"\u003C!DOCTYPE html\u003E\u003Chtml xmlns:xlink=\u0022http://www.w3.org/1999/xlink\u0022 xmlns:xsi=\u0022http://www.w3.org/2007/XMLSchema-instance\u0022 xmlns:mml=\u0022http://www.w3.org/1998/Math/MathML\u0022\u003E\n  \u003Chead\u003E\n    \u003CMETA http-equiv=\u0022Content-Type\u0022 content=\u0022text/html; charset=utf-16\u0022\u003E\n    \u003Cmeta name=\u0022viewport\u0022 content=\u0022width=device-width, initial-scale=1\u0022\u003E\n  \u003C/head\u003E\n  \u003Cbody style=\u0022font-family:sans-serif; font-size:100%;\u0022\u003E\n    \u003Cdiv class=\u0022HpsHansard\u0022\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000001\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsProceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u002209314215cd4a41f6a714bb670ab66cc4\u0022\u003ETHURSDAY, 30 APRIL 2020\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000003\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u00226bc43419eb7244f78dcda07e167f16d1\u0022\u003ETHURSDAY, 30 APRIL 2020\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000002\u0022\u003EThe Speaker took the Chair at 2 p.m.\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000004\u0022\u003EKarakia.\u003C/p\u003E\n    \u003C/div\u003E\n    \u003Cdiv class=\u0022HpsHansard\u0022\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000005\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsProceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u0022dfbbbd6a70a04222b16776b48ab49a10\u0022\u003EBusiness Statement\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000007\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u0022cddd40ee90524cc18efe9de247649e77\u0022\u003EBusiness Statement\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022 data-id=\u0022248d5f56f4bc41ffa4663375e4c3b17f\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000006\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022248d5f56f4bc41ffa4663375e4c3b17f\u0022\u003EHon CHRIS HIPKINS (Leader of the House):\u003C/span\u003E Next week, the House will continue to sit in a fashion that\u2019s consistent with the country being at COVID-19 alert level 3. The Government has undertaken not to advance most aspects of its normal legislative programme at this time. The House will consider legislation relating to COVID-19, including the COVID-19 Response (Further Management Measures) Amendment Bill, which will receive its first reading. There are likely to be other bills on immigration and remuneration. The annual review debate will continue, examining portfolios including foreign affairs, education, and others to be agreed between the parties.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022 data-id=\u0022262208241fed4dfb879b256d0531c490\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000008\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022262208241fed4dfb879b256d0531c490\u0022\u003EHon GERRY BROWNLEE (National\u2014Ilam):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you for the outline of the business under our different arrangements next week. Look, is there a chance that those bills would be available to the Opposition a little sooner than the bills that we\u2019re dealing with this afternoon, which have only become available this morning? We are using processes that now allow the law to reflect the support that\u2019s required for New Zealanders relating to this, but I think it would be valuable and part of good order if we could see those bills a little sooner than was the case today.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022 data-id=\u00228bb1156fb36c433db1af2cc2d341f837\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000009\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00228bb1156fb36c433db1af2cc2d341f837\u0022\u003EHon CHRIS HIPKINS (Leader of the House):\u003C/span\u003E The biggest constraint that we have is just the speed of drafting of the legislation, but, as we did with the bill today, whilst I was unable to get the bill to the Opposition earlier, I was able to get them a summary, and I\u2019m certainly happy to provide the Opposition, hopefully this afternoon, with a summary of the likely content of those bills even if I can\u2019t give them the exact bills.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n    \u003C/div\u003E\n    \u003Cdiv class=\u0022HpsHansard\u0022\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000010\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsProceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u00223569f46e9b5a4e229889befeaeb21c36\u0022\u003EClimate Change Response (Emissions Trading Reform) Amendment Bill\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000011\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u002240f7bf31c3664aaab5aa22927b275ad9\u0022\u003EInstruction to Environment Committee\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022 data-id=\u002204bc1229e30b44f5b8e04ab0ebabc24c\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000012\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002204bc1229e30b44f5b8e04ab0ebabc24c\u0022\u003EHon CHRIS HIPKINS (Leader of the House):\u003C/span\u003E I seek leave for the date by which the Environment Committee must finally report back to the House on the Climate Change Response (Emissions Trading Reform) Amendment Bill to be extended from 1\u00A0May 2020 to 4 May 2020.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022 data-id=\u00224072675b6b0543ffa87f97c3f350be34\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000013\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00224072675b6b0543ffa87f97c3f350be34\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Leave has been sought for that course of action. Is there any objection? There is none.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n    \u003C/div\u003E\n    \u003Cdiv class=\u0022HpsHansard\u0022\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000014\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsProceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u002297717eca229b4f4aa33eab2bfa598547\u0022\u003EStanding Orders\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000015\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u0022ce31ca176e4248559eac7112536888bc\u0022\u003ESessional\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022 data-id=\u0022bcd50d37758148dca25c2db9f9b5f7c8\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000016\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022bcd50d37758148dca25c2db9f9b5f7c8\u0022\u003EHon CHRIS HIPKINS (Leader of the House):\u003C/span\u003E I seek leave to amend the sessional order adopted by the House on 25 March so that the cessation date specified in rule 3 is extended from 28 April 2020 to 4 June 2020. To explain the effect of this, it continues the practice that we made in the last sitting block, extending the deadlines for replies to written questions and responses to select committee reports. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022 data-id=\u00224674d79eeafa43f5b97bb0713df8f203\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000017\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00224674d79eeafa43f5b97bb0713df8f203\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Is there any objection to that course of action being followed? There is none.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n    \u003C/div\u003E\n    \u003Cdiv class=\u0022HpsHansard\u0022\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000018\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsProceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u0022a3ba3a1010dc4042a35523f04d2ab7d2\u0022\u003EOral Questions\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000019\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u0022b5d57bb4f83547c89fad70c7242350f2\u0022\u003EQuestions to Ministers\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000020\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u0022fc615ca4a9ab47bd919a084c6c18e524\u0022\u003EQuestion No. 1\u2014Prime Minister\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022badb0a39-849c-462a-b32f-77fc017c9fc2\u0022 data-id=\u0022c07970c3f4b6407c8a5ab42d1f00f3d7\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000021\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022badb0a39-849c-462a-b32f-77fc017c9fc2\u0022\u003E1. \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022c07970c3f4b6407c8a5ab42d1f00f3d7\u0022\u003EHon SIMON BRIDGES (Leader of the Opposition)\u003C/span\u003E to the Prime Minister: Does she stand by all her Government\u2019s statements and actions?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022 data-id=\u00220a88705bc5e34d32aff9014bdd2cced1\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000022\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00220a88705bc5e34d32aff9014bdd2cced1\u0022\u003ERt Hon JACINDA ARDERN (Prime Minister):\u003C/span\u003E Yes, particularly in regard to the way this Government has responded promptly to the challenges presented through COVID-19, whether it\u2019s the work that\u2019s going through the House today to give roughly $3 billion worth of tax refunds back to business, particularly small businesses, to support them, or it\u2019s our mental health response, where we\u2019ve supported and funded apps and other mechanisms like telehealth services that are available through isolation. We have looked at, and responded quickly to, every element of pain that COVID-19 has caused New Zealand.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000023\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022badb0a39-849c-462a-b32f-77fc017c9fc2\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022525febbe7779427a9900945d5692588c\u0022\u003EHon Simon Bridges\u003C/span\u003E: Does she accept that every day New Zealand remains in level 3 means more businesses failing and more jobs lost?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000024\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022acaff9489c1f4d0a9f0843e88687c709\u0022\u003ERt Hon JACINDA ARDERN\u003C/span\u003E: I accept that any day that we move prematurely into a different alert level poses a risk to New Zealand\u2019s economy and a risk to New Zealanders\u2019 health.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000025\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022badb0a39-849c-462a-b32f-77fc017c9fc2\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00221752f1182e034fefb188e02e6d4a91cf\u0022\u003EHon Simon Bridges\u003C/span\u003E: Quite the reverse.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000026\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022ed6f93b7969546dba60216c56f1b9d77\u0022\u003ERt Hon JACINDA ARDERN\u003C/span\u003E: If we move too soon\u2014and this is supported by Treasury\u2014we risk yo-yoing between levels, and that would be damaging to our economy and to our people. I had a conversation just today with Prime Minister Scott Morrison. We talked about that exact thing\u2014the need for all of us to move with caution.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000027\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022badb0a39-849c-462a-b32f-77fc017c9fc2\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002213e28ebd473a41c9b0196daee79df03e\u0022\u003EHon Simon Bridges\u003C/span\u003E: Does she agree with Prime Minister Scott Morrison, who, in the last 24 hours, has stated that he sees New Zealand\u2019s approach as involving \u201Cmuch more extreme economic measures\u201D and that\u2019s why he\u2019s not going to do that?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000028\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00225ff739675ddf4244b00ba85679f633d8\u0022\u003ERt Hon JACINDA ARDERN\u003C/span\u003E: Two points to make: actually, where we are now, there are some real similarities in the levels that we are at now. Second point: New Zealand has always responded to what is happening here with our population and our cases, and that hasn\u2019t been comparable at those times with Australia. And, thirdly, Prime Minister Morrison often has had to give those responses because people have compared the results in New Zealand and Australia, often favourably around the approach that New Zealand has taken.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000029\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022001e7653ce4b426f8d4359dc2a6f8a2f\u0022\u003ERt Hon Winston Peters\u003C/span\u003E: Can I ask the Prime Minister, as a matter of policy formation, what intellectual credibility would she give to the view that you can smash the curve whilst leaving businesses unaffected?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000030\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00225b41a5966188421f9e0e4afff31f4f25\u0022\u003ERt Hon JACINDA ARDERN\u003C/span\u003E: I think you can see around the world that there are economic impacts to successfully taking on COVID-19\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000031\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022badb0a39-849c-462a-b32f-77fc017c9fc2\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022e4a0ab8969cf4e4da4e390642c75d117\u0022\u003EHon Simon Bridges\u003C/span\u003E: Nobody said that.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000032\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c0f78f60-c2fd-46f4-8138-72f39692fc20\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00226f760278ba7140b08453d5a42dca064a\u0022\u003EHon Todd McClay\u003C/span\u003E: Who said that? Whose view is that?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000033\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022faa1c60e80a343968cac0624e8693e9b\u0022\u003ERt Hon Winston Peters\u003C/span\u003E: What a hypocrite.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000034\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002201075fd4ff8843dd9a67ef5a34378d5a\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Order! No. The right honourable gentleman knows that that expression should not be levelled at any other member. He will withdraw and apologise.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000035\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a8e6f43b7ab9439db8c7c97ead7e7f2e\u0022\u003ERt Hon Winston Peters\u003C/span\u003E: I withdraw and apologise.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000036\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022c955c412c3034a24bd3cbbdd643e3cb0\u0022\u003ERt Hon JACINDA ARDERN\u003C/span\u003E: We can see around the world there are economic consequences to an effective response to COVID-19, but there are also economic consequences if you don\u2019t get it right. You stay in lockdown for longer; the impact on business and jobs is much harsher. Our approach has always been: go hard, go early, get it right the first time. The other thing is I\u2019ve seen the commentary from the likes of Sir Peter Gluckman at the Epidemic Response Committee today. He shared the exact same cautious approach that we have been taking. No one wants to risk the gains that we have made. No one wants a second wave of infection.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000037\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022badb0a39-849c-462a-b32f-77fc017c9fc2\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022e2b5f2c2c5734d828472af494f8b9101\u0022\u003EHon Simon Bridges\u003C/span\u003E: Does she agree that New Zealand has taken a more extreme approach economically than Australia?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000038\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00222fff05bee4bf4ab28934a529b6337a54\u0022\u003ERt Hon JACINDA ARDERN\u003C/span\u003E: Again, I\u2019ve challenged the characterisation that the member\u2019s made at different times of Australia and New Zealand in the House. But I\u2019ve also pointed out that we have had a different experience of COVID-19 in New Zealand, and we have a different population. I would have thought the member would like us to follow our own path on behalf of our own people rather than just replicating what others have done, because it hasn\u2019t necessarily been a successful template in all parts of the world. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000039\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022badb0a39-849c-462a-b32f-77fc017c9fc2\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00220d57b84186824a5ca8e7de9bf162823f\u0022\u003EHon Simon Bridges\u003C/span\u003E: Why does she keep telling us she\u2019s the best in the world?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000040\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00221a3712a90c214631a0bd7120f525b2f7\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Order! Order! She\u2019s the cat\u2019s mother. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000041\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022badb0a39-849c-462a-b32f-77fc017c9fc2\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022e910077910f147b2af757cbe4429dee3\u0022\u003EHon Simon Bridges\u003C/span\u003E: Why doesn\u2019t Cabinet continuously review the need to remain in level 3 instead of arbitrarily waiting two weeks to make the decision?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000042\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00227076143cd0a9482fa618b2c92b32240e\u0022\u003ERt Hon JACINDA ARDERN\u003C/span\u003E: Because, as epidemiologists and scientists and health professionals have continually told us, there are cycles of infection\u2014that if you don\u2019t allow a cycle of infection, then you\u2019re less likely to see whether or not you still have transmission of COVID-19 and whether or not we can safely move. I do want to give some caution to the member opposite. He was the one, when we went into lockdown level 4, that agreed we would not want to move at a pace that would mean that we would damage New Zealand\u2019s health and economy. He appears now to be advocating that we move with haste. No one in the world at the moment is risking their economy or health by moving more rapidly than the science or the evidence or the officials suggest.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000043\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022badb0a39-849c-462a-b32f-77fc017c9fc2\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002283ffaf94400f4f4aa5e6d905fb8be53d\u0022\u003EHon Simon Bridges\u003C/span\u003E: What did she say to the 160 workers at Farmers who today have been made redundant because her Government has shut their stores down for at least seven weeks?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000044\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00227d803d4d54bb427b921f9f58234edb82\u0022\u003ERt Hon JACINDA ARDERN\u003C/span\u003E: I would say to any worker who is affected currently by COVID-19 that, first, we\u2019ve put in place $10 billion worth of support so far to try and keep those workers in their jobs. Secondly, the approach we\u2019ve taken has always been to speed up the opportunity for us to reopen the economy as soon as possible. But the third point is I will not risk their health\u2014I will not risk their family\u2019s health\u2014by moving before we are sure that we can confidently do so.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000045\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022badb0a39-849c-462a-b32f-77fc017c9fc2\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00221eb6f1ea9ccb4eba89073b9ff1ec70d0\u0022\u003EHon Simon Bridges\u003C/span\u003E: What does she say to the managing director of Farmers, David Norman, who says the longer the New Zealand stores are locked down, the more job losses there will be?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000046\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022c86ccfa5ab7e4b5ebe43d793a967cbcf\u0022\u003ERt Hon JACINDA ARDERN\u003C/span\u003E: All the way along, we have known and appreciated the huge impact of an effective response to COVID-19. That\u2019s why we\u2019ve never wanted to be in lockdown longer than we needed to. It\u2019s also why we put in place a 12-week wage subsidy that is worth over $10 billion to support employers, large and small, to keep their employees connected to their work. And our hope is that if we continue to see success, we will be able to move through the alert levels and get people back into work. Seventy-five percent of economic activity has returned now, though.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000047\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022c1a0413d52bf40a08f0a39119e62da5a\u0022\u003EDavid Seymour\u003C/span\u003E: Can the Prime Minister tell the House succinctly how her Government will balance health and economic considerations in the decision to move from level 3 to level 2, and when?