"\u003C!DOCTYPE html\u003E\u003Chtml xmlns:xlink=\u0022http://www.w3.org/1999/xlink\u0022 xmlns:xsi=\u0022http://www.w3.org/2007/XMLSchema-instance\u0022 xmlns:mml=\u0022http://www.w3.org/1998/Math/MathML\u0022\u003E\n  \u003Chead\u003E\n    \u003CMETA http-equiv=\u0022Content-Type\u0022 content=\u0022text/html; charset=utf-16\u0022\u003E\n    \u003Cmeta name=\u0022viewport\u0022 content=\u0022width=device-width, initial-scale=1\u0022\u003E\n  \u003C/head\u003E\n  \u003Cbody style=\u0022font-family:sans-serif; font-size:100%;\u0022\u003E\n    \u003Cdiv class=\u0022HpsHansard\u0022\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000001\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsProceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u0022b19a95c0c75c4d09891ef737563b15b9\u0022\u003EWEDNESDAY, 7 APRIL 2021\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000003\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u00227db8f9857be44b5b9352d2556beecab7\u0022\u003EWEDNESDAY, 7 APRIL 2021\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000002\u0022\u003EThe Speaker took the Chair at 2 p.m.\u003C/p\u003E\n    \u003C/div\u003E\n    \u003Cdiv class=\u0022HpsHansard\u0022\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000004\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsProceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u00226ba6583ab1a04f08a3e0c0b2490d9fed\u0022\u003EKarakia/Prayers\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000006\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u0022469d6244c8f84b0ca437c69f982974ca\u0022\u003EKarakia/Prayers\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00224a25943b-cb3b-49c3-bd10-74316fae17f1\u0022 data-id=\u00221e0fe6b7cbf34ef5bb65c3994386e72f\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000005\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00224a25943b-cb3b-49c3-bd10-74316fae17f1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00221e0fe6b7cbf34ef5bb65c3994386e72f\u0022\u003EASSISTANT SPEAKER (Hon Jacqui Dean)\u003C/span\u003E: Almighty God, we give thanks for the blessings which have been bestowed on us. Laying aside all personal interests, we acknowledge the Queen and pray for guidance in our deliberations that we may conduct the affairs of this House with wisdom, justice, mercy, and humility for the welfare and peace of New Zealand. Amen.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n    \u003C/div\u003E\n    \u003Cdiv class=\u0022HpsHansard\u0022\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000007\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsProceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u0022193d1aed763244f2a1258c2cc42befa7\u0022\u003EPetitions, Papers, Select Committee Reports, and Introduction of Bills\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000009\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u0022706ea16c2d324a7190bdffb8a6ecb961\u0022\u003EPetitions, Papers, Select Committee Reports, and Introduction of Bills\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022 data-id=\u00221a37f376c4fa44b2b947807b2c5a87d3\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000008\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00221a37f376c4fa44b2b947807b2c5a87d3\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: No petitions have been presented. No bills have been introduced.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000010\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003EA select committee report has been delivered for presentation.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022\u0022 data-id=\u0022d004f6d86e8d4db4a6a8895dc76cca15\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000011\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022d004f6d86e8d4db4a6a8895dc76cca15\u0022\u003ECLERK\u003C/span\u003E: Report of the Officers of Parliament Committee on alterations to the 2020/21 appropriations for Vote Audit, Vote Ombudsmen, and Vote Parliamentary Commissioner for the Environment, and 2021/22 draft budgets for the Office of the Controller and Auditor-General, the Office of the Ombudsman, and the Office of the Parliamentary Commissioner for the Environment.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022 data-id=\u00221cae446e0254437396bb23bf4c1a6457\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000012\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00221cae446e0254437396bb23bf4c1a6457\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: That report is set down for consideration.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n    \u003C/div\u003E\n    \u003Cdiv class=\u0022HpsHansard\u0022\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000013\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsProceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u0022593a84cbc1a7439fa12388e4e910361d\u0022\u003EOral Questions\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000014\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u0022fd42ca081c2e4ed8a15dbdfedcd53d8e\u0022\u003EQuestions to Ministers\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000015\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u00222bd0e11b742a40ca85c3af10ab6428d4\u0022\u003EQuestion No. 1\u2014COVID-19 Response\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022c46de55f-b9e4-4c64-9ac6-877bd89c2fc5\u0022 data-id=\u0022975c66fcc7294aee9eae8ffcb26060fd\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000016\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c46de55f-b9e4-4c64-9ac6-877bd89c2fc5\u0022\u003E1. \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022975c66fcc7294aee9eae8ffcb26060fd\u0022\u003EDr TRACEY McLELLAN (Labour\u2014Banks Peninsula)\u003C/span\u003E to the Minister for COVID-19 Response: What recent announcements has the Government made on commencing quarantine-free travel to and from New Zealand?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022 data-id=\u002295ebdeb99f5944a5b7381a1cdd83b2dd\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000017\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002295ebdeb99f5944a5b7381a1cdd83b2dd\u0022\u003EHon CHRIS HIPKINS (Minister for COVID-19 Response):\u003C/span\u003E More good news. Yesterday, the Prime Minister and I announced that quarantine-free travel between New Zealand and Australia will commence at 11.59 p.m. on Sunday, 18 April. The opening of a trans-Tasman bubble is an important step forward in our COVID-19 response and represents a world-leading arrangement: safely opening up international travel while continuing to pursue a strategy of elimination and keeping the virus out. It also represents the start of a new chapter in New Zealand\u2019s COVID-19 response and recovery, one that all New Zealanders have worked so hard for.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000018\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c46de55f-b9e4-4c64-9ac6-877bd89c2fc5\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022d11ce3d34bf741689db07f459d6469ea\u0022\u003EDr Tracey McLellan\u003C/span\u003E: How will New Zealanders benefit from the opening of a trans-Tasman bubble?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000019\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022ded2a81494ef49f88a819531ed1f8b0c\u0022\u003EHon CHRIS HIPKINS\u003C/span\u003E: There is no doubt that the commencement of quarantine-free travel with Australia will give our economic recovery a welcome boost, particularly for airlines and for businesses affected by border closures. I will defer to the Minister of Tourism to elaborate more on that in due course, but one sacrifice that\u2019s been particularly hard for many to bear over the past year has been the separation from friends and family in Australia. Our team\u2019s success in managing COVID-19 and keeping it out over the past 12 months now opens up the opportunity for families and friends to reconnect with loved ones more easily.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000020\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c46de55f-b9e4-4c64-9ac6-877bd89c2fc5\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00229a44297db493402caae06ecc0562881b\u0022\u003EDr Tracey McLellan\u003C/span\u003E: What will the difference between quarantine-free travel and travel pre - COVID-19 be?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000021\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002251a0aa20c39e48bb9ae3e2a457efc315\u0022\u003EHon CHRIS HIPKINS\u003C/span\u003E: It is important to remember that life will not go back to exactly the way it was before COVID-19. Those undertaking travel across the Tasman will need to do so on the basis of flyer beware. People need to plan for the possibility of having travel disrupted if there\u2019s an outbreak on either side of the Tasman. Just as we have our alert level system for managing cases in New Zealand, we also now have a framework for managing New Zealanders in the event of an outbreak in Australia, which involves three possible scenarios: continue, pause, and suspend. While we do want to encourage people to travel both ways across the Tasman\u2014we want visitors to come to New Zealand\u2014it is critical that those undertaking travel understand the risks involved.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000022\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c46de55f-b9e4-4c64-9ac6-877bd89c2fc5\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022499caa5ed34f468c9f5119a95c94da96\u0022\u003EDr Tracey McLellan\u003C/span\u003E: So what precautions have been taken to manage the risk at the border in light of the opening of that trans-Tasman bubble?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000023\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022b6a5bfd3a0d744e183cb477ed6209876\u0022\u003EHon CHRIS HIPKINS\u003C/span\u003E: We have been working very hard to ensure that good, strong, robust public health measures are in place. To be eligible to travel to or from New Zealand on quarantine flights, people must not have had a positive COVID-19 test result in the previous 14-day period. They must not be awaiting results from a COVID-19 test taken during that period. Passengers need to provide comprehensive information on how they can be contacted while they are in New Zealand. They need to complete pre-departure health declarations, and they won\u2019t be able to travel if they have cold or flu symptoms. When they fly, they\u2019ll be required to wear a mask on their flight. They\u2019ll also be asked to download and use New Zealand\u2019s COVID Tracer app whilst they\u2019re in New Zealand. On arrival, they\u2019ll be taken through a green zone at the airport, meaning they won\u2019t have any contact with those who are arriving from other parts of the world and going into managed isolation or quarantine. We\u2019ll also be undertaking random temperature checks of those arriving, as an added precaution.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000024\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u0022607e444fac5f4366889e0658f803fb31\u0022\u003EQuestion No. 2\u2014Prime Minister\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002285ec30d4-6394-433a-a12e-2c4def705dd0\u0022 data-id=\u0022a8e828ccf9ac4b4e8863d46a652d3fca\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000025\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002285ec30d4-6394-433a-a12e-2c4def705dd0\u0022\u003E2. \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022a8e828ccf9ac4b4e8863d46a652d3fca\u0022\u003EHon JUDITH COLLINS (Leader of the Opposition)\u003C/span\u003E to the Prime Minister: Does she stand by all of her Government\u2019s statements and actions?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022 data-id=\u002252c2465cabf84ca4b00aa1da1e5cb264\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000026\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002252c2465cabf84ca4b00aa1da1e5cb264\u0022\u003ERt Hon JACINDA ARDERN (Prime Minister):\u003C/span\u003E Yes\u2014in particular, our announcement yesterday that a trans-Tasman bubble will commence on 19 April. The bubble will give our economic recovery a boost, and represents a unique arrangement of safely opening up international travel while continuing to pursue a strategy of elimination and keeping the virus out of New Zealand. We\u2019ve all worked hard to ensure travel is safe and that the necessary public health measures are in place, and this opening represents a new chapter in our response and recovery to COVID-19.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000027\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002285ec30d4-6394-433a-a12e-2c4def705dd0\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00224e27a2db4f7c44b09cd5a09670657054\u0022\u003EHon Judith Collins\u003C/span\u003E: Does the latest report from the Office of the Director of Mental Health and Addiction Services include data on the age-standardised rate of suicide in New Zealand, as it did in previous versions?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000028\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022f364a377692849debe3be0bf72e0d9ea\u0022\u003ERt Hon JACINDA ARDERN\u003C/span\u003E: My understanding from the Ministry of Health\u2014and keeping in mind that the decisions around this report sat entirely with them\u2014is that they have looked at the original intent of the report, which was to report against three pieces of legislation. They also looked at whether or not information that had subsequently been added over successive years to the report was being reported on elsewhere. Suicide data is an example where they made a decision that because that information was reported elsewhere, it was removed from the report, which was originally intended to capture data that they are required to report on under three different pieces of legislation.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000029\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002285ec30d4-6394-433a-a12e-2c4def705dd0\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002225158746d6e74893ac8bc1450a657cc5\u0022\u003EHon Judith Collins\u003C/span\u003E: Does the report include data on the percentage of people seen by mental health services within three weeks, as it did in previous versions?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000030\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022ec2c6e8c23924ef0a4ff6f4ce090390a\u0022\u003ERt Hon JACINDA ARDERN\u003C/span\u003E: That again is another example of where they had data that was already being reported through their Nationwide Service Framework. So the view was, because that data was already reported elsewhere, it wasn\u2019t included on the report, which originally always had just included reporting, as I understand, against three pieces of legislation. That\u2019s a report that I think\u2019s been produced going back to about 2005. Over successive years, additional things have been added. The Ministry of Health made a decision to go back to the core purpose of the report. If I may, there are a couple of other areas, though, that I\u2019ve been advised were also included in the report that it is not 100 percent clear to me are available elsewhere. I\u2019ll note that the reporting on deaths reported under section 132 of the Mental Health (Compulsory Assessment and Treatment) Act\u2014that is not an area I\u2019ve yet been able to determine whether or not that is information publicly available. I have spoken to the Minister of Health about whether or not we can ask the ministry to confirm\u2014[Interruption]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000031\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002295896897346e4c449016142d00b78163\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Order! Order! Can I ask the Prime Minister to sit down. This is a matter which is a very serious matter for lots of families in New Zealand. It will be heard in silence.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000032\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022ad8b9bd10bc04b5da04f03f795eb1488\u0022\u003ERt Hon JACINDA ARDERN\u003C/span\u003E: Just to complete the question, that is an area where I\u2019m not clear that that information is available elsewhere, so I\u2019ve asked the Minister of Health to work with the ministry around resolving that issue.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000033\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002285ec30d4-6394-433a-a12e-2c4def705dd0\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00225eeaff42784a4d6088d6281c9d3da4e1\u0022\u003EHon Judith Collins\u003C/span\u003E: Does the report include data on the proportion of New Zealanders accessing specialised mental health services, as it did in previous versions?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000034\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00229707ea65b7ac4257b95aa98075849096\u0022\u003ERt Hon JACINDA ARDERN\u003C/span\u003E: Again, that\u2019s information that for the past 20 years has been provided through the Nationwide Service Framework. It\u2019s available online, so that information continues to be publicly available. Again, the Ministry of Health has gone back to reporting against those three pieces of legislation\u2014the Mental Health (Compulsory Assessment and Treatment) Act, the Substance Addiction (Compulsory Assessment and Treatment) Act, and the Intellectual Disability (Compulsory Care and Rehabilitation) Act\u2014and they have removed areas that are available in other public domains and that didn\u2019t necessarily relate to those pieces of legislation.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000035\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002285ec30d4-6394-433a-a12e-2c4def705dd0\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022fb6270fb488c470a8318288e029a54d7\u0022\u003EHon Judith Collins\u003C/span\u003E: When she said yesterday that there had been \u201Ca change in how information is reported\u201D, was she referring to the removal of these key indicators from this report, and does she really think that that\u2019s acceptable?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000036\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002233cd8559c009423e984d3c67483e6f6d\u0022\u003ERt Hon JACINDA ARDERN\u003C/span\u003E: As I\u2019ve explained, it was a decision that the ministry made, to go back to the original intent of the reporting and identify information that was otherwise available in other places. Again, as I\u2019ve said to the member, there are a couple of areas where it is not clear to me that the information necessarily is. That\u2019s an issue that the Minister and I have spoken about and, I understand, he\u2019ll be working with the ministry on.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000037\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002285ec30d4-6394-433a-a12e-2c4def705dd0\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00223010181a9d414736ab2a3bb61ae398d0\u0022\u003EHon Judith Collins\u003C/span\u003E: What targets, if any, has her Government set itself for reducing the number of times mental health patients are locked in rooms on their own, and where can the public review progress towards those targets?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000038\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022c23f947ca6a44a7dac836ac73429ca1f\u0022\u003ERt Hon JACINDA ARDERN\u003C/span\u003E: The ministry began seclusion reduction policy, actually, in 2009. So that\u2019s been something that the ministry\u2014and I think all politicians would agree that having an aspiration to reduce down those numbers is absolutely right. So we\u2019ve seen that over the course of the last decade, overall we\u2019ve seen the total number of hours of seclusion for adult inpatients decrease by 47 percent, but in this latest year we have seen an increase in the use of seclusion. Again, this is data that is reported on, so, obviously, it is open for the public to see some of those changes in trends.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000039\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002285ec30d4-6394-433a-a12e-2c4def705dd0\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002243bed27b2a59429aa7c31be8285790eb\u0022\u003EHon Judith Collins\u003C/span\u003E: Why was the mental health and addiction report not released until six months after it had been approved by the Director-General of Health, Ashley Bloomfield?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000040\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022d99cbff04da24fb78239fd7c8e4f8787\u0022\u003ERt Hon JACINDA ARDERN\u003C/span\u003E: The explanation I have been given from officials\u2014and I don\u2019t think anyone would necessarily agree that this is a good outcome. But the explanation that we\u2019ve been given is that the reporting that was meant to occur on 2018 data\u2014the decision was made, because of delays that occurred with that reporting, to combine the 2018-19 year. The reporting on that was also delayed during COVID-19. Again, I think everyone agrees timely access to information is important. I don\u2019t think the Ministry of Health would be particularly happy with the time line in which that data was reported, but that\u2019s the explanation we\u2019ve been given. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000041\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002285ec30d4-6394-433a-a12e-2c4def705dd0\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022f5d2d63370c74a40927d3a07ac2fea35\u0022\u003EHon Judith Collins\u003C/span\u003E: Does she agree with the journalist Jessica McAllen, who said that if the Government wanted accurate reporting on mental health, then they shouldn\u2019t hide information that has been published every year for the past decade in the same report?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000042\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00222a97eed8a8fc4260becea6db7cee9c75\u0022\u003ERt Hon JACINDA ARDERN\u003C/span\u003E: Again, this is where we ourselves are looking at: can we assure ourselves that the information that otherwise has always been in the public domain continues to be? Whether or not it\u2019s found during the coroner\u2019s reporting on suicide statistics or whether or not it\u2019s via this report or whether or not it\u2019s via the national service framework, we do need to have information available to the public around how we are performing on mental health issues\u2014so, no disagreement there\u2014and that\u2019s why we are undertaking a little bit of work to see the changes that the ministry made don\u2019t detrimentally affect access to that information.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000043\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dbaac12b-3efa-4d95-a08d-f0f637a48bab\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002299f729809f004552b2f823a5227ff60f\u0022\u003EChl\u00F6e Swarbrick\u003C/span\u003E: Does the Prime Minister agree that there should be a legal requirement to report clear and transparent mental health data, like there is for child poverty data?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000044\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00229c2c15291cf641c3a9e3e5b1987ef583\u0022\u003ERt Hon JACINDA ARDERN\u003C/span\u003E: Well, my understanding, of course, is that that\u2019s one of the reasons that this particular report exists, because it is reporting on three different pieces of legislation and those regulated activities. I think one of the things that we would also agree with is, in those really important areas, particularly around things that may contribute to poor mental health outcomes and particularly for our young people\u2014self-harm, whether or not they can access help if they need it. Those are things that we\u2019re actually trying to pick up through our youth wellbeing surveys and strategies. So I think we shouldn\u2019t just look at the tertiary use of care; we should look at the precursors that may lend itself to children either having a positive or negative experience when it comes to mental health services.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000045\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002285ec30d4-6394-433a-a12e-2c4def705dd0\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022624ddc10b7e0466d86726dd5424ffd25\u0022\u003EHon Judith Collins\u003C/span\u003E: Does the Prime Minister agree that it makes it a lot easier for the public to be able to access information on mental health where key indicators are actually recorded and available in one report, since they\u2019re on websites, rather than to have information spread out over a numerous number of reports?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000046\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002220408a8606fc4d2fa57126bd3811d608\u0022\u003ERt Hon JACINDA ARDERN\u003C/span\u003E: Just speaking to that, I think part\u2014obviously, when it comes to suicide statistics, I don\u2019t think naturally people would go to this report when there has been the practice of going to the annual report\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000047\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f12da0af-dc73-4870-8f77-1d50a75eb44c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00223d1225eb364c4f11b396563edc642ecd\u0022\u003ENicola Willis\u003C/span\u003E: Excuses!\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000048\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002288b250b1e1154815a7d9a48db919eca8\u0022\u003ERt Hon JACINDA ARDERN\u003C/span\u003E: I\u2019m simply responding to the question put by your leader around where people seek information. So the Chief Coroner, of course, has tended to be that primary source for that information, and that continues to be the case. Equally, the national service framework is another place where for 20 years, that\u2019s where that information has been available, and it\u2019s only been in recent times, as I understand, that that\u2019s been added to another report. So I think the intent was to try and consolidate the purpose of this report down. I can see why the ministry has done it, but I can equally understand why it\u2019s caused concern.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000049\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u00220f58ed875da94b479693a01157af2223\u0022\u003EQuestion No. 3\u2014Health\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00224b53c8fa-5ba4-4150-98be-dd23e49cf0bb\u0022 data-id=\u0022f645d61cf0eb496ea2d53cbb44643d0b\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000050\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00224b53c8fa-5ba4-4150-98be-dd23e49cf0bb\u0022\u003E3. \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022f645d61cf0eb496ea2d53cbb44643d0b\u0022\u003EANNA LORCK (Labour\u2014Tukituki)\u003C/span\u003E to the Minister of Health: What recent announcements has he made on new crisis mental health and addiction services in Hawke\u2019s Bay?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022 data-id=\u0022ff8f7b81756b44379b1517fefaf26d34\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000051\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022ff8f7b81756b44379b1517fefaf26d34\u0022\u003EHon ANDREW LITTLE (Minister of Health):\u003C/span\u003E Last week, I announced a new support service for people in Hawke\u2019s Bay who are experiencing, or at risk of, mental health and addiction crisis. The mahi that will be delivered through this service will be life changing and represents an important shift in the way we deliver mental health crisis services. The pilot programme, named Te T\u0101wharau, will be a hub of community-based services delivered as a collaboration between health, social services, and police, and will include a dedicated peer support team. That is to say, those providing the support will include those people with lived experience.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000052\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00224b53c8fa-5ba4-4150-98be-dd23e49cf0bb\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00225487bfb6fea146409898bcc523b0cf1c\u0022\u003EAnna Lorck\u003C/span\u003E: Why is this programme different from the current services?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000053\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00222958832d77ac48abb61b391f86903fc2\u0022\u003EHon ANDREW LITTLE\u003C/span\u003E: Te T\u0101wharau is the first programme of its kind where services will be based at one site in the community 24/7. This makes it easier for wh\u0101nau to know where to get help, as services are coordinated to support people in the best way possible. Te T\u0101wharau will include adult respite residential beds, provided by a kaupapa M\u0101ori iwi provider, an emergency mental health and home-based treatment team, peer support workers, Ministry of Social Development support, and a police liaison.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000054\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00224b53c8fa-5ba4-4150-98be-dd23e49cf0bb\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022100311b734c14f2db20b5798a27abb53\u0022\u003EAnna Lorck\u003C/span\u003E: What role will peer support play in the new service?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000055\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002236f17d023b1e4ad2bc9d4325090492a5\u0022\u003EHon ANDREW LITTLE\u003C/span\u003E: Every lived experience of mental health is unique, and the values and depth of understanding that peers\u2014and that includes family members supporting those, with lived experience; every understanding that they bring is important. The intention will be that peer support workers act as a first step in preventing a crisis to ensure those in need can get help early. The peer support workers will be people with their own lived experience or who\u2019ve supported friends or wh\u0101nau through mental health or addiction issues.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000056\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u00223f984988b44d43508bccf2fb24b4d1e3\u0022\u003EQuestion No. 4\u2014Housing (M\u0101ori Housing)\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00227a76db18-baa4-41c1-b366-89e2c753a1e7\u0022 data-id=\u0022d42d01502e7045699325b6ebda9a2b82\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000057\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227a76db18-baa4-41c1-b366-89e2c753a1e7\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022d42d01502e7045699325b6ebda9a2b82\u0022\u003EDEBBIE NGAREWA-PACKER (Co-Leader\u2014Te Paati M\u0101ori):\u003C/span\u003E I\u2019m not sure who this Minister is, sorry. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022 data-id=\u0022155709130fb4468cb5a4701e7a1cacae\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000058\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022155709130fb4468cb5a4701e7a1cacae\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: It\u2019s the Associate Minister of Housing (M\u0101ori Housing).\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00227a76db18-baa4-41c1-b366-89e2c753a1e7\u0022 data-id=\u00221655a7083a5a42e2bfc4fafccc7b0608\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000059\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227a76db18-baa4-41c1-b366-89e2c753a1e7\u0022\u003E4. \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00221655a7083a5a42e2bfc4fafccc7b0608\u0022\u003EDEBBIE NGAREWA-PACKER (Co-Leader\u2014Te Paati M\u0101ori)\u003C/span\u003E to the Associate Minister of Housing (M\u0101ori Housing): Does he, or she, have concerns that homeownership is becoming unattainable for M\u0101ori, given that M\u0101ori individual homeownership has fallen to 26 percent in the latest census and that European New Zealanders have net worth almost five times higher than M\u0101ori?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000060\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00222e45612b970c4008a14bcade8c6da54f\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Just before the Minister answers, if the member just reads a question as it is, because we would have checked that it was going to the right Minister. Clearly, another Minister is going to answer it.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002237a99b65-4919-4800-830d-3dd7c920d5cd\u0022 data-id=\u0022e70cfad41d124afa8de3928cf88faa1a\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000061\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002237a99b65-4919-4800-830d-3dd7c920d5cd\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022e70cfad41d124afa8de3928cf88faa1a\u0022\u003EHon Dr MEGAN WOODS (Minister of Housing)\u003C/span\u003E on behalf of the Associate Minister of Housing (M\u0101ori Housing): Yes, we do have concerns, and that\u2019s why our Government is actively responding to falling M\u0101ori homeownership. We\u2019ve made a start but there is much more work to do. In November 2018, Prime Minister Ardern established a targeted M\u0101ori housing ministerial portfolio. In July 2019, we established a M\u0101ori housing unit specifically to attend to M\u0101ori housing issues. In September 2019, we expanded eligibility for first-home products to include multigenerational families, to ensure the scheme reflected M\u0101ori aspirations. In August 2020, we launched the M\u0101ori and Iwi Housing Innovation (MAIHI) - Framework for Action. Between the MAIHI Partnerships Programme and Te Puni K\u014Dkiri, we\u2019ve enabled 269 houses in M\u0101ori-led developments across the country, and infrastructure on 206 sites. Many of these are affordable houses targeted at homeownership for M\u0101ori. In July 2020, we launched the Progressive Home Ownership Fund, which supports a dedicated iwi and M\u0101ori pathway to support homeownership through iwi and M\u0101ori organisations. And last month, we launched the $3.8 billion Housing Acceleration Fund, which will make funding available for critical infrastructure on iwi and whenua M\u0101ori land to enable housing for homeownership.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000062\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227a76db18-baa4-41c1-b366-89e2c753a1e7\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00226af92f28523e41e9b74fba32fde73ae0\u0022\u003EDebbie Ngarewa-Packer\u003C/span\u003E: Will the Government recognise the severe disadvantage that M\u0101ori face in the housing market, and immediately introduce a M\u0101ori housing package that includes specific financial support schemes, such as the old M\u0101ori Affairs loan in the past; if not, why?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000063\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002237a99b65-4919-4800-830d-3dd7c920d5cd\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022195c3ac615ad4730abcd268e1bc3674b\u0022\u003EHon Dr MEGAN WOODS\u003C/span\u003E: I think I went through, in my primary, a number of initiatives. But over a number of Budgets since we have been in Government, we can point to initiatives that have been targeted and specific to assisting M\u0101ori in housing and M\u0101ori into homeownership. So in Budget 2020, we had the $40 million for the MAIHI framework. In Budget 2019, we had a $40 million package for M\u0101ori housing. In Budget 2019, we also had $56 million specifically for the Whenua M\u0101ori Programme. And then, of course, we\u2019ve had other schemes. I do look to previous schemes that we looked at when we came into Government, such as the K\u0101inga Whenua Loan Scheme that was run and, I think, probably was replaced when the M\u0101ori Party were part of the Government, and they\u2019d only achieved 57 loans across 10 years\u2014and we know we need to do better than that.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000064\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227a76db18-baa4-41c1-b366-89e2c753a1e7\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002270a4c9759e034f7ab4bcb635267915ac\u0022\u003EDebbie Ngarewa-Packer\u003C/span\u003E: Does the Minister have confidence in the Government\u2019s recently announced housing package, when it doesn\u2019t include any specific policies targeted at increasing M\u0101ori homeownership?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000065\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002237a99b65-4919-4800-830d-3dd7c920d5cd\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002264f03d2ad6354ec6954d31f0e49716fc\u0022\u003EHon Dr MEGAN WOODS\u003C/span\u003E: Yes, I do have confidence. What we have outlined in this House on a number of occasions, now that we have secured the funding and made the arrangement, is that we are now working with partners\u2014and some of those partners are iwi and M\u0101ori organisations\u2014to ensure that we can have an infrastructure package that unlocks the potential not only of M\u0101ori-owned land but whenua M\u0101ori land for housing options as well.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000066\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227a76db18-baa4-41c1-b366-89e2c753a1e7\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002228ff5b97626e4bcbb518b529f91495a2\u0022\u003EDebbie Ngarewa-Packer\u003C/span\u003E: Does the Minister think it\u2019s acceptable that more than 11,000 M\u0101ori are currently on the social housing register waiting list\u201449.6 percent of the entire waiting list\u2014and that for many of our w\u2019\u0101nau, housing affordability, let alone homeownership, is currently completely unattainable?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000067\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002237a99b65-4919-4800-830d-3dd7c920d5cd\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00220eb47f123ae44d7a920783aee1d578fb\u0022\u003EHon Dr MEGAN WOODS\u003C/span\u003E: No.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000068\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u002250d857b62b4245bdadf4416d5651d52d\u0022\u003EQuestion No. 5\u2014Health\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022861a1798-a396-4a6c-b9e2-7d2f15d4a001\u0022 data-id=\u0022ca71e42f16c4481fb96bec8d6006177e\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000069\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022861a1798-a396-4a6c-b9e2-7d2f15d4a001\u0022\u003E5. \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022ca71e42f16c4481fb96bec8d6006177e\u0022\u003EDr SHANE RETI (Deputy Leader\u2014National)\u003C/span\u003E to the Minister of Health: What is the current average waiting time in emergency departments, and what proportion of patients are currently seen within six hours?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022 data-id=\u0022ab47ae33f86348a1bf0b19e02959e443\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000070\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022ab47ae33f86348a1bf0b19e02959e443\u0022\u003EHon ANDREW LITTLE (Minister of Health):\u003C/span\u003E In response to the first part of the member\u2019s question, DHBs report on the proportion of patients who are seen in and depart emergency departments within six hours and the proportion of those who are there for more than six hours. DHBs have never reported on the average waiting times of patients presenting in emergency departments. In response to the second part of the member\u2019s question, for the month of February 2021, 83 percent of patients were seen in and departed emergency departments within six hours. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000071\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022861a1798-a396-4a6c-b9e2-7d2f15d4a001\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022f1cb57e22958493599f52d518b36a7e0\u0022\u003EDr Shane Reti\u003C/span\u003E: Have emergency department waiting times deteriorated since 2017 when this Government came to power?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000072\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002226dde8dd33f447eb821bf785611fe659\u0022\u003EHon ANDREW LITTLE\u003C/span\u003E: It\u2019s not possible to say. Some of the problems with emergency departments are not indicative of problems with the emergency departments themselves but the rest of the hospital and the way they manage patient flow, and the challenge for the system as a whole when they perceive there is a bottleneck in the emergency department is to make sure that the decisions about discharge of other patients throughout the rest of the hospital are being made and that space is being freed up for people to move from the emergency department to the rest of the hospital.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000073\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022861a1798-a396-4a6c-b9e2-7d2f15d4a001\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00225663766ffb0e4336b6e3e526f762a351\u0022\u003EDr Shane Reti\u003C/span\u003E: Since he has been Minister, which emergency departments has he visited to observe waiting times?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000074\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022df8eacd95c744d34868aa303f2fdba23\u0022\u003EHon ANDREW LITTLE\u003C/span\u003E: I\u2019ve visited a number of hospitals, including their emergency departments.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000075\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022861a1798-a396-4a6c-b9e2-7d2f15d4a001\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00228a472ab5156f42938ea0457c07e2bee6\u0022\u003EDr Shane Reti\u003C/span\u003E: Can he name one hospital, and since his visit have waiting times improved?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000076\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022950c569fd72441978f5f070c6e92d8af\u0022\u003EHon ANDREW LITTLE\u003C/span\u003E: Well, I visited the Hawke\u2019s Bay DHB emergency department last week, and I haven\u2019t been in touch to see how their waiting times have changed in that time, except to say that it was a well worthwhile visit and a good discussion with the very hard-working, professional personnel who operate it.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000077\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022861a1798-a396-4a6c-b9e2-7d2f15d4a001\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022b7a654e6c1f94192b7eb1ab5657745e7\u0022\u003EDr Shane Reti\u003C/span\u003E: What is the waiting time at Hawke\u2019s Bay emergency department for patients waiting longer than six hours?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000078\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022bc0932bf12694d8d97600cae9a8be00f\u0022\u003EHon ANDREW LITTLE\u003C/span\u003E: I don\u2019t have that data available, and if the member wants that level of precision of information, he can put that in writing or ask another question.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000079\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022861a1798-a396-4a6c-b9e2-7d2f15d4a001\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002246c47b3db39240138f9455ada6ef8df3\u0022\u003EDr Shane Reti\u003C/span\u003E: Can he confirm that last weekend ambulance officers in Christchurch delivered patients to after-hours clinics instead of the emergency department because the wait time of people who could walk was a full day?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000080\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00222d00d4c9527b433ab2de1e69a0a3fbdc\u0022\u003EHon ANDREW LITTLE\u003C/span\u003E: No, I can\u2019t confirm that.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000081\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022861a1798-a396-4a6c-b9e2-7d2f15d4a001\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022da89222a572546cd84b61589c1982654\u0022\u003EDr Shane Reti\u003C/span\u003E: Which DHBs, if any, have had to treat emergency department patients on beds in hospital corridors this year?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000082\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022f2383d8d6e8c47f0aaee2e3b1f7b42dd\u0022\u003EHon ANDREW LITTLE\u003C/span\u003E: I can\u2019t answer that question, but what I can say is that the health system that this Government inherited was in an absolutely appalling state, which explains why this Government has put literally billions of dollars more into the health system, last year alone increasing DHB funding by $980 million, adding 3,000 fulltime-equivalent positions throughout the hospital network: because the previous Government underfunded the health system so badly we are still trying to catch up.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000083\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u0022929f42becc0d4af1a5c661c16b871a27\u0022\u003EQuestion No. 6\u2014Tourism\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00226590faa0-f76b-4386-84f3-9b06296cc772\u0022 data-id=\u0022d6defd662a8a48638767e07ce6d72063\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000084\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226590faa0-f76b-4386-84f3-9b06296cc772\u0022\u003E6. \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022d6defd662a8a48638767e07ce6d72063\u0022\u003ET\u0100MATI COFFEY (Labour)\u003C/span\u003E to the Minister of Tourism: Will quarantine-free travel with Australia provide an economic boost to the New Zealand tourism industry; if so, how?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022bbded2ec-ac25-4a73-a380-3f4d87693084\u0022 data-id=\u002237d529dc30c64330ad07084efb802cf4\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000085\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bbded2ec-ac25-4a73-a380-3f4d87693084\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002237d529dc30c64330ad07084efb802cf4\u0022\u003EHon STUART NASH (Minister of Tourism):\u003C/span\u003E Yesterday\u2019s announcement by our Prime Minister is excellent news for the tourism industry. Tourism New Zealand\u2019s insights suggest that opening to Australia could deliver a billion dollars to the economy by the end of the year. Their research shows that over half of Australians surveyed are motivated to have a holiday that includes fun and enjoyment\u201456 percent\u2014and to relax and refresh\u201453 percent. This presents a great opportunity for tourism operators and other small businesses to offer an experience that will appeal to Australian visitors. Despite solid domestic tourism over the summer, with many Kiwis trying something new, there is still a significant gap from the loss of international\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000086\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00226928b93995d44092b4ddf71595377691\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Order! That answer is too long.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000087\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226590faa0-f76b-4386-84f3-9b06296cc772\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00226eadbd64b5944a2390f48e928c26d4a2\u0022\u003ET\u0101mati Coffey\u003C/span\u003E: What feedback has the Minister received from the tourism industry on quarantine-free travel with Australia?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000088\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bbded2ec-ac25-4a73-a380-3f4d87693084\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022c5b3c8c9338d4ff8b074973532e97486\u0022\u003EHon STUART NASH\u003C/span\u003E: A lot of positive feedback. I\u2019ve seen messages and reports from the Mayor of Queenstown, from the Christchurch Chamber of Commerce, airports, Ng\u0101i Tahu, the tourism industry, and from small businesses, especially in the South Island, who say they are \u201Cover the moon\u201D. Mayor Jim Boult said, \u201CI \u2026 cannot express \u2026 how happy I am at today\u2019s announcement. This is a thing that will make a really big difference for th[e] people who have been struggling.\u201D Tourism Industry Aotearoa said, \u201C[Travel] operators from around the country are breathing a sigh of relief\u201D. They can now take bookings with confidence and scale up their staffing. The timing means that the ski regions, in particular, will receive a boost in the coming months as, in normal times, more than 70 percent of overseas visitors who ski in New Zealand are from Australia. Business\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000089\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002271bd27a2f8794712a6a3c855c5d02c34\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Order!\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000090\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226590faa0-f76b-4386-84f3-9b06296cc772\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022b7dccd33489147b7a54cc1bf4b46292e\u0022\u003ET\u0101mati Coffey\u003C/span\u003E: Final supplementary: what advice has Tourism New Zealand given on the benefits of quarantine-free travel with Australia?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000091\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bbded2ec-ac25-4a73-a380-3f4d87693084\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00223651e10256644b728f12efadb580d0ec\u0022\u003EHon STUART NASH\u003C/span\u003E: Tourism New Zealand has previously stated that, combined with New Zealand\u2019s domestic tourism market, the return of the Australian market provides the opportunity to bring the tourism industry back to 70 percent of pre-COVID tourism value at a national level. Australians previously made up around 40 percent of international arrivals in 2019, and contributed $2.6 billion to the New Zealand economy. Tourism New Zealand\u2019s recent activity in Australia has been designed\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000092\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022d3d5bd87b9be46baaf90b5045ecdaf3a\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: OK. That is enough. These answers are\u2014[Interruption] The member will resume his seat when I stand up. I am accepting the word of Mr Coffey that that was the last supplementary, but the member needs to get his answers down to a reasonable size. I will say to Mr Bennett that, once again today, I am getting sick of his inane interjections. There are members of the House who are trying to convince me at the moment that this is a serious issue. He is not helping.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000093\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u00224d9690a72b0147dd9f183b93f2bc62de\u0022\u003EQuestion No. 7\u2014Health\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022ee649aea-c6fa-4610-9fcf-5c4bb2d3cd33\u0022 data-id=\u0022cf8cda3020c648f8be155b945cd31bdb\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000094\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ee649aea-c6fa-4610-9fcf-5c4bb2d3cd33\u0022\u003E7. \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022cf8cda3020c648f8be155b945cd31bdb\u0022\u003EMATT DOOCEY (National\u2014Waimakariri)\u003C/span\u003E to the Minister of Health: Does he agree with the Mental Health Foundation CEO, who said in response to the Director of Mental Health and Addiction Services\u2019 annual report, \u201CThey are not reporting on the very thing they are trying to improve as a top priority. If the data is there why not continue to publish it in the report where people are used to seeing it? \u2026 you are making the whole situation less transparent\u201D; if not, why not?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022 data-id=\u0022ab701a744d6e4d05815c4b3fbbf69039\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000095\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022ab701a744d6e4d05815c4b3fbbf69039\u0022\u003EHon ANDREW LITTLE (Minister of Health):\u003C/span\u003E No, because it is not correct to say that information previously reported on is not being reported.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000096\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ee649aea-c6fa-4610-9fcf-5c4bb2d3cd33\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00229a8598f840fa4591a9e4231e997ec1b1\u0022\u003EMatt Doocey\u003C/span\u003E: How is his Government living up to its goal of being open and transparent when mental health service data that is being reported in the same format for over a decade is no longer published in the annual report?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000097\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00224b56b2b70da1409bab4307923569ae15\u0022\u003EHon ANDREW LITTLE\u003C/span\u003E: The member is incorrect on two counts. First of all, all the information that has previously been reported, and has been for 20 years, continues to be publicly available in the Nationwide Service Framework. The second point is that because this Government takes seriously the crisis in our mental health system, largely as a consequence of the neglect of the previous Government, we have invested very heavily in upgrading its services\u2014$1.9 billion alone in 2019. That has led to the establishment of the Mental Health and Wellbeing Commission as well as the Suicide Prevention Office, both of which will have reporting responsibilities openly, transparently, and accountably.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000098\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ee649aea-c6fa-4610-9fcf-5c4bb2d3cd33\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022c06d4ddf3b8c4193951fa86c98b65950\u0022\u003EMatt Doocey\u003C/span\u003E: When the Minister just said the information was found elsewhere, how does the Minister\u2019s answers align with one ministry official who said, \u201CSome data omitted would not be produced elsewhere\u201D, and who doubts it would be available publicly if not retained in this annual report?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000099\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022472b3fead6d54724a822e46f74574406\u0022\u003EHon ANDREW LITTLE\u003C/span\u003E: I\u2019m not responsible for what another official has said. I\u2019m responsible for the facts of the matter, which is\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000100\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002243cbe35afff745aa8443aae0202ebc0b\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Order! Order! Dr Nick Smith will stand, withdraw, and apologise. His late correction didn\u2019t help him.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000101\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00220a994743926d479186ba425f4e52cab7\u0022\u003EHon Dr Nick Smith\u003C/span\u003E: I stand, withdraw, and apologise. Point of order, Mr Speaker. The longstanding convention is that a Minister is responsible for his officials. For the Minister to stand up in the House and say it\u2019s not his\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000102\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002297a54020e28f4bc2925fc8e5153c8121\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Right, the member will resume his seat. The member is absolutely right and he gets to it by asking a question, not making an out of order interjection.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000103\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022ac99eb273f8d4362afb52e3f1a7f973b\u0022\u003EHon ANDREW LITTLE\u003C/span\u003E: Mr Speaker, I hadn\u2019t concluded that answer. The point I was going to make is that the advice I\u2019ve received is very clear: that the information that appeared in previous reports by the Office of the Director of Mental Health and Addiction Services is available in other places, but most importantly is available in the Nationwide Service Framework that has been publicly available for 20 years.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000104\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ee649aea-c6fa-4610-9fcf-5c4bb2d3cd33\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022472815ea0f0a4b7198824451cd6987ea\u0022\u003EMatt Doocey\u003C/span\u003E: Is it open and transparent when revealed in ministry official emails that a risk lens was run over the data and removed because it was negative statistics?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000105\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002248f2b41914284a9dbb4e696b829e7509\u0022\u003EHon ANDREW LITTLE\u003C/span\u003E: The advice I\u2019ve received is that to the extent there were changes in this year\u2019s report by the Office of the Director of Mental Health and Addiction Services for the 2018 and 2019 years, it was because since that data was collected other decisions have been made by this Government, including the establishment of the Mental Health and Wellbeing Commission and the establishment of the Suicide Prevention Office, both of which have reporting responsibilities and will report. But nevertheless, as the bottom line, the place where this data is always reported continues and that is the Nationwide Service Framework.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000106\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ee649aea-c6fa-4610-9fcf-5c4bb2d3cd33\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00227c29e4c0600940c194a172197bbd63e4\u0022\u003EMatt Doocey\u003C/span\u003E: Is the Minister confident that no one in the office of the Minister of Health had any communication with the Ministry of Health officials regarding the decision to remove data in the annual report and/or delay the release of the report?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000107\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a49598edf1924c408f680a7e1d8d021c\u0022\u003EHon ANDREW LITTLE\u003C/span\u003E: Yes, absolutely.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000108\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ee649aea-c6fa-4610-9fcf-5c4bb2d3cd33\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022365338365e954e9bb241c13051579e10\u0022\u003EMatt Doocey\u003C/span\u003E: We\u2019ll see.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000109\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00224d66714dbce94e67baf40f47983eb00e\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Order! Who said that? Who made that last interjection? Someone on my left. Was it you, Mr Doocey?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000110\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ee649aea-c6fa-4610-9fcf-5c4bb2d3cd33\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022397bd5a8a1944a85b218cc8a49e716a4\u0022\u003EMatt Doocey\u003C/span\u003E: Mr Speaker, I said, \u201CWe\u2019ll see.\u201D\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000111\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022282cd3e8c8244a87b8e81f9388aa370d\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Yeah, and the member will now stand, withdraw, and apologise. [Interruption]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000112\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ee649aea-c6fa-4610-9fcf-5c4bb2d3cd33\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00223babf33bcb90416fa7811710b080c8c2\u0022\u003EMatt Doocey\u003C/span\u003E: I withdraw and apologise. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000113\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00226ae60bab59f045b189206b36db264b5d\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: And\u2014I\u2019m just trying to work out what to do with Nicola Willis at the moment. She will stand, withdraw, and apologise.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000114\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022c2beb841711947ffa88d94ff3c4acaaf\u0022\u003EHon Member\u003C/span\u003E: She didn\u2019t say anything.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000115\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00228c7fb8f5a8334a7fb15eaf2d2dbf57c4\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Which member was it? If it wasn\u2019t Nicola Willis, which female member on my left was it? [Interruption] One female member on my left injected then, which was it? [Interruption] No, it was someone in this group here. It was a three-letter interjection when I instructed Mr Doocey to withdraw. Who said, \u201CWhy?\u201D\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000116\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c0f78f60-c2fd-46f4-8138-72f39692fc20\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00225dd097b91ab643e3823cae00e4a5ff5a\u0022\u003EHon Todd McClay\u003C/span\u003E: Point of order, Mr Speaker.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000117\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00221500da00b52c4f6392267df8c4c122f3\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: No, it\u2019s not a point of order.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000118\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a79fecf0b97049e587ab2a2951a14100\u0022\u003EHon Dr Nick Smith\u003C/span\u003E: Mr Speaker, I said the word \u201CWhy\u201D.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000119\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00223ba8f3f7943040e9b12284a05cafe7e1\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Sorry, I apologise for being\u2014Dr Smith will leave the Chamber.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000120\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003EHon Dr Nick Smith withdrew from the Chamber. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000121\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022fe6cd2403d264037b94cde636eafeefe\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: I do apologise for getting the gender mixed up. I apologise in particular to Nicola Willis, who I named. Right, we\u2019ll get on to the next question, I think.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000122\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u0022c40d0f6f118e4a4fbc57c0ad6a82211a\u0022\u003EQuestion No. 8\u2014Transport\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002234ec4a4e-60bd-4a4d-b211-10f9324db3ac\u0022 data-id=\u00227499ac982df9474f9868d71d005015b3\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000123\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002234ec4a4e-60bd-4a4d-b211-10f9324db3ac\u0022\u003E8. \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00227499ac982df9474f9868d71d005015b3\u0022\u003EDr GAURAV SHARMA (Labour\u2014Hamilton West)\u003C/span\u003E to the Minister of Transport: What recent improvements have been made to connect Hamilton and Auckland? \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022098b8334-57f8-4062-bac6-bfbc3474e88e\u0022 data-id=\u002269c9b0374e584603bda1a3b9a18d4c57\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000124\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022098b8334-57f8-4062-bac6-bfbc3474e88e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002269c9b0374e584603bda1a3b9a18d4c57\u0022\u003EHon MICHAEL WOOD (Minister of Transport):\u003C/span\u003E Yesterday, the Te Huia commuter rail service officially began, with regular commuter services between Hamilton and Auckland. Te Huia has the potential to replace up to 73,000 return car trips annually, helping to ease congestion and supporting our goal of reducing climate emissions from transport. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000125\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002234ec4a4e-60bd-4a4d-b211-10f9324db3ac\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022eb79b733430446fea307cc149ed2e55d\u0022\u003EDr Gaurav Sharma\u003C/span\u003E: What has the uptake of Te Huia\u2019s service been so far?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000126\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022098b8334-57f8-4062-bac6-bfbc3474e88e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00226826b8a137074446b8ff7e373f67820d\u0022\u003EHon MICHAEL WOOD\u003C/span\u003E: Uptake of the service is going well. Excluding VIPs and reporters, of whom there were many, there are about 120 commuters on the first two morning services and 130 on the return journey on its first day. KiwiRail\u2019s other inter-regional train, the Capital Connection, started with only a handful of commuters when it began about two decades ago, and it now carries between 250 and 300 people every day from Palmerston North to Wellington. We always expect that it will take time to build passenger numbers from a zero base, but this is a very solid start. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000127\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002234ec4a4e-60bd-4a4d-b211-10f9324db3ac\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002263c4be63a869463cb8a960a5951ff75a\u0022\u003EDr Gaurav Sharma\u003C/span\u003E: What support has there been for the Te Huia service? \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000128\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022098b8334-57f8-4062-bac6-bfbc3474e88e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022b665c188b6c444409ac6bcb9994401d8\u0022\u003EHon MICHAEL WOOD\u003C/span\u003E: Well, there has been a lot. I\u2019ve seen reporting that most passengers on the first service said it was an enjoyable and comfortable trip, and I understand that a number of commuters have signalled that this will now be their preferred way of getting from their home in the Waikato to their work in Auckland. The Waikato Regional Council chair, Russ Rimmington, said, \u201CIt will help to make roads safer, give people the stress-free travel and reliability they need between Waikato and Auckland\u201D, and Hamilton mayor, Paula Southgate, said, \u201CThe new rail service will be great for commuters and day-trippers and is a true partnership between local, regional and central government as well as Crown agencies,\u201D. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000129\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u002224c3239d1b9c4ba7a0e5395fba248b7e\u0022\u003EQuestion No. 9\u2014Prime Minister\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022 data-id=\u0022990dc12e8b3340e09ffb0552c4a1fa74\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000130\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003E9. \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022990dc12e8b3340e09ffb0552c4a1fa74\u0022\u003EDAVID SEYMOUR (Leader\u2014ACT)\u003C/span\u003E to the Prime Minister: Does she stand by her statement relating to the COVID-19 vaccine roll-out, \u201COur focus in those early days has been just getting people vaccinated rather than focusing heavily on reporting systems and dashboards\u201D? \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022 data-id=\u002213f88711a56441879a08fa28c15eb9c2\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000131\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002213f88711a56441879a08fa28c15eb9c2\u0022\u003ERt Hon JACINDA ARDERN (Prime Minister):\u003C/span\u003E Yes. I stand by my full statement, which began by noting that \u201CWe have to move to more frequent reporting as we scale up the roll-out.\u201D As the member is aware, we\u2019ve announced our sequencing framework and have a plan in place that will ensure all New Zealanders are offered a vaccine by the end of the year. Our initial focus\u2014and rightfully so\u2014has been on protecting those most at risk of being infected with COVID-19 in their workplace, which is why we\u2019ve focused on vaccinating border and managed isolation and quarantine workers and high-risk front-line workers. We\u2019ve also begun the next phase and are vaccinating people most at risk. As I said this morning, to give even more certainty, we will shift towards more frequent reporting that provides additional information and builds on the weekly updates provided by Ministers. This is why the Ministry of Health has started producing a weekly dashboard, the first of which has been published today. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000132\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002261ad3619c0c64a0694f792d4c22b891b\u0022\u003EDavid Seymour\u003C/span\u003E: If the focus has been primarily on \u201Cgetting people vaccinated\u201D, why is the most people vaccinated in a day still only 6,000 when this Ministry of Health chart dated 17 March says there should be around 40,000 people vaccinated per day now in order to finish vaccination by December? \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000133\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022f8b44d80a9ca4ce1817db5b4b30aebaf\u0022\u003ERt Hon JACINDA ARDERN\u003C/span\u003E: So with the roll-out that we\u2019re working to, you can see the blue line indicates where our projected plan has us and our vaccination rates; the red demonstrating where we actually are. We\u2019re sitting at about 95 percent against our plan. At the moment, it is fair to say our vaccination rates over Easter were low, obviously the public holiday impacting that. We\u2019re hoping to see that catch-up occur in the coming weeks. The whole plan, though, has been designed to see an ongoing uptick in daily vaccination rates until you see at its peak, when we get into the wider population, significant numbers on a daily basis. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000134\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022fc6277e5636e4418a360e22f6d890f7a\u0022\u003EDavid Seymour\u003C/span\u003E: If we can\u2019t rely on this chart published by the Ministry of Health last month, when can we expect every New Zealander who wishes to be vaccinated to be able to be vaccinated by? \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000135\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002202257ef67c8c495c8bd2bb6aad5deb44\u0022\u003ERt Hon JACINDA ARDERN\u003C/span\u003E: Our projections\u2014and, again, this is going to still be contingent on the arrival of Pfizer vaccine against what they\u2019ve given us a general indication around. But the indications we have at the moment are that we should be moving into the general population from about the middle of the year\u2014so from about July. What we\u2019ve been careful to do in sequencing our roll-out\u2014that doesn\u2019t mean that we will have enough vaccination for the whole population from July but that we have enough stored and available that we feel confident that anyone who shows up will be able to be vaccinated, and we\u2019ve taken that approach for the whole roll-out. We don\u2019t want a situation where we scale up, and then we have a halt on supply and we have to scale down. We want it to be a continual ramp up in the availability and vaccination of our people. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000136\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022d9f2b1cc7992486e9fb518b924296d8c\u0022\u003EDavid Seymour\u003C/span\u003E: Is the Government waiting on a supply of vaccine because it signed its first agreement with a pharmaceutical company in October, compared with the US and UK in May, Japan in July, or Kazakhstan, for example, in August? \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000137\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002291ec69de07e34060a756e66fcf2eb536\u0022\u003ERt Hon JACINDA ARDERN\u003C/span\u003E: The first thing I\u2019d say is that countries of course are working incredibly hard to vaccinate their populations so that they can get normality back in their lives. They are working very hard to get what New Zealanders for the most part already have, so that means that of course when it comes to, not our advanced purchase arrangements, but delivery against them, Australia and New Zealand have very openly acknowledged that the pressures in New Zealand are very different to other countries. People are literally not dying while they wait, so that means delivery has been different. The second point I\u2019d make is our programme is different. We\u2019re using a primary vaccination in Pfizer. We will have others available, but that is our primary dose that we\u2019re using. The third point I\u2019ll make is that we have been making sure, as I said, that we are sequencing our roll-out so that it has a continual upward tick\u2014that we don\u2019t open, close, open, close\u2014and so that has been about managing our inventory and the doses we have available on supply. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000138\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00229bce5d9253ee42c9bb25e7390a2112f8\u0022\u003EHon Chris Hipkins\u003C/span\u003E: Can the Prime Minister confirm that the New Zealand Government\u2019s decision to switch to a predominantly Pfizer-based vaccination campaign\u2014relying on one of the safest and most effective vaccines on the market\u2014is one of the reasons why we\u2019re having to wait until the second half of the year to make the vaccine available to the bulk of the New Zealand population? \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000139\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022faf1dfb67c1e49f5a453796c28c5b747\u0022\u003ERt Hon JACINDA ARDERN\u003C/span\u003E: Yes, that has been part of it\u2014our delivery schedule through that primary vaccine. One thing I would say is other countries have made other choices, and they are perfectly legitimate choices and reasonable choices\u2014you know, all of those vaccines have gone through regulator-approval processes. So whilst New Zealand has made this choice, it doesn\u2019t diminish the legitimacy of other countries\u2019 vaccination choices, but for us it has a simplicity to it that we\u2019re operating in this way. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000140\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022c9befba912e342899cc11db612699262\u0022\u003EDavid Seymour\u003C/span\u003E: Is the Prime Minister telling New Zealanders that we are second to last in the OECD for vaccination rates because that\u2019s what this Government actively chose\u2014to be late? \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000141\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002210b3d0f6c30e40fd9e2e8a02c7a5e50e\u0022\u003ERt Hon JACINDA ARDERN\u003C/span\u003E: No. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000142\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022d150f8f087ca4648b063d6f349f32b4b\u0022\u003EDavid Seymour\u003C/span\u003E: When will the national immunisation solution be ready and fully operational? \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000143\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022b27777ae02de4913996301cc0136242c\u0022\u003ERt Hon JACINDA ARDERN\u003C/span\u003E: We already have our COVID immunisation register. The member might be talking about the national booking system, which is separate. We\u2019re expecting that to be nationally available and utilised from about May. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000144\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022bcb412e3dcb04cdfb50ab040f60f40c1\u0022\u003EDavid Seymour\u003C/span\u003E: Is it that late because it was commissioned only in October? \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000145\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002211cd9a7a1bbb4b38a351838f1fa4293f\u0022\u003ERt Hon JACINDA ARDERN\u003C/span\u003E: I think, just to be fair to our health service, of course it is fair to say that the immunised\u2014we have not had a national well-functioning immunisation register for years. We have that now, and that is an absolutely fantastic legacy project that we now have to make sure we improve all our vaccinations. On the booking system, of course DHBs and our health sector have their own booking systems. We\u2019ve seen the need for something nationally. We\u2019ve put in place that solution. But keep in mind we have run immunisation programmes nationally before quite successfully without that in place, but this is a sensible option to enable a smoother roll-out later on down the track. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000146\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022fa9d6a0638a0493d988d1e923be6cc26\u0022\u003EDavid Seymour\u003C/span\u003E: By when will vaccine passports recognised by other countries such as Singapore be available to New Zealanders to aid them in international travel? \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000147\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022efd5447679ac4a0fa5bcaa12b1917a61\u0022\u003ERt Hon JACINDA ARDERN\u003C/span\u003E: Just to be clear\u2014because I notice that there\u2019s sometimes different characterisations of this\u2014in some countries they\u2019re using what they\u2019re calling vaccination passports to gain entry to things like large-scale events, like sports games and music events. Obviously, that\u2019s not something that we require here. People are able to move around freely. If you\u2019re asking about when New Zealanders will be able to carry immunisation information when they travel, of course that\u2019s something that the international travel association\u2014the agency IATA\u2014that deals with those globally recognised pieces of data is working on, so it\u2019s not a matter that New Zealand somehow owns sole responsibility for this. If it\u2019s going to have international recognition, it would need to be designed in that way, and we of course would look to make sure that our population is able to demonstrate internationally when they\u2019ve been vaccinated. If, however, your question is \u201CWhen will people be able to come in if they can demonstrate they\u2019ve been vaccinated?\u201D, the issue will be\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000148\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002254e0246fb1c844e69c65c0ec7d9686c0\u0022\u003EDavid Seymour\u003C/span\u003E: Point of order.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000149\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00226cd5a11151f04e598deda258f6f476fb\u0022\u003ERt Hon JACINDA ARDERN\u003C/span\u003E: I\u2019m happy to hear the clarification of your question. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000150\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022b12e32316e4e40e0a03f9506b0b47ac3\u0022\u003EDavid Seymour\u003C/span\u003E: The question was very clearly \u201CWhen will New Zealanders have passports recognised by other countries that allow them to travel internationally?\u201D The Prime Minister has attempted to answer two questions that clearly weren\u2019t asked, and it seems to me it\u2019s a superfluous diversion to addressing the question. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000151\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022543aa6770a774495a9a3e25ef1a47a5a\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Well, I think the member knows that judgments as to the quality of the answer are not mine, but I did happen to be listening to the answer and I would have thought that having New Zealanders offshore with vaccine passports coming into New Zealand, as the Prime Minister was describing, might be something that would be of interest to at least some members in the House and very much related to the question that the member asked. He asked about New Zealanders having vaccine passports. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000152\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00226c1763026c9640398d3f561d3bd1d52c\u0022\u003EDavid Seymour\u003C/span\u003E: Point of order, Mr Speaker. With the greatest of respect, it was \u201Crecognised by other countries\u201D for New Zealand to travel. Most of what the Prime Minister has said is completely and clearly unrelated, and I just put it to you that it\u2019s a diversion from answering and addressing the question. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000153\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002250a2a1849e8d4d85b9e336d8ee01c381\u0022\u003ERt Hon JACINDA ARDERN\u003C/span\u003E: Point of order. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000154\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022544dde9be1db4d08bca2ad5793746d94\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Speaking to the point of order, the right honourable Prime Minister. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000155\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022690564deb5624b7bbe775eb4aae10b72\u0022\u003ERt Hon JACINDA ARDERN\u003C/span\u003E: I\u2019m happy to continue to answer the question. I appreciate the clarification from the member, but, as I said, if the member is looking for something internationally recognised carried by New Zealanders, then that would be under IATA. That is being worked on. Our Ministry of Transport is closely following that work because of course we want New Zealanders who have been vaccinated to be able to demonstrate that for the purposes of travel. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000156\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u00224fa6ac14c81d43e88ee289d994629309\u0022\u003EQuestion No. 10\u2014Youth\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022cc477162-e622-4c94-add7-36a586729e51\u0022 data-id=\u0022df5b7f60518c47148f875c719b810f7a\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000157\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cc477162-e622-4c94-add7-36a586729e51\u0022\u003E10. \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022df5b7f60518c47148f875c719b810f7a\u0022\u003ENAISI CHEN (Labour)\u003C/span\u003E to the Minister for Youth: What recent announcements has she made about supporting young people impacted by COVID-19?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022872744a3-2256-4cdd-a4cc-939836dc2b11\u0022 data-id=\u002289c3f8beb8234f3cb24966b1c2727e98\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000158\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022872744a3-2256-4cdd-a4cc-939836dc2b11\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002289c3f8beb8234f3cb24966b1c2727e98\u0022\u003EHon PRIYANCA RADHAKRISHNAN (Minister for Youth):\u003C/span\u003E Last week I announced that an additional 4,000 young New Zealanders who have been negatively impacted by COVID-19 will get support to stay engaged, or to re-engage, in their education journey through the \u0100konga Youth Development Community Fund, that was set up in November last year as part of the Government\u2019s response to COVID-19. This is in addition to the 1,500 rangatahi who are already being supported by this fund.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000159\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cc477162-e622-4c94-add7-36a586729e51\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022349daa70f5e84b338c9b7ccc239637d5\u0022\u003ENaisi Chen\u003C/span\u003E: What types of services will this funding deliver?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000160\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022872744a3-2256-4cdd-a4cc-939836dc2b11\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00222f38bf3a8f8e412fb168ec074a84704c\u0022\u003EHon PRIYANCA RADHAKRISHNAN\u003C/span\u003E: Through this funding, 28 iwi- and community-based organisations across Aotearoa will deliver wraparound services for young people most at risk of disengaging with their education journey. They will be able to access programmes that offer a range of support, from comprehensive mentoring to mental health and wellbeing services, and career navigation. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000161\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cc477162-e622-4c94-add7-36a586729e51\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002242d87e29fefd48fca27b984d9f40a1ff\u0022\u003ENaisi Chen\u003C/span\u003E: Why is this funding important?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000162\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022872744a3-2256-4cdd-a4cc-939836dc2b11\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00229855fcedecee40778746206ea35aef19\u0022\u003EHon PRIYANCA RADHAKRISHNAN\u003C/span\u003E: We know that rangatahi are facing specific challenges as a result of the pandemic. This fund presents a great opportunity for local organisations to support our youth to stay connected and committed to their education, while also being active members of their wh\u0101nau and community. These programmes will also equip them with the skills they need to succeed later in life, as we continue to recover from COVID-19.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000163\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u002206e108a4c1f4408b830f8425d6f226c7\u0022\u003EQuestion No. 11\u2014COVID-19 Response\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002257e41e9d-285b-4fb3-847d-a63820ae7137\u0022 data-id=\u002296f93791ab5b4e08ae57806be0857f4c\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000164\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002257e41e9d-285b-4fb3-847d-a63820ae7137\u0022\u003E11. \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002296f93791ab5b4e08ae57806be0857f4c\u0022\u003ECHRIS BISHOP (National)\u003C/span\u003E to the Minister for COVID-19 Response: How many COVID-19 vaccinations have been administered in New Zealand as at 6 April 2021, and is he satisfied with the COVID-19 vaccine roll-out to date?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022 data-id=\u0022d63ee94c04fe46bea7966550ccd2f324\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000165\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022d63ee94c04fe46bea7966550ccd2f324\u0022\u003EHon CHRIS HIPKINS (Minister for COVID-19 Response):\u003C/span\u003E As at midnight last night, 90,286 doses of the vaccine had been administered to date: 71,013 first doses and 19,273 second doses. That\u2019s about 95 percent of the allocation plan, so it is slightly behind schedule. I\u2019m broadly satisfied with the roll-out to date, but I do expect the number of daily doses administered to increase significantly over the next week or so. DHBs forecast delivering around 55,000 doses in the next seven days\u2014around 7,500 a day, on average\u2014and we\u2019re pushing to see that getting up more towards 10,000 a day, on average, over the next few weeks.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000166\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002257e41e9d-285b-4fb3-847d-a63820ae7137\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022716894356d0145e59366c811560ea00c\u0022\u003EChris Bishop\u003C/span\u003E: Why has New Zealand administered only 90,286 of the 390,413 of the COVID-19 vaccination doses, which is what the ministry said should have been administered by now in this leaked Ministry of Health report from January this year?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000167\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002208a7a3abdd4740b3b380012419de4552\u0022\u003EHon CHRIS HIPKINS\u003C/span\u003E: Of course, the Ministry of Health put forward in the early part of the year\u2014or late last year and early into this year\u2014a variety of different models for the potential vaccine roll-out. At that point, they didn\u2019t have information on when vaccines were going to be arriving throughout the year and, particularly, any indication of when the vaccine arrivals were likely to be in the second part of the year.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000168\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003EOne of the challenges around the inventory management is ensuring that we have enough to give people their second dose after they\u2019ve received their first dose, within the three-week window that we\u2019re aiming for to do that\u2014or just past the three-week window\u2014so that they can get those second doses on time.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000169\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003EWe are also aiming, as the Prime Minister has just mentioned, to ensure that we don\u2019t end up with a peak and trough period, where we scale the vaccine campaign up and then run out of doses and have to scale down again before we start to see the bigger numbers arrive. We have been focused on scaling up sustainably, making sure that the vaccines are delivered to our border workforce and their close contacts\u2014their household contacts\u2014first of all, and then expanding out to our front-line health workers and then beyond that. We have used this early opportunity to test our systems, to make sure that we are doing this in a way that, as we get larger quantities of vaccines arriving, we\u2019re able to scale up in order to make sure that we\u2019re getting them out the door.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000170\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002257e41e9d-285b-4fb3-847d-a63820ae7137\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022af23f7c765574e1b9b43fae8f1721c5a\u0022\u003EChris Bishop\u003C/span\u003E: In relation to his comment that the information I just disclosed was provided before the Government had confidence around the Pfizer delivery vaccine schedule, is he aware that the report I just mentioned has preceding pages in which it makes mention of the precise Pfizer delivery vaccine as of 15 February 2021, and why is he using that as an excuse as to why the Government has delivered just 23 percent of the 390,000 that were meant to have been delivered this week?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000171\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a3806ffa3bb64741a4acf55d6426c86b\u0022\u003EHon CHRIS HIPKINS\u003C/span\u003E: Well, one of those two questions is clearly incorrect. He can\u2019t claim that he has a document from January that has information from February in it. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000172\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f5d71749-ae91-4af7-b2bd-77260398912a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022e4e85796e75e4405813ef391a72a1a72\u0022\u003EHon David Parker\u003C/span\u003E: Genius!\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000173\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002257e41e9d-285b-4fb3-847d-a63820ae7137\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022cfd9c191e3d54400b8cd6788aa1c963b\u0022\u003EChris Bishop\u003C/span\u003E: Can he give\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000174\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00229fffcf44ef4241cc99e406b356374f00\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Order! Order! That\u2019s\u2014well, no, we\u2019ll have a withdraw and apologise for whoever made that comment.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000175\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f5d71749-ae91-4af7-b2bd-77260398912a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022b50883fd18644104b96956a7990b56b2\u0022\u003EHon David Parker\u003C/span\u003E: I withdraw and apologise.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000176\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002257e41e9d-285b-4fb3-847d-a63820ae7137\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022bd838da84042456d94ab01dd1a66c0d1\u0022\u003EChris Bishop\u003C/span\u003E: Is he aware that the document I have just cited to him is dated 26\u00A0January 2021 but outlines the Pfizer delivery schedule from 15 February 2021, and outlines for the Government what that will mean in terms of the delivery schedule for the vaccine programme, and why is the Government so behind on its administration of the vaccine?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000177\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a936c86206574f5d81ca465516f00468\u0022\u003EHon CHRIS HIPKINS\u003C/span\u003E: We are not. We are tracking at about 95 percent of the allocation schedule that we have been working to. I don\u2019t know the document the member is referring to, but I do struggle to see how it could contain information from February if it\u2019s dated in January.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000178\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002257e41e9d-285b-4fb3-847d-a63820ae7137\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002289031f2621ee4a08aa76265eba28b7f3\u0022\u003EChris Bishop\u003C/span\u003E: Can he give a categorical assurance that New Zealand will have a nationwide booking system for COVID-19 vaccinations?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000179\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00221062d9abdaa744d2b6c968121a2714ce\u0022\u003EHon CHRIS HIPKINS\u003C/span\u003E: The Ministry of Health team are working to have a nationwide booking system up and running by May\u2014or during May.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000180\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002257e41e9d-285b-4fb3-847d-a63820ae7137\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022ca08f15325c34c2b88ca0a547e2aca27\u0022\u003EChris Bishop\u003C/span\u003E: One or two?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000181\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00223e81c31bb2de4ec1b3261cc8a36e908f\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: It\u2019s up to the whips. You\u2019ve got two extras.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000182\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002257e41e9d-285b-4fb3-847d-a63820ae7137\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022c403ea37c60946748e12676f12c09fb3\u0022\u003EChris Bishop\u003C/span\u003E: Why has New Zealand only administered 1.9 COVID-19 vaccine doses per 100 people in our population, the second-lowest in the OECD, and how does he square this number with his comment earlier in the year that we would be at the front of the queue?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000183\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022cb7de87ca3eb4af08495e0ab27761b85\u0022\u003EHon CHRIS HIPKINS\u003C/span\u003E: There are a couple of reasons for that. One, of course, is that we made the decision not to rush the vaccine approval process, as many other OECD countries, who have been dealing with widespread outbreaks, chose to do, and New Zealanders ultimately can have good confidence in our vaccine programme because of that. It\u2019s been through a very thorough approvals process. And, yes, we have had the opportunity to draw on the clinical and field trials from other countries as a result of our decision to do that. The second is that we did make a decision to switch the way we were viewing our vaccine portfolio, to rely primarily on a Pfizer-based vaccine campaign. We had a variety of reasons for doing that. It did mean that some of the vaccine doses that we expected to arrive in the second quarter we have not taken delivery of, because we are increasing the deliveries of our Pfizer vaccine in the second half of the year.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000184\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u0022237946f6459b4085948e9d30fa5e857b\u0022\u003EQuestion No. 12\u2014Social Development and Employment\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002219ed20db-5d6c-4464-9327-6cdd072bb4fe\u0022 data-id=\u0022083394f4bc6645ecaa0e33bcfd828182\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000185\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002219ed20db-5d6c-4464-9327-6cdd072bb4fe\u0022\u003E12. \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022083394f4bc6645ecaa0e33bcfd828182\u0022\u003ERICARDO MEN\u00C9NDEZ MARCH (Green)\u003C/span\u003E to the Minister for Social Development and Employment: What actions, if any, will she take to help the extra 20,000 people under 30 who are not in paid work compared to a year ago?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022c3a88c42-f60b-4cf9-8065-8bfb80a020eb\u0022 data-id=\u002233c99d5757374231b11bbae06c2f5950\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000186\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c3a88c42-f60b-4cf9-8065-8bfb80a020eb\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002233c99d5757374231b11bbae06c2f5950\u0022\u003EHon CARMEL SEPULONI (Minister for Social Development and Employment):\u003C/span\u003E The Government has implemented a number of initiatives to support younger people into employment, including our Apprenticeship Boost programme, which currently has 21,000 people across New Zealand gaining trade qualifications; Mana in Mahi, which has seen 2,546 young people placed into work; He Poutama Rangatahi, which now has 2,275 young people in education, employment, or training; and Flexi-wage, which will be rolled out over the course of the next two years for 40,000 places. These initiatives\u2014like many, if not all, of our opportunities to upskill, train, and take up employment\u2014are targeted towards people who might be disadvantaged in the labour market; that, of course, includes young people.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000187\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002219ed20db-5d6c-4464-9327-6cdd072bb4fe\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00226290911f3f7b452baa2f4ce0272fac6b\u0022\u003ERicardo Men\u00E9ndez March\u003C/span\u003E: Do Government employment schemes such as Mana in Mahi guarantee at least a living wage; if not, why not?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000188\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c3a88c42-f60b-4cf9-8065-8bfb80a020eb\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00226678927b03344a9399218bb1cd53e295\u0022\u003EHon CARMEL SEPULONI\u003C/span\u003E: No, not necessarily a living wage: some will get paid the living wage; some are on the training wage; some are on the minimum wage.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000189\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002219ed20db-5d6c-4464-9327-6cdd072bb4fe\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022cc3e1480eb364c87a7e512aa12df338f\u0022\u003ERicardo Men\u00E9ndez March\u003C/span\u003E: Will she further increase core benefit levels to provide livable incomes to young people under 30, who are often disadvantaged in a tight labour market?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000190\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c3a88c42-f60b-4cf9-8065-8bfb80a020eb\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022cd57db4e39144160a1621c0b5b2fc72a\u0022\u003EHon CARMEL SEPULONI\u003C/span\u003E: We committed in our manifesto coming into the election to ensure that we continued to address income adequacy in the welfare system\u2014and we are committed to doing that. I will say that the vast majority of people who are on benefit do want to work; do want to take up the upskilling and training opportunities to be able to get into the employment that is available. So on top of improving income adequacy in the welfare system, we are committed to ensuring that young people have access to upskilling and training opportunities so that they can get into work.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000191\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a68928ea-9dd8-4a30-8e2c-a0f49dfc8bea\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002292c92bc40ca0409bbd57fe8e944f99ae\u0022\u003EHon Louise Upston\u003C/span\u003E: Is it still correct that of the four people supported into employment by the $50 million M\u0101ori Trades and Training Fund, only two were under 25, and, if not, how many under-25s have now been supported into employment by the $50 million fund?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000192\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c3a88c42-f60b-4cf9-8065-8bfb80a020eb\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002271ab9a32457b411e8b29da90262b8a9a\u0022\u003EHon CARMEL SEPULONI\u003C/span\u003E: I just need to point out that the member does not accurately depict the M\u0101ori trades training programme. In order to be able to complete qualifications\u2014and trades training does take time\u2014then they need time to be able to complete them. So, also, this has been a programme that we have rolled out that has not been fully rolled out; however, it is not the only programme in place to support M\u0101ori young people who may not be in employment at the moment. I need to point out the Apprenticeship Boost\u2014not just Mana in Mahi, as well, He Poutama Rangatahi, and M\u0101ori trades training. This Government is taking a very fulsome approach to addressing the needs of M\u0101ori young people during a time where there is a bit of a tight labour market.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000193\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002219ed20db-5d6c-4464-9327-6cdd072bb4fe\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00221c3ada8ed9904b7ba9fd59d48eabd6fa\u0022\u003ERicardo Men\u00E9ndez March\u003C/span\u003E: Does the Minister think it is fair that young people on jobseeker who are under 25 get less income support than people over 25?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000194\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c3a88c42-f60b-4cf9-8065-8bfb80a020eb\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002222c0dd3321434b35a0df15d916b908fd\u0022\u003EHon CARMEL SEPULONI\u003C/span\u003E: This was highlighted in the Welfare Expert Advisory Group, and it\u2019s certainly something that I think we need to look at. It was a decision made by the previous Government prior to Labour. I am interested in receiving advice from the Ministry for Social Development on the differential rates. It is in our medium to long term plan to look at that; it is not something that I am addressing right now.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000195\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002219ed20db-5d6c-4464-9327-6cdd072bb4fe\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002260555463b0b5455fb8eadc41cd012254\u0022\u003ERicardo Men\u00E9ndez March\u003C/span\u003E: Is addressing those changes in the medium and long term urgent enough for people like Randeep in Manurewa, who is currently forced to decide between lunch and electricity?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000196\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c3a88c42-f60b-4cf9-8065-8bfb80a020eb\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022b2ed120f543041a781550ee460bd37fa\u0022\u003EHon CARMEL SEPULONI\u003C/span\u003E: As I said earlier, we have committed to, this term, addressing income adequacy within the welfare system, as well as continuing to expand opportunities for people to take up upskilling and training and to get into employment. With regards to young people, as I said earlier, that is in the medium to long term plan, and I look forward to getting the advice. But I will also say that we have lifted benefits, we have indexed them to wages. There is more to do, and we look forward to doing that.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000197\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c3a88c42-f60b-4cf9-8065-8bfb80a020eb\u0022\u003E\u003Cbr\u003E\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n    \u003C/div\u003E\n    \u003Cdiv class=\u0022HpsHansard\u0022\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000198\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsProceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u002218179f22e6e34a1cbcb536dc3c1f1921\u0022\u003EUrgent Debates\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000199\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u002222da68f87ee34c2a90c2bee9449a1ea3\u0022\u003ECOVID-19\u2014Trans-Tasman Travel Bubble\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022 data-id=\u0022503c73ed52694f6495e3d0ba2faa0166\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000200\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022503c73ed52694f6495e3d0ba2faa0166\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: I have received a letter from the Hon Judith Collins, seeking to debate under Standing Order 399 the Prime Minister\u2019s announcement yesterday that the Government will be opening the trans-Tasman travel bubble from 19 April 2021. This is a particular case for which there is ministerial responsibility. The response to COVID-19 and, in particular, the opening of New Zealand\u2019s borders to international travellers is a matter that requires the immediate attention of the House. Therefore I call on the Hon Judith Collins to move that the House take note of a matter of urgent public importance.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002285ec30d4-6394-433a-a12e-2c4def705dd0\u0022 data-id=\u0022b690df2860b14d5292920944c47c85dd\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000201\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002285ec30d4-6394-433a-a12e-2c4def705dd0\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022b690df2860b14d5292920944c47c85dd\u0022\u003EHon JUDITH COLLINS (Leader of the Opposition):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Mr Speaker. I move, That the House take note of a matter of urgent public importance.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000202\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002285ec30d4-6394-433a-a12e-2c4def705dd0\u0022\u003EIt\u2019s been 11 months\u201411 months\u2014from the time that the Prime Minister announced that she was committed to introducing a trans-Tasman bubble, and 11 months until we had yet another announcement to say that in another two weeks it would happen. Eleven months and two weeks. But I am very pleased to know that this trans-Tasman bubble is going to be opened, and I am very pleased on behalf of the National Party that we are going to see some tourism back in Queenstown, in the glacier towns of the South Island, back into Rotorua, into Coromandel, and into Auckland.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000203\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002285ec30d4-6394-433a-a12e-2c4def705dd0\u0022\u003EIt is crucial for New Zealand\u2019s economy but also for the wellbeing of all those people in small and medium sized businesses around the country and all of their employees. It\u2019s no point saying that everyone gets an extra paid holiday when the business is broke and it\u2019s gone under. It\u2019s crucial for everybody in New Zealand that this happens.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000204\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002285ec30d4-6394-433a-a12e-2c4def705dd0\u0022\u003EIt\u2019s also crucial that our nurses and teachers are able to be reunited with their families, many of whom are overseas. We met yesterday, for the National Party, with people who represent our essential workers who have come in from overseas. In many cases, they left their families overseas waiting for their permanent residency to be granted while they\u2019re working on a work permit. Those people have now been separated from their families for over a year. Some of those people have been separated from their families for 500 or even 600 days. It is simply not acceptable.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000205\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002285ec30d4-6394-433a-a12e-2c4def705dd0\u0022\u003EThere are spaces in the managed isolation and quarantine (MIQ) facilities that could be used to help those people. They\u2019re essential to New Zealand. That\u2019s how they were able to get here. We should be kind to them and bring their families home to them. It is simply unacceptable that a Government that prides itself on telling everyone else to be kind forgets that they could be kind right now to people who we need for our economy, to drive our economy, and to restore our country.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000206\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002285ec30d4-6394-433a-a12e-2c4def705dd0\u0022\u003EWhen we look at what\u2019s happened in the Pacific\u2014just think about that. We have heard nothing from the Government about a Pacific bubble. What about Fiji, Samoa, and Tonga? What about the Cook Islands? We know what\u2019s happening there. It happens on 1\u00A0May. We don\u2019t know it from this Government, but we certainly know it from the Cook Islands Government. They\u2019re very free with it and very happy to announce it to everybody, and yet New Zealanders are not allowed to know this information, but thankfully the Cook Islands has told us.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000207\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002285ec30d4-6394-433a-a12e-2c4def705dd0\u0022\u003EWe also know that nothing has been done in relation to Samoa and Tonga and Fiji. Why is that important? Is it just about New Zealanders going and having a winter holiday? No, it\u2019s not. It is very important to our Pacific neighbours and friends that we support their economies. When we look at some of the losses that they have endured because of COVID, we have to ask ourselves: is there something we could be doing better than what we have? And yes, the answer is yes.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000208\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002285ec30d4-6394-433a-a12e-2c4def705dd0\u0022\u003EWe have 400,000 New Zealanders of Pacific origin, Pacific ethnicity, and they want to be able to visit their families. They want their families to be able to visit them. We\u2019ve had Fletcher Melvin from the Cook Islands Chamber of Commerce tell New Zealand media recently, \u201CThey need to treat us like adults\u201D, and that\u2019s the plea. I am sick of listening to people of the Labour Party and some in the media who have said to me, \u201CBut what if something goes wrong in the Pacific?\u201D Stop treating sovereign nations as though they can\u2019t make their own decisions. It is outrageous. It is paternalistic. It is wrong. Just because New Zealand messed up under this Government\u2014messed up the measles vaccine\u2014doesn\u2019t mean that Samoa and Tonga and Fiji can\u2019t actually make their own decisions. It is crucial.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000209\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002285ec30d4-6394-433a-a12e-2c4def705dd0\u0022\u003EHave a look at what\u2019s happened to the GDP of these neighbours and our friends in the Pacific. The Cook Islands economy has lost 20 percent of its GDP. Fiji has fallen 19 percent and unemployment is now, in Fiji, at a whopping 27 percent. We could help fix that. We could do our best. Samoa\u2019s GDP has fallen 8.6 percent.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000210\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002285ec30d4-6394-433a-a12e-2c4def705dd0\u0022\u003EThe other thing that could happen is we could actually bring in Recognised Seasonal Employer scheme (RSE) workers, seasonal workers coming in from the Pacific into horticulture and agricultural areas. They could be earning money, which in six months\u2014and this gives you some sense of scale. In six months working as an RSE worker, a Samoan can earn as much money as they can at home in Samoa in seven years. This is how crucial the RSE work scheme is in the Pacific. It is absolutely crucial, and the great thing with it is that the money goes with the person. It goes with that person who\u2019s earned it. It goes back to their aiga. It goes back to their village. It goes back to their home. It doesn\u2019t go through a Government agency. It doesn\u2019t get clipped on the way through by lots of officials who are helping to add value. It actually goes to the people who earn it, and that\u2019s what we should be encouraging.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000211\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002285ec30d4-6394-433a-a12e-2c4def705dd0\u0022\u003EWe have a Government who announced yesterday that, yes, we\u2019ll have the trans-Tasman bubble, but what are they going to do with all those spots available in the managed isolation and quarantine facilities? They\u2019re going to close them\u2014close them. And close them why? Close them because apparently some of them are unsuitable to be used for MIQ for countries where there is a lot of COVID. So why have they been used for countries with a lot of COVID for the last year? Why has that happened?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000212\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002285ec30d4-6394-433a-a12e-2c4def705dd0\u0022\u003EThe National Party raised these issues. We raised these issues and said the Government should be keeping people from COVID-free places separated from places where there\u2019s lots of COVID. We said there should be pre-departure testing. We said there should be saliva testing on a daily basis as well as the nasal tests. We said that. And what we\u2019ve got is, now, a year later, after we\u2019ve had four lockdowns because of COVID coming through MIQ facilities, or at least three of them, I should say, are from that\u2014at least three. A year later\u2014oh, lo and behold\u2014the Government\u2019s worked out that actually it\u2019s not a good idea having people from places where there are COVID hotspots in the same corridor as people who come from Australia.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000213\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002285ec30d4-6394-433a-a12e-2c4def705dd0\u0022\u003EWell, for goodness\u2019 sake, COVID has been brought into the community through MIQ. It\u2019s taken the Government a year, and instead of saying to those families that we met yesterday, \u201CHere is an opportunity for you to bring your family here.\u201D, who turned up from the Labour Party yesterday? Not one of them. Not one of them. Why didn\u2019t they want to? No, they don\u2019t want to see these hard-working people who have chosen to make New Zealand their home and who want to bring their families here. How can they possibly lecture anyone else about being kind? How can they possibly do that when they\u2019re turning around and saying, \u201CNo, we don\u2019t want to bring those people back now because, actually, we don\u2019t have to.\u201D?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000214\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002298dbeffa-e059-49d5-8bbf-579cbaead9a3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022bc1539ab51cd417ebb4dd9c2ff9e035a\u0022\u003EHon Scott Simpson\u003C/span\u003E: Heartless.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000215\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002285ec30d4-6394-433a-a12e-2c4def705dd0\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00229539c89c669546d3affa199a0294b70e\u0022\u003EHon JUDITH COLLINS\u003C/span\u003E: It is absolutely heartless. And what\u2019s happened to immigration in that time, in COVID-19? Do you think the ministry or the department of immigration would be busy doing what it can to help these families? No\u2014nothing, nothing gone on holiday, apparently working from home. But anyway, what we\u2019re seeing is nothing coming from this. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000216\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002285ec30d4-6394-433a-a12e-2c4def705dd0\u0022\u003ESo, yes, I am very happy for our tourist industry. I\u2019m very happy for our Kiwis who are able to go and visit their families in Australia. And how many times have we heard from the Government, \u201CSomething could go wrong.\u201D? And do you know what something could be? You can have an extra three days in Sydney. Well it\u2019s hardly that bad is it? It\u2019s hardly that bad. And yet we\u2019ve had months and months of being told it was too hard, something might go wrong\u2014and, by the way, someone at some stage in Queensland, they had some COVID a couple of weeks back, and didn\u2019t they deal with it very quickly and well, and that\u2019s because the Australians have been all over this since October. From October, we had opportunities as Kiwis to visit there; we just couldn\u2019t come back, and that was one of the problems. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000217\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002285ec30d4-6394-433a-a12e-2c4def705dd0\u0022\u003EWhy is it that we can trust a travel bubble with Australia but not with our Pacific neighbours? Why is that? What is it that is behind all of that? What is behind the attitude that we can\u2019t have a relationship, a good travel bubble, with Samoa or Tonga or Fiji? And those MPs who are here who have some connections to Samoa or Tonga or Fiji\u2014and some of them claim all of that\u2014why aren\u2019t they advocating for their aiga? Why aren\u2019t they advocating for their family? Why aren\u2019t they advocating for their countries of birth? And the answer is because they don\u2019t care. They don\u2019t care and they like to think that they are in charge.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000218\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002285ec30d4-6394-433a-a12e-2c4def705dd0\u0022\u003ESo I have seen, over the years, some pretty interesting work from this Labour Government and I\u2019ve also seen the odd thing\u2014I\u2019ve thought that ours was quite interesting, too\u2014but I\u2019ve never seen anything like I\u2019ve seen on mental health. Never have I seen anything as bad\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000219\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022c21316f2b936467e9808163b21b229a6\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Order! Order! The member will resume her seat. Now, the member has her letter which she wrote to me, which was a very narrow letter. I have been very liberal with her in letting her go way outside what she asked me to debate. Urgent debates are amongst the most narrow that we have. She has gone a long way away from Australia in her discussions, but doing the next jump is just a step too far. I will say, while I\u2019m on my feet, I\u2019ll let whoever follows the Leader of the Opposition have about two minutes to respond to anything that was irrelevant and, after that, there will be strict relevancy. This debate is about the Australian bubble.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000220\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002285ec30d4-6394-433a-a12e-2c4def705dd0\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00220d68306c27114d54afc7824f340ce6e8\u0022\u003EHon JUDITH COLLINS\u003C/span\u003E: Well, I\u2019m happy to continue on the Australian bubble, and I\u2019m very happy to talk about the mental health issues around that Australian bubble and the fact that, actually, every Government should take that into account. We have had constituents\u2014I have personally had constituents, I know my colleagues have, and I\u2019m sure other people, other members of Parliament, have had\u2014contact us about a family member dying in New Zealand: a family member, a mother in a hospice situation, unable to get back to New Zealand to visit their mother when they are dying, being told they can come to the funeral. And of course, that\u2019s of no use when you can\u2019t actually say goodbye to one\u2019s own mother. We\u2019ve had family members say that they\u2019ve got a child in Australia who is suffering from mental health issues and they should be with their daughter or son. One particular woman I know very well had to leave from New Zealand to go to Australia, taking advantage of the Australians opening the travel bubble with New Zealand from October, to be with her daughter for several months and staying there waiting for this bubble to be opened up because her daughter was undergoing an extremely difficult pregnancy. This is the sort of thing where families have been crying out for some kindness, some decency, some understanding that not everybody who asks for something is entitled. Most people who come to us as members of Parliament asking for our help do so because they have actually lost confidence in the ministries and they don\u2019t know where else to turn. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000221\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002285ec30d4-6394-433a-a12e-2c4def705dd0\u0022\u003ESo this travel bubble with Australia is a good thing. We are delighted to see it finally happen. Yes, we do say thank you to the 45,000-plus people who signed our online petition. Yes, we do think that they made a difference. They made a difference because back in February this year the Government had only just started talking to the states of Australia, having given us all the flannel about how, in fact, they were already discussing all of this. It turned out that wasn\u2019t quite correct. So when Scott Morrison, the Prime Minister of Australia, said\u2014pretty much paraphrasing this I am\u2014\u201CWell, the door\u2019s open any time New Zealand wants it.\u201D, I think he also helped to bring this about. He helped to embarrass the current New Zealand Government into doing something. He helped to do that. But everybody who is now able to travel to their families should understand that the Australians have been able to receive us since October last year. They have been willing to receive us since October last year. The door has been open. The trouble is that the New Zealand Government refused to let the Kiwis back in without going through MIQ. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000222\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002285ec30d4-6394-433a-a12e-2c4def705dd0\u0022\u003EI am delighted that we are getting a victory for the people of New Zealand and their families. I am delighted in our work to make this happen and I am delighted\u2014and I\u2019m delighted\u2014to be able to have the opportunity to speak today in support of all those Kiwis, all those Kiwi families who have missed out for the last six months when it could have happened then. So I am very delighted today.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022 data-id=\u0022c4340efd5fda479aa002531516cf0c5f\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000223\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022c4340efd5fda479aa002531516cf0c5f\u0022\u003EHon CHRIS HIPKINS (Minister for COVID-19 Response):\u003C/span\u003E I think the biggest lesson from that contribution is if you\u2019re going to ask for an urgent debate, it helps to have something to say when the urgent debate request is accepted. If I was being uncharitable, I could remind Judith Collins of all of the things she said during the election campaign about New Zealand\u2019s border\u2014about wanting to charge everybody coming into the country, and talking about the fact that people had had plenty of time to come in prior and therefore we should make it as difficult as possible for people to come back into the country\u2014but of course I\u2019m much more charitable than that.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000224\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003EToday is a good day for New Zealanders, as we look forward to the opening up of free travel between New Zealand and Australia from 19 April\u2014something that we can all look forward to, something that those families that have been separated by our border restrictions will be looking forward to, and something that our tourism industry will be looking forward to as well, as they look forward to welcoming back Australians to New Zealand. To put this into context, before COVID-19, in a typical year, Australians were making up about 40 percent of the arrivals into New Zealand. They brought with them about $2.7 billion in revenue to New Zealand, a lot of that going into our tourism and hospitality sector, and we look forward to welcoming them and their money back into New Zealand in a couple of weeks\u2019 time. It will be good for New Zealand, and it will be good for our businesses.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000225\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003EThe Government has taken a cautious approach when it comes to opening up the trans-Tasman bubble. What we didn\u2019t want to see is the border opening and closing willy-nilly without New Zealanders knowing where they would stand in the event of events happening on either side of the Tasman. We made it clear from the beginning that our preference was for a joint decision-making framework. That was what the Australians indicated they wanted initially. Then, they moved on to one where they indicated that they would prefer to keep a unilateral decision-making framework, where each country made its own decisions about whether the green zone would open or close, depending on how they wanted to respond to events on either side of the Tasman. We adapted to that approach.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000226\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003EWe will still be keeping in regular communication, at a Government-to-Government level, at a health system to health system level, to make sure we are sharing the information so that we can continue to keep the green zone open as much as we possibly can, that any ceasing of those green flights is only done if we absolutely need to do that, and that people understand the reasons for any pause in trans-Tasman travel that may occur\u2014why we\u2019re doing it, how long we think it might last for\u2014so that people know what to expect and they can plan for that as they consider whether or not they want to travel across the Tasman.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000227\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003EWe have been working closely with the airlines, with the airports, to make sure that trans-Tasman travel is safe. To put that into context, at Auckland Airport one of the things that we wanted to see was a physical separation between those coming from known non - green zone countries\u2014so, in this case, Australia\u2014and other countries where they could potentially be bringing COVID-19 with them. Auckland Airport created a plan that allows them to separate those passengers completely. There are still some issues they\u2019re working through around how they would handle red zone passengers, to make sure that they\u2019re not standing around and potentially spreading COVID-19 amongst themselves. They\u2019re still working through that with health officials to provide the reassurance that we are looking for. And we\u2019re confident that the infection prevention and control audits that will be happening this week will give us the information, the certainty that we\u2019re looking for to be able to sign off on that, and the health teams are working on that at the moment.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000228\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003EIn terms of the green zone travel, that will actually be the bulk of the Auckland international airport. In Wellington, it will be the only part of the international terminal. They won\u2019t be accepting any red zone flights. And in Christchurch, work is being done again to separate out red zone and green zone travel. Queenstown will only be accepting green zone flights from international destinations\u2014so, in other words, only from Australia at this point. That gives people confidence that one of the key transmission points in international travel at the moment\u2014being in transit in the airports\u2014won\u2019t be a risk for green zone travellers coming into New Zealand. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000229\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003EIn terms of the airlines, we\u2019ve worked with them to ensure that they are using crews that are separate. There are separate crews flying on the green zone flights to those flying on the red zone flights. There is a process in place to ensure that planes that are flying, both green and red zone flights are sanitised thoroughly between flights, again to reduce any risk of unwanted COVID-19 transmission. It\u2019s been important that we make sure that all of those arrangements are in place. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000230\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003EWe have released the response framework. It sets out how we would respond to a case whether it was in New Zealand or Australia, whether we would continue in the sorts of cases that would see us continuing with green zone travel or whether we would pause for a period\u2014and when I say a pause, we\u2019re talking about maybe up to 72 hours while we gather more information\u2014or whether we would suspend. We would be looking to suspend in the case of widespread community transmission on either side of the Tasman. So we\u2019ve set out the framework that gives people an idea of what they can expect. But \u201Cflyer beware\u201D needs to be one of their watchwords here. They won\u2019t be able to get travel insurance for some of the potential scenarios that people will face when they\u2019re crossing the Tasman, and we wanted to be clear with them about what to expect.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000231\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003EIn terms of the implications of trans-Tasman travel for New Zealand and for managed isolation, we are working our way through that. We have been separating higher-risk and lower-risk passengers in many instances, so we do have some managed isolation facilities that we have only been using for trans-Tasman travellers and those coming from the Pacific. They are less suitable for receiving passengers where the risk profile is higher and where there are likely to be higher concentrations of passengers coming in with COVID-19. So we\u2019re working our way through that. That\u2019s one of the implications of the trans-Tasman travel zone that we\u2019re working our way through.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000232\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003EWe do also have to consider the Pacific in these conversations. We\u2019re in discussions with the Cook Islands about a safe travel zone between New Zealand and the Cook Islands, and one of the things that they are discussing with us is what our arrangements are with Australia so that they understand what the movement of Australians through New Zealand to the Cook Islands might be. That is one of the things that they want to understand at this point, and early indications are that they would expect anyone coming from Australia to remain in New Zealand for 14 days before being able to travel to the Cook Islands. So that is one of the things that we\u2019re working through with them.