"\u003C!DOCTYPE html\u003E\u003Chtml xmlns:xlink=\u0022http://www.w3.org/1999/xlink\u0022 xmlns:xsi=\u0022http://www.w3.org/2007/XMLSchema-instance\u0022 xmlns:mml=\u0022http://www.w3.org/1998/Math/MathML\u0022\u003E\n  \u003Chead\u003E\n    \u003CMETA http-equiv=\u0022Content-Type\u0022 content=\u0022text/html; charset=utf-16\u0022\u003E\n    \u003Cmeta name=\u0022viewport\u0022 content=\u0022width=device-width, initial-scale=1\u0022\u003E\n  \u003C/head\u003E\n  \u003Cbody style=\u0022font-family:sans-serif; font-size:100%;\u0022\u003E\n    \u003Cdiv class=\u0022HpsHansard\u0022\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000001\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsProceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u00221db47c26afb440769e2362aa017888cb\u0022\u003ETUESDAY, 1 DECEMBER 2020\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000003\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u0022595d9efc39c744e2b13489edfdf1bcee\u0022\u003ETUESDAY, 1 DECEMBER 2020\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000002\u0022\u003EThe Speaker took the Chair at 2 p.m.\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000004\u0022\u003EPrayers.\u003C/p\u003E\n    \u003C/div\u003E\n    \u003Cdiv class=\u0022HpsHansard\u0022\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000005\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsProceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u0022f6e9ffc437cc4b10bffcda3e54919f48\u0022\u003EPetitions, Papers, Select Committee Reports, and Introduction of Bills\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000007\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u002283e973c74f7243169c9939ba78786bf2\u0022\u003EPetitions, Papers, Select Committee Reports, and Introduction of Bills\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022 data-id=\u002224d5a50291064aafae3ff077680b2563\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000006\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002224d5a50291064aafae3ff077680b2563\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: No select committee reports have been delivered for presentation. A petition has been delivered to the Clerk.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022\u0022 data-id=\u0022c80c9ba2867942c6a725790b818ae1e4\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000008\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022c80c9ba2867942c6a725790b818ae1e4\u0022\u003ECLERK\u003C/span\u003E: Petition of Sophie Handford requesting that the House of Representatives support a climate emergency declaration, provide for net zero carbon, end fossil fuel exploration and extraction, invest in a sustainable economy, and honour its responsibility to the Pacific.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022 data-id=\u00223512d28243604707afd40eda7e9fc837\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000009\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00223512d28243604707afd40eda7e9fc837\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: That petition stands referred to the Petitions Committee. Ministers have delivered papers.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022\u0022 data-id=\u0022cfbb8e082b6c41c48266cff5e8ab4dd8\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000010\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022cfbb8e082b6c41c48266cff5e8ab4dd8\u0022\u003ECLERK\u003C/span\u003E: \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000011\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022\u0022\u003EReport in relation to selected non-departmental appropriations for the year ended 30 June 2020:\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBItemSL1\u0022\u003EMinister of Tourism for Vote Business, Science and Innovation\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBItemSL1\u0022\u003EMinister of Customs for Vote Customs, and\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBItemSL1\u0022\u003EMinister of Education for Vote Education\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000012\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022\u0022\u003Eannual reports for 2019-20 for:\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBItemSL1\u0022\u003EK\u0101inga Ora\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBItemSL1\u0022\u003EParliamentary Counsel Office\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBItemSL1\u0022\u003ECrown Law\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBItemSL1\u0022\u003ENew Zealand Customs Service\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBItemSL1\u0022\u003EMinistry for the Environment\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBItemSL1\u0022\u003EEnvironmental Protection Authority\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBItemSL1\u0022\u003EMinistry of Education\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBItemSL1\u0022\u003EEducation Review Office\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBItemSL1\u0022\u003ENew Zealand Qualifications Authority, and\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBItemSL1\u0022\u003EMinistry for Women\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000013\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022\u0022\u003Estatement of performance expectations 2020-21 for:\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBItemSL1\u0022\u003E Te K\u0101hui T\u0101tari Ture | Criminal Cases Review Commission, and \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBItemSL1\u0022\u003E New Zealand Trade and Enterprise\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000014\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022\u0022\u003Estatement of intent 2020-24 for Te K\u0101hui T\u0101tari Ture | Criminal Cases Review Commission\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000015\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022\u0022\u003Estatement of intent 2020-25, Ministry for the Environment\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000016\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022\u0022\u003Estrategic intentions 2020-24 for the Parliamentary Counsel Office and\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000017\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022\u0022\u003EMinistry of Education report on the compulsory schools sector in New Zealand 2019.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022 data-id=\u00224bccfdb2563c45ddaf6ac4889ca4b5ad\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000018\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00224bccfdb2563c45ddaf6ac4889ca4b5ad\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Those papers are published under the authority of the House. The Clerk has been informed of the introduction of bills.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022\u0022 data-id=\u0022aa02c3677c384731859473b09c061143\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000019\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022aa02c3677c384731859473b09c061143\u0022\u003ECLERK\u003C/span\u003E: \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000020\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022\u0022\u003EHolidays (Increasing Sick Leave) Amendment Bill, introduction.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000021\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022\u0022\u003ECOVID-19 Public Health Response Amendment Bill, introduction.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000022\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022\u0022\u003EDrug and Substance Checking Legislation Bill, introduction.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022 data-id=\u00225193a3dbd0c54f8c864edac42e94dd25\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000023\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00225193a3dbd0c54f8c864edac42e94dd25\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Those bills are set down for first reading.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n    \u003C/div\u003E\n    \u003Cdiv class=\u0022HpsHansard\u0022\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000024\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsProceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u00227138201e94e14fc192656f187a2935fa\u0022\u003EOral Questions\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000025\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u002271e8bee8999942698d34ded7f0b9958e\u0022\u003EQuestions to Ministers\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000026\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u0022277d2e7138ab457caa95e8987e4fd0ac\u0022\u003EQuestion No. 1\u2014Finance\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022f7fc7ac3-5ce1-43ca-8cd6-dbb0941bf3ae\u0022 data-id=\u0022285cb7a3e9b640f6bc409807b926c5ae\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000027\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f7fc7ac3-5ce1-43ca-8cd6-dbb0941bf3ae\u0022\u003E1. \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022285cb7a3e9b640f6bc409807b926c5ae\u0022\u003EDr DUNCAN WEBB (Labour\u2014Christchurch Central)\u003C/span\u003E to the Minister of Finance: What recent reports has he seen on the New Zealand economy?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022 data-id=\u002232f788445be94925b85cdb6f1cafe1a2\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000028\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002232f788445be94925b85cdb6f1cafe1a2\u0022\u003EHon GRANT ROBERTSON (Minister of Finance):\u003C/span\u003E I have received many positive reports on the New Zealand economy since my last answer on this subject in the House. Just yesterday, we received very positive business confidence data from ANZ, showing business confidence had improved significantly, and that, as the ANZ put it, indicators relating to investment, employment, and profit were also higher. Evidence of this is seen in recent data on retail, with sales values recording their largest September quarter rise since the series began in 1995\u2014up 7.4 percent. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000029\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003EThe latest Statistics New Zealand labour force survey data shows unemployment at 5.3 percent. While we will never be satisfied with this, it is worth noting that this is nearly half the rate of unemployment that had been anticipated at Budget 2020, and it means that 117,000 fewer people are unemployed than expected by Treasury just seven months ago. Even more pleasingly is the very latest data from Statistics New Zealand showing that this strength is continuing with monthly filled jobs data showing an increase of 27,667 jobs in October.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000030\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f7fc7ac3-5ce1-43ca-8cd6-dbb0941bf3ae\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002207d4d690b2664bfea205979487e58c4a\u0022\u003EDr Duncan Webb\u003C/span\u003E: What do the reports on jobs data show? \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000031\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022cfe6695e6b3c4e60b4a980b67f69d813\u0022\u003EHon GRANT ROBERTSON\u003C/span\u003E: Well, manufacturing saw 2,713 new filled jobs; retail was up 2,188 jobs; accommodation and food services rose by 2,019 jobs; and 5,048 jobs went to those aged 15 to 19 years, together with another 3,123 jobs in the next age group, 20 to 24 years. All regions in New Zealand had increases in the number of filled jobs compared with September. Auckland recorded the largest rise of 8,104 for jobs, followed by Wellington with 3,329, and Canterbury with 3,301. We do need to acknowledge that many people have lost their jobs, and some regions are still struggling with the effects of COVID-19, but the New Zealand economy is recovering.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000032\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f7fc7ac3-5ce1-43ca-8cd6-dbb0941bf3ae\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022d35dfe2127df4a2bacadc573b4ccfae4\u0022\u003EDr Duncan Webb\u003C/span\u003E: What recent reports has he seen on export performance?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000033\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022f6badf880c7c48fd9dd549c751d1983f\u0022\u003EHon GRANT ROBERTSON\u003C/span\u003E: Well, I\u2019ve seen recent data on trade from Statistics New Zealand which showed our annual goods trade surplus reached a 28-year high. Goods exports rose $734 million to $60.1 billion in the year to October 2020, despite COVID-19 reducing global economic activity. The annual value of our exports goods rose to countries such as China, the United States, Japan, Korea, the United Kingdom, Germany, and Canada. Overall, the value of our goods exports rose 1.2 percent, showing the continued strength, hard work, and resilience of those in our economy.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000034\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u002205dd20264ba84434951a138fe3cfa5cc\u0022\u003EQuestion No. 2\u2014Prime Minister\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002285ec30d4-6394-433a-a12e-2c4def705dd0\u0022 data-id=\u0022d5a129ab664e4710812045782efd6cd0\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000035\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002285ec30d4-6394-433a-a12e-2c4def705dd0\u0022\u003E2. \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022d5a129ab664e4710812045782efd6cd0\u0022\u003EHon JUDITH COLLINS (Leader of the Opposition)\u003C/span\u003E to the Prime Minister: Does she stand by her statement in relation to accepting policy recommendations on housing, \u201CThe appetite for some of these policies also needs to come from the public\u201D?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022 data-id=\u00224573151d4f3a4b379e9d6b0ca26ca734\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000036\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00224573151d4f3a4b379e9d6b0ca26ca734\u0022\u003ERt Hon JACINDA ARDERN (Prime Minister):\u003C/span\u003E I stand by the full quote\u2014which specifically, at that time, I interpreted to be regarding measures like capital gains tax\u2014where I stated, \u201CWell, look, I would say that actually the appetite for some of these policies also needs to come from the public. We\u2019ve tried three times now to do things that specifically sit in that taxation category, and there hasn\u2019t been wide support for that. But I would point out, again, that actually that is not the only lever that exists.\u201D \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000037\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002285ec30d4-6394-433a-a12e-2c4def705dd0\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002225ac39f13b064c48983f962f52d39d0d\u0022\u003EHon Judith Collins\u003C/span\u003E: Does she believe voters have given her a mandate to implement her housing agenda, which specifically excluded a capital gains tax?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000038\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00220c9843801c694dd2ad02cbf28fa759ec\u0022\u003ERt Hon JACINDA ARDERN\u003C/span\u003E: I do believe that we have been given a mandate from the public to roll out the manifesto commitments that we presented. Of course, some of those we\u2019re seeing in the House today, because we\u2019ve moved very, very quickly on those that matter most to the public in the middle of a pandemic\u2014including, for instance, sick leave provisions; including those income tax increases so we can continue the provision of decent housing, health, and education services. We know, though, in a very short space of time we have seen extraordinary house price increases. We are not the only country experiencing that, and that is why, with the mandate we have, we are responding to concerns that have been raised by the public around that, and we\u2019re waiting for advice that we will consider in the new year. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000039\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002285ec30d4-6394-433a-a12e-2c4def705dd0\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00228681826167784bbebda4a6e3cf953449\u0022\u003EHon Judith Collins\u003C/span\u003E: Will she rule out extending the brightline test beyond five years?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000040\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00222f9f1124dde34ea8ae57ec9679babd1c\u0022\u003ERt Hon JACINDA ARDERN\u003C/span\u003E: Mr Speaker, you\u2019ll have seen during the course of the election that we were very clear that, obviously, a capital gains tax was not in our consideration. We equally ruled out any measures around a wealth tax. These are purely hypothetical questions beyond any of those taxes. However, I note the brightline test policy\u2014introduced by National, extended by Labour\u2014is something we\u2019ve asked for some analysis on over the impact it\u2019s having in the market, and in this current environment that is absolutely the right thing to do. We need to know what levers are and aren\u2019t making a difference to house price increases.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000041\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002285ec30d4-6394-433a-a12e-2c4def705dd0\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002291638e9dadf340a18bf3c328eb2252d9\u0022\u003EHon Judith Collins\u003C/span\u003E: Does she agree that more taxes will not build more houses?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000042\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a40c06109dc6493582a5f1855f78aa9e\u0022\u003ERt Hon JACINDA ARDERN\u003C/span\u003E: I note that the member was actually in the Government that introduced the brightline test. My only assumption would be that there was some expectation from the Government of the day that it would have some impact on what were incredible house price increases under that Government. The big difference between that member and this side of the House is that we do not accept that those house price increases are OK. We do not believe that there is no lever that can be pulled to continue to stabilise what we\u2019re seeing in the market, and we also don\u2019t believe that the answer is selling housing stock, as that last member did.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000043\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022bd6ae875e1ef44319e3463d9e568a26d\u0022\u003EDavid Seymour\u003C/span\u003E: Can the Prime Minister explain how\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000044\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022bd185fd32a704da3a7d864e13cfe1628\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Sorry. A point of order\u2014the Hon Judith Collins.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000045\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002285ec30d4-6394-433a-a12e-2c4def705dd0\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022d6e41b3c7d5f476fae23aee26c11f4df\u0022\u003EHon Judith Collins\u003C/span\u003E: Point of order, Mr Speaker. My question was \u201CDoes she agree that more taxes will not build more houses?\u201D I did not hear anything relating to whether or not more taxes would build more houses in the Prime Minister\u2019s answer.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000046\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00226f224995642944e194ac825e2c0b8fb0\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Well, I certainly thought that the general area was addressed. I thought the member was going to raise a point of order about the length of the reply. She might have been on sounder grounds there.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000047\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00226a77298d02554a5898c5e45bde82e889\u0022\u003EDavid Seymour\u003C/span\u003E: Can the Prime Minister explain to the public how extending the brightline test to 10 years would be different from introducing a capital gains tax?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000048\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002242516ef750314575881206d2254df3fa\u0022\u003ERt Hon JACINDA ARDERN\u003C/span\u003E: Obviously, at the time when ACT supported, as I understand, the brightline test, there was a very clear view put forward by the Government of the day\u2014that was, I believe, supported by the likes of Andrew Bayly\u2014quotes in this House claiming that it was income, not capital gains, tax. That was certainly the argument made by Chris Bishop. But, of course, what I only assume that side of the House intended to do was to deal with speculators. Of course, at that time there was a view that there were a number of people in the market who were purchasing homes and flicking them within a very short period of time in order to benefit from quick gains. We are seeking advice on what impact it has had on the market, and that may go to answer the member\u2019s question.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000049\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00221be70cd01648432098dfe17b696b95a8\u0022\u003EDavid Seymour\u003C/span\u003E: Point of order. Mr Speaker, the question was very clearly about the difference between two policies. We\u2019ve heard an awful lot about who had supported a brightline test and speculation about the reasons they might have supported them but no attempt to explain to the public what the difference between the policies is. She didn\u2019t address the question at all.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000050\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00225eb90a80782943be8e6d0ef6c63e9cc6\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Well, the Prime Minister certainly did address the question\u2014she addressed it by contrast and, from memory, she quoted someone.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000051\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002285ec30d4-6394-433a-a12e-2c4def705dd0\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022739192c8e1ca4102a8318e55a4cb231b\u0022\u003EHon Judith Collins\u003C/span\u003E: Who was to blame for house prices rising 37 percent in her first term of Government? \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000052\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022035c2cf325104dba8840818b39b480b6\u0022\u003ERt Hon JACINDA ARDERN\u003C/span\u003E: Perhaps the member would like to tell us who\u2019s to blame for the 65 percent increase we had under National. The difference is I do not accept that it is acceptable to continue to see house price rises that lift housing out of reach of first-home buyers. There are a range of issues contributing to this environment, and what I will not do is apportion blame to anyone. However, undoubtedly, what is happening in the market right now is there is an impact from low interest rates; there is an impact from the fact that we haven\u2019t had the supply over consecutive decades that we have needed in this country. We have not had, for instance, the rating base in local government to provide for the infrastructure that is needed. We haven\u2019t, for instance, had support for residential housing during economic downturns, like the GFC, where we did not see the development that we needed under that last Government. I\u2019d say a big issue here is whether you take political ownership for trying to fix the problem. National never did.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000053\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022ffff6b49b7b74ee7b90f032e6197fc4e\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Order! I\u2019ve alluded to it previously, but I\u2019m now going to be clear to the Prime Minister: her answer was far too long.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000054\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002285ec30d4-6394-433a-a12e-2c4def705dd0\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a6cacb5ac3d74fe092eb9debb7fde015\u0022\u003EHon Judith Collins\u003C/span\u003E: Why have house prices risen faster in the last month than any time since 2004, according to CoreLogic?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000055\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a5683403828b461e9c433046bc148882\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Order! That\u2019s actually not an area that the Prime Minister has responsibility for.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000056\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022b9cee7af75684cdfb6e10aa96af1da5a\u0022\u003EHon Gerry Brownlee\u003C/span\u003E: Oh hold on, what\u2019d she answer the other questions for?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000057\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00229763e3982800456c90169dc1f2ecb795\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Well, that\u2019s a good question. I\u2019ve been going over that in my head for the last three or four supplementaries. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000058\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002285ec30d4-6394-433a-a12e-2c4def705dd0\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022f1bdb19a40bf443e8605c71b19fe189f\u0022\u003EHon Judith Collins\u003C/span\u003E: When the Prime Minister alluded to house price rises under a previous National Government, what\u2019s her answer to why house prices have increased more in the last month than they did since 2004?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000059\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00226d1feb7e54154ec68f1c85275f42b116\u0022\u003ERt Hon JACINDA ARDERN\u003C/span\u003E: This is actually a very good question. If you look back at the annualised increases under this Government in the last term, according to CoreLogic, they sat at 4 percent. You compare that, for instance, to the previous Government, where annualised figures sat at nine. In the last month we have seen extraordinary growth. Now, part of the issue is not just domestic. If you look overseas, nine out of 10 democracies that we compare ourselves to, and economies we compare ourselves to, are having exactly the same issue. Low interest rates are being used globally to stimulate growth in hard-hit economies through COVID, and members of the public\u2014even in jurisdictions where they have things like capital gains taxes or their equivalent\u2014are investing in property. And so that is part of the issue, but low interest rates are also benefiting first-home buyers. That is not to say there aren\u2019t other levers, and we are investigating all of those to try and get it under control. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000060\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002285ec30d4-6394-433a-a12e-2c4def705dd0\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022187037c46edd4700a3001acc3562fd67\u0022\u003EHon Judith Collins\u003C/span\u003E: If the Prime Minister is correct, then why has Australia only seen a 6 percent increase in the last 12 months, and the UK a 5 percent increase if it\u2019s \u201Clow interest rates\u201D?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000061\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022c34fd8504e7f406a8d9004ed3f502e77\u0022\u003ERt Hon JACINDA ARDERN\u003C/span\u003E: Actually, I recommend to the member some analysis in The Economist just recently around, actually, what\u2014in a very short space of time, even through lockdown\u2014we are seeing from house price increases in the likes of the UK. I haven\u2019t looked on the month-by-month analysis for those jurisdictions, so I\u2019m not sure that that\u2019s fair analysis, but we are not alone in this problem. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000062\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u00225df9727ff0a9435da3ed4e10808b12c0\u0022\u003EQuestion No. 3\u2014Education\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002226b88bf1-f634-40e7-8019-e75cc483ace7\u0022 data-id=\u00227665561852564057b16ec0dd9697f3b5\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000063\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002226b88bf1-f634-40e7-8019-e75cc483ace7\u0022\u003E3. \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00227665561852564057b16ec0dd9697f3b5\u0022\u003EJO LUXTON (Labour\u2014Rangitata)\u003C/span\u003E to the Minister of Education: What response has he seen to Government initiatives to support training and apprenticeships?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022 data-id=\u0022dde79106d85b4024b99bc9eef1490087\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000064\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022dde79106d85b4024b99bc9eef1490087\u0022\u003EHon CHRIS HIPKINS (Minister of Education):\u003C/span\u003E I\u2019m pleased to report that the number of New Zealanders enrolling in apprenticeships has increased by approximately 85 percent and that the number of women signing up for apprentices has more than doubled. Since we made all apprenticeships free in July this year, there have been almost 14,000 new apprentices signing up nationwide, which is an increase from about 7,500 in the same period last year. In particular I want to acknowledge that we have had 1,785 women signing up for apprenticeships compared to 845 in the same period last year. It\u2019s good to see women signing up for these roles. We\u2019re making progress, but of course we still do have a way to go.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000065\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002226b88bf1-f634-40e7-8019-e75cc483ace7\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022d44c50f4de964de8a3293ec70c86114c\u0022\u003EJo Luxton\u003C/span\u003E: Have numbers also increased in other forms of training and, if so, why?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000066\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002294364a1eacb34b77a2b36e8e1fc6a516\u0022\u003EHon CHRIS HIPKINS\u003C/span\u003E: Yes, the Targeted Training and Apprenticeship Fund doesn\u2019t just make all apprenticeships free. It also makes certificates, diplomas, and programmes in targeted industries free until the end of next year, and people have certainly responded warmly to that. Since July more than 17,000 learners have started a programme that is covered by this in industries that are critical to our economic recovery. That\u2019s an increase of around a third compared to the same time last year.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000067\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002226b88bf1-f634-40e7-8019-e75cc483ace7\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022d9b015a28dae4da89e0ddd983e06218b\u0022\u003EJo Luxton\u003C/span\u003E: What else is the Government doing to encourage people into vocational education and training?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000068\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022d8302c454ebb4c30b9db538395c6e835\u0022\u003EHon CHRIS HIPKINS\u003C/span\u003E: We know that one of the things we have to do is turn around the profile of trades and vocational education. We need to make sure that young people see these as the incredibly desirable careers that they are. So we have begun a substantial campaign to change public perception. It starts with a primarily social media campaign, moving into a more traditional media campaign as well, targeting a variety of different audiences to ensure that people understand the roles that are available and how many opportunities there are in those fields. That builds on the work that we\u2019ve done over the last year to get around the country with trades expos and so on to ensure that young people know about the jobs that they could aspire to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000069\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u002231b0010a985e44288153e930f7f9f5c1\u0022\u003EQuestion No. 4\u2014Finance\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022859e13f9-33bb-41bb-b2f0-d848eaf25407\u0022 data-id=\u0022e5315ac4b15343869a8979975d1c3e1b\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000070\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022859e13f9-33bb-41bb-b2f0-d848eaf25407\u0022\u003E4. \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022e5315ac4b15343869a8979975d1c3e1b\u0022\u003EANDREW BAYLY (National\u2014Port Waikato)\u003C/span\u003E to the Minister of Finance: Is he considering further extending the bright-line test to have an effect upon house prices?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022 data-id=\u0022736459ff2bdf40aba747088bbe3d28c4\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000071\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022736459ff2bdf40aba747088bbe3d28c4\u0022\u003EHon GRANT ROBERTSON (Minister of Finance):\u003C/span\u003E As I noted last week, I\u2019ve asked officials for advice on the existing settings and on measures to address the demand side of housing. We are yet to receive that advice and no decisions have been made, so it is premature to say we are considering any particular response. However, I would like to thank the National and ACT parties for passing the brightline test into law in 2015.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000072\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022859e13f9-33bb-41bb-b2f0-d848eaf25407\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022b03643afb6bf4d8eb143ef40c04b4a5e\u0022\u003EAndrew Bayly\u003C/span\u003E: Does he agree with the Labour finance spokesperson Grant Robertson\u2019s comment on Newstalk ZB on 9 September that there will be no extension to the brightline test?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000073\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002279275cf03b564b68ae64d4d12332a8ef\u0022\u003EHon GRANT ROBERTSON\u003C/span\u003E: I find the Labour finance spokesperson Grant Robertson to be a man of immense wisdom, kindness, and compassion. I refer the member to the Labour Party\u2019s policy on taxation that was released on 9 September. I note that, as I\u2019ve said, we are looking to Treasury for some advice on the current settings in the housing market in response to the rapid escalation in house prices.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000074\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022859e13f9-33bb-41bb-b2f0-d848eaf25407\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a34739bb546b432f9af2dbeb128e0847\u0022\u003EAndrew Bayly\u003C/span\u003E: Will he rule out an extension to the brightline test?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000075\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022824e599c317b46349dbf3ecb058d284a\u0022\u003EHon GRANT ROBERTSON\u003C/span\u003E: We have asked Treasury officials for advice; it would be premature at this stage to say anything about that. But I would note that some learned commentators have spoken about the importance of the brightline test, including one who said, \u201CIt\u2019s important that everyone is paying their fair share of tax, particularly property investors are also paying their fair share of tax.\u201D That was one Andrew Bayly.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000076\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022859e13f9-33bb-41bb-b2f0-d848eaf25407\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022d9e4aca18e2342bfa531d67eb0894d7e\u0022\u003EAndrew Bayly\u003C/span\u003E: Why was extending the brightline test off the table two months ago and now back on the table?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000077\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00229052f84c0a79457b9bfecda4addde069\u0022\u003EHon GRANT ROBERTSON\u003C/span\u003E: The member is getting ahead of himself. We are still to receive advice from officials.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000078\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022859e13f9-33bb-41bb-b2f0-d848eaf25407\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00220a155767663d49189a20769cd2af5ad9\u0022\u003EAndrew Bayly\u003C/span\u003E: Would he consider it to be a broken promise to extend the brightline test, considering the Government\u2019s position has been that there will be no other changes to tax beyond the new 39 percent income tax change?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000079\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002287933c8c5f1640008c27f93a3be4262e\u0022\u003EHon GRANT ROBERTSON\u003C/span\u003E: As is consistent with the member\u2019s portfolio title, he\u2019s jumping at shadows.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000080\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u002258bd65df3c5e4ac38f95b30a3a80faf9\u0022\u003EQuestion No. 5\u2014Finance\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002258f935f1-6646-40ab-9d99-17029396850c\u0022 data-id=\u00222883bff21295491ca11d50a1cb2092a9\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000081\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002258f935f1-6646-40ab-9d99-17029396850c\u0022\u003E5. \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00222883bff21295491ca11d50a1cb2092a9\u0022\u003EHon JULIE ANNE GENTER (Green)\u003C/span\u003E to the Minister of Finance: Does he stand by his statement about the Government\u2019s economic response to the COVID-19 shock that \u201Cwe must also not allow inequality to take hold in our recovery\u201D?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022 data-id=\u0022ce86a0c9f02540e4b36ff0f4b1c3a3a3\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000082\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022ce86a0c9f02540e4b36ff0f4b1c3a3a3\u0022\u003EHon GRANT ROBERTSON (Minister of Finance):\u003C/span\u003E Yes, I do. I stand by the full quote which is underpinning all of this, as the Prime Minister said yesterday, \u201Cwe must not allow inequality to take hold in our recovery. In fact we need to take this opportunity to improve the prospects of all New Zealanders and tackle those long-standing divisions\u201D.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000083\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002258f935f1-6646-40ab-9d99-17029396850c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002224e97ae6af57405ca5c244b20e98df83\u0022\u003EHon Julie Anne Genter\u003C/span\u003E: Are rapidly increasing house prices in New Zealand almost unprecedented during a time of recession and growing unemployment causing wealth inequality to get worse?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000084\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00221a5743a74d7942fa8134ea5094ea8b0f\u0022\u003EHon GRANT ROBERTSON\u003C/span\u003E: Well, the very reason why we have asked officials to do work for us on what other options exist in terms of demand in housing is because we are concerned about those rapidly escalating prices. Equally, Minister Woods, as the Minister of Housing, is leading a work programme on how to further address the supply side.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000085\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002258f935f1-6646-40ab-9d99-17029396850c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022092d2a4ab5b1429f8399b606d56c30ec\u0022\u003EHon Julie Anne Genter\u003C/span\u003E: Does he agree with Governor of the Reserve Bank, Adrian Orr, who last week said in relation to controlling house prices that \u201Cmonetary policy is a blunt tool\u201D and that the Government needs to consider its fiscal levers, including tax?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000086\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00222af2a9e9dd7d49a6bf92c135a6ca49b2\u0022\u003EHon GRANT ROBERTSON\u003C/span\u003E: I certainly agree with the fact that monetary and fiscal policy both have a role to play when it comes to the housing market.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000087\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002258f935f1-6646-40ab-9d99-17029396850c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022e252bac4475c43258ac9cd26afe5f75a\u0022\u003EHon Julie Anne Genter\u003C/span\u003E: Will introducing a new top income tax rate without an accompanying tax on capital gains or property wealth help or hurt attempts to get the housing market under control?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000088\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00226894f30ea7a644d1968ff7c911799017\u0022\u003EHon GRANT ROBERTSON\u003C/span\u003E: I think that the increase in the top tax rate is something that has been welcomed by a lot of New Zealanders, because it will mean those on the highest incomes are paying a little more to help with the COVID recovery and make sure that we do continue to get debt under control. In terms of its overall relationship to the housing market, there are many, many factors at play there. I wouldn\u2019t pick that one out.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000089\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002258f935f1-6646-40ab-9d99-17029396850c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022af968b73b8de4f64bd3112b58165ff2d\u0022\u003EHon Julie Anne Genter\u003C/span\u003E: Why is his Government focusing on taxing income and not asset values when the ratio of house values to income has risen from 6.2 to 6.8 in the last year?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000090\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022dfeb395e41b740af9561e74d7f3d8497\u0022\u003EHon GRANT ROBERTSON\u003C/span\u003E: What we believe is that we need to take a range of measures. There is no one silver bullet here when it comes to housing and how we manage house prices. It is a matter of increasing supply. We have been doing that. It is a matter of controlling demand. We have been doing that with the likes of the brightline extension that we did. The ban on foreign buyers\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000091\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002257e41e9d-285b-4fb3-847d-a63820ae7137\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00222115608dfabc4562abd7c988d86e8dc5\u0022\u003EChris Bishop\u003C/span\u003E: How\u2019s that going?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000092\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00221b228051f09a490ebc3bc9a30b1194c1\u0022\u003EHon GRANT ROBERTSON\u003C/span\u003E: The ban on foreign buyers is going well, Mr Bishop. It\u2019s a very popular policy and also the ring-fencing of rental losses. The reason we have asked officials for more advice is so we can see what other levers exist.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000093\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002258f935f1-6646-40ab-9d99-17029396850c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00222b0e0ee96da542889d54c0cfe5bce93e\u0022\u003EHon Julie Anne Genter\u003C/span\u003E: Does he acknowledge that there is significant risk that inequality will continue to worsen if the Government only focuses on taxing work and not taxing property wealth?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000094\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a85895940bc244bcac34f4e2fef97d5b\u0022\u003EHon GRANT ROBERTSON\u003C/span\u003E: We have a range of measures to help lift incomes that revolves around both our social development policy, our housing policy, the work we\u2019re doing to improve productivity in the wider economy. What I would say to the member is that this has to be a comprehensive package of initiatives that deals right across the board. We are taking further advice on those matters at the moment.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000095\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u0022638a6c13d19e4686948ffc7abc71cf6c\u0022\u003EQuestion No. 6\u2014Prime Minister\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022 data-id=\u00227976049077e943beba0a5f613f844f96\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000096\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003E6. \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00227976049077e943beba0a5f613f844f96\u0022\u003EDAVID SEYMOUR (Leader\u2014ACT)\u003C/span\u003E to the Prime Minister: Does she stand by her statement in relation to a COVID-19 vaccine that \u201CAt this point, our expectation that we\u2019ve been running to is more around the March date\u201D? \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022 data-id=\u00226c83aae860974a99a7ad5c4f3345a89b\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000097\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00226c83aae860974a99a7ad5c4f3345a89b\u0022\u003ERt Hon JACINDA ARDERN (Prime Minister):\u003C/span\u003E Yes. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000098\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a98b11ff69fe4f2bb427d53bde48ffea\u0022\u003EDavid Seymour\u003C/span\u003E: Why is her expectation for a vaccine roll-out in New Zealand as late as March 2021 when hospitals in countries such as the UK have been told to prepare for a roll-out as soon as next week? \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000099\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00227d1b45260e274afa9b27fa925e05a936\u0022\u003ERt Hon JACINDA ARDERN\u003C/span\u003E: Look, over the past couple of weeks even, I\u2019ve had conversations with leaders in other countries that, like us, have entered into advance purchase arrangements. We do not yet, as nations, have exact clarity on delivery dates for vaccines. Some\u2014in fact, the vast majority\u2014are still in clinical trials. So that\u2019s the first thing. The second issue is that each country will take their own perspective, or at least sequencing, around the regulatory approvals. Some countries, because they are experiencing a large-scale loss of life, may choose to accept higher risk in their regulatory process. Thirdly, there will not necessarily be the same delivery date for all countries, and I do, again, just reference the fact that some countries are experiencing large-scale loss of life. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000100\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022824efefc37774802b5242755b474b639\u0022\u003EDavid Seymour\u003C/span\u003E: When will the Prime Minister be able to lay out a time line for applying or making available the vaccine, given that it\u2019s become available, given New Zealand\u2019s perspective? \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000101\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022c908c6f6fee34942bebc22124f4f1a66\u0022\u003ERt Hon JACINDA ARDERN\u003C/span\u003E: Well, firstly, as I say, the majority of vaccines are still in some form of clinical trial. So it is highly speculative as to when different countries will expect arrival dates, and, as I say, other leaders I\u2019ve spoken to are speculating themselves. In terms of New Zealand\u2019s time lines, we are still negotiating. We have already announced advance purchase arrangements with two companies\u2014with two pharmaceutical companies. We are in commercially sensitive negotiations with others. As they are announced, we of course share those details. What I\u2019m looking to do is, before Christmas, try and give a bit more certainty around what our current expectations are. But, as I\u2019ve already said, they\u2019re not all arriving at the same time. We expect smaller amounts of doses in the first instance, and we will need to sequence, then, vaccination across the country over the course of the year. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000102\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00221c78df543dbd4c62956b911282944f04\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Just before the member goes for his next question\u2014and it\u2019s an advisory thing, and I let that one run because everyone was interested in the answer\u2014one\u2019s not meant to use a \u201Cgiven\u201D in a question. It actually added nothing. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000103\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022d0e7619b373843b795bdecb46d1bbebf\u0022\u003EDavid Seymour\u003C/span\u003E: Thank you for the reminder, Mr Speaker. Supplementary: wouldn\u2019t it be smart to start planning the roll-out of a vaccine before it arrives? \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000104\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00223a530f137be24be2b3984eedfb82a862\u0022\u003ERt Hon JACINDA ARDERN\u003C/span\u003E: Absolutely. The suggestion we\u2019re not is incorrect. Of course we have already put in place\u2014for instance, for some of the vaccines they have different requirements around storage. We\u2019ve put in place the purchasing arrangements to be able to assure that. The work will need, even on micro-credentialing, to have the staff across the country for a large-scale vaccination programme when it becomes available. We already have Medsafe working on approvals with the clinical data that\u2019s being provided by pharmaceutical companies, even though the vaccination is not in-country. So it is all under way, as you would expect. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000105\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022d5bd734036ce4ed9adfb0661122986b9\u0022\u003EDavid Seymour\u003C/span\u003E: What percentage of vaccine uptake would be required before vaccination allowed New Zealand to change its policies at the border, opening up to more countries? \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000106\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002222d596d5730b4e23bdf452559c644091\u0022\u003ERt Hon JACINDA ARDERN\u003C/span\u003E: A good question. One of the issues is that with the trials we have at the moment, there is not sufficient data to tell us whether or not the prevention of the onset of disease is going to have an effect on transmission\u2014so being vaccinated does not mean that you will not still pass on COVID-19 to others. It may well mean that, but we don\u2019t have enough data yet to tell us. What we do know is that there has been an observed reduction in asymptomatic infections, and so you can assume that it will have an impact. To answer your question, though, around what scale of immunisation, of course we want herd immunity\u2014that\u2019s the best way that we can protect our population. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000107\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00226593c34425cf4e3f8fc7484f1c783871\u0022\u003EDavid Seymour\u003C/span\u003E: What exactly, then, was the Prime Minister referring to when she said that her expectation she\u2019d been running to was more around the March date? \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000108\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022ad4e97bf975d42d2916b8ed371796d26\u0022\u003ERt Hon JACINDA ARDERN\u003C/span\u003E: Of course you\u2019ll know, as I\u2019ve said, we have advance purchase agreements with two companies at this stage. The first, early expectation around delivery around one of those\u2014the suggestion has been that it could be March. Again, there is still some uncertainty there. I will caution: we\u2019re not talking enough doses to vaccinate the whole country, which is why I\u2019ve talked about the need for a rolling regime. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000109\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022793e66fcbb7d44e79ac1ca0363fc5206\u0022\u003EDavid Seymour\u003C/span\u003E: Can the Prime Minister tell New Zealanders anything concrete today about what to expect from the arrival of a COVID vaccine and its effects on the Government\u2019s COVID response next year? \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000110\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022526d4a41e64e4b1e8545fe1d004811ab\u0022\u003ERt Hon JACINDA ARDERN\u003C/span\u003E: Firstly, that New Zealand will have not just one vaccine. There will be many. Some will be more appropriate for different parts of the population than others. That the first arrivals are likely to be smaller numbers of doses, and that we\u2019ll need to sequence the distribution of those for those who are in higher-risk areas of work. Secondly, that as data across the globe is provided, we\u2019ll be able to see whether or not the vaccine also reduces the amount of transmission. That will help us know whether or not, for instance, a vaccinated traveller bears risk to New Zealand or not. And, thirdly, that we are doing everything we can to make sure that we can provide a safe vaccine, when it\u2019s available, to all New Zealanders for free. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000111\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00222417678e65de4a3aaa214d9784c7c30b\u0022\u003EDavid Seymour\u003C/span\u003E: Can the Prime Minister tell the House and the public on what date she expects to be able to give a more specific time line for the roll-out of vaccination against COVID in New Zealand?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000112\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022bd7b4bb60aae4b28b405a238844b3f3c\u0022\u003ERt Hon JACINDA ARDERN\u003C/span\u003E: My expectation is that I\u2019ll give an update before Christmas. But, again, there will be a certain degree of speaking in terms of quarters because we simply do not have firm arrival dates for some vaccines that, as I\u2019ve said, are still in clinical trials, let alone large-scale production. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000113\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u0022c316527468af40afaa2a3beebe139eb9\u0022\u003EQuestion No. 7\u2014Social Development and Employment\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022e60c1237-5e2d-4d0a-9678-ab10db67d1b7\u0022 data-id=\u0022961583c0d7d941899ae587c9fe150e64\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000114\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e60c1237-5e2d-4d0a-9678-ab10db67d1b7\u0022\u003E7. \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022961583c0d7d941899ae587c9fe150e64\u0022\u003EANGIE WARREN-CLARK (Labour)\u003C/span\u003E to the Minister for Social Development and Employment: What announcement has she recently made about support for New Zealanders to take up seasonal work?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022c3a88c42-f60b-4cf9-8065-8bfb80a020eb\u0022 data-id=\u00229ec1278a53b34c1e96cb97e14b8c4383\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000115\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c3a88c42-f60b-4cf9-8065-8bfb80a020eb\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00229ec1278a53b34c1e96cb97e14b8c4383\u0022\u003EHon CARMEL SEPULONI (Minister for Social Development and Employment):\u003C/span\u003E Last Friday, I was pleased to announce that the Government has introduced new incentives to encourage out-of-work New Zealanders into seasonal work, like summer fruit-picking. These new incentives include up to $200 per week for accommodation costs if people are paying housing costs back home and at their seasonal job, for up to 13 weeks; and a $1,000 incentive payment for people who complete contracts of six weeks or longer\u2014this will be paid in two $500 instalments halfway through and at the completion of the contract. We have also increased the wet-weather payment and the Seasonal Work Assistance Programme. This means that people who have left a benefit to do seasonal work will now receive minimum wage for every hour that they are unable to work due to bad weather, for up to 40 hours per week. This payment was previously capped at $940; however, we have lifted this to $2,149 over 26 weeks.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000116\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e60c1237-5e2d-4d0a-9678-ab10db67d1b7\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00229decfcddceb942db8954f12f52114349\u0022\u003EAngie Warren-Clark\u003C/span\u003E: What further support is available to help unemployed people in seasonal work?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000117\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c3a88c42-f60b-4cf9-8065-8bfb80a020eb\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00228c2ad0dca23a43b18b79eaf652059ce9\u0022\u003EHon CARMEL SEPULONI\u003C/span\u003E: Getting New Zealanders into work is our top priority. The Ministry of Social Development (MSD) is working closely with the horticulture and viticulture sectors to ensure that Kiwis make up the majority of the seasonal workforce this season and beyond. We recently expanded the 3K to Work programme, which now allows MSD clients who relocate for a job that\u2019s longer than 91 days to get up to $5,000. This has resulted in twice as many grants given in October and November this year compared to 2019 and covers things like moving costs, furniture, and the bond on a new rental. We\u2019re working hard to provide the right incentives for unemployed New Zealanders to get into this work.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000118\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e60c1237-5e2d-4d0a-9678-ab10db67d1b7\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022727a5cbccfbe496087c73a5f7d7a769b\u0022\u003EAngie Warren-Clark\u003C/span\u003E: Why are these incentives important?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000119\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c3a88c42-f60b-4cf9-8065-8bfb80a020eb\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002282cd870aa6d14b2ab6a590e5e7edee74\u0022\u003EHon CARMEL SEPULONI\u003C/span\u003E: The Government is acutely aware of the impact that COVID-19 is having on employment globally; New Zealand is not immune. We are also acutely aware of the labour shortages that exist in the horticulture and viticulture sectors every year but exacerbated this year by COVID-19. Even with the border exception of 2,000 Recognised Seasonal Employer workers that Minister Faafoi announced last Friday and the 6,000 who have remained in New Zealand over the winter, we acknowledge that there is still a gap. My announcement is part of a cohesive plan to address unemployment and workforce shortages and sits alongside the work being led by the Minister of Immigration and the Minister of Agriculture. We recognise the immense value of our horticulture and viticulture industries and will continue to work with them to ensure the terms and conditions of employment are favourable to New Zealanders taking up these opportunities.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000120\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022e88de256b09643bda9d9c470327b38af\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Order! I think members are aware, with the change in balance in numbers of the House, that numbers of questions and numbers of supplementaries have changed, and it means that the member\u2019s party has significantly more than previously. I don\u2019t expect the lengths of answers to go up in the same proportion.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000121\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u00226013f7d9eedc45679dae6dd06bc31a6c\u0022\u003EQuestion No. 8\u2014COVID-19 Response\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002257e41e9d-285b-4fb3-847d-a63820ae7137\u0022 data-id=\u00226f41e69bd15b42338535002e198eed8f\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000122\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002257e41e9d-285b-4fb3-847d-a63820ae7137\u0022\u003E8. \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00226f41e69bd15b42338535002e198eed8f\u0022\u003ECHRIS BISHOP (National)\u003C/span\u003E to the Minister for COVID-19 Response: Does he agree with the statement from Professor Nick Wilson of Otago University\u2019s Department of Public Health on 25 November 2020, \u201CWell, I am concerned that unless we rapidly improve things, we are going to have more border failures because the system has just got too many persisting weaknesses\u201D; if not, why not?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022 data-id=\u0022703efc36c5d4455181fa82d2e7f74e14\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000123\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022703efc36c5d4455181fa82d2e7f74e14\u0022\u003EHon CHRIS HIPKINS (Minister for COVID-19 Response):\u003C/span\u003E I disagree with the assertion in that statement that every recent case of COVID-19 we\u2019ve dealt with is a sign of border failure. Our protective measures at the border continue to strengthen rapidly every day. Every incident or event is carefully reviewed to identify where further improvements could be made. It\u2019s worth recalling that since March 79,000 people have come through the border, 920 have tested positive for COVID-19, and in all but a handful of cases, that is where the matter has ended. Only a handful of close contacts have ended up being infected, and in every one of those cases, we\u2019ve looked to identify where further improvements can be made. The one outlier was the August Auckland cluster, where we\u2019ve still been unable to identify the source.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000124\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002257e41e9d-285b-4fb3-847d-a63820ae7137\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002241d0afa2a3254d20be0e41bd6a258b84\u0022\u003EChris Bishop\u003C/span\u003E: Will he introduce mandatory pre-flight COVID-19 testing as a further tool for all those coming to New Zealand from high-risk countries, as recommended by public health experts; if not, why not?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000125\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022b763fe5311bb4c888580692d8f08c671\u0022\u003EHon CHRIS HIPKINS\u003C/span\u003E: That\u2019s not recommended by all public health experts, and I\u2019d point out that some of the highest concentrations of positive COVID-19 cases that we have dealt with in our managed isolation facilities are amongst people who were tested before they departed and came to New Zealand. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000126\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002257e41e9d-285b-4fb3-847d-a63820ae7137\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022b60ae151b00f4e07995d051dc3c20726\u0022\u003EChris Bishop\u003C/span\u003E: Do all staff working in managed isolation and quarantine facilities have access to an N95 mask if they wish to wear one?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000127\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00223174ccafd1054775a68e9d716cd91fcc\u0022\u003EHon CHRIS HIPKINS\u003C/span\u003E: The Ministry of Health has just issued new guidance on this, which will ensure that those who need N95 masks, because the environment that they are working in justifies it, will have access to it.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000128\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002257e41e9d-285b-4fb3-847d-a63820ae7137\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00228af2e68287b246f5be65157ed19ba5b5\u0022\u003EChris Bishop\u003C/span\u003E: Will there be a Bluetooth option for contact tracing in place before the busy summer holiday period when Kiwis will be moving around the country?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000129\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002226184c50f9ce4e7db7b1e05898cbd047\u0022\u003EHon CHRIS HIPKINS\u003C/span\u003E: I\u2019ll have more to say around Bluetooth very shortly. We have not made any announcements on that yet.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000130\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002257e41e9d-285b-4fb3-847d-a63820ae7137\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022841b0a8cd6f7412aa5966edcb71c765d\u0022\u003EChris Bishop\u003C/span\u003E: Has the COVID-19 Surveillance and Testing Strategy Group, led by Sir Brian Roche and Heather Simpson, reported back to him, and, if so, when will that report be made public?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000131\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00225d67d722a37f40898a37ad4d7ad11512\u0022\u003EHon CHRIS HIPKINS\u003C/span\u003E: Yes, and once the recommendations have been considered by Cabinet.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000132\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u0022ebc88a209d1c4b1a859952236d6023aa\u0022\u003EQuestion No. 9\u2014Immigration\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022c2e823af-22b7-4411-8b12-14d7b43680ea\u0022 data-id=\u0022499568bebe8d4c38ad2b2f68863612cd\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000133\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c2e823af-22b7-4411-8b12-14d7b43680ea\u0022\u003E9. \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022499568bebe8d4c38ad2b2f68863612cd\u0022\u003EJAMIE STRANGE (Labour\u2014Hamilton East)\u003C/span\u003E to the Minister of Immigration: What recent announcements has he made to set out how the Government is supporting New Zealand businesses?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002290ea1538-43e8-4257-bd80-df3ccd1e5f27\u0022 data-id=\u0022410370182c9447a1a9ecde75bda434c9\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000134\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002290ea1538-43e8-4257-bd80-df3ccd1e5f27\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022410370182c9447a1a9ecde75bda434c9\u0022\u003EHon KRIS FAAFOI (Minister of Immigration):\u003C/span\u003E Last week, the Hon Damien O\u2019Connor and I announced that the Government has approved 2,000 experienced seasonal workers from the Pacific to travel to New Zealand to address labour shortages in the horticulture and wine-growing sectors during the peak season. They will begin arriving in January, following the Christmas rush of Kiwis returning home, and we expect these Recognised Seasonal Employer (RSE) workers will be fully onshore in time for the next year\u2019s harvest season. The Government has already announced measures to attract New Zealand job seekers, as the Hon Carmel Sepuloni has outlined. The Government has listened to the concerns raised by the sector and understands the importance of their sector for the COVID economic recovery. These changes will help support their ongoing success.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000135\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c2e823af-22b7-4411-8b12-14d7b43680ea\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002283e8cdf13c2f4680beb9fc24ec7a73b5\u0022\u003EJamie Strange\u003C/span\u003E: What were the considerations in coming to this decision?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000136\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002290ea1538-43e8-4257-bd80-df3ccd1e5f27\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002238983bcd96d545bf89a3547867b81ea1\u0022\u003EHon KRIS FAAFOI\u003C/span\u003E: The Government has been clear that its priority is protecting New Zealanders from COVID-19 while supporting New Zealand\u2019s economic recovery. This is why we have such a stringent quarantine system and control the numbers of people coming across the border. The intake of RSE workers is the largest group of economic exceptions to our closed border, which recognises the unique challenges that the horticulture and wine-growing sectors are facing in order to harvest what is expected to be a bumper crop. These will be experienced workers and as such they will be paid at least $22.10 per hour. This is also important for helping New Zealand\u2019s Pacific Island neighbours, whose economies have been hit hard by COVID-19, as their seasonal workers provide important remittances back to their homelands.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000137\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c2e823af-22b7-4411-8b12-14d7b43680ea\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00228f975b36fdda491da3d8fa63a065a0dd\u0022\u003EJamie Strange\u003C/span\u003E: How is the Government responding to calls from business for more economic border exceptions?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000138\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002290ea1538-43e8-4257-bd80-df3ccd1e5f27\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002243fa60e447874695a59660f76b0cafdb\u0022\u003EHon KRIS FAAFOI\u003C/span\u003E: Businesses have been very clear with the Government that they are facing difficulties in attracting workers. Where appropriate, we are prepared to listen to these calls and have granted exceptions for the likes of veterinarians, deep-water fishing crews, agricultural mobile plant operators, and shearers. We\u2019ve also approved over 5,000 individual essential worker applications where these workers have a skill set that is not readily obtainable in New Zealand. These are difficult times and we are willing to be pragmatic, but the border is our critical defence in keeping COVID out of New Zealand.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000139\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002250b2396c828b47788bdbbdb86dc2af35\u0022\u003EDavid Seymour\u003C/span\u003E: Why did the Government wait until crops such as strawberries and courgettes had rotted on the ground before letting these 2,000 RSE workers in?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000140\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002290ea1538-43e8-4257-bd80-df3ccd1e5f27\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00221fef9695ea1d4abea27b90ece7af4ecd\u0022\u003EHon KRIS FAAFOI\u003C/span\u003E: I disagree with the premise of the member\u2019s question. From the outset of our closure of our borders, we have been telling sectors that have traditionally relied on migrant labour that they have to come up with a different plan to meet the labour shortages that they are facing. We will continue to work with sectors like the horticulture and viticulture sector to make sure that their harvest grows. It might come as a surprise to the member, but the border is closed for a very good reason.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000141\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u0022e2bac20f17fa454c8595bf03f2d07dca\u0022\u003EQuestion 10\u2014Housing (Public Housing) \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022a68928ea-9dd8-4a30-8e2c-a0f49dfc8bea\u0022 data-id=\u0022b6dade8398804b5dbd81dfe7d1a576ad\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000142\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a68928ea-9dd8-4a30-8e2c-a0f49dfc8bea\u0022\u003E10. \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022b6dade8398804b5dbd81dfe7d1a576ad\u0022\u003EHon LOUISE UPSTON (National\u2014Taup\u014D)\u003C/span\u003E to the Associate Minister of Housing (Public Housing): What is the total number of applicants on the Social Housing Register and how does this compare to September 2017?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022c0e0c86e-e14d-4daa-9bc8-1b5a3d7defeb\u0022 data-id=\u002219f2f2774e094692a672a344c403e15a\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000143\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c0e0c86e-e14d-4daa-9bc8-1b5a3d7defeb\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002219f2f2774e094692a672a344c403e15a\u0022\u003EHon POTO WILLIAMS (Associate Minister of Housing (Public Housing)):\u003C/span\u003E Housing is and has been a top priority for the Labour Government. That\u2019s why Labour has pledged to build 18,000 public and transitional houses, and over the last three years we\u2019ve already delivered 6,000 public homes. The Government wants to make sure people in need get access to warm, safe accommodation and we\u2019ve encouraged people to come forward and ask for help. As of August 2020, there were 20,385 people on the housing register. In September 2017, there were 5,844.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000144\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a68928ea-9dd8-4a30-8e2c-a0f49dfc8bea\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022d581088847024e6fa8c37ac07eee910e\u0022\u003EHon Louise Upston\u003C/span\u003E: What does the Minister consider to be an acceptable number of people on the social housing register by September 2022?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000145\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c0e0c86e-e14d-4daa-9bc8-1b5a3d7defeb\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022d35e8b3721514d479b0fa60a20ecb82f\u0022\u003EHon POTO WILLIAMS\u003C/span\u003E: While I can\u2019t speak forward to those numbers, what I can say is that we want to make sure we get people in need into safe accommodation, and we will help and encourage people to come forward when they ask for help. This is one of the reasons\u2014one of the motivating factors\u2014behind the register increase.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000146\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a68928ea-9dd8-4a30-8e2c-a0f49dfc8bea\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022e915ebc84f8e42428f9369c11b3b5192\u0022\u003EHon Louise Upston\u003C/span\u003E: Does the Minister accept, if the number goes up, that it\u2019s a failure of this Government to support those who need housing?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000147\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c0e0c86e-e14d-4daa-9bc8-1b5a3d7defeb\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00223c7b72038d144664b2e5fa6f2dafd473\u0022\u003EHon POTO WILLIAMS\u003C/span\u003E: No, I do not accept that. What I do accept is that if the National Party in Government were to have built the numbers of houses that we are currently building\u20146,000 houses we have built already in the previous term\u2014then our housing register waiting list would not be as high as it is.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000148\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a68928ea-9dd8-4a30-8e2c-a0f49dfc8bea\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00226d38eb8708c44cc4bccc2e4a7df78f90\u0022\u003EHon Louise Upston\u003C/span\u003E: What is the Minister\u2019s response to Bernie Smith, who is the chief executive of the Monte Cecilia Housing Trust, who says if the wait-list continues to grow by over 6,000 per year, the Government \u201Caren\u2019t even meeting the growth in demand\u201D?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000149\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c0e0c86e-e14d-4daa-9bc8-1b5a3d7defeb\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022e05bfe6d16fb452ca1c26b96374e613a\u0022\u003EHon POTO WILLIAMS\u003C/span\u003E: The increase in the public housing wait-list shows that there is a community expectation on us to deliver\u2014and we are\u2014but the reality is that we are playing catch-up. Where National sold off State houses for nine long years, we are building them, and building them at pace.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000150\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a68928ea-9dd8-4a30-8e2c-a0f49dfc8bea\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002265ca930dfab64f13836e6ee4105e000e\u0022\u003EHon Louise Upston\u003C/span\u003E: What is the current median wait time for the over 20,000 people on the social housing register, and does she consider this acceptable?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000151\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c0e0c86e-e14d-4daa-9bc8-1b5a3d7defeb\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022e57d960867ba4377bd28530af2b1c17b\u0022\u003EHon POTO WILLIAMS\u003C/span\u003E: What I can tell the member is that the average time spent on the social housing register before someone is homed is 241 days. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000152\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u00220333d90c4353449d95630aee703c448f\u0022\u003EQuestion No. 11\u2014Workplace Relations and Safety\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022f677db8b-66c5-4794-953c-bdf7aa425710\u0022 data-id=\u00222858f56fe21a498a94cd158ca2ed58fe\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000153\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f677db8b-66c5-4794-953c-bdf7aa425710\u0022\u003E11. \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00222858f56fe21a498a94cd158ca2ed58fe\u0022\u003EMARJA LUBECK (Labour)\u003C/span\u003E to the Minister for Workplace Relations and Safety: How is the Government delivering on its commitment to increase minimum sick leave entitlements to 10 days a year?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022098b8334-57f8-4062-bac6-bfbc3474e88e\u0022 data-id=\u0022d56660465cb74967b6a710fc61566862\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000154\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022098b8334-57f8-4062-bac6-bfbc3474e88e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022d56660465cb74967b6a710fc61566862\u0022\u003EHon MICHAEL WOOD (Minister for Workplace Relations and Safety):\u003C/span\u003E We\u2019re delivering on our commitment by introducing a bill to increase minimum sick leave entitlements to 10 days a year to the House today. As promised, we\u2019ve introduced the bill before Christmas. It will go through a full select committee process. This will ensure that everyone can have their say on how we implement this important change. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000155\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f677db8b-66c5-4794-953c-bdf7aa425710\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002217fdf6fa43b44ad285a8490592626279\u0022\u003EMarja Lubeck\u003C/span\u003E: Why is increasing sick leave to 10 days important?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000156\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022098b8334-57f8-4062-bac6-bfbc3474e88e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00225c2d6432d17546f987ec51898d516a32\u0022\u003EHon MICHAEL WOOD\u003C/span\u003E: COVID-19 has shown it is important for people who are sick to stay at home. Increasing the statutory minimum will mean that more people who are sick have access to paid sick leave. We also know that businesses benefit. When their staff stay home when they\u2019re sick, it means that bugs don\u2019t spread, leading to fewer absences and increased productivity. [Interruption] They could do with some more productivity over there. We need to move past the \u201Ctough-it-out\u201D culture that risks infecting others. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000157\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f677db8b-66c5-4794-953c-bdf7aa425710\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022c1fbc74885cf45feb5c74edf80663789\u0022\u003EMarja Lubeck\u003C/span\u003E: Is the Minister considering any further changes to sick leave beyond those in the bill?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000158\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022098b8334-57f8-4062-bac6-bfbc3474e88e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00220211eb2be6224ef098752a794ff24d44\u0022\u003EHon MICHAEL WOOD\u003C/span\u003E: The Government has introduced and will refer to select committee a bill that adopts a straightforward approach to increasing sick leave entitlements from five days to 10 days per annum. We are open to considering further changes, and I intend to write to the select committee to request they consider issues that may be wider than the immediate scope of the bill, such as prorating the additional sick leave entitlement for part-time employees, providing some sick leave entitlement from the first day of employment for employees with an expectation of continuous employment, and changing the hours test for employees who do not initially have an expectation of continuous employment. We\u2019re looking forward to striking a good balance, and I also look forward to engaging with the committee and key stakeholders on this important bill.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000159\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f677db8b-66c5-4794-953c-bdf7aa425710\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022e9add9953a3347e48b30ae2d08349afa\u0022\u003EMarja Lubeck\u003C/span\u003E: What reports has he seen on this announcement?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000160\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022098b8334-57f8-4062-bac6-bfbc3474e88e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022031c98539c2f4f2f939b2127ce585317\u0022\u003EHon MICHAEL WOOD\u003C/span\u003E: Some very good reports. Richard Wagstaff from the New Zealand Council of Trade Unions has said that \u201CWorking people are welcoming [this] announcement.\u201D Kirk Hope from Business New Zealand said, \u201Cit\u2019s pretty difficult to disagree with the sentiment \u2026 if people\u201D\u2014[Interruption]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000161\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a0ceccc664f5447f9d03d9bea300af76\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Order! Order! Hang on. There\u2019s a certain predictable reaction from the first name. I would have thought the second might have got a bit more respect from my left. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000162\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002257e41e9d-285b-4fb3-847d-a63820ae7137\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002259c18c4ead74498693f353c8697df0ec\u0022\u003EChris Bishop\u003C/span\u003E: Didn\u2019t hear it.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000163\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022d5f2b38e65f5469a8ce03d7ad43fe2aa\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Well, that\u2019s because you were yelling.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000164\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022098b8334-57f8-4062-bac6-bfbc3474e88e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022b8577b412db44da997cf18e295b98e88\u0022\u003EHon MICHAEL WOOD\u003C/span\u003E: Mr Speaker, would you like me to begin again?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000165\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002237c7f39594124e818a2361603cd3cf5a\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: No, I think you can just start from Kirk Hope.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000166\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022098b8334-57f8-4062-bac6-bfbc3474e88e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00226a55edb39984417599c78d7174404b01\u0022\u003EHon MICHAEL WOOD\u003C/span\u003E: Kirk Hope from Business New Zealand said, \u201Cit\u2019s pretty difficult to disagree with the sentiment \u2026 if people are sick, they should stay at home\u201D, and \u201CThis will impact [half of] businesses not at all.\u201D Michael Barnett from the Auckland Chamber of Commerce said, \u201CIt\u2019s about wellbeing \u2026 [and] doing the right thing\u201D, and \u201CIf you manage [your sick leave] well, [that\u2019s] a positive for you.\u201D\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000167\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u0022f1ca0cbf04b14f988d03429e39d93e86\u0022\u003EQuestion No. 12\u2014Housing\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022f12da0af-dc73-4870-8f77-1d50a75eb44c\u0022 data-id=\u00223c56d8d42ef74bd8a80476367b330026\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000168\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f12da0af-dc73-4870-8f77-1d50a75eb44c\u0022\u003E12. \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00223c56d8d42ef74bd8a80476367b330026\u0022\u003ENICOLA WILLIS (National)\u003C/span\u003E to the Minister of Housing: Has the Government done enough to increase housing supply, and which new measures, if any, for boosting housing supply will she have up and running in the next six months?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002237a99b65-4919-4800-830d-3dd7c920d5cd\u0022 data-id=\u00227ce62a08f59d4b84bc753aaa2491a8c0\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000169\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002237a99b65-4919-4800-830d-3dd7c920d5cd\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00227ce62a08f59d4b84bc753aaa2491a8c0\u0022\u003EHon Dr MEGAN WOODS (Minister of Housing):\u003C/span\u003E In answer to the first part of the question, we have started work to boost housing supply, which has been an issue in the making for decades, but we are the first to acknowledge that the job is far from complete. So far, we have started work on the largest Government build programme since the 1970s, which will deliver more than 18,000 public and transitional houses by 2024. We\u2019ve passed the Urban Development Act and introduced the National Policy Statement on Urban Development. We\u2019ve boosted funding for housing infrastructure via the New Zealand Upgrade Programme and the COVID Response Fund, along with many other initiatives. In the coming months, I expect to announce further initiatives in the Government\u2019s progressive homeownership scheme, a public housing plan setting out locations for the additional 8,000 public and transitional houses funded through Budget 2020, and the roll-out of a $350 million fund to support the residential construction sector. I\u2019m also continuing to work with officials and colleagues on other matters relating to housing supply, and we\u2019ll have more to say in due course.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000170\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f12da0af-dc73-4870-8f77-1d50a75eb44c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00225ef1ccbc1110413b81cb7ab426c253cc\u0022\u003ENicola Willis\u003C/span\u003E: When will the Government deliver on the commitment to increase housing supply by removing the Auckland urban growth boundary?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000171\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002237a99b65-4919-4800-830d-3dd7c920d5cd\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022715051fb2da94994a22d086550045fcd\u0022\u003EHon Dr MEGAN WOODS\u003C/span\u003E: As the member well knows, there is a comprehensive body of work being carried out around issues around land supply. We have the work that is being led by my colleague, the Hon David Parker, around the repeal of the Resource Management Act. Added to that we also have the fast-track consenting process of the COVID fast-track consenting processes; added to that, the National Policy Statement on Urban Development. There are a number of measures under way to make sure that we are freeing up land for development.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000172\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f12da0af-dc73-4870-8f77-1d50a75eb44c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022f5aacbf00d04400f9205cb18dbff167d\u0022\u003ENicola Willis\u003C/span\u003E: Well, will the Minister consider boosting housing development in our major cities by bringing forward the deadlines in the National Policy Statement on Urban Development?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000173\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002237a99b65-4919-4800-830d-3dd7c920d5cd\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002250d0eb83ba6941218cd343262327eee1\u0022\u003EHon Dr MEGAN WOODS\u003C/span\u003E: As a Government, we are examining a range of measures that can boost supply. But I would point to the fact that the COVID fast-track consenting process is providing a way through for a number of housing developments, many of them in Auckland.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000174\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f12da0af-dc73-4870-8f77-1d50a75eb44c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022c733568e17184bd08222f50087d59e8c\u0022\u003ENicola Willis\u003C/span\u003E: Is it correct that only 652 new KiwiBuild houses have been built, 4 percent, of the 16,000 target, and how many KiwiBuild houses will be built next year?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000175\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002237a99b65-4919-4800-830d-3dd7c920d5cd\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022591d2dfb2d44415890107d48f6a85d50\u0022\u003EHon Dr MEGAN WOODS\u003C/span\u003E: I think the number of KiwiBuild houses built has been a very well-traversed number, and I can confirm from the latest dashboard that is available on the ministry\u2019s website that, indeed, 652 have been built. There are a further 916 under construction and the KiwiBuild and K\u0101inga Ora developments have resulted in 1,573 market houses being enabled with another 438 houses being announced. I will put those numbers against the 100 affordable homes delivered by the National Party when last in Government, through the special housing areas, over a period of nine years.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000176\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f12da0af-dc73-4870-8f77-1d50a75eb44c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022e7b6127b6df44a4ab9854c555f2d3662\u0022\u003ENicola Willis\u003C/span\u003E: What additional measures will the Minister consider to help community housing providers get the finance they need to start shovel-ready plans for new housing development?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000177\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002237a99b65-4919-4800-830d-3dd7c920d5cd\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022e36b65e908894e0c8289cb6bb11282c6\u0022\u003EHon Dr MEGAN WOODS\u003C/span\u003E: One of the initiatives that we have started with the community housing providers is entering into long-term contracts with them so they can have the certainty around finance raising. We now have the ability to contract up to 25 years and many of our community housing providers are taking this up. This is an innovative way that we are supporting the community housing sector. I do note that when something is measured as a proportion of a number, the bigger the number of the commitment and that is funded through the income-related rental subsidy, the more community houses that can be built.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000178\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002237a99b65-4919-4800-830d-3dd7c920d5cd\u0022\u003E\u003Cbr\u003E\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n    \u003C/div\u003E\n    \u003Cdiv class=\u0022HpsHansard\u0022\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000179\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsProceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u002216b92c283b5d4104a83f972ac42c169a\u0022\u003EAddress in Reply\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000181\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u00226dddcf3251ea41879fb72eb0e4e5be14\u0022\u003EAddress in Reply\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000180\u0022\u003EDebate resumed from 26 November.\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022 data-id=\u0022c91dcc4e9fde416fa21a56f8a9d09808\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000182\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022c91dcc4e9fde416fa21a56f8a9d09808\u0022\u003EHon GRANT ROBERTSON (Deputy Prime Minister):\u003C/span\u003E It gives me great pleasure to rise in this debate. Before I return to the Address in Reply specifically, I do just want to note that on this side of the House we stand proudly behind our Minister of Housing and the development of housing supply. This is a Government that built more houses than any other Government since the 1970s. This is a Government that on coming into office turned around a policy that saw, in the middle of a housing crisis, the mass sale of State houses. That was their response; it was a housing crisis and they decided to sell houses. As the Minister has already said today, if the previous Government had been building State houses at the rate that this Government has been building them, there wouldn\u2019t be a waiting list. So if the members on the other side of the House want to look at the reason for our housing crisis, look in the mirror.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000183\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003EWhen the Prime Minister stood in the House last week to respond to the Address in Reply debate, she made clear that New Zealand and the New Zealand Government had three priorities from here. The first of those is to keep New Zealanders safe from COVID19. On that score, every member of this House, I am sure, would join me in thanking all 5 million New Zealanders, because while the Government can lay out a plan and a strategy for what we need to do, that only works if every New Zealander buys into it. That is something that has been quite unique about New Zealand\u2019s response to COVID19: that New Zealanders have got in behind the strategy and they\u2019ve stuck with it. They saw a Government that had a plan and stuck with it, didn\u2019t flip-flop about what it wanted, didn\u2019t change its mind about alert levels; it stuck to the plan and New Zealanders backed that, and I am very grateful to them for that. So, from here, it is a matter of the Government continuing that strategy on. The elimination strategy is built on multiple lines of defence.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000184\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003EWhile I\u2019m on the subject of congratulations, I want to say \u201Cthank you\u201D to those who work in our managed isolation and quarantine facilities. This is a very, very difficult job under trying circumstances. Many of them have had to put on hold critical parts of their lives, the work they do in communities, and the time they spend with their families. We have to be very grateful for them. In return, along with that gratitude, we will continue to strengthen what we do at the border: our testing regimes, our infection control mechanisms, and the staffing that we provide there. Also is the work that we do on contact tracing and surveillance testing; all of that has gone well and all of that must continue.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000185\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003EBut what we do want to focus on as we move forward is the ability to deliver a free and effective vaccine to New Zealanders\u2014and, as was traversed in question time today, a lot of work has gone into that. It will be something that will happen over time. We will need to prioritise our health workers. There will be population groups that we have to give that to first. But New Zealand is in a strong position to do this because of the response that we have taken to now.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000186\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003EWe said from day one that the best economic response was a strong public health response, and that has proved to be true. Earlier in question time I ran through some of the economic data. Exports are doing well. Retail sales are up. All of that is possible because we took a strong public health response, because people can be back out in the community spending. Businesses know that; they are working alongside the communities to make sure that jobs are maintained and retained. That will be critical to any recovery. On this side of the House, we will always put people first in New Zealand when it comes to the way that we run our economy.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000187\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003EOur job now is to accelerate that recovery. We\u2019ve done well but we can do better. We also have to acknowledge that there are some people who have lost their jobs, and some communities who are still struggling. We will be alongside them at every step of the way. That comes from investing in our people.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000188\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003EMinister Hipkins has already mentioned today the success of the initiative around apprenticeships. We were never going to repeat the mistake of the previous Government in the wake of the global financial crisis, because what they did then was stand on the sidelines and let apprentices be laid off in business after business. Not only did that affect those people, it also meant that when the recovery came we didn\u2019t have the skilled workforce we needed to actually be able to build the houses and build up the businesses that we need. So that\u2019s why we made apprenticeships free. That\u2019s why we\u2019ve invested in trade training. To hear about the thousands of New Zealanders taking that up warms my heart, and I want to that Minister Hipkins for advocating for that so early on in the piece.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000189\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003EIn addition to that, we will be taking measures to support people into work, including the return of the training incentive allowance for those degree courses. On this side of the House, we will never pull the ladder up behind us, and that\u2019s what we saw over there when the training incentive allowance disappeared last time. We want every New Zealander to be part of this economic recovery. We have got a comprehensive plan of investment there. These numbers can sometimes be mind-boggling, especially for a Minister of Finance: $42 billion going into infrastructure over the next few years to futureproof our economy and create jobs. That\u2019s $9.6 billion for Waka Kotahi, the New Zealand Transport Agency; $3.8 billion on those education facilities that were left out of the plans of the previous Government. The same in our hospitals as well; we are making sure there are facilities being built right across New Zealand, along with the work that K\u0101inga Ora is doing, as the Minister has already said today, to deliver 18,000 public and transitional homes. This is about making sure that the policies that we enact not only accelerate our economic recovery but also start to address some of the long-term issues that New Zealand has. This is the opportunity for us to build back better.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000190\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003EPart of building back better is another part of our economic plan, and that is the preparation for a low-carbon economy. We can bring forward the 100 percent renewable electricity target for 2030. We will prohibit the building of new thermal baseload electricity. We will get those dry year storage options, such as pumped hydro, up. We will get green hydrogen going. On this side of the House, it\u2019s not some kind of \u201Cor\u201D when it comes to the environment and the economy; it\u2019s an \u201Cand\u201D. We only get a strong economy if we have a sustainable environment, and we will address those issues.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000191\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003EWe will continue to back our small businesses. Again I want to give credit to the way that small businesses have dealt with the COVID-19 pandemic. They\u2019ve pivoted, they\u2019ve been innovative, and they\u2019ve been supported by a Government that has got alongside them with the wage subsidy scheme and with the small business cash-flow scheme. On the other side of the House, they like to undermine things like the way we\u2019re going to regulate merchant service fees. All that does is show how out of touch they are with small business, because every member on this side of the House knows that when we went around in the election campaign and you mentioned that policy, retailers\u2019 eyes lit up because they knew that they were being ripped off, and we\u2019re going to do something about it.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000192\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003EAlongside all of this, we can\u2019t forget our position in the world. I want to give credit to both the current and former Ministers of Trade for the work that they\u2019ve done to get us into a position now where we have the Regional Comprehensive Economic Partnership being signed, we\u2019ve made progress in our upgrade of the China free-trade agreement, we\u2019re working on the EU and UK deals that we see in the future, but we\u2019re also out there in the world supporting our businesses to make sure they can get profitable and get more business in an era where they need to be in the digital space much more often. So we\u2019ve put an extra quarter of a billion dollars into New Zealand Trade and Enterprise to be able to support all of that.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000193\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003EBut none of that takes away from the issues that New Zealand was facing before COVID-19 arrived, around issues of climate change, of child poverty, and of housing. We must and we will be taking further action in those areas.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000194\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003EWhen it comes to child poverty, we all know that the Government that Jacinda Ardern leads will put that at the centre of what we do. What we also know is that the statistics that have been thrown up by the National Party over the last couple of years are actually about when they were in Government. When we see the full impact of the Families Package on those child poverty numbers, we know that that\u2019s lifting hundreds of thousands of families out of poverty. We know that the winter energy payment has made sure not only that our low-income people have been able to keep warm but also that our older New Zealanders have as well. The dignity that is offered to New Zealanders by that should never be underestimated by a National Party who opposed all of that.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000195\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003ESo we have a strong plan. We have a five-point economic plan that we are rolling out. We are focused on the long-term issues that have bedevilled New Zealand for so long. But as the Prime Minister says, it\u2019s also about the way we work. This will be a Government that is marked out by the way we continue to improve M\u0101ori Crown relations and by the way that we support one another across all parts of Government to be able to improve the wellbeing and the living standards of New Zealand. I believe the agenda of this Government is something to be extremely proud of; it will change New Zealanders\u2019 lives for the better; and it will ensure that we keep our people safe, we accelerate our recovery, and we make sure that we build the foundations for a strong and prosperous future for all New Zealanders.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022 data-id=\u0022d43b13ab01eb4614b8390ae90613477d\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000196\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022d43b13ab01eb4614b8390ae90613477d\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Andrew Bayly\u2014a five-minute call.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022859e13f9-33bb-41bb-b2f0-d848eaf25407\u0022 data-id=\u00225c2259baad1448a2a45c942bf8144229\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000197\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022859e13f9-33bb-41bb-b2f0-d848eaf25407\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00225c2259baad1448a2a45c942bf8144229\u0022\u003EANDREW BAYLY (National\u2014Port Waikato):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, and, first of all, I\u2019d like to acknowledge you reassuming the Chair, Mr Speaker; the Deputy, and of course, the Assistant Speakers\u2014with our very own Jacqui Dean. I would also like to acknowledge all the new MPs\u2014particularly the five from National\u2014a great intake. Also, to all the returning MPs to the House, great to see you back here today. I just wanted to congratulate the Government. You have won a resounding victory and you now have a massive majority\u2014but that means there are no excuses now. Not even with the Greens tidily tucked away over here, just on the sidelines. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000198\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022859e13f9-33bb-41bb-b2f0-d848eaf25407\u0022\u003EThe nation was gripped, waiting for the Speech from the Throne. We waited, we have waited, and the question that I\u2019ve got to ask: what are the big new initiatives that this Government wants to do over the next three years? With all these new Ministers, with all the ambitions that they\u2019ve got, where is the driving transformational change that they want to bring about in the next three years? When you looked at what the Prime Minister announced so proudly in 2017, she said lovely things: \u201CThis will be a Government of inclusion. This will be a Government of transformation. This will be a Government of aspiration.\u201D But what has happened to the Government of 2020?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000199\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022859e13f9-33bb-41bb-b2f0-d848eaf25407\u0022\u003ETo me, it appears to be playing safe. We know the game. No doubt the Prime Minister\u2019s already said to the Deputy Prime Minister: \u201CGrant, stick in the middle, do not scare people, and let\u2019s keep talking about COVID\u2014because that means we don\u2019t need to justify much. It doesn\u2019t mean that we have to go out and do a whole lot of stuff.\u201D Well, I say to you, let us not be shaped by COVID. Instead, let us use COVID as a platform for growth and change. This raises the wider issue: where is the vision for this term, for this new Government? We are in the grips of the largest economic crisis for some time, for so very long. We\u2019ve seen our debt go from $60 billion to just under $100 billion, and it\u2019s going to double again to $200 billion. We need leadership. We also need a clear vision. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000200\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022859e13f9-33bb-41bb-b2f0-d848eaf25407\u0022\u003EThe speech was full of slogans. I love this one: \u201CRelentlessly pursuing progress.\u201D And the other one, \u201CWe must continue to tackle these issues, at gathering scale, at gathering speed, and with gathering effect.\u201D It\u2019s almost Churchillian. Visionary words, but where are the actions? Where is the vision? How do we get out of this financial mess? This Government is focused on making some tax changes. In fact, we\u2019ve got a bill coming through today which is going to seek to capture $550 million a year. It is tinkering at the edges. What is required is an economic strategy that assists our businesses to employ more people, to want to grow, and to want to take a risk. But what was in the Budget? Not much. A bit of training and a few other initiatives, but for our smaller businesses a nasty, nasty surprise\u2014another five days\u2019 sick leave, which they will have to pay; increase in the minimum wage, which they will have to pay. No doubt with our ex - trade unionist Minister now running the employment law, we will see further changes to that.