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000048\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002275c9a89feda741fb9aa50db7364eb85f\u0022\u003ERt Hon JACINDA ARDERN\u003C/span\u003E: The economic goal has to be reducing as much as possible the amount of time spent in the most restricted levels. The best way to do that is to ensure that you have confidence in your health response, that you do not have community transmission, and that you do not risk yo-yoing back from one level to another. Treasury scenarios demonstrate to us the economic impact of doing that, which is why they supported the decision that we made to have an extra few days at level 4, as we did, to try and lock in the gains that we have made.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000049\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022badb0a39-849c-462a-b32f-77fc017c9fc2\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002250f4f1fe40da4c71b564b4091ccfdfc4\u0022\u003EHon Simon Bridges\u003C/span\u003E: Isn\u2019t it entirely misleading to say that 75 percent of economic activity is up and running, when even Treasury acknowledges that\u2019s not so\u2014that it\u2019s theoretical\u2014and the reality of that, productively, will be much lower?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000050\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022aa4f93fdfb88407d851a402c7e4eb9e8\u0022\u003ERt Hon JACINDA ARDERN\u003C/span\u003E: That\u2019s Treasury\u2019s estimate. If you wish to challenge that, I suggest you do that directly with Treasury.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000051\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022badb0a39-849c-462a-b32f-77fc017c9fc2\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022ba1476bdb38d4ad3b7b342be0505c5a2\u0022\u003EHon Simon Bridges\u003C/span\u003E: Why does she think the Farmers stores in Australia are able to remain open for longer and will be able to open again this week, meaning there will be fewer job losses in Australia than New Zealand?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000052\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022635b2c7abba94898be06e5eaaeb19d5e\u0022\u003ERt Hon JACINDA ARDERN\u003C/span\u003E: I do think it\u2019s too soon to make any comparisons around the relative impact of the difference between, indeed, State approaches, let alone the approach of Australia versus New Zealand as a whole. I think we should allow New Zealand and Australia to let this run its course, and see then the full economic and health impacts. But I don\u2019t apologise for taking an approach that\u2019s specific to New Zealand, to the cases we had here, and to our own population.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000053\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00227532141d236349d1ab999a8da6ea285d\u0022\u003EHon Grant Robertson\u003C/span\u003E: In light of that last supplementary question, can the Prime Minister confirm reports in the Australian media that as at 17 April, only an extra 1.7 percent of workers had gone on to New Zealand\u2019s job seeker benefit, while in Australia the number was 3.8 percent?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000054\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002248af0d5a01854e40885d00c087bfe071\u0022\u003ERt Hon JACINDA ARDERN\u003C/span\u003E: I can confirm that, which is why I do believe it\u2019s important that we allow a bit more time before we start making any crude comparisons like that. I don\u2019t think it\u2019s helpful, necessarily, for the member opposite to be talking down the work that we are all doing to try and gear ourselves back up as quickly and safely as possible.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000055\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022badb0a39-849c-462a-b32f-77fc017c9fc2\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00221c42d6ddaca7494aae8ae875290892cd\u0022\u003EHon Simon Bridges\u003C/span\u003E: What does she say to the man from Lower Hutt who messaged me last night saying, \u201CI\u2019m now on the wage subsidy, which came to $420 in the hand a week. We have a mortgage and six children. I was earning over 50k in an industry which I\u2019ve been in for 25 years. Tonight we fed our children a pumpkin for dinner. Power bill, mortgage, insurance, school fees\u2014and it\u2019s gone. Tomorrow we\u2019re having porridge for dinner. When can we get back to level 2 so we can get back to earning our salaries?\u201D?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000056\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022e80f40d64fba4cf0b72010701d0ccef5\u0022\u003ERt Hon JACINDA ARDERN\u003C/span\u003E: Obviously, that is an employee who very unfortunately is either working in retail or hospitality areas where there is high risk still. What we want to do is make sure that when we\u2019re in a position to open up those parts of the economy, we can do it for good and we don\u2019t keep yo-yoing between the different levels. If that is an individual where we can provide any additional support through our social services, I would really encourage him to make sure that they are in touch with their relevant MP to make sure that they are getting all that they are entitled to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000057\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u00228ba095421c954327b72da7868a01e909\u0022\u003EQuestion No. 2\u2014Education\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022a8cab3e3-b023-4ce7-9f4b-2c4137029057\u0022 data-id=\u0022ea7724eb0c374bd7adf0df8a79da5ede\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000058\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a8cab3e3-b023-4ce7-9f4b-2c4137029057\u0022\u003E2. \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022ea7724eb0c374bd7adf0df8a79da5ede\u0022\u003EKIRITAPU ALLAN (Labour)\u003C/span\u003E to the Minister of Education: What steps is the Government taking to bring forward education infrastructure projects to help stimulate regional economies?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022 data-id=\u00222aefe66b360a48a3b84a5b2c511534b2\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000059\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00222aefe66b360a48a3b84a5b2c511534b2\u0022\u003EHon CHRIS HIPKINS (Minister of Education):\u003C/span\u003E Today, the Government announced upgrades for a further 600 small or remote State schools and kura. This is an additional $160 million property improvement programme that will begin rolling out this year. The upgrades include the installation of LED lights, acoustic panelling, ceiling insulation, and other things in our small and remote schools. We want students to be learning in warm classrooms, we want teachers to have workplaces where the noise levels are more controllable, and we want schools to be able to save on their power bills so that they can invest in learning. So this initiative is part of the Government\u2019s programme to bring forward infrastructure projects to create and support jobs for businesses and reboot our local economies. The list of schools who will benefit from the programme will be announced by the Ministry of Education on their website this week, and every school on the list will also be contacted.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000060\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a5f0fe84-01e8-4eb3-a590-0025017c4243\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022f0fcae0ebf8a423ba63131486387a129\u0022\u003EMarama Davidson\u003C/span\u003E: How many schools will benefit from the first wave of the Sustainability Contestable Fund?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000061\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00222ccd9bfeadf8412f8248e068d29630d1\u0022\u003EHon CHRIS HIPKINS\u003C/span\u003E: Very good news\u2014today, the Government has announced that 53 schools have been successful in the first wave of the sustainability fund, with $2.5 million being spent on projects that will help them save money and reduce emissions. Nearly half of the 53 approved applications were for solar panels on schools. Other projects include things like rainwater collection, water conservation initiatives, and different ways to compost and recycle. The sustainability fund will open again for a second round of applications on 22 June, where a further $2.5 million will be allocated to further sustainability projects in schools.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000062\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a8cab3e3-b023-4ce7-9f4b-2c4137029057\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00227fd5e4bfe390414882bb409c6aa3a6e4\u0022\u003EKiritapu Allan\u003C/span\u003E: What construction is resuming in schools across the country over the next few days?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000063\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002238fe286948c44c78b2b582efbc418083\u0022\u003EHon CHRIS HIPKINS\u003C/span\u003E: Now that we\u2019re in alert level 3, construction work will be restarting this week in almost 250 schools around the country. As well as this, construction will start on another $100 million worth of school property projects. These include things like the major redevelopment to address weathertightness and other building issues at Flaxmere College in Hastings; six new roll-growth classrooms each at Clendon Park School and Rowandale School in Manurewa; replacing fire-damaged buildings at Westland High School; a new 10-classroom block at Beachlands School in Hunua; the rebuild of Banks Avenue School in Christchurch; and the redevelopment of Hagley College in Christchurch, Maniototo Area School in Ranfurly, and Ngaruawahia High School.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000064\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a8cab3e3-b023-4ce7-9f4b-2c4137029057\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00225c9ccb7f443940f8bbc0c258f3fce49e\u0022\u003EKiritapu Allan\u003C/span\u003E: What support is the Government giving the construction industry on existing school property projects after we went into level 4?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000065\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002234a3692ab37d422ea55048a00ab89744\u0022\u003EHon CHRIS HIPKINS\u003C/span\u003E: The Government acknowledges the difficulty some building and construction players experienced during the COVID level 4 lockdown. The Ministry of Education is temporarily lifting its retention requirements, which releases an extra $23 million earlier in the process to help relieve some of the financial strain construction firms are under. The release will cover 246 projects at 237 schools across the country and will help to ease the cash flow and go some way to reducing the impact of the lockdown on those firms.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000066\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u0022175d999a7e4442d8a1ad62d93987717e\u0022\u003EQuestion No. 3\u2014Finance\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002253f86481-33c1-48b2-893b-c11cc0bd673d\u0022 data-id=\u002258573fb1135645c69fe5cc98e5e8ffb1\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000067\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002253f86481-33c1-48b2-893b-c11cc0bd673d\u0022\u003E3. \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002258573fb1135645c69fe5cc98e5e8ffb1\u0022\u003EHon PAUL GOLDSMITH (National)\u003C/span\u003E to the Minister of Finance: What lessons for the New Zealand economy, if any, has he taken from the Australian response to COVID-19?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022 data-id=\u0022e8777ffbbe834dfab35209cd70f60ad2\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000068\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022e8777ffbbe834dfab35209cd70f60ad2\u0022\u003EHon GRANT ROBERTSON (Minister of Finance):\u003C/span\u003E It is too early to draw definitive lessons from the economy from either New Zealand or Australia\u2019s response to COVID-19. What we can say is that both countries have done a good job of getting the virus under control, which gives both countries the best possible chance for their economies to recover.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000069\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002253f86481-33c1-48b2-893b-c11cc0bd673d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00227bdc403b00d6411db4df54208158a740\u0022\u003EHon Paul Goldsmith\u003C/span\u003E: Does he accept that one of the key lessons from Australia\u2019s approach is that effective contact tracing allows more of the economy to safely open up more quickly, thereby saving jobs.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000070\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002276bb1d0c6ea94625a395c03d025de86c\u0022\u003EHon GRANT ROBERTSON\u003C/span\u003E: I think both sides of the Tasman would agree that contact tracing is a very important part of the response to COVID-19. It\u2019s certainly a significant one that we\u2019ve been discussing in this House this week, so it is an important part of the overall response.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000071\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002253f86481-33c1-48b2-893b-c11cc0bd673d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00227b57b406018f4a05a62a740c38ebc9e0\u0022\u003EHon Paul Goldsmith\u003C/span\u003E: Why is a contact tracing app taking so long to develop here?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000072\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022c119fa1d8a974f908959a7d6271e59f9\u0022\u003EHon GRANT ROBERTSON\u003C/span\u003E: The member, if he has questions about the contact tracing app, is better off directing those to the Minister of Health, because the Ministry of Health has been responsible for that. We have made significant improvements and strides in our contact tracing over the last little while, and that will continue, but, for detailed matters on that, the member needs to ask the responsible Minister.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000073\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00220ac35ae3713e410996ba6894d41e9c20\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: I probably should have ruled it out.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000074\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002253f86481-33c1-48b2-893b-c11cc0bd673d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002202c104544eaf448aababc9c657f2492c\u0022\u003EHon Paul Goldsmith\u003C/span\u003E: Does he agree with Prime Minister of Australia Scott Morrison\u2019s assessment that New Zealand has imposed \u201Cmore extreme economic measures\u201D? \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000075\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022db057f5cbe194ef2a700b8579e5ad085\u0022\u003EHon GRANT ROBERTSON\u003C/span\u003E: What New Zealand has done is put in place a regime that is appropriate for our country, and I am particularly proud of the response of New Zealanders in general in keeping this virus under control. I think we should focus on what we can do for our people here.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000076\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002253f86481-33c1-48b2-893b-c11cc0bd673d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022222ebe5f524346a49eee168627a68a11\u0022\u003EHon Paul Goldsmith\u003C/span\u003E: Could he just explain why we are so different to Australians?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000077\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022d79a768836b946d3aba688dc559f390d\u0022\u003EHon GRANT ROBERTSON\u003C/span\u003E: Mr Speaker, I don\u2019t quite know where to start that. Size would be one place\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000078\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022b6f82b334cac4231b34dce27b3ee23ff\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: It could be a thesis, couldn\u2019t it, really?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000079\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022db89adb24e654c05a44acc2427cb6eeb\u0022\u003EHon GRANT ROBERTSON\u003C/span\u003E: Size is one place to start. But also, as the Prime Minister has just said, the fact is that New Zealand has our own unique population of people with a unique set of circumstances in the way that we live and who we are, and we have taken decisions that are appropriate for us. I would note that, for example, what New Zealand has done is front-loaded the fiscal stimulus and the fiscal response that we\u2019ve done. So I think in the financial year that we\u2019re in now, around 70 percent of New Zealand\u2019s response will be spent, whereas in Australia it\u2019s around 33 percent. So we\u2019re making sure that, actually, we\u2019re getting money into the pockets of New Zealanders. The Australian JobKeeper programme has not put any money yet into the pockets of Australians; we have $10.6 billion in the pockets of New Zealanders.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000080\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u0022d038f7a1184d49499dd35a81b5cae71f\u0022\u003EQuestion No. 4\u2014Health\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022c83012b4-3939-4753-80fc-1956a3e2bd1e\u0022 data-id=\u0022ebaebe6773d244858289ffdd8abef679\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000081\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c83012b4-3939-4753-80fc-1956a3e2bd1e\u0022\u003E4. \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022ebaebe6773d244858289ffdd8abef679\u0022\u003EHon MICHAEL WOODHOUSE (National)\u003C/span\u003E to the Minister of Health: Does he agree with statements made by Professor Des Gorman to the Epidemic Response Committee yesterday and, if not, what comments from Professor Gorman does he disagree with?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00225bbd9f26-fdb0-4b85-a836-0fc46e1bba3c\u0022 data-id=\u0022e1e20f5bded543c28eb9f0990d4a2d6c\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000082\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225bbd9f26-fdb0-4b85-a836-0fc46e1bba3c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022e1e20f5bded543c28eb9f0990d4a2d6c\u0022\u003EHon Dr DAVID CLARK (Minister of Health):\u003C/span\u003E As the member will understand, as I\u2019m not a member of the committee, I did not see Professor Gorman\u2019s submission. I have seen reports of what he said, though\u2014some of which I agree with, such as his comment that there had been chronic under-investment in public health. I disagree with his view that we were \u201Cspectacularly complacent\u201D. The Government and New Zealanders have taken this pandemic incredibly seriously. We have gone hard and early, and we have collectively managed to stop community transfer of COVID-19, for now.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000083\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c83012b4-3939-4753-80fc-1956a3e2bd1e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00221cc685425e514fd9a205850fe408bbf8\u0022\u003EHon Michael Woodhouse\u003C/span\u003E: Would he agree with Professor Gorman regarding border closure that \u201Cwe went early but soft.\u201D?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000084\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225bbd9f26-fdb0-4b85-a836-0fc46e1bba3c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00222be1256c009b47b292c5ffb38f0ba00b\u0022\u003EHon Dr DAVID CLARK\u003C/span\u003E: No. New Zealand took early action at the border, starting on 3 February with restrictions on travel from China. At every step, we took into consideration the best available scientific and health advice. It simply would not have been possible to introduce quarantine for all New Zealanders returning to the country in mid-February; there are not enough hotel rooms in the whole country to handle the volume of people that were returning. Our approach has worked, and I think the results speak for themselves.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000085\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c83012b4-3939-4753-80fc-1956a3e2bd1e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00223dd044f0332944058d805ca85599ea2e\u0022\u003EHon Michael Woodhouse\u003C/span\u003E: Is Professor Gorman\u2019s assertion that the current alert level is due \u201Cto a lack of confidence in either community surveillance, contact tracing, or isolation capacity\u201D correct, and, if so, which one does he lack confidence in?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000086\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225bbd9f26-fdb0-4b85-a836-0fc46e1bba3c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022ef7262389aba448a85349eb4b62e1f86\u0022\u003EHon Dr DAVID CLARK\u003C/span\u003E: Could the member please repeat the question.