"\u003C!DOCTYPE html\u003E\u003Chtml xmlns:xlink=\u0022http://www.w3.org/1999/xlink\u0022 xmlns:xsi=\u0022http://www.w3.org/2007/XMLSchema-instance\u0022 xmlns:mml=\u0022http://www.w3.org/1998/Math/MathML\u0022\u003E\n  \u003Chead\u003E\n    \u003CMETA http-equiv=\u0022Content-Type\u0022 content=\u0022text/html; charset=utf-16\u0022\u003E\n    \u003Cmeta name=\u0022viewport\u0022 content=\u0022width=device-width, initial-scale=1\u0022\u003E\n  \u003C/head\u003E\n  \u003Cbody style=\u0022font-family:sans-serif; font-size:100%;\u0022\u003E\n    \u003Cdiv class=\u0022HpsHansard\u0022\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000001\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsProceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u002268270c816da54645bdab1e76435d7905\u0022\u003ETUESDAY, 15 MARCH 2022\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000003\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u00222a3c4c7481e24fe48c0ec76759a040e2\u0022\u003ETUESDAY, 15 MARCH 2022\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000002\u0022\u003EThe Speaker took the Chair at 2 p.m.\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000004\u0022\u003EKARAKIA/PRAYERS\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022a6c42c44-3622-4c9c-98b8-793fb5ec15cc\u0022 data-id=\u0022392fc11499a7467b8c9ca8f3c1e3e780\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000005\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a6c42c44-3622-4c9c-98b8-793fb5ec15cc\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022392fc11499a7467b8c9ca8f3c1e3e780\u0022\u003EIAN McKELVIE (Assistant Speaker) (remote):\u003C/span\u003E Almighty God, we give thanks for the blessings which have been bestowed on us. Laying aside all personal interests, we acknowledge the Queen and pray for guidance in our deliberations that we may conduct the affairs of this House with wisdom, justice, mercy, and humility for the welfare and peace of New Zealand. Amen.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n    \u003C/div\u003E\n    \u003Cdiv class=\u0022HpsHansard\u0022\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000006\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsProceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u00223e889c65cd1d495fa9c682e019a7bb0f\u0022\u003EMotions\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000007\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u002298f638a29e1f4c8b8caddfd1f6a6d83a\u0022\u003EChristchurch Terror Attacks\u2014Third Anniversary\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022 data-id=\u0022a90e2878b91e475cb2934a5099d5a496\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000008\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022a90e2878b91e475cb2934a5099d5a496\u0022\u003ERt Hon JACINDA ARDERN (Prime Minister):\u003C/span\u003E I seek leave to move a motion without notice to mark the third anniversary of the Christchurch terror attacks.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000009\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00227f1e175a015740b8ba1fef494dc8df1e\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: I\u2019m just going to warn people, I\u2019m going to take a little longer, as far as waiting for objection, because of the fact that we\u2019re working remotely, to give people the opportunity to do it. It was pointed out to me that I didn\u2019t previously. Is there any objection to that course of action being followed? There is none.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000010\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022aa3b94166b1a482e9bda4fafeebee33a\u0022\u003ERt Hon JACINDA ARDERN\u003C/span\u003E: I move, That this House remember that three years ago today, 51 people lost their lives and more than 40 were injured in the terror attacks on Christchurch masjidain, that it acknowledge the continuing impact on the Canterbury Muslim community and Muslim New Zealanders, reassert the promise we made as a House to protect Muslim New Zealanders and their right to be safe from fear, and thank all those who have worked so hard to rebuild the impacted communities.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000011\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022\u003EToday, I stand here on behalf of New Zealand to acknowledge those who lost their lives in the terrorist attacks of March 15. We remember the 51 who were killed. We remember the injured. We remember the families who suffered such all-encompassing loss, the communities that embraced them, and we remember the moment where we felt like everything changed around us in an instant. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000012\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022\u003EMarch 15 is a date in our collective national history where we learnt about the very worst and the very best of humanity. I have many reflections from the days and weeks following the attack. Almost every single one of them is a memory, or a lesson, from our Muslim community. We were reminded, not just in the aftermath of the attack but across the course of the sentencing process, of the strength of courage, unity, and determination of our Muslim community. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000013\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022\u003EAfter the sentencing of the perpetrator of this horrific act, the Imam who stood at the front of Al Noor mosque, who watched his own community gunned down in the midst of prayer, who that night was in such shock that I recall when I spoke with him, he uttered but two words. That same man stood outside the court in Christchurch and said: \u201CExtremists represent hate. We represent love and compassion. Muslim and non-Muslim, people of faith and no faith. That is us, New Zealanders. We are very proud to be Muslims in New Zealand.\u201D\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000014\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022\u003EI will never fathom how it is in the wake of such hardship that our Muslim community have never shown disdain for their home, only pride and endless hope that it will be better. And that is what we owe them: better. Better comes through the systemic changes we make, like the changes to our laws. Six days after the attack, we announced the ban for all military-style semi-automatic weapons and assault rifles. This took 61,000 over-powered firearms, 2,800 modified firearms, and more than 200,000 firearms parts and accessories out of our communities. We have also established a dedicated firearms unit within Police to take over firearms regulatory activities, as well as a firearms registry to be set up from June 2023, which will address the 30-year deficit of information when it comes to knowing what legal firearms are out there in our communities.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000015\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022\u003ETen days after the attack, a royal commission of inquiry was set up. It provided 44 recommendations to help our country to become the diverse, safe, inclusive country we hope for it to be. And, as such, a Ministry for Ethnic Communities is in place. Last year was the first annual hui on counter-terrorism and countering violent extremism. A national centre of research excellence for preventing and countering violent extremism is under way, and a Master\u2019s scholarship programme has launched. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000016\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022\u003EIn September last year, our Counter-Terrorism Legislation Bill passed into law, giving enforcement agencies greater powers to protect New Zealanders from terrorist activity and, in particular, ensuring the planning and preparation for a terrorist act is now a criminal offence\u2014a long outstanding gap in previous laws that has now been fixed.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000017\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022\u003EBut the work continues. \u201CBetter\u201D means changing more than the law. The 17 minutes of terror that was live streamed on social media on March 15 remains available on some parts of the web despite measures to take it down. It\u2019s clear the terrorist had spent a great deal of time in the deepest recesses of the web, spiralling into extremism. And so two months after the attack, alongside France, we brought together heads of State and Government, and leaders from the tech sector, to adopt the Christchurch Call, to eliminate terrorist and violent extremist content online. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000018\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022\u003EThe Christchurch Call community now includes the member States of the European Union and the European Commission, the United States, Japan, Korea, and many others\u201455 countries in total\u2014and UNESCO, and the Council of Europe. Ten online service providers have joined the call. The call\u2019s civil society advisory group represents more than 50 different organisations and individuals from around the world. We pledged to work with each other and with civil society to tackle the underlying causes of terrorism and violent extremism and to develop technical solutions that improve the online environment and make social media platforms less hospitable to terrorists and violent extremists. We have made substantial progress but the work continues, including on our own social cohesion agenda. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000019\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022\u003ESo we honour the memories of the 51 Shaheed who were killed with the actions we have taken to make our country a better home for all who live here. We acted as a country to deny infamy to the one who craved it, we acted as a country to cloak our Muslim community in love, and we acted as a country to strengthen tools both at home and around the world to violent extremism. But we must all, every day, work hard to do better, including to combat Islamophobia in Aotearoa New Zealand. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000020\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022\u003EThree years on, we turn to our Muslim community for inspiration to remain resolute in our task to protect one another, to better understand one another, to work together towards a safer, kinder New Zealand. Assalamu alaikum.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022ea31fdd3-90e9-47d7-92a4-20b6a3109eef\u0022 data-id=\u0022de7d6f8caffb46e58d9d44912064fbf8\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000021\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ea31fdd3-90e9-47d7-92a4-20b6a3109eef\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022de7d6f8caffb46e58d9d44912064fbf8\u0022\u003ECHRISTOPHER LUXON (Leader of the Opposition):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Mr Speaker. The Opposition joins in remembering, with heavy hearts, the 51 people who tragically lost their lives in the Christchurch mosque shootings three years ago today. We honour their memories, we send our love to the families and friends they left behind, and to the 40 people who sustained serious injuries that day.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000022\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ea31fdd3-90e9-47d7-92a4-20b6a3109eef\u0022\u003EThe profound sense of loss felt by the families and survivors will, sadly, endure as they carry on rebuilding their lives. The events of March 15 2019 are a permanent stain on our country. That day, we saw an atrocity unfold in our streets, of a nature that had always seemed so distant and so unlike us. The terrorist\u2019s cowardly actions do not bear repeating, other than to say they were so repellent to everything we stand for as New Zealanders. Such senseless violence committed against innocent people in their places of worship, where they were entitled to feel free and safe, is so incongruous with our values and our way of life. Those values we hold dear include our embracing of diversity, tolerance, and understanding. Our diverse, multicultural society is New Zealand\u2019s strength and a point of pride. We cannot let those values fray; we must give nothing to extremism.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000023\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ea31fdd3-90e9-47d7-92a4-20b6a3109eef\u0022\u003EToday is also an opportunity to acknowledge the contribution of our first responders: the extraordinary bravery of our police, who threw themselves into the unknown and whose speed and courage led to the swift apprehension of the attacker, undoubtedly saving more lives; and the dedication of our paramedics, nurses, doctors, and hospital staff, who, in a mass casualty event, saved lives and treated the wounded under unprecedented pressures. And we remember the compassion and the love shown by New Zealanders, who opened their homes and their hearts to the survivors and families, who adorned our streets and our mosques with flowers, and who stood in unity alongside our Muslim community.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000024\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ea31fdd3-90e9-47d7-92a4-20b6a3109eef\u0022\u003EIt is incumbent on us as parliamentarians to do all we can to keep New Zealand safe. As the royal commission of inquiry\u2019s report acknowledges, no country will ever be immune from violent extremism and terrorism, but there is much that the Government can do to minimise that risk. Implementing the royal commission\u2019s 44 recommendations is a good start, and particularly the most important of those, like having a new Minister responsible for leading and coordinating the counter-terrorism effort. The Government has national support in delivering on these vital recommendations at pace.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000025\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ea31fdd3-90e9-47d7-92a4-20b6a3109eef\u0022\u003EThe events of March 15 2019 left an indelible imprint on all of our minds, and, like all of us, I remember that day very well. I was driving between meetings in Auckland when I heard the news, and I immediately headed to the airport to travel to Christchurch, where I remained for several days to support Air New Zealand staff in operations. I was so incredibly proud of all Air New Zealand staff who played their part and worked so tirelessly in those immediate days and weeks to connect impacted wh\u0101nau, to ensure a smooth-running operation, and to support our community in what was a highly emotional and extremely sad day for New Zealand.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000026\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ea31fdd3-90e9-47d7-92a4-20b6a3109eef\u0022\u003ESadly, one of our Air New Zealand family lost their life in those terrible events in Christchurch on that Friday afternoon. Lilik Abdul Hamid was an aircraft maintenance engineer in Christchurch and was in the Al Noor Mosque on Deans Avenue. Lilik was part of our engineering team in Christchurch for 16 years, but had first got to know the team even earlier when he worked with our aircraft engineers servicing customer aircraft in Indonesia over a period of eight years. The friendships he made at that time led him to apply for a role at Air New Zealand, and he and his wife, Nina, packed up and left everything they knew behind them to come to Christchurch.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000027\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ea31fdd3-90e9-47d7-92a4-20b6a3109eef\u0022\u003ELilik was a great testament to why New Zealand is infinitely stronger and better because of diversity, and it was a real privilege to meet with Lilik\u2019s gracious and incredible family in their home, and it was a special time marked with both tears and laughter. He made a tremendous contribution to New Zealand. He was a hard worker, both well liked and well respected, and Lilik was also quite a character, with a terrific sense of humour and a love of outdoors, especially fishing.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000028\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ea31fdd3-90e9-47d7-92a4-20b6a3109eef\u0022\u003EToday, my thoughts, prayers, and love remain with Lilik\u2019s family, as they do with all of the families of the 51 whose lives were taken, and with all Muslim New Zealanders. Assalamu alaikum\u2014peace be with you.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022abf27403-4392-47c9-9af0-6773753e95cb\u0022 data-id=\u00222dc034b692404164b79ad3bade80237f\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000029\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022abf27403-4392-47c9-9af0-6773753e95cb\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00222dc034b692404164b79ad3bade80237f\u0022\u003EGOLRIZ GHAHRAMAN (Green) (remote):\u003C/span\u003E Al salam alaikum. We remember today that day three years ago when our nation\u2019s heart was broken\u2014my heart was broken. The wound is still fresh as we remember the 51 shuhada, all those still living with the harrowing injuries of that day, their wh\u0101nau, and their loved ones. We wrap our arms around the survivors, our Muslim community across the whole of Aotearoa and \u014Ctautahi Christchurch. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000030\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022abf27403-4392-47c9-9af0-6773753e95cb\u0022\u003EI want to remember that we did that immediately as the terror happened, as we found out. I want to remember those vigils across Aotearoa where we all held our little ones a little bit tighter as we remembered little Mucad Ibrahim\u2014at three years old, the youngest victim of the attack. We all remember one or two special victims as we learnt all of their stories, and we sat together, we came together. I remember, as well, that the city of Dunedin ran out of flowers on Saturday the 16th because they were all at the mosque.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000031\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022abf27403-4392-47c9-9af0-6773753e95cb\u0022\u003EThat is the New Zealand who welcomed my family and I here as refugees when I was just nine years old. We were fleeing oppression, the risk of torture. We\u2019d lived through a war. I\u2019ll never forget coming down that escalator at Auckland Airport with my terrified parents, wondering if we would be allowed in. We were welcomed here. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000032\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022abf27403-4392-47c9-9af0-6773753e95cb\u0022\u003ESo I want to thank and remember every single New Zealander who stood for our values as this terror attack unfolded and for the past three years. You are on the right side of history, and it matters to our frightened communities. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000033\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022abf27403-4392-47c9-9af0-6773753e95cb\u0022\u003EI\u2019ll never forget that a Syrian family were amongst the victims of the mosque attacks. They had fled a harrowing war and violence, they\u2019d found safety here, but they died in Christchurch, New Zealand. The terrorist who murdered them hated refugees and he hated Muslims. We owe those victims that truth. We owe them more than remembrance. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000034\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022abf27403-4392-47c9-9af0-6773753e95cb\u0022\u003EWe now have an opportunity to act beyond our gun laws, beyond talking about terrorism. We have had a royal commission report, and the focus of that report, beyond stopping violence, is stopping hate. We know that this was an act of terror. We know it was committed by a white supremacist. It went unchecked because police and national security here didn\u2019t see white supremacy, white nationalism, as enough of a threat, as they surveilled the Muslim community itself, as they surveilled M\u0101ori activists. We know that the SIS still continues to list any white nationalist group on its watch-list outside of the terrorist of the Christchurch mosque shootings himself. Our justice system, we know, is policing and operating on a target of M\u0101ori and Pasifika men rather than far-right violence. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000035\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022abf27403-4392-47c9-9af0-6773753e95cb\u0022\u003EWe know, as well, because the royal commission told us, that this hate began with hate speech. It was allowed to spread online. History has taught us, as well as this terror attack, that atrocity begets atrocity, and it starts with hate speech. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000036\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022abf27403-4392-47c9-9af0-6773753e95cb\u0022\u003EWe know that our Muslim and ethnic communities have been reporting hate crimes and hate speech for years. The Muslim council of New Zealand told us that. But there was no way for police to track it, because hate crimes aren\u2019t clearly defined in our Crimes Act\u2014even real targeted threats of gun violence that are motivated by hate. I know that as my daily truth, as a politician who is perceived to be Muslim and known to be a refugee, and I\u2019ve spoken about the threats I get of gun violence, death threats, rape threats, of shotguns to be loaded, based specifically on those characteristics. Every minority in New Zealand knows that threat in online spaces and bleeding into our everyday lives. Our Muslim wh\u0101nau, M\u0101ori\u2014our East Asian and Pacific communities saw it with the racist threats after COVID\u2014our rainbow community, trans women. And it spreads online. As leaders, we have to stop and listen. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000037\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022abf27403-4392-47c9-9af0-6773753e95cb\u0022\u003EThe truth is that this is a global phenomenon\u2014disinformation deliberately spread, eventually radicalising and making us all unsafe. We can no longer depend on the goodwill of online platforms to police themselves. Facebook doesn\u2019t care about our marginalised communities. Twitter doesn\u2019t care. Google and YouTube only took down that video on the day because they were forced. The violence and vitriol of the recent protests outside Parliament with elements of far-right hate, with signs of white supremacy, taking advantage of disillusion, grifting disinformation, is a perfect example of that. The royal commission told us we need hate speech laws. We need hate crimes to find. The New Zealand Police wants that. It\u2019s time to act. That is what compassion would look like. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000038\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022abf27403-4392-47c9-9af0-6773753e95cb\u0022\u003EWe know, too, that what allows hate against our Muslim community or ethnic and indigenous communities is more insidious. It\u2019s in media portrayals. It\u2019s even in our own responses as politicians, when war or crisis happens, in who we sanction and who we shelter and help. Our refugee quota has been mostly closed for the duration of the pandemic. Refugees and the family reunification programme haven\u2019t been filled. It\u2019s time for that to begin.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000039\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022abf27403-4392-47c9-9af0-6773753e95cb\u0022\u003EToday, our Green call to Government is to commit to filling our refugee quota, including the numbers left behind since 2020, including families ripped apart by war. Today, as New Zealand stood with Ukraine\u2014as we should\u2014by allowing 4,000 families of refugees in Ukraine to be reunited, we need to remember that March 15th and the shuhada deserve the same. Treating all refugees and migrants the same matters. I see the Opposition even supported that Ukrainian visa. So today, on March 15th, let\u2019s also remember Afghanistan, Palestine, Myanmar, Yemen, Syria, Iraq, Hong Kong, and Eritrea. COVID has only made the plight of refugees more dangerous, including refugees of colour.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000040\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022abf27403-4392-47c9-9af0-6773753e95cb\u0022\u003EAotearoa, with that commitment, could say again that refugees are welcome here. That is what inclusion could look like. The truth is that, as politicians on both sides of this House, we are responsible for humanising our ethnic communities. Our most vulnerable communities are hurt. The people at those incredible vigils across Aotearoa three years ago are watching. They will hold us to account. Their acts of love, their resolve, is the standard we have to hold ourselves to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000041\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022abf27403-4392-47c9-9af0-6773753e95cb\u0022\u003EWe must show the rest of the world, as they are watching too, that love, peace, and compassion is a far stronger force than the forces of hate and division. We must shine a light bravely on the shadows of racism and hate that exist in pockets here and act, really act, against them. Then\u2014only then\u2014can we weave that incredible outpouring of love for our Muslim and migrant communities that we have seen over the past three years into the enduring fabric of our society.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000042\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022abf27403-4392-47c9-9af0-6773753e95cb\u0022\u003EKia hora te marino\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000043\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022abf27403-4392-47c9-9af0-6773753e95cb\u0022\u003E[May peace be widespread]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000044\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022abf27403-4392-47c9-9af0-6773753e95cb\u0022\u003EKia whakapapa pounamu te moana\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000045\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022abf27403-4392-47c9-9af0-6773753e95cb\u0022\u003E[May the ocean become like pounamu]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000046\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022abf27403-4392-47c9-9af0-6773753e95cb\u0022\u003EAroha atu, aroha mai\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000047\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022abf27403-4392-47c9-9af0-6773753e95cb\u0022\u003E[Give love, receive love]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000048\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022abf27403-4392-47c9-9af0-6773753e95cb\u0022\u003ET\u0101tou i a t\u0101tou katoa.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000049\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022abf27403-4392-47c9-9af0-6773753e95cb\u0022\u003E[Let us show respect for one another.]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000050\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022abf27403-4392-47c9-9af0-6773753e95cb\u0022\u003EThank you. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022 data-id=\u002210223843ae854d909220259552a23525\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000051\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002210223843ae854d909220259552a23525\u0022\u003EDAVID SEYMOUR (Leader\u2014ACT):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Mr Speaker. I rise on behalf of ACT to join with other speakers in offering our sincere and ongoing condolences for the victims of our nation\u2019s tragedy in Christchurch, just three short years ago.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000052\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003EI note that some other speakers have used the opportunity to promote their policies and make political points. I don\u2019t think it\u2019s the right day for that. What I would say is that the Prime Minister, at the time of our tragedy, had some very fine words that I completely agree with: they are us. She said to the terrorist, \u201CYou chose us but we utterly reject you.\u201D, and said that we would never use that terrorist\u2019s name again. It was very fine leadership that I think embodies the values that our country should take forward out of this tragedy\u2014that we celebrate a universal humanity and resist the urge to commodify each other into identities, which can only be a precursor for more hate and violence. We should stand proudly in the world, as a country that is a place of peace and love and non-violence and acceptance on the basis that everybody is human.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000053\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003EWe should never forget those 51 who lost their lives, those victims who survived but continue to carry injuries for their rest of their lives, and those who survived them and deserve our sympathy and condolences, but we should also honour our police force who were on the scene and apprehended the offender as rapidly as they could under those circumstances. We should, most certainly, honour those medics who were first to the scene, and those hospital heroes who worked so hard to help those who had been injured in these brutal attacks. And we should bear in mind all of the good things that were on display in the New Zealand character and society in the days after our nation\u2019s tragedy. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000054\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003EI thought Golriz Ghahraman from the Green Party put it very well when she said that Dunedin ran out of flowers because they were all at the mosque. In the days after that attack, we saw an outpouring of the best of our country. It brought out the best in nearly every single New Zealander as they spontaneously reacted to an act that we as New Zealanders utterly reject because it is not part of our national character and has no place in this country.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000055\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003ETo those who were lost, al salam alaikum. We will not forget what has happened and we will strive to be a better place and a better society in your honour.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00227a76db18-baa4-41c1-b366-89e2c753a1e7\u0022 data-id=\u00228105f08e691c49f29788ef73c0c91c5f\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000056\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227a76db18-baa4-41c1-b366-89e2c753a1e7\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00228105f08e691c49f29788ef73c0c91c5f\u0022\u003EDEBBIE NGAREWA-PACKER (Co-Leader\u2014Te Paati M\u0101ori) (remote):\u003C/span\u003E T\u0113n\u0101 koe e te P\u012Bka, t\u0113n\u0101 koutou e te Whare. Te Paati M\u0101ori support this motion marking the third anniversary of the Christchurch terror attacks, and remembering the 51 wh\u0101nau, people who lost their lives, the more than 40 people who were injured, and all the wh\u0101nau who are impacted by this evil attack. Te Paati M\u0101ori\u2019s aroha remains with Christchurch masjidain, the Canterbury Muslim community, and Muslim New Zealanders today, and all days. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000057\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227a76db18-baa4-41c1-b366-89e2c753a1e7\u0022\u003EWe had a doctor Amjad Hamid, who worked in our local hospital. He is a very kind, compassionate man who reached out to tangata whenua here. He was received with all the aroha that you can expect in a community like ours that struggles to get doctors. At a personal level, he helped many of our kaum\u0101tua and helped heal my m\u0101m\u0101. Islamophobia is deeply rooted in this country, and feeds off the same white supremacy that targets tangata whenua and black and brown peoples right across Aotearoa and the world. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000058\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227a76db18-baa4-41c1-b366-89e2c753a1e7\u0022\u003EThis nation and this House must be 100 percent committed to smashing white supremacy and dismantling its colonial power structures once and for all. Rather than being responsive to the increasing concerns of our Muslim and tangata whenua communities, our security and intelligence agencies\u2014including the SIS\u2014were focused entirely, as my Green sister said, on the wrong people. In fact, they were targeting the same people who the white supremacists were targeting: tangata whenua, activists, environmentalists, and peaceful Muslim citizens with no history of violence. The misplaced and racist approach which failed to protect our communities will rightly be remembered as a stain on the integrity of our intelligence apparatus in Aotearoa. We need assurance that this has changed.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000059\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227a76db18-baa4-41c1-b366-89e2c753a1e7\u0022\u003EThis week, we also marked the 157th anniversary of when our t\u016Bpuna were murdered from white supremacists in Te Ngaio, our Ng\u0101ti Porou hap\u016B in Taranaki, which goes to show how horrific white supremacy is. This is backed by the Crown. In fact its own leader, General Cameron, had driven the colonial agenda, and the colonial agenda has continued to be driven in this country. We must be brave enough to defend our homes and we must stop the suffering that happens from those who are marginalised. Let us commit to ending it once and for all. We owe that to the fallen. We must be focused on eradicating the hate crimes. It is not only enough for us to be sitting here today, mihi-ing to those who are reaching the pains and continuously living the suffering but we must also encourage peace and all it takes to enact peace. N\u014D reira, t\u0113n\u0101 koutou katoa.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00226e419a18-df21-483e-9650-2aaee4e06211\u0022 data-id=\u0022a4ce050e4ee44da8acf458d8927fbf3c\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000060\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226e419a18-df21-483e-9650-2aaee4e06211\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022a4ce050e4ee44da8acf458d8927fbf3c\u0022\u003EIBRAHIM OMER (Labour) (remote):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Mr Speaker. Assalam alaikum alsalam ealaykum wa rahmat allah wa barakatuh. Ng\u0101 mihi nui ki a koutou katoa. I rise in support of the Prime Minister\u2019s motion to remember the March 15 attacks on Christchurch masjidain. I speak for you all. I\u2019ve noted the third anniversary of the March 15 terror attacks on Christchurch masjidain. Three years ago, we witnessed the painful and dark day in our nation\u2019s history. It\u2019s a day that featured so deeply into the memories of all New Zealanders. I think back to the moment the news broke out and I remember sitting in front of the TV and watching the Prime Minister\u2019s press conference. And I also remember, amongst the chaos, the sense of relief I felt witnessing the swift action of this Parliament as the legislation was fast tracked and passed to improve public safety. We have also seen strong leadership from this Government through the community consultations and the commitment to implement all 44 recommendations of the royal commission\u2019s report, and its continued prioritisation. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000061\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226e419a18-df21-483e-9650-2aaee4e06211\u0022\u003EIn the Qur\u2019an, it\u2019s stated that whoever unjustly kills one person, it\u2019s as though he kills the whole of humanity. This small passage captures just how precisely the 51 lives, shuhada, are regarded and remain to us all. As we continue to heal, we will be thinking of the victims and their families today. We will be honouring them in our hearts and prayers. We will ask Allah, the almighty Allah, to ease our collective pain and to bless those who were martyred in this sinister terror attack.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000062\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226e419a18-df21-483e-9650-2aaee4e06211\u0022\u003EThere is also another verse from the Qur\u2019an that states, \u201CWhoever saves life, it\u2019s as though he has saved all mankind.\u201D When I think of this verse, I think of those brave Cantabrians who heard the commotion and jumped in to help those on the scene. I think of our emergency responders. I think of our community organisations who dropped everything they were doing and rushed to offer their services to the impacted communities. Finally, I think of all New Zealanders who were at home and went out into their local communities and wrapped their arms around their neighbours and communities.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000063\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226e419a18-df21-483e-9650-2aaee4e06211\u0022\u003EIt\u2019s important to remember that the terrorist utterly failed. The plan to turn the whole country against each other was fruitless. The terrorist obviously underestimated his understanding of Islam. Our Islamic faith centres on values such as charity, forgiveness, honesty, patience, and\u2014the most important\u2014kindness. In response, we, the Muslim community, opened our homes and our hearts and we embraced people as we continued to grieve our loss. The terrorist has shown us our similarities and the extent of the empathy and selflessness and kindness we as a nation are able to tap into. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000064\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226e419a18-df21-483e-9650-2aaee4e06211\u0022\u003EIt is important for ever that we remember the legacy of our nation\u2019s response and that we continue to hold on to those values close. And March 15 will always continue to be a day where we renew our commitment to make Aotearoa better for all of us no matter where we come from, no matter what faith we follow, or no matter what we look like or what ways we dress. It will be a day we renew our commitment to make sure that what happened on March 15 will never happen again in our country. N\u014D reira, t\u0113n\u0101 koutou, t\u0113n\u0101 koutou, t\u0113n\u0101 t\u0101tou katoa. Salaam.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022 data-id=\u0022324bda5eb3064038bc1dfde60eb0f065\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000065\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022324bda5eb3064038bc1dfde60eb0f065\u0022\u003EHon GERRY BROWNLEE (National):\u003C/span\u003E It is quite appropriate that the House takes time today to remember the tragedy that occurred just three years ago. It is a day that will live in the memory of anyone who was in Christchurch at the time, for all of their life. We used to ask the question, \u201CWhere were you when the earthquake struck?\u201D A whole new generation of kids will be asking, \u201CWhere were you when the Al Noor Mosque was attacked, and those 51 people lost their lives to the bullets of a deranged gunman?\u201D They\u2019ll remember it because schools were locked down, business places were locked down. The city was, for a time, almost under siege. I\u2019m sure it\u2019s nothing like what is being experienced by others in other parts of the world at the moment, but it was a frightening time for everyone. And while it\u2019s not possible to fully empathise with the emotions that come with the loss of loved ones, with the injuries to loved ones, and to the disruption, terrible disruption, to families who were deeply affected by this\u2014the victims of that gunman\u2014it is possible to empathise with, in a shared way, the violation that that act caused to our otherwise peaceable community. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000066\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003EThere have been some remarkable responses from those who are leaders in the Muslim community. I think particularly of Gamal Fouda, who led that wonderful reflection, I suppose you\u2019d say, one week after, when he spoke to a very large gathering on Hagley Park. It was ahead of the official recognition, where he also spoke brilliantly and generously, and with a great deal of love and forgiveness for the circumstance that had occurred. And I\u2019m sure that in the living memories of anybody who was part of the Christchurch community at the time, the deep respect for the way in which he represented the views of his, I suppose you\u2019d say\u2014I was going to say parishioners, but that\u2019s probably the wrong word\u2014fellow Muslims who were so deeply affected by the event. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000067\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003EThe support that\u2019s needed for those families continues to this day. And it\u2019s not so much support that\u2019s found in anything that we might do legislatively, because I think the initiatives that the Prime Minister outlined earlier in her speech were the right ones, and have been widely supported by Parliament. But there is this ongoing worry for many of those families who do need ongoing support and, while it\u2019s there, I hope that there is no point where it might be in any way withdrawn. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000068\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003EThere is a question about do we do more, in a security sense\u2014should our agencies have known more\u2014all of those sorts of things. They\u2019re appropriate to ask, but I think we do need to remember that many of the people who were affected by the events that day came to live in this country because they wanted to live a life that was free. It was dreadfully disruptive, dreadfully\u2014I suppose you\u2019d say\u2014shattered the dream by the events of that day. But for their families, none the less, the goals that they had in coming here remain true. And so we need to remember that, for all of the security measures that we might put in place, they have to be measures that are acceptable inside a free society, and we cannot completely rearrange everything to affect other people\u2019s freedoms, simply on the back of the activities of, as I said before, a deranged gunman. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000069\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003EMr Seymour spoke of the heroes on the day; there were many of them. Firstly, all of those people who were in the mosque, who had to face the prospect of assisting others who were shot, or got shot themselves. There were the families of those victims\u2014not only those of the deceased but also those who suffered pretty horrendous injuries as well. They were alongside, as heroes, the police, the medical people that were so good\u2014having a trauma centre so close was, perhaps, helpful\u2014but also I wanted to say I think the media did a very good job at that time as well. Everyone wanted to know what happened. Everyone wanted to know what was going on, and I think they handled it with remarkable respect. The Christchurch news team initially and then, later on, some of the more headline presenters from inside the networks. And it\u2019s important that they do that because, at a time when the city was facing an uncertainty over fears\u2014was it one gunman, was it multiple gunmen etc.\u2014it was very important that their work continue. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000070\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003EI just want to conclude by recognising the efforts of Temel Atacocugu. He\u2019s been walking from Dunedin to Christchurch\u2014he would have arrived at Al Noor about an hour or so ago\u2014retracing the steps that that the gunman took on that day, before that horrible event. He\u2019s a man who was shot, I think, nine times, who continues to have a battle with his recovery from those events, but he\u2019s undertaken this effort in what he calls a \u201Cwalk for peace\u201D, and I admire him enormously for what he\u2019s done, because he is making a very, very practical, easily understood statement for his fellow New Zealanders to get alongside, and I wish him very well for what will be, I think, a recovery from some of the pain that he\u2019s experienced on that particular walk. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000071\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003EIt is a day where we might remember the tragedy of it. Before that, or over the top of that, I think we need to remember that the message that came out of it was one of love and forgiveness. That is a remarkable thing and really augurs very well for a diverse New Zealand community, moving forward. Salam alaikum.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000072\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003EMotion agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n    \u003C/div\u003E\n    \u003Cdiv class=\u0022HpsHansard\u0022\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000073\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsProceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u0022460f2cad1bde440ba21308489a40f88e\u0022\u003EPETITIONS, PAPERS, SELECT COMMITTEE REPORTS, AND INTRODUCTION OF BILLS\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000075\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u00229c0d3ef116864639a22f96aab95cf0d9\u0022\u003EPETITIONS, PAPERS, SELECT COMMITTEE REPORTS, AND INTRODUCTION OF BILLS\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022 data-id=\u0022c6d7a5e09a6e4e48af49e3e28943533f\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000074\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022c6d7a5e09a6e4e48af49e3e28943533f\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: No bills have been introduced. Petitions have been delivered to the Clerk for presentation.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022\u0022 data-id=\u00220221f5f4d7d94573b13ee9aff2d2222f\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000076\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00220221f5f4d7d94573b13ee9aff2d2222f\u0022\u003ECLERK\u003C/span\u003E: \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000077\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022\u0022\u003EPetition of Arthur Yeo requesting that the House ensure that Governments are required to consider equestrian users\u2019 needs in the design of all roading, pathways, reserves, and parks \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000078\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022\u0022\u003Epetition of Rosemary Penwarden requesting that the House require KiwiRail to cease transport of coal and re-establish KiwiRail as a Government department  \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000079\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022\u0022\u003Epetition of Jamie Crook requesting that the House reverse COVID-19 mandates and traffic light system, and \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000080\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022\u0022\u003Epetition of Ian Meredith requesting that the House urge the Government to increase the amount of funding for fibre-optic communication network.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022 data-id=\u002238263bb23ede4b6dac1f756c44749497\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000081\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002238263bb23ede4b6dac1f756c44749497\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Those petitions stand referred to the Petitions Committee. Ministers have delivered papers.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022\u0022 data-id=\u00223d6c7bcfe36b4114a34538136105dc09\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000082\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00223d6c7bcfe36b4114a34538136105dc09\u0022\u003ECLERK\u003C/span\u003E: \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000083\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022\u0022\u003EAnnual Reports for 2021 for:\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000084\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022\u0022\u003EExport Education Levy  \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000085\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022\u0022\u003EEducation New Zealand\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000086\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022\u0022\u003EAuckland DHB\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000087\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022\u0022\u003EBay of Plenty DHB\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000088\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022\u0022\u003ECounties Manukau DHB\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000089\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022\u0022\u003EHawke\u2019s Bay DHB\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000090\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022\u0022\u003ESouth Canterbury DHB\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000091\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022\u0022\u003ETair\u0101whiti DHB\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000092\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022\u0022\u003EWairarapa DHB\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000093\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022\u0022\u003EWhanganui DHB\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000094\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022\u0022\u003ENew Zealand Health Partnerships\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000095\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022\u0022\u003EHealthSource, and\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000096\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022\u0022\u003EhealthAlliance New Zealand\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000097\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022\u0022\u003Eannual plans for 2021-22 for:\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000098\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022\u0022\u003EAuckland DHB\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000099\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022\u0022\u003EBay of Plenty DHB\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000100\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022\u0022\u003ECounties Manukau DHB\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000101\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022\u0022\u003EHawke\u2019s Bay DHB\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000102\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022\u0022\u003EWairarapa DHB\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000103\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022\u0022\u003EWhanganui DHB, and\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000104\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022\u0022\u003EHealthSource\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000105\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022\u0022\u003Estatement of performance expectations 2021-22 for:\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000106\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022\u0022\u003ESouth Canterbury DHB, and\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000107\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022\u0022\u003ETair\u0101whiti DHB, and\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000108\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022\u0022\u003Estatement of intent for 2021 to 2025, New Zealand Health Partnerships.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022 data-id=\u002283fa37f655824c3e998fc7b12d2f257e\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000109\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002283fa37f655824c3e998fc7b12d2f257e\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: I present the report of the Controller and Auditor-General, entitled Commentary on He Tirohanga Mokupuna 2021. Those papers are published under the authority of the House. Select committee reports have been delivered for presentation.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022\u0022 data-id=\u0022ac5ec6a642234210bbbcd87ec8d88b43\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000110\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022ac5ec6a642234210bbbcd87ec8d88b43\u0022\u003ECLERK\u003C/span\u003E: \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000111\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022\u0022\u003EReport of the Education and Workforce Committee on the petition of Simone Hamilton\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000112\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022\u0022\u003Ereport of the Environment Committee on the Hazardous Substances and New Organisms (Hazardous Substances Assessments) Amendment Bill\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000113\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022\u0022\u003Ereport of the Governance and Administration Committee on the 2020-21 annual review of the Office of the Clerk of the House of Representatives and the Parliamentary Service\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000114\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022\u0022\u003Ereports of the Justice Committee on the 2020-21 annual reviews of:\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBItemSL1\u0022\u003Ethe Department of Corrections\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBItemSL1\u0022\u003Ethe Ministry of Justice\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBItemSL1\u0022\u003Eand the New Zealand Police\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000115\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022\u0022\u003Ereports of the M\u0101ori Affairs Committee on the 2020-21 annual reviews of:\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBItemSL1\u0022\u003Ethe Ministry of M\u0101ori Development\u2014Te Puni K\u014Dkiri, and\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBItemSL1\u0022\u003Ethe Office for M\u0101ori Crown Relations\u2014Te Arawhiti\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000116\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022\u0022\u003Ereport of the Petitions Committee on the petition of Olivia Rollo.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022 data-id=\u00228daf00e8e962442da5a09a7f79a28383\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000117\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00228daf00e8e962442da5a09a7f79a28383\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: The bill is set down for second reading.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n    \u003C/div\u003E\n    \u003Cdiv class=\u0022HpsHansard\u0022\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000118\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsProceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u002294a86d63effc4b02b6d6abb2dd0dcf15\u0022\u003ESpeaker\u2019s Statements\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000119\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u0022c1d11a517a6547aebe7015f45403a51f\u0022\u003EQuestion Time\u2014Remote Participation\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022 data-id=\u0022de785b2c162a42d2b997eb3efe5bc9d2\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000120\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022de785b2c162a42d2b997eb3efe5bc9d2\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Members, before we move to oral questions, I just want to give members participating remotely three reminders. First, could members please use their first name and last name in Zoom so that the Clerk\u2019s operators can identify them. The operators can\u2019t admit people to the meeting if they do not know who they are, and using full names makes it faster to find members and unmute their microphones. With the exception of whips, who have special accounts, members need to be either in the Chamber or on Zoom. If they do both, it causes confusion. A reminder that unmuting and muting is controlled by operators. When I give the call, the member is unmuted. There is no need for the member to do anything, and trying to unmute themselves can cause the member to mute again.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n    \u003C/div\u003E\n    \u003Cdiv class=\u0022HpsHansard\u0022\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000121\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsProceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u0022ca7f57a441d24b45b7912c48e8545489\u0022\u003EOral Questions\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000122\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u0022a8e68f222a7b4dc8bcf78966c0e6d1db\u0022\u003EQuestions to Ministers\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000123\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u00222e657e455d05484fa2cbe923da7352ca\u0022\u003EQuestion No. 1\u2014Prime Minister\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022ea31fdd3-90e9-47d7-92a4-20b6a3109eef\u0022 data-id=\u00228592f17d2dae41729acda8b1ac6535df\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000124\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ea31fdd3-90e9-47d7-92a4-20b6a3109eef\u0022\u003E1. \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00228592f17d2dae41729acda8b1ac6535df\u0022\u003ECHRISTOPHER LUXON (Leader of the Opposition)\u003C/span\u003E to the Prime Minister: Does she stand by all of her Government\u2019s statements and actions?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022 data-id=\u0022a7f6a7927ac14e3085a8ef3f91fcb726\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000125\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022a7f6a7927ac14e3085a8ef3f91fcb726\u0022\u003ERt Hon JACINDA ARDERN (Prime Minister):\u003C/span\u003E Yes, particularly the Government\u2019s consistent efforts to increase wages and support for low and middle income earners. We cannot control the war in Ukraine, nor the continued volatility of fuel prices, but we can take steps to reduce the impact on New Zealand families. That\u2019s why we have reduced fuel excise duties and road-user charges by 25c and halved the price of public transport. This builds on a comprehensive package due to come into play on 1 April, which increases Working for Families for 346,000 families, ensuring they are better off by, on average, $20 a week. Of course, that coincides with further benefit increases and increases for superannuitants and also student support. On 1 May, the winter energy payment restarts again, benefiting over a million New Zealanders during the winter months, including superannuitants. There is no silver bullet that will fix the cost of living, but we have a plan and are implementing a range of measures that together will help to make a difference. That stands in stark contrast to the idea from the Opposition of reducing taxes for those earning over $180,000 a year.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000126\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ea31fdd3-90e9-47d7-92a4-20b6a3109eef\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a342101577e44221ade41fcf2507b644\u0022\u003EChristopher Luxon\u003C/span\u003E: Does the Prime Minister accept that with weekly rents up a staggering $150 a week under Labour, the largest four-year increase in New Zealand\u2019s history, her Government\u2019s housing policies have made the cost of living crisis much, much worse for the one in three Kiwi households who rent?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000127\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022f3b1927efa8a4da88e5c63bd68415b51\u0022\u003ERt Hon JACINDA ARDERN\u003C/span\u003E: First, if I could just give the context that according to Stats New Zealand rental price index, the rental increases we\u2019ve seen from, for instance, 2013 to 2017 in terms of percentages, is actually the same as, for instance, the period that we\u2019ve seen while we\u2019ve been in office. Where there is a difference is the approach that we as a Government have taken relative to the previous Government. We have worked hard to try and tip the balance in favour of renters and first-home buyers. The combination of interest deductibility, the extension of the brightline test, the work that we have done to incentivise new builds to increase housing stock has led to, for instance, record consents. We know that this is an issue of supply and demand because in those areas where we have increased supply, we\u2019ve seen lesser increases in rents relative to those areas of constrained supply. The big difference is we are working hard to build houses, whereas on the opposite side, they worked hard to sell off Government houses. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000128\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ea31fdd3-90e9-47d7-92a4-20b6a3109eef\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002227d25de765184b52a483469280bd92bc\u0022\u003EChristopher Luxon\u003C/span\u003E: Why did she introduce additional taxes on rental housing last year, despite Inland Revenue Department officials clearly warning her it would drive up rents?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000129\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022baac42d43db4456281b9d27a7eae33ce\u0022\u003ERt Hon JACINDA ARDERN\u003C/span\u003E: As has been the case time and time again in this House, I do want to correct the member. The member is referring to advice that was provided before the additional changes that we made. That\u2019s meant that we are phasing out interest deductibility over a four-year period\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000130\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f12da0af-dc73-4870-8f77-1d50a75eb44c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00224857136b4514472b88ec3852b9b5463d\u0022\u003ENicola Willis\u003C/span\u003E: You were warned.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000131\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022897862f3c55f4e958ffb1022b9ca4e0f\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Order!\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000132\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00221b9fbf91c7b24c8fab44cf0d1fb732c0\u0022\u003ERt Hon JACINDA ARDERN\u003C/span\u003E: \u2014and importantly, including an exemption on new builds. The whole goal is twofold. We want to make it easier for first-home buyers to buy. On the opposite side of the House, they are proposing to remove the brightline test and interest deductibility, which would not improve the housing market for first-time buyers; and secondly, to improve supply, we\u2019ve created a carve-out for new builds, to incentivise the building of houses. This stands in contrast with the Opposition, who actually have no proposals whatsoever. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000133\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ea31fdd3-90e9-47d7-92a4-20b6a3109eef\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00220a334f3eb8524d96915844680cc2204f\u0022\u003EChristopher Luxon\u003C/span\u003E: So why have rents increased by an additional $50 since she introduced those taxes? \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000134\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022d48585e65eb14fa5ac6552a964708f4e\u0022\u003ERt Hon JACINDA ARDERN\u003C/span\u003E: There is no evidence to suggest it has been as a result of those changes, and I remind the member again, the increases that we\u2019ve seen actually mirrored the increases we saw from 2013. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000135\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f12da0af-dc73-4870-8f77-1d50a75eb44c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00223b9e306b26554bb2b4fbfb60eb41e7e1\u0022\u003ENicola Willis\u003C/span\u003E: Incorrect.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000136\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00221e8cb48f270542a6935b99ba274aaa70\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Order!\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000137\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022c9a9720952894f23bc86e4d089986eb5\u0022\u003ERt Hon JACINDA ARDERN\u003C/span\u003E: That demonstrates\u2014that is a statement of fact based on Stats New Zealand\u2014that we\u2019ve got a decades-old problem that in contrast to the Opposition, we have policies that are working hard to solve the problem. On the opposite side, they intend to get rid of everything that will make it easier for first-home buyers.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000138\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00221803423332ff45d0aa21cd3ba5be45b6\u0022\u003EDavid Seymour\u003C/span\u003E: Can the Prime Minister explain to the people of New Zealand just why she thought raising taxes on landlords in a tight rental market wouldn\u2019t lead to an increase in rents? \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000139\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022c9b8dfb2b04c454985f58115555b2529\u0022\u003ERt Hon JACINDA ARDERN\u003C/span\u003E: The CoreLogic data shows that investors still remain active in the market: 36 percent of transactions are going to multiple property owners. What we want to do for those investors is steer them towards new builds so we can expand supply, rather than operating in the same market as first-home buyers. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000140\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ea31fdd3-90e9-47d7-92a4-20b6a3109eef\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022ba3c81dadcd74c21bc8f4130782b8e57\u0022\u003EChristopher Luxon\u003C/span\u003E: Does she accept that with rents up an additional $50 a week since she introduced those taxes\u2014the largest one-year increase in rents we\u2019ve ever seen in this country\u2014her tax increases have clearly made the cost of living crisis much worse, just as she was warned they would? \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000141\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022feae5f69311c4437a15dcde93b8c7221\u0022\u003ERt Hon JACINDA ARDERN\u003C/span\u003E: Here, again, I will point the member back to what the increases have shown. However, the contrast that exists between this side of the House and the opposite is, rather than just seeing those increases and doing nothing, we have invested heavily in supporting low and middle income earners: first, the package of changes we\u2019ve made to try and improve the housing market for first-home buyers and renters\u2014and there is still more to do\u2014secondly, lifting the incomes of low and middle income earners, and on 1 April, we have another tranche of changes again. That stands in contrast with the members opposite, who want to get rid of all of those tax changes to try and help first-home buyers, who stood opposed to some of our measures to stop increases on more than an annual basis for renters, and who want to give those low and middle income earners $2.16 as a solution to the cost of living. We have a much more substantial package. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000142\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ea31fdd3-90e9-47d7-92a4-20b6a3109eef\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022c47db74b5eea4b5ca4427f3e13e20628\u0022\u003EChristopher Luxon\u003C/span\u003E: Does the fact she is now resorting to re-announcing policies that were already announced months ago show that her Government is simply running out of ideas? \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000143\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022f5fc233e95a64c47ac30096db973f022\u0022\u003ERt Hon JACINDA ARDERN\u003C/span\u003E: Two points I would make there: firstly, of course what we announced yesterday\u2014the 25c reduction in excise\u2014was in direct response to the war in Ukraine and the impact it is having on New Zealanders at the pump, as was the 50 percent reduction in public transport to encourage and support those who do have the choice of public transport to adopt it. It was not a policy developed last year, because there was no war last year. