"\u003C!DOCTYPE html\u003E\u003Chtml xmlns:xlink=\u0022http://www.w3.org/1999/xlink\u0022 xmlns:xsi=\u0022http://www.w3.org/2007/XMLSchema-instance\u0022 xmlns:mml=\u0022http://www.w3.org/1998/Math/MathML\u0022\u003E\n  \u003Chead\u003E\n    \u003CMETA http-equiv=\u0022Content-Type\u0022 content=\u0022text/html; charset=utf-16\u0022\u003E\n    \u003Cmeta name=\u0022viewport\u0022 content=\u0022width=device-width, initial-scale=1\u0022\u003E\n  \u003C/head\u003E\n  \u003Cbody style=\u0022font-family:sans-serif; font-size:100%;\u0022\u003E\n    \u003Cdiv class=\u0022HpsHansard\u0022\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000001\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsProceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u002266ea22aa72c642f9854eac4548fe68d1\u0022\u003EWEDNESDAY, 20 JUNE 2018\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000003\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u002257a91c7bfb8743eb9fe16290bf2e831c\u0022\u003EWEDNESDAY, 20 JUNE 2018\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000002\u0022\u003EThe Speaker took the Chair at 2 p.m.\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000004\u0022\u003EPrayers.\u003C/p\u003E\n    \u003C/div\u003E\n    \u003Cdiv class=\u0022HpsHansard\u0022\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000005\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsProceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u0022c813594119814d57a8463d8d9ad308e2\u0022\u003EMotions\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000006\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u00224916d70f8ee04b0cb1545d2270c857e3\u0022\u003EWorld Refugee Day\u2014Commemoration\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022abf27403-4392-47c9-9af0-6773753e95cb\u0022 data-id=\u00229f3da84045324304a150157373ae17fc\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000007\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022abf27403-4392-47c9-9af0-6773753e95cb\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00229f3da84045324304a150157373ae17fc\u0022\u003EGOLRIZ GHAHRAMAN (Green):\u003C/span\u003E I seek leave to move a motion without notice and without debate recognising World Refugee Day. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000008\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022fc2a1905797949449414b5758b688647\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Is there any objection to that process? There appears to be none. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000009\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022abf27403-4392-47c9-9af0-6773753e95cb\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022c5e9411a407a494c9ef1a5d2817dc51d\u0022\u003EGOLRIZ GHAHRAMAN\u003C/span\u003E: I move, That this House recognise World Refugee Day and commemorate the strength, courage, and perseverance of the millions of refugees forced to flee their homes due to war and persecution.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000010\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022abf27403-4392-47c9-9af0-6773753e95cb\u0022\u003EMotion agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n    \u003C/div\u003E\n    \u003Cdiv class=\u0022HpsHansard\u0022\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000011\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsProceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u00220f90517d11f641b6916344e8eeab6e3d\u0022\u003EOral Questions\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000012\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u00228a6b2876010e4598b412e575549f195e\u0022\u003EQuestions to Ministers\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000013\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u0022f05da9dc1caa45bf89d76f6cf11b6c96\u0022\u003EEconomic Programme\u2014Cost of Living, GDP, Regional Fuel Tax, and Rental Costs\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022badb0a39-849c-462a-b32f-77fc017c9fc2\u0022 data-id=\u00221169478c40cc4889adba2057173a61db\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000014\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022badb0a39-849c-462a-b32f-77fc017c9fc2\u0022\u003E1. \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00221169478c40cc4889adba2057173a61db\u0022\u003EHon SIMON BRIDGES (Leader\u2014National)\u003C/span\u003E to the Prime Minister: Does she stand by all her statements and policies?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022 data-id=\u002228aea87daca74335b99e01330ff43188\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000015\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002228aea87daca74335b99e01330ff43188\u0022\u003ERt Hon WINSTON PETERS (Deputy Prime Minister) \u003C/span\u003Eon behalf of the Prime Minister: Yes.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000016\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022badb0a39-849c-462a-b32f-77fc017c9fc2\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00229b0f281b30f340408e3aee07a09591d3\u0022\u003EHon Simon Bridges\u003C/span\u003E: How can the Prime Minister say it is \u201Cunadulterated rubbish\u201D that the new Auckland regional fuel tax and national excise tax will increase costs for an average family by up to $700 a year, when it\u2019s calculated on the Government\u2019s own website figures of suburban Auckland families\u2019 travel and 25c per litre, which is what the Government is legislating for?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000017\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00220bf3145a78b84add928efba39695bea4\u0022\u003ERt Hon WINSTON PETERS\u003C/span\u003E: To begin with, on behalf of the Prime Minister, to even make that calculation, given the number of people who live in Auckland, is extraordinary if that member is relying upon it. The second thing\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000018\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00222e4c14fa01c8423baff3834e62dff4e3\u0022\u003EHon Grant Robertson\u003C/span\u003E: It\u2019s $5 a week for the average family.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000019\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022b77a8cb6689b4966a1ace0245abc785d\u0022\u003ERt Hon WINSTON PETERS\u003C/span\u003E: Yes, it\u2019s $5 a week for the average family, but here\u2019s the real point: last night, in this House, every member over there was shouting out for a regional tax for their own region whilst opposing Auckland\u2019s. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000020\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022badb0a39-849c-462a-b32f-77fc017c9fc2\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00222f74b250544f4a59a479fdd941b34c4a\u0022\u003EHon Simon Bridges\u003C/span\u003E: When the Prime Minister said yesterday \u201Cevery sane, sound economist\u201D disputes that the regional fuel tax and excise tax increases will increase costs on Auckland families by hundreds of dollars, can she name one?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000021\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00222a6513f891f145c1a69ec66cf0d927c2\u0022\u003ERt Hon WINSTON PETERS\u003C/span\u003E: On behalf of the Prime Minister\u2014who was on fire yesterday, I might add\u2014can I say that we\u2019ve done the equations on the costs to families under the previous regime\u2019s rule and under ours, and it\u2019s a dramatic improvement for families today.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000022\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022badb0a39-849c-462a-b32f-77fc017c9fc2\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022200cb24cbf904745b2245e8d91108f8d\u0022\u003EHon Simon Bridges\u003C/span\u003E: So is the reality that when the Prime Minister said yesterday every \u201Csane, sound economist\u201D disputes the hundreds of dollars, she was talking arrant poppycock?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000023\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002216dea0a751a647d4a0e3cb77da8a1ce3\u0022\u003ERt Hon WINSTON PETERS\u003C/span\u003E: On behalf of the Prime Minister, what we heard yesterday was an extraordinary statement. For example, what we heard yesterday was that we were going to get $1,000 per year tax cuts for New Zealanders and families, right? \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000024\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022badb0a39-849c-462a-b32f-77fc017c9fc2\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00220b489b5ff15940cfad2795e22040cb1c\u0022\u003EHon Simon Bridges\u003C/span\u003E: You voted for them. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000025\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022985a3eb406694103a050a7579fa84fca\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Order!\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000026\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00225ba5ee8244994e85b5dcf47de0baea38\u0022\u003ERt Hon WINSTON PETERS\u003C/span\u003E: No, no. That\u2019s what\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000027\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022080d453815d64da7ac7783f3761f1756\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: The member\u2014the Deputy Prime Minister will resume his seat. I think three times yesterday, the member was subject to warnings for exactly the same thing, and it is a matter, as I\u2019ve said, of showing some leadership in the application of the rules in the House, and I expect him to do it. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000028\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002236c8c596-d890-4cca-9767-1eeb5c9ce710\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00222a25133faa5f46438fdddd27583c0292\u0022\u003EDarroch Ball\u003C/span\u003E: No surprises there. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000029\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00226620aee980f349e9ba3205ec0de6d16e\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Order! \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000030\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002283f4b169bb594c44ba547884fa74039a\u0022\u003ERt Hon WINSTON PETERS\u003C/span\u003E: Let me say\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000031\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00220d37e7a599d74422845159a5412b2e33\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: No, resume your seat. The member will stand, withdraw, and apologise. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000032\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002236c8c596-d890-4cca-9767-1eeb5c9ce710\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022b86c7a998c5447e28518edfa173870fd\u0022\u003EDarroch Ball\u003C/span\u003E: I withdraw and apologise. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000033\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002287d6763aaa5148ca9dbb075e752a13af\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: And the National Party get two extra supplementaries.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000034\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00221e856bda40854c719dfcfcbbfd36f0be\u0022\u003ERt Hon WINSTON PETERS\u003C/span\u003E: Yesterday, there was a claim\u2014and he made it\u2014that $1,000 per year tax cuts equals $40 per week. That suffers from some basic arithmetic. If you, for example, divide 1,000 by 52\u2014that\u2019s the number of weeks in a year\u2014you get $19.23, and not $40. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000035\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022badb0a39-849c-462a-b32f-77fc017c9fc2\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002253278d1ea80f4fd2a2d071e9c16fdfc4\u0022\u003EHon Simon Bridges\u003C/span\u003E: Does the Prime Minister stand by her position yesterday that her Government\u2019s policies will lower rents? \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000036\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022c6b500b947d543e0b07c9c1ed7a889d2\u0022\u003ERt Hon WINSTON PETERS\u003C/span\u003E: On behalf of the Prime Minister, yes.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000037\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022badb0a39-849c-462a-b32f-77fc017c9fc2\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00223e2af89fb60443ff99379f3f5d0efab4\u0022\u003EHon Simon Bridges\u003C/span\u003E: How on earth can she say that when her own Government advisers estimate rents have already increased an average of $23 per week since she\u2019s been in office, and when additional taxes such as the brightline test and the ban on negative gearing will inevitably be passed on to renters this term? \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000038\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022320b2329605a4c0087a9ed5269d6310a\u0022\u003ERt Hon WINSTON PETERS\u003C/span\u003E: On behalf of the Prime Minister\u2014because for the last six months, we have been setting out policies that are now going to be rolled out and implemented that will arrest nine years of decay and neglect, and then when you compare rents, you compare it with earnings as well, and that\u2019s why we\u2019re able to make the claim we\u2019re making. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000039\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022badb0a39-849c-462a-b32f-77fc017c9fc2\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022e69663aa67394fda840e854bcf4fccfd\u0022\u003EHon Simon Bridges\u003C/span\u003E: Why, as she said yesterday, is the New Zealand Herald at least to some extent incorrect to report that the cost of fruit and vegetables is set to rise because of higher fuel prices, increasing minimum wages, and increased costs of rent?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000040\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022b965ef5c3cdf44ddbf7c01c9225e7f0a\u0022\u003ERt Hon WINSTON PETERS\u003C/span\u003E: Could I just say that anticipated price rises of food are not a result of the policies and actions of this Government\u2014a fact that was identified by the very authors of the Otago University report which the member based his false assumptions on. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000041\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022badb0a39-849c-462a-b32f-77fc017c9fc2\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00226b1ec2d5f779405ba0057475c4cc29e1\u0022\u003EHon Simon Bridges\u003C/span\u003E: Well, how can Retail New Zealand be wrong when it said last week in that New Zealand Herald report \u201CThere are cost pressures across the board, it\u2019s pretty much everything that is likely to be impacted, \u2026 Fuel prices, and therefore freight and transport costs, the increase to minimum wage and rising property prices are expected to push up the cost of goods.\u201D, and aren\u2019t at least some of those factors absolutely because of Government policies? \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000042\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022c2abf2fd1d9e46b1a788f8427350c6aa\u0022\u003ERt Hon WINSTON PETERS\u003C/span\u003E: Every day, every week, every month, and every year, we\u2019ve had that for the last 50 years. The real issue is what are the Government\u2019s policies to address them, and he put his finger on one of them when he talked about the increase in wages. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000043\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022badb0a39-849c-462a-b32f-77fc017c9fc2\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022e77dc58682bc48a59fa1c5d3654eaa80\u0022\u003EHon Simon Bridges\u003C/span\u003E: Is the Prime Minister really seriously trying to tell us that the increases in fuel prices that are coming from taxes being passed in the House this week by the Government, that the increases in rental costs that her policies absolutely have a significant effect on, and that other cost increases such as significant minimum wage increases are having no effect on costs on hard-working Kiwi families? \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000044\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00225f1e9e5652b04604a2cdeb2a548353ce\u0022\u003ERt Hon WINSTON PETERS\u003C/span\u003E: On behalf of the Prime Minister, who has always been serious, can I just say that the member\u2019s neglecting, for example, the Families Package, which will put $75 per week in the hands of 385,000 families, or, for example, GP visits for 600,000 New Zealanders by up to $30 in terms of assistance, and, dare I say it, every child under 14 years of age getting free doctors visits as a result of this Government. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000045\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022badb0a39-849c-462a-b32f-77fc017c9fc2\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00229f7099025fc145debace8c696a011a8c\u0022\u003EHon Simon Bridges\u003C/span\u003E: Why does she believe, as she said yesterday, that GDP will be higher than forecast when the numbers are released tomorrow? \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000046\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022c4e4a3db8754476a87ab120f0a65aa92\u0022\u003ERt Hon WINSTON PETERS\u003C/span\u003E: On behalf of the Prime Minister, could I say she\u2019s been patient, and he should be patient and wait one more day. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000047\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022badb0a39-849c-462a-b32f-77fc017c9fc2\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022489cf243738d4d33a213b2aa79a1c24f\u0022\u003EHon Simon Bridges\u003C/span\u003E: Can we just confirm the Prime Minister definitely thinks that the GDP figures will be higher than forecast tomorrow?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000048\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a9b7bb8720d14d5f906f39aa485d47cf\u0022\u003ERt Hon WINSTON PETERS\u003C/span\u003E: Could I just say, on behalf of the Prime Minister, no such statement was made. And let me say it very slowly: unlike the gloom-and-doom merchants over there, the sharemarket is the highest this country has ever seen, and, dare I say it, it is the best performer in the world. Those are real indicators, not the blind jealousy and envy of people denied power rightfully.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000049\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u002297faeba0766b43f3936a4661c270145b\u0022\u003EEconomy\u2014Current Account Deficit and GDP\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022dc6c0f88-e781-476d-bca1-d1bf9b69302b\u0022 data-id=\u00226fbd1344965e42a89d8b1760eb52ef70\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000050\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dc6c0f88-e781-476d-bca1-d1bf9b69302b\u0022\u003E2. \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00226fbd1344965e42a89d8b1760eb52ef70\u0022\u003EHon AMY ADAMS (National\u2014Selwyn)\u003C/span\u003E to the Minister of Finance: Does he stand by the statements and policies of this Government regarding New Zealand\u2019s economy?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022 data-id=\u0022a9c4ec6645b847f386e525bb975d38fa\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000051\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022a9c4ec6645b847f386e525bb975d38fa\u0022\u003EHon GRANT ROBERTSON (Minister of Finance):\u003C/span\u003E Yes, in their appropriate context.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000052\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dc6c0f88-e781-476d-bca1-d1bf9b69302b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002210dd66d9b93c49ad991ddc59e03ec8d9\u0022\u003EHon Amy Adams\u003C/span\u003E: Why is he showing no concern that Treasury\u2019s forecast average GDP growth over the next two years has dropped by now half a percent since the Pre-election Economic and Fiscal Update, which means $2.7 billion less in our economy, or for him is any growth figure above zero good enough?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000053\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00223a7dde6fe0c84a4184ce382684a1045a\u0022\u003EHon GRANT ROBERTSON\u003C/span\u003E: What we are seeing is that the consensus forecasts, as released by the New Zealand Institute of Economic Research at the beginning of the week, are in line with the Budget forecast. It is true that GDP levels were forecast to slow from the beginning of 2017, a period of time in which the member asking the question was in Government. They have slowed somewhat. We\u2019ve been very open about the fact that it will take time to turn the economy around from one based on speculation, as overseen by the previous Government, to one based on productivity and sustainability, as overseen by this Government.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000054\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dc6c0f88-e781-476d-bca1-d1bf9b69302b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00224bfc2832d1f143a09b5444cdc978278f\u0022\u003EHon Amy Adams\u003C/span\u003E: Well, given that last answer, does he stand by his statement that this Government won\u2019t be relying on population growth for our economic growth when GDP per capita forecasts have worsened since he took office and actual GDP growth per capita flat-lined in the last quarter to just 0.1 percent?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000055\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002204facf9b9e4e4ff48fd1bf0c4a5287c6\u0022\u003EHon GRANT ROBERTSON\u003C/span\u003E: As we\u2019ve said from day one, it will take time to turn around nine years of basing economic growth on population growth and housing speculation. As the policies of this Government roll out to improve investment in R \u0026amp; D, lift skills in the economy, and get better trade agreements, we will see growth based on productive growth, not the previous Government\u2019s approach.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000056\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dc6c0f88-e781-476d-bca1-d1bf9b69302b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002238f6eb7b74af457ea96b8a61c9742477\u0022\u003EHon Amy Adams\u003C/span\u003E: Does he agree with Statistics New Zealand\u2019s statement today that the current account deficit is\u2014and I quote\u2014\u201Can important indicator of the economy\u2019s health\u201D when they today reported that we now have the largest current account deficit since the 2008 global financial crisis?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000057\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00229f0cbb3c9e7542fdb8603c5f7e4d9651\u0022\u003EHon GRANT ROBERTSON\u003C/span\u003E: The current account deficit does fluctuate from time to time, and it was largely in line with expectations: 2.8 percent of GDP in the year ended March 2018, compared with 2.7 percent of GDP in 2017. That\u2019s not the kind of difference the member should be getting worried about; the kind of difference she should be getting worried about is people having $75 per week extra in their pocket, knowing that this Government is delivering to them.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000058\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dc6c0f88-e781-476d-bca1-d1bf9b69302b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00227087d293f39140b7ad49225c092dfdc3\u0022\u003EHon Amy Adams\u003C/span\u003E: On what date was the public-private partnership (PPP) contract to build Waikeria Prison that he referred to in question time last Thursday signed?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000059\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002246072c99698e4ab695e6f20f4dbf0312\u0022\u003EHon GRANT ROBERTSON\u003C/span\u003E: I don\u2019t have that specific information with me. What I am aware of is that the PPP contract for Waikeria Prison was in place and that breaking it would\u2019ve cost significant sums of money to this Government, given that the contract had been earlier signed. Variations to the contract may well have been signed since then, but the overall break fees for the original contract signed by the previous Government would have been substantial.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000060\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u002221d2bdfab07f41959cbfc5c4a493c8e4\u0022\u003EFamilies Package\u2014Impact and Reaction\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022f7fc7ac3-5ce1-43ca-8cd6-dbb0941bf3ae\u0022 data-id=\u002264d82a7ae5ec4e8f94818091f6021055\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000061\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f7fc7ac3-5ce1-43ca-8cd6-dbb0941bf3ae\u0022\u003E3. \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002264d82a7ae5ec4e8f94818091f6021055\u0022\u003EDr DUNCAN WEBB (Labour\u2014Christchurch Central)\u003C/span\u003E to the Minister of Finance: Will this Government\u2019s Families Package support low- and middle-income families; if so, how?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022 data-id=\u0022d9e7764ba4504d908ac2c178319f28ff\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000062\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022d9e7764ba4504d908ac2c178319f28ff\u0022\u003EHon GRANT ROBERTSON (Minister of Finance):\u003C/span\u003E Yes. The Government\u2019s Families Package, most of which will come into effect on 1 July, will provide targeted income assistance to boost the incomes of middle and low income families, particularly by increasing the Working for Families tax credits and raising the abatement threshold, introducing a Best Start payment of $60 per week to assist families during the critical first few years of life, and increasing paid parental leave to 26 weeks. When rolled out fully, Mr Speaker, as I\u2019m sure you\u2019re aware, 385,000 families with children will be better off by an average of $75 per week.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000063\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f7fc7ac3-5ce1-43ca-8cd6-dbb0941bf3ae\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022325be5a8c88f418795aa8320828919f9\u0022\u003EDr Duncan Webb\u003C/span\u003E: What specific examples can the Minister provide of families that will be better off under this package?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000064\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022bb3373455518479e84c885bb3424d451\u0022\u003EHon GRANT ROBERTSON\u003C/span\u003E: Once these changes begin to take effect on 1 July, a majority of Kiwi families with children will be pleased to see their incomes rise. For example, a Hamilton couple with a six-month-old and a four-year-old earning $65,000 a year will see their income rise by $63.87 a week from 1 July this year. Once the package is fully rolled out, from 1 July 2020, a family in that same situation would be $123.87 per week better off. The Families Package represents a major step in delivering meaningful improvements to the lives of New Zealanders\u2014in particular, our children.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000065\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f7fc7ac3-5ce1-43ca-8cd6-dbb0941bf3ae\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022969b1377019a4f52aac8b39574ccdcb8\u0022\u003EDr Duncan Webb\u003C/span\u003E: Has the Government received any feedback from people who will benefit from these changes?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000066\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002224091c0e90164010ad3b32819143810a\u0022\u003EHon GRANT ROBERTSON\u003C/span\u003E: People have already begun to write in to us and to say what this package means to them. One woman who contacted the Prime Minister\u2019s office said this: \u201CIt is more than money. It is that someone actually has validated our existence and seen that we are not victims, that life has just played a curly hand. Thank you, Jacinda and your team, for caring. It has given me such a motivation to get well and back to being a proud and productive citizen of New Zealand.\u201D\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000067\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u002286a4d28c2f1842a891657b82c5fcdd0c\u0022\u003EHealth, Minister\u2014Counties Manukau District Health Board\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022163d0b68-eb0e-4094-9bed-99e184f063e1\u0022 data-id=\u00226213ec85fe9f49c6baa0828e91bda1fe\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000068\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022163d0b68-eb0e-4094-9bed-99e184f063e1\u0022\u003E4. \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00226213ec85fe9f49c6baa0828e91bda1fe\u0022\u003EJAMI-LEE ROSS (National\u2014Botany)\u003C/span\u003E to the Minister of Health: Does he stand by his answer yesterday when he said \u201CI reject the premise of that question\u201D when asked why he allowed \u201Chis office to put pressure on the CEO of the Counties Manukau DHB not to release documents that would have contradicted his own public statements\u201D; if so, how does he reconcile that with the Counties Manukau DHB CEO emailing board members saying \u201Cunfortunately we are under some pressure from the Minister\u2019s office about what we can and cannot say\u201D?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00225bbd9f26-fdb0-4b85-a836-0fc46e1bba3c\u0022 data-id=\u00223bf086e292e24c5bb72ad3154c1d9baf\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000069\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225bbd9f26-fdb0-4b85-a836-0fc46e1bba3c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00223bf086e292e24c5bb72ad3154c1d9baf\u0022\u003EHon Dr DAVID CLARK (Minister of Health):\u003C/span\u003E Yes, and in response to the second leg of the member\u2019s question, I\u2019m not responsible for what the acting CEO of the Counties Manukau District Health Board (DHB) does and doesn\u2019t say.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000070\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022163d0b68-eb0e-4094-9bed-99e184f063e1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022b585a7b44d164757aee9403c80d2f7f8\u0022\u003EJami-Lee Ross\u003C/span\u003E: Why did he damage the reputations of the Counties Manukau District Health Board chair and CEO by putting them in a position where his office pressured them not to respond when he was told in text messages and phone calls repeatedly that his public statements were wrong?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000071\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225bbd9f26-fdb0-4b85-a836-0fc46e1bba3c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002265e3ad1298f24e8b939311bf09c30f1e\u0022\u003EHon Dr DAVID CLARK\u003C/span\u003E: I did not damage the reputation of those people.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000072\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022163d0b68-eb0e-4094-9bed-99e184f063e1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002279826638510b4c759291d85cdf3c8370\u0022\u003EJami-Lee Ross\u003C/span\u003E: When Rabin Rabindran texted him and said, \u201CI take strong exception to the connection between the state of the buildings and your knowledge of them and my removal from the board, which is damaging my reputation\u201D, why did he not publicly apologise then to Rabin Rabindran?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000073\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225bbd9f26-fdb0-4b85-a836-0fc46e1bba3c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022102f9c70bfdd466ab22b634b12d02571\u0022\u003EHon Dr DAVID CLARK\u003C/span\u003E: Ministers appoint the chairs of DHBs. That is the Minister\u2019s prerogative. I appointed a chair that I believe has the right skill set to address the nine years of neglect that that DHB has suffered\u2014the nine years in which we got rot and mould in the walls of the buildings. That will take a long time to repair, and I have the job, as Minister, to select the team that I think will best be able to address that historical legacy of underfunding in the health sector.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000074\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022163d0b68-eb0e-4094-9bed-99e184f063e1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022765e482211044bad8d6ef02e54ebe082\u0022\u003EJami-Lee Ross\u003C/span\u003E: I raise a point of order, Mr Speaker. I don\u2019t believe the Minister did answer my question.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000075\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022ef7520fe65534c208fc742f2e7f13067\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Well, I think he did.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000076\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022163d0b68-eb0e-4094-9bed-99e184f063e1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022702f23f13b5142d5a34a87af6d56f79a\u0022\u003EJami-Lee Ross\u003C/span\u003E: Why did his draft press release announcing the sacking of Rabin Rabindran further damage his reputation by stating the decision had come \u201Cafter revelations about the state of some of Middlemore\u2019s buildings\u201D, when he told Rabin Rabindran privately that Middlemore Hospital\u2019s issues had happened before Mr Rabindran\u2019s time?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000077\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225bbd9f26-fdb0-4b85-a836-0fc46e1bba3c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022adb12d42b5744ee89565e7b4f5369052\u0022\u003EHon Dr DAVID CLARK\u003C/span\u003E: I\u2019ve been absolutely explicit that the reason for Mr Rabindran\u2019s departure was not due to anything about his performance; it was due to the historical situation we inherited of underfunding. That is what we needed to have refreshed leadership about. The other point I\u2019d make to the House is that that was a draft press release, not released into the public except by that member opposite.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000078\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022163d0b68-eb0e-4094-9bed-99e184f063e1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002236d8169fd98e44de9765bacf66f3f5b2\u0022\u003EJami-Lee Ross\u003C/span\u003E: Why did he have his office draft the press release after his voicemail message to Rabin Rabindran attempting to gag him from speaking publicly and, at the same time, offering to appoint him to further positions?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000079\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225bbd9f26-fdb0-4b85-a836-0fc46e1bba3c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00222fbdaf8025ce494fa1be6f4848d7c80f\u0022\u003EHon Dr DAVID CLARK\u003C/span\u003E: I reject the idea that Mr Rabindran was ever gagged, and I would also note that the DHB fronted media regularly, both with statements and with interviews.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000080\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022163d0b68-eb0e-4094-9bed-99e184f063e1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00223edfbc89c2834376b7b4c0a940b7cd0e\u0022\u003EJami-Lee Ross\u003C/span\u003E: Point of order.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000081\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022d6341fccdce54edd9e7ac1aa9fc419d7\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: A point of order, Jami-Lee Ross\u2014with a bit of a warning.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000082\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022163d0b68-eb0e-4094-9bed-99e184f063e1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002271633f03d7fd4a848a4d266ca018a644\u0022\u003EJami-Lee Ross\u003C/span\u003E: I seek leave to table a draft press release from the Hon Dr David Clark around the changes at Counties Manukau District Health Board which contains the statements that I just read out.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000083\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022d6e44459d5ae4f4db3a0a7067e102b39\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Is there any objection to that document being tabled? There is.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000084\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022d884c069f1104e8e9ce18579ab19c872\u0022\u003ERt Hon Winston Peters\u003C/span\u003E: I raise a point of order, Mr Speaker. A draft press release that wasn\u2019t released is not a press release.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000085\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022d1a77f3d47c645bd990db9638ddc5877\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Well, that\u2019s almost certainly true, but it\u2019s also not a point of order.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000086\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022163d0b68-eb0e-4094-9bed-99e184f063e1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00220e978281cf3b443e9750adad2ea194b9\u0022\u003EJami-Lee Ross\u003C/span\u003E: I seek leave to table a transcript of a voice mail message given to Rabin Rabindran by Dr David Clark on 18 April at 2.24 p.m.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000087\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022dd3feef480c7474c9d6ee7406d9d9703\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: I want to ask\u2014I mean, I know it\u2019s a transcript that I have seen\u2014is it in general circulation?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000088\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022163d0b68-eb0e-4094-9bed-99e184f063e1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022e72a0a8040194f0fba22fa30dcc77fd1\u0022\u003EJami-Lee Ross\u003C/span\u003E: Point of order.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000089\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002231c4b4a6eb3a40ff84445c8b2e95dc52\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Well, has the member released it to the media or anything like that?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000090\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022163d0b68-eb0e-4094-9bed-99e184f063e1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00227420f944286444ef86781bdb9a1953c4\u0022\u003EJami-Lee Ross\u003C/span\u003E: A transcript hasn\u2019t been released by me to the media.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000091\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a6152af835184c24a2117d170360fc6b\u0022\u003EHon Chris Hipkins\u003C/span\u003E: It\u2019s been published in the paper.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000092\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022734c56c452c74b52878b5209db29efef\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: I don\u2019t know that that\u2019s absolutely the case. I will put it to the House. Is there any objection to that being tabled? Yes there is.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000093\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022163d0b68-eb0e-4094-9bed-99e184f063e1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022b4c44031cc9b4f628ece1f39d3c575aa\u0022\u003EJami-Lee Ross\u003C/span\u003E: I seek leave to table the Microsoft Word document properties of that draft press release, which shows it was created on 18 April at 2.53 p.m.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000094\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022cfa99f22b91a436bb664c4cad82b0c13\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Is there any objection to that document being tabled? There appears to be none. It may be tabled.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000095\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003EDocument, by leave, laid on the Table of the House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000096\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u00225a6a49f5f2d84bde8964a03be8865755\u0022\u003EHealth Services\u2014Funding\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022c83012b4-3939-4753-80fc-1956a3e2bd1e\u0022 data-id=\u0022ae9b7807ada5416ab6ea5eb4e4a401d5\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000097\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c83012b4-3939-4753-80fc-1956a3e2bd1e\u0022\u003E5. \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022ae9b7807ada5416ab6ea5eb4e4a401d5\u0022\u003EHon MICHAEL WOODHOUSE (National)\u003C/span\u003E to the Minister of Health: Does he stand by all his statements and actions?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00225bbd9f26-fdb0-4b85-a836-0fc46e1bba3c\u0022 data-id=\u002211b415fbe0fb4f5ab1fb3e17e36d9b1a\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000098\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225bbd9f26-fdb0-4b85-a836-0fc46e1bba3c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002211b415fbe0fb4f5ab1fb3e17e36d9b1a\u0022\u003EHon Dr DAVID CLARK (Minister of Health):\u003C/span\u003E Yes, in the context they were made and taken.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000099\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c83012b4-3939-4753-80fc-1956a3e2bd1e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00222399099775c84f918a8af505a348fcb3\u0022\u003EHon Michael Woodhouse\u003C/span\u003E: Does he stand by his answer to media this morning? When asked \u201CDid the Ministry of Health give you an indication of what the DHBs were looking for?\u201D, he answered, \u201CWe did.\u201D\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000100\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225bbd9f26-fdb0-4b85-a836-0fc46e1bba3c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00220c1e22c940454da2a76bf9fb32df9d69\u0022\u003EHon Dr DAVID CLARK\u003C/span\u003E: I\u2019m not quite clear\u2014I appreciate the member\u2019s quoting back to me what his question is. Is he asking: did we get an indication from the district health boards (DHBs) of what they were after? In which case, I would answer that the work that Ministers do in setting the Budget is done with the Ministry of Health, who look at what they believe the demographics look like, where the cost pressures sit, and we prepare an answer on that basis and a Budget on that basis\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000101\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c83012b4-3939-4753-80fc-1956a3e2bd1e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002258f35ff848394f06a98542dd7eecfdf2\u0022\u003EHon Michael Woodhouse\u003C/span\u003E: I raise a point of order, Mr Speaker. Interesting answer, but it didn\u2019t address the question.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000102\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022c223f07cb8ad4f549fac179c3130be10\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: I\u2019ll get the member\u2014because it was a little bit unclear because it was a partial quote\u2014to ask it again.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000103\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c83012b4-3939-4753-80fc-1956a3e2bd1e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00224e13eecbfa34455a9adfffdb4c5033f0\u0022\u003EHon Michael Woodhouse\u003C/span\u003E: Does he stand by the answer he gave to media this morning? When asked \u201CDid the Ministry of Health give you an indication of what the DHBs were looking for?\u201D, he answered, \u201CWe did.\u201D\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000104\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225bbd9f26-fdb0-4b85-a836-0fc46e1bba3c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00227ce7cfa864f44d97a82f8b1e372fa429\u0022\u003EHon Dr DAVID CLARK\u003C/span\u003E: In the respect that the Ministry of Health works off demographic pressures, and so on supplied information that DHBs hold about their area, there\u2019s ongoing conversations. But I\u2019m not quite sure where the member\u2019s heading with this.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000105\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022904a0ee195cb4b2ab53b0d209a02227e\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: I\u2019m taking that as a \u201CYes, probably.\u201D\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000106\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c83012b4-3939-4753-80fc-1956a3e2bd1e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022df80dab959734a9088783de7c7ebcbcb\u0022\u003EHon Michael Woodhouse\u003C/span\u003E: Well, on the basis of \u201CYes, probably.\u201D, does he also stand by his comment \u201CDistrict health boards this year needed at least $650 million to stand still, but they\u2019re over $200 million short of what they need.\u201D\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000107\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225bbd9f26-fdb0-4b85-a836-0fc46e1bba3c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00221990808708ca417096d3f26bbd37c2b9\u0022\u003EHon Dr DAVID CLARK\u003C/span\u003E: I raise a point of order, Mr Speaker. I believe that the honourable member is referring to statements made a long time ago, not in my responsibility as a Minister.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000108\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022e7933142d64d4ba6b3cdea3af9d44c2d\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Well, we might get to that point. If it was a quote from before the member was a Minister, there are ways of getting it in, but the approach taken by the member so far doesn\u2019t.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000109\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c83012b4-3939-4753-80fc-1956a3e2bd1e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002275fceb9fc0314dc8b710257e692f411c\u0022\u003EHon Michael Woodhouse\u003C/span\u003E: May I rephrase the question? I didn\u2019t get to finish it.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000110\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022e0a653f768234f358ce1b65763fea3ae\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Fair enough. If the member had finished it and not got there, he would have used it up if it was ruled out, but I\u2019ll let him have another go.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000111\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c83012b4-3939-4753-80fc-1956a3e2bd1e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022433e77301c604d7cb7b95503cc038748\u0022\u003EHon Michael Woodhouse\u003C/span\u003E: To the Minister, are there statements he has made prior to obtaining his ministerial warrant that he no longer stands by?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000112\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022dcd14dfe21484af5a5f49e5dd2b31a60\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Order! That is out of order. He has no responsibility for them.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000113\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c83012b4-3939-4753-80fc-1956a3e2bd1e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022799e52d1b40f479f898a30d3cb719e89\u0022\u003EHon Michael Woodhouse\u003C/span\u003E: To the Minister, is he satisfied that district health boards were adequately funded in Budget 2018 when the amount of new money given to them was more than $200 million less than he himself said they needed?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000114\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225bbd9f26-fdb0-4b85-a836-0fc46e1bba3c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00224ff50e0aca3d4ddd9938f6a0f621b258\u0022\u003EHon Dr DAVID CLARK\u003C/span\u003E: I reject the last part of the statement, and, in answer to the first, yes.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000115\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c83012b4-3939-4753-80fc-1956a3e2bd1e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00227293283006b24b66915348d7bc066596\u0022\u003EHon Michael Woodhouse\u003C/span\u003E: Does he stand by his statement that \u201CMy job as Minister of Health is to defend the interests of the patient.\u201D, and how is pending strike action by nurses in the interests of those patients?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000116\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225bbd9f26-fdb0-4b85-a836-0fc46e1bba3c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022e578c60a299049318e34595256c58dde\u0022\u003EHon Dr DAVID CLARK\u003C/span\u003E: I am here as health Minister to defend the interests of the public patient. That is my priority as Minister.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000117\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002219ea1a82924d4cad9075feec0721656c\u0022\u003ERt Hon Winston Peters\u003C/span\u003E: Could the Minister give us the secret of his success with respect to his negotiations with the Minister of Finance, having inherited, when he got the job as Minister of Health, nearly every district health board with a massive debt?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000118\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225bbd9f26-fdb0-4b85-a836-0fc46e1bba3c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a3d5e61a1a8f4040a86e4a150b49b35d\u0022\u003EHon Dr DAVID CLARK\u003C/span\u003E: I can\u2019t reveal too much about the Budget process, but I am delighted that health got such a big chunk of the Budget and the largest increase in a decade, because it was so long neglected under that Government\u2014run down. Those people let the staff exist in a situation of underfunding where the staff were more and more stretched and the pressure went on. The health system deserves to be supported adequately so it can deliver the services that New Zealanders would expect, and I\u2019m proud that we\u2019ve done that in this Budget.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000119\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u002235a00b01caab4016be7d88a53e0a7125\u0022\u003ETax System\u2014Compliance\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002212d74f81-b1f7-4b51-9fb4-8f9481477192\u0022 data-id=\u0022e2b1bd1e48334fb7a29e9eb5cb5db77d\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000120\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002212d74f81-b1f7-4b51-9fb4-8f9481477192\u0022\u003E6. \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022e2b1bd1e48334fb7a29e9eb5cb5db77d\u0022\u003EDr DEBORAH RUSSELL (Labour\u2014New Lynn)\u003C/span\u003E to the Minister of Revenue: What recent announcements has he made in relation to cracking down on non-compliance in the tax system?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022bbded2ec-ac25-4a73-a380-3f4d87693084\u0022 data-id=\u002206f15c7cf00448feb88b412c30400b19\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000121\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bbded2ec-ac25-4a73-a380-3f4d87693084\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002206f15c7cf00448feb88b412c30400b19\u0022\u003EHon STUART NASH (Minister of Revenue):\u003C/span\u003E This coalition Government is committed to creating more fairness in the tax system. Budget 2018 gives inland revenue $31.3 million of operating spending over the next four years to improve tax compliance. Of this, $23.5 million will be dedicated to a targeted campaign, ensuring that outstanding company - tax returns are filed, and $3 million will be used to analyse the potential legislative opportunities. This is expected to recover approximately $183 million, or a return on investment of $6 for every $1 spent.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000122\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022c9ef7ddd48794dc5ad3a2945a8bb71c6\u0022\u003EHon Grant Robertson\u003C/span\u003E: Oh, well done.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000123\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bbded2ec-ac25-4a73-a380-3f4d87693084\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00225620c8138e0c49d79a60cc626538b930\u0022\u003EHon STUART NASH\u003C/span\u003E: Thank you.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000124\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002212d74f81-b1f7-4b51-9fb4-8f9481477192\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022bf2bbf1c1d0d4cd39d570accba369e9a\u0022\u003EDr Deborah Russell\u003C/span\u003E: What advice has he received around the scale of non-compliance in the tax system?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000125\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bbded2ec-ac25-4a73-a380-3f4d87693084\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022c884ab1e2ae74832bca4ab2dce42c737\u0022\u003EHon STUART NASH\u003C/span\u003E: IRD officials have informed me that companies currently have over 100,000 returns outstanding, and recent research by inland revenue and Victoria University estimates that the average under-reporting of self-employed and contractual work is at 20 percent, on average, or around $800 million per year. This is simply not fair on all those hard-working Kiwis who comply with their tax obligations and pay their fair share of tax.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000126\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002212d74f81-b1f7-4b51-9fb4-8f9481477192\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022477214e733994c40a2f5b2082b4894ff\u0022\u003EDr Deborah Russell\u003C/span\u003E: What measures is the Government undertaking to support compliance, in addition to cracking down on non-compliance?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000127\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bbded2ec-ac25-4a73-a380-3f4d87693084\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022c9a8ae7fd76a4fc0b78168dd487f1f74\u0022\u003EHon STUART NASH\u003C/span\u003E: Hand in hand with measures to encourage compliance, the Government knows it needs to do more to simplify the tax system. The Business Transformation programme provides these opportunities to get things right from the start\u2014for example, taxpayers now have the ability to enter into instalment arrangements online instead of calling the IRD, and for individual taxpayers, we are also making progress to eliminate the burden of secondary tax.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000128\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u0022ae841a8d98534075882b30adc42279da\u0022\u003EHousing New Zealand\u2014Tenants\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002285ec30d4-6394-433a-a12e-2c4def705dd0\u0022 data-id=\u00229e125a2763474505ab716dba902bdd3e\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000129\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002285ec30d4-6394-433a-a12e-2c4def705dd0\u0022\u003E7. \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00229e125a2763474505ab716dba902bdd3e\u0022\u003EHon JUDITH COLLINS (National\u2014Papakura)\u003C/span\u003E to the Minister of Housing and Urban Development: Does he stand by all his statements and policies regarding evicting anti-social Housing New Zealand tenants?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022cbc37df2-57ae-4536-94ed-a2e39eecd585\u0022 data-id=\u0022bf096fd157de4f9f8bd1d77abcb17175\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000130\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cbc37df2-57ae-4536-94ed-a2e39eecd585\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022bf096fd157de4f9f8bd1d77abcb17175\u0022\u003EHon PHIL TWYFORD (Minister of Housing and Urban Development):\u003C/span\u003E Yes. In particular, I stand by my statement that \u201Cpeople all over this country of different persuasions and colours and tendencies all live together in diverse communities\u201D and \u201CThis Government is not going to engage in the kind of vile demonising of State house tenants and stereotyping \u2026 to try and stigmatise people\u201D.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000131\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002285ec30d4-6394-433a-a12e-2c4def705dd0\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002216092659409b48d49aaffb3d5dca1f50\u0022\u003EHon Judith Collins\u003C/span\u003E: Does he stand by his statement that \u201CHousing New Zealand is a landlord \u2026 they\u2019re not the police.\u201D?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000132\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cbc37df2-57ae-4536-94ed-a2e39eecd585\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00226e92eb270f1f408098f1cd64e5b5de8b\u0022\u003EHon PHIL TWYFORD\u003C/span\u003E: Yes, I do.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000133\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002285ec30d4-6394-433a-a12e-2c4def705dd0\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002227b1ad451ba14b9c9fe900b99e7d477e\u0022\u003EHon Judith Collins\u003C/span\u003E: If a Housing New Zealand tenant complains that their neighbouring, gang-affiliated Housing New Zealand tenant is selling methamphetamine, what action will Housing New Zealand take?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000134\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cbc37df2-57ae-4536-94ed-a2e39eecd585\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00221fbdea4000f74fdd9982b82f4315d78e\u0022\u003EHon PHIL TWYFORD\u003C/span\u003E: Housing New Zealand works with the police and other agencies to help make our communities safer, and if people have concerns about their safety or suspect illegal behaviour, Housing New Zealand encourages them to contact the police. The good news is that there are now more police on the beat, following years of cuts under that former Minister.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000135\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002285ec30d4-6394-433a-a12e-2c4def705dd0\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022ebbf2f87822a4ca6b349028438cc2769\u0022\u003EHon Judith Collins\u003C/span\u003E: What obligations does he, as the Minister of housing, have to keep Housing New Zealand tenants who are living within the law safe in their homes if they have intimidating behaviour from their neighbouring tenants?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000136\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cbc37df2-57ae-4536-94ed-a2e39eecd585\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00221d2db5a7d02e4f47a4b59c6813f565b7\u0022\u003EHon PHIL TWYFORD\u003C/span\u003E: My view about this is that Housing New Zealand has an obligation to be not only a good landlord but a good neighbour, and that antisocial behaviour should not be tolerated in Housing New Zealand tenants or, in fact, in any tenants and in any neighbours. But this is a complex issue, and Housing New Zealand\u2019s policy tries to strike a balance between being a good neighbour and sustaining tenancies. Evictions, as that member seems to advocate, should be an extreme last resort. Our Government does not share the previous Government\u2019s enthusiasm for throwing people out on the street.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000137\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022872744a3-2256-4cdd-a4cc-939836dc2b11\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022c3c19d8fa86b45998fd8ac8afa679da9\u0022\u003EPriyanca Radhakrishnan\u003C/span\u003E: What is the Minister\u2019s view of Housing New Zealand\u2019s announcement that it will help tenants with alcohol or addiction problems?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000138\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cbc37df2-57ae-4536-94ed-a2e39eecd585\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00223a99898e9fb941e89937b1e48e535b0b\u0022\u003EHon PHIL TWYFORD\u003C/span\u003E: I thank the member for that question. I\u2019m glad that Housing New Zealand is now helping those who have problems with alcohol and addiction, rather than throwing them and their children out on the street. Making tenants and their children homeless doesn\u2019t make their problems disappear; it\u2019s only likely to make things worse for them and society. The Prime Minister said that this Government brings kindness back, and I\u2019m happy that Housing New Zealand is embracing that.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000139\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002285ec30d4-6394-433a-a12e-2c4def705dd0\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002252870e0839404878b350f2a531330a4a\u0022\u003EHon Judith Collins\u003C/span\u003E: Why does he agree with his Housing New Zealand Chief Executive, Andrew McKenzie, who said last week, in relation to antisocial and criminal tenants, \u201CSo our objective is to keep them in the house.\u201D?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000140\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cbc37df2-57ae-4536-94ed-a2e39eecd585\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022f8cfacc033604d5a97b5db837a27feb6\u0022\u003EHon PHIL TWYFORD\u003C/span\u003E: Housing New Zealand has a range of options for dealing with these kinds of situations. The exchange that the member was talking about was about the idea of moving neighbours on, and I would have thought that would be an extreme last resort. While we should not be tolerating antisocial behaviour in public housing or anywhere else, we should also not be tolerating the kind of demonising and stereotyping that that member routinely engages in.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000141\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022d0ed3c97b21f4f0bb8347b621f804c3d\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: There is no question No. 8.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000142\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u0022a1407718465e487198ae86735371bada\u0022\u003ERegional Economic Development, Minister\u2014Statements on Fonterra\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002253f86481-33c1-48b2-893b-c11cc0bd673d\u0022 data-id=\u0022029b8adc17914297af206ec7a362dfa3\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000143\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002253f86481-33c1-48b2-893b-c11cc0bd673d\u0022\u003E9. \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022029b8adc17914297af206ec7a362dfa3\u0022\u003EHon PAUL GOLDSMITH (National)\u003C/span\u003E to the Minister for Regional Economic Development: Does he stand by his statement to the House last week, \u201CFonterra cannot wander around making advertisements, such as they did this year, drawing on the countryside and the personalities of country people and not expect the \u2018champion of the country\u2019 to hold them accountable\u201D?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022f44431ef-b505-4e94-9f57-a60b0a569bf7\u0022 data-id=\u00224732992ccf0844c0889d9ffe876cf704\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000144\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f44431ef-b505-4e94-9f57-a60b0a569bf7\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00224732992ccf0844c0889d9ffe876cf704\u0022\u003EHon SHANE JONES (Minister for Regional Economic Development):\u003C/span\u003E In response to the question, the word \u201Cchampion\u201D is a verb and a noun, and I am delivering it by deed and by word.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000145\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002253f86481-33c1-48b2-893b-c11cc0bd673d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022704599adbb7f4a10a84136bc8af0b7b4\u0022\u003EHon Paul Goldsmith\u003C/span\u003E: Was he speaking in a personal capacity at the time he made that statement to the House?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000146\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f44431ef-b505-4e94-9f57-a60b0a569bf7\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022edf6b0f8839942319d71d83c42a98760\u0022\u003EHon SHANE JONES\u003C/span\u003E: I repeat, I will remain an avid defender of the standards of accountability. Unlike that member, I will not be sucked in by this corporate-based pecuniary prattle, smooth tongue, and what I said, I owned.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000147\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002253f86481-33c1-48b2-893b-c11cc0bd673d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022e0716fa099414fe28974712b4e65ad1e\u0022\u003EHon Paul Goldsmith\u003C/span\u003E: I raise a point of order, Mr Speaker.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000148\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022c5d772a832104b258dd95120c0f9eae9\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Well, I probably should have ruled the question out. I mean, it is absolutely obvious that if a member makes a statement in the House in response to a question as a Minister, then he is speaking as a Minister.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000149\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002253f86481-33c1-48b2-893b-c11cc0bd673d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00229a9fd2cc1c2145bab1f1f25bcc0d9667\u0022\u003EHon Paul Goldsmith\u003C/span\u003E: How does he reconcile his response in the House with the statements of the Prime Minister, who repeatedly said that his comments regarding Fonterra were made in a personal capacity\u2014\u201Cend of story\u201D?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000150\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f44431ef-b505-4e94-9f57-a60b0a569bf7\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022e7fa8d0eb581452580f88a87ed7fc0cc\u0022\u003EHon SHANE JONES\u003C/span\u003E: Just to remind the House, those candid remarks were made to an audience organised by KPMG, where we were told it was Chatham House Rules, and then, when I returned to the House, obviously someone associated with the National Party leaked those remarks to the press gallery. And as befits a plain-speaking, forthright advocate, champion, citizen of the provinces, I own what I said.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000151\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002253f86481-33c1-48b2-893b-c11cc0bd673d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a6c66ff506984f09a7b66209ed7e425e\u0022\u003EHon Paul Goldsmith\u003C/span\u003E: When he told the House last Thursday, the day after the Prime Minister had asserted that his comments about Fonterra\u2019s leadership were made in his personal capacity, \u201CI stand by my remarks in terms of accountability that should be shown by a failing corporate governance culture at the highest levels of our largest company\u2014and if the cab doesn\u2019t suit, then shanks\u2019s pony is just as good\u201D, was he intentionally setting out to make the Prime Minister look weak?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000152\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f44431ef-b505-4e94-9f57-a60b0a569bf7\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00224a34399f1549461c9ecf6d90029273b3\u0022\u003EHon SHANE JONES\u003C/span\u003E: My style is strong and forthright. However, nothing that I have said, done, or am contemplating to do is designed to undermine the Prime Minister, Jacinda Ardern, or indeed the Deputy Prime Minister, soon to be the Acting Prime Minister. And I think what the member needs to understand, it was a rapidly changing narrative. It started where I was invited as the \u201Cchampion of the country\u201D, I gave the remarks to an adoring audience, and I said them to the face of the chairman of Fonterra\u2014not behind his back, like other people on that side of the House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000153\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022ec9df49fddd246d5a0bb4c1b05d718cd\u0022\u003ERt Hon Winston Peters\u003C/span\u003E: Has the Minister seen the supportive comments of the New Zealand Herald writer Fran O\u2019Sullivan, and why would it be that she is allowed to see the common sense of the argument about Fonterra\u2019s lack of accountability but the National Party can\u2019t?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000154\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022e46b02476d424cb899445888a622c813\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Order! Order! \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000155\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022f85bf57c3bf446d38a57f2e8dacea754\u0022\u003EHon Member\u003C/span\u003E: He has no ministerial responsibility.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000156\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022aef98438fba941fc82a0d3125471ff0a\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Well, you know I am allowed to make my own rulings. The member can answer the first part of the question but not the last.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000157\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f44431ef-b505-4e94-9f57-a60b0a569bf7\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002253cd15f664be4fab85c9b5238aab411a\u0022\u003EHon SHANE JONES\u003C/span\u003E: The journalist referred to is a highly respected, well-versed, leading writer about matters of governance and accountability, and I\u2019ve got every confidence when she congratulates my call for accountability she speaks truth to power.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000158\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002253f86481-33c1-48b2-893b-c11cc0bd673d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022fb471f23a79d4643bd4660665953307f\u0022\u003EHon Paul Goldsmith\u003C/span\u003E: So have I got the sequence right? The Prime Minister told him off for attacking corporate leaders, then he did it again, then she said he was only speaking in a personal capacity\u2014not as a Minister\u2014then the Minister rode over that fig leaf in a steamroller and repeated those statements in the House\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000159\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00225543f821260b41d99c25858a8389dd63\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Order! Order! I\u2019m now going to ask the member to very quickly come to a question that doesn\u2019t have the level of embellishment\u2014even if the fig leaf embellishment he used is a small one.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000160\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002253f86481-33c1-48b2-893b-c11cc0bd673d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022af2804dabf3d439db1be9f136b5e62a2\u0022\u003EHon Paul Goldsmith\u003C/span\u003E: Well, I started with the question, Mr Speaker. The question was\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000161\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00224b6484a7f3404082b4e29048e4da466b\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Well, if the member started with the question, has he finished?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000162\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002253f86481-33c1-48b2-893b-c11cc0bd673d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022bc4a49a65f0b4080a00527213239462b\u0022\u003EHon Paul Goldsmith\u003C/span\u003E: Well, no, because I was continuing the question and I haven\u2019t got to the end of it.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000163\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00225962becac90648bca1936abb0cf2fb24\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: OK, right, get to the end quickly.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000164\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002253f86481-33c1-48b2-893b-c11cc0bd673d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00229d003fd5e71541e58699b910f6e4ba5a\u0022\u003EHon Paul Goldsmith\u003C/span\u003E: Well, I\u2019ll start again if I\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000165\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00227d237b2172b444a99807b162986c9dfe\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: No, no. Does the member have a further supplementary?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000166\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002253f86481-33c1-48b2-893b-c11cc0bd673d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00223143fa3942eb4fa2b244479f79838469\u0022\u003EHon Paul Goldsmith\u003C/span\u003E: No. I haven\u2019t finished this particular question.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000167\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022acf13f5c1532485191a13cad7e016c89\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: No, no, you have.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000168\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002253f86481-33c1-48b2-893b-c11cc0bd673d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022d924a21e29d24a70b4b9cee3b72f1a6b\u0022\u003EHon Paul Goldsmith\u003C/span\u003E: Well, I\u2019ll let him answer it then.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000169\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f44431ef-b505-4e94-9f57-a60b0a569bf7\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022e72dbd566be74a9f9e586d3534253ea6\u0022\u003EHon SHANE JONES\u003C/span\u003E: The member obviously doesn\u2019t understand the reproductive cycle. This was a story where seeds were planted in an audience full of farmers and their grandees. It changed. At what point he missed the impregnation, I\u2019m not sure.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000170\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00224ff78b59375044cd89338b5207cd329f\u0022\u003EHon Gerry Brownlee\u003C/span\u003E: I raise a point of order, Mr Speaker. I could see that throughout that question you were asking yourself whether or not it should progress or otherwise and what was right and what was wrong. You at one point said that you thought the simple question about whether he was acting in a personal or ministerial capacity was irrelevant because, clearly, if he\u2019d spoke about it in the House, he was acting ministerially. I wonder if you might consider asking the \u201Cprovincial champion\u201D to provide some sort of timetable for when he is acting personally and when he is acting as a Minister? Because our understanding is that Ministers are at all times Ministers, and when they are invited to speak somewhere as a Minister, they are accountable as a Minister for what they say.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000171\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00222c7ffbd40faf40758c7389003dbd8f0d\u0022\u003ERt Hon Winston Peters\u003C/span\u003E: There is no other authority than the member\u2019s former leader John Key, who made the very distinction which everyone else got but Gerry didn\u2019t.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000172\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002231e1cc6e0c024ea693089121ac13454c\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Well, now the Deputy Prime Minister will stand up and address the honourable member for Ilam in the appropriate manner.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000173\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022e6bb84fb09ae493eb3a85336a46f1a0a\u0022\u003ERt Hon Winston Peters\u003C/span\u003E: Well, which the honourable member for Ilam didn\u2019t get.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000174\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00225301f38ec8314adb91b18cc49b099a91\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Right, now, what\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000175\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00225a7535abfd844b24af2a38719725fd78\u0022\u003EHon Gerry Brownlee\u003C/span\u003E: A further point of order.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000176\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022fab78d5abfe349eb96ccffc41c6b68a7\u0022\u003ESPEAKER:\u003C/span\u003E No. I\u2019m\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000177\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002292f97a6a5c924567944da61a706aa146\u0022\u003EHon Gerry Brownlee\u003C/span\u003E: Well, hang on. If we\u2019re dealing with a point of order and someone makes a contribution on it, everyone\u2019s got to understand it. What circumstance is the Deputy Prime Minister referring to, because there was a long discussion in this House where someone can be considered a party leader, and the Speaker will remember those long discussions some time back. That has been a long-held tenet in this country that if someone is doing something as a party leader, that\u2019s separate from their other roles, but a Minister is always a Minister as long as they hold the warrant.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000178\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00225fcfdaadc92541c88eb876ad9ca9ec55\u0022\u003ERt Hon Winston Peters\u003C/span\u003E: The former Prime Minister Mr Key said that he was not always acting as a Prime Minister, and he gave examples such as when he was put the putting the cat out. So the very principle that that member outlaid to the House just doesn\u2019t stand.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000179\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002290f20898d36f45b1af664bb54cbd5cf3\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Right. I want to thank both members for their contributions. I think they have highlighted something which is an important issue and one which I think in New Zealand we haven\u2019t quite got our heads around. I was reminded earlier today of some comments, I think, attributed to the honourable Mr Finlayson when he referred to the Roman habit of indicating whether or not senators were on duty\u2014whether they were acting as senators\u2014via the colour of their toga. It mightn\u2019t have been Mr Finlayson, but in those days it was very clear whether or not people were acting as Ministers or not. These\u2014[Interruption] Amy Adams\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000180\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dc6c0f88-e781-476d-bca1-d1bf9b69302b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002200b78fcd1419473ab6f136e747157cc0\u0022\u003EHon Amy Adams\u003C/span\u003E: Sorry.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000181\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00227a48062f05e44bc3b6a76d2234680d70\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Well, we have had in this House some quite long discussions, I think without any real conclusion, as to when people are Ministers and when they are members and when they are acting in private capacities. It is clear that Ministers do at times act in all three different capacities. Clearly, there are things which they do\u2014especially those who are constituency members\u2014which they\u2019re not doing as Ministers; they\u2019re doing on behalf of constituents, and that is clear. There have been a number of examples given by Mr Key\u2014I think putting out the cat was one of them. I think there were some others which weren\u2019t quite as repeatable in the House\u2014and we wouldn\u2019t want to get into them in the House\u2014which were done in a personal capacity rather than in a ministerial capacity. So it has been accepted by the House previously that there are occasions where, effectively, the ministerial hat is taken off and people act in a personal capacity. But what I\u2019m not certain of\u2014and maybe we need to have a discussion at the Standing Orders Committee at some stage\u2014is to get things a bit more codified so members can better understand these things.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000182\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00224002e95a46c14e46a52cca80e6037ee2\u0022\u003EHon Gerry Brownlee\u003C/span\u003E: That process will be a good one, but it\u2019s a long process, as you\u2019re aware. In this case, Mr Jones was at a function, invited to speak, because he is a Minister. At no point, as far as we know, did he say \u201CLook, I\u2019m happy to speak, but I\u2019m speaking to you in a private capacity.\u201D, and if he was speaking in a private capacity, then clearly the criticisms he could make could stand, but certainly would not have got the publicity they did as result of his making those statements. So I think some sort of interim ruling from you about what is in and what is out as far as Ministers acting would be useful for the scrutiny of the House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000183\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022b55dc4faa38f49c28c279e83fa210eb3\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: I will see if I can get my head around the issue.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000184\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u002278a71abd5512485c86da527846e8d72d\u0022\u003EEmployment, Minister\u2014Funding for Young People Not in Employment, Education, or Training\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00226590faa0-f76b-4386-84f3-9b06296cc772\u0022 data-id=\u0022534ab5ca2c1544008a138d4f6e804174\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000185\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226590faa0-f76b-4386-84f3-9b06296cc772\u0022\u003E10. \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022534ab5ca2c1544008a138d4f6e804174\u0022\u003ETAMATI COFFEY (Labour\u2014Waiariki)\u003C/span\u003E to the Minister of Employment: What recent announcements has he made about young people not engaged in education, employment, or training?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022f317ee7d-f040-44ec-8f2f-ad0a9f206d75\u0022 data-id=\u002205f34cfa931b4c94ab3bd379a13a75e3\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000186\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f317ee7d-f040-44ec-8f2f-ad0a9f206d75\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002205f34cfa931b4c94ab3bd379a13a75e3\u0022\u003EHon WILLIE JACKSON (Minister of Employment):\u003C/span\u003E On 1 June, in Northland, I announced $4.4 million in funding to three community-led initiatives in Te Tai Tokerau that will support rangatahi into industry-related training and employment pathways that are underpinned by pastoral care. In the past few months, I have announced funding for seven He Poutama Rangatahi initiatives in Te Tai R\u0101whiti, Te Tai Tokerau, and \u014Cp\u014Dtiki\u2014some of the regions in New Zealand with the highest levels of young people not earning or learning. This represents a financial commitment of up to $6.75 million over the next two years.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000187\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226590faa0-f76b-4386-84f3-9b06296cc772\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00221d7da6aa31584992bf56ad290aaf84b6\u0022\u003ETamati Coffey\u003C/span\u003E: Why was that particular announcement significant?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000188\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f317ee7d-f040-44ec-8f2f-ad0a9f206d75\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00221a41d1c87a514760807c4ca2e738feef\u0022\u003EHon WILLIE JACKSON\u003C/span\u003E: The announcement is significant as it represents a shift in the paradigm in funding in that we are partnering with communities who\u2019ve identified the issues and establish solutions with a community-centric focus. This is dedicated funding, the first of its kind to address the gaps that our young people are facing. These regions have been clearly underfunded for the past nine years, and this is part of this Government\u2019s commitment to show we care about the ongoing success of young New Zealanders.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000189\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226590faa0-f76b-4386-84f3-9b06296cc772\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002296c9c25d3a874b148323c0f52a7fcc16\u0022\u003ETamati Coffey\u003C/span\u003E: What other announcement has the Minister made or will make about young people not earning or learning?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000190\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f317ee7d-f040-44ec-8f2f-ad0a9f206d75\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00223cfaf88e46a8429cadba03ee6d4617ba\u0022\u003EHon WILLIE JACKSON\u003C/span\u003E: As part of Budget 2018, this Government announced that just under $14 million has been set aside to tackle the number of rangatahi M\u0101ori who are not earning or learning and who come from our urban centres. The news gets even better, as this Friday, in the Hawke\u2019s Bay, I\u2019ll be making even further He Poutama Rangatahi announcements to a community committed to the ongoing success of their young people, and this Government is backing them all the way.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000191\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u0022de7419b07a6c4e90abd03efe4d2e0edf\u0022\u003EState Services\u2014Office Accommodation\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022 data-id=\u0022462d893e4c5745b5ac6c66be78bd45de\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000192\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003E11. \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022462d893e4c5745b5ac6c66be78bd45de\u0022\u003EHon Dr NICK SMITH (National\u2014Nelson)\u003C/span\u003E to the Minister of State Services: What advice, if any, has he received about accommodation for Government departments?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022 data-id=\u00226340e6ce542e427fa351d35fa4e20106\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000193\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00226340e6ce542e427fa351d35fa4e20106\u0022\u003EHon CHRIS HIPKINS (Minister of State Services):\u003C/span\u003E I have received a range of advice about accommodation for Government departments in my capacity as the Minister of State Services with functional lead for Government property. This has included updates on the Wellington Accommodation Project, phases one and two, and other opportunities to reduce the overhead cost associated with Government departmental accommodation.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000194\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00227f34b2e1b70c4ce394deba31d5415063\u0022\u003EHon Dr Nick Smith\u003C/span\u003E: Is it appropriate for a Government department to share offices with a member of Parliament?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000195\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002298af9f9857de4231a56fac3f47b48bf4\u0022\u003EHon CHRIS HIPKINS\u003C/span\u003E: I\u2019m advised that a story in a local newspaper has made that suggestion and that that story is not true, and that a correction has been requested.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000196\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002241b779da98394a5f953338f3a6c181ab\u0022\u003EHon Dr Nick Smith\u003C/span\u003E: Was it appropriate for the Parliamentary Under-Secretary to the Minister for Ethnic Communities to state in a story that the Department of Internal Affairs\u2019 office of ethnic affairs would be shared with a Labour list MP?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000197\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002280b7cf9ee7e74e9e80a20bd2698818ce\u0022\u003EHon CHRIS HIPKINS\u003C/span\u003E: I think the member didn\u2019t listen to my last answer. The story in the local paper was incorrect and a correction has been requested.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000198\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002247585f3c5cc2491a9b91b3bf2984d34f\u0022\u003EHon Dr Nick Smith\u003C/span\u003E: Is it appropriate for parliamentary under-secretaries and list MPs to misrepresent their political parliamentary office\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000199\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00224e11d38cbe154a99b9f1aa977b3be8d1\u0022\u003ERt Hon Winston Peters\u003C/span\u003E: I raise a point of order, Mr Speaker. The Minister has given two denials and has stated in the House\u2014and it\u2019s on his word, and his integrity\u2019s at stake when he says that\u2014that this matter has been corrected and that there\u2019s going to be a media statement to that effect. Despite that, this member has kept the same line of questioning as though the denial was never made in the first place, and he should be stopped because now he\u2019s impugning a member of this House without any grounds whatsoever.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000200\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00221a437e6102a04c4396f355e82adea4d7\u0022\u003EHon Dr Nick Smith\u003C/span\u003E: Speaking to the point of order, it\u2019s entirely appropriate for a member to ask questions about statements that are in quote marks from members of the Government. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000201\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022b263265245154fc78cdb2027fa3281fb\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Sure.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000202\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a7fdb3a98307453086b7f55d138b52f9\u0022\u003EHon Dr Nick Smith\u003C/span\u003E: While I accept\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000203\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002234b76bd765d546149ad01991934b38f5\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: The member will resume his seat. I\u2019m not stopping him asking that question.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000204\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022ad49868067374726815fb1228e9d89dc\u0022\u003EHon Grant Robertson\u003C/span\u003E: I raise a point of order, Mr Speaker. It\u2019s a different point.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000205\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002286bf6fdfeff646dfbe64fd7be381b9b1\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: A different point of order.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000206\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022c674d27f356d443c9edd688f6c54ee1c\u0022\u003EHon Grant Robertson\u003C/span\u003E: In the question that Dr Smith had begun to ask, the words he used were \u201CIs it appropriate for an under-secretary to misrepresent\u201D. My understanding is that\u2019s the kind of language that is not allowed in the House. You can\u2019t accuse a member of doing that.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000207\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022edf5d02d8d96410a9c2d7d4c15504f1f\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: You certainly can.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000208\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022baed9a8520b040bbb61f70c8ef313eb7\u0022\u003EHon Dr Nick Smith\u003C/span\u003E: Is it appropriate for a parliamentary under-secretary and other members of Parliament in the Government to represent their list office provided by Parliamentary Service as an office of a Government department to ethnic communities?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000209\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022609460efdba74d31a9f52e8941d46a2e\u0022\u003EHon CHRIS HIPKINS\u003C/span\u003E: I haven\u2019t seen the story. I have been advised that the story is incorrect and that a correction has been requested.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000210\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002291b68560b28245ca82c851b2b6ae4bb8\u0022\u003EHon Dr Nick Smith\u003C/span\u003E: Is it appropriate that when members of the public approached this office this morning, they were told that it was part of the Office of Ethnic Communities, when, in fact, it was the office of a Labour list MP?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000211\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00228e3e4362807543169383d767425f0405\u0022\u003EHon CHRIS HIPKINS\u003C/span\u003E: I haven\u2019t seen any evidence of that.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000212\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u00220ad24bb0c25a4f63b05242b9b3c488ad\u0022\u003EBuilding and Construction Industry\u2014Aluminium Composite Panels\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022859e13f9-33bb-41bb-b2f0-d848eaf25407\u0022 data-id=\u0022e4d5dd57e15d4097b16de24f9e331686\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000213\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022859e13f9-33bb-41bb-b2f0-d848eaf25407\u0022\u003E12. \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022e4d5dd57e15d4097b16de24f9e331686\u0022\u003EANDREW BAYLY (National\u2014Hunua)\u003C/span\u003E to the Minister for Building and Construction: When did she receive the peer review of Dr Tony Enright\u2019s report on CodeMark accreditation of aluminium composite panels?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022d14b1afe-2069-41e4-96fa-c8dc81a991a4\u0022 data-id=\u002223a8fb10671b4c0a8d208388a4321d71\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000214\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022d14b1afe-2069-41e4-96fa-c8dc81a991a4\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002223a8fb10671b4c0a8d208388a4321d71\u0022\u003EHon JENNY SALESA (Minister for Building and Construction):\u003C/span\u003E I have not received the report. The peer review of Dr Enright\u2019s report has been received by the Ministry of Business, Innovation and Employment (MBIE). MBIE is currently reviewing the findings and will advise me on its decision as soon as it is made. As the member will appreciate, when MBIE is assessing whether CodeMark certification should or should not be suspended, the process must be appropriate; it must be fair and robust. The safety of New Zealanders is paramount. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000215\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022859e13f9-33bb-41bb-b2f0-d848eaf25407\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00226e222b6cbf0c4db8a118b8d9dd16903c\u0022\u003EAndrew Bayly\u003C/span\u003E: When did MBIE receive the peer review report?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000216\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022d14b1afe-2069-41e4-96fa-c8dc81a991a4\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00221b338de72a9a470d80870a7dce4bb3cd\u0022\u003EHon JENNY SALESA\u003C/span\u003E: I can advise the member that in terms of addressing this particular report, on 1 June this year, MBIE wrote to the accreditation folks about this report, to give them a chance to respond to the report. This is something that, according to our Building Act 2004, is under the chief executive of MBIE to make the decision on that. In terms of the report, as I said in my first response, I myself have not received this report.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000217\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022859e13f9-33bb-41bb-b2f0-d848eaf25407\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00227cd15b89fbda4603a7d132db8cf3ae29\u0022\u003EAndrew Bayly\u003C/span\u003E: I raise a point of order, Mr Speaker. I couldn\u2019t have been clearer with that question, which was when did MBIE receive the report. I don\u2019t think it\u2019s been answered.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000218\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022d1817852e15a4caf8e747cad6b941d83\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: And if the report flowed directly from the primary question\u2014if the member really wanted that date, he would\u2019ve phrased his primary question to ask for that as well, as he could have. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000219\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00220b8972d3f3924f78b07d238b93bc4f3f\u0022\u003EHon Gerry Brownlee\u003C/span\u003E: I raise a point of order, Mr Speaker. I think, with all due respect, that you are not allowing the member to ask a question that flows from the answer to the primary.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000220\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00221efc5d098d2847b19e31ebb5a728bf8c\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: No, sorry. I let him ask the question, but what I\u2019m saying is that if notice of it is not part of the primary question, he can\u2019t expect an exact reply from the Minister. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000221\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022859e13f9-33bb-41bb-b2f0-d848eaf25407\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00221ad9362e44644a61af4ca78bae6921a6\u0022\u003EAndrew Bayly\u003C/span\u003E: Did the peer reviewer come to a similar conclusion as Dr Tony Enright, which was that the use of aluminium composite panels (ACP) should be suspended and that the accreditation of the product was not justified? \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000222\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002248f239a700c7480b88f198fdd9768d8b\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: I am going to let the Minister answer the question, but can I say to members that it is probably important that they listen to primary answers. When a Minister says she hasn\u2019t seen the report, asking for details of it of the Minister is probably not a reasonable thing to do.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000223\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022d14b1afe-2069-41e4-96fa-c8dc81a991a4\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022d572089c20fe47c091ffb94d2582bb97\u0022\u003EHon JENNY SALESA\u003C/span\u003E: MBIE has undertaken an internal validation. They\u2019re following a robust and legally sound process. I will be advised of the chief executive\u2019s decision on this very soon. But can I just refer the member to the Building Act of 2004, where it states clearly, in section 271(1), that suspension or revocation of a product certificate is under the product certification body and the chief executive of MBIE. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000224\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a1f7bbd1-b6ae-41c0-963b-dbe1251f5540\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022119d58be567242c09b4774bebd867333\u0022\u003EKieran McAnulty\u003C/span\u003E: What steps is the Minister taking to ensure building products used in New Zealand, such as ACP, are fit for purpose?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000225\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022d14b1afe-2069-41e4-96fa-c8dc81a991a4\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002218b230820fce40c9be2c9e143111e398\u0022\u003EHon JENNY SALESA\u003C/span\u003E: It is very important to me to ensure our building products are robust and keep New Zealanders safe. MBIE is currently undertaking a review of our building products assurance system right now. I am listening to feedback from the sector and people in our community who want confidence in our building products assurance system while also embracing innovation and change. All of this is in contrast to the inaction by the previous Minister in this area.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000226\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022859e13f9-33bb-41bb-b2f0-d848eaf25407\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00227485e709a4b54d97a7db9a3118941fd2\u0022\u003EAndrew Bayly\u003C/span\u003E: Why has she not released the contents of the original Enright November 2017 report and the peer reviewer\u2019s April 2018 report, both of which say the use of aluminium composite panels should be suspended? \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000227\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022d14b1afe-2069-41e4-96fa-c8dc81a991a4\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00220f4678e12dbd4abea98b04377ff13b7b\u0022\u003EHon JENNY SALESA\u003C/span\u003E: I don\u2019t know how much clearer I can be that this particular report is an operational matter that the MBIE has received. I myself have not received this report. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000228\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002260af336afea646c0a8d57bf20604b702\u0022\u003EHon Gerry Brownlee\u003C/span\u003E: I raise a point of order, Mr Speaker. You appeared to miss quite a significant flick at the member asking that question\u2014when the Minister said that there had been inaction by the previous Government. The Grenfell fire occurred in June of 2017. Reports were commissioned. We\u2019re now nine months away from the time that the Government changed and we\u2019re simply asking what has the Government done in those nine months. It\u2019s not unreasonable to think that between June and September, there was some consideration being given to this matter, which is clearly something that the current Government has to deal with. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000229\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022e1acc00c96ec4cbab656d295b4c3cc1f\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: OK, I hear what the member\u2019s saying, and if I was being absolutely strict, then I would have indicated that a Government question shouldn\u2019t be used to flick at the Opposition. There was certainly a flick in there, which was inappropriate, but if I ruled out everything that was inappropriate today\u2014thinking of the bench immediately to my left\u2014there were probably about five supplementaries that wouldn\u2019t have been allowed through. So I have been asked to try and relax and soften up and be a bit more flexible, including by people on my left, and I\u2019m trying to do that. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000230\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00229c0905c55c0f4ccf8729269196be7ac7\u0022\u003ERt Hon Winston Peters\u003C/span\u003E: Could I ask the Minister to ensure that when the report is complete, she outlines who the member of Parliament was who was involved with the launch of that company\u2019s product in New Zealand in the first place? \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000231\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00227d7ab77ab4794439bb38aed7a2a231ab\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Order! Order! That\u2019s not something she has responsibility for. