"\u003C!DOCTYPE html\u003E\u003Chtml xmlns:xlink=\u0022http://www.w3.org/1999/xlink\u0022 xmlns:xsi=\u0022http://www.w3.org/2007/XMLSchema-instance\u0022 xmlns:mml=\u0022http://www.w3.org/1998/Math/MathML\u0022\u003E\n  \u003Chead\u003E\n    \u003CMETA http-equiv=\u0022Content-Type\u0022 content=\u0022text/html; charset=utf-16\u0022\u003E\n    \u003Cmeta name=\u0022viewport\u0022 content=\u0022width=device-width, initial-scale=1\u0022\u003E\n  \u003C/head\u003E\n  \u003Cbody style=\u0022font-family:sans-serif; font-size:100%;\u0022\u003E\n    \u003Cdiv class=\u0022HpsHansard\u0022\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000001\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsProceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u002263e4215d1c204bbcbf11b10628f4a2fc\u0022\u003ETUESDAY, 24 MAY 2016\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000003\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u00220cc0106e442b41b3847f7ae30ace2cf0\u0022\u003ETUESDAY, 24 MAY 2016\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000002\u0022\u003EMr Speaker took the Chair at 2 p.m.\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000004\u0022\u003EPrayers.\u003C/p\u003E\n    \u003C/div\u003E\n    \u003Cdiv class=\u0022HpsHansard\u0022\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000005\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsProceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u002256fe772b00704a059cb549e35a8a88e6\u0022\u003EVisitors\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000006\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u00224b2445c4dd364247aaacd7d4b56a5d51\u0022\u003EBougainville\u2014Delegation, Parliament\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022e4b09a29-dfd3-42c0-8585-11463bd6077b\u0022 data-id=\u0022d979eab719dd433ca6cce22d7eef9444\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000007\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e4b09a29-dfd3-42c0-8585-11463bd6077b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022d979eab719dd433ca6cce22d7eef9444\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Honourable members, I am sure that members would wish to welcome a parliamentary delegation from the Autonomous Region of Bougainville, led by the Honourable Francesca Semoso, which is present in the gallery.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n    \u003C/div\u003E\n    \u003Cdiv class=\u0022HpsHansard\u0022\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000008\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsProceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u0022a9cdfce3359a4980808285a09af8b527\u0022\u003EAmended Answers to Oral Questions\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000009\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u002273f4833a4aa445ed8d43c7293e9dd3d1\u0022\u003EQuestion No. 12 to Minister, 10 May\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002263776108-58dc-4cab-baf1-95282c61d0de\u0022 data-id=\u002271787ac6185c4e6097b7f4c3eea3a9a6\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000010\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002263776108-58dc-4cab-baf1-95282c61d0de\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002271787ac6185c4e6097b7f4c3eea3a9a6\u0022\u003EHon PAULA BENNETT (Minister for Social Housing):\u003C/span\u003E I seek leave to make a personal explanation to correct an answer I gave to a supplementary question during question No. 5 on 10 May 2016.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000011\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e4b09a29-dfd3-42c0-8585-11463bd6077b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00227a1451309b5e4b7bbe886067cf9d84e0\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Leave is sought for that course of action. Is there any objection? There is none.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000012\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002263776108-58dc-4cab-baf1-95282c61d0de\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00220beeaf14d0c64ef2876f5c60d2eda277\u0022\u003EHon PAULA BENNETT\u003C/span\u003E: In response to a supplementary question asked during question No. 5 on 10 May, I said in relation to the $41.1 million for emergency housing in Budget 2016 that \u201CThe new 3,000 places will be for anyone\u2014individuals or families\u2014who has a genuine need for emergency accommodation.\u201D I should have said that the funding will be for 3,000 places, and that some of those will be new and some will go to the many emergency housing providers that require dedicated ongoing funding so that they can keep their doors open.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n    \u003C/div\u003E\n    \u003Cdiv class=\u0022HpsHansard\u0022\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000013\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsProceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u00222cd794da637045e58ea1ce220d9a2aa7\u0022\u003EOral Questions\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000014\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u00228a1d406fb50d4ce386230e7addcaf9dc\u0022\u003EQuestions to Ministers\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000015\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u0022d290637f2d9e4bc8b9b8558f91e50ee7\u0022\u003EHousing Affordability and Availability\u2014Government Measures to Address\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022 data-id=\u002241f7c70304d94923b81c62c9297d58ef\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000016\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003E1. \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002241f7c70304d94923b81c62c9297d58ef\u0022\u003EANDREW LITTLE (Leader of the Opposition)\u003C/span\u003E to the Prime Minister: Does he have confidence in his Minister for Building and Housing?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00220083bcaa-f44d-4b70-97de-d091a209b88c\u0022 data-id=\u00223e914335b80e425c90dd0dd5ef8dcf8c\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000017\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220083bcaa-f44d-4b70-97de-d091a209b88c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00223e914335b80e425c90dd0dd5ef8dcf8c\u0022\u003ERt Hon JOHN KEY (Prime Minister):\u003C/span\u003E Yes.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000018\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00228887fbda97f743abb39aad097e6d3f95\u0022\u003EAndrew Little\u003C/span\u003E: How can he have confidence in bumbling Nick Smith, who promised 500 hectares of new housing on Crown land in the last Budget but found only 13 hectares, and is now claiming he never made any promise at all?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000019\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220083bcaa-f44d-4b70-97de-d091a209b88c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002266305282c4f1416d952e4ef764caa2cf\u0022\u003ERt Hon JOHN KEY\u003C/span\u003E: Apologies\u2014I just could not hear the question.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000020\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e4b09a29-dfd3-42c0-8585-11463bd6077b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002258f4a12969ef4559aea782828eeea927\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: I will allow the question to be heard. It would be\u2014[Interruption] Order! The question, as I heard it, was certainly one that was going to lead to some interjection, but, so that it is heard clearly, I do not want any interjection, particularly from my right-hand side.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000021\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a0dee9feec294e2795bfafaacd93755d\u0022\u003EAndrew Little\u003C/span\u003E: Thank you, Mr Speaker. I am obliged. How can he have confidence in Nick Smith, who promised 500 hectares of new housing\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000022\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00227f32997cba3147db91d720b476589e45\u0022\u003EHon Dr Nick Smith\u003C/span\u003E: Did not.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000023\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00222e094fe1849d42a5a4c87d9a6c0bf7ed\u0022\u003EAndrew Little\u003C/span\u003E: \u2014on Crown land in the last Budget but found only 13 hectares\u2014he is over there\u2014and is now claiming he never made any promise at all?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000024\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220083bcaa-f44d-4b70-97de-d091a209b88c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022f375691957404dec923be90324267416\u0022\u003ERt Hon JOHN KEY\u003C/span\u003E: I have confidence in the Minister for Building and Housing because he has undertaken a wide range of initiatives when it comes to housing. What we are seeing is a considerable increase in the number of houses that have been built. Yesterday the Minister announced that three sites in Auckland would be paving the way for 750 new homes; if combined with the Moire Road development last year, it is a total of 940 homes.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000025\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00220cf695f7b03f4956b1480e946b7cb3ff\u0022\u003EAndrew Little\u003C/span\u003E: Given his statement about housing, \u201CI don\u2019t think it\u2019s a crisis,\u201D, why does Statistics New Zealand data show falling homeownership rates every quarter under his Government?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000026\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220083bcaa-f44d-4b70-97de-d091a209b88c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022ec0a66b4462c4cf4ad8b3d40287f9b3a\u0022\u003ERt Hon JOHN KEY\u003C/span\u003E: I always have to check those facts when I see them from the Labour Party, but homeownership rates around the world, actually, have been reducing. One thing we do know is that under this Government we are helping a lot of people into their first home. One example of that is the nearly 12,000 people who have been helped into their first home under the KiwiSaver HomeStart grant scheme, totalling $55.6 million.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000027\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022811776c4d8e143aaabc07117bb6edb7f\u0022\u003EAndrew Little\u003C/span\u003E: I seek leave to table information provided by the Parliamentary Library on the dwelling and household figures and ownership rates, which shows a declining\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000028\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e4b09a29-dfd3-42c0-8585-11463bd6077b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00226572b2f7606243b282dc5b9a1dce406c\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Order! [Interruption] Order! The document has been described. Before I put the leave, it is not simply a pr\u00E9cis of Statistics New Zealand, is it?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000029\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00224c284a6f3ff5441490d3ab416dc93beb\u0022\u003EAndrew Little\u003C/span\u003E: Not at all.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000030\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e4b09a29-dfd3-42c0-8585-11463bd6077b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002224b4a97c544b4caab44e4782ffa9cace\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: OK, then I will put\u2014[Interruption] Order! I will put the leave. [Interruption] Order! Leave has been sought to table the information prepared by the Parliamentary Library. Is there any objection to it being tabled? There is none. [Interruption] Order! Can I just have a little less assistance from Mr Brownlee.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000031\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e4b09a29-dfd3-42c0-8585-11463bd6077b\u0022\u003EDocument, by leave, laid on the Table of the House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000032\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022830d2993ef774762bd759e7496f221db\u0022\u003EAndrew Little\u003C/span\u003E: Is Kim Campbell, chief executive of the Employers and Manufacturers Association (Northern), right when he says \u201CWhatever is happening now\u2014it\u2019s not working.\u201D and \u201CWhat we need is a massive Government-led house building programme.\u201D, which, funnily enough, sounds a lot like Labour\u2019s KiwiBuild programme?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000033\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220083bcaa-f44d-4b70-97de-d091a209b88c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022758fe0eeebe24f23ae6dd1b418a36634\u0022\u003ERt Hon JOHN KEY\u003C/span\u003E: He is absolutely right when he says that whatever is happening now is not working, if he is talking about the Labour Party. [Interruption]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000034\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e4b09a29-dfd3-42c0-8585-11463bd6077b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00223a172a0982d940dc9276519fe62990bb\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Order! To my left, the Leader of the Opposition is asking for a supplementary question.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000035\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022c836220b6b6b498eb225f3785af1bbe7\u0022\u003EAndrew Little\u003C/span\u003E: When Kim Campbell, the Council of Trade Unions\u2019 Richard Wagstaff, and even Paula Bennett say there is a crisis, why does he not just admit that the Government\u2019s housing policies have failed?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000036\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220083bcaa-f44d-4b70-97de-d091a209b88c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022d61749426ec44a71b1b5c51547f1da15\u0022\u003ERt Hon JOHN KEY\u003C/span\u003E: The Government\u2019s response in housing has been quite comprehensive, and that is why we are seeing 9,500 new homes being built in Auckland, the highest number in more than 11 years. That is why we are seeing more people employed in construction. That is why we are seeing people accessing KiwiSaver HomeStart to get into their first homes. This is an issue that takes quite a lot of catch-up, because of the work that is required, but I will say that this Government, and under Minister Smith, has been implementing a wide range of policies. The previous Government sat around for 9 years and did absolutely nothing.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000037\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022fb3c12210177418f96e49bc241ecbe61\u0022\u003EAndrew Little\u003C/span\u003E: Have any of these Government policies reversed the fall in homeownership: (1) cheaper Gib board, which has now got more expensive; (2) trying to build houses on cemeteries; or (3) building less than 3 percent of the promised 39,000 houses in special housing areas?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000038\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220083bcaa-f44d-4b70-97de-d091a209b88c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022af5bf6f985ff43499036859a17030665\u0022\u003ERt Hon JOHN KEY\u003C/span\u003E: Once again, the member wishes to make things up, and he is welcome to do that. But I will tell you what is working, and that is the fact that 24,000 houses and sections have been consented in the first 2 years of the housing accord; that there are now 154 special housing areas in Auckland; that the rules have been tightened on property investors; that more Crown land has been released; and that thousands and thousands of people\u2014in fact 42,000, I think, additional people\u2014are in the area of housing and construction. A great deal is happening in Auckland housing. [Interruption] \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000039\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e4b09a29-dfd3-42c0-8585-11463bd6077b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022546ce585304e41ada3a213c3c484cd5f\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Order! [Interruption] Order! Mr Brownlee!\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000040\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022733173dee0c04b838f8c966e4057a6a2\u0022\u003EAndrew Little\u003C/span\u003E: Is it not time to stop the excuses and admit that after 8 years it is the failure of his policies that means that homeownership has fallen every quarter under his Government?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000041\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220083bcaa-f44d-4b70-97de-d091a209b88c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00220b1c726dacc74433ae6e212ac5654734\u0022\u003ERt Hon JOHN KEY\u003C/span\u003E: Firstly, I reject the assertion from the member. Secondly, as I have pointed out already today, there are a great many initiatives that the Government has undertaken. I just look back at the 9 years under the previous Labour Government, and all we saw was interest rates going up. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000042\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022fc8ab326-1806-41d3-8c41-cd58c95dcb45\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022e1ebfa8f03b744a5b111d2ba5bc9f8db\u0022\u003EMetiria Turei\u003C/span\u003E: Why is his Government prioritising the building of 4,500 new hotel rooms for tourists as part of \u201CProject Palace\u201D, when those resources could be directed to the Minister for Building and Housing in order to help build homes for the 4,500 people on the State house waiting list?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000043\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220083bcaa-f44d-4b70-97de-d091a209b88c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002250dc438c90574e6fae9d83db9aaa2775\u0022\u003ERt Hon JOHN KEY\u003C/span\u003E: They are different issues, of course. One is around tourism and the fact that it has become such a massive employer in New Zealand now. I would have thought that the member would want to welcome that. Regarding many of the hotels that are being built, it will ultimately be decided by the private sector whether it wants to invest in them\u2014and they are in places like Queenstown. This might come as a shock to the member, but not every builder who lives in New Zealand wants to move to Auckland. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000044\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022fc8ab326-1806-41d3-8c41-cd58c95dcb45\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00225ca3126281f547d683bde324f44f943d\u0022\u003EMetiria Turei\u003C/span\u003E: Does the Prime Minister not think that in the midst of a housing crisis his Government should prioritise \u201CProject Homes for New Zealanders\u201D and not \u201CProject Palace\u201D for tourists?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000045\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220083bcaa-f44d-4b70-97de-d091a209b88c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00229475ffbcb31741adb4c1e854de9e3c15\u0022\u003ERt Hon JOHN KEY\u003C/span\u003E: I reject the member\u2019s assertion.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000046\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022fc8ab326-1806-41d3-8c41-cd58c95dcb45\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022828d56dc9d8e4c02b40f07d6325e72ab\u0022\u003EMetiria Turei\u003C/span\u003E: Is this the Prime Minister\u2019s new social housing policy, where he builds expensive hotel rooms so that homeless people can stay in them and rack up huge debts to Work and Income instead?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000047\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220083bcaa-f44d-4b70-97de-d091a209b88c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002282097db104f941d494e88ef9c602b028\u0022\u003ERt Hon JOHN KEY\u003C/span\u003E: No.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000048\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022fc8ab326-1806-41d3-8c41-cd58c95dcb45\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002232fb7c96fb3a46efbed56932a446720c\u0022\u003EMetiria Turei\u003C/span\u003E: Does he genuinely think that 4,500 people on the waiting list for a State house and more than 30,000 New Zealanders in severe housing deprivation does not mean that we are in a national housing emergency, one that demands his full attention?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000049\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220083bcaa-f44d-4b70-97de-d091a209b88c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002261cb6b8b5229448db888ab6ccd0adaaf\u0022\u003ERt Hon JOHN KEY\u003C/span\u003E: Like many issues that the Government faces, this does have my full attention. What you have already seen announced by the Minister for Social Development is $41 million being applied to 3,000 places, some of which are new and some of which are existing, but they allow people to access what will no longer be a loan but a grant for social housing. You have also seen the Government moving now on income-related rents for social housing providers. You have seen the Government insulate nearly 300,000 homes. You have seen the Government making sure that there are renewable tenancies, which benefit those with the greatest need. You have seen the Government working in areas like the T\u0101maki redevelopment. The Government is doing a great deal\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000050\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e4b09a29-dfd3-42c0-8585-11463bd6077b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022698d1f671af8473793f3e0a75ce68b39\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Order! The answer is long enough. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000051\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u00228ea28ad7014d438caca640ed6f87f6a8\u0022\u003EImmigration, Auckland\u2014Housing, Infrastructure, and Services\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022 data-id=\u00220f2d1f0f951f46b894f15d2b16c44e36\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000052\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022\u003E2. \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00220f2d1f0f951f46b894f15d2b16c44e36\u0022\u003ERt Hon WINSTON PETERS (Leader\u2014NZ First)\u003C/span\u003E to the Prime Minister: Does he stand by all his statements; if so, why?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00220083bcaa-f44d-4b70-97de-d091a209b88c\u0022 data-id=\u00222fcf3ce44027473f99d8ed939d74ac12\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000053\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220083bcaa-f44d-4b70-97de-d091a209b88c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00222fcf3ce44027473f99d8ed939d74ac12\u0022\u003ERt Hon JOHN KEY (Prime Minister):\u003C/span\u003E Yes, and because I do.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000054\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00220a490585e1d048c0a0d6325aa27cd64f\u0022\u003ERt Hon Winston Peters\u003C/span\u003E: How is Auckland going to solve its housing supply problems when demand is inflated by 34,000 people coming into Auckland from overseas every year\u2014[Interruption] When they stop, I will keep going. [Interruption]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000055\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e4b09a29-dfd3-42c0-8585-11463bd6077b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022140827e1d5f14e97991d69c383946f63\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Order! There is too much interjection, and there is one member, particularly, who is continuing to interject. I can name him if that would help quieten him down. Mr Peters, start the question again.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000056\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022d46bdc4e14c04830b6a07ebcbac25dc4\u0022\u003ERt Hon Winston Peters\u003C/span\u003E: How is Auckland going to solve its housing supply problems when demand is inflated by 34,000 people coming into Auckland from overseas every year, or is this, to quote him, and I do, \u201Chardly some sort of crisis that we cannot cope with.\u201D?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000057\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220083bcaa-f44d-4b70-97de-d091a209b88c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002274959b12ad044ab1af36d7f3438084a7\u0022\u003ERt Hon JOHN KEY\u003C/span\u003E: Some of those people who come in actually come in with skills that can be applied in this particular area of housing. Secondly, if you look at the construction workforce, which has grown by 40,000 in the last 2 years nationally and by 24,200 in Auckland, the reality of a fast-growing Auckland, partly because of population growth both internally and externally, has added to a great deal of economic activity and job opportunities for New Zealanders.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000058\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00220993fd6a25c940c4a14bf214e9050275\u0022\u003ERt Hon Winston Peters\u003C/span\u003E: How is Auckland going to solve its now massive roading infrastructure problems when half the population of New Plymouth, or 34,000, are now coming into Auckland from overseas every year?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000059\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220083bcaa-f44d-4b70-97de-d091a209b88c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00229dc8963a1b874104a618f7b0745f6d70\u0022\u003ERt Hon JOHN KEY\u003C/span\u003E: As the member should know, the Government has been investing massively in infrastructure in Auckland, spending a great deal not only on roading but also on public transport, and billions\u2014I think $4 billion\u2014has gone into KiwiRail in the time that we have had that, and that has included the electrification of lines in Auckland, the additional rolling stock, and the like. The Government is committed to its share of the central business district rail tunnel now. The Government has also invested in very large roading projects like the Waterview Connection.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000060\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022b4ae9daf78ef4a25bf7f96d47cbeea21\u0022\u003ERt Hon Winston Peters\u003C/span\u003E: How is Auckland going to solve its education and health supply problems when the demand for education and health services is inflated by 34,000 long-term arrivals from overseas going to Auckland each year, let alone those who come from the rest of the country?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000061\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220083bcaa-f44d-4b70-97de-d091a209b88c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022161e822550a44ffe81c0a8d81c43d9be\u0022\u003ERt Hon JOHN KEY\u003C/span\u003E: Firstly, many of the people who go to Auckland are returning New Zealanders who have decided to come from overseas because, like myself, they have worked in another part of the world and they have realised what a great place New Zealand is. And under a National-led Government there are so many reasons for them to come back and be a part of Auckland and a part of New Zealand, and there are reasons to celebrate that.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000062\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022b59e5672e00849f390f4e7a5b7f60b59\u0022\u003EHon Gerry Brownlee\u003C/span\u003E: This is great. The member\u2019s running an advertorial for the Government.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000063\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022f2de8335c5674845befa187629b76048\u0022\u003ERt Hon Winston Peters\u003C/span\u003E: Eat your heart out, Gerry.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000064\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002247d654d370f74e39abe3c7cee5683af9\u0022\u003EHon Member\u003C/span\u003E: Bring back Ron.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000065\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022745f2e1c8def493e8ffd402b68d89195\u0022\u003ERt Hon Winston Peters\u003C/span\u003E: They have never asked you, mate.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000066\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e4b09a29-dfd3-42c0-8585-11463bd6077b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022fd76ddcbae0f43ccacf05c91fbf3e3d3\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Order! I know the member is responding, but, on this occasion, can we have the supplementary question.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000067\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00220fef440340a646dc8414c093b081c1c4\u0022\u003ERt Hon Winston Peters\u003C/span\u003E: If the latest household economic survey reports that every income decile has declined in homeownership except for the top 10 percent, when will he start governing for all New Zealanders and not just for his rich mates?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000068\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220083bcaa-f44d-4b70-97de-d091a209b88c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022e415d3834ef84d2fa89037c41f421f3a\u0022\u003ERt Hon JOHN KEY\u003C/span\u003E: If one looks generally at those who think the country is going in the right direction versus the wrong direction, the member will see that, substantially, the number of people who think the country is going in the right direction outnumbers those who think it is going in the wrong direction. They are New Zealanders from all parts of the country and with all different economic cohorts. I think that answers the member\u2019s question. [Interruption]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000069\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e4b09a29-dfd3-42c0-8585-11463bd6077b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022e48f4dbe187c4d208bb015d26ccfdea7\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Order!\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000070\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u00222924bc9bdbf746dcb08939236901f2d8\u0022\u003EBudget 2016\u2014Fiscal Strategy\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022fdb01002-a7cf-4a77-8f05-678d24a36849\u0022 data-id=\u0022afda9931f249482984f7648047de7c85\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000071\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022fdb01002-a7cf-4a77-8f05-678d24a36849\u0022\u003E3. \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022afda9931f249482984f7648047de7c85\u0022\u003ETODD MULLER (National\u2014Bay of Plenty)\u003C/span\u003E to the Minister of Finance: How will Budget 2016 build on the Government\u2019s commitment to a more productive and competitive economy while delivering responsible fiscal management?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022bb158206-360b-4757-8d72-f7d0994e1fb3\u0022 data-id=\u0022debf561c622844599a55c16b7b299397\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000072\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bb158206-360b-4757-8d72-f7d0994e1fb3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022debf561c622844599a55c16b7b299397\u0022\u003EHon BILL ENGLISH (Minister of Finance):\u003C/span\u003E New Zealand has made good progress over the last 3 years. The economy is growing by 10.2 percent, with average growth of 3.4 percent per annum over those 3 years. Average weekly wages have increased by 7.7 percent, there is an average growth rate of 2.6 percent compared with average inflation of 0.7, and the unemployment rate is down\u2014in fact, in the member\u2019s electorate, it is about 5.1 percent compared with 3 years ago. Budget 2016 will build on this considerable progress.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000073\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022fdb01002-a7cf-4a77-8f05-678d24a36849\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00227f37ffe825094a9aabbb4e5d49d89e87\u0022\u003ETodd Muller\u003C/span\u003E: How will Budget 2016 deliver on the Government\u2019s commitment to responsible fiscal management?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000074\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bb158206-360b-4757-8d72-f7d0994e1fb3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022dc7f90ea825b4a77b886d5197523ea44\u0022\u003EHon BILL ENGLISH\u003C/span\u003E: The deficit from 2011 was $18 billion, and in 2015 there was a small surplus. The Government has turned its focus to consolidating those surpluses so it can begin the process of paying down debt, which has run up fairly significantly since 2009 onwards. That would put New Zealand in a better position to deal with future recessions or natural disasters. In Budget 2016 the Government will, of course, measure its success not by how much money is spent but by how much difference the spending makes, particularly for vulnerable New Zealanders.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000075\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022fdb01002-a7cf-4a77-8f05-678d24a36849\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00224003bbd9a1f14315afea2fc62863ee29\u0022\u003ETodd Muller\u003C/span\u003E: What recent initiatives has the Government announced to support a growing economy as part of Budget 2016?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000076\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bb158206-360b-4757-8d72-f7d0994e1fb3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00221253d2f810c24999a8548d1d1356beb0\u0022\u003EHon BILL ENGLISH\u003C/span\u003E: The Government has so many initiatives to support a forward-looking, growing economy that it has announced a number of them prior to the Budget. For instance, there is $45 million for the tourism sector because it is growing so fast, to help communities build smaller scale infrastructure projects. Last week Minister Joyce announced funding for a further 5,500 apprentices by 2020. This will also support 2,500 more people into the M\u0101ori and Pasifika trades training programme, which will reach 3,400 next year\u2014up from just 1,200 in 2014. Those are just a few examples of the Government focusing on getting better results.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000077\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022fdb01002-a7cf-4a77-8f05-678d24a36849\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022e318904c5e6a4c9ca53160a8c0707920\u0022\u003ETodd Muller\u003C/span\u003E: What reports has the Minister seen from notable\u2014or, at least, recognisable\u2014commentators on the indicators of a successful society?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000078\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bb158206-360b-4757-8d72-f7d0994e1fb3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a98d558041a242fab0e75afbfc0e0b15\u0022\u003EHon BILL ENGLISH\u003C/span\u003E: I have seen a recent report from one commentator listing indicators of a successful society, which include improving employment outcomes and raising incomes. By contrast, I have seen a report from another commentator, who, instead, says that what matters is the percentage of the increase in GDP each year going to income. The first one was Grant Robertson, and the second one was Andrew Little. I wish they would agree with themselves. [Interruption] \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000079\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e4b09a29-dfd3-42c0-8585-11463bd6077b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002293fcc6cb2a984127b6534503c5ee720c\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Order! We are coming to it now, I suspect.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000080\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u002256388b7ab80a4e6faa635c41fdac4a8a\u0022\u003EBudget 2016\u2014Tax Cuts\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022 data-id=\u00224f8281a4bbb3456da50f6331f6248684\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000081\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003E4. \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00224f8281a4bbb3456da50f6331f6248684\u0022\u003EGRANT ROBERTSON (Labour\u2014Wellington Central)\u003C/span\u003E to the Minister of Finance: What is his answer to Fran O\u2019Sullivan\u2019s question, \u201CWas John Key\u2019s brain fart on the tax front an involuntary exercise or was it calculated\u201D?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022bb158206-360b-4757-8d72-f7d0994e1fb3\u0022 data-id=\u00225013d9d8ffa345f9b885b0d49b58b973\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000082\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bb158206-360b-4757-8d72-f7d0994e1fb3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00225013d9d8ffa345f9b885b0d49b58b973\u0022\u003EHon BILL ENGLISH (Minister of Finance):\u003C/span\u003E I would say she got it wrong.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000083\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022e3cc028730fb462ca0a5ba17a6345e01\u0022\u003EGrant Robertson\u003C/span\u003E: When he took tax cuts off the table in his pre-Budget speech, was he expecting the Prime Minister to put them back on the table 3 days later?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000084\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bb158206-360b-4757-8d72-f7d0994e1fb3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022c73644aa5d6e434eb05a524f5972a97e\u0022\u003EHon BILL ENGLISH\u003C/span\u003E: What I made clear is that the fiscal conditions in this Budget had not been met for tax reductions, and of course the Opposition will just have to have a look at the numbers in the Budget this week to see whether they think those fiscal conditions can be met in the future.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000085\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00222999e8add80d4734ad8dead81e546706\u0022\u003EGrant Robertson\u003C/span\u003E: What is his response to Westpac economist Dominick Stephens, who said: \u201CIf the plan is for $3 billion of tax cuts, as the Prime Minister said, down the line, then that makes the accounts that he will deliver this week irrelevant and obsolete.\u201D?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000086\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bb158206-360b-4757-8d72-f7d0994e1fb3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022958acaf3987a48f19184fa649f5db6a2\u0022\u003EHon BILL ENGLISH\u003C/span\u003E: I would disagree with him.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000087\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022926c9b7fa8084326b0f383e812bc6d09\u0022\u003EGrant Robertson\u003C/span\u003E: Why do you disagree with him?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000088\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bb158206-360b-4757-8d72-f7d0994e1fb3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022f60da1f3c5664e3b965745d334eff9cc\u0022\u003EHon BILL ENGLISH\u003C/span\u003E: Due to the hard work of the Public Service, the members of the various coalition Governments, and the New Zealand public, this Budget will indicate that New Zealand has choices out ahead of us that very few other developed countries have. They simply will not have choices because their public finances are not yet in a sustainable position\u2014ours are.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000089\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00224845d5e03adf4d42ba664b08729c2172\u0022\u003EDavid Seymour\u003C/span\u003E: When was the last time that the Government of New Zealand cut taxes with the Labour Party in power, and who was the Minister of Finance at the time?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000090\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022bab9122adf034d77ae34ba902c41a1e0\u0022\u003EHon Members\u003C/span\u003E: There\u2019s no responsibility for that.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000091\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e4b09a29-dfd3-42c0-8585-11463bd6077b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022e2b4231c6583401e9519b74318df7141\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Order! No. It is an information question to the House. I think there is some responsibility to answer it.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000092\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bb158206-360b-4757-8d72-f7d0994e1fb3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a5ba84d72f3d44a9a6f4a2d6417418f0\u0022\u003EHon BILL ENGLISH\u003C/span\u003E: This Government\u2019s tax package in 2010 cut some taxes\u2014that is, the taxes on things we like, like work, savings, and investment\u2014and pushed up taxes on something we think we had too much of, which was consumption. Prior to that I think it was Dr Cullen who announced tax cuts in 2008, which could not be fulfilled because of the recession. [Interruption]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000093\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e4b09a29-dfd3-42c0-8585-11463bd6077b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022701a6cdb8deb47b0a4e548221ea6554f\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Order! The level of interjection now on my left-hand side is simply too high. If I want to specifically mention a couple I could do that, but I am going to have to ask for some cooperation. Otherwise, I will be dealing with it more severely. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000094\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00227358181f83b54b81b192679741ab3b5f\u0022\u003EGrant Robertson\u003C/span\u003E: Are tax cuts a priority when New Zealanders are living in cars and garages?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000095\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bb158206-360b-4757-8d72-f7d0994e1fb3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022b179ba95617b417987a05ce73078aabd\u0022\u003EHon BILL ENGLISH\u003C/span\u003E: As we have indicated, there will not be any tax cuts in this Budget. There are other priorities to deal with, but there is a whole range of priorities. On different days the Opposition says it is elective surgery. On other days it is student debt. On other days it is budgeting services. Today it happens to be people living in cars. The Opposition does not seem to have any idea of what it thinks the priorities are. [Interruption] \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000096\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e4b09a29-dfd3-42c0-8585-11463bd6077b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002255311daa3dad4c67b1f511bb731840d9\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Order! [Interruption] Order!\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000097\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00220e9e2ef1a8ad436facd4e11f2413df2f\u0022\u003EGrant Robertson\u003C/span\u003E: In light of that answer, if New Zealanders are still living in cars and garages in 2017 will he still propose tax cuts?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000098\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bb158206-360b-4757-8d72-f7d0994e1fb3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002208d07a69f7c341079c97c40b762d091c\u0022\u003EHon BILL ENGLISH\u003C/span\u003E: The member is getting well ahead of himself. He can be assured that the level of public support for the Budget for 2016, I am sure, will be positive and considerable, and that will give this Government\u2014because of its sound financial position\u2014plenty of choices for dealing with pressures that might be there next year.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000099\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022da30f9abc99945e5bfa2b3872c451f1e\u0022\u003EGrant Robertson\u003C/span\u003E: Did the Prime Minister tell the Minister of Finance that he was going to put tax cuts back on the table just 3 days after he had taken them off?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000100\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bb158206-360b-4757-8d72-f7d0994e1fb3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022b2057483cdc544a4a950d581b61741e4\u0022\u003EHon BILL ENGLISH\u003C/span\u003E: We completely disagree with the member\u2019s characterisation of what the Prime Minister said, and the Prime Minister and I and Ministers regularly have strategic discussions.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000101\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u0022ac304e0c67204b8a9a944240dfb12ff3\u0022\u003EConservation, Department\u2014Funding and Maintenance of Facilities\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002281e8ca24-8b1d-4558-9ef9-c9418df2b3c0\u0022 data-id=\u0022e1fba14d64094b0e904f50408b5a789f\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000102\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002281e8ca24-8b1d-4558-9ef9-c9418df2b3c0\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022e1fba14d64094b0e904f50408b5a789f\u0022\u003EKEVIN HAGUE (Green):\u003C/span\u003E My question is to the Minister of Conservation and asks: is she confident that the Department of Conservation can carry out its work considering the inflation-adjusted reduction in Vote Conservation allocation it has endured under her Government?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022736a5c0b-8df3-4047-ba26-632ba2798b4c\u0022 data-id=\u00227097bdabd3bc4075b6a6d1b1a288c949\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000103\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022736a5c0b-8df3-4047-ba26-632ba2798b4c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00227097bdabd3bc4075b6a6d1b1a288c949\u0022\u003EHon MAGGIE BARRY (Minister of Conservation):\u003C/span\u003E That question varies from the one that was given to us. It has included inflation adjustment. I am happy to answer it.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022e4b09a29-dfd3-42c0-8585-11463bd6077b\u0022 data-id=\u0022481f3b05dbfb4c7ab0377ff3409debd6\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000104\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e4b09a29-dfd3-42c0-8585-11463bd6077b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022481f3b05dbfb4c7ab0377ff3409debd6\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: It is the question as it is on my sheet. I can ask the member to read it again if that would help the Minister. Can we repeat the question? It was certainly read exactly as per my sheet.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002281e8ca24-8b1d-4558-9ef9-c9418df2b3c0\u0022 data-id=\u0022b105210855ca4e0a9c1869f2fff5ba6b\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000105\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002281e8ca24-8b1d-4558-9ef9-c9418df2b3c0\u0022\u003E5. \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022b105210855ca4e0a9c1869f2fff5ba6b\u0022\u003EKEVIN HAGUE (Green)\u003C/span\u003E to the Minister of Conservation: Is she confident that the Department of Conservation can carry out its work considering the inflation-adjusted reduction in Vote Conservation allocation it has endured under her Government?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022736a5c0b-8df3-4047-ba26-632ba2798b4c\u0022 data-id=\u0022dd6464501cc34e738fbc886c5a98464d\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000106\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022736a5c0b-8df3-4047-ba26-632ba2798b4c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022dd6464501cc34e738fbc886c5a98464d\u0022\u003EHon MAGGIE BARRY (Minister of Conservation):\u003C/span\u003E I am entirely confident that the Department of Conservation (DOC) can carry out its work, but I refute the idea that DOC has endured a reduction. It has not. The core Crown revenue provided to DOC in the dying days of the Labour Government in 2007-08 was $263 million. We are forecast to provide $338 million out of an overall budget of $391 million in 2015-16. This is an increase, and, in addition to that, commercial-partnership funding has gone up over the past 7 years from about $4 million to $9.3 million\u2014not a reduction by anybody\u2019s mathematics, I would have thought.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000107\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002281e8ca24-8b1d-4558-9ef9-c9418df2b3c0\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022d5a8c6b3cd6644aaa057b32fdf79b275\u0022\u003EKevin Hague\u003C/span\u003E: I seek leave to table a document. It is a table prepared by the Parliamentary Library, and it analyses the differences in conservation spending from a 2008-09 baseline in real terms, demonstrating the reduction.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000108\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e4b09a29-dfd3-42c0-8585-11463bd6077b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00224c8ec63907c842a981ba130a9ad9e347\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Order! The last part is not necessary. Leave is sought to table that particular Parliamentary Library information. Is there any objection? There is none. It can be tabled.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000109\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e4b09a29-dfd3-42c0-8585-11463bd6077b\u0022\u003EDocument, by leave, laid on the Table of the House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000110\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002281e8ca24-8b1d-4558-9ef9-c9418df2b3c0\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002279fa302ec89f4addae1185766ed05406\u0022\u003EKevin Hague\u003C/span\u003E: Can the Minister confirm that 38 DOC-maintained structures are in serious or critical need of work, including 23 bridges and six viewing platforms, including a well-known viewing platform in Milford Sound?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000111\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022736a5c0b-8df3-4047-ba26-632ba2798b4c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022f435448601124ffea2d6a0dffab02dad\u0022\u003EHon MAGGIE BARRY\u003C/span\u003E: The member is being a bit selective with the places that he is highlighting. I would like to just put some facts out on the table. The data shows that about 13 of 944 huts that DOC manages had some serious work that was outstanding\u2014something as small as a missing hearth brush is enough to mean that a hut does not meet its service standards. The number needing serious work equates to just 1.3 percent of DOC\u2019s extensive network of\u2014often remotely located\u2014huts. This actually serves to reinforce DOC\u2019s inspection and maintenance programme as very thorough. DOC spent more than $18 million on hut maintenance last year, and it continues to invest\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000112\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002281e8ca24-8b1d-4558-9ef9-c9418df2b3c0\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022c0ac9543957b408b9a34f2ca50476666\u0022\u003EKevin Hague\u003C/span\u003E: I raise a point of order, Mr Speaker.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000113\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022736a5c0b-8df3-4047-ba26-632ba2798b4c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002214ce8f8b91c842e9b8c5d6ecf908ec47\u0022\u003EHon MAGGIE BARRY\u003C/span\u003E: \u2014in improving its\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000114\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e4b09a29-dfd3-42c0-8585-11463bd6077b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00229698794e0ecc4d808fa675e13558d244\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Order! Point of order, Kevin Hague.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000115\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002281e8ca24-8b1d-4558-9ef9-c9418df2b3c0\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022e8cb478c932a4f1599b55dd2a0bc744c\u0022\u003EKevin Hague\u003C/span\u003E: It is a long answer, but my question was actually quite straightforward\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000116\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e4b09a29-dfd3-42c0-8585-11463bd6077b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00221d30a3866d4a445d8ba2f7ba0514ede9\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Order! [Interruption] Order! The way forward, because I do not think the question has, at this stage, been addressed, is that I am going to invite the member to ask the question again.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000117\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002281e8ca24-8b1d-4558-9ef9-c9418df2b3c0\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00224bcea19a1d684ad1b0d12d42b4578e2c\u0022\u003EKevin Hague\u003C/span\u003E: Can the Minister confirm that 38 DOC-maintained structures are in need of serious or critical work, including 23 bridges and six viewing platforms, including a well-known viewing platform in Milford Sound?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000118\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022736a5c0b-8df3-4047-ba26-632ba2798b4c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022366f044453f640fc8ae88d300412a0df\u0022\u003EHon MAGGIE BARRY\u003C/span\u003E: There are tasks\u2014and these are ones that the member alludes to\u2014that the engineers have indicated a need to have carried out within the next 6 months. About a third of the work on the list that the member is citing, and was provided with by my office, has already been completed within this past month. The department undertakes tens of thousands of individual tasks such as these every year. All structures are inspected on a 2-yearly rotation. DOC takes its responsibilities for the public\u2019s and its staff\u2019s safety very, very seriously, and we have scheduled work for all of the projects that the member has noted, to be concluded by November this year. We spend $45 million\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000119\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e4b09a29-dfd3-42c0-8585-11463bd6077b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022d85c26aaf81f444b8cff6926540cb9a9\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Order! I think that the question was answered some time ago.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000120\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002281e8ca24-8b1d-4558-9ef9-c9418df2b3c0\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022dd8639e447924756becd8872047eca69\u0022\u003EKevin Hague\u003C/span\u003E: Can the Minister confirm that there are 103 DOC-maintained bridges that either are not safe to walk across or are in critical need of repair?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000121\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022736a5c0b-8df3-4047-ba26-632ba2798b4c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002249a38b20e8ad4c1986ddb60d738c02cd\u0022\u003EHon MAGGIE BARRY\u003C/span\u003E: No. I would go back to the answer that I gave you before. DOC takes its responsibilities very seriously. I will not, and do not, confirm that the repair that is needed is of a substantial nature. If it was dangerous\u2014if our inspectors, who go through regularly and inspect it thoroughly, felt there was any risk to public safety\u2014then those structures would be closed down. They are part of a work schedule that is being done and that is being carried out with all seriousness.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000122\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002281e8ca24-8b1d-4558-9ef9-c9418df2b3c0\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022f3bc4e2fb8cb4d9b8e5d91792d4ac1e3\u0022\u003EKevin Hague\u003C/span\u003E: I raise a point of order, Mr Speaker. I seek your guidance. The numbers that I am using in these questions have been derived from answers that the Minister herself has provided. They relate to the\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000123\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e4b09a29-dfd3-42c0-8585-11463bd6077b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00222c90415b18db4705919e394cb004d300\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Can I have the point of order?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000124\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002281e8ca24-8b1d-4558-9ef9-c9418df2b3c0\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022446feb26475948fb8f74869206e6f5c7\u0022\u003EKevin Hague\u003C/span\u003E: What I am not sure about is whether it is possible for me to table her answers to my questions for written answer.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000125\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e4b09a29-dfd3-42c0-8585-11463bd6077b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002263c96ba5ddf8406f9b4b25e2134db8a8\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: No, it is certainly not, and the member knows that. The question was answered immediately. The member asked whether the Minister could confirm, and then went on and listed 103 bridges etc. being safe or in need of critical repair. The Minister immediately said no, she was not in a position to confirm that. The question was addressed.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000126\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002281e8ca24-8b1d-4558-9ef9-c9418df2b3c0\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002285730153ea6640378a7a0fa0f47fb760\u0022\u003EKevin Hague\u003C/span\u003E: Can the Minister confirm her answer to written question No. 4765 that a quarter of huts do not meet DOC\u2019s own service standard, including, for example, Whariwharangi Hut on the Abel Tasman Coast Track Great Walk?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000127\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022736a5c0b-8df3-4047-ba26-632ba2798b4c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00227d72471b922640d88adc31f9843ce234\u0022\u003EHon MAGGIE BARRY\u003C/span\u003E: The member is misrepresenting the information that he was provided with. The data actually shows that just 13 of the 944 huts that DOC manages had serious work outstanding. Something as small, as I said, as a missing hearth brush\u2014those are the things that count. So the number needing serious work is just 1.3 percent, and we are working on it. We spent more than $18 million on hut maintenance last year.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000128\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002281e8ca24-8b1d-4558-9ef9-c9418df2b3c0\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022250e64b8a9da4a1f8b8597e8c6561223\u0022\u003EKevin Hague\u003C/span\u003E: I raise a point of order, Mr Speaker. My question was about whether or not a quarter of the huts met the service standard, and the Minister is answering about critical repairs. That was not the question.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000129\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e4b09a29-dfd3-42c0-8585-11463bd6077b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00225fd67fc7e6a944d28d32142fc31fa53a\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: The question was whether the Minister would confirm an answer she had given to a written question that she had answered from her office, and she immediately took the approach that the member was misrepresenting and misinterpreting the answer that has been given. That is a right that the Minister has. The member can take it further with supplementary questions, but that question has been addressed.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000130\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002281e8ca24-8b1d-4558-9ef9-c9418df2b3c0\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022c4c0b46b85ce47179a2aae580c1999c0\u0022\u003EKevin Hague\u003C/span\u003E: Can the Minister confirm her answer to written question No. 4766 that nearly half of tracks administered by DOC are not up to the department\u2019s own standard, including 60 percent of Great Walk tracks?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000131\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022736a5c0b-8df3-4047-ba26-632ba2798b4c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002214fe38579ef54b54a5194019c7f86551\u0022\u003EHon MAGGIE BARRY\u003C/span\u003E: When we look at the tracks, 50 tracks have been closed since 2008 on our watch. That has often been due to unavoidable natural hazards, but more than 400 tracks and more than 1,000 extra kilometres have been added to DOC\u2019s network over the same period. As with its hut network, DOC is constantly reviewing and upgrading its network of more than 14,000 kilometres of track. If it would help the member, to go back over to the hut question, the loose bricks that he identified in the chimney of that hut in the Abel Tasman have meant that the chimney has been demolished. The hut is still open for about 20 people to use, and it is safe. It is fully functioning, but the fire and the chimney have been cordoned off. These are the staged repairs that DOC does in an effort to keep tracks and huts, and the people who visit our tracks and huts, absolutely safe.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000132\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002281e8ca24-8b1d-4558-9ef9-c9418df2b3c0\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a0061510a7734c2488f3e1cb6b6d919b\u0022\u003EKevin Hague\u003C/span\u003E: Does the Minister stand by her answer to written question No. 4757 that indicated that there were some 168 structures administered by DOC that had failed their load capacity assessments and 709 that had yet to be assessed?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000133\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022736a5c0b-8df3-4047-ba26-632ba2798b4c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00226984ca9fc564421cb5b3c82a02dee3e6\u0022\u003EHon MAGGIE BARRY\u003C/span\u003E: I think the details that the member is going into are all very well. The general responses that I have given need to be applied, which is that when something goes wrong with a DOC structure, whether it is a bridge, a platform, a hut, or a track, we are on to it right away. We have various stages of importance that we address when we are looking at the stages of work and their priorities. DOC does that with the utmost integrity, and with health and safety as our paramount concern. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000134\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002281e8ca24-8b1d-4558-9ef9-c9418df2b3c0\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00225faf04d8de884f02a19c1420d4777211\u0022\u003EKevin Hague\u003C/span\u003E: In this week\u2019s Budget, will the Government increase conservation funding to enable the Department of Conservation to ensure that the 142 species that have become closer to extinction do not become extinct, that people do not put their lives at risk on DOC viewing platforms or bridges, and that our huts and tracks\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000135\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e4b09a29-dfd3-42c0-8585-11463bd6077b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002204a99e01d076454689aae5d541ba9383\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Order! Bring the question to a conclusion.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000136\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002281e8ca24-8b1d-4558-9ef9-c9418df2b3c0\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002212d1466804224c8dae3d9f12599a6270\u0022\u003EKevin Hague\u003C/span\u003E: \u2014meet the expectations that New Zealanders have for them?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000137\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022736a5c0b-8df3-4047-ba26-632ba2798b4c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00222281330df5324e8294c55ce6645e4e35\u0022\u003EHon MAGGIE BARRY\u003C/span\u003E: There are not 143 species that are at risk. The member is definitely being disingenuous. As a result of further information and classification, you boil that figure down, and there are 14, and they are very detailed and we are working on them very hard. When it comes to additional funding, every department in every Government would always say they would like more. DOC is adequately funded at the moment. We have had $20 million given for Battle for our Birds, and more than $11 million last year for the kiwis. New Zealand species protection is a very important part of what DOC does, and we take it very seriously.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000138\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002281e8ca24-8b1d-4558-9ef9-c9418df2b3c0\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00226998ee6aa4f749048e92dcb8f3db8db4\u0022\u003EKevin Hague\u003C/span\u003E: I seek leave to table a list of the 142 species, derived from the Minister\u2019s answers to written questions\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000139\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e4b09a29-dfd3-42c0-8585-11463bd6077b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022eee8ef24e54a4d36b09fd159346d76a5\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Order! I just need to know the source of the list.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000140\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002281e8ca24-8b1d-4558-9ef9-c9418df2b3c0\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002226c2ac2f624b4a0eae42c53cbbeefe42\u0022\u003EKevin Hague\u003C/span\u003E: It is a list compiled by my office from her answers.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000141\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e4b09a29-dfd3-42c0-8585-11463bd6077b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00225bee495894144bdebd81e876de0e6f6e\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: No. I refer the member to Speaker\u2019s ruling 165/1. Information must come from a source like the Parliamentary Library, which I would consider, but if it is prepared by the member\u2019s own office, I am not prepared to put the leave.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000142\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u0022de995538320944408b5bff37f339c409\u0022\u003EHousing, Auckland\u2014Removal of Urban Limits\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022163d0b68-eb0e-4094-9bed-99e184f063e1\u0022 data-id=\u0022d4f5496be7a045d982c6154acac7631b\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000143\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022163d0b68-eb0e-4094-9bed-99e184f063e1\u0022\u003E6. \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022d4f5496be7a045d982c6154acac7631b\u0022\u003EJAMI-LEE ROSS (National\u2014Botany)\u003C/span\u003E to the Minister for Building and Housing: What steps has the Government taken to dismantle Auckland Urban Limits that were identified by the Productivity Commission report in 2012 as a key problem for the city\u2019s housing supply and affordability?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022 data-id=\u0022b14144c2bec54453b0c3f80bf244e30a\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000144\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022b14144c2bec54453b0c3f80bf244e30a\u0022\u003EHon Dr NICK SMITH (Minister for Building and Housing):\u003C/span\u003E The first step was creating special housing areas in 2013. This enables new housing estates to be approved beyond the urban limit, and, to date, this has provided capacity for 27,000 homes in Auckland beyond the old urban limit. The second step was fast-tracking a new unitary plan to replace those urban limits permanently, and that process has only weeks to run. The third step is the Resource Management Act Reform Bill before Parliament, which puts a specific new requirement on councils to provide for land supply. And the fourth step is a new national policy statement that would not allow councils to reinvent metropolitan urban limits in the future.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000145\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022163d0b68-eb0e-4094-9bed-99e184f063e1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022b9c1056caf914a0ea8dd7d49962bf7a1\u0022\u003EJami-Lee Ross\u003C/span\u003E: What comments and reports has he seen of the adverse consequences of removing Auckland\u2019s urban limits?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000146\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002269b952d601bd427e9012bc66833afe4f\u0022\u003EHon Dr NICK SMITH\u003C/span\u003E: I have read reports that the 2012 Productivity Commission report recommending an end to urban limits was an ideological burp from dinosaurs of the extreme right and was best ignored. I have also read a statement saying that Dr Smith\u2019s threat to get rid of Auckland\u2019s metropolitan urban limit is total nonsense and that it will allow massive urban sprawl and completely unsustainable urban development. I have another statement, which says that wholesale destruction of the city limits is the last thing that Aucklanders want to see. It will allow suburban sprawl to rip across the countryside from Whangarei to\u2014[Interruption] \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000147\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e4b09a29-dfd3-42c0-8585-11463bd6077b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00228c783aeecd164441a7e35416adf716bf\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Order! [Interruption] Order! The member will resume his seat. That answer is not going to help.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000148\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022b06d5dac3e56495d829738fda0e31e22\u0022\u003EHon Gerry Brownlee\u003C/span\u003E: I raise a point of order, Mr Speaker. It was a reasonable question. [Interruption] Well, it was. Although the Minister might have taken too long to read some of the extremely strong quotes that were offered by some, it would be nice for the House to know exactly who said those things.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000149\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e4b09a29-dfd3-42c0-8585-11463bd6077b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002246e77970b5ff4e9daad48beaf1d76b29\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: No, no. It was an unreasonable answer. It went on for far too long, and I listened very, very carefully. I was left in little doubt that it was going to then be in breach of Speaker\u2019s ruling 174/4, and I am sure that I am right. Point of order, Hon Gerry Brownlee.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000150\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022805cfff4eaa34a7199562b7118429d0c\u0022\u003EHon Gerry Brownlee\u003C/span\u003E: Supplementary question.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000151\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e4b09a29-dfd3-42c0-8585-11463bd6077b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022c1b663f2b7054dd9bb5442f051aa86db\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Oh, no. I would need to deal with the point of order first, I suspect.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000152\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a30431df96794bfe9be7111c89489c29\u0022\u003EHon Dr NICK SMITH\u003C/span\u003E: I raise a point of order, Mr Speaker. It was not necessary to identify the source of the comments\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000153\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e4b09a29-dfd3-42c0-8585-11463bd6077b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00225ad4c53111aa4d0d920db712229df893\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: This had better be a point of order, Mr Smith.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000154\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022ce8004dbca144c609425c81205a887c5\u0022\u003EHon Dr NICK SMITH\u003C/span\u003E: \u2014because his face was quite red.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000155\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00226477bc5d8b99403e8a99035edfc46a96\u0022\u003EHon Gerry Brownlee\u003C/span\u003E: I did not quite hear what the point of order was, but my question is: who was the genius personality who made those comments?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000156\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e4b09a29-dfd3-42c0-8585-11463bd6077b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002260151683366b4a3a8b7186960d5ed183\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: No, there is no ministerial responsibility for that.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000157\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022163d0b68-eb0e-4094-9bed-99e184f063e1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022ab51d7fab626459a8c26914796b22348\u0022\u003EJami-Lee Ross\u003C/span\u003E: Does the Minister recall any reports of dozens of hoardings being erected in Auckland in 2013 with his mugshot on them that decried his policy of overriding the urban limits and advocated a compact city; if so, has he subsequently heard from the authors of those hoardings of any change in position?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000158\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002252a9213326c040a38d6f3c6e03b8082e\u0022\u003ERt Hon Winston Peters\u003C/span\u003E: I raise a point of order, Mr Speaker.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000159\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e4b09a29-dfd3-42c0-8585-11463bd6077b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022c287b5d5c0a149a3988fb2666547bf2a\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Order! [Interruption] Order! I will deal with that point of order in a minute. As I call the Minister to answer that question, if it in any way breaches Speaker\u2019s ruling 174/4 and is simply an answer designed to attack the Opposition, I will deal with it very, very severely. There is a point of order from the Rt Hon Winston Peters.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000160\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022682a4c51a5be4e9185404eab9949b6ab\u0022\u003ERt Hon Winston Peters\u003C/span\u003E: I am very reluctant to do this, but no backbencher should describe a Minister as being a mug, no matter how appropriate the description might be.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000161\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e4b09a29-dfd3-42c0-8585-11463bd6077b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022663ef61552104af0866d28c1c92de68d\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: That is hardly going to help the order of the House. Does the Minister wish to answer the question? I suspect it is very unwise to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000162\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002269ae8ffb39594ceebfcf2fbb86f390ca\u0022\u003EHon Dr NICK SMITH\u003C/span\u003E: Yes, I do recall those hoardings, although it was not my best side. There probably is not a best side in my case. In respect of Labour\u2019s change in position, actually I welcome it, because we can now have a far more intelligent discussion about what will make a difference on housing to Auckland families.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000163\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u00221ac9cdc0a9944c75bfdbe9ec691069d3\u0022\u003EHousing\u2014Affordability and Availability\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022cbc37df2-57ae-4536-94ed-a2e39eecd585\u0022 data-id=\u0022088baf335c2b49c889ad11dd79ff9541\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000164\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cbc37df2-57ae-4536-94ed-a2e39eecd585\u0022\u003E7. \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022088baf335c2b49c889ad11dd79ff9541\u0022\u003EPHIL TWYFORD (Labour\u2014Te Atat\u016B)\u003C/span\u003E to the Minister for Building and Housing: Does he stand by his statement when asked about the housing crisis, that \u201Cthe idea that suddenly happened in May 2016 is a figment of some people\u2019s imagination\u201D?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022 data-id=\u0022aa374d78d67f496a898a11141393ad7c\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000165\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022aa374d78d67f496a898a11141393ad7c\u0022\u003EHon Dr NICK SMITH (Minister for Building and Housing):\u003C/span\u003E I stand by my full statement, which was preceded by this: \u201CI have been a member of Parliament for 26 years, dealing with constituency cases every single year involving families in desperate situations around housing, including people living in caravans and people living in garages, as well as cars. This is not new.\u201D\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000166\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cbc37df2-57ae-4536-94ed-a2e39eecd585\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022c8743d8661bf41ebb9f4830e2f1695f9\u0022\u003EPhil Twyford\u003C/span\u003E: What is the Government\u2019s position on the housing crisis: Paula Bennett admits there is a crisis, John Key says \u201Ccrisis\u201D is an emotive word, and he says it is a figment of someone\u2019s imagination?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000167\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022dfec80f694da475baf63ed5becb3aa34\u0022\u003EHon Dr NICK SMITH\u003C/span\u003E: Every one of those claims by the member were typical half-quotes. There is no question that New Zealand is doing well. Our population has grown by 70,000 over the last year and, particularly, our housing issues have become a real challenge in Auckland. I would also have to say that in Christchurch, where rents have dropped by 5 percent, the Government\u2019s measures to address the housing shortages over the earthquakes has seen a drop in the number of people facing acute housing need.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000168\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cbc37df2-57ae-4536-94ed-a2e39eecd585\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022ddbc9e45b08e413ca455d9c4bbb76bb9\u0022\u003EPhil Twyford\u003C/span\u003E: When he accused the media this morning of inventing promises, was he denying that in last year\u2019s Budget, he pledged 500 hectares of Crown land for housing but has delivered only 13 hectares, or was it just a figment of the media\u2019s imagination?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000169\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022f134adec95e6417ea8744e0beabbfe37\u0022\u003EHon Dr NICK SMITH\u003C/span\u003E: I challenge the member to go back and read the press release from last year\u2019s Budget, in which $52 million was committed to the Crown land programme. All of that money has been spent on purchasing land, and that land is going to be providing houses\u2014940 houses for Aucklanders\u2014which I assume members opposite would welcome.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000170\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002258eae615-ef83-4df5-bace-6749bdd312a8\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022d1c10052b1ad43d3b7fb5150de1c211e\u0022\u003EDr Parmjeet Parmar\u003C/span\u003E: Has the Minister seen today\u2019s housing affordability data from interest.co.nz, and what does it say about homeownership costs as compared with a year ago and when National came into office?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000171\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022b96e808344f54803a57e61eaa95e39ff\u0022\u003EHon Dr NICK SMITH\u003C/span\u003E: This independent index of affordability was previously named the Roost index, and it measures the proportion of a single person on the median wage to serve an 80 percent mortgage on a median-priced house. The index today stands at 58 percent nationally; it has improved over the last year from 62 percent, and it is about 20 percent better than what it was in 2008. The index in Auckland is currently 93 percent, down from 96 percent at the same time last year, and 101 percent of where it was at its very worst under the last Labour Government. This index shows, actually, that housing affordability, both nationally and in Auckland, has improved over the last year and is significantly better than at the time when Labour was in Government.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000172\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cbc37df2-57ae-4536-94ed-a2e39eecd585\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022eb6cc770570a451baa1d2406c3c958e8\u0022\u003EPhil Twyford\u003C/span\u003E: When he promised in his 2014 Budget initiative that he would knock $3,500 off the cost of a new home, was that a figment of our imagination, given that plasterboard costs alone have gone up by more than the total saving that he promised?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000173\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022dd343b43b1e04bd1804402ed45dce63e\u0022\u003EHon Dr NICK SMITH\u003C/span\u003E: I absolutely stand by the initiative taken in Budget 2014 to take tariffs off building materials. The advice I have had from the ministry is that the reduction in those tariffs is within 10 percent of the estimates that I gave at that time. I totally dispute the member\u2019s claim that the cost of plasterboard has gone up by 50 percent.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000174\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cbc37df2-57ae-4536-94ed-a2e39eecd585\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022141671a11f62424aa728836fb0a41eba\u0022\u003EPhil Twyford\u003C/span\u003E: Is it not actually the Minister who has the overactive imagination, given that he dreams that houses can magically appear on cemeteries and exploding substations?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000175\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022f3d3f848424848a1ae9dabf8107d057f\u0022\u003EHon Dr NICK SMITH\u003C/span\u003E: I would focus on the facts. The facts are that when Labour left Government, only 10 houses per working day were being built. The latest figures show that, in fact, 40 houses per working day are being built, and I suggest that that is where the answer lies.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000176\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u00223af17777e6244a588996eb796e7a2b8a\u0022\u003ESuperGold Card\u2014Auckland Transport\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022 data-id=\u00227d3a25026d1a402bbe6991a6bee6520e\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000177\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022\u003E8. \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00227d3a25026d1a402bbe6991a6bee6520e\u0022\u003ERt Hon WINSTON PETERS (Leader\u2014NZ First)\u003C/span\u003E to the Prime Minister: Does he stand by all his statements; if so, how?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00220083bcaa-f44d-4b70-97de-d091a209b88c\u0022 data-id=\u002256cf5e8b8c0242dab033556a6be4273b\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000178\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220083bcaa-f44d-4b70-97de-d091a209b88c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002256cf5e8b8c0242dab033556a6be4273b\u0022\u003ERt Hon JOHN KEY (Prime Minister):\u003C/span\u003E Yes; and by saying so. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000179\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022667706d2e3c048caba56ba6575cb1d55\u0022\u003ERt Hon Winston Peters\u003C/span\u003E: Well, if it is by saying so, how does he reconcile his statement of 6 April, \u201Cthe entitlements for the SuperGold card are not changing.\u201D, when over 650,000 senior citizens must spend $15 if they want to use public transport in Auckland after 1 July this year?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000180\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220083bcaa-f44d-4b70-97de-d091a209b88c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022ff9c8278a554406db7d8edf0e462d687\u0022\u003ERt Hon JOHN KEY\u003C/span\u003E: Because my statement was correct on the advice that I had. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000181\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00224156b9ee2aba4c07b31ab34f9faaccaf\u0022\u003ERt Hon Winston Peters\u003C/span\u003E: Why is the Prime Minister\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000182\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e4b09a29-dfd3-42c0-8585-11463bd6077b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00225cfbc42b06f8446d88776e1983a0c2ae\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Order! Is this a supplementary question?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000183\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022ce9e672fd545480d91ba3daa670e3a57\u0022\u003ERt Hon Winston Peters\u003C/span\u003E: I know it should be a point of order, but it is a supplementary question. Why is the Prime Minister insisting upon his word, given only last month, when there is already a travel card that can be used by retirees all over New Zealand\u2014and Auckland\u2014and it is called the SuperGold card?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000184\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220083bcaa-f44d-4b70-97de-d091a209b88c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00226ff8856f7a234a21984db0fb1e728aa4\u0022\u003ERt Hon JOHN KEY\u003C/span\u003E: These can continue to be used, and will be. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000185\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002279811e548df44a90b5b25ea83e68f666\u0022\u003ERt Hon Winston Peters\u003C/span\u003E: Why is the Prime Minister saying that the SuperGold card can continue to be used in Auckland when this document here from Auckland Transport, coming out on Friday, says the very opposite?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000186\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220083bcaa-f44d-4b70-97de-d091a209b88c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022d668cd280d8b4ade8a09082c4254e812\u0022\u003ERt Hon JOHN KEY\u003C/span\u003E: The member did not specifically ask me about Auckland.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000187\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00228a376c3fb4c7439a929045ec93f0b719\u0022\u003ERt Hon Winston Peters\u003C/span\u003E: Why is the subterfuge of a needlessly expensive, gold-coloured HOP card going to replace the free SuperGold card retirees have been happily using for years?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000188\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220083bcaa-f44d-4b70-97de-d091a209b88c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022ff24d044e9ea4fd19556b097c7e00281\u0022\u003ERt Hon JOHN KEY\u003C/span\u003E: The advice I have had is that there are long-term benefits of using the HOP card. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000189\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00220478d0aa76a94925932fb97502fec153\u0022\u003ERt Hon Winston Peters\u003C/span\u003E: I seek leave to table the evidence, to go in behind these questions today, that is from the Auckland Transport release to be made this Friday, which totally gainsays what the Prime Minister said.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000190\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e4b09a29-dfd3-42c0-8585-11463bd6077b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022afc37d9539d24560a0b94094c3d163b1\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: I just need the source. Were they\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000191\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022b175f42fa5d94efb9fcc0e4cc404a69a\u0022\u003ERt Hon Winston Peters\u003C/span\u003E: Auckland Transport. This is the issue that is going out to every retired person\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000192\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e4b09a29-dfd3-42c0-8585-11463bd6077b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002281bed265bdb34571a7e9904979f5bb0b\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Order! Is the stuff available on the website?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000193\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022ebe61818beed4ea1ae5adc6a57878274\u0022\u003ERt Hon Winston Peters\u003C/span\u003E: No, it is not. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000194\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e4b09a29-dfd3-42c0-8585-11463bd6077b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00222633a79cca4642c7b3cd8032702871db\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: No? Then I will put the leave. [Interruption] Order! Leave is sought to table this particular information. Is there any objection? There is. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000195\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u0022c60e35659eba4c619a36f04c2a384313\u0022\u003ERoading, Auckland\u2014Western Ring Route Motorway\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022695678cf-542a-4616-9e0a-86990caec192\u0022 data-id=\u0022c2dfcb1ac9fb438182311e78f851d9ea\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000196\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022695678cf-542a-4616-9e0a-86990caec192\u0022\u003E9. \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022c2dfcb1ac9fb438182311e78f851d9ea\u0022\u003EALFRED NGARO (National)\u003C/span\u003E to the Minister of Transport: What recent progress has been made on construction of the Government\u2019s Western Ring Route motorway in Auckland?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022badb0a39-849c-462a-b32f-77fc017c9fc2\u0022 data-id=\u0022c1170a596a494ecf86d47547bb89d78c\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000197\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022badb0a39-849c-462a-b32f-77fc017c9fc2\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022c1170a596a494ecf86d47547bb89d78c\u0022\u003EHon SIMON BRIDGES (Minister of Transport):\u003C/span\u003E Construction of the Government\u2019s $2.4 billion western ring route has serious momentum. As part of the project, I had the pleasure of opening the $210 million Te Atat\u016B and Lincoln Road interchanges alongside my colleague Alfred Ngaro. West Auckland is experiencing high population growth but many need to travel for work in the central business district, at the airport, and to South Auckland. The new interchanges will support this growth by freeing up traffic flow on the north-western motorway while the extended bus shoulders will improve bus journey times during peak periods. All up, the two projects will mean that traffic and bus services will be able to get to and from west Auckland more quickly and reliably. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000198\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022695678cf-542a-4616-9e0a-86990caec192\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022d803ee227b284f02bb760a997f4c9a8e\u0022\u003EAlfred Ngaro\u003C/span\u003E: How will the Government\u2019s western ring route improve roading connections for those travelling in and around Auckland?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000199\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022badb0a39-849c-462a-b32f-77fc017c9fc2\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022dec2eee9601846f0b4fc9ac288cd7ac7\u0022\u003EHon SIMON BRIDGES\u003C/span\u003E: Once completed, the western ring route will be a game-changer in terms of the way people and freight move about Auckland, by providing an alternative 48-kilometre north-south route to use instead of State Highway 1. The new motorway will support the fast-growing western suburbs of Auckland and provide more reliable access to and from the city and Auckland Airport. It will also improve public transport and ease pressure on local roads. The western ring route is the biggest infrastructure project in New Zealand. It has been 60 years in the making, and I am proud to say that I am part of the Government of infrastructure that is delivering this game-changing motorway for Auckland.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000200\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022793b96f4e3af4dedad7ded4ac1962312\u0022\u003ERt Hon Winston Peters\u003C/span\u003E: What about Northland\u201410 bridges?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000201\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e4b09a29-dfd3-42c0-8585-11463bd6077b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022cebdefda7c7d413dbc3dd3f8d78a19c4\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Order! The member has had his series of supplementaries today. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000202\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u00221847d1ff4cf24eafa44ee8ef9cf16063\u0022\u003EPolice\u2014Funding and Burglary Resolution Rate\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022bbded2ec-ac25-4a73-a380-3f4d87693084\u0022 data-id=\u0022e372474313e74705811fb696425baee8\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000203\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bbded2ec-ac25-4a73-a380-3f4d87693084\u0022\u003E10. \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022e372474313e74705811fb696425baee8\u0022\u003ESTUART NASH (Labour\u2014Napier)\u003C/span\u003E to the Minister of Police: Does she believe the Police have sufficient funding to meet the expectations of the public?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002285ec30d4-6394-433a-a12e-2c4def705dd0\u0022 data-id=\u002225cab158a6be4c8ab95983e768afd98f\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000204\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002285ec30d4-6394-433a-a12e-2c4def705dd0\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002225cab158a6be4c8ab95983e768afd98f\u0022\u003EHon JUDITH COLLINS (Minister of Police):\u003C/span\u003E Yes.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000205\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bbded2ec-ac25-4a73-a380-3f4d87693084\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002224f7fa97cd644d428bc237839729e014\u0022\u003EStuart Nash\u003C/span\u003E: Does she think that the closing of the Papatoetoe Police Station, in order to \u201Creduce property costs,\u201D has contributed to the solving of only 70 of the 1,020 burglaries in Papatoetoe in 2015?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000206\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002285ec30d4-6394-433a-a12e-2c4def705dd0\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002287a642efe85249f6a090fcdeb13cd05d\u0022\u003EHon JUDITH COLLINS\u003C/span\u003E: No.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000207\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bbded2ec-ac25-4a73-a380-3f4d87693084\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00224f42dbeed5bc4336a1209fb04de0638d\u0022\u003EStuart Nash\u003C/span\u003E: Does she think that solving just 53 of the 1,013 burglaries in Glen Innes last year is meeting the expectations of the Glen Innes residents?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000208\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002285ec30d4-6394-433a-a12e-2c4def705dd0\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002288f4e847fd1c429c92f7852b322e87fb\u0022\u003EHon JUDITH COLLINS\u003C/span\u003E: I am sure it is not.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000209\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bbded2ec-ac25-4a73-a380-3f4d87693084\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022eda3f331a92045919cdc5290ac26e842\u0022\u003EStuart Nash\u003C/span\u003E: Does she think that solving none of the nearly 100 burglaries in the tourist spots of Russell national park, Arthur\u2019s Pass, Lake Tekap\u014D, and Te \u0100nau in 2015 is a result of underfunding of the police in these areas?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000210\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002285ec30d4-6394-433a-a12e-2c4def705dd0\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002293b61c9e6ef44984aa8bfda2c5746ac3\u0022\u003EHon JUDITH COLLINS\u003C/span\u003E: Definitely not. In fact, I would suggest to that member that if he considers that burglaries in those particular spots often occur in homes that are vacant\u2014in other words, they are holiday homes\u2014it is very difficult to get burglars when it is announced to the police and reported 6 weeks after the event.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000211\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bbded2ec-ac25-4a73-a380-3f4d87693084\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022f7e70241b17d4e40a346ddd66a14192b\u0022\u003EStuart Nash\u003C/span\u003E: Is the lack of funding the reason that, according to the New Zealand Police\u2019s own annual report, \u201CThe Police employee to population ratio in New Zealand is low in comparison to most similar overseas jurisdictions.\u201D?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000212\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002285ec30d4-6394-433a-a12e-2c4def705dd0\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00224086225a796b460a836445b5c720eec3\u0022\u003EHon JUDITH COLLINS\u003C/span\u003E: Not at all. In fact, I would suggest that that member remember that this Government put 600 extra police on the beat\u2014600 more than his Government ever did.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000213\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u0022b637b22895bc457fbb7a7179ec2d642f\u0022\u003ECyber-security\u2014Computer Emergency Response Team\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002277333e3c-5658-4149-9cad-262a0deed378\u0022 data-id=\u0022c5537d05ec03451083e578596f03a568\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000214\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002277333e3c-5658-4149-9cad-262a0deed378\u0022\u003E11. \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022c5537d05ec03451083e578596f03a568\u0022\u003ETODD BARCLAY (National\u2014Clutha-Southland)\u003C/span\u003E to the Minister for Communications: What recent announcements has the Government made to improve New Zealand\u2019s response to cyber security incidents?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022dc6c0f88-e781-476d-bca1-d1bf9b69302b\u0022 data-id=\u002200d287f4c6054b639e3c3bb9a46bfc8d\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000215\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dc6c0f88-e781-476d-bca1-d1bf9b69302b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002200d287f4c6054b639e3c3bb9a46bfc8d\u0022\u003EHon AMY ADAMS (Minister for Communications):\u003C/span\u003E Earlier this month the Prime Minister announced that $22.2 million of funding would be provided in Budget 2016 for a new national Computer Emergency Response Team (CERT) to combat cyber-attacks and cyber-crime. New Zealand\u2019s CERT will receive and triage cyber reports, track incidents or attacks, and provide advice and alerts to its customers on how to respond and prevent further attacks. It will also be key to our international cooperation on cyber-security. Cyber-security is a growing issue for New Zealand businesses, and costs our economy an estimated $257 million last year. Our new national CERT will be a key piece of our cyber-security architecture, and the central place to go for help and information.