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000233\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003EWhen it comes to extending the safe zone to other countries, including places like Samoa and Tonga, the key message here is that they have to want that too. We can\u2019t unilaterally make that decision. It has to be a two-way decision. At the moment, some of those countries are not letting their own citizens return, so when we\u2019re talking about Recognised Seasonal Employer scheme (RSE) workers, for example\u2014and in another contribution that Judith Collins made she was saying we should have more and more RSE workers coming into New Zealand. One of the impediments to that is that some of those countries aren\u2019t allowing their RSE workers back into their home countries at the end of their time as RSE workers. So we have to work through that very carefully, otherwise those RSE workers end up being stranded in New Zealand, because some of those countries simply are not accepting people in their country. That is their choice. As Judith Collins says, we should respect the sovereignty of those other countries. We won\u2019t impose our will upon them. We have to work with the rules that they are setting for who they will accept and who they won\u2019t.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000234\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003EOne of the comments from the National Party has been about why we didn\u2019t move faster on the trans-Tasman bubble. Let\u2019s bear in mind that the National Party, the week before the big Melbourne outbreak, was saying that we should have been allowing people free travel between New Zealand and Australia at that point. Had we been doing that, New Zealand probably would\u2019ve ended up with an alert level escalation, which we were able to avoid by being cautious and by being careful. Of course, they wanted to open up to just about everybody at that point, including China\u2014something that they don\u2019t seem to be talking about any more.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000235\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003EOur caution\u2014making sure that we\u2019re doing this well, doing it thoroughly, and doing it safely\u2014is one of the reasons that New Zealand as a country has had some of the fewest restrictions of any country in the world over the last year. We\u2019ve been cautious for a reason\u2014because we have been freer than everybody else and we have been freer than everybody else because of that caution. Our Government has not been willing to put that at risk.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000236\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003ESo as we\u2019ve been debating the trans-Tasman bubble, we have been making sure that we have been taking care of the details. We\u2019ve been making sure that we have everything ready so that when this starts, we can continue it. We have been making sure that people will be certain about what they can expect when they\u2019re travelling across the Ditch. Either way, we will be welcoming Australians to New Zealand. Australia will be welcoming New Zealanders there. This is good for both of our countries.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002258f935f1-6646-40ab-9d99-17029396850c\u0022 data-id=\u0022567b812c3dc04d89b1d2d9d93a068531\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000237\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002258f935f1-6646-40ab-9d99-17029396850c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022567b812c3dc04d89b1d2d9d93a068531\u0022\u003EHon JULIE ANNE GENTER (Green):\u003C/span\u003E T\u0113n\u0101 koe, Mr Speaker. T\u0113n\u0101 koutou e te Whare. I rise on behalf of the Green Party, and the first thing I\u2019d like to do is congratulate the Government on how well they\u2019ve handled the COVID-19 crisis and the fact that we\u2019ve reached this fantastic development of being in a position to be able to have a safe travel bubble with Australia, and even working on it with other countries like the Cook Islands.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000238\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002258f935f1-6646-40ab-9d99-17029396850c\u0022\u003EI also want to acknowledge all of those who have been in the unfortunate position of being separated from their loved ones and families because of this global pandemic. There\u2019s no question that this has been an extremely difficult time. It\u2019s been over a year, and people have been separated from their families. My parents are in the United States. They are unable to see their grandsons in person\u2014haven\u2019t for over a year\u2014and who knows when we\u2019ll be able to see each other in person, because, unfortunately, I don\u2019t think the United States is going to be in a position to have a safe travel bubble with New Zealand any time soon, as much as my parents would love to come and see their grandsons. So it is a very difficult situation.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000239\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002258f935f1-6646-40ab-9d99-17029396850c\u0022\u003EI was quite astounded at the tone from the Leader of the Opposition, who seemed to be blaming the Government for the situation of the global pandemic, whereas I\u2019d say here in New Zealand, and certainly elsewhere in the world, people are looking with envy at New Zealand and looking at what the Government has done and have said, actually, they\u2019ve done a really good job and have done their best to make sure that people are safe. We haven\u2019t had our health system overwhelmed. I think I saw last week, and this is\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000240\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022b08f64a286344e89adc3e4680cb1c9e5\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Order! I\u2019ve let the member run for about a minute and a half, and she is now going to move away from a general discussion of the pandemic, back to the subject of the debate. I thought the Minister did a good job in relating each of his comments back to the Australian bubble.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000241\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002258f935f1-6646-40ab-9d99-17029396850c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a841eaf7f37a43f0bc3a5f5b39fe0fbc\u0022\u003EHon JULIE ANNE GENTER\u003C/span\u003E: Mr Speaker, obviously we\u2019re very happy to be able to have this travel bubble with Australia, and that would not be possible if we had 5,000 deaths last week, as the United States has. That would not be possible if COVID had run rampant across this country. And, while it has taken over a year to get to this situation of having a safe travel bubble, I think the reason we can be confident now is precisely for the reason that the Government has taken a cautious approach, as the Minister himself said earlier in his speech.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000242\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002258f935f1-6646-40ab-9d99-17029396850c\u0022\u003EOne of the main reasons that the Leader of the Opposition cited as this being good news was for tourism and economic reasons, and that that was the reason why we should open up sooner to a travel bubble with the Pacific. From the Green Party\u2019s perspective, I think we would say it is far more important that we focus on the human aspect of this. As the Government had said last year, the best economic response is a public health response. There is no economic benefit when you have people getting sick and unable to go to work, and dying.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000243\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002258f935f1-6646-40ab-9d99-17029396850c\u0022\u003ESo I can certainly understand the hesitation and why it is taking longer than some may like to get a safe travel bubble with some countries in the Pacific, and of course we would like that, but I think that, to be fair, the people of the Pacific are valuable in and of themselves, and our relationship is valuable in and of itself. We\u2019re not doing them a favour by letting people come over and pick our fruit for poor wages and conditions. I think that\u2019s really an insult. If we really want to take seriously our obligations to the Pacific, as close neighbours and having a close relationship, the way to do that is to take significant action on climate change, not something I\u2019ve ever heard the Leader of the Opposition refer to, because they\u2019re existentially threatened by climate change.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000244\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002258f935f1-6646-40ab-9d99-17029396850c\u0022\u003EAnd, as for the tourism benefits\u2014[Interruption] I realise a bunch of people on this side of the House don\u2019t believe in climate change. You might want to catch up with the global consensus\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000245\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022fa506eb99f504baea5278440a9f49c4e\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Order! Order! The members were reacting, I think, to something which the member had, not even in a tenuous way, attached to this debate. This is now her second warning to stay narrow. I can also say that sort of reacting to the member\u2019s comments probably doesn\u2019t help.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000246\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002258f935f1-6646-40ab-9d99-17029396850c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002269236a85a99343f2be8f58b804407f22\u0022\u003EHon JULIE ANNE GENTER\u003C/span\u003E: Mr Speaker, I\u2019m sorry; I thought we had up to two minutes to respond to the off-topic things that the Leader of the Opposition had referred to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000247\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022f8cd7d2e30aa47ec82e26b08bf2e5a6c\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: And the member\u2019s now used 4\u00BD minutes.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000248\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002258f935f1-6646-40ab-9d99-17029396850c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022bba28190df9d48a886708a601eaa04ff\u0022\u003EHon JULIE ANNE GENTER\u003C/span\u003E: Mr Speaker, it\u2019s less than 4\u00BD minutes that I\u2019ve been referring to the Leader of the Opposition\u2019s speech\u2014anyway.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000249\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002258f935f1-6646-40ab-9d99-17029396850c\u0022\u003ETourism may well benefit from this safe travel bubble with Australia, but we do need to ensure that we are protecting our natural environment and getting the very best out of this relationship that we have, because it is entirely possible it could be zero-sum. We might get additional Australians coming over and visiting New Zealand but at higher costs to our infrastructure, higher costs to our environment, and with more New Zealanders going to Australia. So, I mean, in that case, it could be absolutely zero-sum, except with additional carbon emissions.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000250\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002258f935f1-6646-40ab-9d99-17029396850c\u0022\u003EIt\u2019s vitally important that we take this opportunity of having had a reset, during the break that we had from general tourism, that, as we open up with the safe travel bubble, we are taking the opportunity to make sure that the jobs that are generated by tourism are sustainable, that they\u2019re high-wage, that they are good, safe conditions, that people aren\u2019t in a precarious situation, that this is not just a race to the bottom, where we\u2019re writing off our environment for the benefit of some supposed tourism dollars, which will make GDP go up. But GDP is not a measure of improving the wellbeing of our society. It\u2019s not a measure of the sustainability of our biophysical environment, which we need to sustain us.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000251\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002258f935f1-6646-40ab-9d99-17029396850c\u0022\u003ESo the thing that I think the Green Party would most like to emphasise, the greatest benefit of the safe travel bubble, is the ability for wh\u0101nau to reunite and see one another, and it really is that human aspect that is most important to our relationship with people in other countries, whether that be Australia or the Pacific or other countries. We must recognise our common humanity, and those human relationships are by far and away the most valuable thing. That is something that I think many of us have realised during this pandemic. It\u2019s not about the dollars and cents; it\u2019s actually about the human relationships. It\u2019s about our health and our wellbeing and our ability to connect, and that, during this great reset of having had a pause to travel, we have an opportunity to reimagine how this could be done in a way that genuinely will benefit people and enhance our wellbeing, enhance our natural environment, our ability to combat climate change, and address inequity in our society and across the world.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022bbded2ec-ac25-4a73-a380-3f4d87693084\u0022 data-id=\u00229426883955d641ad9b2f4f85ad71c4f3\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000252\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bbded2ec-ac25-4a73-a380-3f4d87693084\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00229426883955d641ad9b2f4f85ad71c4f3\u0022\u003EHon STUART NASH (Minister of Tourism):\u003C/span\u003E Yesterday, our Prime Minister announced the implementation of quarantine-free travel with Australia. As a trans-Tasman bubble, that will allow a free flow of travel between our two countries, starting on 19 April. I must admit, never in my time have I seen such an outpouring of love for Australia from Kiwis up and down this country. I am a little bit concerned that when the Wallabies play the All Blacks, it won\u2019t start with a haka; it might start with a team cuddle.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000253\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bbded2ec-ac25-4a73-a380-3f4d87693084\u0022\u003EBut, anyway, it is great news for our tourism industry, and the operators, many of whom have done it hard over the last 12 months. And if there is one industry in particular that has really taken one for the team, it has been the tourism industry. I visited a number of the hotspots that have a significant reliance on international tourism\u2014I\u2019m talking about Queenstown; I\u2019m talking about Te \u0100nau, the glaciers, Kaik\u014Dura, for example. They understand why we\u2019ve done what we\u2019ve done in terms of keeping our population safe, and that\u2019s what they tell me. They say, \u201CWe understand we need to do this.\u201D But, goodness me, they have waited for this Australian bubble, and they are very, very pleased we are here.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000254\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bbded2ec-ac25-4a73-a380-3f4d87693084\u0022\u003EBut the reason we are in a position to be able to open up our international borders is because of the fantastic work that this Government and the people of New Zealand have done in terms of managing the global pandemic. I\u2019ve got a very good friend in Paris at the moment, and have talked to her a bit. They are in lockdown again, and she has said to me, \u201CGoodness me, I\u2019d love to be in New Zealand.\u201D I was on an OECD call recently, and all 38 people from around the world said, \u201CIf only we could be in New Zealand.\u201D But they can\u2019t. We are here, and we live in paradise, and of that there\u2019s no doubt. But I do want to thank Kiwis for the way that they have all responded fantastically. In fact, the work that Tourism New Zealand has done in Australia shows that 95 percent of Australians view New Zealand\u2019s response positively, and this is only enhancing our brand in Australia when Australians are looking to book a holiday over here.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000255\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bbded2ec-ac25-4a73-a380-3f4d87693084\u0022\u003EWhat will the bubble mean to the New Zealand tourism industry? Well, we have already seen a significant interest from Australians to travel here. Already, for example, over 11,000 Australians have visited newzealand.com, compared to a daily average of 2,000. Of those Australians surveyed by Tourism New Zealand, around 77 percent have said that they will come here for a holiday. That compares to the other quarter who say they\u2019re coming to visit friends and family. So Australians want to come here. They want to go on a holiday; they want to spend money in our country. Over half Australians surveyed say they are motivated to have a holiday that includes fun and engagement\u201456 percent\u2014and to relax and to refresh\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000256\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022af7b60dc73054b4e942942a154f030c8\u0022\u003EDavid Seymour\u003C/span\u003E: What about the other 44?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000257\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bbded2ec-ac25-4a73-a380-3f4d87693084\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a99376c7104543fa90fea70b4eb94f4a\u0022\u003EHon STUART NASH\u003C/span\u003E: Mr Seymour, maybe you should relax and refresh just a little bit as well\u2014just chill out, which is\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000258\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022b457f04e38d943bcb5e15bbd7655198f\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Order!\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000259\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bbded2ec-ac25-4a73-a380-3f4d87693084\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002206d30af9ccaf431198c1eb6352e5e042\u0022\u003EHon STUART NASH\u003C/span\u003E: I was responding to\u2014anyway.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000260\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a82f330a67504534a9036f0eb0265186\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Order! It pays not to\u2014it pays not to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000261\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bbded2ec-ac25-4a73-a380-3f4d87693084\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00220fa1a325fe9743ee8e44b35a8b31e729\u0022\u003EHon STUART NASH\u003C/span\u003E: It\u2019s a great opportunity for tourism operators and small businesses that often rely on tourism as well to offer an experience that will appeal to all Australian visitors.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000262\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bbded2ec-ac25-4a73-a380-3f4d87693084\u0022\u003EIn 2019, Australians spent around $2.7 billion in New Zealand. However, a report released by the Australian Treasury in January of this year showed that Australian businesses and households had saved around $200 billion during the pandemic. That\u2019s $200 billion. So I suspect that what we will see when the borders open is a surge in tourism, in the way that New Zealanders travelled when we came out of lockdown, and New Zealanders didn\u2019t stop travelling. And let\u2019s not forget, however, that domestic tourism has historically made up around 60 percent of the total tourism market. And when we asked New Zealanders to \u201CTry something new, New Zealand.\u201D, they did. And Queenstown, for example, experienced over a 70 percent increase in domestic spend in January 2021 compared to January 2020. But I acknowledge that the people of Queenstown have done it tough, and overall spend in Queenstown was down by about 34 percent due to the lack of international visitors, even though there was an increase in domestic spend of over 70 percent. This is why the mayor of Queenstown, Jim Boult, said, upon the announcement of the bubble yesterday, and I quote, \u201CFor many, many businesses, this is survival. This is the thing that will keep businesses afloat \u2026 I \u2026 cannot express \u2026 how happy I am at today\u2019s announcement. This [is the thing that] will make a really big difference for those people who have been struggling.\u201D\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000263\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bbded2ec-ac25-4a73-a380-3f4d87693084\u0022\u003ETourism Industry Aotearoa said, and I quote, \u201CTravel operators from around the country are breathing a sigh of relief. \u2026 [They] can now take bookings with confidence and scale up their staffing. \u2026 The timing means that ski regions in particular will receive a boost in the coming months, [as] in normal times more than 70 percent of the overseas visitors who ski in New Zealand are from Australia.\u201D And Business Events Industry Aotearoa New Zealand has said, and I quote, that \u201CThis is much-deserved relief for our business events industry \u2026 Business events are planned and booked well in advance, and [this] news will give Australian organisers the confidence needed to plan \u2026 their events in New Zealand, not just for this year but further ahead.\u201D\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000264\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bbded2ec-ac25-4a73-a380-3f4d87693084\u0022\u003EI have also seen and received a number of messages and reports from the Canterbury chamber of commerce, airports, Ng\u0101i Tahu, all of whom have echoed the sentiment that they are over the moon with this. But the only reason, I would like to reiterate, we are in this is because the Government has taken a health response. We have been conservative in the way that we have responded to COVID, but as a consequence of the health response, it means that we have had very few deaths and we are actually held up as an exemplar globally for the way that we have managed the pandemic.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000265\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bbded2ec-ac25-4a73-a380-3f4d87693084\u0022\u003EThis will not be all one-way traffic. This is not just about Australians coming to New Zealand. We have to also be aware that there will be New Zealanders who go across to Australia. And whilst Australians spent about $2.7 billion in New Zealand in 2019, New Zealanders also spent about $2.1 billion in Australia. New Zealanders will travel. I take my hat off to the regional tourism organisations (RTOs), who have done an amazing work in attracting New Zealanders to travel domestically, and I would especially like to acknowledge Hamish and the team at Tourism Hawke\u2019s Bay, our local RTO, who really did an amazing job of attracting Aucklanders and Wellingtonians into Hawke\u2019s Bay, and who will now shift their focus not just from domestic tourism but to Australia. But I also understand that there will be Aucklanders and Wellingtonians\u2014who in the past travelled to Hawke\u2019s Bay to experience our fantastic wine, our food, our art deco, our wonderful Hawke\u2019s Bay culture\u2014who will now decide to go to Sydney for the weekend, who will take a holiday in Melbourne, who will go to the Gold Coast. So we do recognise that even though Tourism New Zealand believes that this will contribute about a billion dollars\u2014about a billion dollars\u2014to our economy by the end of the year, which is absolutely fantastic, it won\u2019t be one-way traffic.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000266\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bbded2ec-ac25-4a73-a380-3f4d87693084\u0022\u003EThe other thing I will also say is that Tourism New Zealand, over the last 12 months, has been doing a lot of work in terms of keeping our brand alive and priming the Australian market, ready for when the borders are open. They\u2019re about to kick off an amazing campaign about \u201CStop dreaming Australia, and get over here.\u201D I\u2019ve seen it\u2014it\u2019s a really clever campaign. In fact, you know, Tourism New Zealand are famous for their campaigns, and I would argue the 100% Pure New Zealand campaign is probably the world\u2019s global preeminent tourism campaign. But they\u2019re going to get Australians across here in a way that I don\u2019t think we have seen before, because, of course, there\u2019s a whole lot of pent up demand in Australia; there\u2019s only one place to go: it is New Zealand.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000267\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bbded2ec-ac25-4a73-a380-3f4d87693084\u0022\u003EBut what I would say to tourism operators is that there are things that they can do to make the Australian experience really worthwhile so they head back home and they tell all their mates and cobbers to come back over to this side of the Ditch. First of all, when we start vaccinating the general population, I would urge tourism operators to ensure that, in fact, their workers get the vaccine as well, because they will be front-facing. This will be important. We have to offer an experience that plays into our global brand, and I will admit that I have been critical in the past that some of the operators have been guilty of paying minimum wages, providing no training whatsoever, and not offering the level of experience that I think that New Zealanders should be offering to our overseas guests. Train your staff, get your staff ready, get them prepared, because when these Australians come over, they will be spending money in our economies. They will be supporting New Zealanders, so we need to ensure that the experience that they get\u2014the experience New Zealand delivers\u2014is absolutely 100 percent first-class.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000268\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bbded2ec-ac25-4a73-a380-3f4d87693084\u0022\u003EIn summing up, I think this Australian bubble announcement will be fantastic for the New Zealand tourism industry. It will get the industry through to the end of the year. It\u2019ll get the industry through until the international borders open, and until this time, this will provide a much-needed boost to an industry that has done it incredibly hard. Thank you very much.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022 data-id=\u002273a5c1e4f3234714a1e209d00488dc36\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000269\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002273a5c1e4f3234714a1e209d00488dc36\u0022\u003EDAVID SEYMOUR (Leader\u2014ACT):\u003C/span\u003E Well, thank you very much, Mr Speaker. I rise on behalf of ACT to join in this debate. I want to start by saying that the opening of quarantine-free travel into New Zealand from Australia is a great event for so many people in this country. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000270\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003EIt is a great event for our tourism industry, which, in many cases, has been decimated by the lack of tourists. The Minister of Tourism is right when he says that New Zealanders have done a pretty good job of getting out and supporting the tourism industry, but we know it is not enough. That is why you\u2019ve got hotels closing at Fox and Franz Josef, that\u2019s why you\u2019ve got people going out of business. Because, as any tourism industry operator will tell you quietly, they love Kiwis, but Aussies leave more dollars in the till. So it is a good day for them.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000271\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003EIt is a tremendous day for so many of us in New Zealand who have friends and relatives, cousins, and connections in Australia, who will be able to see them for the first time\u2014in some cases\u2014in several years. I\u2019ve just found out that one of my best friends who\u2019s recently had a baby in Sydney is coming for Anzac Day. There are going to be many stories like that. So it is a great day for many of the family and social connections.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000272\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003EAnd it is a great day for many of those businesses that you might not think were connected with travel, all of those businesses that are importers or exporters or work on projects collaboratively across the Ditch, who will be able to renew relationships and meet face to face, because we all love Zoom, but we know that it is no substitute for meeting people in person. And those relationships in business need to be renewed.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000273\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003ESo for all those reasons, it is a great day and we should acknowledge that. But we also need to acknowledge that this has come at least six months too late. We need some honesty and some transparency about what this so-called bubble means. It is not a bubble; it is a bubble illusion. The Ardern bubble takes you straight back to October. It is actually a time-travel bubble. It takes us to where New South Wales was in October 2020. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000274\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003EAnd you listen to the Prime Minister yesterday, she said, \u201CWe\u2019re now going to treat Australia as if it\u2019s a region of New Zealand. If there\u2019s a hot spot, we won\u2019t let people travel out of there to here.\u201D Really? She said that there is going to be a traffic light system that we\u2019re either going to continue, suspend, or stop travel from Australia\u2014green, orange, or red. And then she said that there are going to be different planes at the airport. We\u2019re going to separate out different travellers depending on where they\u2019ve come from. She said all this as though she was hoping for a Nobel Prize. New South Wales did all those things in October. And when I asked her in the House yesterday, \u201CHow is it that they did it then, and we can\u2019t do it now?\u201D, she said, \u201COh, but they\u2019re not a country.\u201D Well, actually, New South Wales has been dealing with all of the other Australian states as if they were other countries, just as we will be dealing with the Australian states on a case by case basis and, as the Minister for COVID-19 Response said yesterday, managing our border unilaterally. So that is the first thing we need to be clear about: we are doing nothing different from what New South Wales achieved six months ago. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000275\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003EAnd the next thing, we say, is that if all of those benefits for our tourism industry, for our personal relationships, for our business connections with our cousins across the Ditch are truly great benefits on 19 April, they would have been greater benefits back on 16\u00A0October, when New South Wales opened to New Zealand. They would have been even better benefits when the Prime Minister said on 16 April, last year, that we would have the world\u2019s smartest borders. It has taken a year of messing around to get this far. And it doesn\u2019t just matter because of all of that lost opportunity that has occurred while this Government has been spinning its wheels and spinning the public on travel from Australia; it matters because it tells us something about this Government\u2019s ability to deal with complex tasks in response to COVID-19. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000276\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003EIt matters because the tasks that the Government will have to undertake in responding to COVID-19 are going to become more complex. And the reason for that was set out in ACT\u2019s excellent report\u2014I have to say\u2014COVID Response Plan 2.0, which says that we are moving into a different and more complex paradigm. And there are four megatrends that underline that. One of them is vaccination, the second is the variants which may undermine vaccinations, and, finally, new technologies and fatigue with our existing responses. Now, I put it to you that if it takes six months to catch up with what the New South Welsh people of the world were able to do last October, how are we placed to face that world? \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000277\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003EWell, I think, this is a time that we need to be honest with each other, and our Government must be transparent with us and accept that it hasn\u2019t done a good job, it hasn\u2019t gone hard and early; it has actually been incredibly late at doing incredibly simple things. We introduced a few principles that might be helpful for doing better at these kinds of things in the future. We said that in response to those megatrends of vaccination and variants of new technologies and fatigue, actually, we need better principles that will allow us to do things like we\u2019ve just done, better and faster. We need more transparency. The Government should be open about what really happened. It had the opportunity to open up to Australia, just as Australian states were opening up to each other and us last October.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000278\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003EIt should be faster at adopting new technology. We heard today that there is going to be some use of thermometers to check people\u2019s temperature as they come in. That\u2019s the kind of thing the Taiwanese were doing last March. We are just too slow in our tech uptake, and when we do get technology, it is stuff that other countries were doing a year ago.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000279\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003EWe\u2019ve got to become more proportionate to risk. We made Australians stay in managed isolation and quarantine next to people from hot spots for six months, when there was no risk. This goes back to transparency. There have been three cases of COVID19 arriving from Australia in the last six months. Will the Ministry of Health tell us where they came from, when they came, or whether they were even Australians or people transiting from Australia? No, they won\u2019t. That is the level of transparency we get from this Government. But, actually, what that shows us is that had we had a New South Wales - style hot spot system\u2014opening our border, and closing it when there were risks. I suspect all of those cases would have been stopped from coming to New Zealand because they would have come from places that were identified as a hot spot at the time. But we are not managing risk in the way that we should.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000280\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003EWe need a culture of admitting failure. This Government needs to be honest about the fact that it has not done well with this policy of a bubble, that, actually, it needs to do better, and it will need to do much better in a COVID 2.0 world than it has done so far.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000281\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003EAnd, finally, we\u2019re going to need a culture of focusing on the wellbeing of all New Zealanders. There has been far too much harm done by failing to properly balance what the Government describes as the health risks of travel from Australia with all of the other costs that we\u2019ve suffered over the last six months of being needlessly closed to them. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000282\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003EThat is the kind of intelligent approach that we should be taking to our COVID-19 response. It is the kind of response that is going to be needed as vaccines and variants and new technologies and fatigue with simply locking down and closing the border make the old ways unsustainable. As the rest of the world gets vaccinated and gets moving again, we are going to have to be ready to participate in that new paradigm. And if patting itself on the back and seeking gratitude and congratulations the way this Government has in the last 24 hours reflect the strength and sophistication of our response to COVID-19, New Zealand will be getting left behind in this new paradigm, and the people will finally see that this Government has not been adept; it has not gone hard and early; it has been lucky to govern a country that is very isolated, with a population that is very cooperative.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000283\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003EIt\u2019s a great day for New Zealanders; it is a terrible day for this Government that must do better. Thank you, Mr Speaker.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022aed260be-c954-464b-bb75-85579e53d05a\u0022 data-id=\u00220c336c1385464bb981d3001a63e66653\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000284\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aed260be-c954-464b-bb75-85579e53d05a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00220c336c1385464bb981d3001a63e66653\u0022\u003EHon Dr AYESHA VERRALL (Associate Minister of Health):\u003C/span\u003E What a day, where we can look forward to a future with our Anzac comrades with confidence and optimism about the future. We have confidence in our trans-Tasman bubble and the Australian systems that will keep us safe and in our New Zealand systems, and today I want to talk more about that. But before I do, I want to say welcome to Australian visitors that will come to New Zealand when the trans-Tasman bubble opens.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000285\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aed260be-c954-464b-bb75-85579e53d05a\u0022\u003EI\u2019m from the South Island\u2014from Te \u0100nau\u2014and I know that many there are looking forward to welcoming visitors back to New Zealand. I hope Australians consider visiting Fiordland National Park. Even during what\u2019s traditionally been the off season, the national park and its waterfalls are particularly good to see during winter, when there\u2019s more rainfall. Also in Queenstown and W\u0101naka, the ski fields have a commodity that is missing in Australia\u2014or at least in shorter supply\u2014which is snow. I hope Australian colleagues will take the time to visit our ski fields.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000286\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aed260be-c954-464b-bb75-85579e53d05a\u0022\u003EBut what is it that makes our quarantine-free travel bubble with Australia safe? Well, the overarching consideration is that we have a partner we can trust. We know the Australians have good testing systems and strong reporting of COVID\u2014we can rely on their data. We know they use accurate testing methods. Their response is a very strong one, and it has closely followed ours across the last year. We also have a framework for dealing with outbreaks. This includes how we would respond should there be any cases in Australia, and it mirrors the alert level system we have in New Zealand, so people planning travel can consider that there\u2019ll be roughly similar responses to a case in Australia to the types of responses we\u2019ve mounted to cases here. For example, cases that are clearly linked to the border where reliable contact tracing information is quickly obtained would not necessarily require disruption to travel. However, those that are more complicated, where it\u2019s not clear and may reflect community transmission\u2014i.e., the case is unlinked to the border\u2014may require a short pause in the travel bubble. Similarly, travel may be suspended if there is a larger outbreak or multiple unlinked cases and a longer period of time is required to understand what is going on.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000287\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aed260be-c954-464b-bb75-85579e53d05a\u0022\u003EWhat does this mean for travellers? It means that this is not a return to pre - COVID19 travel. It means that in order to make sure that New Zealand is safe from outbreaks of COVID-19, travellers will need to take extra precautions. That means being prepared for disruption in case they are unable to return. It may mean, if they are in Australia in a hot spot, that they may need a pre-departure test before they return to New Zealand. It may also mean that if they have returned to New Zealand from a place that has subsequently been shown to be a site of COVID transmission, they may need to isolate in New Zealand, and that may be self-isolation or in managed isolation, depending on the risk.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000288\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aed260be-c954-464b-bb75-85579e53d05a\u0022\u003EThat means we have to take the approach of flyer beware, and people need to be prepared for disruption during travel. That means thinking about how you would look after yourself if you were required to shelter in place for a time while there. And people have also been warned that insurance may not cover their travel, so it is not a return to business as usual.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000289\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aed260be-c954-464b-bb75-85579e53d05a\u0022\u003EContact tracing arrangements between our two countries are also a really important way of keeping New Zealand safe during this time. Travellers to Australia from New Zealand must use the local state contact tracing app when they are there. The country\u2019s apps are not interoperable. Similarly, visitors to New Zealand will be asked to download the New Zealand contract tracer app and instructed on how to use it. Contact details from travellers are available through a number of sources, and that can be accessed by our finding service should we need to trace back following an outbreak in Australia.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000290\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aed260be-c954-464b-bb75-85579e53d05a\u0022\u003EI recently gave a speech to the Australasian Society for Infectious Diseases specialists about our COVID-19 response. Of course, in many ways Australia and New Zealand\u2019s responses are very similar, and we reflected on that. One of the key things relates to our testing regimes. Both countries have some of the highest rates of COVID-19 negativity in their tests done in the world. That reflects our similar approach to managing COVID19: trying to drive the number of cases down to zero. What that means is that we are looking for a needle in a haystack, so we have high testing rates and low positivity numbers. And what that means is that we can have high confidence in Australia as a partner for this quarantine-free travel.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000291\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aed260be-c954-464b-bb75-85579e53d05a\u0022\u003EFinally, you\u2019ve heard of arrangements for making sure that travel itself doesn\u2019t become a vehicle for transmission. We\u2019ll be making sure that travellers to New Zealand wear masks on the aeroplanes and that green and red zones are separated at airports, and that airports undergo infection prevention and control reviews. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000292\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aed260be-c954-464b-bb75-85579e53d05a\u0022\u003EThe quarantine-free travel zone also gives us the opportunity to reconsider how we use managed isolation. And I think this is important, because the managed isolation system is a very difficult system to run\u2014doing a very important job. It has facilitated the return of over hundreds of thousands of New Zealanders, but there are also risks in running managed isolation facilities, and we have been open about the fact there have been some instances of in-facility transmission that has led to community transmission. It is a risk. And over the course of the response, we\u2019ve learnt more about the situations in which this has happened\u2014in particular, the evidence for airborne spread of COVID-19 has become more clear over time. That\u2019s meant that we have rolled out audits of the ventilation and learnt more about the different facilities that we are using and their suitability as managed isolation facilities. That means, when we think about the capacity in managed isolation that is freed up from having quarantine-free travel with Australia, we can make some decisions that lower the risk profile in managed isolation overall.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000293\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aed260be-c954-464b-bb75-85579e53d05a\u0022\u003EFirstly, this means we can keep some reserved capacity in case there are outbreaks that mean we need to isolate travellers from Australia in New Zealand in managed isolation facilities. But secondly, we have some ability to think about the overall risk profile of people in managed isolation. I think it would raise risk in our managed isolation system overall if we filled up the places that are currently used by people from low-risk countries from people visiting from places where there is high transmission intensity. So another positive aspect of this trans-Tasman bubble is the ability to think more strategically about the managed isolation system.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000294\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aed260be-c954-464b-bb75-85579e53d05a\u0022\u003EAnd the managed isolation system has attracted the question: why don\u2019t we have purpose-built quarantine facilities?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000295\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002257e41e9d-285b-4fb3-847d-a63820ae7137\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022cc47aeb45ff7404dbc2d1c53ea547140\u0022\u003EChris Bishop\u003C/span\u003E: Yeah, good question!\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000296\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aed260be-c954-464b-bb75-85579e53d05a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00227d91ec5ae86743d0addd5d15af348ac6\u0022\u003EHon Dr AYESHA VERRALL\u003C/span\u003E: It is a good question, to which one cannot magic up a purpose-built quarantine facility during a pandemic at short notice. But also I ask those who pose that question\u2014I have worked in a hospital that is a purpose-built facility with respiratory isolation wards, and these are wards where we have negative pressure rooms, where the air is sucked out so that bacteria and viruses leave via the HEPA-filtered system\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000297\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002262828428-6565-42b4-bd4d-fa3b12531f88\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022e59e71afce984f20be3074ef4442a014\u0022\u003ESimon Court\u003C/span\u003E: Yep. I\u2019ve been a patient there.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000298\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aed260be-c954-464b-bb75-85579e53d05a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022fd124712aeb2410ab53cf9b2fa813ea0\u0022\u003EHon Dr AYESHA VERRALL\u003C/span\u003E: I was not your doctor\u2014and each room has an anteroom, and the staff that work on these respiratory wards are particularly trained in prevention control. And yet, transmission and transmission of COVID happens in these types of facilities. It has happened in New Zealand. It has happened all around the world. So while it is important that we continue to focus on options for improving the facilities in which we quarantine people, we should also understand that there is no easy solution here, and we need to think carefully about how we balance the risk across the system as a whole.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000299\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002262828428-6565-42b4-bd4d-fa3b12531f88\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022045fbe0537b04333b39b962fdc49d244\u0022\u003ESimon Court\u003C/span\u003E: Vaccines!\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000300\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aed260be-c954-464b-bb75-85579e53d05a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002298ef2b09c45b4426ae001d8478860144\u0022\u003EHon Dr AYESHA VERRALL\u003C/span\u003E: We\u2019re doing that too. While I don\u2019t want to offend the 18,000 people living in Palau, the quarantine-free travel zone between Australia and New Zealand is unique in the world\u2014countries of this size being able to travel freely without risk of COVID. This was reported in Al Jazeera, BBC, and The New York Times because of precisely how unique travel without risk is now. The fact that we have a quarantine-free travel bubble shows confidence in our systems and Australia\u2019s systems.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002257e41e9d-285b-4fb3-847d-a63820ae7137\u0022 data-id=\u0022ca02d3dd61c147cdaf08ca78e90aa4dd\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000301\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002257e41e9d-285b-4fb3-847d-a63820ae7137\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022ca02d3dd61c147cdaf08ca78e90aa4dd\u0022\u003ECHRIS BISHOP (National):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Madam Speaker. I don\u2019t want to spend too much time talking about the benefits of a trans-Tasman bubble, because they have been well iterated for the House by previous speakers from both sides. The tourism benefits, as the Minister of Tourism explained to the House, are well known, but I actually believe that in time it will be the human benefits that we will look back on when we talk about the events of 2021 and the human cost of not having a bubble in place for the last year. There have been friends and wh\u0101nau and family separated, in some cases for many months, across this border between New Zealand and Australia\u2014mums who haven\u2019t seen their babies, dads who haven\u2019t seen their kids, grandparents who haven\u2019t seen their grandchildren and great-grandchildren. I, for one, am looking forward to going to Australia and seeing one of my best friends who\u2019s just given birth to twins in Sydney. People will, I believe, look back on this period and say, \u201CThank heavens we\u2019ve got the bubble open now.\u201D, and the human hardship has been immense. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000302\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002257e41e9d-285b-4fb3-847d-a63820ae7137\u0022\u003EBut in my contribution I want to talk about how we got to this point. I want to talk about some of the excuses given by the Government, and I want to talk about the implications of having the bubble in place. Firstly, how did we get here? The idea of a bubble was first talked about in May last year.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000303\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a68928ea-9dd8-4a30-8e2c-a0f49dfc8bea\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022e188bd0bc6b34742ae9ac91b174eb536\u0022\u003EHon Louise Upston\u003C/span\u003E: When?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000304\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002257e41e9d-285b-4fb3-847d-a63820ae7137\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022f72e4f624a504579a7ba55e71d7641db\u0022\u003ECHRIS BISHOP\u003C/span\u003E: After the lockdown, in May. And I think people, rightly, said back then, \u201CIt would be great to have the bubble up and running. We don\u2019t have to have it straight away, because we\u2019ve just done the lockdown and we\u2019ve gone through the various levels.\u201D, and, you know, the world was pressing in on New Zealand. But the idea of a bubble was a good one.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000305\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002257e41e9d-285b-4fb3-847d-a63820ae7137\u0022\u003EThen the negotiations started with the Australians. I want to make the point that the Government\u2019s negotiating strategy has been poor. The reason I say that is they went for a joint decision-making framework. My understanding is that what was actually sought by the New Zealand Cabinet was a treaty that would be signed between the Government of New Zealand and the Government of Australia\u2014almost like a Closer Economic Relations, a CER-type arrangement. It would be a formal treaty with all the i\u2019s dotted and all the t\u2019s crossed around what would happen in the event of an outbreak. It would be a formal treaty. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000306\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002257e41e9d-285b-4fb3-847d-a63820ae7137\u0022\u003EIt became clear as months went by that that was a mistake. We don\u2019t know exactly what happened in the negotiations\u2014and I\u2019ve lodged an Official Information Act request to the Government and the Prime Minister to find out exactly what happened, and I hope that we will now have that information released because the decision has been made, and to the extent that it\u2019s possible, without prejudicing the international relations of New Zealand, I hope that we will get to the bottom of exactly what happened in the negotiations\u2014but we wanted a joint decision-making framework.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000307\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002257e41e9d-285b-4fb3-847d-a63820ae7137\u0022\u003EThen what happened in October is the Australian Government just said, \u201CWell, New Zealanders can come.\u201D It is true that at various points various states put in place restrictions for New Zealanders to come. There was a flare-up in New Zealand and that various states would administer the border. But the general rule was that New Zealanders could go to Australia quarantine-free. And so then in December last year, we had the announcement from the Government right at the very tail end of the parliamentary year that the hope was a bubble would be up and running by the first quarter. So that\u2019s the month just gone, the end of March 2021. Professor Baker said actually it was possible then\u2014we\u2019re talking about December, remember\u2014but the hope was we\u2019d get one up and running by the end of March. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000308\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002257e41e9d-285b-4fb3-847d-a63820ae7137\u0022\u003EBut in February this year, the talks broke down after 11 rounds of talks, and I want to tell the House what I think happened. What I think happened is Australia shut its borders temporarily to New Zealand after we had the Valentine\u2019s Day cluster. This is the Papatoetoe cluster that everyone got very worried about for a couple of weeks. Australia temporarily closed the border and the Prime Minister criticised the Australian Government and said, \u201CWe\u2019re not very happy about that. They shouldn\u2019t have done that. We\u2019re doing a great job managing COVID in New Zealand.\u201D, etc., etc. And I think the Australians\u2019 point of view at that point was, \u201CWell, hang on a minute. You\u2019re sitting in here in the joint decision-making framework with us, arguing that you should retain the ability to close off the New Zealand border when there\u2019s a flare-up in Australia, and now here you are, Prime Minister, criticising the Australian Government for doing precisely what you are arguing for in the negotiations.\u201D And I think the Australians said, \u201CWell, that doesn\u2019t really make a lot of sense, actually.\u201D, and they\u2019d be right. So then the talks broke down.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000309\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002257e41e9d-285b-4fb3-847d-a63820ae7137\u0022\u003EIt became very clear at that point that what should happen is what has eventually happened, which is a unilateral decision-making framework, for want of a better phrase, by both countries. In other words, the Australians do what they want to do as their sovereign country, as they\u2019ve done since October last year. They\u2019ve said that New Zealanders can come to Australia quarantine-free, and it\u2019s incumbent upon you, New Zealand, to sort out what you do with your border because you, New Zealand, are a sovereign country. And that\u2019s when Scott Morrison came out and said, \u201CWell, I\u2019m happy for Australians to go to Queenstown and\u201D\u2014and I\u2019m pleased he said \u201CWellington\u201D, my home region, and he listed a few other places. He said, \u201CI\u2019m very happy for Australians, but it\u2019s up to New Zealand.\u201D And that\u2019s what put the pressure, alongside the petition launched by the National Party, for the Government to move. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000310\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002257e41e9d-285b-4fb3-847d-a63820ae7137\u0022\u003EI do want to respond to some people who say\u2014[Interruption] Well, members over there laugh, but I can tell you something for free, Miss Boyack. The officials only got their A into G after that petition got launched and members opposite started being flooded with emails from people saying, \u201CWhy is the Government not moving on a trans-Tasman bubble?\u201D\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000311\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bbded2ec-ac25-4a73-a380-3f4d87693084\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022feb99fea1bca4d5886741b248ac0d07b\u0022\u003EHon Stuart Nash\u003C/span\u003E: Oh rubbish!\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000312\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002257e41e9d-285b-4fb3-847d-a63820ae7137\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022bb8e14ddcbc942da840d653680d247b1\u0022\u003ECHRIS BISHOP\u003C/span\u003E: It\u2019s absolutely true, Stuart Nash. I know that for a fact. But I do want to respond to some people out there who say: if there\u2019s a flare-up and Australia closes the border temporarily, the National Party will be out there saying, \u201CWhat a disaster. You know, the Government\u2019s been terrible. What a disaster and they should never have done it.\u201D We will not do that. Even Jimmy Neesham, you know, a great cricketer\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000313\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002262828428-6565-42b4-bd4d-fa3b12531f88\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022432940dc8c0442fe82971ec7245d350b\u0022\u003ESimon Court\u003C/span\u003E: \u201CLittle Jimmy Neesham\u201D!\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000314\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002257e41e9d-285b-4fb3-847d-a63820ae7137\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022def1655fff2a40adb472f136643a0724\u0022\u003ECHRIS BISHOP\u003C/span\u003E: \u2014off to the Indian Premier League\u2014did he say, \u201CWho\u2019s Jimmy Neesham?\u201D You know who Jimmy Neesham is. He\u2019s a great cricketer. We should get him for the parliamentary cricket team; we\u2019re going to need him on Friday. But Jimmy Neesham said, \u201COh National will criticise it.\u201D And I just want to say to Mr Neesham and to others who have illuminated this view or amplified this view: we will not do that. The reason is that we believe both countries, Australia and New Zealand, should manage our borders flexibly. And it may well be that there will be a flare-up in Australia in the same way there may well be a flare-up in New Zealand, and it will take a bit of political nose-holding by both sides of the Tasman, but also both sides of the House in New Zealand, to get through that period. It will do that, and we\u2019re not going to criticise\u2014I\u2019d just note the caveat\u2014unless we think there is real culpability on the Government; for example, an avoidable mistake at the border or an avoidable series of events that leads to some culpability. But in the event that there\u2019s a minor outbreak in Auckland and the Australians say, \u201CWell, if you come from Auckland to Sydney, you can\u2019t come for a week.\u201D, we\u2019re not going to get stuck into that, and if I do, members opposite should feel free to lay into me.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000315\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002257e41e9d-285b-4fb3-847d-a63820ae7137\u0022\u003EAll these excuses were given by the Government: the airports weren\u2019t ready. Well, they were signed off in October. They said, \u201CThe airlines need more time.\u201D Well, of course they need a bit of time, but if you give them a date, they\u2019ll make it happen, and that\u2019s what we\u2019ve now done. I mean, Air New Zealand is selling flights to Sydney and even Hobart, of all places, and I know that Ben McKay from the Australian Associated Press is very excited about people going off to Hobart. Then they said, \u201COh, what about the tracer apps?\u201D Well, you know, the logical thing\u2019s happened. We\u2019ll use the Australian ones while we\u2019re over there and Australians will use the New Zealand ones. Then they said, \u201CWell, what happens in the event of an outbreak?\u201D And again, the logical thing has happened, which is that it\u2019s flyer beware, caveat emptor\u2014you might get stuck and people will travel with that knowledge. If you treat people as adults, then they will make up their own mind. And then they said, \u201COh, well, Australians can\u2019t leave.\u201D, because the Australians had this rule in place that said Australians basically can\u2019t leave without a visa. And we said, \u201CWell, once New Zealand opens its borders, that will go by the wayside.\u201D, and actually even before New Zealand opens its borders, Scott Morrison and the Australian Government, as a sign of good faith, I suspect, dropped that. So there have been a whole bunch of excuses. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000316\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002257e41e9d-285b-4fb3-847d-a63820ae7137\u0022\u003EJust finally, on the implications: this frees up a lot of space in managed isolation and quarantine. Yesterday, the Prime Minister said, \u201CWe\u2019ve now discovered that a small number of facilities are only suitable for low-risk passengers.\u201D, which raises a lot of questions: what are these facilities and why have there been people from high-risk destinations in facilities not suitable for high-risk passengers up to this point, and when will they be closed down? And there\u2019s a whole bunch of implications from that. But of course, now we\u2019ve got choices and optionality around Recognised Seasonal Employer scheme workers and split migrant families and critical workers that Judith Collins and other members on this side of the House have commented on. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000317\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002257e41e9d-285b-4fb3-847d-a63820ae7137\u0022\u003EThis is a good day. It should have come sooner. We do welcome it. Let\u2019s get on with it and bring the Aussies to New Zealand.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022b398827c-6bf5-403e-90dc-ff03205302a5\u0022 data-id=\u002213a16eb7a6bf45c68b221de8167ff4c5\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000318\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b398827c-6bf5-403e-90dc-ff03205302a5\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002213a16eb7a6bf45c68b221de8167ff4c5\u0022\u003EHon AUPITO WILLIAM SIO (Minister for Pacific Peoples):\u003C/span\u003E When that last speaker, Chris Bishop, began his speech, I was nodding in agreement, but then he suddenly went into this inane diatribe of abuse and tirade\u2014just the usual pattern of criticism, of whining, of whinging\u2014and it just reveals what\u2019s happening on that side. They\u2019re living in a bubble. They\u2019re living in a bubble of unhappiness, of woeful disconnection from reality.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000319\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b398827c-6bf5-403e-90dc-ff03205302a5\u0022\u003EWhat people need to be aware of is that, when the announcement was made by our Prime Minister and Mr Hipkins that we will be opening up the border on 19 April, there was joy that swept through from Northland to Invercargill. This morning, businesses from all over New Zealand were celebrating the news that we\u2019re now able to have this quarantine-free zone between New Zealand and Australia, something that is a testament to the leadership and the strategy of this Government: that we went hard and early and that we believe strongly the best economic response is a strong, strong health response. That\u2019s why we\u2019re here.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000320\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002257e41e9d-285b-4fb3-847d-a63820ae7137\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022e857d13c548f4652b6a9a10dd3abf5d3\u0022\u003EChris Bishop\u003C/span\u003E: Can\u2019t you speak in more than clich\u00E9s?