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000144\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ea31fdd3-90e9-47d7-92a4-20b6a3109eef\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002294137543013e4992b1473048d8078f3f\u0022\u003EChristopher Luxon\u003C/span\u003E: Can the Prime Minister explain why someone should pay more tax because of inflation? \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000145\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022c2360d7d91ba480c93c6e18d410ef489\u0022\u003ERt Hon JACINDA ARDERN\u003C/span\u003E: As I have already highlighted in the House, our primary focus has been on giving back to low and middle income earners at a much larger rate than the tax cuts proposed by the member. It is because our long-term measures to support living cost impacts are long term and targeted. By being targeted, they can be more generous, and, again, I contrast what someone on $45,000 would receive: over $20 on this side versus $2 from that side. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000146\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ea31fdd3-90e9-47d7-92a4-20b6a3109eef\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022091e2db2d2e447c1a6d3e4dca887f03f\u0022\u003EChristopher Luxon\u003C/span\u003E: What is her response to ANZ economist Miles Workman that \u201CInflation is now running laps around wage growth, meaning households are going backwards at an alarming rate.\u201D? \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000147\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022ff7a50dc00794a61b9b41263fa70e616\u0022\u003ERt Hon JACINDA ARDERN\u003C/span\u003E: I\u2019m sure that commentator would also reflect that that has not been the case since this Government came into office, and\u2014as I\u2019ve said many times\u2014since 2018, wages have increased at, roughly, 3.5 percent; inflation has been at 2.2 percent. We are in extraordinary times. We have the wicked perfect storm of a pandemic, the impact on supply, and, add to that, a war. It is having an effect, and that is why we have both the changes we announced yesterday to ease the pressure at the pump, and also the 1 April changes, both of which amount to a significant increase for low and middle income earners that is vastly different than what\u2019s being proposed by members opposite. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000148\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022da0dc22714d04bb8b7701c40302a2d96\u0022\u003EHon Chris Hipkins (remote)\u003C/span\u003E: Can the Prime Minister confirm that the last time New Zealanders experienced a significant increase in the cost of living, they also ended up paying significantly more tax because the then Government decided to increase GST?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000149\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a29e29085f754e829341c7fa44424d39\u0022\u003ERt Hon JACINDA ARDERN\u003C/span\u003E: I can confirm that the last time New Zealanders were experiencing food price increases was in, from memory, 2011, when the then National Government decided to increase GST, which we know is regressive and hits those who can afford it the least the most. That is fairly consistent with their most recent tax policy, where they have proposed to cut the top tax rate of those who earn\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000150\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022f99f2dbb5a9944699630e13c53b8408f\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Order! Order! The question itself was at the edge of the margin, and I think the Prime Minister has taken it beyond. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000151\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ea31fdd3-90e9-47d7-92a4-20b6a3109eef\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00223fb9292492c54e588e8847b9d1d1d45d\u0022\u003EChristopher Luxon\u003C/span\u003E: Is she honestly saying that Kiwis who have seen their real incomes fall over the past year shouldn\u2019t be concerned because inflation four years ago wasn\u2019t as bad? \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000152\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00225b76eb22d6f5413db7271d57f4306c13\u0022\u003ERt Hon JACINDA ARDERN\u003C/span\u003E: No. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000153\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ea31fdd3-90e9-47d7-92a4-20b6a3109eef\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022616f6ae49a9b41ac89b1c3c704cbcd2d\u0022\u003EChristopher Luxon\u003C/span\u003E: How does the Prime Minister think Kiwis struggling with the cost of living feel when they see a Government that\u2019s increased spending by more than $50 billion a year but has still somehow failed to make progress on any of its signature promises, and in areas like housing is actively making things worse? \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000154\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00221c39aa2f274446ccadaef6b296cd403f\u0022\u003ERt Hon JACINDA ARDERN\u003C/span\u003E: By making that statement, I can only assume the member does not support the measures that the Government took in the face of the pandemic to support businesses and keep people in employment, the most significant of which, of course, was the wage subsidy to keep people connected to employment. Just as it was our job to help support New Zealanders through the pandemic, it is our job to help them through the economic impacts that we\u2019ve seen as a result: keeping unemployment at 3.2 percent, as we have done, and debt relative to other countries as low as we have; and, now, supporting them through the cost of living impacts of the pandemic and the war. We demonstrated that we could respond quickly in the face of a pandemic; we are doing the same now in the wake of the Ukraine war. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000155\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dbaac12b-3efa-4d95-a08d-f0f637a48bab\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002214c53dff5c444ab3a0790a2607730e7c\u0022\u003EChl\u00F6e Swarbrick (remote)\u003C/span\u003E: Is there any evidence tax cuts for landlords will pass on to rent cuts for renters? \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000156\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002255796f907c14448c83d8698b053d0a9f\u0022\u003ERt Hon JACINDA ARDERN\u003C/span\u003E: We have consistently heard claims that when you increase, for instance, accommodation supplement, that immediately is taken up in rental increases. We\u2019ve consistently heard that making our homes warmer and drier will negatively impact on tenants, rather than actually keeping them warm, dry, and healthy. There is no evidence to suggest the changes that we\u2019ve been making in the areas the member has indicated and, in fact, all of those other areas have necessarily directly translated in the way the members across the House suggest. Again, it tells me that they actually have very few solutions on how to make the housing market more affordable and to support first-home buyers. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000157\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u0022eb531554496d45058da391bcb0706583\u0022\u003EQuestion No. 2\u2014Finance\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002261725fea-7d5e-4d1f-8fd3-e5779bb7a14d\u0022 data-id=\u0022f5b9da0951c34e05aaaa9e3de50b5151\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000158\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002261725fea-7d5e-4d1f-8fd3-e5779bb7a14d\u0022\u003E2. \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022f5b9da0951c34e05aaaa9e3de50b5151\u0022\u003EBARBARA EDMONDS (Labour\u2014Mana)\u003C/span\u003E to the Minister of Finance: What recent reports has he seen on the New Zealand economy?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022 data-id=\u002268995dce6a994aa4b4059bc1f450de75\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000159\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002268995dce6a994aa4b4059bc1f450de75\u0022\u003EHon GRANT ROBERTSON (Minister of Finance):\u003C/span\u003E In response to the Government\u2019s announcements yesterday to support New Zealanders through the global energy crisis with a temporary reduction in tax on fuel in New Zealand, ANZ bank economists reported that it would reduce inflation. By cutting the fuel excise duty and road user charges by 25c per litre for the next three months, they estimate that the direct impact of the change could reduce inflation in the June quarter by 0.5 percentage points. ANZ noted that the reduction will cause a one-off drop in prices, as well as a second-round impact, as most goods and services rely on fuel somewhere in the supply chain. They said, \u201Cthe impact is small in the context of the current levels of high inflation we\u2019re experiencing, but every little bit helps.\u201D We know there is no one answer, or easy answer, to addressing costs of living issues, but we are also continuing to act to support those most affected by cost of living increases, particularly through the packages that will come through on 1 April to support low- and middle-income households, superannuitants, and students.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000160\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002261725fea-7d5e-4d1f-8fd3-e5779bb7a14d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00223d3e7bc5a45d4b1b82c46b012a9c67d5\u0022\u003EBarbara Edmonds\u003C/span\u003E: What other impacts will the Government\u2019s announcement have for the economy?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000161\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022102d8ea4f052441d82e436d5446e2728\u0022\u003EHon GRANT ROBERTSON\u003C/span\u003E: The advice that we have received is that the decrease we have announced will save New Zealanders $17.25 every time they fill a 60-litre tank, and $11.50 every time they fill 40-litre tank. We recognise that fuel prices are expected to continue to rise due to Russia\u2019s invasion of Ukraine destabilising global energy markets, and we will continue to monitor the situation over the coming months and respond as required. I\u2019d also note that Treasury and the Ministry of Transport have estimated that the cost of the changes announced yesterday will be about $350 million for the three-month period. As this funding from the fuel excise duty goes directly into the National Land Transport Fund that pays for roads, public transport, and walking and cycling infrastructure around New Zealand, we have committed to top up that fund to recognise the critical importance of meeting the country\u2019s transport needs following decades of under-investment.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000162\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002261725fea-7d5e-4d1f-8fd3-e5779bb7a14d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022b5d1c5ec584041edb13c602533532ed3\u0022\u003EBarbara Edmonds\u003C/span\u003E: What steps is the Government taking in Budget 2022 to improve the resilience of the economy?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000163\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00228cf73c6ce21a4877b8fbe19be0f8bccc\u0022\u003EHon GRANT ROBERTSON\u003C/span\u003E: The global energy crisis highlights the importance of the move to energy security and independence for New Zealand. Budget 2022 will focus on investing in initiatives to reduce emissions and meet our climate goals. This will include moving away from volatile global oil markets by decarbonising our vehicle fleet and supporting public transport, cycling, and walking. To respond effectively we need to make significant investments across multiple Budgets. The new Climate Emergency Response Fund will invest the proceeds of our Emissions Trading Scheme to combat climate change and support the transition to a more resilient economy with investments that will create sustainable jobs and boost productivity. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000164\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u00223966edf027d84d8580c584272a06c558\u0022\u003EQuestion No. 3\u2014Finance\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022badb0a39-849c-462a-b32f-77fc017c9fc2\u0022 data-id=\u0022f4f3a66fdd0a432f91d7ea017df793b1\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000165\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022badb0a39-849c-462a-b32f-77fc017c9fc2\u0022\u003E3. \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022f4f3a66fdd0a432f91d7ea017df793b1\u0022\u003EHon SIMON BRIDGES (National\u2014Tauranga)\u003C/span\u003E to the Minister of Finance: Does he agree that New Zealand\u2019s cost of living crisis is wider than simply an energy crisis; if not, why?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022 data-id=\u0022747345af824d4cbe808c7111bc39e7e2\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000166\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022747345af824d4cbe808c7111bc39e7e2\u0022\u003EHon GRANT ROBERTSON (Minister of Finance):\u003C/span\u003E Can I begin by acknowledging the member\u2019s announcement that he made earlier today and to congratulate him on his political career and also on taking up the opportunities ahead of him, and wish him and his family all the very, very best. As I\u2019ve noted a number of times in this House, I do agree that many New Zealand families are facing significant costs of living increases as a result of factors such as global inflation and the war in Ukraine, and that this represents a crisis for many of them. That\u2019s why the Government yesterday announced a 25c per litre cut to the fuel excise duty and equivalent reductions in road-user charges. It\u2019s also why we have our focus squarely on those most affected, which is why there is a package of income support for middle and low income families from 1 April. This package stands in contrast to the member and his party, who are touting the same old National Party policies of giving tax cuts to the richest New Zealanders while giving $2 a week to those earning $45,000 a year.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000167\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022badb0a39-849c-462a-b32f-77fc017c9fc2\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022da28d00b639f455b9e71da00d19aa4c7\u0022\u003EHon Simon Bridges\u003C/span\u003E: Does he agree that we also have a food cost crisis, for example?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000168\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002288a1934df2e7477bbf87c563be2e4b42\u0022\u003EHon GRANT ROBERTSON\u003C/span\u003E: What I agree is what I said in my primary answer\u2014that for many New Zealanders the pressure that they are facing from rising prices is indeed a crisis for them. When it comes to the cost of food, I would note two things. The first is the importance of fuel in the food supply chain and the cost that it adds, and how that will be reduced by the announcement that we made yesterday. Secondly, we are continuing to focus on low and middle income earners, who have the hardest time when food prices rise. That\u2019s why the family tax credit going up by $20 per week matters so much. That\u2019s why the increases in benefits matter so much. It\u2019s just a pity that the member in his time here didn\u2019t support those changes.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000169\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022badb0a39-849c-462a-b32f-77fc017c9fc2\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022ef6e49def692407f89e74f354ea0faf1\u0022\u003EHon Simon Bridges\u003C/span\u003E: What does he say to struggling families around New Zealand dreading their grocery shopping, given that under his watch, food prices have increased by the highest amount in a decade in the last year, with essentials like fruit and veges up 17 percent, and tomatoes, for example\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000170\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022463f6fc36a0e46eca77083b1fa37a736\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Order! The member\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000171\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022badb0a39-849c-462a-b32f-77fc017c9fc2\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022062a2e362439421dab8213d67d22a3ea\u0022\u003EHon Simon Bridges\u003C/span\u003E: \u2014now at $7.29 a kilo. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000172\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022d67eb3e28ef84913a348b974fc542755\u0022\u003EHon GRANT ROBERTSON\u003C/span\u003E: What I would say to those people is that on this side of the House, we understand the pressure that rising prices mean. It\u2019s the reason why we\u2019re putting significant money in the pockets of low and middle income New Zealanders, as compared to that member and his party putting $2 a week in the pockets of someone on a low or middle income. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000173\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022badb0a39-849c-462a-b32f-77fc017c9fc2\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00224956d041d70a44fba03013b083dd28c7\u0022\u003EHon Simon Bridges\u003C/span\u003E: Does he fully accept and understand the wide-ranging nature of New Zealand\u2019s cost of living crisis\u2014whether it\u2019s energy, food, housing, or other price increases\u2014and isn\u2019t the answer to adopt a meaningful tax relief programme in Budget 2022, as Chris Luxon has suggested?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000174\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002250bc7bf95e7445719c437b2f89afb2d8\u0022\u003EHon GRANT ROBERTSON\u003C/span\u003E: I simply disagree with the member that it is meaningful for someone on $45,000 a year to be given $2 a week while members of this House would get thousands of dollars a year from Christopher Luxon\u2019s proposal. On this side of the House, we will continue to focus on low and middle income New Zealanders whilst also addressing the fuel issue that affects all of us.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000175\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022d1c8ad22cbb646b5adca841661e28154\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Order! Before the member takes that, there was, during the asking of that question, a fairly consistent interjection from my right, and as a result of that Mr Bridges will get an extra supplementary.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000176\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022badb0a39-849c-462a-b32f-77fc017c9fc2\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00228a9a0e20dd424bf9bc9b2603d981ca7d\u0022\u003EHon Simon Bridges\u003C/span\u003E: Will I always be his favourite National finance spokesperson? \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000177\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022203a5b81a95c49cf8d4c304f7ec69895\u0022\u003EHon GRANT ROBERTSON\u003C/span\u003E: I\u2019ve been giving significant thought to this question, and I can confirm for the member that among the six National Party finance spokespeople I have faced, he\u2019s in the top half. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000178\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022badb0a39-849c-462a-b32f-77fc017c9fc2\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00225a4fdd799aab489dac4537d76ecbf945\u0022\u003EHon Simon Bridges\u003C/span\u003E: What will he miss most about me? \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000179\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226007dc96-f459-4cdd-9972-4fde2c994088\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002246d2779166c04a63bf19d68885033069\u0022\u003EHon GRANT ROBERTSON\u003C/span\u003E: What I will miss about the member is his ability found latterly in his political career to not take himself too seriously, and I look forward to his hosting of the Country Calendar yak special.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000180\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u002251af1f3d98704057a66f342d91c00b07\u0022\u003EQuestion No. 4\u2014Energy and Resources\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022e60c1237-5e2d-4d0a-9678-ab10db67d1b7\u0022 data-id=\u0022f14a28b0c39540ccb7245cc1dd2954c0\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000181\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e60c1237-5e2d-4d0a-9678-ab10db67d1b7\u0022\u003E4. \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022f14a28b0c39540ccb7245cc1dd2954c0\u0022\u003EANGIE WARREN-CLARK (Labour) (remote)\u003C/span\u003E to the Minister of Energy and Resources: What actions is she taking to give New Zealanders confidence that they will receive the full benefit of the Government\u2019s 25 cent reduction in fuel excise duty and road-user charges announced yesterday?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002237a99b65-4919-4800-830d-3dd7c920d5cd\u0022 data-id=\u00227d497d2e52294b40968739fdf3d65fad\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000182\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002237a99b65-4919-4800-830d-3dd7c920d5cd\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00227d497d2e52294b40968739fdf3d65fad\u0022\u003EHon Dr MEGAN WOODS (Minister of Energy and Resources):\u003C/span\u003E Last night, I wrote to fuel companies to confirm that the Government\u2019s 25c per litre reduction in fuel excise would be passed on to consumers from 11.59 p.m. I also further outlined information disclosure that would be required, and I\u2019d like to thank Z Energy, who have already confirmed that they will voluntarily provide this information. In the coming days, I will propose changes to the Fuel Industry Amendment Regulations 2021 to compel the provision of daily rolling seven-day average margin information so we can monitor this. This information will be made publicly available. The Government\u2019s clear expectation is that fuel companies will pass on the full 25c per litre reduction plus the GST component to consumers. These changes will give New Zealanders confidence that the prices that they pay at the pump reflect our decision to reduce petrol excise duty.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000183\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e60c1237-5e2d-4d0a-9678-ab10db67d1b7\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00222edb622d0759426b8e2c3680fa6dc78c\u0022\u003EAngie Warren-Clark\u003C/span\u003E: When can New Zealanders expect to see a reduction in the prices they pay at the pump, as a result of these measures?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000184\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002237a99b65-4919-4800-830d-3dd7c920d5cd\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00227fb5af5179d4493c8495bbc476932764\u0022\u003EHon Dr MEGAN WOODS\u003C/span\u003E: Following yesterday\u2019s announcement, fuel companies began responding by 5 p.m., dropping their prices by 25c per litre. This means people are already saving $11.50 in excise on a 40-litre tank, and $17.25 on a 60-litre tank. I\u2019m pleased to see that fuel companies acted quickly to pass on savings to consumers, but the Government will continue to monitor prices to ensure that consumers get a better deal at the pump.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000185\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e60c1237-5e2d-4d0a-9678-ab10db67d1b7\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022d2a2821b3cbc4f44b33aefa3ff0dd919\u0022\u003EAngie Warren-Clark\u003C/span\u003E: What can New Zealanders do if they\u2019re concerned that savings are not being passed on?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000186\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002237a99b65-4919-4800-830d-3dd7c920d5cd\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022741575ed388544bea017d3e1b12e70b1\u0022\u003EHon Dr MEGAN WOODS\u003C/span\u003E: In addition to proposing changes to the Fuel Industry Amendment Regulations 2021 to increase monitoring of fuel company margins, I\u2019ve asked officials at the Ministry of Business, Innovation and Employment to follow up on concerns with prices. Of course, we will be collecting data at the company level, not the station level, but I encourage consumers to shop around. If people are concerned that the Government\u2019s reduction in fuel excise is not being passed on, they can email pricewatch@mbie.govt.nz. Emails will be followed up by officials to ensure that people get a better deal at the pump.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000187\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u002242ea6d41add443888db5d5e53e476cac\u0022\u003EQuestion No. 5\u2014Prime Minister\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022 data-id=\u00227a60d73b3d6b472ab7991e31d07576c9\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000188\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003E5. \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00227a60d73b3d6b472ab7991e31d07576c9\u0022\u003EDAVID SEYMOUR (Leader\u2014ACT)\u003C/span\u003E to the Prime Minister: Does she stand by all her Government\u2019s statements and actions?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022 data-id=\u0022e14124bb69ce4a38a28f84d96caa8337\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000189\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022e14124bb69ce4a38a28f84d96caa8337\u0022\u003ERt Hon JACINDA ARDERN (Prime Minister):\u003C/span\u003E Yes, particularly the Government\u2019s actions to increase incomes from 1 April, including increases to Working for Families, which will make around 346,000 families better off by an average of $20 a week\u2014adjusting the income thresholds for childcare assistance annually, in line with average wage growth, benefiting 1,000 families, or around 1,500 children, after this was something frozen by the previous National Government in 2010. Benefits are to increase by up to $35 a week, bringing the total increases for beneficiaries with children, over the time we have been in office, to an average $175 per week, increasing to $207 per week during the 2022 winter period. In addition, on 1 April, student allowances will increase by $25, superannuation will increase by $52 per fortnight for a single person and $80 for a couple. There\u2019s no silver bullet that will fix the cost of living but we have a plan and are implementing a range of measures that together will help to make a difference.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000190\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022f7fa97ffc9084b8294738b76b1afd62c\u0022\u003EDavid Seymour\u003C/span\u003E: Why did every single policy she just listed to increase incomes involve handing out taxpayer money, and what does that say about her level of aspiration for New Zealand?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000191\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022c437ad4f688b4f389ba8c6387d60d863\u0022\u003ERt Hon JACINDA ARDERN\u003C/span\u003E: If the member is opposed to universal superannuation, then that is a matter for the member. If the member does not believe in Government support through sole parent support or jobseeker support, that is, I think, an additional step even for the member. If the member doesn\u2019t believe in student support, again, that is for him to defend. And, again, if the member chooses to get rid of Working for Families, again, that would be a policy that I know the majority of New Zealanders would be very disappointed to hear.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000192\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002222ee95c2eca04771b2cf862009bbbb9f\u0022\u003EDavid Seymour\u003C/span\u003E: Why didn\u2019t the Prime Minister understand that was not an opportunity to talk about ACT\u2019s policies but to explain to New Zealanders what policies her Government has to raise real productivity, wage growth, and economic growth in this country, and why didn\u2019t she have anything to say about that?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000193\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022e6465825891f4beb9783e2f83fec295d\u0022\u003ERt Hon JACINDA ARDERN\u003C/span\u003E: I think it\u2019s only on this side of the House where we stand to gain from New Zealanders hearing more about ACT\u2019s policies. ACT\u2019s policies, which, if I were to simply touch on a few\u2014if we were just to look at the tax programme from ACT, they are proposing, for instance, tax cuts, that would essentially mean $11.85 billion, a hole in future Budgets, in order to give those on over $300,000 a $10,000 tax cut, and those on $45,000 or less absolutely nothing. Right now, the difference between this side of the House and that is that we have chosen to make targeted investments to support lower-middle income New Zealanders and make sure that we\u2019re investing in the services that they view as critical: health, education, and other investments that lessen the cost of living. On the other side of the House, they want tax cuts for the wealthy.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000194\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00229c9bf1146ffc4ae8ac4938047d2f183c\u0022\u003EDavid Seymour\u003C/span\u003E: Does she stand by her statement that New Zealanders face an energy crisis, and, if so, will the Government\u2019s response to this energy crisis be more successful than its response to the housing crisis, where the median house price has gone up $355,000, or 67 percent, on her watch?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000195\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022c65612ad99714690a464e472489f17af\u0022\u003ERt Hon JACINDA ARDERN\u003C/span\u003E: I traversed earlier in question time what we have seen in the housing market, be it the rental market or for homeownership more generally, in the past several years, dating back to well beyond even 2013. In answer to the first half of the member\u2019s question, I stand by those statements, which is why yesterday, as a Government, we moved swiftly to ensure that New Zealanders at the pump were seeing a 25c, and in many cases more, reduction in fuel as a result of the war in Ukraine. We stand by the quick and nimble response there shown to try and ease the pressure, and although it won\u2019t solve everything, our hope is combined, when the 1 April changes, it will make a difference for many.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000196\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00223bf0b792ae294a84b19ab106558fa524\u0022\u003EDavid Seymour\u003C/span\u003E: Does she stand by her earlier statement to this House that the policy to reduce petrol prices by 25c wasn\u2019t ready last year because there was no war and is a response to the war; and if she does stand by it, which budgetary appropriation is she using to fund it, or will this be like Ihum\u0101tao, where she spent $30 million illegally and got rapped over by the Auditor-General?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000197\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022ada85f4dcb88468dbfdc10e469591183\u0022\u003ERt Hon JACINDA ARDERN\u003C/span\u003E: I totally reject the second part of the question. But I will be generous to the member and answer the first part of the question. As the Minister of Finance already demonstrated yesterday, our ability to fund the $350 million that the excise reduction would mean comes from underspend as a result of, primarily, underspend on COVID spending, particularly managed isolation. This is a key difference. The likes of the Automobile Association have supported the initiative, primarily because unlike some of the proposals from the Opposition, we have said that we will not only see the reduction at the pump but we will keep funding critical transport projects and maintenance, which is not what we\u2019ve seen from other members in this House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000198\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a8ebf8aec68a4292a142ed8d11f52a8a\u0022\u003EDavid Seymour\u003C/span\u003E: Will the Government\u2019s response to the energy crisis be more successful than its response to what it\u2019s called a climate emergency, when emissions, according to Statistics New Zealand, have \u201Cshown no obvious sustained reductions compared to 2005\u201D\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000199\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002266b8ac02c87d457c98cd67cd8e99fa9f\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Order! Order! I\u2019ve been thinking about this line of questions. The member is not relating the primary question or subsequent supplementaries to the subsequent supplementary questions, and he is being ironic. I rule that question out.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000200\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022383b175c109b42dd80d5a97322a61806\u0022\u003EDavid Seymour\u003C/span\u003E: Point of order, Mr Speaker. Mr Speaker, the Prime Minister has led off talking about her energy policy. There\u2019s no irony in comparing it with the performance of other policies.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000201\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002287e712f52afd4237aa078ca32bd366d1\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Order! Order! The member will resume his seat. I\u2019ve ruled the question out. Does the member want a further supplementary?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000202\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022225f1f3551d04f4491d6fdc4810a065d\u0022\u003EDavid Seymour\u003C/span\u003E: Why did it take three months from when ACT said there was a cost of living crisis in December for the Prime Minister to admit that there is a cost of living crisis, when Kiwis have known it all along?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000203\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002249c3d586fe0e4661aae3f6cef6fb287e\u0022\u003ERt Hon JACINDA ARDERN\u003C/span\u003E: Actually, at the end of last year, the Government made the decision to put in place the Working for Families changes that come in on 1 April, at a cost of $270 million, which we took in advance of the Budget, because we anticipated exactly what we are seeing now, as part of the COVID response and recovery globally, causing significant cost of living increases.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000204\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00225faf8b90e5494f9ea879b8ade9af8c70\u0022\u003EDavid Seymour\u003C/span\u003E: Did the Prime Minister hesitate to agree there\u2019s a cost of living crisis because usually when she declares there\u2019s a crisis in an area, that\u2019s a prelude to things getting much worse?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000205\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a021cd8494e34ba099f76ca9e4600019\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Order! No. Order! The question was ironic, the member knew it was ironic\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000206\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022be394ac9b9ed415b8d8dce4d1c8ba9ab\u0022\u003EDavid Seymour\u003C/span\u003E: No, I didn\u2019t.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000207\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022f0412986533b428ab0a8821bdac5d32d\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Yes he did.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000208\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022826b60b9aaaa4798bc5a567ffbbec684\u0022\u003EDavid Seymour\u003C/span\u003E: Mr Speaker, point of order.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000209\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002220216b4e1f40415592a817032b4f696f\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: No, I\u2019ve ruled the question out, but point of order, David Seymour.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000210\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002270eaba3853d14d538acb8fa06e73e004\u0022\u003EDavid Seymour\u003C/span\u003E: Mr Speaker, the question\u2019s only ironic if you agree the Government\u2019s policies have failed\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000211\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022f4b1c69bda0f4f33b1dd6998b369c8b7\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Order! Order! The member\u2019s arguing with me again. He will cease now if he wants to stay here and if he wants his party to have any further supplementaries.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000212\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022489d736b-2629-4bc7-8d38-6319c7797a33\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022df9c9f2408144c399adbb243921b6b08\u0022\u003EMark Cameron\u003C/span\u003E: Does she stand by her Minister Stuart Nash\u2019s statement that \u201CI\u2019m not \u2026 sure what Groundswell stands for these days\u201D, and that \u201Cwhat I have read on their website [is] a mixture of racism [and] anti-vax, etc.\u201D; if not, will she apologise before meeting with them?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000213\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002205eafb2207e34705a0685380bc37c4e8\u0022\u003ERt Hon JACINDA ARDERN\u003C/span\u003E: The member that the member across is referring to, the Minister Stuart Nash, has already addressed those comments extensively in the public. The one thing I would say in addition to that is that I have met consistently, perhaps more than with any other sector, with our farming leaders. We have worked constructively together on a range of significant issues, and may I put on record the disappointment in the fact that across the vast majority of parties in this House, there is clear support of initiatives around climate change and emissions reduction, including to ensure that we maintain our reputation abroad, which we trade on on behalf of our primary producers, and instead, unfortunately, those members want to repeal the zero carbon Act, which would take us backwards and make us less competitive as primary producers on the world stage.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000214\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022098b8334-57f8-4062-bac6-bfbc3474e88e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00224f6a59e5da494fc1a4ade30a8f3af244\u0022\u003EHon Michael Wood\u003C/span\u003E: Does she stand by the Government\u2019s actions in securing a free-trade agreement with the United Kingdom?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000215\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aa2209f1-1889-4c24-b51d-cb2aedc7aa93\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002236dd8c6ce07142fa9be1d9b1482f9e66\u0022\u003ERt Hon JACINDA ARDERN\u003C/span\u003E: Absolutely, and I can do no better than reiterate the statements made by seasoned trade officials, who said that this is the best agreement in their memory that New Zealand has achieved, and I want to thank all members in this House who supported and worked so diligently, alongside our excellent trade officials, to deliver that deal, which will make a huge difference for our primary producers, who have carried much weight during the course of this pandemic and pandemic recovery.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000216\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u0022e928cd69ed64427cad63bfd558e79115\u0022\u003EQuestion No. 6\u2014Education\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022f677db8b-66c5-4794-953c-bdf7aa425710\u0022 data-id=\u0022554124cca756426f88dbaad6e0b811cc\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000217\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f677db8b-66c5-4794-953c-bdf7aa425710\u0022\u003E6. \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022554124cca756426f88dbaad6e0b811cc\u0022\u003EMARJA LUBECK (Labour) (remote)\u003C/span\u003E to the Minister of Education: What response has he seen to Government initiatives to support training and apprenticeships?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022 data-id=\u002214d235eaf156422caa1d82a6750b722d\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000218\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002214d235eaf156422caa1d82a6750b722d\u0022\u003EHon CHRIS HIPKINS (Minister of Education) (remote):\u003C/span\u003E I\u2019m pleased to report that New Zealanders are continuing to flock to the trades since we introduced the free vocational training and apprenticeships fund, or the Targeted Training and Apprenticeships Fund (TTAF). The latest enrolment data shows that 188,090 people have been supported through the fund since we introduced it in July 2020\u2014that includes more than 88,000 apprentices. The fund is making a range of qualifications in key targeted areas\u2014and all apprenticeships\u2014free until the end of this year.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000219\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f677db8b-66c5-4794-953c-bdf7aa425710\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00222305f2e5fc1b461eb5ccf96177807c9a\u0022\u003EMarja Lubeck\u003C/span\u003E: Has TTAF supported a diverse range of New Zealanders to undertake vocational education and training?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000220\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022ea0da2d1d63b4181b68a569f8b1074f0\u0022\u003EHon CHRIS HIPKINS\u003C/span\u003E: Yes, the Targeted Training and Apprenticeships Fund are supporting\u201432 percent of the learners supported by that fund are under the age of 25 years old, and 26 percent of them are over the age of 40. Twenty percent of the learners are M\u0101ori, 14 percent are Asian, and 9 percent are Pacific peoples\u2014these three groups collectively accounting for more than 40 percent of all those receiving support under the fund. Thirty-one percent of people supported by the fund are women, and that is significant given the historic under-representation of women in trades. We can still do better and we\u2019ll still keep pushing to do better.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000221\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f677db8b-66c5-4794-953c-bdf7aa425710\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022020886d5e8a84b2f90a8042823f3ceeb\u0022\u003EMarja Lubeck\u003C/span\u003E: What support have employers received from the Apprenticeship Boost initiative in relation to vocational learners in their workplaces?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000222\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00227f59193afa87429db47e8eba330e6248\u0022\u003EHon CHRIS HIPKINS\u003C/span\u003E: The Apprenticeship Boost is part of our COVID-19 support initiatives that helps employers to keep early-stage apprentices employed and training towards their qualification. Since it started in August of 2020, nearly 17,000 employers have been supported to retain over 42,000 first- and second-year apprentices and to take on new apprentices. We now have an unprecedented number of apprentices. In the first two months of this year, we\u2019ve funded over 56,000 apprentices\u2014that\u2019s compared to 48,000 in the same period last year, 2021, and just 37,000 in 2020. So it\u2019s an increase of 18 percent over last year and 55 percent over 2020. As a Government, we\u2019ve been focused on rebuilding our trades and vocational education and training systems, and that work is really delivering results.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000223\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u002282b42250484343b59e417a290884d94b\u0022\u003EQuestion No. 7\u2014Transport\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002219ed20db-5d6c-4464-9327-6cdd072bb4fe\u0022 data-id=\u00226709002c8f314af6a5e4fc5d619f320d\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000224\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002219ed20db-5d6c-4464-9327-6cdd072bb4fe\u0022\u003E7. \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00226709002c8f314af6a5e4fc5d619f320d\u0022\u003ERICARDO MEN\u00C9NDEZ MARCH (Green)\u003C/span\u003E to the Minister of Transport: What steps, if any, will he take to ensure people have access to free, frequent, and accessible public transport?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022098b8334-57f8-4062-bac6-bfbc3474e88e\u0022 data-id=\u00228c48f762226a4e689a1ef854f3cb4c56\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000225\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022098b8334-57f8-4062-bac6-bfbc3474e88e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00228c48f762226a4e689a1ef854f3cb4c56\u0022\u003EHon MICHAEL WOOD (Minister of Transport):\u003C/span\u003E The Government is committed to supporting more people to travel by public transport and to ensuring that public transport is frequent, reliable, and accessible to support mode shift and our emissions reductions goals. The member will be familiar with announcements that were made yesterday that will assist significantly there over the next three months. In addition, we have, over the course of our time in Government, increased public transport funding in the National Land Transport Fund from $336 million to $636 million. This has supported better outcomes, such as new public transport services in places like Timaru, which now has an on-demand public transport system; $2 fares for buses in Queenstown; major new infrastructure such as the Puhinui train station in Auckland, partly funded by the regional fuel tax; and the Eastern Busway. I also announced earlier this year a pilot Community Connect card to provide half-price public transport to low-income earners in Auckland. I would note that while affordable fares are an important part of ensuring an accessible public transport system, they\u2019re not the only part. Making public transport completely free would reduce the revenue coming into the system, and much international evidence suggests that factors such as the frequency and reliability of services are actually more important in terms of driving patronage than free fares.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000226\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002219ed20db-5d6c-4464-9327-6cdd072bb4fe\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022e79d5ab7f17b4e62a4f2d2d193b90557\u0022\u003ERicardo Men\u00E9ndez March\u003C/span\u003E: Why not both increase the frequency of public transport services and make fares free?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000227\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022098b8334-57f8-4062-bac6-bfbc3474e88e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022b32d6c7ff59f4e0a9a1827fa47c60709\u0022\u003EHon MICHAEL WOOD\u003C/span\u003E: As I\u2019ve outlined in my primary answer, the Government is focused both on improving services\u2014also on improving infrastructure\u2014and on making sure that fares are as affordable as possible. I\u2019ve noted the introduction of the Community Connect card on a trial basis in Auckland from 1 July, which will halve fares for people on a community services card. That\u2019s a trial that we want to examine to see if it can be expanded further out. And, of course, as of yesterday, the Government has announced a half-price public transport fare system for the next three months to assist people with cost challenges.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000228\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002219ed20db-5d6c-4464-9327-6cdd072bb4fe\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022dec9d3b6c020482ca11300a06604cb1a\u0022\u003ERicardo Men\u00E9ndez March\u003C/span\u003E: Why did the Government yesterday not make public transport completely free in the same way it did in March 2020, which would allow people to better participate in their communities, further reduce the cost of living, and be quicker to implement?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000229\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022098b8334-57f8-4062-bac6-bfbc3474e88e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002246105490e28d47c6b9d401983ba2b01e\u0022\u003EHon MICHAEL WOOD\u003C/span\u003E: The Government announced a significant package of initiatives which will assist New Zealanders to meet cost challenges and to be able to connect in a more affordable way, including significant reductions to the fuel excise duty and road-user charges, and the half-price public transport fares over that period. As ever, we have to consider carefully the priorities that we have, where expenditure will go, and what will achieve the best effect. I do note that there are some complexities involved in shifting towards a fare-free system. One that has been raised with me by local government, for example, is that one of the benefits of people having to pay fares, whether it\u2019s via ticket or whether it\u2019s via card, is that we collect good patronage data, which enables services to be better planned, and that would be potentially lost if there were free fares. So it\u2019s about priorities, it\u2019s about where the investment best goes to get the outcomes we want, and it\u2019s about some of these complexities that aren\u2019t always obvious on the surface.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000230\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002219ed20db-5d6c-4464-9327-6cdd072bb4fe\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00220bbbb65126694f6aa523b34ab9be2419\u0022\u003ERicardo Men\u00E9ndez March\u003C/span\u003E: Will he commit to extending the discount on public transport fares beyond three months to address inequality and help reduce emissions; if not, why not?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000231\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022098b8334-57f8-4062-bac6-bfbc3474e88e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022fb7d2249b9d642f1a5753ea3234d1c4b\u0022\u003EHon MICHAEL WOOD\u003C/span\u003E: This is a Government which has done more than any other to improve public transport services and to make fares more affordable. As I\u2019ve outlined, we have made a decision to provide funding to local authorities and Waka Kotahi to reduce those fares by half over the next three months, and that is the commitment that we have made. Beyond that, the Government has agreed that we will move forward with the Community Connect pilot in Auckland from 1 July. But, as we move through the Budget process and into the future, including our response within the emissions reduction plan, we\u2019ll continue to look at what we can do to support more Kiwis into high-quality, frequent public transport.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000232\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002219ed20db-5d6c-4464-9327-6cdd072bb4fe\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00221fcb3e8d36fa4ee8a4cb3a4ca61485bb\u0022\u003ERicardo Men\u00E9ndez March\u003C/span\u003E: Does he agree with Labour Party - endorsed Auckland mayoral candidate Efeso Collins, who said, about free public transport, that \u201CIf we are going to address our climate emissions this is the first and best way to do it.\u201D?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000233\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022098b8334-57f8-4062-bac6-bfbc3474e88e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022832bd8ecc5904dd798dd233c85c6d8f4\u0022\u003EHon MICHAEL WOOD\u003C/span\u003E: As I\u2019ve outlined, there are a range of factors which have been shown to improve public transport patronage. Fares clearly have a place within that, but, actually, much of the evidence is that the quality and the frequency of services is actually more significant. So there are choices for both central and local government leaders to make in terms of where resources go to get the best outcomes for the public transport system. As I always say to local government figures, they also have a part to play here. If local government wants to put additional funding into the system to reduce fares, they can do that in the same way that central government currently is.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000234\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002219ed20db-5d6c-4464-9327-6cdd072bb4fe\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022bbdd4a5b8cb7414788f16708cbf8be53\u0022\u003ERicardo Men\u00E9ndez March\u003C/span\u003E: Does he think it would be easier to deliver frequent and good-quality public transport if our infrastructure and services were publicly owned?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000235\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022098b8334-57f8-4062-bac6-bfbc3474e88e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022c6555189359048059ffa962f0d7c0951\u0022\u003EHon MICHAEL WOOD\u003C/span\u003E: The Government is currently reviewing the public transport operating model, and, as a part of that process, which is reaching its conclusions before coming to Cabinet, the set of questions around the appropriate ownership and operations of public transport infrastructure are being considered. So that\u2019s something that I hope to have more to say about in the coming months.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000236\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u002229a40228052046e29dcb24f513be6106\u0022\u003EQuestion No. 8\u2014Environment\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002227535d92-0798-4e04-be80-9e91b53610e2\u0022 data-id=\u0022e282ad4232b7457c90cec06ae1533a14\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000237\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002227535d92-0798-4e04-be80-9e91b53610e2\u0022\u003E8. \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022e282ad4232b7457c90cec06ae1533a14\u0022\u003ERACHEL BROOKING (Labour) (remote)\u003C/span\u003E to the Minister for the Environment: What steps is the Government taking to improve recycling in New Zealand?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022f5d71749-ae91-4af7-b2bd-77260398912a\u0022 data-id=\u002283b5892d80c14fd989884cfb5ccd6b98\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000238\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f5d71749-ae91-4af7-b2bd-77260398912a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002283b5892d80c14fd989884cfb5ccd6b98\u0022\u003EHon DAVID PARKER (Minister for the Environment):\u003C/span\u003E Every year, New Zealand generates more than 17 million tonnes of waste and sends two-thirds\u2014almost 13 tonnes\u2014of that to landfill. Just one-third is recycled. Other developed countries do twice as well, recycling two-thirds. Here, too much rubbish ends up in recycling bins, degrading the good stuff. Too much recyclable material goes into the rubbish bin and is wasted. Too much litter ends up on the streets. We\u2019ve announced a plan to improve recycling with three main parts: standardising kerbside recycling; secondly, a container deposit scheme to incentivise people to return their empty drink containers; and, thirdly, separation of business food scraps from general waste to reduce greenhouse gases and recycle the nutrients. These actions will make a difference and we look forward to Kiwis submitting on the plan.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000239\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002227535d92-0798-4e04-be80-9e91b53610e2\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00229c5cbcac63954704afc3ac36df89778f\u0022\u003ERachel Brooking\u003C/span\u003E: Why is the Government standardising kerbside collection?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000240\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f5d71749-ae91-4af7-b2bd-77260398912a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022fdf4baa0063e4925a09ea93e6dc7cc11\u0022\u003EHon DAVID PARKER\u003C/span\u003E: Standardising kerbside recycling will reduce confusion and help businesses design packaging that is recyclable anywhere in New Zealand. This will make it simpler and easier for people to recycle. Councils and their contractors have asked for these improvements. Food scraps make up more than a third of a typical household\u2019s rubbish each week, and rotting waste overall accounts for about 9 percent of New Zealand\u2019s biogenic methane emissions. I\u2019m advised that landfill gas capture is unable to meet the methane reduction targets recommended by the climate commission. Accordingly, separating food scraps for collection is necessary to reduce those emissions and return the nutrients to the soil.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000241\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002227535d92-0798-4e04-be80-9e91b53610e2\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022bf04fbcf52fd4d7298730ab00c5f5b93\u0022\u003ERachel Brooking\u003C/span\u003E: Why is the Government proposing a container return scheme?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000242\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f5d71749-ae91-4af7-b2bd-77260398912a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a56dd543f23e4b21972936d8d0849b78\u0022\u003EHon DAVID PARKER\u003C/span\u003E: About two and a half billion drink containers are sold every year in New Zealand. Less than half of these containers are recycled, meaning that over a billion containers end up as litter, is stockpiled, or is sent to landfills every year. With a container return scheme, we can increase our recycling for beverage containers to between 85 percent and 90 percent. People will return empty drink containers in exchange for a refundable deposit. This will also increase the supply of recovered materials for our onshore recycling system and for our container manufacturers, and it will also help sustainably underpin the economics of many community recycling facilities.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000243\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u0022f38765b9736d47f1925a7a0e9a28b75a\u0022\u003EQuestion No. 9\u2014Transport\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002255d0b7a4-a2c9-4c38-9b77-475311a48a89\u0022 data-id=\u0022929232ee97914e89a5e1b998a4d40d66\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000244\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002255d0b7a4-a2c9-4c38-9b77-475311a48a89\u0022\u003E9. \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022929232ee97914e89a5e1b998a4d40d66\u0022\u003ESIMEON BROWN (National\u2014Pakuranga)\u003C/span\u003E to the Minister of Transport: Does he have confidence taxpayers are getting value for money with Government transport spending; if so, why?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022098b8334-57f8-4062-bac6-bfbc3474e88e\u0022 data-id=\u0022bd13532f851d4b24b54363c4e5e88723\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000245\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022098b8334-57f8-4062-bac6-bfbc3474e88e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022bd13532f851d4b24b54363c4e5e88723\u0022\u003EHon MICHAEL WOOD (Minister of Transport):\u003C/span\u003E Yes, across over $5 billion of annual expenditure in the transport system, I believe that there is significant value for money for New Zealanders. Some recent examples include the Maintaining International Air Connectivity scheme, which has enabled nearly $19 billion of New Zealand exports to get to markets. The opening of stage 1 of the Eastern Busway, which is providing the people of Pakuranga with frequent and reliable public transport services for the first time, and the reopening of the Napier to Wairoa rail line, which has taken hundreds of logging trucks off regional roads. While not every decision about the use of taxpayer money has or will always meet my expectations, particularly given the devolved nature of decision making to Crown agencies and State-owned enterprises, I will continue to ensure, where I have responsibility, that the spend of taxpayer money is responsible and proportionate and should, at all times, consider what is good value for money.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000246\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002255d0b7a4-a2c9-4c38-9b77-475311a48a89\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002224c292374efe47f3937c3585626e77e2\u0022\u003ESimeon Brown\u003C/span\u003E: What is his response to Treasury\u2019s advice regarding Auckland light rail that \u201CWe have low confidence that these benefits will be realised, resulting in poor public value.\u201D; and does he think spending up to $29.2 billion for light rail is justifiable to taxpayers?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000247\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022098b8334-57f8-4062-bac6-bfbc3474e88e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002272e58b1c85c04673bdd678061a04c579\u0022\u003EHon MICHAEL WOOD\u003C/span\u003E: I think the member needs to read the comments in the full context of Treasury\u2019s advice on this project, including Treasury\u2019s gateway review of the Auckland light rail unit\u2019s business case, which came through with very positive advice for the Government. I think the member also has to be a little careful with the figures that he is using. The cost of the Auckland light rail project, as assessed by the Auckland light rail unit, is $10.4 billion at net present value; $14.6 billion at an inflated value. The figure that the member is using is simply taking those figures, reducing by 50 percent to get a possible lowest cost, and increasing by 100 percent to get a possible outlying cost\u2014those are not actually projections that are based on costings that have been done by the unit.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000248\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002255d0b7a4-a2c9-4c38-9b77-475311a48a89\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022ca4ce2d15b7f48d8b6f9fd6ea9c99da9\u0022\u003ESimeon Brown\u003C/span\u003E: When Kiwis are facing a cost of living crisis, does the Minister think it is acceptable to spend up to $29.2 billion on his Auckland light rail project at a cost of almost $16,000 per New Zealand household?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000249\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002279db8b64-1f9b-4416-9b81-a12963db9cbf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022c97e0652726543ac8acfc0a9915c18a7\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Order! Before the member answers, I\u2019m going to give the member one more chance to ask the question in a way that\u2019s in order.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000250\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002255d0b7a4-a2c9-4c38-9b77-475311a48a89\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022c4580b2c7dbf4c93bf28e075b67f4b36\u0022\u003ESimeon Brown\u003C/span\u003E: Does the Minister think it is acceptable to spend up to $29.2 billion on his Auckland light rail project, at a cost of almost $16,000 per New Zealand household? \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000251\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022098b8334-57f8-4062-bac6-bfbc3474e88e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022e4856ef5ae0e4401992ebe17c76885de\u0022\u003EHon MICHAEL WOOD\u003C/span\u003E: I reject the premise of the member\u2019s question. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000252\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002262828428-6565-42b4-bd4d-fa3b12531f88\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022b67674925176486dbc0f1b6dc0a5f0f3\u0022\u003ESimon Court\u003C/span\u003E: Does he agree with Treasury on light rail that \u201CThere is an emerging risk that the costs will be significantly higher than the previous estimates\u201D, and can he guarantee that the benefits of light rail will exceed the costs?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000253\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022098b8334-57f8-4062-bac6-bfbc3474e88e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022f9324715ed4648c38f4f52a53a2b79c0\u0022\u003EHon MICHAEL WOOD\u003C/span\u003E: I always value the advice provided by Government departments, including Treasury, but, no, I don\u2019t always agree with them, and the job of Ministers is to consider that advice and then to make considered decisions, and that\u2019s what we\u2019ve done in this case. I note that the formal advice that was presented to Cabinet through the indicative business case, provided by the light rail unit, which went through a Treasury gateway process, showed that all of the options before us\u2014including the one that we have selected\u2014have positive strategic cases, positive economic cases, a positive business case, and a positive benefit-cost ratio. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000254\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002262828428-6565-42b4-bd4d-fa3b12531f88\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022da2818fbaa884fb69632f138ce5d7fd9\u0022\u003ESimon Court\u003C/span\u003E: Will he rule out an annual thousand-dollar tax on properties along the light rail route, as proposed in the light rail indicative business case? \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000255\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022098b8334-57f8-4062-bac6-bfbc3474e88e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022165f732f36994b97b344693bb19156f7\u0022\u003EHon MICHAEL WOOD\u003C/span\u003E: The light rail indicative business case does not make a proposal of that kind, and no such proposal is before the Government. The light rail business case and report to the Government suggests that value capture can be an important part of how the project is funding\u2014something that has received support, for example from Simon Bridges, across the House. Further work will have to be done to develop a scheme that is fair and equitable. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000256\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002255d0b7a4-a2c9-4c38-9b77-475311a48a89\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002257c5a541d2484adea9a1f88cbb462f99\u0022\u003ESimeon Brown\u003C/span\u003E: What value have Aucklanders received from the $50 million he spent on the Auckland cycling bridge, which he then cancelled, and is he confident this doesn\u2019t amount to wasteful spending? \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000257\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022098b8334-57f8-4062-bac6-bfbc3474e88e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00227dcfdbfbd0cd4d039e49fe57b59ae7df\u0022\u003EHon MICHAEL WOOD\u003C/span\u003E: The Northern Pathway project, as the member is well aware, has been reallocated so that funding allocated to that project is going to a range of important projects, including stage 2 of the Eastern Busway. To the extent that expenditure was spent that has not resulted in the particular outcome there, that is a matter of some disappointment, but we move forward to deliver the outcomes that Aucklanders need\u2014outcomes that were ignored for many, many years under that previous Government. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000258\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002255d0b7a4-a2c9-4c38-9b77-475311a48a89\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00223c2317a5e4fd43dfa5e1f4fcdc19a7dd\u0022\u003ESimeon Brown\u003C/span\u003E: What value have Wellingtonians received from the $35 million spent on consultants for Let\u2019s Get Wellington Moving, when only $253,000 has been spent on actual construction? \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000259\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022098b8334-57f8-4062-bac6-bfbc3474e88e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002271f9471c37dd467dbbbe97484e6183d8\u0022\u003EHon MICHAEL WOOD\u003C/span\u003E: Wellington was let down for too many years, including by a former Prime Minister who wrote it off as \u201Ca dying city\u201D. Our Government disagrees with that assessment and is finally making the investments in a transport system fit for a first world, thriving capital city. Anyone who actually knows anything about how major transport programmes work, including how one might go about establishing a mass rapid transit system, will understand that before construction can occur, there needs to be investment in design, planning, and consenting, and that is what we are getting on with. