can order the New Zealand SIS to discontinue any activity under the authorisation. Importantly, no further application may be made for an authorisation in respect of the same subject matter. If no warrant application is made to the director, then the director must provide a report to the Minister and the commissioner setting out reasons why it was not done. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000326\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002241146229-4d11-415b-a4ac-f4e2b923e95d\u0022\u003EThese, I think, are very sensible constraints that have been added by the select committee. The Government, as was very clear, was very happy to support them. When the general review of the legislation is conducted next year there is going to be ample time to take a good look at them and see whether they are working or whether further amendments are required. They are the only points I wanted to raise with the Committee at this stage. I have jumped over customs and excise and immigration, but I thought they were the clauses that warranted detailed consideration.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022c699e7c6-53b9-470c-a14a-378cb6fc8a04\u0022 data-id=\u00222c2f33538b1b4baa98a44cdb164321de\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000327\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c699e7c6-53b9-470c-a14a-378cb6fc8a04\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00222c2f33538b1b4baa98a44cdb164321de\u0022\u003EHon PHIL GOFF (Labour\u2014Mt Roskill):\u003C/span\u003E I want to thank the Minister in charge of the NZ Security Intelligence Service, Chris Finlayson, for his assurance in the Committee about the two instances that I mentioned\u2014people who might be going to protect their families against the Islamic State of Iraq and Syria (ISIS), who might be under siege in Kobani on the Turkish border; and people who are going to fight for the Free Syrian Army for a democratic and free Syria that respects human rights. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000328\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c699e7c6-53b9-470c-a14a-378cb6fc8a04\u0022\u003EI have got the Minister\u2019s quote from Q\u002BA. If I could perhaps get the Minister\u2019s attention and get him to listen to this, it seems to contradict the assurance that he has just given us in the Committee. This is the quote from Q\u002BA, presuming the New Zealand Herald is quoting him accurately. This is from Mr Finlayson: \u201CWe do not want any New Zealanders getting caught up in this mess in the Middle East \u2026 whether they go off and want to fight for the Kurds or want to fight for ISIL.\u201D The point that I just made to the Minister was that if I were a Kurdish refugee living in New Zealand and I was watching the slaughter of my people in Syria, I might just be inclined\u2014if I was of that age\u2014to want to go and support my family there. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000329\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c699e7c6-53b9-470c-a14a-378cb6fc8a04\u0022\u003EThe fundamental thing that the Minister has the right to object to, I think, is somebody going to fight for a designated terrorist organisation that is doing acts against humanity and committing war crimes. I understand that. The United Nations Security Council Resolution 2178 says that we should take every step that we can to prevent that happening. I am really worried, however, if we go beyond that resolution. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000330\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c699e7c6-53b9-470c-a14a-378cb6fc8a04\u0022\u003EResolution 2178 was, supposedly, the resolution that was one of the reasons for the urgency of this legislation. But I believe that a New Zealander has the fundamental right to travel in other than that very narrow band of circumstances, where they are going to aid and abet the commission of war crimes. Yes, of course we should stop that. We are obliged to do so internationally, we are obliged to do so under our responsibility to protect, and we are obliged to do so in all humanity. But the Minister\u2019s comments and the comments that he made in the House during the second reading\u2014and, again, I wrote down what he said\u2014were this: \u201CThe main point is we do not want New Zealanders getting involved.\u201D It might not be sensible for a New Zealander to go and fight in Kobani\u2014they are putting their life at risk\u2014but they might believe fundamentally that that is the right thing to do to protect their people, their families, and their homes, and I do not think that this House has any place stopping somebody from going to engage in a conflict for those reasons. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000331\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c699e7c6-53b9-470c-a14a-378cb6fc8a04\u0022\u003ESome years ago I passed legislation in this House that stopped mercenary fighters\u2014that is, where you go overseas to kill somebody for money\u2014and I believe that it is equally justifiable, under the Passports Act, to withhold the ability of a person to travel to do that or to commit crimes against humanity. My father\u2019s generation contained people who proudly went to fight against Fascism in the Spanish Civil War. We are proud of the people who did that, and I would not want to see this legislation, in the 21st century, preventing what a former generation did, which was to fight for democracy and for human rights against oppression\u2014as against the legislation here, which quite properly would prevent people from fighting for a terrorist organisation, committing crimes against humanity. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000332\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c699e7c6-53b9-470c-a14a-378cb6fc8a04\u0022\u003EThe legislation obviously takes its definition from the Terrorism Suppression Act 2002. I regret that there was an amendment to that, around 2007, I think, which means that all sorts of things could be defined as terrorism. You could define going to fight against apartheid and for Nelson Mandela as terrorism. Is that really what we would want to have in our legislation\u2014that we could interpret it as being to prevent that sort of thing happening? So I do seek a clearer definition from the Minister as to when these amendments to the Passports Act might be invoked and when they would not be invoked, because, clearly, officials gave me the assurance that they would not be invoked in the two cases that I mentioned to the Minister not so long ago. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000333\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c699e7c6-53b9-470c-a14a-378cb6fc8a04\u0022\u003EI want to just make a couple of other quick points about the passports legislation. I understand that there may be a reason to need to temporarily suspend a passport for 10 days, as is done in clause 7(1), such as where you think a person may be going to fight for a designated terrorist organisation and you want to stop that person. I have no particular problem with that clause. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000334\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c699e7c6-53b9-470c-a14a-378cb6fc8a04\u0022\u003EI welcome clarification from the Minister on another point, and that is a point that many submitters came to the Foreign Affairs, Defence and Trade Committee about. They said: \u201CYou are clarifying the right to take away a passport from a person who is already overseas. This will render people stateless and this will prevent them from coming home. And the best way to help a terrorist organisation is to not allow a person who might have been led into contributing to ISIS to come home and escape from that.\u201D I think the explanation given was a good explanation: this does not render people stateless, it does not affect their citizenship, and the Minister must\u2014the word in the legislation is \u201Cmust\u201D\u2014provide a journey-specific emergency travel document for them to get home. I have no problem with those two aspects of the changes to the Passports Act. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000335\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c699e7c6-53b9-470c-a14a-378cb6fc8a04\u0022\u003EThe problem that my colleagues in the Opposition parties and I had was the concept that we needed to withdraw a passport for 3 years. This was something that the New Zealand Law Society, in its submission led by Sir Geoffrey Palmer, also had a problem with. The point is this: under the current Passports Act you can already deny a person a passport for a year and then you can renew the denial further. When I asked officials the question as to whether anybody who has been denied a passport\u2014and it is a very small number of people\u2014is now pressing for judicial review or taking court action that might lead them to be able to regain their passport and go over overseas, the answer was no. Three years is a long period of time. I would have thought that legislation introduced under urgency and rushed through the House to deal with a specific problem would be limited to dealing with that problem. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000336\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c699e7c6-53b9-470c-a14a-378cb6fc8a04\u0022\u003EThe one point the Labour Party put to the Government that was not accepted was the issue of whether you actually needed to change that 3-year designated period. Under proper consideration and in the normal course of a bill going through scrutiny and analysis, you might be able to prove to me that that is a good thing. But what the Minister could not prove to me\u2014and nor could you, Mr Chair\u2014is that you needed to do this immediately in this piece of legislation, under urgency. I asked the question repeatedly, as did my colleagues, why it is needed to extend that period of denial of passport to 3 years in one go, after the first year of denying the passport. Why can that not wait until a substantive review takes place, legislation comes into the House in the normal way, and it is considered before a select committee? Why do we have to do this now? There is no evidence that this is needed now, immediately, and before that review takes place. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000337\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c699e7c6-53b9-470c-a14a-378cb6fc8a04\u0022\u003EI would be grateful if the Minister could take another call and just answer those two points. Firstly, why 3 years, when there is no apparent need to do it urgently? And, secondly, could he just clarify what he is quoted as saying on Q\u002BA on Television One and what he has said to the House? I am still left in some doubt as to whether my constituents, in the circumstances I have explained, would actually be able to leave countries overseas, given the transcript of what he said on Q\u002BA.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002247c29b78-eee0-4c91-afdf-7b07be780e1a\u0022 data-id=\u0022ad68257b0104420b85e0f0cbcb99a131\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000338\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002247c29b78-eee0-4c91-afdf-7b07be780e1a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022ad68257b0104420b85e0f0cbcb99a131\u0022\u003EDENIS O\u2019ROURKE (NZ First):\u003C/span\u003E At its first reading, New Zealand First supported this bill to the select committee, but I said then that we would not necessarily support it any further. Since then, two things have become clear. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000339\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002247c29b78-eee0-4c91-afdf-7b07be780e1a\u0022\u003EFirstly, in terms of context, we know now that the Government, despite its unconvincing denials, has been planning military engagement in Iraq with a sizable number of troops. This is not what most people want and it is not what New Zealand First wants. We want to stay out of it. If the Islamic State of Iraq and Syria did not know of New Zealand before now, then it certainly does at this stage. We are now definitely an active and direct enemy. That means an increased risk for New Zealand, not a lesser risk. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000340\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002247c29b78-eee0-4c91-afdf-7b07be780e1a\u0022\u003ESecondly, we have learnt that the great majority of people who submitted do not want this bill because it means giving up some important rights without sufficient cause and without any genuine case for urgency having been made out. Mr Fletcher Tabuteau is going to speak more about what the people who submitted to the select committee said. But I want to simply say this: New Zealand First does not support the deployment of New Zealand troops to Iraq on any basis\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000341\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00228d57c08d6e744e3b8bf448cdf469d233\u0022\u003EThe CHAIRPERSON (Hon Trevor Mallard)\u003C/span\u003E: Order! Can I remind the member we are now in the Committee stage. We have accepted the principle of the bill, and we are now discussing the specific clauses in the Committee, as to whether or not the Committee accepts specific clauses. Therefore, it is important to address those clauses.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000342\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002247c29b78-eee0-4c91-afdf-7b07be780e1a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022113f1fe9f8ef4a919c409c47db7d8dda\u0022\u003EDENIS O\u2019ROURKE\u003C/span\u003E: I certainly will be doing that. I was saying that there is no urgent or sufficient threat to New Zealand to justify any of the clauses of this bill. The assessed threat is \u201Clow\u201D and it is not expected, so it is very sad to see Labour supporting the contents of this bill. It is not just the contents but also the disgraceful fast tracking of it that has upset so many people and treated the public with a lot of disdain, I think, along the way. We are entitled to ask, even at this stage, why the rush now, given that foreign fighters have been going to Syria and Iraq for months, if not years. Why was the public not told that the deployment of troops was planned during the election campaign? Why was the attack on human rights\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022 data-id=\u0022573fbd781f884667931ef00c49bda5cb\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000343\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022573fbd781f884667931ef00c49bda5cb\u0022\u003EThe CHAIRPERSON (Hon Trevor Mallard)\u003C/span\u003E: Order! [Interruption] Order! I have warned the member.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002292557bd5-0e66-473c-a6df-7d108e7822e3\u0022 data-id=\u0022b0eea3c4b8a9422eae9c8e2dd72e1b6e\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000344\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002292557bd5-0e66-473c-a6df-7d108e7822e3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022b0eea3c4b8a9422eae9c8e2dd72e1b6e\u0022\u003EDr KENNEDY GRAHAM (Green):\u003C/span\u003E I rise to address the two Supplementary Order Papers that the Green Party has put forward in my name\u2014Supplementary Order Paper 41 and Supplementary Order Paper 42. I wish to try to explain those and explore them with the Committee, and respectfully invite the Minister in charge of the NZ Security Intelligence Service to address them and explain his Government\u2019s reasons, perhaps necessarily, for opposing them. They are put forward with constructive intent. As I think, Mr Chairman, you mentioned, we are now in the Committee stage where we have accepted the underlying purpose of the bill, even though the Green Party opposed it, and so we are constructively seeking to improve the bill. Supplementary Order Paper 41 essentially brings forward the sunset date from 31 March 2017 to 30 June 2015 in respect of all three pieces of legislation. The purpose of that is to ensure that this bill would expire in advance of the review of the legislation. I have no further explanation for that, other than to put it to the Committee for its consideration. We think the argument is sufficient to do that, for reasons that no doubt are self-evident. If they are not accepted, that will be the will of the Committee. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000345\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002292557bd5-0e66-473c-a6df-7d108e7822e3\u0022\u003EI want to devote more of my time to Supplementary Order Paper 42, which has essentially a purpose clause. We do believe that the omission initially from the omnibus bill of a statement of general purpose was a major shortcoming. Now that it is to be divided into three bills, we would simply recommend that the statement of general purpose be identical in each of those three amendments to those bills. The purpose of that is with a view to trying to get some clarity in it. I listened through the select committee hearings and also to the Minister this afternoon explaining a view that the three bills, in their current form, are \u201Ctolerably clear\u201D, which is a good play on words, reflecting some of the select committee\u2019s deliberations. Our response is that \u201Ctolerably clear\u201D is not sufficient for legislation, certainly in criminal legislation, and also, with equal force, in legislation that essentially curtails civil liberties in the name of an expansion of State powers. It is not sufficient to have it tolerably clear. In our humble view, it actually is not tolerably clear, but even if it were, that is not a sufficient threshold.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000346\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002292557bd5-0e66-473c-a6df-7d108e7822e3\u0022\u003EWhy do we say that? Here I am, still sitting at the feet of the Minister and his governmental colleagues, trying to understand the logical thread by which we get to where we are. What has happened in the last 12 months that has logically prompted us, all the way through, to a stage where we are planting covert surveillance cameras in bedrooms and bathrooms in the name of some new qualitative development? That is the question. If it is sufficient, then the Government should have the capacity, the will, and the integrity to the people to make that blindingly clear\u2014rigorously, necessarily clear\u2014to everybody\u2019s satisfaction. We are not convinced that that has occurred yet, so we have put a statement of purpose in. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000347\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002292557bd5-0e66-473c-a6df-7d108e7822e3\u0022\u003EIf I try to follow that logic that I was talking about, I begin with the Prime Minister\u2019s speech of 5 November and I take out two points. One is a game-changer to the security of New Zealand: \u201CMuch of that\u201D\u2014\u201Cmuch\u201D; I grant you \u201Cmuch\u201D\u2014\u201Cis due to the rapid rise of the Islamic State of Iraq and Levant, or ISIL.\u201D Further, he said: \u201CShould they return to New Zealand fully radicalised and skilled in fighting, they would represent a significant threat \u2026\u201D. I recognise there are two components there: full radicalisation and fighting skill. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000348\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002292557bd5-0e66-473c-a6df-7d108e7822e3\u0022\u003ESuppose I said I have been to the Middle East. I lived there 3 years. I have been there within the last couple of years. I have been there. I have returned. I tell you now I am not skilled in fighting. I could declare to the Committee that I am a pacifist. I am not; but let me declare, hypothetically, I am a pacifist. I then say I am tempted to conclude, having listened to people around New Zealand, that humanity should live under a universal caliphate with strong sharia law. Am I then fully radicalised? Am I a fully radicalised pacifist? I recognise that I would not meet the definition of terrorism\u2014presumably\u2014but I want to know whether I am radicalised. If we are going to pass an intrusive State power bill and it rests on the concept of full radicalisation, the Government owes it to the people to also make clear what in the New Zealand Government\u2019s humble view is full radicalisation. This is the basis of the Prime Minister\u2019s speech. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000349\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002292557bd5-0e66-473c-a6df-7d108e7822e3\u0022\u003EWe then think, right, on the basis of that we look to the bill. The bill itself was introduced initially by the Minister on 25 November. Presumably, it was introduced in his capacity as Minister in charge of the NZ Security Intelligence Service. In its enthusiasm, Hansard has written him up as Minister for Treaty of Waitangi Negotiations and there may need to be a correction, if that has not occurred yet, because that is a somewhat unfortunate Freudian slip. We look to the bill and we find no definition of \u201Cradicalisation\u201D, no definition of \u201Cforeign terrorist fighter\u201D, and no definition of the other phrase, \u201Cother violent extremists\u201D. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000350\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002292557bd5-0e66-473c-a6df-7d108e7822e3\u0022\u003EWe look to the explanatory note for help and the explanatory note says two things: the provisions of the bill reflect in part New Zealand\u2019s international obligation to comply with United Nations Security Council Resolution 2178, which includes concern about people travelling to become foreign terrorist fighters and it urges States to restrict their movements. It says the provisions of the bill reflect \u201Cin part\u201D Resolution 2178. So, if it is only in part, one would think that with a bill of this magnitude and import, the Government would say what the other parts of the reasons were. But it does not\u2014it is totally silent. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000351\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002292557bd5-0e66-473c-a6df-7d108e7822e3\u0022\u003EWe then look to the other part of the explanatory note, which explains: \u201CThe bill is a response to the rapidly evolving threat of terrorism both locally and internationally.\u201D And here is the critical statement: \u201CIt introduces short-term measures allowing the monitoring and investigation of foreign terrorist fighters and other violent extremists, and the restriction and disruption of their travel.\u201D That is the statement of purpose\u2014the nearest thing we have in the bill. It is not defined. That is the statement of purpose. The two concepts are not defined. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000352\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002292557bd5-0e66-473c-a6df-7d108e7822e3\u0022\u003ESo the Green Party feels the need to have a statement of purpose with a definition in each of the three bills that would read as follows. The purpose of each bill is threefold: one, it meets the obligations of Resolution 2178 \u201Cto combat threats to international peace and security caused by terrorist acts including those perpetrated by foreign terrorist fighters;\u201D. That is word for word from Resolution 2178. The second one \u201Censures that such action by New Zealand remains consistent with its obligations under international human rights law,\u201D and refugee and humanitarian law. That is there in Resolution 2178. It is acknowledged in passing in the explanatory note. It is not in the context of the bill. It is not in the text of the bill. The third one \u201Censures that such action by New Zealand is not associated with any religion, nationality, or civilisation.\u201D\u2014the same thing, taken from Resolution 2178. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000353\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002292557bd5-0e66-473c-a6df-7d108e7822e3\u0022\u003EThat gives a degree of balance in the bill. You are meeting the obligations under Resolution 2178, you are remaining consistent, hopefully, with all our human rights obligations, and you are ensuring that the action does not cut across any actions associated with religion, nationality, or civilisation\u2014and that is a trifold balance in the bill that is currently lacking. Then there is new subsection (3), defining the \u201Cforeign terrorist fighter\u201D, which is taken verbatim from Resolution 2178, as a person who travels to a State outside New Zealand for the purpose of perpetrating, planning, or preparation of a terrorist act, or of providing or receiving terrorist training, including in armed conflict. We seriously recommend that consideration be given to that.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022e11a5f05-1940-41b2-8f1e-911dba7a43a5\u0022 data-id=\u00229a7446f403ce4d928427065b15a0b295\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000354\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e11a5f05-1940-41b2-8f1e-911dba7a43a5\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00229a7446f403ce4d928427065b15a0b295\u0022\u003EFLETCHER TABUTEAU (NZ First):\u003C/span\u003E There have been quite a few issues raised in the debate this afternoon. I speak first on the passport issue, which seemed to slip through the conversation in the Foreign Affairs, Defence and Trade Committee\u2014kind of under the radar. It was not an issue of great debate, yet the issue was raised\u2014and it was raised again quite strongly by the honourable member\u2014that we are asking in the Countering Terrorist Fighters Legislation Bill to extend our right to remove a passport from 1 year, which it is currently, to 3 years. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000355\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e11a5f05-1940-41b2-8f1e-911dba7a43a5\u0022\u003EI asked numerous times whether we were not already complying with our requirements to the UN Security Council Resolution 2178. I was told repeatedly that, yes, under current law we comply with the resolution. We are prohibiting the movement of terrorist fighters, we are prohibiting them from leaving our country if we know that that is their intent, and we are prohibiting them from moving across borders in different parts of the world. That legislation exists already. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000356\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e11a5f05-1940-41b2-8f1e-911dba7a43a5\u0022\u003EWhen the honourable Minister in charge of the NZ Security Intelligence Service said how sensible this legislation sounded, I had to agree with him at the time because he is such a sensible-sounding member. But when you actually ask the question whether that compliance already exists in our New Zealand law, then you have to ask where the sense is. How is it sensible that we now remove the right of New Zealand citizens to have access to their passport for a period of 3 years, when in the select committee it was identified and discussed that already there are a very small number of individuals whose passports have been removed where that action has been taken? But it was also noted that at no point has it been necessary to extend that period of time. At no point has the SIS come forward and said: \u201CWe need more time. We need to extend it further.\u201D Where is the sense in that? \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000357\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e11a5f05-1940-41b2-8f1e-911dba7a43a5\u0022\u003EDr Kennedy Graham was speaking just now about our compliance with UN Security Council Resolution 2178, and I acknowledge that, yes, we do comply. We already comply. But, actually, what was noted there also was that the legislation spoke of only that part. The legislation made reference to \u201Ca part\u201D of the resolution. There are several other parts that ask this nation, this Government, to please take account of its citizens\u2019 human rights and their rights to privacy. That is also in the resolution. It explicitly states that it explicitly expects Governments to take consideration of individual human rights and privacy. It even speaks further about the practice of undermining those rights, leading to radicalisation, and that is something that we absolutely must avoid. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000358\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e11a5f05-1940-41b2-8f1e-911dba7a43a5\u0022\u003EAt the moment with the rhetoric that is being used in the presentation of this bill to the New Zealand public, and the rhetoric that is being used to present this bill to the members of the House, we are radicalising a minority group within this country and, in fact, we are already not complying with the UN Security Council Resolution 2178. We are countermanding the requirements there already.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000359\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e11a5f05-1940-41b2-8f1e-911dba7a43a5\u0022\u003EI just want to add my statement around the definitions of terrorism, the definitions that have been referenced in the legislation. It has already been acknowledged and it has been said very eloquently\u2014and I am adding my voice and the voice of New Zealand First to this conversation\u2014that, actually, there is no sensible definition of \u201Cterrorist\u201D. \u201CFreedom terrorist fighter\u201D is not even mentioned in the legislation apart from the title. The ludicrous statements and the use of reference to legislation where we have had members of this House investigated by the security agencies under those current definitions seems to be counterintuitive, and not just that, but undermining the democracy and the human rights of New Zealand citizens. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000360\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e11a5f05-1940-41b2-8f1e-911dba7a43a5\u0022\u003EWe are not clear about what defines a terrorist. We are not clear on what \u201Ccontributing to\u201D might look like. We are not clear on what\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022dfa851f0-ef7b-4834-bc41-1b3b645a3495\u0022 data-id=\u002200f73f5aa0e64fafa0530412a0d8267f\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000361\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dfa851f0-ef7b-4834-bc41-1b3b645a3495\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002200f73f5aa0e64fafa0530412a0d8267f\u0022\u003EDAVID SHEARER (Labour\u2014Mt Albert):\u003C/span\u003E I just want to invite the Minister in charge of the NZ Security Intelligence Service, as Kennedy Graham has just done, to reply to questions about Supplementary Order Paper 42, which Kennedy Graham has put forward. We have, obviously, seen it only recently, and in some ways it is a function of the way this has been sped through. We have not had a chance to perhaps look at these things because they have been contemplated, really, only over the last few days, but on the face of it I do not see it as being unreasonable. We do mention the Security Council Resolution 2178 in the commentary on the Countering Terrorist Fighters Legislation Bill. It is not mentioned specifically in the bill itself, and it would seem to me that, given that this is a narrow piece of legislation, it is there for a particular purpose\u2014in part to comply with Resolution 2178\u2014and it would not be unreasonable to look at that seriously. The definition of \u201Cforeign terrorist fighter\u201D that Mr Graham has put up comes out of Resolution 2178. It does not cross over some of the discussion we had at the Foreign Affairs, Defence and Trade Committee, which was around trying to redefine terrorism and terror as an act, which was a much bigger event that we will probably have to look at as a result of the bigger review we go into. Instead, this looks at and refers to just what this bill is ultimately about. I think that the Supplementary Order Paper is a thoughtful one and a good one, and I invite the Minister to perhaps take a call and give his thoughts on it. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000362\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dfa851f0-ef7b-4834-bc41-1b3b645a3495\u0022\u003EIn this legislation we are looking at a number of issues. There is the issue relating to the Passports Act, which people have spoken on. There are the amendments to the New Zealand Security Intelligence Service Act and the Customs and Excise Act. They are the three Acts that are being modified as a result of this bill. There are a number of contentious pieces of change that we have spent some time on: visual surveillance, warrantless surveillance, the passports issue, the interim nature of the bill, and access to the customs and excise databases.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000363\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dfa851f0-ef7b-4834-bc41-1b3b645a3495\u0022\u003E I want to speak on the first of those I just mentioned, which is visual surveillance. It was put to us in the select committee that there was an imbalance or an inconsistency between the SIS and the police. The police have the ability to conduct visual surveillance; the SIS do not. That was in part, it was explained to us, because the New Zealand Security Intelligence Act was very old. When the SIS first came into being, a camera in somebody\u2019s room would mean a 2-foot by 2-foot object in the corner, and, obviously, it would be noticed. That is not the case, obviously, any more. Cameras are invisible to people in their offices, their cars, their houses, or whatever, so people cannot observe them. We had a long discussion about this and the difference between the threshold that relates to the police and the threshold that relates to the SIS. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000364\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dfa851f0-ef7b-4834-bc41-1b3b645a3495\u0022\u003EThis is a point that was made by both the Legislation Advisory Committee and the Law Society: the police are given that authority by a consenting judge where the offence carries\u2014and there was a bit of disagreement between the Legislation Advisory Committee and the Law Society over this\u2014a term of imprisonment of between 7 years and 14 years. But it had to relate to a crime that it was seriously thought was going to be undertaken, or was in the process of being undertaken, and the seriousness of which brought a 7-year or 14-year imprisonment period. With the SIS it is somewhat different. The threshold is very different. It is about whether we suspect, or have an issue around knowing, that something unsavoury, if you like, might actually happen. We came to the position we did\u2014which was to make sure that if this provision was going to be brought in, it was made very narrow and contingent on whether it related to terrorism or the conducting of a terrorist act\u2014really to safeguard, I think, the definition that we were looking at, and the broader definition of security, which the SIS works under. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000365\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dfa851f0-ef7b-4834-bc41-1b3b645a3495\u0022\u003EThe broader definition for the SIS meant that it would look at, for example: \u201Cthe identification of foreign capabilities, intentions, or activities within or relating to New Zealand that impact on New Zealand\u2019s international well-being or economic well-being:\u201D, as stated in paragraph (b) of the definition of \u201Csecurity\u201D found in the interpretation clause of the New Zealand Security Intelligence Service Act. We felt that that threshold was a low threshold to enable this broadening of powers within the scope of this piece of legislation. So what we were looking at in terms of this bill was to ensure that we took a narrow view of what the threat was and related any measures that needed to counter that threat by the SIS to only that threat, which meant that it related only to the threat or the carrying out of a terrorist act. We were very concerned that without the ability to have a look at this bill in a wider context, we would enable visual surveillance to take place under the guise of a threat of terrorism but that it would relate to the much wider functions of the SIS, and we did not believe that that was where we wanted to go. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000366\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dfa851f0-ef7b-4834-bc41-1b3b645a3495\u0022\u003EObviously, any visual surveillance needs a warrant. There is a part in the legislation about warrantless surveillance, and I will come to that later on in the debate. But I do believe that that means that a warrant has to go to the Commissioner of Security Warrants. It also has to go to the Minister, and in addition to that the Inspector-General of Intelligence and Security needs to be informed. So we have an ability to have those safeguards in this interim piece of legislation, which I think will enable the public to have much more confidence that we have got the balance right. In addition, once the information that is obtained under a warrant for visual surveillance has been used it must be destroyed. Once again, we have a safeguard that this will not be kept in perpetuity. The director of the SIS must be sure and have sufficient evidence to ensure that a warrant for visual surveillance is well and truly justified. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000367\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dfa851f0-ef7b-4834-bc41-1b3b645a3495\u0022\u003EVisual surveillance, as many of the submitters said to us, is a far more intrusive form of surveillance than perhaps tapping somebody\u2019s phone or looking at somebody\u2019s computer. It means that there is a camera inside your house, your bedroom, your office, your car, or wherever. It therefore is beholden on us to make sure that the scope for allowing that to happen is made as narrow as possible and is very much related to the bill itself. I think we have ended up in a place where it does not allow a backdoor for visual surveillance to be used across a broad spectrum of the SIS\u2019s abilities and responsibilities but is restrained and constrained to that alone. I do believe that we have struck a reasonable balance on that. I am sure that when the broader review comes into being there will be a very strong submission made by the SIS that its powers need to be enhanced with regard to visual surveillance. I do not believe that it is simply a question of saying: \u201CThe police have got it, therefore we should have it\u201D. I do not believe that that was a good enough argument, which was made by the Law Society as well. The police and the SIS are operating in different circumstances, and on the basis of that we should be looking at the thresholds quite differently as well. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002248a02a21-c1ac-4159-8789-485ad614bd01\u0022 data-id=\u0022053769f260a04fc8be0d2be2249790f7\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000368\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002248a02a21-c1ac-4159-8789-485ad614bd01\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022053769f260a04fc8be0d2be2249790f7\u0022\u003EMARK MITCHELL (National\u2014Rodney):\u003C/span\u003E I just want to respond to a couple of the issues that have been raised. The first one that I want to talk to is the issue that Mr Goff raised, because we did have quite a lengthy discussion about this in the select committee. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000369\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002248a02a21-c1ac-4159-8789-485ad614bd01\u0022\u003EFirstly, I just want to say that, in relation to a Kiwi wanting to leave New Zealand in order to go and engage in a conflict somewhere else in the world, the actual legislation is very specific when it refers to a terrorist act. Of course, we have got the Terrorism Suppression Act 2002, section 5\u2014and I will come back to some of these points. We have got a very specific guideline that outlines for us very clearly what actions need to be met for an act to be deemed a terrorist act. Mr Goff raised a very good point. I think there is a wider issue that we should think about and reflect upon as a nation, and that is, do we want to be encouraging or allowing Kiwis to leave New Zealand to go and engage in any type of conflict, regardless of which side they may choose to participate on? I think he used Peshmerga in Kurdistan as an example. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000370\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002248a02a21-c1ac-4159-8789-485ad614bd01\u0022\u003EOne thing that I can safely say, having spent some time in the region myself\u2014in fact, a decade\u2014is that it is a very complicated situation that we are having to face. If there are 10 layers of complexity to it, then, after a decade of having been up there, I can safely say that I probably understand one of those layers. So a situation that you think on the face of it may present a certain set of circumstances is liable to change, and can change either quickly or more slowly over time. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000371\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002248a02a21-c1ac-4159-8789-485ad614bd01\u0022\u003EI think a far better and safer position for us to take as a country is to discourage and try to stop any Kiwis leaving New Zealand to go and take up arms and participate in a foreign conflict. But if they do, then we have got very clear guidelines available to us under the Terrorism Suppression Act, which clearly show us what ingredients need to be met, or what threshold needs to be met, for us to understand clearly what a terrorist act is. I will mention maybe just a couple of them. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000372\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002248a02a21-c1ac-4159-8789-485ad614bd01\u0022\u003EUnder section 5(1)(c) of the Terrorism Suppression Act: \u201Cthe act is a terrorist act in armed conflict (as defined by section 4(1)).\u201D It is intended, under subsection (2)(a) and (b): \u201Cto induce terror in a civilian population; or (b) to unduly compel or to force a government or an international organisation to do or abstain from doing any act.\u201D Subsection (3) states: \u201Cthe death of, or other serious bodily injury to, one or more persons (other than the person carrying out the act): (b) a serious risk to the health or safety of a population: [or] (c) the destruction of, or serious damage to, property of great value or importance, or major economic loss\u201D\u2014and that is actually a very important one. There is a fair bit of debate around that as well, because I am pretty sure that here in New Zealand if we were to suffer a major terrorist act at, say, the Port of Auckland or the Port of Tauranga, then it is going to have a pretty significant negative impact on our economy and well-being, not to mention the general, huge negative impact it would have on our psyche as a country. Subsection (3)(d) states: \u201Cserious interference with, or serious disruption to, an infrastructure facility, if likely to endanger human life:\u201D. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000373\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002248a02a21-c1ac-4159-8789-485ad614bd01\u0022\u003EThat is about half of the criteria. So it is actually very, very clear, if you refer to the Terrorism Suppression Act 2002, in terms of the threshold that has to be met to define someone as a terrorist. This bill is about stopping people leaving New Zealand to engage in acts of terrorism as a terrorist. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000374\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002248a02a21-c1ac-4159-8789-485ad614bd01\u0022\u003EThe other point that I want to make, very quickly, is that we talked about the visual surveillance powers\u2014the warrantless powers\u2014that have been given to the SIS. Maybe to give a practical example of what could possibly occur would be a terrorist fighter who has been active and, for whatever reason, has been able to buy themselves a ticket on a flight out of the Middle East and arrives in New Zealand. We have to be able to watch that person for the first 12 to 24 hours when they arrive in the country. [Bell rung] If we did not have that ability\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000375\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022893adc11-ce4e-419c-a079-08f04b3d75f5\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022e8762244bd3743f7a598ff5b58f4b9d6\u0022\u003EThe CHAIRPERSON (Lindsay Tisch)\u003C/span\u003E: Order! \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000376\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002248a02a21-c1ac-4159-8789-485ad614bd01\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00229a66008a68d64a62925662611a55313b\u0022\u003EMARK MITCHELL\u003C/span\u003E: Sorry, sorry. Mr Chair. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000377\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022893adc11-ce4e-419c-a079-08f04b3d75f5\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022e82295ce055c4adc98280aa89db0c616\u0022\u003EThe CHAIRPERSON (Lindsay Tisch)\u003C/span\u003E: You must go for the call. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000378\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002248a02a21-c1ac-4159-8789-485ad614bd01\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022cff203fbba544bae8ff09feadc990df1\u0022\u003EMARK MITCHELL\u003C/span\u003E: Thank you, Mr Chair. If we did not have that ability, then, effectively, we could have someone who was in New Zealand\u2014we did not know the full intent of their visit or their reason for coming to the country and we had no ability, actually, to monitor them properly or try to gather the intelligence that we required to make that determination. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000379\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002248a02a21-c1ac-4159-8789-485ad614bd01\u0022\u003EI think this brings me back to the difference between the Search and Surveillance Act that the police have available to them and the visual surveillance powers that the SIS has. The SIS and the police have got very different roles. The police have to get a warrant through a High Court judge with the view to gathering evidence, with the view to taking a prosecution into our court system, whereas the SIS role is to gather information and gather intelligence to try to work out what the intent of that person is. At no time through that process are they intending to, or can they, prosecute that person in our court. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000380\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002248a02a21-c1ac-4159-8789-485ad614bd01\u0022\u003EIf during the course of that process it becomes apparent that the person is committing a crime, then, of course, there are abilities under the legislation to be able to engage the services of the police, and they would probably take over and then use their powers under the Search and Surveillance Act or the Crimes Act, or whatever they needed to do. I just wanted to be clear about the fact there are two very different roles here for our police service and for our SIS service. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000381\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002248a02a21-c1ac-4159-8789-485ad614bd01\u0022\u003EFinally, I just want to reiterate that I have listened very carefully to New Zealand First and their leader, the Rt Hon Winston Peters. To be honest with you I was surprised. I thought that New Zealand First would have supported this bill. I do not know whether raising an old piece of legislation around sedition, which was removed back in 2007, is a good reason to ignore the situation that we have to deal with presently, but that was the reason put up. I am surprised, because now we are faced with New Zealand First and the Green Party not supporting this bill. Thank you very much.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00220ee528dc-7870-4553-95ed-5ec0cab60f07\u0022 data-id=\u002202d03009a3fa4f8aad37b450ea7c947c\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000382\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220ee528dc-7870-4553-95ed-5ec0cab60f07\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002202d03009a3fa4f8aad37b450ea7c947c\u0022\u003ECATHERINE DELAHUNTY (Green):\u003C/span\u003E I would just like to take a brief call on the parts of the bill that have been a particular concern to many submitters. I do want to refer to some of the submissions that I did not get to hear personally but did get to read at the Foreign Affairs, Defence and Trade Committee. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000383\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220ee528dc-7870-4553-95ed-5ec0cab60f07\u0022\u003EThere seems to be considerable doubt and debate around some of the issues, for example, the definition of terrorism, and it is interesting just to note that there have been no convictions under the Terrorism Suppression Act so far. Section 5 of the Terrorism Suppression Act, which has been referred to a lot in relation to this bill, is defined in such a way that the Prime Minister may add organisations to the list of designated terrorist entities, and if he is satisfied that they have carried out a terrorist act, they can go on a list. So that is quite a broad definition and if you look at, for example, what happened in the 1980s with the African National Congress when they were fighting against apartheid and they bombed South African military buildings\u2014I would never advocate violence, but are those people terrorists? So it is kind of interesting to see how broad these definitions can be and who will be captured. A lot of the submitters did not have confidence that the definitions and the way that these two Acts interrelate would actually target people who are genuine terrorists. They felt that there was real risk of it being broader. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000384\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220ee528dc-7870-4553-95ed-5ec0cab60f07\u0022\u003EIt is an interesting debate as to whether we should support anyone leaving this country to participate in foreign war. We certainly support soldiers doing it in some wars where many of us do not see why. So we are not consistent here about who is a good killer and who is a bad killer. I think it is really important to talk about that as a society, rather than just identify some people who might go and fight for their country\u2019s independence as being bad and other people who are fighting on behalf of the New Zealand Government as automatically being good. I think these things are superficial, which is why we would much rather have a far deeper examination of this whole topic than this rushed legislation. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000385\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220ee528dc-7870-4553-95ed-5ec0cab60f07\u0022\u003EAlso, the Human Rights Lawyers Association made important points about Part 2 when it talked about visual surveillance. It described it as particularly \u201C \u2026 highly intrusive and [impacting] heavily on the right to privacy afforded under domestic law and international convention.\u201D So it believes that before such powers are enacted, the SIS must show the need for them\u2014i.e., the capability to perform existing duties is impaired by an inability to carry out such surveillance. I think that is quite an interesting phrase\u2014the capability to perform existing duties is impaired by an inability. We have not seen the proof of that. I do not know whether it was described at the select committee, but, certainly, these submitters feel that it was not addressed and that there is a whole issue around creating a law for something when, actually, the SIS already has the capability to do a great deal of things, although \u201Ccapability\u201D is an interesting word. After many years of having been surveilled by the SIS and having read many reports about the SIS, I am not sure what it has ever done that seems particularly effective in this country. Maybe there is a whole seething mass of 60 years or so of dissenter behaviour that desperately needed to be followed, but a lot of it seems to have been fairly bizarre, to put it bluntly. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000386\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220ee528dc-7870-4553-95ed-5ec0cab60f07\u0022\u003ENot only the Human Rights Lawyers Association but also Amnesty International talked about the issues that are covered in Part 2 around surveillance, and it had some real concerns about those. It also had concerns about Part 1, in terms of amendments to the Passports Act. Its statement, which I wish to quote, is that \u201CCompliance with all human rights while countering terrorism represents a best practice because not only is this a legal obligation of States, but it is also an indispensable part of a successful medium- and long-term strategy to combat terrorism.\u201D So compliance with human rights, with the New Zealand Bill of Rights Act, and with all forms of international conventions should be absolutely fundamental, and we do not think that this bill has addressed those issues. We think that it is incredibly serious. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000387\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220ee528dc-7870-4553-95ed-5ec0cab60f07\u0022\u003EWhen Amnesty International talks about the special rapporteur on the promotion and protection of human rights, Martin \u201CScheinin-einin\u201D\u2014I have probably pronounced that wrong.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000388\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c699e7c6-53b9-470c-a14a-378cb6fc8a04\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022f49194dfc1f34fe7bfeb8a54790a47ef\u0022\u003EHon Phil Goff\u003C/span\u003E: Martin Sheen? Isn\u2019t he an actor?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000389\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220ee528dc-7870-4553-95ed-5ec0cab60f07\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022503e8a0a391340958aa0d4a6dc10c6e1\u0022\u003ECATHERINE DELAHUNTY\u003C/span\u003E: Scheinin\u2014the special rapporteur\u2014talks about the promotion and protection of human rights and fundamental freedoms as being really vital to actually preventing terrorism because we model and we stand up for human rights, and we acknowledge the human rights of people who could potentially become our enemies. That is why it is so important that this bill is not pushed through with such a hurry when these groups\u2014these very, very committed groups with civil liberty expertise\u2014actually raise really serious issues about the tests and about the conventions.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022530ce0c4-c977-40cb-90fb-754f54931ff1\u0022 data-id=\u00229a71fc97a2864b8281dbf158dc9e94d1\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000390\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022530ce0c4-c977-40cb-90fb-754f54931ff1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00229a71fc97a2864b8281dbf158dc9e94d1\u0022\u003ETRACEY MARTIN (Deputy Leader\u2014NZ First):\u003C/span\u003E I want to take a quick call on behalf of New Zealand First to clarify our reasons for opposition and to be very clear, so that the public is very clear, about New Zealand First\u2019s stand on this. I was not on the Foreign Affairs, Defence and Trade Committee but Mr Fletcher Tabuteau has briefed the caucus incredibly well on this very, very important bill. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000391\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022530ce0c4-c977-40cb-90fb-754f54931ff1\u0022\u003EWith regard to the clauses, which are the substantive amount of the bill, and what the bill actually does, one of the things that New Zealand First has clearly identified\u2014and it has been articulated by members of the Government\u2014is that the majority of actions that this bill supposedly allows are already in legislation. They can already be used, if not by the SIS, then the SIS can go and see the police and the police can actually go and arrest people. Therefore, there is no need for those clauses; they can already be used. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000392\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022530ce0c4-c977-40cb-90fb-754f54931ff1\u0022\u003EThat takes us down to two clauses\u2014two clauses\u2014that are not there. One is the passport clause, which we have already heard about, which is the extension from 1 year to 3 years. What we know\u2014we have already heard it from the Labour Party, from the Green Party, and from New Zealand First\u2014is that the ability to withdraw or cancel somebody\u2019s passport for 1 year can be renewed at the cost to the State, as opposed to the cost to the citizen, to have to fight to get their passport back, should it be cancelled for 3 years. So, in our view, there is a movement of cost here\u2014prove yourself innocent rather than the State having to prove you guilty. But the State has the ability to cancel a passport for 1 year and to roll it over, and it has never been extended\u2014it has never been extended. That was the question asked and that was the question answered, and the chair of the select committee knows that. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000393\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022530ce0c4-c977-40cb-90fb-754f54931ff1\u0022\u003ESo let us just remove the fact that we do not need the 3-year clause around passports because we have this other ability. What are we left with? We are left with video surveillance. We are left with the single thing that is not covered in any other piece of legislation, which the bill says is required to protect our citizens. That is a major issue for New Zealand First, particularly when part of that\u2014let us have video surveillance\u2014comes down to \u201Ctrust us\u201D. Trust us because the inspector-general has increased powers. And yet New Zealand First asked for an oversight committee made up of senior politicians to be able to double-check that within 48 hours. If you have a look at the supposed increased powers of the inspector-general, she can go and report to the Minister and to the Prime Minister, but if they refuse to accept her recommendations, she can go no further. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000394\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022530ce0c4-c977-40cb-90fb-754f54931ff1\u0022\u003ESo it is hardly\u2014hardly\u2014about trusting the inspector-general; it comes back to trusting the Prime Minister and the Minister. That in itself is an issue\u2014the widening video surveillance of your citizens. We now hear that there was a review of this to create this bill\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000395\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002248a02a21-c1ac-4159-8789-485ad614bd01\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00228fd25513188540db9ef081e3918461bb\u0022\u003EMark Mitchell\u003C/span\u003E: We\u2019ve got the most transparent system in the world.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000396\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022530ce0c4-c977-40cb-90fb-754f54931ff1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00220e2a4169f9644e4d9923d8acfd98e006\u0022\u003ETRACEY MARTIN\u003C/span\u003E: And let us keep it that way, Mr Mitchell. Let us keep it transparent and let us be honest with the people of New Zealand, shall we? Let us be honest with the people of New Zealand. There was actually a review done that nobody knew about but, apparently, the Government did. During the election period there was a review done that has now, apparently, informed this bill, but nobody knew about it. This bill arrived after the election and the words \u201Ctrust us\u201D were used. The words \u201Ctrust us\u201D were used. We will not trust it. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000397\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022530ce0c4-c977-40cb-90fb-754f54931ff1\u0022\u003EThere is a review to go forward next year\u2014and there is another review. The fact is that every single thing that this bill asks to be done can be done, except video surveillance\u2014and there is a review next year that should take the proper course and allow the New Zealand public to truly, transparently, and honestly look at what we are being asked to pass here about their rights. New Zealand First will not curtail that process. We will not support this bill until that full review and video surveillance are fully discussed.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022c699e7c6-53b9-470c-a14a-378cb6fc8a04\u0022 data-id=\u00228c5d8461f3ef4b9bbd6274839cd699ad\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000398\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c699e7c6-53b9-470c-a14a-378cb6fc8a04\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00228c5d8461f3ef4b9bbd6274839cd699ad\u0022\u003EHon PHIL GOFF (Labour\u2014Mt Roskill):\u003C/span\u003E I would, first, like to just pick up on a couple of points that the chair of the Foreign Affairs, Defence and Trade Committee, Mark Mitchell, made. He said that the guidelines for what constituted terrorist activity were clearly set out under section 5 of the Terrorism Suppression Act 2002. I have to confess to having had some involvement with that Act and I do not think we did set it out anywhere near as clearly as it needs to be. In respect of a \u201Cterrorist act\u201D, if I give just one example, section 5(2) defines it as: \u201CAn act falls within this subsection if \u2026 [a group tries] \u2026 (b) \u201Cto unduly compel or to force a government or an international organisation to do or abstain from doing any act.\u201D \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000399\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c699e7c6-53b9-470c-a14a-378cb6fc8a04\u0022\u003EI guess, if I was going to fight alongside my family in Aleppo to stop President Bashar al-Assad from bombing my family\u2019s home and slaughtering the people, I would come under the definition of terrorist, unless\u2014and maybe the Minister in charge of the NZ Security Intelligence Service can give me some comfort in this\u2014it is defined as a situation that occurs in a situation of armed conflict. So I think we do need some clarity around that. I am personally not satisfied with the contemporary relevance of that definition. I do not think it is anywhere near tight enough, which is why, if we cannot do it in this bill, I would like the Minister to look at it in terms of the review of the legislation next year. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000400\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c699e7c6-53b9-470c-a14a-378cb6fc8a04\u0022\u003EThe second thing in relation to Mark Mitchell\u2019s point is that he raised the question: \u201CDo we want to encourage Kiwis to go and participate in a conflict?\u201D. I suppose my answer would be the same as the member\u2019s\u2014no, I would not actually want to encourage my kids or my nephews or anybody else to go and fight in that sort of armed conflict. But that is the wrong question. The question is: should we, as the Government, give ourselves the right to prevent them from going to do that? That is a much more difficult question. The answer that I give to that question is no, unless it is a terrorist activity. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000401\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c699e7c6-53b9-470c-a14a-378cb6fc8a04\u0022\u003EI want to pick up the key reason why Labour is now actually supporting this legislation, which is the changes that have been made under visual surveillance and the emergency warrantless surveillance that this bill allows. When this bill came into the House the scope for what the SIS could do with these two powers\u2014visual surveillance, which is incredibly intrusive\u2014my colleague said it could be a camera in the lounge, in the living room, or it could be in the bathroom or the bedroom, as well. It could pick up people who are independent of those whom you might want to surveil. I would not want a camera in my house, and nor would you, Mr Chair. So you need to be very careful about how you would give that power. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000402\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c699e7c6-53b9-470c-a14a-378cb6fc8a04\u0022\u003EUnder the bill as introduced, as the Law Society pointed out, translating the threshold for visual surveillance that already exists under the Search and Surveillance Act for the police to the SIS would \u201Cimpose too low a threshold for the authorisation of visual surveillance \u2026 the threshold for visual surveillance is substantially lower than that which applies to the Police under the [Search and Surveillance Act]\u201D. So we were faced not with equalising a power for the police and the SIS but with giving a power to the SIS that had to meet a much lower threshold, and that clearly was never going to be acceptable to us. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000403\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c699e7c6-53b9-470c-a14a-378cb6fc8a04\u0022\u003EThe solution, in fact, in this bill was to take out the low threshold that was authorised \u201Cfor the detection of activities prejudicial to security\u201D\u2014well, that is very wide\u2014and \u201Cfor the purpose of gathering foreign intelligence information that is essential to security;\u201D, which is equally wide, and to translate it to just looking at the scope of a \u201C(i) terrorist act; or (ii) facilitation of a terrorist act;\u201D. So we have brought that scope for visual surveillance right down to what this bill is apparently about, given the explanatory note on the bill as introduced. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000404\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c699e7c6-53b9-470c-a14a-378cb6fc8a04\u0022\u003ELikewise, we have required that the Director of Security \u201Cmust provide a copy of the visual surveillance warrant to the Inspector-General.\u201D That is new. So we are bringing the inspector-general in to have scrutiny and surveillance over the SIS\u2019s visual surveillance. If I was to make another comment to the Minister in the chair, Christopher Finlayson, I would say that an important part of the review that is coming up would be to increase the independence and powers of the inspector-general. I think that for the first time we are seeing an inspector-general who actually can act independently. Yet when we received a briefing from the inspector-general, she said that her role was to advise the Minister, which it is, but we would like to have it made absolutely clear that the inspector-general sits to one side and independently makes sure that the Minister and the commissioner and the Director of Security are all doing their job under the law and are not in breach of the law. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000405\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c699e7c6-53b9-470c-a14a-378cb6fc8a04\u0022\u003EThe other thing that we did\u2014and nobody has mentioned it in the debate so far\u2014is to increase the penalty for knowingly failing to comply with section 4IB(10), in clause 9 of the bill, from a $1,000 fine to a $10,000 fine. I think that is really important. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000406\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c699e7c6-53b9-470c-a14a-378cb6fc8a04\u0022\u003EI guess my even bigger worry was the concept of having warrantless surveillance. One of the things that you can take some comfort from is that at the moment, before the SIS intrudes into your life with surveillance by means other than visual surveillance, there needs to be a warrant, and in a domestic case that warrant has to be agreed to by the Commissioner of Security Warrants, who is a High Court judge. But, again, we have a situation where, under the bill as introduced, this power of warrantless surveillance was going to come in with a much, much lower threshold. The Law Society said that when the police use warrantless emergency surveillance, it is to follow up any type of serious offence punishable by a term of imprisonment of 14 years or more. So when the police exercise that power, they have to meet a whole series of prerequisites and it has to be for the most serious forms of crime. As the Law Society pointed out, if you gave it to the SIS \u201Cneither the commission of an offence, nor a risk to life or safety, feature in the proposed NZSIS emergency surveillance provisions. By contrast, the only element relating to establishing urgency/emergency is that delay must be likely to result in a loss of intelligence.\u201D That would have been ludicrous. You would have been giving incredibly intrusive powers that were not subject to the normal controls to the SIS, for a very, very low threshold. So, once again, we have narrowed that to simply looking at a terrorist act or facilitating a terrorist act. That is the critical change that has been made in this legislation. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000407\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c699e7c6-53b9-470c-a14a-378cb6fc8a04\u0022\u003EWe have also cut down the hours of warrantless surveillance from 48 to 24, which is quite important, and again, at each point, we have given direct power of oversight to the inspector-general. In the original bill there had to be an agreement to pass it to the inspector-general; now the inspector-general automatically has the power of oversight. I think those changes are really important. They are the difference between our not being able to support the bill and our supporting it. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000408\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c699e7c6-53b9-470c-a14a-378cb6fc8a04\u0022\u003EThe other thing is that these powers are meant to be used incredibly rarely, but how do we know that they will be? The director is now required to report, not annually\u2014because if you report annually, it could be 18 months after the event\u2014but every 6 months, and to bring it down to the actual time bands, the period of time, that the authorisation was in place. I think those changes are important. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000409\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c699e7c6-53b9-470c-a14a-378cb6fc8a04\u0022\u003EI hope, Minister, that they are carried over into the review because, although I am assured by you that you want a consensus-style approach to this, I picked up a comment by the Prime Minister where he said: \u201CWell, we haven\u2019t got these powers, but we can broaden the powers after the review.\u201D Well, that smacked of incredible arrogance, I have got to say, and I am worried about that. I hope that we can do the sort of exercise that we all did on the select committee, which was to look at the legislation properly and work out what is necessary for the protection of New Zealanders\u2014for both their safety and their right to privacy and other rights. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000410\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c699e7c6-53b9-470c-a14a-378cb6fc8a04\u0022\u003EAs a final point, can I ask the Minister to consider Supplementary Order Paper 42, which my colleague Kennedy Graham has put before the Committee. On a first reading of it, it seems to me to be reasonable. It talks about meeting our obligations under Resolution 2178, it talks about ensuring that we remain consistent with our obligations under international human rights law\u2014I cannot see any problem with those two things\u2014and it defines a \u201Cforeign terrorist fighter\u201D. So I would be interested in the Minister\u2019s response to what I believe is a very genuine effort on the part of Dr Kennedy Graham to bring the definition down to something with greater clarity and greater certainty. So can the Minister please reply to that point when he takes the call.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002207dc4112-8a19-4dd6-a57c-878b47f8a9b6\u0022 data-id=\u00228674eb1eb0ef4e649b0398043d846c62\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000411\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002207dc4112-8a19-4dd6-a57c-878b47f8a9b6\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00228674eb1eb0ef4e649b0398043d846c62\u0022\u003ERON MARK (NZ First):\u003C/span\u003E I am going to take only a short call at this point because I really want to carry on the discussion around the debate over the definition of a terrorist act or a terrorist or a freedom fighter. It has been a while, actually, since I stood in this Chamber and I have just been going back through the Hansard\u2014not something you do lightly, or voluntarily\u2014of 2007, when I spoke on a number of bills such as the Terrorism Suppression Amendment Bill and, through the Crimes (Repeal of Seditious Offences) Amendment Bill, the repeal of the seditious offences legislation. It is clear that every time we get into discussing these matters, there is always the question of how we define a terrorist and how we define a terrorist act. How can we assure ourselves that we are not catching people in legislation that we have no intention of catching? I think it is pretty fair to say that one man\u2019s terrorist is another man\u2019s freedom fighter. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000412\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002207dc4112-8a19-4dd6-a57c-878b47f8a9b6\u0022\u003EKeith Locke was famous\u2014or infamous, depending on which side of the political divide you sat\u2014for a very romantic article that he wrote about Pol Pot coming in to the capital of Cambodia, waving his pistol in the air, firing a shot, and drawing the crowd\u2019s attention to himself as he liberated\u2014as he liberated\u2014those poor, sorry people. Of course, Pol Pot proved not quite to be the freedom fighter that Mr Locke, in his days when he was writing for Salient, thought he was, and he tried desperately in this Chamber on many occasions to stop us from referring to that article. In fact, I used to keep a copy of it in my drawer here so that I could always remind him: \u201CYou know, sometimes you get it wrong, Keith.\u201D Pol Pot was not a nice person. I would also point out that there was a chap by the name of Mugabe. The only person who had it right, whom I can recall, was Robbie Muldoon. He said: \u201CHe was a terrorist, he always has been a terrorist, and he always will be a terrorist.\u201D History, unfortunately\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000413\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c699e7c6-53b9-470c-a14a-378cb6fc8a04\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00223a2a81d040ad402090f118565fe79c98\u0022\u003EHon Phil Goff\u003C/span\u003E: He said the same thing about Nelson Mandela.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000414\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002207dc4112-8a19-4dd6-a57c-878b47f8a9b6\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00227862bd6c63bb4c4386228c1c2d19f7ee\u0022\u003ERON MARK\u003C/span\u003E: Well, let us be careful not to go there, because, like I say, one person\u2019s freedom fighter, Phil Goff\u2014you know\u2014is another person\u2019s terrorist. Having seen photographs of men whom I served alongside in the Middle East who were part of the SAS and the Rhodesian fire force, and having seen photographs of bodies used for bayonet practice by terrorists, it leads one who was in uniform to a quick conclusion that the people who carried out those acts\u2014complete with their necklaces and the petrol contained inside the tyre, burning people to death with their hands and knees tied\u2014could quite easily be defined as terrorists, Phil. They were from the African National Congress.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000415\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c699e7c6-53b9-470c-a14a-378cb6fc8a04\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00223b94ff46f2b54be2b5fed62885f1e877\u0022\u003EHon Phil Goff\u003C/span\u003E: Have those who slaughtered people\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000416\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002207dc4112-8a19-4dd6-a57c-878b47f8a9b6\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022be3dbd8f32cc4fca8064409a9211d1ac\u0022\u003ERON MARK\u003C/span\u003E: Phil, you have had about five calls. I am just going to say that some of us still look upon those acts as pure acts of terror designed to terrorise people into accepting a new political order, and I do not care how fancy or how lauded the name is today\u2014those necklaces were acts of terror. Bayoneting the workers of a farmer in the bush of Rhodesia was an act of terror. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000417\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002207dc4112-8a19-4dd6-a57c-878b47f8a9b6\u0022\u003EI come back to the debate that we will always have and I am going to say to the Minister in the chair, Chris Finlayson, and to the chair of the Foreign Affairs, Defence and Trade Committee: give us a sense, because at some stage someone is going to be looking at Hansard when some poor unfortunate chap\u2014he might be a guy who has served with the New Zealand SAS, he might be on circuit, having taken leave without pay or a discharge from the New Zealand army, or he might have gone across to assist some family in Ukraine against the Russians, or, might have gone across to Oman. We actually had three mercenary battalions in Oman, and Phil loves to get all passionate about mercenaries. We used mercenaries over there as paid employees of Sultan Qaboos to do the right thing for that nation and to act in defence against the wrong things being done to it. We had occasions on which some of those chaps from Balochist\u0101n would come to us and say that they had problems at home, and that bandits and people were raiding their\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000418\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022893adc11-ce4e-419c-a079-08f04b3d75f5\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002297b31eb05f9f4bf18edeca9c8e33044f\u0022\u003EThe CHAIRPERSON (Lindsay Tisch)\u003C/span\u003E: Can the member\u2014it is interesting, with your experience\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000419\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002207dc4112-8a19-4dd6-a57c-878b47f8a9b6\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022ac4889ce627c451cb70f71d9cf68077a\u0022\u003ERON MARK\u003C/span\u003E: I know it is.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000420\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022893adc11-ce4e-419c-a079-08f04b3d75f5\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022e78e1e959bfe44a5af0c50de6945b51c\u0022\u003EThe CHAIRPERSON (Lindsay Tisch)\u003C/span\u003E: I know, but when we are in the Committee stage it is about what is drafted in the bill, so I will ask the member to come back to that.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000421\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002207dc4112-8a19-4dd6-a57c-878b47f8a9b6\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a511fe96a0ea4568abd8fbcfb07e4107\u0022\u003ERON MARK\u003C/span\u003E: What is drafted in the Countering Terrorist Fighters Legislation Bill is a continual referral to a definition of terrorism. What is confusing for some people, and hence an amendment is on the Table today, is that some people disagree. What I would like to see in the bill, or even in Hansard today, is some statement that says that these people are not included, and that it is not the intention to capture, under this legislation, New Zealanders who are going to fight people who deserve to be and need to be fought, whether it be in Ukraine or any other part of the world.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022e11a5f05-1940-41b2-8f1e-911dba7a43a5\u0022 data-id=\u0022a43c85928f1d49459611f73aa75c9041\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000422\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e11a5f05-1940-41b2-8f1e-911dba7a43a5\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022a43c85928f1d49459611f73aa75c9041\u0022\u003EFLETCHER TABUTEAU (NZ First):\u003C/span\u003E I just plead to your patience and take this time to acknowledge the chairman of the Foreign Affairs, Defence and Trade Committee, the members of that select committee, their efforts, and their work. I acknowledge that on the other side of the Chamber there were some hard questions asked. I acknowledge especially the work of those of my peers sitting on the left-hand side of the table who would constantly and diligently dig and try to understand what the Government was trying to achieve. We speak today of compromise but I would put it to the Committee that no compromise has been reached. There has been no compromise on warrantless surveillance. There has been no compromise on the use of video surveillance. There has been no compromise on access to passports. There has been no compromise on the access of the SIS to the database of our customs agents. There has been no compromise as to the oversight of the Inspector-General of Intelligence and Security. Her role remains the same. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000423\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e11a5f05-1940-41b2-8f1e-911dba7a43a5\u0022\u003ESpecifically, for example, we talk about warrantless surveillance. We have already had quite detailed discussions about it, and I acknowledge that the definition has been refined. Mr Mitchell spoke about the straightforward nature of reading the Terrorism Suppression Act, but I put it to you that although it is straightforward to read from the page, it is another thing to interpret the intent of those words and exactly what it is they are trying to achieve. When we come to the conversation around a compromise, actually, in my humble opinion, from my time on the select committee and from the numerous submissions I have heard, no compromise has been reached. We will still have this warrantless surveillance and we will still have video surveillance. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000424\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e11a5f05-1940-41b2-8f1e-911dba7a43a5\u0022\u003EOn video surveillance, the advisers spoke about how we are using chunks of legislation and we are pulling them together to make this omnibus legislation straightforward and robust, in that there is an existing template, and therefore we should be satisfied that it is robust. However\u2014and this was spoken to by numerous members in the Committee already\u2014the threshold for video surveillance for those other members of law enforcement agencies, as opposed to surveillance and information-gathering agencies, is so much more rigorous. I put it to the Minister that although we must never confuse the roles of our law enforcement agencies and the roles of our surveillance and information-gathering agencies, we have had it put to us\u2014it has been argued and it has been put to the public\u2014that there is a sense of urgency, that we know something is going to happen, and that we must react to it. So I simply ask the question: under the Search and Surveillance Act the police already have these rights\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000425\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002292557bd5-0e66-473c-a6df-7d108e7822e3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a3995480bc4b471b9793e9cfb4b7d45a\u0022\u003EDr Kennedy Graham\u003C/span\u003E: I raise a point of order, Mr Chairperson. I am sorry to interrupt my colleague and I do not wish to shatter the crystal that was prevailing in the select committee, but correct me if I am wrong\u2014my understanding is that officials are to relate only to the Minister in the chair and not to other members of Parliament.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000426\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022893adc11-ce4e-419c-a079-08f04b3d75f5\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002261d4dce2841c4f0e909ccfa005a41703\u0022\u003EThe CHAIRPERSON (Lindsay Tisch)\u003C/span\u003E: I am sorry. I hear what you say, and that is correct. All right\u2014we will not do it again.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000427\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e11a5f05-1940-41b2-8f1e-911dba7a43a5\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00222a32addb078e4a73b833d3dcbfc6fcdf\u0022\u003EFLETCHER TABUTEAU\u003C/span\u003E: What I was saying was that there is almost an argument that we are at a stage where there is a supposed clear and present danger. Those words were not used; those are my words. I concede that point. But if this is the case and we are in such a state and if this is so urgent, then the police have the right to do what it is we now ask of our SIS agency. Given the nature of the process we have been through, and given the lack of voice from the New Zealand public\u2014actually, I put this to you. During the select committee I mentioned how there were some robust questions asked, even from those on the Government side. What actually seemed to be the most common answer\u2014and it was an answer said with a level of frustration and disappointment\u2014was that, in fact, we cannot answer your questions. The submitters told us quite openly, when we asked them: \u201CWhat would you do? How would you interpret that? What do you think would happen then?\u201D. The submitters replied quite clearly and with a tone in their voice: \u201CYou have not given us enough time to consider the implications and the ramifications of what it is you are asking.\u201D \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000428\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e11a5f05-1940-41b2-8f1e-911dba7a43a5\u0022\u003EThere is no compromise reached in this Committee today. Everything that was in this bill in its original form will come to pass, albeit with different words, but the outcome will be the same. I will just use the rest of my time to say\u2014I have made a note\u2014that it has been commented on by the media about the increase in the powers of the inspector-general. I just want to make it very clear to the New Zealand public and to the members in the Chamber today that the powers of the inspector-general have not changed due to this legislation. This was not within the purview of the select committee or of this piece of legislation. What was increased\u2014and I acknowledge the efforts of the members across the way there\u2014was not the powers of the inspector-general but rather the obligations of the Minister in charge of the NZ Security Intelligence Service and the Director of Security, and their obligations to the inspector-general. I acknowledge that that created an element where reporting and the submission of information to an independent body were required. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000429\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e11a5f05-1940-41b2-8f1e-911dba7a43a5\u0022\u003EBut this conversation about the role and the responsibilities of the inspector-general has come up in this House before. The inspector-general herself described her role and her job as a role that is for the benefit of the Minister. How can we then say that the inspector-general will hold the Minister to account, when under the legislation for that exact position and by her own words she exists for the benefit of the Minister? She will come back and say \u201CYou have done wrong.\u201D, but she will say this to the Minister who has done wrong. She will report back to the very person who is liable and must be held to account, albeit along with the warrants officer. This is what this legislation is saying. This is what the clause will tell her to do. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000430\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e11a5f05-1940-41b2-8f1e-911dba7a43a5\u0022\u003EThen we spoke about her reporting powers and their public nature and how we are publicly accountable. Again, her own words were that the reports are reduced and cut in such a way as to not give away State secrets. That is absolutely right. There might be ongoing cases where we cannot compromise the missions of our security agents, and we would not want them to do that. We need them to get the bad guys\u2014we do. But we are not achieving what we set out to do. The inspector-general gave eight recommendations, I believe, in her latest report. Those recommendations were taken on board by the Minister and we are informed that they will be acted upon. That may be precedent, but it does not mean that in the future the Minister will not simply say: \u201CThank you for your recommendations. I choose to ignore them, and we will carry on as we currently are.\u201D Thank you. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022163d0b68-eb0e-4094-9bed-99e184f063e1\u0022 data-id=\u002262bd86903a334b53aeb6255ce57885ab\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000431\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022163d0b68-eb0e-4094-9bed-99e184f063e1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002262bd86903a334b53aeb6255ce57885ab\u0022\u003EJAMI-LEE ROSS (National\u2014Botany):\u003C/span\u003E I rise to take a call to comment on and to rebut some of the comments being made by New Zealand First, because I believe that the views expressed by Tracey Martin are somewhat misguided and very different from the very specific advice that the Foreign Affairs, Defence and Trade Committee got during its consideration. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000432\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022163d0b68-eb0e-4094-9bed-99e184f063e1\u0022\u003EI want to refer members to the departmental report. I think that Mrs Martin will probably enjoy reading a number of the clauses in this departmental report because they do dispel some of the myths that have been spoken about, firstly in the submissions and then in this Chamber. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000433\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022163d0b68-eb0e-4094-9bed-99e184f063e1\u0022\u003EThere is a strong view held by some\u2014and Mrs Martin expressed it\u2014that the police can simply be called on by the SIS to exercise warrantless surveillance on behalf of the SIS. Well, that simply cannot happen. In 1956 the SIS was separated from the police. The SIS and the police have very separate roles to play in our country. The police are all about enforcing the law. They are all about ensuring that crimes are detected and that people are put before the courts for those crimes. The SIS\u2019s role is very different. The SIS\u2019s role is to ensure that New Zealand\u2019s security is taken into consideration and that there are detection powers in place so that New Zealand\u2019s security can be protected. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000434\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022163d0b68-eb0e-4094-9bed-99e184f063e1\u0022\u003EThere is a good section in this departmental report that points out that \u201CThe NZSIS Act expressly states that it is not a function of the NZSIS to enforce measures for security. NZSIS consequently does not detain people or bring prosecutions. Investigating and bringing prosecutions for criminal offences, including terrorism offences is a function of the Police.\u201D The very reason why this bill is here is that there are instances where New Zealand\u2019s security is at threat and the New Zealand SIS does not currently have the powers to conduct surveillance in a timely manner to keep New Zealand safe. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000435\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022530ce0c4-c977-40cb-90fb-754f54931ff1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a085e33f44b94d0e86d617a596ff7580\u0022\u003ETracey Martin\u003C/span\u003E: Video surveillance. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000436\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022163d0b68-eb0e-4094-9bed-99e184f063e1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022664f2d8043974b7c9201f558852b283d\u0022\u003EJAMI-LEE ROSS\u003C/span\u003E: No, Mrs Martin, you are incorrect. You are incorrect\u2014sorry, Mr Chair, the member is incorrect. The police cannot undertake that power on behalf of the SIS. The police and the SIS have very different roles to play, and that is an important point. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000437\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022163d0b68-eb0e-4094-9bed-99e184f063e1\u0022\u003EI also want to refer to the comments that she made about the passport provisions. She is of the view that passport provisions in this bill are insufficient and unnecessary. There are also some very good comments in the departmental report that highlight the advice the select committee received\u2014advice that Mr Tabuteau could have passed on, if he wanted to. Some are of the view that the passport changes are too lengthy\u2014that there should not be the power to cancel passports for 3 years. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000438\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022163d0b68-eb0e-4094-9bed-99e184f063e1\u0022\u003EThe very important comments that we received from the Department of the Prime Minister and Cabinet officials were that passport cancellation for 1 year is inadequate in some cases because individuals continue to remain motivated to travel. They also go on to say\u2014and this is a very important point\u2014that \u201CDeferring notice of passport cancellations was considered justified in cases where notifying the person concerned could jeopardise the intelligence operation and in some cases increase the threat to public safety.\u201D So everything you do with the legislation is about balancing the rights of individuals with the need to ensure New Zealand is kept safe, to ensure that New Zealand\u2019s threats\u2014which are out there and they are very real\u2014are kept contained. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000439\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022163d0b68-eb0e-4094-9bed-99e184f063e1\u0022\u003EIf there is a possibility that initiating further action under the existing sections of the Passports Act could endanger a security and intelligence operation, could increase the threat to New Zealand, then I do believe that there is justification for the Minister of Internal Affairs in certain extreme circumstances to cancel a passport for 3 years. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000440\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022163d0b68-eb0e-4094-9bed-99e184f063e1\u0022\u003EI, finally, just want to point out the changes that were made around the Inspector-General of Intelligence and Security, because I do not think they can just be glossed over. When the bill was first sent to the select committee, the inspector-general very much had a role of receiving information once unwarranted surveillance was undertaken. The committee mulled over this quite a lot. We were very firm in the view that the inspector-general\u2019s role should not simply be one where she receives reports when the unwarranted surveillance power is initiated but, in fact, she should have the power to investigate. Rather than just the inspector-general initiating investigations on her own behalf, the legislation itself should say that the matter be referred to her for investigation. It is a very important point, because simply receiving advice that unwarranted surveillance powers have been used is very different from receiving that advice and being required to investigate. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000441\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022163d0b68-eb0e-4094-9bed-99e184f063e1\u0022\u003EIt is important that we give New Zealanders confidence that if these powers have to be used, there is sufficient monitoring over the top. That monitoring is by way of the inspector-general. If this bill goes through, she has to investigate when that power is used. Additionally, there was concern that if the destruction of materials when they are no longer required does not take place, that, first, the fine is insufficient, and, two, there needs to be additional monitoring around that. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000442\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022163d0b68-eb0e-4094-9bed-99e184f063e1\u0022\u003EThe committee also inserted clauses where the inspector-general is required to investigate if any matters are not destructed and if any matters\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000443\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022530ce0c4-c977-40cb-90fb-754f54931ff1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022c4d947be0e0343f9942774950b1b0043\u0022\u003ETracey Martin\u003C/span\u003E: Are they shared with the \u201CFive Eyes\u201D? Are they shared with the other members of the \u201CFive Eyes\u201D and then destroyed?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000444\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022163d0b68-eb0e-4094-9bed-99e184f063e1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00220448b41235e744a1bb26df2329f51381\u0022\u003EJAMI-LEE ROSS\u003C/span\u003E: I cannot hear what she is going on about. The powers around the inspector-general were increased in that matter. We also increased the fine that is put in place. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000445\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022163d0b68-eb0e-4094-9bed-99e184f063e1\u0022\u003EWe did consider these matters very seriously. I disagree fundamentally with Mr Tabuteau that the bill has not changed. It is very evident, if someone goes through this bill, that a lot of compromise was discussed here. A lot of changes to the bill have been made\u2014changes that go so far as to get New Zealand\u2019s main Opposition party coming to the table and saying yes, these powers are necessary for New Zealand\u2019s security situation. They are compromises that are designed to give New Zealanders confidence that whilst we look after New Zealand\u2019s security intelligence information and take those issues seriously, we also ensure there is proper monitoring in place, and that is exactly what the changes here do. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002292557bd5-0e66-473c-a6df-7d108e7822e3\u0022 data-id=\u00225655a5912f8242f7848de053842c7911\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000446\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002292557bd5-0e66-473c-a6df-7d108e7822e3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00225655a5912f8242f7848de053842c7911\u0022\u003EDr KENNEDY GRAHAM (Green):\u003C/span\u003E I just want to pick up on some of the comments, really, add to what I said before about the clarity or the lack thereof in the legislation before us, and pick up from the Hon Phil Goff. In his comments he explored the issue of section 5 of the Terrorism Suppression Act. That, indeed, is critical. He was good enough to acknowledge its shortcomings and let the Committee\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000447\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002292557bd5-0e66-473c-a6df-7d108e7822e3\u0022\u003ESitting suspended from 6 p.m. to 7.30 p.m.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000448\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002292557bd5-0e66-473c-a6df-7d108e7822e3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022d8808a6595684d70a7d06258b5e4f00d\u0022\u003EDr KENNEDY GRAHAM\u003C/span\u003E: What I was wanting to do before the dinner break was to essentially reinforce my earlier comments in the Committee about what we in the Green Party see as the need for greater clarity in the terminology of the bill, based on the understanding that this is a hugely important piece of legislation that is addressing constitutional rights to personal privacy and dignity of the individual, and to pick up on the issue of the definitions and have regard to what the Hon Phil Goff was talking about in the sense of a definition of terrorism. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000449\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002292557bd5-0e66-473c-a6df-7d108e7822e3\u0022\u003EIf we look at the passage of the political narrative leading up to the bill and the initial legislation itself, we see there is a kind of mutation. The Prime Minister on 5 November spoke about national security, which, of course, is entirely valid, but when the legislation itself came into the House, it did not use the phrase \u201Cnational security\u201D. In fact, that does not appear, apparently, in New Zealand law anyway; the term \u201Csecurity\u201D does. The initial bill focused, understandably, on the definition of security coming out of the New Zealand Security Intelligence Service Act. In the course of the Foreign Affairs, Defence and Trade Committee consideration, we narrowed that down to terrorism, and I think that was well informed. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000450\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002292557bd5-0e66-473c-a6df-7d108e7822e3\u0022\u003EBut when we look at the somewhat tortured relationship between the definition of \u201Csecurity\u201D and the definition of \u201Cterrorism\u201D, we find that there is almost an inflationary interaction between those two definitions. Let me give an example of the difficulty we can get into. We are talking about countering foreign terrorist fighters and other violent extremists, and we are still struggling to understand what they are. The definition of the first concept is in Resolution 2178. It needs to be in the bill, and also violent extremists. But even if it is narrowed down to the definition of terrorism, let us look at what that could conceivably mean. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000451\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002292557bd5-0e66-473c-a6df-7d108e7822e3\u0022\u003EIt is one thing to have a violent act of physical violence in New Zealand against New Zealanders; that, indisputably, is an act of terrorism. But the definition of terrorism in the 2002 Act goes way beyond that. If you look at section 5 of the Terrorism Suppression Act, there are five subsections, and section 5(1), the first subsection, identifies three alternative actions. That then leads into the definition in section 5(2), which is an elaboration of section 5(1)(a), and it contains two actions. Then section 5(2) requires outcomes that are identified in section 5(3), and those are five outcomes, and any one of those outcomes can obtain. So you have a permutation of five, four, and three outcomes. I am not a mathematician\u2014no doubt there are some possibly scattered randomly around these benches\u2014but my sixth-form imperfect mathematics would have that equalling somewhere around 120 potential actions coming out of the definition in section 5. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000452\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002292557bd5-0e66-473c-a6df-7d108e7822e3\u0022\u003ELet me just give you one of those 120. If I understand the bill correctly, based on an originating source of threat from the Islamic State of Iraq and the Levant in the Middle East, the intrusive powers of covert, warrantless 24-hour surveillance by the SIS in the bedroom of a New Zealander could be undertaken if there is a suspicion that that New Zealander is facilitating an action that is motivated by an ideological cause intended to exert undue compulsion on the Government to abstain from doing something that will result in major environmental damage. That, as I understand it, is one of the 120 or so possible acts of terrorism. If I have an ideological cause, an undue compulsion on the Government to abstain from doing something, and incur major environmental damage, that makes me a terrorist, and that warrants a camera in my bedroom.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002241146229-4d11-415b-a4ac-f4e2b923e95d\u0022 data-id=\u00227348ab8f226e4e49bc6e0393fb55724b\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000453\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002241146229-4d11-415b-a4ac-f4e2b923e95d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00227348ab8f226e4e49bc6e0393fb55724b\u0022\u003EHon CHRISTOPHER FINLAYSON (Minister in charge of the NZ Security Intelligence Service):\u003C/span\u003E I will address the point raised by Dr Graham in a minute, but first I want to address questions that have been raised a number of times today about who would be caught by the definition of \u201Cterrorist act\u201D and thereby become liable for having their passports cancelled. A number of hypothetical instances have been raised. I tried to deal with them in the second reading speech, but I will just try to go through section 8A of the Passports Act and the proposed new schedule fairly carefully for the benefit of members again. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000454\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002241146229-4d11-415b-a4ac-f4e2b923e95d\u0022\u003EThe first point that I think needs to be noted is that each and every case is different and turns on its own facts, so I cannot give absolute blanket assurances in the House about whether someone will or will not be caught. The second point to note is that the test to be satisfied before a passport can be cancelled has a very high threshold. There has to be sufficient information available to satisfy the Minister of Internal Affairs on reasonable grounds and the following conjunctive tests: that the person is a danger to the security of New Zealand or any other country because they intend to engage in or to facilitate a terrorist act, that the danger cannot be effectively averted by other means, and that the cancellation of the passport will prevent or effectively impede the ability of the person to carry out the intended action. All three limbs of the test must be satisfied before a passport could be cancelled. The third point is that the legislation does not prevent New Zealanders from travelling to these areas, although we would strongly advise against it. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000455\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002241146229-4d11-415b-a4ac-f4e2b923e95d\u0022\u003EThat is the point I guess I was trying to make in the New Zealand Herald article that Mr Goff was referring to. I am not saying you cannot travel to these areas, but I am saying it is not the cleverest thing that you could possibly do with your life, assuming you will be able to hold on to your life if you go there. The only people who will be caught are those who intend to carry out or facilitate the terrorist act. Again\u2014and it must be emphasised\u2014when one looks at the ingredients of the clauses, sufficient information would be required to satisfy the Minister on reasonable grounds that the elements of that definition have been met. So, clearly, take this hypothetical: if someone from the Assyrian Christian community in Wellington wants to go to Mosul to see their family and to provide whatever support they can in a horrific situation, one could advise them against going but clearly there are no grounds to stop them going. Humanitarian workers and those who go to help their families in a dangerous environment will obviously not meet the test. If they join a group engaged in conflict, they will not be caught simply because of that fact\u2014in fact, one could classify them in moral terms as freedom fighters. They must intend to commit or facilitate a terrorist act before their passport can be cancelled. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000456\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002241146229-4d11-415b-a4ac-f4e2b923e95d\u0022\u003EThe power is used sparingly. My advice is that only nine passports have been cancelled under section 8A since 2010. The other point that I made in my second reading speech and in the introduction to the Committee stage this afternoon is that the exercise of this power is subject to appeal to the High Court and, with leave, to the Court of Appeal. The court can substitute its own discretion for that of the Minister to confirm, to modify, to quash the decision, so it is a real check and balance on the Minister\u2019s decision making. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000457\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002241146229-4d11-415b-a4ac-f4e2b923e95d\u0022\u003EMr Goff and Dr Graham raised some interesting points about the definition of \u201Cterrorist act\u201D, and I hear what they are saying. We are not dealing with clause 5 as such in the debate tonight because it is already in the Terrorism Suppression Act, but I, for one, think that the definition of \u201Cterrorist act\u201D is a challenging one. It has been drafted to meet our international obligations, and some amendments were made to it in 2007, I think, to make our laws more consistent with our international obligations. It is used in a number of statutes and not just for passport cancellation. Careful consideration will need to be given to any amendments to make sure we continue to meet our international obligations. I am perfectly happy to raise that with other Ministers, because I think it is something that could be included in a wider review of the criminal law applying to this area. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000458\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002241146229-4d11-415b-a4ac-f4e2b923e95d\u0022\u003EIn that context I refer honourable members to Part 5 of the Crimes Act. I have talked about looking at the \u201CCrimes against public order\u201D. Treason is there. Seditious offences were once there, as Mr Mark knows, but it was repealed in 2007. You have got slave dealing, piracy, and so on. It is fair to say, I think, that Part 5 is overdue for consideration. Part of the review of what we are doing will involve looking at Part 5. In that context, one could actually take a good look at the definition of terrorism but not simply\u2014well, the point I want to emphasise is that we have to be consistent with our international obligations, and the definition is used in a number of statues. So I am very happy to look at that because it is probably timely to do so. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000459\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002241146229-4d11-415b-a4ac-f4e2b923e95d\u0022\u003EThe other point I would make about reviews\u2014and this comes from section 21, I think it is, of the Intelligence and Security Committee Amendment Act 2013\u2014is that what we are going to be doing next year, which has to be commenced before 30 June 2015, is a review of the intelligence and security agencies, the legislation governing them, and their oversight legislation. Some of the points that Mr Goff made about the Inspector-General of Intelligence and Security\u2014I think they were very cogent points. All that is up for review in the period of 2015. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000460\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002241146229-4d11-415b-a4ac-f4e2b923e95d\u0022\u003EWhat I hope will happen is that both the reviewers and the Intelligence and Security Committee will be consulted. I will make a point of independently consulting Mr Goff and Mr Shearer on the reviewers, the terms of reference of the review, and so on. The reviewers will be able to look at this area in 2015 and then there will be ample time in 2016 for a full select committee process and then a principled debate on whatever emerges, with a view to concluding that before the sunset period hooks in, which will be, as has been confirmed in the legislation tonight, 31 March 2017. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000461\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002241146229-4d11-415b-a4ac-f4e2b923e95d\u0022\u003EI think that there is ample opportunity to have a good look at all these matters, both the sedition questions that was raised by Mr Peters\u2014well, good luck to him in his quixotic quest to exhume sedition. Certainly in terms of Part 5 of the Act, the public order offences and the definition of \u201Cterrorist act\u201D, all that can be looked at as a separate piece of work.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022861a1798-a396-4a6c-b9e2-7d2f15d4a001\u0022 data-id=\u0022488f43e99b6c4d14b06bc9f145106bd1\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000462\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022861a1798-a396-4a6c-b9e2-7d2f15d4a001\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022488f43e99b6c4d14b06bc9f145106bd1\u0022\u003EDr SHANE RETI (National\u2014Whangarei):\u003C/span\u003E I would like to take a short call just to respond to some of the issues that have been raised around data acquisition and data retention. I would like to focus on the submission on the Countering Terrorist Fighters Legislation Bill from the Privacy Commissioner, who is, of course, that person who is empowered under the 1993 Privacy Act to be responsible for data access, data security, crossmatching registries, and that sort of thing. I would like to talk to what he states as his three areas of concern: one, the duration of visual surveillance warrants. We have successfully reduced that to 24 hours. Point two is the controls around warrantless surveillance powers. Again, we introduced counter-terrorism as being one of the thresholds that is now required. His third point, his third area of concern, was clarifying the continuation of controls around access to passenger name record data under the Customs and Excise Act. Can I point out that we also included in this agreement that the access agreement between the New Zealand SIS and the New Zealand Customs Service must have Privacy Commissioner involvement. So those are the three main areas on the front page of his submissions, and we have addressed them, I would have thought, rather well. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000463\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022861a1798-a396-4a6c-b9e2-7d2f15d4a001\u0022\u003ECould I pick up on another two points. The honourable member Phil Goff commented that, yes, the fines have been increased from $1,000 to $10,000 for data that has been acquired under visual surveillance that is not relevant to the detection of activities prejudicial to security or gathering foreign intelligence information that is essential to security. I think it is a really important point. The comment was made around intention: what is our intention? There is our intention right there\u2014to be punitive around data that has been collected for a purpose that we are not wanting it to be collected for. Thank you.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022dfa851f0-ef7b-4834-bc41-1b3b645a3495\u0022 data-id=\u00225c2bf3af80194953b7bdd72d22aa48e9\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000464\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dfa851f0-ef7b-4834-bc41-1b3b645a3495\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00225c2bf3af80194953b7bdd72d22aa48e9\u0022\u003EDAVID SHEARER (Labour\u2014Mt Albert):\u003C/span\u003E Can I just start by thanking the Minister in charge of the NZ Security Intelligence Service, Christopher Finlayson, for clarifying those points. I think that is useful. \u201CCommitting or facilitating a terrorist act\u201D I think encompasses it, and it also puts that explanation in context with his comments on the weekend. I think if we are required to look at this legislation in the context of a court case or whatever in the future, those points will be helpful in terms of where we want to go with it. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000465\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dfa851f0-ef7b-4834-bc41-1b3b645a3495\u0022\u003EI also think that it would be useful to look at the definition of terrorism. It has evolved significantly with what has happened over the last few years, and I think the review, if it was able to look at that definition, would take into account many of the comments that we received in terms of submissions, and some of the questions we were asking ourselves as well. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000466\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dfa851f0-ef7b-4834-bc41-1b3b645a3495\u0022\u003EI just want to comment on Mr Tabuteau\u2019s contribution just before the dinner break. I have to say it has been one of the few times I actually wholeheartedly agree with the comments of Jami-Lee Ross. I do not think I could fault them, actually.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000467\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022163d0b68-eb0e-4094-9bed-99e184f063e1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022e34c52e7abe6418a8590d474f6c042e8\u0022\u003EJami-Lee Ross\u003C/span\u003E: You\u2019re hurting my career.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000468\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dfa851f0-ef7b-4834-bc41-1b3b645a3495\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a7abd406d2c74e83b8db354414eb3a6b\u0022\u003EDAVID SHEARER\u003C/span\u003E: Yeah, I know.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000469\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002207dc4112-8a19-4dd6-a57c-878b47f8a9b6\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022c4fb216e3d8e4689b1b34dddb8c48bdd\u0022\u003ERon Mark\u003C/span\u003E: A coalition coming up!\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000470\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dfa851f0-ef7b-4834-bc41-1b3b645a3495\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002275fc32a18c594086a73106946a75edcb\u0022\u003EDAVID SHEARER\u003C/span\u003E: A grand coalition\u2014somebody else is going to be squeezed out! \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000471\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dfa851f0-ef7b-4834-bc41-1b3b645a3495\u0022\u003EThere were extraordinary compromises in this bill. When we look at the first bill that we were confronted with and what we have got now, we have got a much better bill, I think, and a much tighter bill. It is much more confined to what the issues were in front of us. Quite apart from the process, which we have made comment on before, I actually do believe that we have come a long way and we should actually acknowledge that. I think we have landed pretty well when we consider that this is a temporary piece of legislation that is meant to last for a pretty short period of time. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000472\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dfa851f0-ef7b-4834-bc41-1b3b645a3495\u0022\u003EThere are a couple of issues in and around that. I mean, there was a comment made by the Inspector-General of Intelligence and Security about her role being to advise the Minister. I actually think that the word \u201Cadvise\u201D is something we need to look at, because to some extent we see the Inspector-General of Intelligence and Security very much being the watchdog. In fact, we have increased that power within this bill\u2014and I think Mark Mitchell mentioned this in his contribution\u2014so that she has a greater ability to look into the various parts of what this bill is setting up to do. The \u201Cadvise\u201D word\u2014I mean, it is not \u201Cfacilitate\u201D, \u201Chelp\u201D, or whatever you were mentioning, Mr Tabuteau. Actually, the word was \u201Cadvise\u201D. I think there is probably some clarity around that that the review could possibly take up as well. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000473\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dfa851f0-ef7b-4834-bc41-1b3b645a3495\u0022\u003EI have to say again\u2014and I think I said it in the second reading speech\u2014that we were very impressed with the ability of the inspector-general to conduct her role effectively. She went into the fact that she has 24/7 access to the SIS and the Government Communications Security Bureau (GCSB). She and her team can look into any aspect of those organisations at any time, whenever they want. Some of the most top-secret issues will need to be cleared with the director, but otherwise they are free to do whatever they like. They will be up to speed and be able to do that by January next year. I have to say these were the changes that were made in the legislation last year, and they were very positive changes. But I do not really think they have had the air time that they really deserve. I think that in many ways, at the legislative level of the oversight of these intelligence committees\u2014and I am not talking about the political level; there are massive problems there\u2014we are very close to providing the degree of oversight that I think we need to have. I do believe that is very positive. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000474\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dfa851f0-ef7b-4834-bc41-1b3b645a3495\u0022\u003EIt was interesting that the inspector-general herself, in her submission, talked about the role that her counterpart in Australia has in looking at the various avenues of intelligence that they are able to look at. Whereas we are confined to the SIS and the GCSB, her counterpart can also look at the committee within the Department of the Prime Minister and Cabinet as well as military intelligence. So it is a broader role. We might want to leave that for a review, but, again, it is an issue that I think probably needs to be looked at in terms of the confines of that role and how that role takes place. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000475\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dfa851f0-ef7b-4834-bc41-1b3b645a3495\u0022\u003EHaving said all that, I think there was one area\u2014notwithstanding the Minister\u2019s explanation around terrorist freedom fighters, etc., and making those sorts of distinctions\u2014where I do not think we quite got to a conclusion to the satisfaction of this side of the Chamber. We let it go because I think the other issues were, in many ways, more important. That area was the issue of the extension of passports being withheld from 1 year out to 3 years. I think we were unconvinced by the rationale of needing to have to extend that out to 3 years. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000476\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dfa851f0-ef7b-4834-bc41-1b3b645a3495\u0022\u003EThere was a lot of talk, as we went into the Foreign Affairs, Defence and Trade Committee, about somebody being rendered stateless if they got their passport taken away from them. Clearly, that is not the case. If you have your passport taken away from you, you are still a New Zealand citizen. You are not stateless. Likewise, if your passport is taken away from you when you are offshore, you still remain a New Zealand citizen. Although you might not have a passport, the Minister must, according to the legislation, provide an avenue\u2014effectively, a straight-line avenue\u2014for you to return to New Zealand; otherwise, that would be totally unfair. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000477\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dfa851f0-ef7b-4834-bc41-1b3b645a3495\u0022\u003EBut the issue of the extension out to 3 years is something that I think we were, as I say, unconvinced about, even after questioning both the director of the SIS and the officials from the Department of the Prime Minister and Cabinet. A passport can be withheld for 1 year. It can be done, without having to provide explanation, for up to 30 days. We accept that. Extensions of more than 1 year can be granted at the moment, with a High Court judge providing that extension. The High Court judge, obviously, has to be convinced that there is still evidence that this person will go off and be a terrorist fighter or commit a terrorist act if they leave the country. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000478\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dfa851f0-ef7b-4834-bc41-1b3b645a3495\u0022\u003EThe argument that was put to us was, well, sometimes these people do not necessarily show themselves. They might lie low and we might not have that evidential test. I think that is kind of going into grounds that I find are a bit dubious. Likewise, the other explanation given was that taking a passport away from somebody for 3 years or 2 years, or whatever, is somehow less problematic than doing it year after year after year\u2014taking it away, then taking it away again; in effect, extending it and extending it. Again, I am not sure that I am particularly convinced by that, and it did not sound particularly convincing coming from the people whom we asked. Added to that is the fact that this legislation has a life only until April 2017. It is conceivable that in March 2017 you could withhold somebody\u2019s passport for 3 years from that date, notwithstanding that the legislation might say something completely and utterly different. This is also a point that was brought up by the Law Society. We were not convinced that this was an area that we felt was particularly justified. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000479\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dfa851f0-ef7b-4834-bc41-1b3b645a3495\u0022\u003EOn the other hand, I will accept\u2014and I think this is the reason why in the end we let it go through\u2014that it is possible to make a submission to the Minister within 30 days. You can take it to judicial review, and if it goes to any more than 1 year, to possibly 3 years, the Minister is bound to go back to that person who had their passport taken and invite them to make a submission in order to be able to have their passport back. Notwithstanding that, I do think this is one area that we need to be taking a much better look at, and certainly a much better look at when it comes to the broader review that is coming down the track. Thank you.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022e11a5f05-1940-41b2-8f1e-911dba7a43a5\u0022 data-id=\u00222d463a37f86d442f963adc1c41e05658\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000480\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e11a5f05-1940-41b2-8f1e-911dba7a43a5\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00222d463a37f86d442f963adc1c41e05658\u0022\u003EFLETCHER TABUTEAU (NZ First):\u003C/span\u003E I just wanted to raise a point that was brought up before the break by a member on the opposite side of the Chamber. The member spoke about the reasons why we need this 3-year extension to the passport cancellation process. He said that it might create some discord or upset the person involved, and it might pay not to tell them that their passport has been cancelled. But, actually, under this legislation the Minister must take all reasonable steps to notify the person that their passport is to be cancelled. They have a right of appeal process, which we are obliged to undertake. They cannot appeal if they do not know that their passport has been taken off them. It seems a bit nonsensical. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000481\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e11a5f05-1940-41b2-8f1e-911dba7a43a5\u0022\u003EThe main point I would like to finish our discussion on tonight is around the process of warrantless surveillance. Under new section 41B(10), inserted by clause 9, we are told that \u201CAs soon as practicable after the expiry of a visual surveillance warrant, the Director must ensure that any records resulting from the visual surveillance undertaken under that warrant are destroyed \u2026\u201D. We spoke about penalties if any data was retained unlawfully and inappropriately, and absolutely that must be the case. But under this current bill as it is written, and I draw the attention of the Minister in charge of the NZ Security Intelligence Service to it, this is \u201Cexcept to the extent that those records are relevant\u201D. Actually, in respect of the process of destroying data and of destroying evidence that was collected without a warrant or that was collected without a warrant further pursued by the offices or the SIS, actually there is a clause in there that says OK, let us keep it. At no point before or after is a warrant issued to collect that data necessarily. It says that we can do this \u201Cto the detection of activities prejudicial to security\u201D. I reopen this can of worms about definitions and terminology and ask the Minister to consider what is meant by \u201Cactivities prejudicial\u201D, to whose security, and also \u201Cto the gathering of foreign intelligence information that is essential to security.\u201D Again, the question is what is essential and what is security? \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000482\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e11a5f05-1940-41b2-8f1e-911dba7a43a5\u0022\u003EFor me, as an individual, this has been one of the biggest bones of contention. There is obviously a lot more. I do not think the compromise has been sufficient for the New Zealand public. But in this particular instance we are asking New Zealanders to accept that we will gather information on them, that we will keep that information and that data, and that we will never seek to apply for a warrant or subsequently be issued with one. This is of huge concern to me around people\u2019s human rights and their rights to privacy. Thank you.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022fdb01002-a7cf-4a77-8f05-678d24a36849\u0022 data-id=\u0022b99266c656a04f798448144904ec95ff\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000483\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022fdb01002-a7cf-4a77-8f05-678d24a36849\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022b99266c656a04f798448144904ec95ff\u0022\u003ETODD MULLER (National\u2014Bay of Plenty):\u003C/span\u003E I move, That the question be now put.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca id=\u0022ad95c5a0ba034ac2b6cffe527cf0f627\u0022 name=\u0022division\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EA party vote  was called for on the question, That the question be now put.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EAyes 64\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand National 60; M\u0101ori Party 2; ACT New Zealand 1; United Future 1.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENoes 57\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand Labour 32; Green Party 14; New Zealand First 11.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EMotion agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000484\u0022\u003EThe question was put that the amendments set out on Supplementary Order Paper 40 in the name of the Rt Hon John Key to Part 1 be agreed to.\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca id=\u002268bea623564d4ea9ab2012bfc2e7d28a\u0022 name=\u0022division\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EA party vote  was called for on the question, That the amendments be agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EAyes 108\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand National 60; New Zealand Labour 32; Green Party 14; ACT New Zealand 1; United Future 1.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENoes 13\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand First 11; M\u0101ori Party 2.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EAmendments agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000485\u0022\u003EThe question was put that the amendment set out on Supplementary Order Paper 41 in the name of Dr Kennedy Graham to clause 4 be agreed to.\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca id=\u0022337055f9646a4a0b9ffaacf587363e13\u0022 name=\u0022division\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EA party vote  was called for on the question, That the amendment be agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EAyes 27\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EGreen Party 14; New Zealand First 11; M\u0101ori Party 2.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENoes 94\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand National 60; New Zealand Labour 32; ACT New Zealand 1; United Future 1.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EAmendment not agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000486\u0022\u003EThe question was put that the amendments set out on Supplementary Order Paper 42 in the name of Dr Kennedy Graham to clause 4 be agreed to.\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca id=\u00224fe7c56cf2334943a032948afc979511\u0022 name=\u0022division\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EA party vote  was called for on the question, That the amendments be agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EAyes 48\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand Labour 32; Green Party 14; M\u0101ori Party 2.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENoes 73\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand National 60; New Zealand First 11; ACT New Zealand 1; United Future 1.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EAmendments not agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca id=\u0022be97245b36bb4244a7d1783dbae0a3cb\u0022 name=\u0022division\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EA party vote  was called for on the question, That Part 1 as amended be agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EAyes 94\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand National 60; New Zealand Labour 32; ACT New Zealand 1; United Future 1.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENoes 27\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EGreen Party 14; New Zealand First 11; M\u0101ori Party 2. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EPart 1 as amended agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000487\u0022\u003EThe question was put that the amendment set out on Supplementary Order Paper 40 in the name of the Rt Hon John Key to clause 9, and the following amendment in the name of the Hon Christopher Finlayson to clause 11, be agreed to:\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000488\u0022\u003Ereplace \u201C41D\u201D with \u201C41E\u201D.\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000489\u0022\u003EAmendments agreed to.\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000490\u0022\u003EThe question was put that the amendments set out on Supplementary Order Paper 41 in the name of Dr Kennedy Graham to Part 2 be agreed to.\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca id=\u00223885e2c6d03c401b9a5c16da777e6c01\u0022 name=\u0022division\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EA party vote  was called for on the question, That the amendments be agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EAyes 27\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EGreen Party 14; New Zealand First 11; M\u0101ori Party 2.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENoes 94\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand National 60; New Zealand Labour 32; ACT New Zealand 1; United Future 1.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EAmendments not agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000491\u0022\u003EThe question was put that the amendments set out on Supplementary Order Paper 42 in the name of Dr Kennedy Graham to Part 2 be agreed to.\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca id=\u002250dc20268222406bbaa2450db402f9b4\u0022 name=\u0022division\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EA party vote  was called for on the question, That the amendments be agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EAyes 48\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand Labour 32; Green Party 14; M\u0101ori Party 2.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENoes 73\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand National 60; New Zealand First 11; ACT New Zealand 1; United Future 1.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EAmendments not agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00225f1453f8-c44e-4ce6-b699-64d600322276\u0022 data-id=\u0022a270cf00dd22415da6c06be1e81b7cb5\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000492\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225f1453f8-c44e-4ce6-b699-64d600322276\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022a270cf00dd22415da6c06be1e81b7cb5\u0022\u003EThe CHAIRPERSON (Hon Chester Borrows)\u003C/span\u003E: The amendment set out on Supplementary Order Paper 43 in the name of the Rt Hon Winston Peters to Part 2 is out of order as being outside of the scope of the bill.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca id=\u0022b8278aacbd3c4bfe8dd705f58f2808ac\u0022 name=\u0022division\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EA party vote  was called for on the question, That Part 2 as amended be agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EAyes 94\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand National 60; New Zealand Labour 32; ACT New Zealand 1; United Future 1.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENoes 27\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EGreen Party 14; New Zealand First 11; M\u0101ori Party 2.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EPart 2 as amended agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca id=\u0022ad56f79488634673ab4693207df93e9c\u0022 name=\u0022division\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EA party vote  was called for on the question, That the schedule be agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EAyes 94\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand National 60; New Zealand Labour 32; ACT New Zealand 1; United Future 1.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENoes 27\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EGreen Party 14; New Zealand First 11; M\u0101ori Party 2.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ESchedule agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca id=\u0022a77c327e84064d789439ccefdd1aa721\u0022 name=\u0022division\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EA party vote  was called for on the question, That clause 1 be agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EAyes 94\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand National 60; New Zealand Labour 32; ACT New Zealand 1; United Future 1.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENoes 27\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EGreen Party 14; New Zealand First 11; M\u0101ori Party 2.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EClause 1 agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca id=\u0022d14e18c02ea64e5f9116d22a7d28b38e\u0022 name=\u0022division\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EA party vote  was called for on the question, That clause 2 be agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EAyes 94\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand National 60; New Zealand Labour 32; ACT New Zealand 1; United Future 1.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENoes 27\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EGreen Party 14; New Zealand First 11; M\u0101ori Party 2.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EClause 2 agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000493\u0022\u003EThe Committee divided the bill into the Passports Amendment Bill, the Customs and Excise Amendment Bill, and the New Zealand Security Intelligence Service Amendment Bill, pursuant to Supplementary Order Paper 39.\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000494\u0022\u003EBill reported with amendment.\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000495\u0022\u003EReport adopted.\u003C/p\u003E\n    \u003C/div\u003E\n    \u003Cdiv class=\u0022HpsHansard\u0022\u003E\n      \u003Cp\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsProceedingHeading\u0022\u003EBills\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000496\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u002259e5a70a50704433a8148b9ec2c763dd\u0022\u003EPassports Amendment Bill\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000497\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u002259e5a70a50704433a8148b9ec2c763dd\u0022\u003ECustoms and Excise Amendment Bill\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000498\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u002259e5a70a50704433a8148b9ec2c763dd\u0022\u003ENew Zealand Security Intelligence Service Amendment Bill\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000499\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u0022d9325e2b6a774af780fbd0d365470ea9\u0022\u003EThird Readings\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002241146229-4d11-415b-a4ac-f4e2b923e95d\u0022 data-id=\u0022020fd4c7eb1b4bb58228581177721926\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000500\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002241146229-4d11-415b-a4ac-f4e2b923e95d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022020fd4c7eb1b4bb58228581177721926\u0022\u003EHon CHRISTOPHER FINLAYSON (Minister in charge of the NZ Security Intelligence Service)\u003C/span\u003E on behalf of the Minister for National Security and Intelligence: I move, That the Passports Amendment Bill, the Customs and Excise Amendment Bill, and the New Zealand Security Intelligence Service Amendment Bill be now read a third time. I want to start by responding to some of the comments made about the truncated legislative process. No one is arguing that it was not speedy, but it was in response to urgent circumstances. I do think it is also useful to go through the time line step by step.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000501\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002241146229-4d11-415b-a4ac-f4e2b923e95d\u0022\u003EThe House had its last sitting day on 31 July 2014 before rising for the general election. Parliament was dissolved on 14 August, and, as we know, the election was 11 weeks ago on 20 September. The UN Security Council passed Resolution 2178, the basis on which the Government is proceeding, only on 24 September. The Government was sworn in 8 weeks ago on 8 October. The terms of review that led to this legislation were approved 7 weeks ago. A draft of the bill was released as soon as it was ready, on 23 November, and the bill received its first reading on 25 November. If one accepts that the foreign fighter threat needed to be addressed urgently and that legislation was required, something on which both the National Party and the Labour Party agreed, it is hard to see how we could have done things differently. I really do think it is quite unfair to compare us with the United Kingdom, Canada, and Australia, who had full committee hearings. Our legislation goes nowhere near as far as those countries have gone, and, of course, those countries did not have general elections this year.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000502\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002241146229-4d11-415b-a4ac-f4e2b923e95d\u0022\u003EMr Shearer made a very interesting series of comments about engaging with representatives of the Muslim community in New Zealand, and Mr Goff echoed those comments. I agree with both of them that this is a very important job. Those comments align with paragraph 16 of UN Security Council Resolution 2178, which says: \u201CEncourages Member States to engage relevant local communities and non-governmental actors in developing strategies to counter the violent extremist narrative that can incite terrorist acts, address the conditions conducive to the spread of violent extremism, which can be conducive to terrorism, including by empowering youth, families, women, religious, cultural and education leaders, and all other concerned groups of civil society and adopt tailored approaches to countering recruitment to this kind of violent extremism and promoting social inclusion and cohesion;\u201D.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000503\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002241146229-4d11-415b-a4ac-f4e2b923e95d\u0022\u003ELet me say for the benefit of those in the Chamber tonight that I take those matters very seriously, and I pledge to work with local Muslim communities over the next period, including during the period of the broader review. I do not intend to take up too much of the House\u2019s time this evening, because I think the arguments have been very well canvassed this afternoon, but I want to make four comments. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000504\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002241146229-4d11-415b-a4ac-f4e2b923e95d\u0022\u003EFirst, as has been made very clear, this is temporary legislation. It will either expire in early 2017 or be replaced by new legislation before that date. Any new legislation, which will be the product of an independent review to be conducted in 2015, will have a full hearing at the select committee. The broader review next year will take a very good look at all the intelligence legislation, and I have noted the comments by Mr Goff and also by Mr Mark and Dr Graham on the definition of terrorism, and I agree that that should probably be looked at as well. We will also look at the public order offences to consider whether there are gaps in Part 5 of the Crimes Act, and I think we also need to look at the procedure and evidence provisions to ensure that, where necessary, the State can prosecute effectively and, of course, the concomitant of that, that defendants can defend themselves properly.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000505\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002241146229-4d11-415b-a4ac-f4e2b923e95d\u0022\u003EThe second point I want to make is on the scope of the changes to the Passport Act 1992. I say to members that this legislation only broadens the scope of the legislation that the last Government put through this House in 2005.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000506\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002241146229-4d11-415b-a4ac-f4e2b923e95d\u0022\u003EMy third point is that the safeguards applying to the legal regime Parliament is amending today are very extensive. The whole regime is subject to ministerial control. There are very clear reporting functions. There are clear lines of responsibility and rules about what can and cannot be delegated. On top of this, everything is overseen by the Inspector-General of Intelligence and Security, who has very extensive powers.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000507\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002241146229-4d11-415b-a4ac-f4e2b923e95d\u0022\u003EFinally, I return to one of the primary motivations behind this legislation, which is fulfilling our role as a good international citizen. All members of this Chamber have been horrified over the past 5 or 6 months at the suffering in the Middle East and the sheer and utter barbarity of the Islamic State of Iraq and the Levant. All countries have to do their bit to confront this unspeakable horror. There is no room for moral ambiguity. We have a responsibility to do whatever we can to ensure that New Zealand citizens do not contribute to the problem. So with those few comments, I again thank the select committee, and in particular I want to acknowledge Messrs Mitchell, Goff, and Shearer for their considerable assistance. I commend the legislation to the House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022dfa851f0-ef7b-4834-bc41-1b3b645a3495\u0022 data-id=\u0022fdb57b5c68864b77b6cd8276c25a1bc4\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000508\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dfa851f0-ef7b-4834-bc41-1b3b645a3495\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022fdb57b5c68864b77b6cd8276c25a1bc4\u0022\u003EDAVID SHEARER (Labour\u2014Mt Albert):\u003C/span\u003E I thank the Minister Christopher Finlayson for those words of clarification, and, in particular, for the commitment to look at the definition of terrorism when the review goes ahead.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000509\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dfa851f0-ef7b-4834-bc41-1b3b645a3495\u0022\u003EFirst, I want to start with something that we have not done before, which is to acknowledge the officials and other members of the Foreign Affairs, Defence and Trade Committee. Certainly from this side of the House, we appreciated your support and your hard work. It was a very intense effort, and I think we came out and landed as well as we perhaps could have, given the time constraints. This legislation was always a question of balance\u2014of getting the balance right between, on the one hand, the ability of our security agencies to safeguard our livelihoods, and, at the same time, to make sure that our basic freedoms, our human rights, and our rights of privacy are protected. That is how it was always presented, and, as I said in the second reading earlier today, the issue for us was that the threat was a real one. The threat was increasing. The number of incidents that were occurring was growing. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000510\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dfa851f0-ef7b-4834-bc41-1b3b645a3495\u0022\u003EBut, at the same time, we do not want to get too carried away and say that somehow on the streets of New Zealand, in our towns and cities, we are facing some sort of major threat. That is not the case. Our threat level has gone from \u201Cvery low\u201D to \u201Clow\u201D, but it is a trajectory that is on an upward movement. For that reason, after hearing from the SIS and after having the chance to hear actual cases, we believe that there are grounds for supporting this legislation, because there was a very real issue of terrorism. But any law that comes into force should be narrow in its scope and focused on this problem and not anything broader than that.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000511\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dfa851f0-ef7b-4834-bc41-1b3b645a3495\u0022\u003EThe safeguards around warrantless surveillance, visual surveillance, the extension of passports, and access to the Customs Service database\u2014the four main areas that we saw as being problematic\u2014have been gone over thoroughly. We brought the SIS back to explain fully, we brought the Inspector-General of Intelligence and Security to the select committee, and we have benefited from the wisdom of the Law Society, the Legislation Advisory Committee, the Privacy Commissioner, and many other people who actually gave submissions for the first time. There was not just the usual queue of individuals who normally appear before a select committee; there were a number of people who appeared for the first time, because they were concerned about where things were going. I hope we listened to them as much as we could, and that we got the balance about right.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000512\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dfa851f0-ef7b-4834-bc41-1b3b645a3495\u0022\u003EI am particularly grateful for the Minister\u2019s comments about the Muslim community. I think it is a community that is at the front line\u2014and we keep on saying this\u2014of protecting New Zealanders as a whole. There are 46,000-odd Muslims, and as one of the submitters said to us: \u201CWe are not Muslims in New Zealand; we are Muslims of New Zealand. Twenty-five percent of us have been born in New Zealand. We are as worried about the safety of our children and our families as any other New Zealander is.\u201D As any terrorism expert will tell you, the best way to combat terrorism is to actually engage with the community that some of those extremists are going to come from. Nobody is more worried, and as seized with the issue of ensuring that those people are identified and, effectively, that their threat is removed, than the Muslim community. We need to do much better for them than what we are doing at the moment.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000513\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dfa851f0-ef7b-4834-bc41-1b3b645a3495\u0022\u003EThe issue around the haste of this legislation is an important one. It is important not just because of the degree of time that we had, in terms of hearing the various submissions and being able to deliberate. It is actually a bigger issue of the confidence that New Zealanders can have in this Parliament to put through laws that are not pushed, and not hurried, but actually do get the right degree of surveillance\u2014if you like to use that word\u2014and scrutiny that enable us to ensure that laws are good laws. We had the Government Communications Security Bureau (GCSB) legislation last year, which was, frankly, a debacle. It was passed through with some urgency as well, and there was a brief select committee process around it. And now we have this bill. This does not give the public\u2014the general public\u2014the confidence that they want and deserve that we are looking after their best interests, while at the same time weighing up their concerns and the issues we need to be grappling with. We need to do much better than we are doing at the moment, and, frankly, I do not accept the Minister\u2019s explanation that this was the only way to do it. A small review of even this legislation could have taken place during the period of the campaign before the election, and we could have had legislation in the House the day that Parliament came back.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000514\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dfa851f0-ef7b-4834-bc41-1b3b645a3495\u0022\u003EThat is to do with this legislation. Now we are moving forward into our review period. With regard to the way I see the threat that is out there, I think we are well-catered-for in New Zealand in terms of our relationships with many of the minority groups in New Zealand. That means that we are not at the same threat level as the UK, Australia, and other countries. But I do not believe that we have the oversight right. I do believe that what we have had up to now, both within the GCSB\u2014the review that went through the GCSB, which I believe was good\u2014and, increasingly within the SIS, are the operational capabilities, safeguards, and checks, which have probably been very much upgraded over the last few years. It is the sense that spies, or whatever we want to call them, do not go off and just do what they want to do\u2014that there is a warranted process, and that everything within the agencies follows a very professional way forward. That is at this level. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000515\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dfa851f0-ef7b-4834-bc41-1b3b645a3495\u0022\u003EThe second level, as I see it, is the judicial level. This is the ability of the Commissioner of Security Warrants and the Minister to be able to oversee the warrant procedure to ensure that they fulfil the needs of the warrants, that they are not overstepping the line, and that the High Court judge who is appointed to be the Commissioner of Security Warrants is doing their job properly. The Inspector-General of Intelligence and Security impressed us by the way that she submitted her evidence in front of the select committee. As I said earlier, she said that she has the ability to go into the SIS or the GCSB 24/7 with a pass and look at anything she wants to look at, and oversee and check on anything that has gone and happened. She has the ability, with information technology, to follow and track the path by which somebody perhaps opened up a computer and took a look at it. I believe that the Inspector-General of Intelligence and Security has an extremely important role, and the beefed-up role gives us a great deal of confidence, but I do think there are some tweaks and improvements that can be made as a part of the review.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000516\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dfa851f0-ef7b-4834-bc41-1b3b645a3495\u0022\u003EWhere we fall down, however, is at the political level. The Intelligence and Security Committee\u2014I know, Phil Goff knows; we have sat on that committee\u2014is, frankly, a joke. It is a joke because the same person who heads the intelligence agencies of the SIS and the GCSB is ultimately the Prime Minister, and the Prime Minister sits on the same committee that oversees the operations of those two ministries. There is certainly not a country that I know of in the Western World that has the person who is in charge of those agencies also chairing the oversight committee that looks into them\u2014as well as having the additional vote, which ensures that everything that is put up by the other side is immediately voted down. We need to look at that as a matter of urgency within this review. That cannot continue to happen. In the UK, the chair of that committee is actually a backbencher of considerable standing who, I think, is voted on to that committee and chairs that committee\u2014rather than being the person who is in charge of those agencies. That needs to happen here.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000517\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dfa851f0-ef7b-4834-bc41-1b3b645a3495\u0022\u003EThe Intelligence and Security Committee needs to be given far more authority than it has at the moment, and a far greater degree of power to be able to look into those agencies, pull things out, and, if necessary, make those issues public. Unfortunately, what we have seen today with both the GCSB and the SIS\u2014with the inspector-general\u2019s report the other day\u2014is that the only time we are looking into those agencies is when there has been some sort of stuff-up, and that is not good enough. That should be looked at as a matter of course, and it should be looked at in the context of the review that is coming. Thank you.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002248a02a21-c1ac-4159-8789-485ad614bd01\u0022 data-id=\u00222374e19488ac4e0dba50cf117469d561\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000518\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002248a02a21-c1ac-4159-8789-485ad614bd01\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00222374e19488ac4e0dba50cf117469d561\u0022\u003EMARK MITCHELL (National\u2014Rodney):\u003C/span\u003E This is my final call on this legislation. Firstly, I want to acknowledge our Attorney-General. It is quite extraordinary the process that we actually went through with this legislation. Most of our hearings were live-streamed, so people were actually able to sit at home and watch them. I think the only hearing that was not live-streamed was the secret evidence of the director of the SIS, which was appropriate; you were able to watch everybody else. People at home tonight can watch this debate live and see our Attorney-General, and see how quickly he can respond and say he has already identified a couple of things that can be folded into the review.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000519\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002248a02a21-c1ac-4159-8789-485ad614bd01\u0022\u003EI want to reiterate the fact that this legislation, as he said, has a sunset clause. We did move that sunset clause from April 2018 to April 2017. That was a significant change, which means we are getting the process started a lot earlier. We have included more reporting. We have wrapped more reporting around the legislation, so that now there is a requirement for the director of the SIS to report every 6 months on how many times the SIS has actually had to use this warrantless visual surveillance power. We have changed the time, in terms of actually getting a warrant issued, from 48 hours to 24 hours\u2014another significant change, wrapping more control around the use of this power. We have a much tighter reporting regime, so that now the Commissioner of Security Warrants and the Minister have immediate visibility over it. They have to approve the warrant, but it also now gets forwarded through to the inspector-general, and, as, I think, the Minister alluded to\u2014actually, it might have been Mr Shearer who explained that\u2014the inspector-general and her staff have the ability to go down to the offices of the SIS and check the files, and go through the files and have full visibility. You cannot get much more transparent than that, in terms of having our inspector-general have access to SIS files and the work in the operations that it is currently working on.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000520\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002248a02a21-c1ac-4159-8789-485ad614bd01\u0022\u003EWe are responding to UN Resolution 2178, which means that it is incumbent on us, as a nation, to take measures to prevent Kiwis from leaving New Zealand to go and take up arms, and start fighting with groups like the Islamic State of Iraq and Syria (ISIS). The Middle East has gone through a radical change. It has been changing a lot in the last 10 years and, unfortunately, the needle seems to have moved in the wrong direction. But what we are seeing at the moment with ISIS is unprecedented. It is a genuine, real threat to global security. We have to be able to respond to that, too. I can tell you right now that terrorist groups out there will be looking to see how we respond, and they will be looking for weaknesses. If they sense that New Zealand is an easy target, then we will become an easy target. I will tell you one thing: I would rather keep the gate locked and the bull inside the cage than have it open and have the bull come charging out, and all of us looking at each other and pointing fingers and asking: \u201CWhat went wrong?\u201D.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000521\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002248a02a21-c1ac-4159-8789-485ad614bd01\u0022\u003EOur threat level has changed. It has changed from \u201Cvery low\u201D to \u201Clow\u201D. It is still low, and that is good, but it means that we do have to respond. Actually, it is incumbent on this Parliament to be able to respond quickly, and that is what we have done, because, as the Attorney-General explained, that is how circumstances led us to what we have done. We have tried to run the best, most robust process that we could. We have given everyone who wanted to come and make an oral submission access to the Foreign Affairs, Defence and Trade Committee. Dr Shane Reti made a very good point when he highlighted the number of submissions that we actually heard\u2014and that was through the dedication and the hard work of the select committee. I want to acknowledge everyone on the committee.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000522\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002248a02a21-c1ac-4159-8789-485ad614bd01\u0022\u003EI am disappointed with New Zealand First. I want to acknowledge Dr Kennedy Graham. Although his position was obvious to us all right from the start\u2014and he was straight up and honest and said: \u201CLook, the Green Party is not going to support this bill.\u201D\u2014he had some very good lines of questioning. In fact, sometimes I thought that he was a National MP, given some of his lines of questioning. [Interruption] Well, Andrew had a go at mine, so I guess it is only fair. I have to say that with New Zealand First I acknowledge Mr Mark\u2019s experience and background\u2014but, look, I do not know what the briefing was that Fletcher Tabuteau gave to you, but, as Mr Shearer pointed out, it was way off base. There have been some big changes made to this bill, and there has been some great work done in terms of wrapping more reporting around it and making it much tighter in terms of definitions, and making sure that it is actually still fit for purpose so that our SIS is still able to respond to a change in threat level.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000523\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002248a02a21-c1ac-4159-8789-485ad614bd01\u0022\u003EFinally, I just want to say that for me it was actually an honour coming back into the service of my country as a member of our House of Representatives. Although it was a very truncated process, it was a real honour to be part of it, and to be working with other members across the House, in the spirit of making sure that our national security remains a priority to us all. Thank you.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022c699e7c6-53b9-470c-a14a-378cb6fc8a04\u0022 data-id=\u0022387b93f2564b4ea9ba500f595f80b5d0\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000524\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c699e7c6-53b9-470c-a14a-378cb6fc8a04\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022387b93f2564b4ea9ba500f595f80b5d0\u0022\u003EHon PHIL GOFF (Labour\u2014Mt Roskill):\u003C/span\u003E Two weeks ago we embarked on the process of considering a piece of legislation that was, frankly, unbalanced. It failed to get the balance right between our responsibility as a Parliament to keep New Zealanders safe and, equally, our responsibility as a Parliament to ensure that we do not allow unnecessary and unwarranted intrusion into the private affairs of New Zealanders or cut across their basic rights. The process, frankly, began as a travesty. To get legislation through in 2 weeks, with just 2 days for New Zealanders to prepare and give submissions to the Foreign Affairs, Defence and Trade Committee was appalling. I hope that that never happens again. But I want to pay tribute to all members on the committee, who tried to make the best they could of the situation.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000525\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c699e7c6-53b9-470c-a14a-378cb6fc8a04\u0022\u003EWhen we first met with officials\u2014and I also want to acknowledge the role of officials\u2014we asked that the legislation be given as early as possible to key organisations, and we demanded that if any cooperation was expected from Labour, there had to be a process of hearing submissions. That happened before the bill was introduced. I will give credit to the Minister in charge of the NZ Security Intelligence Service; he listened to the points that we made. The committee members worked really hard right through Thursday, Friday night, Saturday morning, Monday, and Monday night. We tried to do justice to the New Zealanders who wanted to be heard. I know that the Minister deeply regrets his comments about \u201Cchit chat\u201D, and he apologised for them\u2014and I always welcome an apology. We are still waiting for John Key\u2019s apology for the misuse of the SIS for political reasons, but we have, at least, an apology from the Minister. I give him credit for that.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000526\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c699e7c6-53b9-470c-a14a-378cb6fc8a04\u0022\u003EThe process of submissions was really important. We heard very strong submissions from the Legislation Advisory Committee, the Privacy Commissioner, and the New Zealand Law Society. And we heard compelling submissions from New Zealanders, many of whom had never before in their lives made a submission to a select committee. Labour did something that was fairly unprecedented as well: David Shearer and I produced a paper for the select committee. We went through the Countering Terrorist Fighters Legislation Bill part by part, and we said which amendments we felt were necessary for this legislation to be acceptable and for it to get our support. I have a copy of the paper in my hand here. It is quite an interesting read. If this were an exam, I think we would get 95 percent. I would always prefer 100 percent, but we will settle for 95 percent. We got that because the Government was prepared to entertain arguments that said this legislation goes too far, that it is not balanced, and that it needs changing.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000527\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c699e7c6-53b9-470c-a14a-378cb6fc8a04\u0022\u003EI think the overriding argument was that if there was an argument for this legislation at all, under that sort of urgency, it was for a very narrow range of threats that were posed by an emerging organisation called the Islamic State of Iraq and Syria (ISIS). Yet the bill as introduced was going to give powers that encompassed the wider scope of the SIS\u2019s authority. I think the most significant achievement of the committee was to narrow the scope of the additional powers of visual surveillance and warrantless emergency surveillance only to those matters that pertained to a terrorist threat. If that was the justification for bringing in the legislation in the manner it was introduced, then that was what the bill should be confined to. The Law Society and the Legislation Advisory Committee, headed up by the president of the Law Commission, Sir Grant Hammond, both said that the threshold for visual surveillance, which is incredibly intrusive, and for unwarranted emergency surveillance, which was an unprecedented granting of power to the SIS, was much lower for the SIS than parallel powers were for the police. The police powers were specific and focused on serious crime meriting prison sentences of 14 years or more. The Security Intelligence Service\u2019s powers were very broad, based on the gathering of intelligence. So we pulled back the powers that we deemed unacceptable.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000528\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c699e7c6-53b9-470c-a14a-378cb6fc8a04\u0022\u003EI think that when the Government does its review next year, it needs to consider very seriously whether it wants to broaden those powers or whether we should keep the powers of the SIS as narrow as they can be while it carries out the vital function of providing intelligence information that might pre-empt any terrorist attack. We do not believe in having a surveillance society; we believe in giving the Security Intelligence Service the powers that it needs to protect us, and no more. That is a really important principle that we need to consider.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000529\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c699e7c6-53b9-470c-a14a-378cb6fc8a04\u0022\u003EWe considered the question of passports. Under our New Zealand Bill of Rights Act and the International Covenant on Civil and Political Rights, there is a fundamental human right called the freedom of movement\u2014people can come to and leave their country without unnecessary restrictions. We accepted that there are people in New Zealand for whom that right to freedom of movement needs to be curtailed because their declared intention is to fight for an organisation committing crimes against humanity and war crimes. I accept that. I accept that we have an obligation under United Nations Security Resolution 2178 to do what we can to stop people from contributing their manpower to a terrorist organisation that I am utterly opposed to. But what I do not accept is that we should take that curtailment of a fundamental human right, the freedom to travel, and cover other areas where we think it is unwise that a New Zealander goes to\u2014for example, New Zealand Syrians wanting to go to Syria to fight for the Free Syrian Army against al-Assad, or members of the New Zealand Kurdish community who might go to join the Peshmerga against ISIS. But, actually, we do not have the right to stop them in those instances, just as a generation ago we did not stop those men who went to fight against fascism and Franco in Spain. That was unpopular at the time, but within a couple of years we recognised that what they were doing was the right thing.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000530\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c699e7c6-53b9-470c-a14a-378cb6fc8a04\u0022\u003EThe 5 percent of changes Labour did not get included the extension of the 3-year period when you can withhold a passport. We learnt at the committee\u2014and the Minister repeated it in the House\u2014that there have been nine passports, I think, removed from people since 2010. That is a very small number of people. Not one of those people has applied to get their passport back, and if they did, the Minister of Internal Affairs would have the power to decline them for another year, and the year after that. So what we did not accept was that there was an argument under this form of urgency to withhold passports for a full 3-year period after the first year, and I remain unconvinced of that.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000531\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c699e7c6-53b9-470c-a14a-378cb6fc8a04\u0022\u003EWe also got the changes to the amendments to the Customs and Excise Act that the Privacy Commissioner had recommended. His involvement in the process should have the effect of ensuring that those powers are not misused, and that access to data is restricted to the same data that the Customs Service staff themselves have, and not beyond that.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000532\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c699e7c6-53b9-470c-a14a-378cb6fc8a04\u0022\u003ESo when I look down the list of our recommendations, we achieved just about everything that we wanted to in terms of changing the bill, and it would have been churlish of us, having got the changes that we said were minimally necessary to make it acceptable, to then not accept the bill. This legislation comes out of this House\u2014and I think that all of my colleagues on the committee will agree with this\u2014in a better state than it came into the House, and that was vital.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000533\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c699e7c6-53b9-470c-a14a-378cb6fc8a04\u0022\u003EI want to make a couple of general points. The real protections against terrorism lie not in legislation\u2014although this legislation may help\u2014but in having a harmonious and inclusive society; they lie in our moderate Muslim community, which is responsible and does the right thing; and they lie in our reputation internationally as a country that acts independently and has a sense of good international citizenship. During the course of this debate there have been things that have worried me. On a Q\u002BA programme I listened to Stephen Franks\u2014a former member of the ACT Party, and still a National Party member, I think\u2014saying that we should not be bringing people in from Pakistan. I know that Kanwaljit Bakshi would not agree with that. That is a racist comment that casts a slur across an entire community because one or two people might be miscreants. I heard the Prime Minister talking about there being beheadings in the street\u2014I hope that he has reconsidered saying that; it was a foolish and unwise thing to talk about\u2014and I know of the sort of fear that that engendered. I heard the New Zealand First Party talking about it being a mistake to bring people in from the Middle East, when some of us have got many people from the Middle East\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000534\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002207dc4112-8a19-4dd6-a57c-878b47f8a9b6\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022d8486863f33e4632a3623fbf73860b26\u0022\u003ERon Mark\u003C/span\u003E: No, I didn\u2019t say that. Tell the truth.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000535\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c699e7c6-53b9-470c-a14a-378cb6fc8a04\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022f117de97e8dd47c4b0c5056e00c2cc96\u0022\u003EHon PHIL GOFF\u003C/span\u003E: Read the Hansard, Mr Mark, and you will see it. We all heard it. David Bennett heard it, because he followed it up as the next speaker. What I am saying is that we should not cast a slur on any individual because of their ethnicity and their religion. If we can create a decent society that does not marginalise and alienate any of our communities, then we will not have the problem of terrorism\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000536\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002207dc4112-8a19-4dd6-a57c-878b47f8a9b6\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00220504302bd8ef4ddc8f4f87b8cd1b7065\u0022\u003ERon Mark\u003C/span\u003E: I raise a point of order, Mr Speaker. I am going to say to you, Mr Assistant Speaker, that I take offence at the allegations and assertions from Mr Goff. I\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000537\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022893adc11-ce4e-419c-a079-08f04b3d75f5\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00223f7d498ee6f14c86acaf4647b04b7cbf\u0022\u003EThe ASSISTANT SPEAKER (Lindsay Tisch)\u003C/span\u003E: No. [Interruption] The member will sit. [Interruption] Order! This is a debate. It is a strong rebuttal point. Those comments are fairly reflected in this House, and I am not upholding your point of order.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000538\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c699e7c6-53b9-470c-a14a-378cb6fc8a04\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022b41d072228f04eca8798229694e4c869\u0022\u003EHon PHIL GOFF\u003C/span\u003E: I want to finish on this point: it is one thing to go through this process and come out with a piece of legislation that is in a more acceptable form, but what is critically important is to have in the review that is going to take place a strengthening of the independent powers of the Inspector-General of Intelligence and Security, and, I believe, a strengthening of more independent oversight of the Security Intelligence Service by our select committee without the conflict of interest that currently exists there.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002207dc4112-8a19-4dd6-a57c-878b47f8a9b6\u0022 data-id=\u0022913de49eebde4c65a5fb5f22b2f486e9\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000539\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002207dc4112-8a19-4dd6-a57c-878b47f8a9b6\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022913de49eebde4c65a5fb5f22b2f486e9\u0022\u003ERON MARK (NZ First):\u003C/span\u003E I seek leave to make a personal statement. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000540\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022893adc11-ce4e-419c-a079-08f04b3d75f5\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a18a21fb281e4289af79e124d1b62406\u0022\u003EThe ASSISTANT SPEAKER (Lindsay Tisch)\u003C/span\u003E: A personal statement on what matter?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000541\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002207dc4112-8a19-4dd6-a57c-878b47f8a9b6\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022df332f5b4256483a9946b6d6964ecff1\u0022\u003ERON MARK\u003C/span\u003E: On the matter of assertions that I am a member of a racist party, which I took offence to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000542\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022893adc11-ce4e-419c-a079-08f04b3d75f5\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022707f422aef5a420d99c0256f26f8045b\u0022\u003EThe ASSISTANT SPEAKER (Lindsay Tisch)\u003C/span\u003E: Order! The member will sit. I am just going to seek some advice. The member can make a personal statement on something that reflects on him, but the member cannot revisit the ruling that I have made. Ron Mark\u2014a personal statement.