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000201\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022859e13f9-33bb-41bb-b2f0-d848eaf25407\u0022\u003EThe question is: where is the vision? I think, with a country that\u2019s piling on debt at $110 million a day, New Zealand has an issue, it has problems. What people don\u2019t even realise is that we\u2019re borrowing to pay for the interest. This is not a recipe for success. I welcome the opportunity for initiatives around trade deals, but with gathering scale, with gathering speed, and with gathering effect, we have a train wreck coming towards us in terms of a housing crisis and in terms of an economic crisis. We need a plan and vision.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022a434482b-7ac1-4862-9ce7-13e63289dee3\u0022 data-id=\u0022cadb61d03d8b4054927a819e6d408ce1\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000202\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a434482b-7ac1-4862-9ce7-13e63289dee3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022cadb61d03d8b4054927a819e6d408ce1\u0022\u003EDEPUTY SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: I call the Hon Michael Woodhouse, five minutes.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022c83012b4-3939-4753-80fc-1956a3e2bd1e\u0022 data-id=\u002217a6e3455f4d47b6975334b4594b5af0\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000203\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c83012b4-3939-4753-80fc-1956a3e2bd1e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002217a6e3455f4d47b6975334b4594b5af0\u0022\u003EHon MICHAEL WOODHOUSE (National):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Mr Speaker, and I\u2019d like to add my congratulations to you and your fellow presiding officers on your election. A welcome to all new MPs arriving into the 53rd Parliament and my congratulations to the Government for the very strong mandate that they have.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000204\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c83012b4-3939-4753-80fc-1956a3e2bd1e\u0022\u003EI was reflecting on the comments from the Hon Carmel Sepuloni who also, on last Thursday in this debate, talked about the departing MPs and, in particular, those that weren\u2019t planning to depart. It was a very empathetic comment\u2014she has been there before\u2014but I was quite connected, I think, to her comment that there was \u201Cno time for sad faces.\u201D\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000205\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c83012b4-3939-4753-80fc-1956a3e2bd1e\u0022\u003EShe also rebuked David Seymour for his comments\u2014criticisms, I guess, of the Prime Minister for what he called \u201Cslogans\u201D, and she said, \u201CWell, I don\u2019t call kindness a slogan, actually, I think that we should be proud that as a country, as a party, that kindness is part of people\u2019s everyday language now.\u201D I kind of agree with that, but I\u2019ve got a different definition of \u201Ckindness\u201D, because she was talking about words of kindness, but for me kindness is a verb; it\u2019s an act. We talk about acts of kindness. The opposite of an act is inaction and, sadly, we have seen too much inaction\u2014lots of words, but too much inaction. Promises made but not delivered on. When a Government talks about child poverty but doesn\u2019t actually take the steps to alleviate it, when it implements policies around employment and housing that actually make things worse, that\u2019s not kindness. When it talks about housing prices as a crisis, but actually throws fuel on the fire of runaway house price inflation, that\u2019s not kindness. And when it talks about\u2014for nine years it bagged the previous National Government for its actions in the health sector and then spends three years overseeing dramatically reducing elective surgery, lowering immunisation rates, longer elective surgery waiting times, and cancer treatment, that is a disgrace. That is not kindness.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000206\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c83012b4-3939-4753-80fc-1956a3e2bd1e\u0022\u003EI accept, as the Government says\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000207\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f317ee7d-f040-44ec-8f2f-ad0a9f206d75\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002299a0839db665460bb23d8b035d7f9ec3\u0022\u003EHon Willie Jackson\u003C/span\u003E: No one likes you.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000208\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c83012b4-3939-4753-80fc-1956a3e2bd1e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022eda6bc8ec9c4428d8e800c917232db01\u0022\u003EHon MICHAEL WOODHOUSE\u003C/span\u003E: \u2014that it cannot do everything\u2014oh, Mr Jackson, come up with a better retort than that. When it cannot do everything in three years, I accept that. But one would\u2019ve expected at least a holding pattern, not the backsliding that we have seen in some key statistics. The fact that 4,100 more children are living in material hardship, the fact that there are 12,000 emergency housing special needs grants now being pushed out every month, that the State house waiting list is now over 20,000\u2014a fourfold increase on what they inherited.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000209\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c83012b4-3939-4753-80fc-1956a3e2bd1e\u0022\u003EThe Minister of Finance has just told us what they\u2019ve spent three years telling, and what I would\u2019ve thought, after three years and a significantly increased mandate, they would stop doing. They were saying: \u201CIt\u2019s the National Party\u2019s fault.\u201D Well, guess what? With the mandate they\u2019ve got, the time they\u2019ve had, the promises they\u2019ve made\u2014to be kind\u2014it\u2019s time for this Government to step up\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000210\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022861a1798-a396-4a6c-b9e2-7d2f15d4a001\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022c970c5fda60d4939a9f1d473ed2f72d9\u0022\u003EDr Shane Reti\u003C/span\u003E: Own it.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000211\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c83012b4-3939-4753-80fc-1956a3e2bd1e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022442fcca4522e45bda9f5e8c71c47dc3f\u0022\u003EHon MICHAEL WOODHOUSE\u003C/span\u003E: \u2014and either fix it or own, absolutely right, Dr Reti.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000212\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c83012b4-3939-4753-80fc-1956a3e2bd1e\u0022\u003EThere\u2019s another group that we need to be kind to, and it\u2019s our future generations, because we are saddling them with an eye-watering amount of debt that needs to be repaid. I\u2019ll be long gone\u2014certainly from this House and probably from this Earth\u2014before we even start to make inroads into that. Why? Because this Government does what it does best; it spends. It has a policy of spending more in the good times, because we\u2019ve got more to spend. It has a policy of spending in the tough times because we have to pump-prime the economy. It is the world champion Government of spending. It prints money so it can spend it. But what wasn\u2019t in the Speech from the Throne was anything like a plan for earning it. Governments don\u2019t earn money, they take it off the people who do, and there is an absolute dearth of plans in here to encourage the innovation, the entrepreneurialism, and the sheer hard work of Kiwis to go out and earn the income that the Government then taxes, and that\u2019s the biggest disappointment. So much talk\u2014so much talk about kindness\u2014but very little action.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022a434482b-7ac1-4862-9ce7-13e63289dee3\u0022 data-id=\u0022580d215bcdbf4b5783c06465cbad9ed9\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000213\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a434482b-7ac1-4862-9ce7-13e63289dee3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022580d215bcdbf4b5783c06465cbad9ed9\u0022\u003EDEPUTY SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: This is a split call. I call Willow-Jean Prime\u2014five minutes.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00221ebd1031-ea10-4c3d-bb56-2cd99528ae91\u0022 data-id=\u0022bd70f544ddf94bfc8b2b9d7dbd6da504\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000214\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221ebd1031-ea10-4c3d-bb56-2cd99528ae91\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022bd70f544ddf94bfc8b2b9d7dbd6da504\u0022\u003EWILLOW-JEAN PRIME (Labour\u2014Northland):\u003C/span\u003E T\u0113n\u0101 koe e te M\u0101ngai o te Whare. Tuatahi, m\u0101ku e mihi kau ana ki a koe m\u014D t\u014D t\u016Branga h\u014Du. N\u014D reira, t\u0113n\u0101 koe. Otir\u0101, t\u0113n\u0101 t\u0101tou katoa. Ng\u0101 mihi nui ki a koutou katoa ng\u0101 mema P\u0101remata i roto i t\u0113nei Whare. Ka nui te mihi ki a koutou.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000215\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221ebd1031-ea10-4c3d-bb56-2cd99528ae91\u0022\u003E[Greetings, Mr Deputy Speaker. Firstly, I would like to acknowledge your new role. Congratulations. Greetings to everyone. I would like to acknowledge all of the members of Parliament in this House today. Warm greetings to you all.]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000216\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221ebd1031-ea10-4c3d-bb56-2cd99528ae91\u0022\u003EMr Deputy Speaker, congratulations on your appointment to your new role. Welcome to everybody here in the House, the members of Parliament. As this is my first time speaking as the new MP for Northland, I do want to take the opportunity to thank Northland. I am humbled by their support to be the MP for Northland, and it is an absolute honour and privilege. I also want to acknowledge all New Zealanders who voted for this Government. We are humbled to be the first majority Government under MMP in New Zealand. New Zealanders voted for stability and certainty at the election. We know it is a COVID election, and we know that this comes with huge responsibility. In the middle of a global pandemic, New Zealanders have put their trust in us to make sure that we continue to protect the lives and livelihoods of New Zealanders.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000217\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221ebd1031-ea10-4c3d-bb56-2cd99528ae91\u0022\u003EI want to reflect on the speech just prior to mine, where there was a reference made to how we are going to pay for the borrowing that we are doing. If the member had listened to the Speech from the Throne, he would\u2019ve heard that we have three overarching objectives, and in there, in accelerating our economic recovery, there is a significant spend on infrastructure investment, which is deliberately to create jobs. Those people who will remain in employment will in turn be paying taxes, which will continue to accelerate our economic recovery. So how they cannot connect those dots I don\u2019t understand.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000218\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221ebd1031-ea10-4c3d-bb56-2cd99528ae91\u0022\u003EBut if I can say, our three overarching objectives from the Speech from the Throne and the Prime Minister\u2019s Address in Reply speech were to keep New Zealanders safe from COVID-19. Thank you to the team of 5 million for the work that we have done so far. If I can just say, as we head into the Christmas period and the summer holidays, if everybody can continue to remain vigilant, continue to do the contact tracing, use the apps, continue to stay home if you are sick to protect your loved ones, because we have already done so much work. Our teams at the borders are doing a phenomenal job, constantly adapting to the new challenges being presented, and because of that we are able to now bring more people into the country to support in other areas. So continue to keep New Zealanders safe.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000219\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221ebd1031-ea10-4c3d-bb56-2cd99528ae91\u0022\u003ESecondly, to accelerate our economic recovery with a real focus on investing in important infrastructure for our future and the ability to build back better, we have a five-point economic recovery plan which focuses on jobs and people, positioning us globally but also laying the foundations for a better future. In terms of that, I want to talk about laying the foundations for a better future. Wellbeing will continue to be the priority for the Government this term, with a focus on reducing child poverty, tackling climate change, and addressing the housing crisis. In laying foundations in these areas, we will be guided by our values and by our commitment to the wellbeing of our people, looking beyond GDP as a measure of success.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000220\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221ebd1031-ea10-4c3d-bb56-2cd99528ae91\u0022\u003EI want to highlight child poverty, an issue that is very dear to the Prime Minister\u2019s heart, also dear to mine and, I\u2019m sure, others in this House. We have said in the Speech from the Throne that we will continue to overhaul the welfare system, that we will extend the free and healthy lunch programme to cover over 200 students, that we will improve access to free oral health care for our children and young people by adding an additional 20 mobile dental clinics, including into rural areas like Northland. We will roll out mental health support to our primary and intermediate students and continue to roll out nurses in secondary schools.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000221\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221ebd1031-ea10-4c3d-bb56-2cd99528ae91\u0022\u003EFinally, in the short time that I have left, I want to say what a huge honour and privilege it is to be the co-chair of the largest M\u0101ori caucus within the Labour Party. We will continue to strengthen M\u0101ori-Crown relationships and ensure that the Crown is a better Treaty partner. With 15 members in our caucus\u2014six Ministers, five in Cabinet, one under-secretary, and a number of members available to be on all of the select committees\u2014we know there is a huge expectation and obligation on us from Te Ao M\u0101ori to deliver for Te Ao M\u0101ori, and that is something that as a M\u0101ori caucus, we feel that weight of expectation and we are absolutely committed to giving it our all to ensure that we deliver outcomes for our people. Kia ora.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022f317ee7d-f040-44ec-8f2f-ad0a9f206d75\u0022 data-id=\u002202697e7cc59b4a14a93021697bcb5ad6\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000222\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f317ee7d-f040-44ec-8f2f-ad0a9f206d75\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002202697e7cc59b4a14a93021697bcb5ad6\u0022\u003EHon WILLIE JACKSON (Minister for M\u0101ori Development):\u003C/span\u003E Kia ora, Mr Speaker. Tuatahi, e tika me mihi ki t\u014D t\u0101tou hoa, t\u014D t\u0101tou rangatira, Rudy Taylor. N\u014D reira e te hoa e maumahara t\u014D kaha ki te k\u014Dkiri i ng\u0101 kaupapa m\u014D t\u0101 m\u0101tou k\u0101hui M\u0101ori i ng\u0101 w\u0101 katoa. N\u014D reira e te hoa, moe mai, moe mai, moe mai r\u0101.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000223\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f317ee7d-f040-44ec-8f2f-ad0a9f206d75\u0022\u003EKa nui t\u0113n\u0101. Ki a koutou ng\u0101 mema h\u014Du kua tae mai nei i t\u0113nei r\u0101. Ko t\u0113nei te tino h\u014Dnore ki te mihi ki a koutou. T\u0113n\u0101 koutou, t\u0113n\u0101 an\u014D t\u0101tou katoa.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000224\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f317ee7d-f040-44ec-8f2f-ad0a9f206d75\u0022\u003E[Firstly, it is only right that I acknowledge our friend, our distinguished elder, Rudy Taylor. My friend, I will always remember your endless strength and determination in supporting the M\u0101ori caucus. Rest in peace my friend, rest in peace.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000225\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f317ee7d-f040-44ec-8f2f-ad0a9f206d75\u0022\u003EI will leave that there. To all the new members who have arrived today, it is my great honour to congratulate you all. Greetings to one and all.]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000226\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f317ee7d-f040-44ec-8f2f-ad0a9f206d75\u0022\u003EI was reminded by our chief whip here that I have to be courteous today because this is the first day, so I wanted to welcome all the new members of all the parties, including the National Party\u2014the very reduced, de-juiced, depleted, and depressed National Party. I wish them all the best for the next three years because they\u2019re going to need a bit of luck. And Mr Seymour, who somehow brought 10 people or nine people in with him, well done. Well done to him too\u2014shame he\u2019s on the wrong side of the House. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000227\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f317ee7d-f040-44ec-8f2f-ad0a9f206d75\u0022\u003EThe Speech from the Throne is very clear about our priorities. And our economic plan is perfect for the nation and particularly the M\u0101ori nation. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000228\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002211bda13e96974e038bdb781db4283a42\u0022\u003EDavid Seymour\u003C/span\u003E: Tell us about it.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000229\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f317ee7d-f040-44ec-8f2f-ad0a9f206d75\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00225b779336263243b49eab984f106c9d15\u0022\u003EHon WILLIE JACKSON\u003C/span\u003E: I\u2019m glad you\u2019re listening, Mr Seymour. We prioritise health\u2014the health of New Zealanders who responded to COVID-19. We knew that the best economic response was to protect Kiwis and now we must focus on the economic recovery. And I think the $42 billion investment in infrastructure over the next four years will see\u2014will see the country thriving because we\u2019re going to see and we\u2019re going to have a boost in terms of hospitals. We\u2019re going to have a boost in terms of transport. We\u2019re going to have a boost in terms of our economy. Housing is obviously going to be boosted; but, particularly, in the area of jobs where we have free apprenticeships and training, we\u2019re going to see a boost like we haven\u2019t seen in previous years. The $42 billion will ensure the right type of future for this country and, of course, for the M\u0101ori nation who will benefit hugely off that investment. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000230\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f317ee7d-f040-44ec-8f2f-ad0a9f206d75\u0022\u003EIt will add to our by M\u0101ori for M\u0101ori strategies that have been successful so far. What have those strategies been: M\u0101ori trade training\u2014something very dear to our people, something that\u2019s been invested in in terms of $50 million. As the Prime Minister said, we will continue going down the track. He Poutama Rangatahi\u2014another investment from this Government. What we know is at the coalface, if you get behind some of these young people, if you give them an opportunity, you can change their lives. We\u2019ve been able to do that through Mana in Mahi, through He Poutama Rangatahi, and we\u2019ve been able to do that through M\u0101ori trade training. This Government will invest with iwi, will invest with M\u0101ori organisations in terms of the future of this country, and we\u2019ll see firsthand what opportunity can do for young ones. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000231\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f317ee7d-f040-44ec-8f2f-ad0a9f206d75\u0022\u003EWe\u2019re a Government, I think, who have been brave and courageous in terms of M\u0101ori. Never before have you seen a Government, whether it\u2019s National or Labour, invest in M\u0101ori the way that we have. We had record investment in terms of the Budget, but we also went down the oil and gas exploration side and we\u2019re committed to stopping that. We\u2019re going down the Matariki side in terms of a national holiday. Where before would you have had a M\u0101ori kaupapa right out at the forefront? We\u2019re going to go down and we\u2019re going to resolve the Ihum\u0101tao kaupapa\u2014something that was totally stuffed up by the Opposition and, sadly, by the M\u0101ori Party. We\u2019re committed to resolving Ihum\u0101tao. This is a brave and courageous Government.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000232\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f317ee7d-f040-44ec-8f2f-ad0a9f206d75\u0022\u003EWe\u2019re committed to investing in Wh\u0101nau Ora\u2014something again that was sidelined by the previous Government. In M\u0101ori broadcasting, also\u2014an integral part of M\u0101ori development\u2014you will see a whole new vehicle in terms of M\u0101ori broadcasting. And today I want to salute the Stuff people who have apologised to the M\u0101ori nation for their disgraceful and historic writing that has been very biased and very prejudiced and racist against M\u0101ori. That balance is what we want to do in M\u0101ori broadcasting too, in terms of giving M\u0101ori a voice in that area. This Government is committed to balancing things up, but well done to Stuff. It would be great if Mike Hosking and the New Zealand Herald and the other friends of David Seymour also gave an apology so that M\u0101ori can get a say in society.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000233\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f317ee7d-f040-44ec-8f2f-ad0a9f206d75\u0022\u003EBut in summary, we are committed to change with this Government. Kia ora.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022a434482b-7ac1-4862-9ce7-13e63289dee3\u0022 data-id=\u002217ab32f461054f03b93e1409f96a7947\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000234\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a434482b-7ac1-4862-9ce7-13e63289dee3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002217ab32f461054f03b93e1409f96a7947\u0022\u003EDEPUTY SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Order! The member\u2019s time has expired.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00227c215736-b512-41de-8f0c-6c5543fcfce7\u0022 data-id=\u0022f38a0b2f8db64e64b9ffc6024d6f4b67\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000235\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227c215736-b512-41de-8f0c-6c5543fcfce7\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022f38a0b2f8db64e64b9ffc6024d6f4b67\u0022\u003EHon JAMES SHAW (Co-Leader\u2014Green):\u003C/span\u003E T\u0113n\u0101 koe, Mr Assistant Speaker. I would like to start by congratulating you on your reappointment as an Assistant Speaker for the coming term. I\u2019ve thoroughly enjoyed the work\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000236\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022977cccaf-581d-4f48-924e-32bf6c54a93d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002296ea3679883a4520af3d62ba4955e64d\u0022\u003EDEPUTY SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Deputy Speaker.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000237\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227c215736-b512-41de-8f0c-6c5543fcfce7\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022082a3125565c4492bb5d20b8304b7331\u0022\u003EHon JAMES SHAW\u003C/span\u003E: The Deputy Speaker. I beg your pardon. See? We\u2019re off to a good start already! The firm and guiding hand that you gave us in the last term\u2014I\u2019m looking forward to more of that. I\u2019d also like to congratulate the other Assistant Speakers and, of course, the Speaker himself. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000238\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227c215736-b512-41de-8f0c-6c5543fcfce7\u0022\u003EI would also like to take a moment to congratulate those new members of Parliament who have joined us here in the Chamber for the coming term. No matter which party you\u2019re from, it is a great honour to serve in this House. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000239\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227c215736-b512-41de-8f0c-6c5543fcfce7\u0022\u003EI would like to say I am delighted that three of those new members, of course, are members of the Green Party. The first time that we have managed to expand the size of our caucus in the last 10 years, since 2011; the first time, actually, that we\u2019ve won an electorate seat since 1999, so 21 years; and the first support party in the history of MMP who started at the beginning of a term of Government above the 5 percent threshold and also finished the end of that term above the 5 percent threshold\u2014in fact, in this case, actually increased our support. So, for us, it was a hugely successful election.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000240\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227c215736-b512-41de-8f0c-6c5543fcfce7\u0022\u003EObviously, our success was slightly overshadowed by our friends and colleagues in the Labour Party, who did astonishingly well, and I would like to congratulate the Labour Party for, again, an historical win under MMP at this election and the vast numbers of new MPs who have joined us in the Labour Party. I would like to say, \u201COf those to whom much is given, much is expected.\u201D \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000241\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dbaac12b-3efa-4d95-a08d-f0f637a48bab\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022c3fa530bc4834b88886ee01b4db301a6\u0022\u003EChl\u00F6e Swarbrick\u003C/span\u003E: Let\u2019s do this.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000242\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227c215736-b512-41de-8f0c-6c5543fcfce7\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022801ce96f370e404089f520cb6c36ff3c\u0022\u003EHon JAMES SHAW\u003C/span\u003E: So, given that\u2014let\u2019s do this, even more, even faster, even further. Let\u2019s do more of this, to coin a phrase. So congratulations to you on joining. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000243\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227c215736-b512-41de-8f0c-6c5543fcfce7\u0022\u003ENow, I\u2019d like to get into the debate, the Address in Reply and the Speech from the Throne, by picking up on some of the points that were made by the Hon Michael Woodhouse in his earlier contribution, where he pulled out a bunch of Thatcherite slogans and threw them around completely devoid of meaning. I mean, one of the reasons that we were very proud of our, kind of, low deficits and our low debt-to-GDP ratio over the course of the last couple of decades in this country was because we actually failed to invest in our infrastructure. So whilst we might have been carrying a low debt-to-GDP ratio, we were carrying an astonishingly high deficit in virtually every category of public infrastructure that you can imagine\u2014whether that is transport, where in every category of transport, whether it\u2019s roads, whether it\u2019s rail, whether it\u2019s light rail, whether it\u2019s cycleways, whether it\u2019s walking and cycling, we have a chronic under-investment\u2014and the results of that are being felt in our sclerotic cities at the moment. Of course, the previous National Government, as was well advertised at the time, essentially strip mined the transport budget to put in a few short but astonishingly expensive four-lane highways, leaving a huge deficit for this Government to cover.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000244\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227c215736-b512-41de-8f0c-6c5543fcfce7\u0022\u003EIn housing, clearly, that deficit is making itself felt again and again and again, and the chronic shortage in housing\u2014whether it\u2019s public housing or housing in the private market, whether that\u2019s for people who want to own their own home or to rent\u2014that is absolutely chronic, and that is a result of failures over many decades. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000245\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227c215736-b512-41de-8f0c-6c5543fcfce7\u0022\u003EThe fact that our schools and our hospitals, many of them are crumbling, are mouldering away\u2014again, that\u2019s public infrastructure that should have been invested in over the course of the last three decades. We have another multibillion-dollar problem in terms of the pipes under our feet that are making ourselves sick. If you remember just prior to the previous election in 2017, of course\u2014a couple of deaths and several thousand illnesses in Havelock North due to the poor nature of the water infrastructure there. Wellington, my home town\u2014where we literally have sewage pouring into the harbour as a result of crumbling infrastructure there over the course of the last 30 years. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000246\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227c215736-b512-41de-8f0c-6c5543fcfce7\u0022\u003EWe have tens of billions of dollars\u2019 worth of backlog in every category of infrastructure. That is a result of the fiscal settings over the course of the last three decades. The National Party, who are complaining about the lack of action of the Labour-led Government, are as much responsible for their denuding of the public estate as anybody at all. And that is why\u2014that is why\u2014I completely reject the Hon Michael Woodhouse\u2019s pithy, empty sloganeering in his contribution in this debate earlier, because all of those chickens have come home to roost at precisely the moment when COVID-19 hit. So we have this combination, this confluence, of events, which is the fact that our ageing infrastructure is absolutely at the end of its life or past the end of its life, and an absolute need to inject vast amounts of liquidity into the economy at this time in order to stimulate the economy, to keep people in their jobs, to keep things rolling. So it makes absolutely perfect sense right now to address that 30-year infrastructure deficit using the capital that we have to spend anyway in order to keep the economy going through this astonishing pandemic-led downturn. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000247\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227c215736-b512-41de-8f0c-6c5543fcfce7\u0022\u003ENow, there was something I was looking for in the Speech from the Throne that I didn\u2019t hear a whole lot about, and so I\u2019m very keen to hear from the Labour Party what their intentions are in the domain of oceans. So there were some clues in the appointment of the Hon David Parker in the role of oceans and fisheries Minister as opposed to just fisheries Minister\u2014that\u2019s quite a good hint about the sense of direction. Another hint is in the appointment as the Associate Minister of Rino Tirikatene, in terms of, obviously, the very important interests that M\u0101ori have in the fisheries industry. But as yet, it\u2019s unclear what the programme of action is in this domain, and I would have liked to have heard more about that in the Speech from the Throne, because we know that the system that we have had for the last 30-odd years, in the form of the quota management system (QMS) and the regulatory approach that we\u2019ve had towards the fishing industry, has actually failed to do the job that it is intended to do, which is to make sure that we are able to sustainably operate a fishing industry that actually preserves the biodiversity and marine life in our oceans. It has actually failed to do that. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000248\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227c215736-b512-41de-8f0c-6c5543fcfce7\u0022\u003ENow, it would probably have been worse in the absence of that system, when you look at what\u2019s going on in most of the rest of the world, but the rate of decline is measurable and it is only going in one direction. So, you know, during the course of the election campaign, the Green Party did call for what a lot of other countries around the world are doing, and that is putting a third of our exclusive economic zone into marine-protected areas. We\u2019d like to see that on this agenda. We do think that the QMS does need to be reviewed, not just because, scientifically, when you look at the ecosystem health, it hasn\u2019t delivered what it\u2019s intended to do, but also there is some evidence emerging that it actually hasn\u2019t delivered value for M\u0101ori as quota holders equivalent to other quota holders as well. So we do think that that needs to be looked at. We do think that we need to move away from simply slicing and dicing fisheries into looking at a whole-of-ecosystem approach to how we manage our marine environment and marine spatial planning. I mean, this is, kind of, not leading-edge stuff. This is what some of the leading countries around the world are doing, and so we hope that the next Government tackles that. If they don\u2019t have a plan, they\u2019re welcome to use ours. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000249\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227c215736-b512-41de-8f0c-6c5543fcfce7\u0022\u003EFinally, I do want to turn my attention to what was one of the things that was in the Speech from the Throne that I am very delighted about and has been made obvious over the course of the last week or two: that climate change is still very much at the forefront and at the heart of this new Government\u2019s agenda. There have been some huge developments in recent months. China have come out and said that they intend to be net zero carbon dioxide by the year 2060. That is huge in terms of its impact, not just at the year 2060 but between now and then. With Japan and Korea and others all committing to net zero emissions across all gas categories by the year 2050, every member of the G7 now has a target in place to be net zero in all emissions\u2014I\u2019ll say that, including biogenic methane\u2014across all of their emissions by the year 2050, which is further than this House was prepared to go last year when we unanimously passed the zero carbon Act. So the landscape is shifting hugely, and there is a risk that where we were leading a couple of years ago, we may now be falling behind. There\u2019ll be more on this tomorrow. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000250\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227c215736-b512-41de-8f0c-6c5543fcfce7\u0022\u003ENow, it is important that these targets aren\u2019t just empty language and that they\u2019ve got to be backed up with solid action, and that is true of us here in Aotearoa as well. So whilst, in the last term of Parliament, we are very proud of the work that we did collectively as a House, across the aisle, to ensure that we have a long-term strategy, that we have goals and targets and an institutional framework, we have to make sure that this is the term when we bend the curve on our emissions downwards. First task: transport. We\u2019ve got to get our transport emissions under control, our agricultural emissions, our industrial heat emissions, and the technologies and the approaches are there for us to do it. And that is what I say when I say, \u201CLet\u2019s do this.\u201D \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022977cccaf-581d-4f48-924e-32bf6c54a93d\u0022 data-id=\u00221bf5708f98584874b1316fe8abfb522b\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000251\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022977cccaf-581d-4f48-924e-32bf6c54a93d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00221bf5708f98584874b1316fe8abfb522b\u0022\u003EDEPUTY SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: This is a split call. I call the Hon Dr David Clark\u2014five minutes.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00225bbd9f26-fdb0-4b85-a836-0fc46e1bba3c\u0022 data-id=\u0022d217a0b70e084e4d8c0fed3ef11aac60\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000252\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225bbd9f26-fdb0-4b85-a836-0fc46e1bba3c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022d217a0b70e084e4d8c0fed3ef11aac60\u0022\u003EHon Dr DAVID CLARK (Minister of Commerce and Consumer Affairs):\u003C/span\u003E Mr Deputy Speaker, can I start by congratulating you on your appointment. You are respected across this House and we look forward to working with you in the role. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000253\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225bbd9f26-fdb0-4b85-a836-0fc46e1bba3c\u0022\u003EI also want to congratulate all the new members. They have been referenced by many of the speakers today, and I particularly do want to welcome the two other new members who are resident in the same city as me: Ingrid Leary, who is the new member for Taieri\u2014we welcome her to this House\u2014and also Rachel Brooking, who is resident in Dunedin. It\u2019s bringing the number of local representatives to three, and that\u2019s exciting for our city for the period ahead. So welcome to this House. I look forward to working with you and with all new members across the House. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000254\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225bbd9f26-fdb0-4b85-a836-0fc46e1bba3c\u0022\u003ENew Zealanders voted for stability and certainty this election, and ultimately, on this side of the House, we are humbled to be the first majority Government under MMP in New Zealand. We know\u2014it\u2019s been referenced today\u2014that with this responsibility comes, too, huge responsibility with this privilege. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000255\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225bbd9f26-fdb0-4b85-a836-0fc46e1bba3c\u0022\u003EI want to speak a little in my contribution about our five-point plan for economic recovery that will help New Zealand bounce back faster in the COVID period. We of course have an overarching objective of keeping New Zealanders safe from COVID-19, but then the next thing on our list is keeping our economy in good shape, accelerating the recovery, and then laying the foundations for our future. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000256\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225bbd9f26-fdb0-4b85-a836-0fc46e1bba3c\u0022\u003EI heard Mr Woodhouse contribute to the debate on debt. There were some comments there about spending and so on\u2014the usual tired refrains from an Opposition that seems not to have any ideas of its own\u2014and I would like to point out to this House that the net debt that we are projected to have as a country is likely to be at the level that many other countries would like to have started the COVID period at. Relative to those other countries in the OECD that we like to compare ourselves to, we will be keeping debt much lower through the COVID period, and that\u2019s due to the careful stewardship of the Hon Grant Robertson as Minister of Finance. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000257\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225bbd9f26-fdb0-4b85-a836-0fc46e1bba3c\u0022\u003EI referenced at the outset that New Zealanders voted for stability and certainty at this election. That is what the Minister of Finance, Grant Robertson, represents to many people I spoke to through the campaign. People who had only ever voted National for their whole lives told me that they were voting Labour this time, in part because of the leadership that our Minister of Finance has shown, for his careful stewardship of the economy, and for his ability to keep that debt down, despite the need for investment as well. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000258\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225bbd9f26-fdb0-4b85-a836-0fc46e1bba3c\u0022\u003EThat careful balance that he has maintained with Jacinda Ardern\u2019s leadership for our economy has been crucial to many in the decisions they made in the election, and, of course, the irony of Mr Woodhouse\u2019s comments is that his own party were making spending promises through the election campaign like drunken sailors. They did not say where the money was coming from. They promised money to be thrown about all over the place, but would not commit to scaling anything back. Well, of course, the voters of New Zealand saw through that, and they elected for that stability and certainty of Jacinda Ardern\u2019s leadership and the careful economic stewardship that Grant Robertson has brought to the economy under his tenure. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000259\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225bbd9f26-fdb0-4b85-a836-0fc46e1bba3c\u0022\u003EMr Deputy Speaker, I recognise the time is evaporating fast, so I\u2019m going to very quickly speak to our five-point economic plan. The first part of that plan is investing in our people, and so we\u2019ve already made investments in apprenticeship schemes, that first year fees-free that supports trades training, and so on. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000260\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225bbd9f26-fdb0-4b85-a836-0fc46e1bba3c\u0022\u003EThe second part of our plan is a focus\u2014a relentless focus\u2014on jobs. In my own town, Dunedin, obviously the Government\u2019s bringing the investment in the hospital there\u2014a $1.4 billion investment\u2014that will make sure we have a modern healthcare facility but also it will provide jobs locally, a shovel-ready project that\u2019s going to have 200 jobs attached to it during construction. We\u2019ll build a trades training centre, purpose-built for the city; 200 people will be working on site, then 350 people will be working on the out-patients building; and then, eventually, a thousand people on the in-patients building that will be built in Dunedin. That project is huge for jobs locally. There are infrastructure projects across the country that this Government is investing in to make sure that there are jobs for our people. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000261\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225bbd9f26-fdb0-4b85-a836-0fc46e1bba3c\u0022\u003EWe are preparing for the future, a sustainable future, and that means things like bringing forward the 100 percent renewable target in our electricity sector and making sure there\u2019s no new baseload thermal generation, and making sure we listen to what the independent Climate Change Commission brings back with its independent carbon budgets. We want a sustainable economy into the future. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000262\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225bbd9f26-fdb0-4b85-a836-0fc46e1bba3c\u0022\u003EWe\u2019ll also be supporting small business. We\u2019ve extended the Small Business Cashflow (Loan) Scheme. I\u2019m looking forward to making announcements around regulating merchant service fees, and we also want to focus on trade to make sure we\u2019re positioned well for the future\u2014high-quality trade deals. We have a plan\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022a434482b-7ac1-4862-9ce7-13e63289dee3\u0022 data-id=\u002221b62da6e8b24e0b8755928f06b5f7d8\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000263\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a434482b-7ac1-4862-9ce7-13e63289dee3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002221b62da6e8b24e0b8755928f06b5f7d8\u0022\u003EDEPUTY SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Order! The member\u2019s time has expired. I call the Hon Priyanca Radhakrishnan\u2014five minutes. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022872744a3-2256-4cdd-a4cc-939836dc2b11\u0022 data-id=\u0022b3ef35d355384d06a40e508be72b3f95\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000264\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022872744a3-2256-4cdd-a4cc-939836dc2b11\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022b3ef35d355384d06a40e508be72b3f95\u0022\u003EHon PRIYANCA RADHAKRISHNAN (Minister for the Community and Voluntary Sector):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Mr Speaker. As my colleagues have said before me, can I begin my contribution by offering my congratulations to you, and other presiding officers as well, and also say that I look forward to working with you over the course of this term. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000265\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022872744a3-2256-4cdd-a4cc-939836dc2b11\u0022\u003EAs my colleague who has just resumed his seat, the Hon Dr David Clark, said, New Zealanders have clearly voted at the recent election for stability and for certainty, and it is with humility that we on this side of the House stand, being the first majority Government under MMP in New Zealand. That election also has seen a turnout that has increased in 2020, and it grew the most for our youngest voters, many of whom would not have been eligible to vote back in 2017 and were in 2020. Of course, we made it much more accessible and, you know, improved their ability to be able to vote at the election. This year, 60.9 percent of estimated eligible voters aged 18 to 24 voted, up from 50.1 percent at the 2017 election. As the Minister for Youth, that makes me really happy. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000266\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022872744a3-2256-4cdd-a4cc-939836dc2b11\u0022\u003ECan I also say that one of the results of this election is one of the most diverse Parliaments that we\u2019ve ever had. The diversity on this side of the House also makes me feel incredibly proud. We have an incredibly large M\u0101ori caucus, Pacific caucus, and for the first time ever, an ethnic caucus as well. Can I extend my congratulations and welcome to all our new members of Parliament across the House, but make particular acknowledgment of the fact that we do have now seven members of Parliament from Labour who identify with an ethnic minority community in New Zealand. And it is important. It\u2019s important that our House of Representatives actually reflects the diversity of the people that we are elected to serve. While the Leader of the Opposition made a comment last month around the diversity of thought that is important, I just want to make the point that thought comes from experience and contexts and perspectives, and that\u2019s what\u2019s important. It\u2019s important that all of us here, when we make decisions that impact the lives of people around Aotearoa, that we are able to understand their different contexts, perspectives, and experience. That\u2019s why I am so proud that on this side of the House we are beginning to look like the communities that we are here to represent. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000267\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022872744a3-2256-4cdd-a4cc-939836dc2b11\u0022\u003EIt\u2019s also important because many have said we can\u2019t be what we can\u2019t see. So it\u2019s important that people across New Zealand can actually see themselves represented at every level of leadership, including here in Parliament. That makes me happy as the Minister for Diversity, Inclusion and Ethnic Communities, but we need to go further. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000268\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022872744a3-2256-4cdd-a4cc-939836dc2b11\u0022\u003EI pivot now to the Speech from the Throne, where there is a distinct recognition of the fact that this Government will have a focus on wellbeing and creating a fairer Aotearoa, and that we will continue to strengthen social cohesion in New Zealand, which is incredibly important. It\u2019s about supporting the diversity that I spoke of and creating a New Zealand where all people feel safe, have equal access to opportunities, and don\u2019t experience discrimination. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000269\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022872744a3-2256-4cdd-a4cc-939836dc2b11\u0022\u003EI just want to quickly clarify, because I have been asked over the last few weeks, why the change in the portfolio name from ethnic communities to a focus on diversity and inclusion? I feel very strongly and our Government feels very strongly that not only must we acknowledge the importance and the value of diversity and the diversity of skills that we see but we must work to remove the barriers that prevent all New Zealanders from feeling like they belong as New Zealanders and from being able to participate in our society, in our economy, and our politics as well. So I\u2019m pleased that there is that change, and signalling that change in the work programme, as well. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000270\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022872744a3-2256-4cdd-a4cc-939836dc2b11\u0022\u003EFinally, the three overarching objectives of this Government this term are to keep New Zealanders safe from COVID-19, to accelerate our economic recovery, and to lay the foundations for a better future. I want to just end by thanking, as the Minister for the Community and Voluntary Sector, our charities, our communities across New Zealand\u2014our charitable sector\u2014that demonstrated their aroha, their resilience, and their ability to adapt and respond quickly during lockdowns and various alert levels. They are critical for the success of New Zealand, for a strong and well-functioning community to support all New Zealanders. Thank you.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022a434482b-7ac1-4862-9ce7-13e63289dee3\u0022 data-id=\u002285c1587420ff49e4978bb58fa241c957\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000271\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a434482b-7ac1-4862-9ce7-13e63289dee3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002285c1587420ff49e4978bb58fa241c957\u0022\u003EDEPUTY SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: This is a split call. I call the Hon Louise Upston\u2014five minutes.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022a68928ea-9dd8-4a30-8e2c-a0f49dfc8bea\u0022 data-id=\u0022deacafd8582645d9af9564f6e2351e39\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000272\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a68928ea-9dd8-4a30-8e2c-a0f49dfc8bea\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022deacafd8582645d9af9564f6e2351e39\u0022\u003EHon LOUISE UPSTON (National\u2014Taup\u014D):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Mr Deputy Speaker, and congratulations to yourself and the presiding officers, for the new Ministers who\u2019ve taken on portfolios, including the Minister who\u2019s just resumed her seat\u2014and to the many New Zealanders who\u2019ve joined us in this wonderful House of Parliament. It is a responsibility and we have a proud tradition of serving our communities.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000273\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a68928ea-9dd8-4a30-8e2c-a0f49dfc8bea\u0022\u003EOne of the things I want to touch on, as others have mentioned, is it\u2019s the first time in New Zealand\u2019s history we have a majority Government under MMP. I see that brings with it not just responsibility but obligation, a clear obligation to deliver results for New Zealand. And I want to talk about a couple of those areas, because in the Speech from the Throne this year, actually it was quite similar three years ago and, you know, almost felt a bit like Groundhog Day listening to the Speech from the Throne. But what\u2019s talked about in this year\u2019s one is jobs and a focus on jobs. I think it\u2019s really important when we talk about jobs that there\u2019s been nothing said about where those jobs are, how many jobs they are, what those jobs are, and when they\u2019ll be created. So as a majority Government with an obligation to New Zealanders, I\u2019m expecting to see\u2014and I will hold the Minister accountable for delivering that plan, that detail, and those results. As we know, spending money is easy, really easy, especially when it\u2019s other people\u2019s money. Getting results is much tougher, and now, more than ever, those jobs are needed. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000274\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a68928ea-9dd8-4a30-8e2c-a0f49dfc8bea\u0022\u003EWe\u2019ve seen an increase in the number of people on jobseeker benefits\u201465,000. Actually, half of that was pre-COVID, so we can\u2019t have a Government that continues to blame everything on COVID. Yes, it\u2019s been a particularly challenging time, but guess what? New Zealand was facing challenging times and the Government was failing to get results pre-COVID. So now we have a majority Labour Government, there is an obligation to deliver on jobs. There is an obligation to deliver on housing. There is an obligation to deliver on child poverty. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000275\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a68928ea-9dd8-4a30-8e2c-a0f49dfc8bea\u0022\u003EI\u2019m proud to be a member of a constructive Opposition who supported the then Government in getting climate change legislation through and improving the child poverty legislation, but we must always talk about results. I was quite staggered today, asking the Associate Minister of Housing about the social housing wait list\u2014241 days someone is waiting on the social housing register. That is eight months\u2014eight months! And not only that, if we want to talk about results, the figure has gone up fourfold in the last three years, and the bulk of that was before COVID. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000276\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a68928ea-9dd8-4a30-8e2c-a0f49dfc8bea\u0022\u003ESo for those who are watching this debate, listening to this debate, just remember that the statistics were going in the wrong direction pre-COVID. And so as a constructive Opposition, we will focus on the issues that matter. If you look at child poverty, for example, we talk about material hardship because those are the children who live in the worst conditions. And yes, we talk about jobs, because you are far more likely as a child to be living in material hardship if you are in a benefit-dependent home. If you want to talk about lifting incomes, you\u2019re earning three times as much in the minimum wage job as you are on the jobseeker benefit. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000277\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a68928ea-9dd8-4a30-8e2c-a0f49dfc8bea\u0022\u003ESo the focus in terms of lifting children out of poverty has to be, and must be, about getting one of their parents into work. That\u2019s what this side of the House is going to focus on when we talk about results, when we talk about jobs, when we talk about child poverty, and when we talk about unacceptable levels of the number of people waiting for housing under this Government, because anyone can talk and make big pronouncements and big statements, but there is absolutely zero excuse and zero tolerance for a Government that doesn\u2019t deliver results when that Government has a majority. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000278\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a68928ea-9dd8-4a30-8e2c-a0f49dfc8bea\u0022\u003ESo if you look, for example, at children living in material hardship, the Prime Minister had said she would be reducing the number by 30,000, by 2021. It actually went up 11,000, going in the opposite direction. And I know, for those bright, shiny new MPs, you\u2019ll want to know you made a difference in your community. So it\u2019s about getting results.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022a434482b-7ac1-4862-9ce7-13e63289dee3\u0022 data-id=\u0022b3854e8b92bf4322ae87deb0234d8111\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000279\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a434482b-7ac1-4862-9ce7-13e63289dee3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022b3854e8b92bf4322ae87deb0234d8111\u0022\u003EDEPUTY SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: I call the Hon Todd McClay\u2014five minutes.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022c0f78f60-c2fd-46f4-8138-72f39692fc20\u0022 data-id=\u002202c1b8e40e184777b4b422a7d23541d0\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000280\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c0f78f60-c2fd-46f4-8138-72f39692fc20\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002202c1b8e40e184777b4b422a7d23541d0\u0022\u003EHon TODD McCLAY (National\u2014Rotorua):\u003C/span\u003E Mr Deputy Speaker, thank you very much. May I start by congratulating you on your election to this role, and the Speaker himself and other presiding officers. I look forward to working with you. Can I also congratulate all members of Parliament who are here in this House today. It is a great honour, one of the greatest honours and privileges that anybody can have, to serve their constituents and their country, and I believe all of us come here for the right reasons. The challenge we have is over a period of time whether those right reasons are delivered on. I am quite concerned that it\u2019s going to be difficult for so very many New Zealanders over this next year and these next two years, and even more concerned it\u2019s going to be so very difficult for so many more New Zealanders than it needs to be. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000281\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c0f78f60-c2fd-46f4-8138-72f39692fc20\u0022\u003EFundamentally, the Government has an absolute obligation to come up with a plan that\u2019s going to make people\u2019s lives better. It is a good thing that they care, but caring itself is not helping the mum who\u2019s finding the prices at the supermarket are too much for her to meet because the costs have gone up. And the bit the Government can do something about\u2014the costs they pile on businesses that are passed on to consumers\u2014they are not. It\u2019s important that they say they care about small businesses in New Zealand who are struggling under debt they took on during the lockdown of COVID through no fault of their own, but all that has been extended to them is an extension of more debt, as opposed to real policies that are going to help those businesses get out from the weight of that debt and help more of them survive than is likely to be the case. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000282\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c0f78f60-c2fd-46f4-8138-72f39692fc20\u0022\u003ESo for the next three years, the Government will be judged on how hard it is for New Zealanders and whether, actually, they are able to do more things for them in this three years compared to the last three years, when actually the progress was not what the Kiwis deserve. But we\u2019re seeing this week already that the first thing they\u2019re going to do is some tax.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000283\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225bbd9f26-fdb0-4b85-a836-0fc46e1bba3c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00224ffca9132c93489fac094c7f6acb524d\u0022\u003EHon Dr David Clark\u003C/span\u003E: Stop talking down our businesses.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000284\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c0f78f60-c2fd-46f4-8138-72f39692fc20\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002265fc41ec8f624de9a90bfd4faaf1728c\u0022\u003EHon TODD McCLAY\u003C/span\u003E: What we won\u2019t see is tax on pushbikes\u2014that\u2019s why you\u2019re sitting back there and not up the front any more, so that\u2019s a good thing\u2014but largely what will happen is the top tax rate is going to go up. And the Government signalled that, but it was nothing more than signalling. Actually, what they should be doing is being careful with the spending of the $200 billion that they will borrow\u2014not necessarily sending a signal they want to tax Kiwis more. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000285\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c0f78f60-c2fd-46f4-8138-72f39692fc20\u0022\u003EThe second thing they won\u2019t rule out is around that capital gains tax, or that brightline test. They said before the election they wouldn\u2019t tax Kiwis more, but today we hear in this House that actually it\u2019s not off the table, it\u2019s on the table. With the top tax rate going up to 39 percent, even if they don\u2019t touch the brightline test, Kiwis will be paying more, because it will be based on their actual tax rate, and in many cases it will be a higher rate. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000286\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c0f78f60-c2fd-46f4-8138-72f39692fc20\u0022\u003EAnd, of course, that comes directly back to the cost of living. We\u2019ve seen the Government signal that they\u2019ve started an inquiry for the Commerce Commission into supermarket pricing, and that in a year\u2019s time the Commerce Commission will report back to them. But the Government actually doesn\u2019t have to wait for a year to see why some costs in supermarkets have gone up. There are things that they can do right now to make sure those costs don\u2019t escalate and are reduced, and those are the costs they\u2019re putting on businesses and small businesses in New Zealand. So we\u2019ll see this week the start of a process to double sick leave. Everybody wants an employee to be looked after if they\u2019re sick, but the direct implication of doubling of sick leave; of a new public holiday the Government says they\u2019ll bring in in a year\u2019s time; of the increase of the minimum wage, if it goes too quickly; and of some of the other things they\u2019ve signalled around workplace relations is a cost of $2.8 billion on New Zealand businesses. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000287\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c0f78f60-c2fd-46f4-8138-72f39692fc20\u0022\u003ENow, when a small business in New Zealand has costs imposed on it by the Government, they have to do one of two things. They have to pass those on\u2014and where they can, that increases costs to consumers\u2014or they have to absorb those costs, and over the last two years of extra costs imposed by the Government and the debt with COVID, so many of these small business can\u2019t absorb any more costs. So ultimately, what they do is when somebody leaves their workforce, they\u2019re not able to replace them. That means job growth slows at a time when we need more jobs, not fewer, and that\u2019s a leading indicator of what\u2019s going to happen with unemployment. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000288\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c0f78f60-c2fd-46f4-8138-72f39692fc20\u0022\u003EA lot of people have lost their jobs in New Zealand as a result of COVID. The Government needs a plan to help businesses grow the economy and create jobs, not piling burden of cost upon those businesses, particularly small businesses, because too many Kiwis that deserve to be in jobs won\u2019t be, too many businesses that deserve to survive won\u2019t, and, ultimately, what that means is the recession that we\u2019re seeing and the harm that\u2019s done to the economy will continue. The Government needs a plan to get off the back of small business, which gives them a chance to create the jobs that they need so Kiwis can work hard. It\u2019s hard work that will get us through the recession, not more tax and not more costs.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022a434482b-7ac1-4862-9ce7-13e63289dee3\u0022 data-id=\u0022c646b73722b64bf7bd7bdd2e67588ba4\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000289\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a434482b-7ac1-4862-9ce7-13e63289dee3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022c646b73722b64bf7bd7bdd2e67588ba4\u0022\u003EDEPUTY SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: This is a split call. I call Anahila Kanongata\u2019a-Suisuiki.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002295945ace-51e8-4dbc-a0e3-c19f4ed99ed9\u0022 data-id=\u00229e0d4758608b484c9c8ab855d07fcb65\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000290\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002295945ace-51e8-4dbc-a0e3-c19f4ed99ed9\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00229e0d4758608b484c9c8ab855d07fcb65\u0022\u003EANAHILA KANONGATA\u2019A-SUISUIKI (Labour):\u003C/span\u003E Kia ora e te Mana Whakaw\u0101. May I echo the congratulations from many speakers who have already spoken before me on your selection as the Deputy Speaker. We are honoured that you bring much mana to this role. It would be remiss of me to respond to the speech that has just happened, but I think I will just leave that for another time.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000291\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002295945ace-51e8-4dbc-a0e3-c19f4ed99ed9\u0022\u003EThe question I want to ask, really, is how did we get here, to an MMP environment where the majority of the voters have voted in one particular party? If we ask the question again\u2014how did that happen?\u2014perhaps it is because of its leader, the leadership of our Prime Minister, the Rt Hon Jacinda Ardern. When we talk about being guided by our labour values or our enduring New Zealand values, we ask the question: well, what are those values? Well, actually, it is about the values of equality, \u014Dritetanga; sustainability, kaitiakitanga; opportunity, whaka\u014Dritetanga; solidarity, kotahitanga; and the one I love the most is freedom, rangatiratanga\u2014the right to fully participate in a society and to exercise choice about how we live our lives. These values recognise that people can only exercise the freedom when they can fully participate with the freedom in a society that actually supports strong personal, social, and economic rights for everybody. I want to acknowledge the Prime Minister when she describes our Government as a Government that represents all of New Zealand.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000292\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002295945ace-51e8-4dbc-a0e3-c19f4ed99ed9\u0022\u003EPerhaps the voters voted for us because we have a five-point plan, and I want to remind the House of the objective of those plans. The objective of anything is knowing why we do what we do, and what does that look like? I just want to remind everybody, reflecting on the challenging of COVID-19 and the need to tackle New Zealand\u2019s long-term issues, this Labour Government on this side will have three overarching objectives. Before I get into our objectives, I want to acknowledge the many, many lives throughout the world who are affected by COVID-19 and that we are in a very privileged position because of the leadership of this Government, of Jacinda Ardern and our Deputy Prime Minister, Grant Robertson.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000293\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002295945ace-51e8-4dbc-a0e3-c19f4ed99ed9\u0022\u003EThose three objectives are to keep New Zealanders safe from COVID-19, to accelerate our economic recovery, and to lay the foundations for a better future. So how do we get there? Keeping New Zealand safe from COVID-19, we have got five-point action plans, and the five-point action plan is about investing in our people, putting people at the heart of our plan. I can say I have been honoured and privileged to be selected by the Labour Party to be Labour\u2019s candidate in Papakura. When I talk about people voting for this Government, the Labour Government, I want to acknowledge every person in Papakura, because I have met people who have said to me, \u201CIt is the first time that I have given my party vote to Labour, and it\u2019s the first time that I\u2019ve done that because I believe New Zealand is better off in a Labour Government.\u201D I want to remind us of why that is. They remind us that it is about investing in our people and it\u2019s about jobs, creating jobs not just for today but for our future, preparing for our future, supporting small businesses, and, of course, positioning us globally.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000294\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002295945ace-51e8-4dbc-a0e3-c19f4ed99ed9\u0022\u003EI\u2019m almost running out of time, but I want to take this opportunity to acknowledge the role that I have been privileged to be voted into by our Pacific caucus. We now have 10 members of Pacific in Labour, and I want to thank New Zealand for that. Last night, we had an \u2018ava ceremony, which is a Samoan traditional custom of reminding those who have been voted in of their responsibility to the people, and I want to congratulate all five, including the one first ever member of the Green Party who is Pacific. I want to acknowledge that. New Zealand, it\u2019s come far, and as the chair for the Pacific caucus, I am privileged to contribute to the Government\u2019s plan. This is a Government that will have every New Zealander\u2019s wellbeing in mind. M\u0101l\u014D.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022a434482b-7ac1-4862-9ce7-13e63289dee3\u0022 data-id=\u002259848f427aa342a884853e94020182d8\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000295\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a434482b-7ac1-4862-9ce7-13e63289dee3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002259848f427aa342a884853e94020182d8\u0022\u003EDEPUTY SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: I call Marja Lubeck\u2014five minutes.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022f677db8b-66c5-4794-953c-bdf7aa425710\u0022 data-id=\u00223574d403ab7c4156aed8401373c3a659\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000296\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f677db8b-66c5-4794-953c-bdf7aa425710\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00223574d403ab7c4156aed8401373c3a659\u0022\u003EMARJA LUBECK (Labour):\u003C/span\u003E T\u0113n\u0101 koe e te M\u0101ngai o te Whare. Like those before me, Mr Deputy Speaker, I would like to congratulate you on your elevation to Deputy Speaker, the other presiding officers, and also all my new colleagues\u2014in particular, the two members of Parliament north of the bridge, Vanushi Walters and Shanan Halbert, who both won their electorates, and I\u2019m looking forward to having some more troops in that area of the country. I know there\u2019s something about reflecting at the end of the year, and as I\u2019m sure we all do at this time, we are thinking back on 2020 and how tough it\u2019s been on many people.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000297\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f677db8b-66c5-4794-953c-bdf7aa425710\u0022\u003ESo, as these are my first words back into the 53rd Parliament, I would like to use the opportunity to thank our essential workers who kept New Zealand going under the most stressful of circumstances. I\u2019m talking about our cleaners, our supermarket workers, our health workers, our security guards, our rubbish collectors, our bus drivers, and many, many others. Also, of course, the businesses and the workers who had to go through the most challenging circumstances to keep themselves going in a changed world. A special thanks also to all of our flight crews, our cabin crew, and our staff in the isolation facilities. Now, they have been mentioned before, but these groups of workers make a lot of sacrifices to keep us New Zealanders, and also New Zealand, safe. They follow the protocols, they are isolated from their family and from their friends, they have more tests than the average worker out there, while they\u2019re waiting for the results they have to distance from their family and from their friends. Yet many of those workers feel demonised by the community. So I would just like to acknowledge the sacrifices that these people are making.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000298\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f677db8b-66c5-4794-953c-bdf7aa425710\u0022\u003EAt a time when other countries are still reporting thousands of COVID-related cases every day and many, many deaths, we are here able to pretty much lead normal lives. We saw it when we had the Speech from the Throne, we\u2019re all sitting together in this room, we hug each other when our new colleagues are doing their maiden speeches. This is something that many, many other countries couldn\u2019t even dream of. I\u2019ve said it before and I\u2019ll say it again: I worry about my family on the other side of the world in the Netherlands where COVID is still claiming so many lives every day. Nine thousand people have died so far in a country that\u2019s the size of Northland; it\u2019s only about three times the population of New Zealand. So we should really be counting our blessings.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000299\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f677db8b-66c5-4794-953c-bdf7aa425710\u0022\u003ENow, when we look at the three objectives that my colleague Anahila Kanongata\u2019a-Suisuiki mentioned beforehand, this is very much in line with keeping New Zealanders free from COVID-19 as a first objective. We went hard and early with our health response, and that basically gave us a really good opportunity to kick off our economic response. That gets to the second overarching objective, which is accelerating our economic recovery. But that recovery plan is not really just about getting back to where we were before, but about building back better. It\u2019s also about addressing some of those long-term challenges that we have had in New Zealand, and that plan is already under way. It\u2019s based on five core points. It\u2019s based around jobs, it\u2019s based around people, it\u2019s based on preparing for the future by taking on those challenges that I mentioned so that we can build back better. It\u2019s about supporting small businesses, about supporting entrepreneurs, and it\u2019s also about positioning ourselves globally so that this is a place that people want to invest in and trade with.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000300\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f677db8b-66c5-4794-953c-bdf7aa425710\u0022\u003EThe global economic impact will be felt through New Zealand, but we are placed very well because, as our finance Minister explained previously, we started paying down debt and running surpluses from the very moment that we came into office. That\u2019s given us a head start, and so we are able to keep accelerating our economic recovery.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000301\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f677db8b-66c5-4794-953c-bdf7aa425710\u0022\u003EThat really brings me to the third objective, which is to lay the foundations for a better future. Minister Robertson mentioned this in the Budget speech, and he mentioned it in his speech just earlier on when we kicked off this part of the debate. He said the sentence\u2014and it stayed with me because it really goes to the core of what we\u2019re about, and it talks about a \u201Cglimmer of silver lining on the darkest of clouds\u201D, and that is about our country having an opportunity to build back better. What our response to COVID-19 does is give us exactly that opportunity.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000302\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f677db8b-66c5-4794-953c-bdf7aa425710\u0022\u003ENow, New Zealanders voted for stability and certainty this election, and it\u2019s absolutely humbling to be part of the first majority Government under MMP in New Zealand, which obviously is led by a Prime Minister who unites and has led our country through so many crises and tough times this year. We won\u2019t solve all of our problems overnight, but what we have done is we\u2019ve laid the foundations for change in our first term, and we are heading in the right direction. Thank you, Madam Speaker.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00224a25943b-cb3b-49c3-bd10-74316fae17f1\u0022 data-id=\u0022d15a7db294a34b3592c2c51c0627a03c\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000303\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00224a25943b-cb3b-49c3-bd10-74316fae17f1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022d15a7db294a34b3592c2c51c0627a03c\u0022\u003EASSISTANT SPEAKER (Hon Jacqui Dean)\u003C/span\u003E: I call Melissa Lee\u2014five-minute call.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002218f9e3ea-81c5-4414-af48-d6bb843a9227\u0022 data-id=\u0022af39730e86da40cd9f24e6ea49007a89\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000304\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002218f9e3ea-81c5-4414-af48-d6bb843a9227\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022af39730e86da40cd9f24e6ea49007a89\u0022\u003EMELISSA LEE (National):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Madam Speaker. I\u2019d like to begin this session by congratulating you, Madam Assistant Speaker Dean, on your elevation to the Chair, and to also extend the congratulations to your fellow presiding officers. I look forward to fair adjudication in this House, as we expect from good speakers like yourself. Once again, congratulations. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000305\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002218f9e3ea-81c5-4414-af48-d6bb843a9227\u0022\u003EI would also like to extend my congratulations to the Hon Priyanca Radhakrishnan on her elevation to Minister for Diversity, Inclusion and Ethnic Communities. However, I\u2019m a little bit saddened that it is the first time in this House where the Minister of Diversity, Inclusion and Ethnic Communities is outside Cabinet. I\u2019m a little bit sad about that, but I know that she will be very able in her execution of her role, and I will support her, as a member of the ethnic community. I look forward to meeting her at many ethnic community events, which I\u2019m sure will actually keep her very, very busy indeed. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000306\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002218f9e3ea-81c5-4414-af48-d6bb843a9227\u0022\u003EI\u2019d like to now go to the comments that were made by some of the members opposite, and also I\u2019d like to congratulate all of the new members of Parliament, by the way. I heard some of the speeches last week, and I just wanted to congratulate some of the members who are present in this House. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000307\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002218f9e3ea-81c5-4414-af48-d6bb843a9227\u0022\u003EEarlier, the Hon David Clark was talking about how there were five-point plans that this Government had, but I didn\u2019t quite hear the five-point plans, actually. What he went on about was investing in people. He talked about our students\u2014you know, we needed to invest in our people, and that was one of the tenets of this Government. I think what the Speech from the Throne was talking about, futureproofing of the economy, accelerating the recovery\u2014these are words; these are not actual plans. To me, when people talk about investing in the future and our students, it is talking about education outcomes, and we can say that the fact is in the last three years, when our students graduated from high school, they did worse than the cohorts that went before them. They are worse off in their reading, writing, and maths, and this is something that we need to actually focus on. They are getting worse, and this Government has actually failed in their attempt to do better. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000308\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002218f9e3ea-81c5-4414-af48-d6bb843a9227\u0022\u003EEarlier, the member from the Green Party\u2014the co-leader the Hon James Shaw\u2014was talking in his speech, and I found his speech rather ironic. He talked about the lack of infrastructure, including the mouldering schools, he said, and yet he was part of the Government\u2014he was a Minister of the Government\u2014that actually delivered, apparently, on those infrastructures, or lack thereof, to those schools that he was talking about that had failed. He is actually making a judgment of his own performance for not delivering for New Zealanders, and yet he\u2019s also responsible for the $12 million of funding to the Green School, that is growing crystals. How many of those infrastructures that he thinks that we should be funding could have been funded out of that $12 million that he actually gave out? \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000309\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002218f9e3ea-81c5-4414-af48-d6bb843a9227\u0022\u003ESinking millions on consultants is something that this Government actually does well. You know, they sank millions\u2014actually hundreds of millions\u2014on consultants and working groups and advisory panels. They sank millions on the slow train to the airport on Dominion Road that I\u2019m still wondering what\u2019s happened to. That\u2019s the kind of advancement that this Government is talking about. The plan should really be a plan, and I have not heard details of their plan; just fancy words. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000310\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002218f9e3ea-81c5-4414-af48-d6bb843a9227\u0022\u003EHow are they going to reduce debt\u2014the debt that we\u2019re going to be lumping on our children, our future generations, which this Government seems to think is actually OK. Debt is fast-growing. It is one of the most significant things that we need to worry about in this country. Government doesn\u2019t make money. Government does not earn an income\u2014well, they do, actually, through taxes. The hard-earned taxes that people actually pay is how Governments spend, and this Government is set on spending millions and billions of the hard-earned cash of our taxpayers and completely wasting that. I hope that they will stay focused and do some work. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022f12da0af-dc73-4870-8f77-1d50a75eb44c\u0022 data-id=\u00220313db0217fa42c5be03a2c2667b5294\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000311\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f12da0af-dc73-4870-8f77-1d50a75eb44c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00220313db0217fa42c5be03a2c2667b5294\u0022\u003ENICOLA WILLIS (National):\u003C/span\u003E I want to talk about a grave and serious challenge facing New Zealand that was not addressed in anywhere near the substance New Zealanders have a right to expect in the Speech from the Throne, and that issue is housing. In a time of crisis, with some of the most unaffordable house prices in the world, rapidly reducing rates of homeownership, and more than 20,000 New Zealanders waiting in urgent need of a State house, with an average waiting time of more than 240 days, what did the Government have to say about its plans for housing in this term of Government? Well, I\u2019m afraid to tell you there was an absence of fresh thinking, and it is instructive to compare the Speech from the Throne from this Parliament with that from the 2017 Parliament. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000312\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f12da0af-dc73-4870-8f77-1d50a75eb44c\u0022\u003EIn 2017, housing was described by the Labour-led Government as a top priority. Well, I\u2019m afraid to let you know that it\u2019s now just a priority. In 2017, 12 specific commitments were made to address the housing crisis; in this year\u2019s speech, just nine, and let me tell you what was absolutely missing from that Speech from the Throne: a mention of KiwiBuild. Is it any wonder, because Labour came into Government saying that KiwiBuild would be the solution to New Zealand\u2019s housing woes and, as I stand here today, only just over 600 KiwiBuild houses have been built. That\u2019s less than 4 percent of the 16,000 that were promised\u2014a demonstrable and disgraceful failure. Labour said that a capital gains tax would be a solution to New Zealand\u2019s housing woes, and that, of course, didn\u2019t even get off the ground. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000313\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f12da0af-dc73-4870-8f77-1d50a75eb44c\u0022\u003ESo what have we had instead of new ideas about housing? Well, this week, we have had the shameful spectacle of the Prime Minister playing the blame game. First, it\u2019s National\u2019s fault, then it\u2019s foreigners\u2014because foreigners were investing too much in the housing market, apparently\u2014then it\u2019s people with Chinese-sounding names, and, actually, this week we\u2019ve learnt that the public should bear responsibility for the housing crisis because they didn\u2019t like Labour\u2019s tax plan. Well, this is not the attitude that the people I speak to want to see in a newly elected Government. What they want to see from a newly elected Government is fresh thinking, a sense of responsibility for constructively addressing this major challenge, and what they don\u2019t want to see is a Government that whenever faced with the question of housing, thinks this is an excuse for another sneaky new tax. That is absolutely not what Labour were elected to do. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000314\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f12da0af-dc73-4870-8f77-1d50a75eb44c\u0022\u003EThe scale of the challenge is immense. In the three years since Labour were first elected to Government, the median house has earned more than the median earner\u2014that is, median house prices have gone up by $200,000, and those who own those houses have earned more from them than workers on the median wage earned. We have seen houses get more and more out of reach, so what I commit to do is to help the Government out because what they need are constructive ideas, not just recycling old plans for new taxes. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000315\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f12da0af-dc73-4870-8f77-1d50a75eb44c\u0022\u003EThe Government should be pursuing innovative ideas to encourage a surge in new house building: strengthening the national policy statement on urban development to bring urgent rezoning in our major urban cities forward; removing the Auckland urban boundary, as promised in the Speech from the Throne in 2017, but conspicuously absent this time around; making K\u0101inga Ora capital available to community housing providers\u2014because it is not just the State that can build and supply social housing; why not partner with proven providers such as the Salvation Army to get those shovel-ready plans under way right now? \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000316\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f12da0af-dc73-4870-8f77-1d50a75eb44c\u0022\u003EEstablish a housing infrastructure fund: let\u2019s help local government finance the pipes and roads needed to get new subdivisions under way straight away, and let\u2019s be creative and implement new finance models. We are spending literally billions on the accommodation supplement and income-related rents. Let\u2019s repurpose them to drive new housing developments. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000317\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f12da0af-dc73-4870-8f77-1d50a75eb44c\u0022\u003EYou want ideas? Come see National. They were absent in the Address in Reply debate. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022471dee54-f59e-4497-b3d3-c39044ce7169\u0022 data-id=\u00229c4e3958d2b34b5882c97ec2675bce47\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000318\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022471dee54-f59e-4497-b3d3-c39044ce7169\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00229c4e3958d2b34b5882c97ec2675bce47\u0022\u003EHon DAMIEN O\u2019CONNOR (Minister of Agriculture):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Madam Speaker. It\u2019s been a wet few days in Wellington, and I feel sorry for those who\u2019ve had their houses flooded. I have to say, I feel like I\u2019m drowning in crocodile tears in this place here. Those speeches, the last two speeches from the National Party talking about housing\u2014this is a former Government that sold State houses. It ignored the crisis, and then it promised to reform the Resource Management Act and did nothing. I\u2019ll keep swimming in these crocodile tears. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000319\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022471dee54-f59e-4497-b3d3-c39044ce7169\u0022\u003EI just want to take the opportunity in the first time to speak in this new Parliament to, firstly, say thank you to a whole lot of people. We are very lucky to be here. We are lucky to have had a robust election process. We are lucky to be able to interact as a country in a way that very few other places in the world can do. I have to thank, firstly, New Zealanders for behaving through lockdown, for adhering to the rules that we asked them to adhere to. To the essential workers, and we can\u2019t thank them enough\u2014many who continue to work through into the managed isolation and quarantine facilities\u2014thank you very, very much. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000320\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022471dee54-f59e-4497-b3d3-c39044ce7169\u0022\u003ECan I thank the Kiwis who trusted the Labour Party to take them forward because they want certainty, they want security, and they believe that we are the best party to do that. We have said\u2014as the Prime Minister has said in the speech\u2014we will be here for all New Zealanders, not just for the select few that are often the beneficiaries of a National Government. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000321\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022471dee54-f59e-4497-b3d3-c39044ce7169\u0022\u003EI just want to take the opportunity to thank all my colleagues, my former ministerial colleagues and their oversight, and the Prime Minister, of course, and one other person\u2014Norm\u2014who has been thanked, actually. Norm is Sarah Stuart-Black, who\u2019s been head of emergency management in our country for some time. She\u2019s moving to the Red Cross. There\u2019s a thankyou going on in Parliament now. I want to also say thank you for her work and to her family for giving her to us and her time. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000322\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022471dee54-f59e-4497-b3d3-c39044ce7169\u0022\u003EHe tangata, he tangata, he tangata\u2014M\u0101ori have taught us what is the most important thing in the world, and when we get got hit by COVID, that is indeed what we did. We firstly looked after the health of New Zealanders, and we continue to focus on that as the number one priority for this Government, because all the criticisms that we had in those times that we had to look after business and we had to make sure that people can move around and all the other things\u2014well, you can go and look around the world and see the countries that didn\u2019t put their people first. I\u2019m proud to be part of a Government that did and still does put people first. We\u2019ll continue to work to keep people safe from COVID. The world is full of it. We\u2019re thankful that there is a vaccine or some vaccines in the wind\u2014that\u2019s great\u2014but until that time, we have to keep our borders secure. We have to ensure that our health system is not overrun by infection from COVID. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000323\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022471dee54-f59e-4497-b3d3-c39044ce7169\u0022\u003EWe have to prepare for a better future. It\u2019s not just good enough to think that we\u2019d get back to where we were; we have to get ahead of the game. As a country that is now respected internationally for what we have done, we have a huge opportunity ahead of us to say that we can be, if not the best country in the world\u2014and many of us think that\u2014but the best country for the world, showing and leading by example. As we move into 2021, the year of APEC, we will be hosting 21 economies coming together to look at the challenging issues ahead of us, not just in the areas of COVID but in trade and protectionism, working through how we share the best knowledge to tackle climate change, to tackle the issues of poverty, and to ensure that people have security as we go forward. We are well positioned to do that off the back of what we have done. Thank you, New Zealand\u2014thank each and every one of you\u2014for what you are doing. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000324\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022471dee54-f59e-4497-b3d3-c39044ce7169\u0022\u003EWe will need to support small business. We need to ensure that it\u2019s not just the big players who seize the opportunities from a crisis. Crisis has impacted many, many New Zealanders and we\u2019ve stepped in with direct support and indirect support. The people who might benefit as we go forward must be those people who committed themselves to a better future. We have to ensure that New Zealand is positioned in a global world in a place of respect and with a reputation where people want to knock on our door to buy our goods because they want to be a part of us and because they want to understand how, as a bicultural nation, we can succeed through the challenges, and there have been many of those challenges. I believe that the APEC year next year\u2014300 meetings with the world\u2019s leaders and with other ministers around\u2014will provide us with that opportunity to put us on the stage. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000325\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022471dee54-f59e-4497-b3d3-c39044ce7169\u0022\u003EI have to say that I\u2019m honoured to have a couple of new areas of responsibility, and the one of trade, of course, is a very important one for a small trading nation. We rely absolutely on trade. As Minister of Agriculture, we\u2019ve always been very proud of our position and our export earnings. In spite of all the best efforts of many Governments over many years, the primary sectors continue to be the largest single part of our export and wealth creation. That\u2019s wonderful, and what we are doing in the areas of agriculture and primary production is moving to more sustainable practices. We\u2019ve seen rapid growth, and we\u2019ve all benefited from that, but there have been pressures on the environment, pressures on the workforce, and pressures on local infrastructure. We need to make some improvements to ensure that those people who invest their lives and their capital and their expertise and their families in the areas of private production can see a sustainable return on that into the future. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000326\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022471dee54-f59e-4497-b3d3-c39044ce7169\u0022\u003EWe\u2019ve got to sell what we produce, and so can I firstly acknowledge the former Minister for Trade and Export Growth, the Hon David Parker, and all the great work he did. In a very short time after taking over that role, he managed to negotiate and get over the line the Comprehensive and Progressive Agreement for Trans-Pacific Partnership, a massive agreement that was stuck prior to his intervention and the Prime Minister\u2019s intervention in Da Nang\u2014thank you for that work. We\u2019ve continued to move forward to the point where, a couple of weeks ago, we signed the Regional Comprehensive Economic Partnership, an agreement with a third of the world\u2019s population to put in place some fair trading rules that mean that those entrepreneurs who want to invest in new services or goods to export to a third of the world\u2019s population, where over 50 percent of our existing trade goes to, know what the rules are and can have them upheld. I think we\u2019ve made some great progress. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000327\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022471dee54-f59e-4497-b3d3-c39044ce7169\u0022\u003EI want to thank the primary sectors for increasing their export revenue through challenging times. In the year to the end of October, we\u2019ve seen a 6.5 percent increase\u2014sorry. Sorry, I go back\u2014that\u2019s just for dairy, actually. Can I go back to a 1.2 percent goods increase in the October month. That is really, really important, because elsewhere around the world, we are facing some protectionism. We are seeing countries in the face of COVID say that we\u2019ve got to protect our local people\u2014and, indeed, we can understand that\u2014but when it comes to issues like food security, then New Zealand plays a key role in supplementing what some countries can\u2019t produce for themselves. I\u2019d like to acknowledge Singapore and, again, my colleague Mr Parker for negotiating an agreement early on in COVID that gave food security for them and pharmaceutical products for us. It\u2019s through those trading relationships that we can have more security as we move into the future. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000328\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022471dee54-f59e-4497-b3d3-c39044ce7169\u0022\u003EVery briefly, I said about the agricultural sector moving into a more sustainable space. We, over the last three years, have set out a vision and planned for agriculture: Fit for a Better World. That plan is timely and it\u2019s well positioned to ensure that every one of those people who operate and work in those primary sectors can move down the same path to coordinate and cooperate all their efforts. We\u2019ve put $200 million extra into New Zealand Trade and Enterprise offshore, so that they can help the very people who are creating those jobs, creating that wealth and those export products, and sending it offshore. We have, I think, as a country and as a Government, done very, very well, and I think there is international recognition of all of that. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000329\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022471dee54-f59e-4497-b3d3-c39044ce7169\u0022\u003EI want to round up again by coming back to the challenges that we face around child poverty, around housing, and climate change in our own country. We have a programme. We have a plan. The laissez-faire approach that the National Party takes\u2014and ACT\u2014will sit back and leave it to the market, as some kind of head-in-the-sand stuff that has been disproven and discredited time and time again. What we need is a good plan going forward, and this Government has a plan to tackle the issues of climate change to ensure we have a robust and a very good reputation, with integrity, offshore to make sure that our people in the country get good returns for their efforts, whatever place they play in the horticultural sectors or in any of our industries. People need a decent income to have a decent life in this country. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000330\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022471dee54-f59e-4497-b3d3-c39044ce7169\u0022\u003EHe tangata, he tangata, he tangata. This Government will always focus on what is most important, first and foremost. Thank you. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00224a25943b-cb3b-49c3-bd10-74316fae17f1\u0022 data-id=\u0022616e5e5c6991492a9b1e42c09198e150\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000331\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00224a25943b-cb3b-49c3-bd10-74316fae17f1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022616e5e5c6991492a9b1e42c09198e150\u0022\u003EASSISTANT SPEAKER (Hon Jacqui Dean)\u003C/span\u003E: I call the Hon Paul Goldsmith\u2014a five-minute call. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002253f86481-33c1-48b2-893b-c11cc0bd673d\u0022 data-id=\u002257d630ddb51948d9a59676229faab228\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000332\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002253f86481-33c1-48b2-893b-c11cc0bd673d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002257d630ddb51948d9a59676229faab228\u0022\u003EHon PAUL GOLDSMITH (National):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Madam Assistant Speaker Dean, and congratulations on your high office this evening. It\u2019s my pleasure to speak in this debate and to be back here in the Parliament. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000333\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002253f86481-33c1-48b2-893b-c11cc0bd673d\u0022\u003EI want to start with congratulations to the Labour Party. It was a great result for them. You have gained the support of the public in this election and you have to carry the burden of expectations that comes with that, and this country faces real challenges right now. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000334\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002253f86481-33c1-48b2-893b-c11cc0bd673d\u0022\u003EWe\u2019ve got through towards the end of what has been a very difficult year for many New Zealanders. They\u2019ve put their faith in this Government, and they will be hoping to see some real progress on the big challenges that we face, particularly on the economy. It\u2019s all very well to have a false sense of security when we\u2019re borrowing a billion dollars a week and the printing presses are running very quickly over at the Reserve Bank. That may give a short-term sense of security, but, ultimately, we have to have a strong economy that\u2019s really creating jobs and is genuinely internationally competitive. This Government has chosen to increase taxes, and so it will be interesting to see how that works out. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000335\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002253f86481-33c1-48b2-893b-c11cc0bd673d\u0022\u003EWe\u2019re also going to be relying on private sector investment to grow the economy and create jobs. What we\u2019re seeing in so many places is additional costs being added on to those businesses, making it more difficult for them to create those jobs, and so we\u2019ll be watching that very closely. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000336\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002253f86481-33c1-48b2-893b-c11cc0bd673d\u0022\u003EThen we\u2019ll be thinking about the infrastructure that needs to be built during these difficult times. We\u2019re just hoping that the new Minister of Transport\u2014up in Auckland, anyway, we\u2019re hoping that the new Minister of Transport isn\u2019t quite so obsessed with the funny light rail scheme that his predecessor had as the number one priority for Auckland. Anybody living in Auckland is still scratching their heads as to why a slow tram down Dominion Road should be the priority for the biggest investment in infrastructure in our history. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000337\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002253f86481-33c1-48b2-893b-c11cc0bd673d\u0022\u003EOn housing, what we\u2019re seeing, of course, is a real challenge for, particularly, young New Zealanders as they look and see the yard being lifted higher into housing affordability. We have an unseemly episode of the Governor of the Reserve Bank and the Minister of Finance pointing their fingers at each other for responsibility. There\u2019s no question that increasing the supply of houses is the best solution, but you can\u2019t do that overnight. You can\u2019t do it in a year. It takes time, so, in the meantime, our flooding the country with cash at very low interest rates is adding fuel to what is a raging fire already. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000338\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002253f86481-33c1-48b2-893b-c11cc0bd673d\u0022\u003ESo I\u2019ll be very interested to see how the Minister responds effectively to that issue\u2014which they were so, so critical of the previous National Government about; yet, after three years, have not made much progress on\u2014and we want to work constructively to make some of that progress. At the same time, the Reserve Bank is flooding all this extra cash in order to encourage investment when the Government is making it much more difficult for businesses to actually grow and to hire people. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000339\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002253f86481-33c1-48b2-893b-c11cc0bd673d\u0022\u003EIn the meantime, I\u2019ve been granted the wonderful privilege of working in the education sector, and coming from a household of teachers, I have a keen sense of it. My father was a maths teacher. He had three siblings. Of the four children in my father\u2019s family, three were teachers and one was an anaesthetist, and, of course, there was always a bit of a joke as to who put you to sleep faster of those four. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000340\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002253f86481-33c1-48b2-893b-c11cc0bd673d\u0022\u003EBut, nevertheless, I have huge respect for the teaching profession. It is a very difficult profession, trying to inspire children, young men and women, girls and boys, to love learning and to learn. I think of some of the inspirational teachers that I had. Bob Hunt at Auckland Grammar had a glass eye, and you were never quite sure where he was looking. But he was the one who turned the light on in me and, for the first time, made me passionate about learning a particular subject\u2014Japanese, it was. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000341\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002253f86481-33c1-48b2-893b-c11cc0bd673d\u0022\u003ESo I\u2019m looking forward to working constructively with the sector in what is such an important area for the future of the country: making sure that our young men and women, when they leave school, are able to contribute and succeed in the modern world with basic literacy and numeracy. One of the things that I\u2019ll be very focused on is the absolutely appalling attendance records at school at the moment. It\u2019s an astonishing fact that only around 57 percent of school kids are actually at school on a regular basis. We need to do much, much better, and so that will be an initial focus of mine. Thank you, Madam Speaker. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00224a25943b-cb3b-49c3-bd10-74316fae17f1\u0022 data-id=\u0022178e00de903148d6bd36c66de7871432\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000342\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00224a25943b-cb3b-49c3-bd10-74316fae17f1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022178e00de903148d6bd36c66de7871432\u0022\u003EASSISTANT SPEAKER (Hon Jacqui Dean)\u003C/span\u003E: I call the Hon Scott Simpson\u2014for five minutes. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002298dbeffa-e059-49d5-8bbf-579cbaead9a3\u0022 data-id=\u0022196fb45139424969a243b072b0f67966\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000343\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002298dbeffa-e059-49d5-8bbf-579cbaead9a3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022196fb45139424969a243b072b0f67966\u0022\u003EHon SCOTT SIMPSON (National\u2014Coromandel):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Madam Speaker. What a pleasure it is to follow a former Auckland Grammar old boy in the shape and form of the Hon Paul Goldsmith, and I can remember actually being taught\u2014or Paul Goldsmith\u2019s father actually did try and teach me\u2014maths. I\u2019m not so sure whether he was successful\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000344\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002234d082be135d47a5b68b583556083eeb\u0022\u003EHon Member\u003C/span\u003E: It\u2019s his fault! \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000345\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002298dbeffa-e059-49d5-8bbf-579cbaead9a3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00221ff0999c47734ab5b0b3915ff152084d\u0022\u003EHon SCOTT SIMPSON\u003C/span\u003E: \u2014or not, but maybe it was Goldsmith Snr\u2019s fault. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000346\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002298dbeffa-e059-49d5-8bbf-579cbaead9a3\u0022\u003EBut look, Madam Assistant Speaker Dean, can I commence by congratulating you on your appointment, and your fellow presiding officers. You\u2019ve got a big job to do in this 53rd Parliament, and here on the Opposition benches we\u2019re looking forward to working cooperatively with you. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000347\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002298dbeffa-e059-49d5-8bbf-579cbaead9a3\u0022\u003EI want to pick up on the theme that several of my colleagues have pursued, which is to congratulate the Government on their election victory. We\u2019ve seen in the term of my lifetime some very significant political swings and cycles over a period of time, and New Zealand voters do produce results like this from time to time. But one thing I can assure the current Government is that cycles do turn and they turn quite quickly, particularly if Governments don\u2019t perform, and this Government now has no excuses. This Government has no excuses for the lack of delivery, the lack of performance, the lack of vision, their lack of aspiration, and the lack of hope for New Zealanders that they produced during their first three years in office. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000348\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002298dbeffa-e059-49d5-8bbf-579cbaead9a3\u0022\u003ESo it was with some excitement and anticipation that we marched out of this Chamber last week to hear the Speech from the Throne, a speech that is designed to present to the nation and to the Parliament the Government\u2019s agenda for the next three years, and what did we find? Almost nothing\u2014almost no detail, no aspiration, no hope, no sense of transformation. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000349\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002298dbeffa-e059-49d5-8bbf-579cbaead9a3\u0022\u003ETransformation\u2019s gone. Transformation used to be the catchcry of this Government, and now the catchcry appears to be little more than tinkering. They\u2019ve gone from aspiration to air dancing and that\u2019s really all they\u2019re good for\u2014a little bit of shadow-boxing, but nothing specific; no detail, no aspiration, and nothing to sort of hang their hats on\u2014and, unlike the first Speech from the Throne from this Labour Government, there was no mention of the Kermadec ocean sanctuary. There was no mention of cameras on fishing boats. There was no mention of a ban on mining on the conservation estate. I guess that those are things that have simply slipped through their fingers, no more to be of concern or hope for them. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000350\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002298dbeffa-e059-49d5-8bbf-579cbaead9a3\u0022\u003EThere\u2019s no action on reducing waste to landfill. A lot of warm fuzzy words from the previous Green Minister who had delegated responsibility through her associate environment spokesperson-ship, but nothing in the Speech from the Throne about those sorts of things, and, particularly, no mention at all about the need for technological, biological, breakthrough technology in terms of predator control and the sort of science and technology that is now available to us. Nothing ambitious, nothing on the horizon at all, to solve some of those important issues. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000351\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002298dbeffa-e059-49d5-8bbf-579cbaead9a3\u0022\u003EYes, there was some talk of Resource Management Act reform, but we\u2019ve heard all that before. I want to again reiterate the comments of the National Party leader\u2014the Leader of the Opposition, Judith Collins\u2014who has said that on this side of the House, we actually do want to work with the Government on Resource Management Act reform. We want to do that because we know how important it is to get it right, not just for our natural environment, but also for our built environment. Right at the minute, we all know in this House that the current legislative framework isn\u2019t working for either our natural environment or our built environment, and we can do so much better. But that\u2019s a big job and the risk that this current Government has is that under the Minister for the Environment, David Parker, it\u2019s likely to be a situation where we end up with a bundle of statutes that are worse than we have now. So watch out for that. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000352\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002298dbeffa-e059-49d5-8bbf-579cbaead9a3\u0022\u003EI want to just take a minute to finish in talking about the workplace relations scenario that confronts us. Small businesses, in particular, in New Zealand are being bashed relentlessly by this Government, who insists on inflicting more and more costs upon them. This Government seems to have a view that businesses can have an infinite capacity to absorb cost. Well, the sad news is that they don\u2019t. So an extra week\u2019s sick leave, an extra public holiday, fair-pay agreements\u2014these sorts of things that are driven largely by the agenda of the trade union movement and that now appear to be on the work programme of this current Government all add cost. None of it adds to productivity, and these small businesses, rather than taking on new staff, are at risk of putting staff off because they can only adjust their costs if they have to. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000353\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002298dbeffa-e059-49d5-8bbf-579cbaead9a3\u0022\u003ESo I\u2019m looking forward to this Parliament. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00224a25943b-cb3b-49c3-bd10-74316fae17f1\u0022 data-id=\u0022af3358049d994defb96ee53def91a7ed\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000354\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00224a25943b-cb3b-49c3-bd10-74316fae17f1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022af3358049d994defb96ee53def91a7ed\u0022\u003EASSISTANT SPEAKER (Hon Jacqui Dean)\u003C/span\u003E: I call the Hon Kiritapu Allan\u2014a five-minute call. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022a8cab3e3-b023-4ce7-9f4b-2c4137029057\u0022 data-id=\u002295a4e92dd3a6450288e373ec9451e92b\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000355\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a8cab3e3-b023-4ce7-9f4b-2c4137029057\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002295a4e92dd3a6450288e373ec9451e92b\u0022\u003EHon KIRITAPU ALLAN (Minister of Conservation):\u003C/span\u003E Madam Assistant Speaker, he tino h\u014Dnore ki te mihi ki a koe m\u014D t\u014D t\u016Branga h\u014Du m\u014D t\u0113nei P\u0101remata. Anei he mihi maioha ki a koe m\u014D t\u014D kaiwhakahaere o t\u0113nei Whare. N\u014D reira kei a koe, e te mema o Waitaki, \u0101nei he mihi ki a koe. Otir\u0101, ki ng\u0101 mema h\u014Du o te Whare nei, tino harikoa te ng\u0101kau ki te kite i a koutou kua haramai ki te whakap\u016Bawai ng\u0101 hiahia o t\u014D koutou wh\u0101nau, o t\u014D koutou iwi, o t\u014D koutou hapori katoa. Heoi an\u014D, m\u0101ku e tautoko te k\u014Drero o ng\u0101 mema ki mua\u2014nau mai, haramai, whakatau mai. Horo mai \u014D whakaaro, \u014D ringa ki te whiu atu, whai atu, tautoko atu t\u014D t\u0101tou nei wh\u0101nau. N\u014D reira ki a koutou. Nau mai, haramai, whakatau mai.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000356\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a8cab3e3-b023-4ce7-9f4b-2c4137029057\u0022\u003E[Madam Assistant Speaker, it is an honour to congratulate you on your new position in this Parliament. This is my heartfelt congratulations to you for your running the House. Well done to you, the MP for Waitaki, congratulations. To the new members of this House, I am very happy to see all of you who have made it here to fulfil the wishes of your family, your tribe, and your community. I support what previous speakers have said\u2014welcome, welcome, welcome. Bring with you your ideas and your hard work to throw forth, to pursue, and to support our families. So, to you all\u2014welcome, welcome, welcome.]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000357\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a8cab3e3-b023-4ce7-9f4b-2c4137029057\u0022\u003EI am so excited. I don\u2019t know if you can start this way, but I don\u2019t care. It\u2019s my first speech of the 53rd Parliament, and I am so excited to be here, in this House. It is such an incredible honour to be able to take your place in this Whare. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000358\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a8cab3e3-b023-4ce7-9f4b-2c4137029057\u0022\u003EFor me, it is my first time on my feet as the member of Parliament for the mighty, mighty, mighty East Coast. I must say, I couldn\u2019t be more delighted than to hold that title. I want to thank the constituents of that pito o te ao\u2014that place that is my home\u2014for putting their faith, their trust, and their confidence in me. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000359\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a8cab3e3-b023-4ce7-9f4b-2c4137029057\u0022\u003EI look across this House, and, indeed, during question time today, and, again, the new members that have joined us\u2014they impress me incredibly, the walks that they come from, whether they be from that side or this side of the House. But I am so excited about the lives that they have lived before coming into this place. I am so excited about the contributions that you will add to this House. I have done nothing but skite about the new talent that, in particular, has been added to this side of the House, and I must say that I still feel giddy, although it feels like the election was a long time ago now. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000360\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a8cab3e3-b023-4ce7-9f4b-2c4137029057\u0022\u003EFor us on this side of the House, we lost a couple of people that were really near and dear to us. I want to acknowledge the wh\u0101nau of my good friend Rudy Taylor and, in particular, the new member here, Shanan Halbert, who will give his maiden speech today\u2014the new member for Northcote. He was an incredible mentor to my good friend but, indeed, he was a mentor and colleague to all of us. I want to acknowledge his wife, Kaye Taylor, and all of their wh\u0101nau up there in the Hokianga. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000361\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a8cab3e3-b023-4ce7-9f4b-2c4137029057\u0022\u003EI too want to acknowledge the passing of the mother of my good friend Tane Phillips, the day of the election\u2014actually, it was just the morning after the election. Tane Phillips is the M\u0101ori vice-president for our party. He is a constituent in my electorate from the mighty place of Kawerau, and his family are all members of my Labour electorate committee. But his mother\u2019s passing was indeed a shock for all of us, so I want to throw my thoughts to him as well, and, again, to the passing of the father of our good mate here, Shanan: Winston Halbert, who passed the day of, I think, the election. So, my friend\u2014who will commence his journey in this House in a couple of moments\u2019 time\u2014just know that he has left a huge impression on all of us, and I know that he will guide you as you commence your journey here. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000362\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a8cab3e3-b023-4ce7-9f4b-2c4137029057\u0022\u003EHoi an\u014D, here we are in this 53rd Parliament, and as the Prime Minister gave her speech the other day, there was a clear mandate that has been given to this House, and that is not something that this side of the House takes lightly. The voters of Aotearoa New Zealand, they have voted for stability. They have voted for certainty. They have voted for cohesion. They have voted for a team with a plan. We went to the electorate with a very clear plan about how we would rebuild as a nation from that which has been the last year of COVID19. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000363\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a8cab3e3-b023-4ce7-9f4b-2c4137029057\u0022\u003EMadam Speaker, you heard that there were three very clear objectives for this Government as we come into the 53rd Parliament: first, to keep New Zealanders safe from COVID-19, and that will be an ongoing journey for all of us. Now, as I cast my mind out to my colleagues living across the world right now, they will be saying to me, \u201CKiritapu, you do not understand what it is that you have in Aotearoa New Zealand. You are walking the streets, you are playing sports, you are breaking bread\u2014you are in communion with your community.\u201D That is something we have vowed: to do our valiant best to take care of our community and keep New Zealanders safe from COVID-19. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000364\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a8cab3e3-b023-4ce7-9f4b-2c4137029057\u0022\u003ESecondly, the Prime Minister gave a very clear indication that our priority was on accelerating our economic recovery. That is something that we went to the electorate on. In the mighty East Coast, my colleague the Hon Meka Whaitiri and I\u2014we stomped up and down our electorate in the mighty East Coast looking at where this Government has invested in our future generations so that we can accelerate our economic recovery. I want to turn to that in a moment because it\u2019s something I\u2019m very passionate about: Jobs for Nature, in my portfolio as Minister of Conservation. So I\u2019ll come back to that in a second. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000365\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a8cab3e3-b023-4ce7-9f4b-2c4137029057\u0022\u003EThirdly, there was a very clear directive that we have that is about laying the foundations for our future. Now, there\u2019s one thing that I think we got a really clear direction from, and that came through the Speech from the Throne. This Government is not about doing business as usual (BAU). We\u2019re not here to do BAU, because it\u2019s always easy and it\u2019s been done and it\u2019s been done; we have been given a clear mandate to make radical change for our communities that need it the most. With such incredible turbulence and change that COVID-19 has brought, so too, in turn, must we all pivot. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000366\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a8cab3e3-b023-4ce7-9f4b-2c4137029057\u0022\u003ENow, I want to speak specifically about what we are doing in, particularly, the portfolio of conservation. I want to acknowledge my good friends the Green Party\u2014Te Roopu K\u0101k\u0101riki o Aotearoa. I want to acknowledge my good friend the Hon Eugenie Sage, who put her hand to the till, alongside my colleague the Hon David Parker, and supported, again, by the Minister of Finance. They have invested $1.3 billion in the Jobs for Nature programme, and I see that as fulfilling two key components in, one, our economic recovery and, two, investing in our future, and I want to walk briefly through that. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000367\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a8cab3e3-b023-4ce7-9f4b-2c4137029057\u0022\u003EWe have been given an opportunity with this particular fund to create what I see as a new generation of environmental warriors that we can clad and support. I guess we all know climate change is on our doorstep. Papat\u016B\u0101nuku is demanding something different from us right now. It is demanding that we change the way that we have lived in days gone by. We\u2019ve committed to those things like no more extraction of fossil fuels offshore and we\u2019re committing to climate targets, but, in turn, we have an opportunity with this fund in Jobs for Nature to create a whole generation that is passionate and that we clad with the skills, the abilities, and the technical expertise to come into a new career and new future that is based around the sustainability of our taiao, and I am incredibly excited by that. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000368\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a8cab3e3-b023-4ce7-9f4b-2c4137029057\u0022\u003EJust last week, I had the opportunity of supporting the aspirations of Te \u0100ti Awa ki Whakarongotai, just north of here, in and around \u014Ctaki. The mana whenua\u2014and my good friend the new member of Parliament for, what\u2019s it called? \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000369\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002261725fea-7d5e-4d1f-8fd3-e5779bb7a14d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002264d5d835c7684d0bb4f5cb9aece3b353\u0022\u003EBarbara Edmonds\u003C/span\u003E: Mana. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000370\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a8cab3e3-b023-4ce7-9f4b-2c4137029057\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022d55fdaa73aa4417aab66753ad6b428e5\u0022\u003EHon KIRITAPU ALLAN\u003C/span\u003E: Mana. I\u2019m sure she\u2019ll be very proud that this is in her patch, as well. But what we are doing is we are taking that investment from that Jobs for Nature fund. We are working on the partnership alongside the stewards of the whenua, working alongside those that have expertise in the area, and we are building up and we are investing in the future generations that can come, by creating jobs\u2014by becoming kaitiaki to those places that they call home. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000371\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a8cab3e3-b023-4ce7-9f4b-2c4137029057\u0022\u003EI mentioned just prior that alongside my good colleague the Hon Meka Whaitiri, just recently\u2014oh look, and we\u2019re almost at an end. I want to quickly end on Titirangi Maunga, the incredible work that has been done there stewarded by Charlotte Gibson, but investing in 17 young people to be kaitiaki of Titirangi. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000372\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a8cab3e3-b023-4ce7-9f4b-2c4137029057\u0022\u003EThis is an exciting time. T\u0113n\u0101 koe. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022badb0a39-849c-462a-b32f-77fc017c9fc2\u0022 data-id=\u0022c404078d2bda428c9a9a05f73380c9c1\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000373\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022badb0a39-849c-462a-b32f-77fc017c9fc2\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022c404078d2bda428c9a9a05f73380c9c1\u0022\u003EHon SIMON BRIDGES (National\u2014Tauranga):\u003C/span\u003E It\u2019s a pleasure to be talking in this Parliament, again, and it doesn\u2019t seem like so long ago we were doing that. Can I just acknowledge and welcome the new members. It\u2019s very exciting to see so many new faces. Can I acknowledge the last speaker, the Hon Kiritapu Allan. I thought she was full of energy. A very kinetic presentation, I thought, and\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000374\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a8cab3e3-b023-4ce7-9f4b-2c4137029057\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022cc9a026fc7a94b5dbc7488887b321f22\u0022\u003EHon Kiritapu Allan\u003C/span\u003E: I like that. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000375\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022badb0a39-849c-462a-b32f-77fc017c9fc2\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00224119e00291aa46db9a0621733b62faf7\u0022\u003EHon SIMON BRIDGES\u003C/span\u003E: \u2014that was good to see. Look it up, I think I\u2019ve got the right word. Could be wrong\u2014we\u2019ll see. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000376\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022badb0a39-849c-462a-b32f-77fc017c9fc2\u0022\u003ECould I also acknowledge you, Madam Assistant Speaker Dean, and congratulate you on your role. I know you\u2019ll do it with aplomb. You\u2019re a very experienced member, and we really, as I say, wish you well in it. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000377\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022badb0a39-849c-462a-b32f-77fc017c9fc2\u0022\u003EI want to speak and have a conversation, really, about the context in which this Government finds itself and the next three years that we have before us in this Parliament. I think the truth is that we start this Parliament with the economy stronger than most economists thought was going to be the case at the start of the year. The $14 billion in wage subsidies probably had something to do with that\u2014I don\u2019t know\u2014but there\u2019s been a lot of money pumped in. The pundits weren\u2019t right, and that\u2019s a good thing. But I do wonder, when the finance Minister and the Reserve Bank Governor are literally printing $100 billion\u2014one third of our economy\u2019s GDP\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000378\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00221312749eeeab446da75319038c30eab5\u0022\u003EDavid Seymour\u003C/span\u003E: Why didn\u2019t we think of it earlier? \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000379\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022badb0a39-849c-462a-b32f-77fc017c9fc2\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a36b9bf364204524b0f5ea175c16774b\u0022\u003EHon SIMON BRIDGES\u003C/span\u003E: Exactly\u2014when they\u2019re doing that, where\u2019s it all going to end? You know, as my good friend David Seymour says, why didn\u2019t we think of that earlier? Well, maybe it\u2019s because, actually, Social Credit weren\u2019t right. What we\u2019ve seen in the past shows that it doesn\u2019t work, and eventually\u2014maybe not this term, maybe this term, but some time this decade\u2014it\u2019s going to catch up with the world. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000380\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022badb0a39-849c-462a-b32f-77fc017c9fc2\u0022\u003EI was reading a thing. They\u2019re calling it modern monetary theory, and I think the reality is that if it sounds too good to be true\u2014borrowing yet more money; billions and billions and billions\u2014actually, it is. My great fear is that with a Government on that side of the House that says they\u2019re about inequality and dealing with hard issues like housing and poverty\u2014actually, with policies like that, they will be entrenching inequality in this country. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000381\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022badb0a39-849c-462a-b32f-77fc017c9fc2\u0022\u003EOn this side of the House, we, or certainly I, believe in smaller government. I think the reality is that it\u2019s businesses\u2014not them over there\u2014that make this country great. They get out every day, work hard, take risks, and respond to incentives, and bills like this one this evening put up the tax rate and bills like later this week that simply slap on more cost on small and medium sized business around this country aren\u2019t going to work. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000382\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022badb0a39-849c-462a-b32f-77fc017c9fc2\u0022\u003ERonald Reagan said a long time ago\u2014well, it must have been a long time ago\u2014that \u201CI\u2019m from the Government and I\u2019m here to help.\u201D were the scariest few words in the English language. I\u2019m not sure if that\u2019s true or not, but I do think, actually, a Government that\u2019s got less red tape and less tax and that isn\u2019t borrowing so much in the long-term interest of our country has got to be a better thing for this country, and I worry, actually, that we forget our freedoms sometimes. We\u2019re very complacent about them economically and also politically. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000383\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022badb0a39-849c-462a-b32f-77fc017c9fc2\u0022\u003EI want to say, look, there\u2019s some big issues in the world today. COVID-19\u2014heaven forbid, don\u2019t sort of stone me\u2014I don\u2019t think that\u2019s the biggest issue in the world today, actually. I think the reality of it is that it\u2019s a big issue, but there\u2019s a vaccine on the way, and we\u2019re very optimistic about that. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000384\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022badb0a39-849c-462a-b32f-77fc017c9fc2\u0022\u003EDare I say it, I don\u2019t even think that climate change is the biggest issue in the world today. Don\u2019t get me wrong\u2014and don\u2019t call the Human Rights Commission, all right? I mean, I know that\u2019s probably hate speech, or it will be by the end of this Parliament, but I think that issues like China and the US and the real potential, given a more aggressive China, for the misunderstanding in the room for that\u2014it\u2019s a real issue. I look at what\u2019s happening with Australia and their wine tariffs with real concern, and, actually, I think, for countries like New Zealand, it\u2019s a case of united we stand, divided we fall. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000385\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022badb0a39-849c-462a-b32f-77fc017c9fc2\u0022\u003ESo predictions: I think there are three scenarios for this Labour Government. They might be bold, but I think we can discount that straight away. I don\u2019t think there\u2019s really any chance of that, given our Prime Minister and Grant Robertson\u2019s temperament, and, actually, dare I say it, a bunch of New Zealanders\u2014farmers and other middle New Zealanders\u2014who lent them their vote will be watching them very carefully. I don\u2019t think they\u2019ll be bold. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000386\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022badb0a39-849c-462a-b32f-77fc017c9fc2\u0022\u003EThere\u2019s a chance they\u2019ll do nothing, and, actually, if we look at this week, when we\u2019re going to be debating climate change\u2014it\u2019s so urgent that they didn\u2019t do it last week. Actually, they put it off today and we\u2019ll do it tomorrow, and, when we get round to it, all we\u2019ll do is have a chat, right? That\u2019s literally what we\u2019re going to do, because the reality is that the Government hasn\u2019t done much on that. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000387\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022badb0a39-849c-462a-b32f-77fc017c9fc2\u0022\u003EI think the reality is something in the middle. They\u2019ll roll along not doing much, but with spurts here and there, and let me tell the members opposite something: the National Party will be there to hold you to account in the interest of New Zealanders. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00224a25943b-cb3b-49c3-bd10-74316fae17f1\u0022 data-id=\u0022f1514bc116a24c02bbc4761042d90c49\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000388\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00224a25943b-cb3b-49c3-bd10-74316fae17f1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022f1514bc116a24c02bbc4761042d90c49\u0022\u003EASSISTANT SPEAKER (Hon Jacqui Dean)\u003C/span\u003E: The Hon David Bennett\u2014five minutes. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022eaf79431-1033-44f1-a633-22633da52c0d\u0022 data-id=\u0022a8ef3a08fdcc42f4b0b3ab72098c868f\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000389\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022eaf79431-1033-44f1-a633-22633da52c0d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022a8ef3a08fdcc42f4b0b3ab72098c868f\u0022\u003EHon DAVID BENNETT (National):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Madam Assistant Speaker Dean, and I\u2019d just like to acknowledge you in your success in attaining that role. It\u2019s well-deserved, and I know you\u2019ll be a fair and impartial Speaker and we look forward to working with you. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000390\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022eaf79431-1033-44f1-a633-22633da52c0d\u0022\u003EI remember three years ago, I took this moment in a 10-minute speech to talk about socialism, and I mentioned it about 56 times. I won\u2019t try and mention it as many times today, but I\u2019ve got another word\u2014capitalism\u2014which is a much better word, which we will mention a lot more times in this speech. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000391\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022eaf79431-1033-44f1-a633-22633da52c0d\u0022\u003EThe history of the world shows that in times of a crisis like COVID, the last thing a country needs to do is revert to socialism as its answer. Look at Japan, Germany, South Korea, Vietnam\u2014all embraced capitalism and they are the most successful countries in the world. Countries like New Zealand and Britain, which embraced socialism, have now the problem that they go through a spurt every 20 or 30 years where they have to do a major capitalist reform to pick up where they\u2019ve lost out. Otherwise, they fall further and further down the track against other comparable countries. New Zealand is about to embrace the last period of socialism before we have to have another capitalist reform, because the socialism on that side will create the problems that will force a capitalist revolution in this country. That will happen, and there will be a new type of pro-capitalism, a new form of capitalism which will evolve in New Zealand in the next period of time. It may well come from the housing market or it may well come from those overseas pressures, but there will be a new form of capitalism coming, and it\u2019s not far away. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000392\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022eaf79431-1033-44f1-a633-22633da52c0d\u0022\u003EIt\u2019s going to be a country that\u2019s going to have open immigration, where we value and we bring in people that bring skills to this country, and we don\u2019t stop people, like the Labour Party over that side has. New capitalism will welcome people. New capitalism will actually build the infrastructure for our country. We won\u2019t have the Soviet-style roading projects under this Government, which are taking 10 years to build something that should have been built in three years. We will actually have a new capitalist environment which will build things, and a new capitalist environment that looks at Hamilton, Auckland, and Tauranga and sees that as an economic vehicle that can compete with the eastern seaboard of Australia, and Sydney and Melbourne, and we create a golden triangle between those three places. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000393\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022eaf79431-1033-44f1-a633-22633da52c0d\u0022\u003EWe\u2019ll see a new capitalism that has more technology, where we embrace technology. We welcome technology into this country, and we make this country the most technologically smart and successful country in the world, and we don\u2019t hold back on it. A new capitalism which actually supports our farmers and works with them and our growers to make sure that they are the economic engine of this country. We realise our economic potential but we also realise our competitive advantage, and we don\u2019t cut them off at their knees\u2014we actually let them perform. They will meet market desires and needs, but they need to be given the chance to do that in a productive way. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000394\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022eaf79431-1033-44f1-a633-22633da52c0d\u0022\u003EA new capitalism would reduce government significantly. There is no need for big government like we have now. There is no need for this country to borrow endlessly just to support government and the wishes of the Labour Party. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000395\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022eaf79431-1033-44f1-a633-22633da52c0d\u0022\u003EIn a new capitalist environment, we would actually have lower taxes. There should be lower taxes for New Zealanders going forward. We shouldn\u2019t be increasing taxes at a time when we need to encourage people to invest, to take risks, and to be aspirational for this country so that they can provide the jobs that actually provide the future for New Zealand. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000396\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022eaf79431-1033-44f1-a633-22633da52c0d\u0022\u003EIn a new capitalism, we\u2019re going to actually support M\u0101ori business aspirations so that M\u0101ori can take advantage of not only their people but also their land and the opportunities they have in the trade. A new capitalist environment would develop modern environmental solutions that are fitting for New Zealand but take our country forward and represent the views of our people. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000397\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022eaf79431-1033-44f1-a633-22633da52c0d\u0022\u003EWe\u2019d look at new trade agreements under modern, new capitalism but, most importantly of all, the new capitalism that will arise from this terrible Labour Government will be one that actually looks forward as aspirational for New Zealanders and that actually makes sure that we back our people to take a chance and move forward. That is the future of New Zealand. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000398\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022eaf79431-1033-44f1-a633-22633da52c0d\u0022\u003ESocialism will die with this Government. After that, we will have to go through that revolution we always go through each generation that brings us back to the situation where we actually can fight and compete in a modern world. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022073496a0-73b7-426f-97f8-916bd542b0fa\u0022 data-id=\u0022712724589f214d66b45d34ac10b59498\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000399\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022073496a0-73b7-426f-97f8-916bd542b0fa\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022712724589f214d66b45d34ac10b59498\u0022\u003EHon MEKA WHAITIRI (Minister of Customs):\u003C/span\u003E E te M\u0101ngai o te Whare, t\u0113n\u0101 koe. Otir\u0101, ng\u0101 mema h\u014Du o te Whare nei, t\u0113n\u0101 koutou. Ng\u0101 mema katoa\u2014ka nui te mihi ki a koutou katoa. T\u0113n\u0101 t\u0101tou katoa.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000400\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022073496a0-73b7-426f-97f8-916bd542b0fa\u0022\u003E[To the new members of this House, congratulations. To all the members\u2014greetings and salutations to you all. Thank you.]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000401\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022073496a0-73b7-426f-97f8-916bd542b0fa\u0022\u003EI\u2019m pleased to take a call in this Address in Reply debate. Can I firstly acknowledge yourself, Madam Assistant Speaker Dean, and the presiding officers. I congratulate you all and look forward to your combined wisdom and your guidance in the 53rd Parliament, so ng\u0101 mihi ki a koe. To the new MPs, in my brief opening address, can I acknowledge you all. It is indeed a privilege, as you will find out\u2014serving in this House\u2014so I sincerely congratulate you all for being here. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000402\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022073496a0-73b7-426f-97f8-916bd542b0fa\u0022\u003ELast night, I joined the Pacific caucus in acknowledging our Pacific new MPs, and I want to say it is pleasing to be part of not only a Labour Government but a very diverse Government on this side. I want to acknowledge all our new class of 2020 for the exiting experience, the energy, and, of course, diversity and inclusion they all bring to this House. I want to also acknowledge the returning MPs, for those that have made it back into this House for the 53rd Parliament. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000403\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022073496a0-73b7-426f-97f8-916bd542b0fa\u0022\u003EIkaroa-R\u0101whiti\u2014can I acknowledge the voters of Ikaroa-R\u0101whiti. We had three campaign goals in this year\u2019s election: one, to retain this seat; two, to return a Jacinda Ardern - led Government; and, of course, three, to increase our party vote from 65 percent to 67. We achieved all those gains, and I want to acknowledge the voters of Ikaroa-R\u0101whiti. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000404\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022073496a0-73b7-426f-97f8-916bd542b0fa\u0022\u003EAs is customary, I want to acknowledge those dear ones we have lost over this year, and I want to particularly acknowledge Hinemanuhiri Vercoe. I want to acknowledge Temple Isaacs and, of course, our beloved colleague Shanan Halbert\u2019s father, Winston Halbert. These three people, particularly, were staunch supporters of Labour in my electorate. They are a big loss, and I mihi out to them and their wh\u0101nau. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000405\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022073496a0-73b7-426f-97f8-916bd542b0fa\u0022\u003EAs the Prime Minister outlaid in her debate in this House, the Labour Government has three overarching objectives. Clearly, we are still very much focused on COVID and health and on protecting our nation and our borders, and the recovery\u2014realising we need to accelerate the recovery aspect of our plan\u2014but also with an eye to the future. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000406\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022073496a0-73b7-426f-97f8-916bd542b0fa\u0022\u003EI briefly want to touch on the importance for me, as the Minister of Customs, on how the Customs Service are contributing to those three overarching objectives. In the health space, clearly Customs continues to work at our borders. One of the first and primary agencies to keep our borders safe, I want to acknowledge Customs for their work that they have accomplished over this very trying year, alongside all our other border agencies like Immigration New Zealand and the Ministry for Primary Industries. They have done a stellar job of ensuring that only the right people come in, and I want to acknowledge Customs for their work in that space. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000407\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022073496a0-73b7-426f-97f8-916bd542b0fa\u0022\u003EThey\u2019re also responsible for the Maritime Border Order, an absolutely new role, as we move from airports into our ports. I had the privilege on Friday of visiting such a port in my electorate of Gisborne, alongside my colleague the Hon Kiritapu Allan, to meet some fine folk that are monitoring our ports, and so I want to acknowledge the work on the Maritime Border Order that Customs are administering. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000408\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022073496a0-73b7-426f-97f8-916bd542b0fa\u0022\u003EIn terms of the economic recovery, Customs are playing a role in terms of our long-term economic impacts by boosting New Zealand\u2019s exports and competitiveness through increased trust in the supply chain. They\u2019re also protecting and promoting New Zealand\u2019s trade interests abroad, and they\u2019re also supporting duty-payers and building assurances over e-commerce while building capacity to respond to non-compliance. The work of Customs is often under the radar, but in this particular contribution in the House, I want to acknowledge their stellar work over this year but also as we recover and we move into our future opportunities, as outlaid by the Prime Minister in her Address in Reply debate speech in this House and, of course, in the Speech from the Throne. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000409\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022073496a0-73b7-426f-97f8-916bd542b0fa\u0022\u003EIt\u2019s really important that our economic plan, which is made up of five parts\u2014which resonates with myself as a M\u0101ori Minister but also as a M\u0101ori MP\u2014is about putting our people first and about investing in our people. It is about creating jobs. As an electorate MP of a large electorate\u2014which includes the Tai R\u0101whiti, through the East Coast of the North Island\u2014creating jobs is really going to be critical for our future survival, and I want to acknowledge that is preparing for our future, because we\u2019re a dynamic and transformative Government on this side. We want to invest in our young people, and we\u2019ve got the plans and the policies to do that. We also want to acknowledge the important role small business will play in that recovery, and we\u2019ve got a suite of plans to engage and be informed by the opportunity that small business will play. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000410\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022073496a0-73b7-426f-97f8-916bd542b0fa\u0022\u003EOf course, as many nations around the world close their borders or are still closing them through COVID, we here in Aotearoa New Zealand still enjoy the freedom of movement, and I want to talk about our global positioning. That is the fifth part of our economic recovery plan, and who better to do it than us here in Aotearoa New Zealand. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000411\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022073496a0-73b7-426f-97f8-916bd542b0fa\u0022\u003EI\u2019m proud to be a member, in this 53rd Parliament, of the Labour Government. We have a plan that I\u2019ve outlined and supported that the Prime Minister has shared in this House. I\u2019m standing in support of it because I know for the people of Ikaroa-R\u0101whiti, of Te Tai R\u0101whiti, and of the entire East Coast, we\u2019ve got a plan to ensure that we come out of this COVID solid and building on the energy and the innovation that we represent in this House and the people that we\u2019ve come in to be a voice for, to ensure that the gains are for all. That is what this Government is promising. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000412\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022073496a0-73b7-426f-97f8-916bd542b0fa\u0022\u003EN\u014D reira, e te M\u0101ngai o te Whare, t\u0113n\u0101 koe. T\u0113n\u0101 t\u0101tou katoa. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022 data-id=\u00228351a55f693a4facaf237624f8beead9\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000413\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00228351a55f693a4facaf237624f8beead9\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: I call Naisi Chen for her maiden statement. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022cc477162-e622-4c94-add7-36a586729e51\u0022 data-id=\u0022c1db2c9782d44cfab36a0a0cfb9d5e10\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000414\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cc477162-e622-4c94-add7-36a586729e51\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022c1db2c9782d44cfab36a0a0cfb9d5e10\u0022\u003ENAISI CHEN (Labour):\u003C/span\u003E T\u0113n\u0101 koutou e aku rangatira. Ki ng\u0101 mate, haere, haere, haere atu r\u0101. Ka mihi ki te mana whenua, ki a t\u0101tou e tau nei, kia ora. T\u0113n\u0101 koutou, t\u0113n\u0101 t\u0101tou katoa.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000415\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cc477162-e622-4c94-add7-36a586729e51\u0022\u003E[Distinguished members, greetings. To those who have passed on, rest in peace. I acknowledge the tribes of this land and I acknowledge those of us here today. Greetings one and all.]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000416\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cc477162-e622-4c94-add7-36a586729e51\u0022\u003ET\u0113n\u0101 koe, Mr Speaker. I want to congratulate you on your election. It\u2019s people like you that make it a little bit easier for people like me, a 26-year-old who has hopes of one day also being in this House and to form a family and have children of my own\u2014so thank you. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000417\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cc477162-e622-4c94-add7-36a586729e51\u0022\u003ETo tangata whenua, I acknowledge you. I have always believed that as migrants, we need to build a stronger relationship with M\u0101ori and gain a rich appreciation of tikanga in order to truly understand the land to which we want to belong. I\u2019m also really excited that a part of your history involves the Chinese people. Since the first Chinese person, Appo Hocton, came to New Zealand in 1842, our wh\u0101naus have been interconnected. This is a story which I look forward to telling more. I commit myself to you as an ally, as someone who upholds the principles of Te Tiriti, and, hopefully, one day as your wh\u0101nau too. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000418\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cc477162-e622-4c94-add7-36a586729e51\u0022\u003EI acknowledge the Chinese that have come before me, both in this House but more so in this country, especially the ones that have been here for generations. They have been a community, despite adversity like the poll tax, and have thrived in all endeavours, including the goldmining age, in agriculture, in the laundromats, and in fruit and vege stalls. I acknowledge you all for your spirit and hard work, and look forward to working together to help preserve that knowledge and history. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000419\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cc477162-e622-4c94-add7-36a586729e51\u0022\u003EMy journey to this House started with my father, who is in the gallery here today, arriving on the beautiful shores of Aotearoa in 1996 with just $200 in his pockets. After two years of hard work and lots of challenges along the way, like having his files lost by immigration\u2014I\u2019m sure Kris Faafoi is running a better department now\u2014my mother and I joined him here in 1999. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000420\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cc477162-e622-4c94-add7-36a586729e51\u0022\u003EMy parents practised as an osteopathist and a gynaecologist in China, but didn\u2019t even think twice when offered the opportunity to come to New Zealand. My dad had always had a soul that longed for freedom, and Aotearoa was his perfect little country. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000421\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cc477162-e622-4c94-add7-36a586729e51\u0022\u003EBeing new citizens of a country brought huge challenges. My parents were never engaged in politics. Being migrants, they could not understand the complicated MMP system or keep up with the fighting, adversarial ways we talk in this House. Unlike many colleagues, politics was not discussed at our dinner table, but our community was. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000422\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cc477162-e622-4c94-add7-36a586729e51\u0022\u003EWhether it was how to better help a patient they saw that day, or the details of the next event they had to organise for our local church, I knew my parents were always focused on their neighbours\u2019 needs above their own. Often, I\u2019d wake up in the middle of the night to find that they had been called out to mediate in a domestic dispute\u2014now that I recollect that, it was probably a little bit illegal. They installed in me a never-ending commitment to serving those around me. Despite sometimes facing betrayal and disappointment, they have always demonstrated to me how to persevere in hard times, how to hold on to integrity and stay true to the vision from above, and I acknowledge them in this House today. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000423\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cc477162-e622-4c94-add7-36a586729e51\u0022\u003EGrowing up in New Zealand as a young migrant was a bit like a social experiment. I was trying to balance the stereotypical Asian piano-practising and the good math grades\u2014for those who know me, that\u2019s a joke\u2014against the really Kiwi side of always disappointing my mum when I came home barefoot and with no books in my bag, and all the while often playing translator for my parents, as well, in dealings with our landlord, utility companies, and at parent-teacher interviews. They stopped going once I reached intermediate school because they realised the information they had been getting was somewhat single-sided. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000424\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cc477162-e622-4c94-add7-36a586729e51\u0022\u003EI am not unique in these experiences, as they are shared by most 1.5 generation migrants. I want to be able to celebrate and cheer on each one of them in this House as they take their rightful place in our community. Whether it be on the 6 o\u2019clock news, being made partner in large firms, or in leadership roles within our community, we have been and continue to be bridges back to our families and our communities. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000425\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cc477162-e622-4c94-add7-36a586729e51\u0022\u003EI cheer them on also because it is us who will be the people who contribute more fully to New Zealand and help shape a new New Zealand. I stand here today as the only MP of Chinese ethnicity, despite 5 percent of the population identifying with this ethnicity. So I say that with regret. There are huge barriers for migrant communities in getting into politics. Our stories are often not told by ourselves. With my platform, I will fight to have our voices heard and fight against the racism that we experience. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000426\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cc477162-e622-4c94-add7-36a586729e51\u0022\u003EBut the Chinese community needs to look within, as well. The Chinese language media is often selective in the information that it portrays, and has demonstrated, sometimes, a slight misunderstanding in our country and our system. What gives me hope is that I\u2019m the first 1.5 generation Chinese standing here in this House and I can see a new tide coming in. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000427\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cc477162-e622-4c94-add7-36a586729e51\u0022\u003EMy, perhaps, most taken out of context quote is that \u201CI have no interest in politics.\u201D Taken at face value, it is still rather true. In fact, my whole entire journey of leadership was quite a passive one. All my life, I had one dream, really, and that was to become a housewife. I was always shoulder-tapped to get involved and to hold leadership positions. That started with our high school committee. My good friend Max, then a complete stranger to me, offered me the role of girls school leader when, looking back, the only leadership quality I possessed at that time was just a really loud voice to silence a room full of rowdy teenagers. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000428\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cc477162-e622-4c94-add7-36a586729e51\u0022\u003EThe Office of Ethnic Communities then approached me for me to join the young leaders\u2019 programme, something that has shaped my passion for public service, and then, a year later, Max came back to me and said I should be joining the New Zealand Chinese Students\u2019 Association (NZCSA). Thank you, Max, for always opening up new opportunities for me, for installing in me a love of all things strategy, for teaching me how to think rationally and independently, and for being my biggest critic. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000429\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cc477162-e622-4c94-add7-36a586729e51\u0022\u003EBeing president of the New Zealand Chinese Students\u2019 Association was something I never wanted, but it was one of those \u201CIf not me, then who?\u201D moments I often find myself in. In NZCSA, I realised that most Chinese students never really integrated into the mainstream. They come to New Zealand from their own country, but still hang out in their own groups, seeking employment from Chinese businesses, which I soon realised reflected the wider Chinese community. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000430\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cc477162-e622-4c94-add7-36a586729e51\u0022\u003EI believe that every migrant needs to integrate into New Zealand by adopting Kiwi values. Perhaps the substance of those values requires further discussion, but I would like to suggest the principles Te Tiriti, kindness, and diversity. This does not mean we forbid people from practising their own culture or religion\u2014far from it. Rather, we must celebrate every culture, knowing that it strengthens us as country. In a society as diverse as New Zealand, we shouldn\u2019t ever condone racism, but instead be able to let each culture adapt to New Zealand, so that it becomes a uniquely Kiwi version of that culture. The harmonisation of New Zealand values and cultural heritage\u2014that\u2019s what I see as the biggest challenge in our society during the years I will serve in this House. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000431\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cc477162-e622-4c94-add7-36a586729e51\u0022\u003EThe passivity continued in the story of how I joined the Labour Party. I still think it was borderline reckless that Raymond Huo, two weeks after hearing me speak at a function, asked whether I wanted to be a Labour Party candidate. I still remember at our meeting at his law firm that I had a CV in my bag, thinking he would be offering me a job there and then. He laughed at me when I said I wanted to become a criminal lawyer, but I don\u2019t know whether being an MP was anything better than that. Thank you to the Labour wh\u0101nau. Thank you for accepting me for who I am, for being always so generous in your support, for trusting me to represent our values here in this House. Thank you to our leaders in the party\u2014to Claire, to Nigel, to Andrew Kirton, to Paul, and the entire New Zealand council. Thank you for trusting me then, as a 23-year-old, and thank you for trusting me now.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000432\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cc477162-e622-4c94-add7-36a586729e51\u0022\u003EI was lucky enough to have the Rt Hon Helen Clark as a Prime Minister growing up. The little bit of extra help my mother got from Working for Families was put towards my piano, flute, then eventually double bass and tuba lessons. Music played a huge part in my upbringing. It gave me a platform to build my confidence, to search for the deeper meaning of beauty, and to make lifelong friends. I\u2019m deeply passionate about the arts sector, and, borrowing what my colleague Rachel Boyack said to the youth choir who sang so beautifully at our State Opening last week, when the arts are strong, then our nation is strong. Thank you, Helen, for the leadership you showed in supporting Kiwi talent. I hope to continue your legacy in the promotion of our unique New Zealand identity through music and the arts\u2014and thank you for always replying to my Instagram messages.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000433\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cc477162-e622-4c94-add7-36a586729e51\u0022\u003EBeing the second youngest in this House\u2014although I think Chl\u00F6e and I are four months apart, and we settled on calling ourselves the \u201Cyoung people of Parliament\u201D; shout-out to Chl\u00F6e, because I know what I\u2019m about to say, you are definitely passionate about too\u2014I would like to leave this place seeing my efforts in supporting the next generation of young politics come to fruition in young politicians from all communities. My leadership philosophy has always been to facilitate excellence, and that means I will put in the mahi to make politics more accessible by taking the time to break down jargon, to actually explain concepts, and to model the behaviour I expect of leaders. I invited all my guests today to bring their young children so that at an early age they know Parliament is their Parliament too. I hope they are as fortunate as I am in their journey.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000434\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cc477162-e622-4c94-add7-36a586729e51\u0022\u003EBeing a young person means that we are the bearers of the decisions made today into the future. As this House makes laws to navigate through one of the biggest economic challenges in our lifetime, I want to bring new ideas to the table. I see the recovery period as being a unique opportunity to redefine our economy\u2014build it up to be stronger and more resilient than before. I believe that high tech but green tech will lead us into economic prosperity. I believe this time the world is looking for inspiration and we need to push bolder policies that support these industries by attracting innovative firms to our shores, encouraging Kiwis to really think outside the box, and giving them practical tools to do it. Although we are a small country, we can influence. I hope this House never forgets that power. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000435\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cc477162-e622-4c94-add7-36a586729e51\u0022\u003EOver the last few weeks during the induction process, we\u2019ve been told how difficult it is to have good personal relationships while holding public office. So today I ask forgiveness of all my friends and wh\u0101nau in advance, and tell you that your friendship and aroha means a lot to me. In the gallery sits my best friend since intermediate. Our friendship began with one single question: \u201CCan we be friends?\u201D She\u2019s been backstage at all of my most important events. She was the first to cry when she found out that I got a really high list placing this year; my mum didn\u2019t even bother! Thank you to those who stood with us over the many, many tough years, to Yingrui, Tracy, Ken, my 2017 team in Liangliang Bill, Martin, my new Botany family Ben and Judy. I acknowledge you also, Chris, and also Damien here, in Botany, and the whole greater east side\u2014and Simeon; the east side wh\u0101nau. And thank you to Song, to Ed, for all of the support that you\u2019ve given me in hooking me up with all the coolest collateral in town and picking up the balls when I\u2019ve dropped them. I stand here because of the love they\u2019ve given me, and I want to pass that love on to all the people I come into contact with and serve. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000436\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cc477162-e622-4c94-add7-36a586729e51\u0022\u003EThank you to all my team and the team that will be coming on alongside me of Ming and Ben and every other person in my office. I know we\u2019ve got a big job ahead of us. I\u2019m privileged to serve in the largest ever caucus in MMP history and I\u2019m extremely thankful to our leader, the Rt Hon Jacinda Ardern, for the words of encouragement you\u2019ve given me in the past three years. Jacinda, you\u2019re the best boss any young girl could ask for. You look out for us, you encourage us, and you make sure that we don\u2019t feel overwhelmed in this place.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000437\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cc477162-e622-4c94-add7-36a586729e51\u0022\u003EAt the end of the day, if there is any praise for anything that I am or eventually will become, then let it be reflected in my maker. May God bless our nation and let it be a beacon of light to the world and a haven from everything that\u2019s been going on\u2014all of the contrast that we will bring to a global perspective. Ko koe te hanga, e hiakai ana, e hiainu ana, ki te tika e m\u0101kona hoki r\u0101tou.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000438\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cc477162-e622-4c94-add7-36a586729e51\u0022\u003E[Blessed are they that hunger and thirst for righteousness, for they shall be satisfied.]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000439\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cc477162-e622-4c94-add7-36a586729e51\u0022\u003EN\u014D reira, t\u0113n\u0101 koutou, t\u0113n\u0101 koutou, t\u0113n\u0101 koutou katoa.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000440\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cc477162-e622-4c94-add7-36a586729e51\u0022\u003E[Applause]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022 data-id=\u002210a443c83b4a4fb4b444d21763849298\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000441\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002210a443c83b4a4fb4b444d21763849298\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: I call on Helen White for her maiden statement. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00225ec01d23-b55e-45b9-a668-d3bf14212126\u0022 data-id=\u002226facb7903c741c1a45a84fb9a22411a\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000442\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225ec01d23-b55e-45b9-a668-d3bf14212126\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002226facb7903c741c1a45a84fb9a22411a\u0022\u003EHELEN WHITE (Labour):\u003C/span\u003E T\u0113n\u0101 koutou katoa. It is an honour to be here. While I was preparing for this speech, I was forwarded an email with helpful advice from a member of the judiciary. It reads as follows: \u201CRemind her what a special opportunity she has. She can say what she likes\u2014the New Zealand Bill of Rights Act, section 14. It is a privileged occasion\u2014Defamation Act, section 13. The ordinary rules of debate don\u2019t apply, and the Opposition have no right of reply. Most new MPs do not realise the possibilities for anarchy and spoil it by talking about their ideals and what brought them to Parliament, but she should not feel constrained by a lack of precedent.\u201D It is tempting. Likely to the relief of my party whips, I will not be defaming anyone today. But it occurred to me that it was likely no accident that this call to anarchy came from a person at the top of my profession who had taken on public office at the necessary personal cost of being able to freely express the frustrations that long experience in the law gives rise to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000443\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225ec01d23-b55e-45b9-a668-d3bf14212126\u0022\u003EI recognise the valuable opportunity I have been given to take partisan action, drawing on my experience. I get to say plainly what I think and advocate to fix what I think needs fixing. It is what I saw in my 27 years of practising employment law that drew me here and will guide me. I will get to that in a minute, but first I want to acknowledge that it is the wonderful leadership of the Labour Party right now that makes me thrilled to be here.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000444\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225ec01d23-b55e-45b9-a668-d3bf14212126\u0022\u003EI am delighted to join a team which is at once diverse and unified. When I stood in 2017, the Labour Party was languishing in the polls. Low polls often lead to division, so I was delighted to find the Labour Party was, despite this, ridiculously unified. I have the greatest respect for the Hon Andrew Little, the leader at the time, because he is exactly that: honourable. So I put the unified culture down to good people leading with integrity. But I now think it was also the result of their unifying purpose, which I saw simply as seeking to redevelop basic respect between people, which is the essential building block of community. When we treat each other with dignity and respect, we listen, and we truly see each other, thus we foster genuine connection. What I have witnessed in the last term of Government was the impact of applying that resolve.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000445\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225ec01d23-b55e-45b9-a668-d3bf14212126\u0022\u003EI consider that the Labour team from 2017 has successfully revitalised our sense of community. While it is a pity it didn\u2019t happen earlier, it happened at a critical time in our history. The Government prioritised our vulnerable, and this value guided the response to the pandemic\u2014it still does. I am so thankful for it. It came after years of policies which ignored the interconnections between us and entrenched disrespect for those who were vulnerable. This approach led many of our citizens to become overwhelmed, depressed, and alienated. It shattered our sense of community. It gave rise to things like chronic homelessness. I watched the reality of the impact of the growing gap between rich and poor in my city and in my area of law.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000446\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225ec01d23-b55e-45b9-a668-d3bf14212126\u0022\u003EI grew up and stood in Auckland Central. I want to talk about why I\u2019m committed to providing affordable housing in every community, including expensive places like Auckland Central and Waiheke, why, while it is no wonder that houses in such wonderful locations have gone up, I would like to see the older residents being able to afford to stay, and for these places to once again become places where people can live well no matter what they earn. I share with many others a vision of a well-designed, compact, affordable city which allows this rebalance, and I will work to this end.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000447\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225ec01d23-b55e-45b9-a668-d3bf14212126\u0022\u003EMy parents came from Kawerau to Freemans Bay in 1971 when it was affordable\u2014just. They were not from wealthy families; there was no inheritance. My father told me once about his parents camping a whole summer on a Gisborne beach with a young baby because no one would rent them a house as they had too many children. Eventually, my grandfather lied about the number of children to solve that problem. Both my parents worked. While the inner city was more affordable and undervalued than other parts of Auckland at the time, it was still a struggle for my parents to pay the mortgage. I remember the constant anxiety about whether we would be able to keep our house. As the value of homes in the area rose, the leasehold and the rates went up, and it was becoming impossible to pay the annual land lease. My parents bought the lease when the interest rates were in double digits. Everything they had went into keeping that house. This had nothing to do with astute investment\u2014it is still the first place most struggling families put their money. But as house prices went up, I watched most of the poorer families I grew up with in Auckland Central move out. When I went to primary school, I was one of a few P\u0101lagi kids at a Pasifika-dominated school. Many in the Pasifika community left Auckland Central during my childhood; most working class families did.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000448\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225ec01d23-b55e-45b9-a668-d3bf14212126\u0022\u003EMy experience is that affordable housing is a major building block of healthy relationships with each other, because it means we really know each other as neighbours and as equals. When there is an increasing gap between rich and poor, it is very possible for people on different incomes to live in a physically separated world, and they quickly lose empathy with each other. In the last decade, I frequently heard talk of \u201Closers\u201D by those on high incomes when talking about poorer people. This language betrays a lack of empathy, and it demonstrates how disconnection leads to dangerous contempt. During the campaign, the Opposition complained that Labour\u2019s progressive income tax punished hard workers; this is plainly out of touch with reality. The reality is many low-income workers work the hardest of all New Zealanders, and I saw that in my practice, not to mention that many on lower incomes are doing jobs which help others rather than themselves. It is less likely anyone would think such things if their neighbours proved otherwise.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000449\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225ec01d23-b55e-45b9-a668-d3bf14212126\u0022\u003EIn my work in the same time, I saw that there had been a personal grievance procedure meant to protect the rights of blue-collar workers that had become prohibitively expensive for those very workers. I have seen the exploitation of our most vulnerable workers by the side-stepping of employment law through the adoption of a contracting model. I was frustrated that those who took a case seeking reinstatement had to settle it because they feared a costs award against them and had to trade their job for whatever compensation they could get, often so they could pay their lawyers. I saw wages get lower and work get less secure. Most importantly, as a result I saw good people who had done nothing wrong and their families break under the pressure.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000450\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225ec01d23-b55e-45b9-a668-d3bf14212126\u0022\u003EI have been given more outlet for expressing and acting upon my frustrations than most lawyers. A highlight was taking an important case about collectivity in front of a full court, thanks to Maurice Davis and the wonderful Amalgamated Workers Union NZ, here today in the gallery. It reinforced the value of unions in a society that seemed to have forgotten them. I also recognise that I have been working in a field that has had many redeeming features, including fantastic colleagues and judges. I am aware other areas of the law have been more extremely impacted by the lack of affordable access to justice. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000451\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225ec01d23-b55e-45b9-a668-d3bf14212126\u0022\u003EOne of the most positive changes I experienced in employment law was the introduction of an expectation of respectful treatment in the interactions between employers and employees\u2014what we call good faith. Good faith was introduced by the Rt Hon Margaret Wilson in the Clark Government. It was introduced after a decade of the application of an individualised contractual model. My experience was everyone, including employers, breathed a sigh of relief when good faith was introduced. Combat is exhausting. Most of us will know from our private lives that it simply does not work in any long-term relationship.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000452\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225ec01d23-b55e-45b9-a668-d3bf14212126\u0022\u003EWhat I learnt from this was the power of good legislative change. This standard of respect may be frequently broken, but it is a standard that Parliament set and it has shaped the values and guided those who genuinely seek to be good employers and employees. I do not discount the many injustices that still harm many New Zealanders in our workplaces; I wouldn\u2019t be here if I did. But the legislative change that successfully engendered greater respect between people in the workplace was us.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000453\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225ec01d23-b55e-45b9-a668-d3bf14212126\u0022\u003EIn the first COVID shutdown, workers and employers faced a frightening experience together. There was no real precedent for what to do when a business is severely curtailed by factors beyond the control of either employer or employee. I was surprised at how many employers and employees came to practical compromise over payment and hours. I think that is a testament to the good-faith relationship. However, it also proved how unrealistic a system is which relies on individual negotiation in large workplaces. Is it really practical for 7,000 workers in one workplace to attempt to negotiate individually with their employer over a dramatic pay cut, in 48 hours? Does it really work for the employer or the employee? Isn\u2019t it time for us to recognise the value of a good longstanding relationship between such employers and a union?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000454\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225ec01d23-b55e-45b9-a668-d3bf14212126\u0022\u003EMany have clung to their dislike of unions by considering they are anti-competitive. All that has been achieved is the depression of wages and a greater gap between rich and poor. I want to see competition fostered where it will reinforce growth, including income growth\u2014for example, to see a more certain and concrete prohibition of restraints of trade in employment agreements of low-paid workers. Our law already says that restraints of trade are prima facie illegal, but herein lies the value of my practical experience in the law. Restraints are habitually included in individual agreements for workers on wages close to the minimum wage. The poorer the worker, the more unlikely they are to challenge them. The possibility of litigation is too frightening. This means low-paid workers are afraid to go and set up their own cafe or move to the competition who might offer them a pay rise. It stifles their capacity to move from, say, $20 to $25 per hour. It means their employer has no incentive to pay them more, because they do not fear losing them to a competitor.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000455\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225ec01d23-b55e-45b9-a668-d3bf14212126\u0022\u003EIt is time for me to thank those who have worked their socks off to get me here and who have given me wonderful support. I will never get over the generosity of those willing to actually work for no self-gain. I would like to make special mention of my parents, both of whom are here today. I am so proud of them. My mother, Carol, was the first co-principal in a secondary school in New Zealand, and during that time she welcomed the Tampa refugees into her school. They in turn had, of course, been welcomed by the Clark Government. Those people were better off for the care she showed them and other New Zealanders took of them after a traumatic experience. She set up several creches which flourish today\u2014her first in Kawerau so I could go there. She is a brave and clever woman I much admire.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000456\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225ec01d23-b55e-45b9-a668-d3bf14212126\u0022\u003EI would also like to thank my incredible children Max, Eva, and Imogen. Eva lost her job in recruitment due to COVID and immediately found work in a drive-through testing station, then as a medical receptionist. She is now back in her chosen career, but I acknowledge that she and many others like her had a really hard year. My brother Gabriel also lost his job as an English-as-a-second-language teacher. Despite this, they have both helped me enormously at every turn, and I\u2019d like to thank them. I would like to make a special shout-out to Archie and my family in the UK, who are having a pretty challenging time in lockdown there too.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000457\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225ec01d23-b55e-45b9-a668-d3bf14212126\u0022\u003EFinally, I would like to thank all those who love me despite disagreeing with me. You have brought me so much happiness and it is never boring. I have been very lucky to have you all in my corner and I couldn\u2019t be prouder. Thank you.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000458\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225ec01d23-b55e-45b9-a668-d3bf14212126\u0022\u003E[Applause]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022 data-id=\u002275773d9c528d4439a93a761d8ece076e\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000459\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002275773d9c528d4439a93a761d8ece076e\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: I call Shanan Halbert for his maiden statement. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00229c069cdb-968c-4f11-b126-92f9c655148b\u0022 data-id=\u0022503cd9b374f34f7397226c5e2c017f0f\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000460\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00229c069cdb-968c-4f11-b126-92f9c655148b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022503cd9b374f34f7397226c5e2c017f0f\u0022\u003ESHANAN HALBERT (Labour\u2014Northcote):\u003C/span\u003E Tupu te toi, whanake te toi, he toi ora te toi, he toi i ahu mai i Hawaiki. T\u014D purutanga, t\u014D tauwhanga, t\u014D taumuri ki te mana atua. Ka puta ki te whai ao, ka puta ki te ao m\u0101rama.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000461\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00229c069cdb-968c-4f11-b126-92f9c655148b\u0022\u003EKi te p\u0101p\u0101, e tangi tonu ana te ng\u0101kau ki a koe kua riro nei. Ko koe t\u0113nei i mate i te w\u0101 o te p\u014Dtitanga. Ko te tohu M\u0101ori e k\u012B ana\u2014n\u0101u ng\u0101 tatau o te ao P\u0101remata i huaki, anei ahau t\u014D tamaiti, e tomo atu nei. Waiho ko taku kawe i \u014D akoranga me taku mahi i ng\u0101 mahi hei mihi m\u0101ku ki a koe. Moe mai e P\u0101, moe mai, moe mai, moe mai r\u0101.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000462\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00229c069cdb-968c-4f11-b126-92f9c655148b\u0022\u003EKa huri atu, e te iwi. E ng\u0101 rangatira\u2014te iti, te rahi, e tau nei\u2014t\u0113n\u0101 koutou, t\u0113n\u0101 koutou, t\u0113n\u0101 koutou katoa.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000463\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00229c069cdb-968c-4f11-b126-92f9c655148b\u0022\u003E[Grow the treasure, develop the treasure, it is a living treasure, the treasure that stems from Hawaiki. The call to wait, the call to summon, the call to the ancestors. Let us emerge into the world of light, the world of enlightenment.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000464\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00229c069cdb-968c-4f11-b126-92f9c655148b\u0022\u003ETo my elder, the heart still mourns your passing. You left us during the election. I say, in our own uniquely M\u0101ori way\u2014you opened the doors to Parliament and I, your prot\u00E9g\u00E9, have walked inside. Let the things that I achieve with the learnings you have imparted to be my acknowledgement of you. Rest in peace P\u0101, rest in peace.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000465\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00229c069cdb-968c-4f11-b126-92f9c655148b\u0022\u003EI return to those in this room. To my distinguished colleagues and distinguished guests, to the few and to the many, greetings one and all.]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000466\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00229c069cdb-968c-4f11-b126-92f9c655148b\u0022\u003ET\u0113n\u0101 koe, Mr Speaker. I am proud to stand here as the new member of Parliament for Northcote. I\u2019m here to be a strong local voice for my community. I want to share my future vision for Northcote, but I want to start with my personal story. It\u2019s one of modern Aotearoa. While Auckland is my home now, I grew up in Napier. My family didn\u2019t have much money, but what they did have was a whole lot of love. My mum was the main breadwinner. She worked at the local fish and chip shop, she picked fruit, she worked at St Joseph\u2019s M\u0101ori Girls\u2019 College, and for the past 20 years as a checkout operator at Napier Pak \u2019N Save. She worked tirelessly for her employers, despite the long hours and demands of raising a family. She is my example of why we should all support our essential workers. She\u2019s here today. Thank you, Mum.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000467\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00229c069cdb-968c-4f11-b126-92f9c655148b\u0022\u003EAnd my dad. He served with the New Zealand Defence Force in Malaya, and then worked in seasonal jobs, including at the freezing works in Whakat\u016B. He learnt te reo M\u0101ori at the age of 35 and later trained as a teacher at Te Kura Kaupapa M\u0101ori o Ng\u0101ti Kahungunu ki Heretaunga. This is where I found my love of education. A devout Catholic, he brought me up to love unconditionally. He was generous. In October last year, dad was diagnosed with terminal lung cancer. We were told it was most likely caused by an exposure to asbestos back in his freezing works days. Dad was my biggest supporter, and I dedicated my 2020 campaign to him and, in return, he promised he\u2019d fight the cancer to be with me until election day. I last spoke to dad the night before the election and I was able to tell him again, \u201CI love you, Dad\u201D. Mum called me the next morning with the sad news that he had passed away in the night, but he had kept that promise.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000468\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00229c069cdb-968c-4f11-b126-92f9c655148b\u0022\u003EWhat I am reminded of in this month is that even with the honour of being elected as a member of Parliament, one is still human. I am still a son, and grief impacts us all. My dad played a positive role in my life, and supportive fathers don\u2019t always get the recognition they deserve. Today, I also acknowledge all of the dads and parents in the room as well as those that are looking down upon us.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000469\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00229c069cdb-968c-4f11-b126-92f9c655148b\u0022\u003EDad was laid to rest in the Moawhango Valley amongst our t\u016Bpuna, amongst Ng\u0101ti Whitikaupeka, who are here today and I honour them. I honour those that have carved this space before me. I stand on their shoulders, cloaked with their struggles, and I will continue their work. Today, I especially mention one of my t\u016Bpuna Hiraka Te Rango, a gifted leader who was a part of the Kotahitanga movement to establish the first M\u0101ori Parliament in the 1890s. My iwi, Ng\u0101ti Whitikaupeka, are proud that 115 years later we are represented here too.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000470\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00229c069cdb-968c-4f11-b126-92f9c655148b\u0022\u003EI\u2019d also honour Rudy Taylor who recently passed. Rudy was the chair of our Labour M\u0101ori Council. He believed in building relationships and bringing people together, even in our most challenging of times.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000471\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00229c069cdb-968c-4f11-b126-92f9c655148b\u0022\u003EMy parents taught me to work hard. Mum lined me up with a paper run at the age of 10 with the Daily Telegraph, and at the age of 12 at the Continental Fish Supply in Napier. I joined the Labour Party because of the social values that my parents taught me: that everyone, not just those at the top, deserves a good education and a job afterwards; that everyone has a warm, dry place to live, and access to good healthcare when they need it. I am a beneficiary of growing up in M\u0101ori housing in the 1980s with my parents in our family home, and years later buying my own home because of the KiwiSaver fund that enabled me to establish a deposit.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000472\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00229c069cdb-968c-4f11-b126-92f9c655148b\u0022\u003EWith a M\u0101ori father and a P\u0101keh\u0101 mum, being M\u0101ori is an intrinsic part of who I am. I bring those values to this House: kotahitanga, whanaungatanga, manaakitanga\u2014unity, kinship, kindness. These are also the Labour Party values and they are values that I believe will form strong, vibrant communities in Northcote and in Aotearoa. In 2018, the Hon Kelvin Davis delivered this Labour Government\u2019s commitment to Crown M\u0101ori relations using the concept of a bridge, te arawhiti. For the longest time, M\u0101ori had to cross over that bridge just to talk to our counterparts on the other side, just to justify their place and aspirations in modern New Zealand. But under this Government, the Crown is required to meet us on that bridge\u2014that we make steps to come together. That\u2019s the leadership that I bring to our community and I invite all of my constituents in Northcote to join me along that bridge, to build an even richer culture and identity and an even more inclusive Northcote.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000473\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00229c069cdb-968c-4f11-b126-92f9c655148b\u0022\u003EBut my election was never my journey alone; it was also testament to the relentless, positive energy of our local Labour team led by our electorate chair, Hilary Chidlow. To all of our supporters, our donors, and our volunteers, all of my aroha to you, and thank you. I want to acknowledge my partner, Anthony, who is a front-line doctor at Auckland Hospital. I thank him for his support, and I thank him for the relentless drive and faith that he has had in me.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000474\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00229c069cdb-968c-4f11-b126-92f9c655148b\u0022\u003EThank you, also, to other family that are here, and friends, and colleagues from Auckland University of Technology and Te W\u0101nanga o Aotearoa\u2014many of whom are here today. I also acknowledge a few of our local heroes in Northcote who lift me up and whose causes I will take forward: former Labour Northcote MP Ann Hartley, who is with us today; former MP Marilyn Waring, an icon of our rainbow community; John Marsland, honoured this year for services to community; Bella Powell, who is fighting for lifesaving drugs for herself and others living with cystic fibrosis; and Anil Nathoo, who runs a three-generational family business and is still active in supporting our grass roots community. Like these local heroes, I hope to be a strong and brave local voice, and I will never take my seat in this House for granted.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000475\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00229c069cdb-968c-4f11-b126-92f9c655148b\u0022\u003EI ran for Parliament to lead our community, to lead our causes and strengthen the role that central government plays in our daily lives. Northcote is the perfect example of what New Zealand\u2019s future looks like: diverse and multicultural, urban and green, a local economy tied to a larger market. My vision for Northcote is based on living, on learning, and on earning; a strong local community where we can live, learn, and earn without crossing the Harbour Bridge unless we choose to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000476\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00229c069cdb-968c-4f11-b126-92f9c655148b\u0022\u003EThere are five things that we need to make this vision real: first, everyone living in Northcote needs better transport solutions. Each family and each day presents unique transport requirements, so what we really need are multiple options. I am committed to progressing affordable and accessible buses, ferries, and rail. For some groups, there is a need for free transport. We need a toll-free SkyPath. An additional harbour crossing is a long-term yet urgently, urgently needed project too. These are needed for Northcote residents to get to the rest of Auckland, but also for the rest of Auckland to visit our incredible hospitality, our retail, and our green spaces.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000477\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00229c069cdb-968c-4f11-b126-92f9c655148b\u0022\u003ESecond: healthcare, including mental health support. I know the issues and sometimes tragic stakes in this area all too well. We recently lost one of our talented young men at our local Northcote rugby club, and New Zealand still has one of the highest youth suicide rates in the world. As an electorate MP, I will champion better access to primary healthcare in our community, in our schools, and in our poorer areas\u2014including mental health services and Wh\u0101nau Ora. I will also respond to something that is very personal to me\u2014meth addiction\u2014that has had an impact on both my family and Northcote\u2019s community.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000478\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00229c069cdb-968c-4f11-b126-92f9c655148b\u0022\u003EThird: as Northcote\u2019s wealth and population grow, we need to fight growing inequality. To achieve this, we need to build strong neighbourhoods, welcome people with diverse ethnicities and incomes, and maintain our proud history of social and affordable housing. I will champion for North Shore communities who need Government support and services, and I will build on my work as the chair of the Birkdale Beach Haven Community Project.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000479\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00229c069cdb-968c-4f11-b126-92f9c655148b\u0022\u003EFourth: learning on the North Shore should be attractive and accessible. I\u2019ve spent over 15 years working in the business of education, supporting others into higher learning, and ensuring that everyone has the same educational opportunities that I did. I am passionate about extending beyond our university provision on the shore and bringing more tertiary education options to Northcote, including polytechnics, w\u0101nanga, and trades training.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000480\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00229c069cdb-968c-4f11-b126-92f9c655148b\u0022\u003EFinally: earning in Northcote is essential. I am a huge supporter of our local retail and small businesses, which are a big employer locally. As we build back from COVID-19, I want our businesses to prosper, to train apprentices, create well-paying jobs across our electorate, and build our local economy. Supporting local, retail, and small businesses is going to be a central focus of my time in Parliament. The last Government made huge progress to make Northcote a better place to live, learn, and earn: rebuilding Onepoto Primary School, our only decile 1 in Northcote; a $60 million investment to improve facilities at Northcote College; SkyPath\u2014there are too many examples to list. The last Government launched this work, and it\u2019s now my job as the new local MP to see it through.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000481\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00229c069cdb-968c-4f11-b126-92f9c655148b\u0022\u003EThe class of 2020 are proud to be a part of this progressive, inclusive Labour Government, led by Jacinda Ardern, Kelvin Davis, and Grant Robertson. We will continue to take action on the big generational challenges, from inequality to climate change. We will be a Government for everyone, and I will be a local MP for every constituent. My personal leadership style is about bringing everyone together and I have always felt a sense of urgency to seek new pathways, new opportunities, and to get things done\u2014and my time in Parliament will be no different. No reira, t\u0113n\u0101 koutou, t\u0113n\u0101 koutou, t\u0113n\u0101 koutou katoa.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000482\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00229c069cdb-968c-4f11-b126-92f9c655148b\u0022\u003E[Applause]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000483\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00229c069cdb-968c-4f11-b126-92f9c655148b\u0022\u003EWaiata\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022 data-id=\u00224a77af034989404390f739592254c0a8\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000484\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00224a77af034989404390f739592254c0a8\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: I call Steph Lewis for her maiden statement. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022288783df-ade6-42d2-bd21-06ffa87dedf8\u0022 data-id=\u002280b85be2940a4a9c9a84b707dc696b95\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000485\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022288783df-ade6-42d2-bd21-06ffa87dedf8\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002280b85be2940a4a9c9a84b707dc696b95\u0022\u003ESTEPH LEWIS (Labour\u2014Whanganui):\u003C/span\u003E E rere k\u014D mai te awa nui, mai i te k\u0101hui maunga ki Tangaroa. Ko au te awa, ko te awa ko au. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000486\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022288783df-ade6-42d2-bd21-06ffa87dedf8\u0022\u003EE ng\u0101 mana, e ng\u0101 reo, e ng\u0101 waka maha o t\u0113nei motu, t\u0113n\u0101 koutou, t\u0113n\u0101 koutou, t\u0113n\u0101 koutou katoa. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000487\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022288783df-ade6-42d2-bd21-06ffa87dedf8\u0022\u003E[The ancestral river flows, from the mountains to the sea. The river and I are one.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000488\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022288783df-ade6-42d2-bd21-06ffa87dedf8\u0022\u003ETo the leaders, the representatives, and the descendants of the many ancestral canoes among us, greetings.] \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000489\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022288783df-ade6-42d2-bd21-06ffa87dedf8\u0022\u003EMr Speaker, congratulations on your re-election. It\u2019s an honour to be in the House today, making my maiden statement. I was born in Whanganui, the eldest of Bob and Kim Lewis\u2019 five children. Dad was a prison officer at Kaitoke, and we lived in the village next door. My earliest memory is of prisoners escaping. Dad woke me in the middle of the night and took me into our lounge, where our neighbours were huddled together. I can recall the sound of the prisoners jumping the fence into our backyard and the thud of their footsteps as they ran. They didn\u2019t get far, though, because they tried to swim a lake and needed to get fished out.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000490\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022288783df-ade6-42d2-bd21-06ffa87dedf8\u0022\u003EWhen I was a bit older, I remember asking the grown-ups around me what a prison was and being told that it\u2019s where bad people go. \u201CWhy?\u201D, I asked. \u201CBecause they did bad things.\u201D \u201CWhy?\u201D, I asked again, and was never given a satisfactory answer. But I\u2019ve learnt that the answer is more complex than \u201Cbecause they did bad things.\u201D Many in our prison system have been hurt themselves, often as children by people they trusted. We must break the cycle of children growing into adults who harm others.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000491\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022288783df-ade6-42d2-bd21-06ffa87dedf8\u0022\u003EDad\u2019s dream was to become a full-time farmer. When I was four, my parents bought a 1,200 acre hill country bare block on Omahina Road in Waverley. They dreamt of building a home for us there, but those dreams slipped away because the road to the farm was a path, a track too dangerous to use when it rained. The money they saved to build a home for us went on lawyers\u2019 fees, trying to fix the road. I still remember the look of defeat when my parents came home from court one day. It was then that I resolved to do all I could to help people like them get a fairer go.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000492\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022288783df-ade6-42d2-bd21-06ffa87dedf8\u0022\u003EGrowing up, the cost of living kept increasing. Mum\u2019s contract wasn\u2019t renewed. Dad\u2019s salary didn\u2019t go far to feed and clothe five children. I was bullied at school for wearing hand-me-down clothes on dreaded mufti days. Some mornings I would go to make my lunch for school and realise that there wasn\u2019t enough bread for us all to make sandwiches; without telling anyone, I chose to go without so that my siblings would have something to eat that day. Sadly, my experience was not unique. I was a child of the 1990s who bore the brunt of the austerity of the times. While things were tough for us at times, for many others their situations were far worse. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000493\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022288783df-ade6-42d2-bd21-06ffa87dedf8\u0022\u003EGovernment decisions do make a difference. Initiatives like Working for Families, under Helen Clark\u2019s Government, made life better. I remember in my last year of high school, we had what felt like the first proper Christmas in years, with a roast meal and presents for everyone\u2014a welcome change from the Christmas where I cooked my family fish fingers for dinner. The reforms we made last term through our Families Package will have equally benefited people\u2019s lives, but there is still more work to do.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000494\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022288783df-ade6-42d2-bd21-06ffa87dedf8\u0022\u003EOne thing we need to remember in politics is the power of our words. I worked hard at school but I knew my parents couldn\u2019t afford to send me to university; my only way to get there was with a scholarship. So I spoke to one of my teachers about taking scholarships exams. He said he wasn\u2019t interested because they were for gifted students or kids who went to schools like Collegiate, and I was neither. His words hurt, but with my parents\u2019 support I went to Whanganui City College, where I finished as dux. With the help of scholarships, I completed a Bachelor of Arts and law degree, becoming the first person in my family to graduate. I still believed that with a law degree I could fix the farm road and Dad could live his dreams; sadly, he passed away before I finished. I was just 21 and my youngest sister was five.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000495\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022288783df-ade6-42d2-bd21-06ffa87dedf8\u0022\u003ELike many professions, being a prison officer is hard. It takes a toll physically and mentally. Many of my dad\u2019s workmates died before they were old enough to retire. Dad was 54, having served for 32 years. That\u2019s why it\u2019s important that we provide universal super at 65.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000496\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022288783df-ade6-42d2-bd21-06ffa87dedf8\u0022\u003EI finished university following the global financial crisis and moved home. It took me seven months, nearly, to find a job. I picked up casual work at the Wait\u014Dtara dairy, but I couldn\u2019t find anything full-time or permanent. I made the difficult decision to go into Work and Income. They looked at my CV and said that they had no work for me. Deflated, I went to Community Legal Advice Whanganui (CLAW) to volunteer. Thanks to Sandra, I left CLAW with three days a week paid work as an employment advocate. Since then, I\u2019ve been a lawyer, an investigator, a privacy adviser, and have resolved disputes between individuals and large agencies.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000497\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022288783df-ade6-42d2-bd21-06ffa87dedf8\u0022\u003EIn 2017, I had the privilege of being Labour\u2019s candidate for Whanganui. We ran the campaign of our lives, and came close but missed out by 1,700 votes. Last term, I was elected to Labour\u2019s Policy Council, where I chaired the economic development policy committee. I applied the lessons I\u2019ve learnt from talking to people in P\u0101tea, H\u0101wera, Whanganui, and Stratford to develop policies to help our regions grow.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000498\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022288783df-ade6-42d2-bd21-06ffa87dedf8\u0022\u003EI haven\u2019t shared my story today to seek pity. I\u2019m not claiming to have grown up in severe poverty. There were hard times, but there were good times full of love and laughter. I have shared my story so that those listening today know that I understand what it means to have to choose between paying for food or petrol or power. It is exhausting having to fight every day to survive. My hope, though, is that in this House it doesn\u2019t always have to be a fight, and that we can work together to put people first. I fought my way through and so can you. No matter how hard things get\u2014and sometimes they get bloody hard\u2014there is always a way through. It doesn\u2019t matter how much your parents earn, it doesn\u2019t matter what clothes you wear, and it doesn\u2019t matter if you live in a flash house or drive a fancy car\u2014those things don\u2019t matter. Take risks, pursue your dreams, then it matters how you treat people and how hard you work.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000499\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022288783df-ade6-42d2-bd21-06ffa87dedf8\u0022\u003EI\u2019ve come here to fight for people like the three-year-old boy at a kindy I saw in Whanganui, whose teacher told me that he\u2019s been sleeping in a car with his mum and dad at the local cemetery. I\u2019m here for the year 9 students I met in a math class one day, who were sitting slumped in their chairs, heads bowed or in their hands. They already looked like they believed they were failures at 13 years of age because they had heard again and again that \u201Cyou don\u2019t meet the standard; you haven\u2019t achieved.\u201D I\u2019m here for the solo mum I door-knocked this campaign who had been struggling for years to make ends meet and, thanks to a Labour Government, could study to build a better future for her kids. During the campaign, I met Ruby, a 10-year-old girl interested in learning about politics. It\u2019s our fundamental duty to support the next generation to reach their dreams. I want girls like Ruby to grow up knowing that they can do anything.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000500\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022288783df-ade6-42d2-bd21-06ffa87dedf8\u0022\u003EMy electorate encompasses the great Whanganui awa. It spans from the Whangaehu River to Monmouth Road north of Stratford. It includes Whanganui, Stratford, Kaponga, Manaia, Eltham, H\u0101wera, P\u0101tea, Waverley, Wait\u014Dtara, Fordell, the outskirts of \u014Cpunake, and the settlements up the river. It is a true privilege to represent Whanganui, New Zealand\u2019s most beautiful city for two years running, and Taranaki, which was named the second-best region in the world to visit in 2017.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000501\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022288783df-ade6-42d2-bd21-06ffa87dedf8\u0022\u003EI\u2019ve been asked if I\u2019m excited to have the biggest-ever majority in the Whanganui seat, and I am, but I also feel the weight of the responsibility that comes with it. That is to advocate for everyone in my electorate, to help them achieve their potential so as, hopefully, they get a better ending to their story than my dad got to his. I know that to work here, you\u2019ve got to be prepared to do some long hours. My grandpa, Frank Lewis, worked here as a security guard. I have some of his notes from that time. His final entry, in June 1984, after dealing with a midnight prank call, starts \u201CJust my luck to start my retirement.\u201D, and ends \u201CThird floor cleared. Complete search of the area. Nothing unusual was found. I can relax again. Police departed the complex at 10 past midnight.\u201D\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000502\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022288783df-ade6-42d2-bd21-06ffa87dedf8\u0022\u003EI\u2019m not here to make bold promises; I\u2019m here to work every single day to make sure we get the basics right, so that no family falls through the cracks again. We need to keep putting our people first, and that means keeping investing in our regions, making sure that no matter where you live, you have access to quality health services, that our tamariki and our rangatahi are getting a world-class education, and that all our people have healthy, affordable homes to live in.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000503\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022288783df-ade6-42d2-bd21-06ffa87dedf8\u0022\u003EIn our regions, we need to keep building more affordable housing to take the pressure off that\u2019s been created by the influx of people. We need to make sure that we\u2019re attracting and retaining health professionals in our regions, making sure that they\u2019re connected through broadband, cellphone reception, and our roading networks. Places like P\u0101tea on State Highway 3 should have, at the very least, cellphone reception.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000504\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022288783df-ade6-42d2-bd21-06ffa87dedf8\u0022\u003EThis Government\u2019s investments in the Whanganui Port, H\u0101wera\u2019s civic hub, Stratford\u2019s community pool, and the green hydrogen plant in Kapuni have made a difference. Although COVID-19 has been devastating, it\u2019s presented us with an opportunity to build back better. I\u2019ll work with my communities in my electorate to ensure that they thrive as we recover and rebuild from COVID.