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000260\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u002243567fc16f644ef4b58f48e949f12233\u0022\u003EQuestion No. 10\u2014Health (M\u0101ori Health)\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022b464a62e-d900-452a-b842-e3cf4ccc6149\u0022 data-id=\u0022bf640f7c0e3f443d9eb19b3f11001c5b\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000261\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b464a62e-d900-452a-b842-e3cf4ccc6149\u0022\u003E10. \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022bf640f7c0e3f443d9eb19b3f11001c5b\u0022\u003EARENA WILLIAMS (Labour\u2014Manurewa) (remote)\u003C/span\u003E to the Associate Minister of Health (M\u0101ori Health): What recent announcement has he made regarding the interim M\u0101ori Health Authority?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022e77494a0-1be1-432f-b492-fd160f4c119d\u0022 data-id=\u0022bde129c072874b68a1ffc3aa0db56326\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000262\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e77494a0-1be1-432f-b492-fd160f4c119d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022bde129c072874b68a1ffc3aa0db56326\u0022\u003EHon PEENI HENARE (Associate Minister of Health (M\u0101ori Health)) (remote):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Mr Speaker. This morning I was at the Takap\u016Bw\u0101hia Marae with my colleague the Hon Andrew Little to announce the interim M\u0101ori Health Authority\u2019s first commissioning budget, totalling just over $22 million in funding. This first commissioning budget is a notable further step forward in delivering Pae Ora or Healthy Futures for wh\u0101nau across New Zealand. I am pleased that the interim M\u0101ori Health Authority is getting to work quickly to commission providers to deliver services that will make a huge difference in the lives of M\u0101ori wh\u0101nau.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000263\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b464a62e-d900-452a-b842-e3cf4ccc6149\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022fba7ca57db814fa78479d6541256133a\u0022\u003EArena Williams\u003C/span\u003E: Why is this funding necessary?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000264\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e77494a0-1be1-432f-b492-fd160f4c119d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002282e6ac52e4c84be3bf955c39372d3e47\u0022\u003EHon PEENI HENARE\u003C/span\u003E: For too long, the health system has failed to address the disproportionate health outcomes that M\u0101ori face. On average, M\u0101ori die seven years younger than other population groups, and this situation cannot be allowed to continue. The initial investment we outlined today will start to lay the foundation for the authority\u2019s ongoing role supporting kaupapa M\u0101ori health services to improve outcomes for wh\u0101nau and I can\u2019t reiterate enough that this Government is serious about improving the health outcomes for all New Zealanders. The funding announcement today will not only support M\u0101ori wh\u0101nau, it will also improve the overall health outcomes for Aotearoa New Zealand.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000265\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b464a62e-d900-452a-b842-e3cf4ccc6149\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022b63161ed09f04392b46a309ac5127382\u0022\u003EArena Williams\u003C/span\u003E: So how will this funding help improve health outcomes for wh\u0101nau?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000266\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e77494a0-1be1-432f-b492-fd160f4c119d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022de894d1512e547b89f282574e1293cf3\u0022\u003EHon PEENI HENARE\u003C/span\u003E: Through its first commissioning budget, the interim M\u0101ori Health Authority has outlined its first commitments to embed and expand Te Ao M\u0101ori solutions across our health system, including in areas such as m\u0101tauranga M\u0101ori initiatives and the further development of the M\u0101ori health workforce. The interim M\u0101ori Health Authority will now work with iwi-M\u0101ori partnership boards to create services that could include health education, p\u016Br\u0101kau, resource development, and models centred on addressing the wider social and environmental detriments of health in their communities. This is about putting wh\u0101nau first and supporting new and different approaches that work for M\u0101ori, wh\u0101nau, and their communities.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000267\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u00220bd5d1ebf49f4884a37b8569d88862f8\u0022\u003EQuestion No. 11\u2014Local Government\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022713ccc5b-7ff0-4fa5-ab58-4780620184fe\u0022 data-id=\u00221366f4df2ed24f16b858279c54a6418a\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000268\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022713ccc5b-7ff0-4fa5-ab58-4780620184fe\u0022\u003E11. \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00221366f4df2ed24f16b858279c54a6418a\u0022\u003ESIMON WATTS (National\u2014North Shore)\u003C/span\u003E to the Minister of Local Government: Does she stand by her statement on the Three Waters reform that \u201CThere are two areas of the Three Waters reform programme that I underestimated, and I acknowledge that\u2019s my responsibility\u201D, and is she confident it is only two areas she underestimated?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00220e7e8da2-a6a1-41bb-aeb0-a49be255a293\u0022 data-id=\u0022ddab42bd02e4452c9706b1851c6aa1c7\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000269\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220e7e8da2-a6a1-41bb-aeb0-a49be255a293\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022ddab42bd02e4452c9706b1851c6aa1c7\u0022\u003EHon NANAIA MAHUTA (Minister of Local Government) (remote):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Mr Speaker. Yes, and to elaborate further I stand by my comment that it is not widely understood by the public just how bad the situation in relation to the current performance and future challenges of Three Waters is. It shouldn\u2019t take burst pipes, waste-water overflows, or unsafe drinking water with boiled water notices for us to take notice and care about water infrastructure and service delivery. After three years of review the evidence was so overwhelming there was no other option than to proceed with reform. Continuing to ignore the problem in the face of now compelling evidence would be irresponsible and the status quo is not an option.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000270\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022713ccc5b-7ff0-4fa5-ab58-4780620184fe\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022344fb494b9a04eb897a056f1d91a9ce2\u0022\u003ESimon Watts\u003C/span\u003E: Does she stand by her statement that \u201CI underestimated that the public really knew what was happening with pipes under the ground, and they had a lot more knowledge about the trade-offs that councils were always making\u201D; and if so, will she now give actual consideration to the alternatives like those proposed by Communities 4 Local Democracy?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000271\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220e7e8da2-a6a1-41bb-aeb0-a49be255a293\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00226f125efbffe74ee69d6f1fe9a50dcbcb\u0022\u003EHon NANAIA MAHUTA\u003C/span\u003E: Yes, I stand by my statements that the public did not know the trade-offs that councils were continuing to make between what was being spent above the ground and below the ground. And in addition to that, I consulted with local government to ensure the approach to reform of the Three Waters infrastructure and service delivery arrangements were one that kept the affordability issues for ratepayers in front of our opportunity to reform, as well as Treaty settlement obligations\u2014which was a matter raised by the sector\u2014as well as separating balance sheets to enable a financially sustainable model for the ongoing investment in waters infrastructure. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000272\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022713ccc5b-7ff0-4fa5-ab58-4780620184fe\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00223f35ca857e594db09b191092bdb28d18\u0022\u003ESimon Watts\u003C/span\u003E: Does she stand by her statement that \u201Cthe advertising campaign wasn\u2019t the best way to tell the message\u201D; and if so, will she apologise to local councils for spending $4 million in taxpayer dollars on a campaign blaming them for water infrastructure failures?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000273\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220e7e8da2-a6a1-41bb-aeb0-a49be255a293\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022e6910b2cdcd04b7b8734e07fc373e125\u0022\u003EHon NANAIA MAHUTA\u003C/span\u003E: As referred to in my response around a miscalculation of the sensitivity around the advertising campaign, I want to draw a line under the criticism on that issue because it was one where the sector felt that they were being blamed for decades of under-investment in waters infrastructure. But if we look at the budget that was appropriated\u2014and that was around about $3.5 million\u2014$2.8 million was spent in advertising, including TV advertising, print advertising, and social media advertising. I still stand by the view that we need to do more to educate the public with facts around the parlous state of the waters infrastructure network, and the need to invest more. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000274\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022713ccc5b-7ff0-4fa5-ab58-4780620184fe\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00229e93f25fea11451389193f9505f2b192\u0022\u003ESimon Watts\u003C/span\u003E: Has she also underestimated the ability of her water entities to achieve balance sheet separation and financial benefits; and if not, how can the public be confident given her recent underestimations?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000275\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220e7e8da2-a6a1-41bb-aeb0-a49be255a293\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022761fbaaebb634936abc6d519c0b4d21b\u0022\u003EHon NANAIA MAHUTA\u003C/span\u003E: I think the member might be conflating a number of things, because I\u2019d like to acknowledge the contribution of the governance working group who recently, in their recommendations, identified a number of areas where we can strengthen the governance, representation, and local voice aspects of the Government\u2019s reform programme to ensure that there is greater line of sight between the aspirations of community and the ability to invest in waters infrastructure. At the end of their recommendations, they go on to say that the Government will need to test those recommendations in relation to credit rating and the ability to separate balance sheets.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000276\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022713ccc5b-7ff0-4fa5-ab58-4780620184fe\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00224d659faa74a24dab96555a9063ae4175\u0022\u003ESimon Watts\u003C/span\u003E: Given she now acknowledges she underestimated the public\u2019s understanding of water infrastructure and trade-offs, will she recognise that the majority of the public rejects her reforms and so it\u2019s time for her to rethink Three Waters?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000277\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220e7e8da2-a6a1-41bb-aeb0-a49be255a293\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002225c612db0ca048eaae735ff5ada2fefd\u0022\u003EHon NANAIA MAHUTA\u003C/span\u003E: I join with the local government sector who admit that further work needs to be done to ensure that the public gets good information about the parlous state of waters infrastructure and the need to invest more in that area. The modelling that we have done proves that there is around about $125 billion to $195 billion needed over the next 30 years to ensure greater resilience in our waters infrastructure. We need to find a financially sustainable way to achieve that. At the heart of our reform programme, we are trying to separate balance sheets between councils and the ability to invest in water infrastructure. The model that we have in front of us seriously enables that opportunity, and it will be a total sum benefit to the affordability aspects that ratepayers are currently challenged with.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000278\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u00228aa22ce667fe42229cfa6d559d3554ea\u0022\u003EQuestion No. 12\u2014Transport\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00229c069cdb-968c-4f11-b126-92f9c655148b\u0022 data-id=\u002247527649e97b46a39b08fd970efb4bc7\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000279\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00229c069cdb-968c-4f11-b126-92f9c655148b\u0022\u003E12. \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002247527649e97b46a39b08fd970efb4bc7\u0022\u003ESHANAN HALBERT (Labour\u2014Northcote) (remote)\u003C/span\u003E to the Minister of Transport: What recent steps has the Government taken to support New Zealanders to use public transport in response to the global energy shock?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022098b8334-57f8-4062-bac6-bfbc3474e88e\u0022 data-id=\u002282021912f7b5424aa1da1d86697bff98\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000280\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022098b8334-57f8-4062-bac6-bfbc3474e88e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002282021912f7b5424aa1da1d86697bff98\u0022\u003EHon MICHAEL WOOD (Minister of Transport):\u003C/span\u003E Yesterday, the Government announced that, in response to the global energy shock we are experiencing, public transport fares will be halved for a period of three months to give commuters more options to change the way they travel. At a time of rising fuel prices, brought on in part by Russia\u2019s invasion of Ukraine, the Government has acted swiftly to encourage uptake of public transport by making it a more affordable alternative. It\u2019s expected that this initiative will commence from approximately 1 April, working aside our local government partners, alongside a suite of other measures which will see significant increases in the take-home income of Kiwi families.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000281\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00229c069cdb-968c-4f11-b126-92f9c655148b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022724274b225814f12ab5332fc63b11b4c\u0022\u003EShanan Halbert\u003C/span\u003E: What are the benefits of reduced public transport fares for passengers?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000282\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022098b8334-57f8-4062-bac6-bfbc3474e88e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022ed5fea662d0945468096d06e661ecec9\u0022\u003EHon MICHAEL WOOD\u003C/span\u003E: Primarily, the reduced fares will place a lesser burden on those who might already be making use of the public transport system and make public transport a more viable alternative for families and those who otherwise might find the cost a barrier. Additionally, increasing uptake of public transport and changes in the way that we travel had been identified by the Climate Change Commission as a key factor in reducing emissions from the transport sector.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000283\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00229c069cdb-968c-4f11-b126-92f9c655148b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002260e652902aa145e0ba8c429e49bd4a3d\u0022\u003EShanan Halbert\u003C/span\u003E: What are the flow-on benefits, if any, that this will have for public transport in the coming months?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000284\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022098b8334-57f8-4062-bac6-bfbc3474e88e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022bf492983dd034654ae07e1d9bd1a666e\u0022\u003EHon MICHAEL WOOD\u003C/span\u003E: The last two years have been a challenging time for public transport operators in New Zealand. With a reduction in patronage, we\u2019ve dealt with the impacts of COVID and now the Omicron wave. This initiative has the dual benefit, therefore, of incentivising those who would otherwise be using their cars to use a bus or a train or a ferry, and also supports potentially greater farebox revenue for local authorities and Waka Kotahi to make the services more sustainable.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000285\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002255d0b7a4-a2c9-4c38-9b77-475311a48a89\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022e48d5c06bc14482daba802365efb5431\u0022\u003ESimeon Brown\u003C/span\u003E: Will the half-price public transport announced yesterday include the Te Huia train service between Hamilton and Auckland, which already receives a subsidy of over $280 per passenger?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000286\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022098b8334-57f8-4062-bac6-bfbc3474e88e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00223f318b470e1049e3b9263718dc4bb093\u0022\u003EHon MICHAEL WOOD\u003C/span\u003E: Yes, the service is covered as a public transport service. The point of the announcement yesterday was to ensure that more Kiwis have access to more affordable transport options. That is the direction that this Government believes that we need to move in, and it\u2019s disappointing but not surprising that the member opposite doesn\u2019t seem to support that.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000287\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022098b8334-57f8-4062-bac6-bfbc3474e88e\u0022\u003E\u003Cbr\u003E\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n    \u003C/div\u003E\n    \u003Cdiv class=\u0022HpsHansard\u0022\u003E\n      \u003Cp\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsProceedingHeading\u0022\u003EBills\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000288\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u0022f9931341603c45b5811ca46ee06d8101\u0022\u003ENg\u0101ti Rangitihi Claims Settlement Bill\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000289\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u0022b7632e0121264e05b9012d2ec229bd63\u0022\u003EIn Committee\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022a6c42c44-3622-4c9c-98b8-793fb5ec15cc\u0022 data-id=\u0022084f7ff117364cb5932fb756c1f65220\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000290\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a6c42c44-3622-4c9c-98b8-793fb5ec15cc\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022084f7ff117364cb5932fb756c1f65220\u0022\u003ECHAIRPERSON (Ian McKelvie)\u003C/span\u003E: Members, the House is in committee on the Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi Claims Settlement Bill. I\u2019ll remind members they are able to participate remotely. If you are on Zoom and want to take a call please type \u201Ccall\u201D into the chat. You should also use the chat if you want to raise a point of order. We come to Part 1.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022 data-id=\u00222b2e0ba2cb354707b4bd3c23ec2bd6be\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000291\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00222b2e0ba2cb354707b4bd3c23ec2bd6be\u0022\u003EHon ANDREW LITTLE (Minister for Treaty of Waitangi Negotiations):\u003C/span\u003E Mr Chairman, I seek leave for all questions to be taken as one.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000292\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a6c42c44-3622-4c9c-98b8-793fb5ec15cc\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022b24df90c36af4a7a90a9283559dd85d6\u0022\u003ECHAIRPERSON (Ian McKelvie)\u003C/span\u003E: Leave has been requested for all sections to be taken as one. There\u2019s no objection? There is none. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000293\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a6c42c44-3622-4c9c-98b8-793fb5ec15cc\u0022\u003EParts 1 to 3, Schedules 1 to 4, and clauses 1 and 2\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022 data-id=\u0022ceac771c47af495a83576f894a507a95\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000294\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022ceac771c47af495a83576f894a507a95\u0022\u003EHon ANDREW LITTLE (Minister for Treaty of Waitangi Negotiations):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Mr Chairman. What is before the House for the purposes of this committee is Supplementary Order Paper (SOP) 139, which is in my name. It is there to make some technical and minor amendments for the Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi Claims Settlement Bill. The proposed amendments are incorporated into the following clauses in the bill: clause 56, clause 89(3) and 89(10), clause 90(6), and in Schedule 3. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000295\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003EThese changes come about as a result of land surveying, and the SOP proposes to make the following changes. Firstly, updating the definition of Part Matata property in relation to the joint advisory committee. Secondly, updating the definitions of\u2014quotes\u2014\u201CWaimangu Volcanic Valley\u201D and \u201Creserve\u201D\u2014end quotes\u2014in relation to the vesting of Waimangu Volcanic Valley. Thirdly, updating the descriptions and interests of 12 cultural redress properties. The SOP also corrects a technical error, and, in this respect, the SOP proposes to change the territorial authority reference for one cultural redress property. The changes made by the SOP are consistent with the standard technical approach for Treaty settlement bills. All relevant parties have agreed to the surveys, which is the basis for the proposed changes in the SOP. And, really, that is what the SOP is about. For those looking on\u2014because I know there will be members of Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi who are watching remotely\u2014this is a technical process to make sure that the bill is absolutely perfect in every respect so that when we get to the third reading, and, most importantly, to the end of it and the bill finally gets its Royal assent, then the bill is good to go. It has the force of law and there is no need to correct any aspect of it. So on that basis, I look forward to any questions, but, hopefully, we can get through this period very quickly. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00222170b5bd-171f-4d9f-bfa6-cab72178f108\u0022 data-id=\u00223b6c1e1ad6604a33be75091548a51b2f\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000296\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00222170b5bd-171f-4d9f-bfa6-cab72178f108\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00223b6c1e1ad6604a33be75091548a51b2f\u0022\u003EJOSEPH MOONEY (National\u2014Southland):\u003C/span\u003E I just support what the Minister for Treaty of Waitangi Negotiations, Andrew Little, just said. These are proposed minor amendments that are non-contentious, that are necessary, and they are supported by the National Party. Thank you, Mr Chair. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00224a25943b-cb3b-49c3-bd10-74316fae17f1\u0022 data-id=\u0022e9c511a1376c44ce899f593d14492626\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000297\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00224a25943b-cb3b-49c3-bd10-74316fae17f1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022e9c511a1376c44ce899f593d14492626\u0022\u003ECHAIRPERSON (Ian McKelvie)\u003C/span\u003E: The question is that the Minister\u2019s amendments set out on Supplementary Order Paper 139 be agreed to. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000298\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00224a25943b-cb3b-49c3-bd10-74316fae17f1\u0022\u003EAmendments agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00224a25943b-cb3b-49c3-bd10-74316fae17f1\u0022 data-id=\u0022612d7fecd6154d51b36096f5e790e357\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000299\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00224a25943b-cb3b-49c3-bd10-74316fae17f1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022612d7fecd6154d51b36096f5e790e357\u0022\u003ECHAIRPERSON (Ian McKelvie)\u003C/span\u003E: The question is that Parts 1 to 3, Schedules 1 to 4, and clauses 1 and 2 as amended stand part.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000300\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00224a25943b-cb3b-49c3-bd10-74316fae17f1\u0022\u003EParts 1 to 3, Schedules 1 to 4, and clauses 1 and 2 as amended agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000301\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00224a25943b-cb3b-49c3-bd10-74316fae17f1\u0022\u003EBill to be reported with amendment.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000302\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00224a25943b-cb3b-49c3-bd10-74316fae17f1\u0022\u003EHouse resumed.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00224a25943b-cb3b-49c3-bd10-74316fae17f1\u0022 data-id=\u002233b4c05bcbbb41ada16863c7226a92f9\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000303\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00224a25943b-cb3b-49c3-bd10-74316fae17f1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002233b4c05bcbbb41ada16863c7226a92f9\u0022\u003ECHAIRPERSON (Ian McKelvie)\u003C/span\u003E: Madam Speaker, the committee has considered the Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi Claims Settlement Bill and reports it with amendment. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000304\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022d14b1afe-2069-41e4-96fa-c8dc81a991a4\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002242443637849541abb4b4f5d7c2210889\u0022\u003EASSISTANT SPEAKER (Hon Jenny Salesa)\u003C/span\u003E: The question is that the report be adopted.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000305\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022d14b1afe-2069-41e4-96fa-c8dc81a991a4\u0022\u003EMotion agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000306\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022d14b1afe-2069-41e4-96fa-c8dc81a991a4\u0022\u003EReport adopted.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022d14b1afe-2069-41e4-96fa-c8dc81a991a4\u0022 data-id=\u00226e9d29d6e79d4e0da5ea87afa762c168\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000307\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022d14b1afe-2069-41e4-96fa-c8dc81a991a4\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00226e9d29d6e79d4e0da5ea87afa762c168\u0022\u003EASSISTANT SPEAKER (Hon Jenny Salesa)\u003C/span\u003E: In accordance with a determination of the Business Committee, this bill is set down for third reading forthwith.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000308\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u0022987ed37766484ed6a4e3d3173d3155c6\u0022\u003EThird Reading\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022 data-id=\u00220b7390a1042d4629b6c6055813f6aaf6\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000309\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00220b7390a1042d4629b6c6055813f6aaf6\u0022\u003EHon ANDREW LITTLE (Minister for Treaty of Waitangi Negotiations):\u003C/span\u003E I present a legislative statement on the Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi Claims Settlement Bill. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000310\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022d14b1afe-2069-41e4-96fa-c8dc81a991a4\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00222a7a227b09364af19f72b20422c69618\u0022\u003EASSISTANT SPEAKER (Hon Jenny Salesa)\u003C/span\u003E: That legislative statement is published under the authority of the House and can be found on the Parliament website. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000311\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022c128af95180945fdafc36ad093706b3e\u0022\u003EHon ANDREW LITTLE\u003C/span\u003E: I move, That the Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi Claims Settlement Bill be now read a third time.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000312\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003ET\u0101kiri mai, an\u0101 te ata, ki runga o ng\u0101kau m\u0101rohirohi. Kua rere ana te manu kaupapa, ka ao, ka ao, ka awatea. Tihei mauriora.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000313\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003EE mihi ana ki a koutou kua tau mai nei i runga i te karanga o te kaupapa o te r\u0101. T\u0113n\u0101 koutou katoa. E mihi ana ki te hunga mate, haere, haere, haere atu r\u0101. Ki a t\u0101tou te hunga ora, t\u0113n\u0101 t\u0101tou.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000314\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003EKia whakam\u0101nawatia ng\u0101 mana o \u0113nei whenua e t\u016B \u0101huru nei, he uri P\u0101keh\u0101 au i tupu i te aroha o Taranaki maunga, o Taranaki whenua, o Taranaki tangata. T\u0113nei au, otir\u0101 m\u0101tou te K\u0101wanatanga e mihi nei ki te kaupapa o te w\u0101. T\u0113n\u0101 koutou, kia ora huihui mai t\u0101tou katoa.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000315\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003E[Dawn breaks, a new morning and a dauntless heart. This issue has taken flight, a new dawn leads to the full light of day. I now begin.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000316\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003EI greet you all who have arrived here in response to the call of the issue of the day. Greetings to you all. I acknowledge those who have passed; may you rest in peace. And to us who remain, welcome one and all.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000317\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003ETo pay tribute to this comfortable land, I state that I am a descendant of P\u0101keh\u0101 who grew up under the protection of Taranaki maunga and Taranaki land, surrounded by the love of Taranaki people. I stand here, we the Government stands here acknowledging the issue of the time. Greetings, be well, all of us who have gathered here today.]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000318\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003EIt\u2019s a great privilege to stand here today in this House to support the third reading of the Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi Claims Settlement Bill. I\u2019d like to extend a warm welcome to the members of Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi who, while not in the House, are still able to be at Parliament this afternoon to witness this very significant historic occasion, and they\u2019re watching this debate this afternoon remotely, but within the precinct of Parliament. I greatly appreciate all Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi representatives who were able to travel here today so that we may mark this occasion together, and it was indeed a delight and a privilege to welcome them at a p\u014Dwhiri earlier this afternoon. I also wanted to welcome Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi members who, because of COVID-19 restrictions, are having to watch this third reading online. E te iwi Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi, t\u0113n\u0101 koutou. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000319\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003EI particularly thank Te Mana o Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi Trust and the Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi negotiations team\u2014Kenneth Raureti, Stephen Tipene Perenara Marr, Delwyn Rondon, Peri Perenara, and Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi lead negotiator and chairman, Leith Comer\u2014for their extraordinary dedication in reaching this significant milestone. I also wanted to thank Anthony Olsen, who, with the support of Bruce Stirling, worked tirelessly with officials on the historical account. I\u2019d like to acknowledge the work of their support team, Ian Dickson, Roger Drummond, Alana Hunter, Dougal Stewart, Darcy Stoneham, and Donna Semmens. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000320\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003ENg\u0101ti Rangitihi have endured a long wait to settle their historical claims, and I acknowledge their patience, commitment, and fortitude. This settlement is a testament to the years of Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi\u2019s hard work in negotiating a deed of settlement with the Crown. I acknowledge the work of the Crown\u2019s chief negotiator, Katherine Gordon, and the officials at Te Arawhiti and partner agencies who led and supported the negotiations. Reaching the third reading of this bill is in no small part due to their ongoing and steadfast commitment to achieving a Treaty settlement between Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi and the Crown. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000321\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003EI\u2019d also like to thank my ministerial colleagues, past and present, for their support. I particularly acknowledge my predecessor Chris Finlayson, who, as Leith Comer acknowledged in the p\u014Dwhiri earlier this afternoon, managed to get the Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi claims settlement process up the queue from where it had been knocked back in earlier years because of the decision of Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi to separate out from other iwi in order to get their own settlement. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000322\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003EI also want to acknowledge the former Minister of Conservation, the Hon Eugenie Sage, too for her work, because a lot of the redress negotiation was around conservation, the conservation estate, and conservation issues, and led to many discussions with the Hon Eugenie Sage. In the end, we got there: we got an agreement that I think has not only enriched Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi and its cultural needs but has enriched the Crown, as well. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000323\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003EI know that all of the parties involved have worked extremely hard to support Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi in their journey towards settlement, and will continue to provide assistance in the post-settlement phase. I want to acknowledge also the T\u016Bhourangi Tribal Authority for engaging with Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi and the Crown throughout the settlement process. In particular, I appreciate the steady leadership of the former chair of T\u016Bhourangi, Alan Skipwith, for the contribution that he made in working with Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi chairman Leith Comer to reach agreement between the two iwi that supports this settlement and provides a fruitful and positive future partnership together in the Waimangu Valley. Alan passed away in February last year and, I know, is deeply missed by many. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000324\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003ESignificantly, I wish to acknowledge those from Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi who are not with us today to witness the outcome of years of hard work, courage, and commitment. We cannot and do not forget those who have suffered at the hands of the Crown and those who initiated the claims process for Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi. They are in our thoughts today. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000325\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003EI acknowledge one other person, and that is the person who accompanied me to Matat\u0101 on the occasions I visited to initial the deed of settlement and then sign the final deed of settlement. That is Stephen Ihaka, who was working for Te Arawhiti, who was such a workhorse in that respect and is somebody who I miss deeply to this day. Moe mai, moe mai, moe mai r\u0101 e ng\u0101 rangatira. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000326\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003EToday marks the final stage in the progression of the Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi Claims Settlement Bill. This has been a long and arduous process for generations of Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi, who, through petitions, submissions, and claims from at least the 1860s, have sought acknowledgment of the Crown\u2019s breaches of the Treaty of Waitangi that have caused immeasurable harm. Although no settlement can truly atone for the past injustices or compensate for the hurt that Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi have suffered, it is my hope that we can look forward to a future where Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi and the Crown will work in close partnership with each other to the benefit of future generations. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000327\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003EIt\u2019s now time for the Crown to acknowledge and provide redress to Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi. With the passing of the Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi Claims Settlement Bill, it will give effect to the deed of settlement between Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi and the Crown. I was privileged to be able to sign the deed with Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi at the Rangitihi Marae in Matat\u0101 on 5 December 2020. The deed we signed acknowledged historical Treaty of Waitangi claims relating to Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi. In this bill, the Crown acknowledges the injustices of its past acts and omissions. It breached the Treaty of Waitangi and recognises the resulting pain caused. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000328\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003ENg\u0101ti Rangitihi have suffered severe and lasting effects as a result of the Crown\u2019s breaches of the Treaty of Waitangi, causing them to endure significant social and economic deprivation. The interests of Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi were not protected by the Crown when the Crown leased and purchased Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi land blocks. The Crown did not consider the impact of the native land laws, where factors such as high survey costs led to major land loss for Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi. This was then compounded by the Crown taking an excessive amount of land at Te Ariki for public works. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000329\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003EThe Crown failed to ensure Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi had sufficient land to support themselves after the Tarawera eruption on 10 June 1886, which had a devastating effect on Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi. With their interior lands unusable, the survivors became virtually landless, their tribal structures were undermined, and Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi were severed from their own whenua. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000330\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003EEnvironmental degradation facilitated by the Crown has been the source of great distress for Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi over the years. In the 1910s, the Crown was involved in draining the Rangitaiki swamp, which depleted Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi food sources. Most significantly, the Crown promoted legislation in 1954 that enabled the discharge of industrial waste into the Tarawera River and Lake Rotoitipaku, resulting in heavy pollution. I remember working up in that area in the 1990s, and going past the Tarawera River and seeing it running red with pollution from the industrial plants that sat on its edge. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000331\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003EDespite the many challenges the iwi have faced, Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi have a long and proud history of military service in New Zealand and across many parts of the world, and I wanted to particularly acknowledge that service today. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000332\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003EAs I\u2019ve noted, no settlement package can ever fully compensate Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi for the enormous hurt and suffering they have endured across generations. It\u2019s a testament to the extraordinary grace and kindness of Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi that they have chosen to accept the current package and have decided to move towards a period of reconciliation with the Crown. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000333\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003EThe Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi Claims Settlement Bill seeks to give effect to the Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi settlement package as outlined in the legislative statement. The settlement package provides for the transfer of 19 sites of deep significance to Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi as cultural redress. These include two properties at Te Tapahoro Bay, the beating heart of the Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi rohe; two properties in and around the Waimangu Volcanic Valley; and five properties at Matat\u0101. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000334\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003EIt\u2019s my hope that through the acknowledgment of the historical Treaty claims of Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi, today will signal the beginning of the newly strengthened relationship between Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi and the Crown, one based on cooperation, mutual trust, and respect. I am hopeful that this spirit of partnership will continue to grow through the years to come. I commend this bill to the House. N\u014D reira, t\u0113n\u0101 koutou, t\u0113n\u0101 koutou, kia hohou te rongo ki a t\u0101tou katoa.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000335\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022106966ef-8cc3-434a-9dbe-dd76b708c2a1\u0022\u003E[Therefore, greetings. May peace prevail for all of us.]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022a6c42c44-3622-4c9c-98b8-793fb5ec15cc\u0022 data-id=\u00223541d5edfcda4bb08c7878526995cd70\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000336\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a6c42c44-3622-4c9c-98b8-793fb5ec15cc\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00223541d5edfcda4bb08c7878526995cd70\u0022\u003EASSISTANT SPEAKER (Ian McKelvie)\u003C/span\u003E: The question is that the motion be agreed to. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00222170b5bd-171f-4d9f-bfa6-cab72178f108\u0022 data-id=\u00228a83100b5ebc40df90e1c4be2b8e214a\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000337\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00222170b5bd-171f-4d9f-bfa6-cab72178f108\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00228a83100b5ebc40df90e1c4be2b8e214a\u0022\u003EJOSEPH MOONEY (National\u2014Southland):\u003C/span\u003E I rise on behalf of the National Party to speak on the third reading of the Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi Claims Settlement Bill. T\u0113n\u0101 koutou katoa e koro m\u0101 e kui m\u0101, e rau rangatira m\u0101. E Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi, t\u0113n\u0101 koutou. Nau mai, haere mai ki te r\u0101 whakahirahira.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000338\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00222170b5bd-171f-4d9f-bfa6-cab72178f108\u0022\u003E[Greetings to all the female and male elders, to the many leaders. To Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi, greetings. Welcome, welcome to this important day.]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000339\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00222170b5bd-171f-4d9f-bfa6-cab72178f108\u0022\u003EIt is a privilege to speak on the final reading of the bill, which will bring finality to Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi\u2019s settlement with the Crown for historical grievances. It is a sign of the times and perhaps a unique distinction for the Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi Claims Settlement Bill that it is the first set of Treaty settlement legislation that has been passed in this hybrid configuration of the House of Representatives. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000340\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00222170b5bd-171f-4d9f-bfa6-cab72178f108\u0022\u003EI\u2019d like to extend a very warm welcome to everyone from Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi who is watching virtually, both here and around the country, and tuning in to witness this historic occasion. This legislation, which we are about to read for the final time, is about the hap\u016B and wh\u0101nau of Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi. It is about Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi t\u016Bpuna and uri. Every time we gather to progress a Treaty settlement, we look to the past in reflection, we acknowledge the resilience and generosity of tangata whenua, and in the spirit of kotahitanga and reconciliation, we look to our nation\u2019s future with optimism, knowing that our best days as a nation lie ahead of all of us.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000341\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00222170b5bd-171f-4d9f-bfa6-cab72178f108\u0022\u003EArama Karaka Mokonuiarangi, the renowned Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi chief in 1884 lamented that \u201CDuring the days of the Ancestors our people were numerous and the land was held against all comers.\u201D Today, as in Arama Karaka Mokonuiarangi\u2019s day, Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi remain, effectively, a landless people, dispossessed of their tribal lands, with now an interest in less than 4 percent, approximately 9,000 hectares, of their original 250,000-hectare tribal rohe. Forced out of the inland rohe land by the eruption of Mount Tarawera, Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi relocated into what was left of their limited coastal rohe lands at Matat\u0101 and Hauani. By the time their inland rohe was again fit for human habitation, the Crown had taken over almost all of it as public conservation estate and forestry.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000342\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00222170b5bd-171f-4d9f-bfa6-cab72178f108\u0022\u003EToday, many Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi who choose to remain on their traditional lands lack employment opportunities and exhibit poor health, low levels of education, and poor housing. For generations, the people of Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi have sought redress for breaches of the Treaty of Waitangi by the Crown that have had significant impacts on them. From the 1860s, they have made petitions, submissions, and claims to seek redress for Treaty breaches. In recent decades, Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi have filed more than 20 Treaty of Waitangi claims with the Waitangi Tribunal over various Treaty breaches, some of which have, finally, been addressed in this settlement legislation.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000343\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00222170b5bd-171f-4d9f-bfa6-cab72178f108\u0022\u003EAgainst this background, this bill re-orientates the relationship between the Crown and Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi towards the future. Through this legislation, the Crown recognises and apologises for the many historical injustices brought upon Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi for its failure to uphold its obligations under the Treaty of Waitangi. Crucially, the Crown commits itself to a renewed and strengthened relationship with Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi. Moreover, on behalf of all New Zealanders, in this bill the Crown acknowledges its failure to protect the tribal structures of Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi, to act in good faith when leasing and purchasing Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi land blocks, to protect Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi from becoming virtually landless, to protect the Tarawera River from pollution, to actively protect te reo M\u0101ori and encourage its use, and to protect Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi from excessive survey costs, and it failed to act in good faith by taking excessive land at Te Ariki for public works purposes.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000344\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00222170b5bd-171f-4d9f-bfa6-cab72178f108\u0022\u003EThe Ng\u0101ti Rangitahi settlement package includes total financial and commercial redress of $11,334,820, plus interest, which comprises a share of Crown forest land in the central North Island valued at $7,334,820 plus $4 million in financial redress. Nineteen sites will be transferred in the iwi\u2019s cultural redress settlement, and three place names will be changed through the settlement legislation. The deed of settlement also provides for the establishment of the Tarawera Awa Restoration Strategy Group, which will operate as a permanent joint committee of the Bay of Plenty Regional Council. The group will support, coordinate, and promote the integrated restoration of the mauri and well-being of the Tarawera River catchment. I will just say that I spent some of my childhood in this region and remember well going to Tarawera River as a child. I look forward to the future growth and wellbeing of that river, which is a very important part of the settlement.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000345\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00222170b5bd-171f-4d9f-bfa6-cab72178f108\u0022\u003EThe deed of settlement includes a range of relationship redress to foster a good working relationship between Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi and Crown agencies. And to the hap\u016B and wh\u0101nau of Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi, it is not possible to fully compensate for the loss and prejudice that generations of Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi have suffered. However, I hope and trust that this settlement will forge a new relationship between the Crown and Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi and will be a real catalyst for positive change for present and future generations of iwi.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000346\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00222170b5bd-171f-4d9f-bfa6-cab72178f108\u0022\u003EI\u2019d like to make some brief acknowledgments to those who have gone before and have done the hard work all the way back to centuries past, through till more recent times when the previous Treaty negotiations Minister, Chris Finlayson, began this process, through to the present Minister, Andrew Little. I also want to acknowledge all of the negotiators from Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi and also from the Crown, who worked tirelessly and in good faith to get us to where we are today. I would like to acknowledge, as Minister Little did, the military service of Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi in the past. We are in a House which recognises those who have sacrificed for our nation, and I want to specifically thank Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi and their t\u016Bpuna who have sacrificed for all of our nation, and that is something that is dear to me as someone who has also spent some time in the armed services.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000347\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00222170b5bd-171f-4d9f-bfa6-cab72178f108\u0022\u003EIn conclusion, today is an important day for Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi and the Crown. Again, I reiterate that no settlement can ever atone for wrongdoings of the past. However, this is a very good and very positive step forward for our combined peoples. I sincerely hope that this legislation will be a new starting point that will lead to a strengthened relationship between Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi and the Crown, based on cooperation, mutual trust, and true respect for the Treaty and its principles.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000348\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00222170b5bd-171f-4d9f-bfa6-cab72178f108\u0022\u003EN\u014D reira, t\u0113n\u0101 koutou, t\u0113n\u0101 koutou, t\u0113n\u0101 koutou katoa. I commend this bill to the House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00226590faa0-f76b-4386-84f3-9b06296cc772\u0022 data-id=\u0022faa0023fe4184cc7bdf0b74c76fbac7e\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000349\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226590faa0-f76b-4386-84f3-9b06296cc772\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022faa0023fe4184cc7bdf0b74c76fbac7e\u0022\u003ET\u0100MATI COFFEY (Labour) (remote):\u003C/span\u003E E te M\u0101ngai o te Whare, t\u0113n\u0101 koe.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000350\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226590faa0-f76b-4386-84f3-9b06296cc772\u0022\u003ETe riri o te atua i whiua ki te tangata \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000351\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226590faa0-f76b-4386-84f3-9b06296cc772\u0022\u003EI whiua ki te whenua \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000352\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226590faa0-f76b-4386-84f3-9b06296cc772\u0022\u003EE hora noa mai r\u0101 i te p\u014Duriuri, te p\u014Dtangotango\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000353\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226590faa0-f76b-4386-84f3-9b06296cc772\u0022\u003EWaiho nei te aroha, waiho nei te mamae \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000354\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226590faa0-f76b-4386-84f3-9b06296cc772\u0022\u003EKa tae ki ngau i taku kiri\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000355\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226590faa0-f76b-4386-84f3-9b06296cc772\u0022\u003EI maringi a-wai te roimata i ak\u016B kamo\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000356\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226590faa0-f76b-4386-84f3-9b06296cc772\u0022\u003EKi te iwi, ka wehe.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000357\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226590faa0-f76b-4386-84f3-9b06296cc772\u0022\u003E\u2014It was thus the anger of the god who destroyed the people and the land\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000358\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226590faa0-f76b-4386-84f3-9b06296cc772\u0022\u003EThe people lie scattered in the world of darkness and the world of the dead\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000359\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226590faa0-f76b-4386-84f3-9b06296cc772\u0022\u003ELeaving anguish and pain\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000360\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226590faa0-f76b-4386-84f3-9b06296cc772\u0022\u003ETo gnaw unceasingly within\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000361\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226590faa0-f76b-4386-84f3-9b06296cc772\u0022\u003EAnd the tears drop copiously from my eyes\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000362\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226590faa0-f76b-4386-84f3-9b06296cc772\u0022\u003EFor those who have departed this life.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000363\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226590faa0-f76b-4386-84f3-9b06296cc772\u0022\u003ENg\u0101ti Rangitihi, karanga mai. Ki o iwi, ki \u014D hap\u016B, ki \u014D wh\u0101nau, ki \u014D t\u016Bpuna, ng\u0101 kuia, ng\u0101 koroua kua whet\u016Brangitia, ki ng\u0101 tamariki, ng\u0101 mokopuna kei te heke mai. Ko t\u0113nei t\u014D r\u0101 i t\u0113nei Whare, n\u014D reira ka tika me mihi. Ko au t\u0113tahi o T\u016Bhourangi e mihi atu, e tangi ana ki a koutou. Ka tika me waiatatia te waiata mamae rongonui o T\u016Bhourangi ki a koutou, \u201C\u014Cku Hoa Moenga.\u201D\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000364\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226590faa0-f76b-4386-84f3-9b06296cc772\u0022\u003E[Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi, welcome. To your tribe, to your sub-tribes, to your families, to your ancestors, to the female and male elders who have become stars in the heavens, to the children and grandchildren yet to come, this is your day in this House, therefore it only right to pay tribute to you. I am someone of T\u016Bhourangi who greets and mourns with you. It is appropriate that we should sing the famous lament of T\u016Bhourangi to you, \u201C\u014Cku Hoa Moenga.\u201D]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000365\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226590faa0-f76b-4386-84f3-9b06296cc772\u0022\u003EThe M\u0101ori Affairs Committee examined the Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi Claims Settlement Bill and recommended that it be passed with all amendments, which were minor and technical, unanimously. E te Minita m\u014D t\u0113nei kaupapa, Anaru Iti, ng\u0101 kaimahi o Te Arawhiti, ng\u0101 mema o te Komiti Whiriwhiri Take M\u0101ori, me ng\u0101 \u0101piha o te komiti he mihi an\u014D.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000366\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226590faa0-f76b-4386-84f3-9b06296cc772\u0022\u003E[To the Minister responsible for this work, Andrew Little; to the staff of Te Arawhiti; and the officers of the M\u0101ori Affairs Committee, thank you again.]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000367\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226590faa0-f76b-4386-84f3-9b06296cc772\u0022\u003ETe Mana o Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi Trust, I apologise for not being able to travel to your only marae, Rangiaohia, in our beautiful coastal township of Matat\u0101, the gateway to the Eastern Bay of Plenty, and I apologise for not being there with you today. Thankfully, we live in the future, enabling me to be able to sit here at home in \u014Cwhata, and some of you there in Te Whanga-nui-a-Tara, with everybody else sitting back home in Matat\u0101. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000368\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226590faa0-f76b-4386-84f3-9b06296cc772\u0022\u003ETo those that don\u2019t know, the Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi rohe stretches all the way up the Tarawera Awa, across Ruaw\u0101hia at Tarawera, and out into Kaingaroa. It\u2019s where the deed of settlement was signed, as mentioned by our Minister, in December 2020. The coastal settlement is the location of Te Awa o Te Atua, the former outlets of the combined flows of the Rangitaiki, the Tarawera, and the Orini rivers. The township is surrounded by large reserves featuring nationally important flora. Historically and contemporarily, Te Awa o Te Atua is historically significant to both Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi and to Te Arawa wh\u0101nui; neighbours Ng\u0101ti Awa, Ng\u0101ti Tuwharetoa ki Kawerau. It was the landing place of many waka, including M\u0101taatua waka and the Arawa waka as well. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000369\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226590faa0-f76b-4386-84f3-9b06296cc772\u0022\u003EIn pre-European times, and into the 1800s, Matat\u0101 was the food basket of the Tarawera valley. Te Awa o Te Atua was a significant port, shipping food and flax to markets both in New Zealand and in Australia. Te Awa o Te Atua was also significantly a highway connecting Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi at the coast with its whenua inland. In particular, Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi see the mauri of the Tarawera Awa as a reflection of iwi members\u2019 wellbeing. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000370\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226590faa0-f76b-4386-84f3-9b06296cc772\u0022\u003ECrown actions in the early and mid-20th century destroyed the place. The cutting of the Tarawera and the Rangitaiki awa directly out to sea, and also enabling the mill at Tarawera to discharge anything it wanted into the Tarawera River were the acts that caused the destruction. The Crown has taken the first step in righting these wrongs by acknowledging that it breached its Treaty obligations to Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi. But, let\u2019s be honest, it\u2019s never enough. I\u2019ll say it again: it will never be enough. The Treaty settlement does provide final closure for past grievances, yes, but, at the same time, it opens a big, wide open door for the Government. For many iwi, it\u2019s been firmly closed for many years. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000371\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226590faa0-f76b-4386-84f3-9b06296cc772\u0022\u003ESo, Ministers, Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi is ready to take their seat, and we owe it to every Treaty settlement to do better for them, through protocols and partnerships. And if co-governance and co-management are what iwi want to be able to provide for their own rangatiratanga, then let it be. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000372\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226590faa0-f76b-4386-84f3-9b06296cc772\u0022\u003EAnd, on that note, we must also do better to take New Zealanders on that journey, because once these settlements pass, historical amnesia has a tendency to set in, and sometimes the general public forgets. We must keep reminding New Zealanders that at the end of a settlement, it\u2019s merely the start of a long journey for iwi, and today, Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi, we wish you well on your journey, and may this House never forget what you lost because of actions of the Crown. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000373\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226590faa0-f76b-4386-84f3-9b06296cc772\u0022\u003EAs I\u2019ve come to understand about Treaty settlements, financial redress is important, but one of the biggest things that allows the healing process to begin is the Crown acknowledgments and the Crown apology. That said, I want the rest of my time to be dedicated to the Crown apology directed for all uri of Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi: \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000374\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226590faa0-f76b-4386-84f3-9b06296cc772\u0022\u003E\u201CThe Crown makes the following apology to Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi, to your t\u016Bpuna and to your mokopuna, and recognises your arduous journey in pursuit of justice. This apology is long overdue. The Crown is profoundly sorry for the many hardships and tribulations that Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi have endured, and unreservedly apologises for its failure to fulfil its obligations to you under Te Tiriti o Waitangi. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000375\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226590faa0-f76b-4386-84f3-9b06296cc772\u0022\u003E\u201CThe Crown sincerely apologises for its aggressive acquisition of Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi lands, even when Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi were dealing with the tragic consequences of the Tarawera eruption. The Crown deeply regrets that, in the aftermath of the eruption, and despite recognising that Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi were a \u2018wandering landless people\u2019 suffering deprivation and uncertainty, it still took almost 30 years to provide Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi with the secure title for the Hauani land. The Crown apologises for failing to ensure that Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi had sufficient land for your present and future needs. The Crown\u2019s failure to protect the Tarawera River, a taonga of immense economic, cultural and spiritual significance for Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi, left the river defiled, degraded and polluted. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000376\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226590faa0-f76b-4386-84f3-9b06296cc772\u0022\u003E\u201CThe Crown\u2019s acquisition of Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi lands, combined with environmental damage, has had a devastating social economic impact on Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi, undermined your cultural hauora, and left you feeling as strangers in your own rohe. For this the Crown apologises. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000377\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226590faa0-f76b-4386-84f3-9b06296cc772\u0022\u003E\u201CIt is the Crown\u2019s wish that through this settlement it can restore its sullied honour and atone for the past injustices it has inflicted on Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi. The Crown pays tribute to your proven loyalty, including your long and honourable record of military service in many countries and your resilience in the face of great adversity. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000378\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226590faa0-f76b-4386-84f3-9b06296cc772\u0022\u003E\u201CThe Crown hopes that this settlement will be a starting point rather than an end, and will signal the beginning of a new, strengthened relationship between Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi and the Crown based on cooperation, mutual trust and respect for the Treaty of Waitangi.\u201D\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000379\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226590faa0-f76b-4386-84f3-9b06296cc772\u0022\u003EI commend this bill to the House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022868f3a11-6a23-474f-a25e-6bc1d4c6e93f\u0022 data-id=\u00227c44f21704094b6f8b1450bab7c08e12\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000380\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022868f3a11-6a23-474f-a25e-6bc1d4c6e93f\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00227c44f21704094b6f8b1450bab7c08e12\u0022\u003EHARETE HIPANGO (National):\u003C/span\u003E Ka karanga au ki a koe ki te p\u0101nuitanga tuatoru o t\u0113nei Pire, Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi Claims Settlement Bill\u2014I seek the call for the third and final reading of this Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi Claims Settlement Bill.