"\u003C!DOCTYPE html\u003E\u003Chtml xmlns:xlink=\u0022http://www.w3.org/1999/xlink\u0022 xmlns:xsi=\u0022http://www.w3.org/2007/XMLSchema-instance\u0022 xmlns:mml=\u0022http://www.w3.org/1998/Math/MathML\u0022\u003E\n  \u003Chead\u003E\n    \u003CMETA http-equiv=\u0022Content-Type\u0022 content=\u0022text/html; charset=utf-16\u0022\u003E\n    \u003Cmeta name=\u0022viewport\u0022 content=\u0022width=device-width, initial-scale=1\u0022\u003E\n  \u003C/head\u003E\n  \u003Cbody style=\u0022font-family:sans-serif; font-size:100%;\u0022\u003E\n    \u003Cdiv class=\u0022HpsHansard\u0022\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000001\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsProceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u0022597538e268214fabaef44ad1840d40f2\u0022\u003EWEDNESDAY, 20 NOVEMBER 2024\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000003\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u002288bceb2fb3a244fb8a264746b18a8e90\u0022\u003EWEDNESDAY, 20 NOVEMBER 2024\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000002\u0022\u003EThe Speaker took the Chair at 2\u00A0p.m.\u003C/p\u003E\n    \u003C/div\u003E\n    \u003Cdiv class=\u0022HpsHansard\u0022\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000004\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsProceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u0022f746dae94fd14f75a9a5bad5d1fec086\u0022\u003EKarakia/Prayers\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000006\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u0022a68d12ea7fd946328b6501fc55afa7f0\u0022\u003EKarakia/Prayers\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00223d42e8cf-544e-415d-892b-f4ef8014d80f\u0022 data-id=\u00229c9315f11a274012b56d0b7e97b5a752\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000005\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d42e8cf-544e-415d-892b-f4ef8014d80f\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00229c9315f11a274012b56d0b7e97b5a752\u0022\u003ETEANAU TUIONO (Assistant Speaker):\u003C/span\u003E E te Atua kaha rawa, ka tuku whakamoemiti atu m\u0101tou, m\u014D ng\u0101 karakia kua waihotia mai ki runga i a m\u0101tou. Ka waiho i \u014D m\u0101tou p\u0101nga whaiaro katoa ki te taha. Ka mihi m\u0101tou ki te K\u012Bngi, me te inoi atu m\u014D te \u0101rahitanga i roto i \u014D m\u0101tou whakaaroarohanga, kia m\u014Dhio ai, kia whakaiti ai t\u0101 m\u0101tou whakahaere i ng\u0101 take o te Whare nei, m\u014D te oranga, te maung\u0101rongo, me te aroha o Aotearoa. \u0100mene.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000007\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d42e8cf-544e-415d-892b-f4ef8014d80f\u0022\u003E[Almighty God, we give thanks for the blessings which have been bestowed on us. Laying aside all personal interests, we acknowledge the King and pray for guidance in our deliberations, that we may conduct the affairs of this House with wisdom and humility for the welfare, peace, and compassion of New Zealand. Amen.]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n    \u003C/div\u003E\n    \u003Cdiv class=\u0022HpsHansard\u0022\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000008\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsProceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u00228bf1e5f62ac3419a9d1b8160cb759b7c\u0022\u003EVisitors\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000009\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u002216b2d08d14224e54b24d6c231613aa19\u0022\u003EMalaysia\u2014Senate of Malaysia\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000010\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u0022fea2e238fc3e4197a72b68ab3b0dba57\u0022\u003ETonga\u2014Parliament of Tonga\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022 data-id=\u00225ee65d4326f9482caf1231310b4ed40e\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000011\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00225ee65d4326f9482caf1231310b4ed40e\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: I\u2019m sure that members would want to join with me in wishing a welcome to the delegation from the Senate of Malaysia who are present in the gallery. I\u2019m sure we would wish to welcome the Hon Dr Mo\u2019ale \u2018Otunuku, member of Parliament from the Parliament of Tonga, who is present in the gallery.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n    \u003C/div\u003E\n    \u003Cdiv class=\u0022HpsHansard\u0022\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000012\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsProceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u0022f35cc1788cb34a839aacd7d99bc483b8\u0022\u003EPETITIONS, PAPERS, SELECT COMMITEE REPORTS, AND INTRODUCTION OF BILLS\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000014\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u0022628240daf8ae46cbbfcb6f5a9d7e07ab\u0022\u003EPETITIONS, PAPERS, SELECT COMMITEE REPORTS, AND INTRODUCTION OF BILLS\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022 data-id=\u00220ec0919bf02d477d86d74574e9c93e32\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000013\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00220ec0919bf02d477d86d74574e9c93e32\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: A petition has been delivered to the Clerk for presentation.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022\u0022 data-id=\u00228f31328d00294ed9a6901ed04f27af61\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000015\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00228f31328d00294ed9a6901ed04f27af61\u0022\u003ECLERK\u003C/span\u003E: Petition of Maringi Te Rangi-Ataahua James requesting that the House stop any work on the Principles of the Treaty of Waitangi Bill and instead work towards entrenching He Whakaputanga o te Rangatiratanga o Nu Tireni and Te Tiriti o Waitangi into our constitution.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022 data-id=\u002213b1fac458044b3fafc2be674e32796a\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000016\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002213b1fac458044b3fafc2be674e32796a\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: That petition stands referred to the Petitions Committee. Ministers have delivered four papers.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022\u0022 data-id=\u0022b0b7c2d63557400383bb6c811dcfe2a7\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000017\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022b0b7c2d63557400383bb6c811dcfe2a7\u0022\u003ECLERK\u003C/span\u003E: \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000018\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022\u0022\u003E2023-24 annual reports for the:\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBItemSL1\u0022\u003EHuman Rights Commission\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBItemSL1\u0022\u003EPredator Free 2050 Ltd\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBItemSL1\u0022\u003ETopu Tonu - Ng\u0101puhi Investment Fund, and\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000019\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022\u0022\u003E2024-25 statement of performance expectations for Tupu Tonu - Ng\u0101puhi Investment Fund.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022 data-id=\u002273186434fc9e4fafa538aa8d91261e16\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000020\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002273186434fc9e4fafa538aa8d91261e16\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Those papers are published under the authority of the House. A select committee report has been delivered for presentation.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022\u0022 data-id=\u002233cbe3a5c0b54f3fa9c2e83902aea7bb\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000021\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002233cbe3a5c0b54f3fa9c2e83902aea7bb\u0022\u003ECLERK\u003C/span\u003E: Report of the Environment Committee on the petition of Greenpeace Aotearoa.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022 data-id=\u00228f288d9978624380b53afc16691c0222\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000022\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00228f288d9978624380b53afc16691c0222\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: No bills have been introduced.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n    \u003C/div\u003E\n    \u003Cdiv class=\u0022HpsHansard\u0022\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000023\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsProceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u002225796e6c59b74fe889a08d06a7e2c4a9\u0022\u003EPersonal Explanations\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000024\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u0022cf1e90cd938d4f39b5f1b7609ce5eb48\u0022\u003EOral Questions\u2014Mistakenly Attributed Quote\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002261725fea-7d5e-4d1f-8fd3-e5779bb7a14d\u0022 data-id=\u002295609bf81edb4f45ad2736205185330b\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000025\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002261725fea-7d5e-4d1f-8fd3-e5779bb7a14d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002295609bf81edb4f45ad2736205185330b\u0022\u003EHon BARBARA EDMONDS (Labour\u2014Mana):\u003C/span\u003E Point of order, Mr Speaker. Thank you, Mr Speaker. I seek leave to correct a statement I made in the House yesterday.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000026\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022122002d1c51840f2a662cffe1a4d3ddb\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Leave is sought for that purpose. Is there any objection? There appears to be none.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000027\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002261725fea-7d5e-4d1f-8fd3-e5779bb7a14d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002213fa20f162f3457ba20252f8bc00a5f6\u0022\u003EHon BARBARA EDMONDS\u003C/span\u003E: Thank you. Yesterday, in a supplementary to question No. 4, I attributed a quote to Mr Chris Quin. I now understand that this was a mistaken attribution and was inaccurate. It should have been attributed to an unnamed investment executive. I apologise to both Mr Quin and the House for this mistake.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000028\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00221af3d78eaa53479b8815a494d153c256\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: I\u2019m sure the House thanks you for that correction.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n    \u003C/div\u003E\n    \u003Cdiv class=\u0022HpsHansard\u0022\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000029\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsProceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u00222684470a896d4ca9aaee702db1e87452\u0022\u003EOral Questions\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000030\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u002216316758279548fea6cf58c67227745d\u0022\u003EQuestions to Ministers\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000031\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u002252904561d37e433790f5523a57de85ae\u0022\u003EQuestion No. 1\u2014Prime Minister\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022 data-id=\u002201637cc478f341e48ac3515b3b14aac8\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000032\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003E1. \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002201637cc478f341e48ac3515b3b14aac8\u0022\u003ERt Hon CHRIS HIPKINS (Leader of the Opposition)\u003C/span\u003E to the Prime Minister: Does he stand by all his Government\u2019s statements and actions? \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022ea31fdd3-90e9-47d7-92a4-20b6a3109eef\u0022 data-id=\u002223988ec37d184e799db8f894d7cd36a9\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000033\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ea31fdd3-90e9-47d7-92a4-20b6a3109eef\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002223988ec37d184e799db8f894d7cd36a9\u0022\u003ERt Hon CHRISTOPHER LUXON (Prime Minister):\u003C/span\u003E Yes, and especially our action to crack down on gang activity. At midnight tonight, a raft of tough new laws will take effect. Gang insignia will be banned in all public places, courts will be able to issue non-consorting orders, and police will be able to stop criminal gang members from associating and communicating. Greater weight will also be given to gang membership at sentencing, enabling courts to impose more severe punishments. Gangs aren\u2019t community groups. They\u2019re not Rotary. They thrive on destroying the lives of other New Zealanders, whether that\u2019s by peddling drugs or through brutal acts of violence that leave communities in fear. We promised to restore law and order, and tomorrow, police will have more powers to do exactly that. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000034\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022014177a6f1794f268e1cd049a0275b5f\u0022\u003ERt Hon Chris Hipkins\u003C/span\u003E: Does he stand by his statement: \u201CCasey Costello is very focused on lowering smoking rates and I\u2019m comfortable\u201D; if so, is he comfortable with the news that both daily smoking and vaping rates have risen under his watch, with 16,000 more daily smokers? \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000035\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ea31fdd3-90e9-47d7-92a4-20b6a3109eef\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022e74eaacd16494329bf6d84fafd54d8fd\u0022\u003ERt Hon CHRISTOPHER LUXON\u003C/span\u003E: Well, I\u2019d just say that the Minister is working incredibly hard to make sure that we deliver on Smokefree 2025, but we know that the last group of smokers to come off daily smoking is going to be incredibly hard to move. But we\u2019ve got a great plan and we\u2019re working hard at it. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000036\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00226fb3e25f4056456aba6d706bb64576bd\u0022\u003ERt Hon Chris Hipkins\u003C/span\u003E: Does he stand by his statement that he and Casey Costello will \u201Cdeal with that really hard-core group of smokers as we try and get that target down to 5\u00A0percent. All she\u2019s done is propose alternatives\u201D; if so, are efforts to target that hard-core group by proposing so-called alternatives working? \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000037\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ea31fdd3-90e9-47d7-92a4-20b6a3109eef\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00220d845c9e61f94097bbb3ade62408e996\u0022\u003ERt Hon CHRISTOPHER LUXON\u003C/span\u003E: Well, what I\u2019d say to the member is we\u2019re very focused on four attempts as we try and deal with this last, hard-core group of smokers. That involves us increasing quit attempts, it means we\u2019re improving access to quit support, it means that we\u2019re supporting people to stay smoke-free, and we\u2019re going to reduce the uptake of smoking. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000038\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022f6ea3c78ffeb4f3694e1cc8601031aa6\u0022\u003ERt Hon Chris Hipkins\u003C/span\u003E: What is the return on investment on the $216\u00A0million tax break to tobacco companies his Government has given, apparently to encourage smokers to quit, when it has demonstrably failed, with the first rise in daily smokers in New Zealand\u2019s recent history? \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000039\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ea31fdd3-90e9-47d7-92a4-20b6a3109eef\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002295a14860b6b54cb4be86d19157b7665f\u0022\u003ERt Hon CHRISTOPHER LUXON\u003C/span\u003E: Well, again, the member has difficulty understanding economics, and that was clearly obvious by the economic mess that he left behind after six years in Government. What we have accrued, as you know, is an accounting accrual, essentially, for a loss of excise tax, should we be super successful in taking people off cigarettes and into alternatives. That\u2019s a good thing. We\u2019re just making sure that we are fiscally prudent and managing the economy well\u2014as we do\u2014instead of the mess that you left behind. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000040\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022461880f1eea34226ae88f960e2acf993\u0022\u003ERt Hon Winston Peters\u003C/span\u003E: How difficult is it, Prime Minister, for someone to work out that if the last calculation accurately at the time was $6\u00A0million, it could never get to $216\u00A0million in the next day in the way that that last question was phrased, and, second, that we are in the best three performers in the world because of legislation that was written by New Zealand First and not the Labour Party? \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000041\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ea31fdd3-90e9-47d7-92a4-20b6a3109eef\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002268ba5cb41c414195892e112c386d70fd\u0022\u003ERt Hon CHRISTOPHER LUXON\u003C/span\u003E: Well, I would just pick up on that point that the member raises, which is that when you look at comparable smoking rates from around the world, the UK sits at 11.9\u00A0percent, the US at 11.6\u00A0percent, Canada at 8.3\u00A0percent, Australia at 8.3\u00A0percent, and we\u2019re at 6.9\u00A0percent. We\u2019re making good progress. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000042\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00225315dc506c8f4ad59d012ca2d83510d2\u0022\u003ERt Hon Chris Hipkins\u003C/span\u003E: So is he asserting that the fact that more people are smoking now than when he became Prime Minister, and the Government is, therefore, collecting more tax from that, is a sign of success? \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000043\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ea31fdd3-90e9-47d7-92a4-20b6a3109eef\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022aad88a65d6de4bf4b95b8389f8815c42\u0022\u003ERt Hon CHRISTOPHER LUXON\u003C/span\u003E: No. What we\u2019re saying is that we have more work to do with a very strong cohort of daily smokers. We need to redouble our efforts and work even harder. It\u2019s a harder task, but we\u2019re doing everything we can to do that. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000044\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00221c4b53d5e23e4417ad98ae8efe68d563\u0022\u003ERt Hon Chris Hipkins\u003C/span\u003E: Will he admit that he was wrong to submit to New Zealand First and scrap New Zealand\u2019s world-leading smoke-free legislation, just as he was wrong to submit to the ACT Party and support the Treaty principles bill? \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000045\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ea31fdd3-90e9-47d7-92a4-20b6a3109eef\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00226c55f9a0f9254fb0b36e5ece7913956d\u0022\u003ERt Hon CHRISTOPHER LUXON\u003C/span\u003E: I reject the characterisation of that question. I\u2019m proud of our coalition partners and I\u2019m proud of the work that this coalition Government is doing to clean up the ungodly mess that that member left behind after six years of economic mismanagement, letting crime get out of control, and delivering worse outcomes for New Zealanders. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000046\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022021ce6eb4ae443b6884ae84188af0e4c\u0022\u003ERt Hon Chris Hipkins\u003C/span\u003E: What does it say about his negotiating skills or, indeed, his priorities that he is willing to provoke conflict between the Crown and M\u0101ori and increase the number of Kiwi smokers just to form a coalition with parties who had nowhere else to go anyway? \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000047\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ea31fdd3-90e9-47d7-92a4-20b6a3109eef\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a525455fd92e4e4586f18fe91add247e\u0022\u003ERt Hon CHRISTOPHER LUXON\u003C/span\u003E: I reject the characterisation of that question. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000048\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u0022a2ca6bc597574e5ca3b91af0bde5a20f\u0022\u003EQuestion No. 2\u2014Children\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00227a31ee40-34c3-42b0-9459-7a7e9c815d6a\u0022 data-id=\u00229bb016b2bf5545e7887fecd14e1891c8\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000049\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227a31ee40-34c3-42b0-9459-7a7e9c815d6a\u0022\u003E2. \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00229bb016b2bf5545e7887fecd14e1891c8\u0022\u003EKAHURANGI CARTER (Green)\u003C/span\u003E to the Minister for Children: Will she commit to retaining strategic partnerships with iwi and M\u0101ori organisations, as recommended in the select committee report on the repeal of section 7AA; if not, why not?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002286ae9a20-33bd-4912-8dc1-5b4eb670be44\u0022 data-id=\u00220ea03a087ade4c89aa776829102d202d\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000050\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002286ae9a20-33bd-4912-8dc1-5b4eb670be44\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00220ea03a087ade4c89aa776829102d202d\u0022\u003EHon KAREN CHHOUR (Minister for Children):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Mr Speaker. The repeal of section\u00A07AA is about ensuring the safety and wellbeing of children in care is at the forefront of all decision making. I\u2019ve always said that strategic partnerships should continue, and I\u2019ve made my expectations clear to officials that they should continue the good work that is being done in this space, if the agreement is working in a positive way to the betterment of children. I also made it very clear in my first reading speech that nothing in this bill prevents Oranga Tamariki from retaining its current strategic partnerships or from entering new partnerships with iwi, hap\u016B, and M\u0101ori organisations. In regards to specific recommendations in the select committee report, I want to thank those who made submissions and those who appeared before the committee in person, and I also want to thank the select committee for their careful deliberation and consideration on the bill. I will consider the recommendations and take advice before making any decisions on next steps. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000051\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227a31ee40-34c3-42b0-9459-7a7e9c815d6a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002206ab648c97c743efab8b92a00d0a27e4\u0022\u003EKahurangi Carter\u003C/span\u003E: Why does she not recognise the value of reporting on outcomes and disparities for tamariki M\u0101ori, given she has now recognised the need for strategic partnerships?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000052\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002286ae9a20-33bd-4912-8dc1-5b4eb670be44\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002212facf93dc214a11802dd815d6b2d8c8\u0022\u003EHon KAREN CHHOUR\u003C/span\u003E: In regards to reporting, we have a number of ways that can be reported on issues in that space. We have a report from the Independent Children\u2019s Monitor in this space, we have the National Care Standards report that reports on outcomes for M\u0101ori and young people and their wh\u0101nau, we have an annual Oranga Tamariki report that reports in this space, and under section\u00A0448B of the Oranga Tamariki Act, the Minister for Children is required to report on whether the legislation and Government policy meets the needs of children and young people.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000053\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227a31ee40-34c3-42b0-9459-7a7e9c815d6a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00220a5a898ca72a46fabb4a67e9dcd0432c\u0022\u003EKahurangi Carter\u003C/span\u003E: So does she believe that requiring the chief executive of Oranga Tamariki to consider and report on outcomes for M\u0101ori limits the ability to serve tamariki M\u0101ori, and, if not, would she also reconsider retaining this 7AA requirement? \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000054\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002286ae9a20-33bd-4912-8dc1-5b4eb670be44\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022bd04974a4ca9426eaf77dd9c88125f64\u0022\u003EHon KAREN CHHOUR\u003C/span\u003E: In regards to the first part of the question, what I think is important for the CE of Oranga Tamariki to concentrate on is making sure that the children that come into the care of Oranga Tamariki are safe, healthy, and loved.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000055\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227a31ee40-34c3-42b0-9459-7a7e9c815d6a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022fab19c7da4ff4844b6ca38902297c4f2\u0022\u003EKahurangi Carter\u003C/span\u003E: Will she commit to reconsidering other aspects of this repeal to better reflect select committee evidence, Whanaketia, and Waitangi Tribunal findings that tino rangatiratanga over k\u0101inga and protection and active partnership must be enshrined in care, and, if not, why not?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000056\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002286ae9a20-33bd-4912-8dc1-5b4eb670be44\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00225ca139234a91431ea398086c92abf5d5\u0022\u003EHon KAREN CHHOUR\u003C/span\u003E: When it comes to M\u0101ori children in care, I can tell you: M\u0101ori children are no different to any other child. They want to feel safe, they want to feel loved, and they want to feel like they belong. And they want to know that when they wake up tomorrow, they\u2019re going to be safe.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000057\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227a31ee40-34c3-42b0-9459-7a7e9c815d6a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00223e20b985572348baaafac4b0682d5bae\u0022\u003EKahurangi Carter\u003C/span\u003E: Does she accept Dr Luke Fitzmaurice\u2019s select committee submission argument that \u201CThere is no clash between tikanga and safety \u2026 In reality, the two are intertwined.\u201D, and, if so, how can she go ahead with repealing any aspect of 7AA?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000058\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002286ae9a20-33bd-4912-8dc1-5b4eb670be44\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022111c875fca1148c2b692a4ffd5d84a78\u0022\u003EHon KAREN CHHOUR\u003C/span\u003E: No, I don\u2019t disagree, and I\u2019ve never said that the two clash. What I have said is that the safety and wellbeing of children must be first and foremost when we\u2019re making decisions about all children in care. Every child deserves to feel safe and loved.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000059\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227a31ee40-34c3-42b0-9459-7a7e9c815d6a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00224a1df75222604daca8bbb996fd547a6d\u0022\u003EKahurangi Carter\u003C/span\u003E: Will she admit, now select committee has reported back, that it was a mistake to introduce a bill that would fully repeal section 7AA of the Oranga Tamariki Act, and, if not, why not?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000060\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002286ae9a20-33bd-4912-8dc1-5b4eb670be44\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022c9eeb6614da14911977f3a9eed9a9931\u0022\u003EHon KAREN CHHOUR\u003C/span\u003E: As I\u2019ve said, I will consider the recommendations and take advice before making any decisions in the next step. But, no, I stand by my decision, because I\u2019m proud of the fact that we are redirecting Oranga Tamariki back to their core purpose, which is the safety and wellbeing of children.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000061\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u00224a5aa7b1023f4bd184a5c22a46996eaa\u0022\u003EQuestion No. 3\u2014Finance\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002261725fea-7d5e-4d1f-8fd3-e5779bb7a14d\u0022 data-id=\u0022bb5ebee4f1f24e6d8223ac92bd2342cd\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000062\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002261725fea-7d5e-4d1f-8fd3-e5779bb7a14d\u0022\u003E3. \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022bb5ebee4f1f24e6d8223ac92bd2342cd\u0022\u003EHon BARBARA EDMONDS (Labour\u2014Mana)\u003C/span\u003E to the Acting Minister of Finance: Does she stand by her statement, \u201Cwe had set a very clear plan that it will allow the books to return to an OBEGAL surplus in 2027/28\u201D; if so, is she committed to reaching an OBEGAL surplus no matter the cost?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002257e41e9d-285b-4fb3-847d-a63820ae7137\u0022 data-id=\u0022e6d1462006fa4821b502e67571b5eb44\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000063\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002257e41e9d-285b-4fb3-847d-a63820ae7137\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022e6d1462006fa4821b502e67571b5eb44\u0022\u003EHon CHRIS BISHOP (Acting Minister of Finance):\u003C/span\u003E On behalf of the Minister of Finance, I stand by my full statement, which was, \u201Cwe had set a very clear plan that it will allow the books to return to an OBEGAL surplus in 2027-28. If we had stuck to the spending plans of the last Government, that date would have been pushed out until 2031, an unacceptable outcome.\u201D In answer to the second part of the question, no.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000064\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002261725fea-7d5e-4d1f-8fd3-e5779bb7a14d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022dabaccee68c0430aa56afb871402941b\u0022\u003EHon Barbara Edmonds\u003C/span\u003E: Is the chief economist of Treasury correct when he said, in order to reach that goal, that the \u201Cimplied speed and size of this decline is generally unprecedented in recent history in New Zealand.\u201D?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000065\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002257e41e9d-285b-4fb3-847d-a63820ae7137\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022c9e7ea80b11b42f480883fa4bc9d2706\u0022\u003EHon CHRIS BISHOP\u003C/span\u003E: On behalf of the Minister of Finance, as the fiscal strategy report in Budget 2024 makes clear, the Government is not going to be a slave to a surplus target. It is correct that over the last few years each update to the economic forecast has involved a deterioration in the outlook, which then flows through into the fiscal forecast. The member will have to wait and see what happens in the half-year update. I\u2019m also advised that the person that the member just quotes, the Chief Economic Adviser of Treasury, is giving a speech tomorrow which gives the background to some of the forecast revisions, and in particular the role of Treasury\u2019s assumptions about underlying productivity trends. I know the member will be reading it.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000066\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002261725fea-7d5e-4d1f-8fd3-e5779bb7a14d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00227978bb019ee54acf8e4e32afe25b7f5f\u0022\u003EHon Barbara Edmonds\u003C/span\u003E: Does she plan to shift more services to user-pays to help reach surplus?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000067\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002257e41e9d-285b-4fb3-847d-a63820ae7137\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022112756e00ea2401289c7daf7f92c58e3\u0022\u003EHon CHRIS BISHOP\u003C/span\u003E: On behalf of the Minister of Finance, I\u2019m not ruling out revenue measures like user-pays. The Government, as a general rule, believes that people who benefit from services should pay for them. For example, we have outlined a programme of work around toll roads, which the member will be well familiar with, all of which is designed to align the beneficiaries of infrastructure investment paying for it. That is one example of user-pays: toll roads.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000068\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002261725fea-7d5e-4d1f-8fd3-e5779bb7a14d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022794d2f97ff20497091f7418108e7e615\u0022\u003EHon Barbara Edmonds\u003C/span\u003E: Would shifting publicly run services like education or health to the private sector help her reach a surplus?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000069\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002257e41e9d-285b-4fb3-847d-a63820ae7137\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00227dd5a5348b454592a4d16a48f067940b\u0022\u003EHon CHRIS BISHOP\u003C/span\u003E: Well, on behalf of the Minister of Finance, I reject the assumption behind the member\u2019s question. The Government has a public health service and a public education service. We are focused on driving better performance and delivery out of those two very significant items of State spending. The Ministry of Education is extremely focused on our education system actually (a) getting kids to attend school, and (b) making sure when they\u2019re there they learn how to read and write, unlike the focus of the last Government. The man sitting next to me is very focused on delivering better value for money out of the health system.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000070\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002261725fea-7d5e-4d1f-8fd3-e5779bb7a14d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002276a748414bf04f91b472de61a72d1980\u0022\u003EHon Barbara Edmonds\u003C/span\u003E: Will she guarantee no reduction in front-line services to reach surplus?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000071\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002257e41e9d-285b-4fb3-847d-a63820ae7137\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022ec5638756e48488081668f0aa4afc53d\u0022\u003EHon CHRIS BISHOP\u003C/span\u003E: On behalf of the Minister of Finance, the driving focus of this Government\u2019s fiscal reprioritisation so far has been to make sure that services flow not to the back office but to the front line.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000072\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u00227a7e02723c2044a1a512b93666113ce5\u0022\u003EQuestion No. 4\u2014Finance\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022094b0ff4-e404-451b-b4a9-ad12bd4dee56\u0022 data-id=\u002272a9bf58a057432d9c4d2274129b811b\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000073\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022094b0ff4-e404-451b-b4a9-ad12bd4dee56\u0022\u003E4. \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002272a9bf58a057432d9c4d2274129b811b\u0022\u003ESTUART SMITH (National\u2014Kaik\u014Dura)\u003C/span\u003E to the Acting Minister of Finance: What information has she recently released to improve agencies\u2019 accountability for Government investments?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000074\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a9a0b216b733486d83c66000043a6dd6\u0022\u003EHon Member\u003C/span\u003E: Wake up.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000075\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002257e41e9d-285b-4fb3-847d-a63820ae7137\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022cbc0b8bb573044408c277929dbd1b711\u0022\u003EHon Chris Bishop\u003C/span\u003E: My apologies.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000076\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002299541458116a4dceb4010482e8dd798c\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: The Hon\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000077\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002257e41e9d-285b-4fb3-847d-a63820ae7137\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022ea5bd4f67b77479c8c4b1b3b2d75d293\u0022\u003EHon Chris Bishop\u003C/span\u003E: I\u2019m not used to being so high up the batting order.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000078\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022c51eec1411f94298ba72da80d9a42416\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: That\u2019s good. Just wait till you\u2019re called. We waited for you; you\u2019ll wait for me to call you. The Hon Chris Bishop.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002257e41e9d-285b-4fb3-847d-a63820ae7137\u0022 data-id=\u002203b9e33286c5466bb8b45f8dd606490e\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000079\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002257e41e9d-285b-4fb3-847d-a63820ae7137\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002203b9e33286c5466bb8b45f8dd606490e\u0022\u003EHon CHRIS BISHOP (Acting Minister of Finance):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Mr Speaker. On behalf of the Minister of Finance, this morning I released the September Quarterly Investment Report (QIR), which outlines key information on large central government investments. The Quarterly Investment Report is a key mechanism for the Government to intervene to ensure projects are on track. It\u2019s also a tool for the public to hold agencies in the Government to account for investment performance. It\u2019s the second QIR we\u2019ve released publicly. The first was in August, and we\u2019re going to continue to publish these reports to provide the transparency that taxpayers deserve out of the investment that the Crown is making.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000080\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022094b0ff4-e404-451b-b4a9-ad12bd4dee56\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00227bf3cafcafaf44d6be69d57320a4265c\u0022\u003EStuart Smith\u003C/span\u003E: What does the latest Quarterly Investment Report show?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000081\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002257e41e9d-285b-4fb3-847d-a63820ae7137\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002238f39cd574fd488581da7a0366bf2316\u0022\u003EHon CHRIS BISHOP\u003C/span\u003E: On behalf of the Minister of Finance, the latest QIR shows the significant investment activity across the pipeline. There\u2019s 198 investments in delivery with a combined budget of $85.7 billion, and 176 investments in planning worth close to $80 billion. I do want to say, though, that the data also shows there are still issues with the quality and completeness of data reported by Government agencies. It\u2019s not good enough. Good data is critical for good decision making. We are a Government that is focused on better long-term planning, more fulsome reporting, and stronger monitoring. We will be demanding, as a Government, better information from central government agencies to allow Cabinet to make better decisions.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000082\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022094b0ff4-e404-451b-b4a9-ad12bd4dee56\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00228b8b4b976a2f4083bf5a67e6d711dfa8\u0022\u003EStuart Smith\u003C/span\u003E: How will quarterly investment reporting hold agencies to account?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000083\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002257e41e9d-285b-4fb3-847d-a63820ae7137\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022f667fca0edcc40128c120f91d2f71ade\u0022\u003EHon CHRIS BISHOP\u003C/span\u003E: On behalf of the Minister of Finance, today\u2019s release includes chief executive attestations. These are a formal signal as to whether or not agencies\u2019 investment practices meet Cabinet rules. It\u2019s really important that we learn what Government agencies are following Cabinet rules and what Government agencies are not. One example, to pick up some data from the report, is asset management. It is true to say that agencies and, by extension, decision makers do not know enough about the condition or age of the Crown\u2019s assets and plans to maintain them. This is something the Government is extremely focused on and doing a lot of work on. Asset management and asset maintenance have been something that has been underdone by central government for too long.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000084\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022094b0ff4-e404-451b-b4a9-ad12bd4dee56\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022ff3d5f6bee924df9af5aa50cef83b162\u0022\u003EStuart Smith\u003C/span\u003E: How are central government projects tracking for on-time and on-budget delivery?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000085\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002257e41e9d-285b-4fb3-847d-a63820ae7137\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022cb3b60fbb95e45a59d0e7fa972439914\u0022\u003EHon CHRIS BISHOP\u003C/span\u003E: Well, on behalf of the Minister of Finance, we all want on-time and on-budget projects. The latest data shows that 83\u00A0percent of investments are on budget and there\u2019s still $2 billion of cost escalation, and the September QIR shows that 87\u00A0percent of investments are tracking to their currently approved time frames, but only 54\u00A0percent are tracking to their original time lines. There\u2019s a long history of grand pronouncements, including by the previous Government, where projects are meant to be delivered by a certain date but then exceed those. It is true to say that we need to do a better job across the Government around this. We have work under way to improve project cost and time lines. This is business as usual, good standard investment practice. We are fixing the foundations of our infrastructure investment system.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000086\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022e893077e83914564ac15625813bf609f\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Franco Hernandez.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000087\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022fe342415-6351-4072-a17e-19dab2ef184d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022fc91ae0ab1d64e1182386beba9de4860\u0022\u003EFrancisco Hernandez\u003C/span\u003E: Francisco Hernandez, Mr Speaker. Thank you, Mr Speaker. Does she also intend to hold Ministers accountable for Government investments; if so, will she hold herself accountable for making slash-and-burn cuts to critical public services that we rely on, like the Dunedin Hospital rebuild, while she\u2019s giving billions of dollars of tax giveaways to landlords and hundreds of millions of tax cuts to tobacco companies?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000088\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002257e41e9d-285b-4fb3-847d-a63820ae7137\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00223e28a69243914ba787eacb2db1f04389\u0022\u003EHon CHRIS BISHOP\u003C/span\u003E: On behalf of the Minister of Finance, there\u2019s any number of factual inaccuracies in that question. Firstly, the Government is not slashing and burning. Secondly, in relation to the Dunedin Hospital, the member seems to have missed the fact that, in March, the Government committed an extra $290\u00A0million to the project, bringing the total appropriated amount for the new Dunedin Hospital project to $1.88 billion. In fact, the member highlights exactly why the Government is focused on the Quarterly Investment Reports and rebuilding the foundations of our infrastructure investment system. The Dunedin Hospital project, as has been publicly now released, was subject to no less than four gateway reviews under the previous Government; the last three of which highlighted it as a red-amber project. To put that into vernacular, a red gateway project means that it is at significant risk of critical non-delivery. The last Government received all of those gateway reports and did precisely nothing about it. We have now inherited a situation\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000089\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002229c388fa905c4d8483dd3f782f3d69ae\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Yup, that\u2019s good. [Interruption] That\u2019s enough. [Interruption] That\u2019s enough! Ministers need to keep their answers relatively concise. There\u2019s a trend to get very long answers. I look at the seconds being taken up in answers and they are progressively getting longer, which is not\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000090\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002271442f1569154ef3950d9454cc2d3ef1\u0022\u003ERt Hon Chris Hipkins\u003C/span\u003E: And preferably, keep them true.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000091\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00225eb336afb0b54b1397ec34eea36b26ec\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: When I\u2019m talking, no one else is. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000092\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022fe342415-6351-4072-a17e-19dab2ef184d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022e617b922e8284e709bfdadc824a77b57\u0022\u003EFrancisco Hernandez\u003C/span\u003E: Is the reason why the Minister is ranting instead of answering the question because she\u2019s afraid to hold Ministers to account because she knows that her directive to prioritise needs not race, and slash-and-burn cuts to the Public Service will lead to underinvestment in M\u0101ori health, education, and wellbeing?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000093\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a764bc6d44e94bbfb5f7b12ded235454\u0022\u003ERt Hon Winston Peters\u003C/span\u003E: Point of order. That question cannot be allowed to stand. You cannot get up and make a lot of baseless allegations without any evidence at all, and I don\u2019t care whether you\u2019ve got any experience; we\u2019re going to have standards in this House. [Interruption]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000094\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00223d327481e94042828c998af3146f04a1\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: I\u2019m pleased that everyone else has got an opinion. Keep them to yourself. Would the member like to rephrase his question. Bring it into order.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000095\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022fe342415-6351-4072-a17e-19dab2ef184d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022bbf2705d4278427f8533aae205185497\u0022\u003EFrancisco Hernandez\u003C/span\u003E: Absolutely. Thank you, Mr Speaker. Is the Minister afraid of holding Ministers to account\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000096\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002235464e377d544c50bf42bc6525b88930\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: No, you can\u2019t do that. You\u2019re out. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000097\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022fe342415-6351-4072-a17e-19dab2ef184d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a500c984e9a045b78067e24dc8019eae\u0022\u003EFrancisco Hernandez\u003C/span\u003E: Is the Minister\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000098\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00223798c7f8221942d6b59003018e8d5e45\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Sorry. No, you just lost it. You can\u2019t make a statement like that.