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000216\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002277333e3c-5658-4149-9cad-262a0deed378\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022f5b84ee722b648abbb7426f05c95ea81\u0022\u003ETodd Barclay\u003C/span\u003E: What are the next steps in setting up the CERT?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000217\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dc6c0f88-e781-476d-bca1-d1bf9b69302b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a805f517a1ad49dc841a8d7408985984\u0022\u003EHon AMY ADAMS\u003C/span\u003E: The CERT will initially be set up as a branded business unit within the Ministry of Business, Innovation and Employment, to ensure that the CERT can be stood up without delay. It is also in keeping with our emphasis on the economic benefits of improved cyber-security and making the most of our digital economy. To ensure strong public-private partnership, we are establishing a CERT advisory board to advise us on the set-up and operation of the CERT, and nominations for this board close tomorrow. It is our intention to have the CERT up and running by March next year, while we consider what the best long-term structure should be for the CERT.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000218\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u0022a156ac39f1e84f14aeec6ba2a3b30c85\u0022\u003EChild, Youth and Family\u2014Death of Moko Rangitoheriri and Reform\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022c3d9fd88-4715-419d-be08-e1c4eda7d09e\u0022 data-id=\u00223af8429d9f1a4d1aa5bb0cfbc5ea11b1\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000219\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c3d9fd88-4715-419d-be08-e1c4eda7d09e\u0022\u003E12. \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00223af8429d9f1a4d1aa5bb0cfbc5ea11b1\u0022\u003EMARAMA FOX (Co-Leader\u2014M\u0101ori Party)\u003C/span\u003E to the Minister for Social Development: In the revamp of CYF, will she be strengthening the appeals process for the review of decisions that may prevent incidences such as the death of Moko Rangitoheriri; if so, how?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022977cccaf-581d-4f48-924e-32bf6c54a93d\u0022 data-id=\u00226dd97fd4190a4e2780fa25f2db258834\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000220\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022977cccaf-581d-4f48-924e-32bf6c54a93d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00226dd97fd4190a4e2780fa25f2db258834\u0022\u003EHon ANNE TOLLEY (Minister for Social Development):\u003C/span\u003E The death of Moko was a despicable crime, and we must continue to raise awareness of child abuse so that it does not happen again. I am confident that the coroner will conduct a full investigation into this awful tragedy. Unfortunately, no one raised safety concerns with Child, Youth and Family (CYF) around the care arrangements that were in place for poor wee Moko prior to his tragic death. If we are going to ensure that this does not happen again, we all need to realise our part and do everything that we can to protect the children and mokopuna in our communities. We must pick up the phone if we have concerns about the safety of a child. The design of the new system, including complaints and reviews, will be strengthened to ensure that the voice of the child is at the heart of everything that we do and that decisions are made in the long-term best interest of those children. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000221\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c3d9fd88-4715-419d-be08-e1c4eda7d09e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00229e8d6e04aa694847b01f3eca2f209a6b\u0022\u003EMarama Fox\u003C/span\u003E: Does the Minister, then, agree with her officials that more could have been done to prevent the death of Moko Rangitoheriri; if so, what is she doing about it?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000222\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022977cccaf-581d-4f48-924e-32bf6c54a93d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022025f65a64a814d708244b3676d296ae9\u0022\u003EHon ANNE TOLLEY\u003C/span\u003E: My congratulations to all of those who stood up in the weekend abhorring violence and saying that it is not OK. But as I announced in the overhaul of the Child, Youth and Family system, we are going to move from a system that is focused on crisis to one that begins with prevention and includes intensive intervention, care support, youth justice, and transition into adulthood and independence. I am confident that that system will go some way to preventing such tragedies, but, at the end of it, we all have a responsibility to pick up the telephone when we have concerns for the safety of a child. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000223\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c3d9fd88-4715-419d-be08-e1c4eda7d09e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002277eccc96c10f49e49ff0e1e346b2e480\u0022\u003EMarama Fox\u003C/span\u003E: How can she ensure that information that is sent to her and her officials about the vulnerability of children in CYF care, such as information sent to the Lower Hutt CYF office, is not lost and does not ultimately disadvantage children and their wh\u0101nau?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000224\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022977cccaf-581d-4f48-924e-32bf6c54a93d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002254ba09b765ad43189019132e5090660e\u0022\u003EHon ANNE TOLLEY\u003C/span\u003E: I certainly take all information that is provided to my office seriously, and I am always willing to investigate if people have specific concerns, but I have to balance that with being conscious that with Family Court proceedings and with investigations that are under way, including the complaints process, it is sometimes hard to intervene.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n    \u003C/div\u003E\n    \u003Cdiv class=\u0022HpsHansard\u0022\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000225\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsProceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u002229ccda71cec34bfc95665f7b9d68dbb2\u0022\u003EUrgent Debates Declined\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000226\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u00221cde3a6e6b26442986f551427bdbc848\u0022\u003EMinistry for Primary Industries\u2014Independent Review into Illegal Dumping of Fish\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022e4b09a29-dfd3-42c0-8585-11463bd6077b\u0022 data-id=\u0022fd431bd7f4364f6c8ed248d47775ae75\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000227\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e4b09a29-dfd3-42c0-8585-11463bd6077b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022fd431bd7f4364f6c8ed248d47775ae75\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: I have received a letter from Rino Tirikatene seeking to debate under Standing Order 389 the decision by the Ministry for Primary Industries to launch an independent review into its handling of the illegal dumping of fish in 2012 and early 2013. The announcement is a particular case of recent occurrence involving ministerial responsibility. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000228\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e4b09a29-dfd3-42c0-8585-11463bd6077b\u0022\u003EThe big hurdle to get over in applications for urgent debates is whether the matter has reached the stage where the business of the House ought to be set aside. The test is a high one. There must be an element of urgency or substantive policy change for the matter to take precedent over other business. Although the announcement of an inquiry may warrant an urgent debate, the circumstances must be exceptional, especially when the inquiry may take some time to finalise. I am not persuaded that setting aside the business of the House for an urgent debate on this matter can be justified. The application is therefore declined.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n    \u003C/div\u003E\n    \u003Cdiv class=\u0022HpsHansard\u0022\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000229\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsProceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u0022fcb494d9fb634d8db46cb63eeae4389b\u0022\u003EVoting\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000230\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u00228fc7aa4b1a2d49d0973eba9a75c43792\u0022\u003ECorrection\u2014New Zealand Public Health and Disability (Southern DHB) Elections Bill\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022e4b09a29-dfd3-42c0-8585-11463bd6077b\u0022 data-id=\u0022e8d0d0fc107842029807670981a005e0\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000231\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e4b09a29-dfd3-42c0-8585-11463bd6077b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022e8d0d0fc107842029807670981a005e0\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Honourable members, on 12 May when the House was considering the New Zealand Public Health and Disability (Southern DHB) Elections Bill, the result of the vote on the question that the bill be now read a third time was incorrectly recorded as Ayes 95, Noes 16. The correct result is Ayes 95, Noes 26. The record will be corrected accordingly.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n    \u003C/div\u003E\n    \u003Cdiv class=\u0022HpsHansard\u0022\u003E\n      \u003Cp\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsProceedingHeading\u0022\u003EBills\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000232\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u00221e7681c9af3a4c8daf5cdc290b854bab\u0022\u003EResidential Tenancies Amendment Bill\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000233\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u00221edfbee1f6aa415d8215c1787b7a8b87\u0022\u003EIn Committee\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00228a1cb04e-8a86-44d1-9004-6e158e220339\u0022 data-id=\u0022852fec03739c48f882df7c0ee66bc519\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000234\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00228a1cb04e-8a86-44d1-9004-6e158e220339\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022852fec03739c48f882df7c0ee66bc519\u0022\u003ETIM MACINDOE (Senior Whip\u2014National):\u003C/span\u003E I seek leave for the parts of the Residential Tenancies Amendment Bill to be considered as one debate with the questions to be voted upon separately at its conclusion.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022 data-id=\u0022ce93ea8ac01b47d2a989b9b34a013d77\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000235\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022ce93ea8ac01b47d2a989b9b34a013d77\u0022\u003EThe CHAIRPERSON (Hon Trevor Mallard)\u003C/span\u003E: Is there any objection to that course of action? And I am assuming that the member means the preliminary clauses as well.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000236\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00228a1cb04e-8a86-44d1-9004-6e158e220339\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00229757d1b148df4dcd8f1f1e46c274ce99\u0022\u003ETim Macindoe\u003C/span\u003E: All parts and the clauses.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000237\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022f3807cbd3c0441f18fbe46d7763cfb8f\u0022\u003EThe CHAIRPERSON (Hon Trevor Mallard)\u003C/span\u003E: So, just making it clear, the member has sought leave for the parts and preliminary clauses to be debated as one question, but for votes to be taken separately. Is there any objection to that? There appears to be none.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000238\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u002224a6d8c4940542379767f07880b384d3\u0022\u003EParts 1 and 2, schedule, and clauses 1 to 3\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022cbc37df2-57ae-4536-94ed-a2e39eecd585\u0022 data-id=\u0022d50178d966f14d5aadec2c0191b3b123\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000239\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cbc37df2-57ae-4536-94ed-a2e39eecd585\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022d50178d966f14d5aadec2c0191b3b123\u0022\u003EPHIL TWYFORD (Labour\u2014Te Atat\u016B):\u003C/span\u003E Recognising that we are going to treat the Residential Tenancies Amendment Bill as one part for this debate, including the preliminary clauses, I want to make some opening comments about this debate. We have made it clear all the way through that Labour is supporting this bill because we think that it long overdue that the standards of New Zealand\u2019s rental housing are brought into the 21st century. We believe that it is long past time for mandatory standards to be set for rental properties, public and private, and that there is a strong public support for the idea of making sure that rental properties\u2014whether they are Housing New Zealand, the council, or community organisations, as well as those in the private rental market\u2014are warm and dry. The reason is this: the latest estimates from Otago University are that 50,000 children are hospitalised every year in New Zealand, and many of them are hospitalised with preventable infectious and respiratory diseases that are associated with poverty, overcrowding, and cold, damp, mouldy homes. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000240\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cbc37df2-57ae-4536-94ed-a2e39eecd585\u0022\u003EWe have had many debates in this House about this issue in recent years, and I have to say I am pleased to finally see the National Government acknowledging there is a problem that needs to be solved here, and this bill makes some attempt to set some standards. But we, on this side of the Chamber, are bitterly disappointed that the bill does not go far enough. We agree with the comments that were made by Dr Russell Wills, the Children\u2019s Commissioner, who came to Parliament and said that Nick Smith\u2019s Residential Tenancies Amendment Bill is a broken promise to the nation\u2019s children, and that it is a wasted opportunity to do the job properly. One of the things we are going to be talking about in this debate is what is not in this bill but should be, and we will be doing our best to link that to the specific provisions in the bill.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000241\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002245aa202b8e1845538aac3c4048cadea2\u0022\u003EThe CHAIRPERSON (Hon Trevor Mallard)\u003C/span\u003E: The member had better start fairly soon.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000242\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cbc37df2-57ae-4536-94ed-a2e39eecd585\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00227bdb228281b74ba1ab9f8002e224935e\u0022\u003EPHIL TWYFORD\u003C/span\u003E: What the bill does is set standards for insulation and that is good in itself, but the problem is that without setting standards for heating and for ventilation, all we are doing with this bill is insulating many houses that are cold and damp and miserable. That is why we believe there should have been ventilation standards in here and there should have been heating standards. That is quite doable, and much of the work has been done, particularly by the metro councils. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000243\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cbc37df2-57ae-4536-94ed-a2e39eecd585\u0022\u003EFive different local authorities have done a comprehensive trial of the warrant of fitness concept. There are lots of data that could be drawn on, including the Minister for Building and Housing\u2019s own trial of Housing New Zealand properties, but, sadly, for a spurious reason\u2014the Minister thinks it will be an unwarranted and onerous burden on landlords that may cause rents to go up, and we will deal with that argument in the course of this debate\u2014this bill focuses far too narrowly on insulation standards, and there are many provisions in Part 1 of the bill that deal with the machinery that will implement those insulation standards. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000244\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cbc37df2-57ae-4536-94ed-a2e39eecd585\u0022\u003EThere are other issues that we will deal with in the course of this debate. One of them is the grace period that this bill gives to landlords. There is a 3-year grace period. We believe that is far too long. A year\u2019s grace period would be better, as is reflected in Andrew Little\u2019s Healthy Homes Guarantee Bill (No 2). We could then allow the changes to be implemented as tenancy agreements turn over. I think the average length of a tenancy is around 10 months. If you phased in the changes that are required when tenancies turn over, in a very short period of time the great majority of rental properties would meet the required standards. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000245\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cbc37df2-57ae-4536-94ed-a2e39eecd585\u0022\u003EThe other issue we want to talk about in more detail is in the schedules, and it relates to the regulation-setting powers that this bill puts in place. It is quite sensible for things like insulation standards\u2014and heating and ventilation standards, if there were heating and ventilation standards\u2014to be set by regulation. [Bell rung]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000246\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002251cf4efa4e6f4ef6afa68f485509109f\u0022\u003EThe CHAIRPERSON (Hon Trevor Mallard)\u003C/span\u003E: Just before I call the member, I do want to remind members that the Committee stage of a bill is not the point when members can speak about what is not in the bill. They have got to speak about the bill, the technical clauses in it, and the amendments to it. By way of advice, I would refer members to Metiria Turei\u2019s Supplementary Order Paper to the bill and, in particular, the amendment to add subclause (2B) to clause 13, which probably will help members.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000247\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cbc37df2-57ae-4536-94ed-a2e39eecd585\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022f2a32e60f3874a29978ab67e5cfd26f8\u0022\u003EPHIL TWYFORD\u003C/span\u003E: The only remaining comment I wanted to make in the opening contribution is really about the regulation-setting powers, and to say that it is perfectly logical and reasonable for these kinds of standards to be set by regulation, because standards will change as new technologies, new design, and new products are available, and as social expectations develop. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000248\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cbc37df2-57ae-4536-94ed-a2e39eecd585\u0022\u003EThe unfortunate thing in relation to this bill is that the draft regulations that have been released at the same time as this bill demonstrate an intention by the Government to allow a giant loophole in the insulation standards that this bill propagates. Unfortunately, it is going to allow hundreds of thousands of properties that are already insulated to the redundant 1978 standard, which is insulation that is not very thick, and the draft regulations, which have been released alongside this bill, will mean those properties will not have to be upgraded to the current 2008 building standard, which would allow insulation that is much thicker. This bill is, effectively, legislating into place redundant and inadequate standards for legislation. Thank you.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022fc8ab326-1806-41d3-8c41-cd58c95dcb45\u0022 data-id=\u00228867a70e3ca94d36a96e94d11c44e748\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000249\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022fc8ab326-1806-41d3-8c41-cd58c95dcb45\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00228867a70e3ca94d36a96e94d11c44e748\u0022\u003EMETIRIA TUREI (Co-Leader\u2014Green):\u003C/span\u003E I want to address my Supplementary Order Paper 172. It is quite comprehensive, and I will need to take a number of calls to describe its parts and why we think they are necessary.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000250\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022fc8ab326-1806-41d3-8c41-cd58c95dcb45\u0022\u003EWhat we have in New Zealand now in the rental arena is that we have moved from what used to be about 80 percent of New Zealand homes being owned and occupied by the owner and about 20 percent being rentals. That proportion has significantly changed over the last 20 or 30 years, to much more of a 60:40 kind of proportion. This has put renters at a severe disadvantage because the law has been designed around a very narrow set of residential tenancies, mostly in relation to State housing, actually, from way back.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000251\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022fc8ab326-1806-41d3-8c41-cd58c95dcb45\u0022\u003ESo there has not been a significant upgrade in the rights of long-term renters in our law, and we see the effects of that through the failure of our systems, including enforcement by the Tenancy Tribunal, to make sure that rental homes are up to standard and are actually warm and safe and dry for families to live in. This is why, in part, we have such a major problem with poor-quality housing, because our law does not allow for tenants to be able to require landlords to take action. And although we do have the Tenancy Tribunal, for example, which is established for that purpose, as the proportion of tenants increases and the supply of rental housing decreases\u2014we know we do not have enough for everybody who needs it\u2014then tenants become increasingly vulnerable to landlords who are in it for a quick buck, who are not committed to making sure they are professional landlords and are doing a good job and maintaining their homes to a high standard. When it comes to looking at anything like a warrant of fitness approach to New Zealand\u2019s rental housing, it is also important to improve the rights of the renting families who are in those homes, so that they can genuinely hold their landlords\u2014and often their property managers\u2014to account for the minimum standards that are set in the law.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000252\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022fc8ab326-1806-41d3-8c41-cd58c95dcb45\u0022\u003EThe first of the amendments on my Supplementary Order Paper 172 is to clause 6. Clause 6 is about changes to the tenancy agreements. There are a number of changes that the Government wants to make, and I have a number of additions to them. These additions are about improving\u2014they are a start; they are not the full story\u2014the rights of tenants so they have some ability to hold their landlords to account, both for standards but also to protect their tenancy, so that they are not kicked out if they complain about poor-quality housing or a landlord\u2019s failure to meet the standards.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000253\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022fc8ab326-1806-41d3-8c41-cd58c95dcb45\u0022\u003EThe first of those additions is that a tenancy agreement must include a statement saying that when the tenancy terminates, the tenant has the right of renewal. This is particularly important for families. There are many, many thousands and thousands of New Zealand families now who will never own a home. They are permanently locked out of the homeownership pathway. They will always be renting\u2014raising their children from little babies; through to when they eventually retire\u2014they will always be renting. In those circumstances it is critical that families are able to secure themselves a long-term tenancy. In New Zealand the tenancy agreements are generally for about 12 months, so we do not have the kinds of long-term tenancies that you see in other places where renting has been part of the culture for longer, particularly in places in Europe. This provision, to enable a tenant to have the first right of renewal, means that that tenant can stay in their house. If the landlord is wanting to get rid of them because they want to put up the rent or they want to do something else with the house, well, actually, that house is now the home of the tenant. If it is better for the tenant and their family that they stay in that home\u2014their kids are going to the local school, they have got access to local work, and they have built themselves a life in that community\u2014then they should have the right to stay. That is the first change.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000254\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022fc8ab326-1806-41d3-8c41-cd58c95dcb45\u0022\u003EThe second change is that the tenancy agreement must include the calculation that the landlord intends to use to increase the rent. One of the major problems that we hear from renters is that their rents are going up every 6 months, and they have absolutely no idea what is going to happen. We heard a terrible story, Marama Davidson and I, in Christchurch just last week about a woman who was renting a home. It had earthquake damage. The Earthquake Commission was finally going in to do the repairs. She had to move out. The landlord told her that if she wanted to move back in, she would have to pay another $250 a week in rent, so she is now effectively homeless as a result of the earthquake. This is because there are no protections for tenants, as a result of the earthquake. So this woman and her family are now having to find themselves a new home. This change would at least prevent the landlord from being able to say: \u201CWell, we\u2019re going to massively increase your rent, for you to be able to stay.\u201D The rent calculation would have to be set into the tenancy agreement, so that tenants know how much extra rent they can expect to be paying, and when it is.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000255\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022fc8ab326-1806-41d3-8c41-cd58c95dcb45\u0022\u003EWe would also, under this Supplementary Order Paper, restrict the number of times that a landlord could put up the rent\u2014no more often than once every 12 months. That still seems to me a bit harsh on tenants, but landlords would not be able to put up the rent more than once every 12 months. This gives the tenants certainty\u2014how much the rent is going to go up by, and when it is going to go up, and they can plan for that. It means they can plan their finances. They know the rent increase is coming. It is not going to come as a surprise. It is not going to come rapidly, time after time. They have got some control over it.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000256\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022fc8ab326-1806-41d3-8c41-cd58c95dcb45\u0022\u003EWe would also change the tenancy so that is for a fixed term of 3 years as a default. That, again, is to help provide tenants with greater security. We are advocating these changes because one of the concerns that often gets raised is that if you have a warrant of fitness, even one as minor and as miserable as is in this bill, the tenants\u2019 rents will go up. They need more protection, and there is not sufficient protection. The policy settings to provide sufficient protection are pretty tricky; it is not easy to find a solution to this. We need to get on the policy road of better protecting tenants\u2019 rights, so that they can deal with these kinds of changes and make sure that tenants are secure in their homes.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000257\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022fc8ab326-1806-41d3-8c41-cd58c95dcb45\u0022\u003EOne other thing we would do is get rid of the 42-day notice. There are stories after stories after stories of landlords who issue a 42-day notice to tenants, saying that their kid wants to live there or their auntie wants to live there. No such thing is really happening. The tenants have no comeback. They get 42 days\u2019 notice to leave their home. These are people\u2019s homes. If you are a landlord, you own a house. If you live there, it is your home.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000258\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022fc8ab326-1806-41d3-8c41-cd58c95dcb45\u0022\u003EWe need to make sure that people are warm and safe and dry and secure in the homes they are raising their families in. There is a very significant list of what a comprehensive warrant of fitness would look like. This is a list that has come directly from the research that was prepared by the recipient of the Prime Minister\u2019s Science Prize. I have a great deal of confidence\u2014and clearly the Prime Minister has a great deal of confidence\u2014in the research, the skill, and the veracity of this warrant of fitness list, given that it came from Philippa Howden-Chapman, who was the recipient of the Prime Minister\u2019s Science Prize. I think this would be a great way, if we agree to the list in this bill, to recognise not only her skills as a scientist but actually the work that she does.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000259\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022fc8ab326-1806-41d3-8c41-cd58c95dcb45\u0022\u003EThere are some basic things in here, because they are not provided for in the law, such as adequate cooking facilities. Those of us who live in our own home or have had the benefit of living in a high-quality rental property might not think that is important. But last night I was told a story by a group of students who said that their land agent refused to replace their stove. All they had to cook on was a gas element and a skillet\u2014for 12 months. The land agent said the stove was a non-essential item, and refused to replace it. You can say that they should go to the Tenancy Tribunal, but then they risk losing their home because they have no security of tenure. So you cannot expect people in very vulnerable situations to hold landlords to account for this if they have to argue their case before a tribunal. We have to make it mandatory that the basics are provided: adequate food preparation and storage areas, potable water\u2014there is no requirement in the law for drinking water to be in the home. Hot water\u2014there is no requirement in the law for that. A functional toilet, a bath, or a shower\u2014there is no existing requirement in law for those. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000260\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022fc8ab326-1806-41d3-8c41-cd58c95dcb45\u0022\u003EFixed space heating is also in this list, and it is essential. It has to be adequate for the house. One of the critical issues we have found from the Emma-Lita Bourne tragedy was that this was a home that had a fixed space heater in it, but it was in the lounge in a two-storey, cold, concrete block terraced house. The heating got nowhere except\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00225634618f-04f4-4f2c-a4bb-6ec0edeb2bf5\u0022 data-id=\u0022a550b688a2e0470f99ef4bf5abe0f04e\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000261\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225634618f-04f4-4f2c-a4bb-6ec0edeb2bf5\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022a550b688a2e0470f99ef4bf5abe0f04e\u0022\u003EJONO NAYLOR (National):\u003C/span\u003E I just rise to take a brief call at this Committee stage of the Residential Tenancies Amendment Bill. I just want to, I guess, from my perspective re-emphasise what a balanced, sensible approach this bill is taking. We have heard some contributions already at this stage implying that perhaps the lead-in times for some of the provisions here are too long, but I just want to remind the Committee that in some of these aspects that are being brought in\u2014for smoke alarms, for example, which we know will save lives of people in New Zealand; we know statistically about people who have died in house fires where there have not been smoke alarms installed in rental premises\u2014immediate action is being taken. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000262\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225634618f-04f4-4f2c-a4bb-6ec0edeb2bf5\u0022\u003EAt the moment, what are we talking? We are in May now. By the time this bill goes through, 1 July this year, it is going to be mandatory for rental households to have smoke alarms. That is, I think, appropriate timing, because we know that there are immediate effects and immediate benefits that can be had. Of course it is realistic for a landlord to be able to have those checks in place to ensure that those smoke alarms are going to be in place by 1 July. It is a relatively low-cost thing that can be done and easily organised, and so of course we should ensure that that is put in place immediately. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000263\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225634618f-04f4-4f2c-a4bb-6ec0edeb2bf5\u0022\u003EMr Twyford, in his contribution, thought that the lead-in time for the insulation aspects of this bill was too long. It is a little bit more complex when you are looking at insulation requirements than it is for smoke alarms. When it comes to smoke alarms, as I have said, they are low cost and easy to organise. But if a landlord is having to look at completely redoing the insulation on a property, it is going to take some time to organise\u2014to assess the current standards and to also assess whether or not it is actually going to be viable for that to occur. I am sure as we go through this process there are going to be some things that need to be sorted out from time to time between officials from the Ministry of Business, Innovation and Employment and landlords as to what constitutes viability for the retrofitting of insulation, because not all houses are designed the same. We are going to need a significant lead-in time to ensure that this occurs, and also to ensure that landlords have put aside appropriate financial provision to enable them to do this. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000264\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225634618f-04f4-4f2c-a4bb-6ec0edeb2bf5\u0022\u003EOne of the other arguments that I have heard that has been a bit concerning is that we are simply settling for a substandard level of insulation by requiring people to come up only to the 1978 standards. There has been a bit of misinformation that has been out there, and I just want to make this completely clear: if a house was built prior to 1978, it will need to be insulated up to the 2008 standard. So we are not simply settling for the 1978 standard. What we are saying is if it was built before 1978, absolutely it will need to come up to the 2008 standard. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000265\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225634618f-04f4-4f2c-a4bb-6ec0edeb2bf5\u0022\u003EHowever, if the house was built after 1978 and that insulation is still in good repair, then it will not need to be upgraded. That is because the cost of upgrading what may be a minor amount is not proportional to the benefit that will be determined from that. For example, if a house was built in 2007 and was not up to the 2008 standard but was close to it\u2014not necessarily back at an absolute minimal standard, but because technology had changed over 30 years, a builder may have put something in that was more substantial than the 1978 standard\u2014it would be absolutely impractical, it would be an excessive expense for very little benefit, to require that landlord to retrofit a 2007 house that has been insulated to a very good standard up to that 2008 standard. So, as I said, this is highly practical. It is highly feasible. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000266\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225634618f-04f4-4f2c-a4bb-6ec0edeb2bf5\u0022\u003EIf you think it is all one-way traffic for landlords in this bill, it absolutely is not. There are going to be higher fines for landlords if they do breach any of these things. It is absolutely imperative that we have a big disincentive for landlords to breach any of these things that are being introduced through this bill, and so we are going to be increasing those top fines that people can be paying to ensure that they do comply and do go forward. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000267\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225634618f-04f4-4f2c-a4bb-6ec0edeb2bf5\u0022\u003EI just want to address a couple of things that the previous speaker, Metiria Turei, mentioned. The first is the idea of there sort of being a right of renewal necessary for tenants. Well, I can tell you, I have yet to meet a landlord who had good tenants in place and who, if they wanted to continue, would suddenly just terminate their tenancy at the end of their fixed term.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022b4a597dd-ed8b-42b8-975b-40c6e0cdaee1\u0022 data-id=\u0022465c9c57434b4ff6aa2bff982a67b1ee\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000268\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b4a597dd-ed8b-42b8-975b-40c6e0cdaee1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022465c9c57434b4ff6aa2bff982a67b1ee\u0022\u003ELOUISA WALL (Labour\u2014Manurewa):\u003C/span\u003E I am specifically going to talk about Supplementary Order Paper 172. I want to commend my colleague Metiria Turei for specifically focusing on a 3-year term. The reason I do so is that I have just read an extract in the National Business Review from Philippa Howden-Chapman\u2019s book called Home Truths: Confronting New Zealand\u2019s Housing Crisis, and, actually, the average tenancy is 11 months. The impact of that on families and on communities is pretty intense. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000269\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b4a597dd-ed8b-42b8-975b-40c6e0cdaee1\u0022\u003EI specifically want to talk about a Child Poverty Action Group report called The revolving door: Student mobility in Auckland schools, dated May 2014. The impact of transience on our children\u2019s learning is immense, and I am sure the Minister in the chair, Nick Smith, would be interested to know that within that report, essentially, it said: \u201C \u2018Overall, we found that student mobility often produces an array of negative psychological, social, and academic consequences for children\u2026\u2019 \u201D. But, surprisingly, in that particular report it was not just the children living in transience who were affected, it was actually the entire school community. So what we know is that stable communities produce better outcomes for the social good. And the relevance to electorates like mine in South Auckland is that our Pacific and M\u0101ori rates of homeownership are actually incredibly low\u2014for Pacific it is 18 percent; for M\u0101ori it is 28 percent. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000270\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b4a597dd-ed8b-42b8-975b-40c6e0cdaee1\u0022\u003ESo this piece of legislation is incredibly important, and this amendment that Metiria Turei is trying to have endorsed here in the Chamber today is incredibly important. Allowing children to live in a home for 3 years is actually going to produce much better outcomes, and this is reflected in a Ministry of Education report from 2004. It came from an Education Review Office finding that basically said that carefully planned and sequential learning experiences were required for sustained learning that built upon previous learning. So the impact on our education system of having a housing system that does not provide stability to our most vulnerable communities and community members is incredibly important. The reason that I am standing up to support this particular part of Metiria Turei\u2019s Supplementary Order Paper is that enabling our families who are the most vulnerable to have 3 years of living in the same home is actually going to have a huge impact on our children\u2019s learning. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000271\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b4a597dd-ed8b-42b8-975b-40c6e0cdaee1\u0022\u003EBut not only that\u2014we think that children\u2019s learning actually starts as 5-year-olds or 6-year-olds when we have compulsory education, but what Shirley Maihi found, at Finlayson Park School, in my electorate, was that it actually impacts on early childhood education learning. So the compounding effect of children not having sustained early childhood education when they are 3, 4, and 5 then means that they enter the school system and they are already behind. The long-term implications for not enabling our families and our children to have some security in that tenancy are incredibly important. This then leads to the first part of Metiria Turei\u2019s Supplementary Order Paper, which is that when the tenancy terminates, the tenant has the right to renew that tenancy, hopefully for another 6 years. So, in fact, we build an ability for families to create homes, to be part of communities, to be part of their school communities, and to have a secure base to be able to go to school from, and for parents to be able to get extra education and to go to work. But I think we completely underestimate how vital a home is in the overall development of our children and society. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000272\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b4a597dd-ed8b-42b8-975b-40c6e0cdaee1\u0022\u003EI hope that people who are here today in the Chamber participating in the debate will take seriously the impact of insecure housing on the ability of our children to learn, because I think that it is missing in this whole debate. We are not talking or thinking about the ongoing consequences. We know there are 26,000 \u201Cneet\u201D kids out there\u2014kids who are not engaged in education, employment, or training\u2014but they do not just manifest out of nowhere; they actually manifest because, fundamentally, at the beginning of their lives, those children do not have stable base, they do not have a home, they do not go to early childhood education, and they do not go to school. For people who think that this is irrelevant, I have got, within my electorate, kids who have been to\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022 data-id=\u00229a950436d1f3494d9a22b6443bf45dc8\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000273\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00229a950436d1f3494d9a22b6443bf45dc8\u0022\u003EHon Dr NICK SMITH (Minister for Building and Housing):\u003C/span\u003E Firstly, can I welcome the broad support for this bill across Parliament at the Committee stage. I will briefly summarise the key provisions in these Committee parts and then, just briefly, speak to the Supplementary Order Paper in my name.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000274\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003EThis bill does five important things. Firstly, it requires smoke alarms in all tenanted properties by 1 July this year\u2014thus, the priority for the bill. That is expected to save three lives per year. Actually, 75 percent of the fatalities that occur in fires in New Zealand are in tenanted properties. They are higher risk, and this bill provides the regulation-making power that we have in line, to bring that provision. The Government is particularly keen to get that provision in place by 1 July, as per the requirements in this Committee stage, because we all know that those fire risks are greatest during the winter months.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000275\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003EThe second key requirement of this bill is a requirement for all homes to be insulated progressively over a period of 3 years. I do want to note that during the second reading there was some debate about the number of lives that it would save. I do want to correct something. At that time I said that the figure was 23 lives per year that would be saved as a consequence of the provisions. That was on the basis of a sample size of 30,000 homes. Actually, it is 180,000 homes, so my ministry has come back to me and said that the insulation provisions in this bill are actually expected to save 129 lives per year. They are very substantive, they are important, and I welcome the broad support for them.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000276\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003EThe third provision in this bill toughens up the capacity for the ministry to be able to actually enforce the existing standards. We have housing regulations. They cover issues of heating, electrical, ventilation, and all of those things. The problem is not that the regulations are not there; the problem is a matter of enforcement. What this bill does is create the mechanics in the law to enable my ministry to actually go after that relatively small minority of slum landlords and ensure that those existing regulations are enforced.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000277\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003EThe fourth change in this part is around retaliatory notice. I am sure a number of MPs have noticed the issue that when a tenant does choose to go to the Tenancy Tribunal and seek to have an application of those housing regulations enforced, there is a risk that the landlord will just give them notice. The provisions in this bill extend the period in which we can take a retaliatory notice application to the tribunal and the powers for that to be resolved.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000278\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003EThe last, and the fifth, useful part of this Residential Tenancies Amendment Bill is to provide for abandoned tenancies. Nobody wins from properties sitting vacant for months. As a consequence of the fast-track mechanisms in this bill, it will improve that. The Supplementary Order Paper in my name, No. 177, does make some amendments that I wish to make plain as to their intent and what they do.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000279\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003EThe first of those is in respect of the enforcement orders that are required in respect of the requirement to fix a property. It is making plain that those orders include those important new insulation and smoke alarm provisions. The second is an issue that has been debated, and we want to make absolutely clear that anybody upgrading the insulation of their property before the deadline of 1 July 2019\u2014just 3 years away, and I remind Mr Little, who is in the Chamber, that that is a substantially faster programme of insulating houses than what is provided for in his own bill. What I am making plain with the Supplementary Order Paper is that any insulation work has to be done to the 2008 standard\u2014that is, if you are a landlord and your property is not insulated at the moment, you cannot whip in and get some 1978 insulation and pretend that that meets the requirements of this bill. The Supplementary Order Paper makes that absolutely explicit: any insulation work has to be done to the 2008 standard.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000280\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003EThe last point that I would like to make is that the Government is not intending to support the Green Party amendments. They go too far. Let me give a practical example: it would be illegal to rent a home if it did not have visibility strips, under the Green Party\u2019s Supplementary Order Paper. Yes, we think things like insulation and smoke alarms are right. But I do note that the Green Party\u2019s own offices do not meet\u2014do not meet\u2014the visibility strip requirements that Metiria Turei is imposing on others. We on the Government benches say: \u201CDon\u2019t put rules on others that you\u2019re not prepared to comply with yourself.\u201D It is exactly the same, I have to say, when I check these standards against my own private home\u2014it does not meet them. We need to focus on those things that are the basic legal requirements, and that is what the bill does.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022 data-id=\u0022e7b9c06032e04642b0c9a2ace8cc10f0\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000281\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022e7b9c06032e04642b0c9a2ace8cc10f0\u0022\u003EANDREW LITTLE (Leader of the Opposition):\u003C/span\u003E I would like to take a moment to address clauses 6 and 38 of the bill, as well as Supplementary Order Papers 177 and 172. I just note that, notwithstanding what the Minister in the chair has just said\u2014the requirement that there be insulation, and delegating it to regulation to determine what the standards will be\u2014it is pretty clear that there will be ample rental housing that simply will not meet the 2008 standard that he glowingly talks of now. The reality is that his bill means there will be rental housing that simply will not come up to the 2008 insulation standard. But there is something that is even more disappointing, and that is that it is just confined\u2014this bill and the new standards that rental properties must meet, whether income-related rental properties or not\u2014the only additional standards they now have to meet are an insulation standard and a smoke alarm standard.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000282\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003EIt has been alarming to see in the justifications that the Minister gives that they include\u2014he made this statement on 19 April 2016: \u201CThese new tenancy regulations will make 180,000 homes warmer and drier by requiring insulation \u2026\u201D. I have news for the Minister: adding insulation does not make a house warmer. It will retain whatever warmth there is; it will retain whatever coolness there is. It will not add warmth. It will not make houses warmer, and so this is a lost opportunity.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000283\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003EWhen the Minister talks about houses that are safer because they have smoke alarms, he might just want to reflect on houses that, at the moment, are making people\u2014including young children\u2014sick and are therefore unsafe. He might want to reflect on what a difference he could make if clause 6, which refers to the tenancy agreements, and clause 38, which refers to the new powers for regulation making, in fact added a requirement that not only should there be insulation as determined by the regulations but there should be a form of heating as determined by regulations. The regulation-making power allows ample flexibility for him as Minister, or the department administering the legislation, to ensure that it is not just one form of heating that counts.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000284\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003EI know that part of his criticism of suggestions that other minimum standards should be added, such as a source of heating, is that it is all just about heat pumps\u2014it is not. This is an opportunity for this Committee, with his bill, to get it right, and we could expedite this House\u2019s time on my Healthy Homes Guarantee Bill (No 2) by the Minister admitting that perhaps we can make some modest improvements now that would allow those standards to be added. The regulation-making power in clause 38 would allow ample flexibility, and provide some reassurance to that part of the constituency that he is concerned about who might be thinking that they could be put to extra cost.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000285\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003EI want to refer to Metiria Turei\u2019s Supplementary Order Paper 172 because it does contain a list of additional standards that might be added. The Minister is critical, for example, of visibility strips. He is a former Minister for ACC; he will know from the data from ACC that a common household accident is people walking into ranchsliders and floor-to-ceiling glass. In modern architecture and with a growing number of people living in apartments\u2014and if only there were more of them to alleviate the housing crisis that \u201Cdoes not exist\u201D\u2014we will probably see more of this, so, actually, visibility strips are not such a silly idea. It is, after all, an inexpensive idea.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000286\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003EI will just prevail on the Minister, while he is in the chair and while he has got the time and the attention of this Committee, that with this piece of legislation, at a time when the entire country is gripped by issues of housing, housing standards, and housing quality, now is a time for leadership. He is capable of providing leadership\u2014it has happened before, I am sure of it. He could actually step up and say that insulation is important, but a source of heat, which is what the insulation is there to keep in the house, is equally as important, and those other standards that have been laid out in Supplementary Order Paper 172 are equally important, for safety reasons, for tenants living in rental properties. He could do it today.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022 data-id=\u002223296fceecb840818786fc011cb02a2c\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000287\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002223296fceecb840818786fc011cb02a2c\u0022\u003EHon Dr NICK SMITH (Minister for Building and Housing):\u003C/span\u003E I am delighted to have the opportunity to respond to the challenge from Mr Little. There is only one provision in his Healthy Homes Guarantee Bill (No 2) that is not in the existing regulations, and that is the issue of regulating for a minimum temperature in a house. Members on our side of the Chamber say that it is not proper, in this bill, to regulate for a minimum temperature in a house. What Mr Little needs to go back and check is that housing regulations already require heating. It is already in the current regulations\u2014not the regulations from this bill; it is in the current regulations. Heating, ventilation, absence of mould, electrical safety, plumbing integrity\u2014all those things are in the existing regulations, so the Leader of the Opposition does need to do his homework.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000288\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003EThe second point is this: the member has raised the issue of visibility strips, and it is not the view of the Government that it should be illegal to rent a house that does not have visibility strips. If people want to have them and want to advocate for them, that is fine, but I have to confess that my house does not have them. My office does not have them. That does not mean I am an irresponsible parent or homeowner. It is not the sort of thing that should be regulated for, and I am surprised that Mr Little is getting his party back into the nanny State routine of saying that visibility strips on all long glass windows must be provided or it will be illegal to rent a house.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000289\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003EThe third point I want to make in respect of Mr Little\u2019s contribution is that he is mistaken around the issue of insulation standards. Let me take him through it very simply: in 1978, when we first provided compulsory regulations\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000290\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002257303391fc374c4ca181e4f4b8d2c60f\u0022\u003EAndrew Little\u003C/span\u003E: That one there?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000291\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022d116bf8e550f44948f77a12e2fae0215\u0022\u003EHon Dr NICK SMITH\u003C/span\u003E: Yes, for that insulation. Do you know that that 1978 standard reduces heat loss by 84 percent\u201484 percent? The 2001 standard took that up to 87 percent.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000292\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00229f33c0f9cccd47b180391720131d4eb9\u0022\u003EAndrew Little\u003C/span\u003E: That one?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000293\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a5c05caad07e4039b8d64b2c2c75b04f\u0022\u003EHon Dr NICK SMITH\u003C/span\u003E: No, that is the 2008 standard, righty-o? And here is the issue: why would you want to incur an expense of $3,000 ripping out perfectly good insulation to gain only a few percentage points in insulation performance? It does not make sense. It does not stack up to cost benefits. You are going to impose more costs on people than you are going to impose benefits, and this is where members of the Labour Opposition live in a world where when you impose regulatory requirements, no one gets the cost. Yes, you do. We need to\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000294\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022aaa40941dc5248dda2215c53b5604753\u0022\u003EAndrew Little\u003C/span\u003E: You\u2019re going backwards, Nick.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000295\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022c224a1835b504f4cbb536e0151129f5b\u0022\u003EHon Dr NICK SMITH\u003C/span\u003E: \u2014we are going forwards. In fact, let me just tell you how far we are going forward: 300,000 homes insulated under\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000296\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00229ba800716ed94e8185d068a8d4805a4d\u0022\u003EThe CHAIRPERSON (Hon Trevor Mallard)\u003C/span\u003E: I am just going to interrupt and admonish the Leader of the Opposition, mainly because the responses coming\u2014[Interruption] Well, it is happening both ways. I remind members not to use the second person. Thank you.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000297\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022ef95c09042824d9b9f81822187b4b2d2\u0022\u003EHon Dr NICK SMITH\u003C/span\u003E: This bill\u2019s provisions around insulation, around smoke alarms, around being able to enforce existing standards, and around the abandonment notices and the retaliatory notices are a huge step forward for the standard of residential tenancy agreements. I just encourage Parliament to support this bill, to drop the nit-picking, and to actually focus on what is a big step up in the standard of New Zealand housing.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022c3a88c42-f60b-4cf9-8065-8bfb80a020eb\u0022 data-id=\u0022158f7f8c0634431c92ee58efbb6a7e69\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000298\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c3a88c42-f60b-4cf9-8065-8bfb80a020eb\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022158f7f8c0634431c92ee58efbb6a7e69\u0022\u003ECARMEL SEPULONI (Labour\u2014Kelston):\u003C/span\u003E I am going to focus on a different aspect of this bill. I am looking at clause 17 in Part 1, \u201CSection 661 amended (Landlord\u2019s ongoing obligations)\u201D. This clause is in relation to compliance in respect of smoke alarms and the compliance issues imposed on the landlord by regulations. The issue I have, which I want to ask the Minister about, is that when we were going through the select committee process the regulations for smoke alarms had not yet been determined. As I go through the regulatory impact statement in relation to smoke alarms, again we seem to be presented with two options, but again a decision seems not yet to have been made about what the regulations will look like. So when we are considering these compliance issues we do need to know what the regulations are in order to know whether or not we actually agree with the regulations and then therefore agree with them being imposed on the landlords.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000299\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c3a88c42-f60b-4cf9-8065-8bfb80a020eb\u0022\u003EWhen considering the regulations, I do want to bring up that there was much discussion around the smoke alarm regulations, particularly in relation to having a period of time where landlords would still be able to use battery-powered smoke alarms. The issues that were raised by us on the select committee, and also by some of the submitters, were the issues with families being able to actually take the batteries out of the smoke alarms for other technical devices. It may seem ridiculous, and some people might say\u2014I would not say this\u2014that it would be irresponsible of those people living in those homes. But you can imagine where there are low-income families, then when you need a battery for another more urgent device you will take it out of a smoke alarm, possibly. So the issue around that was that there was more of a push for the photoelectric alarms. They have long life\u201410 years.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000300\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c3a88c42-f60b-4cf9-8065-8bfb80a020eb\u0022\u003EBut in one of the options that we were presented with through the regulatory impact statement, they would not be required unless the current alarm or the existing alarm, which could be one of the battery-powered ones that I am talking about, needed to be replaced, and at that point the expectation would be on the landlord to put in a long-life, 10-year photoelectric alarm. It is really difficult for us to envisage how that could possibly be monitored, but that is what is in option 1 in the regulatory impact statement. So I would really like the Minister, Dr Nick Smith, to speak a little bit to that.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000301\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c3a88c42-f60b-4cf9-8065-8bfb80a020eb\u0022\u003EI guess option 2, which we are presented with in the regulatory impact statement, is even more concerning. Option 2 would involve the Ministry of Business, Innovation and Employment (MBIE) educating landlords and tenants on the benefits of installing smoke alarms and ensuring that the alarms continue to work over time. This option, as quoted in the regulatory impact statement, \u201Cis essentially the status quo, as the Fire Service currently runs a public information programme. It would not be a good use of taxpayer funds for MBIE to also conduct an education programme. Fire Service public information programmes have had relatively limited effect on reducing the incidence of residential fires among high-risk groups, including low-income tenants.\u201D\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000302\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c3a88c42-f60b-4cf9-8065-8bfb80a020eb\u0022\u003EFrom my perspective, option 1 is better but, given the problems with the battery-powered smoke detectors that we are talking about, I still think it is an issue. So I really want to know how far along the Minister has got with considering the regulations for the smoke alarms, so that when we vote for this bill, when are considering this clause, we will know absolutely what the compliance issues are going to be for the landlords and what regulations are going to be imposed on the landlords, because at the moment that is not clear at all.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000303\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c3a88c42-f60b-4cf9-8065-8bfb80a020eb\u0022\u003EI am going through the bill and I am wondering whether there are other clauses too\u2014and maybe the Minister could enlighten us on this\u2014in this bill that have regulation considerations that have not actually been entirely thought through yet. I think we need to know that. I think my colleagues and I will be going through this bill with a fine-tooth comb just to see where those areas may exist, because it is, as I said, very difficult to agree with parts of the legislation when you are not even entirely sure what the regulations will look like. Thank you.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022fc8ab326-1806-41d3-8c41-cd58c95dcb45\u0022 data-id=\u0022a2f92ec823db461594822f49d837c272\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000304\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022fc8ab326-1806-41d3-8c41-cd58c95dcb45\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022a2f92ec823db461594822f49d837c272\u0022\u003EMETIRIA TUREI (Co-Leader\u2014Green):\u003C/span\u003E I am disappointed in Nick Smith\u2014I really am\u2014for two reasons: first, that we have a building and housing Minister who cannot tell the difference between a rental home and an office\u2014and perhaps that explains some of the problems the country has when it comes to the housing crisis\u2014and, second, that he would actually so devalue the lives of 500 children every month who are injured when they fall out of and, more important, through glass windows. I mean, this is 500 kids a month. It is about 120-odd a week, or 17 a day. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000305\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022fc8ab326-1806-41d3-8c41-cd58c95dcb45\u0022\u003ESo today 17 children will present at hospital with injuries ranging from cuts and bruises from toppling out of a window, to severe slicing through their faces, arms, and legs as a result of crashing though glass windows and doors. That matters to me. Those 17 kids today matter to me, the 120 this week matter to me, and the 500 this month matter to me. The cost of preventing injuries to 17 kids today and 500 this month is that we require landlords, as part of their general maintenance of the house, where they have glass doors or windows that reach from the ground to 700 millimetres, because that is what the building code requires, to put in a visibility strip. It is like a slightly opaque kind of design sellotape. It is not tricky. It is not expensive. You can buy it from any hardware store in the country for a couple of bucks. That is one of the provisions in Supplementary Order Paper 172, in my name. That is all it would take, and that alone would help prevent 500 kids a month from going to hospital with bruises and cuts and severe lacerations. I think that is a win for our kids and a win for our families. I think it is a win for landlords. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000306\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022fc8ab326-1806-41d3-8c41-cd58c95dcb45\u0022\u003EDoes anybody want to be a landlord whose tenant\u2019s child smashes though a glass door and injures themselves or sometimes dies just because you could not be bothered getting some tape from Mitre 10 and putting in a glass strip? We do not want any of that happening in this country if we can avoid it. That is why we have regulations to help avoid these kinds of serious and expensive consequences from accidents like this. So I make no apology at all for wanting to protect 500 kids this month and 17 today from going to hospital because they fell through a glass door. So, yes, glass visibility strips are a critical part of a comprehensive warrant of fitness because they are one of the measures that will protect children from injury and help to save lives, along with a range of other measures that are also in these provisions. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000307\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022fc8ab326-1806-41d3-8c41-cd58c95dcb45\u0022\u003EI was talking earlier about Emma-Lita Bourne and about the fact that the home she was living in, which contributed to her death, did have a heater installed in it. But it was an inadequate one, and no proper ventilation, no certainty of being free from mould, and no proper insulation meant that that family could not heat their home adequately and save her life. So if we are going to have regulation around what landlords need to provide to keep their homes warm, safe, and dry, let us make sure that it actually will do that by making sure we include fixed space heating, effective ventilation, and a requirement that it is free from mould. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000308\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022fc8ab326-1806-41d3-8c41-cd58c95dcb45\u0022\u003EThere are other aspects in my Supplementary Order Paper. Effective window latches\u2014this is one of the major issues that were reviewed during the Housing New Zealand test around a warrant of fitness\u2014actually led to massive insecurity of homes. It was a huge risk factor for burglaries, which made people feel insecure in their home. These are not difficult things to do. There are some other provisions in there that members can go through, like securely locking doors, fire egress, and, of course, fire alarms, because they do need to be installed as part of a comprehensive warrant of fitness. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000309\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022fc8ab326-1806-41d3-8c41-cd58c95dcb45\u0022\u003EI would remind us too, following on from Louisa Wall, that children aged between zero and 3 spend 90 percent of their time in their home\u2014so 90 percent of a child\u2019s time between zero and 3 is spent inside their house. The quality and the condition of that house is absolutely critical to their health. We can make sure through relatively inexpensive measures, good quality regulations, and careful thought that every single one of those rental homes that these little babies are living in is warm and safe and dry and secure for them to live in. The consequences of not doing so we see being lived out every day: 40,000 hospitalisations of children for respiratory illness as a result of cold damp homes. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000310\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022fc8ab326-1806-41d3-8c41-cd58c95dcb45\u0022\u003EIf we want to understand how effective a warrant of fitness can be for that, the research on a comprehensive warrant of fitness has shown that in rental homes we can reduce hospitalisations of children by 19 percent\u2014a nearly 20 percent reduction in hospital visits by children because of respiratory illness if we make sure that there is a comprehensive warrant of fitness for their homes. For a child who might be ill and go into hospital three or four or five times in a winter, that is at least one fewer hospital visit for that child. In terms of 40,000 hospitalisations a year, thousands fewer is what we are talking about\u2014thousands fewer children going to hospital because their homes make them sick. That is a win for us. That is a win for policy. That is a win for the Government. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000311\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022fc8ab326-1806-41d3-8c41-cd58c95dcb45\u0022\u003EThere is no cost here to the Government of a comprehensive warrant of fitness. It is not going to be expensive for the Government to require landlords to meet basic safety standards and have good quality homes that they rent out to families. Everybody wins. Landlords have better quality homes that over time they may well be able to rent for greater amounts, improving the value of their property. The Government wins by having good quality policy that reduces hospital visits, reduces accidents, and reduces the financial burden on hospitals and ACC. Families win because they know that their kids are safe in their homes, safe and secure, warm and dry. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000312\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022fc8ab326-1806-41d3-8c41-cd58c95dcb45\u0022\u003ESo I find it impossible to understand why Nick Smith would pick on petty issues and make ridiculous claims about the provisions in my Supplementary Order Paper when he could choose to do something great for New Zealand families\u2014something that is also great for him, is part of his legacy as a Minister, something that is great for the Government in terms of taking housing issues seriously, something that is great for families, and something that is great for the national budget\u2014win, win, win. These are the solutions that the Greens are putting forward. They are good for the Government, good for our economy, good for our homes, and good for our families. Thank you.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002247c29b78-eee0-4c91-afdf-7b07be780e1a\u0022 data-id=\u0022146f1e38ed514967a15a13b1e2f8d5e8\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000313\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002247c29b78-eee0-4c91-afdf-7b07be780e1a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022146f1e38ed514967a15a13b1e2f8d5e8\u0022\u003EDENIS O\u2019ROURKE (NZ First):\u003C/span\u003E The major problem with this piece of legislation is not what it does but that it does not do it well enough. The main problem that we in New Zealand First see with it\u2014we will continue to support the bill, but we are disappointed in it\u2014is the issue about non-uniform insulation standards. This bill does mean that properties built after 1978 with insulation standards that were in force at that time will for ever be permanently exempted from modern insulation standards\u2014for ever exempted from that\u2014and that is completely unacceptable to us. We would expect that, over time, all properties should have to come up to those standards.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000314\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002247c29b78-eee0-4c91-afdf-7b07be780e1a\u0022\u003EI listened to what Minister Nick Smith said about that, and the excuse that he gave as to why he would allow that situation to continue to occur in the future under this bill. I forget the exact figure, but he said that more than 80 percent of the modern insulation standard would be achieved by the 1978 standard. First of all, I do not accept that that is the case. I do not accept that that is anything more than just an estimate, and the reality is that that will be very patchy. There will be some well under that percentage and some, no doubt, considerably better than it. I built my home shortly after that time. I remember investigating standards and looking at what other people were doing, and I found that there was a huge array of different solutions to the insulation of homes, so, factually, I do not accept what the Minister said.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000315\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002247c29b78-eee0-4c91-afdf-7b07be780e1a\u0022\u003EThe other excuse that members on the other side of the Chamber have given for not requiring all properties to come up to modern 2008 standards is the cost. The claim was made that if that cost was imposed on people with properties built after 1978, then that would mean significant rent increases and that that would be a problem for renting properties, but that is completely untrue. That is not the way markets work, because once a regulation is in force, the whole level playing field just goes up a little. One property is not performing any better or worse than the other if that happens, and there are no grounds for one landlord increasing rents more than another. So market competition simply means that the market can bear a certain amount, and that is the amount that will determine the rent, not whether the properties are being improved in terms of their insulation standard. So for that reason I do not accept the National members\u2019 arguments, either.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000316\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002247c29b78-eee0-4c91-afdf-7b07be780e1a\u0022\u003EWhat does, of course, increase rents is house prices, and rents are based on the recovery of the cost of capital of houses. That, today, is what is really driving rent increases, and anybody with half an ounce of common sense knows that if we continue to get the magnitude of house price increases that we are currently getting, then inevitably that is going to push rents up and up and up, and little or no proportion of those rent increases will come from having any requirement for an improved insulation standard. That is the truth of the situation there. I think that the National Government\u2019s arguments in terms of those exemptions\u2014which is what they, effectively, are\u2014for 1978 properties from having the current standards is simply unacceptable.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000317\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002247c29b78-eee0-4c91-afdf-7b07be780e1a\u0022\u003EIn fact, if the Government really was concerned about rent increases arising from having a requirement for properties built after 1978 to improve insulation standards to current standards, then why would it not, for example, allow landlords to expense the whole of the cost of that upgrade in the year that the expense was actually incurred? If that was done, then what we would see is landlords wanting to do this voluntarily, whether it was required in the regulations or not. I know that that is the case, because I have talked to representatives of the landlords\u2019 organisation and they have said to me that for a certain specified number of particular improvements\u2014like insulation, like improved heating facilities in homes\u2014if they were allowed to expense those costs fully in the year that they were incurred, then those people would invest much more readily and much more willingly in the improvements to their homes.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000318\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002247c29b78-eee0-4c91-afdf-7b07be780e1a\u0022\u003ESo if the Government really is concerned about those issues, then that is the sort of thing that it would do about it, but we are not seeing that. So I do not accept at all the arguments that the Minister and the speakers from the other side of the Chamber have put up against requiring, over time, all properties to meet what we are calling now the 2008 insulation standards. There should be no difference, whenever the property was improved or whenever it was built. What I would say is that if a property was built after 1978, because the insulation standards were better than before 1978, I would think it would be reasonable to have a longer period of time for compliance for properties built after 1978\u2014maybe 7 or 8 years, or something like that\u2014but it should not be for ever. There should be a period within which all landlords know that today\u2019s standards\u2014the 2008 standards\u2014are the standards that, ultimately, they will be required to have. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000319\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002247c29b78-eee0-4c91-afdf-7b07be780e1a\u0022\u003EFurthermore, as technologies improve, we should improve those standards, and landlords should continue to have to meet those standards within a reasonable period of time, no matter what those standards are and no matter when a property was built. That has got to be the objective\u2014uniform standards for all properties\u2014so that we get this very essential requirement for insulation at the highest achievable standard that we can in New Zealand, and, of course, that will not be enough by itself.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000320\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002247c29b78-eee0-4c91-afdf-7b07be780e1a\u0022\u003EI want to refer, lastly, to Supplementary Order Paper 172, because the part of that that I particularly want to see is that heating and ventilation must also be subject to minimum requirements for performance of a property in terms of heating and ventilation\u2014not just a list that space heating, for example, should be required, but what the standard actually is. There is not much point in having very good insulation standards without having similar standards for performance of heating systems and for performance of ventilation.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000321\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002247c29b78-eee0-4c91-afdf-7b07be780e1a\u0022\u003EThat should not, of course, apply only to rental properties. We have to try to see that those standards get met throughout New Zealand\u2019s housing stock as soon as possible because, as others have said, the cost savings and the avoidance of illness and the avoidance of a whole raft of social problems that arise from this lack of standards in New Zealand are fundamental problems we have to address in this country, and we need to try to get ourselves much closer to the kinds of standards that you see in North America, in particular, and in parts of Europe. So we need to aspire to that much.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000322\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002247c29b78-eee0-4c91-afdf-7b07be780e1a\u0022\u003EThat is why, I think, I am so disappointed in this piece of legislation, because it really does not go far enough. The Minister has criticised other parties for wanting to go too far. He should look in the mirror and see that the real problem is not them; it is him, for not wanting to go far enough.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022b398827c-6bf5-403e-90dc-ff03205302a5\u0022 data-id=\u0022f1c8a57693324423bc969d1cd9a3cecf\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000323\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b398827c-6bf5-403e-90dc-ff03205302a5\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022f1c8a57693324423bc969d1cd9a3cecf\u0022\u003ESu\u2019a WILLIAM SIO (Labour\u2014M\u0101ngere):\u003C/span\u003E I want to make some preliminary statements and then make reference to clause 4, clause 23, and clause 37 of Part 1, and then, if I have time, I do want to speak in support of Metiria Turei\u2019s Supplementary Order Paper 172.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000324\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b398827c-6bf5-403e-90dc-ff03205302a5\u0022\u003EI want to put to this Committee that we have three significant crises that this country is facing. The first one is housing\u2014the lack of affordable housing and cold and damp housing. The second one is the growing number of children living in poverty. The third one is the growing gap in equality. All three contribute to another growing crisis\u2014that is, sickly and unhealthy children\u2014but I am told by those in the medical profession that if we get the affordable housing and if we get housing to be more warm and more healthy, then we can fix the growing number of sickly and unhealthy children.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000325\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b398827c-6bf5-403e-90dc-ff03205302a5\u0022\u003EFirstly, I want to ask the Minister a question. In a statement that he released as a preamble to this bill he said that this bill was primarily about affordable or cheap insulation, and yet I heard earlier that he talked about saving lives. I want to ask the Minister: what is the primary focus of this bill? Is it about cheap insulation or about saving lives? I put it to you that if you are saying it is about saving lives, then I do not believe\u2014I have to agree with my colleague who spoke earlier, Denis O\u2019Rourke\u2014that you are going to achieve that. And I do not believe the figures that you have put out, particularly when you hear the Children\u2019s Commissioner say that as a result of cold, damp, and unhealthy housing we have 42,000 kids going to hospital and 15 deaths a year. Am I correct\u2014it is 15?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000326\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022adfebb13e22144fd88f08ef08d6eb1cb\u0022\u003EHon Member\u003C/span\u003E: Yes, that\u2019s right. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000327\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b398827c-6bf5-403e-90dc-ff03205302a5\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002250e61314023840ee8ceb7998c061b2c2\u0022\u003ESu\u2019a WILLIAM SIO\u003C/span\u003E: So I am asking the Minister: is it true that the primary focus of this bill is about saving lives, or is it true, what he released in a preamble statement leading to this bill, that it was about cheap insulation? I do not believe that you can have both. If you are going to save the lives of children and families at risk, then you cannot have the primary focus of this bill being cheap insulation. It concerns me what has been raised earlier, that those houses that were built prior to 1978 will get insulation retrofitted but those houses built after 1978 will remain as they are.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000328\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b398827c-6bf5-403e-90dc-ff03205302a5\u0022\u003EI have to say that many of the houses in South Auckland go back to the 1940s, but some of the new houses that come after 1978 do not have insulation. These were built\u2014I think the Hon Maurice Williamson made reference to it\u2014during the period of those homes that had the leaky home syndrome. These were the houses that were built during that era, after 1978\u2014the 1980s. So those houses are not going to be healthy or safe for children if we are not going to compel their owners to retrofit them with insulation that is of the time. By leaving out those houses that were built after 1978, you have got a gap of 33 years.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000329\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b398827c-6bf5-403e-90dc-ff03205302a5\u0022\u003EI do ask the Minister: is this about saving lives or is it about providing cheap insulation? If it is about providing cheap insulation, there we go again\u2014you lead yourself to the condemnation of the public, because the public will be seeing this, and they will say: \u201CThere he goes again\u2014supporting his mates rather than doing the right thing for the country.\u201D I want to, then, ask in terms of clause 4 of Part 1: do the provisions that extend insulation apply to garages and to sleepouts? Because\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000330\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00220da3c21ac66d46ce9d21ae99f4c09fe7\u0022\u003EHon Member\u003C/span\u003E: What about cars?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000331\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b398827c-6bf5-403e-90dc-ff03205302a5\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00229fc3b9e7c25d4c91b32f7722ba115e50\u0022\u003ESu\u2019a WILLIAM SIO\u003C/span\u003E: And cars\u2014well, ha, ha! Right now, at this very moment, we have a number of families with children living in garages\u2014garages with concrete floors. There is no insulation on the walls. There is merely a piece of iron around that, and a boarding up against the wall, but there is also no insulation.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022 data-id=\u002267e8f001d8424bf7a26b04d22f6b09b2\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000332\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002267e8f001d8424bf7a26b04d22f6b09b2\u0022\u003EHon Dr NICK SMITH (Minister for Building and Housing):\u003C/span\u003E I want to rise to the challenge of the points that were made by both Denis O\u2019Rourke and Su\u2019a William Sio, who has just spoken. Firstly, he says the Residential Tenancies Amendment Bill is about cheap insulation. No, it is not. Let me be very clear: the bill and the regulations require that all insulation to be installed is to the 2008 standard\u2014absolutely. He asks the question as to whether cost should be a factor in the policy making. Of course it should, because all costs that we impose through regulation of this sort are ultimately passed on to the tenant, and we have to be confident that the benefit is more than the cost. So here is my challenge for Mr O\u2019Rourke and Mr Su\u2019a William Sio, and it is this\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000333\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00229f4c8a4530df4e388dbbccf1dc9004bc\u0022\u003EHon Members\u003C/span\u003E: Sio.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000334\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00223da83ce7c91b4dd2bd46535226d257a0\u0022\u003EHon Dr NICK SMITH\u003C/span\u003E: \u2014Sio\u2014when it came to the earthquake-prone buildings legislation, this Parliament did not require that every single building be upgraded to today\u2019s standard. Were we, as a Parliament, saying that lives do not matter? No, we were saying, quite logically, that there needs to be an upgrade of older buildings but that it is not realistic that every older building meets the same standard today. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000335\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003EI challenge the member on this point: the current new regulations require every home in New Zealand to have double glazing. Why do we not put in this bill that every house has to retrospectively get double glazing? If you want to follow the logic that you have advanced, which is that every building has to be to the same standard, that is what you would do. The reason we do not do that is not because we do not care about children or about home warmth; it is because we are economically rational. If we required every home to meet today\u2019s standard, and to be double glazed\u2014if you believe what you say, you would actually put in this bill that every home has to be double glazed, because that is the current standard. But we do not, because the cost that that would impose would exceed the benefit. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000336\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003EHere is the bit that I do not think is understood: the 1978 standard provides for an 83 percent reduction in heat loss. The 2001 standard\u2014they are the facts; they are the technical statistics, the R rating. In respect of the 2001 standard, that takes it to 87 percent, and the simple logic is this: insulating the 180,000 homes that are not insulated at all, of which you are getting no reduction in heat loss, is where the massive gains are to be made. Members opposite are completely underestimating the challenge for the insulation industry to do 60,000 homes per year over the next 3 years, which, in my advice, is going to stretch that industry to its absolute limits. That is my view: the cost-benefit analysis is overwhelming in saying that the benefits come from those houses that are uninsulated. Furthermore, this bill requires that where the insulation from 1978 is not in fit and proper condition it does need to be upgraded, and when it is upgraded, it is upgraded to the 2008 standard. That is logical, that is consistent, that is the right thing for New Zealand families, and it is the right thing for New Zealand homes. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022e77494a0-1be1-432f-b492-fd160f4c119d\u0022 data-id=\u00227e8299e2b924421cb8c824a9f153ae4a\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000337\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e77494a0-1be1-432f-b492-fd160f4c119d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00227e8299e2b924421cb8c824a9f153ae4a\u0022\u003EPEENI HENARE (Labour\u2014T\u0101maki Makaurau):\u003C/span\u003E Ka pai, Mr Chairman. Thank you very much for allowing me this opportunity. I rise to make a brief contribution to this debate, and I want to speak specifically to clause 37, in respect of the installation of smoke alarms. Minister Nick Smith has just mentioned to us that we are underestimating the cost, that it has to be economically viable and sustainable, and all of this choice jargon. I received a text message from one of my constituents who is actually watching right now in one of the libraries in South Auckland. Let me explain what is \u201Ceconomically viable\u201D for that constituent\u2014and it is a matter of dollars and cents, just as the Minister has already mentioned. In this particular clause, there will be an onus placed upon the tenant to replace flat batteries in the alarms. I understand the reasons around safety, because we do see a heck of a lot of unnecessary house fires in communities, whether they are rural or in the city, but this particular constituent of mine said that after his expenses go out for rent and for those urgent expenses that are required to maintain life for him and his family, he is left with $15\u2014$15\u2014to make sure he can put kai on the table for his family.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000338\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e77494a0-1be1-432f-b492-fd160f4c119d\u0022\u003EAlthough this might seem just a silly little bit in the bill, when you place an expectation on a tenant who struggles on $15 per week to feed their family, you place on them an expectation to buy, say, in a standard, three-bedroom home, three smoke alarms. You have one in the lounge or open living area\u2014it usually covers the dining room as well\u2014one near the kitchen, which makes sense, and, generally, one in the hallway, which will cover the bedrooms. I am afraid that the price of those batteries is just beyond the reach of some of our families. I know that sounds petty and minuscule to some in the Committee here, but I can tell you that if it is a matter of dollars and cents for those who come through into my offices then they struggle to meet those costs. They struggle to meet emergency situations\u2014a flat tyre, for example\u2014where costs are really high. Even the smallest of price increases in their weekly budget, which they must factor into their budgeting throughout the week or throughout the month\u2014however they might be paid\u2014just those small things are a real challenge for those people.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000339\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e77494a0-1be1-432f-b492-fd160f4c119d\u0022\u003EWhile continuing on this point, I want to consider the current crisis. I want, in relation to smoke alarms, think about the emergency housing situation. I also want to think about the emergency housing situation that is being met right now by the likes of Te Puea Marae. Some of the compliance requirements for those emergency houses\u2014I know this legislation says \u201Cprivate rentals\u201D\u2014I wonder how we can then boost these kinds of protections for those who are providing these necessary services. Some of those people were mentioned by my colleague Su\u2019a William Sio, who talked about garages and the need for those to be insulated and have a fire alarm placed inside them. That is even more important in my constituency, when I consider a particular house I recently visited. Will there be compliance requirements for that private rental property? The garage is also being rented out by the person who owns that property, so, essentially, there are two dwellings on the property where separate families are living. I wonder whether these particular amendments to the bill will require those other dwellings, like a garage\u2014and like a carport, as we have seen very recently\u2014to meet any particular standard that will provide a warm, safe, dry, and healthy home for those families and those resident in those homes; and safe by way of fire alarms.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000340\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e77494a0-1be1-432f-b492-fd160f4c119d\u0022\u003EI consider Supplementary Order Paper 172 presented to the Committee by Metiria Turei, and I think it is probably a fair reflection of what is not being done by this Government. Why? Because if you look at the Supplementary Order Paper, you will see a heck of a lot of recommendations\u2014[Bell rung] Mr Chair?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000341\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225f1453f8-c44e-4ce6-b699-64d600322276\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022bf00466a7a8649559567e530b9cac264\u0022\u003EThe CHAIRPERSON (Hon Chester Borrows)\u003C/span\u003E: Peeni Henare.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000342\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e77494a0-1be1-432f-b492-fd160f4c119d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00227aebc612d662415999851b1a95ae7820\u0022\u003EPEENI HENARE\u003C/span\u003E: Excellent, Mr Chair, thank you very much. You will see quite a large number of amendments being proposed in this Supplementary Order Paper in the hope that we can actually fix the problem\u2014fix the problem, not tinker around the edges. This is because what this particular bill that we are debating at the moment proposes is a \u201Csteady as she goes\u201D approach\u2014that there is actually not a crisis. We will turn a few knobs here, pull a few strings there, in the hope that, longer term, we will have a solution to some of the issues. That is, literally, tinkering around the edges and not doing enough.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000343\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e77494a0-1be1-432f-b492-fd160f4c119d\u0022\u003ENow to Metiria Turei\u2019s fantastic Supplementary Order Paper, which details what I consider to be some pretty standard human rights\u2014some of them are as simple as adequate cooking facilities. I wonder whether there are kitchens in the sheds in South Auckland? Probably not. I wonder whether there are places where there is a bath, a shower, or a toilet with proper sewage disposal in a lot of those sheds that are being rented out as a second dwelling on one property? Probably not. So I want to support Metiria Turei\u2019s Supplementary Order Paper to the Committee today, and once again emphasise the fact that this bill just does not go quite far enough.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000344\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e77494a0-1be1-432f-b492-fd160f4c119d\u0022\u003EJust going back to clause 37: I know there are small, technical things in bills such as this, but the word \u201Cmay\u201D keeps coming up. I consider that the word should be \u201Cmust\u201D. It should be \u201Cmust\u201D in many cases, and in particular this one, where it actually forces the landlords who own these properties to comply and to make sure that smoke alarms go into houses. It sounds like a small word, but it is an important word in the scheme of things. I wonder whether Minister Smith or some of the other members from the other side of the Chamber can just address some of those things, because they are questions that we all have. They are questions around the safety of our families and they are questions that must be answered in order to fix this housing crisis.