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000232\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cbr\u003E\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n    \u003C/div\u003E\n    \u003Cdiv class=\u0022HpsHansard\u0022\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000233\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsProceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u0022b1f06c97e60346e08944973223a26f41\u0022\u003EGeneral Debate\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000235\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u0022a8c2616bab794ed9b911638103914e09\u0022\u003EGeneral Debate\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022 data-id=\u00225bd95aaf3eb546ffa142cb9581c14e92\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000234\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00225bd95aaf3eb546ffa142cb9581c14e92\u0022\u003EHon GRANT ROBERTSON (Minister of Finance):\u003C/span\u003E I move, That the House take note of miscellaneous business.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000236\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003EWhat a good time it is to be in Government in New Zealand, when we have a Government that has got ourselves in a position where we\u2019re managing the accounts carefully and prudently and making the investments that will make a difference to building a more productive, more sustainable economy, because that\u2019s exactly what the Government is doing. In the Budget that I had the honour to deliver, we are investing record sums of money in the provinces of New Zealand, in lifting skills and building our research and development capability, and in taking the necessary steps to create the economy for the middle part of the 21st century.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000237\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003EWe are a Government focused firmly on the future, and that future is more productive, more sustainable, and more inclusive for New Zealand. Sadly, on the other side of the House, the eyes are fairly, squarely fixed on the rear-vision mirror, and that could not have been made more clear than by the National Party\u2019s associate finance spokesperson Alastair Scott.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000238\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00227af2027cc42f4b2e8db14d0f166c43aa\u0022\u003EHon Members\u003C/span\u003E: Who?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000239\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022eefb2929070c44c09a296fc8e32d48bc\u0022\u003EHon GRANT ROBERTSON\u003C/span\u003E: Alastair Scott. So in last week\u2019s debate on the Investment Statement, the National Party\u2019s associate finance spokesperson uttered the following words: \u201CBut why should all our doctors and nurses work out of a building that\u2019s owned by the Government?\u201D That\u2019d be a hospital. That\u2019s why they should be working out of a building owned by the Government, because it\u2019s a hospital.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000240\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003EIt gets better. Alastair Scott, the associate finance spokesperson for the National Party, said, \u201CWe cannot and do not know how to manage $28 billion to $30 billion - odd worth of houses\u201D. Well, that lot didn\u2019t know how to manage them, but on this side of the House we do, because we\u2019re actually investing in them.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000241\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003EMr Scott, in his speech, then got philosophical for all of us. He said he wanted to know what the purpose of us all being here was\u2014what\u2019s the purpose of Government? This is what he said: \u201CIs it to own buildings? Is it to own hospitals? Is it to own schools and social houses?\u201D And do you know what Mr Scott\u2019s answer to that question was? \u201CI say no, absolutely not.\u201D The associate finance spokesperson of the National Party is now revealing to us all where the direction of the National Party is going: it is firmly in reverse\u2014firmly back to the old, tired ideological idea of privatising everything.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000242\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003EMr Scott wasn\u2019t finished. He carried on. His privatised paradise had more to it. Mr Scott said to the House, \u201CJust imagine if we sold $30 billion worth of housing assets and gave it to the 65,000 tenants and said, \u2018See you later.\u2019 \u201D\u2014see you later. Now, he did go on to say, \u201CWe will still look after you. We will still have wraparound services. We will still take taxpayer money to support those \u2026 most in need, but we do not need to house you.\u201D That\u2019s the National Party of old. That\u2019s the National Party we know so well\u2014\u201CWe don\u2019t need to house you.\u201D\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000243\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003ESo if we summarise the associate finance spokesperson for the National Party, his plan is we don\u2019t need hospitals, we don\u2019t need schools, and we don\u2019t need social housing. Actually, I haven\u2019t even got enough time today to go through all of the other things.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000244\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003EHe also described universities as being \u201Clazy assets\u201D for the Government. Several problems with that statement: the first of them is that we don\u2019t actually own the universities. They own themselves, and they\u2019ll be thrilled to learn how lazy they are all being. He also had some concerns about tarmac and how much tarmac the Government should own, which I found to be an interesting statement given the obsession by the National Party members last night to make sure they owned as much tarmac as they possibly could in every single part of New Zealand.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000245\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003ESo Alastair Scott, the associate finance spokesperson for the National Party, is now leading the way. Now, Simon Bridges did talk about possibly a breakaway party. I think the time has come for the \u201CAlastair Scott Party\u201D, and I know there\u2019ll be members all over that side of the House who will be dead keen to join that. On this side of the House, we\u2019re just going to get on with running the country.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002263776108-58dc-4cab-baf1-95282c61d0de\u0022 data-id=\u002261772537505a417bb439726782278e04\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000246\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002263776108-58dc-4cab-baf1-95282c61d0de\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002261772537505a417bb439726782278e04\u0022\u003EHon PAULA BENNETT (Deputy Leader\u2014National):\u003C/span\u003E Well, there\u2019s a vast, vast difference\u2014the difference being, of course, that the Government, in this general debate, thought they would scan around and they might try and find one Opposition MP that might\u2019ve said something that they don\u2019t agree with and they could try and stretch that out for five minutes, yeah? So good on you, you managed to find one that you didn\u2019t agree with.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000247\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002263776108-58dc-4cab-baf1-95282c61d0de\u0022\u003EMy list\u2014that I\u2019m going to try and get through in less than five minutes, because I\u2019ve spent 30 seconds already\u2014could go: Winston Peters, David Parker, Kelvin Davis, Andrew Little, Eugenie Sage, Shane Jones, Stuart Nash, Phil Twyford, Chris Hipkins, Jenny Salesa, David Clark, Iain Lees-Galloway, Michael Wood, and list MPs\u2019 offices. I\u2019m going to try and show the incompetencies of all of those in the short four minutes that I\u2019ve got left. I don\u2019t have only one to get through like they did, in five minutes of trying to find it; I managed to get through such a long list. It is a rich smorgasbord of dysfunction that is happening on a daily basis from this coalition Government. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000248\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002263776108-58dc-4cab-baf1-95282c61d0de\u0022\u003ESo, first of all, we have Mr Winston Raymond Peters, who continuously told us that immigration must be slashed by 30,000\u2014\u201CThese people were dreadful, but now we\u2019re in Government we\u2019ll just zip it.\u201D Of course, these foreigners that are buying all these houses and are doing such a dreadful job\u2014\u201CWe will do something about it.\u201D, he said in Opposition. Now in Government\u2014zip. In fact: \u201CWe\u2019ve changed it.\u201D It\u2019s a complete back-down that we\u2019re seeing.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000249\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002263776108-58dc-4cab-baf1-95282c61d0de\u0022\u003EKelvin Davis doesn\u2019t know how to house prisoners, doesn\u2019t know if they\u2019re double-bunked, doesn\u2019t know what he\u2019s doing in a tourism portfolio, and makes a fool of himself in select committee.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000250\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002263776108-58dc-4cab-baf1-95282c61d0de\u0022\u003EAndrew Little is one that\u2019s really up my goat at the moment. He can\u2019t actually talk to his coalition partners, work out what he might do with stuff that\u2019s going through, and then has the audacity to stand in this House and say that a sexual assault against a corrections female officer\u2014where her buttocks were grabbed for seconds, where she had time off work, where she was followed and intimidated\u2014is a low-level assault. Shame on him, and shame on the women of Labour who sit back and let him make those statements, yet would be the first ones to leap on us if we were to say anything even close to it. In fact, they go looking for our men to say something wrong. This was a man who said that a sexual assault on a corrections officer was considered low level, and did not consider and think about how women these days feel when they want to stand up and be heard about the violence that\u2019s happening out there. So that\u2019s one that I think is absolutely shameful.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000251\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002263776108-58dc-4cab-baf1-95282c61d0de\u0022\u003EEugenie Sage went out there and said \u201CNo bottling of water.\u201D and everything else, and we were supposed to believe that during the campaign. I was a Minister who was involved with the Overseas Investment Office and made the decision not to go ahead with Lochinver Station. She did not ask the right questions, she did not have a stance on it that actually meant something, and she could\u2019ve made a different decision but didn\u2019t actually have the courage to do so. I think that that is shameful, when you stand there.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000252\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002263776108-58dc-4cab-baf1-95282c61d0de\u0022\u003EQuite frankly, Shane Jones and what we saw today in this House\u2014you may find it mildly entertaining. You may find it embarrassing that the Prime Minister had to stand there repeatedly and say of your comments\u2014even though you were invited as a Minister and were speaking as a Minister at an event, you then, in this very House, where you are a Minister, made statements that are degrading one of the best companies that we\u2019ve got in this country, quite frankly. The Prime Minister herself has to say that you made them in your \u201Cpersonal capacity\u2026, end of story\u201D, and she had to say that a good half a dozen times in the media. It\u2019s actually\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000253\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f44431ef-b505-4e94-9f57-a60b0a569bf7\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00225b886f343cf34a85b5e101ad666116c8\u0022\u003EHon Shane Jones\u003C/span\u003E: Champion! Champion! Champion!\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000254\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002263776108-58dc-4cab-baf1-95282c61d0de\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a959952878ad449da867176c0bb1854f\u0022\u003EHon PAULA BENNETT\u003C/span\u003E: You may find it amusing; most of us find it actually embarrassing, but that\u2019s fine.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000255\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002263776108-58dc-4cab-baf1-95282c61d0de\u0022\u003EStuart Nash\u2014I mean, where to start on that? The changes for policing: I get that we come in and make our own stamps as Ministers and do what we want to do, but to actually go out there and campaign that we need more police stations and that New Zealanders need to live closer to them, and then drop that completely\u2014this is not getting noticed by the public at the moment, but, trust me, we\u2019ll make sure it does. Actually, what they\u2019ve done is taken away that every New Zealander should live within 25 kilometres of a staffed police station. I think the \u201Cchampion of the provinces\u201D, as he likes to call himself, should get on that, because I think it is an absolute shame that they will not be opening the stations that we promised them, and instead are closing them.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000256\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002263776108-58dc-4cab-baf1-95282c61d0de\u0022\u003EPhil Twyford\u2014well, let\u2019s be fair. He has KiwiBuild numbers that just don\u2019t add up and aren\u2019t possible, and we\u2019re buying houses instead of building them. Then, today, we hear about a list Labour MP who then brags in the papers with Michael Wood, saying that they are sharing offices and this is a way for\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022 data-id=\u00228ecf621ddc8b48bcb5d7efd540958da6\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000257\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00228ecf621ddc8b48bcb5d7efd540958da6\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Order! The member\u2019s time has expired.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022bbded2ec-ac25-4a73-a380-3f4d87693084\u0022 data-id=\u002220fa7f02344549ab9f3d36871a909aad\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000258\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bbded2ec-ac25-4a73-a380-3f4d87693084\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002220fa7f02344549ab9f3d36871a909aad\u0022\u003EHon STUART NASH (Minister of Police):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you very much, Mr Speaker. Well, what an interesting contribution. We heard the deputy leader of the National Party have a go at Mr Little, a man with incredible, incredible, respect and dignity and purpose, and yet when her Prime Minister pulled a girl\u2019s ponytail, where was she? Where was she? Did she stand up and defend that woman? No, she didn\u2019t. She thought it was funny. She thought it was funny. Well, I don\u2019t see any difference, and that member has the audacity to stand up here and say we\u2019re not doing anything for police.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000259\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bbded2ec-ac25-4a73-a380-3f4d87693084\u0022\u003EWell, let me tell you\u2014let me tell you\u2014that member is a former Minister of Police, and between 2012 and 2017, the police service numbers dropped by 77.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000260\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220e7e8da2-a6a1-41bb-aeb0-a49be255a293\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00220af6060db17547fbbe2922926f40c7e2\u0022\u003EHon Nanaia Mahuta\u003C/span\u003E: By how much?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000261\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bbded2ec-ac25-4a73-a380-3f4d87693084\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00229f3e7861fd44432ca99f3d9a8e461346\u0022\u003EHon STUART NASH\u003C/span\u003E: By 77. The population increased by 380,000. Gang numbers increased\u2014[Interruption] \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000262\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022209b2b7acf144501aae414aa2e014993\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Order!\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000263\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bbded2ec-ac25-4a73-a380-3f4d87693084\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022aeeaef64252e44339dd73e6a7a34a87a\u0022\u003EHon STUART NASH\u003C/span\u003E: Gang numbers increased by 2,000. Meth went through the roof. The only thing that dropped was the number of police in our communities\u2014the number of police in our communities. And, what\u2019s worse, in the last workplace survey, over 60 percent of police said they experienced an undue level of workplace stress and only 40 percent of police\u2014only 40 percent of police\u2014said that they were meeting the promises they made to their community. But the really good thing about the New Zealand Police service is over 80 percent of them said that they were committed to the New Zealand Police service and the communities we serve. So what we have is we have an incredibly dedicated group of men and women who are committed to our communities, committed to the New Zealand Police service, and who know what they need to do to keep our communities safe, but they just do not have the resources. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000264\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bbded2ec-ac25-4a73-a380-3f4d87693084\u0022\u003ESo what happened? Mr Ron Mark, from New Zealand First, and myself went around the country, and we heard this wherever we went: people respect the police. People have the utmost respect for police, but they knew that the the police weren\u2019t there in our communities like they used to be. So what happened? Enter New Zealand First and Labour: 1,800 more police over three years\u20141,800 more front-line police over three years. And that\u2019s not all: 485 back-office staff to support those 1,800 police in our community.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000265\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002263776108-58dc-4cab-baf1-95282c61d0de\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002225635cd5db9e4ffa9aa0aad549207416\u0022\u003EHon Paula Bennett\u003C/span\u003E: But no one believes you can deliver.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000266\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bbded2ec-ac25-4a73-a380-3f4d87693084\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002229fee2ae326f47f89c951f4318b7198e\u0022\u003EHon STUART NASH\u003C/span\u003E: This is about delivery. This is about delivery. What we are seeing at the moment is an immense increase in the number of police going through the Royal New Zealand Police College. Every four weeks, a new recruit wing starts. In fact, two weeks ago, the largest wing in over a decade, of 100 officers, started training in the New Zealand Police. Every four weeks, an amazing group of men and women who have chosen a career less ordinary, who want to go out there and keep our communities safe and make sure that New Zealand is the safest country in the world and cut the head off the snake that is organised crime, are going to be out there keeping our communities safe. So when I hear the Opposition saying \u201CWell, what are you doing about policing? Where are your targets?\u201D, I\u2019d say to them the number one target is 1,800 more police\u20141,800 more police right throughout our community. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000267\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002253f86481-33c1-48b2-893b-c11cc0bd673d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022f09530b9a9124114b59ec544cc328dd7\u0022\u003EHon Paul Goldsmith\u003C/span\u003E: It\u2019s the results that count.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000268\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bbded2ec-ac25-4a73-a380-3f4d87693084\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022d4a9cfd4ff5f4da49e317d79417ec8cc\u0022\u003EHon STUART NASH\u003C/span\u003E: And when I hear that member say\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000269\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002263776108-58dc-4cab-baf1-95282c61d0de\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022c54d370bdba74be997af52880df72a56\u0022\u003EHon Paula Bennett\u003C/span\u003E: Not lowering crime.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000270\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bbded2ec-ac25-4a73-a380-3f4d87693084\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002291b7f2d9a5ce4d37b464f3bc6bbf333c\u0022\u003EHon STUART NASH\u003C/span\u003E: When I hear that member say \u201CWell, the Minister of Police has dropped these operational targets.\u201D, my response is it is not my job to set operational targets; it is my job to ensure that the police have the resources to keep our communities safe. It\u2019s up to the police\u2014it\u2019s not up to politicians to set operational targets. It\u2019s up to the police, and Mr Mark Mitchell knows this. He was a police officer. He worked incredibly hard to keep our communities safe, and I\u2019m sure when Mr Mitchell was a police officer, if he had heard a politician say \u201CYou must do this from day to day\u201D, he would have gone, \u201CThat\u2019s not your role.\u201D\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000271\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bbded2ec-ac25-4a73-a380-3f4d87693084\u0022\u003EIt is my role to give the police the resources they need to keep our communities safe, and what I can say is New Zealand First and Labour heard our communities. We heard them say we need more police, and we are delivering the greatest increase in the New Zealand police service ever\u2014the greatest increase in New Zealand Police ever.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000272\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002263776108-58dc-4cab-baf1-95282c61d0de\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00226c6a510024a744a49dacb460e6029362\u0022\u003EHon Paula Bennett\u003C/span\u003E: You should prepare better, honestly. It\u2019s only five minutes\u201420 more to go.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000273\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bbded2ec-ac25-4a73-a380-3f4d87693084\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002212169895c13d456fb55221191b1f1335\u0022\u003EHon STUART NASH\u003C/span\u003E: And when we come to that member\u2019s electorate and open up stations, when we deliver more police to her electorate, then I\u2019m sure she\u2019ll be there saying, \u201CWell done. It\u2019s what my communities want.\u201D I just want to reiterate: 77 less police over five years; 1,800 more police over three years.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002248a02a21-c1ac-4159-8789-485ad614bd01\u0022 data-id=\u0022172c53106f754e5d892928648e4d97ae\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000274\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002248a02a21-c1ac-4159-8789-485ad614bd01\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022172c53106f754e5d892928648e4d97ae\u0022\u003EHon MARK MITCHELL (National\u2014Rodney):\u003C/span\u003E You know they\u2019re in trouble when their Minister of Finance gets up to deliver a speech and all he does is talk about our associate finance spokesperson. He doesn\u2019t talk about anything the Government\u2019s doing. They all stay in the House\u2014they all stay in the House\u2014so they can rise to their feet and give him a standing ovation\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000275\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022729b4ef8a8bf40e5a3deec5d634ee18f\u0022\u003EHon Member\u003C/span\u003E: They\u2019ve got nothing else to applaud.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000276\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002248a02a21-c1ac-4159-8789-485ad614bd01\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a8e90b118f31415a8253547dc85c1bec\u0022\u003EHon MARK MITCHELL\u003C/span\u003E: \u2014because they\u2019ve got nothing else to keep them going. This is a clear indication of how desperate they are and how bad things are. The most undignified thing I\u2019ve seen in this House is the Hon Ron Mark tripping over himself and falling over himself to get to Grant Robertson to shake his hand for such a great speech. It was embarrassing. He\u2019s had no papers into Cabinet. I assume that he\u2019s putting on a big effort to try to actually secure some funding to actually buy some assets for our Defence Force. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000277\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002248a02a21-c1ac-4159-8789-485ad614bd01\u0022\u003EBut I want to use my general debate speech today to make an acknowledgment. We always in this House stand and acknowledge our first responders, whether it be the police, whether it be the fire service, whether it be the ambulance service, or whether it be our front-line medical staff that are having to deal with cases that come in through the emergency department. But the one service that we don\u2019t really acknowledge, because they\u2019re basically invisible to us as the public, is our corrections service. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000278\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002248a02a21-c1ac-4159-8789-485ad614bd01\u0022\u003EOur corrections staff do an outstanding job every day of making sure that the people that can create harm in the community are actually kept in our corrections facilities. It is an incredibly challenging profession. It requires strong character and resilience to each day turn up and not know what they\u2019re going to face during the day. They might face a prisoner that is completely motivated to self-harm, and they have to show compassion. They might face violent prisoners that want to spit, kick, punch, assault, and attack them. They may even have to face a prisoner that\u2019s actually got a weapon, whether it\u2019s a toothbrush that\u2019s been filed down or some sort of shank. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000279\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002248a02a21-c1ac-4159-8789-485ad614bd01\u0022\u003ETwo hundred and fifty-nine corrections officers were assaulted between June last year and now\u2014259 assaulted or attacked in the workplace. The one thing that we can do as a Parliament is we can apply sanctions. We can put laws in place that send a clear message. I feel strongly that assault against a corrections officer is actually an assault against the State\u2014it\u2019s an assault against all of us\u2014and the one thing that we can do in this House is we can apply sanctions to say that we support corrections officers and we take it very seriously as a country when they are assaulted while they are just trying to do their job and keep the rest of us safe and happy.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000280\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002248a02a21-c1ac-4159-8789-485ad614bd01\u0022\u003ESo it brings me to a point that I want to raise. I was shocked last week when I asked in this House the Minister of Justice for two things: a definition of a low-level offender or offence, and a definition of a non-violent assault. The non-violent assault\u2014to be honest with you, I thought the House might pick up the fact that there is no such thing as a non-violent assault. There has to be some sort of force used, even if it\u2019s spitting. There\u2019s got to be some sort of violence attached to that offence\u2014there is no such thing. He stood in this House and he used as an example an indecent assault against a female corrections officer. That\u2019s the example that he used, and every single one of the members opposite\u2014and especially the female members of the Labour and the Green caucuses\u2014have been completely silent on this.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000281\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dbaac12b-3efa-4d95-a08d-f0f637a48bab\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002233581f8b02d1415da8bb713fb6c3c3bb\u0022\u003EChl\u00F6e Swarbrick\u003C/span\u003E: We care about outcomes.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000282\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002248a02a21-c1ac-4159-8789-485ad614bd01\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002279f677cff5c84b91a89353aabec995a2\u0022\u003EHon MARK MITCHELL\u003C/span\u003E: Sorry, who\u2019s that? The sponsor of the bill, the domestic violence bill\u2014what\u2019s she got to say about it? What\u2019s she got to say about it, as the great saviour and the advancer of these issues?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000283\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002248a02a21-c1ac-4159-8789-485ad614bd01\u0022\u003EI was deeply offended by it. You had the justice Minister of New Zealand stand up and trivialise an indecent assault against a female corrections officer, and I think that that is a disgrace. That message that should be sent from this House is that we support them\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000284\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002269dfdffa-4227-42b6-875a-fc8033bc25cc\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00228e7dc34315ec47e7807f10b15f64ad1c\u0022\u003EJan Logie\u003C/span\u003E: You are the problem right now.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000285\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002285e89e105955401cabd22de0c6550d8a\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Order! Order! Ms Logie, I remind you who you\u2019re addressing.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000286\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002248a02a21-c1ac-4159-8789-485ad614bd01\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00222b8059f10a9143258462fc7aa9ed4fef\u0022\u003EHon MARK MITCHELL\u003C/span\u003E: Thank you, Mr Speaker. This seems to have touched a raw nerve, and it should touch a raw nerve. Get up. Get up and take a call. Get up and take a call and explain, because I\u2019ve been inundated with correspondence from women since the debate in the House\u2014the questions in the House\u2014last week, including another female corrections officer that was also indecently assaulted on the job. And, actually, the result of her assault meant that there was a second strike against the offender.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000287\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002248a02a21-c1ac-4159-8789-485ad614bd01\u0022\u003EIf this is the only example they can come up with against three strikes, it\u2019s a terrible indictment on the fact that they don\u2019t have an argument against three strikes. Thank you, Mr Speaker.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022073496a0-73b7-426f-97f8-916bd542b0fa\u0022 data-id=\u0022162d3a195dd545f7a1b1d37e165c33d1\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000288\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022073496a0-73b7-426f-97f8-916bd542b0fa\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022162d3a195dd545f7a1b1d37e165c33d1\u0022\u003EHon MEKA WHAITIRI (Minister of Customs):\u003C/span\u003E T\u0113n\u0101 koe, Mr Speaker. I am the proud member for Ikaroa-R\u0101whiti. I\u2019m also a very proud Minister in this coalition Government. I want to start off my contribution with the closing remarks of the Minister of Finance, which is \u201CThis is the Government getting on to do the mahi.\u201D We\u2019re getting on and doing the mahi, and I want to just first of all acknowledge that in my electorate of the East Coast, as a result of the floods on the recent Queen\u2019s Birthday weekend that\u2019s just passed.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000289\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022073496a0-73b7-426f-97f8-916bd542b0fa\u0022\u003ECan I just say, in August of 2016\u2014again, in another part of my electorate\u2014we had a gastro outbreak in Havelock North, where 5,000 people were hospitalised, and a couple of people lost their lives\u2014a very, very serious incursion for the people in Havelock North. It took the Government of the day 10 days to come into the House to acknowledge we had a gastro outbreak\u201410 days\u2014and the only way that they did that was that our side of the House caused an urgent debate. We called an urgent debate, and then the Minister was forced to get up on his feet and explain the gastro outbreak. But on the East Coast, that I represent and I\u2019m proud of, within two days of the flood, not only myself but officials from the Ministry for Primary Industries (MPI) and Gisborne District Council were in the air\u2014two days. We were in the air to make sure that we were scanning the outbreak of the floods. I can say that although the flooding was quite localised in Tolaga Bay, the devastation that people saw on their televisions and on social media was devastating for communities and those families that lost their homes, and for farmers that are still recovering from those floods.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000290\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022073496a0-73b7-426f-97f8-916bd542b0fa\u0022\u003ESo I want to make sure that this House acknowledges the response in which this side of the House responded to those floods. I do want to acknowledge my colleague the Minister of Civil Defence, the Minister Kris Faafoi, for his attendance up in Tolaga Bay over the weekend, where he got to meet first-hand and hear from those that are actively on the ground, because this Government is about action. This Government is empathetic to the causes that small communities like Tolaga Bay and Whangar\u0101 experienced as a result of not just one flood, but two floods. I want to acknowledge all the farmers that are doing it hard.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000291\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022073496a0-73b7-426f-97f8-916bd542b0fa\u0022\u003EI want to acknowledge my colleague Minister O\u2019Connor, who, within seven days, called a medium-scale event. Why is that important? Because then that sends a message to the people of Whangar\u0101 and Tolaga Bay that the Government is caring about what\u2019s happening to them\u2014that we are unlocking the services and support of the Government agencies, be they the Ministry of Social Development, be they MPI, around supporting communities and families. It is important that I stand and acknowledge the devastation that\u2019s happened, and still continues to happen, to those communities of Whangar\u0101 and Tolaga Bay.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000292\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022073496a0-73b7-426f-97f8-916bd542b0fa\u0022\u003EThe other issue is around this Government being empathetic not only to communities like the two I\u2019ve mentioned but, actually, to all wh\u0101nau and families within New Zealand. Within our first 100 days, we put families first\u2014we put families first with our Families Package, which would see incomes boosted for 384,000 wh\u0101nau. So we talk about not doing anything of action\u2014that\u2019s what we\u2019ve done. We also passed the extension of paid parental leave to 26 weeks, we increased the minimum wage to $16.50 by 1 April, we announced changes to strengthen workers\u2019 rights, and we announced legislation to set child poverty targets.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000293\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022073496a0-73b7-426f-97f8-916bd542b0fa\u0022\u003ESo let\u2019s not kid ourselves in this House: this side of the House is about action. We\u2019re an empathetic Government, but we\u2019re also bound by strong, principled economic management commitments through our fiscal responsibility codes. We want to make sure that when we leave office\u2014which may be three, four, or five terms away, or 18 terms away\u2014we want to leave the books in a lot better place than what we inherited. So economic fiscal responsibility is a commitment on this side.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000294\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022073496a0-73b7-426f-97f8-916bd542b0fa\u0022\u003EIn the short time that I\u2019m standing\u2014engaging with industry is important. Last week, at the Fieldays, I announced scholarships for forestry degrees targeting M\u0101ori and women. We want more women and M\u0101ori in the forestry industry, so last week we announced that. I announced science scholarships, because we need more primary industry scholars in science. And I also announced the good employer awards. If we are going to recognise good employment in the regions, then we need to start giving that opportunity to celebrate. Kia ora t\u0101tou.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002253f86481-33c1-48b2-893b-c11cc0bd673d\u0022 data-id=\u002298c6dc7c038342c8bc420e2804abd11a\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000295\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002253f86481-33c1-48b2-893b-c11cc0bd673d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002298c6dc7c038342c8bc420e2804abd11a\u0022\u003EHon PAUL GOLDSMITH (National):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Mr Speaker. This Government, with its reckless disregard for the drivers of this economy, its arrogance towards its critics, its lack of self-discipline, its replacement of the previous Government\u2019s clearly articulated economic plan with random and naive do-goodery, is putting this country\u2019s economic prosperity at risk. A weaker national economy means fewer opportunities for New Zealanders. A weaker economy means young Kiwis will decide their prospects are better overseas\u2014quite probably in Australia, where the economy is picking up. A weaker economy means less money available for world-class healthcare, for access to the latest medicines and the latest technology. It means less money available to help those in need.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000296\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002253f86481-33c1-48b2-893b-c11cc0bd673d\u0022\u003EHow can this possibly be happening at a time when our terms of trade\u2014what New Zealand sells into the world\u2014is at record high prices? This Government needs take some responsibility for what\u2019s going on. It needs take responsibility for business confidence falling through the floor\u2014in particular, the measure of businesses\u2019 own assessment of their future investment. The latest ANZ survey, showed that the figure for New Zealand businesses\u2019 assessment of their own future activity is falling. It\u2019s now plus 14 percent, which is very close to the level where the economy is starting to stall, and yet Mr Parker, the Minister for Economic Development, says that\u2019s all junk\u2014it\u2019s junk\u2014and the Deputy Prime Minister, Winston Peters, agrees with him. It\u2019s junk. Well, the ANZ said, in defence of their survey after Mr Parker\u2019s attack, that it\u2019s a service of businesses\u2019 expectations of their own activity and that this \u201Cmaps well with official GDP figures produced by Statistics New Zealand \u2026 meaning it provides a reliable and robust gauge of business activity.\u201D So it\u2019s an unbelievably arrogant thing to say to call it junk. I mean, in effect, what he\u2019s saying is that the 1,500 - odd business people who are talking about what they\u2019re planning to do in the next year don\u2019t know what they\u2019re talking about\u2014he knows better. Their concerns aren\u2019t valid. It\u2019s no surprise that business confidence and business investment intentions are going down.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000297\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002253f86481-33c1-48b2-893b-c11cc0bd673d\u0022\u003EPrimarily, it\u2019s because there is so much uncertainty in this economy. New investment leads to jobs and growth, and would-be investors are keeping their hands in their pockets. Everyone I talk to is keeping their hands in their pockets and not investing because everywhere they look, they see uncertainty. They don\u2019t know whether they\u2019re going to be facing a capital gains tax or not. They\u2019re uncertain about the effect of the new labour laws and the strengthening of union powers, which are seeing strikes everywhere we look. They\u2019re uncertain, if they\u2019re a foreign investor, whether they\u2019re welcome or not\u2014and they\u2019re probably not welcome. And they\u2019re uncertain about the decision-making processes in this Government, as we\u2019ve seen with the oil and gas decision, where a major economic decision was made in the absence of any detailed advice and in the absence of a proper Cabinet process.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000298\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002253f86481-33c1-48b2-893b-c11cc0bd673d\u0022\u003EThey see an arrogant Government that has no sympathy with the wealth creators in this economy. We have an economic development Minister, as I say, who thinks that their opinion is junk; we have a workplace relations Minister who says that if they\u2019re worried about increased labour costs, then businesses are just not resilient enough; and, of course, finally, we have the regional economic development Minister, who goes around attacking business leaders and calling for their sacking and their resignation.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000299\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002253f86481-33c1-48b2-893b-c11cc0bd673d\u0022\u003EAnd, on that point, the most alarming element in that is the chaos that it points to in this Government. So we see Mr Jones and his leader, Winston Peters, in open defiance of the Prime Minister. Let\u2019s recall the sequence of events. He blurted out an attack\u2014because a few days had gone past and he hadn\u2019t been in the news\u2014on Fonterra\u2019s leaders. He had been warned by the Prime Minister before, when he attacked Air New Zealand, not to do it again. He did it again, and then she came along and said, rather hopefully, \u201CWell, he was speaking in a personal capacity, not as a Minister.\u201D\u2014remember, she said that four times\u2014\u201Cend of story.\u201D\u2014end of story. Nobody believed that, but at least that might\u2019ve created a fig leaf that she could\u2019ve stood behind. If it\u2019d stopped there it might\u2019ve gone away, but it didn\u2019t stop there, of course, because then, immediately afterwards, Shane Jones came along and rolled over that fig leaf with his steamroller and said\u2014actually, in the House\u2014\u201CI stand by all those statements.\u201D and continued his attack on Fonterra\u2019s leadership in this House, speaking as the Minister.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000300\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002253f86481-33c1-48b2-893b-c11cc0bd673d\u0022\u003ESo he made the Prime Minister look like a twit, he made her look weak, and he\u2019s done it again in this House, attacking Fonterra in open defiance of the Prime Minister. The only point that he\u2019s making\u2014the message is clear that the Prime Minister may be in office, but she\u2019s not in power\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022 data-id=\u0022168a184a2d34430a9632ac3788d0acf7\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000301\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022168a184a2d34430a9632ac3788d0acf7\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Order! [Interruption] Order! The member\u2019s time has expired.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022e60c1237-5e2d-4d0a-9678-ab10db67d1b7\u0022 data-id=\u00224d1361ccb2b84d9b9c73f3b0d918ab85\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000302\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e60c1237-5e2d-4d0a-9678-ab10db67d1b7\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00224d1361ccb2b84d9b9c73f3b0d918ab85\u0022\u003EANGIE WARREN-CLARK (Labour):\u003C/span\u003E Today, I\u2019m going to take a call in this general debate, and I want to talk about an issue which is actually partisan, and I believe it should be partisan\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000303\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022ed14dd32622842b087015fe88e2a320d\u0022\u003EHon Member\u003C/span\u003E: Oh that\u2019s a shock!\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000304\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e60c1237-5e2d-4d0a-9678-ab10db67d1b7\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022f2650744c329408190a2c75db5403294\u0022\u003EANGIE WARREN-CLARK\u003C/span\u003E: I know, it is a shock. The issue is climate change. We as a nation face challenges ahead of us, and we have heard the member Meka Whaitiri talk today about the adverse weather events that\u2019ve happened in her communities. We\u2019ve heard about these across many, many areas in our country and these are happening more and more frequently, and this is attributed to climate change. So I believe it\u2019s a really important issue, and it\u2019s one that I want to talk to the public and to this House about.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000305\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e60c1237-5e2d-4d0a-9678-ab10db67d1b7\u0022\u003EOf course, the Prime Minister, the Rt Hon Jacinda Ardern, has said that climate change is our generation\u2019s nuclear-free moment. Why is it so important to this coalition and, indeed, to our country? There are many reasons\u2014many reasons\u2014our Pacific nations, that are our close relatives, and there are also the adverse weather effects. But, actually, I\u2019m a fisherwoman, so I\u2019m going to, very selfishly, talk a little bit about the reasons why climate change is important.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000306\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e60c1237-5e2d-4d0a-9678-ab10db67d1b7\u0022\u003EI\u2019m based in the Bay of Plenty. I fish all the time, and I want to focus on the sea\u2014the effect of climate change on our sea. If we don\u2019t address climate emission reductions, this will affect sea levels. It\u2019ll affect sea levels to the point that our Pacific neighbours are not going to have homes, but it will also affect the migratory patterns of our sea fish as they move more poleward towards cooler water. We will see acidification in our sea waters, affecting our p\u0101ua and mussel aquaculture. Now, acidification is quite horrific. The effects on our food chain and, let\u2019s face it, our recreation as well as our industries are going to be horrific. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000307\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e60c1237-5e2d-4d0a-9678-ab10db67d1b7\u0022\u003EWe as a group need to address this matter. The Parliamentary Commissioner for the Environment has called for cross-party collaboration on climate change. We need this issue to be one that is not kicked from election cycle to election cycle. We need to act together, and we need to do it now. I would like to remind the listeners at home that there is currently, under the Ministry of the Environment, www.mfe.govt.nz, the opportunity to have your say around the zero carbon bill. It\u2019s an opportunity for all of us in this nation to have our say around zero carbon emissions. And I encourage everyone to contribute.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000308\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e60c1237-5e2d-4d0a-9678-ab10db67d1b7\u0022\u003ESo climate change and how we respond is something crucial to us all. But let\u2019s look at the last nine years. The Paris Agreement was signed in 2015, and 194 countries in the coalition worked on this around the reduction of emissions without affecting food production\u2014very important. We signed and the then National Government set a target of reducing emissions by 30 percent below the 2005 level by 2030, and then they set a 50 percent reduction by 2050. Well, we\u2019re seeking a new target\u2014one that is actually in line with global ambition\u2014and the member Todd Muller, in his briefing note of 8 June, said, \u201CWe are comfortable with our 2030 and 2050 targets. We will defend against any expansion in ambition.\u201D What is that about? We\u2019re behind in the world, and we\u2019re not going to have any ambition on this issue?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000309\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e60c1237-5e2d-4d0a-9678-ab10db67d1b7\u0022\u003EI\u2019m not surprised, however, because I have just recently seen the National Party\u2019s climate change policy\u2014and I\u2019ve gone on quite a bit\u2014but, remember, the Hon Simon Bridges isn\u2019t even sure\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022 data-id=\u0022d04c37ec235f4ff391ad13bdeba1f0f3\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000310\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022d04c37ec235f4ff391ad13bdeba1f0f3\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Order! The member\u2019s time has expired.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022e11a5f05-1940-41b2-8f1e-911dba7a43a5\u0022 data-id=\u0022d36fa66a2a8746ebb3a7889216564b19\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000311\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e11a5f05-1940-41b2-8f1e-911dba7a43a5\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022d36fa66a2a8746ebb3a7889216564b19\u0022\u003EFLETCHER TABUTEAU (Deputy Leader\u2014NZ First):\u003C/span\u003E Thanks for the opportunity to speak and make a contribution today, Mr Speaker. I haven\u2019t done it for a while, so it\u2019s a genuine pleasure to be part of the debate. Can I start by acknowledging the Hon Tau Henare, who was in the Chamber earlier during question time, and thank him for his contribution and his time in Parliament. Unfortunately, what it did in my mind was make me think of the National Party and the Opposition over there. It made me think there is\u2014or there was; excuse me\u2014a genuine contender for the Leader of the Opposition, and I\u2019ll tell you why\u2014I\u2019ll tell you why. He came into the room and it made me realise he\u2019s got more popularity than the current Opposition leader has. Internally, he\u2019s more well liked than the leader is. It\u2019s just ridiculous.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000312\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e11a5f05-1940-41b2-8f1e-911dba7a43a5\u0022\u003ESo that led me on to think: what is the situation in the Opposition benches over there? What we saw, actually, was incredible timing in terms of reinforcing my thinking, because as they stood up, one after the other, each of those factions within the National Party was represented by those spokespeople, and so it just goes to show you that everybody is positioning, jockeying, and putting themselves out the front there to try and be seen not only by the New Zealand public but by the membership of the National Party. So congratulations to Mr Mitchell\u2014good job! A bit intense. And they\u2019re probably way off the mark, Mr Mitchell\u2014probably way off the mark. Congratulations to\u2014was it Goldsmith? Did Goldsmith\u2014I honestly can\u2019t remember who has stood up this far. What we are seeing now is a frustrated and disgruntled Opposition.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000313\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e11a5f05-1940-41b2-8f1e-911dba7a43a5\u0022\u003ESo, actually, my point is a serious one, because what we\u2019re seeing in that are the backroom operations of the Opposition, where these factions are contending with one another. What that means and what we\u2019re seeing, as evidenced today, is a party that in their dysfunction, are not functioning as a true, strong Opposition. They\u2019re not doing their job properly, is what I\u2019m telling you, Mr Speaker, and the House. They\u2019re not doing their job properly because what we\u2019re seeing are petty attacks on personalities and people instead of a genuine contesting of ideas, of principles, and of policy, and it\u2019s incredibly upsetting to watch and observe from this side of the House. So, instead of debating the issues, we have dysfunctionality, and it is evident in the performance of the Opposition.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000314\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e11a5f05-1940-41b2-8f1e-911dba7a43a5\u0022\u003EWhat I would like to say\u2014oh, jeez, that took me way too long to go over that. So I was going to talk about their deputy finance spokesperson, but I can\u2019t even remember his name either. So look, Mr Speaker and to those members opposite, for the first time in nearly a decade, we have a Government that is focused on the people of New Zealand\u2014all of the people of New Zealand.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000315\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022275c91f8-c6b8-42fd-b3ab-d8fc000dd41f\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022fdcc175c1e7f4a5498170bf8fc574d85\u0022\u003EErica Stanford\u003C/span\u003E: All of them?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000316\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e11a5f05-1940-41b2-8f1e-911dba7a43a5\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022b3690fbdd3474220a607fdd9aaab62c6\u0022\u003EFLETCHER TABUTEAU\u003C/span\u003E: Thank you for reiterating and making the point to Mr Mitchell; I don\u2019t think he heard me. Thank you so much. [Interruption] Ha, ha! Yeah, he\u2019s not getting it.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000317\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e11a5f05-1940-41b2-8f1e-911dba7a43a5\u0022\u003ESo this is a Government that is about capability building. It is about, despite the\u2014was it\u2014Scott? Is it Mr Scott who was going to create the far-right breakaway party for National, the next leader of the far-right party?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000318\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e11a5f05-1940-41b2-8f1e-911dba7a43a5\u0022\u003EUniversities are important and they need to be invested in. Our hospitals are important and need to be invested in. Homes for people who are struggling right now, guys\u2014get this\u2014are important and need to be provided for those who are desperate. Flip that on its head and ask yourselves the question: if we don\u2019t do that, if a Government doesn\u2019t do that, what is the true long-term cost to the people of New Zealand, to this Government, when what we would be doing\u2014and, unfortunately, what this Government is doing now\u2014is picking up the pieces of 10 years of a party that refused to give genuine investment in the people of New Zealand who need it most, and at a time they so desperately needed it. Basically, I\u2019d better end there because I\u2019m out of time and I really want to hear what the Opposition has to say to that. Thank you.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002269dfdffa-4227-42b6-875a-fc8033bc25cc\u0022 data-id=\u00224c7d3c3ddbbc463eaaaaf863b821a4dd\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000319\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002269dfdffa-4227-42b6-875a-fc8033bc25cc\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00224c7d3c3ddbbc463eaaaaf863b821a4dd\u0022\u003EJAN LOGIE (Green):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Mr Speaker. I\u2019m feeling tempted to respond to some of the speeches earlier in the day, but I\u2019m going to hold it and see if I\u2019ve got time left at the end, because, really, I wanted to speak about nurses.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000320\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002269dfdffa-4227-42b6-875a-fc8033bc25cc\u0022\u003EI\u2019m the daughter of a nurse, and I feel as if I have, through my mum\u2019s experience, a bit of an insight into their technical skill and the physicality and the emotional nature of their job. I just have so much respect for the work that they do, and I really want to put it on record in this House that they have been, historically, underpaid and undervalued in our healthcare system. So, in the Green Party, we believe that our nurses deserve to be paid more. And we support their call for urgent mediation in their pay dispute with the district health boards (DHBs).\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000321\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002269dfdffa-4227-42b6-875a-fc8033bc25cc\u0022\u003EI want to acknowledge too that what\u2019s happening now is in the context as described by Richard Wagstaff of the Council of Trade Unions that around the world there\u2019s this wave of action from women, who are saying, basically, that they\u2019ve had enough of waiting for things to get better, and these women are expressing their absolute frustration with the refusal of the system to acknowledge their value. As the quote goes, I believe, \u201CWell-behaved women rarely make history\u201D. So I want to acknowledge their efforts in this current time.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000322\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002269dfdffa-4227-42b6-875a-fc8033bc25cc\u0022\u003EIn my experience, nurses are exceptionally professional, and their rejection of the DHBs\u2019 offer reveals how undervalued they feel after nine years of the health budgets just being squeezed to breathlessness by the previous National Government. So the nurses are standing up for themselves and all women, but they\u2019re also standing up for us as a society. Nurses are the largest occupational group in our health sector. We have an ageing workforce and an ageing population and an increasingly globalised labour market. If we want a strong and effective healthcare service, then we would do well to listen to what the nurses are telling us.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000323\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002269dfdffa-4227-42b6-875a-fc8033bc25cc\u0022\u003EI want to recall the interview on Radio New Zealand yesterday with a nurse, Kathleen. She\u2019s worked as a nurse for eight years and she was saying that she would benefit from the offer, with a 15 percent pay rise. But her concern was for junior colleagues, because at the moment they would only get 3 percent, and they are hearing on a regular basis from junior nurses talking about going to Australia because the pay and the ability to have a decent life looks better over there. She was acknowledging that nurses are working long hours, often they\u2019re in shift work, they\u2019re on their feet all day, and often they don\u2019t get lunch breaks. She\u2019s working most weekends and doesn\u2019t get to have a decent life and is struggling from pay cheque to pay cheque. And that is on top of increased complexity of their work, and the fact that, many days, they are verbally and physically assaulted in their work.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000324\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002269dfdffa-4227-42b6-875a-fc8033bc25cc\u0022\u003EThe nurses are telling us that we need to pay attention, as a country, to ensure that people want to go into this work and stay in this work. The Green Party thank them for their efforts for us to understand that and for us to have a strong healthcare system that we can all rely on when we need it. It\u2019s becoming clearer and clearer that the previous Government patched up efforts around health\u2014where they neglected the buildings; where we have mould in the walls of Middlemore and asbestos in Dunedin\u2014and they have been underpaying the staff, and that has put us to the point of crisis.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000325\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002269dfdffa-4227-42b6-875a-fc8033bc25cc\u0022\u003EWhen we hear Simon Bridges say that he\u2019s standing by the nurses but he just doesn\u2019t think that they deserve more pay, I challenge Mr Bridges to go to a protest of nurses and stand there with a placard and say \u201CNurses don\u2019t deserve more pay.\u201D, because that\u2019s effectively what the leader of the National Party has been saying. The Green Party supports\u2014we recognise it may not happen overnight, but we thank the nurses for their challenge.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002258eae615-ef83-4df5-bace-6749bdd312a8\u0022 data-id=\u0022838e2e479c574becaa882cead51d9fec\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000326\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002258eae615-ef83-4df5-bace-6749bdd312a8\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022838e2e479c574becaa882cead51d9fec\u0022\u003EDr PARMJEET PARMAR (National):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Mr Speaker. I would like to start on a positive note, and that is that I had my office\u2019s open day just a few days ago. I have to say that it went really well, as I have moved from 165 Stoddard Road in Mount Roskill to 68 Stoddard Road. So I want to thank each and every one that came to my office.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000327\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002258eae615-ef83-4df5-bace-6749bdd312a8\u0022\u003EIn those conversations\u2014they were casual conversations, but there were things that came out from each and every person that visited. People are really concerned about the consequences of the policies of this Labour-led Government. There were some business people, those who visited my office\u2014they are saying yes, they don\u2019t have the confidence. They don\u2019t want to invest more in their business. They don\u2019t want to employ more people. So that survey that was done for business confidence is not a waste of paper; that is what we are hearing on the ground and that is what the businesses are saying. So I ask the Government members to go out and connect with businesses to understand what they are saying.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000328\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002258eae615-ef83-4df5-bace-6749bdd312a8\u0022\u003EAs I am the spokesperson for research, science and innovation, we also talked about research and development tax credit policy. People clearly know that this policy is nothing but a copy and paste of 2007\u2019s research and development tax credit policy. The Minister didn\u2019t take any opportunity to do any homework to see what\u2019s happening in other countries. All she\u2019s done is copy and paste that policy and put that out for consultation.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000329\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002258eae615-ef83-4df5-bace-6749bdd312a8\u0022\u003EVery interesting it was when we had Estimates hearings in the select committee process\u2014Minister Megan Woods, she could not answer even simple questions. So I wonder if she has done any homework before putting out that policy for consultation. For example, I asked if she could tell me how much of that money that she has allocated for the R \u0026amp; D tax credit will go for existing business R \u0026amp; D. She said she didn\u2019t know. We know how much business R \u0026amp; D is there. We also know what they\u2019re proposing in terms of tax credit: 12.5 percent. She couldn\u2019t calculate that and give me that figure. This is because she knows that some of that money will also go towards reclassification of work as R \u0026amp; D.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000330\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002258eae615-ef83-4df5-bace-6749bdd312a8\u0022\u003EIt became even more interesting when I asked her how it\u2019s going to be monitored, and she said the Inland Revenue Department will be monitoring all the R \u0026amp; D tax credit claims. And when I asked if any money from this money that she has allocated for the R \u0026amp; D tax credit policy is going towards IRD, she said no. So no wonder that Ministry of Business, Innovation and Employment and IRD staff are planning to go on strike, because if you squeeze people for resources and funding, that is what you get.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000331\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022bd05436fb71f4e6ca73e8353155bc8cf\u0022\u003EHon Grant Robertson\u003C/span\u003E: Ha, ha!\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000332\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002258eae615-ef83-4df5-bace-6749bdd312a8\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022e1ea0000bb7342a89c476795eb0b4661\u0022\u003EDr PARMJEET PARMAR\u003C/span\u003E: Yes. It\u2019s not a laughing matter. That is what you get\u2014strikes\u2014because this Government is just squeezing the IRD without providing any resources and is assuming that R \u0026amp; D tax credit policy will work fine. This policy is so flawed that no matter how much consultation is done on that policy, the design aspects of the policy cannot be fixed.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000333\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002258eae615-ef83-4df5-bace-6749bdd312a8\u0022\u003EThen it became even more interesting when I asked about the minimum threshold. So the Minister didn\u2019t know what\u2019s in the consultation document. One of the officials tried to answer, and she couldn\u2019t confirm who was correct. Then we also see that there is a maximum threshold for companies to claim research and development tax credit, and how that\u2019s going to work? That\u2019s going to be at the Minister\u2019s discretion. So the Minister will decide which company will get the tax credit if they\u2019re spending more than the maximum threshold, and how is that Minister going to decide? We don\u2019t know. So the Minister is going to decide\u2014tick for one company, cross for another company. How is that going to be decided? We have no idea.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000334\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002258eae615-ef83-4df5-bace-6749bdd312a8\u0022\u003EBut maybe we can pick up some hints from how these Government ministers are operating, especially from Minister Shane Jones, as he\u2019s going around spraying the money that he\u2019s got for his portfolio for his political motivations. We need that confidence that this R \u0026amp; D tax credit money that the Minister has allocated will not be used for ticking and crossing the companies based on their own political motivations.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000335\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002258eae615-ef83-4df5-bace-6749bdd312a8\u0022\u003EI am calling on the Minister to stand by the Prime Minister\u2014the Prime Minister who keeps saying that she wants to see that her Government is a transparent Government. I\u2019m calling on Minister Megan Woods to make all the submissions public. And, yes, I understand some submissions on the R \u0026amp; D tax credit policy are public; that is because the submitters have made them public. But I\u2019m calling on the Minister to make those submissions public so that we know what businesses are saying, because we know there is nothing for businesses that do not have a positive cash flow. There\u2019s nothing for small businesses that are working really hard and contributing to research and development.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000336\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002258eae615-ef83-4df5-bace-6749bdd312a8\u0022\u003EThe uncaring policies of this Government are pinching people. But we know that this Government doesn\u2019t care about people\u2019s back pockets being pinched\u2014or even their bottoms being pinched, as we have heard from the justice Minister Andrew Little.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022 data-id=\u00227ab47dba4e154e7bafc26b106d914f6b\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000337\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00227ab47dba4e154e7bafc26b106d914f6b\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Order! The member\u2019s time has expired.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002202e74c40-9529-4e15-adc2-c032eadc2205\u0022 data-id=\u002236944be0c330416fbd7937401338da52\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000338\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002202e74c40-9529-4e15-adc2-c032eadc2205\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002236944be0c330416fbd7937401338da52\u0022\u003EGREG O\u2019CONNOR (Labour\u2014\u014Ch\u0101riu):\u003C/span\u003E I find the general debate a great opportunity to see exactly what\u2019s happening in this House. We propose; they oppose\u2014is how I would really sum it up\u2014and look, to be fair, it\u2019s their job. The only way they\u2019re going to get back into the Treasury seats is by pulling down everything we on this side of the House do\u2014to be completely negative\u2014and look, that\u2019s fine. There\u2019s some very able people there and they do it very well.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000339\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002202e74c40-9529-4e15-adc2-c032eadc2205\u0022\u003EHowever, what I\u2019d like to speak about today\u2014I\u2019d just like to appeal to those members on the Opposition benches to think about the effect of what they\u2019re actually doing in one particular area, and that\u2019s in law and order, in crime, and fear of crime. Now, traditionally around the world, Oppositions home in on the easy wins. They home in on those things that they can directly translate to speaking to the public, scaring the public, making sure that they\u2019ll come back and build up a picture of a country, of a city, or wherever it is actually in peril. The problem with that is that in building that up, it\u2019s an easy win, it\u2019s a damaging win, and it hasn\u2019t actually got anyone anywhere.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000340\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002202e74c40-9529-4e15-adc2-c032eadc2205\u0022\u003EI stand here speaking as an ex - police officer with 41 years\u2019 experience who\u2019s still very much involved in those who are in the crime scene. I\u2019m speaking about someone who I\u2019m trying to assist through a gang experience at the moment, who has just had a horrific beating, and through that I\u2019ve gained a reminder of just what we\u2019re dealing with there.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000341\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002202e74c40-9529-4e15-adc2-c032eadc2205\u0022\u003ENow, if we, and the Opposition, and as a country, become totally focused on the fear of crime, totally focused on scaring the heck out of the public, then what we will do is we risk missing some very obvious fixes here. Just throwing gang members into jail by itself, without any regard to anything else, could actually cause the problems they have in Los Angeles at the moment. Essentially, the jail gangs run the crime scene in Los Angeles. How they do it is because they\u2019re there for ever. They\u2019re never getting out, so they control it\u2014the authorities have no ability to control them\u2014and how they control it is that anyone who\u2019s going to start committing crime anywhere else in Los Angeles knows eventually they\u2019re going to probably get caught and go to jail, and they\u2019ll come under the influence of those gang members. So I\u2019m certainly not standing here saying \u201CDon\u2019t use jail as a tool to help control our gangs.\u201D; I\u2019m just saying let\u2019s use it smartly. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000342\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002202e74c40-9529-4e15-adc2-c032eadc2205\u0022\u003EWhat I fear is that if we just focus simply on, actually, irrational fear, where we\u2019re building a fear that nothing is happening and that every time, particularly, the worried well in some of our safer suburbs still believe that if they step outside they\u2019re going to be beaten, that there\u2019s going to be sexual crimes committed on their street\u2014which is not reality because, actually, crime generally is stable around the world. In fact, crime has come down generally from its highs, but if I could just focus you on one place where it did work. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000343\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002202e74c40-9529-4e15-adc2-c032eadc2205\u0022\u003ESomething that worked that didn\u2019t work anywhere else was in New York. I think anyone with any understanding of how crime and how policing methods have changed over the years will focus on what happened in New York in the 1990s. Now, what happened there was that crime came down considerably. There was an influx of police\u2014just the sort of influx that this Government is now contemplating and putting on the street\u2014but it wasn\u2019t just that that worked. It was how they used them\u2014it was how they used them. They actually concentrated on reducing the fear of crime. So the people of New York, unlike the people of Chicago and unlike the people in the other cities that had equal drops in crime, actually believed their cities were safer. That is where we\u2019ve got to concentrate our efforts. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000344\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002202e74c40-9529-4e15-adc2-c032eadc2205\u0022\u003EIf we are going to use the leverage of fear of crime, I would ask those members opposite now\u2014I\u2019m starting to run out of time, but I\u2019d ask those members opposite to do one thing. When you\u2019re sitting doing your strategy around your board, around your room, around your caucus, just be aware that by grabbing the easy win of fear of crime\u2014grabbing the easy win of grabbing headlines and getting out there and convincing New Zealanders that we\u2019re going to hell in a handcart as a country because crime is rampant on the street\u2014you will not allow the Department of Corrections, and even you yourselves, to make sure that we\u2019re part of fixing this. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000345\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002202e74c40-9529-4e15-adc2-c032eadc2205\u0022\u003ESo I\u2019m not saying that we don\u2019t use jails; I\u2019m not saying that we don\u2019t need jails. I\u2019m just saying let\u2019s use them smartly, and let\u2019s not, basically, disqualify ourselves from doing that by just simply taking the easy win of scaring the hell out of the New Zealand public. Thank you, Mr Speaker.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022943fd636-21ec-4442-9a72-68c49464776f\u0022 data-id=\u00229b1e21f4bca447b382d789f858254af5\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000346\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022943fd636-21ec-4442-9a72-68c49464776f\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00229b1e21f4bca447b382d789f858254af5\u0022\u003EDENISE LEE (National\u2014Maungakiekie):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Mr Speaker. I appreciate the opportunity to speak here in the general debate this afternoon. I would like to spend my short time here referring to some of the issues that have arisen in local government over recent times. We want our local government bodies\u2014do we not\u2014to be effective and for the public to have some trust and confidence in the way that they engage and the way that they feel that councillors and mayors, and even staff and chief executives, can do their job and do their job well. It is incredibly fundamental that we have that trust and assurance throughout the country, but I would like to say and suggest that it is even more so for Auckland Council. You might think that this is something that I would refer to, having been a former Auckland councillor just recently myself, but let\u2019s see what the value is for Auckland Council and why it is that we would undergird this particular local body.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000347\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022943fd636-21ec-4442-9a72-68c49464776f\u0022\u003ENew Zealand\u2019s GDP in 2017 figures is $270 billion. Auckland\u2019s GDP is just a little over $101 billion. That\u2019s 36 percent of New Zealand\u2019s GDP. So that\u2019s the size and the nature of the governing body that we\u2019re going to look at here just quickly this afternoon. So Auckland Council and their council-controlled organisation hold just\u2014if you look at their entire assets and their balance sheet, if I can put it that way\u2014around $70 billion. That\u2019s a very sizable entity\u2014Australasia\u2019s largest council. We\u2019re expected to grow, of course, those holdings, those assets, sizably over the next 10 years, if you look at their recent long-term plan. In the 2016-17 year, the staff at Auckland Council numbered 9,470 full-time equivalents, and, if you look at total headcount, somewhere to the tune of 11,500 staff. That\u2019s massive numbers. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000348\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022943fd636-21ec-4442-9a72-68c49464776f\u0022\u003ESo the importance of Auckland to the rest of the country can\u2019t be underscored. It\u2019s undeniable and it means that the governing body of Auckland Council needs to be stable, needs to be reliable, and councillors need the right information to do their job. This is not rocket science, it\u2019s obvious, unfortunately, that the current system does not seem to be working. We have recently seen councillors blocked from accessing important information, and tensions have been rising to a boiling point\u2014to such a point that it\u2019s come across and cut across here in the House in Parliament.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000349\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022943fd636-21ec-4442-9a72-68c49464776f\u0022\u003ECouncil\u2019s been in the news for the wrong reasons. It\u2019s something that I\u2019ve been through myself, but I\u2019ve never experienced the escalation that I have seen in the last week or so. Now, someone could argue that the timing of the regional fuel tax and the tensions there may be related, but I think there\u2019s a systemic issue here. So what\u2019s the Government done to offer a solution in this space? Little\u2014probably nothing.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000350\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022943fd636-21ec-4442-9a72-68c49464776f\u0022\u003EAnd that was highlighted when I asked the Minister of Local Government in question time yesterday whether she sensed any urgency to address this issue and, even gave her a solution\u2014in fact, two solutions, if you want to put it that way. One was referencing her capacity to use the Local Government Act 2002, where it states clearly, \u201CThe Minister of Local Government may\u201D\u2014and I\u2019m quoting here\u2014\u201Crequire a local authority to provide to her information on the nature and extent of a problem and how the local authority is addressing or planning to address the problem.\u201D Well, that sounds like an A, B, C way forward for the Minister of Local Government to have a conversation with Mayor Phil Goff and Auckland Council about the nature and the extent of the problem that they\u2019re facing. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000351\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022943fd636-21ec-4442-9a72-68c49464776f\u0022\u003ENow, there\u2019s another solution, and that\u2019s my particular member\u2019s bill. I have offered\u2014or I tried\u2014to table that bill in the House and that was rejected by the Government. That bill offers a solution whereby the Local Government Official Information and Meetings Act could be amended and, quite simply\u2014look, here\u2019s the problem. Why do councillors have to go through the same exact process as the public to get information that they should be entitled to, to do their job? It\u2019s not right. It\u2019s a simple solution.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000352\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002285ec30d4-6394-433a-a12e-2c4def705dd0\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002229fb5b99a62e4c70bce8b7e775bf001a\u0022\u003EHon Judith Collins\u003C/span\u003E: Get on with it.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000353\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022943fd636-21ec-4442-9a72-68c49464776f\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022fee2264497a34240a6ccbbf830c0867c\u0022\u003EDENISE LEE\u003C/span\u003E: You should get on with it. Pick up\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000354\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00223e511b38ea1c4a61951279278d5642e7\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Order! The member is\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000355\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022943fd636-21ec-4442-9a72-68c49464776f\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00224cc4674782fe4570a81a3c983e212d44\u0022\u003EDENISE LEE\u003C/span\u003E: The Government should get on with it. Send a signal. Pick up my bill.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000356\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022943fd636-21ec-4442-9a72-68c49464776f\u0022\u003EThe debate having concluded, the motion lapsed.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n    \u003C/div\u003E\n    \u003Cdiv class=\u0022HpsHansard\u0022\u003E\n      \u003Cp\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsProceedingHeading\u0022\u003EBills\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000357\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u0022ed6507deb6144b0fa016e8dcfa7a2a18\u0022\u003EImprest Supply (First for 2018/19) Bill\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000358\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u00229776f862f4074d32bee07790e04029f0\u0022\u003EFirst Reading\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022 data-id=\u0022c63a8b2cea344e9195ef5dcb0771743a\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000359\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022c63a8b2cea344e9195ef5dcb0771743a\u0022\u003EHon GRANT ROBERTSON (Minister of Finance):\u003C/span\u003E I move, That the Imprest Supply (First for 2018/19) Bill be now read a first time. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca id=\u002254198bb6b0f54d44a18e8ffcbf7bbd7f\u0022 name=\u0022division\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EA party vote was called for on the question, That the Imprest Supply (First for 2018/19) Bill be now read a first time.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EAyes 63\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand Labour 46; New Zealand First 9; Green Party 8.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENoes 56\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand National 55; ACT New Zealand 1.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EBill read a first time.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n    \u003C/div\u003E\n    \u003Cdiv class=\u0022HpsHansard\u0022\u003E\n      \u003Cp\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsProceedingHeading\u0022\u003EBills\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000360\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u00229c2b09ef46aa4cc3ab3f85ad87af376e\u0022\u003EAppropriation (2017/18 Supplementary Estimates) Bill\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000361\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u00229c2b09ef46aa4cc3ab3f85ad87af376e\u0022\u003EImprest Supply (First for 2018/19) Bill\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000362\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u0022ef9a48e940e04fe29645a61d78e2957a\u0022\u003ESecond Readings\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022 data-id=\u0022c98b121592ac46faa8de8d45f45ccbd0\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000363\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022c98b121592ac46faa8de8d45f45ccbd0\u0022\u003EHon GRANT ROBERTSON (Minister of Finance):\u003C/span\u003E I move, That the Appropriation (2017/18 Supplementary Estimates) Bill and the Imprest Supply (First for 2018/19) Bill be now read a second time. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000364\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003EI thought it might be helpful at the outset to let members know exactly what these two bills are. The Appropriation (2017/18 Supplementary Estimates) Bill makes new appropriations and changes to appropriations in the 2017-18 Estimates to reflect decisions taken by either the previous Government or the current Government since the 2017-18 Estimates were finalised in April 2017 prior to Budget 2017. The Imprest Supply (First for 2018/19) Bill provides interim bulk spending authority for the first two months of the 2018-19 financial year until the Appropriation (2018/19 Estimates) Bill is passed in August. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000365\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003ESo, just to be absolutely clear, what the National Party just voted against was making sure that there\u2019s money to pay public servants for the next two months. So just to be really clear on what the National Party\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000366\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022dd60341e47754ca2b646ca78b1b5aa8d\u0022\u003EHon Member\u003C/span\u003E: And beneficiaries.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000367\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022b2a195c16d4546048e5dc33b8f791478\u0022\u003EHon GRANT ROBERTSON\u003C/span\u003E: And people and superannuitants, and enough money for Housing New Zealand, and all of the above, is what the National Party just chose to show New Zealanders that they didn\u2019t want to approve of for the Government to have enough money to run for the next two months. Fortunately, the very unified Government on this side of the House casts the votes to make sure that passed.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000368\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003EBut the main thing I want to talk about today is the other bill, the Supplementary Estimates bill. This is, essentially, looking at what happened in the 2017-18 financial year that needs to be tidied up because it wasn\u2019t part of the original appropriations. Because we\u2019ve had a change of Government, there\u2019s rather a lot to do in this area. In particular, the majority of the large changes to appropriations and capital injection authorisations relate to the Government\u2019s 100-day plan, because being a busy and active Government who wanted to get on with the job the moment that we arrived here, there was a certain amount of expenditure that needed to be appropriated and capital amounts to be injected into the economy. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000369\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003EProbably the one of those that\u2019s here in this bill that I want to speak first about is the restarting of Government contributions to the New Zealand Superannuation Fund. So the bill makes the appropriation of $500 million within the Supplementary Estimates. That is the first payment from the Government to the New Zealand Superannuation Fund since July 2009\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000370\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00225c5051c0f54246539c5eb0c6cbe87e62\u0022\u003EHon Member\u003C/span\u003E: When?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000371\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00224d8e9d1a541c43cfab2a83f92dbe5cb3\u0022\u003EHon GRANT ROBERTSON\u003C/span\u003E: July 2009, when the last Government decided they were going to put up the shutters on Government contributions to the super fund.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000372\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022859e13f9-33bb-41bb-b2f0-d848eaf25407\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002279cb3d2c575240abb0c57e049375bb86\u0022\u003EAndrew Bayly\u003C/span\u003E: Oh, but you didn\u2019t want us to take on debt, did you?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000373\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00222c0ca76320d34e89a5b27ac172ae1e6d\u0022\u003EHon GRANT ROBERTSON\u003C/span\u003E: Now Andrew Bayly may be\u2014I can\u2019t quite interpret, but he may be saying there was a global financial crisis and perhaps that would have been a reason to have suspended Government contributions, and in fact the then finance Minister, Bill English, went on television and he said, \u201CWhen the Government books get back into surplus, we will restart these Government contributions.\u201D \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000374\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00220bee77be57f94fd4aa3b0bf62d87552e\u0022\u003EHon Member\u003C/span\u003E: Did he?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000375\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022f4aae5a74a4944e39f249319364a0177\u0022\u003EHon GRANT ROBERTSON\u003C/span\u003E: So we might have differed but that was\u2014it\u2019s in here. It\u2019s in here\u2014for this appropriation, the $500 million that we\u2019re putting in here in the Supplementary Estimates. The reason we have to do that is because the previous Government didn\u2019t put those contributions in. They said they were going to do it when the books got back into surplus, but when the books got back into surplus\u2014no Government contributions; not prioritised. So it is good that we are able through this legislation today to make the necessary financial adjustments to reflect that contribution. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000376\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003EThe Prime Minister and myself had the great honour of going across to Treasury and going to the big internet bank in the sky and pushing the button that saw that contribution go through. I have to say it was quite a scary moment, actually, just in case we hadn\u2019t got the right account number, because there was some concern that if they\u2019d entered the wrong account number, $500 million was winging its way\u2014actually in fairness it was $70 million; they do it in contributions.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000377\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002257e41e9d-285b-4fb3-847d-a63820ae7137\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00221d822a78008449c2afe9e77f248696a9\u0022\u003EChris Bishop\u003C/span\u003E: Don\u2019t worry, Grant. It\u2019s only money.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000378\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00220ad8a7bf3e944ce8bb50d64b5393653d\u0022\u003EHon GRANT ROBERTSON\u003C/span\u003E: Chris Bishop wouldn\u2019t notice an extra $500 million in the bank account out there in Hutt South, but the rest of us would.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000379\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003EI\u2019m sure the New Zealand Superannuation Fund\u2019s very grateful for that. What that means is that across the forecast period of this Budget there will be $7.7 billion extra going into the super fund. By the time we get to the end of the forecast period, the fund is estimated to be worth $63 billion. So the fact that the Government can continue to make contributions under this coalition Government, I\u2019m very pleased about.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000380\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003EThe other area I just want to mention within this Supplementary Estimates bill is the money that\u2019s required for this year to get the fees-free policy under way and going. I want to congratulate my colleague the Hon Chris Hipkins on the fact that he was able to pull this together so quickly. It relied upon some cooperation and collaboration with the tertiary institutions in New Zealand, and the amount that we are bringing across here turns out to be around $254 million. There are some ups and downs in terms of costs that we are expecting to face, but in terms of the 2017-18 year, that\u2019s what\u2019s required. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000381\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003EWhat that policy means is that we are opening up the opportunities not just for young people to go to university but for people who have never trained beyond school before to be able to take that up, be that in the trades, be that doing an apprenticeship, or be that in workplace training. And it is important to note, too, that because of the cost structures that are around apprenticeships, that means that actually it\u2019s worth two years\u2019 free fees for the apprentice and the employer. We want to make absolutely certain that we are giving every New Zealander the opportunity to train and retrain. This policy is an important plank underneath that. Yes, it will help school-leavers, but it is also about looking ahead to a future of work where we know people who work in industries that are changing, that are being affected by technology, need that opportunity to go and do courses and programmes. They won\u2019t be three-year degree programmes necessarily; they may be short, modular courses\u2014six weeks, six months. That facility is provided for in this policy and funded through the Supplementary Estimates that are in front of us here today.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000382\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003EThere are also a range of other changes here. The large ones that I should mention, particularly the reinstatement of the Main North Line in the South Island\u2014the $140 million there to help meet the costs, pending KiwiRail\u2019s insurance claim. Now this is very important because KiwiRail is going through the process of one of the largest ever insurance claims that New Zealand has seen for the rebuilding of that line. They do not have that insurance claim back, and the very reason why we have Supplementary Estimates like this is that we can provide that money in the short term to make sure we get on with the job of giving that vital transport link what it needs.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000383\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003EEqually, for the people of Christchurch, there is a transfer around money for Southern Response, who are the insurance body responsible now for all of the old AMI claims down there. There is a need ongoing for funding there and $137 million needs to be transferred across here. There are also the regular changes that are needed for things like IRD to be able to move forward with its work in terms of student loans and the capital injection that it needs as well.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000384\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003EThe other item I want to mention is around school property portfolio management, and this is an area where the Minister of Education and myself are well aware that we are facing a situation where the schools in New Zealand did not get the investment they needed for the last nine years. The Minister, during the Budget process, as he uncovered more and more about what hadn\u2019t been funded, has raised with me the importance of us taking a long-term view of how we make sure we have the school facilities that we need. In this bill here we\u2019ve got around $180 million being moved forward for the Supplementary Estimates to make sure that we are able to meet the costs of a number of school property projects where there\u2019s been revaluation. We have to do this here in this bill now for today, but it represents just a small part of what we need to do to make sure that our school property portfolio is up to scratch.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000385\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003EThere are several other appropriations that have been put in place here\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000386\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a1f7bbd1-b6ae-41c0-963b-dbe1251f5540\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00221be0244473e64d628af5cdeae304d545\u0022\u003EKieran McAnulty\u003C/span\u003E: What about tarmac?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000387\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002215f64e0ace26425681dfd0918c47d7a0\u0022\u003EHon GRANT ROBERTSON\u003C/span\u003E: Not so much on tarmac in this one, Mr McAnulty. That comes under a different heading. But here what we\u2019re doing is tidying up the accounts so that they are ready to go for the rest of 2017-18, and indeed the imprest supply bill\u2014that will cover us off for the expenses of the Government through to August, when the appropriations come back. I have much pleasure in recommending these bills to the House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022dc6c0f88-e781-476d-bca1-d1bf9b69302b\u0022 data-id=\u0022b28ec1750ffe45a69426dedba28bf622\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000388\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dc6c0f88-e781-476d-bca1-d1bf9b69302b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022b28ec1750ffe45a69426dedba28bf622\u0022\u003EHon AMY ADAMS (National\u2014Selwyn):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Madam Deputy Speaker. Well, I rise this afternoon, of course, to take a call in this debate on both the Supplementary Estimates and the imprest supply legislation, being, obviously, the bills that both adjust the financial accounts of the Government for the completion of the year we\u2019re currently in, the 2017-18 year, and then the mechanism by which Governments are provided with the authority to spend money for the first part of the coming financial year, the year 2018-19, until, obviously, the formal Budget process works its way through.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000389\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dc6c0f88-e781-476d-bca1-d1bf9b69302b\u0022\u003EBut in terms of this House and this debate, what it really is, in a more tangible sense, is the first iteration of this Government\u2019s approach to managing the books. It\u2019s the first iteration of us seeing how the Labour - New Zealand First - Greens Government is planning to use the incredibly strong economy that they have inherited, and what we are continuing to see is that this is a Government that is fiscally incompetent, that was not ready for Government, and that has not moved beyond the sound bites of policy. They have no substance, they are as shallow as a puddle, and as we work through the details and the costings of their policies, more and more that\u2019s becoming utterly and apparently clear. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000390\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dc6c0f88-e781-476d-bca1-d1bf9b69302b\u0022\u003EIt\u2019s very easy, actually, for politicians in Opposition\u2014as the Government were just a few months ago and as, frankly, they fully expected to be post the election. That\u2019s clear by the lack of preparation that they undertook. It\u2019s very clear when a Government hasn\u2019t done the work. We see that they have found it so easy to simply say things\u2014\u201CWe\u2019re going to build houses, we\u2019re going to plant trees, we\u2019re going to fix the world, we\u2019re going to house the homeless, and we\u2019re going to feed the hungry.\u201D\u2014and then they get into Government and they go, \u201COh\u2014expletive\u2014\u201D, and they work out that, actually, they have over promised, they don\u2019t know what it\u2019s going to cost, and they have no idea how to deliver. That is what we are seeing through the Supplementary Estimates, the imprest supply legislation, and the pre-funding of the Budget commitments, because that is, of course, what this bill does.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000391\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dc6c0f88-e781-476d-bca1-d1bf9b69302b\u0022\u003EIf you look to the promises made\u2014the extensive promises made by this Government in Opposition during the election campaign and in the Speech from the Throne\u2014they had no concept of what was even possible, they had no concept of what it would cost, and they clearly have no concept of how an economy works and what\u2019s needed to keep growing the engine room of our economy, to keep our businesses strong and productive and positive. You only have to look very lightly at any number of business confidence surveys to see the utterly clear message that businesses are sending to this Government: \u201CWe don\u2019t like what you\u2019re doing, we don\u2019t trust you, and we don\u2019t have any confidence that you\u2019re going to get it right.