"\u003C!DOCTYPE html\u003E\u003Chtml xmlns:xlink=\u0022http://www.w3.org/1999/xlink\u0022 xmlns:xsi=\u0022http://www.w3.org/2007/XMLSchema-instance\u0022 xmlns:mml=\u0022http://www.w3.org/1998/Math/MathML\u0022\u003E\n  \u003Chead\u003E\n    \u003CMETA http-equiv=\u0022Content-Type\u0022 content=\u0022text/html; charset=utf-16\u0022\u003E\n    \u003Cmeta name=\u0022viewport\u0022 content=\u0022width=device-width, initial-scale=1\u0022\u003E\n  \u003C/head\u003E\n  \u003Cbody style=\u0022font-family:sans-serif; font-size:100%;\u0022\u003E\n    \u003Cdiv class=\u0022HpsHansard\u0022\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000001\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsProceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u0022e1c0f8bba9db4c73b2836cb63165fdda\u0022\u003ETUESDAY, 5 MAY 2020\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000003\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u0022ddebf2fa0a164af2ac1d6c9a3705ef73\u0022\u003ETUESDAY, 5 MAY 2020\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000002\u0022\u003EThe Speaker took the Chair at 2 p.m.\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000004\u0022\u003EKarakia.\u003C/p\u003E\n    \u003C/div\u003E\n    \u003Cdiv class=\u0022HpsHansard\u0022\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000005\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsProceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u002291099b5215834d31b1f2608c25ef0ced\u0022\u003ESpeaker\u2019s Rulings\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000006\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u0022b85d8333c62a4c559d6f10a609a87c9e\u0022\u003ESeating\u2014Request to Move\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022 data-id=\u00229e6aab36a0884855a5c128381da2519a\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000007\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00229e6aab36a0884855a5c128381da2519a\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Before we move on to questions, I am going to make an unusual request of Mr Brown and Rt Hon David Carter to move one seat each to the left and thereby have the separation.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000008\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e4b09a29-dfd3-42c0-8585-11463bd6077b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002249a91f637cc249629424482f23eeb4aa\u0022\u003ERt Hon David Carter\u003C/span\u003E: I don\u2019t like moving to the left.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000009\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a742cf8cf6dc4a8db86b324b254df08a\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: I thought that might be a problem for the member, but there\u2019s a first time for everything.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n    \u003C/div\u003E\n    \u003Cdiv class=\u0022HpsHansard\u0022\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000010\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsProceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u0022efaf86316d2a455eb5804a78ae65b2a8\u0022\u003EREMUNERATION AUTHORITY (MEMBERS OF PARLIAMENT REMUNERATION) AMENDMENT BILL (NO 3)\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000011\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u0022419be8120c424b8481dfb41736089d21\u0022\u003EIntroduction\u2014Leave Declined\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022 data-id=\u0022f69e73adb59f4b898322ec75251cb58b\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000012\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022f69e73adb59f4b898322ec75251cb58b\u0022\u003EDAVID SEYMOUR (Leader\u2014ACT):\u003C/span\u003E I seek leave for a bill in my name, the Remuneration Authority (Members of Parliament Remuneration) Amendment Bill (No\u00A03), to be set down for first reading at a time chosen by the Leader of the House this week, to stand referred to the Epidemic Response Committee for report back by 12 May 2020, and to pass through all remaining stages next week at a time determined by the Leader of the House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022 data-id=\u0022a226e0e32f834e48ae819f8749b04841\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000013\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022a226e0e32f834e48ae819f8749b04841\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Is there any objection to that? There is objection.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n    \u003C/div\u003E\n    \u003Cdiv class=\u0022HpsHansard\u0022\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000014\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsProceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u0022f75eb8037f854667ba847d47aa34985a\u0022\u003EOral Questions\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000015\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u0022e91926fbfb8e4fd89347ad31ba70e008\u0022\u003EQuestions to Ministers\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000016\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u0022af89d477fbb341f696b777c18f484480\u0022\u003EQuestion No. 1\u2014Prime Minister\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022badb0a39-849c-462a-b32f-77fc017c9fc2\u0022 data-id=\u00227f27687184ee47c68a6be399102192b6\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000017\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022badb0a39-849c-462a-b32f-77fc017c9fc2\u0022\u003E1. \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00227f27687184ee47c68a6be399102192b6\u0022\u003EHon SIMON BRIDGES (Leader of the Opposition)\u003C/span\u003E to the Prime Minister: Does she stand by all her Government\u2019s statements and actions?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022 data-id=\u0022b1e6bbdcc61543d2a63880d6e87198a5\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000018\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022b1e6bbdcc61543d2a63880d6e87198a5\u0022\u003ERt Hon JACINDA ARDERN (Prime Minister):\u003C/span\u003E Yes, particularly the Government\u2019s work to prevent and respond to COVID-19, including the announcement last week by Ministers Robertson and Nash to provide interest-free loans of up to $100,000 for a year to small businesses impacted by COVID-19, and the announcement by Minister Parker that we will fast track eligible development and infrastructure projects under the Resource Management Act to help get New Zealand moving again. The global pandemic is hitting every nation hard, and we are moving to cushion the blow for businesses and workers in this country. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000019\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022badb0a39-849c-462a-b32f-77fc017c9fc2\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022ea230ea4392545869c621fa33d3f628e\u0022\u003EHon Simon Bridges\u003C/span\u003E: What is Treasury\u2019s estimate of the number of New Zealanders that actually returned to work last week under level 3, as opposed to the 75 percent being technically available to return to work because restrictions had been eased?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000020\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022236c7717fd3c47028ecf7b329edc49c6\u0022\u003ERt Hon JACINDA ARDERN\u003C/span\u003E: My recollection is the estimates, and I will put emphasis on that: the estimates were an additional 400,000 New Zealanders.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000021\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022badb0a39-849c-462a-b32f-77fc017c9fc2\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00220176f73e54434be9a6204d777f15ea48\u0022\u003EHon Simon Bridges\u003C/span\u003E: Does she accept estimates from ANZ economists that New Zealand\u2019s economy will shrink by 10 percent this year, while Australia\u2019s will fall by less than 5?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000022\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00229651f4675a1a447f885bc1ddc9dcfad6\u0022\u003ERt Hon JACINDA ARDERN\u003C/span\u003E: I\u2019ve seen a range of estimates. Ultimately, though, what will be important are the final results coming out of both New Zealand and Australia, but you\u2019ll understand why my focus is on getting the New Zealand response right, both the health response which, if we succeed, is the best way we can support our economy by recovering quicker. There are very few scenarios we can fall back on with previous global experience. In fact, we have to look back as far as the flu of 1918, but one of the learnings from that was that those countries that moved quickest and hardest to try and prevent the pandemic taking hold were also the economies that recovered the fastest.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000023\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002274309f3f6e184a3d99732a5532b06377\u0022\u003ERt Hon Winston Peters\u003C/span\u003E: Did the Prime Minister also learn that the ANZ economist who was quoted on Q\u002BA last night said that \u201Cthe New Zealand / Australia recovery percentage speed would be about the same\u201D?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000024\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022badb0a39-849c-462a-b32f-77fc017c9fc2\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022d1d9e4918ee84b5685409fad636a3a44\u0022\u003EHon Simon Bridges\u003C/span\u003E: She doesn\u2019t do the economics.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000025\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00224f2e2bc9340245fcbe85bce42b8f32ce\u0022\u003ERt Hon JACINDA ARDERN\u003C/span\u003E: As I\u2019ve said, I heard a range of\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000026\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022badb0a39-849c-462a-b32f-77fc017c9fc2\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022030faa36449b4b0eb21bb28f27dcf440\u0022\u003EHon Simon Bridges\u003C/span\u003E: She doesn\u2019t, I\u2019m sorry.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000027\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00221d54880464414566a87dcd701820e4db\u0022\u003EHon Member\u003C/span\u003E: I\u2019ll let her know!\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000028\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00222b9024d04e434c838cbf00b466233e72\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Order! The member will resume her seat. I think the use of that pronoun back and forth is not that helpful, and I think it would be helpful if the interjections didn\u2019t go back and forth through the answers. The Rt Hon Prime Minister, please start again.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000029\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00221e08a88ad3ab48cbbf0302e945d4b6a6\u0022\u003ERt Hon JACINDA ARDERN\u003C/span\u003E: As the member will well know, my focus is on the New Zealand experience and making the right decision for New Zealanders. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000030\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022badb0a39-849c-462a-b32f-77fc017c9fc2\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002294efd7a59d934fd6bd87ea34b41528e9\u0022\u003EHon Simon Bridges\u003C/span\u003E: Considering Australia and New Zealand have had almost identical health outcomes, why is she still imposing tougher restrictions on economic activity than Australia?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000031\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022067c3704ead442d19de392ec6d2aaeec\u0022\u003ERt Hon JACINDA ARDERN\u003C/span\u003E: Again, as I\u2019ve reiterated in this House multiple times, at the time that New Zealand took the decision it did to go into lockdown which, as I recall, that member supported a mere five weeks ago, we had an infection rate modelled by the likes of Rodney Jones of five\u2014that was higher than Australia. We have a different population base, but also, even the health professionals within Australia reference the fact that there is more in common with our response than there are differences. As members in the House well know, I\u2019ve been in fairly frequent dialogue with the leadership in Australia, and there are a lot of similarities with our approach. Each of us is now looking at removing restrictions and the phased approach in order to do that.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000032\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022badb0a39-849c-462a-b32f-77fc017c9fc2\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00225365c6259afc4866b3f345e70b5d76ed\u0022\u003EHon Simon Bridges\u003C/span\u003E: Rather than making a decision at the start of lockdown and then leaving it, shouldn\u2019t the Prime Minister make a new decision every single day about how she can safely get more businesses back to business, saving jobs and livelihoods in this country?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000033\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00227a3b9d58bd38417ca113d24bda2bb457\u0022\u003ERt Hon JACINDA ARDERN\u003C/span\u003E: I\u2019d love to see the member\u2019s evidence that that\u2019s not exactly what we are doing. We make decisions every day to look after people\u2019s lives and their livelihoods. What the member needs to remember, of course, is that we cannot get ahead of ourselves. We need to lock in all of the results we\u2019ve had to date, we do have cycles of transmission with this virus we have to take into account, and we are listening to the evidence, the research, and the best available advice to make our decisions, which is in the best interests of our economy as well.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000034\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022badb0a39-849c-462a-b32f-77fc017c9fc2\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022eace34a5e83c40a38cc224e46a4fe43c\u0022\u003EHon Simon Bridges\u003C/span\u003E: Well, in light of that answer, is she telling the House that she may well bring forward the decision about whether to move to level 2 from Monday and it could, in fact, be made this week?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000035\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002299a5fb3d8d5a47fbb207feea83a2f577\u0022\u003ERt Hon JACINDA ARDERN\u003C/span\u003E: As I also said in the answer I just gave, if the member was listening, we have to look at the cycle of transmission. Making a decision today, based on a number today, is a reflection of level 4, not about where we are right now. That member may have the luxury of sitting on that side of the House, not bearing the consequences of a wrong move, but we do not. We have to factor in the livelihoods of every New Zealander.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000036\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022badb0a39-849c-462a-b32f-77fc017c9fc2\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002271d1e0e510a547f19c0112fbb5229bce\u0022\u003EHon Simon Bridges\u003C/span\u003E: What does she say to the business owner who emailed me to say, \u201CWe have a business in Australia as well as our New Zealand business. Our Australian business is pumping, sales for March were well ahead of last year. Contrast that with our New Zealand business: close to zero both March and April. I don\u2019t think the Government have any idea how bad things are going to get over here.\u201D\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000037\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00224641ffe43756422082a5a12be3964ade\u0022\u003ERt Hon JACINDA ARDERN\u003C/span\u003E: Again, I hope that is a business, therefore, that accessed the more than $10 billion we\u2019ve put into the wage subsidy to support those businesses.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000038\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022badb0a39-849c-462a-b32f-77fc017c9fc2\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022f9ebb8a0115846b6be47b3b03d97fdb0\u0022\u003EHon Simon Bridges\u003C/span\u003E: Does she accept New Zealand\u2019s more extreme economic lockdown\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000039\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00229c79998e592e474a9bbbff6d9a4b15dc\u0022\u003EHon Gerry Brownlee\u003C/span\u003E: It\u2019s just a complete misunderstanding of how it works.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000040\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00224563dd6da81e4f6b89c603551655bec5\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Order! Mr Brownlee.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000041\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022c9f01c7903364fe4a8423a990a891951\u0022\u003EHon Gerry Brownlee\u003C/span\u003E: Well, I don\u2019t want to be pinged across the House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000042\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00228144b247b67248cf8c4f8c953bb74f1b\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: I think the Leader of the Opposition doesn\u2019t need your assistance.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000043\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022c673e37b7b88454b8a4a2c6c76840647\u0022\u003EHon Gerry Brownlee\u003C/span\u003E: No, he certainly doesn\u2019t\u2014and nor your intervention.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000044\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022688eb667a1a74dd9a4934ef32bed20cc\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Mr Brownlee, I\u2019ve been trying to be quite flexible during this period with people who are breaching the rules as to interjections. It is just not helpful when he interjects over the top of his leader\u2019s question. Mr Bridges.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000045\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022badb0a39-849c-462a-b32f-77fc017c9fc2\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022bdbc6625eb024c8fbcd708429c00c175\u0022\u003EHon Simon Bridges\u003C/span\u003E: Does she accept New Zealand\u2019s more extreme economic lockdown is why the IMF predicts New Zealand\u2019s unemployment rate will rise by 5.1 percent this year, compared to just 2.4 in Australia?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000046\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022b14d89eb0cd24100bcc4b0fdec3717c1\u0022\u003ERt Hon JACINDA ARDERN\u003C/span\u003E: Again, the member\u2019s assessment is premature. If he looks at even some of the decisions recently from credit rating agencies, for instance, they are talking about the resilience in the New Zealand economy, and, of course, time will continue to tell. But I am confident that, based on the investment we put in early\u2014which included things like our wage subsidy, which went out the door faster than Australia\u2019s support\u2014including our interventions to support businesses through IRD, including the small business loan scheme, and our focus on getting back to a level of normality and for businesses to operate as soon as possible, that will then bear out in the results we have. It is simply premature to make comparisons. The final point I\u2019ll make is, having spoken to my Australian counterparts, they have more in common with our approach than the member describes.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000047\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022badb0a39-849c-462a-b32f-77fc017c9fc2\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022af82ab6a50774e66938363ea08182c38\u0022\u003EHon Simon Bridges\u003C/span\u003E: Is her Government taking into account the fact that there have been 1,000 job losses a day so far under lockdown in its decision about whether to move out of level 3 next week?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000048\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022fb8a347ab363437fa7f651c16eca4a29\u0022\u003ERt Hon JACINDA ARDERN\u003C/span\u003E: Of course we take into account economic impacts. We also take into account the economic impact of yo-yoing between levels and further outbreaks.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000049\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u00221a325b44e7564bc89d208762f3a0d559\u0022\u003EQuestion No. 2\u2014Finance\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002253f86481-33c1-48b2-893b-c11cc0bd673d\u0022 data-id=\u002220c3a4cf4e4841e9ba0b1a1304fd2773\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000050\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002253f86481-33c1-48b2-893b-c11cc0bd673d\u0022\u003E2. \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002220c3a4cf4e4841e9ba0b1a1304fd2773\u0022\u003EHon PAUL GOLDSMITH (National)\u003C/span\u003E to the Minister of Finance: What advice, if any, beyond the economic scenarios published on 14 April 2020, has he received from Treasury during the COVID-19 health and economic crisis?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022 data-id=\u002263156aee3d9e4788b19434a7ecb9dbcb\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000051\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002263156aee3d9e4788b19434a7ecb9dbcb\u0022\u003EHon GRANT ROBERTSON (Minister of Finance):\u003C/span\u003E As the member might imagine, I have received a considerable amount of advice from the Treasury on a wide range of matters during the time period that he specifies. This includes advice on the many announcements that the Government has made, including advice on the wage subsidy scheme developed with the business community to protect jobs and incomes and keep businesses and workers connected during the lockdown; advice on the Small Business Cashflow (Loan) Scheme to boost cash flow and help viable businesses with costs like rent, which has been welcomed by the business community; advice on the business finance guarantee scheme, a partnership between the Government and banks to get working capital out to business; and advice on the largest business tax support package in modern New Zealand history to support cash flow, encourage investment, and make it easier for businesses to manage their tax obligations during the crisis.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000052\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002253f86481-33c1-48b2-893b-c11cc0bd673d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022dd548ae580f046dfb32306b8b1e18c1d\u0022\u003EHon Paul Goldsmith\u003C/span\u003E: Why has none of this advice been released?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000053\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00221eaa76e443de482eb565a0bbe5396b29\u0022\u003EHon GRANT ROBERTSON\u003C/span\u003E: Decisions around the release of the advice have been taken under the normal rules that we have, and I\u2019m sure, in time, the member will receive it.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000054\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002253f86481-33c1-48b2-893b-c11cc0bd673d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022beac3cabbca941cdbdc11f91c9936f5b\u0022\u003EHon Paul Goldsmith\u003C/span\u003E: Does the Minister think this is in any way a normal situation where the normal rules of disclosure apply?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000055\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002281b2abc6e04747a1b8225ca29c6deb8a\u0022\u003EHon GRANT ROBERTSON\u003C/span\u003E: As the member knows, I\u2019ve realised the situation we\u2019re in. I\u2019ve come to the Epidemic Response Committee on the occasions that I\u2019ve been invited, I have provided information to that, and, as I say, I\u2019m sure the material the member wants will be released in due course.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000056\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002253f86481-33c1-48b2-893b-c11cc0bd673d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022566380ce17f444669ec8dc47427419dd\u0022\u003EHon Paul Goldsmith\u003C/span\u003E: Why does he not trust New Zealanders with this information now?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000057\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022d29e47bf73a843558395f867d74ee4dc\u0022\u003EHon GRANT ROBERTSON\u003C/span\u003E: I do trust New Zealanders.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000058\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002253f86481-33c1-48b2-893b-c11cc0bd673d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00224594d1f38dbf40fca3fadbcc9ad32570\u0022\u003EHon Paul Goldsmith\u003C/span\u003E: What was the nature of Treasury\u2019s advice on the Small Business Cashflow (Loan) Scheme, mistakenly enacted last Thursday?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000059\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00229d183d9a68b047d7b4ec1399498a7282\u0022\u003EHon GRANT ROBERTSON\u003C/span\u003E: I reject the premise of the member\u2019s question. This is a scheme that has been worked on for some time\u2014including advice from the Treasury about how to best assist small businesses\u2014in addition to the wage subsidy scheme. It\u2019s a scheme that\u2019s been widely welcomed by people in the small-business sector as one that will get money into their pockets and help with cash flow.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000060\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002253f86481-33c1-48b2-893b-c11cc0bd673d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022765dbb1e8dc2417c870eeff450b682d9\u0022\u003EHon Paul Goldsmith\u003C/span\u003E: How could he possibly dispute the fact that the loan scheme was mistakenly enacted last Thursday?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000061\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022d0326ab13c024271b5d8ee843e9367eb\u0022\u003EHon GRANT ROBERTSON\u003C/span\u003E: The loan scheme was intended to be announced this week. It ended up in a piece of legislation that, I believe, will be the subject of a later question on the Order Paper today. That was the outline. The framework of it\u2014the loan scheme itself\u2014is something we\u2019re very proud of, and it\u2019s something that New Zealanders and New Zealand businesses will benefit from significantly.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000062\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002253f86481-33c1-48b2-893b-c11cc0bd673d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002273f71b1a7078416dbee41f7cbcc52523\u0022\u003EHon Paul Goldsmith\u003C/span\u003E: Based on the advice he\u2019s received, what\u2019s the best estimate from Treasury of what the lockdown is costing the New Zealand economy each week?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000063\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00220805af8bd6a04a8a9496df6c3d19ee53\u0022\u003EHon GRANT ROBERTSON\u003C/span\u003E: Well, as I think the member will be aware, the Treasury has done its scenarios, which show the significant impact on the economy. As we\u2019ve been discussing today, in level 3, we\u2019re operating at about 75 percent output. On a per day basis, I\u2019ll have to get back to the member.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000064\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002253f86481-33c1-48b2-893b-c11cc0bd673d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022e74a5b5f6e2e41398179a7e379cc2318\u0022\u003EHon Paul Goldsmith\u003C/span\u003E: Well, isn\u2019t the figure of $1.4 billion a week, based on the Treasury scenario of level 3\u2014dropping 25 percent\u2014burnt on his brain and keeping him awake at night?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000065\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00224b224db74ce8453ea66cf754598eacef\u0022\u003EHon GRANT ROBERTSON\u003C/span\u003E: I find myself, after working, like most members of this House are at the moment, about 18 hours a day, that, when I do get to bed, I sleep relatively well, and then, when I get up in the morning, I work every minute of the day to make sure that New Zealand households and businesses get through this crisis and flourish at the other end.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000066\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u0022570975cbd8bb4ff999baf5b545716245\u0022\u003EQuestion No. 3\u2014M\u0101ori Crown Relations: Te Arawhiti\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022a8cab3e3-b023-4ce7-9f4b-2c4137029057\u0022 data-id=\u0022dd31dd3ba30d478aaa399234207ec190\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000067\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a8cab3e3-b023-4ce7-9f4b-2c4137029057\u0022\u003E3. \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022dd31dd3ba30d478aaa399234207ec190\u0022\u003EKIRITAPU ALLAN (Labour)\u003C/span\u003E to the Minister for M\u0101ori Crown Relations: Te Arawhiti: What actions has he taken to assist M\u0101ori in helping to keep communities safe from COVID-19?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022802874a3-deca-48b7-9d33-9087058892f5\u0022 data-id=\u0022de443d45505f48c082d9a110d460bb12\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000068\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022802874a3-deca-48b7-9d33-9087058892f5\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022de443d45505f48c082d9a110d460bb12\u0022\u003EHon KELVIN DAVIS (Minister for M\u0101ori Crown Relations: Te Arawhiti):\u003C/span\u003E Before the country headed into level 4, we announced a $56.5 million M\u0101ori response package to assist M\u0101ori in their fight against the spread of COVID-19. M\u0101ori were quick to activate their network and deliver practical support in the early stages of our fight against COVID-19. Their response was immediate, and we as a Government worked with M\u0101ori to ensure the resources and funding announced in our M\u0101ori response package helped them in all the work they were undertaking. I\u2019d like to thank iwi up and down the country for their hard work, for their cooperation, and for their future efforts as we move through these unprecedented times.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000069\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a8cab3e3-b023-4ce7-9f4b-2c4137029057\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00225570260ed21a4a5c85daabd41281d943\u0022\u003EKiritapu Allan\u003C/span\u003E: What did the M\u0101ori response package funding deliver to M\u0101ori?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000070\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022802874a3-deca-48b7-9d33-9087058892f5\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022c24b33387bf64462b64edfe9206a365d\u0022\u003EHon KELVIN DAVIS\u003C/span\u003E: This package was able to support 43 M\u0101ori groups and iwi to develop their own pandemic response plans. It delivered business support and advice to 632 businesses, it enabled 2,029 interactions with M\u0101ori business via an 0800 number, it provided extra funding to M\u0101ori health providers and M\u0101ori-led testing stations, and it helped M\u0101ori to resource volunteers to reach out to our most vulnerable and isolated communities, and in particular our kaum\u0101tua and kuia.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000071\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a8cab3e3-b023-4ce7-9f4b-2c4137029057\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022fcb10047de6f44c79c8dd93f82f8fb25\u0022\u003EKiritapu Allan\u003C/span\u003E: How did this funding provide support for vulnerable M\u0101ori wh\u0101nau across Aotearoa?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000072\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022802874a3-deca-48b7-9d33-9087058892f5\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022c4989711e18a4a55b82c0e165efbd5b7\u0022\u003EHon KELVIN DAVIS\u003C/span\u003E: This funding helps support some of our most vulnerable communities, in particular kaum\u0101tua and kuia and those in isolated areas. Part of the package was to boost the work of Wh\u0101nau Ora commissioning agencies, who, because of the M\u0101ori response package, were able to deliver close to 120,000 care packages to vulnerable wh\u0101nau, and over 64,000 wh\u0101nau members have received support through commissioning agencies. This proves that, when M\u0101ori and the Crown work in partnership, we can successfully deliver to M\u0101ori across the country.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000073\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u002281101641a0554f05a8d228a301870099\u0022\u003EQuestion No. 4\u2014Tourism\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022c0f78f60-c2fd-46f4-8138-72f39692fc20\u0022 data-id=\u0022e0288923af384c02b0e8fb0931d72ddf\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000074\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c0f78f60-c2fd-46f4-8138-72f39692fc20\u0022\u003E4. \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022e0288923af384c02b0e8fb0931d72ddf\u0022\u003EHon TODD McCLAY (National\u2014Rotorua)\u003C/span\u003E to the Minister of Tourism: What action, if any, will he take this week to save businesses and jobs in the tourism sector?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022802874a3-deca-48b7-9d33-9087058892f5\u0022 data-id=\u0022f0a60c855d7e4a0aa13ee7b4e5bd7fee\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000075\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022802874a3-deca-48b7-9d33-9087058892f5\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022f0a60c855d7e4a0aa13ee7b4e5bd7fee\u0022\u003EHon KELVIN DAVIS (Minister of Tourism):\u003C/span\u003E This week, like every week since this Government has been responding to COVID-19, we will continue to support tourism businesses through our Economic Response Package, which includes wage subsidy assistance, the business finance guarantee scheme, changes in tax provisions, as well as the tax loss carry-back scheme, the Small Business Cashflow Loan Scheme, changes to the tax loss continuity rules, and further business consultancy support.