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000505\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022288783df-ade6-42d2-bd21-06ffa87dedf8\u0022\u003EI\u2019d like to finish with some thankyous. Firstly, to the voters in Whanganui, South Taranaki, and Stratford, thank you for the faith that you have placed in me. I will represent everyone in our electorate, regardless of who they voted for. My door is open. I acknowledge all of the mana whenua in our electorate, and I look forward to working with you. Thank you to our Prime Minister, Jacinda Ardern, for all that you\u2019ve done to support the people of Aotearoa in the last three years and for showing us there is a place for kindness in politics.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000506\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022288783df-ade6-42d2-bd21-06ffa87dedf8\u0022\u003EI\u2019d like to acknowledge some of the teachers from the nine different schools I went to. They helped me to grow and to find my voice. Adela Stiles, Rae Karipa, Lia Tuffield, Tara McIlroy, Sue Marr, Bronwyn Bullock, Jenny Shaw, Doug Davidson, and, although not actually a teacher, Jason Tamm. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000507\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022288783df-ade6-42d2-bd21-06ffa87dedf8\u0022\u003EThank you to the Whanganui Labour electorate committee for your incredible support over the last four years\u2014in particular, to Rhona, who suggested I stand. I acknowledge those who have contributed over the years, like Dave Vallely, Bill Walmsley, Jocelynne Labrum, and Neville Pollock, who can\u2019t be here, and also Murray Wright and Dave Fieckert, who are no longer with us. To my campaign team, David, Katrina, Craig, Jude, Irving, Rosemary\u2014happy birthday, by the way\u2014Barbara, Emma, Jo, Josh, Bob, Diana, Steve, and Helen, you\u2019ve stood by me through two gruelling campaigns. You\u2019ve run a marathon at a sprinter\u2019s pace, and I can never thank you enough for your support. To our volunteers who helped door-knock, make phone calls, staff our campaign shop, run street corner meetings, run events, deliver leaflets, take up and down signs, donated, or had a sign on your property, I thank each of you. You are the heart and the soul of our campaigns. We could not have achieved this result without you.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000508\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022288783df-ade6-42d2-bd21-06ffa87dedf8\u0022\u003EThank you to the members and supporters who have come here today to see me. To my predecessors, Russell Marshall and Jill Pettis, I acknowledge you for the efforts and sacrifices you made for our electorate. To Hamish McDouall, thank you for mentoring me at CLAW, for your friendship and support. You started this journey by chipping away at National\u2019s majority. I also acknowledge Chester Borrows and Harete Hipango. I wish you and your families well. Thank you to Nicole, Jane, Tiffany, Carla, Emma Kean, Sakura, Ben, Andreas, Jennifer, Kelly, JP, Dean, Yvonne, Jackie, Mike, and Nimmi for being part of my support crew. To my mum in the gallery, and my dad, thank you for your unwavering love and support, for teaching me to dream, to be humble, and for the sacrifices you made for us kids. It\u2019s hard to believe that as of Saturday, Dad\u2019s been gone for 11 years. I\u2019d love to know what a National-voting farmer would make of his daughter being elected as a Labour MP!\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000509\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022288783df-ade6-42d2-bd21-06ffa87dedf8\u0022\u003ETo my brother, Robbie, and my sisters, Vicky, Catherine, and Mikaeyla, thank you for your ongoing support and love and for keeping me grounded. To my husband, Rob, you are my rock. You\u2019ve stood by me through thick and thin and always have a hug and a smile ready at just the right moment. I love you, I adore you, and I\u2019m proud of you. To my wonderful daughter, Scarlett, you are and always will be my number one. You give me a reason to smile every day. I love you. I\u2019m so proud of you, and I hope that in the future, you\u2019re proud of your mum, too, and that you look back and don\u2019t just remember missed bedtimes but lots of love and laughter, too. Kia kaha, kia m\u0101ia, kia manawanui hoki. T\u0113n\u0101 koutou, t\u0113n\u0101 koutou, t\u0113n\u0101 r\u0101 t\u0101tou katoa.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000510\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022288783df-ade6-42d2-bd21-06ffa87dedf8\u0022\u003E[Be strong, be courageous, be steadfast too. Greetings to one and all, thank you.]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000511\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022288783df-ade6-42d2-bd21-06ffa87dedf8\u0022\u003E[Applause]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022 data-id=\u00221ab738846a17463fb2793dc4198991ce\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000512\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00221ab738846a17463fb2793dc4198991ce\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: The sitting is suspended until 7 p.m.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000513\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003ESitting suspended from 6.04 p.m. to 7 p.m.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002237a99b65-4919-4800-830d-3dd7c920d5cd\u0022 data-id=\u00226a473a56e9404a69bf63d03411fc5985\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000514\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002237a99b65-4919-4800-830d-3dd7c920d5cd\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00226a473a56e9404a69bf63d03411fc5985\u0022\u003EHon Dr MEGAN WOODS (Minister of Housing):\u003C/span\u003E I move, That this debate be now adjourned. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000515\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002237a99b65-4919-4800-830d-3dd7c920d5cd\u0022\u003EMotion agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n    \u003C/div\u003E\n    \u003Cdiv class=\u0022HpsHansard\u0022\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000516\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsProceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u00223f2b48ae9fe847378ee32dc1683a95eb\u0022\u003EUrgency\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000518\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u0022e87bc792f21d4e6f9e30e783d53665c3\u0022\u003EUrgency\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022 data-id=\u0022f478dc0da88b4cc88cf5e18420e6e85f\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000517\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022f478dc0da88b4cc88cf5e18420e6e85f\u0022\u003EHon CHRIS HIPKINS (Leader of the House):\u003C/span\u003E I move, That urgency be accorded: \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000519\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003Ethe passing through all stages of the Drug and Substance Checking Legislation Bill\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000520\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003Ethe first reading and referral to select committee of the Holidays (Increasing Sick Leave) Amendment Bill\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000521\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003Ethe passing through all stages of the COVID-19 Public Health Response Amendment Bill\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000522\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003Eand the introduction and passing through all stages of the Taxation (Income Tax Rate and Other Amendments) Bill.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000523\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003EJust taking each of those bills briefly in turn: the Drug and Substance Checking Legislation Bill, it\u2019s the Government\u2019s desire to have that passed before the summer holiday period when there are a number of festivals where we want that activity to be able to take place.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000524\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003EThe Government has made a commitment to increase the amount of sick leave that is available. We want to get that bill to a select committee prior to Christmas, hence including it in the urgency motion.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000525\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003EThe COVID-19 Public Health Response Amendment Bill is a very simple bill. It creates my job as Minister for COVID-19 Response\u2014one of my other jobs as Minister for COVID-19 Response. But particularly important, it allows us to step down alert levels faster, which is important as we go into the longer summer adjournment, should we need to use that.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000526\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003EAnd then finally, the Taxation (Income Tax Rate and Other Amendments) Bill implements the Government\u2019s tax policy that we campaigned on. In order for those tax rates to be in place at the time we committed to putting them in place we need to pass that bill before Christmas.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca id=\u0022aafe5f30c5724dccabe4caffdb4a9e82\u0022 name=\u0022division\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EA party vote was called for on the question, That urgency be accorded.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EAyes 76\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand Labour 64; Green Party of Aotearoa New Zealand 10;\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ETe Paati M\u0101ori 2.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENoes 43\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand National 33; ACT New Zealand 10.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EMotion agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n    \u003C/div\u003E\n    \u003Cdiv class=\u0022HpsHansard\u0022\u003E\n      \u003Cp\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsProceedingHeading\u0022\u003EBills\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000527\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u0022c21d5747e2a040dda03bdb16509b140f\u0022\u003EDrug and Substance Checking Legislation Bill\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000528\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u00228f53b7f2eff64655bc82536cb69fb270\u0022\u003EFirst Reading\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022 data-id=\u00229469b83ff7444aee90f696dc2d470db9\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000529\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00229469b83ff7444aee90f696dc2d470db9\u0022\u003EHon ANDREW LITTLE (Minister of Health):\u003C/span\u003E I present a legislative statement on the Drug and Substance Checking Legislation Bill.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000530\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003ELegislative statement published under the authority of the House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000531\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002272dffc1daa954398abb26ce8a48ef1ab\u0022\u003EHon ANDREW LITTLE\u003C/span\u003E: I move, That the Drug and Substance Checking Legislation Bill be now read a first time.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000532\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003EThis bill is fairly simple. It changes two pieces of legislation: the Misuse of Drugs Act and the Psychoactive Substances Act. It makes those changes for, again, a quite simple purpose, and that is to allow the checking of illicit substances at festivals. The reality is, with the music festival season upon us, we know that some people who attend those festivals partake of recreational drugs and substances. They purchase those substances and sometimes they do not know exactly what they are getting when they purchase them, and there are risks associated with that. In music festivals around the world, we have seen the same thing happening: substances being sold and lives being put at risk, some people getting very seriously ill, and, in fact, some people dying. We saw it in Australia last summer, exactly that happening. This is just a reality that happens when people go to music festivals; these substances are available.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000533\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003EThe measure that this bill represents is a safety measure. It means that those who wish to partake of those substances but who have doubts about the safety of it can get them tested and that those who are carrying out the testing are not, therefore, liable to criminal prosecution. It also means those who are organising the events or otherwise hosting them\u2014if it\u2019s a landowner or the event organiser\u2014are also not liable to prosecution. They would be under the Misuse of Drugs Act, in section 12 of that Act, if this legislation is not passed.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000534\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003EThis continues the approach that this Government has taken, which is about treating drug issues\u2014particularly possession of some drugs\u2014not as a criminal matter, but as a health matter. The truth is, in this day and age, in some places and in some communities, some people partake of drugs and substances that are classified under the Misuse of Drugs Act and the possession of which would otherwise constitute a criminal offence. Well, we can carry on criminalising people for what they\u2019re doing or we might want to better understand why it is that they\u2019re doing that\u2014why it is that they\u2019re taking those risks. The content of this bill and what it seeks to do is about accepting the fact that what people are doing in these circumstances is not actually a criminal matter; it\u2019s a health matter.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000535\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003ENow, if I go to a music festival, I don\u2019t particularly partake of a whole swag of drugs\u2014there\u2019s probably one, which is alcohol, which I admit to, but I don\u2019t partake of other substances. I don\u2019t have a particular interest in it. That\u2019s just me and that\u2019s my choice, but others make different choices\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000536\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002255d0b7a4-a2c9-4c38-9b77-475311a48a89\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022c502daf4970242578e830a65b4957d0c\u0022\u003ESimeon Brown\u003C/span\u003E: To break the law.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000537\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022674a5327419b42b1877acb2d56bab1ba\u0022\u003EHon ANDREW LITTLE\u003C/span\u003E: \u2014and they have been doing that for some years. The member opposite says, \u201CBut they\u2019re breaking the law.\u201D But Mr Brown, they\u2019ve been breaking the law for many, many years over many, many substances. The whole head in the sand approach, which is \u201CWe should just catch up with them and we should come after them with a big book and put them before the court and we should prosecute them and charge them and do all those sorts of things.\u201D Actually, we\u2019ve been doing that. We\u2019ve been doing that for decades, and it doesn\u2019t work. It\u2019s not changing. If we want to change behaviours, then we\u2019ve got to take a different approach.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000538\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003EVictoria University in the next couple of weeks is going to release some research on just this issue about testing drugs at festivals. What their research shows, or the interim results that I\u2019ve seen show, is that about two-thirds of those people who use the services change their behaviours as a result\u2014change the way they think about the ingestion of those substances\u2014and it is much safer for them. Having drug-testing services around with the drug-testing personnel not susceptible to prosecution means that they can actually have a conversation with those drug users, provide some education, provide some information, and provide some advice. It is time for us to consider alternative approaches because, for far too long, what we\u2019ve been doing year after year, decade after decade, has not been working.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000539\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003EWhen we changed the Misuse of Drugs Act last year, we took the approach that it was time to abandon this criminalise everybody approach and actually take a health approach, and that\u2019s what we\u2019re doing here. What is very clear in the debate that we have only recently had on drugs and on illicit drugs is people want to know that those who use it are safe. That\u2019s what New Zealanders want.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000540\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022442a5b9cb3344e14849516c052417ccc\u0022\u003EHon Dr Nick Smith\u003C/span\u003E: New Zealanders said no.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000541\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002266368696173b4a1a9905ae9ec9a3cc3f\u0022\u003EHon ANDREW LITTLE\u003C/span\u003E: New Zealanders said no to legalising cannabis. That\u2019s all they said\u2014that\u2019s what that referendum result said. But what New Zealanders actually want to know is that young people are kept safe. Talk to any parent of a teenager who goes to music festivals or goes to music events. Talk to any parent of a young person who goes to those activities and ask them what they want. They want to know that their child, their young adult, is safe. And that\u2019s what this does. The testing makes sure that those who choose to use substances that they\u2019re not sure about and are otherwise illicit can have them tested to make sure that they\u2019re safe. That\u2019s what this allows.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000542\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003EThere are outfits in the community who do this testing. KnowYourStuffNZ is one of them, the New Zealand Drug Foundation is another, and they are able to do the testing and now they will be able to do it knowing that those providing this service, which is about safety, can do so without risk of prosecution. And that is a good thing. So, on that basis, with this bill doing those very simple things and providing safety for New Zealand, young New Zealanders over the forthcoming summer festival season will be safe.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000543\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003EI might just foreshadow, too, that this is an interim step. It is my intention for us to develop a permanent response to this situation. This bill is self-repealing in 12 months, but by that time we will have a permanent response to this very situation after having had a good quality consultation, engagement with the community, about what is needed to make sure that those who would use substances that are illicit but that might cause harm can have ways of having them tested so that their safety can be preserved. That is the next step, but for tonight this bill is an interim step to provide safety for young people going to music festivals or otherwise using illicit substances in places to do so knowing that those services that do that testing can do so themselves without liability to prosecution, and that will be a good measure for the safety of young New Zealanders. I commend the bill to the House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022977cccaf-581d-4f48-924e-32bf6c54a93d\u0022 data-id=\u0022d4a3624eb4cd4322b25b1f89c8e94754\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000544\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022977cccaf-581d-4f48-924e-32bf6c54a93d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022d4a3624eb4cd4322b25b1f89c8e94754\u0022\u003EDEPUTY SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: The question is that the motion be agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022badb0a39-849c-462a-b32f-77fc017c9fc2\u0022 data-id=\u002297e89efaaa074ae5834e54369d3bb86c\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000545\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022badb0a39-849c-462a-b32f-77fc017c9fc2\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002297e89efaaa074ae5834e54369d3bb86c\u0022\u003EHon SIMON BRIDGES (National\u2014Tauranga):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Mr Speaker. National opposes this bill, which legalises the testing of illicit drugs\u2014mainly ecstasy or E or, as it\u2019s chemically known, MDMA. I want to make two initial points. I accept\u2014and I heard the groan from the other side\u2014that National\u2019s against the zeitgeist of most of our press and this Parliament. We\u2019re on the unfashionable side of the debate\u2014which is something, given that Andrew Little is on the other side. I also acknowledge that those for this always say we have to be evidence led and focused on harm reduction. They go on to say that in opposing this, National is ideological and not evidence led. Well, my view is that on the evidence, the opposite is true. Indeed, that\u2019s the main reason for my personal opposition to this bill.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000546\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022badb0a39-849c-462a-b32f-77fc017c9fc2\u0022\u003EI acknowledge there will be conflicting evidence from different countries and even within them, but there is clear evidence that use and harm will increase through pill testing. At the very least, I say it\u2019s clear that harm won\u2019t reduce and there won\u2019t be more people saved\u2014that is, doing less harm. And that\u2019s even before we get to the message this bill sends to our young. Use will go up. Personally, I would have thought that\u2019s obvious, given that the bill allows you to get an all clear\u2014and the Minister said it himself: tell the parents that it\u2019s safe\u2014on your pills. But it\u2019s also backed by clear evidence. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000547\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022badb0a39-849c-462a-b32f-77fc017c9fc2\u0022\u003EWhile the statistics are poor and equivocal in parts of Europe, in the United Kingdom, actually, the statistics are very good and pretty clear, in my view. The Loop is an organisation which pill tests in the UK and began expanding its work in 2013 with Government approval. Over that time, ecstasy use has gone from 1.2 percent of the population of England and Wales in 2013 to 1.7 percent by 2017 and 2018. That\u2019s a significant increase and the best evidence I\u2019m aware of that since testing, use can go up; it doesn\u2019t go down.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000548\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022badb0a39-849c-462a-b32f-77fc017c9fc2\u0022\u003EWhat\u2019s more: when the use goes up, the harm goes up. You might think that at least as testing went up and up in the UK, harm would decrease. In fact, deaths increased in the same period from 43 to 92. That isn\u2019t harm reduction; it\u2019s quite the opposite, Andrew Little. Why is that? Because it turns out pill testing legalised by Government gives confidence\u2014false confidence. Tests don\u2019t make ecstasy safe, even if they give an all-clear for impurities or contaminants that the tests detect.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000549\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022badb0a39-849c-462a-b32f-77fc017c9fc2\u0022\u003EIn addition, those same impurities are not what causes the harm or, in the worst cases, death. The impurities aren\u2019t the really harmful bit. Actually, Andrew Little, the ecstasy is. In a recent study of 392 ecstasy deaths in Australia between 2001 and 2016, no deaths were from impurities or contaminants in pills. No deaths were from other drugs that went alongside the ecstasy pills. The deaths in Australia were all from the ecstasy itself or the ecstasy plus other drugs consumed at the party alongside the ecstasy\u2014alcohol, cocaine, or others, of course\u2014creating a toxic synergy.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000550\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022badb0a39-849c-462a-b32f-77fc017c9fc2\u0022\u003EIn other words, this study indicates that the pill testing had zero protective effect. Those hundreds of people died from the ecstasy. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000551\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dbaac12b-3efa-4d95-a08d-f0f637a48bab\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022e70aa71d9d724340b7d584b2cbe1ae14\u0022\u003EChl\u00F6e Swarbrick\u003C/span\u003E: It\u2019s not legal in Australia, Simon.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000552\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022badb0a39-849c-462a-b32f-77fc017c9fc2\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002251ba1056b31743008b6008c7d8c953ad\u0022\u003EHon SIMON BRIDGES\u003C/span\u003E: I believe use and harm will go up. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000553\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022badb0a39-849c-462a-b32f-77fc017c9fc2\u0022\u003EThe member opposite, over there, says that it was not legal. That doesn\u2019t change the fact that it wasn\u2019t the contaminants; it was the ecstasy, scientifically. This bill proposes a pill test that doesn\u2019t go to what\u2019s killing young people in Australia, in the United Kingdom, around the world, and in New Zealand. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000554\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dbaac12b-3efa-4d95-a08d-f0f637a48bab\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00220e6e48233d7747b594b0fd46365d4830\u0022\u003EChl\u00F6e Swarbrick\u003C/span\u003E: What did the chief coroner of New South Wales say?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000555\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022badb0a39-849c-462a-b32f-77fc017c9fc2\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022f5a12605e3c942419c9baf6563d68dfa\u0022\u003EHon SIMON BRIDGES\u003C/span\u003E: But even if members point\u2014and I ask the member who\u2019s barracking to do so\u2014to other studies, and this becomes a battle of surveys and studies and reports, it\u2019s heroic to say use and harm will go down if more people take more ecstasy. Good luck with that! \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000556\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022badb0a39-849c-462a-b32f-77fc017c9fc2\u0022\u003EI want to make two other significant points. Why are we rushing this bill when serious drug harm reduction initiatives haven\u2019t been done? In the last term, the Government did, in my view\u2014and I ask the members opposite to challenge me on this\u2014incredibly little towards serious drug harm reduction. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000557\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dbaac12b-3efa-4d95-a08d-f0f637a48bab\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00225447aa293be04b65a83fe215c501b705\u0022\u003EChl\u00F6e Swarbrick\u003C/span\u003E: It\u2019s because you stood in the way.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000558\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022badb0a39-849c-462a-b32f-77fc017c9fc2\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002233f2e2fcdf614bd8ac13c3bb084c4004\u0022\u003EHon SIMON BRIDGES\u003C/span\u003E: Where was the drug-driving testing? We were in support of that. Nick Smith and I begged the Prime Minister, in this House and other places, to get on with it\u2014actually, from the very start of the Parliament. It\u2019s now drugs on our roads that are the single biggest killer, more so than alcohol by a long way. The technology is up to date, and we can test for MDMA. Well, that hasn\u2019t passed. I haven\u2019t seen anything in months and months and months.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000559\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022badb0a39-849c-462a-b32f-77fc017c9fc2\u0022\u003ENext to nothing has been done by the Government regarding the number of beds, counsellor services, rehabilitation, and treatment that is required for drug abuse in this country. I know in Tauranga, in my electorate, which I\u2019m privileged to represent, what a huge problem\u2014what a crisis\u2014it is. I say to the other side, actually, it\u2019s a plague on both our houses. We didn\u2019t do enough, but that side didn\u2019t in the last term either.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000560\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022badb0a39-849c-462a-b32f-77fc017c9fc2\u0022\u003EEven if you disagree with me on the evidence regarding the use and harm of ecstasy, rushing this bill is wrong. It puts the cart before the horse\u2014the harms before the treatments, if you like. Surely we shouldn\u2019t be doing this if we haven\u2019t geared up our health and social and police services to deal with the impacts.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000561\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022badb0a39-849c-462a-b32f-77fc017c9fc2\u0022\u003EThe second thing I want to say is that this bill is part of a wider agenda by the Government to decriminalise illicit drugs. It\u2019s soft thinking by a Government that\u2019s soft on drugs. A majority of New Zealanders\u2014as my friends on this side of the House said to Andrew Little, you didn\u2019t seem to want to acknowledge this point\u2014voted against the legalisation of cannabis very recently. I know Chl\u00F6e Swarbrick, for example, wants to disregard the will of the people. Well, we can\u2019t on the election\u2014we\u2019re not Donald Trump\u2014and I ask that she doesn\u2019t, actually, on that very important referendum where a majority said they didn\u2019t want to see the legalisation of cannabis. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000562\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022badb0a39-849c-462a-b32f-77fc017c9fc2\u0022\u003EMy view, Chl\u00F6e Swarbrick, is that they feel even more strongly about harder illicit drugs\u2014certainly methamphetamine, but also, when they think about it, ecstasy, which is a class A drug, at the top of our criminal calendar, because it is viewed, rightly, by the scientists, by this Parliament, and by the courts as a much more serious drug than cannabis. In short, most Kiwis, when they think it all through, don\u2019t want to go soft on drugs. But that\u2019s the agenda. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000563\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022badb0a39-849c-462a-b32f-77fc017c9fc2\u0022\u003ELast term, we saw the law change, upping the discretion, in my view\u2014and I know the other side disagrees with this\u2014mandating police around New Zealand to stop prosecuting for any illicit drug\u2014cannabis, cocaine, methamphetamine. That\u2019s what that law, through the misuse of drugs amendment, did. For a few points of meth now outside a school, you will no longer be charged. If you say I\u2019m wrong, on the other side, you find me one case\u2014just one case\u2014since that law passed.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000564\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022badb0a39-849c-462a-b32f-77fc017c9fc2\u0022\u003ELast week, in the suburb both Jan Tinetti and I lived in, the community has complained to both of us about meth dealing in cars outside homes by schoolkids. The police view is actually the identical view to one of their senior Ministers, Andrew Little. Their view was: we can\u2019t arrest our way out of this\u2014that is, we\u2019re not going to do anything. So if you can\u2019t beat it, join it, effectively. Well, I don\u2019t think that\u2019s the view of the majority of New Zealanders when they think about these issues. I don\u2019t think it should be the view of the majority of this Parliament either. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000565\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022badb0a39-849c-462a-b32f-77fc017c9fc2\u0022\u003EThis sort of law change at haste will be regretted by New Zealand at its leisure over the long term. I note, as its first law, this is the message the Government\u2019s sending. It\u2019s giving a false confidence, a message that it\u2019s OK, on illicit, hard drugs. Like I say, it\u2019s the wrong message to our young. Drug use will go up. More harm will, tragically, be done along the way to young New Zealanders. I\u2019ll be opposing this bill every step of the way.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00223c5917bd-9c2f-4bdf-af2f-b13cd1a2c8bb\u0022 data-id=\u0022e29951812cd441e6b675cfda3a52d6ad\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000566\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223c5917bd-9c2f-4bdf-af2f-b13cd1a2c8bb\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022e29951812cd441e6b675cfda3a52d6ad\u0022\u003EDr LIZ CRAIG (Labour):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Mr Speaker. Every year in New Zealand young people are turning up in emergency departments, because the drug they thought they were taking wasn\u2019t what they were taking at all. So what this bill does is it keeps our young people safe over this festival season, because it allows drug-checking services to operate with legal certainty. Because the problem we\u2019ve got at the moment is that drug-checking services and the events that are hosting them are at risk of prosecution under the current law, and yet we\u2019ve still got services like KnowYourStuffNZ providing those drug-checking services because of the harm reduction potential. They\u2019ve got the capacity to save people\u2019s lives.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000567\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223c5917bd-9c2f-4bdf-af2f-b13cd1a2c8bb\u0022\u003EIf you look at the Drug Foundation website, what they said is that in 2017-2018, over that festival season, 20 percent of samples that people had tested weren\u2019t what they thought they had, and a further 11 percent of samples were adulterated with other psychoactive additives. So what they found was that if people ended up with substances that actually weren\u2019t what they thought they were, 52 percent said that they weren\u2019t going to take them and another 11 percent said they were thinking about it. I think when you present people with additional information, they will make the safer choice, and that can have a huge impact on young people\u2019s lives.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000568\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223c5917bd-9c2f-4bdf-af2f-b13cd1a2c8bb\u0022\u003EWhat this bill does is it does two main things. The first thing it does is it enables the Director-General of Health to appoint a drug-checking service by notice in the Gazette. What that means is that that service has the certainty that it can receive controlled drugs and other substances, it can test them, it can pass them on to other laboratories for further testing or to the police, and it won\u2019t be prosecuted under the law.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000569\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223c5917bd-9c2f-4bdf-af2f-b13cd1a2c8bb\u0022\u003ESecondly, what this does is it amends section 12 of the Misuse of Drugs Act so it\u2019s not an offence for festival organisers to host a drug-checking service. This is important because under the current legislation it\u2019s actually an offence to allow your premises to be used for the commissioning of an offence under the Act. And what this means is that if you\u2019re saying, \u201CWe can have a drug-checking service,\u201D it means that that organiser is knowingly saying, \u201CWe will have people that are using an illegal substance at our event,\u201D and that puts them at risk of prosecution. So the problem with that is then it means that they don\u2019t allow a drug-checking service on site, or if they do they don\u2019t make sure that young people are aware of its availability. What this bill will do will make it much, much safer for those young people who have decided that they are going to go ahead and use a substance.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000570\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223c5917bd-9c2f-4bdf-af2f-b13cd1a2c8bb\u0022\u003EBut this bill doesn\u2019t do some things. What it doesn\u2019t do is change the status of any drugs or other substances. So it\u2019s still a crime for unauthorised people to possess drugs or to sell them to others. The other thing, though, is that by the same token we don\u2019t actually want to make it easier to increase prosecutions. So what this bill also does is it says that you can\u2019t use the results of this drug testing as evidence against a person who provided the drug, and nor can you take a lot of personal information from those that are having their substances checked and retain that. So basically what it does is there\u2019s many things it doesn\u2019t change with respect to status quo.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000571\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223c5917bd-9c2f-4bdf-af2f-b13cd1a2c8bb\u0022\u003EThis bill is only a temporary measure, and basically it will automatically expire 12 months after coming into force. But in the meantime the Minister of Health early next year is going to return to Cabinet with a proposal for a more detailed drug-testing proposal, and that proposal will then go through the normal levels of parliamentary scrutiny. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000572\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223c5917bd-9c2f-4bdf-af2f-b13cd1a2c8bb\u0022\u003EThis is an important bill and it puts in place some urgent measures that are going to protect our young people over the upcoming festival season, and it\u2019s going to give those providing drug-testing services and the festival organisers who host them that legal certainty they won\u2019t be prosecuted under the current law. I commend this bill to the House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022861a1798-a396-4a6c-b9e2-7d2f15d4a001\u0022 data-id=\u0022d9267cf36f1245c39a14484c714951ad\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000573\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022861a1798-a396-4a6c-b9e2-7d2f15d4a001\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022d9267cf36f1245c39a14484c714951ad\u0022\u003EDr SHANE RETI (Deputy Leader\u2014National):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Mr Speaker. I rise to support my colleagues and to talk against this bill which I, and we, will not be supporting. We\u2019re not in support of this bill and the underlying Government philosophy of \u201Cbecause it is, it should be.\u201D For that, and for many other reasons\u2014which I\u2019ll outline here\u2014we\u2019ll talk against this bill. There\u2019s five main issues that have with this bill. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000574\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022861a1798-a396-4a6c-b9e2-7d2f15d4a001\u0022\u003EThe first is, I\u2019m unconvinced with the ability to identify all the harmful products that are relevant to this discussion. I\u2019m unconvinced with the quantitative and qualitative assessment of the drugs that we\u2019re interested in, unconvinced\u2014as my colleague, the Hon Simon Bridges has said\u2014with the evidence. Certainly, it would seem to cut both ways, but not a clear benefit to this sort of process\u2014and I\u2019d say that it\u2019s especially for those who are regular users. Arbitrarily, those who are first-time users\u2014conjecturally\u2014may well have some benefit. Again, conjecturally. But, certainly for those who are regular users, no clear benefit that they change behaviour once they\u2019ve been through a pill testing process and been notified of what the contents are. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000575\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022861a1798-a396-4a6c-b9e2-7d2f15d4a001\u0022\u003EThe fourth issue I have is the lack of a select committee process. Surely, where the evidence is unclear would warrant\u2014even more so\u2014a thorough select committee process, not a legislative process that forces through poor legislation in short notice and under urgency. Now, the Government has talked very proudly\u2014and Mr Little said again today\u2014about their health approach to drugs. I think it\u2019s worth some scrutiny exactly how the success of their health approach to drugs has been to date, because what they\u2019ve done in their past history probably reflects how well they will do in the future. I want to talk to an Official Information Act (OIA) request I got back last week, which looks at the much touted Misuse of Drugs (Medicinal Cannabis) Amendment Bill (No 2) last year, which\u2014as we all recall\u2014said: if you\u2019re caught in use or possession, instead of getting a conviction\u2014one, if it\u2019s thought to be beneficial, for a health approach, or two, if it was in the public interest\u2014you would go down a health approach pathway. Well and good.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000576\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022861a1798-a396-4a6c-b9e2-7d2f15d4a001\u0022\u003EThis legislation was passed on 7 August and it came into effect on 13 August. So how successful has that been? How successful has the Government been in implementing, so far, a health approach to drugs? Well, what is the health approach to drugs? In my mind, I\u2019m thinking of something like the Portugal example for decriminalisation, if you like, where maybe you\u2019re referred to a counsellor, maybe you\u2019re referred to a medical practitioner, maybe there\u2019s a legal person there as well. What has been the Government\u2019s health approach to the Misuse of Drugs (Medicinal Cannabis) Amendment Bill (No 2)? I\u2019ll tell you what that is: the police send an automated text message. That\u2019s it. That\u2019s the health approach. That\u2019s the health approach, the Misuse of Drugs (Medicinal Cannabis) Amendment Bill (No 2): New Zealand Police send an automated text message encouraging people to contact the alcohol and drug help service line. That\u2019s it. That\u2019s the health approach from this Government. What a poor approach. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000577\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022861a1798-a396-4a6c-b9e2-7d2f15d4a001\u0022\u003EFurthermore, how many people has it applied to? Well, there\u2019s been 565 referrals since the legislation was enabled for a health approach\u2014565. How many of those people took up the health approach? Forty-nine. Five hundred and sixty\u2014did they have a cell phone? Did they even receive the health approach automated text message? Who knows? Who knows, because there\u2019s no data. We\u2019ve asked, and we\u2019ve got no replies to that. I\u2019m referring to OIA H02007573, we received this last week. That, in no shape or form, is any form of health approach. Why would we have faith in this legislation further recommending a health approach when\u2014no more than in this past year\u2014we\u2019ve seen this very poor implementation. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000578\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022861a1798-a396-4a6c-b9e2-7d2f15d4a001\u0022\u003EWe raised this in select committee when we said, \u201CWell, exactly what discretion will police have, and what is the compulsion, if you like, to participate?\u201D Certainly, in the Portugal example of decriminalisation, there\u2019s a sense of compulsion. You have to appear in front of the panel and receive the advice and rehabilitative actions. Not here\u2014just to go over it again\u2014the health approach for this Government, for the Misuse of Drugs (Medicinal Cannabis) Amendment Bill (No 2), is a text message. That falls well short of a health approach and doesn\u2019t even cut it. As we could see, less than 10 percent have actually taken up that approach. And as I\u2019ve mentioned, I\u2019m really interested in who received the text message, do they even have a phone? There\u2019s a whole lot of further information which I\u2019ve asked for, which they decided not to put in the OIA. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000579\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022861a1798-a396-4a6c-b9e2-7d2f15d4a001\u0022\u003EBut I would say, on this basis alone, their ability to implement this legislation is unlikely. I don\u2019t believe it is sound. I don\u2019t believe the evidence is there. I just think this is harmful, with a flawed philosophy from the very beginning, and I think this will do more damage than it will do good. So you\u2019ll find this side of the House pushing back against this on many levels\u2014I\u2019ve identified five of them here\u2014and we will fight this legislation.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022e60c1237-5e2d-4d0a-9678-ab10db67d1b7\u0022 data-id=\u002239282293890c4be5843a573f4bbdaaf7\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000580\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e60c1237-5e2d-4d0a-9678-ab10db67d1b7\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002239282293890c4be5843a573f4bbdaaf7\u0022\u003EANGIE WARREN-CLARK (Labour):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Mr Speaker. It\u2019s a pleasure to rise for the first time in this House for the 53rd Parliament. I want to acknowledge you, sir, for the rulings that you have spoken on over the last 52nd Parliament, and, also, I want to acknowledge that I look forward to the work that we will do together in this House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000581\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e60c1237-5e2d-4d0a-9678-ab10db67d1b7\u0022\u003ESo we\u2019ve heard from the Opposition about the drug-use tests and how it will make things worse, etc. Well, I\u2019m going to talk a little bit about the fact that I am a parent of young people, and let me say to you, Mr Bridges, it is the most horrifying thing to discover that the beliefs and values that you yourself may have about whether children will be taking drugs or not is actually not what is happening with your children. As a consequence, I want to know that if my children are using illicit substances\u2014and I hope that they are not\u2014I want them to know that it is safe to do so.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000582\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e60c1237-5e2d-4d0a-9678-ab10db67d1b7\u0022\u003ESo what will happen with this bill is that we will have testing and that testing will occur to enable people to know, and what we do know from the study that was carried out in Victoria University is that when young people discover what is in those substances, they may make another choice, and that is a good thing. That is what we hope.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000583\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022ce1cd918d0494de1a60218ad1415a2c3\u0022\u003EHon Dr Nick Smith\u003C/span\u003E: When you buy ecstasy, that\u2019s what you get.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000584\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e60c1237-5e2d-4d0a-9678-ab10db67d1b7\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002273b5a898c8bc43b187b5046cfe8c926c\u0022\u003EANGIE WARREN-CLARK\u003C/span\u003E: Not necessarily. The member tells us, \u201CIf you buy ecstasy, that\u2019s what you get.\u201D I have no experience of that, so I appreciate your experience there. However, the important thing here is that we must ensure the safety of the people that are trying these drugs, and this bill does, so I commend this bill to the House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022dbaac12b-3efa-4d95-a08d-f0f637a48bab\u0022 data-id=\u00227070ed49585542d28c53b6a1bee35bfc\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000585\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dbaac12b-3efa-4d95-a08d-f0f637a48bab\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00227070ed49585542d28c53b6a1bee35bfc\u0022\u003ECHL\u00D6E SWARBRICK (Green\u2014Auckland Central):\u003C/span\u003E E te M\u0101ngai, t\u0113n\u0101 koe. T\u0113n\u0101 koutou e te Whare\u2014a pleasure to rise to speak in this House for the first time since the Parliament has been formed again subsequent to the election. I am incredibly stoked, as well, that this is the first piece of legislation that I get to speak on, because it is something that I have spent a few years getting down into the detail of. It is also something which I think, Mr Deputy Speaker, I could tell based on your disapproving looks earlier, kind of makes my blood boil, particularly because of the misinformation, the seeds of doubt, and the real false equivalence that the National Party Opposition right now are attempting to provide, and the way that they are trying to say that there is equal evidence on both sides of this argument. That is simply a falsity. I implore any of those National Party MPs to go and look at this research\u2014to genuinely look at this research\u2014and to tell me that there are countries that have been made less safe by the imposition of legal drug-testing services.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000586\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dbaac12b-3efa-4d95-a08d-f0f637a48bab\u0022\u003EWhat this all actually kind of reminds me of\u2014I remember being quite young\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000587\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022badb0a39-849c-462a-b32f-77fc017c9fc2\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00220f15e8df17df4f539599625dd6149a99\u0022\u003EHon Simon Bridges\u003C/span\u003E: She still is.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000588\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dbaac12b-3efa-4d95-a08d-f0f637a48bab\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022ef2ac9d365904a66a4b86b9a6042b780\u0022\u003ECHL\u00D6E SWARBRICK\u003C/span\u003E: \u2014and watching a film which was quite popular in its day\u2014thank you, Simon Bridges. In that film\u2014it was a 2004 movie\u2014there\u2019s this coach. His name was Coach Carr. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000589\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022badb0a39-849c-462a-b32f-77fc017c9fc2\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00227bec5768454f4a2cacdde169df6f1f12\u0022\u003EHon Simon Bridges\u003C/span\u003E: What\u2019s it called?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000590\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dbaac12b-3efa-4d95-a08d-f0f637a48bab\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00229b7a5c54aa2a4af992d2d883cce09344\u0022\u003ECHL\u00D6E SWARBRICK\u003C/span\u003E: It\u2019s called Mean Girls, Simon Bridges. In that film this coach goes on to say, and I quote, \u201CDon\u2019t have sex, because you will get pregnant and you will die.\u201D That is, effectively, the same kind of abstinence-based, insane approach that is being advocated for by the National Party, and Simon Bridges stands up and goes, \u201CWhy is everybody looking at us like we\u2019re dinosaurs?\u201D Well, it might be because they are light years behind where the research and public opinion is on this issue, because if Mr Simon Bridges wants to talk about that, he can refer to the recent opinion polling which shows that approximately 80 percent of New Zealanders are behind this. The reason for that is because New Zealanders\u2014parents\u2014want their kids to make the right decisions. We all want our kids, we all want our younger siblings, to make the right decisions. But when you pack them up and you send them off to their first summer festival, you want to be sure that if they do engage in risky behaviour\u2014if they do make a mistake\u2014they are as safe as possible.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000591\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dbaac12b-3efa-4d95-a08d-f0f637a48bab\u0022\u003EOf course, this amendment to section 12 of the Misuse of Drugs Act is not going to be a silver bullet to solving all of the drug issues in this country, because you\u2019re going to have to repeal and replace the Misuse of Drugs Act 1975 to do that. I would note here, speaking across the aisle to my colleagues in the Labour Party, that two Labour Ministers in the last term of Government received reports\u2014both the Minister of Justice and the Minister of Health, with the Minister of Health receiving He Ara Oranga\u2014saying that we need to decriminalise substances. Turuki! Turuki!, the Safe and Effective Justice Programme Advisory Group review, went even further, recommending legalisation of all substances to regulate those substances. I note that there\u2019s an ACT Party member who\u2019s booing behind me\u2014so much for consistency of libertarian ideology.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000592\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dbaac12b-3efa-4d95-a08d-f0f637a48bab\u0022\u003EAnyway, the way that section 12 of the Misuse of Drugs Act works right now\u2014to make it really clear to the National Party, who I\u2019m not sure have actually read this bill, section 12 in the Misuse of Drugs Act makes it illegal to knowingly provide a place for people to consume substances. Arguably, tonnes and tonnes, unknowable amounts\u2014the majority of bar owners, of club owners, and of festival organisers in this country\u2014are currently in violation of this law. I have spoken behind the scenes to many of those organisers, who have been terrified at the prospect of enabling NGOs like KnowYourStuffNZ on to their premises, into their festivals, because they would therefore be accepting the premise that they are knowingly having people consuming substances at their festivals, at their venues, at the places and spaces that they organise. But those same festival organisers, those same club owners, say to me\u2014and I\u2019m sure if the National Party sought to speak to them would say\u2014that they are utterly terrified of having a young person die in a place and a space that they organised. Because this isn\u2019t tiddlywinks. This is reality. New South Wales experienced over a dozen young people dying in the past year. The New South Wales chief coroner recommended drug-checking services as a way to ensure that these kinds of needless deaths do not happen in the future. But still the National Party would prefer to stick their heads in the sand. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000593\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dbaac12b-3efa-4d95-a08d-f0f637a48bab\u0022\u003EI also just really want to leave a wero, a challenge, on the table for the next speaker from the National Party, because right now what they seem to be doing is drumming up, as much as possible, false equivalence between, \u201CWell, I\u2019ve got research, you\u2019ve got research, so, you know, it\u2019s all kind of\u2014we\u2019ve all got research\u201D. It\u2019s not quite the same thing. On top of that\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000594\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022badb0a39-849c-462a-b32f-77fc017c9fc2\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002257d37a30692540a89dab3cc2804d0d3f\u0022\u003EHon Simon Bridges\u003C/span\u003E: You haven\u2019t given us any research. She hasn\u2019t given us any research.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000595\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dbaac12b-3efa-4d95-a08d-f0f637a48bab\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022d702957a18094b838514aef79c67278c\u0022\u003ECHL\u00D6E SWARBRICK\u003C/span\u003E: If you\u2019d like some research, there\u2019s domestic, Simon Bridges. I\u2019d recommend you go to knowyourstuff.nz. There you\u2019ll find about six years\u2019 worth of research from an NGO. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000596\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022badb0a39-849c-462a-b32f-77fc017c9fc2\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00223fbf8c1cd1554cfab2eef90cf5ca5b2e\u0022\u003EHon Simon Bridges\u003C/span\u003E: Give me something from a university now.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000597\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dbaac12b-3efa-4d95-a08d-f0f637a48bab\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022c379becb69a94dcfbe24c689561d1513\u0022\u003ECHL\u00D6E SWARBRICK\u003C/span\u003E: From Fiona Hutton\u2014Dr Fiona Hutton. I\u2019m not going to engage with you because you are barraging me and refusing to engage in the substance. But the point that I was getting to is that the National Party here have sought to place false equivalence after false equivalence, as the merchants of doubt that they are. On top of that, they have also sought to somehow invoke the Portugal model as something that maybe they might like us to look at. But last year or the year before, when we were passing through those changes to section 7 of the Misuse of Drugs Act in response to the synthetic crisis, which got so out of hand as a response to the last National Party Government\u2019s approach that it was a matter of personal responsibility, they didn\u2019t want to see the decriminalisation of substances. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000598\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022badb0a39-849c-462a-b32f-77fc017c9fc2\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00224a9ce266dd174c7ba034734fd242efc8\u0022\u003EHon Simon Bridges\u003C/span\u003E: We\u2019ve had three leaders since then\u2014lay off. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000599\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dbaac12b-3efa-4d95-a08d-f0f637a48bab\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022043b6f4275144eb3832a230b9c18441a\u0022\u003ECHL\u00D6E SWARBRICK\u003C/span\u003E: So I\u2019m not quite sure where they sit on this, but none the less, Simon Bridges, I would refer you, actually, to a programme that was instigated by the former National Government. It\u2019s called Te Ara Oranga, and it runs by virtue of a collaboration between Northland District Health Board and police. There, if you speak to people on the ground, you will find that there is, effectively, a decriminalisation of methamphetamine. That has massively improved people\u2019s lives, because people are no longer being thrown in jail cells, but provided with wraparound support. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000600\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dbaac12b-3efa-4d95-a08d-f0f637a48bab\u0022\u003EThe other thing that I would say is if the National Party really, genuinely want to engage in the research, as they continue to say that they do, they had the opportunity to do so approximately three years ago, when, in collaboration with the New Zealand Drug Foundation, I presented to Parliament the architect of Portugal\u2019s model to decriminalise substances, which they now invoke as a matter of something that\u2019s working well\u2014or at the very least better than the infrastructure that they left us to inherit. I would also say that there is an opportunity to do so\u2014to collaborate, to meaningfully engage in that research\u2014should they choose to look at it. But we are not going to continue to pretend that there is this false equivalence here.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000601\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dbaac12b-3efa-4d95-a08d-f0f637a48bab\u0022\u003EThe final thing is, what kind of approach do the National Party want? Because we\u2019ve tried the Misuse of Drugs Act 1975. These drugs are illegal, folks. People are already taking them. People are going to continue to take them. They\u2019re already illegal. Are you going to make them more illegal? Because if you\u2019d like to\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000602\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002255d0b7a4-a2c9-4c38-9b77-475311a48a89\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00221c8da107d710466c809cf4b7c639cf0e\u0022\u003ESimeon Brown\u003C/span\u003E: You\u2019ve given up.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000603\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dbaac12b-3efa-4d95-a08d-f0f637a48bab\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022cfaf7ffd70724d2db06bc65285f2af2b\u0022\u003ECHL\u00D6E SWARBRICK\u003C/span\u003E: No, Simeon Brown. In fact, what you\u2019ll find we\u2019ve done is taken a far more common-sense approach, because you do not get rid of something by pushing it further into the shadows and making it more harmful. I\u2019d refer you here to the speech of Kevin Hague, a former Green MP, when the former National Government was passing the psychoactive substances legislation. He said at that point in time that pushing these substances underground would result in deaths and further harm, and, in fact, it did. This is what happens when you continue to neglect the responsibility of these halls of power. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000604\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dbaac12b-3efa-4d95-a08d-f0f637a48bab\u0022\u003ESo what do the National Party want to do? Do they want to go so far as, I don\u2019t know, Portugal\u2014no, actually, they\u2019ve already mentioned Portugal\u2014as Singapore? As Singapore, down the other end of the spectrum\u2014Singapore, which invokes the death penalty? Because in Singapore, you know, some of those \u201Chard on drugs\u201D kinds of approaches that they\u2019re talking about are invoked. But what Singapore has is some of the most questionable statistics on drug use in the entire world, based out of the UN. So what exactly does the National Party want to do? Because you\u2019ve got the Portugal approach over here, you\u2019ve got Singapore over here, and somewhere in the middle is what\u2019s being proposed in this legislation. I do not endorse people having car crashes, but if they\u2019re going to crash, I want them wearing a seatbelt. I do not endorse people taking drugs, but if they are going to do so, I want them to be as safe as possible.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000605\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dbaac12b-3efa-4d95-a08d-f0f637a48bab\u0022\u003EThe final thing that I would just say is that I\u2019d highly recommend that some of these National Party MPs who are currently yelling actually go and visit the KnowYourStuffNZ tents at some of these festivals\u2014as I know, actually, some in their ranks have, because some in their ranks do believe that this should pass; they just don\u2019t have the courage to step forward and say so. If they do so, what they\u2019ll find\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000606\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a434482b-7ac1-4862-9ce7-13e63289dee3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022d1b3a834486a4be48ffe52170db8be9d\u0022\u003EDEPUTY SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Order! Order! I think that might be out of order making that accusation. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000607\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dbaac12b-3efa-4d95-a08d-f0f637a48bab\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00229013350e2f244730817b157333ae3fe4\u0022\u003ECHL\u00D6E SWARBRICK\u003C/span\u003E: I apologise\u2014I withdraw and apologise, Mr Deputy Speaker. \u201CThe integrity\u201D\u2014is that within\u2014all right. I would hope that they have the convictions\u2014that they would feel strongly enough\u2014thank you, Mr Deputy Speaker.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022a434482b-7ac1-4862-9ce7-13e63289dee3\u0022 data-id=\u0022088b24cebbec43e8a105a9c8211a7df7\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000608\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a434482b-7ac1-4862-9ce7-13e63289dee3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022088b24cebbec43e8a105a9c8211a7df7\u0022\u003EDEPUTY SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Order! The member\u2019s time has expired. Before I call David Seymour, I just want to make a ruling about the interjections coming from the same side of the House. I didn\u2019t interrupt the Hon Simon Bridges when Chl\u00F6e Swarbrick was interrupting him, and I didn\u2019t interrupt Chl\u00F6e Swarbrick when the Hon Simon Bridges was doing the same. Now I\u2019m going to call David Seymour, and I\u2019m going to warn members close by: don\u2019t be caught coming through that member\u2019s microphone.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022 data-id=\u0022d436763794064801b21a669744621d99\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000609\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022d436763794064801b21a669744621d99\u0022\u003EDAVID SEYMOUR (Leader\u2014ACT):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Mr Speaker. I rise on behalf of ACT in support of the Drug and Substance Checking Legislation Bill, and hopefully to dial it down a notch and have some slightly calmer debate about this topic.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000610\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003EIf I\u2019ll say one thing about this great country of ours it\u2019s that people will go out of their way to help each other. They form clubs and associations\u2014rugby clubs, girl guides, La Leche League, whatever\u2014to help people out; to help each other. That\u2019s one of the core values of this country. And we\u2019re also a country that is known for our realism\u2014that we\u2019re prepared to accept the world as it is and choose how we behave and what to do about it. We\u2019re also a country that has a keen sense of what the role of Government is, what the role of this Parliament is, and what it isn\u2019t. We know that Parliament can\u2019t solve every problem. We know that sometimes we have to solve problems for ourselves. And we also are a country where we believe that people have the right to receive and impart information, to think for themselves, and make their own choices.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000611\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003EI give that background to our proud culture as New Zealand because I think all of those characteristics of our country are important when deciding how to take a position on this piece of legislation. We face a reality where, regardless of what this Parliament does, people this summer are going to take MDMA and party pills and all sorts of stuff. That is a given, whether people like it or not. That\u2019s the bit about facing reality. The question is what the role of this Parliament should be, and should this Parliament seek to prohibit those people who are trying to help each other by forming organisations and voluntarily going out to help their fellow New Zealanders make informed decisions and choices about how they act\u2014that\u2019s the question before this Parliament.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000612\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003EAnd before anybody makes a decision, they should also decide what the status quo is. What is Parliament doing now? Because too often this Parliament makes a law without asking what problem we\u2019re trying to solve or what laws are already in place. Well, right now the truth is that this Parliament is actively prohibiting and stopping people from getting out and helping their fellow New Zealanders avoid harm\u2014doing it voluntarily. We\u2019re stopping them voluntarily helping their fellow New Zealanders avoid harm with a law that says if you run a festival or a concert and you let someone come on and test party pills for people who are going to take them, then you as the host are in, at best, a legal grey area\u2014that\u2019s the status quo.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000613\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003EAnd there\u2019s another question that needs to be put: has this got anything to do with taxpayer money? No it does not. If the question was: should the Government fund pill testing, the ACT Party would be opposed. But that\u2019s not the question before this House. The question before this House is: should this Parliament put in place laws that stop New Zealanders\u2014groups such as KnowYourStuffNZ that voluntarily come together to provide a service to help people understand what sort of substances they\u2019re taking so those people can make informed decisions and choose how to act\u2014should this Parliament prohibit that from happening? The ACT Party says it\u2019s very clear: we should not prohibit volunteers going on to festival grounds and helping people make informed choices about the kinds of drugs that they may be taking.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000614\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003ENow, let me make another couple of comments about that. This is not a question about whether we think drugs are good. I\u2019m someone who is very grateful to have a mind through which I can experience the world\u2014and it is a wonderful world with its ups and its downs and its challenges and triumphs and tribulations. I do not understand why people would wish to distort that experience of the world arbitrarily using chemicals. I\u2019m even thinking about quitting caffeine just to keep it real\u2014just kidding! But I understand that people are going to do that. In my world people would not take psychoactive substances. It\u2019s not something I understand, it\u2019s not something I condone, and it\u2019s not something I support.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000615\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003EBut I also live in a real world where we know that people will and where we know that people put themselves at considerable risk because the people providing them with these substances do not follow the Consumer Guarantees Act. They don\u2019t have access to the usual remedies that people are able to access when they make sure that products like food or any other service that they like to buy or consume are safe. That\u2019s why it\u2019s necessary that these groups, such as KnowYourStuffNZ, are able to provide that information, are able to allow people to make informed decisions. To continue the law as it states is no more complicated than this: this Parliament, by the act of retaining the law made in the past, will ensure that some people are going to go to festivals this summer, and they\u2019re going to take substances without proper information. The substances are going to do them harm that may lead to chronic, long-term conditions, that may lead to death, that, at the very least, are going to lead to chronic, short-term discomfort\u2014that\u2019s what\u2019s going to happen. And this Parliament, if it opposes this legislation tonight, will be responsible for having done that. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000616\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003EI say to people that are sceptical about this: there\u2019s a good chance that the person affected will be someone that you know. It\u2019ll be parents who have sent their kids off to a festival. I don\u2019t know if Rhythm and Vines is still going. I can\u2019t remember a lot of being there to be honest. But they\u2019re going to go off to festivals up and down this country over what will hopefully be a sunny summer. It could be your nephew, your niece, your son, your daughter\u2014someone that you used to teach in your class\u2014you just don\u2019t know. And they\u2019re probably not a bad kid. They\u2019re probably not someone that gets into a lot of trouble, but without proper information in the heat of that moment, here\u2019s the simple question: if they\u2019re going to take a substance, would you like it to be a substance that you know is safe, where voluntary organisations have been able to go and do the testing and ensure it\u2019s safe for them, or would you rather just take a chance that maybe it\u2019s full of horse tranquiliser? Because that\u2019s literally the choice that people\u2014if you\u2019re watching Parliament or at home listening to Parliament on your crystal set\u2014are liable to make and people that you know.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000617\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003EFor all of those reasons, in the traditions of a country where people get together, form associations, help each other, face up to reality, and make decisions with properly informed consent, the ACT Party says that supporting this legislation is the right thing to do. That\u2019s why I\u2019m proud to stand in favour of this bill tonight. Thank you, Mr Speaker.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002295945ace-51e8-4dbc-a0e3-c19f4ed99ed9\u0022 data-id=\u0022a9e8eeed956d48568be9f7b045fd4cd5\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000618\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002295945ace-51e8-4dbc-a0e3-c19f4ed99ed9\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022a9e8eeed956d48568be9f7b045fd4cd5\u0022\u003EANAHILA KANONGATA\u2019A-SUISUIKI (Labour):\u003C/span\u003E Kia ora, e te Mana Whakaw\u0101. It\u2019s an honour and a privilege to contribute in the first reading of the Drug and Substance Checking Legislation Bill. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000619\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002295945ace-51e8-4dbc-a0e3-c19f4ed99ed9\u0022\u003EI heard a couple of speeches on that side, and I just want to remind members what this bill actually does. I heard the Minister, the Hon Andrew Little, say that the Drug and Substance Checking Legislation Bill is a time-limited and narrow measure to enable drug testing at festivals to operate within legal certainty this summer. To lose one life just because you went to a concert and took something that you thought would not kill you\u2014to lose one life is one life too many. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000620\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002295945ace-51e8-4dbc-a0e3-c19f4ed99ed9\u0022\u003EI heard from the other side\u2014I\u2019m not sure whether I heard it correctly, but a member from that side said that \u201CYou buy ecstasy; you get ecstasy.\u201D Well, actually, I haven\u2019t bought it in my life, but I don\u2019t think it comes with a label. That\u2019s why we legislate labelling in everything\u2014so that it is safe for the consumer. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000621\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002295945ace-51e8-4dbc-a0e3-c19f4ed99ed9\u0022\u003EThis bill does not change the status of any drug. It does not change the status of any drugs or substance. It will still be a crime for unauthorised persons to possess and sell illegal drugs. What it does is it does not increase the risk of prosecution, because it does provide an avenue where if you do get a drug test at a concert, then that is not admissible as evidence. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000622\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002295945ace-51e8-4dbc-a0e3-c19f4ed99ed9\u0022\u003ESo my advice to anybody who attends a festival is that if you are going to take a choice of taking a drug or something that you don\u2019t know what it is, please get it checked, because your life matters. I commend this bill to the House. M\u0101l\u014D. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022a434482b-7ac1-4862-9ce7-13e63289dee3\u0022 data-id=\u00229bda3557966f4d5f88a65435cd2431ac\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000623\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a434482b-7ac1-4862-9ce7-13e63289dee3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00229bda3557966f4d5f88a65435cd2431ac\u0022\u003EDEPUTY SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: This is a split call. I call the Hon Dr Nick Smith\u2014five minutes. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022 data-id=\u0022ae45ce86f1764af7bc85aa981b082a61\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000624\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022ae45ce86f1764af7bc85aa981b082a61\u0022\u003EHon Dr NICK SMITH (National):\u003C/span\u003E Mr Speaker, it\u2019s an incredibly poor start to the 53rd Parliament that the very first bill that we are to consider is to be tabled this morning and law by tonight. What sort of scrutiny are all those new members of Parliament giving, for their constituents to have a say on this issue? And it adds insult to injury that just 40 days ago New Zealanders voted against the liberalisation of laws and the very first bill is for this Government to give the fingers to the public of New Zealand and say, \u201CNo. We know better.\u201D\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000625\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003ENow, I was thinking that Labour has had a very successful result. They had a manifesto. I have in my hand over 200 policy commitments, and I assumed that if this was the first bill they\u2019d want to pass they\u2019d have a mandate for it. So I searched through Labour\u2019s manifesto\u2014224 promises and there is a promise on drugs\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000626\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002255d0b7a4-a2c9-4c38-9b77-475311a48a89\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002219db84c8109947ea9d3e88014d578ce4\u0022\u003ESimeon Brown\u003C/span\u003E: Oh, what did it say\u2014what did it say?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000627\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022898d00ae946d4884a2daa0bd72ab7b17\u0022\u003EHon Dr NICK SMITH\u003C/span\u003E: \u201CWe will respect the outcome of the cannabis referendum.\u201D and not a word about this party pills testing legislation, and I say that is an insult.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000628\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003EI want to challenge Chl\u00F6e Swarbrick, who ran all the same arguments this evening in the House that she ran on why we should legalise cannabis, but she has sounded horribly like her nemesis Donald Trump in refusing to accept that New Zealanders said no. She said there was a campaign of misinformation. She said that those that were opposed to it\u2014but she will not accept the democratic outcome when the people of New Zealand said no to going soft on drugs. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000629\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003EBut here\u2019s my question for members opposite. There has not been a single death in New Zealand from the use of party pills at concerts. But we do know that last year 107 New Zealanders lost their lives because we have drug-drivers on the road\u2014107 deaths last year; the year before, 93; the year before that, 80. If this Parliament was concerned about saving lives, why has not a member opposite been prepared to back the proven method of saving over a hundred lives a year by getting on and doing drug testing on the road to save lives? We know people are losing lives there. We know the Government have said that 107 people lost their lives last year, and time after time members on this side of the House, including myself, attempted to introduce bills to save lives and members opposite blocked it and dragged their feet.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000630\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003ESo my question for members opposite is this: how is it acceptable, when we do not have a single documented case of a loss of life as a consequence of party pills, that we have to pass a bill through all stages on one day under urgency but we are not prepared to move quickly to address an issue that\u2019s killing two New Zealanders a week? I\u2019ll tell you why. This is not about the most rational approach. This is not about doing what will keep New Zealand safest. This is just another bill along the ideological lines advocated by both the Green Party and the Labour Party of a soft approach on both drugs and crime. That is what this agenda is really about, and I fear for my children who will be going to music concerts this summer that the signal that we are sending to New Zealanders is that drugs like ecstasy are safe. They are not safe, and the clearest message we need to give to New Zealanders\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000631\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022977cccaf-581d-4f48-924e-32bf6c54a93d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022ddad71eb854841acb6aa4f6c3010597c\u0022\u003EDEPUTY SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Order! The member\u2019s time is expired. [Interruption] The member\u2019s time is expired.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00227a76db18-baa4-41c1-b366-89e2c753a1e7\u0022 data-id=\u002210c69a753d0649f0a75401303725e847\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000632\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227a76db18-baa4-41c1-b366-89e2c753a1e7\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002210c69a753d0649f0a75401303725e847\u0022\u003EDEBBIE NGAREWA-PACKER (Co-Leader\u2014Te Paati M\u0101ori):\u003C/span\u003E Kia ora e te M\u0101ngai. I stand up for Te Paati M\u0101ori and I will be less animated and probably a lot more calm. I do have to wonder, though, which concerts some of the members have been to lately. Te Paati M\u0101ori believe we should take a health approach to drugs and not a criminal one. This approach requires this Parliament to be extremely courageous in its decision making. Contrary to statements made tonight, the cannabis referendum was overwhelmingly supported by M\u0101ori, as must be decriminalisation. We recognise and commend r\u014Dp\u016B like H\u0101pai Te Hauora within the drugs sector, working for the rights of M\u0101ori guaranteed within Te Tiriti o Waitangi, and we are also conscious of those who are working on the ground with the most affected and the most at risk of taking poor drugs. We know that M\u0101ori are most affected by drug harm and most criminalised by the use of drugs. Therefore, we are very open to solutions. We also know that the implications of law on the lives of those wh\u0101nau who have to deal with the law and in the context of education, health, and community safety.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000633\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227a76db18-baa4-41c1-b366-89e2c753a1e7\u0022\u003ESo let\u2019s be very clear: for us, this is not about normalisation of drug use. Our rangatahi are going to make mistakes. They\u2019re going to make decisions. This is about us as wh\u0101nau doing the most that we can to keep them safe and mitigate harm. Therefore, we as a party will be supporting this and making sure we can do everything we can to help our rangatahi grow to be the best that they can be. Kia ora r\u0101.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022c21f4beb-20c4-4b12-bc6f-fdc931e2dc96\u0022 data-id=\u0022397f0688bce94de596756c5c7944e2f3\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000634\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c21f4beb-20c4-4b12-bc6f-fdc931e2dc96\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022397f0688bce94de596756c5c7944e2f3\u0022\u003EGINNY ANDERSEN (Labour\u2014Hutt South):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you very much, Mr Speaker. Look, I\u2019d like to take a brief call to talk about the importance of harm minimisation and how important that is in terms of saving young people\u2019s lives and that\u2019s why this bill aligns with those very principles. But at the same time as I\u2019m taking the first call of my time in this 53rd Parliament, I think it\u2019s important that we remember past positions in this House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000635\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c21f4beb-20c4-4b12-bc6f-fdc931e2dc96\u0022\u003EI\u2019m going to point out a glaringly obvious U-turn on the side of the Opposition when the Hon Stuart Nash as the Minister of Police announced that Labour was pursuing a policy of drug testing, of pill testing. In fact, the National Party spokesperson spoke in favour of it, and that they were in support of drug testing at dance parties because that was the safe and the right thing to do. In fact, the spokesperson at that time, Chris Bishop, spoke strongly in favour of pill testing, so I am surprised\u2014I am incredibly surprised\u2014that right now we hear the complete antithesis from those members opposite. In fact, today, when questioned on the tiles, Chris Bishop responded that he was on holiday in the Coromandel at the time, and so he was therefore unable to caucus. Well, I think that the entire National caucus probably deserves a good holiday in the Coromandel at this point, because clearly they need to get their lines sorted. And if you\u2019re going to support drug testing, please say so but don\u2019t do a complete U-turn. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000636\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c21f4beb-20c4-4b12-bc6f-fdc931e2dc96\u0022\u003EThis is a bill quite clearly about supporting New Zealand to make harm a minimal part of our lives\u2014and young people, when you see the chopper come in and pick someone up when their life is hanging on a thread, that\u2019s why we need to pill test. That\u2019s why we need to pill test. We need to pill test because it\u2019s about the safety of young people and providing an environment where young people aren\u2019t consuming toxins. And those members opposite have no opportunity to cast aspersions when they can\u2019t even sort out their own lines.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002255d0b7a4-a2c9-4c38-9b77-475311a48a89\u0022 data-id=\u002262e07e4c8224478891d9489f2a7eed4c\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000637\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002255d0b7a4-a2c9-4c38-9b77-475311a48a89\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002262e07e4c8224478891d9489f2a7eed4c\u0022\u003ESIMEON BROWN (National\u2014Pakuranga):\u003C/span\u003E Well, thank you, Mr Speaker, for the opportunity to take a call on the Drug and Substance Checking Legislation Bill. I just want to thank the member opposite for a wonderful history lesson. But, actually, what we\u2019re here to talk about is this bill which was dumped on us this morning and is being rushed through this Parliament as this Government\u2019s number one priority after the election\u2014the number one priority after the election is to help normalise drugs here in New Zealand.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000638\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002255d0b7a4-a2c9-4c38-9b77-475311a48a89\u0022\u003EThis piece of legislation will not achieve a reduction in harm from drugs in New Zealand. So this bill will not, because this bill, and the evidence which is clear\u2014the evidence is clear\u2014is that the drugs which young people are taking do cause harm. A University of New South Wales study of 392 ecstasy deaths between 2001 and 2016 found no deaths from impurities or contaminants in drugs\u2014and that is a study from the University of New South Wales. The reality is that it is an illegal substance, a class A substance, and it is a drug which kills people. It doesn\u2019t matter how many times you test MDMA, it\u2019s still MDMA\u2014it doesn\u2019t matter how many times you test it, it\u2019s still a drug which will kill people. I\u2019m not sure what Chl\u00F6e Swarbrick doesn\u2019t understand about that. MDMA is a dangerous drug. By telling our young people that they have their MDMA tested and that \u201CYes that is MDMA.\u201D, give them a green light and a little sticker to go away and take their MDMA does not make it safer\u2014does not make it any safer.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000639\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002255d0b7a4-a2c9-4c38-9b77-475311a48a89\u0022\u003EThis piece of legislation will not reduce the harm caused by drugs in our community. The public have just rejected the notion of more drugs in New Zealand with a referendum on marijuana, which did not pass, which failed, with the public rejecting the idea of more drugs and more normalisation of drugs in New Zealand. The first piece of legislation this Government has brought to this Parliament is something which will simply normalise drugs by sending the wrong message to our young people. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000640\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002255d0b7a4-a2c9-4c38-9b77-475311a48a89\u0022\u003EResearchers at the forensic international science journal fear that testing will place a false sense of security into the users\u2019 mind. It is a dangerously misleading claim to say that testing will increase the safety of drug taking. We are playing with young people\u2019s lives when we are saying that this is going to make their drugs safer. The drugs are dangerous. The drugs kill them. The drugs will not be made safer simply by testing them. I think that the members opposite, who have come to this House with great aspirations\u2014and I\u2019ve enjoyed listening to some of the maiden speeches about how they seek to have this new kind of leadership, this consultation, this ability to bring the community along, and, you know, this new type of leadership that they\u2019re promising, and this piece of legislation won\u2019t even go to a select committee.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000641\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002255d0b7a4-a2c9-4c38-9b77-475311a48a89\u0022\u003EIf there\u2019s evidence that the Green Party want to bring, if there\u2019s evidence that the community want to bring, bring it to a select committee. Let the public have their say. Let the evidence be tested. But the very first piece of legislation which has been brought, the public are not even being able to have their say on, and the public are not being able to actually test the evidence in here. There are well-documented limitations with the accuracy with some of the testing site devices. A collaborative testing approach between on-site testing devices and laboratory-based scientists is recommended in order to improve their results. There is evidence which needs to be brought to the select committee to actually prove this stuff works. We don\u2019t have that evidence here. We don\u2019t have this in the bill. We don\u2019t have any of that in the explanatory statement. None\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000642\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022badb0a39-849c-462a-b32f-77fc017c9fc2\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022e54faa62c862450482b11770f769a5f6\u0022\u003EHon Simon Bridges\u003C/span\u003E: The Minister didn\u2019t give us any.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000643\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002255d0b7a4-a2c9-4c38-9b77-475311a48a89\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022c27c07ab127b4cb5929df8bc8b468334\u0022\u003ESIMEON BROWN\u003C/span\u003E: \u2014of that evidence\u2014the Minister didn\u2019t give us; all we heard was hopes and dreams. Well, hope\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000644\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022badb0a39-849c-462a-b32f-77fc017c9fc2\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00229d4502627d734455bfc6207274cef518\u0022\u003EHon Simon Bridges\u003C/span\u003E: Chl\u00F6e Swarbrick didn\u2019t give us any.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000645\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002255d0b7a4-a2c9-4c38-9b77-475311a48a89\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00227655ebbe05f04f0883d4096c842d713b\u0022\u003ESIMEON BROWN\u003C/span\u003E: Chl\u00F6e Swarbrick didn\u2019t give us any evidence; we just heard the hopes and dreams.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000646\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dbaac12b-3efa-4d95-a08d-f0f637a48bab\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022b75b9665804649edbfd0c7de21896e0e\u0022\u003EChl\u00F6e Swarbrick\u003C/span\u003E: New South Wales chief coronial report, six years\u2019 worth of\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000647\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002255d0b7a4-a2c9-4c38-9b77-475311a48a89\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00228b21fdac354043e3a66a86f2fdee9bcd\u0022\u003ESIMEON BROWN\u003C/span\u003E: Well, bring it to a select committee\u2014bring it to a select committee.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000648\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dbaac12b-3efa-4d95-a08d-f0f637a48bab\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022ae45b239abc241d4bc8ea6621b1d15ff\u0022\u003EChl\u00F6e Swarbrick\u003C/span\u003E: I\u2019ll email it to you.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000649\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002255d0b7a4-a2c9-4c38-9b77-475311a48a89\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00222439873589a4465fac3b648b6eff2813\u0022\u003ESIMEON BROWN\u003C/span\u003E: We don\u2019t have the select committee process for this evidence to be tested and for the evidence to actually be weighed up to see whether it will actually make a real difference.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000650\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dbaac12b-3efa-4d95-a08d-f0f637a48bab\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022fa9aacf2ecf547648a69baf37ee076cc\u0022\u003EChl\u00F6e Swarbrick\u003C/span\u003E: We\u2019re working with him, patron saint of the National Party. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000651\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002255d0b7a4-a2c9-4c38-9b77-475311a48a89\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002221da8697ea0c4b43b72926c5dab53c3d\u0022\u003ESIMEON BROWN\u003C/span\u003E: Mr Speaker, I do wonder when the Green Party member continues to interject, as to whether their actual agenda is to simply legalise all drugs. I think the Green Party should actually clarify what their actual agenda here is. Is their agenda simply to normalise and legitimise all drugs? Because this is another step in that journey to simply say that drug use is OK and drug use should be legitimatised and normalised. On this side of the House, we don\u2019t think so. We want to ensure that our young people are sent the very clear message that if you take these drugs, they are dangerous and they are recognised under our legislation for the danger that they do have, and we will not be supporting legislation which continues to normalise drugs in New Zealand. Thank you very much.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022a1f7bbd1-b6ae-41c0-963b-dbe1251f5540\u0022 data-id=\u002247262b30b0f649cc8bc63d123b819441\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000652\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a1f7bbd1-b6ae-41c0-963b-dbe1251f5540\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002247262b30b0f649cc8bc63d123b819441\u0022\u003EKIERAN McANULTY (Labour\u2014Wairarapa):\u003C/span\u003E We have just heard a saying that we probably, factually, should not hear for the rest of this term, and that saying is: \u201CThis side of the House\u201D. Because that party no longer commands that side of the House. That side of the House is split in three. And two of those parties, three of those parties actually\u2014because this side of the House goes over to that side of the House. Three of the parties on that side of the House are supporting this legislation. Why? Because this legislation faces up to some simple facts. No one here is saying that these drugs should be legal. No one here is saying that these drugs should be consumed, but what we are saying is that they are. And as long as they are being consumed, we have a responsibility to ensure that they are safe. That\u2019s it; that\u2019s the guts of it.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000653\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a1f7bbd1-b6ae-41c0-963b-dbe1251f5540\u0022\u003EThe National Party oppose this bill, why? Because it\u2019s not their idea. That\u2019s the guts of it. They are so desperate now for some headlines that they look at this bill and they oppose it. They don\u2019t present any compelling evidence against it; they are happy\u2014they are happy\u2014for our young people to go to the festivals over the summer, and they are happy to accept the fact that these substances will be consumed, and they are happy to leave things to chance and increase the risk to these young people by not providing a simple service of testing those drugs.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000654\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a1f7bbd1-b6ae-41c0-963b-dbe1251f5540\u0022\u003EIt wasn\u2019t that long ago that there were news reports and pushes from the police and other agencies warning young people not to take a particular drug, because what they thought was in it was not in it. That simple warning and measure of safety would be provided if these things were tested at music festivals as an interim measure, in the meantime finding a long-term solution. We can\u2019t ignore this; we\u2019ve just got to deal with it.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca id=\u00227c69c5c90394423fb07f7d61a349d1f7\u0022 name=\u0022division\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EA party vote was called for on the question, That the Drug and Substance Checking Legislation Bill be now read a first time.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EAyes 86\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand Labour 64; ACT New Zealand 10; Green Party of Aotearoa New Zealand 10; Te Paati M\u0101ori 2.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENoes 33\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand National 33.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EMotion agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000655\u0022\u003EBill read a first time.\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000656\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u0022b38c7000ba804707a32dd351897d062b\u0022\u003ESecond Reading\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022 data-id=\u002257b81d91aca54908a36964f0e98c5cd8\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000657\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002257b81d91aca54908a36964f0e98c5cd8\u0022\u003EHon ANDREW LITTLE (Minister of Health):\u003C/span\u003E I earlier presented to the House a legislative statement on the Drug and Substance Checking Legislation Bill. I move, That the Drug and Substance Checking Legislation Bill be now read a second time. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000658\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003EAs we have heard in the debate already, this bill amends the Misuse of Drugs Act 1975 and the Psychoactive Substances Act 2013. As this House is already aware, this bill ensures that those who are providing drug-checking services at festivals can do so without the risk of criminal prosecution. Also, those who are hosting events at which drug-testing services are taking place can also host those events without the risk of criminal prosecution. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000659\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003EThe way this regime works is that the Director-General of Health can designate an outfit to be a drug-testing service. The director-general can attach conditions to that permit to do so, and we expect it won\u2019t take long to put that sort of machinery in place. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000660\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003EI listened very carefully\u2014although I wasn\u2019t in the House\u2014to the contributions from the members opposite in this debate, and I listened very carefully to hear an argument about why we should not in this day and age, knowing about young people\u2019s access to illicit substances, be taking measures to keep young people safe, because that\u2019s what this legislation is about. I heard the Hon Simon Bridges make his speech about being soft on drugs, and all the rest of it. So he dusted off those tired old tropes, but didn\u2019t make a great deal of sense. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000661\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003EI heard\u2014let me see. I heard Dr Shane Reti, who brings, of course, considerable experience and knowledge to just this as a health matter. Not only that, but as an MP based in Whang\u0101rei, he will know the success of the Te Ara Oranga project up there, which is the joint venture between the DHB, the police, and others, in dealing with the scourge of meth in that area up there, and he knows that the benefit and the success of that approach is that we don\u2019t judge people. We see people who are afflicted with addiction to meth and we offer them a health pathway to deal with it, rather than criminalising them. It\u2019s supported by the police, it\u2019s supported by the medical sector up there, and it is achieving great success. It\u2019s so good, in fact, that we\u2019re now seeking to roll it out in other parts of the country. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000662\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003EThat is what a sensible approach to drug use and those who have problematic drug use looks like. You don\u2019t judge the person, you don\u2019t judge them for possessing and consuming; you deal with the issue. For those who are pushing it, for those who trade on the misery of others: different story\u2014and we continue to do what we can to stop that kind of evil trade. But for those who are using, often people resort to psychoactive substances, to mind-altering substances for a reason. It often relates to other things in their lives, trauma in their lives, and those sorts of things\u2014that\u2019s what happens. So perpetually criminalising people in that situation is not an answer. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000663\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003EYou would have thought that after decades of what we\u2019ve done, we\u2019d realise that that, in fact, is the response, and so I was intrigued. In fact, I was interested to hear Dr Shane Reti\u2019s contribution, but I don\u2019t think, with all due respect to him, that it addressed the issue that this bill is seeking to address, and, indeed, when we get on to a long-term solution, what that will ultimately address. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000664\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003EI heard some criticisms of the changes made last year and whether or not they\u2019re working. They are legitimate questions to raise, and a review of the way the new provisions of the Misuse of Drugs Act is working is under way and we want to know exactly how that\u2019s being operated on the front line and the extent to which it\u2019s making a difference to people. But that is not an answer to the challenge that we have of a festival season about to be upon us, young people getting their tickets to the various events around the country and going into an environment where we know as a matter of fact there will be illicit substances, and where we are saying to young people, \u201CYou don\u2019t know. You\u2019re going to take that risk and we don\u2019t care.\u201D Well, actually, that\u2019s not the right response. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000665\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003EIf people are going to make that choice\u2014it\u2019s not a choice I would make. But if they\u2019re going to make that choice and we know there is risk\u2014and, in fact, even the member Simeon Brown acknowledged that and said, \u201CThese are dangerous. These are dangerous drugs.\u201D He knows that; he just doesn\u2019t want to do anything about it. He just doesn\u2019t want to help young people. I don\u2019t know why members opposite don\u2019t want to help young people and make their lives\u2014their more challenging lives\u2014safer for them. They know it\u2019s unsafe. They know that young people are taking risks, but they don\u2019t want to do anything about it. They know there is an easy step that could be taken\u2014and this is it\u2014that would help young people and keep them safe. That\u2019s the disappointing thing about the contributions we\u2019ve heard opposite. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000666\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003EWe heard the Hon Dr Nick Smith dust off his speech that he\u2019s given about 53 times in the last Parliament\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000667\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a1f7bbd1-b6ae-41c0-963b-dbe1251f5540\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022d7d8887c3f704ddab410124e26de3e4c\u0022\u003EKieran McAnulty\u003C/span\u003E: Every year he\u2019s been here. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000668\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00223cfb81afc64e4c178364a1cbea45efe7\u0022\u003EHon ANDREW LITTLE\u003C/span\u003E: \u2014and then I heard this long, slow thudding sound, actually, as he spoke, and I realised it was the leadership of the National Party in the headquarters and the strategists banging their heads against the concrete wall, thinking \u201CNot again\u2014not again!\u201D Nick Smith, who did not speak to the bill, but talked about anything but\u2014he talked about another bill that\u2019s on its way through Parliament, which is the roadside saliva testing of drug users, and complained that his Government was unable to do that. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000669\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003ESo no contribution at all, a sort of moralising, judgmental\u2014and at some point, I suspect, in the next three years, members opposite will say, \u201CWhy did we lose so many votes in the 2020 election? Why did we lose so many seats?\u201D Some bright spark amongst them\u2014because I know they are there\u2014will say, \u201CYou know what? We\u2019re actually out of touch. We actually don\u2019t know how New Zealanders live their lives any more. It\u2019s time we learnt.\u201D \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000670\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003EI know it\u2019s early in this parliamentary term, and I know I\u2019m their political opposite and I shouldn\u2019t really be trying to help them, but you cannot help but have a sense of pity. And we saw it trotted out tonight: more of the same. I just despair for those citizens who are represented by National MPs, who must also now be tearing their hair out, thinking \u201CReally? We put them back in again?