\u201D \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000392\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dc6c0f88-e781-476d-bca1-d1bf9b69302b\u0022\u003ENow, we have seen repeatedly from this Government\u2014from Grant Robertson, from David Parker, from Iain Lees-Galloway, from Stuart Nash, from Megan Woods\u2014that they don\u2019t particularly care what the business economy is telling them; they don\u2019t particularly care what the officials are telling them. Anybody who expresses an opinion that doesn\u2019t suit their ideology is dismissed and degraded. I mean, we\u2019ve seen the Minister of Justice, in the House, stand up repeatedly and say every single legal academic and expert in this country is wrong. We\u2019ve seen the Minister of Police saying he doesn\u2019t bother to read advice he doesn\u2019t like, that doesn\u2019t suit his needs. We\u2019ve seen Megan Woods say she\u2019s received advice but she just disagreed with it, so she ignored it. We\u2019ve seen Grant Robertson tell us they haven\u2019t bothered to get advice on the fiscal impact of one of the most significant announcements they\u2019ve made\u2014the announcement to end oil and gas exploration. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000393\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dc6c0f88-e781-476d-bca1-d1bf9b69302b\u0022\u003EThis is a Government that patently is not concerned about the long-term effects on the economy, and that should worry New Zealand desperately. It should worry New Zealand because in this legislation that we are debating, we are seeing spending being hard-wired in, in that age-old Labour way. There\u2019s one thing Labour Governments are good at\u2014well, there\u2019s two, actually: taxing and spending. This is a Government that is doing both.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000394\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dc6c0f88-e781-476d-bca1-d1bf9b69302b\u0022\u003ESo in the election campaign\u2014it\u2019s not that long ago\u2014we all heard Jacinda Ardern standing proudly on the stump, saying \u201CThere will be no new taxes under a Government that I lead.\u201D, yet what has happened? Well, they\u2019ve come into office; the Auckland regional fuel tax that was only ever talked about for Auckland is not only now in place and pushing up fuel costs in Auckland but, in fact, is staring down the barrel of every region in New Zealand, as council after council are lining themselves up to say, \u201CWe\u2019ll have some of that free money the Government is handing out, too.\u201D Quite apart from the fuel tax, they\u2019ve put up taxes already, in the first nine months, by $2.5 billion. That\u2019s what\u2019s funding the spending in these proposals\u2014$2.5 billion. That\u2019s only in the first few months, and that\u2019s before Michael Cullen gets his fingers on the full range of new taxes that he is looking at. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000395\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dc6c0f88-e781-476d-bca1-d1bf9b69302b\u0022\u003EThe impact of the policies that we are seeing funded through the Budget, through the imprest supply and begun in the Supplementary Estimates, are hurting hard-working New Zealanders. That\u2019s where it really comes home to roost. It\u2019s not actually about the economy or the fiscals or the numbers; it\u2019s about the Kiwis who suffer, and here\u2019s what happens: you have fewer jobs in the economy. Under National, 10,000 new jobs a month were being created. You take the steps that this Government has taken to put the heebie-jeebies through the business community, and do you know what that number\u2019s down to already? It\u2019s down to 4,200 per month\u2014less than half of the new jobs. That hurts Kiwi workers. It means less choice and lower incomes. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000396\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dc6c0f88-e781-476d-bca1-d1bf9b69302b\u0022\u003EWe know the cost of petrol is going up. The hardest-working\u2014some of the Kiwis who are doing it the toughest\u2014are now facing more than 25c a litre extra on their petrol under this Government. This Government, who pretended to come in and care about hard-working New Zealanders\u2014one of the first things they do is act to put petrol prices up when they\u2019re already going up. One of the next things they do is drive just about every landlord out of the private rental market and push rents up. You look at the change in rents under this Government. That goes straight to hard-working New Zealanders, the very New Zealanders that this Government told us they cared about. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000397\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dc6c0f88-e781-476d-bca1-d1bf9b69302b\u0022\u003EOf course, when you put costs up for business, when you put the minimum wage up, when you put the petrol prices up\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000398\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022977cccaf-581d-4f48-924e-32bf6c54a93d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022421b585c8cc046859a92586961a344e9\u0022\u003EDEPUTY SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: I\u2019m not doing any of that.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000399\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dc6c0f88-e781-476d-bca1-d1bf9b69302b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022251913111322454589384074646523c6\u0022\u003EHon AMY ADAMS\u003C/span\u003E: \u2014when the Government puts the cost of transport up, the very thing that happens is the cost of goods goes up. So New Zealand families, and those particularly at the lower end who are struggling to get by, they lost the tax cut that the National Government had put in place for them, they lost the strong, growing economy that the National Government had in place, and they lost the fact that 10,000 new jobs a month were being created. What have they had so far? They\u2019ve had higher petrol prices, they\u2019ve had more taxes, they\u2019ve had higher rents, and they\u2019ve had higher costs of living. That is the reality of this Government when you get past the sound bites. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000400\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dc6c0f88-e781-476d-bca1-d1bf9b69302b\u0022\u003EI want to look at some of the other spending initiatives we\u2019ve seen in these pieces of legislation, and I want to start with one of the ones that the Minister of Finance talked about in his contribution. He trumpeted proudly that Labour were going to put money back into the New Zealand Superannuation Fund. Here\u2019s what he didn\u2019t say: Labour are borrowing to play the stock market.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000401\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dc6c0f88-e781-476d-bca1-d1bf9b69302b\u0022\u003EThe money going into the Cullen fund is being borrowed. How many financial advisers in New Zealand would say to New Zealanders, \u201CWhat you should do is rack up some debt and go and play the stock market.\u201D? Hardly any. \u201CNot many, if any\u201D\u2014to quote Scribe\u2014I would suggest. Yet Grant Robertson thinks that that\u2019s an excellent way to play with New Zealand\u2019s finances.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000402\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dc6c0f88-e781-476d-bca1-d1bf9b69302b\u0022\u003EHe is borrowing money to play the stock market, and he stands in this House and says, effectively\u2014and I paraphrase\u2014\u201CAren\u2019t I wonderful?\u201D That\u2019s what he\u2019s saying. Well, actually, no, Mr Robertson; you\u2019re not. Running up more debt, increasing our debt in real terms when the economy should be growing well, when it should be in the best financial times, and when it has got some of the best terms of trade we\u2019ve seen for many years, is a nonsense. It is a nonsense to be putting up taxes, to be raising debt while the economy is so strong\u2014and why? They overpromised, they didn\u2019t understand the cost of the promises they were making, they paid far too much of a dowry for Mr Peters and his ensemble, and now the chickens are coming home to roost. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000403\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dc6c0f88-e781-476d-bca1-d1bf9b69302b\u0022\u003EIf there was any truth whatsoever in this nonsense that they are peddling about some crisis in underfunding, why have they funded less into health than National did? Why have they funded less in education than National did? The operational grants for schools are lower this year than they were under National. The increase in district health board funding, as a percentage, is lower this year than it was under National. The total funding to health is lower this year than it was under National last year, and, in fact, it will be lower every year for the next four years. That is not a crisis in underfunding. The same is true in infrastructure spending. We keep hearing about the infrastructure deficit that somehow they need to fix. There is less money in this Budget going into infrastructure than under the National Government. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000404\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dc6c0f88-e781-476d-bca1-d1bf9b69302b\u0022\u003EThe Labour Government want to talk about nine years they have to fix. I would suggest to them that they have inherited one of the best economies in the world, and in nine months they have already shown very strong signs that they fully intend to break it and hurt New Zealanders. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00222aa0b524-c38d-45aa-bd5b-99c5927085f4\u0022 data-id=\u00226bc18c37425d4902bae056f40e161485\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000405\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00222aa0b524-c38d-45aa-bd5b-99c5927085f4\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00226bc18c37425d4902bae056f40e161485\u0022\u003EHon CLARE CURRAN (Minister for Government Digital Services):\u003C/span\u003E Well, here we are hearing from the Opposition, the Opposition with a very large chip on its shoulder, repeating the tired old lines\u2014the tired old lines that certainly aren\u2019t resonating and that keep changing. They keep changing. They can\u2019t have it both ways. We\u2019re either taxing or spending, or we\u2019re not doing anything. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000406\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00222aa0b524-c38d-45aa-bd5b-99c5927085f4\u0022\u003EI\u2019m so proud to be standing up here and talking about this Budget and the Supplementary Estimates. I want to start off with education, as well, because this is $310 million authorised for the implementation of that first-year fees-free policy for post - secondary education. It is one of the most fundamentally important changes\u2014and we\u2019ve got a number of them\u2014that this Government has introduced. It\u2019s just the beginning. It\u2019s the beginning of a much bigger strategy around the importance of lifelong learning. That previous Government, now that Opposition with a big chip on its shoulder, could never think beyond a year or two ahead. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000407\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00222aa0b524-c38d-45aa-bd5b-99c5927085f4\u0022\u003EThis Government is thinking about the big picture. It\u2019s putting in place the foundations for the future for rebuilding the critical public services, for building a strong economy, but it\u2019s doing a lot more than that. It\u2019s actually thinking about what the shape of the future is going to look like in the near to medium term. It\u2019s making sure that we\u2019re putting in place now the ability for people not to be left high and dry and for people to be able to continue to learn and to build the skill sets that are needed for the jobs of the future, so that we\u2019re not having major disruptions in our country and in our society. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000408\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00222aa0b524-c38d-45aa-bd5b-99c5927085f4\u0022\u003EThat\u2019s why I\u2019m so proud of that policy that was put in by the Hon Chris Hipkins in post - secondary school education, which isn\u2019t just about kids going to university or polytech. It\u2019s about people going and doing trade apprenticeships, but it\u2019s also about people who are in the workforce now having the option and having the ability and the encouragement to be able to go and retrain for the jobs of the future, so that they can have a future. I feel incredibly proud of that. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000409\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00222aa0b524-c38d-45aa-bd5b-99c5927085f4\u0022\u003EOur productivity story over the last decade has been woeful. One of the biggest issues that emerged under that previous Government was our low productivity and our lack of ability to be thinking about where the value-add in our economy needed to be and what were the things that needed to be done and be put in place for that. That Government never went there\u2014never went there. This Government is putting in place the foundations so that we can boost our productivity. We can do that volume-to-value story that will mean that our children and our grandchildren will benefit from that. It will be a much stronger economy and a much more unified and inclusive society, and we\u2019re rebuilding critical public services at the same time. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000410\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00222aa0b524-c38d-45aa-bd5b-99c5927085f4\u0022\u003EI heard the comments made by Amy Adams around putting money back into the New Zealand Superannuation Fund. What New Zealanders can do is trust that this coalition Government is safeguarding the future of superannuation. How can they argue that we are not doing that? This, again, goes to longer-term thinking, which is something that New Zealanders have been crying out for. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000411\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00222aa0b524-c38d-45aa-bd5b-99c5927085f4\u0022\u003EI give speech after speech after speech to business audiences in this country, and what they are crying out for is a plan and to know that there is a Government with a plan. [Interruption] Oh, they\u2019re laughing because they consider that the new economy is not\u2014are they not effective businesses? Are they not the businesses of the future? What they want is a Government that listens, a Government that\u2019s prepared to work with them, and a Government that has a plan, and that\u2019s what this Government has. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000412\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00222aa0b524-c38d-45aa-bd5b-99c5927085f4\u0022\u003ENew Zealanders can trust this coalition Government. It was Michael Cullen who set that fund up and it\u2019s Grant Robertson who has resumed those contributions after Bill English and Steven Joyce ignored it, and that is the hallmark, that is the legacy, of that previous Government. It is that they ignored the future. That decision by National meant that we forwent more than $23 billion for the Superannuation Fund over that period. Our plan for the Superannuation Fund is to contribute $7.7 billion over the next five years, with $500 million in 2017-18, and I\u2019m really proud to be part of the Government that has done that. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000413\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00222aa0b524-c38d-45aa-bd5b-99c5927085f4\u0022\u003EOn the infrastructure deficit, the infrastructure deficit from the previous Government\u2014the national housing crisis is just a part of that. The infrastructure deficit in education and in local government and the lack, again, of a plan and a lack of forward thinking\u2014we are putting in place the foundations for the future. This Supplementary Estimates bill invests $600 million to invest in the water and roading infrastructure to support the increase in housing supply. Under our infrastructure spending, this Government will invest $42 billion\u2014that\u2019s $42 billion\u2014in new capital and infrastructure over the next five years. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000414\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00222aa0b524-c38d-45aa-bd5b-99c5927085f4\u0022\u003EThat previous speaker, Amy Adams, had the temerity to get up and say that this Government was not investing as much in infrastructure as they did\u2014$42 billion over the next five years is a Government that has a plan and is putting in place the foundations for the future. We are absolutely committed, and that is what is resonating out there, because people know that this Government will rebuild critical public services and will put in place the foundations for a strong economy. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000415\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00222aa0b524-c38d-45aa-bd5b-99c5927085f4\u0022\u003EIn the regions, lifting regional productivity\u2014well, my goodness, where was that? Where was the impetus for that under the previous Government? This bill appropriates $124 million to lift regional productivity through the Provincial Growth Fund. This Government is addressing regional productivity\u2014something that that previous Government neglected for far too long. You see it everywhere you go around the country, and you also see the people and the communities that are just so thankful that they have finally got a Government that is listening and a Government that is enabling regional productivity to be a priority and that is seeing the value in regional New Zealand. The $1 billion per year Provincial Growth Fund\u2014it\u2019s the biggest fund of its type in the world per head of population. It represents the biggest investment in our regions in our lifetimes. What that is demonstrating is true leadership as we roll out our plan to make New Zealand\u2019s economy more productive, more sustainable, and more inclusive. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000416\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00222aa0b524-c38d-45aa-bd5b-99c5927085f4\u0022\u003EThis Government had a 100-day plan, which it delivered on. We\u2019ve delivered a Budget which puts in place the foundations\u2014the true foundations\u2014for a strong, productive, sustainable economy and to rebuild critical services, which resonates with New Zealanders all around New Zealand. We have put a value on regional New Zealand, we\u2019ve put a value on housing, we\u2019ve put a value on education\u2014particularly on lifelong learning\u2014and we\u2019ve put a value on health and the need in health to rebuild critical services in health. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000417\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00222aa0b524-c38d-45aa-bd5b-99c5927085f4\u0022\u003EI\u2019m proud to be part of this coalition Government, I\u2019m proud to be speaking on these Supplementary Estimates, and I\u2019m proud that this country can have a future for everyone, because everyone is included in this Government. It\u2019s a Government for everyone, not just for a few. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002285ec30d4-6394-433a-a12e-2c4def705dd0\u0022 data-id=\u0022f0a196a448a94c89bae4e0b81ecd0fac\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000418\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002285ec30d4-6394-433a-a12e-2c4def705dd0\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022f0a196a448a94c89bae4e0b81ecd0fac\u0022\u003EHon JUDITH COLLINS (National\u2014Papakura):\u003C/span\u003E Oh, that was a long 10 minutes\u2014that was too long for 10 minutes. Actually, the member who\u2019s resumed her seat is the Minister for broadcasting, and I did not hear her mention one word about the $38 million of funding boost for Radio New Zealand that that Government promised and has not delivered on. Thirty eight million dollars\u2014another broken promise.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000419\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002285ec30d4-6394-433a-a12e-2c4def705dd0\u0022\u003EI actually think it\u2019s an indication of the quality of the Government that the Hon Clare Curran was the second speaker in this debate. I think it pays some tribute to the Hon Clare Curran, but it doesn\u2019t pay much tribute to the Government. And to hear her say that the Labour, New Zealand First, Green Government has provided certainty for the provinces\u2014well, they\u2019ve certainly given a lot of certainty to Taranaki! They\u2019ve, basically, stuffed their economy.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000420\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002285ec30d4-6394-433a-a12e-2c4def705dd0\u0022\u003EThey\u2019ve gone after farmers. They\u2019ve gone after anything that makes money. They\u2019ve spent years talking about dirty dairying. They\u2019ve gone after oil and gas. They\u2019ve taken an industry which has been the biggest payer in terms of wages to ordinary Kiwis who work in that industry of oil and gas, and they have gutted it. And they can sit here today talking about the provinces\u2014they wouldn\u2019t know how to spell it, and that\u2019s the problem.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000421\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002285ec30d4-6394-433a-a12e-2c4def705dd0\u0022\u003ESo you\u2019ve got here a Government\u2014I think, quite unkindly, called the accidental Government\u2014and they promised so big on the election trail and they delivered so little, and I thought in quite a cynical way, really. So if you look at, for instance, the previous speaker from the Government, the Hon Grant Robertson, Minister of Finance\u2014which I have to say does send shivers down most people\u2019s spine who know anything about finance\u2014he cynically stood up in the House today and he said of us in the Opposition, \u201CWell, they\u2019re not voting for this bill. Therefore, they\u2019re not voting for wages for nurses.\u201D I have no idea why he said that.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000422\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002285ec30d4-6394-433a-a12e-2c4def705dd0\u0022\u003EI looked on my media indications from the Google people, and guess what? The nurses are striking. I didn\u2019t see the nurses striking under a National-led Government; I see them striking under a Labour, New Zealand First, and Greens Government. I didn\u2019t see teachers striking under National, and yet we see teachers striking under this Government. We\u2019ve got strikes happening in the transport sector, in public transport in Wellington and in Auckland, and that\u2019s happened under a Labour, New Zealand First, and Greens Government.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000423\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002285ec30d4-6394-433a-a12e-2c4def705dd0\u0022\u003EThe people striking are the very people who thought that this Government was going to deliver for them, and their response to this Government and their Budget, which would have to be the biggest flop Budget ever\u2014this dud Budget\u2014has been to go on strike. If we all know nurses, in our families and elsewhere, they are the most dedicated people to their work, and for them to give strike notice, it says a lot.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000424\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002285ec30d4-6394-433a-a12e-2c4def705dd0\u0022\u003EHaving listened the other day to one of the people who are leading this particular strike for the nurses, the comment was this: \u201CThe Nurses Organisation\u201D\u2014in other words, the union\u2014\u201Chave been promising all sorts of things that were going to happen under Labour. The only thing that\u2019s happened is we\u2019ve had to strike.\u201D, and that sums it up.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000425\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002285ec30d4-6394-433a-a12e-2c4def705dd0\u0022\u003EThen, of course, this Budget is also a big $2 billion for KiwiBuild, which, it turns out, is \u201CKiwiBuy\u201D off the plans from a few developers, hope they know how to build properly, hope they don\u2019t go broke halfway through the build, hope we haven\u2019t given them too much money up front, and hope it\u2019s going to be all right\u2014Phil Twyford, KiwiBuild\u2014and it\u2019s just amazing. So we are now, what, eight or nine months into this Government, and how many of these 100,000 houses that were promised have been built? How many? Any number?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000426\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002292824476-4e66-4052-8435-b049833d8b83\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00222049c732131a4338ba78ef42d4c462f2\u0022\u003EHon Nicky Wagner\u003C/span\u003E: Zero.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000427\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002285ec30d4-6394-433a-a12e-2c4def705dd0\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022766ed6a23d264fbabb2faa52df6f945a\u0022\u003EHon JUDITH COLLINS\u003C/span\u003E: Well, the Hon Nicky Wagner knows the answer. The Labour Government\u2019s very quiet on this. The answer is zero.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000428\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002285ec30d4-6394-433a-a12e-2c4def705dd0\u0022\u003EWhat do they have to show for all these months? Well, Phil Twyford\u2019s gone along to a developer who was struggling, who was working in my electorate\u2014he loves the fact it\u2019s in my electorate, for some particular reason\u2014and that particular builder says that he was struggling, he can\u2019t get financing, couldn\u2019t do it. And what that really says is this: if someone\u2019s a developer, you can\u2019t get your financing, and you\u2019re not maybe the most financially secure developer, Phil\u2019s your man. Phil\u2019s your man. Go to Phil\u2014he\u2019ll buy it.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000429\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002285ec30d4-6394-433a-a12e-2c4def705dd0\u0022\u003EWhat happens once you\u2019ve bought this house? What happens once Phil Twyford\u2019s bought the house? He\u2019s going to sell it on to the KiwiBuild first-home buyer. And what do we know about who can be that KiwiBuild first-home buyer? Well, apparently anyone, as long as they\u2019re a first-time buyer in New Zealand. I don\u2019t know whether or not it\u2019s the first-time buyer by themselves or a first-time buyer in this particular relationship they might be in, not the previous one\u2014no detail has been forthcoming from Phil Twyford. I\u2019ve asked parliamentary questions. I\u2019ve asked written ones; I\u2019ve asked oral ones. We\u2019re asking Official Information Act questions. No answers from Phil Twyford, because nothing has been agreed.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000430\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002285ec30d4-6394-433a-a12e-2c4def705dd0\u0022\u003EThat tells us that we\u2019ve got a Minister with $2 billion, with no idea what he\u2019s doing. He\u2019s moved from \u201CWe\u2019re going to build all these houses and we\u2019re going to build them in our first 10 years.\u201D to now saying, \u201COh, we\u2019re going to buy some houses.\u201D\u2014apparently, not build any houses at all, because he hasn\u2019t got any carpenters, plumbers, electricians, or gib-stoppers; the people that you need to do this\u2014and they\u2019re going to buy them off developers, in many cases where the developments have been failing.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000431\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002285ec30d4-6394-433a-a12e-2c4def705dd0\u0022\u003EAnd why should anyone buy a KiwiBuild house? You\u2019d like to think that you\u2019d want to do it so that someone got a start in life\u2014that, actually, the asset that they\u2019re buying might at some stage have a bit of value added to it\u2014and, at the same time, you\u2019d like to hope they were going to have a nice neighbourhood full of people who are aspirational, trying to get ahead, looking after their properties, looking after their neighbourhood. And what we have from the same Minister, the Hon Phil Twyford, is that State house tenants under his watch\u2014now, we have a no-eviction policy for antisocial behaviour. So that means that if you\u2019ve bought your KiwiBuild property, you\u2019ve been in the ballot, it\u2019s great news, you\u2019ve got your KiwiBuild property, and you pay for it, next door, Phil\u2019s got one of his houses and there happens to be some antisocial tenants. What happens then? You move, apparently, according to Phil Twyford.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000432\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f7fc7ac3-5ce1-43ca-8cd6-dbb0941bf3ae\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00228486efcae2f945b8b955aac62ba8f5ae\u0022\u003EDr Duncan Webb\u003C/span\u003E: Who moves?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000433\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002285ec30d4-6394-433a-a12e-2c4def705dd0\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002269de27643c2e42eda842810704d75ef2\u0022\u003EHon JUDITH COLLINS\u003C/span\u003E: You move.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000434\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022977cccaf-581d-4f48-924e-32bf6c54a93d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022ea10472507a24b40befcd202f28e1493\u0022\u003EDEPUTY SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: No, not me.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000435\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002285ec30d4-6394-433a-a12e-2c4def705dd0\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022ed9537d337fb41eb9748086611f86579\u0022\u003EHon JUDITH COLLINS\u003C/span\u003E: Not unless, Madam Deputy Speaker, you wish to buy one of those KiwiBuild houses, which I\u2019m sure you\u2019re not silly enough to do.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000436\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002285ec30d4-6394-433a-a12e-2c4def705dd0\u0022\u003ESo should the KiwiBuild homeowner have a tenant problem with Housing New Zealand, what we\u2019ve heard from this Minister today and previously is they\u2019re on their own. They\u2019re on their own because Housing New Zealand now has a no-evictions policy for antisocial, gang-connected behaviour from tenants. As long as they pay the rent eventually, at some stage\u2014possibly in the future\u2014it\u2019ll be just fine.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000437\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002285ec30d4-6394-433a-a12e-2c4def705dd0\u0022\u003EAnd this is a Government that has overseen the biggest jump in the State house waiting list of any. So after all the carrying on, all the talking in Opposition about what they were going to do for State house tenants and people who needed a house, that waiting list has grown by 2,000, by the Minister\u2019s own admission in the select committee the other day\u20142,000 under his watch. He\u2019s only been in the role for eight or nine months. Imagine what could happen in a year. There are 2,000 people now on the waiting list.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000438\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00222aa0b524-c38d-45aa-bd5b-99c5927085f4\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00224b92c295badc4254becde4a2cf8bb563\u0022\u003EHon Clare Curran\u003C/span\u003E: Tired, old Opposition. Tired, old line.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000439\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002285ec30d4-6394-433a-a12e-2c4def705dd0\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022e22f5d806fe74a338a055c48959ca7be\u0022\u003EHon JUDITH COLLINS\u003C/span\u003E: And that member over there\u2014somebody; I don\u2019t know her name\u2014has called out something about tired, old\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000440\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00222aa0b524-c38d-45aa-bd5b-99c5927085f4\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022c963eed4e3f04f9fb76b08bdab663160\u0022\u003EHon Clare Curran\u003C/span\u003E: Lines.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000441\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002285ec30d4-6394-433a-a12e-2c4def705dd0\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022df5269b26f924e4eb02293ed808b203c\u0022\u003EHon JUDITH COLLINS\u003C/span\u003E: Don\u2019t talk to me like that\u2014an unknown person. What I would say to that person is this: don\u2019t make out you\u2019re going to deliver to people. Don\u2019t tell people they\u2019re going to get $38 million at Radio New Zealand, Clare Curran, and then fail to deliver.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000442\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002285ec30d4-6394-433a-a12e-2c4def705dd0\u0022\u003EThis Government will be a one-term Government. It will be a one-term, and we will make sure of it.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022e11a5f05-1940-41b2-8f1e-911dba7a43a5\u0022 data-id=\u0022d068a4cf731b4c3e923895becdddf7c2\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000443\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e11a5f05-1940-41b2-8f1e-911dba7a43a5\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022d068a4cf731b4c3e923895becdddf7c2\u0022\u003EFLETCHER TABUTEAU (Deputy Leader\u2014NZ First):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you for the opportunity, Madam Deputy Speaker, to speak to the Imprest Supply (First for 2018/19) Bill and Appropriation (2017/18 Supplementary Estimates) Bill, which I\u2019m not sure former Minister Collins was actually doing, or the person before her, or the person before that. So I\u2019ll take the opportunity to address some of the comments made by the member opposite, although I\u2019ll start by contrasting the styles of the two Governments.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000444\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e11a5f05-1940-41b2-8f1e-911dba7a43a5\u0022\u003EWhat the imprest supply and Supplementary Estimates bills highlight to me is this is a Government that is willing\u2014and, in fact, more than willing; ensuring\u2014that the people of New Zealand and their representatives are actually talking about the issues. We\u2019re actually talking about them, and we\u2019re dealing with them, as evidenced in these pieces of legislation. I say that because, in contrast, only a year ago there were six stopwork strikes under the previous Government\u2019s control, but you didn\u2019t really notice it because what that Government was good at when they had the reins, as it were, was suppressing this information. Not stopping it, because people need the ability, and it\u2019s one of the strongest and most powerful ways of people having their voices heard, but\u2014urgh! It\u2019s frustrating listening to the contributions from those opposite.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000445\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e11a5f05-1940-41b2-8f1e-911dba7a43a5\u0022\u003EAmy Adams, for example\u2014my understanding is she\u2019s the spokesperson for finance in Opposition. Apparently they want the New Zealand public to believe that the National Government never taxed anyone. We know, in contrast, they never spent on anyone in New Zealand, but they keep throwing up this whole tax and spend argument like they never did it. It\u2019s just unbelievable, and quite sad to watch as they make the argument, when, yes, they taxed. They increased petrol taxes in their time. They did it constantly and consistently. They increased GST in their time, despite actually saying that they wouldn\u2019t. It was that party that introduced the brightline test, capital gains, to New Zealand\u2019s legislation books, yet somehow they\u2019re telling the public that it is this Government that did that.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000446\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e11a5f05-1940-41b2-8f1e-911dba7a43a5\u0022\u003EOne of the examples that Ms Adams used was around this whole tax and spend argument, and then in the conclusion of her contribution she made the point\u2014and it was a very interesting one, which is highly debatable. But the point she was trying to make was they spent more on hospitals and homes, and she listed\u2014it\u2019s really hard to talk about because it\u2019s so hard to believe, but her final argument was that party spent more than we are now.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000447\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002236c8c596-d890-4cca-9767-1eeb5c9ce710\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00226fdd5289c74f470c95b879780ca3d02d\u0022\u003EDarroch Ball\u003C/span\u003E: It doesn\u2019t make sense.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000448\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e11a5f05-1940-41b2-8f1e-911dba7a43a5\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022575eaafad1b44460a16d4d42cd03654f\u0022\u003EFLETCHER TABUTEAU\u003C/span\u003E: It just typifies and is a great example of the arguments coming from that side of the House. They\u2019re inconsistent and contrary. They don\u2019t make any sense.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000449\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002253f86481-33c1-48b2-893b-c11cc0bd673d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002295ac332ea03946aeadbc7d6b7a0714f9\u0022\u003EHon Paul Goldsmith\u003C/span\u003E: It\u2019s not our fault you can\u2019t figure it out.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000450\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e11a5f05-1940-41b2-8f1e-911dba7a43a5\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00220899635c89e9461699262bcf832e3838\u0022\u003EFLETCHER TABUTEAU\u003C/span\u003E: You\u2019ll hurt my feelings if you say that, Mr Goldsmith.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000451\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022977cccaf-581d-4f48-924e-32bf6c54a93d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00221a1607d77ebf49f6a168b231aece40cb\u0022\u003EDEPUTY SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: I won\u2019t.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000452\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e11a5f05-1940-41b2-8f1e-911dba7a43a5\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002218699d25de5843a29cb01eddb243d2a8\u0022\u003EFLETCHER TABUTEAU\u003C/span\u003E: Despite Ms Adams\u2019 calls of the sky falling in, unemployment continues to fall in New Zealand, whilst incomes rise in a steady pace. Our forecasts say it, but OECD forecasts have steady, sustainable growth in New Zealand over the next year at over 3 percent, all the while\u2014in contrast to the kinds of National Party - sponsored business confidence surveys\u2014our businesses are increasing their investment on non-residential fixed assets. For the Opposition\u2019s benefit, in non-residential fixed assets you\u2019d include transport equipment, plant and machinery equipment, those assets that are growing the business, improving productivity\u2014investment in the business. All the while that they\u2019re decrying lack of business confidence, those very businesses in New Zealand are spending more than they ever had in investing in their businesses in New Zealand. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000453\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e11a5f05-1940-41b2-8f1e-911dba7a43a5\u0022\u003ESo it\u2019s an interesting time that we live in, because unemployment\u2019s falling. Wages are going up, which apparently\u2014I won\u2019t go there. That was another argument from Ms Adams. But she decried the spending on our provinces. She said the Provincial Growth Fund was a waste of money. I am not quoting her literally\u2014those were her words to that effect. Our provinces deserve so much better than the now-Opposition provided them in their time.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000454\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e11a5f05-1940-41b2-8f1e-911dba7a43a5\u0022\u003EThese communities, these people, are the lifeblood of this country, and this is a Government that has stood up and said we will invest in those provinces, because we know if we do that, it\u2019s good for everyone in New Zealand. They, disproportionately more than any other part of the country, provide a return to New Zealand\u2019s economy more than anywhere else, and this Government\u2019s investment now will empower that, will accelerate that, will grow that, and the nature of the investment is such that it is being done by a great team of people who are working with the communities. In fact, thus far it is the communities themselves who are coming to the Government and saying, \u2018This will be good for us\u2014not just good for us; this will create jobs. This will create sustainable jobs. This will grow our communities, this will grow our local economy, and this will be good for the people who live in our provinces.\u201D That was a promise we made to them leading into the election, and that is a promise that we have kept and are delivering on every day as a Government, and I\u2019m proud to play a small part in that.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000455\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e11a5f05-1940-41b2-8f1e-911dba7a43a5\u0022\u003EI just wanted to touch on some of the key Supplementary Estimates that have been raised in this legislation, because, as I started with, they highlight that this is a Government that is addressing the issues, that is willing to engage and talk about issues that the previous Government\u2014that National Party\u2014never wanted to talk about while they were in control of the Government.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000456\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022e0abf404505e4e659745f5dacd652848\u0022\u003EHon Dr Nick Smith\u003C/span\u003E: Oh, rubbish\u2014just rubbish.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000457\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e11a5f05-1940-41b2-8f1e-911dba7a43a5\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00223ebe236262c44c21963e5a3d5285e619\u0022\u003EFLETCHER TABUTEAU\u003C/span\u003E: So education and training\u2014I\u2019ve hurt Mr Smith\u2019s feelings, so there\u2019s one little win for the day. Thank you, Mr Smith. This is very important. So just in this legislation\u2014just in the Supplementary Estimates\u2014we\u2019re talking about $310 million being spent in education and training, and some of the previous speakers on this side of the House highlighted the fact that a lot of that actually is in the capital and the infrastructure of our schools that had been neglected over nine years such that some of those teaching environments were unsafe. It was, again, one of the 100-day plan policies, and the New Zealand public knows that in that 100-day plan we kept the promises that we made, and in this legislation today we\u2019re ensuring that we can continue to do that as we wait for the Budget to be passed in the House. I think that\u2019s in August.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000458\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e11a5f05-1940-41b2-8f1e-911dba7a43a5\u0022\u003ESo education\u2014what we\u2019re saying, and what perhaps isn\u2019t obvious for those opposite in this House, is that this is an investment in the long term. There are now 80,000 people who are eligible for the fees-free programme, and\u2014as was pointed out earlier again, but is worth repeating\u2014in doing this we are empowering those who are looking at trade training, not just universities or polytechs but those in apprenticeships and trades, and that\u2019s incredibly important to get that fundamental groundwork. Actually, there\u2019s quite a lot of money to be made at the moment in those professions.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000459\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002253f86481-33c1-48b2-893b-c11cc0bd673d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022511d809ff0a84462bdd09c96f6e174f9\u0022\u003EHon Paul Goldsmith\u003C/span\u003E: Come on, this is waffle.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000460\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e11a5f05-1940-41b2-8f1e-911dba7a43a5\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022e48984e3d9db4cb281696cb98a3c67d9\u0022\u003EFLETCHER TABUTEAU\u003C/span\u003E: Wait your turn, Mr Goldsmith. This bill invests $600 million in water and roading infrastructure for timely increases in housing supply. Despite what the Opposition is saying, this Government is on its way to building more homes, and we\u2019re getting the job done\u2014a job that they knew needed to be done in their time, but they went on a tour of Auckland to find suitable sites to build homes, and some of those sites were power exchange sites and graveyards, from memory. It was an unbelievable example of that previous Government in action. Anyway, Madam Deputy Speaker, thank you for the opportunity. It\u2019s good enabling legislation. It\u2019s obviously timely, and it\u2019s a pleasure to support. Thank you.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002253f86481-33c1-48b2-893b-c11cc0bd673d\u0022 data-id=\u0022613a8742c6f149dfa698b682e5d8f517\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000461\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002253f86481-33c1-48b2-893b-c11cc0bd673d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022613a8742c6f149dfa698b682e5d8f517\u0022\u003EHon PAUL GOLDSMITH (National):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Madam Deputy Speaker. We\u2019re speaking, obviously, about the Budget that has been passed by this Labour - Greens - New Zealand First Government, that is wreaking so much havoc in this country and this economy. But when we look at the overall Budget there\u2019s no question that it represents, as the last Budget did and the Budget before that, a huge investment on behalf of all New Zealanders in health, in education, in innovation, in keeping our people safe through the justice sector, and in all the many ways in which Government contributes to the lives of New Zealanders.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000462\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002253f86481-33c1-48b2-893b-c11cc0bd673d\u0022\u003EInterestingly enough, I was watching that well-known political commentator Anika Moa on TV recently when she interviewed Winston Peters. Winston Peters, who, as everybody knows, is, effectively, the Prime Minister at the moment and will be for the next few weeks\u2014it\u2019ll be the first time in New Zealand\u2019s history that the leader of a party that has garnered so few a vote, about 7 percent, ends up as the Prime Minister of the country for an extended period of time, but that\u2019s all by the by. Winston Peters was explaining his understanding of the New Zealand economy. His two basic points were that it all went wrong in 1984 and, secondly, that subsequent to that there was a massive free-market experiment that has led to all sorts of terrible consequences for New Zealand\u2014excessive and uncaring capitalism.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000463\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002253f86481-33c1-48b2-893b-c11cc0bd673d\u0022\u003EI just wanted to sort of make those points because, obviously, he seems a little bit\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000464\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002236c8c596-d890-4cca-9767-1eeb5c9ce710\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002258f9d143068f48a1a26f6b7f65e1e5b0\u0022\u003EDarroch Ball\u003C/span\u003E: What are you speaking on?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000465\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002253f86481-33c1-48b2-893b-c11cc0bd673d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022d0f4056e7a8c424ebb52709a4ec01d99\u0022\u003EHon PAUL GOLDSMITH\u003C/span\u003E: I\u2019m talking about the Budget and the context to the Budget.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000466\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002236c8c596-d890-4cca-9767-1eeb5c9ce710\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022c07b4cae4001495892952e2a3c3577be\u0022\u003EDarroch Ball\u003C/span\u003E: You\u2019re not talking about the legislation.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000467\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022977cccaf-581d-4f48-924e-32bf6c54a93d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022f714c4fbaa2a4d2897d98141faead7d8\u0022\u003EDEPUTY SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Order! I decide. The previous speaker spoke for three minutes without mentioning the Budget, all right? So I decide.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000468\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002253f86481-33c1-48b2-893b-c11cc0bd673d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022addfd55956c043b5b7fbff6efae87589\u0022\u003EHon PAUL GOLDSMITH\u003C/span\u003E: Thank you. So the acting Prime Minister says 1984 was where it all went wrong. He forgets that before 1984, we had a totally unsustainable economy, high unemployment, and massive Budget deficits and we couldn\u2019t carry on the way that we were doing because we couldn\u2019t, ultimately, pay our bills. Subsequent to that, we had reforms.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000469\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002253f86481-33c1-48b2-893b-c11cc0bd673d\u0022\u003ENow, when you look at this Budget, and you look at the Budget of last year and all the Budgets of the previous National Government, there\u2019s no way that any honest assessment of that could be made which says that this is a hard right capitalist country that we live in where we\u2019ve gone according to the trickle-down theory and somehow we don\u2019t care about people. If you look at the Budget and you look at last year\u2019s Budget under the National Government, most of the Governments spending has been about taking money off better-off New Zealanders and giving it to New Zealanders who are struggling. There\u2019s massive redistribution. If you look at the papers in the Tax Working Group, you\u2019ll see that, basically, half of the population of New Zealand receives more in services\u2014whether it\u2019s free education, free health, Working for Families tax credits, and grants\u2014than they put in, and a relatively small group, a third of the population of New Zealand, pays, by far and away, the largest proportion of tax.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000470\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002253f86481-33c1-48b2-893b-c11cc0bd673d\u0022\u003ESo, fundamentally, what this Budget represents is a massive redistribution of wealth and income from those who are better off to those who need it, which is right and proper. But you have to have a very warped view of the world, if you look at that and say\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000471\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022977cccaf-581d-4f48-924e-32bf6c54a93d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022dedfcfa755064212b2299da88989f5fd\u0022\u003EDEPUTY SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: I don\u2019t.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000472\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002253f86481-33c1-48b2-893b-c11cc0bd673d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002280a0b8b997594ebf885a159d06acc377\u0022\u003EHon PAUL GOLDSMITH\u003C/span\u003E: Sorry. Any commentator, such as the acting Prime Minister, Winston Peters, would have to have a very warped view of the world if you were trying to categorise that as trickle-down economics or some hard right, free-market, extreme example of capitalism. So we don\u2019t have that in New Zealand, we haven\u2019t had that in New Zealand, and in New Zealand we invest very heavily in ensuring that all New Zealanders have access to the opportunity to live a full and healthy life.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000473\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002253f86481-33c1-48b2-893b-c11cc0bd673d\u0022\u003ENow, you can have arguments about whether you should spend even more or redistribute even more, and this Government has talked a big game about doing that. We haven\u2019t seen a huge amount of evidence of it. Yes, they cancelled the very modest tax adjustment that would have seen wealthier families receiving a small or modest tax cut, but there was no coherency in the way that they went about it, because they then went and turned around and spent $2.8 billion on middle-class welfare in terms of giving free access to tertiary education. It probably means that the overall effect of the Budget is less redistributive than it was before, so they\u2019re muddled and confused in their thinking. But, certainly, there hasn\u2019t been a fundamental shift to what the New Zealand Budget is all about.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000474\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002253f86481-33c1-48b2-893b-c11cc0bd673d\u0022\u003EBut what we have seen since they have been in Government is a series of decisions that have undermined the business confidence of this country. We know that the economic development Minister thinks all those surveys are junk, and we just heard from the previous speaker, Fletcher Tabuteau, who said that they\u2019re National Party - sponsored business surveys. I\u2019m sure the ANZ will be thrilled with that characterisation of their work, but that\u2019s how it was described. And that arrogant view, that more than 1,500 business leaders who were asked about what their investment plans are for the next year, what they\u2019re planning to invest in\u2014and the answer to that question by 1,500 leaders was they don\u2019t know what they\u2019re talking about, according to the economic development Minister, because the results are pure junk, according to him. I don\u2019t think they\u2019re junk. I think what they indicate is that all those business leaders and would-be investors are putting their hands back in their pockets and they\u2019re not spending and they\u2019re not investing because there is an enormous amount of uncertainty about what this Government intends to do.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000475\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002253f86481-33c1-48b2-893b-c11cc0bd673d\u0022\u003EWe all know that there\u2019s 122 reviews going on about what they should be doing, the biggest of which is around tax policy. This Budget that we\u2019re debating today didn\u2019t include the introduction of a capital gains tax, but the Government has signalled that they want to do that. The ideological leader of this Government\u2014not the Prime Minister, not the acting Prime Minister, but David Parker, the most ideological Minister in this Government in the economic sense of view; there\u2019s all sorts of strange ideologies in the other areas of the Government, but in economic terms\u2014desperately wants to introduce a capital gains tax and will do so, and it will probably affect people\u2019s KiwiSaver accounts and all sorts of other things that will surprise people when it comes up. But when people are trying to make a decision about whether to invest, to hire people, to buy new plant, to buy a new business, or to take a risk, they\u2019re all sort of asking themselves, \u201CWell, am I going to be paying a capital gains tax or not?\u201D They don\u2019t know, and as a result of that and all sorts of other uncertainties that this Government has introduced, there is less government going on.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000476\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002253f86481-33c1-48b2-893b-c11cc0bd673d\u0022\u003EAnyway, time rattles on. There\u2019s been over the last couple of weeks this Estimates process, whereby we on the Opposition side have had a chance to question Ministers. It has been a rather dispiriting period because we haven\u2019t got any decent answers. We had, for example, Shane Jones come in to talk about the regional economic development portfolio and the $1 billion a year that he is meant to be spending on the Provincial Growth Fund. We call it the political survival fund, because it turned out that the vast majority of the spending so far was going to one region. Northland had asked for about $55 million worth of projects. They\u2019ve got $61 million, so that was good for them\u2014they got more than they asked for. But the rest of the country had asked for $240 million, and got $42 million. So there would seem to be a bit of a bias in the way that the fund was operating.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000477\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002253f86481-33c1-48b2-893b-c11cc0bd673d\u0022\u003ESo we asked him some questions about that\u2014got no answers. One of the most fundamental questions we asked was: is this actually $1 billion that you\u2019re spending as you talk about\u2014is it new money? It turns out in the Budget figures that, actually, a quarter of the $1 billion is not new money at all; it is what the previous Government were doing. So it\u2019s actually $750 million new funding for the provinces. But, even worse, it turned out that of that $750 million, actually, $250 million - odd of it was funding for forestry over 10 years. So it\u2019s not actually $1 billion that\u2019s being spent next year. A quarter of that is existing spending, and a quarter of the rest of it is actually going to be spread over 10 years.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000478\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002253f86481-33c1-48b2-893b-c11cc0bd673d\u0022\u003EWe asked some basic questions about how that money is going to be spent and he didn\u2019t answer, refused to answer, and fudged. We all know, in this House, that that Minister has a very strange approach to answering a question. He speaks in complete gibberish most of the time. Today in the House he was talking about planting seeds and impregnating things, and I didn\u2019t know what he was talking about, but that\u2019s how he operates. So we haven\u2019t got any clear answers about exactly how much money we\u2019re spending in the Provincial Growth Fund, and it\u2019s a disgrace.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00227c215736-b512-41de-8f0c-6c5543fcfce7\u0022 data-id=\u00224cf0f224f3b74df39a1d830622102ec7\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000479\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227c215736-b512-41de-8f0c-6c5543fcfce7\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00224cf0f224f3b74df39a1d830622102ec7\u0022\u003EHon JAMES SHAW (Leader\u2014Green):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Madam Deputy Speaker. It\u2019s a pleasure to get to rise and to debate the Supplementary Estimates 2017-18. I just wanted to pick up on some of the comments that the previous speaker, the Hon Paul Goldsmith, was making. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000480\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227c215736-b512-41de-8f0c-6c5543fcfce7\u0022\u003EThere\u2019s a debatable point, I think, about the nature of business confidence surveys and how they affect the economy. I think it\u2019s entirely legitimate to say that, you know, it\u2019s a well-run survey, it asks people their opinion, and it\u2019s therefore a statement of what people think. The issue that we\u2019ve had with using business confidence surveys as some kind of barometer for economic performance, as opposed to actual economic performance as a measure of economic performance, is that business confidence surveys tend to be high when there is a National Government and tend to be low when there is a Labour-led Government, regardless of what\u2019s actually going on in the economy. So, absolutely, there\u2019s no relationship to what\u2019s going on in the economy. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000481\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227c215736-b512-41de-8f0c-6c5543fcfce7\u0022\u003EThe last time business confidence surveys were this low was when Sir Michael Cullen was running 10 years of surpluses, making massive investments in things like the Superannuation Fund, getting debt down to zero\u2014all of the things that the National Party thinks are absolutely terrific, all of those actual things that actually take place in the economy that National are so, so keen on. Business confidence was really low during that period of time. It bore no relationship to the actual economy, which is why now, every time they bring out one of these business confidence surveys to say, \u201CBusiness confidence hasn\u2019t been this low since the last time Labour was in Government.\u201D\u2014well, Labour happened to be running an incredibly strong economy during that period of time.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000482\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227c215736-b512-41de-8f0c-6c5543fcfce7\u0022\u003ESo it\u2019s all very good to pull out somebody\u2019s opinion, but it doesn\u2019t actually match the reality of what\u2019s going on in the economy. I just wanted to start by picking up on that point, because it is nonsensical. They do keep trotting it out all of the time, because it\u2019s the only piece of data that they\u2019ve got to grasp hold of, even though it doesn\u2019t bear any resemblance to actual reality.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000483\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227c215736-b512-41de-8f0c-6c5543fcfce7\u0022\u003EI just wanted to pull some highlights about some of the things that are in the Appropriation (2017/18 Supplementary Estimates) Bill. As Grant Robertson said when he opened this debate, because there has been a change of Government which does have different priorities to the old Government, there have been a number of significant things that have changed that have shown up in this Estimates bill. From the Green Party\u2019s perspective, in our confidence and supply agreement with the Government we\u2019ve classified three areas\u2014that is the sustainable economy, a fair society, and a healthy environment. This appropriations bill brings out a number of things in line with that confidence and supply agreement, and I\u2019ll just pick three each in each of those three categories.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000484\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227c215736-b512-41de-8f0c-6c5543fcfce7\u0022\u003EThe first is in relation to the sustainable economy. As someone who was an Opposition spokesperson for a long time, I kept banging on about the need to invest in the long term and in the health and well-being of our economy over multiple decades, particularly when we have a demographic bubble in front of us. I remember having a real go at the National Government at the time for completely focusing only on the short term and ignoring the long term when they refused, even when things started to recover post - global financial crisis and post-earthquake, to start reinvesting in the Superannuation Fund. So one of the things I am most proud of in this Government is that in this Supplementary Estimates we have restarted payments to the Superannuation Fund.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000485\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227c215736-b512-41de-8f0c-6c5543fcfce7\u0022\u003EOne of the things that I keep hearing now Opposition members saying is \u201CYou shouldn\u2019t borrow to invest. Who borrows to invest? Why would you borrow to put money into the Superannuation Fund? You know, it doesn\u2019t make any sense.\u201D Well, let me tell you who borrows to invest: everyone with a mortgage, everybody who buys a house, every single business that ever borrowed money to be able to build plant and to get extra trucks on the road, or whatever it is that they do for a business. Every single business borrows to invest. Every homeowner borrows to\u2014that\u2019s who borrows to invest. So if you have to do a little bit of that in order to make sure you\u2019ve got long-term income for this country, then I\u2019m down with that, particularly at a time when you\u2019ve got historically low interest rates.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000486\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227c215736-b512-41de-8f0c-6c5543fcfce7\u0022\u003ENow, having said that, we\u2019re actually not, because the other thing that we\u2019re doing is we\u2019re continuing to bring down net debt as a portion of GDP. The thing that the National Party finds, sort of, hardest to get their heads around is the idea that you actually can walk and chew gum at the same time. You actually can invest in the long term as well as pay down your debt, as well as invest in social services, right? This is former members of that previous Government who insisted that the only reality that you can possibly have is not to invest in the future, to not just cut debt but also cut spending as a portion of GDP, like that was somehow going to make sure that we had a long-term future, and I think it did anything but.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000487\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227c215736-b512-41de-8f0c-6c5543fcfce7\u0022\u003EThe second thing that I\u2019m particularly delighted about in the domain of the sustainable economy in this bill is the shift in transport spending. We\u2019ve gone from a situation where, literally, 350 kilometres of gold-plated motorways in urban areas won out over every other mode of transport, won out over regional roads and road safety; won out over ensuring that there was any kind of rail, freight or passenger rail; and won out over mass transit in our most congested cities\u2014in particular in Auckland, which suffers from $1.6 billion a year of lost productivity due to congestion charges. Finally\u2014finally\u2014we have a Government that is prepared to make the investment decisions to rebalance the transport portfolio, to decongest our cities, and to make sure that our regions have got the kinds of local roads that they need to move people and freight around the country. I think that is the second thing that I\u2019m most proud of in this, in relation to the economy.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000488\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227c215736-b512-41de-8f0c-6c5543fcfce7\u0022\u003EThe third thing\u2014and one that\u2019s very, I think, dear to the hearts of every New Zealander\u2014is actually to start to solve the housing crisis. It is interesting to me that the now National Opposition uses the phrase \u201Chousing crisis\u201D now that they\u2019re in Opposition, because there wasn\u2019t a crisis when they were in Government, apparently, but now that they\u2019re in Opposition there is. So they\u2019ve finally woken up to the reality of the situation that there is a housing crisis, if not woken up to the reality that they\u2019re now in Opposition.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000489\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227c215736-b512-41de-8f0c-6c5543fcfce7\u0022\u003EThere\u2019s been a lot made of KiwiBuild and other parts of the housing portfolio. One thing that I just want to focus on from this bill is putting some funding into setting up a rental warrant of fitness for homes, because I don\u2019t think anybody previously in the debate has mentioned this yet. I think it is absolutely fantastic that finally\u2014finally\u2014in order to rent a house, you have to guarantee that it won\u2019t kill the resident. That\u2019s pretty remarkable, right? That\u2019s not actually a huge standard. It\u2019s been standard for a long time, for many decades, that if you want to rent someone a car, that car has to be roadworthy. It has to be able to survive an accident and has to not kill its driver or its passengers, but the same has not been true of our homes, and we have had tens of thousands of unnecessary winter deaths and tens of thousands of kids in hospital with entirely preventable respiratory diseases as a result of really shoddy rental homes. So, finally, we\u2019ve made a tough call, and this appropriations bill actually makes it possible for us to finally put in place some minimum standards around our rental properties. So, for that, I\u2019m tremendously proud of this Government.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000490\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227c215736-b512-41de-8f0c-6c5543fcfce7\u0022\u003ESo it is, I think, a great pleasure for us to support the Supplementary Estimates bill, and I commend it to the House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022c83012b4-3939-4753-80fc-1956a3e2bd1e\u0022 data-id=\u0022349aa7b199d94e6f868d157aa7037060\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000491\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c83012b4-3939-4753-80fc-1956a3e2bd1e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022349aa7b199d94e6f868d157aa7037060\u0022\u003EHon MICHAEL WOODHOUSE (National):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Mr Assistant Speaker. It\u2019s a great pleasure to take a call in this Supplementary Estimates bill debate. After today\u2019s appearance at the Estimates review, I think the list of Ministers of this Government that\u2019ve demonstrated that they are completely out of their depth can have a new name added to it, and that is David Clark. Today, we exploded the myth of the $8 billion of underfunding\u2014remember that? This is a health spokesperson and a health Minister that has crusaded around the country, saying that the health budget had been underfunded by $8 billion over four years, and that\u2019s what this Government was going to do to remedy it. They campaigned on that being Pre-election Economic and Fiscal Update (PREFU) 2017 plus $8 billion. They misled the public into believing that this Government would do $8 billion more than what a National Government would do.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000492\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002257e41e9d-285b-4fb3-847d-a63820ae7137\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002273b39e00915a4220b11662dea0e35eea\u0022\u003EChris Bishop\u003C/span\u003E: That\u2019s right.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000493\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c83012b4-3939-4753-80fc-1956a3e2bd1e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00228bd0cf4fcdf34863a9b1fa99daba3cfc\u0022\u003EHon MICHAEL WOODHOUSE\u003C/span\u003E: Quite right. Only that\u2019s not what the reality is, because what we heard confirmed today by the Minister was that nothing could be further from the truth. Simply turning and keeping the lights on in our health sector over the next four years, whatever Government was in place, would have cost $8 billion. And do you know what this Government\u2019s going to do more than that?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000494\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002257e41e9d-285b-4fb3-847d-a63820ae7137\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00223a440cc5cd7b41aaaa08d4b5aa926e6f\u0022\u003EChris Bishop\u003C/span\u003E: What?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000495\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c83012b4-3939-4753-80fc-1956a3e2bd1e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002275c867a1429d40d2abaa5244f1d3b9ba\u0022\u003EHon MICHAEL WOODHOUSE\u003C/span\u003E: Nothing. Not a single thing. In fact, what we have is a seriously long list of broken promises. It started really early, and it started with the GP visits. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000496\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c83012b4-3939-4753-80fc-1956a3e2bd1e\u0022\u003ERemember that Dr Clark went with Jacinda Ardern to the M\u0101ngere market in August last year, to a hero\u2019s welcome, to say\u2014because the previous Government had already just announced a significant package of improvements to GP prices for Very Low Cost Access practices. I can\u2019t remember the exact money\u2014it was about $300 million over four years. It was very significant. It was going to help another half a million New Zealanders. And they said, \u201CWe can do better than that. Every single New Zealander will have a reduction in their GP fees\u2014every single one.\u201D They said, \u201CWe\u2019ve worked it out, we\u2019ve consulted with the GP community, and this is our promise: $250 million - odd a year.\u201D But where is it? They\u2019re now crowing about the fact that 580,000 New Zealanders are going to get\u2014that\u2019s actually a contested number, but let\u2019s say that it\u2019s right; 580,000\u2014discounts on their GP fees, only they told the New Zealand public it would be over 4 million. That is a broken promise, and it\u2019s one of many.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000497\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c83012b4-3939-4753-80fc-1956a3e2bd1e\u0022\u003EI want to remind the House what David Clark said after Budget 2017. He said, \u201CDistrict health boards this year need at least $650 million just to stand still, and they\u2019re $200 million short of what they need.\u201D That was a year ago, and he got the chance to fix it. He became Minister of Health. He inherited coffers that were higher than the PREFU had. The numbers are looking better. They wanted to borrow more. They wanted to do more. He said $650 million last year\u2014that\u2019s what they needed just to keep the lights on. He gave them $549 million. He could not even meet his own lofty expectations for himself. He let himself down by $110 million plus inflation, and it\u2019s no wonder that the district health boards (DHBs) are squirming over the massively high expectations that are being set for funding that cannot be met. The best manifestation of the effect of that failed expectation is in the very sad news that the New Zealand Nurses Organisation have now issued a notice of their intention to strike on 5 July, and I\u2019m very sad about that.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000498\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c83012b4-3939-4753-80fc-1956a3e2bd1e\u0022\u003EI respect the fantastic 30,000-odd public hospital nurses and the other 25,000 nurses in other parts of our health sector who go to work every single day and do a fantastic job. It\u2019s a measure of their frustration and disappointment at the expectations that were raised by this Government that have not been met that they have to take the first strike action of their union in nearly 30 years\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000499\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022843a6c1e89b449c883dd8d97af5f832b\u0022\u003EHon Dr Nick Smith\u003C/span\u003E: How long?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000500\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c83012b4-3939-4753-80fc-1956a3e2bd1e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022938287821e4d4d78a4b160dd738ff541\u0022\u003EHon MICHAEL WOODHOUSE\u003C/span\u003E: \u2014and they can sheet that home\u2014nearly 30 years, Dr Smith, since there was a strike. I believe it was under a previous Labour Government\u2014I\u2019d need to check that\u2014and it\u2019s no surprise when the talk is big and the delivery is zero.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000501\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c83012b4-3939-4753-80fc-1956a3e2bd1e\u0022\u003EHere\u2019s a really interesting factor: they go on about district health board (DHB) deficits, but the analysis of DHB deficits in the last 18 years\u2014until the change of Government\u2014makes very interesting reading. I\u2019ve mentioned it before, but it\u2019s worth noting again because we\u2019re seeing a new trend emerge since this Government came to office. The average deficit between 2000 and 2008 by DHBs was $66.8 million per year. That\u2019s a lot of money, but bear in mind the DHBs have had in that time probably $8 billion and $10 billion of funding appropriated. Between 2009 and 2017, without even adjusting for inflation, it was 5 percent lower than that. The vote was higher; the deficits were lower. The previous National Government funded DHBs better than the previous Labour Government did.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000502\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c83012b4-3939-4753-80fc-1956a3e2bd1e\u0022\u003ESo the lofty promises come. They come in and they go, \u201CWe\u2019re going to fix deficits.\u201D Do you know what\u2019s happened to the forecast deficits since they came to office? In the six short months since they have been in control, it has gone up by 50 percent\u201450 percent.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000503\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c83012b4-3939-4753-80fc-1956a3e2bd1e\u0022\u003ETreasury are now forecasting $211 million of deficits. It was $140 million. It was high\u2014it was uncomfortably high. It\u2019s gone up 50 percent since November, and I think we\u2019re going to need to get used to more and more bad news from a Minister who is completely out of his depth.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000504\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c83012b4-3939-4753-80fc-1956a3e2bd1e\u0022\u003EThe lofty promises have been met with the reality that rescue helicopters in Hamish Walker\u2019s electorate and in Scott Simpson\u2019s electorate of Coromandel are at risk. The Lumsden Maternity Centre is about to close. The Rural Health\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000505\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002257e41e9d-285b-4fb3-847d-a63820ae7137\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00226b67d2302f7348509ef62997c2280d6d\u0022\u003EChris Bishop\u003C/span\u003E: What about Dunedin Hospital?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000506\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c83012b4-3939-4753-80fc-1956a3e2bd1e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002271dd508064ab4b03a1d906f1d3ae89e4\u0022\u003EHon MICHAEL WOODHOUSE\u003C/span\u003E: Well, good question, Mr Bishop. I\u2019m leading to the big hit, but thank you for your excitement over the list. The Rural Health Alliance have lost their funding. What about the Roxburgh children\u2019s camp? This is a fantastic facility that has been providing care to our most vulnerable tamariki for generations. What did this Government that wanted to do more, be more\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000507\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002257e41e9d-285b-4fb3-847d-a63820ae7137\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022ba07db8a66fc448cad34295b40d90bbb\u0022\u003EChris Bishop\u003C/span\u003E: That\u2019s right\u2014compassionate.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000508\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c83012b4-3939-4753-80fc-1956a3e2bd1e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002209e6aa8ec22a4643b01b62d2fe623eef\u0022\u003EHon MICHAEL WOODHOUSE\u003C/span\u003E: \u2014more compassionate\u2014gone. Absolutely gone. And then, Mr Bishop, we have Dunedin Hospital.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000509\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c83012b4-3939-4753-80fc-1956a3e2bd1e\u0022\u003ENow, I have run a gauntlet, and the previous Government was actually criticised by Treasury for going too fast, not too slow\u2014not that you would have that understood by the previous spokesperson, Dr David Clark. How much money was appropriated for the actual build of Dunedin Hospital, a hospital that he petitioned the Health Committee on, imploring the previous Government to start the construction before the last election? Zero. There\u2019s money for design, but not a skerrick of money can be found in this Budget for Dunedin Hospital.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000510\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c83012b4-3939-4753-80fc-1956a3e2bd1e\u0022\u003EThere are so many other disappointments of this Budget, and we are debating a Supplementary Estimates bill and here\u2019s why I think that\u2019s relevant: because there\u2019s no doubt that David Clark will need to come back, cap in hand, to the Minister of Finance and go, \u201CWe pared it back too much. We talked a good game, but we didn\u2019t appropriate enough. We didn\u2019t control the spending.\u201D The $8 billion, Minister of Finance, was a myth. The net increase in the vote was zero. In fact, it was lower this year than the previous Government\u2019s appropriation for health in 2017.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000511\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c83012b4-3939-4753-80fc-1956a3e2bd1e\u0022\u003EThis is a deep, deep disappointment, and the biggest disappointment is that such lofty expectations were raised and they weren\u2019t met, and I think we\u2019ll be hearing a lot, lot more. Time doesn\u2019t even allow me to go into the debacle that is Middlemore Hospital, when they created the myth\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000512\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00226d9436cbb80e4a57af73a9fbe79d24fe\u0022\u003EHon Members\u003C/span\u003E: Ha, ha!\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000513\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c83012b4-3939-4753-80fc-1956a3e2bd1e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022eb165325cbd841a48a86e3dcf8c51dd5\u0022\u003EHon MICHAEL WOODHOUSE\u003C/span\u003E: Oh, laugh if you like. Laugh if you like, but when a Minister phones a chair and says \u201CShut the hell up. And you\u2019re fired because you embarrassed me over buildings, but, by the way, if you stay quiet, we\u2019ll give you another job.\u201D, there is a word for that. They can laugh about Middlemore Hospital, but there\u2019ll be a postscript. There\u2019s more to come, and so sit up and listen, because these guys are going to learn a great lesson\u2014that is, when a Minister overreaches, they get into big trouble. So chuckle away, Ms Curran, but there\u2019s more to come over that.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022a434482b-7ac1-4862-9ce7-13e63289dee3\u0022 data-id=\u0022739723485d114c94a620e7cbcc50f9e3\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000514\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a434482b-7ac1-4862-9ce7-13e63289dee3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022739723485d114c94a620e7cbcc50f9e3\u0022\u003EASSISTANT SPEAKER (Adrian Rurawhe)\u003C/span\u003E: This is a split call\u2014five minutes.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00226590faa0-f76b-4386-84f3-9b06296cc772\u0022 data-id=\u00228a0911e731b0437f89346e46007262c7\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000515\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226590faa0-f76b-4386-84f3-9b06296cc772\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00228a0911e731b0437f89346e46007262c7\u0022\u003ETAMATI COFFEY (Labour\u2014Waiariki):\u003C/span\u003E T\u0113n\u0101 koe, Mr Assistant Speaker. Tuatahi, he poroporoaki t\u0113nei ki t\u0113tahi wahine toa o te atamira kapa haka, ko Talei Morrison t\u014Dna ingoa. Ko t\u0113nei te r\u0101 nehu m\u014D te wahine r\u0101, te manu t\u012Boriori o te kapa haka o Te M\u0101t\u0101rae i \u014Crehu. E hine, ka tangi taku ng\u0101kau ki a koe m\u014D t\u014D wh\u0101nau hoki; haere, haere, haere atu r\u0101 ki Hawaiki nui, Hawaiki roa, Hawaiki p\u0101mamao.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000516\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226590faa0-f76b-4386-84f3-9b06296cc772\u0022\u003ER\u0101tou ki a r\u0101tou, t\u0101tou ki a t\u0101tou; t\u0113n\u0101 koutou e Te Whare.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000517\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226590faa0-f76b-4386-84f3-9b06296cc772\u0022\u003E[T\u0113n\u0101 koe, Mr Assistant Speaker. Firstly, allow me to farewell a champion performer of the haka stage, Talei Morrison. Her funeral is today, and she was one of the celebrated leading female voices of Te M\u0101t\u0101rae i \u014Crehu. My heart goes out to you and your family; farewell, farewell, farewell as you go to Hawaiki nui, Hawaiki roa, Hawaiki p\u0101mamao.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000518\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226590faa0-f76b-4386-84f3-9b06296cc772\u0022\u003ELet us leave those who have passed on and return to us who are the living; greetings to the assembly in the House.]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000519\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226590faa0-f76b-4386-84f3-9b06296cc772\u0022\u003EThank you for allowing me to contribute something small to the Supplementary Estimates legislation. Aren\u2019t we doing well\u2014aren\u2019t we doing well? Aren\u2019t we doing brilliantly? We are doing a great job, and if you would believe the other side of the House, you\u2019d think that the world was going to crash. You\u2019d think that the sky was falling in, and it\u2019s not that bad.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000520\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226590faa0-f76b-4386-84f3-9b06296cc772\u0022\u003EIn fact, they just need to cheer up a little. Cheer up team. Start looking on the positive side of life, because there is a lot going on. And if you just step outside this gracious building of ours, you\u2019ll find that there are plenty of people all around New Zealand that are celebrating this Government\u2014that\u2019s right\u2014because they are becoming people that are going to benefit from our policies. This coalition Government, with our confidence and supply partners over here, the Green Party of Aotearoa, we are doing a brilliant job, and they are telling us so, day in and day out.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000521\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226590faa0-f76b-4386-84f3-9b06296cc772\u0022\u003ELet\u2019s talk about a few of those things that they are celebrating alongside us, because coming up on 1 July, it is going to be a momentous day. That is the day where our superannuitants who are sitting there in their very, very cold houses, trying to wrap up warm so that they can keep themselves alive this winter, will actually be able to access the winter energy payment\u2014that\u2019s right\u2014where they will be able to access some funding to help with their heating costs, because it\u2019s a real pressure when you get to their age. They\u2019re telling me, \u201CTamati, thank you. Thank you for putting that in there. You\u2019ve heard our plea. We\u2019ve been freezing for the last nine years, and thank you to the Government for throwing us a bone and giving us something to look forward to.\u201D\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000522\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226590faa0-f76b-4386-84f3-9b06296cc772\u0022\u003EOn top of that, what they\u2019ve realised is that we are a future-focused Government. When we talk about superannuation and the fund that\u2019s been sitting in stalemate for quite some time, they\u2019re saying to us \u201CThank you for restarting those contributions to the Superannuation Fund.\u201D because\u2014you know what?\u2014they haven\u2019t been. It\u2019s been sitting there dormant for quite some time, and they\u2019re afraid that with the influx of people that are coming through that are going to be collecting their super very soon, maybe the country won\u2019t be able to afford it. So they\u2019ve been saying thank you again to us for that. Our plan for the Superannuation Fund is to contribute $7.7 billion over the next five years, with $500 million from the get-go. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000523\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226590faa0-f76b-4386-84f3-9b06296cc772\u0022\u003EEducation: education is winning out of our Budget, and, although the Opposition might pooh-pooh the whole idea of spending some money on tertiary education, the students are happy. The students are happy because they get to go and they get to not have that barrier that is cost to their education. It wasn\u2019t so long ago\u2014and I would even theorise that quite a few members in this House took advantage of a time when here in New Zealand, tertiary education was free. That\u2019s right, it was free. It was free once upon a time, but then one day it stopped being free, and, unfortunately, students of our generation were the ones that had to go through and start paying\u2014and not paying a little bit; actually paying a lot\u2014to the point where it became a barrier to their further education. So I am proud to stand here and give the kids of today an opportunity and say, \u201CYou know what? This Government is looking after you. This Government is contributing to your well-being, so that you can be circuit-breakers for your wh\u0101nau and go back and help educate them.\u201D\u2014move them on to further education.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000524\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226590faa0-f76b-4386-84f3-9b06296cc772\u0022\u003EM\u0101ori are happy about this because\u2014you know what?\u2014M\u0101ori rates of tertiary education are not that great, they are not that high, and anything that can reduce barriers to M\u0101ori to be able to take up tertiary education has got to be a good thing and you just can\u2019t dispute that. You just can\u2019t dispute that. So that\u2019s why $310 million was authorised for the implementation of the first year of fees-free post - secondary education. This is a brilliant, brilliant Budget.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002257e41e9d-285b-4fb3-847d-a63820ae7137\u0022 data-id=\u00228768b6c39cc84edd99d250b2712f5d24\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000525\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002257e41e9d-285b-4fb3-847d-a63820ae7137\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00228768b6c39cc84edd99d250b2712f5d24\u0022\u003ECHRIS BISHOP (National\u2014Hutt South):\u003C/span\u003E Well, thank you very much, Mr Assistant Speaker. I want to focus in this contribution to the debate on the absolute disarray that the police portfolio is in. Minister Stuart Nash and the coalition Government have gone up and down the country talking about 1,800 front-line cops coming in three years. Let\u2019s just run through what has been revealed as we\u2019ve unpicked that over the last six months, because it\u2019s all very well to talk big\u2014and Stuart Nash is very fond of talking big, talking a good game\u2014but let\u2019s just actually walk through that.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000526\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002257e41e9d-285b-4fb3-847d-a63820ae7137\u0022\u003EWell, first of all, almost the moment he got his ministerial warrants, Stuart Nash was in the paper talking about, \u201COh, maybe we\u2019ll have to bring in some foreign imports. We\u2019ll go back to the days of bringing in foreign police officers.\u201D Well, that lasted about 24 hours before Nanaia Mahuta said, \u201CMate, we won\u2019t be doing that. Last time we tried that it wasn\u2019t a very good idea.\u201D Also, he probably got a call from the Prime Minister, who said, \u201CWe\u2019ve just run an entire election campaign demonising foreigners. It\u2019s probably not the world\u2019s greatest idea to start talking about bringing in foreign police officers the moment after you\u2019ve got your ministerial warrant.\u201D So that went out the back door.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000527\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002257e41e9d-285b-4fb3-847d-a63820ae7137\u0022\u003EThen we found out that of the 1,800 police, 880 of them were actually funded by National\u2014right\u2014through the Safer Communities package. So every single new police officer on the street right now\u2014there\u2019s about 350 of them; they\u2019re coming through the police college right now, they\u2019re going out on the street\u2014is not funded by the Labour Government; they\u2019re funded by the National Government, and that\u2019s actually in the Supplementary Estimates we\u2019re talking about. So the 881st officer, the first genuine new officer, they\u2019ll probably roll on to the street maybe halfway through 2020, maybe\u2014let\u2019s see.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000528\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002257e41e9d-285b-4fb3-847d-a63820ae7137\u0022\u003EThen we revealed through questions in Parliament that of the 1,800, only 1,100 of them are front line; 700 of them are working on organised crime. Very important work, none the less, but Stuart Nash has turned up to Parliament and he says\u2014get this, colleagues\u2014\u201CA police forensic accountant is a front-line officer.\u201D Now look, police forensic accountants do very important work.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000529\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c83012b4-3939-4753-80fc-1956a3e2bd1e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022bd98f2d761ab4ac8ab6241cc000f13ec\u0022\u003EHon Michael Woodhouse\u003C/span\u003E: I\u2019m an accountant, and I do important work.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000530\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002257e41e9d-285b-4fb3-847d-a63820ae7137\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022e259398e5a004147af34e8173312706b\u0022\u003ECHRIS BISHOP\u003C/span\u003E: Michael Woodhouse says he\u2019s an accountant and he does work\u2014they do very important work. They\u2019re going to help smash the gangs and all the things Stuart Nash talks about. But, look, when there\u2019s a family harm incident, when there\u2019s a burglary, or when there\u2019s an assault happening out there, I don\u2019t reckon you\u2019re going to call a police forensic accountant and say, \u201CMate, get down there and sort out that incident.\u201D I don\u2019t think you\u2019re going to call that. So I don\u2019t think we can call them front-line officers, nor can we call the authorised officers\u2014250 of them within the 1,800\u2014front-line officers either.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000531\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002257e41e9d-285b-4fb3-847d-a63820ae7137\u0022\u003EWhat else can we reveal about it? Well, the other interesting thing is Stuart Nash sought $515 million through the Budget\u2014we know that from the leaked Cabinet paper that he doesn\u2019t want anyone to know about, but we know that he did; $515 million\u2014and he said, \u201C$515 million\u2014I can do 1,800 police in three years.\u201D He didn\u2019t get that. Then he said, \u201CIn the alternative, if I get $346.4 million, I can do the 1,800 police in four years.\u201D Well, do you know how much Grant Robertson gave him? He gave him $298.8 million. So he\u2019s short, and he admitted this to the Justice Committee. He\u2019s short $220 million, and what that means is either he\u2019s going to have to go back later on next year for more money, blowing out their Estimates, or, secondly\u2014and this is the far more likely scenario, actually\u2014the new police are going to come out over five years.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000532\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002257e41e9d-285b-4fb3-847d-a63820ae7137\u0022\u003EWell, he says he\u2019s got assurances from Grant Robertson that he\u2019s got the money. Well, the way the Treasury rules work, if he\u2019s got assurances, it\u2019s in the Budget documents. If Treasury and Grant Robertson have told him the money\u2019s coming, well, Parliament has to appropriate that\u2014that\u2019s the way the Treasury rules work. So someone\u2019s doing a bit of misleading, and we\u2019ll wait and see who it actually is.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000533\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002257e41e9d-285b-4fb3-847d-a63820ae7137\u0022\u003EWe know he received advice about getting the new police over five years, because he told me he did. And do you know what he said when I asked him about that in the Estimates? I said, \u201CWhat did you do when you received the paper phasing options for 1,800 new police over five years?\u201D He said, \u201CDidn\u2019t even read it.\u201D I kid you not. I\u2019ll just repeat that for the House. He said to the parliamentary select committee about advice from his own department about his flagship policy\u20141,800 new police, in the coalition document\u2014\u201CDidn\u2019t even read it\u201D. \u201CNot even interested\u201D, he said. I said, \u201CHang on a minute, Minister, this can\u2019t be correct. You can\u2019t be telling the select committee you didn\u2019t even read the paper.\u201D \u201CNot even interested\u201D, he said.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000534\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002257e41e9d-285b-4fb3-847d-a63820ae7137\u0022\u003ENot even interested\u2014they\u2019re not looking up and they\u2019re not interested, because they know that, actually, to do that to a parliamentary select committee is treating taxpayers with contempt. For a Minister not to even read a paper\u2014disagree with the advice if you like; Ministers are entitled to do that\u2014is, frankly, treating Parliament with contempt.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002212d74f81-b1f7-4b51-9fb4-8f9481477192\u0022 data-id=\u0022da4172b7a1ef4329b779936f4c3b2666\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000535\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002212d74f81-b1f7-4b51-9fb4-8f9481477192\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022da4172b7a1ef4329b779936f4c3b2666\u0022\u003EDr DEBORAH RUSSELL (Labour\u2014New Lynn):\u003C/span\u003E I think it\u2019s worth a reminder of what we are debating today, and what this particular debate is actually about.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000536\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c3a88c42-f60b-4cf9-8065-8bfb80a020eb\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022074a4b09d4304bf49df73234d081dfa1\u0022\u003EHon Carmel Sepuloni\u003C/span\u003E: I could do with a reminder.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000537\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002212d74f81-b1f7-4b51-9fb4-8f9481477192\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022699ae6c61f304f66a7be4408c31c8735\u0022\u003EDr DEBORAH RUSSELL\u003C/span\u003E: I thought you could, Carmel! It\u2019s an appropriation bill on the 2017-18 Supplementary Estimates. Now, what that\u2019s based around is the Budget that was set in May 2017, and, since then, stuff has happened: Government departments, in some areas, have had to spend a little more money than they thought they were going to need to, particular needs have come up, there\u2019s been an election, and we have a new Government. All of that means that somehow government expenditure is changing\u2014and it has changed\u2014from the Budget that was set in 2017. As I\u2019ll talk about a little later on, it\u2019s not just the numbers that have changed but the values, too. So here today in Parliament, as part of our role, we are examining the Supplementary Estimates, making sure that they\u2019re OK, testing them, and engaging in our role of scrutinising the finances of Government. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000538\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002212d74f81-b1f7-4b51-9fb4-8f9481477192\u0022\u003EYou know, I don\u2019t think many people actually read the Supplementary Estimates. For those of you who are watching, here are the Supplementary Estimates\u2014A4-sized, 457 pages long. If you\u2019re listening, I\u2019ll tell you that it\u2019s 4 centimetres thick. It\u2019s a lot of reading.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000539\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c3a88c42-f60b-4cf9-8065-8bfb80a020eb\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00221a0b1efed7d54a19bf2dc524a9ab763a\u0022\u003EHon Carmel Sepuloni\u003C/span\u003E: How long did it take you, Deborah?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000540\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002212d74f81-b1f7-4b51-9fb4-8f9481477192\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00221b91d285a0b94dd5918c170568ed0ce7\u0022\u003EDr DEBORAH RUSSELL\u003C/span\u003E: I haven\u2019t read them all, and I suspect no one in this House has read them all. But here I want to pay tribute to the excellent public servants who have worked on these Supplementary Estimates, who have kept an eye on the money, and who have done all the figures. We owe a great debt to our public servants, and I think we should express our gratitude to them from time to time.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000541\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002212d74f81-b1f7-4b51-9fb4-8f9481477192\u0022\u003EYou see, government is not just what happens in the Cabinet room. Government is not just what happens in this House. It\u2019s not just what happens in the select committees. It is also what happens in the ministries, the departments, and the agencies helping us to run this country, and I, for one, am very grateful to the public servants who enable us to do that. That is what we\u2019re talking about today: all the work that they have done on these Supplementary Estimates. For that reason, I do want to sort of engage with some of the arguments that the Opposition have given us\u2014in fact, the mistaken ideas that they have presented us with. I\u2019m going to say \u201Cmistaken\u201D because, surely, no one would say these things in good faith.