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000087\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c83012b4-3939-4753-80fc-1956a3e2bd1e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00225053532afa64484a831bab842132b0fc\u0022\u003EHon Michael Woodhouse\u003C/span\u003E: Is Professor Gorman\u2019s assertion that we are currently in level 3 because of \u201Ca lack of confidence in either community surveillance, contact tracing, or isolation capacity\u201D correct, and, if so, which one does he lack confidence in?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000088\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225bbd9f26-fdb0-4b85-a836-0fc46e1bba3c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022e84500c3241a450592433bc24093bc7f\u0022\u003EHon Dr DAVID CLARK\u003C/span\u003E: No.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000089\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c83012b4-3939-4753-80fc-1956a3e2bd1e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00225fee93588a064688bc400607ef3938f6\u0022\u003EHon Michael Woodhouse\u003C/span\u003E: Does he agree with Professor Gorman that the three-day close-contact target should be 100 percent and not 80 percent?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000090\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225bbd9f26-fdb0-4b85-a836-0fc46e1bba3c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00220181b02551bd4b8b8ecdd7064dc21ef7\u0022\u003EHon Dr DAVID CLARK\u003C/span\u003E: I\u2019m not quite sure that that is accurate. We are tracking our close contacts very successfully, currently, and I think Dr Verrall has made the right recommendations.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000091\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c83012b4-3939-4753-80fc-1956a3e2bd1e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002299fe426005cc4cc789357e4b1086bf01\u0022\u003EHon Michael Woodhouse\u003C/span\u003E: Does he agree that \u201Cwe\u2019ve been successful because of high compliance with social distancing\u201D and not because of our contact tracing, and, if so, does he think the Government\u2019s let the team of 5 million down by not doing its bit soon enough?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000092\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225bbd9f26-fdb0-4b85-a836-0fc46e1bba3c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022d8196ebb3606455090355e7e41c59191\u0022\u003EHon Dr DAVID CLARK\u003C/span\u003E: In respect of the second part of the question, no; in respect of the first part, I do want to thank New Zealanders for their extraordinary efforts in the lockdown. We have successfully managed to squash community transmission for now, and I think that extraordinary effort is thanks to the hard work of ordinary and everyday New Zealanders.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000093\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u00227f0549792e8b40e789cb40dd147520ed\u0022\u003EQuestion No. 5\u2014Education\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022dbaac12b-3efa-4d95-a08d-f0f637a48bab\u0022 data-id=\u0022ed0c3b1f3aac4ef98c910127af939c4a\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000094\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dbaac12b-3efa-4d95-a08d-f0f637a48bab\u0022\u003E5. \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022ed0c3b1f3aac4ef98c910127af939c4a\u0022\u003ECHL\u00D6E SWARBRICK (Green)\u003C/span\u003E to the Minister of Education: Does the Government consider that supporting students and the tertiary education sector is an important part of the response to COVID-19?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022 data-id=\u0022f608452bb2d14c6c97d31a1623d6c43b\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000095\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022f608452bb2d14c6c97d31a1623d6c43b\u0022\u003EHon CHRIS HIPKINS (Minister of Education):\u003C/span\u003E Yes. That\u2019s why the Government moved quickly, as a first step, to double course-related costs to $2,000 for students to draw down support themselves, as that was the quickest way that we could get additional funding to them. We also moved to ensure that they continue to receive the same level of support over an eight-week study break to buffer any disruption that may be caused by COVID-19. We provided tertiary education organisations with a guarantee that their 2020 funding will not be impacted by any loss of domestic students as a result of COVID-19. That ensures that $2 billion in committed Vote Tertiary Education funding will continue to be paid. Tertiary education providers are one of the few sectors that have guaranteed funding during the disruption caused by COVID-19. There are also likely to be increases in enrolments later this year and in 2021 as a result of the economic effects of COVID-19.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000096\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dbaac12b-3efa-4d95-a08d-f0f637a48bab\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022c25e7bbef1ec43f5b2edb65f56cc382d\u0022\u003EChl\u00F6e Swarbrick\u003C/span\u003E: Is the Minister concerned, then, that some tertiary education institutes are charging rent for accommodation that students are not able to live in?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000097\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002289af94a2d9eb421ea67752ef2fbbd99d\u0022\u003EHon CHRIS HIPKINS\u003C/span\u003E: Yes, I am concerned about that, and it is quite a complex situation. In some cases, those accommodation providers are the universities themselves, the tertiary providers themselves. In other cases, they\u2019re third-party providers that are contracted to the universities, and then in other cases, they\u2019re entirely private operations. So it\u2019s quite a complex set of arrangements. The living arrangements themselves are also different. For example, in some cases, students are renting a room in a hostel or a hall of residence. In other cases, they might be renting a room in an apartment. So it\u2019s quite a complex sector. Some of the providers there are accessing the wage subsidy and continuing to charge students their full room rent during that time, which I find utterly unacceptable.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000098\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dbaac12b-3efa-4d95-a08d-f0f637a48bab\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00221b5df046487f4c178d481c05cbd92db4\u0022\u003EChl\u00F6e Swarbrick\u003C/span\u003E: Does he think that more financial support should be provided for students so that they do not need to take on more debt to support themselves through COVID-19?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000099\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00224ceb8fe95dcf47d3b54c926944e3d6d5\u0022\u003EHon CHRIS HIPKINS\u003C/span\u003E: The Government is looking at ways that we can provide additional support to students, and we\u2019re also asking tertiary providers to also be looking at ways that they can support their student communities through this crisis. As new opportunities arise to increase financial support, I\u2019ll continue to push for those.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000100\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dbaac12b-3efa-4d95-a08d-f0f637a48bab\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002219e4643d4fca48cdba5aa7e2693bf0d6\u0022\u003EChl\u00F6e Swarbrick\u003C/span\u003E: Speaking to new opportunities, does he support the New Zealand Union of Students\u2019 Associations\u2019 call for a universal student allowance?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000101\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00228b3b283d1fbc4a0a87677315f6a58104\u0022\u003EHon CHRIS HIPKINS\u003C/span\u003E: Whilst some members on this side of the House have argued over quite a long period of time for things like a universal student allowance, in the current climate, it is really important that we channel additional financial support to the people who need it most in these economic times. So that\u2019s where the Government\u2019s priority is at this point.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000102\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dbaac12b-3efa-4d95-a08d-f0f637a48bab\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022f67b43c964fa48c997bf0735286585ee\u0022\u003EChl\u00F6e Swarbrick\u003C/span\u003E: Will, then, the Government invest more in the tertiary education sector, and in student support, as part of its response to COVID-19, given the importance of training and education in allowing people to take on new career and job opportunities?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000103\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00223c08c0d4ce9d400bb8632a171089c043\u0022\u003EHon CHRIS HIPKINS\u003C/span\u003E: There is a Budget coming up in a very short period of time, and I can indicate to the member that the Government is very much focused on ensuring that retraining opportunities, and support for those who do need to undertake retraining and upskilling as a result of the economic crisis, will be an integral part of the Government\u2019s response.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000104\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00220402ad263645432799dbd56e163e2acc\u0022\u003ERt Hon Winston Peters\u003C/span\u003E: Could I ask the Minister: is it a fact that an unparalleled 100-year crisis of the nature that COVID-19 has inflicted upon our economy means that he may be, as Minister of Education, struggling to fund all the demands made of him?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000105\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022d0b1e4821d654b1d8d35f3e41a4196d3\u0022\u003EHon CHRIS HIPKINS\u003C/span\u003E: That is true, although I\u2019d quite happily fund them all; it\u2019s the gentleman to my left who\u2019s more of the impediment to that.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000106\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u00223f47c301c3154856bc26ff43ef16d2ec\u0022\u003EQuestion No. 6\u2014Regional Economic Development\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002257e41e9d-285b-4fb3-847d-a63820ae7137\u0022 data-id=\u002277526ffb589f48489093e486f67841c5\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000107\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002257e41e9d-285b-4fb3-847d-a63820ae7137\u0022\u003E6. \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002277526ffb589f48489093e486f67841c5\u0022\u003ECHRIS BISHOP (National\u2014Hutt South)\u003C/span\u003E to the Minister for Regional Economic Development: Does he stand by his policies and statements in relation to regional economic development?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022 data-id=\u002286b620ededbe42d1b6eb0b4c95bf76da\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000108\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002286b620ededbe42d1b6eb0b4c95bf76da\u0022\u003ERt Hon WINSTON PETERS (Deputy Prime Minister) \u003C/span\u003Eon behalf of the Minister for Regional Economic Development: I most certainly do, particularly the statement about how the previous National administration wilfully neglected the regions for nine long years.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000109\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002257e41e9d-285b-4fb3-847d-a63820ae7137\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00228b5271a8d5c748a6bf1d97a685df96cb\u0022\u003EChris Bishop\u003C/span\u003E: Has the Government sought advice from officials on making changes to the criteria for the Provincial Growth Fund (PGF) in light of COVID-19, and, if so, what did the advice say?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000110\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00228f67e527149c402d90dfec31da3ca04a\u0022\u003ERt Hon WINSTON PETERS\u003C/span\u003E: On behalf of the Minister, any sound, wise, and experienced Minister would do that facing any crisis, and the crisis of the nature of COVID-19 meant that we had to refocus our priorities. Most certainly we did, and I cannot believe anyone would rise in this House asking that question.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000111\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002257e41e9d-285b-4fb3-847d-a63820ae7137\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00225830be98298f411c85a318f9db716943\u0022\u003EChris Bishop\u003C/span\u003E: Well, in light of that answer, what changes to the Provincial Growth Fund criteria have been made by the Government?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000112\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022757b7aaead4a44ed8dca2bef6f759bad\u0022\u003ERt Hon WINSTON PETERS\u003C/span\u003E: On behalf of the Minister, just take one. For example, we know that tourism is struggling because, amongst other things, international travel will not be happening. Then we\u2019ve got health and security issues and a number of things like the factor of units to keep the operations going all around provincial New Zealand where tourism is concerned. So of course we\u2019re refocusing and repurposing with respect to those initial initiatives where we were supporting tourism. It doesn\u2019t mean that they\u2019re not going to be supported long term, but in the short term, right here, right now, we\u2019re taking the smart commercial decisions that any wise Government would take.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000113\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022530ce0c4-c977-40cb-90fb-754f54931ff1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00226e033f56524248f98be63f9d1d64adaa\u0022\u003EHon Tracey Martin\u003C/span\u003E: Is the PGF focused on the aim to drive a revival in manufacturing in New Zealand?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000114\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002200925657e5e24ceea998f9c627c00293\u0022\u003ERt Hon WINSTON PETERS\u003C/span\u003E: On behalf of the Minister, most certainly. We\u2019re a Government that came to power with manufacturing in decline, and now, one of the great experiences\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000115\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002253f86481-33c1-48b2-893b-c11cc0bd673d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a2361224d5a3438d84115a75b6d3fe37\u0022\u003EHon Paul Goldsmith\u003C/span\u003E: Bring back import licensing. Let\u2019s make TVs. Let\u2019s make cars.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000116\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002258cc40d03f1440379f4ffed0a4bc8800\u0022\u003ERt Hon WINSTON PETERS\u003C/span\u003E: \u2014or lessons of the global crisis caused by COVID-19\u2014it\u2019s no use making a lot of silly sounds from Epsom when the commercial experience that you have as a member of Parliament is precisely zero. Perhaps that member, if he wants to shout out in the House every day, could get up and tell the country what commercial experience he\u2019s got, and, having none, please keep his mouth shut while someone who has got commercial experience seeks to tell him what we\u2019re doing. Now, here\u2019s the real purpose.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000117\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022be2e16e0c52f4637a855054bd9b194b2\u0022\u003EHon Members\u003C/span\u003E: Who\u2019s that?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000118\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022247ac2030f3340c898b1dc424bd1fc61\u0022\u003ERt Hon WINSTON PETERS\u003C/span\u003E: I have.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000119\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022badb0a39-849c-462a-b32f-77fc017c9fc2\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022e92628d0d45c4f28a54480282b89541b\u0022\u003EHon Simon Bridges\u003C/span\u003E: When was that?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000120\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a3090ecec3ad4110a3b61a0b959f9bcc\u0022\u003ERt Hon WINSTON PETERS\u003C/span\u003E: Mr Bridges, I made more money in my law firm than you ever made, right? I made more in one month than you made in six months. That\u2019s a fact. Now, back to your point. If you want to make a silly challenge like that, I\u2019m up to it. But here\u2019s the point: manufacturing was in decline, and we\u2019re going to revive manufacturing because all of a sudden a whole lot of people realise that a call a long time ago to restore New Zealand manufacturing is now making compelling common sense.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000121\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022530ce0c4-c977-40cb-90fb-754f54931ff1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002244f22739adb2498bb77d0c9e7e01f805\u0022\u003EHon Tracey Martin\u003C/span\u003E: Is the PGF focused on supporting New Zealand businesses to add value in New Zealand to our raw materials?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000122\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00227821b6fa7d6c4764aaeaa5c64ef5e176\u0022\u003ERt Hon WINSTON PETERS\u003C/span\u003E: On behalf of the Minister, that\u2019s a brilliant question\u2014take, for example, sending logs offshore in their most raw, unprocessed state for tens of thousands of jobs for some other economy, and six to sometimes 20 times the added value offshore. We seek to add value in that product onshore, New Zealand first, and all around provincial New Zealand where forestry is our mainstay. It will cause an economic and employment and wealth revival. This is common sense. As with all of our primary products, where we can add value, we should add it here and get the top market price, not allow it to go to some other economy. That has always been a wise national strategy.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000123\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022ed0fddd32a2543848b24171263fab5d2\u0022\u003EHon Dr Nick Smith\u003C/span\u003E: Does the Government support the decision of Air New Zealand, in which it\u2019s a 52 percent shareholder, to close its regional maintenance base in Nelson permanently, with the loss of over 100 high-value manufacturing jobs that he seeks to champion?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000124\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002290756893795b4922b9cac18db1286f30\u0022\u003ERt Hon WINSTON PETERS\u003C/span\u003E: On behalf of the Minister, what a fascinating question, given that the construction of the ownership of Air New Zealand was the National Party\u2019s policy, not any policy of any party on this side of the House. He would not know that, of course. That\u2019s his level of experience when it comes to commerce as well. But here\u2019s the same question\u2014and if he thinks the Government is a 52 percent shareholder today, then he knows nothing about what\u2019s just happened. The third thing is Mr Foran is a leading commercial mind that came to Air New Zealand, and we\u2019re prepared to give him a chance to make that airline a great success once again, having been saved for the umpteenth time by the Minister of Finance and the taxpayer.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000125\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022e0f281ba2ff04b4593bad06a2c32de50\u0022\u003EHon Dr Nick Smith\u003C/span\u003E: Supplementary.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000126\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002271fbcd31963f42f28aeaf0a56da7ec53\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: I want to ask Dr Smith just to wait. I know it\u2019s sometimes hard to predict. Wait until the\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000127\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00221a2efd891d974a57bd40ddb8e13156a1\u0022\u003EHon Dr Nick Smith\u003C/span\u003E: A good part of the answers is simply abuse.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000128\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022024f0583fd044daaa23403bffb071913\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: I\u2019m going to stand up. The member will sit down. I\u2019m going to require him to wait until the Minister acting for the Minister for Regional Economic Development has finished his answer before he stands up in that way. If he wants the abuse to stop, I think he should talk to a number of his colleagues who are interjecting in the absolute knowledge that they\u2019re going to set that abuse off.