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000321\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b398827c-6bf5-403e-90dc-ff03205302a5\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022ea641fe7200f43878464070d78439940\u0022\u003EHon AUPITO WILLIAM SIO\u003C/span\u003E: If we had ever followed any of that inane criticism from there, it would be much, much worse. It would have been much, much worse.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000322\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002257e41e9d-285b-4fb3-847d-a63820ae7137\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00221eeec2fb2c8741bd8bd1c2acb2e4064f\u0022\u003EChris Bishop\u003C/span\u003E: Why aren\u2019t you in Cabinet?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000323\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b398827c-6bf5-403e-90dc-ff03205302a5\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022730ec877a1234d62aa3d7cc0be67b15d\u0022\u003EHon AUPITO WILLIAM SIO\u003C/span\u003E: Listen to that\u2014listen to that diatribe. No one\u2014no one\u2014out there in the real world believes anything that they say.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000324\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b398827c-6bf5-403e-90dc-ff03205302a5\u0022\u003EWe are safe. We are safe only because of the elimination strategy of this Government, and what a wonderful joy it is to be a member of the Government that prioritises people\u2019s lives and their livelihoods. Because, if we had followed their example, our hospitals would be inundated. I suspect the fatalities would have been much, much worse, as we\u2019ve seen in other nations, who have taken the approach that they advocated for from the beginning, because they did not see people as a priority. Well, the news reveals it on the airwaves, on our social media.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000325\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b398827c-6bf5-403e-90dc-ff03205302a5\u0022\u003EI\u2019m really pleased, also, because there\u2019s a family in Fiji\u2014the Johansson family. Elder and Sister Johansson have been living in Fiji for quite some time on a church mission. They will be returning to New Zealand this Thursday, and they have been called on another mission in Australia. They are embracing this news with much delight, because they\u2019ll have an opportunity to visit with their families in M\u0101ngere, and then they\u2019ll be travelling to serve out a period of several years in Australia.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000326\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b398827c-6bf5-403e-90dc-ff03205302a5\u0022\u003EBut that\u2019s not all. I have heard today how our Pacific communities are relishing the opportunity to be able to visit, like others, family members, sons and daughters, uncles and aunts. I have warned some of our families: flyer beware, and that it will probably be much safer if they\u2019re staying with relatives\u2014just in case\u2014because, whilst we\u2019re saying we can move with confidence, the virus is still ravaging worldwide. We\u2019re still seeing numbers of deaths, numbers of infections spreading internationally, and so we move with confidence, but we\u2019ve always needed to be alert and to be vigilant.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000327\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b398827c-6bf5-403e-90dc-ff03205302a5\u0022\u003EI want to say I\u2019ve heard criticism also about why we have not opened it up to the Pacific. We are working apace in order to work with the Pacific to make sure that they are receiving the vaccination that we\u2019re able to provide support on. But I think when the Opposition are calling, \u201CWhy are we not opening up the borders to the Pacific?\u201D, it also reveals their ignorance of where the Pacific are, because the diaspora in New Zealand are very conservative. They have played this role of keeping New Zealand safe in a huge way. They\u2019ve played their part as members of the team of 5 million New Zealanders, because, if you look at the test rates of Pacific peoples, they had the highest test rate of any other population cohort. That\u2019s a significant indication of how much they have valued the leadership and the direction that has come from Dr Ashley Bloomfield, our Prime Minister, and those Ministers responsible for the roll-out of messages around COVID-19.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000328\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b398827c-6bf5-403e-90dc-ff03205302a5\u0022\u003ESo, even those countries, Realm Island countries\u2014Niue, for example\u2014they\u2019re not wanting to open up their borders; they\u2019re wanting to follow the example of New Zealand. And though Samoa, Fiji, Tuvalu, and Tonga have all indicated they want to be able to vaccinate their population, they\u2019re not rushing to open up their borders at all, and the diaspora here have also been quite strong in that message: we do not want to be responsible for exporting COVID-19 to the Pacific, which is relatively COVID-19 - free. So I think, again, the opening of the borders in Australia is a signal and a strong testament that the strategy of elimination has worked\u2014that the strategy and the strong leadership that has been advocated strongly by our Prime Minister and this Government actually is working. So I think the result speaks for itself, of what we have seen right throughout yesterday, today, and, I suspect, all week through.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000329\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b398827c-6bf5-403e-90dc-ff03205302a5\u0022\u003EI know that many of my cousins out in Victoria have had a struggling time because of the number of waves and the community transmission that has happened there. Whilst we\u2019re looking at Australia as one country, what we\u2019ve also got to be mindful of is that Australia has its own governance structures in terms of the different states, and so we do need to be vigilant. I\u2019m really pleased at the measures of protection and the layers of protection that our officials have been working really, really hard at to make sure that our borders\u2014the people arriving at the airport, the separation of travellers from other parts of the world\u2014are going to be significant. I\u2019d be keen to travel myself if the whips will allow me a couple of weeks off at some stage to test out the borders. But I am not intending to do that. But it is a good sign. It is a good thing that is happening here, but, whilst we open that up, and whilst businesses are relishing that idea, I think I would just simply say that we need to be cautious.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000330\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b398827c-6bf5-403e-90dc-ff03205302a5\u0022\u003EI think the good thing for New Zealand is we have now rolled out the vaccine to our border workers, our front-line workers, and their families. I know that Minister Hipkins, Minister Little, and my other health Ministers have all been vaccinated to give confidence to that border workforce. I will take the jab tomorrow afternoon. I\u2019ve always hated needles and am not looking forward to that needle, but I believe it\u2019s important to give confidence to what\u2019s happening and keeping New Zealand safe. I think it\u2019s also important to give confidence to the rest of our population, who constantly ask me, \u201CIs the COVID19 vaccine safe?\u201D I will say, \u201CAbsolutely it is safe. Absolutely it is safe.\u201D It\u2019s the first time ever that you\u2019ve seen global coordination, global collaboration of our scientists, as well as the United Nations, come together to rapidly produce a set of vaccines that are safe. But, more importantly for us in New Zealand, we have our Medsafe, our regulator of all vaccines, which has also given its approval for Pfizer and is working through the process of giving approval to the other vaccines. That\u2019s going to be important for us to continually build our confidence in moving around.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000331\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b398827c-6bf5-403e-90dc-ff03205302a5\u0022\u003EBut to the Pacific communities who are looking forward to travelling to Australia, stay safe. Travel with confidence but always remember the mask. This is a different world that we live in, and so the social distancing, the wearing of masks, the washing of hands\u2014that has to be the new pattern of how we conduct our affairs. And, as much as we celebrate our festivals with confidence\u2014and Pasifika is this weekend\u2014again it\u2019s a word: remember the mask. If you\u2019re sick, stay home, and that means, to my father, you don\u2019t need to travel at this time\u2014just simply stay home until you\u2019re well.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000332\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b398827c-6bf5-403e-90dc-ff03205302a5\u0022\u003EAnyway, it\u2019s a great day. It marks a significant success in our strategy of elimination, but there\u2019s still much, much more to do this year. As our Prime Minister said, it\u2019s the \u201Cyear of the vaccine\u201D, and we\u2019ve still got to stay on course.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000333\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b398827c-6bf5-403e-90dc-ff03205302a5\u0022\u003EThe debate having concluded, the motion lapsed.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000334\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b398827c-6bf5-403e-90dc-ff03205302a5\u0022\u003EGeneral Debate\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022bbded2ec-ac25-4a73-a380-3f4d87693084\u0022 data-id=\u0022ebb177b0d6d84bca936db0e5390f3ead\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000335\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bbded2ec-ac25-4a73-a380-3f4d87693084\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022ebb177b0d6d84bca936db0e5390f3ead\u0022\u003EHon STUART NASH (Minister for Economic and Regional Development):\u003C/span\u003E I move, That the House take note of miscellaneous business.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000336\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bbded2ec-ac25-4a73-a380-3f4d87693084\u0022\u003EFirst of all, I just want to say congratulations to the Hon Aupito William Sio\u2014good on you, mate; he\u2019s just left\u2014on having the needle tomorrow, having the injection tomorrow. Andrew Little had his today. I asked him if it hurt and he said he didn\u2019t even feel it. Mind you, Andrew has got pretty thick skin, so that\u2019s pretty good.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000337\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bbded2ec-ac25-4a73-a380-3f4d87693084\u0022\u003EWhat I would like to do is outline, very briefly, some of the initiatives that we are doing in the micro, small, and medium business space in terms of building resilience and getting businesses building back better in terms of the COVID recovery. Just a little bit of a background: we all know that small businesses are the backbone of our country. They form 97 percent of our companies, about 28 percent of GDP, about 40 percent of employees, and this is where the jobs are growing in our economy at the moment. So I will outline some of the work that will allow a level of resilience to be built that we haven\u2019t seen before, through increasing digitisation, thus enabling small businesses to engage with markets and consumers online in a way that was probably not imagined pre-COVID. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000338\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bbded2ec-ac25-4a73-a380-3f4d87693084\u0022\u003EMcKinsey, which is an American consultancy, said that in the States they saw five years\u2019 worth of digitisation taken up in eight weeks. Now, this was an American study, but from what I have seen, I suspect it\u2019s probably the same in New Zealand, and even pre-COVID\u2014but certainly during COVID, and in this time as we recover\u2014I have been saying ever since I\u2019ve been the Minister for Small Business that I think this is probably the last generation of business owners that will survive, let alone thrive, without being digitally enabled. The reason I say that is nearly every single Government initiative that is targeting the small-business sector involves some form of digital enablement. Whether that\u2019s e-invoicing, which will allow small businesses to be paid and to pay within 10 days\u2014in fact, at the moment the Government is paying 95 percent of its invoices within 10 working days, and in terms of cash flow and dealing with the Government, that is huge. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000339\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225bbd9f26-fdb0-4b85-a836-0fc46e1bba3c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022589793eeeb754e31bfaaaba5d77108e8\u0022\u003EHon Dr David Clark\u003C/span\u003E: Big step forward!\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000340\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bbded2ec-ac25-4a73-a380-3f4d87693084\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022c043f72520214e7bac4c38c08ccd44ad\u0022\u003EHon STUART NASH\u003C/span\u003E: It is a really big step forward. The thing is that the 20th of the month following is now an anachronism that no longer needs to be in terms of payment for small businesses\u2014or any business. We have a joint Australasian working party on e-invoicing. We\u2019re working as one with the Australians to make it easier\u2014or as easy as possible\u2014for New Zealand businesses to interact with their Australian counterparts when they decide to head offshore. But e-invoicing is going global, and we need to keep up\u2014we are keeping up\u2014and there\u2019s some fantastic work being done on that. In fact, I would argue the way e-invoicing is being rolled out across the State sector is that a business will not be able to interact with the Government unless they are e-invoicing enabled.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000341\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bbded2ec-ac25-4a73-a380-3f4d87693084\u0022\u003EIRD transformation, GST online, payday filing\u2014what we find is when Inland Revenue rolls out an initiative, there\u2019s normally a bit of a spike in terms of, you know, people that are unhappy with Inland Revenue. Then, after these things have become embedded, small-business owners throw up their hands and say, \u201CGoodness me, why weren\u2019t we doing this five years ago?\u201D Inland Revenue had a key performance indicator around business transformation that said by 2025 they wanted 82 percent of small businesses to be working on digital platforms. That has already been achieved, five years earlier. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000342\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bbded2ec-ac25-4a73-a380-3f4d87693084\u0022\u003EThe topic that I really I want to talk about is Digital Boost\u2014well, I\u2019ll outline in the last minute I\u2019ve got. Digital Boost is really an online digital training network that allows small businesses to learn and to pick up digital tools, to learn digital capacities and competency in their own time. They go online at digitalboost.co.nz and there\u2019s a series of videos that they can engage with at any point in time, and it also provides a whole lot of case studies for businesses that have gone through the Digital Boost experience. It is really a fantastic resource for business owners and operators who may actually be a little bit, you know, digitally incompetent\u2014their words\u2014but it\u2019s up to them. It\u2019s up to them! \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000343\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f677db8b-66c5-4794-953c-bdf7aa425710\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002273c0974aed014ab29d7c43ffc6aee55d\u0022\u003EMarja Lubeck\u003C/span\u003E: Challenged!\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000344\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bbded2ec-ac25-4a73-a380-3f4d87693084\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022d8b6158a9cd0440aa342970887c381fb\u0022\u003EHon STUART NASH\u003C/span\u003E: Digitally challenged! That\u2019s the word, thanks, Marja. We all know these\u2014it\u2019s the older generation that are incredibly good at what they do, but they really haven\u2019t engaged in digital technology in a way that this current generation have. But it is there to help businesses engage in 21st century commerce, engage with the Government, but find a pathway forward on their own terms, in their own time. Keven Mealamu is up there as a digital ambassador. He\u2019s transformed his business due to Digital Boost. I visited a business in Franz Josef Glacier that\u2019s managed to transform their business to allow them to take advantage of digital opportunities in a way they haven\u2019t in the past. Digitalboost.co.nz\u2014visit it!\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022ee649aea-c6fa-4610-9fcf-5c4bb2d3cd33\u0022 data-id=\u00224fa2fb5aa9674f19af69c344a885e787\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000345\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ee649aea-c6fa-4610-9fcf-5c4bb2d3cd33\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00224fa2fb5aa9674f19af69c344a885e787\u0022\u003EMATT DOOCEY (National\u2014Waimakariri):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you very much, Madam Speaker. I rise to give voice to the many thousands of vulnerable New Zealanders who trusted this Government. They turned up to the mental health inquiry and shared their personal and often traumatic stories about their experience with the mental health system. Those vulnerable New Zealanders trusted this Government. The Labour Party rode into power on the back of many people\u2019s pain in 2017. They have promised big, and yet again they have failed to deliver. The gap is galling, between their rhetoric and what they had to deliver. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000346\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ee649aea-c6fa-4610-9fcf-5c4bb2d3cd33\u0022\u003EThe recently released annual report for mental health and addiction services, the first annual report of that mental health inquiry\u2014because it\u2019s been delayed for so long\u2014was the Government\u2019s first opportunity to prove to those vulnerable New Zealanders that they had listened to their stories, they had responded, and they had made a change to the mental health system, which they claimed they would do. And what did they do? They gave those vulnerable New Zealanders a kick in the guts. Why? The data was missing. Numbers accessing specialist mental health services were gone. Numbers accessing community mental health services were stripped out. Consumer survey satisfaction gone, along with suicide statistics. Here we had a Government that was trusted with stories from vulnerable New Zealanders, telling their desperate, often traumatic stories. This Government promised they would make a difference, and they have failed to deliver.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000347\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ee649aea-c6fa-4610-9fcf-5c4bb2d3cd33\u0022\u003EWhat do we hear? We hear the Minister of Health, with his head in the sand, with his response that the Government has no legal obligation to produce that report. Well, if they don\u2019t have a legal obligation, they have a moral obligation to deliver that report. Many people look at that report every year. Those data sets have been delivered in that format for over a decade, and in the first annual report under this Labour Government, they have stripped out data. Why? Well, Stuff, under the Official Information Act, were able to reveal emails from the Ministry of Health officials who introduced a term into the public sector, called \u201Ca risk lens\u201D. They did not want negative statistics. That is something we would expect in North Korea, in Zimbabwe, in Myanmar\u2014and here we are in New Zealand. How can New Zealanders have confidence in the public sector?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000348\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ee649aea-c6fa-4610-9fcf-5c4bb2d3cd33\u0022\u003EAnd not only that, there were some Ministry of Health officials who challenged that and said no\u2014they are accurate statistics and it\u2019s not about whether it\u2019s negative or positive. That data was accurate and if it did not stay in that report, some officials were worried there were going to be no other opportunities for the public to see that data.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000349\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ee649aea-c6fa-4610-9fcf-5c4bb2d3cd33\u0022\u003EAnd what do we learn? The director-general, Dr Ashley Bloomfield, signed that first report off in July 2020. Something has changed since he first signed that report off. Here we are\u2014March 2021 and another report was pushed out just before Easter. Remember the Mental Health and Wellbeing Commission report that was buried on the day of the tsunami warnings and the COVID level changes? Here we have another report disgracefully pushed out, and what we do know is that Ministry of Health officials fought hard not to report negative statistics. They want to run a risk lens over it to protect the Government. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000350\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ee649aea-c6fa-4610-9fcf-5c4bb2d3cd33\u0022\u003EThis Minister of Health needs to take responsibility. He needs to release the data today to New Zealanders. He not only needs to release the data; he needs to tell New Zealanders whether he knew that data was going to be stripped out of the annual report. And, finally, this Minister needs to assure New Zealanders that no one at the Minister of Health\u2019s office instructed Ministry of Health officials to doctor that report. We need to have faith in the New Zealand public sector, and this report doesn\u2019t give us faith.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00220e7e8da2-a6a1-41bb-aeb0-a49be255a293\u0022 data-id=\u0022900f3a8d868c43449cce77743eb48c31\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000351\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220e7e8da2-a6a1-41bb-aeb0-a49be255a293\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022900f3a8d868c43449cce77743eb48c31\u0022\u003EHon NANAIA MAHUTA (Minister of Foreign Affairs):\u003C/span\u003E E te whet\u016B o te ata wh\u012Btikina mai, titiro mai ki tou pononga Morehu e noho toimaha nei. Homai te taro o te ora ki runga i to m\u0101tou hoa, ki a Kiritapu. E Ihoa o ng\u0101 mano, otir\u0101 ng\u0101 ariki manaakitia i a ia. Piki te ora, piki te kaha, piki te m\u0101ramatanga. M\u0101ngai ae, Pai M\u0101rire.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000352\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220e7e8da2-a6a1-41bb-aeb0-a49be255a293\u0022\u003E[Oh, bright morning star, shine down, look down upon your Morehu servant who is currently burdened. Oh, Jehovah of the Multitudes, oh Lord, provide our friend Kiritapu with nourishment. May her health, her energy, and her enlightenment be uplifted. Amen; goodness and peace.]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000353\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220e7e8da2-a6a1-41bb-aeb0-a49be255a293\u0022\u003EI wanted to begin with a mihi to Kiritapu. I, alongside many, many others, acknowledge your courage and wish you a speedy recovery, e hoa.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000354\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220e7e8da2-a6a1-41bb-aeb0-a49be255a293\u0022\u003EThe trans-Tasman travel bubble announced by our Prime Minister yesterday represents a new chapter in our response to, and recovery from, COVID-19. This arrangement with Australia is a world first: a quarantine-free zone between two countries who are both still maintaining an elimination strategy in response to COVID-19. We\u2019re doing this as it is safe to do so and are making sure we don\u2019t jeopardise the hard work New Zealanders have put in to make sure our response is one that works for all of us.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000355\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220e7e8da2-a6a1-41bb-aeb0-a49be255a293\u0022\u003EAs foreign affairs Minister, I am supportive of the reopening to the world, starting with Australia, our nearest and closest neighbour, and see this as a great step for foreign relations. We\u2019re in a great position to start our rebuild towards a new normal: resetting our economies, our relationships, and our shared aspirations across the Pacific. The opening of the trans-Tasman border will enable kanohi ki te kanohi engagement, and I look forward to seeing my Australian counterpart in person very soon. The Australian relationship is important to New Zealand. We are neighbours. We have wh\u0101nau who will look forward to reconnecting with each other across the Tasman.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000356\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220e7e8da2-a6a1-41bb-aeb0-a49be255a293\u0022\u003EThe decision to initiate a quarantine-free travel bubble with Australia was not taken lightly. A health response remains central to our decision, and it wasn\u2019t something that could be just rushed or that we could take for granted. It\u2019s important to remember that at this moment and until more people are vaccinated, our borders are the first line of defence against this global pandemic. Travel will be a little different to what it has been in the past, and travellers will need to recognise this isn\u2019t travel as usual. But this is an important step in reopening our country to the world, starting with Australia.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000357\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220e7e8da2-a6a1-41bb-aeb0-a49be255a293\u0022\u003ENew Zealand has been internationally recognised for its response to COVID-19, both for our work supporting wh\u0101nau through initiatives like the wage subsidy business support scheme, lifting the benefit, and coming together in responding to the need across the Pacific in relation to COVID-19, and the seasonal weather events they have been experiencing as well. Our responsibility has been widespread.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000358\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220e7e8da2-a6a1-41bb-aeb0-a49be255a293\u0022\u003EAt the border, we needed to make sure we could open safely, and there were conditions that needed to be undertaken to address things like establishing our response framework\u2014which is new online\u2014and this will ensure that we are ready if there are outbreaks of COVID-19. We needed to have measures in place to effectively contact trace travellers from Australia to protect New Zealanders. Technical issues needed to be resolved. We needed appropriate regulatory mechanisms in place for border agencies. Airlines, airports, and, agencies needed to be ready. Much work has already been done here, with crew separation and red and green zones at our airports, but they needed time to be in place that meant that we could open safely.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000359\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220e7e8da2-a6a1-41bb-aeb0-a49be255a293\u0022\u003EAnd finally, the Director-General of Health needed to provide advice that he was satisfied we are ready, and we are at that point. I acknowledge the hard work and commitment of all those involved in ensuring our readiness at the border, across the health system, and in the public sector. So we\u2019re now in a fortunate position to implement a trans-Tasman bubble. Benefits for wh\u0101nau, business, and the tourism sector will follow.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000360\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220e7e8da2-a6a1-41bb-aeb0-a49be255a293\u0022\u003EThere have been a number from the New Zealand tourism sector who see this as a positive-sum game. In fact, Prime Minister Morrison said yesterday that it\u2019s great that this can be done in time for Anzac Day, reinforcing how special the relationship is between New Zealand and Australia. Ng\u0101i Tahu Tourism welcomed the announcement and said that this travel bubble \u201Cmeans the chance to showcase once again some of the most beautiful parts of our country\u201D.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000361\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220e7e8da2-a6a1-41bb-aeb0-a49be255a293\u0022\u003EWhile we can rightly be optimistic about the borders opening, this will only work if we remain vigilant and aware that our continued focus on a health response means that we can enjoy such travel privileges and an economic recovery that works for our country.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022f317ee7d-f040-44ec-8f2f-ad0a9f206d75\u0022 data-id=\u0022d74a1ce79387413899a00d8444ab447b\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000362\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f317ee7d-f040-44ec-8f2f-ad0a9f206d75\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022d74a1ce79387413899a00d8444ab447b\u0022\u003EHon WILLIE JACKSON (Minister for M\u0101ori Development):\u003C/span\u003E Madam Speaker, tuatahi e tika ana ki te tautoko i te mihi ki a Kiritapu Allan. T\u0113nei te mihi ki a ia. Ko te t\u016Bmanako ka piki ake tana oranga i t\u0113nei w\u0101.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000363\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f317ee7d-f040-44ec-8f2f-ad0a9f206d75\u0022\u003E[Madam Speaker, it is only right that I support the acknowledgment to Kiritapu Allan. I wish to also acknowledge her. The hope is that her health will improve in due course.]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000364\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f317ee7d-f040-44ec-8f2f-ad0a9f206d75\u0022\u003EJust a lot of aroha from our team going out to our tuahine Kiritapu Allan, who\u2019s going through a tough time at the moment, but she has big support from our Government\u2014and also from the Opposition too. We acknowledge the support from the Opposition in terms of their aroha given to Kiritapu.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000365\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f317ee7d-f040-44ec-8f2f-ad0a9f206d75\u0022\u003EI wanted to use this short time to just correct my friend and whanaunga, Rawiri Waititi. He seems a bit confused lately over some of the wins that the M\u0101ori Party have had over the last few years, and so I thought I\u2019d take this chance just to correct him over a few things. Doing a good job for his people, no doubt about that, but I watched him on TV claiming victory for kaupapa like the M\u0101ori wards: M\u0101ori wards was apparently all due to the M\u0101ori Party. Rawiri needs to look back a little bit, because the M\u0101ori Party wasn\u2019t born when we started the fight for the M\u0101ori wards. In fact, I recall speaking about the M\u0101ori wards here in the House in 2002, and as I remember, the M\u0101ori Party started in 2004, so a little bit off there\u2014the whanaunga\u2014but kei te pai, you know, he gets a bit excited and he\u2019s had a lot of support from the media, sadly. But never mind. So this is a kaupapa that is very dear to us, driven by Minister Mahuta, and finally giving recognition to M\u0101ori in terms of the different councils around the country. Sadly, Hamilton is a bit off target there, but never mind, we have got that firmly entrenched.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000366\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f317ee7d-f040-44ec-8f2f-ad0a9f206d75\u0022\u003ERawiri also claimed success over the Ture Whenua\u2014I think someone needs to remind him that Te Ururoa Flavell probably lost his seat because of his stance on Te Ture Whenua M\u0101ori Bill. M\u0101ori were enraged with the way that the M\u0101ori Party were treating Ture Whenua, and in fact there were protests going up everywhere at the time. The Minister Meka Whaitiri put up a big challenge in that area and talked about M\u0101ori having more access to their land, talked about a more friendly M\u0101ori Land Court, and Te Ururoa Flavell, in the end, actually put a halt on what was happening in the Ture Whenua area. He wasn\u2019t able to save himself though, T\u0101mati Coffey came through. But I was fascinated that Rawiri would, again, claim success in that area.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000367\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f317ee7d-f040-44ec-8f2f-ad0a9f206d75\u0022\u003EHe also claimed success, I think, in Ihum\u0101tao\u2014I think he forgot, along with his National Party mates, that they were the reason for the debacle in Ihum\u0101tao. If it wasn\u2019t for the M\u0101ori Party and the National Party, Ihum\u0101tao would not have happened\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000368\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00221a292f8e4fab44929bf8a07f229ee24b\u0022\u003EHon Dr Nick Smith\u003C/span\u003E: Rubbish! What a fib.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000369\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f317ee7d-f040-44ec-8f2f-ad0a9f206d75\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022bfe1afcadf9e422cac9d50be576cc8dd\u0022\u003EHon WILLIE JACKSON\u003C/span\u003E: \u2014they put them in a special housing area, that\u2019s a disgrace. And if Nick Smith could remind his coalition partner that they were in fact responsible for the debacle, and we all know that the National Party would have dragged those M\u0101oris out by the throat, unlike ourselves who set up a wonderful solution, a very pro-M\u0101ori, pro-wh\u0101nau solution that we were very proud of, and it was another success for M\u0101ori and the Labour Party. But I just need the National Party to remind Rawiri, before he goes on Marae and all the other shows claiming success, that it wasn\u2019t the M\u0101ori Party\u2019s success\u2014it was the M\u0101ori and the Labour Party who drove it. We need some acknowledgment, particularly from Mr Luxon, who is\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000370\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e978865e-57e5-41d6-a7f6-b49daae78630\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022ab103f75a2ce47559ee4ab7445914727\u0022\u003EHon Dr Nick Smith\u003C/span\u003E: Oh, so you drove the campaign?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000371\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f317ee7d-f040-44ec-8f2f-ad0a9f206d75\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022c209c67d5de7473198a964243add7595\u0022\u003EHon WILLIE JACKSON\u003C/span\u003E: We drove the campaign, absolutely. I\u2019m sorry we can\u2019t drive the campaign to get you on the front bench, but your mate on the side there has probably got more of an opportunity as he sinks the National Party leadership. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000372\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f317ee7d-f040-44ec-8f2f-ad0a9f206d75\u0022\u003EAlso, another big win for the M\u0101ori and Labour: the procurement process. What a wonderful process there\u2014finally M\u0101ori getting more opportunity in terms of business, and that\u2019s incredibly important, the 5 percent that we\u2019ve won. Another success: the Public Service Act now demanding that mainstream agencies deliver for M\u0101ori. We\u2019ve got leadership being recognised, and management being recognised, and an emphasis on M\u0101ori leadership happening. The Hon Carmel Sepuloni knows this because she\u2019s driving that sort of process through her different agencies at the moment, and doing some great work. Proud of the work that Minister Sepuloni is doing.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000373\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f317ee7d-f040-44ec-8f2f-ad0a9f206d75\u0022\u003EBut I want to finish by congratulating Rawiri Waititi, because the M\u0101ori Party did do one great thing in the last election, in the last campaign: they named \u201COranga Tamariki\u201D. So congratulations to the M\u0101ori Party! They gave Oranga Tamariki their name. Well done, Rawiri and the M\u0101ori Party.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00221ebd1031-ea10-4c3d-bb56-2cd99528ae91\u0022 data-id=\u00226de65e3bcb594bcfad1a0c7c68cecd08\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000374\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221ebd1031-ea10-4c3d-bb56-2cd99528ae91\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00226de65e3bcb594bcfad1a0c7c68cecd08\u0022\u003EWILLOW-JEAN PRIME (Labour\u2014Northland):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Madam Speaker. It is a pleasure to take this short five-minute call this afternoon. There\u2019s actually a lot that I want to cover in my five minutes\u2014I\u2019ll see how far I can get through my list.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000375\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221ebd1031-ea10-4c3d-bb56-2cd99528ae91\u0022\u003EBut I just wanted to first start with acknowledging that on 1 April, we saw a whole lot of changes come into effect which benefited over 1.4 million people. I did an interview with Te Hiku Radio about the increase in minimum wage and what that means for our wh\u0101nau. So over 175,500 people are better off as a result of the increase in our minimum wage, now at $20 per hour. I want to particularly acknowledge those who worked hard during COVID, protecting us and providing essential services, and many of those will be those that are receiving the increase in the minimum wage. They are our supermarket workers. They are our cleaners. They are our security guards. So I think we all believe, in this House, for the fantastic work that they have done to protect us and to continue to provide those essential services, that they deserve an increase in their wages. So to the 175,500 people who are benefiting from that increase: that came in on 1 April.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000376\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221ebd1031-ea10-4c3d-bb56-2cd99528ae91\u0022\u003EThe next thing I wanted to acknowledge was the Minister for Social Development and Employment, who is in the House this afternoon, and over 830,000 superannuitants who are better off as a result of the indexing of our main benefits and superannuation to wages and also those who are on main benefits. These are substantial increases that people are receiving as of 1 April, and I\u2019m proud to be part of this Government who has brought those changes about.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000377\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221ebd1031-ea10-4c3d-bb56-2cd99528ae91\u0022\u003EThe second thing I want to talk about is in terms of steps forward in our recovery. This morning, I was reflecting on the fact that this time last year, we were in lockdown. Our borders had just been closed. We were in unprecedented times amongst a global pandemic. And to think a year later, we have people receiving the first roll-out of the vaccinations, and just this week we have announced that we will be opening the border in the trans-Tasman bubble. I didn\u2019t think either of those things would happen so quickly. It has felt like an extremely long time\u2014a year. The number of grandmothers who I have met on the streets in Northland who tell me that they miss their mokopuna so dearly are now going to have that opportunity to either travel over there or for them to come to Aotearoa.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000378\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221ebd1031-ea10-4c3d-bb56-2cd99528ae91\u0022\u003ESo I want to acknowledge the team who have done the work in the background to ensure that it is safe, that we have the best systems in place to be able to do this. Remember: these are unprecedented times; this is uncharted territory. There is no rule book or no playbook; we are designing it. There may be risks. We have tried to put in place all of the things we can do to mitigate that risk. It is a wonderful opportunity, but I\u2019m sure those who will take advantage of it also recognise the responsibility that they have. It comes with a risk that if something should emerge, that they will have to change their plans. But I look forward, particularly as the MP for Northland, to welcome visitors to Te Tai Tokerau to come and enjoy what our tourism has to offer. And I look forward to the Minister of Tourism coming on Friday.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000379\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221ebd1031-ea10-4c3d-bb56-2cd99528ae91\u0022\u003ENow, I just wanted to also acknowledge\u2014in the 1\u00BD minutes that I\u2019ve got left\u2014a few other initiatives that have recently been announced. Te Ara \u014D Hine\u2014support for M\u0101ori and Pasifika midwives in training. This is a significant development and I want to acknowledge all of those who are working or training in this area.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000380\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221ebd1031-ea10-4c3d-bb56-2cd99528ae91\u0022\u003EI also want to acknowledge that we announced that there would be free period products in all schools and kura. This is something that is dear to my heart, something I have passionately campaigned on since 2017. It is a wonderful development and I look forward to all of those schools and kura signing up to be part of this initiative. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000381\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221ebd1031-ea10-4c3d-bb56-2cd99528ae91\u0022\u003EFinally\u2014I do only have 45 seconds left\u2014I want to take the opportunity to recognise Kiritapu Allan, a friend and our colleague, who got the devastating news that she is now battling cervical cancer, but her message to all was to take care of your health, to Smear your Mea, wahine m\u0101, and if you notice changes, to see your doctor\u2014don\u2019t wait.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000382\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221ebd1031-ea10-4c3d-bb56-2cd99528ae91\u0022\u003EFinally, I\u2019ll leave the final message as a happy birthday to my auntie Isey Cross, who turned 102. She is the star of the movie James \u0026amp; Isey, which the Minister for Arts, Culture and Heritage and I had the privilege of attending the premiere of at the Civic with 700 other people in a packed-out theatre. Happy birthday, Auntie. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022275c91f8-c6b8-42fd-b3ab-d8fc000dd41f\u0022 data-id=\u002268233e9122e44e8aa55c11e37c11a138\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000383\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022275c91f8-c6b8-42fd-b3ab-d8fc000dd41f\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002268233e9122e44e8aa55c11e37c11a138\u0022\u003EERICA STANFORD (National\u2014East Coast Bays):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Madam Speaker. On a very unusually beautiful day in Wellington yesterday, out here on the forecourt, a protest came to Parliament: the split - migrant families\u2019 protest. They came from all over New Zealand. They made the journey yesterday. They held placards. They held photos of the children they hadn\u2019t seen in a year. The placards told us how many days they hadn\u2019t been able to hold their children for. I said to one man when I looked at his son\u2019s picture\u2014I said, \u201COh my gosh, he\u2019s so young.\u201D His boy was the same age as my boy and when I said that he turned away from me in tears. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000384\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022275c91f8-c6b8-42fd-b3ab-d8fc000dd41f\u0022\u003EThey have no voice. They came to Parliament yesterday to call for an urgent select committee inquiry so that they would have a voice\u2014and we heard them yesterday. The National Party MPs that went down there to the forecourt yesterday\u2014we heard them. The Green Party members, to their credit, heard them as well and so did the ACT Party members. In fact, almost every party in this House heard their message. But where were Labour? Where was Priyanca Radhakrishnan, the Minister for ethnic communities, sticking up for ethnic communities? Where was she yesterday? Was she there? No, she wasn\u2019t there. What about Ibrahim Omer\u2014a migrant himself who told us this wonderful story in the House during his maiden speech, which brought me to tears. It was a fantastic speech of his struggles in this country as a migrant. Where was he yesterday to stick up for the migrant families who were here yesterday telling us about their struggles? Well, he wasn\u2019t there. Where was Marja Lubeck? Where was Vanushi Walters? Where was Naisi Chen? Where was Dr Gaurav Sharma? Not a single Labour MP yesterday came down to care for these split migrant families. Not a single one of them yesterday.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000385\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022275c91f8-c6b8-42fd-b3ab-d8fc000dd41f\u0022\u003EThe PM has always heralded her super-diverse caucus\u2014this wonderful UN of a caucus that she has. But where was this wonderful diverse caucus yesterday in probably the first opportunity they\u2019ve had here in Parliament to stick up for our migrant communities, our ethnic communities\u2014where were they? Well, they weren\u2019t there. As usual, all talk and no delivery as yesterday our migrant families were utterly let down by this Government. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000386\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022275c91f8-c6b8-42fd-b3ab-d8fc000dd41f\u0022\u003EWhere was Minister Faafoi\u2014our Minister of Immigration? Actually, I have to say I\u2019m not surprised he wasn\u2019t there. Who would want to go down and look in the face of the abject human misery that is a result, a direct result, of his absolute failure in this portfolio? How could he go down there and look in the faces of the people he\u2019s been ignoring for nine months? Question time after question time, the Minister hides behind excuses for his inaction. His number one excuse\u2014managed isolation and quarantine (MIQ) capacity. Well, not any more\u2014the trans-Tasman bubble\u2019s open; 1,800 spots every fortnight are being freed up. Even yesterday, our Prime Minister, the Rt Hon Jacinda Ardern, laughed and smiled as she said, \u201CAnd look, MIQ spaces are not being used at the moment because it\u2019s winter and it\u2019s getting colder and people don\u2019t want to come.\u201D You don\u2019t think migrant families know that? They look every single day at the number of MIQ spaces that aren\u2019t being used and they cry for the children that they have who can\u2019t get in through MIQ because this Prime Minister doesn\u2019t care about them.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000387\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022275c91f8-c6b8-42fd-b3ab-d8fc000dd41f\u0022\u003EHer second excuse: our borders are closed. Of course our borders are closed. Well, actually, no, they\u2019re not. Not if you\u2019re a band or a nanny or a comedian or a children\u2019s entertainer or a Lion King dancer. Why, Jacinda Ardern, hey presto, quickly found room for the Wiggles to come in. She gets directly contacted by The Amazing Race producers. They\u2019ve got a direct line to her. Stephen Colbert gets heard by the COVID committee, the highest court in the land when it comes to COVID issues. We let in drag queens, we let in the Queen tribute band, but our split migrant families have no vehicle. They can\u2019t pick up the phone to the Prime Minister. They can\u2019t tell the Prime Minister about their heartache. They can\u2019t go to the COVID committee. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000388\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022275c91f8-c6b8-42fd-b3ab-d8fc000dd41f\u0022\u003EAnother phrase that the immigration Minister uses constantly in question time, as he did yesterday: \u201CWe understand their difficulties.\u201D He says it every single time. The split migrant families don\u2019t want to hear this because, Minister, you don\u2019t understand\u2014sorry he doesn\u2019t understand. Let me give him some insight. They gave up everything to be here. They are maintaining two homes on separate sides of the world. They\u2019ve lost all their savings. Their kids have mental health problems. Their relationships are breaking down. They\u2019ve missed kids\u2019 milestones. They have mental anguish at not being able to hold their babies who they haven\u2019t seen in a year. And what does he say to them? He says, \u201CBe patient.\u201D I would have loved to hear him say that yesterday to the face of the man who left his four-day-old baby in South Africa to come here, whose kid is now 14 months old. I would have loved to hear Minister Faafoi say, \u201CJust be patient.\u201D\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000389\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022275c91f8-c6b8-42fd-b3ab-d8fc000dd41f\u0022\u003EEvery day, the Prime Minister got up at 1 o\u2019clock and told us to be kind. But as it turns out, they were empty words: \u201CDo as I say, but not as I do.\u201D Here we have now the choice to do the right thing, manage the risk, reunite migrant families, and do the right thing for once. Be kind.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022f677db8b-66c5-4794-953c-bdf7aa425710\u0022 data-id=\u00224fad1481ba36411aa5f6bf6e20425d06\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000390\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f677db8b-66c5-4794-953c-bdf7aa425710\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00224fad1481ba36411aa5f6bf6e20425d06\u0022\u003EMARJA LUBECK (Labour):\u003C/span\u003E T\u0113n\u0101 koe e te M\u0101ngai o te Whare. After that speech, I do feel the need to bring it up a notch and bring some positivity back into this House. It\u2019s actually a real pleasure to take a call today, because it has been a week of some great steps forward in our recovery and rebuild.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000391\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f677db8b-66c5-4794-953c-bdf7aa425710\u0022\u003EJust to start with a couple of headlines: health Minister Andrew Little announced more support for mums and wh\u0101nau struggling with alcohol and other drugs. Sport and recreation Minister Grant Robertson and economic development Minister Stuart Nash have welcomed confirmation that New Zealand will host the opening ceremony and the opening match of the 2023 FIFA Women\u2019s World Cup.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000392\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f677db8b-66c5-4794-953c-bdf7aa425710\u0022\u003EThen, of course, we had the housing package, and we had the announcement yesterday of the opening of the quarantine-free travel bubble with Australia, giving our economic recovery a further boost. But wait, there\u2019s more\u2014of course! On 1 April, we had a raft of changes that will come into force that will raise incomes for more than 1.4 million New Zealanders. It includes a boost to the minimum wage, but also a 3.1 percent increase to main benefits and superannuation. We also are seeing the largest rise in abatement levels in two decades. Basically, that means that people who are on a main benefit and who are also working part-time will now be able to receive more of the money that they earn. So lifting the minimum wage is really about fairness for our workers, and roughly around 175,000 people will receive a pay rise in that time.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000393\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f677db8b-66c5-4794-953c-bdf7aa425710\u0022\u003ESo if we look, for example, as a comparison, during their nine years in Government, National increased the minimum wage by $3.25. In comparison, since 2017, when we got into Government, we have already lifted it by $4.25. In real terms, that means that a full-time worker on the minimum wage now earns an extra $170 before tax, thanks to Labour\u2019s changes. For a Kiwi working full time on the minimum wage, they will be earning an extra $44 a week before tax, and it\u2019s estimated that in the economy, that will mean an extra $216 million going around. And that\u2019s not a risk to the economy; that is a responsible and compassionate step to give Kiwis more money in hand and help New Zealand with its economic recovery.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000394\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f677db8b-66c5-4794-953c-bdf7aa425710\u0022\u003EMany of the people who will benefit from this rise are also the same people that we all benefited from in our COVID response. Now, my colleague Willow-Jean, the MP for Northland, already mentioned this, of course, but these are the people that kept us going during COVID, and we can\u2019t say this enough, and I, again, would like to take this opportunity to actually mihi our essential workers who kept New Zealand going during those most unprecedented times. These are our supermarket workers, our security guards, our cleaners, our bus drivers, and all the other essential workers that we depended on so heavily when we had this lockdown last year.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000395\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f677db8b-66c5-4794-953c-bdf7aa425710\u0022\u003EThe people who will benefit from this pay rise of the minimum wage are exactly the people who will need this, and the minimum is, after all, exactly what it is: it\u2019s just a minimum. And the workers who are getting it went above and beyond for us, and they deserve not only our gratitude for what they did, and continued recognition for what they did for the country, but they also deserve this minimum wage increase. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000396\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f677db8b-66c5-4794-953c-bdf7aa425710\u0022\u003ESo there is obviously a lot more to do, and our Government does recognise this, but this is positive progress in the right direction that will see New Zealand better off. And, of course, when compared to some of the rhetoric that we hear from the other side, it is very clear who New Zealanders picked to lead them through the unprecedented times and the challenging times that we\u2019ve had over the last year\u2014that was our brilliant Prime Minister, Jacinda Ardern, leading our team of 5 million, all through hard work and sacrifices, to get us on top of this epidemic and make sure that we, compared to other countries, are able to kick-start our economies. So we are united and we are focused and we are getting on with the job of getting Aotearoa New Zealand through an unprecedented time in our history.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000397\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f677db8b-66c5-4794-953c-bdf7aa425710\u0022\u003EWe already did this before the pandemic arrived on our shores. We were sowing the seeds of change, we continue to do this, and we have actually only been able to accelerate it due to the fact that we went hard and early when COVID arrived on our shores. We do also know that we won\u2019t be able to solve all of our problems overnight\u2014they are longstanding issues\u2014but we have already laid the foundation for change in our first time, and, of course, first term, and we are continuing in the right direction.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000398\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f677db8b-66c5-4794-953c-bdf7aa425710\u0022\u003EI will also express my aroha for Kiritapu Allan.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00223d42e8cf-544e-415d-892b-f4ef8014d80f\u0022 data-id=\u002206a8308940a04e1e9d61ba0565f67ea4\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000399\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d42e8cf-544e-415d-892b-f4ef8014d80f\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002206a8308940a04e1e9d61ba0565f67ea4\u0022\u003ETEANAU TUIONO (Green):\u003C/span\u003E Like the seas rising around the Pacific, I also rise to take this call. It\u2019s a reminder for me that Pasifika peoples are on the front lines of climate change. I also want to acknowledge the leadership of our young people who are also rising and mobilising again this Friday for the School Strike 4 Climate. It is they that have been holding our generation to account for kicking the can down the road and also, for some of our generation, denying the very existence of the climate can.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000400\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d42e8cf-544e-415d-892b-f4ef8014d80f\u0022\u003EPacific Island countries have contributed almost nothing to the causes of the climate crisis, yet are being hit first and hardest by its impacts. The severe injustice of the climate crisis in the Pacific has been matched only by the determination of Pacific leaders and peoples to lead the world to a more just and sustainable future. This was front of mind for me when, on the early morning of the autumn equinox, I sat on the Vaka Haunui: a traditional voyaging waka to take part in a climate talanoa, organised by Pacific Vision Aotearoa with the inasi kava club on the water of the Auckland harbour. It is always a dawn ceremony; it\u2019s never a morning ceremony or a lunchtime ceremony. So when we gathered in the dark, we could see the golden rays stream across the water, and I could feel the mauri on the water. We talked about climate justice through our connected, Pacific ancestral ways: the sharing of kava, vaka, sailing, and voyaging.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000401\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d42e8cf-544e-415d-892b-f4ef8014d80f\u0022\u003EI reflected on the vaka itself being a symbol to help us remember that before there were any borders and territorial lines that carved up the Pacific by colonial powers, it was vaka that helped keep and maintain our connections throughout all of Te Moana-nui-a-Kiwa. It was on vaka that our Pacific ancestors voyaged back and forth across the vast Pacific Ocean, unhindered by the so-called borders and territorial lines as they visited different islands, along with coming here to Aotearoa. Their skill was based on knowledge of the stars, sailing directions, and reading the waves and clouds to determine currents and to predict weather. They were deeply imbedded into their environment. I like to think that we, the descendants of those early navigators, can draw on their prowess and commitment as we navigate the myriad of issues relating to climate change.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000402\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d42e8cf-544e-415d-892b-f4ef8014d80f\u0022\u003EWe were fortunate to be joined by the Minister for Pacific Peoples, the Hon Aupito William Sio, who, among his many significant comments, said something that actually sat with me for a few days: that while we are rolling out the vaccine for COVID-19 and supporting Pacific countries to do so, unfortunately there is no vaccine for climate change\u2014if it was only that simple.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000403\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d42e8cf-544e-415d-892b-f4ef8014d80f\u0022\u003EYes we are a country that must account for its emissions, but we need to think about that in the context of the region that we live in. We live in the Pacific\u2014not Europe, not the Americas\u2014the place on the planet that is the most vulnerable to climate inaction. Yes we need to commit to climate action in Aotearoa to limit global warming to 1.5 degrees, but we also need to ensure our immigration policy is welcoming to Pacific peoples becoming displaced by climate change.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000404\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d42e8cf-544e-415d-892b-f4ef8014d80f\u0022\u003EClimate action means we all take a part. He waka eke noa: a waka that we are all on board, but it also means that when we are on that waka, it\u2019s important that we are all paddling, and, even more importantly, paddling in the same direction. I also note that He Waka Eke Noa is also the name of the Primary Sector Climate Action Partnership. We have to get to a point where we have to stop giving out hallway passes. Almost half of our emissions come from agriculture. For decades, farms were treated like factories, prioritising quantity over quality and popping out pollution. Many Governments told farmers, \u201CMake more milk powder. Don\u2019t worry about the effects on the environment.\u201D The tools farmers need to deal with changes in the climate and changes in their market were taken from them. We have to change, and many farmers know it. We have eight harvest cycles left before it\u2019s too late and we are hit by our climate change tipping point\u2014this is what the scientists are telling us: eight harvests to change the way we grow our food.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000405\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d42e8cf-544e-415d-892b-f4ef8014d80f\u0022\u003EMany farmers are already changing. It is time for the Government to support them to change. We can work with our rural communities to transform our agriculture and horticultural sectors from being one of the biggest causes of climate change into being one of the biggest solutions to climate change. First, we have to stop using nitrogen fertilisers. They pollute our water, they create emissions, and they enable more cows in places where cows have no good reason to be. What dirty coal is to electricity, nitrogen fertilisers are to farming. We can live without it. There are alternatives and we need to use them for the health of our land and air and the health of our ocean.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000406\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d42e8cf-544e-415d-892b-f4ef8014d80f\u0022\u003EAs a reminder of all this, I am left with the words of Reverend Sumalie, who joined us that day on the vaka, and he spoke about his home island of Tuvalu. And he reminded us that if we save Tuvalu, we save the world. Let\u2019s save Tuvalu.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002262ff759d-9586-405a-a6e6-208ad65adeb5\u0022 data-id=\u00229d86dcaad370486299e307d15c688af7\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000407\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002262ff759d-9586-405a-a6e6-208ad65adeb5\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00229d86dcaad370486299e307d15c688af7\u0022\u003ETANGI UTIKERE (Labour\u2014Palmerston North):\u003C/span\u003E M\u0101l\u014D e lelei, Madam Speaker. Can I start by acknowledging my parliamentary colleague the Hon Kiritapu Allan. As a new member of this House, she has been extremely welcoming to this place, and my thoughts are with her and her wh\u0101nau as she\u2019s on her recovery journey.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000408\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002262ff759d-9586-405a-a6e6-208ad65adeb5\u0022\u003EIt\u2019s a great day because some 24 hours ago the Government made its trans-Tasman bubble announcement because of our successful management of COVID-19. I do want to acknowledge those who have been working hard on ensuring that that announcement has become a reality and our next step to our recovery. It is a recovery, because we are in the midst of a global pandemic, all around us, all around the world, and I often think that perhaps the Opposition seem to forget that. I am delighted that my colleagues, Mr McAnulty and Mr McKelvie\u2014from across the way there\u2014who are fellow racing enthusiasts, may actually get this analogy, and that is the Opposition seem to have their blinkers on, on the way to the starting gate. The reality is that perhaps they should just be scratched before they even leave the gates, full stop. Why? Because they seem to be focused on knee-jerk reactions without understanding, actually, the full picture and the broader approach as to what is going on around them here in New Zealand. The Prime Minister and the Deputy Prime Minister have made it very clear, and for the benefit of the Opposition, let me reiterate to them. This side of the House actually make no apology for prioritising the health, safety, and wellbeing of New Zealanders during this unprecedented time. I constantly hear thanks from members of my community, and I know that members on this side of the House hear the same thing as they go about their duties as well. There\u2019s no doubt in my mind, and in the minds of the community, that we are a Government of action, and we are not prepared to simply put everything at risk.