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000099\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u0022375ba4a7a9d144a3b8c82be9c894dc22\u0022\u003EQuestion No. 5\u2014Education\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00229eef65cd-ce82-441c-af1b-954ea0782a04\u0022 data-id=\u0022e1ac6b6f71a34d688ff0362347bcedba\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000100\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00229eef65cd-ce82-441c-af1b-954ea0782a04\u0022\u003E5. \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022e1ac6b6f71a34d688ff0362347bcedba\u0022\u003EHon JAN TINETTI (Labour)\u003C/span\u003E to the Minister of Education: Does she agree with National MP Erica Stanford, who, in May 2023, said, \u201CThe public and school bus systems are failing us. Every day buses are cancelled leaving people stranded. Kids are being left behind when trying to get to school\u201D; if so, why are school bus routes to close up and down the country?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022275c91f8-c6b8-42fd-b3ab-d8fc000dd41f\u0022 data-id=\u00224c4160f95672415a8bd48f1816ee39ef\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000101\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022275c91f8-c6b8-42fd-b3ab-d8fc000dd41f\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00224c4160f95672415a8bd48f1816ee39ef\u0022\u003EHon ERICA STANFORD (Minister of Education):\u003C/span\u003E As the member knows, I made that comment as the local member of Parliament for East Coast Bays in relation to a public meeting that I held in my electorate when a shortage of bus drivers was impacting Auckland Transport, both public bus and public school bus routes. The quotation is directly in relation to the provision of public transport for children. To the second part, Auckland Transport does not operate up and down the country; public buses and public school buses do\u2014however, I do not have ministerial responsibility for those.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000102\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00229eef65cd-ce82-441c-af1b-954ea0782a04\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022b717e0b00c104f64a54bf1d159dd72a2\u0022\u003EHon Jan Tinetti\u003C/span\u003E: Does she agree with Claudia Heaps, a Hawke\u2019s Bay mother, who said that \u201CI can\u2019t believe they would make something as basic as getting to school a challenge for kids, especially in the light of talking about improving attendance records.\u201D; if not, why not?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000103\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022275c91f8-c6b8-42fd-b3ab-d8fc000dd41f\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022fe69a824f42e4012901fbc75c550abed\u0022\u003EHon ERICA STANFORD\u003C/span\u003E: I would say to that mother and all parents across the motu that these decisions are operational. The policy has not changed and if a child is eligible for the ministry\u2019s transport assistance, they will get it. The only time that a ministry-operated bus route will close is because a public bus has been established, the number of students has dropped below eight\u2014where, then, we pay members of that family a conveyancing allowance\u2014or if a route was merged with another route.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000104\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00223319d094aa6840e3a5a712e8275428b0\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Question number six\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000105\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00229eef65cd-ce82-441c-af1b-954ea0782a04\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00229988bf56612946858073fbee31532d79\u0022\u003EHon Jan Tinetti\u003C/span\u003E: Supplementary.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000106\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00227b0e5e1410e74e72a6591c0de52d3116\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Oh, sorry, apologies. My sincere apologies.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000107\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00229eef65cd-ce82-441c-af1b-954ea0782a04\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022d3b9ff702e4c4feea12b798b1b7b1f29\u0022\u003EHon Jan Tinetti\u003C/span\u003E: Does she agree with Rural Women New Zealand president Gill Naylor, who said, \u201CIn rural areas, there\u2019s no public transport options, there\u2019s no footpaths or cycleways, our roads are not safe for kids to be biking to school.\u201D, and, if so, why is she allowing rural school bus routes to close?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000108\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022275c91f8-c6b8-42fd-b3ab-d8fc000dd41f\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002247bb8f343309448bbdf5640df9959143\u0022\u003EHon ERICA STANFORD\u003C/span\u003E: I would say to that person the same answer I gave to the person in the second question.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000109\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00229eef65cd-ce82-441c-af1b-954ea0782a04\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022ac282be8a704403b9582cb8017d80108\u0022\u003EHon Jan Tinetti\u003C/span\u003E: What options are there for schools who have had their school bus routes cancelled and now have students stranded at home and unable to learn?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000110\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022275c91f8-c6b8-42fd-b3ab-d8fc000dd41f\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002244ae487fcd864265879d99548ab279df\u0022\u003EHon ERICA STANFORD\u003C/span\u003E: As I said in my second question, if a route is stopped it is for those reasons, and what we do when the numbers of children drop below eight is we pay families a conveyancing allowance to help them get their children to school.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000111\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00229eef65cd-ce82-441c-af1b-954ea0782a04\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022627ad2cc8b474b08927938b19383b057\u0022\u003EHon Jan Tinetti\u003C/span\u003E: Why is the Minister not taking any steps to protect rural school bus routes and is allowing them to be cancelled on her watch?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000112\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022275c91f8-c6b8-42fd-b3ab-d8fc000dd41f\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00225c54b7674e2a479daa1149b7d62a1f86\u0022\u003EHon ERICA STANFORD\u003C/span\u003E: We are taking responsibility and that\u2019s why in February of this year I\u2019ve instigated a work programme to make sure that bus services for eligible students are fair and equitable across the country, and that work programme is under way. I would also like to point out that the member who asked the question had six years to sort it out and did nothing.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000113\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002255d0b7a4-a2c9-4c38-9b77-475311a48a89\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00227a2a4586a273415a89690eee1550f049\u0022\u003EHon Simeon Brown\u003C/span\u003E: What reports has she seen on Auckland\u2019s public transport network becoming more convenient for students?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000114\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022275c91f8-c6b8-42fd-b3ab-d8fc000dd41f\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00228e05e33fafd044ff9518ed8869073efb\u0022\u003EHon ERICA STANFORD\u003C/span\u003E: In relation to the primary question, I\u2019ve seen great news for students in Auckland who take the bus, train, and ferries to get to and from school. This week marks the first week that students in Auckland have more ways to pay on Auckland\u2019s public transport network; in addition to HOP cards, students can now tag on and off using contactless debit cards as well as Apple Pay, Google Pay, and their smartphones and smartwatches. [Interruption]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000115\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a7e0822c745d4e7ea8c745cb716bb70e\u0022\u003ERt Hon Winston Peters\u003C/span\u003E: Point of order.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000116\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002211a827c633634d4093b3e9ab770df046\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: I was too polite to cancel that question, but I should have. The primary question was essentially about rural bus transports\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000117\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f96cdca1-b63c-4602-b2b3-276f58ebb518\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00227a11d28cea1f4629be29e9b3f13353a3\u0022\u003EHon Chris Penk\u003C/span\u003E: Point of order, Mr Speaker.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000118\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022843f5d479dd34f078d77e825fd4b9091\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: No, you can\u2019t take one, there\u2019s a queue of them, all right?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000119\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f96cdca1-b63c-4602-b2b3-276f58ebb518\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002237fcd5b30c734802b2900591331ab1c0\u0022\u003EHon Chris Penk\u003C/span\u003E: I\u2019ll get in line.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000120\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002228d19e06e51342e8ac69328fca5c8850\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Yeah. Well, certainly the answers have been up to that point. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000121\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a5f3a11e9188470a827e6d1e051f8d6b\u0022\u003ERt Hon Winston Peters\u003C/span\u003E: My point of order is that when the Minister was trying to answer, fully seven people over there were shouting\u2014not separately, all together at the same time. I don\u2019t know how they heard each other, let alone heard the Minister, but we couldn\u2019t hear her.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000122\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002231ce2237299840269120469c120dd68a\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Yep, that is an ongoing problem, and I mentioned that yesterday.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000123\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f96cdca1-b63c-4602-b2b3-276f58ebb518\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022de100a355170422fa676033cf4d3e44f\u0022\u003EHon Chris Penk\u003C/span\u003E: Thank you, sir, point of order. Large swathes of the Auckland region are in fact rural in nature, for example, the former Rodney District and the former Franklin District.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000124\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022c7265a75dfc24be4ad72ba4bee52e900\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Right, well, thank you very much. You must flick that through to Wikipedia so I can find out myself later on.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000125\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u00226074beaeb927453baf25c48abdc32961\u0022\u003EQuestion No. 6\u2014Regulation\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022b2672720-3dfe-421a-af8c-20f00d44da3d\u0022 data-id=\u0022bc7497f08f45441ea5b6d5b567050129\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000126\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b2672720-3dfe-421a-af8c-20f00d44da3d\u0022\u003E6. \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022bc7497f08f45441ea5b6d5b567050129\u0022\u003ETODD STEPHENSON (ACT)\u003C/span\u003E to the Minister for Regulation: What recent announcements has he made?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022 data-id=\u002206461d95ecef40e18968619e1f887a9f\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000127\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002206461d95ecef40e18968619e1f887a9f\u0022\u003EHon DAVID SEYMOUR (Minister for Regulation):\u003C/span\u003E With great pleasure I\u2019d like to inform the House that yesterday I announced the next steps in the Government\u2019s plan to improve the quality of regulation by opening consultation on the proposed regulatory standards bill. To lift productivity and wages, the Government\u2019s agreement is to include a commitment to pass the regulatory standards bill. This bill has four components: a set of principles for responsible regulation, a mechanism to ensure regulations are consistent with the principles, justified departure from the principles, and a recourse to enable New Zealanders to seek an independent assessment when a regulation does not meet the principles and statutory powers for the ministry. Consultation on the proposed regulatory standards bill is open until Monday, 13\u00A0January 2025.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000128\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b2672720-3dfe-421a-af8c-20f00d44da3d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022c8a1f79e8cb54a438362af7b1c97d66c\u0022\u003ETodd Stephenson\u003C/span\u003E: What are the principles of responsible regulation?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000129\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022712e4e2b6c464184a54dd5c6c1d56ea1\u0022\u003EHon DAVID SEYMOUR\u003C/span\u003E: The principles fall into three categories. The first is the principle relating to the design and content of legislation, such as the importance of the rule of law and that fair compensation should be paid for the taking or impairment of private property. Second is the principle of good lawmaking, such as ensuring regulation should produce benefits that exceed the cost of imposing that regulation. The third is the principle relating to regulatory stewardship, such as eliminating regulatory burden and compliance costs and ensuring that regulatory systems are fit for purpose.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000130\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b2672720-3dfe-421a-af8c-20f00d44da3d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00221ec38a43ca61405286c1407453a2ec1f\u0022\u003ETodd Stephenson\u003C/span\u003E: How will the regulatory standards bill improve the quality of new regulations?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000131\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002223eeaaa2b31046669000c08cec91fc97\u0022\u003EHon DAVID SEYMOUR\u003C/span\u003E: The regulatory standards bill is fundamentally an exercise in transparency. There\u2019s nothing in the bill that requires the regulator to follow the principles of regulation. However, it does require regulators to consider the principles and publicly justify why they shouldn\u2019t apply to any particular rule that they\u2019re imposing upon New Zealanders. If we raise the political cost of making bad laws by allowing New Zealanders to hold politicians and regulators accountable, the outcome will be better lawmaking, higher productivity, and better wages for all New Zealanders.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000132\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u00227c20887c32ba4cc4a358ccdc0aca2fc4\u0022\u003EQuestion No. 7\u2014Justice\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00228ba11b3f-65ea-4f86-92e4-fe78ea522647\u0022 data-id=\u0022412c9f435a1c4eee921dda45e5a8a440\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000133\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00228ba11b3f-65ea-4f86-92e4-fe78ea522647\u0022\u003E7. \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022412c9f435a1c4eee921dda45e5a8a440\u0022\u003EDANA KIRKPATRICK (National\u2014East Coast)\u003C/span\u003E to the Minister of Justice: What actions is the Government taking to reduce harm caused by gangs and to make communities safer?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002253f86481-33c1-48b2-893b-c11cc0bd673d\u0022 data-id=\u002218d42f3cdf4c4f47b7a72172b5c0e05b\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000134\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002253f86481-33c1-48b2-893b-c11cc0bd673d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002218d42f3cdf4c4f47b7a72172b5c0e05b\u0022\u003EHon PAUL GOLDSMITH (Minister of Justice):\u003C/span\u003E At midnight tonight the Gangs Act 2024 will come into force. This legislation will reduce the ability of gangs to cause fear, intimidation, and disruption to New Zealanders by giving police additional tools to deal with the mayhem on our streets, and to keep our communities safe.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000135\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00228ba11b3f-65ea-4f86-92e4-fe78ea522647\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00220d1fc72f1f1047a78437bd4c3cae5987\u0022\u003EDana Kirkpatrick\u003C/span\u003E: Why is reducing the harm caused by gangs a priority for this Government?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000136\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002253f86481-33c1-48b2-893b-c11cc0bd673d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022b2d98bb901c542e79f22e879a8150b3e\u0022\u003EHon PAUL GOLDSMITH\u003C/span\u003E: Well, indeed, because gang members make up less than one quarter of 1\u00A0percent of the adult population, yet they\u2019re linked to 18\u00A0percent of all serious violent crime, 19\u00A0percent of homicides, 23\u00A0percent of all firearm offences, and 25\u00A0percent of all kidnapping and abductions. These are abhorrent statistics, and this Government is focused on restoring real consequences for crime. We cannot succeed in our mission to reduce the numbers of victims of serious violent crime without dealing more effectively with gangs.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000137\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00228ba11b3f-65ea-4f86-92e4-fe78ea522647\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00228ea06cda855940828ec7b73e88bf637a\u0022\u003EDana Kirkpatrick\u003C/span\u003E: What additional tools will be available to police at midnight tonight?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000138\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002253f86481-33c1-48b2-893b-c11cc0bd673d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022607c49fe86e442abbd0eed0c820363e5\u0022\u003EHon PAUL GOLDSMITH\u003C/span\u003E: Well, at midnight tonight the display of gang patches in public places is prohibited, and in the case of repeat offences, possession is prohibited. Police will issue dispersal notices to break up gang gatherings that disrupt the public, and issue non-consorting orders to prevent specific gang members from associating. New Zealanders deserve to be able to go about their lives without fear of being intimidated and preyed upon by organised crime, and the police now have the additional tools they need to do the job.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000139\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00228ba11b3f-65ea-4f86-92e4-fe78ea522647\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002206791b355b7147139d5b75ec11a43a38\u0022\u003EDana Kirkpatrick\u003C/span\u003E: What other legislation comes into force at midnight tonight?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000140\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002253f86481-33c1-48b2-893b-c11cc0bd673d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022eed518db39534f83a2dbc786560add37\u0022\u003EHon PAUL GOLDSMITH\u003C/span\u003E: Well, alongside the Gangs Act 2024, the Sentencing Amendment Act 2024 will come into force. This makes gang membership on its own an aggravating factor in sentencing. Gangs have for some time been able to behave as if they were above the law with minimal consequences whilst peddling misery in our communities. As of tomorrow, the time is over.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000141\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u00227b839d5e536f4c809706529a29ea76c8\u0022\u003EQuestion No. 8\u2014Government\u2019s Response to the Royal Commission\u2019s Report into Historical Abuse in State Care and in the Care of Faith-based Institutions\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00221ebd1031-ea10-4c3d-bb56-2cd99528ae91\u0022 data-id=\u0022de042cbac2f742e1bc662bf485b3c067\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000142\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221ebd1031-ea10-4c3d-bb56-2cd99528ae91\u0022\u003E8. \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022de042cbac2f742e1bc662bf485b3c067\u0022\u003EHon WILLOW-JEAN PRIME (Labour)\u003C/span\u003E to the Lead Coordination Minister for the Government\u2019s Response to the Royal Commission\u2019s Report into Historical Abuse in State Care and in the Care of Faith-based Institutions: Does she accept the Royal Commission of Inquiry into Abuse in Care\u2019s findings, including that one of the contributing factors to neglect and abuse in care was the lack of legislation specific to care settings that gave effect to Te Tiriti o Waitangi; if not, why not?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000143\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00224b8ebda5c9fa4dff8dd25dc500dbeb27\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: The Hon Erica Stanford. Can I ask the Ministers to make sure the mikes are facing\u2014yeah.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022275c91f8-c6b8-42fd-b3ab-d8fc000dd41f\u0022 data-id=\u00229943be82df5140daabdb69c569669e98\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000144\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022275c91f8-c6b8-42fd-b3ab-d8fc000dd41f\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00229943be82df5140daabdb69c569669e98\u0022\u003EHon ERICA STANFORD (Lead Coordination Minister for the Government\u2019s Response to the Royal Commission\u2019s Report into Historical Abuse in State Care and in the Care of Faith-based Institutions):\u003C/span\u003E Last month, the Government said that we broadly accept the findings of the royal commission\u2019s final report, with further work required to respond to those findings that are legal in nature. Findings regarding breaches of the Treaty of Waitangi or failure to give effect to the Treaty of Waitangi are included in findings that require further work. The Government expects to receive further advice on these in 2025.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000145\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221ebd1031-ea10-4c3d-bb56-2cd99528ae91\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022c747460abab34b47be86a35165284872\u0022\u003EHon Willow-Jean Prime\u003C/span\u003E: Does she think that the repeal of section 7AA, which explicitly removes Te Tiriti provisions and the requirement to reduce disparities for tamariki M\u0101ori, is consistent with the royal commission\u2019s findings, and, if so, why?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000146\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022275c91f8-c6b8-42fd-b3ab-d8fc000dd41f\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022c90959d1692a4243aae2d85eba02909a\u0022\u003EHon ERICA STANFORD\u003C/span\u003E: My role as the lead coordination Minister for the Government response is to lead the coordination of Ministers and our coordination of our response to the royal commission\u2019s recommendations. I am not responsible for irrelevant portfolios of other Ministers or decisions irrelevant Ministers make.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000147\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221ebd1031-ea10-4c3d-bb56-2cd99528ae91\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00220dda59238f854112858d6feba0654339\u0022\u003EHon Willow-Jean Prime\u003C/span\u003E: Does she think that it is acceptable that the young serious offenders (YSO) bill has no references to M\u0101ori or Te Tiriti when officials advise that 80 to 85\u00A0percent of those eligible for the YSO declaration are likely to be M\u0101ori, and is this consistent with the findings and recommendations of the royal commission?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000148\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022275c91f8-c6b8-42fd-b3ab-d8fc000dd41f\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022ea0a837c6d6940db8f310492adb80f62\u0022\u003EHon ERICA STANFORD\u003C/span\u003E: I refer the member to my previous answer.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000149\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a1f7bbd1-b6ae-41c0-963b-dbe1251f5540\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00225068ecfee8d64cae934896773dc0a2a0\u0022\u003EHon Kieran McAnulty\u003C/span\u003E: Point of order. Mr Speaker, we accept that there are lead Ministers to particular pieces of work. But when the supplementary question to the Minister specifically refers to whether that piece of work is consistent in the report of which this Minister is the coordination Minister, and therefore responsible to the House to answer, I\u2019m not sure that\u2019s an appropriate response.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000150\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022275c91f8-c6b8-42fd-b3ab-d8fc000dd41f\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022aa470e3812234f06be63a8795e9a7f16\u0022\u003EHon ERICA STANFORD\u003C/span\u003E: Speaking to the point of order. The member who asked the question asked about the royal commission\u2019s findings. I am the Minister responsible for the recommendations of the royal commission\u2019s report, not their findings.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000151\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221ebd1031-ea10-4c3d-bb56-2cd99528ae91\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00229e7a0e87e4cb4e568679cc0e593d61ab\u0022\u003EHon Willow-Jean Prime\u003C/span\u003E: Speaking to the point of order. On that specific question, I said, \u201CIs this consistent with the findings and recommendations of the royal commission?\u201D\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000152\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022bef212eb74ee4c74872c23925a2e3f28\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Look, I think you\u2019re always going to get some difficulty when there are multiple Ministers involved in a particular issue, but the reality is we have a lead coordinating Minister. So some other commentary might be helpful from the Minister.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000153\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002255d0b7a4-a2c9-4c38-9b77-475311a48a89\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002272d540be753648ac8b8ff712dc2697bf\u0022\u003EHon Simeon Brown\u003C/span\u003E: Speaking to the point of order, Mr Speaker.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000154\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022dd27b8e358bc430b81821db73cae6a32\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Well, I just ruled on the point of order.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000155\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002255d0b7a4-a2c9-4c38-9b77-475311a48a89\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002263d715c63de14d538b77ad57459de756\u0022\u003EHon Simeon Brown\u003C/span\u003E: Yeah, it\u2019s a point of order.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000156\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00221be01b242e5541dc937bb5d52ee2ad87\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Well, what\u2019s the new point of order?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000157\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002255d0b7a4-a2c9-4c38-9b77-475311a48a89\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022b88def8ee69e4c60926323088892a191\u0022\u003EHon Simeon Brown\u003C/span\u003E: Well, the point of order here is that the Minister is getting asked about a range of things where she is not actually the Minister responsible for those particular items. She is the lead coordinator of the report\u2014and when the questions start going into a range of different individual issues, the only comment she\u2019s going to be able to answer to that is, \u201CI\u2019m not actually responsible for those particular issues.\u201D I\u2019m trying to seek your guidance around how much the Minister can actually provide advice to the House when she\u2019s actually the lead coordinator and not going to be responsible for each of those individual questions.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000158\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002277b2e175732441a9b354811a0f0f0366\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Well, that\u2019s an interesting sort of proposition, but unfortunately I have an idea in my head that \u201Ccoordinator\u201D means the person who organises. Is there another point of order or another question?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000159\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221ebd1031-ea10-4c3d-bb56-2cd99528ae91\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022ab0c7d6032ca4e4e90f140c3399e0b8c\u0022\u003EHon Willow-Jean Prime\u003C/span\u003E: Just speaking to that\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000160\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00225dae8828b1bb4691a6c7594bd8bf7d29\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: We\u2019ll have another response to the question.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000161\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022275c91f8-c6b8-42fd-b3ab-d8fc000dd41f\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022101aa196ce5946d9ae6592ac5104d06a\u0022\u003EHon ERICA STANFORD\u003C/span\u003E: The primary question talked about findings, and in relation to findings and keeping with the primary question, as I\u2019ve said, we broadly accept the findings, but I am the coordinating Minister that has\u2014[Interruption]\u2014responsibility for the recommendations of the report, and that was not in the primary question.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000162\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a1f7bbd1-b6ae-41c0-963b-dbe1251f5540\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002216b52accd0d54ad1a55bbf0c283ec47f\u0022\u003EHon Kieran McAnulty\u003C/span\u003E: Point of order, sir. The point remains that, first of all, yes, the primary question did reference findings\u2014that\u2019s been approved by the Clerk\u2019s office and yourself. The supplementary in question not only referenced findings but also recommendations which this Minister is definitely responsible for.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000163\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022c79f6d676ce240a2b73bde2d5cb98019\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: That\u2019s right, and the Minister just said she was. I don\u2019t think a Minister can be responsible for the findings of a report. It\u2019s the recommendations of a report that the Government\u2019s accepted that makes the ministerial responsibility clearer. Is there another question?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000164\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221ebd1031-ea10-4c3d-bb56-2cd99528ae91\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002215a86e3ac2db4d999f0b63c95e38598e\u0022\u003EHon Willow-Jean Prime\u003C/span\u003E: Speaking to the point of order, Mr Speaker. Therefore my question was\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000165\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022d0013a9c3af0431282739e0162a6c088\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: No, hang on. I\u2019ve just ruled on it. So\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000166\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221ebd1031-ea10-4c3d-bb56-2cd99528ae91\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022723c376a78da40f7b9be1dea2196537c\u0022\u003EHon Willow-Jean Prime\u003C/span\u003E: Which was?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000167\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002277f21cb52b3e44858140ce21149fb998\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: I appreciate that you may not be happy with that, but do you have another supplementary?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000168\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221ebd1031-ea10-4c3d-bb56-2cd99528ae91\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022317d1f60ba864421b1add8719824cb84\u0022\u003EHon Willow-Jean Prime\u003C/span\u003E: I do. Is she concerned, as the lead coordination Minister, that the Minister of Education is making legislative changes to downgrade Te Tiriti when the royal commission found that past education Ministers failed to respond to the identity, language, and culture of M\u0101ori, and that led to harm?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000169\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022779bc90fc2a74632babd8a6997ebc4b2\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Well, you can answer in so much as there is responsibility. The question is very broad.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000170\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022275c91f8-c6b8-42fd-b3ab-d8fc000dd41f\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022eb78a4d2b5224939add7ff19d0bd3e16\u0022\u003EHon ERICA STANFORD\u003C/span\u003E: Well, my responsibility as a lead coordinating Minister is that I don\u2019t have responsibility for individual decisions of those Ministers.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000171\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221ebd1031-ea10-4c3d-bb56-2cd99528ae91\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022e60c7662af374fd4ae59fef24f6a9aef\u0022\u003EHon Willow-Jean Prime\u003C/span\u003E: Does she accept that the disregard of Te Tiriti o Waitangi and its neglect in the design, development, and implementation of the care system went to the heart of the abuse and neglect experienced by many M\u0101ori survivors and their wh\u0101nau, and that she is failing as a Minister of the Crown to change the systems that led to harm in care?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000172\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022275c91f8-c6b8-42fd-b3ab-d8fc000dd41f\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022c75bec22a26843d68b5309b4f732740b\u0022\u003EHon ERICA STANFORD\u003C/span\u003E: As I said in my primary answer, we do broadly accept the findings of the royal commission\u2019s final report.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000173\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u0022d89c81d9fc6d49c8bf539e32fad656c7\u0022\u003EQuestion No. 9\u2014Police\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022587eeeae-8af5-4e11-ac7f-a7690f9c7c3a\u0022 data-id=\u00221ae318ee7dcd4219b7eea789ea1db4de\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000174\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022587eeeae-8af5-4e11-ac7f-a7690f9c7c3a\u0022\u003E9. \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00221ae318ee7dcd4219b7eea789ea1db4de\u0022\u003EDr CARLOS CHEUNG (National\u2014Mt Roskill)\u003C/span\u003E to the Minister of Police: What new tools will Police have from tomorrow to crack down on gangs?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002248a02a21-c1ac-4159-8789-485ad614bd01\u0022 data-id=\u002246f1fba8c71542bc8dd5c46beb8a25b8\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000175\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002248a02a21-c1ac-4159-8789-485ad614bd01\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002246f1fba8c71542bc8dd5c46beb8a25b8\u0022\u003EHon MARK MITCHELL (Minister of Police):\u003C/span\u003E At midnight tonight, it will be illegal to wear or display gang patches and insignia in public in New Zealand. Police will also\u00A0be able to issue gang members with non-consorting orders and issue dispersal notices. The coalition Government promised a gang crackdown; tomorrow, that will be in full force.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000176\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022587eeeae-8af5-4e11-ac7f-a7690f9c7c3a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002252d6440a469143419a8d52bb2863f5e4\u0022\u003EDr Carlos Cheung\u003C/span\u003E: How will non-consorting orders help police fight organised crime?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000177\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002248a02a21-c1ac-4159-8789-485ad614bd01\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022ca9df2e5d4b74413bf8ac28efd4304d6\u0022\u003EHon MARK MITCHELL\u003C/span\u003E: Non-consorting orders are able to be issued by the court against known gang offenders, preventing them from communicating and consorting with each other to commit violent and organised crime. These have proved very effective in other\u00A0jurisdictions at preventing the flow of illegal activity and will enable police to dismantle gangs from the inside.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000178\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022587eeeae-8af5-4e11-ac7f-a7690f9c7c3a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022cdfdc13ec72d49228f639e454ba2af43\u0022\u003EDr Carlos Cheung\u003C/span\u003E: What benefit will dispersal notices have for the public?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000179\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002248a02a21-c1ac-4159-8789-485ad614bd01\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022f29a730392c344548aca6f07ff79349c\u0022\u003EHon MARK MITCHELL\u003C/span\u003E: Police will be able to issue a dispersal notice to any known gang offenders congregating in a public place. This will mean that police can disperse gang gatherings and avert disruption to the public before it happens, by telling members to go home and not come back for seven days.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000180\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022587eeeae-8af5-4e11-ac7f-a7690f9c7c3a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00220683005cbd394d7db89a3020097e921a\u0022\u003EDr Carlos Cheung\u003C/span\u003E: Are police ready to enforce the new laws?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000181\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002248a02a21-c1ac-4159-8789-485ad614bd01\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022c5ab3d48d84a423f83fda2f783f8afcf\u0022\u003EHon MARK MITCHELL\u003C/span\u003E: Yes, they are.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000182\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002253958f14-2b54-4d1c-bfac-7b3ea85e1c2b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00220ed60d1b9aac4f59a08198f412cfee1a\u0022\u003ETamatha Paul\u003C/span\u003E: Supplementary\u2014supplementary, Mr Speaker.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000183\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022d462eaad111b41a4a3d96117e0928538\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Supplementary question\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000184\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002253958f14-2b54-4d1c-bfac-7b3ea85e1c2b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022f699faa9f59f48c88c153a8b8ffdb4ce\u0022\u003ETamatha Paul\u003C/span\u003E: Tamatha Paul.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000185\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022e200e5a34b344aa390facaccccd1842f\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Yeah, I know\u2014bad day today. Tamatha Paul\u2014sorry.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000186\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002253958f14-2b54-4d1c-bfac-7b3ea85e1c2b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002274968e6db3f44ceba6c627b03b0e788a\u0022\u003ETamatha Paul\u003C/span\u003E: All good, no worries. Was the Minister listening at the abuse in State care apology last week when the connection between abuse in State care and the formation of gangs was made?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000187\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002248a02a21-c1ac-4159-8789-485ad614bd01\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022710554333e6643b19c278c5e326bbf11\u0022\u003EHon MARK MITCHELL\u003C/span\u003E: Yes, I was, and I met with and spoke with three gang members that were at the abuse in State care apology. All three of them indicated to me that they wanted to leave the gang, and all three of them indicated that, actually, the gang lifestyle had not been a positive impact in their lives.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000188\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002253958f14-2b54-4d1c-bfac-7b3ea85e1c2b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022974779e52c8245efa609b730e58e8b04\u0022\u003ETamatha Paul\u003C/span\u003E: Does he recognise, then, that this approach to cracking down on gangs and locking them up in prison is not going to achieve the reduction in gang membership that he says he wants?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000189\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002248a02a21-c1ac-4159-8789-485ad614bd01\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00228e83483d76fa4d15858eefc00c1e79f4\u0022\u003EHon MARK MITCHELL\u003C/span\u003E: Well, I\u2019d just make an observation that in the last 12\u00A0months, the police have been cracking down on gangs, and it\u2019s had a massive positive impact in terms of making the communities that they operate in\u2014because these are organised criminal organisations that are perpetrating violence, that are involved with the dealing of methamphetamine; they\u2019re a wrecking ball in terms of misery inside communities. Actually, communities are feeling much safer because the police are cracking down on them.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000190\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u002291380cf4a08d447081b6693db975d16c\u0022\u003EQuestion No. 10\u2014Justice\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022f7fc7ac3-5ce1-43ca-8cd6-dbb0941bf3ae\u0022 data-id=\u0022cb519a2dc4f24b569d0324fa60579225\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000191\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f7fc7ac3-5ce1-43ca-8cd6-dbb0941bf3ae\u0022\u003E10. \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022cb519a2dc4f24b569d0324fa60579225\u0022\u003EHon Dr DUNCAN WEBB (Labour\u2014Christchurch Central)\u003C/span\u003E to the Minister of Justice: Is he confident that the Human Rights Commission is politically independent; if so, why?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002253f86481-33c1-48b2-893b-c11cc0bd673d\u0022 data-id=\u002294982ac16ac5479480ea93ad397758f2\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000192\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002253f86481-33c1-48b2-893b-c11cc0bd673d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002294982ac16ac5479480ea93ad397758f2\u0022\u003EHon PAUL GOLDSMITH (Minister of Justice):\u003C/span\u003E Yes. As the member will know, section 19 of the Human Rights Act 1993 requires the Human Rights Commission to act independently in performing its statutory functions and duties.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000193\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f7fc7ac3-5ce1-43ca-8cd6-dbb0941bf3ae\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002284698ee078fc4c68b90adf106eafd095\u0022\u003EHon Dr Duncan Webb\u003C/span\u003E: Does the Minister consider that it is consistent with the duty to ensure the independence of the commission under the 1993 United Nations Paris principles, that the appointee is the Chief Human Rights Commissioner, Dr Stephen Rainbow, who was\u00A0recommended to him for appointment by the ACT Party?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000194\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002253f86481-33c1-48b2-893b-c11cc0bd673d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022557b91dad9544017a289874b634ed7ec\u0022\u003EHon PAUL GOLDSMITH\u003C/span\u003E: Yes, perfectly. Everybody in this country\u2019s free to nominate somebody and then Cabinet makes the decision about that.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000195\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f7fc7ac3-5ce1-43ca-8cd6-dbb0941bf3ae\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a3119168ab4b4434bbd121760595b32f\u0022\u003EHon Dr Duncan Webb\u003C/span\u003E: Does the Minister consider that he acted consistent with the duty to maintain the independence of the commission, as required by the Paris principles, when Dr Stephen Rainbow was recommended for appointment by the Minister, despite the fact that an expert interview panel found that he did not have the skills and qualifications to be a viable appointment and did not consider him appointable?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000196\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002253f86481-33c1-48b2-893b-c11cc0bd673d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00226bf6d61674914be3a86a966b353a232f\u0022\u003EHon PAUL GOLDSMITH\u003C/span\u003E: Yes. We\u2019ve been over this before. The independent panel are very senior legal people who I respect greatly. They made some recommendations, and in one case we took up that recommendation with Gail Pacheco. In terms of the chief commissioner, ultimately Cabinet made the decision that they were looking for a slightly different set of skills, and in particular a focus on communicating effectively in terms of human rights. So we went with Dr Rainbow. And I\u2019m proud to say I\u2019ve got every confidence that he\u2019ll do a better job than appointments from the previous Government.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000197\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f7fc7ac3-5ce1-43ca-8cd6-dbb0941bf3ae\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00224668fbfb628344eebe06c07aa938ee0e\u0022\u003EHon Dr Duncan Webb\u003C/span\u003E: What actions did the Minister take after Dr Stephen Rainbow was informed that he wasn\u2019t a preferred candidate for the Chief Human Rights Commissioner role that led to Dr Rainbow re-entering the selection process?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000198\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002253f86481-33c1-48b2-893b-c11cc0bd673d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022f3f737ce9b474df78a1a36506e6be880\u0022\u003EHon PAUL GOLDSMITH\u003C/span\u003E: Well, I certainly didn\u2019t inform Mr Rainbow about that. And if he was informed by anybody, they were obviously premature, because no decision had been made until the decision to appoint Dr Stephen Rainbow.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000199\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f7fc7ac3-5ce1-43ca-8cd6-dbb0941bf3ae\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002251decf4b0fa24464999ba650f8c06a6a\u0022\u003EHon Dr Duncan Webb\u003C/span\u003E: Point of order, Mr Speaker. Thank you, Mr Speaker. My question asked what actions did the Minister take subsequent to Dr Rainbow being informed he wasn\u2019t a successful candidate. The Minister didn\u2019t address that at all. He talked about who\u00A0informed Dr Rainbow of that fact. It\u2019s quite an important point. I\u2019d ask that the Minister address the question of whether or not he took any actions to restart that process.