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000543\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002207dc4112-8a19-4dd6-a57c-878b47f8a9b6\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022ce09b48b4bbd43529cdeae9b950f4745\u0022\u003ERON MARK\u003C/span\u003E: I just want to assure the House that as the only member of this House who has served an Arab leader in an Arab army, as the only member of this House who has served in an Arab special force unit, who has commanded Arab soldiers, and who has been looked after by Arab soldiers, I am not the sort of person who is blindly racist towards Middle Eastern, Arab, or Muslim people. I am the sort of person who has allowed Muslim soldiers to take charge of my children and protect them. That is all I wanted to say.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022861a1798-a396-4a6c-b9e2-7d2f15d4a001\u0022 data-id=\u00220d3e6d1438df4c8b81303348b348dc29\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000544\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022861a1798-a396-4a6c-b9e2-7d2f15d4a001\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00220d3e6d1438df4c8b81303348b348dc29\u0022\u003EDr SHANE RETI (National\u2014Whangarei):\u003C/span\u003E Here in my last call I would just like to address a few questions around urgency. The question of urgency was raised many times during the Committee stage. The question was asked as to why the House was sitting under urgency on this legislation, and I would like to summarise some points.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000545\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022861a1798-a396-4a6c-b9e2-7d2f15d4a001\u0022\u003EFirst of all, we have already mentioned UN Security Council Resolution 2178, and that was passed no more than a few months ago by the UN Security Council. It requires member States to act against foreign terrorist fighters. If the UN Security Council has seen the need for urgency to act, so should we. I would like to read verbatim article 10 of that resolution: The Security Council \u201CStresses the urgent need to implement fully and immediately this resolution with respect to foreign terrorist fighters, underscores the particular and urgent need to implement this resolution with respect to those foreign terrorist fighters who are associated with ISIL, ANF and other cells, affiliates, splinter groups or derivatives of Al-Qaida,\u201D and it goes on. I make my point on the urgency that is conveyed in that clause. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000546\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022861a1798-a396-4a6c-b9e2-7d2f15d4a001\u0022\u003EI think the second point is that the Cricket World Cup, as has been commented on, starts on 14 February next year, 2015, and as an international fixture and focus, our internal responsibilities and safety are paramount.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000547\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022861a1798-a396-4a6c-b9e2-7d2f15d4a001\u0022\u003EThe last thing I would like to comment on is the contextual urgency, because the threat level in New Zealand has risen from \u201Cvery low\u201D to \u201Clow\u201D. It is not a zero risk. The risk is possible, but not expected. So let us put this in a context that we can understand, that New Zealanders might understand. Last week I spoke to an earthquake expert at GNS Science, and it turns out that the moment before the Canterbury earthquake\u2014the moment before the Canterbury earthquake\u2014the risk was \u201Cpossible but not expected\u201D. We need to live in a real world, with all the challenges and benefits that that brings, and with this bill we seek to work with New Zealanders to offer protection for New Zealanders at home, for New Zealanders overseas, and for the innocents abroad.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000548\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022861a1798-a396-4a6c-b9e2-7d2f15d4a001\u0022\u003EIn conclusion, as a member of this committee, we have heard evidence in private describing the terrorist risk to New Zealanders, and I am persuaded that this legislation is essential, that it is essential now, and that it is fit for purpose, and I commend it to the House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002292557bd5-0e66-473c-a6df-7d108e7822e3\u0022 data-id=\u00224e0a23f39071412b9555a0d5c1e7dbc8\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000549\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002292557bd5-0e66-473c-a6df-7d108e7822e3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00224e0a23f39071412b9555a0d5c1e7dbc8\u0022\u003EDr KENNEDY GRAHAM (Green):\u003C/span\u003E This legislation has had a tortured life as it has gone through Parliament. Although the Foreign Affairs, Defence and Trade Committee collaborated to good effect, this masked an underlying lack of political consensus that should have been a precondition of its passage. Three parties, it seems, are opposing its final adoption. I just want to make some quick points in response to the four points that the Minister made in his comments on the third reading.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000550\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002292557bd5-0e66-473c-a6df-7d108e7822e3\u0022\u003EWith regard to the first point, he stressed that this was simply temporary legislation, to which we would respond: \u201CYes, true. But that is part of the problem.\u201D It is creating constitutional precedent, and qualitative change is often justified in this way\u2014on a temporary basis, subject to subsequent review. With regard to the fourth point, that one of the primary motivations is that New Zealand should be a good international citizen, and that there is no room for moral ambiguity, yes, I agree with that, as well. But it is equally important that we are not artificially clear-sighted in our moral self-perception and self-regard. There should be no room, I suggest, for moral superiority, whether it is on the part of those promoting the bill or those opposing the bill.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000551\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002292557bd5-0e66-473c-a6df-7d108e7822e3\u0022\u003EThe main problem\u2014the reason for the lack of consensus that I spoke of\u2014has been twofold: a lack of transparency over the source itself of the legislation, the reason for it, and a studied imprecision and a lack of logic in the reasoning through to the final product. Because the Government chose to oppose without any responding explanation the Supplementary Order Paper that the Green Party put forward, which would have defined the central concept of \u201Cforeign terrorist fighter\u201D and advanced a statement of purpose explaining the bills, there will tonight be changes to three Acts on New Zealand\u2019s statute book that will allow new, intrusive powers, with no explanatory statement for the historical record, no statement of purpose of fact, and no definitions entered.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000552\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002292557bd5-0e66-473c-a6df-7d108e7822e3\u0022\u003EWe pride ourselves in passing this legislation efficiently, but we lack the efficiency to clarify the central concepts in them. At the end of the day, the Prime Minister may feel comfortable with this piece of legislation, but most New Zealanders are not, and he leaves a legislative dog\u2019s breakfast as part of his political legacy. The committee chairman, a decent man to whom I want to pay tribute, kept describing the process as \u201Ctruncated\u201D, as recently as half an hour ago. \u201CAborted\u201D might be more accurate if we are talking about the democratic process. No piece of New Zealand legislation addressing constitutional rights, such as those of privacy of the person and dignity of the individual, as we have witnessed these past 2 weeks, should ever be subjected to this procedural abomination. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000553\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002292557bd5-0e66-473c-a6df-7d108e7822e3\u0022\u003EWhat we are doing tonight is passing unprecedented powers of surveillance by the SIS, based on an increased threat posed by the Islamic State of Iraq and the Levant (ISIL) in the Middle East, which potentially intrudes into the ultimate bastions of privacy of all New Zealanders. This legislation claims to target foreign terrorist fighters planning to return to New Zealand fully radicalised and to engage in acts of physical violence, but it stretches beyond that. It will now be possible for the SIS, without ministerial warrant, and at the decision of the director, to plant a camera for 24 hours in the bedroom of any New Zealander who may be suspected of facilitating an act causing major environmental damage, motivated by an ideological cause, and aiming to unduly compel the Government to abstain from some act. That action by the citizen, which may have nothing to do with ISIL in the Middle East whatsoever, falls within the definition of the actions justifying those SIS powers. This is wrong. I am aware of the avoidance of doubt subsection, and that does not change the fact.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000554\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002292557bd5-0e66-473c-a6df-7d108e7822e3\u0022\u003EIt is a sorry day for New Zealand. Yes, the world is a tough place. Yes, ISIL is brutal. Yes, we must ensure New Zealand\u2019s national security is safeguarded, but, no, we must not panic and overreact to the realities out there that have existed since the Munich Olympics of 1972. And we must ensure that we do not get dragged into a higher level of threat than is natural for New Zealand through undue association with larger powers that have less regard for inter-civilisational dialogue, conflict resolution, and peaceful settlement. The Green Party concludes that although these issues are difficult and complex, it was right to have opposed the introduction of the bill in the first reading 14 days ago, and right to oppose its adoption in the third reading tonight.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000555\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002292557bd5-0e66-473c-a6df-7d108e7822e3\u0022\u003EI invite the Prime Minister, once again, to recall Ben Franklin\u2019s observation that \u201Cthose who are prepared to give up essential liberty to purchase a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety.\u201D That comment was made in another age and in a different context, and yet it speaks to us tonight. I invite all of us to reflect on John Rawls, who, in his A Theory of Justice, argues that \u201CEach person possesses an inviolability founded on justice that even the welfare of society as a whole cannot override. For this reason justice denies that the loss of freedom for some is made right by a greater good shared by others \u2026 the rights secured by justice are not subject to political bargaining or to the calculus of social interests\u201D. The Green Party will vote against this legislation.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022e11a5f05-1940-41b2-8f1e-911dba7a43a5\u0022 data-id=\u0022b6d3aff470c840bbb85d056fd32b31c7\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000556\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e11a5f05-1940-41b2-8f1e-911dba7a43a5\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022b6d3aff470c840bbb85d056fd32b31c7\u0022\u003EFLETCHER TABUTEAU (NZ First):\u003C/span\u003E This has been a farce of a democratic process. This use of urgency by the National Government is an alarming trend that is happening more and more often. Does the National Government just not want to talk to the people whom it presumes to represent? Every single one of the submissions, oral and written, made special note of the ludicrous time frame given to the Foreign Affairs, Defence and Trade Committee, and also to everyday New Zealanders to give their input to select committee members. The anger and frustration of those who made the effort to turn up at such short notice before the select committee was highly, highly evident.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000557\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e11a5f05-1940-41b2-8f1e-911dba7a43a5\u0022\u003EIf this was all so urgent, why did every other party in this House vote to break for the holidays this week? Why was New Zealand First the only party that asked the question: \u201CHold on, why break so early? Don\u2019t we have these very important issues to consider and put before the people of New Zealand?\u201D New Zealand First was the only party that opposed these dates, and this bill was just one of the many reasons why. But, no, the Government wanted to go on holiday.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000558\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e11a5f05-1940-41b2-8f1e-911dba7a43a5\u0022\u003EYou cannot agree with the supposed changes to this bill when the entire process used to achieve that outcome was flawed in all of its parts. Our select committee heard from the likes of the Human Rights Commission, the New Zealand Law Society, the New Zealand Council for Civil Liberties, and the Legislation Advisory Committee. Every single one of those groups spoke about the travesty of the truncated process, especially for this bill, and the large and wide-reaching implications for all New Zealanders. You cannot in good conscience sit on that committee and agree with every single person who spoke to us. You cannot stand in this House and speak of this travesty of human justice, state that this process has been a farce, and then say we have reached a compromise and it is OK. You cannot say\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000559\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022893adc11-ce4e-419c-a079-08f04b3d75f5\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002261a47b7f5dec44a19f6263b993e4f81f\u0022\u003EThe ASSISTANT SPEAKER (Lindsay Tisch)\u003C/span\u003E: Order! Do not bring me into the debate. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000560\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e11a5f05-1940-41b2-8f1e-911dba7a43a5\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00220f95620b915a475b80ae2c2fc530b32e\u0022\u003EFLETCHER TABUTEAU\u003C/span\u003E: It cannot be said\u2014because we did not even get a chance to read every submission\u2014that it is OK, that we reached a compromise, especially when no compromise has been reached.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000561\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e11a5f05-1940-41b2-8f1e-911dba7a43a5\u0022\u003EWe still have a 3-year period on the cancellation of passports. We still have new warrantless surveillance rights. We still have new video surveillance rights. We still have the situation that evidence collected without a warrant can be retained by these security agencies. Every time we asked the question to those standing before us we got the same answer. Every time we asked \u201CWhat do you think?\u201D, every time we asked \u201CWhat would you have done instead?\u201D, every time we asked \u201CWhat would you do?\u201D, we got the same answer, and the answer was always accusatory. The answer was: \u201CWe don\u2019t know. You didn\u2019t give us enough time to think this through.\u201D\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000562\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e11a5f05-1940-41b2-8f1e-911dba7a43a5\u0022\u003ESir Geoffrey Palmer said it best, perhaps: \u201CWhere legislation is rushed, it often goes wrong.\u201D. I know, and acknowledge, that all of the select committee members in that room were looking to achieve the best for all New Zealanders, but we 10 cannot, and should not, be the sole critique of legislation that alters the fundamental rights of all New Zealanders. We did not give New Zealanders a just chance to speak.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000563\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e11a5f05-1940-41b2-8f1e-911dba7a43a5\u0022\u003EWe are told there is a threat, and New Zealand First does not disagree that there is one. In fact, members of this party have been part of New Zealand\u2019s armed forces. We were willing to stand up then, and we are willing to fight vehemently against terrorism now, but this bill does not do that. However, what is our threat warning? \u201CPossible, but not likely.\u201D This Government\u2019s urgency implies there is a clear and present danger. New Zealand First accepts that there is a threat and the security setting has changed, but we think the threat does not justify this bill in these circumstances.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000564\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e11a5f05-1940-41b2-8f1e-911dba7a43a5\u0022\u003EI question also the pressure of the Cricket World Cup. During the Rugby World Cup the American team played on the 10th anniversary of 9/11. What was the solution at the time? They beefed up security. They did not change the law. They acted accordingly, and they acknowledged that there might be a risk; they stated it was a low one. Our right to privacy and our human rights were left alone then, and they should be left alone now.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000565\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e11a5f05-1940-41b2-8f1e-911dba7a43a5\u0022\u003EThe Prime Minister has used the Islamic State of Iraq and the Levant (ISIL) conflict in his rhetoric to justify the development and the extension of these intrusive powers. The UN Security Council Resolution 2178 asks New Zealanders to do all they can to restrict the movement of foreign terrorist fighters, and rightfully so. We should not be letting New Zealanders take arms in support of terrorist organisations. But this rhetoric has inflamed many in New Zealand, and has further isolated and marginalised good people whom New Zealand First would presume to support.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000566\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e11a5f05-1940-41b2-8f1e-911dba7a43a5\u0022\u003EWe need to be considerate and measured. The Law Society accepts that the international situation is moving rapidly, and that the national response must keep abreast, as does New Zealand First. It finished by saying that this \u201Cis not synonymous with saying that any legislation should be enacted under urgency.\u201D United Nations special rapporteur Ben Emmerson, when submitting to the UN General Assembly in relation to Resolution 2178, commented that \u201CMeasures justified by reference to States\u2019 duties to protect against the threat of terrorism should never be used as a Trojan horse to usher in wider powers of surveillance for unrelated governmental functions.\u201D \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000567\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e11a5f05-1940-41b2-8f1e-911dba7a43a5\u0022\u003EI have found some excellent words spoken on the rights of New Zealanders, and much of the public fears that our rights are being eroded cut by cut. \u201CWe have an obligation to maintain the integrity of our democratic system, or institutions, and the systems and processes of Government. Here in New Zealand we often take our democratic freedoms for granted. We think they will always be there. We have a Bill of Rights, which is supposed to protect our right to freedom of expression. What on Earth could go wrong?\u201D. The quote continues: \u201CI have a different view. I believe what Thomas Jefferson said\u2014that the price of freedom is eternal vigilance \u2026 There are times when we have to stand up for our rights, and the rights of our neighbours and friends, and indeed the rights of people we totally disagree with, or else these rights will begin to erode away.\u201D That same man who spoke these so appropriate words some time ago is now the leader of our Government. Under his leadership this Government is instigating a system and a process that will undermine the very democratic principles that he spoke to not so long ago.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000568\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e11a5f05-1940-41b2-8f1e-911dba7a43a5\u0022\u003ENew Zealand First recognises our commitment to the United Nations Security Council, which requires us to prevent the travel of foreign terrorist fighters, but we already have the power to do this. We can cancel passports now. But what about the rest of the obligations from the Security Council? What about the statement that we must reaffirm that member States must comply with their human rights obligations when fighting terrorism, which notes that a failure to do so contributes to radicalisation? Where was this Government\u2019s dialogue with religious faiths and ethnic groups? We were told in the select committee\u2014openly and outright\u2014that it had not taken place. Together with the tools and resources to prevent citizens from becoming terrorist fighters, the Government should engage with civil society to address the problems of communities most at risk of recruitment and radicalisation, and achieve their smooth and satisfactory social integration. That comes from a UN Security Council address.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000569\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e11a5f05-1940-41b2-8f1e-911dba7a43a5\u0022\u003E So far all this Government has done is to inflame potentially disaffected members of our society, and it has achieved exactly what the UN Security Council warned us not to do. What I heard in the debate amongst select committee members was an intelligent thrust and counter-thrust of arguments and ideas. I developed a high level of respect for my peers, especially on the left. But what I observed over and above the detail was the public\u2019s repeated and passionate argument that this process is flawed and undemocratic, and, as has been stated many times, a rushed process can lead to flawed legislation. We do not know, we have not taken the time, and we will not find out whether it is flawed.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000570\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e11a5f05-1940-41b2-8f1e-911dba7a43a5\u0022\u003EThe Government and Labour argue that there is a sunset clause, but it is too long, too far away, for those who would get caught up in what history\u2014very recent history\u2014has shown us to be an abused system, with security agencies that are looking for an enemy of the State instead targeting enemies of the Prime Minister and other members of this House. To conclude, beyond all of these issues, information that is gathered without a warrant under this bill can be retained and used, even if no warrant is granted and no subsequent warrant is sought. To clarify, information gathered without a warrant can be used by New Zealand security agencies. Nothing has changed in the rushed committee process. New Zealand First opposes this legislation. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022eaf79431-1033-44f1-a633-22633da52c0d\u0022 data-id=\u0022c7d320e2a01e4045a8f9707ba78fbcbd\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000571\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022eaf79431-1033-44f1-a633-22633da52c0d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022c7d320e2a01e4045a8f9707ba78fbcbd\u0022\u003EDAVID BENNETT (National\u2014Hamilton East):\u003C/span\u003E I would just like to congratulate this Parliament on passing this legislation tonight. I think that many times we hear that this Parliament does not act in the best interests of all New Zealanders and that it takes a very adversarial approach to debating issues. I would like New Zealanders just to reflect on the way that this Parliament has come together in some very quick time\u2014and nobody is debating that\u2014to come to a good solution. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000572\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022eaf79431-1033-44f1-a633-22633da52c0d\u0022\u003EI would like to congratulate all those involved in that process\u2014first of all, the Minister in charge of the NZ Security Intelligence Service, Chris Finlayson, who is here and has contributed through the debates tonight to give detailed analysis of the decisions that were made. I would like to draw special attention to the Foreign Affairs, Defence and Trade Committee chair, Mark Mitchell, who did a fine job in enabling all people to have their points of view well known and took on board the comments made by the Opposition to come to some constructive solutions; to other committee members from the National side who worked hard to achieve that; and also to two special members of the Opposition, David Shearer and Phil Goff. I think their experience in the political process was important for the decisions that they came to in this legislation, and also their understanding of foreign affairs was, I think, essentially a big part of where we got to as a committee. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000573\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022eaf79431-1033-44f1-a633-22633da52c0d\u0022\u003EI would also like to thank our officials who are here. They worked tirelessly in short periods of time to deliver draft on draft of legislation, and to give very strong and solid advice so that the Parliament could come to the solution that it did reach. Last of all, and most important, I would like to thank the submitters. We did get some people, whom you would expect to submit, who were against this bill but we also got a lot of ordinary New Zealanders who wanted to have their say. They had genuine concerns, whether it was around the timing that the bill took or some with a religious or ethnic basis who saw some issues in the process and also the legislation. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000574\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022eaf79431-1033-44f1-a633-22633da52c0d\u0022\u003EIt is not perfect, but this Parliament is never perfect. This Parliament has passed many laws under urgency that have never gone to select committees. This Parliament will continue to do that, in the best interests of the country going forward. The two main political parties agreed on that and came to a compromise that is workable, efficient, and in the best interests of New Zealanders. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000575\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022eaf79431-1033-44f1-a633-22633da52c0d\u0022\u003EI want to emphasise that today because the bill is about keeping New Zealanders safe, and that is all New Zealanders. It is not just the people whom political parties may represent in their voting bases; it is all of us. It is all the different ethnicities, religions, and cultures that make up this country. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000576\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022eaf79431-1033-44f1-a633-22633da52c0d\u0022\u003EI just want to give special credit to Phil Goff as well for the way he took on New Zealand First then. It is disgusting that in this House a political party can do what New Zealand First has done tonight and politicise this issue. It is absolutely disgusting. Fletcher Tabuteau\u2014at least he spoke in the third reading. I give him credit for that. He is a new member so he will not be able to go against his leader, but to make this a political football, to take on some of the most vulnerable people in our communities, is a disgrace from the New Zealand First Party. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000577\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022eaf79431-1033-44f1-a633-22633da52c0d\u0022\u003EThat was one of the things that many submitters did raise with us. I know in my community we have got a large Islamic community. They are great people. They are people who have come here to make a new life for themselves in this country. The last thing we need in this Parliament is for parties like New Zealand First to attack them politically and publicly. We should be supporting those communities, not trying to take them down. That is something that New Zealanders want to see, and both Labour and National have achieved it.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000578\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002207dc4112-8a19-4dd6-a57c-878b47f8a9b6\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00224073f506f94d43b3b5b47600b2588258\u0022\u003ERon Mark\u003C/span\u003E: Name one.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000579\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022eaf79431-1033-44f1-a633-22633da52c0d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022de3fb46f2ee54769becb0e12ff206956\u0022\u003EDAVID BENNETT\u003C/span\u003E: Name one what?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000580\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002207dc4112-8a19-4dd6-a57c-878b47f8a9b6\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022fd8caf9c6147424d9f0a49c9cabd2af8\u0022\u003ERon Mark\u003C/span\u003E: Muslim person you\u2019ve ever looked after.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000581\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022eaf79431-1033-44f1-a633-22633da52c0d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00224faa00f9d7d84c0688d5547cfcf33b77\u0022\u003EDAVID BENNETT\u003C/span\u003E: Name one? Well, if you ever won an electorate seat you would actually have to do a lot of immigration work. We have got thousands of people there whom we have done immigration work for. But that member would never know because he will never win an electorate seat. He has always been on the gravy train, that man. He is in here just because his boss gets him in here. Look at the reality\u2014[Interruption] That is it. You actually go and do some work and then come and tell us what to do. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000582\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022eaf79431-1033-44f1-a633-22633da52c0d\u0022\u003EBut, members of this Parliament, be proud of your Parliament tonight. Your Parliament has stood up for the good things that New Zealanders wanted to achieve. It has stood up for the security of New Zealanders going forward. It has achieved that through working together, as both main political parties have done. That is a credit to our political system, and it is a credit to, I think, all members of those two main political parties. The Greens were never going to vote for the bill. It does not matter what you had in it; they would never vote for it. New Zealand First is just a disgusting party that should not be in this Parliament. That is all that you need to say. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000583\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022eaf79431-1033-44f1-a633-22633da52c0d\u0022\u003EMoving forward there are, and there always will be, threats to the security of a country. We do not know necessarily what those threats may be. They will morph and change, and the organisations involved will not be something that we can put in a box and say this is going to happen, this is the time it will happen, and this is the place. It does not work that way. But we need to have flexibility in our rules. We need to give our institutions that protect New Zealanders the skills and resources to do that. We need to take that insurance to protect the future of our people and our country going forward. That is what this bill is about. It is about giving the tools to the communities that are there and that are vested with the interest of protecting our whole country, of protecting the reputation of New Zealand going forward as a free and open country, of protecting our young people who go about their business on a day-to-day basis, and of protecting vital interests that we have as a country. Labour understood that, National understood that, and we worked to get a solution that is a good compromise. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000584\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022eaf79431-1033-44f1-a633-22633da52c0d\u0022\u003EI think if you had this legislation when it first came before this Parliament and then you had a look at what you have got at the end here now, you would be very happy with what you have got here.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000585\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022893adc11-ce4e-419c-a079-08f04b3d75f5\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a9a3c242c26a42d3bcc127aa55879013\u0022\u003EThe ASSISTANT SPEAKER (Lindsay Tisch)\u003C/span\u003E: Order! \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000586\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022eaf79431-1033-44f1-a633-22633da52c0d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00225bfb103cfc0040e2ae3b71e9e6258a7b\u0022\u003EDAVID BENNETT\u003C/span\u003E: This legislation is a very good compromise. It is actually probably where it would have started off and ended up if we had had more time. It is actually something that I think you would have found that whether National or Labour had promoted it, it would have the same result. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000587\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022eaf79431-1033-44f1-a633-22633da52c0d\u0022\u003EThis is good legislation. It shows New Zealanders that this Parliament is serious about it. The good people who are in this Parliament\u2014and I take into account both parties for that\u2014have delivered for New Zealanders the safety and security they need for their country going forward. I would like to thank everybody involved, especially the submitters, and those who helped with supporting Parliament to achieve that. Thank you.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00220ee528dc-7870-4553-95ed-5ec0cab60f07\u0022 data-id=\u00227403ded6ea4f4241b7f2d21f8337dfae\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000588\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220ee528dc-7870-4553-95ed-5ec0cab60f07\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00227403ded6ea4f4241b7f2d21f8337dfae\u0022\u003ECATHERINE DELAHUNTY (Green):\u003C/span\u003E T\u0113n\u0101 koe, Mr Assistant Speaker. T\u0113n\u0101 koutou e te Whare i t\u0113nei p\u014D. It is a sad moment, because despite the soothing noises, the legal arguments, and all the cosiness that some people are claiming, it is clear to me that this legislation is being supported by people who have never experienced surveillance, and that the people who are actually going to experience the surveillance or have already experienced it, who came before you, have a reason to understand the term \u201Cmoral ambiguity\u201D. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000589\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220ee528dc-7870-4553-95ed-5ec0cab60f07\u0022\u003EI would like to focus on that very term because moral ambiguity is how the conflict in the Middle East has been characterised, and it is fuelling the Islamic State of Iraq and the Levant (ISIL). Moral ambiguity from the Western powers, whose weapons of supposed mass destruction and their blatant politics of oil, not the politics of an ethical stance, has allowed the allies to support various violent regimes, some extremely misogynist, when it suits the Western powers. When it suits the Western powers, legislation like this will be passed. So let us not pretend that we are operating in some independent little country\u2019s virtuous cycle of self-responsibility. This is about \u201CFive Eyes\u201D, and this what the Americans want us to do and so we are doing it. If that is not moral ambiguity, I do not know what it is. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000590\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220ee528dc-7870-4553-95ed-5ec0cab60f07\u0022\u003EI would like to remind people of some citizens of this country who have experienced the SIS and its capacity to be morally ambiguous. Mr Ahmed Zaoui, a gentleman whom I happen to know, was put in solitary confinement because he was supposedly connected with terrorism, because the French did not like him. He did 5 years, and it cost $3 million for his name to be cleared. This man had no connection with violence\u2014he was a member of Parliament in his own country and a non-violent person\u2014but nevertheless ended up rotting in a cell inside New Zealand. The powers that be, the SIS right up to the Prime Minister of the day, refused to look at the evidence. That is how safe we feel about what can happen in this country. I would like to talk about my friend Benny Wenda, who was not allowed to speak in this Parliament\u2014a West Papuan who was on the red list for Interpol. Interpol put him on their red list for no other reason than that the Indonesians had framed him. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000591\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220ee528dc-7870-4553-95ed-5ec0cab60f07\u0022\u003EInformation from other countries about these so-called people who need to be on red lists, or be in solitary confinement, or who are terrorists, can mean they suffer a huge price. This legislation will allow that. Despite all the reassurances that we are going to be dealing with only the bad people\u2014because, of course, the world is divided neatly into good and bad people; we all know that in this House, do we not\u2014what is actually happening is a low-trust model, and we are being asked to trust something that has not yet proven to be trustworthy, i.e., the SIS, let alone the Minister of the day having control over the SIS.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000592\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220ee528dc-7870-4553-95ed-5ec0cab60f07\u0022\u003EI think the point is well made that the committee of this House that makes decisions around the SIS is a failed committee. If there was so much that was heard by the Foreign Affairs, Defence and Trade Committee about how dangerous it all was\u2014my colleague Dr Kennedy Graham heard all the evidence too. Somehow he was not swayed into a state of paranoia. Somehow he did not think it was necessary to forgo human rights and civil liberties in this legislation. Somehow he managed to maintain a sense of proportion in the face of a disproportionate piece of legislation that is not convincing. It has not convinced many, many people. So it is very disappointing, when you know how surveillance works, to hear people talk as if only the bad people are at risk. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000593\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220ee528dc-7870-4553-95ed-5ec0cab60f07\u0022\u003EWe are proud to stand on our record of being peace makers, because this legislation will not make peace. It will not make anyone safer. It has already made people less safe in this country, because Muslim people are being targeted. They are being abused because of the Government having to create the hyperbole to pass the legislation. That is very disturbing\u2014not to mention how much surveillance you can do in 24 hours. Tame Iti told us about the surveillance that was in his bathroom, and the devices that were put in his bathroom. The SIS and others will do these things. People here think, oh, it will not happen to them. For people like myself who have experienced surveillance, we know that this is not about all New Zealanders. This is wrong, this is a betrayal, and this is an abuse of human rights.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022 data-id=\u002258956307c41e42958543c511e1864778\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000594\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002258956307c41e42958543c511e1864778\u0022\u003EDAVID SEYMOUR (Leader\u2014ACT):\u003C/span\u003E I rise on behalf of the ACT Party in support of this legislation. The lines, or the written laws, that demarcate the relationship between the power of the State and the rights and freedoms of the individual are among the most important things that we will ever debate in this House, and so I am grateful for the opportunity to explain my support for this legislation.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000595\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003EDuring the first reading, I said that I too have read both Franklin and Rawls. The main conclusion I came to is that I wish the Green Party would apply its new-found classical liberalism to the role of Government within the domestic economy\u2014but I digress. I also conclude that we do not live by the maxim that those who give up freedom for security deserve neither. In fact, the history of classical liberal society is that we have done precisely that, and have done it very, very carefully to get a good bargain in terms of security for the freedom that we have been prepared to trade off. I said at the time that extending visual surveillance powers that already exist within the police to the SIS was not a significant change in principle, and neither was extending the period that a passport could be cancelled for.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000596\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003EForty-eight hour warrantless surveillance with a very wide scope, however, I said was not OK and was a significant shift in principle rather than extent. So I stand before you today and explain why it is that I have changed my mind on what I regard as a very important matter. No doubt reducing the period of warrantless surveillance to 24 hours puts it far more in line with the practical requirements of the time taken to get a warrant properly. Bear in mind, a much greater threat to civil liberties was that under practical pressures, the existing warrant-granting process might have been watered down. It is far better to have a more transparent process like this than to do that. Narrowing the scope to terrorist acts only was a significant concession that has made it much easier for me to support this bill.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000597\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003EBut most important is the fact that despite the truncated process that we have gone through\u2014and I might say it is very easy for members of New Zealand First to say that we should have sat through the holiday for this legislation, because for them going on holiday does not change their workload very much anyway. I have to say that despite this truncated process, the greatest mercy that we have is that we are able to revisit this legislation within the current term, and that is how I was able to change my mind.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000598\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003EIn particular, I would like to thank the Inspector-General of Intelligence and Security for her briefing. I would like to thank the chair of the Foreign Affairs, Defence and Trade Committee, Mark Mitchell, for his chairing. In particular, I would like to thank senior members of the Labour Party whom I respect. Ultimately, for me, it was their willingness to forgo the ability to do political point-scoring in order to support this legislation for issues of both national security and our civil liberties simultaneously that persuaded me that it was worth supporting this legislation. With that in mind, I commend this legislation to the House. Thank you. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00226dc89bbf-c2ef-45c9-89e4-d2b5952d8d16\u0022 data-id=\u0022a87b4805a31f41bdbb6121c8eff1c1b4\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000599\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226dc89bbf-c2ef-45c9-89e4-d2b5952d8d16\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022a87b4805a31f41bdbb6121c8eff1c1b4\u0022\u003EKANWALJIT SINGH BAKSHI (National):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Mr Assistant Speaker, for the opportunity to speak on the third reading of this legislation. Even though I am not on the Foreign Affairs, Defence and Trade Committee, I thought it was important for me to contribute in the third reading of this legislation. First of all, I would like to congratulate the chair of this select committee, Mark Mitchell, on the hard work and the other members who contributed during the long hours of the select committee. I would also like to thank the officials for their work. It is really good to see quality legislation back in the House. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000600\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226dc89bbf-c2ef-45c9-89e4-d2b5952d8d16\u0022\u003EI thought I would share some of the discussions I had with the Muslim community during the past few weeks. They have raised concerns about their family security. They did not talk about the legislation; they talked about the security of their families and the future of their families, which are important to them. Here I would like to clarify the point raised by Ron Mark about whether David Bennett has worked with the Muslim community or not. I can vouch that I have visited the mosques in Hamilton on a number of occasions with the two hard-working MPs of Hamilton, David Bennett and Tim Macindoe, so I can assure that member that we are working with all communities of this country. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000601\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226dc89bbf-c2ef-45c9-89e4-d2b5952d8d16\u0022\u003EWhile this legislation has been debated there have been a number of issues that have been raised. I would like to take this opportunity to say that the Muslim community should rest assured that they are living in a fair country. We have always welcomed the migrants coming into this country, and we will continue to work. With these words I would like to conclude my speech, and commend this legislation to the House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022 data-id=\u002225fd11b7a69241f1acd1fd6f65e11085\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000602\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002225fd11b7a69241f1acd1fd6f65e11085\u0022\u003EJACINDA ARDERN (Labour):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you for the acclamation. Anyone listening to this debate, I think, would have heard, on balance, a reasonably constructive debate, perhaps with the exception of David Bennett. There are things that unite us in this House, but there are also deeply held principles that we will dispute, and that we will dispute in a constructive way. As Opposition MPs\u2014and we have all noticed this and known this over the past 6 years\u2014we are often forced to take the on-balance view. This legislation is an example of that in the most extreme. But let us be under no illusion. If right now we were voting on the first iteration of the original bill that came before the House, I doubt very much that you would see support from Labour on that version of the bill. In fact, you absolutely would not. It was a bill we just could not support. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000603\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022\u003EIt was made absolutely clear in some of the speeches that were first given in the House that we had five main concerns: the fact that it allowed warrantless surveillance for up to 48 hours; the fact that the sunset clause did not expire until 2018; the fact that it enabled the SIS to conduct visual surveillance like the police; the fact that it increased access to the Customs Service database; and the fact that it extended the period that passports could be cancelled from 1 year up to 3 years. I think everyone in this House would agree that those were significant steps to be taking as a Parliament, and that we had to be assured that there were grounds for those steps to be taken. It was our view that there were not grounds to go as far as that bill first suggested. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000604\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022\u003ELet us also be absolutely clear. If we were voting just based on the process that the Countering Terrorist Fighters Legislation Bill underwent, we also would not be voting in favour of it. The process by which we came to debate some extraordinarily significant issues was appalling to the extreme. I think everyone would probably agree\u2014and, in fact, on ratings they are\u2014that the United Kingdom and Australia are facing a significantly higher threat to their security than New Zealand is. Yet, they are taking greater time to debate and consider these similar powers than we did, and we never heard the justification for that from the Government. We understand that there will always be security and intelligence information that we as citizens, or even as Opposition members of Parliament, are not privy to, and for good reason. In those circumstances we, therefore, place an enormous amount of trust in those who are privy to that information. But if the only comparator that we have is the fact that the UK, which also has similar threats and which also is not able to share that information, is still taking more time than we are, then of course that sows the seeds of doubt as to what the motivation was and whether it was justified. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000605\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022\u003EThe fact that we had a 2-day process, and, yet, still in that time there were 588 submissions, speaks more about the concern of citizens in New Zealand than it does about how grateful the Government was that so many people were still willing to submit. In fact, I have almost heard it termed as a victory on that side of the House that so many people were still willing to come forward and engage, in those circumstances. It was not a victory. How many people missed out because of that short time frame or were unable to be heard, given only 63 submitters were heard? Yes, I congratulate the Foreign Affairs, Defence and Trade Committee on putting in such long hours to hear as many submissions as it could, but it did not have to be that way. The great irony, of course, is that we were proposing that spy agencies be given 48 hours of warrantless surveillance but we would not give that long to submitters to submit on the bill that would have granted that power. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000606\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022\u003EThis was not the basis on which we as an Opposition were forced to make a decision as to whether or not we would support the legislation. Yes, we accept that there is an increased threat. We accept that the acts of terror undertaken by the Islamic State of Iraq and Syria are heinous and should not, and cannot, be tolerated by any nation State. Yes, we accept that the international environment in which we are operating now is very different from what it was even 10 years ago. We accept all of those premises, but how much of our inalienable rights do we trade in order to meet all of those threats that we accept? Well, not as much as the Government first proposed. I want to acknowledge the work that David Shearer and Phil Goff did on behalf of the Labour Party to push extremely hard in the select committee, in a constructive way, to change some of the fundamental elements of the bill. I just want to cover some of those briefly. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000607\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022\u003EFirst of all is warrantless searches. It is a massive step. The threshold needs to be extraordinarily high. As introduced, the bill allowed warrantless searches to \u201Cdetect activities prejudicial to security \u2026 or [for the purpose of gathering] foreign intelligence information that is essential to security;\u201D. That was the definition. This bill was introduced under the premise that we were tackling only international terrorist acts. That is what this bill was meant to be around. That definition was far too broad to ensure that those were the only circumstances in which it was used. So it was because of Labour that that definition has been narrowed as far as it has now. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000608\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022\u003EThe bill also allowed a time frame that was far too generous, and unnecessarily so. The select committee again argued it down to 24 hours, not 48. Extra safety provisions, extra safeguards, have been added. The SIS will have to report to the public every 6 months, rather than annually, on the use of the powers that have been granted to it, and, also, the director of the Security Intelligence Service will be required to immediately notify the Commissioner of Security Warrants and the Inspector-General of Intelligence and Security when using this warrantless power. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000609\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022\u003EThe second major change was to the sunset clause. A sunset clause, of course, means the expiration of a bill. We do tend to do this when we use a controversial extension of powers. We did it when we extended supervision orders for offenders, for instance. It gives a chance for Parliament to review its use. But, as introduced, the sunset clause in this bill did not expire until April 2018. That would mean that a new Parliament would discuss and debate it. It was, of course, quite far out. I think it is right that the select committee made sure that it would expire on 1 April 2017. Part of our argument has been that this should be part of a wider review of our security and intelligence agencies, and we still argue that that review should have taken place even before we saw the massive changes to the powers of the Government Communications Security Bureau. We continue to argue for that broader review. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000610\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022\u003EFinally, of course, there were changes to the Customs and Excise Act. We continue to have concerns about the ability under the Passports Act to cancel a passport for 3 years, rather than 12 years, but we made sure that we would never leave a citizen stateless if their passport were to be revoked. Those, again, were assurances that Labour sought at the select committee. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000611\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022\u003EThere has been considerable talk in this House about perception, except perhaps we have talked about perception in the wrong direction. There has been a view that terrorist agencies would be looking at what New Zealand would be doing, in its domestic context, to tackle terrorism. But what about what New Zealanders perceive of this legislation and this process? This law may now be one, on balance, where we have worked hard to preserve those inalienable rights of New Zealanders, but a balanced view was not what was brought to the debate in the lead up to this law. The perception posed by the Government left members of our ethnic community feeling vilified and feeling targeted, and that was wrong. Yes, perception matters, but what has this process done to that community? \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000612\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022\u003EThat is why I absolutely believe that we must defend\u2014as much as, or even more vehemently than, our security\u2014our independence, we must defend our inclusiveness, and we must defend more than just tolerance in our society. I am extremely sad about what this process has done to damage that.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022656487fe-e0a2-485c-8dc2-fe61b9aec128\u0022 data-id=\u002208c45e5b859949e185d2c5b9727d06e7\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000613\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022656487fe-e0a2-485c-8dc2-fe61b9aec128\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002208c45e5b859949e185d2c5b9727d06e7\u0022\u003EDr JIAN YANG (National):\u003C/span\u003E I am very pleased to be the last speaker in the last reading of the legislation arising out of this particular bill, the Countering Terrorist Fighters Legislation Bill. Perhaps I should summarise some main points. First of all, I would say that this legislation is an effort to protect our national security and to fulfil our international obligations while at the same time trying to have safeguard measures. For that reason we have made a number of changes. Let me summarise a few of these changes. The previous speakers touched upon all sorts of changes. There are three or four major changes. First of all, there is the sunset clause. As the previous speaker, Jacinda Ardern, has just mentioned, the sunset clause will now expire on 1 April 2017 instead of 1 April 2018. Secondly, visual surveillance is strictly limited to countering terrorism. Thirdly, we say that the time of warrantless emergency surveillance is now shortened to 24 hours from 48 hours. These are efforts to make sure that we have safeguard measures there. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000614\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022656487fe-e0a2-485c-8dc2-fe61b9aec128\u0022\u003EMost important, I would emphasise the other point that some other speakers have touched upon\u2014that is, the Muslim society. As a first-generation immigrant from an ethnic minority in New Zealand, I fully appreciate the concerns of the Muslim society. A number of submitters mentioned this while at the hearings. New Zealand is an inclusive society. We all appreciate that and that is why we came to New Zealand. I was told recently that a local Muslim policeman opened a mosque in Taihape just for visitors and local community members. This is very important. We want to see such things happening more and more because we want to see a vibrant cultural society. New Zealand is doing well and we believe that this legislation itself will protect our national security and fulfil our international obligations, but at the same time we will also make sure we treat our Muslim society very, very fairly. I commend the bill to the House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca id=\u00220d330a58eec94845a451cc7f4ab1c8c7\u0022 name=\u0022division\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EA party vote was called for on the question, That the Passports Amendment Bill be now read a third time.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EAyes 94\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand National 60; New Zealand Labour 32; ACT New Zealand 1; United Future 1.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENoes 27\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EGreen Party 14; New Zealand First 11; M\u0101ori Party 2.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EBill read a third time.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca id=\u002279896331bd674d9181bed2d8af8ee50f\u0022 name=\u0022division\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EA party vote was called for on the question, That the Customs and Excise Amendment Bill be now read a third time.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EAyes 94\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand National 60; New Zealand Labour 32; ACT New Zealand 1; United Future 1.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENoes 27\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EGreen Party 14; New Zealand First 11; M\u0101ori Party 2.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EBill read a third time.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca id=\u0022cb4c8e701c0e49589ef85168d084edf5\u0022 name=\u0022division\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EA party vote was called for on the question, That the New Zealand Security Intelligence Service Amendment Bill  be now read a third time.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EAyes 94\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand National 60; New Zealand Labour 32; ACT New Zealand 1; United Future 1.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENoes 27\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EGreen Party 14; New Zealand First 11; M\u0101ori Party 2.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EBill read a third time.