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000129\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022e2ec82ca984f4de0a48e58f3e374b656\u0022\u003EHon Gerry Brownlee\u003C/span\u003E: I raise a point of order, Mr Speaker. I think your somewhat lecturing tone there to the House is unreasonable. There\u2019s been a good degree of decorum in here as reasonable questions have been answered. That was a very reasonable question from Dr Smith, as were questions earlier today. To be greeted with a barrage of personal insult is, I think, somewhat unbecoming for the nature of the House, particularly at this difficult time, and particularly when you\u2019re asking a question that is sensitive to so many New Zealanders who are about to lose their jobs.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000130\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00225edd43283b4b4e2f8ce13e0342254232\u0022\u003ERt Hon WINSTON PETERS\u003C/span\u003E: Can I just say this: every time I\u2019ve visited the House since I\u2019ve come back, in the last day or two, to answer a question, I\u2019ve been met with a whole lot of hectoring and interjections, and the audience out there in New Zealand should know that about three or four people are shouting across themselves at this side of the House. Now, I\u2019ve got a famous line for them, and it\u2019s Elvis Presley\u2019s famous quote: if you\u2019re looking for trouble, you\u2019ve come to the right place.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000131\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002253f86481-33c1-48b2-893b-c11cc0bd673d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00225b3534e827f446788b4b8d48b5482a73\u0022\u003EHon Paul Goldsmith\u003C/span\u003E: I think if we look at the transcript of the Hansard, you will find that that member started personal attacks first and we only responded to his personal attacks.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000132\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00228e20df4333de404b8aca6c132c6feeea\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Well, I think in that particular case\u2014certainly, if we take the question time as a whole, as opposed to just that supplementary\u2014that is not accurate. The member answering the question initially responded to a couple of interjections, at least one of which came from that member. In responding to Mr Brownlee\u2019s point of order, I do look forward to\u2014and I hope that we can have\u2014more decorum in the House. I don\u2019t think members will find another member with more familial interest in the Air New Zealand redundancies than me. And I just want to make it clear: go back to my original point, and that is that the normal courtesy of letting members answer their questions before someone stands up, unless they have a point of order, will be the way that we continue to run the House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000133\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a6952699e2414065a8c12fdd1ca1728b\u0022\u003EHon Gerry Brownlee\u003C/span\u003E: Just not wanting to prolong the point of order, the reply that was given by the Rt Hon Winston Peters was allowed to stand, and I simply want to make it clear to him that the country is in trouble at the moment and we are not looking for more. We just want answers. That\u2019s not an unreasonable position for an Opposition to take when a Government has so much leeway as they have at the present time to do the extraordinary things that are required of them.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000134\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a7110aa5246a4c1488b73e3abcb8888c\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: OK. Well, I\u2019ll deal with that now. The member knows absolutely it\u2019s not a point of order, but I think in any case, I\u2019ll ask the Minister acting for the Minister for Regional Economic Development to take that on. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000135\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a49de4f35fa64ac5b567d56f83352f6e\u0022\u003EHon Dr Nick Smith\u003C/span\u003E: What is his response to the petition to the Minister for Regional Economic Development, signed by over 15,000 people in just a week, seeking that the Government\u2019s $900 million of financial support to Air New Zealand be tagged to retaining the regional maintenance facility in Nelson and the over 100 high-paying jobs?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000136\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022ea2aa5cd77a84ba4a1f2e12ba1b8d8c5\u0022\u003ERt Hon WINSTON PETERS\u003C/span\u003E: On behalf of the Minister, my response is that any opportunity for an intervention like that has been constrained, outlawed, and prohibited by the structure the National Party set up in the ownership of Air New Zealand. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000137\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00221949746c94aa494fabfaa87aef48cd0d\u0022\u003EHon Dr Nick Smith\u003C/span\u003E: It just did a $900 million\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000138\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022e3d8028a0ff24503b23e1e3f29ffe825\u0022\u003ERt Hon WINSTON PETERS\u003C/span\u003E: It deliberately\u2014no. Excuse me. If you\u2019ll just wait\u2014and Mr Brownlee wanted an answer. If you deliberately take a Minister and a Government out of the decision-making power of a business like that, which is what the structure is\u2014and it\u2019s unique; as a State-owned enterprise (SOE), it\u2019s a structure different to any other one\u2014then how can you now intervene? The member\u2019s asked me as a Minister to step up and do that. That is, be part and parcel of the everyday decision-making process of an airline, whilst the operation legally that they\u2019re existing under prohibits the Minister from doing anything like that.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000139\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00228c6e2e04f87a45259728618fcdd9ac99\u0022\u003EHon Gerry Brownlee\u003C/span\u003E: I raise a point of order, Mr Speaker. That answer demonstrates the problem that I outlined before. We are here just to get answers. To be given a lecture like that that is fundamentally wrong and to have that accepted on the Hansard record as being reasonable in this circumstance is not good for the decorum of the House or for the people who are actually wanting to get information from this process. I know in normal times you might get away with a bland answer like that, but it is a fact that in this case it is Government Ministers who negotiated directly with Air New Zealand the arrangements around the $900 million and also made sure it\u2019s partly equity-based if they can\u2019t meet those payments. To say they have no opportunity to put conditions around a loan or the eventual transfer of equity is plain wrong.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000140\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022017c313972f94c40a613b8ceca94f51e\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: OK. I think now for the third time, the member has made an intervention which may or may not be factually correct, but cannot be characterised as a point of order. Members cannot stand up on a point of order in order to disagree with an answer, and I\u2019m sure the member knows it. The solution for the member, as he is aware, is to ask another supplementary. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000141\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022fe1e1c013af94ae3939482e94e8351f6\u0022\u003EHon Dr Nick Smith\u003C/span\u003E: Has the Minister for Regional Economic Development made any statements publicly or directly to Air New Zealand on the significant loss of over 100 high-value manufacturing jobs from the permanent closure of the regional maintenance facility in Nelson, given his propensity to previously make all sorts of comments about Air New Zealand\u2019s business?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000142\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00228b945f486f4a49ffa77d312a3a671f32\u0022\u003ERt Hon WINSTON PETERS\u003C/span\u003E: On behalf of the Minister, and being aware of that last sarcastic addition to the question, the Minister makes it very clear that unlike any other Minister, he has been more profoundly interested in the provincial existence and survival of Air New Zealand services, and still is. But the real point, again, is this: the proscription that says he cannot get involved in everyday decision-making was written by the National Party. And to stand up here today and say that we should forget about that, when its ownership structure is unique\u2014when its ownership structure is\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000143\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002237f04b46a15941f5ab72424e96b3c9e8\u0022\u003EHon Dr Nick Smith\u003C/span\u003E: I raise a point of order, Mr Speaker. My question was: had the Minister made any statements publicly\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000144\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00225ee4d949c8074bde9885990e2f0d02c7\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Order! [Interruption] Order! The member will resume his seat. We will wait until we get to the end of the member\u2019s answer before we prejudge whether he\u2019s answered it or not.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000145\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022b732cb82e9284a54bc6d1c32f79ce0c2\u0022\u003ERt Hon WINSTON PETERS\u003C/span\u003E: Again, on behalf of the Minister, the opportunity to make the kind of statement being invited now, no matter how sympathetic as a Minister I might be towards what is happening around the provinces\u2014dare I say it, the services of the provinces and the workforce in the provinces where Air New Zealand\u2019s concerned\u2014I am nevertheless constrained by a proscription that was put in place by a previous Government, namely the National Government, which, unlike any other SOE, says I cannot do what the member is asking.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000146\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u0022933b92bba7744efaabce610c530ebf70\u0022\u003EQuestion No. 7\u2014Health\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022861a1798-a396-4a6c-b9e2-7d2f15d4a001\u0022 data-id=\u0022eb506bf975ae4b74858344da4df1dc87\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000147\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022861a1798-a396-4a6c-b9e2-7d2f15d4a001\u0022\u003E7. \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022eb506bf975ae4b74858344da4df1dc87\u0022\u003EDr SHANE RETI (National\u2014Whangarei)\u003C/span\u003E to the Minister of Health: Does he stand by all his statements and actions around coronavirus screening at the border?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00225bbd9f26-fdb0-4b85-a836-0fc46e1bba3c\u0022 data-id=\u00228d8eddff56464a35966bcda0126187a7\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000148\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225bbd9f26-fdb0-4b85-a836-0fc46e1bba3c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00228d8eddff56464a35966bcda0126187a7\u0022\u003EHon Dr DAVID CLARK (Minister of Health):\u003C/span\u003E In their full context, yes, noting that primary responsibility for border control sits with the Minister of Customs. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000149\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022861a1798-a396-4a6c-b9e2-7d2f15d4a001\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022acd5bebae8df40cf9cd3a2b6f95ba6ff\u0022\u003EDr Shane Reti\u003C/span\u003E: Is the new passenger arrival card, with coronavirus questions that he describes in written answers, an important border screening tool, and has it screened tens of thousands of arrivals? \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000150\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225bbd9f26-fdb0-4b85-a836-0fc46e1bba3c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00226e6d29e948c74b888961baf414be456d\u0022\u003EHon Dr DAVID CLARK\u003C/span\u003E: I don\u2019t have the details of that particular customs tool in front of me, but I can advise him that the Ministry of Health certainly had input into it, and collection of that information has been important to our efforts. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000151\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022861a1798-a396-4a6c-b9e2-7d2f15d4a001\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022afec49c4e65c42bc81205a252ff206f6\u0022\u003EDr Shane Reti\u003C/span\u003E: Why does the new passengers arrival card ask about fever, cough, and difficulty breathing when written questions show he was advised by the Institute of Environmental Science and Research (ESR) that fever, cough, and a sore throat are the main symptoms? \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000152\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225bbd9f26-fdb0-4b85-a836-0fc46e1bba3c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022b6ae1853897648748ceff856e2f59898\u0022\u003EHon Dr DAVID CLARK\u003C/span\u003E: Obviously, this is a very detailed question in respect of a broader primary question, but what I can tell the member, certainly\u2014and I\u2019d be happy, if he wants to put specific questions down, to provide further detail\u2014is that the customs screening generally is interested not just in coronavirus. We are of course particularly interested in coronavirus right now, but we are also interested in other infectious diseases that might present at the border, and always have been as a country. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000153\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022861a1798-a396-4a6c-b9e2-7d2f15d4a001\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002285361643144e4e8ba09f4b857f803efc\u0022\u003EDr Shane Reti\u003C/span\u003E: Has New Zealand\u2019s new passenger arrivals card been asking the wrong symptoms screening question, given he was advised in written questions from me, No. 4971, that nearly half of the cases in New Zealand present with a sore throat? \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000154\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225bbd9f26-fdb0-4b85-a836-0fc46e1bba3c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022d0050ab866ae44e8a9850da0e0c854dc\u0022\u003EHon Dr DAVID CLARK\u003C/span\u003E: At every point, we have taken decisions based on the best medical and scientific advice. I can assure the member that there is very thorough screening going on at the airport, and conversations are being had to ensure that we are quarantining where appropriate and putting people into managed self-isolation. A very thorough regime is in place, and I want to take this opportunity to thank all of those at the border who are involved in this effort. It is incredibly important to the success that we have had as a country in getting the reproduction rate of that virus right down. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000155\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022861a1798-a396-4a6c-b9e2-7d2f15d4a001\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00224faae2605eb54522be21e8fd61755a28\u0022\u003EDr Shane Reti\u003C/span\u003E: Will he commit to working with ESR to redo the passenger arrival card so that our borders can be better protected? \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000156\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225bbd9f26-fdb0-4b85-a836-0fc46e1bba3c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00222868394be7d4434aa17c6c743a07679e\u0022\u003EHon Dr DAVID CLARK\u003C/span\u003E: I will commit to the Ministry of Health continuing to work with experts to make sure that all of our systems are optimised. Of course, this virus has presented a rapidly evolving situation, and along the way we continue to learn more things about it and its presentation. So, of course, naturally, there will be ongoing conversations. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000157\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u00224d47cf6fa9d0450ca6260301c1d86d5c\u0022\u003EQuestion No. 8\u2014Health\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022217f4585-f6ef-408d-9318-8a6b8506920b\u0022 data-id=\u0022783c71c3f0be4cab81b04d2581f3c2eb\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000158\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022217f4585-f6ef-408d-9318-8a6b8506920b\u0022\u003E8. \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022783c71c3f0be4cab81b04d2581f3c2eb\u0022\u003EPAUL EAGLE (Labour\u2014Rongotai)\u003C/span\u003E to the Minister of Health: How has New Zealand built up its contact tracing capacity?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00225bbd9f26-fdb0-4b85-a836-0fc46e1bba3c\u0022 data-id=\u0022c3d9c1d4f1c9450cb3551d6cdae414de\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000159\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225bbd9f26-fdb0-4b85-a836-0fc46e1bba3c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022c3d9c1d4f1c9450cb3551d6cdae414de\u0022\u003EHon Dr DAVID CLARK (Minister of Health):\u003C/span\u003E Traditionally, all contact tracing in New Zealand has been done at a local level by public health units. These units are staffed by highly skilled professionals and they have done a good job. But in the face of COVID-19, it was clear that we needed to ramp up our contact tracing capacity. That led to the establishment of the National Close Contact Service on 24 March, the first time contact tracing has been centralised and conducted at a national level. The national service has more than 200 trained staff and can make 5,000 calls per day, which can be scaled up to 10,000 if required. And that is on top of the excellent ongoing work of our public health units.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000160\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022217f4585-f6ef-408d-9318-8a6b8506920b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022f4245f44e9464eb8b18a63dc3942e76d\u0022\u003EPaul Eagle\u003C/span\u003E: Has New Zealand now achieved the gold standard for contact tracing?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000161\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225bbd9f26-fdb0-4b85-a836-0fc46e1bba3c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022f3adaa915edd439892d2fee76da07b71\u0022\u003EHon Dr DAVID CLARK\u003C/span\u003E: Contact tracing is one of the key public health measures we can take to keep COVID-19 at bay. The Government has invested a total of $70 million to strengthen and expand our contact tracing, which is now operating on a dedicated information technology platform, the National Contact Tracing Solution. The Director-General of Health has assured New Zealanders that our contact tracing is now gold standard.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000162\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022217f4585-f6ef-408d-9318-8a6b8506920b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022c9e51f641ace48b885893f1c45c5c5f1\u0022\u003EPaul Eagle\u003C/span\u003E: What is being done to ensure our contact tracing continues to be fit for purpose?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000163\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225bbd9f26-fdb0-4b85-a836-0fc46e1bba3c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00220d3295aeacd34d7da943bfbc99285bf2\u0022\u003EHon Dr DAVID CLARK\u003C/span\u003E: As members will be aware, Otago University\u2019s Dr Ayesha Verrall conducted a rapid audit of contact tracing. Work is under way to implement all of her recommendations. Yesterday, appointments were also finalised for a section 11 committee to advise me on our progress. That committee will be chaired by Sir Brian Roche, with members Dr Phillip Hill, Warren Moitara, Dr Marion Paw, and Liz Reid. I want to thank Sir Brian and his team for agreeing to take on this important task.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000164\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u0022c7d192b9d9d0440a9bd02dcb71111a9e\u0022\u003EQuestion No. 9\u2014Education\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022f12da0af-dc73-4870-8f77-1d50a75eb44c\u0022 data-id=\u00228ae129f3c53748eaafcb3c516bffad7a\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000165\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f12da0af-dc73-4870-8f77-1d50a75eb44c\u0022\u003E9. \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00228ae129f3c53748eaafcb3c516bffad7a\u0022\u003ENICOLA WILLIS (National)\u003C/span\u003E to the Minister of Education: Will guidance be available for early learning services about how they will be expected to operate under COVID-19 alert level 2; if so, when will that advice be available?