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000542\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002212d74f81-b1f7-4b51-9fb4-8f9481477192\u0022\u003ELet\u2019s start with Amy Adams, who made the extraordinary claim\u2014the extraordinary claim\u2014that the former National Government had spent more on health than our current Labour and New Zealand First Government, supported by the Green Party. You see, it\u2019s a really straightforward thing, and it\u2019s got me really worried about Amy Adams, actually. You see, the only way you can reach those figures is if you count the TerraNova settlement. So let me just go to the exact figures\u2014let me give you the exact figures. You see, in Budget 2018, the coalition Government allocated $750 million for health capital spend compared to Budget 2017 from the then National Government, which allocated $150 million. She\u2019s just got that wrong, because $750 million is bigger than $150 million.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000543\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002212d74f81-b1f7-4b51-9fb4-8f9481477192\u0022\u003ELet\u2019s talk about the operating budget. If we look at the operating budget in health, we\u2019ll see that in Budget 2018 the coalition Government allocated $3.2 billion of operating health expenditure. In Budget 2017, the amount that was allocated by the then National Government was $2.3 billion. Perhaps she just got the figures a little bit mixed up in her head\u2014$3.2 billion is bigger than $2.3 billion. We could expect that of someone who didn\u2019t know how to back out the TerraNova settlement. Frankly, it worries me that that is the capacity of the person they have as their finance spokesperson. Part of the job of the Opposition is to examine what the Government is doing, and you would at least hope\u2014I would at least hope\u2014that the person doing it knew how to manage figures.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000544\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002292824476-4e66-4052-8435-b049833d8b83\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00223203a2e5e95c408985f23d9741058b3f\u0022\u003EHon Nicky Wagner\u003C/span\u003E: You are a bitch.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000545\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002212d74f81-b1f7-4b51-9fb4-8f9481477192\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00223597058c5b7e420dbdd84a824963c27a\u0022\u003EDr DEBORAH RUSSELL\u003C/span\u003E: So we have\u2014Mr Assistant Speaker, I\u2019m sorry. I believe I heard an unparliamentary word.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000546\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a434482b-7ac1-4862-9ce7-13e63289dee3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002279a190d2a1da47828d73cc3eec892e81\u0022\u003EASSISTANT SPEAKER (Adrian Rurawhe)\u003C/span\u003E: The member needs to take a point of order.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000547\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002212d74f81-b1f7-4b51-9fb4-8f9481477192\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022038c15a1e92845c2a0921ea0d30d24d5\u0022\u003EDr DEBORAH RUSSELL\u003C/span\u003E: I raise a point of order, Mr Speaker. I would like to ask the member on the other side of the House who used an unparliamentary word in response to me to withdraw and apologise.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000548\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a434482b-7ac1-4862-9ce7-13e63289dee3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022dea863baa6744a2f91b45d479266bcf6\u0022\u003EASSISTANT SPEAKER (Adrian Rurawhe)\u003C/span\u003E: Which member, sorry?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000549\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002212d74f81-b1f7-4b51-9fb4-8f9481477192\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022c1a612558f694756a2569f25b16492f7\u0022\u003EDr DEBORAH RUSSELL\u003C/span\u003E: I believe it was Nicky Wagner. I may be mistaken, and if so I apologise, but I do believe I heard an unparliamentary word.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000550\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a434482b-7ac1-4862-9ce7-13e63289dee3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022ac9c360a59b04f21bf9a487988d93923\u0022\u003EASSISTANT SPEAKER (Adrian Rurawhe)\u003C/span\u003E: I didn\u2019t hear the interjection, but I would ask the Hon Nicky Wagner, if she did use an unparliamentary word, that she would withdraw.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000551\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002292824476-4e66-4052-8435-b049833d8b83\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00229a9d9363dfed41289e746f6e088fbdd4\u0022\u003EHon Nicky Wagner\u003C/span\u003E: I will withdraw and apologise.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000552\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a434482b-7ac1-4862-9ce7-13e63289dee3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022c8d214a9a4b94b9db5b591ee19def4a8\u0022\u003EASSISTANT SPEAKER (Adrian Rurawhe)\u003C/span\u003E: Thank you.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000553\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002212d74f81-b1f7-4b51-9fb4-8f9481477192\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022f2cb7a4c499142eca39f33b216501b4d\u0022\u003EDr DEBORAH RUSSELL\u003C/span\u003E: Thank you. Let me carry on. I want to speak just briefly about what Mr Paul Goldsmith had to say, fantasising about taxes\u2014fantasising, speculating about what taxes might come along. He was speculating outrageously. You see, we have introduced a Tax Working Group who are going to engage in a really well-thought-through structure for our tax Act and think about how our taxation system should be structured. Then we will be taking it to the electorate, unlike the former National Government, which simply imposed an increase in GST without taking it to the electorate in 2010. The people who engage in fantasy are not us.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000554\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002212d74f81-b1f7-4b51-9fb4-8f9481477192\u0022\u003EI want to turn to what the Supplementary Estimates say about us and our values. What they say is that the coalition Government, supported by the Green Party of Aotearoa New Zealand, is a Government that builds for the future, that doesn\u2019t take the short-term temporary decisions but looks well into the future. As my colleague Mr James Shaw so beautifully pointed out, this Government is investing in the future by restarting contributions to the New Zealand Superannuation Fund\u2014the fund that is sometimes also called the Cullen fund, in reference to the foresight of the man who got it going, the man who was a Labour Minister making those courageous decisions for the future. We need that New Zealand Superannuation Fund because we know that with demographic changes, we are going to need to spend a lot of money on New Zealand superannuation in the future, and we are going to start providing for that now. That\u2019s the kind of foresight that this Labour - New Zealand First Government has\u2014prudent, sensible, valuing young people\u2014because we will not impose burdens on them that we should be bearing ourselves. That\u2019s exactly what is going on in education, as well.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000555\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002212d74f81-b1f7-4b51-9fb4-8f9481477192\u0022\u003EWe have introduced in these Supplementary Estimates a year of fees-free education for tertiary students\u2014so that\u2019s students at universities, students at polytechnics, students in trade training. It\u2019s a year of fees-free education for young people as they leave school. This is from the Labour - New Zealand First Government that echoes the Government that removed the interest on student loans. Why are we doing this? Well, for starters, we do not want to burden our young people with huge debts. We want to actually value those young people and say, \u201CWe want you to have an education.\u201D It\u2019s also a commitment\u2014a tangible commitment\u2014to the value of education itself. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000556\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002212d74f81-b1f7-4b51-9fb4-8f9481477192\u0022\u003EThis side of the House believes in education, it believes in education for all, and it believes in free education. Why? Because the only way to have a decent society, the only way to run a great democracy, and the only way to ensure that each citizen can participate is to ensure that those citizens are educated so that they are able to be part of our country, to be part of our system of Government, and to be part of our community. That\u2019s why we value education on this side of the House, because it is an enabling action. It enables people, and that\u2019s why we think it should be free so that everyone may access it. We are committed to that kind of forward-looking, that values-laden spending. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000557\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002212d74f81-b1f7-4b51-9fb4-8f9481477192\u0022\u003ENot for us the minginess, the cutting, the pruning, or the sort of just refusing to look to the future\u2014we\u2019re not into just mere management. This side of the House believes in Government\u2014Government of the people, by the people, for the people; a real living, breathing, active democracy\u2014and that is why we are investing and building for the future. That is why I am so in support of the spending that we have engaged in, in health, in education, in welfare\u2014all the things that make this a decent country.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022859e13f9-33bb-41bb-b2f0-d848eaf25407\u0022 data-id=\u0022481ce6e67b984b408dc276e2d528f07a\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000558\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022859e13f9-33bb-41bb-b2f0-d848eaf25407\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022481ce6e67b984b408dc276e2d528f07a\u0022\u003EANDREW BAYLY (National\u2014Hunua):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Mr Assistant Speaker. It\u2019s a pleasure to be talking on the Appropriation (2017/18 Supplementary Estimates) Bill and the Imprest Supply (First for 2018/19) Bill. Of course, I think we\u2019ve heard today that these two bills are basically about ensuring that the Government gets sufficient funding to fund the variations to appropriations in terms of the Estimates bill, and the imprest bill relates to new financial spending in the first two months of the financial year until the Estimates bill is passed. Of course, we\u2019ve seen similar sorts of situations where this doesn\u2019t happen, particularly in the US, where, basically, Government closes down. So it is an important couple of bills that we\u2019re talking about tonight, but principally it directs itself towards the money supply of the Government and what it intends to spend its money on.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000559\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022859e13f9-33bb-41bb-b2f0-d848eaf25407\u0022\u003EI\u2019ve got to say, when you look at the range of spending, some of it is good and some of it\u2019s not so good. In terms of some of the key aspects, we\u2019ve got the Rt Hon Winston Peters\u2019 $700 million package for the curtains and carpets for the Stockholm embassy that, apparently, is the most important embassy to open in all of the world\u2014$700 million for all those wonderful curtains and carpets. We\u2019ve got the Hon Shane Jones\u2019 $1 billion Provincial Growth Fund for the \u201CChampion of the Regions\u201D. Well, interestingly, today I heard in question time he had elevated his status. He\u2019s no longer the \u201CChampion of the Regions\u201D, no; \u201CChampion of the Country\u201D\u2014of the country, no less. Now, I\u2019m just wondering what the Prime Minister might be doing when she\u2019s sitting at home\u2014and I hope she\u2019s well. But when she may have seen that at question time today, she may have just asked herself whether she\u2019s still as relevant as she thought she might have been, because I don\u2019t know where you go beyond becoming the \u201CChampion of the Country\u201D.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000560\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022fdb01002-a7cf-4a77-8f05-678d24a36849\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002249c7f7c48d874ae59e9499811075c39b\u0022\u003ETodd Muller\u003C/span\u003E: The universe\u2014that\u2019s next week.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000561\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022859e13f9-33bb-41bb-b2f0-d848eaf25407\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00227c8d4d2111214c3b8e438b1ec3f75712\u0022\u003EANDREW BAYLY\u003C/span\u003E: Oh, the universe, OK.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000562\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022859e13f9-33bb-41bb-b2f0-d848eaf25407\u0022\u003EI think some of it provides a bit of clarity. I think one of the things that does provide clarity\u2014we all heard about how the New Zealand First Party was going to look after superannuitants, and, of course, we had their proposal of a $700-a-week winter payment to superannuitants\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000563\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00222aa0b524-c38d-45aa-bd5b-99c5927085f4\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00225f3722e6a95e431cace8d809de06be40\u0022\u003EHon Clare Curran\u003C/span\u003E: Energy payment\u2014winter energy payment.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000564\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022859e13f9-33bb-41bb-b2f0-d848eaf25407\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002202af4504628b47788ea9ffe46c2fca47\u0022\u003EANDREW BAYLY\u003C/span\u003E: Winter energy payment, if you want to have its full name\u2014yes, that\u2019s right. And of course in the Budget it was highlighted: 700 bucks for couples and how important that was. But what this shows\u2014in fact, they\u2019re not going to get $700; no, they\u2019re not. They\u2019re only going to get, roughly, about $350 to $380. That\u2019s because there was some sort of technical issue that was somehow not worked through previously when they made that promise. There\u2019s only three months, so in some ways it\u2019s pretty easy: rather than spread it over five months, all you could have done is just gross up the value and pay even more over a certain monthly period, and still pay what you promised to pay, which is the $700. But no, when you get down to the detail, you find it\u2019s a lot, lot less; in fact, for an individual it\u2019s even worse.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000565\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022859e13f9-33bb-41bb-b2f0-d848eaf25407\u0022\u003EI think the thing that struck me most of all that was missing in this Budget, and in these accounts, is the issue that there is no money, no appropriation, for mental health. I think that is the greatest oversight in this Budget. For all the work that had been done involving people like the Chief Science Advisor ,Sir Peter Gluckman, and a whole range of individuals who had worked on a range of packages to deal with mental health\u2014we appropriated $100 million, and that has been removed. That has been put into, now, a new working group that will not report back until probably, at the earliest, early next year. By the time the Minister goes through and looks at it, there will be no new programmes implemented for at least two years, in my view. I think that is probably the travesty of this appropriation and Budget.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000566\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022859e13f9-33bb-41bb-b2f0-d848eaf25407\u0022\u003ESo I think one of the things we need to look at is the environment we are currently discussing this Budget around. I think the biggest thing is the decline in confidence. It\u2019s no different from a non-performing or poor-performing Cabinet Minister. Once they lose their confidence\u2014once they have lost their confidence\u2014then that becomes a killer, and it\u2019s the same for business confidence. When people and individuals start to lose their confidence, they choose not to invest. When they choose not to invest, they stop spending. Unfortunately, we\u2019re starting to see the signs of it. There is an irrefutable connection between the loss of confidence and growth, or declining growth.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000567\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022859e13f9-33bb-41bb-b2f0-d848eaf25407\u0022\u003ESo it\u2019s interesting looking at the Westpac survey recently. They\u2019ve come out and said\u2014this is their recent pronouncement\u2014that the New Zealand economy will continue to underperform its peers for the next few years. Rather damning, I would have to say, particularly when that same bank, only a few months ago when it was under National, described New Zealand as a \u201Crock star economy\u201D. Then, on 19 June, there was an article that highlighted the consensus of a whole range of economic forecasters, including people like\u2014not insignificant organisations, I\u2019d have to say\u2014Treasury, the Reserve Bank, BNZ, ASB, Westpac, the New Zealand Institute of Economic Research, and ANZ, all who are saying, and the consensus is, that they expect GDP will weaken across the New Zealand economy over the next two years. We had the Auckland Chamber of Commerce show that over half their business members\u2014and, of course, business people employ people\u2014expect the economy to deteriorate over the next six months.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000568\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022859e13f9-33bb-41bb-b2f0-d848eaf25407\u0022\u003EThen we\u2019ve had the Hon David Parker describing the ANZ survey on business confidence as junk\u2014junk. Well, I\u2019d say to you that one commentary that may be different from the others\u2014you might accept it as not being valid, but when you get a complete raft of professionals and economists all saying the same thing, that, I believe, is something you need to turn to. Rather, we heard the finance Minister, I think on Tuesday, talking up the Truckometer and all those sorts of really professional surveys as being evidence that he thinks the economy\u2019s still growing.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000569\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022859e13f9-33bb-41bb-b2f0-d848eaf25407\u0022\u003ESo what\u2019s happening? That means it\u2019s rather slightly alarming at the moment, and I hope it doesn\u2019t continue, but we\u2019re seeing rents going up on average by $20 a week, which of course hits lower-income people and also hits those people saving for a new house. We\u2019re seeing food go up as a result of the increase in minimum wages and fuel prices, and there was a report on 19 June\u2014I heard someone across the way saying\u2014that healthy food prices for a family of four in Auckland, Wellington, and Christchurch have risen by up to $21 a week. Of course we\u2019ve seen the fuel prices, and of course we\u2019re going to spend more time tonight talking about the regional fuel tax, which, together with the new tax that this Government has imposed, will mean that in Auckland every person, whether you\u2019re rich or whether you\u2019re poor\u2014and of course it will affect the poorer members of our community much, much more, by 25.3c a litre every time they fill up their tank, which, on average, is $15 extra every time they fill up their tank. That\u2019s on the back of an increasing petrol price.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000570\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022859e13f9-33bb-41bb-b2f0-d848eaf25407\u0022\u003EA couple of things in this Budget really worried me. One of them is that we\u2019re talking about housing, and building and construction. Now, you\u2019d think if we\u2019re going to try and build all those additional houses\u2014100,000, and, again, I hope the coalition agreement actually achieves an objective\u2014you would expect that if you\u2019re going to double the number of houses being completed every day, there would be a need for more people in training in building and construction. You would. If you want to double it, you would, even if you assumed some efficiency gains. Well, guess what? In this Budget, not one extra cent was devoted towards increasing training for building and construction, or the trades\u2014or the trades. Well, it\u2019s a disgrace.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000571\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022859e13f9-33bb-41bb-b2f0-d848eaf25407\u0022\u003EIf you want to try and achieve something, you actually need to set about doing something and being clear about it and putting your money where your mouth is. I just believe that\u2019s, again, another travesty in this Budget.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022f7fc7ac3-5ce1-43ca-8cd6-dbb0941bf3ae\u0022 data-id=\u0022c380d0c3558542dc9d620db10081e53e\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000572\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f7fc7ac3-5ce1-43ca-8cd6-dbb0941bf3ae\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022c380d0c3558542dc9d620db10081e53e\u0022\u003EDr DUNCAN WEBB (Labour\u2014Christchurch Central):\u003C/span\u003E T\u0113n\u0101 koe, e Te Mana Whakaw\u0101. Well, goodness gracious me! Where is the volume switch on this debate? There\u2019s lots of noise but not much sense in there. As for sense\u2014well, there was not only no sense; there was nonsense, because Andrew Bayly suggested that there had been no action on mental health.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000573\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f7fc7ac3-5ce1-43ca-8cd6-dbb0941bf3ae\u0022\u003EWell, at the very same time he was saying that, I was doing a couple of jobs on my tablet here, and this message popped up. The first message came on 22 May from a social worker who is involved in the Mana Ake pilot in primary schools. She says, \u201CI\u2019m one of the social workers involved in getting this off the ground. There are certainly some challenges in the Hornby cluster.\u201D\u2014that\u2019s a fair comment. Then what she said a day or so later was, \u201CWe\u2019re getting the schools on board. We\u2019re in the stage where we\u2019re meeting with the key people. Our project manager at the district health board is doing a great job rolling this out.\u201D So that was great\u2014that\u2019s in May. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000574\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f7fc7ac3-5ce1-43ca-8cd6-dbb0941bf3ae\u0022\u003EYou know what? On Sunday, she messaged me: \u201CHey, Duncan\u201D\u2014that\u2019s me\u2014\u201CJust to let you know, Mana Ake is up and running in the Hornby cluster. We now have families to work with. It feels very real. Thank you.\u201D That\u2019s what we\u2019re doing in Christchurch and that\u2019s what we\u2019ll be doing around the country. We will be having mental health professionals in every school there. So that\u2019s what we are doing, absolutely.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000575\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f7fc7ac3-5ce1-43ca-8cd6-dbb0941bf3ae\u0022\u003EThis isn\u2019t a Government that\u2019s going to sit on its hands and watch New Zealand incrementally fall apart; this is a Government and this is a Budget that cares. This is a Government which is going to seize itself of the issues which are ahead of us and take care of them. This is a Government that is going to get on and fix the things that are wrong with New Zealand, and this is the Budget that we\u2019re going to do it with.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000576\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f7fc7ac3-5ce1-43ca-8cd6-dbb0941bf3ae\u0022\u003EIt\u2019s worth looking at these appropriations\u2014and I don\u2019t want to shout like the previous speaker; I just want to look at what\u2019s actually going on. I want to just do a bit of a case study of Christchurch, because Christchurch is a really good example where some of these supplementary appropriations are simply things which naturally roll over, building on some good work that was done previously, but some of them are new. So $500,000 was appropriated, of course, as soon as we got into Government. We did this straight away. We didn\u2019t wait for a Budget round; we did it, and now we\u2019re going back and appropriating $500,000 for the Christchurch acceleration fund\u2014an acceleration fund that\u2019s been needed for a long, long time. That\u2019s for the planning for that fund, as the former member for Christchurch Central, Nicky Wagner, should well know.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000577\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f7fc7ac3-5ce1-43ca-8cd6-dbb0941bf3ae\u0022\u003ESo we\u2019ve now appropriated the $300 million and we\u2019ve planned it in advance. \u014Ct\u0101karo Ltd, an appropriation for the management of the anchor project\u2014well, you need to appropriate some money to manage them once they get off the ground. So now we\u2019ve got the Metro Sports Facility under way, and the concrete was poured, of course, on the Christchurch Convention Centre shortly after the election.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000578\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f7fc7ac3-5ce1-43ca-8cd6-dbb0941bf3ae\u0022\u003EOf course, it\u2019s worth recognising that there\u2019s a significant appropriation there\u2014$137 million\u2014for Southern Response, and we\u2019ve got to recognise that this remains an important problem in Christchurch and that we\u2019ve got to resolve those outstanding claims. Southern Response, the wind-down company for AMI, which failed\u2014the former Government did bail that out, as it should. We\u2019re going to manage it to conclusion, and we\u2019re going to put in a whole lot of frameworks around it to make sure that those outstanding claims are settled justly and in a timely fashion, because that didn\u2019t happen.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000579\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f7fc7ac3-5ce1-43ca-8cd6-dbb0941bf3ae\u0022\u003EWe\u2019ve set up an Earthquake Commission (EQC) inquiry. So money was set aside to form that inquiry as well, and that inquiry is badly needed because EQC has gone wrong, and you know what? We\u2019ve got to make sure that doesn\u2019t happen in future. We look around New Zealand, we look to Rangitoto, we look to Taranaki\u2014which was in the news today\u2014we look to the earthquake fault that this city lies on, and we know it\u2019s going to happen.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000580\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f7fc7ac3-5ce1-43ca-8cd6-dbb0941bf3ae\u0022\u003EI must say this: Christchurch is best placed to understand what those challenges are. We\u2019re having a symposium in Christchurch very soon to revisit the symposium which the last Government deferred because it didn\u2019t want to look at these questions. Well, we\u2019re going to be really open and transparent. We\u2019re going to look at those things and learn the lessons that need to be learnt, both from within New Zealand and from overseas. We\u2019re going to examine that and share it so that this nation is prepared and resilient for the challenges that lie ahead, and they are substantial.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000581\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f7fc7ac3-5ce1-43ca-8cd6-dbb0941bf3ae\u0022\u003EOf course, the member across the Chamber did do a lot of work around the Christchurch Cathedral, that icon of Christchurch, and there is, in all, $25 million set aside for that\u2014a $10 million grant and a $15 million suspensory loan. So what we\u2019re going to do is we\u2019re going to move Christchurch ahead, and this Budget does it. It shows that this Government is a Government that cares, that manages, and that gets on. Thank you, Mr Speaker.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca id=\u00222649a764cdf847b9a620a56a086a330b\u0022 name=\u0022division\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EA party vote was called for on the question, That the Appropriation (2017/18 Supplementary Estimates) Bill and the Imprest Supply (First for 2018/19) Bill be now read a second time.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EAyes 63\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand Labour 46; New Zealand First 9; Green Party 8.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENoes 56\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand National 55; ACT New Zealand 1.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EBills read a second time.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n    \u003C/div\u003E\n    \u003Cdiv class=\u0022HpsHansard\u0022\u003E\n      \u003Cp\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsProceedingHeading\u0022\u003EBills\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000582\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u0022225ec07eaf5b4873876a75eb18ccaec4\u0022\u003EAppropriation (2017/18 Supplementary Estimates) Bill\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000583\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u00224591157f3f294a85b7ebad3aef2fe587\u0022\u003EThird Reading\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022c3a88c42-f60b-4cf9-8065-8bfb80a020eb\u0022 data-id=\u00229720c9e8ade84d3cac45a95cf2eb74fd\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000584\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c3a88c42-f60b-4cf9-8065-8bfb80a020eb\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00229720c9e8ade84d3cac45a95cf2eb74fd\u0022\u003EHon CARMEL SEPULONI (Minister for Social Development)\u003C/span\u003E on behalf of the Minister of Finance: I move, That the Appropriation (2017/18 Supplementary Estimates) Bill be now read a third time. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca id=\u00229cc61864541a4c6784479a4f33411063\u0022 name=\u0022division\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EA party vote was called for on the question, That the Appropriation (2017/18 Supplementary Estimates) Bill be now read a third time.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EAyes 63\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand Labour 46; New Zealand First 9; Green Party 8.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENoes 56\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand National 55; ACT New Zealand 1.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EBill read a third time.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n    \u003C/div\u003E\n    \u003Cdiv class=\u0022HpsHansard\u0022\u003E\n      \u003Cp\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsProceedingHeading\u0022\u003EBills\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000585\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u00225f43bba2a4ca4463a5489640936aa552\u0022\u003EImprest Supply (First for 2018/19) Bill\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000586\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u0022b5549e1d8aa645c3b0aac58b16da983c\u0022\u003EThird Reading\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022c3a88c42-f60b-4cf9-8065-8bfb80a020eb\u0022 data-id=\u00228016645bab4a471e95780441d7c40207\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000587\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c3a88c42-f60b-4cf9-8065-8bfb80a020eb\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00228016645bab4a471e95780441d7c40207\u0022\u003EHon CARMEL SEPULONI (Minister for Social Development) \u003C/span\u003Eon behalf of the Minister of Finance: I move, That the Imprest Supply (First for 2018/19) Bill be now read a third time. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca id=\u00221ae69b19f0c84f7492c2e980c6047109\u0022 name=\u0022division\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EA party vote was called for on the question, That the Imprest Supply (First for 2018/19) Bill be now read a third time.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EAyes 63\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand Labour 46; New Zealand First 9; Green Party 8.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENoes 56\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand National 55; ACT New Zealand 1.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EBill read a third time.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n    \u003C/div\u003E\n    \u003Cdiv class=\u0022HpsHansard\u0022\u003E\n      \u003Cp\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsProceedingHeading\u0022\u003EBills\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000588\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u002245f084ae4dec423483e9628151f69aeb\u0022\u003ELand Transport Management (Regional Fuel Tax) Amendment Bill\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000589\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u002277c9fb14e8a34d37a18da2ec7e15069a\u0022\u003EIn Committee\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000590\u0022\u003EDebate resumed from 19 June.\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000591\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u0022eaf971fdf205471aa8cb8ca7020c08c5\u0022\u003EPart 2  Amendments to other Acts (continued)\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022 data-id=\u0022f7939896a50648e4a314e8186267eee6\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000592\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022f7939896a50648e4a314e8186267eee6\u0022\u003EHon Dr NICK SMITH (National\u2014Nelson):\u003C/span\u003E The key clause in Part 2 of this bill is in respect of the application of the GST to the regional fuel tax. I particularly on this clause want to challenge the New Zealand First Party because their leader has given speeches, and I have it on record, in almost every corner of New Zealand, calling it a gross injustice of a tax on a tax\u2014that imposing GST on a fuel tax is wrong. The part that has me gobsmacked is that not once in this debate has the leader of New Zealand First, who can give the speech in every corner of New Zealand that it\u2019s wrong to impose a tax on a tax\u2014neither he\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000593\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a434482b-7ac1-4862-9ce7-13e63289dee3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00224fe92491e45740e8944efd722bde6bc1\u0022\u003ECHAIRPERSON (Adrian Rurawhe)\u003C/span\u003E: I\u2019m sorry to interrupt the honourable member, but it has come time for me to leave the chair for the dinner break.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000594\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a434482b-7ac1-4862-9ce7-13e63289dee3\u0022\u003ESitting suspended from 6 p.m. to 7.30 p.m.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000595\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00224c815aac9c69466c93727af5306c56e2\u0022\u003EHon Dr NICK SMITH\u003C/span\u003E: Prior to the dinner break I was making the point that in Part 2 of this bill and in clause 7 in respect of GST, we are passing a proposed provision that would make absolutely explicit the application of GST to this regional petrol tax. I commented that when I searched our dear friend \u201CMr Google\u201D, I found 234 references to the Rt Hon Winston Peters saying that a tax on a tax was wrong.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000596\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003EIn fact, let me just go through the communities where Mr Peters made that statement: he made it in Invercargill, he made it in Queenstown, he made it in Dunedin, he made it in Greymouth, he made it in Christchurch, I\u2019ve got a record of him saying it in the Marlborough Express\u2014I say to my colleague Stuart Smith\u2014he said it in the Nelson Mail, he said it in the Dominion Post, he said it in Taranaki, and he said it in the Manawat\u016B. He said, in every corner of New Zealand, that imposing GST on the excise tax was wrong. In fact, he used even stronger language\u2014he said it was immoral. Well here\u2019s my question: why is it possible for New Zealand First\u2014Jenny Marcroft\u2014to give speeches in every corner of this land decrying GST on the excise tax and then not only not give a single speech in this Chamber but vote for it. There\u2019s an \u201Ch\u201D word for that, which I\u2019m not allowed to use.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000597\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003EBut I challenge members opposite, and particularly the representative from New Zealand First: how come you can campaign, by my record, in seven elections as New Zealand First policy that putting a tax on a tax is wrong and then vote for it? I\u2019d love to hear an explanation from Labour members opposite as to how the acting Prime Minister can so blatantly act completely against such a clear public record of opposing GST on an excise tax. Or has this Government descended to that point\u2014\u201CWell, it doesn\u2019t matter a toss what we said to the electorate.\u201D\u2014for New Zealand First to say \u201CIt does not matter what we said to electors, we are just breaching our word.\u201D?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000598\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003EI say that the last Government that so blatantly breached its word was the Labour Government from 1984 to 1990, and it got tossed out of office in the biggest landslide in the history of this New Zealand Parliament. I say to members that unless they have a death wish, unless they too want to be thrown out for so blatantly dishonouring what you have said to communities all over New Zealand\u2014now I know I have the attention of Ms Marcroft, I say to her: why has your party told communities all over New Zealand that you oppose a GST? [Bell rung]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000599\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003EI raise a point of order, Mr Chairperson. Why is it that the clock, in terms of my speaking time, provides me for four minutes and yet the bell has rung?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022a434482b-7ac1-4862-9ce7-13e63289dee3\u0022 data-id=\u0022f7f92869ac2543ed84d6717bb536de4e\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000600\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a434482b-7ac1-4862-9ce7-13e63289dee3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022f7f92869ac2543ed84d6717bb536de4e\u0022\u003ECHAIRPERSON (Adrian Rurawhe)\u003C/span\u003E: Just for members\u2019 information, if the time left on the clock\u2014and the member will remember I said that he had four minutes remaining. When it\u2019s less than five minutes, we count up, not down, and so the member\u2019s four minutes has expired.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022071f7800-2755-41b6-83df-07ebaf867ae2\u0022 data-id=\u002230ffb8c2e2654d1999a3f71992a82808\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000601\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022071f7800-2755-41b6-83df-07ebaf867ae2\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002230ffb8c2e2654d1999a3f71992a82808\u0022\u003ETIM VAN DE MOLEN (National\u2014Waikato):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Mr Chair. Look, I rise to take a call on Part 2 of the Land Transport Management (Regional Fuel Tax) Amendment Bill. My intent here is to include an amendment to clause 10(5) where we insert a new section 34B(3) into the Local Government Act 2002. So what we\u2019re talking about here, and I think it\u2019s appropriate just to reflect on section 34B(1) and (2)\u2014so this is additional information for the regional fuel tax schemes. What we\u2019re proposing under those two, indeed, in the current proposal of the bill, is that \u201CThe regional council of an RFT region\u201D\u2014regional fuel tax region\u2014\u201Cin its annual report,\u201D must report on the revenue paid to the council, it must report on how that revenue was applied, which projects, and for what purposes that was allocated, and also any progress with respect to the programme of capital projects. So that was new subsection (1), and then under new subsection (2) it goes on to outline some of the definitions within that to capture that succinctly.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000602\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022071f7800-2755-41b6-83df-07ebaf867ae2\u0022\u003ESo what I am proposing here with new subsection (3) is to actually signal the intent\u2014so a precursor, if you will\u2014to that original subpart requiring a report on the progress of the revenue and associated expenditure, and actually requiring an outline of that in advance. So the wording I am proposing is \u201CIn conjunction with councils application for a Regional Fuel Tax councils must produce a report for ratepayers on their forecasted spending priorities in relation to the revenue obtained from the RFT and make this publicly available.\u201D As I mentioned, it\u2019s about signalling the intent so that ratepayers can justifiably have an understanding of what their council is proposing to cover with their request for a regional fuel tax.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000603\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022071f7800-2755-41b6-83df-07ebaf867ae2\u0022\u003EOf course, the regional fuel tax has to be for specific purposes within that council\u2019s jurisdiction and should not be to cover poor funding management, as we are actually seeing under the Auckland Council at the moment. Indeed, actually, we\u2019ve heard already under the discussion last night of Part 1 that had Mayor Phil Goff met his obligation, his promise, his commitment to reduce council expenditure, there would actually be no need for this regional fuel tax.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000604\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022071f7800-2755-41b6-83df-07ebaf867ae2\u0022\u003EThat aside, and coming back to my proposal here, this is what I\u2019m proposing to be a requirement to make it publicly notified in advance what the intent is of those spending priorities alongside the application process for councils. Really, we\u2019re trying to demonstrate appropriate transparency. We\u2019ve heard a lot from this Government about transparency and how important that is. It would be fantastic if we saw that demonstrated as well. Although that is questionable\u2014and certainly on this side we haven\u2019t seen it demonstrated anywhere near what we would like to\u2014that is what we should be seeing from all levels of governance. Certainly in this aspect, in the application for a regional fuel tax the amendment I\u2019m proposing under the Local Government Act 2002, would require those councils to be fully transparent, up front, so their ratepayers can, indeed, have a clear understanding on what their proposal is, how that\u2019s forecasted to be spent, and the objectives envisaged to be obtained as a result of that.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000605\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022071f7800-2755-41b6-83df-07ebaf867ae2\u0022\u003ESo, yes, this may create, and likely will create, additional work for the council in having to outline that detail, but it is important and justified, I believe, in giving that transparency to their ratepayers. Also, when you go through that sort of a process, what it actually does is help crystallise the focus or the priorities in terms of what you\u2019re achieving to really reflect on what the aspects are that are critical to any particular proposal, rather than perhaps getting caught up in some of the higher-level or more pie-in-the-sky wishes that might indeed come off the back of an application being expanded into areas that could perhaps be frivolous.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000606\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022071f7800-2755-41b6-83df-07ebaf867ae2\u0022\u003ESo really, just to recap, we\u2019re looking at, here, including a precursor to the already proposed new section 34B(1) and (2)\u2014although it will come in as section 34B(3). That would provide, in advance, an outline of what we\u2019re anticipating it to be spent on under these sections. I look forward to taking another call shortly on the GST Act. Thank you.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022cbc37df2-57ae-4536-94ed-a2e39eecd585\u0022 data-id=\u0022fe636df1addf4b128b3559b10f78374f\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000607\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cbc37df2-57ae-4536-94ed-a2e39eecd585\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022fe636df1addf4b128b3559b10f78374f\u0022\u003EHon PHIL TWYFORD (Minister of Transport):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Mr Chairman. Let me make some comments in response to the last couple of contributions.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000608\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cbc37df2-57ae-4536-94ed-a2e39eecd585\u0022\u003EWe\u2019ve heard a great number of contributions from members on the Opposition benches about clause 7 in Part 2, which requires that GST be added on to the regional fuel tax when it\u2019s paid by fuel distributors to the New Zealand Transport Agency (NZTA)\u2014so not at the retail end, not at point of sale, but by the fuel distributors\u2014and a number of Opposition members have suggested that this increases the cost of fuel to Auckland consumers from 10c to 11.5c.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000609\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022071f7800-2755-41b6-83df-07ebaf867ae2\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022d3b2786d9cbe4ac6bb2d02aab4df0bfb\u0022\u003ETim van de Molen\u003C/span\u003E: I raise a point of order, Mr Chairperson. Apologies to interrupt the Minister\u2014we are having trouble hearing. The microphone perhaps could do with adjustment, or I\u2019m not sure if it\u2019s working.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000610\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a434482b-7ac1-4862-9ce7-13e63289dee3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022fd4f32753f624812bbc3b3c77419aecf\u0022\u003EASSISTANT SPEAKER (Adrian Rurawhe)\u003C/span\u003E: I\u2019m sure the technicians have heard and, hopefully, have resolved the issue. We\u2019ll give it another go.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000611\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cbc37df2-57ae-4536-94ed-a2e39eecd585\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00222110fa70790446b180645c2abb93fd0e\u0022\u003EHon PHIL TWYFORD\u003C/span\u003E: Thank you for that very considerate contribution. So the suggestion that\u2019s been made by Opposition members is that the requirement in clause 7 that GST be paid by the fuel distributors to NZTA at the wholesale end, not at the retail end, is somehow adding to the cost that\u2019s being paid by consumers. That suggestion is quite wrong.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000612\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cbc37df2-57ae-4536-94ed-a2e39eecd585\u0022\u003EAll of those businesses will be registered for GST. They claim back the GST in the regular course of their interest, so they don\u2019t pass that on. So it\u2019s quite wrong, and shows a real misunderstanding by Opposition members. The fuel companies are required to charge GST on the retail price of the fuel that they sell, not the wholesale. So whether or not they have to pay GST, which they would because undoubtedly all of them will be registered for GST, that amount does not get passed on to the consumer.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000613\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cbc37df2-57ae-4536-94ed-a2e39eecd585\u0022\u003EI want to comment on Tim van de Molen\u2019s amendment, which seeks to add some obligations on to the councils who would be taking advantage of the provisions in this bill to establish a regional fuel tax. Mr van de Molen would like requirements for full consultation publicly notified in advance what the projects are going to be spent on, and it\u2019s an attempt to try to impose some kind of transparency on it. Well, I want to say to Mr van de Molen that there are already extensive obligations on any local territorial authority, any regional council, who wants to take advantage of the regional fuel tax bill. They\u2019re required to fully consult under the terms of the local government legislation and, as Lawrence Yule well knows, those requirements are onerous, to say the least.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000614\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cbc37df2-57ae-4536-94ed-a2e39eecd585\u0022\u003EAuckland Council has just gone through extensive consultation\u2014two rounds of consultation\u2014with the public and with the elected members of the council on this. They have to provide a detailed description of what the proceeds of the fuel tax will be spent on\u2014a list of very precise, named capital projects with extensive descriptions beside each one. It cannot be spent on vague promises or operating expenditure that\u2019s not directly tied to the items of capital expenditure. So those obligations\u2014actually far more burdensome and exacting than the ones in Mr van de Molen\u2019s amendment\u2014are already in place.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022a434482b-7ac1-4862-9ce7-13e63289dee3\u0022 data-id=\u0022a89cf20149e2420082f50d7a3e234616\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000615\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a434482b-7ac1-4862-9ce7-13e63289dee3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022a89cf20149e2420082f50d7a3e234616\u0022\u003ECHAIRPERSON (Adrian Rurawhe)\u003C/span\u003E: Members, before I call the next speaker, which will be Lawrence Yule, I just want to inform the committee that the amendment in the name of Denise Lee amending the Education Act 1989 will be ruled out of order and so cannot be debated.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00220c51564f-6c6e-45cc-adab-f15b6c831fce\u0022 data-id=\u0022299dda2e71cf4a2698c34bf76fe3701d\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000616\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220c51564f-6c6e-45cc-adab-f15b6c831fce\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022299dda2e71cf4a2698c34bf76fe3701d\u0022\u003ELAWRENCE YULE (National\u2014Tukituki):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Mr Chair, and thank you to Minister Twyford for his last explanation. Yes, he\u2019s correct. I do have some knowledge of the Local Government Act and consultation. I also have some knowledge as to how councils work. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000617\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220c51564f-6c6e-45cc-adab-f15b6c831fce\u0022\u003EI want to make a couple of observations right at the beginning of this contribution. First of all, it is very easy to look at Auckland. Auckland is a unitary authority, where all the councils were put together under an amalgamation. They have one process. But this bill actually covers every other regional council in New Zealand. There are a number of other unitary authorities like Auckland: Tasman, Nelson, Gisborne, and Marlborough, from memory. All the rest are a conglomerate of territorial authorities within a regional council boundary. How local government works in those other areas, which are also subject to this legislation, is very different to Auckland because they don\u2019t always agree.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000618\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220c51564f-6c6e-45cc-adab-f15b6c831fce\u0022\u003ESo the regional council has the pre-eminent role of setting up a regional fuel tax, but I happen to know\u2014the Hon Stuart Nash also will know this\u2014that territorial authorities don\u2019t always agree. Sometimes they actually fight each other. So when you impose a regional fuel tax and you go through consultation, as the Minister has said, under this special consultative process at the beginning of this, you are assuming that for the next 10 years everybody will agree on the priorities and the projects and how it\u2019s going to happen.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000619\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220c51564f-6c6e-45cc-adab-f15b6c831fce\u0022\u003ETo be honest, I think that\u2019s naive for the rest of New Zealand. We actually have local body elections every three years. In many cases, there are new mayors who come in every three years with mandates to do things differently. I give an example: the Kapiti Expressway. Depending on which person is the mayor, they would\u2019ve made a different decision about where that\u2019s going to be and how they support it. So in year one, that project is set up on a 10-year plan of funding, but in year three, a new mayor comes along, populates the regional transport committee, and seeks to undermine the decision that was made three years ago.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000620\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220c51564f-6c6e-45cc-adab-f15b6c831fce\u0022\u003EWhy that\u2019s important, Minister, is that under section 15 of the Local Government Act, there is a thing in there called the triennial agreement. It requires every three years for all the councils in an area to agree by 31 May, post the local government elections, on a whole series of things. I\u2019ll go through them: \u201C(a) protocols for communication and co-ordination amongst the local authorities; and (b) a statement on the process by which the local authorities will comply with section 16 in respect of proposals for new regional council activities;\u201D\u2014that probably won\u2019t apply in this case\u2014\u201C(c) processes and protocols through which all local authorities can participate in identifying, delivering, and funding facilities and services of significance to more than 1 district.\u201D This is clearly that.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000621\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220c51564f-6c6e-45cc-adab-f15b6c831fce\u0022\u003ESo my suggestion\u2014and it\u2019s tabled in an amendment in my name\u2014is that clause 10(2) be amended and an amendment to the Local Government Act 2002 be made that adds a new section, section 15(8), which says that \u201CLocal authorities that concurrently exist in a single region (such as territorial and regional authorities) must include a section in the triennial agreement on the management, operation and cost sharing of a regional fuel tax scheme under subpart 3 of the Land Management Act 2003.\u201D\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000622\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220c51564f-6c6e-45cc-adab-f15b6c831fce\u0022\u003EI say that because of my significant years in local government, when most people look at the triennial agreement as a piece of paper that is never looked at again, that is compliant with the Local Government Act. Up until recently, that\u2019s all that\u2019s been done. How do we apply with the Local Government Act? We will sign the triennial agreement. There is nothing of substance in it. But I believe this is actually significant\u201410 years of funding commitment on major projects across a region actually requires agreement in the triennial agreement to force every part of that region to comply.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002258eae615-ef83-4df5-bace-6749bdd312a8\u0022 data-id=\u00220c8a1966983d4b08985b8229b26459eb\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000623\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002258eae615-ef83-4df5-bace-6749bdd312a8\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00220c8a1966983d4b08985b8229b26459eb\u0022\u003EDr PARMJEET PARMAR (National):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Mr Chair, for this opportunity to be able to contribute. I\u2019m taking this call to move the amendment in my name that is \u201CAfter clause 11, insert new Clause 12\u201D. Clause 12 is to amend the Road User Charges Act 2012. So this proposed clause amends the Road User Charges Act 2012: \u201CAt the end of section 33(3) replace \u2018.\u2019 with \u2018, and whether there is a Regional Fuel Tax scheme in place in the region where the [road-user charges] vehicle is primarily used.\u2019 \u201D The purpose of this amendment in my name is to ensure that a road-user charge collector can take into consideration the presence of a regional fuel tax when deciding whether to waive or refund a vehicle\u2019s road-user charges. Our position is very clear: ideally, we don\u2019t want to see this regional fuel tax legislation, overall, going through. But I\u2019m proposing this amendment to help businesses and also to keep the cost of living for people, especially people on superannuation, as low as possible. If Minister Twyford decides not to accept my amendment, I would like to really hear from the Minister why the Minister thinks that this amendment is not a good one to be accepted and the amendment proposed to be put in the legislation. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000624\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002258eae615-ef83-4df5-bace-6749bdd312a8\u0022\u003EI was talking to some people in Mount Roskill, and, yes, there were groups of some business people; there were groups of people there who are on superannuation. One business person that distributes their products all around the country raised this concern with me: to compete with products that are coming from overseas\u2014for some reason, some products that come from overseas, even after the shipping charge goes on them, are able to be sold at a cheaper rate than the products that are manufactured locally. So what this business does is, to compete with these products, it delivers products free of delivery charge, and this is just a tactic that the business has adopted to compete with other products. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000625\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002258eae615-ef83-4df5-bace-6749bdd312a8\u0022\u003EThe concern that this business person had was that with this regional fuel tax legislation going through\u2014in the first step they know that the Auckland Council has already approved that 11.5c per litre is going to be implemented from 1 July, and with this legislation going through it is going to be around 25c a litre. It\u2019s going to be really hard for this business person to be able to absorb the freight charge\u2014the freight charge of the deliveries that he does all around the country. He said that he might reconsider the number of positions that he has in his office. So somehow these businesses will try hard to absorb this additional cost of freight in their business, but there will be some form of impact, and that could be in terms of someone becoming unemployed. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000626\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002258eae615-ef83-4df5-bace-6749bdd312a8\u0022\u003EThen, in that conversation, we had a couple in the group that is on superannuation. Their concern is that it\u2019s not just about the fuel charge, because with freight charges going up\u2014as most of the freight is diesel, and that is where the road-user charge becomes relevant\u2014they said the cost of everything else, especially food, will also go up, and it will become really hard for people on superannuation. I\u2019m talking about families and businesses in Mount Roskill, where we know that the families already find it really hard, and this legislation is going to make it harder for them. They said that the cost of food is the biggest worry they have. As a couple they like to go out once a week, and they were saying that they will have to reconsider their once-a-week outing because even the restaurant food will go up, because it is not just about the petrol prices going up, but it\u2019s about everything else that is linked to petrol or diesel. Everything else that is delivered through various freight mechanisms\u2014the costs of those things are also going to go up. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000627\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002258eae615-ef83-4df5-bace-6749bdd312a8\u0022\u003EIt\u2019s really important that we take into consideration people\u2014those who are on superannuation, businesses that really want to make sure that they\u2019re doing well and are able to employ more people\u2014so that they are not affected. So that\u2019s why I am proposing this amendment in my name that is that a road-user charge collector can take into consideration the presence of a regional fuel tax when deciding whether to waive or refund a vehicle\u2019s road-user charges. This would give some form of relief to businesses, because they will be able to continue their practice of doing deliveries that are free of charge, and also the cost of food and other things\u2014[Time expired]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022872744a3-2256-4cdd-a4cc-939836dc2b11\u0022 data-id=\u0022b002d7b58693489a94866cf6dd85e81f\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000628\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022872744a3-2256-4cdd-a4cc-939836dc2b11\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022b002d7b58693489a94866cf6dd85e81f\u0022\u003EPRIYANCA RADHAKRISHNAN (Labour):\u003C/span\u003E I move, That the question be now put.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022a434482b-7ac1-4862-9ce7-13e63289dee3\u0022 data-id=\u00229957a1f654134cb282da24a110624f02\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000629\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a434482b-7ac1-4862-9ce7-13e63289dee3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00229957a1f654134cb282da24a110624f02\u0022\u003ECHAIRPERSON (Adrian Rurawhe)\u003C/span\u003E: I call Chris Penk.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000630\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00228a1cb04e-8a86-44d1-9004-6e158e220339\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022cea96981c5f748dda225bb53ae499f51\u0022\u003EHon Tim Macindoe\u003C/span\u003E: Oh, really?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022f96cdca1-b63c-4602-b2b3-276f58ebb518\u0022 data-id=\u0022836058a26be34e4e9e7d6b0193b4c687\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000631\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f96cdca1-b63c-4602-b2b3-276f58ebb518\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022836058a26be34e4e9e7d6b0193b4c687\u0022\u003ECHRIS PENK (National\u2014Helensville):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Mr Chair. Your decision was more popular in some parts of these benches than others. It\u2019s possibly even less popular with me than with those colleagues who missed out. I wish to speak to a tabled amendment in my name\u2014an idea that had just come to me so freshly that the ink is still drying on the paper. It is none the less a thoughtful, I think, and worthwhile amendment, and I wish to speak to it in the following terms. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000632\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f96cdca1-b63c-4602-b2b3-276f58ebb518\u0022\u003EThere are five main points I wish to make speaking to a new clause 12 inserting new section 26B into the Local Government Act 2002, which would read as follows: \u201CIn the event of a reorganisation of local authorities where a Regional Fuel Tax is established in one of the regions, the tax will become obsolete.\u201D The five reasons that I propose this amendment are as follows. I will speak to each of these in some detail throughout the rest of my contribution, but, briefly, in outline first, they are: one, not subverting the intention of the reorganisation effort; two, not subverting the intention of the regional fuel tax itself; three, to acknowledge that the region in the regional fuel tax is different following the reorganisation to that which existed prior to such reorganisation; four, to ensure the consultation process takes place; and five, to ensure the integrity of the alignment between the projects that had been contemplated at first and the geographical area to which those apply. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000633\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f96cdca1-b63c-4602-b2b3-276f58ebb518\u0022\u003ETaking the first of those, the desire not to subvert the intention of the reorganisation, it seems to me clear that in the case of local authorities being realigned, or reorganised, as we might say, the intention of such reorganisation would be to create a new set of entities, or a new entity, as the case may be, to apply to a certain region. If the arrangements that were in place in relation to a different region were then carried over, then it could fairly be said, I think, that the object of the reorganisation\u2014the desire to provide somewhat of a clean slate and a fresh start\u2014could be said to be defeated.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000634\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f96cdca1-b63c-4602-b2b3-276f58ebb518\u0022\u003ESecondly, in relation to the desire to avert the subverting of the intention of the regional fuel tax, it would have to be acknowledged, I think, by all in this committee that the purpose of a regional fuel tax is to apply to a specific region that exists at the time that the fuel tax was brought into force. So if a different region were to exist, then surely the arrangements for the tax that would apply to the region should be different as well.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000635\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f96cdca1-b63c-4602-b2b3-276f58ebb518\u0022\u003EThat point really leads to my third point, which goes to the heart of what a regional fuel tax is, which, of course, as it says on the tin, is very much a tax on fuel in a region or regions. So, again, without wishing to belabour the point\u2014or perhaps specifically because I do wish to belabour the point\u2014with a different region in place following the reorganisation of local authorities, a different regional fuel tax regime, or the absence of such a regime, should apply.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000636\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f96cdca1-b63c-4602-b2b3-276f58ebb518\u0022\u003EFourth, to ensure that consultation takes place is an important aspect of my amendment. If consultation takes place with one set of ratepayers and residents of a geographical area, and then a different geographical area is created as a result of the reorganisation and a different set of residents and ratepayers thereby is created, then the consultation that had taken place among the first set of residents might produce a different outcome, or might have produced a different outcome, from that which will be the result of consulting with the second set of residents and ratepayers\u2014namely that created post-reorganisation.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000637\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f96cdca1-b63c-4602-b2b3-276f58ebb518\u0022\u003EMy fifth and final point, Mr Chair, as highlighted, and no doubt, therefore, keenly anticipated by you and, indeed, all this committee\u2014perhaps all the country, if I may be so bold\u2014is to maintain the integrity of the alignment of the projects that were contemplated in relation to the first iteration of the regional fuel tax\u2014namely that in the regional authority that existed prior to the reorganisation and the geographical area to which those apply.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00228a1cb04e-8a86-44d1-9004-6e158e220339\u0022 data-id=\u002206d8d65490094e52afae4348cff3c3fe\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000638\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00228a1cb04e-8a86-44d1-9004-6e158e220339\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002206d8d65490094e52afae4348cff3c3fe\u0022\u003EHon TIM MACINDOE (National\u2014Hamilton West):\u003C/span\u003E T\u0113n\u0101 koe e Te Mana Whakaw\u0101. Kia ora, e Te Whare. Thank you for the call. Just before I resume where I was interrupted last night on Part 2 of this bill, can I just make the point to some of the inexperienced new members opposite that we have only had around about an hour of debate so far on Part 2 of the bill, and, frankly, I\u2019m outraged that they\u2019re already trying to shut down the debate when members on this side of the Chamber have tabled a large number of amendments, many of which have not yet even received a mention, let alone an opportunity for debate. So I would anticipate that we would still be debating this at least until early next week, and they should, instead of trying to shut down debate on an issue of huge importance to New Zealanders right around the country, actually get engaged in that debate and justify to their constituents\u2014particularly if they\u2019re outside the Auckland area\u2014as to why Part 2 of this bill should suddenly be applying to all of them.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000639\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00228a1cb04e-8a86-44d1-9004-6e158e220339\u0022\u003EAs I mentioned, I was in mid-flight on Part 2 of this bill when my last call was interrupted. I\u2019d just like to ask, while the Minister is in the chair, if an answer was provided, because I raised what I thought was quite a serious point under the amendments to the Goods and Services Tax Act 1985\u2014this is clause 7 in Part 2\u2014as to whether, in fact, there was a drafting error. I\u2019m just wondering if the Minister could perhaps indicate by a nod\u2014because I wasn\u2019t in the Chamber later\u2014whether he responded to that point.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000640\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00228a1cb04e-8a86-44d1-9004-6e158e220339\u0022\u003EHe hasn\u2019t responded to that point, so I want to repeat my query as to whether, in fact, the suggestion that in new section 5(6BB), \u201C(a) any amount of regional fuel tax \u2026 that is paid is treated as being consideration for a supply of services in the course or furtherance of a taxable activity carried on\u201D\u2014and that\u2019s the key word here\u2014\u201Cby the New Zealand Transport Agency, as an agent for and on behalf of the local authority\u201D, etc., etc. My query was whether the word \u201Con\u201D is a drafting error, because \u201Ccarrying on\u201D normally implies playing up or acting the goat; it certainly doesn\u2019t suggest a sensible piece of legislation, and I\u2019m wondering whether the word should have been \u201Cout\u201D not \u201Con\u201D. I\u2019m sorry that that point hasn\u2019t been clarified. I very much hope that it will be, because I don\u2019t see how the House could be expected, intentionally, to consider, let alone to adopt, something that contains a drafting error.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000641\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00228a1cb04e-8a86-44d1-9004-6e158e220339\u0022\u003ELet me return to the point that I was beginning to discuss during my last call, and that is relating to the changes to the Local Government Act in clause 10 of Part 2. I was making the point that the new section 34B of that Act specifies something that I think is an appalling deceit, because at no point prior to the initial discussions and advocacy from some parts of Auckland for this tax was it ever suggested that it would apply outside the Auckland region, yet when one reads section 34B, \u201CAdditional Information: RFT Schemes\u201D, subsection (1) says, \u201CThe regional council of an RFT region, in its annual report, must report\u201D\u2014an RFT region. In other words, \u201CHere we\u2019ve suddenly found we\u2019ve gone well beyond Auckland; this could apply to anybody.\u201D I made the point last night: watch out, New Zealand, because this is coming to a town near you.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000642\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00228a1cb04e-8a86-44d1-9004-6e158e220339\u0022\u003EI am asking how such a deceit, which was not consulted upon, certainly in my area, could suddenly now be adopted into legislation, and even\u2014and I dispute this\u2014if it is seen as some sort of solution to Auckland\u2019s problems, how it can possibly be one\u2014and I\u2019d like to pick up on the point that my good friend Mr Smith, the MP for Kaik\u014Dura, was making last night: how can it possibly be a solution for the people of D\u2019urville Island or of the Awatere Valley, who already have to travel huge distances to, let\u2019s say, just get to the shops? To apply such a capricious tax on them in such a sneaky fashion is totally unjustified, and yet this is now being written into the Local Government Act without any mandate whatsoever, not only from the people of D\u2019urville Island but anywhere else around the country.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000643\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00228a1cb04e-8a86-44d1-9004-6e158e220339\u0022\u003EI ask you not just to take my word for it, but to take the word of a former Labour MP, the Road Transport Forum Chief Executive, Ken Shirley, who put out a press statement today describing this as a really bad idea of an Auckland regional fuel tax which has become contagious and is now infecting various other parts of the country. \u201CFrom 2021\u201D, said Mr Shirley, \u201Cevery regional and unitary council in the country can apply to the Government for the right to impose a 10c a litre (plus GST) regional fuel tax on their communities.\u201D So I would like to ask the Minister to respond to Mr Shirley\u2019s\u2014[Time expired]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002226b88bf1-f634-40e7-8019-e75cc483ace7\u0022 data-id=\u00222ece9bb97ec9490491a3ac4c9a454f6c\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000644\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002226b88bf1-f634-40e7-8019-e75cc483ace7\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00222ece9bb97ec9490491a3ac4c9a454f6c\u0022\u003EJO LUXTON (Labour):\u003C/span\u003E I move, That the question be now put.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022094b0ff4-e404-451b-b4a9-ad12bd4dee56\u0022 data-id=\u00225da44edd2ad8455a829aaed2714f3cac\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000645\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022094b0ff4-e404-451b-b4a9-ad12bd4dee56\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00225da44edd2ad8455a829aaed2714f3cac\u0022\u003ESTUART SMITH (National\u2014Kaik\u014Dura):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Mr Chair. It\u2019s a great pleasure to speak for the first time on Part 2 of the Land Transport Management (Regional Fuel Tax) Amendment Bill. It was with great disappointment last night, I have to report, that I had two tabled amendments that I did not get a chance or an opportunity to speak on. I have a tabled amendment\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000646\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a434482b-7ac1-4862-9ce7-13e63289dee3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022d2702f5577904625bd9c05abf8e35d93\u0022\u003ECHAIRPERSON (Adrian Rurawhe)\u003C/span\u003E: We\u2019re on Part 2.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000647\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022094b0ff4-e404-451b-b4a9-ad12bd4dee56\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00226b1a91d085124c3c9af71f0f8d9ac667\u0022\u003ESTUART SMITH\u003C/span\u003E: I know that, Mr Chair, but I am pointing out that last night I did not get the opportunity to speak on those amendments, and I hope that this evening I will get the opportunity to speak on my other tabled amendments apart from the one I\u2019m just about to address.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000648\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022094b0ff4-e404-451b-b4a9-ad12bd4dee56\u0022\u003EIt is with great disappointment that I look on the other side of the Chamber and see them trying to shut this debate down when we have not even discussed our tabled amendments. This is my first call, and we\u2019re entitled to four calls, I believe, on a part, and I think that\u2019s what we should be able to do.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000649\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002251630a79dd774612ab7322977198f19c\u0022\u003EHon Member\u003C/span\u003E: As a minimum, surely.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000650\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022094b0ff4-e404-451b-b4a9-ad12bd4dee56\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022e54321f59c4a4a76ab95c7c0074d0f54\u0022\u003ESTUART SMITH\u003C/span\u003E: As a minimum, yes. I\u2019m very delighted that I now have this opportunity.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000651\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a434482b-7ac1-4862-9ce7-13e63289dee3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022cdf783f8cc644ff889f541ac1976e206\u0022\u003ECHAIRPERSON (Adrian Rurawhe)\u003C/span\u003E: That\u2019s one minute gone without mentioning anything.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000652\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022094b0ff4-e404-451b-b4a9-ad12bd4dee56\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00220023c7c1d6a341f1bc2cd452f963c2ad\u0022\u003ESTUART SMITH\u003C/span\u003E: OK.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000653\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a434482b-7ac1-4862-9ce7-13e63289dee3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a382a2fb856144b9bad0570e0e1b1abe\u0022\u003ECHAIRPERSON (Adrian Rurawhe)\u003C/span\u003E: Please do.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000654\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022094b0ff4-e404-451b-b4a9-ad12bd4dee56\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00224dab12c75f234a5e88c77e5917a11ff9\u0022\u003ESTUART SMITH\u003C/span\u003E: All right, Mr Chair. Now, I am proposing, in clause 10, to add in a new paragraph to new section 34B, inserting section 34B(1)(d): \u201Cthe cost benefit analysis that the Council has undertaken in relation to where the revenue was spent.\u201D That should be read, of course, after paragraph (b), which is: \u201Chow [the] revenue was applied by the council, including to which projects and \u2026 what purposes (for example, capital [expenditure], debt repayment, operational [expenditure]);\u201D etc. So this is very important, and I think it fits well with the tabled amendment in the name of Tim van de Molen, which I think was a new subsection (3) of that very clause.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000655\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022094b0ff4-e404-451b-b4a9-ad12bd4dee56\u0022\u003EI think if you have tax, then you have a responsibility to spend it correctly, and I think you have an obligation to your ratepayers to ensure that you report that correctly. Tax is very much like a drug: it\u2019s highly addictive, and councils and like with a drug, Governments become so dependent on that tax that it has quite significant impacts on them. In the sense of a drug, it has an impact on the body and changes in the body, and if we use that as an analogy for a Government or for a council, then what we see is it forming fat\u2014fat in terms of lazy spending and staff doing jobs that are not required.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000656\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022094b0ff4-e404-451b-b4a9-ad12bd4dee56\u0022\u003EI think a good example, when we have schemes that might be paid for under a regional fuel tax\u2014let\u2019s, for example, say a sewerage scheme. We have a lot of expenditure on a sewerage scheme, like with the Kaipara District Council, that got itself in a lot of trouble. Had it had really close management and reporting regimes back to its ratepayers, I don\u2019t think it would have got in the trouble it did at that time. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000657\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022094b0ff4-e404-451b-b4a9-ad12bd4dee56\u0022\u003EIf I look in my own council, the Marlborough District Council in the town of Blenheim, they would likely line up, I think, for a regional fuel tax. The town is growing significantly. The building inspectors tell me there\u2019s a greater boom than there was in 2008, so that\u2019s an amazing amount of building going on, but there\u2019s a significant sewerage infrastructure upgrade that\u2019s required, and a regional fuel tax might well be the vehicle they use to fund that scheme or that expansion. But how do the ratepayers know they are getting value for money? How do they know that that scheme is actually being delivered in a form that will be good for everyone at a reasonable cost? What would be required, certainly in a business sector, would be strict reporting and cost-benefit analysis on that particular scheme to ensure that people are getting what they pay for and no more. We don\u2019t need more than we set out to pay for, and we want to ensure that the efficiencies run right through the system, because I can assure you that if money is sitting there, they will spend it, and they will spend it even if it isn\u2019t necessary or good quality spending. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000658\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022094b0ff4-e404-451b-b4a9-ad12bd4dee56\u0022\u003ESo I think clause 10 has some really good possibilities in it, but it does need rounding out with Mr van de Molen\u2019s amendment and suggested addition, and with my amendment inserting new section 34B(1)(d) to add \u201Cthe cost benefit analysis that the Council has undertaken in relation to where the revenue was spent.\u201D So, with that, Mr Chair, I thank you.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022163d0b68-eb0e-4094-9bed-99e184f063e1\u0022 data-id=\u00222353e7f4fe944b54ae1ef2cdc8fdc093\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000659\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022163d0b68-eb0e-4094-9bed-99e184f063e1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00222353e7f4fe944b54ae1ef2cdc8fdc093\u0022\u003EJAMI-LEE ROSS (National\u2014Botany):\u003C/span\u003E I raise a point of order, Mr Chairperson. I raise this point of order because earlier in the night, you ruled out an amendment in Denise Lee\u2019s name. It inserts a new clause 12. I ask that you hear this point of order because there will be other amendments that seek to insert new clause 12 amendments as well. My understanding, in discussions with staff in the building, is that one of the reasons why this amendment was ruled out is because it incorporates an amendment to another piece of legislation\u2014in this case, the Education Act\u2014and, just for ease of understanding, in this case, the amendment in Denise Lee\u2019s name would have made some changes to section 139D which would have provided a requirement for the ministry to take an action in response to the regional fuel tax legislation. In this case, it\u2019s around school transport.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000660\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022163d0b68-eb0e-4094-9bed-99e184f063e1\u0022\u003EThere are other amendments that are going to be coming along which will make amendments to other Acts as well that we\u2019re wanting to put forward. I don\u2019t believe it would be right, on a wholesale basis\u2014and I anticipate this may be a consideration you\u2019re giving. I don\u2019t believe it would be accurate to, on a wholesale basis, say any amendments that seek to insert a new clause 12 that incorporate another piece of legislation that is not already in the bill\u2014I don\u2019t believe that would be the right decision, because I submit to you that Part 2 already does include amendments to other pieces of legislation that are not required to make the regional fuel tax scheme workable.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000661\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022163d0b68-eb0e-4094-9bed-99e184f063e1\u0022\u003EFor example, Part 2 includes some amendments to the Local Government Act around reporting. If the argument was that it must be an amendment in Part 2 that is required to make Part 1 work\u2014if that was the argument\u2014then I think that could be a basis for ruling out amendments. But, in fact, we already have in Part 2 a particular proposed change to a piece of legislation that is not required to implement the regional fuel tax scheme, because reporting is not required for implementing the scheme.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000662\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022163d0b68-eb0e-4094-9bed-99e184f063e1\u0022\u003ESo I submit to you that it is in order for members of Parliament to put forward amendments which seek to amend other pieces of legislation if it can be related to the regional fuel tax scheme, as the proposed amendments in the Minister\u2019s name already seek to do. Because we have the ability to consider issues related to a regional fuel tax scheme, such as the Local Government Act amendments, we should have the ability to put forward other amendments and other Supplementary Order Papers which seek to amend other Acts of Parliament, because those are legitimate debating points about consequential issues that may arise that can be linked back to the regional fuel tax scheme. I don\u2019t believe Part 2 as it\u2019s currently drafted in the bill solely contains issues that must be addressed to make a regional fuel tax scheme workable.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000663\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022163d0b68-eb0e-4094-9bed-99e184f063e1\u0022\u003EThere are other issues that are superfluous but are related to the regional fuel tax scheme. We should also have the ability to put forward amendments that, while superfluous to making a regional fuel tax scheme workable, are still worthwhile of debate, and I submit to you that when you give consideration to making rulings on future amendments that we put forward or may have already put forward, you give consideration to the fact that the bill already contains matters very, very similar to what Denise Lee proposed and was ruled out and what other members may be proposing as well.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022a8cab3e3-b023-4ce7-9f4b-2c4137029057\u0022 data-id=\u00225b27eee6fc65447194bc12ad0c1bec75\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000664\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a8cab3e3-b023-4ce7-9f4b-2c4137029057\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00225b27eee6fc65447194bc12ad0c1bec75\u0022\u003EKIRITAPU ALLAN (Assistant Whip\u2014Labour):\u003C/span\u003E The member opposite is, effectively, trying to try to draw out a debate on a very tightly\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022a434482b-7ac1-4862-9ce7-13e63289dee3\u0022 data-id=\u00222d8eb818100347b1906466802b1cfc6d\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000665\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a434482b-7ac1-4862-9ce7-13e63289dee3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00222d8eb818100347b1906466802b1cfc6d\u0022\u003ECHAIRPERSON (Adrian Rurawhe)\u003C/span\u003E: No, no\u2014e noho. E noho. No, I don\u2019t need any of that kind help, thank you. I want to thank the member for bringing this issue to my attention, the way that he sees it. The reason why I ruled that particular amendment out was based on the fact that I believe that it should\u2019ve been part of Part 1, not of Part 2, and as a rebate, it should not be part of Part 2. However, I\u2019m going to take some further advice and come back to the committee. It may be a situation where I just allow the committee to be the master of its own destiny and make that decision for itself through a vote, but I\u2019ll take further advice on that.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022163d0b68-eb0e-4094-9bed-99e184f063e1\u0022 data-id=\u0022e155326f3e924db190b71523e5dff531\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000666\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022163d0b68-eb0e-4094-9bed-99e184f063e1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022e155326f3e924db190b71523e5dff531\u0022\u003EJAMI-LEE ROSS (National\u2014Botany):\u003C/span\u003E I raise a point of order, Mr Chairman. Thank you for giving consideration to the issue. May I make one further submission that I hope may be helpful. Whilst the proposal from Denise Lee could, one could argue, go into Part 1, we in fact are restricted\u2014were restricted\u2014by Part 1, given that Part 1 is amendments to the Land Transport Management Act. With the way in which this bill has been drafted, it, effectively, has two parts: Part 1 is all of the changes to the Land Transport Management Act, and Part 2 is all of the changes to any other Acts. Given that Denise Lee\u2019s proposed amendment would seek to amend the Education Act, it would not, in fact, have been possible to put forward Denise Lee\u2019s amendment in Part 1, because Part 1 is related to the Land Transport Management Act.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000667\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022163d0b68-eb0e-4094-9bed-99e184f063e1\u0022\u003EIf members of Parliament are of a view that we should consider as a committee amendments to other pieces of legislation which are related to a regional fuel tax scheme, the only possible avenue for them to do that, if it is contained in a different piece of legislation to the Land Transport Management Act, is to propose it in Part 2, which she\u2019s done. I ask you to consider that point also when you consider your future ruling.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022a434482b-7ac1-4862-9ce7-13e63289dee3\u0022 data-id=\u00225279678f1741494287104138bd3f4f1b\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000668\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a434482b-7ac1-4862-9ce7-13e63289dee3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00225279678f1741494287104138bd3f4f1b\u0022\u003ECHAIRPERSON (Adrian Rurawhe)\u003C/span\u003E: Thank you.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022a8cab3e3-b023-4ce7-9f4b-2c4137029057\u0022 data-id=\u002209c1a8596c384e7ca8c8aae52f3a3f1c\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000669\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a8cab3e3-b023-4ce7-9f4b-2c4137029057\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002209c1a8596c384e7ca8c8aae52f3a3f1c\u0022\u003EKIRITAPU ALLAN (Assistant Whip\u2014Labour):\u003C/span\u003E I raise a point of order, Mr Chairperson. Mr Chair, I refer you to 62/2 of the speaking orders, and the\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000670\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00228a1cb04e-8a86-44d1-9004-6e158e220339\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002207b0c501bc074b1285a451ea436face1\u0022\u003EHon Tim Macindoe\u003C/span\u003E: Speakers\u2019 rulings or the Standing Orders?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000671\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a8cab3e3-b023-4ce7-9f4b-2c4137029057\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a8e3ca82999d4d7399b9de694f1a87b9\u0022\u003EKIRITAPU ALLAN\u003C/span\u003E: Speakers\u2019 rulings\u2014thank you very much. Speakers\u2019 rulings are relatively clear that the form of drafting of a bill is to be taken into consideration in terms of length of debate. I refer to the remarks of our colleague over the other side of the House, Tim Macindoe, that mentioned that we\u2019ve been going\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000672\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a434482b-7ac1-4862-9ce7-13e63289dee3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022c2441016732c495db1102e65c83339a3\u0022\u003ECHAIRPERSON (Adrian Rurawhe)\u003C/span\u003E: Order!\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000673\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a8cab3e3-b023-4ce7-9f4b-2c4137029057\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00228db386f60df1496abdfad618e0cf0d38\u0022\u003EKIRITAPU ALLAN\u003C/span\u003E: This is a separate point of order, sir.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000674\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a434482b-7ac1-4862-9ce7-13e63289dee3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022301f189a54d345609f2a1342a624e9b7\u0022\u003ECHAIRPERSON (Adrian Rurawhe)\u003C/span\u003E: It doesn\u2019t sound like it, so can you get to\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000675\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a8cab3e3-b023-4ce7-9f4b-2c4137029057\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00221fca110bb2fa42b19bca82493acffc9d\u0022\u003EKIRITAPU ALLAN\u003C/span\u003E: It is a separate point of order, sir.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000676\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a434482b-7ac1-4862-9ce7-13e63289dee3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022e5b02beb675c45c4aa1c0af0be92a111\u0022\u003ECHAIRPERSON (Adrian Rurawhe)\u003C/span\u003E: You need to come to it now, though.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000677\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a8cab3e3-b023-4ce7-9f4b-2c4137029057\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022d17fead3bb2c4d9681982265c91d4d8b\u0022\u003EKIRITAPU ALLAN\u003C/span\u003E: Come to\u2014sorry?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000678\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a434482b-7ac1-4862-9ce7-13e63289dee3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022980145d8ff6641ffabc6d6dde2deebb6\u0022\u003ECHAIRPERSON (Adrian Rurawhe)\u003C/span\u003E: You need to come to exactly what your point of order is.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000679\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a8cab3e3-b023-4ce7-9f4b-2c4137029057\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022e1abe0acbee84ab499c54e9daf73c60d\u0022\u003EKIRITAPU ALLAN\u003C/span\u003E: We\u2019ve been debating this Part 2 for in excess of two hours. We\u2019ve seen an extensive range of amendments that\u2019ve been tabled. There\u2019s nothing in the Standing Orders that require that every single one of these amendments are considered at any length. This Part 2 is a very narrow\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022a434482b-7ac1-4862-9ce7-13e63289dee3\u0022 data-id=\u0022ed013ca7c47c4a0aac26ec303196be86\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000680\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a434482b-7ac1-4862-9ce7-13e63289dee3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022ed013ca7c47c4a0aac26ec303196be86\u0022\u003ECHAIRPERSON (Adrian Rurawhe)\u003C/span\u003E: I\u2019m on my feet\u2014[Interruption] I am on my feet; you sit down. Thank you. Whether the member likes it or not, the Chair is the sole decision maker about when to accept the closure motion\u2014OK? For accuracy, it has not been going for two hours. There are\u2014[Interruption] I\u2019m on my feet. Don\u2019t interrupt\u2014seriously, don\u2019t do that. As I said, that is a matter for the Chair to decide. There are other ways of addressing that; that is not one of them. I\u2019ll take the next call.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002298dbeffa-e059-49d5-8bbf-579cbaead9a3\u0022 data-id=\u0022389e384393754bca89dc3cdc52743af3\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000681\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002298dbeffa-e059-49d5-8bbf-579cbaead9a3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022389e384393754bca89dc3cdc52743af3\u0022\u003EHon SCOTT SIMPSON (National\u2014Coromandel):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Mr Chair. Look, this is the first opportunity I\u2019ve had to participate in this debate, either in the first part or now in the second part. I listened carefully to a contribution made earlier this evening by my very good friend the Hon Tim Macindoe, who gave some very good advice to some of the new junior members of the Government backbench. They really do need to have a much better understanding of the basic principles of democracy that exist in this House. They have come to Parliament to participate in democracy and in debate, and what do we find? They want to close that debate down\u2014they want to close that debate down at the very first opportunity.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000682\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002298dbeffa-e059-49d5-8bbf-579cbaead9a3\u0022\u003EWell, I\u2019ve got very good news for them\u2014very good news for them, indeed\u2014this is a bill that is going to be fought vigorously by this side of the House, and we\u2019ve got an awful lot of debating yet to do and a lot of very good contributions to make. This legislation is fundamentally flawed and it\u2019s going to need a lot of work to get it right\u2014indeed, if it can even be properly considered to be right in any way, shape, or form.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000683\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002298dbeffa-e059-49d5-8bbf-579cbaead9a3\u0022\u003ENow, we have got on the Table tonight a large range of amendments from Opposition members, who have been working diligently and hard on working out ways to try and find a sensible outcome for this piece of legislation, and it\u2019s part of the parliamentary process that here, in the committee stage, that\u2019s exactly what we do. Now, I know that Government members aren\u2019t keen on that kind of democratic proactivity, but they\u2019re going to have to get a little bit used to it because in a Parliament like this, actually, that\u2019s what MPs do: they come to Parliament, they come to debate the issues, they come to debate the policies, and they come to debate the fine detail of legislation like this.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000684\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002298dbeffa-e059-49d5-8bbf-579cbaead9a3\u0022\u003ESo I represent a region in the Coromandel that is going to be greatly impacted by a potential regional fuel tax, and I was horrified today to read in the media that none other than my local council\u2014my local council\u2014is considering lining up and asking for a regional fuel tax, and it got me thinking about the process that a local district council would be involved, as part of a subset of a regional council, in the imposing of an unfair, ubiquitous tax of this sort on the hard-working and dedicated people of the Thames-Coromandel District Council.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000685\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002298dbeffa-e059-49d5-8bbf-579cbaead9a3\u0022\u003ESo I have got an amendment in my name that is seeking to provide an opportunity that exists under the Local Electoral Act of 2001 for territorial authorities to have a referendum on issues such as this. We know, from other pieces of legislation and other events that have occurred recently around New Zealand, that when a certain number of citizens get together and sign a petition, they can invoke and cause to be had a referendum on matters such as this. Particularly when it comes to matters of taxation, representation is very important\u2014that old adage about no taxation without representation comes to mind.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000686\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002298dbeffa-e059-49d5-8bbf-579cbaead9a3\u0022\u003ESo my amendment would seek to insert a new clause after clause 11 in Part 2 and it would be clause 12. It would be clause 12 that would say, \u201CAmendments to Local Electoral Act 2001\u201D. Subclause (1) would say, \u201CThis section amends the Local Electoral Act 2001\u201D, and then subclause (2), \u201CAfter section 9(7) [of the Local Electoral Act 2001] insert a new clause 7(a)\u201D, which would read as follows: \u201CThe above section (7) does not apply if the subject of the referendum is a proposed or existing Regional Fuel Tax scheme. All referendum on the subject of a Regional Fuel Tax scheme must be binding.\u201D\u2014must be binding.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000687\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002298dbeffa-e059-49d5-8bbf-579cbaead9a3\u0022\u003EThe reason for that is to ensure that any referendum that is triggered as a result of the Local Electoral Act 2001 would then have to be voted on by the good citizens of a particular district, or a region, and that then, when that referendum occurred, the result would be binding. And the news for the Government would be very, very sad indeed, because I don\u2019t think that there\u2019s a region or a district in the country that would vote in a referendum of that sort for the kind of terrible taxation\u2014the impost of a fuel tax of the sort that is being proposed here\u2014in a manner that would occur in a referendum where there was a public debate, where there was a debate held among the citizenry of a district, and where arguments for and against were put to the people of the region who were going to be paying this tax. I don\u2019t think that there is a district or a region in the country that would voluntarily vote for a regional fuel tax of this sort.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000688\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002298dbeffa-e059-49d5-8bbf-579cbaead9a3\u0022\u003ESo I commend careful consideration by this committee of the whole House to my proposed amendment, and I commend the prospect to Government members\u2014particularly the new junior ones\u2014of democracy.