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000076\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c0f78f60-c2fd-46f4-8138-72f39692fc20\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00228115b45030af44a195aca0dbcebb317f\u0022\u003EHon Todd McClay\u003C/span\u003E: Thank you. Will he confirm today that wage subsidies will be extended for tourism businesses\u2014who this week face laying off staff\u2014so that these New Zealanders can keep their jobs?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000077\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022802874a3-deca-48b7-9d33-9087058892f5\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022990448337d384756a37fc26e0a1eafc3\u0022\u003EHon KELVIN DAVIS\u003C/span\u003E: In consultation with the tourism sector that is one of the\u2014they would like certainty around the wage subsidy scheme. Those sorts of decisions will be made by the appropriate Ministers at the appropriate time. The wage subsidy scheme\u2014the Minister of Finance was the architect of that. It\u2019s not a decision that the Minister of Tourism makes by himself.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000078\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c0f78f60-c2fd-46f4-8138-72f39692fc20\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002258b56f3f72e5436393061b87ef13c38e\u0022\u003EHon Todd McClay\u003C/span\u003E: Will he today confirm that tourism businesses will receive cash-flow grants rather than Government debt, so they have certainty and Kiwis can keep their jobs?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000079\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022802874a3-deca-48b7-9d33-9087058892f5\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00222caaace2a689474b9d3bdd0d8198948e\u0022\u003EHon KELVIN DAVIS\u003C/span\u003E: I\u2019ve already rattled through a list of things that tourism businesses can access, and to just expand on that a bit further, there is up to $12 billion in wage subsidies so that affected businesses can keep their staff. There is $2.8 billion in business tax changes to reduce cash-flow pressure, including provisional tax threshold lift, the reinstatement of building depreciation, and writing off interest on late payment of tax. There is an initial $600 million package to help the aviation sector. There is a $6.25 billion business finance guarantee scheme for small and medium sized businesses. There is further support for small to medium sized enterprises, including the $3.1 billion tax loss carry-back scheme; as I\u2019ve said, changes to the tax loss continuity rules; further business consultancy support; and there is greater flexibility for affected businesses to meet their tax obligations. The Government has done a heck of a lot to help businesses, not just tourism businesses.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000080\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a8cab3e3-b023-4ce7-9f4b-2c4137029057\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022af7977685f044c219b45855588da9b92\u0022\u003EKiritapu Allan\u003C/span\u003E: How is he ensuring that the tourism sector is involved in his work to respond and restart the industry in a post-COVID world?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000081\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022802874a3-deca-48b7-9d33-9087058892f5\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00223acde9bcfe474da28a3dec6ff1735e5e\u0022\u003EHon KELVIN DAVIS\u003C/span\u003E: As the Minister, I\u2019ve hosted a webinar. By the end of this week, we should have been in touch with over 3,000 people from the tourism industry: tourism operators and businesses. I\u2019ll continue to host multiple regional webinars every week, where each webinar involves about 150-plus tourism operators. Tourism New Zealand is also engaging in one-on-one contact with industry players, to ensure everyone gets a chance to be part of the restart of our tourism industry in a post-COVID New Zealand.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000082\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c0f78f60-c2fd-46f4-8138-72f39692fc20\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022b60af65164864d3dbcbef9cd7e188818\u0022\u003EHon Todd McClay\u003C/span\u003E: Will he tell tourism businesses today what restrictions they will face under level 2, and whether New Zealanders will be able to travel domestically so these businesses can this week make decisions to save jobs?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000083\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022802874a3-deca-48b7-9d33-9087058892f5\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022154942c53f0f4c2ebfab328a0aa9497e\u0022\u003EHon KELVIN DAVIS\u003C/span\u003E: Well, again, if the member waits until Thursday, then a lot will be revealed. But the thing is, tourism operators have said to me that they want certainty around the wage subsidy scheme, they want restrictions on domestic travel lifted, and they would like a trans-Tasman bubble to be created. But the thing is that all of those decisions are made by other Ministers, whereas I have input\u2014and represent the interests of the tourism industry\u2014on behalf of the tourism industry. But one thing I will not do is stand up and undermine my fellow Ministers by talking out of turn on areas that impact their portfolios.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000084\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002225d5b52dc78241b4ac343936b0e52993\u0022\u003ERt Hon Jacinda Ardern\u003C/span\u003E: Can the Minister confirm that on the last opportunity that myself\u2014as Prime Minister\u2014had to sit with tourism operators in Rotorua, they highlighted the importance of a successful campaign against COVID being part of their recovery, so that people can look to New Zealand both from a tourism perspective in the future, but also from a trade perspective, with confidence in our response?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000085\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022802874a3-deca-48b7-9d33-9087058892f5\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022c9e78e80427d4f15baf9b62b42867bff\u0022\u003EHon KELVIN DAVIS\u003C/span\u003E: That\u2019s right. Do it once and do it right. We know that the best thing for our economy is to stamp out COVID-19, and not to risk going up and down between levels. That would be the worst thing ever for not just tourism but the whole economy.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000086\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c0f78f60-c2fd-46f4-8138-72f39692fc20\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022570d9aba04a54801975eb673726c8e04\u0022\u003EHon Todd McClay\u003C/span\u003E: Will he give certainty to the tourism sector today about when his Government hopes to open the trans-Tasman border and under what conditions, so these businesses can keep people in work and save jobs?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000087\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022802874a3-deca-48b7-9d33-9087058892f5\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002279ab825599664284b1eb70f396829dba\u0022\u003EHon KELVIN DAVIS\u003C/span\u003E: I have it on good authority that the Australian Cabinet are still meeting about this very issue. And, again, if we\u2019re talking about lifting border restrictions, we need to talk to the Minister of Foreign Affairs, the Minister of Immigration, the Minister of Customs, and, certainly, the Minister of Health. I represent the interests of the tourism sector, and I make sure that my colleagues know exactly what the tourism sector wants. We\u2019re heading in the right direction, and that is the best thing that we can do.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000088\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u0022920af2b59fab4d79ac43bf33b886fb76\u0022\u003EQuestion No. 5\u2014Social Development\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022a68928ea-9dd8-4a30-8e2c-a0f49dfc8bea\u0022 data-id=\u002214e74d2f8979429789b485bc63e52fb7\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000089\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a68928ea-9dd8-4a30-8e2c-a0f49dfc8bea\u0022\u003E5. \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002214e74d2f8979429789b485bc63e52fb7\u0022\u003EHon LOUISE UPSTON (National\u2014Taup\u014D)\u003C/span\u003E to the Minister for Social Development: What action is she taking, if any, to support the more than 1,000 people who have lost their jobs and gone onto jobseeker support each day since the lockdown?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022 data-id=\u002242049274e617477295ebba4678f87b4e\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000090\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002242049274e617477295ebba4678f87b4e\u0022\u003EHon GRANT ROBERTSON (Minister of Finance)\u003C/span\u003E on behalf of the Minister for Social Development: On behalf of the Minister for Social Development, supporting people into work has always been part of this Government\u2019s agenda, which is why at last year\u2019s Budget, we announced an investment into 263 new work-focused case managers. We acted in early March, establishing rapid response teams to support redeployment activities all across Ministry of Social Development regions. This has continued through the lockdown. We established the wage subsidy scheme and leave support schemes that have supported over 1.7 million Kiwis to stay connected to their employers. Last week, I announced a range of initiatives to keep New Zealand working, including an online recruitment tool. We have 35 new employment centres that are up and running, and operating virtually, to work with employers and clients to support accelerated redeployment.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000091\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a68928ea-9dd8-4a30-8e2c-a0f49dfc8bea\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00220d250d2fb7fe436f96635ecedc6a36c7\u0022\u003EHon Louise Upston\u003C/span\u003E: How many applications for jobseeker support have there been since the start of alert level 4, and how many have been declined? \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000092\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00220b9fb7ccde104c8293f31c84d5964cbb\u0022\u003EHon GRANT ROBERTSON\u003C/span\u003E: In reference to the second part of the question, I don\u2019t have that information with me around declines. What I can say from publicly available information to the member is that it is around the 30,000 mark of additional people on the jobseeker support.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000093\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a68928ea-9dd8-4a30-8e2c-a0f49dfc8bea\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022771e553760bd43fcb616abfa4cd32421\u0022\u003EHon Louise Upston\u003C/span\u003E: Does she have any estimates of how many people have lost their job since the start of alert level 4 but were not eligible for jobseeker support?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000094\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002270fae912d44c4f4ab810e73fbe4c5d18\u0022\u003EHon GRANT ROBERTSON\u003C/span\u003E: The member would need to put a specific question like that down in writing.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000095\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a68928ea-9dd8-4a30-8e2c-a0f49dfc8bea\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00223b8876f4dd294f8b8f61d35d50da9173\u0022\u003EHon Louise Upston\u003C/span\u003E: Does she believe that the 1,000 people going on jobseeker support each day has peaked, or will this number increase when the wage subsidy ends in a month?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000096\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002268847cd819fe4c5cbee1a1b986ea92d6\u0022\u003EHon GRANT ROBERTSON\u003C/span\u003E: Our forecasts around what will happen with New Zealand\u2019s unemployment rate have been provided by a large number of people. As with other countries in the world, there is an expectation that we are facing a period of significant economic downturn. The Government is and will continue to do everything in our power to limit the number of people who find themselves in need of jobseeker support.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000097\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a68928ea-9dd8-4a30-8e2c-a0f49dfc8bea\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022c031ba4c326f48eebfd0f9e3d8db40ff\u0022\u003EHon Louise Upston\u003C/span\u003E: What recent reports has she read, if any, on the social and health impacts of unemployment, and what actions is she taking to reduce this harm?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000098\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022b9ce27511b4f4c46a142aa9f082a97a6\u0022\u003EHon GRANT ROBERTSON\u003C/span\u003E: On behalf of the Minister, I\u2019m not sure exactly what reports the Minister will have read around the health impacts of unemployment, but it\u2019s certainly an issue that the Minister and this Government are very well aware of. It\u2019s why we have worked so hard to reduce unemployment in New Zealand, taking it down to its lowest levels in a decade in the period leading up to COVID-19, and we\u2019ll continue to take that approach of prioritising reducing unemployment and hope to continue the success that we\u2019ve had with that up until COVID-19.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000099\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u0022fbc432e31fce46f48f5c291184934906\u0022\u003EQuestion No. 6\u2014Finance\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022c21f4beb-20c4-4b12-bc6f-fdc931e2dc96\u0022 data-id=\u002213140a02d1494f90942b4c0cb76bb382\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000100\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c21f4beb-20c4-4b12-bc6f-fdc931e2dc96\u0022\u003E6. \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002213140a02d1494f90942b4c0cb76bb382\u0022\u003EGINNY ANDERSEN (Labour)\u003C/span\u003E to the Minister of Finance: What actions has the Government taken to support businesses and households to respond to COVID-19?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022 data-id=\u00220dfab2564cff4a8e9ae37e5d24632214\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000101\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00220dfab2564cff4a8e9ae37e5d24632214\u0022\u003EHon GRANT ROBERTSON (Minister of Finance):\u003C/span\u003E The Government\u2019s ability to support businesses and households is backed by our actions to ensure a strong underlying economic base for the New Zealand economy and our strong fiscal position going into COVID-19. Standard \u0026amp; Poor\u2019s yesterday held New Zealand\u2019s credit rating at AA\u002B with a positive outlook because of the Government\u2019s low debt relative to the rest of the world and the economy\u2019s underlying strength. This has allowed the Government to go hard and early in our economic response to COVID-19 to match our health response. This has been led by the $10.7 billion wage subsidy scheme, supporting more than 1.7 million workers; the business finance guarantee scheme, the largest business tax support package in modern New Zealand history; and further measures announced last week to support small businesses with cash-flow operating costs.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000102\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c21f4beb-20c4-4b12-bc6f-fdc931e2dc96\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a7025f43f229478db6c60278efd9e8e4\u0022\u003EGinny Andersen\u003C/span\u003E: What actions is the Government taking to support small businesses through COVID-19?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000103\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00220c9687a8a5be4003a788291598b207e9\u0022\u003EHon GRANT ROBERTSON\u003C/span\u003E: On Friday, the Government announced the Small Business Cashflow Loan Scheme to provide graduated loans of up to $100,000 to viable businesses with 50 or fewer employees to give them access to cash flow to meet fixed costs such as rent. The scheme will provide $10,000 to each eligible firm, and, in addition, $1,800 per equivalent full-time employee. The interest rate will be 3 percent for a maximum of five years, with repayments not required for the first two years. The loans will be interest free if they are repaid within the first year. IRD will have the scheme up and running by 12 May to start accepting applications, and we expect the first lending decisions to be made about 48 hours after applications are received.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000104\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c21f4beb-20c4-4b12-bc6f-fdc931e2dc96\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022ef01165c03ea4628ba01e6a865dbe854\u0022\u003EGinny Andersen\u003C/span\u003E: What reports has he seen of reactions to the Small Business Cashflow (Loan) Scheme?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000105\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022e9cf65918bb844e3ac97f50ae01949bf\u0022\u003EHon GRANT ROBERTSON\u003C/span\u003E: Many. Employers and Manufacturers Association chief executive, Brett O\u2019Riley, said his members would welcome the Small Business Cashflow (Loan) Scheme. He said the terms of the scheme are very similar to the Canadian approach, which we and other members of the Business New Zealand network encouraged the Government to look at. \u201CWe thank the Minister of Finance, Grant Robertson, for this response.\u201D I\u2019ve also received letters of support and emails from a number of other small businesses and, indeed, the Mayor of the Queenstown Lakes District Council, Jim Boult, on behalf of the businesses in Queenstown. This scheme has been welcomed.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000106\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022163d0b68-eb0e-4094-9bed-99e184f063e1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00224ec7a90bd5cd4c1395392495e75a211e\u0022\u003EJami-Lee Ross\u003C/span\u003E: Will the Government further support businesses and households by legislating for a rates freeze for the 2020-21 local government rating year; if not, why not?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000107\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002211e63eaafa384c05aad0377a164fe110\u0022\u003EHon GRANT ROBERTSON\u003C/span\u003E: That is not the intention of the Government.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000108\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022d3dea09ecaff4632b9a8350ce5286539\u0022\u003ERt Hon Winston Peters\u003C/span\u003E: Has the Minister had regard to a more recently announced scheme, in the last 24 hours, where businesses will not be able to qualify unless they can prove they\u2019ve had a 50 percent loss?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000109\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022386d9a1335b6435cb213bff5fdf2e45f\u0022\u003EHon GRANT ROBERTSON\u003C/span\u003E: I\u2019ve seen a number of ideas proposed in recent times. One of the things that are important in these situations is to have consistency. I certainly know that, in the case of the people proposing that scheme, last week they were describing our scheme as both too loose and too restrictive within hours of each other. Mr Goldsmith and Mr McClay should have a chat with one another.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000110\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022163d0b68-eb0e-4094-9bed-99e184f063e1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022617359bc13934293beb5e81c081c2af4\u0022\u003EJami-Lee Ross\u003C/span\u003E: Why is the Government not considering providing relief to businesses and households by legislating for a rates freeze?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000111\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00224be431ed208342949cf1ebb400ad753c\u0022\u003EHon GRANT ROBERTSON\u003C/span\u003E: We believe that local government needs to make its own decisions about the level of rates that it\u2019s charging at this time. Many of them have responsibilities to co-fund projects that are important to productivity and creating jobs. I\u2019m sure that each local government authority will think very carefully about the level of rates that they charge in this environment.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000112\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u0022372ffa3112b643c09a17ee3605913ba1\u0022\u003EQuestion No. 7\u2014Health\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022861a1798-a396-4a6c-b9e2-7d2f15d4a001\u0022 data-id=\u002257a0dfdf6b814fc59ab934527ad61ea1\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000113\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022861a1798-a396-4a6c-b9e2-7d2f15d4a001\u0022\u003E7. \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002257a0dfdf6b814fc59ab934527ad61ea1\u0022\u003EDr SHANE RETI (National\u2014Whangarei)\u003C/span\u003E to the Associate Minister of Health: Does she agree with Dr Ashley Bloomfield that \u201Call New Zealanders are now able to get a flu jab\u201D?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002258f935f1-6646-40ab-9d99-17029396850c\u0022 data-id=\u00229c9e0f19f1014528b6c4e0495c181b04\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000114\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002258f935f1-6646-40ab-9d99-17029396850c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00229c9e0f19f1014528b6c4e0495c181b04\u0022\u003EHon JULIE ANNE GENTER (Associate Minister of Health):\u003C/span\u003E Yes. On Monday, 27 March, the prioritisation criteria that the Government had put in place to ensure our most vulnerable were able to get their flu vaccine was lifted. This means that all New Zealanders are now eligible to ring their GP or pharmacist and make an appointment to get vaccinated. In previous years, there was never a prioritisation system put in place, so this year, we acted early to ensure that the most at-risk New Zealanders had a head start on getting their flu vaccine in this unprecedented time of a global pandemic.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000115\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022861a1798-a396-4a6c-b9e2-7d2f15d4a001\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00228fbe60f63c224ba9a167737751927080\u0022\u003EDr Shane Reti\u003C/span\u003E: How does that align with her statement this Saturday that \u201Cnot every New Zealander will get a flu vaccine\u201D?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000116\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002258f935f1-6646-40ab-9d99-17029396850c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002286d55d338ba34ab581918b812969456f\u0022\u003EHon JULIE ANNE GENTER\u003C/span\u003E: Well, as we have maintained the entire time, we have a record number of flu vaccines this year: that\u2019s 1.768 million. He will realise that that is less than the population of New Zealand. None the less, in previous years one out of four New Zealanders got a flu vaccine; this year, we\u2019re on track for more than one out of three. We already have record numbers of people over the age of 65 having been vaccinated\u2014that\u2019s on the Nation Immunisation Register (NIR)\u2014more M\u0101ori over the age of 65 have been vaccinated than in any previous year, and that\u2019s with us only having the records of about 770,000 vaccines. So there is still yet a million vaccines to either be administered or for the records to come through.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000117\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022861a1798-a396-4a6c-b9e2-7d2f15d4a001\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00223df1a3b7346d4c8cadefaea1e28bc168\u0022\u003EDr Shane Reti\u003C/span\u003E: What does she say, then, to New Zealanders who may eventually miss out on a flu vaccine because there are not enough?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000118\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002258f935f1-6646-40ab-9d99-17029396850c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00226e850318501447bab128f382f29bec24\u0022\u003EHon JULIE ANNE GENTER\u003C/span\u003E: I would say that there\u2019s very low risk of flu this year. The flu tracker is showing us that we have record low levels of the flu, due to the borders being closed. In all of the precautions that we are taking to prevent the spread of COVID-19, we are also preventing the spread of the flu. We have already vaccinated record numbers of vulnerable people. So I think the clinical outcome of this year\u2019s flu vaccine is excellent, and I want to thank all those hard-working GPs, nurses, and pharmacists who have been vaccinating people at twice the rate of last year\u2014an excellent outcome.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000119\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022861a1798-a396-4a6c-b9e2-7d2f15d4a001\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00226d8d66908c1c441fb7e6a047170796df\u0022\u003EDr Shane Reti\u003C/span\u003E: Why is this the second winter in a row, under her watch, when the front line have had no flu vaccines when they needed them?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000120\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002258f935f1-6646-40ab-9d99-17029396850c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00220bfdb36f4d9541c48ba6b97b1c40e1be\u0022\u003EHon JULIE ANNE GENTER\u003C/span\u003E: I\u2019m really not sure what the member\u2019s referring to. This is actually the first year that I\u2019ve had the delegation for this, firstly. But, secondly, I believe that some GPs are running low, and that is because they are vaccinating people at twice the rate of last year. Also, we\u2019re in the midst of a global pandemic with unprecedented travel restrictions, both internationally and nationally, and that has led to some distribution issues. But everybody is working as hard as they possibly can. The clinical outcome, so far, is so good that I think GPs, nurses, and pharmacists are going to look back on the outcome of this year and the record numbers of vulnerable people who were vaccinated and say that this was a very big clinical success.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000121\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022861a1798-a396-4a6c-b9e2-7d2f15d4a001\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022d8975c369bba4ad7abdaa677e13c15c0\u0022\u003EDr Shane Reti\u003C/span\u003E: When people look back, will it be the same distribution issue she has mentioned now as the distribution issue she quoted for the flu vaccine last year and the measles vaccine?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000122\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002258f935f1-6646-40ab-9d99-17029396850c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00223fa4414d18e64a1d8e6c61173609491f\u0022\u003EHon JULIE ANNE GENTER\u003C/span\u003E: I think that the circumstances that we\u2019re facing right now with a global pandemic and a 90 percent reduction in international travel, and significant reductions in inter-regional travel here in New Zealand, are not comparable to issues that we\u2019ve previously had with vaccines, no. But I will come back to: the outcome is very good because GPs have actually been vaccinating people at twice the rate they had last year, they have had significant supplies, they\u2019ve administered them to record numbers of New Zealanders, and we still have a million vaccines to either be administered or to be entered for the records to come through in the NIR.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000123\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002241267b9e84774f92a24024d1c4286696\u0022\u003EHon Dr Nick Smith\u003C/span\u003E: I raise a point of order, Mr Speaker. I seek leave to table an email from my own Nelson Marlborough DHB, received today, saying they have run out of flu vaccinations.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000124\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00222737794356d34fd4a03e4e0b8bcebc58\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Is there any objection to that occurring? There is none.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000125\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003EDocument, by leave, laid on the Table of the House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000126\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u0022d53199d401db4e1b8d84b1848bc87ed0\u0022\u003EQuestion No. 8\u2014Education\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022a1f7bbd1-b6ae-41c0-963b-dbe1251f5540\u0022 data-id=\u0022e0095fdd1d35424ea856e6946f0f9334\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000127\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a1f7bbd1-b6ae-41c0-963b-dbe1251f5540\u0022\u003E8. \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022e0095fdd1d35424ea856e6946f0f9334\u0022\u003EKIERAN McANULTY (Labour)\u003C/span\u003E to the Minister of Education: What actions has the Government taken to ensure that students in need can access support to learn online in tertiary education?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022 data-id=\u0022f62fe9e57e1040a794525a1ff87be404\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000128\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022f62fe9e57e1040a794525a1ff87be404\u0022\u003EHon CHRIS HIPKINS (Minister of Education):\u003C/span\u003E The Government announced over the weekend $20 million for technology access for tertiary students so that we can make digital devices and internet connections available for students who do not otherwise have those in their homes. While online learning is being undertaken by tertiary organisations in response to COVID-19, many students don\u2019t have access to the appropriate devices or the appropriate internet connections to enable them to undertake technology-enabled learning. Many students still go on to the campus in order to access equipment to learn. Since the country moved into lockdown, officials have worked with the tertiary institutes to identify the number of students\u2014[Interruption] \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000129\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022ff6f4eb901094426adac678d68abe4af\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Order! Order! Look, I apologise to the member, and with my previous history I\u2019m reluctant to say it, but if members want to do something like that, they should take it outside. Chris Hipkins, continue.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000130\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00224105a89f345b4b83a0aae09eb7e049b8\u0022\u003EHon CHRIS HIPKINS\u003C/span\u003E: When the country moved into lockdown, officials worked with tertiary institutes to identify the number of students who they thought didn\u2019t have access to the right devices and didn\u2019t have broadband internet. So the $20 million fund is part of our overall response, which, of course, includes $87.7 million that the Government is funding across schools and early learning services for devices, connections, and hard packs of materials. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000131\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a1f7bbd1-b6ae-41c0-963b-dbe1251f5540\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00226670f87bd44d4aecbba7710cd83c73bf\u0022\u003EKieran McAnulty\u003C/span\u003E: How many learners were identified as needing support for digital devices and technology?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000132\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002270ee40b09d8c4d7fb8fd9707b30ca9e0\u0022\u003EHon CHRIS HIPKINS\u003C/span\u003E: The work undertaken by the institutions identified that around 11,150 learners at tertiary organisations probably don\u2019t have appropriate devices to engage in technology-enabled learning, while a slightly higher number\u201411,350\u2014don\u2019t have access to broadband at home. The package that we are funding provides for devices and internet connections for up to 18,500 learners.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000133\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a1f7bbd1-b6ae-41c0-963b-dbe1251f5540\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00224f91f27a3ace468c8c801e149a3b3bbc\u0022\u003EKieran McAnulty\u003C/span\u003E: How will this money be distributed to universities, private training establishments (PTEs), polytechnics, and w\u0101nanga?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000134\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002221b4081f84c84c7493e17467f77080c0\u0022\u003EHon CHRIS HIPKINS\u003C/span\u003E: In the first instance, half of the fund is being allocated to tertiary organisations on the basis of the number of learners that they have, with a particular weighting to priority learners. For example, the New Zealand Institute of Skills and Technology has been allocated $2.3 million to start purchasing devices and connections. The second half of the fund will be available on application from organisations. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000135\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a1f7bbd1-b6ae-41c0-963b-dbe1251f5540\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00227f0ab70b936e4b3f9bb7d26729361af3\u0022\u003EKieran McAnulty\u003C/span\u003E: How will students be selected for support for devices and internet connections from the universities, w\u0101nanga, PTEs, and polytechnics?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000136\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00225c5a53cc37ec4b0b8eeaa9db07be3290\u0022\u003EHon CHRIS HIPKINS\u003C/span\u003E: We want to make it as easy as possible to get these resources to the students that need them, and we want to enable institutions to use their existing supply chains where possible, so the funding is being allocated to the institutions, and the students that need them should speak to their university, w\u0101nanga, PTE, or polytech in the first instance.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000137\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ed2d10c1-43b7-41d9-9f5c-0c313f70e625\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022d3678f5db33145c982f51322858a8515\u0022\u003EHon Nikki Kaye\u003C/span\u003E: How does that support students that are currently locked out of their accommodation, paying bills to their tertiary providers? How are they going to benefit from that online learning?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000138\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002212541414c7164493baa091b34048588b\u0022\u003EHon CHRIS HIPKINS\u003C/span\u003E: Well, if the accommodation that they are in does not have broadband access or does not have a device that they can use to access the internet and to access online learning, then they will be able to do that. With regard to the institutions continuing to charge rent for rooms that students are unable to occupy, I\u2019ve been very clear around my expectations on that. Those organisations that are accessing the wage subsidy should not be charging full rent to the students for rooms that they cannot use. The universities in particular have a very healthy balance sheet position, which means that they do not need to take some of the measures that they are taking now, and I expect them to behave responsibly and with a degree of compassion towards their learners.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000139\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u00223bc70dec3eae4e93b208e366f4604b17\u0022\u003EQuestion No. 9\u2014Revenue\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022 data-id=\u0022c542d883a35c41d68b44affe54f03e6f\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000140\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E9. \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022c542d883a35c41d68b44affe54f03e6f\u0022\u003EHon GERRY BROWNLEE (National\u2014Ilam)\u003C/span\u003E to the Minister of Revenue: Did he know that the Small Business Cashflow (Loan) Scheme was in the COVID-19 Response (Taxation and Other Regulatory Urgent Measures) Bill that was introduced to Parliament on Thursday, 30 April; if so, why didn\u2019t he notify the Opposition that the scheme was not in the bill supplied to them that morning?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022 data-id=\u00228cbf0d31e43c43d4a21eb10821fe4ffe\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000141\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00228cbf0d31e43c43d4a21eb10821fe4ffe\u0022\u003EHon CHRIS HIPKINS (Leader of the House)\u003C/span\u003E on behalf of the Minister of Revenue: No. The Government had directed that the bill be divided into two, with the small business loan scheme to be progressed through a separate subsequent bill. A miscommunication between the IRD and the Parliamentary Counsel Office resulted in an earlier version of the bill being tabled. I was not made aware of the error until after the House had concluded its business for the day. I regret that the version of the bill supplied to the Opposition differed to the one that was tabled. The Leader of the House has received an apology from the Chief Parliamentary Counsel for the error, and I seek leave for that letter to now be tabled. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000142\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022ef0ad2952b4048a1b2c4895d1947c81f\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Is there any objection to that occurring? There appears to be none.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000143\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003EDocument, by leave, laid on the Table of the House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000144\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002274c28b60c3784e47b1c509926ac6e236\u0022\u003EHon Gerry Brownlee\u003C/span\u003E: Has he had discussions with the Leader of the House that would lead to any bills that might be coming into the House next week in his name being provided to the Opposition ahead of them being tabled in the House so that there can be no confusion about what is in them and what their purpose is?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000145\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00222ecfb2a0c4b445c49ad88f6d3bb4393a\u0022\u003EHon CHRIS HIPKINS\u003C/span\u003E: Yes, there have been several conversations between myself as the Minister of Revenue and the Leader of the House around expectations around this. Also, there have been conversations between the Leader of the House and the Chief Parliamentary Counsel around how to ensure that this sort of error can never happen again in the future, and the Chief Parliamentary Counsel has initiated an independent review to ensure that the process is tightened up.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000146\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022916344e1fba54d7ca0de324903870e6c\u0022\u003EHon Gerry Brownlee\u003C/span\u003E: The question was: will the Minister, if he has bills coming into the House next week in his name, make those bills available to the Opposition ahead of time or, ahead of them being tabled, in a more timely fashion so that there can be no doubt about the purpose of the bills that are being put in front of the Parliament?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000147\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002214e506731ddb4cfcaf0dba62876ffa39\u0022\u003EHon CHRIS HIPKINS\u003C/span\u003E: The shorter answer to that question is yes, and that is what the Government endeavoured to do last week. The copy of the bill that had been approved by Ministers for introduction was supplied to the Opposition. The Parliamentary Counsel Office introduced a different version of the bill.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000148\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00223bc816400796406bac7a74e3d0a12ef7\u0022\u003EHon Gerry Brownlee\u003C/span\u003E: Can we take it from the Minister\u2019s answer that there will be no taxation bills in the urgency motion next week?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000149\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022095e16b000294472817a5c5fa9f68658\u0022\u003EHon CHRIS HIPKINS\u003C/span\u003E: No.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000150\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022c2af32e18edf4e08b34f7445915c8c60\u0022\u003ERt Hon Winston Peters\u003C/span\u003E: That said, is it the job of the Opposition to oppose and propose, to forensically examine bills before Parliament\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000151\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002237c9b965746e4629acef4af56ef80f7e\u0022\u003EHon Gerry Brownlee\u003C/span\u003E: I raise a point of order, Mr Speaker. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000152\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002230eed374531d43cc8310c4f9beaff0d8\u0022\u003ERt Hon Winston Peters\u003C/span\u003E: \u2014and that democracy only works\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000153\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00223d054a72a21f49fa8633c8fb7c104d1b\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: A point of order\u2014[Interruption] Order!\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000154\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00226c98b786f4584502820cdeb12155adbd\u0022\u003ERt Hon Winston Peters\u003C/span\u003E: Sit down.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000155\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022fec2a0a16870446ea702c0e0e27db335\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: No, don\u2019t tell me to do that. The member will be in real trouble. A point of order, the Hon Gerry Brownlee.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000156\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00226d87edc75d8b41f68404e47144f203be\u0022\u003EHon Gerry Brownlee\u003C/span\u003E: Well, Mr Speaker, I think it\u2019s pretty clear where this question is going, and so I just want to make it clear that we do understand what the role of the Opposition is, but the\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000157\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002294949cb06b274b279bb33453ef344fa7\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Order! Now the member will resume his seat. I was giving the right honourable gentleman a chance to get his question into order. It seemed to me the further it went along, the further away he got from it. I\u2019m not going to give him another shot. We\u2019re just going to move on.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000158\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u0022412a18f5c52e4914b6e6dbb8747a9e96\u0022\u003EQuestion No. 10\u2014Justice\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022 data-id=\u0022538a7c6a43064509bb2b45c980a1c59a\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000159\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003E10. \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022538a7c6a43064509bb2b45c980a1c59a\u0022\u003EHon Dr NICK SMITH (National\u2014Nelson)\u003C/span\u003E to the Minister of Justice: Does he stand by all his policies and priorities?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022 data-id=\u00220acedde70c4d476aac28b0e562c5e86d\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000160\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00220acedde70c4d476aac28b0e562c5e86d\u0022\u003EHon ANDREW LITTLE (Minister of Justice):\u003C/span\u003E I stand by all the policies and priorities of the Government.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000161\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00221765012225e54ebe8ed668c52b523f8b\u0022\u003EHon Dr Nick Smith\u003C/span\u003E: Why is the Government rushing his legislation to extend voting rights for prisoners during a national emergency when the Government stated at the beginning of lockdown\u2014and I quote\u2014\u201CAll parliamentary business before select committees that is not COVID-related will be suspended.\u201D?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000162\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002262930065086e443d93e9566b2fafd23f\u0022\u003EHon ANDREW LITTLE\u003C/span\u003E: The bill to which the member refers is in the hands of the Justice Committee. It is not a matter over which I have any control; it is a bill that is in the control of the select committee.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000163\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002279555edbbabb4150ad09650d98418609\u0022\u003EHon Dr Nick Smith\u003C/span\u003E: How can the Minister say he has no control of the bill before the select committee, when for the other two bills before the Justice Committee, one on sexual violence and one on first responders, the Minister has written to the Business Committee seeking an extension of time; and is it the Government\u2019s priorities that prisoners\u2019 rights are ahead of those of victims of sexual violence or first responders?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000164\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00225ef4de24e0cd43eeb2a9494b0ce820c1\u0022\u003EHon Chris Hipkins\u003C/span\u003E: I raise a point of order, Mr Speaker. There has to be a factual inaccuracy in the assertion made in that question. Ministers do not write to the Business Committee seeking extensions for bills; select committees write to the Business Committee seeking extensions.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000165\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00225a4b829a2aa2448399415aa15f85628f\u0022\u003EHon Dr Nick Smith\u003C/span\u003E: Speaking to the point of order, the Standing Orders of the House are that the member in charge of the bill can advise the Business Committee as to whether they approve the extension. In the case of the sexual violence legislation before the Justice Committee, the Minister has\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000166\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00228a10652488af48afbe36456cfb25f99a\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: All right, OK\u2014I get the member\u2019s point. Unfortunately, the way he expressed his question didn\u2019t quite get there. I am going to give him another shot at getting the question accurate.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000167\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a8e2063956ca427192d2eb3275de4ab7\u0022\u003EHon Dr Nick Smith\u003C/span\u003E: Why has the Minister written to the Business Committee approving an extension of time for other justice bills like the sexual violence legislation but not the prisoner voting legislation, when the prisoner voting legislation is on fast track and when the rights of rape victims should come ahead of the rights of prisoners?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000168\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00228273c55708d546e483d50ec409613ebc\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: OK, I\u2019ll let the member answer the question, and I will just get it in order by saying \u201Cindicating support for\u201D rather than \u201Capproving\u201D.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000169\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022f916d38f36f3448188eb693f9e684bb3\u0022\u003EHon ANDREW LITTLE\u003C/span\u003E: Again, any correspondence I\u2019ve had with the Business Committee is in relation to a request by the chair of the select committee and is not a matter over which I assert any control.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000170\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002231a8f057f8634db4b70fe4d7f00dd2a2\u0022\u003EHon Dr Nick Smith\u003C/span\u003E: Does the Minister agree with Professor Andrew Geddis of Otago University that his bill, in clause 8\u2014and I quote\u2014\u201Cgives prisoners more electoral rights than other citizens.\u201D; if so, is it Government policy that convicted criminals have greater rights than victims\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000171\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022874c6e633d8c4db3b3c40a888769d3e7\u0022\u003ERt Hon Winston Peters\u003C/span\u003E: I raise a point of order, Mr Speaker. For the second time, this member\u2019s asked two questions, not one, and he\u2019s about to do it again.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000172\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002243da614a75724d948773dd44fece5b23\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Well, I accept that the member has very long phrases that make up his questions, but he\u2019s so far in order. I\u2019ll ask Dr Nick Smith to start again.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000173\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00221e7cd277122749f49dbbdf124bbaeb3e\u0022\u003EHon Dr Nick Smith\u003C/span\u003E: Thank you, Mr Speaker. Does the Minister agree with Professor Andrew Geddis of Otago University that his bill, in clause 8, \u201Cgives prisoners more electoral rights than other citizens.\u201D; if so, is it Government policy that convicted criminals have greater rights than victims of crime or law-abiding citizens?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000174\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022fbb61467629f46bc906c84013d1c342e\u0022\u003EHon ANDREW LITTLE\u003C/span\u003E: In answer to the second part of the question, no.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000175\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a8f3d8a503ca4268a1ca0cf742ff8309\u0022\u003EHon Dr Nick Smith\u003C/span\u003E: Can the Minister confirm that he has written to the Justice Committee stating that officials will not be able to provide full answers to the committee\u2019s questions or a comprehensive departmental report on the bill, and, if so, why would we continue to rush such legislation?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000176\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002298e3ec86e340447fa661d0fb6c1fc9e3\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: No, well, that is out of order.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000177\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022db7ded19fff0439dba54cc1dd7346a06\u0022\u003EHon Dr Nick Smith\u003C/span\u003E: Can the Minister assure the House that the Justice Committee will have access to a comprehensive report from his ministry and that the ministry will be able to answer all of the committee\u2019s questions thoroughly?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000178\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022faf15db72705414da6c9e95f9921e6b1\u0022\u003EHon ANDREW LITTLE\u003C/span\u003E: As far as I know, that is exactly what ministry officials are providing to that committee.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000179\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00220b7b711aca1f4ee6a52c213d45ad5a7c\u0022\u003EHon Dr Nick Smith\u003C/span\u003E: I raise a point of order, Mr Speaker. The answer that the Minister has just given contradicts the letter that he has written to the select committee.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000180\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022902b57dde5cb4d869ca7a793a4dd2055\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Dr Smith, you are the most senior member of the House\u2014well, the one with the most experience, anyway.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000181\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022d14e356478f3436bbca6550c95937e63\u0022\u003ERt Hon Winston Peters\u003C/span\u003E: No, he\u2019s not.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000182\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002224d93e90e38c43bf8713d167bfdcf3df\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: No, he\u2019s not that either? All right, OK\u2014he\u2019s the father of the House, let\u2019s put it that way. [Interruption] The member has a question; if he wants to ask it, he\u2019ll just zip it up. Dr Smith\u2014the member has been here for a long time and he should know what assertions he can and can\u2019t make by way of point of order, and the fact that he disagrees with an answer is certainly not a reason for a point of order. If we had that, we\u2019d have one of those on just about every supplementary answer in the House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000183\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022aecbeddafa6b41b09520904deadf9765\u0022\u003EHon Gerry Brownlee\u003C/span\u003E: I appreciate your ruling and just seek advice: if the substance of that question was prefaced with \u201Chas\u201D, would that put it in order, because it seems to me we\u2019re getting into some pretty pedantic sort of space? We\u2019re in unusual times. The Opposition has agreed to truncated versions of Parliament because it\u2019s the right thing to do at the moment, but on the basis that the business-as-usual sort of stuff would be pushed off until a later time\u2014and probably facilitated at that later time. But in this case, clearly there is a hell-bent desire by someone to get this piece of legislation through. It\u2019s not unreasonable to question whether or not that is actually being driven by the Minister, and a question \u201CHas he written\u201D\u2014would that stand as opposed to the question that was asked by Dr Smith?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000184\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002289d100c66c8b4784a341ce6651a9ac66\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Well, I didn\u2019t rule out the question in that particular case that was asked. What I said was that I wasn\u2019t saying that the member has to be happy with the answer, and taking a point of order to say that he disagrees with the answer\u2014it didn\u2019t matter really what the question was, because the question was ruled in. To say that the member was unhappy with the answer is not the case. If there is an allegation that the Minister was inaccurate, and deliberately so, the member knows how that should be taken up. If the member has other evidence that he thinks contradicts it and would cause the Minister to correct his answer, then he could be kind enough either to pass it to the Minister or to table it in the House, and that way it would put more pressure on the Minister to correct his answer, if, in fact, it was inaccurate.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000185\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002242356cf6d9844b078378ef161dff944a\u0022\u003EHon Dr Nick Smith\u003C/span\u003E: Thank you, Mr Speaker. I seek leave of the House to table the Minister of Justice\u2019s letter to the Justice Committee saying that justice officials would not be able to provide complete answers or the normal standard of departmental report.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000186\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022de5e168b57f94b1fa4b399b5433e1178\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Is there any objection to that? There is.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000187\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002209582ed22cf841728b2c639282727df9\u0022\u003EHon Chris Hipkins\u003C/span\u003E: Thank you, Mr Speaker. Can the Minister confirm that the bill does little more than reverse a law change passed by the previous Government with the narrowest of margins in the House?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000188\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a19b1ec7ba8545a3b82a381eeab36b35\u0022\u003EHon ANDREW LITTLE\u003C/span\u003E: That is precisely what the bill does, and it is a bill that has also been the subject of questions and submissions made to that committee in the last two years under different types of legislation that could\u2019ve touched on that question. The issues that are in the bill are not new to the current makeup of the Justice Committee.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000189\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00222e6719d7319949629a02b0d54a483f72\u0022\u003EHon Dr Nick Smith\u003C/span\u003E: Can the Minister confirm that clause 8 of the bill before the select committee, that Professor Andrew Geddis has not only pointed out is new but confers on prisoners rights that victims and other citizens do not have, has never been on the law books of New Zealand before\u2014clause 8?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000190\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00221f783d6c61164b07beb8b5ac0d09a378\u0022\u003EHon ANDREW LITTLE\u003C/span\u003E: I understand that the committee has received submissions and, indeed, advice from officials to that effect. That has never been the intention of the Government, but it is in the hands of that committee to make a change to make sure that the provision of that clause is consistent with the rights that every other citizen has, and I eagerly await the unanimous recommendations of that committee to that effect.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000191\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00229ab82a9042964d13900d7196b2cd24e9\u0022\u003ERt Hon Winston Peters\u003C/span\u003E: Is it not a fact, with respect to that last question, that until 2011, that was the extant situation on the law, supported by Holyoake, Marshall, Muldoon, and, dare I say it, Jim Bolger and others, and then all of a sudden it changed? So Professor Geddis is profoundly wrong.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000192\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002274c1ed66bdb340289381743050e6cbd2\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Order! Order! This member has responsibility neither for Professor Geddis or history.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000193\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u0022690baf8bad294c09a2b8c7b38f1ef7e4\u0022\u003EQuestion No. 11\u2014Regional Economic Development\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022 data-id=\u00226e1901d619e94f18a2d60fae17d2e535\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000194\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022\u003E11. \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00226e1901d619e94f18a2d60fae17d2e535\u0022\u003ERt Hon WINSTON PETERS (Deputy Prime Minister)\u003C/span\u003E to the Minister for Regional Economic Development: What recent announcements has he made regarding regional economic development?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022f44431ef-b505-4e94-9f57-a60b0a569bf7\u0022 data-id=\u002276eaebf0f904471787f08426c21976df\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000195\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f44431ef-b505-4e94-9f57-a60b0a569bf7\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002276eaebf0f904471787f08426c21976df\u0022\u003EHon SHANE JONES (Minister for Regional Economic Development):\u003C/span\u003E The dispenser of the provincial panacea has the following to say: during the COVID alert period 4, phase 4, great work took place to recalibrate and repurpose the Provincial Growth Fund (PGF). I can announce, as of today\u2014because digital connectivity is incredibly important and many areas in New Zealand were left neglected in a former period of nine years\u2014places including Murupara, Gisborne, Katikati, will now enjoy the presence of five new digital hubs. In addition to that, last week, over $439 million worth of investment in 60 PGF projects began to work in earnest after moving into level 3. That is evidence that this Government is quick on the fiscal trigger. We have also seen iconic projects that were neglected, unfortunately, but brought to life by the Provincial Growth Fund in the form of the Hundertwasser Art Centre, the Taranaki Crossing, and the Westport Airport seawall\u2014places in those areas of New Zealand that have suffered far too much neglect in the period of time of the former regime. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000196\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022d09adaf0226d485587d783a78f1ea7be\u0022\u003ERt Hon Winston Peters\u003C/span\u003E: How will he ensure that progress on projects happens quickly during the post - COVID-19 recovery?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000197\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f44431ef-b505-4e94-9f57-a60b0a569bf7\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a0303caacc824e3fbaa7d9db1c0d6aa9\u0022\u003EHon SHANE JONES\u003C/span\u003E: I\u2019m incredibly pleased to have worked with my colleague Mr David Parker and his announcements to fast track a consenting process so that projects crucial to the recovery will not be subjected to undue delay through Resource Management Act (RMA) processes. This lays bare the extent of the former Government\u2019s failure to reform the RMA\u2014instead, leaving us with a type of bureaucratic voodoo. It has fallen to this particular group of Ministers to do what the former regime could not do. This is incredibly important, because jobs are very important.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000198\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002263776108-58dc-4cab-baf1-95282c61d0de\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00221574fe73773a4bf7ad553472709a998b\u0022\u003EHon Paula Bennett\u003C/span\u003E: I raise a point of order, Mr Speaker. There is a general debate tomorrow, and I think that is the time for Ministers to make speeches. These answers are incredibly long.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000199\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00223b161a4e50484aa895862fb55d74dd96\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: The member is absolutely right. They are incredibly long. But, tangentially, they are relevant, and I will remind the member, as she knows\u2014because she\u2019s been around here a while\u2014that responsibility for the interruption on the length of answers is mine and not hers and not to be raised by way of point of order.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000200\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002254125837d720400bbe8694b11c69f9a1\u0022\u003EHon Gerry Brownlee\u003C/span\u003E: I raise a point of order, Mr Speaker. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000201\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022c7626df66921442a818b0c7e3231219e\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Oh, Mr Brownlee\u2014the Hon Mr Brownlee!\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000202\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022f6a959034cbb490f9943529dbf9e43c5\u0022\u003EHon Gerry Brownlee\u003C/span\u003E: Thank you, Mr Speaker. I would have thought, sir, that you might have had a greater interest in the answers from Ministers being more forward focused than the jaundiced history that\u2019s constantly presented to the House\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000203\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022badb0a39-849c-462a-b32f-77fc017c9fc2\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022ec564a1947d44437933c01cc74ad3029\u0022\u003EHon Simon Bridges\u003C/span\u003E: He\u2019s obsessed with us.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000204\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002242f00440cad84affb12b1a1d35f65933\u0022\u003EHon Gerry Brownlee\u003C/span\u003E: \u2014by the Hon Shane Jones. Now, his own fixation on the past is interesting. It does reflect in most of his policies. But, in essence, at the present time, where the country is facing significant economic challenge, as well as the health challenge that New Zealanders have so well risen to, it would be appropriate, I think, that you did require that he speaks more to the future than to the past.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000205\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a41d74c873564918aae950c11e31e64a\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: I want to thank members for their advice and to say that the Leader of the Opposition\u2019s interjection during his colleague\u2019s point of order probably made up for what happened earlier in the day. I will listen very carefully to the answers, but I will say to the member that I thought his point of order was something which was approaching something the Hon Paula Bennett was suggesting earlier. It was more a contribution to a debate rather than a serious point of order.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000206\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022b1eb25872d0345198dd797e17cdcad20\u0022\u003ERt Hon Winston Peters\u003C/span\u003E: Is the Minister saying that having been wrongly blamed for nine long years of non-reform of the RMA, he took that experience to collegially work with the Hon David Parker to get dramatic change right here and right now?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000207\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f44431ef-b505-4e94-9f57-a60b0a569bf7\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00227e7c647237a3457b9a32794eb4b915b5\u0022\u003EHon SHANE JONES\u003C/span\u003E: In the very short term, the RMA will be reformed. In a very short period of time, projects will proceed with alacrity, because jobs are essential. Bureaucratic entanglement is something that the future does not find a place for that type of activity, which is why, as the provincial champion, my colleagues on the other side of the House will find great worthiness in this transformational initiative which I\u2019m championing.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000208\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002285ec30d4-6394-433a-a12e-2c4def705dd0\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00222604df64f92344aeac73cbeca502af54\u0022\u003EHon Judith Collins\u003C/span\u003E: Does the Minister, looking back to the past, remember how many times New Zealand First supported any amendments to the RMA in the last nine years?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000209\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022494ec4c828d442e7aa35f86221d1b01f\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Order! I think the member\u2019s probably the most experienced member of the front bench of the Opposition, and she knows that that question is out of order.