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000381\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022868f3a11-6a23-474f-a25e-6bc1d4c6e93f\u0022\u003EKa karanga au ki ng\u0101 uri o Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi. Ko au he uri n\u014D W\u2019anganui. Ka nui te mihi ki a koutou e huihui mai nei i t\u0113nei W\u2019are P\u0101remata. E ng\u0101 mana, e ng\u0101 reo, e ng\u0101 k\u0101rangatanga, e rau rangatira m\u0101, t\u0113n\u0101 t\u0101tou katoa.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000382\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022868f3a11-6a23-474f-a25e-6bc1d4c6e93f\u0022\u003E[I call to the descendants of Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi. I am a descendant from W\u2019anganui. I extend warm greetings you all of you who have gathered in this House of Parliament. To the authorities, to all the voices, the various groups and to all the esteemed leaders, greetings one and all.]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000383\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022868f3a11-6a23-474f-a25e-6bc1d4c6e93f\u0022\u003ENg\u0101ti Rangitihi, it is a privilege to take this call in the passage of your bill into law at this third reading. Finally, this day, long awaited by Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi uri and t\u016Bpuna no longer here, long in waiting, long in tolerating, long in longing, long in grievance. Today is a day of memory and I stand in this Chamber, a place of commemoration. Today is a day also to acknowledge those who have departed, those who started this journey, and those of you gathered here in the precinct of Parliament, who continue and carry that journey from the past, here now, to the present, a gift for tomorrow, your future. Today is a day to put aside the grievance and to celebrate the opportunity moving forward into the future, to celebrate the opportunity for prosperity, Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi\u2014the people, the place, the potential, the relationships, the partnerships, and the prosperity from opportunities now to be gained. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000384\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022868f3a11-6a23-474f-a25e-6bc1d4c6e93f\u0022\u003EWhen I last addressed you all, those who were accessible virtually in this place of Parliament but those from further afar, at the first reading, in my acknowledgment, I extended reference to\u2014should I have the privilege to address the House and you all here and from afar today\u2014the significance of the apology. I turn to clause 10 of the bill, which will be enshrined into law: \u201CThe Crown makes the following apology to Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi, to your t\u016Bpuna and to your mokopuna, and recognises your arduous journey in pursuit of justice. This apology is long overdue. The Crown is profoundly sorry for the many hardships and tribulations \u2026 unreservedly apologises for its failure, \u2026 sincerely apologises for its aggressive acquisition of Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi lands \u2026 The Crown apologises for failing to ensure that Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi had sufficient land for your present and future needs. \u2026 The Crown\u2019s failure to protect the Tarawera River, a taonga of immense economic, cultural, and spiritual significance to Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi, left the river defiled, degraded and polluted. \u2026 For this the Crown apologises. \u2026 The Crown\u2019s wish is that through this settlement it can restore its sullied honour and atone for the past injustices \u2026 The Crown hopes this settlement will be a starting point rather than an end, and will signal the beginning of a new, strengthened relationship based on co-operation, mutual trust and respect\u201D. This formal apology, conveyed by Minister Little at the signing of the deed of settlement at Rangitihi Marae, Matat\u0101 on 5 December 2020, will, in the passage of this bill into law, be forever scripted there.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000385\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022868f3a11-6a23-474f-a25e-6bc1d4c6e93f\u0022\u003EI now turn to some appropriate acknowledgments: Minister Little in continuing the journey that had been commenced by my former colleague Christopher Finlayson as the Treaty settlements Minister then, of the day. I also acknowledge the negotiators of Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi. I also apologise, Leith Comer, and your people gathered here today. Had I known about the p\u014Dwhiri, I would have been there. So I extend an apology from the National Party for the absence of us being there in support. I acknowledge you, Leith, as lead negotiator, as chair of Te Mana o Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi Trust, also as a former military leader. So when I saw the provision within the bill, with reference, my thoughts, my whakaaro, turned, of course, to t\u016Bpuna of Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi but also for your former status as a leader, as a senior military army officer, as a strategist and a negotiator in helping lead your people through this arduous journey. To the trustees also, who were part of that journey\u2014and I will name you so that your name is forever inscribed in the Hansard record: Donna Semmens, Merepeka Raukawa-Tait, Tia Walbrick, Melanie Cheung, Taichi Playle, and Cathy Dewes. Ng\u0101 mihi nui ki a koutou.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000386\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022868f3a11-6a23-474f-a25e-6bc1d4c6e93f\u0022\u003EI look at the time and quickly time passes when we address the House, but how slowly it takes to arrive here. So with the rest of the time, what has been spoken to and addressed by the Minister for Treaty settlements, Minister Little, I endorse and acknowledge. Also to my colleague T\u0101mati Coffey, as the chair of the M\u0101ori Affairs Committee, I listened keenly to your kupu, to the words of your p\u0101tere, waiata. I acknowledge you, e hoa. I also acknowledge the negotiators for the Crown: Catherine Goulden, Te Arawhiti, and special mention made of Stephen Ihaka, and to the officials who have been involved in the passage of this bill through into law, soon to have its Royal assent received. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000387\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022868f3a11-6a23-474f-a25e-6bc1d4c6e93f\u0022\u003EWhen the bill came before the M\u0101ori Affairs Committee\u2014again, a privilege to be able to serve at the table there, and, again, a privilege to be able to listen to the stories\u2014there were some 20 written submissions and seven oral submissions heard. There was still mamae that was imparted and shared with us by those who had a differing view to the majority of Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi who endorsed the settlement with a considerable percentage of support. And we made it clear as members on the M\u0101ori Affairs Committee that it is not for us to determine whakapapa, genealogy; it is for the people amongst yourselves. We acknowledge those who shared the mamae, but we acknowledge also that those of us who live amongst our own, we know our grievance; we also know the solutions. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000388\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022868f3a11-6a23-474f-a25e-6bc1d4c6e93f\u0022\u003EThe M\u0101ori Affairs Committee\u2014best laid plans were put aside with this imposition on all of our lives called COVID. Our intention was to travel and to be amongst the people of Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi at the marae at Matat\u0101. When COVID lifted and the restrictions permitted, I seized the opportunity in my role as spokesperson for M\u0101ori development with the National Party to travel through the motu and to travel for my first time through the coastal region of Matat\u0101. I observed where the marae is and I look forward to the day that I will be able to stand on the marae \u0101tea. I was not able to, with my colleagues, be present amongst that, but we felt the mamae, we felt the grievance, and we paid due to ensure that this bill passes through into law. I also seized the opportunity in my M\u0101ori development role to travel to the\u2014I will reference and turn to the brochure\u2014the Waimangu Volcanic Valley, where I was accompanied by Tania Tapsell to meet with Leith Comer, kaum\u0101tua Kenneth Raureti, and general manager David Blackmore, to be present on the area in the rohe and on the whenua and to feel and to hear the stories.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000389\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022868f3a11-6a23-474f-a25e-6bc1d4c6e93f\u0022\u003ETime has elapsed quickly. It is a privilege to stand and to acknowledge all those past, present, and moving into the future who will give due service to prosperity of recognition of opportunity that arises and will pass through with the third reading of the Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi Claims Settlement Bill. Ka nui te mihi ki a koutou katoa.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000390\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022868f3a11-6a23-474f-a25e-6bc1d4c6e93f\u0022\u003E[Warm greetings to you all.]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022a8cab3e3-b023-4ce7-9f4b-2c4137029057\u0022 data-id=\u002271c402df676d474aad6fc2c4bb573402\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000391\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a8cab3e3-b023-4ce7-9f4b-2c4137029057\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002271c402df676d474aad6fc2c4bb573402\u0022\u003EHon KIRITAPU ALLAN (Minister of Conservation):\u003C/span\u003E Karanga mai r\u0101 Te Arawa waka, karanga mai r\u0101 Ruaw\u0101hia Maunga, karanga mai r\u0101 Tarawera awa. Nau mai, haramai, whakatau mai r\u0101 ng\u0101 uri o Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi kei roto i t\u0113nei Whare.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000392\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a8cab3e3-b023-4ce7-9f4b-2c4137029057\u0022\u003EKa huria m\u0101tou nei ki t\u014D koutou h\u012Btori kei roto i t\u0113nei Whare i t\u0113nei ahiahi. Me noho a m\u0101tou mai i te Karauna kei waho r\u0101 i te ahiahi nei ki te whakarongo i a r\u0101tou i raro i te raukura o Te Ati Awa m\u014D te whakatau i a koutou o Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi kei roto i te Whare M\u012Bere i t\u0113nei ahiahi. Kua rongo a m\u0101tou ki a koutou, ko te mea tino whakahirahira ki a koutou ki te whakamana i ng\u0101 p\u016Br\u0101kau o t\u014D koutou whenua ki te whakahokia te mana o te whenua ki te mana whenua. Me haere tonu t\u0101tou te Karauna me te hau k\u0101inga te iwi o Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi i raro i t\u0113nei kawenata m\u014D te ara ki mua. Heoi an\u014D, kei a koutou ng\u0101 uri o Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi kei roto i te Whare nei, kei a koutou ng\u0101 uri o Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi kei te k\u0101inga i t\u0113nei w\u0101 he rerek\u0113 i raro i te taumahatanga o te mate urut\u0101, kei te mihi, kei mihi, kei te mihi.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000393\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a8cab3e3-b023-4ce7-9f4b-2c4137029057\u0022\u003E [I call to the peoples of Te Arawa, I call to the mountain Ruaw\u0101hia and to the Tarawera River. Welcome, welcome, welcome to the descendants of Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi in this House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000394\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a8cab3e3-b023-4ce7-9f4b-2c4137029057\u0022\u003EWe shall turn our attention to your history this afternoon in this House. Some of us on the Crown side have to be outside the House this afternoon to listen to you of Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi being welcomed into the Beehive under the feather plume of Te \u0100ti Awa. We have listened to you, and the most important things for you are that your ancient stories of your land are validated and that the authority of the land is returned to those with traditional authority over that land. The Crown, the local people, and the people of the Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi tribe need to continue on this path forwards under this covenant. However, to you of Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi in the House, to you of Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi at home at this strange time, under the burden of the pandemic, greetings, greetings, greetings.]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000395\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a8cab3e3-b023-4ce7-9f4b-2c4137029057\u0022\u003EIt\u2019s an absolute privilege to be able to speak in this third reading. Today it marks the end of a six-year journey between Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi and the k\u0101wei of people that have been mandated by the people of Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi to engage with the Crown to acknowledge the historic wrongdoings that have been made over the past 200 years since the Treaty of Waitangi was signed. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000396\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a8cab3e3-b023-4ce7-9f4b-2c4137029057\u0022\u003EOutside this House this earlier afternoon, we had the privilege of welcoming those that could come this afternoon from Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi into this Whare M\u012Bere and what I heard was that the journey to this point\u2014it was long, it was arduous, but one thing that Leith Comer said in his contribution was that while some things like these settlements can often leave a lasting imprint that tear the people apart, this settlement and today is a day of unification for Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi, and I acknowledge those rangatira amongst them that have pulled the people together. I want to acknowledge my colleague the Hon Andrew Little for his stewardship. I too want to acknowledge that the journey was commenced six years ago under the maru, under the helm, of the Hon Christopher Finlayson. I want to too acknowledge my predecessor, the Hon Eugenie Sage, of whom Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi made comment and asked me to please pass on their regards for her work that she did whilst she was the Minister of Conservation.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000397\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a8cab3e3-b023-4ce7-9f4b-2c4137029057\u0022\u003ETreaty settlements are a unique kind of Parliament. It\u2019s a time when we across the House can come to acknowledge our history, our collective history. We can acknowledge those people of a place\u2014and in this instance from my own home, the mighty fine electorate of the East Coast, Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi. I acknowledge the peoples of Matat\u0101 and that they have been tireless in their advocacy for the mana of their people there in Matat\u0101. And I too share the Rangitihi plains with the people of Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi\u2014a little over, closer to Edgecumbe and Te Teko but we share a shared sense of history, contemporary and historical, so I acknowledge my friends and my relations under that hat as well.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000398\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a8cab3e3-b023-4ce7-9f4b-2c4137029057\u0022\u003EBut why I particularly want to take a call today is in my capacity as the Minister of Conservation. We\u2019ve heard\u2014and, actually, I want to acknowledge Joseph Mooney in his contribution, which acknowledged some of the conservation elements to this particular Treaty settlement. One of the comments that Leith Comer also made outside was that this settlement isn\u2019t just about dimes and money; it is about the restoration of the mauri to the whenua, to the awa, and, in particular, Tarawera Awa, which has had a long and sad history.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000399\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a8cab3e3-b023-4ce7-9f4b-2c4137029057\u0022\u003EIt is today that we mark a turning point. It\u2019s not the end of a journey; it\u2019s an end of a particular aspect of a journey which is the negotiation point that gets us to this place, where we agree that from henceforth we, the Crown, and they, the people of Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi, engage on a new frontier in a mana to mana relationship that upholds the principles of the Treaty of Waitangi, that upholds the promises that are made in this settlement that has been hard fought for as a consequence of Crown breaches to the people of Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi. It is something that I have become very familiar with as the Minister of Conservation. It is the opening of a new dawn and a new day, because whilst we acknowledge the historical wrongs of yesterday, yesteryear, tomorrow we have to implement with honour and integrity the promises made in this settlement. That can be a hard journey as well and I want to acknowledge that because things will not be perfect. I\u2019ve learnt in my short tenure that we often will stuff up but what this kawenata\u2014what this settlement\u2014provides for is an enduring promise to act with integrity and it sets out how we will do that. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000400\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a8cab3e3-b023-4ce7-9f4b-2c4137029057\u0022\u003EI wanted to make particular acknowledgment of some of the conservation components to this settlement, which is what I think makes it incredibly unique. Fourteen sites, 14 areas of whenua that have not been in the hands of Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi, will be returned as a consequence of this settlement. These will comprise of p\u0101 sites, w\u0101hi tapu, some sites where there are k\u014Diwi, and we\u2019re going to do that in a number of different ways\u2014some in scenic reserves. Scenic reserves are where we agree that there is incredible indigenous biodiversity or something specific about the flora and the fauna of the environment but the ownership transfers back to Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi. They managed that whenua in a way that upholds those biodiversity aspects. In particular, I just want to acknowledge a site of significance is Waimangu Volcanic Valley where 80 hectares surrounding the unique geothermal attractions will be transferred.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000401\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a8cab3e3-b023-4ce7-9f4b-2c4137029057\u0022\u003EThere are also historic sites\u2014historic sites which can be comprised of things like p\u0101 sites, for example, or significant w\u0101hi tapu, where Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi will say that this is a culturally significant site for these archaeological\u2014for these whatever reasons that they deem are significant to the peoples of that place and the Crown mai r\u0101n\u014D will have to acknowledge what Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi set down. They have the mana to say that these are the things that are important to those areas and, in particular, I just to acknowledge a couple of those places: Moura, Ongarara, which cover a strategic and significant headland over on Lake Tarawera. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000402\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a8cab3e3-b023-4ce7-9f4b-2c4137029057\u0022\u003ERecreational reserves are another type of land, you can say, that have been handed back to the mana whenua. These are open space areas and there was a bit of controversy that I won\u2019t delve into but I will acknowledge that Te Tapahoro is a site of significance that is going back to the peoples of Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi today.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000403\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a8cab3e3-b023-4ce7-9f4b-2c4137029057\u0022\u003EThe kawenata that we engage and that we sign off today is significant for so many reasons. It acknowledges the history and the past but it sets forward a new pathway by which Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi will be at the helm of some of the places that make them who they are. There is a shameful history that we all acknowledge in this House. But today signifies a new dawn and if I can acknowledge the leadership of those that have been at the helm: Leith Comer, Ken Raureti, Tiipene Marr, Cathy Dewes, Merepeka Raukawa-Tait, Donna Semmens, Tia Warbrick, Delwyn Rondon, Anthony Olsen, Dougal Stewart, Peri Perenara, and the many others that have come before. May I thank them for their service and acknowledge that this is, indeed, a new dawn, a new day. T\u0113n\u0101 koe.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00223d42e8cf-544e-415d-892b-f4ef8014d80f\u0022 data-id=\u0022acce041eb5ef481b954cf93a98e02017\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000404\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d42e8cf-544e-415d-892b-f4ef8014d80f\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022acce041eb5ef481b954cf93a98e02017\u0022\u003ETEANAU TUIONO (Green): \u003C/span\u003ET\u0113n\u0101 koe e te M\u0101ngai. Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi, t\u0113nei te mihi atu ki a koutou. Kei te tihi o ng\u0101 whakaaro koutou i t\u0113nei w\u0101, n\u014D reira e mihi ana ki runga i te tika me te pono, i runga i te manawanui, te manawaroa o \u014D t\u016Bpuna kia tae ki t\u0113nei p\u0101nuitanga tuatoru o t\u014D koutou nei pire, o t\u014D koutou nei ture. N\u014D reira koutou an\u014D i tae p\u014Dhiri mai ki t\u0113nei Whare P\u0101remata i t\u0113nei ata, t\u0113nei te mihi atu. T\u0113nei te mihi atu ki a koutou, otir\u0101 ki a koutou ng\u0101 wh\u0101nau noho ki raro o te whakaruruhau o te Zui. M\u0101 t\u0113r\u0101 hangarau matihiko e whakahaere ana t\u014D t\u0101tou nei ao i t\u0113nei w\u0101, t\u0113nei m\u0101tou ng\u0101 K\u0101k\u0101riki e mihi ana ki a koutou m\u014D t\u0113nei r\u0101 whakahirahira m\u014D koutou.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000405\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d42e8cf-544e-415d-892b-f4ef8014d80f\u0022\u003ENg\u0101ti Rangitihi, ahakoa e kore rawa e t\u0113tahi tahua p\u016Btea e t\u0113tahi pire p\u0113nei te \u0101hua te whakatika hapa i te mate me te mamae i p\u0101 ki a koutou, ka whakatakato te whakataunga i t\u0113tahi t\u016B\u0101papa e pakari ai te anamata o tou hoko ahurea hoki o t\u014D koutou nei iwi. I a au e whakarongo ana ki ng\u0101 k\u014Drero o t\u014D t\u0101tou nei tiamana i te mea ko au an\u014D t\u0113tahi o ng\u0101 mema o te Komiti Whiriwhiri Take M\u0101ori, i tae mai te k\u014Drero a t\u014D m\u0101tou nei tiamana a T\u0101mati\u2014\u014Dna hononga mai i T\u016Bhourangi, \u014Dna piringa ki a Arawa waka me te k\u014Drero o te oranga o te pai o t\u0113r\u0101 whenua o koutou. I rongo au i te ingoa o te awa, Te-Awa-o-Te-Atua. I rongo au i tae a M\u0101taatua, i tae hoki a Te Arawa. He w\u0101hi an\u014D i tae an\u014D ng\u0101 atua me taku nei whakaaro i taku nei p\u012Bnati ka whakaaro ake au, e hia k\u0113 nei ng\u0101 atua i tae atu ki t\u014D koutou nei rohe. E hia k\u0113 nei ng\u0101 tipua i tae atu ki t\u014D koutou nei takiw\u0101 ki te aro ki \u014Dna oranga, ki te aro ki \u014Dna h\u012Btori, kia aro ki \u014Dna k\u014Drero o nehe. N\u014D reira, \u0101, ng\u0101 t\u012Bpuna i whakatakoto k\u0113 i \u0113nei o ng\u0101 kaupapa, koutou ki a koutou. Heoi an\u014D, te manako nei kei te whai \u014D koutou nei uri whakatipu ki roto i te ng\u0101kau i riro iho mai i \u014D koutou k\u014Drero tuku iho.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000406\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d42e8cf-544e-415d-892b-f4ef8014d80f\u0022\u003EKi t\u014D m\u0101tou nei whakaaro ko t\u0113nei mea Te Tiriti o Waitangi, ehara i te mea he kirimana noa haere ki te hokomaha ki te hokohoko rare r\u0101nei. K\u0101o. Ko t\u0113nei mea Te Tiriti o Waitangi he mea p\u016Bmau, he mea oranga. Mai i te w\u0101 i hainatia, i t\u0101mokohia e \u014D t\u0101tou nei m\u0101tua t\u012Bpuna ki Waitangi i te tau 1840 tae noa ki t\u0113nei w\u0101, tae noa i a t\u0101tou i matapakihia ng\u0101 k\u014Drero, ng\u0101 kaupapa k\u014Drero. He pono, he p\u016Btake t\u014Dna mai i taua w\u0101 tae noa ki t\u0113nei w\u0101 hei oranga, hei arahi i \u014D t\u0101tou nei P\u0101remata i \u014D t\u0101tou nei iwi katoa e noho ana kei raro o te maru o Aotearoa. Me p\u0113hea te k\u014Dkiri whakamua o t\u014D t\u0101tou nei oranga m\u014D te katoa? N\u014D reira me mihi atu au ki Te Tiriti o Waitangi. T\u0113 taea te whakatau ko Te Tiriti o Waitangi.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000407\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d42e8cf-544e-415d-892b-f4ef8014d80f\u0022\u003EMe mihi atu ki ng\u0101 hap\u016B, ki ng\u0101 p\u016Bk\u014Drero, koutou an\u014D i takahia ki runga i te haerenga kia tae ki t\u0113nei o ng\u0101 w\u0101hi me te whakaaro an\u014D, ko t\u0113tahi oranga i rongo au i \u0113nei momo pire i whai w\u0101hi ng\u0101 kaum\u0101tua, ng\u0101 kuia, ng\u0101 koroua, ng\u0101 pakeke ki te kohikohi i ng\u0101 whakaaro, ki te kohikohi i ng\u0101 p\u016Br\u0101kau, \u0101, ka toha atu ki \u014D koutou nei rangatahi, ki te toha atu ki \u014D koutou nei tamariki. Hei aha? Hei oranga kia hoatu i \u0113r\u0101 m\u014Dhiohio, o \u0113r\u0101 k\u014Drero i roto i t\u0113tahi p\u0101taka k\u014Drero. Hei oranga, hei oranga m\u014D \u0101 koutou nei tamariki mokopuna, n\u014D reira i tautoko katoa au i te k\u014Drero o te Minita Kiritapu Allan n\u0101na noa i k\u014Drerotia r\u0101 \u014Dna whakaaro. Me p\u0113r\u0101 hoki t\u0113r\u0101 kokonga o te Whare hoki.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000408\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d42e8cf-544e-415d-892b-f4ef8014d80f\u0022\u003EHei oranga an\u014D t\u0113r\u0101 ko te piringa o te tangata ki te whenua. Ehara i te mea he m\u0101m\u0101 t\u0113nei mea te h\u012Bkoi ki roto i \u0113nei ture, heoi ko te manako an\u014D kia tiro t\u0101tou wh\u0101nui o t\u014D t\u0101tou nei hapori ka whai ng\u0101 hapori wh\u0101nui i \u0113nei k\u014Drero an\u014D hoki i te mea me haere tahi an\u014D t\u0101tou i runga i te tika me te pono kia kaua \u0113tahi o t\u0101tou nei whanaunga P\u0101keh\u0101 e noho k\u016Bare ki waho i \u014D t\u0101tou nei takiw\u0101 M\u0101ori nei. N\u014D reira, kei te mihi atu au ki t\u0113n\u0101 o ng\u0101 \u0101huatanga. Ko te \u0101huatanga o te pire e p\u0101 ana ki a Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi ko t\u014Dna piringa ki Te Arawa e tau ana ki \u014Dna whenua ki t\u014Dna whenua i Rotorua, i Kaingaroa, i Matat\u0101 an\u014D hoki, i rongo au i te pai, me te pai o \u014D koutou nei whenua, heoi, n\u0101 te \u0101huatanga o te mate urut\u0101, t\u0113 taea e m\u0101tou o te Komiti Whiriwhiri Take M\u0101ori te tae atu ki t\u014D koutou nei marae, te tiro, te t\u016Bhura te whenua i pupu ake \u0113nei o ng\u0101 whakaaro n\u0101 koutou.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000409\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d42e8cf-544e-415d-892b-f4ef8014d80f\u0022\u003EKo \u0113tahi o ng\u0101 nawe h\u012Btori o Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi ki te Karauna ko te korenga \u014Dna e kawe i ana mahi i runga i te pono n\u014Dna i r\u012Bhi, n\u014Dna i hoko atu t\u0113tahi poraka whenua o Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi. Ko te tangohanga o ng\u0101 whenua nui rawa atu i te ariki mai i Te Mahinga T\u016Bmatanui. M\u014Dhio k\u0113 t\u0101tou ng\u0101 iwi M\u0101ori ki t\u0113r\u0101, ki t\u0113r\u0101 o ng\u0101 ture, Te Public Works Act me \u014Dna kia huna an\u014D t\u0113r\u0101 taniwha ki te haere mai ki te whanoke, ki te t\u0101hae i \u014D t\u0101tou nei whenua, n\u014D reira Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi me mihi atu au ki a koutou i te mea kua p\u0101ngia t\u0113r\u0101 \u0101huatanga ki a koutou. I rongo au i ng\u0101 k\u014Drero i te w\u0101 i r\u016B te whenua, i h\u016B te maunga puia a Tarawera me te tauira an\u014D i te w\u0101 i r\u016B te whenua, i puia te maunga i noho marara koutou n\u0101 te raru i t\u0113tahi o ng\u0101 takiw\u0101. I a au e whakaaro ake m\u014D te taha o te Karauna, m\u014D kei hea te Karauna i taua w\u0101. Kei hea rawa te Karauna i taua w\u0101. I rongo i noho mokemoke koutou. Kei whea te ringa \u0101whina n\u0101 te K\u0101wanatanga? Kei whea te ringa tautoko n\u014D te K\u0101wanatanga? N\u014D reira, ko t\u0113nei pire ka whai w\u0101hi an\u014D ki te whakatakoto i t\u0113r\u0101 h\u012Btori kia m\u014Dhio mai t\u0101tou katoa, p\u0113ra ana te \u0101hua, p\u0113r\u0101 ana ng\u0101 hapa, ng\u0101 hara i tau an\u014D i a koutou, i te mea ko te nuinga o ng\u0101 t\u0101ngata i parekurahia i mate i t\u0113r\u0101 o ng\u0101 rautau n\u0101 koutou, n\u0101 koutou t\u0113r\u0101, n\u0101 koutou.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000410\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d42e8cf-544e-415d-892b-f4ef8014d80f\u0022\u003EHeoi r\u0101, e te iwi, i rongo katoa au kei te whai ara an\u014D koutou. Kei te noho koutou me Te Kaunihera \u0101-Rohe ki te whai i t\u0113tahi ara koiora, t\u0113tahi ara whakarauora i \u014D koutou nei wai m\u0101ori ki runga i te tika me te pono, n\u014D reira i tautoko ana au i ng\u0101 k\u014Drero ki t\u014D m\u0101tou nei Minita o mua, Eugenie Sage, n\u0101 te mea i kaha ng\u0101kaunui ana ki ng\u0101 \u0101huatanga o te taiao. Heoi, i a au e whakaaro ana ki Te Tiriti o Waitangi ko te horopaki e noho ana nei t\u0101tou i t\u0113nei w\u0101 ko te m\u014Drearea o te huringa o te \u0101huarangi, te matemate haere o ng\u0101 kararehe, ng\u0101 moroiti ki roto i \u014D t\u0101tou nei awa. Heoi ko t\u0113nei ara i kitea nei koutou i whakatau koutou ki roto i t\u014D koutou nei pire he ara an\u014D kia ora t\u0113ra mauri an\u014D ki roto i te awa, kia ora t\u0113ra mauri an\u014D ki roto i ng\u0101 whenua kei te hoki mai an\u014D ki a koutou.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000411\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d42e8cf-544e-415d-892b-f4ef8014d80f\u0022\u003EE mihi ana hoki ki ng\u0101 \u0101huatanga o ng\u0101 whenua kei te hoki an\u014D ki \u014D koutou nei ringa ki roto i ng\u0101 \u0101huatanga. Me whakarite an\u014D t\u0101tou te P\u0101remata i t\u0113r\u0101 o ng\u0101 \u0101huatanga. Hoki an\u014D taku maumahara ki t\u0113r\u0101 an\u014D o ng\u0101 whakatauk\u012B \u201CM\u0113n\u0101 ka riro whenua atu me hoki whenua mai.\u201D N\u014D reira Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi, anei an\u014D m\u0101tou ng\u0101 K\u0101k\u0101riki e tautoko ana i t\u0113nei o ng\u0101 pire. N\u014D reira, t\u0113n\u0101 koutou, t\u0113n\u0101 koutou, t\u0113r\u0101 k\u014Drero o ng\u0101 m\u0101tua t\u012Bpuna, t\u0113n\u0101 t\u0101tou katoa.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000412\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d42e8cf-544e-415d-892b-f4ef8014d80f\u0022\u003E [Greetings, Madam Speaker. Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi, greetings to you all. You are at the forefront of our minds at this time, therefore I greet you in justice and truth, acknowledging the patience and forbearance of your ancestors, as I welcome you to the third reading of this bill, of your law. Therefore, to you who have made it to the p\u014Dwhiri in the Houses of Parliament, welcome. Greetings to you all, including those by way of the safety of Zoom. This digital technology helps us manage our lives at this time, and we of the Greens acknowledge you all on this very special day of yours.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000413\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d42e8cf-544e-415d-892b-f4ef8014d80f\u0022\u003ENg\u0101ti Rangitihi, although financial redress via a bill of this sort can never correct the mistakes or the calamities, nor relieve the pain that has impacted you, the settlement lays down a foundation to strengthen the future cultural wealth of your tribe. While I was listening to what our chairperson said, as I myself am a member of the M\u0101ori Affairs Committee, the story of our chairperson, of T\u0101mati came up\u2014his connections to T\u016Bhourangi, his relationship to the Te Arawa peoples and about the health and the quality of your land. I heard the name of the lagoon, Matat\u0101 Lagoon. I heard about the arrival of M\u0101taatua, and Te Arawa. In every place another god seemed to arrive, and the thought arose in my mind, goodness knows how many gods arrived in your area. Goodness knows how many ancestors arrived in your region to take heed of its health, its history and its ancient stories. Therefore, to the ancestors who have already set in place this issue, may you rest in peace. However, the desire is that the descendants growing up will follow on with the heart inherited from your oral traditions.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000414\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d42e8cf-544e-415d-892b-f4ef8014d80f\u0022\u003ETo our way of thinking, the Treaty of Waitangi is not just a contract to simply head off to the supermarket to buy lollies. No. The Treaty of Waitangi is a permanent living document. Since its signing by our ancestors at Waitangi in the year 1840 right up until today it is still the subject of debate. It has been a valid foundation since that time that provides benefit in guiding our Parliament and all the peoples residing in Aotearoa New Zealand. How should we move forward in a way beneficial to all? Therefore I have to acknowledge the Treaty of Waitangi. The Treaty of Waitangi can\u2019t be settled.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000415\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d42e8cf-544e-415d-892b-f4ef8014d80f\u0022\u003EI acknowledge the sub-tribes and the orators, you who have travelled this path to arrive at this point. I thought that one of the benefits of this type of bill is that the elders, both female and male, and other adults have the opportunity to gather the thoughts, ideas, and traditional stories, and to share these with the young people and children. What for? So that the benefits of the knowledge in those stories can be saved, as a benefit for your children and grandchildren. So I fully support the thoughts of Minister Kiritapu Allan when she spoke. And it should be the same on that side of the House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000416\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d42e8cf-544e-415d-892b-f4ef8014d80f\u0022\u003EAnother benefit is the connection of people to the land. It is not as if it is an easy thing to navigate these laws, but the desire is that everyone in our communities can follow these processes, because we must work together in justice and truth so that our P\u0101keh\u0101 relatives are not left in ignorance outside of our M\u0101ori settings. Therefore, I applaud this function. Regarding the aspect of the bill relating to the relationship between Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi and Te Arawa concerning its lands in Rotorua, Kaingaroa, and Matat\u0101, I heard about the quality and advantages of your land, however, due to the effects of the pandemic we, of the M\u0101ori Affairs Committee, were unable to visit your marae, to see and explore your land from where your thoughts and ideas have stemmed.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000417\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d42e8cf-544e-415d-892b-f4ef8014d80f\u0022\u003EOne of the historical grievances of Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi against the Crown was the absence of fairness when it leased out, or sold off blocks of land belonging to Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi. The taking of vast tracts of land was done under the auspices of public works. M\u0101oridom already knew of that law, the Public Works Act, which allowed the stealing of land by stealth, so I lament for you, Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi, that these abuses happened to you.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000418\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d42e8cf-544e-415d-892b-f4ef8014d80f\u0022\u003EI heard the stories of the time of the earthquake and the eruption of Mount Tarawera and the example that, at the time of the earthquake and the eruption you were living away from the area due to the problems in that region. As I was thinking about the Crown\u2019s part, about where the Crown was at that time\u2014where the hell was the Crown at that time? I heard you were left isolated at that time. Where was the helping hand of the Crown? Where was the supporting hand of the Crown? Therefore, this bill is an opportunity to lay out the history so that we can all know that this was how it was, these were the mistakes, the transgressions that affected to you, because the majority of people who died in battle, died in the last century were you\u2014you.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000419\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d42e8cf-544e-415d-892b-f4ef8014d80f\u0022\u003EHowever, to the tribes, I heard that you are pursuing a way forward. You are working together with the regional council to pursue a regeneration plan for your waterways based on justice and truth, and so I support the words of our previous Minister, Eugenie Sage, for she was one committed to environmental issues. As I think about the Treaty of Waitangi, today\u2019s context of climate change is a cause of concern, with the continuing loss of fauna and microbial contamination of our waterways. However, the plan you have envisioned and laid out in this bill is one that will enliven the life force in the rivers and on the lands, the lands that are being returned to you.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000420\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d42e8cf-544e-415d-892b-f4ef8014d80f\u0022\u003EI acknowledge you in the circumstances of your land being returned to your hands. This is a process that Parliament should repeat. I am reminded of the proverb \u201CIf land is taken away, it must be returned.\u201D Therefore, Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi, we Greens stand again in support of this bill. Greetings, greetings, in the language of the ancestors, greetings one and all.]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002258baa209-edaf-42a5-92d6-b2613c144bfb\u0022 data-id=\u0022e6cc97ede188474e9b97afd55fb60177\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000421\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002258baa209-edaf-42a5-92d6-b2613c144bfb\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022e6cc97ede188474e9b97afd55fb60177\u0022\u003ENICOLE McKEE (ACT):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Madam Speaker. I stand to rise on behalf of the ACT Party to share in support for this bill going through its third and final reading, the Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi Claims Settlement Bill. I\u2019ve been moved by the history of redress sought by Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi over many decades since the 1860s, and I recognise the knowledge that I learnt today of the separation of Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi from other iwi in order to bring this settlement to a conclusion, and seeing as it\u2019s been going since the 1860s, I commend them for their efforts.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000422\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002258baa209-edaf-42a5-92d6-b2613c144bfb\u0022\u003EI\u2019m moved by the stamina of the people to not only give their physical being by way of military support to the Crown but to do so while trying to seek adequate redress for the claims of the confiscation of some of their lands.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000423\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002258baa209-edaf-42a5-92d6-b2613c144bfb\u0022\u003EI note also the rise in those who have identified themselves of Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi descent, with 5,657 people registered claimants for the settlement process, up from 2,298 members recorded in the 2013 census. I admire the way that iwi and hap\u016B have been able to interact and consider how they will have ownership and transfer of land, specifically at how T\u016Bhourangi are being gifted land at Waimangu valley by agreed post-settlement resolution. I understand that this is something that is very rare but a significant effect of this settlement. I acknowledge Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi and T\u016Bhourangi for their efforts here.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000424\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002258baa209-edaf-42a5-92d6-b2613c144bfb\u0022\u003EHaving spent many years growing up in Rotorua, swimming the lakes, especially Tarawera\u2014that was my home away from home\u2014bathing in the hot pools, walking the tracks, living in and around the extended rohe, learning the history. As an example, as I mentioned in my second reading speech, the impact of Tarawera\u2019s eruption on 10 June 1866, where she blew her top creating nine craters, with the loss of Te Wairoa village and also the historic pink and white terraces. What I did not learn was the plight of Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi and other iwi; the land losses that had occurred. We did not learn about that history at Rotorua Girls\u2019 High School\u2014the land that was taken from iwi and how it was taken. The redress for this claims settlement bill, like so many others, is a long time coming.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000425\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002258baa209-edaf-42a5-92d6-b2613c144bfb\u0022\u003EAs this bill concludes and is soon to become an Act, it is important to acknowledge the years of work in making this settlement happen, the six years of negotiations. My colleagues around the House have named people whom they wish to acknowledge and ACT gets behind those acknowledgments and shares those wishes and thanks that our colleagues have given.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000426\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002258baa209-edaf-42a5-92d6-b2613c144bfb\u0022\u003EI think it\u2019s also very important to acknowledge the iwi and hap\u016B who have strived to bring this settlement to conclusion. To Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi: may your mauri grow as strong as your numbers are growing; may Tarawera, your awa, flow securely with the wairua of your t\u012Bpuna, rather than being thick with pollution; may this settlement bring closure to the many decades of sought redress, the six years of negotiation, and the over 100 years of having your complaints trying to be heard. ACT continues to support this bill. N\u014D reira, t\u0113n\u0101 koutou, t\u0113n\u0101 koutou, t\u0113n\u0101 koutou katoa.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022d14b1afe-2069-41e4-96fa-c8dc81a991a4\u0022 data-id=\u0022c2724b8c5ae44aaebf607e76d573e1cd\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000427\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022d14b1afe-2069-41e4-96fa-c8dc81a991a4\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022c2724b8c5ae44aaebf607e76d573e1cd\u0022\u003EASSISTANT SPEAKER (Hon Jenny Salesa)\u003C/span\u003E: Our next call is a split call. I call on Simon Watts\u2014five minutes.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022713ccc5b-7ff0-4fa5-ab58-4780620184fe\u0022 data-id=\u00226f1a66087e02455980d598c1542f62f9\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000428\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022713ccc5b-7ff0-4fa5-ab58-4780620184fe\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00226f1a66087e02455980d598c1542f62f9\u0022\u003ESIMON WATTS (National\u2014North Shore):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you very much, Madam Speaker. I arise on behalf of National and as the MP for North Shore on the Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi Claims Settlement Bill in its third reading. It is my pleasure to stand here on the third reading of this bill to talk about what is a very important settlement and one which the National Party is very pleased to support. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000429\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022713ccc5b-7ff0-4fa5-ab58-4780620184fe\u0022\u003EThe key settlement outcomes, which have been canvassed by a number of speakers this evening already, are $11.3 million of financial redress comprising of $7.3 million through the Central North Island Forests Iwi Collective settlement, and an additional final redress of $4 million plus interest of $390,000 from their date of agreement as well. There\u2019s also a right of first offer over the Rotomahana farm currently owned by Landcorp, and the right to buy the land under the Matua School and the school health site, with a lease to the Ministry of Education. Lastly, and importantly, the settlement outcomes include cultural redress, which include acknowledging the statutory area of Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi, and reflects this in relation to the Crown Minerals Act, the Resource Management Act, and the Fisheries Act. So this settlement will, in effect, provide the vesting of 19 key sites transferred to this iwi as part of that cultural redress process. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000430\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022713ccc5b-7ff0-4fa5-ab58-4780620184fe\u0022\u003ENational has always, and continues, and has a long and proud history, of supporting our Treaty settlement processes under the Hon Chris Finlayson previously, and we are continuing to support\u2014in a bipartisan manner\u2014this settlement process. The history and the impacts on Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi have been canvassed widely by the speakers this afternoon, and while this settlement can never be a full compensation in terms of the impacts that were felt by members of the iwi and hap\u016B in this regard, it does go some way in order to reflect the impact that it\u2019s had, and in effect to provide a pathway forward for that and those people to move forward into the future. The settlements process\u2014as we know in this House\u2014recognises and rights the wrongs of the past, and strengthens the key partnership between both Crown and iwi, and this is something that the National Party fully support. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000431\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022713ccc5b-7ff0-4fa5-ab58-4780620184fe\u0022\u003EI guess the opportunity as a result of this settlement process is for the iwi to unlock some of the economic potential and boost regional and provincial growth in areas which will benefit from that aspect, and that is important in terms of their ability, particularly in the central North Island where this will impact. The Crown has provided unreservedly an apology in regards to hap\u016B and whenua as a result of failing to uphold the principles of the Treaty, and again that is recognised. I want to, obviously, acknowledge members of the M\u0101ori Affairs Committee who contributed to this bill, and I know that members on this side of the House who are with me this evening played a key role in that, alongside other members around this House as well. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000432\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022713ccc5b-7ff0-4fa5-ab58-4780620184fe\u0022\u003EThat is pretty much all that I\u2019m wanting to talk about this evening. I send my best thoughts and wishes to all the members of the iwi who will be watching this online this evening. It is a shame that you can\u2019t be here in this House to share this very special occasion with us, but we feel you here in spirit and we know that you are watching, and I send my best wishes to you and your wh\u0101nau. I commend this bill to the House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00220f7d126e-c18d-4466-9ebe-d424ae5c4bf6\u0022 data-id=\u002256d1f3c5236f4cdaa5b0d578def07b7c\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000433\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220f7d126e-c18d-4466-9ebe-d424ae5c4bf6\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002256d1f3c5236f4cdaa5b0d578def07b7c\u0022\u003ERAWIRI WAITITI (Co-Leader\u2014Te Paati M\u0101ori) (remote):\u003C/span\u003E Au\u0113, kua moata k\u0113 taku karanga. Kia ora t\u0101tou. Kia ora t\u0101tou i t\u0113nei r\u0101. T\u0113n\u0101 t\u0101tou i a t\u0101tou e whakawh\u0101iti nei i t\u0113nei ahiahi. T\u0113nei t\u0101tou i \u014D t\u0101tou tini mate, ng\u0101 mate huhua o te w\u0101, ng\u0101 mate kei runga o Te Arawa waka i t\u0113nei w\u0101, ng\u0101 mate kei runga o M\u0101taatua, o Te Waiariki wh\u0101nui ki t\u0113r\u0101 kuia ki runga o Ruat\u0101huna, ar\u0101 ki a Hokimoana, r\u0101tou, haere, haere whatungaro atu r\u0101. Hoki mai r\u0101 ki a t\u0101tou ng\u0101 mahuetanga iho, ng\u0101 toenga iho, e hika m\u0101 t\u0113n\u0101 koutou. Ng\u0101 pakeke, ki te iwi, ki ng\u0101 mokopuna kua tae ki P\u0101remata, ng\u0101 mihi nui. Aroha mai ki t\u0113nei kua r\u0101huitia ki te k\u0101inga ko te mea kua p\u0101 te ng\u0101ngara taikuhu kaihuna nei ki \u0101ku tamariki. N\u014D reira aroha mai k\u0101ore e taea ki t\u014D koutou p\u014Dwhiri i t\u0113nei r\u0101 me te h\u0101kari an\u014D ki t\u014D koutou taha engari anei r\u0101 te mihi atu r\u0101 ki a koutou.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000434\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220f7d126e-c18d-4466-9ebe-d424ae5c4bf6\u0022\u003ENg\u0101 uri o Tama-te-Kapua, kua t\u0101tou t\u0113nei. Ko t\u0101tou t\u0113n\u0101 o ng\u0101 uri o Tama-te-Kapua, ar\u0101 i \u016B mai ki Whangapar\u0101oa, ar\u0101 ki te take o Tihirau k\u0101tahi an\u014D ki roto o Maket\u016B, \u0101, tae ake r\u0101 ki ng\u0101 t\u014Dpito katoa o t\u0113nei motu. No reira ko Tama-te-Kapua, ko Tawaki- moe-tahanga, ko Uenuku mai i Rarotonga, an\u0101, ko Rangitihi. Rangitihi upoko whakahirahira. N\u014D Rangitihi, te upoko i takaia ki te akatea. Ehara m\u0101 te Aitanga a Tiki. Nei r\u0101 te mihi atu r\u0101 ki a koutou e ng\u0101 whanaunga, anei r\u0101 t\u014D koutou mokopuna e mihi nei. N\u0101 reira e ng\u0101 karangaranga hap\u016B, kei a koutou, n\u0101 koutou te rangi nei. Ng\u0101ti Hinehua, Ng\u0101ti Hinerangi, Ng\u0101ti Ihu, Ng\u0101ti Mahi, Ng\u0101ti Whareiti, Ng\u0101ti Tionga, Ng\u0101ti Tutangata, t\u0113n\u0101 koutou, t\u0113n\u0101 koutou.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000435\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220f7d126e-c18d-4466-9ebe-d424ae5c4bf6\u0022\u003EKua k\u014Drerohia te nuinga o ng\u0101 k\u014Drero a w\u0113tahi kei roto i te Whare i t\u0113nei r\u0101, engari kei te mihi atu r\u0101 ki a koutou, \u0101, i whakamanahia hei t\u0113nei kaupapa ka aroha nei koutou e whai. He aha ng\u0101 hua ka puta k\u0101ore an\u014D kia whai ki ng\u0101 whakatipuranga o Rangitihi te tipu m\u0101toro ki runga i t\u014Dna ake whenua kia p\u016B\u0101wai an\u014D te reo o Rangitihi kia tarea an\u014D ki te whakarite rautaki m\u014D te tiaki i te taiao me te whakahoki i ng\u0101 ingoa t\u016Bturu o ng\u0101 w\u0101hi katoa o Rangitihi, kia whai oranga te iwi i roto i te m\u0101tauranga i te \u014Dhanga, i te hauora, \u0101huatanga toko te ora me w\u0113ra atu \u0101huatanga katoa. Ko te whakahokitanga mai o ng\u0101 awa, ng\u0101 whenua rotarota, ng\u0101 roto, ng\u0101 w\u0101hi k\u014Dreporepo, ng\u0101 ahi tipua, ng\u0101 ng\u0101wh\u0101 n\u0101 te mea he w\u0101hi m\u014Dmona i ng\u0101 rawa, i ng\u0101 kai, i rongo\u0101 M\u0101ori, i te mahana m\u014D te iwi.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000436\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220f7d126e-c18d-4466-9ebe-d424ae5c4bf6\u0022\u003EAr\u0101, in\u0101 te k\u014Drero ka tiki ake au i ng\u0101 k\u014Drero a te waka, te waiata \u201CKa Eke ki Wairaka\u201D\u2014k\u0101ti au ki taku whenua tipu. Ki te wai koropup\u016B e heria mai nei i Hawaiki r\u0101 an\u014D e Ng\u0101toroirangi me \u014Dna tuahine a Te Hoata a Te Pupu e h\u016B r\u0101 i Tongariro ka mahana i taku kiri. Ka roa a Rangitihi \u0101miomio haere ana p\u0113r\u0101 an\u014D i te \u0101miomio o t\u0101 t\u0101tou t\u012Bpuna a Tama-te-Kapua i te korokoro o Te Parata. Ko t\u0101 Rangitihi ko te korokoro o te K\u0101wana. Te K\u0101wana apo whenua, ar\u0101 240,000 heketea. He K\u0101wana apo k\u0101inga, n\u0101 te kanukanu o ng\u0101 k\u0101inga o Rangitihi i roto i ng\u0101 tau maha. He K\u0101wana apo tangata, n\u0101 te kore mahi, \u0101, me te hunga i mate i ng\u0101 Pakanga o Aotearoa me ng\u0101 Pakanga o Te Ao. He K\u0101wana apo tikanga, te mimiti haere o t\u014D t\u0101tou reo, ng\u0101 tikanga me ng\u0101 k\u014Drero. Ahakoa k\u0101ore e whakahokia mai te katoa i te t\u012Bmata he t\u012Bmatatanga noa iho t\u0113nei. Me waiho ake ng\u0101 mokopuna te 99 \u014Drau e toe ana e pakangatia ana.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000437\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220f7d126e-c18d-4466-9ebe-d424ae5c4bf6\u0022\u003EN\u0101 reira e hika m\u0101, kua pakupaku te w\u0101hanga ki a au engari koia hoki te k\u0101, te pai o te kaupapa e herea ai e Te Paati M\u0101ori. Me whai w\u0101hi ng\u0101 iwi katoa ki te relativity p\u0113r\u0101 an\u014D i a Kai Tahu me Waikato. \u0100, me te Waitangi Tribunal hoki. Me whakamahia ng\u0101 tohutohu a te taraipiunara, \u0101, ng\u0101 tohutohu i tohungia ki te Minita, \u0101, me whakamanahia. \u0100, me whakakorengia an\u014D hoki ng\u0101 full and final settlements, me ng\u0101 large natural groupings, kia tarea an\u014D hoki ng\u0101 hap\u016B te whai waiho ki roto i te \u0101huatanga nei. \u0100, me te whakahoki atu i ng\u0101 whenua o Te Papa Atawhai ki a Mana Whenua.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000438\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220f7d126e-c18d-4466-9ebe-d424ae5c4bf6\u0022\u003EN\u0101 reira e hika kua pau te w\u0101hanga m\u0101 Te Paati M\u0101ori. Ka mihi nui ki a koutou e ng\u0101 kai\u0101rahi o t\u0113nei ker\u0113me ki Leith, Cathy, Merepeka, Tia, Melanie, Taichi, Donna, koutou r\u0101, ng\u0101 mihi nui ki a koutou.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000439\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220f7d126e-c18d-4466-9ebe-d424ae5c4bf6\u0022\u003E[Oh, my call has come early. Greetings, everyone. Greetings, everyone, on this day. Greetings, everyone, as we gather together this afternoon. We mourn the many deaths, the innumerable deaths of the Te Arawa peoples, of M\u0101taatua as well, of the wider Te Waiariki, to the female elder of Ruat\u0101huna, Hokimoana. May they rest in peace. Turning to us, to those left behind, to those remaining, greetings to you all. To the elders, to the tribe, to the grandchildren who have come to Parliament, I acknowledge you. My apologies for being in isolation at home due to my children being affected by this stealthy beast, COVID-19. So my apologies for not being able to be by your side for the p\u014Dwhiri and the feast but none the less, this is my acknowledgment to you.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000440\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220f7d126e-c18d-4466-9ebe-d424ae5c4bf6\u0022\u003ETo the descendants of Tama-te-Kapua, I am one of you. We are the descendants of Tama-te-Kapua, who landed at Whangapar\u0101oa\u2014that is, at the foot of Tihirau\u2014landing then at Maket\u016B, and then spreading out to all corners of this land. So it was Tama-te-Kapua, then Tawaki-moe-tahanga, then Uenuku from Rarotonga and Rangitihi. Rangitihi of the proud and lofty brow. Rangitihi whose head was bound up with bushvines. That is not for a mere mortal. This is my greeting to you, my relations. This is your grandchild who greets you. Therefore, to the many groups of subtribes, this is your day. Ng\u0101ti Hinehua, Ng\u0101ti Hinerangi, Ng\u0101ti Ihu, Ng\u0101ti Mahi, Ng\u0101ti Whareiti, Ng\u0101ti Tionga, Ng\u0101ti Tutangata, greetings to you all.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000441\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220f7d126e-c18d-4466-9ebe-d424ae5c4bf6\u0022\u003EMost of what needs to be said has been said by others today in the House, but I wish to acknowledge you and to enable this issue that you are wanting to pursue. What will be the fruits not yet obtained by the generations of Rangitihi on their own land so that the language of Rangitihi can flourish, so that they can create strategies for care of the environment, and return original names to all the places of Rangitihi, so that the tribe can benefit from traditional knowledge, from economic control, from health, from social support and many other things? The return of the rivers, of the wild areas, the lakes, the marshes, the geothermal areas and hot springs is because this is a fertile place full of resources such as food, traditional medicines\u2014a source of warmth for the tribe.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000442\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220f7d126e-c18d-4466-9ebe-d424ae5c4bf6\u0022\u003EThen there is the story of the waka, the song \u201CKa Eke ki Wairaka\u201D with the line\u2014but now I go back to my own country. The story of the hot springs brought from Hawaiki by Ng\u0101toroirangi and his sisters Te Hoata and Te Pupu, so that Tongariro could erupt and warm my skin. It has been a long time that Rangitihi has been spun round and round, just like our ancestor Tama-te-Kapua was in the throat of the whirlpool of Parata. According to Rangitihi it is the throat of the Government\u2014the Government who grasps land, 240,000 hectares of it. The Government that appropriates villages, shown by the dilapidation of the villages of Rangitihi over many years. A Government that exploits people through lack of work, and those that died in the New Zealand Wars and the World Wars. A Government that destroys customary practices, the loss of our language, practices and stories. Although not everything has been returned it is a beginning\u2014it is just a beginning. Let the remaining 99 percent be left for the future generations to fight for.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000443\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220f7d126e-c18d-4466-9ebe-d424ae5c4bf6\u0022\u003ETherefore, there is little time left for me but this is the point, the good thing about the policy which the M\u0101ori Party supports. All tribes should be able to achieve relativity like Kai Tahu and Waikato. And, to the Waitangi Tribunal as well. We should enforce all the tribunal\u2019s recommendations made to the Minister; they should be validated. We should abandon the concept of full and final settlements, and large natural groupings, so that hap\u016B can participate in the process. Furthermore, all Department of Conservation land should be returned to those with traditional authority over that land.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000444\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220f7d126e-c18d-4466-9ebe-d424ae5c4bf6\u0022\u003EWell, then, the M\u0101ori Party\u2019s time is up. Thank you to all the leaders in this claim, to Leith, Cathy, Merepeka, Tia, Melanie, Taichi, Donna, to all of you, an immense thankyou. Be well one and all.]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022b464a62e-d900-452a-b842-e3cf4ccc6149\u0022 data-id=\u002234893872cc334f379f71d4431fc2ce90\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000445\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b464a62e-d900-452a-b842-e3cf4ccc6149\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002234893872cc334f379f71d4431fc2ce90\u0022\u003EARENA WILLIAMS (Labour\u2014Manurewa) (remote):\u003C/span\u003E T\u0113n\u0101 koe, Madam Speaker. Ki Te Arawa Waka, t\u0113nei te mihi. Ki ng\u0101 uri o Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi, t\u0113n\u0101 koutou i t\u0113nei ahiahi. Ki ng\u0101 pakeke, ki ng\u0101 tamariki mokopuna, t\u0113n\u0101 koutou.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000446\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b464a62e-d900-452a-b842-e3cf4ccc6149\u0022\u003E[Greetings, Madam Speaker. To the peoples of Te Arawa, greetings. To the descendants of Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi, greetings this afternoon. To the elders and to the children and grandchildren, greetings.]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000447\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b464a62e-d900-452a-b842-e3cf4ccc6149\u0022\u003EI first want to acknowledge my colleagues from around the House who have spoken to recognise and celebrate Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi today, and the long-established principle in New Zealand that the Crown owes to M\u0101ori the duty to act in good faith, according to the Treaty of Waitangi. That duty is recognised by MPs with different backgrounds and different ideologies, and it\u2019s such an important part of giving effect to the vision our ancestors had for Aotearoa when they made agreements with one another in 1840. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000448\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b464a62e-d900-452a-b842-e3cf4ccc6149\u0022\u003EThis legislation gives effect to the deed of settlement between the Crown and Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi, which acknowledges both instances where the Crown did not fulfil that duty of good faith, and I\u2019m proud to be a part of a Parliament that does not erase the wrongs that the Crown has done but, instead, comes together in this way, like we are today, in acknowledging those wrongs, and looking forward to setting them right. I want to echo what the Minister for Treaty of Waitangi Negotiations said in his opening remarks this evening, about it being a privilege to stand in support of this legislation, and his words of appreciation for the Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi representatives who are in Wellington, and those who are watching online due to the COVID-19 restrictions. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000449\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b464a62e-d900-452a-b842-e3cf4ccc6149\u0022\u003ENg\u0101ti Rangitihi have endured a very long wait to settle their claims, and this is a significant milestone today. It represents a huge amount of work and commitment by the negotiators, those mandated by Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi, those who have gathered the stories and the histories and told them, and brought people together because of them, and the wider wh\u0101nau\u2014all of you have a place in this, all of you are celebrated today, and all of your work is recognised. Today is also an opportunity to look to the future as an iwi, to continue to build your modern identity, and flourish collectively. It is a day of unification for Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi and that\u2019s something to be very proud of by everyone who\u2019s been involved in this process. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000450\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b464a62e-d900-452a-b842-e3cf4ccc6149\u0022\u003EI want to thank everyone who submitted on this bill, and the diligent advisers, and our clerks, and my colleagues on the M\u0101ori Affairs Committee for their work and considering the views of submitters, and advice in depth\u2014largely by Zoom, as we are now. And it wasn\u2019t light work, learning the history of the t\u012Bpuna of Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi. It is a history of excessive land takings by the Crown, under the guise of public works, and not having sufficient land in the aftermath of the Tarawera eruption to keep people well and to support the future of the iwi. As previous speakers have noted today, Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi are, effectively, a landless people, and they have been dispossessed of their tribal lands. They now have interests in less than 4 percent of their original 250,000 hectare tribal rohe, which included Kaingaroa, and much of that land interest which they do have is unable to be used for economic benefit due to its status as conservation or reserves land. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000451\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b464a62e-d900-452a-b842-e3cf4ccc6149\u0022\u003EBut, looking forward, there are two main ways of addressing those injustices, in this piece of legislation and in all Treaty settlement legislation. There is, first, the financial redress, and many before me have touched on that, and it is significant, but it is the cultural redress that I want to touch on again, because we\u2019ve heard from speakers about the importance of conservation in that and what the iwi has agreed with the Crown, and that is important and an exciting part of this to celebrate. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000452\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b464a62e-d900-452a-b842-e3cf4ccc6149\u0022\u003EIt includes the settlement of 19 sites of deep significance to be transferred to Rangitihi as cultural redress on the settlement date, and that includes two properties at Te Tapahoro Bay, which are known as the beating heart of the Rangitihi rohe; two properties in and around the Waimangu Volcanic Valley, and the former site of the Pink and White Terraces; and five properties at Matat\u0101. But they mean more than the land, and they are more than the sum of their parts: they represent relationships with neighbouring iwi and T\u016Bhourangi, in particular. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000453\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b464a62e-d900-452a-b842-e3cf4ccc6149\u0022\u003EThey represent relationships with local government, and the ability to come to the negotiating table as equals in the local government sphere. They represent relationships with arms of Government like the Department of Conservation, and the Ministry for Culture and Heritage, and those culture and heritage acknowledgments are an opportunity to build on the rich history and culture, and to tell those stories to a wider New Zealand audience. Some of those relationships will be held at the marae level, some at the hap\u016B level, and they allow for the growth of leadership, and a pipeline of young leaders in Rangitihi who will become ready to take on the leadership mantle that those negotiators watching today have taken so well, and have set an incredible example. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000454\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b464a62e-d900-452a-b842-e3cf4ccc6149\u0022\u003ECultural redress represents an opportunity to move forward as kaitiaki and as a partner to the Crown in the rohe. It is truly about nation building for Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi, and it is an exciting thing to be able to do. It\u2019s also for the tamariki and mokopuna who will be future leaders, and it guarantees ownership of assets of significance in the rohe which are important to that question of who we are and what we stand for as M\u0101ori. This cultural redress sets Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi up to stand strong in their rohe as kaitiaki and rangatira, where they should be. May this House never forget what was lost because of the actions of the Crown. I commend this bill to the House. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00229c069cdb-968c-4f11-b126-92f9c655148b\u0022 data-id=\u0022446223312a2c44889952446c4149b96d\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000455\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00229c069cdb-968c-4f11-b126-92f9c655148b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022446223312a2c44889952446c4149b96d\u0022\u003ESHANAN HALBERT (Labour\u2014Northcote) (remote):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Mr Speaker. Mihi ki ng\u0101 rangi, mihi ki te whenua, t\u0113n\u0101 koutou katoa. Me mihi au ki te iwi o Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi. Kei te mihi ki a koutou, ki t\u014D iwi, ki t\u014D hap\u016B, ki t\u014D wh\u0101nau, ki \u014D mokopuna hoki. T\u0113n\u0101 rawa atu ki a koutou i t\u0113nei r\u0101.