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022f7fc7ac3-5ce1-43ca-8cd6-dbb0941bf3ae\u0022 data-id=\u002212be8e530a9a4e01a2d342e87d77b337\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000689\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f7fc7ac3-5ce1-43ca-8cd6-dbb0941bf3ae\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002212be8e530a9a4e01a2d342e87d77b337\u0022\u003EDr DUNCAN WEBB (Labour\u2014Christchurch Central):\u003C/span\u003E I move, That the question be now put.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00227940e9f2-9cea-43d5-8f16-3b470e34f47f\u0022 data-id=\u002218f11f92e49c461fad7fcae37069cefd\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000690\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227940e9f2-9cea-43d5-8f16-3b470e34f47f\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002218f11f92e49c461fad7fcae37069cefd\u0022\u003EMATT KING (National\u2014Northland):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Mr Chair. It\u2019s a pleasure to speak here on this bill. I\u2019d like to acknowledge the assistance of my colleague Harete Hipango from Whanganui, with her legal background, for the drafting of this amendment.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000691\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227940e9f2-9cea-43d5-8f16-3b470e34f47f\u0022\u003EI see in Part 2, clause 11, \u201CAmendment to Search and Surveillance Act 2012\u201D, an enforcement officer must obtain and execute a search warrant to search for evidence of offences against section 65ZC of the Land Transport Management Act 2003. Now, section 65ZC says, \u201CA person commits an offence if that person knowingly or recklessly refuses or fails to file a monthly return under section 65Q\u201D. Section 65Q says, \u201CA regional fuel taxpayer by whom a regional fuel tax is payable under a regional fuel tax scheme in respect of any supplies or transfers of fuel in a month must file with the Agency a monthly return. The return must\u2014(a) be within 20 days of the next month; and (b) be filed in the form and manner reasonably required by the Agency; and (c) contain any information and be accompanied by other documents reasonably required\u201D. If they fail to comply under section 65ZC(2), they are liable, on conviction, to a $15,000 fine, or $75,000 for an organisation. This is bureaucracy gone mad, and it\u2019s what this Government seems to love imposing on our hard-working New Zealanders.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000692\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227940e9f2-9cea-43d5-8f16-3b470e34f47f\u0022\u003ENow, I would like to submit this amendment. This section, under clause 11(2), amends the Search and Surveillance Act 2002, and section 65ZB inserts, after \u201CLand Transport Management Act 2003\u201D, the following words: \u201Can enforcement officer may obtain and execute a warrant to search for evidence of offences against section 65ZC of the Land Transport Management Act 2003 only if there shows a repeated and deliberate pattern of avoidance over 12 months\u201D. The reason I put that amendment in is because as the law stands now and as it\u2019s drafted, a person, after one month of failing to put a return, can be the subject of the execution of a search warrant to search for evidence of offences under the Act. It\u2019s my opinion that that\u2019s Draconian and, in my view, it needs to show a pattern of behaviour. So I submit that.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000693\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227940e9f2-9cea-43d5-8f16-3b470e34f47f\u0022\u003EI also believe that this regional fuel tax brings a layer of bureaucracy to businesses. Anyone that\u2019s run a business knows that this sort of legislation just makes it harder and harder to run a business. I see here under Part 2, clause 10, \u201CAmendments to Local Government Act 2002\u201D, in subclause (5), new section 34B says, \u201CThe regional council of an RFT region, in its annual report, must report on\u2014(a) the revenue from an RFT scheme paid to the council \u2026 that revenue [must be] applied by the council, including to which projects and for what purposes (for example, capital expenditures, debt repayment, operational expenditure); and (c) progress with respect to the programme of capital projects supported by the RFT scheme.\u201D I submit that this is yet another layer of bureaucracy added to the others that business owners and others under this coalition have to endure.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022163d0b68-eb0e-4094-9bed-99e184f063e1\u0022 data-id=\u0022d53b692535d843148d56028baf8c90df\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000694\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022163d0b68-eb0e-4094-9bed-99e184f063e1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022d53b692535d843148d56028baf8c90df\u0022\u003EJAMI-LEE ROSS (National\u2014Botany):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Mr Chair. I wish to speak to the tabled amendment in my name\u2014there\u2019s a couple there. The one I\u2019m speaking to in this call\u2014and I am hopeful of taking additional calls to speak to other tabled amendments, but the amendment in my name I\u2019m speaking to in this case is a new clause 12 which would make an amendment to the Social Security Act 1964. The reason I have put forward this amendment is because we know through the submissions at the Finance and Expenditure Committee and we know through commentary out there in the media by those well-versed in this topic that regional fuel taxes are regressive taxes. They also have an impact on the cost of living for people out there who have to pay them.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000695\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022163d0b68-eb0e-4094-9bed-99e184f063e1\u0022\u003EThe reason why I\u2019ve put this forward, particularly, is because of that impact on people when it comes to those who are living in greater poverty than the average person. Individuals who receive assistance from the State typically are ones that live furthest away from the CBD of a city. They typically are the ones that may drive the least fuel-efficient vehicles, and they\u2019re the ones that would be hit hardest by a regional fuel tax.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000696\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022163d0b68-eb0e-4094-9bed-99e184f063e1\u0022\u003EThe recommendation that I put forward to the committee contained in this amendment would seek to insert a new section into the Social Security Act 1964. This section reads, \u201CAny person who receives a payment under the provisions of this Act\u201D\u2014so anyone who receives a benefit, essentially, under the Social Security Act\u2014\u201Cand primarily resides in a region that has an established regional fuel tax scheme\u201D\u2014in this case it would be Auckland initially, but later on there will be other councils that have already put their hands up, so it\u2019ll be wider than just Auckland. But anyone who primarily resides in that region that has an established regional fuel tax scheme under the provisions of Subpart 3 of the Land Transport Management Act\u2014the ones that have already gone through\u2014would be \u201Celigible for an additional annual payment equal to the average cost \u2026 a person is projected to pay under a regional fuel tax in their region.\u201D\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000697\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022163d0b68-eb0e-4094-9bed-99e184f063e1\u0022\u003EI submit this to the committee because I think it\u2019s important that we recognise, accurately and appropriately, the impact on those people who can least afford to pay a regional fuel tax. Now, it\u2019s imperfect. We can\u2019t always identify perfectly the people that would be hit hardest by a regional fuel tax or the people who would find it the hardest to pay a regional fuel tax because of their personal circumstances, but we do have a relatively crude measure available to us, and that\u2019s those that receive a benefit or receive a payment under the provisions of the Social Security Act.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000698\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022163d0b68-eb0e-4094-9bed-99e184f063e1\u0022\u003EThey are broad, I know, and there are many New Zealanders\u2014tens of thousands, if not hundreds of thousands of New Zealanders\u2014that do receive a payment under the provisions of the Social Security Act. But I think the committee should carefully consider this amendment because it is very clear and very well understood\u2014and, I think, even admitted by the Minister and his officials\u2014that the people who would find it hardest to pay a regional fuel tax are those that are living at the lower end of the socio-economic spectrum. In fact, the Minister, when he\u2019s answered questions in the House around cost of living issues, has, in fact, identified the fact that the Government has made changes to the Social Security Act and also made changes to benefit levels which would compensate those who would struggle paying a regional fuel tax. They point to the Families Package that they have.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000699\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022163d0b68-eb0e-4094-9bed-99e184f063e1\u0022\u003EI submit to you that this particular amendment, in fact, adds on to that, and it says even further that we as a committee wish the Parliament, when it considers the third reading, to include in this bill particular provisions that would make further amendments to the Social Security Act. If the people who are receiving a benefit payment under the Social Security Act are receiving such a payment, they\u2019re the ones that are in need of greater assistance. The bill, in its entirety, would allow greater costs to be imposed on people.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000700\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022163d0b68-eb0e-4094-9bed-99e184f063e1\u0022\u003EThere is strong evidence that was presented at the select committee that those that are living in high-deprivation areas, probably in areas that have a high number of people receiving a payment under the Social Security Act, are the people that\u2014and there\u2019s strong evidence that was put forward by Sam Warburton. I don\u2019t think it was modelled very much, if at all, by the ministry, but there were other submitters that put forward particular arguments that they would be hit the hardest.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000701\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022163d0b68-eb0e-4094-9bed-99e184f063e1\u0022\u003EBut there were also arguments put forward by a particular submitter, and I do talk about Sam Warburton\u2019s submission\u2014[Bell rung] Thank you for the additional call; sorry, everyone else. I do talk particularly to the submission of Sam Warburton because he\u2019s a transport economist. He previously worked for the Ministry of Transport, and he has put a lot of emphasis in his personal and professional life into modelling how taxation in the transport sector impacts on people. He was very clear in his submission that regional fuel taxes\u2014and, indeed, fuel taxes in general\u2014are regressive and that those regressive taxes hurt people living in high deprivation the most. It\u2019s only reasonable that when we\u2019re considering a bill around implementing a regional fuel tax, we make available to us the ability in Part 2 to consider additional policy changes and additional measures by making further changes to other pieces of legislation.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000702\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022163d0b68-eb0e-4094-9bed-99e184f063e1\u0022\u003EThe Minister himself has stood in this House in question time and said, \u201CThere are means to compensate people for a regional fuel tax.\u201D I argue that the regional fuel tax is so damaging to people and so bad for people living under a proposed regional fuel tax scheme that we should do more. I, in fact, don\u2019t think it should be in place at all. In fact, I think there are other ways in which transport infrastructure can be funded\u2014we have canvassed those\u2014but if this is going to go ahead, and if there are going to be changes made to legislation which allow regional fuel tax schemes to be implemented, then we should be doing everything we can to highlight the fact that this tax will hurt people that are at the lowest end and that need assistance more from the State.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000703\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022163d0b68-eb0e-4094-9bed-99e184f063e1\u0022\u003EThe Social Security Act is there for that very purpose. The Social Security Act is there because it says in a piece of legislation there are people that are living in particular situations where they need assistance from the State. The Social Security Act is there because it says there are people who, by virtue of the circumstance they are in or by virtue of decisions they may have made in their life, have ended up in a position where they need assistance. Well, it\u2019s not just individuals in their own personal circumstance that are now being put into a position where additional costs are being put on to them; it\u2019s actually the Parliament that\u2019s about to legislate to allow further costs to be put in place. And if we\u2019re going to do that, if we\u2019re going to allow\u2014and this side disagrees with it, but if the Parliament\u2019s going to allow greater taxation powers, it has to be coupled with an acknowledgment that there\u2019s a need to make other measures available to people to compensate them for these issues.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000704\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022163d0b68-eb0e-4094-9bed-99e184f063e1\u0022\u003EWe\u2019ve had a lot of debate in the Parliament through question time about the cost that would be imposed on people, and the Government comes up with averages and they make it sound like it\u2019s a small amount of money because it\u2019s the cost of a cup of coffee. I\u2019d say to the committee that it\u2019s probably unlikely that people receiving a payment under the Social Security Act are the Ponsonby dwellers that are sipping lattes every single day, several times a day, but they\u2019re the people that actually struggle the most, and they\u2019re the people that probably can\u2019t afford a cup of coffee. But we do know through the evidence that was put forward in the select committee that the people that are living furthest away from the CBD, the people that have the least fuel-efficient cars, the people that can\u2019t afford to buy electric vehicles, and the people that can\u2019t afford alternatives means of travel because they have to travel long distances to get to work, are not going to be paying the cost of a cup of coffee. They\u2019re not going to be paying a small amount of money. They\u2019re probably going to be paying hundreds of dollars a year, and their families\u2014if they have two fuel-inefficient cars travelling long distances\u2014will be paying several hundred dollars a year.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000705\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022163d0b68-eb0e-4094-9bed-99e184f063e1\u0022\u003EOur officials, our staff, have calculated that\u2019s probably around about $700 a year. I know the Minister disagrees with that, but at least in the way in which this is worded, it would allow for an average cost to persons to be calculated. Now, it would be accurate\u2014it would be real-world information. It wouldn\u2019t be anything that the Government\u2019s spin-doctored or we\u2019ve spin-doctored; it would be real information that the ministry would have to come up with to make a calculation under a proposed amendment to the Social Security Act to compensate these people.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000706\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022163d0b68-eb0e-4094-9bed-99e184f063e1\u0022\u003EWe must acknowledge that this bill puts in place additional costs on people. We must acknowledge that this is a regressive tax. We must acknowledge that we\u2019re hurting the cost of living for many New Zealanders out there. We must acknowledge that there should be changes made to legislation to allow it to happen.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000707\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022163d0b68-eb0e-4094-9bed-99e184f063e1\u0022\u003EI see the Minister is signalling he\u2019d like to take a call. We\u2019re looking forward to him taking a call saying why he doesn\u2019t agree with this\u2014I assume he doesn\u2019t agree with this; I hope he actually agrees with this\u2014but it\u2019s important that we address cost of living issues. It\u2019s important the Minister answers these important questions. We\u2019re looking forward to that.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022cbc37df2-57ae-4536-94ed-a2e39eecd585\u0022 data-id=\u00223f21d90e298a4216a7f21863e93abece\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000708\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cbc37df2-57ae-4536-94ed-a2e39eecd585\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00223f21d90e298a4216a7f21863e93abece\u0022\u003EHon PHIL TWYFORD (Minister of Transport):\u003C/span\u003E There have been some very curious contributions from the Opposition benches, but, in the spirit of this committee stage, let me respond to one or two of them. Parmjeet Parmar would like taxation to be a voluntary thing, an optional thing. While I embrace the importance of the spirit of voluntarism in our society, frankly, I\u2019m surprised that the National Party wants to make the payment of taxes an optional thing\u2014but there we go.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000709\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cbc37df2-57ae-4536-94ed-a2e39eecd585\u0022\u003EStuart Smith proposes that a cost-benefit analysis be required for every regional council, reporting on the expenditure of the funds raised by a regional fuel tax. I say to Mr Smith that every significant piece of transport expenditure is subjected to a cost-benefit analysis of some kind. In fact, in line with our Government policy statement, our Government is getting under way with a complete revamp of the entire system of measuring the economic value of transport projects.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000710\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cbc37df2-57ae-4536-94ed-a2e39eecd585\u0022\u003EScott Simpson had a very unusual proposal: basically, requiring councils to have a referendum before a regional fuel tax could be put in place. This is a very odd suggestion, because councils can raise their budgets and raise rates to support those budgets any year that they like. They don\u2019t have to have a referendum to do that, but they have to go through the requirements of the Local Government Act, as Lawrence Yule well knows\u2014the onerous consultation requirements of the Local Government Act\u2014and they have to explain to their citizens, they have to put a proposal in front of them, they have to, basically, invite public submissions, and then they have to report back to their ratepayers and tell them exactly what they\u2019re going to do. But nowhere in the whole system of local government are councils required to hold a referendum to get the agreement from their citizens for the raising of additional revenue, so this would be a very, very unusual inconsistency in the system of local government.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000711\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cbc37df2-57ae-4536-94ed-a2e39eecd585\u0022\u003EMatt King proposes an amendment to the Search and Surveillance Act, because Mr King apparently believes that it\u2019s OK to defraud a system of taxation for a month, but you have to have been defrauding the system for 12 months before you can be subject to the enforcement provisions in this bill. I thought that after nine years in this Parliament, I knew the National Party; clearly, I don\u2019t.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000712\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cbc37df2-57ae-4536-94ed-a2e39eecd585\u0022\u003EFinally, let me respond to Jami-Lee Ross\u2019 contribution in this debate. He wants to amend the Social Security Act to allow a reimbursement of any expenditure on a regional fuel tax\u2014an equivalent amount to be refunded through the social security system. I say to Mr Ross, where was this concern for low-income families facing regressive taxes? Where was this heartfelt concern when the former National Government raised the goods and services tax, having promised\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000713\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227940e9f2-9cea-43d5-8f16-3b470e34f47f\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00224cd14799e8d54d52a7f689d55c7a1e4b\u0022\u003EMatt King\u003C/span\u003E: Yeah, but it was tax-neutral\u2014it was tax-neutral.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000714\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cbc37df2-57ae-4536-94ed-a2e39eecd585\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022f9f2a536ae7b400b83197bb76f874a88\u0022\u003EHon PHIL TWYFORD\u003C/span\u003E: Well, they say it was tax-neutral, but actually it took money out of the pockets of working New Zealanders and gave it to people at the top end. It was not tax-neutral for working New Zealanders. In fact, it was very tax-negative for the big end of town that the National Party has the habit of looking after.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000715\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cbc37df2-57ae-4536-94ed-a2e39eecd585\u0022\u003ESo I also say to Jami-Lee Ross, if he\u2019s so concerned about regressive taxes, where was this concern when the former National Government raised the petrol excise duty and road-user charges by 17c plus GST\u201417c plus GST\u2014six times in nine years? Now, the last time I checked, the petrol excise was a regressive tax, but I don\u2019t recall hearing a single speech in this House\u2014[Time expired]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022a6c42c44-3622-4c9c-98b8-793fb5ec15cc\u0022 data-id=\u0022c06ce8ba91a945998f9e9927caadfac4\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000716\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a6c42c44-3622-4c9c-98b8-793fb5ec15cc\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022c06ce8ba91a945998f9e9927caadfac4\u0022\u003EIAN McKELVIE (National\u2014Rangit\u012Bkei):\u003C/span\u003E Goodness me! Thank you, Mr Chair\u2014something of a surprise! I just about had a heart attack getting up, so it was lucky you did call me. It\u2019s a great pleasure to take a call on Part 2 of the Land Transport Management (Regional Fuel Tax) Amendment Bill. I have, I suppose, the privilege of actually proposing an amendment as well, and that amendment would alter clause 10(5), inserting a new subclause 6). In fact, after subclause (5), you\u2019d insert a new subclause (6), which would add a new subsection, and that subsection would say, \u201CAny proposal for a regional fuel tax scheme under the provisions of subpart 3 of the Land Transport Management Act must incorporate, to the best ability possible, the contents of the infrastructure strategy.\u201D So that is a very constructive piece of alteration to the legislation and it would add to what I think the legislation should have contained in the first place, which was a direct reference the regional land transport plans in each regional council area, which would\u2019ve actually been a very simple way of ensuring that the fuel tax adhered to the plans that those regions had.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000717\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a6c42c44-3622-4c9c-98b8-793fb5ec15cc\u0022\u003EThis is a crock, this piece of legislation. It\u2019s almost like a death by a thousand cuts. It\u2019s like third time lucky, in effect, because this is the third time in my young memory that we\u2019ve had a regional fuel tax introduced to Parliament. Of course, for that to apply, it really needs to apply to the amendment that I introduced to the committee a moment ago, and, if it doesn\u2019t, then it makes it very difficult for regional councils to implement this type of legislation. It is, in my view, not at all practical, and just recently we\u2019ve seen the Rangit\u012Bkei District Council putting their hands up wishing to charge a regional fuel tax. Of course, Rangit\u012Bkei District Council gets all their money from Wellington people going skiing on a Friday night and coming home on a Sunday night, because that\u2019s where the regional fuel tax would come from as they travelled through the district to the mountain. Of course, given Rangit\u012Bkei River runs right next to the boundary, they would fill up in Sanson on their way up and Sanson on the way back and avoid paying the regional fuel tax, which would be somewhat ironic, Mr Chair\u2014of course, in your instance, that contains your very own home.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000718\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a6c42c44-3622-4c9c-98b8-793fb5ec15cc\u0022\u003EEarlier in the night, my colleagues were talking about roads of national significance and the issues that the former Labour Minister Ken Shirley raised, and it occurred to me that that great Labour Minister of transport Harry Duynhoven would have a fair bit to say about this piece of legislation as well, especially given he comes from that great city in the west where they will no longer have fuel to fill up with, anyway, and that will be quite an interesting challenge for them.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000719\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a6c42c44-3622-4c9c-98b8-793fb5ec15cc\u0022\u003ESo I think that the planning around how we get to the point of a community understanding what the regional fuel tax is going to provide for that district or for that region is quite challenging. I think it\u2019s important that it is attached to the planning that\u2019s gone on in those regions where it\u2019s applicable, and, as I said earlier, that\u2019s the Rangit\u012Bkei District Council wanting to impose a regional fuel tax. They\u2019re part of a seven-district regional council, so it would be really interesting for a regional council to pull together a tax that deals with one small piece of that area, so I think that\u2019s quite challenging in itself.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000720\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a6c42c44-3622-4c9c-98b8-793fb5ec15cc\u0022\u003ESo, Mr Chair\u2014or Madam Chair; it\u2019s changed\u2014I think that this whole piece of legislation is going to be extremely difficult to administer equitably. We\u2019ve seen very clearly in the past that it doesn\u2019t work, and I don\u2019t know why we would try to insert or, I guess, come with a \u201Cthird time lucky\u201D proposition to reinsert a regional fuel tax again. There was reference made by the Minister only a minute ago to the way the last Government dealt with fuel tax, and, of course, it is quite an important part of how we fund our road transport system. I think it\u2019s logical that it should be rationally applied across the country, and then allocated on a regional basis where the Government thinks it\u2019s necessary. It would have been a much better way of doing it than this. This is hugely untidy, and whilst I must stick to Part 2, I\u2019d very much like to have got on to where the farmers are going to get to with their challenges with the diesel tax as it comes on in a very different form than it\u2019s ever come before, and it\u2019s going to mean a huge administrative cost.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022dc6c0f88-e781-476d-bca1-d1bf9b69302b\u0022 data-id=\u00228939a3b675a4456cbaddb2732e2bb2dc\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000721\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dc6c0f88-e781-476d-bca1-d1bf9b69302b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00228939a3b675a4456cbaddb2732e2bb2dc\u0022\u003EHon AMY ADAMS (National\u2014Selwyn):\u003C/span\u003E I am pleased to take a call on this Part 2, but in particular I wanted to speak to one of the amendments on the Table that hasn\u2019t previously had attention this evening, and that is a very good amendment in the name of my colleague Hamish Walker, the MP for Queenstown, who has made a very sensible suggestion that I think the Minister should pay serious consideration to, which is adding to the provisions currently in Part 2, which, obviously, are amendments to various pieces of legislation. As we know, they go through the transport legislation, the Local Government Act, and the Search and Surveillance Act\u2014which I want to come back to. But also, in this amendment we are suggesting an amendment after the existing clause 11 to add a new clause 12, which would suggest an amendment which isn\u2019t currently in the legislation, amending the Road User Charges Act.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000722\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dc6c0f88-e781-476d-bca1-d1bf9b69302b\u0022\u003EIt does seem to me, in reading this legislation, that there has been an omission to consider the interplay between this piece of legislation and the Road User Charges Act. If you look at that road-user charges (RUC) legislation, then it\u2019s very clear that in section 53(2) of that Act you have quite a number of provisions that an assessor for road-user charges should take into account in considering whether to make an assessment for the collection of road-user charges. I won\u2019t run through them all, but, as the Clerk can imagine, there are quite a number of provisions in that legislation and it\u2019s quite clear that a road-user charges assessor should turn their minds to a full range of considerations in deciding whether it\u2019s appropriate to make an assessment for road-user charges.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000723\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dc6c0f88-e781-476d-bca1-d1bf9b69302b\u0022\u003EWhat this legislation fails to do, though, is to consider the interplay between that framework and this framework, and I think Hamish Walker is absolutely right when he suggested it\u2019s quite appropriate to add into this framework a subsequent amendment to section 53 of the Road User Charges Act, which would be a new section 53(2)(g) suggesting that where there is a regional fuel tax scheme in place in the region where the RUC vehicle is primarily used, that should be another factor which is considered by the RUC assessor. It is appropriate that when we\u2019re going to be adding in yet another cost on motorists in the system, we have to think about the interplay between that one and existing frameworks. In this case, in the particular amendment that I wanted to address, because it hasn\u2019t been discussed in this committee stage\u2014and I\u2019m aware, actually, that there are a number of amendments, important amendments, still to be discussed in this committee stage. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000724\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dc6c0f88-e781-476d-bca1-d1bf9b69302b\u0022\u003EThis is an important one. Look, it may not be the core of the National Party\u2019s opposition to this bill, which is absolutely around the imposition of an unwarranted, unheralded, unannounced, new tax on the regions of New Zealand that simply won\u2019t address the issues that the Government claims it will\u2014that is obviously at the core of our opposition and a number of us spoke very strongly against that in Part 1\u2014but in this Part 2, we have to turn our minds to the operation of this framework if, in fact, it does become law. It seems quite clear to me that, reading through the existing provisions in Part 2 and the various consequential amendments, there has been an omission to think about the interplay with the road-user charges framework, and my colleague Hamish Walker has come up with a very good suggestion. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000725\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dc6c0f88-e781-476d-bca1-d1bf9b69302b\u0022\u003EIt shouldn\u2019t actually fall on members of this House to fix a Minister\u2019s legislation, but, frankly, I expect very little else from this particular Minister. He\u2019s not known as a Minister of competence in delivering everything he does, and it seems to me that in this bill we see yet another example where the operationalising of the words is failing, and it falls now to members of the National Party to find the omissions\u2014the lacunas\u2014in this legislation, and here is a lacuna relating to the Road User Charges Act where there is no direction so far in the legislation as to how it fits in with this regional fuel tax scheme. This is a very simple amendment that I would like to see the Government take up, very clearly outlining that the road-user charges assessor can make that change.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000726\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dc6c0f88-e781-476d-bca1-d1bf9b69302b\u0022\u003EBut there is another matter that I did want to discuss on Part 2, which is the amendment that is in the legislation to the Search and Surveillance Act. Now how many of our constituents, hearing that they\u2019d face a 25 percent extra charge on their petrol per litre\u201411.5c of which comes from this regional fuel tax\u2014know that it comes with an amendment to the Search and Surveillance Act allowing assessors to search their vehicles if there\u2019s any suggestion of non-compliance with the Act? But in this legislation, we see an amendment to the Search and Surveillance Act. This is how serious this Government is about taking more tax off you\u2014they\u2019re adding an amendment to the Search and Surveillance Act which allows an enforcement officer to obtain and execute a search warrant for evidence. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000727\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dc6c0f88-e781-476d-bca1-d1bf9b69302b\u0022\u003ESo you may think it\u2019s just a matter of pulling up to the pump and the pain of paying a little bit more at the pump, but, no, it goes beyond that. You actually now have\u2014thanks to Minister Phil Twyford and the Labour Government\u2014a fuel tax that allows enforcement officers to stop you, to execute a search warrant, and to search your vehicle for evidence of offences under the Land Transport Act. Now I don\u2019t remember seeing any of that in the press release the Minister put out, and I would like to hear from this Minister exactly why it is and in what circumstances there could possibly be a need for an enforcement officer to search a vehicle for evidence of non-compliance with payment of the regional fuel tax. I think that is a very extensive power that deserves more time and debate in this House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000728\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dc6c0f88-e781-476d-bca1-d1bf9b69302b\u0022\u003EAs member who\u2019s been in this House now for nearly 10 years, I have heard numerous debates where Labour and the Greens, particularly, railed against the Search and Surveillance Act and the overreach of powers of the State. Well, I look forward to Green members taking a call in defence of why a regional fuel tax bill needs powers under the Search and Surveillance Act for searching vehicles, for executing search warrants, and for exposing drivers to that unreasonable extension of powers of the State. The Minister has made no explanation as to why that\u2019s warranted. It is an important matter. It does deserve the time of the committee. The Minister is, not surprisingly, silent on it. Well, National Party members on this side find the gaps in his legislation, find the unworkable holes, and seek to fill them, even in a piece of legislation we don\u2019t support, because we do want legislation of this House to be workable.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000729\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dc6c0f88-e781-476d-bca1-d1bf9b69302b\u0022\u003EIt does show the importance of good quality, careful scrutiny of these consequential amendments to pieces of legislation, because buried in what could be seen as the detritus of a bill\u2014buried in what could be seen as the unimportant little consequential amendments\u2014are some very significant powers, and I\u2019ve heard nothing from the Government in this debate as to why there is no linkage into the road-user charges framework. I\u2019ve heard nothing from the Government as to how the two would fit together\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000730\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c0e0c86e-e14d-4daa-9bc8-1b5a3d7defeb\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00222eb5de97561b47f38284d4741932031d\u0022\u003ECHAIRPERSON (Poto Williams)\u003C/span\u003E: Order! Order! I just want to caution the member regarding repetition. Those arguments were made in your first call. Thank you.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000731\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dc6c0f88-e781-476d-bca1-d1bf9b69302b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00223eb08bff91b8444f9d742856ea0a09d6\u0022\u003EHon AMY ADAMS\u003C/span\u003E: Thank you. That\u2019s right. Just to finish that point, I\u2019ve heard nothing from the Government around why that search and surveillance power needs to be in here.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000732\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dc6c0f88-e781-476d-bca1-d1bf9b69302b\u0022\u003ESo I think there are a number of matters that have been raised so far in this Part 2 debate. I\u2019m aware that there are a number of similar matters to be raised. I would invite the Minister to explain to us why those two deficiencies exist, and I\u2019m very much looking forward to hearing his answer.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022a68928ea-9dd8-4a30-8e2c-a0f49dfc8bea\u0022 data-id=\u0022dcbf91d4a3ca43a3a952805336f0e123\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000733\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a68928ea-9dd8-4a30-8e2c-a0f49dfc8bea\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022dcbf91d4a3ca43a3a952805336f0e123\u0022\u003EHon LOUISE UPSTON (National\u2014Taup\u014D):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Madam Chair. I\u2019m pleased to take a call in this debate on the Land Transport Management (Regional Fuel Tax) Amendment Bill and I want to cover a number of matters in this first call that I intend to take in this Part 2 debate.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000734\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a68928ea-9dd8-4a30-8e2c-a0f49dfc8bea\u0022\u003EI want to start with some comments that the Minister raised in his contribution which really bring in some new elements to this debate. Given that the Minister has raised a number of issues around equity, I want to use that to extend one of the arguments on this side of the House in terms of a number of the amendments. One of them I\u2019ll speak to very specifically, but there are other amendments. I think there are 14 or 15 amendments that haven\u2019t been addressed at all yet, so I will come to a contribution on that in another call. But I wanted to just come back to the Minister\u2019s comments about equity, because as my colleagues have quite rightly said before this\u2014and, in particular, Jami-Lee Ross in his contribution\u2014we\u2019ve actually got two significant issues of inequity. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000735\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a68928ea-9dd8-4a30-8e2c-a0f49dfc8bea\u0022\u003EI raise this because the Minister raised it in his contribution, and in his contribution he specifically asked why it was that when the previous Government increased the goods and services tax, we did not make some of the changes to, for example, the Social Security Act. What the Minister failed to raise in his contribution, which is why I want to bring it to the attention of the committee\u2014because when the Minister spoke in his contribution in the committee of the whole House, he talked about issues that are broader than this particular part of the bill. So I just want to address the issues he\u2019s raised around equity. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000736\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a68928ea-9dd8-4a30-8e2c-a0f49dfc8bea\u0022\u003ESo when the changes were made to increase the goods and services tax, at the same time there were changes to reduce the amount of income tax that those on lower incomes were having to pay. So the equity issue that the Minister has raised in this debate on Part 2\u2014actually, he\u2019s argued against the point that he was trying to make. He\u2019s actually argued in favour of my colleague Jami-Lee Ross\u2019 amendment, which basically says there should be compensation for those on lower incomes if you are increasing a tax called a regional fuel tax. There should be an offset for those on lower incomes. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000737\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a68928ea-9dd8-4a30-8e2c-a0f49dfc8bea\u0022\u003EThe offset proposed by my colleague Jami-Lee Ross is one of supporting individuals in low-income households through the Social Security Act, and this is something I\u2019m particularly interested in, being the National spokesperson on social development. This piece of legislation will have an impact\u2014a disproportionate impact\u2014on low-income households. The comments the Minister himself made in his comments on Part 2, which is the focus of this debate, were about equity. Well, I put to you that this bill that\u2019s before us creates inequities that don\u2019t exist today. The passage of this legislation, as proposed by this Government, will disadvantage low-income households. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000738\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a68928ea-9dd8-4a30-8e2c-a0f49dfc8bea\u0022\u003EThere\u2019s another equity issue that I want to raise\u2014and I raise it because the Minister raised issues of equity and fairness\u2014and that is the original intent of the regional fuel tax being about Auckland and the fact that what we have seen now is other regions introducing it. So you have the inequity\u2014a double inequity\u2014of a low-income family in Auckland that is paying more than a low-income family in another part of the country. So we have two inequities that the Minister and this Government have introduced. That is why I wanted to speak on Jami-Lee Ross\u2019 amendment which basically allows, through the Social Security Act\u2014and in some ways you could argue that the Government has a bit of a precedent in things like the winter energy payment, which is also for a significant cost to a household. There is a direct compensation for superannuitants and for low-income families of $700 a year, and it\u2019s interesting that $700 a year is pretty much the same amount that the calculations have been\u2014that this regional fuel tax will have. So I want to ask the Minister\u2014[Time expired]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002229c236aa-2283-4690-9a84-aa865404bb61\u0022 data-id=\u00228a8dc23e190b4a54abcebba43784264c\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000739\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002229c236aa-2283-4690-9a84-aa865404bb61\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00228a8dc23e190b4a54abcebba43784264c\u0022\u003ENUK KORAKO (National):\u003C/span\u003E Taku mihi ki a koe e Te Kaiwhakahaere. Huri noa i Te Whare nei, kia pai t\u014D t\u0101tou Matariki. N\u014D reira e mihi atu ki a koutou katoa.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000740\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002229c236aa-2283-4690-9a84-aa865404bb61\u0022\u003E[Thank you, Madam Chair. I wish everyone here in this House best wishes for Matariki. Greetings to one and all.]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000741\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002229c236aa-2283-4690-9a84-aa865404bb61\u0022\u003EE Te Kaiwhakahaere, thank you for giving me this opportunity. I was getting a bit of a complex. I thought I was under there and you couldn\u2019t see me, but, anyway, kia ora. I just want to say this is the first opportunity that I have had to speak on the Land Transport Management (Regional Fuel Tax) Amendment Bill, and also it\u2019s the first time, particularly, that I\u2019ve been able to introduce an amendment.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000742\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002229c236aa-2283-4690-9a84-aa865404bb61\u0022\u003ESo my amendment seeks to amend the Local Government Act 2002, and this adds a new section 81(3) after section 81(2). What it does is that it actually introduces section 81(3), \u201CConsultation with Iwi Prior to any Regional Fuel Tax Proposal\u201D. What it says is that \u201CBefore a territorial authority seeks to submit a proposal on a regional fuel tax scheme under Subpart 3 of the Land Transport Management Act 2003, the Council must open consultation with the local Iwi(s) of the region.\u201D I have actually heard this evening that word \u201Cconsultation\u201D, and I\u2019ve heard that word \u201Cconsultation\u201D a number of times.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000743\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002229c236aa-2283-4690-9a84-aa865404bb61\u0022\u003EWhile we actually have been talking about this particular bill, at no point in this debate has anyone had a k\u014Drero about M\u0101ori, or, in particular, the six Auckland iwi. In fact, there is not one mention in this bill around consultation with Auckland iwi. In a lot of ways, that there is a travesty, because when you look at the representation within this bill, at the moment there is none. When we think of the six T\u0101maki iwi that make up the Auckland area, there are actually over 30 marae, and this large natural grouping accounts for over 150,000 of those members of those marae.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000744\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002229c236aa-2283-4690-9a84-aa865404bb61\u0022\u003ESo I want to ask the Minister in the chair\u2014and also, what about the M\u0101ori MPs on the other side of the Chamber there? You are part of, historically, the largest M\u0101ori caucus\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000745\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a8cab3e3-b023-4ce7-9f4b-2c4137029057\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00229950bdfa1bc8490eb4350ef146a20de9\u0022\u003EKiritapu Allan\u003C/span\u003E: That\u2019s right.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000746\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002229c236aa-2283-4690-9a84-aa865404bb61\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022936813cc642c4942a6c8edaa02f1be14\u0022\u003ENUK KORAKO\u003C/span\u003E: \u2014to be ever in this Parliament. That\u2019s right, but where have you been? Where have you been? Why is there no consultation proposal in this particular bill? So why would you not consult with the Treaty partners? Why would you not consult with mana whenua?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000747\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c0e0c86e-e14d-4daa-9bc8-1b5a3d7defeb\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00227535077889ea4ed0beba6dce1f453868\u0022\u003ECHAIRPERSON (Poto Williams)\u003C/span\u003E: Order! Order! Not me.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000748\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002229c236aa-2283-4690-9a84-aa865404bb61\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00222e76a34d79614d139c1cd6aa7a84e5c9\u0022\u003ENUK KORAKO\u003C/span\u003E: Why would you not consult with representatives of the most disaffected groups, who will suffer under this fuel tax? Why would you not consult with them?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000749\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c0e0c86e-e14d-4daa-9bc8-1b5a3d7defeb\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00222031e24b5e054de8b1efe0fb975e352c\u0022\u003ECHAIRPERSON (Poto Williams)\u003C/span\u003E: Order! I just need to remind the member not to refer to the Chair. Thank you.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000750\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002229c236aa-2283-4690-9a84-aa865404bb61\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022ef4aa5ac22ca4e309fb2c959d554e12d\u0022\u003ENUK KORAKO\u003C/span\u003E: Kia ora. So looking at this particular disaffected group, they are actually part of these iwi; they are part of these marae. These are the blue-collar workers, these are the shift workers, these are the marae members, these are the marae workers, and these are the volunteers that actually are going to be affected by this particular fuel tax. So when you look at an example, why would you not follow a piece of legislation called the Resource Legislation Amendment Act, in which, when we look at it, iwi are actually consulted very early in the process, and they\u2019re also consulted right at the end of the process so that they\u2019re not shut out? So why would you not actually put, as my amendment is stating, an amendment in here, in this amendment\u2014[Time expired]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022919a8e8d-afaf-4342-ad6f-71cbb6024544\u0022 data-id=\u002247f10f2fd8094eebb5142a638dce6710\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000751\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022919a8e8d-afaf-4342-ad6f-71cbb6024544\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002247f10f2fd8094eebb5142a638dce6710\u0022\u003ECLAYTON MITCHELL (Whip\u2014NZ First):\u003C/span\u003E I move, That the question be now put.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00226dc89bbf-c2ef-45c9-89e4-d2b5952d8d16\u0022 data-id=\u0022fd527a101d804ab6a40bec70026c1a7a\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000752\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226dc89bbf-c2ef-45c9-89e4-d2b5952d8d16\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022fd527a101d804ab6a40bec70026c1a7a\u0022\u003EKANWALJIT SINGH BAKSHI (National):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Madam Chair. You are very kind. You have given me the opportunity to talk about my tabled amendment. Through you, I would like to request that the Minister consider this amendment, because the veterans have not been mentioned at all, and this is very important for the veterans. My amendment amends clause 12 to the Veterans\u2019 Support Act 2014, and, after section 15(1)(i), inserts \u201C(j) Whether the veteran lives in a region where a Regional Fuel Tax scheme is in place.\u201D\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000753\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226dc89bbf-c2ef-45c9-89e4-d2b5952d8d16\u0022\u003EAs we know, the veterans are those people who have either served in the military forces or fought a war, and they are the ones who have made sacrifices. We should consider very seriously that they should be exempted from the regional fuel tax. I know the Minister is listening to all the speeches and he has made the effort to respond to those concerns raised by different speakers. Here, I would also like to request New Zealand First, through Clayton Mitchell, who is the representative of New Zealand First right now in the Chamber, and, in particular, the Hon Ron Mark, who always considers himself to be the champion of veterans\u2014this is the amendment which is directly going to affect them.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000754\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226dc89bbf-c2ef-45c9-89e4-d2b5952d8d16\u0022\u003EThis amendment ensures that Veterans\u2019 Affairs New Zealand, when deciding whether to provide or contribute to the cost of transport for dependent veterans, can take into account the cost of the regional fuel tax. This is very important, because we know that veterans have limited resources, and if this fuel tax adds to their living costs they are going to suffer. We know they come to different events, like they stand up for the people of this country from time to time\u2014in calamities, in natural disasters\u2014they come and contribute. This is why this amendment is very important for the veterans, and I hope that I will get the support from the opposite side to get it through this process.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000755\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226dc89bbf-c2ef-45c9-89e4-d2b5952d8d16\u0022\u003EWe know that the veterans from different wars have come back to New Zealand and now are living here. Veterans from the Korean War, from Malaysia, from Afghanistan, from Iraq, and from many other parts of the world have come back and settled down and are living in our country. Their contribution\u2014not only their contribution but, I think, the sacrifices made by their families from time to time\u2014should be considered.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000756\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226dc89bbf-c2ef-45c9-89e4-d2b5952d8d16\u0022\u003EI hope that the Minister will give consideration to my amendment, which amends the Veterans\u2019 Support Act 2014 and inserts a subparagraph in that after subparagraph 15(1)(i): \u201C(j) Whether the veteran lives in a region where a Regional Fuel Tax scheme in place.\u201D I hope this relief will go a long way for the veterans. I thank you for the opportunity.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002203fd985b-4fb8-4111-ba38-5033a254d962\u0022 data-id=\u0022bfb8b6aace2344c29f777d10fe5a25e9\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000757\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002203fd985b-4fb8-4111-ba38-5033a254d962\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022bfb8b6aace2344c29f777d10fe5a25e9\u0022\u003EBRETT HUDSON (National):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Madam Chair. Thank you very much for the call. I want to speak on my amendment on this part, one which is all targeted at improving public confidence in the applicability and administration of the regional fuel tax. I think there are some deficiencies there that this amendment would certainly help. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000758\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002203fd985b-4fb8-4111-ba38-5033a254d962\u0022\u003EThis is a very serious business, permitting regional councils, in effect, to levy a tax to apply on large-scale roading or transport infrastructure projects. It\u2019s a big deal. What is more, it is a much bigger deal than the public were led to believe. As the Government was muttering and murmuring about this prospective tax, they were talking all about Auckland, but it turned out, as the bill was introduced, that this actually permits a regional authority in any part of New Zealand to apply to levy a regional fuel tax; they just can\u2019t actually levy it until 1 January 2021.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000759\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002203fd985b-4fb8-4111-ba38-5033a254d962\u0022\u003ESo it\u2019s a big deal. Because of that, I think it\u2019s appropriate that we look to strengthen the public\u2019s confidence that if regional councils get the tax, it will be applied correctly, it\u2019ll be administered correctly, and any probity issues that could potentially appear could be caught, because this will not just be Auckland. In fact, it won\u2019t even just be Auckland, Christchurch, and Wellington. The Minister Phil Twyford, last night in a contribution, claimed that National was scaremongering about a contagion and that this would spread like wildfire around the country. He said we were scaremongering.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000760\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c0e0c86e-e14d-4daa-9bc8-1b5a3d7defeb\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022ff488cd29ec1431780de648facbecd39\u0022\u003ECHAIRPERSON (Poto Williams)\u003C/span\u003E: Order! Order! I just want to remind the member and remind members that there have been lots of repetition of arguments, so I want you to present new arguments in this debate.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000761\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002203fd985b-4fb8-4111-ba38-5033a254d962\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022975bfb29b072432da3032bd616c63bc8\u0022\u003EBRETT HUDSON\u003C/span\u003E: I am, Madam Chair. I\u2019m just seeking to establish why I think it is important.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000762\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c0e0c86e-e14d-4daa-9bc8-1b5a3d7defeb\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002216833f0eaf1f4f1fac694632b5870af9\u0022\u003ECHAIRPERSON (Poto Williams)\u003C/span\u003E: Right. We don\u2019t need for the establishment of why; we just need the argument, thank you.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000763\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002203fd985b-4fb8-4111-ba38-5033a254d962\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002208461a6d797b41879fe50060128721b3\u0022\u003EBRETT HUDSON\u003C/span\u003E: Very well, Madam Chair.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000764\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c0e0c86e-e14d-4daa-9bc8-1b5a3d7defeb\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022222f718ac46145d2a88ab2e3fafea5d3\u0022\u003ECHAIRPERSON (Poto Williams)\u003C/span\u003E: We have all been listening to this debate for the last couple of sessions.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000765\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002203fd985b-4fb8-4111-ba38-5033a254d962\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022899af8b940ca4212b2efe58fddb3367f\u0022\u003EBRETT HUDSON\u003C/span\u003E: So my amendment requires that the Auditor-General, under the Public Audit Act 2001, must\u2014must\u2014undertake a performance audit \u201Cat least one year after the establishment of any regional fuel tax scheme under Subpart 3 of the Land Transport Management Act 2003,\u201D on any of those 14 or more regions, those 14 that have already signalled that they want a piece of this.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000766\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002203fd985b-4fb8-4111-ba38-5033a254d962\u0022\u003EThe first part of the audit is, fundamentally, a performance audit. That\u2019s the part which is ensuring that the relevant public entities are acting effectively and efficiently under the provisions of that Subpart 3. But it goes further: it also checks to ensure, under the audit, that the public entity is complying with all of its statutory obligations under that subpart. It goes further again, and this leads to, particularly, a cost-effectiveness or a cost efficiency. It also seeks to establish or identify \u201Cany act or omission of a public entity, in order to determine whether waste has resulted or may have resulted or may result in relation to [the] functions under subpart 3 of the Land Transport Management Act 2003:\u201D.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000767\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002203fd985b-4fb8-4111-ba38-5033a254d962\u0022\u003EEqually importantly\u2014actually, I would argue, perhaps even more importantly\u2014subclause (1)(d) of my amendment says, \u201Cany act or omission showing or appearing to show a lack of probity or financial prudence by a public entity or 1 or more of its members, office holders, and employees under subpart 3 of the Land Transport Management Act\u201D. As the bill exists at the moment, it focuses in terms of its concern around the administration of the tax simply on determining an assessment of whether or not someone has avoided or evaded paying the tax. It doesn\u2019t have a provision about the people who are actually administering the tax.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000768\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002203fd985b-4fb8-4111-ba38-5033a254d962\u0022\u003ENow, it is true that the Minister could argue that they would already come under the ambit of the Public Audit Act 2001 as it stands. That is true, but my amendment goes further, in the extent that it requires that the Auditor-General may undertake that audit within one year. It also looks at the performance, including cost-effectiveness and cost efficiencies, and the probity and actions of the entity and its employees. This will strengthen public confidence in the bill, Minister. I recommend you take it up.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022490ccdbf-7c22-4e12-98f2-f3aa08f8e676\u0022 data-id=\u00222bdab6e32aa74f4b838a9a8b2592dcdd\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000769\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022490ccdbf-7c22-4e12-98f2-f3aa08f8e676\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00222bdab6e32aa74f4b838a9a8b2592dcdd\u0022\u003EHon IAIN LEES-GALLOWAY (Minister for Workplace Relations and Safety):\u003C/span\u003E I move, That the question be now put.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022758dcaf3-9976-43ac-8593-79f66ee4da22\u0022 data-id=\u0022d0079db6ff6c4205a0df756decd964d6\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000770\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022758dcaf3-9976-43ac-8593-79f66ee4da22\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022d0079db6ff6c4205a0df756decd964d6\u0022\u003EJO HAYES (National):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Madam Chair. I\u2019m pleased because this is my very first contribution to the Land Transport Management (Regional Fuel Tax) Amendment Bill.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000771\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002257e41e9d-285b-4fb3-847d-a63820ae7137\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022d42432340579467c9625e24e0875a34b\u0022\u003EChris Bishop\u003C/span\u003E: First of many.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000772\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022758dcaf3-9976-43ac-8593-79f66ee4da22\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022cda288de93964fd0ac8fa033d44a5037\u0022\u003EJO HAYES\u003C/span\u003E: First of many\u2014first of many. Thank you. My contribution focuses around clause 10(5) in Part 2, and it is the amendment in the name of Jami-Lee Ross. What it states is: \u201CAfter new section 34B(1)(c) insert new 34B(1)(d); How the RFT scheme has impacted on the cost of living\u201D. This is what the bill is saying regional councils of a regional fuel tax region, in its annual report, must report on.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000773\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022758dcaf3-9976-43ac-8593-79f66ee4da22\u0022\u003ESo I\u2019m asking the Minister to add subsection (d) on, and the reason being is that in Canterbury, we have a Canterbury well-being survey that\u2019s done through the Canterbury public health sector. They, obviously, survey the people of Canterbury to find out how their well-being is going over a period of time. Now, I reckon that because of this regional fuel tax, this bill\u2014and Christchurch City Council have announced that they will also want to implement a regional fuel tax in the city\u2014is going to have a negative impact on all of those people that live in the area that I help to look after, in the electorate of Christchurch East. I think, when the Christchurch City Council move on this, there are going to be a lot of people that live in that electorate that are going to be severely disadvantaged from it.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000774\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022758dcaf3-9976-43ac-8593-79f66ee4da22\u0022\u003ENot only that; I have just received on my phone right now a media statement stating that the Christchurch City Council will be increasing rates, over a three-year period, to 17 percent. More money going out of people\u2019s pockets, and that is not right. A regional fuel tax on top of an increase in rates is going to happen across this country, should this bill go ahead. Therefore, regional councils have a responsibility\u2014they have a responsibility\u2014to the well-being of the people in their regions to actually report on the impact of what a regional fuel tax will actually do to the well-being of those people.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000775\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022758dcaf3-9976-43ac-8593-79f66ee4da22\u0022\u003EWhen I look at it, I also look at the M\u0101ori and Pacific wh\u0101nau, because we all know that in every region of this country, M\u0101ori and Pacific peoples are the ones, you will find, that are mainly on the lower-paid incomes. They are always in that area. They do move up, some move up, but the majority of them work in jobs that pay low wages\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000776\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c0e0c86e-e14d-4daa-9bc8-1b5a3d7defeb\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022c42fff010e514e81a8e3f011fe651116\u0022\u003ECHAIRPERSON (Poto Williams)\u003C/span\u003E: Order! Look, I\u2019m sorry. I don\u2019t mean to interrupt the member, but the issue of equity has been well traversed throughout this particular part. Does the member have other contributions and other arguments to make in her contribution?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000777\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022758dcaf3-9976-43ac-8593-79f66ee4da22\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002220711e33b6c74e6f9f4e37d3c0951602\u0022\u003EJO HAYES\u003C/span\u003E: Well, actually, Madam Chair, I think it does need to be hammered in, because I don\u2019t think that the people\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000778\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c0e0c86e-e14d-4daa-9bc8-1b5a3d7defeb\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022c2e383a11e0444478d45c87f6c150805\u0022\u003ECHAIRPERSON (Poto Williams)\u003C/span\u003E: Order! I\u2019m asking the member to use other arguments. [Members seek call] No, the member is still speaking. I\u2019m actually asking the member to continue her speech, but to use other arguments.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000779\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022758dcaf3-9976-43ac-8593-79f66ee4da22\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002224c90b7cc2c44ad385306bd2a9a87708\u0022\u003EJO HAYES\u003C/span\u003E: So I will continue my speech.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000780\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c0e0c86e-e14d-4daa-9bc8-1b5a3d7defeb\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00227fb4addf84ab4eb2b087ee726fbab6b5\u0022\u003EASSISTANT SPEAKER (Poto Williams)\u003C/span\u003E: Thank you.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000781\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022758dcaf3-9976-43ac-8593-79f66ee4da22\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002275de75d1eb5142e2a4ae5f2b9efdf7ed\u0022\u003EJO HAYES\u003C/span\u003E: Anyway, yes, I do have extra to contribute, because, in this bill, in new section 34B, it also says in subsection (1)(b) that the council is also required to report on how the revenue will be applied by the council. Now, where I live, in Christchurch East, the place is becoming like pothole city in all of the roading area going in through Burwood and all around that particular area. So, therefore, if this bill is to go ahead, I would like to see those potholes actually filled up and repaired, with not just a little bit of hot mix put in, but the whole thing done up properly, because if that\u2019s what this bill is going to end up doing, then that is going to take away\u2014and I can say that now: it is going to impact on the way that people get around the city. It actually does impact on the amount of fuel it costs to actually move around the city, and with the regional fuel tax, they\u2019re going to have to pay more.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000782\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022758dcaf3-9976-43ac-8593-79f66ee4da22\u0022\u003ELots and lots of people go flying past on Travis Road every morning and every night, and this is going to severely impact the number of people that are going to be able to afford to do that. Some people might say, \u201COh, but they might end up biking.\u201D Well, I don\u2019t think so. I think that they are going to be severely hit, and it\u2019s going to actually show in the way that their living standards will drop.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000783\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022758dcaf3-9976-43ac-8593-79f66ee4da22\u0022\u003EAlso, new schools are coming in there as well, so\u2014[Time expired]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022c0e0c86e-e14d-4daa-9bc8-1b5a3d7defeb\u0022 data-id=\u0022017845bb0ceb41a6a69af1e6a045b95e\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000784\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c0e0c86e-e14d-4daa-9bc8-1b5a3d7defeb\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022017845bb0ceb41a6a69af1e6a045b95e\u0022\u003ECHAIRPERSON (Poto Williams)\u003C/span\u003E: I think we\u2019ll take one more.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000785\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022094b0ff4-e404-451b-b4a9-ad12bd4dee56\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022838b9b8c322f41e5b3a0e335bf04bced\u0022\u003EStuart Smith\u003C/span\u003E: Madam Chair, I\u2019ve asked ever so politely.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000786\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022342342\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022d7e5ed5822594db9b15a6305479fc962\u0022\u003ECHAIRPERSON (Poto Williams)\u003C/span\u003E: All right, then. Stuart Smith.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022094b0ff4-e404-451b-b4a9-ad12bd4dee56\u0022 data-id=\u00222d141ff9b19c4fc0896509242d6cf0f5\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000787\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022094b0ff4-e404-451b-b4a9-ad12bd4dee56\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00222d141ff9b19c4fc0896509242d6cf0f5\u0022\u003ESTUART SMITH (National\u2014Kaik\u014Dura):\u003C/span\u003E Oh, thank you very much, Madam Chair. I want to address a clause that hasn\u2019t been spoken to\u2014that I\u2019m aware of, anyway, and I think I\u2019ve heard most of this debate\u2014in new schedule 1AA in the schedule, new clause 4, \u201CAdditional amount to be paid before net revenue is paid to Auckland Council\u201D. This is quite interesting. It says \u201Cif an RFT scheme is established for Auckland under section 65K before 1 January 2021, then, before paying any amount to the Auckland Council under section 65U, the Agency must pay to the Crown out of the revenue from the RFT scheme the amount of $1,000,000.\u201D\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000788\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022094b0ff4-e404-451b-b4a9-ad12bd4dee56\u0022\u003EIs this legislation for sale? It sounds like the work that\u2019s gone into researching this piece of legislation\u2014the Crown is seeking to recoup that investment in the initial take of the fuel tax. So what will be next? When the racing legislation, which will no doubt come out from the report that\u2019s being done\u2014and this might be of quite some interest to you, Mr Clayton Mitchell\u2014comes in, will that also have a similar clause as this does? Because I think this is quite an insidious clause, and, you know, I think that it leaves Governments open for quite interesting accusations.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000789\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022094b0ff4-e404-451b-b4a9-ad12bd4dee56\u0022\u003ESo I would like to ask the Minister in the chair, Phil Twyford, to please take a call and please tell me the origin of this particular clause, what that money is to cover, how it was calculated, and, you know, why that is in there. Is this something that the Government will continue with? So I\u2019d like to put that to one side.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000790\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022094b0ff4-e404-451b-b4a9-ad12bd4dee56\u0022\u003EBut I\u2019d like to now turn to the matter of GST, and I think one clause of this that hasn\u2019t been looked at\u2014and I think Dr Smith talked about the Rt Hon Winston Peters making 200-odd statements about tax on a tax. I\u2019d like to offer Mr Peters an option to save some honour from this\u2014find a way out so he can actually not look as though he\u2019s a bit tardy on his reputation\u2014because there is a way around this, and I would submit that the way around this would be to calculate the GST on the cost of the retail price of the petrol\u2014or the fuel\u2014excluding excise and the fuel tax, and then add the excise and the fuel tax on top of the GST inclusive price of the retail fuel.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000791\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022094b0ff4-e404-451b-b4a9-ad12bd4dee56\u0022\u003ENow why that isn\u2019t a tax on a tax\u2014as I can see the cogs whirring in Mr Mitchell\u2019s head there trying to figure that out\u2014is because, Mr Mitchell, excise and a fuel tax are a flat charge, whereas a GST is a percentage of the price. So that\u2019s how you get a tax on a tax, and I think that Mr Peters\u2014I see you\u2019re texting him now. I think it\u2019d be a really good thing for him to come down to the Chamber, put a Supplementary Order Paper (SOP) in, and put this to rights, because, you know, it really is a serious slight on his reputation that he\u2019s made these claims about tax on a tax\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000792\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c0e0c86e-e14d-4daa-9bc8-1b5a3d7defeb\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002240a8c9aec7a84abb830df91314580601\u0022\u003ECHAIRPERSON (Poto Williams)\u003C/span\u003E: You cannot refer to a member who\u2019s not present in the House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000793\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022094b0ff4-e404-451b-b4a9-ad12bd4dee56\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022b56fbc4e6b4044a8b2daa33bd83a4efb\u0022\u003ESTUART SMITH\u003C/span\u003E: OK. All right. But it would be a great thing, I think, if you could get an SOP to try and sort this tax on a tax out, because it is quite insidious. I think we see the same thing in the alcohol, with excise tax going on and then you get the multiplier. It extracts quite a significant greater income on that from GST, and that might be the aim. Maybe that is the aim of having GST on top of the excise-inclusive price rather than the exclusive price, but I think this is really bad governance. I can accept it\u2019s been a long practice, and, you know, we\u2019re as guilty as anyone else of that, but this is a wonderful opportunity to fix this anomaly in this legislation.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000794\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022094b0ff4-e404-451b-b4a9-ad12bd4dee56\u0022\u003EI can see\u2014are you scribbling something down there, Mr Mitchell? I think that would be quite good to write that SOP now, and we could get that in and fix this piece of legislation, because I\u2019m sure there\u2019d be great support on this side of the Chamber. My colleagues would all join me in voting for that SOP to sort that anomaly out and get this bill in much better shape than it already is.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000795\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022094b0ff4-e404-451b-b4a9-ad12bd4dee56\u0022\u003ESo, with that, I thank you, Madam Chair.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022fdb01002-a7cf-4a77-8f05-678d24a36849\u0022 data-id=\u0022b4210d5d358b43c7ac852df14bad90a1\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000796\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022fdb01002-a7cf-4a77-8f05-678d24a36849\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022b4210d5d358b43c7ac852df14bad90a1\u0022\u003ETODD MULLER (National\u2014Bay of Plenty):\u003C/span\u003E Oh, thank you, Madam Chair. If I may just have a moment of celebration, actually, if the committee won\u2019t mind, I had a little phone call this evening from my daughter, who was in her school and they were having an assembly on volunteer week, and they wanted two people from the whole school to front and be part of the presentation and get a gift at the end. Everyone had their hands up, and she said, \u201CDad, it\u2019s a really tough feeling when you\u2019ve got your hands up and you don\u2019t get picked.\u201D, and there\u2019s a few, perhaps, who are feeling like that this evening.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000797\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022fdb01002-a7cf-4a77-8f05-678d24a36849\u0022\u003EHowever, I would, in all seriousness, like to talk about Part 2, obviously, and particularly the section relating to amendments to the Local Government Act. The thing that I would like to particularly explore this evening is the theme of transparency and accountability, which, clearly, as we note in the departmental report, was an area of some debate between the two sides of the House as this particular piece of legislation went through the select committee process.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000798\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022fdb01002-a7cf-4a77-8f05-678d24a36849\u0022\u003ENow, specifically, in clause 10 in Part 2, in new section 34B, is a section relating to additional information, which, in and of itself, I think is a reasonable start\u2014a reasonable, limited effort by the Government to have some obligations on regional councils with respect to transparency and accountability in its particular design of the annual report and the components that the annual report of the regional council that is benefiting from a regional fuel tax must cover.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000799\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022fdb01002-a7cf-4a77-8f05-678d24a36849\u0022\u003EThis evening I would like to particularly speak to my colleague Chris Penk\u2019s amendment\u2014which I don\u2019t believe has had much discussion this evening\u2014that relates specifically to proposed new section 34B(1)(d), which is an insert into what I believe, like I say, is that limited criteria on reporting as part of the broader transparency theme. This particular amendment requires that the \u201CReporting of all RFT schemes should be received by each local board in a region and consultation undertaken with that local board prior to the consultation on the annual report.\u201D\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000800\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022fdb01002-a7cf-4a77-8f05-678d24a36849\u0022\u003ECertainly, when I put my hand up to support this particular amendment, I was thinking specifically of the Bay of Plenty region and the myriad of local boards that are part of the local government governance arrangements in that council, and in the broader Bay of Plenty Regional Council. It\u2019s very clear that the Bay of Plenty Regional Council is potentially one of those councils who see the opportunity, through the options that are enabled in this particular piece of legislation, to put a regional fuel tax in.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000801\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022fdb01002-a7cf-4a77-8f05-678d24a36849\u0022\u003ENow, the key point here is that a number of our local boards have had significant disconnect between regional council roading priorities, and through that there is a risk that if there wasn\u2019t an opportunity or an obligation on the regional councils who are part of a regional fuel tax scheme to liaise back in a more specific way\u2014as outlined by this amendment\u2014to those local boards, I think there is an opportunity for that very local voice to not be part of the broader regional fuel tax framework. Bearing in mind that one of the components of this piece of legislation is to ensure that the needs of a particular local community with respect to regional roading infrastructure are met, I think that this is a particularly useful addition to what I think is a reasonable start.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000802\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022fdb01002-a7cf-4a77-8f05-678d24a36849\u0022\u003EI think if you look at new section 34B(1)(a) through to (c), in clause 10(5), there are some reasonable components there, and I acknowledge Minister Twyford for at least going some way to putting some accountability and transparency into this bill. But I think the particular amendment in the name of my colleague Chris Penk will go a further, significant step to ensuring that there is great connection between people in the local communities and the regional councils if they are part of a wider regional fuel tax scheme.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000803\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022fdb01002-a7cf-4a77-8f05-678d24a36849\u0022\u003EI have many other contributions that I\u2019d love to make, but I\u2019m conscious that others would like to contribute to this very important debate. Thank you, Madam Chair.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022cbc37df2-57ae-4536-94ed-a2e39eecd585\u0022 data-id=\u00226d2507974452476899e5d5246524db50\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000804\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cbc37df2-57ae-4536-94ed-a2e39eecd585\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00226d2507974452476899e5d5246524db50\u0022\u003EHon PHIL TWYFORD (Minister of Housing and Urban Development):\u003C/span\u003E I move, That the committee report progress and sit again presently.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022071f7800-2755-41b6-83df-07ebaf867ae2\u0022 data-id=\u0022f5c168e47d704c9fbe88aad44678705c\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000805\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022071f7800-2755-41b6-83df-07ebaf867ae2\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022f5c168e47d704c9fbe88aad44678705c\u0022\u003ETIM VAN DE MOLEN (National\u2014Waikato):\u003C/span\u003E I raise a point of order, Madam Chairperson. I just wanted to refer back to the earlier point of order raised by Mr Ross that was with regards to\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000806\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022df554580eb0e4617a05d194f4d2d1527\u0022\u003EHon Chris Hipkins\u003C/span\u003E: No, there\u2019s a question before the House\u2014there\u2019s a question before the House. You\u2019ve got to wait. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000807\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022071f7800-2755-41b6-83df-07ebaf867ae2\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002238cbb9b2e89b45e0b1021e1635b2d59c\u0022\u003ETIM VAN DE MOLEN\u003C/span\u003E: \u2014thank you\u2014the addition of other amendments in Part 2 covering Acts not included specifically under that. The Chair was going to come back to us with his consideration on that in this part, and so I\u2019d be interested to hear whether or not\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022c0e0c86e-e14d-4daa-9bc8-1b5a3d7defeb\u0022 data-id=\u0022fc3d4af4af5943f9bc8638a7561158a9\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000808\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c0e0c86e-e14d-4daa-9bc8-1b5a3d7defeb\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022fc3d4af4af5943f9bc8638a7561158a9\u0022\u003ECHAIRPERSON (Poto Williams)\u003C/span\u003E: We\u2019re still within the Part\u2014[Interruption] Yes, I would just ask the member to resume his seat. The Minister actually had just put a question to the committee, so just a moment\u2014will you just hold that.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca id=\u0022508acaf09fb84bf086b851038fe9bb35\u0022 name=\u0022division\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EA party vote was called for on the question, That the committee report progress and sit again presently.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EAyes 63\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand Labour 46; New Zealand First 9; Green Party 8.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENoes 55\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand National 55.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EMotion agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000809\u0022\u003EHouse resumed.\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000810\u0022\u003EThe Chairperson reported progress on the Land Transport Management (Regional Fuel Tax) Amendment Bill and no progress on the Taxation (Neutralising Base Erosion and Profit Shifting) Bill.\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000811\u0022\u003EReport adopted.\u003C/p\u003E\n    \u003C/div\u003E\n    \u003Cdiv class=\u0022HpsHansard\u0022\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000812\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsProceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u00221fff3ab8695441f98fecff8b231ed71e\u0022\u003EUrgency\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000814\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u0022ebc76f3720bd47bb8efd5b782cff7ff5\u0022\u003EUrgency\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022 data-id=\u002236e3bb2a37e04f09a9eb273cc4dc4e1c\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000813\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002236e3bb2a37e04f09a9eb273cc4dc4e1c\u0022\u003EHon CHRIS HIPKINS (Leader of the House):\u003C/span\u003E I move, That urgency be accorded to the committee stage and third reading of the Land Transport Management (Regional Fuel Tax) Amendment Bill and to the committee stage and third reading of the Taxation (Neutralising Base Erosion and Profit Shifting) Bill. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000815\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003EMcGee says that \u201Cthe use of urgency is expected to be confined to situations where an urgent approach is genuinely needed.\u201D The passing of these two bills meets this criteria quite comfortably. The passing of the Land Transport Management (Regional Fuel Tax) Amendment Bill this week is essential so that the Order in Council in clause 5 under new section 65K of the Land Transport Management Act can be made in time to establish the Auckland regional fuel tax scheme from 1 July, as scheduled. A late delay in the start date would make that very difficult, if not impossible. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000816\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003EThe Taxation (Neutralising Base Erosion and Profit Shifting) Bill must be assented by the end of this month to allow the commencement of most of its provisions on 1 July to apply in the income year that begins on that day. Any delay could create serious compliance issues for the IRD and for taxpayers. The bill has been supported by all parties at its first and second reading.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000817\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003EThe scheduling of the remaining stages of these two bills this week was notified to all parties last Thursday, so there are no particular surprises here. The use of urgency today will prevent the disruption of the third readings of the Treaty settlement bills that are planned tomorrow and next Thursday, and it will stop the Government having to interrupt members\u2019 day next Wednesday, which is an undertaking that I have given to members opposite\u2014that we would avoid interrupting members\u2019 days wherever possible.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000818\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003EUrgency will be used very rarely by this Government, as we showed last month when we became the first Government not to seek post-Budget urgency, and therefore I ask the House to support the motion.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca id=\u0022bba560c159784a6690359312537ba802\u0022 name=\u0022division\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EA party vote was called for on the question, That urgency be accorded to the committee stage and third reading of the Land Transport Management (Regional Fuel Tax) Amendment Bill and to the committee stage and third reading of the Taxation (Neutralising Base Erosion and Profit Shifting) Bill.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EAyes 63\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand Labour 46; New Zealand First 9; Green Party 8.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENoes 55\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand National 55.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EMotion agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n    \u003C/div\u003E\n    \u003Cdiv class=\u0022HpsHansard\u0022\u003E\n      \u003Cp\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsProceedingHeading\u0022\u003EBills\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000819\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u00227cab5e151c354fcdb0561fc6111e3b12\u0022\u003ELand Transport Management (Regional Fuel Tax) Amendment Bill\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000820\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u002293f25dcbd00744f88e9a3acff0b0cc2f\u0022\u003EInstruction to Committee\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022163d0b68-eb0e-4094-9bed-99e184f063e1\u0022 data-id=\u0022930c0f20a5de4912bb2925ab9d1d2101\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000821\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022163d0b68-eb0e-4094-9bed-99e184f063e1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022930c0f20a5de4912bb2925ab9d1d2101\u0022\u003EJAMI-LEE ROSS (National\u2014Botany):\u003C/span\u003E I raise a point of order, Madam Speaker. I sense you\u2019re about to put the House back into committee. I wish to move an instruction. Would this be an appropriate time to do so?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000822\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022977cccaf-581d-4f48-924e-32bf6c54a93d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022991535f87f354157932d7691f2bf875f\u0022\u003EDEPUTY SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Yes, I\u2019m prepared to hear it.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000823\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022163d0b68-eb0e-4094-9bed-99e184f063e1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022fd736a8480aa439dabc0cb70a9ca00a2\u0022\u003EJAMI-LEE ROSS\u003C/span\u003E: I move, That it be an instruction to the committee of the whole House on the Land Transport Management (Regional Fuel Tax) Amendment Bill that all members wishing to speak that have already spoken in Part 2 have the ability to have a full four calls reset to zero so each member is able to restart their speaking number.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000824\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022163d0b68-eb0e-4094-9bed-99e184f063e1\u0022\u003EI move this instruction because I think it\u2019s important, given the House has just\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000825\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00229bbd59a7c0ec4833904a2e7cf95eb99e\u0022\u003EHon Chris Hipkins\u003C/span\u003E: Point of order.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000826\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022977cccaf-581d-4f48-924e-32bf6c54a93d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022da58804135ae4907b518b0e68d3a0eb2\u0022\u003EDEPUTY SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Well, this is a point of order.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000827\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002270701fdc9a684f8d805fd0cd85e58b61\u0022\u003EHon Chris Hipkins\u003C/span\u003E: No, he\u2019s moved on to debating it, I assume.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000828\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022977cccaf-581d-4f48-924e-32bf6c54a93d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022b279bd5e9b0d4d61923098cba2559855\u0022\u003EDEPUTY SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: No, I still understand he\u2019s taking a point of order. I will allow the member to speak to the point of order, of course.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000829\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022163d0b68-eb0e-4094-9bed-99e184f063e1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022d3dd54df158047c1b3537f41c1a94d5a\u0022\u003EJAMI-LEE ROSS\u003C/span\u003E: Well, Madam Chair, when one takes a point of order to let the member speaking\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000830\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022977cccaf-581d-4f48-924e-32bf6c54a93d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022540e00c88821440c8fb9d2752cbaff3b\u0022\u003EDEPUTY SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Madam Deputy Speaker.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000831\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022163d0b68-eb0e-4094-9bed-99e184f063e1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022db92b01a01414bcb90677cfa9eda0550\u0022\u003EJAMI-LEE ROSS\u003C/span\u003E: Madam Deputy Speaker\u2014it\u2019s been a long night. That\u2019s why the Government\u2019s taking urgency. When a member moves an instruction, a member does so by way of point of order, and I\u2019m continuing with that. I have the ability, once I\u2019ve moved an instruction, to debate that. I now wish to do so.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022 data-id=\u0022391bc226e9bd46e0aec8f70224367cdd\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000832\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022391bc226e9bd46e0aec8f70224367cdd\u0022\u003EHon CHRIS HIPKINS (Leader of the House):\u003C/span\u003E I raise a point of order, Madam Speaker. That is clearly out of order, as it\u2019s an instruction to the presiding officers.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022163d0b68-eb0e-4094-9bed-99e184f063e1\u0022 data-id=\u0022b36fc28ff03b4d63b5d03d42a6ed0c31\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000833\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022163d0b68-eb0e-4094-9bed-99e184f063e1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022b36fc28ff03b4d63b5d03d42a6ed0c31\u0022\u003EJAMI-LEE ROSS (National\u2014Botany):\u003C/span\u003E Point of order.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022977cccaf-581d-4f48-924e-32bf6c54a93d\u0022 data-id=\u0022f2ea633f01454d879d16ae2b7befc5e8\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000834\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022977cccaf-581d-4f48-924e-32bf6c54a93d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022f2ea633f01454d879d16ae2b7befc5e8\u0022\u003EDEPUTY SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Are you speaking to the point of order or is this a different point of order? I had a point of order from the Hon Chris Hipkins. Are you speaking to that?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022163d0b68-eb0e-4094-9bed-99e184f063e1\u0022 data-id=\u0022651473e4eed34822abbe7afd7f16088b\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000835\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022163d0b68-eb0e-4094-9bed-99e184f063e1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022651473e4eed34822abbe7afd7f16088b\u0022\u003EJAMI-LEE ROSS (National\u2014Botany):\u003C/span\u003E I\u2019m speaking to that. The House has the ability to issue an instruction to the committee on how it should consider speeches and how it should consider the debate. My instruction says to the committee that it is instructed, and the presiding officer within a committee is required to be bound by an instruction from the House as well. My instruction says that the committee should consider this bill as if members have a fresh opportunity to debate that and have their call number reset to zero. That is quite within the House\u2019s right to do so.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022977cccaf-581d-4f48-924e-32bf6c54a93d\u0022 data-id=\u0022c689826102094556a413525e7b9c9c8d\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000836\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022977cccaf-581d-4f48-924e-32bf6c54a93d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022c689826102094556a413525e7b9c9c8d\u0022\u003EDEPUTY SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: I\u2019ve heard enough. I\u2019m just going to get some advice. Under Standing Order 176, \u201C(1) An instruction may be given to a committee of the whole House extending or restricting its powers in regard to consideration of the bill or other matter referred to it\u201D, so the motion is in order. I will accept that motion. That is now debatable.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022163d0b68-eb0e-4094-9bed-99e184f063e1\u0022 data-id=\u002266b6f23eebed4672a4bc792fef961a86\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000837\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022163d0b68-eb0e-4094-9bed-99e184f063e1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002266b6f23eebed4672a4bc792fef961a86\u0022\u003EJAMI-LEE ROSS (National\u2014Botany):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Madam Deputy Speaker. I debate this instruction, and I move this instruction very seriously. I do so because we\u2019re in an extraordinary situation where the House has just resumed because the Minister in the chair moved that the progress be reported. Once progress was reported, the House was then put into urgency. That is the right of the Government, but when the House takes urgency, and when the Government takes such an extraordinary step as to\u2014midway through a debate; midway through the consideration of a committee stage\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000838\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022b10f71108b34465bb2b6680a21dd55b6\u0022\u003EHon Chris Hipkins\u003C/span\u003E: I raise a point of order, Madam Speaker. I was incorrect, and you are correct. However, Standing Order 176(6) states that where an instruction only relates to increasing the number of questions the committee is to debate, there is no debate on that motion.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000839\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022163d0b68-eb0e-4094-9bed-99e184f063e1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022f6354a7e39564c91874dcee0794ea208\u0022\u003EJAMI-LEE ROSS\u003C/span\u003E: Speaking to that point of order, Madam Deputy Speaker. You have already ruled. You ruled that I am able to debate this. You ruled that this is a debatable motion. Notwithstanding the fact that Mr Hipkins has belatedly found something in the Standing Orders, you\u2019ve made a ruling now. You have the right to make that ruling. I have the right to debate it because you\u2019ve made that ruling.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022977cccaf-581d-4f48-924e-32bf6c54a93d\u0022 data-id=\u00225ec3ea5fb53d4f2986a26db2c71af05b\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000840\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022977cccaf-581d-4f48-924e-32bf6c54a93d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00225ec3ea5fb53d4f2986a26db2c71af05b\u0022\u003EDEPUTY SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: In fact, that is correct. I have made a ruling, and it is debatable, and the debate will continue.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00227c215736-b512-41de-8f0c-6c5543fcfce7\u0022 data-id=\u00227dd725326c2343e9a609ba514243e411\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000841\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227c215736-b512-41de-8f0c-6c5543fcfce7\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00227dd725326c2343e9a609ba514243e411\u0022\u003EHon JAMES SHAW (Green):\u003C/span\u003E I raise a point of order, Madam Speaker.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000842\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022977cccaf-581d-4f48-924e-32bf6c54a93d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022da4536953f394f85a9b4e6d9d31f9a0a\u0022\u003EDEPUTY SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Are you questioning my ruling or is this a fresh point of order?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000843\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227c215736-b512-41de-8f0c-6c5543fcfce7\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002225decd17d71f4027bb2bd0ba85ef566b\u0022\u003EHon JAMES SHAW\u003C/span\u003E: It\u2019s in relation to the ability to debate. The clock hadn\u2019t started, so I wasn\u2019t sure how long the member was going to be able to debate for\u2014whether it was five minutes or 10 minutes.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000844\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022977cccaf-581d-4f48-924e-32bf6c54a93d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002206d5c06287d541009f23eb96667a5ab5\u0022\u003EDEPUTY SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Yes, it is 10 minutes.