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000200\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022326a293449e34ab692431418fa5fbbae\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Well, it would be reasonable to assume that if he\u2019s telling the House who informed Dr Rainbow, that it wasn\u2019t him.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000201\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022185436bf93344dd189abb1aeb4ca8aa8\u0022\u003EHon David Seymour\u003C/span\u003E: Is the Minister aware of Dr Rainbow\u2019s long history of hard left-wing activism, stretching back to the 1970s, including membership and candidacy for the Labour and Green parties; and can he assure the House that Dr Rainbow will be able to represent the views of all New Zealanders in his role as Human Rights Commissioner, and not give in to the kind of communist tendencies that some of those parties have occasionally exhibited? [Interruption]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000202\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022c4b396fff48e4567aeae13d84939c8a6\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Let\u2019s just be very clear: that question\u2019s not getting answered.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000203\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f317ee7d-f040-44ec-8f2f-ad0a9f206d75\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022f5660fcc6cc14a3fab4b4ce48f999d1f\u0022\u003EHon Willie Jackson\u003C/span\u003E: Kick him out!\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000204\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022f9285ff23b7d44f6b6a2bbe489c024a4\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: I\u2019ll tell you what, it\u2019s not far off. It\u2019s unbelievable. When questions are asked, you\u2019re silent.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000205\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a1f7bbd1-b6ae-41c0-963b-dbe1251f5540\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00223cfdc2019a984d90ac80db0dd08824b0\u0022\u003EHon Kieran McAnulty\u003C/span\u003E: Point of order. Previous Speakers have consistently ruled that accusations of communism are a breach of Parliament\u2019s\u2014[Interruption]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000206\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002292b6689aceaa4569b8f98beee3e5bbd7\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Right. The next person who speaks when there\u2019s either a question being asked or a point of order taken will be leaving for the week.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000207\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a1f7bbd1-b6ae-41c0-963b-dbe1251f5540\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022c577ee6d28814cba8a9b2385f180beca\u0022\u003EHon Kieran McAnulty\u003C/span\u003E: So I make no commentary on the fact that it was done through an attempt to ask a question, but the point remains that previous Speakers, when members have accused either parties or members of this House of communism, they have been made to withdraw and apologise. Now, I accept that the Minister was asked to stop part way through, but nevertheless it was clear where the accusation was being made. On this occasion, I would ask that you would consider that as an appropriate response.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000208\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002232b5ee277fd7440d91d965a62cc461d9\u0022\u003ERt Hon Winston Peters\u003C/span\u003E: Mr Speaker, point of order. The honourable member\u2019s right, with one exception: it is when the person who is the recipient of the allegation makes the complaint, not someone else. He or she\u2019s got to find it an offence, as some in the past have not. So that\u2019s the distinction here.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000209\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00222e19982a01154522bb105143ce6327fe\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: I think the whole thing was, to say the least, messy. We will move on to question No.\u00A011.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000210\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022bbaf7a89db554a59ade2ad785ba76936\u0022\u003ERt Hon Chris Hipkins\u003C/span\u003E: Point of order, Mr Speaker. It\u2019s a different point of order to the one that\u2019s just been raised with you. Mr Speaker, earlier on in the media today, I noticed that David Seymour was giving direction to you through the media to be more strict in your application of the Standing Orders. The question that David Seymour asked was not only out of order but was, in fact, disorderly. So I wonder whether you might like to reflect on David Seymour\u2019s request that you be more strict in punishing those who violate the Standing Orders.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000211\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022c136262d545742f99440c553dc1caca8\u0022\u003EHon David Seymour\u003C/span\u003E: Speaking to the point of order.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000212\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022bca44080acaa47c0b9b7e0e0c57bba93\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Just give me a minute. I always reflect on advice that comes from members. And I find it not exactly easy to wade through the conflictions inside that advice. This better be useful as an addition to the current point of order.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000213\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002278a816e0f34e44bdac4146179a7fd255\u0022\u003EHon David Seymour\u003C/span\u003E: Well, Mr Speaker, I merely make the point that I would not and have not attempted to give direction to you.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000214\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022728b0af07890437daa2c2641b750cc4a\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: OK, it must have just felt like that!\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000215\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f7fc7ac3-5ce1-43ca-8cd6-dbb0941bf3ae\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022aaa9c9c832c842f5ae3f7b242dd25d7b\u0022\u003EHon Dr Duncan Webb\u003C/span\u003E: Did the Minister take any action to ensure that Stephen Rainbow re-entered the selection process after he\u2019d been told he wasn\u2019t the successful candidate?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000216\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002253f86481-33c1-48b2-893b-c11cc0bd673d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022fb769a29afd7404093e6ec77c2a343ef\u0022\u003EHon PAUL GOLDSMITH\u003C/span\u003E: Well, the action that I took was to continue the process and\u00A0to develop a recommendation to Cabinet to appoint a person for the Chief Human Rights Commissioner. The member may go deeper and deeper into the weeds on this; the reality is that we\u2019ve made three excellent appointments to the Human Rights Commission. The Race Relations Commissioner had been empty for more than a year after the resignation of Meng\u00A0Foon\u2014remember Meng Foon? We\u2019re very confident that those three appointments are going to give some real strength to the commission and they will carry on in a politically independent way to safeguard and stand up for human rights in New Zealand.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000217\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f7fc7ac3-5ce1-43ca-8cd6-dbb0941bf3ae\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00227812a6cd33864ee983ab92989bed6d1e\u0022\u003EHon Dr Duncan Webb\u003C/span\u003E: Is the Minister confident that the commission will retain its A accreditation by the Global Alliance of National Human Rights Institutions under the Paris principles, given that Dr Rainbow was nominated by a governing political party, he was put on a shortlist by the Minister against advice, and his appointment was made despite an independent panel saying he was not a viable appointment?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000218\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002253f86481-33c1-48b2-893b-c11cc0bd673d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022173fe9d93d7a4e188fbe32f68fdf9733\u0022\u003EHon PAUL GOLDSMITH\u003C/span\u003E: Yes, I am quite confident. We went to stand up and defend our human rights in Geneva in April this year. We did face some criticism on our human rights record from Russia, but I\u2019m confident that we\u2019ll be able to continue to have a very high regard in the international sector.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000219\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u002247006c46366745d09718c4f854615ab5\u0022\u003EQuestion No. 11\u2014Trade\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00225665380b-62fd-4d75-85e0-0ed801a402e0\u0022 data-id=\u002237cdce6255f94bc2ae67690da48f1f79\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000220\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225665380b-62fd-4d75-85e0-0ed801a402e0\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002237cdce6255f94bc2ae67690da48f1f79\u0022\u003EMIKE BUTTERICK (National\u2014Wairarapa):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Mr Speaker. My question\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022 data-id=\u002256a6ece5682645b897eeeae1b8b271dc\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000221\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002256a6ece5682645b897eeeae1b8b271dc\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: You can wait until the House gives you the respect of silence.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00225665380b-62fd-4d75-85e0-0ed801a402e0\u0022 data-id=\u00224ba7395866e84aa88b0a18746a72d074\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000222\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225665380b-62fd-4d75-85e0-0ed801a402e0\u0022\u003E11. \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00224ba7395866e84aa88b0a18746a72d074\u0022\u003EMIKE BUTTERICK (National\u2014Wairarapa)\u003C/span\u003E to the Minister for Trade: What actions has the Government taken to grow New Zealand\u2019s economy and increase farm-gate returns for farmers and growers?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022c0f78f60-c2fd-46f4-8138-72f39692fc20\u0022 data-id=\u00220c11a7a054a640018ce5e5f8fc854373\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000223\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c0f78f60-c2fd-46f4-8138-72f39692fc20\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00220c11a7a054a640018ce5e5f8fc854373\u0022\u003EHon TODD McCLAY (Minister for Trade):\u003C/span\u003E The Government is relentlessly focused on reducing trade barriers, unlocking new markets, and supporting Kiwi businesses to grow. A big part of this is reducing non-tariff and technical barriers (NTBs) to trade, which we estimate affect $9.8\u00A0billion worth of New Zealand exports each year, with the primary sector facing the greatest impact. This is why we have started a programme to resolve trade barriers and increase farm-gate returns for farmers and growers. This year, the Government has successfully resolved 16 barriers to trade, affecting $733\u00A0million worth of exports. This directly supports our ambitious target of doubling exports by value in 10 years; and with one in four jobs tied to trade, it returns more money to the back pocket for thousands of New Zealanders.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000224\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225665380b-62fd-4d75-85e0-0ed801a402e0\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002273d0ad2662b541dbbb0b1625830134d4\u0022\u003EMike Butterick\u003C/span\u003E: What actions has the Government taken to support primary exports and reduce other barriers?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000225\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c0f78f60-c2fd-46f4-8138-72f39692fc20\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00222feaa15b7d7f4bee9e2c1a069f982645\u0022\u003EHon TODD McCLAY\u003C/span\u003E: Well, we\u2019re returning more value to the primary producers and other exporters. Since June, we\u2019ve reduced regulatory burdens on wine and spirits exports to the EU; resolved barriers on medical device exports to Mexico; restored onion exports to Indonesia, New Zealand onions\u2019 largest market; restored access for up to $250\u00A0million worth of log exports to India; extended tariff-free access for New Zealand digital exporters to all World Trade Organization members; resolved compliance measures to secure blueberry access to Korea; restored $88\u00A0million worth of frozen deer velvet exports to China; and achieved a 12-month reprieve for costly EU deforestation regulations, saving farmers and exporters up to $200\u00A0million. Reducing these barriers is part of the Government\u2019s plan to grow the economy, to lift incomes for all Kiwis, and to create jobs.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000226\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225665380b-62fd-4d75-85e0-0ed801a402e0\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022bc36cf1e37dc4ba3acb3ee1444393e99\u0022\u003EMike Butterick\u003C/span\u003E: What additional actions are the Government taking to address trade barriers?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000227\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c0f78f60-c2fd-46f4-8138-72f39692fc20\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002274bb5e34f2d14bb3b80a9c873d27926c\u0022\u003EHon TODD McCLAY\u003C/span\u003E: New Zealand exported $98.2 billion worth of goods and services this year to June 2024. Over the next 12 months, we will continue to focus on targeting over\u00A0$900\u00A0million worth of NTBs, including seeking a permanent exemption to EU deforestation regulations, removing a ban on structural timber exports to Australia, restrictions on cosmetic exports to China, and we\u2019ll continue to take action against Canada dairy restrictions. We\u2019re focused on removing barriers to trade and making it easier for farmers and growers to supply high-quality, safe food to the world.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000228\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225665380b-62fd-4d75-85e0-0ed801a402e0\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022dbc4f49aab694fd0be9bdf88d5b59fe8\u0022\u003EMike Butterick\u003C/span\u003E: What action is the Government taking to restore Canadian dairy access?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000229\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c0f78f60-c2fd-46f4-8138-72f39692fc20\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002285a8e9fc79224955b9f1862ec3f1dd31\u0022\u003EHon TODD McCLAY\u003C/span\u003E: Well, Canada continues to fail to meet its obligations to New Zealand under the Comprehensive and Progressive Agreement for Trans-Pacific Partnership in respect of dairy exports to Canada. Last year, under the previous Government, New Zealand started a formal dispute procedure under this agreement with Canada, and we won a panel ruling in our favour. Unfortunately, Canada continues to not comply with their obligations, and, as a result, New Zealand dairy farmers are missing out on market access that was negotiated and granted under that trade agreement. This is a matter of principle. New Zealand takes its obligations seriously and we expect others to also do so, and we will stand up for New Zealand farmers and exporters. We\u2019ve therefore taken further action which forces Canada to meet with us formally to make changes to allow exports or to pay New Zealand compensation for the trade harm they are causing. The ball is now squarely in Canada\u2019s court. The New Zealand Government reserves the right to take any action we deem appropriate, including imposing tariff sanctions on Canadian exports to New Zealand. I say the time is running out for Canada to honour their obligations to New Zealand farmers.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000230\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u0022c30effc4337e4b87987f05e67e79ff42\u0022\u003EQuestion No. 12\u2014Prime Minister\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00227a76db18-baa4-41c1-b366-89e2c753a1e7\u0022 data-id=\u0022d0acdce9b63d4501a25f84cf33903674\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000231\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227a76db18-baa4-41c1-b366-89e2c753a1e7\u0022\u003E12. \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022d0acdce9b63d4501a25f84cf33903674\u0022\u003EDEBBIE NGAREWA-PACKER (Co-Leader\u2014Te P\u0101ti M\u0101ori)\u003C/span\u003E to the Prime Minister: Does he stand by all his Government\u2019s statements and actions?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022ea31fdd3-90e9-47d7-92a4-20b6a3109eef\u0022 data-id=\u002207d8b63337ac49b3b40ee4a6e62c493b\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000232\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ea31fdd3-90e9-47d7-92a4-20b6a3109eef\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002207d8b63337ac49b3b40ee4a6e62c493b\u0022\u003ERt Hon CHRISTOPHER LUXON (Prime Minister):\u003C/span\u003E Yes, and especially our action to restore law and order. A year ago, Kiwis demanded fresh leadership and a new approach to a major rise in violent and retail crime that occurred in recent years. Since then, we\u2019ve made big changes and we\u2019re already seeing results. Foot patrols have increased 30\u00A0percent, ram raids are down 60\u00A0percent, serious assaults have dropped 3\u00A0percent, and aggravated robberies are down 11\u00A0percent. There are more changes coming: tough new gang laws take effect tonight and stronger sentencing is on the way. There\u2019s always more to do, but the signs suggest that restoring law and order means that we\u2019re getting New Zealand back on track.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000233\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227a76db18-baa4-41c1-b366-89e2c753a1e7\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00226c31b6c1a5aa49919ab8a24f6ed061d1\u0022\u003EDebbie Ngarewa-Packer\u003C/span\u003E: Can he define what tino rangatiratanga means, given his Government has introduced a bill to redefine tino rangatiratanga?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000234\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ea31fdd3-90e9-47d7-92a4-20b6a3109eef\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00222d96e85029b742efb5a92b7cbea246fc\u0022\u003ERt Hon CHRISTOPHER LUXON\u003C/span\u003E: Well, as I\u2019ve said, the bill is being introduced at first reading, it won\u2019t be supported at second reading, and therefore it won\u2019t become law.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000235\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227a76db18-baa4-41c1-b366-89e2c753a1e7\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00227ca713ba3f834a0bbe2dd92de7732eab\u0022\u003EDebbie Ngarewa-Packer\u003C/span\u003E: Point of order. My question was asking for the Prime Minister to define what tino rangatiratanga means, not to discuss the second reading of the bill.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000236\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a2ec118e3eb9449cafc57f4c69b80527\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Yes, but you asked two legs in that question. The second part was in relation to the legislation being introduced, and the Prime Minister gave an answer to that.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000237\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220f7d126e-c18d-4466-9ebe-d424ae5c4bf6\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00226bd188bcee6a4db2a490871dc480ce1b\u0022\u003ERawiri Waititi\u003C/span\u003E: Point of order, Mr Speaker. There was not two legs to that question. There was only one leg to the question, which was, \u201CCan he define what tino rangatiratanga means, given his Government has introduced the bill to redefine tino rangatiratanga?\u201D\u2014there was not two legs in that question.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000238\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002246748bcf12214601a637d4990affb2a8\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Yeah, there is.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000239\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220f7d126e-c18d-4466-9ebe-d424ae5c4bf6\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022aa2880c1792e4621b470a1eb6fce4d61\u0022\u003ERawiri Waititi\u003C/span\u003E: So the question was clear and he didn\u2019t address it, nor did he answer it.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000240\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022fd1ea161c719457981f89f436e5edaee\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: The first leg was the question, \u201CCould he define\u201D; the second was \u201Cgiven\u201D. So he\u2019s responded to the second leg of the question. Sorry, I\u2019m not being difficult; I\u2019m just telling you what the rules are. I know that\u2019s challenging for some.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000241\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227a76db18-baa4-41c1-b366-89e2c753a1e7\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022d335f6bd6ee14c6bbcc4caa3f3914cfa\u0022\u003EDebbie Ngarewa-Packer\u003C/span\u003E: Can he define what tino rangatiratanga means?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000242\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ea31fdd3-90e9-47d7-92a4-20b6a3109eef\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00226b9507b56a1b4344bf8418d027c9f35d\u0022\u003ERt Hon CHRISTOPHER LUXON\u003C/span\u003E: Unqualified exercise over land and taonga.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000243\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227a76db18-baa4-41c1-b366-89e2c753a1e7\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00223dda436711cd44cf900c59fc12ecf273\u0022\u003EDebbie Ngarewa-Packer\u003C/span\u003E: The Prime Minister was respectfully welcomed at marae across all the country, so why couldn\u2019t he offer M\u0101ori the same respect when welcoming them to Parliament yesterday?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000244\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ea31fdd3-90e9-47d7-92a4-20b6a3109eef\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002294cdcede87c74067a22bced5ccf0c4f8\u0022\u003ERt Hon CHRISTOPHER LUXON\u003C/span\u003E: Well, as I said yesterday, many of the organisers were affiliated with that member\u2019s party, Te P\u0101ti M\u0101ori. You can hold me to account on this Parliament many days in any given week. My message to the h\u012Bkoi was very straightforward, which is the bill is being supported at first reading but not beyond that and won\u2019t become law. And the last thing, as I say, is I engage with M\u0101ori up and down the country on a range of issues.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000245\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220f7d126e-c18d-4466-9ebe-d424ae5c4bf6\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00221f033c1eedd04183871cbc5f8ff507c3\u0022\u003ERawiri Waititi\u003C/span\u003E: Prime Minister for the whole country, or not?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000246\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022c6413ebcbc584e1091986b60078ee7ef\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Stick to my rules.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000247\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227a76db18-baa4-41c1-b366-89e2c753a1e7\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00224a8b331cceff419ba77ad27c540634b6\u0022\u003EDebbie Ngarewa-Packer\u003C/span\u003E: For clarity, is the Prime Minister saying that any members of Te P\u0101ti M\u0101ori or members of the public who affiliate to Te P\u0101ti M\u0101ori will never be met with by the Prime Minister?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000248\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ea31fdd3-90e9-47d7-92a4-20b6a3109eef\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022146d156d889f481ea639932534375959\u0022\u003ERt Hon CHRISTOPHER LUXON\u003C/span\u003E: No, I\u2019m not saying that. We sent a delegation out from the National Party that represented our position, received the h\u012Bkoi here at Parliament\u2014it was good.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000249\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00224500429b29f04154bc1cba257f3abc50\u0022\u003ERt Hon Winston Peters\u003C/span\u003E: Has the Prime Minister been told that tino rangatiratanga means the chief\u2019s word is gospel; not every Tom, Dick, Rawiri, or Hone?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000250\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022480a5ca093bf4a9dac3cc489aa521abc\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: I think the point is made. Is there another supplementary?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000251\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227a76db18-baa4-41c1-b366-89e2c753a1e7\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002267c3c7877d3e4281967f0ed5d37bf532\u0022\u003EDebbie Ngarewa-Packer\u003C/span\u003E: How will he reconcile the damage he has done to the Crown\u2019s relationship with M\u0101ori after not showing up to the largest h\u012Bkoi in the history of New Zealand?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000252\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ea31fdd3-90e9-47d7-92a4-20b6a3109eef\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00223becdae831cf4b2fab480ffd826bd9de\u0022\u003ERt Hon CHRISTOPHER LUXON\u003C/span\u003E: Well, what I\u2019d say is that the way that we build a stronger relationship with M\u0101ori and the Crown is by focusing on things that matter most to M\u0101ori. And what matters most to them is how they lift their incomes, how they secure better housing, how they get timely, quality access to healthcare, how they improve educational outcomes. Those are the things that matter to M\u0101ori and to non-M\u0101ori, and that\u2019s what this Government is doing. And, you know, frankly, I haven\u2019t heard anything from that member talking about why only 12\u00A0percent of M\u0101ori students are at the standard they need to be at going into high school. That kind of matters.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000253\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002286368934dcd04dbc8effee4fed4362f4\u0022\u003ERt Hon Winston Peters\u003C/span\u003E: Is the Prime Minister not astonished that umbrage is being taken to his not being out there yesterday when he was, like others, never invited to be part of it, unlike in any other M\u0101ori setting?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000254\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002219ed20db-5d6c-4464-9327-6cdd072bb4fe\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00221e3f6756366b4739b8da580b09d7c587\u0022\u003ERicardo Men\u00E9ndez March\u003C/span\u003E: Point of order. [Interruption]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000255\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022af9083668592407c99e86a4cd58b2e50\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Just a minute. We\u2019ve got a point of order going on so we\u2019ll all behave ourselves.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000256\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002219ed20db-5d6c-4464-9327-6cdd072bb4fe\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002252cc219a293140a68c8f59677fd748e6\u0022\u003ERicardo Men\u00E9ndez March\u003C/span\u003E: Thank you. Looking at Speakers\u2019 rulings 197/5 and\u00A0197/6, which I think have been consistently broken by the Deputy Prime Minister, I just wanted to test and seek your guidance about the fact we\u2019ve got a Deputy Prime Minister who keeps referring to the standards of this place, yet continues to ignore the very same rules that he claims to abide by\u2014specifically, in this case, those two Speakers\u2019 rulings.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000257\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022b5b7fb46c8b849198e60df1f175ee158\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Look, I\u2019m not sure that I\u2019ve heard the actual Speakers\u2019 rulings that were being quoted.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000258\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002219ed20db-5d6c-4464-9327-6cdd072bb4fe\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00220eec153394e14c35b2fa2dbeacd81a9a\u0022\u003ERicardo Men\u00E9ndez March\u003C/span\u003E: 197/5\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000259\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00220e8e5785e8ac4d4dac5f4b9a7d643efb\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: 187/5.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000260\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002219ed20db-5d6c-4464-9327-6cdd072bb4fe\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022b4abe720556f447c9e7189b24c0edaf9\u0022\u003ERicardo Men\u00E9ndez March\u003C/span\u003E: 197/5 and 197/6. I can read them out loud.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000261\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00225077c6c9a0934e98a8d674446082da54\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Sorry, what is your number? What page is it?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000262\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002219ed20db-5d6c-4464-9327-6cdd072bb4fe\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022b7ec687887c74da7a091f7fc3912d63d\u0022\u003ERicardo Men\u00E9ndez March\u003C/span\u003E: Page 197. So\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000263\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002286596bab7847408f98cccd3bc2084b84\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: What, sorry?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000264\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002219ed20db-5d6c-4464-9327-6cdd072bb4fe\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022dc27c3095c8249908f1a536a8c4f5411\u0022\u003ERicardo Men\u00E9ndez March\u003C/span\u003E: 197/5, which reads: \u201CThe whole idea of supplementary questions is not to make a range of political statements about an issue but to dig into an issue, to test a Minister\u2019s answer.\u201D\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000265\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00221c27a0bb2e2b496fb71edfdc019dc804\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Oh, OK. So for those who are perhaps listening or viewing who are uncertain what that means, there\u2019s a Speaker\u2019s ruling that says supplementary questions should not be used for making political statements. The fact is, when there was a slightly political statement made, I didn\u2019t allow the question. I can\u2019t know what the question is until it\u2019s made. The second point is that if we were to get strict on that, then there would be a significant number of questions that don\u2019t get asked. So I thank the member for calling that to the attention of the House, it\u2019s something everyone should bear in mind, but there\u2019s nothing further to do here.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000266\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227a76db18-baa4-41c1-b366-89e2c753a1e7\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022b908a08ef1c1465c9d31df19f44377d9\u0022\u003EDebbie Ngarewa-Packer\u003C/span\u003E: Why is he ignoring the 270,000-strong petition to kill the Treaty principles bill when more people signed it than voted for the ACT Party?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000267\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ea31fdd3-90e9-47d7-92a4-20b6a3109eef\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00227a34495b1903415fa146ca9153da6622\u0022\u003ERt Hon CHRISTOPHER LUXON\u003C/span\u003E: Because we have a coalition agreement\u2014we\u2019re supporting the bill to first reading. We honour our commitments and our agreements to each other in this coalition Government, and we\u2019re saying we\u2019re not supporting it at second reading. It won\u2019t become law unless the Opposition parties vote for it.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000268\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227a76db18-baa4-41c1-b366-89e2c753a1e7\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002273944fc095dc43ce92931056b5c80622\u0022\u003EDebbie Ngarewa-Packer\u003C/span\u003E: Supplementary.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000269\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00221dca9fce7fe04a45bee302adda02747d\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Right, sorry, lost my way there\u2014just one or two other things going on.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000270\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227a76db18-baa4-41c1-b366-89e2c753a1e7\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00220710e2dd08654f53abbfbed77d197333\u0022\u003EDebbie Ngarewa-Packer\u003C/span\u003E: Does he agree with New Zealand First that there are no Treaty principles, only articles, and, if so, will he be replacing the principles he\u2019s removing from 28 pieces of legislation with the articles of Te Tiriti o Waitangi?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000271\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ea31fdd3-90e9-47d7-92a4-20b6a3109eef\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002287357ea2c23e4da2a04dc59b83580973\u0022\u003ERt Hon CHRISTOPHER LUXON\u003C/span\u003E: We want to have maximum clarity so we can get things done in this country and that means that when we have a Treaty principles reference, it\u2019s specific to the legislation that it\u2019s involved with.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000272\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220f7d126e-c18d-4466-9ebe-d424ae5c4bf6\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00223a872fd4c633427e9d4f344b1fc3f57b\u0022\u003ERawiri Waititi\u003C/span\u003E: Does he still believe he has lived up to his own statement that \u201CThe Treaty is our past, present, and future. It has shaped the country we have become, and the\u00A0obligations it imposes on both sides will always be with us\u201D, given his Government has introduced the Treaty principles bill, which serves to redefine the Treaty and to remove the Treaty from 28 pieces of legislation; is he misleading the country and being\u00A0fallacious?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000273\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ea31fdd3-90e9-47d7-92a4-20b6a3109eef\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00226e11b127b7894e56acf98745d42d0b56\u0022\u003ERt Hon CHRISTOPHER LUXON\u003C/span\u003E: In answer to the first leg of the question: yes.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n    \u003C/div\u003E\n    \u003Cdiv class=\u0022HpsHansard\u0022\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000274\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsProceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u0022ff782ac1a1514692b7c52057e6cbdf1d\u0022\u003EGeneral Debate\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000276\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u00220f276a6af8d64eb09d27bd1b602dc5b1\u0022\u003EGeneral Debate\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022e29c400e-467a-4398-818d-270ef48b80cf\u0022 data-id=\u0022311c80f717a349509094f8d55613910f\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000275\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e29c400e-467a-4398-818d-270ef48b80cf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022311c80f717a349509094f8d55613910f\u0022\u003ESTEVE ABEL (Green):\u003C/span\u003E I move, That the House take note of miscellaneous business.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000277\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e29c400e-467a-4398-818d-270ef48b80cf\u0022\u003EI sometimes feel\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000278\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002217ab7f14d06a437ebad783daa7fe5f76\u0022\u003ERt Hon Winston Peters\u003C/span\u003E: I wish you would!\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000279\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e29c400e-467a-4398-818d-270ef48b80cf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00228b0932fbcfd1493092bf240c2c8ec9e0\u0022\u003ESTEVE ABEL\u003C/span\u003E: \u2014that\u2019s very kind!\u2014that the sum of this House is, in fact, inferior to the conscience of the individuals within it.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000280\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c0f78f60-c2fd-46f4-8138-72f39692fc20\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022004e6562193341948b9f5d2381c6f836\u0022\u003EHon Todd McClay\u003C/span\u003E: Speak more highly of yourself.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000281\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e29c400e-467a-4398-818d-270ef48b80cf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022dbd771705b3b40b1aeb9a1e7fa5d5f0b\u0022\u003ESTEVE ABEL\u003C/span\u003E: I\u2019m speaking of the member opposite, even. I\u2019m saying that if it had been put to this House as a true conscience vote\u2014that is, whether this House would support the nasty Treaty principles bill\u2014I believe that members on the whole would have voted it down overwhelmingly. But, more than that, I even believe that if the motion was put to this House that M\u0101ori never ceded sovereignty and it was actually allowed to be voted on as a genuine matter of conscience, even now the House and the members of it would vote in support of that motion.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000282\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00225c0e8d78aebd427ab8b9d22b3ee51f6a\u0022\u003ERt Hon Winston Peters\u003C/span\u003E: That\u2019s drivel. That\u2019s arrogant drivel. That\u2019s arrogant white man\u2019s drivel. What do you know about it?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000283\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e29c400e-467a-4398-818d-270ef48b80cf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00225ab5d47a762145ff8bcd580ba8667d81\u0022\u003ESTEVE ABEL\u003C/span\u003E: Well, I would love it if the Deputy Prime Minister would support that motion being put, and let\u2019s see what happens. This Government, and, unfortunately, the expressions from both the Prime Minister and the Deputy Prime Minister in the last iteration of this question time, is anachronistic. It is behind the times in terms of the feeling that is now embodied in the people of this country. What was manifest in that magnificent h\u012Bkoi yesterday that turned up here in its tens of thousands was that the majority of New Zealanders support a principle of unity, of kotahitanga, of standing together in the embodiment and the manifestation of the promise of our founding agreement, Te Tiriti o Waitangi. That indeed will sweep away the hatred and the division embodied by the likes of Hobson\u2019s Pledge. It will sweep it away in a movement of unity that establishes the true promise of Te Tiriti.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000284\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e29c400e-467a-4398-818d-270ef48b80cf\u0022\u003EWhat we have here is an unstoppable commitment to the recognition that we as a nation are stronger when we stand together, and that was the promise that was always embodied in Te Tiriti o Waitangi. The small-minded selling of snake oil that suggests that somehow Te Tiriti is a threat to equality is exactly that. It is snake oil. Te Tiriti embodies a principle of equality in Article the Third, and what is more, we have the New Zealand Bill of Rights Act. We have those things that guarantee equality. In its fundamental sense, Te Tiriti is about relationships, and no one meaningfully wants to have a relationship that does not see self-determination for the other party to that relationship. Who in their hearts wants their children to be raised in a nation where there is not justice for M\u0101ori? Not I, and I\u2019m sure that in all of our hearts we do not want to see that.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000285\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e29c400e-467a-4398-818d-270ef48b80cf\u0022\u003EWhat we have here is, I believe, the last vestiges of that backward thinking that is embodied in the policies of this Government, not just the Treaty principles bill but the removal of section 7AA in terms of Oranga Tamariki, the backward step in the marine and coastal environment, and the 2004 legislation that began the first large h\u012Bkoi. Well, it didn\u2019t begin the first large h\u012Bkoi\u2014there were many h\u012Bkoi before that, but it was the last time until yesterday that we had a major h\u012Bkoi. There was also the revoking of the M\u0101ori Health Authority. All of these actions are actually examples of a Government that has got it completely backwards on what the priorities are for most New Zealanders.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000286\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e29c400e-467a-4398-818d-270ef48b80cf\u0022\u003EIn its essence, the Treaty is about our founding relationship. Te Tiriti underpins a just society. It holds diversity as a strength. It honours a simple principle\u2014that the power of our nationhood begins with the bond of respect. It upholds the right to self-determination for M\u0101ori, the first New Zealanders. It is a living document that ensures dignity and belonging to all of those who make Aotearoa home. It is\u2014and I will say this time and time again because no one has ever said it better\u2014in the words of Moana Jackson, a profound and visionary base upon which to build a country. From yesterday, we have a movement that will take us to constitutional transformation that will fulfil the obligations and the promise of Te Tiriti o Waitangi.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022 data-id=\u0022dd94ce90bf0b4f9493ec9b7320389206\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000287\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022dd94ce90bf0b4f9493ec9b7320389206\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: There is currently quite a volume of noise coming from the gallery as people organise to observe what\u2019s happening for the rest of the afternoon. I just ask the people in the gallery to talk in a whisper rather than a loud voice, if that\u2019s OK.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022c0f78f60-c2fd-46f4-8138-72f39692fc20\u0022 data-id=\u0022328cafcd52a8460cb7e79709db70c88d\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000288\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c0f78f60-c2fd-46f4-8138-72f39692fc20\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022328cafcd52a8460cb7e79709db70c88d\u0022\u003EHon TODD McCLAY (Minister of Agriculture):\u003C/span\u003E Well, Mr Speaker, thank you very much. It\u2019s a pleasure and a privilege to speak in the general debate, and I note that it is my first opportunity this year. I was reflecting for a moment, whilst not listening to the speech of the last member, Steve Abel, that, ultimately, of all the things I\u2019ve been asked to do in this Parliament\u2014of course, with the exception of being the member of Parliament for Rotorua\u2014the greatest privilege and responsibility I feel is as the Minister of Agriculture, because, every day, I get to come to work as the Minister of Agriculture, supported by every single member from each of the parties in the coalition Government to work hard, to make the lot better for our farmers. Today, on behalf of the Government, I would like to say to the farmers of New Zealand that we understand how hard you work and we\u2019re grateful for the work that you put in and for your significant contribution to New Zealand\u2014not only to our economy but to every part of life in New Zealand.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000289\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c0f78f60-c2fd-46f4-8138-72f39692fc20\u0022\u003EOur farmers have been doing it hard and, over a period of time, much harder than they need to. Yet, they get out of bed every day, they take risks, they work hard, they care about their animals, they care about the environment, and they deliver for New Zealand. Whenever New Zealand has had problems with the economy, irrespective of the Government, it\u2019s the farmers that dig deep, produce high-quality, safe food and fibre to export to the world, and they rebuild the economy, and they\u2019re helping this Government pay off the huge hole of debt run up by the Labour Party when they were there.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000290\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c0f78f60-c2fd-46f4-8138-72f39692fc20\u0022\u003EIt\u2019s very easy being the Minister of Agriculture in a National - ACT - New Zealand First Government because we are the Government, we are the parties, that understand farmers and how hard they work. We have been working as hard in the last year as they have. I won\u2019t go through the whole list, but these are just some of the things that we\u2019ve been able to do to help them because we trust farmers. We know they care about their land, we know if we set sensible rules, they will work to them, and, in many cases, they\u2019ll do much more than a Government would ask them to do to meet their environmental responsibilities and to grow the economy.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000291\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c0f78f60-c2fd-46f4-8138-72f39692fc20\u0022\u003EWe\u2019ve disbanded He Waka Eke Noa, and even members opposite, in Labour, are pleased we\u2019ve done that, because I don\u2019t think they wanted it in the end either. We\u2019re removing agriculture from the emissions trading scheme. We\u2019re restoring common sense to intensive winter grazing and stock exclusion rules. We\u2019re committed to rebalancing the hierarchy of obligations under Te Mana o te Wai to recognise the rights and responsibilities of all water users. We\u2019ve commenced an independent review of biogenic methane. We launched a select committee report inquiry into banking. We\u2019ve invested more in catchment groups. We\u2019ve invested more in rural support trusts. We\u2019ve introduced pragmatic rules for on-farm water storage. We\u2019ve established a pastoral group to work with the Government\u2014actually in partnership\u2014to find solutions to the challenges of climate change. We\u2019ve begun reforming rules around biotech, we have implemented sensible changes around significant natural areas, and the list goes on, and it goes on and it goes on.