\u201D \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000671\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003ESo I just simply invite members opposite\u2014I know it\u2019s hard. I know it\u2019s hard, and it\u2019s been difficult times, but I think that if we just focus on the issues, there are risks. There are risks that some in our community are taking. We are not going to stop young people experimenting, trying new things, trying other substances\u2014we\u2019re not going to stop them doing it. But what we can do is keep them safe, and this is a measure that keeps them safe. The members opposite know, and they can describe those people as breaking the law and as criminals as long as they like, but they\u2019re not going to change the patterns of young people of the last 50 years or 60 years or 70 years. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000672\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003EAt some point, it\u2019s actually the role of the nation\u2019s conservative parties, and conservative parties around the world, to accept reality. That\u2019s actually what defines a conservative party. They\u2019re so bedded in the reality of today that they sometimes forget how to make progress. But, actually, on this issue\u2014on this issue\u2014I would have thought it was time for them to accept the reality that this stuff is out there, young people are using it, they\u2019re taking risks, we know those risks, and we can do something about it. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000673\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003EFor those who say, \u201CWell, we\u2019ve never had a death\u201D, actually, it was only a term or so ago that members opposite\u2014and Simeon Brown was one of them\u2014were lecturing us all about the peril of synthetic cannabis and saying that we had to do more about that because that was compromising lives. All of a sudden, he\u2019s changed his tune. His factual basis has changed, and there is no risk any more\u2014people aren\u2019t in danger using substances and chemicals that they don\u2019t know the origins of. Well, actually, you know, sometimes you\u2019ve actually just got to focus on the facts. You\u2019ve got to accept reality and you\u2019ve got to say that where there is risk and we can do something about it, then maybe we should help to mitigate that risk. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000674\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003EOur moral duty in this Parliament is not to stand there moralising about citizens of New Zealand and it is not to stand in judgment of the citizens of New Zealand, but it is to accept that where we see, on public policy grounds, that there is activity that is putting people at risk, we take the practical step of mitigating that risk. That is what this bill does, and, once again, I commend it to the House. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022a434482b-7ac1-4862-9ce7-13e63289dee3\u0022 data-id=\u0022384d1837eb904aeb8056eb7c1def3a2a\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000675\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a434482b-7ac1-4862-9ce7-13e63289dee3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022384d1837eb904aeb8056eb7c1def3a2a\u0022\u003EDEPUTY SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: The question is that the motion be agreed to. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022badb0a39-849c-462a-b32f-77fc017c9fc2\u0022 data-id=\u0022658cee2ef09c4032954ffdbe08e12fbd\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000676\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022badb0a39-849c-462a-b32f-77fc017c9fc2\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022658cee2ef09c4032954ffdbe08e12fbd\u0022\u003EHon SIMON BRIDGES (National\u2014Tauranga):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Mr Speaker. You know, listening to that speech I\u2019ve got no idea why the Labour Party rolled Andrew Little. I mean, you know, he\u2019s a charmer! He\u2019s just such a charmer! He didn\u2019t condescend us at all! He didn\u2019t condescend us at all! He didn\u2019t talk down to us! He didn\u2019t moralise! No, no\u2014he\u2019s a charming individual! And I say in all seriousness to Andrew Little, the shame of it is, actually, he and Chl\u00F6e Swarbrick, dare I say it, have come along to this House with that tone that\u2019s quite personal, putting down members on the other side rather than actually genuinely engaging in the argument and the issues.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000677\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022badb0a39-849c-462a-b32f-77fc017c9fc2\u0022\u003EI\u2019ll tell you why I think that is. I think the real reason for that is they know what they\u2019re doing is trying to come in on a zeitgeist and a feeling but actually without the evidence, the hard evidence, and the reality of the studies, and what is happening, and the long-term effects of this bill\u2014without any of those things on their side. I think that\u2019s why actually we saw the fun and games from Andrew Little. We get the same tone from Chl\u00F6e Swarbrick and from other members of the Labour Party because, actually, the arguments aren\u2019t on their side. They\u2019re smiling right now, they\u2019re laughing, but, actually, they don\u2019t refer to any studies. Kieran McAnulty, give me one right now. He can\u2019t. He can\u2019t. I actually wonder if he can even give us the title of this bill\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000678\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a1f7bbd1-b6ae-41c0-963b-dbe1251f5540\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002251e88cfbbdce4963aedbf78f9ab037a1\u0022\u003EKieran McAnulty\u003C/span\u003E: Who\u2019s \u201CKieran McNulty\u201D? \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000679\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022badb0a39-849c-462a-b32f-77fc017c9fc2\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002216c699ce7e004d879d0fe313c612dae1\u0022\u003EHon SIMON BRIDGES\u003C/span\u003E: I don\u2019t know. Whatever his name is\u2014the list MP who\u2019s now an electorate MP, whatever. [Interruption] Yeah, and congratulations. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000680\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022badb0a39-849c-462a-b32f-77fc017c9fc2\u0022\u003EBut, actually, on this side of the House we come to this debate armed with the facts, and, you know, it seems quite clear to us use will go up. You see, we heard from Andrew Little and from others. We heard from Angie Warren-Clark. Her reason for supporting this bill she says, and the Labour Party, is she wants to know her kids will be safe. The problem is she won\u2019t know that through this bill. She won\u2019t know that and so that\u2019s a real problem. People are going to say to other people, \u201CYou know what, actually Parliament said it\u2019s safe. We\u2019ve had this test.\u201D, so use will go up and the studies show\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000681\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dbaac12b-3efa-4d95-a08d-f0f637a48bab\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022e3f0068ca9ed4e3f8858f20b02ca1d17\u0022\u003EChl\u00F6e Swarbrick\u003C/span\u003E: That\u2019s not what happens.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000682\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022badb0a39-849c-462a-b32f-77fc017c9fc2\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022238657b087a945508c2d541600b6f446\u0022\u003EHon SIMON BRIDGES\u003C/span\u003E: Chl\u00F6e Swarbrick says that\u2019s not what happens. Well, I think that\u2019s absolutely what happens. You go along to a concert, a party, and the guys next to you say, \u201CCome on, take one of these. Why won\u2019t you?\u201D and you say, \u201CNo, look, it\u2019s illegal.\u201D \u201CBut, look, even Parliament says this test is safe. That\u2019s what Angie Warren-Clark said. That\u2019s actually what she said.\u201D That\u2019s the signal we send. Use will go up. Actually, in the only study referred to in this House on what\u2019s happened to use when pill testing has been legalised in the United Kingdom\u2014well, what happened? Use went up\u2014right\u2014from 1.2 to 1.3 to 1.7. By the way, deaths went up as well. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000683\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022badb0a39-849c-462a-b32f-77fc017c9fc2\u0022\u003EThat\u2019s the second point. If use goes up, harm goes up. I don\u2019t think, actually, that\u2019s a particularly difficult, controversial statement to make. And it has to be made, because for all the sneering that we\u2019ve heard on the other side, all the mockery of the good-faith positions that the National Party are taking, if the pill is tested and has ecstasy, that\u2019s where the harm is. It\u2019s the ecstasy. Actually, it\u2019s not the impurities. It\u2019s not the other things. By and large, in the overwhelming majority of cases that are harming and killing, it is the ecstasy. And we\u2019ve seen that again from the very clear, hard data of the hundreds of fatalities in Australia. So there is a false security that comes from going along with this. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000684\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022badb0a39-849c-462a-b32f-77fc017c9fc2\u0022\u003EI mean, the third point really is this. We\u2019re rushing this. We\u2019re rushing this. If the evidence is as I say it is, it\u2019s shameful. But, actually\u2014and Chl\u00F6e Swarbrick tries to make light of this point\u2014if it is at any level equivocal and if she\u2019s so confident, despite the fact she didn\u2019t refer to a single scientific survey or study in her last contribution, if she\u2019s so confident, why doesn\u2019t it go to a select committee so these things can be thrashed out?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000685\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dbaac12b-3efa-4d95-a08d-f0f637a48bab\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00227d5f541afba84d0183e6c31e1c6335aa\u0022\u003EChl\u00F6e Swarbrick\u003C/span\u003E: Stop lying, Simon.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000686\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022badb0a39-849c-462a-b32f-77fc017c9fc2\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00221dd7641404934bb4a4185a4cdeb83be1\u0022\u003EHon SIMON BRIDGES\u003C/span\u003E: So civil society, so the scientists\u2014point of order, Mr Speaker. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000687\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a434482b-7ac1-4862-9ce7-13e63289dee3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022cbbe916940b04e5aaa748cde8473a9d4\u0022\u003EDEPUTY SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Point of order, the Hon Simon Bridges. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000688\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022badb0a39-849c-462a-b32f-77fc017c9fc2\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00228421d48692ae418da19a416786336980\u0022\u003EHon SIMON BRIDGES\u003C/span\u003E: The member just said to me to stop lying. I take offence at that.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000689\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dbaac12b-3efa-4d95-a08d-f0f637a48bab\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022d11ced9d3bf04256ab9f1e2adbb2f20b\u0022\u003EChl\u00F6e Swarbrick\u003C/span\u003E: Responding to the point of order.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000690\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a434482b-7ac1-4862-9ce7-13e63289dee3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00222418d80f48b648bcbe2088b7701a12bc\u0022\u003EDEPUTY SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: No, no, no, no\u2014you sit down. I didn\u2019t hear the comment myself. I will take the member\u2019s word. If the member Chl\u00F6e Swarbrick did use that term, she knows it\u2019s out of order. She should stand, withdraw, and apologise.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000691\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dbaac12b-3efa-4d95-a08d-f0f637a48bab\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00221c016f3098604264b6f941c2edd0544d\u0022\u003EChl\u00F6e Swarbrick\u003C/span\u003E: Responding to the point of order, Mr Speaker.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000692\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a434482b-7ac1-4862-9ce7-13e63289dee3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00221790469913dd49c89b8fe552bc114ad1\u0022\u003EDEPUTY SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: No, you either stand, withdraw, and apologise, or you haven\u2019t done it.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000693\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dbaac12b-3efa-4d95-a08d-f0f637a48bab\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00228aff4ec218ef472d8389bd2dcb18365c\u0022\u003EChl\u00F6e Swarbrick\u003C/span\u003E: I stand, withdraw, and apologise. Mr Speaker, point of order.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000694\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a434482b-7ac1-4862-9ce7-13e63289dee3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a6d7a298efdb4d1bb2ddb4d1d03b969f\u0022\u003EDEPUTY SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Point of order, and if this in any way questions the ruling, be careful.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000695\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dbaac12b-3efa-4d95-a08d-f0f637a48bab\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022da02a41dfaff4b6196e1ed217f7760d7\u0022\u003EChl\u00F6e Swarbrick\u003C/span\u003E: I raise a point of order, Mr Speaker. Could I please request your guidance on how best to approach you?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000696\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a434482b-7ac1-4862-9ce7-13e63289dee3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022d68e12ca059f458e8a34ec9895c7d2dc\u0022\u003EDEPUTY SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: No, that\u2019s not a point of order. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000697\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dbaac12b-3efa-4d95-a08d-f0f637a48bab\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00222db47cb2f3ef49cb99b03c19f47dcd4f\u0022\u003EChl\u00F6e Swarbrick\u003C/span\u003E: An absolute mischaracterisation.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000698\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a434482b-7ac1-4862-9ce7-13e63289dee3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022147c4bdce8b943748435e7f3fc01f631\u0022\u003EDEPUTY SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: That\u2019s not a point of order. No, it\u2019s not. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000699\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dbaac12b-3efa-4d95-a08d-f0f637a48bab\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00225c1c639a8faf4c7eb79ef4f9c97a1133\u0022\u003EChl\u00F6e Swarbrick\u003C/span\u003E: Looking forward to debate. Thank you, Mr Speaker.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000700\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022badb0a39-849c-462a-b32f-77fc017c9fc2\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00225b37853b82294ee099fbec8a6cfc0053\u0022\u003EHon SIMON BRIDGES\u003C/span\u003E: I was just saying, the point is this: if Chl\u00F6e Swarbrick is so confident of the evidence, why isn\u2019t this going to a select committee? As we rush this through this Parliament as quickly as any law in any country in the world can be passed, we haven\u2019t done the serious harm-reduction work that needs to be done. Andrew Little says, \u201CLook, you know, don\u2019t judge this. Deal with the issue. Don\u2019t judge people who take drugs; deal with the underlying issues.\u201D The Government hasn\u2019t done that. It\u2019s reaching for this non - evidence based, unscientific bill that\u2019s just trying to capture the sentiment, the feeling, the feel-good feeling out there rather than having done the hard mahi.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000701\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022badb0a39-849c-462a-b32f-77fc017c9fc2\u0022\u003EFourth, I say, this bill is part of a wider agenda that\u2019s soft-headed and soft on drugs. And we saw that from Mr Little\u2019s mouth. He was quite clear himself. He said, and I\u2019m paraphrasing, but this is in his first contribution, \u201CIt\u2019s a health matter. The fact is some take it. We can carry on criminalising or accept it.\u201D That\u2019s what he said. The Labour Party, the Government of the day, is accepting hard illicit drug use in New Zealand. And then he said this: \u201CIt\u2019s not a criminal matter. It\u2019s a health matter.\u201D\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000702\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b8550e1a-ed25-44a2-b0e2-b0a8d52a7a80\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00220810db0ef5dc4b1d9b484b468ced058b\u0022\u003ERachel Boyack\u003C/span\u003E: It is.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000703\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022badb0a39-849c-462a-b32f-77fc017c9fc2\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022b0b75ea867184effabb1abc6cccfc092\u0022\u003EHon SIMON BRIDGES\u003C/span\u003E: And the member over there, the member for Nelson, says it is\u2014it\u2019s not a criminal matter; it\u2019s a health matter. Except they\u2019re wrong\u2014it is a criminal matter. The Misuse of Drugs Act makes quite clear it is criminal to take and consume class C, B, and, in this case, ecstasy, an A drug. And the issue there is this. You say, \u201CWell, it doesn\u2019t matter. Why are you going on about that?\u201D Well, because that\u2019s the honest truth of what Andrew Little says and thinks he wants to decriminalise. The actual agenda here is to decriminalise, except what he knows is we\u2019ve just had a referendum on a much lighter drug, cannabis, and New Zealanders wouldn\u2019t stand for it. And so because they know they don\u2019t have any mandate\u2014in fact, quite the opposite for decriminalising wholesale drugs in this country\u2014what they do is through the side door in a de facto way, and they did it in the last Parliament and they do it in this Parliament: they keep winding along with their soft-headed, soft on drugs approach, decriminalising. Andrew Little\u2019s true view is we can carry on criminalising or accept\u2014and he accepts\u2014that it\u2019s not a criminal matter; it\u2019s a health matter. Of course it\u2019s a health matter. But, actually, we need to take these things seriously and the Government clearly isn\u2019t.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000704\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022badb0a39-849c-462a-b32f-77fc017c9fc2\u0022\u003EMinister Little also said parents want to know their kids are safe and I dealt with that, really, when we talked about the point Angie Warren-Clark\u2019s making. But Parliament needs to face up to the fact\u2014and I say it again\u2014that this bill won\u2019t make young Kiwis safe. It sends the wrong message. It\u2019ll ensure more drug use. It gives a false confidence that they\u2019ll be safe when they won\u2019t because the ecstasy is what in the vast majority of cases kills. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000705\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022badb0a39-849c-462a-b32f-77fc017c9fc2\u0022\u003EI want to come back to Chl\u00F6e Swarbrick\u2019s contribution. She berated us on the evidence and, as I said, apart from referring me to a website, she doesn\u2019t refer to any case studies, evidence, surveys, and now I\u2019m sure she\u2019s on Google. She\u2019s got\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000706\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dbaac12b-3efa-4d95-a08d-f0f637a48bab\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00228639261a81054c86a53d0a1f70ecf113\u0022\u003EChl\u00F6e Swarbrick\u003C/span\u003E: I seek leave to make a personal statement.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000707\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00224a25943b-cb3b-49c3-bd10-74316fae17f1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00229fcf18cfac3d40699a07ad3f136e4442\u0022\u003EASSISTANT SPEAKER (Hon Jacqui Dean)\u003C/span\u003E: Look, thank you. That member will resume her seat and will wait until Simon Bridges\u2019 speech is concluded.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000708\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022badb0a39-849c-462a-b32f-77fc017c9fc2\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022e0f42cf5ac734ce392e7884685153960\u0022\u003EHon SIMON BRIDGES\u003C/span\u003E: All there is, frankly, from every single speaker on the other side is a bill, is law, by anecdote. What they feel real life is and what they think works\u2014they impute bad faith on the National Party but, actually, we come to this Parliament with good faith. We put forward what we think are serious arguments and serious views that we genuinely hold. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000709\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022badb0a39-849c-462a-b32f-77fc017c9fc2\u0022\u003EI want to finish with something Nick Smith said, which I thought was a phenomenal point. There hasn\u2019t been a single death from party pills in this country at dance parties and the like\u2014the things that we\u2019re talking about here today\u2014so far. And yet this is what we\u2019re spending all our time on today. And yet over a hundred die from drug-driving and this Parliament is on go-slow on that. If that\u2019s not posturing, if that\u2019s not playing politics rather than dealing with the real harms and the real issues on drug use, well, I don\u2019t know what is. And so the National Party\u2019s going to continue to oppose this and do all we can to make sure this goes through the night, because what\u2019s happening tonight is wrong.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022dbaac12b-3efa-4d95-a08d-f0f637a48bab\u0022 data-id=\u0022cc6c0af7f5a94b5c90f3aa0774aff86c\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000710\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dbaac12b-3efa-4d95-a08d-f0f637a48bab\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022cc6c0af7f5a94b5c90f3aa0774aff86c\u0022\u003ECHL\u00D6E SWARBRICK (Green\u2014Auckland Central):\u003C/span\u003E Madam Speaker, I seek leave to make a personal statement. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000711\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00224a25943b-cb3b-49c3-bd10-74316fae17f1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00229702cbf4628c43a4b1a3e1054d820851\u0022\u003EASSISTANT SPEAKER (Hon Jacqui Dean)\u003C/span\u003E: OK, thank you.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000712\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dbaac12b-3efa-4d95-a08d-f0f637a48bab\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022982782914e764bd8a5c475051d0337b1\u0022\u003ECHL\u00D6E SWARBRICK\u003C/span\u003E: My understanding of the convention of the personal statement is that I cannot use this time or this space to, obviously, attack the Opposition, and I have no intention of doing so. However, I think that it is really important\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000713\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00224a25943b-cb3b-49c3-bd10-74316fae17f1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00225d89927855c24cafa665976feb6009e8\u0022\u003EASSISTANT SPEAKER (Hon Jacqui Dean)\u003C/span\u003E: Sorry. Order! Sorry to interrupt\u2014the member will resume her seat. Sorry, I\u2019ve very much got my training wheels on this evening, and so, in terms of procedure, I must put leave to the House for the member to make a personal statement. Is there any objection to that course of action? Yes, there is. OK.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00223c5917bd-9c2f-4bdf-af2f-b13cd1a2c8bb\u0022 data-id=\u00226c56bfafd252433aa5b1f5ceaac63bb5\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000714\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223c5917bd-9c2f-4bdf-af2f-b13cd1a2c8bb\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00226c56bfafd252433aa5b1f5ceaac63bb5\u0022\u003EDr LIZ CRAIG (Labour):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Madam Speaker. Reading this bill this afternoon brought back some memories of my time working in emergency departments at the weekends. Often we\u2019d see young people coming in having ingested an unknown substance. I think the issue was having to spend time with those young people with often quite frightening symptoms and working out what it is that they\u2019d taken and how best to look after them over the next few hours or days that they were in hospital. It made me reflect on the two options we\u2019ve got in front of us: one is to have drug testing at festivals and other events, and the other is not to do so.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000715\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223c5917bd-9c2f-4bdf-af2f-b13cd1a2c8bb\u0022\u003EJust looking at the New Zealand Drug Foundation website, it describes what actually happens if you do go to a festival and turn up to have your drugs or substances tested. What it says is you will receive a one-on-one service, and it takes about 15 minutes. So what will happen is trained volunteers will take a very small sample of your substance, and they\u2019ll divide it into three piles. Two of those piles are tested with reagents, and what that does is it\u2019s got acids and it makes colour changes if certain substances are present. Then one of the piles is tested with a spectrometer and what it does is it compares your sample against other known samples of known substances and it can detect the presence of unexpected substances, adulterants, or additives. Then what you get in that 15 minutes is you get a report, and you also get some harm reduction advice. As I was mentioning in my previous contribution, about 20 percent of people\u2019s substances don\u2019t turn out to be what they thought they were and another 11 percent have got additives that were completely unexpected. So then it\u2019s your choice whether you go ahead and you take that substance or not. In many cases, if there\u2019s a difference in what you\u2019re expecting, you don\u2019t take the substance\u2014harm reduction and issue averted.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000716\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223c5917bd-9c2f-4bdf-af2f-b13cd1a2c8bb\u0022\u003EIf you actually, though, think about what happens if you don\u2019t go down that route\u2014you can do a quick google and if you put \u201CMDMA\u201D into the search engine, what comes up is a range of headlines. For example: \u201C13 hospitalised in Christchurch after taking drugs they thought were MDMA\u201D; \u201CSubstance behind mass hospitalisations was three times stronger than MDMA\u201D; \u201CDodgy batch suspected in Christchurch Hospital emergency admissions spike over the weekend.\u201D And they go on to talk about the spike of cases where nine patients turned up in the emergency department over a very short period of time, patients with agitated state, dangerously high blood pressure, elevated heart rate, and the health team was so concerned that they started to put out warnings talking about how serious this stuff could be, talking about the fact that permanent damage to the heart, long-term mental health problems, severe kidney failure, heart attacks, and seizures may occur. So it\u2019s just weighing up 15 minutes\u2014basically getting your pills tested to find out if they contain what you thought they did, versus the risk of turning up to a hospital department with long-term side effects potentially on the radar. So I think what this bill does today is make sure that our young people can be kept safe over summer when they start to attend their festivals, if they do choose to take drugs and have those tested.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000717\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223c5917bd-9c2f-4bdf-af2f-b13cd1a2c8bb\u0022\u003EBut in the longer term, Andrew Little, Minister, will be going through and putting a more detailed proposal through to Cabinet so that over the next year we can go through and create the legislative framework we need that\u2019s got more time. Thank you, I commend this to the House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022861a1798-a396-4a6c-b9e2-7d2f15d4a001\u0022 data-id=\u002286dfa1982a7f4a35ade76c244f944bef\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000718\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022861a1798-a396-4a6c-b9e2-7d2f15d4a001\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002286dfa1982a7f4a35ade76c244f944bef\u0022\u003EDr SHANE RETI (Deputy Leader\u2014National):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Madam Speaker. It\u2019s a pleasure, in the legislative process, to then have the report back from the select committee, and this is that report. Yes, this is the report from the select committee\u2014because there was none; because there\u2019s been no select committee process. I\u2019ll talk to that in this hurried legislation that\u2019s going to give us problems in the future\u2014exactly as to what some of those problems will be. I want to identify five of them.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000719\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022861a1798-a396-4a6c-b9e2-7d2f15d4a001\u0022\u003EThe first is we\u2019ve heard the statement made that the country is not less safe after pill testing. Well, we\u2019d make the point that that false sense of security that young people may have may well indeed make us less safe.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000720\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022861a1798-a396-4a6c-b9e2-7d2f15d4a001\u0022\u003EAlso, there was some discussion around decriminalisation and the health approach. No one actually wanted to discuss the facts we put on the table from the Official Information Act request\u2014the failed decriminalisation health approach with the Misuse of Drugs Act and the fact that that health approach is just a text message, as I alluded to earlier.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000721\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022861a1798-a396-4a6c-b9e2-7d2f15d4a001\u0022\u003ENow, Te Ara Oranga was commented on. That is indeed a very good Northland programme. It\u2019s actually a methamphetamine reduction programme modelled on the Matrix\u2014it\u2019s \u201CMatrix-lite\u201D\u2014which is an intensive outpatient programme, fundamentally. But, quite in contrast to what was commented here, the Matrix programme, in its full implementation, actually has a urine-testing, or a drug-testing, component as well, and it goes like this: you urine test or you drug test; if you\u2019re positive, there\u2019s a consequence: you\u2019re kicked out of the programme. This is quite different. You have a test. If you\u2019re positive, you give the drugs back. I don\u2019t see quite how you could map those two programmes together. By the way, the magic in Te Ara Oranga is what\u2019s called the pouwhenua, which are the lived-experience community people who have often had a drug experience themselves, and so they\u2019re excellent teachers. If you speak with the people there, that\u2019s actually the magic to Te Ara Oranga.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000722\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022861a1798-a396-4a6c-b9e2-7d2f15d4a001\u0022\u003EDavid Seymour emphasised it was a funding issue. I found that kind of interesting. The principle would seem to be that if it needs Government funding, then it\u2019s not good legislation, but, if it doesn\u2019t, it\u2019s OK to pass. I hope he\u2019ll reflect on that and think if that\u2019s really what he wanted to convey. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000723\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022861a1798-a396-4a6c-b9e2-7d2f15d4a001\u0022\u003EI think, though, as is often the case with this Government and with hurried legislation, you can hang them with their own policies. I think the policy that\u2019s missing here from the table is a regulatory impact statement, and it shows the hurried nature of this legislation. Let me read a few parts from the departmental disclosure statement: 2.3. \u201CWere any regulatory impact statements provided to inform the policy decisions that led to this Bill? NO\u201D, and, as it says here, there was insufficient time to revisit parts of this question. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000724\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022861a1798-a396-4a6c-b9e2-7d2f15d4a001\u0022\u003EIf we look at part 2.4. \u201CHas further impact analysis become available for any aspects of the policy to be given effect by this Bill? NO\u201D. We had a member over here saying the evidence is not controversial, it\u2019s incontrovertible, it\u2019s really clear, and there\u2019s lots of it, and here we are with their own departmental disclosure statement saying, no, the evidence isn\u2019t available\u2014no, it hasn\u2019t been done. Remember, this is the Government\u2019s own policy. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000725\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022861a1798-a396-4a6c-b9e2-7d2f15d4a001\u0022\u003E3.3. \u201CHas advice been provided to the Attorney-General on whether any provisions of this bill appear to limit any of the rights and freedoms affirmed in the New Zealand Bill or Rights Act 1990? NO\u201D. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000726\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022861a1798-a396-4a6c-b9e2-7d2f15d4a001\u0022\u003E3.6. \u201CExternal consultation\u201D\u2014\u201CHas there been any external consultation on the policy to be given effect\u201D. \u201CYES. The broad policy has been discussed with KnowYourStuff, a drug checking organisation.\u201D Is that the limit of external consultation on this bill? KnowYourStuff\u2014do you think that could possibly be a biased piece of advice in this consultation? \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000727\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022861a1798-a396-4a6c-b9e2-7d2f15d4a001\u0022\u003E3.7. \u201CHave the policy details to be given effect by this bill been otherwise tested or assessed in any way to ensure the Bill\u2019s provisions are workable and complete? NO\u201D. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000728\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022861a1798-a396-4a6c-b9e2-7d2f15d4a001\u0022\u003EWith the Government\u2019s own departmental disclosure statement, they, fundamentally, say we\u2019ve been out to an external organisation who is in keeping with the intent of this bill\u2014there\u2019s no real balance to that. Do they think it can be deployed? Has it been tested in any way to show it can be deployed? No. Are there external articles, external provisions? They make a comment that Victoria University of Wellington is due to come up with some policy, but, at this point in time, no, there\u2019s not particularly any evidence that they can bring to this.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000729\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022861a1798-a396-4a6c-b9e2-7d2f15d4a001\u0022\u003EBy the way, it\u2019s dated 30 November\u2014so dated yesterday. It makes a mockery of all the evidence that was available and how incontrovertible it was. No, it wasn\u2019t. With their own departmental disclosure statement, it says there\u2019s no evidence, we don\u2019t know if it\u2019s going to work, but we\u2019re just going to do it anyway. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000730\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022861a1798-a396-4a6c-b9e2-7d2f15d4a001\u0022\u003ESo I think, really, that just adds weight to the point that we\u2019re making: hurried legislation. We remain unchanged from our first views in the first reading. Thank you, Madam Speaker.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022e60c1237-5e2d-4d0a-9678-ab10db67d1b7\u0022 data-id=\u0022e86f011b03e643b4a66d780eb55533f0\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000731\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e60c1237-5e2d-4d0a-9678-ab10db67d1b7\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022e86f011b03e643b4a66d780eb55533f0\u0022\u003EANGIE WARREN-CLARK (Labour):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Madam Speaker, and it\u2019s a pleasure to see you sitting in the Chair. I look forward to working with you this Parliament.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000732\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e60c1237-5e2d-4d0a-9678-ab10db67d1b7\u0022\u003EThe Drug and Substance Checking Legislation Bill is an omnibus bill, and it amends two Acts: the Misuse of Drugs Act 1975 and the Psychoactive Substances Act. This bill does not change the status of any drugs, and it does not make any changes to possession or supply. It does none of those things. These things stay in place. What it does do is enable a regime of testing to support the safer use of these drugs.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000733\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e60c1237-5e2d-4d0a-9678-ab10db67d1b7\u0022\u003EWe would hope that at the time that those drugs are being tested, the conversation with the person having that drug tested would help them make a decision not to take it. They are still going to take these drugs, or if they do, we know prohibition does not work. We know that harm is occurring, and it is, therefore, a good bill and a useful bill, and I commend this bill to the House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022dbaac12b-3efa-4d95-a08d-f0f637a48bab\u0022 data-id=\u0022e074c6b8ebc544149a98a78d906e82c3\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000734\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dbaac12b-3efa-4d95-a08d-f0f637a48bab\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022e074c6b8ebc544149a98a78d906e82c3\u0022\u003ECHL\u00D6E SWARBRICK (Green\u2014Auckland Central):\u003C/span\u003E E te M\u0101ngai, t\u0113n\u0101 koe. T\u0113n\u0101 koutou e te Whare. As we have gone about debating this bill through its first reading tonight and now into the second reading, and the theatrics from the National Party on the notion of a select committee, I\u2019ve been working through in my head how best to articulate the history that brought us to this point. I want to begin by referring to a situation in our relatively recent history.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000735\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dbaac12b-3efa-4d95-a08d-f0f637a48bab\u0022\u003ESo I want all MPs to put themselves in this situation. There are hundreds if not thousands of New Zealanders who are contracting HIV/AIDS from intravenous drug use. Heroin usage is becoming rampant throughout the country and we know, based on international research and what is being recommended by domestic experts and professionals and academics and those who work in addiction services, that the best way to deal with this spiralling out of control issue of HIV/AIDS being contracted amongst intravenous drug users is to legalise needle exchange services. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000736\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dbaac12b-3efa-4d95-a08d-f0f637a48bab\u0022\u003EWell, we did just that in 1987. We were the first country in the world to do just that, and as a result we have amongst the lowest rate of HIV/AIDS amongst intravenous drug users in the entire OECD. But if that same decision were confronting the National Party of today they would be standing in the way of that drug harm reduction procedure in the same way that they are standing in the way, or at the very least attempting to, given that they are a small minority in this House\u2014they would be standing in the way of it in the same way that they are today.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000737\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dbaac12b-3efa-4d95-a08d-f0f637a48bab\u0022\u003EThe National Party also keep riling themselves up about the notion of consultation. And on this I\u2019d ask them where they were in October of last year when I presented to the Health Committee\u2014which the National Party was supposed to make up approximately half of\u2014a petition on behalf of 6,200 New Zealanders, those New Zealanders that they claim to represent, calling for the legalisation of drug-checking services at festivals ahead of the summer festival season. Yet they decided to leave empty seats and not turn up. Yet here they are yet again railing against the lack of opportunity to engage in this debate in a thorough way that they pretend to want to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000738\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dbaac12b-3efa-4d95-a08d-f0f637a48bab\u0022\u003EThis isn\u2019t at all about anything to do with any form of progress or conservativism at least as far as I can tell. It\u2019s just that the National Party want to take a position of opposition. They just want to stand in the way of the inevitable direction\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000739\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00225eb975209c3c418788a6c532eb5b0a1d\u0022\u003EDavid Seymour\u003C/span\u003E: Simon Bridges has crossed the floor!\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000740\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dbaac12b-3efa-4d95-a08d-f0f637a48bab\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022b98bf387535b4ccba35bf799ccd2078d\u0022\u003ECHL\u00D6E SWARBRICK\u003C/span\u003E: \u2014towards harm reduction. And Simon Bridges was also asking about other forms of research\u2014where else this has been happening. So I\u2019d refer the National Party to the Netherlands, which has been doing legal drug-checking services since 1992. I\u2019d refer them to Austria, which has been doing it since 1997; to Switzerland, which has been doing it since 2001; to Spain and Portugal since 1999; and to the UK, which they invoke in quite a cheeky way, having done so since 2013. And here I\u2019d like to give them another spin on the research that they are dubiously putting forward through a very specific, very niche, and very interesting lens, which is that study from the University of Durham in 2018, published in the International Journal of Drug Policy, that showed demonstrably that in the years subsequent to the implementation of legal drug-checking services provided by The Loop, which they invoke, there has been a 95 percent reduction in hospital admissions for those who have used illicit substances. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000741\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dbaac12b-3efa-4d95-a08d-f0f637a48bab\u0022\u003ESimon Bridges also spoke about me not using research or evidence, and I sought to respond to that point by way of a point of order or otherwise. I understand that the processes of this House do not enable such things. However, what was so frustrating about that is that we have multiple National Party MPs standing up tonight and saying that they want to do this by virtue of good faith. I think they demonstrated just how little good faith there genuinely is in a debate like this, when they are willing to stand up and say the complete opposite of the reality, which is that I have, multiple times over, referred them through to six years\u2019 worth of domestic research out of KnowYourStuffNZ. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000742\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dbaac12b-3efa-4d95-a08d-f0f637a48bab\u0022\u003EI have also referred them to the New South Wales chief coronial report, which came out after more than a dozen young people had died. We also had the Hon Simon Bridges saying, \u201CThere hasn\u2019t been a death yet. Waah!\u201D You know, what are we supposed to do, Simon? Are we supposed to wait until somebody does die? Because that\u2019s exactly what they\u2019ve done, and that\u2019s the impasse that they have seen in New South Wales. Over 13 young people have died in the past year. The Chief Coroner has reported on top of multiple coronial reports that legal drug-checking services will save lives and they need to do it. Yet you have the Premier of New South Wales saying exactly the same things that the National Party is saying right now.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000743\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dbaac12b-3efa-4d95-a08d-f0f637a48bab\u0022\u003ESo it would seem as though it doesn\u2019t matter if we have a death count or not. In fact, the National Party just don\u2019t want to see this change occur for the same rationale that would have seen them opposing the changes to legalise needle exchange services in 1987, which has resulted in us having the lowest number of HIV/AIDS amongst intravenous drug users in the OECD.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000744\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dbaac12b-3efa-4d95-a08d-f0f637a48bab\u0022\u003EI don\u2019t know what that is, when you are unwilling to engage with the research and the data on that level, but purely ideological, purely retention of the status quo for sake of holding on, clinging on to some life raft of how the world works. Well, I just really, really hope that those National Party MPs that I know for a fact want to vote for this tonight are really looking into their consciences. I really, really appeal to those MPs, including some of those who I know sit along the front bench, right now to really think about what you believe in, think about the research, the data, the evidence, your past statements, the conversations that you have had, the tents that you\u2019ve gone into with Wendy from KnowYourStuff. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000745\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dbaac12b-3efa-4d95-a08d-f0f637a48bab\u0022\u003EAnd on that point, on this second reading tonight, I also want to say thank you to those who have stood up constantly\u2014Wendy Ellison from KnowYourStuff\u2014despite constantly being shot down, talked down to, patronised for continuing to persist in building the evidence base that is bringing this to the House tonight, that is enabling us to pass a measure that will reduce harm.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000746\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dbaac12b-3efa-4d95-a08d-f0f637a48bab\u0022\u003EJust finally, if I may\u2014because it seems as though many National Party MPs who are speaking about this tonight have not engaged with this process and have no idea how it occurs\u2014when you go in to get your drugs tested at these currently legal grey area drug-checking services, the first thing they say to you is \u201CDon\u2019t take drugs. Do not take these drugs. The best way to reduce harm is to not take drugs at all.\u201D That is far from the green light that the National Party Opposition is mythologising tonight and, to be honest, I\u2019m just thoroughly gutted. I mean, I\u2019d hoped that with this new term, we\u2019d have the opportunity for some good faith, evidence-based debates, but it would appear as though the likes of the Hon Nick Smith are just really keen to lean back on old behaviour.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000747\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dbaac12b-3efa-4d95-a08d-f0f637a48bab\u0022\u003EI am incredibly proud to have worked alongside those grassroots activists, those who have been pushing to build the evidence basis for the past three years, to bring legislation like this to the House tonight. And I hope that it definitely leads to a complete repeal and replacement of the absolute demonstrably unworkable Misuse of Drugs Act 1975. I commend this bill to the House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002266f06e7e-afa8-457f-a105-048b86a13282\u0022 data-id=\u00229935edde4b884d15b58f09f878af7b29\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000748\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002266f06e7e-afa8-457f-a105-048b86a13282\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00229935edde4b884d15b58f09f878af7b29\u0022\u003EBROOKE VAN VELDEN (ACT):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Madam Speaker. I rise on behalf of the ACT Party in support of the Drug and Substance Checking Legislation Bill. I support the bill\u2019s primary objective, which is this: to reduce the harm of illegal substances by allowing drug and substance checking services to operate legally in New Zealand. It\u2019s pretty straightforward. This is not a debate about whether drugs should be legal or illegal, nor is it a moral question on whether people should or should not take drugs. Drugs do exist and, even though they\u2019re illegal, people do take them.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000749\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002266f06e7e-afa8-457f-a105-048b86a13282\u0022\u003EThis bill doesn\u2019t seek to change whether these drugs are illegal. This legislation simply seeks to clarify a legal uncertainty over whether testing services provided can operate or not. It will make it legal for someone to handle illegal drugs for a few minutes, simply to test them.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000750\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002266f06e7e-afa8-457f-a105-048b86a13282\u0022\u003EIt might not feel like summer\u2019s coming any time soon to Wellington, but as we head into summer, as happens every summer, young people, school kids, and university students will head out to festivals and music concerts all around New Zealand. Many of these young people will be presented with illegal substances. Most parents would hope that their kids wouldn\u2019t be the ones taking these illegal substances, especially when they don\u2019t know what\u2019s in them, but it does happen. These are not bad kids. Young people just take risks\u2014some with adverse consequences. No one wants to be the loved one of a tragic fatality that could have been avoided. This bill will reduce a lot of that risk. Passing this bill will reduce harm from drug use.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000751\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002266f06e7e-afa8-457f-a105-048b86a13282\u0022\u003EThe present situation is that people are likely to consume substances with less information than they could have about its potential to do them harm because the origin, composition, and toxicity of the substance is unknown. I think it\u2019s useful to acknowledge, when we\u2019re discussing how to address this issue, what actually happens now. Drug testing already occurs, but it does so in a grey area. The testing sites are used, but they\u2019re far and few between\u2014operating through volunteers unable to touch the drugs themselves, rather allowing young people to use the drug machines and avoid touching them because they face the risk of prosecution through possession or supply.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000752\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002266f06e7e-afa8-457f-a105-048b86a13282\u0022\u003EThis simple law change makes that operation clear. It will take away that uncertainty for a drug-test site, gives a person better information about what drugs and substances they\u2019re using, and allows a person to make a potentially life-saving decision not to consume it. I believe that this change is needed and the ACT Party will support this bill. Thank you, Madam Speaker.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002295945ace-51e8-4dbc-a0e3-c19f4ed99ed9\u0022 data-id=\u0022253abc798d254473a8a006458105928c\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000753\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002295945ace-51e8-4dbc-a0e3-c19f4ed99ed9\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022253abc798d254473a8a006458105928c\u0022\u003EANAHILA KANONGATA\u2019A-SUISUIKI (Labour):\u003C/span\u003E Kia ora e te Mana Whakaw\u0101. Thank you for the opportunity to take the second contribution to this bill. I want to acknowledge the last speaker who just sat down, Brooke van Velden. It\u2019s refreshing to hear a youthful voice from that side of the House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000754\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002295945ace-51e8-4dbc-a0e3-c19f4ed99ed9\u0022\u003EThe Drug and Substance Checking Legislation Bill\u2014what it also does is that if the concert organisers find substance in a certain pill that is dangerous to the population, what they can do is publish on their social media warning signs that this drug is circulating at this festival, and that would warn festival goers not to use that particular drug. That is something that this bill would do, be a warning sign at festivals of the dangerous harm of whatever is circulating at that festival. I commend this bill to the House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022 data-id=\u0022fe6123b2530745919ff796415e014d94\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000755\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022fe6123b2530745919ff796415e014d94\u0022\u003EHon Dr NICK SMITH (National):\u003C/span\u003E We are at the second reading of this very first bill of this Parliament, and our Standing Orders tell us this is where we talk about the evidence that we heard at the select committee. This is the debate where we look at and consider every one of the clauses, and members will be thinking, well, what did happen in the select committee? What evidence did we hear from officials and experts? The answer is absolutely diddlysquat, because the very first bill that this Parliament is passing under urgency hasn\u2019t gone anywhere near a select committee, and it\u2019s impossible for any member to have a thoughtful contribution.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000756\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003ENow, the job of this Parliament is to scrutinise legislation. I know we\u2019ve got many new members in the House. It\u2019s a 34-clause bill. Here\u2019s my question: how many members in the House have read the 34 clauses?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000757\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dbaac12b-3efa-4d95-a08d-f0f637a48bab\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00226b268bc314be42b8a1d8f83dbddee5bf\u0022\u003EChl\u00F6e Swarbrick\u003C/span\u003E: Me.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000758\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022758c1ef78883439aae9e08e5c5ab3e63\u0022\u003EHon Dr NICK SMITH\u003C/span\u003E: Chl\u00F6e has. I\u2019ve got three. So here we are, a Parliament of 120; I can see at least 15 new members who are voting for a bill and they haven\u2019t even bothered to read it. Are they taking their responsibilities as members of this House appropriately when they are prepared to just nod and agree and slam a piece of legislation through all three stages when the bill has only been introduced to the House today?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000759\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003ENow, I\u2019ve been once bitten, twice shy on the sorts of arguments that have been put forward by those of the likes of Chl\u00F6e Swarbrick. This Parliament, eight years ago, passed legislation for psychoactive substances. We were told that it was better to regulate those party pills, that it was better if we had a proper regulatory regime, that we would make it safer. Within eight months, every member of this House was confronted with situations in their communities where, actually, that psychoactive substance had made our communities a lot less safe, our accident and emergency departments were full of people who had used substances that had been approved by this Parliament, and, actually, over 200 New Zealanders died.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000760\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003ESo I say to this Parliament this is a life and death issue and deserves far more scrutiny than being introduced and rammed through on a single day. I would love to have the sort of evidential challenge that the Green Party\u2019s Chl\u00F6e Swarbrick wishes to have, and so I say to the Green Party and I say to the ACT Party: why won\u2019t you support this bill going to a select committee? If they want to have a detailed evidential debate, let\u2019s hear the evidence. Why do we bypass the very processes of this Parliament and not give a single opportunity for that expert evidence?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000761\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003ENow we come to the issue of making drugs safe. They say that if we pass this bill, we\u2019ll make them safe. Well, here\u2019s the evidence\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000762\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00220524b7ae9ce34ef68c4d26b5164f8662\u0022\u003EHon Member\u003C/span\u003E: You\u2019re not interested in the evidence.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000763\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022036ae517c12041d99209fab400bf6b88\u0022\u003EHon Dr NICK SMITH\u003C/span\u003E: \u2014let\u2019s have some evidence\u2014392 Australians died as a consequence of using party pills, and the research by the University of New South Wales found that not one of those deaths were due to impurities. Yet every member says this is all about making sure that our people going to concerts are only going to have access to safe drugs. Actually, it\u2019s not the impurities that killed 390 young people in Australia; it was the drug itself. So when members opposite say that we must pass this law to make party pills like ecstasy safe, on the basis that it is the impurities that are leading to people dying, that is not backed up by the evidence. The evidence is that the use of the drug, the ecstasy itself, is causing those deaths.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000764\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003EThe last point is that when the Government, as with the psychoactive substances, says something\u2019s safe, there will be an increase in use, and with that increased use will go increased harm. That\u2019s the sort of evidence that I want to test and I want to scrutinise at a select committee, and members opposite are denying that sort of robust process on this bill.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022c2e823af-22b7-4411-8b12-14d7b43680ea\u0022 data-id=\u002289209a6512424bc78101cd7f666a1175\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000765\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c2e823af-22b7-4411-8b12-14d7b43680ea\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002289209a6512424bc78101cd7f666a1175\u0022\u003EJAMIE STRANGE (Labour\u2014Hamilton East):\u003C/span\u003E Madam Speaker, thank you for the opportunity to take a brief call on this bill. I\u2019m not going to canvass many of the arguments, but I am going to respond to the Hon Dr Nick Smith, who is asking the question: why is this bill not going to a select committee? I would like to raise an important point that I think it\u2019s important for the House to know and for people who are listening at home to know\u2014that at the end of 2019, Chl\u00F6e Swarbrick took a petition to legalise drug-checking services to a select committee of this House. It had support from the Ministry of Health, over 6,000 petitions, and the National Party didn\u2019t turn up to that select committee to look at that petition. So that petition was suggesting exactly what this bill is doing, and the National Party showed no interest in it. Now, all of a sudden, they\u2019ve got interest. Are the National Party playing politics here? I\u2019ve just put that question out there. That\u2019s for them to decide. I hope they aren\u2019t, but I put that question out there. This is a good bill. It\u2019s an important bill. I commend it to the House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002255d0b7a4-a2c9-4c38-9b77-475311a48a89\u0022 data-id=\u0022dce61a6f1b71438e94cc03e633baf1d7\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000766\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002255d0b7a4-a2c9-4c38-9b77-475311a48a89\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022dce61a6f1b71438e94cc03e633baf1d7\u0022\u003ESIMEON BROWN (National\u2014Pakuranga):\u003C/span\u003E Madam Speaker, is mine a 10-minute or a five-minute call? Ten minutes. Thank you, Madam Speaker.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000767\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002255d0b7a4-a2c9-4c38-9b77-475311a48a89\u0022\u003EMadam Speaker, I just want to say thank you for the opportunity to take a call on the second reading of the Drug and Substance Checking Legislation Bill. I must say, that was a bit of a strange call from the member opposite around a petition which came to a select committee back in 2019. Not a lot of detail about that petition, some people didn\u2019t turn up, but the point is: it wasn\u2019t a bill going through Parliament. This is a bill which is going through Parliament, and the process which we follow when legislation goes through Parliament is we put it to a select committee. Sometimes we only put it to a select committee for a few days or a few weeks\u2014standard time is six months. This isn\u2019t even going to a select committee for one minute, it\u2019s being rammed through this Parliament as the number one priority for this Government after the election, which they won. The number one issue that they are ramming through this Parliament is the Drug and Substance Checking Legislation Bill.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000768\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002255d0b7a4-a2c9-4c38-9b77-475311a48a89\u0022\u003EI wonder how many New Zealanders out there are actually wondering whether this is their number one priority for our country at the moment. Because when I was campaigning up and down my electorate in Pakuranga I didn\u2019t have one single person come up to me and say, \u201CThe number one issue that needs to be solved is we need to legalise pill testing at music festivals. That\u2019s what I want you to go down to Parliament for; that\u2019s what needs to be done.\u201D I didn\u2019t have queues out the door of my office this Monday, when I had my constituent clinic, of people saying, \u201CSimeon, when you go to Parliament this week, can you please pass legislation to legalise pill testing?\u201D There wasn\u2019t one single person saying that this Monday morning at my constituent clinic, but this is the Labour Government\u2019s number one priority coming into this term in Parliament. And let\u2019s not mistake it, it\u2019s the Labour Government\u2019s number one priority, because they control the majority in this House. For the first time under MMP, the Labour Party controls the majority in this House. So the Labour Party and Prime Minister Jacinda Ardern\u2019s number one priority coming into this Parliament is to make drug testing of drugs legal in New Zealand. I would\u2019ve thought it would\u2019ve been something to do with COVID-19. I would\u2019ve thought it would\u2019ve been something to do with addressing the issues facing our country with the pandemic.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000769\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002261720d2e-5b1d-4742-b4f0-30424316ccc1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022cdec94598582403387b739c7a9f10a28\u0022\u003EBarbara Kuriger\u003C/span\u003E: Housing.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000770\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002255d0b7a4-a2c9-4c38-9b77-475311a48a89\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a1465e9ab4b045228f5619d181be37d9\u0022\u003ESIMEON BROWN\u003C/span\u003E: I would\u2019ve thought it might\u2019ve been to do with housing, the Resource Management Act, that\u2019s right, or the issues facing our agriculture sector, law and order, all of those important issues\u2014the health system\u2014which matter to New Zealanders. Here we are facing a piece of legislation to simply legalise drug testing so that people can get their drugs tested before this summer\u2019s festivals. Well, surely this could have gone to a select committee and been considered prior to that actually taking place.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000771\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002255d0b7a4-a2c9-4c38-9b77-475311a48a89\u0022\u003EThe bill will not reduce harm. We\u2019ve heard lots of arguments\u2014well, not arguments. We\u2019ve heard lots of slogans. \u201CThis will reduce harm\u2014this will reduce harm.\u201D It doesn\u2019t matter how many times you say it, it doesn\u2019t prove it. Actually, we want to see the evidence. At a second reading, we\u2019re meant to be considering the submissions from submitters. And as Dr Shane Reti outlined from the departmental statement, the only people consulted on this issue has been KnowYourStuffNZ, the organisation which does and has an interest in this issue. No one else in New Zealand has had their views taken into account, and the departmental statement doesn\u2019t even articulate the view that this will even work or that there is any evidence that this will actually work.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000772\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002255d0b7a4-a2c9-4c38-9b77-475311a48a89\u0022\u003EWhen we look overseas and we do look at the evidence around the world, we do not see that this will reduce the harm caused to young people because the reality is that the drugs which are being tested are harmful. The argument getting put across is that these drugs are full of impurities and if only we can find out those impurities, young people won\u2019t take them. Well, the reality is that the drugs themselves are dangerous. Ecstasy is a dangerous drug. The evidence we see from Australia where they examined 392 ecstasy deaths between 2001 and 2016 found that none of those deaths came from impurities or contaminants in the ecstasy drug. The deaths came from the ecstasy or from people taking ecstasy with alcohol or cocaine or another substance. That is the evidence that we see. So by testing the drug, or testing it multiple times, you\u2019re only going to find out that it\u2019s ecstasy and that ecstasy is dangerous, and we need to be telling our young people it\u2019s a dangerous drug which kills people and that they shouldn\u2019t be taking it. It is illegal.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000773\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002255d0b7a4-a2c9-4c38-9b77-475311a48a89\u0022\u003EThe other issue in this is around dosage. It\u2019s one thing to test it and say, \u201CThis has X, Y, Z substances.\u201D It doesn\u2019t tell anybody anything about dosage in the amount of drug that they have. It simply tests for what type of substance might be in there. And dosage is important because dosage will make a difference because people\u2019s bodies will react differently to different drugs in different quantities of drugs. This bill does not address that very important issue.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000774\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002255d0b7a4-a2c9-4c38-9b77-475311a48a89\u0022\u003EWe\u2019ve just had a referendum in New Zealand in regards to drugs. We\u2019ve just had a referendum on the topic of whether we should be legalising marijuana. The decision made by New Zealanders is that they did not want to see drugs being legalised. But the people now coming to this Parliament to push through this bill seem to have some sort of Trumpian way about them where they don\u2019t want to accept the will of that referendum and want to instead bring this through as the consolation prize for the people who voted Yes to marijuana. This seems to be the agenda which is being brought here today.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000775\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002255d0b7a4-a2c9-4c38-9b77-475311a48a89\u0022\u003ESo what should be done? What should we be looking for in New Zealand? What are the things that we should be looking for and what would be talked about at a select committee? We\u2019d be talking about drug rehab. Have we got enough drug rehab spaces in New Zealand? Do we have enough addiction treatment services across our country to help young New Zealanders who are facing addiction to these types of drugs? These are the issues which we would have been able to address if this bill had actually gone to select committee. We would have been able to look and examine as to whether the Government\u2019s $1.8 billion that they\u2019ve put into our mental health and addiction services is actually having an impact and whether it\u2019s delivering the services that we need to help reduce the harm of drugs in New Zealand. We\u2019d be able to hear from the public and hear their perspectives on this issue. But are we able to have that conversation? Are we able to stand here at this second reading and have that debate and debate the evidence to and fro? No, we can\u2019t, because it\u2019s been rushed through under urgency without being able to have that conversation.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000776\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002255d0b7a4-a2c9-4c38-9b77-475311a48a89\u0022\u003ESo the National Party will be opposing this piece of legislation and is deeply disappointed that this has not had the opportunity for New Zealanders to be able to have their say so they can put their input in so that this Parliament can look at the evidence fully and have a full debate on it at the second reading. We will oppose this legislation. Thank you, Mr Speaker.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022f7fc7ac3-5ce1-43ca-8cd6-dbb0941bf3ae\u0022 data-id=\u00226c52fbcb36d84481a7358e049a257139\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000777\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f7fc7ac3-5ce1-43ca-8cd6-dbb0941bf3ae\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00226c52fbcb36d84481a7358e049a257139\u0022\u003EDr DUNCAN WEBB (Labour\u2014Christchurch Central):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Mr Speaker. It\u2019s with a little bit of sadness we come back to the House and hear the usual scaremongering and inaccuracies on the issue of drug safety. The fact of the matter is that the National Party is standing between someone trying to make something safe for a citizen. Under the current law, the moment a person takes a drug, takes ecstasy, and says \u201CI will test it to make sure this is what it says it is\u201D, they\u2019re committing the offence of possession of a drug. These people would have our law keep it that way. Well, on this side of the House, and around the rest of the House, we say, \u201CNo.\u201D We say, \u201CIf people are going to make decisions\u2014decisions which might not be the wisest decisions\u2014we want to make that as safe as we possibly can.\u201D That\u2019s really all you need to say about this piece of legislation. We will make people as safe as we possibly can. This bill is part of that, and I commend it to the House. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca id=\u00226aea62790f6940dca1230a92241024c6\u0022 name=\u0022division\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EA party vote was called for on the question, That the Drug and Substance Checking Legislation Bill be now read a second time.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EAyes 86\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand Labour 64; Green Party of Aotearoa New Zealand 10; ACT New Zealand 10; Te Paati M\u0101ori 2.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENoes 33\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand National 33.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EBill read a second time.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000778\u0022\u003EMotion agreed to.\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002255d0b7a4-a2c9-4c38-9b77-475311a48a89\u0022 data-id=\u0022d6cca83fd27a4102adc0e88267758e89\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000779\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002255d0b7a4-a2c9-4c38-9b77-475311a48a89\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022d6cca83fd27a4102adc0e88267758e89\u0022\u003ESIMEON BROWN (National\u2014Pakuranga):\u003C/span\u003E Point of order. I seek leave to move a motion for the bill to be referred to the Justice Committee.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022 data-id=\u0022b9769fa6e3824992b02ce91bca77fa59\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000780\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022b9769fa6e3824992b02ce91bca77fa59\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Is there any objection to that? There is objection. The Drug and Substance Checking Legislation Bill is set down for committee stage forthwith. Oh sorry, I declare the House in committee for consideration of the Drug and Substance Checking Legislation Bill\u2014you know, I was just giving my new assistant a bit of time to get here. Madam Chair. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000781\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u002228753841fd4a4ff9a1e13dcc12b28fd9\u0022\u003EIn Committee\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000782\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u0022936714a8964a4b3baffc3c09263e5d1e\u0022\u003EPart 1  Amendments to Misuse of Drugs Act 1975\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00224a25943b-cb3b-49c3-bd10-74316fae17f1\u0022 data-id=\u0022b7d767851f5040f9b4505f6dfb3555b7\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000783\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00224a25943b-cb3b-49c3-bd10-74316fae17f1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022b7d767851f5040f9b4505f6dfb3555b7\u0022\u003ECHAIRPERSON (Hon Jacqui Dean)\u003C/span\u003E: The House is in committee on the Drug and Substance Checking Legislation Bill. Members, we come first to the debate on Part 1. This is the debate on clauses 4 to 16, Amendments to the Misuse of Drugs Act 1975. The question is that Part 1 stand part.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022 data-id=\u0022f582833ee21947b3b6c2cef6d4a3df8c\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000784\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022f582833ee21947b3b6c2cef6d4a3df8c\u0022\u003EHon ANDREW LITTLE (Minister of Health):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Madam Chair. Part 1 deals with amendments to the Misuse of Drugs Act 1975. So this is the part of the bill that gives the power of the director-general to effectively give a permit to any outfit that wants to offer drug-testing services. The director-general has to be satisfied that they can do so, and the director-general can attach any conditions to any permit that they give.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000785\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003EThe effect of it, then, is that the person providing the service is protected from liability for prosecution. It also means that the host of an event in which a drug-testing service is carried out is also protected from liability for prosecution. So these provisions deal with that, which is the cornerstone, really, of the legislation, as we seek to provide these services and provide protection to young people going to festivals and the forthcoming summer season.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022 data-id=\u0022a70a5e53ef9744c6ae85ec193648d1ac\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000786\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022a70a5e53ef9744c6ae85ec193648d1ac\u0022\u003EHon Dr NICK SMITH (National):\u003C/span\u003E In speaking to Part 1, the first question I have for the Minister of Health and sponsor of the bill is that in the comments that he has just made and in the press release and all of the information that the public has is that the testing of these drugs\u2014whether it be meth or ecstasy or whatever drug might be used\u2014is going to be for music festivals. The problem I have in Part 1 is that there is no limit on where that drug testing were to occur. I can\u2019t find the word \u201Cfestival\u201D, I can\u2019t find the word \u201Cevent\u201D, I can\u2019t find the word \u201Cconcert\u201D, or any of those there. So the only interpretation I can reasonably take is that the drug-testing services that are proposed in this part could be applied anywhere\u2014for instance, I know in my home community, one of the scourges not just in Nelson but up and down New Zealand is the issue of P, meth use. And, yes, there will be those who argue that those who are buying and trading and use meth in communities all over New Zealand should\u2014just as at a music concert or festival will have it tested to make sure that it doesn\u2019t have impurities or that it\u2019s pure meth or that it\u2019s what people are selling\u2014that, indeed, this part would provide that you could have such a testing service at the street corner, in the local area where gangs might be dealing with drugs, or any old where.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000787\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003ENow, it is quite a\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000788\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f7fc7ac3-5ce1-43ca-8cd6-dbb0941bf3ae\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00224ba3d2e8c345477391efa9d5e9a2951b\u0022\u003EDr Duncan Webb\u003C/span\u003E: What\u2019s the question?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000789\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00227184bf0e20fc4682b80500edc96866bc\u0022\u003EHon Dr NICK SMITH\u003C/span\u003E: Well, my question that I put to the member opposite\u2014and it would be helpful if he could do it\u2014is: does the bill limit the testing to that of music festivals and concerts? Because all of the public dialogue has been that that\u2019s what the bill is about: making festivals and concerts safe. But that is not what the part says. The part makes no restriction to it being a particular event. It makes no restriction on it being for music festivals. So, effectively, Parliament is giving the authority for whether it be in Trafalgar Street, Nelson or in Cashel Street in Christchurch or in Gore or in any other part of the country\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000790\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00224e997ac3eeb34fc5a593256db5d869a9\u0022\u003EHon Member\u003C/span\u003E: Rathbone Street, Whang\u0101rei.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000791\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00224e30446696a74db6a15f5e0c12018f7b\u0022\u003EHon Dr NICK SMITH\u003C/span\u003E: \u2014for drug testing services to be able to\u2014even in Epsom, on Remuera Road\u2014as I\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000792\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002288176f320e644471b86f0ebd4595b605\u0022\u003EDavid Seymour\u003C/span\u003E: That\u2019s not in Epsom. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000793\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002229e47bf2fa994092942b6b9c388fa588\u0022\u003EHon Dr NICK SMITH\u003C/span\u003E: \u2014read this bill, Mr Seymour\u2014maybe Mr Seymour knows; I know he\u2019s supporting the bill. Is it the intent that the drug-testing services would be limited to concerts and festivals or could they, in fact, be anywhere?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000794\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00227ec4935c72c04f07af74e8267e9c04a7\u0022\u003EDavid Seymour\u003C/span\u003E: Well, the tester would have to be authorised by the Director-General of Health.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000795\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022d248ae03cace4439b4aa3dc0ce54583e\u0022\u003EHon Dr NICK SMITH\u003C/span\u003E: So does Mr Seymour and the ACT Party apply the same philosophy that testing drugs at a concert or festival, but equally so it could occur in the community, and that, actually, if you believe in the philosophy behind this bill\u2014and that is that you are going to make drug use safer in New Zealand for illegal substances like P or like ecstasy, which is probably the most common drug that is intended behind this bill, but it may well be cocaine or some other service\u2014that it is not limited to simply a music festival or event? Actually, the part provides the authorisation by Parliament for that testing to occur anywhere, and that may well be the Government\u2019s intent, that may well be what ACT is intending to support. But my question is: why should it? Do we really think we are going to make the use of drugs like P, like cocaine, like meth safer if we test it not just at music festivals and events but otherwise? And can they, please, if it intended to limit it to music festivals\u2014why would your philosophy be different? \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000796\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003EWe know that drug harm actually is biggest in our communities not at music festivals, and if you were going to apply the logic that by testing these drugs you\u2019re going to make them safer at festivals, then why would you not apply the same logic in our communities? And doesn\u2019t, in fact, Part 1 of this bill make no mention of music festivals, no mention of concerts? In fact, it is a regime that provides for the authorisation of illegal drugs, drugs that this Parliament has determined are illegal, and for all of those to be tested and actually for them to be tested anywhere and there\u2019s no restriction in this part of the bill that it should only be music festivals and such events.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022 data-id=\u00228f3e068630004d63a73067627e772551\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000797\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00228f3e068630004d63a73067627e772551\u0022\u003EHon ANDREW LITTLE (Minister of Health):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Madam Chair. I understood that the question that the member has taken a considerable amount of time to ask is whether or not the bill, on its face and in the language that it uses, limits the place where testing might be carried out just to festivals and music festivals and the like. The answer to that is clearly no, because there is no reference to festivals. But then the member might want to\u2014look, my invitation to members opposite is to get into the real world and understand the context of this.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000798\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003ESo we know that there are one or two outfits that do pill testing for the safety of consumers of them. One is KnowYourStuff and the other, as I understand it, is the New Zealand Drug Foundation\u2014I stand to be corrected on that. They typically operate around festivals and events like that where young people gather. Their big risk that they face is the risk of prosecution when they are carrying out a service that is about trying to keep young people safe, people who choose to use substances that are mind altering, that can have an effect on the body, but mixed with others could cause even greater harm, and they want to keep them safe. We want to make sure that it is possible to have testing services available at events where young people gather, and this is a way of doing that.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000799\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003ENow, the member will also know, having studied the bill and seeing the media releases and what have you, that this is time limited, that this is self-repealing within 12 months. Because the other public announcements that have been made is that we do actually need to have a more considered examination of a law change that will do this on a permanent basis\u2014I know members opposite have raised, in the first and second reading speeches, their concern about there being no select committee process and no examination\u2014there will be a full parliamentary process when we come up with a long-term solution for this problem, and members can dust off their old speech notes that they\u2019ve been using tonight, and run them all out again, but there will be a select committee examination and all of that.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000800\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003ESo I just invite that member who\u2019s resumed his seat, and other members, to look at the context in which this is happening and know that, in the practicality of the real world, it will be limited in application, because that is the only way in which these services will be carried out, in the foreseeable period contemplated by the bill.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00224a25943b-cb3b-49c3-bd10-74316fae17f1\u0022 data-id=\u00223d7c74a6f71b4ede94e0d73a6bea4957\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000801\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00224a25943b-cb3b-49c3-bd10-74316fae17f1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00223d7c74a6f71b4ede94e0d73a6bea4957\u0022\u003ECHAIRPERSON (Hon Jacqui Dean)\u003C/span\u003E: Order! Order! Before I take the next speaker, I just want to remind the House that in the previous Parliament we had instituted a new way of running the committee where the member asking the question doesn\u2019t necessarily need to take the full five minutes. In fact, asking a question succinctly then really requires the Minister, if they have a mind to, to provide an answer. So can I encourage the House: that was a system that was beginning to work quite well in the last Parliament, and could well work in this Parliament.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022 data-id=\u002200cb19b7dbf54ba7ad33303ecd008961\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000802\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002200cb19b7dbf54ba7ad33303ecd008961\u0022\u003EDAVID SEYMOUR (Leader\u2014ACT):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Madam Chair. I sincerely hope that your reminder to the committee about the need, or the lack of need, to fill the complete five minutes was in no way a reflection on the contribution of Dr Nick Smith, because I thought that what he said was well and truly worthy of taking up five minutes. It was a very good contribution that we\u2019re very grateful to have heard.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000803\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003EBut I would like to ask a question of the Minister, because, in the absence of a regulatory impact statement and a select committee examination of this bill, I think that there are things that people will wish to know. For instance, if we take clause 8, which appears to amend section 12, it says, \u201CIt is not an offence against subsection (1) for a person to permit any premises to be used by a drug and substance checking service provider\u201D for the purpose that\u2019s defined later in the bill. Now, that\u2019s for a person to permit any premises, so I assume the intention is that that\u2019s the person that owns the premise, or at least has control of it\u2014has leased or rented, perhaps, a vineyard in Marlborough where they\u2019re doing a festival. I guess the question is: what if it was, say, a gang? Would they be able to do it? Would they be in any way excluded? It does say any person and any premise.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000804\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003EJust to sort of tease out what this means for people, let\u2019s say, for instance, a great place where I\u2019ve spent some great nights is the Powerstation on Mount Eden Road. That is a place where young people gather. It\u2019s private property. It\u2019s owned by some very passionate business people. I wonder if they would be able to permit a drug-testing service to be used there at the Powerstation. Now, I don\u2019t have a particular problem with that. I believe in the principle of the bill, and I think a lot of the parents in that part of our country, just the same as parents up and down New Zealand, would want this kind of security and information to be available. But it\u2019s worth just clarifying. It could be, for instance, the Powerstation. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000805\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003EThen, the next question I\u2019d ask is, OK, just for total clarity, for people interested in this bill, it\u2019s still illegal to possess those substances. You know, it\u2019s still illegal to have illegal drugs, by definition, at that location or any other venue. All this bill is doing is saying that it\u2019s not illegal for the property owners, for the venders of the Powerstation, to allow a pill-testing service to operate on their site. Now, I think I\u2019ve got this right, but I think there\u2019s a reason for this committee stage, and it\u2019s important that we actually tease out what exactly the legislation says and what the meanings of it are in that case, and perhaps some of the unintended consequences. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000806\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003ESo, to wrap up, the question is: could this be, for instance, a music venue in central Auckland\u2014number one. Will all of the other laws about drugs continue to be enforced at that venue for possession and supply and so on is question number two. I guess question number three is: what if, actually, that venue\u2014not so far from the Powerstation, in the north of Mount Eden, is a very well-known gang patch that I won\u2019t name, because I don\u2019t want to get myself in any trouble. Is there any\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000807\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022badb0a39-849c-462a-b32f-77fc017c9fc2\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002238112c9220f0448a931a4622398b72df\u0022\u003EHon Simon Bridges\u003C/span\u003E: Why? Are you on the CCTV?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000808\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022ace8273c62b54cac809e56f10ccf6f94\u0022\u003EDAVID SEYMOUR\u003C/span\u003E: Well, you never know. There\u2019s no application. I\u2019ve been delivering my pamphlets outside, and they could have them pointing out there, couldn\u2019t they, Simon Bridges? You are in a boisterous mood tonight, Mr Bridges. I hope the member hasn\u2019t been taking anything himself!\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000809\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003EAnd what about people that are involved in organised crime? Is there anything in the bill that excludes them from being involved in pill testing? Perhaps, with somebody who was on the police gang list, is there any way that they would be excluded from being engaged in a pill-testing business. I think those are some of the questions that people at home would like to be clarified as they watch this legislation go through.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022 data-id=\u00227d1e92280a934fe08c85dfc5bb30242f\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000810\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00227d1e92280a934fe08c85dfc5bb30242f\u0022\u003EHon ANDREW LITTLE (Minister of Health):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Madam Chair. Thank you to that member for his questions. He\u2019s referred to clause 8 and the proposed amendment to section 12, and he rightly points to the words \u201Cperson to permit \u2026 premises\u201D. So this relates to the person in control of premises\u2014whether the owner or the lessee or someone with a licence in charge of the premises or in charge of the event. They will be the person who is entitled to, I guess, the protection of this particular law.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000811\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003EBut, in terms of the dangers that he raises\u2014what about other drug laws, and what if a venue was not just a music venue but gang headquarters\u2014I refer the member to clause 10 of the bill, in particular the proposed section 35DA of the Misuse of Drugs Act and also proposed section 35DB, which sets out the functions of the service provider. Now, in terms of proposed section 35DA in clause 10, the director-general has to give a permit. The director-general appoints the drug service provider. I think it follows that the director-general, in making that appointment, has to be sure that the person who they\u2019re giving the permit to can perform the functions set out in section 35DB. The director-general is not going to appoint somebody who is incapable of performing those functions. So there\u2019s going to have to be a level of competency and capability required.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000812\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003EThe other thing the director-general can do is specify reasonable terms and conditions of an appointment. It is well within the powers of the director-general to say, \u201CWell, I\u2019m going to allow you to do this, and, by permitting you to do this, you are protected from criminal liability, but, to limit that, I\u2019m going to make sure that, when you are discharging these services, they are at appropriate events or venues.\u201D The director-general has it in their power to define that and, I expect, probably will. That contains the extent to which these services will be provided. If the venue was a gang headquarters, the director-general might ask the applicant for the permit and say, \u201CWell, where do you propose to conduct these services?\u201D If it\u2019s going to be at gang premises, I expect the director-general\u2014not I expect; I\u2019m almost certain that the director-general\u2014will decline to grant the permit. So I think there are, in the scheme of the bill in total, sufficient safeguards that mean that the risk of drug-testing services popping up all over the place, including at a gang headquarters, is so minimal\u2014so negligible\u2014as to be virtually zero.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022badb0a39-849c-462a-b32f-77fc017c9fc2\u0022 data-id=\u0022949b94ad0f02405f85207cdf13795dae\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000813\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022badb0a39-849c-462a-b32f-77fc017c9fc2\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022949b94ad0f02405f85207cdf13795dae\u0022\u003EHon SIMON BRIDGES (National\u2014Tauranga):\u003C/span\u003E Actually, I want to follow on from that with the Minister, because he\u2019s been talking about particularly the requirement of who it will be that will be doing this testing, and I also want to touch on and ask him a question or two on the \u201Cwhat\u201D. Perhaps we\u2019ll wrap them up in this contribution. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000814\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022badb0a39-849c-462a-b32f-77fc017c9fc2\u0022\u003EOn the \u201Cwho\u201D\u2014I\u2019ve just heard what he said\u2014I\u2019d make the point to him that we\u2019re talking about, as we\u2019ve heard in the committee, parents wanting an assurance that this is safe. And so surely it\u2019s more than simply a question, I\u2019m asking him, of competency; isn\u2019t it also a question of good character? And is there a good-character requirement in this? Because we could envisage\u2014and some may say, \u201CWell, they\u2019re far-fetched\u201D; I doubt they actually are\u2014scenarios where people with a background in and with a connection to drug offending, or those who may be engaged in those things, could be involved here. Not only could that colour their advice but potentially there\u2019d be other ramifications from that, as well. And will there be, in terms of those people who will get, under new section 35DA in clause 10, the tick from the Director-General of Health, training? Because we\u2019d want to know that actually there\u2019s more than just a once over lightly. How will that competency be assessed? Because, you know, I come back to it: parents are wanting an assurance of safety here, and surely you want to make sure that information that\u2019s going to them is of the best quality, isn\u2019t coloured, isn\u2019t too relaxed, but is serious, given we\u2019re not just dealing with class C and B drugs; we\u2019re dealing with class A drugs, as well, with serious harms.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000815\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022badb0a39-849c-462a-b32f-77fc017c9fc2\u0022\u003ETo wrap this up in one go here, I\u2019ll also ask the Minister not just about the \u201Cwho\u201D but about the \u201Cwhat\u201D, which we get in new section 35DB, in clause 10\u2014the functions of the service provider. I\u2019m particularly interested in not just the information and harm reduction advice, which I\u2019ve already touched on, but also this question of the outcome of the testing, and when the testers will return or dispose, and what advice they will be giving around that, and any sense he can give us of what that guidance will be from the director-general\u2014if there\u2019s anything in this bill, or if he envisages any further regulatory instrument to do that. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000816\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022badb0a39-849c-462a-b32f-77fc017c9fc2\u0022\u003EAnd I say that because if I take a simple perspective on this\u2014I\u2019m not in any way an expert on MDMA; I\u2019ve done jury trials in that area, but they\u2019re a long time ago. I\u2019ve done a lot of jury trials in the area of cannabis, which was rather more common in the Bay of Plenty, but the issue with cannabis, of course, is we know that the THC can be at a low level or a very high level, and the buzz at the high level is much more dangerous. And so, for example, where impurities are found, will there be a list? Where compounds are found, will there be a list? Will there also be guidance on at what strengths, in a sense, the harm thresholds should be being applied here? I accept entirely these are not areas I have expertise in, but I would be interested in asking the Minister, given this bill is going through urgency without a parliamentary committee, what the story there will be. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000817\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022badb0a39-849c-462a-b32f-77fc017c9fc2\u0022\u003EAnd finally on all of that, in terms of that returning and disposing\u2014even when they\u2019re not disposed of and they are returned\u2014if there aren\u2019t going to be limitations for certain strengths, or buzzes, if you like, will it nevertheless be the case that there will be warnings for the ecstasy or other drugs in those? I really want to get some assurance from the Minister on those matters.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022 data-id=\u0022417fc9c3b8f34c74988d31e4bc393cff\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000818\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022417fc9c3b8f34c74988d31e4bc393cff\u0022\u003EHon ANDREW LITTLE (Minister of Health):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Madam Chair, and I thank the member for his questions. I understand his first question related to who is doing the testing, and how that can be determined or controlled, and he raised the particular question about the good-character nature of the tester. I again refer the member to clause 10 of the bill and the proposed section 35DA. Again, when the director-general comes to appoint drug- and substance-checking service providers, the director-general has to be sure that this is an output or a person who can carry out the functions provided for in new section 35DB in clause 10. I think the member can be sure, and the committee can be sure, the director-general will want to know that this is someone who has the means, the capability, and the qualifications to carry out substance testing. And, in fact, if you look at proposed section 35DB(1)(b), one of the things that the drug-testing service has to do is to \u201Cascertain the composition and likely identity of the drug\u201D. So they\u2019re going to have the means, the equipment, the chemicals\u2014whatever\u2014to carry out that function. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000819\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003ESo the director-general, in appointing someone to that role, has to be sure that they can do it. So this is not going to be any old mug off the street waltzing up their application to the director-general and saying, \u201CI\u2019ll do it,\u201D and thinking they\u2019re in for a good time. These are going to be competent, qualified people who do the job, as, indeed, the people who do it for KnowYourStuffNZ are. So I think the scheme of the bill gives the reassurance that this is going to provide a level of safety and therefore assurance to parents of young people who might be availing themselves of these sorts of services. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000820\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003EThe member raised questions about what the owner of the substance who surrenders it for testing will be told. Well, again, the scheme of the bill makes it clear: they will be given information and harm reduction advice. So they will be told regardless: \u201CYou might want to use this; it might be your choice; do you know what this might do?\u201D Once it\u2019s been tested, they will then be given advice on the composition and likely identity of it, and, again, it\u2019s an opportunity for the drug checker to give advice on ingestion of that particular substance. And then there\u2019s a range of other things that the tester can do, which also includes that the substance provided for testing, if the person who\u2019s provided it doesn\u2019t want it any more, is for the drug-testing service to dispose of. So the dangers that I think the member is raising, quite legitimately, are, I think, satisfactorily covered off in the full scheme of the bill, as laid out, particularly, in clause 10 of it.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002255d0b7a4-a2c9-4c38-9b77-475311a48a89\u0022 data-id=\u0022d0d3c9ca19884a79a9bc4f3210957a18\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000821\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002255d0b7a4-a2c9-4c38-9b77-475311a48a89\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022d0d3c9ca19884a79a9bc4f3210957a18\u0022\u003ESIMEON BROWN (National\u2014Pakuranga):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Madam Chair, for the opportunity to take a call in the committee stage on the Drug and Substance Checking Legislation Bill. I\u2019ve got a couple of questions in regards to how this bill is going to work. My first question is around how a young person who\u2019s attending some festival somewhere, when they turn up to the festival and someone\u2019s there saying, \u201CI\u2019m going to test your drugs\u201D, how to know that they have been certified under clause 10, new section 35DA. The ministry has to have a website which lists the people who have been certified, but there\u2019s no information required\u2014from what I can see\u2014for the service provider to actually put it in front of that young person their certification, the fact that they have been certified by the Director-General of Health. How are they going to know that this person has been given the lawful authority to do this drug testing and that they are doing it in accordance with the law and therefore meeting the standards and the conditions imposed upon them by the Director-General of Health?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022 data-id=\u0022da11e9ec12584f3e866a8598d3434f2d\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000822\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022da11e9ec12584f3e866a8598d3434f2d\u0022\u003EHon ANDREW LITTLE (Minister of Health):\u003C/span\u003E Again, the director-general, in giving somebody this permit to provide drug-checking services, can also specify reasonable terms and conditions of that appointment. My expectation is that one of the conditions will be that the person who was given the permit to carry out drug-testing services must display the permit authority from the director-general. So that is covered off in the bill; it is there and it allows, therefore, that person to carry out that testing. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000823\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003EAgain, when we think about the practical reality, the situation that we are now in, we know that there are outfits\u2014of one at least, called KnowYourStuff, that has been around for a while, is well known to people, has an established track record of carrying out drug-treatment services. They will, no doubt\u2014if given the authority to do so under this legislation\u2014be able to establish themselves in a relevant event, or be known at the event, or display their permit, as a trusted provider of these services. That is what the bill provides for.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022 data-id=\u0022eea140c0b0044557a9afe200d7a5a8f7\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000824\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022eea140c0b0044557a9afe200d7a5a8f7\u0022\u003EDAVID SEYMOUR (Leader\u2014ACT):\u003C/span\u003E Well, thank you very much, Madam Chair. I\u2019d just like to ask a little bit about clause 19, which contemplates somebody who is operating a pill-testing site, tests drugs, and returns them to a person. Of course, it contemplates that they\u2019ll give it back, but what if\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00224a25943b-cb3b-49c3-bd10-74316fae17f1\u0022 data-id=\u00225952d8ec5bdc41df932ab7986fe30819\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000825\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00224a25943b-cb3b-49c3-bd10-74316fae17f1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00225952d8ec5bdc41df932ab7986fe30819\u0022\u003ECHAIRPERSON (Hon Jacqui Dean)\u003C/span\u003E: Order! Order! The member will resume his seat. We are debating Part 1 at the moment. Part 1 contains clauses 1 to 16. The member was addressing clause 19.