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022163d0b68-eb0e-4094-9bed-99e184f063e1\u0022 data-id=\u0022ac2f1099e59546be87a229f317636ad8\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000845\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022163d0b68-eb0e-4094-9bed-99e184f063e1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022ac2f1099e59546be87a229f317636ad8\u0022\u003EJAMI-LEE ROSS (National\u2014Botany):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you. I think this is the third attempt now to take this, and I think that just highlights for the members around that\u2019ll be making a decision on how they wish to vote on this instruction that we have such an extraordinary night. I say it\u2019s an extraordinary night, and it\u2019s extraordinary move for me to move this instruction because we do have such an extraordinary situation.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000846\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022163d0b68-eb0e-4094-9bed-99e184f063e1\u0022\u003EThe extraordinary situation we have, where we\u2019ve just had the Government put the House into urgency, means that we are now in a position where we are having to take urgency on a matter that is to do with taxation, a matter that we weren\u2019t expecting we would be in urgency under, and a situation where we, quite legitimately, as the Opposition, were using our ability to put up amendments, our ability to put up arguments, our ability to delay the passage of a piece of legislation that we believe is dangerous. We should now have more of an opportunity to put forward arguments, put forward amendments, and put forward very valid reasons why this bill should not progress\u2014because the House has taken urgency, because midway through the process, because midway through the consideration of this bill, the Government\u2019s had a complete change of tack and the Government\u2019s had a complete change in situation, where they\u2019re having to now take urgency on this. It wasn\u2019t expected. They are in a position where they\u2019re now embarrassed. They are in a position where they\u2019ve had to do something that I haven\u2019t seen in the seven years I\u2019ve been here. We should have had the opportunity to have our calls reset to zero.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000847\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022163d0b68-eb0e-4094-9bed-99e184f063e1\u0022\u003EThe reason I suggest this is because there\u2019s an important principle in play when the House considers something in urgency, or when the committee considers something in urgency, because the normal rules around tight speeches, the normal rules around ensuring members are kept very tightly to the debating points, the rules around ensuring that our amendments are considered and not too broad\u2014those rules get moved out quite a lot when we go into urgency. There\u2019s very clear precedent that when the committee\u2019s considering a bill under urgency, the parameters broaden considerably. The parameters broaden in such a way that the Opposition has more opportunity to put forward amendments, the Opposition has more opportunity to test in the committee whether or not we should be putting forward new parts, and the Opposition has the ability to try and go even further to delay the legislation, because the House has taken an extraordinary move to take urgency.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000848\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022163d0b68-eb0e-4094-9bed-99e184f063e1\u0022\u003ESo if the Opposition has the ability to, under an urgent situation, broaden its parameters, broaden its debate, broaden the amendments that we may put forward, it\u2019s only fair and reasonable that we have our call number reduced back to zero, because the situation we were operating under for many, many hours\u2014and I accept we worked hard on that, and I accept the Government didn\u2019t like it, and I accept we sent them into a position where they had to take urgency. But the fact that we were able to do that and the fact that we now have a situation where the House is in urgency, about to put the House into committee stage, we should have a fresh go.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000849\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022163d0b68-eb0e-4094-9bed-99e184f063e1\u0022\u003EWe should have a fresh go because the rules of engagement have changed. We should have a fresh go because the way in which the committee now has to consider the bill and the way in which we all operate as members of Parliament\u2014the playing field\u2019s changed. So if the playing field\u2019s changed, if the Government\u2019s now in a position where they\u2019ve been embarrassed into taking urgency because the opposition to a regional fuel tax is so strong that the Opposition has utilised its full might and muscle to delay the legislation and they\u2019re now having to take urgency, we deserve a good, proper go to do so under urgency in those circumstances.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000850\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022163d0b68-eb0e-4094-9bed-99e184f063e1\u0022\u003EMadam Deputy Speaker, I know that you were listening to the debate a lot, both in your office and when you were presiding as the Chair in the committee. You will know, Madam Deputy Speaker, that we were working hard to ensure we kept our debate tight, and we were working hard to ensure we had new amendments that were legitimate. You know that we were working exceptionally hard to debate this properly. We were doing what Oppositions do.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000851\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022163d0b68-eb0e-4094-9bed-99e184f063e1\u0022\u003EOppositions have the right in the Parliament to delay legislation. Oppositions have the right in the Parliament to stand up and express a view on behalf of New Zealanders about why a dangerous piece of legislation shouldn\u2019t proceed. Oppositions have long held the ability to delay a Government and to impede their legislative programme. That\u2019s what we\u2019ve done. That\u2019s what we\u2019ve managed to do. That\u2019s what we\u2019ve managed to force the Government into\u2014an embarrassing situation. But because they\u2019ve taken an extraordinary step\u2014and I say it\u2019s an extraordinary step because we didn\u2019t expect it. I say it\u2019s an extraordinary step because it was never signalled. I say it\u2019s an extraordinary step because the Government\u2014the Leader of the House has never at any point in time that I\u2019ve seen in the media said, \u201CHey, we\u2019re going to be taking urgency on this piece of legislation.\u201D We deserve a full go. We deserve the full set of calls.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000852\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022163d0b68-eb0e-4094-9bed-99e184f063e1\u0022\u003ESo I ask that the House give serious consideration to this instruction. I ask that the Government, in fact, allow us a full go. OK, they\u2019ve taken urgency now. They\u2019re going to lose their select committees tomorrow. I don\u2019t know if there\u2019s any\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000853\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002257e41e9d-285b-4fb3-847d-a63820ae7137\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002286d4d360113449b89ccb966274de536c\u0022\u003EChris Bishop\u003C/span\u003E: Kelvin Davis?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000854\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022163d0b68-eb0e-4094-9bed-99e184f063e1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00226727e0d627a04c1583fd2545dbb77158\u0022\u003EJAMI-LEE ROSS\u003C/span\u003E: \u2014oh, Kelvin Davis is on tomorrow. I don\u2019t know if there are any committees that are going to be doing Estimates hearings, but those opportunities have been lost, and I know the Government wouldn\u2019t do that unless they felt strongly that this has to happen. So I say to the House: if this is such an issue where the Government feels so strongly that it wants to take urgency.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000855\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002221f34b8b8c6e4935a437f33f2fb7698d\u0022\u003EHon Member\u003C/span\u003E: Repetition.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000856\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022163d0b68-eb0e-4094-9bed-99e184f063e1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022db93d03cf19a4b3a88bd03f27c103892\u0022\u003EJAMI-LEE ROSS\u003C/span\u003E: I\u2019m allowed to be repetitious. They have just put the House into urgency. It\u2019s an extraordinary step, and it wasn\u2019t expected. So I say: if this is going to proceed, then the House needs to give consideration to this instruction so that we get a fair whack at it, so we get a fair opportunity to speak to the bill afresh, so we can put new amendments up, and so we can ensure that this gets a full debate.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022 data-id=\u0022c3efa13ab1a9424ebe0f055ebb1768c5\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000857\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022c3efa13ab1a9424ebe0f055ebb1768c5\u0022\u003EHon CHRIS HIPKINS (Leader of the House):\u003C/span\u003E I move, That the motion be amended to delete all the words after \u201CThat\u201D and replace them with \u201CThat it be an instruction to the committee that the remaining questions on the Land Transport Management (Regional Fuel Tax) Amendment Bill be put without further debate.\u201D\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000858\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003EIt is an interesting approach for the Opposition to take to put this motion before the House. It does suggest that the majority of the House be empowered to instruct the Chair as to how they should exercise their discretion. That has been ruled within order, and therefore it is within order for the House to instruct the Chair not to take any further calls on that matter, which, of course, will bring the debate to a much faster conclusion, and it will be a much more satisfactory outcome from the Government\u2019s perspective.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000859\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003EI\u2019d encourage the Opposition to consider, when they decide to encourage the rules of the House to be changed, the ultimate precedent value that that creates and where that may well land up, because, ultimately, the power will remain with the majority in the House in those situations. So I welcome the fact that the House is now being given the opportunity to instruct the committee as to how many speeches there should be on the remaining stages of the Land Transport Management (Regional Fuel Tax) Amendment Bill, and I believe that this is a very sound amendment that will ensure that the integrity of the House is preserved.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002257e41e9d-285b-4fb3-847d-a63820ae7137\u0022 data-id=\u0022295ec35cecbb489f87d1b44e7fdbe005\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000860\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002257e41e9d-285b-4fb3-847d-a63820ae7137\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022295ec35cecbb489f87d1b44e7fdbe005\u0022\u003ECHRIS BISHOP (National\u2014Hutt South):\u003C/span\u003E Well, thank you very much, Madam Assistant Speaker. What an extraordinary time we are in. I just want to be clear, for members in the House, newer members\u2014well, they\u2019re not here, but newer members from New Zealand First and from the Greens\u2014and for the members of the public who are interested. I know in Auckland they\u2019re particularly interested in this debate. I just want to be clear for the House about what the Leader of the House has moved. What he has moved: firstly, that the House will go into urgency on two taxation bills\u2014and we\u2019ll come to that point because it\u2019s very important\u2014but the amendment to the motion means that the debate on the committee stage of the bill will be completely cut off.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000861\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002257e41e9d-285b-4fb3-847d-a63820ae7137\u0022\u003EThis is an extraordinary abuse of Government power and, frankly, I am surprised that the Leader of the House has resorted to something like this. I actually am genuinely surprised, because I was a staffer and an MP in Parliament when Chris Hipkins railed against the use of urgency\u2014it was despotic, it was dictatorial, and it was the Government using its majority to override the minority and free and fair debate. So I am just staggered that we are in here in the House tonight debating an urgency motion, essentially, on the cusp of the lifting of the House at 10 o\u2019clock at night on a Wednesday, and we\u2019re going to start again tomorrow morning because the Government is so incompetent that they can\u2019t organise their Order Paper properly.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000862\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002257e41e9d-285b-4fb3-847d-a63820ae7137\u0022\u003EI want to make three points about why my good colleague Jami-Lee Ross\u2019 motion should be supported, and, of course, the point of the motion is to allow members who have spoken already to continue to speak on the committee stages of the regional fuel tax legislation. The first point I want to make is that these are bills dealing with taxation. I make that point very seriously. The whole structure of our constitution rests on the idea that the Government governs with the consent of Parliament, and the appropriate mechanism for testing whether or not the Government enjoys the confidence of the House is confidence motions. Now, obviously, the Speech from the Throne\u2014that\u2019s the very first test of whether or not a Government enjoys the confidence of the House. The Governor-General stands up and reads out what the Government\u2019s written\u2014what the Prime Minister\u2019s written, or a staffer for the Prime Minister.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000863\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002257e41e9d-285b-4fb3-847d-a63820ae7137\u0022\u003ESo that\u2019s the first test. But then the secondary test is what happens when we have the Budgets, the imprest supply bills, the Supplementary Estimates bills, and, of course, the appropriation bills, like we\u2019ve just finished\u2014I think we\u2019re still actually debating that at the moment\u2014and, of course, those are confidence motions. What that means is the Government is able to tax money, take money from New Zealanders, and spend it on their behalf in the way that the Government decides to do\u2014that\u2019s the whole point. The Government lays out the reams of documents\u2014and members on this side have enjoyed going through those over the last few weeks\u2014and they put it before the House and the Minister of Finance goes around and hands out the Budget documents. Then the Parliament and the select committees\u2014and the Finance and Expenditure Committee lead this\u2014go through and make sure that the Government is actually spending the money on the right things. They test that.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000864\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002257e41e9d-285b-4fb3-847d-a63820ae7137\u0022\u003ESo taxation is of critical constitutional importance. These are not ordinary bills. These are not bills that are just everyday, run-of-the-mill legislation bills\u2014the Military Justice Legislation Amendment Bill, which I think\u2019s meant to be on the Order Paper for tomorrow, which I was looking forward to debating, but it turns out it\u2019ll probably be debated in a couple of weeks\u2019 time, once we\u2019ve finally finished the Land Transport Management (Regional Fuel Tax) Amendment Bill. But taxation bills have a special place in our constitutional and legislative framework because it is the biggest power the State enjoys\u2014or one of the biggest powers the State enjoys. The power to lock someone up and the power to prosecute and charge is an important one, but the power to, with the barrel of a gun, expropriate money from people in what would otherwise be theft\u2014right? In the ordinary course of events, taking money from someone is theft, but we legislate to legalise that, to allow that to happen\u2014and no one\u2019s arguing taxation is theft. I\u2019m not making that point, but I\u2019m making the point that in our constitutional framework the power to tax is exceptional and important.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000865\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002257e41e9d-285b-4fb3-847d-a63820ae7137\u0022\u003EWe are dealing\u2014I mean, it\u2019s not just the regional fuel tax. This was the Taxation (Neutralising Base Erosion and Profit Shifting) Bill. Taking one look at it\u2014there\u2019s a large number of sections to it. I remember when this was first introduced to the Finance and Expenditure Committee, that I sit on. This deals with extraordinarily important matters to do with multinational companies, to do with the way that they organise their financial affairs, and what the Leader of the House has essentially done is said, not just in relation to the regional fuel tax bill, but the Taxation (Neutralising Base Erosion and Profit Shifting) Bill\u2014\u201CNo more debate.\u201D In fact, we haven\u2019t even started the debate on that.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000866\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022b0d0678bbde24907850c2dfca8169129\u0022\u003EHon Chris Hipkins\u003C/span\u003E: No, that\u2019s not what the amendment was.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000867\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002257e41e9d-285b-4fb3-847d-a63820ae7137\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00227ef201fbe0944b62a262de1536324435\u0022\u003ECHRIS BISHOP\u003C/span\u003E: Oh, you\u2019re not amending that. OK, it\u2019s just the regional fuel tax. Well, the point still remains that this will be going through under urgency and the first point is that taxation is extremely important for the House to pay cognisance to, and therefore it\u2019s important that we have a wider debate.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000868\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002257e41e9d-285b-4fb3-847d-a63820ae7137\u0022\u003EThe second point I want to make as to why this motion should be supported is that we on this side of the House have organised ourselves around the idea of no urgency. This was never advised by the Government until now. This has been sprung on us, literally on the cusp of the House rising on a Wednesday night. There are members not here and members who will be here next week who have organised themselves around speaking on this bill, and they will have their opportunity to speak on the regional fuel tax bill cut off by what the Government is doing.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000869\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002257e41e9d-285b-4fb3-847d-a63820ae7137\u0022\u003ELook, frankly, there are members around the country who want a chance to come down here and move amendments and speak on the bill. This is not a bill that\u2019s just limited to Auckland, as has been widely canvassed. There are regional councils lining up around the country. In fact, it\u2019d be easier to completely rename it, because there\u2019s not a council in the country that doesn\u2019t want the opportunity\u2014or it seems like there\u2019s not a council in the country\u2014to levy more taxation on the hard-working members of those regional councils. So the point is that members here have organised ourselves to give ourselves the ability to speak at a particular time, and the Government, by the stint of this extraordinarily arrogant and contemptuous action, has turned up\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000870\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022163d0b68-eb0e-4094-9bed-99e184f063e1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022e11603b7e3c649b9a1d1b87922d71915\u0022\u003EJami-Lee Ross\u003C/span\u003E: It\u2019s vindictive.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000871\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002257e41e9d-285b-4fb3-847d-a63820ae7137\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022229a010c4fdf42b08374259a7028fde2\u0022\u003ECHRIS BISHOP\u003C/span\u003E: It\u2019s vindictive. My colleague Jami-Lee Ross says it\u2019s vindictive. It is completely vindictive. Through sheer ineptitude, through sheer incompetence, and through an arrogance that is worryingly frequent and common for this Government, we find ourselves at the dead of night, basically, stuck into urgency. No more select committees tomorrow. We had Kelvin Davis up tomorrow morning. I mean, frankly, we were really looking forward to having Kelvin Davis up for the Estimates, but now we will no longer. So that\u2019s the second point.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000872\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002257e41e9d-285b-4fb3-847d-a63820ae7137\u0022\u003EThe third point is that committees of the whole have traditionally had a wider scope when considering bills under urgency.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id201806200d8ca52c9eb1433990832326dd980b76000873\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002257e41e9d-285b-4fb3-847d-a63820ae7137\u0022\u003ESitting suspended from 10 p.m. to 9 a.m. (Thursday)\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n    \u003C/div\u003E\n    \u003Cdiv class=\u0022HpsHansard\u0022\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000001\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsProceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u002298a89ff0f9b04a0a8502e99d3b4b26cb\u0022\u003EWEDNESDAY, 20 JUNE 2018\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000002\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u0022bc0c7cbc2ada4921859ec6fc5767cece\u0022\u003E(continued on Thursday, 21 June 2018)\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n    \u003C/div\u003E\n    \u003Cdiv class=\u0022HpsHansard\u0022\u003E\n      \u003Cp\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsProceedingHeading\u0022\u003EBills\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000003\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u0022fd6472e59dd84bddb0bd491c7c3a7ff2\u0022\u003ELand Transport Management (Regional Fuel Tax) Amendment Bill\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000004\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u0022569ad3cbda3c498b9d5aefd561f7c850\u0022\u003EInstruction to Committee\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000005\u0022\u003EDebate resumed from 20 June.\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022 data-id=\u00221997e7a2710e49a5af6791e7454d8d04\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000006\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00221997e7a2710e49a5af6791e7454d8d04\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Last night, when the instruction to the committee was moved, the question should have been proposed. So the question now is that the motion be agreed to and the Hon Chris Hipkins\u2019 amendment to it be agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000007\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003EWhen the House was suspended last night, we were debating the instruction to the committee of the whole House and the amendment proposed to it. Chris Bishop has the call and has one minute and 51 seconds remaining if he so wishes.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022 data-id=\u002271ba9113b47f4618afe8386a9e7f8ed1\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000008\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002271ba9113b47f4618afe8386a9e7f8ed1\u0022\u003EHon CHRIS HIPKINS (Leader of the House):\u003C/span\u003E I raise a point of order, Mr Speaker. I\u2019m sorry to interrupt the member who was speaking. I have reflected very carefully on where the House got to last night and on both of the questions currently before the House, and I do not believe it is in the best interests of the House for this to continue. I therefore seek leave to withdraw my amendment to the motion that is currently before the House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022 data-id=\u0022c78cca66ea4a49beaabda47d0bfde594\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000009\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022c78cca66ea4a49beaabda47d0bfde594\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Is there any objection to that? There appears to be none.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022 data-id=\u0022415b3babdfbb4548963aa9c1a4af0571\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000010\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022415b3babdfbb4548963aa9c1a4af0571\u0022\u003EHon Dr NICK SMITH (National\u2014Nelson):\u003C/span\u003E I raise a point of order, Mr Speaker. I welcome the move by the Leader of the House to withdraw the motion. The motion that was moved\u2014the amendment last night\u2014was an absolute affront\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022 data-id=\u0022ddf7cf722c3149e98213d1fbe1eb0be3\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000011\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022ddf7cf722c3149e98213d1fbe1eb0be3\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Order! [Interruption] No. The member will resume his seat. The member has not referred to a point of order. [Interruption] The member cannot take a point of order while I\u2019m on my feet. Whether or not I agree with him\u2014and I do agree with him\u2014that both these motions are an affront to the House, and that motion would certainly not have had my support, I do want to make it clear that that motion can now not be debated. The only motion that can be debated currently is the one in the name of Jami-Lee Ross, and I will not have points of order which purport to reflect on a motion now no longer before the House. And I want to warn the Hon Dr Nick Smith that the consequences will be serious.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022 data-id=\u0022e22488acd8b94c409d345d7664e12015\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000012\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022e22488acd8b94c409d345d7664e12015\u0022\u003EHon Dr NICK SMITH (National\u2014Nelson):\u003C/span\u003E I\u2019ve been a member of this House for 27 years, and I should be able to raise a serious point of order without being\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022 data-id=\u002272a0d29c1ba5487c91e8fc1f3dc5ec1e\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000013\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002272a0d29c1ba5487c91e8fc1f3dc5ec1e\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: The member will resume his seat. [Interruption] The member will resume his seat. And the member is absolutely right; if the member had raised a serious point of order, he would have been heard. He didn\u2019t. He abused the process. He referred to a motion no longer before the House and did not have a point of order on that.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000014\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022d5efe920cf7f43a1b61e242260a46f80\u0022\u003EHon Dr Nick Smith\u003C/span\u003E: Point of order, Mr Speaker.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000015\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00227922a77695734e0ba12faadd324b416e\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: The member will resume his seat. I\u2019m going to warn the member now that if he takes a point of order that is not within order, then the consequences for his party today will be serious.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022 data-id=\u00226602835c9268450894b333d8c0e2c12c\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000016\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00226602835c9268450894b333d8c0e2c12c\u0022\u003EHon Dr NICK SMITH (National\u2014Nelson):\u003C/span\u003E I raise a point of order, Mr Speaker. That point is completely understood, and I do ask you to give me a moment to explain my point of order, because it\u2019s a serious one and it is one that welcomes the comments that you have made in resuming the Chair in the House this morning. The unfortunate precedent, though, that has been established is that the motion to give an instruction to the committee was accepted by the Speaker last night. That has created\u2014even though the motion has been withdrawn\u2014an unfortunate precedent. What I am seeking from you, Mr Speaker, under Standing Order 176 is a ruling that the motion that was moved was not within the Standing Orders, and the reason\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022 data-id=\u0022d053af8d730f4929b33a0bcac4d8e885\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000017\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022d053af8d730f4929b33a0bcac4d8e885\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Well, the member will now resume his seat. The motion was accepted by the Speaker last night. If it had been a matter that had been accepted by the Chair, in the Chair, then it would be appropriate for me to rule on that. The Speaker in this Chair last night made a decision; that decision is final and is not appealable to me. There might be some cause to reflect on it, and it could well be a matter that the Standing Orders Committee, either in the short term or the longer term, has a look at, probably along with the motion that is currently before the House. And I just want to say to Dr Nick Smith that he is sailing very, very close to the wind. He is the father of the House. He does know that one cannot appeal the rulings of an acting Speaker to the Speaker.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000018\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003EDebate interrupted.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n    \u003C/div\u003E\n    \u003Cdiv class=\u0022HpsHansard\u0022\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000019\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsProceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u002264156b7f832742abb05640c401c86318\u0022\u003EMotions\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000020\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u00228cb355925d79492c91a3067e3f0eb0f8\u0022\u003EPrime Minister\u2014Best Wishes for Impending Birth\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002263776108-58dc-4cab-baf1-95282c61d0de\u0022 data-id=\u00227c85b063f59442c7901d8e6dfe32d3b2\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000021\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002263776108-58dc-4cab-baf1-95282c61d0de\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00227c85b063f59442c7901d8e6dfe32d3b2\u0022\u003EHon PAULA BENNETT (Deputy Leader\u2014National):\u003C/span\u003E I seek leave to move a motion without notice or debate wishing the Prime Minister and Clarke Gayford well with the impending birth of their child today.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000022\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00222df28517637a4db39262f2eebec682aa\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Is there any objection to that? There appears to be none.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000023\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002263776108-58dc-4cab-baf1-95282c61d0de\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00226abc20fa0b0f4a55889a6a5f72ec39e8\u0022\u003EHon PAULA BENNETT\u003C/span\u003E: Thank you, Mr Speaker. I move, That the House wish the Prime Minister and Clarke Gayford well with the impending birth of their child today.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000024\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002263776108-58dc-4cab-baf1-95282c61d0de\u0022\u003EIt is unique circumstances that the country itself finds itself in today, and it is a really, really big time for both the Prime Minister and for Mr Gayford. I know certainly the whole House and the whole country is sitting on the edge of their seat, and I just wanted to put on record that we wish her and this baby the best of health, a speedy and, hopefully, really pleasant birth\u2014as good as they can be. I know this is an exceptional day for them, and we certainly just want to really wish them both\u2014and the whole three of them, we hope\u2014all the best for today.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000025\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022023fe9c707954a9a87374cd040c2d89f\u0022\u003EHon Chris Hipkins\u003C/span\u003E: Mr Speaker?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000026\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022d40fd8a5b0ab4519987ec058e52c9b79\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Well, I\u2019m going to be a little bit liberal now, because we\u2019ve just accepted a motion without debate.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000027\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022e2686bebd5864ea2b8118d4a78dff081\u0022\u003EHon Chris Hipkins\u003C/span\u003E: Well, the motion was just debated.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000028\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00221e08184a0ad34e80b398ba393abd60f6\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: No. That was the motion, actually. I\u2019m sure the House\u2014there\u2019s a bit of fairy dust around us and if the member wants to respond\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022 data-id=\u0022a2ad621dba8a496bb094e3f89ab684f2\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000029\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022a2ad621dba8a496bb094e3f89ab684f2\u0022\u003EHon CHRIS HIPKINS (Minister of Education):\u003C/span\u003E I\u2019ll be very brief in speaking on behalf of the Labour Party to this motion to also add our best wishes to the Prime Minister, which, of course, have already been passed on in person. It\u2019s a very unusual situation, I think, that the Prime Minister finds herself in, where the international media is staking out the hospital, waiting for the outcome of this particular delivery. There aren\u2019t many people that face that when they are giving birth, and so I think that adds an added dimension of pressure to the Prime Minister at a time when she\u2019s probably got more than enough pressure to cope with as she goes through this process. But I think the whole House wishes her all the very best. It is world leading for New Zealand, and I think we are all very proud of her.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000030\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003EMotion agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n    \u003C/div\u003E\n    \u003Cdiv class=\u0022HpsHansard\u0022\u003E\n      \u003Cp\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsProceedingHeading\u0022\u003EBills\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000031\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u0022ae8bb49c67b949b288174e66bb314bc2\u0022\u003ELand Transport Management (Regional Fuel Tax) Amendment Bill\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000032\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u002292ff8ecd33cd4831bc2eaf2a8f1bafa7\u0022\u003EInstruction to Committee\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000033\u0022\u003EDebate resumed.\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002257e41e9d-285b-4fb3-847d-a63820ae7137\u0022 data-id=\u002296fe0029610d4c2ba4578045a2757558\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000034\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002257e41e9d-285b-4fb3-847d-a63820ae7137\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002296fe0029610d4c2ba4578045a2757558\u0022\u003ECHRIS BISHOP (National\u2014Hutt South):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you very much, Mr Speaker. When I was speaking last night in my contribution on the motion moved by Mr Jami-Lee Ross to, essentially, reset the counter to zero for members speaking in the committee stage of the Land Transport Management (Regional Fuel Tax) Amendment Bill, I\u2019d made three remarks\u2014or I was coming to the third remark. The first point I want to just quickly recapitulate for the House is the very important point\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000035\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00224cbb60980c614330983bab198724d253\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: I\u2019m just going to warn the member\u2014we had a slight problem with the clocks, so he hasn\u2019t got quite as long as it appears.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000036\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002257e41e9d-285b-4fb3-847d-a63820ae7137\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022d288e2abfdb247008380c409927877e9\u0022\u003ECHRIS BISHOP\u003C/span\u003E: OK. The first very important point I made was around taxation, and I talked about the constitutional importance of taxation in this House as a means of testing the confidence of the House in the Government and the paramount importance of taxation bills because of the power the State gives to itself in regard to its citizens. What we\u2019re dealing with here are two bills to do with taxation: regional fuel tax, apparently only to Auckland but potentially further around the country, but also very important rules around multinational tax, base erosion and profit shifting\u2014something that has concerned many members of the House on both sides of it. I think that means we need to debate the bills thoroughly, particularly because we are in a very unusual situation of urgency having been moved at 9.35 p.m., right on the cusp of the House lifting.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000037\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002257e41e9d-285b-4fb3-847d-a63820ae7137\u0022\u003EThe second point I made was in relation to that unusual use of the urgency. Usually, urgency is advertised in advance. There\u2019s a couple of days\u2019 notice given, every member knows exactly what bill is about to be debated, arrangements are made so have that question time can happen and maybe Estimates can happen, and select committees can sit\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022 data-id=\u002218edd0a1125b42de99cfc0324a092ab5\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000038\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002218edd0a1125b42de99cfc0324a092ab5\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: The member\u2019s time has expired.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022c83012b4-3939-4753-80fc-1956a3e2bd1e\u0022 data-id=\u0022244618e28b8e4435a35b106284693f24\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000039\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c83012b4-3939-4753-80fc-1956a3e2bd1e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022244618e28b8e4435a35b106284693f24\u0022\u003EHon MICHAEL WOODHOUSE (National):\u003C/span\u003E There were certainly a number of things that I had expected to be doing this Thursday morning; speaking in the House on this motion certainly wasn\u2019t one of them\u2014and, certainly, not under urgency. This is a robust House, a debating chamber where there are decisions made on the fly, in the heat of the moment, trusting one\u2019s instincts, and a decision was made last night that meant I expected to come to the House and decry this day as a day where there may be the birth of the Prime Minister\u2019s baby but the death of democracy. Without wanting to overly broaden the debate back into a decision that\u2019s already been made\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000040\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022fedd8b486a1a4fc4b814e7052d21e2e7\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Can I just warn the member the Chamber clocks are going up, not down. It might feel the other way.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000041\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c83012b4-3939-4753-80fc-1956a3e2bd1e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002262e3fc7d1f9b40fca97529f0385234a8\u0022\u003EHon MICHAEL WOODHOUSE\u003C/span\u003E: That\u2019s fine, thank you very much. I want to acknowledge the importance of reflection and the considered decisions that can be made by this House. We are the architects of our own destiny, and we shouldn\u2019t be above recognising, looking back in the cool light of the morning, that sometimes we may make decisions that don\u2019t do this House justice. I think it\u2019s a credit to this place that we are robustly but respectfully able to reflect on and change our positions, and I certainly want to acknowledge that.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000042\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c83012b4-3939-4753-80fc-1956a3e2bd1e\u0022\u003EThere has been comment, though, about this motion as somehow analogous to the one that is no longer before us, the amendment. There is a compare and contrast situation, I think, between an attempt to broaden free speech with an attempt to curtail it, and I don\u2019t agree that this motion has any of the elements of curtailment that others previously considered would have. Indeed, the circumstances that led Mr Ross to move this motion on instructing the committee to have more time to consider were for those colleagues\u2014particularly, of mine\u2014who feel passionately about the taxation representation principle that underpins a working democracy and the ability to be able to stand and represent one\u2019s constituents and say, \u201CWe need to scrutinise this.\u201D\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000043\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c83012b4-3939-4753-80fc-1956a3e2bd1e\u0022\u003EWe have a set time limit for the first, second, and third readings, and we have a robust select committee process, but the committee of the whole House is the machine in which we are able to deconstruct and analyse a bill, part by part, clause by clause. It is true that some of that analysis in this House has, by any measure, not been that intelligent, and I want to acknowledge the significant improvements that have taken place in the last couple of years to require Ministers to answer good technical questions but also the quid pro quo\u2014that is, it is incumbent on members to technically analyse a bill. I think that is a significant improvement on the committee process. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000044\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c83012b4-3939-4753-80fc-1956a3e2bd1e\u0022\u003EWhat Mr Ross is doing, though, which I think has merit, and the House should really consider this, is being proposed against the backdrop of something that may also be unprecedented. That is the taking of urgency in the middle of the committee of the whole House, where there was an honest belief\u2014it may well not be but it\u2019s certainly unusual, Mr Hipkins, I think you\u2019ll agree\u2014and where there is a lot of work that is required to deconstruct and analyse the bill and a number of members who may not have been in the position at the time that the committee stage started to be able to do that.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000045\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c83012b4-3939-4753-80fc-1956a3e2bd1e\u0022\u003EWe found ourselves in a situation last night where that opportunity was curtailed and rushed, and I don\u2019t think it\u2019s unreasonable for the House to consider this instruction so that those who are\u2014and there are many of them\u2014passionate about the provisions of this bill and how it can be improved for their constituents are able to re-state, re-litigate, re-suggest, and suggest new Supplementary Order Papers that will enhance this bill. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000046\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c83012b4-3939-4753-80fc-1956a3e2bd1e\u0022\u003ENow, it\u2019s a value judgment whether or not members on the other side or other members of the House, and the Chair, value the merit of that, but I\u2019m long enough in this House to remember the Auckland super-city legislation. Never again will we, as a committee of the whole House, descend to the situation that we came to where 30,000 tabled amendments were set. That is not the brand of this House any more. But it is incumbent on all of us to make sure that regardless of the merits or the perceptions of the merits or otherwise of these amendments and the suggested changes that can be made to this bill, this is a tax bill. This is a bill that will, by far, lift the hand of the State into the pockets of the people of, firstly, Auckland, and then, certainly, the rest of New Zealand. It behoves this House to give every consideration and give every member the opportunity to be able to represent those people in this place, so that we can give that bill every scrutiny.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000047\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c83012b4-3939-4753-80fc-1956a3e2bd1e\u0022\u003ESo it\u2019s not an affront. I don\u2019t believe that for a moment. We\u2019re a unicameral House. We\u2019re the only place legislation goes before the Governor-General gives her assent. We have a very scripted first, second, and third reading process, and we have, for administrative efficiency, structured the passage of legislation in a way that does reduce the ability for a bill to get scrutiny. This is the place to do it. Yes, it is a novel instruction; it may not in itself be unique. In fact, by agreement and by leave there have been other arrangements made where calls can be distributed to subject matter experts. That\u2019s certainly been the case. It\u2019s been a very efficient way to do it. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000048\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c83012b4-3939-4753-80fc-1956a3e2bd1e\u0022\u003EOn this bill, I would consider all of the members who have put amendments on the Table to be experts in the representation of their constituents, and it is very, very important to me that we are able to go back to our constituencies and say \u201CWe did our best for those people.\u201D, because this is a significant impost on them financially. The Government has laid out its reasons. It has tried to downplay the fact that in three short years, every single region in the country is going to be faced with the possibility of getting a fuel tax coming to a region near them, and I think it is appropriate that those members have every opportunity. If they have already made their points and they have more to make, who are we to say that is not a valid position? Well, actually, we are. This is the reason we\u2019re debating that. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000049\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c83012b4-3939-4753-80fc-1956a3e2bd1e\u0022\u003EThe Government, by a majority, may defeat this motion, but at least let\u2019s have this conversation. They thought it urgent enough to go into the House at 9 o\u2019clock this morning, setting aside every single select committee, every other piece of business that we would be doing, Ministers appearing before committees to explain the Budget that they hold in such high regard. But in higher regard is the need to tax Aucklanders and, in a few short years, the rest of New Zealand, so the Government has said this is important enough to set aside that business, and now it\u2019s for us to decide whether it\u2019s important enough to allow every member of this House to have the best opportunity to be able to represent their constituencies, and I urge all members to think very carefully before they cast their vote on this instruction motion. We will go back into committee and we will robustly scrutinise it, but we should not be rushed. This is the committee of the whole House. This is the engine room where good bills are scrutinised\u2014sometimes bad bills get scrutinised as well, and they even get through.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000050\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002298dbeffa-e059-49d5-8bbf-579cbaead9a3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022cb60deb253444632b9391eec5ab8bb04\u0022\u003EHon Scott Simpson\u003C/span\u003E: What role will the Greens play?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000051\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c83012b4-3939-4753-80fc-1956a3e2bd1e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002292ad8581dbdf4ac5b5a6eaa395912e60\u0022\u003EHon MICHAEL WOODHOUSE\u003C/span\u003E: Well, we may well hear about that, Mr Simpson. But we hold ourselves up as one of the world\u2019s great democracies, and I want to see us demonstrate it. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002275a05f96-2474-4c90-a6ea-cf7b5798e03e\u0022 data-id=\u0022e541e6f512fd48e7a83cdfa3e00f8bcd\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000052\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002275a05f96-2474-4c90-a6ea-cf7b5798e03e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022e541e6f512fd48e7a83cdfa3e00f8bcd\u0022\u003EHon RUTH DYSON (Senior Whip\u2014Labour):\u003C/span\u003E I move, That the question be now put.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022 data-id=\u0022e72b0d85dc104acb9ffba699ff19cf9d\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000053\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022e72b0d85dc104acb9ffba699ff19cf9d\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Well, we have had a very simple question before us, we\u2019ve had two eloquent speeches explaining the reasons for it, and I think the House is in a position to make a decision as to whether or not. If members feel that it\u2019s not, they can vote against it.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca id=\u002272a08122f2654c4aae49a06ea8807328\u0022 name=\u0022division\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EA party vote was called for on the question, That the question be now put.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EAyes 63\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand Labour 46; New Zealand First 9; Green Party 8.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENoes 55\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand National 55.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EMotion agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca id=\u00227b786abf0022404488dd7a0f92ad91ff\u0022 name=\u0022division\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EA party vote was called for on the question, That it be an instruction to the committee of the whole House on the Land Transport Management (Regional Fuel Tax) Amendment Bill that all members wishing to speak that have already spoken in Part 2 have the ability to have a full four calls reset to zero so each member is able to restart their speaking number.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EAyes 55\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand National 55.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENoes 63\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand Labour 46; New Zealand First 9; Green Party 8.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EMotion not agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022 data-id=\u002225aa3a015b5040e7980ac9d6377b965a\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000054\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002225aa3a015b5040e7980ac9d6377b965a\u0022\u003EMr SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Before I declare the House in committee again, I just want to make one comment to the House, and it is that there are a lot of amendments before the committee. I\u2019ve had a quick look at some of them and have received advice on them. It has become clear that a significant number of those are not in order. The general practice has been, recently, to allow debate until such time as they are ruled out of order and to curtail debate at that point in time. My encouragement to the officers of the House is to rule out out-of-order amendments quickly in order for the House not to be misled or waste time having arguments about things on which it cannot have votes. It used to be the practice for them to be ruled out more or less immediately and for debate not to be held on it.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022c83012b4-3939-4753-80fc-1956a3e2bd1e\u0022 data-id=\u0022630c26493bf445e68dd687e5f05944a3\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000055\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c83012b4-3939-4753-80fc-1956a3e2bd1e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022630c26493bf445e68dd687e5f05944a3\u0022\u003EHon MICHAEL WOODHOUSE (National):\u003C/span\u003E I raise a point of order, Mr Speaker. You have just made a very significant ruling, and I just want to clarify, if I may, whether or not this is a formal Speaker\u2019s ruling that will be tabled in the documents, because we did have a situation, with an omnibus bill last year, where there were whole new parts put in, in the committee stage, that were, arguably, not within the scope of the bill. And, at that point, the question of whether they were in scope was very clearly indicated to the committee; that, regardless of that decision, they were, in fact, debatable, and the debate was prolonged. So I am seeking your ruling that that is now a new process, because that is quite a significant change.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022 data-id=\u0022ea1def478adc435d82e07871357d83c7\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000056\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022ea1def478adc435d82e07871357d83c7\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: I\u2019m going to make it very clear. From the point that a Chair of the committee rules that a particular amendment is out of scope or otherwise not allowed\u2014and there can be a number of reasons why amendments can be ruled out\u2014from that point on, it is not debatable.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022c83012b4-3939-4753-80fc-1956a3e2bd1e\u0022 data-id=\u0022ba6db81dca144804b6237755e94435c9\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000057\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c83012b4-3939-4753-80fc-1956a3e2bd1e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022ba6db81dca144804b6237755e94435c9\u0022\u003EHon MICHAEL WOODHOUSE (National):\u003C/span\u003E I raise a point of order, Mr Speaker. Just a small clarification: that means then that, at that point, the Supplementary Order Paper (SOP) is not voted on?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022 data-id=\u00225d0b36df648b4aeeb10cd4f574827c53\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000058\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00225d0b36df648b4aeeb10cd4f574827c53\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: It never is. If an SOP is ruled out of order, it is never voted on.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000059\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u0022fc4e8ae049fc459a99d0203e99fae653\u0022\u003EIn Committee\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000060\u0022\u003EDebate resumed.\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000061\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u0022673611b7fd6f45ff988055179c7212e5\u0022\u003EPart 2  Amendments to other Acts (continued)\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00228a1cb04e-8a86-44d1-9004-6e158e220339\u0022 data-id=\u0022b05d5d13c5d44e1f82b2230b355546ac\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000062\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00228a1cb04e-8a86-44d1-9004-6e158e220339\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022b05d5d13c5d44e1f82b2230b355546ac\u0022\u003EHon TIM MACINDOE (National\u2014Hamilton West):\u003C/span\u003E I raise a point of order, Madam Chairperson. You will be aware of the ruling that the Speaker gave immediately prior to putting the House into committee. As you can see, almost every member of the Opposition is here, and I am advised that a large number of members of the Opposition have tabled amendments. We are now in a position where the vast majority of us do not know whether the amendments, or maybe many amendments, in our names will be debated, and I wonder whether, before you call, you\u2019re able to indicate to some of us whether our amendments have been deemed to be out of scope and are unable to be debated, because knowing whether or not we\u2019re preparing to speak on our own tabled amendments or perhaps in support of those of our colleagues is going to make a significant difference to the way in which we approach this debate.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022977cccaf-581d-4f48-924e-32bf6c54a93d\u0022 data-id=\u00220491e2d96dcb418cb7cf73dea49a766a\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000063\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022977cccaf-581d-4f48-924e-32bf6c54a93d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00220491e2d96dcb418cb7cf73dea49a766a\u0022\u003EThe CHAIRPERSON (Hon Anne Tolley)\u003C/span\u003E: I thank the member for that. I understand the dilemma. What I suggest we do, while we organise this, is that someone take the call, and then I will make sure that we are able to inform those whose amendments are out of order.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00220c51564f-6c6e-45cc-adab-f15b6c831fce\u0022 data-id=\u0022c00324a137554277b8c9b4bf848b4651\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000064\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220c51564f-6c6e-45cc-adab-f15b6c831fce\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022c00324a137554277b8c9b4bf848b4651\u0022\u003ELAWRENCE YULE (National\u2014Tukituki):\u003C/span\u003E I\u2019m happy to take a call in relation to a tabled amendment I lodged yesterday on Part 2. As I said to the honourable Minister Phil Twyford last evening, it\u2019s all very well in theory to think this is going to work, but, actually, there are some realities that I want to point out to the Minister and this committee.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000065\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220c51564f-6c6e-45cc-adab-f15b6c831fce\u0022\u003EUnder the regional fuel tax legislation the key responsibility at a local level is the regional council, but, under the provision of who\u2019s funding the work, it won\u2019t be the regional council; it\u2019ll be the territorial authorities in places other than unitary areas. So in places like mine, if we were ever to have a regional fuel tax in Hawke\u2019s Bay, the costs of the projects will actually be jointly funded between the local authority, the New Zealand Transport Agency (NZTA), or even the regional fuel tax itself.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000066\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220c51564f-6c6e-45cc-adab-f15b6c831fce\u0022\u003ENow, I want to point out to this committee that, actually, regional councils have a very different role than delivering transport solutions other than in public transport. Regional councils largely look after air and water and the management of those, and in many cases they also have a significant provision about passenger transport, and they also host and generally organise the regional transport committees and the regional priorities. But they do not fund the work. They have a facilitation role, and they manage the public transport committees. So while there is a trade off in terms of what the regional council might do in this space, the biggest trade-offs, actually, are, in money terms, from the territorial authorities\u2014how they spend their money on this project versus that project. And if they know that a regional fuel tax is going to partially fund, there is a big temptation amongst local authorities to shift money into that where they can actually get regional fuel tax money as well.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000067\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220c51564f-6c6e-45cc-adab-f15b6c831fce\u0022\u003EWhat I\u2019m seeking to do is put a new clause, under a tabled amendment in my name, which would say that after clause 10(5) there is a clause 10(6), and that would require that the regional council of a regional fuel tax region in its long-term plan must report on the following things: the revenue from a regional fuel tax, how this revenue was applied, and progress with respect to that programme supported by the regional fuel tax.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000068\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220c51564f-6c6e-45cc-adab-f15b6c831fce\u0022\u003EAnd, just to make it very clear to this committee, the long-term plan is the biggest consultative document that a local authority will do in a three-year period. In fact, outside of that three-year period it can, if it wishes, not do any other form of consultation. So once every three years\u2014once every three years\u2014it must, by the Local Government Act 2002 section 82, consult with its community. And what we\u2019re saying in this tabled amendment, and what I\u2019m asking the Minister to think about, is actually making it very transparent in that document that while the regional council is the facilitator of the process, the territorial authorities are the funders, and they\u2019re going to use their resources\u2014even in a coordinated way, and often with NZTA\u2014to look at projects together. I say that because, simply, without doing that, most members of the public, apart from the first period in the 10-year period, will not have any visibility about what the regional fuel tax is doing and what projects it\u2019s going to fund.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000069\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220c51564f-6c6e-45cc-adab-f15b6c831fce\u0022\u003ESo I say to the Minister, I think this is a simple solution to try and force the regional council, using the public consultative process in the long-term plans, to make a difference that will matter. Regional councils\u2014in my experience in the last six years, anyway\u2014have got way better at consulting with the community. So they consult with the community about land and water measures and about public transport, and I think it would be a great measure for this amendment to be added into the mix so that they can formally consult and report on as part of the long-term plan.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002285ec30d4-6394-433a-a12e-2c4def705dd0\u0022 data-id=\u0022373bd1e9f01c4333a34edcd82010e698\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000070\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002285ec30d4-6394-433a-a12e-2c4def705dd0\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022373bd1e9f01c4333a34edcd82010e698\u0022\u003EHon JUDITH COLLINS (National\u2014Papakura):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Madam Chair. This is the first call that I\u2019m taking in this debate. Coming to Part 2 of the Land Transport Management (Regional Fuel Tax) Amendment Bill, I want to focus very much on clause 7(3), where it says in here, in new section 5(6BB) that there will be a new part of the Act where \u201C(a) any amount of regional fuel tax \u2026 that is paid is treated as being consideration for a supply of services in the course or furtherance of a taxable activity carried on by the New Zealand Transport Agency, as agent for and on behalf of the local authority responsible for the [regional fuel tax]\u201D.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000071\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002285ec30d4-6394-433a-a12e-2c4def705dd0\u0022\u003EWhat that means, in plain English, is that the regional fuel tax that New Zealanders are going to be required to pay is itself now going to be treated as a service\u2014goods and service\u2014under the GST Act. This means that GST, at 15 percent, is now going to be added to the amount of regional fuel tax.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000072\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002285ec30d4-6394-433a-a12e-2c4def705dd0\u0022\u003EThat is a tax on a tax, and that is actually something that I know members in this House, particularly the New Zealand First Party, have railed against time and time again\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000073\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002298dbeffa-e059-49d5-8bbf-579cbaead9a3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002252aa3107872b4130a9522962f55499c7\u0022\u003EHon Scott Simpson\u003C/span\u003E: Relentlessly.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000074\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002285ec30d4-6394-433a-a12e-2c4def705dd0\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022e6b89256a2c54abab9b6d01c20600df9\u0022\u003EHon JUDITH COLLINS\u003C/span\u003E: \u2014relentlessly, for years, against a tax on a tax.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000075\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022d4d2e89a809d442da3ef5b27bc393b89\u0022\u003EHon Chris Hipkins\u003C/span\u003E: As did your colleagues last night, repeatedly.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000076\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002285ec30d4-6394-433a-a12e-2c4def705dd0\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002247e536cfa20f4337a027321fed15a0d4\u0022\u003EHon JUDITH COLLINS\u003C/span\u003E: We have seen referenda from all over the country, repeatedly, as Mr Chris Hipkins has said\u2014although I think he may wish to be a little quiet today, given his mea culpa, and I think\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000077\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002298dbeffa-e059-49d5-8bbf-579cbaead9a3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022c155f503ac524bb7b437daa05f0bff7d\u0022\u003EHon Scott Simpson\u003C/span\u003E: He\u2019s been humiliated. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000078\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002285ec30d4-6394-433a-a12e-2c4def705dd0\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a1319c8e85f44249966dfa4903d934d3\u0022\u003EHon JUDITH COLLINS\u003C/span\u003E: He\u2019s actually been humiliated, and having been humiliated by himself makes it even worse. So New Zealand First has railed for years\u2014and who here on this side of the Chamber has heard them do it; haven\u2019t we all heard them; they have\u2014against a tax on a tax. When I look at this, I think, \u201CMy goodness, things have changed.\u201D Where is the New Zealand First Party on this issue? Where is the Rt Hon Winston Peters, now Acting Prime Minister, who could stop this\u2014who could stop this\u2014because he is actually now running Cabinet and the Government. He could stop this tax on a tax. Where is he on this issue?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000079\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002298dbeffa-e059-49d5-8bbf-579cbaead9a3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002230009b0bccd540a380f74b31529c83e3\u0022\u003EHon Scott Simpson\u003C/span\u003E: Silent.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000080\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002285ec30d4-6394-433a-a12e-2c4def705dd0\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022192690a04f0f412c8dfda00409f8230b\u0022\u003EHon JUDITH COLLINS\u003C/span\u003E: He is silent. He\u2019s a lion in Opposition and he is a lamb in Government, as is the New Zealand First Party. Why are they all looking down? Is it because they cannot face the truth? \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000081\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e11a5f05-1940-41b2-8f1e-911dba7a43a5\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002203f4ca7636bd4975940ba6101b18d31e\u0022\u003EFletcher Tabuteau\u003C/span\u003E: You\u2019re boring me.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000082\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002285ec30d4-6394-433a-a12e-2c4def705dd0\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00225611010698d94cc4a2a785134a0a30e6\u0022\u003EHon JUDITH COLLINS\u003C/span\u003E: Is it because they cannot face the truth? And Fletcher Tabuteau, who is an unknown to most of New Zealand\u2014let me help him with his profile. He, an unknown\u2014a virtual unknown and novice, and, apparently, the right-hand person to the Rt Hon Winston Peters\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000083\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002257e41e9d-285b-4fb3-847d-a63820ae7137\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022322182fa1d3942b0baacd69b3b2f7eda\u0022\u003EChris Bishop\u003C/span\u003E: That\u2019s right\u2014the next leader.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000084\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002285ec30d4-6394-433a-a12e-2c4def705dd0\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022cb6e47406219483693968b8bb41e87cd\u0022\u003EHon JUDITH COLLINS\u003C/span\u003E: The next leader\u2014the next leader. He says it\u2019s all too boring. He said that today. Now, a tax on a tax, Mr Tabuteau\u2014I\u2019ve got a feeling this is going to come back to haunt you. So this is a tax on a tax, where we have a Government that doesn\u2019t want to debate the issues and has had to put the House into urgency on a bill that they knew they had for a long time, rushing this through without representation.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000085\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002285ec30d4-6394-433a-a12e-2c4def705dd0\u0022\u003EA hallmark of any liberal democracy is that we have representation on taxation and we have taxation by consent of the people. Who is consenting to regional fuel tax? I can tell the committee: New Zealand First is consenting to regional fuel tax, the New Zealand Labour Party is consenting to regional fuel tax, and the Green Party are consenting to regional fuel tax. The people are not consenting to regional fuel tax, and that\u2019s why the National Party is here today, because we will not agree with something like this, where 70 percent of the people have said that they do not agree. They want us to defend their right not to pay this tax on a tax.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022977cccaf-581d-4f48-924e-32bf6c54a93d\u0022 data-id=\u00224906b8439c2140dc9b9fdc9dff338ee2\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000086\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022977cccaf-581d-4f48-924e-32bf6c54a93d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00224906b8439c2140dc9b9fdc9dff338ee2\u0022\u003ECHAIRPERSON (Hon Anne Tolley)\u003C/span\u003E: OK, if I just take a moment and I will notify the committee of the amendments I am ruling out of order. Before I do that, I just remind speakers that they\u2019re starting to get quite repetitive, and that means that that could bring the debate to a close.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000087\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022977cccaf-581d-4f48-924e-32bf6c54a93d\u0022\u003ESo I am ruling out of order Lawrence Yule\u2019s amendment inserting new clause 10 as outside the scope of the bill. Denise Lee\u2019s amendment inserting new clause 12, amending the Charities Act, is outside the scope of the bill. Denise Lee\u2019s amendment inserting new clause 12, amending the Education Act 1989, is out of order because the subject of the rebate to which it relates has been dealt with already under Part 1. Chris Penk\u2019s amendment inserting new clause 12, amending the Local Government Act 2002 is outside the scope of this bill. Hamish Walker\u2019s amendment inserting new clause 12, amending road-user charges, is outside the scope of the bill. Jami-Lee Ross\u2019s amendment inserting new clause 12 is out of order as benefit and other similar payments are outside the scope of the bill. Kanwaljit Singh Bakshi\u2019s amendment amending the Veterans\u2019 Support Act is also outside the scope of the bill. Dr Parmjeet Parmar\u2019s amendment inserting new clause 12, amending the Road User Charges Act, is outside the scope of the bill. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022f96cdca1-b63c-4602-b2b3-276f58ebb518\u0022 data-id=\u002222f630b260874c079fb1231dab639976\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000088\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f96cdca1-b63c-4602-b2b3-276f58ebb518\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002222f630b260874c079fb1231dab639976\u0022\u003ECHRIS PENK (National\u2014Helensville):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Madam Chair. It\u2019s a pleasure to rise and speak to a tabled amendment that has not been ruled out yet, in relation, specifically, to the Land Transport Management (Regional Fuel Tax) Amendment Bill. My amendment relates to Part 2, of course, in this part of the debate, and it, specifically, would seek to insert a new paragraph in new section 34B(1) in clause 10(5). The wording of the text I\u2019ll speak to and then, obviously, I\u2019ll outline the reasons that I am proposing such an amendment to the committee: \u201C(d) Reporting of all RFT Schemes should be received by each local board in a region and consultation undertaken with that local board prior to the consultation on the annual report.\u201D\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000089\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f96cdca1-b63c-4602-b2b3-276f58ebb518\u0022\u003EThe reasons that I have proposed this amendment, first, relate to the fact that reporting will be required by the insertion of this amendment. Reporting is inherent to the nature of a regional fuel tax (RFT) scheme because it is an accountability mechanism to the extent that the bill even requires accountability in the first place. The people of a region who will be subject to a regional fuel tax must have the ability to know that the projects that have been used to justify the imposition of such a tax are being undertaken. The reporting element is a fundamental feature, therefore, and that is the reason that I am suggesting it by way of this amendment, specifically in relation to local boards. That is the matter now that I wish to turn to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000090\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f96cdca1-b63c-4602-b2b3-276f58ebb518\u0022\u003ELocal boards, it seems to me, are the most appropriate level of local government for such reporting to be made. The reason is that a regional fuel tax is, by very definition, applicable to an entire region, and a region can be a large geographical area, whereas a local board area is, of course, as one would expect, a much smaller area and therefore more responsive to the needs of the local people. Again, to increase the transparency and the accountability of the projects aligning with the taxation that has justified it, it is appropriate that local board members should be accountable to their people who have voted them in, in that very direct fashion.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000091\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f96cdca1-b63c-4602-b2b3-276f58ebb518\u0022\u003EThe next point that I wish to make in relation to my amendment is the fact that it would be in an annual report that such consultation and reporting would be made. An annual report is, of course, sufficiently regular\u2014once a year, as the name implies\u2014that progress of projects would be monitored carefully and on a continuous and, indeed, continual basis up until the point at which those projects are completed. If, in accordance with the mechanism set out in the regional fuel tax, a project is used to justify the introduction of a fuel tax, it makes sense that the progress of that project be reported back regularly\u2014not less than once a year, I would suggest\u2014by way of annual report.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000092\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f96cdca1-b63c-4602-b2b3-276f58ebb518\u0022\u003EMy final point in relation to this amendment, in the time that remains to me, is the fact that such reporting would be mandatory. This is the reason that I have chosen the words \u201Cshould be\u201D, as in \u201CReporting of all RFT Schemes should be received by [a] local board\u201D. Arguably, I could have been stronger in my language, perhaps, and used something like \u201Cmust\u201D, \u201Cshall\u201D, \u201Cin every case be required to\u201D, and so on. However, I think it is clear enough to say that the reporting \u201Cshould be\u201D received, and the point of that, of course, at the risk of stating the obvious, is that it is to be required that such reporting take place. If we leave it at the option of the local board or, indeed, any other level of local government to make such reporting or not, then the people of the region who are subject to a regional fuel tax can have no assurance and no guarantee that such reporting would be made.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000093\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f96cdca1-b63c-4602-b2b3-276f58ebb518\u0022\u003EAs a related note, as I understand it, such a mechanism would, in turn, require that the Office of the Auditor-General be able to have oversight of such reporting, and the accountability mechanism, therefore, would be\u2014[Time expired]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002255d0b7a4-a2c9-4c38-9b77-475311a48a89\u0022 data-id=\u00227859a1aeb13a4171bb29bd6d257a5942\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000094\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002255d0b7a4-a2c9-4c38-9b77-475311a48a89\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00227859a1aeb13a4171bb29bd6d257a5942\u0022\u003ESIMEON BROWN (National\u2014Pakuranga):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you very much, Madam Chair. It\u2019s a pleasure to take another call\u2014well, actually, my first call in Part 2 of the Land Transport Management (Regional Fuel Tax) Amendment Bill. I thought I would also speak in favour of the amendment in the name of Chris Penk, which he\u2019s just been speaking to. I thought I could bring to the committee some experience, having sat on a local board, and support the good work that he is doing by bringing this amendment to the committee.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000095\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002255d0b7a4-a2c9-4c38-9b77-475311a48a89\u0022\u003EI just want to commend Chris Penk as the new member of Parliament for Helensville for doing such a good deed, because the people\u2014and he represents a number of local boards in Auckland and all of those local boards wish to be seen as co-governors in the Auckland Council. I think what would be fair to say from my experience being on a local board in Auckland is that too often local boards are seen as second-class governors, and they need to be more empowered. This proposed new section 34B(1)(d) inserted by clause 10(5) would give more power and would give more influence to local boards across Auckland.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000096\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002255d0b7a4-a2c9-4c38-9b77-475311a48a89\u0022\u003EThere are a number of reasons why I\u2019d like to speak in support of this. I think, firstly, the reporting is an important part\u2014going to local boards\u2014because local boards represent the people, they represent constituents, and they need to know that the tax being paid by the people that they\u2019re representing is having an impact in the local area. And I think what we see with the regional fuel tax which is being proposed by Auckland Council is, yes, they\u2019ve tried to spread the benefits out across Auckland, but local boards need to know that each year progress is being made and what that progress will be, so that they can be part of that conversation, not just be recipients of information after the fact or just see what\u2019s being talked about at the governing body table.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000097\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002255d0b7a4-a2c9-4c38-9b77-475311a48a89\u0022\u003ELocal boards are players. They have decision-making power. They have budgets which they can also put towards transport projects\u2014and I understand in the long-term plan that budget has been doubled for local boards in Auckland. So they are actually significant players when it comes to local transport in their areas. So they need to be part of this process each and every year along the way.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000098\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002255d0b7a4-a2c9-4c38-9b77-475311a48a89\u0022\u003EI think the other very significant word which has been included in this new section which has been proposed by my colleague Chris Penk is the work \u201Cprior\u201D. It says, \u201CReporting of all RFT Schemes should be received by each local board in a region and consultation undertaken with that local board prior to the consultation on the annual report.\u201D Now, I think that word \u201Cprior\u201D is a critically important word in the context of Auckland Council, because, from my experience, local boards get told things after the fact. They get told them later, and what they need to be is engaged in the process earlier.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000099\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002255d0b7a4-a2c9-4c38-9b77-475311a48a89\u0022\u003EI am speaking very strongly in favour of this because local boards need to be seen as co-governors in Auckland Council. The Local Government Act sees them as playing a very important part in representing their local community and developing their local community, and this is another way in which we can improve this legislation if it was to pass\u2014and, you know, on this side of the Chamber, we don\u2019t support this legislation, but I think this is a very sound amendment.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000100\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002255d0b7a4-a2c9-4c38-9b77-475311a48a89\u0022\u003EI\u2019d like the Minister, actually, to take it very seriously, as someone who is a member representing a seat in Auckland and who has local board members which he would meet with regularly and who would understand some of the issues and challenges that they face. I think they would have a very strong view on this, and I would like to hear the Minister outline his views on this clause and\u2014I hope he would support it, and it would be great if he did, but, if not\u2014why he doesn\u2019t support it. I think local boards and local board members, of which I think there are 170 of them in Auckland, would deserve the right to have the Minister explain to them exactly why they should be left till after the report comes out\u2014why they should find out after the annual report comes out and not be engaged in the process of actually making that annual report and what impact it will have on their local communities.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000101\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002255d0b7a4-a2c9-4c38-9b77-475311a48a89\u0022\u003ESo I think this is a really important amendment. I commend again the member for putting it forward. I think there\u2019s a range of amendments being put forward which make small but significant and sensible changes to this legislation to help improve it and which are actually, I think, well thought through. So, once again, thank you very much to the member Chris Penk for putting this forward, and I very much look forward to the Minister answering my questions and explaining his thoughts on this issue. Thank you. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022859e13f9-33bb-41bb-b2f0-d848eaf25407\u0022 data-id=\u0022cdb494780f7347eda4b6e64c268469b9\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000102\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022859e13f9-33bb-41bb-b2f0-d848eaf25407\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022cdb494780f7347eda4b6e64c268469b9\u0022\u003EANDREW BAYLY (National\u2014Hunua):\u003C/span\u003E I want to talk about an amendment to clause 10 which is an amendment from my good colleague from Kaik\u014Dura, Mr Stuart Smith, who represents that excellent electorate down there, which I understand is just slightly larger than the State of Israel. So, of course, very relevant because Kaik\u014Dura\u2019s got a lot of roading projects down there, and, of course, this is what we\u2019re talking about: fuel tax.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000103\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022859e13f9-33bb-41bb-b2f0-d848eaf25407\u0022\u003EWhat the proposal actually is about is that after clause 10(5), we want to amend new section 34B of the Local Government Act, which is about the issue of cost-benefit analysis. It states in new section 34B(1)(d), \u201Cthe cost benefit analysis that the Council has undertaken in relation to where the revenue [is] spent.\u201D\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000104\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022859e13f9-33bb-41bb-b2f0-d848eaf25407\u0022\u003EThe reason why I want to focus on that is that we all know that if we\u2019re spending great dollops of money on roading and infrastructure projects, so-called being driven from this fuel tax that\u2019s being raised\u2014by the Auckland Council initially, but, of course, we know it\u2019s going to ripple around New Zealand\u2014where is that money going to be spent and how is it going to be spent? The big question\u2014even if we go to Auckland, where this fuel tax is going to be put in place on 1 July, in only a matter of a few days, we know that their options are: do we spend it on public transport, do we spend it on roads, do we spend it on rail, do we spend it on cycleways, do we spend it on safety improvements, or do we spend it on ferries? And I note, in the recent press announcement just yesterday, that there is virtually nothing allocated to ferries in Auckland\u2014a shame in my personal view.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000105\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022859e13f9-33bb-41bb-b2f0-d848eaf25407\u0022\u003EAnd I think the allocated efficiency of how you spend money is really, really important, and that is really what benefit-cost analysis is about. And we know that it is about allocated efficiency, and we know about the Pareto factor\u2014don\u2019t we?\u2014which is a very important part of a cost-benefit analysis. And I just don\u2019t think there is enough thought about those sorts of issues.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000106\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022859e13f9-33bb-41bb-b2f0-d848eaf25407\u0022\u003ESo one of the things is I think, you know, there\u2019s always a choice about where you spend your money and where we spend all this money that\u2019s so-called going to be raised by this fuel tax in Auckland. So one of the things is: how do you align that money that\u2019s been ripped from the heart of people\u2019s wallets into appropriate projects?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000107\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022859e13f9-33bb-41bb-b2f0-d848eaf25407\u0022\u003EAnd I think one of the important things\u2014I think if you don\u2019t have a disciplined approach around benefit-cost analysis of that money, what you do is you end up with very sloppy expenditure. I can quote you, for example, in my electorate alone the Redoubt Road - Mill Road proposal. The Government love to say that they\u2019re doing the Mill Road extension, which is an entire motorway from Manukau down round Papakura and re-joining between Drury and Ramarama; unfortunately, that is not the case. All they\u2019re doing is the first bit, Redoubt Road, which, of course, was what Auckland Council wanted to do all along.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000108\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022859e13f9-33bb-41bb-b2f0-d848eaf25407\u0022\u003EAnd so what they\u2019re doing is they\u2019re spending not the $1 billion that the National Party agreed to do before the election but only $500 million. And they\u2019re going to do Redoubt Road, and then they\u2019re going to upgrade a couple of intersections. And what I don\u2019t think the cost-benefit analysis does enough is actually look at all the benefits.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000109\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022859e13f9-33bb-41bb-b2f0-d848eaf25407\u0022\u003ESo normally you do a cost-benefit analysis on the entire project, but, if you\u2019re only doing part of the project, that means that you do not actually get all of the benefits. And I think, in many cases, some of the expenditure being proposed in the ATAP\u2014Auckland Transport Alignment Project\u2014does not have a proper analysis around all the benefits as if the projects were completed in full.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000110\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022859e13f9-33bb-41bb-b2f0-d848eaf25407\u0022\u003EAnd that, of course, brings me to the Living Standards Framework that Treasury has been proposing\u2014and, in fact, we\u2019ve been debating it over the last couple of days. What are the benefits? Should it only be a financial benefit? Should it only be an economic benefit? Or should we be applying the Living Standards Framework that the Secretary to the Treasury has been proposing\u2014you know, social capital, human capital, and environmental capital? I think all of those, but I think the most crucial point is that when this money is being used, it should be put through a proper cost-benefit analysis and should be subject to a disciplined approach.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022cbc37df2-57ae-4536-94ed-a2e39eecd585\u0022 data-id=\u0022920c7df8752f465fb43a1b39ba0ff7e6\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000111\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cbc37df2-57ae-4536-94ed-a2e39eecd585\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022920c7df8752f465fb43a1b39ba0ff7e6\u0022\u003EHon PHIL TWYFORD (Minister of Transport):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Madam Chair. It\u2019s deeply moving to hear a member of this committee, like Andrew Bayly, obviously moved to a great degree by the cost-benefit analysis. I\u2019m very pleased to see this new adherence and commitment to sturdy cost-benefit analysis from a party who, during the last Government, committed about $13 billion worth of motorway expenditure without a cost-benefit analysis being done at all.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000112\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cbc37df2-57ae-4536-94ed-a2e39eecd585\u0022\u003EI want to reassure Andrew Bayly that the transport projects that will be funded by this regional fuel tax will all\u2014any significant expenditure will be dealt with with a cost-benefit analysis, because that\u2019s the way the New Zealand Transport Agency does its work. So there\u2019s no need to require mandatory cost-benefit reporting as part of this regional fuel tax bill, because virtually every significant item is subject to the cost-benefit analysis.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000113\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cbc37df2-57ae-4536-94ed-a2e39eecd585\u0022\u003EI also want to respond to the member Chris Penk, who has proposed by way of an amendment that there be mandatory reporting to local boards, but this is a kind of\u2014if I can suggest\u2014random, nit-picking imposition of added consultation. Just for argument\u2019s sake, imagine the fourth term of the Ardern-Peters Government, a long time in the future. Some other regional council around New Zealand may be considered for a regional fuel tax, and that regional council may not have local boards, because most regional councils do not have local boards in their areas. Some have community boards. There\u2019s nothing about community boards in this amendment. Many regional councils don\u2019t have local boards or community boards. They have neither. If the member knew much about the extensive consultation requirements that are already placed on councils and their community boards and local boards, he would know that this kind of random imposition of more bureaucracy is simply not needed.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00228a1cb04e-8a86-44d1-9004-6e158e220339\u0022 data-id=\u0022a7f9313a1d3941f7b65c6c87c002f73d\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000114\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00228a1cb04e-8a86-44d1-9004-6e158e220339\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022a7f9313a1d3941f7b65c6c87c002f73d\u0022\u003EHon TIM MACINDOE (National\u2014Hamilton West):\u003C/span\u003E May I say, I have no idea why the Minister in the chair, Phil Twyford, took that call, because I hoped that he was about to answer some very legitimate questions that colleagues on this side of the House have been asking about Part 2 and, instead, all we got was an arrogant and, frankly, insulting put down of my colleague Andrew Bayly, followed by an unbelievably condescending remark to one of the newer but very intelligent members on this side of the House Chris Penk. He has not answered anything.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000115\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00228a1cb04e-8a86-44d1-9004-6e158e220339\u0022\u003EMadam Chair Tolley, could I nevertheless thank you for the considered ruling that you gave us, which is appreciated on this side of the Chamber because, without it, we would have been struggling to marshal our forces for the next hour or so. So I do appreciate that.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000116\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00228a1cb04e-8a86-44d1-9004-6e158e220339\u0022\u003EBut let\u2019s be under no mistake. As we consider Part 2, we are in uncharted territory here, and, therefore, I think it is incumbent on the Government, and particularly the Minister in the chair, to give considered and dignified responses to the very legitimate amendments that are being put forward. Because it\u2019s palpably obvious to anybody listening that we on this side of the House do not like this bill and firmly reject Part 2, but we are, through our amendments, attempting to help to improve it, and it is up to him, surely, to take those points on board and to respond to them.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000117\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00228a1cb04e-8a86-44d1-9004-6e158e220339\u0022\u003ENow, when I was last speaking on this part, I was beginning to quote from Mr Ken Shirley who is, of course, the Chief Executive of the Road Transport Forum. And I was making the point that under Part 2 of this bill, his concerns about the implications on local government need to be taken very seriously indeed. He\u2019d made the point that it came as no surprise to learn that 14 councils around the country are seeking a regional fuel tax.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000118\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00228a1cb04e-8a86-44d1-9004-6e158e220339\u0022\u003EAnd when I was interrupted I was going to go on and quote from him the following: \u201CWith a number of councils obviously seeking this option it is likely to result in unintended consequences such as forcing transport operators and fuel retailers out of certain regions to avoid the tax. That is, of course, if price spreading doesn\u2019t just make a mockery out of the whole concept anyway.\u201D And so I am asking the Minister in the chair to respond to the concerns of Mr Shirley, who is, after all, a former Labour MP, presumably reasonably sympathetic toward some of the goals of the current Government, and to say whether he believes Mr Shirley is wrong and, if he believes he\u2019s wrong: why is he wrong and what is it about this bill that can satisfy him? Mr Shirley is an expert in this area, and we are entitled to an answer.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000119\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00228a1cb04e-8a86-44d1-9004-6e158e220339\u0022\u003EI\u2019m also deeply unimpressed that the Minister in the chair has still not given an answer\u2014at least while I\u2019ve been in the Chamber, and I\u2019ve been here for much of this debate\u2014to the legitimate query that I have raised as to whether there is a drafting error. It\u2019s on page 27 of the bill under Part 2, clause 7, in new section 5(6BB)(a) to the Goods and Services Tax Act. I\u2019ve read it out a couple of times before, and it refers to the \u201Cfurtherance of a taxable activity carried on by the New Zealand Transport Agency,\u201D. And my query is whether that wording is wrong.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000120\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00228a1cb04e-8a86-44d1-9004-6e158e220339\u0022\u003EThe Minister has not yet answered that. To refuse to do that I would suggest is both arrogant and treating this House, while we\u2019re in committee, with contempt, and I\u2019m asking him to stand up and take a call and tell us.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000121\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00228a1cb04e-8a86-44d1-9004-6e158e220339\u0022\u003EI now want to turn to the amendments to the Local Government Act 2002, which are outlined in clause 10 of Part 2, and that\u2019s on page 28 of the bill. I\u2019ve already referred to the first part of clause 10, where it is proposed to insert a new section 34B, but under paragraph (b) of subsection (1) there\u2014I haven\u2019t got on to this one yet\u2014\u201Chow that revenue was applied by the council, including to which projects and for what purposes (for example, capital expenditures, debt repayment, operational expenditures);\u201D.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000122\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00228a1cb04e-8a86-44d1-9004-6e158e220339\u0022\u003EAnd my question to the Minister is: why is this clause so wide, and how can its provisions possibly be justified? I haven\u2019t heard a single explanation yet of why this very wide clause has been included. I\u2019m asking the Minister to stand up to answer all of the questions that have been put to him by members on this side of the House; to respond in an intelligent and honest fashion to the way in which the amendments that we\u2019ve put forward have been argued; if he disputes them, to explain that clearly; to answer the questions that I have put forward in this particular part; and to understand that Part 2 of this bill\u2014while it was originally thought that Part 1 was the meaty bit\u2014actually contains a considerable amount of material that needs the considered attention of this committee. I can see that I\u2019m running out of time.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022071f7800-2755-41b6-83df-07ebaf867ae2\u0022 data-id=\u00224fa8669b5ba6420d83d5496068c329f4\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000123\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022071f7800-2755-41b6-83df-07ebaf867ae2\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00224fa8669b5ba6420d83d5496068c329f4\u0022\u003ETIM VAN DE MOLEN (National\u2014Waikato):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Madam Chair. It\u2019s a pleasure to rise and take another call on Part 2 of the Land Transport Management (Regional Fuel Tax) Amendment Bill, and to address the second of my proposed amendments, which, fortunately, was not ruled out and has not yet been debated in this part. What I am proposing here is to amend clause 7(3) and insert a new subclause 6BB(c) to \u201CAmendments to Goods and Services Tax Act 1985\u201D.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000124\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022071f7800-2755-41b6-83df-07ebaf867ae2\u0022\u003ENow, as we\u2019ve already heard from the Hon Judith Collins, what we\u2019re proposing here, actually, has been to put GST on top of a fuel tax\u2014therefore a tax on a tax\u2014and we have heard vigorous opposition to that from numerous Government members in the past. It\u2019s actually been interesting to note, since joining this House, how quickly the Government parties have been prepared to go back and change their stance on a number of areas they previously advocated for so passionately, so strongly, and how they now change their minds in that regard.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000125\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022071f7800-2755-41b6-83df-07ebaf867ae2\u0022\u003EWith regards to this amendment, what we\u2019re actually seeing here is a proposal to amend the Goods and Services Tax Act, and we\u2019ve already heard that the regional fuel tax is now considered to be a supply of services and, therefore, taxable, and therefore a tax on a tax. Now, I\u2019m surprised at the arrogance of this Government\u2014that they have not made any efforts whatsoever to address this or any number of other top quality amendments that we\u2019ve seen presented from the Opposition benches throughout the debate on this part. I\u2019ve been here for the duration of the debate on Part 2, across, now, several days, and it amazes me that we are yet to see a single member from the Government benches rise and take a call on this part. It is simply outrageous and a clear sign of arrogance that they have no interest whatsoever in debating the content of this part and in trying to get a better solution for all Aucklanders, in this case, and subsequently for all New Zealanders once this is expanded to many other areas.