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000210\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002284d3e4211031433ba91f8ad2a6603164\u0022\u003EHon Gerry Brownlee\u003C/span\u003E: Given his very bold claims in the House today, can he assure the House that the Government has the numbers to pass the provisions that he\u2019s so boldly claiming will make such a difference?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000211\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f44431ef-b505-4e94-9f57-a60b0a569bf7\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022214641f9b6ee4d4597d7e45b89a8edb9\u0022\u003EHon SHANE JONES\u003C/span\u003E: We are such a collegial crowd on our side of the House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000212\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022e9435c6785c7446f980f567c209af8c1\u0022\u003ERt Hon Winston Peters\u003C/span\u003E: With respect to the last question, did he hear Morning Report and the effusive support from the National Party for this dynamic legislation? That being the case, how will he assist the COVID-19 economic recovery being balanced and resolved to meet the changes faced by the long hitherto neglected regions?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000213\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a0944a91e9e445bf87d48c2fddad7a60\u0022\u003EHon Gerry Brownlee\u003C/span\u003E: I raise a point of order, Mr Speaker. Which one of those questions, on two different topics, is allowed to be answered by the Minister\u2014completely different topics?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000214\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00227f3c666432af4ef795db7ddd9e079e96\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: What I\u2019m trying to work out, Mr Brownlee, is whether I should lift my standards or not in relation to the linking of legs of supplementary questions. I think that I tried to tighten up not very long ago and was subject to some pretty intense criticism from members not very far away from him. In this matter, my natural inclination is actually to agree with the member and to be very tight, but I want to say that if I do, there would have been at least 10 of today\u2019s questions that would have been ruled out, and they all came from his side of the House. So I\u2019m not going to rule that way now, but if the member wants to come back to me and say that it\u2019s the view of the Opposition that the supplementary questioning should be tightened up with regard to relevance and the relationship with prior supplementary questions or prior answers, then I would be more than happy to oblige the Opposition.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000215\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f44431ef-b505-4e94-9f57-a60b0a569bf7\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002256536d50d9304498b216306223928ed3\u0022\u003EHon SHANE JONES\u003C/span\u003E: In contrast to the other member, I shall demonstrate my verbal acrobatic skills. There is a serious drought, for example, affecting Northland. That is a simple example of one of the challenges the Government inherited, with poor outcomes with the water storage in those neglected parts of the country, which is why we are going to charge ahead and deal with the anxieties and the uncertainties as the primary sector generates more wealth in the post-COVID environment, marrying land to water, equalling greater prosperity.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000216\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u00222557588668b84d1cab43ce12429d3b59\u0022\u003EQuestion No. 12\u2014Health\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022c21f4beb-20c4-4b12-bc6f-fdc931e2dc96\u0022 data-id=\u0022b8247acba2c44770976df191082c891c\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000217\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c21f4beb-20c4-4b12-bc6f-fdc931e2dc96\u0022\u003E12. \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022b8247acba2c44770976df191082c891c\u0022\u003EGINNY ANDERSEN (Labour)\u003C/span\u003E to the Minister of Health: How has the rollout of new frontline mental health services been affected by COVID-19?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00225bbd9f26-fdb0-4b85-a836-0fc46e1bba3c\u0022 data-id=\u002261840ce9d7d44770924e0923aa89ba77\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000218\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225bbd9f26-fdb0-4b85-a836-0fc46e1bba3c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002261840ce9d7d44770924e0923aa89ba77\u0022\u003EHon Dr DAVID CLARK (Minister of Health):\u003C/span\u003E Despite disruptions caused by the global COVID-19 pandemic, work has continued on the roll-out of the free front-line mental health and addiction services funded through Budget 2019. By June next year, 1.5 million New Zealanders will have access to free mental health care at their GP or primary care outlet. This work is well under way, with more than 100 sites receiving a combined investment of $40 million in this roll-out. Rolling out such an ambitious new service requires an entirely new workforce. We\u2019ve made sure not to lose momentum during the lockdown and have adapted the training so that it can be delivered virtually. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000219\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c21f4beb-20c4-4b12-bc6f-fdc931e2dc96\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00225ae5116fe1b34c879d903e7bcaec2e63\u0022\u003EGinny Andersen\u003C/span\u003E: How has the provision of these services been affected by COVID-19? \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000220\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225bbd9f26-fdb0-4b85-a836-0fc46e1bba3c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00227e488612b8e746b0b3e18f054a999353\u0022\u003EHon Dr DAVID CLARK\u003C/span\u003E: I am pleased to report that services have continued to be delivered via phone and videoconferencing throughout alert levels 4 and 3, and, more broadly, mental health services have always been considered an essential service. Therefore, their provision has continued throughout all COVID-19 alert levels. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000221\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c21f4beb-20c4-4b12-bc6f-fdc931e2dc96\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00225b45c4d14fdd4bf1b9d4831725e669ab\u0022\u003EGinny Andersen\u003C/span\u003E: What other extra mental health support has the Government made available to New Zealanders feeling the effects of COVID-19? \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000222\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225bbd9f26-fdb0-4b85-a836-0fc46e1bba3c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00229d1531ff457b4a4db927a894e4fbc6d6\u0022\u003EHon Dr DAVID CLARK\u003C/span\u003E: Many people across New Zealand will be feeling distress or anxiety about the future because of COVID-19. I want people to know that it is normal to feel this way in times of uncertainty and that there is a range of free support available. Over the past weeks, the Government has announced online information for parents, awareness campaigns, apps, e-therapy, and tools to help people maintain their mental wellbeing throughout this unusual time. These tools have been brought on stream quickly to complement a wider package of support such as face-to-face sessions and the 1737 number. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000223\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225bbd9f26-fdb0-4b85-a836-0fc46e1bba3c\u0022\u003E\u003Cbr\u003E\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n    \u003C/div\u003E\n    \u003Cdiv class=\u0022HpsHansard\u0022\u003E\n      \u003Cp\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsProceedingHeading\u0022\u003EBills\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000224\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u0022194ef3c5932d4dc9b15c6efa29280463\u0022\u003ECOVID-19 Response (Further Management Measures) Legislation Bill\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000225\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u0022045ef51a8e904dd9896c1ee5f7af03bf\u0022\u003EFirst Reading\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022 data-id=\u00225d4c7d0bd3d54c909f6bb4be137c64a9\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000226\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00225d4c7d0bd3d54c909f6bb4be137c64a9\u0022\u003EHon CHRIS HIPKINS (Leader of the House):\u003C/span\u003E In accordance with a determination of the Business Committee, I move, That the COVID-19 Response (Further Management Measures) Legislation Bill be now read a first time. I nominate that the bill be referred to the Epidemic Response Committee. At the appropriate time, I intend to move that the bill be reported back to the House by 12 May 2020.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000227\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003EThe bill follows the COVID-19 Response (Urgent Management Measures) Legislation Act, which this House passed on 25 March 2020. That Act canvassed a wide range of issues that were considered necessary to effectively respond to COVID-19 and to aid our recovery from it. Altogether, this bill amends or modifies the application of 45 different statutes. It will better equip New Zealand businesses and charities to ride out the impact of COVID-19. It will ensure that essential workers are able to contribute their skills to the recovery effort without being disadvantaged. It will provide an equal opportunity for people to participate in local government by-elections, and it will address a range of potential problems that regulators and regulated parties might encounter administering and complying with statutory requirements in the context of the COVID-19 response. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000228\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003EThere are two tiers of amendments that are included in this bill. The first tier are more significant amendments that will enable businesses, civil society organisations, local government, and others to more effectively manage the immediate impacts of the response to COVID-19 and to mitigate unnecessary and potentially longer-term impacts on society. Changes to insolvency and corporate law will increase the prospects of businesses surviving the COVID-19 response. Changes include the addition of a business debt hibernation regime that will allow companies and other entities to enter into agreements with their creditors in relation to existing debt, and adding safe harbour for insolvency-related directors\u2019 duties. Other changes include giving registrars the ability to issue exemption notices in relation to compliance with statutory obligations, and relief for entities that cannot comply with rules in their constitutions because of COVID-19. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000229\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003EChanges to commercial property law will support commercial tenants and borrowers to manage situations where businesses are unable to pay their rent or to meet their mortgage obligations. The amendments extend the notice period before landlords can cancel commercial leases for non-payment of rent, and they extend the notice period before mortgagees can exercise their rights to sell or repossess a property. Changes to parental leave will allow essential workers to temporarily return to work to assist in the response to COVID-19 without being disadvantaged by losing certain leave entitlements and payments. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000230\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003EChanges to local government by-election timing adjust the timing requirements for local government by-elections. The bill enables key stages of these by-elections to be postponed until COVID-19 movement restrictions are no longer in effect. They\u2019re temporary changes that will ensure that COVID-19 doesn\u2019t prevent New Zealanders from being able to have a reasonable and equal opportunity to participate in local government by-elections as and when they arise. The first change postpones the start of voting for the current \u014Ctorohanga District Council by-election if significant movement restrictions are still in place by the time this bill is enacted. The second change establishes an Order in Council mechanism to make further by-election timing adjustments if these are necessary. The final amendment enables council chief executives to postpone any further by-elections if public health concerns mean that holding a by-election to fill an extraordinary vacancy isn\u2019t appropriate due to COVID-19. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000231\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003EChanges to the Gambling Act will allow for a period of 18 months for the Heart Foundation, Coastguard, and Countdown Kids Charitable Trust to send and receive forms and take payments for their lotteries online or by phone. This provides these organisations with the ability to operate their existing lotteries despite social restrictions and the continuing impact of COVID-19 on face-to-face sales. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000232\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003EThe second tier of changes in the bill concern 22 minor amendments considered necessary to respond and recover from COVID-19. Rather than outlining each of these amendments individually, I\u2019m going to highlight the general policy parameters of these changes in their groupings. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000233\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003EThree amendments are proposed to defer new regulatory requirements in circumstances where Government agencies or businesses would have difficulty implementing the new legislation or requirements that are due to come into force while New Zealand is responding to COVID-19\u2014for example, delaying the commencement of a new regime to regulate financial advisers. This is necessary, as the requirements under alert level 4 in particular made it difficult for the sector to prepare for the regulation while at the same time responding to an increase in demand for financial advice services. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000234\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003EFour amendments are proposed to defer existing statutory deadlines and other minor exemptions where compliance would not be possible or would be unnecessarily burdensome\u2014for example, extending the duration of firearms licences and dealers licences that are expiring in a situation where COVID-19 restrictions have resulted in deferred processing of licence renewal applications. This is necessary to avoid situations where people are non-compliant with the Act through no fault of their own. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000235\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003ESeven amendments are proposed to mitigate impracticality issues that have arisen through the COVID-19 response\u2014for example, amending the Coroners Act 2002 to enable a coroner to direct a pathologist to take swabs to test for COVID-19 as part of a post-mortem examination in a situation where the deceased is suspected to have had COVID-19. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000236\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003EFinally, eight amendments have been proposed to mitigate problems with legislative compliance that have arisen due to the physical presence requirements or other technological reasons\u2014for example, to allow for clinical examinations and reviews taking place under the Mental Health (Compulsory Assessment and Treatment) Act 1992 to be undertaken by audiovisual link rather than in person.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000237\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003EIn closing, I\u2019d like to acknowledge the support of colleagues in the development of this bill. The bill cuts across quite a large number of portfolios and it does demonstrate the wide-reaching impacts of the COVID-19 epidemic, and I commend the bill to the House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002253f86481-33c1-48b2-893b-c11cc0bd673d\u0022 data-id=\u00226313faf351d348f2ae3a1279fd2f1a70\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000238\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002253f86481-33c1-48b2-893b-c11cc0bd673d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00226313faf351d348f2ae3a1279fd2f1a70\u0022\u003EHon PAUL GOLDSMITH (National):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Mr Speaker. My pleasure to speak on this COVID-19 Response (Further Management Measures) Legislation Bill, which the Opposition will support to the first reading and to select committee.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000239\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002253f86481-33c1-48b2-893b-c11cc0bd673d\u0022\u003EI\u2019m holding two copies of the bill here: this one here, which I\u2019ve picked up from the Table, and this was the one that was sent to us last night, and I\u2019m glad\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000240\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00222b3273f8b6534489804d90444e74d948\u0022\u003EHon Chris Hipkins\u003C/span\u003E: They\u2019re both the same. I can assure you they\u2019re both the same.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000241\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002253f86481-33c1-48b2-893b-c11cc0bd673d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00226d834182c5a94011a7523d5d9aeca814\u0022\u003EHon PAUL GOLDSMITH\u003C/span\u003E: I\u2019m looking very carefully, and there are 133 pages on each side, and I\u2019ve read them before, and I do think they are the same law. That is a relief, following the last piece of legislation. So I\u2019m hoping that we are not inadvertently going to pass another several billion dollars of spending by mistake. You would think it was a laughing matter, but it\u2019s not a laughing matter. Actually, it\u2019s been quite a dramatic period that we\u2019ve had in the House here, where I think New Zealanders have understood that the Parliament and the Government has to respond swiftly to an incredible situation that we\u2019re facing with COVID-19 and the impact that it\u2019s having across the economy. So they do need to respond quickly and effectively, but it is also important that the legislation that\u2019s brought before the House is properly scrutinised so that we can have a reasonable understanding of it, and that system failed last week.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000242\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002253f86481-33c1-48b2-893b-c11cc0bd673d\u0022\u003EBut I\u2019m hoping this piece of legislation, which does a number of things which are designed to\u2014well, there\u2019s a whole heap of things, but if I was to focus primarily on those activities that are trying to deal with some practical issues that business is having to deal with because of the consequences of the lockdown that we\u2019ve had for coming up to the seventh week now, and we\u2019ve had a number of businesses that, in the national interest, have been told that they can\u2019t trade and so they\u2019ve had very little revenue, and that creates all sorts of problems, as one can imagine\u2014problems for paying the bills, keeping a company solvent. That\u2019s a very difficult issue for directors of companies who obviously face very substantial legal threats and dangers if they are seen to be trading insolvently. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000243\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002253f86481-33c1-48b2-893b-c11cc0bd673d\u0022\u003EBut, of course, we don\u2019t want to have a situation made even worse where many businesses will fail, many people will lose their jobs, and so we\u2019re looking for practical ways. So the safe harbour provisions around insolvency-related issues, duties, and the business debt hibernation are practical things that we support and will make a difference around the edges. What they probably won\u2019t do sufficiently is make the sort of difference that a scheme to get cash in the hands of small businesses, such as was suggested by the National Party today and Simon Bridges, the National Party leader\u2014which is to say, let\u2019s have a look at the GST that you paid last year and allow businesses to get those payments repaid up to $100,000. Cash in the hand would make a real difference to businesses right now. These provisions in this legislation will help a bit, but certainly not, on their own, bring an end to the situation.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000244\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002253f86481-33c1-48b2-893b-c11cc0bd673d\u0022\u003EThe other thing that\u2019s being covered in this bill is changes to the company property law area where, again, we\u2019re seeing right around the country a lot of businesses struggling to pay the rent. We\u2019ve had the Government\u2019s wage subsidy, which has brought in a lot of money\u2014$10 billion to help pay wages for people employed. That money, I\u2019ve heard the Prime Minister say a number of times and lots of other Ministers say, is going to businesses when, really, that money is actually going to employees in order to keep them employed and to pay their wages. But the businesses themselves are still having to struggle with, particularly, rent and a whole heap of other costs, interest costs, and they\u2019ve put out a whole new fit and all sorts of material that they\u2019ve leased for the company to trade, and there\u2019s costs associated with that.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000245\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002253f86481-33c1-48b2-893b-c11cc0bd673d\u0022\u003ENow, rent has been a real issue. Five weeks ago, six weeks ago, the Minister of Finance said he was going to sort it, don\u2019t worry, and an announcement is imminent. At one point, we heard that it was going to be announced before Easter, and Easter came and went and nothing happened. Then, eventually, a week or two ago, they made this very underwhelming announcement that what they were going to do is extend the notice period before mortgagees can be thrown out\u2014not mortgagees, but also lessees in arrears to the landlord\u2014so from a few days to a few more days. That was met with a great deal of disappointment right across the country.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000246\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002253f86481-33c1-48b2-893b-c11cc0bd673d\u0022\u003EAgain, the best remedy to that is a mechanism to get cash directly into the hands of those small businesses affected. Now, people might ask, \u201CWell, what\u2019s going on here? The National Party is in favour of giving cash out to businesses? I thought they understood that businesses had to stand on their own two feet.\u201D Yes, indeed, that is our general approach, but what we\u2019re dealing with here is a situation where the Government, on behalf of all New Zealanders, has said, \u201CYou cannot trade for seven weeks. You cannot sell your stuff. You cannot open your store and effectively do your business.\u201D That is an extraordinary situation, one that we haven\u2019t really had in this country\u2019s history, and that is why there is a very strong argument to support businesses properly. So this legislation, in so far as it extends a period that leases must be in arrears before landlords can cancel leases, is very much too little, too late on that score and very much inferior to the policy that the National Party announced today.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000247\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002253f86481-33c1-48b2-893b-c11cc0bd673d\u0022\u003EThe only thing I\u2019d also mention is changes to the Commerce Act around cartels. As a former commerce Minister, I\u2019ve always been interested in this, and this is, again, a minor thing but not insignificant. We\u2019re in the heat of the battle as companies try and organise things to keep trading when they\u2019re under extreme limitations during this period. You now have the ability to go to the Commerce Commission to get an authorisation of an arrangement between companies, and this legislation waives the application fee. So, you know, we\u2019re broadly comfortable with that, and, again, it will make a slight practical difference to some parties.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000248\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002253f86481-33c1-48b2-893b-c11cc0bd673d\u0022\u003ESo all in all, if I was to sum up this legislation, we will go off and it will be considered by the Epidemic Response Committee, and I\u2019m grateful that it has a little bit of time\u2014you\u2019d probably want a little bit more time, but we can understand the urgency here. These things in this bill will make a small difference, but if you really want to save jobs and enable reducing the carnage amongst the small business battlers of this country, then the best thing you can do is get some cash in their hands right now. So alongside this bill, I\u2019d encourage the Government to seriously consider changing their approach to that. Thank you very much, Mr Speaker.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022 data-id=\u0022c273377d404c4c128a2452a8ac28834f\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000249\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022c273377d404c4c128a2452a8ac28834f\u0022\u003EHon ANDREW LITTLE (Minister of Justice):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Mr Speaker. It\u2019s a great pleasure to take a call on the COVID-19 Response (Further Management Measures) Legislation Bill. I can agree with the member who\u2019s just resumed his seat, Paul Goldsmith, that this is no doubt utterly extraordinary circumstances for New Zealand and for any Government in office at the time. We\u2019ve had to respond to a situation that pretty much every other country around the world is having to face but do so in a way that understands and respects and is sensitive to the needs of New Zealanders and our peculiar circumstances. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000250\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003EOur particular circumstances are this is a condition that is largely imported. With a border like ours and New Zealand as a destination that it is, not only for its expatriates but for tourists, a lot of people cross our border and that is how the virus made its way here. So the measures we\u2019ve had to take in response, knowing what we knew at the time and know now\u2014because knowledge about the virus is changing by the week and by the day. We have responded and taken measures to protect New Zealand and its interests, and there\u2019s no question that the more we understand about this virus, and until we get the ultimate control mechanism, which is a vaccine, then some measures that we have in place now are going to last for some considerable period of time. That will have an impact on sectors in our economy. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000251\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003ESo it was vital, absolutely vital, with the support of members opposite, that we put in place the initial set of protections\u2014this is after the controls on the border and a variety of other measures. But those measures are in place to sustain and support business\u2014and we\u2019ve done that. Bucket-loads of cash, frankly, have been provided to support business to get through this very difficult phase. That\u2019s the immediate phase. Then there will be the next phase of response for those businesses and those communities who have all done the right thing. Then there\u2019ll have to be, as we move down the alert levels, a range of other measures as we start to get back to something closely resembling normality. But we\u2019ll still be a significant way off that.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000252\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003EThen there is the really long-term stuff, which is what we do, which is the real jobs-generating stuff, knowing that there will be workers displaced from their current jobs, and some sectors will be worse affected than others. It\u2019s the investment that the State can encourage and provide, and also work alongside private investment to get new endeavours of new activities and new investments up and running that\u2019s going to generate those future jobs. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000253\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003EThis bill is partway between the initial responses and the next wave of responses to enable measures to be put in place, rules to be put in place, that allow public organisations and private organisations to make decisions, make judgments, and get on and do their thing. So that\u2019s what this is about. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000254\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003EIn relation to the Property Law Act, which comes under my responsibility as the Minister of Justice, we have been very concerned\u2014and it was predictable that it would happen; that businesses that were forced to cease trading and therefore couldn\u2019t cover their overheads beyond just their wage costs, which could be supported through the wage subsidy scheme, were going to need some assistance to manage that relationship with their landlord. Of course, it\u2019s not just the tenants either. There are some landlords who are somewhat vulnerable too. If your small business is as a landlord with a tenant who is a big multinational corporate, actually you as the landlord are not the one with the whip hand, necessarily; it\u2019s the tenant. So these measures in relation to the Property Law Act are about pushing out the time frames by which a landlord could issue a notice of termination for breach of covenant, principally the covenant requiring the tenants to pay their rent, to provide a breathing space and hope that the parties will take the opportunity to come to terms, understanding that this is an extraordinary set of circumstances, and so that the landlord who thinks there\u2019s a bunch of other tenants queuing up to take their premises when, actually, that queue isn\u2019t very long\u2014in fact, there\u2019s no queue at all\u2014might be able to come to terms with their tenants.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000255\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003EI\u2019m announcing this\u2014the signal was very clear, and I\u2019m pleased to say, at least anecdotally, the response I\u2019ve had has been very good. Many landlords have responded, many tenants have responded, and they\u2019ve been able to come to terms and reach agreements. But it is fair to say too that there is some residual effort required to deal with those landlords and tenants who haven\u2019t been able to reach agreement, and work is under way in Government to explore and to look for a solution that will deal with that, but that is not in this bill. But Schedule 14 of this bill covers those changes to the Property Law Act.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000256\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003EAnother area that is my specific responsibility is the Coroners Act. There is a small administrative change, if you like, to deal with the situation where a person had died and it is assessed as most likely as a result of the virus but they have not been able to return a positive test or even be tested prior to their death, and this allows a coroner to order a test to be taken so that it can be determined that that death is associated with COVID-19. So those changes appear in Schedule 6.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000257\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003EIn Schedule 15, there are changes to some of the time frames under the Local Government Act, because\u2014would you believe it\u2014less than a year after the last local body elections, there are some by-elections that have to be held, and this is simply not a time to be running by-elections with the difficulties of people getting their post, getting their mail, and what have you, and officials and potential candidates being able to communicate with their constituency. So there have been some pragmatic judgments made about some changes to time frames to allow that to happen.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000258\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003EAnother area that is of specific interest to me is in Schedule 8, the changes to the Courts (Remote Participation) Act, in relation to Corrections to allow, where audiovisual link facilities are not available, audio-only means to be used to conduct hearings and get decisions made in those crucial areas.