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000456\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00229c069cdb-968c-4f11-b126-92f9c655148b\u0022\u003E[Greetings to the skies and to the land, greetings one and all. I must acknowledge the Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi tribe. I acknowledge you all, your tribes, your hap\u016B, and your families and grandchildren as well. Warm greetings to you all on this day.]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000457\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00229c069cdb-968c-4f11-b126-92f9c655148b\u0022\u003EIt is always an honour to speak on settlements and to be a part of the M\u0101ori Affairs Committee, where we get to hear directly from r\u014Dp\u016B, from iwi, from hap\u016B, and then we get to travel the journey with them, in some sense, to hear the history and, in this sense, the historical grievances of M\u0101ori, and, in this instance, of Ngati Rangitihi. This bill settles historical Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi claims with the Crown today. Through this settlement, the Crown seeks redress for the past injustices that have been inflicted upon Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi and provides opportunities for Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi and our Crown to move forward. This settlement lays the cultural and economic foundation for Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi, their rangatahi, their mokopuna, and future generations. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000458\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00229c069cdb-968c-4f11-b126-92f9c655148b\u0022\u003EOur Labour Government is committed to completing all historic Treaty settlements in our manifesto, and this bill is yet another step towards completing that commitment. I follow my own journey in M\u014Dkai P\u0101tea in our own Treaty journey, and I understand fully the hurt and the grievances that M\u0101ori has suffered over many, many years since colonisation. And today, I acknowledge Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi for getting to this part of the journey, and some would present this particular day as a way forward and, in many respects, a starting point. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000459\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00229c069cdb-968c-4f11-b126-92f9c655148b\u0022\u003EI want to acknowledge our Minister, Andrew Little, for the work that he\u2019s done on this particular bill, but also our M\u0101ori Affairs Committee, chaired by T\u0101mati Coffey, who is a part of our team and continues to work tirelessly to support particular kaupapa like this. I want to acknowledge also to Te Arawhiti and the mahi that they\u2019ve done to progress this particular bill, to support Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi, and also the officials that have worked tirelessly alongside this particular kaupapa. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000460\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00229c069cdb-968c-4f11-b126-92f9c655148b\u0022\u003EPart of our job as members of Parliament is to hear the stories, to learn from them; more so that we don\u2019t make similar mistakes. In this particular bill, we heard from a number of submitters and I want to acknowledge them today. Particularly to matua Leith Comer. Mihi atu kia koe, Leith. Thank you for your contribution that you made to our M\u0101ori Affairs Committee. The reflection that you gave on Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi\u2019s journey to settlement\u2014that it has largely been cohesive and unifying. We take your point, however, that the Treaty relationship with the Crown does not end at settlement, but rather signifies the beginning. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000461\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00229c069cdb-968c-4f11-b126-92f9c655148b\u0022\u003EI also want to acknowledge other submitters throughout this journey: Craig Atkinson, Rex Bunn, Allan Clarke, Dean Foster, Rea Martin, Lianne Mylie, matua Patrick Nicholas, Tania Rangiheuea, and the Matata Action Group. Like any journey, there\u2019s a number of stories that contribute to this particular outcome. I\u2019m proud of this piece of work that our M\u0101ori Affairs Committee have proceeded through, but I\u2019m equally proud of the opportunity that, in some senses, this sets up for Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000462\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00229c069cdb-968c-4f11-b126-92f9c655148b\u0022\u003EThe summary of the bill\u2014Part 1 sets out the purpose of the bill. It provides the provisions of the bill that take effect on the settlement date unless a provision states otherwise, it specifies that the bill binds the Crown, and it defines terms used in the bill, including Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi and their historical claims. Part 2\u2014and I acknowledge the k\u014Drero from my tuahine Arena Williams\u2014\u201C deals with cultural redress and the provision for the cultural redress to be provided to Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi. Tuatoru, Part 3, \u201CCommercial redress\u201D provides for the commercial redress to be provided to Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi, and what excites me about that particular part is that it provides a certain amount of p\u016Btea for Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi to determine the future of how their iwi operates and what that money is used for, for the social, the cultural, and the economic development of their wh\u0101nau and their tamariki mokopuna. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000463\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00229c069cdb-968c-4f11-b126-92f9c655148b\u0022\u003E There are four schedules to this particular bill. Tuatahi: \u201CStatutory areas\u201D that define and will be subject to a statutory acknowledgement or deed of recognition. Tuarua: \u201CWhenua r\u0101hui area\u201D that defines the area; and tuatoru: \u201CCultural redress properties and Te Ariki site\u201D, and this defines the properties themselves and includes the interests that they\u2019re subject to. Tuawha: \u201CNotices in relation to RFR land\u201D sets out the notice provisions for rights of first refusal. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000464\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00229c069cdb-968c-4f11-b126-92f9c655148b\u0022\u003EI just want to acknowledge mostly Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi, and this sets a way forward for their iwi, their hap\u016B, their wh\u0101nau, and their mokopuna, and that they get to determine the way forward for themselves. But I take matua Leith\u2019s points on board: that this is the beginning of a relationship with the Crown, and I wish them incredibly well in the way forward. Today, we make another apology, to settle the historical grievances for Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi with our Crown, and I acknowledge that today. Without further ado, I\u2019d like to commend this bill to the House. T\u0113n\u0101 tatou. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022073496a0-73b7-426f-97f8-916bd542b0fa\u0022 data-id=\u00222d8b79071c6240a582182da98aa1a3cd\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000465\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022073496a0-73b7-426f-97f8-916bd542b0fa\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00222d8b79071c6240a582182da98aa1a3cd\u0022\u003EHon MEKA WHAITIRI (Minister of Customs): \u003C/span\u003EE te M\u0101ngai, t\u0113n\u0101 koe. Otir\u0101 ng\u0101 mema katoa o te Whare nei, t\u0113n\u0101 t\u0101tou katoa. E ng\u0101 mate huhua kua wehe atu ki te p\u014D, ko Marina Sciascia n\u014D Ng\u0101ti Kiri, ko Miriana Hammond n\u014D Te Wairoa, ng\u0101 mate katoa o te motu nei, haere, haere, haere atu r\u0101.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000466\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022073496a0-73b7-426f-97f8-916bd542b0fa\u0022\u003E[Greetings, Mr Speaker, and to all the members of the House, greetings one and all. To the many who have passed into the night, to Marina Sciascia of Ng\u0101ti Kiri, to Miriama Hammond from Wairoa, to all the deaths around the country, may you rest in peace.]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000467\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022073496a0-73b7-426f-97f8-916bd542b0fa\u0022\u003EIt is indeed an honour for me to stand and contribute in the third and final reading of the Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi Claims Settlement Bill. Can I acknowledge all our Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi visitors who are here in the House today and all those who are watching this online. It is hugely significant that we get to the third and final reading, but it really does not go far enough in acknowledging the years and the hours of struggle that the people of Rangitihi have first lived through and also have pursued in the final settlement of their claims.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000468\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022073496a0-73b7-426f-97f8-916bd542b0fa\u0022\u003EIt is an honour to speak and acknowledge the perseverance, firstly, of the iwi of Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi. I want to acknowledge the hard work of the negotiators, particularly acknowledging Leith Comer as the chair. I\u2019ll have something more to say about the negotiators later in my contribution. Very top line-up of negotiators, I must say. I want to acknowledge the Crown negotiators, I want to acknowledge our Ministers of Treaty settlement, the Hon Andrew Little, and, of course, the former Minister, Christopher Finlayson. I want to acknowledge all the officials, Te Arawhiti, the submitters who examined the bill, the M\u0101ori Affairs Committee\u2014who took the process and opened it up for public scrutiny. I thank all those that have helped. But, like I said in my earlier opening statement, it pales in comparison to the sacrifice and, I guess, the patience and the tenacity of the Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi people whose experience in the breach of the Treaty we have found ourselves here today.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000469\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022073496a0-73b7-426f-97f8-916bd542b0fa\u0022\u003EEach Treaty settlement has a very unique set of qualities distinguishing them from each other settlement, and, in reflection of earlier contributors in this House, I want to acknowledge the unique qualities in this settlement around whenua, awa, and, of course, people. And in this comprehensive settlement, I particularly want to draw\u2014as I did in the second reading contribution I made on the cultural redress\u2014on the settlement of the Tarawera Awa restoration. In the bill, which other members have talked about in terms of the various parts, it is a significant part of this bill that we are debating as the third and final reading\u2014the Tarawera Awa Restoration Strategy Group, which is in Part 2, clauses 121 to 143. But the technical part that we are talking about here in the third and final reading of this bill, again there is a long leeway into why this has ended up in this Treaty settlement, and I want to acknowledge all the hap\u016B who have lived along the Tarawera River.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000470\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022073496a0-73b7-426f-97f8-916bd542b0fa\u0022\u003ESome members in this House have shared their own stories of growing up along it, but I want to acknowledge the many hap\u016B wh\u0101nau that have lived along that particular awa, and it has created their identity. And I guess I want to acknowledge it has been probably a sad thing for them to see the degradation of their awa over the many years. This particular clause, the Tarawera Awa restoration part of this bill goes somewhat to restoring the awa, the mauri of the awa, and that\u2019s why I wanted to acknowledge it in my contribution today. Particularly, I want to acknowledge both how we talk in this bill about establishing and the purpose of the strategy group. And in clause 121, particularly, we talk about the permanency of this committee\u2014the permanency of this committee\u2014and it cannot be discharged unless all appointees agree to it being discharged. So this is putting a stake in the ground that this committee is a permanent committee committed to the restoration and the return of the mauri of the Tarawera River for those who have inhabited it, the hap\u016B up and down it, but, actually, for all people who have enjoyed the beauty and the sustenance that this particular awa has given to all those people in this area. I want to acknowledge that.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000471\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022073496a0-73b7-426f-97f8-916bd542b0fa\u0022\u003EI also want to acknowledge the membership of this particular group because it makes for good reading as to who actually gets on this strategy group. So you see we have one member appointed from Te Mana o Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi Trust, one from Ng\u0101ti M\u0101kino Iwi Authority, one from Te R\u016Bnanga o Ng\u0101ti Awa, one from Ng\u0101ti T\u016Bwharetoa (Bay of Plenty) Settlement Trust, one from the Bay of Plenty Regional Council, one from Kawerau District Council, one from Rotorua Lakes District Council, and one from Whakat\u0101ne District Council. So this cause that I\u2019m referencing to has all the major players. You have all the regional council, all the district council, but, more importantly, you have the hap\u016B and iwi who call the Tarawera Awa their own\u2014at the table with a commitment to cleaning up the awa. I think that is worthy of acknowledgment in this third and final reading. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000472\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022073496a0-73b7-426f-97f8-916bd542b0fa\u0022\u003EI said I was going to talk about the negotiators and I do want to take the time in the acknowledging, at this third reading, of both Leith Comer, Ken Raureti Tia Warbrick, Merepeka Raukawa-Tait\u2014and I\u2019m sorry, I know there were some other negotiators but I don\u2019t have the names in front of me, but I just want to congratulate you. You are a fine bunch of individuals who have a lengthy experience that I know that you\u2019ve leaned on really hard with your settlement. Your negotiators reflect what you have achieved and we are honoured to acknowledge your presence.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000473\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022073496a0-73b7-426f-97f8-916bd542b0fa\u0022\u003ESo three of those negotiators all have Public Service experience, and so I want to say: the Public Service has an amazing way of growing future leaders that eventually go back and awhi their iwi. And in Leith, obviously, his military background\u2014I\u2019m hoping going forward in Rangitihi that we may see an academy of some sort for all those young men that have come through Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi. And, of course, Ken Raureti; I worked with Ken back in the Department of Labour days\u2014a fantastic employment adviser, and then I\u2019m looking forward to some far-reaching employment laws and, of course, conditions there for Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi because Ken has an amazing background in labour relations. And, of course, Tia Warbrick, who does also have a paid job in Stats New Zealand, and I\u2019m hoping that there\u2019s some investment in growing data capability for the Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi, with Tia\u2019s background. I know it will position the iwi particularly strong going forward. I say that in jest, but it\u2019s an honest reflection of the skill and capability of the Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi negotiators, what they\u2019ve been able to achieve. And I know going forward with their leadership, their combined leadership, and, of course, with Merepeka\u2019s leadership there and the role that she plays in looking after families, particularly, I know Rangitihi are in good hands. I have nothing but admiration for this bill that we are passing in the House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000474\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022073496a0-73b7-426f-97f8-916bd542b0fa\u0022\u003EAnd with those few words, I commend it to the House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022217f4585-f6ef-408d-9318-8a6b8506920b\u0022 data-id=\u00223fb29b9ed8464fa0a89a442028c2266c\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000475\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022217f4585-f6ef-408d-9318-8a6b8506920b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00223fb29b9ed8464fa0a89a442028c2266c\u0022\u003EPAUL EAGLE (Labour\u2014Rongotai):\u003C/span\u003E T\u0113n\u0101 koe e te M\u0101ngai o te Whare. It\u2019s a real honour to be taking the last call in this, the Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi Claims Settlement Bill. E te iwi Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi, t\u0113n\u0101 koutou katoa.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000476\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022217f4585-f6ef-408d-9318-8a6b8506920b\u0022\u003ECan I acknowledge all the speakers who have spoken previously, right through the process to bring this to a conclusion and, therefore, some happiness for our iwi, Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi. Can I start by acknowledging the Minister for Treaty settlements, the Hon Andrew Little. I know in December last year he travelled to Matat\u0101 to sign the deed of settlement, and his words\u2014I remember him saying that he was humbled to stand there on the marae and to apologise. I think as I have learnt about these claims settlement bills that come through the House and being a member of the M\u0101ori Affairs Committee, the importance of getting the apology right means a lot. The words that are crafted carefully and put into the bill take some time to ensure that they accurately reflect the horrific acts and the deeds that were done to the iwi of the time, many years ago. I remember the Minister talking about his apology on behalf of the Crown for its acts and omissions that prejudiced Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000477\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022217f4585-f6ef-408d-9318-8a6b8506920b\u0022\u003EThere are some acknowledgments I want to make and just reinforce. I talked about the M\u0101ori Affairs Committee. Can I acknowledge the chair, T\u0101mati Coffey and the whole committee, of which we had members here today, in Harete Hipango and all of those who have spoken. Because it is a committee where we do work together strongly as a team and get a thorough understanding of each of these iwi\u2019s settlements.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000478\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022217f4585-f6ef-408d-9318-8a6b8506920b\u0022\u003EBut in terms of the members of Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi, it is some shame that they\u2019re not here this afternoon to share with us this third reading. One of the great traditions, as has been said previously, is that there would be a waiata following the last speech, and usually there\u2019s some whanaungatanga, manaakitanga, together to actually put that kanohi ki te kanohi in action and understand and see the people who have been\u2014and for some it\u2019s been many, many years in the making\u2014bringing this to a conclusion.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000479\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022217f4585-f6ef-408d-9318-8a6b8506920b\u0022\u003EI want to acknowledge their lead negotiator Leith Comer. T\u0113na koe, Leith. I know you\u2019ve put in a lot of work personally to this point. There are some people past and present who\u2019ve really kept the fires burning, who have made sure that what\u2019s being put forward and what\u2019s here today\u2014and I mentioned the word \u201Caccurate\u201D\u2014is accurate and is fulsome, to ensure that the acknowledgment of the t\u012Bpuna of Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi who are no longer with us are respected.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000480\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022217f4585-f6ef-408d-9318-8a6b8506920b\u0022\u003EI also want to acknowledge the chief Crown negotiator in Katherine Gordon. I\u2019ve learnt that the structure of these arrangements is such where they work alongside each other. And, of course, there is also Te Arawhiti, the M\u0101ori Crown relations Government agency, who put staff in and ensure that we get these settlements shaped up in the way that they are.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000481\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022217f4585-f6ef-408d-9318-8a6b8506920b\u0022\u003EI did want to just finish the acknowledgments by just signalling two rangatira who are no longer with us. One, and it\u2019s been mentioned earlier, was Stephen Ihaka, who was the cultural adviser to the Crown for many, many years. He was involved in that facilitation and cultural support through the settlement. I know the Minister spoke fondly of him in the first reading to say, \u201CLook, this is a person who was involved at those more difficult times, which often these settlements have.\u201D He certainly led that party on to Rangitihi marae in December for the deed signing. And I want to mihi to Stephen and the wh\u0101nau.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000482\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022217f4585-f6ef-408d-9318-8a6b8506920b\u0022\u003EAlso there\u2019s Allan Skipwith, the chair of T\u016Bhourangi Tribal Authority, close neighbours to Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi. Throughout the settlement, I think the words were \u201Ctested and strained\u201D, and those are fair words because too often these things are not brought to the surface early enough. I know with some of the hearings we had, those raruraru are aired there, but I admire the late Allan Skipwith for the mahi that he did, his firm and measured leadership in bringing this to the conclusion. I did not meet him. I wish I had because there are great words said about him. So I want to acknowledge those two gentlemen. Moe mai r\u0101 e ng\u0101 rangatira, moe mai, moe mai.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000483\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022217f4585-f6ef-408d-9318-8a6b8506920b\u0022\u003EIf I move on to the settlement itself, I know in particular for this one, since the \u201860s, they have certainly made petition, submissions, and claims to seek that redress for breaches. For this, the Crown acknowledges those well-founded breaches in its obligations, and the failure to protect those tribal structures, for example, to act in good faith in terms of leasing and purchasing land, those land blocks, and really, at the end, failing to protect Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi from becoming virtually landless. That\u2019s something that\u2019s been hurtful across many settlements but I acknowledge it here also. Also, the failure to protect the Tarawera awa and te reo and to encourage its use. There\u2019s a number of things there that culminate in the\u2014I guess it\u2019s summed up as the taking of excessive land for public works purposes. I want to acknowledge those issues there. The settlement, however, does provide for 19 sites\u2014those have been mentioned previously\u2014of deep significance to Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi, and those are part of that cultural redress. There are two properties there, and they are in the Waimangu Volcanic Valley and five properties at Matat\u0101.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000484\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022217f4585-f6ef-408d-9318-8a6b8506920b\u0022\u003EOne of the things I\u2019ve enjoyed seeing as part of this settlement, however, is the establishment of a restoration strategy group, and that\u2019s a permanent joint committee with the regional council there, the Bay of Plenty Regional Council, and there\u2019ll be some funding. There was half a million, $500,000 in terms of making sure that that will be set up and can be coordinated and do the promotion work that needs to be done and summed up by, you know, enhancing the mauri of the relationship between Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi and the Tarawera awa. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000485\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022217f4585-f6ef-408d-9318-8a6b8506920b\u0022\u003EThere are those statutory acknowledgments that come through this and some deeds of recognition over four various areas, and the amount for that commercial redress that covers those has been said is just over $11 million. There is also some shares in the Crown forest land within that central North Island, and, of course, an additional financial redress as part of the overall settlement. I do want to just take a moment to say that, however, it\u2019s never, I don\u2019t think, enough to fully compensate an iwi, in this case Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi, for their loss that they have endured; the mamae of the t\u012Bpuna, their ancestors. However, I do hope that this settlement, does forge a new relationship, a new pathway forward, between Crown, the iwi, the iwi and its wh\u0101nau, hap\u016B, to ensure that we can, or they can start once again. I know that they are ready to go. That\u2019s the great thing\u2014they have got their structures in place, their relationship is strong, and I know that, as I said in this speech, if they had the opportunity to be here we would hear the strong melody and the waiata of Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi beat with pride this afternoon. It\u2019s a pleasure to be the last and final speaker of the Ng\u0101ti Rangitihi Claims Settlement Bill for its third reading. T\u0113n\u0101 koutou, t\u0113n\u0101 koutou, t\u0113n\u0101 koutou katoa.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000486\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022217f4585-f6ef-408d-9318-8a6b8506920b\u0022\u003EMotion agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000487\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022217f4585-f6ef-408d-9318-8a6b8506920b\u0022\u003EBill read a third time.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n    \u003C/div\u003E\n    \u003Cdiv class=\u0022HpsHansard\u0022\u003E\n      \u003Cp\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsProceedingHeading\u0022\u003EBills\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000488\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u00229202d4002ef441229f7ddccfb2bda377\u0022\u003ECOVID-19 Response (Courts Safety) Legislation Bill\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000489\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u002276fdd9bf176740dab7ddcf8aab2a13e9\u0022\u003EInstruction to Justice Committee\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000490\u0022\u003EDebate resumed from 10 March.\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022a6c42c44-3622-4c9c-98b8-793fb5ec15cc\u0022 data-id=\u00225eaa671515bb423bbfb41d9934dd383c\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000491\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a6c42c44-3622-4c9c-98b8-793fb5ec15cc\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00225eaa671515bb423bbfb41d9934dd383c\u0022\u003EASSISTANT SPEAKER (Ian McKelvie)\u003C/span\u003E: When last on this debate, Toni Severin had the call and has 8 minutes 33 seconds remaining to speak, and I just remind speakers this is a very narrow topic.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00229d892f20-579d-4c43-8247-7ab72c4f7c2e\u0022 data-id=\u0022f4e49b137a744e1fb005677995386ce5\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000492\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00229d892f20-579d-4c43-8247-7ab72c4f7c2e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022f4e49b137a744e1fb005677995386ce5\u0022\u003ETONI SEVERIN (ACT):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Mr Speaker. I\u2019ve only just got a few points to finish off on the COVID-19 Response (Courts Safety) Legislation Bill\u2014the instructing the committee to put this through fast tracking.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000493\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00229d892f20-579d-4c43-8247-7ab72c4f7c2e\u0022\u003EMy biggest concern is, like a lot of businesses these days, they are suffering from a lot of people with COVID. I just feel it\u2019s very unfair that we\u2019re given a very short time frame for submitters to be able to submit on this bill, because of the numbers down with COVID. And the other thing is: how can New Zealanders keep trusting this Government if we keep fast tracking these bills and they\u2019re not getting their say? That is just not fair on our justice system as well.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000494\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00229d892f20-579d-4c43-8247-7ab72c4f7c2e\u0022\u003EThe last thing of all is: I know this is going to go through, which is very sad, but I would just like to thank the Justice Committee staff for the hard work they\u2019re going to be doing in the next week or so. Thank you to the select committee, and we oppose this bill. Thank you, Mr Speaker.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca id=\u00229609810b141a47d4b1ec06a3187a1693\u0022 name=\u0022division\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EA party vote was called for on the question, That the COVID-19 Response (Courts Safety) Legislation Bill be reported to the House by 31 March 2022 and that the committee have authority to meet at any time while the House is sitting (except during oral questions), during any evening on a day on which there has been a sitting of the House, and on a Friday in a week in which there has been a sitting of the House, despite Standing Orders 193 and 196.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EAyes 110\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand Labour 65; New Zealand National 33; Green Party of Aotearoa New Zealand 10; Te Paati M\u0101ori 2.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENoes 10\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EACT New Zealand 10.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EMotion agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000495\u0022\u003EThe result corrected after originally being announced as Ayes 108, Noes 10 to include Te Paati M\u0101ori\u2019s votes.\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022a6c42c44-3622-4c9c-98b8-793fb5ec15cc\u0022 data-id=\u0022d9412127798d4cc4975d8e3d5de24a5e\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000496\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a6c42c44-3622-4c9c-98b8-793fb5ec15cc\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022d9412127798d4cc4975d8e3d5de24a5e\u0022\u003EASSISTANT SPEAKER (Ian McKelvie)\u003C/span\u003E: I declare the House in committee for consideration of the Taxation (Annual Rates for 2021-22, GST, and Remedial Matters) Bill and the Maori Commercial Aquaculture Claims Settlement Amendment Bill.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n    \u003C/div\u003E\n    \u003Cdiv class=\u0022HpsHansard\u0022\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000497\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsProceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u0022e0ec60cbc257494e86440200ff15d79d\u0022\u003EHouse in committee\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000499\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u0022f05b8f25a0904cc6a16ef2875525f4c6\u0022\u003EHouse in committee\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022d14b1afe-2069-41e4-96fa-c8dc81a991a4\u0022 data-id=\u0022b94dbb9ed1c549bf84ab9513a67bcd6b\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000498\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022d14b1afe-2069-41e4-96fa-c8dc81a991a4\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022b94dbb9ed1c549bf84ab9513a67bcd6b\u0022\u003ECHAIRPERSON (Hon Jenny Salesa)\u003C/span\u003E: Members, the House is in committee on the Taxation (Annual Rates for 2021-22, GST, and Remedial Matters) Bill and the Maori Commercial Aquaculture Claims Settlement Amendment Bill. I\u2019ll remind members that they are able to participate remotely. If you\u2019re on the Zoom and want to take a call, please type \u201Ccall\u201D into the chat. You should also use the chat if you\u2019d like to raise a point of order. If I receive new tabled amendments, I\u2019ll advise members so that they can refresh the House papers page to see the new amendment. Finally, it would be helpful for members to ask multiple questions, if they have them, of the member in charge during their call. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n    \u003C/div\u003E\n    \u003Cdiv class=\u0022HpsHansard\u0022\u003E\n      \u003Cp\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsProceedingHeading\u0022\u003EBills\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000500\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u002237f25c8c65c3425ba378fef2c006af87\u0022\u003ETaxation (Annual Rates for 2021\u201322, GST, and Remedial Matters) Bill\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000501\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u0022ea1767d85a4d4937a24cd90a3d82c998\u0022\u003EIn Committee\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000502\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u0022075cf056f1b746669e758ddf25bc9bd8\u0022\u003EPart 1  Annual rates of income tax\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022d14b1afe-2069-41e4-96fa-c8dc81a991a4\u0022 data-id=\u002280ceaecbe3bf443c847067a8d57f148c\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000503\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022d14b1afe-2069-41e4-96fa-c8dc81a991a4\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002280ceaecbe3bf443c847067a8d57f148c\u0022\u003ECHAIRPERSON (Hon Jenny Salesa)\u003C/span\u003E: We come to the first debate, on Part 1, which is the debate on the annual rates of income tax. I\u2019m aware that members have tabled amendments proposing different tax rates. These amendments will be voted on at the end of the debate on Part 3, because they amend the Income Tax Act 2007, and Part 3 deals with amendments to that Act. However, members should discuss their proposed amendments to the tax rates as part of this first debate, because the focus of the debate is the tax rates for 2021-22. Standing Orders require that the annual tax rates have a debate of their own each year. Part 1 is the debate on clause 3, \u201CAnnual rates of income tax for 2021\u201322 tax year\u201D, and any proposed amendments to those tax rates. The question is that Part 1 stand part.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022 data-id=\u00222f4593a3ef954315ad84850ea833c4b7\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000504\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00222f4593a3ef954315ad84850ea833c4b7\u0022\u003EDAVID SEYMOUR (Leader\u2014ACT):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Madam Speaker, and thank you for that introduction to this debate. It is right and proper that New Zealand has in its Parliament each year a debate on the rates of tax\u2014how much of people\u2019s money does this Parliament allow that Government to take out of people\u2019s income? The ACT Party\u2014the Association of Consumers and Taxpayers in its full name\u2014says that that the Government is taking too much tax out of hard-working families\u2019 incomes and, in particular, it is taking highly progressive taxation that means that some people pay too much tax and many pay none at all, or very little.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000505\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003EEven putting that aside, the overall amount of tax has increased dramatically under this Government. How much? Well, if we take the amount of tax that the Government was collecting at the start of its term in October 2017, and we ask ourselves how much more tax it\u2019s taking for every person\u2014and there are no tricks here. We\u2019re adjusting for the growth in population. There are more people now, and that\u2019s good. We\u2019re adjusting for inflation\u2014that\u2019s been rapid. The price of everything is going up\u2014we know that. But if we adjust for population growth and if we adjust for inflation, then this Government is taxing $2,138 more off every man, woman, and child, every human, in this country\u2014even babies just being born. On their behalf\u2014the average New Zealander\u2014this Government is taxing more than ever before, and $2,138 more for every person than it did when it took office in October 2017.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000506\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003EThe other problem is: who it\u2019s being taken off. I want to put a thought in the minds of people at home: how much of the income tax should be paid by the 12 percent who pay the most income tax? Should it be 12 percent? Should they pay as much as they earn, in proportion? Should they pay 24 percent? Should they pay twice as much tax as the number of people? Should it be 36 percent? How many people at home think, \u201CLet\u2019s soak the rich people. They can pay three times more tax than the number of people.\u201D? How many think they should pay three times as much? Well, now, many people would be surprised to know that the top 12 percent of income tax payers in this country, according to the Inland Revenue Department, are paying 48 percent of all the income tax\u201412 percent of the taxpayers are paying half of all the income tax. So if people think that there is some sort of system where the rich get richer and aren\u2019t paying their share and get away, well, that just is not supported by the facts. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000507\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003EAnd you go to the other side\u2014and I think every party in this Parliament, including ACT, wants to help people who maybe have had a tough time or are at a stage of their life when they need more help. Maybe they\u2019re very young or they\u2019re older, and they don\u2019t pay as much tax, and they get more. But let me ask you this question: how much tax do the 48 percent who pay the least\u2014how much of the income tax do they pay? Well, do 48 percent of people pay 38 percent of the tax? Do they pay 24 percent of the tax? No; 48 percent of taxpayers are paying only 8 percent of total tax. That is the system we have today.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000508\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003ESo there\u2019s two things here so far. Number one: the amount of tax that this Government is taking across all the different taxes has gone up $2,138 under this Government. Adjusted for population, adjusted for inflation, they\u2019re taking more money than ever and it\u2019s very unclear what results they\u2019re getting for it. The second thing is that when we look at who\u2019s paying the tax, we have a very small group of people, 12 percent, paying half of all the income tax, and we\u2019ve got a very large group of people, half of all the taxpayers, paying only 8 percent. What that looks like is a small group of people being picked on by a large group of people, and that is what brings division.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000509\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003ENow, I would like to talk to a Supplementary Order Paper (SOP) that I\u2019ve put on the Table, that I think would go some way to improving the situation. Supplementary Order Paper 140 would go a long way to making our tax system fairer and flatter and giving people back the opportunity to earn money and keep more of it. And that\u2019s what I\u2019m urging my colleagues on the National Party side to support. This is where you get down to the nitty-gritty of tax policy. You see, my good friend from down in South Auckland Andrew Bayly has an amendment that would adjust the tax thresholds. But do you know what that really means? I like the fact that it gives some money back, but here\u2019s the problem with it: if he adjusts the tax thresholds for inflation the way he\u2019s proposing, what he is doing is he\u2019s making sure that more of the tax burden falls on higher incomes and less of it falls on lower incomes. What he\u2019s really saying is that he wants to perpetuate the idea that half the people pay 8 percent of the income tax, and 12 percent of the people pay half the income tax. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000510\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003EThe ACT Party says that if we want a culture of aspiration and a united country, then we cannot have a tax system that is filled with tall poppy syndrome, where the majority of people vote at the ballot box to take money off the minority, where they\u2019re less concerned about the quality of Government spending\u2014because, hey, it\u2019s only this little group that we\u2019re taking all the money off. And we have, fundamentally, division and exploitation, and tall poppy syndrome in our tax code. That\u2019s why ACT can\u2019t support Andrew Bayly\u2019s amendment to adjust those thresholds. It\u2019s one way of giving money back to people\u2014or letting them keep it, to put it more accurately\u2014but it is not the best way, because it perpetuates that tall poppy syndrome in the tax code. What the ACT Party is proposing\u2014and we hope that our colleagues around the House will join us\u2014is a fairer, flatter, more consistent tax policy that will allow people to keep, on the average wage, around about $2,000 more of their own money.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000511\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003EHow does that work? Well, we\u2019re going to get rid of the 39c envy tax that this Government has put in place. Why? Are they going to get more money? No, they\u2019re not. They\u2019ll be lucky if they get a few hundred million dollars more when this Government has already started spending tens of billions more than when it came into office. So the amount of tax it gets by putting on this 39c rate is immaterial. It makes no difference in the context of this Government\u2019s taxing and spending. But what it does do is it just sends a little message. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000512\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003EIt sends a little message to every child in this country: \u201CIf you work hard, listen to your teacher, get good grades, turn those into skills that turn into qualifications, that turn into jobs and careers, and put a little money away and invest it carefully, you know, if you do all that and it works out for you, guess what! We\u2019re going to take it. Not because it makes a big difference to how much money the Government has to spend; just because we can, because there\u2019s not many of you and there\u2019s lots of us, and, in democracy, you\u2019re outvoted and we\u2019re going to take your money.\u201D And that is wrong. It is morally wrong to pick on small groups of people and take their stuff just because you can. Just because a Minister has a chip on his shoulder for whatever reason, it is wrong to go and take people\u2019s money just because it\u2019s possible to do it. So we\u2019ll get rid of that 39c rate. It needs to go for the culture of aspiration and unity in this society and in this country.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000513\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003EThen, the Government says, \u201CWhat\u2019ll we do with the middle income tax rate, the rate that you pay between $48,000 and $70,000?\u201D Well, you know, if someone on the minimum wage put in a few extra hours, half an extra shift, 44 hours a week, they can find themselves paying the 30c tax rate on their next dollar. We think that 30c in the dollar on an average wage is too high. So the next thing that these amendments on SOP 140 do is they drop that 30c tax rate down to 17.5. So from $14,000, the 17\u00BD kicks in. You pay that all the way to 70, then you pay 33c after that\u2014there\u2019s no 39 rate.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000514\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003EIt\u2019s good we have a debate about taxation in our Parliament, because there\u2019s no proper taxation without representation, and the ACT Party speaks for those who are tired of having their money taken away just because this Government thinks it can. We stand for fairer, flatter tax rates where we don\u2019t have one group of people picking on another and taking their money because they can. We stand for giving genuine relief, around $2,000 to the average earner back on their tax bill, with a generous middle-income tax reduction, and if people think that that sounds like a good future for our country, they should vote for ACT\u2019s amendments.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022859e13f9-33bb-41bb-b2f0-d848eaf25407\u0022 data-id=\u0022e6f689f433d34415aa2815e10fd90590\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000515\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022859e13f9-33bb-41bb-b2f0-d848eaf25407\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022e6f689f433d34415aa2815e10fd90590\u0022\u003EANDREW BAYLY (National\u2014Port Waikato):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Mr Chair. I\u2019d just acknowledge my colleague David Seymour there for his passionate speech about tax. He is quite right: tax is the issue we should be talking about today. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000516\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022859e13f9-33bb-41bb-b2f0-d848eaf25407\u0022\u003EI would just preface my comments with what we heard at question time, when the Prime Minister was asked about the issue of cost of living increases. Of course, we do have a cost of living crisis. Her response was that we should be increasing benefits. She was very proud about what\u2019s been done with benefits. Of course, it\u2019s all about the Government taking money from taxpayers\u2014from hard-working New Zealanders\u2014and reinjecting it, putting it through the big mincing machine called the Government, and then repaying it out to people that they decide are the most worthy of that benefit.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000517\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022859e13f9-33bb-41bb-b2f0-d848eaf25407\u0022\u003EBut, of course, as Mr Seymour has quite rightly pointed out, taxes come from hard-working New Zealanders, and that is the central issue. That\u2019s why we will be opposing this bill: because we\u2019re fundamentally opposed to a Government that thinks that it has a right to continue to increase taxes\u2014which this Government has, and I\u2019ll talk about that shortly\u2014and then to pay it out the way it should do. The principle we should be trying to do to drive New Zealand forward is to increase real wages\u2014not by artificial means of paying benefits to support people or to reduce bus fares or whatever but by actually creating wealth through better jobs, better economic outcomes, and, as a result, real increases in wages. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000518\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022859e13f9-33bb-41bb-b2f0-d848eaf25407\u0022\u003EAs Mr Seymour alluded to, the Government is raking in tax at the moment. This year, we\u2019re, basically, talking about $100 billion. Over the next four years, it will take in roughly about another $24 billion of additional tax. Just to be clear: what I mean by that is that by 2026, it will be not taking in $100 billion but, in that single year, will be taking tax of about $124 billion. Of course, that is a massive increment of tax\u2014because you\u2019ve got increases next year and the year after, ultimately to get to that figure. The only reason I quote four-year figures is that is what the Government\u2019s projections are always about: four-year cycles. We have got a Government that is just continuing to rake in huge amount of tax, and that is principally because of inflation. There have been a whole stack of other taxes that have been imposed, but I\u2019m principally talking about personal tax. The other taxes, as we all know, that the Government has put in place\u2014there\u2019s a whole stack of them; we\u2019ve been talking about the fuel tax today\u2014are just driving up the cost of living for people. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000519\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022859e13f9-33bb-41bb-b2f0-d848eaf25407\u0022\u003EHere is a Government that is very happy to spend money. We\u2019ve got the $15 billion light rail project. We\u2019ve got the $500 million that\u2019s going to be spent on the health reforms, and that\u2019s only a part down payment. We\u2019ve got the $1 billion that\u2019s going to be set aside for the three waters change. Of course, that is about taxing people to fund that. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000520\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022859e13f9-33bb-41bb-b2f0-d848eaf25407\u0022\u003EThat is why we oppose the tax rates that have been put forward in this bill: because, fundamentally, we don\u2019t believe that they are justified. That is why we have put up an amendment in my name which is about reducing tax rates. Of course, this was announced by our leader, Christopher Luxon, not long ago, and is actually a core part of what the Hon Simon Bridges has been talking about for a long time, which is adjusting tax rates to take into account inflation.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000521\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022859e13f9-33bb-41bb-b2f0-d848eaf25407\u0022\u003EIf we look back, for instance, and say \u201CWhat has been the net inflation over the last four years, under the Labour Government?\u201D, it\u2019s been about 12 percent\u2014just slightly under. So what we\u2019ve proposed\u2014and this is what the amendment deals with specifically\u2014is that we should go back and adjust the threshold at which point people enter into the higher tax bracket. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000522\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022859e13f9-33bb-41bb-b2f0-d848eaf25407\u0022\u003EFor instance, at the moment New Zealanders pay tax at 10.5 percent on the first $14,000 of income. Under the proposal that we\u2019re talking about, we would increase that to $15,600 because that is the inflation, taking into account the 11.5 percent that I talked about over the past four years. Conversely\u2014just working through the next arrangement\u2014at the 17.5 percent tax rate, we\u2019re suggesting that that cut in at $15,600 and would increase to $53,500. At present, that rate stops at $48,000. There is a $5,500 increase in the threshold. Of course, that would mean, for people earning an average wage, they would still be paying tax at 17.5 percent rather than, as currently, flipping into the next tax rate of 30 percent. The next rate would be increasing from $53,500 to $78,000 for the rate of 30 percent. The 30 percent at the moment goes up to a maximum of $70,000; we\u2019re increasing that to $78,000. The final adjustment is that all tax from $78,000 onwards would be paid at the 33 percent tax rate. Of course, what all this does, and what the proposals are around this, is put more money back into Kiwi pockets.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000523\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022859e13f9-33bb-41bb-b2f0-d848eaf25407\u0022\u003EI know that the Government, particularly the Hon Grant Robertson\u2014and it would be interesting to see what the Hon David Parker says\u2014characterise this as a tax cut. They\u2019re not tax cuts, actually. What they are is stopping the Government and reversing the Government\u2019s tax take that has been imposed on New Zealanders over the past four years. It\u2019s reversing that and giving it back to New Zealanders. It\u2019s like saying, \u201CLet\u2019s go back to the status quo, before the Labour Government came into office four years ago.\u201D That is hardly a tax cut. What it is is saying, \u201CNew Zealanders, you should keep what you should have been entitled to back in 2017, and we\u2019re going to reverse it back there.\u201D \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000524\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022859e13f9-33bb-41bb-b2f0-d848eaf25407\u0022\u003EWhat it means, ultimately, is that New Zealanders will have more cash in their pockets and more money to spend on vital things for their families. Of course, this is at a time when we\u2019ve got these massive cost of living increases. We\u2019ve been talking about fuel, about housing costs\u2014rent\u2019s up by $150 a week since the Labour Government\u2019s come into play\u2014and about all those increases around fruit and vegetables. That is making it so much harder for New Zealanders and New Zealand families to just be able to pay for the necessities of life. For the lower-income people, they are the ones who have little discretionary income, and this is about helping people on those lower incomes. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000525\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022859e13f9-33bb-41bb-b2f0-d848eaf25407\u0022\u003ETo put it in context, for an average wage, they would be getting about $870 extra per annum, and for someone earning over $78,000\u2014which the Government loves to focus on\u2014they\u2019d be roughly about the same: about $1,000 extra. What these broad changes will mean is that every year people are about $800 better off. For superannuitants\u2014which is a very important component\u2014they\u2019d be about $540 better off as a couple. Giving money back to them that the Government has otherwise taken off them over the past four years will allow them to meet their commitments and to look after their lives and to actually try and deal with this massive cost of living explosion that we\u2019ve had. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000526\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022859e13f9-33bb-41bb-b2f0-d848eaf25407\u0022\u003ENow, these tax cuts will cost about $1.7 billion, and I think what this will mean is that we move back to a situation where we stop taxing and taxing people and the Government taking that, putting it through all the administration that the Government has, and spending it on a lot of bureaucratic processes to get to a point where the Government then pays it back to New Zealanders. That is just a way to circumvent that, so that people keep the money at the time that they earn it and so that they can prioritise how they want to use it. It is about allowing New Zealanders to get on with their lives with less input and influence from the Government.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000527\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022859e13f9-33bb-41bb-b2f0-d848eaf25407\u0022\u003EThis is what my amendment is about, and I think\u2014if I may say so\u2014this is something that we\u2019ve been talking about for some period of time as the National Party. It is an excellent idea. It has got good outcomes for all New Zealanders. It\u2019s fair and equitable. There are further amendments that I\u2019m going to talk to on this matter, but I know my time is drawing to a close. I think this is an excellent start in terms of the tax debate. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022f5d71749-ae91-4af7-b2bd-77260398912a\u0022 data-id=\u0022a666c9e15a594c4d8255fda9fd201227\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000528\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f5d71749-ae91-4af7-b2bd-77260398912a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022a666c9e15a594c4d8255fda9fd201227\u0022\u003EHon DAVID PARKER (Minister of Revenue):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Mr Chairman, for the opportunity to take the first call from the chair.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000529\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f5d71749-ae91-4af7-b2bd-77260398912a\u0022\u003ENow, listening to the last two contributions, you\u2019d think that New Zealand\u2019s an overtaxed country, that we\u2019ve somehow got swingeing rates of taxation, and that the overall wedge of taxation, as a percentage of the economy, is high by the standards of countries with which we compare ourselves. There are 38 countries in the OECD. New Zealand, in 2020, was 24th of those 38 countries in the OECD for taxation as a percentage of GDP. Not 24th highest, but\u2014yes, 24th highest. Of the 38 countries, we\u2019re the 14th or 15th lowest as a percentage of GDP that goes to taxation\u201424th. I suspect, when those statistics come out in the next few years, looking at other countries, we\u2019ll look even better compared with other countries, because, of course, since COVID hit, New Zealand\u2019s actually, overall, had GDP growth compared with the European countries, United States, and the likes.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000530\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f5d71749-ae91-4af7-b2bd-77260398912a\u0022\u003EWhere do we sit on that table? Our tax as a percentage of GDP in New Zealand is lower than the UK and slightly higher than Japan, not too different from Japan. The countries that have higher percentages of GDP collected in taxation include countries that we traditionally compare ourselves with, like Canada, most of the European countries that we compare ourselves with, and certainly the Scandinavian countries. All liberal democracies have taxation needed to fund the services that people desire from their Government and vote for them to fund. Health, education, and superannuation are the largest cost centres, justice is obviously also important.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000531\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f5d71749-ae91-4af7-b2bd-77260398912a\u0022\u003EIn respect of the statistic that we heard from David Seymour, about 12 percent of taxpayers paying 48 percent of the income tax, it brings to mind that saying, \u201CLies, lies, damned lies, and statistics.\u201D, because that\u2019s true as a statistic but it\u2019s really a misrepresentation of the underlying facts. So 12 percent pay 48 percent of the income tax, and I haven\u2019t checked his number, but I\u2019m accepting that that\u2019s true. But, of course, in his population, he forgets to say, \u201CWell, that includes children, that includes people who are out of the workforce raising children, that includes superannuitants.\u201D He also conveniently overlooks the fact that GST, as a proportion of income\u2014which is a regressive tax\u2014is a higher proportion of income for lower-income earners than it is for higher-income earners, because lower-income earners consume all of their earnings, whereas higher-income people save some of theirs and don\u2019t spend as much as a proportion of their income on GST-inclusive services. So, again, his statistics exclude the fact that GST is a higher share of the income of a lower-income person than it is of a higher-income person.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000532\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f5d71749-ae91-4af7-b2bd-77260398912a\u0022\u003EFinal point I\u2019ll make on that is that, if we compare ourselves with the Australians across the Ditch, their top marginal tax rate is higher than the 39c rate in New Zealand, it\u2019s 45c in the dollar. So we compare pretty well on that one as well.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000533\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f5d71749-ae91-4af7-b2bd-77260398912a\u0022\u003EIn respect of the amendments that are proposed by the ACT Party and the National Party to get rid of the top tax rate of 39c over $180,000, and the other rate adjustments, we will be opposing those. And we do make the point that it really does show where both the National Party and the ACT Party sit, that they would give thousands of dollars of tax cuts to the highest income and $2 a week to someone on $45,000 per annum. So, for those reasons, the Labour Party will be opposing those amendments.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022a6c42c44-3622-4c9c-98b8-793fb5ec15cc\u0022 data-id=\u0022241d7fd1de2740788d888df63db2020b\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000534\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a6c42c44-3622-4c9c-98b8-793fb5ec15cc\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022241d7fd1de2740788d888df63db2020b\u0022\u003ECHAIRPERSON (Ian McKelvie)\u003C/span\u003E: Members, the time has come for me to leave the chair. The House will resume after the dinner break at 7 p.m.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000535\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a6c42c44-3622-4c9c-98b8-793fb5ec15cc\u0022\u003ESitting suspended from 6 p.m. to 7 p.m.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022859e13f9-33bb-41bb-b2f0-d848eaf25407\u0022 data-id=\u0022d06f48c4dba848e6a79228661cce1b51\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000536\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022859e13f9-33bb-41bb-b2f0-d848eaf25407\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022d06f48c4dba848e6a79228661cce1b51\u0022\u003EANDREW BAYLY (National\u2014Port Waikato):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Mr Chair. I thought my colleague Mr Watts was going to get the call, but anyway. Hey, I just want to respond to Minister Parker, and I thank the Minister for standing up just before we had our dinner break. I suppose the first question is, we were talking about the tax take and how this year the Government\u2019s going to rake in\u2014oh, I should acknowledge the members on the other side of the Chamber, as well. I\u2019ve got the Hon Kris Faafoi here. I hope he\u2019s going to make a strong contribution to this tax debate. The Hon Willie Jackson\u2014he\u2019s here. I\u2019m sure we\u2019re going to have an enlivened tax debate, because these guys are expert at these matters, and I\u2019m looking forward to\u2014Ginny Anderson, of course. So, hopefully, we will have a good conversation tonight.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000537\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022859e13f9-33bb-41bb-b2f0-d848eaf25407\u0022\u003EAnyway, the Minister\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000538\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002290ea1538-43e8-4257-bd80-df3ccd1e5f27\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00222b667b5df69a442b923fa017d2931ea3\u0022\u003EHon Kris Faafoi\u003C/span\u003E: While you talk, someone\u2019s doing the numbers.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000539\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022859e13f9-33bb-41bb-b2f0-d848eaf25407\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00224f6997f1ea29476baebe5a1c0ff3c160\u0022\u003EANDREW BAYLY\u003C/span\u003E: Yeah, we\u2019re doing our numbers. The thing about tax, Mr Faafoi, is that, this year, the Government\u2019s going to take in $100 billion of tax. In four years\u2019 time, it will take in about $124 billion of tax: an extra $24 billion in one year. And, of course, under current scenarios, that is going to increase. The Hon David Parker spoke about the Government, saying we\u2019ve got a reasonable tax base, and therefore\u2014I think his argument was\u2014\u201CHey, that\u2019s fine, because we seem like we\u2019re OK compared to most other people.\u201D \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000540\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022859e13f9-33bb-41bb-b2f0-d848eaf25407\u0022\u003EI suppose the first question is: at what point do you think the Government should tax its population? At what point is it reasonable to say, \u201CGee, that\u2019s enough. We shouldn\u2019t take the money off hard-working New Zealanders, because it\u2019s better that they keep it.\u201D? That is the issue. I think, from the comments the Minister said before, my inference was, \u201CLook, we\u2019re OK\u2014we\u2019re reasonably OK compared with the rest of the world, and therefore we can continue to tax a whole lot of New Zealanders a whole lot more tax.\u201D And, of course, we\u2019ve seen all of the new tax that the Government\u2019s trying to do. Obviously, we\u2019re talking about them tonight: the imposition of the new 39 percent tax rate. We\u2019ve seen the brightline tax rate. We\u2019ve seen the loss of interest deductibility. We\u2019ve seen a fuel tax. All these new taxes of the Government have come into play. I would say to Mr Parker, I think it\u2019s really important that the Government is\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000541\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f5d71749-ae91-4af7-b2bd-77260398912a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00224b907e587a4a408fa4add30d71406c13\u0022\u003EHon David Parker\u003C/span\u003E: The fuel tax just came off.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000542\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022859e13f9-33bb-41bb-b2f0-d848eaf25407\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002203bf299cfe6c4025b88ee8bf07187904\u0022\u003EANDREW BAYLY\u003C/span\u003E: Sorry, the Minister\u2019s saying the fuel tax has come off. Yeah, that\u2019s right: it\u2019s come off. That\u2019s because there was a poll last week. That\u2019s the only reason that tax has come off. The Labour Party are reacting to what Kiwis are finally saying to them, which is, \u201CWe\u2019ve got a cost of living crisis.\u201D That\u2019s why we need to remove the fuel tax, Mr Parker\u2014and I note it\u2019s only for three months. And, of course, what I\u2019ve heard a number of people say to me today: \u201CWhat about my diesel tax?\u201D Haven\u2019t seen any changes to the diesel tax. I understand there\u2019s regulations that have to be followed\u201445 days\u2019 notice\u2014before anyone who drives a diesel car\u2019s going to get any relief. Wow, that\u2019s a fast-moving Government! So, yes, the fuel tax is coming off, but only for a matter of three months. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000543\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022859e13f9-33bb-41bb-b2f0-d848eaf25407\u0022\u003EThis huge increase in tax raises a much more significant issue, and I think you need to see it in the context that, over the last 22 months, Mr Grant Robertson has doubled the debt in New Zealand to $60 billion to over $120 billion. That has got to be some record over 22 months\u2014less than two years\u2014and that is why the Government is keen to keep taxing people. That\u2019s why it\u2019s keen to take another $24 billion of additional tax in four years\u2019 time. That\u2019s why Mr Robertson keeps going on a spend-up. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000544\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022859e13f9-33bb-41bb-b2f0-d848eaf25407\u0022\u003EI think we heard from Mr David Seymour before, talking about trying to keep tax to a minimum. We all understand the requirement to make sure we\u2019ve got good health services, good education, all that sort of stuff. What we don\u2019t want to hear from the Government is the wasteful spending that\u2019s been going on\u2014the huge amount of wasteful spending and, of course, the $6 billion that Mr Robertson\u2019s set aside in his Budget, over atop of all the other allowances. So we need to make sure that we\u2019ve got reasonable tax. This is why we need to change the tax rates, because Mr Seymour is correct: the top 12 percent of tax earners pay, roughly, about 48 percent of all tax. And, of course, if you have a family, Working for Families, many people who are on the lower income rates don\u2019t pay any tax at all, after you net off the benefits. That\u2019s why we need to\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000545\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f5d71749-ae91-4af7-b2bd-77260398912a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022519b53812c0142f0ae66a9e0b61a0884\u0022\u003EHon David Parker\u003C/span\u003E: That\u2019s not correct. What about GST?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000546\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022859e13f9-33bb-41bb-b2f0-d848eaf25407\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022e6d7f029e719420c95b58a9f69c98ccb\u0022\u003EANDREW BAYLY\u003C/span\u003E: They pay tax in stores, but after you deduct benefits\u2014[Time expired]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022a5f0fe84-01e8-4eb3-a590-0025017c4243\u0022 data-id=\u0022743869b9597241c8b5aca6562b44fe11\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000547\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a5f0fe84-01e8-4eb3-a590-0025017c4243\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022743869b9597241c8b5aca6562b44fe11\u0022\u003EHon MARAMA DAVIDSON (Co-Leader\u2014Green) (remote):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you\u2014this is my first remote call and I am hoping that I am now unmuted, because I might have stuffed that up. Thank you everyone for letting me know.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000548\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a5f0fe84-01e8-4eb3-a590-0025017c4243\u0022\u003EThank you, Mr Chair. So this is the Taxation (Annual Rates for 2021-22, GST, and Remedial Matters) Bill and, as has been traversed, we, the Green Party, are going to abstain on this legislation. It was a massive missed opportunity for far more progressive change that really could have seen a tax system that finally\u2014finally\u2014starts to acknowledge that for far too long, the way that we redistribute and hold wealth has been completely unfair, unsustainable, continues to benefit the wealthy few, and pays little attention to those who are struggling the very most.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000549\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a5f0fe84-01e8-4eb3-a590-0025017c4243\u0022\u003ESo, in my contribution at this stage, I wanted to again remind us\u2014and I\u2019ll be going to some of the Supplementary Order Papers (SOPs) as well\u2014that we\u2019ve recently seen the wealthiest in this country gain nearly $1 trillion in wealth, not through hard work, as far too many of the members in this House like to pretend, but simply through benefiting from the system that is rigged, simply through having capital and wealth already, and that is all.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000550\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a5f0fe84-01e8-4eb3-a590-0025017c4243\u0022\u003EThe current policy settings continue to treat housing as a tradable commodity, as opposed to what we should be doing, which is, first and foremost, housing are homes for people to live in, are public good for the wellbeing of all and our community. We have missed the opportunity to make some real difference in this legislation. That is why we will be abstaining. We have continued to give high trust and support to businesses through this legislation but not to people who receive a benefit, people who are on the lower incomes. We, right now especially, need bold policy that properly redistributes that wealth, and this bill does not get us there. It instead tinkers with the brightline test, when we could instead just introduce capital gains and wealth taxes. It tweaks tax deductibility rules which mean even less opportunity to treat housing the way that we should be, and instead upholds treating housing like a pyramid scheme; it does not de-commodify the way that we look at housing and treat housing right now, including in our tax system.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000551\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a5f0fe84-01e8-4eb3-a590-0025017c4243\u0022\u003ESo, in that\u2014I\u2019m keeping an eye on time, with the SOPs that both the National Party and the ACT Party are putting up, those SOPs from the National Party undo even the small attempts at trying to tilt the scales back to any sort of justice balance, and even the small attempts the National Party wants to undo. The ACT Party, as always, doesn\u2019t even pretend to care about anyone on the lower incomes and continues to uphold a much-debunked trickle-down theory about tax cuts. So their SOPs are, in fact, not for anyone earning under $48,000 per year. So, Mr Chair, thank you for the time. We will be abstaining, and we will absolutely be opposing the National and ACT SOPs.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022713ccc5b-7ff0-4fa5-ab58-4780620184fe\u0022 data-id=\u002221e333406c5c419788dcb5fdb30525bd\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000552\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022713ccc5b-7ff0-4fa5-ab58-4780620184fe\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002221e333406c5c419788dcb5fdb30525bd\u0022\u003ESIMON WATTS (National\u2014North Shore):\u003C/span\u003E Mr Chair, thank you very much for the opportunity to talk at this committee stage of the Taxation (Annual Rates for 2021-22, GST, and Remedial Matters) Bill. I was actually hoping\u2014listening to that last contribution, it sounded like a party that were opposing this legislation, but, no, they\u2019re going to be abstaining. So what that says is a vote for the Greens is a vote to sit on the fence, and that is completely opposite. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000553\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022713ccc5b-7ff0-4fa5-ab58-4780620184fe\u0022\u003EBut I want to talk about Part 1, \u201CAnnual rates of income tax\u201D, because that\u2019s what we\u2019re here to talk about. I think, listening to the Minister\u2019s contribution just before, the Hon David Parker, he gave us a bit of a lecture in terms of how lucky\u2014how lucky\u2014Kiwis are to live in a country that were 24th on the list in terms of taxation, like some sort of\u2014you know, the people sitting at home are going, \u201CJeez, I\u2019m lucky to be getting more tax out of my hard-earned income that I do and contribute to this country every day.\u201D And that\u2019s sort of what we heard from that. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000554\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022713ccc5b-7ff0-4fa5-ab58-4780620184fe\u0022\u003EWhat wasn\u2019t recognised is that what we\u2019ve seen, and what we\u2019re seeing as part of this bill, is an increase in taxation on hard-working Kiwis and the opportunity, really, in terms of what\u2019s available for this Government in terms of the huge amount of tax take that they are going to be taking in the next three to five years. There\u2019s actually the ability to spread that benefit back to Kiwis and, I guess, that the ideological difference between National and Labour primarily is that National trusts individuals to spend their own money better than this Government. And that is key and a fundamental ideological difference. That\u2019s why National opposes this bill, particularly because all it does is it increases the amount of taxes. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000555\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022713ccc5b-7ff0-4fa5-ab58-4780620184fe\u0022\u003EYeah, don\u2019t get me wrong. There\u2019s some remedial actions around GST, etc., that, you know, is part impartial and partly is sensible. But the key elements of this, the three elements that make up this bill, are really around increasing taxes. And you can\u2019t take your way out of a deficit, right? You can\u2019t take your way out of a hole, and you can\u2019t expect that this is going to create more economic value and more economic benefit for this country. Actually, our view is it\u2019s going to do the complete opposite. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000556\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022713ccc5b-7ff0-4fa5-ab58-4780620184fe\u0022\u003ESo, look, the annual rate element, I guess we\u2019ve talked and we will talk a lot more about some of our changes that we want to see made in this bill. But the 39c tax rate is one element that\u2019s going to be coming in, in terms of Part 1; we are obviously strongly opposed to this. We see that that is not going to create the benefit that this country needs. Actually, you know, as a result, I think what we\u2019re really going to see is just a burgeoning of the benefits for tax accountants out there, and other compliance matters\u2014of people just getting their way out of it. And, you know, that\u2019s just a complete waste of time. There\u2019s been a lot of commentary from members, including those that presented at the select committee, that the payback on that isn\u2019t going to be there. And, you know, that\u2019s a great shame. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000557\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022713ccc5b-7ff0-4fa5-ab58-4780620184fe\u0022\u003EBut, I guess, in terms of tax rates, National has proposed a number of pragmatic solutions in terms of what we would do differently around the way in which people are taxed, and, right at its heart, we believe that the rate at which people are taxed should take into account the impact of inflation, and haven\u2019t we seen the impact of inflation, and Kiwi households have seen the impact of inflation, in the past year. And I think what this shows is a Government and a Minister that are out of touch with hard-working Kiwis out there in New Zealand at the moment. They\u2019re seeing a Government that\u2019s simply saying, \u201CLook, the only solution that we see for you is to increase taxes.\u201D and what people out there, I think, in hard-working Kiwiland are saying is this, \u201CLook, we\u2019re doing it tough. Times are tough. Costs are going up across the board.\u201D And, you know, at the end of the day, what they are looking for is a little bit of relief to allow them to do what Kiwis want to do and that\u2019s, you know, live aspirational lives in this country. And I think this bill, and particularly Part 1, \u201CAnnual rates of income tax\u201D, is going against it. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000558\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022713ccc5b-7ff0-4fa5-ab58-4780620184fe\u0022\u003ESo, look, overall, National will be opposing this bill. We don\u2019t believe that, as I said, it\u2019s going to make any significant difference; actually, quite the contrary, and we will look to hear a little bit more about that soon.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002266f06e7e-afa8-457f-a105-048b86a13282\u0022 data-id=\u00227171530c9b9f4487b0a78b72e5d3abe1\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000559\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002266f06e7e-afa8-457f-a105-048b86a13282\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00227171530c9b9f4487b0a78b72e5d3abe1\u0022\u003EBROOKE VAN VELDEN (Deputy Leader\u2014ACT):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Mr Chair. It\u2019s my pleasure to rise to take a call in the committee of the whole House on the Taxation (Annual Rates for 2021-22, GST, and Remedial Matters) Bill. I wanted to talk about the tax take and, in particular, what it means for the country that we want to live in. I\u2014and, I know, the rest of my ACT Party colleagues\u2014want to live in a country where people don\u2019t feel bad for wanting to work hard, where people get rewarded for their efforts and they know that the money that they\u2019re putting aside and setting aside and saving responsibly is actually going to go some way to helping them feed their family and set up some financial security for the future.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000560\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002266f06e7e-afa8-457f-a105-048b86a13282\u0022\u003EIt\u2019s really unfortunate that over this term of Government, and since the Government was elected, New Zealanders are now paying around $2,000 extra or more than they were four years ago. It\u2019s a frustration that I\u2019m hearing up and down the country. It feels as though people are working harder and feeling even more tired, especially through this COVID pandemic, and yet it feels harder and harder to actually get ahead, and more of the money that people are earning is going to the Government and not to their own pockets\u2014not to their children to help pay for their uniforms and pay for food on the table, but going into the Government to be spent on stupid projects and getting wasted. We know that there has been a huge amount of Government wasteful spending, and that\u2019s a real tragedy when, you know, New Zealanders should actually have a little bit more of the money that they earn for themselves and their families going back to them, so that they can actually provide for themselves.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000561\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002266f06e7e-afa8-457f-a105-048b86a13282\u0022\u003EWe are living in a cost of living crisis. You know, you only have to go to the supermarket to see the cost of fresh fruit and vegetable going through the roof. And if you\u2019re like me and you\u2019re just buying for one person, it seems remarkable that you can just take one bag to the supermarket and, before you know it, you\u2019ve spent 150 bucks just walking out with one bag. I hate to think how that feels when you\u2019ve got children that you\u2019re providing for too, and you\u2019ve, you know, got a growing kid and they\u2019re wanting to go through half a box of Weet-Bix in the morning. It\u2019s just incredible how much money people are needing to spend every week at the supermarket, and that\u2019s on top of the cost of petrol going up. You know, there are so many outgoings that people need to set aside their own money for and, since this Government was elected, $2,000 extra per year is going to the Government. What are they actually getting back? There hasn\u2019t been any significant improvement from what we\u2019re actually seeing being spent by this Government that would actually contribute to it being worthwhile.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000562\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002266f06e7e-afa8-457f-a105-048b86a13282\u0022\u003EI\u2019m constantly hearing from people who feel like they have a good income, but the pull to go overseas is getting stronger and stronger, and a lot of people talk about wanting to go to Australia because they know that their wages will be higher over there, and that\u2019s a real shame because it\u2019s about the type of country that we want to live in, and we should be rewarding people with aspiration for their hard work, the dedication for wanting to get up in the morning, earn a living for themselves and their families. Instead, the type of situation that we\u2019re in in New Zealand is more and more people are saying, \u201CYou know, I actually think another country would reward me for my efforts and would be more welcoming for that type of person.\u201D\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000563\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002266f06e7e-afa8-457f-a105-048b86a13282\u0022\u003EWe want to make sure that we\u2019re keeping people who want to work hard, and so Supplementary Order Paper 140 that\u2019s been put forward in David Seymour\u2019s name would go some way to helping make sure that that would be a reality. And that would be by reducing the income tax bracket down from the $48,000 to $70,000 bracket to 17.5 percent. So that would mean that any bit of money between $14,001 to $70,000 would be taxed at a rate of 17.5 percent, and that would mean that the average person would get another $40 in their pocket per week to help pay for their groceries, to help pay for their kids\u2019 extracurriculars\u2014making it that much easier, when they say that they want to join a rugby team this year and they actually need some new boots, to say, \u201CYep, you know what? We can actually, as a family, afford that.\u201D And it\u2019s a real shame that people are actually having to struggle to make those changes to their own lives.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000564\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002266f06e7e-afa8-457f-a105-048b86a13282\u0022\u003EThis Government\u2019s borrowing, spending, taxing, and regulating has added to the cost of everything. There\u2019s so much wasteful spending. We need to give New Zealanders a break, give them more of the money that they earn for themselves, and the ACT Party has a solution that would actually help the middle-class battlers who are being squeezed in every direction. Thank you, Mr Chair.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022f5d71749-ae91-4af7-b2bd-77260398912a\u0022 data-id=\u0022a722b0a1b83e4095a1abf8be8c4ed299\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000565\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f5d71749-ae91-4af7-b2bd-77260398912a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022a722b0a1b83e4095a1abf8be8c4ed299\u0022\u003EHon DAVID PARKER (Minister of Revenue):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Mr Chairman. These people that the last speaker for the ACT Party, Brooke van Velden, said would move overseas because of tax rates\u2014well they\u2019re not going to move to the United Kingdom, because that would be to a country that has taxation that\u2019s a higher proportion of the economy, nor France, nor Italy, nor Canada. Maybe they\u2019d go to the United States, but, of course, there they\u2019d face state taxes as well as central government taxes, and, of course, they wouldn\u2019t have a decent health system funded out of their taxes, and they\u2019d have to get private health insurance to cover their health costs if they could\u2014if they could\u2014and they might not be able to, as many people in the United States can\u2019t. So I think those apocryphal stories that we\u2019re somehow going to lose people to New Zealand because they can go to countries with lower tax rates are not going to come to pass. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000566\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f5d71749-ae91-4af7-b2bd-77260398912a\u0022\u003ESo we will be opposing the Supplementary Order Paper from the ACT Party, and I would again note that the majority of the tax cuts that they propose compared with the status quo\u2014because all this bill does is carry on with the status quo\u2014would be going to wealthy people, and people who are middle-income earners and lower would get less.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022f7fc7ac3-5ce1-43ca-8cd6-dbb0941bf3ae\u0022 data-id=\u0022ad3afb92266e449abfaed489c54d7cea\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000567\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f7fc7ac3-5ce1-43ca-8cd6-dbb0941bf3ae\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022ad3afb92266e449abfaed489c54d7cea\u0022\u003EDr DUNCAN WEBB (Labour\u2014Christchurch Central) (remote):\u003C/span\u003E Kia ora, Mr Chair. Thank you for that, and, look, I want to absolutely endorse the comments of Minister Parker in this matter. I heard Brooke van Velden speaking before about the average New Zealander, and, of course, the danger with the average New Zealander is that if we have a small amount of very wealthy people, then it skews entirely what the average is. I want to talk about people who are earning under $48,000 a year, of which there are many, and, of course, the tax proposals put forward by the ACT Party would do absolutely nothing for them\u2014but everyone over that, including the people who would benefit most? Those earning over $180,000 a year. It\u2019s absolutely extraordinary to me that Brooke van Velden can come to this committee and talk about the costs of her $150 shopping bag, when some people are struggling to feed many children on that. Yet she\u2019s trying to create tax breaks through her Supplementary Order Paper for people who are earning even more than she is. Truly extraordinary. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000568\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f7fc7ac3-5ce1-43ca-8cd6-dbb0941bf3ae\u0022\u003EAnd, of course, the cost of living crisis: we know the costs are real. We know there are difficulties there. But the ACT Party\u2019s proposals do nothing at all. As for the suggestion that people are going to leave for lower tax rates: well, over in Australia, the top tax rate\u2019s 47 percent; Canada, 53; the UK, 45; and even the United States is 43 percent on those top income brackets. So it is absolutely fictitious to suggest that there is some kind of \u201CEl Dorado\u201D out there. As the Minister said, you might want to escape to the United States if you\u2019ve got lots of money, but you won\u2019t be getting State-funded healthcare. You won\u2019t be getting a consistent education system. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000569\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f7fc7ac3-5ce1-43ca-8cd6-dbb0941bf3ae\u0022\u003EAnd as for the National Party saying that the Government\u2019s engaging in wasteful spending and that they can somehow make up the $3 billion hole of tax revenue that they would see, I\u2019d like to know: other than cameras on fishing boats, no one yet has said what they would cut. Are they going to cut nurses\u2019 salaries, at this time? Are they going to cut teachers\u2019 salaries? Are they going to address care workers? Are they going to lower the minimum wage? We are yet to see a single meaningful suggestion. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000570\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f7fc7ac3-5ce1-43ca-8cd6-dbb0941bf3ae\u0022\u003EEven from here, from 400 kilometres away, I can hear Andrew Bayly yapping in the background there, but he\u2019s got nothing to say. He should get up now, and he should tell us right now what the National Party will cut. What is this alleged wasteful spending in this time of crisis? The budget is better than the Treasury has projected. We have lower debt than projected, we have lower unemployment than projected, and we have a better fiscal outlook than projected. And yet the National Party says they can do better. I challenge them to stand up and say: what will they cut? Where will they find the money to cut? Thank you, Mr Chair. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022eaf79431-1033-44f1-a633-22633da52c0d\u0022 data-id=\u0022ed9c8af828034fe6ae0af9834cca54e9\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000571\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022eaf79431-1033-44f1-a633-22633da52c0d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022ed9c8af828034fe6ae0af9834cca54e9\u0022\u003EHon DAVID BENNETT (National):\u003C/span\u003E We had the Minister speak before about tax rates relative in other countries, so would he just like to expand on that with relative income rates for, say, a teacher, a nurse, a doctor in Australia, for example, and give New Zealanders a fair estimation of the income levels that somebody, if they were a truck driver in Australia would get compared to a truck driver in New Zealand, so that it can be a relative discussion, rather than the tax rates necessary as part of the income for those things. Then you can add on the housing cost in Australia as well\u2014what\u2019s the cost of a house compared to the cost in Auckland, which has gone up horrendously under his watch.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000572\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022eaf79431-1033-44f1-a633-22633da52c0d\u0022\u003ESo would the Minister like to give a fair representation of the income and expenses of somebody moving to, say, Australia or those other countries that he wanted to acknowledge, rather than trying to purport to just give one view of what the economic cost may be?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022f5d71749-ae91-4af7-b2bd-77260398912a\u0022 data-id=\u0022e773b1a33a2c495ea53f793865c66912\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000573\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f5d71749-ae91-4af7-b2bd-77260398912a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022e773b1a33a2c495ea53f793865c66912\u0022\u003EHon DAVID PARKER (Minister of Revenue):\u003C/span\u003E I won\u2019t go too far into this, because it\u2019s straying a fair way from the bill. But I would say that the rate of increase in salaries for nurses and teachers since we came to office exceeds what occurred during the nine years prior in the National Party.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002212d74f81-b1f7-4b51-9fb4-8f9481477192\u0022 data-id=\u0022d301b07553be467f83d022fe15d8737a\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000574\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002212d74f81-b1f7-4b51-9fb4-8f9481477192\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022d301b07553be467f83d022fe15d8737a\u0022\u003EDr DEBORAH RUSSELL (Labour\u2014New Lynn) (remote):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Mr Chair. It\u2019s a delight to speak on this bill, albeit remotely. I want to just add a little bit of clarity to some of the numbers that have bandied about here, especially by members of the Opposition parties.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000575\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002212d74f81-b1f7-4b51-9fb4-8f9481477192\u0022\u003EWe had the leader of the ACT Party, David Seymour, standing up and ranting and raving, telling us that it was horrendous that 12 percent of individuals in this country paid 48 percent of the income tax. I checked the numbers out; indeed, those are correct. There\u2019s a table on the Treasury website, and if you go to that table and look through the numbers, indeed, 12 percent of income earners do pay 48 percent of all the income tax. However, there is no table on the Treasury website which talks about the amount of income they earn in the first place. But if you dig a bit further and do your homework properly and head through the IRD website, you can find a table there which will give you an estimation of income distributions in this country. So, if you\u2019re sitting there and crunching through the numbers and working with them a bit, and it doesn\u2019t even take a lot of effort to do it, what you do find is that 12 percent of income earners in this country earn 38 percent of all the income. A huge proportion of the income is earned by just a small proportion of people in this country. That\u2019s not even taking into account people who don\u2019t earn any income at all. The particular spreadsheet I\u2019m working off only works with people who are aged 16 and older, and does not include people who earn no income at all. So, in actual fact, that 38 percent of income is likely a lot higher.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000576\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002212d74f81-b1f7-4b51-9fb4-8f9481477192\u0022\u003ESo if we\u2019re talking about a fair distribution of income tax, then it turns out that the fairness we need to speak in terms of is fairness in relation to the income earned, not just the single headcount\u2014the single individualistic headcount that the ACT Party relies on. Tell the story, but tell the whole story, and that is what the ACT Party neglected to do; they neglected to look at income distributions. We have a long-established principle in this country that if you earn more income, then you pay more income tax. This is a principle that goes way back to Adam Smith in The Wealth of Nations, writing about the principles of fair taxation. Adam Smith said that the more income a person earns, the more that person ought to contribute to the general good\u2014to the general good. So I think we can ignore the stats\u2014the dubious stats\u2014that the ACT Party have presented us with, with only a partial view.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000577\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002212d74f81-b1f7-4b51-9fb4-8f9481477192\u0022\u003EAnd then from the National Party we had the idea that, in fact, we\u2019re all paying outrageously high income taxes in this country. That is just not the case. The Minister presented it early on in this debate; he pointed out that in terms of the 38 OECD countries, in terms of what our overall tax take is as a percent of GDP, we are 24th. That is, that there are 23 countries that have higher tax takes than we do\u201423. And that\u2019s countries like the United Kingdom and Canada, and the Scandinavian countries; places where it\u2019s actually good to live. So other countries have higher tax takes than us. And, of course, Mr Bayly also ignored\u2014by concentrating only on income taxes, he ignored the other taxes that are in our system, things like GST and company tax and the like. So, again, only a partial story; a partial picture of what was going on.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000578\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002212d74f81-b1f7-4b51-9fb4-8f9481477192\u0022\u003EI put it to you and to the members of the House that, in actual fact, we could debate about tax rates all we like, but I think we should talk about other principles. Mr Bayly has suggested that our income tax thresholds should be indexed to inflation, but that suggests that they are already at the right level. It suggests that no Government should have a very careful think about the overall structure of our income tax rates; we should just leave them permanently indexed and set in relation to what they are now. Who knows what the future may bring? We need to remain flexible, we need to have the flexibility to adjust income tax thresholds as we need for the benefit of all New Zealanders, because we are all in this together. Thank you, Mr Chair.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022c0f78f60-c2fd-46f4-8138-72f39692fc20\u0022 data-id=\u0022ed09a5a5237546d2bdf021cf3f84ff57\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000579\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c0f78f60-c2fd-46f4-8138-72f39692fc20\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022ed09a5a5237546d2bdf021cf3f84ff57\u0022\u003EHon TODD McCLAY (National\u2014Rotorua):\u003C/span\u003E Mr Chair, thank you very much. I was thinking that there would not be a reason to speak in this debate, because members would see common sense, but I couldn\u2019t help it, having listened to the anaemic speech of the last member, Dr Deborah Russell, calling from somewhere else in the country. You see, for every single member of the Labour Party, the mantra that they teach them before they become MPs is \u201CThere is not a problem that can\u2019t be fixed with a new tax.\u201D And that\u2019s what we\u2019ve seen over 4\u00BD years. You know, Minister Parker can be quoting other very high tax jurisdictions around the world and patting himself and his colleagues on the back for being better than them, but this is a high-tax Government at a time when Kiwis are doing it hard. What we\u2019ve seen this week, in a reaction to ongoing pressure from the Opposition, from the National Party, about cost of living, is, finally, the Prime Minister said, \u201CWell, I suppose there\u2019s a little, tiny bit of a crisis, and we\u2019re going to give a little bit of the extra, extra, extra tax we\u2019re getting, because fuel rates have gone up so much, back to you for just three months, and could you be grateful to us, please.\u201D That was the message that was delivered to Kiwis.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000580\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c0f78f60-c2fd-46f4-8138-72f39692fc20\u0022\u003EThen we saw, in the House today, Minister Woods, who is completely out of touch with what the energy companies are doing, saying that, actually, the announcement yesterday of 25c a litre that\u2019s being given back\u2014well, it\u2019s not being given, because it\u2019s actually already been taken. So they\u2019re taking it with one hand and giving it back with the other. The 25c tax per litre is being given back. The oil companies have already applied that. Well, of course they have, and the reason for that is\u2014and this is a problem with Labour Party members of Parliament: they fundamentally don\u2019t understand business. Of course the petrol companies had to implement that straight away, otherwise few people would buy petrol until the Government gave the tax back at midnight last night. And that\u2019s the thing about a business: when you have costs, you have to meet them. On the forecourt of a petrol station, you have costs when you\u2019re sitting there, whether you\u2019re selling gas or not, and, because of the Government\u2019s announcement, they wouldn\u2019t have been. So they have forced them to implement it straight away.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000581\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c0f78f60-c2fd-46f4-8138-72f39692fc20\u0022\u003EThe Government cannot take credit for what the fuel companies did\u2014taking a cut, waiting for them to get around to it. And, by the way, that cut to petrol tax should have taken place a long time ago. In fact, if they really believed there was a crisis, they would take the extra tax [Interruption] that they have placed\u2014well, this is a debate about tax, Mr Chair\u2014but they would have given\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022a6c42c44-3622-4c9c-98b8-793fb5ec15cc\u0022 data-id=\u0022b266b80baff3484a976a0fb7da0ca038\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000582\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a6c42c44-3622-4c9c-98b8-793fb5ec15cc\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022b266b80baff3484a976a0fb7da0ca038\u0022\u003EASSISTANT CHAIRPERSON (Ian McKelvie)\u003C/span\u003E: Not this broad.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000583\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c0f78f60-c2fd-46f4-8138-72f39692fc20\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00227e342bc422cb4ea18e42639e30bbf8ef\u0022\u003EHon TODD McCLAY\u003C/span\u003E: I\u2019m coming to the point very quickly: they would have taken that extra Auckland tax off a long, long time ago, and not kept it in place, asking people to be grateful.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000584\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c0f78f60-c2fd-46f4-8138-72f39692fc20\u0022\u003EWe should be seeing changes to the tax system in New Zealand, and this isn\u2019t a philosophical debate. Kiwis are taxed too much. You know, when somebody on the minimum wage who works 44 hours a week pays a 30 percent tax rate\u2014well, that\u2019s just ridiculous. It\u2019s crazy. It\u2019s a Government that\u2019s out of touch. When the middle-income earner is on the 33 percent tax rate\u2014remember when that used to be the top tax rate? Well, what the Government is saying is, actually, if you are an average earner in New Zealand, you have to pay the top tax rate, except we don\u2019t want you to, so we\u2019re going to create a whole other, higher tax rate, to take some more off people. But when the average income earner is paying the 33 percent tax rate, the system is not working. And don\u2019t get me started when they go out there with what, in the end, for some, would be an \u201Cenvy tax\u201D, a 39 percent tax rate\u2014not because, actually, they\u2019re making the case of fairness in the tax system; because they need as much as they can get to spend on projects that are not delivering for Kiwis at all. Fifty million dollars on a bridge for cyclists that\u2019s never going to be built: well, that was a great use of somebody\u2019s tax! Put the tax rate up a bit higher, so you can spend more money on more bridges you\u2019re never going to build, I say to the Labour Government!\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000585\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c0f78f60-c2fd-46f4-8138-72f39692fc20\u0022\u003ENew Zealanders are overtaxed. There is a cost of living crisis. Twenty-five cents a litre of tax being handed back at a time when the Government doesn\u2019t need it because they\u2019re getting more tax from fuel than they ever have before, than they dreamed of, actually speaks to the challenge here. This isn\u2019t a philosophical debate. It\u2019s not about the practicalities; it\u2019s about a Government, the Labour Party, that believes\u2014entrenched deep in their DNA, their psyche\u2014that there isn\u2019t a problem that can\u2019t be solved with a new tax. And there are many, many problems in New Zealand today, up and down the country. That means many, many more taxes from the Labour Party.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022859e13f9-33bb-41bb-b2f0-d848eaf25407\u0022 data-id=\u00222ecdfdaf5ce8412983ba297b164daa39\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000586\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022859e13f9-33bb-41bb-b2f0-d848eaf25407\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00222ecdfdaf5ce8412983ba297b164daa39\u0022\u003EANDREW BAYLY (National\u2014Port Waikato):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Mr Chair. Wow, we\u2019re having a good time tonight. I just did want to, first of all, respond to Dr Duncan Webb, because he challenged me to say what has been wasteful spending of this Government, and, of course, you know, this is a Government that has spent $60 billion over the last 22 months, and so I just wanted to respond to that because it was raised in the debate. So, obviously, Dr Duncan Webb wasn\u2019t watching before tea but, of course, we\u2019ve talked about the $500 million that\u2019s been set aside for the health reforms. We wouldn\u2019t be doing that. We wouldn\u2019t be spending the $15 billion on the tram down through Mt Roskill, and we wouldn\u2019t be spending the $1 billion that\u2019s just been the down payment for the three waters. Those are obvious examples. We certainly wouldn\u2019t be spending the $51 million that the Hon Michael Wood spent on the Auckland cycle bridge, which is going nowhere\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000587\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002255d0b7a4-a2c9-4c38-9b77-475311a48a89\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022d0dd3d0ddd31426bb4849b21e37ffa92\u0022\u003ESimeon Brown\u003C/span\u003E: How is that going?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000588\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022859e13f9-33bb-41bb-b2f0-d848eaf25407\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022667628af4af24232860706670bbd306c\u0022\u003EANDREW BAYLY\u003C/span\u003E: Going nowhere, Mr Brown. And then we certainly wouldn\u2019t spend $50 million\u2014actually up to now\u2014doing the investigation in the Auckland tram which, of course, is going to go nowhere, because when will that be finished, Mr Brown? \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000589\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002255d0b7a4-a2c9-4c38-9b77-475311a48a89\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00222d584a83e3ce4af8b78853d311a3d652\u0022\u003ESimeon Brown\u003C/span\u003E: Oh, 2090-something. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000590\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022859e13f9-33bb-41bb-b2f0-d848eaf25407\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022eb9d883e317c4ceaaf615e182c4fcf65\u0022\u003EANDREW BAYLY\u003C/span\u003E: 2090 was the suggestion. And, of course, we wouldn\u2019t be spending the $35 million on the Let\u2019s Get Wellington campaign moving again, so called; $35 million on consultants and, what, not one piece of work\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000591\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002255d0b7a4-a2c9-4c38-9b77-475311a48a89\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022e110536bdba3432db8e420f88ab325c0\u0022\u003ESimeon Brown\u003C/span\u003E: They want to build a pedestrian crossing.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000592\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022859e13f9-33bb-41bb-b2f0-d848eaf25407\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022cc3b3de164f042e3bdb44559f0b439a6\u0022\u003EANDREW BAYLY\u003C/span\u003E: Want to build a pedestrian crossing. And so there are six examples, but I can say to Dr Webb that we\u2019ve got 149 projects that we know have been examples of wasteful spending of this Government. So the other contribution, of course, came from our resident tax expert, and I was watching the Hon David Parker\u2019s face very carefully during the last speaker\u2019s contribution, and I just don\u2019t think Mr Parker was agreeing with what Deborah Russell was saying and, to be honest, I had trouble understanding it. But, the reality is, Mr Seymour is right: 48 percent of tax is paid by the top 12 percent earners and, in fact, when you get to over $100,000\u2014and there are very few people earning over $100,000 currently\u2014actually, they still pay a significant contribution. So the issue that Dr Deborah Russell was talking about is you\u2019ve got to take into account their income. Well, the tax does take into account their income. I found the argument very, very confusing, and I don\u2019t think it helped assist anything in the debate tonight. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000593\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022859e13f9-33bb-41bb-b2f0-d848eaf25407\u0022\u003EThe sheer fact, the simple fact is, this Government loves\u2014in the words of the deputy leader of ACT\u2014to borrow, spend, tax and regulate, and that\u2019s what they\u2019re doing. They\u2019ve been borrowing $60 billion over the last 22 months, they\u2019ve been spending something chronic\u2014and we don\u2019t mind good quality spending\u2014but the reality is there has been truckloads of wasteful spending and, of course, when you do that, what is your option? You can either try to grow the economy. That\u2019s a difficult thing and, actually, this Government hasn\u2019t really focused on growing the economy, improving the incomes of New Zealanders; what they\u2019ve done is gone for the easy answer, which is simply to tax more. And this is why we do not support this bill, and this is why we\u2019re opposing it. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000594\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022859e13f9-33bb-41bb-b2f0-d848eaf25407\u0022\u003EMr Parker said, \u201CWell, you know, all it is is the status quo.\u201D Well, it\u2019s not the status quo. The status quo\u2014what we want to return to\u2014is what the tax situation in New Zealand was prior to this Government coming into power in 2017 and before they started imposing all these new taxes. And that is why we oppose this. That is why we want to return to the original tax rates. That is why the Supplementary Order Papers are on the table, because that means, at the end of the day, hard-working mum and dad looking after their families are going to keep more money at source, rather than being collected by this Government that just loves spending it on wasteful stuff, and actually leaving it in their wallet before you nick it to spend it on some Government project. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022489d736b-2629-4bc7-8d38-6319c7797a33\u0022 data-id=\u0022e55f2d54c15e4515a657806938e64837\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000595\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022489d736b-2629-4bc7-8d38-6319c7797a33\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022e55f2d54c15e4515a657806938e64837\u0022\u003EMARK CAMERON (ACT):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Mr Chair. Just for the sake of the argument, Mr Bennett\u2019s question wasn\u2019t actually answered by the Minister at all. Minister Parker alluded to the fact that other jurisdictions, in terms of the tax that they were paying, were significantly higher than here in New Zealand. But, equally, when asked by the member Mr Bennett what they were actually earning relative to that tax, he didn\u2019t answer it, and I think this committee deserves to know\u2014or perhaps he simply doesn\u2019t.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022 data-id=\u00222cdff0cb725641c8869772a4a30eba70\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000596\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00222cdff0cb725641c8869772a4a30eba70\u0022\u003EDAVID SEYMOUR (Leader\u2014ACT):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Mr Chair. I\u2019d like to talk a little bit about these tax rates, from the point of view of small business. The Mt Eden Village is one of the life centres of the Epsom electorate that I\u2019m proud to represent. I think a lot of people would say that the life centre of the Mt Eden Village is the iconic cafe of Frasers. Anyone who\u2019s been to Mt Eden will know the place that I\u2019m talking about. Mt Eden Village is reeling, at the moment, on the news that Frasers may close. I happen to know the proprietors of Frasers\u2014as a good local MP should know the people that are trying to do business and serve their customers and employ people and make the place a little bit vibrant. What they\u2019ve said to me repeatedly is that they have been beaten down by four years of anti-business sentiment by this Government. The relevance of that to this particular piece of legislation is that income tax\u2014a lot of people miss this, but income tax is a cost that businesses pay, because they are desperate to get people\u2014hasn\u2019t helped that this Government closed the border for two years. They\u2019re desperate to get people in a tight labour market, and one of the costs that business faces when they try to employ people is that they have to pay those people, and those people have to pay income tax.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000597\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003ESo every time you go to Frasers and you order a coffee or a piece of toast, or any other small business at Mt Eden Village or in the wider Epsom electorate or anywhere up and down from Cape Reinga to Bluff, part of the cost of everything you pay is the income tax that is taken out of people\u2019s pockets by this Government. People forget that; they think income tax is something that you pay when you earn money, but, actually, it\u2019s something that you pay when you spend it. I\u2019d just put it to this Government that by keeping the income tax rates they have, particularly that punishing middle income tax rate of 30 percent as soon as you hit $48,000, they are not only taxing people who are trying to make ends meet, they are actually taxing the businesses that are trying to employ them and the customers who are going to buy things at those businesses. After two years of COVID restrictions, with global shocks, we are starting to see those costs actually knock off iconic and beloved businesses up and down New Zealand.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000598\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003EOne of the most powerful reasons why this Government should support Supplementary Order Paper 140 that I have put on the Table\u2014to cut that top 39c envy tax and to drop that middle income tax rate from 30c down to 17\u00BD on all income, from $48,000 per year to $70,000 per year\u2014is to give relief to those businesses that are struggling, because we can\u2019t afford to keep seeing the life centre of the villages and suburbs that make up this country being decimated and pushed over the edge, and having proprietors, when their lease comes up, say, \u201CI just don\u2019t want to sign up to another lease. There\u2019s too much cost. There\u2019s too much uncertainty.\u201D One of the biggest costs that is being put on to people like that is the income tax that their staff are forced to pay.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000599\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003EBut here\u2019s another aspect of income tax that some people don\u2019t think of. We are told that when you buy a litre of petrol, around about $1.40 of that is excise tax and GST and emissions trading scheme levies and a couple of other minor levies that are put on to a litre of petrol; they add up to $1.40. But what they don\u2019t tell you is that if you do a full economic analysis of what people are paying in terms of total tax to buy a litre of petrol, you\u2019ll also have to go out and earn the money, and when you do that, you pay income tax.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000600\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003EIf I can go back to the heady days through the mists of time, when a litre of petrol 91 was only $3, I\u2019m talking about, sort of, last week, before the latest increases, think about what it actually means to go out and earn a dollar so that you can fill up the tank and actually pay to take the kids to hockey practice or rugby practice. I\u2019ve heard from people having to decide which kids to take to practice, because they just can\u2019t afford to go anywhere. I\u2019m getting on social media, young people sending pictures of their whole flat sitting around at home because they can\u2019t afford to go anywhere. I\u2019m hearing from people who are saying, \u201CWe are not going to work anymore because by the time you factor in all of the costs, including petrol, we can\u2019t afford to do it.\u201D\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000601\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003EBut let\u2019s go back to that full analysis of how much tax people are paying to get a litre of petrol. Well, it\u2019s not $3\u2014if we just take round numbers\u2014and then $1.40 on tax, and $1.60 for the oil and the refining and the retailer. By the way, does anyone remember when, \u201CWe\u2019re going to reduce the price of petrol by having a market study.\u201D? I think that was Kris Faafoi. I think he said that the 18c importer margin was going to go down 32c. He actually believed that BP and Mobil and Z Energy, they were all going to pay 14c a litre for the pleasure of selling it to you.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000602\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003EBut the thing is, it\u2019s not just that $1.40 of tax that you\u2019re paying. Actually, if you\u2019re paying a marginal rate of 33c on the dollar, and if you\u2019re on the average wage, you almost are, actually, to spend $3 at the pump, you have to earn $4.50, then you pay 33c in the dollar in income tax. And you\u2019ve got $3, and then you buy a litre of petrol from BP or Mobil or wherever\u2014I hear it\u2019s cheaper at Waitomo\u2014then you pay $1.40 of that in tax. So the total tax that people are being hit with, when you talk about the income tax, is not just the $1.40; it\u2019s the $1.50 of income tax, then the excise tax, then the GST, then the levies. Actually, you\u2019re paying $2.90 of tax, in order to buy 1 litre of petrol. People don\u2019t often say this; they just focus on what you pay at the pump. But, actually, when you buy a litre of petrol, you have to earn $4 50, if your marginal rate is 33c, pay $1.50 in tax, $1.40 in taxes that are in the petrol, and to get $1.60 litre of petrol, you pay $2.90 in petrol.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000603\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003ENow, of course, that was back through the mists of time, you know, two weeks ago, when you could actually get a litre of 91 for three bucks, that\u2019s no longer the case. But it makes the point that these income tax rates that we are debating make a very real contribution to what people are paying at every stage of life. It has a huge impact on the cost of living crisis that people face, because it\u2019s not just petrol. People are finding that if they want to buy a 2 litre bottle of it\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000604\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a6c42c44-3622-4c9c-98b8-793fb5ec15cc\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022e1797f599e2345afb4ef2584a4a39124\u0022\u003ECHAIRPERSON (Ian McKelvie)\u003C/span\u003E: Can I just remind members that if I have to wear a mask, it\u2019d be good if everyone in the Chamber wore a mask. Sorry.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000605\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022843f457e649c4abd94feaaeef16cb6bf\u0022\u003EDAVID SEYMOUR\u003C/span\u003E: No problem, Mr Chair. It\u2019s good to see everyone observing the COVID restrictions.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000606\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003EIf you want to buy, for example, 2 litres of milk, and if you think you can get it very cheap for $4, but let\u2019s be realistic, it\u2019s actually, for most people, $5. And the thing is, of that $5 they\u2019re paying, well, there\u2019s 15 percent GST in there. So that\u2019s about 70c of GST they\u2019re paying. But what people miss is that if you\u2019re over $70,000, you have to go along and earn an extra $7.50 to pay for that milk and pay the income tax that comes with it. So, really, when you buy a $5 bottle of milk, you\u2019re paying $2 50 income tax, then 70c of GST, you\u2019re actually paying $3.20 of tax to get a 2-litre bottle of milk.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000607\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003EWe need to reduce these tax because it\u2019s everywhere.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022eaf79431-1033-44f1-a633-22633da52c0d\u0022 data-id=\u002208f18d43d0ca450b884e2ba42528114e\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000608\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022eaf79431-1033-44f1-a633-22633da52c0d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002208f18d43d0ca450b884e2ba42528114e\u0022\u003EHon DAVID BENNETT (National):\u003C/span\u003E Just going back to those questions that we asked Minister Parker before, would he like to actually answer them? They weren\u2019t actually that difficult. You know, as somebody that represents himself in this House as understanding the details, to give a childish answer and try to go back to look at percentage increases over the last decade or so as an answer for what real New Zealanders are making a choice about\u2014what are the income differentials in Australia against New Zealand for those kinds of jobs? What are the cost differentials in New Zealand against Australia for those kinds of jobs? Give the public a fair perspective, and not the slant that the Labour Party wants to put on this issue. Is the Minister going to answer, or is he just going to look at his phone and hide and not going to reply? \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002255d0b7a4-a2c9-4c38-9b77-475311a48a89\u0022 data-id=\u0022c2815efe9a0246ef9c35b9445bbb0c5f\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000609\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002255d0b7a4-a2c9-4c38-9b77-475311a48a89\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022c2815efe9a0246ef9c35b9445bbb0c5f\u0022\u003ESIMEON BROWN (National\u2014Pakuranga):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Mr Chair. I think those are some very good questions from my colleague the Hon David Bennett, asking questions about whether Minister Parker is actually going to give the public transparency around the actual tax rates that we are paying in comparison to other countries. It\u2019s one thing for the Government to come in here and try to confirm the tax rates and say that, \u201COh, we\u2019re paying low taxes here in New Zealand,\u201D but he continues to hide the fact that in New Zealand, it\u2019s not just the income taxes: it\u2019s the GST, it\u2019s the fuel excise, it\u2019s all of the other taxes and regulations and the impact that they have on New Zealanders which actually need to be compared if he\u2019s going to be open and transparent in this debate here in this committee.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000610\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002255d0b7a4-a2c9-4c38-9b77-475311a48a89\u0022\u003EI come here as the member of Parliament for Pakuranga and the hard-working people of my community who are facing a cost of living crisis here in New Zealand. Members on that side of the House might say, \u201COh, well, the people out there, they earn plenty of money.\u201D Well, I\u2019m sorry, someone earning $70,000, $80,000, $90,000, on average wages in New Zealand, is actually struggling with the cost of living crisis that we are facing in New Zealand. Average rents: up $150 under this Government. Petrol prices: over $3 a litre. Food prices: up 14 percent. And we have not seen any tax relief ever given by this Government when it comes to our income taxes. I actually don\u2019t remember ever\u2014yesterday was probably the first time in my life that a Labour Government\u2019s actually ever cut any form of tax that I can recall. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000611\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022859e13f9-33bb-41bb-b2f0-d848eaf25407\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002282809ffa73924e0094f1324a86040663\u0022\u003EAndrew Bayly\u003C/span\u003E: That\u2019s how desperate.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000612\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002255d0b7a4-a2c9-4c38-9b77-475311a48a89\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00222f3921763a254648907f78ec9312e717\u0022\u003ESIMEON BROWN\u003C/span\u003E: That\u2019s how desperate they must be: first time I\u2019ve ever seen it. But the point about it: it\u2019s only temporary. It\u2019s for three months. That\u2019s as much as they could give: a three-month temporary cut to the excise for fuel. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000613\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002255d0b7a4-a2c9-4c38-9b77-475311a48a89\u0022\u003EThe point I\u2019m making here is that what we\u2019ve seen over the last number of years is the increase in inflation and how that continues to put pressure on people\u2019s real incomes after tax, and pushes people up into higher tax brackets, and means that, effectively, they go home with less in their back pockets, less to spend on the necessities that they need to pay, less that they need to be able to pay the bills and do all of the things that they need to be able to do. So the question that the Government needs to answer is: are they ever going to consider any form of indexation of the tax brackets? Are they ever going to think about any form of trying to shift the tax brackets to take into account the effect of inflation, or is this Government going to sit on the side and constantly let inflation eat into the back pockets of New Zealanders, eat into their after-tax income, meaning that they\u2019re, effectively, left poorer under this Government? \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000614\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002255d0b7a4-a2c9-4c38-9b77-475311a48a89\u0022\u003EI can tell you, I get the sense this Government is, rather, going to sit on the side, where they are going to take as much as they can, because they like doing three things. They like taxing. Tax, tax, tax\u2014any tax that they can try to take, and any amount of money, they will do it. They spend like drunken sailors. I just listened to my colleague Andrew Bayly listing off just a few examples of some of the absolute wastage of money under this Government. Tens of millions of dollars\u2014they just blink an eyelid. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000615\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002255d0b7a4-a2c9-4c38-9b77-475311a48a89\u0022\u003EThe Minister of Transport stood up this afternoon, and he said, in response to $50 million being spent on the Auckland cycle bridge, \u201COh, well, I\u2019m a little bit disappointed we didn\u2019t quite get the outcome that we were after.\u201D Fifty million dollars: for most New Zealanders that is an eye-watering sum of money. The people on the other side, the Government members on the other side, need to remember: that is not your money. That is taxpayers\u2019 money. They are the ones who work hard every single day, and they pay their taxes expecting some benefit for it, not for it to be thrown down the drain in some form of experiment, which is what we\u2019re seeing far too often. Fifty million dollars! Let\u2019s Get Wellington Moving\u2014$35 million, I heard Andrew Bayly say; $35 million for consultants. Let\u2019s Get Wellington Moving sounds like it\u2019s \u201CLet\u2019s Get Wellington Consulting\u201D. Well, there\u2019s probably already too much consulting happening and not enough doing, and that\u2019s another problem, that we can discuss on another day, with this Government. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000616\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002255d0b7a4-a2c9-4c38-9b77-475311a48a89\u0022\u003EThe reality is New Zealanders are facing a cost of living crisis. There is a need to adjust those tax brackets in a way which gives New Zealanders some tax relief at this incredibly challenging time\u2014not what we just saw from the Government yesterday, which was a small concession that there\u2019s an issue, but, actually, addressing the question and the issue properly.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022a1f7bbd1-b6ae-41c0-963b-dbe1251f5540\u0022 data-id=\u0022b7040c56260441ac97276630f8f84724\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000617\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a1f7bbd1-b6ae-41c0-963b-dbe1251f5540\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022b7040c56260441ac97276630f8f84724\u0022\u003EKIERAN McANULTY (Chief Whip\u2014Labour):\u003C/span\u003E I move, That the question be now put.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022 data-id=\u0022690bcb109a9e4e399909699fcf7e822e\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000618\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022690bcb109a9e4e399909699fcf7e822e\u0022\u003EDAVID SEYMOUR (Leader\u2014ACT):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Mr Chair.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000619\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a1f7bbd1-b6ae-41c0-963b-dbe1251f5540\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002238e997c3ad474d62afd57996cfc2fd74\u0022\u003EKieran McAnulty\u003C/span\u003E: Point of order, Mr Chair. Thank you, Mr Chair. I apologise to the member. However, this is a debate on Part 1, and that was the fourth member in a row where you did your signal to keep to the bill. We\u2019re more than happy to have the debate, but it should just be relevant to Part 1 of this bill.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000620\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a6c42c44-3622-4c9c-98b8-793fb5ec15cc\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00228df84a672aa6422da1172ee19975b74d\u0022\u003ECHAIRPERSON (Ian McKelvie)\u003C/span\u003E: Thank you for your advice, Mr McAnulty.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000621\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00223662363c59a441a799955e5c509869b3\u0022\u003EDAVID SEYMOUR\u003C/span\u003E: Thank you very much, Mr Chair. I apologise. I didn\u2019t realise that was the signal that you were making; I thought that you were resisting the urge to clap through my speech. I thought, \u201CHe agrees with me, but he\u2019s too professional to show it audibly.\u201D But now that I know that you were talking about narrowing the debate, it will certainly be clear that my contributions are about this very important topic. It\u2019s the only real debate that this Parliament has all year about the most important thing it does, which is pass laws so that taxation is done with representation, and the amount of money taken out of people\u2019s income is at least debated in this House, even though many people don\u2019t agree with it.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000622\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003EI want to talk a little bit about the implications of these tax rates in relation to administration and compliance costs. Now, it was very interesting to hear Simeon Brown, from Pakuranga, get up and say that the Labour Party in Government has never cut taxes in his lifetime. I thought that\u2019s interesting, because in 1986, with Sir Roger Douglas as finance Minister, the Labour Party in Government halved the top tax rate from 66 percent to 33 percent. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000623\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002255d0b7a4-a2c9-4c38-9b77-475311a48a89\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022c655e02ce82f4cc688693497749489c4\u0022\u003ESimeon Brown\u003C/span\u003E: I wasn\u2019t here in 1986, my friend.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000624\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022f61bd6a81935479a8978e5dca41d3283\u0022\u003EDAVID SEYMOUR\u003C/span\u003E: He\u2019s just corrected us. He wasn\u2019t born in 1986. I was worried that he might have been misleading the House, but, actually, he is just too young to remember a Labour\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000625\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002255d0b7a4-a2c9-4c38-9b77-475311a48a89\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002244d86db8b8e7442f870e21bd4355e57e\u0022\u003ESimeon Brown\u003C/span\u003E: I raise a point of order, Mr Chair. I wasn\u2019t misleading the House. I wasn\u2019t born until 1991. I just want to correct that. Thank you.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000626\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a6c42c44-3622-4c9c-98b8-793fb5ec15cc\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00226b9e4325d4b94c47a7aaa0c05b9d196b\u0022\u003ECHAIRPERSON (Ian McKelvie)\u003C/span\u003E: That, I\u2019ll remind the member, is not a point of order.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000627\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00227c44d12c19804935bfb9d7a3502afbab\u0022\u003EDAVID SEYMOUR\u003C/span\u003E: Mr Chair, I\u2019ll tell you what: he\u2019s older than he looks, then. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000628\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003EIn any case, that was an important period in New Zealand history, because, by halving the top tax rate, the amount of revenue collected off the top tax rate actually increased. The reason for that is that when Governments have a wide range of rates of tax, it creates more and more opportunities for people to change the incidence of their tax\u2014to change how they pay it, what entity pays it, and in what time period. If they can shift some of their income into another time period, then they can reduce the amount of income tax paid. Now, to some extent, that\u2019s an inevitable result of any tax system, but the more complex our taxation system gets, the more difficult it is for Government to collect tax and the more difficult it is for citizens to comply with tax law. The net result is that New Zealanders spend more time on administering tax, from the IRD side, and complying with tax, from the citizens\u2019 or the taxpayers\u2019 side. That leaves less time to do the kinds of things that make life worthwhile. Nobody, as far as I\u2019m aware, actually enjoys tax compliance or, even in the case of Inland Revenue staff, tax administration.