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000292\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c0f78f60-c2fd-46f4-8138-72f39692fc20\u0022\u003EThis year, we will hear very soon about agriculture\u2019s contribution to the economy\u2014more than $55\u00A0billion worth of exports all over the world; high-quality, safe food that consumers around the world not only want, they are willing to pay more for, and they\u2019re doing that as a result of the reputation of New Zealand producers and New Zealand farmers, and this is a Government that backs them. We\u2019re actually saying we\u2019re not going to leave them alone, that we have their backs, and we\u2019re going to work harder for them to get more money through the farm gate because we want our farmers and growers to earn more this year and next year for their hard work than they have previously. We\u2019re going to reduce costs and get what they earn up.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000293\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c0f78f60-c2fd-46f4-8138-72f39692fc20\u0022\u003EAlready in the area of market access, we\u2019ve got some runs on the board in just 12\u00A0months. For instance, we\u2019ve got the EU free-trade agreement (FTA) into place many months sooner than we were told we would, which means that kiwifruit and onion producers got $46\u00A0million extra this year in tariff savings that they wouldn\u2019t have otherwise. That New Zealand - UAE FTA, which we negotiated in just 4\u00BD months, gives the best access on day one to that market of any agreement that New Zealand has ever signed. And the conclusion of the Gulf Cooperation Council (GCC) agreement with those Gulf States after 18 years means that our exporters will do better.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000294\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c0f78f60-c2fd-46f4-8138-72f39692fc20\u0022\u003EI have a prediction for the sheep farmers out there who are doing it harder than anybody else around New Zealand\u2014they will remember the years when, actually, all of our lamb used to go into Iran. I think the GCC and, particularly, Saudi Arabia, who have a great desire for the food that we produce and the lamb that we grow in New Zealand, will actually replace what Iran was, so that we can sell more. The Government is doing that, with the Prime Minister leading, hustling on the world stage, with the Deputy Prime Minister out there bringing down our barriers so that we can have better access, and with me as the trade Minister. We\u2019re doing that so our farmers can earn more and our sheep farmers can do well. The Agreement on Trade and Sustainability\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022 data-id=\u00220a6af9f227604ddcab492ddce0409474\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000295\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00220a6af9f227604ddcab492ddce0409474\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Very good\u2014the member\u2019s time has well expired.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00227a76db18-baa4-41c1-b366-89e2c753a1e7\u0022 data-id=\u00222c39938cb94e4b11b33435a92c6ef595\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000296\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227a76db18-baa4-41c1-b366-89e2c753a1e7\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00222c39938cb94e4b11b33435a92c6ef595\u0022\u003EDEBBIE NGAREWA-PACKER (Co-Leader\u2014Te P\u0101ti M\u0101ori):\u003C/span\u003E T\u0113n\u0101 koe e te P\u012Bka. First of all, I\u2019d like to mihi to our people who rose in the last nine to 10 days and arrived here in a huge korowai of love. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000297\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227a76db18-baa4-41c1-b366-89e2c753a1e7\u0022\u003EKa nui te mihi aroha o t\u014D t\u0101tou Ku\u012Bni, Ariki Nga wai hono i te po [Many compassionate acknowledgments of our Queen, Queen Nga wai hono i te po], who saw her people walking, who felt the pain of her people, and led with them. Huge acknowledgment to the communities who dipped into their pockets, who dipped into their w\u2019\u0101nau pockets, and who made sure they supported our wh\u0101nau. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000298\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227a76db18-baa4-41c1-b366-89e2c753a1e7\u0022\u003EA huge mihi to Toit\u016B Te Tiriti kaihaut\u016B, who, with the experience of the OGs, carried the pouwhenua o Te R\u014Dp\u016B Matakite. You mobilised, you showed, with determination and dignity, that you could care for each other, respect the mana of the whenua you moved through, and the reconciliation and the respect that got you here. We have immense pride in the way you mobilised and arose, and we showed that we are not outnumbered. In fact, we showed we can organise ourselves. You know and I know that there were at least 70,000 to 80,000 there\u2014the police, clearly, left the rangatahi and the children out\u2014but we\u2019ve become used to that narrative from this place, and despite our staff being blocked from being able to give out water and toilet our kaum\u0101tua, and being blocked from being able to look after our disabled community, we still looked after you with dignity. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000299\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227a76db18-baa4-41c1-b366-89e2c753a1e7\u0022\u003EE te iwi, you have every right to rise, every right to be angry and deeply hurt. This Government has betrayed iwi M\u0101ori. It has unleashed a wrecking ball through te iwi M\u0101ori. The Prime Minister has traded the mana of Te Tiriti. He\u2019s exposed our mokopuna to harm for a bill it doesn\u2019t even intend to support. He thinks so little of te iwi M\u0101ori that he has unleashed an unprecedented attack on our mokopuna, which we are forced to defend. Be very clear who the attacker and who the defenders here are, and we will expose to the world the cruelty of this Government. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000300\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227a76db18-baa4-41c1-b366-89e2c753a1e7\u0022\u003ETe Puea and T\u0101 Apirana collaborated. They strengthened and they joined forces to mobilise an affirmative action to unite and strengthen our people. This was the price of citizenship. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000301\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227a76db18-baa4-41c1-b366-89e2c753a1e7\u0022\u003EK\u014Dhanga reo was created as a movement of young parents over 40 years ago to mobilise an affirmative action reclaiming te reo tikanga for our babies, and here we have, accumulated over nine days, an affirmative call to action that landed and was realised at Parliament yesterday. Our babies of 40 years ago are leaders today. They are smart, they are savvy, in two worlds ki te ao [in the world], and that threatens those who thrive off a one-world view.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000302\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227a76db18-baa4-41c1-b366-89e2c753a1e7\u0022\u003EGovernments in this House have crossed many, many lines. In the past, they have moved bills to confiscate our whenua. They have moved bills to imprison our t\u016Bpuna without trial. They have moved and apologised for the way that they have treated te iwi M\u0101ori. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000303\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227a76db18-baa4-41c1-b366-89e2c753a1e7\u0022\u003ETino rangatiratanga is not found in David Seymour\u2019s bill. Tino rangatiratanga is not found in Luxon\u2019s coalition agreement. Tino rangatiratanga is not found in that uncle\u2014it\u2019s not found in New Zealand First. Tino rangatiratanga is not determined by the K\u0101wanatanga. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000304\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227a76db18-baa4-41c1-b366-89e2c753a1e7\u0022\u003ETino rangatiratanga is in you. Tino rangatiratanga is in me. Tino rangatiratanga is in our\u00A0mokopuna. That\u2019s where tino rangatiratanga is, and anyone that tries to silence our mokopuna in this House will see the wrath of te ao M\u0101ori and the wrath of our tikanga. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000305\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227a76db18-baa4-41c1-b366-89e2c753a1e7\u0022\u003ETino rangatiratanga is about us. It belongs in our homes, in our marae, in our hap\u016B, and in our communities. We are our own rangatiratanga, and I get that not everybody wants to celebrate their rangatiratanga, but we are it, and that\u2019s what\u2019s next, wh\u0101nau m\u0101. What\u2019s next and what comes next is us asserting our rangatiratanga. \u201CKo te kokonga o te whare e kitea, engari ko te kokonga o te ng\u0101kau k\u0101ore e kitea\u201D. [\u201CThe corners of a house are clear to see, but the corners of the heart are invisible\u201D.]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000306\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227a76db18-baa4-41c1-b366-89e2c753a1e7\u0022\u003EThere is no aroha for our people in this House. There is no aroha when we sit there and we have to see our staff blocked from being able to manaaki, to give water to everybody, because what the last nine days has been about, wh\u0101nau m\u0101, is everybody\u2014everybody who fights and wants to have the right to live with peace, and aroha, and dignity. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000307\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227a76db18-baa4-41c1-b366-89e2c753a1e7\u0022\u003EThis is what it\u2019s about, wh\u0101nau. You are the affirmative action. You are the next step. You have the ability to march and put yourself and register on the M\u0101ori roll. That is the only way we\u2019re ever going to clean up this paruwaru. That is the only way you\u2019re going to be able to assert and make sure this Government and future Governments never try to tinker, or tamper, or tut\u016B with our Tiriti and our mokopuna. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000308\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227a76db18-baa4-41c1-b366-89e2c753a1e7\u0022\u003EE te wh\u0101nau m\u0101, e te wh\u0101nau m\u0101, that is the affirmative action. You have it within yourselves. It takes two minutes to go home and to get on and make sure you register to go on to the M\u0101ori roll. Do not let them have the last say, e te iwi M\u0101ori. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022a1f7bbd1-b6ae-41c0-963b-dbe1251f5540\u0022 data-id=\u002224031e11af9e40acb1ee90c94ed8e9e0\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000309\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a1f7bbd1-b6ae-41c0-963b-dbe1251f5540\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002224031e11af9e40acb1ee90c94ed8e9e0\u0022\u003EHon KIERAN McANULTY (Labour):\u003C/span\u003E Point of order, Mr Speaker. Thank you, Mr Speaker. Does the requirement for interjections to be rare and reasonable still apply during the general debate? \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022 data-id=\u0022b4165034367742b09a34b167361b44a9\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000310\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022b4165034367742b09a34b167361b44a9\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Probably less so. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000311\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a1f7bbd1-b6ae-41c0-963b-dbe1251f5540\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00225a5fa9593ff24b39a808b174a6671a2f\u0022\u003EHon Kieran McAnulty\u003C/span\u003E: Less so? OK. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000312\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002249ed4e01301e47b0bba9937aa3579c89\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: It\u2019s generally a very robust debate, as the member will be well aware, but if I\u2019m being asked to make a statement now about what might be coming, then, you know, it\u2019s obviously a moveable feast.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000313\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a1f7bbd1-b6ae-41c0-963b-dbe1251f5540\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00228ddc900805de42f186f7e6bfba220f90\u0022\u003EHon Kieran McAnulty\u003C/span\u003E: No, not at all. No, it\u2019s what has been; not what\u2019s coming. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000314\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022d1cdf99193b14753b26ecd6989a708ef\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: OK, right. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022 data-id=\u0022d01bf507bdb64c8a87c5135a3e890370\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000315\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022d01bf507bdb64c8a87c5135a3e890370\u0022\u003ERt Hon WINSTON PETERS (Deputy Prime Minister):\u003C/span\u003E Yesterday\u2019s h\u012Bkoi wasn\u2019t grassroots; it was\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000316\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a39c442613054ca0acdb1177c5cd3eb5\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Sorry, I have called you, so we\u2019ll stick with that, but it was a Labour call. My apologies. The Rt Hon Winston Peters will start again.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000317\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a352f0fff4c04cb5afd6b4f711779a6c\u0022\u003ERt Hon WINSTON PETERS\u003C/span\u003E: Yesterday\u2019s h\u012Bkoi wasn\u2019t grassroots; it was a M\u0101ori Party astroturf. What most in the mainstream media are not reporting is that the organiser of the h\u012Bkoi is the son of sitting M\u0101ori Party MP Kapa-Kingi. He\u2019s employed by the M\u0101ori Party and stood as a candidate for the M\u0101ori Party before. The company that fund-raised and coordinated the h\u012Bkoi was incorporated in September by the wife of Rawiri Waititi and the daughter of the M\u0101ori Party president, John Tamihere. This was a total commercial jack-up. Driving and flying to Parliament in their \u201Ccar-koi\u201D was nothing but a recruitment and fund-raising tool for the M\u0101ori Party, and the Labour Party ignorantly joined them at doing it.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000318\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022\u003EThe M\u0101ori Party just used and manipulated thousands of M\u0101ori yesterday for their pointless political stunt. They staged a protest against a piece of legislation that they already knew is not going to pass into law. The faux outrage is obvious for all those who can see it for what it is. Their aim was to gather anyone and everyone, no matter what their cause, including patched gang members. It\u2019s the same reason they conducted a sham haka in the House last week\u2014a disgraceful, pre-planned, and coordinated stunt that served only to intimidate and undermine the running of the House and grab as many headlines as they could.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000319\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022\u003EThey are a bunch of extremists and middle New Zealand has had enough. New Zealand is a democracy whether the M\u0101ori Party like it or not, and using M\u0101ori culture as an excuse for their disgraceful behaviour is an insult to M\u0101oridom. I have never seen this kind of arrogant person in the House like we\u2019ve seen with the M\u0101ori Party today. No ordinary Kiwi, M\u0101ori or non-M\u0101ori, should accept this behaviour and intent of this party of extremists. They don\u2019t want democracy; they want anarchy. They don\u2019t want one country, one people, one law; they want separatism, division, and the laws being based on race the way they see it. They state that specifically, and the Labour Party have fallen over themselves to try and join them in their race to the bottom.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000320\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022\u003EThere are some more conservative Labour MPs who know they are coming to a point of no return. Their party has already left middle New Zealand a long time ago, and their party is going to leave them hanging in the wind soon also. They must wake up at night in cold sweats, thinking about how much Labour is now fighting for the space on the woke far left instead of fighting for middle New Zealand. There are too many people there who don\u2019t know what a working day is. They\u2019ve never done a manual job, and they don\u2019t know what poverty smells, tastes, and feels like\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000321\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022471dee54-f59e-4497-b3d3-c39044ce7169\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022f25f88c0c28f44489f6592fde51ef4d6\u0022\u003EHon Damien O\u2019Connor\u003C/span\u003E: Oh, that\u2019s wrong.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000322\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022dc04b85b351a46a98023e0096415f59c\u0022\u003ERt Hon WINSTON PETERS\u003C/span\u003E: \u2014and it shows all the time. No, no, that member knows. I know he knows. Take a look at his hands and I know he knows, but they don\u2019t know.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000323\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022\u003ENow, since 1867, M\u0101ori have been elected to Parliament, with just four winning a general seat until the introduction of MMP, and I\u2019m one of those four. We saw the exponential growth of the number of M\u0101ori MPs with MMP. Right now, we have the record number of M\u0101ori in Cabinet\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000324\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a1f7bbd1-b6ae-41c0-963b-dbe1251f5540\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022028abfefe22b4492b516d7088fdbfe2b\u0022\u003EHon Kieran McAnulty\u003C/span\u003E: You can\u2019t make a speech without reading.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000325\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022ffd6eab8fb574b00aa8066f9153d43e8\u0022\u003ERt Hon WINSTON PETERS\u003C/span\u003E: \u2014of any Government\u2014more than all the M\u0101ori Party MPs combined. Yeah, I\u2019m reading it because I wrote it. Unlike that member, I can write my own speech. I\u2019m not an incoherent, thoughtless twit. I\u2019ve got it out there because it\u2019s going out shortly over the airwaves and I want the language to be as accurate as I planned it.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000326\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022\u003EHere we go. We\u2019ve got a record number, and all the party of extremists wants to do is act with utter contempt and ignorance of the process that has been made thus far in all we\u2019ve accomplished. And what is their record for M\u0101ori? They\u2019ve done, over the years, exactly nothing. Some of us can speak for days about what we\u2019ve done, but not them. They are trying to tear down our country along with them. We are not going to concede or yield to these separatists, these people who spew an anthem of hate against other people. We will not be bullied by these cultural elitist extremists.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000327\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022\u003EWe stand for one people, one country, one flag, united as one, M\u0101ori and non-M\u0101ori, and as someone who can remember the M\u0101ori Land March\u2014and all its beginnings in a famous court case in 1974 and 1975, over 50 years ago\u2014and Whina Cooper being at a meeting one night in Pataua when we were getting ready to take on the then Labour Party Government and the Whang\u0101rei County Council, and she said, \u201CI know what I\u2019ll do. We\u2019ll have a M\u0101ori land march.\u201D That\u2019s the background of this sort of behaviour\u2014not this \u201Ccar-koi\u201D I saw yesterday\u2014where she endeavoured to walk as many kilometres as she could. This is someone I know, not yesterday\u2019s pretence where Te P\u0101ti M\u0101ori also stayed at the Sofitel, flew down at the taxpayers\u2019 cost, stayed the Sofitel, then back they go.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000328\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022\u003EWe are not going to take it any more. It\u2019s the only way our country will ever succeed, and we will never give up fighting for that. In the words of The Seekers, \u201Cthe carnival is over\u201D.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022 data-id=\u0022e0f87c61e76049cd960657c27c275f5f\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000329\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022e0f87c61e76049cd960657c27c275f5f\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: It\u2019s my fault that the sequence of the afternoon\u2019s debate has got out of sequence. There will be two Labour speeches consecutively over the next two calls.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022a503e324-3a0b-4efd-bf44-ec6740ec9a62\u0022 data-id=\u00229df74576c5de4357867a9862b5ead4bd\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000330\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a503e324-3a0b-4efd-bf44-ec6740ec9a62\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00229df74576c5de4357867a9862b5ead4bd\u0022\u003ECAMILLA BELICH (Labour):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Mr Speaker. It\u2019s an honour to be able to contribute to this general debate today. I know there are a lot of very important issues going on this week\u2014the h\u012Bkoi yesterday, which I participated in; I\u2019m sunburnt and I\u2019ve got blisters from it. I want to acknowledge everyone who turned out yesterday. I also want to acknowledge the reading of a very important, significant bill for the Samoan community that will be coming up too.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000331\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a503e324-3a0b-4efd-bf44-ec6740ec9a62\u0022\u003EWhat I want to speak about today is the anniversary yesterday of Pike River, which was 14 years ago, and the acknowledgment that the House made yesterday of the loss of those 29 men\u2014acknowledging their families, their friends, acknowledging the people who took part in the rescue and recovery events following that, and still think of those family members every day. I want to acknowledge the House for unanimously remembering that fateful day.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000332\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a503e324-3a0b-4efd-bf44-ec6740ec9a62\u0022\u003ENow, of course, that day changed the health and safety approach that New Zealand had. Since then, we\u2019ve had significant changes to our health and safety legislation and significant changes, I think, to our approach to health and safety. These have largely been things that have had agreement across the House. Health and safety, I think, is an area that doesn\u2019t need to be politicised. We are all of the view as New Zealanders that everyone deserves to go to work and come home safely, and we should all be working towards that objective.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000333\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a503e324-3a0b-4efd-bf44-ec6740ec9a62\u0022\u003EUnfortunately, since our reforms that were undertaken by the then National Government after Pike River, we haven\u2019t seen a significant decrease in the number of workplace fatalities or the number of workplace-related illnesses that people have contracted at work. I think the estimate that WorkSafe has, including illnesses and fatalities, is that around 10,000 people, over 10,000 people, have been killed as a result of those work-related injuries and illnesses. This number is simply too high. We must do better as a country.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000334\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a503e324-3a0b-4efd-bf44-ec6740ec9a62\u0022\u003EIt is very difficult to point the finger at one particular reason for this, because we do have very similar regulatory systems to countries that have much better health and safety statistics. What I mean by that is when they send their people out to work, they\u2019ve got a much better chance of coming home safely than they do in New Zealand. Two countries that do have very similar regulatory systems to us are Australia and the United Kingdom, but we have 60\u00A0percent higher fatalities than Australia and a massive 500\u00A0percent higher fatalities than the United Kingdom. We must do better.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000335\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a503e324-3a0b-4efd-bf44-ec6740ec9a62\u0022\u003EWhat we know now is that the Government is currently reviewing health and safety in New Zealand. What I would urge the Minister for Workplace Relations and Safety, and in fact members of the Governing parties, to consider is the fact that this does not need to be a thing that divides us politically. We need to make decisions to invest in health and safety. That\u2019s not just me saying that as someone who is looking for bipartisan consensus to invest in health and safety. This is actually something echoed by the business leaders throughout New Zealand. In fact, 60 businesses recently wrote to the Minister and suggested that there should be more investment and better regulatory reform around health and safety.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000336\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a503e324-3a0b-4efd-bf44-ec6740ec9a62\u0022\u003ENow, I know the Minister is looking at this and has recently concluded an exercise on what changes should be made to health and safety, but what I\u2019m concerned about is the direction this is going in, considering the cuts that the Government has made not only in this particular area but across the public sector. Since last November, WorkSafe, which is our main health and safety regulator, has cut 113 roles and been ordered by Cabinet to find at least $5\u00A0million worth of savings. They\u2019ve recently announced a second restructuring process that would look to reduce and change their workforce, and they are looking to change 180 roles. They\u2019ve already lost 15\u00A0percent of their staff\u2014an additional 10\u00A0percent of their budget through agreements with ACC. We need more investment and we need better regulatory reform in health and safety.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000337\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a503e324-3a0b-4efd-bf44-ec6740ec9a62\u0022\u003EBusinesses throughout New Zealand are saying this, they\u2019re doing this, and they\u2019re saying this in conjunction with unions. The reason that this is so important is we now have the same number of health and safety inspectors per head of population that we had during Pike River. We cannot allow another Pike River to happen under our watch. So I urge this House and I urge the Minister to come together to make sure we have the world-leading health and safety regulatory system that keeps our people safe at work so that when we say goodbye to our loved ones in the morning, we know with confidence that they are going to be able to come home safe at the end of the day.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00221ebd1031-ea10-4c3d-bb56-2cd99528ae91\u0022 data-id=\u00227145cedc502544aca444064f0b29fc56\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000338\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221ebd1031-ea10-4c3d-bb56-2cd99528ae91\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00227145cedc502544aca444064f0b29fc56\u0022\u003EHon WILLOW-JEAN PRIME (Labour):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Mr Speaker, and can I also acknowledge those who are here in the gallery this afternoon.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000339\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221ebd1031-ea10-4c3d-bb56-2cd99528ae91\u0022\u003EYesterday, we greeted the H\u012Bkoi m\u014D Te Tiriti here on the lawns of Parliament\u2014well, those that could fit on to the lawns of Parliament. We\u2019ve been watching the h\u012Bkoi\u2019s progress over the past nine days, winding its way across the country from Muriwhenua and Murihiku and activating large crowds across the motu. In what I believe to be the largest Parliament protest in history, we saw tens of thousands of New Zealanders converge on Parliament to send this Government a message. That message is \u201CKill the bill\u201D. We don\u2019t need your Treaty principles bill, your divisive, moumou moni, moumou t\u0101ima [waste of money, waste of time] bill. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000340\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221ebd1031-ea10-4c3d-bb56-2cd99528ae91\u0022\u003EThe bill does nothing but take M\u0101ori-Crown relationships backwards. It undermines decades of progress we have fought hard for to recognise and compensate for past breaches of Te Tiriti o Waitangi.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000341\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221ebd1031-ea10-4c3d-bb56-2cd99528ae91\u0022\u003EAs Chris Hipkins said, this bill is structured to facilitate anger, hatred, fear, resentment, and division, and the only reason we have this bill is because Christopher Luxon is willing to trade off M\u0101ori-Crown relationships, undermine M\u0101ori rights, and waste over $4\u00A0million simply because he prioritised his deal with David Seymour over the best interests of the New Zealand public.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000342\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221ebd1031-ea10-4c3d-bb56-2cd99528ae91\u0022\u003EWhile we are being deliberately distracted, let\u2019s not forget that in the New Zealand First and National coalition agreement, the Prime Minister, Christopher Luxon, has agreed to a comprehensive review of all legislation and all references to Treaty principles in legislation, and what they have agreed to is to replace it with specific words\u2014what words; who is deciding what those words are?\u2014or to repeal it entirely. This is all because Christopher Luxon has agreed to this. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000343\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221ebd1031-ea10-4c3d-bb56-2cd99528ae91\u0022\u003EThis Government has already done so much damage to M\u0101ori. They\u2019ve disestablished Te Aka Whai Ora, an entity established to help address significant health disparities that M\u0101ori suffer in this country. They have directed Pharmac not to prioritise work on the Treaty, despite obvious health needs for M\u0101ori. They\u2019ve downgraded Te Tiriti in our schools and in what we teach our children. They\u2019ve started to rewrite and rebalance Aotearoa histories in schools. They\u2019ve introduced a bill that will repeal the Treaty provisions in the Oranga Tamariki Act\u2014section 7AA. This is the legislation that governs State care, where M\u0101ori are disproportionately represented because of our country\u2019s colonial history. They have implemented boot camps, a failed experiment that impacts significantly on rangatahi M\u0101ori. All participants are rangatahi M\u0101ori. They are removing M\u0101ori wards in an attempt to diminish M\u0101ori voices. They are amending the Marine and Coastal Area (Takutai Moana) Act to make it harder for M\u0101ori to exercise their rights. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000344\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221ebd1031-ea10-4c3d-bb56-2cd99528ae91\u0022\u003EToday, the lead Minister for the Government\u2019s response to the royal commission could not even say that she accepts the findings that conclude that contributing factors to neglect and abuse in care were the lack of legislation specific to care settings that gave effect to\u2014wait for it\u2014Te Tiriti o Waitangi.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000345\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221ebd1031-ea10-4c3d-bb56-2cd99528ae91\u0022\u003ELet\u2019s make no mistake, this Government is hell-bent on taking M\u0101ori and race relations backwards, as if the only way they can maintain power is to divide us, but yesterday, what we also saw at the h\u012Bkoi was a beautiful demonstration of kotahitanga. The Treaty unites us. Don\u2019t use it to divide us. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000346\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221ebd1031-ea10-4c3d-bb56-2cd99528ae91\u0022\u003EI want to mihi to all of those who came to Parliament and to all of those who could not be here but were supporting from afar. The message that you brought was powerful. It is one of hope and positivity for our future. I implore this Government to recognise and respect Te Tiriti o Waitangi. Kia ora, Mr Speaker.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022ee649aea-c6fa-4610-9fcf-5c4bb2d3cd33\u0022 data-id=\u002297dfa7595ddb4f14b83bc29522253963\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000347\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ee649aea-c6fa-4610-9fcf-5c4bb2d3cd33\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002297dfa7595ddb4f14b83bc29522253963\u0022\u003EHon MATT DOOCEY (Minister for Mental Health):\u003C/span\u003E Recently, I had the pleasure in \u014Ctautahi Christchurch of opening the new Mapu Maia Pasifika mental health and addiction service. What a great service Mapu Maia is in the Pasifika community, because for us on this side of the House, what it speaks to is local solutions for local needs. We know that in mental health that is the approach we need. It\u2019s about local communities being supported and empowered to look after themselves\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000348\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c3a88c42-f60b-4cf9-8065-8bfb80a020eb\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002246118ac9bb954126b68d7ca9cfb6d683\u0022\u003EHon Carmel Sepuloni\u003C/span\u003E: How much money was cut from the Pacific budget this year, Mr Doocey?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000349\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ee649aea-c6fa-4610-9fcf-5c4bb2d3cd33\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022798006568a78414fa3e7dd4d8bb14495\u0022\u003EHon MATT DOOCEY\u003C/span\u003E: \u2014and Mapu Maia is a good example of that. The Opposition can call out, but what they need to take responsibility for is the dire straits of the health system that they left us after six years. They took a wrecking ball to the health system in the middle of a pandemic. Their own report said to reduce from 20 district health boards to between eight to 10. What did they do? In the middle of a pandemic, they took a wrecking ball to the health system and went down to zero. What they did was centralise. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000350\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ee649aea-c6fa-4610-9fcf-5c4bb2d3cd33\u0022\u003ELet\u2019s look back at that last Government, which was a failed socialist experiment. Their only playbook was to centralise, whether it was the polytech reforms, whether it was three waters\u2014that went down like a cup of cold sick\u2014and, of course, the pae ora health reforms. In their view, Wellington knows best, but in local communities\u2019 view, they know that they know best. That\u2019s exactly what this Government is backing. When you look at the reforms we are bringing into the health system of bringing in regionalisation, of bringing back accountability and local decision making to the front line, that needs to be supported. What we don\u2019t want is money stuck in the beltway of Wellington. We need to get that out into the communities.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000351\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ee649aea-c6fa-4610-9fcf-5c4bb2d3cd33\u0022\u003EThat\u2019s why this coalition Government made the decision to fund Gumboot Friday: $24\u00A0million to give 15,000 young people the timely mental health support they need. It was great to see in the health survey that got released yesterday the declining rate of unmet need for young people for mental health, because when you look at the issue, it is about timely access. We want to ensure that when young people have a need for mental health support, they can get that need. That\u2019s why we\u2019re proud to fund hundreds of councillors across the motu that can reach out, quite often within 24 or 48 hours, to provide young people with the support they need. That\u2019s why this Government will ensure that we get money out of Wellington to the front line.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000352\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ee649aea-c6fa-4610-9fcf-5c4bb2d3cd33\u0022\u003EWe recently started rolling out a new peer support service in emergency departments. That was not new money; that was old money stuck in the beltway because of the last Government. Who would believe with all the need around mental health, the last Government was just\u00A0sitting on money in Wellington. That\u2019s why we\u2019ve got money out of Wellington to the front line.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000353\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ee649aea-c6fa-4610-9fcf-5c4bb2d3cd33\u0022\u003ELook at the recently announced mental health workforce plan. The Auditor-General came out in a damning report on the last Government: in six years, they hadn\u2019t even put a mental health workforce plan. We put that out in our first year.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000354\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ee649aea-c6fa-4610-9fcf-5c4bb2d3cd33\u0022\u003EOn top of that, we\u2019ve committed to doubling the amount of psychologists in New Zealand and increasing the number of psychiatrists training by 50\u00A0percent; also, a $1\u00A0million fund to train further peer support workers. All of that was done out of baseline. That didn\u2019t need any new funding. There was funding sitting in Wellington that the last Government wouldn\u2019t put out to the front line. They can talk a big game in mental health, but on this side of the House, we know that Wellington doesn\u2019t know best. We know the answer isn\u2019t just centralising. We want to back local communities like the Mapu Maia service in Christchurch, who will provide timely Pasifika mental health and addiction support. Thank you, Mr Speaker.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022cfc7092e-b202-4acf-aa9c-8aebd551cc39\u0022 data-id=\u00229c82b9a6a5ce4ed7ae20289b5112f545\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000355\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cfc7092e-b202-4acf-aa9c-8aebd551cc39\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00229c82b9a6a5ce4ed7ae20289b5112f545\u0022\u003ECAMERON LUXTON (ACT):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Mr Speaker. There is a dichotomy in life. All living creatures come and spring from the same source, meaning each of us is part of the whole. Since the first reproducing life emerged on this planet, we have been on a journey of diversifying into the myriad of species and ways of life that we see on Earth today. We humans have had a truly remarkable impact on this world, to the point that some have proposed a category of this epoch being the Anthropocene, the human era, to describe this time in Earth\u2019s history. Humans in our civilisation have reached great heights of achievement, and have made mistakes along the way.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000356\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cfc7092e-b202-4acf-aa9c-8aebd551cc39\u0022\u003EZooming in on this country, from the first human arrivals, we have introduced alien species to it and exterminated native ones. This place has changed beyond recognition from the primordial land that glided away into the South Pacific from Gondwana. We must see what has happened, but we must move forward and have a realistic view of the environment. I do not speak in this House today of grand global changes; I speak in this House about the parks, the ranges, the fiords, ng\u0101here, roto, ng\u0101 m\u0101unga [forests, lakes, and mountains], as well as the animals that are held within.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000357\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cfc7092e-b202-4acf-aa9c-8aebd551cc39\u0022\u003EIt is an interesting question: what gives value to an animal? Many don\u2019t think twice about swatting a fly or trapping a rat. Our Australian cousins shudder at our callous disregard to the life of their humble possum. There are many groups in New Zealand lauded and looked to for their environmental bona fides. In many cases, they do incredible work, but there is a group who has been overlooked. They are a diverse group from all parts of New Zealand and every walk of life, united in their pursuit of both that diversity and unity which is achieved when taking part in the most natural activity: hunting. Hunters are conservationists. Someone who hunts cannot help but care for the unified natural world because they are so much a part of it, and more than any human being could ever hope to be.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000358\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cfc7092e-b202-4acf-aa9c-8aebd551cc39\u0022\u003ETo be a hunter you need ecological insight and intuition, and to become a part of the ecosystem at a level that is totally unnecessary without the pursuit of an animal. Whatever game one is looking for, the hunter must understand the plants, the weather, the land, the history, the pursued animal, and the other species in the environment. It is a profound connection with nature. Hunters become part of, and care for, the environment because to be successful you must be a part of it. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000359\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cfc7092e-b202-4acf-aa9c-8aebd551cc39\u0022\u003ETo have hunters, there must be the hunted. In this country, these are mostly introduced species, the alien animals brought here by us, but these species have become as much a part of this land as we have. They are valuable. One value is realised in the effect of drawing thousands of Kiwis into the deepest parts of this country again and again, parts that are often only reached because of the animals they hold. To be a hunter, one must be in tune with the environment. The result is the people who see the changes first and in the greatest depths are often the hunters who walk on, crawl on, and sleep on the land as they move through its flora and fauna in the pursuit of those valuable animals.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000360\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cfc7092e-b202-4acf-aa9c-8aebd551cc39\u0022\u003EThese animals also have a more material value. Hunter-led groups such as the Sika Foundation harvest these animals and donate literally tonnes of healthy, nutritious meat to charities such as Meat the Need to share this bounty with communities who need it. The Fiordland Wapati Foundation uses their time and experience to run sections of Fiordland for the better management of the whole environment by sustainable harvest and\u00A0predator control. Hunters for Conservation are educating recreational hunters to be the ethical management tool to sustainably manage ko te ng\u0101here te taonga\u2014our treasured bush. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000361\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cfc7092e-b202-4acf-aa9c-8aebd551cc39\u0022\u003EOther groups, like the New Zealand Deerstalkers Association and their members, devote great labours and resources to keeping our tracks and huts open so all Kiwis can get out into our treasured natural asset. Hunters and the animals they value should be valued by all of us.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000362\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cfc7092e-b202-4acf-aa9c-8aebd551cc39\u0022\u003EWhen it comes to conserving our environment, I believe that hunters don\u2019t just deserve a voice at the table, I think that we\u2019d be crazy not to make a place for them. We can all gain from the deep connections, knowledge, and understanding which hunters have. Hunters come from all walks of life and the beauty of what it takes to be a hunter is that it is open to everyone. Thank you, Mr Speaker.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022f44431ef-b505-4e94-9f57-a60b0a569bf7\u0022 data-id=\u0022b5179d4659574f1b91ec9716bf44a616\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000363\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f44431ef-b505-4e94-9f57-a60b0a569bf7\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022b5179d4659574f1b91ec9716bf44a616\u0022\u003EHon SHANE JONES (Minister for Oceans and Fisheries):\u003C/span\u003E There\u2019s a great line out of the Good Book, and it actually refers to the fact that warmth can\u2019t be generated alone: ki te takoto tahi te tokorua t\u0113r\u0101 te mahana [we have seen heat but no warmth]. If I\u2019m not mistaken, it\u2019s from the Book of Ecclesiastes, and from the M\u0101ori Party we have seen heat but no warmth. There is no warmth emanating out to the broad New Zealand public, there is no warmth associated with people enjoying mutual respect, but there are ongoing accusations, ongoing reprising of historical events as if we live with them and under them as a yoke. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000364\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f44431ef-b505-4e94-9f57-a60b0a569bf7\u0022\u003EStop, M\u0101ori Party\u2014stop, M\u0101ori leadership\u2014condemning New Zealand to live under the shadow of made-up history and threats and exaggerations, and stop coming into this House. To my relations: no, you are not self-appointed; no, you are chattering fools. You may celebrate the h\u012Bkoi, but we know it was used as a recruitment device by yourselves, and also the shawl-wearing Green false prophets.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000365\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f44431ef-b505-4e94-9f57-a60b0a569bf7\u0022\u003EM\u0101oridom know, as my leader has just said, that the carnival is over; now it\u2019s back to the grindstone of life. Put your hands upon the plough. Look after ourselves. Stop all these false expectations that somehow through a h\u012Bkoi, somehow through endless debates about the Treaty that work will emerge, investment will flow, security will be widespread. That comes from the sweat of thy brow. I love sounding in this old-fashioned way, because that\u2019s what\u2019s missing from that particular narrative.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000366\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f44431ef-b505-4e94-9f57-a60b0a569bf7\u0022\u003EI don\u2019t know about you, New Zealanders, but I\u2019ve had a gutsful of the fake feathers, as artificial as the political narrative served up day after day after day, as if the only way forward for New Zealand is to continually turn around and join with a small group of M\u0101ori bemoaning our history. We cannot dissolve our history away. Irrespective of whether you regard it as having a bleak colour or a joyful colour, the future lies in front of us. What about that future? One thing: M\u0101ori Party, M\u0101ori leadership, be quick to listen. Be quick to listen and slow to speak.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000367\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f44431ef-b505-4e94-9f57-a60b0a569bf7\u0022\u003EI heard some of the speeches at the h\u012Bkoi yesterday. They were definitely a non-climax. They were not befitting for such an occasion and they offered no hope, they offered no integration, and they certainly offered no sense of direction. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000368\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f44431ef-b505-4e94-9f57-a60b0a569bf7\u0022\u003EOf course, New Zealand First will be condemning the Waitangi Tribunal to a haircut. We are sick and tired of what\u2019s been spilling out of those reports, which is driving New Zealanders apart but, more importantly, is not rooted in historical fact. Secondly, we most certainly will be proceeding. We will be proceeding to prune unnecessary references to the Treaty of Waitangi from the statutory foliage\u2014sloppy references to the Treaty\u2014to give focus, meaning, and confidence, because without investment, without growth, without jobs, without confidence, we are going to go continually down on a slippery slope where there is very little opportunity for the growth of our people in the future.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000369\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f44431ef-b505-4e94-9f57-a60b0a569bf7\u0022\u003ENow, I don\u2019t want to speak ill of the individuals who took time off work, pulled their kids out of school, marched throughout the huarahi, the roads, to come to the head of the fish, but know this from me: a child that is not educated, not well adjusted, is a child condemned to a very miserable existence. Stop believing that numeracy, literacy, and a robust understanding of our broad history is inferior to a day of a h\u012Bkoi. Of course people can enjoy their democratic rights, but those rights must be observed in the context of obligations. The coin of reciprocity has duty on one side and rights on the other.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000370\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f44431ef-b505-4e94-9f57-a60b0a569bf7\u0022\u003EM\u0101ori leadership, it\u2019s all very good to celebrate rights but teach our children, teach yourselves, that obligations and an ethic of service outstrips rights. It is time that service was emphasised and the words of dissention were sent to Coventry.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00229634e377-7e76-4353-9662-fb444eb2ec9d\u0022 data-id=\u0022e800ba0392cb49b2a8b312c0e0f8231c\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000371\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00229634e377-7e76-4353-9662-fb444eb2ec9d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022e800ba0392cb49b2a8b312c0e0f8231c\u0022\u003ECARL BATES (National\u2014Whanganui):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Mr Speaker. Before I start my contribution this afternoon, I just want to acknowledge those in the gallery who have come here today for the next part of the House\u2019s agenda, the Citizenship (Western Samoa) (Restoration) Amendment Bill. I want to acknowledge the contribution and work of my colleagues Cameron Brewer, Tim Costley, and Tom Rutherford, and members across the House for what will be a historic third reading this afternoon.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000372\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00229634e377-7e76-4353-9662-fb444eb2ec9d\u0022\u003EWhat I wanted to speak about in this debate is what delivery looks like; what a Government that is getting this country back on track looks like. From 1\u00A0January to 30\u00A0September 2023, versus 1\u00A0January to 30\u00A0September 2024, we have seen ram raids down 61\u00A0percent; we\u2019ve seen aggravated robbery down 11\u00A0percent; and we\u2019ve seen unlawful entry with intent, burglary, or breaking and entering down by 10\u00A0percent.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000373\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00229634e377-7e76-4353-9662-fb444eb2ec9d\u0022\u003ETonight the clock is ticking. Tick-tock\u2014tonight, the nightmare this evening will be for the gangs of this country, because despite what the Opposition want to try and convince this country of, it has taken something terrible for each of those members to have those patches. Those patches don\u2019t deserve to be seen in public, they don\u2019t deserve to be seen on the streets of this country, and they don\u2019t deserve to be on the arms of New Zealanders being seen by law-abiding citizens; so tick-tock, tick-tock, because at 12\u00A0o\u2019clock tonight, those gang patches will be banned from being seen by the public of this land\u2014as they should be.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000374\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00229634e377-7e76-4353-9662-fb444eb2ec9d\u0022\u003EThe Government has implemented tougher measures to combat gang violence and intimidation, including, as I say, the banning of gang patches in certain public cases, and we have given police powers to disrupt gang gatherings. The free ride for gangs is over when the clock strikes midnight tonight.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000375\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00229634e377-7e76-4353-9662-fb444eb2ec9d\u0022\u003EWe\u2019ve also seen an increase in police numbers. National has delivered on its commitment to boost front-line police numbers. During the campaign last year, I went into stores along Victoria Avenue that hadn\u2019t seen their local MP when the doors had been raided and they wanted to know where the police were. Well, foot patrols have increased by 30\u00A0percent; and, as I say, ram raids are down by 60\u00A0percent.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000376\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00229634e377-7e76-4353-9662-fb444eb2ec9d\u0022\u003EI received this text message the other day. It says, \u201CHello, Carl. I was wondering whether to bother you with the observation that the bobbies are again noticeably on the beat in the CBD.\u201D People are noticing it in the electorate, the wonderful electorate of Whanganui; they are noticing it across the country. They are noticing that National and this Government is delivering on our commitment not only to get this country back on track but to restore law and order to this nation.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000377\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00229634e377-7e76-4353-9662-fb444eb2ec9d\u0022\u003EWe are strengthening sentencing laws and there are new laws that have been introduced. Currently before the hard-working Justice Committee is the Sentencing (Reform) Amendment Bill and the Sentencing (Reinstating Three Strikes) Amendment Bill. We\u2019ve expanded youth crime initiatives, and much has been said on that already this\u00A0afternoon in this House. They are working and they are delivering. They are aimed at breaking the cycle of crime before it escalates.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000378\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00229634e377-7e76-4353-9662-fb444eb2ec9d\u0022\u003EI have seen a focus on the support for victims. The Government has expanded support services for the victims of crime, including faster access to counselling and financial assistance, reinforcing a victim-first approach to justice.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000379\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00229634e377-7e76-4353-9662-fb444eb2ec9d\u0022\u003EAs I bring this contribution to a conclusion, I want to acknowledge the contribution of Andrew Foster and welcome the new Police Commissioner, Richard Chambers, who I\u2019m sure will continue to put in this work to see law and order restored across this nation. Thank you, Mr Speaker.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00225ec01d23-b55e-45b9-a668-d3bf14212126\u0022 data-id=\u00228568163ccd1d45beadcf9df20eafe573\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000380\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225ec01d23-b55e-45b9-a668-d3bf14212126\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00228568163ccd1d45beadcf9df20eafe573\u0022\u003EHELEN WHITE (Labour\u2014Mt Albert):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Mr Speaker. Today, in Tokoroa, the Kinleith Mill announced that it is proposing to restructure, and 230 jobs will be lost in\u00A0the\u00A0mill if that occurs. The consultation period goes through to about January. Those 230 jobs are not the end of this story, because Tokoroa is a town of 14,000-plus people and it means that things like childcare centres and cafes and retail will all go by the wayside too.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000381\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225ec01d23-b55e-45b9-a668-d3bf14212126\u0022\u003EWe\u2019ve seen this happen in New Zealand before, where the Government has turned a blind eye to the need to get in boots and all and assist in rural communities to keep their industry afloat. As a result of that\u2014I was there; I remember that happening\u2014little towns took a battering and so did the people in them. When you get entrenched unemployment as a result of Government neglecting its role to lead and nurture our communities, you get entrenched unemployment. That actually, ironically, leads to people going into things like gangs because it is a hopeless situation, and bad stuff happens. I\u2019m not romanticising gangs when I say that, and I\u2019m not excusing them, but bad stuff happens in communities when we neglect them, because poverty is actually a huge, huge part of a problem.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000382\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225ec01d23-b55e-45b9-a668-d3bf14212126\u0022\u003EIn Tokoroa, we have decent work. We have great jobs in that mill. I\u2019ve been involved\u2014I was actually a lawyer involved in that work for many years\u2014so I know the value of that work and I know that this is an issue\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000383\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002236fcc60cda7d4b608a7bf90139c3079f\u0022\u003ERt Hon Winston Peters\u003C/span\u003E: What about Mt Albert?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000384\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225ec01d23-b55e-45b9-a668-d3bf14212126\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022b6a88318e32141d487aa53f92aaf0a27\u0022\u003EHELEN WHITE\u003C/span\u003E: I\u2019m looking at the Hon Winston Peters and I\u2019m thinking that, actually, New Zealand First has a really positive role to play here. It knows the value of Government getting in beside and doing stuff like the regional growth fund. The Provincial Growth Fund could really help in this situation, and it would be a really good thing if New Zealand First would stop worrying so much about battering the M\u0101ori Party and get on with helping a place like Kinleith, helping Tokoroa, because it has some bargaining power at the\u00A0table. I would love to see Shane Jones get in behind a bit of a rescue package here, because manufacturing New Zealand is in trouble. This is the fourth major closure of a manufacturing industry.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000385\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225ec01d23-b55e-45b9-a668-d3bf14212126\u0022\u003EWhat I was concerned to hear was the comments and responses coming from the social development Minister. She was basically saying, in a nutshell, \u201COh, you know, we\u2019ll be there to support the unemployed.\u201D She was not saying, \u201CWe\u2019ll get in and we\u2019ll make sure that unemployment doesn\u2019t happen and we\u2019ll build an economy and a manufacturing sector. We\u2019ll build it on the basis of what we\u2019ve got here: beautiful access to primary industries.\u201D We have great dairy. We have great timber industries. We have absolutely great wool and meat industries. And guess what\u2019s closing at the moment! We\u2019ve just had one of our major meat works close. We\u2019ve just had this closure: Winston Pulp International. It is a chance to get involved and make our economy one that actually pays off for the people in it.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000386\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225ec01d23-b55e-45b9-a668-d3bf14212126\u0022\u003EI don\u2019t want to hear any more about the gang patch issue and the crowing that things\u00A0are right. I want to hear people saying that they\u2019ll commit to decent jobs in this country, high employment, decent jobs, because once you start a cycle of entrenched unemployment, it isn\u2019t good for New Zealanders, and I think we should know that in this House. That\u2019s the difference between a platitude which comes out as \u201COh, we\u2019re so sorry. We\u2019ll get this country back on track.\u201D, and actually something real which is a concrete plan for manufacturing in this country, which brings about some hope for people, which actually produces something. Rather than talking about productivity, let\u2019s get on with it. I suggest that it\u2019s time to actually go up to Tokoroa, find out what\u2019s going wrong, and put some money and some support behind the people there to make sure that we keep our primary sector on track, actually.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000387\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225ec01d23-b55e-45b9-a668-d3bf14212126\u0022\u003EJust one final thing I\u2019d like to mention is that all recycling of paper ends if this mill closes. It goes offshore. It is a terrible thing to do to New Zealand.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002239b9bac1-a992-4ccf-a473-9591aeb3a298\u0022 data-id=\u0022a7d713ed40a342e6b7848a19be4d1856\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000388\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002239b9bac1-a992-4ccf-a473-9591aeb3a298\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022a7d713ed40a342e6b7848a19be4d1856\u0022\u003ERIMA NAKHLE (National\u2014Takanini):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Mr Speaker. Before I begin, I\u2019d like to acknowledge, as well, our beautiful members of our Samoan community in the gallery, a number of whom are from my neighbourhood of Takanini: hello and bless you and thank you for coming.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000389\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002239b9bac1-a992-4ccf-a473-9591aeb3a298\u0022\u003EI\u2019d like to begin with just reiterating what Minister Mark Mitchell said earlier this week. He said, \u201CAfter nearly a year in Government, Kiwis have seen significant change across law and order with promising early results shown across some Police statistics\u201D. In this statement, Minister Mitchell referred to a statement he made back in August of 2023 where the Minister told us Kiwis that if we did not start seeing a change in public safety within one year of his appointment as police Minister, he said\u2014back then\u2014he would resign. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000390\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002239b9bac1-a992-4ccf-a473-9591aeb3a298\u0022\u003ENow, the magnitude of that statement that he made in August 2023 was quite compelling to me, for two reasons. First, because it showed how serious Mr Mitchell\u2014our Minister now\u2014was and is about his laser focus on improving safety for New Zealanders across the motu. Second, because he made this statement right in the crux of South Auckland, in the heart of my electorate of Takanini; he made it in Wattle Downs. The Minister\u2014the MP back then\u2014had come to Takanini to perform a few welfare checks with me on a number of businesses that had been grossly negatively impacted by criminal behaviour, and on that day when he made that statement, we were visiting Uday\u2019s family in Wattle Downs. Uday had been violently attacked a few days beforehand where youths barged into his dairy early morning, bashed him with a bat, smashed up his dairy, and he was in hospital for quite some time afterwards as a result. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000391\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002239b9bac1-a992-4ccf-a473-9591aeb3a298\u0022\u003EOn that day, we also visited Stonz in Takanini where they had a smash and grab in broad daylight on a Sunday afternoon; Manjinder and Harpreet, their business in Takanini had been ram-raided many times and they shared with the Minister and with me that they dread going to sleep because of that 2\u00A0o\u2019clock phone call from police in the morning saying their shop has been ram raided again; Sarith from The Coffee Club, his glass was smashed; 2degrees, where the staff told us that they were being intimidated daily by people demanding free products.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000392\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002239b9bac1-a992-4ccf-a473-9591aeb3a298\u0022\u003EThe new stats that have emerged this week have been welcomed greatly in my patch of South Auckland and East Auckland, Takanini, where ram raids, as we know, have gone down by 60\u00A0percent. What an achievement\u2014what an achievement.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000393\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002239b9bac1-a992-4ccf-a473-9591aeb3a298\u0022\u003ESpeaking of patches, as we heard from my good friend Carl Bates, 12 a.m. tonight is when our Government\u2019s ban on gang patches in public will begin, and with it we will start to feel more safe and a sense of real security across my electorate of Takanini. For too long\u2014for too long\u2014my neighbours have been feeling the most unsafe they have ever felt. When a father in Waiata Shores told me last year that he was too afraid to take his twins out to the local park because of the lack of safety, it shows that we\u2019ve got a problem. When almost every home that I door-knocked that one day in Flat Bush had been a victim to vehicle crime, it shows that we have a problem with safety. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000394\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002239b9bac1-a992-4ccf-a473-9591aeb3a298\u0022\u003EI\u2019m proud of the work that we\u2019re doing on this side of the House to restore law and order and to allow decent Kiwis to feel safe, and I\u2019m privileged, indeed I am, to be part of the hard-working Justice Committee and see this work in action. This week we embrace our 27th bill, which is part of our work that has a focus on justice and putting victims, not criminals, first. We\u2019ve seen a reduction in victimisations across the board. We\u2019ve seen foot patrols increase by 30\u00A0percent and everything, all of this, is so that our neighbours in Takanini and across New Zealand can feel safe. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000395\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002239b9bac1-a992-4ccf-a473-9591aeb3a298\u0022\u003EThank you to our police for the immensely hard work that you\u2019re doing. As we prepare for this gang patch ban, which will begin at 12 a.m. tonight, I know a lot of my neighbours will continue this feeling where they know this Government they voted for is making measures to allow them to feel safe. Mr Speaker, thank you very much.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000396\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002239b9bac1-a992-4ccf-a473-9591aeb3a298\u0022\u003EThe debate having concluded, the motion lapsed.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n    \u003C/div\u003E\n    \u003Cdiv class=\u0022HpsHansard\u0022\u003E\n      \u003Cp\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsProceedingHeading\u0022\u003EBills\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000397\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u00224dd99207d8c34377b3f6c904e16b2518\u0022\u003ECitizenship (Western Samoa) (Restoration) Amendment Bill\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000398\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u0022ef4b94e469fe49369122e5a304bdb967\u0022\u003EThird Reading\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00223d42e8cf-544e-415d-892b-f4ef8014d80f\u0022 data-id=\u0022c5b06cea1e8b4f9185c4853a2ed0d058\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000399\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d42e8cf-544e-415d-892b-f4ef8014d80f\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022c5b06cea1e8b4f9185c4853a2ed0d058\u0022\u003ETEANAU TUIONO (Green):\u003C/span\u003E I move, That the Citizenship (Western Samoa) (Restoration) Amendment Bill be now read a third time. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000400\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d42e8cf-544e-415d-892b-f4ef8014d80f\u0022\u003EWhat a great day it is to be Pasifika in this Parliament. Actually, it is always a great day to be Pasifika, but let me begin by saying, before the Hon Barbara Edmonds says it, that this is the 682 backing the 685. Let me begin by giving a big kia or\u0101na k\u014Dtou k\u0101toatoa to all of my Samoan relatives today, and a big I-E-Ko-Ko!\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000401\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d42e8cf-544e-415d-892b-f4ef8014d80f\u0022\u003EThis bill is about justice, reconciliation, and progress for our Samoan communities in Aotearoa, and I hope that the passage of this bill is a milestone in addressing historical injustices, acknowledging intergenerational harm, and fostering accountability for past actions such as the Dawn Raids. It\u2019s also about community involvement and the broader importance of strengthening relationships between Aotearoa and our Pacific neighbours while also promoting unity in our pursuit for justice for our communities.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000402\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d42e8cf-544e-415d-892b-f4ef8014d80f\u0022\u003EThis bill is a significant step for Pasifika justice here in Aotearoa and around the Pacific. I also want to acknowledge the rarity of this bill receiving unanimous political support across the House in the second reading and, of course, in the committee of the whole House. As we say in politics, it\u2019s best not to count your chickens before they\u2019re in the umu, but I am confident that there will be enough support\u2014hopefully, unanimous support\u2014for this bill to get through its third reading.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000403\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d42e8cf-544e-415d-892b-f4ef8014d80f\u0022\u003EI want to also emphasise that I didn\u2019t know previously\u2014because this is the only bill that I\u2019ve ever had pulled out of the biscuit tin\u2014that it\u2019s rare for an Opposition MP to get a bill this far. I want to acknowledge the very strong advocacy of the community today. It was your advocacy and your ability to talk right across the political aisle that is the reason why we have gotten to this point today. I say a big fa\u2018afetai tele lava to all of you.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000404\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d42e8cf-544e-415d-892b-f4ef8014d80f\u0022\u003EOften people ask me the reasons for me putting this bill in the biscuit tin, and there are a number. As a first-term MP, you try to put something together to put into the biscuit tin, and in the last parliamentary term we were working on the Dawn Raids apology, an incredibly heavy and painful subject for our peoples. As I was doing that, Samoans my age were reaching out to me going, \u201CWell, while you\u2019re doing this, there\u2019s actually all these other issues, and in particular this very specific issue for our communities that we want you to address.\u201D\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000405\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d42e8cf-544e-415d-892b-f4ef8014d80f\u0022\u003EToday, I want to acknowledge the Samoans of my generation who are, like myself, first-generation Pacific Islanders born here in Aotearoa New Zealand, who have similar experiences as me and who asked me to put this bill into the biscuit tin. I want to acknowledge a number of them today. A friend of mine, Tai Pritchard is here as well. Other friends of mine like Tony Fala are here, and Renee Dingwall as well, a Green Party councillor who asked me specifically, a lot, to actually put something together and put this in the tin.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000406\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d42e8cf-544e-415d-892b-f4ef8014d80f\u0022\u003EI also acknowledge all the Samoans I went to Auckland University with, along with the Hon Jenny Salesa\u2014she\u2019ll know all of them\u2014people such as Lotu Fuli. A number of us ended up in the Foufou a Pulotu o Niue, which was the Niuean Students Association; people such as Terry and the others. You had an enormous impact on me, on why I should put forward this bill in solidarity with you and your communities. Most of all, today, I am thinking of my brother\u2014our brother\u2014Fa\u2019an\u0101n\u0101 Efeso Collins. This one\u2019s for you, uce\u2014this one\u2019s for you.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000407\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d42e8cf-544e-415d-892b-f4ef8014d80f\u0022\u003EThere is a historical context to this bill, and I want to acknowledge Falema\u2018i Les\u0101, who I think might be in the gallery somewhere today. I want to acknowledge her commitment and the work that she did in 1978 to challenge the Government when they took away her citizenship. I want to acknowledge the workers of that time who came to the select committee, who presented and talked about how they rallied behind Falema\u2018i and her legal team to get the p\u016Btea together, to get the funding together, to take the case to the Privy Council. They won that court case and they were right. They were New Zealand citizens, and they had their citizenship removed.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000408\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d42e8cf-544e-415d-892b-f4ef8014d80f\u0022\u003EI want to reflect on the weight of the debates that we\u2019ve had in this Chamber, the weight of the conversations that we heard through the select committee process, and I want to celebrate and acknowledge the extensive consultations that we had with the impacted community. There were powerful testimonies from the Samoan community during the select committee process. I want to praise the authenticity and the passion of young people\u2014of our rangatahi\u2014who came to the select committee process with their vision for a better future. If I can say to our Pasifika communities, seeing the strength and the intelligence of those young people, I am certain that the future of Pasifika communities is in safe hands.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000409\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d42e8cf-544e-415d-892b-f4ef8014d80f\u0022\u003EI want to acknowledge the involvement of many former MPs. I acknowledge you, Arthur Anae, for your steadfast commitment to continue to push on this issue. I note that there was a 2003 petition which had nearly 100,000 people and also a demonstration outside the steps of Parliament. I want to acknowledge the other former Samoan MPs who have participated or shown their support throughout this process, such as the Hon\u00A0Luamanuvao Winnie Laban; Terisa Ngobi; and Aupito William Sio, who was actually one of the first people I rang when the bill was pulled out of the biscuit tin.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000410\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d42e8cf-544e-415d-892b-f4ef8014d80f\u0022\u003EI want to acknowledge Te P\u0101ti M\u0101ori for being one of my first responders when I asked\u00A0them if they would support the bill, and acknowledging the connection between tangata whenua and tangata moana. T\u0113n\u0101 koutou katoa. I also want to acknowledge the role\u00A0of engagement with Vaovasamanaia the Rt Hon Winston Peters and the considered conversations with myself. We had a number of conversations with myself and the Hon\u00A0Jenny Salesa. In 1982, I was just a kid, so having the experience of the right honourable Deputy Prime Minister was valuable in trying to find a way to navigate a way forward in\u00A0this.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000411\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d42e8cf-544e-415d-892b-f4ef8014d80f\u0022\u003ELemauga Lydia Sosene messaged me this morning, and I know that if she could have been, she would have been here\u2014if she could have been, she would have been here. Suga, sister, I know that you are probably listening today. This bill is also for you. This bill is also acknowledging the work that you have done in the select committee and in your communities to get people to move forward as well.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000412\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d42e8cf-544e-415d-892b-f4ef8014d80f\u0022\u003EI would like to acknowledge the ACT Party who, in the first reading, surprised the nation, I think, with their support. Dr Parmjeet Parmar, I would like to recognise your contribution and the contribution of the ACT Party. The select committee process was amicable, I think, and I\u2019d like to acknowledge Cameron Brewer, Tim Costley, and Tom Rutherford for their work behind the scenes, trying to wrangle their lot to get this over the line in a way that suits\u00A0and benefits them, and, of course, Andy Foster, whose tabled amendment got up when my two didn\u2019t. Congratulations to him for making sure that those tabled amendments got over as well.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000413\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d42e8cf-544e-415d-892b-f4ef8014d80f\u0022\u003EBefore I end, I have to say that the thing with these types of things, as members of Parliament we get up and we talk and everybody thinks that it\u2019s all about us, but, actually, the real heroes are the staff. The real heroes are the workers. I\u2019d like to acknowledge the staff that have helped to support me, our chief of staff, our directors, our communications staff, but I want to acknowledge Samu Telefoni, who is here today. When I started this, I started this with Samu. I am an Atiuan; he is a Tongan\u2014so you have an Atiuan and a Tongan supporting our Samoan family.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000414\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d42e8cf-544e-415d-892b-f4ef8014d80f\u0022\u003EI would also like to acknowledge Leaara Kauika-Stevens, who did a lot of the heavy lifting behind the scenes, making sure that I\u2019m organised, along with Samu as well, and the massive amounts of support that we\u2019ve had from many of our young M\u0101ori and Pacific staff as well: Jack, Poppy, Tamahina, and Chargn, and all of our Green Party staff. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000415\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d42e8cf-544e-415d-892b-f4ef8014d80f\u0022\u003EThe Greens are proud to have championed this bill, and we hope that it goes some way to atoning for the past wrongs of this Parliament, by the State, against Pasifika communities. Let\u2019s savour this small but significant victory and carry forward the momentum to achieve possibly even greater things. When we unite in the pursuit of justice there is so much more that we can accomplish. Mr Speaker, fa\u2018afetai tele lava. Meitaki ranuinui. I commend this bill to the House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002202e74c40-9529-4e15-adc2-c032eadc2205\u0022 data-id=\u00224cc63335f1154c7ca5a0003682187cf4\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000416\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002202e74c40-9529-4e15-adc2-c032eadc2205\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00224cc63335f1154c7ca5a0003682187cf4\u0022\u003EASSISTANT SPEAKER (Greg O\u2019Connor)\u003C/span\u003E: The question is that the motion be agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002289809535-e289-43e8-ad08-668cf3046ffb\u0022 data-id=\u00227316c6c0a9ac45cebc0dc4d406f65c7a\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000417\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002289809535-e289-43e8-ad08-668cf3046ffb\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00227316c6c0a9ac45cebc0dc4d406f65c7a\u0022\u003ECAMERON BREWER (National\u2014Upper Harbour):\u003C/span\u003E Talofa lava, Mr Speaker, distinguished guests, and Your Excellency, Samoa\u2019s High Commissioner to New Zealand. Thank you for your submissions, thank you for your patience, thank you for your belief in the process, and thank you for your graciousness. The National Party is pleased\u2014very pleased\u2014to support this third reading of the Citizenship (Western Samoa) (Restoration) Amendment Bill. We believe we have landed at a good place after a lot of work from a lot of people.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000418\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002289809535-e289-43e8-ad08-668cf3046ffb\u0022\u003EThe bill will restore New Zealand citizenship to individuals born in Western Samoa between 13\u00A0May 1924 and 1\u00A0January 1949 yet were not in New Zealand in 1982, whose citizenship was removed with the 1982 Citizenship (Western Samoa) Act. The House\u2019s intention is clear; the Governance and Administration Committee\u2019s intention is clear: we are ring-fencing a cohort of now very special elderly people, possibly up to 3,500 individuals, and only those directly affected will be eligible, as of right, for citizenship by grant, not their descendants. By ring-fencing the eligible 1924-48 cohort, we have done something, as I\u2019ve said before, that no New Zealand Parliament has done in the 42 years since the Privy Council decision. We are acknowledging today what many lost when the 1982 Parliament unanimously voted to rule those living in New Zealand at the time, citizens, but not those living in Samoa or elsewhere.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000419\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002289809535-e289-43e8-ad08-668cf3046ffb\u0022\u003EOne historical perspective that continues to be perpetuated, including in the New Zealand media today, was that it was the Muldoon Government alone that overturned the Privy Council\u2019s ruling through the 1982 legislation to take away that citizenship. Taking away that citizenship in 1982 was a unanimous decision by this Parliament, with Bill Rowling\u2019s Labour Party and Bruce Beetham\u2019s Social Credit joining the Government of the day to unanimously push through that legislation. Isn\u2019t it great that, 42 years later, this Parliament is united again in the restoration of citizenship?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000420\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002289809535-e289-43e8-ad08-668cf3046ffb\u0022\u003EI want to pay tribute to our Prime Minister, the Rt Hon Christopher Luxon, and I also want to pay tribute to the support from senior MPs, their offices and their officers\u2014the Hon Nicola Willis; Shane Reti; Chris Bishop; Erica Stanford; our Department of Internal Affairs (DIA) spokesperson Chris Penk; and the chief of staff in the Prime Minister\u2019s Office, Cam Burrows. I also want to acknowledge the Deputy Prime Minister and Minister of Foreign Affairs, the Rt Hon Winston Peters, and our Minister of Internal Affairs, Brooke van Velden\u2014thank you, Mr Peters, for all the work that you have done and continue to do in the Pacific as part of your Pacific reset programme.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000421\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002289809535-e289-43e8-ad08-668cf3046ffb\u0022\u003EBy amending and not repealing this legislation, we have avoided violating the 1962 protocol to the Treaty of Friendship and potentially straining diplomatic relations with Samoa. With that in mind, and all that work that\u2019s been done to get us this far, I want to acknowledge the sponsor, Green MP Teanau Tuiono, for his work\u2014all his work\u2014and leadership and willingness to adapt his original bill to get it over the line\u2014before we could arguably lose what is the last chance to make a meaningful acknowledgement to this generation.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000422\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002289809535-e289-43e8-ad08-668cf3046ffb\u0022\u003EI want to also thank my Government colleagues National MPs Tim Costley and Tom Rutherford, as well as New Zealand First\u2019s Andy Foster, for their interrogation and hard work over many months to knock this into shape. I want to also acknowledge Anae Arthur Anae, one of my old bosses, for all the work that he\u2019s done and the tenacity that he\u2019s shown. I remember writing research papers on this for caucus back in the late 1990s and he never let it go. As I\u2019ve said before, I turned up to Auckland Council with him and he was still going on about it\u2014and he never let it go. Thank you for all the work you\u2019ve done, Arthur. I know it\u2019s not exactly what you wanted, but it\u2019s as good as we could deliver across this House and you should be very proud.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000423\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002289809535-e289-43e8-ad08-668cf3046ffb\u0022\u003EI want to also take this opportunity to make a public service announcement of some sort, with information that I have sought from the Department of Internal Affairs today, via the Minister\u2019s office, to shine some light on how this will work in an operational sense, in a logistical sense. Assuming that the bill is signed by the Governor-General on Monday, applications for citizenship can be received from Tuesday next week. I want to also announce that the estimated processing time is 30 working days, but this is dependent on the volumes received and the information applicants provide.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000424\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002289809535-e289-43e8-ad08-668cf3046ffb\u0022\u003EThe website\u2014the dedicated web page\u2014will be www.govt.nz/citizenship-Samoa-pre-1949. You\u2019ll be able to find it just by going to the govt.nz site\u2014remember that: the govt.nz site. That\u2019ll go live by Friday\u2014that\u2019ll go live by Friday\u2014with the application form, information on how to apply, and a contact centre will go live as well.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000425\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002289809535-e289-43e8-ad08-668cf3046ffb\u0022\u003EPeople can also\u2014their children, grandchildren, nieces and nephews, friends and themselves\u2014apply in person at a DIA counter in Auckland, in Wellington, in Christchurch, in Sydney, in London, and, most importantly, at the High Commission in Apia; or by mailing the application form to DIA. Information on the refunds for successful applicants, which the Government and others have agreed to, will be on the website\u2014so that\u2019s the information on the refunds.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000426\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002289809535-e289-43e8-ad08-668cf3046ffb\u0022\u003EThis is a very, very historic day. As I was just saying to my good friend Tom Rutherford, no two days in the New Zealand Parliament are ever alike. It\u2019s great to be here for this historic moment, knowing that it has been 42 years in the making. Frankly, our Prime Minister can feel proud that since 1982, after six Labour Prime Ministers and four National ones, he is the one Prime Minister who is putting his support to this.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000427\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002289809535-e289-43e8-ad08-668cf3046ffb\u0022\u003EI want to also acknowledge the support and willingness of the National caucus to back this\u2014that is, the front bench and the backbench. This is 42 years in the making and it gives me great pleasure to commend to the House the Citizenship (Western Samoa) (Restoration) Amendment Bill. Thank you.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022 data-id=\u0022f5b6f61c535947f189bb78ef604f77ab\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000428\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022f5b6f61c535947f189bb78ef604f77ab\u0022\u003ERt Hon CHRIS HIPKINS (Leader of the Opposition):\u003C/span\u003E Talofa lava, Mr Speaker, and to all of our Samoan communities who are here at Parliament today and who are watching around Aotearoa and, in fact, the world, I know today is a very significant day for all of you. Welcome to Parliament. Today is about righting an historic wrong. It is a very big day, and I\u2019m proud to be able to take this call and lend Labour\u2019s full support to this bill.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000429\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003EToday is about correcting and finally recognising thousands of Samoan New Zealanders who have always had the right to New Zealand citizenship. Today is about justice, and I acknowledge it has been a long and hard battle for so many people who have fought for justice for so long.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000430\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003EI want to acknowledge Teanau Tuiono for bringing this bill before the House. I want to thank him and the Green Party for working constructively with all parties in this House and for working particularly with my Labour colleagues who I\u2019m speaking alongside here today. Thank you for your collaboration in making sure that this bill made it over the line. On issues like this, working together is absolutely the right thing to do, and I\u2019m very proud to stand here today to say Labour has supported this bill at every step of the way.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000431\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003ETo the tens of thousands from our Samoan communities whose voices have helped to shape this bill, thank you for your ongoing and strong advocacy. I know there have been a lot of talanoas held throughout the year with the community, and I want to acknowledge that many have shared deeply felt, personal, and generational stories of their experiences as a result of that 1982 Act and the history between New Zealand and Samoa. I want to thank you for sharing those stories.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000432\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003EI want to thank our Labour MPs who have put so much work into making sure that we as a team understood why this bill was important and why our support for it mattered. They have been right there alongside our Samoan New Zealanders, supporting them each\u00A0and every step of the way, whether it\u2019s during all of those meetings around the country, on marches, bringing their voices and aspirations to Parliament. Thank you to our Pasifika MPs. To Lemauga Lydia Sosene, who can\u2019t be here today but who sat on the Governance and Administration Committee, a very warm thankyou to you. To Carmel Sepuloni, Barbara Edmonds, Jenny Salesa, and Tangi Utikere: thank you for all of the engagement I know that you have been doing with our communities across the country. And can I thank Rachel Boyack, who so competently chaired the select committee, and all of the members on the select committee for bringing this bill back to the House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000433\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003EIt is a powerful thing to have strong Pacific representation at Parliament, and I\u2019m very proud of Labour\u2019s strong connection with our Pacific communities and the strong representatives that you have sent to be part of our team. The strong relationship and that strength of relationship is something that we celebrate and we respect every single day in this House. It helps to bring about change, like the one that we are seeing here today, and\u00A0that\u2019s why I\u2019m proud to say that Labour will continue to wholeheartedly support this\u00A0bill.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000434\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003EThere have been many strong voices heard during this debate\u2014almost 25,000 submissions during the select committee process. It\u2019s been very clear that this is an issue important to and close to so many within our community. I want to thank one submitter, Falema\u2018i Les\u0101, who made history by successfully arguing her case to the Privy Council four decades ago, that she was indeed a New Zealand citizen. Her oral submission, spoken in Samoan, articulated, \u201CThe only thing I want is for my people to be able to travel freely without hindrance or legal implications. If only they didn\u2019t take away this right from Samoans.\u201D We have heard that message. She and many other aunties and uncles have shared similarly heartbreaking experiences of facing deportation when they should have been recognised as citizens. Thank you for sharing your testimony and for continuing to advocate to this day.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000435\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003EAlthough this bill only applies to the elders of the community\u2014and I say elders only in the sense of age\u2014I feel very much encouraged by the staunch voices of young Samoans who have also been pushing for change. To quote one young and bright activist who led a petition in support of this bill, Esmae Salesa, who is here. I want to quote from her directly: \u201C[They] have a right to be here as much as anyone else does and they deserve their citizenship.\u201D I totally agree. This is about fairness. It\u2019s about ensuring that those who are entitled to the rights other New Zealanders have are afforded those rights.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000436\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003EOutside of the scope of this bill, during the select committee process, we also heard from the community that they want Samoan New Zealand visas to be reviewed. We as a Labour team would be supportive of the Government exploring those issues to remove and alleviate any potential barriers for Samoan New Zealanders wanting to make coming to New Zealand more accessible for their families.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000437\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003EToday\u2019s decision to overturn injustices of the past against our Samoan communities is the way forward in honouring the spirit of the Government\u2019s Dawn Raids apology. The apology was a watershed moment for New Zealand, and I know how important it was for our Pacific communities. I also know that we\u2019ve still got a way to go to make sure that our actions match up with the words in that apology. Today\u2019s passage of this bill through the House is another thing that gives meaning to the words when we said as a country that we were sorry.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000438\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003EWe must look to our past to reconcile our future. The Muldoon era heralded a series of discriminatory immigration laws, which, of course, led to the Dawn Raids and the subsequent 1982 removal of citizenship for Samoans born between 1924 and 1948. It should never have happened. Today is a step forward.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000439\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003EI know for many aiga, they\u2019ve waited a long time for this. I know just how much today means for you all and what it means for the thousands who are now going to be eligible for citizenship. I\u2019m glad, through the select committee process, we were able to achieve something which wasn\u2019t achieved at the first reading, the unanimous support of all parties in Parliament for this legislation. There were concessions along the way that needed to be made to get that, but I am glad that everybody got there in the end. What\u2019s important is that there is a pathway forward for those who would otherwise have been left behind.