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000259\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003ESo this bill deals with, I think, some very practical questions that might be around for some time. It makes it appropriate to make these changes to this legislation\u2014changes that could not be made under the Epidemic Preparedness Act and the immediate management order provision under that legislation. So this bill makes some very useful changes. It is good that it has got to this point, good that the bill we\u2019re debating is the one that in fact the House should expect to pass\u2014because we have learnt from last week. On that note, I commend the bill to the House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022 data-id=\u002272fd6286592e4f05ad6259f546a20807\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000260\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002272fd6286592e4f05ad6259f546a20807\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: The Hon Roger McClay\u2014Todd McClay.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022c0f78f60-c2fd-46f4-8138-72f39692fc20\u0022 data-id=\u002209a0588f84e6471990619a873c922a0d\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000261\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c0f78f60-c2fd-46f4-8138-72f39692fc20\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002209a0588f84e6471990619a873c922a0d\u0022\u003EHon TODD McCLAY (National\u2014Rotorua):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Mr Speaker. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000262\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022f1f1700851154cc986cc22a764f71c50\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Taumarunui rugby club.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000263\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c0f78f60-c2fd-46f4-8138-72f39692fc20\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022bbd997acb0844fffb86b960131726a48\u0022\u003EHon TODD McCLAY\u003C/span\u003E: That\u2019s right, exactly. Thank you, Mr Speaker. I too rise to speak on this bill, and the National Party will be supporting it. It is an important time for New Zealanders to see that the House can work together where we can pass legislation or make changes that will help everyday New Zealanders and, in this instance, a lot of businesses who are facing great uncertainty. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000264\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c0f78f60-c2fd-46f4-8138-72f39692fc20\u0022\u003EBut I am going to preface that by saying I don\u2019t think the bill goes far enough, or at least there are many other things that we need to focus on and that need to be done with great urgency, because we have a great number of New Zealanders and their businesses. When I talk about businesses, I\u2019m talking about individual New Zealanders\u2014the people that live in our communities that go to work every day and work hard, and that business is more than just a business for them. For many of them, it\u2019s not only their livelihood and the way they pay for their children\u2019s education and other things; it\u2019s actually their life. They are facing great uncertainty and a huge amount of challenge, and I want to address that in a moment.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000265\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c0f78f60-c2fd-46f4-8138-72f39692fc20\u0022\u003EIndeed, some of the parts of the bill make a lot of sense: the extension of the rent arrears. I can see why the Government would see that\u2019s important at the moment, but it is talking about arrears and death; it\u2019s not talking about, or finding ways to, helping those that are in arrears or those they owe money to\u2014the landlords\u2014and I\u2019ll come to that in a moment.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000266\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c0f78f60-c2fd-46f4-8138-72f39692fc20\u0022\u003EThe business debt hibernation also buys time for businesses. I suppose it gives us some certainty, but it doesn\u2019t take away the weight that\u2019s on the shoulders of small business, where they wonder how they can even come close to dealing with the debt that has been built up over the last five or six weeks\u2014for some, seven and longer. The reduction around the impact of regulations is very important, but, actually, there are many more areas where regulatory reform is needed at all times, but particularly today, to get burden off business. As we look at how some of these business people are going to try and rebuild their lives\u2014how they are going to go out there and try and get their business back on an equal footing\u2014there are many areas of burden from regulation that will impose cost upon them, and if the Government doesn\u2019t look to focus and do something about that very quickly, there will be far more businesses that fail that should and could otherwise survive.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000267\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c0f78f60-c2fd-46f4-8138-72f39692fc20\u0022\u003EThe safe harbour around directors is very important. It\u2019s technical but it is very important because we\u2019re not in, as far as business rules are concerned, normal times. Therefore, the normal rules and the responsibilities that directors have can\u2019t have the same impact upon them.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000268\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c0f78f60-c2fd-46f4-8138-72f39692fc20\u0022\u003EIn everything I\u2019m about to say, this is about the jobs of New Zealanders. Now this comes to the deficiencies in the bill and what more needs to be done and how it could be added to and what is needed. It\u2019s around saving jobs and making sure that New Zealanders can see that the taxpayer, through the Government, is going to work with them to protect them, to help them, to keep them in jobs, to keep their businesses going. I would say this House did a very important thing. It\u2019s almost seven weeks ago, maybe eight, when we came in recess and met and we passed legislation, and we gave the Government the ability to spend up to $52 billion without a lot of direction, or a lot of direction from the Government at least, as to what that was to be spent on. One of the first things they did was the wage subsidy, and that has meant that New Zealanders, as they sit at home during lockdown, have less uncertainty more certainly, I suppose.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000269\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c0f78f60-c2fd-46f4-8138-72f39692fc20\u0022\u003EBut the wage subsidy for 12 weeks runs out in four weeks\u2019 time, and this bill should be dealing with that. It should be extending that or talking about how, in many sectors, it will become available or extended. The reason for that is that a company that has taken 12 weeks of the funding for wage support is giving that to their workers. It doesn\u2019t actually do anything for the business other than mean they didn\u2019t have to lay them off at the time it was given. They didn\u2019t have to make those workers redundant or to sack them. But it hasn\u2019t been productive for them, because during the lockdown\u2014that\u2019s the reason we have this bill here: to deal with the implications and the flow-on of that lockdown\u2014their employees were sitting at home. They weren\u2019t generating anything for them, so the taxpayer subsidy that kept people at least on the books, in as far as work was concerned, didn\u2019t help the business at all, other than their employees are still there.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000270\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c0f78f60-c2fd-46f4-8138-72f39692fc20\u0022\u003EKelvin Davis, when I asked in question time earlier, said, \u201CWell, there\u2019s still money left available.\u201D Grant Robertson was the same. There is four more weeks. But if you are a small business or a large business in New Zealand and you still are not able to open, because this bill doesn\u2019t allow you to open, and you have four weeks\u2019 worth of the subsidy left and you don\u2019t know what it is you will be able to do with it\u2014whether you\u2019ll be able to trade or not or the conditions of that or what level 2 looks like\u2014you have so much uncertainty that you are this week faced with the decision of whether or not to lay those workers off, to make them redundant. The reason for that is generally the redundancy period would be four weeks.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000271\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c0f78f60-c2fd-46f4-8138-72f39692fc20\u0022\u003ESo the problem we have is that, actually, if there is not the certainty from the Government that this bill should be providing, that the subsidy will continue or they\u2019ll be able to open and trade again, they can\u2019t wait, because in four weeks\u2019 time the full subsidy will have been used up and they won\u2019t have income to the level they need or they won\u2019t have reserves to then\u2014I\u2019m coming back to that, Mr Speaker\u2014be able to lay those workers off. So this week, New Zealanders face uncertainty of whether they will return to their jobs because businesses up and down the country are facing uncertainty. They don\u2019t know whether they can open, they don\u2019t know what the rules will be yet because the Government hasn\u2019t provided that to them clearly, and they don\u2019t know whether or not that subsidy will continue.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000272\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c0f78f60-c2fd-46f4-8138-72f39692fc20\u0022\u003EIn this bill, there\u2019s a lot of work around rent and landlords. I want to be cautious, because there have been times when it seems that, on purpose or not, the Government has tried to demonise landlords. We certainly saw that during the Epidemic Response Committee hearing when we discussed this. I asked Grant Robertson seven weeks ago, I think it was now, whether or not he would look to do more with landlords and businesses that couldn\u2019t pay their rent. He said at the time it was a few days, maybe a week, away. Well, we\u2019re still waiting.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000273\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c0f78f60-c2fd-46f4-8138-72f39692fc20\u0022\u003ESo in this legislation, there are provisions to help businesses with debt and around what landlords can do and so on. But that\u2019s not good enough, because we have many situations where businesses have had no turnover for seven weeks. They\u2019ve had no grant from the Government at all. There is a small interest-free loan for a year, that for the average business may be $20,000 or $30,000, but that doesn\u2019t come anywhere close to the debt that\u2019s been built up, and still landlords are sitting there, not sure what will happen, even though they\u2019ve been working hard and reducing their rents and giving rental holidays and so on, and the economic burden\u2014the weight of this debt upon businesses in New Zealand\u2014continues to grow.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000274\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c0f78f60-c2fd-46f4-8138-72f39692fc20\u0022\u003ESo what is it that actually is needed? This bill should be actually talking about the wage subsidy and extending it. It should be looking at cash-flow grants for businesses in New Zealand\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000275\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002217eb05b164634e2ebd3a5276ab2ad007\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Order! I\u2019ve been very generous with the member, but I think he better come back to what\u2019s in the bill. Just the last two minutes.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000276\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c0f78f60-c2fd-46f4-8138-72f39692fc20\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00222c871e5fea014a79bd56280dc8be8def\u0022\u003EHon TODD McCLAY\u003C/span\u003E: Good. All right, thank you, Mr Speaker. And therein lies a problem, because whilst there are some good things in there, actually there is not that much to fill up 10 minutes.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000277\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002226d28c7d7e1942268434b1f480f7c909\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: There\u2019s no obligation to fill the time. If the member feels he can\u2019t stay in order, I\u2019m happy to terminate his call.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000278\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c0f78f60-c2fd-46f4-8138-72f39692fc20\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002280c06aa06e6842e2ac598630860899d7\u0022\u003EHon TODD McCLAY\u003C/span\u003E: Thank you. I\u2019ll do my very best. Why don\u2019t I finish with this, Mr Speaker: a heartfelt plea on behalf of the business community in New Zealand\u2014the tourism sector, the small businesses, the people that are still locked away and can\u2019t open their shops\u2014for the Government this week to address the challenges that they face. The weight of the debt and the uncertainty that\u2019s upon them is going to have implications not for days or weeks or months but for years to come. This bill is a start, which is why we are supporting it. But, actually, they can\u2019t wait until the Budget next week. They can\u2019t wait until some politics plays out. They need certainty today around what\u2019s going to happen so they can plan, and if that doesn\u2019t happen quickly enough, there will be businesses that close that shouldn\u2019t close because those people have done\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000279\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022d990e04a406c4462998282a6059375ed\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Second warning.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000280\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c0f78f60-c2fd-46f4-8138-72f39692fc20\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002237a66b026d3c4082b39009ba63a712f9\u0022\u003EHon TODD McCLAY\u003C/span\u003E: \u2014what they were meant to. Then, finally, there will be people that will lose their jobs this week that wouldn\u2019t have to otherwise. Thank you, Mr Speaker.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022f44431ef-b505-4e94-9f57-a60b0a569bf7\u0022 data-id=\u0022c892c85901844cef8980afb1ea2358fb\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000281\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f44431ef-b505-4e94-9f57-a60b0a569bf7\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022c892c85901844cef8980afb1ea2358fb\u0022\u003EHon SHANE JONES (Minister of Forestry):\u003C/span\u003E I rise to support this bill\u2014an extraordinarily broad piece of legislation. Mercifully, I will not be taking my full allotted time, but I want to talk about some of the significant provisions.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000282\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f44431ef-b505-4e94-9f57-a60b0a569bf7\u0022\u003EI want to start speaking very briefly about insolvency and corporate law support for businesses to survive and the development which has already been elaborated upon by Minister Kris Faafoi about the concept of a safe harbour. Whilst it is important for firms\u2014whether they are large or whether they are modest\u2014that the directors feel that they have the latitude to continue to maintain the firm\u2019s operations despite the threat of liquidity, crunches, or insolvency, Kiwi businesses and the men and women in those businesses need to strike a balance. It would be a very, very dismal outcome if, in actual fact, firms are already insolvent and they continue to trade, racking up bills with their suppliers that will never be paid. So whilst this provision does give the necessary latitude and it removes the fear of litigation and statutory action being taken against directors, it does impose upon those directors an additional duty\u2014largely unenforceable\u2014of judgment to be very, very careful with the decisions that they make. They don\u2019t actually have, under this bill\u2014the directors\u2014a carte blanche level of entitlement to engage in reckless behaviour, but much is the fiscal cost of slip between company cup and debtor lip.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000283\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f44431ef-b505-4e94-9f57-a60b0a569bf7\u0022\u003EIn relation to the mortgage support for commercial renters and landlords, this is a vexed issue. Obviously, tenants and many of us as members of the House have received stories of woe in the sense that income\u2019s dried up. The medical emergency has shrunk revenue and it\u2019s caused an enormous amount of stress amongst people who love their businesses, derive not only their livelihood but virtually a sense of being, and the pride associated with taking an idea\u2014whether it\u2019s in tourism or retail, whatever the service is that\u2019s being offered\u2014and building up a nest egg and building up a sense of esteem, and all that has been severely disrupted as we\u2019ve managed our way through the COVID crisis. This particular provision will assist both landlords and leaseholders to work together to resolve their problems. Many landlords are up to the gills in debt, and they do depend on the cash flow from those that occupy their buildings to service the debts that they have against their assets. Not only do we expect a level of common sense; it may come to pass that further work is required in this area, because inevitably what we might like to see as an act of pragmatism and economic kindness may not necessarily come to pass.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000284\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f44431ef-b505-4e94-9f57-a60b0a569bf7\u0022\u003EIn terms of local government elections\u2014of course, we think about the own election in the House, but more on that at a later date\u2014this enables widespread participation at local elections that could be disrupted. It\u2019s a moot point as to how long restrictions are going to impact on us in terms of our ability to move freely around\u2014a key entitlement that Kiwis have taken for granted\u2014but, having said that, this bill reminds us that when it\u2019s been necessary for us to act in a collective fashion, we have done so over the last four or five weeks. But it\u2019s important that these statutory processes continue\u2014i.e., the ability to elect from the community our representatives and they not be halted because of inflexibility in various laws.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000285\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f44431ef-b505-4e94-9f57-a60b0a569bf7\u0022\u003ESo I stand, once again, and I say that our party supports this piece of legislation.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002248a02a21-c1ac-4159-8789-485ad614bd01\u0022 data-id=\u0022245b4b5cf8ab4eb7ae83246b6ea2fa38\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000286\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002248a02a21-c1ac-4159-8789-485ad614bd01\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022245b4b5cf8ab4eb7ae83246b6ea2fa38\u0022\u003EHon MARK MITCHELL (National\u2014Rodney):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Mr Speaker. It\u2019s my pleasure to be able to stand to speak in the House, since we were suspended, to this COVID-19 Response (Further Management Measures) Legislation Bill. If you\u2019ll humour me, Mr Speaker, can I just start by first of all acknowledging all our first responders and essential workers that have carried us through what has been a challenging time for us as a nation, through both the level 4 and now the level 3 lockdown. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000287\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002248a02a21-c1ac-4159-8789-485ad614bd01\u0022\u003ECan I acknowledge the Government and the work that they have done. None of us could have predicted or expected to be hit with something as serious as a global pandemic, and I think that everyone in this House has responded and worked as hard as they can to do the best that we can for the country. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000288\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002248a02a21-c1ac-4159-8789-485ad614bd01\u0022\u003EOn saying that, I felt very strongly six weeks ago or seven weeks ago, when we moved into level 4, that\u2014and we went into a full lockdown. All of us could see and understand, or should have seen and understood, just how significant the impact was going to be on us as a nation. We had to be focused on flattening the curve, and I think that the country\u2019s done a very good job of doing that. But we understood that there was going to be a price to pay on that, and that was going to be the economic harm that we now have to face and try and deal with in terms of recovery. I felt very strongly at the time\u2014and I raised this with the Minister for Small Business and the Minister of Revenue, the Hon Stuart Nash. I said to him, \u201CIf you are going to move us into level 4 and if you are going to shut the country down, of course we\u2019ll get behind you.\u201D\u2014and the country has got behind that decision\u2014\u201CBut you must have an equal and opposite response when it comes to the economy.\u201D \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000289\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002248a02a21-c1ac-4159-8789-485ad614bd01\u0022\u003EYou must have someone\u2014Dr Bloomfield\u2019s done a very good job of protecting the health system and leading the health response. You must have a focus on what we\u2019re doing from day one in terms of the support that needs to be put in place, especially for our small and medium sized enterprises (SMEs) but across our whole economy. If you don\u2019t do that, if you fail to do that, and you take too much time, then the pain and the suffering and the damage is going to be far worse. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000290\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002248a02a21-c1ac-4159-8789-485ad614bd01\u0022\u003EI feel that we\u2019re in a position right now where although it\u2019s good to have this bill in the House, and most of the provisions in it we are supporting\u2014and I will talk directly to the issues that the Hon Andrew Little has raised in his role as the Minister of Justice and in my role as the portfolio holder in our party in Opposition. But I just want to say and put on record that this is way too slow. This should have happened four, five, six weeks ago. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000291\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002248a02a21-c1ac-4159-8789-485ad614bd01\u0022\u003EI indicated clearly and signalled clearly to Stuart Nash that we were already working on this. There was no problem. Our leader, Simon Bridges, had indicated that we would cooperate and work if it meant passing legislation to make sure that the enforcement agencies actually had the powers under a state of emergency to be able to actually police the lockdown, right through to our economic response in terms of\u2014and especially with\u2014businesses having cash flow. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000292\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002248a02a21-c1ac-4159-8789-485ad614bd01\u0022\u003EHaving had my own company and having done my own start-up, and having carried the burden of understanding clearly the responsibility to my employees and the fact that they had families that they were feeding and children that they needed to school\u2014they needed certainty. They needed to be able to financially plan themselves. Understanding all of that, I understood very clearly that there were two things that were going to be front of mind. One was cash flow coming into the company and the other one was payroll, and you had to make sure and you had to be confident and work hard so that you could match those two things together. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000293\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002248a02a21-c1ac-4159-8789-485ad614bd01\u0022\u003ENow, the Government has responded\u2014sorry, Mr Speaker. I will get back to the\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000294\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022c21aebc31f9446458bd2f5fae1c406d8\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Well, hardly back to it\u2014the member hasn\u2019t quite been there yet. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000295\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002248a02a21-c1ac-4159-8789-485ad614bd01\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022fede29c413c54ab3ac0090861c542924\u0022\u003EHon MARK MITCHELL\u003C/span\u003E: The Government has responded in terms of the wage subsidy. We could debate the effectiveness of that, because, unfortunately, a lot of companies have fixed costs, and they may have to use some of that when it\u2019s actually intended for the employees. So we could have a debate about the wage subsidy. Fundamentally, that was good. A good response\u2014good to put that in place. At least employees had some certainty around three months on the 80 percent, but there was a massive deficit and hole around cash flow. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000296\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002248a02a21-c1ac-4159-8789-485ad614bd01\u0022\u003EComing to the\u2014thank you for your patience, Mr Speaker, and I want to acknowledge that. I will come back to what\u2019s being proposed in the bill. Very quickly, on the rents\u2014to me, that\u2019s good, but it\u2019s messing around on the fringes. We\u2019re going from 10 to 30 days. I understand the sentiment that the Minister was talking about in terms of allowing the landlords and the people renting to have that space to be able to negotiate something, but one thing I think we can all agree on is that there is no square peg going into a square hole here. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000297\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002248a02a21-c1ac-4159-8789-485ad614bd01\u0022\u003EI know that with every single case that I deal with in my own electorate in supporting my own constituents, every case is different. Some landlords are not wealthy commercial property owners. They might have invested their life savings in one commercial building and, actually, that revenue is quite important to them. So I agree with the Minister: let\u2019s not demonise the commercial landlords, because many of them are working very hard, and they\u2019re trying to accommodate the businesses that are renting space in their buildings, without a doubt. I just don\u2019t feel that this goes far enough. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000298\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002248a02a21-c1ac-4159-8789-485ad614bd01\u0022\u003EIt extends it from 10 days to 30 days. It\u2019s putting off the inevitable, because what\u2019s happened is that the tap\u2014that cash flow I was talking about\u2014has been turned off, and the hand that turns it off has got a responsibility to find a way of actually filling that gap that\u2019s created. It\u2019s through no fault of their own. It\u2019s not the Government\u2019s fault that we had to deal with coronavirus and it\u2019s not the country\u2019s fault that we had to deal with that, but the reality of it is that the Government\u2019s hand was the one that turned the tap off, so we have to find solutions and ways to be able to bring those SMEs through. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000299\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002248a02a21-c1ac-4159-8789-485ad614bd01\u0022\u003ESMEs run on two things, fundamentally. They run on confidence and they run on energy. If you remove the confidence or the energy is driven down, you\u2019ve got a big problem in terms of trying to recover and have them lead the recovery, because the Government\u2014they don\u2019t generate revenue. It\u2019s our businesses that generate the revenue. They are the ones that pay the tax that runs our health system and that runs our education system. So, fundamentally, they need to be supported. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000300\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002248a02a21-c1ac-4159-8789-485ad614bd01\u0022\u003EIn terms of the electronic communications in our courts\u2014look, this is common sense. We have got a backlog. I understand that we\u2019re going to have to deal with that, so, basically, what the Government\u2019s proposing is that instead of using the audiovisual link (AVL), we can go to an audio link. I agree with this. I think this is a good move. I don\u2019t want to see it used once we transition out of lockdown and when we can get the courts back up and running again. I think that it\u2019s important that we transition back to having the default of an AVL, because, obviously\u2014the Minister\u2019s agreeing. He knows the issues around going to just an audio link only. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000301\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002248a02a21-c1ac-4159-8789-485ad614bd01\u0022\u003EIn terms of being able to swab a deceased person\u2014absolutely. It makes complete sense. We\u2019re in support of that. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000302\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002248a02a21-c1ac-4159-8789-485ad614bd01\u0022\u003ESo, Mr Speaker, thank you again for your tolerance. I just felt very strongly that I wanted to make some comments that I feel, fundamentally, are critically important for us as a nation. I\u2019d just finish on this: it feels like there\u2019s been a sense of urgency\u2014I think that there has been a genuine sense of urgency. That sense of urgency needs to scale up and not be reduced. Every day now is a wasted opportunity in terms of how we respond, and I\u2019d rather see\u2014people are starting to feel \u201CWhy are we staying in level 3?\u201D They want more information and they want more transparency around that, and I feel very strongly now that, daily, the Government should be looking at ways to be able to get the country moving again. That means having that rapid testing regime in place. That means having\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022 data-id=\u002206f1d8a5611645628910ecb1b1551bf2\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000303\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002206f1d8a5611645628910ecb1b1551bf2\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Order! Order! Order! I have been very tolerant. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002269dfdffa-4227-42b6-875a-fc8033bc25cc\u0022 data-id=\u0022a89824986f4444ac90c082dab19fc1fb\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000304\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002269dfdffa-4227-42b6-875a-fc8033bc25cc\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022a89824986f4444ac90c082dab19fc1fb\u0022\u003EJAN LOGIE (Green):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Mr Speaker. I rise to take a call on behalf of the Green Party on the COVID-19 Response (Further Management Measures) Legislation Bill, and in my speech I will talk to the content of the legislation, starting with the title of it. Just pointing out that this is further management measures, and this does sit in the context of a huge amount of work that has been going on in Government, working with business and with our communities to make sure that we all get through this together and reset ourselves to be as strong as possible in the next stages of our recovery.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000305\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002269dfdffa-4227-42b6-875a-fc8033bc25cc\u0022\u003EThis piece of legislation is not the headline-grabbing legislation\u2014I don\u2019t think anyone would characterise it that way\u2014but it\u2019s really important, and I think it does demonstrate the extent of the work that\u2019s required at the moment, because this legislation amends 45 statutes and it\u2019s in two tiers. So there are some substantive policy issues, and then there\u2019s a lot more technical amendments that are helping just make sure that the law is meeting the needs of people in the changing times and that we\u2019re not putting undue expectations on them that are actually impossible with the restrictions that we have in place at the moment.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000306\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002269dfdffa-4227-42b6-875a-fc8033bc25cc\u0022\u003ESo, just to talk to some of the headline changes that are in this legislation\u2014although I will just say that I am really pleased to see, considering the breadth of amendments in this, that it will be going to the Epidemic Response Committee for consideration and submissions, because it is very easy, in the speed that all of Government is operating in at the moment and the range of people coming together to work on these responses, for mistakes to be made. So to have that public scrutiny is very welcome to us. That there\u2019ll be the report-back date on 12 May, back to this House\u2014that also acknowledges the urgency of this work, and I think that the Government has got the balance of that right. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000307\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002269dfdffa-4227-42b6-875a-fc8033bc25cc\u0022\u003ESo, back to some of the headline substantive changes\u2014that probably won\u2019t be headlines\u2014that are around changes to insolvency and corporate law, and that creates a business hibernation regime to allow companies and other entities to enter into agreements with the creditors in relation to existing debt and adding a safe harbour for insolvency-related directors\u2019 duties. That has been raised, and we have heard those issues coming from the community, of people wanting that added security, and it does, I think, make sense in this context to add that in. I will also endorse, though, the messages from the Hon Shane Jones in relation to safe harbour not being an incentive to neglect duties and responsibilities, and that is not the intent of this.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000308\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002269dfdffa-4227-42b6-875a-fc8033bc25cc\u0022\u003EAnother point that has had quite a bit of discussion from the Opposition members is around the changes to commercial property law and extending the notice period before landlords can cancel commercial leases for non-payment of rent, and extending the notice period before mortgagees can exercise their rights to sell or repossess a property. While more is being called for in this space, and I suspect there will be more work needed in this area, it is good to see this coming in now in the context of a wide range of changes and that that can happen more speedily while the other policy work can be properly considered.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000309\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002269dfdffa-4227-42b6-875a-fc8033bc25cc\u0022\u003EAnother aspect in this, which has been about just\u2014and is\u2014securing that the essential workers and people who really put themselves out there to keep us going through this really difficult time, of just making sure that none of those people are unintentionally penalised, and so I haven\u2019t heard anybody else mention in the House that in here is the change that, if somebody has returned or returns temporarily from paid parental leave, but to be able to help keep us going, they\u2019re not going to lose their parental leave. I think that is really important, because we know that people really want to be part of the solution and be part of trying to get us all back on our feet, and I\u2019d hate to see people penalised from time with their children in the future for that instinct and that assistance that they\u2019ve offered us. So it\u2019s great to see that change.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000310\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002269dfdffa-4227-42b6-875a-fc8033bc25cc\u0022\u003EThere\u2019s also a change to local government by-election timing, as I understand that there are by-elections that are scheduled. So voting in the current \u014Ctorohanga District Council by-election would not be possible with the restrictions in place, and we don\u2019t\u2014certainly in the next phases, either\u2014want people congregating. So this just enables postponement from any by-elections to a time when it would be appropriate for people to be coming together.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000311\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002269dfdffa-4227-42b6-875a-fc8033bc25cc\u0022\u003EAnother thing that this bill is changing which is considered substantive and, I think, speaks to some of the Government\u2019s connection to community, that this has come through in the changes, is a change to the Gambling Act\u2014not something that I, certainly, would have expected to be part of our COVID response. But it enables charitable organisations, specifically the Heart Foundation, Coastguard, and Countdown Kids Charitable Trust, for whom one of their primary fund-raising mechanisms is through those raffles that people may have seen or bought at other times, and that keeps those organisations running. But the legislation prevents those organisations from selling raffle tickets via online or by phone. So this is recognising that we don\u2019t want these organisations to fall over; we want them to be able to maintain their traditional funding base. So it makes a change to the Gambling Act to enable them to do that in this time when they can\u2019t do that on a face-to-face basis. I do really just want to acknowledge the extent of the Government\u2019s communication and connection to community that this type of change is being picked up and is being responded to so promptly in legislation. It gives me a lot of confidence for our future.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000312\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002269dfdffa-4227-42b6-875a-fc8033bc25cc\u0022\u003ESo there\u2019s also the second tier, as the Minister referred to it, of technical changes, and there are 22 minor amendments that fall into that category, and they cover a wide range of things\u2014so, deferring regulatory requirements where we know that either the Government or the sector covered by the regulatory regime actually just won\u2019t have the time to be able to put the new system in place. So that covers, I think, the new system or regime that\u2019s been set up to regulate financial advisers, just because, in this context, people haven\u2019t had the chance to get together to be able to do that work. It defers existing statutory deadlines and other minor exemptions where compliance would just not be possible. So firearms licences, where people are not able to go in, and we certainly don\u2019t want, I\u2019m assuming, our police time taken up with renewing firearms licences at this time\u2014there is other work for them to be doing. So this just extends that and makes sure that people aren\u2019t at odds with the legislation, through no fault of their own, and makes amendments to mitigate impracticality issues. So, at the moment, one example of this is to enable coroners to direct a pathologist to take swabs to test for COVID-19\u2014pretty straightforward but actually not something that\u2019s supported by legislation at the moment and, I think, something that we all, while it\u2019s a technical change, have an interest in seeing that change happen quickly.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000313\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002269dfdffa-4227-42b6-875a-fc8033bc25cc\u0022\u003EThen, also, amendments to mitigate problems with legislative compliance, and one of the examples of this is to allow clinical examinations or reviews under the Mental Health (Compulsory Assessment and Treatment) Act to be undertaken by audiovisual link instead of having to be face-to-face, which is what the law requires at the moment. I think that is a good temporary measure\u2014and, obviously, a temporary one; we wouldn\u2019t want to see that become the norm in other circumstances. But, again, we\u2019re happy to commend this bill.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022 data-id=\u0022c2f1ad93fd7a4b87bf056a041e64b931\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000314\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022c2f1ad93fd7a4b87bf056a041e64b931\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Before I call the member, I\u2019m just going to ask Mr Faafoi to move the offending object. Thank you.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00224a25943b-cb3b-49c3-bd10-74316fae17f1\u0022 data-id=\u002268b3d6dba3384a7c96778f81bffff995\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000315\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00224a25943b-cb3b-49c3-bd10-74316fae17f1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002268b3d6dba3384a7c96778f81bffff995\u0022\u003EHon JACQUI DEAN (National\u2014Waitaki):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Mr Speaker. It\u2019s with pleasure that I lend my thoughts to the COVID-19 Response (Further Management Measures) Legislation Bill. In particular, I want to focus on the clauses as they relate to local government. But, first, before I do that, I would like to thank and acknowledge the work that the Government has done over the past nearly six weeks, and that\u2019s all encompassing for all Ministers, and also to widen out my acknowledgment to all members of this House, who, from their homes in isolation, and their bubbles in isolation, have kept up particularly the pastoral care work, which is an important part of an MP\u2019s role. It seems that just reaching out at the end of a telephone line to an individual somewhere in the electorate or in New Zealand is a really good way of connecting at the moment. If we can do anything more than provide information and reassurance, then I would say that we have all been gainfully occupied in this time and will continue to do so for some time.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000316\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00224a25943b-cb3b-49c3-bd10-74316fae17f1\u0022\u003ESo this COVID-19 Response (Further Management Measures) Legislation Bill does make a number of amendments to a number of bills. I want to focus my attention, as I said, on local government. To add context to that, I want to say that on 24 March this year, as I was going into the fruit and vege shop for the last time in what will probably be more than a month or so, I got a phone call from a former parliamentary colleague, now Mayor of Northland, the Hon John Carter, who alerted to me and raised the issue with me the future of local government within COVID and after the COVID epidemic has been brought under control, and that is the impact on local government funding.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000317\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00224a25943b-cb3b-49c3-bd10-74316fae17f1\u0022\u003EWhat the Hon John Carter raised with me is that he knew the day before we went into lockdown\u2014as, no doubt, a number of mayors and CEs knew\u2014that local government revenue would be badly impacted. John Carter raised with me commercial rates, that businesses would be struggling and unable to honour their rents sometimes, and that therefore the commercial landlord would then be unable in some instances to honour their rate obligations. John Carter had done some calculations about the impact that would potentially have on his district council, and I imagine that district councils all throughout New Zealand were doing the same sort of calculations about the impact on revenue\u2014not only from rates revenue but also fees and charges, development contributions, and so on. And such has come to pass. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000318\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00224a25943b-cb3b-49c3-bd10-74316fae17f1\u0022\u003EThe conversation very quickly turned to the issue of rate increases. Should it be a zero rate increase\u2014very attractive in some quarters? Should it be a managed rate increase? Should that expenditure be more targeted towards recovery\u2014more targeted towards infrastructure? So there\u2019s been a lot of thinking in local government all around New Zealand on just how they were going to respond to the COVID-19 epidemic and what their response was going to be.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000319\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00224a25943b-cb3b-49c3-bd10-74316fae17f1\u0022\u003EThis legislation makes several amendments to the Local Government (Rating) Act, to the Local Electoral Act, and to the Local Government Act, which are set out in the bill. I\u2019m not going to go through every one. Some of them are practical and sensible. Jan Logie, the previous speaker, mentioned a few of them. Timing milestones, which are set in statute for by-elections, have been given greater flexibility for carrying out their by-elections. There is one current by-election currently under way. There will be allowance to fill extraordinary vacancies on councils as they arise from time to time. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000320\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00224a25943b-cb3b-49c3-bd10-74316fae17f1\u0022\u003EI think what is probably quite undervalued but a very useful amendment is that there is a clause which removes the requirement to publish a notice in the newspaper. Those of us who have been around legislation for a while know that there have been amendments in a number of statutes where public notices are required to widen out that requirement to wider than just a notice in the newspaper. As we know, a number of newspapers still cannot publish, and particularly in smaller communities. Those small community newspapers are the very place where people do see public notices, but now, due to this bill, those local authorities can use other forums. I think a happy consequence of that is that people who do take notice of public announcements will get used to perhaps following councils websites as a good source of information for them.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000321\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00224a25943b-cb3b-49c3-bd10-74316fae17f1\u0022\u003EThe only clauses that give National members a little cause for concern are those that allow for consultation to be limited on current long-term plan changes. Normally, there is a prescribed consultation process for LTPs, long-term plan, change processes, and due to the nature of timing and the limitations on consultation we find ourselves in now, there are clauses in this bill to limit that consultation provided that the Office of the Auditor-General (OAG) provides a report on the changes within the LTP proposed changes. That is a good measure. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000322\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00224a25943b-cb3b-49c3-bd10-74316fae17f1\u0022\u003EBut there is a concern that there are clauses where, because of the timing\u2014where waiting for a report from the OAG would prevent a change in an LTP if it had to take effect before 30 June this year, which is not a long way away; it\u2019s something like seven weeks away\u2014it will then be acceptable for the LTP to go through without an Auditor-General report, but the report must state that there has been no OAG oversight and state the reason why. I understand that fail-safe. I understand the reason for it, but as my colleague and spokesperson for Auckland local government, Denise Lee, pointed out in a conversation to me last evening, Auckland Council, for example, is dealing with a very large annual budget. For scrutiny of any changes of any kind where in legislation consultation is prescribed, any change to that should be done rarely and reasonably. So that is one of the clauses\u2014the only clause, to be fair, in the local government part of this bill\u2014where National does have some concerns.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000323\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00224a25943b-cb3b-49c3-bd10-74316fae17f1\u0022\u003ESo I will just about conclude my contribution by just saying to the local government sector that the local government sector may be at home in their bubbles, mayors and chief executives may be zooming their meetings instead of having them in person, and councils may be meeting with or without their pants on\u2014David Benson-Pope, Dunedin City Council today; most unusual\u2014but, none the less, business is still being done, communities are still being minded, and I commend and congratulate them for that.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022977cccaf-581d-4f48-924e-32bf6c54a93d\u0022 data-id=\u002244363f8691d246c595d73652a1e9bae6\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000324\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022977cccaf-581d-4f48-924e-32bf6c54a93d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002244363f8691d246c595d73652a1e9bae6\u0022\u003EDEPUTY SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: I call Ginny Andersen. Well, it is a split call. This is the next split call.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022c21f4beb-20c4-4b12-bc6f-fdc931e2dc96\u0022 data-id=\u0022cd9100cde3b24adb8e2fc6e7d4a5ec45\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000325\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c21f4beb-20c4-4b12-bc6f-fdc931e2dc96\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022cd9100cde3b24adb8e2fc6e7d4a5ec45\u0022\u003EGINNY ANDERSEN (Labour):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Madam Speaker. Thank you for the opportunity for speaking on this bill at this important time in New Zealand\u2019s history. This bill forms part of the Government\u2019s plan to get New Zealand moving once again. It provides support and certainty\u2014certainty at a time when we need it. It amends 45 different pieces of legislation to allow businesses, workers, local government, families, and charities to adapt to the changed environment that we are now operating within to enable us to manage the immediate impacts of COVID-19 but also to mitigate those longer-term impacts. This Government took immediate action to cushion the economic blow by protecting jobs, incomes, and businesses, and this bill forms part of the foundations now being laid to chart our course to recovery. So far, we have already seen over 1.6 million New Zealanders supported through the wage subsidy; also, the introduction of new tax and rent measures to support small and medium businesses; and we have worked with banks to help guarantee finance to businesses that need it. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000326\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c21f4beb-20c4-4b12-bc6f-fdc931e2dc96\u0022\u003EThis bill enables us to adapt, and it does it in five main areas. This bill includes changes to insolvency and corporate law to help businesses facing insolvency increase their prospects of remaining viable, and to keep New Zealanders in jobs during the COVID-19 response. Secondly, there are measures to support commercial tenants and landlords who are struggling to pay rent or to meet mortgage payments, which I know from my own area in the Hutt is a real concern. Thirdly, it changes the parental leave scheme to allow essential workers to return to work without being disadvantaged by losing entitlements to certain leave payments. It changes the local government area, as already has been mentioned, by looking at the by-election timing so that this continues to be a fair process. Finally, changes will also be made in the charitable space to allow groups such as the Heart Foundation, Coastguard, and Countdown Kids Charitable Trust to process their fund-raising lotteries through email, phone, and electronic payments. These are important adaptations and changes to enable our country to continue working under such extraordinary circumstances.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000327\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c21f4beb-20c4-4b12-bc6f-fdc931e2dc96\u0022\u003EWe have a hard road ahead of us in New Zealand, and I would like to conclude today by simply acknowledging firstly those essential workers and their families that have gone above and beyond for New Zealand at a time when we have needed it more than ever before. I would like to acknowledge all of those businesses that are doing everything they possibly can to keep ticking over at a time that is incredibly difficult. I would like to acknowledge all those Government workers in the public sector who have done work so that we have bills like this to continue to pass legislation when we need to. And I would like to acknowledge all those people at home who are working, alongside trying to school their children every day. I know it\u2019s not easy. It\u2019s a hard road ahead, but I know that by working together across this House and getting agreement, as we have today on this bill, New Zealand can work together to make sure we recover from the shock which is COVID-19.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022861a1798-a396-4a6c-b9e2-7d2f15d4a001\u0022 data-id=\u002250bdf52e204744f79d1310d824f5896e\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000328\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022861a1798-a396-4a6c-b9e2-7d2f15d4a001\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002250bdf52e204744f79d1310d824f5896e\u0022\u003EDr SHANE RETI (National\u2014Whangarei):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Madam Speaker. It\u2019s a pleasure to talk to this bill and to collaborate on a piece of work that we think is important. I want to talk to three schedules in this bill: Schedule 11, Schedule 4, Schedule 6. The first two comments I make will be brief, the third\u2014to Schedule 6\u2014will be a little bit more substantive. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000329\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022861a1798-a396-4a6c-b9e2-7d2f15d4a001\u0022\u003ESection 11\u2014I want to talk to the mental health component. The audio and teleconferencing abilities under this schedule are useful. I just want to exercise some caution\u2014a mental health examination done by audio or done by teleconference will be incredibly difficult. It\u2019s already difficult in person and there are so many cues in person that you pick up that I would just exercise some caution and great skill in using that part of the bill. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000330\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022861a1798-a396-4a6c-b9e2-7d2f15d4a001\u0022\u003ESchedule 4 talks to the business debt hibernation scheme and also alludes to the wage subsidy, both of which we support and would be particularly useful for people like those we saw in front of the Epidemic Response Committee this morning: the hairdressers, for example, who tell us that, unfortunately, there are host employers already handing back their apprentices; the master plumbers who have written to me and said if the wage subsidy is not extended, an estimated 35 percent\u2014or about 970 apprentices\u2014will be laid off. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000331\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022861a1798-a396-4a6c-b9e2-7d2f15d4a001\u0022\u003EI would also like to point to the travel industry, who may benefit from this, and encourage the Government to look at what they might particularly do for travel agents. The reason I say that is this. It turns out there is about $100 million of offshore refunds, cash refunds, for New Zealanders who booked with travel agents. If travel agents don\u2019t survive, the ability to bring that back into New Zealand will be severely compromised because it was done through a one-to-one relationship. Imagine if we could bring that $100 million back\u2014those refunds in fares; cash fares, not credits\u2014into New Zealanders\u2019 hands. To do that, we\u2019re going to need to keep some of the travel brokers, the face-to-face travel brokers, alive. So if we could just apply ourselves to that\u2014how we could also do something good there. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000332\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022861a1798-a396-4a6c-b9e2-7d2f15d4a001\u0022\u003EI particularly, though, want to talk to Schedule 6, which is amendments to the Coroners Act. The particular line I want to talk to here is new section 21B(2) inserted by clause 2: \u201Ca preliminary inspection of the body performed under section 21A of the Act must include the taking and testing of nasopharyngeal and oropharyngeal swabs in any case where the deceased is suspected to have had COVID-19 at the time of death.\u201D Now, we already have, under several provisions in law, the ability and the requirement to do testing on deceased people. So I see this more as a reminder rather than something dramatically new into the law. I also point out there that the requirement is to do a nasopharyngeal\u2014nose\u2014swab as well as a throat swab and that\u2019s a reflection on the times when we\u2019ve been running out of nasal swabs during this lockdown period\u2014just how important that is, that we\u2019re going to put that in legislation: you\u2019ve got to do them both, a nose and a throat swab. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000333\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022861a1798-a396-4a6c-b9e2-7d2f15d4a001\u0022\u003EI also want to comment on the large body of work that needs to wrap around this particular provision, so everyone in the House is absolutely agreed it\u2019s the right thing to do. We need to do swabs on those who are deceased who we think might have had the infection. But here\u2019s my problem. My problem comes from a written parliamentary question four days ago, 5604 to the Minister of Health: \u201CHow many coronavirus tests, if any, have been undertaken on deceased patients?\u201D And here\u2019s the answer: \u201CI\u2019m advised that this information is not collected by the Ministry of Health in a form that is able to be reported on.\u201D Why on earth are we passing legislation if we\u2019re not going to be able to do anything with it? \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000334\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022861a1798-a396-4a6c-b9e2-7d2f15d4a001\u0022\u003ESubstantially, the ministry, if they want this piece of legislation to be effective\u2014and it\u2019s good. It\u2019s important. We need to know if people have deceased and actually had coronavirus, because that will give us some sense of where it is in the community and what we may or may not be missing. But if we do that, if we pass this, if we say yes, that\u2019s what must be done. It helps us nought if we\u2019re unable to report on it. As of four days ago, the Minister of Health said to me, \u201CWe\u2019re not able to collect it and we\u2019re not able to report on it.\u201D That will be a substantial body of work, and I\u2019d suggest it\u2019s a digital collection, because we found that out with contact tracing\u2014you can\u2019t answer the questions because it was manual, manual, manual through until about 6 April, when they moved to a centralised digital platform, and now we can start getting some reporting on it. These will be important figures. Let\u2019s do it right from the beginning. Let\u2019s get to a digital platform as soon as we can so that we can report on the nose and throat swabs that are done on deceased patients who we suspect coronavirus. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000335\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022861a1798-a396-4a6c-b9e2-7d2f15d4a001\u0022\u003ESo the point I\u2019m making here is the argument for it to be in the bill is good, but it\u2019s going to need a lot of wraparound work to actually bring it to life. So if the Government could apply themselves, please, to get it into a mechanism where we can easily collect and easily report, I think it will fulfil the ambition of this schedule. Thank you, Madam Speaker.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022 data-id=\u00225a617a2ed3ee44ddb8fb8bfe408c51d3\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000336\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00225a617a2ed3ee44ddb8fb8bfe408c51d3\u0022\u003EDAVID SEYMOUR (Leader\u2014ACT):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Madam Speaker. I rise on behalf of ACT in opposition to the COVID-19 Response (Further Management Measures) Legislation Bill. It\u2019s commonly said that the Government makes laws. That is not true. This Parliament makes laws, and New Zealanders overwhelmingly and voluntarily follow the laws of this Parliament. Why? Because they believe that our processes are robust, that we think carefully about the laws that we are making, and that we listen. As a result of that, we have a long tradition of democracy in this country that has done pretty well for us.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000337\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003ENow, lately, things have been a little different. We have been facing a global crisis, and we\u2019ve been asked to unite against a common enemy. I think it\u2019s fair to say that Parliament has come to the party and given the Government a free pass. Well, the anaesthetic is wearing off. This Parliament cannot afford to continue to be a rubber stamp for the Government sweeping its mistakes under the carpet. I think the turning point we saw just last Thursday when I read in the newspaper \u201CParliament passes wrong law\u201D. Well, actually, I often think that\u2019s happened, but I never imagined it would happen because the Government couldn\u2019t even make sure the right piece of paper was on that Table and Parliament really did pass the wrong piece of legislation. It is time to bring democracy back and for Parliament to do its job that New Zealanders elect us for, of scrutinising the Government\u2019s legislation properly.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000338\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003ENo member of this House can say in good conscience that the 133 pages that they received less than 24 hours ago have been properly read or understood in terms of their implications. I suspect that there will be serious unintended consequences of some of the headline issues in this bill. The Hon Shane Jones pointed out that the safe harbour against trading while insolvent may well be abused. Well, I\u2019ve had a number of people in the business community raise this possibility with me. They\u2019ve said that for every director who continues to trade and is able to keep the nexus of a company together because of this exemption, you are going to find people who take advantage of it and put bad debts on to other companies, and it may well turn out that this so-called safe harbour is net negative.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000339\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003EBut what of the other major initiative in this bill, which is the change in the time after which a bank can foreclose on a landlord who\u2019s borrowed from them, or a landlord can move on a commercial tenant? Well, what I\u2019d say to the Government is that over the last four or five weeks, overwhelmingly, landlords, tenants, and banks have come to voluntary arrangements. I know there are some egregious and sometimes heartbreaking exceptions, but, overwhelmingly, people have come to arrangements. I said to the Minister of Finance at the Epidemic Response Committee five weeks ago now, \u201CWith respect, Mr Robertson, you have to move on commercial leases and you have to move soon.\u201D Well, five weeks later, he moves, but it\u2019s far too late. If people have got through the last five weeks, they probably don\u2019t need his help now. What they do need is a serious cash injection for those companies that have no money\u2014no good passing the buck from tenant to landlord to bank, because the buck has to stop somewhere.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000340\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003EIt\u2019s with considerable regret that I oppose some aspects of this bill. I think allowing charities to continue raffles digitally is very sensible. I think some of the local government amendments allowing people to have digital meetings and some of the administrative changes allowing forms to be filed digitally are very sensible. I think extending firearm and driver licences is very sensible. But the question, when a member of Parliament decides whether or not to vote for a piece of legislation, is not \u201CDoes the member of Parliament think there are some sensible things?\u201D but \u201CCan they in good conscience vote for a bill that not one person in this Parliament\u201D\u2014I can guarantee\u2014\u201Chas properly read and understood?\u201D For that reason, I stand in opposition to this bill on behalf of the ACT Party.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000341\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003EI\u2019d go on to say that the regulatory impact statement requirements have been neglected in the case of this bill, and that is a great shame. Throughout this COVID-19 response, the Government has said, \u201CWe don\u2019t believe that there should be a regulatory impact statement.\u201D The Government hasn\u2019t taken the option even of using cut-down regulatory impact analysis on this bill. What they have done is said \u201CWe don\u2019t believe regulatory impact analysis gives any value.\u201D, and that\u2019s in the departmental disclosure statement for this bill. The best they could come up with is a vaguely related regulatory impact statement from another bill which doesn\u2019t actually really have anything to do with this particular bill. The fact of the matter is that if the Government thinks that regulatory impact analysis has no value, then they believe the impact of their laws on New Zealanders has no value, and the property rights and the rights of New Zealanders in general have no value. The fact that there is no\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022977cccaf-581d-4f48-924e-32bf6c54a93d\u0022 data-id=\u0022806b3d5a3b5c42efab6ce8f356c49ea4\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000342\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022977cccaf-581d-4f48-924e-32bf6c54a93d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022806b3d5a3b5c42efab6ce8f356c49ea4\u0022\u003EDEPUTY SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: I\u2019m sorry to interrupt the member, but the member\u2019s time has\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000343\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00220aea422e756f4a789f4c2dfc3250edad\u0022\u003EDavid Seymour\u003C/span\u003E: \u2014regulatory impact analysis is another reason to oppose this bill. Madam Speaker, can we get some clarity on how long this speech is?