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000126\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00228a1cb04e-8a86-44d1-9004-6e158e220339\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002254f2f9e8c49a4eb09c41d044ffb72dfc\u0022\u003EHon Tim Macindoe\u003C/span\u003E: But they want to pass it under urgency.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000127\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022071f7800-2755-41b6-83df-07ebaf867ae2\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022d190003af42b49f9838d278745f69732\u0022\u003ETIM VAN DE MOLEN\u003C/span\u003E: Indeed, as Mr Macindoe points out, they are looking to pass this under urgency. Suddenly, they\u2019ve been caught out and have realised that they are perhaps not able to meet their time line of 1 July, given that they have obviously poorly managed this process to date and are now trying to proceed through it quickly without any discussion on this. Also, we\u2019ve heard from the Minister in the chair, the Hon Phil Twyford\u2014he\u2019s taken a call and that\u2019s good\u2014but, actually, we\u2019d like to see him addressing in more detail the many points that have been raised now, not just today but in previous discussions last night too across the range of amendments that were proposed.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000128\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022071f7800-2755-41b6-83df-07ebaf867ae2\u0022\u003ESo this amendment in particular\u2014\u201CAmend clause 7(3) insert new 6BB(c) to the Goods and Services Tax Act 1985\u201D\u2014reads, \u201CAll Goods and Services Tax (GST) levied by the RFT [the regional fuel tax] must be allocated for expenditure in the Region within which it was raised.\u201D So look, this is something that I feel the Government could well support. They\u2019ve made numerous comments along these lines with other areas of GST that has been claimed or earned as revenue. For me, this is one area that I feel would be well supported, of course, by the applicant for any particular regional fuel tax, because they\u2019re advocating for their specific projects and, therefore, would be desiring to have as much cash as possible to fund those particular projects.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000129\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022071f7800-2755-41b6-83df-07ebaf867ae2\u0022\u003EWe\u2019ve seen now a massive array of councils around the country looking to put forward proposals in this instance. I\u2019d also just like to quickly refer to my previous amendment, which would require anyone making such a submission to provide more detailed advance notice around their intentions on the particular projects they\u2019re looking to support to give clarity to their ratepayer. What we\u2019re seeing here, even in my electorate, in the Waikato, we\u2019ve heard both the Waikato District Council and the Waikato Regional Council are now looking to advocate for their own opportunity to have a regional fuel tax to fund projects, quite probably projects that were outlined by the previous Government under the roads of national significance, which I would strongly encourage this Government to continue to support.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022977cccaf-581d-4f48-924e-32bf6c54a93d\u0022 data-id=\u002259469e44e8c1494082596fba7ceac329\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000130\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022977cccaf-581d-4f48-924e-32bf6c54a93d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002259469e44e8c1494082596fba7ceac329\u0022\u003ECHAIRPERSON (Hon Anne Tolley)\u003C/span\u003E: I call Chris Penk. I\u2019m sorry; I call Simeon Brown.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002255d0b7a4-a2c9-4c38-9b77-475311a48a89\u0022 data-id=\u00220c1b48e810cf4b4c8fc7afb8cafb6bb0\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000131\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002255d0b7a4-a2c9-4c38-9b77-475311a48a89\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00220c1b48e810cf4b4c8fc7afb8cafb6bb0\u0022\u003ESIMEON BROWN (National\u2014Pakuranga):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you very much, Madam Chair. I know I look quite similar, and I\u2019m very fresh and new, just like Chris Penk.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000132\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002285ec30d4-6394-433a-a12e-2c4def705dd0\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a5674c8627fe4de48eb3bdb0eec8971c\u0022\u003EHon Judith Collins\u003C/span\u003E: And very talented and hard-working.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000133\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002255d0b7a4-a2c9-4c38-9b77-475311a48a89\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00222b002521a0a04967af76dfea7cae75fc\u0022\u003ESIMEON BROWN\u003C/span\u003E: And equally hard-working, like the good member Christopher Penk, who\u2019s working hard in Helensville, whereas I\u2019m the good member for Pakuranga and I\u2019m pleased to be able to stand here and represent the interests of the motorists in my electorate who will be punished by this tax\u2014realising there should be no taxation without representation, and that\u2019s a message I will continue to advocate for during my time in the House. I have just tabled a new amendment which seeks to address a point raised by the Hon Phil Twyford when he disagreed with the amendment in the name of Chris Penk which says that there would be reporting of all regional fuel tax schemes, to be received by each local board in the region, in consultation undertaken with that local board prior to the consultation on the annual report.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000134\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002255d0b7a4-a2c9-4c38-9b77-475311a48a89\u0022\u003ENow, the Minister took a call, and I was very pleased that he took a call, because I think this is a very worthy amendment and makes a lot of sense. It empowers local boards and has all of the reasons that I gave beforehand. But he made a very good point. He said that there are community boards as well, and other territorial local authorities, and, of course, local boards are really only in Auckland, which, of course, is a unitary authority under the Local Government Act, and local boards were given to ensure that local communities had a strong voice in Auckland and in its decision-making power. So of course community boards should also be added, but the point in this, which I think got missed by Mr Twyford, was that, of course, this tax is only meant to be for Auckland. So when Mr Penk put together this amendment, a very good amendment, he was thinking, \u201CThis is a Government which will keep its promises. This is a Government which is only going to be putting a regional fuel tax in for Auckland, because that\u2019s what they campaigned for\u2014so therefore you\u2019d only need reporting for Auckland and therefore the legislation should only need to cover local boards.\u201D\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000135\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002255d0b7a4-a2c9-4c38-9b77-475311a48a89\u0022\u003EBut, of course, we know that this doesn\u2019t just allow regional fuel taxes for Auckland; this allows regional fuel taxes across New Zealand after 2021. And what do we call that? A broken promise. But it also means that this legislation needs to reflect what the Government\u2019s true intent is. So I would like to take a moment to again explain why this is important\u2014and it is important, and not just for local boards. If these regional fuel taxes are going to be put across all of New Zealand\u2014and we know there\u2019s about a dozen councils which have put their hands up and said, \u201CPlease tax us.\u201D or \u201CPlease tax our motorists and our residents and ratepayers, who already pay a huge amount of money.\u201D\u2014\u201CPlease tax us.\u201D Well, there are community boards there, which also deserve to be part of the local government decision-making process. They deserve to have their voice heard. They deserve to have that consultation prior to the annual report, and, again, that word \u201Cprior\u201D was included in my amendment, because it\u2019s important that our local boards and our community boards are not continued to be trampled over by this Government and by the senior leadership in that council and then just left there to deal with the pieces at the end of the day.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000136\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002255d0b7a4-a2c9-4c38-9b77-475311a48a89\u0022\u003ESo the amendment says that it should be done prior. They should be part of the process before the annual report is produced, so they know that the money which has been taken off the people who vote for them, the people that they represent, is going into projects in their area and so they know what the progress of those proposals is, how it\u2019s going, whether the construction is on time, whether it\u2019s being delivered as it was said it was going to be delivered by the plan, whether there\u2019s been a delay, why the delay is happening, and what the reason for it might be, so they can feed into that annual report.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000137\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002255d0b7a4-a2c9-4c38-9b77-475311a48a89\u0022\u003EBecause we all know that projects take time, and often we see projects being delayed for a variety of reasons. Most of them, I would say, there are reasons why they happen, but local boards and community boards need to be part of that conversation. So I hope now that I\u2019ve clarified the Minister\u2019s concerns over that amendment in the name of Christopher Penk, and I hope that he will support my amendment in the name of Simeon Brown and that he will vote for it and support it so that all communities can have their say and be included. Thank you very much, Madam Chair.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022cbc37df2-57ae-4536-94ed-a2e39eecd585\u0022 data-id=\u00225c53673f864b4529bb3925cb79010b13\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000138\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cbc37df2-57ae-4536-94ed-a2e39eecd585\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00225c53673f864b4529bb3925cb79010b13\u0022\u003EHon PHIL TWYFORD (Minister of Transport):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Madam Chair. I want to respond to a query that\u2019s been raised a couple of times by the member Tim Macindoe about the use of the words \u201Ccarried on\u201D in the bill. There\u2019s some cause, I think, for the member to have concern about the words \u201Ccarried on\u201D and I quote the Cambridge online dictionary, which refers to a number of meanings for \u201Ccarried on\u201D. It can mean \u201Cto behave in an uncontrolled, excited, or anxious way\u201D. It can refer to \u201Can old-fashioned informal reference to have a sexual relationship\u201D. It can also mean \u201Cbehaviour that shows you are annoyed, worried, not satisfied, or excited\u201D\u2014usually more than the situation deserves.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000139\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cbc37df2-57ae-4536-94ed-a2e39eecd585\u0022\u003EBut I have sought advice from the Parliamentary Counsel Office about the drafting that led to the use of these words in the bill, and I\u2019m informed they\u2019ve checked and the phrase \u201Ctaxable activity carried on\u201D is used 29 times in existing legislation. The phrase \u201Ctaxable activity carried out\u201D, which I think was the alternative that the member referenced, is not used at all. There\u2019s no record of it being used in existing legislation. So these words are, in fact, standard IRD drafting, and I hope that answers the member\u2019s query.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002275a05f96-2474-4c90-a6ea-cf7b5798e03e\u0022 data-id=\u002206b9bee981c747e68279bce623356e9b\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000140\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002275a05f96-2474-4c90-a6ea-cf7b5798e03e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002206b9bee981c747e68279bce623356e9b\u0022\u003EHon RUTH DYSON (Senior Whip\u2014Labour):\u003C/span\u003E I move, That the question be now put.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca id=\u0022bf19c2bd005e45f6b4cb4783251cb4ae\u0022 name=\u0022division\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EA party vote was called for on the question, That the question be now put.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EAyes 63\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand Labour 46; New Zealand First 9; Green Party 8.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENoes 55\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand National 55.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EMotion agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022977cccaf-581d-4f48-924e-32bf6c54a93d\u0022 data-id=\u0022cb3c4e6de8644ce9b72084831aac9206\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000141\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022977cccaf-581d-4f48-924e-32bf6c54a93d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022cb3c4e6de8644ce9b72084831aac9206\u0022\u003ECHAIRPERSON (Hon Anne Tolley)\u003C/span\u003E: Bear with us for one minute. We just want to make sure we get all the amendments correct so that every amendment has the opportunity to be put and voted on.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000142\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022977cccaf-581d-4f48-924e-32bf6c54a93d\u0022\u003EThe question was put that the following amendment in the name of Tim van de Molen to clause 7(3) be agreed to:\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000143\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022977cccaf-581d-4f48-924e-32bf6c54a93d\u0022\u003Ein new section 5(6BB), insert after paragraph (b) the following paragraph:\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000144\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022977cccaf-581d-4f48-924e-32bf6c54a93d\u0022\u003E(c)\tAll Goods and Services Tax (GST) levied by the RFT must be allocated for expenditure in the Region within which it was raised.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca id=\u0022c7642e8a20334c9f9e1bb3eccadcdfb0\u0022 name=\u0022division\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EA party vote was called for on the question, That the amendment be agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EAyes 55\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand National 55.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENoes 63\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand Labour 46; New Zealand First 9; Green Party 8.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EAmendment not agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000145\u0022\u003EThe question was put that the following amendment in the name of Jami-Lee Ross to clause 8 be agreed to: \u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000146\u0022\u003Edelete clause 8.\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca id=\u002245b7872818bd40908d821681eba21241\u0022 name=\u0022division\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EA party vote was called for on the question, That the amendment be agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EAyes 55\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand National 55.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENoes 63\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand Labour 46; New Zealand First 9; Green Party 8.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EAmendment not agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000147\u0022\u003EThe question was put that the following amendment in the name of Jami-Lee Ross to clause 9 be agreed to: \u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000148\u0022\u003Edelete clause 9.\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca id=\u0022c2ef0dd4389e4ef4b7f62e3f3389f8d1\u0022 name=\u0022division\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EA party vote was called for on the question, That the amendment be agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EAyes 55\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand National 55.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENoes 63\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand Labour 46; New Zealand First 9; Green Party 8.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EAmendment not agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000149\u0022\u003EThe question was put that the following amendment in the name of Jami-Lee Ross to clause 10 be agreed to: \u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000150\u0022\u003Edelete clause 10.\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca id=\u00225bb6ee70974b4062915c24176a9d52e3\u0022 name=\u0022division\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EA party vote was called for on the question, That the amendment be agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EAyes 55\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand National 55.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENoes 63\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand Labour 46; New Zealand First 9; Green Party 8.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EAmendment not agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000151\u0022\u003EThe question was put that the following amendment in the name of Jami-Lee Ross to clause 11 be agreed to: \u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000152\u0022\u003Edelete clause 11.\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca id=\u0022c03bbb5fffbf47fba8bb462ffc82e3e2\u0022 name=\u0022division\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EA party vote was called for on the question, That the amendment be agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EAyes 55\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand National 55.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENoes 63\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand Labour 46; New Zealand First 9; Green Party 8.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EAmendment not agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000153\u0022\u003EThe question was put that the following amendment in the name of Nuk Korako to clause 10 be agreed to: \u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000154\u0022\u003Einsert, after subclause (5), the following subclause:\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000155\u0022\u003E(6)\tAfter section 81(2), insert:\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000156\u0022\u003E(3)\tConsultation with Iwi Prior to any Regional Fuel Tax Proposal\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000157\u0022\u003EBefore a territorial authority seeks to submit a proposal on a regional fuel tax scheme under Subpart 3 of the Land Transport Management Act 2003, the Council must open consultation with the local Iwi(s) of the region.\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca id=\u00227ff50bd660f94c2599235551c245285c\u0022 name=\u0022division\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EA party vote was called for on the question, That the amendment be agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EAyes 55\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand National 55.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENoes 63\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand Labour 46; New Zealand First 9; Green Party 8.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EAmendment not agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000158\u0022\u003EThe question was put that the following amendment in the name of Chris Penk to clause 10 be agreed to: \u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000159\u0022\u003Ein new section 34B(1), insert after paragraph (c) the following paragraph:\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000160\u0022\u003E(d)\tReporting of all RFT Schemes should be received by each local board in a region and consultation undertaken with that local board prior to the consultation on the annual report.\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca id=\u002280b60668be0b4aec99dc6126b7c13be3\u0022 name=\u0022division\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EA party vote was called for on the question, That the amendment be agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EAyes 55\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand National 55.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENoes 63\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand Labour 46; New Zealand First 9; Green Party 8.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EAmendment not agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000161\u0022\u003EThe question was put that the following amendment in the name of Simeon Brown to clause 10 be agreed to: \u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000162\u0022\u003Ein new section 34B(1), insert after paragraph (c) the following paragraph:\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000163\u0022\u003E(d)\tReporting of all RFT Schemes should be received by each local board or community board in a region and consultation undertaken with that local board or community board prior to the consultation on the annual report.\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca id=\u0022c536bc7fb8f94821bdec24fca493e786\u0022 name=\u0022division\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EA party vote was called for on the question, That the amendment be agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EAyes 55\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand National 55.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENoes 63\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand Labour 46; New Zealand First 9; Green Party 8.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EAmendment not agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000164\u0022\u003EThe question was put that the following amendment in the name of Jami-Lee Ross to clause 10 be agreed to: \u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000165\u0022\u003Ein new section 34B(1), insert after paragraph (c) the following paragraph:\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000166\u0022\u003E(d)\tHow the RFT scheme has impacted on the cost of living.\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca id=\u00226bb62a1cee924751bd244ee79bc7ba89\u0022 name=\u0022division\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EA party vote was called for on the question, That the amendment be agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EAyes 55\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand National 55.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENoes 63\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand Labour 46; New Zealand First 9; Green Party 8.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EAmendment not agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000167\u0022\u003EThe question was put that the following amendment in the name of Stuart Smith to clause 10 be agreed to: \u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000168\u0022\u003Ein new section 34B(1), insert after paragraph (c) the following paragraph:\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000169\u0022\u003E(d)\tthe cost benefit analysis that the Council has undertaken in relation to where the revenue was spent.\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca id=\u0022a6f61995d728419089f937b2c791011a\u0022 name=\u0022division\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EA party vote was called for on the question, That the amendment be agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EAyes 55\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand National 55.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENoes 63\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand Labour 46; New Zealand First 9; Green Party 8.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EAmendment not agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000170\u0022\u003EThe question was put that the following amendment in the name of Tim van de Molen to clause 10 be agreed to: \u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000171\u0022\u003Ein new section 34B, insert after subsection (2) the following subsection:\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000172\u0022\u003E(3)\tIn conjunction with councils application for a Regional Fuel Tax councils must produce a report for ratepayers on their forecasted spending priorities in relation to the revenue obtained from the RFT and make this publically available.\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca id=\u002274f9c1c7ec984a6588ff035466d83b16\u0022 name=\u0022division\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EA party vote was called for on the question, That the amendment be agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EAyes 55\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand National 55.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENoes 63\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand Labour 46; New Zealand First 9; Green Party 8.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EAmendment not agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000173\u0022\u003EThe question was put that the following amendment in the name of Lawrence Yule to clause 10 be agreed to: \u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000174\u0022\u003Ein new section 34B, insert after subsection (2) the following subsection:\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000175\u0022\u003E(3)\tRegional Councils are required to write to all electors annually after their annual report to inform them on the progress of the RFT scheme in their region.\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca id=\u00221ff5ffa1ebc840ff99b6eb18bb2872cd\u0022 name=\u0022division\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EA party vote was called for on the question, That the amendment be agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EAyes 55\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand National 55.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENoes 63\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand Labour 46; New Zealand First 9; Green Party 8.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EAmendment not agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000176\u0022\u003EThe question was put that the following amendment in the name of Lawrence Yule to clause 10 be agreed to: \u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000177\u0022\u003Einsert, after subclause (5), the following subclause:\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000178\u0022\u003E(6)\tIn Schedule 10, after clause 17A insert:\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000179\u0022\u003E17B\tAdditional information: RFT schemes\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000180\u0022\u003E(1)\tThe regional council of an RFT region, in its long-term plan, must report on\u2014\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000181\u0022\u003E(a)\tThe revenue from an RFT scheme paid to the council by the Agency; and\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000182\u0022\u003E(b)\tHow that revenue was applied by the council, including to which projects and for what purposes (for example, capital expenditures, debt repayment, operational expenditures);\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000183\u0022\u003E(c)\tProgress with respect to the programme of capital projects supported by the RFT scheme.\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000184\u0022\u003E(2)\tIn this clause,\u2014\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000185\u0022\u003E(a)\tregional council, RFT region, and RFT scheme have the same meanings as in section 65A of the Land Transport Management Act 2003; and\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000186\u0022\u003E(b)\tAgency has the same meaning as in section 5(1) of that Act.\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca id=\u0022289ff5baaffa4446aa5d0113cbf91d64\u0022 name=\u0022division\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EA party vote was called for on the question, That the amendment be agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EAyes 55\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand National 55.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENoes 63\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand Labour 46; New Zealand First 9; Green Party 8.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EAmendment not agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000187\u0022\u003EThe question was put that the following amendment in the name of Ian McKelvie to clause 10 be agreed to: \u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000188\u0022\u003Einsert, after subclause (5), the following subclause:\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000189\u0022\u003E(6)\tAdd new subsection 101B(7):\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000190\u0022\u003E(7)\tAny proposal for a regional fuel tax scheme under the provisions of subpart 3 of the Land Transport Management Act must incorporate, to the best ability possible, the contents of the infrastructure strategy.\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca id=\u0022f74519adf44d4f2dbc5bee9b9523aaa0\u0022 name=\u0022division\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EA party vote was called for on the question, That the amendment be agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EAyes 55\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand National 55.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENoes 63\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand Labour 46; New Zealand First 9; Green Party 8.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EAmendment not agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000191\u0022\u003EThe question was put that the following amendment in the name of Matt King to clause 11(2) be agreed to: \u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000192\u0022\u003Einsert, after \u201CLand Transport Management Act 2003\u201D, \u201Conly if there shows a repeated and deliberate pattern of avoidance over 12 months\u201D.\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca id=\u00224bcbca301f6f49a693aa80577e208a4a\u0022 name=\u0022division\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EA party vote was called for on the question, That the amendment be agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EAyes 55\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand National 55.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENoes 63\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand Labour 46; New Zealand First 9; Green Party 8.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EAmendment not agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022977cccaf-581d-4f48-924e-32bf6c54a93d\u0022 data-id=\u002291ffedacbf9648c7ba2d648549312f96\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000193\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022977cccaf-581d-4f48-924e-32bf6c54a93d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002291ffedacbf9648c7ba2d648549312f96\u0022\u003EDEPUTY SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: The Hon Scott Simpson\u2019s amendment inserting new clause 12, amending the Local Electoral Act 2001, is out of order as the requirements for local authority referendums are outside the scope of the bill. Jami-Lee Ross\u2019 amendment inserting new clause 12, amending the Social Security Act 1964, is out of order as benefit and other similar payments are outside the scope of this bill.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000194\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022977cccaf-581d-4f48-924e-32bf6c54a93d\u0022\u003EThe question was put that the following amendment in the name of Brett Hudson to Part 2 be agreed to: \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000195\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022977cccaf-581d-4f48-924e-32bf6c54a93d\u0022\u003Einsert, after clause 11, the following subclause:\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000196\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022977cccaf-581d-4f48-924e-32bf6c54a93d\u0022\u003E12\tAmendment to the Public Audit Act 2001\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000197\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022977cccaf-581d-4f48-924e-32bf6c54a93d\u0022\u003E(1)\tThis section amends the Public Audit Act 2001.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000198\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022977cccaf-581d-4f48-924e-32bf6c54a93d\u0022\u003E(2)\tAfter section 16 insert new section 16A:\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000199\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022977cccaf-581d-4f48-924e-32bf6c54a93d\u0022\u003E16A\tRegional Fuel Tax Scheme Audit\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000200\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022977cccaf-581d-4f48-924e-32bf6c54a93d\u0022\u003E(1)\tThe Auditor-General must, at least one year after the establishment of any regional fuel tax scheme under Subpart 3 of the Land Transport Management Act 2003, examine\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000201\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022977cccaf-581d-4f48-924e-32bf6c54a93d\u0022\u003E(a)\tthe extent to which any public entity is complying with Subpart 3 and to what extent the relevant public entities are activing effectively and efficiently under the provision of that subpart\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000202\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022977cccaf-581d-4f48-924e-32bf6c54a93d\u0022\u003E(b)\ta public entity\u2019s compliance with its statutory obligations under subpart 3 of the Land Transport Management Act 2003:\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000203\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022977cccaf-581d-4f48-924e-32bf6c54a93d\u0022\u003E(c)\tany act or omission of a public entity, in order to determine whether waste has resulted or may have resulted or may result in relation to functions under subpart 3 of the Land Transport Management Act 2003:\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000204\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022977cccaf-581d-4f48-924e-32bf6c54a93d\u0022\u003E(d)\tany act or omission showing or appearing to show a lack of probity or financial prudence by a public entity or 1 or more of its members, office holders, and employees under subpart 3 of the Land Transport Management Act 2003.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000205\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022977cccaf-581d-4f48-924e-32bf6c54a93d\u0022\u003E(2)\tAn audit under this section may relate to 1 or more public entities.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca id=\u0022b72771d44b5f42789b4cd8bf10351877\u0022 name=\u0022division\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EA party vote was called for on the question, That the amendment be agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EAyes 55\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand National 55.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENoes 63\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand Labour 46; New Zealand First 9; Green Party 8.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EAmendment not agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca id=\u0022d0b663e1e1bc4367a0822227843d6d93\u0022 name=\u0022division\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EA party vote was called for on the question, That Part 2 be agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EAyes 63\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand Labour 46; New Zealand First 9; Green Party 8.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENoes 56\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand National 55; ACT New Zealand 1.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EPart 2 agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000206\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u0022813b4f16d4f8484f841a265b01c537e6\u0022\u003ENew Part 3  Commerce Commission Fuel Market Study\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022977cccaf-581d-4f48-924e-32bf6c54a93d\u0022 data-id=\u0022f55e258af7324ac38946970d9af2e313\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000207\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022977cccaf-581d-4f48-924e-32bf6c54a93d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022f55e258af7324ac38946970d9af2e313\u0022\u003ECHAIRPERSON (Hon Anne Tolley)\u003C/span\u003E: I remind the committee that this is quite a narrow debate on a Commerce Commission fuel market study.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002203fd985b-4fb8-4111-ba38-5033a254d962\u0022 data-id=\u00228ad0d42cce20464fbb47b2ed90c24f92\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000208\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002203fd985b-4fb8-4111-ba38-5033a254d962\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00228ad0d42cce20464fbb47b2ed90c24f92\u0022\u003EBRETT HUDSON (National):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Madam Chair. It\u2019s a pleasure to, in fact, move this new part to the bill\u2014\u201CPart 3 \u2014 Commerce Commission Fuel Market Study\u201D\u2014a part that seeks not only to help the Government to provide a better level of oversight into the impacts of the regional fuel tax (RFT), if it goes ahead, but, more importantly, actually, to give New Zealand consumers and, indeed, New Zealand businesses greater confidence and certainty around the impacts of the regional fuel tax, not only in the regions\u2014and there could be up to 14 of those, as news reports have indicated\u2014where the regional fuel tax is in effect but, actually, on some of the behaviours and impacts outside of that immediate region. If we look at what will happen with the application of the fuel taxes, it will create some natural incentives, incentives that do not indicate any sort of wrong or nefarious behaviour but, simply, are people and businesses responding to a natural incentive when additional costs are placed\u2014particularly in the area they live or conduct the centre of their operations.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000209\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002203fd985b-4fb8-4111-ba38-5033a254d962\u0022\u003EFor instance, for consumers, there is a natural incentive, if one lives or travels close enough to the border of the regional fuel tax area, to go a bit a further to go outside of that area and to therefore take advantage of fuel pricing which does not have the regional fuel tax applied to it, which, to a consumer who can\u2019t claim GST, is 11.5c a litre. It is a significant amount of money for that consumer or consumers to seek to not have applied to them.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000210\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002203fd985b-4fb8-4111-ba38-5033a254d962\u0022\u003EIf we take Auckland as an example of this, because it is important to understand, I think, the context of normal behaviours today, outside of the regional fuel tax additional application. I met with a fuel company ahead of this going into the committee stage. Their information was that inside of the Auckland boundary, today\u2014prior to this new tax\u2014there are already variances across that region of up to 20c a litre. They know that people travel some distance to take advantage of them. So when those consumers are faced with a higher impost if they shop and buy their fuel within their region, their behaviour already exhibits that they will go to some lengths to get the cheapest possible price.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000211\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002203fd985b-4fb8-4111-ba38-5033a254d962\u0022\u003EThere is a natural incentive for Aucklanders\u2014and other regional fuel tax area residents\u2014to travel outside of their region to get cheaper fuel, but there\u2019s also the incentives on fuel companies in a competitive market. Because, as I say, there\u2019s already a spread in Auckland, for instance, of up to 20c a litre, no fuel company is going to want to be disadvantaged by having a local competitor discount their fuel\u2014fuel that includes the tax\u2014and then take market share off another local fuel company. So they have an incentive to still keep a competitive market, despite the fact that the cost of product in that market has risen by 10c a litre plus GST. So we will still see market movements inside an RFT area, and also not only within that area\u2014particularly for independent operators and retailers\u2014but outside of the area. Just outside of the border, there is a natural incentive for a small, independent retailer\u2014obviously, because they don\u2019t have to apply the tax\u2014to discount their fuel even more, because they can then take advantage of consumers\u2019 willingness to travel to keep their costs down. The ability to sell fuel that doesn\u2019t include a regional fuel tax and, therefore, take volume off all of those other fuel companies that operate within the regional fuel tax area, and therefore should have that levy attached to their retail price\u2014there are natural incentives.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000212\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002203fd985b-4fb8-4111-ba38-5033a254d962\u0022\u003EAlthough the bill contains provisions that talk about monitoring and keeping a track on volumes and everyone reporting data back, what it doesn\u2019t do is seek an in-depth look, taking into consideration those natural incentives and existing behaviours, all of which are legal and, indeed, part of a functioning, competitive market. The bill as it stands does not have the provision for those deep studies to truly understand if there are behaviours that are so abhorrent to the provisions and intention of the bill that they should be captured.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000213\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002203fd985b-4fb8-4111-ba38-5033a254d962\u0022\u003EFirstly, it allows them, through competition studies, to ascertain the facts\u2014the facts not only of the RFT area itself but of the implications of those actions and behaviours on areas, not only just outside the border of the RFT area but, indeed, how that fits into the broader New Zealand market. So such a study can, in much more detail and with a greater context, actually provide legitimate and real information to make an independent and more accurate assessment on what sorts of behaviours are happening within and without the RFT area, and to determine whether or not action can be taken under the existing provisions, or indeed if the Government of the day might then choose further legislative measures to address behaviours that perhaps are either unintended consequences or just unforeseen.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000214\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002203fd985b-4fb8-4111-ba38-5033a254d962\u0022\u003EOne of the assumptions that have come up, both in the rhetoric ahead of this stage and certainly in contributions across parts in this stage, is a concern that fuel companies will seek to not apply the tax impost in the RFT area because of competitive concerns, because they don\u2019t want to lose market share. There\u2019s actually another possibility, which I don\u2019t think the Government has considered. It is just possible\u2014and I\u2019m certainly not passing any sort of legal judgment\u2014I think it could be argued that if a fuel company sought to not apply the tax in an RFT area, they could be in breach of the offences clause in the bill in either avoiding paying RFT or evading paying RFT. But it\u2019s not actually a deliberate act by a fuel company that is the only means for the effect, in terms of price, of the RFT to not be borne within the RFT area, but instead to be borne by consumers and businesses from outside the area. It is simply those competitive forces.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000215\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002203fd985b-4fb8-4111-ba38-5033a254d962\u0022\u003EWe\u2019ll use Auckland as an example not only because it\u2019s the first cab off the rank but because it is such a large market. Because it\u2019s already a competitive market, you could look at it and go, \u201CFrom 1 July, every fuel company and retailer is charging 10c a litre extra plus GST\u201411.5c a litre extra\u2014because the law demands that.\u201D, but all it takes is an operator, and particularly, I was told by the fuel company I spent some time with, it is more likely to be an independent retailer at the margin, not a large fuel company. All it takes is for either a fuel company or one of those retailers to make a significant discount to the price of the fuel in their outlet\u2014done nothing about the tax; they\u2019re still paying the tax. They are complying with the law: they are paying the 11.5c to the New Zealand Transport Agency under the provisions of the bill, but they simply choose to price it to consumers at a different rate. Should they do that, other companies and retailers in the area are almost certainly going to have to move to meet the market, because it is a competitive market, and to not move it will see those other companies lose share. That is simply not a good thing for their business models.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000216\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002203fd985b-4fb8-4111-ba38-5033a254d962\u0022\u003ESo we then end up in a situation where the margins are constrained, and possibly even negative, inside of area such as Auckland. They\u2019re meeting their obligations on fuel tax with respect to the Government. The cost of their product has gone up and, as businesses, they have to make returns to their shareholders. So what will they do? They will apply a different price in different parts of New Zealand\u2014parts of New Zealand that don\u2019t have a regional tax applied to them. It is a completely legal and reasonable business model. It won\u2019t meet the provisions of avoidance or evasion, in my view, under the bill, yet what will happen, in effect, is what has been talked about as price spreading.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000217\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002203fd985b-4fb8-4111-ba38-5033a254d962\u0022\u003EAt this point, you don\u2019t necessarily have to focus on whether it is a deliberate attempt to shift the price or just the factor of a competitive market in action. The effect for consumers and businesses outside of the regional fuel tax area or areas is that they will bear an impost of the effect of the tax for an area that should be bearing it but won\u2019t be bearing all of it. A competition study gives the Commerce Commission the authority and scope and power to be able to look into that, and to determine and to advise the Government so that the Government can know with some certainty whether there are unforeseen circumstances arising from the bill in action and then look to actions the Government might take to address that.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002285ec30d4-6394-433a-a12e-2c4def705dd0\u0022 data-id=\u0022d2eb5c5d1a66475d822d1e9fec809633\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000218\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002285ec30d4-6394-433a-a12e-2c4def705dd0\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022d2eb5c5d1a66475d822d1e9fec809633\u0022\u003EHon JUDITH COLLINS (National\u2014Papakura):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Madam Chair. This is an excellent new part that has been in the name of Brett Hudson. Speaking as the former Minister of Energy and Resources and, in fact, the Minister who, with the support of my colleagues, started the fuel price study of petrol and diesel prices last year, and that came back from a Ministry of Business, Innovation and Employment study, along with support from economists and other experts in the area. It came back with a finding that because some of the fuel companies, in fact, from memory, Mobil\u2014actually, not from memory; I know it very well\u2014and also the Gull people did not provide all the information they were supposed to and promised to do so, but BP did and Z Energy did.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000219\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002285ec30d4-6394-433a-a12e-2c4def705dd0\u0022\u003EWhat that was very clear about was that there was a great deal of concern that people\u2014ordinary New Zealanders, who go and buy their petrol and their diesel\u2014were right to be concerned. We were right to be concerned, and I acknowledge the Minister, the Hon Stuart Nash, who was the then Opposition spokesperson for the area, who first raised the issue with me and was supportive of the work that we did.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000220\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002285ec30d4-6394-433a-a12e-2c4def705dd0\u0022\u003ESince then, we\u2019ve got a new Minister in the situation of energy and resources, and that\u2019s the Hon Dr Megan Woods. Megan Woods has humped and talked about it and carried on, but she\u2019s actually done nothing to bring about the changes that we in Government approved through Cabinet in about August last year, just before the three-month period came in for an election.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000221\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002285ec30d4-6394-433a-a12e-2c4def705dd0\u0022\u003ESo this is a very genuine attempt by Brett Hudson to help out that Minister to actually get this issue dealt with\u2014in a way that her amendments to the Commerce Act, clearly, are not moving anywhere\u2014and this is a very sensible way to deal with it. The Minister who is in the chair, Phil Twyford, has previously stated that this is an issue that needs to be dealt with, so he actually had the chance to deal with it and he didn\u2019t. His inability to deal with that has been picked up and assisted by Brett Hudson to try and get him out of this hole that the Government has got itself into.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000222\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002285ec30d4-6394-433a-a12e-2c4def705dd0\u0022\u003ESo it\u2019s now been, what, eight months of this particular Government. They talked a lot about the different energy prices around the country, the fuel prices. We know fully well that there is this thing called the Gull effect in the prices of petrol and diesel. We\u2019ve heard of some very, very strange behaviours from some in the market. I recall that BP had some interesting comments about how they were putting up the prices in \u014Ctaki so that it was less obvious that places like Levin\u2014where apparently there is a Gull station there\u2014were being discounted because of the competition from Gull.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000223\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002285ec30d4-6394-433a-a12e-2c4def705dd0\u0022\u003EThis is actually a very serious issue, and when we know that this regional fuel tax, which was only going to be for Auckland and which now is going to be able to be done for the whole of the country\u2014that this is actually a way of dealing with a situation where New Zealanders who pay for their own petrol and diesel are right to say that there\u2019s something very strange going on when they can go to one big-named petrol station in one town and in the next town it\u2019s an entirely different price, and that price is very much based on whether or not there seems to be either a Gull station there or a Waitomo Group station or one of the other smaller independents.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000224\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002285ec30d4-6394-433a-a12e-2c4def705dd0\u0022\u003ESo this is this Minister\u2019s opportunity to get off his high horse, to listen to the Opposition, and to get up and speak in favour of this amendment, and this side of the House might actually increase its view of him. All we\u2019ve heard so far from him has been sanctimony and, actually, put-downs of people who have generally tried to help his bill, so that\u2019s his condescension writ large.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022163d0b68-eb0e-4094-9bed-99e184f063e1\u0022 data-id=\u0022e781eec179404f7d86af17f06f7a23fe\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000225\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022163d0b68-eb0e-4094-9bed-99e184f063e1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022e781eec179404f7d86af17f06f7a23fe\u0022\u003EJAMI-LEE ROSS (National\u2014Botany):\u003C/span\u003E Madam Deputy Chair, thank you very much for this opportunity. I wish to speak to both of the new Part 3s. I understand that it is a legitimate way of addressing this. There\u2019s a new Part 3 in the name of my colleague Brett Hudson, which is seeking to insert a new Part 3 that is around the Commerce Commission fuel market study, which he has spoken to and the Hon Judith Collins has spoken to. Then I\u2019d like to turn to the new Part 3 that I\u2019ve proposed\u2014the amendment in my name which also seeks to insert a new Part 3 to do with reviews. I think it\u2019s timely that we do consider this, because this bill is proceeding, unfortunately, and how it is impacting on New Zealanders is what should be carefully considered.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000226\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022163d0b68-eb0e-4094-9bed-99e184f063e1\u0022\u003EThe amendment in the name of Brett Hudson should actually be a very easy amendment for the Government to decide to support. The reason why it should be easy for the Government to decide to support this is because every time I\u2019ve asked in the House questions of Phil Twyford, the Minister, around price spreading\u2014every time I have asked questions around how petrol companies are responding to all of his new taxes of up to 25 cents a litre\u2014his answer has been that they\u2019re going to have new powers for the Commerce Commission to put in place fuel market studies to enable them to better understand the situation. According to the Government, the answer is to monitor this more. They think monitoring will lead to greater scrutiny, greater sunlight, as a form of disinfectant when it comes to price spreading, and they\u2019re of the view, as a Government, that there should be powers there for the Commerce Commission to do so.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000227\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022163d0b68-eb0e-4094-9bed-99e184f063e1\u0022\u003EThe problem is the bill that the Government has put forward regarding Commerce Commission fuel market studies will take quite some time to get through the legislative process. It won\u2019t be in place on 1 July, which is very close\u2014it\u2019s not too far away. It will not be in force at the point at which the regional fuel tax for Auckland proceeds, on 1 July, and there will not actually be powers right at that point of time for the Commerce Commission to undertake studies around that.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000228\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022163d0b68-eb0e-4094-9bed-99e184f063e1\u0022\u003EI submit to the House that if we were all to unite on this issue of price spreading, and we were all to support the amendment in Brett Hudson\u2019s name, then there would be the power immediately, from 1 July, for the Commerce Commission to start doing this work. And what better time for the Commerce Commission to start doing this important work, according to the Government\u2014it is their solution to the issue. The work that the Government wants to do could commence immediately on 1 July if they were to support Brett Hudson\u2019s amendment. So I have to say that I\u2019m looking forward to what the Minster or Government members may wish to say on this amendment, because they have an opportunity, right now in the Parliament, to say to New Zealanders that they actually take the issue of price spreading seriously.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000229\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022163d0b68-eb0e-4094-9bed-99e184f063e1\u0022\u003EWhy should they take the issue of price spreading seriously? It should be self-evident, but let\u2019s just go through it a little bit. One of the biggest issues with a regional fuel tax\u2014aside from the fact that we\u2019re of the view it\u2019s unnecessary\u2014is that that there\u2019s going to be fuel market behaviour which sees not just Aucklanders paying an Auckland regional fuel tax; it will be spread across the whole country. People in the South Island will be paying for the Auckland regional fuel tax. People in the South Island, people in Wellington, people in the Bay of Plenty, people in Waikato will be paying for the Auckland regional fuel tax. So if the Government\u2019s solution is to have it monitored, here\u2019s a way to do so. Why should we care, though, that it\u2019s happening? We should care because if there\u2019s going to be a regional fuel tax in Auckland, then Aucklanders should be paying the bill. We\u2019re seeing, however, that fuel companies are already deciding to put up the price of fuel in other parts of the country. Many commentators have suggested that they\u2019re doing so in anticipation of the regional fuel tax in Auckland coming into force.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000230\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022163d0b68-eb0e-4094-9bed-99e184f063e1\u0022\u003EI\u2019m particularly interested in some of the wording that Mr Hudson has put into his amendment. The wording he\u2019s put into his amendment gives the Commerce Commission quite some latitude to prepare a report around competition. I think it\u2019s also interesting that he wants to give the Commerce Commission the ability to look at changes to the policies or practices of central or local government. That\u2019s quite interesting, because it is local government which comes up with the proposals that will be funded in the regional fuel tax scheme. It\u2019s a whole new way of local government doing things, and the benefit of having this information quite early is that we know that the intention of this Government is to allow other councils around the country to have regional fuel taxes in just a few short years. That will be quite a change to local government practices and, therefore, it\u2019s helpful for the Commerce Commission to do this work.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000231\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022163d0b68-eb0e-4094-9bed-99e184f063e1\u0022\u003EThe other point about that wording that I think is interesting is that we know that it\u2019s not just a regional fuel tax that the Government is proposing; the total combined impact of fuel tax increases under this Government is up to 25c a litre when you include GST. So it\u2019s important for the Commerce Commission to understand the changes and the issues that are in there and that are being impacted by Government policy around increases to fuel taxes.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000232\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022163d0b68-eb0e-4094-9bed-99e184f063e1\u0022\u003EI now wish to turn to the amendment that\u2019s in my name. We\u2019re also asking the committee, by way of this amendment, to support there being a review conducted by the Ministry of Transport and Treasury. This amendment, if successful, would provide a requirement for the Minister of Transport and the Minister of Finance to commission a report three years after the implementation of the regional fuel tax, to understand exactly how it is impacting New Zealanders. The very reason why I think this is important is because we learnt quite a bit through the bill, in terms of the views that individuals submitting had, about the impacts of the regional fuel tax.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000233\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022163d0b68-eb0e-4094-9bed-99e184f063e1\u0022\u003EWe also learnt\u2014and this came out at Estimates through the answers to the questions\u2014that there was very little modelling done on the impact on New Zealanders. There was almost no modelling done on price spreading. In fact, the paragraphs around price spreading\u2014now, I don\u2019t blame the officials that work for the Minister, because they\u2019ve had limited time to do a whole lot of work on this, but there\u2019s limited information out there around price spreading. There\u2019s limited information out there about how it would actually impact on those that are struggling the most in this country, from a cost of living perspective, and understanding about how they will be impacted. There was evidence provided by submitters that those living the furthest away from the CBD and those that have the least fuel-efficient vehicles are, typically, the people in this country who need assistance from the State the most. Typically, people in this country who are living in lower socio-economic circumstances will be impacted the most by this.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000234\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022163d0b68-eb0e-4094-9bed-99e184f063e1\u0022\u003ESo I think it\u2019s reasonable that Treasury and the Ministry of Transport do work on issues to do with cost of living, issues to do with congestion\u2014and let\u2019s just pause for a moment on congestion. We don\u2019t actually believe that many of the projects that the Minister has seen put forward under this will solve the congestion issues for Auckland alone, but if there\u2019s going to be an argument put forward that the regional fuel tax is the grand solution, the great panacea for Auckland\u2014to tax people more and extract more money from their pockets\u2014then let\u2019s actually have some real information around congestion and get that work done.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000235\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022163d0b68-eb0e-4094-9bed-99e184f063e1\u0022\u003EI\u2019m also interested to learn more about the public transport use and whether this regional fuel tax will actually see more public transport use come about in Auckland as a result of the regional fuel tax. There are also other elements to do with environmental impacts and to do with fuel consumption, and other issues to do with regional fuel taxes.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000236\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022163d0b68-eb0e-4094-9bed-99e184f063e1\u0022\u003EIn this legislation, we should put in place issues to be considered seriously, given that so little work was done on this regional fuel tax. Given that so little work was done to understand the impacts, to understand how much this hurts New Zealanders\u2014particularly in Auckland, where it will start; so little emphasis put on doing any work around price spreading\u2014these two amendments are timely and they should be supported by the Government. There is nothing that the Government has to fear from having, firstly, work done that they\u2019ve already proposed through another piece of legislation come into force immediately. If they\u2019re so proud of their tax hikes, if they\u2019re so proud of the work they\u2019re doing to ram through under urgency legislation to put in place new taxes on Aucklanders, then they shouldn\u2019t be afraid to front up and hear what Treasury and the Ministry of Transport would have to say about the impact of those regional fuel taxes.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000237\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022163d0b68-eb0e-4094-9bed-99e184f063e1\u0022\u003ESure, under the amendment I\u2019ve put forward, it would take three years for that report to be done. At least we would have a cycle of a local government election. There\u2019d be an opportunity to consider how it\u2019s being implemented\u2014and, of course, these are infrastructure projects. So it does take some time for infrastructure projects to be implemented, but there\u2019s nothing the Government should be afraid of when it comes to their taxes and how they\u2019re impacting on New Zealanders, because they\u2019re so gung-ho and so proud of everything they\u2019re doing to increase taxes on New Zealanders at a time when, I say, it\u2019s not actually necessary or desirable for New Zealanders.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022 data-id=\u0022d3bd59004bd24bc0b2e79183d64d0894\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000238\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022d3bd59004bd24bc0b2e79183d64d0894\u0022\u003EHon CHRIS HIPKINS (Leader of the House):\u003C/span\u003E I raise a point of order, Madam Chairperson. The members of the Opposition have now added a number of additional parts to the bill amending other Acts other than the primary Act being amended by the bill. The structure of the bill is such that amendments to other Acts were contained in Part 2. Therefore, the amendments either should have been proposed during the debate on Part 2 or, basically, should be ruled out, because the House has now debated and considered its desire to amend other Acts as a result of the changes made in Part 1 and has concluded its debate upon that. The ongoing nature of adding additional parts is alien to the structure of the bill, which is very clear. There are two parts to the bill. There is a part that has the principal amendments proposed to the Land Transport Act and a second part, which contains the consequential or other relevant amendments to other Acts, and both of those debates have now concluded.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022163d0b68-eb0e-4094-9bed-99e184f063e1\u0022 data-id=\u002230389d6d617e4b9c963868c6ecb28a34\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000239\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022163d0b68-eb0e-4094-9bed-99e184f063e1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002230389d6d617e4b9c963868c6ecb28a34\u0022\u003EJAMI-LEE ROSS (National\u2014Botany): \u003C/span\u003EThere\u2019s a couple of points that I think are worthwhile considering when you decide on how to rule on this. The first point to consider is that the Government has taken a decision to put the House into urgency. We know that when urgency is accorded to a piece of legislation, there is wider latitude for the Opposition to put forward amendments, and we\u2019re exercising that prerogative right now.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000240\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022163d0b68-eb0e-4094-9bed-99e184f063e1\u0022\u003ESecondly, though, if you were to rule, as the Minister is asking, that no amendments can come through as a new part if they amend another piece of legislation other than what is already contained in the bill, or that any other amendments that come through as a proposed new part that amend an additional piece of legislation must be contained in Part 2, then you would, in effect, be ruling that if the Government continues to structure bills as they\u2019ve done so here, where there\u2019s only ever two parts\u2014one amending a principal Act and a second part amending every other possible Act that is consequential to the proposal in the bill\u2014then you would, effectively, be ruling out in entirety the ability, ever, for the House to consider new parts. If the Government changes the way they structure bills, that would be different, but should the Government continue structuring bills like this, Madam Chair, your ruling would be very broad and would have, I believe, quite a dangerous impact in the long term for this House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000241\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022163d0b68-eb0e-4094-9bed-99e184f063e1\u0022\u003EMy third point in response is that we took some very careful advice from the Clerk in drafting these tabled amendments. The advice we received was that Part 2 was for amendments to other pieces of legislation that were related to how the regional fuel tax scheme would be implemented. These new proposed parts are not in relation to how the regional fuel tax would be implemented but, rather, are in relation to how it is subsequently reviewed or actions that could be taken\u2014in this case, by the Commerce Commission\u2014in response to the regional fuel tax already being in place. So it\u2019s about subsequent decisions and subsequent issues arising after the fuel tax is in place. The amendments in Part 2 are around assisting the regional fuel tax to be implemented. Therefore, Madam Chair, I think you should rule these new parts should continue.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022eaf79431-1033-44f1-a633-22633da52c0d\u0022 data-id=\u00221fbe64a1c77c4849a2e48d8897527092\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000242\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022eaf79431-1033-44f1-a633-22633da52c0d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00221fbe64a1c77c4849a2e48d8897527092\u0022\u003EHon DAVID BENNETT (National\u2014Hamilton East):\u003C/span\u003E I\u2019d just like to add to the comments made there that the member also had the opportunity in Part 2 to raise an issue like this if he felt that was an issue at that time. He did not do that and has passed that point now, and so we\u2019re now into Part 3, and he\u2019s had that opportunity already.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022977cccaf-581d-4f48-924e-32bf6c54a93d\u0022 data-id=\u0022bb17cd2c0c2f4e4f8daa3838d2a7e5a9\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000243\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022977cccaf-581d-4f48-924e-32bf6c54a93d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022bb17cd2c0c2f4e4f8daa3838d2a7e5a9\u0022\u003ECHAIRPERSON (Hon Anne Tolley)\u003C/span\u003E: I thank the members for their contributions. [Interruption] Could I just ask the clerks just to leave the Table for a minute, just while we\u2019re dealing with this\u2014thank you\u2014so that I can see the Chamber. I am troubled by the point, actually, that the Hon David Bennett has made. The amendments were accepted by the Clerk\u2019s Office and tabled yesterday, so the committee has had knowledge of those proposed amendments to the bill for quite some time, and it doesn\u2019t seem right to me that just halfway through the debate, we suddenly get a different piece of advice from the Clerk\u2019s Office. I am disturbed by that, because the committee is already debating Part 3.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000244\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022977cccaf-581d-4f48-924e-32bf6c54a93d\u0022\u003EI can\u2019t find anything to help me in Speakers\u2019 Rulings, but it indicates that the House has accepted that there is a debate on Part 3. So to curtail that debate and say \u201CWell, it should have been done in Part 2. We\u2019ve finished Part 2 so we move on.\u201D seems, to me, to be out of order. So I\u2019m going to rule that the two tabled amendments that we have for new Part 3 are acceptable\u2014that they are relevant\u2014and therefore, then, the further amendment to amend the new Part 3 is also in order.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022 data-id=\u002243e101e01ebc4870ba50521c3e1c955b\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000245\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002243e101e01ebc4870ba50521c3e1c955b\u0022\u003EHon CHRIS HIPKINS (Leader of the House):\u003C/span\u003E This does have significant precedent value. Therefore, I move, That the Speaker be recalled to give a ruling on the matter.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022977cccaf-581d-4f48-924e-32bf6c54a93d\u0022 data-id=\u0022a7983122a64a4ea58fa52995a066a853\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000246\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022977cccaf-581d-4f48-924e-32bf6c54a93d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022a7983122a64a4ea58fa52995a066a853\u0022\u003ECHAIRPERSON (Hon Anne Tolley)\u003C/span\u003E: I\u2019m happy to do that, but I just refer the member to Speakers\u2019 rulings 74/1-3, particularly Speaker\u2019s ruling 74/2, that says, \u201CThe Speaker may not interfere with the decision of the chairperson on a question of relevancy.\u201D\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000247\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022977cccaf-581d-4f48-924e-32bf6c54a93d\u0022\u003EMotion agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000248\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022977cccaf-581d-4f48-924e-32bf6c54a93d\u0022\u003EHouse resumed.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000249\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u0022117f9a4ce46546a9b87fa2743a6d5ad4\u0022\u003ESpeaker Recalled\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022977cccaf-581d-4f48-924e-32bf6c54a93d\u0022 data-id=\u0022fbbbf71909c64d7781f49443df3be5e8\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000250\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022977cccaf-581d-4f48-924e-32bf6c54a93d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022fbbbf71909c64d7781f49443df3be5e8\u0022\u003ECHAIRPERSON (Hon Anne Tolley)\u003C/span\u003E: Mr Speaker, the committee has voted to recall you to the Chair. We\u2019ve had five speeches on the new Part 3, and the Leader of the House has taken a point of order to have the new Part 3 tabled amendments ruled out of order. I\u2019m disturbed by that motion because those tabled amendments have been accepted by the Clerk\u2019s Office and have been on the table now since yesterday\u2014they are not new\u2014and we\u2019ve had five speeches in the debate. I have ruled that those three tabled amendments are in order and that the debate would continue.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022 data-id=\u0022b34e42a57e574939bfdcec581978d6db\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000251\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022b34e42a57e574939bfdcec581978d6db\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Just checking that, by new Part 3, you are talking about the one in the name of Jami-Lee Ross, you\u2019re talking about the\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000252\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022977cccaf-581d-4f48-924e-32bf6c54a93d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022d5b9748f28b5446fb2fe978a0f819778\u0022\u003ECHAIRPERSON (Hon Anne Tolley)\u003C/span\u003E: And Brett Hudson.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000253\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00221d4280f883c64df18a8d22464abf52d4\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Brett Hudson is the other one, and there\u2019s a third one, which is an amendment to Brett Hudson\u2019s one.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000254\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022977cccaf-581d-4f48-924e-32bf6c54a93d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022e43616686e17405da0d2e9bff737ae70\u0022\u003ECHAIRPERSON (Hon Anne Tolley)\u003C/span\u003E: Yes, that\u2019s correct.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022 data-id=\u0022cba517482d3a481d95a96ea9dc095654\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000255\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022cba517482d3a481d95a96ea9dc095654\u0022\u003EHon CHRIS HIPKINS (Leader of the House):\u003C/span\u003E There are a number of issues here; the most significant of which is the way that the bill is structured. The bill is structured so that all of the principal amendments are contained in Part 1 and all of the subsequent amendments to different Acts are contained in Part 2. The practice of the House previously\u2014I know because I tried when I was in the Opposition\u2014has been that any additional Acts to be amended should be amended in the part of the bill that deals with that. So, in the case of other amendments that we put forward in Opposition\u2014different additional parts\u2014previous Chairs of committee have ruled that they should be dealt with in the debate on the part of the bill that deals with that. In this case, the committee has already completed its debate on the principal part of the bill, Part 1, and on the subsequent amendments, which were in Part 2, and therefore it is alien to the structure of the debate to allow the committee to continue to add more and more parts.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000256\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003EWith regard to the point that the Chair of the committee made about the debate already being under way and already being ongoing, in fact, the House this very morning has already dealt with that issue. There were a number of amendments tabled yesterday and debated yesterday that have subsequently been ruled out this morning by the Chair of the committee. So it is not unprecedented, once a debate on a tabled amendment is under way, for it to be subsequently ruled out.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022163d0b68-eb0e-4094-9bed-99e184f063e1\u0022 data-id=\u00220cf250fbcb9c4df6b2afc679752916de\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000257\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022163d0b68-eb0e-4094-9bed-99e184f063e1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00220cf250fbcb9c4df6b2afc679752916de\u0022\u003EJAMI-LEE ROSS (National\u2014Botany):\u003C/span\u003E Mr Speaker, thank you. The Minister has quite accurately identified how the bill has been structured. I agree that there would be high precedent value if the decision was made that he\u2019s asking for, because the Government can choose to structure bills in that way, and if it were to continue structuring bills in that way, such a ruling from you would have the precedent that there would never be the ability for the committee to consider a new part to a bill, because if the argument is that Part 1 will always contain amendments to the principal Act to be amended and that Part 2 will contain amendments to every other Act\u2014if the argument from Mr Hipkins is that you could never have another Act amended by a new Part 3, because it should have been done in Part 2\u2014there\u2019ll never be the ability for there to be a new Part 3 in the future.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000258\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022163d0b68-eb0e-4094-9bed-99e184f063e1\u0022\u003EHaving said that, I have a second point worth considering, which is that when the committee was considering the Family Incomes Package some months ago\u2014it was a similar bill, dealing with incomes and taxation, and it was considered under urgency as well\u2014the committee did have a number of new parts to do with reviews, which were accepted and debated. Therefore, there is precedent that the committee can do that.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000259\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022163d0b68-eb0e-4094-9bed-99e184f063e1\u0022\u003EMy third point is that, on advice from the Clerk\u2019s Office, as we were structuring our tabled amendments and taking up our ability to put forward amendments, we were clearly advised that Part 2\u2019s amendments that amend other pieces of legislation\u2014Part 2 is written is such a way that those amendments to other pieces of legislation are there to assist with the implementation of a regional fuel tax scheme; the two amendments proposed by myself and Mr Hudson seek to have reviews of the situation with the regional fuel tax\u2014are not to do with implementation of the regional fuel tax; they\u2019re to do with how it is reviewed and how it is being implemented. Therefore, it is a new issue that should be considered as a new part.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022 data-id=\u0022d5386ec176b2414e86c63a5f7fa3383b\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000260\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022d5386ec176b2414e86c63a5f7fa3383b\u0022\u003EHon CHRIS HIPKINS (Leader of the House):\u003C/span\u003E I do appreciate the member\u2019s frustration, and, in fact, this issue was specifically discussed in the last review of the Standing Orders, where a proposal was put forward by the then Opposition that any amendments to different Acts should be separate parts\u2014that the ability to group changes to different Acts should not be allowed to be done in the way that it has been done, certainly for the entire time that I have been a member of this House. The Standing Orders Committee rejected that proposal, and, as a result, the ability of those in charge of bills to, basically, have one part or two parts\u2014as they choose to\u2014remains in place.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000261\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003ETherefore, what we are doing in this debate is no different to countless other bills that have passed through the House over the last decade that I\u2019ve been a part of it, and in the way the debate has been approached, where all of the amendments to other Acts have been contained in a single part, Chairs have ruled that additional amendments to other Acts should be tabled and considered as part of that debate and not as part of additional debates. The risk that we run here is that, if we continue to allow amendments to be added ad nauseam to any bill, the House will never be able to pass any bill. In fact, other legislatures around the world do have that difficulty, and that, of course, is one of the things that the House has considered from time to time in the way it structures its debates.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022eaf79431-1033-44f1-a633-22633da52c0d\u0022 data-id=\u0022bbce8fad054347fbb9b2960d64d85226\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000262\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022eaf79431-1033-44f1-a633-22633da52c0d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022bbce8fad054347fbb9b2960d64d85226\u0022\u003EHon DAVID BENNETT (National\u2014Hamilton East):\u003C/span\u003E I agree with what Jami-Lee Ross has said, and I just want to add another point, and that is that, in the debate on Part 2 of this bill, the member from the Government side did not raise any issue at that time, fully knowing that there were these amendments coming up in Part 3. A precedent within this House\u2014and I know that you\u2019re very keen to see it continue at question time\u2014is that you raise issues at the time they are relevant. If there was going to be an issue that that member felt was relevant, Part 2 would have been the time to raise it. Doing it in Part 3, later, when we\u2019re halfway through the debate, is simply not the case of raising an issue at the time when it is relevant.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022163d0b68-eb0e-4094-9bed-99e184f063e1\u0022 data-id=\u0022fb1d66ea48b94f34a6ee10cef63ef09f\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000263\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022163d0b68-eb0e-4094-9bed-99e184f063e1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022fb1d66ea48b94f34a6ee10cef63ef09f\u0022\u003EJAMI-LEE ROSS (National\u2014Botany):\u003C/span\u003E Mr Speaker, I simply wish to point out that I think the Minister, effectively, made my point, which was that if you were to rule that we cannot have these new Part 3s, then there would be precedent value, and what the Minister is, effectively, arguing is that we shouldn\u2019t have any amendments inserting new parts if they\u2019re going to introduce issues that could, in his view, have been held in Part 2. He\u2019s made my very point. The second thing I wish to say, in response to Mr Hipkins, is that simply because the Standing Orders Committee did consider something and decided not to act\u2014the fact that a committee decided not to act\u2014is not a change to our Standing Orders and is not something that should be considered in this situation.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022 data-id=\u002227215533106544799d397d084d768d5e\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000264\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002227215533106544799d397d084d768d5e\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Right. This is a complicated set of matters, and I might just deal with a couple of the latter points first. The fact that something has been looked at and considered by the Standing Orders Committee and the Standing Orders Committee has decided to stay with the status quo is, in fact, something which I will take into account, because it\u2019s an indication of the view of the House and is important. In fact, if other suggestions put to the Standing Orders Committee last year had been accepted, the Government would not be allowed to have urgency in this situation.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000265\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003EOn the question of raising matters immediately, this is not like a point of order for disorder or a question. This is a matter which is currently before the committee and at any stage while it is before the committee it can be raised, and the fact that things have been on the Table for a period of time and not been raised does not exclude members raising them. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000266\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003EIt is not new to rule out an amendment on the grounds that it should have been raised in an earlier part. It\u2019s something that my predecessor has done, or it has been done in the time of my predecessor, and one of the reasons that bills are grouped in parts\u2014and I just want to say, you know, in brackets, that I actually think our arrangements for having things in parts in the way that we debate them is unfortunate.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000267\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003EI might sound like someone living badly in the past, but I think the quality of debate when bills were debated clause by clause and people actually debated the clauses that were important to them, and debated those ones well where they had positive suggestions, and we had better cross-floor discussion, using the proper role of the committee\u2014and the role of the committee is that once the House has decided to proceed with the legislation, which is what the second reading has done, the House has accepted the principle of the legislation, and all we\u2019re debating now is the details of how to do it. Previously, there were, I think, much better-quality debates because Opposition members got the opportunity to make positive suggestions. They could say, \u201CWell, we don\u2019t like this legislation, but it would work better this way.\u201D, and it held the Ministers to account in a much better way.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000268\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003EWhile I\u2019m on my feet saying how things should work, in Speakers\u2019 Rulings there\u2019s a very good Speaker\u2019s ruling from one of the previous Assistant Speakers in the last Parliament on how Parliament should work during the committee stages. What that says is, effectively, if reasonable questions are asked, the Minister should answer them. That will not lengthen the debate; that will shorten the debate. My view is that if Ministers had done that, this debate would have finished on Tuesday, and we wouldn\u2019t be here in this situation now. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000269\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003ESo, having got that off my chest, I\u2019ll now go to the essence of the matter, to reinforce the previous rulings that have been made that it is not new to rule out an amendment on the grounds it should have been raised in an earlier part. It has happened in the last Parliament, and for that reason, I have a suggestion, and that is that Mr Hudson\u2019s new part and, presumably, the amendment to it, which should be part of Part 2\u2014my suggestion is that the House grant leave to return to Part 2 for the purpose of voting on that part, on those two amendments. If a member wants to seek leave to do that, that will give the chance to the House to express its opinion on those, but I make it very clear that it will be for the purpose of voting. On Jami-Lee Ross\u2019s amendment, it is my view that that is outside the scope of the bill. It brings matters into the bill which were not previously in the bill, and it is properly raised as an issue\u2014as an amendment. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000270\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003EBut I will say to the Government that I feel very strongly for my colleagues, because I think there probably have been three of them in the Chair during the period that these amendments have been sitting on the Table of the House. My view is that it\u2019s the role of the Minister in the chair and the Leader of the House and the Government whips to constantly review the amendments that are on the Table and to bring them to the Chair\u2019s attention as soon as possible\u2014not days afterwards\u2014in order to get their rulings and stop the House wasting its time, which has happened as a result of their tardiness. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000271\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003ESo is a member prepared to seek leave for Mr Hudson\u2019s amendment and the amendment to that to be voted on by the committee? \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022163d0b68-eb0e-4094-9bed-99e184f063e1\u0022 data-id=\u00225da66f5a3b554f4d98011a435731c9d1\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000272\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022163d0b68-eb0e-4094-9bed-99e184f063e1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00225da66f5a3b554f4d98011a435731c9d1\u0022\u003EJAMI-LEE ROSS (National\u2014Botany):\u003C/span\u003E I raise a point of order, Mr Speaker. Can I seek clarification. Firstly, are you saying that Mr Hudson\u2019s amendment is otherwise out of order if for voting purposes it does not get included in Part 2?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000273\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022ca7dc6d56da143988975f9f10bf484f2\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: That\u2019s right.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000274\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022163d0b68-eb0e-4094-9bed-99e184f063e1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002218ae40b0a852454c859df858b2be0d15\u0022\u003EJAMI-LEE ROSS\u003C/span\u003E: And are you further saying we cannot debate the essence of Mr Hudson\u2019s new Part 3?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000275\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022714efe87a7e2434d82424ff29abaee8e\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: That\u2019s right.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000276\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022163d0b68-eb0e-4094-9bed-99e184f063e1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00224b2751a89e4148bfaf8226d501ce3a67\u0022\u003EJAMI-LEE ROSS\u003C/span\u003E: Can I have a further clarification from you. In the drafting of amendments, we took extensive advice from the Clerk\u2019s Office\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022 data-id=\u002220613d7e0b5042d5a323e335347e04e4\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000277\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002220613d7e0b5042d5a323e335347e04e4\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: The member\u2014stop right now. One of the very strong principles of this House is that members take responsibility for their own amendments, and it is not the practice of good members to seek to put responsibility with other people for things which they\u2019ve signed their name to. I say as a Minister I made a lot of errors that were as the result of advice but I always took responsibility for those, and I\u2019m not having my staff blamed for members\u2019 errors.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022eaf79431-1033-44f1-a633-22633da52c0d\u0022 data-id=\u002200187a3287db492c88d1a14642436074\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000278\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022eaf79431-1033-44f1-a633-22633da52c0d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002200187a3287db492c88d1a14642436074\u0022\u003EHon DAVID BENNETT (National\u2014Hamilton East):\u003C/span\u003E I raise a point of order, Mr Speaker. I\u2019m just seeking clarification as well that you\u2019re, basically, saying that a Government member can, at a later point, revisit an earlier part of a bill and ask for it to be reconsidered.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022 data-id=\u0022034847122e3548fbbfd663e485f87910\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000279\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022034847122e3548fbbfd663e485f87910\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: No, no. The member will resume his seat. I am saying that any member now, if they want to have a vote on Mr Hudson\u2019s amendment, can seek leave. The House can do anything by leave. There\u2019s clearly an amendment there which would have been within scope if it had been addressed in the right way. It\u2019s clearly something which some members feel quite strongly about, and all I\u2019m suggesting is a way for the House to consider that by way of a vote, if they so wish, in order to have the House express an opinion on Mr Hudson\u2019s amendment. I don\u2019t know if\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000280\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022163d0b68-eb0e-4094-9bed-99e184f063e1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022c2298f82ff474165b5f888d887af5310\u0022\u003EJami-Lee Ross\u003C/span\u003E: But we do that in committee?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000281\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00221cc7e095b646479f9ec9ddf3ebf683f3\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: I think it\u2019s probably proper to do it now to get it sorted, because otherwise I think the Chair would be obligated to just proceed to report back again, because there\u2019d be nothing before the committee.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022163d0b68-eb0e-4094-9bed-99e184f063e1\u0022 data-id=\u002232b3fc851f874d418f6329a35ae1aa07\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000282\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022163d0b68-eb0e-4094-9bed-99e184f063e1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002232b3fc851f874d418f6329a35ae1aa07\u0022\u003EJAMI-LEE ROSS (National\u2014Botany):\u003C/span\u003E I seek leave for Mr Hudson\u2019s amendment to be voted on as a question under Part 2.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022 data-id=\u0022dcac934426e046f0bb7df8590599187d\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000283\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022dcac934426e046f0bb7df8590599187d\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Right, and the clear implication of that is that it will be a vote and not a debate. Is there any objection to that? There appears to be none.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000284\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u0022d85d380020104ef0a466cbcb2ca0178b\u0022\u003EIn Committee\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000285\u0022\u003EDebate resumed.\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000286\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u00225663434b15f0484b930cc94010cfa918\u0022\u003EPart 2  Amendments to other Acts (continued)\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000287\u0022\u003EThe question was put that the following amendment in the name of Brett Hudson be agreed to:\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000288\u0022\u003EAfter clause 12, insert new Part 3\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000289\u0022\u003EPart 3 \u2013 Commerce Commission Fuel Market Study\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000290\u0022\u003E9\tPrincipal Act\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000291\u0022\u003EThis part amends the Commerce Act 1986\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000292\u0022\u003E10\tPurpose\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000293\u0022\u003ETo provide for powers for the Commerce Commission to undergo a competition study (market study) of a regional fuel market immediately following the establishment of a RFT scheme in a region.\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000294\u0022\u003E11\tNew Part 3A\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000295\u0022\u003EAfter Part 3, insert:\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000296\u0022\u003E48\tInterpretation\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000297\u0022\u003EIn this Part, unless the context otherwise requires,\u2014\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000298\u0022\u003Ecompetition report means a report prepared by the Commission under section 51B\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000299\u0022\u003Ecompetition study means a study of any factors that may affect competition for the supply or acquisition of goods or services\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000300\u0022\u003Edepartment means a department of the public service specified in Schedule 1 of the State Sector Act 1988\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000301\u0022\u003Eorganisation means any of the following:\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000302\u0022\u003E(a)\tan organisation named in Part 2 of Schedule 1 of the Ombudsmen Act 1975:\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000303\u0022\u003E(b)\tan organisation named in Schedule 1 of the Official Information Act 1982:\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000304\u0022\u003E(c)\tthe Auditor-General.\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000305\u0022\u003ERegional Fuel Tax means any regional fuel tax or regional fuel tax scheme put in place under the Land Transport Management Act 2003\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000306\u0022\u003ERegional Fuel Tax Region means any region of New Zealand that has a regional fuel tax scheme in place under the Land Transport Management Act 2003\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000307\u0022\u003E49\tFunctions of Commission under thus Part\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000308\u0022\u003EThe functions of the Commission under this Act include carrying out competition studies, and preparing competition reports, under this Part.\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000309\u0022\u003E50\tCommission may carry out competition study\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000310\u0022\u003E(1)\tThe Commission must carry out a competition study of fuel markets in a regional fuel tax region no later than one year after a regional fuel tax scheme is established in that region;\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000311\u0022\u003E(a)\tThe Commission must carry out a competition study that assesses the regional fuel tax region in relation to the NZ fuel market\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000312\u0022\u003E(b)\tBefore carrying out a competition study, the Commission must, by notice in the Gazette, issue a statement of intention to carry out the study, which must\u2014\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000313\u0022\u003Eprescribe the terms of reference for the study; and\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000314\u0022\u003Especify the date by which the Commission will make the final competition report for the study publicly available.\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000315\u0022\u003E(2)\tThe study must assess whether price spreading behaviour is occurring in the RFT region\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000316\u0022\u003E(3)\tA copy of the notice must be made publicly available.\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000317\u0022\u003E(4)\tThe Commission may amend the notice in the manner set out in subsections (1) to (3).\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000318\u0022\u003E(5)\tThe Commission may revoke the notice by further notice in the Gazette.