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000345\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e77494a0-1be1-432f-b492-fd160f4c119d\u0022\u003EI end by saying once again that this bill is just not good enough and it is not big enough. OK, we will be supporting it, but we do have huge reservations and we also have some other views that we hope to express. Kia ora.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022695678cf-542a-4616-9e0a-86990caec192\u0022 data-id=\u00222f3b6582c13f4f959de75419b83d137b\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000346\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022695678cf-542a-4616-9e0a-86990caec192\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00222f3b6582c13f4f959de75419b83d137b\u0022\u003EALFRED NGARO (National):\u003C/span\u003E It is quite an honour to be able to take a call. I want to start by first acknowledging the comment by Mr Peeni Henare, when he said that small things do make a big difference. I absolutely agree. For almost 20 years I worked in the community of Glen Innes\u2014for a number of years\u2014which had the largest State housing stock in New Zealand at one stage. Almost 2,500 homes were there. I know that, in working with a small trust with the families, the children, and the young people in that community, and wanting to meet their needs\u2014I know there were many times that there were cold homes that I went into. There were homes in which there were people who were struggling, where there was poverty, and where there were issues.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000347\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022695678cf-542a-4616-9e0a-86990caec192\u0022\u003EAlthough the talk on the other side is about housing, poverty, and health conditions, I saw all those three things, and under a Labour Government of 9 years, not once did I see any change in that. I can name the streets: Fenwick Avenue, that is there; Flanders Street; and Ropata Avenue. Those are the streets with houses that families were in, and not once in those 9 years did I see insulation going into those homes, addressing the issues of poverty. Even the Salvation Army\u2019s state of the nation report talked about how that needed to happen.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000348\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022695678cf-542a-4616-9e0a-86990caec192\u0022\u003EBut I am talking about the bill here in its Committee stage. What is really important are the issues. I want to address the issues around insulation, because talking about insulation\u2014there has been outcry over the fact that this does not meet the standard. I understand that many of those members may not have had the report. We know that the Building Research Association of New Zealand (BRANZ) had a report and a survey. It said that there were 450,000 homes out there that needed some form of insulation. When Mr O\u2019Rourke talked about the sense of uniform ability\u2014well, if he had read the report, he would realise that at least 100,000 of those homes are unable to be insulated because of their physical dimensions.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000349\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022695678cf-542a-4616-9e0a-86990caec192\u0022\u003EI want to point to the two different sizes of insulation that have been making their way around the Opposition benches. Having come from a construction background, as an electrician by trade, what I can say to you is this: while they can bandy around and show two different forms of insulation, what they will not understand is that to truly insulate a property and a home, it is like, for instance, how you need to think about a chilly bin or a cooler. In order to get 100 percent insulation, you need to make sure it is watertight and airtight. You cannot do that in a house, but what you can do is move towards that with double-glazing of windows. It is insulation in ceilings and in the floor\u2014that is what this Government is moving towards. That is what this bill is moving towards and has the best reasonable and rational point of view in what it is doing.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000350\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022695678cf-542a-4616-9e0a-86990caec192\u0022\u003EWhat do we say, then, to the point of insulation from 1978? Well, there was an energy performance survey that was done in which it clearly states that, obviously, from 1978, the sealing of the insulation that was installed to the new standard of 2008\u2014when the Opposition members talk about it, they will keep holding up the two different levels of insulation. If you take the technical aspect\u2014not just your own philosophy or ideology\u2014the technical issue is that from that form of insulation to this form of insulation, the efficacy and the efficiency that you will try to gain is not there. As long as the insulation retains itself to that 1978 standard\u2014to try to include that is not there. The technical aspect of different insulation does not weigh up.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000351\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022695678cf-542a-4616-9e0a-86990caec192\u0022\u003ELet us go a little bit further than that, because the BRANZ report clearly states this: the average cost of insulation is $3,400 per home, for ceiling and floor, right? Therefore, if you were to upgrade that form of insulation to try to get it back to what you would call the standard of 2008, what is the cost? It is $2,800 on average. Where is the cost saving in that? There is none. There is no cost saving.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000352\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022695678cf-542a-4616-9e0a-86990caec192\u0022\u003EBut here is the question that Mr O\u2019Rourke then brought: will that cost go back to the tenants? He said that of course it will not. Mr O\u2019Rourke needs to realise this: over 70 percent to almost 80 percent of current landlords in New Zealand are who? They are mum and dad investors with one rental property. That is the average. They are good people who are out in our communities, who want to do the right thing, and who are doing the right thing. That is what we are saying inside of this legislation. If we are going to try to have a uniform response, to try to make sure that everyone has to impose these costs, then mum and dad and average investors will simply say: \u201CWe have to push this cost on to the tenant.\u201D That is not rational. That is not reasonable. That is the reason why we believe the standards that we are taking are making a difference.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000353\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022695678cf-542a-4616-9e0a-86990caec192\u0022\u003EI just want to make some other comments in regard to regulatory powers that are inside the bill. There was the issue around ventilation. The Housing Improvement Regulations 1947 clearly state the fact that households need to provide adequate ventilation and also the heating that is inside of that. The question was asked to the Ministry of Business, Innovation and Employment (MBIE) and it looked and reviewed this. What clearly came back from MBIE was this: that the cost that is incurred will be passed on to the tenant.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022 data-id=\u0022f64d20817c7c4fd2b4d5b750d8246ee4\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000354\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022f64d20817c7c4fd2b4d5b750d8246ee4\u0022\u003EJACINDA ARDERN (Labour):\u003C/span\u003E We have had a lot of discussion about cost-benefit analysis, and obviously with any significant legislative change there is an expectation, not just because of the requirements around setting out regulatory impact statements, that at least some cost-benefit analysis is done. But it is really up to a Minister and a department to factor in the range of issues that they would like to include in that cost-benefit analysis. In this debate, an area that seems to be severely lacking in the Minister for Building and Housing\u2019s logic around the cost of, for instance, including standards in the Residential Tenancies Amendment Bill around heating, or even including higher standards around insulation, is that it does not factor in the cost to the State in the cost-benefit analysis of some of the issues around living in cold and damp housing. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000355\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022\u003EI would actually really like to hear from the Minister about what he considers to be an adequate cost-benefit analysis, because he describes this bill as economically rational when, for instance, the cost to the State of rheumatic fever for a child is between $300,000 and $500,000. Obviously, the Government does consider that to be a cost worth mitigating because why else would it have made it one of its Better Public Services targets. It has implemented ways to screen by swabbing children for streptococcus and treating children with antibiotics, but, actually, if we were serious about prevention in this space we would acknowledge that you cannot pick up a child who is not at school\u2014because that is where the children are being swabbed\u2014and so if you really want to prevent further incidences you would look to the source, which is cold, damp, overcrowded housing. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000356\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022\u003ESo I think that it would make very good sense to include in a cost-benefit analysis the cost of the diseases of poverty and overcrowding, but also those that are directly influenced by\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000357\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002251e8d55fdf534dbe97b4daf89ca708fd\u0022\u003EHon Dr Nick Smith\u003C/span\u003E: They have.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000358\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022ca5af675cb3c48119d9cc23048032dd9\u0022\u003EJACINDA ARDERN\u003C/span\u003E: If the Minister says that they have, I would welcome, then, further detail on why it is that in his cost-benefit analysis, where we have over 40,000 children admitted to hospital per annum, it did not make economic sense in his mind to add, for example, heating and higher standards around insulation in this instance, because\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000359\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00223849b0eb05544050acadbf6cf3c2264c\u0022\u003EHon Dr Nick Smith\u003C/span\u003E: It\u2019s already in the regulations.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000360\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022f5fce639629341c3a803183a2c139792\u0022\u003EJACINDA ARDERN\u003C/span\u003E: It does not make economic sense for the State to bear the burden of that cost, because the ministry has made an assumption that if that went to a landlord\u2014and I challenge this assumption\u2014and we required landlords to provide a source of heating, they would automatically put that cost on to their tenants. I actually question that rationale. Alfred Ngaro has said that mum and dad investors are the people we are talking about here who would be impacted by changes like that\u2014I do not disagree with that\u2014and that they want to be good landlords, and those are the people whom we would be putting this cost on to who would naturally then pass it on. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000361\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022\u003EI question the decision making there to assume that every single landlord would put that cost on to the tenant. I have been a tenant for most of my life living in properties outside of my family home. I have had continual upgrades to different properties that I have lived in. Not once has that upgrade come at a cost where that landlord has said to me: \u201CBecause I have made this adjustment to the property that you are in, I am now going to immediately charge you more in your rent.\u201D I have not had that experience. We have made an assumption here\u2014an assumption that we want the tenant to bear the brunt of poor quality housing, because the trade-off is that they will paying more. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000362\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022\u003ETenants are paying more because we have a housing crisis\u2014let us be clear on that. That is the reason why tenants are primarily paying more. Why not have a requirement that landlords do right by their tenants, because, actually, I have a belief that there are a good number of landlords who would not necessarily pass that on. For those who would not\u2014those who are the slum landlords\u2014let us make them provide quality housing. What is wrong with that? Why should we as a State bear the burden of the cost of children being hospitalised whilst we allow landlords to get away with not providing quality housing?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00222df33ee5-23d6-441c-a9ba-6495aa69f9fd\u0022 data-id=\u00229f89ece6ed364b10b171c55a92422e66\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000363\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00222df33ee5-23d6-441c-a9ba-6495aa69f9fd\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00229f89ece6ed364b10b171c55a92422e66\u0022\u003EDENISE ROCHE (Green):\u003C/span\u003E I rise to take a short call on this. I want to address the Supplementary Order Paper that my colleague Metiria Turei has put forward. But before I do that, I just want to make a couple of general comments. I think I will start by saying that, essentially, what we have got in New Zealand is housing stock rental accommodation that is substandard. How do we know that? We know that because there are, according to the Children\u2019s Commissioner, 42,000 hospital visits per year, with 15 children dying every year because of substandard housing with poor insulation. We know that because we have seen so many people who are desperate for housing who are living in sheds, who are living in garages, and who are living in caravans and even in cars. I blame this Government because it has not addressed the housing crisis that has enabled bad landlords to continue to provide poor rental accommodation. It is about time that we did something about it.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000364\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00222df33ee5-23d6-441c-a9ba-6495aa69f9fd\u0022\u003EThe Minister said earlier that we do have regulations. But they are being flouted. There are so many different examples of people who are living in substandard housing where, if there are regulations, their landlords are not meeting them anyway. I have examples of that in my own community where I have some friends who, essentially, were renting a house in which, in the end, they, basically, could not turn on the electricity because the wiring was so poor, let alone heat the home in the middle of winter. When they asked for that to be fixed, it just did not happen, and so they moved out. But the landlord put that property on the market and another desperate family moved in, with no repairs being undertaken whatsoever.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000365\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00222df33ee5-23d6-441c-a9ba-6495aa69f9fd\u0022\u003EI want to refer to some of the submissions that came through that support the measures that my colleague Metiria Turei has put in the Supplementary Order Paper. These were particularly from the Citizens Advice Bureau that said that it has had a 40 percent increase in inquiries related to residential tenancies in the last 5 years. I believe that reflects the fact that there is a wide breach of minimum standards from landlords, and it is probably why the bureau supports more regulation for the protection of tenants. That is what we should be aiming at. We should be remembering that a home when it is rented is a home; it is not just a rental property and not just a way for the landlord to make money. If we focus on that, then we should be focusing on the rights of tenants as well: the right to warm, safe, dry, affordable housing is the first point, but the second point is around security of tenancy. This is why we have in the Supplementary Order Paper a right of renewal for tenants after 3 years.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000366\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00222df33ee5-23d6-441c-a9ba-6495aa69f9fd\u0022\u003EI grew up in rental accommodation provided by the State through the railways. About 10 or 11 years of my life was spent in one rental property. That enabled me to go to one school, to have one community that I was part of, and to be very, very stable. We have seen through various reports the declining education outcomes from children who are shifting from house to house to house because their rental properties are not secure, and who have to move because they are facing rent increases. That is another reason why we want rights for tenants that include that any increases in rent need to be part of the rental agreement at the beginning. And it has to be justified so that we do not have families who are facing major rental increases, are unable to budget, and are having to shift into cheaper accommodation\u2014and upsetting, interfering, and interrupting the education of their children.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000367\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00222df33ee5-23d6-441c-a9ba-6495aa69f9fd\u0022\u003EWhen you move into a home, it is a home, and that means that you are part of a community\u2014that is where the schools are\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002290ea1538-43e8-4257-bd80-df3ccd1e5f27\u0022 data-id=\u0022d1ff505d519041289f5fd385f2b1ab26\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000368\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002290ea1538-43e8-4257-bd80-df3ccd1e5f27\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022d1ff505d519041289f5fd385f2b1ab26\u0022\u003EKRIS FAAFOI (Labour\u2014Mana):\u003C/span\u003E It is a genuine pleasure to speak to the Residential Tenancies Amendment Bill. Can I refer to clause 38, which I think a number of my colleagues have referred to previously in the debate.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000369\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002290ea1538-43e8-4257-bd80-df3ccd1e5f27\u0022\u003ELike Denise Roche, who said in her speech that she grew up in a railway house, I too spent most of my younger years in a State house, in Christchurch. I do not think I left it until I was about 20. I think my parents moved in there about 1976, so it would have been prior to the 1978 age of insulation. I think my colleague Jacinda Ardern poses a decent question to ask of the Minister for Building and Housing around any work the Government has done around how this piece of work will make the lives of those people in low to medium income families better off and safer and healthier in those homes. The reason I ask that is that I grew up in one of those homes. I suffered from asthma; I still do to this day, and I think it is because of the lack of decent insulation my family home had that I still suffer from asthma from time to time\u2014sometimes it is due to my own management, but most of it, I believe, is because of the home that I grew up in. I do not say that lightly. There were a couple of occasions, my late father told me, when the doctor said \u201CWell, that was a close one.\u201D when I was young, because I had such bad asthma attacks that I nearly died.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000370\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002290ea1538-43e8-4257-bd80-df3ccd1e5f27\u0022\u003EI believe we come to this House with a responsibility to make the lives of people who follow us markedly better. It is certainly one of the things I push for in my own electorate. With all sincerity and all generosity and fairness to the Government, although it is trying to make an effort with this piece of legislation, I do not think it goes far enough. I fear that the same kind of experiences that my family went through, with me having asthma when I grew up, will happen to families who grow up in the same poorly insulated homes, which we are allowing to continue to happen under this piece of legislation. On this side of the Chamber we have argued that as well as insulation there needs to be a decent mode of heating\u2014something, again, that my family did not have. We had fan heaters, which cost us far too much to run\u2014and I am talking here of the 1980s and 1990s.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000371\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002290ea1538-43e8-4257-bd80-df3ccd1e5f27\u0022\u003EI am asking, in all seriousness, why families who are on low incomes and in poorly insulated houses have to go through the same experience my family went through 20 years ago. Why should parents have to worry about their children who get constantly admitted into hospital with illnesses like asthma, like me\u2014and in some cases those children will pass away, unnecessarily\u2014because we here in Parliament have not learnt the lessons of 20 to 30 years ago? I do not think my parents overly enjoyed the experience of taking me to the hospital and seeing me nearly pass away from an asthma attack, yet in this Parliament we seriously think it is OK to let the conditions of a 1978 insulation standard continue to be OK for families here in New Zealand. It is simply not good enough. I was one of the lucky ones, but I still go to hospital every so often with an asthma attack. But why should we allow this to continue to happen?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000372\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002290ea1538-43e8-4257-bd80-df3ccd1e5f27\u0022\u003ESomeone from that side of the Chamber\u2014and they already have\u2014stood up and said: \u201CWell, what did you guys do in your last period of Government?\u201D. Are we here to sit here and continue to play politics like that?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000373\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002260200136-9d63-4a82-b4f5-c00411adb1fd\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00220126f589839046c69b40c11a8d823cdf\u0022\u003EHon Jo Goodhew\u003C/span\u003E: Ha!\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000374\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002290ea1538-43e8-4257-bd80-df3ccd1e5f27\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00222bbcfe5f3fbc4bf8a9e122bcccae36fc\u0022\u003EKRIS FAAFOI\u003C/span\u003E: Is that all you are going to say? And there is laughter over there. But I do not think it is good enough that we allow conditions, in terms of heating and insulation, to continue to be those of 1978, 1980s, and 1990s standards. The Government members can laugh at my speech\u2014they can say whatever they like\u2014but what I think is that we deserve to do better for the families out there, like mine, who are living in these substandard conditions and who do not want their kids to go to hospital with life-threatening illnesses not just once but constantly.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000375\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002290ea1538-43e8-4257-bd80-df3ccd1e5f27\u0022\u003EI think we owe it to the people of New Zealand who are in these conditions and these substandard houses to make sure that they can live a decent life. I was lucky enough to do that because my parents cared for me and looked after me, and I think other families deserve that too. When people ask why I am a member of Parliament, I say it is because I got the lucky chance to have a decent home and be looked after, and I am in Parliament to be able to make sure we do better for the children in New Zealand. We can do better, and we must do better.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022bbded2ec-ac25-4a73-a380-3f4d87693084\u0022 data-id=\u00220d115a1c80044c8d856688ba997e63c5\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000376\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bbded2ec-ac25-4a73-a380-3f4d87693084\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00220d115a1c80044c8d856688ba997e63c5\u0022\u003ESTUART NASH (Labour\u2014Napier):\u003C/span\u003E I would like to talk, first and foremost, about something called a social contract. The social contract is a philosophical term, and it talks about the moral and the political obligations that are dependent upon members of society to look after the health and well-being of others. Basically, what it says is we have an obligation to build the sort of society within which we all like to live. This is where I think every single landlord understands the social contract, and if they do not we legislate to make sure they abide by the moral and social obligations that society has put on them. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000377\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bbded2ec-ac25-4a73-a380-3f4d87693084\u0022\u003EI would agree with Mr Faafoi and other speakers that this bill does not go far enough in this. There is an implied social contract, and that is that a landlord will provide a tenant with a warm, dry, safe home. It does not matter whether it is a private landlord or the Government in the form of State houses. Insulation, I believe, is a fundamental part of that social contract when we are talking about tenancy and when we are talking about rental accommodation. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000378\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bbded2ec-ac25-4a73-a380-3f4d87693084\u0022\u003EIf we talk about the sort of society we want to create\u2014and this is related to clause 38 with regard to insulation\u2014I think that most of us find, for example, rheumatic fever, which is a disease of poverty, to be abhorrent. The cost to the health system of a child diagnosed with rheumatic fever, from when they are diagnosed to when they die about 50 years later, is about $1 million per person. It is extremely high. So I think we have to enforce this obligation on landlords to provide tenants the sort of warm, dry house the landlord himself or herself would be prepared to live in or put their own children in. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000379\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bbded2ec-ac25-4a73-a380-3f4d87693084\u0022\u003EI am a landlord myself. Last winter I installed four heat pumps in a block of apartments. I can tell you that I did not change the rent one cent. The reason for that is that I reject the Minister for Building and Housing\u2019s argument that if we impose a cost on the landlord, then that will only translate into higher rents, because what determines the rent is, in fact, the market. If I had said \u201CWhat I\u2019m going to do is I\u2019m going to put up the rent by $3,000 a year for every single one of my tenants in this block of apartments.\u201D they would have been well within their rights to say \u201CIf that is the case, then we are handing in our notice.\u201D and I could well have ended up with an empty apartment. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000380\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bbded2ec-ac25-4a73-a380-3f4d87693084\u0022\u003EFor me\u2014and I know for a lot of landlords\u2014the ability to have tenants in there that are going to stay for a long time is much more important than ramping up the cost every single time I possibly can. I have not increased the rent at all, and yet I have installed four heat pumps. That is because that is how the market works, and I reject the notion that placing an obligation on landlords to provide warm, dry, healthy homes means an increase in rent, because that is not the case. The market determines the rent, and tenants have the ability, if the rent is too high, to say \u201CI\u2019m not going to stay here anymore.\u201D \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000381\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bbded2ec-ac25-4a73-a380-3f4d87693084\u0022\u003EWhen we talk about insulation, the evidence is incredibly clear. If a person, or a child, or a family lives in a home that is warm and dry, then it is safe and it is healthy. My son is in hospital at the moment. I do not want to talk about my son\u2014I do not want to bring my family into the debate\u2014but on the wall in the children\u2019s ward there is a list of 10 things that children need. One of those things is a warm, safe, dry environment. What children do not need is to live in homes that do not provide them with the sort of security they require to be the best they possibly can be. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000382\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bbded2ec-ac25-4a73-a380-3f4d87693084\u0022\u003EI just think it is inherently unfair to not require landlords to provide that sort of house. Not to do that is manifestly wrong, and I think it breaches the implied social contract between society, Parliament, the Government, and those who rent a house for whatever reason. Let us be honest about this. We have talked about the housing crisis in a number of ways, and I would like to acknowledge, as someone who lives in Napier, that the housing crisis is not simply an Auckland issue at all. There are 130 people on the waiting list in Napier. This is a crisis that goes across the country, and I want that to be known because this is often assumed to be simply an Auckland crisis. It is not. But we must provide tenants with warm, dry homes.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002258eae615-ef83-4df5-bace-6749bdd312a8\u0022 data-id=\u0022da3150a7a5654908a182b0ee857ff412\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000383\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002258eae615-ef83-4df5-bace-6749bdd312a8\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022da3150a7a5654908a182b0ee857ff412\u0022\u003EDr PARMJEET PARMAR (National):\u003C/span\u003E It is a pleasure to rise and take this call. The Opposition has been going on and on about heating and ventilation, so I would like to talk about clause 13, which amends section 45 of the Residential Tenancies Act, which states the landlord\u2019s obligations. Yes, the landlord\u2019s obligation does not include heating and ventilation as a minimum requirement. There are significant reasons for that. No. 1 is the evidence. The evidence shows that most benefits, in terms of health outcomes related to cold houses, can be obtained by insulating uninsulated houses rather than adding heating to insulated houses. So it is based on evidence. Yes, I understand\u2014it is technical. It is difficult to comprehend. That is why a technical advisory group was set up to look into the idea of a warrant of fitness. That group did come up with ideas for ventilating bathrooms, but later on dropped that as a minimum requirement because it realised that that is linked to the behaviour of the person in the house. So it will be the tenants\u2019 obligation to ventilate the bathroom.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000384\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002258eae615-ef83-4df5-bace-6749bdd312a8\u0022\u003EGiven the lack of evidence of adding all of these requirements on top of the requirements that are in this bill, I do not see any sense in that. I do not see any sense in that. This is all based on evidence, and based on the evidence we are focused on insulation.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000385\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002258eae615-ef83-4df5-bace-6749bdd312a8\u0022\u003EA second point I want to talk about is clause 6, and I also want to talk about the Green member\u2019s Supplementary Order Paper 172. I do not support that Supplementary Order Paper. The Green member Metiria Turei says that there should be calculations indicating increases in rent. That is not possible because we cannot base this on any baseless assumptions that all landlords will be able to absorb the costs that we keep imposing on them. Every landlord is in a different situation. Some landlords can put in heat pumps and may not pass the cost on to the tenants, but others might have to, simply because they just cannot afford it.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000386\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002258eae615-ef83-4df5-bace-6749bdd312a8\u0022\u003EThe second thing is that landlords love to have long-term tenants, but sometimes, if landlords want their property back for some reason, they should be able to give notice to their tenants, to get their property back. Clause 6 also requires landlords to specify the extent of insulation. They are required to include that in the tenancy agreement. If the house is exempt from that requirement, then the landlords are also required to provide that statement in the tenancy agreement. That is a good thing because we are putting the responsibility on to landlords to assess the property and provide that assessment, and statement, accordingly, to their tenants. Yes, if tenants feel that they have been given the wrong information, that they are not satisfied with the state of the house, or that it does not match with the statement that is provided by the landlord, then they can get an independent assessment done. They can go to the Tenancy Tribunal and they can get a work order issued for work to be done on that property.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000387\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002258eae615-ef83-4df5-bace-6749bdd312a8\u0022\u003EWe heard about a warrant of fitness for houses. We have been hearing that continually from the Opposition. But the idea of having a kind of warrant of fitness\u2014having an independent body assessing houses\u2014is going to cost. Yes, it does cost. These things do cost. We did a cost-benefit analysis. Yes, cost-benefit analyses are important. You cannot dismiss them. The cost-benefit analysis said that it would cost $100 million a year\u2014$100 million a year. Yes, landlords will pass that cost on to their tenants. So if I break it down to the cost per house, it comes to $225 a year for a tenant. This is without providing any additional benefits. So how is it fair to pass on this kind of cost to tenants, when there is no benefit for them?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000388\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002258eae615-ef83-4df5-bace-6749bdd312a8\u0022\u003EThe member opposite, Peeni Henare, spoke about a family he knows that is left with just $15 after paying their rent. This is $15 per week. If this cost of $225 is passed on to that family, they will be left with just $10 a week. How fair is that? It is not fair. We do not think that the idea of having a warrant of fitness is good. If I speak about the amounts for unlawful acts, I believe that they are very reasonable, after the changes that have come after the select committee process, especially for breaches under section 54(3), inserted by clause 15, for a retaliatory termination notice. We know that these kinds of notices are not uncommon. After looking at that, we decided to increase the amount from $2,000 to $4,000. Looking at other amounts that are there for unlawful acts, to make sure that landlords are complying and also to make sure that tenants are complying\u2014for example, if tenants fiddle with their smoke alarms they can be fined up to $3,000. When looking at these things, I believe that this is reasonable.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022cbc37df2-57ae-4536-94ed-a2e39eecd585\u0022 data-id=\u00222354e1141ed24f468ab9daa37953acbe\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000389\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cbc37df2-57ae-4536-94ed-a2e39eecd585\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00222354e1141ed24f468ab9daa37953acbe\u0022\u003EPHIL TWYFORD (Labour\u2014Te Atat\u016B):\u003C/span\u003E The Minister for Building and Housing, the Hon Dr Nick Smith, in his last contribution I think, if I am correct, urged the Committee to stop what he called nit-picking. I was kind of reflecting on this\u2014that the Minister thinks that the criticisms that the Opposition have of his bill are nit-picking. We have a lot of fun on this side of the House, at the expense of Dr Smith. It is mostly because there is such a big gulf between the scale of the housing crisis and this endless procession of half measures that he brings to the House and to the public. That is why we have so much fun, at his expense. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000390\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cbc37df2-57ae-4536-94ed-a2e39eecd585\u0022\u003ENevertheless, the Residential Tenancies Amendment Bill deserves to be treated with some gravity, because it is something. It is something. After prevaricating for several years, the Minister has brought a bill to the House that actually does contain some good stuff. It does actually set some standards for insulation and smoke alarms. It has comprehensive provisions that put in place the machinery of government that will be necessary in the future to administer and enforce some proper and decent standards about the quality of housing. That is something, and that is why we are voting for this bill. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000391\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cbc37df2-57ae-4536-94ed-a2e39eecd585\u0022\u003EBut the sad thing about it is that it falls so far short of what the Minister could be doing. He knows that credible New Zealand research and evidence shows that $1 invested in retro-fitting houses, through insulation and modern, affordable heating, saves $5 to $6 in future public health expenditure. That is the cost-benefit analysis, and that is why we cannot understand, on this side of the Chamber, why the Minister is legislating in this bill redundant insulation standards that go back to 1978. That is the shame of it. When this bill passes\u2014as it will because National has the numbers in the House\u2014hundreds of thousands of rental properties in New Zealand that are currently insulated to the 1978 standard will not have to be upgraded to the current 2008 standard. That is the shame of this bill, and that is the poverty of ambition that underlies so much of this Minister\u2019s housing policy. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000392\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cbc37df2-57ae-4536-94ed-a2e39eecd585\u0022\u003EThe reason for the deficiencies, the rationale for the deficiencies at the heart of this bill, is that it would be too much of a burden on landlords. The Minister is clearly afraid that requiring, for example, a $3,000 heat pump will be such a burden on landlords that they will have to put the rent up. My colleague Stuart Nash has put paid to that assertion. We know, everybody knows, the Minister knows, that rents are set by supply and demand. Just because a landlord has to replace the roof because it is leaking, and spends $10,000 on replacing it, the landlord cannot put up the rent to recover that cost from the hapless tenant. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000393\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cbc37df2-57ae-4536-94ed-a2e39eecd585\u0022\u003EIf you consider the case of heat pumps, a heat pump might cost, let us say, at most, $3,500. A modern heat pump would have a lifetime of 15 years. Over that time, across the country, an average rental property with an average weekly rent of $440 would generate gross revenue of $340,000. If it is an Auckland property, with an average rent of $520 a week, the gross revenue over the 15-year period, the lifetime of that heat pump, would be $400,000. To suggest that requiring a landlord to invest $3,500 in a heat pump is going to force them to put up the rent and throw the tenants out on the street, which is the argument that the Minister has repeatedly used, is a complete nonsense. It will not happen. It is simply a cover for this Minister\u2019s refusal to do the right thing. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000394\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cbc37df2-57ae-4536-94ed-a2e39eecd585\u0022\u003EBy taking this position, the Minister is standing up for slum landlords. As an earlier speaker said, there are good mum and dad landlords and professional landlords all over the country who understand the importance of making sure that their rental property is not a threat to the life and health of their tenants.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022471dee54-f59e-4497-b3d3-c39044ce7169\u0022 data-id=\u0022c76b74a6ff934430a77b345f7164a6a1\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000395\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022471dee54-f59e-4497-b3d3-c39044ce7169\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022c76b74a6ff934430a77b345f7164a6a1\u0022\u003EHon DAMIEN O\u2019CONNOR (Labour\u2014West Coast - Tasman):\u003C/span\u003E Mostly, I am proud to be in this House, but sometimes I am absolutely ashamed. People out there must think this is a place of such hypocrisy when they listen to this debate. We have spent tens if not hundreds of hours in recent times debating health and safety legislation in this House to protect the lives of New Zealanders, because we had a terrible tragedy in my area where 29 people lost their lives.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000396\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022471dee54-f59e-4497-b3d3-c39044ce7169\u0022\u003EOn this particular issue the Children\u2019s Commissioner came to the Social Services Committee and said there are \u201C42,000 [hospital] admissions\u201D and \u201Cfifteen children a year die\u201D because they are in cold, damp homes. This is an outrage. Where in the health and safety legislation did we say: \u201COh, it is OK to have a few New Zealanders die?\u201D. Did we say that? No, we did not. Yet in this legislation the Government is saying it is OK to let 15 children a year die\u2014quoting the Children\u2019s Commissioner. The Government made a promise to New Zealand children: \u201CWe will make your house healthy.\u201D Three years on from that Budget promise this bill will do little for children living in cold, damp, mouldy housing. It is a wasted opportunity and a broken promise to our children. I do not want to be part of a hypocritical Parliament that on one hand stands up for the rights of working New Zealanders, which is good, but here today does not stand up for the rights of the 15 children who will die every year because this Government is not prepared to legislate for proper healthy, safe, and dry homes. That is what we are talking about here.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000397\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022471dee54-f59e-4497-b3d3-c39044ce7169\u0022\u003EWe have a Government that is running a review of Child, Youth and Family because there are faults in the care of children who need care. We have got people marching in the streets for the tragedy of poor Moko Rangitoheriri, who lost his life because of terrible, terrible domestic violence that is rife throughout our country. And so it should be that people speak out, but when we get to Parliament, where the Government has the right\u2014the obligation, I would say\u2014to put in place legislation that does the very best possible for young children in this country, it is failing.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000398\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022893adc11-ce4e-419c-a079-08f04b3d75f5\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00228525815761764d209f13b953faf18712\u0022\u003EThe CHAIRPERSON (Lindsay Tisch)\u003C/span\u003E: Order! Back on the bill.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000399\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022471dee54-f59e-4497-b3d3-c39044ce7169\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00222f962e2f3e37461ab1f667b833ea6482\u0022\u003EHon DAMIEN O\u2019CONNOR\u003C/span\u003E: It has failed, and it is on this legislation.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000400\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022471dee54-f59e-4497-b3d3-c39044ce7169\u0022\u003EJust as the Royal Commission on the Pike River Coal Mine Tragedy said we had to change legislation to protect New Zealanders in mines and other places, the Children\u2019s Commissioner comes into the Parliament and says there are 42,000 hospital admissions per year and 15 children dying per year from houses that are not adequately insulated or heated. And this Government says: \u201COh no, we have got to have an exception. We have got to have an exception for old properties and old insulation methods.\u201D We did not say that in the health and safety legislation. We did not say that some could abide by a lesser standard and that is OK and we will allow those poor New Zealanders working in those conditions to take a greater risk, but we are saying that here in this piece of legislation.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000401\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022471dee54-f59e-4497-b3d3-c39044ce7169\u0022\u003EThe National Government has bowed over, once again, to landlords who are putting children every single day at risk in this country. It is not unusual, I have to say. I have battled to try to get lower speed limits outside schools. Somehow, whether it is because they do not vote or whatever, children do not get the same level of care and protection that they should.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000402\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022471dee54-f59e-4497-b3d3-c39044ce7169\u0022\u003EThis is an opportunity for the Government to show that it really does care and it does not just bring to the House hypocritical pieces of legislation\u2014because that is what it is: moving one step forward, but leaving a big gap that most likely the most vulnerable children in our country, the ones who can pay the lowest rent in the oldest houses, will fall into. But, no, we are not going to give them a guarantee of warmth, of a dry home, or of a safe home\u2014never mind the fact that the Government does not even want to give them a home.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000403\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022471dee54-f59e-4497-b3d3-c39044ce7169\u0022\u003EThis is a disgraceful piece of legislation, and the Government is not protecting the children in this country, which it should be doing each and every day.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022d14b1afe-2069-41e4-96fa-c8dc81a991a4\u0022 data-id=\u0022b45c6b28f1914ec98af13ecf78e4daa9\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000404\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022d14b1afe-2069-41e4-96fa-c8dc81a991a4\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022b45c6b28f1914ec98af13ecf78e4daa9\u0022\u003EJENNY SALESA (Labour\u2014Manukau East):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you for this call on the Residential Tenancies Amendment Bill. Putting in place a legal framework to ensure that residential tenants are renting safe and healthy homes is crucial. This bill proposes to introduce some useful provisions towards providing standards for housing in private rentals, but it does not go far enough in addressing the dreadful circumstances that many families are living in, especially as we go into winter. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000405\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022d14b1afe-2069-41e4-96fa-c8dc81a991a4\u0022\u003EI would like to tautoko my colleague the Hon Damien O\u2019Connor. We have a responsibility as parliamentarians\u2014121 of us chosen by our constituents to come into this Committee\u2014to do our best to save children\u2019s lives. When we sit on this side we hear members of Parliament, particularly from the other side, talking about the cost and how it is too expensive to heat and to insulate houses, but when you actually put to the other side that we are talking about children\u2019s lives\u2014children\u2019s lives\u2014we should actually feel a little bit ashamed, or maybe a lot ashamed, that we are not doing what we as responsible MPs should be doing. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000406\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022d14b1afe-2069-41e4-96fa-c8dc81a991a4\u0022\u003EMinimum insulation standards for private rental houses are a step in the right direction\u2014they are. However, this National Government should do more. This bill proposes a minimum insulation standard. When you insulate a cold house, that house still remains cold. When you insulate a cold house but you do not put in efficient, modern heating, do you think that house will magically become warm, dry, and healthy? No, it will not. I agree with Dr Russell Wills; this bill should do much better for our children. This is a shameful bill. This is an opportunity to do right by our children, but we are not doing that. Rental houses need to be warm, dry, and healthy. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000407\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022d14b1afe-2069-41e4-96fa-c8dc81a991a4\u0022\u003EMy question, as we talk about insulating houses, is whether we are also going to ensure minimum insulation for garages. Just this last week we saw so many garages where families are living. I do not think this current legislation actually covers minimum insulation for garages, but it is a reality that we have too many families living in garages, and as we go into winter we should also consider the fact there are families that have been forced out of houses\u2014forced out of houses\u2014to live in cars, as well as in garages. They also need to live in warm, dry conditions. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000408\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022d14b1afe-2069-41e4-96fa-c8dc81a991a4\u0022\u003EThe Productivity Commission stated in its report on housing affordability that \u201CGenerally, the quality of New Zealand\u2019s housing stock is considered to be poor.\u201D This issue of quality applies to private houses as well as to Housing New Zealand State houses. In the Auckland Regional Public Health Service submission to the Health Committee, it stated that \u201CNew Zealand currently has a high proportion of unhealthy rental homes, and the average temperature in almost a third of New Zealand homes is below World Health Organization (WHO) recommendations.\u201D The WHO recommends a minimum indoor temperature of 18\u00B0C for most people, and if you are a child, if you are elderly, or if you are disabled, it recommends 21 degrees for a house. But in this country the mean temperature in Auckland homes, which is what was in this submission, is around 16.5 degrees; 16.5 degrees is pretty cold. That is something this legislation should actually cover: insulation as well as minimum standards of heating. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000409\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022d14b1afe-2069-41e4-96fa-c8dc81a991a4\u0022\u003EClause 6 of this bill covers information that must be included in tenancy agreements. Clause 6(3) would require a landlord to describe the insulation that is installed at a property he or she is renting out. Omitting to provide this information would be an unlawful act. This bill came back from the Social Services Committee with an amended clause 6(3), where landlords would be allowed to state that, despite making all reasonable efforts, they have not been able to satisfy themselves of the extent of the insulation. So I worry that this is a fairly slippery set of requirements, whereby insulation that is too onerous\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00224d83c8a5-2f48-4991-9c45-b1a6060daedd\u0022 data-id=\u00224803a1284a0a4e9b84fad9628e966184\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000410\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00224d83c8a5-2f48-4991-9c45-b1a6060daedd\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00224803a1284a0a4e9b84fad9628e966184\u0022\u003EMAUREEN PUGH (National):\u003C/span\u003E It is my pleasure to stand and speak to this, the Residential Tenancies Amendment Bill, in its Committee stage today. I want to take this opportunity to note my thanks to the Hon Nick Smith for being the driving force behind this sensible and practical piece of legislation. I am sure that the rest of my colleagues on this side of the Chamber join me in congratulating the Minister on sponsoring such a great and practical bill.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000411\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00224d83c8a5-2f48-4991-9c45-b1a6060daedd\u0022\u003EI live down the road from a small place called \u014Ctira. Back in the day \u014Ctira grew into a tent city as workmen inhabited it to work on the \u014Ctira Tunnel. In that tent city the women and children grew and worked and survived in canvas houses, and some of them who were lucky enough had wooden floors. So we have come a long way since those days, and the standards have improved over time and continue to improve. This legislation will provide yet another way for us to improve the living standards of those people who depend on rental properties\u2014I am talking about 450,000 New Zealanders who live in those rental accommodations. This legislation is going to ensure that they are warmer, drier, and safer.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000412\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00224d83c8a5-2f48-4991-9c45-b1a6060daedd\u0022\u003ECurrently the Residential Tenancies Act requires landlords to keep their properties in a reasonable state of cleanliness and repair, and they must comply with a variety of standards. These include meeting the standards in terms of ventilation, cooking facilities, heating, and so forth. Today I would like to talk about smoke alarms. That has been a great topic of conversation today. It is one of the key objectives of this Residential Tenancies Amendment Bill, and it is designed to reduce fire-related fatalities and injuries in residential rental properties. As the Minister has noted already today, the highest incidence of those fatalities and injuries is in rental properties. Smoke alarms will be a requirement as of 1 July this year.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000413\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00224d83c8a5-2f48-4991-9c45-b1a6060daedd\u0022\u003EInsulation will be installed progressively over the next 3 years, and landlords will be required to disclose the extent of insulation in tenancy agreements. This offers openness and transparency to tenants as they enter into tenancy agreements. However, social housing landlords, who receive income-related rent subsidies, must install floor and ceiling insulation from the commencement date of this bill, which is 1 July. These measures, as we have heard from the Hon Nick Smith today, will save 129 lives a year. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000414\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00224d83c8a5-2f48-4991-9c45-b1a6060daedd\u0022\u003EI would like to go on to talk about some of the main changes that were made at the select committee stage. The Residential Tenancies Act will now have a higher maximum payment for two unlawful acts, in order to help address the natural power imbalance between tenants and landlords. The maximum amount payable by a landlord to a tenant in the form of damages for failing to comply with regulations about smoke alarms or insulation has been increased from $3,000 to $4,000. This is an encouragement to landlords to ensure that they comply with this potentially lifesaving requirement.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000415\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00224d83c8a5-2f48-4991-9c45-b1a6060daedd\u0022\u003EThe other issue that came up at the select committee relates to retaliatory notices. We heard that some tenants are reluctant to bring complaints against their landlords for fear of eviction. We also heard that some tenants found the 14-day time requirement to appeal too short and were submitting too late. This time requirement has been extended from 14 to 28 days. The maximum penalty for a landlord who does give a retaliatory notice is going up to $4,000.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000416\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00224d83c8a5-2f48-4991-9c45-b1a6060daedd\u0022\u003EA third change that was made in the select committee process was to forbid and prohibit cash payments in return for work that was required on rental properties. A fourth change was giving landlords a specific right of entry for installation of smoke alarms and insulation, which brings it in line with repairs and maintenance. Thank you.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002290ea1538-43e8-4257-bd80-df3ccd1e5f27\u0022 data-id=\u00228bbbce02b9e54eefaa4636941d34c677\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000417\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002290ea1538-43e8-4257-bd80-df3ccd1e5f27\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00228bbbce02b9e54eefaa4636941d34c677\u0022\u003EKRIS FAAFOI (Labour\u2014Mana):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you very much. You did have a choice, so thank you very much, Mr Chair. I do want to take the opportunity to respond to a number of the submissions made across the Chamber to clause 38, around insulation. The last speaker to make a contribution, Maureen Pugh, said that the Residential Tenancies Amendment Bill was \u201Cpractical\u201D. Unfortunately for that speaker, that is not what the Children\u2019s Commissioner thinks. He said in his submission to the Social Services Committee, rather bluntly, that, in his view, \u201Cthis Bill will not achieve improvements in the quality of rental housing and will not reduce the numbers of children becoming ill from living in cold and damp housing.\u201D \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000418\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002290ea1538-43e8-4257-bd80-df3ccd1e5f27\u0022\u003EI think the Children\u2019s Commissioner might know a thing or two about keeping children safe and healthy. Although this Government may think that the bill is practical, the Children\u2019s Commissioner disagrees with the Government, saying that it will not make any difference to reduce the numbers of children becoming ill from living in cold and damp housing\u2014something that I think the people of New Zealand should take into consideration when they think about being practical and keeping children safe and healthy in cold and damp houses. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000419\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002290ea1538-43e8-4257-bd80-df3ccd1e5f27\u0022\u003EAlso, in relation to clause 38, another one of the Government\u2019s speakers said that, based on evidence, having a heater in an insulated home will make no difference at all\u2014again, something that the Children\u2019s Commissioner, at the select committee, disagreed with. He said: \u201C\u2026 I would have expected to see the following elements included in the Bill: 1. A heating standard for all properties, not just those in which insulation cannot be practically installed. The health benefits of insulation come from the combination of insulation and efficient space heating producing a warm, dry living environment. It is well known that children, especially very young children, suffer significant adverse health impacts from living in unheated environments;\u201D. I think, again, that the Children\u2019s Commissioner might know a thing or two about the effect that heating may have on the health of children. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000420\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002290ea1538-43e8-4257-bd80-df3ccd1e5f27\u0022\u003EAlso, if we are going to look at evidence, research by the University of Otago showed that insulating to the 2008 standard would reduce child hospital admissions by 6 percent, around 3,000 children each year. In rental properties this reduction would be about 19 percent. So, in terms of evidence and practicality, it seems the evidence is on the side of the Children\u2019s Commissioner, and the practicality is only on the side of the Government, which is doing nothing in this piece of legislation to improve the lives of children living in damp and cold homes. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000421\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002290ea1538-43e8-4257-bd80-df3ccd1e5f27\u0022\u003EIf Government members are going to stand up in this Parliament and say that, based on evidence, a heater will not make any difference to the lives of children and families living in insulated homes, I have got a challenge for them: take the heaters out of your houses and see how winter goes for you. See how winter goes for you, because that is the reality for many of the people, families, and children whose lives we are trying to make better here. So if we are going to look at being evidence based, go and live in your insulated\u2014I am assuming\u2014houses without a heater for winter, and see how winter goes for you.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022dfa851f0-ef7b-4834-bc41-1b3b645a3495\u0022 data-id=\u0022551b9c7b1aa44be38bb5d2fb5a79d91e\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000422\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dfa851f0-ef7b-4834-bc41-1b3b645a3495\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022551b9c7b1aa44be38bb5d2fb5a79d91e\u0022\u003EDAVID SHEARER (Labour\u2014Mt Albert):\u003C/span\u003E I want to pick up exactly where my colleague Kris Faafoi left off, because he is absolutely right. Just think about what it would be like to live in a home that may be insulated but without a heater. It does not make it any warmer, and that is exactly the point that we are trying to make in the Labour Party and the Greens\u2014frankly, everybody except the National Government\u2014in trying to promote and get through a bill that will actually make a real difference.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000423\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dfa851f0-ef7b-4834-bc41-1b3b645a3495\u0022\u003EIf you look at the statistics and you look at what this bill could potentially do for children\u2014but does not\u2014it could reduce the number of kids being admitted into hospital by about 6 percent, and by Otago University\u2019s figures that would be 3,000 children a year. That is a very conservative estimate; there are others who believe that it could, in fact, be much more. Just think: 3,000 kids who will not need to go to hospital with rheumatic fever, with respiratory conditions, with colds\u2014with problems that will get so serious that they need to be admitted. Think of the savings to the taxpayer on our health bill if 3,000 children no longer need to go to hospital. There is an overwhelming benefit to New Zealand in this bill being done properly. It is an overwhelming benefit because it costs the Government effectively nothing. I cannot think of a policy change that we could look at right now, that we could implement, that would have such dramatic impacts on the very people that we want to help most, who are the people who are living in poverty and living in rental accommodation. Another statistic\u2014if you can keep this in your head\u201470 percent of kids who are in poverty are in rental accommodation. So we are addressing the issues affecting most those children who are living in poverty and in the worst conditions. Think of another policy that would be able to target them and have that dramatic effect as quickly.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000424\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dfa851f0-ef7b-4834-bc41-1b3b645a3495\u0022\u003EMy surprise is that I think this was brought up in 2013, and here we are debating it in 2016. I am thinking: 3 years? That was 9,000 hospital admissions ago. We have 16 children dying every year from poverty and housing-related issues. Just imagine\u2014some of those kids might well have been here as a result of this. Three years at 3,000 hospital admissions. Think of the cost in dollar terms. Think of the cost in social terms. Think of the cost to those families of having to take their kids to hospitals because of not meeting the basic requirement of having a warm dry house. Many of my colleagues have already spoken about this and the fact that New Zealand is well behind in terms of the housing quality that we have here in New Zealand. This is an Act that has needed to be addressed for some time. I do not know why it has not been addressed more urgently.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000425\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dfa851f0-ef7b-4834-bc41-1b3b645a3495\u0022\u003EHere are the three things that we in particular want to be able to see. We want to be able to see that when these houses are brought up to spec\u2014when they are insulated and they are warm and dry\u2014they are monitored by the local council, and there is an enforcement policy. I know\u2014certainly from people who are coming into my electorate and talking to me about their housing issues\u2014that many of them are too scared to complain to their landlords because they think their landlords will kick them out. In Auckland, where there is a real housing crisis\u2014how anybody could not call it a crisis I do not know; it is a severe crisis\u2014they are scared about complaining to their landlords. So we need an independent arbiter making sure that those houses are monitored and enforced. We need to heat cold houses, for God\u2019s sake. It is all very well putting insulation and everything else in it, but we need to have a heating source so that those kids stay warm. And we need to make sure that the insulation is up to date\u2014that we have 2008 insulation standards, and not insulation standards that are 20 or 30 years old. When I mentioned, at the beginning of my contribution this evening, being able to save\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00229884e8e8-651f-4f48-a429-70b72d5e2821\u0022 data-id=\u002286014db292ea45748fe84a232d3f61f3\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000426\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00229884e8e8-651f-4f48-a429-70b72d5e2821\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002286014db292ea45748fe84a232d3f61f3\u0022\u003ESARAH DOWIE (National\u2014Invercargill):\u003C/span\u003E I move, That the question be now put.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000427\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00229884e8e8-651f-4f48-a429-70b72d5e2821\u0022\u003EMotion agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000428\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00229884e8e8-651f-4f48-a429-70b72d5e2821\u0022\u003EThe question was put that the amendments set out on Supplementary Order Paper 177 in the name of the Hon Dr Nick Smith to Part 1 be agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000429\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00229884e8e8-651f-4f48-a429-70b72d5e2821\u0022\u003EAmendments agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000430\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00229884e8e8-651f-4f48-a429-70b72d5e2821\u0022\u003EThe question was put that the amendments set out on Supplementary Order Paper 172 in the name of Metiria Turei to Part 1 be agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca id=\u0022dbd02dd17c03427ba95884a9dccef33e\u0022 name=\u0022division\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EA party vote was called for on the question, That the amendments be agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EAyes 60\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand Labour 32; Green Party 14; New Zealand First 12; M\u0101ori Party 2.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENoes 61\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand National 59; ACT New Zealand 1; United Future 1.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EAmendments not agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000431\u0022\u003EPart 1 as amended agreed to.\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000432\u0022\u003EPart 2 agreed to.\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000433\u0022\u003ESchedule agreed to.\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000434\u0022\u003EClause 1 agreed to.\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000435\u0022\u003EClause 2 agreed to.\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000436\u0022\u003EClause 3 agreed to.\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000437\u0022\u003EBill to be reported with amendment presently.\u003C/p\u003E\n    \u003C/div\u003E\n    \u003Cdiv class=\u0022HpsHansard\u0022\u003E\n      \u003Cp\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsProceedingHeading\u0022\u003EBills\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000438\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u00225942c2931b424701a21e686acd37d062\u0022\u003ETaxation (Transformation: First Phase Simplification and Other Measures) Bill\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000439\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u0022530e30db11854009a03e67c89e9c5714\u0022\u003EIn Committee\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000440\u0022\u003EDebate resumed from 10 May.\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022893adc11-ce4e-419c-a079-08f04b3d75f5\u0022 data-id=\u00223a5be54e4ee345bdb18b5e8c8a5097aa\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000441\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022893adc11-ce4e-419c-a079-08f04b3d75f5\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00223a5be54e4ee345bdb18b5e8c8a5097aa\u0022\u003EThe CHAIRPERSON (Lindsay Tisch)\u003C/span\u003E: Members, we now turn to further consideration of the Taxation (Transformation: First Phase Simplification and Other Measures) Bill. When we were debating this bill, we were debating the question that Part 1 stand part. Before I call the speaker, who will be Stuart Nash if he wishes to finish his 2 minutes 40 seconds, I have a statement in terms of a ruling that I made when we were last debating this bill. You may recall that we had a Supplementary Order Paper in the name of Julie Anne Genter and I ruled it out of order, being out of scope, out of scope of what the bill is. There was some discussion\u2014quite lengthy discussion, in fact\u2014and I said that I would come back and report to the Committee as to the rationale behind my decision.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000442\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022893adc11-ce4e-419c-a079-08f04b3d75f5\u0022\u003ETo clarify the ruling that I made: the Clerk\u2019s Office will draft amendments for members and circulate them even if they are not in order. It will advise the member that amendments in its view are not in order. The fact that it publishes and circulates a Supplementary Order Paper does not indicate that it is in order. Ultimately, it is up to the Chairperson in the Committee of the whole House to rule on the admissibility of any amendment. To be in order, an amendment must be within the scope of the bill as introduced\u2014and this is Speaker\u2019s ruling 131/4.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000443\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022893adc11-ce4e-419c-a079-08f04b3d75f5\u0022\u003EThe Chair rules on scope by considering the amendment in light of the bill as introduced and the report-back from the select committee. An amendment that is outside the scope of the bill does not widen the scope of the debate on the bill\u2014and that is Speaker\u2019s ruling 132/1\u2014nor does the debate determine the scope of the bill or the admissibility of amendments.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000444\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022893adc11-ce4e-419c-a079-08f04b3d75f5\u0022\u003EFor a Supplementary Order Paper that is outside the scope of the bill to be considered by the Committee of the whole House, it can be done only by way of an instruction\u2014and that is Standing Order 176\u2014to the Committee by the House at the second reading.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000445\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u0022581908061eac490282e14cc0b0a3d3d7\u0022\u003EPart 1  Amendments to Income Tax Act 2007 (continued)\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022bbded2ec-ac25-4a73-a380-3f4d87693084\u0022 data-id=\u00226efb552673e84d6bb8fe2cd6d1e23021\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000446\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bbded2ec-ac25-4a73-a380-3f4d87693084\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00226efb552673e84d6bb8fe2cd6d1e23021\u0022\u003ESTUART NASH (Labour\u2014Napier):\u003C/span\u003E I must admit that it is difficult to stand in the middle of a Committee stage that I think we were talking about 2 weeks ago and hit it, because I was really hitting my straps, I remember, when we pulled up stumps. If you give me about 2 minutes, I will talk about what this bill is about, once again. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000447\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bbded2ec-ac25-4a73-a380-3f4d87693084\u0022\u003EThis is the Taxation (Transformation: First Phase Simplification and Other Measures) Bill. The title is probably longer than a lot of matter in the bill. Basically, it looks at bringing the tax system into the 21st century. This is about simplifying the communication process, electronic signatures, and sending and accepting emails instead of written notices. In the tax Acts before this, if you wanted to officially communicate with the commissioner or vice versa, it needed to be in writing. It was required to be in writing. Now we are talking about emails. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000448\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bbded2ec-ac25-4a73-a380-3f4d87693084\u0022\u003EAs in all tax bills that have come through this House recently, we do think this is a missed opportunity because there are some huge, huge issues in our tax system at the moment that we know about: avoidance, aggressive tax planning to the tune of between $1 billion to $7 billion worth of lost revenue to our economy. And here we are talking about whether we should be saying \u201Cnotify\u201D or using other small terms. What I was talking about when I was interrupted by the bell is something that I think is quite important. This is clause 59 and this amends section RM 5. It is an amendment of the overpayment on income statements [Interruption]\u2014it is, Mr O\u2019Connor; this may affect you\u2014in the Income Tax Act 2007. What it did say\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000449\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002209a6f83636c0444984b7288ed5809806\u0022\u003EGrant Robertson\u003C/span\u003E: Very interesting.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000450\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bbded2ec-ac25-4a73-a380-3f4d87693084\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002226186856676249d184cc9eae3230cdb7\u0022\u003ESTUART NASH\u003C/span\u003E: You are dead right, Mr Robertson. It is very interesting. It is a huge piece of legislation but also a very important piece of legislation. What it used to say was: \u201CThis section applies when an income statement has been provided to a person and the result is that an amount of tax must be refunded to the person. For the purposes of this section, the amount of tax must be more than $200.\u201D As we know, $200 these days hardly pays for a good night out on Ponsonby Road. What they have actually done is they have brought it into the 21st century. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000451\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bbded2ec-ac25-4a73-a380-3f4d87693084\u0022\u003ELet me provide a little bit of background. When a wage or salary earner\u2014not a company, but a wage or salary earner\u2014needs an end of year assessment they are issued with, or they can request, what is called a personal tax summary. If the result of this personal tax summary is a refund and they can confirm the personal tax summary, that refund will be issued automatically. [Bell rung] Mr Chair?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000452\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022893adc11-ce4e-419c-a079-08f04b3d75f5\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00227957aa19c0244788a6ab062e9e739280\u0022\u003EThe CHAIRPERSON (Lindsay Tisch)\u003C/span\u003E: Stuart Nash.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000453\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bbded2ec-ac25-4a73-a380-3f4d87693084\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00223ed4fa5fbbe542479dba4b5e668b7a64\u0022\u003ESTUART NASH\u003C/span\u003E: Ha, ha! Thank you for that vote of confidence!\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000454\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022893adc11-ce4e-419c-a079-08f04b3d75f5\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002245f1d2ec41c04adeaf8c1ddb7af97356\u0022\u003EThe CHAIRPERSON (Lindsay Tisch)\u003C/span\u003E: Your big moment!\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000455\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bbded2ec-ac25-4a73-a380-3f4d87693084\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022ae1cd204af8c4535a93dba4c3355b208\u0022\u003ESTUART NASH\u003C/span\u003E: In the past, or before this bill\u2014well, at this point in time, if the refund is less than $200 and they do not confirm their personal tax summary, then that money will be automatically released to the taxpayer\u2014i.e., it will be put into their bank account or they will be sent a cheque after 30 days. What this bill does, and I think this is most important\u2014it is sort of tucked away but it will affect a lot of people\u2014is it proposes to reduce the time delay and increase the threshold, so credits that would be released in 15 days after a personal tax summary would be issued if the refund is less than $600. So instead of waiting for 30 days and not having to do anything if the refund is under $200, it will now be done in 15 days\u201415 working days, so it is 3 weeks; still a bit of time\u2014but it is $600. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000456\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bbded2ec-ac25-4a73-a380-3f4d87693084\u0022\u003EThe reason I think this is important is that the Inland Revenue Department (IRD) actually owes New Zealanders $750 million. Not many people know that\u2014that the IRD owes New Zealanders $750 million. A good chunk of this money is owed to people who have paid secondary tax or other withholding taxes and do not actually realise that the IRD does owe them this money. There are not many engaged\u2014well, there are a number, and I must admit that awareness of the personal tax summary, or the fact that there actually exists a personal tax summary, is increasing. There is no doubt about that, and what I will say to anyone who pays secondary tax is that I would absolutely encourage them to go to the IRD and request a personal tax summary. Even if it means that they do not do anything about it, they will come up on the radar of the IRD, and I would almost guarantee that if someone pays secondary tax they will be owed money by the IRD. If they do not do anything else except apply for a personal tax summary and they are owed $600 or less, then the IRD will automatically either (a) send them a cheque or (b) put the money in the bank account if the IRD holds that bank account. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000457\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bbded2ec-ac25-4a73-a380-3f4d87693084\u0022\u003EThe reason I say this is important is that what it does, I think, is it enables more people to become engaged and to get the money back that they require. I must say that the interesting thing about this $750 million is if a taxpayer owes the IRD money, the IRD will go after them to the ends of the earth. If the IRD owes the taxpayer money, then this falls off the cliff after 4 years. So if the IRD owes you money and it is 5 years since that obligation was incurred, then the IRD does not have to pay that money back. In fact, it does not pay that money back. I think this is wrong. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000458\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bbded2ec-ac25-4a73-a380-3f4d87693084\u0022\u003EWe have talked to the IRD about this and asked it what it is going to do in respect of actually going as hard to give taxpayers their money back as it does chasing the money owed. It believes that this new business transformation system should make it a lot more streamlined, and people should not be owed money, or if they are owed money they probably will not even have to request a personal tax summary. In fact, for me, the ultimate is to not even have to pay secondary tax. Secondary tax at the moment is a withholding tax that people must pay, because what happened in the past was if they were working two or more jobs, they were underpaying their tax and at the end of the tax year they were hit with a massive bill by the IRD\u2014something they just could not pay. It was a withholding tax. So secondary tax meant that they did not end up with a bill, but what a lot of them actually have ended up with is a credit, but most of them do not know. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000459\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bbded2ec-ac25-4a73-a380-3f4d87693084\u0022\u003EI have an incident of someone who was working for a relative of mine. These relatives were saying to this person: \u201CGive the IRD a call. Go on.\u201D She was very reluctant to. In the end she did and she found out that she was actually owed $800. That is not an unusual story. So to everyone watching\u2014and I know a lot are\u2014who pays secondary tax, just go to the IRD. In fact, you can go to the IRD\u2014public service announcement here\u2014website. As long as you have got your IRD number, put it in and it takes about 5 minutes\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000460\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022eaf79431-1033-44f1-a633-22633da52c0d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002218753219125d440aadecf8e83ba979e6\u0022\u003EDavid Bennett\u003C/span\u003E: How long?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000461\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bbded2ec-ac25-4a73-a380-3f4d87693084\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a4a2d80a5ba7499483b08a058e3af790\u0022\u003ESTUART NASH\u003C/span\u003E: \u2014about 5 minutes\u2014after you have put in your IRD number to find out whether you have got a credit or not. Until the IRD becomes a lot more proactive in giving this money back, we have got to do it ourselves. I would encourage you all to do it. Or, as mentioned, what I would do is I would go to the IRD and I would ask for a personal tax summary. The taxpayer will then come up on the radar and if they are owed less than $600\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000462\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022eaf79431-1033-44f1-a633-22633da52c0d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002230d57e15c143448682ebde25fbe02ace\u0022\u003EDavid Bennett\u003C/span\u003E: Is this the best he can do?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000463\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bbded2ec-ac25-4a73-a380-3f4d87693084\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022ccd8d4ddca8e48ae99531caa37a72d92\u0022\u003ESTUART NASH\u003C/span\u003E: \u2014they will get it back automatically. It is very important. Mr Bennett here, on this side of the Chamber, is going \u201COh, $600 isn\u2019t important to good hard-working Kiwis.\u201D I believe it is, and most people do.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022893adc11-ce4e-419c-a079-08f04b3d75f5\u0022 data-id=\u00220023942c1f3e4f5abe282d21b0a77649\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000464\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022893adc11-ce4e-419c-a079-08f04b3d75f5\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00220023942c1f3e4f5abe282d21b0a77649\u0022\u003EThe CHAIRPERSON (Lindsay Tisch)\u003C/span\u003E: I call Jo Hayes\u2014stand up if you want to take a call.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000465\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022758dcaf3-9976-43ac-8593-79f66ee4da22\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002224a2badf1bf04fc3a44a86291f8b7932\u0022\u003EJoanne Hayes\u003C/span\u003E: I do.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000466\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022893adc11-ce4e-419c-a079-08f04b3d75f5\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022df7d0df079b24fb0ad03b53d057fecc3\u0022\u003EThe CHAIRPERSON (Lindsay Tisch)\u003C/span\u003E: You must stand up. If a member wants to take a call, they must stand up and call out. I cannot second-guess whether someone wants to take a call.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022758dcaf3-9976-43ac-8593-79f66ee4da22\u0022 data-id=\u00229eeea7117e0341b489b2df80a6ef44db\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000467\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022758dcaf3-9976-43ac-8593-79f66ee4da22\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00229eeea7117e0341b489b2df80a6ef44db\u0022\u003EJOANNE HAYES (Third Whip\u2014National):\u003C/span\u003E I move, That the question be now put.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca id=\u002233aecf50da9c49c987b6d2aa5bccf11c\u0022 name=\u0022division\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EA party vote was called for on the question, That the question be now put.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EAyes 63\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand National 59; M\u0101ori Party 2; ACT New Zealand 1; United Future 1.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENoes 58\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand Labour 32; Green Party 14; New Zealand First 12.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EMotion agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000468\u0022\u003EThe question was put that the amendments set out on Supplementary Order Paper 171 in the name of the Hon Michael Woodhouse to Part 1 be agreed to.\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000469\u0022\u003EAmendments agreed to.\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022893adc11-ce4e-419c-a079-08f04b3d75f5\u0022 data-id=\u00223ba788229b554b51bff6cf45c9a8b36d\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000470\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022893adc11-ce4e-419c-a079-08f04b3d75f5\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00223ba788229b554b51bff6cf45c9a8b36d\u0022\u003EThe CHAIRPERSON (Lindsay Tisch)\u003C/span\u003E: We now move to Julie Anne Genter\u2019s amendment inserting new clause 45A, as set out on Supplementary Order Paper 173. This amendment is out of order as it is outside the scope of the bill, and I ruled on that earlier.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000471\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022893adc11-ce4e-419c-a079-08f04b3d75f5\u0022\u003EPart 1 as amended agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000472\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u00227ad2317507ed4d9a8defd56c0ff22462\u0022\u003EPart 2  Amendments to Tax Administration Act 1994\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022 data-id=\u0022b8a57029b2fd46a1951594229c418614\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000473\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022b8a57029b2fd46a1951594229c418614\u0022\u003EGRANT ROBERTSON (Labour\u2014Wellington Central):\u003C/span\u003E It is a pleasure to take a call on Part 2 of this bill. I want to focus my initial contribution on the section of the bill that deals with the communications framework, and in particular clause 74. It may come as a surprise to those who follow tax legislation intimately and closely that this particular clause tended to be more like an English grammar class. Chris Bishop came into his own during this period as somebody who was educated in the 2000s, when grammar was taught. I struggled because I went to school in the 1980s, when they had stopped teaching grammar at all, and so some of this was confusing to me, but\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000474\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002257e41e9d-285b-4fb3-847d-a63820ae7137\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022bb4d0bad45be433dbd67ae490850bb09\u0022\u003EChris Bishop\u003C/span\u003E: It was a terrible Labour Government then.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000475\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00220c2d81cb11184a1ba2dc40bcbe11ca98\u0022\u003EGRANT ROBERTSON\u003C/span\u003E: That is right. Well, that particular Labour Government\u2014yes, Mr Bishop. But this was quite an interesting, and actually quite important, part of the bill. Essentially, what this was about doing was trying to simplify and make clear different forms of the ways in which the Inland Revenue Department (IRD) interacts with taxpayers and trying to bring that into the modern age at the same time as defining various terms. Essentially, what the bill did was to set up three tiers of interactions between the IRD and taxpayers, and it then sought to define those. The Finance and Expenditure Committee did actually come to the conclusion that we needed to amend aspects of this to make absolutely clear to taxpayers the meaning of these different terms. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000476\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003ESo the three tiers that were proposed were a tier that included the terms \u201Casking, requesting, or informing\u201D, and any one of the following was a means by which you can do that: \u201Cby telephone\u201D, \u201Corally in person\u201D, \u201Cby electronic means\u201D, \u201Cin print\u201D, or \u201Cin another manner permitted by the Commissioner.\u201D\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000477\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002290ea1538-43e8-4257-bd80-df3ccd1e5f27\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022562035de22af43be80d51acf7c349487\u0022\u003EKris Faafoi\u003C/span\u003E: What does that mean?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000478\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022c8ba35fdece74d0586f1e81905cfc53c\u0022\u003EGRANT ROBERTSON\u003C/span\u003E: Well, that is right. You may well ask, Mr Faafoi, what it means. So we could take the example, perhaps, of whether or not John Key asked, requested, or informed Bill English that he was going to put tax cuts back on the table 3 days after Mr English had taken them off. He certainly did not notify him\u2014which is something we will come to shortly\u2014nor formally notify him, so he possibly did ask or inform him by phone, orally in person, by electronic means, and perhaps he texted him.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000479\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f9c512a8-d532-4ef9-ad51-0fe8d752a893\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022dfcea4787d8847a192b8c39de5464942\u0022\u003EHon Clayton Cosgrove\u003C/span\u003E: Semaphore?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000480\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00223efc04be0145467a976490bb0566268d\u0022\u003EGRANT ROBERTSON\u003C/span\u003E: He may have done that. So the lowest level of form of communication is asking, requesting, or informing. Then we include\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000481\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022eaf79431-1033-44f1-a633-22633da52c0d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00221e8d96d72f784f68890524f07ead4c41\u0022\u003EDavid Bennett\u003C/span\u003E: Tell us about your tax increases.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000482\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022c2875f3dec164a6591b5bac32e646571\u0022\u003EGRANT ROBERTSON\u003C/span\u003E: Mr Bennett was all over the detail of this when we went through it, I can tell you.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000483\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003EThen we came to \u201Capplying or notifying\u201D, by which any one of the following is an acceptable means to apply or notify: \u201Cby electronic means,\u201D \u201Cin print\u201D, or \u201Cin another manner permitted by the Commissioner.\u201D So we have stepped up here, and you cannot do it by phone and you cannot just drop into the IRD and let it know. You actually have to do it by electronic means, in print, or in a manner that is acceptable to the commissioner. Then the highest tier of communications is that of \u201Cformally notifying\u201D, which is to be \u201Cin print, delivered personally or by registered post,\u201D but not by way of \u201Cemail, the internet, or other electronic means.\u201D\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000484\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003EI guess in many ways that starts to show us the limits of what we were trying to do here in the Committee. So it is a recognition that most people are not going to fax through their communications. Mr Cosgrove might still fax people, as he does from time to time, but, actually, most people have moved on from that and, frankly, most people have moved on from using the post to communicate with the IRD. So these clauses do have a serious element, which is that it is time to bring the IRD into the 21st century and have email as an acceptable form of communication.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000485\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003EWhat we learnt in the committee was that from a tax accountant\u2019s point of view, for those people who have regular interaction with the tax system, these terms need to have specific meaning within specific Acts. So the Tax Administration Act is one of those, but the Income Tax Act is one as well. And we had submitters come to the committee and tell us that unless those terms are notified this could provide some difficulty. They felt that the three tiers were not sufficiently defined within each of those Acts. So in a sort of belt and braces approach we now, by the amendment of the committee, have decided that we will define each of those terms in each place that it appears in taxation legislation. As I say, you might think that this is not an important thing, but if people fail to comply with what the IRD wants from them, there are serious penalties. If they do not know, for example, that notifying cannot take place by telephone, then they may find themselves in breach of various things. So it is actually an important thing to make clear to taxpayers that the way that they communicate with the Inland Revenue Department is confined\u2014[Bell rung] Mr Chair?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000486\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022893adc11-ce4e-419c-a079-08f04b3d75f5\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002214aa8508f1d545169961a7a20daff408\u0022\u003EThe CHAIRPERSON (Lindsay Tisch)\u003C/span\u003E: Grant Robertson.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000487\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00223d4b80c2e38c4a439e0f028ec6b7ecf4\u0022\u003EGRANT ROBERTSON\u003C/span\u003E: I tell you, there is more to come on this. So this, I think, is actually an important part of it. The\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000488\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002290ea1538-43e8-4257-bd80-df3ccd1e5f27\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00225211c9ed1f5c4ed8ae9ed64f58cf6dcd\u0022\u003EKris Faafoi\u003C/span\u003E: This is the soundtrack. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000489\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022228cd13cf9c3476286f9c8da282c1ecb\u0022\u003EGRANT ROBERTSON\u003C/span\u003E: That is right. This is only tier one notification, I can tell you. We have got more coming here.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000490\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003EInterestingly, the IRD itself was very keen to tell us that it was trying to put emails on the same footing as paper letters delivered by post, and I think, as I say, for most people that that is important. However, its highest level\u2014the formal notification\u2014is still done by post and not electronically. One day, perhaps, that will change.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000491\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003EThere was an element of futureproofing, so there is some ability for the commissioner to be able to say that as new technologies arise and as new forms of communication occur they can be adopted into the practices of the IRD without necessarily needing to change the legislation every single time that occurs.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000492\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003ESo that is an advance. There was a bit of confusion, I have to say, between the officials, our expert adviser, the submitters, and ourselves about the exact meaning of various terms. But under clause 74 and related clauses, I do believe that we have now found our way to a position where people will be able to understand what is required of them, and certainly it is now possible to use electronic means for at least the first two tiers of communication between the IRD and others.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000493\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f9c512a8-d532-4ef9-ad51-0fe8d752a893\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022276291d6690a45678084b2084999d3c5\u0022\u003EHon Clayton Cosgrove\u003C/span\u003E: Brilliant.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000494\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022564fea372f9f41e8b983c885a1d6bc0d\u0022\u003EGRANT ROBERTSON\u003C/span\u003E: Yes, and it is an advance. It is, to quote from the title of the bill, transformational, because that is the standard this Government has for transformation\u2014the meaning of the word \u201Cnotify\u201D. We will come back, in a later debate, to the title of this bill, and I think this is the point at which we must acknowledge the radical transformation of the definitions of the words \u201Cnotify\u201D, \u201Cinform\u201D, \u201Cask\u201D, and \u201Crequest\u201D. So well done, I say to the Government\u2014radical agenda there! That will turbocharge the economy for you, right there!