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000344\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022977cccaf-581d-4f48-924e-32bf6c54a93d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022d86f9eabe5f942388f22212249058d5f\u0022\u003EDEPUTY SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: It\u2019s finished.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000345\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00228087d5449c0d48198f757c4e9a2ec639\u0022\u003EDavid Seymour\u003C/span\u003E: Oh, it\u2019s finished. So what you mean is 7\u00BD minutes?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000346\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022977cccaf-581d-4f48-924e-32bf6c54a93d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022c7c640a55dd84022a1338cbedbdf2c8e\u0022\u003EDEPUTY SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: It was my mistake. I beg your pardon.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000347\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022682ecb30503c4571af4d124e6a03a701\u0022\u003EDavid Seymour\u003C/span\u003E: I appreciate the extra time. Thank you, Madam Speaker.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000348\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022977cccaf-581d-4f48-924e-32bf6c54a93d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00229416af9884e641e590444e947819ce46\u0022\u003EDEPUTY SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: I do apologise to the House. I thought that the Labour member went first and ACT came second, in which case no Labour member stood up, so I gave you the full 10, but it\u2019s been pointed out to me that it was my mistake, that you go first and the Labour member goes second. So I will now call the Labour member.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022a8cab3e3-b023-4ce7-9f4b-2c4137029057\u0022 data-id=\u00223c5ab27f887543fa9497cc8765674af0\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000349\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a8cab3e3-b023-4ce7-9f4b-2c4137029057\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00223c5ab27f887543fa9497cc8765674af0\u0022\u003EKIRITAPU ALLAN (Labour):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you to my colleague Mr Seymour, and I understand that, look, we\u2019re operating in relatively fluid and flexible times, so I don\u2019t intend to take much time of this House this afternoon. This is unprecedented times. We are passing immeasurable amounts of legislation to ensure that we can protect New Zealanders, and consistent with the comments from this side of the House, we commend this bill to the House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002203fd985b-4fb8-4111-ba38-5033a254d962\u0022 data-id=\u0022c24b7a1b257d4a168fbdc5f20e36b291\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000350\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002203fd985b-4fb8-4111-ba38-5033a254d962\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022c24b7a1b257d4a168fbdc5f20e36b291\u0022\u003EBRETT HUDSON (National):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Madam Speaker. I rise in support of the COVID-19 Response (Further Management Measures) Legislation Bill. I\u2019m going to limit my comments predominantly to the matters relating to commerce and the matters particularly relating to changes to insolvency laws to give some protection to businesses, and particularly to directors of those businesses, and also to the debt hibernation scheme as proposed.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000351\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002203fd985b-4fb8-4111-ba38-5033a254d962\u0022\u003EI\u2019m going to speculate that, clearly, Ministers and Government members had the same sorts of conversations that many National Party members had with business owners and directors preceding and then into the early stages of the lockdown. Given previous issues in our history, there are very stringent requirements on directors and their obligations regarding their oversight of companies, and particularly where they might be trading when they are insolvent. If we actually look at the conversations that we had with people in those roles, and the situation today and in the weeks preceding, it\u2019s quite possible\u2014a debatable point\u2014that there are any number of businesses whose directors should possibly already have instigated measures towards potential insolvency, simply because the outlook has been so bleak, and remains to a large degree, that it is completely uncertain, and their very clear legal obligations would no doubt and did, in fact, given the conversations we had, lead many to believe that they were at risk of being deemed to have failed to have met those obligations and were permitting a company to continue trading when they had every or sufficient reason to believe that insolvency was in very severe doubt.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000352\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002203fd985b-4fb8-4111-ba38-5033a254d962\u0022\u003ESo if these measures were not to be taken, unquestionably we would have many more businesses folding in very short order in New Zealand. Now, this is no guarantee that they won\u2019t, but it is very clear that without these measures, there would certainly be any number\u2014and probably a great number\u2014of businesses that would have to be put into insolvency because of that gross uncertainty of the outlook and the legal obligations that rest upon those that govern those businesses. So we support the principle of the measures. Now, that doesn\u2019t necessarily mean that they are guaranteed to work, and it doesn\u2019t mean that as they are written they will have the consequence that they intend.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000353\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002203fd985b-4fb8-4111-ba38-5033a254d962\u0022\u003EIf we look at it, the fundamental issues that are facing businesses right now\u2014yes, there is the future uncertainty, a massive uncertainty which persists and will probably persist for some time to come, but the immediate greater issue, actually, is a lack of cash flow. So many businesses have been shut down if not completely, as near as complete as possible. Many are still either unable to trade or unable to trade anything like their normal levels under the current alert level 3. What they really need is income, cash flow, to help keep those businesses solvent and going.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000354\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002203fd985b-4fb8-4111-ba38-5033a254d962\u0022\u003EJust today, the Leader of the Opposition announced plans that National, had it the opportunity, would do to help to address those very immediate issues, which are things like the GST cash-back, the ability to recognise capital investment very rapidly\u2014things that would help to keep a company trading today and give a greater sense of optimism and certainty about the future to maintain themselves or to sustain for some time. Alas, we\u2019re on the wrong side of the House at the moment. We can have great plans but we can\u2019t legislate for them.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000355\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002203fd985b-4fb8-4111-ba38-5033a254d962\u0022\u003EIn the absence of being able to put that very good plan into action today, we would instead say that these measures are important but they are just a part of it. There is no bill on the Order Paper that seeks to do anything like what the Leader of the Opposition proposed today. There is this, these measures around the safe harbour and the debt hibernation, but there is no other side of the equation which is putting cash flow into businesses, money into businesses, in the immediate sense. So it\u2019s about a half of the puzzle in that respect.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000356\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002203fd985b-4fb8-4111-ba38-5033a254d962\u0022\u003EBut further to that\u2014and we are absolutely going to support this through to select committee\u2014I note with some trepidation, as I went through the provisions related to these measures, yet again\u2014and I have at least been consistent in my criticism of Government bills which have large, broad, powerful regulation-making powers riddled throughout. I\u2019ve done so on the Arms Legislation Bill, on the Fair Trading Amendment Bill, and the conduct of financial institutions, and these measures are, again, measures that have enormous scope of regulatory amendment to them once this bill, should it be enacted, is enacted.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000357\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002203fd985b-4fb8-4111-ba38-5033a254d962\u0022\u003EThe worry I have with that\u2014it\u2019s two: one is, really, that, as I\u2019ve said previously in other bills, it\u2019s a bit of a sign that the Government hasn\u2019t actually got its policy sorted out. Now, the circumstances we\u2019re in sort of justify that to some extent: there simply isn\u2019t the same time that there would normally be in the formulation of policy and the translation of that into a bill. But none the less, it\u2019s indicative of the fact that the policy is not concrete in its detail yet, so that is an issue. But the worry I have about it is: what will it mean for directors of companies who may be relying on these\u2014the safe harbour and this debt hibernation and the certainty that it\u2019s supposed to help to bring\u2014if the regime is one which can be changed readily without recourse to Parliament?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000358\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002203fd985b-4fb8-4111-ba38-5033a254d962\u0022\u003EAlmost any manner of the provisions of these items can be changed. For instance, in the debt hibernation, there are certain excluded debts through regulation. Excluded debts can be changed at any time over the period that these protections would otherwise apply. So what a director signs up for today may change before the term of the crisis and the term of the provisions of the bill apply or expire. So my question to that is: how are directors going to respond to that? Are they going to say it introduces uncertainty which might limit their ability to actually sign up and take advantage of the debt hibernation and safe harbour provisions? Or will they say, \u201CNo, we\u2019re comfortable.\u201D and that the intent of Parliament is clear, and \u201CAlthough the power is with Government to change things almost at a whim, we won\u2019t hold that that introduces so much uncertainty as to prevent us from using the provisions.\u201D, that they might think differently?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000359\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002203fd985b-4fb8-4111-ba38-5033a254d962\u0022\u003ESo my point is: to raise this is not to say it\u2019s a reason to not support the bill but to emphasise with the Government that it is important that they listen to the submissions that are made in the very short select committee process this bill will receive. We know that the Epidemic Response Committee will give it very good attention, but it is important that the Government is prepared to listen to what submitters say and the implications of the bill as written, what it will mean for them perhaps being able to take up the intentions which rest behind it. Because if they say, \u201CIt\u2019s fine, no problem.\u201D, well, that\u2019s all well and good. But if we have submitters that come and say, \u201CWell, actually, the way you\u2019ve written it is good from a legislator\u2019s point of view but from a director\u2019s point of view, actually, you\u2019ve not given us the certainty around the regime that we need in order to be able to sign up to it.\u201D, then I would implore the Government to heed that, if those are the messages that come through, and make changes.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000360\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002203fd985b-4fb8-4111-ba38-5033a254d962\u0022\u003EIt may actually be better to have the regime very clearly articulated in the primary legislation and accept that if during the course of events it is determined that something was not quite right, well, that\u2019s what an amendment bill is there for, rather than have a very broad and almost unrestricted regulation-making power, if it is the case that submitters tell us that having that would create an uncertainty which might make it difficult for them to use the safe harbour or the debt hibernation provisions that are being put there to protect\u2014or the idea to protect and sustain businesses.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000361\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002203fd985b-4fb8-4111-ba38-5033a254d962\u0022\u003ESo we support the bill. I note comments made from the ACT member a few moments ago. We will support the bill. It\u2019s not enough on its own; it is a piece of the puzzle. Really, the Government should be looking at how they can get cash into the hands of businesses now so that they can sustain themselves alongside these sorts of measures which do help, to a degree, deal with the fact that there are so many uncertainties into the future yet. But we will support the bill to the select committee.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022490ccdbf-7c22-4e12-98f2-f3aa08f8e676\u0022 data-id=\u002260c92dcec7204141b363ea186f2586d0\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000362\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022490ccdbf-7c22-4e12-98f2-f3aa08f8e676\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002260c92dcec7204141b363ea186f2586d0\u0022\u003EHon IAIN LEES-GALLOWAY (Minister for Workplace Relations and Safety):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Madam Speaker. I wish to speak very briefly on behalf of the Government in support of the COVID-19 Response (Further Management Measures) Legislation Bill. This is an omnibus bill which contains provisions that have been worked on by Ministers across the Government who have, alongside their officials, been working day and night to identify the practical and pragmatic ways in which the Government can support the response and the recovery to and from the COVID-19 epidemic. I look forward to its consideration by the COVID Epidemic Response Committee. I look forward to their feedback from it, and I commend this bill to the House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca id=\u0022af1de11eb30243aeae14d979380a42a9\u0022 name=\u0022division\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EA party vote was called for on the question, That the COVID-19 Response (Further Management Measures) Legislation Bill be now read a first time.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EAyes 119\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand National 55; New Zealand Labour 46; New Zealand First 9; Green Party of Aotearoa New Zealand 8; Ross.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENoes 1\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EACT New Zealand 1.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EBill read a first time.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000363\u0022\u003EBill referred to the Epidemic Response Committee.\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022490ccdbf-7c22-4e12-98f2-f3aa08f8e676\u0022 data-id=\u0022aa9b716712224c3fb2faa820d72f489b\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000364\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022490ccdbf-7c22-4e12-98f2-f3aa08f8e676\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022aa9b716712224c3fb2faa820d72f489b\u0022\u003EHon IAIN LEES-GALLOWAY (Deputy Leader of the House) \u003C/span\u003Eon behalf of the Leader of the House: I move, That the COVID-19 Response (Further Management Measures) Legislation Bill be reported to the House by 12 May 2020.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000365\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022490ccdbf-7c22-4e12-98f2-f3aa08f8e676\u0022\u003EMotion agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n    \u003C/div\u003E\n    \u003Cdiv class=\u0022HpsHansard\u0022\u003E\n      \u003Cp\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsProceedingHeading\u0022\u003EBills\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000366\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u00220b79d07b66ec49c1b6ca00d14547c4a2\u0022\u003EImmigration (COVID-19 Response) Amendment Bill\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000367\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u002239337831143d45bcb52ec8c1258ecb7f\u0022\u003EFirst Reading\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022490ccdbf-7c22-4e12-98f2-f3aa08f8e676\u0022 data-id=\u0022a1abe1d061ae4564b0eed8ac73b9c16d\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000368\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022490ccdbf-7c22-4e12-98f2-f3aa08f8e676\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022a1abe1d061ae4564b0eed8ac73b9c16d\u0022\u003EHon IAIN LEES-GALLOWAY (Minister of Immigration):\u003C/span\u003E In accordance with a determination of the Business Committee, I move, That the Immigration (COVID-19 Response) Amendment Bill be now read a first time. I nominate the Epidemic Response Committee to consider the bill. At the appropriate time I intend to move that the bill be reported to the House by 12 May 2020.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000369\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022490ccdbf-7c22-4e12-98f2-f3aa08f8e676\u0022\u003EThe coronavirus pandemic has had, and will continue to have, an extraordinary impact on the global economy and, of course, on our local economy here in New Zealand. The scale and speed of the epidemic has meant that we have had to work quickly and nimbly to respond and ensure that New Zealand is able to manage its consequences\u2014the immigration system is a good example of this. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000370\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022490ccdbf-7c22-4e12-98f2-f3aa08f8e676\u0022\u003EThe underlying principle of the Immigration Act 2009 is that, except in limited circumstances, individual applications are processed by an individual immigration officer who carefully considers all of the circumstances of the applicant before deciding whether to grant a visa. This one-on-one consideration enables Immigration New Zealand to manage risk and make decisions tailored to each applicant\u2019s circumstances. However, the scale of the epidemic means that we need to be more nimble. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000371\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022490ccdbf-7c22-4e12-98f2-f3aa08f8e676\u0022\u003ESince the start of the epidemic, New Zealand has closed the borders to all but a few visa holders. Other countries\u2019 travel restrictions and the consequential decline in flights from 700 per week a year ago to 25 per week now have meant that it is also difficult for travellers to leave New Zealand. Visa holders in badly affected sectors may lose employment and, as a result, no longer meet the conditions of their visas; others may be trapped outside of New Zealand and unable to meet visa time frames for travel to New Zealand through no fault of their own. Immigration New Zealand has had to suspend most of its offshore processing activities and has limited onshore capacity while the level 3 restrictions remain in place. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000372\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022490ccdbf-7c22-4e12-98f2-f3aa08f8e676\u0022\u003EPrevious Governments foresaw the possibility of an impact on the immigration system from an epidemic. The Act has a small number of emergency provisions that were triggered when the Prime Minister issued an epidemic management notice under the Epidemic Preparedness Act. Valid visas held by people in New Zealand, which would otherwise be due to expire, are automatically extended, so they will expire three months after the day on which the epidemic management notice expires, and adjustments can be made to detention on immigration grounds. Those settings have the effect of buying us time to address some of the practical challenges by giving onshore visa holders certainty about their visa status at a time of significant disruption. Around 80,000 temporary visas, which have been automatically extended under the epidemic legislation, will now expire on 26 September.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000373\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022490ccdbf-7c22-4e12-98f2-f3aa08f8e676\u0022\u003EThis certainty has been useful but more is needed to ensure that the immigration system can react in a timely and nimble fashion. It is the Government\u2019s view that new powers are needed for a time-limited period. Under existing settings, temporary migrants who wish to remain in New Zealand must submit individual applications for a new visa or to vary their existing visa\u2019s conditions when the migrant\u2019s circumstances change. This can be where they need to be redeployed by their employer into a different role or to a different region, or to look for another job after being made redundant. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000374\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022490ccdbf-7c22-4e12-98f2-f3aa08f8e676\u0022\u003EApplications are also required by regulation to include fees, passport photos, and travel documents. Receiving and processing such applications is not practical when Immigration New Zealand staff are working from their homes. In particular, they cannot meet banking requirements for handling payments. Waiving requirements on an individual basis is not practical, while individually processing thousands of applications at once is time-consuming and expensive and provides little certainty for affected applicants at a time where we need Government services to be able to be flexible and efficient. This bill therefore amends the Immigration Act 2009 to provide powers to enable the Government to respond appropriately and efficiently to the COVID-19 epidemic by providing additional flexibility in the immigration system. These powers will expire 12 months after enactment. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000375\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022490ccdbf-7c22-4e12-98f2-f3aa08f8e676\u0022\u003EIt is important that this bill is passed without undue delay, to enable immigration responses to the COVID-19 epidemic to be a flexible and efficient as possible at this time. The timetable I\u2019m asking the House to agree to will enable these powers to be brought into effect this month.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000376\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022490ccdbf-7c22-4e12-98f2-f3aa08f8e676\u0022\u003EThis bill aims to ensure that the Government can respond appropriately and efficiently to the immediate immigration issues arising from the COVID-19 outbreak by providing additional flexibility in the immigration system where, for example, large numbers of visas need to be changed or extended at once. It does so by introducing eight time-limited powers. In order, through the bill, they are: (1) the power to extend, vary, or cancel conditions for classes of resident class visa holders; (2) the power to impose, vary, or cancel conditions for classes of temporary entry class visa holders; (3) the power to waive any prescribed regulatory requirements for applying for a visa with respect to classes of people; (4) the power to grant visas to individuals and classes of people in the absence of an application; (5) the power to extend the expiry dates of temporary class visas for classes of people; (6) the power to waive in any individual case the requirement to obtain a transit visa; (7) the power to revoke the entry permission of a person who has been deemed by regulations to have been granted entry permission; and (8) the power to suspend the ability for any class of persons to make applications for visas or submit expressions of interest in applying for visas.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000377\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022490ccdbf-7c22-4e12-98f2-f3aa08f8e676\u0022\u003EExamples of how these powers could be used include making changes to visa conditions; allowing workers to be redeployed to a different employer or location; allowing visa holders currently offshore more time to travel to New Zealand within the validity of their visa; and suspending new applications for particular visa categories until global border restrictions are loosened and visa holders are able to travel to New Zealand. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000378\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022490ccdbf-7c22-4e12-98f2-f3aa08f8e676\u0022\u003EOne power, the power to grant visas without an application, is likely to be used only in limited circumstances\u2014such as where individuals are too unwell to be able to make an application. I\u2019m hoping that this will not need to be exercised, but there is a precedent. This power would have been useful to support people severely injured in the Whakaari / White Island eruption. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000379\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022490ccdbf-7c22-4e12-98f2-f3aa08f8e676\u0022\u003EThe powers in this bill are subject to a range of safeguards. The majority need to be exercised by special direction, and one, the ability to suspend the making of applications, requires an Order in Council. Some can be only exercised by myself as Minister of Immigration.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000380\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022490ccdbf-7c22-4e12-98f2-f3aa08f8e676\u0022\u003EWhen it comes to special class directions, these directions must be published on the internet and tabled in this House. All the powers are also time-limited and subject to a 1-year sunset clause. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000381\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022490ccdbf-7c22-4e12-98f2-f3aa08f8e676\u0022\u003EThis bill will provide important powers to enable the Government to respond to the COVID-19 epidemic through providing additional flexibility in the immigration system. This will enable Immigration New Zealand to work appropriately and efficiently to support the welfare of some temporary migrants and situate us well for our economic rebuilding. I commend this bill to the House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022094b0ff4-e404-451b-b4a9-ad12bd4dee56\u0022 data-id=\u0022fc6ed3db22a941289e9169feae88e9d1\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000382\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022094b0ff4-e404-451b-b4a9-ad12bd4dee56\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022fc6ed3db22a941289e9169feae88e9d1\u0022\u003ESTUART SMITH (National\u2014Kaik\u014Dura):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Mr Speaker. I would like to begin by thanking the Minister for his briefing last night on this bill. It is helpful to have a heads-up on the bill, and it is important that we get these things right. The Immigration (COVID-19 Response) Amendment Bill is one of those bills that is being rushed through. Of course, there are good reasons for that, but we can\u2019t lose sight of the fact that last week a bill went through the House and passed something that the people that debated it didn\u2019t know was in the bill. Even the Minister responsible didn\u2019t know it was in the bill. We don\u2019t know if there\u2019s anything like that in this bill\u2014I don\u2019t see anything like that, but that\u2019s possible. So it is important that these bills get good scrutiny.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000383\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022094b0ff4-e404-451b-b4a9-ad12bd4dee56\u0022\u003EI think that this is hugely important, this bill, in that we had arrived at the situation prior to the COVID outbreak, Immigration New Zealand (INZ) were well behind with 11,500 residency applications waiting to be processed. So they were already under extreme pressure and were in trouble, really, trying to deal with what was ahead of them. Now, this has been exacerbated, of course, by the current situation where we had a thousand people working for INZ that weren\u2019t at work. Under level 3, 20 percent of those people are back at work, and when it goes to level 2, there will only be 50 percent of those people back at work. So we don\u2019t have the resource on the ground to deal with these issues that are in front of us. Yes, I think we need to deal with these variations of conditions quite quickly and deal with them appropriately. I know there are people in Queenstown\u2014it is a really good example of a lot of people that will be out of work in the hospitality sector and the tourism sector in general. That will be the same in other places like Rotorua and my own electorate in Hanmer Springs, with the announcement of the closure of the Heritage Hotel. Those things are going to be happening all over the country. At some point we will need to have a debate about what the future looks like for immigration in New Zealand, because it\u2019s unlikely that we\u2019ll need a lot of people to come into the hospitality sector to work where a lot of immigrants have come in, but that\u2019s a debate for another day. We need to deal with this issue here and now.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000384\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022094b0ff4-e404-451b-b4a9-ad12bd4dee56\u0022\u003EThat issue is often that people are stuck here through no choice of their own, and they are unable to work. In my own electorate\u2019s case\u2014and particularly where I live in Marlborough\u2014people came into New Zealand to work in the wine industry as winemakers or cellar hands, skilled migrants on temporary work visas came in. Now their job is finished, they\u2019re in Marlborough, they are actually willing to work, and they want to go out and prune grapes. Unfortunately, the way the system works at the moment, if the winery employs them as a grape pruner, that\u2019s fine, or they can go and get another winemaking job with another employer. But they can\u2019t do both. Unfortunately, a lot of the winemakers don\u2019t prune grapes, but vineyards do. And, as we don\u2019t have the people to do the job, we have these people in Marlborough and in other places sitting there and, in some cases, being supported by civil defence because they can\u2019t go home; they don\u2019t have the economic capability to look after themselves now. So we have a mess, and it\u2019s caused partly because of the way this has played out. It\u2019s not anyone\u2019s fault; it\u2019s just the way it is. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000385\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022094b0ff4-e404-451b-b4a9-ad12bd4dee56\u0022\u003EThe thing is: how do we fix it? Yes, this bill\u2014I hope that the Minister will be prepared, and his officials, to address that very issue. Hopefully this bill will allow that issue to be dealt with quickly and efficiently so that those people can go back to work in a different role. Yes, it\u2019s Kiwis first and always will be and should be, but we don\u2019t have the Kiwis for some of those jobs, and we\u2019re supporting those people anyway.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000386\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022094b0ff4-e404-451b-b4a9-ad12bd4dee56\u0022\u003EI think that there has been some criticism of this bill, and particularly from Lane Neave, a law firm in Canterbury, who put an article out that was quite critical of the bill. As one immigration adviser described it to me, this is a leap of faith, this legislation; we don\u2019t have time to consider it. Yes, I think that\u2019s a fair criticism, and it\u2019s something that this House does reluctantly, but it has to. But it is incumbent upon the Epidemic Response Committee and the Minister\u2019s officials to ensure that all of the questions are addressed, that the questions are not only just addressed, they are addressed in detail so that we ensure all the fish-hooks that will be in there are dealt with.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000387\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022094b0ff4-e404-451b-b4a9-ad12bd4dee56\u0022\u003EI think one of the other key things with this bill is that there is little to prevent the Minister from using his powers outside of the direct health response. I\u2019ll give you an example: an international student visa holder, the Minister could, overnight, strike out their right to work while they\u2019re here. Now, how would they support themselves? There are some international students here in New Zealand, and there\u2019s already talk from the universities that they want to restart that. Now, the Minister may give assurances that that\u2019s not going to happen, but, nevertheless, under the bill, that could be possible. We know the kind of pressures that will come on when the vast numbers that will lose their jobs materialises. There will be real political pressure on us all to try and soothe those issues and deal with them. That might be one thing that comes out of that, and I think that would be really a very bad move because this bill\u2019s premise is to actually look after the migrants that are in here. So that has to be the underlying response to this issue, remembering also that there is an absence of appeal rights for the exercise of these powers.