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000629\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003EThis is a very important feature of this debate that is often missed. We have an increasingly steep and complex tax structure that leads to more time spent on administration and compliance, and that is the reason why we should be trying to have lower, flatter, fairer taxes: so we spend less time on administration and compliance. This 39 percent rate is going to raise very little revenue, but it will mean that, for a whole range of people, it\u2019s worth\u2014for 6 percent of your income over a certain level\u2014paying accountants more to avoid it. That creates a cat and mouse game between the Inland Revenue Department; the Finance and Expenditure Committee, which oversees tax lawmaking, which I used to sit on; the tax accountants; and the taxpayer. It\u2019s wasteful behaviour.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000630\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003EYou only have to look at other countries to see how bad it can get. You look at the proportion of New Zealanders who can fill out their tax return without a tax accountant, and we\u2019re actually one of the best systems in the world. You go over to Australia: most people need a tax accountant to do their returns because their system is complicated, it has more rates, it has more exemptions, and they just spend more time paying tax. That is not helpful. You go to Canada, or, worse still, you go to the United States, where their levels of taxation have more rates, more exemptions, and more complexity\u2014a tax system like Swiss cheese\u2014and people spend an enormous amount of time on tax administration and compliance. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000631\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003EThat is one of the reasons why I\u2019ve put amendments on the Table for this legislation that would go some way to improving the simplicity of our tax system by getting rid of that 39 percent rate and dropping the 30 percent rate. So instead of having five different rates of tax, we\u2019d have three. Up to $14,000, you pay 10.5 percent. From $14,000 to $70,000, you pay 17.5 percent. Above $70,000, you\u2019d pay 33 percent, up to the sky. If we had that system, we would just be moving a little bit closer to the ideal of a low, flat tax system that does not have all sorts of incentives for people to come up with trusts and schemes and arrangements to try and avoid paying tax\u2014because that\u2019s no longer profitable when you have fewer rates\u2014or less profitable. And it means that tax law is less complicated and we can get on with being productive and making stuff and doing stuff that makes life worth living.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000632\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003ENow, actually, we really need to go further, because even with the proposals that ACT has on the Table, that are fiscally affordable under the current circumstances\u2014the Government just borrowed 60 billion bucks, and so on; closed the border and decimated the economy; and printed a lot of money and can\u2019t know what to do with it\u2014even then, there\u2019s still a lot of work to be done. For example, we have a trust rate of 28 percent, a company rate of 28 percent, and three different income tax rates above that. ACT would take that to one tax rate above that. But you\u2019d still have a 5 percentage point gap between the top income rate and the trust and company rate. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000633\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003EThe place we\u2019d like to get to is actually to say we have one top rate, and the incentive of that is that suddenly it\u2019s not profitable to get your accountant to try and change the kinds of arrangements that you have. We have a simpler tax system. We spend less time administering and complying tax; more time doing stuff that makes life worth living. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000634\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003EIf we were to go that extra step, then we would find ourselves in a position where, actually, we started to be looked at like we once were: as a country that had policies that led the world; instead of a has-been policy environment that is slowly degrading into all the problems that were got rid of just in time for Simeon Brown to be born. We were clearing the way for you, mate!\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000635\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002255d0b7a4-a2c9-4c38-9b77-475311a48a89\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a31613bebbea402abeae6217c3ea94a4\u0022\u003ESimeon Brown\u003C/span\u003E: Thank goodness!\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000636\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00227d873e4698944e41b55efc7ac5a488f1\u0022\u003EDAVID SEYMOUR\u003C/span\u003E: Yes, I know. If only you\u2019d made more of it. That is what we could be doing. We could be having that debate about New Zealand being the best in the world\u2014about having the simplest, fairest, flattest tax structure. Instead, we have a Government that wants five different income tax rates, plus another different rate for companies and trusts and a growing amount of administration and compliance opportunities that are not actually good for New Zealand\u2019s future as a place where people have time to get on with making life worthwhile.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000637\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003EThat will probably be my final contribution on this part\u2014unless, of course, we get some answers from the Minister, and hope springs eternal. But I think people need to consider, first of all, the culture that you get from your tax system. If a large group of people pay little tax and vote for a small group of people to pay most of it, I don\u2019t think that\u2019s good for cohesion in our society. When we have a Government that\u2019s taken $2,138 more per person, adjusted for inflation, in the last 4\u00BD years, that leaves a hole in household budgets, and that\u2019s why people are struggling at the supermarket checkout and the petrol pump. Income taxes are not just a cost that you pay after you get paid and buy stuff; they\u2019re also a cost that increase the prices that businesses charge, and they\u2019re also something that you have to factor in when you look at the true cost of things you buy. It\u2019s not just the price that you pay at the pump or the checkout; it\u2019s the money you had to earn to pay the income tax to get there to pay that price. When you look at it that way, the amount of money that the Government is taking out of New Zealanders\u2019 real resources to provide for themselves and their families is actually greater than is commonly believed. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000638\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003EThose are all reasons why I hope this House will support the amendment I\u2019ve put forward to drop that 39 percent rate down to 33 percent and drop that 30 percent rate down to 17.5 percent and go from an increasingly complex system of five different tax rates down to a system with three rates that is flatter, fairer, and simpler for the prosperity of all New Zealand. Wouldn\u2019t that be something to get behind and something we could be proud of as a country? Thank you, Mr Chair.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022489d736b-2629-4bc7-8d38-6319c7797a33\u0022 data-id=\u002250666ce4af0141d4a5fa3f0fbfacdb9b\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000639\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022489d736b-2629-4bc7-8d38-6319c7797a33\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002250666ce4af0141d4a5fa3f0fbfacdb9b\u0022\u003EMARK CAMERON (ACT):\u003C/span\u003E Yeah, look, again, Minister, with the greatest respect, this third iteration where we ask the same question we routinely seem to have you obfuscate that reality\u2014we\u2019ve talked about productivity, we\u2019ve talked about wages offshore relative to tax, you still haven\u2019t answered the question. I believe you made iterations about nurses etc. offshore. We said, hey look, the deputy leader of the ACT Party made inference to the fact that people were leaving New Zealand to get jobs overseas. You then inferred that they were paying higher rates of tax. Now, that is not contestable. What is contestable, on this House by this side, by both myself and Mr Bennett, was what they were actually earning and what was relative to that. You haven\u2019t answered it, and I think anyone who was on Parliament TV tonight, and God bless them, might actually want to have an answer for that.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022f5d71749-ae91-4af7-b2bd-77260398912a\u0022 data-id=\u0022c19748e8ac3240708a1ea1e1e3e9104c\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000640\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f5d71749-ae91-4af7-b2bd-77260398912a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022c19748e8ac3240708a1ea1e1e3e9104c\u0022\u003EHon DAVID PARKER (Minister of Revenue):\u003C/span\u003E Those that are listening to the debate will know that this is a debate about the tax rates for the year, not wage rates.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002261725fea-7d5e-4d1f-8fd3-e5779bb7a14d\u0022 data-id=\u00220842f15dfc6b480b9b71e2aa0a4b64af\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000641\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002261725fea-7d5e-4d1f-8fd3-e5779bb7a14d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00220842f15dfc6b480b9b71e2aa0a4b64af\u0022\u003EBARBARA EDMONDS (Associate Whip\u2014Labour):\u003C/span\u003E I move, That the question be now put.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022a6c42c44-3622-4c9c-98b8-793fb5ec15cc\u0022 data-id=\u0022c0cf80a9edec4c0a9c47184a50f01983\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000642\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a6c42c44-3622-4c9c-98b8-793fb5ec15cc\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022c0cf80a9edec4c0a9c47184a50f01983\u0022\u003ECHAIRPERSON (Ian McKelvie)\u003C/span\u003E: Members, I just remind you that the amendments to the rates of income tax were put at the end of the Part 3 debate. The question is that part 1 stand part [Interruption]\u2014apologies, I\u2019m out of order.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca id=\u00220e89657ba8854347a51a7f05d2d8a97e\u0022 name=\u0022division\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EA party vote was called for on the question, That the question be now put.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EAyes 77\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand Labour 65; Green Party of Aotearoa New Zealand 10; Te Paati M\u0101ori 2.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENoes 43\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand National 33; ACT New Zealand 10.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EMotion agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022a6c42c44-3622-4c9c-98b8-793fb5ec15cc\u0022 data-id=\u0022ce3b293c5d2e41769a9ae6a85ef4d5fe\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000643\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a6c42c44-3622-4c9c-98b8-793fb5ec15cc\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022ce3b293c5d2e41769a9ae6a85ef4d5fe\u0022\u003ECHAIRPERSON (Ian McKelvie)\u003C/span\u003E: Members, I just remind you that, as I was doing before\u2014I remind you that the amendments to the rates of income tax were put at the end of the Part 3 debate.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca id=\u0022432e68b7e70c4c6cb46b4e33c1362443\u0022 name=\u0022division\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EA party vote was called for on the question, That Part 1 stand part.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EAyes 67\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand Labour 65; Te Paati M\u0101ori 2.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENoes 43\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand National 33; ACT New Zealand 10.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EAbstentions 10\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EGreen Party of Aotearoa New Zealand 10.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EMotion agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000644\u0022\u003EPart 1 agreed to.\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000645\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u0022766a7b00720c4d5e8de4dcf90e0f5997\u0022\u003EPart 2  Amendments to Goods and Services Tax Act 1985\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000646\u0022\u003E\u003Cbr\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022a6c42c44-3622-4c9c-98b8-793fb5ec15cc\u0022 data-id=\u00223539b37c63394f239adbe42136d866b0\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000647\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a6c42c44-3622-4c9c-98b8-793fb5ec15cc\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00223539b37c63394f239adbe42136d866b0\u0022\u003ECHAIRPERSON (Ian McKelvie)\u003C/span\u003E: Members, we now come to Part 2. Part 2 is the debate on clauses 4 to 45, \u201CAmendments to Goods and Services Tax Act 1985\u201D. The question is that Part 2 stand part. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022f5d71749-ae91-4af7-b2bd-77260398912a\u0022 data-id=\u00222631b1fd913c4201bdc0420aba367531\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000648\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f5d71749-ae91-4af7-b2bd-77260398912a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00222631b1fd913c4201bdc0420aba367531\u0022\u003EHon DAVID PARKER (Minister of Revenue):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Mr Chairman. It\u2019s somewhat ironic given the claims from the other side that we never reduce any taxes, but the two points I would highlight in respect of Part 2 relate to amendments to the Goods and Services Tax Act 1985: a number of remedial provisions, two of which are the zero rating of cryptocurrencies\u2014treating it like a financial service rather than a GST-able service\u2014and also the removal of GST on the internal part of an international, part domestic transport service. Currently, there\u2019s some lack of\u2014well, there\u2019s actually quite a difficult regime for taxpayers to comply with, and this simplifies it to expand zero rating to accommodate subcontracting arrangements for the transport of goods in New Zealand where this is part of the international transportation of goods. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022859e13f9-33bb-41bb-b2f0-d848eaf25407\u0022 data-id=\u002262a1df6ef03449d884840f49a16dc657\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000649\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022859e13f9-33bb-41bb-b2f0-d848eaf25407\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002262a1df6ef03449d884840f49a16dc657\u0022\u003EANDREW BAYLY (National\u2014Port Waikato):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Mr Chair. I acknowledge those challenges that the committee considered those issues carefully, as the Minister will be well aware. Particularly around cryptocurrency, as the Minister is also aware, the use of hybrid instruments around cryptocurrency, we thought it was appropriate that it should remain as it would with shares or some other hybrid or derivative, so the issue around cryptocurrency was an important issue that the committee considered, and we think that was useful. The other one is, as the Minister quite rightly points out, the domestic lag of an international transaction, and the committee found that it was an appropriate amendment because of, as he said, the complications around that.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000650\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022859e13f9-33bb-41bb-b2f0-d848eaf25407\u0022\u003EI just want to talk now about the records of taxable supplies and, for people who are listening in, there is a change to the requirements around records for taxable supplies and it might be just worthwhile the Minister talking a little bit about this. So, at the moment, when people go to buy an item like a power tool from, let\u2019s say, Mitre 10, a good New Zealand company, they will get issued a receipt at the till. That, surprisingly, what most people don\u2019t understand is it doesn\u2019t actually constitute a taxable invoice, because, under the current Act, that does not have all the necessary information. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000651\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022859e13f9-33bb-41bb-b2f0-d848eaf25407\u0022\u003ESo what I was hoping the Minister might do is just elaborate a little bit more around the new arrangements around the invoice, because there is now a cut-off, and the committee talked about this at length, around if you are buying an item up to the value of $1,000. Then, as I understand\u2014and this would be useful for the Minister to confirm\u2014that till receipt, in effect, will become legitimate because there is a de minimis, or minimum value, that\u2019s now been applied. And for an item that you acquire for more than $1,000, then there is a greater level of disclosure. I suppose the question I really want to ask, because I\u2019m hoping the Minister will inform the audience, is: will a point-of-sale document other than a handwritten invoice\u2014because a lot of small businesses, and we\u2019ve got 350,000 of them, don\u2019t want to be sitting there writing out hand documents\u2014still be deemed appropriate, or what are the rules around that? So it\u2019ll just be helpful if the Minister could elaborate on that particular issue.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022f5d71749-ae91-4af7-b2bd-77260398912a\u0022 data-id=\u00225e87a0a044184a26bef50f4263c427d4\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000652\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f5d71749-ae91-4af7-b2bd-77260398912a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00225e87a0a044184a26bef50f4263c427d4\u0022\u003EHon DAVID PARKER (Minister of Revenue):\u003C/span\u003E I\u2019m happy to assist the member, who was on the committee and, I\u2019m sure, understands these issues well. These issues are dealt with in clause 19 of the bill. The member is quite correct that the practice in commerce has overtaken the old rules, and the terms \u201Cinvoice\u201D and \u201Ctax invoice\u201D are being replaced with \u201Csupply information\u201D and \u201Ctaxable supply information\u201D, which are simpler and can better accommodate the till receipts that the member refers to as meeting the obligations needed to be valid tax records. So there\u2019s less specificity as to the form of what used to be a tax invoice; more flexibility\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000653\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022859e13f9-33bb-41bb-b2f0-d848eaf25407\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022cdbae09b83e1480a941b7b1a92de55a9\u0022\u003EAndrew Bayly\u003C/span\u003E: So will a point of sale work?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000654\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f5d71749-ae91-4af7-b2bd-77260398912a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022f2c631aa836a43dba3c48e7c7183603a\u0022\u003EHon DAVID PARKER\u003C/span\u003E: I will check that with officials, but I would except that a till receipt from the likes of Mitre 10, as the member said, would qualify as a record of a sale for GST purposes if the GST number is on it. I\u2019ll check that with officials, but that\u2019s my understanding\u2014yes, up to a thousand dollars, that\u2019s correct. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022713ccc5b-7ff0-4fa5-ab58-4780620184fe\u0022 data-id=\u002279948129e49346da8b1cb4907f8a4837\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000655\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022713ccc5b-7ff0-4fa5-ab58-4780620184fe\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002279948129e49346da8b1cb4907f8a4837\u0022\u003ESIMON WATTS (National\u2014North Shore):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you very much, Mr Chair, and thank you to the Minister for engaging in conversation around the points that my colleague Andrew Bayly raised. I want to refer now to Part 2, new sections 19E to 19P, set out in clause 19, in regards to the removal of the words \u201Ctax invoice\u201D\u2014a term that has been in use for nearly 30 to 40 years, a lot longer than some members have been in this House. I\u2019m interested, particularly from the Minister, around the implications of that, because, you know, the feedback received from the select committee process said that a number of contracts and elements, such as that, use that term throughout, so there actually is a process of unwinding the removal of that term. I\u2019m interested, from the Minister\u2019s point of view, what, if any, assessment has been undertaken in regards to the potential compliance costs or time around that and the implication of that change in the bill. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000656\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022713ccc5b-7ff0-4fa5-ab58-4780620184fe\u0022\u003EThe other aspect I\u2019d like to ask the Minister around is the lead time in order to implement the changes. My colleague Andrew Bayly just spoke about a number of questions in regards to clause 26, replacing section 24, with regards to the changes around the tax invoice portion. Again, my question here is around the timing of the implementation of these changes, which, I think we would agree on both sides of the Chamber, are modernisation changes to the GST scheme, which were not in play in 1985. But with changes comes a time required for that lead-in to convert from one process to another, and for those taxpayers, I think that will, in effect, click in on 1 April, then that time line isn\u2019t that long. So I\u2019d appreciate a little bit of feedback around that process and whether any consideration would be given to provide some extension of time for those taxpayers to meet what, for some of them, will be reasonably significant compliance obligations. Thank you, Minister. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022f5d71749-ae91-4af7-b2bd-77260398912a\u0022 data-id=\u0022a3ab484b66434d0cbf9b54bbbcf167f3\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000657\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f5d71749-ae91-4af7-b2bd-77260398912a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022a3ab484b66434d0cbf9b54bbbcf167f3\u0022\u003EHon DAVID PARKER (Minister of Revenue):\u003C/span\u003E In respect of the member\u2019s question about new section 19E, set out in clause 19, that\u2019s the new form of a credit note. For example, if you\u2019re take some goods back and you\u2019re getting a credit note, then the replacement for that is what\u2019s called here \u201Csupply correction information\u201D, and the requirements of that are set out in new section 19E(1) and, for example, a name and registration number of the supplier have to be included on the till docket, if you like, if that\u2019s the form of it.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000658\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f5d71749-ae91-4af7-b2bd-77260398912a\u0022\u003EIn respect of the implementation date, some of the taxpayer-friendly changes take effect from the enactment of the bill. Some of the others that require some systems changes on the part of taxpayers come into effect on 1 April 2023 in order for those systems changes to be made by those\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000659\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022859e13f9-33bb-41bb-b2f0-d848eaf25407\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022866e5fab5be04611899c92edb63104b7\u0022\u003EAndrew Bayly\u003C/span\u003E: And so does this one apply then?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000660\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f5d71749-ae91-4af7-b2bd-77260398912a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022c6f054136db0499d8fe0056e4850febf\u0022\u003EHon DAVID PARKER\u003C/span\u003E: I\u2019ll check that issue. The member\u2014for those that didn\u2019t hear that, Mr Bayly just asked, in respect of the supply correction information, whether it\u2019s from enactment or 1 April 2023, and I\u2019ll check on that. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022859e13f9-33bb-41bb-b2f0-d848eaf25407\u0022 data-id=\u00228baf18bf063f4bec8d3671f7adfdd337\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000661\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022859e13f9-33bb-41bb-b2f0-d848eaf25407\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00228baf18bf063f4bec8d3671f7adfdd337\u0022\u003EANDREW BAYLY (National\u2014Port Waikato):\u003C/span\u003E Yeah, people probably didn\u2019t hear, but I did ask the question whether it would apply from 1 April 2023. Very good questioning from my colleague Mr Simon Watts. It was an issue that we considered at the Finance and Expenditure Committee. Whilst in some cases for larger companies\u2014because they\u2019ve got bigger systems, they\u2019ve got bigger IT departments\u2014actually to comply with invoices over a thousand dollars becomes very, very easy\u2014well, easier\u2014because they\u2019ve capacity and capability to make those changes, what many of us were concerned about at committee level was changes for smaller businesses. Ninety-seven percent of small businesses employ 20 or fewer people in New Zealand, and so they don\u2019t have large IT people sitting around. Obviously, sometimes they have systems that are white label, that are not easily able to be changed, even at a point-of-sale system. And they\u2019re costly to change, in the time it takes to change. So there was significant talk about this at the committee, and I know Mr Watts is referring to that, in an oblique way. But the strong desire was that it should be delayed until 1 April 2023, and, again, we did come to a resolution on it, but I\u2019d be very grateful if the Minister of Revenue has got an answer on that.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022f5d71749-ae91-4af7-b2bd-77260398912a\u0022 data-id=\u002218190dd365284d6397258b53ed8ca5c0\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000662\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f5d71749-ae91-4af7-b2bd-77260398912a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002218190dd365284d6397258b53ed8ca5c0\u0022\u003EHon DAVID PARKER (Minister of Revenue):\u003C/span\u003E New clause 19E nests within clause 19 of the bill, and the commencement date for that is found at clause 2(28B), which lists clause 19 of the bill as coming into force on 1 April 2023.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022859e13f9-33bb-41bb-b2f0-d848eaf25407\u0022 data-id=\u00229595fefab754474e8bec2bb0e526aa1b\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000663\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022859e13f9-33bb-41bb-b2f0-d848eaf25407\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00229595fefab754474e8bec2bb0e526aa1b\u0022\u003EANDREW BAYLY (National\u2014Port Waikato):\u003C/span\u003E Well, the Minister is a former lawyer\u2014and it\u2019s good that he can follow his own bill. So the next thing, I think\u2014and I thank the Minister for doing that, because I think people need to have clarity around these new rules. Of course, we\u2019re going to have 375,000 business owners tonight going, \u201CGee, I may have to ring up my provider, my point-of-sale provider, or whatever they may be, and get on to that tomorrow, because it will take some time for me to put in place a new system.\u201D\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000664\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022859e13f9-33bb-41bb-b2f0-d848eaf25407\u0022\u003EThe other issue I just want to turn to now is clause 25, which is about apportionment rules, and, obviously, this is quite a reasonably sort of complex tax issue. But under clauses 7(4) and 25, it would, basically, amend the GST apportionment rules in the GST Act. And the first thing is I just want to make sure that this only applies to property developers, this clause. It appears to, but, again, I want to make sure that the Minister is clear with people who are watching tonight, that clause 25, regarding enforcement rules, only relates to property developers. That\u2019s the first thing.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000665\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022859e13f9-33bb-41bb-b2f0-d848eaf25407\u0022\u003EI think the big issue here\u2014and it may be worthwhile for the Minister to explain what we mean by apportionment rules, but, basically, it means the difference between taxable activity and non-taxable activity. Again, maybe he can give us an example if it is relating to property development how that would work, and just in respect of this type of apportionment rule, there\u2019s, obviously, been a change. And, again, I\u2019d just ask the Minister to sort of highlight what those key aspects are.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022f5d71749-ae91-4af7-b2bd-77260398912a\u0022 data-id=\u00221244e975af904873b78cd3ce0bc7fc5a\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000666\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f5d71749-ae91-4af7-b2bd-77260398912a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00221244e975af904873b78cd3ce0bc7fc5a\u0022\u003EHon DAVID PARKER (Minister of Revenue):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Mr Chairman. My understanding is that, yes, it is dealing with subdividers or developers of land who are furthering a taxable activity of developing land or dividing land into lots, which is the description at clause 25 of the bill, if I\u2019m referring to the clause that the member\u2019s interested in. I think I am, but, if I\u2019ve got the wrong clause, let me know. And in respect of the apportionment, to ensure that people are not overtaxed, then there\u2019s a division or an apportionment between input tax deductions so that the disposal of a mixed-use asset, which is one that\u2019s used for both taxable and non-taxable purposes that have appreciated\u2014that they\u2019re not overtaxed. The cap will continue to apply to the land disposed of by the property developers as an increase in the value of which they dispose of is connected to their taxable activity, which is property development.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022859e13f9-33bb-41bb-b2f0-d848eaf25407\u0022 data-id=\u00228e1e01dc311c42eb90ada94d8682b382\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000667\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022859e13f9-33bb-41bb-b2f0-d848eaf25407\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00228e1e01dc311c42eb90ada94d8682b382\u0022\u003EANDREW BAYLY (National\u2014Port Waikato):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Madam Chair, and I just acknowledge the Minister. It\u2019s good that we\u2019ve clarified that it only relates to property developers. The second part of the question before\u2014and maybe he\u2019s just reflecting on it\u2014was that it would be useful to have an example of how this might work. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000668\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022859e13f9-33bb-41bb-b2f0-d848eaf25407\u0022\u003EFor instance, if someone owned a property and on it was a building where some of it was used for private purposes\u2014the developer lives in it\u2014some of it was used for an office, and then there is the issue of the land, we\u2019ve actually got three parts to this title that the developer owns: the private-use part, the office, and then we\u2019ve got the land underneath it. So, in an apportionment, first of all, it would be good to understand what is the basis for the apportionment between the private use and the business or taxable component of the house, and also, at the same time, how the land component comes into play. I\u2019ll ask him that question first, and then we can go into the next bit. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022f5d71749-ae91-4af7-b2bd-77260398912a\u0022 data-id=\u00228864dc064c164beb977fc4f77159b8dc\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000669\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f5d71749-ae91-4af7-b2bd-77260398912a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00228864dc064c164beb977fc4f77159b8dc\u0022\u003EHon DAVID PARKER (Minister of Revenue):\u003C/span\u003E If the member wants to be getting more precise answers than this, then I\u2019ll have to go to officials. But what the tax system\u2019s trying to do is to differentiate between the parts of the use of that land asset, part of which is subdivisible land and part of which is a residence, to make sure that the part that is related to residential use\u2014which is not a GST-able activity\u2014doesn\u2019t attract GST, and that\u2019s achieved through apportioning value as between that part of the property and the part of the property that is being subdivided, which does or may attract GST. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022859e13f9-33bb-41bb-b2f0-d848eaf25407\u0022 data-id=\u00228147ce05a81e479b8374b0fc68c44c7e\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000670\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022859e13f9-33bb-41bb-b2f0-d848eaf25407\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00228147ce05a81e479b8374b0fc68c44c7e\u0022\u003EANDREW BAYLY (National\u2014Port Waikato):\u003C/span\u003E Sorry, I\u2019m just seeking a bit of clarification. Are we talking about the land, the subdivision component of the land, only, or are we talking about the component of the house? Because I heard Minister Parker talk about subdivisional components. So that\u2019s the first, and maybe the Minister might take the opportunity to talk to the good official there.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000671\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022859e13f9-33bb-41bb-b2f0-d848eaf25407\u0022\u003EThe second thing, I suppose, is: how do you determine this? How do you determine the two components, between taxable and non-taxable? Do you have to go and get independent verification, or do you just make an assessment, subject to the IRD coming back and maybe asking you to clarify that? What is the formal process for actually getting through this process?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022f5d71749-ae91-4af7-b2bd-77260398912a\u0022 data-id=\u00225b7c1b07a4e64557962b0f235a192e1e\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000672\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f5d71749-ae91-4af7-b2bd-77260398912a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00225b7c1b07a4e64557962b0f235a192e1e\u0022\u003EHon DAVID PARKER (Minister of Revenue):\u003C/span\u003E I\u2019m advised that that apportionment has to be done anyway, because there is part of this activity that is taxable, as a subdivision, and part of it that is not, from the GST point of view, because it\u2019s a personal residence. So that need to distinguish between the two already exists at law, so there\u2019s not an additional compliance cost; it\u2019s just trying to make clear the apportionment rules.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022859e13f9-33bb-41bb-b2f0-d848eaf25407\u0022 data-id=\u0022f3bfd2f09be2484ea715121de8e3be26\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000673\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022859e13f9-33bb-41bb-b2f0-d848eaf25407\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022f3bfd2f09be2484ea715121de8e3be26\u0022\u003EANDREW BAYLY (National\u2014Port Waikato):\u003C/span\u003E So, if that is the case, the purpose of clause 25 is really to say that the disposal of land that the person has acquired is a zero-rated supply. So that is the non-taxable element\u2014that is the private-use component of it. But, in terms of the component that is taxable, there is now a new definition in subclause 6(b), which says, \u201Cfor a disposal to which paragraph (a) does not apply,\u201D\u2014that\u2019s the paragraph above\u2014\u201Cthe amount that, when added to any deduction already claimed, produces a total amount equal to the amount of the full input tax deduction on acquisition \u2026\u201D. So maybe the Minister can just explain the new cap rules on that total amount of GST that is payable or claimable.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022d14b1afe-2069-41e4-96fa-c8dc81a991a4\u0022 data-id=\u00227db55f25a6bc4782a9d9c61da13a5b3a\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000674\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022d14b1afe-2069-41e4-96fa-c8dc81a991a4\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00227db55f25a6bc4782a9d9c61da13a5b3a\u0022\u003ECHAIRPERSON (Hon Jenny Salesa)\u003C/span\u003E: I call Simon Court\u2014sorry; Simon Watts.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022713ccc5b-7ff0-4fa5-ab58-4780620184fe\u0022 data-id=\u0022daf627eb0f0246f9a50acad61c3977c7\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000675\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022713ccc5b-7ff0-4fa5-ab58-4780620184fe\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022daf627eb0f0246f9a50acad61c3977c7\u0022\u003ESIMON WATTS (National\u2014North Shore):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you very much, Madam Chair. Crikey! Look, I was thinking about that good contribution from my good colleague Andrew Bayly, and I know the Minister is conferring at the moment with officials, and so I thought, while we\u2019re doing that, we would buy a little bit of time just to talk about a slightly different topic while we come back to the very important points that have been asked. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000676\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022713ccc5b-7ff0-4fa5-ab58-4780620184fe\u0022\u003EI want to go to clause 5, (2) and (3). It is in relation to the changes that have been brought into play in the GST legislation around cryptoassets. And I think those on the Finance and Expenditure Committee will remember, probably, this conversation\u2014that the changes made under the Goods and Services Tax Act 1985 relate to the exclusion of \u201Ccryptoasset\u201D from the definition of \u201Cgoods and services\u201D, and, in effect, moving it to the definition of \u201Ccurrency\u201D. And, I guess, what we discussed at the committee\u2014and I\u2019d be interested to just get the Minister\u2019s perspective on it\u2014is the unintended consequences of that change of definition, for cryptoassets, because while we\u2019re acknowledging the fact that they aren\u2019t going to be subject to GST, the unintended consequence of that change in definition\u2014which may seem subtle but actually is significant\u2014is the other associated services, such as brokerage, on those type of transactions may therefore be captured.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000677\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022713ccc5b-7ff0-4fa5-ab58-4780620184fe\u0022\u003ESo I\u2019m interested for the Minister just to provide a little bit of perspective\u2014and I appreciate he might want to have a chat with his officials, which he\u2019s currently doing, so I\u2019ll continue just to add a little bit more context to my points while we\u2019re doing that\u2014I\u2019d appreciate if the Minister could come back and give us a little bit more clarity around clause 5, (2) and (3) on cryptoassets. Thank you, Minister. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022f5d71749-ae91-4af7-b2bd-77260398912a\u0022 data-id=\u0022275ca6a9e58c407fbe7c9f1cb32eb369\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000678\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f5d71749-ae91-4af7-b2bd-77260398912a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022275ca6a9e58c407fbe7c9f1cb32eb369\u0022\u003EHon DAVID PARKER (Minister of Revenue):\u003C/span\u003E Responding to Andrew Bayly\u2019s earlier question, I\u2019m advised that the intention here is that people who are not property developers do not get overtaxed by the apportionment rule that does not apply to property developers. I think I\u2019ve got that right.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000679\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f5d71749-ae91-4af7-b2bd-77260398912a\u0022\u003EIn respect of the allied services in respect of cryptocurrency, yes, a boundary has to be drawn somewhere. If the service that is being provided is, for example, a brokerage service, then, as would be the case for a broker selling shares or servicing a share transaction who charges brokerage, that would attract GST and so would the brokerage on a cryptocurrency transaction.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002266f06e7e-afa8-457f-a105-048b86a13282\u0022 data-id=\u00224eeafaab5c0c47598cba6b304567a1cd\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000680\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002266f06e7e-afa8-457f-a105-048b86a13282\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00224eeafaab5c0c47598cba6b304567a1cd\u0022\u003EBROOKE VAN VELDEN (Deputy Leader\u2014ACT):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Madam Chair. I wanted to go back to a topic that my colleague Andrew Bayly was talking about with the Minister, before, about the supply correction information under new section 19N, inserted by clause 19, and I note that the section applies \u201Cwhere a registered person has previously issued taxable supply information that includes an inaccuracy.\u201D But there is a subclause (4), which states that \u201Ca registered person is not required to supply correction information under subsection (2) for a supply because part of the consideration shown in the taxable supply information for the supply has been rebated under a Pharmac agreement to Pharmac, whether Pharmac is acting on its own account or as an agent for a public authority.\u201D And I just wondered if the Minister would be able to provide some clarity around this sub-clause about the benefit of it being added, what the hope was behind it, and why Pharmac itself has been singled out with its own subclause, because I know there will be a lot of people who have interest in medicines access. But I\u2019ve tried to look around the report that came back from the Finance and Expenditure Committee, and I noted in that report there was no reference to Pharmac. So I wondered if the Minister could provide a little clarity about its addition into this new section 19N.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022713ccc5b-7ff0-4fa5-ab58-4780620184fe\u0022 data-id=\u0022a2c5c0fdb20e459088e17764663b7190\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000681\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022713ccc5b-7ff0-4fa5-ab58-4780620184fe\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022a2c5c0fdb20e459088e17764663b7190\u0022\u003ESIMON WATTS (National\u2014North Shore):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Madam Chair. I appreciate the Minister\u2019s engagement with us on these questions; I appreciate that some of them probably are, for those at home, extremely thrilling, but the GST Act, in all the main, is important.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000682\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022713ccc5b-7ff0-4fa5-ab58-4780620184fe\u0022\u003ESo what I want to refer to is around new sections 19E and 19F, and there\u2019s some changes that have been made in regards to the GST legislation around information-gathering requirements. There seems to be\u2014and it was noted through the submission process\u2014an inconsistency of the different information requirements for suppliers and recipients, respectively, that is required in the new \u201Ctaxable supply information\u201D definition that\u2019s come into play, and that\u2019s specifically under new section 19K(8). I\u2019m interested in a little bit of consideration around why we\u2019re seeing, potentially, some different requirements around the information requirements in those portions of the Act, whether that\u2019s intentional or whether it\u2019s more so an oversight in terms of drafting, it would be good just to get a little bit more detail in regards to that. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022f5d71749-ae91-4af7-b2bd-77260398912a\u0022 data-id=\u00229c336b6191ab45debc2eb6164f4c9c41\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000683\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f5d71749-ae91-4af7-b2bd-77260398912a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00229c336b6191ab45debc2eb6164f4c9c41\u0022\u003EHon DAVID PARKER (Minister of Revenue):\u003C/span\u003E Well, my reading of the bill\u2014and I might misunderstand the question\u2014but there is now no 19K(8).\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022859e13f9-33bb-41bb-b2f0-d848eaf25407\u0022 data-id=\u00225f4a4536ea47460d960f948fe036c409\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000684\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022859e13f9-33bb-41bb-b2f0-d848eaf25407\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00225f4a4536ea47460d960f948fe036c409\u0022\u003EANDREW BAYLY (National\u2014Port Waikato):\u003C/span\u003E Madam Chair, thank you for that. I\u2019ll let Mr Watts just review that.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000685\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022859e13f9-33bb-41bb-b2f0-d848eaf25407\u0022\u003EI just want to go back\u2014just to talk about these apportionment rules. I think the Minister the Hon David Parker had a valiant attempt at talking about these beastly apportionment rules, but I\u2019m not quite sure he showed the clarity that we\u2019re actually searching for. So I want to maybe just push it back to the Minister and see whether what I\u2019m saying is maybe a better description of these apportionment rules. Does it mean that where you have a private interest or you\u2019re not a developer, then you won\u2019t have to pay GST, but if you are conducting a taxable activity, such as property development, you will have to pay GST, but there\u2019s a cap on how much you can claim, which is limited to the amount that you\u2019ve originally deducted or claimed, so the total at the end is the same? Is that correct?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022eaf79431-1033-44f1-a633-22633da52c0d\u0022 data-id=\u0022c839bb2f726849528c6113211530b07c\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000686\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022eaf79431-1033-44f1-a633-22633da52c0d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022c839bb2f726849528c6113211530b07c\u0022\u003EHon DAVID BENNETT (National):\u003C/span\u003E The other issue with that is if the tax rate changes within the transaction period. For example, if the Labour Party put up GST to 17.5 percent, which is completely likely, and someone had purchased at 15 percent, how does that work, then?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022f5d71749-ae91-4af7-b2bd-77260398912a\u0022 data-id=\u00227ad9e60d71c34d948d238e3bf50d2151\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000687\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f5d71749-ae91-4af7-b2bd-77260398912a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00227ad9e60d71c34d948d238e3bf50d2151\u0022\u003EHon DAVID PARKER (Minister of Revenue):\u003C/span\u003E If a developer is involved in a transaction, then they can\u2019t pick and choose and say that for part of the transaction they\u2019re not a developer, because they\u2019re in the business. All of their revenue is related to a taxable activity, and therefore is caught. If they are not a developer, then different rules apply. If the member has a more specific question than that, in respect of wanting to dig into that second category, I\u2019m happy to answer further questions.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022a97e1705-20b1-4844-8140-1090426c1397\u0022 data-id=\u00226045219201e74529a60701c793e89886\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000688\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a97e1705-20b1-4844-8140-1090426c1397\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00226045219201e74529a60701c793e89886\u0022\u003EDAMIEN SMITH (ACT):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you. This bill has three main purposes. It is supposed to strive to improve the current tax settings by ensuring that the current tax rules work as intended, but it also seeks to modernise tax settings with regard to the administration of KiwiSaver and Working for Families. Then the bill sets the annual rates of income tax for the 2021-22 tax year. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000689\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a97e1705-20b1-4844-8140-1090426c1397\u0022\u003EWhat I\u2019d like to do with regards to GST is talk about a tax on a tax. My favourite document at the moment is the Half Year Economic and Fiscal Update, and it seems that tonight there hasn\u2019t been a lot of conversation about actual numbers. If you look at GST, as a major tax, it is actually going to, in terms of forecasts, be an average $2.6 billion higher each year compared with the Budget update, with the biggest drivers being an increase in the forecast for private consumption and residential investment, and a small contribution from the opening of the borders in terms of migration. If you look at core tax revenue, you take it up a level. This is where Minister Parker could be accused of being Mr Scrooge. It\u2019s going to be an extra $2.2 billion per year, on average. That\u2019s $48.6 billion higher by 2024-25. There\u2019s no mechanisms in here with regards to management of inflation around GST, corporate tax, source deductions, and other withholding taxes. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000690\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a97e1705-20b1-4844-8140-1090426c1397\u0022\u003ESo one of the things that has slipped by\u2014and it\u2019s not too late, because the petrol tax was changed in a matter of days\u2014is to actually look at the overall inflationary effect that the Government is benefiting from in terms of its GST intake. Irrespective of cryptocurrencies, which is a long-term strategy, generally, more and more money\u2019s going to be pulled out of the economy from businesses and personal households for consumption. That is having an extra kicker being placed on top of it. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000691\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a97e1705-20b1-4844-8140-1090426c1397\u0022\u003EI\u2019d like to ask the Minister: when we spoke about this at the Finance and Expenditure Committee, seven or eight months ago, these figures, as they\u2019ve developed, weren\u2019t as progressive for the Government, if you\u2019d like to call it that. Today should have been the day that we all came together to look at the overall taxation strategy, and whether giving New Zealanders a break or their businesses a break were an essential thing to do. If you look at that quantum of money that\u2019s going to be taken in over the next five years, everybody does talk about GST being sacrosanct and a simple system, but, in the wider context, there\u2019s a hell of a lot of money going to be collected, and we\u2019d like to make sure that there is some empathy towards the people of New Zealand and the businesses of New Zealand with regards to the GST component of the bill, as well as the income tax component. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022f5d71749-ae91-4af7-b2bd-77260398912a\u0022 data-id=\u00224a039c98cd1e4379b3e37514737fa820\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000692\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f5d71749-ae91-4af7-b2bd-77260398912a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00224a039c98cd1e4379b3e37514737fa820\u0022\u003EHon DAVID PARKER (Minister of Revenue):\u003C/span\u003E Dealing with Brooke van Velden\u2019s question in respect of new section 19N in clause 19 of the bill, I\u2019m advised that the provision at subclause (4) is a replication of an existing provision in the Goods and Services Tax Act, so it needs to be restated in accordance with the new, more flexible rules as to tax invoices, or their equivalent supplier information. The existing law has an exception in respect of rebates\u2014the amount that\u2019s being rebated under a Pharmac agreement to Pharmac\u2014and that\u2019s just being carried forward in this provision. So there\u2019s no substantial change. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022d14b1afe-2069-41e4-96fa-c8dc81a991a4\u0022 data-id=\u0022f8c6ad0c422e472fb709c2832ba682af\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000693\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022d14b1afe-2069-41e4-96fa-c8dc81a991a4\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022f8c6ad0c422e472fb709c2832ba682af\u0022\u003ECHAIRPERSON (Hon Jenny Salesa)\u003C/span\u003E: The question is that the Minister\u2019s amendments to Part 2 set out on Supplementary Order Paper 134 and in the Minister\u2019s tabled amendments be agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca id=\u00225e029add64614a13bb0f3ad02633105e\u0022 name=\u0022division\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EA party vote was called for on the question, That the amendments be agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EAyes 67\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand Labour 65; Te Paati M\u0101ori 2.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENoes 43\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand National 33; ACT New Zealand 10.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EAbstentions 10\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EGreen Party of Aotearoa New Zealand 10.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EA party vote was called for on the question, That Part 2 as amended be agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EAyes 67\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand Labour 65; Te Paati M\u0101ori 2.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENoes 43\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand National 33; ACT New Zealand 10.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EAbstentions 10\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EGreen Party of Aotearoa New Zealand 10.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EA party vote was called for on the question, That the question be now put.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EAyes 67\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand Labour 65; Te Paati M\u0101ori 2.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENoes 43\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand National 33; ACT New Zealand 10.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EAbstentions 10\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EGreen Party of Aotearoa New Zealand 10.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EMotion agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000694\u0022\u003EAmendments agreed to.\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000695\u0022\u003EPart 2 as amended agreed to.\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000696\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u00223cf60ca90fe44fcc8f5a412728cc5f71\u0022\u003EPart 3  Amendments to Income Tax Act 2007\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022d14b1afe-2069-41e4-96fa-c8dc81a991a4\u0022 data-id=\u00229ce109f9f7c6477f893f7132faefb67b\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000697\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022d14b1afe-2069-41e4-96fa-c8dc81a991a4\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00229ce109f9f7c6477f893f7132faefb67b\u0022\u003ECHAIRPERSON (Hon Jenny Salesa)\u003C/span\u003E: Members, we now come to Part 3. Members\u2019 amendments to adjust rates of income tax were debated under Part 1 of the bill but will be voted on at the end of this debate. Part 3 is the debate on clauses 46 to 133 and Schedule 1A, \u201CAmendments to Income Tax Act 2007\u201D. The question is that Part 3 stand part.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022859e13f9-33bb-41bb-b2f0-d848eaf25407\u0022 data-id=\u0022d17680b761b442988ee6acd6a88e0de7\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000698\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022859e13f9-33bb-41bb-b2f0-d848eaf25407\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022d17680b761b442988ee6acd6a88e0de7\u0022\u003EANDREW BAYLY (National\u2014Port Waikato):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Madam Chair. Moving on to new ground and I think this is the substantive part of the bill, as, no doubt, the Minister is well aware of it, in terms of what it means for property owners. And so the first bit I want to talk about is my Supplementary Order Paper (SOP) 137, which is the issue of deductibility of interest. What the Labour Government is proposing here is a fundamental shift from a well-established principle, which I don\u2019t think has been ever broken before, which is that expenses that relate to a taxable activity are deductible against the taxable income, and, of course, what this bill does is do away with the ability of property owners who may own a rental property, who are paying tax on the rent\u2014and yet cannot deduct the interest. It is a fundamental change to the strong principle of matching deductibility against accessible income, and that is why we absolutely disagree with the Government on its approach and that is why my SOP 137 goes through and highlights all the relevant clauses of this bill and deletes them, which would mean that it would limit the interest cost deductibility for investment properties. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000699\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022859e13f9-33bb-41bb-b2f0-d848eaf25407\u0022\u003EI suppose the interesting thing is just how significant an issue this is. We spent some time in the committee looking at this very issue and it is significant when we asked the officials to go away and look at the numbers about how many people actually are getting a deduction against their rental properties, because I know the Government loves to characterise these mum and dad investors as rapacious investors\u2014use the term \u201Cinvestors\u201D but often with the implication that they are rapacious\u2014they are only there to further their own interests, they\u2019re such a bad thing, they\u2019re cutting everyone out of the market. So I said to the officials, \u201CTell us how many there are.\u201D Well, that was a first issue. The officials actually had a great deal of difficulty actually determining how many of these so-called rapacious investors there were. So they did come back, only after we asked them specifically, and they came back with an estimate. They had to base it on the 2019-20 year and the 2020-21 year, and they did it off the data returns. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000700\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022859e13f9-33bb-41bb-b2f0-d848eaf25407\u0022\u003EWhat staggered me is that this information actually wasn\u2019t known before the Government actually started talking about this so publicly, and pushing\u2014and I see the Minister of Housing in the Chamber tonight, which is good to see\u2014absolutely denigrating these mum and dad investors and saying how bad they were. I would have thought that they\u2019d actually have a handle on it and it wasn\u2019t until, really, in the Finance and Expenditure Committee. We said, \u201CGo away and give us some numbers.\u201D So they came back with an estimate and they said that there is a population pool of approximately 350,000 landlords who could potentially be affected. That was their best estimate: 350,000. So that\u2019s the total pool of these mum and dad investors.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000701\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022859e13f9-33bb-41bb-b2f0-d848eaf25407\u0022\u003ESo the next question was, \u201COK, how many of those have some borrowing against their rental property?\u201D And so they went away and they did some more work. \u201CIf the number of potentially affected landlords is limited to landlords that have claimed interest expenses, the number of landlords potentially affected by the proposed interest under the new rules is approximately 258,000.\u201D I\u2019m hoping you\u2019re going to allow me to carry on here. And so 258,000. So the next question was, \u201CSo we\u2019ve got a quarter of a million mum and dad investors who have these properties and who have got some form of borrowing on them: in some cases very little, in some cases, not much.\u201D And that was the next question. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000702\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022859e13f9-33bb-41bb-b2f0-d848eaf25407\u0022\u003ESo then we said to the officials, \u201COut of those 258,000 rapacious investors, how many\u2014or what sort of portion of income were they making? How much money were they making off these people?\u201D So it\u2019s a pretty important thing, right? So they came back\u2014again not definitive. And again, I was staggered that we didn\u2019t have this information prior to the Government making its wonderful pronouncements here in the House and elsewhere. But officials said that approximately 75 percent of landlords have gross rental income of less than $30,000 per annum right away and just under 60 percent\u2014to be precise, for the record, 58 percent\u2014have gross rental income of less than $20,000 per annum. Now, the Hon David Bennett here is a very smart numbers man, accountant, and he will know: if you\u2019re earning less than $30,000, what is your weekly rental? What\u2019s the weekly rent will you be charging?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000703\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022eaf79431-1033-44f1-a633-22633da52c0d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002269970f31dbec4231900a0f598c39bb25\u0022\u003EHon David Bennett\u003C/span\u003E: 700 bucks.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000704\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022859e13f9-33bb-41bb-b2f0-d848eaf25407\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022afe468ad7f1b4fab8e0983d5cdff4e3d\u0022\u003EANDREW BAYLY\u003C/span\u003E: No; just under 600 bucks. What\u2019s the average rent in New Zealand? I\u2019m looking around the Chamber. Maybe the Minister can tell the Chamber why I\u2019m asking them, posing this question. We do know rents have gone up by 150 bucks under Labour, right? So if you go to Auckland, actually, if you look at the summary for rentals in Auckland, somewhere between $650 and $800. If you go to Invercargill, it\u2019s obviously less. So what this is saying, by implication\u2014the extrapolation of this figure of $30,000 rent a year, and most people, 75 percent of landlords, earn less than $30,000\u2014is that they only have one house. So of the 258,000 people that own a rental, 78 percent owned one rental. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000705\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022859e13f9-33bb-41bb-b2f0-d848eaf25407\u0022\u003ENow, I put it to you that they are not the rapacious investors that the Minister of Housing and the Labour Government have continuously maligned and slighted and been dreadfully harassing. This cuts to the core of what the Government is trying to achieve in this piece of legislation. It is wrong to suggest that these rapacious investors\u2014so-called mum and dad\u2014who have chosen to invest in one property should be now subject to a tax regime that cuts across the core of what it is, that if you run a commercial enterprise you have to pay tax on the revenue, on the $30,000, but you cannot deduct the interest costs. As it\u2019s been pointed out quite recently, with these tax changes, which will come into effect over the next four years\u2014right now many of these mum and dad investors who have been putting their money into these rentals to provide a house for those many thousands of people who cannot afford a house, or those people wanting to buy their first house, they cannot claim that money, and therefore they are losing money this year.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000706\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022859e13f9-33bb-41bb-b2f0-d848eaf25407\u0022\u003EIt\u2019s interesting, you know, as mortgage rates increase\u2014and we\u2019re likely to see 6 percent, 7 percent by the middle of next year\u2014many of these mum and dad investors will be losing up to $7,000, $8,000 a year, on the current estimates. So, far be it from these people being seen as rapacious investors ripping people off; these are people who invested in a house, often for their retirement purposes, who provide a good standard of living. Not all mum and dad investors are great landlords, but the vast majority are. This is why we absolutely oppose this interest deductibility part of this bill, and that is why we put up Supplementary Order Paper 137. I think the Government actually needs to stand up and explain very cogently why they see this as such a bad aspect, because I don\u2019t think the facts stand up for it.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022f5d71749-ae91-4af7-b2bd-77260398912a\u0022 data-id=\u002235ca123f365d49739617861129793ce2\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000707\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f5d71749-ae91-4af7-b2bd-77260398912a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002235ca123f365d49739617861129793ce2\u0022\u003EHon DAVID PARKER (Minister of Revenue):\u003C/span\u003E The trend in New Zealand over recent decades is that a declining percentage of our population owns their own home. More homes are owned by landlords owning multiple homes and fewer as a percentage\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000708\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022859e13f9-33bb-41bb-b2f0-d848eaf25407\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022e555c990542e4d6a80eb45c4a2959cb0\u0022\u003EAndrew Bayly\u003C/span\u003E: Well, that\u2019s not what this says.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000709\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f5d71749-ae91-4af7-b2bd-77260398912a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022859fc38d22914dbdadf83d5cfc8d167e\u0022\u003EHon DAVID PARKER\u003C/span\u003E: The trend is quite clear. The trend is clear that over recent decades the proportion of New Zealanders who live in their own home has decreased and the proportion who are renting has increased. In respect of the breakdown of those, between landlords who own lots and lots of properties and who own one extra, as Mr Bayly was talking about, there was an interesting article by Valocity reported in a Stuff series based on their data that they gathered. And one of the more astounding stats there was that \u201COver 22,000 homes\u201D\u2014and I\u2019m quoting from them\u2014\u201Care owned by an elite class of large investors who each own more than 20 properties\u201D. That\u2019s the equivalent of Invercargill or Nelson\u2014all of the houses being owned by 906 people, whose portfolios continue to grow. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000710\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f5d71749-ae91-4af7-b2bd-77260398912a\u0022\u003EHow do they do that? Well, we know that they\u2019re able to outcompete over time first-home buyers, really, because they\u2019re the ones that are dropping out of the market, by leveraging their existing asset, plus the asset that they\u2019re purchasing, effectively often borrowing 100 percent of the cost of the new property with the debt spread over the new property that they\u2019re purchasing and the old property that they already\u2014not the old property, but the properties that they already own. The effect of which has been putting upward price pressure on properties. It\u2019s been one of the contributing factors to house price inflation. I know there are a lot of other factors in there, including the lowest interest rates that the world\u2019s ever seen that have been visited upon the world, probably by Mr Greenspan and his mistakes prior to the global financial crisis in monetary policy around the world since. But against the background that there\u2019s a decreasing number of people living in their own home, this side of the House believes that the tax advantage that comes from tax deductibility of those high rates of leverage that can, really, only be obtained as an investment methodology from this class of investment is undesirable socially, and we believe that justifies the measures that are proposed.