\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000319\u0022\u003E51A\tCompetition study terms of reference \u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000320\u0022\u003E(1)\tThe terms of reference for a competition study must\u2014\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000321\u0022\u003E(a)\tExamine the way in which regional fuel taxes influence the price of fuel in a regional fuel tax region and;\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000322\u0022\u003E(b)\tExamine the impact of price spreading of a fuel tax and;\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000323\u0022\u003E(c)\tAny other related area that the Commission deems necessary to examine in relation to regional fuel taxes\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000324\u0022\u003E(2)\tThe terms of reference may name any of the following that it intends to consult as part of the study:\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000325\u0022\u003E(a)\tdepartments:\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000326\u0022\u003E(b)\torganisation:\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000327\u0022\u003E(c)\tpersons:\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000328\u0022\u003E(d)\tclasses of persons.\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000329\u0022\u003E(4)\tThe Commission\u2014\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000330\u0022\u003E(a)\tmust carry out the competition study in accordance with the terms of reference; and\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000331\u0022\u003E(b)\tmay exercise its discretion in relation to any ancillary matters that are related to, but not explicitly covered by, the terms of reference.\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000332\u0022\u003E51B\tPreparation of competition report\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000333\u0022\u003E(1)\tThe Commission must prepare a competition report that records its findings from the competition study.\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000334\u0022\u003E(2)\tThe report may, without limitation, recommend 1 or more of the following:\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000335\u0022\u003E(a)\tchanges to legislation or other instruments:\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000336\u0022\u003E(b)\tchanges to the policies or practices of central or local government:\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000337\u0022\u003E(c)\tchanges to the policies or practices of a person or an organisation responsible for the oversight or regulation of a specified industry:\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000338\u0022\u003E(d)\tchanges to the amount or type of information made available by a person or an organisation in relation to a specified industry:\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000339\u0022\u003E(e)\tthat a person or an organisation research or monitor a specified matter:\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000340\u0022\u003E(f)\tthat persons within a specified industry change their behaviour.\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000341\u0022\u003E51C\tConsultation on draft competition report\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000342\u0022\u003E(1)\tBefore a competition report is finalised, the Commission must\u2014\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000343\u0022\u003E(a)\tmake a draft report publicly available; and\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000344\u0022\u003E(b)\tallow a reasonable time for comments on the draft.\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000345\u0022\u003E(2)\tIn preparing its final report, the Commission must have regard to any comments received on the draft report within the time allowed.\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000346\u0022\u003E51D\tPublication and status of competition report\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000347\u0022\u003E(1)\tA final competition report must be made publicly available.\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000348\u0022\u003E(2)\tTo avoid doubt, a competition report is not a determination of the Commission.\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca id=\u00224d7dab5b8cc646559310ea4331bf5158\u0022 name=\u0022division\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EA party vote was called for on the question, That the amendment be agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EAyes 55\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand National 55.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENoes 63\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand Labour 46; New Zealand First 9; Green Party 8.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EAmendment not agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000349\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u00229def98e86ba248bab2ea2922a8a38ddf\u0022\u003ESchedule\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca id=\u0022929507434cf94fb6a0de227fc3cd86be\u0022 name=\u0022division\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EA party vote was called for on the question, That the schedule be agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EAyes 63\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand Labour 46; New Zealand First 9; Green Party 8.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENoes 55\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand National 55.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ESchedule agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000350\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u002254af6ee877b84f77b420ffdedcc0d5ea\u0022\u003EClauses 1 and 2\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022163d0b68-eb0e-4094-9bed-99e184f063e1\u0022 data-id=\u0022d2a260dc9b394f8bb719d634fcf38c31\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000351\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022163d0b68-eb0e-4094-9bed-99e184f063e1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022d2a260dc9b394f8bb719d634fcf38c31\u0022\u003EJAMI-LEE ROSS (National\u2014Botany):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Madam Chair. I rise to speak to an amendment\u2014there\u2019s a couple of amendments, actually; I\u2019ve just put a couple more into the Table Office\u2014in my name but also to say that, in principle, this side of the committee will be opposing the title and commencement of the bill, as one would expect, because we are opposed to this bill proceeding any further. We are also opposed to the bill\u2019s timing because we do not believe there\u2019s been sufficient work done around a whole range of issues that we\u2019ve already discussed. The reason why I\u2019ve put forward my amendment is because I think there are some circumstances in which the issue of a regional fuel tax being in existence should actually fall out of place and should actually have an automatic repeal inserted into the legislation. The reason why I\u2019ve done that is because the price which people pay for fuel in this country, impacted by tax hikes that the Government is responsible for, is a matter that should be considered as to whether a regional fuel tax should proceed.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000352\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022163d0b68-eb0e-4094-9bed-99e184f063e1\u0022\u003EI have questioned the Minister multiple times in question time to ask him whether he would show some consideration to the cost of fuel that people are paying, and I\u2019ve asked him whether he would consider abandoning his plans for new tax hikes if the cost of fuel got to $3 a litre. Consistently, the Minister has refused to make a decision on that or give me an answer, claiming that it\u2019s a hypothetical. Well, it might be a hypothetical that the cost of fuel might get to $3 a litre, but it is a very real possibility out there and it\u2019s a very real possibility that has been discussed in the media\u2014and I\u2019d say, actually, many New Zealanders are concerned about the price they will be paying at the petrol pump and are concerned about the cumulative impact of fuel price increases because the Government has made decisions to increase the cost of fuel because they\u2019re putting up taxes.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000353\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022163d0b68-eb0e-4094-9bed-99e184f063e1\u0022\u003ESo my amendment inserts a new clause 3, which would see the whole regional fuel tax legislation fall out of force if, at any time, the average fuel price in New Zealand reaches $3 per litre, or if the average fuel price in a region that has an active regional fuel tax scheme reaches $3 per litre for fuel. We are concerned, on this side of the House, about how much people are having to pay. We are concerned, on this side of the House, about the cumulative impact of tax hikes and tax increases, which this Government, particularly, is responsible for. I know the Minister in the chair, Phil Twyford, if he does take a call, will stand up and say we were responsible for 17c a litre in nine years, but I think it\u2019s quite significant when this Government\u2019s proposing 25c a litre in a shorter period of time of only three years\u201417c in nine years, or 25c in three years. And so it\u2019s right and proper that this committee considers the way in which this bill should proceed, if at all, when the price gets to a certain point.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000354\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022163d0b68-eb0e-4094-9bed-99e184f063e1\u0022\u003EWe know that the House going through the legislative process of repealing a whole piece of legislation is time consuming. Now, of course, the Government could take urgency again and structure bills in ways that curtail debate; that would probably speed it up. But we should have an automatic repeal clause in there, and I argue that it\u2019s quite valid, because to let this bill proceed without such a repeal clause is saying that the House simply trusts the Minister to make quality and proper decisions when the price of fuel gets to a certain point. I\u2019ve asked multiple times if he\u2019ll do that; he refuses to comment. I\u2019ve asked multiple times if he will assist the people of New Zealand, who are paying his taxes\u2014whether or not he will make decisions in the future to abandon fuel taxes. I accept that the way the legislation\u2019s drafted, he would have the ability, by Order in Council, to recommend to the Governor-General, if he felt that a certain price that people were paying for fuel was too high, that the regional fuel tax scheme could be abandoned, but we\u2019ve had no certainty, we\u2019ve had no answers, we\u2019ve had nothing from the Minister to give us some advice around how he would see himself making decisions under the quite extensive powers, actually, for a regional fuel tax that are in the bill.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000355\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022163d0b68-eb0e-4094-9bed-99e184f063e1\u0022\u003EA further reason for considering this new clause is that whilst, you know, fuel\u2019s around $2.20 or $2.50, hypothetically, and a 10c increase might not take it close to $3, it\u2019s a very real possibility that the price of fuel could get to $3 not just because of normal market activity\u2014normal market activity that they don\u2019t want the Commerce Commission looking at immediately; normal market activity may take it to $3 a litre\u2014but, in fact, because, where there are extensive powers under regulation-making powers granted through other parts of the bill, where the Minister can have the regional fuel tax price at a much higher point than 10c a litre, where there\u2019s no constraint on that, if the Minister was to exercise his power, which will be granted in this bill, to increase a regional fuel tax to 25c a litre, or 50c a litre, hypothetically, then we\u2019d get to $3 a litre quite a lot faster. And so an automatic repeal provision in this bill would be right and just to protect New Zealanders. And I think New Zealanders do need protection from tax increases.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000356\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022163d0b68-eb0e-4094-9bed-99e184f063e1\u0022\u003EThe very purpose of a House of Representatives is to represent the people that we are sent here to serve, and I think we would be letting them down if we were not to put up some arguments as to why the tax increases that the Minister wants to put in place\u2014where, I believe, they have a dangerous impact on people, where, if the cost of fuel gets so high, families around this country will be struggling to pay fuel, then I believe it should be automatically repealed. I know the Government thinks that they\u2019ve solved all the cost-of-living issues with the Families Package that\u2019s been referred to previously, but, I have to say, if the Families Package proceeds but the cost of fuel gets to $3 a litre, the additional impact on New Zealanders would far outweigh the potential positive benefits of their Families Package. So this would be recognition that the cost of living and the price point which people pay for petrol are very important, and I ask the Government to consider this amendment. I ask them to show some humility around their plans for the regional fuel tax. I ask them to show some compassion, actually, for the cost of fuel to people in New Zealand.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000357\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022163d0b68-eb0e-4094-9bed-99e184f063e1\u0022\u003EWhilst the market may be a significant dictator of how fuel prices are implemented around the country, the Government does have a big part to play, because we know that a significant portion of the cost of fuel right now is taxes, and this legislation before us gives the Minister more power to put in place more taxes\u2014not capped at 10c a litre but capped at whichever point the Minister so desires when he\u2019s considering his powers under regulation.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000358\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022163d0b68-eb0e-4094-9bed-99e184f063e1\u0022\u003EI also have a number of amendments, which I hope have made their way to you, around changing the title of the bill, and I do think that, where the Government has decided that they want to, in a very gung-ho fashion, proceed with a regional fuel tax, they take full ownership of it. One of my suggested amendments is to rename this bill the \u201CLand Transport Management (Twyford Tax) Bill\u201D. And whilst some may think that\u2019s frivolous, I know that Mr Twyford, the Minister in the chair, is exceptionally proud of what he\u2019s doing. He\u2019s exceptionally proud of the fact that he is hiking taxes on Aucklanders and exceptionally proud of the fact that he is the one that is bringing forward legislation that lets Phil Goff off the hook with regards to his own promises around finding savings and efficiencies in the council. If Mr Twyford feels so strongly about that, then I think we should do the right thing and name it after him, because when a man as proud as Phil Twyford brings such legislation to the House, which he thinks will be part of his future legacy, where he hikes taxes on Aucklanders so that the Auckland Council doesn\u2019t have to pay for part of the cost of his future light-rail plans, which I don\u2019t think are affordable or necessary, then let\u2019s do the right and decent thing and name it after him. I\u2019m sure the Hon Phil Twyford\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000359\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002255d0b7a4-a2c9-4c38-9b77-475311a48a89\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022ed456d50b7b9457ba2cc0d5a0d98060d\u0022\u003ESimeon Brown\u003C/span\u003E: Immortalise his name. Immortalise his name.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000360\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022736a5c0b-8df3-4047-ba26-632ba2798b4c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00229db8c33eb50e4707b47418a7d25eda33\u0022\u003EHon Maggie Barry\u003C/span\u003E: Epitaph!\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000361\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022163d0b68-eb0e-4094-9bed-99e184f063e1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00221c93d5a20803498aba20a5cfbd55db7d\u0022\u003EJAMI-LEE ROSS\u003C/span\u003E: \u2014would want his name immortalised in legislation. It\u2019s not quite a statue. It\u2019s not quite a plaque at the opening of his future light-rail project. It\u2019s not quite a name on a building, but it\u2019s a name on a piece of legislation\u2014one that he\u2019s proud of, one that he has so proudly shepherded through the House. And I say this is our gift to you, Phil Twyford: to name this Act of Parliament after you.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002203fd985b-4fb8-4111-ba38-5033a254d962\u0022 data-id=\u0022f6b1a36f59c7454b86fac2676af7494b\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000362\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002203fd985b-4fb8-4111-ba38-5033a254d962\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022f6b1a36f59c7454b86fac2676af7494b\u0022\u003EBRETT HUDSON (National):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Madam Chair. It\u2019s a pleasure to speak on these final two clauses of the bill.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000363\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002203fd985b-4fb8-4111-ba38-5033a254d962\u0022\u003EAs my colleague Mr Ross pointed out at the beginning of his contribution, we don\u2019t support the bill, so it\u2019s very difficult, of course, to support the commencement clause at all, let alone as it stands. But I would make this point and, actually, make a call to the Minister in the chair, Phil Twyford. Why won\u2019t the Minister be prepared to change this? There are very good reasons for adopting a change to the commencement clause. You see, the rhetoric and all of the talk, all of the press, around this bill before it landed in the House was it was all about a regional fuel tax for Auckland. As the Minister has pointed out in his own contributions over the course of this debate in the committee of the whole House, the Labour Party\u2014so, the Minister in a previous capacity\u2014had campaigned on a fuel tax for Auckland in the election campaign. But what they hadn\u2019t campaigned on\u2014and, in fact, what they hadn\u2019t put into the public arena ahead of this bill being introduced\u2014was that a regional fuel tax that could be applied in any region of New Zealand was coming.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000364\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002203fd985b-4fb8-4111-ba38-5033a254d962\u0022\u003ESo when the bill landed, New Zealand was suddenly faced with the prospect of a new tax outside of Auckland and, indeed, in any region in New Zealand, and they never saw that coming. The Government hadn\u2019t signalled that. So you\u2019ve got a new tax to be legislated for and approved in this parliamentary term, but it can\u2019t be collected until 1 January 2021. That\u2019s new to the public. They hadn\u2019t had an opportunity to consider that in the election campaign\u2014so when they made their decision over which party to support. So I think it is thoroughly appropriate that the Minister could now take the opportunity to amend the commencement clause such that no provision on this bill will take effect until 1 January 2021, because that gives New Zealanders ample opportunity to digest the truth and the facts of the matter around this bill and to make a decision at the next election as to whether or not they will support what my colleague has suggested be renamed the \u201CTwyford Tax Bill\u201D.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000365\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002203fd985b-4fb8-4111-ba38-5033a254d962\u0022\u003EI think the Minister should do that because, in good conscience, that\u2019s when the bill actually does what it says on the tin, which is not introduce new taxes. You then go through an election where people could have that information and make that decision. So I call on the Minister. He has it within his power right now to put a Government Supplementary Order Paper (SOP) in to change the commencement clause, and I call on him to do that and to change it to 1 January 2021.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000366\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002203fd985b-4fb8-4111-ba38-5033a254d962\u0022\u003EI would like to offer my voice in support of Mr Ross\u2019 proposed amendment to the title of the bill\u2014that it should be named the \u201CLand Transport Management (Twyford Tax) Amendment Bill 2018\u201D. I also agree with his idea that Mr Twyford, given he\u2019s so proud of the new taxes he\u2019s going to place one in Auckland and also enable the application and approval thereof across any region in New Zealand prior to the next election, should have his name in lights, recorded for posterity, or any other view of the taxpayers and voters of New Zealand. He should have his name indelibly inked on the bill so that the public can always know that it was Phil Twyford, Minister Twyford, who told them that he wasn\u2019t imposing a new tax, it was an Auckland regional fuel tax only, but actually introduced legislation that not only enabled a regional fuel tax to be debated but actually approved\u2014approved\u2014for any region in New Zealand ahead of the next election, and the fact that it can\u2019t be levied until 2021 does not take away from the fact that this legislation allows for the absolute, concrete locking-in of fuel taxes for regions outside of Auckland.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000367\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002203fd985b-4fb8-4111-ba38-5033a254d962\u0022\u003EThe Minister could also perhaps take an opportunity to do his own Government SOP for a different bill name. I think it could validly be known as the \u201CLand Transport Management Regional Fuel Tax - Distortion of Collection Thereof Amendment Bill.\u201D The Minister has acknowledged in his contributions that it is regressive, it\u2019ll hurt lower-income earners more. His response to that was that it\u2019ll be good for them in the long run, which I argue is thoroughly patronising. But there have been a lot of contributions around how, either through deliberate intent or, more likely, through natural competitive forces in the competitive market, in Auckland in particular to begin with, the actual pricing\u2014not the tax component\u2014will be spread around communities across New Zealand so that, in effect\u2014not illegally so, but in effect\u2014the consumers and businesses outside of Auckland will end up paying, in effect, part of the regional tax price amount that should be applied to Auckland in the first instance. So I call upon the Minister to make an amendment to acknowledge that so the public can know.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022f96cdca1-b63c-4602-b2b3-276f58ebb518\u0022 data-id=\u00220d5d8abd76114056969c7aa44933de76\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000368\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f96cdca1-b63c-4602-b2b3-276f58ebb518\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00220d5d8abd76114056969c7aa44933de76\u0022\u003ECHRIS PENK (National\u2014Helensville):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you very much, Madam Chair. I wish to speak on the title of this bill. I will firstly just reflect very quickly on the point made by Jami-Lee Ross that this memorialising of Mr Twyford\u2019s name will not be a statue. It will none the less be a statute, the difference only being a \u2018t\u201D\u2014and, of course, as oil is sometimes referred to as \u201CTexas Tea\u201D, maybe there is some appropriateness there. Another thought I had in relation to the title of the bill was that it could be something along the lines of \u201CFill Up, Phil Down\u201D, so fill up your petrol and Phil will go down\u2014whether that\u2019s Phil Twyford of Phil Goff, I suppose, punters may make their choice as they see fit, certainly within the Auckland region. But, actually, having thought about those possibilities, I decided upon a different approach.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000369\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f96cdca1-b63c-4602-b2b3-276f58ebb518\u0022\u003EI thought the words \u201Cregional fuel tax\u201D are, obviously, pretty integral to the bill, but the Government, surely, would not want to be associated with such a concept, and so I thought if we were to switch the letters of those words around, if we were to sort of mix it up somehow but still retain that character by way of an anagram, then we might come up with something at least as useful in understanding what this bill is about. So an anagram for \u201Cregional fuel tax\u201D is a \u201Cregulation flex\u201D, and it seems to me appropriate that we will have a mechanism for creating regulations, flexing the muscles of the Government to be able to tax New Zealanders in this way. Alternatively, we could have a \u201Crelegation flux\u201D which could indicate the passage\u2014I say that, perhaps euphemistically\u2014of the \u201Crelegation\u201D or perhaps \u201Cdelegation\u201D, if that were to have fitted, of the powers of the Government to those who will be setting in the future such schemes in place.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000370\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f96cdca1-b63c-4602-b2b3-276f58ebb518\u0022\u003EOther options allowed by my desire to mix things up a little bit in this way include also a \u201Cloafer exalting\u201D. I rejected that, however, because it seemed to me that it might suggest that there was particular enjoyment being taken by the Minister, and it seems to me that a loafer is not a fair description of the Hon Phil Twyford. So I rejected that along with the similar, a \u201Cfouler exalting\u201D, because that seems\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000371\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c0e0c86e-e14d-4daa-9bc8-1b5a3d7defeb\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022669ec2fd8ccf4040a0887feb41331c0f\u0022\u003ECHAIRPERSON (Poto Williams)\u003C/span\u003E: Order! Could I just call the member to order. I know there is a little bit of levity that often accompanies the title and commencement phase of the committee stage. However, we are starting to stray outside of any sense of relevancy to the bill, so I would ask the member to come back to that, please.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000372\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f96cdca1-b63c-4602-b2b3-276f58ebb518\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a9e2eb9129894b319e3ba705aa59c0e4\u0022\u003ECHRIS PENK\u003C/span\u003E: Thank you, Madam Chair. It\u2019s a pleasure to speak in relation to the title and, more narrowly, perhaps, now in relation to the actual title as it currently sits and to just sort of analyse how that all fits together. The bill is a land transport management (regional fuel tax) bill. The word \u201Cland\u201D to me implies\u2014and I think most New Zealanders would read the ordinary, natural meaning of the word \u201Cland\u201D to indicate that it would be about fuel for vehicles that travel by land, and yet we have learnt through the process of discussing the bill in relation to non-commercial ships, to which it will apply, and potentially other craft that do not travel on land as well, that, actually, it should not be the Land Transport Management Act only that is amended in this way.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000373\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f96cdca1-b63c-4602-b2b3-276f58ebb518\u0022\u003ENow, I\u2019m not proposing that any other Acts be amended, because that would be more appropriate to a Part 2 debate. However, I wonder if some clarification could be given in the title of the bill to make it clear that the usual presumption is that a land transport management Act will actually continue to refer only to matters of land transport. Hence something along the lines of \u201CRegional Fuel Tax in Relation to Land and Other Media or Domains\u201D would perhaps be a useful way of setting out that distinction that is being made in this bill.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000374\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f96cdca1-b63c-4602-b2b3-276f58ebb518\u0022\u003EMy final point relates to the word \u201Cregional\u201D within that, and much has been said already about the fact that it is going to be on a regional basis. However, it\u2019s worth setting out clearly, I think, in the title of the bill that there will be multiple regions, lest anyone be unclear.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022a1f7bbd1-b6ae-41c0-963b-dbe1251f5540\u0022 data-id=\u00223cc34ff18f184f74a95ac69b65602f4d\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000375\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a1f7bbd1-b6ae-41c0-963b-dbe1251f5540\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00223cc34ff18f184f74a95ac69b65602f4d\u0022\u003EKIERAN McANULTY (Junior Whip\u2014Labour):\u003C/span\u003E I raise a point of order, Madam Chairperson. I purposely waited to the end of that speech, although I\u2019m starting to regret that. I\u2019d like you to consider Speakers\u2019 rulings 114/6 and 115/1, in regard specifically to the motion that a Minister\u2019s name be included in the title of this bill, I ask that you offer a ruling on whether these proposals are indeed in order.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022c0e0c86e-e14d-4daa-9bc8-1b5a3d7defeb\u0022 data-id=\u00220e82bc8bf08e49899f937f0e5a095d3a\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000376\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c0e0c86e-e14d-4daa-9bc8-1b5a3d7defeb\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00220e82bc8bf08e49899f937f0e5a095d3a\u0022\u003ECHAIRPERSON (Poto Williams)\u003C/span\u003E: Thank you. I thank the member for his contribution. We have been considering that particular matter, and, as you would have guessed by my bringing the previous speaker, Chris Penk, back to relevancy, I have been considering whether including the name of the honourable Minister within the title of the bill, as proposed in the amendment by Jami-Lee Ross, is actually frivolous. I could rule it out of order in that case, or I could wait for the will of the committee to determine that at the end of the proceedings. In this case, I am looking to members to continue to be relevant, so in this case I am ruling that the will of the committee will prevail, and we will allow the amendment.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002285ec30d4-6394-433a-a12e-2c4def705dd0\u0022 data-id=\u0022dace09faeba74a28a4d779b401a7abf0\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000377\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002285ec30d4-6394-433a-a12e-2c4def705dd0\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022dace09faeba74a28a4d779b401a7abf0\u0022\u003EHon JUDITH COLLINS (National\u2014Papakura):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Madam Chair. Thank you. I wish to speak to my amendment around the title of this bill. Now, unlike under Mr McAnulty\u2014I think I\u2019ve said that right\u2014I actually don\u2019t see any problem at all with a Minister wanting to be fairly immortalised for posterity in the name of the bill. Actually, I take it back to that lovely American tradition where you have all these bills named after people and laws that are named after whatever. I also would say things like some of the laws that we have in New Zealand lack the punch\u2014lack the punch\u2014and I see it in actually stating what they\u2019re all about.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000378\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002285ec30d4-6394-433a-a12e-2c4def705dd0\u0022\u003ESo my amendment is that the bill be renamed to the \u201CLand Transport Management and all of Regions Fuel Tax (Phil) Amendment Bill\u201D. Why I say that is because the Phil in this case that I am referring to is a P-H-I-L Phil, not an F-I-L-L. But I love that. It\u2019s the same thing. I think that this could be an excellent name, because that way when everybody around the country\u2014not just Auckland, because this is actually not an Auckland bill; this is actually a bill that was promoted as an Auckland bill but is not an Auckland bill. It can relate to any region in the country. When people go around New Zealand and pay the extra money on their fuel tax and the GST on top of that fuel tax, they will want to say this is because of the \u201CPhil Bill\u201D. Whether it\u2019s a Hon Phil Goff bill or a Hon Phil Twyford bill, it\u2019s still the \u201CPhil Bill\u201D. I think that that\u2019s so much better\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000379\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022919ab950849540ad87432eb84d81d933\u0022\u003EHon Dr Nick Smith\u003C/span\u003E: Poetic justice.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000380\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002285ec30d4-6394-433a-a12e-2c4def705dd0\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022742dff8061d74b78a233a09df7017acd\u0022\u003EHon JUDITH COLLINS\u003C/span\u003E: I think it is poetic justice, yes\u2014from the Hon Nick Smith\u2014a very good idea from the Hon Nick Smith. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000381\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002285ec30d4-6394-433a-a12e-2c4def705dd0\u0022\u003EI think it\u2019s the sort of thing where if you\u2019re going to have\u2014generally, nobody likes paying taxes. Well, no\u2014everyone likes someone else to pay taxes. So when you go to fill up the car, it will be an \u201CI\u2019m filling up on the Phil Bill\u201D. People in Papakura, in my electorate, who have to pay so much in fuel tax if they are travelling into the city or travelling to west Auckland or travelling to the North Shore or travelling further south, they will want to know who to thank for that regional fuel tax, because they certainly won\u2019t be thanking the Hon Phil Goff for the Mill Road extension if it stops at Alfriston School. That is going to be funded by some of these taxes. They\u2019re certainly not going to thank the Hon Phil Twyford if the Mill Road extension goes to Alfriston School, doesn\u2019t go through to Papakura, doesn\u2019t go through to Drury, and doesn\u2019t open up the way through for all the developments that have been planned and which the Minister of Housing and Urban Development\u2014also the Hon Phil Twyford\u2014has been so busily promoting, which are, actually, just a bit too far away from the Mill Road extension to be of much use.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000382\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002285ec30d4-6394-433a-a12e-2c4def705dd0\u0022\u003EI think it\u2019s important that we have bills that people can find when they\u2019re looking for statutes\u2014that\u2019s the other thing. A lot of these bills that you put through, and Acts of Parliament, they\u2019re so numerous and they have such generic and, really, no fun at all names\u2014people can\u2019t find them. Who\u2019s going to know where to find a Land Transport Management (Regional Fuel Tax) Amendment Bill, because it will go into the main Act and it will just be swallowed. Much, much better, I think, in future, that we start thinking about giving these bills names that New Zealanders can find when they look in the legislation website to look for relevant legislation. Because that\u2019s one of the hard things. I\u2019m a lawyer\u2014a very experienced one. It\u2019s not so hard for me, but actually, we\u2019re not here for me; we\u2019re actually here for New Zealanders all over the country, and they should be able to know this is a \u201CPhil Bill\u201D.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002255d0b7a4-a2c9-4c38-9b77-475311a48a89\u0022 data-id=\u002230cef8d1fd134e9c994cc1708213c574\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000383\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002255d0b7a4-a2c9-4c38-9b77-475311a48a89\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002230cef8d1fd134e9c994cc1708213c574\u0022\u003ESIMEON BROWN (National\u2014Pakuranga):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you very much, Madam Chair. It\u2019s a pleasure to take my first call on the land transport management title and commencement part of this piece of legislation. I just want to continue our discussion around the title of this piece of legislation. I\u2019ve just put an amendment on the Table which I think is a very good one, and I think it\u2019s one which the committee should take some time to consider. The proposal is that this Act should be called the \u201CLand Transport Management (Let\u2019s Tax This) Amendment Act 2018\u201D, because, to be frank, this legislation and this regional fuel tax, which will eventually be a fuel tax across all of Auckland\u2014as we know, it\u2019s not going to be regional; it\u2019ll be for the whole country\u2014will have an impact on literally everything which people buy. I think of the people in my electorate in Pakuranga, who are working hard and they drive their children to school, they go to work, and every time they fill up their car they have to pay the regional fuel tax. They go to the shops, and the goods which arrive at the supermarket come on a truck, and that has to include the cost of the regional fuel tax. They go to a cafe, and at the cafe they get a coffee and there are some sandwiches or whatever they get, and the goods and services\u2014wherever they go, this regional fuel tax will have an impact and have a cost on everything. As they will go along the road, as they go there, they will pay the regional fuel tax.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000384\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002255d0b7a4-a2c9-4c38-9b77-475311a48a89\u0022\u003ESo the name of this legislation should reflect the impact, in my view, that it is going to have on literally everything that people purchase and the way that people get around and the journeys that people take. Also, I think it reflects quite nicely on how the Labour Government, or the coalition Government, should I say, with the three parties\u2014their view of how taxation should just be made up and tax everything, and I think that\u2019s a good slogan of how this Government\u2019s approach to taxation has taken place, of just literally taxing everything.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000385\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002255d0b7a4-a2c9-4c38-9b77-475311a48a89\u0022\u003EI remember a promise that there would be no new taxes, and here we are in the first year of this Government with a tax which\u2014yes, they said there\u2019d be a tax for Aucklanders\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000386\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c0e0c86e-e14d-4daa-9bc8-1b5a3d7defeb\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022e30c4f00d12d4be09c210ece0954339f\u0022\u003ECHAIRPERSON (Poto Williams)\u003C/span\u003E: Order! Repetition.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000387\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002255d0b7a4-a2c9-4c38-9b77-475311a48a89\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002254e3f1918f8e4841b46d0fe5bf9ec6c5\u0022\u003ESIMEON BROWN\u003C/span\u003E: They said there\u2019d be a tax for Aucklanders, but it\u2019s a tax for the whole country. So that\u2019s a suggestion, and I look forward to the will of the committee on that. I think there are a number of other names which this could be called\u2014the \u201CBroken Promise Act\u201D, because it is a broken promise, and that goes back to the point I would just make, so I won\u2019t reflect too much further on that because I already have made that point.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000388\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002255d0b7a4-a2c9-4c38-9b77-475311a48a89\u0022\u003EThe \u201CTravel to Hamilton to Get Your Fuel Tax Act\u201D, because for the first three years, while Aucklanders will have\u2014I know the member for the Waikato is here, and he loves Hamilton, and a lot of people in this House have good memories of that place. Some of them live here, some of them visit, but we know how great a place Hamilton is. But if you\u2019re going to go there to get your tax, well, that\u2019s what this legislation\u2019s going to be doing for the next three years. So maybe that\u2019s one way\u2014but I guess you\u2019d need to change the commencement if you were going to put that title in, because after 2021 we know that other regional councils are able to put in place these taxes. So maybe if that was the title that this committee was to agree to, maybe there should be some way to have the name of the Act changed over time. So the first three years it can be referred to as the \u201CGo to Hamilton to Get Your Tax\u201D, but once Hamilton\u2019s got its tax, obviously you won\u2019t be going to Hamilton because everyone will be paying across the country for their legislation.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000389\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002255d0b7a4-a2c9-4c38-9b77-475311a48a89\u0022\u003EThere\u2019s been a number of other names about fill up, Phil down, and I think those are also good to be thought about. I think the other thing which is\u2014I mean, in those names is really the reflection that this tax is letting Auckland Council off the hook. It\u2019s letting Auckland Council off the hook, and I\u2019m not sure if there\u2019s some way we can allow this legislation to reflect the fact that Phil Goff said that he would reduce savings by 3 to 4 percent, which is enough for this tax to not be necessary. If he\u2019d kept to his promise to reduce costs and to find savings in Auckland Council, we know that this legislation would not have been required.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000390\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002255d0b7a4-a2c9-4c38-9b77-475311a48a89\u0022\u003ESo I think this committee needs reflect upon that, reflect upon the fact that the Auckland Council, which this legislation will initially apply to\u2014the mayor promised, and now we\u2019re letting him off the hook by letting this legislation go through so that he can tax his constituents and tax my constituents to pay for a range of projects. Thank you.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022a1f7bbd1-b6ae-41c0-963b-dbe1251f5540\u0022 data-id=\u00227834fb9759fb41468aaf6d5dfa00d984\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000391\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a1f7bbd1-b6ae-41c0-963b-dbe1251f5540\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00227834fb9759fb41468aaf6d5dfa00d984\u0022\u003EKIERAN McANULTY (Junior Whip\u2014Labour):\u003C/span\u003E I raise a point of order, Madam Chairperson. I seek your guidance specifically in relation to that previous speech and the proposal to change the title of the bill to make a political point. I refer you specifically to Speakers\u2019 ruling 115/1(3) and the rulings of Chairpersons Braybrooke and Hartley, which give the example of the Tariff (Zero Duty Removal) Amendment Bill and changing that to make a political point. I put it to you that proposing to change the name of the title of this bill to one which is a clear reference to a political slogan from the last campaign would be in breach of that Speakers\u2019 ruling.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022c0e0c86e-e14d-4daa-9bc8-1b5a3d7defeb\u0022 data-id=\u00229cfe79184f2243858485edc5d1be5a81\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000392\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c0e0c86e-e14d-4daa-9bc8-1b5a3d7defeb\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00229cfe79184f2243858485edc5d1be5a81\u0022\u003ECHAIRPERSON (Poto Williams)\u003C/span\u003E: Thank you, and I thank the member Kieran McAnulty for his intervention. I\u2019m not sure that it\u2019s entirely helpful given my previous ruling; however, I will consider that. And, as I said, there are two options: whether we leave it to the will of the committee, or whether I make a ruling. I am strongly suggesting that we don\u2019t continue to embark upon that journey. We are getting to the point where relevancy is being tested within this committee, in terms of the titles that are being suggested. So I\u2019m making a strong suggestion to members of the committee in that regard.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022a1f7bbd1-b6ae-41c0-963b-dbe1251f5540\u0022 data-id=\u0022d7dfc39a852348ea8904d7b36f853d92\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000393\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a1f7bbd1-b6ae-41c0-963b-dbe1251f5540\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022d7dfc39a852348ea8904d7b36f853d92\u0022\u003EKIERAN McANULTY (Junior Whip\u2014Labour):\u003C/span\u003E I move, That the question be now put.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca id=\u0022ae773bbb6db04e0eb00e9f2a670d28bf\u0022 name=\u0022division\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EA party vote was called for on the question, That the question be now put.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EAyes 63\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand Labour 46; New Zealand First 9; Green Party 8.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENoes 55\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand National 55.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EMotion agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022c0e0c86e-e14d-4daa-9bc8-1b5a3d7defeb\u0022 data-id=\u002244bf0910817448c0b62097fd08d0fda4\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000394\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c0e0c86e-e14d-4daa-9bc8-1b5a3d7defeb\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002244bf0910817448c0b62097fd08d0fda4\u0022\u003ECHAIRPERSON (Poto Williams)\u003C/span\u003E: The Jami-Lee Ross amendment changing the title to the Land Transport Management (Twyford Tax) Amendment Bill is out of order as not being a serious amendment.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000395\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c0e0c86e-e14d-4daa-9bc8-1b5a3d7defeb\u0022\u003EThe question was put that the following amendment in the name of Jami-Lee Ross to clause 1 be agreed to: \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000396\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c0e0c86e-e14d-4daa-9bc8-1b5a3d7defeb\u0022\u003EClause 1\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000397\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c0e0c86e-e14d-4daa-9bc8-1b5a3d7defeb\u0022\u003EReplace Clause 1 with:\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000398\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c0e0c86e-e14d-4daa-9bc8-1b5a3d7defeb\u0022\u003ELand Transport Management (Not Just Auckland but Other Regions Fuel Tax) Amendment Bill\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca id=\u0022be27305991fa402daf6429dc4edaa101\u0022 name=\u0022division\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EA party vote was called for on the question, That the amendment be agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EAyes 55\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand National 55.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENoes 63\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand Labour 46; New Zealand First 9; Green Party 8.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EAmendment not agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022c0e0c86e-e14d-4daa-9bc8-1b5a3d7defeb\u0022 data-id=\u00220f9f88292a4e49e3a97fe38b6fac5cd2\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000399\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c0e0c86e-e14d-4daa-9bc8-1b5a3d7defeb\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00220f9f88292a4e49e3a97fe38b6fac5cd2\u0022\u003ECHAIRPERSON (Poto Williams)\u003C/span\u003E: Simeon Brown\u2019s amendment changing the title to the \u201CLand Transport Management (Twyford and Goff) Amendment Bill\u201D is out of order as not being a serious amendment. Simeon Brown\u2019s amendment changing the title to the \u201CLand Transport Management (Let\u2019s Tax This) Amendment Bill\u201D is out of order as not being a serious amendment. Judith Collins\u2019 amendment changing the title to the \u201CLand Transport Management (Phil) Amendment Bill\u201D is out of order as not being a serious amendment.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca id=\u00220f0da8858fc7420f91fc217f6b3e9627\u0022 name=\u0022division\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EA party vote was called for on the question, That clause 1 be agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EAyes 63\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand Labour 46; New Zealand First 9; Green Party 8.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENoes 55\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand National 55.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EClause 1 agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000400\u0022\u003EClause 2 agreed to.\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000401\u0022\u003EThe question was put that the following amendment in the name of Jami-Lee Ross be agreed to: \u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000402\u0022\u003ENew Clause 3\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000403\u0022\u003E(1)\tAll of the sections of this Act fall out of force if, at any time, t\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000404\u0022\u003Ea.\tThe average fuel price in New Zealand reaches $3 a litre.\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000405\u0022\u003Eb.\tThe average fuel price in a region that has an active regional fuel tax scheme reaches $3 per litre of fuel.\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca id=\u00227cd2dce44bca471dbcd46fe00a4e9c82\u0022 name=\u0022division\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EA party vote was called for on the question, That the amendment be agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EAyes 55\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand National 55.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENoes 63\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand Labour 46; New Zealand First 9; Green Party 8.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EAmendment not agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000406\u0022\u003EBill to be reported with amendment presently.\u003C/p\u003E\n    \u003C/div\u003E\n    \u003Cdiv class=\u0022HpsHansard\u0022\u003E\n      \u003Cp\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsProceedingHeading\u0022\u003EBills\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000407\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u0022cadc86aa5e1d4d599f505cf40bae764d\u0022\u003ETaxation (Neutralising Base Erosion and Profit Shifting) Bill\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000408\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u0022e73462fa315e4f2da4cba4e1fa0a3bbf\u0022\u003EIn Committee\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000409\u0022\u003EDebate resumed from 14 June.\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000410\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u0022baca069a2844489683b44a655889b382\u0022\u003EPart 2  Amendments to Tax Administration Act 1994 (continued)\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002203fd985b-4fb8-4111-ba38-5033a254d962\u0022 data-id=\u00227ec403f0bc474b06b307d94cf666bbed\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000411\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002203fd985b-4fb8-4111-ba38-5033a254d962\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00227ec403f0bc474b06b307d94cf666bbed\u0022\u003EBRETT HUDSON (National):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Madam Chair. It\u2019s a pleasure to rise and speak on this bill. I think the bill has broad support across the House. I particularly want to talk about clauses 54 and 55, and I have some questions for the Minister. If we have a look at the departmental report and have a look at the submissions, I think submitters raised some very valid points, such as: \u201CTaxpayers should not be exposed to criminal penalties for the acts/omissions of another group member over whom they have no control.\u201D That was ASB, Corporate Taxpayers Group, EY, Russell McVeagh. And I do note that, in the departmental report, the officials said they agree. They agree with the submitters, and the recommendation was that the submissions be accepted.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000412\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002203fd985b-4fb8-4111-ba38-5033a254d962\u0022\u003EThere\u2019s one in particular that I\u2019d like to ask the Minister about, and that is, I think, the New Zealand Law Society, who raised an extremely good point in their submission. And theirs was that \u201Cit should be a defence under sections 143 and 143A that the member charged with the offence did not have the knowledge that the requested information was in the knowledge, possession or control of another member of the group.\u201D Taking a look at those two sections in the Tax Administration Act, it is my read of that, Minister, that the offence is committed if the knowledge or possession is in the hands of that other member of the group. The person being charged, whether they have the knowledge or not as to whether someone else in, say, the multinational has the knowledge or possession of the information, is irrelevant. And that cuts across, therefore, still, in my view\u2014it doesn\u2019t take on board the submission from the New Zealand Law Society.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000413\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002203fd985b-4fb8-4111-ba38-5033a254d962\u0022\u003ESo I would like the Minister to stand and take a call and tell us, given the departmental report says that the submissions be accepted, how it is\u2014given that the bill itself now just strikes out the provisions, the clauses that relate to 143 and 143A of the Tax Administration Act. So how is it, therefore\u2014given the sections as they currently stand in the Tax Administration Act, where knowledge of the person actually being charged with the commission of the offence, knowledge of what the person elsewhere in the world in the group has or doesn\u2019t have, isn\u2019t actually part of, or doesn\u2019t appear to be part of, the test or the concern as to whether or not an offence has been committed. So I look forward to the Minister\u2014and I see the Minister turning to officials, looking to get some clarity around that\u2014taking a call and just sharing with us how that has been addressed, because I do note that officials did say, in their report, that the submissions be accepted.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000414\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002203fd985b-4fb8-4111-ba38-5033a254d962\u0022\u003EThe other matter I\u2019d just like to touch upon is clause 53, which is the same general matter but about civil penalties. And I\u2019m particularly interested here in the rationale from the Minister as to why\u2014and this is a submission from Westpac. Westpac said that \u201Cimposing a civil penalty liability that exceeds the available criminal sanctions is equally inappropriate\u2014particularly if its intent is to avoid the need for Inland Revenue to bring civil proceedings.\u201D And they note, \u201CThere are no equivalent civil proceedings in the Act relating to comparable failures;\u201D That\u2019s from Westpac. And there are; there are quite substantial differences in the amounts payable under the criminal versus civil penalties. Civil penalty has a maximum of $100,000. So, clearly, I imagine there was a reason for officials and for the Minister, therefore, in seeking to continue with a regime where the maximum civil penalty is quite substantially greater than the fine, at least, for the criminal offence. So unless the entity has pretty clear confidence that Inland Revenue aren\u2019t going to charge them greater than the penalty they would otherwise incur, then perhaps that creates something of a disincentive to settle, effectively, out of court. So I would just like the Minister to comment on that.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000415\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002203fd985b-4fb8-4111-ba38-5033a254d962\u0022\u003EI would sort of pre-empt that I don\u2019t think trusting the Inland Revenue\u2014while we all might do; we might have great faith in them as an entity\u2014not to apply a penalty which others might see as a bit unfair\u2014I don\u2019t think that\u2019s really where we could be on this. So I\u2019d just like to hear from the Minister on those two areas: the part I raised around sections 143 and 143A around the criminal penalty, and also about how the civil penalty is higher, or can be higher, than the criminal penalty. I look forward to that, Minister.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002285ec30d4-6394-433a-a12e-2c4def705dd0\u0022 data-id=\u00228ea4c2232a6142a8bd725301df1dd6c2\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000416\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002285ec30d4-6394-433a-a12e-2c4def705dd0\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00228ea4c2232a6142a8bd725301df1dd6c2\u0022\u003EHon JUDITH COLLINS (National\u2014Papakura):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Mr Chair. Can I acknowledge the excellent contribution from my colleague Brett Hudson. I think his questions are very good questions, and I\u2019m sure that the Minister in the chair will want to answer those. But I want to just speak on this bill, because this is a bill that I started\u2014and the Minister\u2019s acknowledged that before, so it\u2019s not a big thing. But it\u2019s not as though it was all my work. Revenue worked so hard to make this all happen, but also I signed us up as a country, at the OECD, to the multilateral arrangements around tax and information collection that this bill is part of.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000417\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002285ec30d4-6394-433a-a12e-2c4def705dd0\u0022\u003EIt addresses a situation, in Part 2 of the bill, very much around the fact that we now have big multinationals in the world who are, in many ways, much bigger, much more powerful, and far better-resourced than some countries, including ours. Those particular multinationals do shift their profits from one country to the other, but also they use their losses or their cost of business to put them in tax advantageous places. As was explained to me at the OECD, some of these big multinationals do in fact have entirely massive tax departments, and as a tax lawyer I found that very interesting. But also they have these big tax departments which are very much focused, as part of their business, on shifting the losses and the profits, depending on where they can pay the least tax.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000418\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002285ec30d4-6394-433a-a12e-2c4def705dd0\u0022\u003ENow, that works OK for them, and it works OK for their shareholders. But it does not work OK at all for the rest of the world that does not get to do that. By the way, the rest of the world\u2019s paying for the roads and the schools and the law and order and all the things that help make places safe for people to undertake business in.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000419\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002285ec30d4-6394-433a-a12e-2c4def705dd0\u0022\u003ESo I am someone who is very pro - this bill. I know that our party absolutely supports it, because we agreed to it before, when we were in Government, and started it. But I am also someone who thinks that we need to sometimes dial back our enthusiasm for all things collected internationally and shared, because we also need to be aware that, with the greatest and best of intentions, we can in fact empower a group as professional and responsible as our Inland Revenue Department people are\u2014and I have great confidence in them, having been their Minister\u2014but also understanding that what actually helps the Inland Revenue Department to remain a very well-respected department and well-thought-of department and trusted department is that they do not just have carte blanche to go and do anything that they particularly want to do. They have to keep to the law.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000420\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002285ec30d4-6394-433a-a12e-2c4def705dd0\u0022\u003ESo I am just a little bit concerned, along with my colleagues, around the penalties, and particularly when there are multinationals that New Zealanders may be involved in in some way: law firms, accountants, other professionals, or even shareholders or whatever, and people who are directors, who are going to, under this legislation, bear\u2014I think, in some ways\u2014a disproportionate responsibility for the actions of others. One might say that, \u201CWell, that\u2019s their fault for being involved in these businesses.\u201D But, actually, as a law professional, we also have a code of ethics that requires us to\u2014as they say, people take the first cab off the rank. That means that law firms do not get the luxury of saying to a client, or someone presenting as a client, \u201CI don\u2019t like you much, so I\u2019m not going to act for you.\u201D\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000421\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002285ec30d4-6394-433a-a12e-2c4def705dd0\u0022\u003ESo I think we need to think about that, and I think the questions raised by my colleague Brett Hudson are incredibly valid. We do not want to have a situation where, rushing to agree with everything that we\u2019ve signed up to before\u2014rushing to agree to all the things that we share in terms of the intentions\u2014we actually create a bigger problem a little bit further down the track.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000422\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002285ec30d4-6394-433a-a12e-2c4def705dd0\u0022\u003ESo I think it is important: the issues raised by the law firm Russell McVeagh and others around this\u2014that we don\u2019t actually penalise our law professionals or our tax professionals or others who are working in these areas quite legitimately\u2014that we don\u2019t penalise them because of what\u2019s being done overseas, where they have no control of it. That\u2019s the thing with the law profession or the accountancy profession: you have your obligations, you certainly have your code of ethics, and what that doesn\u2019t always allow you to do is to actually delve into all of the things that are going on elsewhere.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000423\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002285ec30d4-6394-433a-a12e-2c4def705dd0\u0022\u003EWe need to be very careful that we don\u2019t end with a situation where the penalty for members of a large multinational group failing to provide information under clause 53 of the bill becomes one that actually means that our very competent lawyers and other professionals have to say to overseas companies or multinationals\u2014or even New Zealand companies\u2014\u201CI\u2019m actually sorry. We can\u2019t act for you. We can\u2019t do anything for you. We can\u2019t be part of this organisation. We can\u2019t be a director. We can\u2019t do whatever it is that we\u2019d normally be able to do, because the penalties that could be imposed on us for actions over which we have no control are so onerous that, actually, we just can\u2019t do it.\u201D I think that actually creates quite a bit of a conflict for anybody who is in one of those professions around their ethical obligation to take on clients who turn up seeking assistance. So we just need to get some clarification from the Minister as to how that will in fact be undertaken.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000424\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002285ec30d4-6394-433a-a12e-2c4def705dd0\u0022\u003EI think we\u2019ve also seen some pretty chilling\u2014and I want to actually just raise this as an issue, because I think it\u2019s a very good point. We\u2019ve seen in the United States recently\u2014and I don\u2019t want to go into any details of people\u2019s court cases\u2014where some lawyers have been specifically targeted around their actions, or, actually, even the actions of their clients. That, I think, has a chilling effect, and should have a chilling effect, on all lawyers and professionals who are working in these very often very difficult ethical areas in the liberal democracies of which we form a part. I\u2019m not saying that what happens in America necessarily affects us, but I certainly see that there is a certain culture of going after, if I can use that colloquial term, people connected to those in high places or those who are seen as being a legitimate target. So I really want to hear a bit more from the Minister about this. I\u2019m sure he\u2019ll give us some good assurances.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000425\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002285ec30d4-6394-433a-a12e-2c4def705dd0\u0022\u003EBut it\u2019s the sort of thing where I think that it\u2019s good for Parliament to question just how this law will in fact, or could in fact\u2014a very legitimate profession and one that we should actually protect ourselves, because it goes to the rule of law. When we can\u2019t have lawyers and other professionals whose job and career and ethical obligations are around the protection of rights\u2014if they cannot continue with their work free of fear that they will suddenly end up penalised for something they have no knowledge of and no control over\u2014then we are going down a very, very slippery path.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000426\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002285ec30d4-6394-433a-a12e-2c4def705dd0\u0022\u003EI don\u2019t want that to happen. I know it has never been the intention of this Parliament, but what I also know, as an experienced lawyer, is that the intention of Parliament is not necessarily what matters; it is the actions of Parliament that matter, and it\u2019s what the law itself says. So I would like to hear from the Minister in the chair, Stuart Nash\u2014and I\u2019m sure he\u2019ll want to address this\u2014just to make sure what it is that we are talking about, how this will operate, and how professionals in this very important area will in fact be protected from undue bullying or pursuit by revenue and the Inland Revenue Department investigators.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022bbded2ec-ac25-4a73-a380-3f4d87693084\u0022 data-id=\u0022af732df65497490aaff84b986633f1fb\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000427\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bbded2ec-ac25-4a73-a380-3f4d87693084\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022af732df65497490aaff84b986633f1fb\u0022\u003EHon STUART NASH (Minister of Revenue):\u003C/span\u003E Let me start off by dealing with the penalties issue\u2014well, I will deal with the penalties issue. First and foremost, to the last member, Judith Collins, who I have the utmost respect for and who did some fantastic work in this area, I acknowledge the fact that she went to the OECD and signed up to this and set New Zealand on the path to actually enhancing the integrity of our tax system, which is what we all want. It\u2019s a little bit rich for her to share concerns over certain obligations to which she signed New Zealand up for, but one thing I will say to her and Mr Butler\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000428\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002285ec30d4-6394-433a-a12e-2c4def705dd0\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00222600c892468a453b83ebd0661b9a3042\u0022\u003EHon Judith Collins\u003C/span\u003E: The Minister started so well and let himself down.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000429\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bbded2ec-ac25-4a73-a380-3f4d87693084\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022d1435f5e540a4aa295834e4609f0916d\u0022\u003EHon STUART NASH\u003C/span\u003E: Ha, ha! I absolutely trust the Inland Revenue Department, first of all\u2014[interruption]\u2014to prosecute under the appropriate law, Mr Butler; so that will happen. There is no doubt about that. The second thing is that we know that Inland Revenue operates with huge integrity\u2014we know that. We also know\u2014and I can give you my utmost assurance\u2014that Inland Revenue is not going to \u201Cgo after\u201D a large organisation or an individual just because they\u2019re high profile or a tall poppy. They just haven\u2019t got the time or the resources or the inclination, let alone this is not how they operate. They will only \u201Cgo after\u201D someone if they believe they have broken the law\u2014and so they should\u2014which is what this legislation is about.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000430\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bbded2ec-ac25-4a73-a380-3f4d87693084\u0022\u003ENow, talking about clauses 54 and 55, well, it\u2019s a little irrelevant, because what we actually did is we took criminal charges out of the bill. So they\u2019ve been removed. Criminal penalties don\u2019t apply anymore; so it was not necessary to amend these penalties.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000431\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bbded2ec-ac25-4a73-a380-3f4d87693084\u0022\u003EThe other thing I would say to the Hon Judith Collins is that we\u2019re talking about failure to provide information, OK? So someone is going to get prosecuted if they fail to provide information that the Inland Revenue has requested, but the penalties that we\u2019re talking about in the $100,000-range only apply to large multinational groups with global revenues of more than \u20AC750 million. So the former Minister, the Hon Judith Collins, talked about lawyers and accountants; well, if you\u2019re lucky enough to have a client with global revenues of over \u20AC750 million, then the practice is probably doing really well, and you\u2019re probably highly experienced and incredibly competent in a certain area of law. So we don\u2019t think that, in this context, a civil penalty of up to $100,000 is excessive at all. In fact, you could mount an argument that it should perhaps be higher, but we won\u2019t go there. So let me deal with this.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000432\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bbded2ec-ac25-4a73-a380-3f4d87693084\u0022\u003EThe second one is that civil penalties were introduced because we consider the existing penalty of $4,000\u2014$4,000\u2014is unlikely to be adequate when applied to failures of large multinationals to cooperate by providing information that the Inland Revenue has requested. So this is a big area. I hope I\u2019ve dealt with those concerns, with regard to penalties and with regard to clauses that have been taken out, and with regard to the scale of the penalty, but, also, with regard to whom Inland Revenue may seek to prosecute. I just want to reiterate: Inland Revenue is not going to go after someone if they don\u2019t think there is a very good case. Thank you very much.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00220c51564f-6c6e-45cc-adab-f15b6c831fce\u0022 data-id=\u0022c853d5eec1d041798161e88ed0a73ae8\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000433\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220c51564f-6c6e-45cc-adab-f15b6c831fce\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022c853d5eec1d041798161e88ed0a73ae8\u0022\u003ELAWRENCE YULE (National\u2014Tukituki):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you for the call. I\u2019m pleased to support this bill and acknowledge the work of the Hon Judith Collins and the Hon Stuart Nash in getting to this point.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000434\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220c51564f-6c6e-45cc-adab-f15b6c831fce\u0022\u003EI\u2019ve sat on the Finance and Expenditure Committee. It\u2019s been a learning experience, a significantly complex piece of legislation, but we\u2019re here, in urgency, to get it to the next stage. That being said, Mr Chair\u2014and to the Minister in the chair, the Hon Stuart Nash\u2014there is a suggestion I\u2019d like to make for no other reason than I think we are potentially exposing ourselves unnecessarily to a whole lot of legal fights and a whole lot of lawyers\u2019 interpretations. I specifically comment on clause 50, new section 17(1CB). In this section, there is a specific mention around how we can access information for multinationals in other jurisdictions. It says, \u201Cdisregarding any law of a foreign country relating to secrecy of information,\u201D.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000435\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220c51564f-6c6e-45cc-adab-f15b6c831fce\u0022\u003ENow, I worry that that is something we don\u2019t need to say. It is something in the legislation that, particularly, points us to a fight that I\u2019m not sure we will necessarily win. I say that on the advice of the submitters to the select committee, including ASB, BNZ, Chapman Tripp, Corporate Taxpayers Group, New Zealand Bankers\u2019 Association, Russell McVeagh, Westpac, and Chartered Accountants Australia and New Zealand. They considered this a significant overreach in terms of what the powers are, or actually, more so, what is the reality of the situation. So I understand we\u2019re trying to be able to reach into other countries and other entities of multinationals, but, in May, the OECD published figures that show there are 2,700 bilateral relationships already, and that continues to grow.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000436\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220c51564f-6c6e-45cc-adab-f15b6c831fce\u0022\u003EMy point is that if we set amendments that are impossible to comply with and are not necessary, all we\u2019re doing is offering a chink, a bureaucratic nightmare\u2014or whatever word is you want to call it\u2014to something that may not need to be there and would need to be tested in law anyway. While I\u2019m not a lawyer\u2014and I freely admit that\u2014I do think taking on and telling a foreign country that this bill supersedes any other law related to that foreign country is a fight we might not want to have.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000437\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220c51564f-6c6e-45cc-adab-f15b6c831fce\u0022\u003ESo the Inland Revenue Department does not consider it\u2019s appropriate to allow multinational corporations to locate information overseas. I understand that, and I have some sympathy, actually, in our ability to go after multinationals. But I have put in a tabled amendment in my name which, specifically, seeks to remove the words \u201Cdisregarding any law of a foreign country relating to \u2026 secrecy of\u201D, in clause 50, new section 17(1CB). I do that because I think it\u2019s superfluous. If I\u2019m wrong, I\u2019d encourage the Minister to show us, in this Chamber, what value it would, in fact, add to this piece of legislation.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000438\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220c51564f-6c6e-45cc-adab-f15b6c831fce\u0022\u003EI\u2019m very supportive of this bill. It\u2019s been a steep learning curve, as I\u2019ve said, and I offer this point, in a way, to help future Parliaments and the New Zealand Government\u2014and the Inland Revenue Department, actually\u2014to make sure that we do not get caught up in some big multinational sort of activity and court case when, if you look at the OECD website that looks at this work, massive progress has been made. I suggest we keep going on that path rather than putting in what I regard as unnecessary, over-the-top sort of inflammatory comments in a clause, which I\u2019m not convinced can actually be enacted anyway.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000439\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220c51564f-6c6e-45cc-adab-f15b6c831fce\u0022\u003ESo I ask the Minister to take a call and, specifically, outline the reasons for that, and if he cannot, then I respectfully request that he consider my tabled amendment and make an amendment to this piece of legislation. Thank you.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022f7fc7ac3-5ce1-43ca-8cd6-dbb0941bf3ae\u0022 data-id=\u0022b3460804f65b414398a22347ea40c64b\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000440\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f7fc7ac3-5ce1-43ca-8cd6-dbb0941bf3ae\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022b3460804f65b414398a22347ea40c64b\u0022\u003EDr DUNCAN WEBB (Labour\u2014Christchurch Central):\u003C/span\u003E I move, That the question be now put.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002253f86481-33c1-48b2-893b-c11cc0bd673d\u0022 data-id=\u002265d99b57366d48c9a42e4080a6f8c02e\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000441\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002253f86481-33c1-48b2-893b-c11cc0bd673d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002265d99b57366d48c9a42e4080a6f8c02e\u0022\u003EHon PAUL GOLDSMITH (National):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you very much, Mr Chair. I wanted to focus a little bit on clause 52 and the country-by-country reports that are being requested. The idea here, of course, is to ensure that a New Zealand - headquartered multinational group with consolidated funds of \u20AC750 million in revenue for the previous year furnish the IRD with information on their global earnings. Now, it\u2019s interesting, actually, in the briefings, that it\u2019s been stated that this would apply to about 20 multinational groups. I\u2019m a little bit pleased and surprised to learn that there are 20 such companies of scale in New Zealand, and maybe there are more. That probably is a reflection of the robust health of the economy that we\u2019ve seen over the last nine years, and I do hope that that continues that way under this Government, where business confidence is falling.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000442\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002253f86481-33c1-48b2-893b-c11cc0bd673d\u0022\u003EI suppose the primary question I have to the Minister\u2014well, before I get to that, the point of this is that by requiring that these multinational companies give information about the gross revenues and profits, income tax paid, income tax accrued, stated capital, accumulated earnings, number of employees, and tangible assets in each of the countries in which they operate, the idea is that then the IRD will share that information with other nations, not so that they can do their tax assessment directly\u2014we\u2019re not asking for that level of detail\u2014but just to give them a broad idea so that they can have a clearer idea of the overall tax picture and make further inquiries if they need to in other countries.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000443\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002253f86481-33c1-48b2-893b-c11cc0bd673d\u0022\u003ESo the primary question I have for the Minister is: how confident is he that New Zealand will get useful information on the many hundreds of multinational companies based elsewhere in the world who have operations in New Zealand, so that the information that we receive will be useful in our collecting of tax by multinationals that are not based in New Zealand but operate in New Zealand? So that\u2019s the primary question: how confident are we that we will get useful information from other countries? I presume it\u2019s only a certain number of countries that have signed up to this and that that would be a moving feast. I\u2019d be keen to get an indication from the Minister as to what percentage of those companies, in terms of overall coverage, in terms of major companies operating in New Zealand which are subsidiaries of multinational companies in the rest of the world and that operate in New Zealand, will be covered by reciprocal relationships and reciprocal information that flows through this country-by-country reporting that we, obviously, expect other countries to be doing, as well as us. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000444\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002253f86481-33c1-48b2-893b-c11cc0bd673d\u0022\u003EI\u2019d be interested to know the projected time line, I suppose, as to when we think we will start to get that sort of useful information from other countries, because we\u2019re doing this. New Zealand has always been a good global citizen and been prepared to make our effort in order to ensure that there is good cross-country cooperation and understanding of how the taxation burden is met by multinational companies. So we\u2019re doing this and we\u2019re passing this law in the next few days, and it\u2019s been largely a bipartisan law because we are keen to make sure it works. What I\u2019m keen to understand is whether we are going to actually get useful information from other countries out of this that will help us; who they are; roughly, what the percentage of overall revenue for such companies will be covered by countries that are helping us in this area; and what the time frame is for our expected flow of information. I\u2019d be very interested to hear from the Minister and to get a sense of that.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022eaf79431-1033-44f1-a633-22633da52c0d\u0022 data-id=\u00223347e30b363c4763bb890f0ba25f68be\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000445\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022eaf79431-1033-44f1-a633-22633da52c0d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00223347e30b363c4763bb890f0ba25f68be\u0022\u003EHon DAVID BENNETT (National\u2014Hamilton East):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Mr Chair. I just want to take a call in regard to clause 38 of the bill, and that is in regard to the new section HD 30, and that\u2019s \u201CMembers of wholly-owned large multinational group\u201D. This clause had a number of submissions on it, from ASB, the Corporate Taxpayers Group, New Zealand Bankers\u2019 Association, PricewaterhouseCoopers\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000446\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a434482b-7ac1-4862-9ce7-13e63289dee3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022006cb148a5dc4646b31c201892a13553\u0022\u003ECHAIRPERSON (Adrian Rurawhe)\u003C/span\u003E: Order! Sorry to interrupt the member, but we are on Part 2, which is clauses 49 through to 53B.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000447\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022eaf79431-1033-44f1-a633-22633da52c0d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022713994303b884872b5040e248aae1e4d\u0022\u003EHon DAVID BENNETT\u003C/span\u003E: OK.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022f96cdca1-b63c-4602-b2b3-276f58ebb518\u0022 data-id=\u00226e2970289bb0461ab5c020ec199f3166\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000448\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f96cdca1-b63c-4602-b2b3-276f58ebb518\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00226e2970289bb0461ab5c020ec199f3166\u0022\u003ECHRIS PENK (National\u2014Helensville):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Mr Chair. It\u2019s with pleasure that I address Part 2 of the Taxation (Neutralising Base Erosion and Profit Shifting) Bill. Specifically, I wish to address clause 51 of the bill, which will insert new section 21BA into the parent Act.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000449\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f96cdca1-b63c-4602-b2b3-276f58ebb518\u0022\u003EI would like to outline the significance of this clause before I speak to some quite specific aspects of those provisions. The significance is really in the heavy powers that are going to be accorded to the commissioner in relation to requiring information from a large multinational group. In new section 21BA(1), we read, \u201CThis section applies if the Commissioner notifies\u201D\u2014noting that that\u2019s a unilateral instigation of a process, as reflected by the fact that there\u2019s an information demand and a requirement by the member to comply. So the language is very clearly setting out a situation in which the IRD, through its commissioner, has very large powers, and we don\u2019t need to think too long and hard about overseas jurisdictions in which tax departments\u2014or services, as they might be referred to in other countries\u2014have used their powers in a way in which the citizens of that country would surely not approve. I would not suggest for a moment, Mr Chair, or indeed to the Minister in the chair, Phil Twyford, or to anyone else listening, that our own revenue service would apply powers in an ultra vires way, but, nevertheless, it\u2019s important to bear that in mind when we consider exactly what powers we are going to give them to conduct lawfully in accordance with the statute book.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000450\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f96cdca1-b63c-4602-b2b3-276f58ebb518\u0022\u003ESo, specifically, then, in relation to new subsection (1)(c), a point has been highlighted in submissions to the Finance and Expenditure Committee\u2014and I note, in passing, that I was not a member of the select committee for very many of the times that the committee considered this bill. The phrase that has been met with some objection\u2014or at least some concern, perhaps it\u2019s not too far to say\u2014by the New Zealand Law Society is the one that states: \u201Cwhether or not in the knowledge, possession, or control of the member,\u201D. The significance of that is that information that must be provided, as required by the commissioner, is not excluded on the basis that the member doesn\u2019t have knowledge, possession, or control of that information. So that\u2019s a pretty high threshold. The suggestion of the New Zealand Law Society\u2014and it seems a sensible one to me, at least\u2014is some slight stepping back from that absolute strict liability requirement so that good-faith measures to hold, possess, or have such knowledge could be applied. Alternatively, we might consider wording such as \u201Cbest endeavours\u201D or another similar type of approach.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000451\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f96cdca1-b63c-4602-b2b3-276f58ebb518\u0022\u003EIn any case, bearing in mind that the onus is placed fairly and squarely on the taxpayer\u2014namely, the member as defined\u2014I think some slight mitigation of that pretty tough, stringent requirement could be in order. If the Minister is prepared to take a call to give some indication of whether he\u2019ll contemplate that, then I will draft a Supplementary Order Paper along those lines\u2014and I would be very happy to do so.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000452\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f96cdca1-b63c-4602-b2b3-276f58ebb518\u0022\u003EHeading to the next subsection, within that same section that I\u2019d like to address, subsection (3), I note that a submission was made along similar lines by various submitters\u2014but most compellingly, in my view, by PricewaterhouseCoopers\u2014that the provisions excluding evidence are \u201Ctoo harsh\u201D. Subsection (3) talks about a situation in which a member of a large multinational group might dispute a prosecution, imposition of a penalty, and so on, and, in doing so, the rules for the evidence being allowed or not, as then set out in subsection (4), are subject to a number of criteria. Each of those criteria is required in order for an exclusion to be set aside such that\u2014[Time expired]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022bbded2ec-ac25-4a73-a380-3f4d87693084\u0022 data-id=\u0022c296cd76196947d8ab8f925a1de89676\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000453\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bbded2ec-ac25-4a73-a380-3f4d87693084\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022c296cd76196947d8ab8f925a1de89676\u0022\u003EHon STUART NASH (Minister of Revenue):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you very much, Mr Chair. Let me answer some of the questions that have been asked and see where we end up. First of all, to the Hon Judith Collins, I just want to reiterate an answer I gave earlier. You were concerned that New Zealand lawyers, etc., would not advise multinationals or take on multinationals as clients for fear of being hit with a $100,000 fine if they did something wrong or something occurred outside of their knowledge. I\u2019m pleased to inform the member that, in fact, the civil penalties apply to members of large multinational groups, and it would not apply to their advisers. So, hopefully, that has answered that point.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000454\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bbded2ec-ac25-4a73-a380-3f4d87693084\u0022\u003ELawrence Yule brought up a point around secrecy. It is not an amendment that we can consider. In clause 50, there is reference to disregarding foreign secrecy laws, and this is consistent with existing information request provisions within the Tax Administration Act anyway. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000455\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bbded2ec-ac25-4a73-a380-3f4d87693084\u0022\u003EThe other thing I would also say is that most countries are repealing their secrecy laws to meet new standards for exchange of information. Keep it in mind we\u2019re not going this alone; this is OECD-led. Everyone\u2014every jurisdiction, every tax department\u2014wants multinationals to pay their fair share. Let me give an example\u2014and I know the committee was briefed on this\u2014of where we may need to do what we\u2019ve done in the bill. That is, for example, a tax haven\u2014not that many large multinationals use tax havens, of course\u2014may have a secrecy law that makes it illegal to provide certain information to a foreign Government. So that\u2019s the reason why we\u2019ve gone down that route. Most secrecy laws relate to bank secrecy, and so it would not prevent a multinational from providing IRD with information about their own tax position.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000456\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bbded2ec-ac25-4a73-a380-3f4d87693084\u0022\u003EThere is something I would like to say to Mr Penk, and that is: please do not compare New Zealand\u2019s IRD to other jurisdictions, certainly those that may be considered in not the same light as New Zealand. We are known globally\u2014we are renowned globally; we have a global reputation\u2014for a fantastic tax system. The integrity of our tax system is very, very highly valued, and there are two former Ministers of Revenue here who understand that, who worked hard on that. The thing I would say is that one of the reasons\u2014it\u2019s not the only reason, but one of the reasons\u2014is, obviously, a broad base - low rate but also the commissioner. The commissioner\u2014in this case, the current commissioner\u2014is a person of immense integrity, even though I am well aware that this bill will transcend her time\u2014I\u2019m assuming; who knows how long she will be there?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000457\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bbded2ec-ac25-4a73-a380-3f4d87693084\u0022\u003EThe thing about this bill\u2014and I talked about this a lot when I was in Opposition\u2014is there are the words \u201Cmay\u201D and \u201Cmust\u201D: when are we going to compel the commissioner to do this, or when is it up to the commissioner\u2019s discretion to do this? I\u2019m not prepared to accept an amendment that waters down the commissioner\u2019s ability to go hard against multinationals, for two reasons. Yes, you are dead right; the onus is always on the taxpayer to provide information to IRD. It doesn\u2019t matter if it\u2019s your money or a large multinational. If someone has that information or not, that is still up to the taxpayer to find that information and furnish that to the commissioner, keeping in mind the commissioner\u2014I sort of addressed this last week\u2014just doesn\u2019t have the time to go on fishing expeditions, and that would not enhance the integrity of our tax system in any way, shape, or form.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000458\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bbded2ec-ac25-4a73-a380-3f4d87693084\u0022\u003ESo what we are doing here is providing the commissioner powers to investigate or compel the taxpayer to provide information when there is evidence or when there is a very strong suspicion that, in fact, that taxpayer is not complying with the law. I think if we watered that down, then we would open a massive big loophole for a whole lot of corporate lawyers to march right on in and say, \u201CWell, the commissioner had to use their discretion. We don\u2019t know if the discretion was used appropriately.\u201D, etc., etc. So I think compelling the commissioner to do this is actually the right thing to do to maintain the integrity of the Act, as well as the tax system. Thank you.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022a8cab3e3-b023-4ce7-9f4b-2c4137029057\u0022 data-id=\u0022a97a70094d5b43d79b70587279fee914\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000459\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a8cab3e3-b023-4ce7-9f4b-2c4137029057\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022a97a70094d5b43d79b70587279fee914\u0022\u003EKIRITAPU ALLAN (Assistant Whip\u2014Labour):\u003C/span\u003E I move, That the question be now put.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca id=\u0022cfccfc64dd814d4da853cc70c4f879eb\u0022 name=\u0022division\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EA party vote was called for on the question, That the question be now put.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EAyes 63\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand Labour 46; New Zealand First 9; Green Party 8.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENoes 55\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand National 55.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EMotion agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000460\u0022\u003EThe question was put that the following amendment in the name of Lawrence Yule to clause 50 be agreed to:\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000461\u0022\u003Eamend new section 17(1CB) by deleting the words \u201Cdisregarding any law of a foreign country relating to the secrecy of information\u201D\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca id=\u0022f8b2fe0a6af54a31954262c9378e731b\u0022 name=\u0022division\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EA party vote was called for on the question, That the amendment be agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EAyes 55\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand National 55.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENoes 63\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand Labour 46; New Zealand First 9; Green Party 8.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EAmendment not agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000462\u0022\u003EPart 2 agreed to.\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000463\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u0022e15b00bc9845451e8622355069d00af6\u0022\u003ENew Part 3  Parameters of Review\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022a434482b-7ac1-4862-9ce7-13e63289dee3\u0022 data-id=\u00227e826aeb793b44e0809b7cdc94010260\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000464\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a434482b-7ac1-4862-9ce7-13e63289dee3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00227e826aeb793b44e0809b7cdc94010260\u0022\u003ECHAIRPERSON (Adrian Rurawhe)\u003C/span\u003E: I call Andrew Bayly.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022859e13f9-33bb-41bb-b2f0-d848eaf25407\u0022 data-id=\u00229ab7f6fbeef84e98ad8660395af35b9a\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000465\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022859e13f9-33bb-41bb-b2f0-d848eaf25407\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00229ab7f6fbeef84e98ad8660395af35b9a\u0022\u003EANDREW BAYLY (National\u2014Hunua):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you very much.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000466\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022f2fd94204647479ea50fe77e54961121\u0022\u003EHon Chris Hipkins\u003C/span\u003E: I raise a point of order, Mr Chairperson. I\u2019m sorry to interrupt Andrew Bayly. I do understand that he wants to speak on this. I would just like to point out to the committee that, if I don\u2019t do this next bit, if I don\u2019t get the call at this point, the House will not be able to end its urgency and question time will not be able to happen and the Treaty bill that we are going to be debating this afternoon will not be able to be debated. I\u2019m not attempting to stop him speaking on this. As soon as the committee resumes its debate on this bill, in normal sitting time, he, I\u2019m sure, will be seeking the call. I\u2019m asking his indulgence to give me the call so that we can end the urgency right now and then we can come back and Parliament can finish its regular business for the day.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000467\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022859e13f9-33bb-41bb-b2f0-d848eaf25407\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022ade607f6be564e4e948108d45ed9f8e7\u0022\u003EANDREW BAYLY\u003C/span\u003E: Give him the call.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022a434482b-7ac1-4862-9ce7-13e63289dee3\u0022 data-id=\u0022217a5807abd4497fb1e56d97e13dbc41\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000468\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a434482b-7ac1-4862-9ce7-13e63289dee3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022217a5807abd4497fb1e56d97e13dbc41\u0022\u003ECHAIRPERSON (Adrian Rurawhe)\u003C/span\u003E: The member has agreed. I call the Hon Chris Hipkins.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022 data-id=\u0022cc822a163e0947b0a6bb1c890b8b3125\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000469\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022cc822a163e0947b0a6bb1c890b8b3125\u0022\u003EHon CHRIS HIPKINS (Leader of the House):\u003C/span\u003E I move, That the committee report progress on the Taxation (Neutralising Base Erosion and Profit Shifting) Bill.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022c83012b4-3939-4753-80fc-1956a3e2bd1e\u0022 data-id=\u002220f18abb837c48cbb72004076a01d2a7\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000470\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c83012b4-3939-4753-80fc-1956a3e2bd1e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002220f18abb837c48cbb72004076a01d2a7\u0022\u003EHon MICHAEL WOODHOUSE (National):\u003C/span\u003E I raise a point of order, Mr Chairperson. Before that\u2019s voted on, may I raise a point of order, because we\u2019re in the committee; otherwise we\u2019ll be out. I just want to clarify that Mr Bayly\u2019s successful seeking of the call wouldn\u2019t constitute one of his speeches in the committee stage.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000471\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a434482b-7ac1-4862-9ce7-13e63289dee3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a9a8c8dd5e0b4b63b13fd65287394a43\u0022\u003ECHAIRPERSON (Adrian Rurawhe)\u003C/span\u003E: I think that just to be on the safe side\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000472\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c83012b4-3939-4753-80fc-1956a3e2bd1e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00228fb49b8369cb45a2bb3a20b621841707\u0022\u003EHon MICHAEL WOODHOUSE\u003C/span\u003E: In that case, I seek leave for the call not to be counted for the purpose of the committee stage count.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000473\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a434482b-7ac1-4862-9ce7-13e63289dee3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002208e54f44eb304b2faf7c53edb30d3c91\u0022\u003ECHAIRPERSON (Adrian Rurawhe)\u003C/span\u003E: Leave is sought for that purpose. Is there any objection? There appears to be none.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000474\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a434482b-7ac1-4862-9ce7-13e63289dee3\u0022\u003EMotion agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000475\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a434482b-7ac1-4862-9ce7-13e63289dee3\u0022\u003EHouse resumed.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000476\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a434482b-7ac1-4862-9ce7-13e63289dee3\u0022\u003EThe Chairperson reported the Land Transport Management (Regional Fuel Tax) Amendment Bill with amendment, and progress on the Taxation (Neutralising Base Erosion and Profit Shifting) Bill.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000477\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a434482b-7ac1-4862-9ce7-13e63289dee3\u0022\u003EReport adopted.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20180620096b26448f82497e8183059e75f5ac94000478\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a434482b-7ac1-4862-9ce7-13e63289dee3\u0022\u003EThe House adjourned at 12.51 p.m. (Thursday)\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n    \u003C/div\u003E\n  \u003C/body\u003E\n\u003C/html\u003E"