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022 data-id=\u00221ce7d26327244f97b10faaf9ad1e000b\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000826\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00221ce7d26327244f97b10faaf9ad1e000b\u0022\u003EHon Dr NICK SMITH (National):\u003C/span\u003E I want to speak to the amendment that\u2019s been moved in my name and tabled, because I think it\u2019s important, particularly when we are being asked to rush legislation through the Parliament, that we keep it to the very narrow purpose that has been publicly stated. And if you look at the press release in the Minister\u2019s name, if you look at both newspaper articles and media coverage, this bill is meant to be all about providing for drug- and substance-checking services specifically for summer music festivals or concerts; yet this very part provides no such limitation. It says that the drug-testing service could be provided on Trafalgar Street on any day of the week or any other part of New Zealand.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000827\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003EThe reason I\u2019m concerned is because when I hear the advocate for this bill, Chl\u00F6e Swarbrick of the Green Party, she makes absolutely plain that she, indeed, believes that this drug-testing service should be equally available for the P dealer or the meth dealer or the cocaine dealer that are selling drugs in our communities every day of the week and not just at music festivals and concerts. And so I seek the support of the committee for an amendment that ensures the bill only does what we say it would do, and that is that this is solely a narrow bill that is going to provide for the testing of drugs at music festivals and concerts. Shouldn\u2019t we put in the legislation what we said?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000828\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003EIf that is the area that the Government and the parties that are supporting it, around specifically providing that drug-testing service, where there may be some level of risk, let\u2019s do as we say and constrain Part 1 specifically to the issue of providing music festivals or concerts. Or is this really a Trojan Horse? Is this really about providing a far wider drug-testing service? \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000829\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022fe11c0cbef444673acb181078a1565e4\u0022\u003EDavid Seymour\u003C/span\u003E: He\u2019s on to them.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000830\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002263e9d118ac06483a8a7d711a326d165d\u0022\u003EHon Dr NICK SMITH\u003C/span\u003E: Well, I\u2019d be interested, does the ACT Party\u2014is it your party\u2019s intent that for the dealer of cocaine or meth or ecstasy in Auckland, Nelson, Christchurch, Dunedin\u2014if you accept the logic that drug-testing services make things safer at the music festival, do you accept the logic of the Green Party that equally it would make it safer if the drugs that are purchased anywhere else is also tested for impurities?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000831\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022e1c6cedd1dba465b8dff2dff80af864a\u0022\u003EDavid Seymour\u003C/span\u003E: Where could this informed choice thing go?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000832\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00225dbe42455df342aaa2edb4a9c22f1196\u0022\u003EHon Dr NICK SMITH\u003C/span\u003E: Well, indeed, I would fear to know how liberal that party might go. But I\u2019m just old fashioned and say that we should do as we say. If the press release says it\u2019s about music festivals and concerts, if the members opposite in every one of their speeches says it\u2019s about solely providing this service at music festivals and concerts, the explanatory note of the bill specifically says it\u2019s about providing testing at festival venues and for festival organisers, well, if that\u2019s what we\u2019re saying publicly, let\u2019s do that with the law. Let\u2019s limit the testing service to those specific music festivals or concerts where people are concerned that there is risk.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000833\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003ESo I invite the Government, who has used those specific phrases in its press releases and its comments and the explanatory note, and the other parties, who have all referred to that being a concern, I invite them to support my amendment to clause 35DJ that says that a service provider will be limited to providing that service at such music festivals or concerts. And if members from the ACT Party or Labour or the Greens are not going to support that amendment in my name, could they please provide an explanation as to why they want the broader testing service available?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000834\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003EMy view is that this country has a serious problem with drugs like meth, not just at music festivals, actually right through our country, that we should not be providing the testing service for the general dealing in those drugs, that we should limit it solely to those music festival events, and I seek the support of the House for the amendment in my name that does just that.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022861a1798-a396-4a6c-b9e2-7d2f15d4a001\u0022 data-id=\u0022e1e85660545944989a31918fe76708f8\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000835\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022861a1798-a396-4a6c-b9e2-7d2f15d4a001\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022e1e85660545944989a31918fe76708f8\u0022\u003EDr SHANE RETI (National):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Madam Chair. I just have a simple question to the Minister in the chair. The regulatory impact statement says Victoria University has conducted research into drug-checking services and that the Ministry of Health has been provided with interim results. What are those results with respect to the actions of the clauses in Part 1, please?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022 data-id=\u00224cbf3822823c4d82b43c07b611eb3de4\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000836\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00224cbf3822823c4d82b43c07b611eb3de4\u0022\u003EHon ANDREW LITTLE (Minister of Health):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Madam Chair. I thank the member for his question. Look, it would be desirable if the research were released fully and properly. As I understand it, it is expected to be released in the next couple of weeks, but the interim results of that research, I am advised, led to the conclusion that two-thirds of people using drug-checking services at festivals or events changed their behaviour as a consequence\u2014either didn\u2019t consume the substance that they had submitted for testing, modified their consumption of the substance for testing, or in a subsequent period changed their drug-consumption habit.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022badb0a39-849c-462a-b32f-77fc017c9fc2\u0022 data-id=\u0022e5b9abf82c2f4a9ca4577c3f184dff7a\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000837\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022badb0a39-849c-462a-b32f-77fc017c9fc2\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022e5b9abf82c2f4a9ca4577c3f184dff7a\u0022\u003EHon SIMON BRIDGES (National\u2014Tauranga):\u003C/span\u003E I have two questions also on Part 2, primarily\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000838\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022af3de5272d3e423eae9f67be42933ba5\u0022\u003EHon Dr Nick Smith\u003C/span\u003E: Part 1.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000839\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022badb0a39-849c-462a-b32f-77fc017c9fc2\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a77e2430ca244c3cb9517bcf0528196c\u0022\u003EHon SIMON BRIDGES\u003C/span\u003E: Part 1, I\u2019m sorry, Minister Little\u2014new section 35DD, in clause 10, \u201CSupplying or surrendering controlled drug to service provider\u201D, an individual may supply or surrender the control drug to the service provider. My question on this is a point David Seymour made, which is that, of course, it is still an offence in this land to possess an illicit drug within the classifications of the Misuse of Drugs Act, and the service provider, of course, is immune, has immunity through this part. What, though, about the individual who is supplying or surrendering? Is there, for example, a safe space for them? If they are there, just about to hand those over, is there any guidance or anything there to stop police from simply arresting them at that point in time? Because, as the Minister knows, we don\u2019t agree with the bill, but that would seem a ridiculous proposition and against the spirit of this. So it\u2019s a question about the safe space or how that will work. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000840\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022badb0a39-849c-462a-b32f-77fc017c9fc2\u0022\u003ESecondly, and relatedly\u2014and I confess, if I\u2019ve got this wrong, that is that\u2014but I don\u2019t see in Part 1, where I think it would logically flow, any provision about the disposal of the drugs. I\u2019m wanting to understand that, because it seems to me, again\u2014and the Minister, effectively, by his omission made clear\u2014that, whilst it\u2019s up to the director-general, it\u2019s not necessarily the case that there\u2019d be good character requirements around the service providers. One could envisage a bad egg who is approved and who slips through this having a defence a week later, three weeks later, with that big bucket of\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000841\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00224d37c59409e247ddbdaa3d9a0c6e4e3b\u0022\u003EHon Member\u003C/span\u003E: Drugs.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000842\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022badb0a39-849c-462a-b32f-77fc017c9fc2\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002206bc6831d9d6479e96809a6cd825538b\u0022\u003EHon SIMON BRIDGES\u003C/span\u003E: \u2014drugs surrendered to him or her. I was thinking of the avocados in my kitchen, frankly, that were in the bucket, but they don\u2019t need testing. But those pills, which were, in fact, for the purpose of something else, obviously illegal purposes\u2014surely there should be, and I ask is there, or, if there isn\u2019t, what is his view on what the disposal situation should be?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022 data-id=\u00228d1226d35fad4c8db96d1ec4310c72a8\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000843\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00228d1226d35fad4c8db96d1ec4310c72a8\u0022\u003EHon ANDREW LITTLE (Minister of Health):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Madam Chair, and I thank Mr Bridges for his questions. Can I just deal with his last one first, which was to do with disposal of drugs or substances provided to the drug checker for checking. So if we have a look at proposed section 35DB, in clause 10, which lists as the functions of the service provider, it includes not only in paragraph (e) disposing of any sample of a controlled drug or substance used in testing, but in paragraph (f) disposing of or arranging for the disposal of any drug or substance surrendered by any individual for disposal. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000844\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003ESo one can anticipate there\u2019ll be situations where the drug checker says to the person, \u201CYou don\u2019t really want this. This is so bad. It\u2019ll do you so much harm.\u201D And the person says, \u201CYou know what? You\u2019re right. I\u2019m going to give it to you. Can you dispose of it and I\u2019ll go off and have a drug-free enjoyable period at my concert, listening to Roger Whittaker.\u201D\u2014or whatever concert it is that I\u2019m at. And then if we have a look at proposed section 35DH, in clause 10, which are the protections from liabilities of the service provider, it says \u201CAn employee or a volunteer of a service provider is not liable for anything they do or fail to do in the course of the performance or intended performance of the service provider\u2019s functions\u201D, unless it was shown to act in bad faith. So they\u2019re protected from liability for disposal of it, and they will therefore dispose of it.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000845\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003EGoing back to the first question I think the member was raising, which was that point in time in which the possessor of the drug or substance waltzes up to the place where they\u2019re going to get checked and all the time committing a criminal offence in possessing it, then hands it over. There\u2019s that little point in time\u2014or, in fact, there\u2019s a point in time when, having handed it over, they\u2019re no longer in possession, therefore not committing a criminal offence anymore; the drug checker has it in their possession, protected from criminal offence under this bill. And so I have to say in the early drafts there was consideration given to some sort of protection for the possessor of it, of the substance or drug, but it was difficult to define at what point that should sort of stop and start. The reality is we are not stopping people who possess drugs or substances from being criminally liable; they are. They remain that. It\u2019s only if they\u2019re carrying out testing services they\u2019re free or if they\u2019re the controller of the premises or the place where it happens they are protected from liability for criminal prosecution.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000846\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003ESo the person who possesses it then falls back to the changes to the Misuse of Drugs Act we made last year, which is to give a signal about the exercise of prosecutorial discretion to the police. So the police might stand there and see all this happening, but the police know that, when they come to exercise their discretion, if the only criminal offence they see committed is possession of the drug, then they\u2019re actually going to have to fall back on a health referral anyway. So the scheme in total, I think, makes sense for what we\u2019re trying to achieve, which is knowing there are people who have illicit substances in circumstances where they have bought an illicit substance, don\u2019t really know what it is, know there\u2019s a risk, and get it tested\u2014we want that person, if the police are concerned about them, to have a health referral, not to be treated through the criminal justice system, and this helps to achieve that.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022 data-id=\u0022bb7f743a95924a46b441c636146d16e2\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000847\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022bb7f743a95924a46b441c636146d16e2\u0022\u003EDAVID SEYMOUR (Leader\u2014ACT):\u003C/span\u003E Well, thank you very much, Madam Chair. I refer briefly to the amendment on the Table in the name of Dr Nick Smith, which would, as he tells us, restrict the testing to be done at music festivals. We\u2019re listening\u2014ACT is listening\u2014but we would like Dr Smith to tell the committee how a music festival will be defined. Will there be a required level of musicality or festivity in his amendments, and how will that be enforced? Because it could be quite useful if those things were indeed measurable and practical to measure. Perhaps Dr Smith would even give a demonstration of the musicality and festivity required to the committee, but I suspect it\u2019s going to be difficult for us to support that.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000848\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003EI\u2019d also like to ask the Minister in the chair, Andrew Little, about new section 35DH, the amendments that would say, \u201CAn employee or a volunteer of a service provider is not liable for anything they do or fail to do in the course of the performance\u201D. In the scenario where some drugs are tested and it turns out they\u2019re bad and somebody is harmed by taking them but the service provider has in some way failed in their duty, are they liable under the Health and Safety at Work Act? Because surely they\u2019re a person conducting a business or undertaking (PCBU). Now, this leads to an interesting question: is there a carve-out? Because a lot of people up and down this country would love a carve-out from the liabilities of the Health and Safety at Work Act. Being a PCBU, if you\u2019re a director, if you\u2019re somebody on one of these service providers, if you\u2019re on the board of KnowYourStuffNZ, you\u2019d want to know that you are not going to be liable for some kid that takes some drugs. You tell them\u2014you don\u2019t communicate properly, whatever, and they harm themselves\u2014have you taken all reasonably practicable steps? Because that\u2019s the bar that people operating farms and businesses up and down this country face.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000849\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003ESo, you know, we\u2019ve got to be very careful here. It may well be that, with regard to workplace health and safety, service providers like KnowYourStuffNZ are already operating in that kind of legal grey area and this legislation will actually have no effect on the situation. If that\u2019s the case, I don\u2019t think we should concern ourselves with it tonight, but on the other hand, you\u2019d want to be pretty sure\u2014and I know the Minister in the chair has only recently become the Minister of Health. He\u2019s got a very, very rich background in labour relations and workplace health and safety; he\u2019s in a very good position to address this, and I\u2019m sure there will be people who would very much like to have some reassurance about how the new section 35DH, particularly subsection (1) of that new section, is going to interact with the laws that apply to people up and down this country when they are operating a business as a person conducting a business or undertaking\u2014you know, what sorts of rules apply to them, and does this section actually create a carve-out from the Health and Safety at Work Act, because if that\u2019s the case, well, this is something the ACT Party wholeheartedly supports. There\u2019d be a wide range of people\u2014employers and people in organisations, rugby clubs, up and down this country\u2014who would love to know that Parliament can give them such an exemption. But certainly, to date, it seemed very unusual\u2014in fact, unprecedented\u2014that that has been allowed to happen.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000850\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003ESo I hope that the Minister, drawing on the expertise that he has and has built up over many decades in his law practice and as a Minister in the previous Government and as a member of this House, will be able to give some clarity, because I know that there\u2019ll be people who are very much in favour of this bill, people who would otherwise be operators, who would actually really, really like to be able to get some clarity. I think, particularly in a scenario where there is the absence of a regulatory impact statement, where there is the absence of a select committee process with submissions and so on, and where all of this is going to happen very, very fast with guidelines set out by the Director-General of Health\u2014given all of that, it would be very, very helpful if the Minister could rise to his feet and give clarification about the interaction between the Health and Safety at Work Act on the one hand and this legislation before us tonight on the other.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000851\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003ENow, I don\u2019t know what\u2019s happening, Madam Chair\u2014I was fairly certain that at 10 \u00A0o\u2019clock the committee would actually rise, but it looks like we\u2019re going into extra time, and I\u2019m looking forward to hearing what the Minister has to say all night long.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00224a25943b-cb3b-49c3-bd10-74316fae17f1\u0022 data-id=\u0022412a6712f2a6417697921ca54763facd\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000852\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00224a25943b-cb3b-49c3-bd10-74316fae17f1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022412a6712f2a6417697921ca54763facd\u0022\u003ECHAIRPERSON (Hon Jacqui Dean)\u003C/span\u003E: Thank you for that last comment around the procedures around the end of play for the day. The Standing Orders have changed for this Parliament and we do have a five-minute window on either side to allow members to make a contribution. So, members, the time has come for me to leave the Chair. The committee will resume at 9 a.m. tomorrow. Thank you.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000853\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00224a25943b-cb3b-49c3-bd10-74316fae17f1\u0022\u003EDebate interrupted.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000854\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00224a25943b-cb3b-49c3-bd10-74316fae17f1\u0022\u003ESitting suspended from 10.03 p.m. to 9 a.m. (Wednesday)\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id202012011128612538414077adbd11edf4b24ef9000855\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00224a25943b-cb3b-49c3-bd10-74316fae17f1\u0022\u003E\u003Cbr\u003E\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n    \u003C/div\u003E\n    \u003Cdiv class=\u0022HpsHansard\u0022\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000001\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsProceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u002289cf5118de7d430db63f3c10f00904e4\u0022\u003ETUESDAY, 1 DECEMBER 2020\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000002\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u0022b7fee1a502a742f4a3492b47ad50e0ec\u0022\u003E(continued on Wednesday, 2 December 2020)\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n    \u003C/div\u003E\n    \u003Cdiv class=\u0022HpsHansard\u0022\u003E\n      \u003Cp\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsProceedingHeading\u0022\u003EBills\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000003\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u00221c4f21547c294a16954932237b0e3c54\u0022\u003EDrug and Substance Checking Legislation Bill\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000004\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u002248b4b77a01644d99bdb877de006355bf\u0022\u003EIn Committee\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000005\u0022\u003EDebate resumed.\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000006\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u0022cc9195aeb45e464e935ac1e0ee4dfba0\u0022\u003EPart 1  Amendments to Misuse of Drugs Act 1975 (continued)\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022a434482b-7ac1-4862-9ce7-13e63289dee3\u0022 data-id=\u0022761a8cf0eb674b2b8e4043a23780193b\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000007\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a434482b-7ac1-4862-9ce7-13e63289dee3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022761a8cf0eb674b2b8e4043a23780193b\u0022\u003ECHAIRPERSON (Adrian Rurawhe)\u003C/span\u003E: K\u0101ti r\u0101, t\u0113nei te mihi ake ki a t\u0101tou. Members, when we suspended last night, the committee was debating Part 1 of the Drug and Substance Checking Legislation Bill, which is the debate on clauses 4 to 16, Amendments to Misuse of Drugs Act 1975.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022 data-id=\u00224be17dd29d6548899772d228e6d3b4f5\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000008\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00224be17dd29d6548899772d228e6d3b4f5\u0022\u003EHon ANDREW LITTLE (Minister of Health):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Mr Chairman. When we adjourned last night, David Seymour had asked a searching question about the application of proposed section 35DH in clause 10 of the bill, and he had wondered whether, in the references to an employee or volunteer of a service provider not being liable for anything they do or fail to do in the course of the performance or intended performance of the service provider\u2019s functions, that meant they were off the hook for, for example, health and safety breaches. I am pleased to advise the member that no, they won\u2019t be.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000009\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003EIt\u2019s important, of course\u2014as former member of the House the Rt Hon Winston Peters used to say, words matter. So you have to look at all the words of a provision. If the member looked at the rest of the words in subsection (1) of the proposed new section 35DH, where it says \u201Cunless it is shown that they acted in bad faith or without reasonable care\u201D\u2014now, that\u2019s in relation to the performance of the functions as defined in the bill, and those functions are set out in proposed section 35DB. Providing an employee or volunteer of a drug-checking service provider carries out those functions in good faith and with reasonable care, they won\u2019t be liable for any act or omission on their part. It does not absolve them of the responsibility to comply with the requirements of the health and safety and employment legislation, which, of course, will apply to the host of the event and any other person conducting a business or undertaking that is operating around the event.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022 data-id=\u0022ad4c3a4d8bf648aa8bef1800026f4357\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000010\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022ad4c3a4d8bf648aa8bef1800026f4357\u0022\u003EDAVID SEYMOUR (Leader\u2014ACT):\u003C/span\u003E Well, thank you, Mr Chair. I\u2019m sorry not to see Dr Smith take a call; I hope he will soon, because I\u2019m particularly keen to hear his explanation of just how musical and festive a music festival would have to be to qualify under his amendment. Upon further examination of Dr Smith\u2019s amendment, I\u2019ve also noticed that it is an amendment to section 35DJ. That is the amendment that requires the testing to be done at a music festival\u2014so, hey, 35DJ! We\u2019re looking forward to hearing Dr Smith get up and explain his amendment.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000011\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003EBut I would like to just drill down a bit further into the more serious matter that\u2019s being discussed and that the Minister\u2019s just very helpfully given a partial answer to, but I do wonder about the remaining liabilities for both the host of the venue and for other people who might comprise a person conducting a business or undertaking\u2014for example, a testing service that the directors or management, that the volunteers and workers, have certainly absolved. But what liability do they have in the case where somebody avails themselves of a testing service and still goes on to be harmed by impure drugs? Because I just think it\u2019s\u2014you know, given the absence of a regulatory impact statement, given the absence of a select committee process, can we just tease out and understand what liabilities people\u2014who I support, who I think should be offering their services\u2014will face under the Health and Safety at Work Act, given this law? And the answer may well be no different from what they face now. If that\u2019s the answer, I think hearing that from the Minister in the committee would be very helpful.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022 data-id=\u0022d20118cfda3a4e8a88caa15c06e1ed0f\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000012\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022d20118cfda3a4e8a88caa15c06e1ed0f\u0022\u003EHon ANDREW LITTLE (Minister of Health):\u003C/span\u003E Thanks again to that member for the further question. I do go back to those words at the very end of that proposed subsection and proposed clause, or new section 35DH: \u201Cunless it is shown that they acted in bad faith or without reasonable care\u201D. So there is an expectation that they will exercise reasonable care. We know, as a matter of law, reasonable care will differ depending on the qualifications, competency, or capability of the person. A medical professional who volunteers to assist with a drug-checking service will be held to a higher standard than somebody who has got a basic science knowledge, knows how to run the testing equipment, and can interpret a result and advise a person of the result. That is the reality. So I think the expectation with these testing services is that they conduct the test, they get the result, and they provide that to the person who has provided the sample or the drug for testing. There will be some advice or counselling about\u2014first of all, advice about the content of the substance, then, second, about the health effects of ingesting it. Provided that is happening, consistent with the person\u2019s skills, competency, and capability, then they have discharged their obligation.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000013\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003EIf there is an adverse reaction further down the track, well, then, the person in the drug-checking service won\u2019t be held responsible for that, because, in the end, it will be the choice of the person who has acquired the substance, sought testing of it, and then has knowledge of it, and what they choose to do with it after that will be on them. That is the regime that has been set up, and I think that member would accept that this is about saying to those people who do choose to use mind-altering substances, that is a choice that they take regardless of the lawfulness of the substance. We know that there are health effects, and the purpose of this is to allow an opportunity to provide health advice at that time, but if they make that choice, they make that choice. We want to seek to minimise the negative health effects, but I think reality and life tells us we won\u2019t stop some people, or people within a cohort, from experimenting, trying stuff out, even if it has a predictable and obvious effect on them.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022 data-id=\u00225dad679efc9746ec9cf0caec3b95bf44\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000014\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00225dad679efc9746ec9cf0caec3b95bf44\u0022\u003EHon Dr NICK SMITH (National):\u003C/span\u003E The part in which I entirely agree with the Minister is firstly about the fact that Parliament needs to be focused on minimising the harm, and the second is that words matter. I want to pursue a little further with the Minister the practical implications of Part 1, along a similar line as David Seymour raised, and that is its interaction with the health and safety workplace laws. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000015\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003EThe reason I ask these questions is that when I talk to festival operators in the Nelson region, they are incredibly and properly risk-averse around the issue of drugs at such music festivals, like the Bay festival and the like, and rightly so because they are really nervous that if there is tragedy during their festival in which a young person takes one of these psychotic recreational drugs and dies, they will be legally liable. So they actually go to quite a lot of effort to try and keep those venues drug-free. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000016\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003EHere\u2019s the tough question for the Parliament. I\u2019d like a colleague to address it. I\u2019d like Chl\u00F6e Swarbrick to address it as well. If we provide for a drug-testing service at those festivals, does that in any way shift or alter the legal obligations of those festival organisers? In other words, if I\u2019m a festival organiser who at the moment is quite risk-averse, and rightly so\u2014whether they\u2019re running White Island volcanic tours or building sites, factories or music festivals, we want them focused on safety and that\u2019s the very purpose of that Act\u2014is there a risk in Part 1 that as a consequence of providing for this drug and substance checking, I as a festival organiser am going to be able to say, \u201CHey guys. I had the drug-testing service there. I\u2019ve met my obligations.\u201D, and, effectively, turn a blind eye to those that are peddling the meth, the ecstasy, the cocaine at these sorts of festivals? In my view, if that is the legal effect of Part 1, we actually run a risk of increasing the harm, not reducing it\u2014on which we agree.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000017\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003EThe second point I want to address is my amendment to section 35\u2014coincidently\u2014\u201CDJ\u201D, and no I\u2019m not going to indulge my colleague David Seymour by singing an item, although I do note that the member of Parliament for that, Chris Baillie, may like to give us a maiden number as a band member with musical talent. If I was to test my musical talents in this Chamber, I assure you that I would probably get disciplined and named by the Chair. But there is a serious point, and the serious point is this: if the logic of this part, that providing drug-testing services at music festivals is going to make them safer, why would you not equally, Minister, run that argument in the broader community? The reality is the bulk of our illicit drugs are not used at music festivals and such events; they are actually used out in the community every single day in homes and all over the country. If the logic is that there is a risk at music festivals, is it the Government\u2019s intent to also apply that testing to The Octagon in Dunedin or Queen Street in Auckland and every other nook and cranny of New Zealand where, sadly, there are high and increasing levels of illicit drug use? If you apply the logic that you\u2019re going to make it safer at a music festival, do you also apply the logic that says that it would so too apply to others? As Part 1 is currently drafted, this drug- and substance-testing service could be applied anywhere. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000018\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003EI have proposed an amendment to try and narrow the focus of the bill. I\u2019d be interested in the Green Party view. Is it the intent that the drug-testing service would apply only at music festivals or is the intent actually to apply it at other places where illicit drugs are used? If there is a difference in public policy view about those different circumstances, please explain, because I am unconvinced. I would stress to this Parliament, particularly when it is passing urgent legislation in a hurry, that we keep it narrow, and let\u2019s at least keep it to those music festivals and those sorts of concert events, and let\u2019s see how it goes for 12 months before we throw the net more widely. I would be interested both in the Minister\u2019s response, the Green Party\u2019s response, and I\u2019d be particularly interested in the ACT Party supporting our amendment so that we can keep this urgent provision to the very specific issue that has been in the public arena, and that is the issue of music festivals and concerts.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022 data-id=\u00220b9e88af4e784196ae2fbf15ce5cfa49\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000019\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00220b9e88af4e784196ae2fbf15ce5cfa49\u0022\u003EHon ANDREW LITTLE (Minister of Health):\u003C/span\u003E I\u2019m thankful for questions posed by the Rt Hon Dr Nick Smith. Can I deal with the second question first, which flows from his amendment and his proposal to add proposed section 35DJ\u2014coincidently\u2014and say that I\u2019d be very clear: it is the intention of this Government through the next phase of legislation it will bring to Parliament, which will go through the full parliamentary process and a full select committee examination, to ensure that there are drug-checking services available beyond just festivals, because the member is absolutely right: there are substances available on the street, so to speak, that are unsafe to people. There is all sorts of peddling of substances and wares on the streets in cities around New Zealand, which are a hazard to youth, and which people ought, if they get the opportunity, to better find out what is contained in those substances.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000020\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003EBecause that is a significant policy step\u2014a health policy step\u2014it is right that that comes under the full scrutiny and examination of this Parliament, and that member and other National Party members who will be on the relevant select committee, the Health Committee, will have an opportunity to go through in detail the policy considerations and the pharmacological information that informs that policy.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000021\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003EBut right now this particular provision is conceived to apply for the forthcoming festival season. It is based around the Director-General of Health being able to give a permit, and the basis on which the Director-General of Health will give those permits, bearing in mind that the Director-General of Health can put conditions on it, will relate to the music festival, music concert, sort of, regime that happens around this time of the year anyway. Given that the concert season, the festival season, is about to kick off this month, we want to make sure that that is in place for there. That is what the policy intention is confined to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000022\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003EIn terms of the member\u2019s proposed amendment I might just add\u2014and I think David Seymour referred to it yesterday. The difficulty with this proposed amendment is: what is a music festival or concert? Does a music festival that has all sorts of other offerings\u2014food, other beverages, entertainment\u2014constitute a music festival for the purposes of the member\u2019s proposed amendment? I think that has the potential to create more confusion than to provide assistance.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000023\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003EOn to the member\u2019s first point that he raised in relation to interaction with health and safety and employment obligations; look, I\u2019ve met festival organisers who say, \u201CThe reality is, we know that at these events people are going to turn up with substances and some of them won\u2019t know exactly what is in the substance they have.\u201D From their point of view, they consider the bigger risk is that they don\u2019t have the means available to better ensure safety for those who do want to consume those substances. The event organisers I\u2019ve spoken to welcome the ability to have drug-checking services available in a way that means that they are not criminally liable. So they see that as discharging their health and safety obligations as opposed to going in the opposite direction.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000024\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003EI\u2019ve yet to meet a festival organiser, dealing particularly with the kind of summer rock festivals that we get, who aspires to drug-free events. They know that with the cohort and the demographic that turns up to those events, there is a high probability that there will be illicit substances circulating within that group. What they want to do is make sure that those who choose to ingest those substances do so with a level of information and education and knowledge and do so safely. So I think that is a fulfilment of health and safety obligations for a person conducting a business or undertaking, not contrary to it.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022f7fc7ac3-5ce1-43ca-8cd6-dbb0941bf3ae\u0022 data-id=\u00222f254c255a96470aba10c183960c1026\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000025\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f7fc7ac3-5ce1-43ca-8cd6-dbb0941bf3ae\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00222f254c255a96470aba10c183960c1026\u0022\u003EDr DUNCAN WEBB (Junior Whip\u2014Labour):\u003C/span\u003E I move, That the question be now put.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022 data-id=\u002256c69c2aa6994db992dae000076a1225\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000026\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002256c69c2aa6994db992dae000076a1225\u0022\u003EHon Dr NICK SMITH (National):\u003C/span\u003E The Minister has not specifically addressed the question that I sought about the legal liability of festival organisers. Just to keep it very short and sharp to the Minister: will the provision of drug- and substance-checking services at a festival reduce the liability that a festival organiser will face in the event of a tragedy at a festival event? In other words: has he had any advice from officials about the interaction of this bill and our health and safety and workplace laws around the obligation? And here\u2019s the rub of it for the Minister\u2014why I\u2019m concerned\u2014the core of the argument this morning is everybody wants to reduce harm. That\u2019s not the question. The question we have as a consequence of providing the substance testing is that you make the organisers of festivals less cautious about trying to prevent drug dealers getting into their festival events, that you get people getting less cautious about using the substance, because now it\u2019s got a Government testing - approved agency that\u2019s doing it, and, as a consequence, you\u2019ll get increased use and you get increased harm. So the reason for the question is that these provisions might be counter-productive to reducing harm, if, in fact, we have organisers saying, \u201CGood, this law reduces my liability and risk.\u201D, and that\u2019s why I\u2019d specifically ask the Minister what advice he has received, what assurances he can give to the committee that that is not a risk that we should be concerned with.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022 data-id=\u00222e3069dd8024421199511825126d36db\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000027\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00222e3069dd8024421199511825126d36db\u0022\u003EHon ANDREW LITTLE (Minister of Health):\u003C/span\u003E I thank the member again for his further clarification, and I think the point is this: the only exoneration of liability, if you like, for the event organiser is exoneration from section 12 of the Misuse of Drugs Act. They won\u2019t be liable for prosecution by having the drug-checking services at their event knowing that that means that there will be people at an event that the event organiser controls who are in possession of illicit substances. So they are off the hook for criminal liability for that. They are not off the hook for the range of other duties that they would be expected to exercise in terms of the safety of people.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000028\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003ENow, if an event organiser knows that somebody is turning up with, you know, volumes of illicit substances that can cause great harm, then that person with great volumes is acting criminally, and if the event organiser knows that, they would also be liable for not taking steps to remove that person from the place or take steps to prevent such a person from entering that place, and they do that through security checking\u2014people coming into their premises. The only point of liability that this legislation prevents the event organiser from being susceptible to is allowing a drug-checking service onsite knowing that that drug-checking service will receive illicit substances. But they must take every other step to ensure people are safe. I might add too, for the drug-checking service, if they have somebody who comes and surrenders a substance for testing and it turns out that it is highly toxic and very dangerous, then the legislation makes it clear in terms of the requirements to act reasonably, they will be acting unreasonably if they don\u2019t take every step to say, \u201CYou should not be taking this. This will kill you, or come close to it.\u201D We, you know, tell you not to take it. If it is a soft message about \u201CWell, you\u2019re really taking your chances here, but it\u2019s up to you.\u201D, that won\u2019t be enough for the highly toxic substance that comes to the knowledge of the drug-checking services and subsequently the person.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000029\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003EI am satisfied that the regime that is in place in this bill covers off all those risk areas, for the safety not only of the drug consumer but for others attending the particular event.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00229c069cdb-968c-4f11-b126-92f9c655148b\u0022 data-id=\u00223b37d5dbe68c4f94a3c147296dd1e2a1\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000030\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00229c069cdb-968c-4f11-b126-92f9c655148b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00223b37d5dbe68c4f94a3c147296dd1e2a1\u0022\u003ESHANAN HALBERT (Labour\u2014Northcote):\u003C/span\u003E I move, That the question be now put.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca id=\u00222a14f2a5638d4643a6467cce78549612\u0022 name=\u0022division\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EA party vote was called for on the question, That the question be now put.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EAyes 76\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand Labour 64; Green Party of Aotearoa New Zealand 10; Te Paati M\u0101ori 2.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENoes 43\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand National 33; ACT New Zealand 10. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EMotion agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022a434482b-7ac1-4862-9ce7-13e63289dee3\u0022 data-id=\u00220679b7e053624728bb4dbc7007fa4fe3\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000031\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a434482b-7ac1-4862-9ce7-13e63289dee3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00220679b7e053624728bb4dbc7007fa4fe3\u0022\u003ECHAIRPERSON (Adrian Rurawhe)\u003C/span\u003E: The question is that the Hon Dr Nick Smith\u2019s tabled amendment to clause 10, inserting new section 35DJ, be agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca id=\u002282267bd047d84a3fad4be989619dab5e\u0022 name=\u0022division\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EA party vote was called for on the question, That the amendment be agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EAyes 33\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand National 33. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENoes 86\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand Labour 64; Green Party of Aotearoa New Zealand 10; ACT New Zealand 10; Te Paati M\u0101ori 2.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EAmendment not agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca id=\u00225450d14e07a0406ba68d35f670167563\u0022 name=\u0022division\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EA party vote was called for on the question, That Part 1 be agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EAyes 86\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand Labour 64; Green Party of Aotearoa New Zealand 10; ACT New Zealand 10; Te Paati M\u0101ori 2.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENoes 33\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand National 33.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EPart 1 agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000032\u0022\u003EThe result corrected after originally being announced as Ayes 84, Noes 33. \u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000033\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u002265053ecdefdc4d47810bf17ab0aa626b\u0022\u003EPart 2  Amendments to Psychoactive Substances Act 2013\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022a434482b-7ac1-4862-9ce7-13e63289dee3\u0022 data-id=\u002234150f518a484b07add6bfc35884be64\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000034\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a434482b-7ac1-4862-9ce7-13e63289dee3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002234150f518a484b07add6bfc35884be64\u0022\u003ECHAIRPERSON (Adrian Rurawhe)\u003C/span\u003E: We now come to the debate on Part 2. This is the debate on clauses 17 to 23, Amendments to Psychoactive Substances Act 2013.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022 data-id=\u00220b5840ed109b4fe384fc16b8bc276a20\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000035\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00220b5840ed109b4fe384fc16b8bc276a20\u0022\u003EHon ANDREW LITTLE (Minister of Health):\u003C/span\u003E I won\u2019t take too much of the time of the committee on my comments on this, except to say that the operative sections of this part are clause 19 and clause 20, which set up exceptions to the criminal liability provisions of the Psychoactive Substances Act and simply mean, as was provided for in Part 1, that a person who provides to a drug-checking service a psychoactive substance otherwise unlawful under the Psychoactive Substances Act is not\u2014the drug-checking service, at least, is not criminally liable for having possession of it while they\u2019re carrying out the testing and until they return it to the person who has given it to them in the first place.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022 data-id=\u0022f42b887ae0c149cca81e9358d7d20562\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000036\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022f42b887ae0c149cca81e9358d7d20562\u0022\u003EHon Dr NICK SMITH (National):\u003C/span\u003E My questions on Part 2 of this bill relate to what Government has learnt relevant to this part from the disaster that followed the Psychoactive Substances Act that was passed back in 2013, with the Hon Peter Dunne. Let\u2019s just recite quickly what occurred there, because it has a very close parallel and is one of the reasons that National is cautious of the broader drug- and substance-checking proposals that we\u2019re passing under urgency in this bill. We were persuaded, as a Parliament, unanimously at that time, that if we regulated these psychoactive substances, that would make New Zealand safer. I remember being hauled into the accident and emergency department by specialist doctors at my own hospital within a few months of us passing that law\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000037\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f7fc7ac3-5ce1-43ca-8cd6-dbb0941bf3ae\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022d5e59746963f4eac87be08edccdfd715\u0022\u003EDr Duncan Webb\u003C/span\u003E: Wrong bill.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000038\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00227ef0e07cb9904f38850d7a2fb544b204\u0022\u003EHon Dr NICK SMITH\u003C/span\u003E: \u2014and seeing the\u2014yeah, yeah, what I\u2019m saying is that we\u2019re amending that psychoactive substances legislation\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000039\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dbaac12b-3efa-4d95-a08d-f0f637a48bab\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00223f2a7281c3094193beed0758be76510b\u0022\u003EChl\u00F6e Swarbrick\u003C/span\u003E: Which you screwed up.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000040\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00222d2c114c99544d8690a8f8008fc1ce9e\u0022\u003EHon Dr NICK SMITH\u003C/span\u003E: And my question\u2014well, I\u2019d be interested\u2014does the Green Party accept that Parliament erred in 2013? Because if we look at the number of fatalities that follow, if we\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000041\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dbaac12b-3efa-4d95-a08d-f0f637a48bab\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002240e0775314e444ffbd62216861105e09\u0022\u003EChl\u00F6e Swarbrick\u003C/span\u003E: I\u2019ll send you an article about how you screwed up, Nick.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000042\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002285a10421145d46bd91c2ebe7c145afe8\u0022\u003EHon Dr NICK SMITH\u003C/span\u003E: Well, I\u2019d be interested for the Green Party MP to explain, because Parliament was persuaded in 2013 that if we regulated these substances, we would make New Zealand safer than if we prohibited them. And what happened? What happened was that right through New Zealand there was a scourge of deaths, of admissions to hospitals, and Parliament unanimously repealed that law within\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000043\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dbaac12b-3efa-4d95-a08d-f0f637a48bab\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002291c9dea12aa04c93ac0435d6362828d8\u0022\u003EChl\u00F6e Swarbrick\u003C/span\u003E: No, it didn\u2019t.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000044\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00229f13bdff2e894436abf13318fd60233d\u0022\u003EHon Dr NICK SMITH\u003C/span\u003E: Well, actually\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000045\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dbaac12b-3efa-4d95-a08d-f0f637a48bab\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002284744da799b94a43878b53809f9c8c93\u0022\u003EChl\u00F6e Swarbrick\u003C/span\u003E: The Greens abstained.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000046\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a070ac58f3344c9787482d06696da917\u0022\u003EHon Dr NICK SMITH\u003C/span\u003E: The Greens abstained. Now, that\u2019s really strong, isn\u2019t it? So what happened was that Parliament passed the law in a hurry around psychoactive substances, it turned to custard, and Parliament then had to revisit it urgently and there wasn\u2019t a member of this House that was not moved by the tragedies that occurred around the country. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000047\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003EAnd I\u2019m simply asking: has this Parliament learnt? Have we actually taken on board\u2014you\u2019re allowed to make mistakes once, but to make mistakes twice would be extremely foolish, particularly when we\u2019re dealing with life and death issues for our young people around drug use. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000048\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003ESo my question for the Minister in the chair: what does he think are the learnings from the experience of 2013 when the Psychoactive Substances Act was passed? At the core of that issue was the issue of the testing regime, and where the caution was\u2014effectively what Parliament did at that time was say if things already in the marketplace are already going to be used, then we\u2019re going to allow them to continue to be used while we put a regulatory regime in place. What this is proposing to do is to allow for the drug- and substance-testing of those same psychoactive substances\u2014and without being too crude about it, because it\u2019s broader, but, effectively, we\u2019re talking about synthetic cannabis - type products. Does he expect as a consequence of passing this bill that we will see a re-emergence of those synthetic cannabis - type products which caused so much harm then? And if\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000049\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dbaac12b-3efa-4d95-a08d-f0f637a48bab\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a37db54adb83424cbb3c83bbfbda2708\u0022\u003EChl\u00F6e Swarbrick\u003C/span\u003E: They\u2019re already out there, Nick.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000050\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00223cf52c7440b943bb85d5380ad343814b\u0022\u003EHon Dr NICK SMITH\u003C/span\u003E: Well, I\u2019d love the member for the Greens, who\u2019s repeatedly interjecting, to actually take a call and to address the issue of what Parliament did in 2013, how we made a mistake, why Parliament repealed it\u2014albeit I acknowledge that the Green Party decided to abstain on the repeal\u2014and explain it, because, in my view, I do not want to see a repeat of what occurred at that time. Parliament got it wrong and needs to accept it got it wrong. So how will the provisions in this part to provide for the testing of those synthetic cannabis - type products actually improve the safety, and are we falling back down the same track we did then?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022a434482b-7ac1-4862-9ce7-13e63289dee3\u0022 data-id=\u0022be420bce1c654d6380b370594f3adff8\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000051\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a434482b-7ac1-4862-9ce7-13e63289dee3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022be420bce1c654d6380b370594f3adff8\u0022\u003ECHAIRPERSON (Adrian Rurawhe)\u003C/span\u003E: Before I give the call, on the last vote that we had for Part 1, the numbers given were incorrect. The Ayes are actually 86 and the Noes are 33. So the record will be amended. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022 data-id=\u0022582147832b2e465294f8c6f4929777e3\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000052\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022582147832b2e465294f8c6f4929777e3\u0022\u003EHon ANDREW LITTLE (Minister of Health):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Mr Chairman, and thank you to the member who\u2019s just resumed his seat. As I recall, the problem with the psychoactive substances legislation, as passed in 2013, was that it set up a permitting regime under which no permits were given, and all that meant was that the stuff that up to that time had actually been on shop counters and stuff just went underground, and, worse, other substances entered the underground market and nobody knew what it was\u2014and that\u2019s what put people\u2019s health at risk. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000053\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003EThis does the opposite. This says if you are getting stuff and you don\u2019t know what it is, what the substance is or what it contains, particularly when it comes to things like synthetic cannabis, you can get it tested, so you are safer. That option wasn\u2019t available under the psychoactive substances legislation as at 2013\u2014not available, even now, lawfully. This is about making that process lawful to keep people safe, and the message will be very clear. I don\u2019t think it\u2019s a good idea for people to be taking a whole heap of mind-altering substances, but people do that, and what we want to know is that if they are going to experiment with it, if they are going to try stuff out, that we have a regime that does the best we can to keep people safe. The psychoactive substances legislation didn\u2019t do that; this will do that.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022dbaac12b-3efa-4d95-a08d-f0f637a48bab\u0022 data-id=\u002263c4acb72c3343eeaedfcec80b9a2179\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000054\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dbaac12b-3efa-4d95-a08d-f0f637a48bab\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002263c4acb72c3343eeaedfcec80b9a2179\u0022\u003ECHL\u00D6E SWARBRICK (Green\u2014Auckland Central):\u003C/span\u003E All right. So, Nick Smith may be professing\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000055\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a434482b-7ac1-4862-9ce7-13e63289dee3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022921e6960cba54880a59f594f0814162b\u0022\u003ECHAIRPERSON (Adrian Rurawhe)\u003C/span\u003E: The Hon Dr Nick Smith.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000056\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dbaac12b-3efa-4d95-a08d-f0f637a48bab\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002289476e385dfe4f05a1ab5f9371c09bf9\u0022\u003ECHL\u00D6E SWARBRICK\u003C/span\u003E: The Hon Dr Nick Smith may be professing that Parliament got it wrong, but, in fact, it\u2019s Dr Nick Smith and the National Party who got it wrong at that point in time. So when it comes to the history of the psychoactive substances legislation, which Dr Nick Smith lived through, but he doesn\u2019t seem to remember all too clearly, let me run Parliament through a really truncated chronology of how all of that got so deeply messed up. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000057\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dbaac12b-3efa-4d95-a08d-f0f637a48bab\u0022\u003EIn approximately 2008, we had the emergence of substances like benzylpiperazine on the underground market and Parliament was moving as fast as possible to continually categorise and classify new substances as they appeared, and at that point in time had to move to constantly make amendments to the Misuse of Drugs Act 1975. It was a really slow process that did not work fast enough, and I would have hoped that, at that point in time, it also showcased the failures of the Misuse of Drugs Act 1975\u2014as ended up being demonstrated in the 2011 Law Commission review, which actually advocated for a complete repeal and replacement to, effectively, decriminalise all substances. But none the less, that aside; then you saw the emergence of the synthetics that Dr Nick Smith is speaking to. They continue to get around the Misuse of Drugs Act 1975 classification process and the slow movement of our Parliament by constantly changing the chemical, the molecular structure, from the slight tweaks of that which was put forward in the Misuse of Drugs Act amendments. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000058\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dbaac12b-3efa-4d95-a08d-f0f637a48bab\u0022\u003EYou then had the establishment of what was called the Expert Advisory Committee on Drugs, which, ironically, could only recommend where substances could be classified in response to the harm of other substances. In reference to those other substances, they literally\u2014this expert advisory committee\u2014could only recommend how much to punish people for the use or possession of those substances. Not any better approach to how we can reduce the harm of those substances. But none the less, all of that aside, that meant that all of a sudden you had this ubiquity of synthetic substances, particularly synthetic cannabinoids, which I\u2019m loath to call cannabis, because it\u2019s far molecularly different, but nonetheless, it\u2019s plant matter, sprayed with a number of chemicals to, effectively, mimic the look of cannabis. You then had this appearing on effectively dairy counters under the former National Government. You then had a situation whereby Parliament couldn\u2019t move fast enough to outlaw the stuff. You had a huge number of people who were consuming it. This became a problem primarily because of the whistle being blown by those who were on the front lines in communities. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000059\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dbaac12b-3efa-4d95-a08d-f0f637a48bab\u0022\u003EParliament then moved to pass the psychoactive substances legislation in 2013. Interestingly, this was lauded around the world at that point in time as a potential massively progressive framework to enable the legal regulation of all substances to reduce harm. However, the major flaw in it is that it immediately outlawed any substances that were currently illegal for jumping through those hoops to prove their safety, which in turn meant that the only psychoactive substances that could be legally regulated under the psychoactive substances legislation as passed by the former National Government were those that were synthetics, i.e., potentially more dangerous than their natural cohorts. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000060\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dbaac12b-3efa-4d95-a08d-f0f637a48bab\u0022\u003EOn top of that, you also had\u2014in the original psychoactive substances 2013 legislation\u2014a temporary licensing framework which enabled approximately a dozen of the substances which at that point in time had not been linked to any harm, to any deaths, or to any problems. There was nobody who died at that point in time. The temporary licensing scheme, as prescribed under the Psychoactive Substances Act 2013, meant that those substances went from being incredibly ubiquitous on dairy counters, to in stores which had to be R18 by way of access. They also could not sell alcohol. That meant, in practice, that they were being sold at adult shops. So the problem became visible\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000061\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a434482b-7ac1-4862-9ce7-13e63289dee3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022783a098fc8ce403380048550566343e9\u0022\u003ECHAIRPERSON (Adrian Rurawhe)\u003C/span\u003E: I\u2019m going to interrupt the member and just ask her in the last 60 seconds to relate what she has said so far to the actual Part 2 of this bill. Thank you.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000062\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dbaac12b-3efa-4d95-a08d-f0f637a48bab\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022dce43f4edd9049ba83c44832f2554ac8\u0022\u003ECHL\u00D6E SWARBRICK\u003C/span\u003E: Mr Chair, in relating all of what I have said in attempting to bring the National Party\u2019s understanding to the flaws of the psychoactive substances legislation which they passed, which my former colleague Kevin Hague spoke to, as it would, and I quote Kevin here, \u201CProhibition takes supply out of the hands of regulated, controlled retailers and instead puts that supply into the hands of criminal gangs and other illicit suppliers.\u201D And I move forward, \u201CWe should expect that the supply of products that are a high risk will increase as a result of this bill.\u201D\u2014that being the Psychoactive Substances Act 2013\u2014\u201CThose people, those illicit drug dealers will, in addition to having a range of psychoactive substances \u2026 have, in another pocket, other drugs like methamphetamine. So the product of this bill will be that the demand, which will not go away as a result of this bill, will also be met by an increased supply of currently illicit drugs.\u201D\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002255d0b7a4-a2c9-4c38-9b77-475311a48a89\u0022 data-id=\u00221cc1bb6d1b624fb7996c42a984bbf40b\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000063\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002255d0b7a4-a2c9-4c38-9b77-475311a48a89\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00221cc1bb6d1b624fb7996c42a984bbf40b\u0022\u003ESIMEON BROWN (National\u2014Pakuranga):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Mr Chair, and I appreciate the history lesson we\u2019ve just been able to learn. Thank you very much. Thank you for the opportunity to take a quick call on Part 2 of the Drug and Substance Checking Legislation Bill. My question to the Minister, in relation to how this impacts on the Psychoactive Substances Act, is: is the Minister envisaging a situation here where people will be able to find, potentially, incredibly dangerous synthetic drugs\u2014we\u2019ve just had the situation in New Zealand, AMB-FUBINACA; it\u2019s been just recently, in this last Parliament, classified as a class A substance, responsible for the deaths of dozens of individuals, including Calum Jones, a young man who was given a freebie by the drug dealer. If he\u2019d been able to go and get it tested, down at one of the testing services which is going legalised under this, would he have been able to get it tested and got a green ticket to say, \u201CYep, that\u2019s AMB-FUBINACA, it\u2019s exactly what you wanted,\u201D and then he\u2019d be dead with a green ticket in his pocket? \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000064\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002255d0b7a4-a2c9-4c38-9b77-475311a48a89\u0022\u003EIs that the point? Is that the point of this? Because what we see in some of these incredibly dangerous synthetic drugs is that they are deathly. They are something which people react to incredibly differently. I fear that this is going to actually lead to a situation where we\u2019re going to be giving young people green tickets to say, \u201CYep, you got what you wanted, you got what you paid for, and now go take it.\u201D Yes, maybe some information along the lines of the harms, but if that\u2019s what the young person wanted, and he\u2019s been given a green ticket, and we know as parliamentarians how dangerous it is, shouldn\u2019t we be taking a different approach?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022 data-id=\u0022e89785f5c0904fc89ebf20941d49bcb7\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000065\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022e89785f5c0904fc89ebf20941d49bcb7\u0022\u003EHon ANDREW LITTLE (Minister of Health):\u003C/span\u003E Mr Chairman, thank you. Can I just acknowledge our young guests in the gallery there, too, for whom this, I hope, will be an educational part of their visit. Just to explain for their benefit the process that we\u2019re going through at the moment, this is the part of making law where we have a detailed, clause by clause examination of the piece of legislation that is before Parliament. We\u2019ve already had a first reading, where we have a general debate about it; we\u2019ve had a second reading; and now we\u2019re at what\u2019s called the committee stage, and all members are entitled to pose questions to the Minister who\u2019s responsible for the piece of legislation\u2014that\u2019s me, and we\u2019re going through some of the clauses in it. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000066\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003EThe question we\u2019ve just had from the honourable member Simeon Brown is the one that you\u2019ve heard about whether this piece of legislation will deal with synthetic cannabis. I might add, this piece of legislation\u2014the proposal in it\u2014is to allow testing of drugs and substances, largely at music festivals and the like, over the forthcoming summer, because we know there is a real issue about young people turning up to those places with substances that they\u2019re not necessarily sure about and taking real risks with their health. We don\u2019t think we can stop that behaviour, but we think we can make it safer. So that\u2019s the objective of the exercise.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000067\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003ETo respond to Mr Brown\u2019s question, I might add that when it comes to synthetic cannabis in the form that was described by the member Chl\u00F6e Swarbrick, which is dried matter sprayed with chemical substances, the testing regime that outfits like KnowYourStuffNZ operate will not be able to test synthetic cannabis; it\u2019ll be able to test pills, powders, and fluids; that\u2019s what it will test. So to the extent that there is concern\u2014and there still is concern\u2014about dried matter sprayed with toxic chemicals, that is a question we ought to consider for the long-term solution, but this legislation won\u2019t provide an answer to that problem. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca id=\u00225427c470087a4af385dd87bb9bfddc3d\u0022 name=\u0022division\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EA party vote was called for on the question, That Part 2 be agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EAyes 86\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand Labour 64; Green Party of Aotearoa New Zealand 10; ACT New Zealand 10; Te Paati M\u0101ori 2.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENoes 33\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand National 33.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EPart 2 agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000068\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u0022d3a30524ee2c419dbe642590feb48cbf\u0022\u003EClauses 1 to 3\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022a434482b-7ac1-4862-9ce7-13e63289dee3\u0022 data-id=\u0022e6072c67033341898844143fec561221\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000069\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a434482b-7ac1-4862-9ce7-13e63289dee3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022e6072c67033341898844143fec561221\u0022\u003ECHAIRPERSON (Adrian Rurawhe)\u003C/span\u003E: Members, we now come to the debate on clauses 1 to 3, which are clauses on the title, commencement, and repeal.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022badb0a39-849c-462a-b32f-77fc017c9fc2\u0022 data-id=\u00226cdeaffa5d7a4d889ec1b2578e6da8df\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000070\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022badb0a39-849c-462a-b32f-77fc017c9fc2\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00226cdeaffa5d7a4d889ec1b2578e6da8df\u0022\u003EHon SIMON BRIDGES (National\u2014Tauranga):\u003C/span\u003E Mr Chair, Minister, the commencement and repeal clauses seem to me to actually assume significant importance in this bill, given that\u2014as I understand it\u2014what you\u2019re, effectively, doing here as a Government, and we as a Parliament, is to put this in place for a finite period of time and then repeal it, at which time you as Minister will bring to the Parliament a further, I presume more significant or something, bill. So I\u2019d like you to explain that more. I don\u2019t think I have a particularly good sense of that, and I don\u2019t think it\u2019s been set out so far in this Parliament\u2014why the finite period? It seems to me quite clear that the Government\u2019s position is that pill testing of hard illicit drugs will make people more safe, and that that\u2019s a good thing, is the Government\u2019s position. We\u2019ve got a bill to do that, so why is it being repealed? What\u2019s going on here, and does it mean that, in fact\u2014as has been the contention of the Opposition, or certainly the National Party\u2014that the Government\u2019s rushed this, that it feels that it needs to see how it goes, because there are clauses that may need a bit of a tidy up, or it\u2019s incomplete, or, indeed, you\u2019re just not entirely sure? Because, to not put too fine a point on it, New Zealanders wouldn\u2019t want to have a sense that there\u2019s an experiment going on here where the Government\u2019s just not quite sure and so it\u2019s going to come round and do it right a little bit later in the law.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000071\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022badb0a39-849c-462a-b32f-77fc017c9fc2\u0022\u003ESo I\u2019d like to get a very clear sense of just precisely why this bill is being enacted and then repealed. My tentative position\u2014I say tentative because I haven\u2019t talked with any colleagues about this\u2014is that firstly, and this isn\u2019t tentative, do it once, do it right, but secondly, if you are sure, well frankly, why waste the time of the Parliament to come back and do it all again? Is it a case of actually getting rid of the repeal provision in this bill and going with this, as much as I disagree with the bill, rather than wasting Parliament\u2019s time another time?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000072\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022badb0a39-849c-462a-b32f-77fc017c9fc2\u0022\u003EAnd then I come to something the Minister said in this committee a little earlier about what follows, where in an interchange with Dr Smith he made the point that, well, what\u2019s going to happen here is we sort of are\u2014I apologise if I\u2019m not putting this phrase in this exactly right\u2014kind of interested in the music festival side of all of this, but you know what? We\u2019re going to come back and put this everywhere in due course. Well, I\u2019d like to understand, as best the Minister can, a sense of what is coming, because it seems to me that is very relevant to what we are voting on in this bill today.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000073\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022badb0a39-849c-462a-b32f-77fc017c9fc2\u0022\u003ESo, really succinctly, there\u2019s two points I\u2019d appreciate the Minister\u2019s clear view on\u2014why the finite period, and what is coming next?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022 data-id=\u0022abd5ef518529496290762eec2e4dffd2\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000074\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022abd5ef518529496290762eec2e4dffd2\u0022\u003EHon ANDREW LITTLE (Minister of Health):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Mr Chair. And, again, for the benefit of those in the gallery who are rapidly being educated on what lawmaking looks like, they used to say about lawmaking that it\u2019s a bit like making sausages. You really don\u2019t want to see it happening, but sometimes the product can be magnificent, so we\u2019ll see what happens.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000075\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003ESo the first question that the Hon Simon Bridges asked is, \u201CWhy the repeal provision at all?\u201D Totally legitimate question. This is because it has been pretty clear from the organisers and owners that we\u2019ve heard from\u2014including outfits that have been doing drug-checking services for some time\u2014is that they feel an increasing risk they take when they offer these services, and they do so because they\u2019re dedicated to the safety of people who are ingesting these substances, that they are liable to prosecution, and that by doing something that they see a public interest and public benefit in, they are afforded some protection for that. We think, in principle, that is right. We are on the cusp of the next summer music festival season, and we wanted to get something in place that affords that protection because we know, particularly in the year that we\u2019ve had COVID-19, a whole lot of bottled up need for exuberance and happiness and joy that we think would be expressed awesomely this summer by a lot of people going to music festivals, we want to make sure that the services that do drug testing or drug checking can operate without fear of prosecution, and likewise the host of the events can encourage drug-checking services to be available at their events without the risk of prosecution.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000076\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003EBut the member is right, and the members in the National Party who have spoken in this debate have legitimately raised the issue that this is a significant policy shift in the way we approach drugs\u2014particularly illicit drugs\u2014and the way we manage them in the community. We do want a regime that goes beyond just music festivals. We know that there are substances available on the street that are being sold and handed over, and people consuming substances they don\u2019t really know the safety of, so we want a regime that deals with that element as well. But we want to take time, as Mr Bridges himself said, to do it right, to do it properly, and that will need a little more time to do that. We do want all of Parliament to provide the full scrutiny that Parliament would ordinarily give to any law to allow that to happen. Again, I\u2019ll just take a couple of minutes to educate our friends in the gallery. We\u2019re in a process called urgency at the moment, so we are putting a law through all of its stages in a very short space of time\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000077\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00224d83c8a5-2f48-4991-9c45-b1a6060daedd\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00228907b52775f34985808634911aedbcab\u0022\u003EMaureen Pugh\u003C/span\u003E: Point of order, Mr Chair. Just some clarification, if you will, sir, about the now three references to members in the gallery from the speaker in the chair.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000078\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a434482b-7ac1-4862-9ce7-13e63289dee3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002247ed5ebfc097459793c4d21cf1910751\u0022\u003ECHAIRPERSON (Adrian Rurawhe)\u003C/span\u003E: So what\u2019s your point of order?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000079\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00224d83c8a5-2f48-4991-9c45-b1a6060daedd\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00221d599164e5974db6b1258fc9a3f372bb\u0022\u003EMaureen Pugh\u003C/span\u003E: The Speakers\u2019 rulings 9/6 and 9/7 that it is not appropriate to refer to members in the gallery. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000080\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a434482b-7ac1-4862-9ce7-13e63289dee3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022614b04b42d9e4098985928f9e2464189\u0022\u003ECHAIRPERSON (Adrian Rurawhe)\u003C/span\u003E: I think the issue is that the Minister\u2019s speaking to the people in the gallery like he\u2019s speaking to the whole of New Zealand. In terms of if the Minister in charge of the bill thinks it\u2019s important enough on this bill to speak to whoever\u2019s in the gallery, without naming them\u2014which he has not done\u2014then I think that\u2019s OK. Members can take a call and dispute what he\u2019s saying if they like.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000081\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022128b7b6842894c18b4f8d2dff581879a\u0022\u003EHon ANDREW LITTLE\u003C/span\u003E: And, of course, my comments apply to those who are looking on their television sets around the country and around the world.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000082\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022badb0a39-849c-462a-b32f-77fc017c9fc2\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022e5e3f25e8aa9480b86221da7ce53320b\u0022\u003EHon Simon Bridges\u003C/span\u003E: There\u2019ll be hundreds of thousands; possibly millions.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000083\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022cd31ab8acd25424cab10564138aab483\u0022\u003EHon ANDREW LITTLE\u003C/span\u003E: I\u2019m sure there\u2019s calls from CNN right now, wanting follow-up interviews. The point is that we\u2019re passing a law very quickly, it\u2019s called urgency, and members are quite rightly saying there needs to be more scrutiny, because ordinarily in the law\u2014particularly on an important issue like this\u2014there would be a lot more scrutiny. We want to make sure that when we make a permanent change to this law that it has the full scrutiny of Parliament, and I commit to that happening in the next phase of this lawmaking.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca id=\u0022c28a7c1bc6934284897168fac8923cc4\u0022 name=\u0022division\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EA party vote was called for on the question, That clause 1 be agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EAyes 86\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand Labour 64; Green Party of Aotearoa New Zealand 10; ACT New Zealand 10; Te Paati M\u0101ori 2.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENoes 33\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand National 33.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EClause 1 agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca id=\u00229241235175eb4d5b8e5daa7f595f02be\u0022 name=\u0022division\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EA party vote was called for on the question, That clause 2 be agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EAyes 86\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand Labour 64; Green Party of Aotearoa New Zealand 10; ACT New Zealand 10; Te Paati M\u0101ori 2.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENoes 33\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand National 33.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EClause 2 agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000084\u0022\u003EClause 3 agreed to.\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000085\u0022\u003EHouse resumed.\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022a434482b-7ac1-4862-9ce7-13e63289dee3\u0022 data-id=\u002245f146b5fde948baa17b8b8404cf7bbc\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000086\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a434482b-7ac1-4862-9ce7-13e63289dee3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002245f146b5fde948baa17b8b8404cf7bbc\u0022\u003ECHAIRPERSON (Adrian Rurawhe)\u003C/span\u003E: Madam Speaker, the committee has considered the Drug and Substance Checking Legislation Bill and reports it without amendment. I move, That the report be adopted.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000087\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a434482b-7ac1-4862-9ce7-13e63289dee3\u0022\u003EMotion agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000088\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a434482b-7ac1-4862-9ce7-13e63289dee3\u0022\u003EReport adopted.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000089\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u002223fbbf99766b45a79ae35f34df7b58c7\u0022\u003EThird Reading\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022 data-id=\u00223a582a17d4634e9b9f4ceaeb06c6f438\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000090\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00223a582a17d4634e9b9f4ceaeb06c6f438\u0022\u003EHon ANDREW LITTLE (Minister of Health):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Madam Speaker. I earlier presented to the House a legislative statement on the Drug and Substance Checking Legislation Bill. I move, That the Drug and Substance Checking Legislation Bill be now read a third time. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000091\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003EAs the House has heard, this bill amends the Misuse of Drugs Act 1975 and the Psychoactive Substances Act 2013. It makes amendments to enable drug-checking services to operate and to operate without the threat of criminal liability for both those operating the drug-checking services and also for those who host events or organised events at which drug-checking services are available.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000092\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003EThe reason we\u2019re doing this and doing it under urgency is because it is December. The music festival season for the forthcoming summer is upon us. We know that there are festivals organised, music events organised. We know that the cohort of people who go to those festivals tend to be younger people, and many of them are at an age where they are experimenting with substances, many of them illicit substances, and some of them are substances the safety and security of which is not really known. So we accept the reality that this is going to happen. People are going to turn up to these events with illicit substances. We know that some of those substances are at risk of a lack of safety and causing harm to the potential user of them, and we want to minimise that harm and we want to make the ingestion of those substances, or the risk being taken with the ingestion of those substances, as low as possible and therefore promoting greater public safety. That\u2019s the motivation for it. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000093\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003EThis is a time-limited bill, so it will self-repeal within 12 months, but my commitment to the House is that within that time we will bring back a piece of legislation that is a more thoroughgoing solution to that particular policy problem, with a view to having that passed in time for this time next year, and that will come under the full scrutiny of the House. Members opposite have raised legitimate questions about whether this is the appropriate way to go about this with this particular policy challenge, and I get that and I do make the commitment that we will have a draft law that will come back to the House which they will be able to give full scrutiny to. But, in the meantime, we have to deal with the very real challenge that that festival season is upon us. We have outfits that have operated already in previous summer seasons as drug-checking services, but they are facing a heightened risk or a growing risk of criminal prosecution\u2014or, at least, the volunteers who operate the actual services\u2014and we want to take that risk away from them. We also want to take the risk away from the event organisers because we think it is important that more event organisers, particularly those who are attracting that young cohort\u2014that young demographic\u2014make these services available to provide greater safety for young people who are prone to wanting to experiment with and ingest these substances. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000094\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003EMembers opposite have raised a number of concerns, some of which, in my view, are not relevant to what we are trying to achieve here. We can all cast moral judgment on those who would use illicit substances. We can all be horrified that some people might actually want to engage in activities that are on the edge of or outside the law, but I think, when it comes to the consumption of drugs and the health effects that go with that, I would rather that we focus on taking a health approach, not criminalising more and more people. We\u2019ve done that for far too long and criminalised far too many people whose only crime, really, if you like, is they\u2019ve taken a risk, a risk with their own health. For some of them, they do fall into a bit of a hole of addiction and other kinds of reactions on their own part and, actually, what they don\u2019t need is a criminal prosecution; what they do need is some help, and this is a further step in the direction when it comes to drugs in our community, illicit substances, mind-altering substances\u2014to say actually offering help for health responses is way more effective and way more beneficial than simply another criminal prosecution, another bed in another jail, over another extended period of time. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000095\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003ESo that\u2019s why we have introduced this law and, on that basis, I commend it to the House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022a434482b-7ac1-4862-9ce7-13e63289dee3\u0022 data-id=\u002232b31b007d8a41448bdc894873b22f38\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000096\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a434482b-7ac1-4862-9ce7-13e63289dee3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002232b31b007d8a41448bdc894873b22f38\u0022\u003EDEPUTY SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: The question is that the motion be agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022badb0a39-849c-462a-b32f-77fc017c9fc2\u0022 data-id=\u00227eb67190224a4551b971048fade28509\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000097\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022badb0a39-849c-462a-b32f-77fc017c9fc2\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00227eb67190224a4551b971048fade28509\u0022\u003EHon SIMON BRIDGES (National\u2014Tauranga):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Mr Speaker. On my stroll home last night, immediately after this debate, I might say, reflecting on the debate, it seemed to me really what we\u2019re debating is one big issue\u2014the safety of our kids, and what makes our kids, our young adults, if you want to be more modern in this vernacular, more safe. The Labour Party\u2019s view is, well, it\u2019s happening anyway, and this bill when law means that parents can sleep easily, they can have confidence that their kids are safe when they\u2019re out at their raves and parties and whatever it is that they\u2019re doing. The problem is, in National\u2019s view, that that\u2019s not so.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000098\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022badb0a39-849c-462a-b32f-77fc017c9fc2\u0022\u003EWe referred to studies and actually haven\u2019t, despite all the protestation and, frankly, anger\u2014woke anger\u2014from Chl\u00F6e Swarbrick, been seriously challenged on any of those contentions or studies. The facts of testing and the message that it sends will see more use, and I refer again to the clear evidence of the United Kingdom, since testing, of use going up and up and up\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000099\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dbaac12b-3efa-4d95-a08d-f0f637a48bab\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00225ed5326c48154bfc871ea1b5a5df0605\u0022\u003EChl\u00F6e Swarbrick\u003C/span\u003E: Ninety-five percent less hospitalisation.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000100\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022badb0a39-849c-462a-b32f-77fc017c9fc2\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00224f69aa9597b24749adb113beab002077\u0022\u003EHon SIMON BRIDGES\u003C/span\u003E: \u2014and more harm\u2014you\u2019ll get your turn, Chl\u00F6e Swarbrick\u2014and more harm.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000101\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022badb0a39-849c-462a-b32f-77fc017c9fc2\u0022\u003EThat\u2019s the reality of it, and we\u2019re seeing again, just in that UK example, where from 40-something to 90-something fatalities a year are occurring. More of our kids, as a result of this bill becoming law, will take drugs like ecstasy and more will be harmed. Dare I say it, and I don\u2019t like to be alarmist about it\u2014they scoff over there\u2014I don\u2019t like to be alarmist about it, but that includes that harm, more fatalities, given the morbidity rate with ecstasy. Parents of kids just can\u2019t be confident. Actually, if they are, it\u2019s a false confidence, because no ecstasy pill is safe\u2014not a single one of them. People respond differently to them, and, in fact, differently to different ecstasy pills. MDMA, right from the start, is harmful. What\u2019s more\u2014and again I challenge Chl\u00F6e Swarbrick because she\u2019s such an expert about all of these things; just ask her! I challenge her to find me studies that show that it\u2019s impurities and compounds that are the big deal, because, actually, they\u2019re not. They\u2019re not the things within the pills that are killing young people, and, again, we referred to that much earlier. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000102\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022badb0a39-849c-462a-b32f-77fc017c9fc2\u0022\u003EWhat\u2019s also worrying here is the context of this Government\u2019s drug agenda\u2014I repeat again. Andrew Little\u2014I mean, I credit him at a level in that I think he is being more upfront and direct than your average Government Minister in this Government and, dare I say it, the Prime Minister about what\u2019s really going on here. He\u2019s quite explicit: it\u2019s happening anyway; let\u2019s go with it. He makes clear: \u201CIt\u2019s now a health matter, not a criminal one.\u201D That\u2019s his clear position. Well, actually, Andrew Little, it is both, and this is not a moral contest. Morality doesn\u2019t come into it at any level, right? That\u2019s the law of the land. It is illegal in New Zealand. It is a criminal offence to consume and possess classes A, B, and C drugs, as listed in the Misuse of Drugs Act schedules. So you\u2019re wrong, Andrew Little, when you say it\u2019s not a health or a criminal matter. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000103\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022badb0a39-849c-462a-b32f-77fc017c9fc2\u0022\u003EThe reality is they could change that law. I\u2019m hearing squawking from the other side. They could change those laws if they wanted to, but Kiwis rejected the legalisation of cannabis. That was a class C drug. Ecstasy, which primarily is what we\u2019re dealing with here, is a class A drug, and Kiwis are even less keen, and they know this. Kiwis are even less keen, the harder the drug, to see a liberalisation, whether decriminalisation or legalisation. So knowing this\u2014and, again, I credit Andrew Little for his candid talking on these issues at a level\u2014this Government isn\u2019t going to come out and do what their convictions, in their view, tell them, and that\u2019s decriminalise or legalise classes A, B, and C drugs in New Zealand. They know that\u2019s political kamikaze, right? They know that. So they do it through bills like this\u2014the bill in the last Parliament which, effectively, directed police not to arrest for possession of any illicit drug in New Zealand. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000104\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022badb0a39-849c-462a-b32f-77fc017c9fc2\u0022\u003EIf members of the public don\u2019t believe me\u2014and I say with respect to our press, they won\u2019t, but they should be, frankly, reporting this, because it is a big story; it is a significant thing that is happening in this Parliament right now. We\u2019ve heard from Andrew Little, clear words in committee, that his intent is to come back to this Parliament with a bill when this one runs out. With what started as just pill-testing at the festivals, the One Love and the one in Gisborne that Angie Warren-Clark goes to\u2014I can\u2019t remember what it\u2019s called. I don\u2019t know that, by the way. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000105\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e60c1237-5e2d-4d0a-9678-ab10db67d1b7\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002270c81a39866040fd874618732ac9ba95\u0022\u003EAngie Warren-Clark\u003C/span\u003E: I wish I did!\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000106\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022badb0a39-849c-462a-b32f-77fc017c9fc2\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022f39d4ab54a684015bbbed9771278c6ae\u0022\u003EHon SIMON BRIDGES\u003C/span\u003E: She wishes she did. I could see you there, right? I could see\u2014anyway, let\u2019s not go down that rabbit hole that takes us nowhere. From that, they will move from those festivals to pill-testing all over New Zealand on our streets.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000107\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f7fc7ac3-5ce1-43ca-8cd6-dbb0941bf3ae\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022280c661803714447adceb48f0e4de20e\u0022\u003EDr Duncan Webb\u003C/span\u003E: God forbid!\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000108\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022badb0a39-849c-462a-b32f-77fc017c9fc2\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022396bea85a9b2464ea585d89f2a958edc\u0022\u003EHon SIMON BRIDGES\u003C/span\u003E: Now, see the member over there says, \u201CGod forbid!\u201D Well, why don\u2019t the Government have the courage of their convictions and do the honest thing and decriminalise? Well, they won\u2019t. What they will do, though, is actually just do it through laws like this, because they don\u2019t have the courage of their convictions. They won\u2019t say it, but it\u2019ll be on us, and this bill and what is coming is part of a wholesale decriminalisation of drugs in New Zealand. By the time it\u2019s done, New Zealanders will say, \u201CWhat? We didn\u2019t like that. We weren\u2019t sure about that.\u201D But that\u2019s what\u2019s happening today under urgency.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000109\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022badb0a39-849c-462a-b32f-77fc017c9fc2\u0022\u003EFinally, you know, actually, whether you agree with what I\u2019m saying or not, this bill\u2014the first bill of this Parliament\u2014is being rushed and there\u2019s no chance for the contest of evidence that Chl\u00F6e Swarbrick goes on about but never produces studies on. There\u2019s no chance for any of that. This bill comes to us flawed, I think, actually, and what the Minister didn\u2019t say when he was in the chair in committee\u2014that\u2019s quite clear\u2014he\u2019s going to have to come back and do it properly. The evidence of this comes, actually, just\u2014the other members did a great job fleshing some of this out as well, but just from my questions, from a cursory look at this bill, we see there\u2019s no provisional process for the disposal of the bad illicit drugs. You could drive a truck through that as a criminal lawyer in a jury trial, by the way, at good hourly rates, dare I say it. There\u2019s no provision there for disposal. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000110\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022badb0a39-849c-462a-b32f-77fc017c9fc2\u0022\u003EThere\u2019s no good character requirements, given that we\u2019re dealing with class A drugs, around any of this. David Seymour, and fleshed out by Nick Smith, made, I thought, an excellent point around the health and safety ramifications that have not been thought out, and, yet, this will be law very shortly\u2014actually, by the end of today. We\u2019re rushing this, and all the while we rush it, on the other side, where there is proven fatalities from the blood tests of over a hundred Kiwis every single year, by being hit and killed for drug-driving on our roads, where there\u2019s proven technology, where we could get this up and running very quickly, that bill languishes on the Order Paper. No deaths from music festivals in New Zealand from this. There will be, as the numbers rack up, because that\u2019s simply statistically what\u2019s happened overseas, but on the other side, proven over a hundred fatalities, the biggest killer on our roads and the Government does nothing. It\u2019s got its priorities wrong. Nick Smith\u2019s point about that\u2014the lack of fatalities at the festivals, the roadside deaths\u2014I think is a very powerful one.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000111\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022badb0a39-849c-462a-b32f-77fc017c9fc2\u0022\u003EWe\u2019d support real harm reduction initiatives\u2014drug-driving law, more beds, more counselling services; none of that is happening. This is a law which has passed with haste but which New Zealanders, when they wake up, will repent and disagree with at their leisure.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022a434482b-7ac1-4862-9ce7-13e63289dee3\u0022 data-id=\u002294dc4f336d704806916047169dd5323b\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000112\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a434482b-7ac1-4862-9ce7-13e63289dee3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002294dc4f336d704806916047169dd5323b\u0022\u003EDEPUTY SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Order! The member\u2019s time has expired.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00223c5917bd-9c2f-4bdf-af2f-b13cd1a2c8bb\u0022 data-id=\u00222366c1a362774a059ac007b481cadc0c\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000113\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223c5917bd-9c2f-4bdf-af2f-b13cd1a2c8bb\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00222366c1a362774a059ac007b481cadc0c\u0022\u003EDr LIZ CRAIG (Labour):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Mr Speaker. This bill is an incredibly important bill because it\u2019s going to ensure that young people are kept safe this festival season by putting in place a time-limited solution to make sure that drug-checking services and the festival organisers who host them can operate with legal certainty. That\u2019s because, at the moment, those that are operating these drug-testing services and those that are hosting them are at risk from prosecution under the current law. The issue is that services like KnowYourStuffNZ are actually going out there and they are doing the checking services because they believe that those services have the potential to reduce harm and save people\u2019s lives. Now, this is only a temporary measure; so it expires 12 months after it comes into force because, in the meantime, the Minister of Health is going to go back to Cabinet with a more detailed solution. At that time, Parliament will be able to debate in detail and will have a full select committee process so the people of New Zealand can come in and provide their feedback on that more detailed solution. Important bill; important to get under way before Christmas; and I commend this bill to the House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000114\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002248a02a21-c1ac-4159-8789-485ad614bd01\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002265cd0ac789534928b8b6db71ad482ec5\u0022\u003EHon Mark Mitchell\u003C/span\u003E: Mr Speaker.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022a434482b-7ac1-4862-9ce7-13e63289dee3\u0022 data-id=\u0022f1f3f12025254839b3afb2825b497de0\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000115\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a434482b-7ac1-4862-9ce7-13e63289dee3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022f1f3f12025254839b3afb2825b497de0\u0022\u003EDEPUTY SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: I\u2019ll let you get back to your desk! I call the Hon Mark Mitchell.