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000440\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003EI know our Samoan communities are amongst our hardest-working and proudest New Zealanders, and I know that today is a big day. I know, for some of you, citizenship was the last step to being fully recognised as a New Zealander and finally feeling like you can call Aotearoa New Zealand home. I can assure you that you have always been home here.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000441\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003EWhenever I\u2019ve been with our Samoan communities here, whether it\u2019s at a Pasifika Fest, at the fale, or simply walking down Great South Road in \u014Ct\u0101huhu, I\u2019ve always been made to feel very warmly at home, I have always been very, very well fed, and I have always enjoyed great company.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000442\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003EWe are really proud of our Samoan communities here in New Zealand. Thank you for everything you contribute to the richness of this country. It\u2019s a legacy of empowering our communities that we\u2019re firmly committed to upholding. For those of you who are eligible\u2014I understand the oldest cohort may be as young as 100 years young\u2014once the applications are open, I encourage you to consider it. You have a right to participate in this country to the fullest, and we are very pleased that you are finally going to get this opportunity. Fa\u2018afetai tele lava. Thank you all again. As my colleague and good friend Barbara Edmonds, who no doubt is going to speak and say this later on, says, \u201CToday is the 685s to the world.\u201D\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002258eae615-ef83-4df5-bace-6749bdd312a8\u0022 data-id=\u0022c1d279ff847e417285f73f4d6ac2e1e0\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000443\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002258eae615-ef83-4df5-bace-6749bdd312a8\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022c1d279ff847e417285f73f4d6ac2e1e0\u0022\u003EDr PARMJEET PARMAR (ACT):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Mr Speaker. I\u2019m taking this call on behalf of the ACT Party to support the Citizenship (Western Samoa) (Restoration) Amendment Bill. We are quite pleased to see that this bill has come to this stage. I know that it\u2019s a member\u2019s bill, so for any member for their bill to be drawn from the ballot is quite exciting. And then to see this bill come to this final stage in the House is even more exciting. I would like to congratulate the member in charge, Teanau Tuiono, for bringing this bill to Parliament, giving us the opportunity to debate this issue, and coming to this point that we are agreeing to support this bill.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000444\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002258eae615-ef83-4df5-bace-6749bdd312a8\u0022\u003EI would also like to express my deepest gratitude to 24,000-plus submitters. Their effort is commendable. I also want to thank everybody who has been part of this process. I know that during the first reading we had many, many members of the community\u2014those who came here to witness the passing of the first reading and then the second reading. After the second reading, we had a beautiful function with the community, and I can say there were easily close to 150 members of the community who joined us for that function after the second reading was passed in the House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000445\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002258eae615-ef83-4df5-bace-6749bdd312a8\u0022\u003EIn the committee of the whole House, good progress was made on this bill. The amendment which was made\u2014Andy Foster\u2019s amendment, supported by the whole committee\u2014I want to acknowledge, because that amendment provided a good balance. This bill is not about obtaining citizenship; this bill is about reclaiming citizenship. I think it provides that really good balance that if the application is approved, the applicant will be able to get their fee refunded. The whole committee supported that amendment which is, again, a great thing. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000446\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002258eae615-ef83-4df5-bace-6749bdd312a8\u0022\u003ENow, in the third reading, again, I see that there are so many members of the community here in the gallery and our gallery is full. Thank you so much for making this special effort. I know it\u2019s not easy to come all the way to Parliament, but you have done this because this is so important for you all. It\u2019s great to see that the community is here in person to witness the third reading of this bill. I want to thank you all for your efforts.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000447\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002258eae615-ef83-4df5-bace-6749bdd312a8\u0022\u003EJust recently at an event I was talking to an individual\u2014a respectable individual. I guess I can name that individual because that individual\u2019s daughter has been already named: the Hon Jenny Salesa. I was talking to her, and she said that her daughter has been quite instrumental in gathering support for this bill because her grandad was affected by the 1982 Act. There have been so many reasons why people have come forward to support this bill. People really felt strongly about putting their word forward in the select committee process.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000448\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002258eae615-ef83-4df5-bace-6749bdd312a8\u0022\u003EThis has shown that our democratic system works. This is not the first time that the issue has come before the House. As the member in charge mentioned before, there was a petition that was in 2003, which had close to 90,000 signatures. At that point, that issue did not go through, but now this has come in the form of a member\u2019s bill, and we are all supporting this bill and really looking forward to seeing that this bill becomes law. To the community, I would say that if you really believe in an issue, do not give up\u2014do not give up. This is your Parliament. Keep bringing that issue again and again, as you have done this time: convinced a member to take up an issue as a member\u2019s bill. Continue to do that. I really commend your efforts in doing so.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000449\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002258eae615-ef83-4df5-bace-6749bdd312a8\u0022\u003EBecoming a citizen\u2014as I am an immigrant\u2014is not a small thing. Especially becoming a citizen of New Zealand is a matter of pride. It is a matter of real privilege. We know the value of being a New Zealand citizen. It brings a lot of positives. It brings a lot of obligations which are all positive, again. It brings responsibilities as well. That is our duty towards the royal authority and our duty as New Zealand citizens to make sure we are following all the laws of our country. These people have been waiting, waiting, and waiting for a very, very long time to be citizens of New Zealand and to reclaim their citizenship, so it\u2019s not going to be anything new.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000450\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002258eae615-ef83-4df5-bace-6749bdd312a8\u0022\u003EToday, with the passing of the third reading of this bill, I know that it will evoke a number of different kinds of emotions amongst community members. There will be those who will feel their obligation becoming a New Zealand citizen, and there will be the sense of relief as well, because this has been a long fight. I want to acknowledge Falema\u2018i Les\u0101 and everybody who joined in that journey when that journey started, and all the community that is here today\u00A0to support us debating this bill. This shows that sometimes the road to justice is not that straightforward. It\u2019s not quick, it can be long, it can have some bumps, but ultimately justice is delivered. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000451\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002258eae615-ef83-4df5-bace-6749bdd312a8\u0022\u003EAs I said in the first reading of the bill, for the ACT Party, it is about fairness, it is about equality, it is about justice. We really wanted to see this bill go to a select committee process, and it did. I\u2019m really glad to see that so many came forward to speak about this bill and support this bill. I want to acknowledge all my ACT Party colleagues for being so supportive of this bill from the start. I want to especially acknowledge the Hon David Seymour, and the Hon Brooke van Velden as the Minister of Internal Affairs. It\u2019s really good to see that they have been very, very supportive from day one about this bill.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000452\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002258eae615-ef83-4df5-bace-6749bdd312a8\u0022\u003EGoing forward, yes, the process will start very, very soon. After five days, all those individuals who will be eligible after this bill goes through will be able to apply to reclaim their citizenship. It will be, I know, an exciting moment, because I know so many of these individuals already have families here in New Zealand. It will be a great opportunity for them to become New Zealand citizens and then utilise their time with their families here in New Zealand without going through the longer processes that they might be going through at the moment. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000453\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002258eae615-ef83-4df5-bace-6749bdd312a8\u0022\u003EThe community\u2019s voice has been heard. The community\u2019s voice has been really strong. I would like to say to the community: keep your voice strong. Continue to advocate for issues that matter. This is something that is to fix a historical wrong. Thank you for giving us the opportunity to fix this historical wrong. It is because of you coming forward that we have been able to pay attention to this issue and take this issue seriously and bring it to this stage.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000454\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002258eae615-ef83-4df5-bace-6749bdd312a8\u0022\u003EFinally, I also want to say that I know that there are so many other community members who could not be here today and could not join us during the first reading or the second reading of the bill. I want to acknowledge them as well. I really know that the commitment of those who have been part of this fight, those who have been part of this journey, will be honoured by the entire community. As an immigrant, I understand the emotions that the community is going through and the emotions that the community will feel applying for citizenship and seeing their family members able to reclaim New Zealand citizenship.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000455\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002258eae615-ef83-4df5-bace-6749bdd312a8\u0022\u003EGoing forward, I know that we are quite excited and we are really looking forward to welcoming those 3,000-plus Kiwi Samoans to New Zealand, as they will become Kiwi Samoans after gaining New Zealand citizenship. I want to congratulate all those individuals who will be reclaiming their citizenship. It\u2019s a real pleasure to support this bill and commend this bill to the House. Thank you.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00227dbfbd83-6770-4555-8477-85fa01511504\u0022 data-id=\u0022426d34218e6544f889840be379fa2196\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000456\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227dbfbd83-6770-4555-8477-85fa01511504\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022426d34218e6544f889840be379fa2196\u0022\u003EANDY FOSTER (NZ First):\u003C/span\u003E This is a good day, this is a happy day, this is a day of alofa. It\u2019s a day that we, together, take the final steps in this House to right a wrong that is 42 years old. It\u2019s a day when this Parliament does what no other Parliament has done over that 42 years, despite several requests to take action; and it\u2019s a day when this Parliament will be unanimous\u2014I\u2019m confident we\u2019ll be unanimous, Teanau\u2014in supporting this legislation to correct that wrong, which was done 42\u00A0years ago when that House was unanimous in creating the wrong in the first place. I\u2019m delighted to speak in support of this bill on behalf of New Zealand First.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000457\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227dbfbd83-6770-4555-8477-85fa01511504\u0022\u003EFirst of all, I just want to make some congratulations. Teanau Tuiono, I want to congratulate you. People can get congratulated for getting a bill drawn out of the hat, but the reality is you had to be in to win. You got it in there, it came out, and you have worked diligently with the Governance and Administration Committee, with the Samoan community to make sure that we got this bill to a place where it can get through today. I wanted to congratulate you for all of that.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000458\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227dbfbd83-6770-4555-8477-85fa01511504\u0022\u003EI also wanted to place on record my thanks and congratulations to all of the select committee. The Governance and Administration Committee worked really collegially under the chairmanship of Rachel Boyack; Lemauga Lydia Sosene, who\u2019s unfortunately not able to be with us; quite a number of other members of Parliament were involved in it\u2014my colleagues on this side are Tim Costley, Cam Brewer, and Tom Rutherford\u2014and we worked really, really collegially together to make sure that we got this bill into a place where it will get through this House unanimously.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000459\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227dbfbd83-6770-4555-8477-85fa01511504\u0022\u003EWe thanked a little bit the officials, but I do want to place on record\u2014and I\u2019m probably going to miss someone here\u2014our thanks to all the officials from the different agencies: the Department of Internal Affairs; the Ministry of Business, Innovation and Employment, through immigration; the Ministry of Foreign Affairs and Trade (MFAT); the Ministry for Pacific Peoples. The fact that you have so many agencies just illustrates that what looked like a simple bill wasn\u2019t; it became very, very complicated. Every time you peeled the onion a little bit, it got more and more complicated. I want it placed on record my thanks to all of those officials.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000460\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227dbfbd83-6770-4555-8477-85fa01511504\u0022\u003EBut my biggest thanks is to the Samoan community. I just want to say it\u2019s great to see you all here in the gallery with us. Talofa lava, afio mai, and it is wonderful to have you here. This is your Parliament, and I hope that today is a way of your Parliament saying that we are your Parliament and proving that.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000461\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227dbfbd83-6770-4555-8477-85fa01511504\u0022\u003EI also want a very special welcome to His Excellency Afamasaga Faamatalaupu Toleafoa\u2014I think I got that there; it\u2019s lovely to see you, Your Excellency\u2014and also to Falema\u2018i Les\u0101, who I believe is in the room as well. Thank you for your courage and what you did all the way back in 1982 and for following through on that, because, without that, we would not be here today and we would not be celebrating this day. Thank you.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000462\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227dbfbd83-6770-4555-8477-85fa01511504\u0022\u003EI\u2019d also like to thank, as others have done, Arthur Anae, who has been absolutely diligent in pushing for this. As others have said: you haven\u2019t quite got everything here, but it\u2019s a big step forward. Thank you, Arthur, and thank you for keeping on the case.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000463\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227dbfbd83-6770-4555-8477-85fa01511504\u0022\u003EIt\u2019s been, as I said, a privilege to be on the Governance and Administration Committee to work through this complicated bill. As you\u2019ve heard, we had in excess of around 25,000 submissions. Actually, on top of that, one of those submissions actually represented nearly 6,000 people, so, effectively, we had 30,000 voices from around New Zealand but also from Samoa as well. I think that shows the depth of feeling and the importance of this bill to the Samoan community.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000464\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227dbfbd83-6770-4555-8477-85fa01511504\u0022\u003EI want to say we heard you. We heard what you had to say. We heard your stories. We heard your hopes, your dreams. We heard the stories of your fathers, your mothers, your grandfathers, and your grandmothers. We heard clearly the sense of a great injustice having been done in 1982. We heard your passion. We heard about the immense positive difference that you have made as the Samoan community in New Zealand, and I just want to say thank you for telling us your stories, thank you for your patience, thank you for your positivity, and thank you for your grace in what you have done.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000465\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227dbfbd83-6770-4555-8477-85fa01511504\u0022\u003EWhat the bill does: well, first of all, as we know, it gives the right to citizenship for people born in Samoa between 13 May 1924\u2014and when I wrote down \u201C24\u201D, it\u2019s like going, \u201COh, that\u2019s this year.\u201D, but no, it wasn\u2019t; it was 100 years ago\u2014and 31\u00A0December 1948. It gives the right to apply for New Zealand citizenship and to know that it will be granted\u2014to know that it will be granted.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000466\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227dbfbd83-6770-4555-8477-85fa01511504\u0022\u003EI was pleased that the House unanimously picked up and supported an amendment, which one or two of the other speakers have already mentioned. We deliberately tried to keep the price of application low in the first place, but we decided we would put a price on it simply because otherwise we might have an enormous number of applications which weren\u2019t eligible. The Immigration Service was saying, \u201CPlease God, don\u2019t let us get overwhelmed by that.\u201D, so we put a price on. But, to me, the issue there was: why should you have to pay for something which was already yours? You pay upfront, and the amendment which the House unanimously supported\u2014which I thank you all for, from myself and from New Zealand First\u2014is that you will get that money back. That is so you don\u2019t have to pay for what you already have.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000467\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227dbfbd83-6770-4555-8477-85fa01511504\u0022\u003EThis bill, soon to be an Act, is built on history and it\u2019s not a history that New Zealand can be very proud of. New Zealand took over Samoa\u2014in the great colonial way, as things were in those days\u2014from Germany during the beginning of the First World War. New Zealand held Samoa as a protectorate, as a mandate country, until independence on 1\u00A0January 1962. There are a whole series of citizenship Acts in New Zealand, and it was actually only in 1948 that New Zealanders became New Zealand citizens\u2014before that, New Zealanders were British citizens. But, to me, when you look at that legislation, it\u2019s quite clear that people born in Samoa when Samoa was a protectorate of New Zealand were New Zealand citizens\u2014because if not New Zealand citizens, then what? Samoa was not recognised, so what other than being a New Zealand citizen? That, really, is at the heart of this case, and that was the heart of Falema\u2018i Les\u0101\u2019s case: \u201CHow can I be an overstayer if I\u2019m already a New Zealand citizen?\u201D\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000468\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227dbfbd83-6770-4555-8477-85fa01511504\u0022\u003ENow, the courts in New Zealand said, \u201CNo, no, that can\u2019t be right.\u201D, but the Privy Council said, \u201CYeah, that\u2019s right. Yes, you are a New Zealand citizen.\u201D Then, of course, the Government of the day\u2014with the support of the Opposition of the day; all the parties of the House\u2014said, \u201CActually, no, we don\u2019t like that, so we\u2019re going to remove that.\u201D That is the injustice which we\u2019re putting right today. As I said, it\u2019s not a history that New Zealand can be proud of.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000469\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227dbfbd83-6770-4555-8477-85fa01511504\u0022\u003EIt was negligence\u2014a bit of arrogance probably in there as well\u2014that led to a New Zealand ship docking in Samoa during the influenza, and one in five of the Samoan population perished as a result. It was probably worse than negligence when New Zealand forces opened fire on a peaceful demonstration in 1929, killing 11 people. Then, of course, I don\u2019t know what you call it other than racism to say how New Zealand behaved during the Dawn Raids. New Zealand does not have a proud record. As we went through the process of hearing some of the submissions, I kind of wondered, \u201CWhy is it that you want to be part of New Zealand?\u201D I say sorry on behalf of that\u2014and you\u2019ve had apologies over time, but New Zealand does not have a proud record in terms of our relationship with Samoa.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000470\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227dbfbd83-6770-4555-8477-85fa01511504\u0022\u003EIn terms of the bill, we considered several key issues. First of all, do we agree with the core of the bill? And the answer now, unanimously, is: yes, we do. Secondly, do we repeal the 1982 Act\u2014because it\u2019s much hated, it\u2019s a good symbol to repeal it\u2014or do we amend it? We decided by majority to amend it. The reason for that was, apart from MFAT saying, \u201CJust please don\u2019t repeal it, because there are a whole bunch of things tied up in the Treaty of Friendship\u201D\u2014and we\u2019ve only actually got one Treaty of Friendship with New Zealand and that is with Samoa\u2014\u201Cbecause it will cause ructions in that.\u201D\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000471\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227dbfbd83-6770-4555-8477-85fa01511504\u0022\u003EThe 1982 Act, of course, also included a faster pathway to citizenship. If you\u2019re in New Zealand, you don\u2019t have to wait the five years, which other people do. I remember as the Mayor of Wellington, I always used to ask in citizenship ceremonies, which are a wonderful thing, how long people have been in New Zealand: \u201COh, five years\u201D\u2014six years, seven years, 20 years, 30 years. Samoan people said, \u201COh yeah, a year maybe.\u201D It was a faster pathway, so we didn\u2019t want to get rid of that. We\u2019d have had to rewrite that into some other piece of legislation had we repealed it. But the important thing was\u2014I think we\u2019ve got to the right place\u2014the title of the bill got changed. Changed the title to \u201C(Restoration)\u201D. Restoration\u2014something that always should have been yours being restored. I think that that is a really good, positive thing to do. As I said, citizenship will be automatic. You just have to apply.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000472\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227dbfbd83-6770-4555-8477-85fa01511504\u0022\u003EJust to finish off with, there\u2019s a couple of other things outside the bill, and I was really, really strong on this personally. One of them was we heard a lot of submissions saying, \u201CWe want the ease of being able to move backwards and forwards. Whether we\u2019re a citizen, whether this affects us or not. It\u2019s the ability to be able to move backwards and forwards for family reasons, for events, whatever it might be, for celebrations.\u201D That\u2019s really important, and that is one thing we as a select committee have said to the executive: \u201CPlease can you have a look at that?\u201D, and we heard the Leader of the Opposition saying that they would support that as well.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000473\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227dbfbd83-6770-4555-8477-85fa01511504\u0022\u003EThe final thing I wanted to say was that we also heard a little bit\u2014not a lot; a little bit\u2014about superannuation. Normally, it takes 10 to 20 years to get superannuation, depending on the age, but that is something that New Zealand First will give very careful thought to. Once again, I commend the bill to the House, but this is a special day; it\u2019s a happy day. Fa\u2018afetai lava. Thank you.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002202e74c40-9529-4e15-adc2-c032eadc2205\u0022 data-id=\u0022eb1320fd3f304ff2828e846f729d49e1\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000474\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002202e74c40-9529-4e15-adc2-c032eadc2205\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022eb1320fd3f304ff2828e846f729d49e1\u0022\u003EASSISTANT SPEAKER (Greg O\u2019Connor)\u003C/span\u003E: This is a five-minute split call. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00227a76db18-baa4-41c1-b366-89e2c753a1e7\u0022 data-id=\u00220ff1a24bfdb64abdb91d25115f668b0f\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000475\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227a76db18-baa4-41c1-b366-89e2c753a1e7\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00220ff1a24bfdb64abdb91d25115f668b0f\u0022\u003EDEBBIE NGAREWA-PACKER (Co-Leader\u2014Te P\u0101ti M\u0101ori):\u003C/span\u003E T\u0113n\u0101 koe e te P\u012Bka. Ou te tu atu i luma nei e avea a\u02BBu ma sui o Tangatawhenua ma mokopuna o Samoan M\u0101ori e lagolago le mamalu o tagata Samoa o lenei Tulafono. Ia faamanuia atu o matou Tupuna ia outou, ia aumai e le Atua le manuia mo t\u0101tou. Fa\u2018afetai lava. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000476\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227a76db18-baa4-41c1-b366-89e2c753a1e7\u0022\u003EKei aku nui, kei aku rahi, kei aku w\u2019akatamarahi ki te rangi, kei aku w\u2019akateitei ki te w\u2019enua, t\u0113n\u0101 t\u0101tou katoa. E t\u016B ana au hei m\u0101ngai m\u014D ng\u0101 kaik\u014Drero o Te P\u0101ti M\u0101ori e kaha tautoko ana i t\u0113nei kaupapa, otir\u0101 i te p\u0101nuitanga tuatoru o t\u0113nei pire. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000477\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227a76db18-baa4-41c1-b366-89e2c753a1e7\u0022\u003EKei aku whanaunga o te Moana-nui-a-Kiwa, n\u014D koutou te r\u0101. E tika ana te k\u014Drero e k\u012B ana, \u201CPapaki mai ng\u0101 nunui, wawaratia ng\u0101 tai rere, e ripo e ng\u0101 ngaru nui, te rehu tai, \u2018ei konei r\u0101.\u201D \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000478\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227a76db18-baa4-41c1-b366-89e2c753a1e7\u0022\u003E[To the great and important ones, those who stand proud to the heavens, those who stand tall upon the earth, greetings to us all. I stand to represent the speakers of the M\u0101ori Party, who strongly support this initiative; indeed, the third reading of this bill. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000479\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227a76db18-baa4-41c1-b366-89e2c753a1e7\u0022\u003ETo my kin from the Pacific Ocean, the day is yours. True is the statement that says, \u201CThe great waves crash, the currents spread, swirling with the large wave, the sea spray, fare well.\u201D]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000480\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227a76db18-baa4-41c1-b366-89e2c753a1e7\u0022\u003EThe great waves crash, the currents spread, swirling with the large wave of the foam of the sea\u2014this is the k\u014Drero that describes our w\u2019anaungatanga and the power of the movement of the oceans signify the movement of the significance of today and, in this case, the significance of you, our whanaunga, our tuakana. We are one moana; we are one people; we are multiple, multiple waka. It is right, it is pono, it is tika to always be here and witness when something so kino, so bad, has been removed.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000481\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227a76db18-baa4-41c1-b366-89e2c753a1e7\u0022\u003EWe acknowledge all who had to stand in the face of this harmful, racist legislation and all our mokopuna today who continue to have to confront the experience of racism, discrimination. For those who don\u2019t believe and feel the beauty of our w\u2019anaungatanga, of our mokopuna, of our Samoan mokopuna, our M\u0101ori mokopuna, our Pasifika mokopuna, it is heartbreaking to know what you had to endure, and we stand in sadness for all of our t\u016Bpuna who didn\u2019t get to experience this today.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000482\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227a76db18-baa4-41c1-b366-89e2c753a1e7\u0022\u003EIf only this House could stop creating harm. We call on you as our tuakana because you are not immigrants\u2014you are not immigrants. Citizenship is about w\u2019anaungatanga and w\u2019akapapa, and if we were running our country, the ability to flow with the moana, in and out, around and back, would happen as seamlessly as it did in the past. That is what citizenship, for us, is about.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000483\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227a76db18-baa4-41c1-b366-89e2c753a1e7\u0022\u003EToday, we celebrate what has been achieved and what has been fought for. A huge mihi to you, our brother, Teanau Tuiono, who had the vision and the boldness and the humility to be able to negotiate this to where it is today. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000484\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227a76db18-baa4-41c1-b366-89e2c753a1e7\u0022\u003EOur w\u2019akapapa is something to be treasured, and while it is that we hear the lament of those in this House who have apologised and have supported this bill, I acknowledge you all. I acknowledge the mokopuna of those who had to experience this great deep sadness and what it is that they turned up yesterday for us, because your t\u0113ina here are going to call on you and will need your tautoko for what we\u2019re confronting as well.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000485\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227a76db18-baa4-41c1-b366-89e2c753a1e7\u0022\u003EHeoi an\u014D, w\u2019\u0101nau, this is a celebration to w\u2019akanui you and to w\u2019akanui the strength, the vision, and the guts of those who never gave up, and may that always be flowing through the blood of our mokopuna today, as they have to continue to fight, but also enjoy the blessings of our God, who made sure that we got to be here today to enjoy and be able to see what it is for us to experience kotahitanga.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000486\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227a76db18-baa4-41c1-b366-89e2c753a1e7\u0022\u003ETe P\u0101ti M\u0101ori has the absolute honour to be here to tautoko this bill. May we never ever see the repeat of this in our history, and may we be brave and bold enough to continue to push for what it is that we know is real and true. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000487\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227a76db18-baa4-41c1-b366-89e2c753a1e7\u0022\u003EI thank you for the honour of my mokopuna and the most beautiful son-in-law that I could ever have. Our Manutai wh\u0101nau, you have graced us with every strength that we could have and, together, we will continue to look at what the waters and the moana brings us. N\u014D reira, i te \u0101huatanga o \u014D t\u0101tou t\u016Bpuna, ng\u0101 mihi aroha ki a koutou katoa. [And so, in the spirit of our ancestors, loving greetings to you all.]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000488\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227a76db18-baa4-41c1-b366-89e2c753a1e7\u0022\u003E[Applause]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002261720d2e-5b1d-4742-b4f0-30424316ccc1\u0022 data-id=\u0022b386a18e73e94523aa2a97bf9507ed92\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000489\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002261720d2e-5b1d-4742-b4f0-30424316ccc1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022b386a18e73e94523aa2a97bf9507ed92\u0022\u003EDEPUTY SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Just before I call Ricardo Men\u00E9ndez March, I\u2019ve just had a discussion with the previous Speaker as we came in. Clapping is great, but it\u2019s actually broadening out the time. All parties have spoken now, so maybe we\u2019ll just save our cheering and our waiata for the end. I\u2019m not wanting to tamp down your excitement, but let\u2019s have a big celebration at the end. Thank you.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002219ed20db-5d6c-4464-9327-6cdd072bb4fe\u0022 data-id=\u0022dd06d46ec10a4e9dbcbfb9461389a762\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000490\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002219ed20db-5d6c-4464-9327-6cdd072bb4fe\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022dd06d46ec10a4e9dbcbfb9461389a762\u0022\u003ERICARDO MEN\u00C9NDEZ MARCH (Green):\u003C/span\u003E T\u0113n\u0101 koe, Madam Speaker. I just firstly want to acknowledge that this is a bill about justice and reconciliation, and I note your comments, Madam Speaker, about clapping, but I can\u2019t avoid but feel the wairua and the energy from the gallery around how momentous and historic this is, and I just want to commend your validation and basically your words by nature of the reciprocity when it comes to how you engage with this debate. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000491\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002219ed20db-5d6c-4464-9327-6cdd072bb4fe\u0022\u003EI want to acknowledge the longstanding history of advocacy and campaigning, from Samoan communities, for truth, because, actually, when I heard submitters, rewatching the amazing words that were spoken to the Governance and Administration Committee, actually, many people were simply speaking the truth in the pursuit of justice. People were seeking for intertwined histories to be recognised\u2014the good, the bad, the ugly, including our shameful history of colonisation. When we\u2019re here finally at this stage, I think there\u2019s an opportunity to set the terms of how we move forward, not just in this bill but in any other policy that touches your communities.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000492\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002219ed20db-5d6c-4464-9327-6cdd072bb4fe\u0022\u003EI want to acknowledge my friend and colleague Teanau Tuiono and our beloved Fa\u2019an\u0101n\u0101 Efeso Collins, who we carry with us every single day. I know how much this bill meant to him and the communities that he served.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000493\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002219ed20db-5d6c-4464-9327-6cdd072bb4fe\u0022\u003EThis bill has been decades in the making. I know that many have acknowledged Falema\u2018i Les\u0101 for her amazing advocacy and fight to have her rights recognised, but for any MP who does constituency work, we know that we continue to see members of the Samoan community who have been deemed overstayers and how they have to plead to the system for their connections with Aotearoa to be recognised. This is a fight that no one should have to have, and I think this bill will be one step to avoid having members of the communities pleading their case for what is simply theirs and was always theirs to begin with.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000494\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002219ed20db-5d6c-4464-9327-6cdd072bb4fe\u0022\u003EI wanted to echo the words of Auckland University law lecturer Dylan Asafo, who, when he was talking about the history of why we have this bill, noted the moral panic, and if I quote him, he said, \u201CIt\u2019s one of the most racist pieces of legislation on the books. It came about because the Muldoon government deemed Pacific migrants a danger to NZ society. If the government is genuine and wants to apologise for the racism [of the Dawn Raids], then it needs to repeal this piece of legislation, to at least offer to S\u0101moans, who had their citizenship rights revoked through that legislation, to get their citizenship back.\u201D Today, I think we\u2019re finally getting one step closer to the words that were spoken in the Dawn Raids apology by the Government, because I think those words needed to be carried by action. That was actually what the people, on that day, communicated to politicians.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000495\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002219ed20db-5d6c-4464-9327-6cdd072bb4fe\u0022\u003EThe Green Party fought for justice to be delivered in full, and I want to acknowledge every other political party that worked collaboratively with my colleague Teanau Tuiono to get to a place where the bill could have unanimous support, but I do want to note that submitters asked for descendants to be included. I want to note that submitters asked for the fees to be completely waived. Submitters also pleaded to politicians to look beyond the scope of this bill to look what justice actually looks like in full.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000496\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002219ed20db-5d6c-4464-9327-6cdd072bb4fe\u0022\u003EMany noted that our immigration system continues treating Pasifika as a danger to New Zealand, and I think this is reflected by the fact that we continue asking Samoans to fork out hundreds of dollars to apply to visit their relatives. I know submitters asked us to look at the broader immigration settings, and the Greens remain committed for Samoa to be a visa waiver country, for the rights of recognised seasonal employer workers to be improved, for workers to have pathways to residency, and for us to finally put in place an amnesty for so-called overstayers. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000497\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002219ed20db-5d6c-4464-9327-6cdd072bb4fe\u0022\u003EThose are all things that the Green Party will continue backing the submitters and members in the community who have long campaigned for justice to be delivered, because what I see today in the gallery and across the nation over the past few days is a rising movement for Pasifika justice, for Te Tiriti justice, and a recognition that our histories and our liberations are intertwined and that I am not free until all of us are free.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000498\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002219ed20db-5d6c-4464-9327-6cdd072bb4fe\u0022\u003EI want to end by commending this bill to the House in the hope that we can all move forward in delivering full and true justice, as previous speakers have said, and that we can collaborate to get Samoa to be a visa waiver country as soon as possible. Kia ora.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022b9dc1924-4df4-4d8f-91ec-8a0f29348308\u0022 data-id=\u0022e9069fc708e4480b99b8289a9870c225\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000499\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b9dc1924-4df4-4d8f-91ec-8a0f29348308\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022e9069fc708e4480b99b8289a9870c225\u0022\u003ETIM COSTLEY (National\u2014\u014Ctaki):\u003C/span\u003E Faatalofa atu i le pa\u02BBia ma le mamalu o Samoa ua potopoto. Talofa lava, Madam Speaker. In my office in Levin proudly hangs some artwork. [Holds up artwork] It is artwork that represents our community in Horowhenua: artwork from Fiji, Aotearoa, Tonga, and, at the top\u2014though I know you can\u2019t see it from the gallery\u2014proudly, it says \u201CManu Samoa\u201D. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000500\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ef094bb1-be4f-48b8-bb53-52ce955a1c2d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002238d197adba6b4d2c9d4b12dcd67c0fba\u0022\u003EJames Meager\u003C/span\u003E: Table the artwork. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000501\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b9dc1924-4df4-4d8f-91ec-8a0f29348308\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002297ff7e428f39432cba1b65f0d22e9c71\u0022\u003ETIM COSTLEY\u003C/span\u003E: Well, I\u2019ve been asked to table it, and I would happily do so. It was done by students at Taitoko School in Levin. It\u2019s our lowest-decile school, but the most amazing school and the most amazing children, who represent their Pasifika communities so well. At the school, they have big murals from these different Pasifika countries\u2014including Kiribati, as well\u2014that are hung up, and I am just so proud of them, not just for their art but for what they bring to our community, the important role that Pasifika play in Horowhenua, especially. I\u2019m so proud to represent them and all of us here, today. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000502\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b9dc1924-4df4-4d8f-91ec-8a0f29348308\u0022\u003EI want to just start by noting the character that we\u2019ve seen from our Samoan community over 110 years, and the patience, the dignity, and the willingness to persevere while working through our democratic institutions and our parliamentary system to fight for the right outcome but also to fight in the right way. I think we have seen that depth of character from our Samoan community, one that inspires me. I see it in all our Pasifika communities, but I see it particularly in Horowhenua, in Levin, in the \u014Ctaki electorate, across New Zealand, and, of course, across the Pacific. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000503\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b9dc1924-4df4-4d8f-91ec-8a0f29348308\u0022\u003EIt has been a 110-year journey to get here. I think back to 1914, when the UK asked New Zealand to go to Samoa and take over what was a German colony. No consultation\u2014clearly, not with the Germans\u2014but no citizenship was promised, either. From 1924, following on from the Spanish flu, and, again, we were told the intent at the time was clearly to offer no citizenship\u2014that is what we are overturning today. We are overturning that much of the intent from 1924 in the clear intent of this bit of legislation. But it goes on. In 1946, the then Labour Government made it very clear that the destiny of Samoa was for its people to have no New Zealand citizenship, and while the legislation that came\u00A0into force at the start of 1949 holds today, we are changing the bit that leads up to that, which we can. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000504\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b9dc1924-4df4-4d8f-91ec-8a0f29348308\u0022\u003EI have to acknowledge the fight of Falema\u2018i Les\u0101\u2014and what an honour it is to have you joining us here today\u2014from 1975 through to 1982. Even then, after the victory in the Privy Council, the entire New Zealand Parliament joined to say that there would be no citizenship. In 2003, the petition was turned down by the Government\u2014no citizenship. I heard from Radio Samoa in Auckland the commentary that all the hopes for what might be were not to be. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000505\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b9dc1924-4df4-4d8f-91ec-8a0f29348308\u0022\u003EThis bill today is so significant, and I have to acknowledge Teanau Tuiono for his work in bringing it\u2014bringing it where no one else was willing or able to do so, answering the question that many had just let go walking by. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000506\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b9dc1924-4df4-4d8f-91ec-8a0f29348308\u0022\u003ENow, the number of people impacted today might be small, but the significance is large. The symbolism is huge. It goes where no other country has gone before. Of all those League\u00A0of Nations - mandated countries, Mesopotamia, now Iraq, had no citizenship from the UK; and it was the same for Transjordan, now Jordan. There was no French citizenship for Syria\u00A0or Lebanon; nothing from Belgium for Rwanda or Burundi; and I can think of Tanzania, Cameroon\u2014which was the UK, and a small portion was France\u2014and Ghana; and Australian-mandated countries like New Guinea, which is now Papua New Guinea, and Nauru. The South Pacific Mandate offered no Japanese citizenship; South West Africa, now Namibia, offered no South African citizenship; and the same, until today, was true for\u00A0Samoa. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000507\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b9dc1924-4df4-4d8f-91ec-8a0f29348308\u0022\u003EThat is the significance of the day. We\u2019re not just going where we have never gone before; we are going where no one\u2014no country, no Government, no leader in the world\u2014has gone before, and in New Zealand, we weren\u2019t willing to go there. Not the Reform Governments of the 1910s and the 1920s, not the Labour Governments of the 1930s and 1940s\u2014successive Labour and National Governments through the last century and the first quarter of this one. Not Massey, not Savage, not Fraser, not Muldoon, not Lange, not Palmer, not Moore, not Clark, not Ardern, and not Hipkins, but Luxon is the first Prime Minister to see this through, and that is significant. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000508\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b9dc1924-4df4-4d8f-91ec-8a0f29348308\u0022\u003EWe have changed the bill in the Governance and Administration Committee to refine it to adhere to the intent of the 1982 legislation and to ensure that it is reversing what was done in that 1982 legislation, and, secondly, to change it to amend and not to repeal. Those two changes are significant\u2014they are so that we maintain the Treaty of Friendship and we can honour what was there\u2014but the most important thing is that this is not, I believe, a victory for MPs, though Mr Tuiono should take a great deal of credit; this is a victory of the Samoan people, and that is what has inspired me the most. That is what has caught my emotions the most through this. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000509\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b9dc1924-4df4-4d8f-91ec-8a0f29348308\u0022\u003EI want to finish by just reading some of the things that touched me from the huge pile of submissions I have, and I wish we had time to read them all. There were three key themes. One was \u201CWe need to see a tangible action.\u201D\u2014and I\u2019m quoting from David Lui here. He said that the previous apologies were \u201Chollow\u201D, and \u201CThey fell short because there is inadequate action.\u201D The same was true from Dr Melani Anae, and she said that \u201CThe two governmental apologies do little to dismantle our Pacific memories.\u201D The Samoan Trade and Investment Council said, \u201CThe previous apologies don\u2019t cut it.\u201D; and from Su\u2019a Hans Schwalger, who brought the same message. He said that \u201CWe need a tangible and outward and visible sign of this inwards and invisible bond that our two countries share.\u201D \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000510\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b9dc1924-4df4-4d8f-91ec-8a0f29348308\u0022\u003EI think of those that shared their personal experience of how this impacted their families, like Akeripa To\u2019alepaiali\u2019i, who spoke about how he didn\u2019t have citizenship. He was born in the target window, and he said, \u201CThe loss of our New Zealand citizenship has been a source of profound personal and collective grief for many of us.\u201D He has had to apply for that three-month visa to come and see his daughter and his grandchildren. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000511\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b9dc1924-4df4-4d8f-91ec-8a0f29348308\u0022\u003EMataio Lemaveve shared a similar story. Ierome Lui Vaoliko spoke about this being a blessing. You know, the Samoan people I have seen are a people of great faith, and it is something that inspires me and something I want to share with you. It speaks of the blessing that comes from this legislation. Lealas\u0101 Tovio has her citizenship. She was born in 1948, but her older sister, who was born in 1946, doesn\u2019t. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000512\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b9dc1924-4df4-4d8f-91ec-8a0f29348308\u0022\u003EAgain, it\u2019s this wanting to reunite the families once more. I have piles of these that we don\u2019t have time to read, but they all deserve the recognition and the credit for what they have done. As Leaula Desmond Amosa said, \u201CThe role of Parliament is to ensure justice is served.\u201D, and that\u2019s what today, I believe, is doing. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000513\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b9dc1924-4df4-4d8f-91ec-8a0f29348308\u0022\u003ELet me finish: we support this bill, which is, in a refined sense, targeted to those impacted by the 1982 legislation. It is amending it and not repealing it so that the Treaty of Friendship can continue. It is the victory of the Samoan people and what they have demonstrated, and I have to finish by quoting Tamasese Lealofi, who died in the 1929 massacre. He said, \u201CMy blood has been spilt for Samoa. I am proud to give it. Do not dream of avenging it, as it was spilt in peace.\u201D The way that the Samoan people have worked and have led over the last 110 years in peace\u2014you deserve what comes from this. This is your day. This is your victory. Ou te matua lagolagoina lelei tele mo Samoa.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022c3a88c42-f60b-4cf9-8065-8bfb80a020eb\u0022 data-id=\u002262dd183df7b5440ea76e5243b0c68058\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000514\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c3a88c42-f60b-4cf9-8065-8bfb80a020eb\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002262dd183df7b5440ea76e5243b0c68058\u0022\u003EHon CARMEL SEPULONI (Deputy Leader\u2014Labour):\u003C/span\u003E E so\u2019o le fau i le fau\u2014a thread can\u2019t hold its own, its strength comes from being interwoven with other threads to create the fine mat. Unity is in strength. It is the unity of our Samoan community that has led to what will be a successful passing of the Citizenship (Western Samoa) (Restoration) Amendment Bill here today. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000515\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c3a88c42-f60b-4cf9-8065-8bfb80a020eb\u0022\u003EWith that in mind, my first acknowledgement must go to our Samoan community who have driven the campaign to have this bill heard and passed: our elders, our young people, Samoans in Samoa and in other parts of the world and Samoans here in Aotearoa. I sat on the Governance and Administration Committee to receive some of the submissions; you were staunch, you were evidence based, you appealed to the human decency of all the select committee members. At times you had select committee members in tears; you had me in tears. You shared the injustices inflicted on our Samoan people and the struggles that ensued. Fa\u2018afetai lava for possessing the courage to share our collective stories, our collective experiences, and our collective reality here in Aotearoa New Zealand.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000516\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c3a88c42-f60b-4cf9-8065-8bfb80a020eb\u0022\u003EMy father is an avid Radio Samoa listener\u2014and yes, I saw you up there, Savea. He has listened keenly to all of the talkback guest interviewees, politicians, and Samoan community leaders on this issue, as did so many. I know that alongside Radio Samoa, the Pacific Media Network, Tagata Pasifika, and all of our Pasifika media and Pasifika journalists made sure that this was an issue that was made accessible to our community. We are grateful for the role that our media has played across the course of this billed being pulled from the tin to now about to pass third reading, for keeping our people informed. Because of all of you, we are about to pass this bill that rights a historic wrong for those born in Samoa who had their citizenship revoked under the 1982 Act when they were rightly entitled to it. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000517\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c3a88c42-f60b-4cf9-8065-8bfb80a020eb\u0022\u003ENow, sometimes as politicians, someone from another political party has a good idea. The real test of politicians is our ability to get in behind that idea and put aside the party political agendas and to support with seeing the policy or law through to fruition. This was not a problem for Labour in this instance. Teanau Tuiono is our Cook Island brother. Outside of Labour, he is the only other elected Pacific member of Parliament in Parliament at this time. We share in our love for our Pasifika community and in the knowledge of the history of our community here in Aotearoa New Zealand: the good, the bad, and of course the ugly. We share in a belief that the Treaty of Friendship with Samoa needs to be honoured and that there have been decisions made by the New Zealand Government over the course of time that have not honoured that friendship. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000518\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c3a88c42-f60b-4cf9-8065-8bfb80a020eb\u0022\u003EWe also believe that the Dawn Raids apology is a living apology and didn\u2019t start and finish\u00A0on the day the apology was made. As politicians from across political parties, we should be\u00A0continually seeking out opportunities for actions to match the words of that apology through our policy, through our funding, and our legislative decisions. Teanau Tuiono, thank you on this occasion for being the politician with a good idea. Not just a good idea, but a bill\u00A0that would address an injustice committed against Samoa and Samoans. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000519\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c3a88c42-f60b-4cf9-8065-8bfb80a020eb\u0022\u003EI feel that the substance of the Samoan citizenship bill has been adequately traversed by those that have spoken before me, so I\u2019d like to give the gallery and listeners a peek behind the scenes into the politics of this House on the bill. This will also enable me to make some acknowledgements of political parties and politicians, both current and former. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000520\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c3a88c42-f60b-4cf9-8065-8bfb80a020eb\u0022\u003ENow, there was never a question about the Greens, Labour, and M\u0101ori Party support for this bill. It was not only about the current politicians; we had our former ones on our tails making sure we were living up to the expectations of our community. From Labour\u2019s perspective, I particularly acknowledge\u2014and she can\u2019t be here with you all today\u2014Luamanuvao Winnie Laban and Aupito William Sio. They were active proponents for this bill, and all of our other former Labour Pasifika MPs were constantly also checking in on us. We also had our two lead Labour MPs on the select committee who diligently consulted with our Labour Pacific MPs on this bill: the Governance and Administration Committee chair Rachel Boyack and our Samoan sister Lemauga Lydia Sosene, who can\u2019t be with us here today due to illness.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000521\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c3a88c42-f60b-4cf9-8065-8bfb80a020eb\u0022\u003EDespite our position being clear from the get-go, when I reflect on the journey of this bill, I\u2019m very mindful of the other political parties and their positioning. From the time the bill was drawn, we actually had some faith in the possibility that New Zealand First might support this bill. Although we don\u2019t agree with a lot of the New Zealand First policy agenda, the one thing that the Rt Hon Winston has demonstrated over the years is a level of commitment to our Pacific region and a respectful relationship with our Pasifika communities. I will share with you that initially Teanau Tuiono found him to be quite elusive when trying to lobby him\u00A0on this issue, but with some tag-teaming between himself and Jenny Salesa and lobbying from our strong Pasifika leaders, conversations were able to be had. In true Winston Peters style, the New Zealand First position was held close to their chest until the first reading,\u00A0but the Rt Hon Winston Peters lived up to what we hoped for.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000522\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c3a88c42-f60b-4cf9-8065-8bfb80a020eb\u0022\u003ENow as I said, we don\u2019t agree with a lot of New Zealand First policy, but we agree with even less when it comes to the ACT Party. In saying that, there was some hope that they would support this bill. The hope for me sprang from David Seymour participating in the delegation to Samoa in 2022 to commemorate 60 years of the Treaty of Friendship. While on this delegation, David Seymour had the opportunity to feel and experience the hospitality of Samoa and to hear the Samoan Prime Minister and other Samoan leaders speak to the special relationship between New Zealand and Samoa. The Rt Hon Jacinda Ardern gave all members of that delegation the opportunity to participate in high-level conversations with leaders. I often find it difficult to comprehend David Seymour\u2019s views on matters, let alone agree with him, but the words he shared, whilst they were insightful and genuine\u2014knowing this, when this bill came up I knew there was an outside chance he would agree and he did.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000523\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c3a88c42-f60b-4cf9-8065-8bfb80a020eb\u0022\u003ETurning to National, I think they underestimated their two coalition partners on this matter and I will also add I feel they did themselves a disservice by voting against this bill at first reading. It is disappointing because, despite not having any current Pacific representation, National has had Samoan and Cook Island MPs who undoubtedly would have supported this if they were currently in caucus. I acknowledge Anae Arthur Anae, in particular, as a former National MP who has been one of the most active people promoting this bill; malo, Anae.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000524\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c3a88c42-f60b-4cf9-8065-8bfb80a020eb\u0022\u003EThe redeeming factor for National here is despite opposing the bill at first reading, National was able to listen to the voices of over 24,000 Samoans who submitted on this bill and then work with other political parties to form a consensus on this bill. Although it\u2019s good that we can agree, it is important to note when there are areas of disagreement. Labour and the Greens heard the call from the community to extend eligibility to descendants born prior to 1\u00A0January 1962; this was not supported. Labour and the Greens also wanted the application for those eligible to be free of charge. Instead, an amendment was put up at the committee of the whole House stage that means those who make successful applications can be refunded the fee. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000525\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c3a88c42-f60b-4cf9-8065-8bfb80a020eb\u0022\u003EThere were also areas traversed during the submission process that fell out of the scope of the bill. It\u2019s important to mention them; it was issues with the quota for Samoans coming from Samoa, there were issues with visas and access to Samoa, particularly for important events. As has been mentioned in the House by our leader Chris Hipkins, Labour believes that these areas should be explored. Labour commits to giving consideration to these next steps, but given the reins of power sit squarely with National, ACT, and New Zealand First, we encourage you to keep the pressure on. Make your thoughts and voices heard; be relentless in your drive to have more change effected that not only honours the Treaty of Friendship but honours the spirit of the Dawn Raids apology. I can assure you that Labour, and no doubt the Greens and the M\u0101ori Party, will be right beside you.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000526\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c3a88c42-f60b-4cf9-8065-8bfb80a020eb\u0022\u003EI started with a Samoan saying, so it\u2019s only appropriate I end with another. E vave taunu\u2019u le malaga pe a tatou alo va\u2019a fa\u2019atasi\u2014our destiny is within sight when we paddle our canoe together. Labour commends this bill to the House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022d64de4c1-ef68-477e-9c50-db5cbdf99404\u0022 data-id=\u00224fc2cc9421fb4585bc4c5991415d519a\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000527\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022d64de4c1-ef68-477e-9c50-db5cbdf99404\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00224fc2cc9421fb4585bc4c5991415d519a\u0022\u003ETOM RUTHERFORD (National\u2014Bay of Plenty):\u003C/span\u003E Talofa lava, Madam Speaker. Good afternoon and good evening to all my friends in the public gallery today. I promise you there will be no tears. Today marks the culmination of a journey towards justice, as we complete the third reading of the Citizenship (Western Samoa) (Restoration) Amendment Bill. This moment carries special significance as we prepare to move from legislative process to practical implementation\u2014from promise to action. To our guests in the gallery and those watching at home, particularly those whose lives were directly impacted by the 1982 Act: your patience and perseverance over four decades has brought us to this historic day. Your presence here reminds us that behind every line of legislation there are real lives, real families, and real stories of resilience.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000528\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022d64de4c1-ef68-477e-9c50-db5cbdf99404\u0022\u003EFor over 40 years, the Samoan community has lived with the impact of the 1982 Act\u2014an Act that stripped citizenship rights from thousands overnight. This wasn\u2019t just about legal status. It affected families, careers, and lives. It created a wound in our relationship with Samoa that has taken generations to heal. The stories we heard during select committee of families separated, of opportunities lost, of dignity denied, remind us of the real human cost of that decision. Each testimony served to strengthen our resolve to ensure that this legislation would deliver genuine, practical restoration.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000529\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022d64de4c1-ef68-477e-9c50-db5cbdf99404\u0022\u003EThe Government understands the importance of fostering strong relationships with Pacific nations. We take seriously our responsibility to be a good neighbour and partner. What we achieved today is unprecedented: the first time in history that a trustee administered country will be given citizenship in this way. No other mandated country has ever taken this step. This makes our actions today not just nationally significant but internationally groundbreaking.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000530\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022d64de4c1-ef68-477e-9c50-db5cbdf99404\u0022\u003EThe strength of feeling on this issue was demonstrated by more than 24,000 submissions received by the Governance and Administration Committee, one of which represented the views of nearly 6,000 people. This extraordinary level of engagement from both here and overseas shows the power of community organisation and the importance of this moment. It speaks to the deep connection between our nations and the urgency of addressing this historical wrong.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000531\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022d64de4c1-ef68-477e-9c50-db5cbdf99404\u0022\u003EThis parliamentary process has been thorough and considered. At first reading we debated fundamental questions about scope and implementation. Through select committee we heard powerful testimonies that shaped our understanding and approach. During committee of the whole House we refined and improved the technical aspects, ensuring the legislation would work as intended. Through the select committee process we secured several important amendments that improved the bill\u2019s clarity and effectiveness. These include a decision to amend the 1982 legislation rather than repeal it wholesale, providing a clearer, more straightforward way to restore citizenship without breaching the 1962 Treaty of Friendship with Samoa. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000532\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022d64de4c1-ef68-477e-9c50-db5cbdf99404\u0022\u003EThis careful approach ensures we maintain the important frameworks that have governed our special relationship with Samoa over six decades. We also clarified the bill\u2019s scope of eligibility to the cohort of approximately 3,500 individuals who were born between 1924 and 1948 and lost their citizenship when this law was changed in 1982. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000533\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022d64de4c1-ef68-477e-9c50-db5cbdf99404\u0022\u003EThe bill establishes a straightforward application process through the Department of Internal Affairs, with a modest application fee of $177. Importantly, as agreed during the committee of the whole House stage, this fee will be refunded to successful applicants\u2014a change we made to further reduce barriers to citizenship restoration. This approach ensures accessibility while maintaining the integrity of our citizenship process. Let me be clear about who can apply under the legislation: those born in Western Samoa between 13\u00A0May 1924 and 1\u00A0January 1949 who were British subjects by virtue of that birth, women who became New Zealand citizens in 1949 through marriage to such persons, descendants of those born in this period who were themselves born before 1949 and were British subjects, and women who became citizens through marriage to those descendants.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000534\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022d64de4c1-ef68-477e-9c50-db5cbdf99404\u0022\u003EFollowing strong advocacy from select committee members, particularly Lemauga Lydia Sosene and the bill\u2019s sponsor Teanau Tuiono, we have ensured that clear communication will be at the heart of implementation. All documentation, guidance, and support will be provided in both English and Samoan, ensuring the process is truly accessible to all those who are eligible. The legislation strikes a careful balance. While it rights a historical wrong, it does so in a way that strengthens rather than compromises our relationship with Samoa.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000535\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022d64de4c1-ef68-477e-9c50-db5cbdf99404\u0022\u003EThe Department of Internal Affairs will provide comprehensive support to help applicants understand their eligibility and navigate the process. This will include dedicated staff, documentation guidance, and resources in both English and Samoan. For those who are eligible, the path to reclaiming New Zealand citizenship will be straightforward and supported. Each step of the process has been designed with the applicant in mind, ensuring dignity and respect throughout. Most importantly, today we\u2019ve demonstrated how Parliament can work together constructively to achieve meaningful change.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000536\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022d64de4c1-ef68-477e-9c50-db5cbdf99404\u0022\u003ETo the officials who will be tasked with implementing the legislation: your role is vital. Each application you process represents a family\u2019s story, a legacy to be restored, and wrong to be righted. The mana of the legislation will rest in how it is brought to life through your work. We trust you to carry out this important task with the care and respect it deserves. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000537\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022d64de4c1-ef68-477e-9c50-db5cbdf99404\u0022\u003ETo our Samoan community: this bill\u2019s final form reflects your voices, your stories, and your aspirations. The practical process it establishes will soon allow many of you to reclaim what was taken in 1982. While we cannot turn back time, we can and will move forward together. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000538\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022d64de4c1-ef68-477e-9c50-db5cbdf99404\u0022\u003EWhen future generations look back on Parliament\u2019s work, let them see in this bill an example of how a nation can acknowledge its mistakes and take practical steps to address them. Let them see how we can strengthen relationships with our Pacific neighbours through actions, not just words. Let them understand that while justice may sometimes be delayed, it need never be denied.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000539\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022d64de4c1-ef68-477e-9c50-db5cbdf99404\u0022\u003EI wish I could carry on talking for the rest of my three-minute contribution, but I want to make sure we get to the vote before the dinner break, all right? Today, we don\u2019t just pass a law; we open a door that was closed 42 years ago. We extend a hand of justice to those who have waited too long, and we strengthen the bonds between New Zealand and Samoa for generations to come. Fa\u2018afetai tele lava. I commend this bill to the House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002261720d2e-5b1d-4742-b4f0-30424316ccc1\u0022 data-id=\u00222fe7b649dfc345a396f6ec11ae6c58fe\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000540\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002261720d2e-5b1d-4742-b4f0-30424316ccc1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00222fe7b649dfc345a396f6ec11ae6c58fe\u0022\u003EDEPUTY SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: The next call is a split call.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002261725fea-7d5e-4d1f-8fd3-e5779bb7a14d\u0022 data-id=\u00223d59083ab9784d4a99ea4c95f6717f9b\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000541\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002261725fea-7d5e-4d1f-8fd3-e5779bb7a14d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00223d59083ab9784d4a99ea4c95f6717f9b\u0022\u003EHon BARBARA EDMONDS (Labour\u2014Mana):\u003C/span\u003E Tatolu mai tatolu mai, tatolu mai tatolu mai, lua pati mo Samoa, lua pati mo Samoa. I just wanted to make sure that we have the Samoans still in the House today. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000542\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002261725fea-7d5e-4d1f-8fd3-e5779bb7a14d\u0022\u003EMuch history has been transversed as this bill has progressed through our Parliament\u2014our Samoan history with the New Zealand administration, from the ship the Talune and the influenza pandemic to the Dawn Raids apology. Today is a joyful and historic day for our Samoan community. Again, representatives of our Samoan community are here in Parliament to ensure\u2014like any auntie or uncle would\u2014that we, the members of this House, hold true to our word and support this last reading. There is nothing like the stare of repercussions by a Samoan auntie or uncle to ensure we comply\u2014let that be a lesson for us all.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000543\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002261725fea-7d5e-4d1f-8fd3-e5779bb7a14d\u0022\u003EIn the same spirit that yesterday\u2019s h\u012Bkoi was conducted, a kaupapa of rangimarie under the cloak of aroha\u2014peace and honour\u2014we see what is possible when people come together for a right and just cause. It gave me such heart when I saw the Samoan flags and the flags\u00A0of our Pacific nations side by side with tangata whenua over the last week. My ask is that we continue as tangata moana to stand in solidarity with our t\u0113ina who are feeling the weight of decisions being made without them\u2014much like why we are here today.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000544\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002261725fea-7d5e-4d1f-8fd3-e5779bb7a14d\u0022\u003EMuch deserved thanks has been given to our brother Teanau Tuiono for his shepherding of this bill. If he didn\u2019t before, I\u2019m sure he knows fully well now that us Samoans are a complex yet organised people, with many, many views as to the right way of doing things. We stand wholeheartedly behind him. Our thanks to you for taking this forward. We also remember at this time our good friend Fa\u2019an\u0101n\u0101 Efeso Collins, and his wife Fia, and his beautiful girls, who would have been proud of the impact he continues to make here.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000545\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002261725fea-7d5e-4d1f-8fd3-e5779bb7a14d\u0022\u003EMuch thanks has been given today; I echo those sentiments to all those that have been named. The one group I wanted to focus my particular thanks to today, as we conclude this historic day, are the hundreds of cleaners, kitchen hands, and supermarket workers in our Samoan community in the 1970s and 1980s who organised to raise the funds for the Privy Council taken by Falema\u2018i Les\u0101, who tested the law, succeeded, and ultimately has paved the path to where we are today. These low-income workers and their supporters did what we know best: worked as a village to raise funds for a matter of significance. What little they had, they still gave, and\u2014similar to the parable of the widow\u2019s offering in the Gospel according to Mark\u2014much blessings will be given accordingly, whether it be in this life or the next.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000546\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002261725fea-7d5e-4d1f-8fd3-e5779bb7a14d\u0022\u003EVillages need chiefs, and I want to ask the House to indulge me on acknowledging the Special Committee on Overstayers Issue. This special committee was formed to lead this organisation and fund-raising, and it was based both here in Wellington and Auckland. It is only fitting that on this day, I name them so that their contribution to our history be recorded\u00A0in the Hansard: Faalua Elifasa; Asofa Tagataese; Richard Robert Pritchard; Auuaola Fia Samuela; Michael Fomai Fio Mercury; Sakaria Peniata; Elizabeth Peivi Smith Leelo (Auntie Liz); Dr George Barton; Pulepule Ta\u2019avao Aiono; George Rosenberg; Paula Siuga Masoe; Reverend Tuao Tiatia; Puni Raea; Pipi Fa\u2019ailo; Pisa Fa\u2019aeia; Ti\u2019i Letolo\u2014some, and many, who have passed away. And, of course, Falema\u2018i Les\u0101 herself. Fa\u2018afetai, fa\u2018afetai, fa\u2018afetai tele lava to you all.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000547\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002261725fea-7d5e-4d1f-8fd3-e5779bb7a14d\u0022\u003EIt is my great privilege\u2014first and foremost a Samoan girl from the villages of Fale\u2019ula, Faleatiu; Safotu; Fasito\u2019o-uta; and Asau\u2014to lend my support. I commend this bill to the House\u2014685 to the world!\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002239b9bac1-a992-4ccf-a473-9591aeb3a298\u0022 data-id=\u00220c3eda40ceb14dae962184bf3ca3cefc\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000548\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002239b9bac1-a992-4ccf-a473-9591aeb3a298\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00220c3eda40ceb14dae962184bf3ca3cefc\u0022\u003ERIMA NAKHLE (National\u2014Takanini):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Madam Speaker. Malo le soifua, one and all. It really is a pleasure to rise on this extremely, extremely profound and special occasion. I must begin by saying that I did not have the pleasure of being on the select committee that helped shepherd this bill to this stage with Teanau Tuiono\u2014the Governance and Administration Committee\u2014but it is a privilege to stand here today.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000549\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002239b9bac1-a992-4ccf-a473-9591aeb3a298\u0022\u003EIf you don\u2019t mind, I\u2019m only going to take a couple of minutes, because I\u2019m aware that many of you need to travel home, hopefully to Takanini and beyond, but I will say that it\u2019s an important bill that was drawn from the ballot on 3 August 2023. What I\u2019ve been reflecting on is how interesting the dynamics of this is, that something so deep and so impactful was drawn out of a ballot. I guess we can reflect on that as we continue with our journeys in this Parliament; in this great House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000550\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002239b9bac1-a992-4ccf-a473-9591aeb3a298\u0022\u003EI\u2019d like to acknowledge the approximately 24,581 people, groups, individuals that made submissions. I\u2019d like to acknowledge as well my friends in the gallery, Teleiai Edwin Puni, my neighbour, and Tofilau Tevaga. I saw you both for the first time giving a deputation at the Manurewa Local Board and I realised you\u2019re absolutely movers and shakers, so thank you for all the contribution you\u2019ve done as well.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000551\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002239b9bac1-a992-4ccf-a473-9591aeb3a298\u0022\u003EFinally, I\u2019d like to say that I was blessed to have my heart opened to our Pasifika community many years ago in Australia when my sister married my Pasifika brother-in-law, and I have half-Pasifika nieces and nephews. What I\u2019ve learnt about our Pasifika community is that, in many instances, you smile and laugh with all your heart, but when you suffer, you suffer in silence but continue to have the smile on your face for everyone.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000552\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002239b9bac1-a992-4ccf-a473-9591aeb3a298\u0022\u003EGod bless you all. Thank you for the wisdom that you\u2019ve shown us and that you\u2019ve woven into Aotearoa New Zealand. God bless your journeys going forward. I commend this bill to the House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022d14b1afe-2069-41e4-96fa-c8dc81a991a4\u0022 data-id=\u002263a638153ee44b648e54fb1de974c914\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000553\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022d14b1afe-2069-41e4-96fa-c8dc81a991a4\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002263a638153ee44b648e54fb1de974c914\u0022\u003EHon JENNY SALESA (Labour\u2014Panmure-\u014Ct\u0101huhu):\u003C/span\u003E Talofa lava. Fa\u2018afetai tele, Madam Speaker. O le aso lenei na faia e Ieova, ia tatou olioli ma fiafia i ai. This is the day that the Lord has made, we shall rejoice and be glad in it.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000554\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022d14b1afe-2069-41e4-96fa-c8dc81a991a4\u0022\u003EThis is a really significant and historic day for our Samoan aiga and for Aotearoa New Zealand and Samoa, as well as the many thousands of Samoans all over the world. Malo le soifua and welcome to all of the Samoans in your hundreds who are here in Parliament, as well as those who are watching online from other parts of Parliament, as well as from Saint Paul\u2019s Cathedral and right across the world. It is unusual that this House of Parliament is so full of alofa. It is unusual that we are so united as politicians, as many of you both current politicians and former politicians know, but this is the right thing to do. It is so good that we are united to restore justice.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000555\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022d14b1afe-2069-41e4-96fa-c8dc81a991a4\u0022\u003ETens of thousands of Samoans have been affected by the Citizenship (Western Samoa) Act, which was passed in this Parliament in 1982, and as we have heard through the thousands of submissions, that Act effectively revoked the citizenship of Samoans who were rightfully entitled to New Zealand citizenship. But it is not actually just Samoans for whom today is significant; it is also a significant day for New Zealand, because we are addressing one of those historic wrongs, and consequently it is a step towards justice that all New Zealanders should recognise and be really proud of.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000556\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022d14b1afe-2069-41e4-96fa-c8dc81a991a4\u0022\u003ERestoring justice for our Samoan aiga has been a very, very long process and for lawmakers in Aotearoa New Zealand, it is indeed with humility that we reflect on the past, that we acknowledge the injustices that have resulted from the passage of an Act that was enacted from this House. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000557\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022d14b1afe-2069-41e4-96fa-c8dc81a991a4\u0022\u003EI would also like to thank the many Samoans, especially those affected by the 1982 Act, who are in this House today in person. I thank you for your guidance, I thank you for your advocacy, and I thank you especially for your patience. Fa\u2018afetai tele lava to all of you nearly 25,000 people who made submissions on this bill.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000558\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022d14b1afe-2069-41e4-96fa-c8dc81a991a4\u0022\u003EI would also like to especially acknowledge my friend and colleague Teanau Tuiono. We were at law school together, so I\u2019ve known him for many decades\u2014I won\u2019t say exactly how long. Meitaki maata. Ng\u0101 mihi nui, Teanau, for all of your hard work, as well as all of your patience in shepherding and guiding this legislation through and for all of the hard work, not only in making sure that all of the parties in this House agree but actually ensuring that our communities\u2014because there are many voices in our Samoan community, making sure that all of those voices are actually reflected in the final bill that we have in front of us.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000559\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022d14b1afe-2069-41e4-96fa-c8dc81a991a4\u0022\u003ELike you, Teanau, I would also like to acknowledge our friend and colleague Fa\u2019an\u0101n\u0101 Efeso Collins. Today, if he was here, he would have been so proud. He would have made a speech that would have made all of us laugh and all of us cry too. I acknowledge him.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000560\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022d14b1afe-2069-41e4-96fa-c8dc81a991a4\u0022\u003EI would also like to acknowledge Falema\u2018i Les\u0101 for your work and your resilience. I acknowledge you and your legal team and all of the people\u2014my colleague the Hon Barbara Edmonds said all their names before, the Samoan community both here in Wellington and in Auckland who got together, who fund-raised to ensure that your legal case went all the way to the Privy Council. I thank you, Falema\u2018i Les\u0101, because you are here today. You are here to witness justice being restored. I thank you also for coming to the Governance and Administration Committee. I was one of the privileged MPs that sat in that select committee. Even though your submission was mostly in Samoan, you actually made me cry. So many of the submitters that came to us that day made us cry. Thank you for never giving up. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000561\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022d14b1afe-2069-41e4-96fa-c8dc81a991a4\u0022\u003EToday is about acknowledging the many tens of thousands of Samoans whose citizenship was revoked and disavowed in 1982. I want to remember that some of those Samoans are here today and watching online, however, the sadness of today is that this redress has taken over 40 years and that most of the Samoans that were affected by the 1982 Act have since passed away. They have not lived to see this moment. Today we remember all of them.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000562\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022d14b1afe-2069-41e4-96fa-c8dc81a991a4\u0022\u003EThis issue is personal to me and my family and to many thousands of constituents in my own electorate in Panmure-\u014Ct\u0101huhu. Nearly 50\u00A0percent of my electorate are Pacific people. Many of them are Samoans and Tongans. My father-in-law is one of those people affected, Tusanilefaia\u2019ao Ieremia Salesa. I mention him today because of his deep connection not only with our family but I mention him because we have so many fathers, fathers-in-law, grandfathers, mothers, aunties, and uncles\u2014all of our aiga who are not here to see this justice. We remember all of you.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000563\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022d14b1afe-2069-41e4-96fa-c8dc81a991a4\u0022\u003EThese acts of memory are absolutely vital to us to keep us at our best and to ensure that we remain the best nation we can be. As we saw yesterday, under the leadership of Te P\u0101ti M\u0101ori, New Zealand continues to wrestle with its colonial past. It is important that today we remember Samoa\u2019s part of New Zealand\u2019s colonial history which is so often forgotten and overlooked. We will only move forward together if we face our past honestly and with integrity.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000564\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022d14b1afe-2069-41e4-96fa-c8dc81a991a4\u0022\u003EAs the great Samoan writer Maualaivao Albert Wendt put\u2014and I quote\u2014\u201CWe are what we remember.\u201D Today, we remember those deep connections that bind Samoa and Aotearoa New Zealand together. Our roots are deep, but our past is not easy and parts of it are confronting. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000565\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022d14b1afe-2069-41e4-96fa-c8dc81a991a4\u0022\u003EIn 1914, New Zealand established a military occupation on behalf of Great Britain to take possession of Samoa from Germany. In 1920, this colonial role was affirmed by the League of Nations as the administrator of Samoa. Samoan people had no say in those decisions, no votes. They were not consulted. This was true of the entire period of New Zealand\u2019s rule. New Zealand\u2019s role as colonial administrator continued right up until 1962. There were many difficult times for Samoans during this period. The colonial period in Samoa was not to New Zealand\u2019s credit. The Samoan resistance movement, the Mau, struggled against New Zealand rule for decades. Their vision for Samoa was Samoa mo Samoa\u2014Samoa for Samoans.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000566\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022d14b1afe-2069-41e4-96fa-c8dc81a991a4\u0022\u003EI would like also to acknowledge Arthur Anae and the Mau movement group, Tofilau Nina Kirifi Alai, and many others, as well as Lemauga Lydia Sosene, who had a lot to do with this bill in the select committee. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000567\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022d14b1afe-2069-41e4-96fa-c8dc81a991a4\u0022\u003EI also would like to especially acknowledge, similar to Teanau, the Rt Hon Winston Peters and New Zealand First, because the two of us tag-teamed New Zealand First to ensure that we actually got their support right through to third reading. You see, we were united in Opposition, so we only needed one party from the coalition of the Government and that was our hope\u2014New Zealand First.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000568\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022d14b1afe-2069-41e4-96fa-c8dc81a991a4\u0022\u003EI do want to thank Dr Parmjeet Parmar and the ACT Party as well. Those of us who were here during that first reading, as soon as Dr Parmjeet Parmar said that the ACT Party supported this bill, there were so many of us who were yahooing because we knew that this bill would get to select committee.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000569\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022d14b1afe-2069-41e4-96fa-c8dc81a991a4\u0022\u003ELast but not least, I would like to acknowledge my National Party colleagues, Cameron Brewer and all of the members in the select committee and the National Party for supporting this bill. It is wonderful that it is a bill that is unanimously supported, because it is the right thing for all of us to support it unanimously in restoring justice for our Samoan people. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000570\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022d14b1afe-2069-41e4-96fa-c8dc81a991a4\u0022\u003EI would like to thank all of our Samoan people, especially those affected by this Act, for your advocacy, your guidance, and your patience. Fa\u2018afetai tele lava to all of you who submitted and made this bill become law. Fa\u2018afetai tele lava. Manuia le aso.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00221573c6f8-999b-434d-8bde-a47a586ee0f0\u0022 data-id=\u00228e8bc918eabf4698836dc7154b45f6b3\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000571\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221573c6f8-999b-434d-8bde-a47a586ee0f0\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00228e8bc918eabf4698836dc7154b45f6b3\u0022\u003EGREG FLEMING (National\u2014Maungakiekie):\u003C/span\u003E Lau Susuga i le Fofoga Fetalai, ou te faafetai tele i le Atua ua mafai ona tatou faatasi i lenei as i lona alofa. Faatalofa atu i lau afioga le Fofoga Fetalai, Susuga i le Palemia ma lau Kapineta faapea sui uma a le fono o le Palemene o Niu Sila. Faasilisili ona ou faatalofa atu i le mamalu ma le pa\u02BBia o Samoa ua potopoto faapea Samoa i tulu\u02BBiga uma o le lalolagi. O upu a le fai Salamo, \u201Ce faasaga a\u02BBe o\u02BBu mata i mauga, e maua mai ai lo\u02BBu fesoasoani o lo\u02BBu fesoasoani e maua mai ia Ieova lea o le na faia le lagi atoa ma le lalolagi\u201D. Faafetai Samoa mo le tou auai mai i le aso e molimauina le aso o le a toe faafoi atu ai le sitiseni o Niu Sila i tagata Samoa \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000572\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221573c6f8-999b-434d-8bde-a47a586ee0f0\u0022\u003EI love Wednesdays. They start early with morning prayer at the cathedral just over the road. It\u2019s a weekly reminder of where the real power lies. Sometimes my prayers are requests. This morning, they were only praise. For today is a good day\u2014it\u2019s a very good day. I spoke about this with Savea last Friday on Radio Samoa. Good to have you here, Savea.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000573\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221573c6f8-999b-434d-8bde-a47a586ee0f0\u0022\u003EIn the gallery today is Pastor Tomasi Aiono, who hails from the villages of Fasito\u2019o Uta and Lona, Fagaloa. Tomasi is the second-eldest of 10 children. His parents, Aiono Fina\u2019i Mika and Gafa Aiono, lost their citizenship in 1982. Two years later, they sent their son to New Zealand to pursue a better future. Tomasi found a job, worked incredibly hard, and over the next six years was able to bring both his parents and siblings to New Zealand. He and his family planted a church in Ellerslie. They adopted and cared for many children and have blessed, and continued to do so, thousands of New Zealanders. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000574\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221573c6f8-999b-434d-8bde-a47a586ee0f0\u0022\u003ETomasi\u2019s wife, Ioka Aiono, is also here today. She hails from the village of Saleapaga. Ioka\u2019s the second-eldest of 14 children\u2014I thought we had done all right with five. She came to New Zealand in 1987 with the hope of bringing her parents, Uialatea and Faleosina Fauena, to New Zealand. She was never able to. Ioka, I\u2019m sorry. But I know you have aunties and uncles who have lived to see their citizenship now restored. This is a good day.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000575\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221573c6f8-999b-434d-8bde-a47a586ee0f0\u0022\u003ETomasi and Ioka\u2019s daughter is my friend and colleague Margaret Epati. Along with Shani Hatitio, we have the privilege and delight of together serving the people of Maungakiekie. Last Thursday after work, Margaret went to buy a dress but the shop was closed so she drove outside the electorate all the way to Ormiston mall\u2014she really wanted that dress. There, she was approached by a distressed lady who asked if she spoke Samoan, and could she help as the EFTPOS card had just failed at the supermarket and she was out of petrol to get home. As Margaret sorted those things, she asked her story.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000576\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221573c6f8-999b-434d-8bde-a47a586ee0f0\u0022\u003E Losa Leota came to New Zealand just two years ago with her four children, but sadly not her husband\u2014he was killed in a car accident in Samoa just after they qualified for New Zealand through the quota. A few weeks ago, Losa brought her mother to New Zealand. Alofa Toma is currently here on a three-month visa and Losa is desperate for her to stay as there is no one back home in Samoa to look after her and she needs her mum. Losa applied for a further visa for her mother, but at her advanced age there was no chance. At that point, Margaret asked what year her mother happened to be born. Losa replied that Alofa was born on 17\u00A0September 1940. Margaret told Losa about this bill, which she had not heard of, to make sure that they listened to this third reading now. When this bill passes in a few minutes and she submits her application on Monday, her mother Alofa will again be a citizen of Niu Sila. This is a good day.