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002266f06e7e-afa8-457f-a105-048b86a13282\u0022 data-id=\u0022ec220efb1caa4c3ea8b1aa8e2ef16b04\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000711\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002266f06e7e-afa8-457f-a105-048b86a13282\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022ec220efb1caa4c3ea8b1aa8e2ef16b04\u0022\u003EBROOKE VAN VELDEN (Deputy Leader\u2014ACT):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Madam Chair. I rise on behalf of the ACT Party to talk about the interest deductibility changes that this Government is proposing. I believe that they are divisive changes. When the Government and the Minister proposed them last year, it was stated that these interest deductibility changes were supposed to help tilt the market away from speculators and tilt them towards first-home buyers. The ACT Party did what the Government should have done, and we actually went out and we talked to people who would be affected by this change. There are a lot of people whose financial security is now in jeopardy because of these divisive changes. But the real issue here is that it\u2019s not actually going to make people better off. This doesn\u2019t help build more homes for first-home buyers to actually live in. In the meantime, it actually pushes up rents. We saw from the advisers\u2019 own advice last year that the average landlord is going to have an imposed cost of about $4,000 extra per year because of these changes. It shouldn\u2019t be a surprise to anybody who would be able to realise that that cost has got to go somewhere. Most landlords don\u2019t want to put up their rents on good tenants, but they will be forced to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000712\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002266f06e7e-afa8-457f-a105-048b86a13282\u0022\u003EI\u2019ve gone around the country, and I\u2019ve spoken to a lot of property investors and mum and dad landlords who have said that they\u2019ve intentionally kept their rents below market rates because they have good tenants, and they know that they should be charging them more but they like their tenants and they want them to stay, but, because of limiting interest deductibility, they will be forced to put up rent on people that they never wanted to put it up on. For that reason, it\u2019s divisive.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000713\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002266f06e7e-afa8-457f-a105-048b86a13282\u0022\u003EIt also tries to scapegoat a class of people who are actually providing accommodation in New Zealand\u2014a job that the Government doesn\u2019t do very well on. It should actually be the role of private investors to help supply rental accommodation in New Zealand. There is a place for that, and it\u2019s very unfortunate that this is even happening.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000714\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002266f06e7e-afa8-457f-a105-048b86a13282\u0022\u003EI want to take the opportunity to share a couple of examples, because the ACT Party reached out to people who would be affected by this law change, and we had 15,000 people sign a petition asking for this not to happen. There were really, really heartbreaking examples. There are a few that kind of spring to mind to give a little bit of balance to this debate. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000715\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002266f06e7e-afa8-457f-a105-048b86a13282\u0022\u003EThis woman says, \u201CI would prefer if this letter could please be read out in Parliament. My husband and I both have disabilities. My husband can\u2019t work, because of his back injury, and I have diabetes and PTSD. Now, the reason we bought a property was in order to support ourselves and our two adult sons who have a disability. We accept the minimum rent to cover the mortgage and miss out on charging market rent for both of my two older sons. One of my adult sons has schizophrenia, and the other has a head injury and dyspraxia. We are constantly busy working with mental health, WINZ, network personnel, and social workers, acting as their advocates. Everybody is very supportive, but my husband and I are nearly 60 years old, and we have put our retirement on hold so that we can ensure our sons live in safe, dry, and secure accommodation. These two properties are plain bedroom flats. They are warm and safe. We don\u2019t get paid to support our adult sons. They\u2019re 28 and 30. Nor do we expect any additional support on top of what we already receive. We are very grateful for what we do receive. But the Government is relentless to try and make our lives even more difficult. I\u2019ve made two suicide attempts in the last 12 months and ended up in hospital. Everything is related. I see more people like me in my situation who are overlooked. I\u2019ve asked Grant Robertson to make an exception for people like us in this policy, but it was fallen on deaf ears.\u201D \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000716\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002266f06e7e-afa8-457f-a105-048b86a13282\u0022\u003EIt is an absolutely tragic situation. There are people in our society wanting to do the right thing and support their own families. They don\u2019t want to rely on Government support, but they are being forced to sell the homes that they bought, to help support their own family members to make sure that those children would have a stable home to live in. I think we should admire people like that, and it is a real tragedy that this Government\u2014and the changes made to limiting interest deductibility\u2014will mean that those two disabled sons may be forced into Government-run accommodation rather than being able to live in a home owned by their parents.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000717\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002266f06e7e-afa8-457f-a105-048b86a13282\u0022\u003EThe second is a lady who lives in Porirua, and she has a home that she rents out. It\u2019s pretty nice. Her tenants wanted to rent that home for another four to five years, because they\u2019re well-settled in the area with work and school for their boys. But now they\u2019re going to be moving out in three days. This person had to ask them to move out because they knew that these changes were happening. Before that, they offered to sell them the house, but these tenants said that they could not afford it because it would cost them an extra $400 a week in a mortgage repayment, the rates, and the insurance. This landlord felt very bad and had to apologise to them and explain to them that they just cannot simply continue to keep this house, because they will end up having to pay $150 extra a week from their salary, just so that they can live in it. That $150 per week is not something that they can actually afford. This home that has been a stable, secure home for a family and kids going to the local school will be sold, and likely that person who was living there will have to move on.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000718\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002266f06e7e-afa8-457f-a105-048b86a13282\u0022\u003EThere\u2019s also another example: somebody who has four dwellings that are specifically designed as student accommodation\u2014because they\u2019re a block of flats. It\u2019s unlikely that a first-home buyer is ever going to want to buy this block of flats. What\u2019s going to happen? They\u2019re going to have to end up either putting up rent on students who will live in these flats, or selling an entire block of flats. You know what? No first-home buyer is going to be buying a block of flats. That is just not something that they would do. The Government did not exempt blocks of flats from the interest limitation rules that they\u2019re putting in. There will be people in small, little units in shared titles who will have their rents increased because the Government decided that first-home buyers should buy them. There is no market for that.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000719\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002266f06e7e-afa8-457f-a105-048b86a13282\u0022\u003EThe ACT Party opposes this bill because it\u2019s divisive and because the changes that it will make to people\u2019s lives are so negative, the costs outweigh the benefits. But there is also an element in my Supplementary Order Paper (SOP)\u2014because I drafted this SOP to scrap these interest deductibility changes\u2014of the brightline test. The brightline test should also be scrapped completely. It was an acorn that has grown into a fully-fledged tree. It was two years, it\u2019s gone to five years, and it\u2019s gone to 10 years. There is no need for us to take it back to two years. It should be scrapped completely because you need to cut it from the root, otherwise it will spring forth into another tree again. It is an acorn that has grown. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000720\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002266f06e7e-afa8-457f-a105-048b86a13282\u0022\u003EWe need to get rid of it, in particular for the types of people that have been emailing me, like a man who lost his job in Auckland and managed to find a job on a farm where the home was supplied for him. He\u2019s now renting out his primary residence in Auckland, but, because he\u2019s now got this job in another town, he\u2019s going to be captured by the brightline test. That\u2019s really unfortunate, because he says, \u201CAll I can do is sell, and maybe never get back on the market\u2014never be able to afford another one\u2014or just acknowledge that I am not going to be able to get the capital gains that everybody else would be able to get.\u201D\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000721\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002266f06e7e-afa8-457f-a105-048b86a13282\u0022\u003EIt is a divisive law. It\u2019s not going to work. It\u2019s going to push up rents for people who could least afford it, and we need people to supply rental accommodation in New Zealand. There is a place for landlords. They shouldn\u2019t be vilified for actually wanting to do the right thing, and we should actually be proud of people who want to put aside a nest egg for their own financial security.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022f5d71749-ae91-4af7-b2bd-77260398912a\u0022 data-id=\u0022f86d1ad07bb7460c8a85ee208333a650\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000722\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f5d71749-ae91-4af7-b2bd-77260398912a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022f86d1ad07bb7460c8a85ee208333a650\u0022\u003EHon DAVID PARKER (Minister of Revenue):\u003C/span\u003E Can I begin by saying that, you know, that\u2019s a heartfelt story that was told then, and I\u2019m sure I speak for other members on my side\u2014I won\u2019t speak for other members on the Opposition, although I\u2019m not suggesting they would have any other sentiment\u2014of course we respect the difficulty of raising and looking after disabled family members, and have the utmost respect for people who do that.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000723\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f5d71749-ae91-4af7-b2bd-77260398912a\u0022\u003EIn respect of some of the underlying issues that the member Brooke van Velden mentions, I would say that, on this side of the House, we don\u2019t think we get wealthier as a nation by bidding up the price of existing houses and selling them to each other at ever higher prices. It doesn\u2019t generate any productive increase in productive output.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000724\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f5d71749-ae91-4af7-b2bd-77260398912a\u0022\u003EAnd as to the suggestions that this is going to increase rents, the statistics that were put by the Leader of the Opposition, for example, to the Prime Minister today, said that rents have gone up, I think the figure was 16.4 percent in the period from October 2017 to December 2021. Interestingly, during the period from August 2013 to October 2017, the rate of increase in rents was exactly the same: 16.4 percent. Interestingly, in the StatsNZ rental price index for the year annually in New Zealand, January 2021 to January 2022, rents went up by 4.6 percent nationally, which is pretty much the rate of inflation. In respect of Auckland, the increase was 2.7 percent, and we on this side of the House say that\u2019s because, in the end, the driver of prices is the cost of new housing and the supply of new housing, and because we\u2019ve got building activity strongly outpacing population growth in Auckland now\u2014something that the last Government never achieved; they went backwards\u2014we\u2019ve had Auckland price increases of 2.7 percent, year on year. In terms of the national statistics, in February 2022, the national rental price index fell by 0.6 percent from the prior month.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000725\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f5d71749-ae91-4af7-b2bd-77260398912a\u0022\u003ESo I don\u2019t think the statistics bear out the dire predictions that are being made by the Opposition, and I think they do tend to support the view that the key to slowing rent increases is new supply, which we\u2019re seeing in Auckland, which is why Auckland rent increases have been at a lower rate than in the rest of the country. I would also note that, in respect of our efforts to intervene, we have deliberately skewed the field towards investment in new housing, and so the brightline test is softer in respect of new houses, and the interest limitation rules don\u2019t apply to them for the first 20 years of the new build.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000726\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f5d71749-ae91-4af7-b2bd-77260398912a\u0022\u003ESo we think we\u2019ve got the balance right and we think the stats will bear that out and we don\u2019t think that the underlying trend of decreasing homeownership that we have been seeing in our country is desirable, socially or economically. I heard the members saying that they like the fact that people are encouraged to save and put away a nest egg. I agree with that, and I think that is most important for the home occupier, and I am happy on this side of the House to be preferring the interests of the home occupier over those who rent other properties.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022eaf79431-1033-44f1-a633-22633da52c0d\u0022 data-id=\u0022f02014702a354afe9ba0956fe6ad37c1\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000727\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022eaf79431-1033-44f1-a633-22633da52c0d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022f02014702a354afe9ba0956fe6ad37c1\u0022\u003EHon DAVID BENNETT (National):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Madam Chair. I hope New Zealanders have listened carefully to that Minister tonight, because he\u2019s, basically, said that the Government will intervene in this market because they don\u2019t like the results of the market. He\u2019s saying that there\u2019s 906\u2014I think that was the number he used\u2014large-scale rental owners that dominate the market and that\u2019s why the Government has to stop it.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000728\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f5d71749-ae91-4af7-b2bd-77260398912a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002220b06694b16246aaa609d6aca381a58b\u0022\u003EHon David Parker\u003C/span\u003E: That\u2019s not quite what I said.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000729\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022eaf79431-1033-44f1-a633-22633da52c0d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022c1ace43649bb45a99ebacf15f229ef1a\u0022\u003EHon DAVID BENNETT\u003C/span\u003E: That\u2019s exactly what he said.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000730\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f5d71749-ae91-4af7-b2bd-77260398912a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002278b0af8271464050a97a1e234dee07e9\u0022\u003EHon David Parker\u003C/span\u003E: No.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000731\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022eaf79431-1033-44f1-a633-22633da52c0d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022370409da35dc4cf3b37014b2f3464afc\u0022\u003EHon DAVID BENNETT\u003C/span\u003E: Well, let\u2019s go to any other industry in New Zealand; the steel industry. Let\u2019s go to any other part\u2014that\u2019s part of the building industry. Should we break up Mitre 10 and Bunnings Warehouse because they\u2019re too big? Shouldn\u2019t we have a little store on each corner where you can get one plank of wood and one nail? That\u2019s the theory that he is using.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000732\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022eaf79431-1033-44f1-a633-22633da52c0d\u0022\u003EHe doesn\u2019t want to have a business of rental houses. They do not believe that that is a legitimate business. And if you take that to the necessary extreme, then let\u2019s go into other parts of the building and construction industry. If you want to reduce the price of houses, let\u2019s do that, why don\u2019t we do that? This isn\u2019t market failure\u2014that\u2019s what he\u2019s arguing. This is actually a market showing what actually needs to be done. Market failure is when Government\u2019s intervene, thinking they know best. He is, essentially, nationalising the New Zealand rental market by this kind of programme. That\u2019s his plan. Let\u2019s go nationalise the New Zealand energy market! Let\u2019s go nationalise New Zealand steel market! Let\u2019s go nationalise it all!\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000733\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022eaf79431-1033-44f1-a633-22633da52c0d\u0022\u003EBecause in that great socialist utopia that exists, if Government can control it, it will be right. That is his plan. And he\u2019s saying, \u201COh no, rents won\u2019t go up, there\u2019s no chance that\u2019s going to happen.\u201D Well, if people can\u2019t earn an income where they can take off the deduction for the interest, they\u2019re going to have to put more income in there, aren\u2019t they, to pay to mortgage? They still have a mortgage. They still are in the market. There\u2019s nobody going to the banks and saying, \u201COh, you only own one house, so you don\u2019t have to pay this interest rate and if you had 900 houses you have to pay much, much more.\u201D That\u2019s not how the real world works. This is doomed to failure because it is the Government putting its hands into the market. It has never worked in New Zealand\u2019s history and it will never work now.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000734\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022eaf79431-1033-44f1-a633-22633da52c0d\u0022\u003ENow, that Minister will pat himself on the back and say, \u201CI\u2019m here for those people that can\u2019t get there and you trust me because my decision tonight will change it all.\u201D There\u2019s no way in hell he\u2019s going to make any judgment tonight that\u2019s going to make any difference. If anything, it\u2019s going to consign the people at the bottom to higher rents and when they\u2019ve got higher rents they have less income that\u2019s disposable, when they\u2019ve got less disposable income they have less savings, and when they have less savings they can\u2019t buy a house, so they have to keep renting and renting, paying more and more rent, and the circle keeps going on.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000735\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022eaf79431-1033-44f1-a633-22633da52c0d\u0022\u003ESo it\u2019s brilliant economics, Minister; it\u2019s going to fail, but we wish you all the very best in your little dream world, and we look forward to you actually explaining to New Zealanders why you don\u2019t think somebody should be able to own more than two houses in New Zealand, why you think it\u2019s a bad thing for somebody that\u2019s got capital to use it for somebody else that hasn\u2019t got capital to have a roof over their head, or do you know best, and if you limit it to one or two houses [Interruption] and take away\u2014and you said you do.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000736\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002237a99b65-4919-4800-830d-3dd7c920d5cd\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002278e667ba35334c4d95b820e151a6a608\u0022\u003EHon Dr Megan Woods\u003C/span\u003E: No, I said you shouldn\u2019t say you.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000737\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022eaf79431-1033-44f1-a633-22633da52c0d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00226a13e71237c4402f8c38604f6dc73538\u0022\u003EHon DAVID BENNETT\u003C/span\u003E: Well, that\u2019s the answer. The Minister of Housing says she does\u2014she says she does. She said, \u201CYes, I do.\u201D Well, there we go. We know their answer, and it will be a failure just waiting to happen. So all those Kiwis out there that genuinely want to get a house should be listening to the failure that is this Government and their silly economic policies.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022f5d71749-ae91-4af7-b2bd-77260398912a\u0022 data-id=\u0022e4160d640e924a17a9379628f4275515\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000738\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f5d71749-ae91-4af7-b2bd-77260398912a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022e4160d640e924a17a9379628f4275515\u0022\u003EHon DAVID PARKER (Minister of Revenue):\u003C/span\u003E I found that intervention from the Hon David Bennett illustrative of the difference in values, one side of the House to the other. He explicitly said then that he doesn\u2019t mind dominance in the housing sector as you find in every other sector. I think that shows a difference between this side and that side, because for us on this side, actually, homes are not just another asset class, and we think that it is desirable to have higher rates of homeownership. We don\u2019t see it just as another asset class to allocate, like shares or steel or the other industries that he mentioned. He then also, ridiculously, said that we\u2019re nationalising the housing market.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000739\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022eaf79431-1033-44f1-a633-22633da52c0d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00228c5fc3968b6b4fdcb4380b692fab30fd\u0022\u003EHon David Bennett\u003C/span\u003E: You are.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000740\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f5d71749-ae91-4af7-b2bd-77260398912a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022b366b719cafd40d689f7583ac3414808\u0022\u003EHon DAVID PARKER\u003C/span\u003E: We\u2019re not.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000741\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022eaf79431-1033-44f1-a633-22633da52c0d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022714a28481cf64a0db1566b945bd36672\u0022\u003EHon David Bennett\u003C/span\u003E: You are.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000742\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f5d71749-ae91-4af7-b2bd-77260398912a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002247d9f95dfafc4d209fb7b4c39dca812d\u0022\u003EHon DAVID PARKER\u003C/span\u003E: The Government\u2019s not purchasing these houses. These houses aren\u2019t coming into the ownership of the Government. They\u2019ve been purchased by other people.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000743\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f5d71749-ae91-4af7-b2bd-77260398912a\u0022\u003EIn respect of another issue, we certainly do not have perfect tax settings around housing in New Zealand\u2014we don\u2019t. And it\u2019s been one of the reasons why house prices in New Zealand are amongst the least affordable in the world: it\u2019s because of the tax bias in favour of that asset class, and that partly relates to interest deductibility, because interest payments are not wholly an expense. Even if I was to accept the National Party logic here\u2014and I don\u2019t\u2014and even if I was to accept the theory that housing is like any other asset class and all related costs should be deductible, that\u2019s only true of real costs, and it\u2019s not true of the inflationary component of an interest payment. If members want me to go into this in more detail\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000744\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022145dc0b911854c36b3b1508e4075cc5b\u0022\u003EDavid Seymour\u003C/span\u003E: Oh, please. Second call.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000745\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f5d71749-ae91-4af7-b2bd-77260398912a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022fe2782d3e4bc4b5e94ce4acf13cbaef8\u0022\u003EHon DAVID PARKER\u003C/span\u003E: I\u2019m happy to, because an interest payment is not all a real cost, because part of it is compensating the lender of the money for inflation, and\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000746\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022859e13f9-33bb-41bb-b2f0-d848eaf25407\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00226946e2a47c9f4d0ab8b05209062abe9f\u0022\u003EAndrew Bayly\u003C/span\u003E: How much is that of it?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000747\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f5d71749-ae91-4af7-b2bd-77260398912a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022809390bde1a440898f2c09150b7750a7\u0022\u003EHon DAVID PARKER\u003C/span\u003E: It\u2019s roughly half. Over time, if you go over a period of 20 or 30 years and you say that inflation over a longer period averages 3 percent per annum, let\u2019s say for this sort of asset class there\u2019s a margin above inflation of 3 percent. The real interest rate that is being paid by the borrower is only 3 percent, even though they\u2019re paying a nominal rate of 6. And they get a deduction, effectively, from the inflationary component of their interest payment to the lender, which is compensating the lender for the diminishing value of the loan. At the end of the year, the real debt of the borrower has decreased by 3 percent in after-inflation terms.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000748\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f5d71749-ae91-4af7-b2bd-77260398912a\u0022\u003EAt the moment\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000749\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022eaf79431-1033-44f1-a633-22633da52c0d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002227719bcdb2a84f07bfe14d272bc634ab\u0022\u003EHon David Bennett\u003C/span\u003E: Rubbish.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000750\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f5d71749-ae91-4af7-b2bd-77260398912a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00224c4a8b5c091d45f38174578120d40555\u0022\u003EHon DAVID PARKER\u003C/span\u003E: What\u2019s that? Rubbish? \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000751\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022eaf79431-1033-44f1-a633-22633da52c0d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00220a815572f068434b9234cb236c69ade5\u0022\u003EHon David Bennett\u003C/span\u003E: If that is the case, then how come\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000752\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022d14b1afe-2069-41e4-96fa-c8dc81a991a4\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002266e968065d634537b2b75e3a5cb698f4\u0022\u003ECHAIRPERSON (Hon Jenny Salesa)\u003C/span\u003E: The Minister is still in the middle of his speech. If the member would like to ask a question\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000753\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022eaf79431-1033-44f1-a633-22633da52c0d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00220d29aedd263b45d7880ff723419ba38b\u0022\u003EHon David Bennett\u003C/span\u003E: He was asking a question. I was replying.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000754\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022d14b1afe-2069-41e4-96fa-c8dc81a991a4\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002217c5a627c2fe4e43a1e05973edb2e7cb\u0022\u003ECHAIRPERSON (Hon Jenny Salesa)\u003C/span\u003E: If the member would like to ask a question, he can do so later.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000755\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f5d71749-ae91-4af7-b2bd-77260398912a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00224aa88216dc0d4e1a8edf9176f3be7298\u0022\u003EHon DAVID PARKER\u003C/span\u003E: We know, particularly for many properties, that their pattern is that they experience an inflationary gain in their property, they re-leverage their property to buy another property, and they maintain their level of debt in respect of their property portfolio at high levels, and they forever, essentially, for many decades, get a tax deduction for the inflationary component of their interest payment, which is not a real cost, and they pay nothing on either the inflationary or the real gain. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000756\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f5d71749-ae91-4af7-b2bd-77260398912a\u0022\u003ESo there is an economic illiteracy on the part of people who say that we should persist with tax settings that reward speculative investment, and to the extent that you take a tax deduction for an inflationary part of your interest payment and you pay no tax on either the inflationary or the real part of your gain, you do have a distortionary tax setting, which is one of the reasons why house prices are so inflated in New Zealand and one of the reasons why residential rental owners have multiple properties and can outbid a first-home buyer, and that sits behind one of the reasons why, over recent decades, we\u2019ve got declining homeownership rates.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022d14b1afe-2069-41e4-96fa-c8dc81a991a4\u0022 data-id=\u0022d65db967e7fc4311b7c875fa0e0be58d\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000757\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022d14b1afe-2069-41e4-96fa-c8dc81a991a4\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022d65db967e7fc4311b7c875fa0e0be58d\u0022\u003ECHAIRPERSON (Hon Jenny Salsa)\u003C/span\u003E: I call Simon Court\u2014I\u2019m sorry; Simon Watts.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022713ccc5b-7ff0-4fa5-ab58-4780620184fe\u0022 data-id=\u00224c8b26ef91f5454a90e44f9bf5e11b1d\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000758\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022713ccc5b-7ff0-4fa5-ab58-4780620184fe\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00224c8b26ef91f5454a90e44f9bf5e11b1d\u0022\u003ESIMON WATTS (National\u2014North Shore):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Madam Chair. Twice in one night, and I appreciate that humour\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000759\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022d14b1afe-2069-41e4-96fa-c8dc81a991a4\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022060d673ba11f4113a257f3bb673f69b9\u0022\u003ECHAIRPERSON (Hon Jenny Salesa)\u003C/span\u003E: My apologies.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000760\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022713ccc5b-7ff0-4fa5-ab58-4780620184fe\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022ab7d16c584204a51bc998228a1f04652\u0022\u003ESIMON WATTS\u003C/span\u003E: \u2014because listening to that last contribution from the Minister, I was starting to get a little bit worried about some other thing. I think, for those five or so people that are still watching this at home and haven\u2019t gone to sleep after listening to that, I think they will be significantly disappointed because what we\u2019ve just heard, really, is the difference around ideology, around driving the denial of interest deduction on the mortgages for rental income versus the case where interest deduction is allowed on any other form of business income. Right? So we\u2019ve got a complete inconsistency that\u2019s being created within the tax system. And one of the benefits of the New Zealand tax system is that, actually, we\u2019ve got a reasonably fair and broad-based system, right? But what is happening as a result of this specific change in Part 2 is the denial of interest deductibility, based on an ideological view that this is going to have some miraculous impact in terms of improving the issue that impacts pretty much the majority of Kiwis and is the most significant issue facing Kiwis\u2014which is around housing affordability and housing access\u2014which is an absolute fallacy.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000761\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022713ccc5b-7ff0-4fa5-ab58-4780620184fe\u0022\u003EAnd it\u2019s not just me saying that. Can I quote to you from KPMG\u2019s submission to the Finance and Expenditure Committee in regards to interest deductibility\u2014and maybe KPMG are also believing that this is that, but I will quote from the front page, and it says \u201CWe understand that standard economic approaches would suggest the above propositions generally do not hold.\u201D What they were referring to there is the concept that this denial of interest deductibility will actually have an effect around decreasing the ability for property investors to pay less when they purchase properties, in effect, trying to bring back the price of houses, and the other aspect is around a reference around the change in rents.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000762\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022713ccc5b-7ff0-4fa5-ab58-4780620184fe\u0022\u003ESo what the difference is, I think, and as the Minister tried to look at the difference between, you know, this side of the House\u2014and that side of the House, actually\u2014when we think about taxation, we think about how do we use taxation in order to deal with factors that are true market failure. And what we\u2019re trying to deal with here through this is an ideological tax that makes the members on that side of the House, and a small number of supporters in this country, think, \u201COh, that feels good, that\u2019s going to deal with the problem.\u201D Well, it\u2019s not, and it\u2019s not going to deal with the problem. That\u2019s the shame about this aspect of Part 2 of the bill.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000763\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022713ccc5b-7ff0-4fa5-ab58-4780620184fe\u0022\u003EThe analysis to support the anticipated effect on the housing market of not allowing interest deductibility is pretty much sparse, if not available, and that was also commented for a number of submissions through the Finance and Expenditure Committee process. The other aspect that we haven\u2019t\u2014and I\u2019d be interested to hear the feedback from the Minister around, is the complexity that this change brings into our tax system. As I said before, we have a simplistic, a reasonably simplistic, tax system. But what we\u2019re bringing in play now is a complete inconsistency that will bring complexity which, really, again, will only probably derive benefit for those advisers out there.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000764\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022713ccc5b-7ff0-4fa5-ab58-4780620184fe\u0022\u003ELastly, it is interesting to note that both the IRD and Treasury also advised the Government against the denial of interest deductibility. So it\u2019s not just this side of the House at this time of the night saying that this is a completely ridiculous idea and hearing the other side of the House saying that, actually, \u201CGovernment knows best and Kiwis don\u2019t quite understand.\u201D Well, I\u2019m sorry, it doesn\u2019t work like that. And that is backed up by a number of advisers, a number of people around this country. I back Kiwis, I back smart, sensible Kiwis out there that know what they\u2019re doing with their own money and know that this is an absolutely an ideological tax that will not benefit and not bring any change to the housing market that so significantly needs change in order to make sure that our future generations have a house to live or to rent and to live a great life in this country.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022f7fc7ac3-5ce1-43ca-8cd6-dbb0941bf3ae\u0022 data-id=\u0022886a65985b664ea7a4552a97ef5f5c45\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000765\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f7fc7ac3-5ce1-43ca-8cd6-dbb0941bf3ae\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022886a65985b664ea7a4552a97ef5f5c45\u0022\u003EDr DUNCAN WEBB (Junior Whip\u2014Labour) (remote):\u003C/span\u003E I move, That the question be now put.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022 data-id=\u0022c0dbd6af14eb49219f7e02c32ca71ebd\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000766\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022c0dbd6af14eb49219f7e02c32ca71ebd\u0022\u003EDAVID SEYMOUR (Leader\u2014ACT):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you very much, Madam Chair. I\u2019d just like to quickly refer back to the contribution to this committee stage by Brooke van Velden, because I think she highlighted graphically, and in a way that clearly moved the Minister, one of the central problems with this policy of removing mortgage interest deductibility from landlords renting out homes. You see, the Minister of Revenue stands up and he says, \u201COur goal is to make sure that more people are owner-occupiers and fewer people are landlords with tenants.\u201D\u2014that\u2019s their goal\u2014and the problem with that is that the people who are currently tenants are collateral damage, and some of them are very vulnerable people in very difficult situations. That\u2019s the central problem. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000767\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003EWhen the Prime Minister introduced this policy and said that her Government wanted to \u201Ctilt the playing field towards first-home buyers\u201D, what she didn\u2019t say\u2014what she didn\u2019t say\u2014was that she would be tilting it away from anyone who was a tenant, and I can\u2019t work out if this is wilful ignorance or her just having made a political call. I asked the Prime Minister in question time today why did she think that adding extra tax to landlords in a tight rental market wouldn\u2019t be passed on in rents, and she couldn\u2019t explain why she thought that, but I think most people can figure it out. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000768\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003EIf you put an average of $4,000 extra tax on to a landlord and the market\u2019s tight\u2014and it\u2019s not as though tenants can go elsewhere\u2014guess where that cost is going to end up! Paid for by tenants, some of the most vulnerable people. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000769\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003EHere\u2019s the next irony, which is that most people who are tenants actually do\u2014as the Minister said\u2014want to become first-home buyers, and that means they\u2019re saving for a deposit. But if you put a tax on the housing sector and increase the tax on the housing sector, then of course you\u2019re taking away from their ability to save to be depositors who buy a first home. There you see the own goal of epic proportions that comes from failing to properly understand the situation and the problem, and it\u2019s worth just stopping to think about what sort of extra cost is going to be put on to landlords and passed on to tenants. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000770\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003EWell, at the moment, if you have an interest cost, you can deduct it, and if you have a mortgage, say, on a home of half a million dollars and you have income of $48,000 or above, then you\u2019re going to be paying 30c or 33c\u2014so about a third is your tax rate\u2014and if you have a 3 percent mortgage and you\u2019re paying about a third tax that you can no longer deduct, then you\u2019re paying 1 percent. That\u2019s what it costs now because of no more interest deductibility from this legislation. So 1 percent of your mortgage\u2014that\u2019s what you\u2019re paying. But remember, I said that that\u2019s with 3 percent mortgage rates. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000771\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003ENow, I listened carefully to Adrian Orr. It\u2019s not always in the best interests of my welfare and health to hear what that guy\u2019s on about, but the thing he says is that we\u2019re going up with interest rates. If you imagine 6 percent interest rates, then all of a sudden it\u2019s 2 percent of the cost of your mortgage, and if you\u2019ve got a half-million-dollar mortgage, then it\u2019s not $5,000 or $100 a week; it\u2019s $200 a week that you have to pass on to tenants. This has got to be the biggest rent-increasing policy that a Government has ever brought through, and the problem is that in the rush to help first-home buyers, people who are tenants are collateral damage, and, ironies of ironies, people who are tenants often want to be first-home buyers and are saving for a first home. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000772\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003EThat\u2019s why I support the amendments on Supplementary Order Paper 135 put on the Table by Brooke van Velden, but that\u2019s just one reason. The second reason I support that is actually the changes that are proposed to the brightline test, and when I say \u201Cchanges\u201D, I mean \u201CGet rid of it.\u201D \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000773\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003EI should say a little bit more about mortgage interest deductibility, because these two policies that Brooke van Velden\u2019s amendments would get rid of from the tax law have something in common: a failure to define the underlying problem. You see, the problem with falling homeownership rates\u2014and on that we have common ground with the Minister; it has got harder for Kiwis to own their own home\u2014is not the tax treatment. The reason that there is inflation and the reason that people are finding it harder to afford a home is because there are too many people chasing not enough homes. Until you\u2019ve solved that fundamental problem, then these changes to taxes, whether it be mortgage interest deductibility or having the brightline test at 10 years or five years or two years or any length of time, the only thing you\u2019re going to do is redistribute a shortage of houses and change the people who don\u2019t have housing, based on who the Government\u2019s favoured political group is at any time. That\u2019s not real problem-solving. That\u2019s not real change and solutions. That\u2019s politics, and that does not make New Zealanders better off. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000774\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003EIf you come back to this question about mortgage interest deductibility, well, actually, the Minister is right that inflation is not deductible. But you have to ask yourself: why is there so much inflation in housing? Well, because there\u2019s a shortage. That\u2019s the real problem. He\u2019s not solving the real problem; he\u2019s trying to treat the symptoms of it. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000775\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003EWhy is it that we have a shortage of housing? Well, land-use planning and infrastructure funding, building regulations, making councils the building regulator\u2014those are the problems that need to be solved. This will not solve them at all. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000776\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003EThe problem could have been seen from another angle, which is that income tax\u2014I claim no expertise in these matters, but it appears to be on income, and income is revenue minus expenses and interest is an expense. So if having income tax on income, which is revenue minus expense, with interest being an expense, hasn\u2019t created a bubble in the price of Toyota Corollas or desks or chairs or anything else that is freely available\u2014and when the price goes up, people create more of them\u2014maybe the problem with housing is not the tax treatment that applies to everything the same, but maybe the problem with housing was the supply of housing, or, to be really precise\u2014because I know that the Minister loves to nerd out on this stuff\u2014the supply elasticity of housing, and maybe if we fix the real problem, we\u2019d be in a better space. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000777\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003EBut the other reason I think we should support Brooke van Velden\u2019s amendment is that it gets rid of the brightline test. I know there\u2019s another amendment that I can\u2019t support that reduces it to two years, and that amendment is also guilty of a failed problem definition. You see, the problem with housing in New Zealand is not the length of time that people own them. It\u2019s not people that own houses for less than two years or less than five years or less than 10 years. The problem with housing in New Zealand is just there are more people than there are houses, and because people are bidding them up, the price goes up, and they become unaffordable, and that destroys a lot of the opportunity that New Zealanders should have. And when the National Party comes along and says, \u201COh, we\u2019re going to stop people flipping them.\u201D, that\u2019s not the problem. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000778\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003EThe length of time people own a house is not the problem here, and, by the way, the problem is not tax treatment, because here\u2019s another problem with failing to define the problem. You see, the problem is there are not enough houses for the number of people, and when supply doesn\u2019t match demand, prices go up. Well, in putting Government taxes on rising house prices, the prices still rise, but it\u2019s just that the Government becomes a silent partner in the speculation, and we don\u2019t want the Government to be a silent partner in the speculation. We want to build more houses and not have a problem with the prices going up, so that people can afford them. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000779\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003ESo getting rid of the brightline test is the right thing to do\u2014not make it two years so Labour can put it back. Labour, National, Labour, National; two-year, five-year, 10-year\u2014depending on who\u2019s in power. We actually want to get rid of it. As Adam Smith said, an income tax is intolerable interference into the affairs of people, and this brightline test is actually one of the worst because you have to prove where you live for 10 years and it\u2019s outrageous. So we want to get rid of that brightline test altogether, and we want to restore mortgage interest deductibility for housing, because that is allowing us to focus on the real problem. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002212d74f81-b1f7-4b51-9fb4-8f9481477192\u0022 data-id=\u002282e6b7c4a3374aee9d21de1017a3e811\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000780\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002212d74f81-b1f7-4b51-9fb4-8f9481477192\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002282e6b7c4a3374aee9d21de1017a3e811\u0022\u003EDr DEBORAH RUSSELL (Labour\u2014New Lynn) (remote):\u003C/span\u003E I move, That the question be now put.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022d14b1afe-2069-41e4-96fa-c8dc81a991a4\u0022 data-id=\u00226a325d20428a4aaab9815ce3894fe6c3\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000781\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022d14b1afe-2069-41e4-96fa-c8dc81a991a4\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00226a325d20428a4aaab9815ce3894fe6c3\u0022\u003ECHAIRPERSON (Hon Jenny Salesa)\u003C/span\u003E: The question is that the Minister\u2019s tabled amendment to the Minister\u2019s Supplementary Order Paper 134, amending clause 80C, be agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca id=\u0022d947623a269c4463a6a60867d7c75c21\u0022 name=\u0022division\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EA party vote was called for on the question, That the amendment to the amendment be agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EAyes 67\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand Labour 65; Te Paati M\u0101ori 2.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENoes 43\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand National 33; ACT New Zealand 10.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EAbstentions 10\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EGreen Party of Aotearoa New Zealand 10.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EAmendment to the amendment agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022d14b1afe-2069-41e4-96fa-c8dc81a991a4\u0022 data-id=\u002255d543fbf88646bebbdd41568718a3b7\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000782\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022d14b1afe-2069-41e4-96fa-c8dc81a991a4\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002255d543fbf88646bebbdd41568718a3b7\u0022\u003ECHAIRPERSON (Hon Jenny Salesa)\u003C/span\u003E: The question is that the Minister\u2019s amendments to Part 3 set out on Supplementary Order Paper 134, as amended, and in the Minister\u2019s tabled amendment, be agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca id=\u002205fd59b4c89b44298977d04edc6cac4f\u0022 name=\u0022division\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EA party vote was called for on the question, That the amendments, as amended, be agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EAyes 67\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand Labour 65; Te Paati M\u0101ori 2.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENoes 43\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand National 33; ACT New Zealand 10.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EAbstentions 10\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EGreen Party of Aotearoa New Zealand 10.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EAmendments, as amended, agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022d14b1afe-2069-41e4-96fa-c8dc81a991a4\u0022 data-id=\u0022b37578b20e2144dfb229990a2f799cbc\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000783\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022d14b1afe-2069-41e4-96fa-c8dc81a991a4\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022b37578b20e2144dfb229990a2f799cbc\u0022\u003ECHAIRPERSON (Hon Jenny Salesa)\u003C/span\u003E: Brooke van Velden\u2019s amendment to clauses 48, 56B, 64BB, 64DB, 64E, and 80C, set out on Supplementary Order Paper 135, are out of order as inconsistent with a previous decision of the committee. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000784\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022d14b1afe-2069-41e4-96fa-c8dc81a991a4\u0022\u003EThe question is that Brooke van Velden\u2019s remaining amendments to Part 3 set out on Supplementary Order Paper 135 be agreed to. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca id=\u0022da4b200a7c3645a68ed46d26e54edd50\u0022 name=\u0022division\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EA party vote was called for on the question, That the amendments be agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EAyes 10\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EACT New Zealand 10.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENoes 108\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand Labour 65; New Zealand National 33; Green Party of Aotearoa New Zealand 10.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EAmendments not agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022d14b1afe-2069-41e4-96fa-c8dc81a991a4\u0022 data-id=\u002241a0d7905dab421bbd883bcc8e886462\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000785\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022d14b1afe-2069-41e4-96fa-c8dc81a991a4\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002241a0d7905dab421bbd883bcc8e886462\u0022\u003ECHAIRPERSON (Hon Jenny Salesa)\u003C/span\u003E: Andrew Bayly\u2019s amendments to Part 3 set out on Supplementary Order Paper 137 are out of order as being the same in substance to amendments on Supplementary Order Paper 135. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000786\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022d14b1afe-2069-41e4-96fa-c8dc81a991a4\u0022\u003EThe question is that Andrew Bayly\u2019s amendments to Part 3 set out on Supplementary Order Paper 136 be agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca id=\u002253d3615f81a14ddd8179a8ca65aa935c\u0022 name=\u0022division\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EA party vote was called for on the question, That the amendments be agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EAyes 33\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand National 33.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENoes 85\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand Labour 65; Green Party of Aotearoa New Zealand 10; ACT New Zealand 10.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EAmendments not agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022d14b1afe-2069-41e4-96fa-c8dc81a991a4\u0022 data-id=\u002272583320c5304e50a472c689141e8291\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000787\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022d14b1afe-2069-41e4-96fa-c8dc81a991a4\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002272583320c5304e50a472c689141e8291\u0022\u003ECHAIRPERSON (Hon Jenny Salesa)\u003C/span\u003E: The question is that David Seymour\u2019s amendments to adjust tax brackets and remove the 30 and 39 percent brackets set out on Supplementary Order Paper 140 be agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca id=\u00228ce64bf75e6b432ebe2eee3b59569b49\u0022 name=\u0022division\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EA party vote was called for on the question, That the amendments be agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EAyes 10\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EACT New Zealand 10.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENoes 108\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand Labour 65; New Zealand National 33; Green Party of Aotearoa New Zealand 10.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EAmendments not agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022d14b1afe-2069-41e4-96fa-c8dc81a991a4\u0022 data-id=\u0022ed7cdb2f442a4a4c976a4599a88abc71\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000788\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022d14b1afe-2069-41e4-96fa-c8dc81a991a4\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022ed7cdb2f442a4a4c976a4599a88abc71\u0022\u003ECHAIRPERSON (Hon Jenny Salesa)\u003C/span\u003E: The question is that Andrew Bayly\u2019s tabled amendment to adjust tax brackets by the rate of inflation be agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca id=\u00227c73d2b8ab0244f0a3044651ebba5f5c\u0022 name=\u0022division\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EA party vote was called for on the question, That the amendment be agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EAyes 33\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand National 33.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENoes 85\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand Labour 65; Green Party of Aotearoa New Zealand 10; ACT New Zealand 10.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EAmendment not agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022d14b1afe-2069-41e4-96fa-c8dc81a991a4\u0022 data-id=\u0022482776b793bc48c1ab28ae27099c9975\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000789\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022d14b1afe-2069-41e4-96fa-c8dc81a991a4\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022482776b793bc48c1ab28ae27099c9975\u0022\u003ECHAIRPERSON (Hon Jenny Salesa)\u003C/span\u003E: The question is that Andrew Bayly\u2019s tabled amendment to remove the 39 percent tax bracket be agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca id=\u0022f798a3ec8bac45e9a8c271ec201e8a1a\u0022 name=\u0022division\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EA party vote was called for on the question, That the amendment be agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EAyes 43\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand National 33; ACT New Zealand 10.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENoes 75\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand Labour 65; Green Party of Aotearoa New Zealand 10.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EAmendment not agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca id=\u0022c75dcf22387543259fea0b18b5d129d8\u0022 name=\u0022division\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EA party vote was called for on the question, That Part 3 as amended be agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EAyes 67\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand Labour 65; Te Paati M\u0101ori 2.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENoes 43\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand National 33; ACT New Zealand 10.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EAbstentions 10\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EGreen Party of Aotearoa New Zealand 10.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EPart 3 as amended agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000790\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u0022e1474fdc07ae4903b31c62f5d8e4ffb8\u0022\u003EPart 4  Amendments to other enactments\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022d14b1afe-2069-41e4-96fa-c8dc81a991a4\u0022 data-id=\u00225bcf284d01804bdc93c91b9241ab660d\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000791\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022d14b1afe-2069-41e4-96fa-c8dc81a991a4\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00225bcf284d01804bdc93c91b9241ab660d\u0022\u003ECHAIRPERSON (Hon Jenny Salesa)\u003C/span\u003E: Members, we come now to Part 4. This is the debate on clauses 134 to 204 and Schedule 1, amendments to other enactments. The question is that Part 4 stand part.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022859e13f9-33bb-41bb-b2f0-d848eaf25407\u0022 data-id=\u0022fe6d0b052f394c4fb5a070aefab9e99b\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000792\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022859e13f9-33bb-41bb-b2f0-d848eaf25407\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022fe6d0b052f394c4fb5a070aefab9e99b\u0022\u003EANDREW BAYLY (National\u2014Port Waikato):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Madam Chair. Interesting part of the bill, this. There\u2019s three or four areas that we\u2019d like to canvas with the Minister, so appreciably he\u2019s still in the chair.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000793\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022859e13f9-33bb-41bb-b2f0-d848eaf25407\u0022\u003EI think the first one we\u2019re going to pick up on is clause 135, (2) and (3), which is civil penalties in relation to electronic sale suppression tools. And, again, for people listening, this is software that\u2019s designed to falsify, basically, the receipt and how it folds back into the company\u2019s or business\u2019s revenue systems, so it\u2019s a way to minimise tax. So there\u2019s quite a section here that defines that you cannot \u201C\u2026 hide, conceal, modify, falsify, destroy, or prevent the creation of a record that\u2014\u201D the person\u2019s required under a tax law to make or keep. Of course, earlier tonight, we talked about the \u201Cunder $1,000 test\u201D and the \u201Cgreater than $1,000 test\u201D\u2014or \u201Cis, or would be, created by a system that is or includes an electronic point of sale system;\u201D.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000794\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022859e13f9-33bb-41bb-b2f0-d848eaf25407\u0022\u003EAnd, of course, this also, under proposed new section 141EE\u2014there we are, I\u2019m just finding it here, which I thought I had but I can\u2019t. Excuse me, Madam Chair, I\u2019m just trying to find the clause I was looking for. I know what I was going to refer to. So this is obviously quite a significant issue, but my first point to the Minister is: how significant is this? This is obviously something that\u2019s been inserted into his bill. So what\u2019s the IRD been saying about this issue? Is it now becoming increasingly widespread at point of sale? Is it only a point-of-sale issue, or is it something that is now we\u2019re seeing other mechanisms or methodologies to try and undermine the tax system? I think in proposed new section 141EE, if this is a significant issue, why there is only a $5,000 penalty? Where did that come from? Whether that\u2019s changed or not. Depending on the answer to the first one, the first part of that, whether it\u2019s a significant issue or not, whether, in fact, $5,000, which is an all-encompassing fee, is actually appropriate? What consideration was given to whether or not to change that fee? So, very interested just to hear from the Minister on that particular issue.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022f5d71749-ae91-4af7-b2bd-77260398912a\u0022 data-id=\u00225d925341ad814b40a5b70b37b6547c9a\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000795\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f5d71749-ae91-4af7-b2bd-77260398912a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00225d925341ad814b40a5b70b37b6547c9a\u0022\u003EHon DAVID PARKER (Minister of Revenue):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you to the member Andrew Bayly for that question. This was something that I didn\u2019t know was a problem until I became Minister of Revenue, that there is software which, I think, originally originates from overseas but is now being modified for use in New Zealand that enables someone who is collecting GST, effectively, on behalf of the Government, because they\u2019ve got a GST-inclusive sale, to use a computer programme to, effectively, corrupt their own computer records so that when the revenue goes and does an audit of the firm, the computer record appears to show lower receipts and therefore lower GST due. What this change to the law does is to create an offence to use that software and also to supply that software, or to\u2014 \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022d14b1afe-2069-41e4-96fa-c8dc81a991a4\u0022 data-id=\u0022ce27be91bc754d59b8a0655e09566dc2\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000796\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022d14b1afe-2069-41e4-96fa-c8dc81a991a4\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022ce27be91bc754d59b8a0655e09566dc2\u0022\u003ECHAIRPERSON (Hon Jenny Salesa)\u003C/span\u003E: My apologies, Minister. This debate is interrupted. It is time for me to report progress on this bill.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000797\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022d14b1afe-2069-41e4-96fa-c8dc81a991a4\u0022\u003EProgress to be reported.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000798\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022d14b1afe-2069-41e4-96fa-c8dc81a991a4\u0022\u003EHouse resumed.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022d14b1afe-2069-41e4-96fa-c8dc81a991a4\u0022 data-id=\u00226e98d22aa80848d4ad53a1ca263220e3\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000799\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022d14b1afe-2069-41e4-96fa-c8dc81a991a4\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00226e98d22aa80848d4ad53a1ca263220e3\u0022\u003ECHAIRPERSON (Hon Jenny Salesa)\u003C/span\u003E: The committee has considered the Taxation (Annual Rates for 2021-22, GST, and Remedial Matters) Bill and reports progress. I move, That the report be adopted.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca id=\u00221be052c574cc4f74b5afbf645a466c10\u0022 name=\u0022division\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EA party vote was called for on the question, That the report be adopted.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EAyes 77\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand Labour 65; Green Party of Aotearoa New Zealand 10; Te Paati M\u0101ori 2.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENoes 43\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand National 33; ACT New Zealand 10.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EMotion agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000800\u0022\u003EReport adopted.\u003C/p\u003E\n    \u003C/div\u003E\n    \u003Cdiv class=\u0022HpsHansard\u0022\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000801\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsProceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u00222e69c91650ba45ab8e4909c6e8d5baee\u0022\u003EVoting\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000802\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u002233826c5797524f689a41ec4b4833d425\u0022\u003ECorrection\u2014COVID-19 Response (Courts Safety) Legislation Bill\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022a6c42c44-3622-4c9c-98b8-793fb5ec15cc\u0022 data-id=\u0022996aa803b89340a08207959097a139dc\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000803\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a6c42c44-3622-4c9c-98b8-793fb5ec15cc\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022996aa803b89340a08207959097a139dc\u0022\u003EASSISTANT SPEAKER (Ian McKelvie)\u003C/span\u003E: Members, before I adjourn the House\u2014prior to the committee stage, the House considered the instruction to the select committee on the COVID-19 Response (Courts Safety) Legislation Bill. The result of the vote was announced as Ayes 108, Noes 10. The correct result is Ayes 110, Noes 10. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000804\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a6c42c44-3622-4c9c-98b8-793fb5ec15cc\u0022\u003EThe House is now adjourned till 2 p.m. next sitting day.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20220315ce9ab1dcb6194707aeed2b94d9271968000805\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a6c42c44-3622-4c9c-98b8-793fb5ec15cc\u0022\u003EThe House adjourned at 9.58 p.m.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n    \u003C/div\u003E\n  \u003C/body\u003E\n\u003C/html\u003E"