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002248a02a21-c1ac-4159-8789-485ad614bd01\u0022 data-id=\u0022bdc4d1f09ca9411ca085833d5cf62c32\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000116\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002248a02a21-c1ac-4159-8789-485ad614bd01\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022bdc4d1f09ca9411ca085833d5cf62c32\u0022\u003EHon MARK MITCHELL (National\u2014Whangapar\u0101oa):\u003C/span\u003E I was just checking to see if I was up now! I haven\u2019t had the chance to speak on this bill, but I\u2019m glad that I\u2019m being given the chance. Mr Speaker, first of all, can I just take my first opportunity to say congratulations on taking up the role of Deputy Speaker. I always enjoy when you\u2019re in the seat. You are very fair. I would ask that you, maybe, advocate for removing the sanctions around the use of \u201Cyou\u201D, because I seem to be the one that gets most heavily penalised in this House for that. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000117\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002248a02a21-c1ac-4159-8789-485ad614bd01\u0022\u003EBut, anyway, I\u2019m very pleased to stand and take a call on this bill. I think the reality of it is that all of us come to this House because we want to make New Zealand a safer place and, in particular, we want to protect our young people. We do understand and we do know that we have got a drug problem in New Zealand\u2014methamphetamine, these party pills. It\u2019s becoming a growing industry, unfortunately, because we are being the recipients of serious criminal organisations like these 501s, these gangs, the Comancheros and the Mongols, that are coming in from Australia, and they\u2019re taking us to a new level in terms of violence and organisation around the drug trade and the supply chain. So we\u2019ve got a big issue\u2014we\u2019ve got a big issue in our country; there\u2019s no doubt about that. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000118\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002248a02a21-c1ac-4159-8789-485ad614bd01\u0022\u003EI can see why the Government would want to be focused on tackling that, but I feel very strongly in my heart of hearts that this is the wrong pathway to go down. I\u2019m just going to step that through quickly. I think I\u2019ve listened carefully to the evidence and the data that Chl\u00F6e Swarbrick has put up. I\u2019ve listened carefully to the evidence and the data that our own team has put up. The one thing that\u2019s become very evident to me is that we needed a select committee process, and we needed to go through that because, actually, we need to sift through all that information, that data\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000119\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dbaac12b-3efa-4d95-a08d-f0f637a48bab\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4607c49d040389d01ee7aef09918c\u0022\u003EChl\u00F6e Swarbrick\u003C/span\u003E: You didn\u2019t turn up, Mark. There was one for my petition.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000120\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002255d0b7a4-a2c9-4c38-9b77-475311a48a89\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022c75de05513174638a53e9df93c6c9ed4\u0022\u003ESimeon Brown\u003C/span\u003E: That was a petition.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000121\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002248a02a21-c1ac-4159-8789-485ad614bd01\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00220667fda69f1f4cd985552f2b764b328f\u0022\u003EHon MARK MITCHELL\u003C/span\u003E: Well\u2014yeah, that\u2019s right. That was\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000122\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dbaac12b-3efa-4d95-a08d-f0f637a48bab\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022fa5fe15caaae48b68a12845c033f97a8\u0022\u003EChl\u00F6e Swarbrick\u003C/span\u003E: There was Ministry of Health advisers and officials.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000123\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002248a02a21-c1ac-4159-8789-485ad614bd01\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a90c5e272b68446d858c4ec398c1c0b1\u0022\u003EHon MARK MITCHELL\u003C/span\u003E: And, like they said, that was on a petition. But the reality of it is that this is a serious, serious piece of legislation as we come into the summer break. Make no mistake about it. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000124\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002248a02a21-c1ac-4159-8789-485ad614bd01\u0022\u003EI just want to run through the concerns that I have from an operational level. Maybe the next caller, or even, Chl\u00F6e, you could stand and respond to this\u2014that, firstly, we\u2019re going to send a message as a Parliament. We should be the responsible ones. We should be the ones that are actually studying and making very, very clear decisions, because what we do here does matter, and the signals that we send to the rest of the country and our young people do matter. The reality of it is, passing this bill today, it\u2019s going to change the conversation amongst young people. There are good young people out there, actually, that won\u2019t take drugs, and the reason why they won\u2019t take drugs is that it\u2019s illegal and they don\u2019t want to break the law. But the conversation is now going to change\u2014and trust me, the conversation will change. Now they\u2019re going to have a lot more peer pressure and they\u2019re going to have people saying, well, you know what, the Government said that it\u2019s OK; we\u2019ll test your drugs. But\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000125\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00227b7d2409b7b14baa8576729a1b039130\u0022\u003EHon Member\u003C/span\u003E: We haven\u2019t, though. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000126\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002248a02a21-c1ac-4159-8789-485ad614bd01\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002203f5f94d3c984d289298c77c4ec6656f\u0022\u003EHon MARK MITCHELL\u003C/span\u003E: I know that you keep putting up the argument that you\u2019re saying that it\u2019s not OK and it\u2019s making it safer. That is a false argument, because the way that the young people see it is\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000127\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022badb0a39-849c-462a-b32f-77fc017c9fc2\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002241fda73c2e8f49c0ba83936d1d668d36\u0022\u003EHon Simon Bridges\u003C/span\u003E: They won\u2019t get that advice.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000128\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002248a02a21-c1ac-4159-8789-485ad614bd01\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00223f37abfec2dd4e759deef32470213cec\u0022\u003EHon MARK MITCHELL\u003C/span\u003E: They won\u2019t, and they\u2019ll see their Parliament as quite simply saying that it is OK\u2014it is OK to take these drugs. And, by the way, when they hand the drugs over and they are tested and they receive them back, they will think\u2014they\u2019re not going to be involved in a nuanced debate about what the ingredients are or what\u2019s actually in them; all that they\u2019ll know is that they\u2019ve had their drugs tested and they\u2019ve got them back and they\u2019re safe. And they\u2019re not safe; they can kill them. I can tell you what, I had a long conversation with Simon Watts, who\u2019s a new MP, the MP for North Shore, who\u2019s come into our caucus. He\u2019s a paramedic\u2014he\u2019s a paramedic that actually attends these concerts. He incubates people that have taken these drugs. I\u2019ve got no doubt at all\u2014the chemical product inside these drugs that\u2019s harmful is the MDMA. That\u2019s what kills young people. So that\u2019s the first thing. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000129\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002248a02a21-c1ac-4159-8789-485ad614bd01\u0022\u003EThe next thing that I want to know is\u2014because I heard the Minister on the radio this morning saying that these drugs are still illegal, that people can still be arrested and charged. So if young people\u2014or not even young people; if anyone, a member of the public, is coming into a concert\u2014by the way, these concert promoters normally try to promote their concerts as drug free because a lot of parents, when they let their kids go to them, want to have a high level of confidence that there\u2019s not drugs there, that there aren\u2019t drug dealers there, that they\u2019re not being peddled. So when people arrive and they\u2019re coming in with their drugs and they\u2019re being tested and they\u2019re being handed back, are the police allowed to monitor and watch? Are the promoters of the concert allowed to watch those people, knowing that they\u2019re coming in with drugs, knowing that probably an outcome is going to be that guys like Simon Watts and our paramedics are going to have to be incubating and trying to save them? Are they allowed to monitor them? Are they allowed to watch them? I don\u2019t know. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000130\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002248a02a21-c1ac-4159-8789-485ad614bd01\u0022\u003EIn my view that would be common sense, wouldn\u2019t it? Because you know that you\u2019ve got people entering with a harmful product or a harmful drug that could ultimately end up with them in a seizure, frothing at the mouth, or even in a cardiac arrest with some brain damage. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000131\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00229c069cdb-968c-4f11-b126-92f9c655148b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022280ca3b857804b5991f005238a58b073\u0022\u003EShanan Halbert\u003C/span\u003E: Simon Watts would want a health response.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000132\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002248a02a21-c1ac-4159-8789-485ad614bd01\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022b06e332e5f84415b88a092f7f597e15d\u0022\u003EHon MARK MITCHELL\u003C/span\u003E: Sorry, what was that? Simon Watts\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000133\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00229c069cdb-968c-4f11-b126-92f9c655148b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00222739e1e1fca34b2e8678eb04c9e8eff5\u0022\u003EShanan Halbert\u003C/span\u003E: \u2014would want a health response.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000134\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002248a02a21-c1ac-4159-8789-485ad614bd01\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002260fe6e6947fb4290801bde86929bb731\u0022\u003EHon MARK MITCHELL\u003C/span\u003E: So I\u2019ve just had a response here from one of the new members. I\u2019m sorry, I don\u2019t know your name, but it\u2019s a good question.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000135\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00227eda667dc2fc41f6a9f40d8fa33d1523\u0022\u003EHon Member\u003C/span\u003E: You know his name.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000136\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002248a02a21-c1ac-4159-8789-485ad614bd01\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00220a6c30bd45a049b3808720c7de0e734e\u0022\u003EHon MARK MITCHELL\u003C/span\u003E: No, I\u2019m genuine. I\u2019m sorry, I don\u2019t. But it\u2019s a good question. The member for Northcote\u2014Shanan. So congratulations and it\u2019s a good question. He said a health response\u2014let\u2019s have a health response. So if we\u2019re going to have a debate in this Chamber that this is a health response and this is a health-related policy, then put up the evidence and the data that shows us that less people will use drugs and there\u2019ll be less harm, because in this debate, not one of you\u2014take a call, take a call and convince me and show me that, actually, you\u2019ve got the data that shows that there\u2019s less use and there\u2019s less harm. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000137\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002248a02a21-c1ac-4159-8789-485ad614bd01\u0022\u003EI\u2019ll make a prediction\u2014I\u2019ll make a prediction\u2014that this summer season at these concerts there\u2019s going to be more use and there\u2019s going to be more harm. And I\u2019ll make another prediction, because what we\u2019ve done is we\u2019ve created a safe zone and we\u2019ve incubated drug dealers from prosecution. You might raise your eyebrows. You might say, \u201COh, he\u2019s being alarmist.\u201D No, I\u2019m not being alarmist. I\u2019m just providing you with feedback from our front-line responders, the people like the police. I don\u2019t know if you\u2019ve been and spoken with the police or whether you\u2019ve spoken with our paramedics. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000138\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002255d0b7a4-a2c9-4c38-9b77-475311a48a89\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002265f8614bf6d6404c8274c71c882f39fd\u0022\u003ESimeon Brown\u003C/span\u003E: They haven\u2019t been consulted.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000139\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002248a02a21-c1ac-4159-8789-485ad614bd01\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a62170c4777345aebf884fdabb7192bb\u0022\u003EHon MARK MITCHELL\u003C/span\u003E: I don\u2019t know if they\u2019ve been consulted on this legislation. Apparently, I\u2019m told that they haven\u2019t been. They are the ones that pick up the pieces. When we\u2019re off on our summer holidays at the beach, they\u2019re the ones that are actually picking up the pieces. They\u2019re the ones that have got the kids vomiting in a comatose, semi-comatose, state. They\u2019re the ones trying to contact parents or taking them to the hospital or trying to track down where the drugs are coming from and shut the supply chain down. They\u2019re the ones that are actually dealing with it. Surely, on a piece of legislation like this, we should have actually been listening to them. We should have been listening to what they had to say and their feedback. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000140\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225bbd9f26-fdb0-4b85-a836-0fc46e1bba3c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022e318285ecb964d8a9fab304e1083be78\u0022\u003EHon Dr David Clark\u003C/span\u003E: Police have been supportive of a health response.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000141\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002248a02a21-c1ac-4159-8789-485ad614bd01\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022cdac48a36f07480286b29439e807227c\u0022\u003EHon MARK MITCHELL\u003C/span\u003E: So what did they say? We\u2019ve got the Hon David Clark in the House. Let\u2019s listen\u2014let\u2019s listen. Let\u2019s get some feedback. Take a call and give us the feedback on what they said, because I can predict something right now: you are going to have\u2014I\u2019m getting the wind-up message. So you are going to have drug dealers\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000142\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dbaac12b-3efa-4d95-a08d-f0f637a48bab\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022b25f171c061347c3b12c75d8c44c66cd\u0022\u003EChl\u00F6e Swarbrick\u003C/span\u003E: You have them now.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000143\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002248a02a21-c1ac-4159-8789-485ad614bd01\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022c664d6ed447c49358cc9c63abde4d3fc\u0022\u003EHon MARK MITCHELL\u003C/span\u003E: \u2014that are going to come\u2014no, you\u2019re going to have drug dealers now that target concerts, because you know why? They are now incubated. Concert goers and drug dealers now will freely ply their trade. Not only will they freely ply their trade; their pills will actually be quality tested. So they\u2019re going to have them quality tested and then people are going to go in there, they\u2019re going to consume them, and they\u2019re going to have the results of drug use and drug overdoses. That\u2019s what\u2019s going to happen. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000144\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002248a02a21-c1ac-4159-8789-485ad614bd01\u0022\u003ESo this bill is not a good bill. It\u2019s not a safe bill. I\u2019m pleased that it\u2019s going to have to come back to the House, but I am concerned and I do flag\u2014and I hope that we\u2019ll all be watching to make sure this doesn\u2019t happen\u2014that there will be an increase in use of these drugs. There\u2019ll be a new insidious pressure put on young people that currently say, \u201COur Government says that it\u2019s illegal and we shouldn\u2019t be taking them.\u201D, and there\u2019s going to be an increase in harm, talking to the health policy. That\u2019s what I\u2019ll be watching very closely this summer. Thank you, Mr Speaker.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022e60c1237-5e2d-4d0a-9678-ab10db67d1b7\u0022 data-id=\u0022b76b3cbd013d427989a38dcf9060fbd4\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000145\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e60c1237-5e2d-4d0a-9678-ab10db67d1b7\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022b76b3cbd013d427989a38dcf9060fbd4\u0022\u003EANGIE WARREN-CLARK (Labour):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Mr Speaker. I\u2019m not quite sure how we are incubating the drug dealers, however\u2014however. I\u2019d also like to respond to the Hon Simon Bridges. I\u2019m sorry, I\u2019ve never been to Rhythm and Vines. I have never been to One Love, our own local concert, and\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000146\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022badb0a39-849c-462a-b32f-77fc017c9fc2\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00228c603a667e5f4c28ae5766cd83103401\u0022\u003EHon Simon Bridges\u003C/span\u003E: I\u2019ll go with you. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000147\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e60c1237-5e2d-4d0a-9678-ab10db67d1b7\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00224de959be6a084f21a929b08a738d7e51\u0022\u003EANGIE WARREN-CLARK\u003C/span\u003E: Oh, all right, it\u2019s a date, Simon Bridges. It\u2019s a date\u2014One Love. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000148\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e60c1237-5e2d-4d0a-9678-ab10db67d1b7\u0022\u003EI would like to take a very quick call to refer to this bill. As we know, it is about harm reduction. What we all wish for our children and the thing that we teach our children is that we very much hope that they will not go down this path, but what we do know is that at a certain point our young people make their own decisions. Those decisions are being made with their peers in mind, and, yes, there is peer pressure. What we really want is for kids to say no, but what we do know is that they don\u2019t\u2014that they actually take the opportunity to try things out\u2014and this bill is merely, simply about making it safer for those young people to try things. We are not encouraging them to do so. It is still illegal to take these drugs and to possess these drugs, but what we want is safety for these young people. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000149\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e60c1237-5e2d-4d0a-9678-ab10db67d1b7\u0022\u003EI\u2019d also like to say very quickly a big thankyou to the volunteers who go to these concerts, who spend day after day and evenings in hot, stinky tents where they\u2019ve got people, and they have those conversations which talk about the harm that can occur when they take these drugs. Whether they are having the ingredients that the person who purchased them wants to take or not, they\u2019re having those conversations and they are persuading, or talking with people and saying, \u201CThis is the harm that will occur. Do you need help? Do you want an alternative to taking this?\u201D That, in essence, is what this bill does. I commend it to the House. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022dbaac12b-3efa-4d95-a08d-f0f637a48bab\u0022 data-id=\u002278ecb747a2f7448483ea5300cecbf83b\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000150\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dbaac12b-3efa-4d95-a08d-f0f637a48bab\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002278ecb747a2f7448483ea5300cecbf83b\u0022\u003ECHL\u00D6E SWARBRICK (Green\u2014Auckland Central):\u003C/span\u003E E te M\u0101ngai, t\u0113n\u0101 koe. T\u0113n\u0101 koutou e te Whare. It is an absolute pleasure to rise and speak on this, the third reading of this bill, which will legalise festival drug-checking services. I have lost the name of the actual bill, but none the less that\u2019s exactly what it does. I want everybody in the House and everybody who\u2019s at home and all those who are in the gallery today to just imagine a scenario, to paint a picture the likes of what the Hon Dr Nick Smith did: you walk into a festival\u2014there\u2019s a music festival, there\u2019s music going; I\u2019m not sure what level of musicality is required, Dr Nick Smith, but none the less there is music going\u2014you line up, and you\u2019re in line for a socially acceptable drug. This socially acceptable drug has been tested for toxicity, and it is licensed, and it is regulated. You\u2019re in line, and you get this drug, and that drug is alcohol. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000151\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dbaac12b-3efa-4d95-a08d-f0f637a48bab\u0022\u003EWe\u2019ve been doing it for a really long time now, in terms of legally regulating substances to reduce harm. I absolutely will stand here in this House today, as I have multiple times before, and say that we need to do a whole lot better when it comes to regulating the harm that alcohol presently causes in our communities, because there\u2019s a spectrum of approaches that you can take to any given substance. The likes of this legislation recognise, as I hope other legislation throughout this term recognises, that a substance is one thing, but the legal response that we have to that substance can either increase or decrease that harm. So, if the National Party want to talk about decreasing harm when it comes to substances, I\u2019d absolutely invite them to collaborate with me on reducing the harm that alcohol can cause by removing alcohol advertising, glamorisation, and sponsorship. There\u2019s a challenge for you.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000152\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dbaac12b-3efa-4d95-a08d-f0f637a48bab\u0022\u003EMoving forward, the Hon Simon Bridges asked me to speak about the deaths that have been experienced in other countries, other jurisdictions, and states such as in the likes of Australia. There he spoke primarily to the instances in New South Wales, where young people\u2014and, actually, there\u2019s been a lot of talk about young people, about young ravers in particular, but I know that there are folks out there, such as the journalist Russell Brown, who want me to make a shout-out to the elder ravers, because there\u2019s been a bit of age discrimination. There are a number of people who are experienced and have been engaging in illicit substances for a while now, many of whom have been doing so under the shadows of, effectively, the black market. But we\u2019ll get back to that point later. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000153\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dbaac12b-3efa-4d95-a08d-f0f637a48bab\u0022\u003ESo the Hon Simon Bridges was asking about those deaths, which have resulted\u2014again, primarily, not necessarily\u2014when it comes to ecstasy, from a lack of impurities, but from excessive use of that substance. All of this has happened, I might add, without festival drug-checking services being legal. That is without people having access to the information and the education that festival drug-checking services provide. Notably, as well, New South Wales has experienced a number of deaths at festivals without those drug-checking services, which has led the chief coroner there to recommend the introduction of drug-checking services to end unnecessary, needless deaths. I also want to respond to the points raised by, particularly, the Hon Mark Mitchell around the likes of paramedics. Again, in the UK, where this has been legal now for around seven years\u2014since 2013\u2014there have been 95 percent fewer hospitalisations as a result of legal festival drug-checking services. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000154\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dbaac12b-3efa-4d95-a08d-f0f637a48bab\u0022\u003ESo here\u2019s the simple problem that this bill, this soon-to-be law, will fix: section 12 of the Misuse of Drugs Act 1975 makes it a crime to knowingly provide a place, an event, or a space for people to consume illicit substances. By virtue of currently providing drug-checking services on their premises or at their event, it could be argued that a festival organiser, that a bar owner, or a club owner is, effectively, providing tacit endorsement for the consumption of illicit substances on their premises. That is the legal grey area, the quandary, if you will, that NGOs like KnowYourStuffNZ have been operating in for the past six-odd years\u2014risking criminal prosecution, as those festival organisers have been too. And I really do hope that the National Party go and speak to those festival organisers, who have, actually, actively over the past several years, come to me behind the scenes. I\u2019ve had conversations with them about the moral rock and a hard place that they are between, where they do not want to be breaking the law by providing services like KnowYourStuffNZ whilst section 12 was in effect but they also don\u2019t want to be responsible for hosting an event that a young person ends up using illicit substances at and dying. They want this law to go through so that they can reduce harm. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000155\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dbaac12b-3efa-4d95-a08d-f0f637a48bab\u0022\u003ESo the other thing that the Hon Mark Mitchell was saying is about the message that this sends to young people. First things first: I\u2019m not sure which young people he\u2019s spoken to about the messages that they care about that the Government is sending, because quite typically it\u2019s young people actually doing the opposite of what those in authority are saying they should do. So, first and foremost, with regard to the messages that are presently being sent from a prohibition type of approach, they\u2019re \u201CDo it secretly. Just do it over there. We don\u2019t really want to know about it, but we kind of tacitly know that it is occurring right now.\u201D And all of that has actually been acknowledged, ironically, by the National Party. They know that it exists. I have constantly laid out the challenge to them to propose the alternative, but they keep saying, \u201COh, this is happening, and the Government wants to acknowledge the reality that this is happening, but we don\u2019t think that that\u2019s a good thing.\u201D Well, what is your alternative? Please outline how you want to reduce harm, because so far all I\u2019ve heard is that you want to be an impediment to improvements in the law\u2014to looking to the research, looking to the evidence, looking at what\u2019s happening internationally. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000156\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002244b6e4a80a4b4d14b2d0e939787cf58e\u0022\u003EHon Dr Nick Smith\u003C/span\u003E: Drug courts. Improved rehab.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000157\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dbaac12b-3efa-4d95-a08d-f0f637a48bab\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00220aaed72d11bf4eef8b06090705d2f05a\u0022\u003ECHL\u00D6E SWARBRICK\u003C/span\u003E: The Hon Nick Smith, drug courts occur after the crime has been committed. It does not actually help whatsoever when it comes to people\u2019s consumption habits. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000158\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dbaac12b-3efa-4d95-a08d-f0f637a48bab\u0022\u003EOn top of that, I also just want to challenge the National Party Opposition here. Alongside the challenge that I have laid down with regard to collaborating on alcohol law changes, there also is, evidently\u2014as they\u2019ve identified, interestingly enough\u2014a need to change the Misuse of Drugs Act 1975, because it\u2019s demonstrably unfit for purpose. I\u2019m really interested, though, in whether the National Party just thinks that we should make the illegal drugs more illegal, as though people who are currently contemplating whether they consume a substance are cross-referencing it to the Misuse of Drugs Act 1975 and thinking about, you know, \u201CDo I want nine years? Do I want life?\u201D The Misuse of Drugs Act has been found time and again to simply not stop people from using illicit substances, and, as I referred to in my speeches last night, we have a situation where the countries that have taken more hard-line approaches have not got rid of these substances. And, in fact, those that have taken the most hard-line approaches, such as Singapore, have amongst the least independently verifiable data on drug consumption habits in those jurisdictions. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000159\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dbaac12b-3efa-4d95-a08d-f0f637a48bab\u0022\u003EWhen it comes to debating what this health approach actually looks like, I think we need to acknowledge the reality that, over the past several years, we have seen constant carve-outs of the Misuse of Drugs Act 1975. We\u2019ve seen it for medicinal cannabis. We\u2019ve seen it for hemp. We\u2019ve seen it for drug-checking services now, and we\u2019ve seen it for the section 7 changes that have been alluded to time and again during this debate\u2014which, I note, the National Party also opposed but seemed to invoke multiple times during debates around cannabis legalisation over this past election cycle. When are we going to admit that this Frankenstein of a law is simply not serving its purpose? \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000160\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dbaac12b-3efa-4d95-a08d-f0f637a48bab\u0022\u003EWell, we have the 2011 Law Commission review, which says exactly that: the Misuse of Drugs Act is demonstrably unfit for purpose; decriminalise substances and provide a meaningful health approach. We also have two reports to Labour Party Ministers. Interestingly, the same Minister who now is the Minister of Health was formerly the Minister of Justice, where he received a report known as Turuki! Turuki!, the Safe and Effective Justice Programme Advisory Group review, which recommended looking to legalise all substances to regulate that harm. And just to really drive this home to the Hon Nick Smith, this doesn\u2019t look like retail shops. I\u2019d highly recommend that you look at the 1990 approach of Switzerland when it came to regulating heroin to reduce the harm thereof. There also is He Ara Oranga, the mental health and addiction inquiry, which said, again, we need to stop criminalising people for using these substances. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000161\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dbaac12b-3efa-4d95-a08d-f0f637a48bab\u0022\u003ESo, when the National Party genuinely want to engage in good faith, and if they genuinely will, then I\u2019d love to start a working group with you. I\u2019d love to just get on with the dang work that New Zealanders expect and anticipate from those who have the privilege of sitting in this Chamber. Quite frankly, I\u2019m stoked to be delivering my last speech on this bill, because we are going to get it through and we are going to have to stop listening to the high-horse moralising from the National Party, who, by the sounds of the way that they are talking about substances, have never engaged in them. So I\u2019d love to hear how the National Party seeks to resolve these issues. Kia ora.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022 data-id=\u0022cd86a054405b4d388b0f22cc93f25b38\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000162\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022cd86a054405b4d388b0f22cc93f25b38\u0022\u003EDAVID SEYMOUR (Leader\u2014ACT):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Madam Speaker. I rise on behalf of the ACT Party in support of this third reading of the Drug and Substance Checking Legislation Bill. I want to reprise some of the arguments that have been given in favour of this legislation and also address some of the arguments that have arisen during the debate over the three readings and in the committee stage. I finally want to just comment on what this debate means for New Zealand politics, the priorities of the Government, and the different positions that some political parties have taken on it.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000163\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003EFirst of all, it\u2019s important to recognise what this legislation is and isn\u2019t. All it does is temporarily allow voluntary organisations, filled with people who want to help others reduce harm, go about their business without the fear of prosecution that exists in the current legal grey area around pill testing. It allows people who are hosting music festivals, concerts, and so on to have people who offer a testing service for drugs to be able to be on their premises without fear of legal repercussions; that is all this legislation does. All it does is remove the threat of prosecution for those activities. It does not remove the prohibition on supply and possession of classified illegal drugs. They remain illegal, and people who supply, possess, and use them remain in the same legal jeopardy, which they were under before this legislation came about. It\u2019s only for testing.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000164\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003EThis legislation does not place any onus on the taxpayer to fund pill-testing services; it doesn\u2019t do that.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000165\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002296eeac89f6a44d78908fd5a275295e7f\u0022\u003EHon Dr Nick Smith\u003C/span\u003E: It will.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000166\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00224a67cc676bcf4ae4addbc3f6039b294f\u0022\u003EDAVID SEYMOUR\u003C/span\u003E: It doesn\u2019t contemplate taxpayer funding. And I hear Nick Smith from the National Party saying, \u201CBut it will.\u201D Let\u2019s think about the logic of that. If that\u2019s really the logic of the National Party today, that we shouldn\u2019t legalise anything because anything we let people do might end up being funded by the taxpayer, then no wonder we need the ACT Party to stand up for taxpayers in this country. Because the ACT Party says that something can be legal and not actually require taxpayer funding. Isn\u2019t it great that we still have a party in this House standing for that position? So this is not about taxpayer funding of pill testing.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000167\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003EAnd, finally, it is not about the encouragement of drug taking. The question that any sensible person should ask when confronted with an empirical question is: where\u2019s the evidence? Now, if the opponents of this legislation had stood up and said, \u201CHere is a survey of countries who have introduced pill testing, and, on balance, we can show, using robust statistics, that harm is increased, because not only do you have more people using drugs but the reduction in people using bad drugs is less than the increase.\u201D\u2014if they could show there was an increase of harm, using robust empirical evidence\u2014then maybe that would be a justification for continuing the ban on voluntary organisations helping people know what they are putting in their body, maybe that would justify the Government continuing to prohibit people helping each other make better, more informed decisions, maybe that would be a justification, but I have not seen any member of this House who\u2019s opposed to this legislation get up and show the robust empirical evidence that this change to the law will increase harm. They haven\u2019t done it, and that, as I\u2019ve heard in the barracking from some members, is to lose the argument. So it\u2019s not about more people taking drugs; it\u2019s about reducing the harm from people who are taking them.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000168\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003EWhat this legislation is about is something quintessentially Kiwi. It\u2019s about Kiwi values: that when we see problems in our community\u2014and there are problems in our community\u2014people band together and form organisations and help each other.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000169\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002255d0b7a4-a2c9-4c38-9b77-475311a48a89\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022e15bcc4058614b51b85de4bc3f2273d3\u0022\u003ESimeon Brown\u003C/span\u003E: No.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000170\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00220f0fcfecb4924334bed30f9995415f44\u0022\u003EDAVID SEYMOUR\u003C/span\u003E: These should be, Simeon Brown, conservative values. Simeon Brown, if he knew what was good for him, would be standing up and saying, \u201CI actually support people banding together and forming\u201D\u2014as one of his heroes would say\u2014\u201Cthe little platoons of Edmund Burke to go out and help other people solve problems for themselves.\u201D But the problem with Simeon Brown is he doesn\u2019t know his own intellectual tradition, let alone anyone else\u2019s. We should be in favour of people like KnowYourStuffNZ getting together and helping out others make informed decisions. That should be the conservative position on this legislation, but, sadly, it is not, at least not on the heart of the National Party.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000171\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003EI want to say to people who have questioned the use of urgency that this is one of the examples of urgency being used for the right reason. Urgency exists in our Standing Orders that\u2019ve been passed down to us through the ages by Parliaments\u201452 of them before this 53rd one\u2014so that we can make better laws. Urgency should be used when there is time sensitivity about a law. Well, the use of these recreational drugs in music festivals is seasonal. I defy any member of this House to tell me they\u2019ve been to an outdoor music festival in June. My birthday\u2019s in June; I know all about the weather in that month. There is a seasonal component here. Now, personally, I wish the Government would use urgency to help out the horticultural industry by letting in some Recognised Seasonal Employer scheme workers. We\u2019ll talk a bit about priorities later. But the fact is there is actually urgency, not just some political prerogative or need to avoid scrutiny, there is some urgency here.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000172\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003EThe next thing I\u2019d say is that this is a time-limited piece of legislation, and it is actually removing a prohibition, removing a Government prohibition, a restriction on people\u2019s freedom, and I think that the bar for increasing freedom and reducing intervention in people\u2019s lives should always be lower than, for example, banning contracts with only five days\u2019 sick pay or increasing the amount of tax taken above a certain threshold. But this is not a bad law to put through under urgency, particularly when it is time limited.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000173\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003ENow, I\u2019ll make a couple of comments about what the debate around this bill says about the state of New Zealand politics today. What it says about the Labour Party is that their priority is party pills, not the horticultural industry. It\u2019s not any of the issues around reconnecting safely with the rest of the COVID world where possible. This is the first piece of legislation that they\u2019ve put through in this Parliament, and I think people will reflect on that. It\u2019s not about Pharmac for all those people short of drugs; it\u2019s actually about people testing illegal drugs. But that is the Labour Party\u2019s choice of priority, and people will reflect on that.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000174\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003EThe National Party chooses to oppose something that I can tell them many of their potential constituents are worried about because their kids are good kids. They know that they are going off, and they know that even good kids take risks. This is an opportunity for the risks they take to be safer. Christopher Luxon knows that because he\u2019s a sensible parent. He knows his kids are good kids, but he also worries about what some of their friends might get up to, and he wants them to do it in a safer environment.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000175\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003EThen there\u2019s the Green Party, who are pretty relaxed about people selling and buying drugs, but, you know, I look at the Green Party\u2019s economic policies and the problem is that they\u2019re trying to stop people buying and selling just about anything else. Whatever it is you try to trade in in the New Zealand economy, the Green Party will have a tax or a regulation to try and prevent you, unless you\u2019re planting crystals, in which case they\u2019ll give you a subsidy to hurry it along, and that is a sad set of priorities.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000176\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003EThat leaves the ACT Party standing on principle for a freer and more compassionate society, where people can make better and more dignified choices about how they live their lives, in cooperation with each other. In short, as Margaret Thatcher liked to say, we stand for freedom under the rule of law. This is an example of a piece of legislation where the ACT Party has come to a position with our small but growing caucus and decided that we should support a more compassionate, more informed society that allows people to reduce the risk and harms they face, in cooperation with each other. I commend this bill to the House. Thank you, Madam Speaker.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002295945ace-51e8-4dbc-a0e3-c19f4ed99ed9\u0022 data-id=\u00226b8e2304b4154a9983d53e21d456345d\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000177\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002295945ace-51e8-4dbc-a0e3-c19f4ed99ed9\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00226b8e2304b4154a9983d53e21d456345d\u0022\u003EANAHILA KANONGATA\u2019A-SUISUIKI (Labour):\u003C/span\u003E Te Mana Whakaw\u0101, I want to take this opportunity to acknowledge you\u2014yesterday I had forgotten to do that. Thank you for also pronouncing my name correctly. So I look forward to future pronunciations from the rest of us. It is an honour and a privilege to speak on this Drug and Substance Checking Legislation Bill. I want to take this opportunity to acknowledge the Minister of Health, the Minister\u2019s leadership in bringing this bill into urgency\u2014because it is. It\u2019s the reason for the season. We are going into the festive season, where we are having all these festivals and we want every person that attends the festivals to be safe. The Minister also had the insightful\u2014we heard the other side talk about how there needs to be a contest of evidence, that it didn\u2019t go to select committee, da da da, da da da; well, actually, they have the opportunity to do that next year, when the Minister brings it back. So I want to acknowledge the Minister for that. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000178\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002295945ace-51e8-4dbc-a0e3-c19f4ed99ed9\u0022\u003ESo, just to remind us that this bill ensures that our young people who attend festivals have access to drug testing and the opportunity to make an informed choice, and, for the organisers\u2014if they find a dangerous substance in these drugs\u2014that they use social media, that they use every method that they have to warn festival goers and to warn the country of effects of the dangerous drug that\u2019s circulating. Also, we know history tells us that M\u0101ori and Pasifika people are more likely to be arrested around New Zealand for certain offences. This bill ensures there\u2019s no risk from prosecution. The evidence taken at the testing will not be used to prosecute anybody who uses the testing services. I want to again commend this side of the House, on my right\u2014that we can all work together in this House, except for that side, together on something that will add value to the safety of all New Zealanders. Te Mana Whakaw\u0101, tautoko ahau ki t\u0113nei pire ki te Whare. Kia ora. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002255d0b7a4-a2c9-4c38-9b77-475311a48a89\u0022 data-id=\u0022e174366bac8a4c9081354b9703221cf9\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000179\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002255d0b7a4-a2c9-4c38-9b77-475311a48a89\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022e174366bac8a4c9081354b9703221cf9\u0022\u003ESIMEON BROWN (National\u2014Pakuranga):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Madam Speaker, for the opportunity to take a short call on the Drug and Substance Checking Legislation Bill at its third reading\u2014and what an interesting debate that we\u2019ve had on this piece of legislation. I find the contribution from my Green colleague Chl\u00F6e Swarbrick to be Trumpian, to say the least, when she won\u2019t answer the question whether she\u2019ll accept the referendum result on marijuana. Her speech seemed to spend more time talking about her vision of more drugs in this world, not less, and she doesn\u2019t seem to understand that no means no. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000180\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002255d0b7a4-a2c9-4c38-9b77-475311a48a89\u0022\u003EWe also had a lecture from David Seymour in the ACT Party trying to lecture us on conservatism. Well, I would encourage him to consider this study by Andrew Groves, which said that there have been no studies which have fully tested in a controlled way whether pill testing reduces harm, and the actual conservative approach is actually to look at the evidence to see whether there is a need for change. There have been no studies which have fully tested in a controlled way whether pill testing actually reduces harm, and that is why here in the National Party we\u2019ve been very clear that, actually, this should have gone to a select committee to actually look at the evidence, look at the facts, and actually have submissions and the public have their say. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000181\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002255d0b7a4-a2c9-4c38-9b77-475311a48a89\u0022\u003EThis bill will not reduce harm. The evidence from overseas is clear. The evidence in the United Kingdom is clear that where they have had legal drug-testing at music festivals, the amount of people using MDMA, ecstasy, has increased from 1.2 percent of the population to 1.7 percent\u2014an almost 50 percent increase in usage. Secondly, in Australia, we have seen that it is not the impurities in these substances but it is the ecstasy itself which is doing the killing. A University of New South Wales study of 392 ecstasy deaths between 2001 and 2016 found no deaths in those 392 deaths from impurities or contaminants. The deaths came from the use of the drug itself, and so what this bill is doing is giving young people the green light to go ahead and it\u2019s saying this drug is safe. Well, I\u2019m sorry, these drugs are not safe; these drugs are deadly, and what we are saying is we\u2019re giving them a little ticket, which could be their ticket to their death. That is something which I think is incredibly dangerous, and we will see more harm from this law change. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000182\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002255d0b7a4-a2c9-4c38-9b77-475311a48a89\u0022\u003EThere has been no evidence given from the departmental statement. The departmental statement on this bill is absolutely bereft of detail. The only people consulted have been KnowYourStuffNZ, the organisation in this country which has a direct interest in this issue, and the departmental statement does say that this will put the cost on to the Department of Health to have to fund this activity here in New Zealand. So I reject what my friend David Seymour says. This will have a cost on the taxpayer. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000183\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00225316ea51987a4937bd5ddbbd73871672\u0022\u003EDavid Seymour\u003C/span\u003E: What cost?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000184\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002255d0b7a4-a2c9-4c38-9b77-475311a48a89\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00224ed0b4dd072d45b99eb7f076b912c613\u0022\u003ESIMEON BROWN\u003C/span\u003E: And I wish he had read\u2014I would suggest you read the departmental statement, because it\u2019s probably good you read that before you come down here and make statements which are opposite to that. So, the National Party will be opposing this legislation.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022c21f4beb-20c4-4b12-bc6f-fdc931e2dc96\u0022 data-id=\u002202ba7ea056ea44209c50a4284df31d49\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000185\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c21f4beb-20c4-4b12-bc6f-fdc931e2dc96\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002202ba7ea056ea44209c50a4284df31d49\u0022\u003EGINNY ANDERSEN (Labour\u2014Hutt South):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you very much, Madam Speaker. It\u2019s good to take another call on the Drug and Substance Checking Legislation Bill. As I\u2019ve listened to the debate as it\u2019s progressed over the last day or so, it\u2019s, essentially, been a debate on harm minimisation. So we know that any drug strategy or any approach to illicit substances has three areas: one being supply control, which is, for example, police action to remove drugs; the second being demand control, which is educating people about the harms of drugs; and the third being harm minimisation, and that is to acknowledge that there is a level of drug use that occurs, and to enable that to happen as safely as possible so people don\u2019t die.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000186\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c21f4beb-20c4-4b12-bc6f-fdc931e2dc96\u0022\u003ENow, the alternate\u2014the argument that we\u2019ve heard against harm minimisation from those members opposite\u2014is to turn a blind eye. It\u2019s to say it\u2019s illegal, it\u2019s not happening, we don\u2019t want to know about it\u2014by enabling safety and lives to be saved, we are somehow implicitly condoning illegal drug use. So that\u2019s where the crux of the debate lies, and it lies right across many countries. We\u2019re not the only one having this discussion.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000187\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c21f4beb-20c4-4b12-bc6f-fdc931e2dc96\u0022\u003EThis issue, I remember, was first raised by the Law Commission, right back under the last National Government when the Misuse of Drugs Act was first being reviewed. And, at that time, under the past National Government, it was declined, again, for those very reasons: it was perceived as not being able to be proven as reducing harm. It\u2019s difficult to look at that evidence when it\u2019s currently illegal, but we do know for a fact that those people who have had a pill tested and have been told that it is not in fact the substance they thought they were purchasing, they discard it. We know that happens. So we do know that it has an impact upon what people are ingesting.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000188\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c21f4beb-20c4-4b12-bc6f-fdc931e2dc96\u0022\u003EMy concern, to conclude, is that what this split in ideology has actually demonstrated is the split within the National caucus, because straight away when this idea was first touted by the then Minister of Police Stuart Nash, we heard the spokesperson from National in support of pill testing\u2014in strong support\u2014and what we\u2019ve seen since then is the diminishing liberal voice within the National caucus, which has been subsequently subsumed by a very strong Puritan view that everything bad is wrong, and rule it out, and don\u2019t talk about it. And that will come at the peril of the next generation.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022 data-id=\u0022df79e9a1187c4de1b91411732cdb7ec0\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000189\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022df79e9a1187c4de1b91411732cdb7ec0\u0022\u003EDAVID SEYMOUR (Leader\u2014ACT):\u003C/span\u003E Point of order. I\u2019m very conscious that we\u2019re about to debate the Holidays (Increasing Sick Leave) Amendment Bill. The bill refers to regulatory impact analysis, though there be none provided on the Table. Now, members, of course, can find it online, but I just wonder if you could inquire: are we still putting all the documents on the Table, because it\u2019s pretty important stuff for people to be able to read. It doesn\u2019t appear to be there, unless I\u2019ve missed it\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000190\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00224a25943b-cb3b-49c3-bd10-74316fae17f1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022b198b74230ee4456941b53ba4665d2a2\u0022\u003EASSISTANT SPEAKER (Hon Jacqui Dean)\u003C/span\u003E: OK. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000191\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a8c7a6bf9ca145399720d96d511ae258\u0022\u003EDAVID SEYMOUR\u003C/span\u003E: \u2014and I wonder if the Minister might be able to say if he\u2019s provided it. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00224a25943b-cb3b-49c3-bd10-74316fae17f1\u0022 data-id=\u0022ee0dbdd49cd9454881ba1fedd1f358af\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000192\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00224a25943b-cb3b-49c3-bd10-74316fae17f1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022ee0dbdd49cd9454881ba1fedd1f358af\u0022\u003EASSISTANT SPEAKER (Hon Jacqui Dean)\u003C/span\u003E: Thank you for that. I\u2019ll just take a bit of advice. Thank you to the member. So the matter\u2019s not been called yet. It\u2019s not on the Order Paper. It\u2019s part of the urgency motion, and so the matter will be tabled when the item is under consideration. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022 data-id=\u0022e8cd8d2449fb41379c58ca7706ad5e6f\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000193\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022e8cd8d2449fb41379c58ca7706ad5e6f\u0022\u003EHon Dr NICK SMITH (National):\u003C/span\u003E There are three key concerns that I have in respect of the Drug and Substance Checking Legislation Bill, the very first bill to be passed under this new Parliament. The first concern is that this is a law that\u2019s being passed under urgency and it only arrived yesterday. What an awful precedent we\u2019re setting with the very first bill\u2014to ram it through overnight\u2014and I say to all those new members of Parliament whose job it was to come here and scrutinise legislation that they are neglecting their duty. I bet you the bulk of them have not even read the 34 clauses of this bill.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000194\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003EMy second concern is a lack of respect for the referendum in which New Zealanders rejected the liberalisation of our laws. I have to say to Chl\u00F6e Swarbrick and the Green Party that they sound horribly like President Trump in respect of their view of the referendum result. New Zealanders said no to liberalising drug laws, and that has not been registered either by the Government or by the Green Party.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000195\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003EThe third part for me is a contradiction of mandate. There was only one commitment from Labour in their manifesto on the issue of drugs, and that was to respect the outcome of the referendum. Andrew Little, prior to the election, was specifically asked if drug testing would be legalised by a Labour Government. He said it would not, and the very first bill we have contradicts that position. Now, the key premise on which this bill is based is that people are dying because of impurities in illegal drugs being used at music festivals. Here\u2019s the evidence: 392 deaths in Australia from party pills; not one from impurities\u2014not one. Every one of those deaths was caused by the ecstasy, the cocaine, or the P, not from any impurities.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000196\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003EMy last point is this, and it\u2019s about priorities. It is a matter of evidence and fact that 107 New Zealanders died last year as a consequence of drug-impaired driving. We on this side of the House have tried and tried and tried to get the Parliament to pass a law to introduce roadside drug testing, and the Labour and Green parties have come up with every excuse not to progress that. In contrast, there has not been a single death in New Zealand from the use of party pills. We have repeatedly asked at each stage of this debate why the Government is giving enormous priority to ramming through legislation over the issue of party pills when there has been no documented evidence of death in New Zealand but is dragging its feet and doing everything it can to slow the introduction of roadside drug testing, something that we know will save dozens of lives\u2014it\u2019s costing two deaths every single week. The truth is that this Government is soft on drugs, and the contradiction in its approach to the issue of party pills and testing and in respect of the issue of roadside deaths actually says that it\u2019s just about its agenda of wanting to soften the laws.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000197\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003EMy very last point is that I don\u2019t doubt that there is a uniformity of concern in this Parliament about protecting young people from the use of drugs. The difference on this side of the House is that we say that actions speak louder than words. Members opposite can say to young people as much as they like, \u201COh, we don\u2019t really think you should take ecstasy or cocaine or P; it\u2019s just that we want to test it to make sure it is safe.\u201D Young people are not foolish. They know it is actions that actually speak louder than words, and the action of saying that these pills have been tested and they are safe runs a very real risk of increasing harm. I say to members opposite that, if there is an increase in use and an increase in fatalities or harm from this bill, it will rest on your conscience for rushing through legislation on an issue that poses a very real risk to New Zealand.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022a1f7bbd1-b6ae-41c0-963b-dbe1251f5540\u0022 data-id=\u002297c114046e2140049e0cdcad72195592\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000198\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a1f7bbd1-b6ae-41c0-963b-dbe1251f5540\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002297c114046e2140049e0cdcad72195592\u0022\u003EKIERAN McANULTY (Labour\u2014Wairarapa):\u003C/span\u003E The honourable member Nick Smith wishes to talk about contradictions. So do I. Let\u2019s talk about the contradictions of the position of the National Party on this bill. Here we have one faction of the National Party, such as it is, led by Simon Bridges and Simeon Brown and the Hon Dr Nick Smith, saying that the National Party opposes this bill, and yet their leader goes on TV and says that, personally, she does not have an issue with it. How is that for contradictions? \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000199\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a1f7bbd1-b6ae-41c0-963b-dbe1251f5540\u0022\u003EWhen the leader of a political party that likes to frame themselves as that side of the House\u2014but I\u2019d like to point out that we not only have the National Party on that side of the House now; we also have the M\u0101ori Party\u2014welcome\u2014and we also have the ACT Party, the Green Party, and some of the Labour Party. So it is not that side of the House that opposes this bill; it is the National Party\u2014well, half of it, I suspect. Half of the National Party, or perhaps slightly half. If the leader of the National Party cannot lead them into a position that every other party in this Parliament holds in support of this bill, I think that we are in for a very interesting summer. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000200\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a1f7bbd1-b6ae-41c0-963b-dbe1251f5540\u0022\u003EThe reason that the vast majority of this Parliament supports this bill is because we accept a very simple principle: no one wants to see people take drugs, no one wants to see consumption increase, but we accept that consumption happens. We accept that consumption will happen over summer, and let\u2019s take measures to ensure that we increase the safety of that behaviour. That\u2019s what this bill is about, and I think it speaks volumes that not only are the National Party divided but they are choosing this issue\u2014an issue of safety, primarily for our young\u2014on which to desperately clutch at headlines to try and get themselves into the papers. I think it\u2019s a shame, and I am very proud to commend this bill to the House. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca id=\u0022511f1831783443bba0d90e92214f1916\u0022 name=\u0022division\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EA party vote was called for on the question, That the Drug and Substance Checking Legislation Bill be now read a third time.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EAyes 86\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand Labour 64; Green Party of Aotearoa New Zealand 10; ACT New Zealand 10; Te Paati M\u0101ori 2.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENoes 33\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand National 33.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EMotion agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000201\u0022\u003EBill read a third time.\u003C/p\u003E\n    \u003C/div\u003E\n    \u003Cdiv class=\u0022HpsHansard\u0022\u003E\n      \u003Cp\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsProceedingHeading\u0022\u003EBills\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000202\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u00227f47a6f6ca82400f9ee2ee958176024c\u0022\u003EHolidays (Increasing Sick Leave) Amendment Bill\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000203\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u0022e6a5bc0df09a49c88f4dcc43b79b8a37\u0022\u003EFirst Reading\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022098b8334-57f8-4062-bac6-bfbc3474e88e\u0022 data-id=\u00229ec9a95cfe5d46cea7de77302ca0ebb1\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000204\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022098b8334-57f8-4062-bac6-bfbc3474e88e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00229ec9a95cfe5d46cea7de77302ca0ebb1\u0022\u003EHon MICHAEL WOOD (Minister for Workplace Relations and Safety):\u003C/span\u003E I present a legislative statement on the Holidays (Increasing Sick Leave) Amendment Bill.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000205\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022098b8334-57f8-4062-bac6-bfbc3474e88e\u0022\u003ELegislative statement published under the authority of the House\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000206\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022098b8334-57f8-4062-bac6-bfbc3474e88e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00222120eaf59e6349fbb4a64bd9194a453f\u0022\u003EHon MICHAEL WOOD\u003C/span\u003E: I move, That the Holidays (Increasing Sick Leave) Amendment Bill be now read a first time. I nominate the Education and Workforce Committee to consider the bill. At the appropriate time I intend to move that the bill be reported to the House by 6 April 2021.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000207\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022098b8334-57f8-4062-bac6-bfbc3474e88e\u0022\u003EAt the end of what some of us termed \u201Cthe year of COVID\u201D, we have learnt many things, and one of the things that we have learnt is the importance of people who are sick staying at home to look after themselves and to not spread infection to others. COVID has been a reminder to us, in terms of dealing with a pandemic, but more generally looking after the health and wellbeing of our people, that people need time off work when they are unwell. It is important for their own health and their own wellbeing. It\u2019s important for the health and wellbeing of their colleagues, who we do not want to become sick through the risk of infection. It is important for businesses, who want to have healthy and well-engaged and productive workforces, and it\u2019s important in a broader sense, in terms of managing the increased risk in our country and around the world of infections such as COVID-19, which can have system-wide impacts on our economy. And what has become clear to the Government and to many people across New Zealand this year is that our current statutory minimum entitlement of five days sick leave per year does not satisfy those requirements and does not satisfy our ambition to ensure that the health and wellbeing of people and the risk of spreading infection is managed well.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000208\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022098b8334-57f8-4062-bac6-bfbc3474e88e\u0022\u003EI note that this is a realisation that many others have come to. Many businesses in New Zealand currently provide more than the statutory minimum for sick leave in recognition of these factors. Many of the countries with whom we compare ourselves currently provide a higher statutory minimum for sick leave. Australia, for example, provides 10 days\u2019 sick leave per year for workers, which is what has been proposed by the Government in this bill. I was very pleased that the Labour Party manifesto that was taken to the New Zealand electorate this year made a very clear commitment to address this issue with some urgency, and that is what we are doing in the first sitting week of the House this year. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000209\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022098b8334-57f8-4062-bac6-bfbc3474e88e\u0022\u003EAs I said, many businesses in New Zealand do currently provide 10 days\u2019 sick leave or more per year. One of the things that I think is a relevant factor for the House to consider, as this bill goes through, is the equity impacts of our current system, because workers who are most reliant on the statutory minimums tend to be workers in the most vulnerable sectors, tend to be workers with less agency and bargaining power in their workplaces, and tend to be workers who are going to be less able to negotiate to have additional sick leave if that is needed. So we have a situation in New Zealand where many workers\u2014the estimate is around about half of all workers\u2014do have 10 days of sick leave or more per year. But the workers who potentially need it the most\u2014workers who particularly are liable to have children and other dependents for whom they may need to access that sick leave, as well\u2014are the workers who tend to rely on the statutory minimum of five days per year. If we think about the people in our lives who might have children, who might have dependents, who might be more vulnerable in various ways, pretty quickly you can see how that statutory minimum of five days per year may be used up. And that\u2019s just in ordinary times, let alone those periods of time when we are strongly advising people, from a public health perspective, to be cautious and to stay at home if they are unwell with symptoms that may be related to COVID. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000210\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022098b8334-57f8-4062-bac6-bfbc3474e88e\u0022\u003EI think one thing that this bill and this issue have brought out is a need for the cultural mind-set in New Zealand workplaces to change. Indeed, I think it is changing. I think for a long time we\u2019ve sort of had this attitude\u2014and I\u2019ve been as guilty as many other people\u2014of toughing it out, of saying, \u201COh, well, it\u2019s just a bit of a cold. I\u2019m not feeling all that well, but I\u2019ll go in anyway.\u201D We do need to move past that. We\u2019ve learnt this year that there can be serious public health impacts if we don\u2019t move past that. We\u2019ve learnt this year that there can be productivity impacts if we don\u2019t move past that. We\u2019ve learnt that there are serious public health risks for the whole country if we don\u2019t move past that attitude. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000211\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022098b8334-57f8-4062-bac6-bfbc3474e88e\u0022\u003EMore broadly, my vision as Minister in this portfolio and the vision of the Government is that we move past that view of workplace relations where we say the best thing and the only thing we should be doing is to be minimising upfront costs. Actually, we\u2019ve got a much higher level of ambition for workplaces in New Zealand. It\u2019s about building workplaces that are fair, that are safe, and that are productive, and moving on from that 1990s mind-set which says that you trade those things off against each other, that the only way to be productive is to reduce the costs and reduce the investment in your workers down to the minimum possible level. Actually, I believe that those attributes of workplaces that are fair, safe, and productive are mutually reinforcing, that if we invest in workers, if we treat them well, if we ensure that through measures like this\u2014for example, they have adequate sick leave, they have adequate annual leave, they have a voice in the workplace\u2014that is going to lead to more productive workplaces. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000212\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022098b8334-57f8-4062-bac6-bfbc3474e88e\u0022\u003EA survey undertaken by Business New Zealand and Southern Cross Healthcare in 2018 found that a significant number of employers do already provide more than five days of sick leave per year in recognition of this. The same survey found that from 2012 to 2018 the proportion of enterprises with a clear policy stating that staff should not come into work when sick also increased significantly. Other research reveals that when workers are asked the question, \u201CWould you come into work if you are sick?\u201D in 2012, 49 percent of workers said yes, they would. That reduced to 35 percent by 2018, and, I dare say, that at the end of 2020 more workers also recognise the need to stay at home when they are unwell. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000213\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022098b8334-57f8-4062-bac6-bfbc3474e88e\u0022\u003ESo I think there is a journey that is taking place across New Zealand workplaces that is reflected in the views of both employers and employees that it is incredibly important to ensure that there is adequate sick leave in place. And I\u2019ve been very pleased this week to see a range of leaders from unions and business organisations also recognising this in their public comments about this issue. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000214\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022098b8334-57f8-4062-bac6-bfbc3474e88e\u0022\u003EI referenced, before, the fact that this doesn\u2019t need to be a trade-off\u2014that, actually, decent sick leave, supporting employees to stay at home when they\u2019re not well, actually can be a boon to productivity. It\u2019s a pretty simple equation, really. If people are coming into work sick with illnesses that are easily spread\u2014of course, we think of COVID-19 this year, but those other bugs that are always around: the common cold, influenza, and other easily transmissible conditions. If more people pick up those conditions because workers come into work when they are unwell, that is a significant drag on the productivity of businesses in New Zealand, and we do not want to see that happening. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000215\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022098b8334-57f8-4062-bac6-bfbc3474e88e\u0022\u003EThere\u2019s good evidence on this as well. Respondents to the 2015 American Working Conditions Survey who reported working while sick, estimated that this reduced their productivity by around about 20 percent on average, and that\u2019s not taking into account the other people for whom illnesses may have been passed on. The same study found that providing paid sick leave in the United States by employers could have saved between $630 million to $1.88 billion per year in absenteeism costs, by preventing the spread of illnesses. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000216\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022098b8334-57f8-4062-bac6-bfbc3474e88e\u0022\u003EThis is a Government which has a balanced approach. We are committed to increasing sick leave to deal with the issues that I\u2019ve covered. We\u2019re also committed to continuing to support businesses in what has been a difficult period due to the impacts of COVID19. The COVID-19 Leave Support Scheme has been an important component of this work and I\u2019m currently having a good look at that scheme to make sure that it\u2019s providing the support to employers that they need during this period. And we have a range of other policies to support businesses as we navigate this period, including interest-free small-business loans; obviously we\u2019ve had the wage subsidy scheme; and the Government\u2019s ongoing programme to provide free business advice, support to get online, and tackling that issue of expensive merchant service fees. So this policy fits within a broader framework of making sure that we\u2019re providing good rights to employees, we\u2019re improving productivity, and we\u2019re supporting businesses through a challenging process. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000217\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022098b8334-57f8-4062-bac6-bfbc3474e88e\u0022\u003EAs part of that balanced approach, we\u2019re also asking the select committee to have a good look at this bill, to consider a range of other issues that have been raised by stakeholders in the consultation. We will be running a full select committee process, and we\u2019ve heard from businesses that a little bit of lead-in time for the implementation of this is important. So the implementation is proposed to take place two months after the legislation takes effect. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000218\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022098b8334-57f8-4062-bac6-bfbc3474e88e\u0022\u003EThis is a bill which responds to some of the challenges that have arisen in 2020, but addresses a more fundamental issue about making sure that we have workplaces that are fair, safe, and productive through the provision of decent sick leave for workers who need to stay at home when they are unwell. I commend it to the House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00224a25943b-cb3b-49c3-bd10-74316fae17f1\u0022 data-id=\u0022a8ecf675cd8547d8a9fb2893cfdd6991\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000219\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00224a25943b-cb3b-49c3-bd10-74316fae17f1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022a8ecf675cd8547d8a9fb2893cfdd6991\u0022\u003EASSISTANT SPEAKER (Hon Jacqui Dean)\u003C/span\u003E: The question is that the motion be agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002298dbeffa-e059-49d5-8bbf-579cbaead9a3\u0022 data-id=\u0022bd91f4a5c5444b6286437dad0f3c6e23\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000220\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002298dbeffa-e059-49d5-8bbf-579cbaead9a3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022bd91f4a5c5444b6286437dad0f3c6e23\u0022\u003EHon SCOTT SIMPSON (National\u2014Coromandel):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Madam Speaker. I want to commence my contribution in this first reading debate by congratulating the Minister on his appointment to the portfolio of workplace relations and safety. He\u2019s a new Minister in this Labour Government, and he comes to his role, and, indeed, to this Parliament, through the well-trodden and well-traversed pathway that is the traditional pathway to Parliament for Labour MPs, through the trade union movement. In his time as a senior negotiator for Finsec, the Finance and Information Workers Union, which has now merged into part of FIRST Union, he was a staunch and very, very effective, I understand, advocate for his union members. But that\u2019s nothing new for those of us who have watched Labour Party Governments come and go over the years. The traditional pathway is well known, it\u2019s well-trodden, and those links and associations between the trade union movement and the Labour Party are historic and go back many, many years.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000221\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002298dbeffa-e059-49d5-8bbf-579cbaead9a3\u0022\u003ESo it came as no surprise that virtually straight after this year\u2019s general election, in a publication called Trans Tasman, the Council of Trade Unions president, one Richard Wagstaff, presented his wish list of things that he wanted from the current new Labour Government. He says, \u201CWorking people and their unions have expectations\u201D\u2014working people and their unions have expectations\u2014of this Government and they are looking for some kind of implementation very quickly. And guess what was top of Richard Wagstaff\u2019s list of expectations from this Government? Well, number one was safer sick leave: \u201Cas per their election promise, we look forward to the increase to 10 days sick leave being put into law in their first 100 days in office\u201D. Well, the union\u2019s wish list is being utterly complied with, sycophantically complied with, and the rest of the detail on the list, I\u2019m sure, won\u2019t be far behind as this Government unfolds its agenda. The mirroring of the Government\u2019s agenda, we saw in the Speech from the Throne, mirrors almost exactly the wish list from the Council of Trade Unions, and that comes as no surprise.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000222\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002298dbeffa-e059-49d5-8bbf-579cbaead9a3\u0022\u003EThis is a small bill\u2014it literally is just a page and a bit. It seeks to amend the already complex and difficult to negotiate Holidays Act, and it extends the minimum provisions of sick leave from five days a year to 10. That comes as no surprise because, as the Minister said, that was the Labour Party\u2019s slogan campaign during the election. But when they were campaigning on the election, they really didn\u2019t pay much attention to the detail, to the unintended consequences, to the costs. I listened very carefully to the former senior adviser to the Finsec union, the Minister say\u2014I heard him say almost nothing. In fact, the only time, I think, in his 10 minutes he referred to the employers was one when he referred to how some employers already give 10 days, and some do, because they understand that the relationships with staff are warranting that. There was no mention, effectively, of the impact on employers.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000223\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002298dbeffa-e059-49d5-8bbf-579cbaead9a3\u0022\u003EBut in the regulatory impact statement, there are some frightening insights into the lack of detail and the lack of preparation that is going to impact on businesses, particularly small businesses, as a result of this legislation. Frighteningly, the reviewer of this impact statement says\u2014and I quote\u2014\u201CThe Impact Statement has been produced under tight time constraints which has led to limitations in the policy process \u2026 A lack of consultation with affected stakeholders, particularly small businesses and businesses in the sectors that are most likely affected by the change.\u201D and \u201CA limited range of options has been considered, particularly alternative sick leave duration periods and funding approaches (as [have been] adopted [in] other countries.\u201D That should be enough to make most members of this Parliament sit up and take notice, because there hasn\u2019t been the work and detail done.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000224\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002298dbeffa-e059-49d5-8bbf-579cbaead9a3\u0022\u003EThe report goes further into looking at some of the likely risks and impacts, and, unsurprisingly, the risks and impacts fall disproportionately upon small to medium sized enterprises, those enterprises that are least able to absorb and least able to make arrangements for sick leave provisions when somebody doesn\u2019t turn up. I\u2019ve been in the situation where I\u2019ve run and operated both large and small businesses, and I can assure you that big businesses actually do have capacity to cover when someone is away because they\u2019re sick; small businesses don\u2019t have that. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000225\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002298dbeffa-e059-49d5-8bbf-579cbaead9a3\u0022\u003EWhat is also said in the impact statement\u2014and this is not covered at all by the Minister in his introductory comments\u2014is the cost. The cost is estimated by the Ministry of Business, Innovation and Employment to be close to $1 billion a year, added to the costs already being foisted upon New Zealand businesses by a Government that actually thinks businesses have an infinite capacity to absorb cost. Well, businesses don\u2019t have an infinite capacity to absorb cost. Businesses want to stay profitable, and, ultimately, they want to stay in business, so that they can employ people. That\u2019s the ultimate game, that\u2019s the ultimate objective of all commercial enterprises, to stay in business, make a profit, employ people, and return, sometimes, a very modest return to the investors and shareholders who have put their faith into that business.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000226\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002298dbeffa-e059-49d5-8bbf-579cbaead9a3\u0022\u003ESo a billion dollars, which actually represents close to 1 percent of the nation\u2019s total payroll, is going to have to be absorbed somehow by businesses already under pressure. Those costs, the report says, will be borne\u2014and I quote\u2014\u201Cmostly by employers who currently provide between five and 10 days of sick leave. Employers in the manufacturing, construction and accommodation and food services sectors are more likely to only provide the minimum entitlement, [and] so [therefore] are most likely to be impacted.\u201D\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000227\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002298dbeffa-e059-49d5-8bbf-579cbaead9a3\u0022\u003ESo if we go back to the manufacturing, construction, accommodation, and food services sectors, those are some of the most impacted services and sectors that have been impacted by this year of COVID. This brings me to the point about the rationale for bringing this in now. I\u2019m sorry to say that I think this Government is using the cover of COVID to implement a policy that has long been wanted by the trade union movement, long been wanted but never actually previously been able to be got through in a way that is remotely acceptable to the wider New Zealand public and business sector. Yet now we have the cover of COVID being used as an excuse, as a rationale, for bringing this extra impost and cost upon businesses, particularly small businesses, in. If that was the case, surely\u2014surely\u2014there is then an argument for limiting this result and making it COVID- related so that, eventually, one day, and who knows when that might be, when we return to a situation of relative normality, the status quo could be returned to. But, no, this Government has no intention of time-limiting or impact-limiting this piece of legislation. It\u2019s designed to be permanent for ever, for keeps, and ongoing, and that is a difficult challenge for all employers.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000228\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002298dbeffa-e059-49d5-8bbf-579cbaead9a3\u0022\u003EI\u2019m delighted, however, that the Minister has at least foreseen to send this piece of legislation to select committee. That\u2019s a positive, and I thank the Minister for that. But he\u2019s given a report-back date that is 6 April. This Parliament rises next week and we go into the great Kiwi Christmas summer closedown. Many New Zealanders will be wanting to beat a retreat to the beautiful Coromandel electorate, where they\u2019ll want to be spending time and money in my very nice electorate. They won\u2019t want to be focused on preparing submissions for a select committee hearing on an extra week\u2019s sick leave for their employees. What we will have, however, is probably, at select committee, a very long list of trade union representatives and members parading through the select committee, giving examples of what the Minister has referred to as enlightened employment arrangements. What we won\u2019t have is the hard-working representatives from small businesses, many of whom will actually be working over the summer period.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000229\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002298dbeffa-e059-49d5-8bbf-579cbaead9a3\u0022\u003ESo my concern is that although we\u2019re going to have a select committee process, I\u2019m not sure that it\u2019s going to get to the bottom of the real issues, and I don\u2019t think the time frame is particularly appropriate. In fact, I would call upon the Minister to reconsider the earlier report-back date, because I don\u2019t think that\u2019s going to allow a time for adequate and sensible submissions to be prepared and presented over the summer break, when many people are either on holiday themselves or, indeed, working. National will oppose this bill.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022f677db8b-66c5-4794-953c-bdf7aa425710\u0022 data-id=\u00226f4f69348fb6410aab74d279d6895c1c\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000230\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f677db8b-66c5-4794-953c-bdf7aa425710\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00226f4f69348fb6410aab74d279d6895c1c\u0022\u003EMARJA LUBECK (Labour):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Madam Speaker, and also congratulations on your appointment as Assistant Speaker.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000231\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f677db8b-66c5-4794-953c-bdf7aa425710\u0022\u003EFirst of all, I think, I would like to thank the member Scott Simpson for recalling the proud work history of our new Minister. We\u2019re absolutely proud of that. He referred to the well-trodden path via the union movement. I guess that is in stark contrast to the well-trodden path of the National Party, where $100,000 will do the job. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000232\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f677db8b-66c5-4794-953c-bdf7aa425710\u0022\u003ENow, the member talked about the fact that there was no consideration for employers in the ministerial speech, when the Minister very clearly referred to the COVID-19 Leave Support Scheme. That was a scheme that was put in place very quickly by our Government to ensure that employers did have the support and the help immediately to work through the options that they needed to have and work through all of the different matters they needed to take to remain viable. Now, I am very saddened to see that someone can stand up and do a speech when they actually haven\u2019t even listened to what the Minister was stating in his speech. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000233\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f677db8b-66c5-4794-953c-bdf7aa425710\u0022\u003EThe Minister talked about how productivity doesn\u2019t have to be one size fits all, \u201Cjust working harder will do the job\u201D, and this is how we see that the National Party is so stuck in the mind-set of just looking at what employers might like, in their view, and their absolute hate for employees. This doesn\u2019t need to be a trade-off, as the Minister very clearly said. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000234\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f677db8b-66c5-4794-953c-bdf7aa425710\u0022\u003ENow, the study in the US that the Minister mentioned showed that there was actually a lot of cost associated with people taking their germs into the workplace, and consequently other co-workers get sick, and that has a huge cost on their productivity. The member also made an incorrect statement with regards to the cost in the regulatory impact statement. The cost that the member mentioned is a gross cost, and that cost does not take into account the fact that when someone gets sick in a workplace and goes to the workplace to spread their germs, other workers will go sick as well. So that cost needs to be taken into consideration, too.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000235\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f677db8b-66c5-4794-953c-bdf7aa425710\u0022\u003ENow, I would like to applaud the Minister for bringing this bill to the House. COVID, more than anything else, has shown us that it\u2019s so important that we look after our workers. It\u2019s so important that we make sure that people don\u2019t go to work sick and don\u2019t feel the pressure of having to go to work sick, because that is what we see. I see Christopher Luxon on the other side of the room, and I\u2019m hoping that he will have a different story to tell and take a call on this bill, perhaps\u2014not prior to the maiden speech. We worked at Air New Zealand under a high performance, high engagement workplace, and perhaps the member Scott Simpson can take some lessons from one of his new colleagues, because in that environment, we weren\u2019t hating on employees; we were actually working with unions and we were working with employees. So perhaps that hatred of the union might get a little bit dissolved once there is a new member and perhaps a new leader in the National Party. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000236\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f677db8b-66c5-4794-953c-bdf7aa425710\u0022\u003ENow, with regards to businesses being aware of this productivity, there are already plenty of businesses out there that have implemented sick leave policies that give workers paid time off to address their basic health needs. In Air New Zealand, for example, and in many of the aviation collective contracts, there was, in fact, for a while, undefined sick leave. I don\u2019t like to say \u201Cunlimited\u201D, because that would sort of imply that people just took leave whenever they wanted, but \u201Cundefined\u201D meant that the workers would make an assessment on when they needed to have that sick leave and would look after their health before anything else. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000237\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f677db8b-66c5-4794-953c-bdf7aa425710\u0022\u003EThese businesses, they realise that what is good for their employees is actually good for the business, because it\u2019s not only the employees that benefit from better sick leave provisions; it is actually the businesses. When businesses provide sick leave so that their workers can take the paid sick leave when they need, they will recover properly, they will not spread any illnesses into the workplace, but they will also come to work healthy, refreshed, on top of their game, and in that sense they are productive\u2014and more productive than if they were to slog themselves into the workplace, be half fit, make everyone else sick, and make mistakes, because you make errors when you\u2019re sick. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000238\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f677db8b-66c5-4794-953c-bdf7aa425710\u0022\u003ESo the very short-sighted and narrow view from the National Party\u2014you know, five days\u2019 sick leave and for the rest you just have to make do with being sick in the workplace\u2014is absolutely the wrong thing to take. It saddens me to see that they\u2019re stuck in the same rut, like with everything else, throwing out the same old narrative, hating on employees. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000239\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f677db8b-66c5-4794-953c-bdf7aa425710\u0022\u003EBut I think this is a great bill. It shows its importance that our Minister, Michael Wood, brought this bill to the House as the first item of business, and it shows the importance that our Government puts on keeping people and keeping New Zealand safe. I commend it to the House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022c0f78f60-c2fd-46f4-8138-72f39692fc20\u0022 data-id=\u0022bdf49f4c1d2b475e83c71584042b9ffa\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000240\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c0f78f60-c2fd-46f4-8138-72f39692fc20\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022bdf49f4c1d2b475e83c71584042b9ffa\u0022\u003EHon TODD McCLAY (National\u2014Rotorua):\u003C/span\u003E The word \u201Cproductivity\u201D has been used a lot in the House today. And if increasing productivity in the economy in New Zealand is as easy as they say, which is just spending more money, then New Zealand will be the most productive country in the world because this Government is borrowing $200 billion to spend when others are also having to borrow money in their businesses and in their homes to spend and nobody is actually earning more. The way we become more productive is to produce more for the average amount of work that is done. Now, the last speaker, Marja Lubeck, and the Minister for Workplace Relations and Safety purposefully oversimplify what this legislation is about because it will not increase productivity. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000241\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c0f78f60-c2fd-46f4-8138-72f39692fc20\u0022\u003EIt doesn\u2019t mean that on this side of the House, we don\u2019t believe that when people are ill or they\u2019re sick they should be forced to work. Indeed, they\u2019re not\u2014in New Zealand at the moment. But to come to the House and say to all businesses in New Zealand, \u201CBut you already know about this because we talked about it in the campaign and you\u2019ve got a year or so probably to get used to it. And don\u2019t worry, by increasing the cost upon businesses in New Zealand with this measure alone by $1 billion\u201D\u2014that they will have to find somehow\u2014\u201Cyou will be more productive.\u201D suggests to me that actually the definition of \u201Cproductivity\u201D in the Labour Party is one that no business person in New Zealand shares. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000242\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c0f78f60-c2fd-46f4-8138-72f39692fc20\u0022\u003EFor that last member and the Minister to come here and lecture about looking after employees versus employers, and who\u2019s better at that and who\u2019s not, misses the point that when you impose cost upon business and those businesses can\u2019t absorb it any more because the Government continues to put cost on them\u2014when employees leave, they can\u2019t afford to re-employ again; jobs are not created. Here\u2019s the thing. The way to make somebody better off is through work, not through not having a job, and before COVID we saw job growth in our economy slow significantly to some months when it was negative. The Government hasn\u2019t got a plan to create jobs, because they\u2019re not looking to work with businesses who help grow the economy and they\u2019re also looking to pile cost on that, in the end, won\u2019t be good for employees who haven\u2019t got jobs. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000243\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c0f78f60-c2fd-46f4-8138-72f39692fc20\u0022\u003ESo here\u2019s an international organisation that studies this stuff around the world. The IMF has just produced a report that projects that on present economic settings in New Zealand, New Zealand incomes by 2025 will be lower than they are today. Yet in the House today, there is an announcement of doubling sick leave to increase productivity. Last week, we heard that actually the Minister, the new Minister, is not ruling out accepting the Helen Clark\u2019s Foundation\u2019s proposal to increase the minimum wage to the living wage next year with the concept of \u201Cpredistribution\u201D. But nobody knows what the predistribution is except a small-business man that is not making money this year that had to borrow during the lockdown through no fault of their own that\u2019s seeing cost upon cost imposed on them by the Government. They\u2019re not sure how they\u2019re going to survive. They\u2019re actually probably eventually going to have to reduce their workforce because they can\u2019t keep increasing their costs because consumers can\u2019t afford that. And the predistribution model that the Minister\u2019s signing up to, because he said he\u2019s going to look next year at moving the minimum wage to the living wage, is that you tax somebody and redistribute it before it has been earned, and that won\u2019t do anything for productivity at all. Five years of no income growth in New Zealand is what the IMF is predicting based on current economic settings in New Zealand, and that means those that have the least will be able to afford even less come 2025. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000244\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c0f78f60-c2fd-46f4-8138-72f39692fc20\u0022\u003EThere are 200,000 New Zealanders out of work. Those New Zealanders are more interested in how they\u2019re going to get a job and how their job will be created than in a year\u2019s time having an extra five days\u2019 sick leave if they need it. They\u2019re much more interested in how they\u2019re going to get a job to provide for their families, those 200,000 people, than an extra public holiday in a couple of years\u2019 time. They\u2019re much more interested in how a small business in their community will be able to create a job to afford to pay them so they can provide for their families than a sharp increase in the minimum wage\u2014and let\u2019s not start on the 1970s style, union-friendly workplace relations proposals the Government has been talking about that actually will not drive productivity. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000245\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c0f78f60-c2fd-46f4-8138-72f39692fc20\u0022\u003ESo here\u2019s an opportunity for the Minister to answer a couple of questions on this. If increasing productivity in the economy is as simple as increasing the minimum wage without consequence, why stop where you have? Why not go to $50 an hour because all of a sudden poverty will be gone? But what will be the cost in the supermarkets and elsewhere of those costs being passed on? And if actually the way to increase productivity is through greater sick leave, why are you only doing five days? Why are you limiting it to 20 days over a period of time? The reason for that is it feels good and it sounds good but it\u2019s not an economic plan to grow the economy. It\u2019s not an economic plan to work and support small business people to be able to create jobs. It\u2019s not going to do anything at all to help them get out from the debt that has been imposed on them because of the lockdown. And it will mean that job creation slows as we saw in the last term, before COVID, and when job creation slows it\u2019s a leading indicator of an unemployment rate that will increase.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000246\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c0f78f60-c2fd-46f4-8138-72f39692fc20\u0022\u003EActually, we started to see that before COVID, then COVID hit the economy and the unemployment rate went so very high. And this isn\u2019t a plan to fix that. It\u2019s not an economic plan. The IMF is correct that actually on present economic settings, New Zealanders\u2019 incomes by 2025 will be lower than they are today. That\u2019s an appalling record that the Government has set up. They say they care\u2014and they do\u2014but in five years from now there\u2019ll be no income growth in New Zealand, which means those that have the least will have even less. They will be able to afford even less. And those that are middle-income New Zealanders who are sort of trying to do OK at the moment will have found that actually costs have gone up, including housing and rents and food and other things. And there will be fewer businesses because we will be less productive; we will not be more productive.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000247\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c0f78f60-c2fd-46f4-8138-72f39692fc20\u0022\u003EThis isn\u2019t a debate about whether or not people should have to work when they\u2019re ill; of course, they should not. But the Government has dressed this up as a response to COVID, but is not a response to COVID because already if somebody thinks they might have COVID and they have to go and have a test and they have to self-isolate until then, the Government has a scheme of $50 million to help them already. So if they have thought or they think they have COVID or they could have and they want to go and get a test, they do not have to work today, except the Government scheme doesn\u2019t work well enough. They are using COVID as a cover to extend this out. And if that\u2019s their policy, which it was before the election, then they should own that aspect to it. But they shouldn\u2019t say it\u2019s going to increase productivity, because COVID didn\u2019t increase productivity in the country, and actually piling cost upon business at a time when we should be finding ways for businesses to be able to grow so they are more productive and they can pay more\u2014actually, that plan is something that\u2019s needed much more than this. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000248\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c0f78f60-c2fd-46f4-8138-72f39692fc20\u0022\u003EThe five days\u2019 sick leave and the extra day\u2019s holiday the Government has proposed to fix the problem of the tourism industry, but you\u2019re not going to get it for two years, doesn\u2019t do anything for the businesses that are struggling and are likely to close this year waiting for a public holiday with its extra cost. With the increase of the minimum wage and the Minister\u2019s suggestion that he\u2019s looking at whether he brings it up to the living wage or not will be a cost of more than $3 billion on businesses. Now, the Government gets to borrow that money and one day taxpayers have to pay it back through the tax system. But when a business has to pay extra costs imposed on it by the Government, it has to borrow that or it has to increase its costs\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000249\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a1f7bbd1-b6ae-41c0-963b-dbe1251f5540\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022cfdec040243a46a09a85cfddcd973155\u0022\u003EKieran McAnulty\u003C/span\u003E: What\u2019s this got to do with the bill?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000250\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c0f78f60-c2fd-46f4-8138-72f39692fc20\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00229f0f7bbaa29c43baae1a7f4ce44ebd27\u0022\u003EHon TODD McCLAY\u003C/span\u003E: \u2014or it has to reduce costs, and they don\u2019t get to do all of those things. In fact, they\u2019ve already had to do most of them. And largely what it means is they\u2019re going to have to reduce costs, which means fewer people in the workforce, fewer jobs, not job creation. \u201CAnd what\u2019s this got to do with sick leave?\u201D a member on the opposite side of the House says. At a time when businesses in New Zealand need the Government to understand how hard it\u2019s been to work with them with a plan to grow the economy and create jobs, they\u2019re merely piling cost on them without talking to them, without understanding them. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000251\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c0f78f60-c2fd-46f4-8138-72f39692fc20\u0022\u003ENow if the Minister stands up and says, actually, this is a select committee process, we\u2019re going through it. If we see from businesses a better way or it\u2019s going to be too harmful, or it\u2019s not going to create jobs at the moment or for a period of time, and he\u2019s willing to then look at that and change some of the timing that employers of small businesses around the country, hard-working chippies and others have asked for already since the announcement, so be it. But I guarantee you, he won\u2019t do that, because this is ideology at its worst. Everybody wants somebody when they\u2019re unwell to be treated properly. If you believe you\u2019re at harm of COVID, then the Government will provide an income for you as you self-isolate. To dress this up as something because we need it\u2014because it\u2019s COVID it\u2019s there for a long time\u2014will impose cost upon business at a time that it\u2019s not needed, and it\u2019s going to mean fewer jobs, not more jobs. And in five years\u2019 time, these guys will turn around and say it\u2019s not our fault that incomes haven\u2019t grown because we care.