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n    \u003C/div\u003E\n    \u003Cdiv class=\u0022HpsHansard\u0022\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000615\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsProceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u00222dfa8e48e38046ae919b80385126ebc5\u0022\u003EBusiness of the House\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000617\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u0022b30c9e81bfc14b5290a8fe5600f9b52e\u0022\u003EBusiness of the House\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00228a1cb04e-8a86-44d1-9004-6e158e220339\u0022 data-id=\u002274139210d5914e6c8e7293c78285978b\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000616\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00228a1cb04e-8a86-44d1-9004-6e158e220339\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002274139210d5914e6c8e7293c78285978b\u0022\u003ETIM MACINDOE (Senior Whip\u2014National):\u003C/span\u003E I seek leave for the Committee stages of Government Orders of the Day Nos 2 and 3 to be considered together.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022893adc11-ce4e-419c-a079-08f04b3d75f5\u0022 data-id=\u0022bbd0ee5323a44b9ebe58c1d24037b777\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000618\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022893adc11-ce4e-419c-a079-08f04b3d75f5\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022bbd0ee5323a44b9ebe58c1d24037b777\u0022\u003EThe ASSISTANT SPEAKER (Lindsay Tisch)\u003C/span\u003E: Leave is sought for that course of action. Is there any objection? There is no objection.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n    \u003C/div\u003E\n    \u003Cdiv class=\u0022HpsHansard\u0022\u003E\n      \u003Cp\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsProceedingHeading\u0022\u003EBills\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000619\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u00223a2f6023a0ff44d18bff347bb46a3119\u0022\u003ENg\u0101ti Koroki Kahukura Claims Settlement Bill\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000620\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u00225ba2a8ad43454855916928239e0cb62b\u0022\u003EIn Committee\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000621\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u00227dd9b145c01640aea26cea36191c84ab\u0022\u003EPart 1  Preliminary matters, acknowledgments and apology, and settlement of historical claims\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002241146229-4d11-415b-a4ac-f4e2b923e95d\u0022 data-id=\u0022876ebcc2058840a0bd0965ca1f6d6552\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000622\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002241146229-4d11-415b-a4ac-f4e2b923e95d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022876ebcc2058840a0bd0965ca1f6d6552\u0022\u003EHon CHRISTOPHER FINLAYSON (Minister for Treaty of Waitangi Negotiations):\u003C/span\u003E I just want to address briefly Supplementary Order Paper 37. As a consequence of the Historic Places Trust legislation being repealed earlier this year and replaced by the Heritage New Zealand legislation, there are a couple of minor changes that will need to be made to the substantive legislation, and that really is what this Supplementary Order Paper is about. Then there are some minor technical amendments to the bill and they are so minor I will not bother the Committee with them at this hour of the night. Thirdly, as a result of recent survey work, there are some minor changes to the legal descriptions of certain properties, which are described in the bill.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000623\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002241146229-4d11-415b-a4ac-f4e2b923e95d\u0022\u003EThe question was put that the amendments set out on Supplementary Order Paper 37 in the name of the Hon Christopher Finlayson to Part 1 be agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000624\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002241146229-4d11-415b-a4ac-f4e2b923e95d\u0022\u003EAmendments agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000625\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002241146229-4d11-415b-a4ac-f4e2b923e95d\u0022\u003EPart 1 as amended agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000626\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u0022b74dc8e4b2cd457fb1645c7c2d2af0d8\u0022\u003EPart 2  Cultural redress\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000627\u0022\u003EThe question was put that the amendments set out on Supplementary Order Paper 37 in the name of the Hon Christopher Finlayson to Part 2 be agreed to.\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000628\u0022\u003EAmendments agreed to.\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000629\u0022\u003EPart 2 as amended agreed to.\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000630\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u002281bce2867ee64cd6b844bb1e4845c836\u0022\u003EPart 3 agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000631\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u0022c5462adda2d84f988f711489d5a0f004\u0022\u003ESchedule 1 agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000632\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u00224e25a58edef9464aa157acb0db047e7a\u0022\u003ESchedule 2 \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000633\u0022\u003EThe question was put that the amendments set out on Supplementary Order Paper 37 in the name of the Hon Christopher Finlayson to schedule 2 be agreed to.\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000634\u0022\u003EAmendments agreed to.\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000635\u0022\u003ESchedule 2 as amended agreed to.\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000636\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u00228093914931944f79a79df548aa7483ba\u0022\u003ESchedule 3 agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000637\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u002217ab53f86521464bb6e8c23094389702\u0022\u003ESchedule 4 agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000638\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u00224e4207a3acb8415fa13913df76630300\u0022\u003EClause 1 agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000639\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u00225331cc7a289d48c99c39e047382775de\u0022\u003EClause 2 agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000640\u0022\u003EBill to be reported with amendment presently.\u003C/p\u003E\n    \u003C/div\u003E\n    \u003Cdiv class=\u0022HpsHansard\u0022\u003E\n      \u003Cp\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsProceedingHeading\u0022\u003EBills\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000641\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u002239d7ba65d9f3458ba2db9265867e7b40\u0022\u003ENg\u0101ti Hau\u0101 Claims Settlement Bill\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000642\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u00226816e998e54540809ed6cc5d8a498b31\u0022\u003EIn Committee\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000643\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u0022a4e7ea44914d483caef40c876a7452e9\u0022\u003EPart 1  Preliminary matters, acknowledgements and apology, and settlement of non-raupatu historical claims\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002241146229-4d11-415b-a4ac-f4e2b923e95d\u0022 data-id=\u00228a5606fbb36a47ba97190f3a8a6189c0\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000644\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002241146229-4d11-415b-a4ac-f4e2b923e95d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00228a5606fbb36a47ba97190f3a8a6189c0\u0022\u003EHon CHRISTOPHER FINLAYSON (Minister for Treaty of Waitangi Negotiations):\u003C/span\u003E This is a very similar Supplementary Order Paper to the Supplementary Order Paper we have just dealt with in relation to the Ng\u0101ti Koroki Kahukura Claims Settlement Bill. It does a number of things. First it makes amendments that reflect the enactment of the Heritage New Zealand Pouhere Taonga Act 2014. The second thing it does is remove provisions that provided for the possibility of an exchange of land, which was contemplated when the bill was introduced and which related to an aspect of the cultural redress provided to the iwi. It was not thought it would be completed before the settlement date because the exchange has actually now been completed. So that solves that issue. Finally, it updates the legal description of the cultural redress property described in the bill as a consequence of the exchange of land and some very recent survey work. So, again, like the other Supplementary Order Paper, this Supplementary Order Paper is very technical and in the nature of a tidy-up.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000645\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002241146229-4d11-415b-a4ac-f4e2b923e95d\u0022\u003EThe question was put that the amendment set out on Supplementary Order Paper 38 in the name of the Hon Christopher Finlayson to Part 1 be agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000646\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002241146229-4d11-415b-a4ac-f4e2b923e95d\u0022\u003EAmendment agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000647\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002241146229-4d11-415b-a4ac-f4e2b923e95d\u0022\u003EPart 1 as amended agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000648\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u002283cccd25b42f420b8be36edf46b5b485\u0022\u003EPart 2  Cultural redress\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000649\u0022\u003EThe question was put that the amendments set out on Supplementary Order Paper 38 in the name of the Hon Christopher Finlayson to Part 2 be agreed to.\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000650\u0022\u003EAmendments agreed to.\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000651\u0022\u003EPart 2 as amended agreed to.\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000652\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u0022fdf4f94eab6647b0ad9b1485d5d4fe46\u0022\u003EPart 3 agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000653\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u00227515b14098674866ba75b3c7ec5c654d\u0022\u003EPart 4 agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000654\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u0022290422df0e9545b18e19c73d2068b09d\u0022\u003ESchedule 1 agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000655\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u00221043d7b1dab24d6dba97b0fd531bc7ee\u0022\u003ESchedule 2 agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000656\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u00229de52e239f3d4509b071fe479c2c05c8\u0022\u003ESchedule 3\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000657\u0022\u003EThe question was put that the amendments set out on Supplementary Order Paper 38 in the name of the Hon Christopher Finlayson to Schedule 3 be agreed to.\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000658\u0022\u003EAmendments agreed to.\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000659\u0022\u003ESchedule 3 as amended agreed to.\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000660\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u0022bbc329d1e5004020bd0c6a9fa96c100b\u0022\u003ESchedule 4 agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000661\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u002226e4f11d082c4c3781dc672039fcd9e2\u0022\u003ESchedule 5 agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000662\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u00221923a739d0b64fdf90129e20cb01ee2e\u0022\u003EClause 1 agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000663\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u0022535f4091a36348d3b899b44d9ce2127b\u0022\u003EClause 2 agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000664\u0022\u003EHouse resumed.\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000665\u0022\u003EThe Chairperson reported the Ng\u0101ti Koroki Kahukura Claims Settlement Bill with amendment and the Ng\u0101ti Hau\u0101 Claims Settlement Bill with amendment. \u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000666\u0022\u003EReport adopted.\u003C/p\u003E\n    \u003C/div\u003E\n    \u003Cdiv class=\u0022HpsHansard\u0022\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000667\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsProceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u0022894bc41944ad4b3e86de365e228ede10\u0022\u003ESittings of the House\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000669\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u0022843f071d25be48b8aeafaa3e904da44b\u0022\u003ESittings of the House\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00228a1cb04e-8a86-44d1-9004-6e158e220339\u0022 data-id=\u0022e9250a3c251446c4867d35f58e6f464f\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000668\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00228a1cb04e-8a86-44d1-9004-6e158e220339\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022e9250a3c251446c4867d35f58e6f464f\u0022\u003ETIM MACINDOE (Senior Whip\u2014National):\u003C/span\u003E The House has made excellent progress tonight. I thank all members for their contributions, and I seek leave for the House to suspend until 9 a.m. tomorrow. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022893adc11-ce4e-419c-a079-08f04b3d75f5\u0022 data-id=\u00227f494f1661a641aeba557527a573378c\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000670\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022893adc11-ce4e-419c-a079-08f04b3d75f5\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00227f494f1661a641aeba557527a573378c\u0022\u003EThe ASSISTANT SPEAKER (Lindsay Tisch)\u003C/span\u003E: Leave is sought for that purpose. Is there any objection? There is no objection. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209bb9a6eaa202648a2a9cde8272facdac6000671\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022893adc11-ce4e-419c-a079-08f04b3d75f5\u0022\u003ESitting suspended from 9.52 p.m. to 9 a.m. (Wednesday)\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n    \u003C/div\u003E\n    \u003Cdiv class=\u0022HpsHansard\u0022\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000001\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsProceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u0022005c1c30678e419298340c186a23ad67\u0022\u003ETUESDAY, 9 December 2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000002\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u00226920686a5cbc42459a152ae6d8ccf90e\u0022\u003E(continued on Wednesday, 10 December 2014)\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n    \u003C/div\u003E\n    \u003Cdiv class=\u0022HpsHansard\u0022\u003E\n      \u003Cp\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsProceedingHeading\u0022\u003EBills\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000003\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u00225c0df76d8ed54a338eecc10a1cc8054d\u0022\u003ENg\u0101ti Koroki Kahukura Claims Settlement Bill\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000004\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u0022b57c9bec55a2449d88764e35c282b6dd\u0022\u003EThird Reading\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002241146229-4d11-415b-a4ac-f4e2b923e95d\u0022 data-id=\u0022c9b4e4b324674321ac7e6b704f2ba75b\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000005\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002241146229-4d11-415b-a4ac-f4e2b923e95d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022c9b4e4b324674321ac7e6b704f2ba75b\u0022\u003EHon CHRISTOPHER FINLAYSON (Minister for Treaty of Waitangi Negotiations):\u003C/span\u003E I move, That the Ng\u0101ti Koroki Kahukura Claims Settlement Bill be now read a third time. As we all know, we gather in this House to consider, to debate, and to address matters of State and matters of Government\u2014matters that often define us as a nation. Very few things can be more defining than the occasion of a third reading of Treaty settlement legislation. This is an occasion that brings the Crown and iwi together for a common purpose: to reconcile past differences and to seal our shared commitment to a more enlightened and rewarding future together. In this House today, as we debate the third reading of the Ng\u0101ti Koroki Kahukura Claims Settlement Bill, we welcome the people of Ng\u0101ti Koroki Kahukura, their leaders, and their supporters. To them I pay my respects, and in so doing I acknowledge K\u012Bngi Tuheitia me Te Whare o Te K\u0101hui Ariki. T\u0113n\u0101 koutou, t\u0113n\u0101 koutou, t\u0113n\u0101 koutou katoa. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000006\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002241146229-4d11-415b-a4ac-f4e2b923e95d\u0022\u003EOne of the great things about settlement legislation is that you can read into the permanent record the story of the iwi whose claims we settle. Ng\u0101ti Koroki Kahukura descend from the high chief Korok\u012B, a descendant of Hoturoa, captain of the Tainui canoe. Ng\u0101ti Koroki Kahukura descend from the high chieftainess Kahukura, and, joined together through common ancestry and lineage, their descendants are the people whom we greet in the House today. The homeland of Ng\u0101ti Koroki Kahukura stretches from Karapiro, along the Pukekura Range, and through Rotorangi in the west; from Maungatautari IV and V Blocks to the top of Lake Arapuni in the south; then follows the Waikato River back to Piarere in the east; and from Piarere to the south of the Maungakawa Reserve, and to Karapiro in the north. It also includes interests within the Waikato raupatu claim area. The raupatu claims of Ng\u0101ti Koroki Kahukura within the raupatu boundaries were settled as part of the Waikato-Tainui raupatu settlement in 1995, and their claims in respect of the Waikato River were settled in 2009 through the Waikato-Tainui Waikato River settlement. This bill finally settles all the historical Treaty claims of Ng\u0101ti Koroki Kahukura. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000007\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002241146229-4d11-415b-a4ac-f4e2b923e95d\u0022\u003EAs we contemplate why these settlements are important, the Ng\u0101ti Koroki Kahukura experience\u2014like that of so many others\u2014should be reflected upon. Early contact between Ng\u0101ti Koroki Kahukura and European settlers was characterised by trade. They engaged in a number of economic activities during the 1840s and 1850s, and were a prosperous and flourishing community. They built two flour mills near Maungatautari, and were involved in the flax industry. They transported goods and produce by sea for trade. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000008\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002241146229-4d11-415b-a4ac-f4e2b923e95d\u0022\u003EFrom the 1850s, T\u012Boriori was the recorded leader of Ng\u0101ti Koroki Kahukura. He developed the relationship with Crown officials, leading to his appointment as an assessor for the Waikato district. When adherence to K\u012Bngitanga became important for Ng\u0101ti Koroki Kahukura, relations between the iwi and the Crown deteriorated. Despite that deterioration, Tioriori did his best to maintain cordial relationships with the Crown. He went to the aid of the civil commissioner of Waikato after a chief from a neighbouring iwi seized the Government printing press at Te Awamutu. Tioriori took up residence with the commissioner to prevent further attacks. Ng\u0101ti Koroki Kahukura helped defend K\u012Bngitanga lands and peoples against the Crown at the battles of Meremere and Rangiriri, when the Crown breached the aukati along the Mangatawhiri River. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000009\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002241146229-4d11-415b-a4ac-f4e2b923e95d\u0022\u003ETioriori was captured at the Battle of Rangiriri, having been wounded while assisting a wounded British officer of the colonial forces. He was then incarcerated without trial in squalid conditions on the hulk of the Marion in Auckland. Tioriori\u2019s incarceration without trial left Ng\u0101ti Koroki Kahukura leaderless at a time of great upheaval. The incarceration had adverse effects on the standing of Tioriori and Ng\u0101ti Koroki Kahukura. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000010\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002241146229-4d11-415b-a4ac-f4e2b923e95d\u0022\u003EThe raupatu that followed the Waikato Wars affected the iwi and caused them severe economic hardship. The confiscation of the Waikato lands isolated Ng\u0101ti Koroki Kahukura from their primary transport and trade route. As a result of the confiscation, they became alienated from lands, traditional p\u0101, w\u0101hi tapu, and other significant sites. These events contributed to a weakening of the identity of Ng\u0101ti Koroki Kahukura as a people, with effects that continued to be felt for decades. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000011\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002241146229-4d11-415b-a4ac-f4e2b923e95d\u0022\u003ETo add to this, the cumulative effect of the operation and impact of native land laws and Crown purchasing left Ng\u0101ti Koroki Kahukura virtually landless, and further undermined their economic, social, and cultural development. From the early 1900s the Crown dammed the upper reaches of the Waikato River to produce hydroelectric power. The flooding caused the direct destruction of burial caves and significant cultural sites of this iwi. Members of the iwi recall having to collect the bones of ancestors as they emerged from graves and floated down the river. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000012\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002241146229-4d11-415b-a4ac-f4e2b923e95d\u0022\u003EIn the early 1800s the introduction of muskets disrupted relationships between iwi and hap\u016B across New Zealand. During this time of conflict a number of iwi and hap\u016B occupied the Maungatautari area. A pivotal battle was fought by Ng\u0101ti Koroki Kahukura in 1830. For the iwi a significant consequence of the battle was the cremation of slain warriors on rocks, where the Hau\u014Dira Stream joined with the Waikato River. And from that time, Ng\u0101ti Koroki Kahukura considered these rocks to be tapu and akin to a headstone. The site was called Karapiro, after the foul odours emanating from the cremations. The creation of Lake Karapiro flooded the sacred site, submerging the rocks. To complete this desecration, the rocks were blasted with dynamite to clear the way for rowing lanes for the 1975 World Rowing Championships. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000013\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002241146229-4d11-415b-a4ac-f4e2b923e95d\u0022\u003EFrom this dark period in the relationship between Ng\u0101ti Koroki Kahukura and the Crown, we come today to a major turning point of a Treaty settlement that opens the way for reconciliation and a new relationship based on the principles of the Treaty. At the heart of this settlement lie two taonga: Maungatautari and Te Awa o Waikato. To Ng\u0101ti Koroki Kahukura, Maungatautari and the river are inseparable and indivisible t\u016Bpuna and living taonga. Maungatautari was named by a tohunga who arrived on the Tainui waka, and Waikato was named by the tumu ariki and the captain of the Tainui waka. As we all know, Maungatautari is a defining feature of the landscape south of Cambridge. It has been there for at least 1.8 million years. It is also a defining feature of the human landscape, forged generation upon generation by those who call its slopes their home. It is central to the identity and to the mana of Ng\u0101ti Koroki Kahukura. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000014\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002241146229-4d11-415b-a4ac-f4e2b923e95d\u0022\u003EToday, it is supported by a diverse community with varying perspectives, which converge in an affinity for the mountain and a deep sense of pride in the world-renowned ecological island now established on Maungatautari. This broad community of interests presented its own particular challenges when negotiating a settlement. It will for ever be a mark of the standing, the integrity, and the generosity of spirit of this iwi that they were prepared to compromise their aspirations and agree to an inclusive and novel arrangement that through their settlement legislation, will see the wider Maungatautari community become the owner of the Crown properties on the mountain. I have really been very lucky over a number of occasions to visit the Maungatautari ecological island and see the great work that is being done by Ng\u0101ti Koroki Kahukura, other iwi, the Waip\u0101 District Council, and the Maungatautari Ecological Island Trust. Thanks to the generosity of the iwi, all of the community has a stake in the ownership of the maunga and everyone needs to give their full cooperation to the trust to allow the special place to be cared for in a way we all want it to be. Participation by Ng\u0101ti Koroki Kahukura through the Waikato Raupatu River Trust, in the Waikato River Authority, and other co-management arrangements for the river reflects and confirms Crown recognition of Ng\u0101ti Koroki Kahukura as a river iwi. The provisions of this bill address an unfinished aspect of the river arrangements. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000015\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002241146229-4d11-415b-a4ac-f4e2b923e95d\u0022\u003EIn closing, I acknowledge the principal claimant for Ng\u0101ti Koroki Kahukura, the late Wally Papa. He and others no longer here have worked in so many ways for so long to get the Crown to acknowledge its wrongs. I know that Ng\u0101ti Koroki Kahukura, along with members of this House, have many, many special people in mind at this time. I acknowledge Mere Kara, known as Aunt Olly Kara, who passed away this year. She was here during the first reading of the legislation and she was particularly looking forward to the third reading. The deed of settlement most eloquently says: \u201CWe remember well those who led the challenge, those who flew the flag, and those who have carried the burden of responsibility to arrive at this point in time: the orators, the quiet leaders, the strong shoulders and the undying supporters of yesteryear. To you we say, although you are no longer seen, you will never be forgotten.\u201D I acknowledge Linda and Willie Te Aho, R\u0101hui Papa, Taotao Tauroa, Hinerangi Kara, Karaitiana Tamatea, Poto Davies, Steven Wilson, Johnson Raumati, and so many others. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000016\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002241146229-4d11-415b-a4ac-f4e2b923e95d\u0022\u003EThis is a great day for the Crown and for Ng\u0101ti Koroki Kahukura. I acknowledge all those who have given me assistance. I particularly want to acknowledge my friend the member for Taup\u014D, who worked so closely with me on the Maungatautari redress. She did a great job and she too has been pivotal in reaching a successful conclusion. I commend the bill to the House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00220e7e8da2-a6a1-41bb-aeb0-a49be255a293\u0022 data-id=\u002252fb77f7613145bda8eafac997774fb7\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000017\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220e7e8da2-a6a1-41bb-aeb0-a49be255a293\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002252fb77f7613145bda8eafac997774fb7\u0022\u003EHon NANAIA MAHUTA (Labour\u2014Hauraki-Waikato):\u003C/span\u003E He h\u014Dnore, he kor\u014Dria, he maungarongo ki te mata o te whenua, he whakaaro pai ki ng\u0101 t\u0101ngata katoa. Arohaina ng\u0101 t\u0113ina me ng\u0101 tuakana i whakat\u014Dp\u016B mai i raro i te tuanui o t\u0113nei Whare hei m\u0101takitaki ki t\u0113nei t\u016Btukitanga ki waenganui i a t\u0101tou i t\u0113nei rangi. No reira, Ng\u0101ti Koroki Kahukura, Ng\u0101ti Haua, nei te mihi maioha ki a koutou. E te Tumuaki, ko koe te kanohi m\u014D \u0101 t\u0101tou nei taonga e pupuru ana i waenganui i a t\u0101tou hei whakaoranga m\u014D ng\u0101 whakatupuranga, n\u014D reira, t\u0113n\u0101 koe, t\u0113n\u0101 koutou, t\u0113n\u0101 koutou, t\u0113n\u0101 t\u0101tou katoa. N\u014Dku te waimarie i t\u0113nei rangi, te t\u016B ki te tautoko ng\u0101 \u0101huatanga e p\u0101 ana ki t\u0113nei tutukitanga, i \u0113nei tutukitanga ker\u0113me. Tuatahi ki a koutou o Ng\u0101ti Koroki Kahukura ka hoki ng\u0101 mahara ki t\u0113r\u0101 o ng\u0101 kaum\u0101tua a Wally, me ng\u0101 k\u014Drero i puta mai i waenganui i a r\u0101ua i t\u014Dku matua m\u014D \u0113nei \u0101huatanga. Me \u016B ki t\u0113nei wh\u0101inga kia tutuki pai ng\u0101 \u0101huatanga kei waenganui i a koutou hei painga, hei oranga m\u014D ng\u0101 tamariki, ng\u0101 mokopuna. No reira, kua tae ki t\u0113nei w\u0101. E tika ana me mihi atu ki t\u0113r\u0101 maunga e tautari ana, ki t\u014D t\u0101tou nei awa a Waikato, ar\u0101, ki ng\u0101 marae ki P\u014Dhara r\u0101ua ko Maungatautari hei whakaora i ng\u0101 hiahia, ng\u0101 pup\u016B i te whatumanawa i t\u0113nei rangi. N\u014D reira t\u0113n\u0101 koutou, t\u0113n\u0101 koutou, t\u0113n\u0101 koutou katoa. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000018\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220e7e8da2-a6a1-41bb-aeb0-a49be255a293\u0022\u003E[Honour, glory, peace on earth, goodwill to all mankind, and loving thoughts to the younger and elder siblings who have assembled here under the roof of this House to witness this settlement amongst us today. Affectionate thoughts therefore to you, Ng\u0101ti Korok\u012B Kahukura and Ng\u0101ti Hau\u0101, and, to you, the leader. You are the face of these possessions that we hold amongst us as a betterment for the generations to come, so greetings to you in particular. Acknowledgments and congratulations to you collectively, and my appreciation to us all. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000019\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220e7e8da2-a6a1-41bb-aeb0-a49be255a293\u0022\u003EIt is my good fortune today to stand and support the circumstances relating to this settlement and these claims. First of all, to you of Ng\u0101ti Koroki Kahukura, my thoughts go back to that elder of ours, Wally, and what emerged from the discussions that took place between those two and my father in regard to these situations. Let us hold firm to this aim that we complete the circumstances amongst you well, that will benefit children and grandchildren. So this point in time has arrived, where it is appropriate that I acknowledge that mountain standing upright there, this river of ours, the marae of P\u014Dhara and of Maungatautari to restore aspirations and hopes welling up in the mind today. And so I acknowledge, greet, and commend you all.]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000020\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220e7e8da2-a6a1-41bb-aeb0-a49be255a293\u0022\u003EIt is a great day when we can stand in this House and support the progression of Treaty settlements, and when the Minister for Treaty of Waitangi Negotiations is able to retell the story of so many iwi who come into this House and the long-suffering endurance that they have had to get to this point. To the Minister I say thank you so much for your determination to see the resolution of both the Ng\u0101ti Koroki Kahukura and the Ng\u0101ti Hau\u0101 claims in such a short time frame. I too was at Maungatautari when the settlement was signed, and I remember that day for two reasons. Firstly, I had just had my daughter, who was 6 days old, and that was her very first outing. I was determined to get to the signing, because other than at my own marae at Waahi, my father\u2019s picture hangs at Maungatautari Marae\u2014that is the only other marae. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000021\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220e7e8da2-a6a1-41bb-aeb0-a49be255a293\u0022\u003EI remember, as a child growing up, in some small way observing, as you do, the kaum\u0101tua of the time talking about these big take, like raupatu, and what was happening in different parts of the rohe. There was a gentlemen\u2019s accord between Wally T\u012Boriori Papa and my father about how to progress, in part, the substantial raupatu claim but also, in part, the interests of Ng\u0101ti Koroki Kahukura in their particular part of the rohe. It was with that type of heartfelt commitment that I saw real opportunities to try to progress the Ng\u0101ti Koroki claim as quickly as possible. It is important really to extend our own relationships as members of this House to the various claims that come through here. But there is so much more happening in the rohe that I would like to comment on before turning to the substance of the claim. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000022\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220e7e8da2-a6a1-41bb-aeb0-a49be255a293\u0022\u003EThe many wh\u0101nau in this particular rohe around Karapiro and Arapuni, as Louise Upston would know, were involved in some part, back in the day, in building the dams, seeing the change in the natural landscape within their rohe, and seeing marae settlements move from one place to the other. In fact, before the river claim, when kaum\u0101tua were taken up the Waikato River and stories were being retold, when you got to the Karapiro and further up the top of the river, actually you had to use a fish-finder to see how the lie of the land used to look prior to the dams being put in, and you could have a sense of appreciation of the resilience of hap\u016B like Koroki Kahukura who have seen their history change because of things like the dams being built. I recall that fondly because I think it is a part of the story that you, Minister, have told so well. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000023\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220e7e8da2-a6a1-41bb-aeb0-a49be255a293\u0022\u003EThe people there are very meshed within the way of life. There are a lot of farmers around that community. A former Prime Minister used to have her holidays up with the Hicks wh\u0101nau around Maungatautari. She remembers Maungatautari mountain very well. But the farming community and the M\u0101ori community at times have been intermeshed with each other\u2019s success and prosperity, and often challenges and difficulties. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000024\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220e7e8da2-a6a1-41bb-aeb0-a49be255a293\u0022\u003EKarapiro\u2014what we see now is a modern representation of what is possible through Treaty settlements when relationships work. Ng\u0101ti Koroki Kahukura have shown very well their mana whenua, their tangata whenua relationship, with not only the river but the life of the river and what happens along the river. When you visit the rowing centre, you will see there the impression of that influence in the centre, in major events that take place there in terms of recognising protocol. We have had a major international rowing competition, several waka ama competitions and rowing competitions, and an international waka ama competition, not to mention TriM\u0101ori some weeks ago. But the point of all of that is that Ng\u0101ti Koroki Kahukura are a group of people who exercise on a daily basis the strength of their influence as mana whenua, as tangata whenua within their own rohe, at Karapiro, with the Waip\u0101 District Council, and with the community at large. One can only but think that, as a result of the settlement, that will only be amplified in positive ways\u2014I am absolutely sure. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000025\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220e7e8da2-a6a1-41bb-aeb0-a49be255a293\u0022\u003EBut it has not come without challenges. There have been several. I can recall a number of challenging discussions about Maungatautari, as the member for the area, Louise Upston, would also recount. Those have caused some of the testiest types of interactions about who owns what, but also about what is in the greatest interest of the community. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000026\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220e7e8da2-a6a1-41bb-aeb0-a49be255a293\u0022\u003EHaving an ecological island in our part of the rohe\u2014actually in our country\u2014with a pest-proof fence is a first. It does provide real opportunity for tourism, and in the settlement there is an opportunity for that relationship to be further strengthened and I am hopeful that that can continue. There has been a very gracious acknowledgment made by Ng\u0101ti Koroki Kahukura to the people of the Waip\u0101 District and, in fact, to New Zealand for the future management of the Maungatautari maunga. I want to put on the record that that is huge and significant. It may be reviewed over time as people follow that model and then they see: \u201CActually, we can give a little bit more, acknowledge a little bit more.\u201D, but let time be the test of that particular intent. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000027\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220e7e8da2-a6a1-41bb-aeb0-a49be255a293\u0022\u003EI want to particularly comment on the contribution that kaum\u0101tua of Ng\u0101ti Koroki Kahukura have made to the substantial claims of the raupatu settlement and also the river settlement\u2014kaum\u0101tua who are no longer with us, kaum\u0101tua who in their time would have been recognised for the wealth of knowledge and understanding and whakapapa connections to weave together outcomes through the Treaty settlement process. Their contribution is significant and I really want to recognise that. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000028\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220e7e8da2-a6a1-41bb-aeb0-a49be255a293\u0022\u003EThe select committee tried very hard to address some outstanding issues for Ng\u0101ti Koroki Kahukura in relation to land-banked lands in Arapuni, in relation to the clean-up fund, in relation to the ongoing management and access issues around the Maungatautari mountain. We are limited in our capacity to be able to do that, but the intent was there. I want to say that everybody who made submissions on this particular settlement did so in a way that gave us great confidence as a select committee that here was a hap\u016B, a group of people, who were absolutely going to exercise their full authority as kaitiaki, as mana whenua, as tangata whenua in the Ng\u0101ti Koroki Kahukura rohe. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000029\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220e7e8da2-a6a1-41bb-aeb0-a49be255a293\u0022\u003ELast, but not least, I want to thank the M\u0101ori Affairs Committee and the advisers and the officials whom we had for the input that they had in trying to get the committee to a point of understanding, especially on the three outstanding issues that I have mentioned. It is important to recognise that the future of the ongoing management of the Waikato River would not be successfully achieved across the whole of the catchment without Koroki Kahukura playing its integral role around the Karapiro-Arapuni area. I would hope going forward\u2014certainly as people listen to the tenor of this debate\u2014that when it comes to the co-management responsibilities that Ng\u0101ti Koroki Kahukura have affirmed on them by rights of this settlement, there will be some recognition by both Raukawa and Waikato that there is a distinct relationship in this part of the river. For those co-management responsibilities to be undertaken to their full extent, there needs to be recognition and a bit of give and take around how that can be successfully done so that everybody can breathe life into the river that we all love, which has given joy and happiness to a number of generations and will continue to do so and will provide employment. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000030\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220e7e8da2-a6a1-41bb-aeb0-a49be255a293\u0022\u003ELastly, can I thank the negotiating team. You have approached this with the integrity of the people at heart, the determination of our kaum\u0101tua at heart, but also with the koi of the hinengaro, and you have gone toe to toe with Crown officials in a way that I think has held this whole process to full account. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000031\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220e7e8da2-a6a1-41bb-aeb0-a49be255a293\u0022\u003EN\u014D reira i t\u0113nei w\u0101, he paku k\u014Drero, he paku whakaaro hei tuitui ki t\u0113nei kaupapa, i t\u0113nei rangi i mua i a koutou. T\u0113nei te mihi atu ki a koutou katoa, ki a t\u0101tou, t\u0113n\u0101 t\u0101tou. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000032\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220e7e8da2-a6a1-41bb-aeb0-a49be255a293\u0022\u003E[And so a brief statement and viewpoint at this juncture to thread together this matter before you collectively. I acknowledge you and us all, thank you.]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002229c236aa-2283-4690-9a84-aa865404bb61\u0022 data-id=\u0022c1bacb2d6a2545d8b374a7bff86aed25\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000033\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002229c236aa-2283-4690-9a84-aa865404bb61\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022c1bacb2d6a2545d8b374a7bff86aed25\u0022\u003ENUK KORAKO (National):\u003C/span\u003E T\u0113n\u0101 koe. Ko te hau mua, ko te hau muri, ko te hau tamaw\u0101hine, ko te hau tamat\u0101ne e t\u016B mai r\u0101 te tokotoko a T\u0101nenui\u0101raki. E tuturu mai kia whakamaua, ka tina, tina, haumi e, hui e, taiki e! \u0100, t\u0113n\u0101 r\u0101 koutou ng\u0101 pou waitaka o t\u014D t\u0101tou Matua T\u012Bpuna, \u0101, k\u0101 mea nui ki te mihi atu ki t\u014D t\u0101tou Matua Nui i Te Raki, ko ia te t\u012Bmataka me te whakamutuka o koutou katoa. N\u014D reira, ka mihi au ki Te Kaih\u014Dmai o k\u0101 mea katoa. Ka maumahara m\u0101tou ki a r\u0101tou kai tua kua wehe ki te ao wairua. N\u014D reira, koutou r\u0101 o ia marae, o ia iwi, o ia waka e haere i ruka ki te ara o te wh\u0101nui a T\u0101ne ko tua o te \u0101rai, haere, haere, haere. N\u014D reira, \u0101 t\u0113n\u0101 koutou o te iwi o Ng\u0101ti Korok\u012B Kahuhura. E nau mai, haere mai ki Te Whare P\u0101remata, e mihi nei, e tangi nei koutou ng\u0101 taoka whakahirahira, koutou e t\u016Bmanakohia ake nei, koutou e h\u0101pai iwi nei, nau mai, nau mai, nau mai, haere mai. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000034\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002229c236aa-2283-4690-9a84-aa865404bb61\u0022\u003E[Hail the winds of the north, south, east, and west, and from where the rod of the great heavenly Father is upraised. Stand resolute eternally, gather, join, and unite! So acknowledgments to you, esoteric pillars of our Father in heaven. The main things to thank our great Father in heaven for is that He is the beginning and the ending for you all, and in regard to this, I pay homage to the provider of all things. We remember, too, those who have departed to the spiritual realm, and so to you all, from every marae, tribe and canoe that have traversed the wide path of man to beyond the divide; depart, journey on, farewell! So greetings to you, the tribe of Ng\u0101ti Korok\u012B Kahuhura. Welcome, come hither to Parliament House here, acknowledging and grieving you as elements of importance and much yearned for, you that elevate people. Welcome, welcome, welcome, draw near.]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000035\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002229c236aa-2283-4690-9a84-aa865404bb61\u0022\u003EI want to welcome those manuhiri here today from Ng\u0101ti Koroki Kahukura. I acknowledge the work done by so many people to bring these negotiations to a conclusion. A Treaty settlement provides an opportunity to look back on our history. It is an opportunity to acknowledge the wrongs that have been committed in the past and to seek to put them right. It is an opportunity to begin a new relationship between the Crown and Ng\u0101ti Koroki Kahukura. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000036\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002229c236aa-2283-4690-9a84-aa865404bb61\u0022\u003EThe redress provided for these wrongdoings will never be perfect. It is impossible to restore everything that was taken. The Crown cannot take back the desecration of burial sites or the wrongful imprisonment of leaders; it cannot return every hectare of land that was confiscated, or heal the many decades of hurt and hardship caused by this alienation, but the redress this settlement offers Ng\u0101ti Koroki Kahukura will be significant for their future. It vests 15 sites of cultural and historical significance in Ng\u0101ti Koroki Kahukura. Ng\u0101ti Koroki Kahukura will also receive a package of cultural redress to assist them with securing their economic future and their social well-being. They will receive financial redress, plus interest. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000037\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002229c236aa-2283-4690-9a84-aa865404bb61\u0022\u003EI want to talk a little about the Waikato River, and the Maungatautari\u2014the Waikato\u2014is of great influence to Ng\u0101ti Koroki Kahukura. This is recognised in the deed of settlement. The deed recognises that both Koroki and Kahukura are direct descendants of tohuka Rakataura, aboard the great Tainui waka, who gave Maungatautari its name. Koroki and Kahukura are also direct descendants of Hoturoa, the captain of the Tainui waka. As the deed of settlement states, Maungatautari and Waikato are inextricably linked to the identity of Ng\u0101ti Koroki Kahukura. Maungatautari and Waikato are inseparable and they are indivisible. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000038\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002229c236aa-2283-4690-9a84-aa865404bb61\u0022\u003EIt is good to see that the Crown and Ng\u0101ti Koroki Kahukura have been able to come to an agreement about how best to recognise the huge importance of these two living taoka. Ng\u0101ti Koroki Kahukura have endorsed the vision and strategy for the Waikato River set out in the Waikato-Tainui raupatu claims settlement. The area covered by joint management agreements between the Waikato Regional Council, the Waip\u0101 District Council, and the Waikato Raupatu River Trust has been extended to cover the portion of the Waikato River that is within Ng\u0101ti Koroki Kahukura\u2019s area of interest. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000039\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002229c236aa-2283-4690-9a84-aa865404bb61\u0022\u003EIn the case of Maungatautari, the t\u012Bpuna mauka of Ng\u0101ti Koroki Kahukura\u2014the significance of what they have agreed to cannot be overlooked. Ng\u0101ti Koroki Kahukura consider themselves to be the tangata whenua of Maungatautari, but they have graciously agreed to ownership of the Maungatautari mountain scenic reserve to be held by the wider community. This community is comprised of other iwi who also have customary interests in Maungatautari and members of the wider community connected with Maungatautari. It is appropriate that the deed of settlement recognises the generosity of Ng\u0101ti Koroki Kahukura in agreeing to this unique arrangement. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000040\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002229c236aa-2283-4690-9a84-aa865404bb61\u0022\u003EI want to briefly acknowledge the work of Minister Finlayson in shepherding this settlement through the process and this bill through the House. We are lucky to have a Minister for Treaty of Waitangi Negotiations who is so committed to righting the wrongs that have scarred our history. The extraordinary amount of progress he has made on Treaty settlements under this Government speaks for itself. I would also like to acknowledge the Hon Tau Henare and the members of the M\u0101ori Affairs Committee who considered this bill in the 50th Parliament, including the new Minister for M\u0101ori Development, Te Ururoa Flavell. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000041\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002229c236aa-2283-4690-9a84-aa865404bb61\u0022\u003EBut my final acknowledgments are reserved for the people of Ng\u0101ti Koroki Kahukura, those who have led them through this process, and their negotiators. It has taken you an immense amount of hard work and patience to get to this day. There is, however, more hard work ahead for those of you who will be involved in maximising the economic and social well-being of your people through this settlement. But today is a day to celebrate and take pride in what you have achieved. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000042\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002229c236aa-2283-4690-9a84-aa865404bb61\u0022\u003ENg\u0101 k\u0101k\u0101 waha nui o r\u0101tou m\u0101, ka mihi atu r\u0101. R\u0101tou ki a r\u0101tou, t\u0101tou ki a t\u0101tou, t\u012Bhei mauri ora.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000043\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002229c236aa-2283-4690-9a84-aa865404bb61\u0022\u003E[To the great orators of those ancestors who have gone, I doff my hat to you. Let them remain with them, and we remain with us. Behold, therefore, the breath of life!]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000044\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002229c236aa-2283-4690-9a84-aa865404bb61\u0022\u003EN\u014D reira, can I also wish the people of Ng\u0101ti Koroki Kahukura Meri Kirihimete me ng\u0101 mihi o te tau hou ki a koutou, e huri noa i Te Whare, ki a koe e Nanaia, ki a koutou \u0113r\u0101 mema o P\u0101remata, ng\u0101 mihi, e mihi atu ki a koutou katoa.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000045\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002229c236aa-2283-4690-9a84-aa865404bb61\u0022\u003E[Merry Christmas and greetings of the new year to you, Mr Assistant Speaker, Nanaia, and to other members throughout the House. Greetings to you all.]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000046\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002229c236aa-2283-4690-9a84-aa865404bb61\u0022\u003EI commend this bill to the House. Kia ora.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022e77494a0-1be1-432f-b492-fd160f4c119d\u0022 data-id=\u0022acd8282f9be94eef9142965e597677ed\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000047\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e77494a0-1be1-432f-b492-fd160f4c119d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022acd8282f9be94eef9142965e597677ed\u0022\u003EPEENI HENARE (Labour\u2014T\u0101maki Makaurau):\u003C/span\u003E \u0100, t\u0113n\u0101 koe e Te M\u0101ngai o Te Whare, \u0101-Reo M\u0101ori. Tihei uriuri, tihei nakonako ka tau h\u0101 whakatau ko te rangi i runga nei. Whakatau h\u0101 whakatau ko te papa i raro nei, whakatau h\u0101 whakatau i m\u0101tuku mai i Rarotonga. Koia i rukuhia manawa pou roto, koia i rukuhia manawa waho kia whakatina te more i Hawaiki e pup\u016B ana, e wawau ana kia t\u0101rewa t\u016B ki te rangi, eke, eke panuku, eke Tangaroa, hui e, taiki e! K\u0101ti ake r\u0101 ka tau mai ng\u0101 manaakitanga o Te Kaihanga ki runga i t\u0113nei Whare, otir\u0101, ki runga i a koutou e ng\u0101 kiri whingiwhingi, ar\u0101 koutou e kara m\u0101, e kui m\u0101. Koutou e ng\u0101 mokopuna, e ng\u0101 m\u0101t\u0101tahi o Ng\u0101ti Korok\u012B Kahukura, ar\u0101, koutou ng\u0101 taniwha o te awa o Waikato, t\u0113n\u0101 koutou. Ko aua manaakitanga katoa ka \u016Bhia ki runga i t\u014D t\u0101tou K\u012Bngi, kia piki te ora, kia piki te kaha, kia piki te m\u0101ramatanga ki runga i a ia, ki roto i ng\u0101 taumahatanga me ng\u0101 nekenekehanga o t\u0113nei w\u0101, rire, rire hau, paim\u0101rire. K\u0101ti ake e koutou m\u0101 e t\u0101pae nei koutou i \u014D koutou tini aitua ki te t\u0101h\u016Bh\u016B o t\u0113nei Whare, kia kotahi ai te reo, kia kotahi ai te tangi, kia kotahi ai te m\u014Dteatea ki a r\u0101tou i kapohia ai e Te Ringa Kaha o Aitu\u0101, o Ait\u016Bere, o Ait\u016Bkikini, o Ait\u016Bt\u0101maki. N\u0101na i k\u014Dwhaki ai i te kauwae o t\u0113r\u0101 e tangi mai r\u0101, o t\u0113r\u0101 ake r\u0101, o t\u0101tou e tangi atu nei. N\u014D reira, koutou katoa kua ngaro atu ki te tirohanga kanohi, koutou kua whakawhiti atu r\u0101 ki tua o Paerau ka tau ki runga i te pae o mahara, t\u0113n\u0101 korikori mai. Hoki wairua mai r\u0101 koutou ki roto i ng\u0101 whiriwhiringa me ng\u0101 k\u014Drero kei mua i Te Whare i t\u0113nei rangi. T\u0113n\u0101 t\u016B kamu a Mahuta, t\u0113n\u0101 t\u016B ka korikori, t\u0113n\u0101 t\u016B me haere t\u0101ua. Me haere t\u0101ua ki runga i ng\u0101 k\u014Drero kua pae nei ki runga i a koutou e Ng\u0101ti Korok\u012B Kahukura ki roto i te roanga ake o t\u0113nei ata. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000048\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e77494a0-1be1-432f-b492-fd160f4c119d\u0022\u003EN\u0101, i t\u012Bmata mai e te Minita, i ng\u0101 mahi t\u016Bkino a Te Karauna i a koutou, he tohu t\u0113n\u0101 o ng\u0101 mahi o Te Karauna ki a t\u0101tou te iwi M\u0101ori ki roto i ng\u0101 tau. N\u0101, kua waha mai te Minita ki roto i t\u0113nei Whare i aua t\u016Bkinotanga i p\u0101ngia ki runga i a koutou e Ng\u0101ti Korok\u012B Kahukura, t\u0113n\u0101 koutou. K\u0101ti e tautoko ana ahau i ng\u0101 k\u014Drero o t\u014Dku tuahine ki a koutou, otir\u0101, ki Te Whare nei. E tautoko ana m\u0101tou o Te R\u014Dp\u016B Reipa i t\u0113nei pire ki roto i tana tat\u016Bnga ki roto i t\u0113nei Whare, ka tau ki runga i te taumata k\u014Drero, ka k\u014Drero, ka k\u014Drero, ka k\u014Drero. K\u0101ti, e mihi atu ana ahau ki a koe e Te Minita, kua roa rawa m\u0101tou ki roto o Ng\u0101puhi e whakaaro ana i t\u0113tahi ingoa ka tapaina ki runga i a koe, n\u0101 t\u014D m\u0101ia, n\u0101 t\u014D toa ki te k\u014Dkiri i ng\u0101 take e p\u0101 ana ki Te Tiriti o Waitangi, t\u0113nei e mihi atu nei. Ka waihong\u0101tu m\u0101 ng\u0101 kaum\u0101tua me ng\u0101 k\u016Bia taua ingoa te tapaina ki runga i a koe, k\u0101ti t\u0113nei e mihi atu ana, t\u0113n\u0101 koe. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000049\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e77494a0-1be1-432f-b492-fd160f4c119d\u0022\u003EN\u0101, e mihi atu ana ahau ki t\u014Dku tuakana ki a Tau H\u0113nare. Ko t\u0113r\u0101 taniwh\u0101 ka noho ki runga i Te R\u014Dp\u016B Wh\u0101iti i ng\u0101 Take M\u0101ori. N\u0101, ka whakaaro ake ahau ki t\u014Dku tupuna ki a taurekareka H\u0113nare me t\u014Dna p\u0101nga ki a koutou e Waikato. N\u0101, ka noho a Te P\u016Bea ki roto o M\u014Dtatau ki roto i ng\u0101 tau. Ko tana k\u014Drero ki a Ng\u0101ti Hine, ka mahi, ka \u012Bnoi, ka mahi an\u014D. Hoin\u014D, ko t\u0113r\u0101 wero ka takotoria ki mua i a koutou, kia kaua e p\u014Dh\u0113h\u0113, kia kaua e tatari! \u0100e, kua k\u014Drero m\u0101tou o Te Whare nei i ng\u0101 take e p\u0101 ana ki t\u0113nei pire. \u0112ngari, ka kapohia ake e ahau i te k\u014Drero k\u014Drero a Kauiti me anga te titiro ki ng\u0101 taumata o te moana, ar\u0101, ki ng\u0101 maru\u0101p\u014D i wawatahia ai e \u014D t\u0101tou m\u0101tua t\u016Bpuna, otir\u0101, \u014D koutou m\u0101tua t\u016Bpuna m\u014D Ng\u0101ti Korok\u012B Kahukura. N\u014D reira, e mihi atu ana ahau ki t\u0113n\u0101, heke iho mai ki t\u014Dku tuakana ki a Tau H\u0113nare e \u0101rahi nei i t\u0113nei pire ki roto i ng\u0101 mahi whiriwhiringa o t\u0113nei Whare, e Te M\u0101ngai. K\u0101ti, ka tiro atu ahau ki t\u0113nei pire. Ko ng\u0101 w\u0101hanga katoa kai roto \u0113hara i te mea, ko ng\u0101 rare katoa. ar\u0101, ko ng\u0101 perehana katoa o Hana K\u014Dk\u014D ka tau mai ki runga i a koutou. \u0112, k\u0101hore \u0113ngari ko te mea atu ahau ki a koutou i a au e \u0101ta wetewete ana i ng\u0101 k\u014Drero kai roto, an\u0101, ko te whakahokinga mai o ng\u0101 whenua tapu, o ng\u0101 w\u0101hi tapu ki a koutou o Ng\u0101ti Korok\u012B Kahukura. E mihi atu ana ahau ki a koutou, otir\u0101, koutou katoa o te awa tapu o Waikato. N\u0101, ko koutou t\u0113n\u0101 kai te tauihu o te waka. Kai te tauihu o te waka m\u014D ng\u0101 mahi ng\u0101tahi me Te Karauna hei tiaki, hai whakahaere i ng\u0101 whenua, me ng\u0101 taonga e p\u0101 ana ki a koutou, e pupuri nei e koutou, an\u0101, ko te mihi atu ki a koutou. Ka wh\u0101toro atu te ringa ki Te Karauna kia mahi ng\u0101tahi nei koutou ki te tiaki i \u014D koutou w\u0101hi tapu, t\u0113n\u0101 koutou. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000050\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e77494a0-1be1-432f-b492-fd160f4c119d\u0022\u003EN\u0101, ka titiro atu ahau ki te w\u0101hanga tuarua. Ka whai reo koutou ki roto i ng\u0101 mahi o ng\u0101 kaunihera. Ka whai reo koutou ki roto i ng\u0101 whiriwhiringa o te k\u0101wanatanga m\u014D take e p\u0101 ana ki a koutou, \u014D koutou whenua, \u014D koutou take, \u014D koutou whakatupuranga. N\u014D reira, e mihi atu ana ahau ki a koutou ka noho ng\u0101tahi me Te Minita ki te \u0101ta wetewete i t\u0113r\u0101 o ng\u0101 nekehanga m\u014D koutou.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000051\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e77494a0-1be1-432f-b492-fd160f4c119d\u0022\u003EK\u0101ti ka titiro atu ahau ki te w\u0101hanga tuatoru ka tau ki runga i te awa o Waikato. Kua k\u014Drero ahau, he pikopiko, he taniwha. Kaua e p\u014Dh\u0113h\u0113 ka tau taua k\u014Drero ki a koutou anake, e Waikato. T\u0101 te mea ki roto i ng\u0101 mahi whiriwhiringa o ng\u0101 take e p\u0101 ana ki Te Tiriti o Waitangi, he piko, he taniwha, he piko, he taniwha. N\u014D reira, kua hoe nei e koutou i t\u014D koutou awa tupuna. Kai konei m\u0101tou e mihi atu nei, kei konei m\u0101tou e tangi atu nei. Ki waho i t\u0113nei Whare ka heke mai ng\u0101 roimata. He tohu t\u0113n\u0101 m\u014D ng\u0101 p\u014Duritanga, m\u014D ng\u0101 aitu\u0101, \u0101, he tohu an\u014D t\u0113r\u0101 ki a t\u0101ua Te M\u0101ori m\u014D te harikoa. N\u014D reira, ka hoe atu r\u0101 koutou ki runga i t\u014D t\u0101tou awa, e hoe, e hoe, t\u014Dkihi! \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000052\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e77494a0-1be1-432f-b492-fd160f4c119d\u0022\u003EK\u0101ti, ki te w\u0101hanga tuawh\u0101 o te pire. Ko t\u0101ku atu ki t\u0113nei Whare, ko te p\u016Bte\u0101 ka tukuna atu, ka t\u0101koha atu ki a Ng\u0101ti Korok\u012B Kahukura, hoin\u014D e mea ana te P\u0101keha, he drop in the bucket. Iti noa iho te p\u016Btea ka whakahokia atu ki a koutou ki t\u0113r\u0101, i tangohia e Te Karauna i roto i ng\u0101 tau. \u0112ngari i t\u0113nei w\u0101, e mihi atu ana ahau ki a koutou. Kua whai i t\u0113r\u0101 p\u016Btea ka taea e koutou te t\u014Dkihi atu ki ng\u0101 taumata o te moana e k\u014Drero atu ahau i mua tata nei. N\u014D reira, kia kaha r\u0101 koutou. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000053\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e77494a0-1be1-432f-b492-fd160f4c119d\u0022\u003EKo t\u0113nei wero, ki Te Whare e noho nei. Me kaua t\u0113nei Whare e p\u014Dh\u0113h\u0113 kua tat\u016B noa ng\u0101 take e p\u0101 ana ki a t\u0101tou Te Iwi M\u0101ori ki roto i ng\u0101 mahi whiriwhiringa o ng\u0101 take e p\u0101 ki Te Tiriti o Waitangi. Korekore ka noho mai a Ng\u0101ti Korok\u012B Kahukura ki te aro haehae i ng\u0101 k\u014Drero. Ki te totohe i ng\u0101 take e p\u0101 ana ki a r\u0101tou ki rot i te roanga ake o ng\u0101 tau kei mua i a t\u0101tou, \u0101, kati e Te Whare. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000054\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e77494a0-1be1-432f-b492-fd160f4c119d\u0022\u003EE Ng\u0101ti Korok\u012B Kahukura, ka waiho n\u0101tu t\u0113nei k\u014Drero o t\u014Dku tupuna ki a koutou hei whakakapi ake i t\u0113nei k\u014Drero, i t\u0113nei t\u0101ima. Ka k\u014Drero ahau i ng\u0101 k\u014Drero o t\u014Dku tupuna a K\u0101witi e p\u0101 ana ki Te Tiriti o Waitangi, \u201CE te whanau, i te pakanga ahau me ng\u0101 atua o te p\u014D, heoi, k\u012Bhai ahau i mate. N\u014D reira, takahia te riri ki raro i \u014D waewae. Kia \u016B ki te whakapono, he p\u014Dwai P\u0101keh\u0101 koutou \u0101 muri ake nei. Waiho kia kakati te namu i te wh\u0101rangi o te pukaupuka hei konei, ka tahuri atu ai. Kei takahia e koutou ng\u0101 papa pounamu a \u014D koutou t\u016Bpuna e takoto nei. Titiro atu ki ng\u0101 taumata o te moana. E ng\u0101 namu e kakati nei i ng\u0101 wh\u0101rangi o te pukapuka o Te Tiriti o Waitangi. K\u0101ti, e mihi atu nei ki a koutou, tau mai, tau atu, t\u0113n\u0101 koutou, t\u0113n\u0101 koutou, e Te M\u0101ngai, t\u0113n\u0101 t\u0101tou katoa. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000055\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e77494a0-1be1-432f-b492-fd160f4c119d\u0022\u003E[Thank you, Mr Speaker. I will be speaking in M\u0101ori. May our descendants live on and our hopes be fulfilled. Welcome to the Sky Father above and to Mother Earth below. Behold the heron from Rarotonga lands. Welcome, we have made landfall. Let the ritual be performed by placing the red stone of Hawaiki on this side and that, toward land and sea. The ritual is now complete. Our origins rise up towards the heavens and hang there suspended. We have surmounted the dangers of the seas and the realm of the maritime god. Let us take up the adze and carve out a new existence. Enough for now! May the kindness of the Creator be upon this House but, at the same time, upon you, the elder men and womenfolk, the grandchildren and young people of Ng\u0101ti Korok\u012B Kahukura\u2014in other words, upon you, the chiefs of the Waikato River. May all those acts of kindness be cast over our King T\u016Bheitia, as well, to ensure that his health, strength, and enlightenment is restored. Bring forth the calming winds of goodwill and peace. To those of you who have placed myriad of your deaths beneath the roof of this House so that they who have been snatched up by the strong hand of disappointing, excruciating, and convulsive mishap can be accorded a tribute, a traditional chant and mourned over in unison, enough! It was mishap that wrenched off the jaw of that one and the other one mourning over there, our jaw mourning here. Enough! Enough, I say! So those of you who passed from our sight, who have crossed beyond the Divide to land on the horizon of recollection, stir yourselves! Return spiritually amidst these negotiations and speeches that are before the House today. Rise up and confront Mahuta! Stand up, make a move! Rise up, let us go together! Let us go forth on the contributions delivered before you collectively by Ng\u0101ti Korok\u012B Kahukura as this morning unfolds. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000056\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e77494a0-1be1-432f-b492-fd160f4c119d\u0022\u003EIt began with the Minister stating that there were adverse acts by the Crown upon you; an indication of Crown actions that impacted adversely on us, M\u0101oridom, over the years. The Minister brought those wrongdoings unto this House; those wrongdoings that impacted upon you, Ng\u0101ti Korok\u012B Kahukura, into this House, and so I salute you and endorse the contributions by my sister colleague to you collectively, but at the same time, to this House. We, the Labour Party, supported this bill when it arrived in this House, throughout its passage to the ultimate level of speeches, contributions, talks, and addresses. And so I congratulate you, Minister. We of Ng\u0101puhi have spent a long time considering a name for you, because of your confidence and valour to thrust forward matters that relate to the Treaty of Waitangi settlement. In regard to that, I commend you sincerely. I leave that name for the elder men and womenfolk to figure out and bestow it upon you. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000057\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e77494a0-1be1-432f-b492-fd160f4c119d\u0022\u003EI acknowledge that elder sibling of mine Tau H\u0113nare now. That powerful creature sat on the M\u0101ori Affairs Committee. Now I wonder about my ancestor Taurekareka H\u0113nare\u2019s links to you, Waikato. Years ago, Te Puea lived in M\u014Dtatau. Her message to Ng\u0101ti Hine was \u201Cwork, pray, and work again!\u201D. Well, that is the challenge that I present to you, to not make assumptions, and to not wait. Accordingly, I place that challenge before you. Do not be deluded and do not wait! Yes, we of this House have discussed the matters relating to this bill, but I pick up on the statement by K\u0101witi, focus on the tops of the sea. In other words, focus on the dreams of our grandparents, your grandparents, indeed, of Ng\u0101ti Korok\u012B Kahukura yearned for. Therefore, I acknowledge that, right down to my elder cousin Tau H\u0113nare, who shepherded this bill through the procedures of this House. Enough! \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000058\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e77494a0-1be1-432f-b492-fd160f4c119d\u0022\u003EI look at this bill and all parts in it, not because of all the lollies\u2014in other words, all of Santa\u2019s presents\u2014that will land on you. That indeed will not happen, but, rather, I advise that you analyse the statements within the bill carefully, and there you will see the return of sacred places and lands to you of Ng\u0101ti Korok\u012B Kahukura. I doff my hat to you collectively but, at the same time, to all of you of the sacred river of Waikato. You are now at the prow of the canoe in terms of working together with the Crown to protect and administer the lands and resources that relate to you, which you hold, and so I congratulate you. The hand is extended to the Crown to work cooperatively with you to safeguard your sacred sites. Well done. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000059\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e77494a0-1be1-432f-b492-fd160f4c119d\u0022\u003EI look now at part two. You will have a say in the operations of the councils. You will have a say in negotiations with the Government in regard to matters of concern to you, your lands, issues, and kin. And so I congratulate you collectively on working carefully together with the Minister to examine those movements for you. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000060\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e77494a0-1be1-432f-b492-fd160f4c119d\u0022\u003ENow I look at part three, which relates to the river of Waikato. I have stated already that at every bend, there is a chief. Do not be deluded by the fact that the statement applies to you alone, the Waikato people, because it applies just as aptly to negotiations of Treaty of Waitangi matters. At each bend is a chief, at each bend is a chief. And so you have now navigated on your ancestral river. We here acknowledge and shed tears for you. Tears are being shed outside of Parliament, it is raining. That is an indication about the despondencies, deaths; an indication to you and me in M\u0101oridom about joys. So as you paddle out collectively on our river, paddle, paddle, go for it! Enough! \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000061\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e77494a0-1be1-432f-b492-fd160f4c119d\u0022\u003EAnd so to the fourth part of the bill, where my interpretation of it to this House is that the fund will be released and gifted to Ng\u0101ti Korok\u012B Kahukura, but mainstream would say it is a drop in the bucket. The funding returned to you is miniscule in comparison to that which the Crown took from you over the years. But at this time, I congratulate you. You have received that fund and will be able to go for it, to the tops of the ocean that I alluded to just before. And so, be strong. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000062\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e77494a0-1be1-432f-b492-fd160f4c119d\u0022\u003EThe challenge to this House sitting here is not to be deluded by the fact that all matters relating to M\u0101oridom have been resolved, in terms of negotiations about matters of the Treaty of Waitangi. Ng\u0101ti Korok\u012B Kahukura will never sit back to critically discern the contributions, to contest the matters concerning them as the years ahead of us go on, and so, enough, the House. To end this address, Ng\u0101ti Korok\u012B Kahukura, I will leave this saying of my ancestor with you, at this point in time. I will relate what my ancestor K\u0101witi said about the Treaty of Waitangi. He said this: \u201CFamily, I fought with the gods of the night and survived, however. So put the anger under your feet and tramp all over it. Hold fast to the faith, and you will move with a fan-like motion afterwards, like a European. Leave it until the sandfly nip the pages of the Treaty, and at this point, address them just in case you tramp all over the greenstone boxes of your ancestors lying here. Look at the tops of the ocean and say to the sandfly nipping at the pages of the Treaty of Waitangi, \u2018Enough!\u2019 \u201D. Mr Speaker, I doff my hat here and there to acknowledge and congratulate you and us all collectively. Thank you.]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022c3d9fd88-4715-419d-be08-e1c4eda7d09e\u0022 data-id=\u002246a99a463c8247b0b3c60c2f7012a155\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000063\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c3d9fd88-4715-419d-be08-e1c4eda7d09e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002246a99a463c8247b0b3c60c2f7012a155\u0022\u003EMARAMA FOX (Co-Leader\u2014M\u0101ori Party):\u003C/span\u003E \u0100, e Te Mana Whakaw\u0101, anei m\u0101tau e t\u0101pirihia nei ng\u0101 mihi ki a koutou kua tae \u0101-tinana mai ki te whakarongo ki ng\u0101 mihi, ki te whakarongo ki ng\u0101 k\u014Drero, \u0101, ki te tautoko i ng\u0101 mahi o te rangi nei. \u0100, t\u0113nei m\u0101tau, e hika, ka t\u016B whakaiti kei mua i a koutou. I ahau e noho nei, e whakaaro ana au, hika, ka noho i te whakam\u0101. He aha taua whakam\u0101? Ka tiro wh\u0101nui ki Te Whare, kai hea, kai hea \u014D t\u0101tau hoa ki te whakarongo ki ng\u0101 k\u014Drero h\u014Dhonu, te whakarongo ki ng\u0101 k\u014Drero kua takoto nei kei roto i te Whare nei kia m\u014Dhio pai r\u0101tau ki te kiko o t\u0113nei mea Te Tiriti o Waitangi me ng\u0101 hara kua tau ki runga i a t\u0101tau Te Iwi M\u0101ori, ki runga i a koutou. N\u0101 reira, i ahau e noho whakam\u0101 nei, e tiro ki ng\u0101 t\u016Bru e w\u0101tea nei, ka hiki an\u014D te manawa i runga i te k\u014Drero \u014D t\u014D t\u0101tau parata nei, a Peeni, te k\u014Drero a Nanaia me Te Minita, the Hon Chris Finlayson. Ng\u0101 k\u014Drero nei e whakanui, e whakamana i a koutou ahakoa he iti, he pounamu te k\u014Drero. Kia k\u014Drerohia t\u0113nei k\u014Drero i roto i Te Whare kua noho ki runga i ng\u0101 pukapuka m\u014D \u0101ke tonu r\u0101. N\u0101 reira, ka t\u016B whakaiti ki mua i a koutou me te tautoko i ng\u0101 k\u014Drero. E Te Mana Whakaw\u0101, kai te p\u012Brangi au ki te mihi atu ki a koutou o Tainui, ki a koutou, \u0101, ng\u0101 uri whakaheke o Ng\u0101ti Korok\u012B Kahukura, koutou o Te K\u012Bngitanga, me k\u012B. E tika me mihi ki a koutou \u014Dku pou, \u014Dku rahi, t\u0113n\u0101 koutou katoa. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000064\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c3d9fd88-4715-419d-be08-e1c4eda7d09e\u0022\u003E[Mr Speaker, here we are adding to the tributes extended to you collectively that have arrived here physically to listen to the tributes, contributions and to support today\u2019s proceedings. Here we are, goodness me, standing before you all in humility. While I was sitting here thinking, heavens above, I am embarrassed. What was that embarrassment? I looked extensively around the House, wondering where, indeed, are our colleagues to listen to the words of depth, the contributions put before this House so that they have a good understanding about the substance in regard to this Treaty of Waitangi thing and the transgressions that have alighted upon M\u0101oridom and you collectively. So while I was sitting here, embarrassed and looking at the empty seats before me, my spirit soared at the contribution by our brother colleague Peeni H\u0113nare here, sister colleague Nanaia, and the Minister, the Hon Christopher Finlayson. These contributions magnified and empowered you collectively. Even though the talk was diminutive, it was precious. When these statements are delivered in the Chamber, they are captured in the records for ever. So, I stand humbly before you, collectively, to endorse the contributions. I would like to commend you of Tainui, descendants of Ng\u0101ti Korok\u012B Kahukura and the King Movement, shall we say, Mr Speaker. It is apt that I acknowledge you my pillars and the many. Thank you all.]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000065\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c3d9fd88-4715-419d-be08-e1c4eda7d09e\u0022\u003EI rise to support the third reading of the Ng\u0101ti Koroki Kahukura Claims Settlement Bill. I welcome you here today. Almost exactly 2 years ago, on 20 December 2012, the Crown and Ng\u0101ti Koroki Kahukura signed a deed of settlement, agreeing to the final settlement of the non-raupatu Treaty of Waitangi claims of Ng\u0101ti Koroki Kahukura. In that action, the trustees of Ng\u0101ti Koroki Kahukura were acting in the best interests of an estimated 4,000 members who whakapapa to that sacred maunga, Maungatautari in the Waikato. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000066\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c3d9fd88-4715-419d-be08-e1c4eda7d09e\u0022\u003EThe bill respects and protects the unique tribal structures of Ng\u0101ti Koroki Kahukura in providing for the special relationship that the iwi have with that maunga and the Waikato River. Every one of their uri whakaheke deserves to be proud of the tribal history dating back to the 1840s, 1850s, and before, when they were a thriving, healthy people, when they successfully traded with one another and with the European settlers, and when they enjoyed, not just survived, the life that they lived. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000067\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c3d9fd88-4715-419d-be08-e1c4eda7d09e\u0022\u003EHowever, by the late 1850s there was rising tension over the land alienations. Ng\u0101ti Koroki Kahukura actively supported the establishment of the K\u012Bngitanga and, in an effort to safeguard their lands from alienation, placed their lands under the protection of the M\u0101ori King. At the same time their rangatira T\u012Boriori worked to maintain cordial relationships with the Crown. This fact of history is pivotal\u2014pivotal to know. It is a context that helps us to understand where we have come from as a nation and as a wh\u0101nau, hap\u016B, and iwi into the rising tensions of the 1860s, when war broke out, resulting in the deaths of some of Ng\u0101ti Koroki Kahukura and the capture of others, including their esteemed rangatira T\u012Boriori. Despite their preference for peace, Ng\u0101ti Koroki Kahukura were labelled rebels, and for that, under the Suppression of Rebellion Act, they had much of their land confiscated, and yet it is viewed as non-raupatu. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000068\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c3d9fd88-4715-419d-be08-e1c4eda7d09e\u0022\u003EThis iwi have maintained their interests in their homeland. They preserved\u2014they retained\u2014the essence of who they were even though their whenua was ripped out from under their feet. Maungatautari was, and remains, their tipuna, their ancestral mountain, central to their identity, yet in the 19th century the land in and around the maunga fell victim to Crown-imposed tenure reform. As a result, Ng\u0101ti Koroki Kahukura were involved in more than 50\u201450\u2014Native Land Court hearings before 1901. As a result, swamps and wetlands were drained and the Waikato River polluted. Hydroelectric power schemes depleted their traditional fisheries and flooded their cultural significant sites, as we have heard. By the end of the 20th century Ng\u0101ti Koroki Kahukura had become virtually landless. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000069\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c3d9fd88-4715-419d-be08-e1c4eda7d09e\u0022\u003EToday the bill rectifies this in some small way\u2014this and other wrongs imposed by the Crown on Ng\u0101ti Koroki Kahukura. The bill records a history of Ng\u0101ti Koroki Kahukura and the Crown apology to them\u2014the apology for the forced operation of the native land and public works legislation, the apology for the failure of the Crown to protect the traditional tribal structures of Ng\u0101ti Koroki Kahukura, the apology for the Crown\u2019s failure to recognise and provide for their relationship to Maungatautari and the Waikato River, and the Crown\u2019s apology for policies and legislation that instigated the economic, social, environmental, and cultural degradation of Ng\u0101ti Koroki Kahukura and their physical and spiritual resources. That last point is particularly important. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000070\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c3d9fd88-4715-419d-be08-e1c4eda7d09e\u0022\u003EIn the 1860s and onwards the Crown commenced its campaign to assimilate M\u0101ori into European culture. Ng\u0101ti Koroki Kahukura elders recall corporal punishment\u2014lashings\u2014being used to discourage them from speaking their reo, leaving behind a legacy in which fewer than 5 percent of their people still retain the ability to speak Te Reo M\u0101ori today. Eighty years on, and by 1950 many Ng\u0101ti Koroki Kahukura migrated from their traditional rohe in search of better economic prospects. Many disconnected from their communities and local culture. In both of these critical areas\u2014education and employment\u2014Ng\u0101ti Koroki Kahukura consider that landlessness and social deprivation have contributed to the Crown not recognising them as an iwi in their own right. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000071\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c3d9fd88-4715-419d-be08-e1c4eda7d09e\u0022\u003EI stand to support this bill because of its role in addressing the wrongs imposed by the Crown on Ng\u0101ti Koroki Kahukura. The bill enables us to look forward to a new era in the Crown\u2019s relationship with Ng\u0101ti Koroki Kahukura. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000072\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c3d9fd88-4715-419d-be08-e1c4eda7d09e\u0022\u003EMaungatautari is the maunga, Waikato is the awa. Through this settlement the maunga will be a scenic reserve and will be guarded by Te Hapori o Maungatautari. The transfer of ownership recognises the iconic and spiritual importance. The river will be managed together. There will be recognition of the river and its tributaries, and Ng\u0101ti Koroki Kahukura will have this as an area of interest, as well as Lake Arapuni and Lake Karapiro. This settlement means that you can co-manage it together. Ko Ng\u0101ti Koroki Kahukura te iwi. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000073\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c3d9fd88-4715-419d-be08-e1c4eda7d09e\u0022\u003EThe Crown confirms that it is deeply sorry and profoundly apologises to the ancestors and descendants of Ng\u0101ti Koroki Kahukura for the hardships they have endured. The way that they have treated and engaged with other iwi and the wider community during negotiations is a good example for the Crown, which in its long history of delay with Ng\u0101ti Koroki Kahukura was guilty of shutting them out. The graciousness of Ng\u0101ti Koroki Kahukura during these negotiations has been a defining characteristic of this settlement. Had the Crown possessed the same virtues in its dealings with Ng\u0101ti Koroki Kahukura, then the anguish and injustices that have brought us here today may well have been avoided. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000074\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c3d9fd88-4715-419d-be08-e1c4eda7d09e\u0022\u003EE Te Mana Whakaw\u0101, ka t\u016B ake au ki te tautoko i t\u0113nei pire. Hoi an\u014D r\u0101 ki a koutou kua tae \u0101-tinana mai ki te whakarongo \u0101-taringa, ki te kite \u0101-karu, ki te whakarongo \u0101-wairua hoki, nei r\u0101 te mihi atu ki a koutou katoa. Nei r\u0101 te mihi whakaiti kai mua i a koutou, te mihi whakanui i a koutou katoa, te whakamana, \u0101, te whakah\u014Dnore i a koutou katoa i roto i t\u0113nei whakapau werawera, whakapau kaha kia t\u016Btuki t\u0113nei pire kei mua i a t\u0101tau. T\u0113nei te mihi ki a koutou katoa, t\u0113n\u0101 koutou, t\u0113n\u0101 koutou, t\u0113n\u0101 koutou katoa.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000075\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c3d9fd88-4715-419d-be08-e1c4eda7d09e\u0022\u003E[Mr Speaker, I rise to support this bill, and therefore to you collectively, indeed, who came here in person to hear and see first-hand and to listen spiritually, as well. l salute you all. I stand before you in humility to congratulate, empower and honour you for the sweat and energy spent to complete this bill that is before us. So, well done, congratulations, and thank you all.]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00222df33ee5-23d6-441c-a9ba-6495aa69f9fd\u0022 data-id=\u00228540b003e59b46449c4be8d2f94bd48f\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000076\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00222df33ee5-23d6-441c-a9ba-6495aa69f9fd\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00228540b003e59b46449c4be8d2f94bd48f\u0022\u003EDENISE ROCHE (Green):\u003C/span\u003E T\u0113n\u0101 koe Mr Speaker, t\u0113n\u0101 koutou katoa. E ng\u0101 mate, haere, haere, hoki atu r\u0101 ki te p\u014D. E ng\u0101 mana, e ng\u0101 reo, rau rangatira m\u0101, t\u0113n\u0101 koutou, t\u0113n\u0101 koutou, t\u0113n\u0101 koutou katoa.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000077\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00222df33ee5-23d6-441c-a9ba-6495aa69f9fd\u0022\u003E[Thank you, Mr Speaker, and greetings to you all. Farewell to you, the dead; journey on, depart, and return to the void. Acknowledgments to the authorities, voices, esteemed leaders of a hundred fold, accolades and congratulations to you all.]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000078\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00222df33ee5-23d6-441c-a9ba-6495aa69f9fd\u0022\u003EWhen I stand in this House to speak on the final reading of a Treaty bill, I am always very aware that with the passage of the bill history is being made. Today is the culmination of years and years of work. That work includes the fight for recognition as an iwi so that Ng\u0101ti Koroki Kahukura could negotiate with the Crown; the setting-up of various settlement trusts and post-settlement trusts; the engagement with, and the voting of, the iwi members themselves; and then, of course, more recently the renegotiations with the Crown around some of the public unease about the settlement deed itself. That process was pre-dated by decades and decades of pressure from subsequent generations dating back to the first Native Land Court cases in the mid-1860s and the iwi\u2019s attempt to oppose the alienation from their land. I want to acknowledge all that work. I want to acknowledge the incredible persistence that has been needed to continue the fight against the injustices of the past and seek redress for the wrongs done by the Crown when at times it must have felt quite hopeless. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000079\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00222df33ee5-23d6-441c-a9ba-6495aa69f9fd\u0022\u003EIt is clear from even a cursory reading of the settlement bill that grave wrongs were perpetuated against this iwi, starting with the land-grabs in the 1850s and leading on to the confiscation after the Waikato Land Wars in 1863 and 1864, even though Ng\u0101ti Koroki Kahukura\u2019s rangatira T\u012Boriori worked with the Crown for peace. The actions of the Crown in the 1860s and onwards into the early 20th century broke the collective ownership of Ng\u0101ti Koroki Kahukura\u2019s land into smaller parcels, which enabled the people to be alienated from the land. We all know that divide and conquer is a sure-fire method to break down the strength of the collective. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000080\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00222df33ee5-23d6-441c-a9ba-6495aa69f9fd\u0022\u003EThe acknowledgment of the past in the bill outlines the process of that alienation in detail. At the start of the summary of the historical account in the bill, in clause 8(1), it says: \u201CDuring the 1840s and 1850s, Ng\u0101ti Koroki Kahukura were a prosperous and flourishing people. Among other things, they successfully traded with Europeans. However, by the late 1850s there was rising tension over land alienations.\u201D Later in the same clause, in subclause (4), it says: \u201CThe combined impact of confiscation and the alienation of land for which the Native Land Court had awarded titles to individuals resulted in Ng\u0101ti Koroki Kahukura becoming virtually landless by the end of the twentieth century.\u201D Then that impact is also outlined further on in the deed of settlement and in clause 8(8) of the bill, where it says: \u201CBy 1950, many Ng\u0101ti Koroki Kahukura were migrating from their traditional rohe in search of better economic prospects. This disconnected many from their communities and local culture. Ng\u0101ti Koroki Kahukura consider that landlessness and social deprivation have contributed to the Crown not recognising them as an iwi in their own right.\u201D \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000081\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00222df33ee5-23d6-441c-a9ba-6495aa69f9fd\u0022\u003EThis Treaty settlement bill offers financial and commercial redress of around $3 million and cultural redress amounting to around $3.23 million. Ng\u0101ti Koroki Kahukura went from having their own resources and land\u2014having their own economic base\u2014to virtual landlessness. Along the way they suffered the loss of their landscape, their language, and their w\u0101hi tapu. They suffered the flooding of some of their sacred places for hydroelectric dams and, 100 years ago, at the start of World War I, some of their people were arrested for resisting going to fight in that war. Their relationship with their awa, Te Waikato, and with their sacred maunga, Maungatautari, has been damaged, and they have had difficulty accessing those sacred places. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000082\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00222df33ee5-23d6-441c-a9ba-6495aa69f9fd\u0022\u003EThis bill addresses just a tiny fraction of what Ng\u0101ti Koroki Kahukura have endured, and yet there are some New Zealanders who have no understanding of the history and who will declare this Treaty settlement, and all Treaty settlements, a gravy train. My response to that is to remind those people that in 2010 this Government bailed out South Canterbury Finance to the tune of $1.7 billion. This settlement is a drop in the bucket\u2014and those people did not lose their land. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000083\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00222df33ee5-23d6-441c-a9ba-6495aa69f9fd\u0022\u003EAmong those who have little understanding about the history of this nation is the Prime Minister. In his statement quite recently he said New Zealand was colonised peacefully and that M\u0101ori are grateful for the capital that the settlers brought to New Zealand. Ignorance is not bliss. Ignorance in these cases compounds the injuries that iwi have suffered over generations. The rosy 1950s myth of New Zealand as a leader in race relations is completely unfounded and needs to be debunked. Having the leader of our country perpetuate that rubbish is insulting in the extreme. There is no way that any iwi\u2014and certainly not this iwi\u2014would affirm that colonisation was a peaceful process. I ask the Minister for Treaty of Waitangi Negotiations to take his leader in hand and show him a Treaty bill. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000084\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00222df33ee5-23d6-441c-a9ba-6495aa69f9fd\u0022\u003EI recognise, though, that today is a day for Ng\u0101ti Koroki Kahukura to celebrate. Having said that, I am compelled to state for the record the Greens\u2019 position. We will be supporting this bill, but we need to state that we do not believe that these are full and final settlements. We remain deeply uneasy that the Crown picks the winners and losers. It can pit M\u0101ori against M\u0101ori, iwi against iwi, and hap\u016B against hap\u016B, and we fear that in doing so, it will create more Treaty breaches. The Greens do not believe that it is full compensation, and we must acknowledge the generosity of this iwi, who will accept this settlement. They will work alongside other iwi, the community, and the councils to safeguard and protect their sacred places\u2014Waikato and Maungatautari\u2014and all the people of New Zealand benefit from that generosity. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000085\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00222df33ee5-23d6-441c-a9ba-6495aa69f9fd\u0022\u003ENor do we believe that it is a final settlement. These are historical claims. That suggests that the past is done with, but it is not. We cannot know what impact the past actions will have on future generations. We do understand that this settlement gives Ng\u0101ti Koroki Kahukura a start\u2014an economic base that you can use to secure better opportunities for your people; a solid place to step forward into the future. I want to acknowledge the Treaty negotiation teams of both the iwi and the Crown for the work that they have done to bring the settlement to the House today. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000086\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00222df33ee5-23d6-441c-a9ba-6495aa69f9fd\u0022\u003EI want to finish with the last paragraph in the apology that is contained in the deed of settlement and in the bill itself. It says: \u201CNg\u0101ti Koroki Kahukura have a long tradition of seeking a positive relationship with the Crown, and the Crown looks forward to renewing that tradition and building an enduring association of mutual trust and co-operation with Ng\u0101ti Koroki Kahukura that is based on respect for Te Tiriti o Waitangi and its principles.\u201D We too have hope for a New Zealand where the Crown abides by the Treaty of Waitangi. The children and grandchildren of Ng\u0101ti Koroki Kahukura depend on that respect, as do all our children. T\u0113n\u0101 koutou, t\u0113n\u0101 koutou, t\u0113n\u0101 koutou katoa.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022cba965bb-864f-4e06-99dc-6fcdfd007ad5\u0022 data-id=\u0022fe637427945d44cdb145f48eac934c74\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000087\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cba965bb-864f-4e06-99dc-6fcdfd007ad5\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022fe637427945d44cdb145f48eac934c74\u0022\u003EPITA PARAONE (NZ First):\u003C/span\u003E \u0100, t\u0113n\u0101 koe e Te Mana Whakaw\u0101. T\u0113n\u0101 t\u0101tou o Te Whare, aku tu\u0101kana, ng\u0101 tu\u0101hine hoki i t\u016B ake i mua i a au ki te \u2018hakatau i \u0113nei o ng\u0101 rangatira kua tae mai nei i waenganui i a t\u0101tou i te r\u0101 nei. Koutou o Ng\u0101ti Korok\u012B Kahukura, e Te Tumuaki, koutou ng\u0101 kaik\u014Drero, ng\u0101 m\u0101ngai, ng\u0101 kai\u0101rahi, koutou hoki kua tae mai nei ki te \u2018hakarongo i ng\u0101 k\u014Drero i puta mai i t\u0113nei w\u0101hanga, he w\u0101hanga mutunga kia \u2018hakamana t\u0101 koutou pire. Tua atu i t\u0113n\u0101, e tika ana kia mihi atu ki t\u0113n\u0101 o ng\u0101 whanaunga karanga maha i ngaro atu ki te tirohanga kanohi i te r\u0101 nei. I roto i ng\u0101 k\u014Drero o r\u0101tou m\u0101, ki a koutou te wikit\u014Dria \u0113ngari, n\u0101 r\u0101tou te h\u014Dnore. N\u014D reira, e tika ana te mihi atu ki t\u0113n\u0101 o ng\u0101 rangatira a Wally me \u0113r\u0101 atu. Me hoki te tuahine i \u2018hakahuangia e Te Minita i te ata nei, me \u0113r\u0101 atu e kawe atu t\u0113nei kaupapa m\u014D koutou ki Te Whare nei. N\u0101 reira e ng\u0101 mate, haere, hoki atu. N\u0101 reira, kua ea te w\u0101hi m\u0101 r\u0101tou, ka hoki mai ki a t\u0101tou te hunga ora, n\u0101 reira, t\u0113n\u0101 koutou, t\u0113n\u0101 koutou, t\u0113n\u0101 koutou. T\u0113n\u0101 hoki koutou m\u014D \u014D koutou whakaaro ki te whakaaengia i te pire nei, ahakoa e tika ana te k\u014Drero o taku tuakana, \u0113, te \u0101hua nei kua tae mai a Hana K\u014Dk\u014D kua tukuna atu he rare. Kia aha tia? Kia aha tia? \u0112ngari ko te \u0101hua o te kaupapa, ko te \u0101hua o te kaupapa. N\u0101 reira, t\u0113r\u0101 pea ka huri taku reo kia m\u014Dhio mai Te Kai\u2019hakaw\u0101 he aha r\u0101 ng\u0101 k\u014Drero.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000088\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cba965bb-864f-4e06-99dc-6fcdfd007ad5\u0022\u003E[Thank you, Mr Assistant Speaker, and greetings to us all: the House, my elder brethren and sister colleagues, as well, who stood before me to welcome these noble leaders who have arrived here amongst us today. You of Ng\u0101ti Korok\u012B Kahukura, the head, speakers, representatives and leaders, as well, who have arrived here to listen to the contributions that have emerged from this part, the final reading to formalise your bill. Further to that, it is appropriate that I pay a tribute to that one of the relatives of many callings, who is gone and no longer seen today. According to the sayings of many ancestors, the victory is yours, but the honour is theirs. So it is apt, indeed, that I acknowledge Wally, that of the esteemed elders and others. I go back to the sister mentioned by the Minister this morning, along with the others who took this policy to the House on your behalf. So, farewell to you, the dead, go back. The part to them is therefore fulfilled, and so I come back to us the living. Greetings, acknowledgments and congratulations to you collectively. Thank you, also, for your thoughts in terms of agreeing to this bill, despite the comment by my elder cousin, it seems like Santa Claus has arrived to hand out lollies, but what will be done to them? What? But that is exactly what the nature of the policy is about. Therefore, I should switch to English so that the Speaker understands what is being stated.]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000089\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cba965bb-864f-4e06-99dc-6fcdfd007ad5\u0022\u003EThis bill rectifies the wrongs imposed by the Crown on Ng\u0101ti Koroki Kahukura. I do not want to go to great length in repeating the history that has brought this bill to this stage, but I think it is only correct that we should make reference to the bill and its recording of the history of Ng\u0101ti Koroki Kahukura and the apology proffered by the Crown to this iwi. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000090\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cba965bb-864f-4e06-99dc-6fcdfd007ad5\u0022\u003EWhy the apology? It is for the operation of the native land and public works legislation, the failure of the Crown to protect the traditional tribal structures of the iwi, the Crown\u2019s failure to recognise and provide for their relationship to Maungatautari and the Waikato River, and the Crown policies and laws that led to the economic, social, environmental, and cultural degradation of the iwi. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000091\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cba965bb-864f-4e06-99dc-6fcdfd007ad5\u0022\u003EToday this House will pass into legislation the Ng\u0101ti Koroki Kahukura Claims Settlement Bill, and New Zealand First will certainly be supporting this bill. I am aware that New Zealand First did not participate in either the first or the second stages of this bill, but I am here today to ensure that we do participate in this stage. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000092\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cba965bb-864f-4e06-99dc-6fcdfd007ad5\u0022\u003ELike similar Treaty of Waitangi claims settlement legislation that has preceded this bill, this is a combination of trial and tribulation. It is a trial and tribulation for those people involved in negotiating the terms of settlement and I have some sympathy for them because, irrespective of what they have been able to negotiate with the Crown, the people whom they represent will never be satisfied, and rightly so\u2014rightly so\u2014but that is the challenge that negotiators have to make in this whole process. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000093\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cba965bb-864f-4e06-99dc-6fcdfd007ad5\u0022\u003ENot only have they had to contend with reaching an agreement with those representing the Crown, but they have had the daunting task of getting the support of their iwi. We have heard today some of the reasons why there has been a reluctance on the part of iwi members not to be too overjoyed about accepting this settlement. But having said that, I think it would be remiss of me not to acknowledge the Minister for Treaty of Waitangi Negotiations. The Minister has had to face those negotiators, knowing full well that his purse will never be big enough, but, again, we see in this bill an example of an iwi making a contribution to this country, making a contribution of the resources they have had and cherished for centuries. I make reference to Maungatautari and the sharing of the management of that sacred mountain with the rest of the community. Also, we see the sharing of the responsibility for the care of the Waikato River. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000094\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cba965bb-864f-4e06-99dc-6fcdfd007ad5\u0022\u003EThe Waikato-Tainui Raupatu Claims (Waikato River) Settlement Act of 2010 and the Ng\u0101ti Tuwharetoa, Raukawa, and Te Arawa River Iwi Waikato River Act of 2010 provide very important mechanisms for the care and well-being of the Waikato River, and therein lies the blueprint for both the iwi and the community, through the district council or local body, to be able to work together to make our environment a better place to live in. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000095\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cba965bb-864f-4e06-99dc-6fcdfd007ad5\u0022\u003ESo I say to Ng\u0101ti Koroki Kahukura today that I acknowledge the time and effort you have put into seeing this bill to fruition, and, more important, the sacrifices you have made along the way. I say to you that if you thought this journey has been difficult, the one you take from this day forth will be fraught with as many challenges as you have had to face so far. As my t\u016Bpuna, our t\u016Bpuna, have always said to us, in Ng\u0101ti Hine: \u201CYou\u2019ve come too far not to keep going. You\u2019ve done too much not to do more.\u201D \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000096\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cba965bb-864f-4e06-99dc-6fcdfd007ad5\u0022\u003EI say to the leadership, and I quote my father on this, which he said when I was elected to be chairman of that great r\u016Bnunga Te R\u016Bnanga o Ng\u0101ti Hine\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000097\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002207dc4112-8a19-4dd6-a57c-878b47f8a9b6\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022e37778f2ec3749868cf54e86660b3164\u0022\u003ERon Mark\u003C/span\u003E: You had to get it in, eh?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000098\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cba965bb-864f-4e06-99dc-6fcdfd007ad5\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00224f265ed46a784ebe902ecc3b45a4eb20\u0022\u003EPITA PARAONE\u003C/span\u003E: \u2014yes\u2014\u201CAlways look behind you, because you have to ask yourself: if there is no one there, then who are you leading?\u201D. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000099\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cba965bb-864f-4e06-99dc-6fcdfd007ad5\u0022\u003EKoi n\u0101 te wero! Koi n\u0101 te wero m\u014D koutou ng\u0101 kai\u2019hakahaere kia anga mua t\u0113nei kaupapa hei painga m\u014D koutou. N\u0101 reira, e kore e t\u014Droa \u0113nei t\u016B \u0113ngari, t\u016B ake t\u0113nei ki te tautoko ng\u0101 k\u014Drero i k\u014Drerohia i mua i a au. E tika ana hoki kia tukuna atu ng\u0101 mihi, ng\u0101 manaakitanga o Te Runga Rawa ki runga i a koutou. Ng\u0101 mihi, ng\u0101 \u0101whero nui m\u014D te tau hou. N\u0101 reira, t\u0113n\u0101 koutou, t\u0113n\u0101 koutou, kia ora mai an\u014D t\u0101tou. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000100\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cba965bb-864f-4e06-99dc-6fcdfd007ad5\u0022\u003E[That is the challenge. That is the challenge for you administrators, to ensure this settlement goes forward to benefit you collectively. And so, I will not prolong these sentiments by standing any longer, but I rose to endorse the contributions by those before me. It is appropriate as well to acknowledge the Almighty above for His kindness upon us. Best wishes and aspirations for the new year. So, greetings, congratulations to you and all of us, thank you.]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022758dcaf3-9976-43ac-8593-79f66ee4da22\u0022 data-id=\u002277d1e51313214462acb2081008fc4961\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000101\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022758dcaf3-9976-43ac-8593-79f66ee4da22\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002277d1e51313214462acb2081008fc4961\u0022\u003EJOANNE HAYES (National):\u003C/span\u003E T\u0113n\u0101 koe e Te Mana Whakaw\u0101. Te K\u012Bngi T\u016Bheitia, t\u0113n\u0101 koe e te rangatira. Ng\u0101 wh\u0101nau, ng\u0101 hap\u016B, rau rangatira m\u0101, ng\u0101 kui, ng\u0101 koro o te iwi Ng\u0101ti Korok\u012B Kahukura. Ka nunui te mihi atu ki a koutou, \u0101 , nau mai, haere mai. Ng\u0101 mema o Te Whare P\u0101remata, t\u0113n\u0101 koutou.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000102\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022758dcaf3-9976-43ac-8593-79f66ee4da22\u0022\u003E[Thank you, Mr Speaker. Greetings to you, King T\u016Bheitia esteemed leader, families, sub tribes, many leaders and the elderly women and men of the Ng\u0101ti Koroki Kahukura tribe, a huge welcome to you, and so welcome, welcome, greetings to you, the members of Parliament House.]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000103\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022758dcaf3-9976-43ac-8593-79f66ee4da22\u0022\u003EI stand to take a brief call on this bill, this very important bill. I want to say that I was very disappointed in the k\u014Drero of our Green member because today, wh\u0101nau, is a day of celebration for Ng\u0101ti Koroki Kahukura. Today is your day and we are here to celebrate with you, not to dredge up and talk very unsavoury k\u014Drero to you. I also want to say to you that in listening to our previous speaker, the member Pita Paraone, he is right. The pockets of the Minister for Treaty of Waitangi Negotiations are only so big and I know that we all want it to be much bigger than it is, but that is where it is. I think that the Minister and the iwi negotiators need to be congratulated because this has been a tough process for everybody\u2014for absolutely everybody\u2014but we have managed to get to this point, the point of celebration. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000104\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022758dcaf3-9976-43ac-8593-79f66ee4da22\u0022\u003EPeople start to talk in this House about drops in buckets, but I can tell you that from a drop comes the rain, and from the rain comes the moana and the awa. That is how I look at the claims settlement process. We started with a drop in 2012, with the first signing of this deed, and we end today with the beautiful rain that spreads over all of you. That is the rain of your future. That will be the future of the mokopuna. It is what you do with it from here on out that makes the difference. I must say that I do support the Minister and the hard work that he has done for all the iwi of this country. He will continue to do that until every single Treaty settlement is settled in this House. That is the commitment of this Government and the commitment to everybody. So I say forget about the detractors. Close our ears. Let us look forward. Let us grow our iwi. Let us grow all iwi. We are the future. You are the future. When I look at the p\u0113pi and I look at the hap\u016B women who walk around our streets and our country, that is our future. That is what we need to talk about. So I am very humbled to stand here today to support the Ng\u0101ti Koroki Kahukura Claims Settlement Bill. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022893adc11-ce4e-419c-a079-08f04b3d75f5\u0022 data-id=\u00221594ecb22f16428ba47c720744d8860c\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000105\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022893adc11-ce4e-419c-a079-08f04b3d75f5\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00221594ecb22f16428ba47c720744d8860c\u0022\u003EThe ASSISTANT SPEAKER (Lindsay Tisch)\u003C/span\u003E: I understand the next call is a split call. Meka Whaitiri\u20145 minutes.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022073496a0-73b7-426f-97f8-916bd542b0fa\u0022 data-id=\u0022bbcfd35027d9476d8334bd9efaa7193f\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000106\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022073496a0-73b7-426f-97f8-916bd542b0fa\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022bbcfd35027d9476d8334bd9efaa7193f\u0022\u003EMEKA WHAITIRI (Labour\u2014Ikaroa-R\u0101whiti):\u003C/span\u003E T\u0113n\u0101 koe, Mr Assistant Speaker. \u0100, t\u0113n\u0101 t\u0101tou katoa ng\u0101 mema o te Whare nei. Ng\u0101ti Korok\u012B Kahukura, e te iwi, e ng\u0101 p\u0101keke, e ng\u0101 rangatahi, nau mai, nau mai, hara mai. Nau mai, hara mai ki t\u014D t\u0101tau Whare, Te Whare M\u012Bere o Aotearoa. He mihi maioha, he mihi mahana ki a koutou katoa n\u014D reira, t\u0113n\u0101 t\u0101tau. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000107\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022073496a0-73b7-426f-97f8-916bd542b0fa\u0022\u003E[Thank you, Mr Assistant Speaker. Greetings to us all, members of this House, and to you, Ng\u0101ti Korok\u012B Kahukura, to the tribe, elders, and young people, welcome, welcome, welcome. Welcome, draw near to our House of Representatives of New Zealand. A sincere and warm welcome to you, and all of us. Thank you.]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000108\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022073496a0-73b7-426f-97f8-916bd542b0fa\u0022\u003EI bring warm greetings from Te Tai R\u0101whiti, from Ng\u0101ti Kahungunu, from Rangit\u0101ne, and from Te \u0100tiawa\u2014the iwi who make up the electorate that I proudly represent, Ikaroa R\u0101whiti. I stand here proudly to acknowledge the mahi and the passage of this very important bill, the Ng\u0101ti Koroki Kahukura Claims Settlement Bill, in its third and final reading. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000109\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022073496a0-73b7-426f-97f8-916bd542b0fa\u0022\u003ECan I please acknowledge those who have travelled long distances to join in this great day of celebration, to acknowledge the work that many of your people have done who are no longer amongst us. I acknowledge the tipuna who have passed on and may they sleep well. I want to also acknowledge, particularly, the rangatahi, the mokopuna, whose mahi we are here for, so that when they come into their own it is a better place than when we inherited it. So I want to acknowledge the rangatahi, the tauira I see in the gallery, to be witness to the passing of this important piece of legislation. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000110\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022073496a0-73b7-426f-97f8-916bd542b0fa\u0022\u003EForty years ago, in 1974, the Labour Prime Minister at the time, Norman Kirk, spoke at Waitangi with a special message for all New Zealanders when he said: \u201C\u2026 we are a distinctive nation, unlike any other in the world. And this is so, largely because Maoritanga\u2014the history, the culture, the life-style of the Maori\u2014is woven as rich gleaming threads in the fabric of our society.\u201D Those words were true in 1974, they remain as true today, and Labour stands for a strong, enduring relationship between the Crown and M\u0101ori. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000111\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022073496a0-73b7-426f-97f8-916bd542b0fa\u0022\u003EI want to spend the short time I have in acknowledging the day today by talking about a particular place that is dear to these people, and that is Lake Karapiro, and to share my affinity with that particular lake, since the early 1990s, from mid-January, I have always made a h\u012Bkoi to Lake Karapiro. I was a member of the M\u0101ori Affairs Committee in the 50th Parliament and we went to Karapiro to hear the submissions on this particular bill. It was the first time I have ever been back to Lake Karapiro when I did not actually have a paddle. So I stand here to acknowledge the contribution that that place plays in the fabric of the waka ama nation across Aotearoa. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000112\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022073496a0-73b7-426f-97f8-916bd542b0fa\u0022\u003EI have to say that many, many years ago, when I first went, Te Tai R\u0101whiti groups from Horouta Marae used to clean up all the races, but in recent years I have to acknowledge that the Waikato clubs have now come into their own and we are lucky even to get a medal. So I want to acknowledge the special place that Lake Karapiro has particularly in my heart and I acknowledge the good people of Koroki Kahukura who manaaki us when we come there\u2014who look after us. I know that my sister Nanaia talked about the rowing capital being Lake Karapiro, but I also want to acknowledge the significant way that the people of Koroki Kahukura look after the waka ama wh\u0101nau when we arrive at your lake. Can I acknowledge you and can I also say perhaps Rowing New Zealand could take a leaf out of the book of waka ama about how we manaaki our visitors to your beautiful lake. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000113\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022073496a0-73b7-426f-97f8-916bd542b0fa\u0022\u003EWith that small contribution can I say thank you to the Minister for Treaty of Waitangi Negotiations for getting us to this point, and to all the negotiators, including my whanaunga Willie and his lovely wife, Linda. We can say things like that when you are whanaunga; you cannot change whom you are related to. To all the negotiators, to the Office of Treaty Settlements, and to all officials I say n\u014D reira e te iwi. T\u0113n\u0101 koutou, t\u0113n\u0101 koutou, t\u0113n\u0101 t\u0101tou katoa.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022b4a597dd-ed8b-42b8-975b-40c6e0cdaee1\u0022 data-id=\u0022e0b052b2596b4676b251c467a76a410e\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000114\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b4a597dd-ed8b-42b8-975b-40c6e0cdaee1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022e0b052b2596b4676b251c467a76a410e\u0022\u003ELOUISA WALL (Labour\u2014Manurewa):\u003C/span\u003E Kia ora e Te M\u0101ngai o Te Whare. E ng\u0101 mana, e ng\u0101 reo, rau rangatira m\u0101, ng\u0101 wh\u0101nau o Ng\u0101ti Korok\u012B Kahukura me Ng\u0101ti Haua, t\u0113n\u0101 koutou, t\u0113n\u0101 koutou, t\u0113n\u0101 t\u0101tau katoa. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000115\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b4a597dd-ed8b-42b8-975b-40c6e0cdaee1\u0022\u003E[Thank you, Mr Assistant Speaker, and welcome to the authorities, dialects, many leaders, and families of Ng\u0101ti Korok\u012B Kahukura and Ng\u0101ti Hau\u0101. Welcome, welcome. I congratulate us all.]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000116\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b4a597dd-ed8b-42b8-975b-40c6e0cdaee1\u0022\u003EToday is always a day of mixed emotion. It is an emotional day because it is a day that Ng\u0101ti Koroki Kahukura looks back at how they have arrived at this point in time. It interesting to note that we are over 155 years since our Native Land Acts and our M\u0101ori Land Wars. We are nearly 40 years since the Waitangi Tribunal was established under the Treaty of Waitangi Act. In fact, it was 20 years ago, in 1994, that Wally Papa and others put their Wai claims before the Crown. They were Wai 1294 and Wai 1494. So today is the beginning; it is not an end. Today is a day where, as a wh\u0101nau, I think that all those memories come flooding back. Adrian Rurawhe and I were just sitting here admiring the strength and the resilience of your iwi, Ng\u0101ti Koroki Kahukura, because the challenges that were faced over the years to get to this point in time have been ones where I think we ourselves have had to go through processes that the Crown has established to get your mandate, to get your negotiating team, to negotiate with the Crown. What I always appreciate about this process is the strength and resilience of our iwi. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000117\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b4a597dd-ed8b-42b8-975b-40c6e0cdaee1\u0022\u003EWe come and go. I am in my second term here. In the 50th Parliament I was a proud member of the M\u0101ori Affairs Committee. In this term I am not a member of the M\u0101ori Affairs Committee, but I am a proud M\u0101ori member of this House of Parliament and I am a proud member of Labour\u2019s M\u0101ori caucus. What you need to know is that this Treaty settlement space is actually one where we do have consensus across the House and that all of us in this House want to work with iwi as fast as we can to give, I guess, formal recognition to your status. When I look at these bills, for me it is always the statutory acknowledgments that take my eye. Those statutory acknowledgments are actually about the Crown recognising the mana of the tangata whenua, and it is upon that relationship that I think we have clarity going forward because we see you as an equal partner under the statutory acknowledgment space. We see that our mana whenua actually do have rights and responsibilities in consenting and resource management issues, so for me that is the platform in terms of the relationship that provides the most clarity about our status as the mana whenua, the tangata whenua\u2014the indigenous people\u2014of Aotearoa New Zealand. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000118\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b4a597dd-ed8b-42b8-975b-40c6e0cdaee1\u0022\u003EI always stand here with, I guess, the humbleness that comes from being in this House of Parliament and I am privileged to be part of this Treaty settlement process. I want to acknowledge and thank the strength and the mana of our iwi for getting us, as a country, to this point in time because without your generosity we would not be in a place where, actually, we are in a truth and reconciliation process. We can move forward and look forward with tremendous pride about, and appreciation for, the contribution that I know you have made, and that you will make, as an iwi to the development of our nation. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000119\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b4a597dd-ed8b-42b8-975b-40c6e0cdaee1\u0022\u003ETo all our kaum\u0101tua and our kuia, thank you for being the p\u014Du and for being there to lead the way for the rangatahi. I do want to acknowledge, as my colleague Meka Whaitiri did, our mokopuna and our tamariki who are here because I think the legacy that we are creating actually holds us in good stead for the future. I am going to be really excited about how Ng\u0101ti Koroki Kahukura uses this settlement process to achieve the dreams and aspirations that I know you have been planning since 2010. I have looked on the website and I want to congratulate you on the engagement that you have had with your people to take them on this journey. N\u014D reira, t\u0113n\u0101 koutou, t\u0113n\u0101 koutou, t\u0113n\u0101 t\u0101tou katoa.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002203fd985b-4fb8-4111-ba38-5033a254d962\u0022 data-id=\u0022ae754ceef1be4a3ea844711bdbc3a3d7\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000120\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002203fd985b-4fb8-4111-ba38-5033a254d962\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022ae754ceef1be4a3ea844711bdbc3a3d7\u0022\u003EBRETT HUDSON (National):\u003C/span\u003E It is indeed a privilege to stand and take this short call in the third reading of this bill. Allow me to acknowledge Ng\u0101ti Koroki Kahukura. With settlements such as these, it is important and appropriate that they recognise the wrongs in the past of our country and that they seek to make right those wrongs. In doing so, they also help to strengthen the partnership between the Crown and M\u0101ori. Settlements help iwi across the country unlock economic potential and boost regional and provincial productivity. It is important in addressing the wrongs that we provide that capability to iwi, and it is completely in keeping with this Government\u2019s priority to build a more competitive and productive economy. It is our wish and our hope that through this settlement, and through the other settlements we have made, M\u0101ori will be able to fully participate in that growing and more productive economy. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000121\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002203fd985b-4fb8-4111-ba38-5033a254d962\u0022\u003EI would also like to acknowledge the Minister for Treaty of Waitangi Negotiations, the Hon Christopher Finlayson, along with all the iwi across New Zealand who have been willing and able to enter into settlement negotiations. It is his drive and his determination that has seen 48 deeds of settlement signed since November 2008, and an outlook that by 2017 all willing and able iwi should have deeds of settlement completed. It is indeed an honour to be a participant, no matter how small, in these proceedings. I think that by looking back, acknowledging the wrongs of the past, and seeking to put them right, we actually clear the way to a better future for all New Zealand. I commend this bill to the House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022a434482b-7ac1-4862-9ce7-13e63289dee3\u0022 data-id=\u0022aff4d88932e14648b7b75c6a45a9038b\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000122\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a434482b-7ac1-4862-9ce7-13e63289dee3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022aff4d88932e14648b7b75c6a45a9038b\u0022\u003EADRIAN RURAWHE (Labour\u2014Te Tai Hau\u0101uru):\u003C/span\u003E \u0100, t\u0113n\u0101 koe e Te M\u0101ngai o Te W\u2019are, otir\u0101, e p\u012Brangi ana au kia tuku mihi atu ki a r\u0101tou an\u014D \u2019oki e Te M\u0101ngai o Te W\u2019are. N\u014D reira, ki a koutou Ng\u0101ti Korok\u012B Kahukura, anei a \u2019au te tuku mi\u2019i atu ki a koutou katoa kua tae mai ki Te W\u2019are nei i t\u0113nei r\u0101. Kei te mi\u2019i atu a au ki a koutou m\u014D \u014D koutou ka\u2019a, \u014D koutou m\u0101ia, o koutou pono an\u014D \u2019oki, kia w\u2019akatau\u2019ia t\u0113nei ker\u0113me. N\u014D reira, t\u0113nei te mi\u2019i. Kei te mi\u2019i \u2018oki au ki a koe e Te Tumuaki, t\u0113n\u0101 koe, otir\u0101, ki te mauri o Te Motu ki a K\u012Bngi T\u016Bheitia. T\u0113nei te mi\u2019i ake ki a ia. N\u014D reira, t\u0113n\u0101 t\u0101tou katoa.