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000409\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002262ff759d-9586-405a-a6e6-208ad65adeb5\u0022\u003ECan I just paint a picture to provide some context for those in New Zealand right now? We have young people, we have rangatahi, who are able to go to school and engage in education and training. We have people who are in employment. We have people that can go about church and other faith-based opportunities. We have people\u2014individually and collectively\u2014who are able to play sports, whether that\u2019s during the week or in the weekends. We have mass gatherings that are enjoyed by many, many people. We\u2019re able to travel domestically and, in the matter of a couple of weeks, we will be able to travel internationally. We simply are the envy of the world.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000410\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002262ff759d-9586-405a-a6e6-208ad65adeb5\u0022\u003EI have to say that last week was a fantastic week. We finished the visit from the first leader of a Government, actually, in over a year, and that\u2019s the Cook Islands Prime Minister, Prime Minister Brown. I have to say that I am disappointed, if not I am appalled, at the comments from the Leader of the Opposition this morning, especially when she is the spokesperson for Pacific peoples. She infers, actually, that people on this side of the House who are of Pacific heritage\u2014because us 10 members in the Pasifika caucus here on this side of the House, and my colleague who has just resumed his seat: that\u2019s it, 11; over there, I don\u2019t see it. Now what I would like to say, actually, is that it is appalling that the Opposition spokesperson adopts that view because, quite simply, the 11 Pasifika members that have heritage here in this Parliament are concerned about the islands, we are concerned about small nations, and we are not prepared to place at risk those very communities by simply allowing us to go there without things being done properly. I reflect back to my last visit to the island of Aitutaki. The hospital there has fewer hospital beds than Palmerston North Hospital would have in one particular wing. So we\u2019re not talking about apples with apples; it is quite different.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000411\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002262ff759d-9586-405a-a6e6-208ad65adeb5\u0022\u003EI guess, though, in reality, the Opposition have a little bit of a dilemma. Because if they are to replace that spokesperson for Pasifika peoples, just look at them, who could they have? Is there an element of choice there? Is there an element of choice? Talofa, talofa, talofa, is what we say on this side of the House. Now, what I would say is that my colleagues have previously spoken about a number of changes that have come in last week, and I\u2019m really proud of that. I\u2019m proud of the fact that people in my community of Palmerston North are going to have an increased minimum wage. I am proud of the fact that, actually, the very people who we talked about as a House around last night\u2019s Social Security (Subsequent Child Policy Removal) Amendment Bill are the very people who will benefit from the decisions that this Government has delivered over the last week. So it\u2019s a great time to be a member of a Government that is focused on its community, is focused on delivering, and we look forward to continuing to do that as part of our recovery for all New Zealanders. T\u0113n\u0101 koe, Madam Speaker. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002255d0b7a4-a2c9-4c38-9b77-475311a48a89\u0022 data-id=\u00228192419f623f45a5bff58dd288f1ce18\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000412\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002255d0b7a4-a2c9-4c38-9b77-475311a48a89\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00228192419f623f45a5bff58dd288f1ce18\u0022\u003ESIMEON BROWN (National\u2014Pakuranga):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Madam Speaker. Thank you for the opportunity to speak in this debate. Public safety is being put at risk under this Government. The Government has lost control of law and order in New Zealand, and is putting New Zealanders\u2019 safety at risk. Our streets are becoming less safe. Our police officers are being assaulted more and more often and having firearms presented at them more often. Our corrections officers are being assaulted more often in our prisons. Gangs are taking control of our streets. New Zealanders have had enough and it\u2019s time for this Government to take control of law and order in New Zealand.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000413\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002255d0b7a4-a2c9-4c38-9b77-475311a48a89\u0022\u003ENew Zealanders don\u2019t deserve to be put at risk on the streets. Under this Government, we have seen the number of serious assaults in New Zealand double. In 2017, there were 10,681 serious assaults recorded in New Zealand. In 2020, there were 21,252 serious assaults on our streets. This is four years of failure by this Government when it comes to law and order. The number of our police officers who are being assaulted has increased. Last year, 1,348 people were charged with assaulting police officers in New Zealand, something that is unbelievable. And do you know what the saddest fact is? Gang members are recruiting faster than the New Zealand Police. There has been a 48 percent increase in gang membership in New Zealand, and the Police have only recruited 1,300 new police officers, under this Government.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000414\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002255d0b7a4-a2c9-4c38-9b77-475311a48a89\u0022\u003EThis Government has blinkers on. They\u2019re not interested in the facts, they\u2019re not interested in the statistics, and they\u2019re not interested in New Zealanders\u2019 safety, which is becoming incredibly concerning. I was in Paihia on Thursday for a public meeting where locals, business owners, community groups, the community patrol, and wardens in that town turned up saying, \u201CWe don\u2019t see the police on our streets.\u201D The local police station is not even being manned on a regular basis in that community. Kelvin Davis, one of the local members of Parliament up there, decided to decline the event after first saying he was going to be there. Five minutes before it started he said he couldn\u2019t make it and didn\u2019t show up. That was an absolute disgrace for the people of Paihia.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000415\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002255d0b7a4-a2c9-4c38-9b77-475311a48a89\u0022\u003EWhat is this Government doing about law and order? Well, they promised 1,800 new police over three years. It is now 3\u00BD years since they came into office and we\u2019ve only got 1,347 new officers on the beat. Of those 1,800, 700 were to be focused on tackling gangs and organised crime, and how many of them have they delivered? Two hundred and thirty-nine new officers focused on tackling gang and organised crime. Police have not got the resources that this Government promised. New Zealanders have not got the resources that this Government promised.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000416\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002255d0b7a4-a2c9-4c38-9b77-475311a48a89\u0022\u003EAnd did you know that at the same time that they haven\u2019t delivered on their promise of new police\u2014the 1,800 new police\u2014the police training college is sitting empty? They\u2019re not taking a new wing of recruits until May of this year, and they won\u2019t be on the beat until September or later this year. That is unbelievable and unacceptable. The excuse that they\u2019re giving for not taking new recruits is that the attrition rate is too low. Well, when they started the 1,800 programme they said that the attrition rate was too high so they were not going to be able to meet the programme. Now they\u2019re saying it\u2019s too low. Well, New Zealanders have had enough of the excuses and are wanting to see action and delivery from this Government.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000417\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002255d0b7a4-a2c9-4c38-9b77-475311a48a89\u0022\u003EThis Government has an opportunity to take law and order seriously. They need to keep to their word. They need to deliver on their promises. They could bring forward funding to make sure those police are delivered, to make sure those police are trained, to make sure they\u2019ve got the tools they need to be able to do their job and keep safe. I find it shocking that police officers are becoming afraid of turning up to jobs because they think it\u2019s too risky. They\u2019re afraid of having a gun pointed at them when they turn up, because they don\u2019t have the back-up and the support they need. It\u2019s time this Government listened to front-line officers on the street, on the beat, who are doing the hard work but don\u2019t feel the support that they\u2019ve got from this Government. Then they\u2019ve got policies coming through saying they can\u2019t pursue, they can\u2019t go and eradicate marijuana, they can\u2019t do all these other policies they\u2019ve being doing for years. This needs leadership from the Government. It has its blinkers on when it comes to law and order, and I\u2019m calling on this Government to take this issue seriously before those statistics get even worse.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022288783df-ade6-42d2-bd21-06ffa87dedf8\u0022 data-id=\u002279b9d4f0aecd45f5887d0686849c54ef\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000418\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022288783df-ade6-42d2-bd21-06ffa87dedf8\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002279b9d4f0aecd45f5887d0686849c54ef\u0022\u003ESTEPH LEWIS (Labour\u2014Whanganui):\u003C/span\u003E As my colleagues have mentioned, yesterday the Prime Minister announced that as of 19 April, Kiwis and Aussies can travel back and forth without needing to book a spot in managed isolation and quarantine. I know that that\u2019s going to be a huge relief for many people in my electorate, who, like many across the country, have missed their friends and their family over the last 12 months. It\u2019s been a long and, at times, hard year, but the combined effect of our efforts means that friends and families can again be reunited. I\u2019ve heard from many grandparents in my electorate who have missed the birth of a new grandchild, and I know it will bring them great joy to finally be able to meet their grandchild. That is a good thing. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000419\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022288783df-ade6-42d2-bd21-06ffa87dedf8\u0022\u003ESo too is the fact that last week we introduced a range of measures that will raise the incomes of 1.4 million New Zealanders, and that\u2019s a crucial step to making sure we build back better and further our recovery. Last week, minimum wages went up to $20 an hour. Pensions and benefits, which were indexed to increases in wages, also went up, because, despite the odds, last year wages in New Zealand increased by 3.1 percent. Abatement thresholds were also changed, and what that means is that people receiving a benefit and in part-time work can keep more of what they earn. That is great news for people in my electorate too. You see, a few years ago, when the previous Government was in, Whanganui was called a ghost town by a visiting reporter, and that was at the point where we had a so-called rock star economy. Well, we didn\u2019t see that rock star economy in the regions. Instead, what we saw was shops closing, more and more families living in cars, and we didn\u2019t see wage growth. Times were tough for families\u2014unnecessarily so\u2014but what a difference a few years makes when you\u2019ve got a Government that backs the regions, that invests in our regions, that works in partnership with our regions, and we\u2019ve felt the benefit of that in my electorate, where we feel more hope and more optimism now through a global pandemic than we did when we had a so-called rock star economy. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000420\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022288783df-ade6-42d2-bd21-06ffa87dedf8\u0022\u003ECOVID has been tough on us all, but together we have come through it, and in Whanganui and Taranaki, we\u2019ve come through better than most, with tourism numbers up and spending data showing increases too. Instead of a ghost town, we are well on our way to becoming a thriving, vibrant city again. Take our arts community, for example. In the last fortnight, we\u2019ve had Whanganui Walls, where artists have come to Whanganui and painted beautiful murals on walls across our city. We\u2019ve had artists open studios, where local artists across the region have opened their studio doors to the public for two weeks, and the changes that were announced last week are going to help more people to be able to afford to come and see that vibrancy and experience it for themselves. I recommend starting at the Whanganui Sarjeant art gallery, in its temporary location, of course, because the iconic Sarjeant art gallery is being restored thanks to investment from this Government, and, yes\u2014credit where credit\u2019s due\u2014the previous Government, too. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000421\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022288783df-ade6-42d2-bd21-06ffa87dedf8\u0022\u003EBut don\u2019t just stop in Whanganui. If you\u2019ve come for the arts scene, take your time, travel up through Taranaki to the amazing small galleries, and make sure you definitely stop at the Percy Thomson in Stratford, too. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000422\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022288783df-ade6-42d2-bd21-06ffa87dedf8\u0022\u003EThere\u2019s so much more to do. Check out the local attractions, travel up the awa on the historic Waimarie paddle steamer. Visit our shops. Check out our cafes. Take the kids to the two best playgrounds in New Zealand: Kowhai Park in Whanganui and King Edward Park in H\u0101wera. While you\u2019re in Taranaki, check out the Taranaki Crossing, with its upgraded tracks and facilities, thanks to help from the Provincial Growth Fund from this Government. Drive up the Forgotten World Highway, which is, at long last, finally in the process of having the last 12 kilometres sealed, thanks, again, to investment from this Government, and that investment is creating local jobs, which is helping us to recover locally. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000423\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022288783df-ade6-42d2-bd21-06ffa87dedf8\u0022\u003EDo not underestimate the impact that an increase in income can make to our regional communities. If it allows a few more families to get out and explore our regions, then this is good news for our recovery. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022d14b1afe-2069-41e4-96fa-c8dc81a991a4\u0022 data-id=\u00221b821705339c437283c83ddec898b26c\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000424\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022d14b1afe-2069-41e4-96fa-c8dc81a991a4\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00221b821705339c437283c83ddec898b26c\u0022\u003EASSISTANT SPEAKER (Hon Jenny Salesa)\u003C/span\u003E: Order! The time for this speech has expired. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002286ae9a20-33bd-4912-8dc1-5b4eb670be44\u0022 data-id=\u0022da1243df62a84319b47d1a54882adaee\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000425\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002286ae9a20-33bd-4912-8dc1-5b4eb670be44\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022da1243df62a84319b47d1a54882adaee\u0022\u003E KAREN CHHOUR (ACT):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Madam Speaker, for giving me the opportunity to speak today in this debate. I often sit and think about all the reasons I came to this place, and what I want to achieve. There are many social issues in this country, and, yes, there is a lot more the Government could be doing in this area, but it is also up to us within our communities to do our bit. MPs hear from many people from all walks of life when we sit on select committees, and get some real insight into what is happening in our communities. What I hear most is the need for more mentorship and support within our communities. When I think about mentorship and support, it reminds me of my time volunteering with St John. Considering it is St John\u2019s Heart of Gold Annual Appeal this week, I thought it would be appropriate to speak about the multiple programmes they provide within our communities. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000426\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002286ae9a20-33bd-4912-8dc1-5b4eb670be44\u0022\u003ESt John as an organisation has a presence in some sort of way pretty much in every major city and small town in New Zealand, whether it be an ambulance that comes to your aid in your most vulnerable moments or when they are teaching kids life skills in our schools. When we think of St John, many people don\u2019t realise that they are a charitable organisation. They receive some funding from Government, and the rest is made up from fund-raising. Government and many community organisations are now recognising and speaking to the fact that we need to put more effort into prevention and support for our most vulnerable. We should not be waiting until families are in crisis mode before they are able to seek help. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000427\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002286ae9a20-33bd-4912-8dc1-5b4eb670be44\u0022\u003EI was lucky enough to be invited to a presentation on a new initiative that St John has started to launch as part of their school programme. Wh\u0101tuia te Waiora\u2014Weaving Wellbeing\u2014is a wellbeing and resilience programme for year 7 to 8 students. They recognise this is the age where a lot of our young ones are struggling the most. This programme gives children the opportunity to weave positivity into their daily lives. The one thing that stood out for me was their concept that a state of wellbeing is not simply the absence of the negative, but the presence of the positive. Students will learn what character strength is and how these are different from values and skills. Students will discover how to use their strengths and identify opportunities in which they can grow. Students will learn how to call on their strengths in times of challenge and build their resilience. Students will develop awareness around positive and negative emotions, and ways to boost those positive emotions. Students will discover kindness to themselves in learning how to be their own best friends. Students discover the idea of community wellbeing and explore where there is a call to action that they can be involved in. I am proud that I was part of that organisation for many years, and I am proud of the initiatives that they are coming up with. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000428\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002286ae9a20-33bd-4912-8dc1-5b4eb670be44\u0022\u003ESt John has many community programmes, mostly staffed by volunteers. Health shuttles which enable patients to get to vital health appointments like chemotherapies that they might not otherwise be able to attend, Friends of the Emergency Department, community carers, ASB St John in Schools, youth groups and cadets, caring callers, and therapy pets\u2014all relying on people within the community to go out and volunteer their time. In addition to that, they have a commercial service that provides first aid, mental health first aid, training courses, and medical alarms, which help build community resilience. So when you are out and about this week and you see the wonderful volunteers with their Heart of Gold badges standing outside the ASB and selling their sausages at the local Bunnings\u2014which is where I would usually be at this time of the year\u2014you can know that your generous donation is making a difference in a community near you. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000429\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002286ae9a20-33bd-4912-8dc1-5b4eb670be44\u0022\u003EThe ACT Party recognises there are many organisations in this country that are helping to make New Zealand a better place, and we would like to express our gratitude to them all. Thank you, Madam Speaker. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000430\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002286ae9a20-33bd-4912-8dc1-5b4eb670be44\u0022\u003EThe debate having concluded, the motion lapsed.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n    \u003C/div\u003E\n    \u003Cdiv class=\u0022HpsHansard\u0022\u003E\n      \u003Cp\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsProceedingHeading\u0022\u003EBills\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000431\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u0022b1dd79a3cdfe445aa3a161c175ca1d97\u0022\u003EAdverse Weather-affected Timber Recovery on Conservation Lands Bill\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000432\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u0022ba1d5c59e782496dae9b8a49876985c2\u0022\u003EFirst Reading\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000433\u0022\u003EDebate resumed from 24 March.\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022e122e0e6-61c6-4d17-9a79-6ad2ac7d127e\u0022 data-id=\u0022040caaa166c441f28b6fa2d9a57293d3\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000434\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e122e0e6-61c6-4d17-9a79-6ad2ac7d127e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022040caaa166c441f28b6fa2d9a57293d3\u0022\u003EHon EUGENIE SAGE (Green):\u003C/span\u003E T\u0113n\u0101 koe, Madam Speaker. I\u2019m pleased to take a call on the Adverse Weather-affected Timber Recovery on Conservation Lands Bill, and I am grateful to my Labour colleague Rachel Brooking for her very careful legal analysis and dissection of the many failings of this bill from a legal point of view. But I want to focus on why the Green Party is opposing this bill and will be voting against it. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000435\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e122e0e6-61c6-4d17-9a79-6ad2ac7d127e\u0022\u003EThis bill represents a fundamental attack on conservation values, on nature, on our public protected lands and our indigenous forests, nature\u2019s cathedrals: our kauri, rimu, beech, kahikatea, mata\u012B, and podocarp forests. The Green Party opposed the bill on which this is based\u2014the Hon Nick Smith\u2019s West Coast Wind-blown Timber (Conservation Lands) Bill\u2014in June 2014, which was pushed through the House under urgency with no chance for select committee consideration and no chance for public submissions, even though it affected public land. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000436\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e122e0e6-61c6-4d17-9a79-6ad2ac7d127e\u0022\u003EThis bill fails to recognise the history of forest clearance in Aotearoa New Zealand. Forest once covered 85 percent of our country, some 23 million hectares, and yet in 25 to 30 generations, we have reduced the extent of that forest cover to around 20 percent of our land area. We\u2019ve converted it to pasture. We need to protect what remains. We need to protect these magnificent forests on conservation lands and the homes that they provide for our distinctive indigenous plants and wildlife, yet this bill goes back to the 19th century with its desire to see logging on conservation land, authorised by the Director-General of Conservation, which would see the Department of Conservation collect fees for that logging. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000437\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e122e0e6-61c6-4d17-9a79-6ad2ac7d127e\u0022\u003EThe National Party and the member are grounded in the 19th century, not the 21st century. They fail to recognise the key ecosystem services that these forests provide and their importance as habitat for wildlife. It\u2019s opportunistic plundering of conservation land that this bill is promoting rather than safeguarding its indigenous biodiversity. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000438\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e122e0e6-61c6-4d17-9a79-6ad2ac7d127e\u0022\u003EThe bill also fails to recognise that for over 30 years, there has been strong public support for the prohibition on logging in section 30 of the Conservation Act 1987. That prohibition on logging was put in place for very good reasons, because when Te Papa Atawhai\u2014the Department of Conservation\u2014was established in 1987, it brought all of the \u201Cgreen dots\u201D that were spread throughout the Forest Service, Department of Lands and Survey, and the Wildlife Service together into one agency. We had had the Forest Service, which was trying to be a multiple-use agency. On the one hand, its environmental forestry arm was encouraging recreation on public land, and, on the other, it was napalming indigenous forests, rimu forests, in the Buller and elsewhere and converting those into pine plantation. That was enormously destructive. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000439\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e122e0e6-61c6-4d17-9a79-6ad2ac7d127e\u0022\u003EThe Labour Government phased out the Forest Service in that restructuring in the 1980s. It created Te Papa Atawhai, which has the Conservation Act, which prohibits logging. This bill also fails to recognise the history of the huge effort that the conservation movement\u2014New Zealanders, iwi; all of us\u2014have made to protect these forests on public land from logging. We had the big campaigns in Orikaka, in \u014Ck\u0101rito, in Waikukupa, Whirinaki, Pureora, and the Longwoods and Rowallan forests in Western Southland to stop logging on public land. The dying days of logging were under the former National Government. A newly elected Labour Government stopped the beech scheme that Timberlands West Coast wanted to proceed with, which would have resulted in pock-marking the forest with a whole lot of clear-cut and saw 120,000 hectares of West Coast forest then added to the conservation estate. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000440\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e122e0e6-61c6-4d17-9a79-6ad2ac7d127e\u0022\u003EThis bill would take us back to that era of logging, destruction of biodiversity, and destruction of nature. It fails to recognise the key role that wind-blown timber and fallen trees have in recycling nutrients in the forest, that dead trees have in providing nest holes for birds like k\u0101k\u0101 and k\u0101k\u0101riki, and that fallen trees have in providing a seed-bed for regenerating forest and regrowth of the forest. This bill is just opportunistic. It seeks to plunder conservation land and the Green Party is opposing it. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002262ff759d-9586-405a-a6e6-208ad65adeb5\u0022 data-id=\u0022c76570da8dee4e38b87dda693bea0672\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000441\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002262ff759d-9586-405a-a6e6-208ad65adeb5\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022c76570da8dee4e38b87dda693bea0672\u0022\u003ETANGI UTIKERE (Labour\u2014Palmerston North):\u003C/span\u003E M\u0101l\u014D e lelei, Madam Speaker. Thank you. I rise to take a call on this, the Adverse Weather-affected Timber Recovery on Conservation Lands Bill. In doing so, I note that this piece of proposed legislation, essentially, was prompted by the West Coast Wind-blown Timber (Conservation Lands) Act 2014, which I think I will just refer to as the WBT Act, moving forward. But I note actually what\u2019s proposed is quite different from that piece of legislation. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000442\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002262ff759d-9586-405a-a6e6-208ad65adeb5\u0022\u003EThere are two points of difference that I can take from it. The first is that it\u2019s not limited to a specific area geographically in its sense, such as the West Coast. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000443\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00224d83c8a5-2f48-4991-9c45-b1a6060daedd\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00224c553f34d9314de88a612ee8b911be5b\u0022\u003EMaureen Pugh\u003C/span\u003E: Weather happens all over the place.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000444\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002262ff759d-9586-405a-a6e6-208ad65adeb5\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022171893ca5e9640b7b6c2a67f9372087c\u0022\u003ETANGI UTIKERE\u003C/span\u003E: And for the benefit of the member whose bill this is, reviewing the Hansard, I noted that she asked my colleague previously what the conservation land had to do with it when she was identifying the list\u2014Rachel Brooking, who did a very good job of doing that in the last call. So for the benefit of the member\u2014I mean, it\u2019s her bill. I would have thought she would know, but I will just reiterate that this would, essentially, identify conservation areas under the Conservation Act and also under the Reserves Act. When it looks at the Conservation Act, we are specifically looking, as I understand it, to conservation parks, wilderness areas, sanctuary areas, water course areas, amenity areas, wildlife management areas, and other conservation areas being that of stewardship. But also it would apply to land that falls under the Reserves Act, and four of those sit comfortably: recreation, historic, scenic, and Government purpose reserves. So we are not talking about just a specific locality or locale; it\u2019s much broader than that. That\u2019s the first thing. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000445\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002262ff759d-9586-405a-a6e6-208ad65adeb5\u0022\u003EThe second thing is that it\u2019s actually not limited to time. The WBT Act does have a time frame of five years; this doesn\u2019t. So I think it\u2019s really important that we do acknowledge the context within which the proposed bill would lie. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000446\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002262ff759d-9586-405a-a6e6-208ad65adeb5\u0022\u003ESo what then does the bill seek to do? Well, it would kick in, related to an adverse weather event, and that\u2019s not defined, but I accept the member whose bill this is did suggest in her opening remarks in the first introductory speech that the select committee process would be one where that could be sort of looked into. But it does none the less still raise a number of concerns, because when you look at the relevant clauses within it, I turn my mind to issues around the process of removal. So, OK, it\u2019s clear in the bill that items must be authorised by the Director-General of the Department of Conservation, and when I have a look at clause 8(4), there are, essentially, four things that the director-general could do in his or her absolute discretion. The first is they could accept an application, the second is they could decline one, the third is they could enter into some sort of private negotiation to try and get some agreement, and the fourth one is to reject all applications. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000447\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002262ff759d-9586-405a-a6e6-208ad65adeb5\u0022\u003EBut what\u2019s interesting is that if we go on further and have a look, the discretion of the director-general seems to be rather loose, because he or she may have regard to the interests, even including the financial interests, of the Crown in relation to the specified piece of land but also any other matters the director-general considers relevant. So, in essence, it is a catch-all, that et al: anything else that he or she may consider relevant. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000448\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002262ff759d-9586-405a-a6e6-208ad65adeb5\u0022\u003EWhen you look at the regulatory impact statement that accompanied the former Act, what it did actually note was that dead, standing, and fallen trees are an essential or favoured habitat and food source for many species, a normal part of nutrient cycling and forests, and beneficial to regeneration. In that sense, the timber component for which this bill is primarily related to does have a purpose. So it really does, I guess, come down to a balancing act, and the concern that the Government has is that there is simply too much uncertainty. It\u2019s too loose, and therefore we simply cannot support it. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000449\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002262ff759d-9586-405a-a6e6-208ad65adeb5\u0022\u003EThere is uncertainty in the provisions that I have just touched on. There is uncertainty in that there is a real risk to local in situ ecology, because there is a biodiversity value proposition at play there. Finally, there really is uncertainty in the long-term impacts of the removal of the timber. So when we look at all of those aspects, the common-sense approach is not to support the bill in its current form because of the huge level of uncertainty, and that\u2019s something that we are not prepared to support at this stage. So, obviously, we will be voting against it. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002258baa209-edaf-42a5-92d6-b2613c144bfb\u0022 data-id=\u0022481a140bdf62445b99425247d2d1a2ff\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000450\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002258baa209-edaf-42a5-92d6-b2613c144bfb\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022481a140bdf62445b99425247d2d1a2ff\u0022\u003ENICOLE McKEE (ACT):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Madam Speaker. I take this opportunity to rise on behalf of the ACT Party to speak on the adverse weather-affected timber recovery bill. Adverse weather events in New Zealand are quite common. We certainly do have a few of them occur here, and I commend Maureen Pugh on her foresight to look at how she can look after the area that she resides after we have some of these adverse weather events. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000451\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002258baa209-edaf-42a5-92d6-b2613c144bfb\u0022\u003EI mean, the West Coast is quite notorious for getting the brunt of extreme weather, let alone adverse weather. In March 2019, for example, we saw the remnants of Cyclone Trevor wreak havoc on the West Coast. There was the destruction of the Waiho River bridge and the closure of major roads and schools, and people were forced to evacuate. In December 2019, we saw a storm that left a thousand people stranded in Franz Josef. There were slips, there were closed highways, and there were food parcels that needed to be sent into that area, and that\u2019s just two events in the one year. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000452\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002258baa209-edaf-42a5-92d6-b2613c144bfb\u0022\u003EOn the pre-election campaign last year, the ACT Party went down to Hokitika, and after a weather event that occurred there, we actually had a delay in people turning up, with one guy telling us that he had to get the chainsaw out to remove the fallen trees that had come down upon his driveway. In fact, it\u2019s so bad that the National Institute of Water and Atmospheric Research (NIWA) has actually written a book specifically on the weather events of the West Coast, explaining that it is the wettest region in New Zealand. There\u2019s a table within NIWA\u2019s book which tells you about the wind gusts that the West Coast experiences, mostly in Greymouth, Westport, and Hokitika. Having the alps situated along the West Coast ridgeline means that a good proportion of the rivers in that area will flow towards the West Coast, and with extreme rainfall and a rising river, it can take with it vegetation as it moves quickly towards the sea, leaving those towns on the Coast with flooding issues. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000453\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002258baa209-edaf-42a5-92d6-b2613c144bfb\u0022\u003EBut the events themselves are not the issue in this bill. I\u2019m merely pointing out the large number of adverse weather events that occur on the West Coast. It\u2019s the clean up after the events, and my colleague from the Greens suggested it\u2019s logging. It\u2019s not logging; it\u2019s rotting, and what we want to do is utilise the by-product and not waste a thing. We want to be able to remove some of these trees so that we can promote new growth in the area. If the trees fall down on your own property, you can get someone to remove them. If they fall on conservation land, you can\u2019t. The West Coast region has the largest proportion of land and conservation estate. Contrast that with the 20 percent that\u2019s in the North Island, 40 percent of the South Island is legally protected, and 10.7 percent of New Zealand is covered in 3 million hectares of national parks. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000454\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002258baa209-edaf-42a5-92d6-b2613c144bfb\u0022\u003ESo what happens when we have an adverse weather or extreme event leaving fallen trees? As I said earlier, if it was on your own property, you would have them removed, but, legally, we cannot do that on Crown-managed land. We cannot remove the irreversibly damaged trees. This bill will allow the Department of Conservation to authorise the removal of damaged timber, and the people who want to remove it must be invited to apply to remove it. They can\u2019t just rock on up and take it out of the bush. They\u2019ve got to pay royalties, they\u2019ve got to pay fees, and they\u2019ve got to pay any charges that are required, as well. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000455\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002258baa209-edaf-42a5-92d6-b2613c144bfb\u0022\u003EImportantly, it also allows for the root system of the tree and the tops of the trees to stay there, which is helping the biodiversity that is occurring in our natural environment. We are only looking at needing to take away the main trunk of the tree, not disrupting the bugs and the insects that are dependent on that coverage. It will not have a major effect on our ecosystem. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000456\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002258baa209-edaf-42a5-92d6-b2613c144bfb\u0022\u003EThe ACT Party are in support of this bill, and while Labour sit across the room and say they don\u2019t support it, Tangi Utikere, the previous speaker across the way there, has just said across the way there that he thought that there would be some good aspects that could be brought up in select committee. I think this bill is worth looking at for what can be done in select committee, but it needs your support to get there. So while ACT support this bill, I hope Labour change their mind and do the same. Thank you, Madam Speaker. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002296f5f6b7-c116-477e-88a9-ea17aa616886\u0022 data-id=\u00229bfed2a983104829ba576833dd5f875f\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000457\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002296f5f6b7-c116-477e-88a9-ea17aa616886\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00229bfed2a983104829ba576833dd5f875f\u0022\u003EINGRID LEARY (Labour\u2014Taieri):\u003C/span\u003E I have some sympathy for what the member Maureen Pugh has tried to do with this bill. The intent of it is really about scaling up something that has been shown to work before, and it is trying to get some economic benefit for people where she lives. So while the intention is pure, I\u2019m afraid I can\u2019t support it, because the scale-up element of it simply doesn\u2019t work, and that\u2019s for three reasons: firstly, it\u2019s just simply not ecologically working in the same direction that we\u2019re going as a Government and that we know that we need to go with climate change; secondly, the economic arguments don\u2019t stack up; and, thirdly, it\u2019s simply not needed. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000458\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002296f5f6b7-c116-477e-88a9-ea17aa616886\u0022\u003ELook, if we go back to what the original Act was, which was alluded to by my colleague Tangi Utikere, the Act that was brought in, the West Coast Wind-blown Timber (Conservation Lands) Act of 2014, came at the tail end of Cyclone Ita, and that was on 17 April 2014. There was wind damage to over 40,000 hectares of indigenous forest. There was severe damage, and there were mature beech trees near Westport, and there was t\u014Dtara and mata\u012B in Whataroa. But, as has been pointed out, the Act that worked in that case was very limited. It was confined to the events of Cyclone Ita. It excluded World Heritage areas, national parks, and the white heron sanctuary, and it expired on 1 July 2019. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000459\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002296f5f6b7-c116-477e-88a9-ea17aa616886\u0022\u003EIt\u2019s true that Forest and Bird in Canterbury and the West Coast are opposing\u2014very strongly opposing\u2014the proposed scale-up of that bill because of what it would mean for the protection of conservation forests from logging, which has already been traversed by the Greens. We know that wind-blown trees are some of the most difficult to remove, they\u2019re hazardous, they\u2019re dangerous, and they provide ecological support for the forests that they fall in. That has all been covered. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000460\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002296f5f6b7-c116-477e-88a9-ea17aa616886\u0022\u003EBut perhaps looking at the economic case that has been put forward for this, the approved operators spoken to for the report done by the ministry of conservation didn\u2019t identify any particular new business opportunities that came from that West Coast scenario. They also pointed out that adverse weather events are unlikely to supply the consistency that would be needed to make the economic case for a scale-up like this. It could also create winners and losers as an effect in the timber industry, benefiting those that have an adverse weather event at a point in time. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000461\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002296f5f6b7-c116-477e-88a9-ea17aa616886\u0022\u003EAlso, there are risks that aren\u2019t present when considering only West Coast forests. There\u2019s likely to be pressure and demand for access to other woods in Whirinaki, Warawara, and Trounson Kauri Park, for example, with kauri a particular target. There are biosecurity risks that would be harder to manage or control for potential impact in areas such as these, especially where kauri dieback is concerned. There is also a risk that the bill would support the harvesting of swamp kauri. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000462\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002296f5f6b7-c116-477e-88a9-ea17aa616886\u0022\u003ESo, in summary, the Government could consider special legislation if a very significant weather event happened, such as what happened in 2014. We could do that in a way where timber recovery was economically and ecologically viable. There is no need for a large scale-up of a piece of legislation that responded to a very specific event. We\u2019ve traversed the arguments around the ecology, around the economy, and we don\u2019t need to take it to a select committee when, in fact, there is a much simpler mechanism which could respond to a severe weather event, which would be to introduce a very specific and focused piece of legislation to deal with that. For all these reasons\u2014while I have some sympathy for what the member is hoping to achieve, and I commend her for working for her constituents to do that\u2014unfortunately, the logic doesn\u2019t stack up, and I simply cannot support this bill. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002202e74c40-9529-4e15-adc2-c032eadc2205\u0022 data-id=\u002241f348f692484baeb63abdc76b41ba50\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000463\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002202e74c40-9529-4e15-adc2-c032eadc2205\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002241f348f692484baeb63abdc76b41ba50\u0022\u003EGREG O\u2019CONNOR (Labour\u2014\u014Ch\u0101riu):\u003C/span\u003E I\u2019d just like to start by congratulating the member Maureen Pugh for having this drawn out of the ballot. I know she\u2019s from a longstanding West Coast family and this is the type of thing, when one does grow up on the West Coast, as have I\u2014in fact, my family have been involved in, initially, gold, subsequently coalmining, and, ultimately, in timber recovery through the \u012Anangahua area and through much of the northern part of the Buller. So foresting is very much\u2014like the member\u2014part of my DNA. However, I also grew up as a lad on the West Coast doing a lot of hunting and some of the best hunting areas, of course, were the areas that had been well forested, where you had the access of timber trails going and often where a heck of a lot of forest had been knocked down to get to one very nice-looking rimu or even t\u014Dtara in there, and the damage that had been done\u2014as I say, it was great for us as young blokes heading up there with our old World War II three-os looking to get access to some very nice venison. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000464\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002202e74c40-9529-4e15-adc2-c032eadc2205\u0022\u003EBut, looking back on it, that very same access\u2014and I think of up around the \u014Cparara area. When you get to Karamea and someone tells you there\u2019s a very good place to go and see about an hour\u2019s drive from Karamea, you think, \u201CWhere can you drive for an hour from Karamea?\u201D, but if you ever get a chance to, go in and see the \u014Cparara arches, a wonderful area. If you were to have a look in there and see what happens as a result of the afforestation in there, probably you\u2019d say it\u2019s a good thing, because you wouldn\u2019t get an access there had it not been for those good timber trails in there. That really comes to the point that getting the timber out is not that easy a job, and in doing so, from my experience of what I\u2019ve seen over the years, there\u2019s considerable damage caused. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000465\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002202e74c40-9529-4e15-adc2-c032eadc2205\u0022\u003EThis is where I can see where this bill will actually fall down, to a large degree. I know it is not West Coast - specific, and I can see that the bill, looking through it, clearly is designed for weather events throughout New Zealand. Not knowing other parts of New Zealand quite as intimately, although I do have to say I currently live out in the \u014Ch\u0101riu Valley area of my electorate\u2014a beautiful area. Most of you get to fly over it as you come into Wellington, into a southerly. One thing, if you look out the plane window, you\u2019ll see is there are not too many trees out there. Mr Luxon, I see you\u2019re smiling there. You will have done that route many times. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000466\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002202e74c40-9529-4e15-adc2-c032eadc2205\u0022\u003EFrom having grown up on the West Coast, like the member over there, I\u2019ve grown to understand that we do need trees and I know what trees add to our ambience, add to our lives, and I certainly would like to see a lot more trees around. So, particularly in an area where we do end up with so little land left to actually\u2014there\u2019s so much of it we can drive, basically, from Wellington to Auckland, virtually going through several of the many farms owned by the member opposite, and you\u2019ll see there\u2019s not too many trees left on too many of them.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000467\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002202e74c40-9529-4e15-adc2-c032eadc2205\u0022\u003ESo as a society and in the time we\u2019ve come to, we\u2019ve just really got to come to the stage where we do understand that trees, re-afforestation, is a very, very important part of a legacy which we do want to leave to the next generations. So, again, I\u2019m not standing here, I don\u2019t carry\u2014I\u2019m Catholic. I can be guilty about many things, but I don\u2019t need to be guilty about my ancestors in the forest and what they did. They did what they do on the West Coast, that extractive industry that\u2019s been part of the West Coast for many, many generations. But time does march on and, really, what I would say is that in a time\u2014and I think some of the previous speakers have talked about it. We are in a sort of an era of probably re-afforestation whether it be re-afforestation\u2014just last night, I was listening to a briefing from foresters who are looking at getting that balance right between exotic trees and native trees. So I think we\u2019re sort of in an era where re-afforestation is probably the best legacy we\u2019ll leave for those that do come after us. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000468\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002202e74c40-9529-4e15-adc2-c032eadc2205\u0022\u003ESo when I look at this bill, it probably does sort of go against some of that whole, I suppose, philosophy we have now in our life when our generation will be looked at as a time we sort of reversed that trend of extractive industry and of making sure that we use trees that are going to be an important part of getting our world back in order for our grandkids. Thank you, Madam Speaker. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022a6c42c44-3622-4c9c-98b8-793fb5ec15cc\u0022 data-id=\u0022afaaa0097796423aab9a9f6b3a2e8a5d\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000469\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a6c42c44-3622-4c9c-98b8-793fb5ec15cc\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022afaaa0097796423aab9a9f6b3a2e8a5d\u0022\u003EIAN McKELVIE (National\u2014Rangit\u012Bkei):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Madam Speaker. Listening to O\u2019Connor speak is a bit like watching him bowl\u2014you never know what\u2019s coming next. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000470\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a6c42c44-3622-4c9c-98b8-793fb5ec15cc\u0022\u003EBefore I start, I just want to mention the Hon Kiri Allan. She\u2019s one of the toughest people I\u2019ve ever come across in my life, and if anyone can get through the challenges she\u2019s got in front of her, I think Kiri will certainly do that, and I\u2019d just like to wish her all the best because she is a special person. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000471\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a6c42c44-3622-4c9c-98b8-793fb5ec15cc\u0022\u003EThis bill is also the product of a special person, from the West Coast, interestingly: Maureen Pugh. I think it\u2019s a great credit that she\u2019s brought this bill to the House as the previous legislation, which Maureen Pugh agitated for at length and was put through by Nick Smith, has expired. Interestingly, despite what we\u2019ve heard in the House tonight, in the course of that legislation and actions as a result of that legislation, there was no damage done to the conservation land at all. I think some 30,000 or 40,000 cubic metres of damaged native timber was brought out of those forests with absolutely no damage and no costs, I guess, to the conservation estate. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000472\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a6c42c44-3622-4c9c-98b8-793fb5ec15cc\u0022\u003EI just want to make the point that when you stand in this House, all you can see in here is exactly the sort of timber we\u2019re talking about, and timber that if we\u2019re not careful will be lost to future generations for them to use other than to recycle. I was privileged enough to live in a house with not one single treated board in it, and nowadays, of course, we use pine trees which entirely have to be treated, and I\u2019m not criticising that. That\u2019s the type of forestry sector we\u2019ve got now. So I want to congratulate Maureen Pugh on bringing this bill to the House. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000473\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a6c42c44-3622-4c9c-98b8-793fb5ec15cc\u0022\u003EI want to comment quickly on a couple of comments, one from Eugenie Sage who thinks it\u2019s\u2014in her unfortunate terminology\u2014opportunistic and plundering of the conservation estate. Well, of course, it\u2019s not. What happens with this bill is that the conservator has got the sole right to decide whether or not this gets used at all. In fact, it can\u2019t be implemented if not for the Director-General of Conservation. I think that\u2019s an eminently sound start. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000474\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a6c42c44-3622-4c9c-98b8-793fb5ec15cc\u0022\u003EThe other thing that my friend Tangi Utikere from across the boundary\u2014in fact, I\u2019m surrounded in Palmerston North\u2014talked about was the fact that the bill doesn\u2019t really stack up at the moment. Well, that\u2019s why we have a select committee process, and, of course, this Government has tended to forget the need for a select committee process in most of the legislation they\u2019ve put through in the last four months. So perhaps they don\u2019t realise what a select committee actually does. [Interruption] It fixes things, doesn\u2019t it, McAnulty? It fixes things. So I think that to have sent this bill to a select committee, irrespective of what it came out looking like, would\u2019ve been a great advance for the Parliament and certainly would be worthwhile. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000475\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a6c42c44-3622-4c9c-98b8-793fb5ec15cc\u0022\u003EMy interest in the bill, aside from the fact that I think it\u2019s a very good bill, is really the result of my role as the Opposition spokesperson for forestry, and subsequently that stretches into the manufacturing sector and all things associated with use of wood in New Zealand. To have the opportunity to bring our wind-damaged or storm-damaged timber for specific use in New Zealand, I think, would\u2019ve been well worthwhile. It would\u2019ve added value to that sector, and despite what Ingrid Leary said a minute ago, it won\u2019t pick winners and losers. It will give opportunity wherever the opportunity occurs, if in fact it does occur, for that timber, or that wood, to be used and used specifically for special projects in New Zealand. I think it would be quite an exciting opportunity for the sector to be able to do that. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000476\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a6c42c44-3622-4c9c-98b8-793fb5ec15cc\u0022\u003EI do have some sympathy for a lot of the views, and in the north of Rangit\u012Bkei, you walk through what once must have been beautiful native bush which no longer is because the best bits are all picked off and the rest was left behind. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000477\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a1f7bbd1-b6ae-41c0-963b-dbe1251f5540\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002291083bdecb9749ae928bdd8b885f8f99\u0022\u003EKieran McAnulty\u003C/span\u003E: That\u2019s the member\u2019s farm! \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000478\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a6c42c44-3622-4c9c-98b8-793fb5ec15cc\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002202e764bceba345e29c2a3c1f1940734e\u0022\u003EIAN McKELVIE\u003C/span\u003E: No farmer would ever treat anything like that. So I think there is reason for us to protect our native bush that\u2019s left, and protect it as best we can. Certainly, this bill would have added to the protection of it because it would give people the opportunity, provided the director-general agreed with it, to go in and pick the wind-damaged trees out and leave a very clear and much better environment for new plants to regenerate. So I think there is good reason for this bill to have be pushed through, but it wasn\u2019t. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000479\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a6c42c44-3622-4c9c-98b8-793fb5ec15cc\u0022\u003EOne other point I wanted to make about this is that having altered nature over the last 180 years or 300 years or whatever in New Zealand, we\u2019re never going to rectify it without human intervention. One of the very quick examples I\u2019ll give you of that is where we\u2019ve got native wilding pines creeping into all of our North Island national parks\u2014Whanganui National Park is a great example of that\u2014and that\u2019s going to have to be removed. It\u2019s going to be a very interesting debate in this House when we have to go in there and get them out, because the same thing\u2019s going to happen as when we go in and get wind-damaged stuff out. That\u2019s my lot. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002295945ace-51e8-4dbc-a0e3-c19f4ed99ed9\u0022 data-id=\u00224f34c7f876c945bb929c089ce63f6958\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000480\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002295945ace-51e8-4dbc-a0e3-c19f4ed99ed9\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00224f34c7f876c945bb929c089ce63f6958\u0022\u003EANAHILA KANONGATA\u2019A-SUISUIKI (Labour):\u003C/span\u003E Kia ora e te Mana Whakaw\u0101. It\u2019s an honour and a privilege to speak on anything to do with conservation here in Aotearoa. I want to acknowledge the member Maureen Pugh and congratulate her on the amount of work that she\u2019s done to get her bill to this stage. But before I talk about the reasons why I join my colleagues and our party in opposing this bill, I want to acknowledge the Minister of Conservation. I want to acknowledge the sister the Hon Kiritapu Allan: kia kaha, wahine toa, and much arohanui from us here\u2014all of us here in the Whare. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000481\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002295945ace-51e8-4dbc-a0e3-c19f4ed99ed9\u0022\u003EI\u2019ve gone through the pages of this bill, and we\u2019re in the 21st century, and there\u2019s nowhere\u2014I don\u2019t know; maybe I\u2019ve missed it\u2014that refers to being a Treaty partner. There\u2019s nowhere that refers to consulting or working with tangata whenua. We recently had the annual review of the Department of Conservation. They came through, and the thing that I liked about their presentation was about the principles\u2014the principles of conservation, which was about elevating principles of the Treaty and fulfilling Treaty partnership. I looked at the bill; I couldn\u2019t find that anywhere. It\u2019s about holding wellbeing and safety within conservation\u2014I couldn\u2019t find that here, either. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000482\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002295945ace-51e8-4dbc-a0e3-c19f4ed99ed9\u0022\u003EWhat I found was a bill that just looked at the tree; it didn\u2019t look at the whole forest. It looked at the trees\u2014didn\u2019t look at the whole forest. So I\u2019m really concerned\u2014I\u2019m really concerned. I think that this bill is about the slippery slope. I am concerned about the forest\u2014the kauri. I am concerned about the kauri. It\u2019s a slippery slope into swamp harvesting\u2014kauri swamp harvesting. This is opening the door to that. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000483\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002295945ace-51e8-4dbc-a0e3-c19f4ed99ed9\u0022\u003ESo I\u2019m really concerned about that, and before the Department of Conservation\u2014let\u2019s just say, adverse weather effect, a tree falls on somewhere where humans walk. Part of the conservation is to get rid of that risk, not to go into the forest. So I would say, adverse\u2014what is it? Adverse weather - affected timber recovery\u2014timber recovery. It\u2019s just looking at the timber; it\u2019s not looking at Papat\u016B\u0101nuku and the forest and what we are conserving. It\u2019s time that we stop being siloed\u2014that we stop just looking at the West Coast. I hear that the Hon Eugenie Sage in her contribution spoke about that bill that was passed in\u2014I\u2019ve forgotten what year it was. That Act was passed through urgency of the House. It didn\u2019t go to a select committee, didn\u2019t have a tangata whenua contribution to it\u2014it didn\u2019t, didn\u2019t\u2014and here we are. We are here today, in 2021, and we know that in this House, diversity makes it better. It adds value, yet this bill, it is siloed. It is only looking at what\u2019s happening in their backyard. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000484\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002295945ace-51e8-4dbc-a0e3-c19f4ed99ed9\u0022\u003EThe reason I am concerned is because we are not just talking about the West Coast. This bill is not just talking about the West Coast. We are talking about all of New Zealand. Our borders are going to open up to Australia. What are they going to come to look at? I bet that some of them will come to look at the forests, who have been conserved by the Department of Conservation. They will be looking at that\u2014they\u2019re coming to that. So, financially, that\u2019s coming through the border. It is coming through the border because conservation does good work. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000485\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002295945ace-51e8-4dbc-a0e3-c19f4ed99ed9\u0022\u003EThe principle of the Department of Conservation, it\u2019s about a healthy nature. We\u2019ve heard everyone talk about it: healthy nature. Trees would fall and rot, a lot of diversity in the ecology system would feed from that, and that is because we have learnt from years and years of siloed looking at the forest that we are destroying the forest. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000486\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002295945ace-51e8-4dbc-a0e3-c19f4ed99ed9\u0022\u003EI stand in unison with our deputy chair of our Environment Committee, Rachel Brooking, and the awesome contribution by Tangi Utikere today\u2014oh, Greg O\u2019Connor, too. I stand in unison with them and I oppose this bill. I oppose the Adverse Weather-affected Timber Recovery on Conservation Lands Bill. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000487\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002295945ace-51e8-4dbc-a0e3-c19f4ed99ed9\u0022\u003EOn that note, I oppose this bill to the House. M\u0101l\u014D. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022d14b1afe-2069-41e4-96fa-c8dc81a991a4\u0022 data-id=\u00225748f2714d654904804eda40f3f36919\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000488\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022d14b1afe-2069-41e4-96fa-c8dc81a991a4\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00225748f2714d654904804eda40f3f36919\u0022\u003EASSISTANT SPEAKER (Hon Jenny Salesa)\u003C/span\u003E: This debate is interrupted. The House is suspended until 7 p.m. this evening. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000489\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022d14b1afe-2069-41e4-96fa-c8dc81a991a4\u0022\u003ESitting suspended from 6 p.m. to 7.00 p.m.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000490\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00224a25943b-cb3b-49c3-bd10-74316fae17f1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002266b33ffd6e874cbcae197651f0c3c1c8\u0022\u003EASSISTANT SPEAKER (Hon Jacqui Dean)\u003C/span\u003E: The House is resumed. When the House rose for the dinner break, we were considering the Adverse Weather-affected Timber Recovery on Conservation Lands Bill.