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022 data-id=\u0022c3f373fab8a046148e4bd1d0e9330e97\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000166\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022c3f373fab8a046148e4bd1d0e9330e97\u0022\u003EHon CHRIS HIPKINS (Minister of Education):\u003C/span\u003E As I said yesterday, guidance for the shift from alert level 3 to alert level 2 has already been published. This was consulted on with the sector before it was sent out. The Ministry of Education has continued to have regular meetings with individual providers as they normally would do\u2014and representative bodies\u2014and more detailed guidance will be disseminated around the middle of next week. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000167\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f12da0af-dc73-4870-8f77-1d50a75eb44c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00228001575cd91647f1b564c5ddae6477fd\u0022\u003ENicola Willis\u003C/span\u003E: Will parents be able to safely return their children to normal hours of early childhood education attendance at alert level 2?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000168\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00224e55a3c0b4e4477081fd6784f63d8ce2\u0022\u003EHon CHRIS HIPKINS\u003C/span\u003E: What I can speak to is the very high-level principles that were set out in the Government\u2019s alert level framework, and people can find that on covid19.govt.nz. That envisages that schools and early learning services will be reopened more or less completely at alert level 2, with some exceptions. For those who are at high risk, there will still be some provisions to support them to learn from home using distance learning, and to support learning from home with school and early childhood staff. Further information, of course, is going to be released in due course.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000169\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f12da0af-dc73-4870-8f77-1d50a75eb44c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022fd0017e71d034b1ab84e687074d7a978\u0022\u003ENicola Willis\u003C/span\u003E: What guidelines is the Government considering to ensure early childhood services can operate safely with full attendance at alert level 2?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000170\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022adca8c615e9443dbb65e71b02696f5e8\u0022\u003EHon CHRIS HIPKINS\u003C/span\u003E: The Ministry of Education has been working very closely with the Ministry of Health\u2014and regional public health officials, in particular\u2014alongside the sector leadership in early childhood education to ensure that both the guidelines are clear and that services have any additional support that they need in order to be able to operate at alert level 2. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000171\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f12da0af-dc73-4870-8f77-1d50a75eb44c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00220a50c3e484274e09ba06decf1901f777\u0022\u003ENicola Willis\u003C/span\u003E: Does he think any early childhood education services will close as a result of COVID-19 - related enrolment and financial pressure?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000172\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022de79046ab5b44d8e835cf96bc0122041\u0022\u003EHon CHRIS HIPKINS\u003C/span\u003E: No, I don\u2019t think it will be directly as a result of COVID-19, because the Government is continuing to provide the full subsidies for those services, even where they only have one or two or even no children attending those early childhood services. Where their parent revenue\u2014the fees charged to parents\u2014makes up more than 30 percent of their income, they have been eligible to apply for the wage subsidy, and several of those services have already done so. So I don\u2019t think that that will be the reason for some services experiencing financial difficulty. I do want to acknowledge, though, that even before COVID-19, there were some small community-based early childhood services that had been experiencing financial difficulties, and that the COVID-19 situation has simply brought that into even starker relief.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000173\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u0022aba5bc5147dd4f78b7b8ee689f235dad\u0022\u003EQuestion No. 10\u2014Health\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022ee649aea-c6fa-4610-9fcf-5c4bb2d3cd33\u0022 data-id=\u00224912a3dc2403424d85e86bd421c2116b\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000174\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ee649aea-c6fa-4610-9fcf-5c4bb2d3cd33\u0022\u003E10. \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00224912a3dc2403424d85e86bd421c2116b\u0022\u003EMATT DOOCEY (National\u2014Waimakariri)\u003C/span\u003E to the Minister of Health: Why, as of February 2020, has the Government only spent $3.2m of the promised $455m announced in Budget 2019 for a new frontline mental health service, and why in the recent re-announcement of $40m for this new frontline mental health service was the rollout not expected to be completed until the middle of 2021?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00225bbd9f26-fdb0-4b85-a836-0fc46e1bba3c\u0022 data-id=\u00222d95c14b47b345418b65b54d57a89092\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000175\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225bbd9f26-fdb0-4b85-a836-0fc46e1bba3c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00222d95c14b47b345418b65b54d57a89092\u0022\u003EHon Dr DAVID CLARK (Minister of Health):\u003C/span\u003E In answer to the first part of the question, the total investment of $455 million is for a national roll-out over four years, and that roll-out will continue thereafter. A total of $25 million has been allocated to service delivery in 2019-20, and the $3.2 million distributed to providers as at February 2020 that the member refers to relates to sustaining the 22 previously pilot sites providing services through general practice and continuation of other existing primary mental health and addiction supports. I\u2019d also note that this Government has also funded other new initiatives, including Mana Ake, which has helped around 5,000 primary and intermediate aged children in Canterbury in Kaik\u014Dura, and Piki, which is providing mental health support for 18- to 24-year-olds in Wellington and Wairarapa, which is not to mention nurses in schools across the country. We\u2019ve also put more into acute services, mental health, alcohol and drug support, and building new mental health facilities. And in answer to the second part of the member\u2019s question, it was not a re-announcement; these are new contracts we\u2019re announcing for new services that will serve a population of 1.5 million once it is fully rolled out. It does take time to train new workforces and establish new services.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000176\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ee649aea-c6fa-4610-9fcf-5c4bb2d3cd33\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022f3c3681929954ebd9f4690405f2462ee\u0022\u003EMatt Doocey\u003C/span\u003E: Thank you, Mr Speaker. Why is the Minister using the excuse of available workforce when New Zealand Association of Counsellors accredited primary care counsellors contracted to DHBs are being told there is no funding available to respond to the growing demand of mental health referrals as a result of the impacts of COVID-19?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000177\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225bbd9f26-fdb0-4b85-a836-0fc46e1bba3c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022ed6cd56da73c42dfbf4fe1bb3302627e\u0022\u003EHon Dr DAVID CLARK\u003C/span\u003E: What I would say is that, first off, I want to thank those who are working in this response, because they\u2019ve been working tirelessly through COVID-19. A number of additional access points have been set up, and that includes, of course, the Mentemia app\u201435,000 downloads in just 10 days\u2014Melon, which is an online resource that\u2019s being supervised by counsellors; and Sparklers at Home\u201448,000 people have accessed that uniquely in a month. And Wise Group has stood up an app. These responses are there to support New Zealanders\u2019 immediate needs in response to COVID-19. The Government has already allocated an additional $15 million to support the psychosocial wellbeing of New Zealanders during this outbreak. In terms of a specific issue the member might be raising, a specific instance, I\u2019d be happy to hear more from him if he wants to put a question down in writing.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000178\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ee649aea-c6fa-4610-9fcf-5c4bb2d3cd33\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022067b60ed163a43918f99e45687980485\u0022\u003EMatt Doocey\u003C/span\u003E: Is the Minister\u2019s new front-line mental health service, announced in 2019 but only to be partially rolled out by the middle of 2021\u201414 months away\u2014too late for the many people described by New Zealand Medical Association chair, Dr Kim Baddock, at the Epidemic Response Committee last week, when she said her colleagues have seen a huge increase in the amount of mental issues they are facing?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000179\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225bbd9f26-fdb0-4b85-a836-0fc46e1bba3c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022f899a4ac84e34b2d859e5561c791ab3f\u0022\u003EHon Dr DAVID CLARK\u003C/span\u003E: I would refer to some of those things I\u2019ve mentioned in my previous answer. The uptake of those services has been extraordinary in a short period of time, and I think bears witness to the appropriateness of them rolling out during the COVID period. I\u2019d also note that the 1737 number has helped tens of thousands of New Zealanders this year and has scaled up significantly. So the Government has responded quite specifically to the situation we find ourselves in. I would also note that already 18,000 free sessions have been delivered to New Zealanders by this new front-line service. Many of those people might not have received this support in a timely fashion without this new service. And we\u2019re rolling it out nationwide. By the middle of next year, a population of 1.5 million people will have access to a new service at their local GP for free. This service was simply not available previously. The demand for mental health services had nearly doubled\u2014or perhaps over doubled\u2014in a decade, and the support for services had only gone up by around half the amount needed. So introducing this new free service for Kiwis is something that is timely, and I believe the uptake rates of these services indicate that they are providing a unique and important service for New Zealanders that was not previously available.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000180\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ee649aea-c6fa-4610-9fcf-5c4bb2d3cd33\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00222787ef9a43a04f039bc0196937caaf58\u0022\u003EMatt Doocey\u003C/span\u003E: Why is the Minister saying that there is more funding available for mental health services when, at the recent DHB annual reviews, DHB representatives said they couldn\u2019t point to where the money is exactly and they think the $1.9 billion hasn\u2019t flowed out yet?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000181\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022314314\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022c0208a983c154b9a86bf329c6f778425\u0022\u003EHon Dr DAVID CLARK\u003C/span\u003E: I can\u2019t answer for those unnamed representatives the member speaks of, but what I would say is, of course, that the DHBs received over $200 million more in the ring-fenced mental health fund. So $200 million is certainly not nothing, and that\u2019s in their annual budget, and they received $200 million more the year before as well. So, on average, I think it\u2019s $103 million more per annum that has gone into DHBs specifically for mental health\u2014off the top of my head\u2014on top of the $1.3 billion, which, of course, is being rolled out over a four- or five-year period. So the member will, of course, know that our record as a country is of under-investment in this area. I\u2019m very proud to be a part of a Government that is for the first time taking mental health seriously.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000182\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ee649aea-c6fa-4610-9fcf-5c4bb2d3cd33\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022f22338cf4d9b4effafcf4a7f074f6bc1\u0022\u003EMatt Doocey\u003C/span\u003E: Which of the following statements does he consider most correct: the New Zealand Association of Counsellors president, Christine Macfarlane, who said the Government\u2019s latest mental health announcement is a total waste of taxpayers\u2019 money, or, following the Minister\u2019s interview on his announcement on Saturday, Newshub Nation reporter Simon Shepherd saying this has got a slight KiwiBuild flavour about it?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000183\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225bbd9f26-fdb0-4b85-a836-0fc46e1bba3c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00223163f87bdcfa4138a721e5f9c12cd7bd\u0022\u003EHon Dr DAVID CLARK\u003C/span\u003E: I disagree with the first comment, and I certainly haven\u2019t seen the second.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000184\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u0022891e5f61845f40a1b83180a36363f278\u0022\u003EQuestion No. 11\u2014Revenue\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022a8cab3e3-b023-4ce7-9f4b-2c4137029057\u0022 data-id=\u0022acbfa35a909e4fbb8ad305daf597c32e\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000185\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a8cab3e3-b023-4ce7-9f4b-2c4137029057\u0022\u003E11. \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022acbfa35a909e4fbb8ad305daf597c32e\u0022\u003EKIRITAPU ALLAN (Labour)\u003C/span\u003E to the Minister of Revenue: What recent tax measures, if any, has he announced to support businesses affected by COVID-19?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022bbded2ec-ac25-4a73-a380-3f4d87693084\u0022 data-id=\u0022935a580c008144da89a83e2173bff855\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000186\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bbded2ec-ac25-4a73-a380-3f4d87693084\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022935a580c008144da89a83e2173bff855\u0022\u003EHon STUART NASH (Minister of Revenue):\u003C/span\u003E The last time I was in this House, we announced\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000187\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022ab1ba640642a4d798adbe83e5ef13b0c\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Tidy your shirt up, will you? Your collar. Thank you.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000188\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bbded2ec-ac25-4a73-a380-3f4d87693084\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022950340f1010d4e44bfb2dfcab79575b7\u0022\u003EHon STUART NASH\u003C/span\u003E: \u2014it\u2019s been five weeks since I\u2019ve had to wear a tie, Mr Speaker\u2014a $2.8 billion business tax package to help cushion New Zealanders from the worst economic impacts of the COVID-19 outbreak. We restored depreciation deductions from commercial buildings, increased the provisional tax threshold to relieve the compliance burden for small businesses, and allowed the immediate write-off for low-value assets. These measures are now law. Since then, we\u2019ve also announced a $3.1 billion tax loss carry-back scheme and changed the rules to the loss continuity regime. That provides an estimated $60 million in annual savings to business. This package delivers the single biggest Government support package to businesses, via the tax system, in modern New Zealand history.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000189\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a8cab3e3-b023-4ce7-9f4b-2c4137029057\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002216858877fcc74fc7aba18368fa62159c\u0022\u003EKiritapu Allan\u003C/span\u003E: How does the loss carry-back scheme help support businesses affected by COVID-19?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000190\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bbded2ec-ac25-4a73-a380-3f4d87693084\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022513d9c33695e4fda8aec9fdcebf89010\u0022\u003EHon STUART NASH\u003C/span\u003E: The loss carry-back scheme means that businesses will get a refund from some of the tax paid in the previous year. The changes mean tax could start flowing to businesses, via the tax system, as early as next week. Tax refunds will be a cash lifeline for businesses with non-wage fixed costs, like rent, interest, and insurance. Some don\u2019t want to take on extra debt with a bank loan. Without this support, these otherwise viable small to medium enterprises may be forced to close. Many small and medium businesses are feeling the pain now. We are moving urgently to get tax into their hands as quickly as possible. As the Prime Minister and the Minister of Finance have said, we are constantly monitoring the situation for businesses, and adjusting our support as required.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000191\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a8cab3e3-b023-4ce7-9f4b-2c4137029057\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002292b479c8f5d34728ba383723ae4ff896\u0022\u003EKiritapu Allan\u003C/span\u003E: What responses has he seen in reaction to the loss carry-back scheme?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000192\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bbded2ec-ac25-4a73-a380-3f4d87693084\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a0ffd39f25a94189905e493a1df351eb\u0022\u003EHon STUART NASH\u003C/span\u003E: Overall, this policy has been positively received. The loss carry-back scheme \u201Cprovides significant cash support to businesses [that] can be accessed relatively quickly.\u201D, says John Cuthbertson of Chartered Accountants Australia and New Zealand. Kirk Hope, Business New Zealand, says the loss carry-back scheme \u201Cwill be a significant help for many firms\u201D with cash-flow problems. MYOB New Zealand country manager, Ingrid Cronin-Knight, said many smaller local businesses are staring down the barrel of a loss this year, and the Government scheme could make a difference, and\u2014I quote\u2014\u201Cthe ability to offset a forecast loss in the current year against the previous year\u2019s tax will give them more options to reduce cost and free up cash.\u201D\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000193\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00220ed11ae359c148ca83db1d890cd94e8d\u0022\u003EHon Gerry Brownlee\u003C/span\u003E: But they have to trade unprofitably to get it.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000194\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bbded2ec-ac25-4a73-a380-3f4d87693084\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022f5f1c5c046ab418698e0ca28b1ff802f\u0022\u003EHon STUART NASH\u003C/span\u003E: This is an unprecedented global event, Mr Brownlee, and will have a significant impact on our economy. We are pulling out all stops to protect the health of New Zealanders and the health of the economy,\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000195\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u0022409e12b424784ffdbb35b0e43079d185\u0022\u003EQuestion No. 12\u2014Building and Construction\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022859e13f9-33bb-41bb-b2f0-d848eaf25407\u0022 data-id=\u00221398d012950744b8a09d0624928c52bb\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000196\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022859e13f9-33bb-41bb-b2f0-d848eaf25407\u0022\u003E12. \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00221398d012950744b8a09d0624928c52bb\u0022\u003EANDREW BAYLY (National\u2014Hunua)\u003C/span\u003E to the Minister for Building and Construction: Does she expect builders and their apprentices can fully resume work as lockdown restrictions are lifted?