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000388\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022094b0ff4-e404-451b-b4a9-ad12bd4dee56\u0022\u003EThis is perhaps the one Government department where a Minister has the most controversial power: to have power over individual people\u2019s lives. When people appeal for a visa or their right to stay or whatever it happens to be, and the Minister, if they do exercise that right, there is no appeal to that. So we have to be very careful that those legislative powers are tightly defined. That is something I\u2019ll be looking forward to exploring further in the select committee. So it\u2019s with that qualified support that I commend the bill to the House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002290ea1538-43e8-4257-bd80-df3ccd1e5f27\u0022 data-id=\u002227e6c4786ac243c8a0627d10b1020b74\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000389\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002290ea1538-43e8-4257-bd80-df3ccd1e5f27\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002227e6c4786ac243c8a0627d10b1020b74\u0022\u003EHon KRIS FAAFOI (Minister of Broadcasting, Communications and Digital Media):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Mr Speaker. Just a quick contribution to reinforce some of the contributions that were made by the Minister of Immigration. To reflect on the two speeches that have already been made: these are not normal times, so in order to manage a process which is, obviously, not running at full steam, the Minister and the Government has seen fit to pass this legislation. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000390\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002290ea1538-43e8-4257-bd80-df3ccd1e5f27\u0022\u003ETo give us a scale of what the issue is here: as of the end of April this year, there were approximately 350,000 temporary visa holders here in New Zealand; just a little over 200,000 have work visas whose visa employment conditions may need to be varied as we respond to the COVID crisis; nearly 75,000 student visa holders, whose conditions may need to be amended in able to change their course of work or extra hours until the education providers are reopened; and a little under 57,000 on visitor visas whose expiry dates may need to be extended. So there is a scale that we have to deal with, and also a need to do that at speed and to also be nimble. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000391\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002290ea1538-43e8-4257-bd80-df3ccd1e5f27\u0022\u003EPointing to the comments of the earlier member, there are safeguards within this piece of legislation for the measures that have been put in place, most notably the 12-month sunset clause within it, and the necessary steps taken in some instances to get an Order in Council to use some of the powers that are made in, obviously, not a normal way. So it is needed because of scale and the need to be nimble. But to address the point that the member Stuart Smith made, who was just previously on his feet: there are safeguards built into this to make sure that we are doing the right thing as well as being pragmatic in dealing with the response and recovery to COVID. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022c83012b4-3939-4753-80fc-1956a3e2bd1e\u0022 data-id=\u0022e4febe50bab3482d98b1e4d7137ae870\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000392\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c83012b4-3939-4753-80fc-1956a3e2bd1e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022e4febe50bab3482d98b1e4d7137ae870\u0022\u003EHon MICHAEL WOODHOUSE (National):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Mr Speaker. I have a pretty strict rule of not speaking on matters related to immigration. I get the sense that I would sound like the drunk at the end of the bar talking about the good old days. But I\u2019ve broken that rule twice in a week, which is another measure of the extraordinary times we are in, basically because members of the select committee that would normally talk about immigration issues aren\u2019t here, and, indeed, this bill, the Immigration (COVID-19 Response) Amendment Bill, is going to the epidemic response subcommittee, of which I will be the chair for the next few days. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000393\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c83012b4-3939-4753-80fc-1956a3e2bd1e\u0022\u003EThat subcommittee is going to have the Herculean task of getting advice, calling for, and hearing submissions on this bill and the bill that has previously been debated, the COVID-19 Response (Further Management Measures) Legislation Bill\u2014considering it, suggesting amendments, and reporting back to the House by this time next week. That is no mean feat, but I\u2019m confident that we will be able to do that, and I\u2019m really pleased that we are doing that. I\u2019m not going to relitigate previous comments about the risks of hastening a legislation. As my colleague Stuart Smith said, we will support it, but we do have some concerns, and I want to just articulate some of them. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000394\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c83012b4-3939-4753-80fc-1956a3e2bd1e\u0022\u003EThe explanatory note is very interesting. It, basically, talks about wanting to assist the visa holders, but, actually, the principal goal of this, it seems to me, is to assist Immigration New Zealand with the potentially overwhelming amount of work that it would be required to do to issue visas past the three-month deadline, or at least it\u2019s the later of the three months after the epidemic notice is issued, or the expiry of the visa. So while Minister Faafoi did talk about the 350,000 visa holders that could be in New Zealand right now, it\u2019s by no means the total population of what would be required to be done. That would be a much, much smaller number. I was surprised at those numbers, frankly. That seems to be nearly 100,000 more than the number of temporary visa holders in New Zealand a couple of years ago.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000395\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c83012b4-3939-4753-80fc-1956a3e2bd1e\u0022\u003EI have a tremendous amount of sympathy and compassion for them right now. I cannot imagine what it must be like to be in a foreign country\u2014even one that you\u2019ve chosen to go to as a working holidaymaker or an international student or an essential skills worker\u2014and to find oneself in the middle of a global pandemic where everything shuts down and the income supply is in the short run immediately curtailed. I commend the Government for including overseas workers in the wage subsidy\u2014I think that was a sensible thing to do\u2014but that\u2019s going to end. There is fear\u2014I know there is fear. My colleagues Mses Walker, Dowie, Dean, and I were on a Zoom call with southern mayors a couple of weeks ago, where Mayor Boult from Queenstown Lakes District articulated what was going on there. It is a tremendous potentially humanitarian problem. I don\u2019t think that is overstating the issue. I think it is going to be very difficult but very important for the Government to decide what is to be done about that. I see this as very much a temporary measure. I am open to the view that it\u2019s not necessary for 12 months, and I trust the Minister of Immigration will be discerning in the application of the powers that we are granting him. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000396\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c83012b4-3939-4753-80fc-1956a3e2bd1e\u0022\u003ESomewhat of a gentle rebuke, I think, knowing those terrific staff at Immigration New Zealand, but, nevertheless, we don\u2019t have the same problem with the Ministry of Social Development. We don\u2019t have the Minister for Social Development issuing a blanket order to give jobseeker support to a population. It still needs to be considered on its merits on application, and while the Ministry of Social Development is under tremendous strain at the moment, it will resource up, it will find ways, to get through that problem. I think this is kind of kicking the can down the road a bit, in a couple of ways, because eventually Immigration New Zealand is going to be hit with a bow wave of applications from people who want to stay but for whom that will not be possible.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000397\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c83012b4-3939-4753-80fc-1956a3e2bd1e\u0022\u003EWhile we talk about the humanitarian challenge and potential there\u2014crisis in the minds at least of those people affected by it\u2014one needs to be very clear that, as my colleague Stuart Smith said, Governments of both colours share the view of a Kiwis-first approach to immigration policy. Therein lies the conundrum, because I understand why the Minister would want to do things like a blanket variation of conditions. Indeed, when I was Minister I found that the variation of conditions process was probably on occasion a little too strictly monitored by immigration officials. But now we\u2019re going the other way, and what we\u2019re saying is Kiwis are going to be losing their jobs in their tens, if not hundreds or thousands, and they are in a contest for what work is available when the hospitality, tourism, adventure-tourism, construction, and education sectors all come back online\u2014how do we apply that Kiwis-first approach? \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000398\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c83012b4-3939-4753-80fc-1956a3e2bd1e\u0022\u003EIt worries me. It worries me because overseas workers right now are not eligible for income supports other than the wage subsidy\u2014and I don\u2019t know what thinking the Government\u2019s doing there. It\u2019s a difficult one because the taxpayer has been very clear in its support for the generosity that needs to be shown to those people and small businesses that are at risk right now. But we\u2019re about to go off a cliff and the jobseeker numbers are going to rise dramatically, and it worries me that we are going to pit overseas workers and New Zealanders in a contest for the same roles. The Minister shakes his head, and I\u2019m not sure whether that\u2019s more in hope than confidence, because the powers that he has here will enable potentially international students to work more than 20 hours a week. It will enable essential skills workers who have lost their jobs to go into other industries, to go into other parts of the country. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000399\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c83012b4-3939-4753-80fc-1956a3e2bd1e\u0022\u003ENow, that in some industries may well be the right thing to do, because, as Mr Smith said, we have a bit of a challenge getting people to work in certain industries. Now, it\u2019s not impossible. I was the Minister after the Psa outbreak, where a number of workers were lining up at Work and Income after jobs were lost, but with employers and contractors still wanting to bring people in from overseas to do that work. It does take a firm hand to say, actually, that\u2019s not appropriate. So there are challenges. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000400\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c83012b4-3939-4753-80fc-1956a3e2bd1e\u0022\u003EHowever, that said, I also support strongly things like the Recognised Seasonal Employer (RSE) scheme , and I think there is an opportunity here to be more finessed than this gives the Minister the power to do. That is to say, where there remain genuine labour shortages\u2014and I think the industries that benefit from the RSE scheme could well be amongst them\u2014then that\u2019s fine. Let\u2019s see if we can get those workers in, and, indeed, most of them come from the Pacific. I\u2019m sure there is thinking going on about what to do about that. But the reality is that most of them aren\u2019t; most of them are actually in the very industries that have been decimated by COVID\u2014hospitality and tourism. Why would we be giving extensions to, I don\u2019t know, a Chinese tour interpreter, a visa, and then allowing them to go and work in any other part of the industry when we don\u2019t have Chinese tourists? So we really do have a problem. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000401\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c83012b4-3939-4753-80fc-1956a3e2bd1e\u0022\u003EThe biggest problem I think that is going to come before the Government in the not too distant future is the question of the expectations from those people that won\u2019t be met. We\u2019ve got a residency programme that\u2019s been slashed by a third, under this Government, nearly, and, yet, a great number of the people who are here on essential skills and temporary visas want to stay permanently, and they\u2019re not going to be able to, and they weren\u2019t before COVID, and it\u2019s going to get much harder after COVID. We need to start that conversation as a country. We\u2019ll hear a little bit of it, I think, over the next few days in the consideration of this bill when we hear from the Migrant Workers Association and the Association for Migration and Investment. But it is absolutely crucial that in our efforts to make things better in the short term that we don\u2019t make them worse in the long term, either for the overseas people who are here and potentially stuck or for those New Zealanders who have lost their jobs and are desperate to find new work, to provide for their families, in industries that they might not be used to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000402\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c83012b4-3939-4753-80fc-1956a3e2bd1e\u0022\u003ESo I look forward to that conversation. It\u2019s going to be a speedy one. We\u2019re going to be back here next Tuesday. But in the meantime, I support the Minister and I commend the bill.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022f44431ef-b505-4e94-9f57-a60b0a569bf7\u0022 data-id=\u0022e3f65df9eed647fe9af43177e38baa1f\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000403\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f44431ef-b505-4e94-9f57-a60b0a569bf7\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022e3f65df9eed647fe9af43177e38baa1f\u0022\u003EHon SHANE JONES (Minister of Forestry):\u003C/span\u003E I rise to take a call on the Immigration (COVID-19 Response) Amendment Bill. I rise to support the sentiments expressed by the Minister of Immigration along with the former Associate Minister of Immigration the Hon Kris Faafoi. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000404\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f44431ef-b505-4e94-9f57-a60b0a569bf7\u0022\u003EThe issue at stake here is a change to our immigration settings that enables the Minister to exercise extraordinary power. That power, obviously, will be exercised within a policy envelope, and, given the tremendous level of interest that our party has in the role immigration policy will play going forward in the COVID recovery, there will be lots of discussions as to what is an acceptable envelope. But the Minister has made quite a compelling case, and I don\u2019t think all of our MPs realised how many global citizens were actually caught up by this COVID lockdown\u2014into the hundreds of thousands\u2014and we do need to reflect a level of humanity in dealing with their awful situation. They are not able to pack up and go home. They do want, in many cases, to remain in the country, and I look forward to the submissions that will inevitably flow.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000405\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f44431ef-b505-4e94-9f57-a60b0a569bf7\u0022\u003EIn the general policy statement, the bill outlines\u2014and, actually, the departmental disclosure statement is very helpful as well\u2014the specific time-limited categories of power; eight of them. This enables the cancellation and variation of conditions. Whilst the borders aren\u2019t going to be open in any comprehensive sense any time soon, this does raise some deep questions as to how we reorientate and retrain our own young people, rural and urban, whilst at the same time maintaining a flow of international migration that adds to the knowledge base of New Zealand. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000406\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f44431ef-b505-4e94-9f57-a60b0a569bf7\u0022\u003EPrior to coming to Parliament today, I took the opportunity to speak to the Auckland University of Technology vice-chancellor, Mr Derek McCormack, who pestered the Helen Clark Government\u2014very successfully, if I recall\u2014to gain the status of a university.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000407\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022cf6b736a1c0146dda19149373d81cb7c\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: No. It was his predecessor.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000408\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f44431ef-b505-4e94-9f57-a60b0a569bf7\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a64214f1970b414997f4715a18f4773b\u0022\u003EHon SHANE JONES\u003C/span\u003E: Oh\u2014OK. So I thought I\u2019d pick the brains of Mr Derek McCormack. He outlined to me that a university such as his has about 20,000 students, 17 percent of international character. Those are students that do contribute financially, and those are students who are entitled to work for a period of time. But the challenge now lies with the tertiary sector, ensuring, as they go forward, how they can compete in the absence of a comprehensive opening of the border. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000409\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f44431ef-b505-4e94-9f57-a60b0a569bf7\u0022\u003EI was left with quite a healthy respect for the level of thinking that is taking place in our tertiary institutions, because I draw a distinction between those legacy anchor institutions and the proliferation of other private training establishments, which I will not taint this speech by talking about, or problems associated with that sector. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000410\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f44431ef-b505-4e94-9f57-a60b0a569bf7\u0022\u003ESo other than to say that we support the sentiments reflected by the Minister of Immigration, this is a tricky area. This does give considerable authority to the Minister; however, it enables him to deal efficiently with the variation of conditions pertaining to thousands\u2014hundreds of thousands\u2014of men and women from overseas who are here. I do say, however, that those decisions will be exercised within a policy envelope, and that policy over time will be developed by the coalition Government. Thank you very much.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022a68928ea-9dd8-4a30-8e2c-a0f49dfc8bea\u0022 data-id=\u002215f62145c53743e1a26d6d503d235d7a\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000411\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a68928ea-9dd8-4a30-8e2c-a0f49dfc8bea\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002215f62145c53743e1a26d6d503d235d7a\u0022\u003EHon LOUISE UPSTON (National\u2014Taup\u014D):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Mr Speaker. I\u2019m pleased to take a brief call in this Immigration (COVID-19 Response) Amendment Bill. This is, of course, the introduction, and as my colleague Stuart Smith has indicated, National will support it in the first reading. It is really important\u2014this is being considered by the Epidemic Response Committee, and my colleague the Hon Michael Woodhouse referred to a couple of the larger organisations that represent migrants and migrant workers, but I would encourage others to participate in the process. Sometimes the most effective submissions are those of very personal stories and examples of when things don\u2019t work.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000412\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a68928ea-9dd8-4a30-8e2c-a0f49dfc8bea\u0022\u003EObviously, for most New Zealanders at the moment, COVID-19 doesn\u2019t work, but for the 350,000 temporary visa holders that are in New Zealand, they\u2019re kind of stuck in a bit of limbo. When, traditionally, as the Minister pointed out, an individual applicant would have their application considered by an individual immigration officer, that\u2019s clearly not feasible at the moment. If you look at the different categories of visa holders, because I think sometimes there\u2019s far too many generalisations around those who are on work visas\u2014if I reflect on my own electorate, if I reflect on essential workers and those courageous men and woman who got us through the five weeks of level 4 lockdown, many of them were here on essential skilled visas, particularly in our healthcare area and also our aged-care sectors.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000413\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a68928ea-9dd8-4a30-8e2c-a0f49dfc8bea\u0022\u003ESo, yes, there is this priority for Kiwis first, but there is a complete and utter naivety if there\u2019s an expectation that someone who\u2019s working in a hospitality job, or was six weeks ago, next week could turn up and work in an aged-care facility. We are very fortunate in this country to have incredibly skilled workers in a whole range of different sectors, many of those heavily occupied by those on work visas, and the suggestion that they could be replaced any time soon is a bit naive. That\u2019s not to say that that work doesn\u2019t need to begin, and I think one of the things that I think is really important in this process, and that I hope will come through in the submissions to the Epidemic Response Committee, is managing expectations.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000414\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a68928ea-9dd8-4a30-8e2c-a0f49dfc8bea\u0022\u003ESo there\u2019ll be a lot of people here on visas, whether they\u2019re student visas, whether they\u2019re visitor\u2019s visas, whether they are essential skilled visas, and, actually, as a country, we need to be clear with them about their expectation of a future here in New Zealand. The future after COVID-19 looks very different than it was six months ago, and, you know, there are many people in very challenging circumstances at the moment. I\u2019ve heard, unfortunately, from far too many of them who six weeks ago were working and now they\u2019re ringing the welfare civil defence line asking for housing and food support. That is never a situation those people envisaged they would ever be in in a country they have chosen to come to because of opportunities. So we do need to do right by them, and I\u2019m hoping that the Government is doing some work on that at the moment.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000415\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a68928ea-9dd8-4a30-8e2c-a0f49dfc8bea\u0022\u003EIt\u2019s not just about allowing their visa conditions to change and the time frames to change; actually, there\u2019s a much broader issue of support for those who are in New Zealand at the moment, in a way that they\u2019re not getting supported at the moment. I do hope that people do take the time\u2014although it\u2019s a short report back, it will be considered by a select committee. I think the lesson came last week when the wrong bill was passed. That cannot happen again. Even though there\u2019s an urgency in terms of delivering a solution, both to those who are here as migrants and also to Immigration New Zealand, who needs to solve this issue, it still needs fair scrutiny.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000416\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a68928ea-9dd8-4a30-8e2c-a0f49dfc8bea\u0022\u003ESo, as I said, National will be supporting this in the first reading. We want to make sure the issues are explored fully. There are extraordinary powers that are provided in here and a lot less scrutiny that\u2019s going to occur, so any time that happens the unintended consequences do need to be considered carefully.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000417\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a68928ea-9dd8-4a30-8e2c-a0f49dfc8bea\u0022\u003EThe other point that I want to just add is whether or not the Associate Minister, who has responsibilities for considering exemptions to policy, is also going to take a \u201Cnew environment, new rules\u201D approach, because many electorate MPs will have faced some absolutely heart-wrenching immigration cases at the moment, and it is absolutely critical that when there are ministerial decisions to be made, they are also considering those based on the circumstances we face as a country, whether it\u2019s a situation I\u2019m dealing with where half the family is overseas trying to get back to continue their work in New Zealand\u2014we\u2019ve got to be far more compassionate and practical and pragmatic about how we reunite those families and how we ensure that those critical essential workers are able to continue their work in New Zealand. Thanks, Mr Speaker.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022 data-id=\u002249fedc820f9247728c5afbb425b6c0e9\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000418\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002249fedc820f9247728c5afbb425b6c0e9\u0022\u003EDAVID SEYMOUR (Leader\u2014ACT):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Mr Speaker. I rise on behalf of ACT in support of the Immigration (COVID-19 Response) Amendment Bill. I\u2019ll just make a couple of comments about the process there. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000419\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003EI spoke earlier in the afternoon in opposition to the COVID-19 Response (Further Management Measures) Legislation Bill. I think this one has a few aspects that make it worth our support, even in these rushed circumstances. One is that unlike the 133 pages that we had dumped on us, with less than 24 hours to compute what that legislation would mean in the context of the other laws it was changing, what we have here is a 16-page bill that, largely, changes the Immigration Act. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000420\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003ESecondly, not only is it much shorter, but it is also a piece of legislation that, as Michael Woodhouse noted\u2014although he said this with a certain amount of cynicism\u2014is, by and large, about the administration of the immigration department, and I\u2019ll get to why I think that\u2019s actually very needed. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000421\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003EThe other thing I think that the Minister\u2019s done that is very responsible is that all of this has a sunset clause, and if the principle is we need to rush legislation to deal with the COVID-19 crisis, then it\u2019s perfectly fitting that we don\u2019t make permanent changes and long-term decisions in the context of a crisis. So I think the Minister\u2019s actually made some really good decisions about how this legislation works.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000422\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003EIt is absolutely necessary. If you\u2019d asked me a couple of years ago could any Government department drive more people, more constituents, to the door of my electorate office than Auckland Transport (AT), I would have said, \u201CNo way. It\u2019s impossible.\u201D Well, I have to say, over the last couple of years AT\u2019s actually improved a little bit, but immigration has become the leading reason that people come to see me in my electorate office, and, I dare say, MPs\u2019 electorate offices up and down the country, because I get a lot of similar feedback and chatter from other MPs. That problem is not a subject for today\u2014but it does need to be resolved\u2014but it has been badly exacerbated by the COVID-19 crisis, and some of it is for very obvious reasons. The closure of the border was always going to be difficult for immigration, quite obviously. Secondly, the general sense of crisis was going to make a lot of people\u2019s situations difficult\u2014not having work, and so on. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000423\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003EBut as the legislation identifies, it was especially going to be a problem for the administration of immigration law, which is all set up to do one-by-one or case by case consideration, when, actually, whole classes of people have been affected by the COVID-19 situation. So I completely support the idea that we\u2019re going to have some general determinations that will help whole groups of people who, through no fault of their own, are caught up. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000424\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003ELet me just give a couple of examples\u2014people that have contacted me. An immigration agent from Hamilton\u2014they\u2019ve got people who are all ready to go, to come here, and they\u2019re not going to be able to do it, and, yet, they\u2019ve bought property. You know, the difficulties that people are facing as a result of this crisis, being caught between two countries, are in many cases harrowing. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000425\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003EI give the example of\u2014the Minister will know a perennial topic for me and people that get in touch with me\u2014the Recognised Seasonal Employer scheme (RSE). Now, you know, at the moment, Porirua is closed. They are trying to individually process visas and agreements to recruit, and the result is that the RSE scheme at this rate will be all but null and void for the coming summer. That has real impacts. I think the Government needs to be clear. If they think that the horticultural industry is supposed to employ Kiwis for the season, then they should come out and say that, because at the moment that\u2019s the result they\u2019re getting to by default.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000426\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003ENevertheless, this legislation is proportional to the crisis. It\u2019s much needed. It\u2019s going to solve a real humanitarian problem for a lot of people, and for that reason I support it on behalf of ACT and commend it to the House. Thank you, Mr Speaker.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000427\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003EBill read a first time. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000428\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003EBill referred to the Epidemic Response Committee.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022490ccdbf-7c22-4e12-98f2-f3aa08f8e676\u0022 data-id=\u0022a72e40f891b94050982ce119adb43b92\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000429\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022490ccdbf-7c22-4e12-98f2-f3aa08f8e676\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022a72e40f891b94050982ce119adb43b92\u0022\u003EHon IAIN LEES-GALLOWAY (Minister of Immigration):\u003C/span\u003E I move, That the Immigration (COVID-19 Response) Amendment Bill be reported to the House by 12\u00A0May 2020. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000430\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022490ccdbf-7c22-4e12-98f2-f3aa08f8e676\u0022\u003EMotion agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n    \u003C/div\u003E\n    \u003Cdiv class=\u0022HpsHansard\u0022\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000431\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsProceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u00227d3847a5cceb4d4ab7c674c5a2a2b580\u0022\u003ESittings of the House\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000433\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u0022affe489fe9354a3ebc3ddd477a7a03dc\u0022\u003ESittings of the House\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022490ccdbf-7c22-4e12-98f2-f3aa08f8e676\u0022 data-id=\u0022cfe8f1345a994c82ab9c02c769e2cf8a\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000432\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022490ccdbf-7c22-4e12-98f2-f3aa08f8e676\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022cfe8f1345a994c82ab9c02c769e2cf8a\u0022\u003EHon IAIN LEES-GALLOWAY (Deputy Leader of the House):\u003C/span\u003E I seek leave for the House to adjourn until the next sitting day.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022 data-id=\u00229d8345977e4046c4a6ef8f39fb975ccf\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000434\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00229d8345977e4046c4a6ef8f39fb975ccf\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Is there any objection to that? There is none.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202005059dc376a79d3a4d55827f70d8366b3777000435\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003EThe House adjourned at 5.22 p.m.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n    \u003C/div\u003E\n  \u003C/body\u003E\n\u003C/html\u003E"