\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000495\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003EThe other point I wanted to make was related to this, and that concerns the use of electronic signatures, which have previously not been allowed but are now allowed under this legislation. There was some concern about the veracity of them, and about how they could be stored and so on, but actually, again, this is the modern world. An electronic signature is your own signature. In a whole lot of walks of life people use electronic signatures where they have obligations under the law, and there is no reason why the Inland Revenue Department cannot also be in a position to deal with that also.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000496\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003EThe other matter\u2014which I may not get to finish in this call, but I will certainly happily take up another call\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000497\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f9c512a8-d532-4ef9-ad51-0fe8d752a893\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022e53a4d16c1a74694bf7249a4723a6f7c\u0022\u003EHon Clayton Cosgrove\u003C/span\u003E: Have another one.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000498\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022bbcce716ec594b88a96e5ae384da005f\u0022\u003EGRANT ROBERTSON\u003C/span\u003E: My colleague Clayton Cosgrove will want to talk about this because it was a matter that he was seized of when the committee considered it. It is the question of co-location of offices. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000499\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002257e41e9d-285b-4fb3-847d-a63820ae7137\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022e662f52e091b49c0a87f70f5f8279401\u0022\u003EChris Bishop\u003C/span\u003E: Oh, this is a cracker.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000500\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00229842bc8efeee4c56a07c01e97e85ff4a\u0022\u003EGRANT ROBERTSON\u003C/span\u003E: I know Mr Bishop enjoyed these discussions, as well. So the IRD\u2014as are now a number of Government departments\u2014is co-located with other Government agencies. In Christchurch, for instance, the Ministry of Social Development is looking at being in with the IRD, because they are the people who are going to be in the Christchurch central business district because Gerry Brownlee has forced all the Government agencies in there. So they are going to be working together, and there is an issue about the secrecy requirements on IRD staff versus the secrecy requirements on other Government agencies. We had a very long and in-depth discussion in the committee about how to manage this. And in the end what the committee came down on the side of was to say that IRD employees are not considered to have breached secrecy conditions \u201Cif they did not intend the breach and took the care reasonable for place and conditions to prevent it.\u201D That notion of reasonable care was what the committee inserted into the bill.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000501\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003EThere was considerable debate about this. Obviously, if you have knowingly contravened the Act and if you have deliberately gone out and broken secrecy rules, then there are punishments that should follow that. But where you are sitting in a co-located environment and you are having a conversation with one of your IRD colleagues about a taxpayer or a tax matter\u2014which you are able to do\u2014and you are both aware of your obligations, if there is a staff member of another Government agency within earshot, to what extent is it the responsibility of the IRD staff member to not have those kinds of conversations? You know, the nature of modern work spaces now with open-plan offices means that the risk of this increases, and, in fact, all of the co-located ministries and so on are starting to work in those environments.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000502\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003EOn the committee we were concerned because the secrecy of taxpayer information is something we should all take seriously, and it is actually, more often than not, a higher obligation than that of other Government agencies. So we were concerned to make sure that we had adequate protections in place around both the understanding that taxpayers would have of how their information would be treated\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022f9c512a8-d532-4ef9-ad51-0fe8d752a893\u0022 data-id=\u0022f61cec324d8d4873b1a4eed9ac9f7234\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000503\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f9c512a8-d532-4ef9-ad51-0fe8d752a893\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022f61cec324d8d4873b1a4eed9ac9f7234\u0022\u003EHon CLAYTON COSGROVE (Labour):\u003C/span\u003E I want to pick up where Mr Robertson left off in his eloquent address and analysis of this bill\u2014but in all seriousness, the point that he made should be made again, for the record of the Committee. The Finance and Expenditure Committee did take quite a bit of time to work through a scenario that, essentially, some of us felt at the time was providing less of an incentive, if you like, to comply with the law\u2014that is, the penalty was less than it ordinarily should have been.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000504\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f9c512a8-d532-4ef9-ad51-0fe8d752a893\u0022\u003EThose of us who were around in Parliament back a wee way can remember inheriting in 1999 an Inland Revenue Department (IRD) that had significant difficulties. John Perham, I think\u2014if I recall his name correctly\u2014was charged, as the Commissioner of Inland Revenue at the time, with trying to rectify many of those difficulties where there had been, in the 1990s, significant breaches of information. I do not think the IRD at that time had electronic fingerprinting, if you like\u2014or footprinting, as it was\u2014in terms of traceability of personnel who were accessing information. I know that the then member Rodney Hide, along with some of his cohort, was quite vigorous in illustrating some of the problems that had occurred, and, as I recall, some prosecutions came out of that.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000505\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f9c512a8-d532-4ef9-ad51-0fe8d752a893\u0022\u003EIt did test the select committee, and we tested officials, in terms of whether there were enough safeguards around these issues to protect taxpayer information. Regarding tax systems, as I have said in other debates, there are a number of principles: transparency, simplicity, and community confidence in them\u2014but also that information is incredibly secure. One of the things that, I think\u2014I am reflecting on Mr Robertson\u2019s analysis of the various terms in clause 74 and the huge, precise definitions around those terms. Some of us struggle with the fact that the IRD and its Minister have taken great care over those terms\u2014which is fair enough\u2014but, it seems, there was a lesser duty of care around those other arrangements in respect of co-location. However, we have given the analysis and the recommendations the benefit of the doubt.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000506\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f9c512a8-d532-4ef9-ad51-0fe8d752a893\u0022\u003EI think it is incumbent upon the IRD\u2014to put on the record of this Committee\u2014to take extra care. If you are going to be co-located and there is even the slightest chance of taxpayer information being inadvertently shared\u2014and I make the point that I believe that, since the IRD has cleaned its act up from the 1990s, the IRD staff are pretty well exemplary in their conduct. They take a great deal of care, in terms of the security of taxpayer information. However, if you do move into a co-location scenario, things can happen. I, like Mr Robertson\u2014and I am sure the Minister would share the view\u2014do not believe that these things are intentional, but there is a tenet of law that says that the greater the penalty, the more care people are likely to take, because the circumstances they may find themselves in if they are prosecuted are far more heavy-duty than they may ordinarily be. That is a basic principle. So I think that, as we go through this, we would be grateful for some assurances from the Minister around taxpayer security, given the co-location issues, and I think it would be important to get that on the record of the House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000507\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f9c512a8-d532-4ef9-ad51-0fe8d752a893\u0022\u003EI think the bill is\u2014I would not call it transformational, but certainly it updates many of the IRD systems. It is linked to the so-called Business Transformation programme, and I would be remiss if I did not ask the Minister, while we have got his attention, whether he could perhaps give us a quick brief on the expenditures in\u2014to be fair to him\u2014the mess that he inherited with the Business Transformation programme, which I think we are going from, what was it, $1.6 billion\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000508\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022e29fcfae9e4d4364bd3c51568c6cbfe9\u0022\u003EGrant Robertson\u003C/span\u003E: $1.9 billion.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000509\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f9c512a8-d532-4ef9-ad51-0fe8d752a893\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022b258de6bf3164d85bcd8f69726555f49\u0022\u003EHon CLAYTON COSGROVE\u003C/span\u003E: \u2014$1.9 billion, and then it went down again, and then it went up again. I am mindful of Novopay\u2014without getting into that\u2014and I am mindful of the difficulties the Police are having, as espoused today, with the PricewaterhouseCoopers issues and their payroll systems. We do have a track record in this Parliament, I have to say, on the National side, not on the Labour side, if you go right back to INCIS, of IT programmes just going right off the rails.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000510\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f9c512a8-d532-4ef9-ad51-0fe8d752a893\u0022\u003EI would be grateful if the Minister could give us a continued assurance that we are not going to have money spent like water, because there is a large amount of discretion provided to the department\u2014it is the expert, it hires the contractors, and it signs the contracts, not the Minister. With that discretion comes a huge amount of responsibility, and we would like to ensure that the dollars are accounted for.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000511\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f9c512a8-d532-4ef9-ad51-0fe8d752a893\u0022\u003EI do not know whether I can enlarge on the eloquence of Mr Robertson, especially in respect of clause 74, but at this point I, like others\u2014subject to those assurances from the Minister\u2014support the bill.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022bbded2ec-ac25-4a73-a380-3f4d87693084\u0022 data-id=\u002222e9572e093047479d0dd524d39a3caa\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000512\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bbded2ec-ac25-4a73-a380-3f4d87693084\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002222e9572e093047479d0dd524d39a3caa\u0022\u003ESTUART NASH (Labour\u2014Napier):\u003C/span\u003E I would also like to elaborate on a couple of things that Mr Robertson has spoken about. As mentioned, electronic signatures\u2014we have talked at length in Part 1 of this bill on how there is a move from requiring a written notice to the acceptability of an email or other electronic form of transaction. The reason for this is that it does bring it into the 21st century, and that is important. But there is a very important rider on that, and this is where electronic signatures come into play, because if an electronic signature was not acceptable, what it would in fact do is it would negate everything else in the bill in terms of an acceptability of the commissioner receiving the document on behalf of the taxpayer. So it is an important thing; it is an important measure.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000513\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bbded2ec-ac25-4a73-a380-3f4d87693084\u0022\u003EI would say, though, that it does say in new section 13B(3), inserted by clause 73, that \u201CWhen the Commissioner receives a document bearing the electronic signature of a person, unless there are reasonable grounds to suppose otherwise,\u2014(a) the document is treated as signed by the person;\u201D. I am not too sure what \u201Creasonable grounds to suppose otherwise\u201D might be. It may be, for example, that it is so out of character or that it is a piece of communication that is not part of the correspondence that is going on at that point in time. I think it would be quite good to clarify that, because \u201Creasonable grounds\u201D\u2014it is the sort of \u201Creasonable man\u201D test in law. But what does define reasonable grounds for accepting or not? I suppose the one question I would have is that what I would not want to see is a taxpayer and the commissioner in court because the commissioner has said \u201CWell, I had reasonable grounds for not accepting this signature\u201D, and the taxpayer has said: \u201CWell, it actually was me.\u201D That is just my one concern\u2014the definition around those reasonable grounds.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000514\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bbded2ec-ac25-4a73-a380-3f4d87693084\u0022\u003EThe other thing is, under clauses 71, 83, and 87\u2014from 2001-02\u2014this is part of the tax administration area to make it easier for taxpayers to actually get what they need. This is amendments being made to the Tax Administration Act to allow the Commissioner of Inland Revenue to provide a special tax code directly to the Ministry of Social Development to help people receiving New Zealand superannuation or the veterans pension to meet their income tax obligations. What it does is it reduces compliance costs, it makes it a lot easier, and it requires a whole lot less obligation on behalf of the superannuitant or the veteran.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000515\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bbded2ec-ac25-4a73-a380-3f4d87693084\u0022\u003EI would also like to talk very briefly about something that Mr Cosgrove mentioned and something Mr Robertson alluded to, and this is about disclosure of information. Crucial to this is the intention test. I think it is the only test we can have, and if it is proved that someone has intentionally disclosed private information then that person, under several different Acts and, I think, also under their employment contract, can have their employment terminated immediately. But the intention test is very hard to prove, and a classic case of this is actually under the Income Tax Act, where whether or not the sale of a property is subject to income tax is based around the intention of the owner of that property when they bought it\u2014whether the intent was to make a capital gain or to buy it for rental yield. The interesting thing is that the Inland Revenue Department (IRD) has only ever successfully prosecuted one person for not complying with the Income Tax Act due to a misallocation of profits on there. We have to just be sure that the intention test is applied correctly.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000516\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bbded2ec-ac25-4a73-a380-3f4d87693084\u0022\u003EWhat I would hope, and what I am assuming is going to happen, is that the IRD will actually issue a briefing note, if not hold briefings with all its staff, around what this action means. I trust the IRD, I think it does a fantastic job, and I would never question the integrity of its staff in any way, shape, or form, but what I would like to see, and what I would like to know, is that the IRD is taking this as seriously as the select committee took it, and, as a consequence of that, it does make very, very clear to its staff the rules and regulations around this. I have a suspicion that they know this anyway, but we do need to ensure that there is clarity, because the last thing we would want to do is have someone divulge information unintentionally but break the law, and then have to be dragged through some sort of employment court or employment dispute because the definition of intention is incorrect.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000517\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bbded2ec-ac25-4a73-a380-3f4d87693084\u0022\u003EBut, on that note, we do understand that what is happening with Government departments is very important\u2014they are working closer together, and we do believe this needs to happen. Whether this is out of necessity\u2014i.e. in Christchurch when different departments had to come together and co-locate, or whether it is just out of greater efficiency\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022893adc11-ce4e-419c-a079-08f04b3d75f5\u0022 data-id=\u0022c2531914dd0f467f94ac3f57b5158760\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000518\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022893adc11-ce4e-419c-a079-08f04b3d75f5\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022c2531914dd0f467f94ac3f57b5158760\u0022\u003EThe CHAIRPERSON (Lindsay Tisch)\u003C/span\u003E: Sorry to interrupt the honourable member, but the time has come for me to leave the Chair for the dinner break. This debate is interrupted, and I shall resume the Chair at 7.30 p.m.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000519\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022893adc11-ce4e-419c-a079-08f04b3d75f5\u0022\u003ESitting suspended from 6 p.m. to 7.30 p.m.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022e11a5f05-1940-41b2-8f1e-911dba7a43a5\u0022 data-id=\u0022ec60be1b7dc7415aa8b5f2d7a390c8f9\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000520\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e11a5f05-1940-41b2-8f1e-911dba7a43a5\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022ec60be1b7dc7415aa8b5f2d7a390c8f9\u0022\u003EFLETCHER TABUTEAU (NZ First):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you for the opportunity, Mr Chairman. I just want to touch on a few of the contributions that have been made this evening, and acknowledge the kinds of issues around the electronic signature problem that the Inland Revenue Department (IRD) has been working through over the years. And the reality is, in modern practice\u2014and we look to most of our banks at the moment\u2014we see there is very much a safe and appropriate mechanism for the electronic signature, and it is taking a while but we have got there. I think it is absolutely appropriate, which is part of the reason why New Zealand First is supporting the legislation.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000521\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e11a5f05-1940-41b2-8f1e-911dba7a43a5\u0022\u003EBut what I did want to touch on, in particular, because it is an issue\u2014and it is still, perhaps, for me and for New Zealand First\u2014that needs further exploration and some commitment from the Minister, one would hope, is the co-location and secrecy issue that was raised in terms of discussions within the Finance and Expenditure Committee.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000522\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e11a5f05-1940-41b2-8f1e-911dba7a43a5\u0022\u003ESo, firstly, let me put it into points. The conversation started with the fact that the IRD was going to have to share locations in terms of physical office space with different Government departments, and that would raise some privacy and secrecy issues. I just wanted to note, though, that the IRD considers that no amount of training, best-practice guidelines, or adopted behaviour is likely to adequately address the substantial risk of the IRD employees inadvertently disclosing taxpayer information to other Government employees in a co-location environment. So what we have here is the ministry itself acknowledging that this is quite a huge problem and there does not seem to be, even with the best of intent, the ability to mitigate\u2014well, maybe mitigate is a possibility, but to eliminate these privacy issues is a real concern for the ministry itself and the staff involved.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000523\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e11a5f05-1940-41b2-8f1e-911dba7a43a5\u0022\u003ESo in the select committee we had very in-depth conversations about what that would involve. I note Mr Cosgrove made a contribution about that earlier in the evening. I would like to support his words because it was a contentious issue. What we have done within this legislation is we have said: \u201CWell, actually, let\u2019s acknowledge that this is a possibility. Let\u2019s acknowledge that despite the best efforts of ministry staff, best practice, implementation, and procedures we will have issue.\u201D So that is not a debate. I think that is perhaps the primary concern for New Zealand First. There will be an issue. There is no debate on that. It is how we get around the problem for individual staff. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000524\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e11a5f05-1940-41b2-8f1e-911dba7a43a5\u0022\u003ESo with great reluctance, as part of that committee, my contribution was to support and say that, yes, let us come up with some additional safeguards for employees if it was proven that they were not deliberately trying to disclose private information\u2014that that was unfair and unreasonable to take them to court proceedings if that was established in the first instance. But as that conversation was fleshed out, actually, we decided that is what a court is there for. So the court is there to establish the intent and the degree of the intent, and if there was intent then the court would come down hard and appropriately on those individuals. Conversely, if there was no intent then the court would establish that and the argument would be that, well, clearly there was no intent, and it was a true mistake on behalf of the employee\u2014\u201CWhy has it come to us? Let us dismiss it for the accident it was.\u201D And yet, we have more legislation around this. I think it is quite an issue that needs further exploration and consideration from the Minister.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000525\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e11a5f05-1940-41b2-8f1e-911dba7a43a5\u0022\u003EI think, in terms of cost saving, we may have gone a bridge too far; for the expediency around a few dollars we are compromising the privacy of New Zealand taxpayers. It is an important issue that needs, I think, more consideration from the Minister and the Government. But, in the main, when we consider that this legislation is about updating the technology and the practices available to the ministry, I think we can support it.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022 data-id=\u0022fc51c0a85b56407db54942f133cdb597\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000526\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022fc51c0a85b56407db54942f133cdb597\u0022\u003EGRANT ROBERTSON (Labour\u2014Wellington Central):\u003C/span\u003E You were spoilt for choice. Thank you, Mr Chair. I actually do want to pick up the very point that Fletcher Tabuteau was discussing, and that is the question of co-location, and perhaps go back to the beginning because I think there is some confusion here around the question of a deliberate breach of secrecy by a staff member, and an inadvertent breach. Currently, the Act applies only where someone knowingly acts in contravention of section 81 of the Tax Administration Act, which is about disclosing information that they should not. Should a breach occur, there is a legal process to determine, as Mr Tabuteau said, whether the breach was unintended or made knowingly, and then appropriate sanctions apply.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000527\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003EWhen we were discussing this in the select committee, the position we reached was that an employee could be judged to have knowingly contravened section 81 where the breach was inadvertent but it occurred where there was a real risk inherent in the co-located environment. As it says in our report: \u201CFor example, an IRD employee might be aware of the risk that a co-located employee could overhear information, but not be able to avoid that possibility.\u201D So we acknowledge that but, obviously, we have an obligation to ensure that that information is held in appropriate secrecy. So that was the discussion we were having: do we need a threat of a sanction to emphasise the point that this is a really important area of confidentiality, and there is an increased risk with co-located departments?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000528\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003EAt one point we almost discussed whether we needed the clause at all because, actually, at the moment the obligations on Inland Revenue Department (IRD) staff are quite clear; they know what they are, and they sign an enhanced secrecy agreement above and beyond what almost any other public servant would do. But the co-location issue means that there is now a set of increased risks around those employees. We did, on balance, decide to include the concept of taking reasonable care in that co-located environment. Quite clearly, for the IRD employees who have already signed their secrecy agreements, they are going to be taking care, but this is a clause that at least acknowledges in some form or other that reasonable care would be required. Again, to quote the most excellent report of the committee: \u201CBeing compelled to take reasonable care would motivate employees to proactively manage the risk associated with a co-located environment. It would also provide an additional safeguard against reckless and negligent behaviour.\u201D\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000529\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003EI do not want people to gain the impression that we think that the IRD staff are going around engaging in reckless and negligent behaviour, but that the risk of inadvertently giving information out needs to be considered. I do think it would be useful for the Minister, whom I believe may take a call, to just address the way in which the IRD is going to go about taking this into account. This applies to the wider Public Service in my view, as well\u2014that although we are all looking for efficiencies that come from public sector agencies being co-located, we know in the regions of New Zealand there used to be large Public Service agencies in\u2014I do not know, a city like Wanganui, until the Government tore them out and took them back to Palmerston North\u2014places like Wanganui, where Public Service agencies come together as a matter of efficiency and ease for the public to use them, where there is a lot of information flowing around. We have been encouraging through legislation\u2014including in this legislation, in fact\u2014public sector departments to share information where relevant.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000530\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003ESo we have got, on one hand, a level of encouragement, but on the other the risk that the information, particularly around tax, could inadvertently be shared. I know that those who are listening in on this might be saying: \u201CWell, why is this such a controversial issue?\u201D. It is because it is about sensitive taxpayer information. We know that every time there is a privacy breach\u2014every time someone leaves a briefcase on Lambton Quay\u2014this causes upset. Well, here we are with people day in, day out needing to talk about taxpayer information, but working now in an environment where people who do not have the same secrecy provisions in their contracts will be.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000531\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003ESo we are really just looking for an assurance from the Minister that it is understood what has happened here. The select committee grappled with it and we came up with what we thought was a decent solution, which was to include a higher duty of care but not try to, effectively, criminalise people just going about their daily jobs. So I hope the Minister understands what the committee has tried to do here. We certainly support the co-location of departments, but when it is the IRD we do absolutely want to make sure that New Zealand taxpayers\u2019 privacy is protected. Given that you have not rung the bell, Mr Chair, although you are just about to do that\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022c83012b4-3939-4753-80fc-1956a3e2bd1e\u0022 data-id=\u0022c0b3a2884aae4221a2a02a07e9a3724b\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000532\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c83012b4-3939-4753-80fc-1956a3e2bd1e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022c0b3a2884aae4221a2a02a07e9a3724b\u0022\u003EHon MICHAEL WOODHOUSE (Minister of Revenue):\u003C/span\u003E I just want to address the three or four very important issues that have been raised either side of the dinner break. But before I do, can I thank the members of the Finance and Expenditure Committee for their consideration of this bill. Tax bills tend to be reasonably dry things, but I think the select committee has applied itself diligently to some issues that have been raised both in the select committee and in the Committee of the whole House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000533\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c83012b4-3939-4753-80fc-1956a3e2bd1e\u0022\u003EI will start with the point that Mr Robertson has addressed in respect of co-location. I want to thank the committee specifically for its diligent consideration of this issue, because I think we all understood what was intended. Firstly, co-location is not only about efficiency; actually, what we will be seeing\u2014and indeed the Inland Revenue Department (IRD) has the responsibility for the administration of things like the student loans scheme, Working for Families, and child support\u2014is a significant overlap with the Ministry of Social Development and its roles and functions. So co-location might have efficiency in at least one office that it occurs in now, but it also has the potential to improve the quality of the service that we can provide to the New Zealand taxpayer. But I think that the committee was right to look carefully at clause 117 in order to ensure that we have the right balance between ensuring that due diligence takes place, because there is a higher standard of care that is required to maintain the secrecy of people\u2019s tax records, and that inadvertent breaches do not give rise to an unnecessary punishment. I think the committee landed that clause in exactly the right place, but the proof of the pudding will be in the eating.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000534\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c83012b4-3939-4753-80fc-1956a3e2bd1e\u0022\u003EThe effectiveness of the amendment that the committee has made will be in the manner in which the commissioner gives effect to it. I am confident that she understands and will use her best endeavours to protect the integrity of the tax system, bearing in mind that the exception applies only to unintentional breaches\u2014no intentional breach will be given the protection of this clause. I think that was understood by the committee, but I think that the question was more about the margins and what, effectively, constitutes \u201Creckless\u201D or \u201Ccareless\u201D and not really about understanding or applying oneself to that requirement as an IRD employee. I am confident, having spoken to many, many IRD staff around the country, that they take their secrecy obligations very, very seriously. I have yet to find anybody who is flippant about that. In fact, if anything, Ministers have found section 81 a very, very strong black box, and rightly so. However, I do note that later in the year, as part of the tax programme, we will be reviewing the Tax Administration Act, and so this is a nice sort of segue into a broader review, and the questions of the privacy of information are going to be foremost in that.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000535\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c83012b4-3939-4753-80fc-1956a3e2bd1e\u0022\u003ECan I turn now to the issue of electronic signatures because\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000536\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002257e41e9d-285b-4fb3-847d-a63820ae7137\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022e19b273509e54248be31ebe8497aee23\u0022\u003EChris Bishop\u003C/span\u003E: Oh, please do.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000537\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c83012b4-3939-4753-80fc-1956a3e2bd1e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002209a7e6d315aa4872957ef4f1b446c924\u0022\u003EHon MICHAEL WOODHOUSE\u003C/span\u003E: OK, I will. Mr Nash made a very good point before dinner, and it has been followed up by Messrs Tabuteau and Robertson. I think he asked the question about what would constitute \u201Creasonable grounds\u201D for the receipt of an electronic signature, but he then went on to quote clause 74. That was inadvertent, I am sure, but clause 74 actually works on out-bound communications, so I want to touch on both of those things.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000538\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c83012b4-3939-4753-80fc-1956a3e2bd1e\u0022\u003EAt the moment, we currently have an arrangement whereby a document might be deemed to be sent if it is sent to the last-known physical address, even if that person has moved on. We certainly need to update that, because the whole essence of this is to give effect to a much more modern tax administration system. I think it would be enough simply to say that if somebody has communicated with the IRD by email, then there are reasonable grounds to presume that the commissioner can then communicate back. In fact, registering with myIR requires an email address to be put on there. Once the identity of the registered person is verified, then I think it would be reasonable grounds to assume that the commissioner can communicate with the taxpayer via that email address. Even if the email address changes, the same thing would apply with the last-known physical address: that it would be deemed to have been sent.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000539\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c83012b4-3939-4753-80fc-1956a3e2bd1e\u0022\u003EIt is clause 73 that deals with the issue that Mr Nash was raising in respect of what would constitute reasonable grounds for the use of electronic signatures in the receipt of communications from it. I think the same principle would apply, but the question then becomes one of identity\u2014verification that the communication is from the source that it claims to be\u2014because it is not difficult, actually, to purport to be someone else in an electronic world. There is, I think, an allowance for the IRD to place a reasonable reliance on the use of electronic signatures, because there is discretion, obviously, for a signature not to be accepted if the IRD has reasonable grounds to suppose otherwise; that might be inconsistency of information, such as having a separate communication from someone who was also purporting to be that taxpayer, from a different electronic source. But in the absence of a \u201Creasonable grounds\u201D test, the IRD would be prevented from actually acting on not accepting the signature, even though it had good grounds to suspect that it was from a fraudulent source\u2014perhaps changing a bank account, for example, and then asking for a refund to be paid into a different bank account. The IRD has got to be very diligent in ensuring that it is on top of that. I think \u201Creasonable grounds\u201D is a well understood nomenclature in legal jurisprudence, so I am confident that the tests that will be applied will be effective ones.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000540\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c83012b4-3939-4753-80fc-1956a3e2bd1e\u0022\u003EI want to just finish by giving the Committee a brief commentary on an issue that Clayton Cosgrove raised before dinner, and that was on the issue of the update on Business Transformation. The essence of taxpayer security, the reliance on electronic signatures, and the things that this bill will give effect to are all predicated on a business transformation project the like of which I think the Government has not seen at all. The number was $1.5 billion; it is now down thanks to, well, excellent efforts by the Minister, of course, backed up by the IRD. But, actually, the fact that we are not building a bespoke system has, I think, a significant value-add, and I am satisfied that although this is a project that is not actually just about technology, this is about fundamentally changing the way the IRD engages with the many millions of taxpayers around the country\u2014that real lightbulb moment where we are building our tax system around the needs of the taxpayer, not the other way around. I think that is a significant opportunity to materially improve the experience of interacting with the IRD. But it is a big project. It is risky. Mention was made by Mr Cosgrove of going all the way back to the 1990s and INCIS, and Novopay, more recently, but there are successes in Government IT projects\u2014the ones you never hear about. Certainly, the department of immigration\u2019s online system, version 2015, has gone extremely well. It is under budget, and it was just on time.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000541\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00222aa0b524-c38d-45aa-bd5b-99c5927085f4\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00228d1c537e9cf24ae78400ffb7a6b19207\u0022\u003EClare Curran\u003C/span\u003E: Why don\u2019t we hear about them then?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000542\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c83012b4-3939-4753-80fc-1956a3e2bd1e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022877ce4ac11bc438fb8d39d92af478b5e\u0022\u003EHon MICHAEL WOODHOUSE\u003C/span\u003E: We do not hear about them, Ms Curran, because they are good news\u2014they are good news\u2014and, of course, good news does not make the front page of the Dominion Post, I have to say; bad news definitely will, and Novopay is a good example of that. But it is also true to say that Novopay was a good learning experience, I think, in making sure that we do not sign agreements before we know that the vendor is ready to roll.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000543\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225f1453f8-c44e-4ce6-b699-64d600322276\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022077e9546bf1f4814873841470e6027e3\u0022\u003EThe CHAIRPERSON (Hon Chester Borrows)\u003C/span\u003E: Hipkins would agree.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000544\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c83012b4-3939-4753-80fc-1956a3e2bd1e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002210a918ac5fa24b6a9e8c92ff9e16b1c5\u0022\u003EHon MICHAEL WOODHOUSE\u003C/span\u003E: Mr Hipkins would certainly agree with that, I am sure. But I am satisfied, actually, that I have seen the whites of the eyes of the IT managers at the IRD\u2014their blood pressure is normal; I test it every fortnight\u2014and although we are still some months away from phase 1, the GST roll-out, I am confident that the Business Transformation project and the IT platform that will underpin these changes are well on track for a successful implementation.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00225f1453f8-c44e-4ce6-b699-64d600322276\u0022 data-id=\u0022b6dbd4615d9043c98f7a43aad11668a8\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000545\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225f1453f8-c44e-4ce6-b699-64d600322276\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022b6dbd4615d9043c98f7a43aad11668a8\u0022\u003EThe CHAIRPERSON (Hon Chester Borrows)\u003C/span\u003E: Rev. Dr David Clark.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00225bbd9f26-fdb0-4b85-a836-0fc46e1bba3c\u0022 data-id=\u0022c5f84ffad3ff420e86d2067dc5a0c230\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000546\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225bbd9f26-fdb0-4b85-a836-0fc46e1bba3c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022c5f84ffad3ff420e86d2067dc5a0c230\u0022\u003EDr DAVID CLARK (Labour\u2014Dunedin North):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Mr Chair. It is very kind of you to use my extended title. The Minister of Revenue has raised the issue of the rebuild, as many members before him have, and some of my questions that I would like some reassurance from the Minister on relate precisely to that same project. I wish to discuss\u2014and I do not think anyone in the debate has yet raised these\u2014clauses 59 and 116, which specifically point to changes in thresholds. Clause 59 amends the repayment threshold for overpayment on income statements. They relate to the personal tax summary.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000547\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225f1453f8-c44e-4ce6-b699-64d600322276\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00225eaca6616d2e497f864b443201ac2bbe\u0022\u003EThe CHAIRPERSON (Hon Chester Borrows)\u003C/span\u003E: Are they related to Part 2?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000548\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225bbd9f26-fdb0-4b85-a836-0fc46e1bba3c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00228de1940914474c80bcdac9fbb1755f89\u0022\u003EDr DAVID CLARK\u003C/span\u003E: Yes, absolutely, Mr Chair\u2014clause 116 is absolutely in Part 2. The other clause is in Part 1, but it is the same general principle that is in both parts of the bill and relates to the thresholds. The basic issue, for those who are at home or new to the debate, is that if your personal tax summary shows that you are owed a refund, it can be automatically returned to you as a taxpayer. There is a threshold, which is currently $200. So if the refund is less than $200 and you do not confirm it through a personal tax summary interaction with the department, it is automatically returned to you after 300 days. If it is over $200, then you have to go through the process.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000549\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225bbd9f26-fdb0-4b85-a836-0fc46e1bba3c\u0022\u003EThe proposal in those two clauses together amounts to changing that threshold to $600 and making the wait just 15 days. So if you are entitled to a refund you get it within 15 days, which seems to me, broadly, a sensible step. It is about reducing bureaucracy. It is about saying if it is below a certain threshold we should not have lots of bureaucrats batting backwards and forwards. It would be very odd, given the competence, historically, of the Inland Revenue Department (IRD), for that number to be wrong. \u201CWe should just get on and do it\u201D is the basic premise, I take it, behind this change.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000550\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225bbd9f26-fdb0-4b85-a836-0fc46e1bba3c\u0022\u003EMy one concern is whether the IRD can deliver on this, given the significant changes that are going on with the business transformation package that is before us, which the Minister has just spoken to, because we have had situations in this House in the past couple of years when the Minister\u2014and the previous Minister is the one who has had to do this\u2014has brought back child support legislation that simply has not been able to be implemented when thresholds have changed or when a formula has changed. We have passed a law through the Parliament, which is one thing, to say: \u201CWe\u2019re going to change this to what we think is more sensible as a Parliament.\u201D It is then voted upon, a change is made that looks sensible on paper, and then the Government has been in the distinctly embarrassing situation of having to come back and reverse out those changes because the IRD had not been able to implement them through the computer system. It has happened more than once.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000551\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225bbd9f26-fdb0-4b85-a836-0fc46e1bba3c\u0022\u003EWhat I would like to know\u2014and I believe it was not discussed at the Finance and Expenditure Committee\u2014is whether the Minister has sought assurances that this change can be simply made and whether it can be delivered in the time frame, which, in the proposed amendment in the original commentary was 1 April this year. Clearly, that is no longer the schedule, and I would be interested in the Minister letting us know whether this is, in fact, still the schedule for delivery\u2014whether it is a retrospective piece of legislation. I mean, it is a detail, but this is what we are here to discuss in respect of the committee changes. This is the kind of thing that could trip the Government up and see the whole legislation coming back to the House. If the Minister has not got that assurance, I am prepared to move an amendment that would either remove that or push out the date for implementation to a time when the Minister thinks he could safely ensure that change as a part of the rebuild without the embarrassment of having to bring it back to the House again, as has befallen the Government previously. The Minister, I see, has had some advice so I will look forward to his contribution.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000552\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225bbd9f26-fdb0-4b85-a836-0fc46e1bba3c\u0022\u003EI do not wish to prolong my contribution much further, only to say that if that is not deliverable, as I have mentioned already to the Minister, I would be happy to move an amendment that either changes the date so it can be safely implemented, or, if that is not necessary, I am sure the Minister will explain to us shortly. Thank you.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022 data-id=\u0022209c4034c98148db91d35a2fb38fda31\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000553\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022209c4034c98148db91d35a2fb38fda31\u0022\u003EGRANT ROBERTSON (Labour\u2014Wellington Central):\u003C/span\u003E Mr Chairperson, you are catching the eye of the Minister of Revenue there to see whether he wanted to respond to those questions\u2014I am sure he will in time. I just have a couple of smaller, minor matters in Part 2 of the Taxation (Transformation: First Phase Simplification and Other Measures) Bill to raise that have not been raised yet because the Government members of the Committee are assiduously promoting this piece of legislation that has come before the House, which they are obviously so proud to get up and talk about. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000554\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003EI want to talk about one matter that is actually a very positive and necessary development for a reasonably small group of people, but one for whom this particular clause matters, and that is around the question of special tax codes. This did occupy a little bit of time for the Finance and Expenditure Committee when we were working on it. Essentially, amendments are being made to the Tax Administration Act to allow the Commissioner of Inland Revenue to provide special tax code certificates directly to the Ministry of Social Development (MSD) to help people receiving New Zealand superannuation or veterans pensions to meet their income tax obligations. These amendments are basically about reducing compliance costs imposed on superannuitants or veterans pensions recipients in providing the certificate to the MSD and removing any delay in the application of the correct tax reduction rate. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000555\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003EIt is quite a specific change, but one that affects a group of people for whom the amount of income they are getting outside of their pension source, particularly, is often quite small, and there have been unnecessary delays in the relationship between the Inland Revenue Department (IRD) and MSD in terms of providing the information that is required. So the amendments are going to enable the commissioner to provide a special tax code certificate directly to MSD when the superannuitant or veterans pension recipient has applied for that certificate and advised MSD they want the certificate to apply to their superannuation income or veterans pension income. Many electorate MPs in the House will have had the experience of someone coming to their office to talk about the issues that arise between making choices about these issues and how quickly you are able to access the money. So I think this will be a welcome change for those people. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000556\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003EThere was one issue where it appeared, in the original drafting, we were limiting this to being in respect of having only one employer. If someone had more than one employer, that may have been ruled out, so a change has been made within new clause 84 of the bill to make sure the reference could be to income from one or more employers. That small oversight was one that would have led to more people coming back to Mr Woodhouse asking him to make it easier for them to be able to work between MSD and IRD. So I do want to, actually, congratulate the Government on that. It is a matter that has been of concern to those who receive veterans pensions, particularly, that there was unnecessary bureaucratic delay and unnecessary double-handling, essentially, of the issues of the income they receive. I thank the Minister and the officials for bringing that before the Committee. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000557\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003EThe only other matter I wanted to raise in Part 2 relates to biometric information, and I do think this is one of those clauses we will come back to in time\u2014we all know the use of biometric information is increasing all over the world. Every time we got to an airport, every time we enter all kinds of different buildings now, biometric information is used. The issue here was around the disclosure of biometric information and, potentially, the illegal disclosure of biometric information under the now famous section 81 of the Tax Administration Act. What the previous clause 117(5) of this bill did was authorise the disclosure of taxpayer voice biometric information to an officer or employee of a public sector agency. What the amendment the committee proposed did was specify that that data could be released only with the taxpayer\u2019s consent and only for the purpose of verifying the identity of the client. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000558\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003EI know, as a lot of taxpayers are doing more of their interactions with the IRD online and more of their interactions over the phone, that there is an increasing concern about what happens to that data and what happens to that information, particularly in the days of identity theft and all those sorts of things\u2014biometric voice data is now very significant in the interactions that you have. The committee again, not wanting to get in the way of progress but wanting to continually assure ourselves that we are putting the right rules around the use of this new information, felt that this was an additional safeguard that we could put in. The Minister of Revenue will be delighted to know that he will now be notified when biometric information is shared. [Bell rung] Mr Chair? \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000559\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225f1453f8-c44e-4ce6-b699-64d600322276\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022faaeac470b794229b0e0b7ea6fdf5655\u0022\u003EThe CHAIRPERSON (Hon Chester Borrows)\u003C/span\u003E: Grant Robertson.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000560\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002210bda3d6eff54846a1343e82d411a266\u0022\u003EGRANT ROBERTSON\u003C/span\u003E: Just briefly, the Minister will be notified now when the information is shared\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00225f1453f8-c44e-4ce6-b699-64d600322276\u0022 data-id=\u00221321961273e94154b254b65a85eda357\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000561\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225f1453f8-c44e-4ce6-b699-64d600322276\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00221321961273e94154b254b65a85eda357\u0022\u003EThe CHAIRPERSON (Hon Chester Borrows)\u003C/span\u003E: I am sorry to interrupt the member. I should not have given him the call, because he has had four calls on this part and his time has expired.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022163d0b68-eb0e-4094-9bed-99e184f063e1\u0022 data-id=\u0022250f7f8dce6b415b8914ed595d2500fe\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000562\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022163d0b68-eb0e-4094-9bed-99e184f063e1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022250f7f8dce6b415b8914ed595d2500fe\u0022\u003EJAMI-LEE ROSS (Junior Whip\u2014National):\u003C/span\u003E I move, That the question be now put.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00225bbd9f26-fdb0-4b85-a836-0fc46e1bba3c\u0022 data-id=\u00224f54441bca3349d9af7c5b4648070099\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000563\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225bbd9f26-fdb0-4b85-a836-0fc46e1bba3c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00224f54441bca3349d9af7c5b4648070099\u0022\u003EDr DAVID CLARK (Labour\u2014Dunedin North):\u003C/span\u003E I do want to press on the previous point that I was making, because I have also perused a bit further and I have got further concerns about whether this will be able to be implemented. I am going to cover a bit that has broadly been covered so far in the debate but from a different angle. It is in Part 2\u2014quite rightly\u2014and it is clause 71. We are talking here about software packages that are accepted and able to be used. I go back again to the ability of the Inland Revenue Department to work with these packages, and whether this will indeed be able to be implemented. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000564\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225bbd9f26-fdb0-4b85-a836-0fc46e1bba3c\u0022\u003EThe point I did not make perhaps strongly enough in my previous contribution is about this particular change that is going on at the Inland Revenue Department, which the Minister spoke so eloquently about\u2014in fact, about his own involvement in bringing the figures down from $1.5 billion to $1 billion. I would be interested to hear how he did that\u2014whether he licked his finger and held it into a stronger breeze, or quite how he got to the $1 billion figure, because it is a fairly round number. That aside\u2014no, perhaps the Minister would like to address that. Part of that change is actually about bringing that computer system into the 21st century. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000565\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225bbd9f26-fdb0-4b85-a836-0fc46e1bba3c\u0022\u003EThe current system was designed and implemented in about 1993. That is 10 years, at least, before Facebook came on the scene. It is about the time that Excel spreadsheets were being invented and used. Certainly, things like Twitter and all kinds of other things that we use as MPs in our daily correspondence with constituents were not even dreamt of. The existing system we have known has been a legacy system that has not been able to deliver the modern tax system we need. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000566\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225bbd9f26-fdb0-4b85-a836-0fc46e1bba3c\u0022\u003EThe Prime Minister said\u2014I think it was in 2012; it was certainly on Valentine\u2019s Day because I described it as a Valentine\u2019s Day promise at the time, when I was the tax spokesperson for the Labour Party\u2014that he would be horrified to think that policy was being held back because we had a computer system to deliver our taxes that was out of date. We now know, as I said in my previous contribution, that in fact some proposed tax changes have had to come back to this House, because they could not be delivered by the existing tax system. Again, here we have some more complex interaction involving software packages. I seek assurances from the Minister that he is confident these can be delivered. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000567\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225bbd9f26-fdb0-4b85-a836-0fc46e1bba3c\u0022\u003EIn my previous contribution I talked about the changes in thresholds and the date of delivery being 1 April. Some at home may find it ironic that that is the date that is being aimed for by the tax department to deliver changes it has previously struggled to deliver. I ask the Minister whether he has sought assurances that these changes can be put in place without this legislation having to come back to the Parliament, to be reversed out again\u2014and, of course, we know that has an associated cost. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000568\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225bbd9f26-fdb0-4b85-a836-0fc46e1bba3c\u0022\u003EThe cost of running this Parliament is well over $1 million, I think, for every bill that goes through. I hope I am right in that. It is a figure I looked up a long time ago. I was certainly surprised at all of the departmental costs that go into it\u2014the staff, the MPs\u2019 salaries; the whole works of Parliament. Democracy is an expensive thing. What we do not want is duplication. We do not want to duplicate those costs as they go through. The Minister looks like he is ready to address the question.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000569\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c83012b4-3939-4753-80fc-1956a3e2bd1e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002238f00ef13e29491ba0cff8171dbfdfc3\u0022\u003EHon Michael Woodhouse\u003C/span\u003E: I will at a later stage.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000570\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225bbd9f26-fdb0-4b85-a836-0fc46e1bba3c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00227bd0724c30cb4f228a2192101c1137fb\u0022\u003EDr DAVID CLARK\u003C/span\u003E: He will at a later stage, he says. Well, I think the Minister ought to jump to his feet soon because the people who are following this debate will want an assurance that the Minister is concerned about whether this can be delivered and is not being frivolous with taxpayers\u2019 money to simply ram a political point through, and that the system should be more accountable, should be quicker, and should be less bureaucratic. That political point has been made in this House before, and we have all carried the cost as the legislation has come back and we have had to reverse it out. Taxpayers at home have had to bear the cost of that. I think the Minister owes those taxpayers an assurance that the same thing is not going to happen again with this bill.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000571\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225bbd9f26-fdb0-4b85-a836-0fc46e1bba3c\u0022\u003EThe question was put that the amendment set out on Supplementary Order Paper 171 in the name of the Hon Michael Woodhouse to Part 2 be agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000572\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225bbd9f26-fdb0-4b85-a836-0fc46e1bba3c\u0022\u003EAmendment agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000573\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225bbd9f26-fdb0-4b85-a836-0fc46e1bba3c\u0022\u003EPart 2 as amended agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000574\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u0022c3924b28a7f44b75b5e45571671340b1\u0022\u003EPart 3  Amendments to other enactments\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022 data-id=\u00225d221986119642fab810b02876c383ff\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000575\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00225d221986119642fab810b02876c383ff\u0022\u003EGRANT ROBERTSON (Labour\u2014Wellington Central):\u003C/span\u003E This is the first go on this part, so we will make sure we keep counting this time. I do not actually have many things to raise in Part 3 of the bill, but I do want to discuss the clauses relating to KiwiSaver, and in particular clauses 205 to 211, which relate to minors\u2014that is younger people, as opposed to those down coalmines\u2014opting out of the KiwiSaver scheme. The bill proposes a new provision that would allow minors who have been incorrectly enrolled into KiwiSaver to opt out before their 19th birthday. This would, as the officials told us, provide some protection to minors who may not know they have been enrolled, and want to exit the scheme. Members who opt out of KiwiSaver under this new provision will have the contributions they have made returned to them, their Government contributions will be returned to the Crown, and their compulsory employer contributions will be returned to their employer. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000576\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003EMembers of the committee asked officials how widespread this problem was, because we did find it a little curious that we were coming to Parliament to debate, perhaps, this rush of young people being enrolled in KiwiSaver by parents over-eager to get them in when they genuinely did not want to be, or felt it had happened in an incorrect manner. Officials assured us this was not an enormously widespread problem, but there was a need to provide a provision for KiwiSaver members to do that. So new section 59CB, inserted by clause 210, will allow members who have been incorrectly enrolled in KiwiSaver when they were minors to opt out, up until their 19th birthday. They have to meet these criteria: they are aged under 16 and they have the consent of one of their guardians, or they are acting under their own authority, between 17 and 19 years of age. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000577\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003EI really do want to make a couple of points here. The first is that I do not think it is desirable to be promoting, in any way, the withdrawal from KiwiSaver of people who have been enrolled under the age of 18. The Government has withdrawn the kick-start payment, which was a very attractive reason for a lot of people to be enrolled before they reached the age of 18. I think that is a pity and a shame, and I think it undermines some of the improvements to the savings culture that have been developed as KiwiSaver has gone on. But we do accept that there may be situations where people feel the need to do this. I think it is important to make that point. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000578\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003EI am still a little bewildered about the extent of this and why it has come to the Committee in this way. Minors are only able to join KiwiSaver by directly contracting with a KiwiSaver provider, obviously, as they will not necessarily have an employer, and the providers have the ability to receive and review parental consent. That all should actually be happening. This is to try to cover a situation where, for some reason, a provider has decided that it is just going to accept someone coming in as a minor and signing up for KiwiSaver. The officials eventually said to us\u2014and they say it in the commentary on the bill\u2014\u201CTo date Inland Revenue has not received any complaints from minors who have been incorrectly enrolled into KiwiSaver through their employers.\u201D That would be none enrolled through their employers. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000579\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003ESo I think the extent of this problem is very limited, but I guess it is a good thing to ensure that people under the age of 18, particularly, are not exploited. The reason the clause goes up to 19 years of age, which we did discuss, is to give time for KiwiSaver members, once they have reached 18 years of age and are in a position to be advocating on their own behalf, to be able to get out of the scheme, should they wish to. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000580\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003EAs I say, it is not a clause that I think we would like to see used very often, but it is conceivable people will find their way, through either a rogue KiwiSaver scheme, a rogue parent, or a rogue employer\u2014although there are not any who have done that. It would seem an odd clause, but I thought it was worth noting that it is now possible under this section of the bill. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000581\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003EWhen the bill came before the Finance and Expenditure Committee we did consider that the wording of the bill appeared to treat an automatic enrolment as a mistake, and only if there was a failure to meet all of those criteria that I mentioned before rather than one of them, and so the committee altered the bill under clause 207 to ensure that if any of those criteria were failed, then the person who had been incorrectly enrolled had the ability to withdraw from the scheme. Unless the Minister of Revenue wants to clarify the extent of the thousands of young people writing to him with deep concern about their automatic enrolment in KiwiSaver, we are happy to support the clause.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00225bbd9f26-fdb0-4b85-a836-0fc46e1bba3c\u0022 data-id=\u00224a06cfcba92f48da8ed2da1556d8abd0\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000582\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225bbd9f26-fdb0-4b85-a836-0fc46e1bba3c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00224a06cfcba92f48da8ed2da1556d8abd0\u0022\u003EDr DAVID CLARK (Labour\u2014Dunedin North):\u003C/span\u003E I wish to disagree with the previous speaker a little. I think he may be understating the potential of this problem. The Inland Revenue Department may in fact be trying to cut off at the pass a serious concern about minors wanting to withdraw from the scheme. I was not on the Finance and Expenditure Committee so I will defer to those who have wider knowledge, but my concern arises from the fact that in the last Budget the Government cut the KiwiSaver kick-start. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000583\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225bbd9f26-fdb0-4b85-a836-0fc46e1bba3c\u0022\u003EThe terms of the KiwiSaver scheme have changed. In Dunedin, my home town, I know that as a result of those changes 14,000\u201414,000\u2014young New Zealanders, probably first-time savers, the majority of them, will have missed out on that kick-start payment. If someone signed them up and they thought they were going to get that, they may well have felt aggrieved and may wish to remove themselves from the scheme.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000584\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00229123df78bd994e088d8573ab0b504184\u0022\u003ERt Hon Winston Peters\u003C/span\u003E: How many thousand?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000585\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225bbd9f26-fdb0-4b85-a836-0fc46e1bba3c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022849fbeb6636f4264a2762c2a0dcf17b7\u0022\u003EDr DAVID CLARK\u003C/span\u003E: 14,000.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000586\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022f870381d999f4ca0ab242e05e65e0f27\u0022\u003ERt Hon Winston Peters\u003C/span\u003E: That\u2019s unbelievable.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000587\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225bbd9f26-fdb0-4b85-a836-0fc46e1bba3c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002270d2ea9f62e1467c81b15143401703ea\u0022\u003EDr DAVID CLARK\u003C/span\u003E: It is unbelievable.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000588\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022b6d2ba8dcf3646909acb2f14d75fb220\u0022\u003ERt Hon Winston Peters\u003C/span\u003E: Doesn\u2019t he come from Dunedin?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000589\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225bbd9f26-fdb0-4b85-a836-0fc46e1bba3c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002274e551c5d3984b5983e362c128bd1c3e\u0022\u003EDr DAVID CLARK\u003C/span\u003E: It is shocking\u2014and the Minister comes from Dunedin. There are 14,000 people missing out on that $1,000 KiwiSaver kick-start as a result of the last Budget. It is indeed an outrage. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000590\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225bbd9f26-fdb0-4b85-a836-0fc46e1bba3c\u0022\u003ESo I think it is entirely possible that young people who have been signed up to a scheme where they thought they were going to get a savings boost from the Government will find out later that the Government has taken it from them in the previous Budget, as is its wont at the moment. And goodness knows what we will find out later this week as it plays to the mega-wealthy. I mean, we have seen what the Government is doing with the Panama Papers, and so on. We will see what it does with the Budget this week, but I am betting that middle New Zealand will be cut out of the picture once more by this Government, which is increasingly arrogant, Mr Bishop, and out of touch. Mr Bishop knows it: he laughs, he laughs, and he laughs. He takes this lightly, but I genuinely think that New Zealanders will be disappointed\u2014those people in the middle who are struggling to get by\u2014and I think some of those young people who might have discovered that they have been enrolled in this scheme would quite rightly be aggrieved and may wish to withdraw. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000591\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225bbd9f26-fdb0-4b85-a836-0fc46e1bba3c\u0022\u003EI politely put it to my colleague that this might be an issue and that, in fact, it might be in the interests of Minister Woodhouse to play it down, because it is his Government that has robbed middle New Zealand and is making it tougher and tougher for them, so that it can look after its mates who are the ultra-wealthy. It is this Government that is screwing the scrum in favour of those who have privilege already. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000592\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225bbd9f26-fdb0-4b85-a836-0fc46e1bba3c\u0022\u003EIt is my concern that this clause may in fact be there for the right reasons. I would seek the Minister\u2019s assurance that that is the case when he delivers his short address on why the existing system will be able to deliver all the changes in this bill, because he promised me that when he interjected before. I am looking forward to that speech. I hope it is not the Minister just pushing this out into the never-never as though his Government is above explaining itself, because that is becoming a pattern that New Zealanders are becoming increasingly concerned about: a Government that makes changes and says: \u201CWell, to hell with the rest of you. We\u2019re going to make the changes we want because we do not want to engage with the public any more. We\u2019re just going to make the changes that we want to do.\u201D \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000593\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225bbd9f26-fdb0-4b85-a836-0fc46e1bba3c\u0022\u003EI come back to the point that is around clause 213 in the bill, where those deductions can be looked at and people can withdraw from the scheme.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022 data-id=\u00223508aa3ba3214eef930b8b6fe5ef0eda\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000594\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00223508aa3ba3214eef930b8b6fe5ef0eda\u0022\u003EGRANT ROBERTSON (Labour\u2014Wellington Central):\u003C/span\u003E I thought it would be useful to carry on this discussion with Dr Clark, because I do not think we are disagreeing at all here, in fact. He does raise a very good point about the impact of the removal of the KiwiSaver kick-start on the very people whom clause 207 alleges to help. The Prime Minister stood up in this House and said that removing the kick-start would \u201Cnot make a blind bit of difference\u201D to the number of people who were joining the KiwiSaver scheme.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000595\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022f02f98f931934f26931fd561ae18b6da\u0022\u003ERt Hon Winston Peters\u003C/span\u003E: Who said that?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000596\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022f1d8c3f41df14aef922dbd5ab0e8e4eb\u0022\u003EGRANT ROBERTSON\u003C/span\u003E: John Key said that\u2014he said that. It is interesting, Mr Peters, because he said that, and then we got, under the Official Information Act, the advice of his officials, who said that this would significantly reduce the number of people who enrol in the scheme. But Mr Key took his own advice\u2014an unwise course of action\u2014and said: \u201CNo, this is not going to make a blind bit of difference.\u201D\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000597\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003EWell, what occurred within a year was a reduction\u2014and my colleague Trevor Mallard always says that you cannot have a reduction like this\u2014of 182 percent in the number of 0 to 17-year-olds joining the scheme. In other words\u2014[Interruption] I know, and Alastair Scott is making the point that there was a reduction of 1,188 people on the average new enrolments of 0 to 17-year-olds over the previous 12 months. It fell away. It has collapsed, and it has collapsed for a very good reason, and that is that the kick-start was an incentive to young New Zealanders to get themselves into the KiwiSaver scheme. So I accept the point that Dr Clark is making, which is that it is possible that some of those people who were enrolled will now feel aggrieved about the fact that they were enrolled, because they do not get that kick-start any more. I think that is a legitimate point.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000598\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022f158303e4eb84e21983e4e3645d73796\u0022\u003ERt Hon Winston Peters\u003C/span\u003E: That\u2019s been a kick in the guts.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000599\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00229df76fb96f77468894139f250d1f2ddc\u0022\u003EGRANT ROBERTSON\u003C/span\u003E: It is, indeed, a kick in the guts. It is a kick in the guts for the savings culture that KiwiSaver has developed\u2014the very thing that we have been so poor at in New Zealand for so long: saving. I know the member has a history of promoting savings in New Zealand and the importance of it, but KiwiSaver has made a real difference, and to see that kick-start go in the Budget last year was a huge disappointment to a lot of New Zealanders. As my colleague Dr Clark says, who knows what they will do? So I do just want to put on the record the fact that I share the concerns of Dr Clark.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000600\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003EWhat this clause did was create the process by which people could withdraw from the scheme up to the age of 19. I still do not want New Zealanders to do that. I still want young New Zealanders to be in KiwiSaver, because, long term, it is important to New Zealand that they are. It is just a pity that this Government has consistently undermined KiwiSaver over the last 8 years.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00225bbd9f26-fdb0-4b85-a836-0fc46e1bba3c\u0022 data-id=\u00220aee43190b4943fda3bb9ac9c4fbd41d\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000601\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225bbd9f26-fdb0-4b85-a836-0fc46e1bba3c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00220aee43190b4943fda3bb9ac9c4fbd41d\u0022\u003EDr DAVID CLARK (Labour\u2014Dunedin North):\u003C/span\u003E I think we are reaching a point of harmony in the Committee. It may just be a difference in emphasis. I ask Mr Robertson to consider that it will be, in my estimation, more than 30,000 first-time savers in the Greater Wellington region who have missed out on this $1,000 KiwiSaver kick-start as a result of the changes the Government had made since the last election, where it, increasingly, is skewing the playing field in favour of the ultra-wealthy and is letting people in the middle miss out. I think Mr Robertson and I are, indeed, in agreement that this will create some concern for people and that there may well be people who wish to withdraw.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000602\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225bbd9f26-fdb0-4b85-a836-0fc46e1bba3c\u0022\u003EI agree also with Mr Robertson that we should not be encouraging people to do that\u2014that, instead, we should be encouraging people into savings, and that the movement that was started by the last Labour Government to really push a savings culture is one that is worth taking into the future. I guess we would encourage this Government to take up that cause. For starters, it could look at restoring the kick-start fund that it took out, because that is the harm that has been done. It has changed behaviour, and the Government has had the advice that that has changed behaviour. So that is where, I suspect, the concern from officials came\u2014from the Government\u2019s own advice. I mean, the Government\u2019s best economic advice is that the damage the Government did to that kick-start scheme, which withdrew that entitlement for a lot of first-time savers, will have a lasting impact and that we will see it play out in different ways. So I suspect that is what is reflected in this.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000603\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225bbd9f26-fdb0-4b85-a836-0fc46e1bba3c\u0022\u003EMr Robertson and I agree. Harmony is breaking out in the Committee, and, actually, Labour is supporting this bill. I think that is something we should also note along the way. We believe in a broad-based tax system that is fair. Of course there are aspects that we will disagree with the Government on. We do not think that it has the tax system right, but we do want to work towards simplification, and that is what a good deal of this bill is about. I am still looking forward to the Minister giving us some assurances that he can actually implement this legislation. I hope that he does not consider himself above giving members of this House and the wider public that assurance. It is a mistake his Government is slipping into, where, increasingly, it is seen as arrogant and out of touch. I hope the Minister himself will rise to the occasion and give that assurance. Thank you.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00225f1453f8-c44e-4ce6-b699-64d600322276\u0022 data-id=\u00223e0534e2b7594011a4f8329788f7fd1e\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000604\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225f1453f8-c44e-4ce6-b699-64d600322276\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00223e0534e2b7594011a4f8329788f7fd1e\u0022\u003EThe CHAIRPERSON (Hon Chester Borrows)\u003C/span\u003E: We are all glad that you are getting on.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000605\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225f1453f8-c44e-4ce6-b699-64d600322276\u0022\u003EPart 3 agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000606\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225f1453f8-c44e-4ce6-b699-64d600322276\u0022\u003ESchedule agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000607\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u0022499560664115481f82e80f65ad07169e\u0022\u003EClauses 1 and 2\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022c83012b4-3939-4753-80fc-1956a3e2bd1e\u0022 data-id=\u002262aa7b895ade428698a3a0b07d889cd1\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000608\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c83012b4-3939-4753-80fc-1956a3e2bd1e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002262aa7b895ade428698a3a0b07d889cd1\u0022\u003EHon MICHAEL WOODHOUSE (Minister of Revenue):\u003C/span\u003E I am pleased to take a very, very short call to address the issues raised by the Rev. Dr David Clark in Part 2 of the bill, and specifically clauses 59 and 116\u2014his challenge to me to verify\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000609\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225f1453f8-c44e-4ce6-b699-64d600322276\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022f73465070759445295cfa260c234a640\u0022\u003EThe CHAIRPERSON (Hon Chester Borrows)\u003C/span\u003E: Clauses 1 and 2.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000610\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c83012b4-3939-4753-80fc-1956a3e2bd1e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022ed400d98e3324342aa3d86d250f5dcc8\u0022\u003EHon MICHAEL WOODHOUSE\u003C/span\u003E: Yes, we are working on the commencement clause, which is why I raise it in this context. The member will note that clauses 59 and 116, among others, have a commencement date of 1 April 2016. The date 1 April has passed. The system changes that will give effect to this have already been made; now we need to give legal effect to it. These are system changes being made to the legacy system, not to the new system. They have already been made, we are ready to go, and the only thing holding it up is the passage of the legislation. I encourage\u2014nay, I implore\u2014Messrs Clark and Robertson not to delay it any further and to get out of the Committee stage.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00225bbd9f26-fdb0-4b85-a836-0fc46e1bba3c\u0022 data-id=\u00228145cc76646b41828caf24d8f11a2053\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000611\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225bbd9f26-fdb0-4b85-a836-0fc46e1bba3c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00228145cc76646b41828caf24d8f11a2053\u0022\u003EDr DAVID CLARK (Labour\u2014Dunedin North):\u003C/span\u003E I thank the Minister for that explanation. We will see whether, in practice, this is true. I suspect the Inland Revenue Department (IRD) had given assurances around the child support legislation previously, which were amendments to the legacy system. Simply because they are amendments to the legacy system does not always make them straightforward\u2014that is part of the problem with the legacy system. It is something that needs to be addressed and updated, because it is hard work to push changes through the system\u2014at least, that is my understanding from talking to those technical experts at the IRD who make those changes. That is part of what needs to be rectified. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000612\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225bbd9f26-fdb0-4b85-a836-0fc46e1bba3c\u0022\u003EWe need a 21st century responsive tax system, and this Government has, of course, delayed. It has been in Government for 8 years, and the whole time it has been here, it has had brought to its attention that the system is out of date. The Government has been very slow off the mark, and these changes along the way, which it has not been able to make, have hindered tax policy in New Zealand, and they have harmed the reputation of the IRD, which is no longer as strong as it once was. Its reputation as a place of fair dealing and of being easy to deal with has slipped under this Government, and I do not think that the Minister can duck that responsibility so easily. I do thank him for his assurance; he has, at least, sought some assurance that this will be possible to implement, but, of course, the proof will be in the pudding.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022 data-id=\u00221ba0f306a2bd4b06b96ab04f08fabe23\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000613\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00221ba0f306a2bd4b06b96ab04f08fabe23\u0022\u003EGRANT ROBERTSON (Labour\u2014Wellington Central):\u003C/span\u003E In clause 1, I do want to refer to the title of the bill. It is the first and second words of the title of the bill that I want to reference: taxation transformation. Well, I think we have heard in the course of the debate tonight that it is the view of the current Government that the transformation of our taxation system relies on the definition of verbs\u2014that is, going to transform our taxation system. It relies upon electronic signatures being allowed to be used\u2014that is, transformation for this Government. It is about the ability of young people to opt out of KiwiSaver\u2014even though none of them have actually asked to\u2014that, apparently, is transformative as well.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000614\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003ETransformation of our taxation system will occur when the Government gets off its chuff and starts actually making people pay their fair share. Fundamentally, tax is the price of a decent society, the price of a fair society, and the price of making sure that every single New Zealander gets the opportunities that they are entitled to by being here. It is about making sure that everyone gets a fair go\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000615\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022eaf79431-1033-44f1-a633-22633da52c0d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00224e905492f2464546839514cdf8b126ab\u0022\u003EDavid Bennett\u003C/span\u003E: No, it\u2019s not.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000616\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022db19d1bacc664f248148b5b3d016d82d\u0022\u003EGRANT ROBERTSON\u003C/span\u003E: \u2014and David Bennett does not care about New Zealanders getting a fair go. David Bennett is so out of touch that he does not think that transformation of the tax system in New Zealand actually requires people to pay their tax.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000617\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003EI will tell you what else would transform the tax system in New Zealand: when the Prime Minister gets up\u2014he is talking about multinational tax avoidance\u2014and says \u201CWell, you see, the problem here is that the ethical thing to do might not be the legal thing to do.\u201D How can those two things be different in a proper, functioning tax system: the ethical thing to do and the legal thing to do\u2014they are not quite the same? If we were transforming the tax system\u2014which is what this bill says in its title that it wants to do\u2014then we would not have the Prime Minister standing up and saying that. We would have a Prime Minister who actually understands the difference between right and wrong and who actually understands that everybody paying their fair share is the core of our tax system.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000618\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003EWith all due respect to colleagues who use phrases like \u201Caggressive tax planning\u201D, \u201Caggressive tax planning\u201D is people getting away with not paying their fair share. That is why members on this side of the Chamber have been so annoyed and upset with the blas\u00E9 attitude of the Government to New Zealand\u2019s increasing reputation as a tax haven. I know that the Minister and others will say \u201CBut we\u2019re not a tax haven\u201D\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000619\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225f1453f8-c44e-4ce6-b699-64d600322276\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022da58ff928ca54b52848e27238aa22be1\u0022\u003EThe CHAIRPERSON (Hon Chester Borrows)\u003C/span\u003E: Order! I just want to bring the member\u2019s attention to the fact that a Supplementary Order Paper addressing the issue that the member is straying into has been found out of order. He was allowed the opportunity to make an aside. If he wants to continue to make this a bigger chunk of this speech, then I am afraid that he will have to sit down.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000620\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022d7d0ecdca513497089985e479c23ac35\u0022\u003EGRANT ROBERTSON\u003C/span\u003E: I am referring to the title of the bill, which claims to be transforming our tax system\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000621\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225f1453f8-c44e-4ce6-b699-64d600322276\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00228ddf9d6c2dbf4e9da5b0912f018f9ea0\u0022\u003EThe CHAIRPERSON (Hon Chester Borrows)\u003C/span\u003E: Well, make that argument then.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000622\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022aedc8ecbb5584745982d7ddeb504db1e\u0022\u003EGRANT ROBERTSON\u003C/span\u003E: \u2014and the transformation of the tax system we are looking for on this side of the Chamber is one where we can hold our heads high internationally. That would be a transformed tax system. A transformed tax system would collect the billions of dollars from multinationals that decide that they do not want to pay tax in New Zealand. Transformation would be about saying we stand for every New Zealander paying their fair share. Would it not be a great day when, rather than aggressive tax planning, we actually had companies and individuals in New Zealand who said: \u201CI am paying my tax because it\u2019s the right thing to do. I\u2019m paying my fair share because it\u2019s my contribution to society. It\u2019s my way of saying I am part of society.\u201D That would transform our tax system, not tinkering about the edges, not looking into whether or not different parts of the IT system work or not, but actually saying that our tax system is the fundamentals of a decent society, the fundamentals\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000623\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022859e13f9-33bb-41bb-b2f0-d848eaf25407\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022b336dff6c4db4047ab9177cb58587f84\u0022\u003EAndrew Bayly\u003C/span\u003E: Why don\u2019t you just say it\u2014you want to put up tax rates?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000624\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022047923d44bd54361b1cb0a4f61c49d7d\u0022\u003EGRANT ROBERTSON\u003C/span\u003E: \u2014of what allows New Zealanders to do that.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000625\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003EAndrew Bayly is talking to us here about the right and wrong thing to do. Andrew Bayly and his Government need to make sure that they are on the side of ordinary New Zealanders\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000626\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022eaf79431-1033-44f1-a633-22633da52c0d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022f51bb4b51fe24762a61422947305a827\u0022\u003EDavid Bennett\u003C/span\u003E: Oh, what a load of rubbish.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000627\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022132aedb434b9472f9cc481836809701f\u0022\u003EGRANT ROBERTSON\u003C/span\u003E: David Bennett reacts\u2014the people who pay their PAYE every day of the week, those New Zealanders who do the right thing, who meet their tax obligations\u2014and David Bennett would prefer to be on the side of the fortunate few who can hire an accountant and hide their tax. Well shame on you, Mr Bennett. Shame on you. If you want to transform the tax system, Mr Bennett, get alongside parties who want New Zealanders to do the right thing. [Bell rung] Mr Chair? There ain\u2019t no one else. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022163d0b68-eb0e-4094-9bed-99e184f063e1\u0022 data-id=\u0022bf50bb094901472289806557a1070731\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000628\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022163d0b68-eb0e-4094-9bed-99e184f063e1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022bf50bb094901472289806557a1070731\u0022\u003EJAMI-LEE ROSS (Junior Whip\u2014National):\u003C/span\u003E I move, That the question be now put.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00225bbd9f26-fdb0-4b85-a836-0fc46e1bba3c\u0022 data-id=\u00224df2325e2e984f149ff120dbc368e104\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000629\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225bbd9f26-fdb0-4b85-a836-0fc46e1bba3c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00224df2325e2e984f149ff120dbc368e104\u0022\u003EDr DAVID CLARK (Labour\u2014Dunedin North):\u003C/span\u003E I want to pick up where my colleague Grant Robertson left off, because he raised the critical point: this bill is called a transformation bill. I had a look in a dictionary for what \u201Ctransformation\u201D means. It is a very simple term. It means to make a \u201CMarked change in the form, nature, or appearance of:\u201D\u2014\u201CMake a marked change in the form, nature, or appearance of:\u201D. It is not about a little patch-up here and there, which this bill is about. We approve of the patch-ups, but what we would like to see is genuine transformation, where people are actually encouraged to pay their fair share, where tax avoidance is not something to be sniffed at and laughed at, and where Mr Bennett does not chuckle away at the very suggestion that everyone should pay their fair share. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000630\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225bbd9f26-fdb0-4b85-a836-0fc46e1bba3c\u0022\u003EWe want genuine transformation, on this side of this House. We believe in having a fair society, where everybody has the opportunity to get ahead, not just the wealthiest people whom National is alongside. We want a New Zealand where middle New Zealand has the same kinds of opportunities that the wealthy few whom those members on that side are supporting have. That is the kind of transformation we want and it is not in this bill, and that is why I contend that this bill is not named in an accurate fashion. We might be better to say \u201CIncremental Change:\u201D\u2014the \u201CTaxation (Incremental Change: First Phase Simplification and Other Measures) Bill\u201D. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000631\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225bbd9f26-fdb0-4b85-a836-0fc46e1bba3c\u0022\u003EWhat we see in this bill is not genuine transformation. It is not changing those tax structures that enable tax planning aggressively to avoid paying a fair share. It is not addressing the issue of the way in which our society is becoming increasingly divided, in which we have got these growing inequalities where we have the lowest homeownership rate\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000632\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022eaf79431-1033-44f1-a633-22633da52c0d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002282b66f6c16d9468fa827ea85314f84bc\u0022\u003EDavid Bennett\u003C/span\u003E: No, rubbish\u2014rubbish.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000633\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225bbd9f26-fdb0-4b85-a836-0fc46e1bba3c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002210feba4fd901494f8a51e855895c5ade\u0022\u003EDr DAVID CLARK\u003C/span\u003E: \u2014since 1951, Mr Bennett. It is not addressing those issues, this bill. It is an incremental bill, and so I contend it would be better named the \u201CTaxation (Incremental Change: First Phase Simplification and Other Measures) Bill\u201D. I look forward to the Minister\u2019s consideration of this suggestion and to his thoughtful response.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022 data-id=\u0022c7672be0d18b4ea4a6f42a844b62a746\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000634\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022c7672be0d18b4ea4a6f42a844b62a746\u0022\u003ERt Hon WINSTON PETERS (Leader\u2014NZ First):\u003C/span\u003E I have got to confess that some of us are down here tonight for this debate on false pretences because we were told that National was going to introduce and pass through certain stages the Taxation (Transformation: First Phase Simplification and Other Measures) Bill. That is why we are here, only to find out that we have been grievously misled. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000635\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022\u003EYou will recall there was a family down in Louisiana in the United States called the Long family, and Huey Long\u2019s famous comment about taxation was\u2014very much epitomised by the National Party attitude when on the hustings, until it gets in here\u2014that taxation reform is very much like \u201CDon\u2019t tax you, don\u2019t tax me, tax that man behind the tree.\u201D That is exactly where we are now tonight, because when we talk about transformation it is quite possible that people out there who do think that the Parliament in this country has got some sort of credibility and is actually serious about the word \u201Ctransformation\u201D in the title. There is nothing very transformative in this legislation at all. In fact, all it epitomises is that in the 8th year of its term in Government, National is still flitting around the edges and does not quite know what it is doing, and it will probably be back in 6 months to change this as well. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000636\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022\u003EAnd then, on the issue of simplification, let me say that we have more tax law than the United States. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000637\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00221cf3cd36e241402396134ae47101218a\u0022\u003EHon Member\u003C/span\u003E: No, we don\u2019t. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000638\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00226055395ba7f14245981ff5c0fa880efa\u0022\u003ERt Hon WINSTON PETERS\u003C/span\u003E: We do so. It is more voluminous and more complicated than the United States, but, of course, over there if they catch someone cheating they put them behind bars for 10, 20, or more years. Here, we give them a knighthood or we cover it up. We do our utmost not to disclose it. Any transformation or simplification would certainly be attacking, for example, those trusts that are a big issue, politically, in this country, but which no one can mention tonight. With all that evidence glaringly out there in the public domain, with voluminous amounts yet to come soon to home in on all sorts of personalities in this country, and headlining the latest National Business Review on the front page, it does not make it into this legislation, which tells you that we may be wasting the taxpayers\u2019 time and, indeed, the time of this Parliament.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000639\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022\u003EClause 1 agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000640\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022\u003EThe question was put that the amendment set out on Supplementary Order Paper 171 in the name of the Hon Michael Woodhouse to clause 2 be agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000641\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022\u003EAmendment agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000642\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022\u003EClause 2 as amended agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000643\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022\u003EBill to be reported with amendment presently.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n    \u003C/div\u003E\n    \u003Cdiv class=\u0022HpsHansard\u0022\u003E\n      \u003Cp\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsProceedingHeading\u0022\u003EBills\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000644\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u00223265f9a73569449197c671b56ead2801\u0022\u003EHuman Rights Amendment Bill\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000645\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u00224fd41b406679418b88a0bb1ad0b34f06\u0022\u003EIn Committee\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000646\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u0022b698125510324e6b8804206d1cd9232a\u0022\u003EPart 1  Amendments to Human Rights Act 1993.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022 data-id=\u0022a4d0600c19a44b9e89a817f516fef623\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000647\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022a4d0600c19a44b9e89a817f516fef623\u0022\u003EJACINDA ARDERN (Labour):\u003C/span\u003E It is pleasing to be able to have an opportunity to speak again on the Human Rights Amendment Bill, which was originally brought to this House by Judith Collins. I think it is interesting that\u2014perhaps as we have seen with other transitions that portfolios have made between Judith Collins and the now Minister Amy Adams\u2014there have been a few tweaks to this bill. I would say it has actually made a rather substantive change to the Human Rights Amendment Bill for the better, and it does not actually surprise me that Amy Adams has reversed a decision that was made by her colleague Judith Collins when it was brought before the House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000648\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022\u003ETo quickly traverse the substantial parts of the Human Rights Amendment Bill\u2014and the most substantive parts are contained in Part 1\u2014currently the Human Rights Act 1993 does set out that there is room for the statutory appointment of two specialised commissioners outside the role of the Chief Human Rights Commissioner. They are the Race Relations Commissioner\u2014and, obviously, I doubt anyone in this House would dispute the need to maintain that role\u2014and the Equal Employment Opportunities Commissioner, which is also a role that I think this Committee would probably agree there is certainly still an important place for, and a role that I think has been fulfilled very well by an ex-colleague from this House, Jackie Blue.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000649\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022\u003EThe Act as it originally stood also allowed some flexibility in additional commissioners that could be appointed. We had a situation where you could have three full-time and then up to five part-time commissioners. That allowed a certain flexibility to appoint commissioners based on what needs were identified by the Human Rights Commission and also flexibility in the employment arrangement\u2014which seems fitting for the Human Rights Commission given the fact that there were part-time roles available, dependent, obviously, on the priority of those commissioner roles.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000650\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022\u003EWhat this bill does, however, is substantially change that flexibility. It provides different designations. Well, actually, it removes designations in its original form and reduces down the number of commissioners who can be available. So where we had a situation where there were three full-time and up to five part-time, we moved to the situation that we have according to clause 6 of the bill, which sets out the membership of the commission. Clause 6(1) states: \u201CThe Commission consists of the following Human Rights Commissioners: (a) the Chief Commissioner; and (b) not less than 3 and not more than 4 other Commissioners.\u201D So there is a substantive change in the amount of flexibility going from three full-time and up to five part-time\u2014a total of eight different designations that could be held.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000651\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022\u003EI think something important here, as well, is that removing part-time options does remove the flexibility that existed for the commission. It may well be that you might have a portfolio that did not require a full-time post. For instance, what if down the track we see that we have substantial issues for our seniors, and the Human Rights Commission determines it would be useful to have a role\u2014Australia has done the same\u2014to actually have someone identifiable who holds that role singly, but maybe it was a part-time role. We are now removing that ability\u2014it would be full time or nothing\u2014and you might have a situation where the human rights commissioners are holding multiple designations. I think that really muddies the waters and muddies the distinction that we want between those different commissioners. So we have lost a bit of flexibility there. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000652\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022\u003EThere has been quite a substantive change, though, since the time that the bill was introduced, between what the original Minister was suggesting and what we now have via a Supplementary Order Paper that Amy Adams has produced. I would say this side of the Chamber supports that Supplementary Order Paper. We still have substantial problems with the bill and do not intend to support the bill, but Supplementary Order Paper 175 is an improvement and something that we think we should support.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000653\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022\u003ELet me cover what that Supplementary Order Paper does. Originally, under clause 6(1A) of the Human Rights Amendment Bill, which sets out how the designation needs to work amongst those new three or four commissioners, it states: \u201CThere must be a Commissioner, other than the Chief Commissioner, appointed to lead the work of the Commission in each of the following priority areas:\u201D. Originally, the bill set out \u201C(a) disability rights\u201D, which actually is one part of the bill we absolutely support, as did roughly half of the submissions at the select committee\u2014they supported the establishment of a disability rights role within a Human Rights Commission; not before time, I have to say. It is fantastic that that has been included, and we absolutely support that. But we supported the idea of a disability rights commissioner.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000654\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022\u003EWhat the bill originally did was just set out that there must be a priority area of disability rights. There was not a specific commissioner. It was not clear necessarily how that portfolio would be managed, and so on. Clause 6(1A) then set out (b) \u201Cequal employment opportunities (including pay equity)\u201D, as if pay equity were a side thought, and \u201C(c) race relations\u201D. So those three designations were now just set out as portfolios rather than as specific designations for each of the commissioners.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000655\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022\u003EThen we had the Minister enter into it. On Tuesday, 10 May Supplementary Order Paper 175 was tabled. This has been described as a minor amendment\u2014a technical amendment to the bill. I often find that these \u201Ctechnical\u201D and \u201Cminor\u201D changes are wolves in sheep\u2019s clothing, because, actually, I would not consider this to be minor at all. The explanatory note notes that \u201CThis Supplementary Order Paper makes minor amendments to new section 8(1A) of the Human Rights Act 1993 as inserted by clause 6 of the Bill. The amendments give the designations of Disability Rights Commissioner, Equal Employment Opportunities Commissioner, and Race Relations Commissioner to the commissioners appointed to lead the work of the Human Rights Commission in the priority areas \u2026\u201D. So that was what we used to have. That was what we had as the status quo, apart from the Disability Rights Commissioner that, we accept, is the new amendment. In this bill that was brought before the House by Judith Collins, we did not have those commissioner roles before. She was getting rid of them. They were just titles, bits of lead work that needed to be done by someone. Now we have Amy Adams bringing them back\u2014bringing them back as specific commissioner designations. All I would say is\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000656\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00222aa0b524-c38d-45aa-bd5b-99c5927085f4\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002239417cfa420145c38358cdecadfc0aff\u0022\u003EClare Curran\u003C/span\u003E: Whew.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000657\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002282d9caaee889478f8777ffa58be5bd22\u0022\u003EJACINDA ARDERN\u003C/span\u003E: \u2014good. It is\u2014and perhaps \u201Cwhew\u201D. Clare Curran, you are absolutely right: \u201Cwhew\u201D is a good description. Perhaps we actually had some role in persuading the Minister\u2014who would know? But it did seem a waste of energy to us to say, on the one hand, that there is a need now to have a Disability Rights Commissioner but, in the other breath, we are going to get rid of the commissioners in the other areas. So I thank the Minister for her Supplementary Order Paper. I think it is the right thing to do.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000658\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022\u003EThe comment I have, though, is that this Supplementary Order Paper does not change the total number of commissioners that can be appointed. We have not got a change to the total number. Remember that in clauses 6(1A) and 6(1B) it sets out that there will be a chief commissioner and \u201Cnot less than three and not more than four other commissioners\u201D. Well, we have got disability rights, we have got equal employment opportunities, and we have got race relations. So basically we have our buffer of one now. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000659\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022\u003EWe used to have more discretion before this bill came to the House. The commissioner had more discretion to appoint other commissioners, and that has not been reinstated by that Supplementary Order Paper. So we are still disappointed. We do not see the rationale for that in terms of the make-up of the commission\u2014and I will come back to this later on in the discussion. That discretion\u2014much to our disappointment\u2014actually now lies to a certain degree with ministerial discretion as well, and we disagree with that. Priority areas now are in consultation. We do not think that is right. We think that there should be that absolute independence of the commission. So it is good on the one hand but does not go quite far enough, in our thinking.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000660\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022\u003EThe other question I would pose to the Minister is does the addition of the word \u201Ccommissioner\u201D, as her Supplementary Order Paper 175 sets out\u2014does a separate delegation of commissioner mean that you cannot hold multiple portfolios? So you could not be the Disability Rights Commissioner and the Equal Employment Opportunities Commissioner and/or the Race Relations Commissioner? If you can hold multiple portfolios, I guess that means that there would be greater flexibility. I am not clear in my own mind as to whether or not the Minister\u2019s Supplementary Order Paper precludes one designation from holding multiple roles, and it would be useful to know that. Of course, it sets out in the rest of clause 6(1B) that the \u201CCommissioner must lead the work of the Commission in any other priority area that is designated by the Chief Commissioner, and the Chief Commissioner may designate an area of work priority area only in accordance \u2026\u201D\u2014and this was an amendment by the select committee\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022e77494a0-1be1-432f-b492-fd160f4c119d\u0022 data-id=\u0022610229ff76004b6b8371c364ebce6963\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000661\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e77494a0-1be1-432f-b492-fd160f4c119d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022610229ff76004b6b8371c364ebce6963\u0022\u003EPEENI HENARE (Labour\u2014T\u0101maki Makaurau):\u003C/span\u003E You are spoilt for choice, Mr Chairperson. I rise to make a contribution in this stage on the Human Rights Amendment Bill. I want to preface my contribution by mentioning that just recently, approximately a month ago, I attended the Ethnic Communities\u2019 Engagement Summit hosted by Auckland University of Technology. They did a great job of bringing together a broad range of ethnic communities to discuss human rights, of all things. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000662\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e77494a0-1be1-432f-b492-fd160f4c119d\u0022\u003EWe had present at that particular forum the current Race Relations Commissioner, Dame Susan Devoy, who heard from all of the ethnic communities that were represented there just how stretched the resources of the Human Rights Commission are, from their perspective as people within the communities who are looking towards the Human Rights Commission to look after some of these issues that they are faced with every day. They were very clear in their dissatisfaction with the service they received and are afraid that that is going to get worse under this particular amendment bill. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000663\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e77494a0-1be1-432f-b492-fd160f4c119d\u0022\u003EI think my colleague Jacinda Ardern has covered off quite well the aspects of the bill that we do not agree with that are forcing us to not support this bill. In particular, I want to have a look at clause 5, \u201CFunctions of Commission\u201D, in particular where it says: \u201CSection 5(2) is amended by inserting the following paragraphs after paragraph (k) that section 5(2) is amended by inserting the following paragraphs after paragraph K: \u2018(ka) to report to either or both of the Prime Minister and the Minister responsible on any existing or proposed legislation (including subordinate legislation), administrative provision, or policy of the Government that the Commission considers may affect human rights:\u2019 \u201D \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000664\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e77494a0-1be1-432f-b492-fd160f4c119d\u0022\u003ESome of that I get. That is pretty straightforward. I think there should be a good relationship there between the relevant Minister and, of course, the commission in the important work that it does. But I take the contribution made by my colleague Dr Clark on the previous matter before the House where this seems like another process in licking your finger and putting it in the air and just wondering which way the wind blows. I am rather confident that there is no crystal ball in existence that allows that kind of a prescribed work agenda to be set to allow the Human Rights Commission to really do its job and do it well. What this tells me is that once it has put its finger in the air it has said to itself that there clearly is not a need for some of these roles\u2014that we will not need an advocate for important matters such as equal employment opportunities. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000665\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e77494a0-1be1-432f-b492-fd160f4c119d\u0022\u003EWe have had particular pieces of legislation come through this House recently where it has actually been highlighted that we do these types of roles to make sure that there are people there to represent the views of a wider community that are disaffected by these matters. Also, in terms of the disestablishment of the Race Relations Commissioner role, I would have thought at this particular point in time\u2014as I said at the beginning of my contribution about the ethnic communities\u2019 summit and the realities that they face\u2014we know that there is an increasing number of people entering and flooding into our country. Some of them find their feet, but many of them do not. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000666\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e77494a0-1be1-432f-b492-fd160f4c119d\u0022\u003EI want to just digress very briefly, Mr Chair, with your indulgence, about one of the points made by a lot of the ethnic communities there. One of the panels that I spoke on was about the relationship between the Treaty of Waitangi and ethnic communities. They wondered whether there was any provision, or any sort of plan by this Government, and those who set the test for citizenship, to allow ethnic communities and those who come into the country to be afforded some sort of training in the Treaty of Waitangi, and a bit of history around the Treaty of Waitangi. But I will leave that on the floor for consideration. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000667\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e77494a0-1be1-432f-b492-fd160f4c119d\u0022\u003ESo it is important, then, that the disestablishment of the Race Relations Commissioner as a full-time appointment is of huge concern to us. It is of huge concern to us in T\u0101maki-makau-rau, where most of the large ethnic communities find a home. A lot of them struggle. A lot of them do not know where they can go to. I am afraid that, sadly, by disestablishing these full-time appointments, we are going to find a group in our society who will not know where to go and who will not have the confidence to approach the office of the Human Rights Commission to express their views so that their views are heard and so that the role of the commission can be fulfilled in advising this Government, or producing the types of evidence and reports that are required to assist this Government in making a good policy plan moving forward, on how we help to establish the many ethnic communities that find a home here in Aotearoa New Zealand. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000668\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e77494a0-1be1-432f-b492-fd160f4c119d\u0022\u003EI want to just go back briefly to the section that I talked about with regard to the provision \u201Cto report to either or both of the Prime Minister and the Minister responsible\u201D. We have some concerns with regard to this, as we feel that the role of the commission is actually to be somewhat of an independent lens upon many of the issues that are brought to its office from across the country. Sadly, we feel that by having that kind of a relationship, where work schedules are set and where policy directions are forced upon the Human Rights Commission, we are afraid that a lot of the actual work that was done by the commission\u2014the good work\u2014is going to be lost. There will be no consideration in the future for a lot of the priority needs of the communities that seek the assistance of the Human Rights Commission. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000669\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e77494a0-1be1-432f-b492-fd160f4c119d\u0022\u003EJust in conclusion, one of the big concerns, and this is my contribution this evening, is the reduction in the number of commissioners. We have debated many times in this House about the huge workload and the programme being placed on institutions such as the Human Rights Commission and our public sector, yet we question whether or not the support is in place for them to fulfil their job properly and we question whether or not they have the resources and the capacity to actually fulfil their job and do it well. Recently I have talked about the M\u0101ori Land Court and some of the shortcomings there, and I am afraid that this amendment being proposed to the Human Rights Commission is just going to put more stress on it. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000670\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e77494a0-1be1-432f-b492-fd160f4c119d\u0022\u003EI want to finish by quoting\u2014which I have done before in this Chamber, and others have\u2014the expression of Meri Ng\u0101roto from the far north, who said \u201CHe aha te mea nui o t\u0113nei ao, m\u0101ku e k\u012B atu he tangata, he tangata, he tangata!\u201D, and I can say that he tangata come in many shapes and forms. We are afraid that the proposed amendment that we are debating this evening is going to remove the rights and the assistance and the services for those many people in our community who make up that expression \u201Che tangata, he tangata, he tangata!\u201D. Kia ora t\u0101tou.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022a94870a7-abc4-4c1b-bd1e-8a27b98a2a4c\u0022 data-id=\u00226af2be2fbfcc4f80bc09046f411270d4\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000671\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a94870a7-abc4-4c1b-bd1e-8a27b98a2a4c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00226af2be2fbfcc4f80bc09046f411270d4\u0022\u003EMOJO MATHERS (Green):\u003C/span\u003E I would like to focus my comments in support of Supplementary Order Paper 175, which reinserts the separate designation of the Race Relations Commissioner and the Equal Employment Opportunities Commissioner, as well as that of the Disability Rights Commissioner. I want to stand and acknowledge the M\u0101ori Party for lobbying and enabling that, and I acknowledge Minister Amy Adams for listening and bringing this Supplementary Order Paper to the House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000672\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a94870a7-abc4-4c1b-bd1e-8a27b98a2a4c\u0022\u003EThe Supplementary Order Paper expresses one of the major concerns that the Green Party and many submitters had about the bill, which the Minister of Justice at the time refused to address. It was clear to me from listening to the many submissions that the removal of the specific titles was perceived by the communities that these commissioners support as a lessening of the roles and a change in the specific special character and focus on disability of these roles.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000673\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a94870a7-abc4-4c1b-bd1e-8a27b98a2a4c\u0022\u003ESo the change in this Supplementary Order Paper, I would say, is not minor. It is significant. It is significant because titles do matter, and for each of the priority areas of the Human Rights Commission it is vital, in our view, that the titles of the commissioners do reflect these priority areas. Specific designations not only create clarity and increase visibility; they affirm the critical importance of these issues to the groups represented, in a way that downgrading to generalised commissioners leading the areas of priority does not.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000674\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a94870a7-abc4-4c1b-bd1e-8a27b98a2a4c\u0022\u003EThis is because the priority areas in the bill are just that\u2014priority areas that really focus on the community, where there is still a long way to go to ensure that their human rights are recognised, for disabled people are amongst the most marginalised and discriminated-against people in New Zealand. They are under-represented in employment and homeownership, they are overrepresented in prisons, and they face major challenges in accessing health and other services. Over 30 percent of complaints to the Human Rights Commission are related to disability. Gender issues are as critical as ever, with record levels of domestic and sexual violence in this country, and a significant pay gap for women in many sectors. We see appalling\u2014absolutely appalling\u2014levels of abuse and racism directed at M\u0101ori in this country on an almost daily basis. All of these factors combined affirm that this is absolutely not the time to be disestablishing the specialised designations for the human rights commissioners.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000675\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a94870a7-abc4-4c1b-bd1e-8a27b98a2a4c\u0022\u003EFirst, I want to put on record, again, that the move by the Government to create the position of a Disability Rights Commissioner was partly prompted when a member\u2019s bill by my colleague Catherine Delahunty was pulled from the members\u2019 bill ballot in 2010. That bill by Catherine established a designated disability commissioner to sit alongside the existing specialist designations of the Race Relations Commissioner and the Equal Employment Opportunities Commissioner, and it was long overdue because for far too long the needs and rights of disabled people have languished far behind those of other people, in part due to the major structural and systematic failures that disabled people face in this country, along with systematic, negative attitudes towards people living with impairment\u2014towards disabled people.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000676\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a94870a7-abc4-4c1b-bd1e-8a27b98a2a4c\u0022\u003ECatherine, at the time, was doing her best in good faith, when the Government announced that it would be creating a disabilities commissioner, under the assumption that such a position would be created to stand alongside the existing designated positions, and that is why we objected so strongly when it was found that the bill was going to go much further than that and actually restructure the commission and downgrade the specific designations. So it is a huge relief, in fact, that this Supplementary Order Paper now reinserts these specific designations. Thank you.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022dfa851f0-ef7b-4834-bc41-1b3b645a3495\u0022 data-id=\u0022e7165712e5c8423580bd110dc234f18d\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000677\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dfa851f0-ef7b-4834-bc41-1b3b645a3495\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022e7165712e5c8423580bd110dc234f18d\u0022\u003EDAVID SHEARER (Labour\u2014Mt Albert):\u003C/span\u003E This bill is opposed by Labour because, actually, it is trying to fix something that is, in fact, not broken. We actually have a very effective system of being able to protect the rights of people in New Zealand who obviously, and very frequently, do not get a voice, and for many of those people, that voice is either going to be taken away or downgraded to the point where it is not going to be able to be effective. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000678\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dfa851f0-ef7b-4834-bc41-1b3b645a3495\u0022\u003EWe do agree with the idea of having a commissioner who would protect the rights of people with a disability. That is something that is long overdue. We signed that convention in the UN in, I think, 2008, and this gives it weight and it gives it a means of being able to be carried through and supported. But what we do not and cannot accept is that with this legislation\u2014as I say, really not fixing anything because I do not believe anything is broken, and I really question the underlying motives of why this legislation has come into being\u2014why we do need to take away the specific roles of the Equal Employment Opportunities Commissioner, which is currently held by Jackie Blue, and the Race Relations Commissioner, which is currently held by Susan Devoy. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000679\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dfa851f0-ef7b-4834-bc41-1b3b645a3495\u0022\u003EJust simply by looking at the number of times that those people appear in the media\u2014and I know that is not a particularly good measure\u2014you can see they are the people who are standing up for many of the issues that are facing us today. So if we look at equal employment\u2014do we have equal employment opportunities in New Zealand? Of course we do not. We have looked at the number of times that, for example, women are not represented well; their salaries in comparable jobs are not equal. There is a very real need for ensuring that that particular commissioner stays there, if only for that simple reason: to provide the focus of work and attention on those issues. They are real issues in New Zealand that are certainly not being addressed. In fact, in many of the statistics we are actually going backwards and not forwards. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000680\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dfa851f0-ef7b-4834-bc41-1b3b645a3495\u0022\u003ELikewise in race relations\u2014why would we want to disestablish this particular role in New Zealand at a time when, for example, the city that I come from, Auckland, is the second-most diverse city in the world? There is a need for looking at the opportunities, the rights, the way that people are treated in our society with regard to what kind of ethnicity they have, what background they hold, and to make sure that somebody is specifically standing up for them and protecting their rights and making sure that they get a fair go. This has been longstanding in New Zealand. We have had a Race Relations Commissioner for a very long time, and this Government wants to disestablish the position. This is a lessening and a weakening of our system of rights in New Zealand, and it is for that reason that we are opposing this legislation. That is the first reason. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000681\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dfa851f0-ef7b-4834-bc41-1b3b645a3495\u0022\u003EThe second issue is the independence and the operations of this office as well. I unfortunately happened to be on the select committee that was looking into the operations of the Government Communications Security Bureau in 2013 and I heard John Key, when the Chief Human Rights Commissioner came before our select committee\u2014John Key clearly did not agree with the findings of the Chief Human Rights Commissioner. He said that the Human Rights Commission needed to pull its socks up, implying that it was going to lose its money, the $9.3 million that it is given every year in order to do its job effectively. That is the really scary, frightening aspect of putting an office like that too closely in sync with the Government, and what this bill will do is ensure that the office itself will have to pass its work programmes in front of the Minister. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000682\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dfa851f0-ef7b-4834-bc41-1b3b645a3495\u0022\u003EThe Minister might be a very honourable person, but I do not believe that it is healthy for our Parliament, for our society, to have a situation where the commissioners need to pass their work past a Minister. There should be a complete separation, and there should be no threats being able to be levelled at one of those commissioners by the Prime Minister, or whoever. We might have good Ministers now, but Ministers, like all people, come under enormous amounts of stress, their situation is criticised, and perhaps one of their first reactions is to attack back at the independence and the ability of these people to do their jobs. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000683\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dfa851f0-ef7b-4834-bc41-1b3b645a3495\u0022\u003EThe third issue is that this move threatens what we believe are international minimum standards. It has been criticised by the United Nations Committee on the Elimination of Racial Discrimination, with particular emphasis on the abolition of the Race Relations Commissioner. The move down this track does nothing for the reputation of New Zealand internationally\u2014it does a lot of harm. It is not just a re-juggling, a change that is supposed to make this more effective; it is actually, in some ways, going to bring some discredit to New Zealand in terms of the way it is going. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000684\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dfa851f0-ef7b-4834-bc41-1b3b645a3495\u0022\u003EThese are, I think, three very powerful reasons why we do not need to change this piece of legislation. I have yet to see and have yet to hear a rational, strong argument by the Minister and those who are in support of this bill for why this bill needs to go through. It has taken a year for it to get from when it was last read, to now, so it is not exactly urgent anyway, but irrespective of that, I do not see the reason why we are spending valuable parliamentary time on a bill that does not purport to do anything that is going to be remotely positive. In fact, it is going to take away, as I say, the focus on critical areas and critically weakened areas within our society that need to be stood up for and supported. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000685\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dfa851f0-ef7b-4834-bc41-1b3b645a3495\u0022\u003EWe agree with the introduction of a Disability Rights Commissioner and support that inclusion, but taking away the Equal Employment Opportunities Commissioner in the form of the current holder of that role, Jackie Blue\u2014actually, a former National MP who, to her credit, has come out and criticised this Government. She has not stood back and withheld her criticism. She has been, I believe, a very effective commissioner. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000686\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dfa851f0-ef7b-4834-bc41-1b3b645a3495\u0022\u003EThe Race Relations Commissioner, again appointed by this Government, in the person of Susan Devoy, was actually highly criticised when she got the job. People said: \u201CWhy has she got the job?\u201D. I think she has done a very credible job. She has actually stood up for and done what we expected her to do. Sometimes I did not always agree with her, but I have to say she has tried to act as independently as possible. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000687\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dfa851f0-ef7b-4834-bc41-1b3b645a3495\u0022\u003EBut the fact that those two people can do that speaks volumes about why we need to have those people in our society and as part of the structure of our institutions. Take those away and we lose something\u2014those people who might be supported by those very institutions lose an advocate, and that is an important point. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000688\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dfa851f0-ef7b-4834-bc41-1b3b645a3495\u0022\u003ESecondly, as I said before, the independence of these groups is being threatened by the fact that their work programme and the ministerial oversight is so strong that it will influence the way that they are able to operate independently. I think that is such a backward step. This Government used to call the former Labour Government nanny State; this is actually more than that. This is about a steel grip around our independent organisations, pushing them in the direction that the Government wants to go. Thirdly, I do not believe that it actually helps our international standing in the world when we sign up to these agreements.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022dc6c0f88-e781-476d-bca1-d1bf9b69302b\u0022 data-id=\u0022bdac5dc86f7545109e70bf7a36fe8f9c\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000689\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dc6c0f88-e781-476d-bca1-d1bf9b69302b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022bdac5dc86f7545109e70bf7a36fe8f9c\u0022\u003EHon AMY ADAMS (Minister of Justice):\u003C/span\u003E I will take a call this evening on the Human Rights Amendment Bill and address a number of the issues that I have heard discussed around the Committee this evening. Firstly, it is not entirely clear to me that Mr Shearer, who has just resumed his seat, and Mr Henare, I think it was, who spoke earlier in the debate, are aware of the Government\u2019s Supplementary Order Paper 175\u2014which I will talk to in a minute\u2014which makes it very clear that, far from disestablishing any positions, they are absolutely being maintained in name and in function. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000690\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dc6c0f88-e781-476d-bca1-d1bf9b69302b\u0022\u003EWhat I want to take the Committee through is that the point of the bill was to address the fact that, at the moment, the structure of the Human Rights Commission limits the ability of the Commission to act as effectively as it could, so at the moment the Commission can only act with three full-time members and a number of part-time members. It might interest the Committee to know that, actually, at the moment the commission has the equivalent of 4.7 commissioners, so we have three full-time and a number of part-time commissioners, who make up 4.7 full-time slots if you take them out to a full-time equivalent. What we have found in talking with the commission is that, actually, for those part-time commissioners, although they have done some excellent work, it has really impinged upon their ability to take full part in the life of the commission as what they are, first and foremost, which is human rights commissioners. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000691\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dc6c0f88-e781-476d-bca1-d1bf9b69302b\u0022\u003EThe change of the structure of the commission is an important one, and one that the commission supports, which is to say that, actually, to have four or five full-time commissioners absolutely preserves the resourcing of the commission, and that is the point I wanted to make very clearly. We are not reducing the total number of commissioners. Four to five full-time commissioners is the same as is available at the moment, and slightly more if needed, but it means that each one of those commissioners is a full-time human rights commissioner and is not finding that they are losing a large part of their working day on administrative matters. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000692\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dc6c0f88-e781-476d-bca1-d1bf9b69302b\u0022\u003EI have spent a number of my working years in part-time roles. I can tell you that when you are in a part-time role, you spend a huge amount of your time doing the administrative meetings that everyone has to do, and that leaves you very little time to do your job, and that is certainly what our part-time commissioners were finding. So by making them all full-time commissioners, we expect, and the commission expects, that they will be far more able to take an active role in the life of the commission. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000693\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dc6c0f88-e781-476d-bca1-d1bf9b69302b\u0022\u003EI want to come back to this point around this alleged disestablishment of the roles. I want to read what the bill said initially, which made it very clear that there must be a commissioner, other than the Chief Human Rights Commissioner, who will lead the work of the commission in respect of disability rights\u2014which is, of course, the new commissioner position\u2014equal employment opportunities, including pay equity; and race relations. All the way through, the bill has been extremely clear that there has to be a full-time commissioner appointed to lead the work in each of those roles. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000694\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dc6c0f88-e781-476d-bca1-d1bf9b69302b\u0022\u003ETalking with my colleagues in the M\u0101ori Party, they felt very strongly that the title itself had to be provided in statute, and, look, I was very open to that. So we have put up the Supplementary Order Paper, which makes it clear that after each of those lines, it now goes on to say \u201C(the Disability Rights Commissioner)\u201D, \u201C(the Equal Employment Opportunities Commissioner)\u201D, and \u201C(the Race Relations Commissioner)\u201D. The roles were always in the legislation, the roles have never been disestablished, and now, with the Supplementary Order Paper, we are making it very clear that the title also remains. If the title gives this Committee some comfort, then that is wonderful; I am very happy to support that. The roles were always there. They were there in substance, and they remain there. So to stand in this Chamber and suggest that the roles are being disestablished is completely misleading and, I would say, somewhat disingenuous. From the day this bill was introduced, it has been absolutely clear in statute that there would always be a requirement for commissioners to be leading each one of those pieces of work and, in fact, as I have said, now we have made it very clear that the titles are also not being removed, and I would argue that there was no requirement they ever would be. But, as I said, if it gives the Committee some comfort, we are very happy to do that. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000695\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dc6c0f88-e781-476d-bca1-d1bf9b69302b\u0022\u003EThe other allegation that has been made is one that, somehow, the bill removes the independence of the chief commissioner. Again, I dispute that. The bill makes it very clear that the chief commissioner has the right to determine other priority areas. One of the things I like about the structure of this bill is that although we have created the new Disability Rights Commissioner and we have protected the statutory roles of the Equal Employment Opportunities Commissioner and the Race Relations Commissioner, we have also made it very clear that we have provided the capability for the chief commissioner to identify other priority areas. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000696\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dc6c0f88-e781-476d-bca1-d1bf9b69302b\u0022\u003EHuman rights are not a static beast. We are living in a period of incredible change with the advent of the digital economy, and the way we live our lives is changing. It is absolutely clear to me that in the period that this legislation is current, there will be the need to have human rights commissioners focused on other pieces of work. We wanted to make sure that the chief commissioner absolutely had the capability and the legislative scope to do that. Under the bill, the chief commissioner has the absolute right to determine any of those other priority areas. Yes, there is an obligation to consult with the other commissioners, as there is an obligation to consult with the Minister, but the Minister does not control it, the Minister does not dictate it, and the Minister cannot veto it. You would expect any chief commissioner working under the responsible Minister to at least advise and seek the views of the Government. That chief commissioner can ignore them if he or she chooses, and that is very clear in the bill\u2014it is only an obligation to consult. I would suggest that to not do that would be absolutely poor practice, and I would not think anyone would support that. But it cannot be said that somehow the Government has the control or that that independence is in any way being diminished. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000697\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dc6c0f88-e781-476d-bca1-d1bf9b69302b\u0022\u003EThe last comment I wanted to pick up on was, again, Mr Shearer\u2019s suggestion that somehow this bill was being looked down on by the international community and we were being criticised or it degrades us. In actual fact, I was at the UN\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000698\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022e3bbaefbc69b450090e1b2b68db1afba\u0022\u003EJacinda Ardern\u003C/span\u003E: We were. The UN criticised us. That\u2019s why you changed the bill.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000699\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dc6c0f88-e781-476d-bca1-d1bf9b69302b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022920b0d153b0f48ac847dc5681c24ecc5\u0022\u003EHon AMY ADAMS\u003C/span\u003E: \u2014no\u2014Human Rights Council in Geneva this year, and it was very clear\u2014in fact, it encouraged the Government to pass this bill without delay. So I would just say to the Labour Party, which is opposing it, that the Human Rights Council of the UN urged the Government to pass this legislation without delay. That is what we are doing, and I think the Labour Party has to look at itself to ask why it is opposing legislation that the UN Human Rights Council has urged this Government to pass without delay, that the Human Rights Commission is anxious to get under way with, that creates the new role of Disability Rights Commissioner, that provides the scope and capability for the chief commissioner to develop other priority areas, and that ensures that they have the full resourcing to do that. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000700\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dc6c0f88-e781-476d-bca1-d1bf9b69302b\u0022\u003EIt is an excellent bill. I look forward to this House passing it.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002247c29b78-eee0-4c91-afdf-7b07be780e1a\u0022 data-id=\u0022d2e945c0afbe4c0db7771612d80c2218\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000701\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002247c29b78-eee0-4c91-afdf-7b07be780e1a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022d2e945c0afbe4c0db7771612d80c2218\u0022\u003EDENIS O\u2019ROURKE (NZ First):\u003C/span\u003E Every party in this House wants an effective and efficient Human Rights Commission\u2014that much, I think, is common amongst us all. The only question, then, is: how do you achieve that? On this occasion New Zealand First agrees with the Government and does not agree with either the Greens or the Labour Party. The reasons for that are fairly clear in my mind. Firstly, I listened to David Shearer\u2019s speech and he said that the bill is not fixing anything\u2014for reasons I will give later, I think that it does\u2014he questioned underlying motives, which he did not specify; he said that there would be a weakening of rights, which does not occur in this bill; he questions independence, which is not actually threatened at all; and he says that, internationally, minimum standards, especially in relation to the Race Relations Commissioner, would be reduced, thus resulting in international reputational damage. I do not see any of that occurring either. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000702\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002247c29b78-eee0-4c91-afdf-7b07be780e1a\u0022\u003EThe truth about the matter is that if you actually look at what the bill says, it says that there must be a commissioner other than the chief commissioner appointed to lead the work in each of the priority areas, which are actually specified: disability rights, which the Greens are particularly interested in, and that is great; equal employment opportunities, which I know the Labour Party is particularly interested in, and that is great, too; and race relations, which we are all very interested in. But the important thing here is that the chief commissioner is also able to designate a commissioner to lead work in other priority areas, and that is a leap forward as far as I am concerned. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000703\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002247c29b78-eee0-4c91-afdf-7b07be780e1a\u0022\u003EWe in New Zealand First, for example, think that there is a lot of work to do as far as the elderly are concerned and some of the rights that they are not being delivered in this country. In fact, ageism is a really serious problem in New Zealand. I hope that the chief commissioner will have a look at that. Of course, he will have to consult about those additional designations with the other commissioners\u2014and, yes, with the Minister\u2014but I see no harm in consultation on that. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000704\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002247c29b78-eee0-4c91-afdf-7b07be780e1a\u0022\u003ENew Zealand First does not agree with the other parties about the perceived loss of specialised commissioners. If you look at Supplementary Order Paper 175 you will see straight away that the titles or designations are actually restored in that anyway. The new approach will lead to commissioners being appointed to lead priority areas but that still allows the flexibility that those commissioners can work in other areas as well. I think that is very important. I think that is one of the things that is fixed in this legislation. I think it will make the Human Rights Commission more effective and more efficient, and surely we all want that.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000705\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e0192ed9-5715-4f6c-bd52-8db4f3466087\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022f97f123283be4ff39d2b0e73529f79fd\u0022\u003EHon David Cunliffe\u003C/span\u003E: More efficient to abolish it altogether.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000706\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002247c29b78-eee0-4c91-afdf-7b07be780e1a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00226743b5b650cd40f5bc2ca3e655fb4270\u0022\u003EDENIS O\u2019ROURKE\u003C/span\u003E: See, that is the kind of comment that I hear from Mr Cunliffe: \u201Cabolish it altogether.\u201D Can that member have actually read this bill if he is going to make an inane and idiotic statement like that? Can he have actually read the bill if he is going to make a stupid statement like that? Obviously not\u2014obviously not. What the bill actually says is that the decisions made about what those lead areas are going to be has to be done in accordance with the strategy that all of the commissioners have to agree upon. The Justice and Electoral Committee actually added the words to amended section 8(1B): \u201C\u2026 in accordance with the strategic direction and the general nature of activities determined by the Commission under section 7(1) \u2026\u201D. So it shows that what is going to guide its decision making in this is a strategy, and I am very glad to see that, because if it had not been in this bill it is exactly what New Zealand First would have moved to achieve. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000707\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002247c29b78-eee0-4c91-afdf-7b07be780e1a\u0022\u003EThose new priority areas will have to be allocated in accordance with the strategic direction determined by the commission as a whole. That is, I think, one of the things that is being fixed in the bill. We do not have the concern that some of the other parties have over the fact that the Minister is to be consulted over the strategy in those priority areas. There is nothing wrong with consultation if that is all it is\u2014consultation. Consultation with the Minister of Justice is completely appropriate, as it would be with anyone else who has a direct interest, but consultation does not mean direction. Direction would be inappropriate, and I am sure that if direction was attempted with that commission, it would be rejected. So I do not see an issue with that either. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000708\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002247c29b78-eee0-4c91-afdf-7b07be780e1a\u0022\u003EThe issue that I want to end on is simply this: the bill does fix something else in that it makes sure that the people appointed will be suitable people for the lead areas. This is something that I would like the Green Party in particular to consider, because I know that it is especially concerned about disability issues, and I have great respect for its expertise in that area. But it says that you have to have a commissioner whose only job is to do that. I do not think that is necessarily good for the commission, and I think that as long as suitable people are selected then there is not going to be a problem. If you look at new section 13, inserted by clause 9, you will see that the Minister has to have regard not just to their own personal opinion but to some specified criteria. The first is an understanding of the principles and practice relating to the relevant priority area\u2014the relevant priority area; secondly, an appreciation of the issues in the area internationally; and thirdly, an ability to carry out the functions specified in new section 16, which itself has actually been substituted to ensure skills and leadership ability and the ability to contribute to public debate. So if you look at all of those criteria together I am sure that this regime will result in a more effective and more efficient Human Rights Commission where people will have specified roles, leadership to exercise, special expertise backing that up, and they will also, however, work together as a commission on everything. I think that one of the defects in the existing legislation is that it did not make that very clear. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000709\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002247c29b78-eee0-4c91-afdf-7b07be780e1a\u0022\u003EI think that this is a prescription for a much, much better Human Rights Commission, one that will work together in an integrated way and one that will understand what each area is doing, and yet, at the same time, will mean that that leadership that is necessary in those priority areas will still be exercised. So I think that is a great balance. It is a big step forward. I do not for the life of me understand why either the Labour or the Green Party are opposing it, because it is good legislation. We do not hesitate to say so when that is true, and we will be voting for it. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00222df33ee5-23d6-441c-a9ba-6495aa69f9fd\u0022 data-id=\u0022a03bbf72f2164ead8ab1cc7dc80a2049\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000710\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00222df33ee5-23d6-441c-a9ba-6495aa69f9fd\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022a03bbf72f2164ead8ab1cc7dc80a2049\u0022\u003EDENISE ROCHE (Green):\u003C/span\u003E I just want to clear something up: the Greens\u2019 position on this bill has changed from time to time, and with the introduction of Supplementary Order Paper 175, in the Minister\u2019s name, we have revised our positon. If that Supplementary Order Paper passes, then we will be supporting the bill. The reason we are doing that is that we see it as an act of good faith. The reason we see it as an act of good faith is\u2014if some people in this House cast their minds back, they may remember\u2014that in October 2010 the Greens had a member\u2019s bill in the name of Catherine Delahunty pulled, which was called the Human Rights (Disability Commissioner) Amendment Bill. That bill, essentially, set out that the Human Rights Commission would have a designated disability commissioner, because we do not actually agree with the New Zealand First speaker who suggests that you can do everything. Generalisation means that specific attention wanders, and that is what we need if we are to address some of the issues facing the disability community.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000711\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00222df33ee5-23d6-441c-a9ba-6495aa69f9fd\u0022\u003EAs well as creating a designated disability commissioner, Catherine Delahunty\u2019s bill also spelt out the specific criteria for the appointment and an extensive list of the functions that that disability commissioner would undertake. It was developed in extensive consultation with the disability community. One of the things that the disability community said it really wanted from a disability commissioner was for that person to have experienced having a disability, for them to actively engage with different communities or persons living with impediments\u2014they needed to be an advocate for their interests, rights, and well-being, and, crucially, they needed to assist the Government to work towards the implementation of the United Nations Convention on the Rights of Persons with Disabilities. This was all part of a bill that was pulled from the ballot. When the Government said in 2010 that it was looking to introduce legislation that would enshrine in legislation the position of a disabilities commissioner, we pulled that bill in good faith. So you can imagine that we were very, very disappointed when this bill came to the House and it was not actually at all like what we had hoped for. In fact, it looked like it was set to disestablish the specific positions and to just have them covered by broad portfolio roles. That has been our major concern all the way through: that the Equal Employment Opportunities Commissioner and the Race Relations Commissioner and the work of disability would basically be portfolios rather than specific commission roles.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000712\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00222df33ee5-23d6-441c-a9ba-6495aa69f9fd\u0022\u003EThe other thing that we found extremely difficult about the introduction of this bill, as it was written when it went to the first reading, was that it did look like it was restructuring the Human Rights Commission by stealth. We certainly believe that we still need designated commissioners working within the Human Rights Commission, with the Chief Commissioner, and that they are specifically addressing the issues of each of those areas. We still need an equal employment opportunities commissioner. We just have to look at the whole situation with the Kristine Bartlett equal pay case, where the Crown is currently negotiating what the principles are in order to ensure that women\u2019s work is valued at the same amount as traditionally male occupations. There is still a pay gap of between 11.8 percent and 14 percent for the average hourly rate for women workers. So we have not achieved pay equity yet. Women are still facing barriers to leadership in the workplace, both in the public and private sectors, with only around about 43 percent of women in senior positions at board level. How can we know these facts if we have not got someone keeping their eye on it? The role of these commissioners is to advocate in these areas. We would not necessarily know this information if we did not have someone set to do it.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000713\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00222df33ee5-23d6-441c-a9ba-6495aa69f9fd\u0022\u003EWe also need a specific Race Relations Commissioner. The New Zealand Federation of Multicultural Councils rightly pointed out in its submission that the \u201Cgenericisation\u201D or \u201Cmainstreaming\u201D of positions that are dedicated to race relations functions means that the functions are diminished and absorbed, which is why it stated that it is therefore all the more important that the designation of Race Relations Commissioner itself not be disestablished. We know from its report, which it released last year, Our Multicultural Future, that non-P\u0101keh\u0101 New Zealanders still continue to face massive discrimination in New Zealand, particularly in the areas of education and employment, with people who have the requisite qualifications and experience facing difficulties finding commensurate employment and having their previous employment overseas recognised. The 2012 Statistics New Zealand report revealed that 187,000 New Zealanders had experienced racial discrimination and that nearly one in five Asian New Zealanders has also reportedly experienced racism in the last 12 months. That harassment ranges from a variety of bad behaviour, including workplace harassment, street cat-calling, applying for work, or dealing with the police. So it is clear that New Zealanders have a lot more work to do and that a specific Race Relations Commissioner is part of that.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000714\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00222df33ee5-23d6-441c-a9ba-6495aa69f9fd\u0022\u003EWe also support, and we specifically need, the Disability Rights Commissioner, and that is the major reason we are supporting this bill, because it creates that in legislation for the first time. We need a Disability Rights Commissioner because of the shocking 60 percent unemployment rate among people with disabilities. Disabled people are also less likely to have a formal qualification, with 67 percent holding a school or tertiary qualification compared with 85 percent of adults with no disabilities. Sixty-four percent of disabled adults have an annual gross income of $30,000 or lower, compared with 45 percent of the abled community. So, overall, it is clear that in this country we are not doing more to enable New Zealanders with disabilities to fully participate in everything that our country has to offer, and that is why we need a Disability Rights Commissioner to advocate for that and to make it happen. Thank you.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022e0192ed9-5715-4f6c-bd52-8db4f3466087\u0022 data-id=\u0022a8dadddfb50b4d479f10e1482d7ea7b1\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000715\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e0192ed9-5715-4f6c-bd52-8db4f3466087\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022a8dadddfb50b4d479f10e1482d7ea7b1\u0022\u003EHon DAVID CUNLIFFE (Labour\u2014New Lynn):\u003C/span\u003E I rise to reaffirm Labour\u2019s opposition to this bill, and I do so on two grounds in particular. Firstly, this bill undermines the independence of the Human Rights Commission. It makes it subject to consultation with a Minister, which is the antithesis of the independence required of an independent body, such as the Human Rights Commission, which is charged, sometimes, to lean against Government policy. Therefore, making its work programme subject to ministerial consultation is entirely the opposite of what would make a more effective and more efficient commission. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000716\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e0192ed9-5715-4f6c-bd52-8db4f3466087\u0022\u003ESecondly, although it is true the Government has introduced a late Supplementary Order Paper that restores the title of the Equal Employment Opportunities Commissioner and the Race Relations Commissioner, which we welcome, we still do not believe that the process there has been transparent, nor was the original bill one that would uphold New Zealand\u2019s reputation, and I will come back to that reason and the evidence for it. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000717\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e0192ed9-5715-4f6c-bd52-8db4f3466087\u0022\u003EThirdly, this bill still reduces the number of commissioners, thereby limiting the scope of the commission. Taken as a whole, Labour continues to believe that this was not a bill that was required, and that the so-called fix is worse than the problem. It reduces the effectiveness and efficiency of the commission. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000718\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e0192ed9-5715-4f6c-bd52-8db4f3466087\u0022\u003EMay I also introduce, as I set out the case here, the fact that the Government\u2019s attempts to weaken the Human Rights Commission\u2014because that is what it amounts to; or to fetter it or to hog-tie it to the whims of the Minister of the day\u2014is in keeping with other efforts that the Government has made to weaken the independent statutory watchdogs of our polity. The underfunding of the Ombudsman is something that is now so well-known across the community, and the backlogs that have been created by the current Government\u2019s arrogant and out-of-touch efforts to constrain its resourcing are such that we are faced with a position where Ministers thumb their noses at Official Information Act requests awaiting an appeal that might take a year to come. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000719\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e0192ed9-5715-4f6c-bd52-8db4f3466087\u0022\u003EWe have also noticed, in terms of independent watchdogs, the weakness in the Overseas Investment Commission, which has been thrown\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000720\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022893adc11-ce4e-419c-a079-08f04b3d75f5\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022597629daca61490290efdf1f3069a18e\u0022\u003EThe CHAIRPERSON (Lindsay Tisch)\u003C/span\u003E: Order! That is not in this. Come back to the bill.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000721\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e0192ed9-5715-4f6c-bd52-8db4f3466087\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022d02ebfcd3583499a8711a6d84fe91fe2\u0022\u003EHon DAVID CUNLIFFE\u003C/span\u003E: \u2014into stark relief, no doubt, by the Panama Papers.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000722\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e0192ed9-5715-4f6c-bd52-8db4f3466087\u0022\u003EComing back to this bill, our concern is that the weakening of the Human Rights Commission would be amongst the factors that Transparency International will consider next time around when it gives New Zealand a further downgrade. Why does this matter? Because New Zealand\u2019s international reputation as a trading nation, let alone our hoped-for position as an upstanding member of the international community committed to the rule of international law and human rights, is downgraded by this successive top-slicing of these independent institutions by a Government that is showing every sign of \u201Cthird-term-itis\u201D, wanting to take more power to the executive, undermining the role of the watchdogs\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000723\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022badb0a39-849c-462a-b32f-77fc017c9fc2\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00221de3946612f647558508c4417b53c4ce\u0022\u003EHon Simon Bridges\u003C/span\u003E: The member knows all about that. He\u2019s been there, done that, written the book.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000724\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e0192ed9-5715-4f6c-bd52-8db4f3466087\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022021f3c5b59e14d6186589f279f8bb290\u0022\u003EHon DAVID CUNLIFFE\u003C/span\u003E: \u2014undermining the role of the legislature. Oh, Mr Bridges. Mr Bridges has not learnt the lessons of the Northland campaign, where he showed up and offered a whole few bridges, and the good people of Northland sent him packing.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000725\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022893adc11-ce4e-419c-a079-08f04b3d75f5\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002297c20049f01a40fcaee1683acfeabca2\u0022\u003EThe CHAIRPERSON (Lindsay Tisch)\u003C/span\u003E: Order! Come back to the bill.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000726\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e0192ed9-5715-4f6c-bd52-8db4f3466087\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00221e50ddf4ecd6441fa4c560119d72fe21\u0022\u003EHon DAVID CUNLIFFE\u003C/span\u003E: I am responding to an interjection, Mr Chairman, which I am sure you found as amusing as the members opposite. Look how enlivened they are. Look how enlivened they are by the debate.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000727\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002257e41e9d-285b-4fb3-847d-a63820ae7137\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022962a391c16a74648a74fbd89ddc6b574\u0022\u003EChris Bishop\u003C/span\u003E: You couldn\u2019t even be bothered running.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000728\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e0192ed9-5715-4f6c-bd52-8db4f3466087\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022d6b39d682ffe4a02bf8427d02407938a\u0022\u003EHon DAVID CUNLIFFE\u003C/span\u003E: Mr Bishop, the also-ran from Lower Hutt, is just looking across at his colleague in jealous admiration\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000729\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e77494a0-1be1-432f-b492-fd160f4c119d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022683e92dbc3d04cdba166fa5ec766debb\u0022\u003EPeeni Henare\u003C/span\u003E: Get involved in Northland.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000730\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e0192ed9-5715-4f6c-bd52-8db4f3466087\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002234746a083f7c41b88fcaf149103bae28\u0022\u003EHon DAVID CUNLIFFE\u003C/span\u003E: \u2014of his also-ran in Northland. I am surrounded by the sons of Ng\u0101puhi, and they are looking across the Chamber and saying \u201CMr Bridges, good luck.\u201D \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000731\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e0192ed9-5715-4f6c-bd52-8db4f3466087\u0022\u003EBut look, back to the issues that concern us here. All revelry and joking aside\u2014it is late in the evening\u2014the issue here is that New Zealand\u2019s reputation counts for something. If we want to be a trading nation, if we want to expand our markets overseas, then our reputation for integrity has got to be beyond question. It is a matter of concern to New Zealanders that we are slipping down the rankings for the anti-corruption index and Transparency International, and it is, in part, because the Government is doing successive small weakenings of our independent watchdog agencies\u2014and that is what this is. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000732\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e0192ed9-5715-4f6c-bd52-8db4f3466087\u0022\u003ELet me come to the second issue here, which is concerned with Supplementary Order Paper 175. The Government initially stripped the explicit titles of the Equal Employment Opportunities Commissioner and the Race Relations Commissioner out of the legislation governing the Human Rights Commission. Although we support, as our Green colleagues do, the appointment of a disabilities commissioner, we are very concerned to see those titles withdrawn. It might seem semantic, but how would a commissioner stand up in public and uphold the specific weight of an office if that office\u2019s title has been removed? And why do it, other than to subsume that?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000733\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022bbca4460c6b548acb16911ec3d7b9a0c\u0022\u003EHon Member\u003C/span\u003E: The SOP.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000734\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e0192ed9-5715-4f6c-bd52-8db4f3466087\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00221fc75a870654420c9676d4c4df30fdde\u0022\u003EHon DAVID CUNLIFFE\u003C/span\u003E: I know that the Supplementary Order Paper does, but I am just saying that we in the Labour Opposition have not been impressed by the original displayed intent, nor the lack of transparency in the process. It is only after the United Nations itself criticised the Government for the original drafting, and only after, word has it, some of the Government\u2019s coalition partners turned turtle on it and it lost the numbers to get the bill through in its original form, that it has had to compromise and come back to the House with its tail between its legs, offering up this Supplementary Order Paper in a last-ditch attempt to get the bill through.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000735\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e0192ed9-5715-4f6c-bd52-8db4f3466087\u0022\u003EWhy such a humiliating back-down for a Government, on a bill that has been before the House since January last year\u2014and done in Budget week. Has the Government nothing better to do? Has it nothing better to do? There are huge issues facing New Zealand\u2014climate change, homelessness, poverty\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000736\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022893adc11-ce4e-419c-a079-08f04b3d75f5\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00226419c759146c4342afcf877610ba5dd8\u0022\u003EThe CHAIRPERSON (Lindsay Tisch)\u003C/span\u003E: Order! If I have to interrupt the member again on relevancy, I will terminate his speech.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000737\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e0192ed9-5715-4f6c-bd52-8db4f3466087\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00227cc761bbd27c45089854a2faacbb5610\u0022\u003EHon DAVID CUNLIFFE\u003C/span\u003E: Thank you, Mr Chairman. Therefore, we have had a considered reflection on this bill, and we maintain our opposition to it. It is, in summary, based on three grounds\u2014firstly, the fettering and limitation of the commission by requiring consultation with the Minister of the day, and I will say a couple more words on that. The Minister, of course, represents the executive. The whole point of having an independent statutory commissioner is to weigh against the executive by taking an independent statutory perspective. The commission has its own resourcing; it has its own media. It is not subject to Order in Council. It is not subject to Cabinet collective responsibility. That is the whole point. It is a creature created by statute, created by this House. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000738\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e0192ed9-5715-4f6c-bd52-8db4f3466087\u0022\u003EThe commission has delegated statutory powers that depend upon not only its actual independence but its perceived independence. That perceived independence is under threat, as is the actual independence, when its work plan has got to be consulted on with the Minister. Consultation, in this context, is a loaded term. It means that the civil servant has to walk up to Minister Adams\u2019 or Minister Collins\u2019 office, as it was when the bill was drafted, to say: \u201CWell, this is what we want to do. What do you think?\u201D. The Minister says \u201CWell, I really don\u2019t want you doing (a), (e), and (f) on that list.\u201D, and some sort of compromise might be worked out. That is what consultation amounts to. That is inappropriate, both in substance and in perception, and that is the principal reason why this Labour Party continues its opposition to this bill. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000739\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e0192ed9-5715-4f6c-bd52-8db4f3466087\u0022\u003EIf we want to have a reputation for integrity, if we want that to underpin our position in international affairs, then we have to have not only the substance but also the recognition of that independence, and that does not mean fettering independent watchdog agencies to consultation with a member of the executive. It is not appropriate. It is actually the antithesis of what the commission should be. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000740\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e0192ed9-5715-4f6c-bd52-8db4f3466087\u0022\u003ESo, summing up, we have got three reasons why we are continuing to be opposed to the bill: the first is the consultation process, the second is the lack of transparency and the original formation of the withdrawal of the titles of the Race Relations Commissioner and the Equal Employment Opportunities Commissioner, and the third is the overall limitation on the number of commissioner positions. Thank you very much.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022 data-id=\u00223593ae7da1e242238b2b0cc7319d04e8\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000741\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00223593ae7da1e242238b2b0cc7319d04e8\u0022\u003EJACINDA ARDERN (Labour):\u003C/span\u003E I think we need to be absolutely clear about what Minister Adams has and has not done with her amendments to this bill. This bill does not simply reinstate positions that were removed and everything is back to the status quo. The current legislation allows for there to be up to three full-time and up to five part-time commissioners and for the flexibility to appoint around what those roles need to be. Of course, we have added the Disability Rights Commissioner, the specific role, and we applaud that. Obviously it means that we would then have four commissioners. But what this bill does is it means that we could, essentially, end up with fewer commissioners than what the original Human Rights Act allowed us to have. I want to be absolutely clear. Thank you, Minister, for your Supplementary Order Paper 175. We support the Supplementary Order Paper. It was the right thing to do, to reinstate those specific designations, but the bill still has not changed the fact that the commission will consist of the Chief Human Rights Commissioner and no fewer than three and no more than four other commissioners. Even if they take the maximum, we will still have fewer commissioners. That is a matter of fact.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000742\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022\u003EI am yet to see a rationale from this Government as to why we would want to reduce the representative roles that commissioners have within the Human Rights Commission. Why would we want to reduce their capacity? They have always used their flexibility appropriately in that regard. They have sometimes used their part-time roles as a 0.3 and up to a 0.5, according to what the needs of the commission were. But it seems suspicious to me that at the same time there have been criticisms that the chief executive of the Human Rights Commission is drawing a salary that required, as I understand, a special exemption from the State Services Commission. At the same time as we are drawing higher salaries for our chief executives, we are reducing the number of commissioners. So I am somewhat suspicious about that. Unless the Minister can tell me that she fully exhausted all of the rationale as to why we would not want to give the capacity to have the same number of commissioners as we have now, then I will remain suspicious as to why we are doing that\u2014unless I hear some rationale as to why we would reduce that representation. That is one of the reasons that we have had concerns and previously had opposition to this bill. Thank you for the designations, but I still have significant suspicions.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000743\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022\u003EPerhaps the Minister might want to rise, and if she is perhaps suggesting that this is not an issue of concern, why is there not a Supplementary Order Paper that, at the same time as she has included the specific designations, reinstates the number of commissioners that it is possible to have? It was one of the options canvassed by the regulatory impact statement. It looked at just simply retaining that flexibility. In fact, one of the whole reasons we had this bill in the first place was a complaint that there was a lack of flexibility for the commissioners to be appointed. Well, now we have got a situation where the Minister, rightly, has said we will have a specific Equal Employment Opportunities Commissioner, we will have a specific Race Relations Commissioner, and we will have a specific Disability Rights Commissioner. Actually, if you include the Chief Human Rights Commissioner in there, we could end up with nothing else\u2014nothing else.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000744\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022\u003EMinister , I would really appreciate some rationale from you, perhaps; maybe, if not that, a commitment that any budget saved would be going back into representative work and not just higher salaries, or a Supplementary Order Paper on the Table saying that actually there is no point reducing the number of commissioners and that you will maintain what was the status quo. I look forward to some response from the Minister in that regard, because it is significant. It may seem like we are just removing some flexibility, but we, of course, had grave concerns with taking out a designated title, so why would we not have concerns with removing the discretion in the future to appoint a commissioner in an area that becomes of substantive concern? I have already raised an example of where, down the track, it would be potentially useful to have that ability from the human rights commissioner.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000745\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022\u003EThere has also been raised the issue of consultation with the Minister. Even though there is some specification within the Human Rights Act 1993 around consultation\u2014that is in specific reference, it reads to me, to the commissioner\u2019s allocation of portfolios\u2014in this particular amendment bill, it is very clear under Part 1, clause 6(1B), where it states: \u201CA Commissioner must lead the work of the Commission in any other priority area that is designated by the Chief Commissioner, and the Chief Commissioner may designate an area of work as a priority area only in accordance with the strategic direction and the general nature of activities determined by the Commission under section 7(1) and after consultation with the Minister and the other Commissioners.\u201D That reads to me that both the strategic direction and the designation of roles could, therefore, be determined with the Minister.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000746\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022\u003EI know it has been stated that consultation\u2014consultation\u2014means that the commissioner can come in and inform. I have seen the word \u201Cconsultation\u201D used in those relationships before. Let us be really clear, because I have heard, for instance, the Law Commission, which I doubt anyone in this Committee would think feels under the thumb of the Government at all, say at select committee that even though it has the ability to set its own agenda in terms of the work that it does, it knows there is no point in bringing to the Minister\u2014in consultation with the Minister for its work programme\u2014something that is not within their political orbit or their political priorities. So there is a self-filtration that happens when you are required to consult\u2014even though it is the word \u201Cconsult\u201D\u2014that means entities, naturally, will not bring something that they consider to be unpalatable in case it gets taken off the agenda and just dismissed. If it is simply a matter of being informed, then call it that. Let us be specific that it is actually just that they have to notify the Minister. The word \u201Cconsult\u201D is very different to the word \u201Cnotify\u201D, and I have no doubt that a human rights commissioner who is obliged to consult is therefore likely to take on board the feedback that is given by that Minister when it comes to allocating any potential new commissioner roles.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000747\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022\u003EI thought that this amendment bill could have been a perfect chance to reflect back on the Paris principles, which were passed by the United Nations General Assembly on 20 December 1993, which set out the status of national institutions\u2014basically, what should it look like when a country sets up a human rights institution? What are the really core principles to make sure you establish a proper, robust human rights institution? It says in the Paris principles that a national institution \u201Cshall be vested with competence\u201D. It should be given \u201Cas broad a mandate as possible\u201D. I think that is interesting: \u201CA national institution shall be given as broad a mandate as possible, which shall be clearly set forth in a constitutional or legislative text\u201D. So although we want to specify composition and sphere of competence, actually allowing that flexibility that we talked about in those roles, which we lose in this bill, is a core principle of the Paris principles. It also talks about submitting any human rights concerns to the Government \u201Con an advisory basis either at the request of the authorities\u201D or at the exercise of its own power.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000748\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022\u003EBut all the way through, right down through, I found, particularly, Minister, the methods of operation\u2014the framework that the national institution shall freely consider any questions falling within its competence, whether they are submitted by the Government or not; hear any person; address public opinion; and establish working groups from among its members as necessary. All of these fundamental principles talk about the need for it to maintain that independence. There was a prime opportunity with this review of the Act to sit back and ask: are we upholding the Paris principles to the very best of our ability? And if there is any concern that embedding principles around consultation may be misinterpreted by a commission to be more than advising or informing, then perhaps we should change our language. Perhaps we should look at the kind of language that embeds independence.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000749\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022\u003EIn fact, if we really were taking a first-principles review, why would we not set up at the same time a select committee within our Parliament to review human rights on a regular basis to ensure that we are upholding those important institutions within New Zealand? It has been recommended. I think there are good grounds for it. That is the kind of first-principles debate we should have been having when this amendment bill was put forward, and, in fact, when the Ministry of Justice in 2010 established its review in the first place\u2014going back and ensuring that we were trying to uphold those principles that we signed to in Paris in 1993.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002257e41e9d-285b-4fb3-847d-a63820ae7137\u0022 data-id=\u0022b3fab777159041efb2cdeda26d8e3d01\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000750\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002257e41e9d-285b-4fb3-847d-a63820ae7137\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022b3fab777159041efb2cdeda26d8e3d01\u0022\u003ECHRIS BISHOP (National):\u003C/span\u003E I move, That the question be now put.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca id=\u0022d43c52da310544a6b58f5c9311bdc412\u0022 name=\u0022division\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EA party vote was called for on the question, That the question be now put.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EAyes 88\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand National 59; Green Party 13; New Zealand First 12; M\u0101ori Party 2; ACT New Zealand 1; United Future 1.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENoes 32\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand Labour 32.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EMotion agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca id=\u002271f6d7dfbad7440bb2ab3bf27a771512\u0022 name=\u0022division\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EThe question was put that the amendments set out on Supplementary Order Paper 175 in the name of the Hon Amy Adams to clause 6 be agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000751\u0022\u003EAmendments agreed to.\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000752\u0022\u003EPart 1 as amended agreed to.\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000753\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u0022a1d0d9bbe1b247cea510af83fa4ba62c\u0022\u003EPart 2 agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000754\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u00228817a75424774fff8dda7b0c0666a96b\u0022\u003ESchedule agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000755\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u00228c20d509aee249b18caff6609b24d709\u0022\u003EClause 1 agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000756\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u0022b42388f0c58044e7a1d2337ffba738c4\u0022\u003EClause 2 agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000757\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u0022c052b646f45c4411823620e48e0d0f36\u0022\u003EClause 3 agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000758\u0022\u003EBill to be reported with amendment.\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000759\u0022\u003EHouse resumed.\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000760\u0022\u003EThe Chairperson reported the Residential Tenancies Amendment Bill with amendment, the Taxation (Transformation: First Phase Simplification and Other Measures) Bill with amendment, and the Human Rights Amendment Bill with amendment.\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000761\u0022\u003EReport adopted.\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000762\u0022\u003ESitting suspended from 9.55 p.m. to 9 a.m. (Wednesday)\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20160524cb2fd86be0e5444bbde2ede6d4c0827f000763\u0022\u003E\u003Cbr\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n    \u003C/div\u003E\n    \u003Cdiv class=\u0022HpsHansard\u0022\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000001\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsProceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u00224cbfc33102154912852071c4b3bcd507\u0022\u003ETUESDAY, 24 MAY 2016\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000002\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u0022c9e2cf35497142d99a166057b9d48a0c\u0022\u003E(continued on Wednesday, 25 May 2016)\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n    \u003C/div\u003E\n    \u003Cdiv class=\u0022HpsHansard\u0022\u003E\n      \u003Cp\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsProceedingHeading\u0022\u003EBills\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000003\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u0022fb84702f82274f9a8fe4ef6131a32551\u0022\u003EHineuru Claims Settlement Bill\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000004\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u0022a374cb0afc234c9880a7446b323d55c9\u0022\u003ESecond Reading\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022ec266512-9fe8-47da-883e-48f046ee5059\u0022 data-id=\u00223f141032fd1d4f8cab82144e77c4a0db\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000005\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ec266512-9fe8-47da-883e-48f046ee5059\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00223f141032fd1d4f8cab82144e77c4a0db\u0022\u003EHon TE URUROA FLAVELL (Co-Leader\u2014M\u0101ori Party):\u003C/span\u003E I seek leave, me k\u012B, kia w\u0101w\u0101hi te \u0101huatanga \u014D w\u0101 t\u0101tou k\u014Drero i t\u0113nei r\u0101, n\u0101 runga i te \u0101huatanga o te kupu k\u014Drero ki te w\u0101hi ngaro \u0101-karakia nei, n\u014D reira, kai te \u012Bnoi atu ki Te Whare kia whakat\u016Bwherahia i roto i te kupu k\u014Drero \u0101-karakia nei, kia \u012Bnoi atu ki a Adrian Rurawhe pea, hei w\u0101wahi i w\u0101 t\u0101tou k\u014Drero, mena e pai ana t\u0113n\u0101 ki Te Whare.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000006\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ec266512-9fe8-47da-883e-48f046ee5059\u0022\u003E[I seek leave, shall we say, to re-examine the way we begin today, in terms of opening up our contributions in regard to acknowledging the unseen place in a traditional way or through a prayer. Therefore, I seek the indulgence of the House that we proceed to do that by way of a prayer, and furthermore respectfully ask whether Adrian Rurawhe might perhaps lead the way with a prayer to open up our contributions, if the House so desires.]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022893adc11-ce4e-419c-a079-08f04b3d75f5\u0022 data-id=\u0022a81cb97009614e28993b4c1fd7e66115\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000007\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022893adc11-ce4e-419c-a079-08f04b3d75f5\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022a81cb97009614e28993b4c1fd7e66115\u0022\u003EThe ASSISTANT SPEAKER (Lindsay Tisch)\u003C/span\u003E: Leave is sought for that purpose. Is there any objection? There is no objection.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022a434482b-7ac1-4862-9ce7-13e63289dee3\u0022 data-id=\u0022d2ba3f6502654864bf6387d572cf4ea4\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000008\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a434482b-7ac1-4862-9ce7-13e63289dee3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022d2ba3f6502654864bf6387d572cf4ea4\u0022\u003EADRIAN RURAWHE (Labour\u2014Te Tai Hau\u0101uru):\u003C/span\u003E \u0100, k\u0101ti r\u0101, kor\u014Dia, harer\u016Bia ki koe, E Ihowa, ng\u0101 mano t\u016B\u0101uriuri, whai\u014Dio, k\u012B tonu Te Rangi me Te Whenua i te nui o t\u014D kor\u014Dria. N\u014D reira, anei m\u0101tou whakahokia te reo whakamoemiti ki mua i \u014D koutou aroaro m\u014D \u014D koutou tini manaakitanga ka tukuna mai e koutou ki runga ki a m\u0101tou. Oti noa, ka tono atu an\u014D ki a koutou kia h\u014Dmai te ora, te kaha me te m\u0101ramatanga, te rangim\u0101rie, kia manaakitia hoki m\u0101tou i roto katoa i o m\u0101tou whiriwhiringa k\u014Drero. Manaakitia hoki ng\u0101 iwi katoa kua tae mai i t\u0113nei r\u0101 ki te whakarongo ki \u014D r\u0101tou pire. N\u014D reira, ko koutou hoki nei te t\u012Bmatanga me te whakaotinga mai hoki \u014D m\u0101tou t\u016Bmanako atu nei i roto i \u014D koutou k\u014Droriatanga. M\u0101 Te M\u0101ngai e tautoko mai \u0101ianei, ake nei, \u0101e.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000009\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a434482b-7ac1-4862-9ce7-13e63289dee3\u0022\u003E[And so glory and praise be to you, Jehovah of the multitudes and the thousands upon thousands, and whereupon heaven and earth are filled with your glory. We are here, therefore, returning and placing our words of praise before your multitude and thousands upon thousands for the protection and care bestowed upon us. Furthermore, we seek that you make us well, energetic, understanding, and calm and that you look out for us throughout our deliberations. Take care of all the tribes that have arrived here today to listen to their bills. Therefore, our inspiration begins and ends also with you in your glory. May Te M\u0101ngai endorse this now and forever, yes.]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002241146229-4d11-415b-a4ac-f4e2b923e95d\u0022 data-id=\u0022254b40059d304b66b8d23008dbd0fb67\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000010\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002241146229-4d11-415b-a4ac-f4e2b923e95d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022254b40059d304b66b8d23008dbd0fb67\u0022\u003EHon CHRISTOPHER FINLAYSON (Minister for Treaty of Waitangi Negotiations):\u003C/span\u003E I move, That the Hineuru Claims Settlement Bill be now read a second time. This bill is going to give effect to a deed of settlement between the Crown and Hineuru that was signed here in Wellington in April last year, settling all the historic Treaty of Waitangi claims relating to Hineuru. The settlement comprises historical redress, which records the breaches and the past injustices caused by failures of the Crown; cultural redress reconnecting the people of Hineuru with a number of their most culturally significant sites; and financial and commercial redress reasserting Hineuru\u2019s role in the region with a strong economic base for them to grow.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000011\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002241146229-4d11-415b-a4ac-f4e2b923e95d\u0022\u003EAs always, I want to thank and acknowledge the work of the M\u0101ori Affairs Committee, which has once again done an excellent job in progressing this bill in a very timely manner. The committee began its consideration of the bill in September last year and considered 13 submissions from interested groups and individuals, including one submission that was extremely critical of the Treaty settlement process, suggesting that the Waitangi Tribunal is a \u201Cracist rip-off\u201D and that M\u0101ori are not indigenous to New Zealand. It is what I call\u2014and I often receive emails from such people\u2014a \u201CKKK submission\u201D. Although I do not want to give credence to individuals with these rather odd beliefs, I want to acknowledge the unique perspective on Treaty settlements as a timely reminder of the importance of these settlements for the development of our country. It is only right the history of these settlements be recorded, remembered, and retold to future generations to ensure the wrongs of the past are neither forgotten nor belittled. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000012\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002241146229-4d11-415b-a4ac-f4e2b923e95d\u0022\u003EThe committee travelled to Napier in November last year to hear from submitters on the settlement. I was very pleased to see that the majority of submissions were in full support of the settlement, including a number of submissions from neighbouring iwi who wanted to show support for their Hineuru relations. The committee makes 13 recommendations, which are all either technical or consequential in nature. I want to thank the chair, the committee members, and the advisers for their consideration of the bill and their combined efforts to return the bill to this House without undue delay.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000013\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002241146229-4d11-415b-a4ac-f4e2b923e95d\u0022\u003EI intend to keep my comments in the second reading very short. I will leave my final thanks to the Hineuru negotiating team until the third reading. However, before I end I want to acknowledge the patience of the trustees of Hineuru, who have been anxious to reach settlement of their historical claims, and I want to assure them that I and, I am sure, everyone in this House, share their aspiration for a just and durable settlement as soon as possible. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000014\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002241146229-4d11-415b-a4ac-f4e2b923e95d\u0022\u003EI look forward to the bill moving towards its third reading in a very timely manner. I also look forward to welcoming the community of Hineuru back to Parliament as we draw to a close this final stage in this particular settlement and come together to celebrate a stronger and more prosperous future for the people of Hineuru. I commend the bill to the House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022073496a0-73b7-426f-97f8-916bd542b0fa\u0022 data-id=\u002249eca521b2774b84b9fb8b178867bff7\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000015\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022073496a0-73b7-426f-97f8-916bd542b0fa\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002249eca521b2774b84b9fb8b178867bff7\u0022\u003EMEKA WHAITIRI (Labour\u2014Ikaroa-R\u0101whiti):\u003C/span\u003E \u0100 waiho ki \u201CTe amorangi ki mua, ko te h\u0101pai \u014D ki muri\u201D. E ng\u0101 mate huhua kua hinga atu, haere, haere, moe mai r\u0101.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000016\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022073496a0-73b7-426f-97f8-916bd542b0fa\u0022\u003EE rau rangatira m\u0101! Ng\u0101ti Hineuru, e ng\u0101 kaum\u0101tua, nau mai, haere mai, hoki mai. Hoki mai ki t\u014D t\u0101tou Whare. E Te M\u0101ngai o Te Whare nei, t\u0113n\u0101 koe, e ng\u0101 mema katoa, \u0101, t\u0113n\u0101 t\u0101tou katoa. E t\u0101tou e \u201Cte iti rearea, teitei kahikatea ka taea\u201D. N\u014D reira, t\u0113n\u0101 koutou katoa.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000017\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022073496a0-73b7-426f-97f8-916bd542b0fa\u0022\u003E[Leave it to the aphorism: \u201CEmblem of god in the vanguard, food bearers to the rear\u201D. To the vast number that have fallen, depart, go, rest there.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000018\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022073496a0-73b7-426f-97f8-916bd542b0fa\u0022\u003ETo the respected leaders of a hundredfold, to you, Ng\u0101ti Hineuru, respected elders, welcome, come forth, and welcome back. Welcome back to our House. Mr Assistant Speaker, thank you, and acknowledgments to all of us members. We are indeed like \u201Cthe tiny bellbird capable of soaring over the great heights of the kahikatea tree\u201D. Well done all.]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000019\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022073496a0-73b7-426f-97f8-916bd542b0fa\u0022\u003EIt is indeed my honour to stand in support of the Hineuru Claims Settlement Bill. In terms of context, as the Minister Christopher Finlayson has alluded to, the second reading is really an opportunity to report back what was presented in front of the M\u0101ori Affairs Committee. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000020\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022073496a0-73b7-426f-97f8-916bd542b0fa\u0022\u003EBefore I address some of the critical issues that Ng\u0101ti Hineuru themselves raised at the M\u0101ori Affairs Committee, may I just paint some context for the tribe of Ng\u0101ti Hineuru. They descend from two ancestors: Apa-h\u0101pai-taketake of Ng\u0101ti Apa and Kurapoto. The Hineuru rohe\u2014although a mountainous region; its location is on the main access routes between Napier and Taup\u014D, Rotorua, and the Bay of Plenty. Their history is, indeed, an interesting one. Although the subjects were raised at the select committee\u2014and, as the Minister for Treaty of Waitangi Negotiations rightfully said, recommendations were made and technical changes were made\u2014I want to take my time and talk around the negotiation process that the negotiators of Ng\u0101ti Hineuru had to endure. They raised some very important points in front of the select committee that I may seek the indulgence of the House to traverse in my contribution this morning. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000021\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022073496a0-73b7-426f-97f8-916bd542b0fa\u0022\u003EThe history with the Crown is described by the submission submitted by Ng\u0101ti Hineuru. The most important incidence of the Hineuru history was the Crown attacks at \u014Cmarunui and P\u0113tane in 1866, during which their rangatira, Te Rangi H\u012Broa, was killed. Following these attacks many were captured and sent to the Chatham Islands. There they came across Te Kooti and were subsequently involved in his escape and the subsequent wars that ensued. While all this was happening the Crown was purchasing and taking Hineuru lands. Ng\u0101ti Hineuru were left virtually landless. And, to add salt to the wounds, the Crown also awarded certain Hineuru lands to other iwi. This is an area of contention for Hineuru, as it is for many other iwi who have suffered a similar fate. Once a very powerful iwi, Hineuru held very strategic areas in the central North Island. Following the loss of their lands, resources, and people, the Hineuru people who remained lived in poverty and in the shadow of the pains of the past. Once a powerful nation, their journey to settlement is about rebuilding their people.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000022\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022073496a0-73b7-426f-97f8-916bd542b0fa\u0022\u003EThe other interesting aspect of this particular claim was that Ng\u0101ti Hineuru had to attend three hearings: the M\u014Dhaka ki Ahuriri inquiry during 1996 and 2000, the central North Island tribunal hearings in 2005, and Te Urewera hearings from 2003 to 2005. It is a challenge enough to attend your own hearings and prepare yourself to ensure that your interest in your rohe is protected, but in this particular instance of Ng\u0101ti Hineuru the requirement to protect what little they had required them to attend three hearings. I would put the question around whether any other iwi has to endure three hearings to ensure what land they have can be protected. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000023\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022073496a0-73b7-426f-97f8-916bd542b0fa\u0022\u003EEntities were established. Ng\u0101ti Hineuru Iwi Inc. was established in 2005, and its responsibility was for the negotiations. Te K\u014Dpere o Te Iwi o Hineuru Trust, responsible to receive and manage the redress, was ratified by just under 75 percent in late 2015. I want to acknowledge the six pou that form the intent of the iwi to rebuild their people: the restoration and protection of their cultural heritage and history for future generations; the restoration of the health and well-being of their people; the recognition of the mana of Hineuru and the restoration of the relativity Hineuru had with other iwi in the region; the reassertion of the presence of Hineuru through their rohe; the rebuilding of their economic base; and the revitalisation and restoration of their role as kaitiaki of their natural resources and environment.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000024\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022073496a0-73b7-426f-97f8-916bd542b0fa\u0022\u003EThe two issues that I want to raise in my contribution are, first, issues pertaining to the negotiations, and, second, the continuing pursuit of recognition. It was interesting in the submission to the M\u0101ori Affairs Committee\u2014we often do not hear the struggles that sometimes negotiators have to go through in terms of getting their particular settlement over the line. I want to mention the issue around the Crown Forestry Rental Trust funding and the extra pressure it put on the negotiators when it came to funding the particular negotiations. It was sorted\u2014I would like to say that; it was sorted through perceived conflicts of trustees of Crown Forestry Rental Trust\u2014but the upshot was that Ng\u0101ti Hineuru were left with a debt, and they still have a debt over something that had nothing whatsoever to do with them in terms of the releasing of funds. So I want to say to the Minister for Treaty of Waitangi Negotiations that if there is any way, in his good grace, that we could forgo that debt, I am sure that you will make Ng\u0101ti Hineuru people very, very happy.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000025\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022073496a0-73b7-426f-97f8-916bd542b0fa\u0022\u003EThe other issue that was raised at the select committee was the continuous pursuit of recognition. As we have seen in many, many settlements, the use of iwi authorities in current legislation confers some benefit, and clearly those who do not have the status of iwi miss out. In Ng\u0101ti Hineuru\u2019s case, they mentioned the fisheries protocol with the Ministry for Primary Industries. Far be it from me to be talking about fish in this settlement, but the fisheries settlement means that Ng\u0101ti Hineuru\u2019s part of the settlement is not managed by them. If I can read through their submission, they would one day like (1) to be recognised as an iwi; but (2) to pursue and enjoy the opportunities that other iwi have in relation to the Treaty of Waitangi (Fisheries Claim) Settlement Act. Again I put that on the floor of this House: if there is anything that the Minister could help with in that regard, we would definitely support that\u2014and also the census classification.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000026\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022073496a0-73b7-426f-97f8-916bd542b0fa\u0022\u003EI too, in my final couple of minutes, want to thank the select committee, the Minister, the officials, the negotiators, and the people of Ng\u0101ti Hineuru.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000027\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022073496a0-73b7-426f-97f8-916bd542b0fa\u0022\u003EIn my closing point, the Ng\u0101ti Hineuru claim, like many others, has shown the Crown\u2019s action in retaining M\u0101ori whenua in M\u0101ori hands has been dismal, has been an abject failure, and has been a dereliction of duty. Like Ng\u0101ti Hineuru, none of their land loss was of their own making. Being removed from their land and incarcerated on the Chatham Islands without trial was not of their doing. Their land being sold in their absence was not of their doing. Earlier this month the Government introduced a brand new M\u0101ori land law, Te Ture Whenua M\u0101ori Bill\u2014not an amendment of the existing Te Ture Whenua Maori Act, but a complete rewrite. M\u0101ori landowners have had a year to understand the 400-page bill. Like Ng\u0101ti Hineuru, I contend this is not of their doing. I commend this bill to the House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022ec266512-9fe8-47da-883e-48f046ee5059\u0022 data-id=\u0022fce9555e54a041b99f4d292bf634b360\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000028\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ec266512-9fe8-47da-883e-48f046ee5059\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022fce9555e54a041b99f4d292bf634b360\u0022\u003EHon TE URUROA FLAVELL (Co-Leader\u2014M\u0101ori Party):\u003C/span\u003E T\u0113n\u0101 koe, Mr Assistant Speaker, kia ora t\u0101tau katoa. Ka mihi ki a koe e te mema o Te Tai Hau\u0101uru m\u014D te \u0101huatanga \u014D w\u0101 t\u0101tou whakarite i t\u0113nei ata, hei w\u0101w\u0101hi i te \u0101huatanga o ng\u0101 k\u014Drero o t\u0113nei ata. Ka mutu, ka huri atu ki a koutou katoa e whakakanohi nei, a Ng\u0101ti Hineuru i t\u0113nei ata, t\u0113n\u0101 koutou, m\u014Drena, moatarau! Haere mai ki Te Whare P\u0101remata, Te Whare Paremata, \u0101, i takatakihi nei i te mana o Ng\u0101ti Hineuru i ng\u0101 tau kua hipa ake nei, an\u0101 e k\u014Drero ake nei, e t\u0113nei o ng\u0101 mema, e Meka Whaitiri. Ka pai tana k\u014Drero, ko ia te mea whakatakoto i ng\u0101 r\u0101rangi k\u014Drero m\u014D te \u0101huatanga o ng\u0101 h\u012Btori, e kore au e hoki ki \u0113n\u0101 k\u014Drero, kua k\u014Drerohia, kua rongo k\u0113 koutou i \u0113r\u0101 korero.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000029\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ec266512-9fe8-47da-883e-48f046ee5059\u0022\u003EKa mutu, i a au e t\u016B nei ka rere ng\u0101 whakaaro ki Te Tai Tokerau, e hoa m\u0101, ko te \u0101huatanga o t\u0113r\u0101 o ng\u0101 pou o Te K\u014Dhanga Reo, ki a M\u0101nuera Tohu, ko ia t\u0113r\u0101 e takoto mai r\u0101 i roto i Te Tai Tokerau. \u0112hara i te mea ko ia i t\u014Dna kotahi \u0113ngari, ng\u0101 mate huhua k\u0101re e kore, kua heria mai ai e koutou i t\u0113nei r\u0101. He kite kanohi, ka hoki ng\u0101 mahara, he rongo \u0101-taringa, te \u0101huatanga o t\u0113nei ingoa, a Ng\u0101ti Hineuru, ka hoki \u014Dku whakaaro ki a Whet\u016B Tipiwai. Ko ia te tangata i aki nei, i t\u016B hei whakakanohi nei i te \u0101huatanga o t\u0101 koutou ker\u0113me i te w\u0101 i a ia, ka tangi ake ki a ia kua riro ki tua o te pae o maumahara. N\u014D reira, k\u0101ti. Ko t\u0101ku he whakakao mai i ng\u0101 mate katoa i raro i te korowai o \u014D t\u0101tou nohotahi i t\u0113nei ata me te k\u012B atu, koutou e te p\u014D, e moe, e moe, e moe, t\u0101tou te hunga ora huri noa i t\u014D t\u0101tou whare, t\u0113n\u0101 koutou, t\u0113n\u0101 koutou, kia ora t\u0101tou katoa.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000030\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ec266512-9fe8-47da-883e-48f046ee5059\u0022\u003EI tuatahi, k\u0101re au i konei i roto i Te Whare nei i te w\u0101 i k\u014Drerohia tuatahitia t\u0113nei o ng\u0101 pire, \u0113ngari ko te \u0101huatanga o ng\u0101 k\u014Drero o Ng\u0101ti Hineuru, \u0101e, ar\u0101 \u0113tahi paku rerek\u0113tanga \u0113ngari ko te tino kaupapa e orite ana, muru i te whenua, raupatu i te whenua, k\u014Dhuru i te tangata, \u0113r\u0101 \u0101huatanga katoa. \u0112hara i te mea, he k\u014Drero h\u014Du i roto i t\u0113nei Whare P\u0101remata m\u014D ng\u0101 take ker\u0113me. N\u014D reira, ko t\u0101ku i te tuatahi ka mihi ki te komiti i haere n\u0101 ki roto i te takiw\u0101 o Ng\u0101ti Hineuru, i rongo ki ng\u0101 k\u014Drero, e kore au e k\u014Drero m\u014D \u0113r\u0101 k\u014Drero i te mea, ko koutou te hunga i rongo n\u0101 i \u0113r\u0101 korero; \u0113ngari, ka mihi r\u0101 ki te tiamana, otir\u0101, koutou ng\u0101 mema o t\u014D t\u0101tau r\u014Dp\u016B, t\u014D t\u0101tau komiti o Te Whare P\u0101remata i a koutou te mahi nui.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000031\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ec266512-9fe8-47da-883e-48f046ee5059\u0022\u003EKua aro tonu atu \u014Dku taringa ki te \u0101huatanga o ng\u0101 k\u014Drero a Meka Whaitiri me te k\u012B atu, e kore e taea te whakah\u0113 i tua atu o t\u0113tahi kaupapa, \u0101, ko Te Ture Whenua M\u0101ori, n\u014D reira ka hoki mai ki t\u0113r\u0101 \u0101 taihoa ake nei. I k\u014Drerohia m\u014D te \u0101huatanga o ng\u0101 tohe, o ng\u0101 pakanga i t\u016B, ka mutu, ki Petone, ka mutu i k\u014Drerohia te ingoa o Te Rangih\u012Broa, kua tuhia ki roto i ng\u0101 pukapuka o Te Whare P\u0101remata i t\u0113nei w\u0101, n\u014D reira, e kore au e hoki ki \u0113r\u0101.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000032\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ec266512-9fe8-47da-883e-48f046ee5059\u0022\u003EKo te \u0101huatanga o Te K\u014Dti Whenua, \u0101, \u0113hara, kei te tika t\u0113r\u0101! Ko te K\u014Dti Whenua i whai w\u0101hi i roto i ng\u0101 whiriwhiringa m\u014D koutou Ng\u0101ti Hineuru, ko t\u0101na mahi he wh\u0101nako i te whenua i raro i te ture, \u0101kuanei pea te \u0101huatanga o Te K\u014Dti Whenua M\u0101ori. N\u014D reira, kai te whakaae atu ki \u0113r\u0101 momo k\u014Drero ki t\u0113r\u0101 momo h\u012Btori! Kei te whakaae atu an\u014D hoki ki t\u0101 te mema n\u0101, e k\u014Drero n\u0101, kia whakahokia te mana o ng\u0101 \u0101huatanga o te kaitiaki o runga i te whenua o Ng\u0101ti Hineuru ki a koutou. E whakaae atu ana au ki t\u0113r\u0101, n\u014D reira, e kore au e whakat\u014Dwai i \u0113r\u0101 k\u014Drero i te mea, kua k\u014Drerohia, kua puta t\u0113r\u0101 k\u014Drero.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000033\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ec266512-9fe8-47da-883e-48f046ee5059\u0022\u003EKotahi, e rua pea waku t\u0101piringa k\u014Drero ki ng\u0101 k\u014Drero i k\u014Drerohia ake nei. Tuatahi, m\u014D te haerenga o t\u0113tahi iwi ki mua i te aroaro o Te Taraipiunara o Waitangi, otir\u0101, ki mua i te aroaro o iwi k\u0113, \u0113hara t\u0113r\u0101 i te \u0101huatanga hou. Koia te \u0101huatanga i roto i ng\u0101 ker\u0113me katoa! Kai a au t\u014Dku mana, kai au t\u014Dku h\u012Btori \u0113ngari, a h\u0101, kua rerek\u0113 te k\u014Drero a t\u0113n\u0101 iwi, \u0101 t\u0113n\u0101 iwi, \u0101 t\u0113n\u0101 iwi. N\u014D reira, me p\u0113hea hoki? Me haere ki Te K\u014Dti, ki reira whakatau ai, \u0101, ko te w\u0101hi ki a koe, ko te w\u0101hi ki a au. E p\u0113r\u0101 ano hoki, \u0101, kai te m\u014Dhio pea koutou, ko te \u0101huatanga o ng\u0101 ker\u0113me, me k\u012B, o te Central North Island, ha! E 3 tau a ng\u0101i t\u0101tau e tohe ana, ki a t\u0101tau an\u014D m\u014D te rohe kai a au, kai t\u0113n\u0101, kai t\u0113n\u0101, kai t\u0113n\u0101, kai t\u0113n\u0101. N\u014D reira, ko te haerenga ki Te K\u014Dti ki reira whiriwhiri ai i ng\u0101 take \u0101-rohe whenua, \u0101-mana nei \u0113hara i te \u0101huatanga hou. N\u014D reira, kai te whakah\u0113 atu au ki t\u0101 te mema e k\u014Drero n\u0101.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000034\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ec266512-9fe8-47da-883e-48f046ee5059\u0022\u003ETuarua, e whakaae atu ana ki tana t\u012Bmatanga k\u014Drero, i te w\u0101hanga whakamutunga o tana k\u014Drero, me tana k\u012B atu: \u201CHe w\u0101hi m\u014D te ture\u201D, \u0101e! E tika! Ko te ture he mea i takatakahi nei, i muru i te whenua nei i raro i te korowai, e ai ki t\u0101 te ture, o te tika me te pono. Ko te mate k\u0113, k\u0101re i te tino p\u0113r\u0101. Kei konei t\u0101tou e ngana nei ki te whakatika i \u0113r\u0101 \u0101huatanga.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000035\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ec266512-9fe8-47da-883e-48f046ee5059\u0022\u003EN\u014D reira, i k\u014Drero ia m\u014D te \u0101huatanga o Te Ture Whenua M\u0101ori \u0101, t\u0113n\u0101. I aroha mai m\u014D te huri ki t\u0113r\u0101 kaupapa \u0113ngari, a koia nei te \u0101huatanga o Te Whare P\u0101remata: he tau utuutu te korero. Ka t\u016B t\u0113tahi, \u0101, ka whakautua e t\u0113tahi. Ka t\u016B mai t\u0113tahi kaupapa, ka whakautu e t\u0113tahi. N\u014D reira, taihoa ake nei, kia eke ki te mea tuatoru, \u0101, kia h\u0101ngai tonu ki te kaupapa o t\u0113nei mea ko t\u0101 koutou ker\u0113me o Ng\u0101ti Hineuru.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000036\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ec266512-9fe8-47da-883e-48f046ee5059\u0022\u003EKo t\u0101ku ki Te Ture Whenua M\u0101ori e p\u0113nei ana, ko Te Ture Whenua M\u0101ori hou; i t\u012Bmata mai ai i te tau kotahi mano, 1993, e 5 tau i muri mai\u2014ha!\u2014kua t\u012Bmata ki te whakapanoni, \u0101, mai i t\u0113r\u0101 w\u0101 kua k\u014Drerohia, kua k\u014Drerohia, kua k\u014Drerohia i ng\u0101 tau, \u0101, tae r\u0101 an\u014D ki te tau kua hipa. N\u014D reira, ahakoa ko te mema ka k\u012B, poto noa iho te w\u0101 ki te k\u014Drero o roto, me k\u012B m\u014D te marea, m\u014D t\u0113nei kaupapa \u0113hara! Kua roa t\u0113nei kaupapa e k\u014Drerohia ana! Ko t\u0101na kaupapa, he whakatikatika i ng\u0101 nawe i k\u014Drerohia e koutou, Ng\u0101ti Hineuru, i roto i t\u0101 koutou ker\u0113me. Tuatahi, ko te mana motuhake o te whenua M\u0101ori me noho ki roto i ng\u0101 ringaringa o te ao M\u0101ori. Taku m\u014Dhio, ka whakae atu a Ng\u0101ti Hineuru ki t\u0113r\u0101 k\u014Drero. Ka rua, mena e hiahia ana a Ng\u0101ti Hineuru ki te whakawhanake ake t\u014Dna whenua, kai a ia te k\u014Drero, kaua m\u0101 t\u0113tahi, kaua m\u0101 Te K\u014Dti, kaua m\u0101 t\u0113tahi atu. \u0100, ki taku m\u014Dhio kai te whakaae mai a Ng\u0101ti Hineuru ki t\u0113r\u0101 k\u014Drero.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000037\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ec266512-9fe8-47da-883e-48f046ee5059\u0022\u003EKaupapa tuatoru: \u0101, k\u0101ti. Ko Te Whenua M\u0101ori, he taonga tuku iho, he taonga. Kia kaua e riro t\u0113r\u0101 whenua ki tangata k\u0113. Ki taku m\u014Dhio ka whakaae atu a Ng\u0101ti Hineuru, ki t\u0113r\u0101 k\u014Drero. N\u014D reira, k\u0101ti, he aha te raruraru? \u0100 t\u0113n\u0101 ko t\u0101 t\u0101tau, ng\u0101 m\u0101rama kai mua i te aroaro? Ko te aha te ruku ki te h\u014Dhonutanga o t\u0113nei take, he aha ai? E tika ana t\u0101 te mema, kia kaua t\u0101tau e hoki ki ng\u0101 p\u0113hitanga, ki ng\u0101 mahi tinihanga o roto i Te Ture, i wh\u0101nako nei, i riro ai e Te Karauna te mana o te whenua, kore te kaupapa. N\u014D reira, Ng\u0101ti Hineuru, haere mai, haere mai ki roto i Te Whare P\u0101remata, kia k\u014Drerohia \u0113nei take.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000038\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ec266512-9fe8-47da-883e-48f046ee5059\u0022\u003EKo te \u0101huatanga o te h\u012Btori ka whakatakotohia e te mema, kua k\u014Drerohia i te p\u0101nuitanga tuatahi. Kia hoki mai t\u0101tau ki te mea tuatoru, \u0101, k\u0101ti, me whakanui t\u0101tau i te \u0101huatanga, kaua i ng\u0101 mahi o Te K\u014Dti Whenua M\u0101ori, kaua i te h\u014Dia, kaua i ng\u0101 tohe, hei tohengia ng\u0101 pakanga, k\u0101o! Me whakanui i te take kua roa koutou e whaihai haeretia ana i roto i ng\u0101 tau, ar\u0101, kia hoki te mana, otir\u0101, t\u0113tahi paku painga ki a koutou \u0101 ng\u0101 tau kai mua i te aroaro.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000039\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ec266512-9fe8-47da-883e-48f046ee5059\u0022\u003EN\u014D reira, k\u0101ti, haere mai. Whakarongo ki ng\u0101 k\u014Drero, \u0101, k\u0101ti. \u0100 te w\u0101hanga tuatoru, kua hui an\u014D t\u0101tau ki konei whakanui ai. Haere mai, t\u0113n\u0101 koutou. Ki ng\u0101 mema o Te Whare P\u0101remata, huri noa, kia ora t\u0101tou katoa, kai raro.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000040\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ec266512-9fe8-47da-883e-48f046ee5059\u0022\u003E[Thank you, Mr Assistant Speaker, and greetings to everyone. My appreciation to the member for Te Tai Hau\u0101uru in regard to how we commenced proceedings this morning. Further to that, I turn to all of you Ng\u0101ti Hineuru who have fronted up this morning\u2014acknowledgments to you, good morning, and an early one at that! Welcome to Parliament, the very one that walked all over the authority of Ng\u0101ti Hineuru in past years, as reiterated by the member Meka Whaitiri. Her contribution was good, she outlined the historical side\u2014which I will not revisit as you have already heard it.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000041\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ec266512-9fe8-47da-883e-48f046ee5059\u0022\u003EFurthermore, as I stand here my thoughts fly north, friends, to one of the pillars of the Te K\u014Dhanga Reo movement, M\u0101nuera Tohu, currently lying in state up there in the Far North. It is not as though it is him alone, but also the innumerable masses, many of whom you bring with you here today. Seeing your faces brings back memories of them. Upon hearing this name, Ng\u0101ti Hineuru, my thoughts bring back memories of Whet\u016B Tipiwai. He was the person who, during his time, was the face of your claim. I lament him. He has gone beyond the horizon of memories. Enough. My part here this morning is to bring together all the departed under the cloak that belongs to all of us assembled here as one this morning, and to say to them\u2014you of the void\u2014sleep, rest, and slumber. To us the living throughout our House, my greetings, acknowledgments, and salutations to you collectively and to us all.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000042\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ec266512-9fe8-47da-883e-48f046ee5059\u0022\u003EFirst of all, I was not present in the House when the first contributions were made on this bill, and, yes, although the tenor of the statements by Ng\u0101ti Hineuru may have differed a little, the basic theme remained the same: plundering the land, confiscating the land, murdering people, all those kinds of things. But that sort of statement is not new in this Parliament as far as claim issues are concerned. So the first thing for me is to acknowledge the M\u0101ori Affairs Committee, which went throughout the Ng\u0101ti Hineuru district and heard the accounts. I will not address those, because you, the committee members, were the ones who heard those accounts. However, I do acknowledge the chair and you, the members of our group, our committee of Parliament; you have a big role to play.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000043\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ec266512-9fe8-47da-883e-48f046ee5059\u0022\u003EMy ears are focused on the nature of Meka Whaitiri\u2019s comments and assuring her that it is not possible to dispute what she has stated beyond the M\u0101ori land legislation, but I will come to that presently. The circumstances around the disputes and battles were discussed further at Petone, and what is more, the name Te Rangih\u012Broa was the subject of discussion which has been written into the records of Parliament\u2014and so I will not go back to those.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000044\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ec266512-9fe8-47da-883e-48f046ee5059\u0022\u003EIn regard to the Land Court, that is indeed correct. The Land Court was involved in the negotiations for you, Ng\u0101ti Hineuru. Its role under the Act was to steal the land, and that, perhaps, is the situation as far as the M\u0101ori Land Court is concerned. Therefore, I agree with that sort of talk and that kind of history! I agree also with what that member is saying\u2014that the power of the trustee, in terms of Ng\u0101ti Hineuru land, should be returned to you. I agree to that and will not prolong those comments, because it has been mentioned and is out there already. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000045\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ec266512-9fe8-47da-883e-48f046ee5059\u0022\u003EPerhaps I have one or two more supplementary statements to add to those that were made. The first one is in regard to a tribe going before the Waitangi Tribunal but at the same time ahead of another tribe; that is not a new situation at all. That is the situation in all claims! I have my own power and my own history, but\u2014hello\u2014what that tribe, that one, and that one are saying is quite different. So what happens now? Go to the court and settle the part that concerns you and the part that concerns me. It is similar as well, shall we say, to the Central North Island collective claims of which you are well aware. We have been fighting amongst ourselves for over 3 years for the region that I have and that that one, that one, and that one have. And so in the end it is a trip to the court to negotiate matters relating to land boundaries and authority\u2014none of that is a new situation. Therefore, I disagree with what the member has said.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000046\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ec266512-9fe8-47da-883e-48f046ee5059\u0022\u003ESecondly, I agreed with her opening remark in the closing stages of her address and where she said \u201CThere is a place for the law\u201D. Quite correct! It was the law that abused and plundered this land under the cloak, according to the law, justly and honestly. The problem was that it was not really like that. We are still here trying to sort out those situations.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000047\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ec266512-9fe8-47da-883e-48f046ee5059\u0022\u003EShe alluded to the situation concerning the M\u0101ori land legislation. She apologised for turning to that matter, but this is the situation in the House: the protocol is first one side and then the other side. One side stands and delivers, then the other side responds. Eventually the third reading is reached, and contributions must remain focused on this task at hand\u2014which is your claim, Ng\u0101ti Hineuru.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000048\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ec266512-9fe8-47da-883e-48f046ee5059\u0022\u003EIn terms of the M\u0101ori land legislation, I put it like this: it began in 1993; 5 years after\u2014hello\u2014changes began to happen. From that time onwards, discussions took place each year right up until the year just gone. So despite the member\u2019s assertion there has only been a short period for consultation, in terms of public consultation, that is not it at all\u2014the time devoted to this matter has been long enough. Her agenda was to amend the concerns you, Ng\u0101ti Hineuru, raised in your claim. Firstly, that the autonomy of M\u0101ori land must remain in the hands of M\u0101oridom. Secondly, if Ng\u0101ti Hineuru wants to develop its own land then it must have a say in that. No one else has a say in it; not the court, no one else. And, to my knowledge, Ng\u0101ti Hineuru agrees to that statement.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000049\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ec266512-9fe8-47da-883e-48f046ee5059\u0022\u003EWell, now to the third matter. M\u0101ori land is a treasure handed down; it is a treasure and must never be taken by someone else. As I understand it, Ng\u0101ti Hineuru agrees to that statement. Therefore, what is the problem? What else is there for us to consider in the months ahead? What else is there for us to delve into at depth, and for what purpose? The member is right\u2014we must never go back to actions of suppression and deception through the Act that enabled the Crown to alienate land and secure ownership of it without the policy. Therefore welcome, Ng\u0101ti Hineuru, welcome into Parliament to discuss these matters.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000050\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ec266512-9fe8-47da-883e-48f046ee5059\u0022\u003EThe member has set down the historical context; it was considered in the first reading. And so when we come back for the third reading, suffice to say we will celebrate the circumstance and not the actions of the M\u0101ori Land Court, not the constabulary, disputes, and battles. We will celebrate the reason it took you so long to follow up this matter over the years\u2014the return of the mana to you, in other words\u2014to get back one small benefit for you collectively in the years to come.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000051\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ec266512-9fe8-47da-883e-48f046ee5059\u0022\u003ESo enough and welcome. Listen to the contributions. And I leave it there. At the third reading we will assemble here again to celebrate. Welcome and acknowledgments to you, Ng\u0101ti Hineuru. My acknowledgments to the members of the House throughout, and to all of us indeed, thank you. I resume my seat.]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00222df33ee5-23d6-441c-a9ba-6495aa69f9fd\u0022 data-id=\u0022fb4c8a8d66db49af8b595f5f1805276b\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000052\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00222df33ee5-23d6-441c-a9ba-6495aa69f9fd\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022fb4c8a8d66db49af8b595f5f1805276b\u0022\u003EDENISE ROCHE (Green):\u003C/span\u003E Te M\u0101ngai o Te Whare, t\u0113n\u0101 koe, t\u0113n\u0101 koutou, e Te Whare. Ki a koutou ng\u0101 uri o Ng\u0101ti Hineuru e rere haere ana ng\u0101 mihi aroha o Te R\u014Dp\u016B K\u0101k\u0101riki ki a koutou katoa i t\u0113nei r\u0101 whakahirahira \u014D koutou, t\u0113n\u0101 t\u0101tou katoa.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000053\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00222df33ee5-23d6-441c-a9ba-6495aa69f9fd\u0022\u003E[Thank you, Mr Assistant Speaker, and to you collectively, the House. To you, the descendants of Ng\u0101ti Hineuru, affectionate empathy goes to you all from the Green Party on this inspirational day of yours, so congratulations to us all.]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000054\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00222df33ee5-23d6-441c-a9ba-6495aa69f9fd\u0022\u003EI rise to take the call for the Green Party in this, the second reading of the Hineuru Claims Settlement Bill, and I am doing so on behalf of Catherine Delahunty, who addressed Parliament at the first reading. So I am just taking her place for today. Firstly, I want to acknowledge the people of Hineuru who have got the legislation in this settlement to where it is today, and I include in that acknowledgment not only the people who have worked on the negotiations since 2010 but also those of previous generations who have worked their entire lives for justice for their people. And, like the others before me, I do want to acknowledge those who have passed on. I want to acknowledge the M\u0101ori Affairs Committee, also the submitters who sent in their submissions, and those who came and spoke to the committee in person in Napier. I have read through some of the submissions, and I have also read the deed of settlement. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000055\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00222df33ee5-23d6-441c-a9ba-6495aa69f9fd\u0022\u003EI agree with my colleague Catherine Delahunty that the history of Ng\u0101ti Hineuru has been invisibilised. It is a harrowing read. But I feel it necessary to read of the tragic losses and grief that have been suffered by the people, in order to understand this settlement itself. That history includes the alienation from their land and from the people of Hineuru through mostly foul means, as well as the historical injustices that were meted out to the people. I want to just quote from one part of the summary of the deed of settlement: \u201CThirty-four Hineuru individuals were among the 86 prisoners of the Crown captured at \u014Cmarunui and the conflict near P\u0113tane. Most were transported to the Chatham Islands and detained without trial in harsh conditions for almost two years. In 1868 the prisoners escaped and became embroiled in a war with the Crown. During this war Crown forces attacked Ng\u0101tapa in January 1869. After the attack a severed head reported to belong to Nikora of Hineuru was brought back to the Crown camp. Crown forces summarily executed a number of prisoners captured at Ng\u0101tapa.\u201D \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000056\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00222df33ee5-23d6-441c-a9ba-6495aa69f9fd\u0022\u003EThis history is important. This history must hurt a lot. And it is the scars that the people of Hineuru bear today that this settlement seeks to heal. This history is hardly known by P\u0101keh\u0101. This history is not taught in schools, and that is another tragedy, for how can young M\u0101ori plot their future if they do not know their past? And a wider knowledge of the history of people\u2014the frequently brutal story of colonisation\u2014would maybe go some way towards preventing the ignorant and casual racism that pervades our society. So, yes, I think this history should be compulsory in schools. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000057\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00222df33ee5-23d6-441c-a9ba-6495aa69f9fd\u0022\u003EI want to acknowledge that in this settlement Ng\u0101ti Hineuru have identified six pou that they want to see realised, and others have touched on them. They are the restoration and protection of Hineuru\u2019s cultural heritage; the health and well-being of their people; the recognition of Hineuru\u2019s mana and the restoration of their relationships with neighbouring iwi, which is very important; the reassertion of Hineuru presence throughout the rohe; the ability to rebuild an economic base for the iwi; and the revitalisation of Hineuru\u2019s role as kaitiaki of the environment and their resources. And I note that the negotiations have tried to achieve that with this redress package, which includes financial redress of $25 million in the financial redress, plus $2 million for cultural revitalisation, plus some commercial redress, and the statutory recognition and deeds of recognition of w\u0101hi tapu in places where Ng\u0101ti Hineuru have special association. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000058\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00222df33ee5-23d6-441c-a9ba-6495aa69f9fd\u0022\u003EI also want to acknowledge that in this settlement Ng\u0101ti Hineuru have shown great generosity. One example is not only accepting this settlement, which does not cover their losses, but also things like the Waipunga Falls Scenic Reserve, which will be vested in Hineuru and held by them for 10 days but then returned as a gift to all New Zealanders. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000059\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00222df33ee5-23d6-441c-a9ba-6495aa69f9fd\u0022\u003EI do have to say that, although the Greens celebrate with iwi the great achievements in getting this settlement through the House, we also have concerns about the settlement process itself. I note the supportive submissions of some of the neighbouring iwi, like Maungaharuru-Tangit\u016B, but I also note the concerns of, for example, Ng\u0101i Tahu ki Waikare about the competing interests in the M\u014Dhaka-Wakare block. Our concern is that the Crown determines whom it will negotiate with, and it, obviously, prefers to deal with large natural groupings\u2014that is what it says. So, essentially, again, the Crown holds the power. It determines who is in and who is out. I know it is a very difficult decision around who gets what but it is the Crown that determines it, and our concern is that that reinforces the Crown\u2019s position as a coloniser and it pits iwi against iwi, hap\u016B against hap\u016B. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000060\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00222df33ee5-23d6-441c-a9ba-6495aa69f9fd\u0022\u003EWe know that there can be many interests from hap\u016B and iwi in some significant places, because of the nature of relationships\u2014the interweaving of the strands of whakapapa. However, the decision about who gets what rests with the Crown, and we worry about the potential that has to create additional grievances. Having said that, we acknowledge the negotiators who have had to balance those interests, and particularly the negotiators from Ng\u0101ti Hineuru, who have achieved the best settlement they can. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000061\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00222df33ee5-23d6-441c-a9ba-6495aa69f9fd\u0022\u003EFor the record, I do have to state that the Greens never\u2014and we do not with this one either\u2014accept the settlement as full and final, regardless of what it says in the deed of settlement. It is certainly not full when you compare the losses\u2014the huge losses; the terrible hurts\u2014with the compensation. It is certainly not a full settlement, and we do not think it is final, because the historical breaches\u2014what happened in the past\u2014may yet affect generations to come in ways that we have not foreseen, and I know that Ng\u0101ti Hineuru, in common with iwi across the country, have no wish to short-change the children yet to come. We do, however, recognise that this settlement is the best that could be negotiated for Ng\u0101ti Hineuru in these circumstances. We hope that it will be an economic base, a way to restore their mana, and that their people will be restored to their rightful place. We therefore commend the bill to the House. T\u0113n\u0101 koutou, t\u0113n\u0101 koutou, t\u0113n\u0101 koutou katoa. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002281825190-fd5d-4ed0-bb80-f12f3c93e653\u0022 data-id=\u0022dd40bab00b974a0794806edcee871d43\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000062\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002281825190-fd5d-4ed0-bb80-f12f3c93e653\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022dd40bab00b974a0794806edcee871d43\u0022\u003ERINO TIRIKATENE (Labour\u2014Te Tai Tonga):\u003C/span\u003E T\u0113n\u0101 koe, Mr Assistant Speaker, \u0101, t\u0113n\u0101 koutou \u014Dku rangatira huri rauna i t\u014D t\u0101tou Whare. E t\u016B tautoko ana ahau i t\u0113nei pire i t\u014Dna p\u0101nui tuarua. Ki a koutou Ng\u0101ti Hineuru, nau mai haere mai, piki mai, whakatau mai ki Te Whare P\u0101remata e takat\u016B nei, t\u0113n\u0101 koutou, t\u0113n\u0101 koutou, \u0101, t\u0113n\u0101 t\u0101tou katoa.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000063\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002281825190-fd5d-4ed0-bb80-f12f3c93e653\u0022\u003E[Thank you, Mr Assistant Speaker, and acknowledgments to you, my noble ones around and throughout our House. I endorse this bill in its second reading. Welcome to you, Ng\u0101ti Hineuru, come hither, climb aboard, and pay homage to Parliament waiting here in readiness; so greetings, salutations, and acknowledgments to you collectively and to us all.]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000064\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002281825190-fd5d-4ed0-bb80-f12f3c93e653\u0022\u003EIt is a pleasure to speak in support of this bill at its second reading. It was a great honour to be on the M\u0101ori Affairs Committee when this bill was being considered and to travel up to the Hawke\u2019s Bay with our\u2014well, it was actually only half of the select committee, because we split on that particular day. But it is very important that we do travel to the takiw\u0101\u2014well, near enough to the takiw\u0101 involved\u2014so that we can hear all of the submitters, especially the hau k\u0101inga. It is always a pleasure. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000065\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002281825190-fd5d-4ed0-bb80-f12f3c93e653\u0022\u003EI have sat on a few Treaty settlement bills in my time, when I was on the select committee, and the issues are very similar right across the board through every Treaty settlement, and I guess that was evidenced by the submitters who came forward. I am pleased that the overwhelming majority of all the submitters were wholeheartedly in support of this bill, in particular the neighbouring iwi in Maungaharuru-Tangit\u016B. I was very pleased to see the support of the whole area, because there are a lot of connections between those various iwi, and they go back a long way. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000066\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002281825190-fd5d-4ed0-bb80-f12f3c93e653\u0022\u003EJust to remind this House, actually, for those who do not know where the country of Ng\u0101ti Hineuru is, it is\u2014it will not be accurate if I give geographic points. I could try, but it would probably not be effective. If you could picture it, for those who are familiar with the area, driving on the highway from Taup\u014D to Napier, from Tarawera on the Napier-Taup\u014D highway you go up to Te H\u0101roto, over the saddle, and down into the Hawke\u2019s Bay. So it is a massive, massive area. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000067\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002281825190-fd5d-4ed0-bb80-f12f3c93e653\u0022\u003EI am well familiar with Te H\u0101roto; I have actually been to Ng\u0101ti Hineuru as a young child. I was in the R\u0101tana band. We were up there for\u2014it must have been a whakamoemiti or hui of great note, but I remember it very well because it was snowing and it was extremely cold, and I was there, shivering in my uniform with my fellow band members. We could hardly get out a note, it was that cold. So we did not sound too good, marching on\u2014in fact, we were very quick marching on. But I do have fond memories of Te H\u0101roto, even though it was mightily cold\u2014even from someone from the south. I do know what the cold is like, but it was certainly cold up there on that particular day. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000068\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002281825190-fd5d-4ed0-bb80-f12f3c93e653\u0022\u003EJust getting back to the submitters, there was a lot of local support. It was wonderful to hear those supportive submitters. There were submitters such as Ng\u0101i Tahu, and I know we all perk up when we hear \u201CNg\u0101i Tahu\u201D but there is no connection to the southern Ng\u0101i Tahu; this is a hap\u016B from up those ways.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000069\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022073496a0-73b7-426f-97f8-916bd542b0fa\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022bb37ff68ed824b3e8de4ae63b2fabd3d\u0022\u003EMeka Whaitiri\u003C/span\u003E: P\u0101hauwera. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000070\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002281825190-fd5d-4ed0-bb80-f12f3c93e653\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002297c138026ddd45fb938d18e412fc5335\u0022\u003ERINO TIRIKATENE\u003C/span\u003E: P\u0101hauwera, that is right. We heard similar submissions when the P\u0101hauwera settlement was going through and when the Maungaharuru-Tangit\u016B settlement was going through, in terms of who is included in what and who should be included on this. It is always difficult when peoples are on those boundaries or they all sort of mix together or are intermingled. But we heard those submitters, and those matters were clearly dealt with in the P\u0101hauwera settlement and also in the Maungaharuru one. It was very clear that Ng\u0101ti Hineuru definitely have their own grievances and their own settlement. That was made clear to us, but I do acknowledge those Ng\u0101i Tahu submitters who were there to have their particular say. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000071\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002281825190-fd5d-4ed0-bb80-f12f3c93e653\u0022\u003ENg\u0101ti Hineuru, as I said, is this vast geographical area, but it has actually been involved in four Waitangi Tribunal inquiries. So we are talking about T\u016Bhoe, we are talking about Taihape, we are talking about the central North Island\u2014and one other. It is a vast area. Oh, it was M\u014Dhaka ki Ahuriri. How could I forget the main one? It is a vast geographical area in a M\u0101ori sense, in an iwi sense, and it is really gratifying to know that we are progressing this bill so that Ng\u0101ti Hineuru can assert their identity, assert their mana, and their tino rangatiratanga over their ancestral landscape and over their tribal whenua. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000072\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002281825190-fd5d-4ed0-bb80-f12f3c93e653\u0022\u003EI was pleased to note that Ng\u0101ti Hineuru do not muck around. They are a very progressive iwi. They have been working very hard\u2014so hard that they have even purchased a farm that was a right of first refusal in their deed of settlement, which would be expiring later this year, but I understand they have already taken up that right of first refusal and have purchased the Woodstock farm\u2014I would prefer to say their maunga tapu. It is their maunga tapu. They have purchased quite a large farm and adjoining forest lands, which are part of their maunga tapu, and it is wonderful that through this Treaty settlement, through the cultural redress and commercial redress, they have already been able to activate those hard-fought gains that they have managed to achieve within their settlement to bring their whenua back to their people and to be able to stand on their own maunga. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000073\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002281825190-fd5d-4ed0-bb80-f12f3c93e653\u0022\u003EI do not want to prolong my contribution, but I do support Ng\u0101ti Hineuru for travelling down today through the storms and the lightning and the thunder. They were able to make it here safely to see this House support the safe passage of their bill, and I commend it at its second reading. I commend the swift passage of this bill through the House. Kia ora t\u0101tou. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022cba965bb-864f-4e06-99dc-6fcdfd007ad5\u0022 data-id=\u0022bc961cd8dba0429ca94191e8d83c200a\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000074\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cba965bb-864f-4e06-99dc-6fcdfd007ad5\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022bc961cd8dba0429ca94191e8d83c200a\u0022\u003EPITA PARAONE (NZ First):\u003C/span\u003E \u0100, t\u0113n\u0101 koe, Mr Assistant Speaker, t\u0113n\u0101 hoki t\u0101tou e noho nei i roto i Te Whare i te ata nei. E t\u016B ake t\u0113nei ki te tautoko i ng\u0101 mihi i mihingia e ng\u0101 kaik\u014Drero i t\u016B ake i mua i a au \u0113ngari, e te tuakana, Adrian, e mihi ana hoki ki a koe nau nei i whakaritengia w\u0101 t\u0101tou noho i te ata nei. E tika ana kia huri ng\u0101 whakaaro ki Te Runga Rawa kia \u012Bnoi atu ki a Ia, kia pai ai \u014D t\u0101tou mahi i te r\u0101 nei. \u0112ngari tua atu i t\u0113n\u0101, e tika ana kia mihi hoki ki a koutou m\u0101 Ng\u0101ti Hineuru i tae mai i waenganui i a t\u0101tou i te ata nei, me koutou e noho mai n\u0101 i te w\u0101 k\u0101inga, me koutou hoki e m\u0101takitaki mai ana i runga i te pouaka whakaata ki \u0113nei k\u014Drero e p\u0101 ana ki t\u0101 koutou ker\u0113me.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000075\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cba965bb-864f-4e06-99dc-6fcdfd007ad5\u0022\u003E\u0100, mihi hoki ki t\u0113n\u0101 o ng\u0101 mate maha kei waenganui i a koutou n\u0101 Te Minita i whakahuangia te ingoa, a Whet\u016B n\u0101 te mea, ko ia tetahi i kawea atu i t\u0113nei kaupapa i runga i te h\u012Bkoitanga o t\u0113nei take ki Te Whare nei. He mihi hoki ki a ia kua t\u016B honohono ki t\u0113r\u0101 o ng\u0101 mate kei waenganui i a m\u0101tou, mai Te Tai Tokerau, n\u0101, ko Manuera Tohu t\u0113n\u0101. Ko ia tetahi o ng\u0101 pou o Te K\u014Dhanga Reo, n\u0101 reira, e tika ana kia mihi tonu ki a r\u0101tou.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000076\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cba965bb-864f-4e06-99dc-6fcdfd007ad5\u0022\u003E\u0100, ka hoki mai ki a t\u0101tou te hunga ora, t\u0113n\u0101 koutou, t\u0113n\u0101 koutou, t\u0113n\u0101 koutou.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000077\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cba965bb-864f-4e06-99dc-6fcdfd007ad5\u0022\u003E[Thank you, Mr Assistant Speaker, and acknowledgments to us seated here in the House this morning. I stand to support the tributes accorded by speakers who got up before me, but to you in particular, Adrian, my senior, a special thankyou for conducting a prayer over us seated here this morning. It is proper that thoughts are cast up to heaven, to Him, to ensure our work goes well today. But that aside, it is proper as well that you collectively of Ng\u0101ti Hineuru who have arrived here amongst us today be acknowledged, plus those of you back home, as well, watching these contributions on television that relate to your claims.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000078\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cba965bb-864f-4e06-99dc-6fcdfd007ad5\u0022\u003EA tribute also to that one of the many deaths amongst you, whom the Minister for M\u0101ori Development named as being Whet\u016B, because he was one who took this proposal on its trek to this House here\u2014a tribute to him, united now with that other one of our deaths in the north, Manuera Tohu, one of the pillars of the k\u014Dhanga reo institution. Therefore, it is fitting that we continue to pay a tribute to them.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000079\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cba965bb-864f-4e06-99dc-6fcdfd007ad5\u0022\u003EAnd so we come back to us, the living; acknowledgments, salutations, and congratulations to you collectively.]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000080\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cba965bb-864f-4e06-99dc-6fcdfd007ad5\u0022\u003EOn behalf of New Zealand First I stand to support this bill in its second reading. As an earlier speaker pointed out, this is the opportunity to report on the submissions that were presented to the M\u0101ori Affairs Committee, which I felt privileged to be a member of. The Minister for Treaty of Waitangi Negotiations quite rightly points out that the bill is about settling all claims and providing cultural redress to the iwi, together with financial redress, to allow them to go forward in terms of the economic development of the iwi. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000081\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cba965bb-864f-4e06-99dc-6fcdfd007ad5\u0022\u003ECan I say that the committee received 13 submissions, and a majority of them were in favour of the bill. However, there were one or two submitters who spoke in opposition to the bill, and a number of concerns were also raised by those who supported the bill, not least of all the concern was that, as an iwi, they had not been recognised by the system\u2014I am talking about Statistics New Zealand. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000082\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cba965bb-864f-4e06-99dc-6fcdfd007ad5\u0022\u003EMembers may recall that during the first reading of this bill I expressed my envy of Ng\u0101ti Hineuru, whose population, according to the information that was provided to us, was around the vicinity of 1,500. Yet my wh\u0101nau exceeds the 5,000s\u2014and that is just the Paraone wh\u0101nau. But I belong to\u2014well, I refer to\u2014an iwi called Ng\u0101ti Hine in the north. And we are not even recognised as an iwi. Kia ahatia, kia ahatia? Koin\u0101 te \u0101huatanga o t\u0101tou!\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000083\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cba965bb-864f-4e06-99dc-6fcdfd007ad5\u0022\u003E[So what? So what of it? That is how it goes with us!]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000084\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cba965bb-864f-4e06-99dc-6fcdfd007ad5\u0022\u003EBut I am making the point, in support of this bill, that Ng\u0101ti Hineuru should be given due recognition, and when the next census is carried out, I would want to see Ng\u0101ti Hineuru on the list\u2014next to Ng\u0101ti Hine. But if that is going to be a prevention of Ng\u0101ti Hineuru being on the list, then I am quite happy to stand down, because you have got to this stage as part of your settlement process and I think that it should be duly recognised. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000085\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cba965bb-864f-4e06-99dc-6fcdfd007ad5\u0022\u003EAs part of that whole process also, some disquiet was mentioned about not being able to participate in the fisheries allocation, although being an iwi. And we can understand that. But I just want to say to Ng\u0101ti Hineuru that Ng\u0101ti Hine is mentioned in the actual Maori Fisheries Act, but we have yet to see a scale. But that is another matter\u2014hoi an\u014D. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000086\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cba965bb-864f-4e06-99dc-6fcdfd007ad5\u0022\u003EThe report of the select committee also mentions the issue around the M\u014Dhaka-Waikare block. The report, quite rightly, says that we heard the concerns of a representative of the Ng\u0101i Tahu ki Waikare ancestral owners who queried the right of Ng\u0101ti Hineuru to include that part of their lands into their claim. We were aware that the Crown carried out investigations into the historical interests in the area before offering Hineuru redress in the M\u014Dhaka-Waikare block, and these investigations found that Hineuru in fact has customary interests in the block. After the agreement in principle between the Crown and Hineuru was signed, the Crown consulted with all overlapping claimants to enable fair and appropriate redress. I think, in this respect, that that process needs to be commended because of the support that was provided by those iwi who had overlapping claims. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000087\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cba965bb-864f-4e06-99dc-6fcdfd007ad5\u0022\u003EThe Office of Treaty Settlements advised the committee that Ng\u0101i Tahu ki Waikare is included in the definitions of Ng\u0101ti P\u0101hauwera and Maungaharuru-Tangit\u016B Hap\u016B claimants, and that those groups were part of the consultation on overlapping claims. Redress was provided in deeds of settlement for both groups to settle all of their historical claims. Therefore the Office of Treaty Settlements believes that the Crown has adequately considered the interests of Ng\u0101i Tahu ki Waikare. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000088\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cba965bb-864f-4e06-99dc-6fcdfd007ad5\u0022\u003EIn terms of those who opposed the bill, one submitter was astonished that a hap\u016B of T\u016Bwharetoa Taup\u014D has a Treaty of Waitangi grievance claim to lands outside of their ancestral boundaries. They referred to Hineuru as a hap\u016B, alongside other T\u016Bwharetoa hap\u016B, that has received p\u016Btea from land sales beginning in 1859 through to the 1900s. They said that Hineuru was a major beneficiary of the M\u014Dhaka-Waikare land during the gift-back of confiscated land, including the Tarawera, Tataraakina, and Pohokura blocks. We also heard from another submitter, who objected to the claims settlement bill pertaining to the Waitara block that the Crown retained after confiscation in 1869. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000089\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cba965bb-864f-4e06-99dc-6fcdfd007ad5\u0022\u003EBefore I conclude, I just want to support some of the comments made by the Greens spokesperson in terms of this bill not being a complete settlement, in terms of iwi groups. But we do acknowledge the contribution that these settlements make to our nation. I commend this bill to the House. Kia ora.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002229c236aa-2283-4690-9a84-aa865404bb61\u0022 data-id=\u00226ea3e7b7c4cb4055b6a4ad5999d71f21\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000090\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002229c236aa-2283-4690-9a84-aa865404bb61\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00226ea3e7b7c4cb4055b6a4ad5999d71f21\u0022\u003ENUK KORAKO (National):\u003C/span\u003E T\u0113n\u0101 koe e Te M\u0101ngai o Te Whare, e mihi atu ki a koutou ng\u0101 mema o Te Whare P\u0101remata. N\u014D reira, e ng\u0101 uri o Rangih\u012Broa, Ng\u0101ti Hineuru, M\u0101taatua Waka, M\u014Dhaka Awa, T\u012Bt\u012B\u014Dkura Mauka, e mihi nei, e tangi nei, e mihi atu ki a koutou katoa. Mauria mai he whakaako ki te kaupapa nunui, \u0101, ko t\u0113nei r\u0101, e mihi atu ki a koutou.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000091\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002229c236aa-2283-4690-9a84-aa865404bb61\u0022\u003E[Thank you, Mr Assistant Speaker, and I acknowledge you, members of Parliament. To you, the descendants of Rangih\u012Broa, Ng\u0101ti Hineuru, M\u0101taatua Canoe, M\u014Dhaka River, and T\u012Bt\u012B\u014Dkura Mountain, grieving and mourning here, I acknowledge you all. Bring forth a learning of huge significance, which is this day; I salute you.]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000092\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002229c236aa-2283-4690-9a84-aa865404bb61\u0022\u003EI want to also, first of all, acknowledge the M\u0101ori Affairs Committee, as its chair, and say that it has actually presented here today a lot of the background to the Hineuru Claims Settlement Bill. So as the chair of the M\u0101ori Affairs Committee I say there are just two important points that I would like to make, and they concern, actually, the progress to the second reading. In the first reading we covered very much the historical aspects of this claim, this settlement. In this one it came down to the M\u0101ori Affairs Committee, and then from there we heard the 13 submissions. I think the important thing is that in those submissions we heard for and against. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000093\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002229c236aa-2283-4690-9a84-aa865404bb61\u0022\u003ESo the first one I want to talk about is one that was actually for\u2014one of the many that was for\u2014the Hineuru Claims Settlement Bill. This one came from Karauna Brown, who is also one of the co - lead negotiators. Karauna spoke of the mamae and the pain that is being carried to this day by Ng\u0101ti Hineuru, particularly around the Crown confiscations. Karauna also highlighted the way the settlement provides recognition for Hineuru as an iwi, as a people. Hineuru have often been listed as a hap\u016B of other iwi, such as Kahungunu or T\u016Bwharetoa. Hineuru members have been reminded every 4 years during the census that they are not actually seen as being a listed iwi for them to select, but the members of Hineuru have continued to consider themselves to be an iwi in their own right, despite the Crown\u2019s actions to undermine their status. This settlement recognises the mana of Hineuru as a distinct iwi and restores them to the place of relativity with other iwi in partnership with the Crown, so that, to me, is one of the real highlights of this Treaty settlement bill. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000094\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002229c236aa-2283-4690-9a84-aa865404bb61\u0022\u003EThe next one is, again, from a party from the other side, which did not agree with this settlement. The M\u0101ori Affairs Committee actually hears\u2014one of the great things about this is it is an opportunity for those who are involved in that whakapapa in the particular iwi to actually come and address the M\u0101ori Affairs Committee. The one I am talking about is from the representatives from Ng\u0101i Tahu ki Waikare. These were ancestral owners, as they said, who submitted before the committee, and they have interests in the M\u014Dhaka-Waikare block, which has been highlighted here a number of times today. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000095\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002229c236aa-2283-4690-9a84-aa865404bb61\u0022\u003EI think the important thing, though, with the M\u0101ori Affairs Committee is that we did give this a very, very good hearing, and, particularly, it was a very, very long discussion, as well. We took into account the historical interests and then also one of the important parts as to the whakapapa, and all of that, but at the end of the day it was a consensus of the committee that we found no reason to disagree with the Crown\u2019s conclusion. So they are the two important submissions, I believe, in this process, in which we confirmed we would move this bill to the second reading. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000096\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002229c236aa-2283-4690-9a84-aa865404bb61\u0022\u003EI look forward again to this particular Treaty settlement coming back so that it can go through its Committee stage and then into its third reading. You will notice that we have only a very, very short time on this side of the House to actually k\u014Drero, but on that note, hopefully, I have highlighted those two most important points. N\u014D reira, I commend this bill to the House. Kia ora.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022b4a597dd-ed8b-42b8-975b-40c6e0cdaee1\u0022 data-id=\u00226f6b3432a3b4497b960b5e3afe6357ad\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000097\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b4a597dd-ed8b-42b8-975b-40c6e0cdaee1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00226f6b3432a3b4497b960b5e3afe6357ad\u0022\u003ELOUISA WALL (Labour\u2014Manurewa):\u003C/span\u003E T\u0113n\u0101 koe e Te M\u0101ngai o Te Whare, e ng\u0101 mana, e ng\u0101 reo, rau rangatira m\u0101, t\u0113n\u0101 koutou, t\u0113n\u0101 koutou, t\u0113n\u0101 t\u0101tou katoa. Ng\u0101 mihi r\u0101 ki ng\u0101 whanaunga, ng\u0101 uri o Ng\u0101ti Hineuru, t\u0113n\u0101 t\u0101tou.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000098\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b4a597dd-ed8b-42b8-975b-40c6e0cdaee1\u0022\u003E[Thank you, Mr Assistant Speaker, and to the powers, voices, and esteemed ones of a hundredfold, acknowledgments, salutations, and greetings to us all. Acknowledgments indeed to the relatives and descendants of Ng\u0101ti Hineuru; greetings to us.]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000099\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b4a597dd-ed8b-42b8-975b-40c6e0cdaee1\u0022\u003EI stand here as a descendant of Ng\u0101ti Hineuru, incredibly proud to be in the House in the second reading of the Hineuru Claims Settlement Bill. What I have decided to do is to actually let the voice of Ng\u0101ti Hineuru speak in this process, and what I want to do is quote from some of the submissions that were heard by my colleagues during the select committee process. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000100\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b4a597dd-ed8b-42b8-975b-40c6e0cdaee1\u0022\u003EThe first such is Ivy Kahukiwa-Smith, and I quote from her submission: \u201CI get emotional thinking about the journey we have travelled. The most powerful aspect that has been hard for me has been hearing our histories and our stories. The stories of our struggles, our fights, the loss of life and whenua, and the consequence of being nearly landless are stories that have been really hard to hear. However, in learning these stories, it is important that this information is never lost. I am excited for the future because there is light beyond all of [the] pain and anguish suffered by my tupuna and it starts again with the finalisation of this settlement. Our Hineuru people deserve this. I think about all of those people who have been victims of this claim. I think about our old people who fought over many years and who are not alive to see the settlement come to fruition. Our old people deserve this. This settlement is about them. It is about making sure they are recognised for the mamae they have suffered as a consequence of the actions of the Crown. This is also about our future and about building a stronger Hineuru. With this settlement, we are able to make sure our people are well looked after. It is as much about the past as it is about our future.\u201D \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000101\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b4a597dd-ed8b-42b8-975b-40c6e0cdaee1\u0022\u003EI would also like to quote from the submission of Karauna Brown: \u201COur people were peaceful people, but the Crown believed that we were rebels and so we were attacked. They were peaceful, but being at Omarunui, they were absolutely slaughtered. Our people were then imprisoned and taken to the Chatham Islands where they lived in inhumane conditions before coming back with Te Kooti. Our people were then stripped of their land by the Crown through various means and now we are centrally located in a very small settlement; Te Haroto. There was a huge mamae for me from the battle of Omarunui because in that slaughter was my own koro and his name is Te Wano. He is on one of the poupou in our whare. Because of my Koro, I continue this journey today. He started it, and now I hope I can take it over and finally finish it. He deserves it and so too my mokopuna. As a negotiator, when I heard the Crown offer the apology, I had a bit of a tangi. This is because it brought back a lot of the mamae that we carry from the raupatu. It brings back all of the memories of the stories. One major aspect of the settlement for me is recognition of who we are as a people. We are not a hap\u016B of Kahungunu or Tuwharetoa, but we are an iwi in our own right. This settlement has been about us fighting to rebuild our mana as an iwi. For far too long, we have been subsumed into other iwi. This settlement provides us with another standing to be recognised as an iwi and to stand proud as Hineuru.\u201D \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000102\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b4a597dd-ed8b-42b8-975b-40c6e0cdaee1\u0022\u003EToi T\u0101whai\u2019s submission says: \u201CThe reason why I support this Bill is because of how proud I am to be Hineuru, how proud I am to have been part of this journey and how I believe it is an important step in us moving forward as an iwi. Given the effort of all negotiators involved, and how long it has taken to come this far, I believe we got the best settlement we could have in the circumstances. \u2026 I think that this settlement will make our future brighter and allow us to remedy the grievances that the Crown has inflicted on us in the past. It will enable us \u2026 to move forward with mana. The Hineuru settlement does not compensate us for all of our grievances, nor does it satisfy every single member of Hineuru. No settlement will ever be sufficient to fix or to right the wrongs of the past or to satisfy everyone. However, as someone who is involved in this kaupapa, I can say that we have worked tirelessly to achieve this outcome for our people.\u201D \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000103\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b4a597dd-ed8b-42b8-975b-40c6e0cdaee1\u0022\u003EI would now like to quote from Tirohia Bridger\u2019s submission: \u201CFor me this bill is the end of a long, hard journey that my mother began when this kaupapa started decades ago. Her name is Hine (Gladys) Campbell and her life\u2019s work has been working for her iwi, Hineuru. At times this mahi, for her, was very difficult and her work has not been rewarded. She also did not get to see the benefits that this Treaty settlement will bring for the iwi. But I always remember that she never got involved for selfish reasons. One of my mother\u2019s catchphrases when she used to take me around on hui was: \u2018When you start doing this mahi, never ever focus on the money. When you are working for Hineuru, you focus on Hineuru.\u2019 Therefore, for me, the settlement is about my kuia, our generation, and the future mokopuna to come.\u201D \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000104\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b4a597dd-ed8b-42b8-975b-40c6e0cdaee1\u0022\u003EI would now like to quote from R\u0113nata Bush: \u201CThis type of mahi takes a big toll on the wairua, and for me it is important to continue to have karakia. I pray to our heavenly father that we complete this settlement very soon so that we can let go of the pain and mamae of our people, and begin to work toward a better future for our mokopuna.\u201D \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000105\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b4a597dd-ed8b-42b8-975b-40c6e0cdaee1\u0022\u003EAnd, finally, T\u016Bhuiao Kahukiwa: \u201CI remember my kuia and koroua say[ing] to me years ago\u2014I was a mokopuna then. My old people said to me, \u2018Mokopuna, this is all for you. We are fighting for this for you.\u2019 Now that I have grown up, I say to you, my mokopuna, \u2018Moko, this is all for you.\u2019 I was the mokopuna then, but now I am still fighting for my mokopuna. I don\u2019t think my children will see the eventual fruits of this settlement. My mokopuna might see some fruits, but the next generation after that will be hugely rewarded for the pain and suffering caused by my old people. This is for them. We want to finalise this settlement because the future is for Hineuru. It is no one else\u2019s to take it away from them. We are ready to build a stronger future for our mokopuna. I wholeheartedly support the completion of the Hineuru settlement and the finalisation of the Hineuru Claims Settlement Bill.\u201D \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000106\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b4a597dd-ed8b-42b8-975b-40c6e0cdaee1\u0022\u003EI read these out because I think it is important that the voice of Ng\u0101ti Hineuru is recorded in Hansard, and because for me it has always been about the power of our people through this truth and reconciliation process to get to a point of settlement that is very much about our aroha for our t\u016Bpuna, but it is also about us accepting what has happened to us and actually focusing on the future. Every iwi in Aotearoa have their stories, Hineuru have their own stories, but I think it is incumbent upon us in Parliament to make sure that the voices of the people whom we represent and the voices of the people who are involved in the Treaty settlement process actually are the most important voice in this House. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000107\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b4a597dd-ed8b-42b8-975b-40c6e0cdaee1\u0022\u003EI have been listening intently, actually, to the whole focus on identity and the status of an iwi, and how important it is for iwi to be recognised. One of the issues that Hineuru brought up in the select committee process was that it wants recognition through the census. I guess it is an opportunity to recommend to the M\u0101ori Affairs Committee that it is an opportunity for you to write to Minister Foss, who is our Minister of Statistics, and jointly with the Minister of Treaty of Waitangi Negotiations to actually create not a precedent but a principle: that if iwi are recognised through the Treaty settlement process then they automatically should be included in the next census. I actually thank Hineuru for bringing that to the attention of the House, because it is something that we can do and that we can include, possibly not as part of the settlement but as a principle going forward. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000108\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b4a597dd-ed8b-42b8-975b-40c6e0cdaee1\u0022\u003ESo, with my colleagues, I commend this bill to the House, and I am incredibly proud to be here today to witness the passage of this legislation. Kia ora.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022c3d9fd88-4715-419d-be08-e1c4eda7d09e\u0022 data-id=\u002240dc619aeeec472787f94e6c7941ca35\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000109\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c3d9fd88-4715-419d-be08-e1c4eda7d09e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002240dc619aeeec472787f94e6c7941ca35\u0022\u003EMARAMA FOX (Co-Leader\u2014M\u0101ori Party):\u003C/span\u003E E Te Mana Whakaw\u0101, t\u0113n\u0101 koe. T\u0113n\u0101 koutou e hui \u0101-kanohi nei i t\u0113nei r\u0101, koutou i hara mai \u0101-tinana ki te whakarongo \u0101-taringa, ki te tiro atu \u0101-karu, \u0101, ki te rongo \u0101-wairua hoki ki te kiko o ng\u0101 k\u014Drero kua wh\u0101rikihia i t\u0113nei r\u0101, nei te mihi atu ki a koutou i roto i \u014D koutou mate i t\u0113nei w\u0101, ng\u0101 mate o te wiki, o te marama, o te tau \u0113ngari an\u014D m\u014D ng\u0101 tahi rau tau kua hipa, \u014D koutou t\u016Bpuna i mate mai i roto i te pakanga o \u014Cmarunui, kai te mihi atu ki a r\u0101tou katoa. \u0100, n\u0101 reira, t\u0113n\u0101 koutou, t\u0113n\u0101 koutou, kia ora mai t\u0101tou katoa.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000110\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c3d9fd88-4715-419d-be08-e1c4eda7d09e\u0022\u003E[Thank you, Mr Assistant Speaker, and greetings to you gathered here physically, face to face, on this day to hear, see, and spiritually experience the gist of these contributions delivered before you. I acknowledge you collectively in regard to your deaths at this point in time\u2014not just those of the week, month, or year, but those as well of the past hundred years, your ancestors who died in the battle of \u014Cmarunui. I do pay a tribute to them all, so greetings and salutations to you collectively. My appreciation to us all.]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000111\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c3d9fd88-4715-419d-be08-e1c4eda7d09e\u0022\u003ENg\u0101ti Hineuru, like many other iwi in Aotearoa, you have suffered. Ng\u0101ti Hineuru suffered land confiscation under the New Zealand Settlements Act, suffered in the Land Wars at \u014Cmarunui, near P\u0113tane, where Te Rangi H\u012Broa lost his life. The involvement of Hineuru with Te Kooti and your participation in the peaceful Pai M\u0101rire movement branded the people as rebels, which yielded unwarranted attacks. The t\u016Bpuna who survived those attacks were exiled\u2014exiled from the ancestral lands to the Chathams. Whilst the people were exiled the lands were plundered, rendering the people of Hineuru virtually landless. In fact, some of the land was given to other iwi. The Crown detained the ancestors of Hineuru and executed those ancestors without trial. When settlement negotiations started in 2009 Hineuru negotiators provided a set of pou, representing the settlement aspirations: mai i Hineuru, m\u014D Hineuru [from Hineuru, for Hineuru].\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000112\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c3d9fd88-4715-419d-be08-e1c4eda7d09e\u0022\u003EBut what is most astounding to me in the history of this people is the significance of the landholdings, the strategic landholdings in a pivotal part of the central North Island that you once held. They were the arterial routes between Hawke\u2019s Bay and Taup\u014D, Rotorua, and the Bay of Plenty. They included Rangitaiki and K\u0101ingaroa, which, in your submission, was explained as a mahinga kai area, and bordered by Maungaharuru, Te Waka Range, and the K\u0101weka Range where the settlement was\u2014a significant part of the central North Island. What is astounding is that, despite that huge area, after decimating your people the Crown did not even acknowledge your status as an iwi and you were left out of the fisheries settlement because of what the Crown decided you were, because the Crown wanted to make a decision about who you were and where you got to live. You know, from that prominent position that you held and then becoming landless, what is, again, astounding to me is the small area that is coming back to you\u2014the small parcel of land that is coming back to you, the Hineuru people. You have had to use the settlement money to purchase some more land, and the small amount of money the people get is being subsumed further by having to purchase more land. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000113\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c3d9fd88-4715-419d-be08-e1c4eda7d09e\u0022\u003EI ask myself why. I have a 5-minute call only, but I ask myself: why do we do this? When will Aotearoa recognise the gift that our people give in their settlements, because if we took all that should have been returned, our country could not afford it. You, the Hineuru people, have answered why: through your pou: tuatahi restoration, protection, cultural heritage\u2014aroha mai, Mr Assistant Speaker. Your pou explains it. N\u014D reira, t\u0113n\u0101 koutou, kia ora mai t\u0101tou katoa.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022 data-id=\u00225f5ccff70c2443d39107addac4730d05\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000114\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00225f5ccff70c2443d39107addac4730d05\u0022\u003EThe ASSISTANT SPEAKER (Hon Trevor Mallard)\u003C/span\u003E: Joanne Hughes.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022758dcaf3-9976-43ac-8593-79f66ee4da22\u0022 data-id=\u00229b49d44127de4b05bac8a9eabfa7d6ff\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000115\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022758dcaf3-9976-43ac-8593-79f66ee4da22\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00229b49d44127de4b05bac8a9eabfa7d6ff\u0022\u003EJOANNE HAYES (National):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you\u2014Hayes.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000116\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002222beadd9dca0485ba2c3af02227fb20d\u0022\u003EThe ASSISTANT SPEAKER (Hon Trevor Mallard)\u003C/span\u003E: Hayes\u2014sorry, I apologise.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000117\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022758dcaf3-9976-43ac-8593-79f66ee4da22\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022e7000e49225743538977f2af87491ded\u0022\u003EJOANNE HAYES\u003C/span\u003E: \u0100, ka nui te mihi atu ki a koutou ng\u0101 wh\u0101nau o Ng\u0101ti Hineuru. Nau mai, haere mai! \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000118\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022758dcaf3-9976-43ac-8593-79f66ee4da22\u0022\u003E[And so I acknowledge you greatly, the family of Ng\u0101ti Hineuru. Welcome, come hither!] \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000119\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022758dcaf3-9976-43ac-8593-79f66ee4da22\u0022\u003EThis is going to be a short contribution today because we have got to start looking to the future for Ng\u0101ti Hineuru. Much has been said about the content of your bill and the travesty that you suffered through land loss, through the invasion of the Crown on to your land. So I want to turn you to looking towards your future and where to from here, because this is all about the future for mokopuna in Ng\u0101ti Hineuru\u2014remembering the past but looking forward to the future. So without any further ado I want to commend the bill to the House and look forward to the rest of the process to see your bill traverse its way into legislation. Kia ora.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000120\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022758dcaf3-9976-43ac-8593-79f66ee4da22\u0022\u003EBill read a second time.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n    \u003C/div\u003E\n    \u003Cdiv class=\u0022HpsHansard\u0022\u003E\n      \u003Cp\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsProceedingHeading\u0022\u003EBills\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000121\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u00228b56a0d6a14649f1bd6e0a8f7f6dde3d\u0022\u003ENg\u0101i Te Rangi and Ng\u0101 P\u014Dtiki Claims Settlement Bill\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000122\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u00221072395b9b0d429bac77d143d32bf51a\u0022\u003EFirst Reading\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022ec266512-9fe8-47da-883e-48f046ee5059\u0022 data-id=\u0022a207dfe7360b454facfd7ac3849a3108\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000123\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ec266512-9fe8-47da-883e-48f046ee5059\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022a207dfe7360b454facfd7ac3849a3108\u0022\u003EHon TE URUROA FLAVELL (Minister for M\u0101ori Development)\u003C/span\u003E on behalf of the Minister for Treaty of Waitangi Negotiations: T\u0113n\u0101 koe, Mr Assistant Speaker. I move, That the Ng\u0101i Te Rangi and Ng\u0101 P\u014Dtiki Claims Settlement Bill be now read a first time. I nominate the M\u0101ori Affairs Committee to consider the bill.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000124\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ec266512-9fe8-47da-883e-48f046ee5059\u0022\u003EKai aku rangatira o Tauranga Moana, t\u0113n\u0101 koutou, haere mai. He ng\u0101wari t\u0101 koutou noho, kua oti k\u0113 i a m\u0101tau te tuku i t\u0113tahi kupu k\u014Drero ki te w\u0101hi ngaro, an\u0101, kua rongo ng\u0101 uri o Ng\u0101ti Hineuru i t\u0113r\u0101 karakia, \u0101, n\u014D reira kua ea t\u0113r\u0101, kua huri ki a koutou katoa kua haramai i raro i a Mauao, \u0101, i Te \u0100kau o Tauranga Moana, t\u0113n\u0101 koutou, haere mai, haere mai, haere mai! \u0112hara t\u0113nei h\u012Bkoi \u014D koutou i te huarahi h\u014Du, kua tae k\u0113 mai a Ng\u0101ti Ranginui, kua tae k\u0113 mai a Ng\u0101ti P\u016Bkenga. N\u0101, kua eke ki te r\u0101, \u0101, kua eke mai koutou; n\u014D reira, ko t\u0101ku ko te k\u012B, \u0101, hei w\u0101w\u0101hi i te \u0101huatanga o ng\u0101 k\u014Drero, t\u0113n\u0101 koutou, haere mai.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000125\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ec266512-9fe8-47da-883e-48f046ee5059\u0022\u003EHe kitenga kanohi, ka hoki ng\u0101 mahara. Tuatahi, ki te hunga kua ngaro in\u0101tata nei; Colin Reeder kai te m\u014Dhio tonu koe ki te \u0101huatanga o to t\u0101ua hoa a Matiu i Te Whare W\u0101nanga, ka tangi ake. N\u0101 t\u0101tau t\u0113r\u0101 i tuku ki Te K\u014Dp\u016B o Papat\u016B\u0101nuku i te kotahi marama pea kua hipa ake. Ko Matiu t\u0113r\u0101 i roto i ng\u0101 whiriwhiringa m\u014D t\u0113nei o ng\u0101 kaupapa. Ar\u0101 an\u014D ng\u0101 pakeke e m\u014Dhiotia nei e koutou, kai aku rangatira o Ng\u0101i Te Rangi, Ng\u0101 P\u014Dtiki, ko Rere Amoamo, ko r\u0101tau, t\u0113r\u0101 hunga, t\u0113r\u0101 whakatipuranga, \u0101, ka mutu, taihoa ake nei ka hoki ki \u0113tahi, kia k\u014Drerohia r\u0101tau. \u0112ngari ki ng\u0101 pakeke, haere mai, haere mai, haere mai.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000126\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ec266512-9fe8-47da-883e-48f046ee5059\u0022\u003EE Turi t\u0113n\u0101 koe e whakakanohi nei i to p\u0101p\u0101. He \u0101hua p\u0101p\u014Duri te ng\u0101kau k\u0101re t\u0113r\u0101 koroua, t\u0113r\u0101 o ng\u0101 p\u0101p\u0101 i haramai ki roto i Te Whare P\u0101remata kia rongo i t\u0113nei o ng\u0101 kaupapa. Ko ia te kanohi e k\u014Drerohia ana i runga i ng\u0101 marae o Te Motu. Te kanohi o Tauranga Moana, ka mutu o Ng\u0101i Te Rangi. Ko ia, ki a koe te p\u0101p\u0101 Hauata, t\u0113n\u0101 koe haere mai. E te hoa o Te Whare P\u0101remata i ng\u0101 tau kua hipa ake te h\u014Dnore e Mita, t\u0113n\u0101 koe. Haramai ki te h\u014Dro, haramai ki te marae o Te Whare P\u0101remata, kua waia k\u0113 koe ki \u0113nei momo \u0101huatanga. N\u014D reira, he oranga ng\u0101kau kua tae mai koe i te taha o to iwi, ki konei k\u014Drero ai i ng\u0101 take o t\u0113nei r\u0101. N\u014D reira, e Tiare, ko koe t\u0113r\u0101 te tiamana i whai w\u0101hi n\u0101 i roto i ng\u0101 whiriwhiringa o te iwi, ka nui te mihi. Ki ng\u0101 kanohi e m\u014Dhiotia ana, t\u0113n\u0101 koutou, t\u0113n\u0101 koutou.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000127\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ec266512-9fe8-47da-883e-48f046ee5059\u0022\u003EE Riri, t\u0113n\u0101 koe, Wikit\u014Dria, \u0113, ko koutou kua haere mai i t\u0113nei r\u0101. Ko te wh\u0101nau R\u014Dritanga pai te kite atu i a koutou, haere mai, haere mai, haere mai r\u0101. N\u014D reira, kia whai w\u0101hi au ki te mihi ki Te Minita i te mea, ko ng\u0101 ker\u0113me katoa i ng\u0101 6 tau pea kua hipa, n\u0101na tonu i \u0101ki ki te whakatakoto ki roto i Te Whare P\u0101remata nei, kia taea ai e ng\u0101 iwi te kimi, te whai tonu i t\u0113tahi huarahi hei painga m\u014D r\u0101tau. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000128\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ec266512-9fe8-47da-883e-48f046ee5059\u0022\u003EAn\u0101, ko koutou t\u0113nei i whai i ng\u0101 tapuwae o ng\u0101 iwi i k\u014Drerohia n\u0101 e au in\u0101tata nei. N\u014D reira, t\u0113nei te huarahi i kitea e \u0113tahi iwi i mua i a koutou an\u0101, ko Ng\u0101ti Hineuru t\u0113r\u0101 i mua i a koutou. Whai muri i a koutou ko ng\u0101 iwi o Whanganui ka tae mai ki te k\u014Drero m\u014D Te Awa Tupua o Whanganui. Heoi an\u014D, me p\u0113nei rawa te k\u014Drero, kai te m\u014Dhio tonu ahau he ara t\u0101pokopoko i wh\u0101ia e koutou. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000129\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ec266512-9fe8-47da-883e-48f046ee5059\u0022\u003EMe mihi r\u0101 ki ng\u0101 mea e noho nei hei kaik\u014Drero m\u014D koutou. Ko te taha ki a Ng\u0101i Te Rangi ki a Spencer Webster\u2014k\u0101re au i te tino kite i a ia\u2014\u0101e, kai reira tonu ia. Ki a Mita, ki a koe; ki a Willie Te Aho, t\u0113r\u0101 M\u0101ori ka whai w\u0101hi tana ringa ki roto i ng\u0101 ker\u0113me katoa o Te Motu \u0113ngari, \u0101, hoi an\u014D t\u0113r\u0101, t\u0113r\u0101. Ka mutu kia huri atu ki a Ng\u0101 P\u014Dtiki, ki a koe Wikit\u014Dria, \u014Dtir\u0101, ki a M\u0101t\u0101nuku, \u0101, k\u0101re au i te tino m\u014Dhio ki t\u014D p\u0101nga ki Tauranga Moana \u0113ngari, he pai tonu. M\u0101u t\u0113r\u0101 e k\u014Drero, ko te whakapapa ki roto o Tauranga Moana, \u0113ngari, t\u0113r\u0101 pea \u0101-r\u014Dia nei, ka mihi ki a koe. Ko koe te ringa \u0101whina ki a Ng\u0101 P\u014Dtiki, ka mihi ki a koe i haramai ki te taha o ng\u0101 p\u0101p\u0101 nei, o ng\u0101 k\u016Bia nei, o ng\u0101 wh\u0101nau nei, \u0101, t\u0113n\u0101 koutou katoa.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000130\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ec266512-9fe8-47da-883e-48f046ee5059\u0022\u003EKua rongo koutou i ng\u0101 k\u014Drero o ng\u0101 mema P\u0101remata in\u0101tata nei m\u014D te iwi nei m\u014D Ng\u0101ti Hineuru. Ko te w\u0101hi ki a au, \u0113hara i te mea ki te whakatakoto i ng\u0101 h\u012Btori katoa, ka waiho ake m\u0101 Te Minita t\u0113r\u0101 e k\u014Drero. Ko t\u0101ku ko te k\u012B atu, kai te rongo koutou i t\u0113tahi paku rerek\u0113tanga o ng\u0101 nawe, o ng\u0101 take o Ng\u0101ti Hineuru ki \u0113r\u0101 o Ng\u0101 P\u014Dtiki, o Ng\u0101i Te Rangi\u2014ki taku m\u014Dhio, k\u0101o. Ki taku m\u014Dhio k\u0101o. Muru i te raupatu, ko koutou t\u0113r\u0101. Muru raupatu, \u0101, he kaupapa e waia nei koutou ki t\u0113r\u0101 \u0101huatanga. Ko te muru i te whenua, ko te takatakahi i te mana, \u0101, ko te t\u016B o te pakanga. \u0112hara koutou i te tauh\u014Du ki \u0113r\u0101 k\u014Drero.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000131\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ec266512-9fe8-47da-883e-48f046ee5059\u0022\u003EKia k\u014Drero au m\u014D te \u0101huatanga o Pukehinahina, o Te Ranga. I t\u016B ng\u0101 tohe o Te Karauna ki ng\u0101 iwi, \u0101, k\u0101ti, kua waia k\u0113 t\u0101tau ki ng\u0101 mahi tohe a Te Karauna, ng\u0101 pakanga i waenganui i a t\u0101tau. N\u014D reira, mai i te tau 18, taku m\u014Dhio, 65, \u0101, tae r\u0101 an\u014D ki ng\u0101 tau, me k\u012B, 1970, t\u0113r\u0101 w\u0101hanga, \u0101, i \u0101hua p\u0113r\u0101 rawa te \u0101huatanga o te noho o Te Karauna ki ng\u0101 iwi o roto o Tauranga Moana, otir\u0101, o Te Motu. Ko taku iwi o Ng\u0101ti Rangiwewehi i t\u016B, pokohiwi ki te pokohiwi, ki Te Ranga. Ki taku m\u014Dhio p\u0113r\u0101 an\u014D hoki ki Pukehinahina. Me p\u0113r\u0101 i te mea kua \u0101hua tata nei te whenua e nohoia nei e \u014Dku p\u0101p\u0101, e \u014Dku koroua, e \u014Dku kuia ki t\u0113r\u0101 o roto o Tauranga Moana. \u0112ngari ko te mate k\u0113, i raro i te ture, i raupatuhia ng\u0101 whenua o Ng\u0101i Te Rangi, otir\u0101, o Ng\u0101 P\u014Dtiki. Ko te taunga waka rererangi, ki taku m\u014Dhio, i murua i a koutou. Ko te \u0101huatanga o te rori h\u014Du, ng\u0101 w\u0101hi o te rori h\u014Du mai i Tauranga Moana ki Te Puke, he p\u0113r\u0101 an\u014D te \u0101hua.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000132\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ec266512-9fe8-47da-883e-48f046ee5059\u0022\u003EKa hoki aku mahara ki t\u0113tahi pire n\u0101ku tonu i k\u014Dkiri ki roto i t\u0113nei Whare P\u0101remata. Ko te ingoa o te pire nei, ko Mount Maunganui Borough Reclamation and Empowering Act Repeal Bill. N\u0101ku t\u0113n\u0101 i k\u014Dkiri ki roto nei. He aha i p\u0113r\u0101 ai? I te mea, \u0101, ko te tikanga o t\u0113r\u0101 pire he whakahoki atu i t\u0113r\u0101 whenua ki a koutou, i te mea i murua e Te Karauna. Otir\u0101, i tukuna ki te kaunihera, m\u014D te aha? Kia taea ai e te kaunihera o Tauranga te tuku i t\u0101na parapara ki roto i ng\u0101 whenua o Ng\u0101i Te Rangi. Me k\u012B, ki te t\u0101huna o Rangataua, \u0101, ka tukuna te para, te t\u016Btae, te aha r\u0101nei ki te \u0101kau ki Papamoa. N\u014D reira, ka tangi ake, koir\u0101 t\u0113tahi tauira o te \u0101huatanga o te mahi a Te Karauna ki ng\u0101 iwi o roto i a koutou, a Ng\u0101 P\u014Dtiki, a Ng\u0101i Te Rangi \u0113ngari, he pai tonu, i te w\u0101 poto kai a au kua huri pea a Ng\u0101i Te Rangi, Ng\u0101 P\u014Dtiki ki te whai ao, ki te ao m\u0101rama.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000133\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ec266512-9fe8-47da-883e-48f046ee5059\u0022\u003EKo au t\u0113tahi i waimarie ki te tae atu ki Te Whet\u016B, ki te whakatuwheratanga o t\u0113r\u0101 kaupapa \u0101-whare n\u0101. Wikit\u014Dria ko koe t\u0113r\u0101 i k\u014Dkiri i t\u0113r\u0101 kaupapa. N\u014D reira, \u0101, ka mutu ki Mangataua. He p\u0113r\u0101 an\u014D te \u0101huatanga. He aha te mahi? He hanga whare kia tiaki i ng\u0101 pakeke, kia tiaki i ng\u0101 kuia, i ng\u0101 koroua. N\u014D reira, ka mihi r\u0101 ki t\u0113r\u0101 \u0101huatanga. \u0112hara i te mea kai te noho koutou i te p\u014D uriuri, te p\u014D tangotango, k\u0101o! He hiahia n\u014D koutou kia puta ki te whai ao, ki te ao m\u0101rama. M\u0101 t\u0113nei huarahi pea ka eke ki t\u0113r\u0101 taumata. N\u014D reira ko te w\u0101hi ki a au, he w\u0101w\u0101hi i ng\u0101 k\u014Drero m\u014D Te Whare P\u0101remata i t\u0113nei r\u0101 me te k\u012B atu, nau mai, haere mai i t\u0113nei r\u0101.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000134\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ec266512-9fe8-47da-883e-48f046ee5059\u0022\u003E\u0112hara i te mea kua mutu, k\u0101o! He t\u012Bmatanga noa ake t\u0113nei i te mea, ka haere Te Whare P\u0101remata ki a koutou ki te rongo i ng\u0101 k\u014Drero, ka mutu ko te p\u0101nuitanga tuatahi, \u0101, ka mana, kua w\u0101tea te huarah. N\u014D reira, kua rahi m\u0101ku i t\u0113nei r\u0101, haere mai, kai aku rangatira, t\u0113n\u0101 koutou, t\u0113n\u0101 koutou, kia ora t\u0101tau katoa.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000135\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ec266512-9fe8-47da-883e-48f046ee5059\u0022\u003E[Greetings and welcome to my esteemed of Tauranga Moana. You can rest easy; we have already paid homage to the unseen world, the descendants of Ng\u0101ti Hineuru witnessed that prayer, all of that has been taken care of, so I turn now to all of you who have arrived from Mauao, from the shores of Tauranga Moana, greetings to you collectively, welcome, welcome, welcome! This journey of yours is not a new one, Ng\u0101ti Ranginui and Ng\u0101ti P\u016Bkenga have already been here, and now we come to this today, to your arrival; therefore, I say, as a way of introducing matters on this issue, salutations to you, welcome.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000136\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ec266512-9fe8-47da-883e-48f046ee5059\u0022\u003EA face seen is a memory recalled. Firstly, to those recently departed: Colin Reeder, you knew our good friend Matiu very well at university. I lament him. It was us who buried him only a month ago. Matiu was involved in the negotiations for this matter. And there were other elders that you all know. To my esteemed ones of Ng\u0101i Te Rangi and Ng\u0101 P\u014Dtiki, to Rere Amoamo, they were the group, that generation. Also, I will refer to others whom I will talk about. However, to the elders, welcome, come hither.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000137\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ec266512-9fe8-47da-883e-48f046ee5059\u0022\u003ETo you, Turi, I thank you for representing your father here. I am a little bit saddened that that elderly gentlemen, that uncle of ours, was not able to be here in Parliament to hear these matters. He was a person who was spoken of on every marae around the country, the representative of Tauranga Moana and indeed of Ng\u0101i Te Rangi. And to you, my Uncle Howard, greetings and welcome to you. To a dear friend of this Parliament in years gone by, to the honourable Mita, greetings. Welcome to the House, welcome to the marae of Parliament. You are already very familiar with these occasions. It is very uplifting to see you have arrived here with your tribe, to discuss the matters before us this day. And to you, Charlie, you are the chairman who was given this opportunity by your iwi. My sincerest gratitude to you. To all the others whom I know, greetings and acknowledgments to you all.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000138\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ec266512-9fe8-47da-883e-48f046ee5059\u0022\u003EI pay tribute to you, Riri, to Wikit\u014Dria, and to all the others who have come this day. To the Rolleston family, it is good to see you all. I bid you all welcome, welcome, indeed welcome. Furthermore, I take this opportunity to pay tribute to the Minister for Treaty of Waitangi Negotiations, because, with all the claims that have gone through in the last 6 years, it was he who encouraged them to be presented before this Parliament so that the tribes could quickly get on with the job of pursuing a better pathway for them all. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000139\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ec266512-9fe8-47da-883e-48f046ee5059\u0022\u003EAnd so this is you\u2014you have followed in the footsteps of those other tribes that I have recently mentioned. Therefore, this was the pathway that other tribes had discovered before you, and it was Ng\u0101ti Hineuru just before you all. After you, the tribes of Whanganui will be arriving to discuss the ancestral river of Whanganui. However, let me put it this way, I know it is a billowy course that you have travelled.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000140\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ec266512-9fe8-47da-883e-48f046ee5059\u0022\u003E I want to thank those who are here as spokespersons for you. On behalf of Ng\u0101i Te Rangi there is Spencer Webster\u2014I cannot really see him\u2014oh yes, he is still there. To you too, Mita, and to you, Willie Te Aho\u2014that M\u0101ori who seems to have a hand in all the claims around the country. However, so be it. Futhermore, can I turn to Ng\u0101 P\u014Dtiki, to you, Wikit\u014Dria, and at the same time to you, M\u0101t\u0101nuku\u2014I am not really sure of your connection to Tauranga Moana\u2014but that is fine. You can mention it, your geneology to Tauranga Moana. However, as a lawyer, I must pay tribute to you. You were the helping hand for Ng\u0101 P\u014Dtiki, and so I thank you for coming along with these uncles and old matriachs of the families here. My acknowledgments to you all.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000141\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ec266512-9fe8-47da-883e-48f046ee5059\u0022\u003EYou would have heard some of the contributions from the members of Parliament just recently in regard to Ng\u0101ti Hineuru. My contribution will be not to outline all the historical account; I will leave that to the Minister. I would like to say\u2014you will hear a slightly different version of the concerns, of the issues of Ng\u0101ti Hineuru, to those of Ng\u0101 P\u014Dtiki and of Ng\u0101i Te Rangi\u2014my understanding is, no. As far as I know, there is no justice for confiscations, that is you. Confiscation is an issue that you are very familiar with. The dispossession of lands, the disregard for mana\u2014that is something that you are quite used to now. The confiscation of land, the disregard for mana and the engagement of war. You are not strangers to those stories.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000142\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ec266512-9fe8-47da-883e-48f046ee5059\u0022\u003EI would like to make mention of the circumstances of Pukehinahina, of Te Ranga. These were battles initiated by the Crown against the tribes. Oh well, we are quite familiar with the disagreements of the Crown and the battles between us. Accordingly, since 1865 and up until the 1970s\u2014that period\u2014that is very much how things were between the Crown and the tribes of Tauranga Moana, and, indeed, of the country. My own tribe of Ng\u0101ti Rangiwewehi stood shoulder to shoulder at Te Ranga. And as far as I know it was similar at Pukehinahina. And I should say that, because the land where my own uncles and grandparents live is similar to that land in Tauranga Moana. The only problem is\u2014in terms of the law\u2014the land was confiscated, the lands of Ng\u0101i Te Rangi and of Ng\u0101 P\u014Dtiki. The airport is one place where I believe the land was taken from you. And there are the circumstances of the new road, those parts of the new road, from Tauranga Moana to Te Puke, it is the same.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000143\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ec266512-9fe8-47da-883e-48f046ee5059\u0022\u003EI cast my mind back to a bill that I actually introduced into this Parliament. The name of the bill was the Mount Maunganui Borough Reclamation and Empowering Repeal Bill. I introduced this into the House. Why was that? Because the intention of that bill was to return the land to you all, as it was taken by the Crown. However, why was it given to the council, for what purpose? So that the Tauranga council could deposit their effluent into the lands of Ng\u0101i Te Rangi, let us say, to the shore of Rangataua, and they released their rubbish, their excrement, and whatever else, on to the beaches at Papamoa. I weep at this situation. This is an example of the sorts of things the Crown was doing to the tribes amonst you, of Ng\u0101 P\u014Dtiki anf Ng\u0101i Te Rangi. However, it is OK. In the short time I have had, maybe Ng\u0101i Te Rangi and Ng\u0101 P\u014Dtiki have become a bit clearer and more enlightened on the issues.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000144\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ec266512-9fe8-47da-883e-48f046ee5059\u0022\u003EI was one of the fortunate ones to go to Te Whet\u016B, to the opening of the housing complex there. It was you, Wikit\u014Dria, who advanced this issue. Therefore, it is similar with Mangataua. There are similar circumstances. And what were they? They were to do with the building of houses to care for the elderly, the old womenfolk and menfolk. Consequently, I acknowledge that matter. It is not as though you are all sitting in the dark, in the intense darkness\u2014never! It is your earnest desire to enter into the glimmer of dawn and into the world of light. This pathway may assist you in reaching that pinnacle. And, therefore, it has been my task to begin this debate for Parliament today, and to say to you all welcome and salutations to you today.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000145\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ec266512-9fe8-47da-883e-48f046ee5059\u0022\u003EIt is not as though it is all over; no, this is just the beginning, and Parliament will be coming to you to listen to what you have to say. It will become official following the first reading. The way will be clear. Therefore, that is enough from me today. I say welcome to my esteemed elders, greetings and salutations to you collectively, and my appreciation to us all.]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000146\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ec266512-9fe8-47da-883e-48f046ee5059\u0022\u003EI commend this bill to the House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022e77494a0-1be1-432f-b492-fd160f4c119d\u0022 data-id=\u002282b53409fb104a77a6e531250d708d67\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000147\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e77494a0-1be1-432f-b492-fd160f4c119d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002282b53409fb104a77a6e531250d708d67\u0022\u003EPEENI HENARE (Labour\u2014T\u0101maki Makaurau):\u003C/span\u003E T\u0113n\u0101 koe Te M\u0101ngai o Te Whare. Tuku mauri ora ki te whei ao ki te ao m\u0101rama, t\u012Bhei w\u0101 mauri ora! I a au e tupu tamariki ana, ko ng\u0101 m\u0101tua o te hau k\u0101inga o Te Tai Tokerau, whakaakohia mai te mahi o te kai k\u014Drero tuarua hei tautoko ake i ng\u0101 k\u014Drero a te kaik\u014Drero tuatahi. N\u0101 runga i taua whakaaro, ko ng\u0101 mihi hoki ki t\u014Dku tuakana ki te mema P\u0101remata o Te Tai Hau\u0101uru, n\u0101na t\u014D t\u0101tou huihuinga i te ata nei i whakarite, kia anga atu ng\u0101 kanohi me ng\u0101 wairua ki t\u014D t\u0101tou Kaihanga. M\u0101na t\u0101tou e tiaki ki roto i ng\u0101 nekehanga o te w\u0101 nei, m\u0101na an\u014D hoki koutou e tiaki ki roto i t\u014D koutou nohoanga i roto i t\u014D t\u0101tou Whare, ka mutu ki t\u014D koutou hokinga atu ki te w\u0101 k\u0101inga.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000148\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e77494a0-1be1-432f-b492-fd160f4c119d\u0022\u003EKa t\u0101pae atu ng\u0101 mihi me ng\u0101 tangi ki \u014D t\u0101tou tini aitu\u0101, ng\u0101 mate o te w\u0101 kua wahaina mai e Te Minita, e t\u014Dku matua a Te Ururoa, ki t\u0113r\u0101 pou o te k\u014Dhanga reo, t\u0113r\u0101 tauira o te ao k\u014Dhatu ka riro atu ki roto i te k\u014Dp\u016B o te whenua, k\u0101ti, e tangi ana t\u0113nei; ka t\u0101pae hoki au i ng\u0101 mate, ko \u014Dku tu\u0101kana \u0113r\u0101 kua ngaro atu ki te p\u014D. E Ng\u0101i Te Rangi, ng\u0101 mihi nui ki a koutou. I te w\u012Bkene kua pahura ake nei i tuki waka i aitu\u0101ngia e \u014Dku tu\u0101kana ki roto i a koutou. Koutou r\u0101 t\u0113n\u0101 e tiaki i a r\u0101tou i te r\u0101 nei, ka ngaro atu ki te hua k\u014Diwi o ng\u0101 m\u0101tua, o ng\u0101 t\u016Bpuna ki roto o Pangaru, Waihau, i te r\u0101 nei. K\u0101ti te w\u0101hanga ki ng\u0101 mate, haere, haere, haere!\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000149\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e77494a0-1be1-432f-b492-fd160f4c119d\u0022\u003EKia whakahokia mai ng\u0101 r\u0101rangi k\u014Drero ki a t\u0101tou, t\u0113n\u0101 t\u0101tou katoa! E Ng\u0101i Te Rangi, e Ng\u0101 P\u014Dtiki, e tautoko ana ahau i ng\u0101 whakatau ki a koutou i te r\u0101 nei. Haere mai r\u0101 koutou. Haere mai r\u0101 koutou ki te whakakanohi i ng\u0101 m\u0101tua, i ng\u0101 t\u016Bpuna r\u0101tou ng\u0101 wh\u0101nau kei te k\u0101inga e tatari mai ana. M\u014D te aha te take? M\u014D ng\u0101 rawa kei roto i te pire? K\u0101hore! M\u014D ng\u0101 k\u014Drero a t\u0113nei Whare? K\u0101hore! \u0112ngari kia whakahokia atu ko te mana motuhake i whawhai \u014D koutou m\u0101tua t\u016Bpuna tahi me ng\u0101 t\u016Bpuna o t\u0113nei e k\u014Drero nei, e hoki atu ki te k\u0101inga. T\u0113n\u0101 koutou, t\u0113n\u0101 koutou, t\u0113n\u0101 koutou katoa.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000150\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e77494a0-1be1-432f-b492-fd160f4c119d\u0022\u003EI te m\u0101rama kua pahura ake nei, i k\u014Drero atu ahau ki \u014D koutou whanaunga i tae mai ki roto i ng\u0101 take ker\u0113me i roto i Te Whare nei. I taua t\u0101ima i k\u014Drero ahau m\u014D ng\u0101 p\u0101nga \u014D koutou ki a m\u0101ua ko t\u014Dku tuakana nei a Pita, mai i te pakanga o Te Ruapekapeka ka whai whakaaro ahau ki ng\u0101 pakanga o t\u014Dku k\u0101inga hei t\u0101pae atu ki ng\u0101 pakanga kua k\u014Drero mai n\u0101 e Te Minita ki roto i t\u014D t\u0101tou Whare i te r\u0101 nei. Ka whakaaro an\u014D hoki ki ng\u0101 m\u0101tua t\u016Bpuna n\u0101 r\u0101tou i haina i Te Tiriti o Waitangi ahakoa te rangirua, ahakoa \u0113hara i te mea he mataku \u0113ngari he rangirua ki ng\u0101 mahi tinihanga ki ng\u0101 mahi m\u0101minga a Te Karauna i taua t\u0101ima. Ahakoa t\u0113r\u0101, ka hainatia r\u0101tou i Te Tiriti o Waitangi, \u0113tahi \u014D r\u0101tou, me te hiahia kia whiwhi oranga r\u0101tou ki roto i ng\u0101 tau ka haere ake. K\u0101ti, ko ng\u0101 m\u0101tua t\u016Bpuna t\u0113r\u0101 heke iho mai ki a koutou, otir\u0101 ki a t\u0101tou i t\u0113nei r\u0101; t\u0113n\u0101 t\u0101tou.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000151\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e77494a0-1be1-432f-b492-fd160f4c119d\u0022\u003EM\u0101m\u0101 noa iho te k\u014Drero atu m\u014D ng\u0101 iwi e k\u014Dkiri ana i ng\u0101 take nei ka whai whakaaro ahau ki ng\u0101 hap\u016B kei roto i a koutou. Kua k\u014Drero mai t\u014Dku tuakana a Pita m\u014D te \u0101huatanga ki a Ng\u0101ti Hine ki roto i Te Tai Tokerau. K\u0101ti, ka mihi atu ki te mana o ng\u0101 hap\u016B kua whakakotahi mai nei kia karangahia t\u0113nei Whare he iwi k\u0113 koutou. N\u014D reira, e mihi atu ana au ki a koutou i roto i ng\u0101 \u0101huatanga o te w\u0101 nei. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000152\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e77494a0-1be1-432f-b492-fd160f4c119d\u0022\u003EE aku rangatira, kua k\u014Drero \u0113tahi m\u014D ng\u0101 whawhai, m\u014D ng\u0101 pakanga m\u014D ng\u0101 t\u016Bkino a Te Karauna i a Ng\u0101i Te Rangi r\u0101tou ko Ng\u0101 Potiki. Ka whakaaro ake ahau, \u0101e, e m\u014Dhio ana t\u0101tou Te M\u0101ori i ng\u0101 pakanga, i ng\u0101 mahi t\u016Bkino a te k\u0101wanatanga an\u0101 ko te p\u016B te mea e arahi nei i te k\u014Drero. \u0112ngari i t\u0113nei w\u0101, ka whakaaro ake ahau ki ng\u0101 ture. He nui ng\u0101 p\u0101tai ka p\u0101taihia mai ki a au nei, \u0101e, e m\u014Dhio ana au i t\u016Bkinohia e te K\u0101wanatanga i a m\u0101tou; \u0113ngari, ka whakaaro ake ahau m\u014D ng\u0101 ture hei w\u0101w\u0101hi i ng\u0101 iwi M\u0101ori hei tango i te whenua hei patu i te wairua. N\u014D reira, ka whakaaro ake ahau ki ng\u0101 k\u014Drero a Te Minita a mea m\u014D te tuku para m\u014D te tuku t\u016Btae m\u014D te tuku puta ki roto i ng\u0101 wai kaukau o \u014D koutou m\u0101tua t\u016Bpuna, k\u0101ti. Ka whakaaro ake ahau ki te mahi rangahau e t\u0101tou m\u0101.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000153\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e77494a0-1be1-432f-b492-fd160f4c119d\u0022\u003EKa whakaaro ake ahau ki t\u0113nei pire i pahure ki roto i t\u0113nei Whare, ar\u0101, ko te Mount Maunganui Borough Reclamation and Empowering Act 1975, \u0101e m\u0101rika, \u0101e m\u0101rika! Ka p\u0101nui ahau i t\u0113nei pire me te ki atu ahakoa ka w\u0101w\u0101hi te pire nei i t\u0113tahi huarahi, ka taea e ng\u0101 t\u0101ngata katoa o te w\u0101hi r\u0101 ki te tuku k\u014Drero ki te tuku i w\u0101 r\u0101tou mana e p\u0101 ana ki t\u0113nei w\u0101hi kua tango mai e Te Karauna i a koutou. Ka mutu ka p\u0101nui ahau i ng\u0101 niupepa o taua t\u0101ima, ka t\u016B kaha a Ng\u0101 P\u014Dtiki me ng\u0101 iwi katoa o Tauranga Moana ki te whawhai i t\u0113nei pire ahakoa i k\u012B ki roto i te pire nei, ka whai w\u0101hi koutou ki roto i ng\u0101 mahi nei. Kua kite t\u0101tou i roto i ng\u0101 k\u014Drero, k\u0101hore, k\u0101hore, k\u0101hore!\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000154\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e77494a0-1be1-432f-b492-fd160f4c119d\u0022\u003EN\u014D reira, ko te pai o t\u0113nei pire i te r\u0101 nei ki te whakatutuki i ng\u0101 whawhai, i ng\u0101 k\u014Drero \u0101 koutou i taua t\u0101ima i roto i ng\u0101 mahi o te w\u0101 nei. He aha ai? Kia whai oranga koutou i roto i ng\u0101 mahi kei mua i a koutou, hei oranga ng\u0101kau, hei oranga wairua, hei oranga m\u014D ng\u0101 uri whakatupu e haere ake nei. \u0100e m\u0101rika te nanakia o ng\u0101 ture P\u0101keh\u0101.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000155\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e77494a0-1be1-432f-b492-fd160f4c119d\u0022\u003EKei roto i \u0113nei pukapuka ko ng\u0101 ture w\u0101w\u0101hi whenua, ka tono atu ki ng\u0101 P\u0101keh\u0101 m\u0101 r\u0101tou e whakahaere. Ko t\u0113tahi \u0101huatanga pai ki a au nei i roto i t\u0113nei pire, ko te nuinga o ng\u0101 pire kua kite nei t\u0101tou, e wehewehe nei i a t\u0101ua te M\u0101ori. N\u0101, kua kite ahau i t\u0113r\u0101 \u0101huatanga ki roto o Ng\u0101puhi. \u0112ngari, m\u0101 t\u0113nei pire ka \u0101hei a Ng\u0101i Te Rangi, ka \u0101hei a Ng\u0101 P\u014Dtiki me ng\u0101 t\u0101ngata katoa, ng\u0101 hap\u016B katoa, ng\u0101 mana katoa, ng\u0101 iwi katoa o t\u0113r\u0101 k\u0101inga te mahi ng\u0101tahi. He aha ai? Hei whakahaere ake i ng\u0101 whenua ka whakahokia atu hei whakahaere ake i ng\u0101 rawa, kia whakahoki atu ki a Ng\u0101i Te Rangi, ki a Ng\u0101 P\u014Dtiki i t\u0113nei r\u0101.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000156\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e77494a0-1be1-432f-b492-fd160f4c119d\u0022\u003EE Te P\u0101p\u0101, e Taku Ariki e Tumu, k\u0101tahi an\u014D koe kua tau mai ki roto i t\u014D t\u0101tou Whare; t\u0113nei e mihi atu nei te ng\u0101kau; t\u0113n\u0101 koe, t\u0113n\u0101 koe!\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000157\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e77494a0-1be1-432f-b492-fd160f4c119d\u0022\u003EKua rongo koutou i \u0101ianei kua tangi te pere, n\u014D reira, kua wh\u0101iti te t\u0101ima ki a au nei. N\u014D reira, ko t\u0101ku k\u014Drero whakamutunga ki a koutou e aku rangatira, e te p\u0101p\u0101 e Mita, koutou, koin\u0101 te take o t\u0113nei Whare; rawa atu au e kite i te nuinga e noho mai n\u0101 k\u012B p\u0101tata i a koutou. N\u014D reira, ka huri atu ki a koe e te p\u0101p\u0101 e Mita, e mihi atu ana ki a koe, kua \u0101rahi mai n\u0101 e koe i t\u014D iwi ki roto i t\u014D t\u0101tou Whare.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000158\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e77494a0-1be1-432f-b492-fd160f4c119d\u0022\u003EHei whakakapi ake, ko te taha p\u016Btea ka whakahokia atu ki a koutou, e whakaae ana t\u0113nei, otir\u0101, te nuinga o m\u0101tou, he k\u014Dnae iti ki te rawa i riro atu ki te K\u0101wanatanga i te taima i raupatuhia e r\u0101tou \u014D koutou whenua, i takahia ai r\u0101tou i \u014D koutou mana me t\u014D koutou wairua. K\u0101ti, m\u0101 t\u0113nei pea ka whai oranga koutou i roto i ng\u0101 mahi kei mua i a koutou. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000159\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e77494a0-1be1-432f-b492-fd160f4c119d\u0022\u003EKo t\u0101ku atu ki a koutou e Ng\u0101i Te Rangi, e Ng\u0101 P\u014Dtiki i t\u0113nei ata, m\u0101 Te R\u014Dp\u016B Whiriwhiri i Ng\u0101 Take M\u0101ori, m\u0101 ng\u0101 mema katoa o t\u0113nei Whare, e \u0101ta whakaarohia, e \u0101ta wetewete ng\u0101 k\u014Drero kei roto i te pire, m\u014D koutou te take. N\u014D reira, k\u0101ti ake r\u0101 i konei e Te M\u0101ngai o Te Whare, e aku rangatira kua tau nei, t\u0113n\u0101 koutou, t\u0113n\u0101 koutou, kia ora t\u0101tou katoa.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000160\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e77494a0-1be1-432f-b492-fd160f4c119d\u0022\u003E[T\u0113n\u0101 koe, Mr Assistant Speaker. As energy is manifest into the world of light, it is life. Growing up, as a child, our parents\u2019 generation back home in the Far North taught us that the role of the second speaker is to support the speech of the first speaker. Accordingly, I thank my senior colleague and member of Parliament for Te Tai Hau\u0101uru, who commenced our proceedings this morning by turning our eyes and spirits to our creator, who will protect and guide us in this dynamic environment, and who will also protect and guide you in your stay here in our House, and on your safe return journey home.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000161\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e77494a0-1be1-432f-b492-fd160f4c119d\u0022\u003EI acknowledge and lament our dearly departed, including those recently deceased mentioned by the Minister for M\u0101ori Development, by my uncle Te Ururoa, such as that pillar of the k\u014Dhanga reo movement who exemplified the ancient world, now laid to rest within the earth, alas; I too mourn. I also acknowledge my own older cousins who only just passed away. Ng\u0101i Te Rangi, my sincere thanks to you. Just last weekend my older cousins died in a car accident within your tribal area. You looked after them and today they are being laid to rest in the hallowed burial grounds among the ancestors of Pangaru and Waihau. Farewell to all the dearly deceased, may you rest in eternal peace.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000162\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e77494a0-1be1-432f-b492-fd160f4c119d\u0022\u003EReturning to us, the living\u2014greetings one and all! Ng\u0101i Te Rangi and Ng\u0101 P\u014Dtiki, I support this settlement with you today. Welcome, all of you. Welcome to you, the representatives embodying the faces of the elders and ancestors and the many families waiting back home. For what exactly? For the assets within the bill? No. For the words of this House? No. But for the return of self-determination, which your ancestors and mine fought for together, that it be returned home. My greetings and salutations to you all.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000163\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e77494a0-1be1-432f-b492-fd160f4c119d\u0022\u003EIn the month just gone I spoke with your relations who had arrived here in the House pursuant to the claims process. At that time I referred to the connection that exists between yourselves and my senior kinsman Pita and me, from the battle of Te Ruapekapeka; indeed, I reflect on the battles of my own home in relating to the battles spoken of by the Minister in our House today. I also reflect on the ancestors who signed the Treaty of Waitangi despite great apprehension, not through fear but in trepidation of the treachery and deceit of the Crown at that time. Despite that, they still signed the Treaty of Waitangi, some of them, anyway, with the hope of securing prosperity in the years ahead. And so it was for those ancestors from whom you descend today, or rather from whom we descend, indeed; greetings to all of us.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000164\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e77494a0-1be1-432f-b492-fd160f4c119d\u0022\u003EIt is easy to talk about tribes advancing these issues, but I also reflect on the subtribes among you. My senior kinsman Pita has spoken to me about Ng\u0101ti Hine in the Far North. Accordingly, I acknowledge the integrity of the subtribes that have come together here to enable this House to refer to you collectively as a tribal entity. And so I congratulate you in the circumstances of this moment.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000165\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e77494a0-1be1-432f-b492-fd160f4c119d\u0022\u003EEsteemed guests, some have commented on conflicts, battles, and atrocities committed by the Crown against Ng\u0101i Te Rangi and those of Ng\u0101 P\u014Dtiki. On reflection, yes, we M\u0101ori are aware of the wars in regard to acts of atrocities inflicted by the Government, and there you are\u2014the gun is leading the talk! But at this moment I reflect on the laws. Many questions have been asked for me to respond to; yes, I am aware we were molested by the government. However, I think about the laws as a means of driving M\u0101ori tribes apart from each other, taking possession of land and being a killjoy. I cast my thoughts back to the Minister\u2019s comments in terms of direct pollution and sewage releases into the waters where your parents and ancestors bathed\u2014but enough. I reflect on what is being done in the area of research, which I consider is good for everyone.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000166\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e77494a0-1be1-432f-b492-fd160f4c119d\u0022\u003EI think about the bill that was passed in this House, namely the Mount Maunganui Borough Reclamation and Empowering Act 1975\u2014yes, indeed, and very much so. I read this bill and speculated: even if this bill opens up a way, everybody from that area can make a submission and stake their authority to this place that was taken from you by the Crown. Furthermore, I read in the newspapers of that time that Ng\u0101 P\u014Dtiki and all the tribes of Tauranga Moana stood strongly to fight that bill even though there was a provision in the bill for you to be involved in these operations. We have seen in the accounts that absolutely nothing came out of it at all. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000167\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e77494a0-1be1-432f-b492-fd160f4c119d\u0022\u003ETherefore, the good thing about this bill today is that it allows the battles and your accounts of that time to be fulfilled and to be included in current operations. Why? So that there is a livelihood in the work and in the future that will sustain your psychological and spiritual well-being and the well-being of future generations. Yes, indeed, not bad for P\u0101keh\u0101 law.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000168\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e77494a0-1be1-432f-b492-fd160f4c119d\u0022\u003EContained in these documents are laws that divide up lands, and then send them to P\u0101keh\u0101 for them to administer. To me, an aspect of this bill that is good is that the majority of the bills we have seen separate the M\u0101ori\u2014you people and me. I have seen that situation in Ng\u0101puhi. But through this bill, Ng\u0101i Te Rangi, Ng\u0101 P\u014Dtiki, and everybody, all subtribes, authorities, and tribes of that place, are able to work collaboratively. Why? To administer the lands that are to be returned, and to manage the resources that are to be returned to Ng\u0101i Te Rangi and Ng\u0101 P\u014Dtiki today.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000169\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e77494a0-1be1-432f-b492-fd160f4c119d\u0022\u003ETo you, the respected father figure, to my paramount chief, Tumu, I have just noted your arrival into our House; I acknowledge your noble presence and extend a heartfelt welcome to you; greetings and welcome.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000170\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e77494a0-1be1-432f-b492-fd160f4c119d\u0022\u003EYou all would have heard the bell ring, and so I have not much time left. My final comment to you esteemed ones, to Uncle Mita, and to you all collectively is that that then is the purpose of this House; I have never seen such masses of your ilk fill this House and be packed so closely as you are. And so I acknowledge you, Uncle Mita. You did that by leading your people into this House of ours.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000171\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e77494a0-1be1-432f-b492-fd160f4c119d\u0022\u003EIn conclusion, and in regard to the funding to be returned to you, despite it being a mere pittance compared to the resources the Government accrued at the time your lands were confiscated and your status and spirit were trampled upon, the majority of us and I agree to that happening. Enough; this might bring about the well-being that you are striving for through the work ahead of you.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000172\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e77494a0-1be1-432f-b492-fd160f4c119d\u0022\u003EI assure you, Ng\u0101i Te Rangi and Ng\u0101 P\u014Dtiki, that the M\u0101ori Affairs Committee and all the members of this House will carefully consider and scrutinise the accounts in this bill with your interests in mind. Therefore, Mr Assistant Speaker and my esteemed ones gathered here, acknowledgments and greetings to you collectively and my appreciation to us all.]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002241146229-4d11-415b-a4ac-f4e2b923e95d\u0022 data-id=\u0022520570c2ed404a4fb5dee98804e95bdd\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000173\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002241146229-4d11-415b-a4ac-f4e2b923e95d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022520570c2ed404a4fb5dee98804e95bdd\u0022\u003EHon CHRISTOPHER FINLAYSON (Minister for Treaty of Waitangi Negotiations):\u003C/span\u003E I am very pleased to take a call to support the first reading of this bill, which, like other Tauranga bills, has been many years in the making. To those in the gallery who have come to witness the long-awaited and historic day, I welcome you to Parliament. T\u0113n\u0101 koutou. Can I say that it is great to see our former colleague Mita Ririnui back in the House today.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000174\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002241146229-4d11-415b-a4ac-f4e2b923e95d\u0022\u003EThe signing of this deed of settlement in 2013 signalled the completion of all settlements with the three Tauranga Moana iwi. The bill follows the introduction of the other two Tauranga Moana bills, the Tauranga Moana Iwi Collective Redress and Ng\u0101 Hap\u016B o Ng\u0101ti Ranginui Claims Settlement Bill and the Ng\u0101ti P\u016Bkenga Claims Settlement Bill. I spoke at the first readings of both those bills on 14 April, and it was a great pleasure for us parliamentarians to host Ng\u0101i Te Rangi for that occasion, along with the other Tauranga Moana iwi. It is fitting for the three Tauranga Moana iwi, who began their Treaty settlement journey all those years ago, to be basically at the same stage in the legislative process. Despite the time that has been taken to get to this point, I never had any doubt that we would get there, and that is why I am so pleased to see representatives of the iwi in the gallery, and I hope they agree with me that it has been worth the wait.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000175\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002241146229-4d11-415b-a4ac-f4e2b923e95d\u0022\u003EAn unusual feature of this settlement is that there are two entities mandated to negotiate the settlement of Ng\u0101i Te Rangi\u2019s claims. We have got Te Runanga o Ng\u0101i Te Rangi and the Ng\u0101 P\u014Dtiki a Tamapahore Trust. In October 2008 the Crown recognised the mandate of Te Runanga o Ng\u0101i Te Rangi to negotiate a settlement of the historical Treaty claims for nine of the 10 Ng\u0101i Te Rangi hap\u016B. Then, in May 2011, the Crown recognised the mandate of the trust to represent the Ng\u0101 P\u014Dtiki claimant community in negotiations of their historical Treaty claims as part of the Ng\u0101i Te Rangi negotiations with the r\u016Bnanga. I want to take a moment to commend the Ng\u0101i Te Rangi and Ng\u0101 P\u014Dtiki negotiators and trustees for the way in which they worked together at one table to negotiate with the Crown. It was, indeed, an unusual arrangement to have two mandated groups negotiating at the one Treaty settlement table with the Crown, but they managed this relationship with professionalism and with manaakitanga for each group\u2019s aspirations.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000176\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002241146229-4d11-415b-a4ac-f4e2b923e95d\u0022\u003EIn June 2013 Cabinet approved the Ng\u0101i Te Rangi and Ng\u0101 P\u014Dtiki settlement package, and the agreement in principle was signed on 28 June 2013. The team was determined to try to achieve the signing of a deed of settlement in 2013 and they did keep the pressure on the Crown to achieve this, and eventually it was signed on 14 December 2013, on a typically fine Tauranga Saturday morning.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000177\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002241146229-4d11-415b-a4ac-f4e2b923e95d\u0022\u003EThis bill will give legislative effect to the final agreements on the redress as set out in the deed. The historical claims of Ng\u0101i Te Rangi and Ng\u0101 P\u014Dtiki primarily relate to the Crown-initiated military conflict in Tauranga in 1864, which was in breach of the Treaty and its principles. The claims also relate to the ensuing confiscation, or raupatu, the Crown purchase of the Te Puna - Katikati block, the imposition of native land laws in Tauranga Moana, Crown purchasing methods in the Tauranga district in the 1880s and 1890s, the compulsory acquisition of uneconomic interests, and, inevitably\u2014and I say this every debate on a settlement bill\u2014public works takings. As a result of these actions, Ng\u0101i Te Rangi and Ng\u0101 P\u014Dtiki are virtually landless, retaining only approximately 2 percent of their rohe with their cultural landscapes and seascapes compromised and diminished.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000178\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002241146229-4d11-415b-a4ac-f4e2b923e95d\u0022\u003EAs we know, it is not possible to compensate Ng\u0101i Te Rangi and Ng\u0101 P\u014Dtiki fully for the loss suffered as a result of the Crown\u2019s acts and omissions, but, hopefully, the financial and commercial redress provided seeks to recognise those losses. Commercial redress includes quantum of $26.5 million plus interest to Ng\u0101i Te Rangi and $3 million to Ng\u0101 P\u014Dtiki, plus interest, land-banked properties, commercial redress properties, sale and leaseback properties, and rights of first refusal in relation to the disposal of Crown land. Cultural redress includes the vesting and joint vesting of sites of cultural and historical significance to Ng\u0101i Te Rangi. It also includes changes to official geographic names and statutory acknowledgments over areas that are of great significance.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000179\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002241146229-4d11-415b-a4ac-f4e2b923e95d\u0022\u003ENg\u0101i Te Rangi can trace their origins to the M\u0101taatua waka. They have had a long and varied history of war and migration. By the 18th century they had become known as Ng\u0101i Te Rangihouhiri, named after their leader, who, along with his brother Tamapahore, led their people through turbulent times and to the area they now call home. I am sure that both those t\u016Bpuna would be very proud indeed of the way the negotiators and trustees have fought hard to achieve the best settlement possible for future generations of Ng\u0101i Te Rangi and Ng\u0101 P\u014Dtiki. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000180\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002241146229-4d11-415b-a4ac-f4e2b923e95d\u0022\u003EI want to acknowledge all those who have supported the settlement, those who are with us today and those who have since passed. I particularly want to acknowledge those who championed the claims at the tribunal, through to the wh\u0101nau, the marae, and the r\u016Bnanga workers who quietly slaved behind the scenes to support the work of others.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000181\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002241146229-4d11-415b-a4ac-f4e2b923e95d\u0022\u003EA person of more recent times it is appropriate to acknowledge is Matiu Dickson. Matiu came from the Ng\u0101i Te Rangi hap\u016B of Ng\u0101i T\u016Bkairangi. He was a man of many talents, who made an important contribution to M\u0101ori education and to iwi politics. These talents included being a law lecturer at the University of Waikato, serving as a Tauranga city councillor, being a board member of Pharmac, and being a judge for Te Matatini National Kapa Haka Festival competitions. He had a particular skill in bringing people together and forging a shared sense of understanding when it came to Treaty of Waitangi aspirations. As one of the Ng\u0101i Te Rangi negotiators, his skills in this area were critical to reaching this point, and I acknowledge his contribution.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000182\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002241146229-4d11-415b-a4ac-f4e2b923e95d\u0022\u003EI particularly want to acknowledge the chief Crown negotiator for the three negotiations in Tauranga, Dame Patsy Reddy. She oversaw the work on this settlement and was instrumental in the completion of all the Treaty settlements in the region. I take this opportunity to wish her all the best for her next role, and I hope, as indeed she hopes, she is in the chair to sign into law the Tauranga settlement bills. On that day I hope we can all have a great party\u2014all of us\u2014up at Government House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000183\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002241146229-4d11-415b-a4ac-f4e2b923e95d\u0022\u003EFinally, I want to thank my ministerial colleagues, the officials from the Office of Treaty Settlements, and officials from the various agencies for all the work they have done to make this settlement possible. I consider the bill should proceed without delay to the M\u0101ori Affairs Committee, and thus I commend the bill to the House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022 data-id=\u0022cb66f1f8e4f645bb9cdeacc8a87cc925\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000184\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022cb66f1f8e4f645bb9cdeacc8a87cc925\u0022\u003EThe ASSISTANT SPEAKER (Hon Trevor Mallard)\u003C/span\u003E: Kelvin Davis. [Interruption] Sorry, I apologise to the member, but I have called Kelvin Davis.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022802874a3-deca-48b7-9d33-9087058892f5\u0022 data-id=\u00226d63577619f14778bc8314dd136c78d0\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000185\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022802874a3-deca-48b7-9d33-9087058892f5\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00226d63577619f14778bc8314dd136c78d0\u0022\u003EKELVIN DAVIS (Labour\u2014Te Tai Tokerau):\u003C/span\u003E T\u0113n\u0101 koe, Mr Assistant Speaker. Tuatahi m\u0101ku e tautokongia ng\u0101 kupu hei whakatau i a koutou Ng\u0101i Te Rangi, Ng\u0101 P\u014Dtiki ki roto i t\u0113nei t\u014D t\u0101tou Whare i runga i ng\u0101 k\u014Drero e p\u0101 ana ki \u014D koutou ker\u0113me. E te hoa, e Mita, hari koa ana ahau te kite i a koe i roto i Te Whare; t\u0113n\u0101 r\u0101 koe. Mihi kau ana ki a koe m\u014D \u014D kaha tautoko i ahau i taku taenga mai ki t\u0113nei Whare Paremata, n\u0101 reira e mihi kau ana ahau ki a koe. T\u0113n\u0101 koutou katoa. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000186\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022802874a3-deca-48b7-9d33-9087058892f5\u0022\u003E[Thank you, Mr Assistant Speaker. The first thing for me is to endorse the welcoming sentiments accorded to you, Ng\u0101i Te Rangi and Ng\u0101 P\u014Dtiki, into this our House in regard to the speeches relating to your claim. In so far as you are concerned, Mita and friend, I am overjoyed to see you in the House; greetings indeed to you. I really acknowledge and appreciate your tremendous support when I arrived in this House, and therefore I thank you immensely for that. Thank you all.]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000187\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022802874a3-deca-48b7-9d33-9087058892f5\u0022\u003EIn these settlement claim bills I think it is always appropriate to go over the historical background relating to the bills and the historical account. I have said it time and again that I get really fed up with the great unwashed, ignorant people out there who say: \u201CWhy are these M\u0101oris always in here putting their hand out, wanting more money?\u201D. It just irritates me to the eyeballs, and I think it is really important that we go through the historical account so people understand, first of all, what was lost before they start hearing and complaining about what is going to come back to the tribes. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000188\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022802874a3-deca-48b7-9d33-9087058892f5\u0022\u003EI remember meeting some people down here in a restaurant in Wellington who attacked me, basically, by saying: \u201COh, you M\u0101oris, why are you always doing this? Why are you always asking for more money? Why have you got your hands out? When\u2019s it going to impact on the people in your tribes?\u201D. I basically had a stand-up argument with them and said: \u201CYou guys need to actually get your facts straight. You need to find out what really happened and stop being so ignorant.\u201D \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000189\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022802874a3-deca-48b7-9d33-9087058892f5\u0022\u003EIn terms of Ng\u0101i Te Rangi, in the late 1850s and early 1860s, they were going about their business quite peacefully, settled there around Tauranga just basically doing what people do\u2014finding food, looking after the wh\u0101nau\u2014but then with the establishment of the K\u012Bngitanga in 1858 and the Crown\u2019s attempts to quell what was happening in Waikato, Ng\u0101i Te Rangi, as well as Ng\u0101 P\u014Dtiki, supported their whanaunga over in the Waikato by taking arms, food, and supplies. It happens these days whenever countries go to war. There is always an economy created around the supply and the logistics and support for those battles. It was no different in those days. Ng\u0101i Te Rangi and Ng\u0101 P\u014Dtiki saw their whanaunga needing assistance, and so went to their aid. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000190\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022802874a3-deca-48b7-9d33-9087058892f5\u0022\u003EThe Crown, though, to quash this, came and fought Ng\u0101i Te Rangi and Ng\u0101 P\u014Dtiki and confiscated some 290,000 acres. The population of Aotearoa New Zealand at the time was probably around about that\u2014everybody in Aotearoa New Zealand could have had a whole acre to themselves. That is the size of the parcel of land that was confiscated in the district in Tauranga. It was done to punish those M\u0101ori who opposed the Crown. When that land was to be returned, Ng\u0101i Te Rangi rangatira understood that 25 percent of the land would be held, but it would be only from those who had resisted the Governor. In the end, that was not the case. The Crown retained 50,000 acres. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000191\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022802874a3-deca-48b7-9d33-9087058892f5\u0022\u003EMy uncle up in Motu\u014Dtau had a farm of some 200 acres. I thought it was a huge bit of land, especially when I had to lift hay-bales. But some 50,000 acres of land\u2014this was not a punishment; this is tantamount to a form of genocide by excluding people from huge amounts of land. It was all about revenge on behalf of the Crown. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000192\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022802874a3-deca-48b7-9d33-9087058892f5\u0022\u003EI see here that there was a prominent Ng\u0101i Te Rangi rangatira, H\u014Dri T\u016Bpaea. He was associated with Paimarire activities, and he was detained without being charged with any offence. I find it interesting that it is acknowledged\u2014and I am sorry to detract here slightly from the bill\u2014that it is wrong to detain somebody without charges, and, 150 or so years after that event, we are saying sorry to a person who has passed away. If the Government is really, really apologetic about detaining somebody without charges, then we also need to address the situation where our whanaunga in Australia are being detained without charges. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000193\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022802874a3-deca-48b7-9d33-9087058892f5\u0022\u003EI remember when the M\u0101ori Affairs Committee went to Tauranga Moana to discuss the Marine and Coastal Area (Takutai Moana) Act 2011, some 5 years ago. I remember a kaum\u0101tua standing up and telling us about the area of the coast where they used to gather kai moana when he was a little kid. It was plentiful, plentiful kai moana, heaps of food. Then he said that within a matter of years a port was built right where they gathered their kai moana. No consultation, no asking\u2014just plonk a port there. So what are people meant to do when their pantry, their food stores, are just taken away like that, and they are made to feel bad\u2014\u201COh, what are you worried about? The port\u2019s here, you can go and pick pipis somewhere else, but this is good for the economy of Tauranga and for the Bay of Plenty.\u201D \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000194\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022802874a3-deca-48b7-9d33-9087058892f5\u0022\u003EWell, my question is how have Ng\u0101i Te Rangi and Ng\u0101 Potiki benefited from that port? Sure, some people may have got jobs, but the reality is their mana over those areas of land was just taken and gone. The unfairness of it all, this is what I want people listening in to understand\u2014the unfairness of these decisions by the Crown and by their agencies, and the systems that they have set up to rob people of their livelihoods, of their food stores. Ng\u0101 P\u014Dtiki suffered similar fates. Their burial place of Tamapahore on top of a strategic maunga, an ancestral maunga, was disturbed for quarrying. Many of the non-M\u0101ori people probably do not know the significance to us of our maunga. Whenever we recite our pepeha, we talk about our waka and\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000195\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022802874a3-deca-48b7-9d33-9087058892f5\u0022\u003EI mihi to M\u0101taatua, koutou ng\u0101 tuakana; ko ahau t\u0113tahi o ng\u0101 uri o Puhi, te teina, n\u0101 reira e mihi kau ana ki a koutou.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000196\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022802874a3-deca-48b7-9d33-9087058892f5\u0022\u003E[I greet you, M\u0101taatua, you the elder siblings; I am one of the descendants of Puhi, the younger sibling, and so I really acknowledge you collectively.]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000197\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022802874a3-deca-48b7-9d33-9087058892f5\u0022\u003EMaunga are so significant to us, and along comes a council and just quarries\u2014quarries, disturbs the bones of their t\u016Bpuna. A rubbish dump was built on Rangataua tidal flats\u2014a rubbish dump\u2014where, again, they collected kai moana, and then later a sewage pond was constructed there. This would be the equivalent these days of someone going into Pak \u2019N Save and taking a crap in the seafood aisle. The place would be closed down. The shelves would be cleared, it would be fumigated, and yet the Crown and the council at the time said it was OK to have a sewage pipe going through the kai moana - gathering spot and a rubbish dump leeching all of its waste into that estuary. And where do Ng\u0101 P\u014Dtiki go to get kai moana then?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000198\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022802874a3-deca-48b7-9d33-9087058892f5\u0022\u003EThis is the reality, and it is a pity that the group of schoolchildren left the gallery a few minutes ago because this is what needs to be told. Our people growing up need to know the true history of our country. It does need to be taught in schools, as was mentioned earlier in the House, so that we do not have people hitting up politicians and M\u0101oris in restaurants and pubs and saying: \u201CWhy have you guys always got your hands out and wanting more money?\u201D. The reality is\u2014and we all know\u2014that the value returned is going to be less than 2 to 3 percent of what was taken, and that is why these claims need to be settled. Kia ora.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00222df33ee5-23d6-441c-a9ba-6495aa69f9fd\u0022 data-id=\u00223daade2e18a543db81525167c0d078f3\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000199\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00222df33ee5-23d6-441c-a9ba-6495aa69f9fd\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00223daade2e18a543db81525167c0d078f3\u0022\u003EDENISE ROCHE (Green):\u003C/span\u003E E Te M\u0101ngai o Te Whare, t\u0113n\u0101 koe, t\u0113n\u0101 koutou e Te Whare; ka huri aku whakaaro ki te hunga mate, r\u0101tou ng\u0101 t\u016Bpuna o Ng\u0101i Te Rangi me Ng\u0101 P\u014Dtiki kua wehe atu ki te p\u014D i runga i te ara roa o te ker\u0113me nei. Haere, haere, haere, oti atu r\u0101! \u0100piti hono, t\u0101tai hono, te hunga mate ki te hunga mate, \u0101piti hono, t\u0101tai hono, te hunga ora ki te hunga ora. T\u0113n\u0101 koutou, t\u0113n\u0101 koutou katoa ng\u0101 uri kua tae mai nei. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000200\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00222df33ee5-23d6-441c-a9ba-6495aa69f9fd\u0022\u003E[Thank you, Mr Assistant Speaker, and to you collectively, the House; my thoughts turn to the dead, to the ancestors of Ng\u0101i Te Rangi and Ng\u0101 P\u014Dtiki who have gone to the void upon the long road of this claim. Depart, leave, and go forever! Let the dead link up and remain with each other, we acknowledge you; let the living link up with each other. Acknowledgments to you collectively and to you, all the relatives who have arrived here.]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000201\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00222df33ee5-23d6-441c-a9ba-6495aa69f9fd\u0022\u003EI want to start by firstly acknowledging the people of Ng\u0101i Te Rangi and Ng\u0101 P\u014Dtiki who have passed on. I particularly want to acknowledge those who have spent their lives\u2014and it has been over many generations\u2014fighting for justice for their people. This bill signals the last of a series of settlements relating to the iwi of Tauranga Moana. The larger iwi, Ng\u0101i Te Rangi, negotiated to work collectively with Ng\u0101 P\u014Dtiki to achieve this joint settlement, and that is what we are celebrating today. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000202\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00222df33ee5-23d6-441c-a9ba-6495aa69f9fd\u0022\u003EThe history behind this bill is a history of betrayal by the Crown. It is a history of raupatu in both the 19th and the 20th centuries. The Crown brought war to Tauranga Moana in order to justify confiscation and to gain access to the fertile lands there, and in a bid to limit Ng\u0101i Te Rangi support for the K\u012Bngitanga. In particular, General Cameron brought a reign of terror to the Waikato, which was also because the Crown wanted that land. The consequences of the battles in Tauranga were a massive confiscation of the land of these two iwi and a betrayal of the promise that only some lands of those involved in the fighting would be confiscated. A large area was taken, as we have heard from Kelvin Davis, the previous speaker, and when some of it was returned it was returned to individuals, not to hap\u016B, which, when you analyse it, is how you alienate the collective hap\u016B from their land. It undermines the hap\u016B rangatiratanga. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000203\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00222df33ee5-23d6-441c-a9ba-6495aa69f9fd\u0022\u003EGiven the importance of this history and the Land Wars\u2019 impacts on these iwi and many others, you would think that the Crown in 2016 would be ensuring that this history would be taught in our schools. How many people, for example, would know that Te Papa Peninsula, which is today where the Tauranga central business district is, was included in the confiscations? That is acknowledged in the deed of settlement and in the acknowledged history. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000204\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00222df33ee5-23d6-441c-a9ba-6495aa69f9fd\u0022\u003EIn addition to the large land loss and destruction of social and economic structures, the 20th century saw a continuation of the attack on the people of Ng\u0101i Te Rangi and Ng\u0101 P\u014Dtiki via the use of the Public Works Act. The sacred burial site of Ng\u0101 P\u014Dtiki t\u016Bpuna, Tamapahore, at Mangatawa, was destroyed, firstly by a quarry and subsequently by a reservoir. The Public Works Act was used to build sewage works that would pollute their food basket and undermine their kaitiakitanga. This is acknowledged in the deed of settlement, and I just want to quote from it. It says that \u201Cthe development of the Port of Tauranga, the disposing of sewerage and wastewater into the harbours and waterways of Tauranga Moana, and the construction of effluent treatment ponds on Te Tahuna o Rangataua, have resulted in the environmental degradation of Tauranga Moana and reduction of biodiversity and food resources which remain a source of great distress to Ng\u0101i Te Rangi and Ng\u0101 P\u014Dtiki.\u201D \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000205\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00222df33ee5-23d6-441c-a9ba-6495aa69f9fd\u0022\u003EIt also says in the deed of settlement that since 1886, on top of the thousands and thousands of acres of land that were confiscated or swindled from iwi, \u201C421 acres of Ng\u0101 P\u014Dtiki lands have been acquired for public works purposes.\u201D To this day, the Public Works Act is, correctly, considered to be an instrument of oppression against tangata whenua lands, and this is why my colleague, Green MP Catherine Delahunty, has a bill that has been selected from the ballot to prevent any more collectively owned M\u0101ori land being taken under the Public Works Act. It has been hugely supported by iwi across the country. It may not stop it all, but it is a start, and many tangata whenua are supporting it because the Public Works Act has done enough damage. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000206\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00222df33ee5-23d6-441c-a9ba-6495aa69f9fd\u0022\u003EAlthough we acknowledge the journey that it has taken to get this bill to the House, the Greens also maintain that this bill does not represent a full and final settlement. It is not final because at this stage we do not know how the past actions of the Crown will impact on the generations yet to come, and it is certainly not full when we compare the redress package with the huge losses suffered, and the previous speaker spoke about that. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000207\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00222df33ee5-23d6-441c-a9ba-6495aa69f9fd\u0022\u003EWe also have strong reservations about the process, which is that the Crown determines whom it will and will not negotiate with. We worry that this will cause more breaches of the Treaty of Waitangi because it can pit iwi against iwi and hap\u016B against hap\u016B. Make no mistake: the settlement, although it is to be acknowledged and celebrated, is a deal. It is the best offer iwi could negotiate at the time, but we still need to recognise that it is a deal. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000208\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00222df33ee5-23d6-441c-a9ba-6495aa69f9fd\u0022\u003EThe financial redress package for Ng\u0101i Te Rangi is $25 million and for Ng\u0101 P\u014Dtiki it is $3 million. They will receive interest, and there are some commercial properties as well, but, as it says in the deed of settlement, this is for setting up an economic base. It says that the financial and commercial redress is aimed at providing Ng\u0101i Te Rangi and Ng\u0101 P\u014Dtiki with resources to assist them to develop their economic and social well-being, which was basically stripped from them with their land. The iwi will also have the opportunity to buy back some properties\u2014about 37 of them for Ng\u0101i Te Rangi, and 32 for Ng\u0101 P\u014Dtiki. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000209\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00222df33ee5-23d6-441c-a9ba-6495aa69f9fd\u0022\u003EI think we have to acknowledge the generosity of Ng\u0101i Te Rangi and Ng\u0101 P\u014Dtiki for agreeing to this settlement. The compensation is a drop in the bucket. Tomorrow is Budget day. That is when the Government will decide how many millions it will allocate for its various projects. With a total of nearly $30 million for this settlement, it does not come anywhere near the $1.7 billion that this Government allocated to bail out South Canterbury Finance about 4 or 5 years ago, and those investors did not even lose their land. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000210\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00222df33ee5-23d6-441c-a9ba-6495aa69f9fd\u0022\u003EThe relationship redress sets out how the Government agencies will interact and consult with Ng\u0101i Te Rangi and Ng\u0101 P\u014Dtiki. It includes provisions for the Minister for Treaty of Waitangi Negotiations and the Office of Treaty Settlements to write letters introducing members of Ng\u0101i Te Rangi and Ng\u0101 P\u014Dtiki to governance entities like Government agencies, local authorities, education providers, and State-owned enterprises. There are also some reserves that will be vested in Ng\u0101i Te Rangi as cultural redress. That will give the opportunity for the iwi to work with the Crown to protect and enhance the conservation values. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000211\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00222df33ee5-23d6-441c-a9ba-6495aa69f9fd\u0022\u003ELast, but not least, the legislation contains the apology from the Crown to iwi. That apology is to be valued. It can never be underestimated. Again, we acknowledge the generosity of Ng\u0101i Te Rangi and Ng\u0101 P\u014Dtiki. We hope that this settlement will help with setting up an economic base for their people and that the apology will go some way towards healing the hurts from the past, but we have a long way to go before they are fully restored to their place in Aotearoa New Zealand. Having said that, we will be supporting this bill.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022cba965bb-864f-4e06-99dc-6fcdfd007ad5\u0022 data-id=\u00223cd8442910e6414c88a569e9f13603cf\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000212\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cba965bb-864f-4e06-99dc-6fcdfd007ad5\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00223cd8442910e6414c88a569e9f13603cf\u0022\u003EPITA PARAONE (NZ First):\u003C/span\u003E T\u012Bhei w\u0101 mauri ora, tuku mauri ora ki te whei ao ki te ao m\u0101rama! E t\u016B ake t\u0113nei ki te tautoko i ng\u0101 mihi i mihingia e aku tu\u0101kana i t\u016B ake i mua i a au ki te \u2019hakatau i a koutou kua tae mai nei i te r\u0101 nei. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000213\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cba965bb-864f-4e06-99dc-6fcdfd007ad5\u0022\u003EE Ng\u0101i Te Rangi, e Ng\u0101 P\u014Dtiki, karekau e m\u014Dhio ana ko wai koutou e noho nei \u0113ngari, \u2019hakarongongia e au ng\u0101 k\u014Drero a Te Minita i \u2019hakahuangia \u0113tahi o ng\u0101 ingoa. N\u0101 reira e kara, e Mita, hoki mai koe ki te w\u0101 k\u0101inga. Charlie, ng\u0101 mihi hoki ki a koe i arahi mai i t\u014D r\u014Dp\u016B kia \u2019hakatau t\u0113nei kaupapa i te Whare nei, \u0101, ki a koe hoki e Haueta. Hoki te mahara i te w\u0101 e noho ana koe i roto i a m\u0101tou i Te Tai Tokerau kia haututu i a t\u0101ua, kia ahatia? \u0112ngari, ka nui ng\u0101 mihi ki a koutou. \u0112ngari, i mua i te haere tonu o t\u0113nei kaupapa, e tika ana kia mihi kau ana ki a koe e te rangatira e Tumu, \u0101, me t\u014D r\u014Dp\u016B i tae mai nei i roto i Te Whare i te r\u0101 nei. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000214\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cba965bb-864f-4e06-99dc-6fcdfd007ad5\u0022\u003EE \u2019hakaaro ana au: \u201CHe aha ng\u0101 take k\u0101rekau au i kite atu i a koutou Ng\u0101i Te Rangi, Ng\u0101 P\u014Dtiki?\u201D N\u0101 te mea e noho ana koutou ki t\u0113nei taha ki te titiro \u0101-kanohi i t\u0113n\u0101 e noho nei i te w\u0101 taha o Te K\u0101wanatanga. \u0112ngari m\u0101ku e mea atu ki a koutou, kia mahara \u0101 te tau e t\u016B mai, he k\u014Dhiringa p\u014Dti, i muri mai i t\u0113n\u0101, kei a m\u0101tou o t\u0113nei taha i neke atu ki t\u0113r\u0101 taha, m\u0113n\u0101 e tautoko ana i a koutou ki m\u0101tou, kia ahatia? Kia hoki mai ki te kaupapa i mua i a t\u0101tau i te r\u0101 nei.  \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000215\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cba965bb-864f-4e06-99dc-6fcdfd007ad5\u0022\u003E[Behold the breath of life! Well-being to the natural and enlightened world! I rise to endorse the words of welcome accorded by my elder colleagues who got up before me to you who have arrived here. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000216\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cba965bb-864f-4e06-99dc-6fcdfd007ad5\u0022\u003EAlthough I cannot see any of you who are seated, Ng\u0101i Te Rangi and Ng\u0101 P\u014Dtiki, I did listen to what the Minister for M\u0101ori Development was saying and to some of the names he mentioned. And so to you, my friend Mita, welcome back home. I compliment you, Charlie, who led your group here to this House to settle this matter, and now to you, Haueta. I think back to the time when you lived amongst us in the north and we got up to mischief\u2014so what! But much appreciation to you collectively. Before I go on with this matter, it is only proper that I acknowledge you, esteemed one Tumu, and your group that has arrived here inside the House today. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000217\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cba965bb-864f-4e06-99dc-6fcdfd007ad5\u0022\u003EI am thinking: \u201CWhy am I not able to see you, Ng\u0101i Te Rangi and Ng\u0101 P\u014Dtiki?\u201D Because you are sitting on this side so you can face that lot on the Government side. But I want to warn you that there is an election next year, and afterwards, we on this side might shift to that side if you support us, so what are you going to do about it? But let us come back to the matter in front of us today.]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000218\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cba965bb-864f-4e06-99dc-6fcdfd007ad5\u0022\u003EOn behalf of New Zealand First I stand to make a contribution to this debate, which deals with the Ng\u0101i Te Rangi and Ng\u0101 P\u014Dtiki Claims Settlement Bill. Can I say that, unlike other settlement bills that have come to this House at this point in time, this is the first one that I have seen where two claimant groups are being dealt with through the claims process under one bill.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000219\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cba965bb-864f-4e06-99dc-6fcdfd007ad5\u0022\u003EI want to commend those who have been responsible for bringing the claim to this stage. As the Minister for Treaty of Waitangi Negotiatons quite rightly pointed out, that could have happened only with the cooperation of the parties involved. However, having said that, I look forward to the time when the M\u0101ori Affairs Committee will have the opportunity to hear submissions from the claimants, particularly those who support the claim but also those who probably do not support the claim. I think it is important that they have the opportunity to be able to express their view.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000220\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cba965bb-864f-4e06-99dc-6fcdfd007ad5\u0022\u003EThe settlement is about cultural and financial redress, and is a financial settlement as well, in terms of the assessed value of the claim. I say \u201Cassessed\u201D because, as the speaker before me, Denise Roche, quite rightly pointed out, these claims, although they are regarded as full and final, cannot really be regarded as fully compensating the various iwi.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000221\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cba965bb-864f-4e06-99dc-6fcdfd007ad5\u0022\u003EOne speaker mentioned that he was somewhat annoyed at being badgered when he went to a restaurant by people who clearly did not understand the process that iwi have to go through to reach this stage. Part of the problem is that not too many people know the history of our nation, particularly the history involving our people.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000222\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cba965bb-864f-4e06-99dc-6fcdfd007ad5\u0022\u003EI want to take this opportunity, for those who are sitting in the gallery, to say that in a few weeks\u2019 time school boards of trustees will be having their elections. When the M\u0101ori Affairs Committee heard submissions regarding the recognition of New Zealand battles, we were told by the Ministry of Education that in order to change the curriculum, submissions had to be made by the boards of governors of each school. If that is the case, then I want to say to you in the gallery to take the opportunity to put up our people to stand for boards of trustees so that you can influence the schools to be able to teach our history. It is a sad commentary that we have to do it by that process, because if the Government wants to change something, it does not go back to each community to seek its approval; it just makes the decision. I just wonder why the Government cannot take the opportunity, given the highlight that has been given to New Zealand history over recent months, to make the decision to include the teaching of New Zealand history in the curricula of our schools. Be that as it may, that is the situation at the moment.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000223\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cba965bb-864f-4e06-99dc-6fcdfd007ad5\u0022\u003EBut that is no consolation to the people of Ng\u0101i Te Rangi and Ng\u0101 P\u014Dtiki. They certainly have grounds to be concerned about the loss of land over the 1850s and the balance of that century. This is an opportunity to try to rectify that. I think that with a will they will certainly be in a position to advance the economic cause of their people by way of this settlement.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000224\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cba965bb-864f-4e06-99dc-6fcdfd007ad5\u0022\u003EI just want to say one thing about this and other settlements. It seems to me that prior to settlements actually being made, once the quantum is mentioned, other interests are wanting to lean on the iwi to contribute to the wider benefit of the community. I just want to signal that that should not be a signal for M\u0101ori to necessarily assist their local bodies or even central government in terms of addressing some of the social issues confronting our people.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000225\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cba965bb-864f-4e06-99dc-6fcdfd007ad5\u0022\u003EI just want to take this opportunity to say that New Zealand First supports this bill and it commends its referral to the M\u0101ori Affairs Committee. Kia ora.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002229c236aa-2283-4690-9a84-aa865404bb61\u0022 data-id=\u0022a60fca9f64584026b0c255dd917cc16d\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000226\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002229c236aa-2283-4690-9a84-aa865404bb61\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022a60fca9f64584026b0c255dd917cc16d\u0022\u003ENUK KORAKO (National):\u003C/span\u003E T\u0113n\u0101 koe, e Te Mana Whakaw\u0101, \u0101, huri noa i Te Whare nei ka mi\u2019i nui atu ki t\u014D t\u0101tou Matua Nui i Te Raki. Ko Ia te t\u012Bmataka me te whakaotika o koutou katoa. N\u014D reira, ka mi\u2019i au ki Te Kaih\u014Dmai m\u014D ka mea pai katoa. N\u014D reira, t\u0113nei te mihi ki a Ng\u0101i Te Rangi Ng\u0101p\u014Dtiki e mihi atu o te whanauka o Te Waka o T\u0101kitimu, e M\u0101taatua, n\u014D reira, huri noa, huri noa i Te Whare, e mihi atu ki a koutou katoa. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000227\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002229c236aa-2283-4690-9a84-aa865404bb61\u0022\u003E[Acknowledgments to you, Mr Assistant Speaker, and throughout this House with a huge blessing to our great father in heaven; he is the beginning and the ending for you all, my thanks to the provider of all good things. Therefore, I this kin of the T\u0101kitimu canoe, M\u0101taatua, greet you, Ng\u0101i Te Rangi and Ng\u0101 P\u014Dtiki, and you all throughout the entire House.]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000228\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002229c236aa-2283-4690-9a84-aa865404bb61\u0022\u003EI have been given only a very, very short call because that is what we get on this side of the House, so when you see a note coming across, I have got 1 minute. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000229\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002229c236aa-2283-4690-9a84-aa865404bb61\u0022\u003EAs chair of the M\u0101ori Affairs Committee I do want to acknowledge the fact that around 3 or 4 weeks ago we had the Tauranga Moana Iwi Collective Redress and Ng\u0101 Hap\u016B o Ng\u0101ti Ranginui Claims Settlement Bill. That bill had its first reading, but there was one more to come and it is this bill here today. So it has actually arrived. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000230\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002229c236aa-2283-4690-9a84-aa865404bb61\u0022\u003EWith this bill\u2014just very, very quickly I will go over some of the main points that are going to be a highlight of this bill itself. In settlements, as we have seen, this is really another familiar story around the reasons why we should have a Treaty settlement. This is about land loss through broken promises and confiscations. This is about underhand purchases, particularly from minors. This is about relationships with the K\u012Bngitanga that were actually detrimental to Ng\u0101i Te Rangi and Ng\u0101 P\u014Dtiki. This is also about\u2014which is quite unique\u2014a famous battle at Gate P\u0101 that was won by the vanquished. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000231\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002229c236aa-2283-4690-9a84-aa865404bb61\u0022\u003EAs I said, all of these stories are familiar, but one of the most beautiful things about this settlement is around the tikanga, particularly when we see the coming together of two iwi and particularly the uri of two brothers. I mention Rangihouhiri and the ancestors Ng\u0101i Te Rangi and Tamapahore, the ancestor of Ng\u0101 P\u014Dtiki. What a beautiful way to bring that together and embark on this journey to settlement. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000232\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002229c236aa-2283-4690-9a84-aa865404bb61\u0022\u003EIt is interesting that we hear from the other side of the House around the fact that you will see who is holding the purse strings\u2014not that side, but this side. When you look at this Government, and particularly over the last three terms, there is an incredible number of Treaty settlements that have been put through. I just want to acknowledge that. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000233\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002229c236aa-2283-4690-9a84-aa865404bb61\u0022\u003EThe final thing is the fact that there is a very, very principled and pragmatic select committee in this House that is called the M\u0101ori Affairs Committee, and as chair I want to acknowledge the members of that particular committee. We love to think that we park all of our political affiliations at the door and get on with what is good for our people, and with this particular bill that is certainly what we will do. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000234\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002229c236aa-2283-4690-9a84-aa865404bb61\u0022\u003EI want to finish on this note. A young wahine from Waiuku said yesterday at the Youth Awards that were held here at Parliament: \u201CLet\u2019s not dwell too long on what was lost. Let\u2019s embrace what we have obtained today, for our future\u2014not that we will ever forget the wrongs that have happened, but it\u2019s actually about an apology. It\u2019s about moving forward.\u201D \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000235\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002229c236aa-2283-4690-9a84-aa865404bb61\u0022\u003EThe M\u0101ori Affairs Committee looks forward to receiving this bill. I commend it to the House. Kia ora.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00220e7e8da2-a6a1-41bb-aeb0-a49be255a293\u0022 data-id=\u0022c0443fbd4fab4dd8a160081433faf7a7\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000236\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220e7e8da2-a6a1-41bb-aeb0-a49be255a293\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022c0443fbd4fab4dd8a160081433faf7a7\u0022\u003EHon NANAIA MAHUTA (Labour\u2014Hauraki-Waikato):\u003C/span\u003E T\u0113n\u0101 t\u0101tou katoa. Tuatahi t\u0113nei te mihi atu ki a koe Te Ariki, e Tumu, hei whakakanohi mai i a r\u0101tou m\u0101 i whakat\u016B te pou ki P\u016Bkawa kia whaia e t\u0101tou te mana motuhake o Te Iwi M\u0101ori n\u014D reira, ki a koutou n\u014D Te Awa o Whanganui t\u0113nei te mihi atu. Ka hoki mai ki a koutou o Ng\u0101i Te Rangi, Ng\u0101 P\u014Dtiki, nei te tino t\u0101piri atu aku mihi maioha ki \u0113r\u0101 i waihotia i mua i a koutou nei aroaro t\u0113nei p\u0101nuitanga o t\u0101 koutou pire; n\u014D reira, t\u0113n\u0101 koutou katoa. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000237\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220e7e8da2-a6a1-41bb-aeb0-a49be255a293\u0022\u003E[Greetings to us all. Firstly I acknowledge you, paramount chief Tumu, who are the face of those who erected the pillar at P\u016Bkawa where we sought independence for M\u0101oridom, and to those of you of the river of Whanganui, I greet you. I come back to you, Ng\u0101i Te Rangi and Ng\u0101 P\u014Dtiki, and add my genuine and fond regards to those who left before you this reading of your bill; therefore congratulations to you all.]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000238\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220e7e8da2-a6a1-41bb-aeb0-a49be255a293\u0022\u003EIt gives me great pleasure to be able to support the first reading of the Ng\u0101i Te Rangi and Ng\u0101 P\u014Dtiki Claims Settlement Bill, and the intent of the legislation. I want to acknowledge both Ng\u0101i Te Rangi and Ng\u0101 P\u014Dtiki for their longstanding efforts to get to this particular time, and also commend their aspirations for the future. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000239\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220e7e8da2-a6a1-41bb-aeb0-a49be255a293\u0022\u003ECan I acknowledge those negotiators who have already been mentioned but make special acknowledgment of my former colleague Mita Ririnui, who was an associate spokesperson on Treaty settlements, and of Matua Hauata Palmer, who kindly hosted me when I was doing a little bit of research of my own. I will come to those salient lessons as I go through my speech. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000240\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220e7e8da2-a6a1-41bb-aeb0-a49be255a293\u0022\u003EI want to also acknowledge Matua Waka Paama and Matiu Dixon. I had some personal interaction with Matiu during his time in the Waikato, over a number of years. Can I say, Minister, that everything you said about Matiu was absolutely true. He made a huge contribution to the Waikato. He is sadly and sorely missed in our area because he was a community man. He understood the necessity of trying to hold on to and uphold the values that M\u0101ori have within an ever-changing world, and I think he was absolutely consistent right through to his untimely death. Waka also made a huge contribution to the H\u0101hi R\u0101tana. He was a kind soul and very wise, and people who sought his advice would always get two sides of the coin, I think. He gave very wise counsel. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000241\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220e7e8da2-a6a1-41bb-aeb0-a49be255a293\u0022\u003EI came to this whole process of the Tauranga Moana Treaty settlement knowing those commonalities of our experience. Raupatu was all about iwi standing up for their own lands, fighting to retain what was theirs in their own area. But let us put Tauranga Moana into some context, because today Tauranga Moana has one of the most successful ports other than Auckland. In the future it will continue to be one of the most successful economic areas, or engine rooms, for the country. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000242\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220e7e8da2-a6a1-41bb-aeb0-a49be255a293\u0022\u003ESo when we think about the opportunities going forward it is no wonder that there has been some significant effort to try to retain some gains around local government representation. Mita Ririnui himself, under some vociferous and nasty debate, introduced the first provision for M\u0101ori seats at the regional council level. Once you understand the extent of the impact that that level of decision making at central government and local government can have, I think the opportunities in this particular settlement can only be built on. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000243\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220e7e8da2-a6a1-41bb-aeb0-a49be255a293\u0022\u003EI want to reiterate the comments of the Minister. The Ng\u0101i Te Rangi and Ng\u0101 P\u014Dtiki Claims Settlement Bill really brings together what has already been debated at first reading in this House for Ng\u0101ti Ranginui and Ng\u0101ti P\u016Bkenga. However, those things outstanding, the Tauranga Moana framework\u2014everything to do with what is happening in the marine space of Tauranga Moana\u2014is absolutely significant. We have not mentioned the Rena, but it did have a big impact on their area. The response may not have been as well accommodated for as iwi wanted, but should it ever happen again\u2014we hope it does not\u2014the response should be much better informed with the direct contribution of iwi. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000244\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220e7e8da2-a6a1-41bb-aeb0-a49be255a293\u0022\u003EAgain, the other issue about the Tauranga Moana framework, which in time we may well get to support if it requires legislation, is the ongoing ability of iwi within Tauranga Moana to have a say on the way in which the harbour develops, because if, for example, any extension to the port or any dredging within that part of the marine space of Tauranga Moana is required, iwi should have a say. The turnover of the Port of Tauranga just last year was $79 million, so you calculate how long the port has been there and what the lost opportunity is for the people of Tauranga, and then see what the ongoing obligation of any Government would be to try to include the people of Tauranga Moana within the development of their particular part of the world. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000245\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220e7e8da2-a6a1-41bb-aeb0-a49be255a293\u0022\u003EHousing is unaffordable for people from Tauranga. Tangata whenua from Tauranga are being outpriced in their own region. That cannot be fair. The settlement does provide an avenue for opportunities, and I was heartened by my visit to Ng\u0101 P\u014Dtiki and looking at what they are doing to enter into the space of the provision of housing for their own people in the social housing space through partnerships. They are starting in ways that they obviously have a plan around and are doing good work in, but the sad reality is that as Tauranga becomes more economically prosperous, our question has to be: will this settlement enable them to continue to live and thrive in their own region? That is going to be the ongoing test of the settlement. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000246\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220e7e8da2-a6a1-41bb-aeb0-a49be255a293\u0022\u003EI made mention earlier that I went to visit Hauata with the specific intent\u2014I am the representative for Hauraki-Waikato, and I am standing to make some very certain statements based on some research that I undertook, because I had questions, knowing that Hauraki iwi had made claims into Ng\u0101i Te Rangi. My questions were very simple, and from my own upbringing. If you understand your own history you use that as a platform to be whakah\u012Bh\u012B enough to go and ask a question\u2014n\u0101 runga i te kore m\u014Dhio, n\u0101 runga i te k\u016Bwaretanga. He p\u0101tai noa iho kia \u0101ta kimihia te huarahi pai m\u0101ku [be arrogant enough to go and ask a question because of one\u2019s lack of knowledge and ignorance. It is just a question of carefully seeking a way for me]\u2014so that I could stand with a level of conviction about things. But I did have concerns about the extent, Minister\u2014and you know this\u2014of Hauraki\u2019s interests right into the central business district of Tauranga. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000247\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220e7e8da2-a6a1-41bb-aeb0-a49be255a293\u0022\u003EMy questions were simple. Was there a tatau pounamu? Was there a significant marriage that occurred? Beyond Ng\u0101ti P\u016Bkenga\u2014that history stands by itself\u2014was there a significant marriage that happened between the people of Hauraki and the people of Ng\u0101i Te Rangi that was enduring to this day? Was there an urup\u0101? Was there a significant ancestor who came from Hauraki and had enduring interests, like ahi k\u0101, within the area? I asked my k\u016Bare questions\u2014I will say that in front of Hauata, and he kindly responded\u2014but I have come to know this, having also gone back to Hauraki to ask questions. Minister, the process does not lend itself too kindly to a M\u0101ori way of sorting out these things. If kaum\u0101tua had been able to be encouraged to sit down and sort this out, I think the extent of Hauraki\u2019s interests would have been where they rightly should be, which is back in their own rohe. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000248\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220e7e8da2-a6a1-41bb-aeb0-a49be255a293\u0022\u003EI say this as a member of Hauraki-Waikato, and at the risk of not being elected at the next election, because it is the right thing to do. It is the right thing to do. We see so many times iwi coming to this House through the Treaty settlement process and being put in some very difficult situations where it is hard enough within their whakapapa connections, arguing with one another, let alone somebody coming from somewhere else and making all sorts of claims. But I do it because it is the right thing to do. I do it because I know that Tauranga Moana have had a very long history of trying to seek redress, and it is a smidgen. But if the real opportunity of the collective of Tauranga Moana redress around the impact of raupatu within their rohe is measured, then it is the way in which, going forward, any Government sitting on that side of the House would seek to continue to uphold not only its obligations due to the settlement but its ongoing obligations to support leveraging through local government and other decision making about the economic prosperity of the Tauranga Moana region, because it can only flourish with all the iwi of Tauranga Moana. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000249\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220e7e8da2-a6a1-41bb-aeb0-a49be255a293\u0022\u003EN\u014D reira, he paku mihi, he paku whakaaro hei t\u0101piri atu ki \u0113nei k\u014Drero ki ng\u0101 kaupapa.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000250\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220e7e8da2-a6a1-41bb-aeb0-a49be255a293\u0022\u003E[And so it is just a brief acknowledgment and thought to add to these contributions to the proposals.]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022893adc11-ce4e-419c-a079-08f04b3d75f5\u0022 data-id=\u00226773cafd4fad43a894241121018a8a8f\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000251\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022893adc11-ce4e-419c-a079-08f04b3d75f5\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00226773cafd4fad43a894241121018a8a8f\u0022\u003EThe ASSISTANT SPEAKER (Lindsay Tisch)\u003C/span\u003E: I call Marama Fox\u20145 minutes.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022c3d9fd88-4715-419d-be08-e1c4eda7d09e\u0022 data-id=\u002203da9823825c4257a9effc4dd476661b\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000252\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c3d9fd88-4715-419d-be08-e1c4eda7d09e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002203da9823825c4257a9effc4dd476661b\u0022\u003EMARAMA FOX (Co-Leader\u2014M\u0101ori Party):\u003C/span\u003E T\u0113n\u0101 koe e Te Mana Whakaw\u0101, anei te mihi atu ki a koutou e hui nei i t\u0113nei w\u0101 ki a koutou, Ng\u0101i Te Rangi, Ng\u0101 P\u014Dtiki; kai te mihi atu ki a koutou \u0113ngari kua k\u012Bk\u012B Te Whare i ng\u0101 k\u0101wai rangatira kai waenganui i a t\u0101tau, koutou ng\u0101 h\u0101 kui, ng\u0101 koroua o te motu nei kai te mihi atu ki a koutou. N\u0101 koutou t\u0113nei Whare e whakamana, n\u0101 koutou t\u0113nei Whare e whakamana. Kai te mihi atu ki a koutou o Ng\u0101i Te Rangi. Kua k\u014Drero k\u0113 nei \u014Dku hoa mahi i te h\u012Btori o t\u014D koutou ker\u0113me, \u0101, kua tae \u0101-tinana mai koutou. Ko te p\u0101nuitanga tuatahi t\u0113nei m\u0101 koutou. He paku noa te w\u0101 m\u014Dku n\u0101 reira, kai te p\u012Brangi au ki te h\u0101ngai aku k\u014Drero ki te k\u014Drero e p\u0101 ana ki a Pukehinahina. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000253\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c3d9fd88-4715-419d-be08-e1c4eda7d09e\u0022\u003E[Thank you, Mr Assistant Speaker, and a welcome to you assembled here at this moment, Ng\u0101i Te Rangi and Ng\u0101 P\u014Dtiki; I acknowledge you but note that the House is packed with the leaders amongst us, you the elderly women and menfolk of the country. I salute you collectively. This House is enhanced and made noble by your presence; I commend you, Ng\u0101i Te Rangi. My fellow colleagues have already addressed the history of your claim and you are here physically. This first reading is for you. I have only a limited time, so I want to focus my comments on the story about Pukehinahina.]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000254\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c3d9fd88-4715-419d-be08-e1c4eda7d09e\u0022\u003EI am going to concentrate my comments, for the short time that I have, on the battle of Gate P\u0101, or Pukehinahina. Why? Because we talk about it, say that it was raupatu, it was a battle, and there it ends. But the story is so much greater, and the story points to the resilience of these people. So I want to read it into the history, and I want to read it into the Hansard of this House, and not just dismiss it as: \u201CThere was a battle.\u201D\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000255\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c3d9fd88-4715-419d-be08-e1c4eda7d09e\u0022\u003EIn March 1864 the Tauranga Moana tribes challenged British troops stationed at Te Papa in Tauranga to battle. The soldiers had been sent there to block any support for the K\u012Bngitanga. The first challenge went unheeded, and so the field of battle was moved closer and the fortifications were built at Pukehinahina, now known as Gate P\u0101. R\u0101wiri Puhirake of Ng\u0101i Te Rangi was the chief in charge at Pukehinahina. H\u0113nare Taratoa, a Christian minister, wrote a code of conduct for the battle, imploring that the enemy be cared for and not ill-treated when wounded.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000256\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c3d9fd88-4715-419d-be08-e1c4eda7d09e\u0022\u003EFighting broke out on 29 April 1864, when 1,700 soldiers faced the 230 M\u0101ori warriors. Their artillery levelled the p\u0101. Then 300 soldiers stormed the ruins, but they were caught off guard. They were caught off guard as the defenders were safely hidden in the bunkers and opened fire and decimated their ranks. With the troops in disarray, the tribal warriors abandoned the scene of their victory.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000257\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c3d9fd88-4715-419d-be08-e1c4eda7d09e\u0022\u003EThe soldiers\u2019 revenge for Gate P\u0101 came a few weeks later, on 21 June 1864 at Te Ranga. While the defenders were building a new fortification they were attacked, and many were killed. In M\u0101ori terms, this was considered a treacherous act, as great kindness had been shown to the British wounded at Gate P\u0101. This spelt the end of fighting in the Tauranga district and the beginning of the confiscation of thousands of hectares of fertile, pristine Tauranga land, for which we have finally gathered here today.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000258\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c3d9fd88-4715-419d-be08-e1c4eda7d09e\u0022\u003ENo matter what we say and no matter what we do, the negotiations that your people have been through will in no way make up and compensate for the loss that has been so well articulated here today. So, again, I recognise the koha that you give in even settling\u2014as little as it is\u2014for the history, the confiscation, and the loss of posterity in your own lands over this time.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000259\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c3d9fd88-4715-419d-be08-e1c4eda7d09e\u0022\u003EYour whakatauk\u012B or your pepeha \u201CKo Mauao te maunga, ko Tauranga te moana\u201D\u2014he tohu t\u0113n\u0101 o te tangata, ki uta, ki tai. K\u0101 t\u016B m\u014D ake tonu atu ahakoa te patu o te tangata, ahakoa te p\u0113hitanga o te K\u0101wanatanga kai runga i a koutou, kai konei \u0101-tinana, \u0101-kanohi kia tutuki pai t\u0113nei ker\u0113me; nei te mihi atu ki a koutou. T\u0113n\u0101 koutou, kia ora mai t\u0101tou katoa.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000260\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c3d9fd88-4715-419d-be08-e1c4eda7d09e\u0022\u003E[Your saying or your proverb \u201CThe mountain is Mauao, the sea is Tauranga\u201D\u2014that is the identity of the individual at the foreshore and in the hinterland. The symbol stands forever, regardless of harm inflicted by mankind or oppression imposed by the Government upon you collectively, you are here physically and face to face to ensure that this claim is fulfilled; I commend and congratulate you. My appreciation to us all.]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022758dcaf3-9976-43ac-8593-79f66ee4da22\u0022 data-id=\u00225e4f68d6d1e84c0290a3c97a1875ff7f\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000261\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022758dcaf3-9976-43ac-8593-79f66ee4da22\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00225e4f68d6d1e84c0290a3c97a1875ff7f\u0022\u003EJOANNE HAYES (National):\u003C/span\u003E Kia ora e Te Mana Whakaw\u0101. Ng\u0101 uri o Ng\u0101i Te Rangi me Ng\u0101 P\u014Dtiki, nau mai, haere mai; Mita Ririnui, t\u0113n\u0101 koe, \u0101, nau mai. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000262\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022758dcaf3-9976-43ac-8593-79f66ee4da22\u0022\u003E[Thank you, Mr Assistant Speaker. And so to the descendants of Ng\u0101i Te Rangi and Ng\u0101 P\u014Dtiki, welcome, draw hither; acknowledgments to you, Mita Ririnui, and welcome.]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000263\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022758dcaf3-9976-43ac-8593-79f66ee4da22\u0022\u003EI am pleased to stand to take a very short call on this bill. It is a very important bill. As iwi you are part of the Tauranga Moana, yet your bill stands alone by itself. I want to acknowledge the distance you have travelled to be here today, for Ng\u0101i Te Rangi and Ng\u0101 P\u014Dtiki. I acknowledge the journey many of you may have made historically, and I want to acknowledge the journey of Ng\u0101 P\u014Dtiki and that it has taken 17 years to actually get here today. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000264\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022758dcaf3-9976-43ac-8593-79f66ee4da22\u0022\u003EI want to acknowledge the many people who have helped to bring Ng\u0101 P\u014Dtiki here. My focus, as you realise, is going to be on Ng\u0101 P\u014Dtiki today. I want to acknowledge the work of Kathy Ertel, who worked very hard. She was a strong advocate for the claims for Ng\u0101 P\u014Dtiki. I want to thank our kaum\u0101tua Waka T\u0101ite for his contributions here in supporting Ng\u0101 P\u014Dtiki\u2019s claims here today. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000265\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022758dcaf3-9976-43ac-8593-79f66ee4da22\u0022\u003EI want to acknowledge our kuia up here, Poihaere Walker, who has been on this journey for a long time to get Ng\u0101 P\u014Dtiki here. That is not the only reason I acknowledge her; I also acknowledge her because she is the mother of my executive assistant, Elaine Durie. I want to also acknowledge Victoria K\u012Bngi, M\u0101tire Duncan, and Colin Reeder\u2014all kaimahi who have worked to get Ng\u0101 P\u014Dtiki here. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000266\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022758dcaf3-9976-43ac-8593-79f66ee4da22\u0022\u003EAs we have heard in the House today, concerning these bills, there has been a mention about drops in buckets. Well, today there are 26.5 million drops in the bucket for Ng\u0101i Te Rangi and over 3 million drops in the bucket for Ng\u0101 P\u014Dtiki, and, as I have said in many of my contributions in the House, it is not how many drops in the bucket you get, but it is actually the ocean you create economically as a result for your iwi. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000267\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022758dcaf3-9976-43ac-8593-79f66ee4da22\u0022\u003EThis is an amazing bill. It is an amazing time for both iwi. I look forward to it coming to the M\u0101ori Affairs Committee, and I commend it to the House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000268\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022758dcaf3-9976-43ac-8593-79f66ee4da22\u0022\u003EBill read a first time. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000269\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022758dcaf3-9976-43ac-8593-79f66ee4da22\u0022\u003EBill referred to the M\u0101ori Affairs Committee.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000270\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022758dcaf3-9976-43ac-8593-79f66ee4da22\u0022\u003EWaiata\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n    \u003C/div\u003E\n    \u003Cdiv class=\u0022HpsHansard\u0022\u003E\n      \u003Cp\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsProceedingHeading\u0022\u003EBills\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000271\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u002229817a94624447748e9169bfe4db21c6\u0022\u003ETe Awa Tupua (Whanganui River Claims Settlement) Bill\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000272\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u0022e4221c101876433db60d33862ef96c81\u0022\u003EFirst Reading\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002241146229-4d11-415b-a4ac-f4e2b923e95d\u0022 data-id=\u00220af1ec9ab832405b974082d056a1aebe\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000273\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002241146229-4d11-415b-a4ac-f4e2b923e95d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00220af1ec9ab832405b974082d056a1aebe\u0022\u003EHon CHRISTOPHER FINLAYSON (Minister for Treaty of Waitangi Negotiations):\u003C/span\u003E I move, That Te Awa Tupua (Whanganui River Claims Settlement) Bill be now read a first time. I nominate the M\u0101ori Affairs Committee to consider the bill. This is a truly historic day because today, after all these years, this House will debate Te Awa Tupua (Whanganui River Claims Settlement) Bill for the first time. I warmly welcome to Parliament all representatives of Whanganui iwi. They were here 2 years ago to initial the deed of settlement, and now our common goal of bringing recognition to the great Whanganui River has brought us back together.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000274\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002241146229-4d11-415b-a4ac-f4e2b923e95d\u0022\u003EThere are a number of people who have been pivotal in reaching this point, so it is sad that they are unable to be here. First and foremost, I mention Sir Archie Taiaroa. He is one of those key people whom I have acknowledged in the past. We cannot forget that his vision for Te Awa Tupua is why we are here today. He always proposed that the river be addressed first, for it is the river that unites the people of Whanganui. There are so many people who have passed on since this process began that I can recognise only some of them this morning. From the trust board, I acknowledge Martha, Lady Taiaroa; Hikaia Amohia; Joan Akapita; Michael P\u014Dtaka; William, or Barney, Haami; and Dardanella Metek\u012Bngi-Mato. I acknowledge particularly the former board member Waimaria Erueti, who passed away in 2011. Her son Kiwa witnessed my signature at the signing of the deed of settlement in 2014. I welcome Kiwa and Waimaria\u2019s mother, Evelyn, to Parliament, and I have to say I am delighted that Kiwa is going to be my Youth MP in July.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000275\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002241146229-4d11-415b-a4ac-f4e2b923e95d\u0022\u003EAlthough our first negotiations did not come to fruition, I acknowledge those who were members of the 2002 negotiating team, Piripi Haami and Meena Williams, and I also acknowledge the leadership of the collective iwi of Te Awa Tupua, whose support continues to be pivotal. Our recent meeting with the leadership of the iwi demonstrated once again that it is the river that brings us together, and I look forward to working with the iwi to implement the framework, for of course there is a lot of work to be done.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000276\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002241146229-4d11-415b-a4ac-f4e2b923e95d\u0022\u003EI acknowledge the leadership within the regional and district councils, whose support has enabled a settlement that is appropriate and fit for the purpose, and I particularly acknowledge the presence here today of Annette Main, who has been such a wonderful supporter of this particular exercise. I acknowledge her work as the Mayor of Whanganui\u2014thank goodness she was the mayor when we were dealing with this issue. I acknowledge the lead Whanganui iwi negotiator, Gerrard Albert, who led the negotiations and is now leading his people in the post-settlement world. I pay particular respect to John Maihi and Te Tiwha Puketapu.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000277\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002241146229-4d11-415b-a4ac-f4e2b923e95d\u0022\u003EI acknowledge the Office of Treaty Settlements and all the key agencies that have worked so very hard on this issue. I particularly want to thank John Wood, my chief Crown negotiator, for his outstanding work. He is a great New Zealander. I particularly want to make a special acknowledgment of Amber Duncalfe. Amber was an official from the Department of Conservation. Sadly, she passed away late last year, but I welcome Amber\u2019s parents and sister to Parliament. She had a key role to play within the negotiating team for both the Whanganui River and the T\u016Bhoe settlements, and she was, and remains, greatly respected by the negotiators for the work that she did. She made a lasting contribution to the innovative inclusion of conservation and natural resources within Treaty settlements.