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002290ea1538-43e8-4257-bd80-df3ccd1e5f27\u0022 data-id=\u002204683731a46c4b1c898e7e444275b605\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000197\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002290ea1538-43e8-4257-bd80-df3ccd1e5f27\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002204683731a46c4b1c898e7e444275b605\u0022\u003EHon KRIS FAAFOI (Minister of Broadcasting, Communications and Digital Media)\u003C/span\u003E on behalf of the Minister for Building and Construction: The Government has been working for some time to minimise the impact of COVID-19 and its economic consequences on construction firms and workers. We\u2019ve been working to ensure people can return to work as promptly and safely as possible. Construction Health and Safety New Zealand, in conjunction with the joint Government and industry Construction Sector Accord, published detailed construction health and safety standards and protocols to help develop a control plan. While everyone wants to get back to a work site, we must do it safely. A return to a higher alert level is the worst-case scenario for the industry and our economy. Anyone wanting more information on those protocols can visit building.govt.nz, where a full range of advice is available to them on how to operate under alert levels 3, 2, and 1.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000198\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022859e13f9-33bb-41bb-b2f0-d848eaf25407\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00224153a37579924a9d980431e25419ed01\u0022\u003EAndrew Bayly\u003C/span\u003E: Does she have an estimate of how many of the 250,000 builders and apprentices are currently back at work?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000199\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002290ea1538-43e8-4257-bd80-df3ccd1e5f27\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00224ef7cd32dd4247739f9f64884037dad0\u0022\u003EHon KRIS FAAFOI\u003C/span\u003E: On behalf of the Minister, I don\u2019t have that number on me at the moment, but as I said, some clear guidelines were given to the construction sector over a week ago in order to ensure that they could return to work sites safely at level 3. My understanding of the situation is because of issues like social distancing on building work sites, that would in some cases mean that not everyone who would normally be on a work site could, to ensure the safety of those people on that work site. But, hopefully, if New Zealand pulls together through level 3, we can ensure more people can get back to building sites in order to work safely and continue economic activity.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000200\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022859e13f9-33bb-41bb-b2f0-d848eaf25407\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002260098a7fa0bb426d852ca5becf40531c\u0022\u003EAndrew Bayly\u003C/span\u003E: Does she agree with the reports I\u2019ve been receiving from the building industry that a large number of the 25,000 building apprentices will be laid off before the end of the year?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000201\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002290ea1538-43e8-4257-bd80-df3ccd1e5f27\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002243053d7b78564ed4a98d9f218033c37e\u0022\u003EHon KRIS FAAFOI\u003C/span\u003E: I\u2019ve seen media reports to that effect, and all I could say to that is that I think it is too early to tell exactly what those numbers might be. As has been mentioned by many Ministers as the House has resumed, there is going to be an economic impact across all sectors. Exactly what that is at this stage is hard to tell, but the Government is absolutely focused on making sure that we can protect every job that we can possible. But we have said from the outset that it is going to be difficult to save every job. One thing that we do want to make sure we can do\u2014and other Ministers are working on this issue, especially in relation to apprentices\u2014is making sure that we make a commitment to upskilling and retraining people if they find themselves out of work and in need of a new career.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000202\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022859e13f9-33bb-41bb-b2f0-d848eaf25407\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00229b925623a1e6483291e06c8a4613aa9c\u0022\u003EAndrew Bayly\u003C/span\u003E: What reports has she seen on the number of building consents that could have been processed during the five-week lockdown but weren\u2019t and are still outstanding?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000203\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002290ea1538-43e8-4257-bd80-df3ccd1e5f27\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022e9ef3dd3c9104fc4bab313b60f0a70a9\u0022\u003EHon KRIS FAAFOI\u003C/span\u003E: On behalf of the Minister, I don\u2019t have that number on me at the moment, but I\u2019m happy for the member to submit that as a written question. Obviously, economic activity has slowed down as a result of being in lockdown for the last five to six weeks, and I would expect that a number like that would have reduced.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000204\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002290ea1538-43e8-4257-bd80-df3ccd1e5f27\u0022\u003E\u003Cbr\u003E\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n    \u003C/div\u003E\n    \u003Cdiv class=\u0022HpsHansard\u0022\u003E\n      \u003Cp\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsProceedingHeading\u0022\u003EBills\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000205\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u00223b361c7b4c1140b6b090df42a655d71b\u0022\u003ECOVID-19 Response (Taxation and Other Regulatory Urgent Measures) Bill\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000206\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u00224226f637ca484593b76a4af176b8cfba\u0022\u003EIntroduction\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022 data-id=\u002229c6aca944cf4d7fbb9336bb24895c1a\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000207\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002229c6aca944cf4d7fbb9336bb24895c1a\u0022\u003EHon CHRIS HIPKINS (Leader of the House):\u003C/span\u003E Following discussions across the House, I seek leave for the introduction and the passing through all stages of the COVID-19 Response (Taxation and Other Regulatory Urgent Measures) Bill, and that there be no debate on the first and second readings and no committee stage of this bill.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022 data-id=\u00226bc71c56adc14de28426221472ff4a3c\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000208\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00226bc71c56adc14de28426221472ff4a3c\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Is there any objection to that course of action being followed? And, while we\u2019re considering the matter, the Minister of Revenue will get that desk cleaned up. There appears to be no objection.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000209\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u00224dbef40ba42e4dc3ba09aed541a3f112\u0022\u003EFirst Reading\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000210\u0022\u003E\u003Cbr\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022bbded2ec-ac25-4a73-a380-3f4d87693084\u0022 data-id=\u0022c4fa3c1131fc494796fe39f895ce1f48\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000211\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bbded2ec-ac25-4a73-a380-3f4d87693084\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022c4fa3c1131fc494796fe39f895ce1f48\u0022\u003EHon STUART NASH (Minister of Revenue):\u003C/span\u003E I move, That the COVID-19 Response (Taxation and Other Regulatory Urgent Measures) Bill be now read a first time. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000212\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bbded2ec-ac25-4a73-a380-3f4d87693084\u0022\u003EBill read a first time.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000213\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u00224dbd87584ef34c35916ae3ea3605aea5\u0022\u003ESecond Reading\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022bbded2ec-ac25-4a73-a380-3f4d87693084\u0022 data-id=\u0022c8c669853038481ba85a4762024735ab\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000214\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bbded2ec-ac25-4a73-a380-3f4d87693084\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022c8c669853038481ba85a4762024735ab\u0022\u003EHon STUART NASH (Minister of Revenue):\u003C/span\u003E I move, That the COVID-19 Response (Taxation and Other Regulatory Urgent Measures) Bill be now read a second time. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000215\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bbded2ec-ac25-4a73-a380-3f4d87693084\u0022\u003EBill read a second time.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000216\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u00225d121ccf670d40098c4cf2fab1fb76f2\u0022\u003EThird Reading\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022bbded2ec-ac25-4a73-a380-3f4d87693084\u0022 data-id=\u0022d21311f6751c42b9a07b575de4851525\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000217\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bbded2ec-ac25-4a73-a380-3f4d87693084\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022d21311f6751c42b9a07b575de4851525\u0022\u003EHon STUART NASH (Minister of Revenue):\u003C/span\u003E I move, That the COVID-19 Response (Taxation and Other Regulatory Urgent Measures) Bill be now read a third time. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000218\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bbded2ec-ac25-4a73-a380-3f4d87693084\u0022\u003EThe proposed tax measures in this bill add to the support and aim to help sustain individuals and businesses during the global pandemic and economic crisis. With over $23 billion in support, the coalition Government has launched the most significant peacetime economic plan in modern New Zealand history to cushion the impact of COVID-19 in the fight to support Kiwis\u2019 jobs and the domestic economy from the virus. The Government is united in doing everything we can to support New Zealand workers and businesses. We need our businesses to stay solvent to help with the economic recovery as we emerge from this health crisis. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000219\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bbded2ec-ac25-4a73-a380-3f4d87693084\u0022\u003EWe are also supporting business to help people in work so that, no matter what happens, as many New Zealanders as possible can continue to provide for their families and contribute to their local communities. The support already provided through the tax system alone is substantial, and this support includes $2 billion in tax deductions to landlords through depreciation on commercial buildings; the removal of 95,000 taxpayers from the provisional tax regime by raising the tax threshold to $5,000; allowing businesses to claim back more for spending on low-value assets like laptops and phones; and allowing interest to be waived. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000220\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bbded2ec-ac25-4a73-a380-3f4d87693084\u0022\u003EThese measures provide wide-scale support and protection in response to the coronavirus. But we must also not overlook the fact that some sectors, individuals, and businesses face unique difficulties which we can and must help alleviate. This cross-Government omnibus bill therefore contains some non-tax proposals aimed at supporting New Zealanders to get through this crisis.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000221\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bbded2ec-ac25-4a73-a380-3f4d87693084\u0022\u003EI\u2019ll provide a quick overview of the proposals in the bill. Loss carry-back: under existing tax loss continuity rules, business losses can be carried forward to reduce taxable income in future years. This helps prevent over-taxation, but, for businesses facing difficult times ahead, carrying the loss forward postpones the benefit of being able to claim losses and means that a business would still incur a tax liability from the previous year. Carrying a loss forward also carries the risk that a business may lose that loss through ownership changes, which is especially relevant in a time where ownership adjustments may be required to support businesses. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000222\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bbded2ec-ac25-4a73-a380-3f4d87693084\u0022\u003EThe Government is aware that many businesses might have made a profit in the 2019-20 year, but then, due to the virus, have a large loss from 2020-21 to carry forward as would be the usual procedure under the current rules. We are therefore proposing a loss carry-back measure which would enable businesses to offset the loss made in the current year against the profit made in the previous year. This loss carry-back policy will also help established businesses which have been profitable but will dip into loss because of the COVID-induced economic downturn. We want to help those businesses. They are viable but vulnerable. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000223\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bbded2ec-ac25-4a73-a380-3f4d87693084\u0022\u003EBusinesses will get a refund of some of the tax already paid in the previous year, thereby having a positive impact on their cash flow in the current year, when this really counts. They\u2019re still paying the right amount of tax in terms of the profit they\u2019ve made over those two years, but they are able to take advantage of their losses now. This is an urgent measure. The next instalment of provisional tax is due on 7 May, and we want those businesses to know what they have to do and what their options are. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000224\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bbded2ec-ac25-4a73-a380-3f4d87693084\u0022\u003EAdministrative flexibility for Inland Revenue: the Government is proposing a law change to give Inland Revenue the discretion to quickly provide an extension to due dates or time frames or to modify other administrative requirements for taxpayers affected by COVID-19. This could, for example, include extending deadlines where an affected taxpayer has difficulty filing tax returns or paying provisional or terminal tax. This could cover any taxpayer affected by COVID-19 and could apply to individuals, companies, trusts, or so on. It would allow the IRD to anticipate new issues for compliance as they arise and to act swiftly. It could be applied for any time frame or procedural requirement across all tax or social policy obligations set out in the revenue Acts. We\u2019re proposing that this discretionary power be limited to an 18-month period, would operate retrospectively, and only apply to the benefit of the taxpayer. This measure is also urgent because of a number of practical issues with compliance that have already arisen due to COVID-19, and we don\u2019t want taxpayers stressing about this.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000225\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bbded2ec-ac25-4a73-a380-3f4d87693084\u0022\u003EBenefit to Kiwis overseas: because of lockdown travel restrictions, some New Zealanders have been stranded overseas and forced to be away from home much longer than they intended. For some, this means they could be at risk of losing their pension and benefit payments. The Minister for Social Development has made a welfare programme to ensure that equivalent payments of New Zealand superannuation, veterans pension, main benefits, orphans benefit, unsupported child benefit, and supplementary assistance can be made from the date that the person had expected to return to New Zealand, even if they have not made it home yet. The bill proposes that these payments will be subject to the same tax and child support rules as the payments they normally receive from the Ministry of Social Development. This would also cover any Working for Families entitlements. The bill represents a cross-Government response to the economic upheaval. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000226\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bbded2ec-ac25-4a73-a380-3f4d87693084\u0022\u003ESo I now turn to some other non-tax measures. Credit contracts legislation amendment: the Government also proposes to change the timing of various measures introduced by the Credit Contracts Legislation Amendment Act 2019. Some protections relating to high cost loans only are proposed to be moved forward. They are: a limit on the accumulation of interest in fees capped at 100 percent of loan principal, a prohibition on charging compound interest, and a cap on default fees. These protections were intended to commence from 1 June 2020. These protections were always important and now they are urgent. The proposed new commencement date would be the day after the bill receives Royal assent. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000227\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bbded2ec-ac25-4a73-a380-3f4d87693084\u0022\u003EThis bill also enables a delay of broader reforms in the amendment Act. These were to come into force from 1 April 2021. The bill therefore shifts the backstop commencement date to April 2023, but the reforms can be brought into force prior to that date by Order in Council. For efficiency, the bill also provides for the coming into force of a range of technical and other provisions of the amendment Act, which would otherwise have been brought into force by an Order in Council. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000228\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bbded2ec-ac25-4a73-a380-3f4d87693084\u0022\u003EAnimal welfare: people who own or care for animals perform many routine procedures on animals such as docking lambs\u2019 tails. These surgical procedures are currently performed by non-veterinarians. However, an amendment to the Animal Welfare Act 1999, due to come into effect soon, will require these types of procedures to become veterinarian only. The Ministry for Primary Industries (MPI) had intended to discuss new regulations with owners and people in charge of animals before the amendment came into effect. These regulations would allow non-veterinarians to continue to perform some procedures under certain circumstances. However, the lockdown has prevented this. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000229\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bbded2ec-ac25-4a73-a380-3f4d87693084\u0022\u003EThis bill now proposes to delay the date the amendment to the Animal Welfare Act comes into effect and therefore the immediate need for regulations to align with the amendment. This will allow people who own animals or are in charge of animals to continue to undertake these procedures and allow MPI time to have those discussions with stakeholders once lockdown regulations have eased. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000230\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bbded2ec-ac25-4a73-a380-3f4d87693084\u0022\u003EThe final measure I wish to mention relates to State-owned enterprises. Extension of time frame for providing plan documents: State-owned enterprises, departments, and Crown entities are required to prepare and finalise a number of planning documents for responsible Ministers by 30 June 2020 or 1 May 2020 for statements of corporate intent and statements of performance expectations. Meeting this requirement is going to be challenging under the current restrictions, and these entities are likely to find themselves in breach of the State-Owned Enterprises Act 1986, the Public Finance Act 1989, and the Crown Entities Act 2004. The Government is therefore proposing that if responsible or shareholding Ministers are satisfied that certain criteria are met, the SOE be allowed up to three months to produce these planning documents. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000231\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bbded2ec-ac25-4a73-a380-3f4d87693084\u0022\u003EIn conclusion, the effects of the coronavirus are being felt in different parts of our economy and society in different ways. This cross-Government bill is one which is urgently needed for a cross-section of society, because we must do our best for all New Zealanders. I commend this bill to the House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002253f86481-33c1-48b2-893b-c11cc0bd673d\u0022 data-id=\u0022e5eff1bca1ac446baef933f94cd5b2f0\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000232\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002253f86481-33c1-48b2-893b-c11cc0bd673d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022e5eff1bca1ac446baef933f94cd5b2f0\u0022\u003EHon PAUL GOLDSMITH (National):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Mr Speaker. I stand for the National Party to support this urgent bill: the COVID-19 Response (Taxation and Other Regulatory Urgent Measures) Bill. We are supporting this bill\u2014with a little bit of anxiety because it is a bill dealing with taxation changes. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000233\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002253f86481-33c1-48b2-893b-c11cc0bd673d\u0022\u003ENormally, you would want to spend a lot of time making sure that you get it right because just about every time you go anywhere near the tax Act, you find that you make more mistakes than you don\u2019t and you have to come back and fix them. And so in a perfect world, we would have had more time about this. Obviously, it needs to be in before 7 May. I still argue we probably could have had a two- or three-day select committee process to just give people a little bit of a chance to look at the detail, particularly around the temporary loss carrying back regime and to make sure that it covers all bases. But we are where we are and we are here to support the Government in trying to get these measures through, so I\u2019ll confine my comments to this temporary loss carry-back regime.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000234\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002253f86481-33c1-48b2-893b-c11cc0bd673d\u0022\u003EI suppose the broader point is one that we\u2019re under a period of real pressure for small and medium sized enterprises particularly. We\u2019ve just got to remember that we\u2019ve made decisions in the interests of the nation around public health which have meant that many businesses have been forced to close. I heard on Radio New Zealand this morning somebody saying, \u201COh, well, you know, what\u2019s all this worry about small businesses? They like to capitalise the gains and socialise the losses and perhaps we shouldn\u2019t be spending so much money on them.\u201D \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000235\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002253f86481-33c1-48b2-893b-c11cc0bd673d\u0022\u003EI think that\u2019s a very unfair thing to think and to say, because, ultimately, what we\u2019re dealing with is businesses that have been told that, in the national interest, they cannot trade for an extended period of time and that is the justification for the rest of society, many of whom have carried on relatively unscathed from an economic point of view, to help those businesses through to relieve the pressure so as to save jobs. We\u2019re not going to save every job but we can reduce the economic carnage somewhat. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000236\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002253f86481-33c1-48b2-893b-c11cc0bd673d\u0022\u003ESo this proposal, the temporary loss carry-back regime, is one element of the broader effort to try and help those companies. So if they were in profit in the last couple of years and they\u2019ve fallen to a loss-making situation in this year, which many of course will have, then they\u2019ll be able to even out those losses and gains over a couple of years and thereby get some money back. That will help a few businesses.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000237\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002253f86481-33c1-48b2-893b-c11cc0bd673d\u0022\u003EI would make the point, though, that it certainly won\u2019t help every business, every small business\u2014particularly at the small end of town, many businesses are owned by mum and dad owners, and they take most of the profits of the company in the form of a salary for an owner-operator, and the actual company itself may not have any profit at all. It wouldn\u2019t necessarily mean that it\u2019s not a profitable business; it\u2019s just that the profits were taken in the form of salary and tax was paid in that respect. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000238\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002253f86481-33c1-48b2-893b-c11cc0bd673d\u0022\u003ESo there\u2019ll be a kind of a random element to it at that smaller end of town where some businesses will benefit from this better than others. But, in so far as it goes, the Government\u2019s estimated it might be worth $3 billion\u2014I\u2019d be interested to see how it pans out; it may be, or it may be less, but it is one thing that will help.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000239\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002253f86481-33c1-48b2-893b-c11cc0bd673d\u0022\u003EI suppose it\u2019s a bit like some of the other options that were announced: the loans guarantee, which has had a pretty modest impact, and the wage subsidy, which has been very substantial: $10 billion. But it is important to make the point that most of that money is going to the workers as opposed to the companies themselves, which are struggling with many other costs, whether there may be rent or many ongoing lease costs or utility bills\u2014all those sorts of things. Those are the sorts of things that some of this tax money\u2014in the circumstances of the companies that get it\u2014will be able to help with. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000240\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002253f86481-33c1-48b2-893b-c11cc0bd673d\u0022\u003EI suppose the broader point that we would make is that it is necessary for the Government to go further in terms of offering relief to those businesses most affected, because we have got to remember that there are many companies out there right now that for the national interest have had zero revenue now for coming up to six weeks, and they don\u2019t know how many more weeks they\u2019re going to have zero revenue. It could be one or two weeks; it could be longer. These are on the back of decisions that were made\u2014and we heard today the Australian Prime Minister described them as extreme economic measures, more extreme economic measures than have been taken in Australia.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000241\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022fcc01b2ab04a49dca2222d3411d5824e\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Order! Order!\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000242\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002253f86481-33c1-48b2-893b-c11cc0bd673d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022bd014d8efd974758b60e85b2441e5419\u0022\u003EHon PAUL GOLDSMITH\u003C/span\u003E: Yeah, well, and that is why, Mr Speaker, this bill is important, and it is why we support it, given that the Government has made those decisions. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000243\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002253f86481-33c1-48b2-893b-c11cc0bd673d\u0022\u003EThey have been cautious with the lockdown. They have extended the lockdown. We hear very much the mantra of this Government: that we went hard, and that we went early. We can debate both of those things\u2014about the earliness\u2014but we can\u2019t debate about the hardness. They certainly did go hard. They went a lot harder than Australia, and as a result of that the economic consequences will be severe. This bill is an attempt to try and reduce that pain by getting some cash back in the hands of small businesses. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000244\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002253f86481-33c1-48b2-893b-c11cc0bd673d\u0022\u003EThe broad point I\u2019d make is, yes, thank you very much. We agree with that and we support it, but we make the point that its impact will be\u2014it will vary enormously between companies, just depending on the way that they are structured and the way that they are organised. It will help some companies, but it won\u2019t be anywhere near enough to help a lot of companies get through this difficult period, and, as a result of that, many Kiwis will lose their jobs. So we support the Government in this bill and we encourage them to go further. Thank you.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022dbaac12b-3efa-4d95-a08d-f0f637a48bab\u0022 data-id=\u0022f4e0a1e2866045fcb052b0f69abe921b\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000245\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dbaac12b-3efa-4d95-a08d-f0f637a48bab\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022f4e0a1e2866045fcb052b0f69abe921b\u0022\u003ECHL\u00D6E SWARBRICK (Green):\u003C/span\u003E E Te M\u0101ngai, t\u0113n\u0101 koe. T\u0113n\u0101 koutou e Te Whare. It\u2019s a pleasure to rise and speak on behalf of the Green Party of Aotearoa New Zealand in this one contribution that we will be making to this taxation bill today, the COVID-19 Response (Taxation and Other Regulatory Urgent Measures) Bill. It is a rare circumstance in this Chamber that we do find consensus across the floor, but, of course, what has been elucidated by the Minister of Revenue is that these are extraordinary times and it is incredibly important that we are providing immediate relief, particularly for those small businesses.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000246\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dbaac12b-3efa-4d95-a08d-f0f637a48bab\u0022\u003EOf course, the Minister himself has outlined that this bill broadly does two things, the first of which is to implement targeted measures for those economically impacted by COVID-19, particularly business and small business. The second is measures to address regulatory compliance issues that COVID-19 has prompted or exposed, particularly pertaining to that first broad subset of issues. We have, of course, loss carry-backs, which the Minister spoke to in quite a lot of depth, which is, basically, access to previous tax payments as cash refunds from a forecasted loss offset against the tax paid on profit from the previous year. There is also administrative flexibility for Inland Revenue, and tax treatment for New Zealanders who are stranded overseas during this pandemic.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000247\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dbaac12b-3efa-4d95-a08d-f0f637a48bab\u0022\u003EI think it\u2019s also important to speak to one of the seemingly more minor or technical amendments that this piece of legislation creates\u2014that being bringing forward the commencement date of the Credit Contracts Act, and this is a really important thing, particularly for cracking down on loan sharks by way of enabling us to protect our most vulnerable consumers, who are often exploited by those seeking to exploit that vulnerability, that need for immediate access to cash. So, of course, the Greens are incredibly in favour of that amendment.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000248\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dbaac12b-3efa-4d95-a08d-f0f637a48bab\u0022\u003EJust in summation of why the Greens are standing today and supporting this bill along with, I understand, every other member in the Chamber: I want to refer to some of the kind of broader economic thoughts that have been raised by other speakers thus far, noting as well that the Minister of Revenue himself has spoken to the need for greater economic investment, transformation, and obviously that there are further circumstances and context shifts that we will be facing. Here, inside of this legislation, we can see that there is primarily a focus, of course, on those small businesses that are going to be immediately impacted, and only a so-called minor or technical focus on those vulnerable consumers. And here I think that we see the way that balance is regularly, perhaps far too often, struck in pieces of legislation and policy like this.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000249\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dbaac12b-3efa-4d95-a08d-f0f637a48bab\u0022\u003EIt so happens that oftentimes those who have access to the levers of power, those who have the wealth to do things like lobby, are those who end up with the kinds of changes that they need to see in legislation to ensure that they don\u2019t end up losing out.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000250\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dbaac12b-3efa-4d95-a08d-f0f637a48bab\u0022\u003EI want to reflect on the statement that was made by the Secretary for Education, Iona Holsted, who said that this pandemic didn\u2019t cause inequity but in fact exposed it. This is where moving forward with pieces like this COVID-19 Response (Taxation and Other Regulatory Urgent Measures) Bill, we recognise where the breadth of focus has thus far gone. And we recognise the importance, moving forward, of focusing on equity and reducing that wealth gap, which existed far before this pandemic.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000251\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dbaac12b-3efa-4d95-a08d-f0f637a48bab\u0022\u003EJust in conclusion, it\u2019s pretty obvious here that in measures such as this, we are borrowing from the future and that we need to be investing that wisely. We have the opportunity to break the routine of so-called normality, which upheld that inequality we took for granted, which was already fraying under pressure far before this pandemic came into effect. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000252\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dbaac12b-3efa-4d95-a08d-f0f637a48bab\u0022\u003EThe Greens are proud to support this legislation and hope that it is just the beginning of broader reforms to come.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022 data-id=\u002285fd9807580a42fa89e7daf92a0482e7\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000253\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002285fd9807580a42fa89e7daf92a0482e7\u0022\u003EDAVID SEYMOUR (Leader\u2014ACT):\u003C/span\u003E Well, thank you very much, Mr Speaker. I rise on behalf of ACT in support of the COVID-19 Response (Taxation and Other Regulatory Urgent Measures) Bill, and I think it\u2019s a bill worth supporting for some of the clauses that provide relief to businesses struggling with cash flow at this time. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000254\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003EI have to say that while the urgency of the situation is obvious to everybody, it needs to be clear to everybody that we are legislating at the speed of light. Normally, a bill like this would be drafted over several months in consultation with different interest groups by the Government, and through the full machinery of Government it would go through a Cabinet process over several weeks, it would be introduced to Parliament, it would sit there for several days so that everybody could study it, and then it would be debated for the first time and debated a second time and a third time, with public consultation and committees in between\u2014a process that usually takes a year. Today, we\u2019ve had this bill put on the Table and we have to make a decision and vote on it almost straight away, and we should always be wary of that, particularly when we get into issues as complex and as notorious for creating unintended consequences as taxation law. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000255\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003EWhy support it? Well, because the temporary loss carry-back scheme, allowing businesses that had paid company tax in a prior year to access that tax\u2014effectively, bringing tax paid on last year\u2019s profits back to this year as a refund\u2014will be vital to a lot of businesses. It\u2019s worth noting that a lot of smaller businesses don\u2019t often record a lot of profit. They actually cycle income in and out of their owner, which could just be one person\u2014and, often, one person who has put their house up to secure loans to that business\u2014and they won\u2019t benefit from this, which is why I was pleased to see something called a small-business cash-flow scheme. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000256\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003EThat sounds fantastic, but what I\u2019d say to the Minister of Revenue is that given the speed of the lawmaking, there\u2019s going to have to be some really good communication about how this works, because we\u2019ve seen it with the case of the business loan guarantee. It\u2019s taken three or four weeks before it\u2019s emerged what some of the details are and how much is really guaranteed, and where in the order of creditors the Government and the Crown versus the borrower actually falls. What borrowers have found in that case is that they actually may have to personally guarantee 100 percent. The Government only guarantees 80 percent after all other avenues such as personal guarantees have been exhausted, and that\u2019s a communications issue, because it\u2019s really taken three weeks for most people to understand it. So this small-business cash-flow scheme sounds great; I just hope that the Government does enough communication so that people can understand it and access it. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000257\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003ESimilarly, tax policy treatment of pension and benefit equivalent payments\u2014a very sensible thing for a Government to do. A lot of New Zealanders\u2014I know people, and I have constituents stranded overseas through no fault of their own, and they don\u2019t want to be treated differently from the point of view of taxation due to those circumstances beyond their control. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000258\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003EI\u2019ll just comment briefly on the credit contracts Act legislation being brought into force earlier. As a member of the Finance and Expenditure Committee, I was heavily involved in that bill being made, and I have to say my judgment was that the Government made a call that was wrong to ignore all the advice it had previously received that capping rates of interest would not actually achieve what it wanted, because there were so many workarounds. All it would do is make loans more administratively burdensome and not actually reduce the interest charged, and that\u2019s been the experience of the UK. I don\u2019t really understand why. Some unkind people might say that for political expediency, the Government abandoned that advice and introduced it, but I don\u2019t think it\u2019s a very good bill, and I\u2019m not sure that it\u2019s going to have the effects intended. But it was going to happen anyway, so we support it in this instance. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000259\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003ESo it\u2019s a bill that is going to have some help\u2014a few hits, a few misses\u2014but, on the whole, it is worthwhile supporting, and so I commend it to the House. Thank you, Mr Speaker. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022c0f78f60-c2fd-46f4-8138-72f39692fc20\u0022 data-id=\u00221be241a091e74dd3b5a963ca88742546\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000260\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c0f78f60-c2fd-46f4-8138-72f39692fc20\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00221be241a091e74dd3b5a963ca88742546\u0022\u003EHon TODD McCLAY (National\u2014Rotorua):\u003C/span\u003E Mr Speaker, thank you very much. I too stand to support this legislation, and echo the comments of my colleague David Seymour, who I think has it just about exactly correct. We do so because for all New Zealanders, they need certainty, as much certainty as possible, after what\u2019s happened over the last five weeks. Secondly, we know that for so many individuals, businesses, and the individuals who own those businesses, they\u2019re going through very difficult times; actually, this House cannot give them enough certainty today, because they are not aware of what the next steps will be in as far as the economic harm that\u2019s been done to our economy as a result of the Government\u2019s shutdown.