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000123\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a434482b-7ac1-4862-9ce7-13e63289dee3\u0022\u003E[Thank you to the Speaker of the House, but, at the same time, I would like to acknowledge them, as well. And so to you, Ng\u0101ti Korok\u012B Kahukura, here I am acknowledging you all who have arrived in this House today. I salute you for your strength, resilience, and faith as well also to settle this claim and so my congratulations. I acknowledge you the head, greetings but at the same time how vital the essence of the country is to King T\u016Bheitia. I salute him and therefore us all.]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000124\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a434482b-7ac1-4862-9ce7-13e63289dee3\u0022\u003EI join with my colleagues in acknowledging all of the people who have arrived here today to hear the third reading of the Ng\u0101ti Koroki Kahukura Claims Settlement Bill. I want to acknowledge all of the contributions from members today. It is indeed one of the occasions when the House speaks with one voice, usually, on the passing of settlement bills. Today I want to acknowledge in particular the Minister for Treaty of Waitangi Negotiations, Christopher Finlayson, for the work that he has done, and also the negotiators of this settlement. From experience I know that this is not an easy task, and it does take a long time. As my colleague Louisa Wall has said, the original claim was made 20 years ago, so a lot of people have worked very hard to get to this stage. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000125\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a434482b-7ac1-4862-9ce7-13e63289dee3\u0022\u003EI want to also acknowledge those who have passed on. In 20 years it is without a doubt that people who have made huge commitments to this legislation will have passed on. In particular, I want to acknowledge Wally Papa and others as well for the work that they have done on this settlement. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000126\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a434482b-7ac1-4862-9ce7-13e63289dee3\u0022\u003EI have read a number of historical accounts in deeds of settlement, and what never ceases to amaze me is the resilience of our people. It never ceases to amaze me as well that in each and every one of them\u2014or at least in most of them\u2014there are words to the effect that this iwi has become virtually landless. This is an issue that certainly drives most iwi in wanting to settle their historical claims. It is usually all about the land. In this particular bill, I want to particularly acknowledge Maungatautari. This has huge interest for Ng\u0101ti Koroki Kahukura. I want to acknowledge the innovative mechanism that has been produced and agreed by both the Crown and Ng\u0101ti Koroki Kahukura to see that this taonga, this special place, is indeed looked after not only for the iwi but also the wider community. I have to say that that is a huge gift from Ng\u0101ti Koroki Kahukura, an act of generosity towards both the community and also Aotearoa. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000127\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a434482b-7ac1-4862-9ce7-13e63289dee3\u0022\u003EThe Native Land Court awarded that particular land to individuals, and, of course, individuals had the right to sell that land, which they eventually did. Of course, those kinds of acts, the omissions of the Crown, and the legislation that was in place at that time all contributed to the ongoing land loss. As it states in the deed of settlement, by the end of the 20th century Ng\u0101ti Koroki Kahukura were deemed to be virtually landless. This piece of legislation begins to heal that issue. It does not in itself resolve the whole issue. There are many, many years to come, I think, before Ng\u0101ti Koroki Kahukura progress to a point where they can stand up proudly and say that things have been resolved. This is a beginning, not an end. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000128\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a434482b-7ac1-4862-9ce7-13e63289dee3\u0022\u003EI want to acknowledge the contribution from Denise Roche. I want to say it in this way, though: at a particular time, I think every iwi that has settled will re-examine their settlement. I think it is incumbent upon future generations\u2014and I mihi to the rangatahi who are in attendance here today\u2014that they do revisit these Treaty settlements. There are issues like relativity, which will be difficult to really achieve until every single iwi has settled their claims. I would put it this way: it would be difficult to express relativity between a settlement made 20 years ago and one made today. There are mechanisms within each of those settlements\u2014for example, the purchase of Crown properties. I would certainly want to be paying land prices of 20 years ago rather than land prices today. That contributes to the relativity of each individual claim. I think it will be one that will be raised in the future. I will not go so far as to say that this claim is not full and final. That is for the lawyers to decide in the future. But I would suggest to each and every rangatahi in the gallery today that they should take note of these proceedings. They should take note and remember this day as a special day, but one that also provides them with an opportunity to relook at where they are, in the future. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000129\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a434482b-7ac1-4862-9ce7-13e63289dee3\u0022\u003EI want to also mention the cultural redress items within this settlement. The statutory acknowledgments mentioned by my colleague Louisa Wall are very good instruments, I believe. However, I think they could be extended further into the future than they are. Also, the deeds of recognition provide a multitude of management mechanisms over certain land as well. The letters of introduction are a very important part of developing relationships, moving into the future. We have already heard from the Hon Nanaia Mahuta about the strong relationship-building capability of Ng\u0101ti Koroki Kahukura. These letters are important, but they provide an opportunity that can be fully utilised only from the point of view of the receiver of the letter. What I am saying in that is that I encourage those ministries, those departments, to actually put real effort into making good relationships with Ng\u0101ti Koroki Kahukura. From my experience, that is not always the case. N\u014D reira, ka mutu taku k\u014Drero i konei, otir\u0101, kai te mi\u2019i atu an\u014D ki a koutou Ng\u0101ti Korok\u012B Kahukura m\u014D \u014D koutou kaha kia \u2019ara mai m\u014D t\u0113nei r\u0101 whakahirahira, t\u0113nei te mi\u2019i atu ki a koutou katoa, oti noa puta noa i Te W\u2019are nei, t\u0113n\u0101 t\u0101tau.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000130\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a434482b-7ac1-4862-9ce7-13e63289dee3\u0022\u003EN\u014D reira, ka mutu taku k\u014Drero i konei, otir\u0101, kai te mi\u2019i atu an\u014D ki a koutou Ng\u0101ti Korok\u012B Kahukura m\u014D \u014D koutou kaha kia \u2019ara mai m\u014D t\u0113nei r\u0101 whakahirahira, t\u0113nei te mi\u2019i atu ki a koutou katoa, oti noa puta noa i Te W\u2019are nei, t\u0113n\u0101 t\u0101tau.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000131\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a434482b-7ac1-4862-9ce7-13e63289dee3\u0022\u003E[So I conclude my contribution here but, at the same time, acknowledge you once again, Ng\u0101ti Korok\u012B Kahukura, for your efforts to come here for this important day. I congratulate you and thank us all, as well, throughout this House.]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002298dbeffa-e059-49d5-8bbf-579cbaead9a3\u0022 data-id=\u0022624f9de3cb4342a2847b21d0b6921899\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000132\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002298dbeffa-e059-49d5-8bbf-579cbaead9a3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022624f9de3cb4342a2847b21d0b6921899\u0022\u003ESCOTT SIMPSON (National\u2014Coromandel):\u003C/span\u003E As a P\u0101keh\u0101 New Zealander it gives me enormous pleasure and pride to be the last speaker in this momentous, historic debate. I wish to greet those who have come from so far to be here today to witness what is a momentous step forward, not just for the iwi but for all New Zealanders, and part of an ongoing programme of Treaty settlements. I wish to acknowledge the remarkable hard work and spirit of energy that the Minister for Treaty of Waitangi Negotiations, the Hon Chris Finlayson, brings to these settlement negotiations.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000133\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002298dbeffa-e059-49d5-8bbf-579cbaead9a3\u0022\u003EI wish to briefly acknowledge those who have contributed so much in terms of negotiating this settlement, which is of such significance. It is a way forward, and it is a way forward that acknowledges those who have gone before. And so, as we come to the conclusion of this formal debate and the passing of this special piece of legislation, it is my absolute pleasure to commend the bill to the House and to the country. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000134\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002298dbeffa-e059-49d5-8bbf-579cbaead9a3\u0022\u003EBill read a third time.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000135\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002298dbeffa-e059-49d5-8bbf-579cbaead9a3\u0022\u003EWaiata\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n    \u003C/div\u003E\n    \u003Cdiv class=\u0022HpsHansard\u0022\u003E\n      \u003Cp\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsProceedingHeading\u0022\u003EBills\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000136\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u0022d08fbc54e21a4d038f8e3460ce4b972f\u0022\u003ENg\u0101ti Hau\u0101 Claims Settlement Bill\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000137\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u0022a21a2229f58f4bd897f9ae741cdc6d8a\u0022\u003EThird Reading\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002241146229-4d11-415b-a4ac-f4e2b923e95d\u0022 data-id=\u00222604585385784a6287c63ebbe415eb69\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000138\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002241146229-4d11-415b-a4ac-f4e2b923e95d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00222604585385784a6287c63ebbe415eb69\u0022\u003EHon CHRISTOPHER FINLAYSON (Minister for Treaty of Waitangi Negotiations):\u003C/span\u003E I move, That the Ng\u0101ti Hau\u0101 Claims Settlement Bill be now read a third time. I want to welcome the Tumuaki, the people of Ng\u0101ti Hau\u0101, and their supporters to this great occasion, the third reading of their bill. Nau mai haere mai ki t\u0113nei Whare o t\u0101tou. I greet those watching and listening elsewhere, and, of course, I want to acknowledge the people of Ng\u0101ti Hau\u0101 who have since passed on and cannot be here today to mark this achievement: moe mai r\u0101. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000139\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002241146229-4d11-415b-a4ac-f4e2b923e95d\u0022\u003EToday is a very important day in the history of Ng\u0101ti Hau\u0101 and this country, as we settle this great iwi\u2019s remaining non-raupatu historical claims. The settlement represents the culmination of six generations of work, beginning with the rangatira W\u012Bremu Tamihana Tarap\u012Bpipi Te Waharoa and continuing today with the actions of \u0100naru Thompson, the Tumuaki of Ng\u0101ti Hau\u0101. The Crown recognises the long and heavy burden this iwi has shouldered in pursuing justice for the wrongs of the Crown, so I congratulate them on their decision to settle their claims against the Crown, and it is my hope that the settlement heralds the beginning of a new relationship between the Crown and Ng\u0101ti Hau\u0101 based on the principles of the Treaty. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000140\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002241146229-4d11-415b-a4ac-f4e2b923e95d\u0022\u003EWe have arrived at this milestone because of the strong leadership and the commitment of \u0100naru Thompson, of Lance R\u0101pana, and the other trustees of the Ng\u0101ti Hau\u0101 Iwi Trust, as well as Mr Willie Te Aho, who worked on the settlement for Ng\u0101ti Hau\u0101. Ng\u0101ti Hau\u0101 approached the Crown in 2012 with a settlement proposal that demonstrated their vision and their pragmatism, and I still remember that day in Bill English\u2019s office where they said they wanted to get settlement in 7 months. It was a Tui advert kind of moment. They walked out and we said: \u201CYeah, right!\u201D. Well, a deed of settlement was signed just 7 months later because they were utterly committed to the task. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000141\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002241146229-4d11-415b-a4ac-f4e2b923e95d\u0022\u003EThis settlement is special not just because it is the fastest Treaty settlement; it is special because it has all the hallmarks of what the Treaty partners were aiming for in signing the Treaty of Waitangi in 1840. It is a partnership that is courageous, it is pragmatic, it is future-focused with strong leadership, and it is able to harness its collective strength to work for the mutual benefit of two peoples who do want to do something extraordinary, regardless of what people may hear in this Chamber from time to time. This settlement set a new standard in the resolution of Treaty claims. I want to thank my parliamentary colleagues past and present who have worked on this settlement: the Deputy Prime Minister, the Hon Kate Wilkinson, the Hon Louise Upston, the Hon Nanaia Mahuta, and\u2014without bringing you into the debate, Mr Assistant Speaker Tisch\u2014you, and the Hon Nick Smith. I want to thank the Matamata-Piako District Council, the Waip\u0101 District Council, and the Waikato Regional Council for their contributions to this settlement. I also want to acknowledge the various agencies of Government involved in the negotiations, who fully embraced what we were trying to achieve. I do not need to remind you, Mr Assistant Speaker, that Ng\u0101ti Hau\u0101 is an eastern Waikato iwi, represented in these negotiations by the Ng\u0101ti Hau\u0101 Iwi Trust. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000142\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002241146229-4d11-415b-a4ac-f4e2b923e95d\u0022\u003EThe people of Ng\u0101ti Hau\u0101 descend from their ancestor Hau\u0101 and they affiliate to the Tainui waka. Their customary rohe spans from Te Aroha and Te Rapa in the north, moving south to Te Weraiti and to Maungatautari. The deed of settlement is the final settlement of all historical Treaty claims of Ng\u0101ti Hau\u0101 resulting from acts or omissions by the Crown prior to 21 September 1992. The raupatu claims of Ng\u0101ti Hau\u0101 were settled through the Waikato-Tainui Raupatu Claims Settlement Act of 1995 and the Waikato-Tainui Raupatu Claims (Waikato River) Settlement Act. The settlement addresses the non-raupatu historical claims of Ng\u0101ti Hau\u0101 not settled by earlier settlements. The Crown recognised the mandate of the trust in December 2012 and, as I said, the agreement in principle was signed on 19 February 2013. The bill gives effect to the undertakings by the Crown in the deed signed by the parties on 24 May 2013. The settlement provides financial, commercial, and cultural redress. The settlement also acknowledges where Crown acts and omissions have breached the Treaty and its principles, including the operation and impact of the native land laws on Ng\u0101ti Hau\u0101, the Crown\u2019s purchase of Ng\u0101ti Hau\u0101 land in disregard of the collective decision of the owners not to sell, and the cumulative effect of the Crown\u2019s actions and omissions, leaving Ng\u0101ti Hau\u0101 with insufficient land for their present and their future needs. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000143\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002241146229-4d11-415b-a4ac-f4e2b923e95d\u0022\u003EThe settlement acknowledges paramount chief W\u012Bremu Tamihana\u2019s historical fight for justice in the wake of the Waikato war and raupatu. On several occasions he petitioned Parliament, detailing the injustice of the war, to seek recognition for the harm done to his people, and to find a pragmatic way to move forward. In his third and final petition Tamihana referred to his great darkness and sorrow of heart, and stated that he had travelled to Wellington in the hope that the great weight upon him might be lifted. Following his death, his second son carried on his fight for justice. The role of tumuaki is a historic role and it is a hereditary role. It encompasses significant political and spiritual functions for Ng\u0101ti Hau\u0101 and the Kingitanga, and it is pivotal to the Ng\u0101ti Hau\u0101 identity. W\u012Bremu Tamihana and successive tumuaki sought a pragmatic way forward on behalf of their people, so I am honoured to stand in this House and work with other members to make amends for the past and to move forward into the future. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000144\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002241146229-4d11-415b-a4ac-f4e2b923e95d\u0022\u003EThe deed of settlement envisages a new, mutually mana-enhancing relationship between the tumuaki and the Crown. In setting out to achieve a new relationship, the settlement provides unique redress that includes meetings with the Crown, the tumuaki, and Ng\u0101ti Hau\u0101 to occur on an annual basis. A special feature of the settlement is a relationship agreement between Ng\u0101ti Hau\u0101, the Department of Internal Affairs, and Te Papa in respect of the restoration and protection of Te Kauhanganui o Mahuta. This is a whare taonga and it is a monument at that beautiful Rukumoana Marae, dedicated to the establishment of the M\u0101ori Parliament, and it holds a very impressive collection of taonga. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000145\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002241146229-4d11-415b-a4ac-f4e2b923e95d\u0022\u003EThe loss Ng\u0101ti Hau\u0101 suffered can never be fully compensated for by the Crown, and much of what was lost simply cannot be returned. However, the people of Ng\u0101ti Hau\u0101 have graciously agreed to accept the redress contained in the deed of settlement, and in so doing I acknowledge their generosity towards this land. I certainly do look forward to a strong relationship in the future. That is one of the reasons why this Government has established a Post Settlement Commitments Unit, to ensure that the Crown keeps its promises\u2014not just tomorrow but in the years to come. I can say this: the National Party and the Labour Party understand the importance of this because they have experience in Government, and down through the generations successive Governments of whatever hue have done their best to address these issues. I think of names like Ngata, Hanan, Rata, Horomia\u2014whose book by a good National Party person was launched last night\u2014Graham, Bolger, and Cullen. These are people who, regardless of political affiliation, have done their best to address these issues. There are those who can simply snipe on the sidelines, because that is all they have to offer. They may be very pleased with their moral superiority, but actually they contribute nothing; they never do. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000146\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002241146229-4d11-415b-a4ac-f4e2b923e95d\u0022\u003ETomorrow we hold the Waikato-Waip\u0101 River iwi fora and both sides, in the language of the diplomats, are going to have a full and frank discussion. I will be meeting with Maniapoto, Waikato-Tainui, Raukawa, and other iwi, and we will be addressing issues arising out of their settlements over the river, and other matters. It will not be, quite frankly, a \u201CKumbaya\u201D love-in. There will be some pretty straight talking. But that is as it should be\u2014straight talking on both sides, because both sides want this to work. It is all very well to come down here and snipe and exhibit one\u2019s great moral superiority. But that means nothing. The proof of the pudding is in this kind of meeting, as both parties understand it. I commend the bill to the House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00220e7e8da2-a6a1-41bb-aeb0-a49be255a293\u0022 data-id=\u00222785802540ab41eea33fe25381e3cea2\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000147\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220e7e8da2-a6a1-41bb-aeb0-a49be255a293\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00222785802540ab41eea33fe25381e3cea2\u0022\u003EHon NANAIA MAHUTA (Labour\u2014Hauraki-Waikato):\u003C/span\u003E Anei an\u014D te pai te \u0101huareka te nohotahi o ng\u0101 t\u0113ina me ng\u0101 tu\u0101kana i raro i te whakaaro kotahi. N\u014D reira, e Te Tumuaki, koutou o Ng\u0101ti Hau\u0101, kei reira te nako o ng\u0101 taonga i waihotia ki waenganui i a koutou m\u014D t\u0101tou o Waikato, taua taonga o te whakapono. T\u0113n\u0101, k\u0101re pea e tino m\u0101rama ng\u0101 tokomaha o t\u0113nei Whare ki ng\u0101 hua \u014D t\u0101 koutou t\u016Btukitanga ker\u0113me. Te \u0101huatanga o Te Kaipupuru o te taonga me ng\u0101 mahi hei whakaw\u0101hi i taua \u0101huatanga, kei runga i a koutou, i a Ng\u0101ti Haua t\u0113r\u0101, te w\u0101hanga ki te pire, ar\u0101, ng\u0101 k\u014Drero e p\u0101 ana ki ng\u0101 tiaki i t\u014D t\u0101tou Tumuaki, ng\u0101 w\u0101hanga katoa o taua mahi, te \u0101huatanga ki t\u014D t\u0101tou Kauhanganui me \u0113r\u0101 wh\u0101inga o ng\u0101 m\u0101tua t\u016Bpuna ki te mana motuhake M\u0101ori, taua taonga m\u014D t\u0101tou katoa te motu e wh\u0101ia ana i t\u0113r\u0101 hiahia. Me te m\u014Dhio an\u014D, kei roto, kei waenganui i a koutou me ng\u0101 whakatipuranga ng\u0101 k\u014Drero h\u014Dhonu e p\u0101 ana ki taua wh\u0101inga o te here i \u014D t\u0101tou iwi ki t\u0113nei taonga o Te K\u012Bngitanga. Pai k\u0113 kia waihotia \u0113tehi o ng\u0101 whakam\u0101rama ki roto i te reo P\u0101keh\u0101 \u0113ngari, ko te nuinga o ng\u0101 k\u014Drero ka waihotia ki roto i te kokonga o te ng\u0101kau. N\u014D reira, kei a koutou t\u0113r\u0101 Ng\u0101ti Hau\u0101. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000148\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220e7e8da2-a6a1-41bb-aeb0-a49be255a293\u0022\u003EE tika ana me mihi atu ki Te Minita me te \u016B o t\u014Dna kaha ki t\u0113nei hiahia kia tutuki ng\u0101 ker\u0113me tiriti. \u0112hara t\u014Dna huarahi he huarahi m\u0101m\u0101. E p\u0101t\u014Dt\u014D te tokomaha i runga i t\u014Dna kuaha me ng\u0101 k\u014Drero hei wero atu ki a ia i mua, i muri hoki. Pai k\u0113 t\u0113r\u0101! Koi n\u0101 te \u0101huatanga o t\u0113nei mahi \u0113ngari, he k\u014Drero poto i roto i t\u014D t\u0101tou nei Reo M\u0101ori m\u014D taua \u0101huatanga, te maha o ng\u0101 hua o t\u0113nei tutukitanga kei roto i te kokonga o te ng\u0101kau, kua kite au i t\u0113r\u0101! Waimarie au, i tae atu ki t\u0113r\u0101 marae o Rukumoana m\u014D te hainatanga o t\u0101 koutou tutukitanga, me te m\u012Bharo an\u014D ki te kite i te tokomaha o ng\u0101 rangatahi i puta mai me \u014D r\u0101tou koa, \u014D r\u0101tou hari ki te whakaputa whakaaro ki mua i te aroaro o te iwi i taua w\u0101. Waimarie m\u0101tou ki te kite i t\u0113r\u0101!\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000149\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220e7e8da2-a6a1-41bb-aeb0-a49be255a293\u0022\u003E[How pleasant and nice it is for the younger and elder brethren to live together in unison. And so to you, the Head, and you of Ng\u0101ti Hau\u0101, the angst over the effects left amongst you for us of Waikato is there in that treasure of faith. Perhaps, not a lot of this House are very clear about the outcomes of your settlement claim in regards to the situation of the keeper of effects and operational functions to devolve that situation. That responsibility is on you, Ng\u0101ti Hau\u0101, in so far as the part relating to the bill\u2014in other words, the details about protecting our Head, all parts of that function; the situation relating to our trustee; and those ancestral forefathers\u2019 objectives in terms of M\u0101ori autonomy\u2014that treasure for us all of the nation, who are seeking that desire. I am quite aware that you have amongst you and the following generations some deep knowledge about the aspiration of strengthening the connections of our people to our prized treasure, the K\u012Bngitanga. It is better that some explanations be left in English, but most of it should be left in the corners of the heart. So that is over to you, Ng\u0101ti Hau\u0101. That is apt. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000150\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220e7e8da2-a6a1-41bb-aeb0-a49be255a293\u0022\u003EI acknowledge the Minister and the strength of his commitment to settle Treaty claims. His path is not an easy one. Many will be knocking on his door with remarks that will challenge him directly or indirectly. That is fine. It is the nature of this job, but a brief comment about it in M\u0101ori. Many outcomes of this settlement are in the corners of the heart. I witnessed that. Luckily, for me, I got to the signing of your settlement at that marae of Rukumoana and was amazed, once again, to see how many young people appeared with their elation and delight, keen to express their views before the tribe on that occasion. We were fortunate to witness that.]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000151\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220e7e8da2-a6a1-41bb-aeb0-a49be255a293\u0022\u003EMr Assistant Speaker Tisch, like you, as the local member, and like my friend Sue Moroney, who lives in Tauwhare, as you well know, we are very pleased to be able to support the passage of this particular bill. There is so much more to it than what we can say on paper, but let it be known that the aspirations of Ng\u0101ti Hau\u0101\u2014as you too would agree, Minister Finlayson\u2014like those of Ng\u0101ti Koroki Kahukura, are aspirations that have been forged over a long period of time. In fact, their settlement experience has spanned some 20 years in relation to the Waikato settlement, the raupatu settlement, and the river settlement, so I am absolutely confident that the nature of the negotiating conversation that you had with both Ng\u0101ti Hau\u0101 and Ng\u0101ti Koroki Kahukura brought with it that 20 years of experience and expectation of what could be achieved. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000152\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220e7e8da2-a6a1-41bb-aeb0-a49be255a293\u0022\u003EWe have to consider that within the context of what is happening within the broader review of Waikato-Tainui. They are reviewing the governance of the entity. The two settlements that have been reached today will undoubtedly put greater expectations on how Waikato-Tainui become relevant today and tomorrow to the aspirations of Hau\u0101 and Koroki Kahukura within the Waikato iwi collective, as it can actually achieve far greater things now that these discrete and important settlements have been achieved.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000153\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220e7e8da2-a6a1-41bb-aeb0-a49be255a293\u0022\u003ECan I say that this was a very speedy settlement. Everybody gasped at the thought of having such a fast settlement put through, but, actually, all the elements are right there. I had the pleasure of attending some of the hui that were held in Ng\u0101ti Hau\u0101, as a lot of extensive discussions were happening around how to form the marae and the hap\u016B within Hau\u0101 in relation to the settlement, in relation to what was happening back in Waikato, and in relation to the future opportunities the settlement provided to the people of Hau\u0101. There would be none short for hui, which were held on a fairly regular basis\u2014around about 60 people turning up. Anybody who goes to their own marae committee meeting knows that is a huge feat in some communities, but that was a regular kind of expectation within Hau\u0101. So that gave me great confidence that, despite the speed at which this settlement was reached, the intent had probably spanned a far longer period of time with a greater maturity of conversation about the intent of outcome. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000154\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220e7e8da2-a6a1-41bb-aeb0-a49be255a293\u0022\u003EThe rangatahi in Hau\u0101 in particular have a beautiful kura kaupapa there that holds on to the many rich and vibrant stories, as well as the local schools. We can only but use that as an opportunity to say here are the hallmarks of opportunity arising out of settlements when we have the ability for Hau\u0101 to not only have their rights and interests recognised within their rohe but to be able to tell those stories through the education system. There was a time there when our own local histories were never told. Now it is an absolute reality and expectation of a modern education system, and we see examples of that amongst Hau\u0101.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000155\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220e7e8da2-a6a1-41bb-aeb0-a49be255a293\u0022\u003EI wanted to make a brief comment on the letters of introduction because, Minister, you too highlighted that point. It is an opportunity to forge a new type of relationship with Government departments. Many iwi have come to this House and said: \u201CWell, the faces on the other side of the table change on a fairly regular basis, but we are always the same face on this side of the table.\u201D One might only hope and expect that the continuity of knowledge that is transmitted from iwi to the Crown in terms of monitoring against expectations and the terms of settlements can be retained within the post-settlement unit. I am sure that is the expectation of Hau\u0101. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000156\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220e7e8da2-a6a1-41bb-aeb0-a49be255a293\u0022\u003EThe ability to restore Te Kauwhanganui at this particular point in time is a comment that I really want to focus on. On 20 December we will be celebrating 20 years since the Waikato-Tainui raupatu settlement was achieved. Much of the contribution of the elements of that settlement were shaped by many of the kaum\u0101tua who are from Hau\u0101, but Te Kauwhanganui in particular is the name right now of the modern governing house, if you like, of Waikato-Tainui. The relevance is not lost on me that as the modernising of Waikato-Tainui\u2019s governance structure and the gifting back of the name to Hau\u0101 happens over this period of time, so too will the restoration of Te Kauwhanganui be happening. I think it is absolutely coming together at the right time for the right reasons. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000157\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220e7e8da2-a6a1-41bb-aeb0-a49be255a293\u0022\u003ECan I say that within Te Kauwhanganui there is a rich history of all the parliamentary-type meetings that occurred since the establishment of that particular whare. I hope that some of the future relationships in terms of the national archives and in terms of the restoration of significant historical documents of nationwide significance can be the type of partnership that we might see out of this particular settlement. This is a small and discrete settlement. It is one that adds value to what Hau\u0101 is already doing, but it also raises expectations within a community where Hau\u0101 engages with no less than four district councils and a regional council.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000158\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220e7e8da2-a6a1-41bb-aeb0-a49be255a293\u0022\u003EIt also leverages for Hau\u0101 a real opportunity to have a say in the ongoing preservation of, and caring for, the environment: the Hauraki Gulf; the Sea Change project, an integrated marine plan where the Waihou flows into the Hauraki; the integrated river-catchment plan where Hau\u0101 have many vested interests; the ongoing care of reserves and conservation areas where Hau\u0101 have many vested interests; and the ongoing care of reserves and conservation areas where Hau\u0101 absolutely assert their connection and relationship with the lands around them. Hau\u0101 is a place where rich horticultural activity has always occurred and will continue to occur. I hope that, as a culmination of this particular settlement, we will once again continue to see Hau\u0101 thrive and prosper in such a way that the next generation knows that it has had great t\u016Bpuna who have made great tracks for them to follow.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000159\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220e7e8da2-a6a1-41bb-aeb0-a49be255a293\u0022\u003EN\u014D reira, i raro i t\u0113r\u0101 paku korero, e Te Tumuaki, ka waihotia i mua i t\u014D aroaro ki t\u014D iwi i t\u0113nei w\u0101, hei t\u0101piri atu ki t\u0113r\u0101 o ng\u0101 tino wh\u0101inga, kia ea t\u0113r\u0101 hiahia, te mana motuhake o Te Iwi M\u0101ori i t\u0113nei w\u0101, t\u0113n\u0101 koutou katoa.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000160\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220e7e8da2-a6a1-41bb-aeb0-a49be255a293\u0022\u003E[And so further to that brief statement to you, the Head, I leave it before the tribe at this point in time, and add it to the other one of the key objectives to achieve autonomy for M\u0101oridom in this time frame. Thank you. My appreciation to you all.]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002229c236aa-2283-4690-9a84-aa865404bb61\u0022 data-id=\u0022751b3a90beb9497e90636d53dab2aec2\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000161\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002229c236aa-2283-4690-9a84-aa865404bb61\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022751b3a90beb9497e90636d53dab2aec2\u0022\u003ENUK KORAKO (National):\u003C/span\u003E E Te Mana Whakaw\u0101, \u0101, t\u0113n\u0101 koe. Ka tangi t\u012B, ka rua t\u012B, ka noho mai te tawhiti t\u014Dr\u0113r\u0113, ka raun\u0101, ka raun\u0101, ka noho mai te k\u012Bw\u012B, k\u012Bw\u012B he p\u014Dh\u0113 waitakitaki n\u014D p\u012B, n\u014D p\u0101 ka huria mai. Kei hea ana whet\u016B, kei hea te m\u0101rama k\u014Dt\u012Bt\u012B au\u0113! R\u0113rere r\u0101 i ruka i te pekapeka t\u014Droro w\u012Bw\u012B, w\u0101w\u0101 eke, eke, kia m\u0101nu, kia tau, tihei mauri ora! \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000162\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002229c236aa-2283-4690-9a84-aa865404bb61\u0022\u003EKo Kaitahu t\u0113nei. T\u0113n\u0101 koutou, e ka mihi. Te Ati Awa Toa Rangatira mana whenua, ka mihi. N\u014D reira, t\u0113n\u0101 koutou e ng\u0101 manuhiri o tu\u0101raki o te iwi o Ng\u0101ti Haua o Waikato. E mihi nei, e tangi nei n\u014D reira, t\u0113n\u0101 koutou, t\u0113n\u0101 koutou e mihi atu ki a koutou katoa.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000163\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002229c236aa-2283-4690-9a84-aa865404bb61\u0022\u003E[Thank you, Mr Assistant Speaker. One fantail, two fantails remain, hovering at a distance, circling, circling. The k\u012Bw\u012B remains. The k\u012Bw\u012B settles. It is night, a water barrier, a barrier of sorts surrounds it. Where are its stars and the nomadic moon? Alas! Fly up on the branch, stretch out, float up, up, up, settle. Behold! It is the breath of life!\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000164\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002229c236aa-2283-4690-9a84-aa865404bb61\u0022\u003EThis is Kaitahu. Greetings to you collectively. I acknowledge the indigenous authority here Te \u0100ti Awa Toa Rangatira. Greetings and welcome to you, the visitors from afar, Ng\u0101ti Hau\u0101 of Waikato. I salute and grieve here for you. So acknowledgments, greetings, and welcome to you all.]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000165\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002229c236aa-2283-4690-9a84-aa865404bb61\u0022\u003EIt is an honour to stand in this House to speak on the Ng\u0101ti Hau\u0101 Claims Settlement Bill. Ng\u0101ti Hau\u0101 has a special place in the history of M\u0101ori, the history of the K\u012Bngitanga movement, and, therefore, the history of our nation. It was a Ng\u0101ti Hau\u0101 leader W\u012Bremu Tamihana, the first Tumuaki or kingmaker, who placed the Bible on the head of Te Wherowhero to anoint him as king. That tradition continues to this day, and I acknowledge the presence of the current Tumuaki \u0100naru Thompson, who anointed K\u012Bngi Tuheitia in the same way. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000166\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002229c236aa-2283-4690-9a84-aa865404bb61\u0022\u003EIt was fitting that the deed of settlement was signed on the 148th anniversary of one of W\u012Bremu Tamihana\u2019s petitions asking the Crown to redress confiscations of land from Ng\u0101ti Hau\u0101. It stands as a tragedy of our history that no attempt was made to provide this redress when it was asked for. In fact, the Crown went on to commit further breaches of the Treaty, including Public Works seizures of land in 1951. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000167\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002229c236aa-2283-4690-9a84-aa865404bb61\u0022\u003EThe deed of settlement that this bill gives legal power to seeks to put right these wrongs. It cannot fully address the loss that the people of Ng\u0101ti Hau\u0101 suffered. As Minister Finlayson said, your acceptance of this settlement is an act of generosity. Although it has already been recognised during the second reading of this bill, I want to acknowledge the work of the M\u0101ori Affairs Committee of the 50th Parliament, and the chair, the Hon Tau Henare. I also want to acknowledge here in this House today my parliamentary colleagues who were also on that M\u0101ori Affairs Committee of the 50th Parliament. One of the hallmarks of the M\u0101ori Affairs Committee is the collegiality of that committee, and the fact that we like to think we park everything\u2014including political affiliations\u2014at the door, and then we go into that room and do what is best for M\u0101ori. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000168\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002229c236aa-2283-4690-9a84-aa865404bb61\u0022\u003EThe committee considered this bill before I took my place as a member of Parliament, so I have not had the chance to consider the bill in the same depth as some of my colleagues and those who have actually come before me. But in doing my research, I have been impressed by the universal acknowledgment of the leadership of Ng\u0101ti Hau\u0101\u2014the leadership that they have demonstrated throughout this process. The Minister has spoken of his surprise at the speed with which the settlement was concluded, as a result of the excellent and focused negotiations undertaken by Ng\u0101ti Hau\u0101. That was the true essence and the reason for why it was concluded, in a lot of ways. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000169\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002229c236aa-2283-4690-9a84-aa865404bb61\u0022\u003EIssues and tensions can easily arise when Treaty claims overlap, but I note that Te Poari Matua o Raukawa\u2014the Ng\u0101ti Raukawa Settlement Trust\u2014put in a submission on this bill, and they did that to specifically show their support for Ng\u0101ti Hau\u0101. Their submission acknowledges the open and respectful way Ng\u0101ti Hau\u0101 engaged with them and the way that this strengthened the relationship between Ng\u0101ti Hau\u0101 and Ng\u0101ti Raukawa. This again demonstrates the leadership Ng\u0101ti Hau\u0101 has shown throughout this process. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000170\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002229c236aa-2283-4690-9a84-aa865404bb61\u0022\u003EThis Treaty settlement bill marks the end of the grievance process. But more than an end, it is indeed a beginning. As we in Ng\u0101i Tahu know from our own experience, the hard work starts after the settlement is complete. Now it is about realising the economic potential that this settlement gives you and your people. It has taken diligence, it has taken resolve, and it has taken hard work to get to this point. It will take more of the same to move forward from here, but I can see that Ng\u0101ti Hau\u0101 is in good hands. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000171\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002229c236aa-2283-4690-9a84-aa865404bb61\u0022\u003EFinally, again, there is the recognition of this Government throughout not just this claim settlement process, but right across the settlements that have been done to date under this Government. There is a really interesting proverb\u2014I would like to say it comes from Ng\u0101i Tahu, but it does not\u2014and it is: \u201CAfter all that was said and done, there was more said than done.\u201D, and e koutou m\u0101 this is not what we have done. This Government has gone out and done the work\u2014implemented it\u2014and this is just one of the amazing results that have been achieved. I will give you a Ng\u0101i Tahu proverb: \u201CM\u014D t\u0101tou, \u0101, m\u014D ka uri \u0101 muri ake nei.\u201D [It is for us and for the generations that follow.]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000172\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002229c236aa-2283-4690-9a84-aa865404bb61\u0022\u003EThat is for us and our children. I leave you with that, Ng\u0101ti Hau\u0101. This is a wonderful opportunity\u2014the third reading of this bill and the acceptance that you can move forward. N\u014D reira, e koutou m\u0101, ng\u0101 k\u0101k\u0101 waha nui \u014D r\u0101tou m\u0101, r\u0101tou ki a r\u0101tou, t\u0101tou ki a t\u0101tou. N\u014D reira, t\u0113n\u0101 koutou, e mihi, e mihi atu ki a koutou katoa.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000173\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002229c236aa-2283-4690-9a84-aa865404bb61\u0022\u003E[Therefore, to you, the great orators of those who have departed, allow them to remain there amongst themselves, while we remain here amongst ourselves. Salutations to you all.]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000174\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002229c236aa-2283-4690-9a84-aa865404bb61\u0022\u003EE Te Mana Whakaw\u0101 [Mr Assistant Speaker], I commend this bill to the House. Kia ora.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022a434482b-7ac1-4862-9ce7-13e63289dee3\u0022 data-id=\u0022b7704a2895a04f4296b66d1807790688\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000175\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a434482b-7ac1-4862-9ce7-13e63289dee3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022b7704a2895a04f4296b66d1807790688\u0022\u003EADRIAN RURAWHE (Labour\u2014Te Tai Hau\u0101uru):\u003C/span\u003E K\u0101ti r\u0101, t\u0113n\u0101 an\u014D t\u0101tou. Otir\u0101, anei a\u2019au e tuku mi\u2019i atu ki a Ng\u0101ti Hau\u0101 kua tae mai i t\u0113nei r\u0101 w\u2019akahirahira m\u014D t\u0113nei p\u0101nuitanga o t\u0113nei pire. N\u014D reira, t\u0113nei te mi\u2019i atu ki a koutou, ki a koe an\u014D hoki e Te Tumuaki, t\u0113nei hoki te mihi ki a koe i roto i ng\u0101 manaakitanga o r\u0101tou m\u0101 i te w\u0101\u2019i ngaro. E tika hoki kia huri atu ki te mi\u2019i atu an\u014D ki te \u0101\u2019uatanga ki a r\u0101tou m\u0101 kua wehe atu. N\u014D reira, r\u0101tou katoa anei a\u2019au te tuku atu te reo poroporoaki ki a r\u0101tou. N\u014D reira, ki a t\u0101tou katoa, ng\u0101 mema katoa o Te W\u2019are nei, t\u0113nei te mi\u2019i atu. N\u014D reira, e Te M\u0101ngai o te W\u2019are, t\u0113n\u0101 koe. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000176\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a434482b-7ac1-4862-9ce7-13e63289dee3\u0022\u003E[Well, greetings to us once again, but at the same time, here I am acknowledging Ng\u0101ti Hau\u0101, who have arrived here on this important day for the reading of this bill. So I salute you collectively and you, as well, the Head. I particularly acknowledge you through the generosity of those in the unseen realm. It is appropriate, as well, that I turn to acknowledge the circumstances that pertain to them and others who have departed. I therefore farewell them. To us, all members of this House, I greet you, and so thank you, Mr Assistant Speaker of the House.]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000177\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a434482b-7ac1-4862-9ce7-13e63289dee3\u0022\u003EIt is indeed an honour to speak on this bill. I have read through the historical account in the deed of settlement, and what it highlights to me is the ongoing action of Ng\u0101ti Hau\u0101 to address the breaches of the Treaty of Waitangi. We have already heard from members about the actions of W\u012Bremu Tamihana. I want to pay attention particularly to the deeds of his son Tupu Taingakawa. Can I read an extract from the historical account: \u201CIn the early decades of the twentieth century Tupu Taingakawa continued to petition and protest for the rights of all M\u0101ori under the Treaty to be upheld by the Crown, securing nearly 30,000 signatures to one petition. In 1909 Tupu Taingakawa presented this petition to the Government. The Government denied the allegations levelled that the Crown had breached the Treaty of Waitangi, including through its confiscation of Waikato land during the 1860s.\u201D \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000178\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a434482b-7ac1-4862-9ce7-13e63289dee3\u0022\u003EIt carries on to say: \u201CWhen Mahuta died in 1912, his son, Te Rata, was anointed as King by Tupu Taingakawa as the Tumuaki. In 1914 Taingakawa and King Te Rata travelled to London in the hope of gaining redress for their grievances from the British Crown. The pair was introduced to King George V and Queen Mary but their appeal was referred back to the New Zealand Government. \u2026 In 1924 Tupu Taingakawa returned to London, this time in the company of the prophet Tahupotiki Wiremu Ratana. They were denied the opportunity to present their petition (signed by 34,000 people) to King George V but subsequently travelled to Geneva in the hope that the League of Nations would intervene to secure justice for the M\u0101ori people. The petition, along with a copy of the Treaty of Waitangi, and a huia feather and kiwi cloak, was deposited with the League of Nations by Tupu Taingakawa.\u201D \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000179\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a434482b-7ac1-4862-9ce7-13e63289dee3\u0022\u003EI mention these because they show ongoing action to address the breaches of the Treaty of Waitangi. It is an honour for me to stand and speak to this particular bill because of those connections between Tainui, the K\u012Bngitanga, and R\u0101tana. The name Tupu Taingakawa is very well-known in the place that I come from\u2014R\u0101tana. It is a huge-ish thing to get a petition of 30,000 people today, in 2014, with all of the technology that we have available to us. But imagine in 1909 a gentleman by the name of Tupu Taingakawa was able to collect 30,000 signatures, and to then again be part of another petition some 10 years later to collect another 34,000 signatures. This represented a huge number of the M\u0101ori population at that time, and it should be acknowledged in this House again that these petitions are finally being addressed today. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000180\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a434482b-7ac1-4862-9ce7-13e63289dee3\u0022\u003EI want to acknowledge the negotiators of this Treaty settlement. I want to acknowledge the tenacity, the fortitude, and the resilience of the Ng\u0101ti Hau\u0101 people, over a period of more than 160 years, to get to settlement today. I greet each and every one of you who has arrived here today for the reading of this bill. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000181\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a434482b-7ac1-4862-9ce7-13e63289dee3\u0022\u003EWithin the bill also are Crown acknowledgments and the apology, as every Treaty settlement bill has within them. The breaches that are acknowledged relate to the operation and impact of the native land laws, which undermine the traditional tribal structures of Ng\u0101ti Hau\u0101. It made their lands more susceptible to partition, fragmentation, and alienation. The Crown\u2019s purchase of over 1,400 acres of Ng\u0101ti Hau\u0101 land from individuals in the 20th century left the iwi, again, virtually landless. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000182\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a434482b-7ac1-4862-9ce7-13e63289dee3\u0022\u003EI stand here today, as I have in the previous readings, to acknowledge the work that the people of Ng\u0101ti Hau\u0101 have put into this settlement in addressing it, and, indeed, I have to say again\u2014as I have said on the two previous times that I have spoken in the House on Treaty settlement bills\u2014that this iwi has performed an act of generosity in settling this claim. It is, indeed, a start. I look forward to seeing the progress that Ng\u0101ti Hau\u0101 make for the benefit of their future generations. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000183\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a434482b-7ac1-4862-9ce7-13e63289dee3\u0022\u003EWithin this settlement there are, of course, commercial redress items, which are a beginning. It is a beginning because it is redress, not compensation. I think it is worthwhile that the House recognises the difference between the two. Redress gives the opportunity for iwi to receive a small financial redress within this act. It is but a fraction of what the compensation will be, and I would expect that Ng\u0101ti Hau\u0101 would have asked themselves the question whether it is worth going down this pathway. The fact that we are here means that they have answered yes. I suspect it is about the future generations, because this settlement will provide an opportunity to grow that asset, to provide a better future for Ng\u0101 Uri o Ng\u0101ti Hau\u0101. Finally, I want to acknowledge again all of the people who have come here today to celebrate the passing of this legislation into law.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000184\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a434482b-7ac1-4862-9ce7-13e63289dee3\u0022\u003E\u0100, n\u014D reira ki a koutou katoa, Ng\u0101ti Hau\u0101, otir\u0101, ki a koe an\u014D hoki e Te Tumuaki, anei a\u2019au e tuku mi\u2019i atu mai i taku P\u0101ti o Te R\u014Dp\u016B Reipa, otir\u0101, mai i t\u014Dku rohe, mai i t\u014Dku k\u0101inga me t\u014Dku w\u2019\u0101nau o R\u0101tana P\u0101 ki a koutou katoa, n\u014D reira, t\u0113n\u0101 t\u0101tou.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000185\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a434482b-7ac1-4862-9ce7-13e63289dee3\u0022\u003E[So, to all of you of Ng\u0101ti Hau\u0101, but at the same time to you, as well, the Head, I extend greetings to you and to us all from my Labour Party, but at the same time, from my electorate back home and from my R\u0101tana P\u0101 family. Thank you.]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022c3d9fd88-4715-419d-be08-e1c4eda7d09e\u0022 data-id=\u002266c781f1a407447281bb99388fcc40b0\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000186\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c3d9fd88-4715-419d-be08-e1c4eda7d09e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002266c781f1a407447281bb99388fcc40b0\u0022\u003EMARAMA FOX (Co-Leader\u2014M\u0101ori Party):\u003C/span\u003E T\u0113n\u0101 koe, e te Mana Whakaw\u0101. \u0100, mai ara r\u0101, mai ara r\u0101! Mai ara r\u0101 te rangi i runga nei, mai ara r\u0101 te papa i raro nei. Mai ara r\u0101 Te K\u0101hui Ariki, Te Kahui Tipua, Te K\u0101hui Tauira. Tuku ana, tuku ana. Tuku ana te reo kia rere. Tuku ana te take kia mau. \u016A e h\u0101, \u016B e h\u0101. \u016A e h\u0101 nuku, \u016B e h\u0101 rangi. \u016A e h\u0101 T\u0101ne-nui-\u0101-Rangi. T\u0101ne whakapiripiri n\u0101na te rangi i runga nei i tuku kia t\u016B h\u0101h\u0101, kia t\u016B k\u0113 \u0101na rangi. Ka tangi te hau, ka m\u0101tao, ka ao, ka awatea, t\u012Bhei mauri ora. Nei taku mihi maioha ki a koutou katoa. Ki a koutou e whakarongo mai ki ng\u0101 k\u014Drero e whakawhiti haere ana i roto i te Whare. \u0100, ko koutou t\u0113n\u0101 kua tutuki t\u0113nei kia tae ki t\u0113nei w\u0101 kia whakarite i te huarahi kei mua i a koutou. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000187\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c3d9fd88-4715-419d-be08-e1c4eda7d09e\u0022\u003E[Where has it come? Where has it come from? It has come from the Sky Father above and Mother Earth below here. It has come from the cluster of aristocracy, supernatural, and the pre-ordained. Release it, let it go. Allow the language unfettered licence to flow. Allow the purpose to be captured. Be resolute and unyielding on earth and in the stratosphere. The wind shrieks, it becomes intensely cold. Light comes, then the dawn. Behold! The breath of life! This is my affectionate salutation to all of you listening to the cross contributions flowing around the House; and that is you, as a collective, who have completed this and ensured that it arrives here at this point in time to consider the path that is before you.]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000188\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c3d9fd88-4715-419d-be08-e1c4eda7d09e\u0022\u003EEach time I listen to the claims in these settlement readings, they make me a little emotional. I admit that I shed a few tears. I struggle to hold in the pain of loss, the empathy of frustration, and also the bubbling and the tenacity of the mang\u014Dpare that drives us\u2014the drive that makes us more determined to work a little harder, to search a little longer, to push on to rectify the injustices and the atrocities that have been meted out to our people.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000189\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c3d9fd88-4715-419d-be08-e1c4eda7d09e\u0022\u003EIt is right and fitting that these bills, the Ng\u0101ti Koroki Kahukura Claims Settlement Bill and the Ng\u0101ti Hau\u0101 Claims Settlement Bill, receive their third readings on the same day. Ng\u0101ti Koroki and Ng\u0101ti Hau\u0101 are linked through geography, adjacent relationship of their rohe, and also through whakapapa. In standing to tautoko this bill, I acknowledge the uri of Ng\u0101ti Hau\u0101 kua tae tinana mai i t\u0113nei w\u0101\u2014those who have come to this House. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000190\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c3d9fd88-4715-419d-be08-e1c4eda7d09e\u0022\u003EWe pay tribute to all of those who descend from the eponymous ancestor, Hau\u0101\u2014Ng\u0101ti Te Oro, Ng\u0101ti Werewere, Ng\u0101ti Waenganui, Ng\u0101ti Te Rangitaupi, Ng\u0101ti Rangi Tawhaki. We draw on their vision, their optimism, and their faith in a future for all their mokopuna to benefit from. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000191\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c3d9fd88-4715-419d-be08-e1c4eda7d09e\u0022\u003EI say \u201Cfaith\u201D deliberately because on Monday night I was a in a debate with my fellow colleagues from New Zealand First and the Greens, discussing the opportunities for M\u0101ori representation that will emerge from the creation of a M\u0101ori ward in Taranaki. I say \u201Cfaith\u201D because, despite our celebration here today of this final reading of the settlement bill, from the comments on Monday night, we need to have some faith, because it is obvious to me that there is still much to do. On Monday night one of the locals came to me and talked on stage, and said that if M\u0101ori just tried a little harder, and if they just did their homework, they would find success in gaining positions in local government. It was an interesting argument, based on the view that everyone is born equal. There is nothing more challenging to that point of view than the tragic histories associated with our settlements. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000192\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c3d9fd88-4715-419d-be08-e1c4eda7d09e\u0022\u003EIn this settlement we retrace the impact of Treaty breaches from the 1860s onwards. The context for this bill is set out in the 1840s and 1850s, when the people of Ng\u0101ti Hau\u0101 were benefiting from a thriving economy\u2014an economy that was systematically destroyed. The bill tells of the direct and devious means employed to strip Ng\u0101ti Hau\u0101 of their fertile lands, rivers, and maunga. I feel like I have said this already today. During the invasion of the Waikato in 1863 and 1864 countless members of Ng\u0101ti Hau\u0101 were killed or wounded.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000193\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c3d9fd88-4715-419d-be08-e1c4eda7d09e\u0022\u003EIn 1865 the Crown confiscated a large area of Waikato land. The raupatu caused destitution within the Ng\u0101ti Hau\u0101 rohe and left them virtually landless. Until his death in 1866 W\u012Bremu Tamihana sought the return of Ng\u0101ti Hau\u0101 lands, a cause pursued by his son Tupu Taingakawa. By the 1880s private parties had acquired a large quantity of Ng\u0101ti Hau\u0101 land. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000194\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c3d9fd88-4715-419d-be08-e1c4eda7d09e\u0022\u003EThe alienation was exacerbated in the 19th and 20th centuries though public works takings for roading, railways, and schools, and for hydroelectric purposes. In the 1940s the land was taken for the aerodrome, for the war, after which there was a complete failure to return that land. Slowly, surely, and comprehensively the landscapes and waterways within the Ng\u0101ti Hau\u0101 rohe were forced out of their hands. The loss of land, of these taonga, undermined their social and traditional structures, removing their ability to exercise customary rights and responsibilities. The story of Ng\u0101ti Hau\u0101 has been told in various forms for other iwi across this nation. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000195\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c3d9fd88-4715-419d-be08-e1c4eda7d09e\u0022\u003EThis is not a matter of Ng\u0101ti Hau\u0101 just needing to try a little harder and do a little more homework. In actual fact, the clear and pragmatic approach that Ng\u0101ti Hau\u0101 have brought to their claim is inspirational. Ng\u0101ti Hau\u0101 co-lead negotiator Lance R\u0101pana revealed the secret to their success was the ability of the iwi to pull together 100 percent and move on as one. The concept of kotahitanga is one I am committed to, and Ng\u0101ti Hau\u0101\u2019s example is one that again gives me faith. Their hard work and unity, their ongoing pursuit of peace and justice as an iwi whakapono, is inspiring not just to iwi in Waikato and around the country but to all New Zealanders. The hurdles they have had to jump have been ongoing and massive. Surely, we have given, and they have given, more than they were required to give. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000196\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c3d9fd88-4715-419d-be08-e1c4eda7d09e\u0022\u003EAlthough the negotiations for this bill were one of the fastest on record, as has been explained, for Ng\u0101ti Hau\u0101, its passage began 150 years ago, instigated by their rangatira W\u012Bremu Tamihana. At this point I want to acknowledge all of those who have passed in the time it has taken to finally get to this point here. I acknowledge their lives and their commitment. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000197\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c3d9fd88-4715-419d-be08-e1c4eda7d09e\u0022\u003EDespite a long history of seeking a meaningful relationship with the Crown, and despite Ng\u0101ti Hau\u0101\u2019s insistence on peace and justice, the iwi has endured great prejudice at the hands of the Crown. This settlement acknowledges the wrongdoings of the Crown in this regard. In doing so, this settlement heralds a new chapter in the relationship between Ng\u0101ti Hau\u0101 and the Crown based on respect, mana, and the rangatiratanga of Ng\u0101ti Hau\u0101 and its leaders. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000198\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c3d9fd88-4715-419d-be08-e1c4eda7d09e\u0022\u003EThe settlement will recognise in law the importance of their relationship to their whenua. Ng\u0101ti Hau\u0101 will be involved in the co-management of the Waikato River within their area of interest as with Ng\u0101ti Koroki, through Waikato-Tainui. This and other redress included in the settlement package in no way fully compensates for the full extent of loss experienced by Ng\u0101ti Hau\u0101 at the hands of the Crown. However, I am profoundly moved and encouraged by the attitudes of Ng\u0101ti Hau\u0101 and, indeed, the spirit of settlement approached by the Crown. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000199\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c3d9fd88-4715-419d-be08-e1c4eda7d09e\u0022\u003EAt this point I want to acknowledge Minister Finlayson, who is held in high regard around the country. His pragmatic approach to honouring a pathway of partnership is one that we can take faith in for a future for our people. No one can say that the two partners entered into the relationship on an equal basis. The hardship, the suffering, and the loss incurred by Ng\u0101ti Hau\u0101 has been extreme. Their courage in moving forward is now on public record. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000200\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c3d9fd88-4715-419d-be08-e1c4eda7d09e\u0022\u003EJoy, tears, and applause greeted this settlement when it was signed in July last year. Today I stand to support the third reading of this bill with the same acclamation and praise. N\u014D reira, t\u0113n\u0101 koutou, t\u0113n\u0101 koutou, t\u0113n\u0101 koutou katoa.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00220ee528dc-7870-4553-95ed-5ec0cab60f07\u0022 data-id=\u0022e86e158d83f54f40bbf1b1b9e9b6b714\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000201\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220ee528dc-7870-4553-95ed-5ec0cab60f07\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022e86e158d83f54f40bbf1b1b9e9b6b714\u0022\u003ECATHERINE DELAHUNTY (Green):\u003C/span\u003E T\u0113n\u0101 koe, Mr Assistant Speaker. T\u0113n\u0101 koutou e te Whare. He mihi nui ki a Ng\u0101ti Hau\u0101, Te K\u012Bngitanga; he mihi nui ki Tainui me Te Kotahitanga o Ng\u0101ti Hau\u0101, he mihi nui.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000202\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220ee528dc-7870-4553-95ed-5ec0cab60f07\u0022\u003E[I extend a huge acknowledgment to Ng\u0101ti Hau\u0101, the King Movement, the collective of Ng\u0101ti Hau\u0101, a real mighty one.]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000203\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220ee528dc-7870-4553-95ed-5ec0cab60f07\u0022\u003EI would just like to acknowledge the people in the gallery, the people who have travelled from the Ng\u0101ti Hau\u0101 rohe down here today, and to say that the Green Party stands in respect and celebration of your achievement in this time of progress. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000204\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220ee528dc-7870-4553-95ed-5ec0cab60f07\u0022\u003EI am going to make a contribution that the Minister may describe as a \u201Cnothing\u201D contribution, the Green Party\u2019s contribution on this take, but actually I believe that in order to fulfil the vison of Te Tiriti o Waitangi all of our contributions are needed, all of our korero is valued, and all of our challenges are part of the story. So as we celebrate, we can also challenge, not out of moral superiority but out of respect for history and out of a recognition that we are in a political evolution towards a vision not yet fulfilled, but it is a vision that this iwi before us has contributed to generously on behalf of their people to my people. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000205\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220ee528dc-7870-4553-95ed-5ec0cab60f07\u0022\u003EI have to say as a P\u0101keh\u0101 that I feel very small today, not because the contribution is not important but because the history is quite overwhelming for me. I lived in Hauraki, on the edge of Ng\u0101ti Hau\u0101, and the history is overwhelming. Also I need to say that unlike the Prime Minister, who has a somewhat bizarre view of history, I do not believe that this country was settled peacefully and that the myths of the 1950s are useful any more. I think the history of Ng\u0101ti Hau\u0101 makes it pretty clear that colonial settlement was, from the 1840s on, a troubled and violent process, and that we cannot hold our heads up and say it was better than in other countries.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000206\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220ee528dc-7870-4553-95ed-5ec0cab60f07\u0022\u003EThe story of Ngati Hau\u0101, the recognition of what \u201Clandless\u201D means, is the story that absolutely refutes the view that somehow we have anything to be superior about in terms of the way in which Aotearoa was colonised. So today is a positive day for Ngati Hau\u0101, but the history is heavy and the need for challenge is ongoing. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000207\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220ee528dc-7870-4553-95ed-5ec0cab60f07\u0022\u003EI would like to also just acknowledge all of the parties in the efficient\u2014you could almost call it speed-dating, compared with some of the other settlements, but effective speed-dating whereby a genuine relationship was completed. But behind that there was a lot more\u2014many, many many years, which others have touched on, of deep and profound research, so that when Ngati Hau\u0101 came to the Crown they were ready with their objectives and the Crown was ready to hear them. So that is a credit to everybody. Fast can be effective. It was a credit to all who were involved. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000208\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220ee528dc-7870-4553-95ed-5ec0cab60f07\u0022\u003EI want to talk a little bit about the tupuna W\u012Bremu Tamihana Tarap\u012Bpipi and how his attempt to engage with the Crown left him dissatisfied. I am sure, however, that today he would be very proud of his own. And when we think about the sacredness of he maungarongo, covenant of peace, it is a challenge to all of us now, in 2014, that we need to respect the unfinished business. That is why the Greens are prepared to say that we do not believe in full and final settlement. We believe in the ongoing relationship. Te Tiriti o Waitangi is not a divorce; it is a marriage. It is quite important in marriage that we keep talking. Maybe in divorce you make the deal and walk away; but in marriage we keep talking\u2014hopefully. We keep laughing, we keep arguing, we keep challenging, but we keep communicating, with love and respect for each other. That is what the Greens would like to say about the importance of the ongoing right for tangata whenua to say: \u201CWe are not finished. We are not settled.\u201D, and that to me is a fair and just position. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000209\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220ee528dc-7870-4553-95ed-5ec0cab60f07\u0022\u003EThere are many aspects of this settlement that are interesting and important, and the history, particularly around the Public Works Act in the 20th century, needs to be acknowledged. Sometimes settlements are presented as a long way away, way back in the 19th century, but, in fact, there is a sustained and ongoing way in which\u2014maybe it was not direct raupatu, but it amounted to the same. So if we look at 1951 and the issues around the rohe, and particularly Waharoa and other places, we realise that the Public Works Act was an instrument of confiscation that needed to be challenged, and still does. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000210\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220ee528dc-7870-4553-95ed-5ec0cab60f07\u0022\u003EI am actually looking at a review of the Public Works Act because I believe that there should be something in there that makes it clear that no tangata whenua land can ever be taken again under public works. I think that is a critical issue. Patricia Grace\u2019s wh\u0101nau, Te \u0100tiawa, have experienced that, and others are facing threats of that. It is really, really important that, even if you win in the Environment Court, tangata whenua should not have to go there. That is an instrument of the past that should be silenced. It should be shut down and there should be a way in which that Act cannot be used for any further form of raupatu in our time, in our name. That is what I want to stand up for. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000211\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220ee528dc-7870-4553-95ed-5ec0cab60f07\u0022\u003EThere are very interesting issues within here. I would love to know what W\u012Bremu Tamihana would have thought of the latest Waitangi ruling where the Waitangi Tribunal makes it clear that M\u0101ori never ceded sovereignty in 1840. The Crown may not want to engage with this but, nevertheless, it is a profound and significant moment in the history of Aotearoa that the Waitangi Tribunal has ruled what tangata whenua have always known. So that has to be part of the picture when we are talking about settling things: recognition that something was never given away and that rangatiratanga was never ceded, and that the role of the K\u0101wana is a different role from the way in which the Crown in the last century or so has tried to present it. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000212\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220ee528dc-7870-4553-95ed-5ec0cab60f07\u0022\u003ESo for us in the Greens we are really interested in that conversation and we want to hear the voices of the descendants of W\u012Bremu Tamihana as to how they see that; what that means for them. This is a day of celebration but also a day to raise questions about where to from here. How do we interpret the current rulings based on past knowledge? How do we actually deal with these things? It is really relevant to situations referred to in the settlement around statutory authority and statutory overlay. I have been having a little look at that and having some conversation with some tangata whenua groups around the motu who are struggling post-settlement because, although the law is clear in the settlement, some of the local authorities are not as clear in their understanding of the world. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000213\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220ee528dc-7870-4553-95ed-5ec0cab60f07\u0022\u003EIt is reassuring that the Waikato region has M\u0101ori seats but, nevertheless, the regional and district councils have an obligation. I am pleased to hear about the post-settlement commitment because it is my culture that has to be brought on board. It is my culture, represented in councils, that has often been the block and the barrier to the genuine expression of Te Tiriti o Waitangi relationship. There is not much point, as Te Tau Ihu tangata whenua said to me that they were going to have to spend their Treaty settlement money fighting local authorities to get the Treaty settlement realised. That to me is a gross abuse\u2014that once the settlement is settled and supposedly final, they have to use their settlement money to go to court to persuade their local authorities to do the right thing by those elements of the Treaty settlement process. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000214\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220ee528dc-7870-4553-95ed-5ec0cab60f07\u0022\u003EI am more hopeful for Waikato. I am more hopeful. We have to be hopeful, but we have to be real about experience. The P\u0101keh\u0101 culture has tremendously sophisticated ways of resisting change. We also have a new generation who want change. So there are a lot of positive people out there who understand that this is a new era and a lot can be done. But there are also pockets of resistance. I think my colleague Marama Fox just mentioned a pocket of resistance, the myth of equality, and all the other myths. We really need to engage so that Ng\u0101ti Hau\u0101 can fully realise, through their relationship with the Department of Conservation, through their relationship with Heritage New Zealand, and through their relationship with the local authorities, the nature of Te Tiriti o Waitangi relationship in all its meaning. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000215\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220ee528dc-7870-4553-95ed-5ec0cab60f07\u0022\u003EI as a Green am confident that if Ng\u0101ti Hau\u0101 have the ability to express their rangatiratanga in the rohe, the rivers will be cleaner, the whenua will be healed, the mokopuna will have some kai to inherit\u2014all of the things that really matter, the real economy, which is our whenua, our awa, our moana. All of those things are better looked after if there is a full realisation of what is actually committed to in the settlement in terms of statutory overlay and authority. I know that the challenge then comes back to my people: make it real. But congratulations, he mihi nui ki a koutou katoa. We wish you all the very best and we will continue to find ways to stand beside you in the realisation of Te Tiriti.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022cba965bb-864f-4e06-99dc-6fcdfd007ad5\u0022 data-id=\u0022fb7a71bc6b9a44b1a213a1f3ae398377\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000216\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cba965bb-864f-4e06-99dc-6fcdfd007ad5\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022fb7a71bc6b9a44b1a213a1f3ae398377\u0022\u003EPITA PARAONE (NZ First):\u003C/span\u003E T\u0113n\u0101 koe. T\u0113n\u0101 hoki t\u0101tou e Te Whare nei me koutou i t\u016B ake i mua i a au ki te tuku atu i \u014D koutou whakaaro ki te kaupapa o te pire nei. E t\u0101tou m\u0101, wena te mea pai o t\u0113nei w\u0101hi! Ahakoa korekau ana koe e \u2018hakaae ki ng\u0101 k\u014Drero o \u0113tahi r\u014Dp\u016B i te mutunga o te r\u0101, n\u0101 r\u0101tou te k\u014Drero. \u0112ngari, i rongo au te \u0101huatanga o \u0113n\u0101 o ng\u0101 k\u014Drero a te kaik\u014Drero i t\u016B ake i mua i a au. Ki a au nei, e \u0101hua \u2018hakaiti ana i a ia ki a koutou n\u0101 te mea, n\u0101 koutou i \u2018hakaae atu ki te pire nei \u0113ngari n\u0101na i mea mai, \u2018E, k\u0101hore, \u0113hara k\u0113 i t\u0113tahi g k\u0101hore kau k\u0113 he pire mutunga. \u0112ngari waihotia! N\u0101n\u0101 w\u0113n\u0101 k\u014Drero! Horekau ia e \u2018hakararu i a ia \u0113ngari, w\u0113n\u0101 te mea pai o t\u0113nei w\u0101hi. \u0112ngari e t\u016B ake nei ki te tautoko i te pire ahakoa m\u014Dhio ana t\u0101tou, horekau i tino tau ki \u014D koutou hiahia. \u0112ngari e tika ana te k\u014Drero, \u2018kei te huri haere te ao!\u2019M\u0113n\u0101 e hiahia ana t\u0101tou ki te anga whakamua t\u0113r\u0101 pea ko t\u0113n\u0101 t\u0113tahi huarahi hei \u2018hakatau i \u0113n\u0101 whakaaro. \u0112ngari taku p\u016Bhaehae m\u014D koutou! He uri t\u0113nei o Hine\u0101maru te tuahine o Rongo-patu-taonga. K\u0101hore an\u014D m\u0101tou o te hau k\u0101inga kia tae atu ki t\u0113nei w\u0101hanga n\u0101 te mea, kei te raru tonu m\u0101tou, kei te whawhai tonu ki a m\u0101tou, \u0113, ko wai r\u0101 te kaik\u014Drero ka tae atu ki te t\u0113pu kia k\u014Drero tahi ai me Te Karauna? \u0112ngari ki a koutou kua pau k\u0113 t\u0113n\u0101 \u0101huatanga, kua t\u012Bmata mai, kei te taka mai ng\u0101 huruhuru ahakoa he iti noa iho. \u0112ngari a m\u0101tou m\u0101.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000217\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cba965bb-864f-4e06-99dc-6fcdfd007ad5\u0022\u003E[Thank you, and greetings also to us, this House, and to those of you who got up before me to express your thoughts about the purpose of this bill. I say everyone; that is what is so good about this place. Even though you disagree with some parties\u2019 sentiments, at the end of the day, the sentiments are theirs. But I heard the tenor of those sentiments by the speaker who preceded me. It appears she was being somewhat disrespectful to you, because you were the ones that approved of this bill. She was the one that said: \u201CNo, it is not really a conclusive bill\u201D. But leave it there. Those are her sentiments. She is not going to contradict herself, and that is what is so good about this place. But I stand here to support the bill, even though we know it was not really settled according to your expectations. But the aphorism \u2018the world is evolving\u2019 is correct. If we want to go forward, that is possibly a way to appease those kinds of thoughts. But I am envious of you. I am a relative of Hine\u0101maru, sister of Rongo-patu-taonga. We, back home, are not yet at this part, because we are still experiencing problems. We are still fighting with each other. Hey, who is to be spokesperson at the table to negotiate jointly with the Crown? As far as you are concerned, however, that situation is over. It has begun, outcomes are dropping down in your direction, even though it is mere pittance, but, as for us.]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000218\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cba965bb-864f-4e06-99dc-6fcdfd007ad5\u0022\u003EThe deed of settlement was signed last year, and I think that the fact that we have come to this day is a testament to the resilience of Ng\u0101ti Hau\u0101 and their desire to move on. People have talked about the generosity that this iwi have shown in terms of this agreement, but I should say that they are no different from other iwi who have also settled, and I think history will show the level of generosity that M\u0101ori, who, quite rightly, should feel aggrieved, have shown to ensuring that the future of their following generation will be able to benefit from the fruits that this settlement will bring to them. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000219\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cba965bb-864f-4e06-99dc-6fcdfd007ad5\u0022\u003EIt was 151 years ago, just 24 years after the signing of the Treaty, when, quite clearly, the Crown forgot what it had signed at Waitangi on 6 February. Because Ng\u0101ti Hau\u0101 chose to use their whanaungatanga in asking that they provide allegiance to the K\u012Bngitanga\u2014and quite rightly so; they were looking for protection\u2014unfortunately, the Crown saw that as a threat and in 1853-54, it invaded the geographical area occupied by Ng\u0101ti Hau\u0101. Consequently, we saw the confiscation, or the raupatu, of their lands and the loss of their social and traditional structures. It removed their ability to exercise customary rights and responsibilities. This bill brings to an end the prejudice endured by the iwi, and it brings us to the point of reaching a meaningful relationship with the Crown. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000220\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cba965bb-864f-4e06-99dc-6fcdfd007ad5\u0022\u003EThe bill also refers to cultural redress. A previous speaker in this House said in the debate on an earlier bill that history was being made. Can I just say, from my point of view and the point of view of New Zealand First, that history has been corrected and that the real events of the day are now part of the record of this country, and I think that is the most important part of this bill. Future generations, whether they be M\u0101ori or non-M\u0101ori, will come to learn that these are the sacrifices that iwi have made as a consequence of the actions of the Crown. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000221\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cba965bb-864f-4e06-99dc-6fcdfd007ad5\u0022\u003EBut, having said that, I too\u2014like many of my colleagues on this side of the House\u2014want to acknowledge the Minister for Treaty of Waitangi Negotiations. I am sure that it has not been an easy task for him because he has to go back to the Minister of Finance to see how much of a p\u016Btea he can have so that he can negotiate with the iwi. But I think it is to the credit of the leadership of Ng\u0101ti Hau\u0101 that they have come to this stage. They want to carry on. They want to progress. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000222\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cba965bb-864f-4e06-99dc-6fcdfd007ad5\u0022\u003EAs I said earlier on, always look behind you. May the sun and the wind be at your back, and the future relationship with the Crown will be much better than that experienced by your ancestors. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000223\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cba965bb-864f-4e06-99dc-6fcdfd007ad5\u0022\u003EN\u014D reira t\u0101tou m\u0101, ka hoki mai ki te k\u014Drero i ng\u0101 wiki e t\u016B mai, kei maumahara i a t\u0101tou te wh\u0101nautanga o t\u014D t\u0101tou Kai\u2019hakaora. N\u0101 reira, t\u0113nei ng\u0101 mihi ki a koutou i raro i taua kaupapa, ng\u0101 manaakitanga o Te Runga Rawa kei runga i a koutou m\u014D t\u0113nei w\u0101, \u0101, m\u014D ng\u0101 tau kei te heke mai. N\u0101 reira t\u0113n\u0101 koutou, t\u0113n\u0101 koutou, kia ora mai an\u014D t\u0101tou.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000224\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cba965bb-864f-4e06-99dc-6fcdfd007ad5\u0022\u003E[Therefore, as far as every one of us are concerned, come back to talk to us in the weeks ahead, as we reminisce now about the birth of our Redeemer. So under that matter, greetings to you collectively, and may the kindness of the Almighty above be upon you and us all at this time and in the years ahead. Thank you.]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022893adc11-ce4e-419c-a079-08f04b3d75f5\u0022 data-id=\u0022613db6cc7bf24683a929d5742e93dccf\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000225\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022893adc11-ce4e-419c-a079-08f04b3d75f5\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022613db6cc7bf24683a929d5742e93dccf\u0022\u003EThe ASSISTANT SPEAKER (Lindsay Tisch)\u003C/span\u003E: The next call is a split call of 5 minutes\u2014Meka Whaitiri.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022073496a0-73b7-426f-97f8-916bd542b0fa\u0022 data-id=\u002222a388f2751d4758802021df854c036f\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000226\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022073496a0-73b7-426f-97f8-916bd542b0fa\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002222a388f2751d4758802021df854c036f\u0022\u003EMEKA WHAITIRI (Labour\u2014Ikaroa-R\u0101whiti):\u003C/span\u003E \u0100, t\u0113n\u0101 koe, Mr Assistant Speaker. T\u0113n\u0101 t\u0101tou katoa ng\u0101 mema o Te Whare nei. E te iwi, Ng\u0101ti Hau\u0101, t\u0113n\u0101 koutou. T\u0113n\u0101 koutou, nau mai, haere mai ki Te Whare nei, e Te Tumuaki, Anaru, ka nui te mihi ki a koe. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000227\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022073496a0-73b7-426f-97f8-916bd542b0fa\u0022\u003E[Thank you to the Assistant Speaker, and acknowledgments to us all, members of this House. I salute you, the tribe of Ng\u0101ti Hau\u0101. Welcome and draw near to this House. I acknowledge you greatly, Anaru, the Head.]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000228\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022073496a0-73b7-426f-97f8-916bd542b0fa\u0022\u003ELadies and gentlemen, it gives me pleasure to speak in support, with all members of this House, of the third reading of this settlement bill for Ng\u0101ti Hau\u0101. Can I too stand and acknowledge on behalf of the iwi that I represent here: we stand in support and acknowledge the significant day of the passing of this important legislation. I want to say that in the earlier contribution I made to the Ng\u0101ti Koroki Kahukura Claims Settlement Bill, I forgot to acknowledge my ancestry to M\u0101hinarangi. So I stand here as an uri of M\u0101hinarangi, also, to acknowledge those who have travelled far to support this important piece of legislation going through today. It is a day of remembrance. It is a day to rejoice. It is a day to reflect. I know from being, before coming into Parliament, a negotiator for my Rongowhakaata people that it is a huge commitment. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000229\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022073496a0-73b7-426f-97f8-916bd542b0fa\u0022\u003EWhen I look at each Treaty bill that comes through the House, there is always a point of difference with each and every one of these settlements. I have heard some great contributions in the House today, starting with the Minister for Treaty of Waitangi Negotiations about this being the fastest settlement in history\u2014like the fastest gun in town\u2014at 7 months. When I was negotiating\u2014I was one of four negotiators for our own iwi\u2014that was our plan: to negotiate within 1 year. So you had 7 months; we took about 7 to 8 years. So I want to acknowledge your commitment. Some people may think that the haste in which you settled means there may have been some corners cut, but I see the positive side of your settlement, and that is one that was carried out on the basis of a very good strategy and a very good plan. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000230\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022073496a0-73b7-426f-97f8-916bd542b0fa\u0022\u003ELike other members in the House have said, unification, kotahitanga, is critical. Those who know me know I am a planner from way back. I cannot operate without a plan, otherwise I get lost. So for you to achieve settlement to a point where you are happy with it after 7 months is, I have got to say\u2014from my reading of it\u2014because you have done your homework. You have done your research. You have gathered your people together, and you had a clear strategy and a plan to get to the end point. So I want to acknowledge Ng\u0101ti Hau\u0101 and the negotiators who led that negotiation on your behalf, for not only developing your plan but for sticking to it. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000231\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022073496a0-73b7-426f-97f8-916bd542b0fa\u0022\u003ECan I acknowledge, of course, the Minister Christopher Finlayson for his work in bringing us to today. He is a man of his word. He is a practical man. When he says he wants to do something he will do it, so I do want to acknowledge the Minister for his work there. I acknowledge his officials, of course, and the M\u0101ori Affairs Committee, which saw the passage through at the pace that you obviously wanted to achieve, so I want to acknowledge all the officials who worked on it. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000232\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022073496a0-73b7-426f-97f8-916bd542b0fa\u0022\u003EWe are getting to the Christmas period, but I know for the good people of Ng\u0101ti Hau\u0101 that this ends many, many years of hard work, but again opens the commitment to many, many years going forward. I look upon you all\u2014and I look at those who are not here but are at home, probably listening to this broadcast\u2014and think about the vision, the aspirations, that you have for your people. When I see the rangatahi and tauira in the gallery, it is about their future. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000233\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022073496a0-73b7-426f-97f8-916bd542b0fa\u0022\u003EI do hope that historical accounts of this settlement bill, and all settlement bills, become an automatic part of our national curriculum throughout our schooling system. That is something that we need to take on in the next generation\u2014around how chequered our past and the history of this country is, and to keep the stories alive. For the Ng\u0101ti Hau\u0101 uri, it is important in your rohe that your stories, your histories, and the commitment of your tipuna to bring us to today are never, ever forgotten. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000234\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022073496a0-73b7-426f-97f8-916bd542b0fa\u0022\u003EOtir\u0101, e te iwi, huri noa, t\u0113nei te mihi maioha, t\u0113nei te mihi aroha ki a koutou katoa. T\u0113n\u0101 koutou, t\u0113n\u0101 koutou, \u0101, t\u0113n\u0101 t\u0101tou katoa.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000235\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022073496a0-73b7-426f-97f8-916bd542b0fa\u0022\u003E[But at the same time, I acknowledge and salute you, the tribe, and us all, lovingly and affectionately throughout. Thank you.]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022b4a597dd-ed8b-42b8-975b-40c6e0cdaee1\u0022 data-id=\u00225518897b05ab4ea6b415e662386ab5f0\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000236\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b4a597dd-ed8b-42b8-975b-40c6e0cdaee1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00225518897b05ab4ea6b415e662386ab5f0\u0022\u003ELOUISA WALL (Labour\u2014Manurewa):\u003C/span\u003E Kia ora e Te M\u0101ngai o Te Whare, ng\u0101 mana, e rau rangatira m\u0101; ng\u0101 mihi ki Te Tumuaki me ng\u0101 wh\u0101nau o Ng\u0101ti Hau\u0101. T\u0113n\u0101 koutou, t\u0113n\u0101 koutou, t\u0113n\u0101 t\u0101tou katoa.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000237\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b4a597dd-ed8b-42b8-975b-40c6e0cdaee1\u0022\u003E[Greetings to the Assistant Speaker of the House, authorities, and many leaders; acknowledgments to the Head and families of Ng\u0101ti Hau\u0101. Congratulations, and well done to you and to us all. Thank you.]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000238\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b4a597dd-ed8b-42b8-975b-40c6e0cdaee1\u0022\u003EI have to say that I think we have had some of the most thoughtful contributions this morning to the Treaty settlement process. From my perspective, I think we are in a new era. It is a new era of resistance. Sitting here listening to the contributions\u2014thinking of people like Tamihana, thinking of people like Taingakawa, and thinking of people like \u0100naru Thompson, who now has the mantle in terms of the resistance of Ng\u0101ti Hau\u0101\u2014it makes me really proud that where we are now is a period of what I call rehabilitation. We have survived. We have survived, and we have survived to a point where we are getting some of our lands back, and, actually, our culture never died, and neither did our language. But the biggest challenge that we have going forward is to make sure that 100 percent of our wh\u0101nau have access and opportunity in terms of our culture and our language. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000239\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b4a597dd-ed8b-42b8-975b-40c6e0cdaee1\u0022\u003EFor me, today is a significant day, and I want to mihi to all the people who have been involved in this process. The Wai claims\u2014Wai 306, Wai 1017\u2014were lodged by Alan Gillett, by Eru Kaukau, and by Marsden Kaukau. I acknowledge the trustees who signed the terms of negotiation in December 2012. Again, I want to acknowledge the chair, \u0100naru Thompson, the tumuaki. Today is actually the 74th settlement in this House. We are now 60 percent of the way through the Treaty settlement process. I want to acknowledge the Hon Chris Finlayson, because I think that the process he has now instituted is meaning that we are moving at a quicker pace. As you have seen displayed today, this is a place where we can debate the significance and the meaning of some of the things that have been included in our Treaty settlement process. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000240\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b4a597dd-ed8b-42b8-975b-40c6e0cdaee1\u0022\u003EAgain, I want to highlight the statutory acknowledgments that, for me, give meaning to our status as mana whenua, as tangata whenua, not only within the context of these Treaty settlement processes but our relationships with local councils and other things. For me, it also means: what is our relationship with the Ministry of Education, our boards of trustees, and all the schools and the kura within your Ng\u0101ti Hau\u0101 rohe? I think the next task of this post-settlement commitment unit is actually translating this process and this history into history books that our kids learn generically, not just ng\u0101 uri o Ng\u0101ti Hau\u0101 but actually ng\u0101 uri o Aotearoa New Zealand, because it is a taonga in itself, and everyone should have the right and opportunity to understand and know our history. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000241\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b4a597dd-ed8b-42b8-975b-40c6e0cdaee1\u0022\u003EWhen I look at how we translate this recognition of our status, conversations about what is happening in New Plymouth\u2014and the mayor and the council there saying we should have a M\u0101ori, and a specific M\u0101ori, on that local board of the local council\u2014actually have significance and relevance right across the motu. I think the driver of that opportunity has to come from our iwi and our hap\u016B. If we want it, then we need to add some value to the statutory recognitions in our status, in our relationships, and in our partnerships with our local council. I think the evolution of that will mean that forevermore our status will never be diminished, because fundamentally we, as tangata whenua, as mana whenua, as the guardians of our mokopuna and our tamariki\u2014the future actually now is in our hands. I look forward to the challenge that that now poses our post-Treaty settlement resistance fighters, as I called them before, because this is only the beginning. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000242\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b4a597dd-ed8b-42b8-975b-40c6e0cdaee1\u0022\u003ESo I mihi to you all and acknowledge you. It must be an incredibly proud day. As a member of Parliament, I am incredibly humbled to have an opportunity to be a part of this process. Safe travels home. On behalf of my Labour Party colleagues and the rest of the members of this House, I hope you know that this is a genuine process of consensus and that as a House we are actually really committed to this Treaty settlement and to the next phase in our status as tangata whenua in Aotearoa. N\u014D reira, t\u0113n\u0101 koutou, t\u0113n\u0101 koutou, t\u0113n\u0101 t\u0101tou katoa.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022e77494a0-1be1-432f-b492-fd160f4c119d\u0022 data-id=\u00224671bad0ca5f4cd9be6796eb5c1dab9b\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000243\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e77494a0-1be1-432f-b492-fd160f4c119d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00224671bad0ca5f4cd9be6796eb5c1dab9b\u0022\u003EPEENI HENARE (Labour\u2014T\u0101maki Makaurau):\u003C/span\u003E Kia ora, Mr Assistant Speaker. Recently I was challenged by my kaum\u0101tua and kuia: when speaking on M\u0101ori issues or M\u0101ori causes within this House I should revert to my native tongue of Te Reo M\u0101ori. No reira ka huri atu ahau. He pito k\u014Drero ka whakahokia. Ka pap\u0101 te whatitiri, hiko hiko te uira, kahukura ki te rangi. Te ai t\u016B ka riri ka rongo mai ka h\u0113 ko Ngungunu, ko Ngangana, ko Ap\u0101rangi; ko te tit\u012B o te rua, ko te tao whakahoro, ko te tao whakawahine, ko te tao o t\u014Dku tupuna a Hineamaru. Tihei w\u0101 mauri ora. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000244\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e77494a0-1be1-432f-b492-fd160f4c119d\u0022\u003EKa waihon\u0101 t\u016B taua k\u014Drero hei whakataki ake i t\u0113nei k\u014Drero kei mua i te aroaro o t\u0113nei Whare i te rangi nei. Ko te tikanga o t\u0113r\u0101 e Te M\u0101ngai o Te Whare, ka tuituia \u014Dku m\u0101tua t\u016Bpuna ki ng\u0101 t\u0101ngata katoa kua tat\u016B mai nei ki runga i te kaupapa kua whakak\u0101hui nei t\u0101tou i te rangi nei. Ar\u0101, ko ng\u0101 whakapapa kei waenganui i a m\u0101tou, ar\u0101, ko t\u014Dku tupuna ko Hineamaru kua k\u014Drero nei e t\u014Dku p\u0101pa a Pita, m\u014D te \u0101huatanga ki te rongo p\u0101p\u016B taonga te wahine o T\u0101whiao. Ka heke iho mai ki a Heni Ngarino, ko t\u014Dku tupuna t\u0113r\u0101 ko Ng\u0101ti Hine e t\u016B. N\u0101 ka huri tua atu ki \u014Dku wheinga, t\u014Dku toto ki roto i a Te Taitokerau ko Reit\u016B, ko Uaoneone, t\u0113nei ka tangi, t\u0113nei ka mihi, t\u0113n\u0101 koutou katoa. K\u0101ti, ka huri ng\u0101 whakaaro ki ng\u0101 tai kua mimiti atu ki te p\u014D. R\u0101tou kua hinga mai n\u0101, kua hinga atu r\u0101. R\u0101tou i takahia ai i te ara wh\u0101nui ki Te Rua o T\u0101pokorau, te huarahi i heke ai a M\u0101ui ki te p\u014D ki te anu m\u0101tao. Ka whakapiki atu r\u0101 koutou ki tua o rei ao an\u0101 ka tau ki runga i Te Pae o Mahara ki te whakamaung\u0101 kekete, e kekete mai ai te kekete, e ara mai ai te ara. E takahia atu r\u0101 i te Aratiatia i takahia ai t\u014D t\u0101tou tupuna a T\u0101ne nui \u0101 rangi. Ka tiaho mai r\u0101 ki runga i te kahu o te tupuna o Ranginui, ka tangi tonu ahau. Haere e ng\u0101 mate, haere. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000245\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e77494a0-1be1-432f-b492-fd160f4c119d\u0022\u003EKa tika huri ng\u0101 whakaaro ki a t\u0101tou e te hunga ora t\u0113n\u0101 t\u0101tou e Te M\u0101ngai o t\u0113nei Whare. E tautoko ana ahau i ng\u0101 k\u014Drero katoa kua pahure ake nei ki roto i te \u0101huatanga o t\u0113nei kaupapa, e \u0101ta w\u0101nanga, e \u0101ta k\u014Drerohia nei t\u0101tou ki roto i te Whare. N\u0101, e tautoko ana, e rere tonu ana ng\u0101 mihi ki te Minita ki te H\u014Dnore ki a Chris Finlayson. Kua k\u014Drero te Whare m\u014D t\u014Dna m\u0101ia e Te M\u0101ngai. Kua k\u014Drero Te Whare m\u014D t\u014Dna kaha ki te tutuki i ng\u0101 take e p\u0101 ana ki Te Tiriti o Waitangi. N\u0101 kua waha nei \u0113tahi o ng\u0101 mema o t\u0113nei Whare ki ng\u0101 o mahi i oti i a ia. N\u014D reira e rere tonu ana ng\u0101 mihi ki a ia me \u014Dna \u0101piha ki roto i ng\u0101 Tari K\u0101wanatanga.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000246\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e77494a0-1be1-432f-b492-fd160f4c119d\u0022\u003EN\u0101 e manawanui ana ahau e Te M\u0101ngai o t\u0113nei Whare. E manawanui ana ahau ki te k\u014Drero a te Minita e mea ana ka whakat\u016B i t\u0113tahi r\u014Dp\u016B hei \u0101whina atu i ng\u0101 iwi kua tat\u016B nei ng\u0101 ker\u0113me, hei \u0101whina atu i ng\u0101 iwi ki roto i te w\u0101hanga a muri ake i te tat\u016Bnga o ng\u0101 ker\u0113me, ka manawanui t\u0113nei. Ka haere tonu ng\u0101 mihi ki ng\u0101 \u0100piha, ki ng\u0101 \u0100piha o ng\u0101 kaunihera, ki ng\u0101 \u0100piha o ng\u0101 Tari K\u0101wanatanga \u0101 ko te tari tat\u016B ai ng\u0101 ker\u0113me. Ka mihi atu ahau ki a r\u0101tou e kawea nei i t\u0113nei kaupapa ki roto i te Whare. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000247\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e77494a0-1be1-432f-b492-fd160f4c119d\u0022\u003EKa mutu, ka huri atu ahau ki a koutou e Ng\u0101ti Hau\u0101. N\u0101, kua k\u014Drero mai ng\u0101 mema o t\u0113nei Whare m\u014D te tupuna o Tai Ng\u0101kawa. Ka t\u012Bmata mai i te tupuna a Te Waharoa ka heke iho mai ki a W\u012Bremu Tamihana Tarap\u012Bpipi. I t\u0113nei t\u0101ima e te p\u0101p\u0101, e Te Tumuaki, ko te aroha o t\u014Dku p\u0101p\u0101, otir\u0101, o t\u014Dku wh\u0101nau, ka tau ki runga i a koe i t\u0113nei t\u0101ima. Kua \u0101rahi nei e koe i t\u014D iwi. Kei te arahi tonu koe i te iwi M\u0101ori, ar\u0101, me te K\u012Bngitanga i roto i ng\u0101 nekehanga o t\u0113nei w\u0101 ka heke iho taua mana ki runga i a koe, t\u0113nei ka mihi, t\u0113nei ka tangi. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000248\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e77494a0-1be1-432f-b492-fd160f4c119d\u0022\u003EN\u0101 ka hoki atu ahau ki ng\u0101 whakapapa kua takia nei e au ki mua i a koutou, m\u014D t\u014D koutou ake whakapapa e, e Te Tumuaki. N\u0101, ka kapohia ake ahau i ng\u0101 k\u014Drero e p\u0101 ana ki a Taingakawa. N\u0101, kei roto i t\u0113nei whare t\u0113tahi pikitia. Ka t\u016B ko Taingakawa me te Pirimia o taua taima, ar\u0101, ko Dick Seddon. N\u0101, ko taua pikitia hei tohutohu, hei tohutohu ki ng\u0101 mema M\u0101ori o t\u0113nei taima m\u014D te m\u0101ia o ng\u0101 m\u0101tua t\u016Bpuna ki te mahi ng\u0101tahi me te karauna. N\u0101, ko t\u014D t\u016Bpuna t\u0113n\u0101, i arahi nei i te iwi M\u0101ori me t\u014Dna iwi i roto i ng\u0101 nekehanga ahakoa ng\u0101 t\u016Bkinotanga o te karauna ki a Ng\u0101ti Hau\u0101 otir\u0101 ki te iwi M\u0101ori. No reira, e mihi atu ana ahau ki a Ng\u0101ti Hau\u0101. Ko te tohu t\u0113n\u0101 o te rangatira k\u0101 k\u014Drero t\u0101tou katoa ka whakatauk\u012Bhia e t\u0101tou ki roto i t\u0113nei taima, ko te kai a te rangatira ko te k\u014Drero. N\u0101, ko taua kai kei roto i te ringa o Ng\u0101ti Hau\u0101 ki roto i ng\u0101 tau, tae noa mai ki t\u0113nei w\u0101. Kia kaua e p\u014Dh\u0113h\u0113 m\u0101 te k\u0101wanatanga t\u0113nei ker\u0113me e tat\u016B wawe mai. K\u0101hore. Engari, m\u0101 te arohanui o Ng\u0101ti Hau\u0101, ki ng\u0101 take me ng\u0101 mokopuna me ng\u0101 whakatipuranga kei te haere mai t\u0113nei ker\u0113me ka tat\u016B noa. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000249\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e77494a0-1be1-432f-b492-fd160f4c119d\u0022\u003ENo reira, e te M\u0101ngai o t\u0113nei whare, n\u0101 wai r\u0101 te k\u012B m\u0101 te p\u016Btea anak\u0113 te iwi M\u0101ori, otir\u0101, Ng\u0101ti Hau\u0101 e ora ai. E tika ana te whakatauk\u012B \u2018m\u0101 te huruhuru te manu ka rere\u2019 o te p\u016Btea e k\u014Drerohia nei t\u0113tahi o ng\u0101 kahukura ka tau ki runga i taua manu. Engari, ka whakaarohia ake ahau ki ng\u0101 kiko kei roto i t\u0113nei pire, he nui ng\u0101 huruhuru, he nui ng\u0101 kahukura ka taea e Ng\u0101ti Hau\u0101 te manu ka rere. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000250\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e77494a0-1be1-432f-b492-fd160f4c119d\u0022\u003EN\u0101 ka tiro atu ahau ka k\u014Drero atu ahau e te M\u0101ngai o t\u0113nei whare, m\u014D ng\u0101 taonga kei roto i t\u0113nei pire. N\u0101 kua k\u014Drero mai i t\u0113nei Whare m\u014D te Kauhanganui. Ko te Kauhanganui o Mahuta e tino hari koa ana te ng\u0101kau ka ora mai taua taonga ki roto i ng\u0101 tau kei mua i a t\u0101tou. Kia kaua ng\u0101 k\u014Drero i pahure ki roto i ng\u0101 poupou o taua whare, te mahue ake m\u014D ng\u0101 whakatipuranga e haere ake nei. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000251\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e77494a0-1be1-432f-b492-fd160f4c119d\u0022\u003EN\u0101, ka k\u014Drero an\u014D au m\u014D te taonga e kawea nei e t\u014Dku p\u0101p\u0101 e Anaru i t\u0113nei rangi. E tino hari koa ana kei roto i t\u0113nei pire te w\u0101hanga hei tautoko atu i te tapu, i te mauri o taua taonga. N\u0101, ko te taonga i te Huiipukawa. I reira taku tupuna n\u014D te Taitokerau ki te whakarongo atu ki te titiro atu ki te tapu o taua taonga, ka tau ki runga i ng\u0101 pokowhiwhi o te Tumuaki i t\u0113nei rangi. No reira, e hari koa ana ahau i ng\u0101 kiko kei roto i t\u0113nei pire. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000252\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e77494a0-1be1-432f-b492-fd160f4c119d\u0022\u003EKoi n\u0101 t\u0101ku e mea ana ki t\u0113nei Whare mai i t\u0113nei taha o te Whare mai i te R\u014Dp\u016B Reipa. Ka riro ki a au nei te w\u0101hanga hei whakakapi ake i ng\u0101 k\u014Drero o t\u0113nei taha o Te Whare. No reira, ki roto i t\u0113n\u0101, ka huri atu ahau ki te reo p\u0101keh\u0101 m\u014D t\u0113tahi w\u0101 paku noa nei kia kaua a Peeni i k\u014Dhuru i ng\u0101 kupu a t\u0113tahi atu.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000253\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e77494a0-1be1-432f-b492-fd160f4c119d\u0022\u003E[And so I go back into a short incantation, which I will wind back. The thunder crashes, and the lightning flashes, as there is a rainbow in the sky. It is flashing an ill-omen, as a war party is heard by Ngungunu, Ngangana an Ap\u0101rangi at the opening of the pit, as the incantations releasing the warriors from tapu are recited, the incantations of my ancestor Hine\u0101maru. Behold! The breath of life! \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000254\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e77494a0-1be1-432f-b492-fd160f4c119d\u0022\u003EI leave those words to introduce this speech before the House today. The reason being is that those words bind my ancestors to all of the people that are present and here today for this prestigious occasion. The genealogical links between us lie with my ancestor Hine\u0101maru and Te Rongop\u0101t\u016Btaonga, wife of T\u0101whiao, who was mentioned by my uncle Pita Paraone. Descending from that line is H\u0113ni Ng\u0101rino, who was of Ng\u0101ti Hine lineage like this person standing before you. Then I turn to my elders, to my Far North blood linkages, to the ancestors Reit\u016B and Uaoneone, as I weep and acknowledge you all. And so allow me to turn our attention to the tides receding to the darkness, to those deceased here and there. Those who traversed the expansive pathway of Te Rua o T\u0101pokorau, which M\u0101ui travelled on his journey down to the darkness, to the coldness. You then soared past Reiao and settled beyond memory, beyond the veil. Scale the celestial ladder that your ancestor T\u0101ne-nui-\u0101-Rangi climbed. It shines above the cloak of Ranginui as I continue to cry out. Farewell to the dead, farewell! \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000255\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e77494a0-1be1-432f-b492-fd160f4c119d\u0022\u003EAnd it is appropriate to pay respects to the living. Greetings to the Assistant Speaker. I endorse all of the previous speeches pertaining to this matter, as we examine and discuss this bill within the House. I also support the acknowledgments to the Minister, the Hon Christopher Finlayson. The House has spoken about his courage. The House has also spoken of his sterling efforts to settle Treaty of Waitangi claims. Other members of Parliament have spoken about his accomplishments, and he continues to be acknowledged along with his officials from various government departments. To the Assistant Speaker of the House, I am heartened. I am heartened to speak because a group will be established to assist tribes that have settled claims, and to assist with the work involved after the claims are settled. I am heartened with this. I wish to acknowledge the officials from the local councils and government departments, including the Office of Treaty Settlements. I would also like to congratulate those who brought the bill to the House. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000256\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e77494a0-1be1-432f-b492-fd160f4c119d\u0022\u003ENow I turn my attention to Ng\u0101ti Hau\u0101. The members of Parliament have spoken about the ancestor Tai Ng\u0101kawa. We begin with the ancestor Te Waharoa, down to W\u012Bremu Tamihana Tarap\u012Bpipi. At this time, I wish to express the love of my father and my family to you, the Head. You have led your people, and you continue to lead the M\u0101ori people and the King Movement within the current affairs, as the authority was passed down to you, and so I stand to acknowledge you. Now I will refer back to your geneology that I recited before you, the Head. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000257\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e77494a0-1be1-432f-b492-fd160f4c119d\u0022\u003ENow I will recount a story relating to Taing\u0101kawa. Within this building, there is a photo showing Taing\u0101kawa and the Prime Minister of that time, Dick Seddon. That photo depicts to the current M\u0101ori members the confidence of our ancestors to work with the Crown. And it was your ancestor who lead the M\u0101ori people, in spite of the wrongdoings of the Crown, to Ng\u0101ti Hau\u0101 and, indeed, the M\u0101ori people. Therefore, I wish to congratulate Ng\u0101ti Hau\u0101, as it is a sign of nobility to express these proverbial sayings at this time, for the food that sustains chiefs, is oratory. And that food has always laid within the hands of Ng\u0101ti Hau\u0101.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000258\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e77494a0-1be1-432f-b492-fd160f4c119d\u0022\u003ELet us not assume that the Government settled this claim with haste. No, but it was through the great love of Ng\u0101ti Hau\u0101 towards their affairs with their children and future generations that this claim was settled. Therefore, to you, the Assistant Speaker of this House, who said M\u0101oridom and, indeed, Ng\u0101ti Hau\u0101 will thrive only with money. The proverb that states that \u2018birds need feathers to fly\u2019 is correct, as the \u2018money\u2019 is an analogy for the feathers that adorn birds. But I have reflected upon the substance of this bill. There are many positives, there are many feathers that Ng\u0101ti Hau\u0101 will be able to utilise in order to fly. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000259\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e77494a0-1be1-432f-b492-fd160f4c119d\u0022\u003EAnd now I turn to reflect and speak about the treasures within this bill. Now this House has spoken about the trustee, the trustee of Mahuta. I am delighted that this treasure will be reborn in the years ahead. Let not the words that have been spoken within the walls of that house be abandoned for future generations. Now I will again speak about the valuable role that my uncle \u0100naru Thompson is carrying out. I am pleased that within this bill is a section that supports the sacredness and vital importance of the role of the Head. Now, at the conference in P\u016Bkawa, my ancestor from the Far North heard and witnessed the sacredness of this treasure that has been bestowed upon the shoulders of the Head today, and so I am delighted at the substance of this bill. This is the position of the Labour Party, as I conclude the contributions from this side of the House. And with that in mind, I will speak English for a brief time so that Peeni will not murder the words of others.]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000260\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e77494a0-1be1-432f-b492-fd160f4c119d\u0022\u003EI just want to say these words that can be found in the journals of New Zealand. It goes a little something like this: those who study the Treaty will find whatever they seek. Those who look for difficulties and obstacles that surround Te Tiriti o Waitangi will find nothing but difficulties and obstacles. But those who approach in a positive frame of mind and propose to regard it as an obligation of honour will find that Te Tiriti o Waitangi is more than capable of being implemented into law. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000261\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e77494a0-1be1-432f-b492-fd160f4c119d\u0022\u003EN\u014D reira, ka waihon\u0101t\u016B t\u0113r\u0101 k\u014Drero kei mua i te aroaro o t\u0113nei Whare m\u014D t\u0113nei w\u0101. Ka huri ng\u0101 mihi ki a koutou e \u014Dku m\u0101tua, e kara m\u0101, e kui m\u0101, e kawea nei i te tapu i te mauri o Ng\u0101ti Hau\u0101 ki runga i te t\u0101h\u016Bh\u016B o t\u0113nei Whare. T\u0113n\u0101 koutou, e te M\u0101ngai o t\u0113nei Whare. T\u0113n\u0101 t\u0101tou katoa. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000262\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e77494a0-1be1-432f-b492-fd160f4c119d\u0022\u003E[I therefore leave that contribution before this House, for this moment. I turn to you, my elders, the elderly men and women folk. My acknowledgments to you for conveying the vital essence and sacredness of Ng\u0101ti Hau\u0101 upon the roof of this House. Thank you. Thank you to the Assistant Speaker of this House, and to us all.]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022758dcaf3-9976-43ac-8593-79f66ee4da22\u0022 data-id=\u00227e46141aaac844fdb1e99b14e283ec9f\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000263\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022758dcaf3-9976-43ac-8593-79f66ee4da22\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00227e46141aaac844fdb1e99b14e283ec9f\u0022\u003EJOANNE HAYES (National):\u003C/span\u003E T\u0113n\u0101 koe e Te Mana Whakaw\u0101. E koro m\u0101, e kui m\u0101, e Te Tumuaki o te iwi Ng\u0101ti Hau\u0101, ng\u0101 mihi mahana ki a koutou. Nau mai, haere mai ki Te Whare P\u0101remata i te r\u0101 whakahirahira m\u014D ng\u0101 wh\u0101nau me ng\u0101 hap\u016B o te iwi.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000264\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022758dcaf3-9976-43ac-8593-79f66ee4da22\u0022\u003E[Thank you, Mr Assistant Speaker, and warm greetings to you, the elderly men, elderly women, the Head of the Ng\u0101ti Hau\u0101 tribe. Welcome and draw close to Parliament on this great day for the families and subtribes of the people.]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000265\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022758dcaf3-9976-43ac-8593-79f66ee4da22\u0022\u003EI am privileged to stand to take the last call in the final reading of the Ng\u0101ti Hau\u0101 Claims Settlement Bill. I want to acknowledge the tireless work of the negotiation teams, particularly those of Ng\u0101ti Hau\u0101, especially to turn round a bill within 7 months. That is a record. I also want to thank the Minister for Treaty of Waitangi Negotiations, the Hon Chris Finlayson, for his undying dedication to ensuring that all our claims will be settled within due course. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000266\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022758dcaf3-9976-43ac-8593-79f66ee4da22\u0022\u003EI also want to acknowledge ng\u0101 hap\u016B o Ng\u0101ti Hau\u0101, Ng\u0101ti Te Oro, Ng\u0101ti Werewere, Ng\u0101ti Waenganui, Ng\u0101ti Te Rangitaupi, and Ng\u0101ti Rangi Tawhaki because I have heard those hap\u016B spoken of in this House today by only two of us, and I just want to acknowledge you and acknowledge the work that you have done.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000267\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022758dcaf3-9976-43ac-8593-79f66ee4da22\u0022\u003EThis settlement claim provides redress in both financial and cultural form to the trustees of the Ng\u0101ti Hau\u0101 Iwi Trust. It represents good progress in the Waikato and Raukawa claims. As I said in my previous k\u014Drero, today is a day of celebration. It is the beginning of a prosperous future for ng\u0101 wh\u0101nau o Ng\u0101ti Hau\u0101. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000268\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022758dcaf3-9976-43ac-8593-79f66ee4da22\u0022\u003EAs I said in the start of my k\u014Drero, if you can turn round a bill like this in 7 months, just imagine what you can do with the claims that you are receiving today. I think that you have great potential, and I am really proud that my cousin married one of you. My cousin\u2019s name was Taui Paku. He married a Marie Paku\u2014I cannot remember her maiden name, because back in the day I was brought up thinking that all M\u0101ori were Ngati Porou. When my cousin Taui passed, he asked that he would go back to lie at the Ng\u0101ti Hau\u0101 marae where his wife is from, and so we travelled there, and he is buried alongside in your beautiful urup\u0101 just out of Cambridge. So I am very pleased that my cousin is in your arms being looked after by you. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000269\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022758dcaf3-9976-43ac-8593-79f66ee4da22\u0022\u003EIn closing, I want to say thank you all for coming along today. I wish you all a merry Christmas and a happy New Year. I wish you safe journeys home, and, hopefully, we will see you sometime into the future. I wholeheartedly commend this bill to the House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000270\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022758dcaf3-9976-43ac-8593-79f66ee4da22\u0022\u003EBill read a third time.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022893adc11-ce4e-419c-a079-08f04b3d75f5\u0022 data-id=\u0022bb40f5eccf90473db7e995a2ed24a1b0\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000271\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022893adc11-ce4e-419c-a079-08f04b3d75f5\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022bb40f5eccf90473db7e995a2ed24a1b0\u0022\u003EThe ASSISTANT SPEAKER (Lindsay Tisch)\u003C/span\u003E: The debate has finished, ladies and gentlemen. I do not get to speak in these debates, but I would like to congratulate both iwi today on their achievements. I was a signatory with the Minister for Treaty of Waitangi Negotiations on this last bill, the Ng\u0101ti Hau\u0101 Claims Settlement Bill, and so this is a special day also and I share that with you.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000272\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022893adc11-ce4e-419c-a079-08f04b3d75f5\u0022\u003EWaiata\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000273\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022893adc11-ce4e-419c-a079-08f04b3d75f5\u0022\u003EThe House adjourned at 12.11 p.m.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20141209c01725f40389448abb59f86ec78986f7000274\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022893adc11-ce4e-419c-a079-08f04b3d75f5\u0022\u003E\u003Cbr\u003E\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n    \u003C/div\u003E\n  \u003C/body\u003E\n\u003C/html\u003E"