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022e60c1237-5e2d-4d0a-9678-ab10db67d1b7\u0022 data-id=\u0022e61988fe11b74cd4a333ba56dac59153\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000491\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e60c1237-5e2d-4d0a-9678-ab10db67d1b7\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022e61988fe11b74cd4a333ba56dac59153\u0022\u003EANGIE WARREN-CLARK (Labour):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Madam Speaker. Look, it is a real pleasure to rise and speak on this\u2014long name\u2014Adverse Weather-affected Timber Recovery on Conservation Lands Bill. I want to acknowledge and congratulate my colleague across the floor\u2014Maureen Pugh\u2014for bringing this bill through the House. I think I\u2019d really like to acknowledge you for the thought and the effort in bringing this bill. However, I think you\u2019ve probably come now to realise that Labour does not support this bill to select committee.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000492\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e60c1237-5e2d-4d0a-9678-ab10db67d1b7\u0022\u003EI do want to acknowledge the advocacy for your community that you have put in place. I guess, for me, that is perhaps one of the faults with the bill, in that you talked about conservation land in the context of the entire country. What I really feel you were focusing on here\u2014perhaps, if I may suggest\u2014is the community of the West Coast of the South Island. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000493\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e60c1237-5e2d-4d0a-9678-ab10db67d1b7\u0022\u003ENow, Maureen Pugh, the member Greg O\u2019Connor has spoken of his community connection and I too will speak of my community connection to the West Coast of the South Island. So my family comes from the West Coast of the South Island, both sides of the family. So we were miners, we were publicans\u2014you\u2019ll like that, Kieran McAnulty: we were publicans\u2014and we were millers, so we owned mills. So forestry and the milling of the beautiful beach forests, etc., is something that has a long history in my family. I think the member Greg O\u2019Connor also said this: that we don\u2019t need to be ashamed of where we\u2019ve come from, even if we ourselves would not make those choices going forward now.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000494\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e60c1237-5e2d-4d0a-9678-ab10db67d1b7\u0022\u003ESo the bill itself is specifically for the entire conservation estate in this country. I\u2019ve heard lots of arguments\u2014and I particularly want to acknowledge the member the Hon Eugenie Sage for her statements\u2014but I want to talk a little bit about the fact that New Zealand had a really long period of geological isolation. So 80 percent of New Zealand plant species are endemic or only found in New Zealand.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000495\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e60c1237-5e2d-4d0a-9678-ab10db67d1b7\u0022\u003EI also want to talk about the ecology of the forest and what happens when a tree falls in the forest, and if no one\u2019s there to\u2014no, I\u2019m not going to say that joke\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000496\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c83012b4-3939-4753-80fc-1956a3e2bd1e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002297b9323a19cd48a2bf3a1d760829df44\u0022\u003EHon Michael Woodhouse\u003C/span\u003E: Go on, just say it!\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000497\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e60c1237-5e2d-4d0a-9678-ab10db67d1b7\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022697b972c519b4cc8b89f2593c0b2eec0\u0022\u003EANGIE WARREN-CLARK\u003C/span\u003E: Ha, ha! I\u2019m not going to say that joke. So, essentially, we have heard arguments that talk about trees as being an economic unit, something to be taken from and taken across and made into an economic unit and supporting industry. However, what hasn\u2019t been talked about is the flora and fauna that a fallen tree creates and the cycle of life that the trees, when they fall\u2014even in a large adverse weather event\u2014create for the regrowth of the environment. If we take away those systems and those structures, what happens is that we lose the biodiversity, we lose the fungi, the animals, the plants that grow on that rotten log. So the ecology of the environment is so very important. So by taking these logs out of these areas, we cause a change to the environment and the ecology that we are not sure is a positive thing\u2014in fact, science is telling us that it is less and less positive.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000498\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e60c1237-5e2d-4d0a-9678-ab10db67d1b7\u0022\u003EThere is also the opportunity, should we have a massive adverse weather event\u2014winds, etc.\u2014that we can actually do a small, time-limited, area-specific bill which will enable and support the clearing of some of this land. It really does support a better ecology and a moving forward. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000499\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e60c1237-5e2d-4d0a-9678-ab10db67d1b7\u0022\u003EThe Labour Party is trying to fight climate change and the adverse weather events; we\u2019re not trying to make money out of those events. So, as a consequence, we won\u2019t be supporting this bill. But I do want to acknowledge the member for bringing it up to the House. Thank you.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00224d83c8a5-2f48-4991-9c45-b1a6060daedd\u0022 data-id=\u0022f84848c8ce9a4a26a10421810ea8ef99\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000500\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00224d83c8a5-2f48-4991-9c45-b1a6060daedd\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022f84848c8ce9a4a26a10421810ea8ef99\u0022\u003EMAUREEN PUGH (National):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Madam Speaker. I stand to take the final call on the first reading of the Adverse Weather-affected Timber Recovery on Conservation Lands Bill. Unfortunately, it looks like it will be the last reading\u2014full stop. And I\u2019ll talk a little bit about what has been said in some of the other speeches. One of the main issues is around the terminology of \u201Clogging\u201D. This is a huge mischaracterisation of what actually goes on in one of these weather events\u2014and I will come back to that a little bit later, with some stats around that.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000501\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00224d83c8a5-2f48-4991-9c45-b1a6060daedd\u0022\u003EThis bill was never proposing anything that hasn\u2019t already happened, that hasn\u2019t already been tested in both the administration and the practical application, the operations that happen on the ground and within the Department of Conservation (DOC). This bill is simply a continuation of the legislation that was passed back in 2014, and that\u2019s been mentioned a lot in this House. But what\u2019s also been mentioned is that this is a scale-up. This is not a scale-up. The reality is that this legislation parks the authorisation with the Director-General of Conservation for when, or if, there is another event. Many members on the other side\u2014it must have been in their speech notes\u2014have all said, \u201CWe can pass special legislation for specific events.\u201D This is exactly what this bill sets out to achieve. It creates the template so that the Director-General of Conservation can, at any time, if there is a scaled event, re-enact this authorisation that he will have to maybe go into the forest and take some of that timber out. It puts a huge amount of methodology into the system that we\u2019ve already got, because, as I\u2019ve said, it\u2019s been tested over the Cyclone Ita experience that we had.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000502\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00224d83c8a5-2f48-4991-9c45-b1a6060daedd\u0022\u003EThe members on the other side are also very confused about the types of land that we are talking about. This bill does not go near any of the nature reserves. It doesn\u2019t go near the scientific reserves, ecological areas, or national parks. So we are not talking about pristine environments. Mainly what we talk about with this bill is stewardship land or land that has very low conservation values. So it\u2019s important to note that during the implementation of the 2014 event, there were no lost time injuries or events for the workers on the ground or the public that was involved in the forest. It was an extremely dangerous situation, and I give full credit to DOC and the Ministry for Primary Industries (MPI) for working together to manage the health and safety aspects of it. But we also saw ecologists and resource managers from Landcare Research, Lincoln University, MPI, and DOC all work closely together to ensure that the timber was removed safely and that there was minimal impact on the environment.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000503\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00224d83c8a5-2f48-4991-9c45-b1a6060daedd\u0022\u003ENow, I just want to explain, too, about the scale of the operations. So, for instance, if there were several hectares of windthrow timber, only half of that was able to be used\u2014so, if you had one hectare here, one hectare here had to be preserved. Inside that one hectare, you could salvage only a minimal amount\u201450 percent of the trees that came down in this one hectare. So we\u2019re talking about 50 percent of 50 percent. Then you could take only 10 percent of the biomass of each tree. So there was a minimal amount of extraction that went on in the forest.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000504\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00224d83c8a5-2f48-4991-9c45-b1a6060daedd\u0022\u003EI wanted to go back to talking about some of the comments that were made, about the mischaracterisation of what this bill sets out to achieve. It is not plundering. The trees that were flattened in Cyclone Ita covered an area the size of all of Samoa, and out of that we got a minimal amount of material. We got 8,000 cubic metres of timber that came out of there. There were millions of cubic metres of fallen trees that have remained in the forest. This bill talks about giving authority to the Director-General of Conservation. The problem on that side of the House is that none of them can see the wood for the trees. This was a practical solution.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca id=\u00226653bf61b8b84d57b446ee2ee839e1cf\u0022 name=\u0022division\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EA party vote was called for on the question, That the Adverse Weather-affected Timber Recovery on Conservation Lands Bill be now read a first time.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EAyes 43\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand National 33; ACT New Zealand 10.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENoes 77\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand Labour 65; Green Party of Aotearoa New Zealand 10; Te Paati M\u0101ori 2.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EMotion not agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n    \u003C/div\u003E\n    \u003Cdiv class=\u0022HpsHansard\u0022\u003E\n      \u003Cp\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsProceedingHeading\u0022\u003EBills\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000505\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u00227a09840199cc45cbae8112242201e4eb\u0022\u003EAccident Compensation (Notice of Decisions) Amendment Bill\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000506\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u0022d7359371468243f287a9d2f6a981aebb\u0022\u003EFirst Reading\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022f96cdca1-b63c-4602-b2b3-276f58ebb518\u0022 data-id=\u00220600cf6db0af466f96fc9de8dc763c69\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000507\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f96cdca1-b63c-4602-b2b3-276f58ebb518\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00220600cf6db0af466f96fc9de8dc763c69\u0022\u003ECHRIS PENK (National\u2014Kaipara ki Mahurangi) \u003C/span\u003Eon behalf of Simon Watts: I move, That the Accident Compensation (Notice of Decisions) Amendment Bill be now read a first time. I nominate the, a select committee to, oh the Regulations Review Committee to hear the bill. [Assistant Speaker shakes her head] I\u2019m getting a shake of the head\u2014the Economic Development, Science and Innovation Committee to receive the bill. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000508\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a1f7bbd1-b6ae-41c0-963b-dbe1251f5540\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00226a50c7884125415cab8969274bafedb0\u0022\u003EKieran McAnulty\u003C/span\u003E: Any of the above.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000509\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f96cdca1-b63c-4602-b2b3-276f58ebb518\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002238b235a57a1b400e998c5d2c17bf2438\u0022\u003ECHRIS PENK\u003C/span\u003E: Or any of the above. Thank you very much, Madam Speaker. I stand to take a call, the first call, indeed, on a piece of legislation that owes nothing to my own labours. This is a piece of legislation that was introduced into the ballot by my former colleague Paulo Garcia, whom I would love to see again in this Chamber in due course, and has more recently being transferred into the name of Simon Watts, who I\u2019m very pleased has recently joined us in this Chamber.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000510\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f96cdca1-b63c-4602-b2b3-276f58ebb518\u0022\u003EThe bill rectifies an anomaly in the accident compensation regime. It is not a large anomaly in the overall scheme of a framework that is a very helpful and useful part of our public life and indeed private life. A piece of legislation\u2014the establishment of the scheme that\u2019s played an important part in the lives of many New Zealanders, mostly for better, occasionally for worse. There are many issues that we can discuss in relation to ACC, and changes that perhaps might be usefully made to the regime, but the changes within the scope of this bill are relatively modest, but important nonetheless.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000511\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f96cdca1-b63c-4602-b2b3-276f58ebb518\u0022\u003EThe ACC scheme is, of course\u2014well, purports to be comprehensive. I would argue that in fact, it\u2019s not, but let\u2019s, for argument\u2019s sake, say that it\u2019s designed to be a comprehensive, no-fault personal injury scheme. As such, I think that most people in this country would regard it as a useful mechanism for providing coverage for injuries that might take place to New Zealanders, roughly speaking, through no fault of anyone. Although, again, that\u2019s a contestable claim, for the sake of shorthand please allow it for the purpose of this bill. It does provide a large amount of power to the State. That\u2019s no bad thing in itself, so long as that power is exercised reasonably and in a manner that is justifiable, including by way of the ability for those who are affected by such decisions to have them reviewed. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000512\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f96cdca1-b63c-4602-b2b3-276f58ebb518\u0022\u003EWhen large powers are involved in relation to an individual\u2014of course, the person who is injured or the person which might be a natural person or a legal person running the workplace in which a person is injured\u2014it\u2019s important that the principles of natural justice are observed. I would start by saying at a high level, if I may, that where a person is affected in terms of their rights and also their responsibilities, it is important that they are able to have a say in the exercise of that power and the way that they are affected by that. This is, roughly speaking, known as the right to be heard. Of course, decisions should be knowable in the first place, and also reviewable, at least to some extent. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000513\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f96cdca1-b63c-4602-b2b3-276f58ebb518\u0022\u003EI think it\u2019s worth noting that one of the generally accepted advantages of the ACC scheme is that we bypass much that would otherwise be required by recourse to the courts. Avoiding expensive litigation is generally a good thing, provided that there is not a gap in the ability of an individual or other person to obtain justice. I would be remiss if I were not to mention a number of constituent cases that have come to me in my capacity as a local member of Parliament\u2014and no doubt every other member of Parliament, whether electorate or list, who in this Chamber now or in the past has received contact from constituents, pointing out difficulties that they\u2019ve had with the scheme.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000514\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f96cdca1-b63c-4602-b2b3-276f58ebb518\u0022\u003EI think we should consider ways that treatment injury victims, in particular, can be catered for much better, the way that disincentives do need to be provided where workplaces might otherwise act in a cavalier manner, such that a person be injured. Also we should seriously consider ways that the system can be made much fairer in covering injury that\u2019s caused in a way that\u2019s difficult to prove, as relating to a particular situation, perhaps a repetitive strain as opposed to an accident or injury. But as I say, that\u2019s because that\u2019s outside the scope of the bill. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000515\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f96cdca1-b63c-4602-b2b3-276f58ebb518\u0022\u003ESo I just want to acknowledge some of those themes do receive at least some recognition in the form of this bill. Partly that\u2019s because of the fact that, at its heart, it\u2019s understanding and acknowledging that a workplace is a place, sadly, that injuries can and do occur. Of course, it\u2019s the moral and legal obligation of every employer or workplace to minimise that possibility and, of course, to do everything within the power of such a workplace to play a positive part in the rehabilitation where such injuries do occur. But it does behove the State to provide a mechanism and the ability\u2014indeed the right\u2014for a workplace to understand what is happening when a claim is made by a person about an aggravation or a re-injury of a work-related injury that might have happened previously.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000516\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f96cdca1-b63c-4602-b2b3-276f58ebb518\u0022\u003ESo just briefly, the operative provisions of the bill simply say, at clause 4, that employers must be notified of decisions to accept a claim as an aggravation or a re-injury of a work-related injury. Clause 5 includes employers as among the class of persons able to apply for a review of a decision to accept a claim, again, over an aggravation or injury of a work-related injury. Clause 6 states\u2014and it should be an obvious and logical matter that flows from the other provisions\u2014that employers should be able to be present and be heard at a review hearing, again, when an aggravation or re-injury of a work-related injury takes place. And, similarly, at clause 7, that they would have the ability to appeal such review decisions.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000517\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f96cdca1-b63c-4602-b2b3-276f58ebb518\u0022\u003EIt seems right that if we are to take away the ability of individuals and also workplaces to go to court to seek remedy and to surrender their rights they would otherwise have, to have their matter discussed and their position known, and to be heard, it is only right that we allow at least some sort of reasonable participation in that process. And that\u2019s at the heart of what the bill intends to do. It\u2019s not a matter of establishing a \u201Cthem\u201D and \u201Cus\u201D dichotomy as between a worker and a workplace. If anything, it should be a matter of understanding that a responsible workplace and a willing worker who abides by the reasonable rules of that workplace to keep himself or herself safe can all be involved in a way that this bill actually encourages, not discourages. And so I hope that it receives support across the House. I say that on behalf of the member whose name the bill is now, namely Simon Watts, who I acknowledge and who, unfortunately, is not able to open the remarks. I don\u2019t wish to refer you to any possible absence from the Chamber. Nevertheless, that\u2019s where we find ourselves, and a previous member of Parliament for the National Party Paulo Garcia and whose name the bill was placed into the ballot and indeed withdrawn from that. I commend the bill to the House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022f677db8b-66c5-4794-953c-bdf7aa425710\u0022 data-id=\u0022cdd9bdf7cbf045948af178e292c65995\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000518\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f677db8b-66c5-4794-953c-bdf7aa425710\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022cdd9bdf7cbf045948af178e292c65995\u0022\u003EMARJA LUBECK (Labour):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Madam Speaker, an absolute delight to be able to take a perhaps quite lengthy call on this bill, since it contains a lot of technical detail that Mr Penk just ran us through, so I would like to respond to that with quite a bit of detail myself. This is, in fact, my second call today which is truly strange, because I haven\u2019t had much opportunity to take calls this term. As you can see, in this Chamber, there is a variety of new talent on board which\u2014rightfully\u2014have taken most of the slots and pushed us more experienced hands, perhaps, to the second tier. But I have enjoyed everything I\u2019ve had to say, and I\u2019ve learnt a lot from this new intake with their many talents and their many skills, so thank you for sharing all of your knowledge every day for me to enjoy. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000519\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f677db8b-66c5-4794-953c-bdf7aa425710\u0022\u003EAnyway, I digress. I rise on behalf of the Labour Party in opposition to the Accident Compensation (Notice of Decisions) Amendment Bill, so my apologies to Chris Penk for having to squash his hopes that he would find support at this side of the Chamber\u2014he does look devastated. So perhaps pass that on to the sponsor of the bill, with a note that I don\u2019t believe that this is a bill that comes from a bad place, knowing the person who just spoke on this bill, who I have the pleasure, actually, to encounter quite a bit in the Kaipara ki Mahurangi electorate where we both have established quite a collaborative relationship, although that may not be known to your colleagues. You may want to keep that quiet because maybe collaboration is not really the right thing to do! But hey, I do enjoy the way that we both go around the electorate. But back to the bill.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000520\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f677db8b-66c5-4794-953c-bdf7aa425710\u0022\u003EWith regards to this bill, it is not clear on what it tries to achieve, and that\u2019s the first point, first of all. What it claims is that employers should have a review right for what is called an \u201Caggravation or re-injury\u201D of a work-related injury. But this particular term doesn\u2019t actually feature in either the member\u2019s bill nor in the actual Accident Compensation Act, and that is a real problem, because\u2014just to rephrase that\u2014the policy intent is unclear. As an example, there is no definition for \u201Caggravation or re-injury\u201D of a work-related injury in this bill or in the primary Act. That\u2019s the first point. Then we get to the second point: because the policy intent is unclear, the member\u2019s bill will create confusion and conflict with the Act, and it may in fact\u2014when you talk about unintended consequences\u2014make some unwanted changes. And here\u2019s where it gets a little bit detailed, perhaps. I know the previous speaker made it sound quite simple, running us through clauses 1 to 7, but the devil is in the detail, and therefore I will provide that detail.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000521\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f677db8b-66c5-4794-953c-bdf7aa425710\u0022\u003EWhat the confusion is about is that, as a first point, it will give the employer a review right that they already have. So if there is a new injury and not a re-injury, then that review right is already there. If there is a re-injury, it will, effectively, create a new review right over decisions on entitlements like treatment, and that is very important because it is something that is explicitly barred by the Accident Compensation Act. It will create confusion as to which is the correct empowering provision for employers to be able to challenge work-related cover decisions. It will create potential privacy issues for claimants, and this may actually be one of the more significant issues with this bill, other than creating confusion and conflicting with the original Act, because, of course, privacy issues when it comes to health are hugely important. Decisions on entitlements are made considering a claimant\u2019s need for rehabilitation and compensation based on evidence and expert assessment. What this bill would do is it would basically have any current or former employer entitled to ongoing clinical and health information, and that is a real concern. Employers would need to see a claimant\u2019s clinical information, information about their health, to challenge an entitlement decision, and that causes significant privacy issues.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000522\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f677db8b-66c5-4794-953c-bdf7aa425710\u0022\u003ECome to my No. 5, it will also drastically increase the number of reviewable decisions, and knowing the system as it is now\u2014already quite over-burdened\u2014that is not a good thing, because it will compromise the effectiveness of the system. We also need to look at existing settings that are already balancing claimant and employer interest for work-related claims in a fair, proportionate way. There really is no compelling argument to extend the rights for employers to have an extension of the right to review, because there is already a balance there. The no-faults nature of the scheme protects employers from the risk of litigation, and they don\u2019t need to meet claims costs incurred by the scheme, so this is about the balance there. Experience rating or no-claim discount programmes result in levy-lowering or discount for the employer rather than a liability for claims cost, and this limits the impact that any employer would encounter from any such claim. The experience rating or no-claims discount programmes are also only affected by work-related injury that occurred over a three-year period prior to that levy invoice. That means that costs that occur four or more years after your original injury will actually not affect the employers\u2019 individual levy. I know there was a point made about employers\u2019 levies, but the fact needs to be made that that won\u2019t actually affect those levies.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000523\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f677db8b-66c5-4794-953c-bdf7aa425710\u0022\u003ESo then just to recap in my last three minutes, this bill would\u2014as we\u2019ve heard\u2014seek to rebalance the interests of employers and claimants for work-related claims. That would suggest that somehow the balance is off kilter but, from what I\u2019ve seen and the points that I\u2019ve just run everyone through, that argument doesn\u2019t actually hold up under pressure. If you look at the details of where the balancing is already taking place, then that is not an argument for new legislation. The existing settings already balance claimant and employer interests for work-related claims, and the current settings ensure that employer interests are reflected in a fair way. The very nature of this scheme actually already protects employers from the risk of litigation because it is operating on a no-fault basis, and the employer doesn\u2019t need to meet claim costs incurred by the scheme. There is a lot about this bill that really just isn\u2019t clear. I think I\u2019ve outlined several points that perhaps the next speaker may want to touch on in detail to turn that argument around, but it should be noted that for a bill that refers to circumstances where an employee has an aggravation or a re-injury of a work-related personal injury, there is not a definition to specify that, either in this particular member\u2019s bill or in the primary Act, the Accident Compensation Act.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000524\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f677db8b-66c5-4794-953c-bdf7aa425710\u0022\u003ESo, then, with my time running out, I will just basically reiterate the significant issues with the bill, which are the lack of clarity\u2014which I have provided five bullet points on\u2014the privacy concerns, the impact on operational issues, and, ultimately, there being no compelling basis to extend employer review rights, because the balance is already there. Now, also, to make the point that this actually an area already subject to an incredible amount of litigation, and I\u2019m sure with the amount of lawyers here in the House, there may be some support for that. Cover decisions are challenged regularly, and I saw that when I was in the union dealing with these decisions. So all the bill will do is create more litigation without any compelling basis to extend employer review rights. Therefore, unfortunately, I will not be able to support this bill. Thank you, Madam Speaker.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002269dfdffa-4227-42b6-875a-fc8033bc25cc\u0022 data-id=\u0022902fbdf924ed486a99630d525a4ec7a2\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000525\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002269dfdffa-4227-42b6-875a-fc8033bc25cc\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022902fbdf924ed486a99630d525a4ec7a2\u0022\u003EJAN LOGIE (Green):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Madam Speaker. I rise on behalf of the Green Party to add our voice in opposition to the Accident Compensation (Notice of Decisions) Amendment Bill. Normally at this point I\u2019d congratulate the member for getting a bill drawn, but, sadly, it wasn\u2019t drawn under your name. So congratulations for picking up the work and for acknowledging that in the House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000526\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002269dfdffa-4227-42b6-875a-fc8033bc25cc\u0022\u003EI would like to commend anybody who\u2019s just listening to my speech and missed the last one\u2014if they\u2019re wanting a really detailed, rational outline of some of the problems with this bill, listen to the outline of it by the previous speaker, Marja Lubeck, because I thought it was very articulate and very clear and covered off all the key points about this being a bill with an answer searching for a problem and really potentially adding a lot more confusion and barriers in the way of people getting the support in terms of accessing appropriate rehabilitation services. Access to ACC is something that we need people to have, because it helps keep people well and keep people in employment and create a safer society.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000527\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002269dfdffa-4227-42b6-875a-fc8033bc25cc\u0022\u003EI do want to point out, around that, that the member, when he spoke on the introduction of this bill, mentioned some points he would like to see around the extension of the ACC Act. I would love to have seen a member\u2019s bill that did that. That would have actually been something we could have engaged with and supported. So maybe next time around, because the Greens want to see an extension of ACC. We recognise that the system at the moment is not working as well as it could be, that it\u2019s kind of based on 20th century ideas of industrial health and wellbeing that is really out of date, and we need to get updated on that. We are seeing more and more stories coming through in terms of the inequity around disability through coverage of ACC and our health system, around the lack of treatment and support in relation to birth injuries, around psycho-social injury, which is deeply gendered, as well as the difficulty of getting new diseases on to the schedule, because it\u2019s just an outdated model of care in terms of the legislation.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000528\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002269dfdffa-4227-42b6-875a-fc8033bc25cc\u0022\u003EI also want to acknowledge the member in his speech as well for talking about that point, about wanting to see an extension and how he hears those stories coming through from his constituents. I, too, have an experience that relates to this legislation of a very dear friend of mine who had repetitive strain injury (RSI). It was acknowledged by ACC, which was back in the day not necessarily that common, and she was given the rehabilitative support to get better and get back to work. There were conditions applied to be able to keep her healthy and safe in her workplace, but her manager and her workplace did not keep to those obligations and she got another case of RSI. Then her employer refused to acknowledge that they had any fault in that and did not support her claim for ACC. So she was faced with\u2014and this is a very common situation\u2014taking a legal case to challenge their decision when stress exacerbated that injury, and she was not in a position to do that. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000529\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002269dfdffa-4227-42b6-875a-fc8033bc25cc\u0022\u003EWe do not need any more of that within our system, and this legislation would increase that situation right across our workplaces. We don\u2019t need that. Our focus needs to be on updating it to be modern, not taking it back into more adversarial late 20th century industrial relations practice. The Greens cannot support this bill.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00226e419a18-df21-483e-9650-2aaee4e06211\u0022 data-id=\u0022970f106a32394d5d9261f9b7eee7b33a\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000530\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226e419a18-df21-483e-9650-2aaee4e06211\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022970f106a32394d5d9261f9b7eee7b33a\u0022\u003EIBRAHIM OMER (Labour):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Madam Speaker. I appreciate the opportunity to speak on this bill. Can I, first, express my solidarity with my comrade, and also colleague, Kiritapu Allan. The first day I arrived in this House as an elected MP, on the Monday after the election, I could see the media gathered outside, and I literally felt like turning away and going back home, because I was just so scared. Kiri was the one who welcomed me, and I will never forget the hug that she gave me and the few words that she said to me that really eased the pressure and also the stress. So I know that she is a woman of steel spirit and I have no doubt she will come back stronger and healthier to us.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000531\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226e419a18-df21-483e-9650-2aaee4e06211\u0022\u003EIn regard to this bill, the proposed amendment to the Accident Compensation Act 2001 to require ACC to inform the employer and the employee of the decisions in respect of aggravation or re-injury of a work-related injury and provide for a review by the employer of the decision, creates significant issues. This bill seeks unreasonably to overturn a fair process that exists now by extending employer review rights with no compelling basis. The rationale for this is that, although the employers are not liable to pay entitlements to claimants, decisions on entitlements may affect an employer\u2019s claim history and the experience rating for ACC levy purposes, and so they should be able to challenge it. This is absurd, to say the least, because the levies are adjusted based on the performance of the employer, and the ability to reduce a work levy by preventing injuries at work and helping injured employees recover and get back to work sooner is an incentivising process to create a more productive work environment.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000532\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226e419a18-df21-483e-9650-2aaee4e06211\u0022\u003ESo the work levy employers pay protects and insures their most value asset, which is their employees. It also goes towards helping prevent these accidents from happening over and over, and in the first place as well. There is no real incentive to support this bill other than unfairly tipping the ACC process towards employers and infringing on claimant rights. We know that the no-fault of the scheme protects employers from the risk of litigation. We know the employers are already notified of and can review covered decisions on a work-related injury. This bill also seeks to reduce the effectiveness of ACC\u2019s review system by allowing the employers to apply for a review of a decision and significantly increasing the number of ACC decisions which employers can review.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000533\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226e419a18-df21-483e-9650-2aaee4e06211\u0022\u003EThe other problem with this bill is the policy intent, as my friend Marja Lubeck explained perfectly. There is no consideration for the clear definition for \u201Caggravation or re-injury\u201D of a work-related injury in this bill, which is funny because, by doing that, it actually overlooks the main aspect of this bill. So that lack of clarity creates confusion and conflicts. So this bill seems to make entitlement decisions contestable by employers, which is another issue. The Act excludes employers already from lodging a review against the entitlement decisions, because entitlement decisions are needs based and employers do not have the same interests in a cover. So, to me, this goes to the heart of the rights of workers. On that note, I oppose the continuation of this bill in the House. Thank you.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00229d892f20-579d-4c43-8247-7ab72c4f7c2e\u0022 data-id=\u002256b8c9423e8d4407b195174381fe4f41\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000534\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00229d892f20-579d-4c43-8247-7ab72c4f7c2e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002256b8c9423e8d4407b195174381fe4f41\u0022\u003ETONI SEVERIN (ACT):\u003C/span\u003E I rise on behalf of the ACT Party to support this bill, the Accident Compensation (Notice of Decisions) Amendment Bill. ACC can be confusing for a lot of employees, and this bill here, from what I read, actually may have its problems, but we are only bringing it to go to select committee. But what I see this as being\u2014as a previously small-business owner, we had staff that would come back to us and would re-aggravate or injure\u2014well, injury. All we\u2019re asking is that us as employers\u2014to actually help our staff to get an assessment and find out what ACC can do to help them.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000535\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00229d892f20-579d-4c43-8247-7ab72c4f7c2e\u0022\u003EIt\u2019s only a minor change. This bill\u2019s not perfect, but this is why we send things off to select committee: so that we can iron out these problems. It\u2019s not about who\u2019s at fault. It\u2019s not. It is making sure that our staff are working safely so that we can make sure that they can continue on. We do not want staff to end up in a major situation down the track, but if an employer can go and seek a review because there has been a re-injury or an aggravation, then we will then understand what we need to do to assist that employee.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000536\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00229d892f20-579d-4c43-8247-7ab72c4f7c2e\u0022\u003EI\u2019m very disappointed, looking at Labour over there, when you say that you are here for the employees and you\u2019re not supporting this bill. As I said, it\u2019s not perfect. Yes, it has its faults. ACC is very confusing legislation, full stop\u2014lots of complaints. However, this is something that I see being such a minute little thing that we could do to help them.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000537\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00229d892f20-579d-4c43-8247-7ab72c4f7c2e\u0022\u003EThe thing is that we always have injuries happening in our workplace. No matter how safe these workplaces are, no matter what rules and regulations we put into our businesses, accidents happen. Now, we get these lovely staff back to us after they\u2019ve had their treatment. We nurture them to make sure that they are not re-aggravating, not re-injuring. However, there\u2019s always a possibility that they think that they\u2019re better than what they are a little bit too soon and they\u2019ll do something silly and they re-aggravate it. But by taking this away and not having employers help these employees by having a review, what can we do? You know, that\u2019s the sad reality of it. What can we do?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000538\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00229d892f20-579d-4c43-8247-7ab72c4f7c2e\u0022\u003EThis to me is something that I feel very strongly should be looked at seriously and go to select committee, because we as employers want to make sure we have healthy employees. We want them to be able to feed their families. We want them to be able to work. We don\u2019t want them on 80 percent wages; we want them on 100 percent wages. So it\u2019s very, very, very sad when you guys constantly oppose bills that aren\u2019t perfect. They are members\u2019 bills. They are not written with the expertise that the Government has to write these lovely bills, but we can always iron out problems. We can always add things to them. We can send them to select committees, people can submit their ideas, and then, if it doesn\u2019t get passed, then we can reassess it and see how we can improve it or come up with a better idea.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000539\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00229d892f20-579d-4c43-8247-7ab72c4f7c2e\u0022\u003ENow, it\u2019s just so shocking to see the list of what\u2019s going on. It\u2019s very, very sad as a previous employer that I could not help my staff with this. We already get notifications, so this isn\u2019t anything privacy. We know when our staff are injured, and half the time the staff member will come to us and tell us what\u2019s going on. So this would not be breaching their privacy, because the majority of the time employees and employers do communicate.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000540\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00229d892f20-579d-4c43-8247-7ab72c4f7c2e\u0022\u003EI am very, very sad that the opposition here is not supporting this minor change and sending it to select committee so that anything that needs to be ironed out could be ironed out. Thank you, Madam Speaker.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00225ec01d23-b55e-45b9-a668-d3bf14212126\u0022 data-id=\u00221162620e894449cf9b22853d6f8dfa4d\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000541\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225ec01d23-b55e-45b9-a668-d3bf14212126\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00221162620e894449cf9b22853d6f8dfa4d\u0022\u003EHELEN WHITE (Labour):\u003C/span\u003E I rise to oppose the continuation of this bill for some very sound reasons. I appreciate the work that goes into members\u2019 bills, but this is a bill that doesn\u2019t help workers whatsoever. I just want to explain what the bill is about and where it is aimed and why it really doesn\u2019t help us at all.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000542\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225ec01d23-b55e-45b9-a668-d3bf14212126\u0022\u003EFirst of all, just to let you know, I\u2019m an employment lawyer, so I did a little bit of ACC. It is a complex area and it isn\u2019t easy. But what happens when I act for an employer in this area is that if there is an injury at work, I can, on their behalf, review that. So I go through a review process. That is already there. That will decide whether there has been a work injury. And that is the right place for an employer to be involved and it is the right place for the employer to have information about that employee.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000543\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225ec01d23-b55e-45b9-a668-d3bf14212126\u0022\u003EWhat this bill proposes is that if the employee is re-injured\u2014so, for example, they go out mountain biking and they re-injure, and they might do that years later\u2014then all that information about that re-injury would go to the employer at that stage, perhaps even the former employer. It would be private information, and it would be given to an employer for what purpose?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000544\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225ec01d23-b55e-45b9-a668-d3bf14212126\u0022\u003ENow, it is actually very clear when you look at the summary what the party who put this forward thinks the purpose is, but I want to explain why that is wrong. So the purpose is supposed to be because the actual acceptance of that claim, the re-injury claim, is going to affect what is called the experience rating. The experience rating is something that sets up the employer for a levy, and it is based on a calculation that involves the last three years of workplace injuries and it\u2019s a risk assessment. One of the things that goes into that assessment is how many days the employees have had off work. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000545\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225ec01d23-b55e-45b9-a668-d3bf14212126\u0022\u003ENow, if you really want to help your employer, what you do is you stay involved. You are quite entitled to and you should stay involved and you should rehabilitate. And if you stay involved, the work days off work will go down, and your employee will go back to work sooner, and your rating will be better. That is how you legitimately get your experience rating down. If the employee has a re-injury, or, actually, an aggravation, there is no purpose of the employer being involved in that conversation. That conversation still happens, it still goes to ACC, and the claim still has a review process that involves the employee, who is the right person to involve because they are the impacted person in that situation, and they will be involved in that process right there and then. That is a way we keep our system simple and dignified, and it is a principled way to actually deal with it.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000546\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225ec01d23-b55e-45b9-a668-d3bf14212126\u0022\u003EI repeat: if you want to get your experience rating down, get down your holistic risk rating by actually getting that experience rating down by keeping involved, being involved in rehabilitation in a really meaningful way, and those levies will go down. That is a system that works. And I am proud to say that the approach at the present time is one of the better aspects of our legislation in this area. This is a no-fault system, and what this legislation would do is it would invite employers to actually come at this at their worst, which is to look at a situation and think, \u201CI\u2019m going to lose out of this situation because my employee went mountain biking and they re-injured themselves.\u201D There is no part of that conversation that is good for the employment relationship, and it should be absolutely something we resist in a no-fault system, because we are streets ahead of the rest of the world in this area. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000547\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225ec01d23-b55e-45b9-a668-d3bf14212126\u0022\u003EWe have a very good system and we should support it, and this would erode it. And that is why I oppose this bill. Thank you.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00224a25943b-cb3b-49c3-bd10-74316fae17f1\u0022 data-id=\u002203cc510ceb194080953dc8f2b79c571e\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000548\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00224a25943b-cb3b-49c3-bd10-74316fae17f1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002203cc510ceb194080953dc8f2b79c571e\u0022\u003EASSISTANT SPEAKER (Hon Jacqui Dean)\u003C/span\u003E: The question is that the motion be agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022b464a62e-d900-452a-b842-e3cf4ccc6149\u0022 data-id=\u0022ec3e69b6addf4b22a80d1eb8cea13e27\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000549\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b464a62e-d900-452a-b842-e3cf4ccc6149\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022ec3e69b6addf4b22a80d1eb8cea13e27\u0022\u003EARENA WILLIAMS (Labour\u2014Manurewa):\u003C/span\u003E T\u0113n\u0101 koe e te M\u0101ngai o te Whare. Thank you, Madam Speaker, for the opportunity to speak on this bill. I want to start, for anyone watching this at home, by giving some brief introductory remarks about the ACC system as a whole. New Zealand\u2019s accident compensation scheme is world leading. It is the envy of jurisdictions within the world that have a common law system which has had, over the years, the development of a tort law system where personal injury is something that people can sue someone for, based on a fault system, and claim against them.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000550\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b464a62e-d900-452a-b842-e3cf4ccc6149\u0022\u003EWhat\u2019s really interesting and important to note in this debate is that our accident compensation scheme in its no-fault aspect is incredibly important for the employers that it protects. I remind those members in the Opposition that the reason we have the system is so that there is a bar against employees in this situation being able to sue their employers. We are talking about situations where a worker has been injured at work and would otherwise be able to sue their employer for that injury and for their employer\u2019s role in that.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000551\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b464a62e-d900-452a-b842-e3cf4ccc6149\u0022\u003EThis bill seeks to change the balance between how these situations can be reviewed and to give more rights to employers to review those decisions by ACC, with the worry that\u2019s been presented by the Opposition members that their levies will go up and, essentially, they will pay more.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000552\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b464a62e-d900-452a-b842-e3cf4ccc6149\u0022\u003EIt\u2019s important to revisit the very core of the accident compensation scheme, about how this protects employers and creates a system where fault is not necessary to be proven and, as my colleague Helen White has said, it\u2019s really important that we do not tinker with a system which is world leading in creating and inviting a space where employers are asked to come to this at their worst, where we\u2019re inviting employers to go out of their way to prove that they did not have any contributing factor, because the strength of this system is that they do not need to do that and they do not need to establish fault.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000553\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b464a62e-d900-452a-b842-e3cf4ccc6149\u0022\u003EI want to turn to this issue of privacy. My concerns with this bill are that it raises serious privacy concerns in an unjustified invasion of workers\u2019 rights. This bill in its current form has the potential to cause privacy and operational issues because of the potential of a person who has a review right being entitled to see the basis of the decision that they request a review of. I\u2019m talking here about the principles of natural justice where, if an employer had the right to review a decision with ACC, you would naturally expect them to have the right to inquire as to the basis of the decision that ACC have made, and, potentially, clinical information. That\u2019s not a position that we could possibly support on this side of the House. It\u2019s a position that gives employers far too much information about workers\u2019 health conditions, and information which those workers would not have the ability to oppose or give consent to giving to their employers. It creates a system where employers are asked to delve into the clinical history of their employees, which is not something that we on this side of the House could possibly support.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000554\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b464a62e-d900-452a-b842-e3cf4ccc6149\u0022\u003EThe concern that any former employer could be entitled to this in an ongoing sense, that there would be a review system that would last for more than the relevant time period which this bill seeks to address, is also a serious concern. And it creates significant operational issues by allowing employers to apply for a review of a decision that would be a significant increase on the number of ACC decisions which employers can review.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000555\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b464a62e-d900-452a-b842-e3cf4ccc6149\u0022\u003EI think it\u2019s really useful for us to think about how useful our accident compensation scheme is at the moment, the reason why we protect it, the reason why it draws moral lines in the sand that sometimes those in this House do not agree with on any given day. That is not a reason to tinker with it around the edges. It\u2019s important to protect the accident compensation scheme for what it is, and it\u2019s important to approach any changes very carefully and very mindfully. On this side of the House we don\u2019t believe that this bill does that, and that is why we oppose it.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022d2995873-613f-4202-a773-5ea2d57cc953\u0022 data-id=\u0022fe7ce2c049de4deeb788187178f9b046\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000556\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022d2995873-613f-4202-a773-5ea2d57cc953\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022fe7ce2c049de4deeb788187178f9b046\u0022\u003EPENNY SIMMONDS (National\u2014Invercargill):\u003C/span\u003E I\u2019m pleased to speak in support of the Accident Compensation (Notice of Decisions) Amendment Bill, and I congratulate my colleagues, past and present, for bringing it to the House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000557\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022d2995873-613f-4202-a773-5ea2d57cc953\u0022\u003EThe purpose of the bill, which amends the Accident Compensation Act 2001, is to broaden the range of circumstances that give employers the right to apply for a review of accident compensation decisions related to a claim. As so many of the speakers have said, ACC plays an important part in New Zealanders\u2019 lives by providing that comprehensive, no-fault, personal injury cover, and thank goodness it does, so that we don\u2019t spend time and money on lawyers.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000558\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022d2995873-613f-4202-a773-5ea2d57cc953\u0022\u003EThis bill would increase the range of situations where employers can question or challenge ACC decisions that might affect an employer\u2019s claims history and experience rating. This would ensure that employers have the right to a review of decisions that may be determined by ACC regarding re-injury of an employee\u2019s initial work-related injury. In a previous life I was an employer of a significant number of employees, and from time to time they would access ACC, so I know how important it is that employers have the right to apply for a review of decisions.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000559\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022d2995873-613f-4202-a773-5ea2d57cc953\u0022\u003EIn my Invercargill electorate there are a number of large businesses that are important to New Zealand\u2019s economy, businesses like Alliance Group, which exports our wonderful lamb, beef, and venison to 65 different countries; Fonterra\u2019s Edendale factory; HWR, that wonderful family, Richardson\u2019s group; a number of agricultural contractors, food growers, and processors such as Pyper\u2019s Produce, who grow the best carrots in New Zealand, and Southern Cross Produce, who grow the best parsnips in New Zealand; and, of course, our hard-working farmers are also major employers. I want to acknowledge the wonderful, productive work of those employers, creating wealth for their employees, the community, and the New Zealand economy. It is absolutely imperative that these important employers and all our hard-working employers throughout New Zealand have the ability and the right to review decisions that affect their claims history and experience rating, and on the re-injury of an employee to ensure that the liability of those injuries is borne by the appropriate employer.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000560\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022d2995873-613f-4202-a773-5ea2d57cc953\u0022\u003ELook, I acknowledge that the re-injury situation, where an employee might have changed employers, happens very, very rarely, but when it does happen it\u2019s incredibly tedious and irksome and costly for those employers. So I see that clauses 5, 6, and 7 of the bill, amending sections 134, 142, and 149 of the Act, will address this to ensure that that liability lies where it should. So I would have thought that those across the House would be very keen to support this bill after all the impositions that the Labour Government have placed on our valuable employers, all the extra costs and extra regulations of additional leave, of additional sick leave, of additional stats, of additional costs with regulations\u2014that they would have wanted to offer this small crumb to our valuable employers across New Zealand to make it a little bit easier for them to be able to challenge some of the decisions that are made by the Accident Compensation Corporation. I commend this bill to the House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022c83012b4-3939-4753-80fc-1956a3e2bd1e\u0022 data-id=\u0022145831fdfe60489e9d2d88cf5261fae7\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000561\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c83012b4-3939-4753-80fc-1956a3e2bd1e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022145831fdfe60489e9d2d88cf5261fae7\u0022\u003EHon MICHAEL WOODHOUSE (National):\u003C/span\u003E Can I begin, firstly, by thanking the chief Government whip for his indulgence in allowing me to take one of the Labour calls in this debate. The reason I asked for that was because, while the bill is in the name of Simon Watts, I actually wrote it, and there\u2019s been a lot of misinformation and misunderstanding about what are the intent and the purpose of the bill and what the intent behind it is. So I\u2019ll take the opportunity to set out the circumstances that led to my drafting the bill and then address some of the issues that have been raised by members.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000562\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c83012b4-3939-4753-80fc-1956a3e2bd1e\u0022\u003ESo there are two scenarios that can affect an employer\u2019s experience rating, and both of these have occurred and been brought to my attention. One is where an initial injury has been incurred and there is a change of employer before the exacerbation of that injury. Depending on ACC\u2019s decision in respect of whether or not it\u2019s a new injury or whether or not it\u2019s a re-injury, that can affect the experience rating of the employer that is being asked to carry the can for it, when, in fact, the injury did not occur at his or her workplace. The second scenario is one where a non - work-related injury is exacerbated by an injury that occurs at work, and this was a case that was brought to my attention, where somebody with a relatively minor knee injury, tripping up a step, aggravated an old and longstanding rugby injury. Now, members should understand that the experience rating impact of these sorts of scenarios is not insignificant. In this case, it was over $120,000 for surgery, extended time off work, physiotherapy, and other therapies. That was put on to the employer\u2019s experience rating, where the actual cause of the injury was sport-related, not work-related. But by the time that became clear, the ability to appeal the decision to attribute it as a work-related injury had passed, and this bill seeks to remedy that.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000563\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c83012b4-3939-4753-80fc-1956a3e2bd1e\u0022\u003ENow, Marja Lubeck is right: the law\u2014the Accident Compensation Act\u2014does not refer to the nomenclature that is in this bill, and I\u2019m sure Helen White will be aware of this, as a lawyer who\u2019s worked on ACC cases. There is often nomenclature around re-injury that is used, and ACC themselves accept that personal injury caused by an accident can be reactivated after a long period, and that\u2019s what we\u2019re talking about. That\u2019s what the language in the bill was designed to do. Now, the ACT member who\u2019s just resumed her seat before, Toni Severin, is right: if the language is wrong, then the select committee can fix it. That\u2019s often the case with members\u2019 bills because we don\u2019t have the vast resources of Government and, therefore, we are limited in our ability to get things right. In fact, frankly, we don\u2019t do a worse job than Government. Some of the bills that have been brought by the Government before this House actually are in no better shape than some of the members\u2019 bills brought before this House. So that would have been the place where we could have addressed some of those things.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000564\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c83012b4-3939-4753-80fc-1956a3e2bd1e\u0022\u003ENow, a lot of things were talked about by members that I, frankly, think are not appropriate or attributable to this bill, and my experience on the Transport and Industrial Relations Committee in my first term in Parliament was that there was a high level of congeniality and collegiality until we got to things like workers\u2019 rights and industrial relations, and then the left are up like meerkats. And that included the ACC Act. This is what I think we are seeing today, when actually, and I stress this, the claimant is not negatively affected by this one bit\u2014unless it is a repetition strain injury that did not occur at work, and that is a very rare thing. It might be tennis elbow or something like that, but generally speaking the claimant will never be affected by this bill if it is passed. However, the employer may have the right to challenge not whether the claim should be accepted but whether the experience rating liability should fall on his or her business. That is what this is going to fix, or would have had Labour been a little less like meerkats and actually supported it at first reading. I\u2019m disappointed they won\u2019t do that. This will fix a problem that won\u2019t harm claimants.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00225cf229a9-8722-46b2-a37e-b528e075be7d\u0022 data-id=\u002268e23d8446c44e31964789d01a2ed55f\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000565\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225cf229a9-8722-46b2-a37e-b528e075be7d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002268e23d8446c44e31964789d01a2ed55f\u0022\u003EANGELA ROBERTS (Labour):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you for giving me the opportunity to engage in this debate, and I\u2019m proud to stand with my fellow meerkats and stand up for workers\u2019 rights. They\u2019re very cute. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000566\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225cf229a9-8722-46b2-a37e-b528e075be7d\u0022\u003EI\u2019m confused. People on the other side of the House have been talking about how this is going to simplify things\u2014let\u2019s get rid of some red tape\u2014and, actually, what it is doing is it is making things very, very messy. You know, I had this whole \u201CLet\u2019s test these ideas.\u201D so I\u2019m very grateful for the member who stood before and made it very, very clear that it\u2019s the overreach, the unnecessary overreach, that this legislation will enable. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000567\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225cf229a9-8722-46b2-a37e-b528e075be7d\u0022\u003EI have spoken before in this House of my love for the great outdoors and for tramping. When I was a teacher, I would have accompanied the year 12 trampers around our beautiful maunga and I may have\u2014I haven\u2019t, thankfully\u2014injured myself at work on a tramping trip. That\u2019s fine. It\u2019s all really, really clear: the review process and the engagement with the employer at that point. What I\u2019m a little confused about is 10 years later, when I\u2019m working at another school and I take another tramping trip and I re-injure myself, what my previous employer has got to do with helping me to recover, with that overreach. Or maybe I\u2019m tramping on the weekend with my children and I re-injure myself so my re-injury doesn\u2019t happen in the workplace. It\u2019s not a rugby injury, but a tramping injury. And again, you know, my employer years down the track possibly has this overreach and an ability to challenge something that doesn\u2019t actually have an implication for them. Me, my recovery, the costs for that recovery being borne by the system to protect the employer\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000568\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c83012b4-3939-4753-80fc-1956a3e2bd1e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022e9f3308ef51242f9a2c43914a40b6aa2\u0022\u003EHon Michael Woodhouse\u003C/span\u003E: By the employers, not the system.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000569\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225cf229a9-8722-46b2-a37e-b528e075be7d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00221fbbba56963d4c65af59ecef3a09f5e0\u0022\u003EANGELA ROBERTS\u003C/span\u003E: \u2014to protect the employer. My previous employer doesn\u2019t have to pay, and I\u2019m just really confused about that overreach. This is not about simplification. This is about unnecessary overreach and it is not the right solution to what is suggested to be a problem. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000570\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225cf229a9-8722-46b2-a37e-b528e075be7d\u0022\u003EI think some of our previous speakers had been really clear about the unintended consequences\u2014you know, the cost and the complexity of this adversarial approach. We\u2019ve talked about challenging decisions made by ACC. You know, the ability to review and be involved and engaged is absolutely appropriate, especially when an employer wants to be involved in making sure that rehabilitation\u2014and actually that those accidents don\u2019t happen again in the future is absolutely appropriate. But this doesn\u2019t enable that. So, again, it\u2019s a bit of overreach in saying that that\u2019s the appropriate reasoning for this legislation. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000571\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225cf229a9-8722-46b2-a37e-b528e075be7d\u0022\u003EThe operational capacity and cost has been raised and that is a concern when we know how challenged ACC is in deploying its resources. And the issue of privacy\u2014again, you know, I move on employers 10, 15 years down the track. They don\u2019t necessarily have a right to have a really interesting little look into my future engagement around this. So there is confusion. It is not simple. I still haven\u2019t heard the argument yet for this to be a useful piece of legislation. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000572\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225cf229a9-8722-46b2-a37e-b528e075be7d\u0022\u003EOne of the other important pieces we need to think about is something that Jan Logie raised. We have a unique system in New Zealand\u2014no-fault\u2014but we can see that we can futureproof it. We have got improvements that we want to make\u2014we\u2019ve heard it many times in the House\u2014and we should be putting our energy into making those improvements, not on taking this flawed solution off to select committee, to tinker with it and try and make it work when it isn\u2019t actually solving a problem. So for that reason, I urge the House to put its energy and its resources into places where it will effect change and will strengthen the protections for not just our workers, but our employers. And so I must say that I will be not supporting this bill going to the next stage. Thank you.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca id=\u0022782318de477e4bfa9eda3ebb9c036044\u0022 name=\u0022division\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EA party vote was called for on the question, That the Accident Compensation (Notice of Decisions) Amendment Bill be now read a first time.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EAyes 43\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand National 33; ACT New Zealand 10.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENoes 77\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand Labour 65; Green Party of Aotearoa New Zealand 10; Te Paati M\u0101ori 2.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EMotion not agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n    \u003C/div\u003E\n    \u003Cdiv class=\u0022HpsHansard\u0022\u003E\n      \u003Cp\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsProceedingHeading\u0022\u003EBills\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000573\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u00222e525d60fcff4f91b2551ebd0eda34b2\u0022\u003ESunscreen (Product Safety Standard) Bill\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000574\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u0022a8c71b6ff6714c5282867ef38ee9ca69\u0022\u003EFirst Reading\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022fdb01002-a7cf-4a77-8f05-678d24a36849\u0022 data-id=\u00221fd5cd22e4f94d5fab4c75caa42f122c\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000575\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022fdb01002-a7cf-4a77-8f05-678d24a36849\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00221fd5cd22e4f94d5fab4c75caa42f122c\u0022\u003ETODD MULLER (National\u2014Bay of Plenty):\u003C/span\u003E I move, That the Sunscreen (Product Safety Standard) Bill be now read a first time. I nominate the Health Committee to consider the bill.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000576\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022fdb01002-a7cf-4a77-8f05-678d24a36849\u0022\u003EIn 1987, I was holidaying in Taup\u014D, when my 18-year-old younger self decided that I\u2019d had enough of being pale and it was time to embrace the sun\u2019s rays and be a little more cooler, in my own mind. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000577\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a1f7bbd1-b6ae-41c0-963b-dbe1251f5540\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022ec83ee3bd3eb4d78879866bdaadcec2b\u0022\u003EKieran McAnulty\u003C/span\u003E: How\u2019d you go?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000578\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022fdb01002-a7cf-4a77-8f05-678d24a36849\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a0fd5e2451aa4d4b884848878cccb1ba\u0022\u003ETODD MULLER\u003C/span\u003E: So I decided\u2014thank you, Kieran McAnulty, I knew it wouldn\u2019t take long! I decided to embrace the sun\u2019s rays in the elevation of Taup\u014D for most of the day, and woke up the next morning with my face entirely blistered\u2014completely blistered\u2014and my back only marginally less so. I am reminded of this youthful indiscretion every six months when I catch up with Dr Paul Salmon from the Tauranga SkinCentre as he regularly books me in for Mohs surgery to remove basal cell and other skin cancers. Of course, my father had a melanoma himself, but was lucky enough to have it caught, for it runs in my family.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000579\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022fdb01002-a7cf-4a77-8f05-678d24a36849\u0022\u003ESunscreen is important for me. It is important for my two red-headed daughters and my son, who, hopefully, won\u2019t repeat my mistake. Sunscreen is important to me. What the label says on the sunscreen is important to me\u2014that if it says SPF 50, then I have an expectation that it will be SPF 50. That\u2019s why I am so proud to be standing here this evening, presenting for the first reading the Sunscreen (Product Safety Standard) Bill.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000580\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022fdb01002-a7cf-4a77-8f05-678d24a36849\u0022\u003ENow, I\u2019m sure most in the House would have been somewhat surprised when they saw this bill, and would have thought, \u201CBut surely we have a sunscreen standard in this country.\u201D, and we do. It is a shared standard with Australia. It is the Australian New Zealand Sunscreen Standard AS/NZS 2604:2012, which comprehensively prescribes the test methods for both broad spectrum and water resistant sunscreen products and their labelling requirements. But you see, in Australia, the standard is mandatory, meaning a product cannot go on to the shelf without meeting the standard. But in New Zealand, compliance is voluntary. And the result is that many sunscreens do not meet the promise of the label. They say they are broad spectrum, they say they are SPF 50 or a similarly high number, but, actually, when tested, they do not deliver that claim.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000581\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022fdb01002-a7cf-4a77-8f05-678d24a36849\u0022\u003EIn 2019, Consumer New Zealand tested 20 sunscreens, and nine products did not meet the SPF claim on the label. In 2020, they tested a further 10 sunscreens and five failed the SPF claim. Now, it\u2019s one thing for me to be lying on a beach in Taup\u014D, trying to be cool, and being accountable, ultimately, for that error\u2014in a blistered face and an ongoing life of removal of skin cancers from my body\u2014but it is quite another thing for New Zealanders to go and buy an SPF 50 on the promise that it will protect them, only for that sunscreen not to be delivering against that standard. Quite frankly, that anomaly needs to be fixed.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000582\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022fdb01002-a7cf-4a77-8f05-678d24a36849\u0022\u003ESo let\u2019s talk to the bill itself. It\u2019s not particularly complex\u2014it\u2019s very, very simple. The bill requires the Minister of Commerce and Consumer Affairs to recommend the setting of mandatory regulation under section 29 of the Fair Trading Act 1986, prescribing a product safety standard for sunscreen products\u2014that\u2019s the first thing it requires. Secondly, the bill expressly states that this is to be the NZS\u2014the New Zealand standard\u20142604:2012 or any New Zealand standard substituted for that standard. There is work under way\u2014almost being concluded, actually\u2014for that standard to be updated, so that would automatically become the new standard in these regulations. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000583\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022fdb01002-a7cf-4a77-8f05-678d24a36849\u0022\u003EThat is largely it. If you look at the reference in this bill to section 29, it is very clear: section 29 of the Fair Trading Act states, \u201CProduct safety standards (1) The Governor-General may, from time to time, on the recommendation of the Minister, by Order in Council, make regulations in respect of goods of any description or any class or classes of goods, prescribing for the purpose of preventing or reducing the risk of injury to any person, a product safety standard\u201D. In the second subsection, \u201C(2) The Governor-General may, from time to time, on the recommendation of the Minister, by Order in Council, make regulations [that sets]: (a) an official standard or an official standard with such additions or variations as are specified in the regulations is a product safety standard:\u201D. So the standard that is a voluntary compliance currently will be put in the Fair Trading Act as an obligation on manufacturers. That is, in my view, a way to strengthen consumer protections immediately.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000584\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022fdb01002-a7cf-4a77-8f05-678d24a36849\u0022\u003ENow, I do have to acknowledge that there has been work under way by this Government in the therapeutic products regime, and also in the natural products regime, with a hope to be able to bring a new, refreshed framework to the House sometime in the next year. Now, it is probable that in time that new regime will reflect on how to treat sunscreen, but we all know that that is likely\u2014the Minister himself has said that that is many months away before it would be presented in the House, and then it would have to run through the obvious select committee process. This small change to the Fair Trading Act means that this summer, New Zealanders can have greater confidence in the efficacy of sunscreens that they buy in New Zealand. Right now, this House, through supporting this bill, can make that change and give effect to it.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000585\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022fdb01002-a7cf-4a77-8f05-678d24a36849\u0022\u003EI don\u2019t just stand here as someone who has a personal interest, and I guess some negative impact of not following the right approach in terms of protecting oneself from the sun. I obviously stand here as a father with children who are particularly fair-skinned and exposed in that context, but I also stand here on behalf of the many New Zealanders who have expressed their deep concern at the fact that sunscreens are simply not delivering the protection that they expected they would deliver when they bought them and applied them not only to themselves but also to their children. I also stand here on behalf of groups who have written to me in support: Cancer Society of New Zealand, Cosmetics New Zealand, Albinism New Zealand, Kylie Findlay and 1,329 others who have a petition in front of the Health Committee at the moment, Melanoma Network of New Zealand, and many other individuals, who I won\u2019t read out, over the last few weeks.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000586\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022fdb01002-a7cf-4a77-8f05-678d24a36849\u0022\u003EThis is not a detailed, dense bill; it is a precise, forensic addition to the Fair Trading Act to ensure that the sunscreen that we purchase in this country has greater efficacy and that consumers have greater protection, and I would hope that this is a bill that this whole House can support to select committee to further refine and debate. Thank you very much.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00224a25943b-cb3b-49c3-bd10-74316fae17f1\u0022 data-id=\u0022e21d091ab688498c93f6c80be0e904a3\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000587\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00224a25943b-cb3b-49c3-bd10-74316fae17f1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022e21d091ab688498c93f6c80be0e904a3\u0022\u003EASSISTANT SPEAKER (Hon Jacqui Dean)\u003C/span\u003E: The question is that the motion be agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022c2e823af-22b7-4411-8b12-14d7b43680ea\u0022 data-id=\u00222577090bd6e5495db73aad18ec355696\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000588\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c2e823af-22b7-4411-8b12-14d7b43680ea\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00222577090bd6e5495db73aad18ec355696\u0022\u003EJAMIE STRANGE (Labour\u2014Hamilton East):\u003C/span\u003E Madam Speaker, thank you for the opportunity to take a call on this bill, the Sunscreen (Product Safety Standard) Bill. I\u2019d like to acknowledge the member Todd Muller for bringing this bill to the House. The member mentioned a personal story that he has, and I\u2019m sure that many of us have either had a similar story or know someone very close to us who has had a story around melanoma, because the most common form of cancer in New Zealand is, basically, skin cancers: making up a total of 82,000 per year; all other cancers form a total of 16,000\u2014so skin cancer itself 82; all other cancers 16.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000589\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c2e823af-22b7-4411-8b12-14d7b43680ea\u0022\u003EOur skin cancer rates are the highest in the world. The melanoma rate in New Zealand and Australia is four times that of Canada, the US, and the UK. We have a very harsh sun here, and the reality is that we have to be incredibly vigilant around this. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000590\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c2e823af-22b7-4411-8b12-14d7b43680ea\u0022\u003ESo I\u2019ll talk a little bit about, actually, just to put a bit of context into it in terms of sunscreen, what has brought us to the point that we are now with sunscreens and the SPF rating. Then I\u2019ll move on to the Government\u2019s position on this bill and then I\u2019ll talk a little bit more around various aspects of the bill.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000591\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c2e823af-22b7-4411-8b12-14d7b43680ea\u0022\u003EBefore I start, I also have a similar story about wanting to be cool. I think we\u2019ve possibly all been there at some time! For me, it was the 1980s with zinc\u2014I don\u2019t know if people remember zinc; I can see some nods, yes, from people who are my age and older. Kieran McAnulty, you are too young for zinc, but it was various colours on the face. I mean, we have a laugh about it because, you know, the colours were fairly vibrant. However, it was an incredibly important campaign, and we had zinc products come out with different colours for the express purpose of encouraging people to wear zinc, which was, obviously, a form of sunscreen\u2014a very good form, actually, as I understand it.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000592\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c2e823af-22b7-4411-8b12-14d7b43680ea\u0022\u003ESo in terms of what has brought us to this point, in terms of sunscreen, just for the benefit of the House\u2014a little bit of context. The ancient Greeks and Egyptians actually used sunscreen\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000593\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022f27f1c48632844b8b42c2f5c4b22a862\u0022\u003EHon Gerry Brownlee\u003C/span\u003E: No.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000594\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c2e823af-22b7-4411-8b12-14d7b43680ea\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022bea5081abad648a49683e0e1967e005b\u0022\u003EJAMIE STRANGE\u003C/span\u003E: They used natural products\u2014that\u2019s right, Mr Brownlee. Zinc oxide paste was around for thousands of years, even before it was cool in the 1980s. Synthetic sunscreens were first used in 1928, so that\u2019s when the mass synthetic production of sunscreen came, in 1928. In fact, in World War II, the US military used sunscreen in the Pacific. In 1974, the sun protection factor, which has been alluded to in the previous member\u2019s speech\u2014SPF\u2014was introduced. That\u2019s 1974. Water-resistant sunscreens were introduced in 1977. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000595\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c2e823af-22b7-4411-8b12-14d7b43680ea\u0022\u003EJust in terms of the SPF rating, most of the sunscreens in the 1970s were around an SPF rating of two or lower\u2014very, very light. We didn\u2019t know much about sunscreens and we didn\u2019t know much about skin cancer back then. But, certainly, things have changed. If we move forward to today\u2019s society, dermatologists\u2014and I tread carefully because I know we\u2019ve got three doctors in the row in front of me here\u2014recommend SPF of 30 or above, and an SPF of 30 blocks 90 percent of the sun\u2019s UV rays. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000596\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c2e823af-22b7-4411-8b12-14d7b43680ea\u0022\u003EBut the point of the SPF and the point of this bill here is that SPF ratings must be accurate. If someone is buying an SPF rating of 15, but the rating isn\u2019t 15, then there can be quite severe consequences. Some people for, you know, quite strict medical reasons need 30 or 50 SPF. And if they are picking something off the shelf that says that and it is not, there can be life-threatening consequences, as we\u2019ve heard outlined in the previous speech.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000597\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c2e823af-22b7-4411-8b12-14d7b43680ea\u0022\u003EJust to move on to this Government\u2019s position on this bill at the first reading: so the Government are supporting this bill to select committee. We are not guaranteeing any support beyond that, but we are supporting this bill to the select committee. We think it is important for it to go through that process.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000598\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c2e823af-22b7-4411-8b12-14d7b43680ea\u0022\u003EThis bill requires the Minister of Commerce and Consumer Affairs to recommend the making of regulations under section 29 of the Fair Trading Act 1986, prescribing a product safety standard for sunscreen products. The Government is supporting this bill to select committee to facilitate additional consideration of the regulations surrounding safety standards for sunscreen products.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000599\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c2e823af-22b7-4411-8b12-14d7b43680ea\u0022\u003EWe are, however\u2014as the member alluded to\u2014already progressing the regulation of sunscreen products as part of the proposed Therapeutic Products Bill, which we anticipate will be introduced to the House later this year. Now, I acknowledge the member\u2019s comments in terms of wanting to move quickly, but that is just to signal to the member that we do intend to bring that bill in towards the end of the year. We are supporting taking a health-based approach to the regulation of sunscreen safety standards.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000600\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c2e823af-22b7-4411-8b12-14d7b43680ea\u0022\u003EWhat the bill does: so it requires the Minister of Commerce and Consumer Affairs to recommend the making of regulations in the Fair Trading Act. It states that the product safety standard, the New Zealand standard with sunscreen, or any New Zealand standard situated for that standard\u2014it notes that the Minister must make the recommendations as soon as practicable after the commencement of this Act, but no later than six months after its commencement.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000601\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c2e823af-22b7-4411-8b12-14d7b43680ea\u0022\u003ESo the reason we are supporting it to select committee is because while we are progressing the regulation of sunscreen products as part of the proposed Therapeutic Products Bill, select committee scrutiny of this particular bill will offer an additional opportunity for consideration of the regulatory settings around the safety of sunscreen products. And, obviously, we will consider our support then again after the select committee process. So we support taking a health-based approach to the regulation of sunscreen safety standards. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000602\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c2e823af-22b7-4411-8b12-14d7b43680ea\u0022\u003EI\u2019d also like to touch on something that the previous speaker highlighted, which was the work done by Consumer New Zealand, because this is quite important work for this piece of legislation. I quote Consumer New Zealand. They say, \u201CThe Sunscreen Product Safety Standard Bill \u2026 highlights the need for better regulation and could provide an opportunity to make sunscreen testing mandatory,\u201D. That\u2019s what Consumer New Zealand said, and that, obviously, certainly fits in with the work that we are doing on this side of the House. So there are certainly various streams of work going on in this area because it is important that we do have things right in this space. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000603\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c2e823af-22b7-4411-8b12-14d7b43680ea\u0022\u003EAs Consumer New Zealand said, sunscreen is currently classified as a cosmetic, and that is at the root of the issue here: the fact that because it is a cosmetic, manufacturers aren\u2019t required to regularly test these products, and the sunscreen standard is voluntary. We heard, previously\u2014and just to highlight it again\u2014at the Consumer New Zealand test, five of the 10 products\u2014which is quite remarkable, actually; Consumer New Zealand took 10 products off the shelf, checked their SPF rating. Five of those 10 products were inaccurate; they didn\u2019t meet the SPF label claim, and they weren\u2019t over the SPF; they were under the SPF. As I highlighted earlier in my speech, that certainly has potentially fatal ramifications around skin cancer. And, in fact, two of those also failed to meet the requirements for broad spectrum protection. In Australia, sunscreen is subject to a mandatory standard and regulated by the Therapeutic Goods Administration. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000604\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c2e823af-22b7-4411-8b12-14d7b43680ea\u0022\u003EIn 2019, Consumer New Zealand wrote to the Minister of Health, urging for priority to be given to a mandatory sunscreen standard. So there is no doubt that the time has come for a mandatory sunscreen standard. In terms of Consumer New Zealand, the chief, Jon Duffy, said, \u201CThe results were, unfortunately, not much a of a surprise\u201D, which is quite sobering because I\u2019m sure if you walked down to Lambton Quay and spoke to members of the public and held up a bottle of sunscreen\u2014you know, \u201CDo you believe this is SPF 30 or 40?\u201D\u2014most of them would say, \u201CYeah, I\u2019m sure it is.\u201D But the fact that the CEO of Consumer New Zealand said that it wasn\u2019t much of a surprise that only five out of 10 were accurate\u2014that is certainly concerning. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000605\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c2e823af-22b7-4411-8b12-14d7b43680ea\u0022\u003ESo, basically, just to summarise, people need to be clear on what they are buying, in terms of the SPF rating. The member has brought a bill to the House; we\u2019re supporting it at first reading to select committee. Also, from the Government\u2019s side of it, we are working on a piece of legislation, as well, which will be ready by the end of the year. So, Madam Speaker, thank you for the opportunity to speak to this bill and we support it at first reading. Thank you.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00227ec53e32-05ab-4c6b-a080-4024e72a9099\u0022 data-id=\u0022fbfa84b58ff044a4a86e94c6523b0e4f\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000606\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227ec53e32-05ab-4c6b-a080-4024e72a9099\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022fbfa84b58ff044a4a86e94c6523b0e4f\u0022\u003EDr ELIZABETH KEREKERE (Green):\u003C/span\u003E Ng\u0101 mihi ki a koe. \u0100, t\u0113n\u0101 koe e te Whare. Kia ora koutou katoa. I stand in support of this bill. One of the key principles of the Green Party health policy states, and I quote, \u201CAll services should be provided to the highest possible level of quality (accessibility, acceptability, effectiveness, efficiency and safety) as determined by service users, peer review, audits, and the community at large.\u201D Since sunscreen is a product purchased by people to prevent damage to their health, establishing a product safety and standard certainly is in line with this. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000607\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227ec53e32-05ab-4c6b-a080-4024e72a9099\u0022\u003EThe Greens have long supported consumer protections that ensure people can trust what they are buying. This bill would increase consumer trust in the claims of sunscreen brands. We also note that Consumer New Zealand, which publishes regular critiques on sunscreen markets, issued a release welcoming any movement to improve regulation. We know that Aotearoa has the highest rate of melanomas in the world. Although M\u0101ori and Pasifika are much less likely to get them, when we do we have a higher risk of thick and more advanced melanoma with a poorer prognosis. Whereas for non-M\u0101ori it is predominately men who get melanomas, for some reason for M\u0101ori it is predominately women. Research is not available on the impact on takat\u0101pui, trans, intersex, and non-binary people. Of course, prevention is better, and we acknowledge agencies such as Te Herenga Hauora, our health promotion agency, for their SunSmart campaign. We\u2019re told to \u201Cslip, slop, slap\u201D and now \u201Cwrap\u201D. So slip on a shirt or slip into shade, slop on some sunscreen, slap on a hat, and wrap on some sunglasses. But sometimes even that may not always work. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000608\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227ec53e32-05ab-4c6b-a080-4024e72a9099\u0022\u003EAlong with my National colleague who proposed this bill, Todd McClay, I also have personal experience in this. Proud as I am of my M\u0101ori whakapapa that gave me these brown eyes and this hair, it is my mother\u2019s strong Irish blood that gave me this fair skin. So for decades now I have used quality skin care and sunscreen to make sure that I go a lovely brown colour and not bright pink. So it was quite a surprise to me in 2005 to find the tiny lump beside my eye suddenly started growing at an alarming rate. My partner made me go to a doctor and I was diagnosed with skin cancer. I was told that the waiting list was at least six months long but I was likely to keep getting bumped because I would always be low priority. They also told me, though, if I waited too long I would likely go blind. I have sight in both of my eyes because one of my friends loaned me the $2,000 it cost back in 2005 to do a 15-minute procedure in a private hospital. All because the labelling on the products I was using in good faith were not accurate.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000609\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227ec53e32-05ab-4c6b-a080-4024e72a9099\u0022\u003ENow, that was 16 years ago. How many more people since then have lost their sight, lost function in some part of their body, or just died because of it? People should be able to trust that what they are putting on their skin to protect them will actually help them. Labels on health-related, not cosmetic, products should be accurate. The safety standard for sunscreen should be mandatory. The Minister of Commerce and Consumer Affairs should absolutely recommend the setting of mandatory regulations under the Fair Trading Act to prescribe that standard, and end users should not have to pay extra for their sunscreen because of it.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000610\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227ec53e32-05ab-4c6b-a080-4024e72a9099\u0022\u003EN\u014D reira, I commend this bill to the House. Kia ora.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022cc477162-e622-4c94-add7-36a586729e51\u0022 data-id=\u00225c436aae081c4a1db52f4ac9b84c1972\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000611\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cc477162-e622-4c94-add7-36a586729e51\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00225c436aae081c4a1db52f4ac9b84c1972\u0022\u003ENAISI CHEN (Labour):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Mr Speaker. I\u2019m extremely excited to rise in this House to speak on the sunscreen bill, because I actually have a huge passion, which I don\u2019t think my colleagues probably know this about me, but I feel very strongly about SPF. The reason for that is, while we\u2019ve heard stories from the 1980s and probably earlier from our colleagues across the floor today\u2014OK, probably later\u2014but, Mr Speaker, probably not known to you, but right now SPF is a really, really hot topic in the beauty influencer industry at the moment. SPF has become a really, really, widely talked about topic, no matter whether that\u2019s on your YouTube influencing platforms, or on your podcasts\u2014there\u2019s literally people who make podcasts just about how to wear their SPF\u2014sunscreen has actually come a long way since, you know, the days of maybe what my colleague Todd here was talking about, in terms of there\u2019s so many different ways of protecting yourself against the sun.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000612\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cc477162-e622-4c94-add7-36a586729e51\u0022\u003ESo there are now different types of sunscreens; as we know, there\u2019s the mineral sunscreens, there\u2019s the chemical sunscreens, there\u2019s sunscreens that are specifically formulated to sit under your make-up so that it\u2019s a matt finish, so that it doesn\u2019t have a gleam to it, a white sheen to it. There are specific sunscreens that are formulated for different skin colour as well, so that that white skin doesn\u2019t\u2014you know, it\u2019s not just for people with fairer skin, so that white, creamy kind of colour doesn\u2019t come through your make-up as well. And, of course, now\u2014which I\u2019ve noticed in this bill doesn\u2019t get mentioned\u2014there\u2019s also powdered sunscreen as well. So for people who wear make-up on a day-to-day basis, the powdered sunscreen actually makes it easier for you to touch up your sunscreen\u2014because you\u2019re supposed to reapply sunscreen every two hours\u2014so that you don\u2019t actually ruin your make-up. The matt finish, because of the powder, actually soaks up the excess oil that your skin produces after you\u2019ve put on your initial dose of sunscreen in the morning. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000613\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cc477162-e622-4c94-add7-36a586729e51\u0022\u003ESo what I\u2019m trying to say here today is that sunscreen is absolutely important and on-trend to talk about right now, in this House, and I think it\u2019s extremely important that we have the right legislation to look at what we should be regulating in Aotearoa New Zealand here. I completely recognise my colleague Todd Muller for talking about the outdated ways of how we regulate the sunscreen market, and, actually today, in anticipation of this debate, I actually looked up on the internet what \u201CSPF\u201D actually means. Now we all know that means \u201Csun protection factor\u201D, but how is SPF actually tested, and how do we actually come to the conclusion of what product has which number?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000614\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cc477162-e622-4c94-add7-36a586729e51\u0022\u003ENow, it\u2019s actually really, really interesting\u2014so in order to get the sun protection factor of any product, what you\u2019re supposed to do is on an area of skin, you\u2019re supposed to apply 2 milligrams of sunscreen, and, next to it, a control, which means there\u2019s no sunscreen on another piece of skin. And this is all done by human, like so that\u2019s all done by volunteers in all of these experiments. And then so you expose the same person\u2014usually, I imagine, their back\u2014to a UV lamp, and so when the sun or the UV lamp comes into contact with that volunteer\u2019s skin, the speed to which that skin burns divided by\u2014so the one with sunscreen divided by the one without sunscreen becomes your sun protection factor. So, may I say, science has advanced, has come a really long way since we\u2019ve done things this way, but right now this is still the best way that we have to measure the sun protection factor, which I found actually really, really interesting. So it\u2019s still done by a human way, we have to still just time it by sight to see when someone\u2019s skin burns\u2014yeah, I found that extremely fascinating.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000615\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cc477162-e622-4c94-add7-36a586729e51\u0022\u003ESo I\u2019d be really interested in the select committee stage, which our party supports, to actually hear what people think, not only just about, obviously, the regulations but also about any new advances in technology of how we test the SPF factors; also the different types of sun protection the market now offers, because I see here in the drafting of the bill that in the list here, for example, it only talks about creams, oils, gels, or sprays, and, like I already mentioned at the beginning of my contribution, I would like to see powders to be included in that\u2014and also clothing and fabric as well, because now there is a specific type of jacket that actually protects your skin as well, which is really, really interesting.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000616\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cc477162-e622-4c94-add7-36a586729e51\u0022\u003EAnd so, with that, I would be really excited to hear all the submissions in the select committee process. Thank you Mr Speaker. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022a97e1705-20b1-4844-8140-1090426c1397\u0022 data-id=\u0022983dcadcee8b4bd4bb9fb1d988fe3c4d\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000617\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a97e1705-20b1-4844-8140-1090426c1397\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022983dcadcee8b4bd4bb9fb1d988fe3c4d\u0022\u003EDAMIEN SMITH (ACT):\u003C/span\u003E I had a dream last night about sunscreen. My new friend Kieran McAnulty and I were sitting\u2014it was Easter, we were drinking pints at the Honest Broker, or, sorry, the Honest Lawyer pub in Nelson, and there was extended hours, and it was just like the bills came together. I said to Kieran, \u201CCan we have some more pints? You\u2019re looking a bit red, though, in the face, show us your sunscreen.\u201D And I said, \u201COh, that one\u2019s no good. You should stop taking that.\u201D And then a flash forward to the summer when Mr Nash and I were standing on the beach in our budgie smugglers welcoming back the Australians to our fine beaches, and I said \u201CStuart, why have they got better sun cream than us?\u201D And then my mind turned to the law, a very serious piece of work that needs to be done. But I have a solution which will bridge that.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000618\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a97e1705-20b1-4844-8140-1090426c1397\u0022\u003ESo the bill does require the Minister of Commerce and Consumer Affairs to recommend the setting of mandatory regulation. And by way of background, Mr Muller\u2019s already touched on the standards between Australia and New Zealand, which prescribes product tests and labelling requirements for both broad-based spectrum and water-resistant sunscreen products, and there\u2019s now powders. But both countries take a very different approach to how they apply this. In Australia the standard is mandatory, but here New Zealand\u2019s compliance is voluntary. This means that a sunscreen product in Australia can\u2019t go on to the shelf without meeting the standard but in New Zealand it means that anyone can make a sunscreen and sell it without having to test it provides the claims and protections that it states. There\u2019s clearly a market failure here, and even though the ACT Party is light on regulation, I think this is a good case for it.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000619\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a97e1705-20b1-4844-8140-1090426c1397\u0022\u003ESo the bill requires a sunscreen standard to be set as mandatory in Fair Trading Act regulations. But just to give you a bit of background, I have a 13-year-old daughter who was diagnosed, after a mole check, with an advanced melanoma, which is unheard of, really, at that age. We had to go to the USA for a test because it was actually an adult-type tumour. We were really lucky to catch it at a very early stage, otherwise she mightn\u2019t be here today. But now she\u2019s confined to covering up from exposure at certain times of the day. There needs to be a complete education programme around the use of sunscreen, and also when you should go out, and how you should plan, and there should be professional advice around that.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000620\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a97e1705-20b1-4844-8140-1090426c1397\u0022\u003ESo that\u2019s when I found out about the variability in sunscreens and standards. So we do need to meet our mothers\u2019 and children\u2019s and young adults\u2019 expectations. As for the law, a mandatory requirement may not be necessary to correct this issue. It is likely governed under the Fair Trading Act, but it is misleading. However, a mandatory requirement would ensure that such misleading advertising can be brought more easily into line.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000621\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a97e1705-20b1-4844-8140-1090426c1397\u0022\u003EThe ACT Party has a recommendation. This policy is a very worthy one. On this point, ensuring clear standards and accurate information to consumers is vital. It\u2019s vitally important to mothers, kids, teenagers, and to give them confidence. Moreover, recent reporting has highlighted the dangers to comply with a gap in the current regime. We do see pictures of sunburnt children in the newspapers and on television but there\u2019s nothing worse than seeing them in your own home. But I have lived with that fear and the fear of loss.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000622\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a97e1705-20b1-4844-8140-1090426c1397\u0022\u003EHowever, the method of addressing the policy objective here is peculiar. The bill instructs the Minister to regulate. If the bill has the numbers to pass it will obviously require Labour\u2019s support. If Labour supports the bill it could simply pass an Order in Council instead of wasting Parliament\u2019s time, and that\u2019s no disrespect to the committee stage process. I would plead with them to do that. Arguably, a better medium for this type of policy change would have been through a letter to the Minister.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000623\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a97e1705-20b1-4844-8140-1090426c1397\u0022\u003EGiven the aforementioned, the ACT Party will be supporting the first reading of this bill while making this point. And if Labour is in support, they should regulate immediately rather than wasting Parliament\u2019s time further, and do a sun-loving act to the outdoors people of New Zealand, a great service to all the consumers that use these products. However, if it goes to select committee, we will be supporting that and we will be supporting the first reading. So we\u2019d like that option to be considered. And thank you for the opportunity to speak tonight.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00221cd33f16-add4-4363-a2d4-f457841a5c4c\u0022 data-id=\u00222e0653d9c6d84a4db7b5b43670035e45\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000624\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221cd33f16-add4-4363-a2d4-f457841a5c4c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00222e0653d9c6d84a4db7b5b43670035e45\u0022\u003EGLEN BENNETT (Labour\u2014New Plymouth):\u003C/span\u003E Kia ora, Mr Speaker. Thank you for allowing me to take a call on Todd Muller\u2019s bill, the Sunscreen (Product Safety Standard) Bill. Now, I want to talk this evening on a couple of points. Firstly, and my colleague Jamie Strange mentioned it earlier, around the changing understanding of the impacts of the sun and our response to that. I also want to talk tonight about why I want to support this bill through to select committee and the opportunity not to waste time but to gain knowledge and understanding around this important issue. And, thirdly, I want to talk about the summer of \u201999\u2014not \u201969. I know, for some of you across the other side of the room, that\u2019s their favourite song, but we want to talk about the summer of \u201999. But I\u2019ll get to that very shortly. Bryan Adams, thank you very much! I know him well!\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000625\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221cd33f16-add4-4363-a2d4-f457841a5c4c\u0022\u003ENow, I think back to the mid- to late-70s. My mother was a keen sunbather. I remember the coconut oil smells and all the sorts of things where you were pretty much putting stuff on your body to make you look browner and look more beautiful, evidently, which wasn\u2019t necessary at all. But we\u2019ve changed, obviously, with the ozone layer, with our UV radiation issues. I remember when SPF 4 was it. And if you were SPF 8 or more, you were just like this kind of lightweight who obviously had some terrible skin condition! So it\u2019s changed a lot, thankfully, and I\u2019m really grateful that SPF 50 is now just quite normal to take home or to take to the beach, and you\u2019re not judged whatsoever. But it\u2019s changed, and I\u2019m really surprised, to be honest, that Consumer New Zealand had obviously done those studies, and around five out of those 10 sunscreens actually weren\u2019t as effective or impactful as they should be. So we\u2019ve changed; we\u2019ve come a long way. SPF 4 is long gone, and we need to ensure that SPF 50-plus is just the norm for our society.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000626\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221cd33f16-add4-4363-a2d4-f457841a5c4c\u0022\u003ESecondly, I support the bill to select committee because I want to hear the views of the public. I want to hear people\u2019s lived experiences. I want to hear from professionals, and what\u2019s important there. Because I want to listen, and I enjoy listening and understanding and gaining more knowledge in my kete than I already have. And, as Jamie Strange said earlier, we want to progress regulation of sunscreen products as part, obviously, of the Therapeutic Products Bill, but I am really keen that we can critique and listen and understand in this space, which I\u2019m sure everyone in this House wants to do.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000627\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221cd33f16-add4-4363-a2d4-f457841a5c4c\u0022\u003EFinally, I want to take us back to the summer of 1999. Y2K was on the horizon, but also a beautiful Australian, who I will be able to visit in a few weeks, released a song. His name is Baz Luhrmann, a wonderful opera writer and also, obviously, created some amazing films. Do we remember the sunscreen song? No? Come on!\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000628\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00227601315b6eba43f2a614905eaf2d78c8\u0022\u003EHon Members\u003C/span\u003E: Sing it!\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000629\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221cd33f16-add4-4363-a2d4-f457841a5c4c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002245cb90d8273b4148a8953c71cba85a2d\u0022\u003EGLEN BENNETT\u003C/span\u003E: I was hoping that we would. Well, it\u2019s kind of\u2014it\u2019s a spoken word. I\u2019m not sure what the rules of the House are, but it begins\u2014and I\u2019m sure, because it hit the New Zealand charts, and driving around, actually, Todd Muller\u2019s electorate in that summer, I remember listening to the song time and time again. The words begin like this: \u201CWear sunscreen / If I could offer you one piece of advice for your future, sunscreen would be it / The long-term benefits of sunscreen have been proven by scientists / Whereas the rest of my advice has no basis more reliable than my own meandering experience. I will dispense this advice now\u201D\u2014drop the beat! OK, people don\u2019t remember it, but it\u2019s an amazing song. Please go back. But if I could offer you one piece of advice, sunscreen would be it, and this evening I am here to support this piece of legislation going through to select committee so that I can listen, that I can learn more, and I can ensure that people around our nation are protected from the unfortunate impacts the sun has on us, particularly down here in Aotearoa New Zealand.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000630\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221cd33f16-add4-4363-a2d4-f457841a5c4c\u0022\u003ESo, in closing, our world is changing\u2014our understanding of the sun and how we respond to it. I support this bill to select committee, and don\u2019t forget that summer of \u201999. If I could offer you one piece of advice, sunscreen would be it. Kia ora, Mr Speaker.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002234ec4a4e-60bd-4a4d-b211-10f9324db3ac\u0022 data-id=\u002205b107a5f08445489ef438438da66dc6\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000631\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002234ec4a4e-60bd-4a4d-b211-10f9324db3ac\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002205b107a5f08445489ef438438da66dc6\u0022\u003EDr GAURAV SHARMA (Labour\u2014Hamilton West):\u003C/span\u003E I rise today in the House to take a call on the Sunscreen (Product Safety Standard) Bill. I want to acknowledge in the House Jamie Strange, who just spoke before me as part of our Hamilton contingent. I actually thought it was David Bennett speaking. I didn\u2019t realise it was Glen Bennett speaking before. So I was going to acknowledge the other member of Parliament from Hamilton as well.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000632\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002234ec4a4e-60bd-4a4d-b211-10f9324db3ac\u0022\u003EI was quite impressed to see the passion Jamie showed in talking about this bill. Now, we may not have a beach like Mr Muller\u2019s electorate. I do recall that the last time I put on sunscreen it was actually with both Jamie and David. We were at a community parade. We were all dressed up as clowns. I don\u2019t remember the SPF rating of the sunscreen we applied, but I gather the point that Mr Todd Muller is trying to make here with the introduction of this bill.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000633\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002234ec4a4e-60bd-4a4d-b211-10f9324db3ac\u0022\u003ENow, New Zealand and Australia currently have a shared sunscreen standard which comprehensively prescribes test methods for both broad spectrum and water-resistant sunscreen products\u2014labelling requirements, etc. Despite having a shared standard, though, both countries take a very different approach to application. In Australia, I understand that the standard is mandatory, which means that a product cannot go on to a shelf without meeting the standards, whereas in New Zealand it is voluntary, which is a bit surprising because there was recent testing done by Consumer New Zealand where they found 50 percent of the sunscreens that they tested failed to provide the claims that they had on sun protection. So out of the 10 that they tested, five did not meet the requirements. As for Consumer New Zealand, this wasn\u2019t the first time: some of the brands actually had tested negatively before that as well. So having brands test two or three times negatively is not good for the consumers\u2014for our patients.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000634\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002234ec4a4e-60bd-4a4d-b211-10f9324db3ac\u0022\u003EOne of the things that the Consumer New Zealand chief mentioned was that regulation has been due for a long time, and I understand that\u2019s what Todd is trying to get at. But also, I guess, it\u2019s important to remind ourselves how big the burden of skin cancer is in New Zealand. As my colleague Jamie Strange mentioned, we have one of the highest rates of skin cancers in the world. If you look at melanoma: 35 to 40 people per 100,000 per year. That\u2019s one of the highest age-standardised rates in the world.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000635\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002234ec4a4e-60bd-4a4d-b211-10f9324db3ac\u0022\u003ENow, limiting UV radiation exposure through sun smart behaviour is one of the key ways of preventing these cancers. I speak this as a medical professional in my past life. And if we can\u2019t ensure that the sunscreens that people are applying have the right SPF that they claim to have, then how do you bring down these numbers? So, in theory, this actually makes really good sense, and I think if we take a health-based approach, we definitely would recommend this going to the Health Committee. But, I guess, the bill requires the Minister of Commerce and Consumer Affairs to recommend the setting of mandatory regulation under section 29 of the Fair Trading Act 1986, prescribing a product safety standard for sunscreen products.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000636\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002234ec4a4e-60bd-4a4d-b211-10f9324db3ac\u0022\u003ESo I look forward to this bill going through the select committee stages. I also understand that the Ministry of Health themselves have proposed a different bill altogether, which is the Therapeutic Products Bill, which will be a little bit more comprehensive and will be looking at a few more broader issues, not just the sunscreen itself. But until then, we would like to see what the submissions are on this bill and we would like to hear from other members of the community, and especially the medical community and, obviously, the consumers as well, some of whom might have gotten skin cancer because they didn\u2019t take the right sunscreen, which made claims that obviously weren\u2019t true.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000637\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002234ec4a4e-60bd-4a4d-b211-10f9324db3ac\u0022\u003ESo as far as the bill goes, I would like to support it in terms of a health-based approach to go through the select committee to the next stage to be discussed. I want to thank Todd Muller for bringing this to the House. Thank you.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022861a1798-a396-4a6c-b9e2-7d2f15d4a001\u0022 data-id=\u0022e23ca77d48094581a7298504e70498ee\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000638\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022861a1798-a396-4a6c-b9e2-7d2f15d4a001\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022e23ca77d48094581a7298504e70498ee\u0022\u003EDr SHANE RETI (Deputy Leader\u2014National):\u003C/span\u003E I rise to strongly support this bill and congratulate my colleague Todd Muller on bringing this bill to the House. I do have some experience in this domain. I completed my postgraduate Diploma in Dermatology in Wales and then practised for 20 years as what\u2019s called a \u201CGPSI\u201D GP with a special interest in dermatology. So I have probably seen my fair share of sun-induced and other sorts of cancers and other lesions, and I\u2019m very pleased to see this sort of proposal in front of the House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000639\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022861a1798-a396-4a6c-b9e2-7d2f15d4a001\u0022\u003EI\u2019ve been intrigued and privileged to manage sun-induced conditions for a number of years, melanomas, which I\u2019ve heard my colleagues speak about, which are clearly influenced by the sun; and non-melanoma conditions, the ones that most people have. I\u2019d also just mention that there are some conditions that are very photo-sensitive. Lupus erythematosus, for example, is very sensitive to the sun, and you\u2019d be wanting people with that to be using sunblock as well, but the cancers are the main lesions that we want to be attending to. And, of course, these talk to the properties of UVB, and the more ubiquitous rays and then the less defined UVA, and I\u2019ll talk about that a little bit further when we get into the sunblocks. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000640\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022861a1798-a396-4a6c-b9e2-7d2f15d4a001\u0022\u003ESunblocks generally work in two basic categories. They\u2019re reflective or absorbent. The reflective ones basically look to bounce the sun\u2019s rays away. So that\u2019s what the zincs and the titanium oxides do\u2014they\u2019re reflective sunblocks. Their trade-off is that they\u2019re a bit gluggy. They block the pores on the skin. That\u2019s what you see the cricketers wear\u2014you\u2019ve heard of the zinc and various other things. But that\u2019s their mechanism of action\u2014they\u2019re reflective. They bounce the sun\u2019s rays away. The others are absorptive, and what they do is they absorb the sun and use the energy of the sun to break chemical bonds and form two, three, or four inert chemicals. I know that at one point in time, there was some concern around whether those inert chemicals could themselves be troublesome, but that hasn\u2019t proven to be so. I\u2019m talking about things like PABAs, the para-aminobenzoic acids, and those sorts of things. They were very, very common in the early years for sunblocks and even today you\u2019ll still see them.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000641\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022861a1798-a396-4a6c-b9e2-7d2f15d4a001\u0022\u003EThis bill specifically talks to the SPF. We\u2019ve heard people talk about how that\u2019s assessed, and it\u2019s quite right. You apply sunblock to skin that is exposed and not exposed, a certain layer\u20142 milligrams per millimetre as I recall\u2014and then you basically irradiate them and look for where you get minimal redness and compare the time to get minimal redness in an area that is covered and an area that is not, and you do a formulaic division, and that gives you the SPF. This mainly talks to UVB. UVA is not quite so clear, and, in fact, we use something called persistent pigment darkening to determine what the UVA category is. As you\u2019ll see, UVA comes into the broad sun spectrum sunblocks\u2014less easy to measure but primarily SPF is talking about UVB, and I\u2019m sure we\u2019ll hear more about that in select committee.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000642\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022861a1798-a396-4a6c-b9e2-7d2f15d4a001\u0022\u003EThe author of this bill notes that when products failed, to quote consumer reports, they failed significantly. A number of them were rated at 50\u002B, and when they were independently tested they turned out to be about 20\u002B, so not even close\u2014actually half of what they were promoting. I think when we focus on the SPF factor in this bill, it strikes me that it\u2019s not a bill of science. It\u2019s a bill of consumer affairs because it fundamentally says that what we want is for you to be honest with your labelling, honest with your claims, honest with your statements. You do need to have the laboratory certification to back up the statements you\u2019re making. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000643\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022861a1798-a396-4a6c-b9e2-7d2f15d4a001\u0022\u003EWe\u2019ve made the comparison with what they do in Australia. We have a voluntary code which is clearly not working. Australia has mandated it. But if we look across the world it\u2019s also widespread as to how they regulate sunblock. The European Commission doesn\u2019t let you label sunscreens with an SPF less than six, but everything greater than six can be called \u201Cbroad spectrum.\u201D As we commented, between ourselves and Australia we do have some consistent standards; it\u2019s just how we apply them that is different. The USA, through the Food and Drug Administration, has a completely different range. The real difference tends to be around the broad-spectrum, which is the UVA component.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000644\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022861a1798-a396-4a6c-b9e2-7d2f15d4a001\u0022\u003EI\u2019m sure we\u2019ll hear more about all of this and maybe even get to apply some of them in select committee. I\u2019m really looking forward to that coming. This is a really good consumer affairs bill. This is just about honest trading. The science is well known, the science is accepted, and it\u2019s very timely for this bill to come to the House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000645\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022861a1798-a396-4a6c-b9e2-7d2f15d4a001\u0022\u003EOne recommendation\u2014as everyone is sharing their moments\u2014is that I\u2019ve said to my daughters for a long time that the cheapest Botox they will ever use is sunblock. Use it during the winter, use it during the summer. I generally say to them, \u201CChoose your favourite moisturiser and then find something with at least SPF15 in it\u201D, because I find that cosmetically they don\u2019t get concerned about blocking the sun\u2014you know, put your sunblock on and you\u2019ll get acne; all that sort of trade-off, and I think they\u2019ve been pleased. And I used to say to my patients as well that the cheapest Botox they\u2019ll ever use is sunblock.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000646\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022861a1798-a396-4a6c-b9e2-7d2f15d4a001\u0022\u003ESo I\u2019m a strong supporter of sunblock. I look forward to this bill coming to the select committee. It\u2019s an excellent bill. Thank you, Todd.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00228e5576ce-ac6e-42fa-8d46-bdec9ba3ec7c\u0022 data-id=\u0022e2bc815fedfe4a0f81d2c9585408cb67\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000647\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00228e5576ce-ac6e-42fa-8d46-bdec9ba3ec7c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022e2bc815fedfe4a0f81d2c9585408cb67\u0022\u003EDr ANAE NERU LEAVASA (Labour\u2014Takanini):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Mr Speaker. I would like to commend the member Mr Todd Muller for bringing this bill to the House, and I\u2019m grateful to have the opportunity to take a call on the Sunscreen (Product Safety Standard) Bill.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000648\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00228e5576ce-ac6e-42fa-8d46-bdec9ba3ec7c\u0022\u003EI\u2019ve heard all the stories about sunscreen. I think I have a story, in terms of a brown fulla. What\u2019s sunscreen got to do with a brown fulla? Well, actually there is still a risk with getting skin cancers as a dark-skinned guy. I remember my time in Samoa, walking around in the villages, on the beach at Lalomanu or Falelatai, and just putting it on my face. But then, you know, I got my shoulders exposed, my back exposed, and then later that evening I had a really sore shoulder and sore back and then the next following days peeling from the sunburn. It\u2019s really important not only for our fair-skinned populations, but also for my Pacific Islanders as well. It\u2019s important because there\u2019s always a risk to get skin cancers. The three most common being BCCs, basal cell carcinomas, squamous cell carcinomas, or melanomas as well. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000649\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00228e5576ce-ac6e-42fa-8d46-bdec9ba3ec7c\u0022\u003EAccording to the bill\u2014I\u2019ll just touch on a few points\u2014the bill requires the Minister of Commerce and Consumer Affairs to recommend the making of regulations under section 29 of the Fair Trading Act 1986. Also it states that the product safety standard\u2014again, we\u2019ve heard from other colleagues about making sure that it is up to New Zealand sunscreen standard, NZS 2604:2012.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000650\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00228e5576ce-ac6e-42fa-8d46-bdec9ba3ec7c\u0022\u003EWe are supporting this, like many of my colleagues have said, to select committee. But the huge thing I want to touch on is the health-based approach. The member before me, Dr Shane Reti, being a primary care physician himself\u2014we see a lot of skin conditions coming through the doors. Sometimes it\u2019s a bit late. We always say prevention\u2019s better than cure, and sometimes we get a lot of our patients turning up, and assessing their skin conditions we may have to do excision biopsies, shave biopsies, or refer on to dermatologists as well. I think this is a good time to acknowledge the work that is done by our primary care colleagues, our dermatologists, our specialists in the health system that do care for skin cancers in the system. But, again, it\u2019s all about prevention, and this is what the bill aims to do.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000651\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00228e5576ce-ac6e-42fa-8d46-bdec9ba3ec7c\u0022\u003EWe\u2019ve heard about the Consumer New Zealand testing, with five out of 10 last year being false, not reaching the SPF factor that they claim to have. Also, when I look at SPF, sun protection factors, the SPF 50\u002B filters about 98 percent of UVB. I\u2019ll just touch on the UVA, ultraviolet A radiation, UVB, and UVC. UVA is 95 percent of radiation that we do get that penetrates the atmosphere and has a low energy compared to UVB, so it doesn\u2019t do as much damage compared to UVB, and that\u2019s why we see in our sunscreen products that we try to target UVB. When we talk about broad spectrum, it\u2019s trying to target both the UVA and UVB. UVC is pretty much absorbed by the atmosphere, so we don\u2019t provide products such as that.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000652\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00228e5576ce-ac6e-42fa-8d46-bdec9ba3ec7c\u0022\u003EThat\u2019s why this bill is really important, to make sure that what we\u2019re giving out, whether it\u2019s been clinicians advising patients to put on SPF 30 or SPF 50\u002B, is to make sure that we are protecting our wh\u0101nau from these skin cancers as mentioned before. Again, SPF 50\u002B filters 98 percent of UVB compared to the SPF 30, that filters up to 96 percent, 97 percent as well.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000653\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00228e5576ce-ac6e-42fa-8d46-bdec9ba3ec7c\u0022\u003EWhen I look at the risk with our patients, whether it be older adults or fair skinned, again, like I said, dark skinned populations as well, those who have a family history, it\u2019s really important that we get things right. It\u2019s really important that our manufacturers are providing products that do meet the standard, and this bill aims to do that. This is all about protecting our wh\u0101nau, protecting those who are at risk of getting skin cancers, and making sure that the product is doing what it\u2019s claiming to do. So that\u2019s why I commend this bill to the House. Thank you.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022e7bab061-0905-44a1-a4ec-cf89b58a1baf\u0022 data-id=\u00224943e8d08f7d487d97b6abcd01fe366c\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000654\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e7bab061-0905-44a1-a4ec-cf89b58a1baf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00224943e8d08f7d487d97b6abcd01fe366c\u0022\u003ESARAH PALLETT (Labour\u2014Ilam):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you so much, Mr Speaker. I rise this evening to speak to the Sunscreen (Product Safety Standard) Bill that has\u2014and I congratulate Mr Todd \u201COn-trend\u201D Muller for bringing this bill to the House for our discussion. I was really interested to hear my colleague Naisi Chen talking with such enthusiasm and information sharing. I didn\u2019t actually realise that you could get sunscreen in powder form but it does sound like a really good opportunity for those of us who actually want to continue to apply it over our make-up. But it is a serious issue, and as you\u2019ve heard my colleagues on this side of the House say, we are supporting this bill to go forward to select committee.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000655\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e7bab061-0905-44a1-a4ec-cf89b58a1baf\u0022\u003EI was actually genuinely quite shocked to see when the news came forward about five out of 10 products, as we\u2019ve repeatedly heard, being tested by Consumer NZ not meeting the SPF claims, and rather than mention brands, I just would direct people towards the article by RNZ if people want to get further information on that. Because I do think it\u2019s really important that we\u2019re aware of what\u2019s in the bottles of sunscreen that we all rely upon\u2014and we really do rely on them being accurate. New Zealand, as we\u2019ve heard, has a really high rate of skin cancer and melanoma, and if this is preventable, it\u2019s really important that we\u2019re able to prevent that accurately.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000656\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e7bab061-0905-44a1-a4ec-cf89b58a1baf\u0022\u003ENow, looking at me, you correctly guess that, like Mr Muller, I do need to apply effective sunscreen. I\u2019m looking at many of my colleagues across the House who would fall into the same category. My partner would also be on the fair side, and probably burns even more than I do. I know that in my youth, which was not in the 80s, we used to go to the\u2014well, I say \u201Cwe\u201D; I actually didn\u2019t do this\u2014but my friends used to go to the chemist, which was the only place you could buy olive oil, and apply it to themselves in order to actually achieve that desirable tan. I mean, here you wouldn\u2019t\u2014I was in the UK, and even though I was in the beautiful and very sunny island of Jersey, the sun didn\u2019t carry quite the same strength to it in terms of capacity to burn as it does in New Zealand. My partner, as I said, who is fairer than me, actually was raised in the north of England where I don\u2019t believe the sun shines very frequently. But when we came to New Zealand, we found ourselves covering up and scampering from shadow to shadow, and relying really heavily on that sunscreen.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000657\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e7bab061-0905-44a1-a4ec-cf89b58a1baf\u0022\u003EOf course, the sun is almost always shining in Ilam, the electorate that I represent, and it\u2019s very important that we are covering up and using good sunscreen. But I did, myself, fall foul of this sunscreen inadequate labelling. Earlier on in my time in New Zealand, I had to spend much of the day outside and couldn\u2019t achieve the shade that I would have preferred to achieve, and was really relying on constant application of sunscreen. Unfortunately, I was using one of the brands that was found to be actually delivering a less-than-adequate level of protection, and burnt really badly. Fortunately I haven\u2019t ended up with serious consequences so far, that my colleague Elizabeth Kerekere described earlier.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000658\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e7bab061-0905-44a1-a4ec-cf89b58a1baf\u0022\u003EI was interested to find out, too, that SPF\u2014we\u2019ve heard lots of people talking about it, but I didn\u2019t actually realise until this evening that what it actually means is that an SPF 15, for example, would mean that 1/15th of the burning radiation reaches your skin. SPF 50 would mean that 1/50th of the actual burning radiation would reach your skin. So you can see there\u2019s a really big difference in the impact on your skin, and it\u2019s incredibly important that we are able to achieve an accurate understanding of what we\u2019re applying to ourselves. So I do look forward to receiving this in select committee should this bill pass forward, which I hope it will, and certainly we are in support of that.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000659\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e7bab061-0905-44a1-a4ec-cf89b58a1baf\u0022\u003EI\u2019m looking forward to hearing more from the public, and I\u2019m looking forward to hearing more from people like my colleague Naisi Chen, who may be able to share some even more interesting experiences and further products that can mean that we\u2019re further on trend. So I do commend this bill to select committee, and thank you again for bringing it forward.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022fdb01002-a7cf-4a77-8f05-678d24a36849\u0022 data-id=\u0022461d9fbc38ef4206bb1a11e9fc030a46\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000660\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022fdb01002-a7cf-4a77-8f05-678d24a36849\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022461d9fbc38ef4206bb1a11e9fc030a46\u0022\u003ETODD MULLER (National\u2014Bay of Plenty):\u003C/span\u003E Look, thank you, Mr Speaker. Can I, firstly, thank the House for their endorsement of this bill. It\u2019s always very exciting, particularly when you\u2019re an Opposition MP, to put up a bill that gets the level of support that this does, and I appreciate and thank all of the contributors to the debate. It\u2019s been quite an interesting debate, really. It\u2019s had moments of high humour, and also underpinning actually everyone\u2019s contribution is an acknowledgment of the serious issue that we\u2019re trying to address here. I\u2019d have to say there were times through Naisi Chen\u2019s contribution that I felt that I\u2019d reached the pinnacle of my political career. I mean, to be described as \u201Con trend\u201D. I don\u2019t think I\u2019m going to be able to beat that in the time that I\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000661\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ee649aea-c6fa-4610-9fcf-5c4bb2d3cd33\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022ffe3dfd0dbc847f0a0e19749b38fe6d2\u0022\u003EMatt Doocey\u003C/span\u003E: First time ever.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000662\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022fdb01002-a7cf-4a77-8f05-678d24a36849\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022d9202ba1b1494c5cb6227290d4652346\u0022\u003ETODD MULLER\u003C/span\u003E: It\u2019s not only the first time ever\u2014I have teenage children who I\u2019m going to remind of that accolade time and time again, because from their perspective, I\u2019m the opposite of on trend, so this is great to have it confirmed here in this House so publicly, and I really appreciated her enthusiasm, somewhat surprising enthusiasm, actually, for what we are seeking to do.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000663\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022fdb01002-a7cf-4a77-8f05-678d24a36849\u0022\u003EBut I thought if I can, in conclusion, just acknowledge Damien Smith\u2019s contribution because, you know, he talked to the seriousness that sits behind this. We are a country that is hugely exposed to skin cancer in terms of incidence across our population. It is one of the cancers that is at a level the easiest to avoid if you are very focused on applying sunscreen and protecting yourself from our sun. And New Zealanders expect that when they put sunscreen on and they are fulfilling their part of the bargain of protecting themselves, they have confidence that the sun protection factor that\u2019s on the label is indeed what\u2019s in the bottle, and I think it\u2019s heartening to hear the collective support around that intent. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000664\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022fdb01002-a7cf-4a77-8f05-678d24a36849\u0022\u003EI acknowledge, of course, the Labour Party\u2019s support for this. We all appreciate that if they don\u2019t see the merit in a bill, however flawed that perspective might be in previous bills, things don\u2019t progress. So I do appreciate the fact that they have seen the merit in this bill. Obviously, a lot of focus and repetition of the fact that the support lies to the first reading and we see where we go with the select committee. I do hope that we have significant contribution from people who have been affected, those who are involved in this particular issue in an advocacy perspective, and also that the Government reflects actually very fairly on the time it will take for the therapeutic products bill to be finalised, to have stakeholder engagement, and then to progress through this House. I think, based on our initial approaches on the bill ourselves when we were in Government, it\u2019s a very complex bill that only becomes more complex if you\u2019re going to integrate the natural health products, which, I understand, the Government are minded to do. So it is likely that that will take time. And in the meantime, we have a bill that has the support of the House, I know has the support of the country, and I think we can progress this in a way that will actually deliver some value to the wider community, regardless of our political persuasion. So thank you. I appreciate the support and I look to forward to participating with others in the Health Committee to debate it. Thank you.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000665\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022fdb01002-a7cf-4a77-8f05-678d24a36849\u0022\u003EMotion agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000666\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022fdb01002-a7cf-4a77-8f05-678d24a36849\u0022\u003EBill read a first time. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022a434482b-7ac1-4862-9ce7-13e63289dee3\u0022 data-id=\u002206a0bb93ee64477b9490f9ddd63c0b99\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000667\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a434482b-7ac1-4862-9ce7-13e63289dee3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002206a0bb93ee64477b9490f9ddd63c0b99\u0022\u003EDEPUTY SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: The question is, That the Sunscreen (Product Safety Standard) Bill be considered by the Health Committee.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000668\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a434482b-7ac1-4862-9ce7-13e63289dee3\u0022\u003EMotion agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000669\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a434482b-7ac1-4862-9ce7-13e63289dee3\u0022\u003EBill referred to the Health Committee.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n    \u003C/div\u003E\n    \u003Cdiv class=\u0022HpsHansard\u0022\u003E\n      \u003Cp\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsProceedingHeading\u0022\u003EBills\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000670\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u00227f90be6ce78a434d837ac3c157d20595\u0022\u003EPolicing (Killing a Police Dog) Amendment Bill\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000671\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u002257cd3ea24734491da9179ec0e14cea25\u0022\u003EFirst Reading\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022ee649aea-c6fa-4610-9fcf-5c4bb2d3cd33\u0022 data-id=\u00228e5fb52cb82449c09ca3ec1373b0a333\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000672\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ee649aea-c6fa-4610-9fcf-5c4bb2d3cd33\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00228e5fb52cb82449c09ca3ec1373b0a333\u0022\u003EMATT DOOCEY (National\u2014Waimakariri):\u003C/span\u003E I move, That the Policing (Killing a Police Dog) Amendment Bill be now read a first time. I nominate the Governance and Administration Committee to consider the bill. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000673\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ee649aea-c6fa-4610-9fcf-5c4bb2d3cd33\u0022\u003EThe purpose of this bill that we will be debating tonight is to amend the Policing Act 2008 to increase the penalty for killing a police dog from a maximum of two years, to a maximum of five years\u2019 imprisonment. The bill replaces section 53 of the Policing Act 2008 to extend the maximum imprisonment for killing a police dog from the current two-year maximum to a new maximum of five years. The current maximum fine of $15,000 remains unchanged. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000674\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ee649aea-c6fa-4610-9fcf-5c4bb2d3cd33\u0022\u003EOne of the absolute joys of being an elected representative is to take the views of your constituency to Parliament, and I love opening my doors in my electoral office with a range of people coming in with a range of issues and ideas that they want to champion forward, and what I love about my electorate of Waimakariri is they are an electorate that cares. They care very deeply, not only about people, but about animals. In fact, I\u2019d say Waimakariri represents and reflects New Zealand at its best. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000675\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ee649aea-c6fa-4610-9fcf-5c4bb2d3cd33\u0022\u003EI remember the day when the media covered the tragic death of the police dog Gazza, and I received, like many members of Parliament in this House, a number of emails and phone calls where people were appalled that that would happen in New Zealand. What people ended up being absolutely more exercised about was the lenient punishment that we have in New Zealand for killing a police dog, and I want to take the time to acknowledge one constituent, Thomas Tripp, who I know will be watching this tonight. Thomas is a caring man, and it was his idea for this bill, to increase the penalty, as a tougher penalty, as a tougher way, of supporting our police dogs, and I want to acknowledge his work in getting this bill here today, because what this bill is about is caring for the service dogs that go out and protect us. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000676\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ee649aea-c6fa-4610-9fcf-5c4bb2d3cd33\u0022\u003EI want to start off by putting it in the words of Chris Cahill, president of the New Zealand Police Association, who supports this bill. To quote the New Zealand Police Association, because I think they put it in a very articulate way: \u201CA police dog is a key part of a police team, and within police, any act of violence towards the police dogs is considered similar to an attack on a police officer. It is a direct attack on law and order and needs to be recognised for the serious offence it is.\u201D \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000677\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ee649aea-c6fa-4610-9fcf-5c4bb2d3cd33\u0022\u003EWe also note the cost of training a police dog is considerable. I think those words sum it up quite eloquently from me: an attack on a police dog in New Zealand is considered similar to an attack on a police officer. That\u2019s the view of the many men and women in blue who serve out country. They go out every day and every night to keep us safe. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000678\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ee649aea-c6fa-4610-9fcf-5c4bb2d3cd33\u0022\u003EI was actually surprised when I worked with Thomas Tripp about this bill and we looked at the penalties, comparatively, overseas, and it is interesting. We are quite lenient compared to other jurisdictions. In the United States it is up to 10 years\u2019 imprisonment; Canada, up to five years; and South Australia up to five years. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000679\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ee649aea-c6fa-4610-9fcf-5c4bb2d3cd33\u0022\u003EIn fact, only through this bill now being pulled out of the ballot, with the Attorney-General\u2019s New Zealand Bill of Rights Act report, I\u2019ve since learnt that there actually is an inequity, currently, in New Zealand statutes, because the Animal Welfare Act puts the penalty as up to five years. However, in the Policing Act, it\u2019s capped at up to two years. I would argue there is not one New Zealander who would say that that is fair and that is right. The reason I am confident of that is because many in this House would have seen on my social media that I put up a petition in the last week. That has received thousands of signatures, because what we know in New Zealand is we care about people but also about animals\u2014more so our hard-working police dogs that serve us, to keep our families and to keep our communities safe. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000680\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ee649aea-c6fa-4610-9fcf-5c4bb2d3cd33\u0022\u003EWe have around 132 police dogs in New Zealand, nine in training. It costs over $60,000 to train a police dog, and they are called out over 40,000 times a year. Sadly, in New Zealand, we\u2019ve lost a number of police dogs; and not only have we lost a number of police dogs in service but a large number of police dogs have been injured in service, as well. Those dogs quite often not only go out on the beat with our hard-working servicemen and women but also they\u2019re family pets. They go home to kids at night, and under the current law in New Zealand, it\u2019s a two-year penalty. How is that fair? \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000681\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ee649aea-c6fa-4610-9fcf-5c4bb2d3cd33\u0022\u003EI\u2019m not saying this is the biggest bill around\u2014this isn\u2019t going to change the fabric of New Zealand\u2014but what I\u2019m doing is bringing the voice of people I represent, and this is the right thing to do for New Zealand\u2019s Parliament tonight. Gazza, the dog this bill was based on, was the seventh dog that we\u2019ve lost in the line of duty since 1972. Twenty-four police dogs have died in the line of duty. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000682\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ee649aea-c6fa-4610-9fcf-5c4bb2d3cd33\u0022\u003EWhat I\u2019d like to see tonight is the support of all political parties to send this to select committee, because I actually think we can look at other types of service animals and how we look to protect them, and I\u2019m looking forward to the submissions that we are going to receive. I\u2019ve also had a suggestion by the New Zealand Police Association, who want to add to proposed new section 53A a provision around reckless disregard for the safety of a police dog: \u201CBecause the concept of reckless disregard is consistent with the wording in the Crimes Act, our reasoning for this suggestion is that showing reckless disregard covers a possible loophole for an offender to believe that they were trying to stop the dog biting them, or trying to get away from the dog and didn\u2019t intend to kill it.\u201D This is the wish of the New Zealand Police force. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000683\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ee649aea-c6fa-4610-9fcf-5c4bb2d3cd33\u0022\u003EI carry also the wishes of the people of Waimakariri, and the thousands of people that have signed the petition, but what I took the greatest heart from was an email I received yesterday from the police dog handler of Gazza, who had tragically lost his dog. He had heard about this bill through some of his police colleagues. He was stoked. He was stoked that this bill would come forward and would actually recognise the service of the police dogs and the protection they provide our families and our communities. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000684\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ee649aea-c6fa-4610-9fcf-5c4bb2d3cd33\u0022\u003ESo I\u2019m looking forward to full support for this bill tonight. I genuinely think, although a small bill, it is significant. It shows we care and we have full respect for police, and also for the police dogs that serve them well. Thank you, Mr Speaker.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022a434482b-7ac1-4862-9ce7-13e63289dee3\u0022 data-id=\u002217405af0646b4cc8b6f3c4f3c5a674ff\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000685\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a434482b-7ac1-4862-9ce7-13e63289dee3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002217405af0646b4cc8b6f3c4f3c5a674ff\u0022\u003EDEPUTY SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: The question is that the motion be agreed to. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022c21f4beb-20c4-4b12-bc6f-fdc931e2dc96\u0022 data-id=\u0022e3978ed41e0c46ddb4de5172e9093655\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000686\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c21f4beb-20c4-4b12-bc6f-fdc931e2dc96\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022e3978ed41e0c46ddb4de5172e9093655\u0022\u003EGINNY ANDERSEN (Labour\u2014Hutt South):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Mr Speaker. I would like to thank Mr Doocey for his contribution tonight and acknowledge the fact that so many New Zealanders have wholeheartedly contributed to a matter that is dear to all of our hearts. In fact, we respect the duty that is done not only by police officers and the back-up staff of the police service but also police dogs. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000687\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c21f4beb-20c4-4b12-bc6f-fdc931e2dc96\u0022\u003EI\u2019m going to be honest: tonight I will speak from the heart to say that my husband served in the New Zealand Police for 25 years, and Mark Mitchell will know that because he served alongside him as a dog handler. My husband was unfortunate enough to lose a dog in the line of duty. So I can say that within our household, we know firsthand the ability of dogs to track offenders where no human can do so, and the ability that they provide to the justice system to make sure that offenders are held accountable and victims receive the justice that they deserve. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000688\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c21f4beb-20c4-4b12-bc6f-fdc931e2dc96\u0022\u003EI think it is also important to acknowledge the bond that exists between a dog handler and the dog. That is probably unimaginable for most of us, so to lose a dog, whether that be through accident or through the harm done by an offender, is a huge thing to think about and a huge thing to imagine. I think that is why we have the memorial at the Police College which records the name of every single dog handler who has lost a dog in the line of duty. I always look proudly to see my husband\u2019s name there. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000689\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c21f4beb-20c4-4b12-bc6f-fdc931e2dc96\u0022\u003EThe practicality is that when someone kills a dog in the line of duty, that is not the single motive that they thought about when they woke up that day. They commit a series of offences. Some of those are against police officers, some of those are against property, and some of those are against members of the public, so when a police prosecutor charges someone for killing or hurting a police dog, it is a series of charges that are laid. In those charges it is very interesting to look over the history to see the time served for that particular offence. So the problem that I have is that increasing the current penalty from two years to five years seems to not really understand or even, I guess, identify the problem this piece of legislation is trying to address. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000690\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c21f4beb-20c4-4b12-bc6f-fdc931e2dc96\u0022\u003EI would like to know the nature of the problem. I agree\u2014I see that there is a great need for support, for understanding of those on the front line, and for compassion and understanding when we lose a police dog. But I would find it hard to understand in real terms how you would have a specific instance where an offender would be charged alone with killing a police dog. Therefore, that is probably why we have never seen, as far as I can ascertain from looking through the list of police dogs that have been lost in front-line duty, where anyone has ever served that time of two years. Currently, that time is at the discretion of judges and it has never been served currently. So I would question what the merit is of extending that period from two years to five years when I can\u2019t see how that is currently, in the history of these instances, being actually administered to someone who\u2019s been accused of this offence and held to be accountable for it.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000691\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c21f4beb-20c4-4b12-bc6f-fdc931e2dc96\u0022\u003ESo I would also go back to looking, to try and understand the thinking of the member Mr Doocey, how he came to this. The point was that there was a particular instance, I understand\u2014and I may be enlightened at the end of this debate\u2014where a police dog was injured, and that took action to bring this member\u2019s bill to the House. But the problem I have is that the bill that\u2019s been put forward by the member leaves the penalty for injuring a police dog unchanged, meaning that it would have no impact, for example, on the person who injured but did not kill the dog. But for the police dog in the case that inspired Mr Doocey, that was exactly what happened. So it is fundamentally unclear that the higher sentence in this bill would provide any significant deterrent against dogs being killed or even, in fact, injured in the line of duty. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000692\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c21f4beb-20c4-4b12-bc6f-fdc931e2dc96\u0022\u003EOffenders who kill or injure a police dog are often, as I\u2019ve said, charged with more serious crimes, and I\u2019d like to provide members with a particular example. Christopher Graham Smith, who killed police dog Gage in 2010, also pled guilty to the attempted murder of Senior Constable Bruce Lamb, and, subsequently, he received 14 years in prison. So the point I\u2019m trying to get to is I\u2019m really keen to understand an instance in New Zealand\u2019s history where the particular offence that the member has identified would actually occur. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000693\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c21f4beb-20c4-4b12-bc6f-fdc931e2dc96\u0022\u003EWhat the bill does is increase the maximum penalty from two to five years, and the main point, from what I understand from what the member has unpacked thus far, is that this would be a deterrent. So the person who set out to do a bunch of other offences or who was in the commission of those would somehow be deterred from injuring the police dog in that range of other instances of, potentially, murder, property damage\u2014the person would be deterred from the police dog offence if we increase the penalty from two to five years, and that\u2019s kind of where I have the problem. That\u2019s the wider kind of problem that sits with the National Party, in that if you just increase the penalty, then that will somehow change how people think or operate. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000694\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c21f4beb-20c4-4b12-bc6f-fdc931e2dc96\u0022\u003EWe see it time and time again with a range of offences, whether it be failing to stop, whether it be making it illegal to be a gang member. I clearly remember having to advise Judith Collins, who was then the Minister of Police, when she asked how many we convicted of those people who are in a gang because we made it illegal, and the answer, I think, was zero at the time and she was really cross about that. We had to explain that when someone gets charged for being a gang member, they\u2019ve often done a bunch of other stuff, and so those things are the primary offences. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000695\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c21f4beb-20c4-4b12-bc6f-fdc931e2dc96\u0022\u003ESo I think what really underlies this is the lack of understanding from those members opposite of how the real world actually works\u2014of how prosecution, how front-line policing, and how the real world actually works. Yep, police dogs are important. Yes, we love them\u2014we would never do a bad thing to them. People would die for them, but the reality is, and how the justice system works, is that people get charged with more than just killing or wounding a dog. That is the truth of the matter. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000696\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c21f4beb-20c4-4b12-bc6f-fdc931e2dc96\u0022\u003ESo if you want to create a meaningful and good outcome, you would be resourcing and making sure there are better efforts in that space, but merely increasing a penalty from two to five years fails to address what you\u2019re trying to fix. I don\u2019t even, actually, to be honest, know what the problem is that they\u2019re trying to fix indeed, because while they\u2019ve said some really good things that connect emotionally, I fail to see what the actual problem that this member\u2019s bill attempts to fix is, and I think that the member opposite knows that quite clearly. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000697\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c21f4beb-20c4-4b12-bc6f-fdc931e2dc96\u0022\u003EI would like to really spend the last part of my speech acknowledging the work that New Zealand Police do on a day-to-day basis, the fact that they put their lives on the line on a daily basis, the fact that they work so hard making sure that people are safe in their homes, no matter where we go along the streets\u2014whether it\u2019s Courtenay Place\u2014in terms of family violence, or making sure our roads are safe, they do an amazing job. They go above and beyond. Quite frankly, I think they deserve more than being politicised by trying to increase a penalty on a dog being killed from two to five years, and I think the member opposite knows that as well. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000698\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c21f4beb-20c4-4b12-bc6f-fdc931e2dc96\u0022\u003ESo I would like to thank the member opposite for his good intent in an area where I think that he\u2019s got all the right feelings and emotions in place, and I agree with those. However, I would like to point out that his understanding of practicality and how the real world operates and how people are prosecuted for offences\u2014what he would propose when it\u2019s applied in practicality would have an unworkable effect on day-to-day life. That is the primary reason why Labour will not be supporting this bill. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002219ed20db-5d6c-4464-9327-6cdd072bb4fe\u0022 data-id=\u0022606fe7f3473f45588bc9478e2476363e\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000699\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002219ed20db-5d6c-4464-9327-6cdd072bb4fe\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022606fe7f3473f45588bc9478e2476363e\u0022\u003ERICARDO MEN\u00C9NDEZ MARCH (Green):\u003C/span\u003E T\u0113n\u0101 koe, Mr Speaker. I rise to speak in regards to the Policing (Killing a Police Dog) Amendment Bill, and I believe it\u2019s\u2014no pun intended\u2014nothing short of a dog whistle. The purpose of this bill, to increase the penalty for killing a police dog from a maximum of two years to five years of imprisonment under section 53 of the Policing Act 2008, won\u2019t result in keeping people safe. It also goes against our Green Party\u2019s policy that aims towards a rehabilitative purpose. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000700\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002219ed20db-5d6c-4464-9327-6cdd072bb4fe\u0022\u003EIt is highly unlikely that increasing the penalty for killing a police dog will actually reduce instances of this crime. As the member to my left pointed out, addressing the issue of violent crime doesn\u2019t come from imprisonment; it actually comes from addressing the determinants that lead people to commit crimes in the first place. So to follow the example of the US or Canada or Australia\u2014who all have mass incarceration problems, who all have issues of inequities within the prison system\u2014is not a model that I would like this House to follow. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000701\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002219ed20db-5d6c-4464-9327-6cdd072bb4fe\u0022\u003EWe know\u2014and I\u2019m quoting here a piece from Mark Hanna titled \u201CWe need to talk about police dogs\u201D, published in Honest Universe\u2014that there\u2019s also a wider issue with the use of police dogs in general and the fact that despite being used at only 6.9 percent of incidents in 2018 where police used force, attack dogs actually caused more than half the moderate and serious injuries inflicted by police that year. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000702\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022071f7800-2755-41b6-83df-07ebaf867ae2\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002202b49e86d3204ae8bd6995870b28278c\u0022\u003ETim van de Molen\u003C/span\u003E: What\u2019s an attack dog? \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000703\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002219ed20db-5d6c-4464-9327-6cdd072bb4fe\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002257c6543ba4914f01a9820eac848f1aa7\u0022\u003ERICARDO MEN\u00C9NDEZ MARCH\u003C/span\u003E: It\u2019s a police dog that is used to attack. We have to make it clear that the purpose and the use of these dogs ultimately results in harm. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000704\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002219ed20db-5d6c-4464-9327-6cdd072bb4fe\u0022\u003EWe also want to bring to attention the data from 2020, in May, \u201Cabout the high proportion of mental health or emotional distress in incidents where people were hospitalised by [police] dog injuries\u201D, and despite the \u201CNZ Police [defending] their use of this extremely dangerous tactical option\u201D, we know that ultimately M\u0101ori were disproportionately affected by this. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000705\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022071f7800-2755-41b6-83df-07ebaf867ae2\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00220469cd06f4754741b30d35a34e50e23a\u0022\u003ETim van de Molen\u003C/span\u003E: So they\u2019re racist dogs too? \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000706\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002219ed20db-5d6c-4464-9327-6cdd072bb4fe\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022159d588f063a4bf9b739af6267305986\u0022\u003ERICARDO MEN\u00C9NDEZ MARCH\u003C/span\u003E: Well, as the members to our right will point out, dogs may not be racist, but our criminal justice system and prison system is, and this bill will just not address any of these issues. If the members to the right are so concerned about keeping people safe, they may as well be supporting issues like increasing benefits, public housing, and preventative approaches to our justice system. The Green Party won\u2019t stand by dog-whistle politics that will not keep people safe, and we will not be recommending this bill to the select committee. Kia ora. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002283dca3a7-93a6-4a78-a313-6fce42ebe49e\u0022 data-id=\u0022242f42267cff46408f3565a82d40fac5\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000707\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002283dca3a7-93a6-4a78-a313-6fce42ebe49e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022242f42267cff46408f3565a82d40fac5\u0022\u003EVANUSHI WALTERS (Labour\u2014Upper Harbour):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Mr Speaker, for the opportunity to take a call to speak to the Policing (Killing a Police Dog) Amendment Bill, a bill that is really about the maximum sentencing for this offence, which would increase the maximum prison sentence from two to five years. I also do want to acknowledge the intent that\u2019s given rise to the bill, which I do believe has come from a really good place and is about recognising the significant and tragic loss of those dogs who have been killed. It is about acknowledging what they meant to those handlers and to the families who have cared for them as well. When I learnt that I was speaking to this bill, I also reflected on the stories of police dogs who had passed not in tragic circumstances but who have been honoured in New Zealand media in some ways, such as the dog Ike who passed over after a long career of service last year, so we, as a New Zealand community, are a community who hugely respect the important role that police dogs play in our police force. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000708\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002283dca3a7-93a6-4a78-a313-6fce42ebe49e\u0022\u003EBut I do think we also need to recognise that the intent that this is coming from is really about deterrence. As my colleague Ginny Andersen has already spoken to, there are practical reasons for why we aren\u2019t supporting this through to select committee at this stage\u2014the biggest, of course, that we don\u2019t believe that this would act as a deterrent; that the provisions in place, therefore, are sufficient; and, because it won\u2019t act as a deterrent, then we simply don\u2019t think this would be an effective use of our House time to send it through the select committee process.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000709\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002283dca3a7-93a6-4a78-a313-6fce42ebe49e\u0022\u003EBecause we\u2019re talking about maximum penalties, I just wanted to reflect for a bit on what we as lawmakers ought to be considering as we turn our minds to maximum sentences, and the Sentencing Advisory Council of Victoria makes some useful observations. In a paper published in 2020, they talk about the fact that maximum penalties should place really some clear, legally defined upper limits on the courts\u2019 sentencing power and that they should be reasonable and proportionate. But as reasoned lawmakers, we also need to turn our minds to what I would call the legal principle of parsimony, which is a principle that states the maximum penalty should be set at the lowest level that achieves its intended purpose. So again, here, the intended purpose is deterrence.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000710\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002283dca3a7-93a6-4a78-a313-6fce42ebe49e\u0022\u003EI think while we look at the number of times this has occurred in New Zealand\u2019s past, there is some evidence that the settings are correct at present. So just reflecting on the scale of the issue, I think when we all hear those stories, like Gazza\u2019s story, we\u2019re all extremely outraged. But we also have to look at the big picture, which is that almost 40,000 call-outs are made each year and, of those, there are actually very few police dogs who are injured, let alone killed. I think it was 24, 25 dogs who have been killed, many of whom have been killed in accidents, not intentional incidents to kill them. Secondly, I do think we have sufficient provisions at the moment and I looked at a few examples overseas. I did reflect on some of your articles last year\u2014to the MP in the House\u2014and I noted that in the UK there\u2019s the Animal Welfare Act 2006, which was amended by the Animal Welfare (Service Animals) Bill. And the penalty there\u2014it\u2019s a comparable though not exact comparison\u2014is more or less for one year for unnecessary suffering for an animal. In Queensland, there\u2019s a penalty of 40 units or two years of imprisonment for attempting to kill a police dog.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000711\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002283dca3a7-93a6-4a78-a313-6fce42ebe49e\u0022\u003EMy colleague, again, has reflected on the fact that we don\u2019t believe that making this change from two years to five years will be a sufficient measure of prevention or a motivation for people to not engage in this because people often don\u2019t walk into a situation intending to do this to an animal. We\u2019d also question whether that act of increasing it by three years does anything to deter whatsoever. My colleague also spoke about the fact that there\u2019s no change to the penalty for injuring a police dog so there would be no change of deterrence on that front. So, again, while I would recognise that there is really good intent here, we are unable to support this bill through to select committee because of its practical inefficiencies.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002258baa209-edaf-42a5-92d6-b2613c144bfb\u0022 data-id=\u0022fc1ef74bda2d4623abd302c10de07b1c\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000712\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002258baa209-edaf-42a5-92d6-b2613c144bfb\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022fc1ef74bda2d4623abd302c10de07b1c\u0022\u003ENICOLE McKEE (ACT):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Mr Speaker. I rise in support of this bill, the Policing (Killing a Police Dog) Amendment Bill, on behalf of the ACT Party. I just, before I start, would like to perhaps make some comments on comments that were raised from across the Chamber. I\u2019ve heard about this law being a deterrent and that not being good enough. Well, you know, I don\u2019t have a legal law degree, but what I would have thought is that every law we make is for some form of deterrence. That is why we make the laws.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000713\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002258baa209-edaf-42a5-92d6-b2613c144bfb\u0022\u003EFurther to that, when we talk about or hear about situations where police dogs have been killed and the two-year sentence hasn\u2019t been placed on the perpetrator\u2014so why increase it to five? Well, I would have thought, this uneducated person over here, that by increasing it to five, the judges might actually start to use the ability to give a deterrence\u2014oh, I got that wrong; give a sentence to the perpetrator who has killed an animal.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000714\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002258baa209-edaf-42a5-92d6-b2613c144bfb\u0022\u003EThe third point that I would like to make is in regard to all of this good intent that we are hearing that could be fixed\u2014with some of the issues that have been addressed from across the floor there\u2014in a select committee hearing. But what I have heard, bill after bill after bill, is just a flat-out \u201CNo, we don\u2019t even want to go there. Oh, we like your attempt. We thank you for what it is that you\u2019re trying to do, but, no, that\u2019s it, we\u2019re going to leave it there. We\u2019re not going to allow the community to come in and have a say on this.\u201D\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000715\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002258baa209-edaf-42a5-92d6-b2613c144bfb\u0022\u003ESo getting back to my speech, I\u2019m going to start to repeat some of the stats because I think that they really are quite important: 24 police dogs have died since 1972; four of them have occurred just since the 2000s came in. That is an average of one police dog every two years. And when we have 40,000 callouts, that is, really, pretty good stats, but we\u2019ve still lost 24 dogs. We had Gazza in an armed incident in 2016, we had Gage who was shot dead in Christchurch in 2010, and then we had the Tangowahine, Dargaville shoot-out in December last year, where, thankfully the animal was not killed. I think what we have here is legislation that has not fixed the problem about criminals with guns, because now they are shooting our police dogs. That falls on your heads, over there, because the Labour Party put through a piece of legislation that has not protected them.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000716\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002258baa209-edaf-42a5-92d6-b2613c144bfb\u0022\u003ENot only that, I\u2019d also like to address the fact that it is not just police dogs; what we have are guide dogs, hearing dogs, mobility dogs, therapy dogs, epilepsy dogs, assistance dogs, medical alert assistance dogs, service dogs, and police dogs. They are there to do a job, and there are seven organisations in New Zealand who can certify that these dogs are not purely attack dogs but are actually able to complete a task to help their humans and help society.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000717\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002258baa209-edaf-42a5-92d6-b2613c144bfb\u0022\u003EBlind Low Vision New Zealand have approximately 250 dogs. It takes 18 to 20 months to train them and it costs $75,000 per dog. Now, if that is what it takes for a Blind Low Vision dog, imagine what it takes for a service dog. Imagine what it takes for a police dog to be trained. And then we\u2019ve got the Ministry for Primary Industries detector dogs. They are not attack dogs; they are dogs that have been trained to go into major airports and ports and look after our communities and make sure there are no bombs in those places. The New Zealand Army have over 100 teams of patrol dogs and detector dogs. So, ideally, I\u2019d like to see a bill where we can protect all of the dogs that help society.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000718\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002258baa209-edaf-42a5-92d6-b2613c144bfb\u0022\u003EBut, at the end of the day, ACT does like to stand up for the minority parties. I believe that a dog specifically trained to help and protect humans deserves respect for the taking of its life. The trainers of all these dogs\u2014whether they are service, disability, detector, or police\u2014deserve closure upon the untimely death of their family friend. This bill is not about all of those dogs; it is about the police dogs\u2014it is about the police dogs in the Policing Act 2008. And if this bill can be amended to include all service dogs, ACT would howl in approval!\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000719\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002258baa209-edaf-42a5-92d6-b2613c144bfb\u0022\u003EBut on behalf of Nero, Nick, Thor, Barlow, Jon, Ebba, Panzer, Luke, Sarge, Ozi, Rada, Josh, Lance, Ryka, Rex, Spike, Kone, Jock, Mal, Valour, Duke, Enzo, Gage, and Gazza\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022a434482b-7ac1-4862-9ce7-13e63289dee3\u0022 data-id=\u0022a9d86f83dadf492f8c154ae9fb6684d1\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000720\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a434482b-7ac1-4862-9ce7-13e63289dee3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022a9d86f83dadf492f8c154ae9fb6684d1\u0022\u003EDEPUTY SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Order! The member\u2019s time has expired.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022288783df-ade6-42d2-bd21-06ffa87dedf8\u0022 data-id=\u0022489edd863df048ba82e7cea51110309e\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000721\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022288783df-ade6-42d2-bd21-06ffa87dedf8\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022489edd863df048ba82e7cea51110309e\u0022\u003ESTEPH LEWIS (Labour\u2014Whanganui):\u003C/span\u003E T\u0113n\u0101 koe, Mr Speaker. I am grateful to rise and take a call on the Policing (Killing a Police Dog) Amendment Bill tonight. I know that this debate so far has been a bit emotional, and I know where that emotion comes from. It does come from a good place. We are a nation who loves our dogs. They are our friends. They are loyal. They are a part of our families, police dogs included.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000722\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022288783df-ade6-42d2-bd21-06ffa87dedf8\u0022\u003EAs I\u2019ve mentioned in this House previously, my parents had a sheep and beef farm in South Taranaki, and to help us out on that farm we had over the years a number of working dogs. You spend hours with your dog, training them, building a relationship, earning their trust, and they your trust. Each dog has its own personality. Dad would always remind us that we weren\u2019t to spoil the dogs; they were working dogs and weren\u2019t to come inside, but that rule was never strictly followed, and we all knew, at the end of the day, that they were part of our family too and treated with respect. When one of them passed away, we all grieved and we missed them.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000723\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022288783df-ade6-42d2-bd21-06ffa87dedf8\u0022\u003EI acknowledge that the bond between a police officer and their dog is even more special and unique, and the trust in that relationship is unwavering. I saw as a child, as well, growing up at the prison village, the relationship that police have with their dogs. I recall watching local officers bring their dogs down to the prison to run training drills. In fact, I remember one day\u2014one wintery evening\u2014Mum taking us down to the prison to drop off Dad\u2019s dinner when he was working a four to midnight shift, and one of the local officers asking if we would mind the dog sniffing around our car as part of their training. I saw the bond and the trust in that relationship. Police dogs do provide huge value to our communities, and the loss of any police dog\u2019s life is tragic. It\u2019s tragic for the dog\u2019s handler and for the wider police communities.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000724\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022288783df-ade6-42d2-bd21-06ffa87dedf8\u0022\u003EI was interested to learn, when doing some research to take this call tonight, that the first police dogs came to New Zealand in 1956. Since those first dogs arrived, some 65 years ago, 24 police dogs have tragically lost their lives in the line of duty or in accidents associated with their service. I think that low number shows how well our police officers take care of their dogs, how well they protect them and are devoted to them, and they should be commended for that. Tonight, though, we are debating an amendment proposed to the Policing Act, in particular the current section 53 of the Policing Act, which, as mentioned, makes it an offence to intentionally kill, maim, wound, or otherwise injure a police dog and carries a fine of up to two years in prison or $15,000. The bill before us tonight proposes to increase the penalty for killing a police dog from two years to five years.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000725\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022288783df-ade6-42d2-bd21-06ffa87dedf8\u0022\u003EAt this point, I think it\u2019s worth mentioning that, in the past, when someone has been charged with killing a police dog, those charges have also been laid alongside a number of other charges associated with the individual\u2019s actions and offending. In fact, as my colleague Ginny mentioned earlier tonight, the individual charged with the murder of police dog Gage in 2010 was actually sentenced to a total of 14 years in prison for the total of his offending, which related to a number of offences.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000726\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022288783df-ade6-42d2-bd21-06ffa87dedf8\u0022\u003EAs I\u2019ve said, I do acknowledge the value that police dogs provide us. However, I also come from a legal background, and one of the things that we are taught to do is to step back and look at all of the evidence. That means not just to take knee-jerk reactions. The evidence is pretty clear, and that evidence says that, in general, increasing penalties and sanctions does very little, if anything, to deter individuals from committing crimes. What does deter individuals is actually taking steps to address the causes of crime: reducing poverty, making sure that individuals can live with dignity in their communities and participate in a meaningful way.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000727\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022288783df-ade6-42d2-bd21-06ffa87dedf8\u0022\u003EI would like to finish tonight by acknowledging the incredible work our police force does, and I am proud to stand alongside a Labour Government committed to supporting that work and providing them with the support that they need to keep our communities\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022a434482b-7ac1-4862-9ce7-13e63289dee3\u0022 data-id=\u00220ccfde861cad42ca924d35baf68202f0\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000728\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a434482b-7ac1-4862-9ce7-13e63289dee3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00220ccfde861cad42ca924d35baf68202f0\u0022\u003EDEPUTY SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Order! The member\u2019s time has expired.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022b464a62e-d900-452a-b842-e3cf4ccc6149\u0022 data-id=\u00223f39349fdaa543259e9c51175e042031\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000729\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b464a62e-d900-452a-b842-e3cf4ccc6149\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00223f39349fdaa543259e9c51175e042031\u0022\u003EARENA WILLIAMS (Labour\u2014Manurewa):\u003C/span\u003E T\u0113n\u0101 koe e te M\u0101ngai o te Whare. It\u2019s a privilege to be able to speak on this bill, because it is entirely appropriate for harsh penalties to be administered for people who kill police dogs in the line of duty. It is entirely appropriate for harsh penalties to be administered for anyone who hurts an animal and for anyone who abuses an animal. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000730\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b464a62e-d900-452a-b842-e3cf4ccc6149\u0022\u003EWhat\u2019s not appropriate is for the Opposition to propose raising the penalty from two years in prison to five years in prison when the effect of that is, frankly, nothing, and when they know that, and when they are leading public discourse in this area, knowing full well that increasing the penalty will not result in charging offenders who kill police dogs, will result in longer sentences, and it will not result in a deterrent effect in cases of violence against police dogs. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000731\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b464a62e-d900-452a-b842-e3cf4ccc6149\u0022\u003EI thank the member from ACT for her contribution in memorialising those police dogs who have lost their lives in the line of duty. It\u2019s useful and it\u2019s right for us as parliamentarians to acknowledge the work that police dogs do for us, and our gratitude to them. We are the recipients of selfless, loving service of these dogs, both for their constables who are their handlers and for the public who they protect. It\u2019s right for us to acknowledge all of those lives lost of those dogs in service in protecting our communities. But it\u2019s not helpful for us to have this discussion on the backdrop of merely looking tough on crime without following an evidence basis about this.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000732\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b464a62e-d900-452a-b842-e3cf4ccc6149\u0022\u003EWhen we talk about the deterrent effect of this, it\u2019s useful for us to consider in what cases and in what scenarios these dogs are losing their lives. These are situations where an offender will be facing a raft of serious charges\u2014serious assaults on police officers, evading police officers\u2014the charge that they were going to be charged with in the first place, which may be a serious offence, because they are evading police. These are situations where the people who are apprehended are already facing serious charges, long-term prison sentences, and there is, in fact, no deterrent effect in the heat of the moment where they are injuring and committing violence against a police dog, if we are proposing here to increase the sentence from two years to five years.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000733\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b464a62e-d900-452a-b842-e3cf4ccc6149\u0022\u003EWhat is helpful for us to do is to place more importance on the work of these police dogs, to acknowledge in this House their service by acknowledging their names. And I want to turn to the member Nicole McKee\u2019s acknowledgment of the names and just highlight for the House a few of those dogs which have died in the line of service. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000734\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b464a62e-d900-452a-b842-e3cf4ccc6149\u0022\u003EWe\u2019ve made a few references to the first police dog that died in an accident in Napier. His name was Nero, and that accident was the first in this country for what was a very new system where we use police dogs with our police officers in enforcing the prevention of crime. The next dog who lost his life was in 1975 and his name was Nick, and he was shot in Wellington. That was the first incident where it was deliberate harm against a police dog that caused a police dog to lose his life. And it highlights, I think, the importance of acknowledging these crimes. But in those incidents, there would have been no deterrent effect if the penalties had been harsher. It\u2019s important for us to remember that this already exists as a penalty in law and that it can be prosecuted. And it is. It is treated as a very serious offence by police and prosecuted to the fullest extent, because police and prosecutors recognise this offence as an offence against police. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000735\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b464a62e-d900-452a-b842-e3cf4ccc6149\u0022\u003EIt\u2019s also right for us to acknowledge that the safety record of police dogs is very high, that the police officers charged with the care of police dogs take their duties really seriously to what are their partners in work. And considering that they\u2019re called out 40,000 times a year, the rate of safety is very good. So we need to be able to acknowledge the important work here and also acknowledge that increasing penalties is simply painting this as a political issue, which makes some parliamentarians look tough on crime and does not address the root cause of this problem. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000736\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b464a62e-d900-452a-b842-e3cf4ccc6149\u0022\u003EI want to, finally, conclude my remarks by saying that 30 years of locking more people up for longer has failed to make our communities safer and has resulted in a reoffending rate of 61 percent. That\u2019s why on this side of the House we will continue to do things differently and use evidence-based methods to determine what the penalties in these situations should be in all areas of our law and order system, in order to reduce\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022a434482b-7ac1-4862-9ce7-13e63289dee3\u0022 data-id=\u00227d3be147f2fa4e7f8cc40bf60cc5dc2c\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000737\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a434482b-7ac1-4862-9ce7-13e63289dee3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00227d3be147f2fa4e7f8cc40bf60cc5dc2c\u0022\u003EDEPUTY SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Order! The member\u2019s time has expired. This debate is interrupted and set down for resumption next sitting day. The House stands adjourned until 2 p.m. tomorrow.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000738\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a434482b-7ac1-4862-9ce7-13e63289dee3\u0022\u003EDebate interrupted.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20210407080df67e24d84edb87c1969e093d96cc000739\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a434482b-7ac1-4862-9ce7-13e63289dee3\u0022\u003EThe House adjourned at 9.57 p.m.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n    \u003C/div\u003E\n  \u003C/body\u003E\n\u003C/html\u003E"