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000278\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002241146229-4d11-415b-a4ac-f4e2b923e95d\u0022\u003EFinally, I welcome back to the House the great Tariana Turia. She is here for the first reading of her iwi\u2019s bill. She secretly loves it when I call her great. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000279\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002241146229-4d11-415b-a4ac-f4e2b923e95d\u0022\u003EKelvin Davis made a very valuable contribution to the previous debate, and I was particularly intrigued by his comments about what he tells those people who moan about Treaty settlements. He tells them to learn something about the facts. Of course, he is absolutely correct, not only in relation to the previous debate but also in relation to this one, because it is very important for all of us to understand the facts here.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000280\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002241146229-4d11-415b-a4ac-f4e2b923e95d\u0022\u003EThe constant position of Whanganui iwi for well over 150 years was that they never willingly relinquished possession or control of the Whanganui River and all things that give the river its essential life. For generations they have pursued justice in respect of the river. Their claim has been persistently maintained and advanced since the first petitions to Parliament in 1873 and 1887. Numerous further petitions and submissions followed over the next 125 years. The endless quest for justice was brought home to me when I saw the long list of legal counsel who have supported the iwi in their cause, beginning in the Native Land Court in 1938 with the late Chief Judge Morison, and continuing today with the likes of Jamie Ferguson, Peata Williams, and so many others. I particularly want to place on record one of their counsel, the late George Barton, who represented them in the Court of Appeal, it was, as far back as 1962. George was a very close friend of both Jamie Ferguson and mine, and a great New Zealander.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000281\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002241146229-4d11-415b-a4ac-f4e2b923e95d\u0022\u003EThe Wai 167 claim was filed by members of the trust board on behalf of all Whanganui iwi in 1990 and was heard by the Waitangi Tribunal in 1994. Progress was made in 2011 and in 2012, when the Crown and Whanganui iwi signed two important documents. The record of understanding and the T\u016Btohu Wh\u0101katupua set out the key elements of Te Awa Tupua upon which these negotiations have grown. On 5 August 2014 the vision was realised, when we signed the deed of settlement at R\u0101nana on the banks of the river. The signing came after Whanganui iwi carefully considered the settlement package and voted overwhelmingly to support it. In addition, all those who look to the river have expressed their support for the settlement. I thank them for their support, and I acknowledge Sir Tumu here today. Since that memorable day, the Crown and the iwi have continued to work together to refine the deed of settlement into the Te Awa Tupua bill. It has been a long road to its introduction, and at times it has not been easy. However, I am proud that the bill we are debating here today is practical, it is workable, and it provides a platform for the Crown and Whanganui iwi to move together in partnership.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000282\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002241146229-4d11-415b-a4ac-f4e2b923e95d\u0022\u003EThe redress provided for in the bill has both novel and exciting aspects, and I can barely touch on them in the available time. The river is going to be recognised in law as Te Awa Tupua, an indivisible and living whole, from the mountains to the sea, incorporating its tributaries and all its physical and metaphysical elements. The Crown will no longer own the riverbed but the Crown will still have a role to play, and we have developed this concept of the role of Te Pou Tupua, where both the Crown and iwi will appoint two guardians, and that will be the face of Te Awa Tupua and will symbolise our partnership through the Treaty. This is an exciting project for both the Crown and iwi, and to support it there will be a $30 million contestable fund to support activities to promote the health and well-being of Te Awa Tupua. There are numerous other aspects of the bill that will need to be considered very closely by the committee. Finally, the settlement includes the payment of $81 million to Whanganui iwi in recognition of the settlement of their claims to help advance the future health and well-being of the river and its people.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000283\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002241146229-4d11-415b-a4ac-f4e2b923e95d\u0022\u003EThere is so much more that one could say about the bill but I am getting that look, so, Mr Assistant Speaker, I commend the bill to the House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022a434482b-7ac1-4862-9ce7-13e63289dee3\u0022 data-id=\u0022cd6dc5d15a894c31b075d97839146672\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000284\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a434482b-7ac1-4862-9ce7-13e63289dee3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022cd6dc5d15a894c31b075d97839146672\u0022\u003EADRIAN RURAWHE (Labour\u2014Te Tai Hau\u0101uru):\u003C/span\u003E \u0100, t\u0113n\u0101 koe e Te M\u0101ngai o Te Whare, otir\u0101, kor\u014Dria harer\u016Bia ki a koe e Ihoa ng\u0101 mano. T\u016B\u0101uriuri, wh\u0101ioio, k\u012B tonu te rangi me te whenua i te nui o t\u014Dna kor\u014Dria, \u0101, tihei mauri ora! Mai i Te Rakiura ki Te Tonga, whiti atu ki Te Wharekauri ki te r\u0101w\u2019iti, toro atu ki te uru, piki ake ki Te Reinga, ki Te Tai Tokerau, ng\u0101 kokonga e wh\u0101 o Te Motu o Aotearoa, tae atu ki Te Awa Tupua e rere nei.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000285\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a434482b-7ac1-4862-9ce7-13e63289dee3\u0022\u003EE ng\u0101 w\u2019\u0101nau i raro i te kapua p\u014Duri, kei te h\u012Bkoi i roto i te \u0101taarangi o ng\u0101 wh\u0101rua o te mate, mauria mai r\u0101 \u014D koutou pare kawakawa kia tangihia i te w\u0101 iti nei. T\u0113nei te tangi apakura e aku parepare, aku w\u2019akaruruhau, e te m\u016Brau o te tini, te wenerau o te mano, kua maunu ki te waka o aitu\u0101, kua huri k\u0101weka i ng\u0101 rangi, i ng\u0101 wiki, i ng\u0101 marama kua ta\u2019a ake nei. Ko koutou \u0113r\u0101 e taka\u2019i ana i te ara tukutuku o Poutama, kia eke ki ng\u0101 rire o ng\u0101 rangi ki te karanga o Te Runga Rawa, e moe, e moe, e moe! \u0100, k\u0101ti m\u014D t\u0113n\u0101.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000286\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a434482b-7ac1-4862-9ce7-13e63289dee3\u0022\u003EN\u014D reira, e Te W\u2019are t\u0113n\u0101 t\u0101tau, \u014Dtir\u0101, e tika hoki kia tuku mi\u2019i atu ki a koe e Te Ariki e Tumu. T\u0113nei te mi\u2019i ake ki a koe t\u0113n\u0101 koe! Oti noa, ki a koutou, ki a t\u0101tau ng\u0101 \u2018ap\u016B me ng\u0101 tupuna ro\u2019e o te awa o W\u2019anganui, anei au tuku mi\u2019i atu ki a koutou ng\u0101 paerangi, ng\u0101 poutama, ng\u0101 hau. Ng\u0101ti H\u0101ua, Ng\u0101ti Kura, Ng\u0101ti P\u0101moana, Ng\u0101ti Patutokotoko, Ng\u0101ti Peket\u016Broa, Ng\u0101ti Rangi, Ng\u0101ti Ruak\u0101, Ng\u0101ti Tuera, Ng\u0101ti Tupo\u2019o, Ng\u0101ti Uenuku, Hinengakau, Tama\u016Bpoko, Tupo\u2019o, Tama\u2019aki, Uenuku. T\u0113nei te mi\u2019i ake ki a t\u0101tau katoa. T\u0113nei a\u2019au t\u014D koutou w\u2019anaunga e tuku mi\u2019i atu ki a koutou, ki a t\u0101tau ng\u0101 uri o Te Awa Tupua, nau mai, \u2019aere mai ki Te W\u2019are P\u0101remata nei.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000287\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a434482b-7ac1-4862-9ce7-13e63289dee3\u0022\u003E\u2019Aere mai ki te p\u0101nuitanga tuata\u2019i o t\u0113nei pire hei whakatau t\u0113nei ker\u0113me m\u014D Te Awa Tupua, t\u0113n\u0101 koutou. Kua roa te w\u0101, kua rongo t\u0101tau i te k\u014Drero o Te Minita. Neke atu i te 150 ng\u0101 tau kei te haere t\u0113nei ker\u0113me. Ka \u2019uri aku w\u2019akaaro ki a r\u0101tau i tuku t\u0113nei ker\u0113me i te tuata\u2019i. Ki a Kaiw\u2019are Kiriona, Tanginoa Tapa, Te Kira Taina, Tonga Tume, H\u014Dhepa Hekenui, H\u0113nare Keremeneta, Te Rama W\u2019anarere, Hekenui Whakarake, T\u012Bt\u012B Tihi, Pong\u0101tu Tau, Taka-i-te-iwa Anderson, Kahukiwa Whakareke. E tika ana kia tuku mi\u2019i atu ki a r\u0101tau.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000288\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a434482b-7ac1-4862-9ce7-13e63289dee3\u0022\u003EKa w\u2019akapiri \u2019oki aku w\u2019akaaro, aku mi\u2019i ki te mi\u2019i o Te Minita, me t\u014Dna whakahua i ng\u0101 ingoa e m\u014Dhio ana t\u0101tau; ki a Hikaia Amohia, n\u0101na i tuku atu te ker\u0113me i te tuatahi. T\u0101 Te Atawhai Taiaroa, me p\u0113\u2019ea te mihi ake ki a ia. Ki a Rangiti\u2019i Ta\u2019up\u0101rae, Matiu M\u0101reikura, Niko Tangaroa, Koro Pestel; ki te p\u0101p\u0101 Te Anga Tipa, r\u0101tau katoa. Hoi an\u014D, e tika ana kia tuku atu te reo poroporo\u0101ki ki a r\u0101tau, n\u014D reira, e \u2019oki, e moe, e moe. Oti noa i runga i ng\u0101 kupu \u0101 kui m\u0101, \u0101 koro m\u0101: \u201CRipi, ripia, hae, hae\u0101! Ripi, ripia, hae, haea, turakina! Paranitia atu koko o te ng\u0101ngara kai tangata, u\u0113, \u0101! He a\u2019a te to\u2019u o te ringaringa! He kawakawa tuku ki raro ki a ope r\u0101! He toro ki a ko te w\u2019akatau o te mate, u\u0113, \u0101, u\u0113 \u0101!\u201D. \u0100, n\u014D reira aku w\u2019anaunga t\u0113n\u0101 t\u0101tau.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000289\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a434482b-7ac1-4862-9ce7-13e63289dee3\u0022\u003E[Greetings to you, Mr Assistant Speaker, and at the same time, glory and hallelujah to Jehovah of the inumerable thousands. Heaven and earth is filled with the greatness of his glory, behold the breath of life! From Stewart Island in the south across to the Chatham Islands in the east, stretching forth to the west, ascending to Cape Reinga in the north. These are the four corners of New Zealand, including Te Awa Tupua flowing here.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000290\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a434482b-7ac1-4862-9ce7-13e63289dee3\u0022\u003ETo the familes clouded by sorrow, walking in the shadow of the valley of death, bring forth your wreaths of mourning to be mourned at this brief moment. I mourn and lament my fortifications and havens, and the dread of the multitude and envy of thousands who have departed on the conveyance of mishap over the past days, weeks, and months. You are the ones going up the stairway of Poutama to the extremities of the heavens, at the call of the Almighty above; rest, sleep and slumber! Let us leave that there.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000291\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a434482b-7ac1-4862-9ce7-13e63289dee3\u0022\u003ESo acknowledgments to us all, the House, but at the same time it is fitting that I acknowledge you, paramount chief Tumu. I acknowledge and greet you! Furthermore, I greet you and we subtribes, ancestral regions of the Whanganui River, the horizons, genealogies, and winds. Ng\u0101ti H\u0101ua, Ng\u0101ti Kura, Ng\u0101ti P\u0101moana, Ng\u0101ti Patutokotoko, Ng\u0101ti Peket\u016Broa, Ng\u0101ti Rangi, Ng\u0101ti Ruak\u0101, Ng\u0101ti Tuera, Ng\u0101ti Tupo\u2019o, Ng\u0101ti Uenuku, Hinengakau, Tama\u016Bpoko, Tupo\u2019o, Tama\u2019aki and Uenuku, I acknowledge you all. I, your relative, extend this greeting to you and to us all, the descendents of Te Awa Tupua, welcome, welcome to this House. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000292\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a434482b-7ac1-4862-9ce7-13e63289dee3\u0022\u003EWelcome to the first reading of this bill that will settle this claim for Te Awa Tupua. Well done to you. It has been a long time. We heard what the Minister for Treaty of Waitangi Negotiations said, that this claim has been going on for more than 150 years. My thoughts turn to those who made this claim in the first place, Kaiw\u2019are Kiriona, Tanginoa Tapa, Te Kira Taina, Tonga Tume, H\u014Dhepa Hekenui, H\u0113nare Keremeneta, Te Rama W\u2019anarere, Hekenui Whakarake, T\u012Bt\u012B Tihi, Pongat\u016B Tau, Taka-i-te-iwa Anderson, and Kahukiwa Whakareke. It is fitting that they are acknowledged.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000293\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a434482b-7ac1-4862-9ce7-13e63289dee3\u0022\u003EI also append my thoughts and congratulations to the Minister for his pronunciation of the names we are familiar with; to Hikaia Amohia, who submitted the claim the first time; to Sir Te Atawhai Taiaroa\u2014how many more accolades can we heap on him; to Rangiti\u2019i Tahup\u0101rae, Matiu M\u0101reikura, Niko Tangaroa, Koro Pestel, and Uncle Te Anga Tipa\u2014all of them. So it is only fitting that we accord them a farewell tribute, so rest, slumber, sleep. Furthermore, and in the words of our elders, men and women: \u201CSlash and cut up, slash and cut up, overturn it, brand the head of the monster that consumes man, u\u0113-\u0101! What is that in the hand? It is the mourning wreath to be handed to that entourage as a tribute of death over yonder, u\u0113-\u0101!\u201D. So my appreciation to us, my relatives.]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000294\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a434482b-7ac1-4862-9ce7-13e63289dee3\u0022\u003EThe Minister for Treaty of Waitangi Negotiations has spoken about Te P\u0101 Auroa n\u0101 Te Awa Tupua. This provides a framework for moving forward. I am very pleased about the nature of this framework. It provides seven principal elements that encapsulate the way that we all feel about Te Awa Tupua in a way that honours the awa in its rightful manner. I want to add my mihi to those who have taken responsibility for bringing this bill to this House today.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000295\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a434482b-7ac1-4862-9ce7-13e63289dee3\u0022\u003EIt has been a long journey for those who have been directly involved with bringing this bill to the House, so I acknowledge every single one of the negotiators for their tenacity in transferring the understanding, the knowledge, and the mauri of the awa into a bill that fairly reflects the way that we feel about the awa. It could not have been an easy journey. I can only imagine from my experience the battles that went on behind the closed doors to bring this to fruition so that it can come here to this House\u2014this House that decides laws and brings new laws and settlement bills like this into law.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000296\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a434482b-7ac1-4862-9ce7-13e63289dee3\u0022\u003ENot that we ever needed a law for the Te Awa Tupua. Te Awa Tupua is ingrained in our hearts and in our minds. I think that this piece of legislation, with its framework that has a human face for our awa, is charged with the responsibility of ensuring that the health and well-being of Te Awa o Whanganui\u2014Te Awa Tupua\u2014is able to be maintained, not so much for us here today but for future generations.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000297\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a434482b-7ac1-4862-9ce7-13e63289dee3\u0022\u003EI do want to acknowledge the rangatahi who have journeyed here to Parliament to witness this. They have a responsibility for future generations to remember this day and the last 150 years, and that this is but a means to give the full recognition of Whanganui iwi as well as the awa itself in the days to come. N\u014D reira, k\u0101ore e roa t\u0113nei t\u016B, otir\u0101, e tika ana kia tuku mi\u2019i atu ki a r\u0101tau m\u0101, r\u0101tau katoa, i hara mai Te Awa o W\u2019anganui ki Te W\u2019are P\u0101remata. N\u014D reira, e mi\u2019i ana a\u2019au ki aku w\u2019anaunga i runga i \u0113nei kupu nei: e rere kau mai te awa nui, mai i te k\u0101hui maunga ki Tangaroa, ko au te awa, ko te awa ko au.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000298\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a434482b-7ac1-4862-9ce7-13e63289dee3\u0022\u003E[This delivery therefore is not a long one, but at the same time it is fitting that I pay a tribute to them, my relatives, all of them who came from the river of Whanganui to Parliament, and I do so with these words: the mighty river flows from the mountain cluster to Tangaroa, the sea; I am the river and the river is me.]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022c3d9fd88-4715-419d-be08-e1c4eda7d09e\u0022 data-id=\u0022556bfb23708144369a7c65859265b110\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000299\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c3d9fd88-4715-419d-be08-e1c4eda7d09e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022556bfb23708144369a7c65859265b110\u0022\u003EMARAMA FOX (Co-Leader\u2014M\u0101ori Party):\u003C/span\u003E P\u014Dkarekare ana ng\u0101 ta\u2019ata\u2019ha o ng\u0101 wai o W\u2019anganui,\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000300\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c3d9fd88-4715-419d-be08-e1c4eda7d09e\u0022\u003ETika rere mai i waenganui e\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000301\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c3d9fd88-4715-419d-be08-e1c4eda7d09e\u0022\u003EKo au t\u0113nei te aorererangi nei i runga i te kapua\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000302\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c3d9fd88-4715-419d-be08-e1c4eda7d09e\u0022\u003EE titiro nei ki te tira hoe waka\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000303\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c3d9fd88-4715-419d-be08-e1c4eda7d09e\u0022\u003EP\u014Dkarekare ana ng\u0101 wai o W\u2019anganui, korikori ana te mouri tipua, \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000304\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c3d9fd88-4715-419d-be08-e1c4eda7d09e\u0022\u003EKo au t\u0113nei, ko koe t\u0113n\u0101 e ng\u0101 mokopuna,\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000305\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c3d9fd88-4715-419d-be08-e1c4eda7d09e\u0022\u003EE rukuruku nei i ng\u0101 wai te puenga ake he tipua.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000306\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c3d9fd88-4715-419d-be08-e1c4eda7d09e\u0022\u003EKo te taurahere ki Te Rangi.\t\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000307\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c3d9fd88-4715-419d-be08-e1c4eda7d09e\u0022\u003EP\u014Dkarekare ana ng\u0101 wai o W\u2019anganui, korikori ana te mouri tipua, \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000308\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c3d9fd88-4715-419d-be08-e1c4eda7d09e\u0022\u003EKo au t\u0113nei, ko koe t\u0113n\u0101 e ng\u0101 mokopuna,\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000309\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c3d9fd88-4715-419d-be08-e1c4eda7d09e\u0022\u003EE rukuruku nei i ng\u0101 wai te puenga ake he tipua.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000310\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c3d9fd88-4715-419d-be08-e1c4eda7d09e\u0022\u003EKo te taurahere ki Te Rangi.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000311\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c3d9fd88-4715-419d-be08-e1c4eda7d09e\u0022\u003EKo te taurahere ki Te Rangi.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000312\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c3d9fd88-4715-419d-be08-e1c4eda7d09e\u0022\u003E[The waters of the Whanganui agitate along the banks\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000313\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c3d9fd88-4715-419d-be08-e1c4eda7d09e\u0022\u003EAs it flows directly from the centre\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000314\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c3d9fd88-4715-419d-be08-e1c4eda7d09e\u0022\u003EI am this aircraft up in the cloud \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000315\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c3d9fd88-4715-419d-be08-e1c4eda7d09e\u0022\u003ELooking down upon the team of canoe paddlers\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000316\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c3d9fd88-4715-419d-be08-e1c4eda7d09e\u0022\u003EThe waters of Whanganui ripple, the ancestral deity stirs\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000317\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c3d9fd88-4715-419d-be08-e1c4eda7d09e\u0022\u003EThis is me, is that you, oh grandchildren,\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000318\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c3d9fd88-4715-419d-be08-e1c4eda7d09e\u0022\u003EDiving about in the waters from whence a deity emerged\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000319\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c3d9fd88-4715-419d-be08-e1c4eda7d09e\u0022\u003EAs the link to the heavens.]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000320\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c3d9fd88-4715-419d-be08-e1c4eda7d09e\u0022\u003EE hika m\u0101, t\u0113n\u0101 koutou!\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000321\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c3d9fd88-4715-419d-be08-e1c4eda7d09e\u0022\u003E[Well, friends, that was well done!]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000322\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c3d9fd88-4715-419d-be08-e1c4eda7d09e\u0022\u003EWell, wh\u0101nau, I greet you. It is as if the awa itself has flowed right into Parliament today, not only here in the gallery, but also overflowing into the foyer outside and into the big room with the great big TV\u2014I am not sure what it is called. I greet you. T\u0113n\u0101 koutou. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000323\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c3d9fd88-4715-419d-be08-e1c4eda7d09e\u0022\u003EWell, that is just about my time up, but I do have a speech. I want to talk about the awa, Te Awa Tupua, which forms an indivisible whole from the mountains to the sea. I acknowledge the inalienable interconnection between the iwi and the hap\u016B of Whanganui and the Whanganui River\u2014I practise my \u201Cwhangas\u201D. E rere kau mai te awa nui nei mai i te k\u0101hui maunga ki Tangaroa.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000324\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c3d9fd88-4715-419d-be08-e1c4eda7d09e\u0022\u003E[This great river flows directly from the mountain cluster to Tangaroa, the sea.]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000325\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c3d9fd88-4715-419d-be08-e1c4eda7d09e\u0022\u003EToday we recognise the perseverance, the discipline, and the faith of Hinengakau, Tama\u016Bpoko, Tupoho, Tamahaki, Uenuku, the t\u016Bpuna rohe groups of the Whanganui iwi. There is a whakatauk\u012B amongst the people of the river: \u201CKauaka e k\u014Drero m\u014D te awa, k\u014Drero ki te awa.\u201D\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000326\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c3d9fd88-4715-419d-be08-e1c4eda7d09e\u0022\u003E[Do not talk about the river, but rather to it.]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000327\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c3d9fd88-4715-419d-be08-e1c4eda7d09e\u0022\u003EToday then I want us to remember and to reflect and to refresh our thoughts with those who have the care, the protection, the management, and the use of the Whanganui River in accordance with the kawa and tikanga maintained by the descendants of Ruatipua, Paerangi, and Haunui-\u0101-P\u0101p\u0101rangi. Te Kuia Peeti was one of the many who recalled the river of their childhood at Kaiwhaiki. She said she could swim before she could walk: \u201CFrom morning to night we would swim and learn about ourselves and surrounding environment. As youngsters, our bodies were developed in the water. Limbs were stretched and pulled. We learnt fleetness of body and mind. \u2026 The river was our playground.\u201D The people of the river told the tribunal that the teardrops of Ranginui are the source of their being, the artery of their one heart: \u201CThe awa is a healer, a k\u0101pata kai, a highway, and a protector. It is the rope that binds all the wh\u0101nau together from the mountain to the sea.\u201D; te taur\u0101whiri o Hineng\u0101kau\u2014the plaited rope of their tipuna Hinengakau. The k\u014Drero was consistent: the river is the beginning; it ties the people together like the umbilical cord of the unborn child. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000328\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c3d9fd88-4715-419d-be08-e1c4eda7d09e\u0022\u003EMatiu Mareikura explained to the tribunal: \u201CThe river is ultimately our mana, our tapu, our ihi, our wehi, all these things make up what the river means to us. It is our life cord, not just because it is water\u2014but because it is sacred water to us. Our people go to the river to cleanse themselves, they go to the river to pray, and they go to the river to wash. They go to the river for everything [for everything] leads back to the river. And the river, in return, suffices all our needs.\u201D \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000329\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c3d9fd88-4715-419d-be08-e1c4eda7d09e\u0022\u003EI have taken this time to traverse the power of the tupuna awa Whanganui because it is at the heart of this bill. Today our memories are focused on the original nine trustees of the Whanganui River M\u0101ori Trust Board, who in December 1990 brought the Whanganui River claim on behalf of Te \u0100ti Haunui-\u0101-P\u0101p\u0101rangi. Their sacrifice and devotion is now recorded in this House, and so we mihi to the vision of Hikaia Amohia, Archie Taiaroa, Raumatiki Henry, Kevin Amohia, Hoana Akapita, Te Turi Ranginui, Brendan Puketapu, Michael P\u014Dtaka, John Maihi, and Rangipo Mete-K\u012Bngi. In doing so we honour the generations of inequities, of enquiries, of petitions, and of court cases dating back to 1873; those who brought their awa tupua into this House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000330\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c3d9fd88-4715-419d-be08-e1c4eda7d09e\u0022\u003EAfter the hearings at the marae up and down the river in 1998, the tribunal declared, on page 385 of their report\u2014you can look it up\u2014\u201CContrary to some popular opinions New Zealand was not colonised on the basis that rivers were publicly owned. The right of ownership was based on universal principles of law, principles guaranteed in the Treaty of Waitangi.\u201D\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000331\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c3d9fd88-4715-419d-be08-e1c4eda7d09e\u0022\u003EI know my time is running short, so I am going to cut straight to the words of Te Kuia Peeti: \u201CTo my sorrow my own children and mokopuna have not grown up in this environment, but what we had as children is no longer there. What we thought was unchangeable and immutable, the river, [has] undergone changes which we never dreamt of. Our beautiful safe swimming places have all gone. Because so much of the water was taken away, and therefore it made it inhospitable for the fishlife to live, it was not uncommon for us to see dead [fish] floating down the river. Where once stood strong trees all along the river, we now have very serious erosions on our bank.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000332\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c3d9fd88-4715-419d-be08-e1c4eda7d09e\u0022\u003E\u201CWhere once the birds were plentiful and we could recognise their cries, or squawks, we hardly see them at all now. Where once we had crystal clear water flowing up and down our marae, this is now a very rare occurrence.\u201D\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000333\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c3d9fd88-4715-419d-be08-e1c4eda7d09e\u0022\u003EAnd I finish with this, her words. \u201CIn fact, the river is filthy dirty most all of the time, that is our friend, tupuna, our whanau, has been desecrated by bad farming practices. Where once we had a healthy waterway, we now have a sick river \u2026\u201D.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000334\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c3d9fd88-4715-419d-be08-e1c4eda7d09e\u0022\u003EWhat you have returned to you is not what was taken, but I acknowledge the strength of your people to restore it in its own entity. He pai te mihi atu ki a koutou kua hui mai nei i t\u0113nei rangi, t\u0113n\u0101 koutou, t\u0113n\u0101 koutou, kia ora mai t\u0101tou katoa.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000335\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c3d9fd88-4715-419d-be08-e1c4eda7d09e\u0022\u003E[It is so wonderful to acknowledge you collectively who have assembled here today; greetings and congratulations and my appreciation to us all, thank you.]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022802874a3-deca-48b7-9d33-9087058892f5\u0022 data-id=\u00220419d8eef2be436582c07c4b07c02895\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000336\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022802874a3-deca-48b7-9d33-9087058892f5\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00220419d8eef2be436582c07c4b07c02895\u0022\u003EKELVIN DAVIS (Labour\u2014Te Tai Tokerau):\u003C/span\u003E T\u0113n\u0101 koe, Mr Assistant Speaker; \u0101, tuatahi m\u0101ku e mihi kau ana ki a koutou ng\u0101 hap\u016B i \u2019hakahuangia \u014Du koutou ingoa, n\u0101 koutou i tau mai nei ki raro i te tuanui o t\u0113nei t\u014D t\u0101tou Whare, Te Whare o Te Motu. E Te Ariki, e Tumu, t\u0113n\u0101 r\u0101 koe. Te Kahurangi a Tariana, t\u0113n\u0101 r\u0101 koe. Rau rangatira m\u0101, t\u0113n\u0101 koutou, t\u0113n\u0101 koutou, nau mai, haere mai, whakatau mai. E Te Awa o Whanganui, t\u0113nei t\u0113tahi uri o Taum\u0101rere, e mihi kau ana ki a koutou. M\u014Dhio ana t\u0101tou ki \u014D t\u0101tou awa awa, ka rere atu ka tae ki te moana, \u0101, kei reira ng\u0101 awa awa katoa o te motu, o te ao, e t\u016Bhonohono ai r\u0101tou ki a r\u0101tou. N\u0101 reira, e p\u0113nei ana a Taum\u0101rere, e honohono ana ki a koutou ki Te Awa o Whanganui. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000337\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022802874a3-deca-48b7-9d33-9087058892f5\u0022\u003EE ng\u0101 tini mate kua rongo hoki i ng\u0101 ingoa maha i \u2019hakahuangia i roto i Te Whare i t\u0113nei rangi, r\u0101tou i whakapau i o r\u0101tou kaha kia tae ki t\u0113nei w\u0101, ka mihi atu ki a r\u0101tou. Kore e taea te whakahuangia i ng\u0101 ingoa katoa i te mea, kua rongo ahau i te k\u014Drero a Te Minita i te tau 1873, kua tae t\u0113tahi petihana ki t\u0113nei Whare, mai i taua w\u0101 i te tohetohe, i te whawhai koutou o Te Awa. N\u0101 reira, ka nui ng\u0101 mihi atu ki a koutou, ng\u0101 uri \u014D r\u0101tou m\u0101 kua tae ki t\u0113nei w\u0101hi ki te whakatutukitanga o taua moemoe\u0101 \u014D r\u0101tou.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000338\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022802874a3-deca-48b7-9d33-9087058892f5\u0022\u003E[T\u0113n\u0101 koe, Mr Assistant Speaker. First of all, I acknowledge you, the subtribes whose names were mentioned, you who have arrived here under the roof of this House of ours, the House of this country. Greetings to you, paramount chief Tumu; and Dame Tariana, greetings. Acknowledgments, leaders of a hundredfold; salutations, welcome, welcome. To the Whanganui River, this descendant of Taum\u0101rere welcomes you. We know that when our rivers reach the ocean it is there that all of them from the country and from the world link up with one another. Taum\u0101rere is doing just that, linking up with you, the Whanganui River.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000339\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022802874a3-deca-48b7-9d33-9087058892f5\u0022\u003ETo the many deaths\u2014I have also heard many names mentioned in the House today, those who used up a lot of energy to arrive here at this moment, and I pay tribute to them. It is not possible to mention all the names, because I heard the Minister for Treaty of Waitangi Negotiations say that in 1873 a petition arrived at this House, and since that time you of the river have been debating and in conflict. So there is much admiration for you, the descendants of those, who have arrived here at this place for the completion of that dream of yours.]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000340\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022802874a3-deca-48b7-9d33-9087058892f5\u0022\u003EThis bill declares that Te Awa Tupua \u201Cis an indivisible and living whole [and comprises] the Whanganui River from the mountains to the sea, incorporating all its physical and metaphysical elements.\u201D, and is a legal person with \u201Call the rights, powers, duties, and liabilities of a legal person.\u201D Two things sprang to mind when I read that. First of all, what on earth does metaphysical mean? And then kua rongo ahau i roto i ng\u0101 k\u014Drero a Adrian, a Marama, te mana, te mauri, te ihi, te wehi, w\u0113r\u0101 \u0101huatanga. Mehemua kua tuhia aua kupu ki roto i te pire, \u0101, ka m\u014Dhio, \u0113ngari, kia ahatia r\u0101? \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000341\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022802874a3-deca-48b7-9d33-9087058892f5\u0022\u003E[And then I heard in the contributions by Adrian and Marama, references to power, life principle, force and fear\u2014those aspects. If those words were written into the bill, one would know\u2014but so what?] \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000342\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022802874a3-deca-48b7-9d33-9087058892f5\u0022\u003EThe second issue that sprang to mind was that it is about time\u2014I think this is the third time, but it is about time and it needs to happen more\u2014that the M\u0101ori world view is basically legitimised in legislation. To say that we are talking about a person, incorporating all their physical and metaphysical elements, when talking about a river, just as we have spoken in this House about Te Urewera having similar mana\u2014Te Awa o Waikato has similar mana. It is about time that this House started recognising and legitimising the M\u0101ori world view. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000343\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022802874a3-deca-48b7-9d33-9087058892f5\u0022\u003EWe will all remember the time when they were building a road somewhere up north and the local hap\u016B said \u201COh, there\u2019s a taniwha there. Be careful.\u201D M\u0101oridom was ridiculed. So we have come a long way since that time when we were ridiculed for actually putting our point of view forward, to the extent now that we are legitimising M\u0101ori concepts in law. I can imagine how outside of these walls the country will be going off: \u201COh, my gosh! These M\u0101oris\u2014what are they on about now?\u201D Well, if in our P\u0101keh\u0101 culture and in our Christian culture we believe someone can walk on water, then we can believe that Te Awa o Whanganui is a person. So it is a beautiful thing. I acknowledge the Minister for Treaty of Waitangi Negotiations and everyone who put all the effort into getting to this stage. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000344\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022802874a3-deca-48b7-9d33-9087058892f5\u0022\u003EI just want to read out two paragraphs that struck me from the acknowledgments of the bill. \u201CThe Crown acknowledges that through this settlement Whanganui Iwi have sought to bring all the iwi, hap\u016B, and other communities of the Whanganui River together for the common purpose of upholding and protecting the mana of the Whanganui River and its health and well-being for the benefit of future generations and, ultimately, all of New Zealand.\u201D The two words that hit me there were \u201Cother communities\u201D\u2014\u201CWhanganui Iwi have sought to bring all the iwi, hap\u016B, and other communities \u2026\u201D. This is not about M\u0101ori just wanting again to do stuff for ourselves. This is about New Zealand as a country, including all of our communities. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000345\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022802874a3-deca-48b7-9d33-9087058892f5\u0022\u003EHow can we possibly protect the mana of the river, and its health and well-being, for the benefit of future generations if M\u0101ori have got to do it all on our own? This is about bringing businesses into the fold\u2014about farmers, forestry, the Department of Conservation, Forest and Bird, and all the commercial interests and recreational interests. Everybody has a role to play in ensuring the mana, the mauri, and the hauora of the river. And just on recreational interests, it reminds me of my great-grandfather Uru Davis, who happened to live in Wanganui over a century ago now. I think he even played rugby for Wanganui. He was certainly a rower, and he was part of the Wanganui rowing club. So that is just another little link from myself to the Whanganui River. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000346\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022802874a3-deca-48b7-9d33-9087058892f5\u0022\u003EThe Crown also acknowledges \u201Cthat the approach taken by Whanganui Iwi in respect of this settlement represents significant compromise and generosity of spirit by Whanganui Iwi and promotes a collaborative, inclusive approach to the Whanganui River and its future governance and management with the recognition and protection of Te Awa Tupua at its heart.\u201D Those are great words in the acknowledgment. This is about collaboration, working together, and all the various communities\u2014iwi, hap\u016B, organisations, everybody\u2014coming together to protect the mana, the ihi, and the wehi of this great body of water. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000347\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022802874a3-deca-48b7-9d33-9087058892f5\u0022\u003EWe all know that when we pepeha\u2014I said this in the debate that we just had on the previous bill, the Ng\u0101i Te Rangi and Ng\u0101 P\u014Dtiki Claims Settlement Bill\u2014we acknowledge our waka, we acknowledge our maunga, and we acknowledge our awa. It is part of us. It is who we are. This bill endorses that. It just outlines to the whole country how special our awa are. Be it Whanganui, be it Taum\u0101rere, be it wherever, they are an integral part of who we are as M\u0101ori. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000348\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022802874a3-deca-48b7-9d33-9087058892f5\u0022\u003EThe framework that is being spoken about I believe is fantastic and will go a long way to ensuring the mana and the mauri of the awa. The bill provides for the establishment, purpose, functions, and powers of Te Pou Tupua; \u201CIts purpose is to be the human face of Te Awa Tupua and to act in the name of Te Awa Tupua.\u201D So we are going to have people who are going to have the job of making sure that this bill is enacted. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000349\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022802874a3-deca-48b7-9d33-9087058892f5\u0022\u003EI will just quickly race through in the short time that I have got left and talk about the other parts of the framework. Te Karewao\u2014the bill establishes Te Karewao as an advisory group for Te Pou Tupua, so it is advising the people who will be on Te Pou Tupua. Te K\u014Dpuka n\u0101 Te Awa Tupua\u2014it establishes Te K\u014Dpuka n\u0101 Te Awa Tupua as a strategy group for Te Awa Tupua, made up of not more than 17 members made up from a number of groups. Te Heke Ngahuru ki Te Awa Tupua is \u201Cto provide for the collaboration of persons with interests in the Whanganui River, in order to address and advance the health and well-being \u2026\u201D. Te Korotete o Te Awa Tupua, which is Te Awa Tupua Fund\u2014this here is the $30 million that will be spent in order to promote the hauora, mauri, and mana of te awa. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000350\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022802874a3-deca-48b7-9d33-9087058892f5\u0022\u003EAgain, I would like to congratulate everybody who was involved in the development of this bill, in particular the recognition of the M\u0101ori world view and legislating for it. This is the start. We are looking forward in the M\u0101ori Affairs Committee to hearing submissions on this bill, but I do commend it to the House. N\u014D reira, t\u0113n\u0101 koutou, t\u0113n\u0101 koutou, t\u0113n\u0101 t\u0101tou katoa.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022fc8ab326-1806-41d3-8c41-cd58c95dcb45\u0022 data-id=\u002291f63a3a90ce4fa091e1f0b4bcec8874\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000351\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022fc8ab326-1806-41d3-8c41-cd58c95dcb45\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002291f63a3a90ce4fa091e1f0b4bcec8874\u0022\u003EMETIRIA TUREI (Co-Leader\u2014Green):\u003C/span\u003E E Te M\u0101ngai o Te Whare, t\u0113n\u0101 koe. Ki a t\u0101tou, huri noa i Te Whare, t\u0113n\u0101 t\u0101tou katoa. I te tuatahi, me mihi au ki te hunga mate, ki a r\u0101tou ng\u0101 kuia me ng\u0101 kaum\u0101tua i tautoko i te ara o t\u0113nei whakataunga, kua wehe, me ng\u0101 mate katoa i waenganui i a t\u0101tou i t\u0113nei ata, haere, haere, haere oti atu r\u0101! Ki a t\u0101tou te kanohi ora e tau nei; t\u0113n\u0101 t\u0101tou katoa. N\u014Dku te whiwhi ki te t\u016B m\u014D te R\u014Dp\u016B K\u0101k\u0101riki, t\u0113nei te p\u0101nuitanga tuatahi o te pire m\u014D Te Awa Tupua. He uri ahau o Te Awa Tupua o \u0100tihaunui \u0101 P\u0101p\u0101rangi. I wh\u0101nau mai t\u014Dku kuia a Piupiu i Hiruh\u0101rama, \u0101, ka takoto ia i tona moenga roa kei te whenua o P\u016Btiki. Ka t\u016B toku manawa n\u0101 te whakahirahiratanga o t\u0113nei r\u0101 m\u014D m\u0101tou ng\u0101 uri; n\u014D reira, t\u0113n\u0101 t\u0101tou katoa.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000352\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022fc8ab326-1806-41d3-8c41-cd58c95dcb45\u0022\u003E[Thank you, Mr Assistant Speaker, and to us all, acknowledgments throughout. First of all I pay a tribute to the dead, the elderly men and womenfolk who supported the passage of this settlement and who have passed away, and all the dead amongst us this morning, farewell, depart, travel on forever! I acknowledge us all seated here; salutations to us all. I am privileged to speak on behalf of the Green Party at this the first reading of the bill for Te Awa Tupua. I am a descendant of it\u2014of \u0100tihaunui \u0101 P\u0101p\u0101rangi. My grandmother, Piupiu, was born at Hiruh\u0101rama and her resting place is at P\u016Btiki. My heart came to a halt because of the significance of this day for us offspring; and so greetings to us all.]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000353\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022fc8ab326-1806-41d3-8c41-cd58c95dcb45\u0022\u003EAs a survivor of the people of Te Awa Tupua, it really is an honour to have this opportunity to rise on behalf of the Greens to support the first reading of Te Awa Tupua (Whanganui River Claims Settlement) Bill. I rere kau mai te awa nui mai i te k\u0101hui maunga ki Tangaroa, ko au te awa, ko te awa ko au\u2014the great river flows from the mountains to the sea; I am the river and the river is me. This whakatauk\u012B speaks of Te Awa Tupua as an indivisible and living whole, comprising the river from the mountains to the sea, to its tributaries, and all its physical and metaphysical elements. Kia ora, Kelvin. Our identity as mana whenua of this rohe is intrinsically and inextricably connected to our awa, and so in these lines of the whakatauk\u012B also lie the history and the spirit of our people. It is because of this rich history of whakapapa and connection to the land and to the water that the significance of this occasion is certainly not lost on me. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000354\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022fc8ab326-1806-41d3-8c41-cd58c95dcb45\u0022\u003EThis bill gives effect to the deed of settlement, Ruruku Whakatupua, which is the culmination of well over a century of efforts by our people to protect the awa and our kaitiakitanga relationship to it. The challenges for iwi and hap\u016B to uphold this relationship have been ongoing and massive. In the 1870s and the 1880s they faced regulations that threatened fishing grounds and the economic base, the destruction of p\u0101 tuna by colonists to make way for gold and coal prospectors, the removal of gravel from the awa to build roads, the clearing of rapids, and the draining of swamps. The removal of gravel has continued over many decades. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000355\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022fc8ab326-1806-41d3-8c41-cd58c95dcb45\u0022\u003EBut throughout this history of pain, and despite the confiscation and the violence that has been inflicted on the awa, our people have been there at every step of the way doing everything we could to uphold the kaitiaki relationship and to protect the tupuna awa. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000356\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022fc8ab326-1806-41d3-8c41-cd58c95dcb45\u0022\u003EAs far back as 1888 iwi members were petitioning the Crown to stop the destruction of the p\u0101 tuna. In 1895 iwi took a claim to the Supreme Court over customary fishing rights. In response the Government established the Whanganui River M\u0101ori Trust Board, a Crown agency that took control of the awa. From the 1930s to the 1980s iwi would continually fight for the recognition of ownership, tikanga ownership, of the river. And often those small victories that were won would lead to larger setbacks. After long and hard work during the 1980s and 1990s to get to a place of negotiation with the Crown, even then the struggle has had to continue. Two proposals for hydroelectric dams, which would have been massively destructive to the mauri of the awa, were stopped because of mana whenua claims and campaigns\u2014P\u0101kaitore of the 1990s. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000357\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022fc8ab326-1806-41d3-8c41-cd58c95dcb45\u0022\u003EIn 2001, the same year the terms of negotiation with the Crown was signed, the Environment Court approved a 35-year extension to the resource consent for the diversion of the Whanganui awa headwaters, which had happened 40 years earlier and was to be continued for another 35 years. It has been a continuous battle for our iwi, our people, to protect the river against all of the incursions against it. Through it, of course, our people have endured and so has the river\u2014not in the state that we want it, but it is still there, still thriving, and now under this settlement, hopefully, with a great deal more control for our people over our place. That is something. That really is something. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000358\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022fc8ab326-1806-41d3-8c41-cd58c95dcb45\u0022\u003ESo I just want to, before I finish\u2014I do not want to speak for too long\u2014acknowledge the importance of the legal status that is afforded the awa in this legislation. Yes, I agree that it is absolutely about time the law caught up with our tikanga. It has been our tikanga for ever that our environment is entitled to its own integrity, is entitled to be protected and restored from damage and injury for its own sake, and that our environment, however we want to describe it, is our ancestor and from where we come, and, therefore, we owe our environment everything\u2014our life, our existence, our future. The law slowly is starting to find ways\u2014clumsy and not perfect by any means, but it is slowly trying to find ways\u2014to understand that core concept. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000359\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022fc8ab326-1806-41d3-8c41-cd58c95dcb45\u0022\u003EI guess that for those P\u0101keh\u0101 who might find it difficult to understand how we could give legal status to an ecology, to an environment, I ask them to just consider why it is that we have in our law the right for corporations to have legal status as a person. We actually do have, in P\u0101keh\u0101 law, something quite similar. A corporation is not a thing. It does not have a separate identity, but it does actually have legal rights like a legal person. A corporation has rights under the New Zealand Bill of Rights Act, for goodness\u2019 sake. It is just a construction in our own minds about how the law responds to an entity. It is so much more important\u2014so much more important\u2014that we give status for its own sake to the very thing that gives us life, and in Whanganui that is our river. It is a small step forward but a step none the less. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000360\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022fc8ab326-1806-41d3-8c41-cd58c95dcb45\u0022\u003EFinally, I want to pay tribute to the negotiators, the petitioners, the claimants, and the kaitiaki of the awa over so many so generations\u2014to all of those who have contributed to getting us to this place in the journey, and I wish us all the very best for the future of this settlement and for our awa. Kia ora koutou katoa.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022cba965bb-864f-4e06-99dc-6fcdfd007ad5\u0022 data-id=\u00220c0977a45b6149ee9ef0f6c2479d4494\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000361\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cba965bb-864f-4e06-99dc-6fcdfd007ad5\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00220c0977a45b6149ee9ef0f6c2479d4494\u0022\u003EPITA PARAONE (NZ First):\u003C/span\u003E T\u0113n\u0101 koe, Mr Assistant Speaker, t\u0113n\u0101 an\u014D hoki t\u0101tou. Ka nui ng\u0101 mihi ki a koutou e noho nei ki te tautoko mai i te kaupapa nei. E m\u014Dhio ana au, mai i t\u0113r\u0101 rau tau tae noa ki te w\u0101 nei, ko t\u0113nei tetahi o ng\u0101 taumahatanga e noho ana kei runga i a koutou, he aha ai? I ng\u0101 mahi kikino a Te Karauna ki a koutou o Te Awa. N\u0101 reira, ng\u0101 mihi hoki ki a koutou i te r\u0101 nei. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000362\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cba965bb-864f-4e06-99dc-6fcdfd007ad5\u0022\u003E[Thank you, Mr Assistant Speaker, and to us all as well. Much appreciation to you seated here in support of this matter. I know that since the last century and right to the present time this has been a burden on you, and why? Because of the injustices inflicted upon you of the river by the Crown. So congratulations to you today.]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000363\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cba965bb-864f-4e06-99dc-6fcdfd007ad5\u0022\u003EWhen Te Awa Tupua (Whanganui River Claims Settlement) Bill first came on to the Order Paper I went home that night and I thought of two people in particular, and in so naming them I am not being disrespectful to those who have carried this kaupapa from last century through to the present time. One was Nik Tangaroa. I knew him in Auckland as an active member of the union, and he was a good fella to have on your side. The other one\u2014it was not until he was knighted that I came to know what his full name was\u2014I always knew as Archie Taiaroa. Archie and I worked for the Department of M\u0101ori Affairs in a time when we actually looked after our people in a way that we do not necessarily see today. But that is another issue. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000364\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cba965bb-864f-4e06-99dc-6fcdfd007ad5\u0022\u003EKa nui taku mihi ki a r\u0101ua, ahakoa k\u0101re r\u0101ua i noho \u0101-tinana i waenganui i a t\u0101tou i te r\u0101 nei \u0113ngari, kei te maumahara i a r\u0101tou. N\u0101 reira, moe mai k\u014Drua e Nik, e Archie, me r\u0101tou m\u0101, e noho nei i te k\u0101punipuni o ng\u0101 wairua. N\u0101 reira, kua ea te w\u0101hi m\u0101 koutou, ka hoki mai ki a t\u0101tou te hunga ora, t\u0113n\u0101 koutou, t\u0113n\u0101 koutou, t\u0113n\u0101 koutou. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000365\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cba965bb-864f-4e06-99dc-6fcdfd007ad5\u0022\u003E[I have a huge appreciation for those two. Even though both are not here physically amongst us today, I reminisce about them. So sleep there, Nik and Archie, in the place where spirits inevitably end up. And so the part for them has been satisfied. I come back to us, the living: greetings, acknowledgments, and well done to you collectively.]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000366\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cba965bb-864f-4e06-99dc-6fcdfd007ad5\u0022\u003EListening to the previous speaker, Metiria Turei, I think she made some telling points when we talk about the river as a living being. She made mention of legislation or the law actually catching up with tikanga. When she said that, I thought of the fisheries settlement\u2014particularly that part surrounding the Kermadecs. It passed through this House. Everyone was happy because the protection of our fishing rights was ensconced in legislation, and then, over recent weeks, things about the legislation seem to have been forgotten. So although I and New Zealand First support this legislation, I think it is incumbent on all of us, those of us who sit in this House, and those of you who have come, sitting in the gallery, to ensure that we never ever see the river lost to us again. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000367\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cba965bb-864f-4e06-99dc-6fcdfd007ad5\u0022\u003EThis settlement is a little bit different from other settlements because it comprises two deeds. The first deed is to establish the river as a separate legal entity. It provides for two river guardians, the development of a strategy for river well-being, the vesting of the Crown-owned parts of the bed in Te Awa Tupua, and the establishment of funds to support the activities of these entities. In the second deed, where the historic account is agreed to, the Crown makes acknowledgments and apologises. There is cultural and financial redress for the Whanganui iwi. So in all there is the settlement redress of $81 million, the funding for Te Korotete of $30 million for the health and well-being of Te Awa Tupua, for Te Pou Tupua $200,000 per annum for the next 20 years\u2014and I would recommend that they capitalise on that fund and take the $4 million now rather than wait every year for the next 20 years\u2014and for Te Heke Ngahuru, $430,000 for administration costs. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000368\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cba965bb-864f-4e06-99dc-6fcdfd007ad5\u0022\u003EThe good thing about this\u2014and I think she was acknowledged\u2014is that the Mayor of Whanganui is in attendance. Given the history between the council and local iwi over recent years, I think it augurs well to know that we have the support of the local body in terms of the future of the river. I just want to acknowledge that and have that placed on the record of Hansard. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000369\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cba965bb-864f-4e06-99dc-6fcdfd007ad5\u0022\u003EWhen I think about the Whanganui River I recall first hearing the saying \u201CThe river is me and I am the river\u201D. I thought that we in Ng\u0101ti Hine were the only iwi who subscribed to that notion when we talked about our traditional river, Taum\u0101rere-herehere-i-te-riri. I think it was Mr Davis who talked about swimming in the local river and learning more about one another\u2014oh, I think it was the member for the M\u0101ori Party. Having been brought up in a place called M\u014Dtatau, I can remember doing the same thing, and when she said about knowing about others, I thought: \u201CHey, they must have been just like us. We go for a swim, no clothes, and we know what everybody is about.\u201D And those are some of the histories surrounding our rivers\u2014learning about one another in more ways than one, I might add, but also realising how important the river has been to our t\u016Bpuna. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000370\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cba965bb-864f-4e06-99dc-6fcdfd007ad5\u0022\u003EAs a young person going to Bay of Islands College and learning about M\u0101ori history, I can recall seeing photos of t\u0101ua holding tuna, and the caption saying that these were on the Whanganui River. Again, I liken the Whanganui River to our traditional river of the hau k\u0101inga, of Taum\u0101rere-herehere-i-te-riri. I welcome this opportunity of contributing to this debate but also having this bill referred to the M\u0101ori Affairs Committee, because it will give people the opportunity to express their view as to whether they support or oppose the bill. If they do, then it gives them the opportunity to articulate as to why. Having said that, I commend the bill to the House. Kia ora.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002229c236aa-2283-4690-9a84-aa865404bb61\u0022 data-id=\u0022931e27eed68b4201a1e89de9eaf724d7\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000371\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002229c236aa-2283-4690-9a84-aa865404bb61\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022931e27eed68b4201a1e89de9eaf724d7\u0022\u003ENUK KORAKO (National):\u003C/span\u003E T\u0113n\u0101 koe e Te M\u0101ngai o Te Whare, huri noa i Te Whare nei, e mihi atu ki a koutou katoa. Ki te iwi o Ng\u0101ti Hau, e mihi nei, e tangi nei, koutou ng\u0101 taoka whakahirahira, koutou e tumanakohia ake nei, koutou e h\u0101pai iwi nei, n\u014D reira, ko ng\u0101 iwi o Ng\u0101ti Hau, Ng\u0101tikotahitaka, nau mai, nau mai, haere mai ki Te Whare P\u0101remata. N\u014D reira, e mihi atu ki a koutou katoa. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000372\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002229c236aa-2283-4690-9a84-aa865404bb61\u0022\u003E[Thank you, Mr Assistant Speaker, and acknowledgments to you all throughout this House. To the tribe of Ng\u0101ti Hau, I greet and mourn you. You are treasures of significance, have aspirations, and support tribes, therefore to you, the tribes of Ng\u0101ti Hau and Ng\u0101tikotahitaka, welcome, draw hither, and welcome to the House of Representatives. I acknowledge you all.]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000373\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002229c236aa-2283-4690-9a84-aa865404bb61\u0022\u003ETo all of you, I know the feeling of coming here, as a son of K\u0101i Tahu, and to actually be listening to the first reading of your bill. But the really significant thing about this particular one reminds me of when K\u0101i Tahu were actually doing not the same thing but a little bit of the same process around Aoraki Mauka. So what I see here today is the fact that just like us, it was not about us; it was actually about all of New Zealand. I acknowledge you, here, for that. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000374\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002229c236aa-2283-4690-9a84-aa865404bb61\u0022\u003EWe have heard so much so far around the bill itself. I would like to concentrate on just one part of it that actually reflects the uniqueness of this actual settlement. The uniqueness of this settlement is in the legal framework for the river, because this is what makes this particular settlement groundbreaking. This recognises Te Awa Tupua, comprising the entire Whanganui River, its tributaries as well, and all its physical and metaphysical elements, as a legal person\u2014as a legal person\u2014and with all of the corresponding rights, duties, and liabilities. The establishment of the river as a legal entity, then it provides the framework for the recognition of the unbreakable connection between the Whanganui iwi and Te Awa Tupua. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000375\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002229c236aa-2283-4690-9a84-aa865404bb61\u0022\u003EThe other part of this is to provide human representation for Te Awa Tupua and the position of Te Pou Tupua, which will be established and filled by two people nominated by the Whanganui iwi and also the Crown, which is a really important part of this kotahitaka within this settlement. The Crown-owned bed, of course\u2014the Whanganui River\u2014will be vested in Te Awa Tupua, and a $30 million contested fund will be established to support the health and well-being of Te Awa Tupua. This new legal framework is an innovative use of the Western judicial system to manage the river in a way that is distinctly M\u0101ori. That is one of the most unique things of any settlement that has ever come before this House. This settlement allows the Whanganui iwi to take back their responsibility for the river, which should never have left them following the Treaty of Waitangi. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000376\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002229c236aa-2283-4690-9a84-aa865404bb61\u0022\u003EI also want to acknowledge the members of Whanganui iwi who have worked on this settlement but also all of those who have gone before, as we have just heard, and we acknowledge them. As before, for over a century, the people here are uri of those who protected and preserved the river itself and the iwi interest in it. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000377\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002229c236aa-2283-4690-9a84-aa865404bb61\u0022\u003EI want to acknowledge, also, one particular person\u2014we have done a lot of acknowledgments here today and, sure, we have to and we must do. I want to acknowledge the Hon Christopher Finlayson, whose personal involvement in this particular settlement reflects the importance of it. That is not to take away the importance of any other settlement, but particularly this settlement, because this is groundbreaking legislation, is an achievement that I think speaks volumes about the value of having such a distinguished and respected legal mind as our Minister for Treaty of Waitangi Negotiations. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000378\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002229c236aa-2283-4690-9a84-aa865404bb61\u0022\u003ETo everyone here, your time has come. This is the final beginning of your long journey, and on that note, as the chair of the M\u0101ori Affairs Committee, we indeed look forward to this bill coming to the select committee so that we may continue its journey, or shepherd its journey, through to the third reading and the finality of the journey itself, which will happen here and it will be enacted in law. So kia ora to you all, Ng\u0101ti Hau. Ka nunui te mihi, ka nunui te aroha, e mihi, e mihi ai atu ki a koutou katoa. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000379\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002229c236aa-2283-4690-9a84-aa865404bb61\u0022\u003E[The appreciation and empathy is massive; well done and congratulations.]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000380\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002229c236aa-2283-4690-9a84-aa865404bb61\u0022\u003EI commend this bill to the House. Kia ora.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00220e7e8da2-a6a1-41bb-aeb0-a49be255a293\u0022 data-id=\u002248ae5000cf0f413d94dc2ad0a02e903a\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000381\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220e7e8da2-a6a1-41bb-aeb0-a49be255a293\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002248ae5000cf0f413d94dc2ad0a02e903a\u0022\u003EHon NANAIA MAHUTA (Labour\u2014Hauraki-Waikato):\u003C/span\u003E T\u0113n\u0101 t\u0101tou katoa. T\u0113nei e t\u0101piri atu ng\u0101 mihi ki ng\u0101 puna, ng\u0101 m\u0101t\u0101puna, ng\u0101 wai marino, ng\u0101 wai rere, ng\u0101 ripo, ng\u0101 \u016B kaha o Te Awa o Whanganui, t\u0113nei te mihi atu ki a koutou katoa.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000382\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220e7e8da2-a6a1-41bb-aeb0-a49be255a293\u0022\u003ET\u0113nei e t\u0101piri atu taku mihi ki a r\u0101tou i whakahuatia maitia nei i roto i Te Whare, r\u0101tou kei te w\u0101hi ngaro. E kore e mutu ng\u0101 whakaaro ki a r\u0101tou e kawea nei t\u0113nei kaupapa, tae noa ki t\u0113nei w\u0101, kei konei r\u0101tou katoa. Ka nui te mihi atu, heke iho mai ki a koutou ng\u0101 mahuetanga iho, nei te mihi aroha, nei te mihi maioha ki a koutou katoa, t\u0113n\u0101 koutou.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000383\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220e7e8da2-a6a1-41bb-aeb0-a49be255a293\u0022\u003EMe te hoki mahara ki ng\u0101 k\u014Drero i waihotia i te w\u0101 i haere m\u0101tou ki runga i Te Awa o Whanganui ki te taha o t\u014D t\u0101tau nei \u0100riki, t\u0113r\u0101 k\u014Drero i whakat\u014D mai i roto i te whakatumanawa kia tuitui ki te tino taonga i waenganui i \u0101 koutou pononga ki Te Awa o Whanganui. E rua ng\u0101 roimata i heke mai n\u0101 Rangi Nui i runga i Te Maunga o Ruapehu, in\u0101, ko Te Awa o Whanganui, ko Te Awa o Waikato, mai i Te K\u0101huinga Maunga ki Tangaroa, t\u0113nei te nui o te mihi maioha ki a koutou katoa, t\u0113n\u0101 koutou!\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000384\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220e7e8da2-a6a1-41bb-aeb0-a49be255a293\u0022\u003E[Salutations to us all. I add my acknowledgments to the pools, sources, calm waters, waterfalls, eddies, and strong currents of the Whanganui River; I acknowledge you all.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000385\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220e7e8da2-a6a1-41bb-aeb0-a49be255a293\u0022\u003EI add my tribute to those who were mentioned in the House, to those at the unseen place. Thoughts about those who carried this matter right up to this moment will never cease; they are all here. Much appreciation to them, right down to you, the ones left behind; a loving and affectionate regard to you all.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000386\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220e7e8da2-a6a1-41bb-aeb0-a49be255a293\u0022\u003EI reflect also on the stories that were left behind when we went on the Whanganui River with our paramount leader, yours and ours, that legendary account that welled up from within you and was woven into the priceless heirloom, the core of your collective belief about the Whanganui River. There were two tears that came down from the Great Sky above that fell upon Mount Ruapehu and flowed down to Tangaroa, the sea, from the mountain cluster: one was the Whanganui River and the other was the Waikato River. I acknowledge you greatly, well done!]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000387\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220e7e8da2-a6a1-41bb-aeb0-a49be255a293\u0022\u003EIn standing to support the contribution of my colleague Adrian Rurawhe on this particular bill, I had prepared a certain speech to read today, then I heard the Minister for Treaty of Waitangi Negotiations speak and recollect a number of important people, and then I heard Adrian speak and recollect a number of people. I have to say that during my brief opportunity\u2014actually, privilege\u2014to journey down the Whanganui River, one person came to mind very specifically, and that was Piripi.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000388\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00228b16d8290dd64f09a3812e7d06971aa6\u0022\u003EHon Members\u003C/span\u003E: Ha, ha!\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000389\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220e7e8da2-a6a1-41bb-aeb0-a49be255a293\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002224267dadbbad47d285d204a96b3916da\u0022\u003EHon NANAIA MAHUTA\u003C/span\u003E: Ha, ha! But let me come back to Piripi. Let me come back to Piripi. I had the good fortune to be able to be one of a small group of people who travelled in support of a tono from Matiu M\u0101reikura to Taiaroa, and John Tahup\u0101rae to Te Arikinui, to travel down the Whanganui River. We started in Taumarunui and went all the way down. Actually, before we even got there we talked about how they were going to take us down on k\u014Dpapa, and, you know, we had better get all fit and all of this. Actually, we got there and we went down on speedboats. There was so much more to that journey than physically being on the river and travelling down it. It was all the k\u014Drero and all the things that we witnessed along the way. Actually, Morgan was with us as well\u2014Morgan K\u0101wana. We knew that every day he did a flip of that good book, something special was happening. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000390\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220e7e8da2-a6a1-41bb-aeb0-a49be255a293\u0022\u003EIt was in that recollection that I want to, perhaps, share\u2014there has been some talk in the House today about the metaphysical identity and tikanga merging with law and things like that. Actually, to know one\u2019s awa, like you can smell its different fragrances; to know one\u2019s awa when you can witness a change, albeit so subtle; to know one\u2019s awa to the point where you understand something else is happening in our world, but it has been read through the awa\u2014that is what we were able to experience in coming down the Whanganui River. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000391\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220e7e8da2-a6a1-41bb-aeb0-a49be255a293\u0022\u003EI think it is a great day today because it has been a long journey for the people of Whanganui to get to this point. It is not without context if we think about the Waitangi Tribunal and the opportunity that has been offered to people to look to redress historical claims, and just the journey of our rivers. Waikato lodged their claim to the tribunal in 1987, Whanganui lodged their claim in 1990, T\u016Bwharetoa got the Crown to vest the lake to T\u016Bwharetoa in 1992, and then we had a claims process. It is all interconnected. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000392\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220e7e8da2-a6a1-41bb-aeb0-a49be255a293\u0022\u003EIt is the journey of our waters, I think, that leads us to some very important conversations today. For me, this is quite historic today, because it is happening within the context of very important conversations that this nation is having around the health and well-being of our waterways and the issues of fresh water. I want to acknowledge that because when we talk about the role that Parliament plays, yes, to give effect to the intent of the deed of settlement for the Whanganui River, it is within a context and some broader conversations. I think the M\u0101ori Affairs Committee is quite cognisant of that. We will use the opportunity of the submission process to ask questions within context\u2014for example, the resource management legislation going through that is talking about collaborative planning, that is proposing models for collaborative planning, and that does not address issues of fresh water but that impacts potentially on any river settlement that has already been reached. We will ask the types of questions about what is the anticipated connection between what you are seeking to achieve for the awa of Whanganui and what is being proposed. That is to ensure that the intent and the integrity of your settlement can be preserved. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000393\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220e7e8da2-a6a1-41bb-aeb0-a49be255a293\u0022\u003EMany people before us have always said that Governments come and go, but, funnily enough, the institutional memory of the iwi stays very determined over a long period of time, and it is a very long institutional memory that keeps any Government accountable. We are mindful of that, too. It is with that view in mind that I think we will be considering very carefully the submissions coming to the select committee. I am hopeful, actually, that we might have a sitting at Tieke. We would actually have to get on a waka and then get to Tieke, and then appreciate the fullness of the experience of what is being talked about\u2014he whakaaro noa iho [it is just a thought].\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000394\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220e7e8da2-a6a1-41bb-aeb0-a49be255a293\u0022\u003EComing back to Piripi now, on another occasion, after the opportunity with Te Arikinui, I did have the opportunity to join a few tira hoe. My very first tira hoe that I joined, little did I know\u2014after karakia I was assigned my crew mate. It was Piripi. Then one of the whanaunga said to me \u201CDon\u2019t worry, Piripi is the best in the river. You\u2019ll never fall out.\u201D, because I was kind of in a bit of trepidation. Well, I can guarantee you, every ripo, every curve of that river we fell in. I think I may as well have just swum the Whanganui River. But my gratitude goes to Piripi, because in the great joy of experiencing, you know, t\u0113r\u0101 \u0101hua, te ruruki, te wai o ng\u0101 m\u0101tua t\u016Bpuna, t\u0113r\u0101 \u0101hua [that aspect of waters to ancestral forefathers, it was nourishing]. It was nourishing. The fact that we could laugh about it all the way down\u2014and I remained his crew member\u2014was, I think, a testament in itself. But all the people who have gone who lived the river, who enjoyed sharing the river with the next generation, who told stories from their own place of reference, I think are a richness that this settlement will never convey, but we know it is there. I have certainly witnessed that and I want to acknowledge it. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000395\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220e7e8da2-a6a1-41bb-aeb0-a49be255a293\u0022\u003EThe other thing\u2014eating piharau. Was that legal then? We ate piharau. I had never tasted piharau before, and I am from people where we have lots of eels, but I have never tasted such a beautiful delicacy ever in my life. That taste has remained with me, right to this day. Every time I hear that word \u201Cpiharau\u201D, oh boy, everything starts coming back. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000396\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220e7e8da2-a6a1-41bb-aeb0-a49be255a293\u0022\u003EThe other thing\u2014when you are going along the river and you see how the canoes got through and you see the dents in the sides of the river, you know, those are stories that cannot be captured in settlement legislation, but they tell us that long before the British came to New Zealand there was a history well before their time that was long established. I hope that the settlement, in some small way, will contribute to what you have always lived, always believed. You have not lost anything; the legislation just had an impact on you. Even going to a marae where they talked about the health legislation during M\u0101ui P\u014Dmare\u2019s time, the Maori Councils Act, \u201CPire Kiore\u201D, I think they called it, and learning that history, how relevant it was in the physical presence along the river and how you told the story of its context and impact on yourselves\u2014those are the treasures that have stayed with me for life. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000397\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220e7e8da2-a6a1-41bb-aeb0-a49be255a293\u0022\u003EThose are the treasures that I think about when, within the context of today\u2019s world, we talk about Archie, Matiu M\u0101reikura, and John Tahup\u0101rae and their thinking\u2014Ao M\u0101ori thinking, wairua M\u0101ori thinking\u2014and how it impacts on what we are trying to achieve today. Archie\u2014Sir Archie Taiaroa\u2014led the freshwater issues after the settlement and helped implement the fisheries claim. It is within that context\u2014although we are mentioning their names here within the settlement today, they have had such a broad impact on the way that New Zealand has evolved its understanding to be a lot more complementary and coexisting with our M\u0101ori world, and that is to create a better New Zealand. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000398\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220e7e8da2-a6a1-41bb-aeb0-a49be255a293\u0022\u003EWith that, I am not going to take up too much time. Can I just leave you with one lasting memory that I will never ever forget. I think I was in my early teens then, coming down the river, but I was always inspired by Nanny Nui, Te Manawanui Pauro. At her age\u2014and I think she was well over 80 at that time; could have been 90\u2014she was still paddling down the Whanganui River. Her love for the river gave her a level of, I think, kind of like a supernatural effervescence about her. Never did she waver, never did she tire. That is the type of sustenance that the next generation can draw on as those types of exemplars, all of them. N\u014D reira, ki a koutou katoa, t\u0113n\u0101 koutou.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022ec266512-9fe8-47da-883e-48f046ee5059\u0022 data-id=\u0022d6a13984b22e4970ac666150545c4c14\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000399\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ec266512-9fe8-47da-883e-48f046ee5059\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022d6a13984b22e4970ac666150545c4c14\u0022\u003EHon TE URUROA FLAVELL (Co-Leader\u2014M\u0101ori Party):\u003C/span\u003E T\u0113n\u0101 koe, Mr Assistant Speaker, kia ora t\u0101tau katoa, haere mai ki roto i Te Whare P\u0101remata. \u0112, Kahurangi Tariana, hoki mai ki te w\u0101hi i nohoia e koe i ng\u0101 tau kua hipa ake. He oranga ng\u0101kau kua eke ki t\u0113nei taumata. Ko koe te mea k\u014Drero nei m\u014D te \u0101huatanga o t\u0113nei o ng\u0101 ker\u0113me i ng\u0101 tau \u0113 hia k\u0113 nei. Ka mihi ki a koe, haere mai, haramai me t\u014D tira, haramai me t\u014D iwi Te \u0100ti Haunui-a-P\u0101p\u0101rangi, Ng\u0101ti Apa, t\u0113n\u0101 koutou, kia ora t\u0101tau. Kai taku Ariki e Tumu, t\u0113n\u0101 koe, haramai m\u014D te \u0101huatanga ki a t\u0101ua ki a Te Arawa \u0113ngari, ka rere mai t\u0113nei o ng\u0101 awa i a koe, \u0101, i Ruapehu, \u0101, ka eke ki te takutai moana. Ko koe t\u0113nei e whakakanohi nei i t\u0113r\u0101 taha o t\u0101ua, n\u014D reira t\u0113n\u0101 koe, t\u0113n\u0101 koutou, kia ora t\u0101tau.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000400\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ec266512-9fe8-47da-883e-48f046ee5059\u0022\u003EK\u0101re e kore kua rongo koutou i te k\u014Drero o taku tuahine a Marama. N\u0101na an\u014D r\u0101 i whakar\u0101rangi mai i ng\u0101 k\u014Drero. Kaua e riri mai, k\u0101re au i konei i t\u0113r\u0101 w\u0101, e hia k\u0113 nei ng\u0101 M\u0101ori kai roto i Te Whare P\u0101remata i t\u0113nei r\u0101. Kua tae mai ki te whakarongo ki ng\u0101 k\u014Drero e p\u0101 ana ki w\u0101 r\u0101tau ker\u0113me. N\u014D reira, w\u0101 poto ki a au. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000401\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ec266512-9fe8-47da-883e-48f046ee5059\u0022\u003EE rua ng\u0101 w\u0101hanga tuatahi kia k\u014Drerohia m\u014D t\u0113nei kaupapa i t\u014Dna orokohanga mai, ka mutu, p\u0113nei i t\u0101 taku tuahine e k\u014Drero n\u0101 ko te h\u014Dhonu o t\u0113nei mea o te wai ki a t\u0101ua. I taku m\u014Dhio, \u0101, ko Tariana t\u0113tahi i k\u014Drero m\u014D t\u0113nei ker\u0113me. \u0112 hia k\u0113 nei ng\u0101 tau e tatari nei, e tatari nei, \u0101, tae r\u0101 an\u014D ki t\u0113nei w\u0101, a W\u2019anganui e tatari nei kia rongo i \u0113nei k\u014Drero. Ka mihi r\u0101 ki a Te Piki K\u014Dtuku, ki taku m\u014Dhio, ko ia t\u0113r\u0101 i whakatakoto i t\u0113tahi petihana i te tau 1927. N\u0101wai, n\u0101wai, ka eke ki a Hekenui Whakarake me \u0113tahi atu, i k\u014Dkiri nei i t\u0113nei take i roto i ng\u0101 tau 30 pea. \u0100, n\u0101wai, n\u0101wai, ka eke ki te Wai e 167 i te tau 1990. Ko ng\u0101 mea p\u0113nei i a Hikaia Amohia, Joan Akapita, Rangip\u014D Metek\u012Bngi, tae atu ki a Michael P\u014Dtaka, tae atu ki t\u0113nei o ng\u0101 tipua ki a Te Atawhai, ko r\u0101tau kua ngaro atu i t\u0113nei w\u0101, tae r\u0101 an\u014D ki te hoa rangatira a Te \u0100tawhai, ki a Martha, ka tangi ake! \u0112ngari an\u014D a R\u016Bm\u0101tiki Linda Henry, a Kevin Amohia, a Julie Ranginui, e kui, m\u0113n\u0101 kai konei koe? An\u014D hoki a Te Tiwha Puketapu, a John Maihi kei konei koe, haere mai! Ko koutou t\u0113r\u0101 i k\u014Dkiri tonu nei i t\u0113nei take kia eke ki t\u0113nei w\u0101. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000402\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ec266512-9fe8-47da-883e-48f046ee5059\u0022\u003EKo Te \u0100tawhai, p\u0113nei i t\u0101 taku tuahine e k\u014Drero nei, koin\u0101 te tangata whakatau i te wairua o te tangata kia taea ai te k\u014Dkiri i t\u0113nei take ki roto i Te Whare P\u0101remata. Ki a Titi Tihu, te rangatira n\u0101na an\u014D r\u0101 t\u0113nei k\u0113hi i whakaara ake i t\u0113nei kaupapa m\u014D te hunga e k\u014Drerohia ake nei. N\u014D reira, ka tangi ake ki te hunga kua ngaro, ki a Tahup\u0101rae, ki a Piripi, taihoa a Piripi, ki a Niko, \u0113r\u0101, ko r\u0101tau katoa kua ngaro atu. Waiho r\u0101tau kia okioki, anei t\u0101tau e hui nei i t\u0113nei r\u0101, t\u0113n\u0101 koutou katoa.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000403\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ec266512-9fe8-47da-883e-48f046ee5059\u0022\u003E\u0100 t\u0113n\u0101, i puta te k\u014Drero i taku tuahine ko te h\u014Dhonutanga o t\u0113nei mea o te wai ki te tangata. I a t\u0101tau e k\u014Drero nei m\u014D Te Piripi nei, tangata nui nei, nui \u0101-ng\u0101kau, nui \u0101-tinana, ka mutu, koir\u0101 t\u0101na mahi. Ka hoki ng\u0101 mahara ki t\u0113tahi hui i ng\u0101 tau kua hipa ake. N\u0101ku tonu \u0113tahi o ng\u0101 tamariki o te kura rongonui o T\u012Bpene, St Stephen\u2019s College, \u0101e; i haere atu ki te marae o Ken Mair. \u0100, ko te k\u014Drero a Piripi, me eke ki runga i te waka kia puta ki te awa o W\u2019anganui. K\u0101re au i rite ki a koe e te tuahine, k\u0101re au i haere i te taha o Piripi, k\u0101o! He mataku n\u014Dku. I haere au ki t\u0113tahi atu o ng\u0101 waka \u0113ngari an\u014D t\u0113r\u0101 i taka, i heke ki te wai. Hoi an\u014D t\u0113r\u0101, t\u0113r\u0101! Ka hoki ng\u0101 mahara ki a ia, \u0101, ko ia t\u0113r\u0101 i t\u016B ki mua i te aroaro o te taraka, \u0101, te taraka i muri i a ia, k\u0101o, k\u0101o, k\u0101o! Ko Piripi t\u0113r\u0101!\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000404\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ec266512-9fe8-47da-883e-48f046ee5059\u0022\u003EOtir\u0101, ko te rally i W\u2019anganui, \u0101, p\u0113r\u0101 an\u014D hoki ng\u0101 radicals me ng\u0101 activists o W\u2019anganui. \u0100, ko te jet boat race, ko aua take, \u0113r\u0101! Whakakorengia, n\u0101 runga i te aha? N\u0101 runga i te ng\u0101kaunui o te iwi nei ki t\u0113nei o ng\u0101 awa. Ka hoki r\u0101 an\u014D ki te \u0101huatanga o P\u0101kaitore. Te ata, te ata tonu o t\u0113r\u0101 o ng\u0101 kaupapa. Ko m\u0101ua ko Te Miringa Hoh\u0101ia i haere i Taranaki kia eke atu ki te marae i W\u2019anganui. He aha te mahi? I noho i te p\u014D, ko t\u0101 Tahup\u0101rae, kaihau, kaihau! Ar\u0101, he aha te tikanga o t\u0113r\u0101? Kaua e kai. I te ata tonu, i te ata h\u0101para i eke atu r\u0101 ki te awa, ki reira, \u0101, i tuku i te karakia. Ko Niko t\u0113r\u0101 i tuku i te karakia. Ka r\u012Bngiringihia m\u0101tau e te wai, kia tau te wairua i mua o te ekenga ki P\u0101kaitore, ka hoki ng\u0101 mahara.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000405\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ec266512-9fe8-47da-883e-48f046ee5059\u0022\u003EN\u014D reira koinei te h\u014Dhonutanga o t\u0113nei mea o te awa ki te tangata p\u0113nei i taku tuahine e k\u014Drero nei. E kore au e whakat\u014Droa i \u0113nei k\u014Drero. He t\u012Bmatanga noa iho. Hoki mai m\u014D te mea tuatoru, hoki mai m\u014D te mea tuatoru ki reira t\u0101tau whakanui ai i t\u0113nei kaupapa. Kai te k\u012B mai te tangata nei me whakar\u0101popoto i taku k\u014Drero. N\u014D reira me \u0101mene atu ki a ia, t\u0113n\u0101 koutou, t\u0113n\u0101 koutou, kia ora t\u0101tau katoa, kai raro.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000406\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ec266512-9fe8-47da-883e-48f046ee5059\u0022\u003E[Thank you, Mr Assistant Speaker, and hello there, everyone, welcome into Parliament! Dame Tariana, welcome back to the place you occupied some years ago. How reassuring it is to have reached this level. You were the one who commented on the circumstances about this claim for several years now. I acknowledge you, welcome, draw hither with your people, Te \u0100ti Haunui-a-P\u0101p\u0101rangi and Ng\u0101ti Apa, greetings to you collectively and to us all. Welcome to you, my paramount chief, Tumu, in regard to the circumstances that relate to you and me in terms of Te Arawa, but one of these rivers flows to you by way of Ruapehu, and eventually reaches the foreshore. This is you, the face on that side in regard to you, and so salutations to you, to you collectively, and to us all.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000407\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ec266512-9fe8-47da-883e-48f046ee5059\u0022\u003EWithout a doubt you have heard the address of my sister colleague Marama Fox. She outlined the tenor of the contributions. Do not be offended I was not here at that time. There are so many M\u0101ori in Parliament today. They have arrived to listen to the contributions about your claims. Therefore, the time for me is short. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000408\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ec266512-9fe8-47da-883e-48f046ee5059\u0022\u003EThere are two primary parts I want to comment on, the origin of this bill furthermore and, as my sister colleague alluded to, the depth of our understanding about this thing, water, to you and me. I understand that Tariana was one who spoke on this claim. The Whanganui people have been waiting to hear these speeches for a very long time. I am full of admiration for Te Piki K\u014Dtuku; in my understanding, Te Piki was the one who submitted a petition in 1927. Eventually Hekenui Whakarake and others advanced this matter over approximately 30 years. After a time the Wai 167 claim was filed in 1990 by Hikaia Amohia, Joan Akapita, Rangipo Metek\u012Bngi, Michael P\u014Dtaka, and the legendary Sir Archie Te Atawhai Taiaroa. They, along with Martha, wife of Sir Archie, have all passed away. I grieve for them. As for R\u016Bmatiki Linda Henry, Kevin Amohia, Julie Ranginui\u2014old lady, are you here? And also Te Tiwha Puketapu and John Maihi\u2014are you here? Welcome! You were the ones who advanced this claim until it eventually arrived at this point in time. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000409\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ec266512-9fe8-47da-883e-48f046ee5059\u0022\u003ETe Atawhai, like my sister colleague said, was the one who was capable of putting a person at ease to advance this matter into Parliament. Now to Titi Tihu, the chief who was responsible for raising this case, this matter, on behalf of the people I mentioned previously. And so I grieve for those who have died, Tahup\u0101rae, Piripi\u2014more about him later\u2014and Niko. Those ones\u2014all of them have passed away. Allow them to rest, as we the living gather here today. Leave them to rest there as we are gathered here today; greetings to you all, and much appreciated.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000410\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ec266512-9fe8-47da-883e-48f046ee5059\u0022\u003EMy sister colleague made a statement about the deeper implication of water to mankind. While we were talking about this man Piripi\u2014he is a large man; big in heart, big physically, and furthermore, that is his job! I recall a meeting some years back. I took some younger students from that famous T\u012Bpene school\u2014St Stephen\u2019s College, yes; we went to Ken Mair\u2019s marae. And that Piripi urged us to climb aboard a canoe to get out to the Whanganui River. Unlike you, my sister colleague Nanaia, I did not go with Piripi\u2014not likely! I was too scared. I went to one of the other canoes and got on board. But it capsized, and I fell into the water. But that is that incident! Memories go back to others, like the time he stood in front of the truck with one behind him calling out, no, no, no! That was Piripi.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000411\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ec266512-9fe8-47da-883e-48f046ee5059\u0022\u003EAt the same time there was the rally in Whanganui, and similarly also with the radicals and activists of Whanganui and the jet boat race. Those were those matters! Why were they stopped? Because of their commitment to this river. It goes all the way back to the P\u0101kaitore situation. At the very dawn of the morning of that protest, Te Miringa Hoh\u0101ia and I travelled from Taranaki to go on to the marae at Whanganui. So what was to take place? We were going to sleep the night. Tahup\u0101rae exhorted: consume air, eat air. So what does that protocol mean? Don\u2019t eat! At the break of dawn we ascended the river to release prayer; Niko led that. Water was sprinkled over us to appease us and to settle us down before the ascension of P\u0101kaitore; memories go back to that event.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000412\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ec266512-9fe8-47da-883e-48f046ee5059\u0022\u003ETherefore, in regard to the depth of appreciation for the individual about this river thing, and like what my sister colleague alluded to, this is it. I will not prolong these sentiments. This is only a beginning. Come back for the third reading; come back for the third one, where we will celebrate this bill. I have been given the wind-down signal and agree to end my contribution. Therefore, acknowledgments and salutations to you collectively and my appreciation to us all. I resume my seat.]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022758dcaf3-9976-43ac-8593-79f66ee4da22\u0022 data-id=\u002266820c15e5c24ef4a75bce138b764dae\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000413\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022758dcaf3-9976-43ac-8593-79f66ee4da22\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002266820c15e5c24ef4a75bce138b764dae\u0022\u003EJOANNE HAYES (National):\u003C/span\u003E Mai i te k\u0101hui maunga ki Tangaroa, \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000414\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022758dcaf3-9976-43ac-8593-79f66ee4da22\u0022\u003EKa w\u2019akapiria mai ko ng\u0101 piringa,\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000415\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022758dcaf3-9976-43ac-8593-79f66ee4da22\u0022\u003EHineng\u0101kau, Tama\u016Bpoko, T\u016Bpoho, P\u014Dtiki e,\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000416\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022758dcaf3-9976-43ac-8593-79f66ee4da22\u0022\u003EKo au te awa, te awa ko au.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000417\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022758dcaf3-9976-43ac-8593-79f66ee4da22\u0022\u003E[From the mountain cluster to the sea,\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000418\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022758dcaf3-9976-43ac-8593-79f66ee4da22\u0022\u003EThe connections are added, \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000419\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022758dcaf3-9976-43ac-8593-79f66ee4da22\u0022\u003EHineng\u0101kau, Tama\u016Bpoko, T\u016Bpoho and P\u014Dtiki,\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000420\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022758dcaf3-9976-43ac-8593-79f66ee4da22\u0022\u003EI am the river, the river is me.]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000421\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022758dcaf3-9976-43ac-8593-79f66ee4da22\u0022\u003ENg\u0101 uri o Te Awa o Whanganui, e rau rangatira m\u0101, t\u0113nei te mihi, t\u0113nei te mihi, t\u0113nei te mihi atu ki a koutou katoa, nau mai!\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000422\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022758dcaf3-9976-43ac-8593-79f66ee4da22\u0022\u003E[To the descendants of the Whanganui River, esteemed ones of a hundredfold, I acknowledge, greet and, commend you all, welcome!]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000423\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022758dcaf3-9976-43ac-8593-79f66ee4da22\u0022\u003EBefore I start my contribution, I want to just put in an apology from the Hon Chester Borrows. He was unable to be here today. He really wanted to be here, but he is hosting some manuhiri back in Whanganui. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000424\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022758dcaf3-9976-43ac-8593-79f66ee4da22\u0022\u003EI want to first of all acknowledge the knights and the dames amongst you: T\u0101 Tumu te Heuheu Dame Tariana Turia\u2014you are the great Dame Tariana Turia. You always kept us on our toes as the coalition partner, and you still keep us on our toes today. I also want to acknowledge the Mayor of Whanganui, Annette Main\u2014and yes, I tautoko what the Minister said about you being the mayor here today; kia ora\u2014as well as your deputy sitting here over in the corner. I want to acknowledge the kaiwhakahaere for Whanganui, John Maihi. John and I go back a wee way, from when I worked for Taumata Hauora Trust and Ng\u0101 Tai o Te Awa. He was always the one in my ear, telling me what I could and could not do.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000425\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00228a1cb04e-8a86-44d1-9004-6e158e220339\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022ce9f9d00edad43b385400c52e93a1cf8\u0022\u003ETim Macindoe\u003C/span\u003E: Now it\u2019s me.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000426\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022758dcaf3-9976-43ac-8593-79f66ee4da22\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022bfe53abda5c44d589b0360031420ac66\u0022\u003EJOANNE HAYES\u003C/span\u003E: And now it is this guy here. I acknowledge that it has been a long journey for the iwi of the Whanganui awa. It has been a very long journey, from the 1800s right through to today, from the original claimants of the Whanganui awa to the seven new trustees of Ng\u0101 T\u0101ngata Tiaki o Whanganui. Believe you me, I knew a lot about Ng\u0101 T\u0101ngata Tiaki, because John would never let me forget it when I worked for him. So much has happened, so many things have happened\u2014let us say that a lot of water has run under the many bridges of Whanganui. Today is a historic day, and I am so proud to be part and parcel and give my voice to tautoko this settlement bill today.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000427\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022758dcaf3-9976-43ac-8593-79f66ee4da22\u0022\u003EI want to acknowledge T\u0101 Archie Taiaroa, and I acknowledge you, Lady Martha. I acknowledge you because your husband did an amazing job for the Whanganui River M\u0101ori Trust Board for all the iwi of Whanganui. Piripi\u2014yes, Piripi and I had a bit of a history there for a little while. He was fondly known amongst our team at Ng\u0101 Tai o Te Awa and Taumata as Pirip. He did some amazing things, like he had a contract with me that went only as far as Taumarunui, yet when I looked at his travel records, he would be in Bombay Hills or he would be all the way down south. I would say to him \u201CHow come you\u2019re all over there?\u201D, and he would go: \u201CIt\u2019s all part and parcel of the claim.\u201D I would say: \u201COK, righty-o.\u201D\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000428\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022758dcaf3-9976-43ac-8593-79f66ee4da22\u0022\u003EI want to acknowledge Matiu Mareikura. I never got to meet the man, but I heard all about him. I want to acknowledge John Mateparae because\u2014and I did meet him and we did have some encounters a few times\u2014he was an amazing person. Auntie Dardi, Julie Ranginui\u2014they are some of the many people who have helped to bring this claim to the House today.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000429\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022758dcaf3-9976-43ac-8593-79f66ee4da22\u0022\u003ESoon you will receive an investment, an investment that will be invested two ways, Ruruku Whakatupua Te Mana o Te Awa Tupua and Ruruku Whakatupua Te Mana o Te Iwi o Whanganui. It is amazing\u2014over $80 million. Wow! As I said before, I stand humbled to be able to contribute my voice to this claim, to my wh\u0101nau\u2019s claim. I end with this: e rere Te Awa Tupua [flow on, the Whanganui River].\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000430\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022758dcaf3-9976-43ac-8593-79f66ee4da22\u0022\u003EI commend the bill to the House. Kia ora.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000431\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022758dcaf3-9976-43ac-8593-79f66ee4da22\u0022\u003EBill read a first time. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000432\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022758dcaf3-9976-43ac-8593-79f66ee4da22\u0022\u003EBill referred to the M\u0101ori Affairs Committee.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000433\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022758dcaf3-9976-43ac-8593-79f66ee4da22\u0022\u003EWaiata\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201605245097a19381734ac88ebf834ed75a68a7000434\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022758dcaf3-9976-43ac-8593-79f66ee4da22\u0022\u003EThe House adjourned at 12.59 p.m. (Wednesday)\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n    \u003C/div\u003E\n  \u003C/body\u003E\n\u003C/html\u003E"