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022badb0a39-849c-462a-b32f-77fc017c9fc2\u0022 data-id=\u002243d3b0fffdc846d3ac0257d90604f466\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000252\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022badb0a39-849c-462a-b32f-77fc017c9fc2\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002243d3b0fffdc846d3ac0257d90604f466\u0022\u003EHon SIMON BRIDGES (National\u2014Tauranga):\u003C/span\u003E Point of order. I move an extension of time for Todd McClay. That was a brilliant speech. We need another five minutes.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00224a25943b-cb3b-49c3-bd10-74316fae17f1\u0022 data-id=\u00222afce20bc8524bbcabf64e4e61d452bb\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000253\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00224a25943b-cb3b-49c3-bd10-74316fae17f1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00222afce20bc8524bbcabf64e4e61d452bb\u0022\u003EASSISTANT SPEAKER (Hon Jacqui Dean)\u003C/span\u003E: That is not a point of order.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002226b88bf1-f634-40e7-8019-e75cc483ace7\u0022 data-id=\u002220a2d83c3f0f4afbb921800e2c08aee0\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000254\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002226b88bf1-f634-40e7-8019-e75cc483ace7\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002220a2d83c3f0f4afbb921800e2c08aee0\u0022\u003EJO LUXTON (Labour\u2014Rangitata):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Madam Speaker. It\u2019s with absolute pleasure, as a small-business owner, that I rise in support of this bill.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000255\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002226b88bf1-f634-40e7-8019-e75cc483ace7\u0022\u003EI think it\u2019s time that members opposite hear a real-life experience from a business owner rather than the uninformed opinions that they seem to think are what every business and business owner agrees with, while those members of the National Party are wrong. I would like to talk about my experience as a small-business owner, in so far as that I would rather that my staff, if they were unwell, stay at home. I am one of those business owners that provides more than five days\u2019 sick leave for my staff currently. I am looking forward to increasing it to 10 days for my staff, because there is nothing worse than having sick staff members come in to work because they feel that they have to because they\u2019ve got no sick days left. They\u2019ve been at home looking after their children during the year, because they\u2019re sick, and they are desperately in need of those wages, that they\u2019d come along, sick as a dog, and get on with it. However, then they pass on those germs to the other staff members. Then those staff members have to go away sick, and you are losing productivity. So I already do it as a business owner, and I am proud of the fact that I do it. I am proud of the fact that I am a good business owner and a good employer of my staff, and care enough about them.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000256\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002226b88bf1-f634-40e7-8019-e75cc483ace7\u0022\u003EIt\u2019s not all about this pie in the sky idea that because of this piece of legislation all of a sudden every staff member in every business is going to take 10 days\u2019 sick leave automatically, straight away, and no one\u2019s going to be working anywhere. That is what that party opposite, the National Party opposite, seems to think. It\u2019s always a glass half empty rather than a glass half full with them. I am so proud to support this piece of legislation.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002269dfdffa-4227-42b6-875a-fc8033bc25cc\u0022 data-id=\u0022ad60d559dbbf4ad3b0fd4b2d36409e2d\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000257\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002269dfdffa-4227-42b6-875a-fc8033bc25cc\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022ad60d559dbbf4ad3b0fd4b2d36409e2d\u0022\u003EJAN LOGIE (Green):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Madam Speaker. It was a little earlier than I expected, but I am very pleased to get the chance to speak on this bill. It really does feel as if it has been a long time coming, so I would like to add my congratulations to the new Minister, Michael Wood, for showing that he\u2019s getting down to business so quickly in this new parliamentary term. And also, Madam Speaker, my congratulations to you. It\u2019s lovely to see you in the Chair, and I look forward to your wise ruling over this term.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000258\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002269dfdffa-4227-42b6-875a-fc8033bc25cc\u0022\u003ESo there\u2019s been some debate about the relevance of COVID across the sides of the House, but really, for me, if COVID has taught us anything\u2014and I\u2019ve referenced a lot of lessons I\u2019ve taken from COVID around, actually, the ability to make change at speed when required, and our interconnectedness with each other and our environment. They are very strong lessons. But, for me, if there is any lesson from COVID, it is the danger of, when you are sick, carrying on as if there is no consequence to that. That behaviour has put our entire country at risk. It\u2019s one of the top-line messages from the Government and the public health responses: if you are sick, stay home. That\u2019s the number one message to the country in response to COVID, because that behaviour keeps us safe. And the Government has initiated the COVID leave scheme as an interim measure, specifically responding to the failures of our sick-leave scheme at the moment, to enable more people to be able to take that advice and not to have to choose between being able to pay their rent and keeping their workmates and their community safe.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000259\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002269dfdffa-4227-42b6-875a-fc8033bc25cc\u0022\u003ESo at the moment we know that half of the employers in this country provide just the minimum: only five days. What that tells us is that a significant number of small and medium sized businesses provide more, despite what the National Party has been suggesting in their speeches. But it tells us as well that a huge number of people in this country right at the moment will be feeling as if they need to go to work, even though they are feeling sick, because they will have used up their leave or been worried about reaching that point and maybe their kids will get sick and they\u2019ll need it for them.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000260\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002269dfdffa-4227-42b6-875a-fc8033bc25cc\u0022\u003EThe Greens have long called for an extension to sick leave. Our first motivation was recognising the pressure on, mostly, working mums, but mostly parents, around the ease of kids getting sick when they\u2019re at school or k\u014Dhanga or early childhood education\u2014kids get sick, right. You need\u2014and we all want, I would have thought\u2014their parents to be there with them when they\u2019re sick. And for the parents, that\u2019s part of women being able to stay in work, because we haven\u2019t managed to share those roles out between men and women equally yet. So that\u2019s part of what helps keep women in work.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000261\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002269dfdffa-4227-42b6-875a-fc8033bc25cc\u0022\u003ESo the discussion that we heard from the National Party earlier is that New Zealanders just want work and the jobs; that\u2019s all they care about. They don\u2019t care about whether they\u2019ve got sick leave or not. But, actually, if that side of the House had listened to half the country at all, they would have heard that, actually, people don\u2019t want to have to choose between caring for their families and putting food on the table. Actually, they want to contribute, they want to be in jobs that enable them to fulfil both functions. We know that people who are only getting that statutory entitlement are more likely to be young, they\u2019re more likely to be women, they are more likely to be M\u0101ori, and have caring responsibilities. So this is a problem for us as a society. If we\u2019re saying we\u2019re a caring society, then, actually, our leave provisions are inconsistent with that. And if we care about public health and preventing outbreaks of sickness, of communicable diseases, then our sick leave provisions are inconsistent with that.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000262\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002269dfdffa-4227-42b6-875a-fc8033bc25cc\u0022\u003EI do just want to quote\u2014there was an op-ed in the paper from a woman that sounds like she works in a call centre, Halaena Mckeague, who I just thought put it kind of nicely that \u201Cfive days goes really, really quickly. Especially when the \u2026 Prime Minister [is telling you] to play it safe and stay home if we\u2019ve got any of the many \u2026 symptoms of COVID-19. Sore throat? Stay home. Runny nose? Home. Bit of a cough? Don\u2019t come in.\u201D That is our advice. We need people to follow that advice. Five days as a total? It\u2019s not really consistent with that advice.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000263\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002269dfdffa-4227-42b6-875a-fc8033bc25cc\u0022\u003EThere\u2019s academic work and analysis of our behaviour in workplaces that talks about the problem of \u201Cpresenteeism\u201D. We hear from what I would characterise as bad employers who talk about absenteeism as a real problem\u2014as the main problem. But, actually, we have a bigger problem with people coming to work sick, in a compromised state. And we heard the evidence around actually a 20 percent reduction in their effectiveness when they come to work sick. But more than that, they\u2019re making their colleagues sick, and that is reducing productivity in the whole workplace. So the presenteeism is a key problem. Part of the way we change that is by sending a very clear message through our legislation and increasing our provision of sick leave. And that is what we are starting to do today.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000264\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002269dfdffa-4227-42b6-875a-fc8033bc25cc\u0022\u003EI also just want to say that while I speak to some of these key points, I do want to acknowledge that this legislation, from the Greens\u2019 perspective, isn\u2019t perfect, and actually doesn\u2019t solve all of those problems, because there\u2019s a lot of people in this country who are either in casual work or\u2014when we have one of the highest rates of turnover in and out of employment in the entire OECD\u2014many people will be at the stage of their employment where they won\u2019t have been in the job six months, and they won\u2019t be entitled in the current provisions to any of these protections. I really want people to think about that, and the fact that we also have a gap between our COVID leave scheme at the moment and the protection for those workers. They\u2019re not covered by our sick leave entitlements.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000265\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002269dfdffa-4227-42b6-875a-fc8033bc25cc\u0022\u003EAnd with the COVID leave scheme, really, it\u2019s a limited number of people who are able to access it through their employers. So if you\u2019re a horticultural worker who\u2019s being employed for the season, or if you\u2019re a retail worker who\u2019s been brought in for the Christmas rush, or a hospo worker who\u2019s only got casual hours and you are feeling sick, then at the moment in most workplaces, you will have to choose between being paid or looking after your community and protecting us from having to go into a lockdown. And from my perspective and the Greens\u2019 perspective, as we head into the summer break, this is an urgent issue that needs resolution if we are to have security around our response over the summer period as we are all getting out and moving around the country more than we normally would. That is an issue that needs prioritising, and we\u2019re a little sad to see that that wasn\u2019t built into this legislation and that wasn\u2019t being solved through urgency.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000266\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002269dfdffa-4227-42b6-875a-fc8033bc25cc\u0022\u003EI would just say as well that we\u2019re interested to hear from the Minister at some stage around why this framework won\u2019t bring in the protections for some workers until mid-2022, when there could have been an option to have made sick leave balances 10 days minus any leave days taken since the work anniversary date from the date of implementation. It would have, I think to my mind, been a simpler implementation mechanism or framework, and would have brought forward access to it. If we\u2019re buying the principle that this actually supports good productivity within workplaces, which I am 100 percent of that view, and that this helps build good public health initiatives and supports family and caring\u2014things that we really believe in\u2014then I think the sooner we do this the better.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022 data-id=\u00227a6b3ece09f242db9041213c53ebb822\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000267\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00227a6b3ece09f242db9041213c53ebb822\u0022\u003EDAVID SEYMOUR (Leader\u2014ACT):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Madam Speaker. I rise on behalf of ACT in opposition to the Holidays (Increasing Sick Leave) Amendment Bill. This piece of legislation, more than anything else, shows the priorities of this Government. We\u2019ve just rushed through a bill under urgency to deregulate pill testing\u2014and a fine initiative it is\u2014now, when it comes to employment, and business, and jobs, and growth, the Government is rushing through legislation to increase the regulation and costs put on people who choose to employ. That is the priority of this Government in a nutshell, here under urgency, plain for the people of New Zealand to see. It also shows the way this Government approaches problems. This Government is not interested in growing the pie, it\u2019s not interested in productivity growth; its solution to every problem is redistribution. They never see the opportunity for New Zealanders to do more stuff smarter, with more investment capital and better technology. All they see is the opportunity to take what exists and give it to people who they think are more likely to vote for them. It is a sad and sorry way to lead a country.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000268\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003EIt\u2019s worth revising what people who seek to be employers have gone through over the past sad 13 years, because employers are not some sort of cash cow for the policies that the Labour Party front bench used to fantasise about as they ran student unions in their youth. They are actually people who assemble investment capital and an idea for a product, or a service, and customers, and if they do that successfully, they can make payroll every second Thursday and make sure that jobs actually exist. That\u2019s what employers are. But employers have a big numerical problem in this country. There are only 154,000 of them, five percent, versus employees of which there\u2019s 50 percent\u2014interestingly, the same percentage that voted for the Labour Party. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000269\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003EThis excellent opinion piece by Geoff Neal says here\u2019s why it\u2019s getting harder to employ New Zealanders. He says take the last 13 unlucky years that employers have faced, in 2007, the Labour-led Government lands a triple blow to business. Number one, an extra week\u2019s annual leave puts up employers\u2019 staff costs 2 percent in an instant. Then it says KiwiSaver, employers have to pay 2 percent of someone else\u2019s retirement, later increased by a National Government to 3 percent. Then, in 2007, the adult minimum wage goes up a dollar an hour, actually a 10 percent increase in one go. How many businesses can do a 10 percent increase in productivity to pay for that? The fact is, they can\u2019t. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000270\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003EAll the way through, from 2009 to 2017, minimum wage increases were at least somewhat achievable through productivity growth, at 25c to 50c per year. But it didn\u2019t mean that the National Party wasn\u2019t prepared to Mondayise Waitangi Day and Anzac Day. That\u2019s just another 0.2 percent on the costs of employing people in this country, just another little smidgen that gets added on to the cost of people who assemble capital, and products, and services, and customers to provide jobs. But hey, it all adds up.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000271\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003EIn 2018, with a new Labour-led Government, the minimum wage goes up again, by 5 percent in one go. Then, in 2019, it gets worse again, a 7 percent increase in the minimum wage by $1.20; new domestic violence leave policies which say that employers\u2014not ACC, not the taxpayer\u2014are somehow responsible for paying, for the public benefit, for those who are harmed by those close to them to be able to have respite. Why anyone would put that narrow tax on to employers to achieve a wider public good is a question anybody who knows anything about public policy will never be able to answer sensibly. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000272\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003EThey weren\u2019t finished in 2019. Then they went and got rid of the 90-day trial for people who had the temerity to employ more than 20 other New Zealanders. These are the kinds of costs that have been put on to the Government, on to employers by this Government, and the last one, and the one before it. This bill comes at the end of 13 years of people who seek to employ their fellow New Zealanders having additional costs loaded on to them for purely political purposes. And here we are in 2020, looking into 2021: what does this Government have in store for people who have the temerity to give other New Zealanders a job? Well, we\u2019re going to see another 6 percent increase to minimum wage. How many employers can get a 6 percent increase in productivity every year to pay that? I wish there were more, but sadly, there isn\u2019t. It\u2019s simply unsustainable. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000273\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003EAnother week\u2019s sick leave, another public holiday. These are the things that are going on to the costs faced by employers. And people wonder why we\u2019re not getting productivity growth when it\u2019s all been sucked up in redistribution for political purposes by a Labour Party that just doesn\u2019t get what it takes to create investment, jobs, and growth. What about this bill before us? Well, I looked earnestly at the regulatory impact statement that was put on the table with a minute\u2019s notice by the Minister, because it couldn\u2019t be here because this Government is so\u2014how do they say?\u2014ass about face, they\u2019re running to stand still and keep up. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000274\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003EDoes it say anything about a problem to be solved that New Zealanders don\u2019t have enough sick leave? Well, we look at the summary of the problem and proposed approach, does it mention anything? The closest it gets is\u2014if you go through to, I think, page 3, it says if you look at the statistics, the Wellness in the Workplace Survey, actually 35 percent of workers surveyed said they\u2019d gone to work sick, down from 49 percent seven years earlier. A problem that is solving itself, but no analysis of what the costs and benefits of the policy are. No justification, except for this\u2014here\u2019s the justification we\u2019ve heard from the Minister, here\u2019s what we see on the regulatory impact statement\u2014it\u2019s all about COVID. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000275\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003EWell, well, haven\u2019t this Government heard the advice \u201CNever waste a good crisis.\u201D? What Government would possibly want to use an excuse of COVID that requires people, if they tested positive, to take off 14 days, a few thousand people potentially, if things get really bad. A few people might need to take 14 days off while they recover from COVID and prove they have no symptoms or infection from COVID. Instead of helping those small number of people get through COVID, this Government is giving five extra days\u2019 sick pay to 2.7 million workers. Now, unlike Paul Goldsmith, my dad wasn\u2019t a maths teacher, but maybe that\u2019s not a bad thing. But I think I can do enough maths to understand that giving 2.7 million workers\u2014at an estimated cost of a billion bucks a year to employers\u2014five extra days off is not a solution to a problem that may see a few thousand workers requiring 14 days off. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000276\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003ESo there you have it, we live in a country where we need an economic recovery that will depend on one Kiwi offering another Kiwi a job hundreds of thousands of times in the weeks and months and years to come as we come out of COVID. We have a Government whose priorities are to deregulate pill testing and then increase the regulation on employment, putting a billion bucks of costs, ostensibly because of COVID-19, in a way that won\u2019t actually help people who need 14 days off for COVID-19. It comes after a 13-year litany of additional costs by the blue team and the red team put on to the cost of people who actually take the effort to assemble the capital, the products, the services, and the customer base to provide other New Zealanders a job. People wonder why it is that the IMF says this country will be poorer in 2025 than it was in 2019. Anybody seeking the answer to that question? I present to you the Labour Government and this myopic, stupid, disgraceful legislation that the ACT party proudly opposes. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00225ec01d23-b55e-45b9-a668-d3bf14212126\u0022 data-id=\u0022acc511671aff49f685e79879967acda5\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000277\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225ec01d23-b55e-45b9-a668-d3bf14212126\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022acc511671aff49f685e79879967acda5\u0022\u003EHELEN WHITE (Labour):\u003C/span\u003E I can say very confidently to the Opposition that as an employment lawyer who has worked for employers and who has worked for employees and who has worked for unions, this legislation is something we should be very proud of. You have been burying your heads in the sand. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000278\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225ec01d23-b55e-45b9-a668-d3bf14212126\u0022\u003EI have been working in this field for so long that I have seen\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000279\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00224a25943b-cb3b-49c3-bd10-74316fae17f1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002201a70513d4304eb2af8b5992d3700361\u0022\u003EASSISTANT SPEAKER (Hon Jacqui Dean)\u003C/span\u003E: Order! \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000280\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225ec01d23-b55e-45b9-a668-d3bf14212126\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00221fb29bf88a2b45f0955427db6e9455b3\u0022\u003EHELEN WHITE\u003C/span\u003E: \u2014the terrible things that have been done to people under\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000281\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00224a25943b-cb3b-49c3-bd10-74316fae17f1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00224ce6c89869744bb7b75728adffad5f61\u0022\u003EASSISTANT SPEAKER (Hon Jacqui Dean)\u003C/span\u003E: Order! The member\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000282\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225ec01d23-b55e-45b9-a668-d3bf14212126\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a77f6852c1c04036a19aa07b6e091911\u0022\u003EHELEN WHITE\u003C/span\u003E: \u2014the old regime, and thank goodness\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000283\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00224a25943b-cb3b-49c3-bd10-74316fae17f1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022d3458a65376e4e3eae13e8a0a4be778d\u0022\u003EASSISTANT SPEAKER (Hon Jacqui Dean)\u003C/span\u003E: Order! \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000284\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225ec01d23-b55e-45b9-a668-d3bf14212126\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00223559eeeb66854b748089d549c556f91f\u0022\u003EHELEN WHITE\u003C/span\u003E: Sorry, ma\u2019am. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000285\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00224a25943b-cb3b-49c3-bd10-74316fae17f1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00228785cdad84114d3d9f42191e8302265d\u0022\u003EASSISTANT SPEAKER (Hon Jacqui Dean)\u003C/span\u003E: The member will resume her seat. The member does not bring the Speaker into the debate by saying \u201Cyou\u201D to a member. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000286\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225ec01d23-b55e-45b9-a668-d3bf14212126\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00225871151e28284b959f296c38edba0f0c\u0022\u003EHELEN WHITE\u003C/span\u003E: Sorry, ma\u2019am. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000287\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a1f7bbd1-b6ae-41c0-963b-dbe1251f5540\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022b083fb1361434bc5a66fe2940e41778c\u0022\u003EKieran McAnulty\u003C/span\u003E: Just say \u201Cthe member who\u2019s sitting there\u201D. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000288\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022bdb9e356cd19441cbeefcee9fb440a57\u0022\u003EHon Member\u003C/span\u003E: Like \u201CThe member\u2019s wrong.\u201D \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000289\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225ec01d23-b55e-45b9-a668-d3bf14212126\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022520a87668b9b42728c612ce1fa9ae3c4\u0022\u003EHELEN WHITE\u003C/span\u003E: The member is wrong\u2014the member is certainly wrong. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000290\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225ec01d23-b55e-45b9-a668-d3bf14212126\u0022\u003EIn the time that I have been an employment lawyer, I have seen large employers, who could certainly pay, actually performance-manage staff for taking under the minimum entitlement, because they saw it as a performance issue. It is an extremely unsustainable position, given what we have seen in COVID, that we are actually encouraging people to be in a workplace when they are sick. It is bad for our economy and it is bad for our humanity. I commend this bill. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022275c91f8-c6b8-42fd-b3ab-d8fc000dd41f\u0022 data-id=\u0022adfb8bb1e0bb4864807d1770f8044883\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000291\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022275c91f8-c6b8-42fd-b3ab-d8fc000dd41f\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022adfb8bb1e0bb4864807d1770f8044883\u0022\u003EERICA STANFORD (National\u2014East Coast Bays):\u003C/span\u003E Madam Speaker, I too would like to join some of my other colleagues in this House in congratulating you on your ascendency to\u2014I was going to say, \u201Cthrone\u201D\u2014the Chair and wish you all the very best.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000292\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022275c91f8-c6b8-42fd-b3ab-d8fc000dd41f\u0022\u003EIt is at times like these that I always like to remind myself of that now infamous quote by the honourable Deborah Russell, who said, \u201CWe are seeing a number of small businesses really struggling after only a few weeks in a pretty bad situation, which must speak to the strength of those businesses going into this lockdown.\u201D That was the honourable Deborah Russell\u2014oh, she\u2019s not \u201CHon\u201D; hopes and prayers.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000293\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022b3488d0efe9f4ff9b5a5a1cc89bd8f23\u0022\u003EDavid Seymour\u003C/span\u003E: Why isn\u2019t she?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000294\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022275c91f8-c6b8-42fd-b3ab-d8fc000dd41f\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00226d63fc2195e94c49824bd85ab78d1155\u0022\u003EERICA STANFORD\u003C/span\u003E: Who knows. The reason I like to think about that quote is that it so perfectly encapsulates and sums up the view of the Government of business\u2014that they are a pit of money that can continually afford more and more and more costs placed upon them. It\u2019s really interesting actually, because we\u2019re at a time when this Government, on the one hand, is doling out cash in terms of extending business loans and wage subsidies because they\u2019re acknowledging that businesses are doing it tough, that they\u2019re needing to borrow money just to get by, and in the very same breath they\u2019re standing up here today and, on the other hand, piling on more and more and more costs on these businesses that cannot afford it.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000295\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022275c91f8-c6b8-42fd-b3ab-d8fc000dd41f\u0022\u003EWe are seeing businesses who are laying off staff, reducing hours, not hiring when people leave, and taking on these massive loans and not paying themselves, especially the small to medium sized enterprises in this country. They are doing it really tough, and the Government acknowledges that. It acknowledges that, on the one hand, by offering subsidies if they employ more people, and by giving loans and extending loan schemes. And yet, as I said, in the very same breath they are, on the other hand, taking that away by imposing more and more cost. It doesn\u2019t make sense.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000296\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022275c91f8-c6b8-42fd-b3ab-d8fc000dd41f\u0022\u003EAnd the Government has the audacity to lecture businesses today. They\u2019re up here lecturing businesses, saying to them, \u201CWell, it just makes sense. If you give more sick leave, it magically leads to more productivity, and some businesses understand that and they do it, and the rest, obviously, are just stupid. They don\u2019t understand productivity. Clearly, they don\u2019t know business. They perhaps even shouldn\u2019t even be in business if they don\u2019t understand productivity and how to increase productivity by simply giving some more sick leave.\u201D\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000297\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022275c91f8-c6b8-42fd-b3ab-d8fc000dd41f\u0022\u003EThe fact is that even the regulatory impact statement (RIS) points out that there is limited evidence on this. There are some overseas studies. They talk about anecdotes and assumptions, and the reason, Marja Lubeck, that they are not able to say that the billion dollars in costs is offset by a certain figure is because they can\u2019t. There\u2019s nothing in the RIS that says that the billion dollars in costs will be offset by X amount of increased productivity, because they can\u2019t. And further to that, there\u2019s a whole lot of unintended consequences that are brought up in the RIS which the Minister didn\u2019t talk about\u2014things like what are these companies going to do in terms of making up that cost. Are they going to pass that cost on in their prices, therefore increasing the cost of living to New Zealanders, which is what\u2019s been happening for the last three years of this Government in all the taxes and increased costs it\u2019s been piling on people? Will they reduce hours? Will they not take on part-time employees? Will they not take on women? Actually, they talk about that in the RIS\u2014will there be certain groups of people that they won\u2019t take on because they have traditionally more childcare responsibilities and usually take more leave? Those are things that are brought up in the regulatory impact statement.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000298\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022275c91f8-c6b8-42fd-b3ab-d8fc000dd41f\u0022\u003EA catchy election slogan does not make good policy, and we\u2019re seeing that in the RIS. \u201COh, double sick leave; it\u2019ll all be fine.\u201D, and then we get to the RIS which points out that actually there are a lot of considerations, a lot of issues, that this legislation brings up that are actually just being shunted down the line to the very hard-working Education and Workforce Committee, which I sit on, which will be looking at it. There are all kinds of consequences around entitlements for people who are working part time and whether or not you should bring this leave in straight away. There\u2019s a whole pile of work we have to now do because the work wasn\u2019t put into this piece of legislation. They didn\u2019t consult with business. They\u2019ve talked about that in the RIS. They went out and had a catchy election slogan because they knew it would win votes, but they didn\u2019t spend any time talking to business or actually developing good policy.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000299\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022275c91f8-c6b8-42fd-b3ab-d8fc000dd41f\u0022\u003EThe problem is there\u2014yes, there is a problem\u2014but they automatically go to piling costs on businesses rather than looking at other mechanisms of delivering the policy outcome. They already have the COVID-19 support leave scheme, but they didn\u2019t consider whether or not they could extend that or tweak that\u2014they went straight to rich businesses, apparently, who can just afford it.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022b464a62e-d900-452a-b842-e3cf4ccc6149\u0022 data-id=\u002221953ee35bcc4b2eb44f8ba171ba604e\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000300\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b464a62e-d900-452a-b842-e3cf4ccc6149\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002221953ee35bcc4b2eb44f8ba171ba604e\u0022\u003EARENA WILLIAMS (Labour\u2014Manurewa):\u003C/span\u003E Madam Speaker, thank you, and congratulations to you for your election to the position of Assistant Speaker. I find myself comically over-prepared for this first contribution that I make to the debate. I find myself also comically prepared in the face of an Opposition who would have us socialise the costs to all New Zealanders of the spread of the flu and colds and summer bugs, for the benefit of a minority of employers who do not already allow their workers to take the sick leave that they need simply to keep the germs to themselves. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000301\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b464a62e-d900-452a-b842-e3cf4ccc6149\u0022\u003EI wanted to talk about a couple of the reasons why I think this bill, which was introduced very ably by the new Minister for Workplace Relations and Safety, will be met with applause by my constituents in Manurewa, both workers and employers. By increasing sick leave, we\u2019re supporting workers, and giving people who care for their kids and dependents more flexibility to be part of paid work. It\u2019s important for people who I met on the campaign, like Flor. She\u2019s a cleaner in the Manukau Westfield in the Manurewa electorate, and she\u2019s a mum of two wee girls, a step-mum to another with complex health needs, and a carer for the elderly people in her family. As an employer myself, I know how much people like Flor contribute to their workplace. You give a busy mum a task and she\u2019ll get it done by five, and the members on the other side of the House who are employers will know that well. Flor wouldn\u2019t be able to contribute to the workplace safely and reliably without these 10 days\u2019 sick leave in the current environment. Why? Because, like many working mums, she\u2019s the pillar of her home, and her employers know that, too. But the reality in the workplace currently is without that statutory minimum, she\u2019s not realistically able to take those extra days\u2019 leave when she needs them. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000302\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b464a62e-d900-452a-b842-e3cf4ccc6149\u0022\u003EIt\u2019s also an important part of the package to support what the Government is already providing to businesses and workers as we accelerate the economy\u2014things like the free apprenticeships programme, which has doubled the number of female apprentices starting from 845 last year to 1,786 this year. They are themselves likely to be workers who are most reliant on the statutory minimums. It\u2019s important to expand the Small Business Cashflow (Loan) Scheme so businesses can invest more in technology which allows people to work more flexibly in their house. Those are some of the reasons why I commend this bill to the House. Thank you.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002253f86481-33c1-48b2-893b-c11cc0bd673d\u0022 data-id=\u0022ed6de9f531e84ad9abe7a2adbcd795ba\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000303\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002253f86481-33c1-48b2-893b-c11cc0bd673d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022ed6de9f531e84ad9abe7a2adbcd795ba\u0022\u003EHon PAUL GOLDSMITH (National):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Mr Speaker\u2014very good to have you back in the Chair. I suppose the number one, sort of, issue that has arisen by this bill is just a question of timing, because I don\u2019t think there\u2019s anybody who thinks this isn\u2019t a nice idea for New Zealanders to have access to more sick leave. Isn\u2019t that nice? I think everybody would agree that it would be nice if New Zealanders could have access to higher incomes and higher minimum wages. The whole purpose of good Government policy is to increase wages and to make it easier for New Zealanders to live their lives and look after themselves when they\u2019re sick and when their family are sick. So it\u2019s a nice thing to have.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000304\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002253f86481-33c1-48b2-893b-c11cc0bd673d\u0022\u003EThe question is: is this the moment in time when it makes sense to extend those rights and expectations of workers and burdens on employers? I think most people making a rational assessment of where we are as a country right now would have to say, well, hang on, maybe not. [Interruption]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000305\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022f4fd884e00b84b6ebd24d87c7c1ba1c3\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Order! That\u2019s not that much decorum, Mr Hipkins.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000306\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002253f86481-33c1-48b2-893b-c11cc0bd673d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00220529746fabe34dff9285c3d937632c4f\u0022\u003EHon PAUL GOLDSMITH\u003C/span\u003E: Thank you, Mr Speaker. So what we\u2019re facing right now is that the 500,000 small businesses in this country are facing very, very difficult times, particularly as a reflection of COVID, when they are struggling to keep their businesses afloat and employ New Zealanders. The economy is shrinking. This year it has fallen in economic growth at the fastest level, the biggest drop in the size of our economy in recent history\u2014in fact, in any history that you can go back to. So we\u2019re under incredible economic pressure. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000307\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002253f86481-33c1-48b2-893b-c11cc0bd673d\u0022\u003ENow, the Government has responded to this by borrowing a billion dollars a week and splurging money out across the economy. Now, that\u2019s fine. You know, that may have been required during the COVID lockdown, but it\u2019s not a real situation. You can\u2019t keep on doing that for ever. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000308\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022415065a1ff024c5292588a7795823733\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Order! Order! Order! I\u2019m now going to ask the member to speak to the bill. Sorry, I was slightly distracted and I came back and I thought he was talking about the next piece of legislation, the COVID matter. Let\u2019s talk to the bill.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000309\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002253f86481-33c1-48b2-893b-c11cc0bd673d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00229ebc799670e54d20bab21373ee34504a\u0022\u003EHon PAUL GOLDSMITH\u003C/span\u003E: Well, thank you, Mr Speaker. I am providing the basic context to this bill, and this bill is, as I say, another example of this Government adding costs and regulations to employers at a time, as I was trying to explain, when they are under intense pressure. They are under intense pressure as it is at the moment; they will be under more intense pressure when the inevitable happens and this Government stops borrowing and at the rate that it is at the moment, because we can\u2019t keep on doing that for ever. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000310\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002253f86481-33c1-48b2-893b-c11cc0bd673d\u0022\u003ESo what puzzles many New Zealanders right now is that given the pressures that we\u2019re facing, is it really the time to be continuing every week, it seems, to extend the burdens upon employers? It\u2019s very easy for a politician, the Prime Minister, to stand up during an election campaign and promise to give some New Zealanders the money that is owned by other New Zealanders\u2014to say, \u201COK, vote for us and we will make them give you more money.\u201D Well, it\u2019s very easy to do, but it\u2019s not very easy for those businesses to stay in business if they can\u2019t afford to pay the extra costs that are being imposed on them. It\u2019s not immaterial. We get the impression from some speakers on the other side that doubling the sick leave is not a matter of any consequence; it\u2019s just something that happens and it\u2019s no big deal. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000311\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002253f86481-33c1-48b2-893b-c11cc0bd673d\u0022\u003EWell, the estimates from the officials, the best that they can come up with\u2014and they\u2019re probably not very detailed, and that\u2019s what we\u2019ll need to be investigating when we have a look at the select committee\u2014is that it could be around a billion dollars. Now, that comes on top of additional costs in terms of the minimum wage increases, which have been very substantial, again, at a time when businesses are struggling, and a number of other regulatory impositions. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000312\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002253f86481-33c1-48b2-893b-c11cc0bd673d\u0022\u003ESo the only question that I have, and I\u2019d be very interested to explore this as the bill goes through, is how we expect that we will be able to grow the economy and create sustainable, higher living standards without businesses investing and growing. Right now it seems the Government is prepared to make it more difficult for that private sector to invest and grow. Look, it\u2019s all right for, you know, the city councils and the Government departments and all that to keep on providing more and more generous payments and salary arrangements, but, ultimately, it needs to be paid for by the private sector and that private sector needs to be based on competitiveness. Ultimately, the export sector needs to be internationally competitive and our domestic sector needs to be able to provide goods that people can afford. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000313\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00220966e6d4cb6a407280b8fb9463c8d314\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Order! Order! The member is now getting a second warning, and his last warning, to come back to the bill. This is not a general economic debate; it\u2019s a debate on a specific piece of legislation, and I\u2019ll remind the member that there\u2019s no obligation to fill a full 10 minutes.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000314\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002253f86481-33c1-48b2-893b-c11cc0bd673d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00223c59e4e3b0904b1683458a8c9c0ee7f7\u0022\u003EHon PAUL GOLDSMITH\u003C/span\u003E: Thank you very much, Mr Speaker. So I think I\u2019ve made my point, and the simple point is that this piece of legislation, the doubling of sick leave requirements, is something that is nice to have for a country, and the question is: is this the right moment to be extending that thing, which is nice to have, given the incredible pressures that we have at the moment?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000315\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022098b8334-57f8-4062-bac6-bfbc3474e88e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022f5b490884a3649d38e0bb44f96feae9a\u0022\u003EHon Michael Wood\u003C/span\u003E: A nice to have\u2014stay at home when you\u2019re sick.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000316\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002253f86481-33c1-48b2-893b-c11cc0bd673d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022d0f0b98a8cd247cebf55936b104f32b1\u0022\u003EHon PAUL GOLDSMITH\u003C/span\u003E: Well, if it\u2019s nice to have, why don\u2019t you just double it again, make it four weeks? We have to have some sort of arbitrary limit. So the question is: why is it right, right now, to double those requirements and put those, because it\u2019s not a free thing that you\u2019re offering? It needs to be paid for by somebody. If you\u2019re saying that now is the moment to do it, well, OK, please provide us the evidence as to why now is the time to do it, at a time when businesses are struggling more than ever. Thank you very much, Mr Speaker.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022a1f7bbd1-b6ae-41c0-963b-dbe1251f5540\u0022 data-id=\u00229fb95157434049d1879d0bf1051ff042\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000317\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a1f7bbd1-b6ae-41c0-963b-dbe1251f5540\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00229fb95157434049d1879d0bf1051ff042\u0022\u003EKIERAN McANULTY (Labour\u2014Wairarapa):\u003C/span\u003E Right throughout the National Party\u2019s time in this House we\u2019ve heard the same old arguments that we\u2019re hearing in response to this bill. They opposed Working for Families, and yet they didn\u2019t repeal it. They opposed increasing annual leave, and yet they didn\u2019t repeal it. And today we hear them oppose the proposal to extend sick leave, and not once did we hear them say that they would repeal it. Why? Because when they\u2019re in Opposition they make a lot of noise, but, actually, when they\u2019re in Government, they realise in order to get there they had to give people what they want. And we\u2019ve heard talk of a lot of costs, scaremongering of costs\u2014the same arguments we heard around the minimum wage. \u201CIf we increase the minimum wage, businesses will fail!\u201D\u2014no evidence, of course, and despite the fact that every single year when the National Party were in Government they increased the minimum wage. Yet when this Government does it, they oppose it. Why? Because when it\u2019s their idea it\u2019s good\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000318\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00220d9ffbc54f5c4690894032c0083f0232\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Order! Order! The member will resume his seat when I\u2019m on my feet. The member\u2019s had a good minute for his introduction; he will now get on to the bill.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000319\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a1f7bbd1-b6ae-41c0-963b-dbe1251f5540\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00225f719feec95a48ed83684ae9015f4c97\u0022\u003EKIERAN McANULTY\u003C/span\u003E: Thank you, Mr Speaker. There is a simple principle at play here: if someone is crook, they shouldn\u2019t have to go to work. And what we find with five days, particularly with workers that have child dependents and have to look after their children when they\u2019re crook, is they are forced to go to work when they\u2019re ill. That makes other people ill. We learnt that from COVID. The question was posed: why are we doing it now? Well, I would say that we\u2019ve certainly learnt a lot over the last few months, and productivity is affected when people go to work crook, and other people are crook, and therefore they have to take sick leave. But if the provisions are there to allow people to take the time they need to get better, less people get crook, less businesses are impacted, and we can all be more productive. It\u2019s not very\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000320\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a97587363072431a9605fd2fbab6915d\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Fewer. Fewer, not less.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000321\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a1f7bbd1-b6ae-41c0-963b-dbe1251f5540\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022412c8d7d6bf0464b9ab305f19b3f6e79\u0022\u003EKIERAN McANULTY\u003C/span\u003E: Right. Well, thanks for that, Mr Speaker. I appreciate that. I\u2019ll remember that next time you ask me not to involve you in the debate. So, Mr Speaker, thank you very much. I\u2019ve said all I need to say. This is a good bill.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca id=\u0022e65676a61dec4965b413eae8aca41ed1\u0022 name=\u0022division\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EA party vote was called for on the question, That the Holidays (Increasing Sick Leave) Amendment Bill be now read a first time.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EAyes 76\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand Labour 64; Green Party of Aotearoa New Zealand 10; Te Paati M\u0101ori 2.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENoes 43\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand National 33; ACT New Zealand 10.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EMotion agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000322\u0022\u003EBill read a first time.\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022 data-id=\u0022fe4fe8521a994519b903e759065cca7f\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000323\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022fe4fe8521a994519b903e759065cca7f\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: The question is, That the Holidays (Increasing Sick Leave) Amendment Bill be considered by the Education and Workforce Committee.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000324\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003EMotion agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000325\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003EBill referred to the Education and Workforce Committee. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000326\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u0022d584162c29724606acbd2d053b130387\u0022\u003EInstruction to the Education and Workforce Committee\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022098b8334-57f8-4062-bac6-bfbc3474e88e\u0022 data-id=\u002249007305418f464da50b4072860fd841\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000327\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022098b8334-57f8-4062-bac6-bfbc3474e88e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002249007305418f464da50b4072860fd841\u0022\u003EHon MICHAEL WOOD (Minister for Workplace Relations and Safety):\u003C/span\u003E I move, That the Holidays (Increasing Sick Leave) Amendment Bill be reported to the House by 6 April 2021.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca id=\u0022b4263ef74c3d42bfb9bd058b87874033\u0022 name=\u0022division\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EA party vote was called for on the question, That the Holidays (Increasing Sick Leave) Amendment Bill be reported to the House by 6 April 2021.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EAyes 76\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand Labour 64; Green Party of Aotearoa New Zealand 10; Te Paati M\u0101ori 2.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENoes 43\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand National 33; ACT New Zealand 10.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EMotion agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n    \u003C/div\u003E\n    \u003Cdiv class=\u0022HpsHansard\u0022\u003E\n      \u003Cp\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsProceedingHeading\u0022\u003EBills\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000328\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u0022095a0218cf4c4df8a78e733e5adbfe19\u0022\u003ETaxation (Income Tax Rate and Other Amendments) Bill\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000329\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u0022f76613167fda467bb6458b9f37a93635\u0022\u003EIntroduction\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022 data-id=\u00222dfc4051031846b7a715e68b356aefb9\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000330\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00222dfc4051031846b7a715e68b356aefb9\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: I understand it is the intention of the Government to introduce a bill.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022\u0022 data-id=\u00224187041610f34af190fd3da2e0ffc604\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000331\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00224187041610f34af190fd3da2e0ffc604\u0022\u003ECLERK\u003C/span\u003E: Taxation (Income Tax Rate and Other Amendments) Bill. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022 data-id=\u0022b033f4c43c10402099c4fb9adacfe025\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000332\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022b033f4c43c10402099c4fb9adacfe025\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: That bill is set down for first reading. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n    \u003C/div\u003E\n    \u003Cdiv class=\u0022HpsHansard\u0022\u003E\n      \u003Cp\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsProceedingHeading\u0022\u003EBills\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000333\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u00223a0529a5c1bc438bbce4989aa2ef0a86\u0022\u003ECOVID-19 Public Health Response Amendment Bill\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000334\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u00228e74ceae52324855ace00cec1b8df574\u0022\u003EFirst Reading\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022 data-id=\u0022ef3200a55b984f7e9d8971617d96fe6b\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000335\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022ef3200a55b984f7e9d8971617d96fe6b\u0022\u003EHon CHRIS HIPKINS (Minister for COVID-19 Response):\u003C/span\u003E I present to the House a legislative statement on the COVID-19 Public Health Response Amendment Bill. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000336\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003ELegislative statement published under the authority of the House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000337\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00227bbbcd14aba04985bf2a0c344ab5e728\u0022\u003EHon CHRIS HIPKINS\u003C/span\u003E: I move, That the COVID-19 Public Health Response Amendment Bill be now read a first time. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000338\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003EI hope that this bill will be a relatively non-controversial bill. It is a simple bill that does two things, and at the end of my speech introducing this bill, I am going to seek leave for a slightly different process to facilitate it through the House, following discussion amongst the parties on both sides of the House. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000339\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003EThe bill, basically, does two things, as I\u2019ve indicated. The first thing it does is relatively simple: it changes references to the Minister of Health to the Minister responsible for the Act, and that\u2019s quite simple. At the moment, the Minister of Health is the Minister who issues orders and issues exemptions from orders under the Act. That is a power that I have exercised for most of the time that the Act has been in existence, first as Minister of Health, and, secondly, more latterly, since the new Government was sworn in, under section 7 of the Constitution Act 1986, where I have been exercising the powers of Minister of Health. This will tidy that up and make sure that I\u2019m not exercising powers on behalf of another Minister; that I am, in fact, exercising the powers as the Minister responsible for the Act\u2014a relatively simple technical adjustment that reflects the fact that there is now a Minister for COVID-19 Response, which there was not when the legislation was first introduced, and that power was vested with the Minister of Health. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000340\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003ETo be clear, the orders that we\u2019re talking about are things like the air border order, the maritime border order, our isolation and quarantine order, the orders requiring people to be tested, and any orders that are issued relating to alert levels. They will now be issued, once this is passed, in my name, as the Minister for COVID-19 Response, rather than in the name of the Minister of Health. Similarly, exemptions to those orders will be granted by me as Minister for COVID-19 Response. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000341\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003EThe second amendment that the bill makes\u2014that, again, I hope will be relatively non-controversial\u2014is it allows the Government to remove restrictions made under orders with less than 48 hours\u2019 notice. At the moment, if we escalate up alert levels, in order to de-escalate, to move back down the alert levels, we have to give 48 hours\u2019 notice of that. In some instances where we\u2019re simply removing restrictions, it makes sense to be able to move more quickly. For example, if at the moment I was to remove the requirement for people to wear masks on public transport, I would have to give 48 hours\u2019 notice of that. In reality, once we get to the point where we\u2019re satisfied that there is no longer a risk that would justify the wearing of masks, it should be possible for us to remove that restriction much more quickly than having to provide 48 hours\u2019 notice. So this bill would allow us to remove restrictions faster. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000342\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003EI think there is good reason to say where we\u2019re imposing new restrictions, where it is not a genuine emergency, then we should give 48 hours\u2019 notice of introducing a new requirement, but we shouldn\u2019t necessarily need to give 48 hours\u2019 notice to remove one. So the bill allows us to move more quickly with regard to that. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000343\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003ESo that\u2019s the conclusion of my first reading contribution, and I seek leave, Mr Speaker\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000344\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022b7e7d54e6c03479bb7107a772d8df083\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: The question is that the motion be agreed to. Chris Hipkins, seeking leave.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000345\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022bc0b9167e65844c4a6ce29427c5c1b50\u0022\u003EHon CHRIS HIPKINS\u003C/span\u003E: Thank you, Mr Speaker. I seek leave that there be no debate on the second reading of the COVID-19 Public Health Response Amendment Bill and that there be no committee stage on the bill.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022 data-id=\u00225a9b841a05034ed6a6edd67e2d1628cf\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000346\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00225a9b841a05034ed6a6edd67e2d1628cf\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Is there any objection to that process? There appears to be none.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002257e41e9d-285b-4fb3-847d-a63820ae7137\u0022 data-id=\u00222ba88203a6df4ef787ecb3cb1c56ca6d\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000347\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002257e41e9d-285b-4fb3-847d-a63820ae7137\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00222ba88203a6df4ef787ecb3cb1c56ca6d\u0022\u003ECHRIS BISHOP (National):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you very much, Mr Speaker. The National Opposition will be supporting the passage of this bill through its particularly truncated passage through the House. We think it\u2019s a, to the extent that it does anything, sensible piece of legislation. I do have to wonder at the utility of the change\u2014essentially, the name change\u2014from transferring the powers from the Minister of Health to the Minister for COVID-19 Response, as the bill statement, under the new Standing Orders, that has been issued by the Minister makes clear. Section 7 of the Constitution Act 1986 allows for any member of the Executive Council to exercise powers conferred on another Minister under legislation. So, yeah, for tidiness, I suppose, it\u2019s useful to have the Minister for COVID19 Response in the legislation rather than the Minister of Health, but I\u2019m not really sure it was absolutely required. The explanatory note says it shouldn\u2019t be relied on in the long term and an amendment for flexibility and accuracy is appropriate. I suppose that\u2019s true. So, if you\u2019re legislating anyway, I suppose you may as well chuck it in the legislation as a minor amendment. But there\u2019s only one other item in the legislation.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000348\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002257e41e9d-285b-4fb3-847d-a63820ae7137\u0022\u003EI should say also, sir, that we have a supplementary amendment to make the Minister of Health be added alongside the Prime Minister and the Minister of Justice to the people who must be consulted mandatorily during the development of the orders under the Act, and that flows from the change I\u2019ve just talked about. That makes sense, but the only other thing is the 48 hours\u2019 notice requirement, and that\u2019s, really, the sort of heart\u2014to the extent this bill has a heart\u2014of the bill and we support that. And I suspect, without knowing for sure, it was a drafting error at the time the initial COVID legislation was drafted, and no one\u2019s going to be particularly hard on the Parliamentary Counsel Office, who do a very good job, for possibly a technical error because it was drafted in haste, I suspect, and again the exigencies of the situation demanded that and, of course, you\u2019d expect perhaps an error or two. So we think it does make sense to allow the flexibility for when you\u2019re going down the alert levels, if the Government decides\u2014or the Minister, in this case, decides\u2014to promulgate a change to the alert levels, for example, or a particular element of the alert level changes. The Minister has talked about mask wearing on public transport, for example, but people could think about other examples as well. Not having to give 48 hours\u2019 notice when going down an alert level, we think, makes sense.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000349\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002257e41e9d-285b-4fb3-847d-a63820ae7137\u0022\u003ESo, look, we don\u2019t wish to hold up the House. There\u2019s a tax bill after this, and I know that members on this side of the House are far more interested in talking about the taxation response from the Government than this very minor but useful bill. Thanks.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022098b8334-57f8-4062-bac6-bfbc3474e88e\u0022 data-id=\u0022eac7471d177a47a198ceb13d73a455e4\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000350\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022098b8334-57f8-4062-bac6-bfbc3474e88e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022eac7471d177a47a198ceb13d73a455e4\u0022\u003EHon MICHAEL WOOD (Minister of Transport):\u003C/span\u003E I rise to take a brief call on the COVID-19 Public Health Response Amendment Bill. I acknowledge the previous speaker for his enthusiastic and full-throated support for it. The issue that I just want to briefly focus on is the 48-hour stand-down changes. Just before I do that, the thing I do want to note is that this piece of legislation is an important part of the overall legislative infrastructure for how we have managed our way through an extraordinary year. I think the way in which the Parliament and the Government have been able to come together to ensure that we have legislation that\u2019s fit for purpose, that enables quick decisions to be made in the public health interest, while also making sure that there is parliamentary oversight, has actually been a bit of a standout success story of our democracy this year. I acknowledge all parties and all members for that.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000351\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022098b8334-57f8-4062-bac6-bfbc3474e88e\u0022\u003EIn terms of this particular bill, the removal of the requirement for there to be 48 hours\u2019 notice when there is a movement down in alert levels I think is one that everyone would acknowledge is a sensible and pragmatic one. Of course, we all understand why there needs to be notice before alert levels are lifted. They do, by their nature, require an imposition on people, on businesses, and organisations, and it is only reasonable that there is a period before which people are required to comply with what are sometimes some quite major restrictions. But when it goes in the other direction and we\u2019re shifting back towards a more normal mode for people, for businesses, and other organisations, there is no particular need on an ongoing basis for there to be a 48-hour period. Obviously, sometimes the changes in going down alert levels will still take organisations some time to implement, but there is no need for there to be a requirement around that. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000352\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022098b8334-57f8-4062-bac6-bfbc3474e88e\u0022\u003ESo that change and the others reflected in this bill are all pretty sensible, all pretty pragmatic, and contribute to us having an ongoing piece of legislation that helps us to keep New Zealanders safe in these challenging times. I commend the bill to the House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022 data-id=\u0022d30053023a134b5aa51bd1b7efabc29a\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000353\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022d30053023a134b5aa51bd1b7efabc29a\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: The question is that the motion be agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000354\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003EMotion agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000355\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003EBill read a first time.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000356\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u00224b09526fbaf5401ea2f1bd2d68bd9c92\u0022\u003ESecond Reading\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022098b8334-57f8-4062-bac6-bfbc3474e88e\u0022 data-id=\u00221b347782c606419898001fb6b6b84c56\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000357\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022098b8334-57f8-4062-bac6-bfbc3474e88e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00221b347782c606419898001fb6b6b84c56\u0022\u003EHon MICHAEL WOOD (Minister of Transport) \u003C/span\u003Eon behalf of the Minister for COVID-19 Response: I move, That the COVID-19 Public Health Response Amendment Bill be now read a second time. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022 data-id=\u002270d1c58b7ab84da79318480679194da2\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000358\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002270d1c58b7ab84da79318480679194da2\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: The question is that the motion be agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000359\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003EMotion agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000360\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003EBill read a second time.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000361\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u00227d2347936b274a31b0a283204940b2b3\u0022\u003EThird Reading\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022098b8334-57f8-4062-bac6-bfbc3474e88e\u0022 data-id=\u002200e80620ec9f441a9f98ea0dd867d1b4\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000362\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022098b8334-57f8-4062-bac6-bfbc3474e88e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002200e80620ec9f441a9f98ea0dd867d1b4\u0022\u003EHon MICHAEL WOOD (Minister of Transport) \u003C/span\u003Eon behalf of the Minister for COVID-19 Response: I move, That the COVID-19 Public Health Response Amendment Bill be now read a third time. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022 data-id=\u0022a49143440bf14480b152f3236f6ca272\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000363\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022a49143440bf14480b152f3236f6ca272\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: The question is that the motion be agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000364\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003EMotion agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000365\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003EBill read a third time.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n    \u003C/div\u003E\n    \u003Cdiv class=\u0022HpsHansard\u0022\u003E\n      \u003Cp\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsProceedingHeading\u0022\u003EBills\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000366\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u0022ce2f9c0f7f064d79bd370d73dd258e55\u0022\u003ETaxation (Income Tax Rate and Other Amendments) Bill\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000367\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u0022da4feb6152c0452c80381d135fb1999e\u0022\u003EFirst Reading\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022098b8334-57f8-4062-bac6-bfbc3474e88e\u0022 data-id=\u00220cdad5da22d64f61b9d98863b790d6a3\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000368\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022098b8334-57f8-4062-bac6-bfbc3474e88e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00220cdad5da22d64f61b9d98863b790d6a3\u0022\u003EHon MICHAEL WOOD (Minister of Transport)\u003C/span\u003E on behalf of the Minister of Revenue: I present a legislative statement on the Taxation (Income Tax Rate and Other Amendments) Bill.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000369\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022098b8334-57f8-4062-bac6-bfbc3474e88e\u0022\u003ELegislative statement published under the authority of the House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000370\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022098b8334-57f8-4062-bac6-bfbc3474e88e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022b0d4e79df4cc421d80435c0f24e9187e\u0022\u003EHon MICHAEL WOOD\u003C/span\u003E: I move, That the Taxation (Income Tax Rate and Other Amendments Bill) be read a first time.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000371\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022098b8334-57f8-4062-bac6-bfbc3474e88e\u0022\u003EThis bill, which signalled to the New Zealand public before the election and which has been advanced as a Government priority and signalled through the Speech from the Throne, is an important piece of legislation to ensure that New Zealand has a tax system which supports our recovery from COVID-19 and which makes sure that all New Zealanders are paying their fair share as a part of supporting our public services and supporting the recovery in the wake of COVID-19.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000372\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022098b8334-57f8-4062-bac6-bfbc3474e88e\u0022\u003EThe bill has a number of significant provisions. The first one is the introduction of a new top personal tax rate. The bill introduces a new personal top tax rate of 39 percent on incomes in excess of $180,000. This will apply from the tax year in 2021/22, and for most taxpayers that means that the new rate kicks in from 1 April 2021. There are a number of consequential changes to ensure that the new rate applies consistently across the personal income tax system, most of which will also apply from 1 April 2020.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000373\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022098b8334-57f8-4062-bac6-bfbc3474e88e\u0022\u003EThis change in the bill is probably the one that will attract the most debate in the House and in public debate, and it\u2019s one that this Government stands firmly behind. As we rebuild and recover from COVID-19, this is a Government that is absolutely determined that as a part of that recovery and rebuild, we will ensure that all New Zealanders have access to strong public services and that we manage the Government\u2019s books responsibly to ensure that we manage debt and pay it down as quickly as we can. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000374\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022098b8334-57f8-4062-bac6-bfbc3474e88e\u0022\u003EI think all members in all parties\u2014although they might vary in degrees around this\u2014will understand that the Government response to the global pandemic of COVID-19, and the serious economic impacts, is one that has required the Government to draw down on debt to ensure that we have a strong economic response. Key policies which were critical to New Zealand making it through this extremely challenging year of COVID-19 include measures such as the COVID relief scheme; include measures such as the wage subsidy scheme, which by itself required around about $14 billion of investment. I think there would be few people around the Chamber who would not recognise that those investments have been extremely important in terms of supporting New Zealand through this difficult year and keeping many people in jobs and keeping them connected with their employers.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000375\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022098b8334-57f8-4062-bac6-bfbc3474e88e\u0022\u003EThe reality of that situation means that we need to now have a fiscal plan which enables us to manage that expenditure, which enables us to manage the debt and move to a situation where we\u2019re paying it down as soon as we can. There have been Governments in the past who in response to difficult economic times, and particularly external economic crises, have used the opportunity to reduce public services; this Government will not do that. The imposition of a new top marginal tax rate of 39c in the dollar above $180 million is one of the core pieces of this legislation which will support our objectives in that space. It has the capacity to raise several hundred million dollars of additional revenue per year, which will support both of those Government objectives, continuing the public services that we need and paying down debt in the longer run.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000376\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022098b8334-57f8-4062-bac6-bfbc3474e88e\u0022\u003EI just want to make sure that it\u2019s very clear and on the record, because there has been some misunderstanding around this\u2014that we are talking about a marginal tax rate here. So, to be extremely explicit, that means that the new marginal tax rate of 39c in the dollar applies to income that is earned above $180,000 per year. There have been people, including members in this Chamber, who in their comments have incorrectly given the impression that this creates a tax impost that applies from the first dollar that is earned. It is extremely important to understand that this measure applies to income earned above $180,000. The best estimates that we hold tell us that this will affect between 2 and 3 percent of people who pay income tax in New Zealand.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000377\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022098b8334-57f8-4062-bac6-bfbc3474e88e\u0022\u003ESo this helps us to create a marginal tax system in which we\u2019re asking those who earn a little bit more\u2014the top 2 to 3 percent of income earners\u2014to just contribute a little bit more to ensure the maintenance of those public services and the responsible management of our debt situation. It\u2019s my view that after a year in which so many New Zealanders have given so much, so many New Zealanders have made sacrifices to help New Zealand get through, that it is not unreasonable for New Zealanders on the very highest incomes\u2014including, I note, members in this Chamber\u2014to make a small, additional contribution to ensure that we meet those objectives.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000378\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022098b8334-57f8-4062-bac6-bfbc3474e88e\u0022\u003EThe bill introduces a number of other changes to the taxation system. The first relates to secondary tax codes. The bill introduces a new tax code, tax code SA, for secondary employment earnings for an employee whose total income subject to PAYE is more than $180,000\u2014and that, in effect, is one of the measures which brings in the additional marginal tax rate. In terms of fringe benefit tax (FBT), to account for the introduction of a new top personal tax rate of 39 percent, the bill introduces a new top FBT rate of 63.93 percent applying to all-inclusive pay exceeding $129,680. There are further consequential changes consistent with the change of the top tax rate to resident withholding tax and to employer superannuation contribution tax. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000379\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022098b8334-57f8-4062-bac6-bfbc3474e88e\u0022\u003EOne of the other important parts of this bill is ensuring that we have appropriate measures in respect of information gathering from trustees. Trustee income is subject to a 33 percent final tax rate, and the bill proposes increased disclosure on trusts to help ensure that trusts aren\u2019t being used to avoid paying income tax at the rate of 39 percent. This is an issue which is usually explored when there are changes to income tax rates, to ensure that we don\u2019t create incentives for people to misrepresent sources of their income. Currently, trusts are required to file a return of income if they have taxable income. The changes in the bill specify certain information disclosures required as part of the trust\u2019s annual return of income. The amendments in the bill require trusts to provide information on distributions and settlements made in the income year, and financial information such as profit and loss statements and balance sheets. Those rules will apply for returns from the 2021/22 income year.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000380\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022098b8334-57f8-4062-bac6-bfbc3474e88e\u0022\u003EThe bill does also include the ability for the commissioner to request the information from trusts for prior income years back to 2013/2014. This will allow for comparable information to be gathered where appropriate.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000381\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022098b8334-57f8-4062-bac6-bfbc3474e88e\u0022\u003ENon-active trusts, which are trusts that don\u2019t have income or deductions, are not currently required to file, and this won\u2019t change under the rules introduced by this piece of legislation. Charitable trusts incorporated under the Charitable Trusts Act and M\u0101ori land trusts constituted under Te Ture Whenua Maori Act 1993 are also not affected by these changes. Foreign trusts are already subject to a robust registration and disclosure regime and are also not covered by these rules.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000382\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022098b8334-57f8-4062-bac6-bfbc3474e88e\u0022\u003EThe Commissioner of Inland Revenue has the power to request information from taxpayers when the information is required under Inland Revenue Acts or the information is required for any other function lawfully conferred on the commissioner. This bill contains a clarifying amendment to ensure that the commissioner can require information to be provided solely to assist with the development of tax policy. This is an important measure in the bill to help ensure the integrity of our tax system and to ensure that in the ongoing development of policy, we do understand how income is being reported and the ways in which people and entities may respond to changes that are made through the passage of this bill.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000383\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022098b8334-57f8-4062-bac6-bfbc3474e88e\u0022\u003EIn conclusion, I do commend this bill to the House. It is a piece of legislation that was well signalled by the Government as part of the Labour Party manifesto heading into the election. It is part of our commitment to ensure that we continue to support the public services that New Zealanders rely upon as we rebuild and recover from COVID-19. It is part of our long-term plan to responsibly manage debt, and the way in which we are doing that is by asking those 2 to 3 percent of New Zealand income earners who earn the highest incomes in our country to make a small additional contribution to make sure that we have a tax system that is able to support those objectives. I look forward to the debate and I commend this bill to the House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022859e13f9-33bb-41bb-b2f0-d848eaf25407\u0022 data-id=\u0022c64a9e332109476080402fdc3e19e6da\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000384\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022859e13f9-33bb-41bb-b2f0-d848eaf25407\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022c64a9e332109476080402fdc3e19e6da\u0022\u003EANDREW BAYLY (National\u2014Port Waikato):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Mr Speaker. I rise to talk on the Taxation (Income Tax Rate and Other Amendments) Bill. I\u2019ll just pick up on the first point, which is by the speaker who\u2019s just sat down, the Minister Michael Wood. If this intent to put in place this tax change has been signalled so well, why is it that the papers and the actual legislation have only literally been tabled probably less than 45 minutes ago? I think it is absolutely outrageous that a major tax bill has not been tabled so the Opposition can have a proper review of it. It is a significant piece of legislation. I just think, in terms of procedure and in terms of good governance, especially as this piece of legislation is going to be rammed through by this Government under urgency, which means that it\u2019s literally probably going to be passed by tonight\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000385\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002257e41e9d-285b-4fb3-847d-a63820ae7137\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00223a2ab4f802714f56ac250a712ba9057e\u0022\u003EChris Bishop\u003C/span\u003E: Tomorrow.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000386\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c83012b4-3939-4753-80fc-1956a3e2bd1e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022dec1ca5d3fdb46e4ae35bc2a1b887453\u0022\u003EHon Michael Woodhouse\u003C/span\u003E: Tomorrow morning.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000387\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022859e13f9-33bb-41bb-b2f0-d848eaf25407\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022838d5580bec6424d8a422b770ab3c52b\u0022\u003EANDREW BAYLY\u003C/span\u003E: Or maybe tomorrow morning, right? But we\u2019re going to have no input from any tax advisers, no consultation with the tax community or the business community. This is a piece of legislation that has been worked out by the Government in secret and tabled at the last moment so people cannot see what\u2019s in it. If I went out to the tax community right now and said, \u201CWhat\u2019s in here?\u201D, they would not know.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000388\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022859e13f9-33bb-41bb-b2f0-d848eaf25407\u0022\u003EJust to raise the issue, it is a complicated bill, as set out in the legislative statement from the Minister. This tax bill will not only involve a new piece of legislation with that, but will have the impact on PAYE rules, fringe benefit tax, resident withholding tax, employer\u2019s superannuation contribution tax, residential land withholding tax, retirement scheme contribution tax, taxable M\u0101ori authority distribution non-declaration rate. It is a complicated bill. This is how you end up with tax bills that create the opportunity for people to work their way around it, because it hasn\u2019t been properly thought out, it hasn\u2019t had the proper consultation, and it hasn\u2019t gone through a proper select committee. I think it\u2019s outrageous\u2014absolutely outrageous.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000389\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022859e13f9-33bb-41bb-b2f0-d848eaf25407\u0022\u003EBut let\u2019s just talk about the general intent of this bill. This bill seeks to raise $550 million\u2014half a billion dollars. So just to put it in context. As a Government we raise roughly about $85 billion a year from tax revenue. So this is $550 million\u2014it\u2019s less than 1 percent. So here we are, we\u2019ve got this piece of legislation, and we\u2019ve got debt that\u2019s gone from $60 billion to just under $100 billion over the last seven months, and which is forecast to double again to $200 billion\u2014eye-watering amounts of money. In fact, the annual cost of the current debt is about $3.5 billion, projected. That is the same cost it takes to run the New Zealand Police force.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000390\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022859e13f9-33bb-41bb-b2f0-d848eaf25407\u0022\u003ESo $3.5 billion just to pay the interest costs. And, by the way, because we\u2019re not making any money in the country, we\u2019re borrowing to pay the interest, which is really bad. But here we are, we\u2019ve got a bill we\u2019re ramming through that\u2019s going to raise $550 million. It\u2019s a pittance in terms of the New Zealand Government\u2019s tax revenue. But the issue about this is you cannot tax your way out of a recession. New Zealand is essentially in a recession. You cannot tax your way out, and raising half a billion bucks is not going to do it by any means. The issue about what this Government should be talking about today and what we should be debating is how we\u2019re going to grow the economy of New Zealand.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000391\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022859e13f9-33bb-41bb-b2f0-d848eaf25407\u0022\u003EI think the worst thing about this\u2014because it\u2019s going to be rushed through\u2014is we\u2019re going to, basically, create an environment where there are going to be unwelcome behaviours. There is such a thing as legitimate tax avoidance, and there\u2019s a thing about evasion of tax. So there is an issue about minimising tax legitimately and when you do things illegally. And this piece of legislation has got the potential to lead people down a route of trying to minimise their tax\u2014and they have a legitimate right to do that.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000392\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022859e13f9-33bb-41bb-b2f0-d848eaf25407\u0022\u003ESo the first question\u2014even the half-billion dollars that they\u2019re quoting that they\u2019re going to raise out of it\u2014is we have no indication whether, in fact, that $500 million is going to be achieved. I suspect that is going to be something we will be focusing on over the next three years, because the expectation that people are going to pay this tax and pay that amount of money, I think, will be maybe seen to be a bit of an issue.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000393\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022859e13f9-33bb-41bb-b2f0-d848eaf25407\u0022\u003EBut I think the other thing about this bill is the only beneficiaries out of it are, basically, going to be tax lawyers and tax accountants. We\u2019re going to spawn another regeneration of those types of people, because they love it. The one thing about the New Zealand tax system at the moment is we are the envy of the world because it\u2019s a very simple system. We have one GST rate, we have four personal tax rates, and we have one simple company tax rate. And here we are, we\u2019re going back\u2014this is back to the future, by the way, because we used to have a higher tax rate and, of course, that\u2019s all been reduced over time. And here we are, we\u2019re going to now go back to the future and raise the top tax rate. I think, as I keep saying, the complications around this are very, very significant.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000394\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022859e13f9-33bb-41bb-b2f0-d848eaf25407\u0022\u003ESo just to talk a little bit on it, I think the first thing is: what\u2019s going to happen before the bill comes into play? So there is going to be a significant push to make sure those people in the situation will try to leapfrog before this legislation comes into play. So you\u2019re going to see things like early payment of bonuses to employees, and you\u2019re going to see early payment of dividends. So already in the tax system, there will be people sitting there and trying to work out how to minimise the tax, and they are legitimate queries and actions they can do. So we\u2019re going to see behaviours even before the bill comes into play.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000395\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022859e13f9-33bb-41bb-b2f0-d848eaf25407\u0022\u003EOnce it comes into play, I think the biggest issue is we have now ended up with quite a complicated structure. We\u2019re going to have a top tax rate of 39 percent, we are going to have a trust rate of 33 percent, we\u2019re going to have a company tax rate of 28 percent, and we\u2019re going to have a top portfolio investment entity (PIE) rate of 28 percent. And what we\u2019ve done\u2014and we are now going to end up with the biggest gap between a top personal tax rate and those other entity tax rates. That is the biggest mismatch in terms of having a high tax rate versus a low tax rate since, I think, the early 2000s. That is why there was a lot of effort put into simplifying the tax system. And what we\u2019ve done here with this bill is we\u2019re going to make it incredibly more complicated.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000396\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022859e13f9-33bb-41bb-b2f0-d848eaf25407\u0022\u003ESo the issue with trusts, which is an important issue\u2014we\u2019re going to have a rate of 33 percent versus 39 percent. So that will drive certain behaviours. And this bill has got some most Draconian aspects to it\u2014particularly new section 17GB, where the Commissioner of Inland Revenue may require information or production of documents for tax policy. But, more specifically in relation to trusts, around new section 59BA there is a lot more information which is a way of the Government trying to deal with the issue of why the system will be at risk. So the simple raison d\u2019\u00EAtre\u2014the reason for bringing in this tax\u2014is already compromising the tax system.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000397\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022859e13f9-33bb-41bb-b2f0-d848eaf25407\u0022\u003EThe other aspect to it is the large differential between the corporate and the new top personal rate. Just to highlight this\u2014yes, this is the figure I\u2019ve got: the biggest differential we have was 9 percent in 2009, and differential since the year ended 31 March 2012 was 5 percent. So we\u2019ve got this very large differential of 11 percent now. That is really significant in terms of good tax policy.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000398\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022859e13f9-33bb-41bb-b2f0-d848eaf25407\u0022\u003EThe other thing is around family holding companies\u2014what happens to them. The last thing is the PIE rates: how people are going to use those entities. So all we\u2019re going to do is we\u2019ve got a Government going to have to spend the next two-three years pushing through new changes and updating this legislation through the Finance and Expenditure Committee where, hopefully, we will start to get some experts turning up and telling the Government why they\u2019ve done this wrong and why they should have actually paused and done it properly, and we\u2019re going to spend a whole host of time actually fixing up a bad piece of legislation.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002212d74f81-b1f7-4b51-9fb4-8f9481477192\u0022 data-id=\u0022f638608aed8e41a0ae966b52edb550f9\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000399\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002212d74f81-b1f7-4b51-9fb4-8f9481477192\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022f638608aed8e41a0ae966b52edb550f9\u0022\u003EDr DEBORAH RUSSELL (Labour\u2014New Lynn):\u003C/span\u003E This is an excellent piece of legislation\u2014an excellent piece of legislation\u2014that fulfils a key campaign promise made by the Labour Party, and as the party that was elected by over half of New Zealanders, we have a New Zealand that has endorsed this legislation and has accepted it, and we are implementing our campaign promise. So it is straightforward legislation that implements a campaign promise.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000400\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002212d74f81-b1f7-4b51-9fb4-8f9481477192\u0022\u003EI wish to take issue with a number of things that the immediately previous speaker, Andrew Bayly, said about this bill. First up, the immediately previous speaker said that it was a complicated piece of legislation\u2014a complicated piece of legislation. To the contrary, it is actually a very simple piece of legislation. What is does\u2014very straightforwardly\u2014is implement a 39 percent tax rate on income over $180,000, and in order to do that properly, it entails making sure that that particular rate change goes through all the relevant sections of the Act. It affects not just the income tax paid on, say, salaries and wages and business income and so on, but it also affects the rate paid on fringe benefit tax. So the fringe benefit tax changes in here\u2014the rate changes in here\u2014simply reflect the 39 percent rate. It is a simple change, which happens regularly when tax rate changes go through.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000401\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002212d74f81-b1f7-4b51-9fb4-8f9481477192\u0022\u003EThe same thing applies with respect to the employer superannuation contribution tax, the ESCT. The changes there simply reflect the 39 percent rate being applied across all the relevant types of tax within the Income Tax Act. And so on it goes, with residential land withholding tax, with retirement scheme contribution tax, with the taxable M\u0101ori authority distributions\u2014any place where the rate is determined by the Income Tax Act, any place in the Income Tax Act where that occurs, any particular type of tax it applies to, that rate is simply applied right through those changes. So that\u2019s what we see in this Act: that 39 percent rate being implemented right through the relevant tax types in order to reflect the change in the income tax rate. So it is not a complicated piece of legislation. It is a set of simple technical changes that are made every time a rate change is made. It is straightforward. It has been done many times before. It is not difficult to do at all. So it is a simple bill.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000402\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002212d74f81-b1f7-4b51-9fb4-8f9481477192\u0022\u003EIt is also a very, very important bill\u2014a very important bill\u2014because at its heart lies the concept of fairness and vertical equity in taxation; the idea that the way we do fairness in taxation, and this has been proven again and again in New Zealand, is we do it by using a progressive income tax scale. And a progressive income tax scale means that those who earn more pay a little bit more tax. In particular, in this case, what we are saying is that people who earn over $180,000 should pay just 6c more in the dollar for income over $180,000\u2014just 6c more. So, if someone earns $190,000, they are simply paying 6c more in the dollar for those first $10,000\u2014for that $10,000. It\u2019s a change of $600. That\u2019s it. And so on it goes, up through. If someone earns $200,000, they pay $1,200 more tax. So someone who earns $20,000 more than $180,000\u2014which is a high income in the first place\u2014simply pays $1,200 more tax. It is a small change. And the interesting thing about that $180,000 threshold is that only 2 percent of New Zealanders earn income above $180,000. Many members of this House do not earn that much. The salaries of backbench MPs fall below that threshold. That is how high the threshold is set. So it applies to only a very small percentage of New Zealanders.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000403\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002212d74f81-b1f7-4b51-9fb4-8f9481477192\u0022\u003EIn terms of fairness, it\u2019s really worth considering income tax rates that have applied in the past. We remember, those of us who are old enough, and I appreciate that some people in this House are not, when, under the National Government led by Robert Muldoon, the top tax rate was 66c in the dollar\u201466c in the dollar under a National Government. I certainly remember that rate, Mr Speaker; I imagine you do too.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000404\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00222a8e19d6fc2a41c18d99ead9720a751b\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: I never paid it.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000405\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002212d74f81-b1f7-4b51-9fb4-8f9481477192\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002249a48397a88948bca7d0c8624a65a4d8\u0022\u003EDr DEBORAH RUSSELL\u003C/span\u003E: It was an extraordinarily high rate.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000406\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00220a750b74530c49ad8760a5002d21b052\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: I was an MP at the time.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000407\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002212d74f81-b1f7-4b51-9fb4-8f9481477192\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00222aab58b08c7246e19fb6f4a6378628ab\u0022\u003EDr DEBORAH RUSSELL\u003C/span\u003E: So I think it is not an outrageous rate. It is simply a rate that expresses our ideals of a fair tax system being a progressive tax system.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000408\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002212d74f81-b1f7-4b51-9fb4-8f9481477192\u0022\u003EI wish to address the issue that Mr Bayly raised about tax avoidance. First of all, he said that tax avoidance was acceptable, which is actually not the case. If we look at section BG 1 of the Income Tax Act, it says that a tax avoidance arrangement may be struck down by the Commissioner of Inland Revenue. A tax avoidance arrangement is an arrangement whereby someone sets out to exploit the tax laws in such a way that they pay less tax than they otherwise would have. It\u2019s when people enter into complicated arrangements the purpose of which is avoiding taxation, and it is against the Income Tax Act.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000409\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002212d74f81-b1f7-4b51-9fb4-8f9481477192\u0022\u003EMr Bayly did raise the point that the last time there was a differential rate between the highest income tax rate and the trustee income tax rate, we did see some tax avoidance behaviour, and indeed that tax avoidance behaviour was caught and penalised by the courts. They did their job. The tax avoidance arrangement was famously ruled out. So our courts and our laws do have the tools to deal with tax avoidance. Of course, there are many very, very smart and able tax accountants and tax lawyers, and no doubt some of them will find some way through these rules; that\u2019s what they do, and then we respond. It\u2019s the way that the tax law grows and evolves. But, in order to manage this, we will be collecting more information to see if there is a need to make further changes, to see if there is a need to make a change to the trustee rate as well. So that\u2019s part of what this bill does. It enables the revenue to collect some more information so that they have better information against which to assess whether or not they should advise us to change that trustee rate. So that information will be collected and used in order to develop better policy in this space.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000410\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002212d74f81-b1f7-4b51-9fb4-8f9481477192\u0022\u003EI do just wish to point out one other thing here: that Mr Bayly was very concerned about the differential between the income tax rate and the company tax rate. That differential has existed for quite some time, and it is already well managed; the tools are there to do it. Of course, we can improve those over time, but there is not a screaming need to do that right at present.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000411\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002212d74f81-b1f7-4b51-9fb4-8f9481477192\u0022\u003EI wish to draw attention to one other matter that is sitting in this bill, and that is an increase to the minimum family tax credit. Now, that is a tax credit that exists in order to ensure that people who are in work do end up just having slightly more income than people who are on benefit. So it\u2019s set through a series of calibrations to make sure that people who are able to work do actually earn a little bit more than they otherwise might, given their family situation, if they were on benefit. It\u2019s part of the structure of our benefit system. That minimum family tax credit does need to be adjusted most years, and this bill achieves that as well.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000412\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002212d74f81-b1f7-4b51-9fb4-8f9481477192\u0022\u003ESo this is excellent legislation. It achieves what we set out to do as a campaign promise, in a campaign when the Labour Party was elected by over half of New Zealanders. It is a simple piece of legislation that propagates that particular tax rate through the Income Tax Act, as needs to be done in order to keep the system fair. It is a piece of legislation that expresses our values as a country, where we have a progressive income tax scale. It enables us to collect a little more information so that we can understand better what is going on out in the world of tax specialists and tax advisers and people who do use trusts for various purposes. And it increases the level of the minimum family tax credit in order to keep that basic promise we make to ensure that people have at least livable incomes when they are in work. So, Mr Speaker, an excellent piece of legislation, and I commend it to the House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022 data-id=\u0022fab2a5edcb9442c3ac74731c2938ed7d\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000413\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022fab2a5edcb9442c3ac74731c2938ed7d\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: The Government has indicated to me that it\u2019s not their intention to proceed further with urgency at this time. The House stands adjourned until 2 p.m. today.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000414\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003EThe House adjourned at 1.02 p.m. (Wednesday)\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20201201c76b89e2d84547c7959b28d669e58f52000415\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cbr\u003E\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n    \u003C/div\u003E\n  \u003C/body\u003E\n\u003C/html\u003E"