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000261\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c0f78f60-c2fd-46f4-8138-72f39692fc20\u0022\u003EBut there are a number of provisions in this legislation that are going to help. The temporary loss carry-back will be of help to some, but unfortunately not enough. The reason for that is if you take a small business in New Zealand, very few of them, actually, who use their accountants run large profits, and so a lot of them will have paid a lot of tax last year. I did ask the Minister, when he was before the committee, I think, a week ago, the number of businesses in New Zealand that forecast to be able to have these temporary losses carried back so that they would get a refund. He was able to talk about the value\u2014\u201Cthe cost\u201D, I think he said\u2014to the Government, how much the Government was giving out, but not the number. It\u2019s the number that is very important because we are a country of small businesses; we\u2019re a country of small-business men and women. There will be some larger corporations that will be able to use this and claim a larger share of the amount of the tax the Government will be giving back than necessarily should be the case for the number\u2014the great number\u2014of small businesses that need help.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000262\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c0f78f60-c2fd-46f4-8138-72f39692fc20\u0022\u003EIf we just take a small business that maybe made $10,000 or $20,000 profit last year, which sounds modest to some, but for a small business in New Zealand, for a shopkeeper or somebody that runs a flower shop or a butcher shop or maybe a greengrocer that hasn\u2019t been able to open for the last five weeks\u2014and it will be more than seven weeks until they can open\u2014if they have made $20,000 worth of profit in the last year, they get to carry forward only about $5,600. Whilst that will be a start for them, if they are losing money this year that will be a start for them that\u2019s nowhere near enough to help them with the significant costs they have incurred or have built up over that last seven weeks of the lockdown.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000263\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c0f78f60-c2fd-46f4-8138-72f39692fc20\u0022\u003EEqually, we\u2019ve been talking a lot about what other support is needed. I would have liked to have seen in this bill, with more urgency, other things that would help small businesses.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000264\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002244a7b0873d4144fbb3caa65c9fc9e96a\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Talk about what\u2019s in the bill.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000265\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c0f78f60-c2fd-46f4-8138-72f39692fc20\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022917f00cdd20c467cbc6626d18247c601\u0022\u003EHon TODD McCLAY\u003C/span\u003E: I raise a point of order, Mr Speaker. I accept that the scope can be very narrow, but what we have agreed with the Government is all stages of this legislation in less than one hour.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000266\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00228719b0fd1b38423bb2993a3a8d820b75\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: I\u2019ve been pretty liberal on the member in the first three minutes of his speech. I\u2019m not going to be doctrinaire but I am going to ask the member to address the bill as it\u2019s emerged from the committee.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000267\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c0f78f60-c2fd-46f4-8138-72f39692fc20\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022b2b1ef52d81d4c4abc4c5c7baed342d8\u0022\u003EHon TODD McCLAY\u003C/span\u003E: Well, Mr Speaker, thank you very much. So the only treatment for small businesses in here that will help them\u2014because this is a measure to help small businesses in New Zealand, as a result of the significant economic harm that has been done to them as a result of the lockdown\u2014largely, is if they had paid tax previously, they can bring it forward. Over and above that, there is not significant assistance for them. What this bill should be doing, in addition to that, is providing so very, very much more.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000268\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c0f78f60-c2fd-46f4-8138-72f39692fc20\u0022\u003ENow, the challenge that we have is in the 10 minutes available to us to talk about only the part of this bill that is going to help actually does a great injustice to all of those New Zealanders who have been suffering. So I implore the Government\u2014and the Opposition\u2019s supporting this because it is an important step forward and will do things for them\u2014to do so very much more.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000269\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c0f78f60-c2fd-46f4-8138-72f39692fc20\u0022\u003EI ask the Minister to think about changing this legislation. Well, the problem we have is he can\u2019t, because we are putting it through in less than one hour. So the injustice that is done to New Zealanders in this Parliament not being able to have a full and frank debate does not outweigh the urgency of putting this through so that support can be there, but the Minister could have taken a little bit more time and sent it to committee for a day or two to see what additions could have been done to help so very much more\u2014albeit that\u2019s not the case here today.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000270\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c0f78f60-c2fd-46f4-8138-72f39692fc20\u0022\u003EOne of the things that I think we need to be very mindful of is that the Government is passing this legislation to try and keep New Zealanders in jobs, in work. So if you look at the support that\u2019s available to businesses through this cashing out of losses, it means that more businesses, we hope, will survive. Every time a business is able to continue to trade, it means the owners keep their jobs and their livelihoods, and it also means that the people they employ do, as well. There are very many more ways that the Government needs to look to support New Zealanders to keep their jobs and keep in work. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000271\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c0f78f60-c2fd-46f4-8138-72f39692fc20\u0022\u003EWe\u2019ve seen, just this week, suggestions of significant job loss on the part of Air New Zealand. Air New Zealand are struggling because they have no revenue, virtually, as so many other businesses in New Zealand. I don\u2019t believe they will be able to use this to the degree that we would want them to\u2014this carrying forward of any profits they\u2019ve had previously. But if it was more generous than this, or had looked more closely, then there was the chance that actually they could, and every single person in New Zealand that now faces an uncertain future as a result of redundancy could well keep their job. I\u2019m trying to remember whether Air New Zealand had a profit last year or a loss; either way they are in a loss-making situation now. There could well be some relief for them in this, but not the same degree of relief there could have been when the Government provided them with a $900 million loan facility, which is very important. Unfortunately, they appear to be paying the Government about 6 percent in interest more than if they had gone to the market to get that money. We see that Qantas has borrowed a similar amount of money at a much lower rate. That would have meant if they had actually gone to the market\u2014or the Government had been in a position to do so rather than relying upon whether they made a profit and they can carry it forward and get a refund and a loss\u2014indeed they would have had about $54 million more available to them over the next year to invest their company and to perhaps keep more New Zealanders working with Air New Zealand.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000272\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c0f78f60-c2fd-46f4-8138-72f39692fc20\u0022\u003EThe final point that I want to make is I think it is appropriate that the Government is looking to help New Zealanders who, through no fault of their own, are not able to get back to the country, and therefore their pensions, and other entitlements around support from the State, won\u2019t be available to them. Indeed, I encourage the Government to look more broadly and more widely at how we can help New Zealanders than just this measure. I think it\u2019s appropriate and I do think it\u2019s very important, but there will be many New Zealanders overseas\u2014but so many more in New Zealand\u2014who are going to struggle more than anybody would want them to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000273\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c0f78f60-c2fd-46f4-8138-72f39692fc20\u0022\u003EThis is a good start. The Opposition, the National Party, is happy to support this legislation. But at the same time, I implore the Government, on behalf of New Zealanders who are doing it hard with their businesses who still can\u2019t open, New Zealanders who are sitting at home who soon, as we go to level 2, will be able to go out and go back to the workplace and will find that their jobs no longer exist\u2014I implore the Government to do much, much more, much more quickly than what is in this legislation. Thank you.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022859e13f9-33bb-41bb-b2f0-d848eaf25407\u0022 data-id=\u0022621a166ad7854693b45a668c33e12f05\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000274\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022859e13f9-33bb-41bb-b2f0-d848eaf25407\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022621a166ad7854693b45a668c33e12f05\u0022\u003EANDREW BAYLY (National\u2014Hunua):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you very much, Mr Speaker. The first thing I\u2019d just like to say\u2014obviously, we\u2019re going to support this bill, but I think we\u2019ve missed an opportunity. I received a copy of this bill, which is not insignificant, at 1.39 this afternoon, and here we are a couple of hours later having to give a speech on it, and it is quite a detailed bill. So I think we have lost a little bit of the opportunity to be able to work collaboratively with the Government and to have proper opportunity to discuss this and work through it. Obviously, there is no select committee stage and there is, in fact, no proper Parliament stage to go through all three readings and the committee of the whole House. So my first point is I wish we could\u2019ve had the opportunity to collaborate with the Government, because I think we could\u2019ve improved this bill.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000275\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022859e13f9-33bb-41bb-b2f0-d848eaf25407\u0022\u003EThe second point I want to make is one that I made yesterday when the Minister of Finance was lauding the success of this major part of reform to help businesses in their hour of need. There is no doubt that this bill gives some support to small businesses, but in my mind, I believe that there is a tendency to gild the lily about this bill. What this bill is about is the Government acting as a temporary bank in terms of banking losses that companies would be making, and allowing them to claim it in the preceding year rather than delaying it until next year. In terms of a cash payment, that is all we\u2019ve done, is changed the timing of when that occurs. The actual net cost to the Government of this scheme, using the $1.3 billion, is actually the cost of one year\u2019s financing, $3.1 billion\u2014or, in other terms, a $90 million cost to the Government. That is the net cost to the Government of this package, and so it should be described as a $90 million bill. But I do accept the proposition that by doing and acting as a bank, the Government, effectively, is giving the opportunity for businesses to access or, in effect, pay less tax than they would\u2019ve otherwise been required to do so by a period of one year. That is useful in the time of need we\u2019ve got right now.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000276\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022859e13f9-33bb-41bb-b2f0-d848eaf25407\u0022\u003EBut my second, or third point, actually, is I can\u2019t understand where the $3.1 billion comes from. We actually haven\u2019t had an explanation of it. If you look at the projections for the 2020 tax year, it was expected that corporate tax would generate $14.5 billion. So we\u2019ve got this figure of $3.1 billion that\u2019s been quoted ad nauseum. I do not understand how that is justified and what the basis is for it, and, hopefully, the Minister of Revenue might be able to shed some light on it. But that represents roughly 20 percent of all the profits, so does that mean that 80 percent of companies are still going to have to pay full company tax, or that this is the only portion that they\u2019re entitled to claim against last year\u2019s profits? That is an aspect of this bill I haven\u2019t had any explanation on, either yesterday or today.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000277\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022859e13f9-33bb-41bb-b2f0-d848eaf25407\u0022\u003EI think, just explaining the bill\u2014and a number of the members have done it, and very adequately and well\u2014what this bill provides for is that either in the 2019-20 income year, and we\u2019re just at the close of the 2019-20 year, if you\u2019ve got a March balance date, or the 2020-21 income year, you can look at your situation and reassess your losses. The bill provides, though, that you may only claim it back retrospectively against one year\u2019s profit; and that\u2019s the issue with this, because for many companies, they may have made a profit last year but the loss this year will be substantially greater than that. Therefore, this mechanism is quite mean, in a way, because it hasn\u2019t actually given the ability for companies to recover all tax losses. Now, again, I\u2019m not underplaying the benefit of this scheme, but I think if we\u2019d been able to work collaboratively with the Government, we might\u2019ve been able to make it a fairer scheme.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000278\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022859e13f9-33bb-41bb-b2f0-d848eaf25407\u0022\u003EIt\u2019s generous in the sense that it allows you to look at two financial years, but you have to make the choice against which preceding company\u2019s year you will use it, and that is an issue both in terms of the accessibility of the tax deductibility, but also it actually brings into play a lot of the implementation issues. This is where we should\u2019ve had scrutiny in the Finance and Expenditure Committee, because if you anticipate that you\u2019re going to make a tax loss in either the 2019 or the 2020 or 2021 income year, you will need to reassess or re-estimate your tax in the preceding year. So that\u2019s OK, but for those doing so, you\u2019re potentially at risk for use of money at 8.6 percent, and the issue with that is that you need to make a re-estimate of the 2020 tax year now before you can carry it back to 2019, and you have to do it before 7 May, which is only in a few days\u2019 time. So if you\u2019re going to apply it for this financial year, in the next seven days you are required to sit down and re-estimate your profit or your loss and actually then go and make an adjustment through the IRD. Now, that\u2019s not easy, and that\u2019s not easy particularly in the environment that many people find themselves where they don\u2019t know what the current trading is\u2014if they\u2019re a retailer, haven\u2019t even reopened, and they\u2019re probably not going to reopen before 7 May. So it places on those entities a lot of concern and administration burden, right at a time when they\u2019re probably more worried about how they\u2019re going to survive.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000279\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022859e13f9-33bb-41bb-b2f0-d848eaf25407\u0022\u003EI think, also\u2014and this is getting into a little bit of the technical side of it\u2014to be able to access those losses, you will have to have required imputation credits, and, again, if you haven\u2019t got the imputation credits, you may not be able to access all of the losses. But for those small to medium sized enterprises that don\u2019t always rely on keeping the profits in their company, what they do in many cases\u2014and most small businesses in New Zealand do this\u2014is they actually strip out the profits in part by way of salaries to their shareholders. Now, if the shareholder salary is nil or reduced, there\u2019s a need to make a revised provisional tax payment before 7 May, and the issue with that is it then gives rise to things like interest on shareholder current accounts that may be overdrawn, and it also gives rise to how you then have to change your accounts if you\u2019re a business and what that means for the banking arrangements you may have with your bank, because what you\u2019re effectively doing is changing prior-period profits.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000280\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022859e13f9-33bb-41bb-b2f0-d848eaf25407\u0022\u003EThe other aspect to it is if the shareholders are changing their remuneration\u2014and it\u2019s all legitimate under this arrangement\u2014they will then have to reassess ACC. So whilst on the face of it this bill looks like it\u2019s going to provide a lot of benefit to people, the reality is, actually, it\u2019s quite a difficult ability for companies to be able to access, and it requires quite a lot of work right now. In many cases, businesses will not be entitled to actually access all the tax losses that they may be going to generate in this coming financial year, and I think that\u2019s a shame. I think if we\u2019d had the opportunity, as I said before, to be able to work together, it might\u2019ve been more helpful.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000281\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022859e13f9-33bb-41bb-b2f0-d848eaf25407\u0022\u003ENow, the last little bit I want to cover is the issue of child support payments, and, again, this bill refers to it in Part 1. The issue with child support payments is that they\u2019re set at March during the course of each year, and they\u2019re set for 12 months starting from 1 April. Now, of course, with the COVID crisis, those arrangements and what\u2019s happened in April mean that many people, parents, have lost their jobs and their situations have changed entirely. Something I\u2019ve spoken to the commissioner about that is very, very important is that those who have got revised child support payments need to be able to address those very quickly and make an application to the IRD, but in many cases, the IRD can\u2019t actually reduce those payments. They\u2019ve got limited capacity and capability around that. So it is an issue that people need to get in touch with the IRD about and to make them aware of the changed circumstances so that children do not miss out.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000282\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022859e13f9-33bb-41bb-b2f0-d848eaf25407\u0022\u003EBill read a third time.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n    \u003C/div\u003E\n    \u003Cdiv class=\u0022HpsHansard\u0022\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000283\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsProceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u0022e79e6f0aefdf4215be23cd547f1c4ed8\u0022\u003ESittings of the House\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000285\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u0022b73a8cdbfb7c4f81846aa3743dc9dfdc\u0022\u003ESittings of the House\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022 data-id=\u0022239a92d3af6545bc9fd3fdc03065dc10\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000284\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022239a92d3af6545bc9fd3fdc03065dc10\u0022\u003EHon CHRIS HIPKINS (Leader of the House):\u003C/span\u003E I seek leave for the House to now adjourn for the day.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022 data-id=\u0022ec79cd66591746d1a1008096fd661e86\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000286\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022ec79cd66591746d1a1008096fd661e86\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Is there any objection? There is none. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000287\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003EThe House adjourned at 3.53 p.m.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20200430302e67d225e642de841e14806bc59f74000288\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cbr\u003E\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n    \u003C/div\u003E\n  \u003C/body\u003E\n\u003C/html\u003E"