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000577\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221573c6f8-999b-434d-8bde-a47a586ee0f0\u0022\u003EA o le i uma la\u02BBu tautalaga ou te faafetai atu Samoa, ou te faamanuia atu Samoa i ou tagatanu\u02BBu e tusa ma lau sa\u02BBiliga malo. Faafetai i la outou lagolago malosi ina ia manuia lenei pili a lea ua tali le Atua. Faamalo le loto toa faamalo le loto atunuu. Fai mai le Efeso muamua fuaiupu e tolu, \u201CIa tatou faafetai atu i le Atua le Tama ma lo tatou Alii o Iesu Keriso o le na faamanuia mai ia i tatou i faamanuiaga faaleagaga uma lava i mea o i le lagi ona o Keriso\u201D. Faamanuia le Atua, 685 to the World! \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002261720d2e-5b1d-4742-b4f0-30424316ccc1\u0022 data-id=\u00223aae89ab80be44f6ab887e6dd16bcd63\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000578\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002261720d2e-5b1d-4742-b4f0-30424316ccc1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00223aae89ab80be44f6ab887e6dd16bcd63\u0022\u003EDEPUTY SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: OK, so I appreciate\u2014I say to the gallery\u2014that you\u2019ve waited a very long time. I\u2019d just ask for your indulgence of about 30 more seconds. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000579\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002261720d2e-5b1d-4742-b4f0-30424316ccc1\u0022\u003EMembers, I have some housekeeping before I put the question. At the conclusion of this order of the day, the House will be suspended for the dinner break and will resume in committee at 7.30\u00A0p.m. for consideration of members\u2019 order of the day No. 2, the Corrections (Victim Protection) Amendment Bill. The question is that the motion be agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000580\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002261720d2e-5b1d-4742-b4f0-30424316ccc1\u0022\u003EMotion agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000581\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002261720d2e-5b1d-4742-b4f0-30424316ccc1\u0022\u003EBill read a third time.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000582\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002261720d2e-5b1d-4742-b4f0-30424316ccc1\u0022\u003E[Applause]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000583\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002261720d2e-5b1d-4742-b4f0-30424316ccc1\u0022\u003E[Speech from the gallery]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000584\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002261720d2e-5b1d-4742-b4f0-30424316ccc1\u0022\u003EWaiata\u2014\u201CLe Atua Mamana e\u201D\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000585\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002261720d2e-5b1d-4742-b4f0-30424316ccc1\u0022\u003ESitting suspended from 6.04\u00A0p.m. to 7.30\u00A0p.m.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n    \u003C/div\u003E\n    \u003Cdiv class=\u0022HpsHansard\u0022\u003E\n      \u003Cp\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsProceedingHeading\u0022\u003EBills\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000586\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u00223f8a4f8a84a644d583c70ccca8796181\u0022\u003ECorrections (Victim Protection) Amendment Bill\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000587\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u00220d0b74e5e33b4b3587825482d1e9d68d\u0022\u003EIn Committee\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000588\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u0022232a57fc616d488ea574969e84dd0101\u0022\u003EClause 1  Title\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002261720d2e-5b1d-4742-b4f0-30424316ccc1\u0022 data-id=\u002220480edaa5784c6991eb4db7e5dc8eee\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000589\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002261720d2e-5b1d-4742-b4f0-30424316ccc1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002220480edaa5784c6991eb4db7e5dc8eee\u0022\u003ECHAIRPERSON (Barbara Kuriger)\u003C/span\u003E: Good evening, members. Members, the House is in committee on the Corrections (Victim Protection) Amendment Bill. We start with clause 1. Clause 1 is the debate on the title. The question is that clause 1 stand part.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002239b9bac1-a992-4ccf-a473-9591aeb3a298\u0022 data-id=\u00224bb490c02d904dfa92587c0dc9373f3d\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000590\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002239b9bac1-a992-4ccf-a473-9591aeb3a298\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00224bb490c02d904dfa92587c0dc9373f3d\u0022\u003ERIMA NAKHLE (National\u2014Takanini):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Madam Chair. It really is a pleasure and actually a privilege to be in this seat as we are in the committee stage of the member\u2019s bill in my name\u2014Rima Nakhle, that is, for those of you listening at home\u2014the Corrections (Victim Protection) Amendment Bill. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000591\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002239b9bac1-a992-4ccf-a473-9591aeb3a298\u0022\u003EFor our friends and wh\u0101nau at home, what\u2019s going on here is now we are in what\u2019s called the committee of the whole House stage. We\u2019ve been through the first reading, we\u2019ve been through select committee, and we\u2019ve been through the second reading. What we\u2019re doing now is kind of like another type of select committee, but in the debating chamber.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000592\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002239b9bac1-a992-4ccf-a473-9591aeb3a298\u0022\u003EMadam Chair, if you\u2019d indulge me while I just talk about this bill on a holistic basis, and then coming back to the different clauses. Yep, it\u2019s a short bill; it\u2019s a small bill, but we feel that the ripple effects will be many and will be very positive in terms of how we are going to protect victims even more.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000593\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002239b9bac1-a992-4ccf-a473-9591aeb3a298\u0022\u003EIt\u2019s very interesting, the conversations that took place when we were discussing in the different stages so far of this bill, the Corrections (Victim Protection) Amendment Bill. A number of issues were raised. There weren\u2019t that many submissions, but the submissions were really good. One of the questions that was raised by the Law Society was the fact that the Corrections Act, which is the principal Act which this amendment bill hopes to amend, doesn\u2019t really define what a victim is. What they very clearly outlined to us on the select committee\u2014the Justice Committee, chaired by my mate here, James Meager\u2014is that also in the amendment bill, there wasn\u2019t a definition for \u201Cvictim\u201D. We took that on board. That\u2019s one of the many things we took on board, and we\u2019ll peruse all these considerations as we go through this evening, hopefully, clause by clause.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000594\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002239b9bac1-a992-4ccf-a473-9591aeb3a298\u0022\u003EEssentially, what this bill aims to do is to protect victims\u2014victims of crime, those that have a protection order for their benefit from unwanted contact from people that are under the supervision of Corrections that are located within prisons. That in itself was quite a journey with respect to this bill. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000595\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002239b9bac1-a992-4ccf-a473-9591aeb3a298\u0022\u003EWhat I would like to say is that it\u2019s been quite a staged effect with respect to this bill: where we started, where we\u2019re at now, and where we\u2019re hoping to go. The general kaupapa, like I said, kind of fits in the objectives for our Government\u2014that is, how do we put victims at the forefront of the actions that we\u2019re doing, the changes we\u2019re making in order to protect victims? To highlight the general work that our Government is doing, it is about saying that those that commit crimes need to be held accountable. The reason why we\u2019re focused on that is because of our desire to protect the victims of crime even more.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000596\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002239b9bac1-a992-4ccf-a473-9591aeb3a298\u0022\u003EI welcome the continued k\u014Drero that we\u2019re going to have this evening, and I thank my colleagues across the Chamber in the Justice Committee with their patience with me as I questioned and delved into what more we can do to strengthen these protections. I look forward to us continuing this conversation this evening. Thank you, Madam Chair. I\u2019m happy to take questions.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022ef094bb1-be4f-48b8-bb53-52ce955a1c2d\u0022 data-id=\u0022ae430e622de5475185bda9faaee48158\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000597\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ef094bb1-be4f-48b8-bb53-52ce955a1c2d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022ae430e622de5475185bda9faaee48158\u0022\u003EJAMES MEAGER (National\u2014Rangitata):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Madam Chair. I want to start my contribution tonight as is traditional, which is to give somewhat of a brief overview and then get to the clause that we are discussing at the moment, but I wanted to start by acknowledging the work of my colleague Rima Nakhle on this bill. It would be hard to find a stronger and more voiceful advocate for victims in our caucus and in the Parliament. I think what we\u2019ll see over the next hour, hour and a half, maybe longer, will be a demonstration of the work that Rima Nakhle has put into this bill throughout the process and the dedication she is putting to supporting victims right up until the last minute.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000598\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ef094bb1-be4f-48b8-bb53-52ce955a1c2d\u0022\u003EI note that Mrs Nakhle has an amendment that we\u2019ll get to later on. I don\u2019t want to discuss it now, because that would be somewhat disorderly because it\u2019s the wrong clause. It is an amendment that the member has been working on because she is constantly trying to see: can she strengthen the bill, can she make sure the bill is as good as it can be? Because it is a member\u2019s bill, it\u2019s limited in what it can do. It doesn\u2019t have the resource of hundreds of officials. In fact, we can see that the member, my colleague, will be flying solo tonight when it comes to answering questions and taking advice and trying to clarify questions from members.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000599\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002298dbeffa-e059-49d5-8bbf-579cbaead9a3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022d27ea51b94594ae890f8240439156dee\u0022\u003EHon Scott Simpson\u003C/span\u003E: Flying high.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000600\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ef094bb1-be4f-48b8-bb53-52ce955a1c2d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022f46d1a30545d48a38050fe3fdf368658\u0022\u003EJAMES MEAGER\u003C/span\u003E: Flying high. Flying solo but flying high, as my colleagues say. I wanted to acknowledge her stewardship of the bill through the House. It\u2019s an important moment for the class of  \u201923 in our caucus too, because this is the first member\u2019s bill that has come from the National Party through the Justice Committee. We\u2019ve had one from Mr\u00A0O\u2019Connor, one from Deborah Russell, and also Todd Stephenson has a bill too, but this is the first one that we\u2019ve had the opportunity to acknowledge the work of our colleagues and to help support through the House. National will be supporting the bill through the committee stage, I think that\u2019s quite clear.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000601\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ef094bb1-be4f-48b8-bb53-52ce955a1c2d\u0022\u003EWe do have some testing questions for the member throughout. There were a lot of issues raised in select committee about the scope of the bill, and it has been narrowed somewhat. I understand that we\u2019ll get to those clauses later on. The focus for us always in this bill and always as a party and as a Government is on protecting the rights of victims and ensuring that it is in a context of a justice system which does look at the offender and the does look at strong rehabilitation and does look at the role that a justice system plays in making sure people are held to account for their actions but are also rehabilitated. But we can never lose sight of the core of our purpose, and that is to make sure that we look after victims; that we make sure that there are fewer victims of crime; and that where there are victims of crime, they are protected by the State and they are protected by the mechanisms of the State. That\u2019s where we get to in the start of this debate when we are talking about the title of the bill.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000602\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ef094bb1-be4f-48b8-bb53-52ce955a1c2d\u0022\u003EThe title is, of course\u2014I\u2019ll read it out for the committee\u2014the Corrections (Victim Protection) Amendment Bill. It\u2019s important to acknowledge that, with all debates in the committee on title clauses, the title should represent or reflect what is in the bill or what the bill actually does. We\u2019re not going to be, as a group on this side of the Chamber, offering up amendments that try to detract from the purpose of the bill, which is quite simply and plainly on its face to provide further mechanisms to protect victims of crime from actions of offenders under the custody of Corrections.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000603\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ef094bb1-be4f-48b8-bb53-52ce955a1c2d\u0022\u003ENow, we\u2019ll get to some changes made later on about the extent to which we were trying to protect victims of crime in the community, and sometimes there are restrictions on what we can do there. Unfortunately, I think\u2014and Mrs Nakhle can speak to this\u2014the bill may not meet the expectations of all victims out there. It may at the moment only cover those victims of offenders who are in prisons and the victims are being protected by prison managers and the chief executive of Corrections because they are serving custodial sentences. But it is important to point out that it is not just victims; it is also those other individuals who are affected by the offenders who may be associated with victims or who may be family members of offenders who will benefit from this bill and who would be protected by the provisions in this bill.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000604\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ef094bb1-be4f-48b8-bb53-52ce955a1c2d\u0022\u003EI don\u2019t have an amendment to offer to the committee on the title. I think the title does quite accurately reflect the content of the bill. I would invite and encourage members from across the Chamber to make a brief contribution about their views on the bill in the opportunity that we have at the start to talk somewhat more broadly before we get into the meat and bones of each clause. I commend the member for bringing it to the House and I look forward to making a number of contributions in the time that we have later on tonight.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022d64de4c1-ef68-477e-9c50-db5cbdf99404\u0022 data-id=\u002245b4b68eed384cf9a38b55037edcba4f\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000605\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022d64de4c1-ef68-477e-9c50-db5cbdf99404\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002245b4b68eed384cf9a38b55037edcba4f\u0022\u003ETOM RUTHERFORD (National\u2014Bay of Plenty):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you very much, Madam Chair, and just picking up where my colleague James Meager, as the chair of the Justice Committee, left off\u2014acknowledging this bill has been through the Justice Committee, shepherded by Rima Nakhle, who\u2019s sitting in the chair next to you.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000606\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022d64de4c1-ef68-477e-9c50-db5cbdf99404\u0022\u003EWhen I look at the title of this bill, I want it to be quite crystal clear around the implementation and what it\u2019s actually meaning, because it is important that the title is reflective of the action that is being delivered through the bill itself. With the title being the Corrections (Victim Protection) Amendment Bill, when I read through the\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000607\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f7fc7ac3-5ce1-43ca-8cd6-dbb0941bf3ae\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002227e75c0d3ba24453ba1108280df93c68\u0022\u003EHon Dr Duncan Webb\u003C/span\u003E: This is disrespectful to the member.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000608\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022d64de4c1-ef68-477e-9c50-db5cbdf99404\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00228da912b2ec5c4aceb182a823aaa39d69\u0022\u003ETOM RUTHERFORD\u003C/span\u003E: What was that, Mr Webb?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000609\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f7fc7ac3-5ce1-43ca-8cd6-dbb0941bf3ae\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a24a39f77ee547dc813dcb03ea1e2981\u0022\u003EHon Dr Duncan Webb\u003C/span\u003E: This is disrespectful to the member, to filibuster your own member\u2019s bill.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000610\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022d64de4c1-ef68-477e-9c50-db5cbdf99404\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022057597508e9d4d95a3f2fd0ed5110c77\u0022\u003ETOM RUTHERFORD\u003C/span\u003E: It\u2019s a little bit ironic Mr Webb across the Chamber talks about filibustering.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000611\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002261720d2e-5b1d-4742-b4f0-30424316ccc1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002276c4a134111244328a593879a7cb9183\u0022\u003ECHAIRPERSON (Barbara Kuriger)\u003C/span\u003E: I don\u2019t think we\u2019ve heard Mr Rutherford\u2019s question yet, so carry on.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000612\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022d64de4c1-ef68-477e-9c50-db5cbdf99404\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022718c14e8bf9d48e08af8447a756c3f6c\u0022\u003ETOM RUTHERFORD\u003C/span\u003E: No, we haven\u2019t. We haven\u2019t, and I would welcome Mr Webb taking a call on the bill if he would like to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000613\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022d64de4c1-ef68-477e-9c50-db5cbdf99404\u0022\u003EAnyway, if I may, I\u2019d like to come back to the point that I was getting to. Through the select committee process and the submissions that were received by the Justice Committee, the Law Society said at the time in their submission that they noted there wasn\u2019t actually a definition of the word \u201Cvictim\u201D in either the Corrections Act or this bill, which is the Corrections (Victim Protection) Amendment Bill. There was some suggestion that, potentially, the bill be amended to include a definition related to \u201Cvictim\u201D, but also acknowledging that in the Act, victims are referred to in a wider sense than what is specifically captured by this bill.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000614\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022d64de4c1-ef68-477e-9c50-db5cbdf99404\u0022\u003EIt\u2019s interesting, when we have the title being \u201CCorrections (Victim Protection) Amendment Bill\u201D but then you dive into the Corrections Act or you dive into this bill and you don\u2019t actually see the word \u201Cvictim\u201D being defined. I\u2019m just really keen to garner the interests of the member in charge\u2014whether she was open to a scope of potentially changing the title or whether she\u2019s comfortable having the word \u201Cvictim\u201D included in the title without the definition necessarily being prescribed. I would welcome the opportunity from the member in the seat to respond to that question.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000615\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022d64de4c1-ef68-477e-9c50-db5cbdf99404\u0022\u003EThen, as my colleague James Meager outlined earlier, as we move through clause by clause on this debate, we will be diving into the nitty gritty and the weeds of each particular part, because it\u2019s really important, through the committee of the whole House. This is the opportunity to get into the weeds. This is the opportunity for us to dive down in there and to make sure\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000616\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225ec01d23-b55e-45b9-a668-d3bf14212126\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022f0832ef26e7f4369b5c38ee5bda2fe11\u0022\u003EHelen White\u003C/span\u003E: Well, you\u2019re there.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000617\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022d64de4c1-ef68-477e-9c50-db5cbdf99404\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022b1298e72bb574361a2b50c528b30d63a\u0022\u003ETOM RUTHERFORD\u003C/span\u003E: What was that, Helen White?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000618\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225ec01d23-b55e-45b9-a668-d3bf14212126\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002212944f72ef024237825f6554b888d38a\u0022\u003EHelen White\u003C/span\u003E: You\u2019re in the weeds.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000619\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022d64de4c1-ef68-477e-9c50-db5cbdf99404\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00229b61702ef8d745aaa1e2f518a332509c\u0022\u003ETOM RUTHERFORD\u003C/span\u003E: Yeah\u2014early days, early days. I\u2019m just getting started. It is a really good opportunity for us to make sure that the legislation is fit for purpose when it comes to the implementation phase. I understand the member, in different clauses, has some amendments that she\u2019ll make, and we\u2019ll talk to those at that time, but it\u2019s really important that right now and throughout this committee of the whole House, we get the bill in the best possible shape so that, when it comes to the implementation stage, those that are actually implementing the intentions of this bill know what the intentions of Parliament were for them to do it and that it can be done successfully.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000620\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022d64de4c1-ef68-477e-9c50-db5cbdf99404\u0022\u003EI would welcome the opportunity for the member, in the later stages, to talk about some of the changes that were made to this piece of legislation through the select committee stage and through the feedback that was received by the Justice Committee, because it\u2019s really important to ensure that when it comes to the implementation of it, they understand why those changes were initially made and then why the intention of the bill was brought forward so that it could be implemented in New Zealand.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000621\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022d64de4c1-ef68-477e-9c50-db5cbdf99404\u0022\u003ETo come back to the point I made at the start, it says \u201CCorrections (Victim Protection) Amendment Bill\u201D. The New Zealand Law Society, in their submission to the Justice Committee\u2014which, I believe, are on their 28th bill, if I\u2019m correct, Mr Meager\u2014noted that the word \u201Cvictim\u201D is not defined in either the Corrections Act or in this bill specifically. They did suggest that they amend the bill to include a definition for \u201Cvictim\u201D, so I\u2019d welcome the\u00A0opportunity from the member in charge to speak to those questions, if she may.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002239b9bac1-a992-4ccf-a473-9591aeb3a298\u0022 data-id=\u00223aa068100bb74bca89f2e7e5a26b4bda\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000622\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002239b9bac1-a992-4ccf-a473-9591aeb3a298\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00223aa068100bb74bca89f2e7e5a26b4bda\u0022\u003ERIMA NAKHLE (National\u2014Takanini):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Madam Chair. Look, I\u2019d like to thank my colleagues for those contributions. First, I\u2019d like to thank our unwavering chair, James Meager, for his kind comments. Thank you very much, my friend. I know that you work very hard in the pursuit of restoring law and order as well, as many of us in this committee do, and protecting the rights of victims. I\u2019d like to acknowledge you, Tom Rutherford, for the contributions you\u2019ve just made. And, if I may, I\u2019d just like to say thank you, Dr Webb, for feeling you need to rise to my defence, but in this situation, this is a result of a conversation.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000623\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002239b9bac1-a992-4ccf-a473-9591aeb3a298\u0022\u003EWhat I love about my colleagues\u2014we call ourselves the newbies, the class of 2023\u2014is that we actually sit down and really traverse a lot of the nuances, the ideas, and the yes and the no of different bills that come before our House. This conversation is a result of a k\u014Drero that we\u2019ve had where my mate Tom came up to me and said, \u201CHey, look, you know your bill\u2014there\u2019s a few thoughts that I have about it. Can you talk me through it?\u201D I let him know about the departmental report and what\u2019s said there and the advice we received. Thank you, but I don\u2019t take this as filibustering.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000624\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002239b9bac1-a992-4ccf-a473-9591aeb3a298\u0022\u003ELook, we won\u2019t spend too much time on the title, because there\u2019s other clauses to consider, but the reason why I feel it\u2019s important is because I also considered this, especially when we realise that, actually, there\u2019s no real definition for \u201Cvictims\u201D in the principal Act, the Corrections Act. As I mentioned earlier, the Law Society made a point of this void, and they suggested that we seriously consider adding it in this amendment bill that\u2019s in my name.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000625\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002239b9bac1-a992-4ccf-a473-9591aeb3a298\u0022\u003EThe advice from the Corrections officials was that, if they included it, if we were to amend the bill and include a definition for \u201Cvictims\u201D, essentially, it would need significant resource to operationalise. I\u2019d like to quote, if you don\u2019t mind, from the departmental report, paragraph 25: \u201CWe consider that defining \u2018victim\u2019 in this bill would not allow Corrections to operationalise the bill as drafted. This is because it will take significant resource and fiscal investment to administer that database to hold this information in an appropriate way, and significant concerns around privacy would need to be managed.\u201D Now, that\u2019s a pretty strong statement, and that\u2019s why we thought, \u201COK, you know, I thought I was doing a lot of the thinking over the nights. I\u2019ll back away from insisting on this definition for victims.\u201D\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000626\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002239b9bac1-a992-4ccf-a473-9591aeb3a298\u0022\u003EHowever, what I appreciate about these deep philosophical conversations and law conversations is that it highlights different voids across our legal system. This is important, and it\u2019s, I guess, what you can call\u2014maybe it\u2019s surrendipitish\u2014what\u2019s the word? \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000627\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022d64de4c1-ef68-477e-9c50-db5cbdf99404\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00221c8e7dd53ab1430f8f457ee623ddca99\u0022\u003ETom Rutherford\u003C/span\u003E: Serendipitous: finding something good without looking for it.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000628\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002239b9bac1-a992-4ccf-a473-9591aeb3a298\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022c32bb9ffbe3d43f2b64c452ccbf09e3a\u0022\u003ERIMA NAKHLE\u003C/span\u003E: Serendipitous\u2014English is my second language\u2014finding out something you didn\u2019t expect to, but you find it. So, in terms of the definition of \u201Cvictim\u201D, what I appreciate is that that has been highlighted to me\u2014\u201COh my goodness! It\u2019s not even defined in the Corrections Act.\u201D\u2014but what I will say is that, look, I didn\u2019t want to push that we amend the title. It is something that I\u2019m happy that we\u2019ve brought to the attention of the committee, to the attention of you, Madam Chair, and to the attention of people listening from home and throughout the world. Yes, the bill is named the \u201CCorrections (Victim Protection) Amendment Bill\u201D, but I\u2019m mindful that \u201Cvictim\u201D doesn\u2019t necessarily have a very technical and legal definition in the bill and in the principal Act.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000629\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002239b9bac1-a992-4ccf-a473-9591aeb3a298\u0022\u003EAgain, I\u2019m happy that we\u2019ve traversed this, I\u2019m happy that it\u2019s something that I can feel comfortable conversing with my colleagues about, and I hope that in the future, we can maybe think about doing something to fill that void, so to speak. So thank you, James, for your earlier comments\u2014James Meager; my apologies, Madam Chair. And thank you, Tom Rutherford, for your consideration of the title of this bill, especially in light of the fact that we don\u2019t have a definition for \u201Cvictim\u201D as it stands.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002261720d2e-5b1d-4742-b4f0-30424316ccc1\u0022 data-id=\u002260bfc58e097b40b283aad98cd55d9b80\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000630\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002261720d2e-5b1d-4742-b4f0-30424316ccc1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002260bfc58e097b40b283aad98cd55d9b80\u0022\u003ECHAIRPERSON (Barbara Kuriger)\u003C/span\u003E: I\u2019m going to take a call from Tracey McLellan, but what I am going to say is that this is a small bill with a number of clauses. As I look through the bill, there are some clauses that have some more worthy debate than going round and round on the title, so please be very mindful of that\u2014to everybody.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022c46de55f-b9e4-4c64-9ac6-877bd89c2fc5\u0022 data-id=\u0022fbf6fbb07e7e4be081a58947f3eb46df\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000631\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c46de55f-b9e4-4c64-9ac6-877bd89c2fc5\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022fbf6fbb07e7e4be081a58947f3eb46df\u0022\u003EDr TRACEY McLELLAN (Labour):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Madam Chair. It\u2019s in lieu of that warning or observation, I should say, that I stand to take a call.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000632\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002261720d2e-5b1d-4742-b4f0-30424316ccc1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00220cdd960e7cbe42919a95249ffd703928\u0022\u003ECHAIRPERSON (Barbara Kuriger)\u003C/span\u003E: It\u2019s not a warning to you.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000633\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c46de55f-b9e4-4c64-9ac6-877bd89c2fc5\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022b1bc80ed617e446b8f0e983301f7de5e\u0022\u003EDr TRACEY McLELLAN\u003C/span\u003E: No, I understand. I did have a series of small questions for the member Rima Nakhle, but it was fairly evident that the other side of the Chamber were going to filibuster a bit, so I decided to get in quick and to make my opening comments in case it took several other five-minute speeches to get the opportunity to. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000634\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c46de55f-b9e4-4c64-9ac6-877bd89c2fc5\u0022\u003EI did want to acknowledge the member for being able to shepherd the bill through to this stage. It\u2019s not often that members get to sit in that chair and to do the task that you\u2019re doing now and to present and to answer questions\u2014having gone through and sat through this process, with all its complexities and all the nuances, to sit there and confidently be able to answer questions.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000635\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c46de55f-b9e4-4c64-9ac6-877bd89c2fc5\u0022\u003EAs I said, I did have a just a couple of quick questions. I\u2019m not going to ask them now, because we\u2019re only in the title phase, and I was only going to ask them so that you would have the opportunity to be able to respond and to answer some questions, but I didn\u2019t want to miss the opportunity to congratulate the member and to wish her all the very best for the rest of this bill.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022f429fecb-a955-4d95-8105-e5144e651204\u0022 data-id=\u0022416fa1737a3b455ab36a4ec2a0a71a1c\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000636\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f429fecb-a955-4d95-8105-e5144e651204\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022416fa1737a3b455ab36a4ec2a0a71a1c\u0022\u003EDAN BIDOIS (National\u2014Northcote):\u003C/span\u003E Madam Chair, thank you for indulging me in this part of the\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000637\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002261720d2e-5b1d-4742-b4f0-30424316ccc1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00224fc63865a66045c1a8b441a26bb54503\u0022\u003ECHAIRPERSON (Barbara Kuriger)\u003C/span\u003E: I haven\u2019t decided whether to indulge you yet. I\u2019m going to listen to what you say first.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000638\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f429fecb-a955-4d95-8105-e5144e651204\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00228796c1196a1c4e70a946ed48f7472da9\u0022\u003EDAN BIDOIS\u003C/span\u003E: Thank you, Madam Chair. I will make a brief contribution because I do not want to be accused of filibustering. I just want to open my remarks by saying it\u2019s great to have this bill coming from my colleague Rima Nakhle, who is a tiresome advocate for victim protection in\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000639\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00226629ef5540d344128fb360cc3a462389\u0022\u003EHon Members\u003C/span\u003E: Tireless\u2014tireless.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000640\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f429fecb-a955-4d95-8105-e5144e651204\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00222655bc021b604077a7827232df2c778f\u0022\u003EDAN BIDOIS\u003C/span\u003E: Tireless\u2014tireless. I\u2019ve had too many\u2014yeah, tireless. It\u2019s just great to have her bring this bill to the House. I know how much she is passionate about the rights of victims and about restoring law and order in her community and throughout the wider country. We are in the title and commencement phase, and\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000641\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002261720d2e-5b1d-4742-b4f0-30424316ccc1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00220ab929287b444062a9e0ea6cb46e427e\u0022\u003ECHAIRPERSON (Barbara Kuriger)\u003C/span\u003E: No, just the title.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000642\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f429fecb-a955-4d95-8105-e5144e651204\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022ac143a82e1c940c29087769b5623f735\u0022\u003EDAN BIDOIS\u003C/span\u003E: Just the title. I just read the introduction of the bill. I haven\u2019t been on the Justice Committee, so this is the first time I\u2019ve actually read this bill.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000643\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f7fc7ac3-5ce1-43ca-8cd6-dbb0941bf3ae\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00226550b2a825274b6eb9fe4a83728697fa\u0022\u003EHon Dr Duncan Webb\u003C/span\u003E: That\u2019s shameful.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000644\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f429fecb-a955-4d95-8105-e5144e651204\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00229174b43b041e4854a7bcf212dde61565\u0022\u003EDAN BIDOIS\u003C/span\u003E: Thank you, Dr Duncan Webb.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000645\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002261720d2e-5b1d-4742-b4f0-30424316ccc1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022ac995de351424b9da08ae4067378abc5\u0022\u003ECHAIRPERSON (Barbara Kuriger)\u003C/span\u003E: Does the member have a question?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000646\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f429fecb-a955-4d95-8105-e5144e651204\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00224ef7eabaeb754982ad340e4ff5d32def\u0022\u003EDAN BIDOIS\u003C/span\u003E: Yes, I do have a question. I\u2019m coming to it, and it is around the fact that it\u2019s victim focused, which is great, but I understand here it\u2019s also got \u201Cvictims of crime and people under a protection order\u201D, and I just wanted to indulge the member who thought of the title for this bill.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000647\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f429fecb-a955-4d95-8105-e5144e651204\u0022\u003EOn reflection, it doesn\u2019t just include victims, it also includes people under a protection order. My colleague here and I were just chatting about protection orders, and they may be victims, but they may not be victims. There are, you know, family members and other people that aren\u2019t a direct victim, or they may be a victim in the future. I just wanted to clarify with the member if she considered, potentially, a broader title to encompass those that she believes were under the focus of the bill, which is about people under a protection order, and if there were other alternative titles that she considered to make this more encompassing for the focus of the bill. That\u2019s my question.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000648\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f429fecb-a955-4d95-8105-e5144e651204\u0022\u003EAgain, I look forward to making the odd contribution from time to time throughout this debate, and I thank the member for bringing this bill to the House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022f5d71749-ae91-4af7-b2bd-77260398912a\u0022 data-id=\u00225062a132a0314077adba7978e45529ed\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000649\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f5d71749-ae91-4af7-b2bd-77260398912a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00225062a132a0314077adba7978e45529ed\u0022\u003EHon DAVID PARKER (Labour):\u003C/span\u003E I want to make a serious point in respect of members\u2019 bills, including this one, and the time that we\u2019re wasting on the title debate here. I\u2019m not going to blame the Government members any more than I would blame the prior Labour administration, but there is a bad habit forming here that we are filibustering members\u2019 bills.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000650\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f5d71749-ae91-4af7-b2bd-77260398912a\u0022\u003EMembers\u2019 bills are provided for as a very small part of the parliamentary agenda so that members, be they Government backbenchers or members of the Opposition, can bring forward policy ideas. Members who do not like those ideas can vote them down, but I would suggest to members of the committee that we reflect upon whether we\u2019re getting into bad habits at delaying the purpose of members\u2019 bills, which is to consider as many of these members\u2019 ideas as we can.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000651\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f5d71749-ae91-4af7-b2bd-77260398912a\u0022\u003EThe way to deal with issues that are not agreed to by other political parties through the members\u2019 ballot is to vote them down. It\u2019s actually not to delay their consideration so as to stop more bills being drawn from the ballot.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002261720d2e-5b1d-4742-b4f0-30424316ccc1\u0022 data-id=\u0022a2f488de883546e9917a9d7c69710dbf\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000652\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002261720d2e-5b1d-4742-b4f0-30424316ccc1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022a2f488de883546e9917a9d7c69710dbf\u0022\u003ECHAIRPERSON (Barbara Kuriger)\u003C/span\u003E: Thank you for making that point, the Hon David Parker. Yes, it is a relevant point for the purposes of the committee. Just to point out that I am unable, as the Chair, to take a vote until everyone stops speaking or someone moves the closure motion, so that is completely in the hands of the committee. Thank you.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022f5d71749-ae91-4af7-b2bd-77260398912a\u0022 data-id=\u0022fd6215e5a60c4a8c8e970ca1ac6076ee\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000653\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f5d71749-ae91-4af7-b2bd-77260398912a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022fd6215e5a60c4a8c8e970ca1ac6076ee\u0022\u003EHon DAVID PARKER (Labour):\u003C/span\u003E I move that the debate on this part of the bill be now concluded. Sorry, what\u2019s the new wording? \u201CI move that the question be now put.\u201D is a bit out of date.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002261720d2e-5b1d-4742-b4f0-30424316ccc1\u0022 data-id=\u00228253a0d70de44b1c9275dca9ac839de9\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000654\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002261720d2e-5b1d-4742-b4f0-30424316ccc1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00228253a0d70de44b1c9275dca9ac839de9\u0022\u003ECHAIRPERSON (Barbara Kuriger)\u003C/span\u003E: I\u2019m going to give the member another chance. The question is that debate on this question now close.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022f5d71749-ae91-4af7-b2bd-77260398912a\u0022 data-id=\u0022cd2727a4aecb42b39314ac9789fb9a4c\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000655\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f5d71749-ae91-4af7-b2bd-77260398912a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022cd2727a4aecb42b39314ac9789fb9a4c\u0022\u003EHon DAVID PARKER (Labour):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you. I move, That debate on this question now close.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000656\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f5d71749-ae91-4af7-b2bd-77260398912a\u0022\u003EMotion agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000657\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f5d71749-ae91-4af7-b2bd-77260398912a\u0022\u003EClause 1 agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000658\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u00225f5305a993d2485eb895b5ee0b55ccba\u0022\u003EClause 2  Commencement \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002261720d2e-5b1d-4742-b4f0-30424316ccc1\u0022 data-id=\u002244e616d923cf4d42ab19ac4e02bb159e\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000659\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002261720d2e-5b1d-4742-b4f0-30424316ccc1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002244e616d923cf4d42ab19ac4e02bb159e\u0022\u003ECHAIRPERSON (Barbara Kuriger)\u003C/span\u003E: Members, we now come to clause 2. This is the debate on clause 2, commencement. The question is that clause 2 stand part.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000660\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ef094bb1-be4f-48b8-bb53-52ce955a1c2d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002284e217485e7b4359a7b5ac3ff5c0e0d8\u0022\u003EJames Meager\u003C/span\u003E: Madam Chair?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000661\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002261720d2e-5b1d-4742-b4f0-30424316ccc1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00225600cd462f1b4a3cbdd8774241966e67\u0022\u003ECHAIRPERSON (Barbara Kuriger)\u003C/span\u003E: James Meager. I just wasn\u2019t sure if the member in the chair was going to take a call, but I\u2019ll take a call from James Meager.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022ef094bb1-be4f-48b8-bb53-52ce955a1c2d\u0022 data-id=\u00225d6baaf8d1bb4130838ef6cb54040a2d\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000662\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ef094bb1-be4f-48b8-bb53-52ce955a1c2d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00225d6baaf8d1bb4130838ef6cb54040a2d\u0022\u003EJAMES MEAGER (National\u2014Rangitata):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Madam Chair. I appreciate it, because I do have to shoot and carry on another piece of business.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000663\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ef094bb1-be4f-48b8-bb53-52ce955a1c2d\u0022\u003EI just wanted to talk very, very briefly about the commencement clause and just note to colleagues in the committee that I understand\u2014the member can speak to this, actually, but we had a brief discussion in the Justice Committee about the commencement of the bill. I understand from both reviewing the departmental report and my recollection of the discussion at the time was that officials were comfortable at that point with the proposed implementation being that the bill come into force on the day following Royal assent.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000664\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ef094bb1-be4f-48b8-bb53-52ce955a1c2d\u0022\u003EI now understand that, following conversations, there\u2019s going to be an amendment proposed. I\u2019m not sure if it\u2019s been tabled, but I just wanted to highlight that to the committee, because we\u2019re all new to this process and I just want to double-check that members were aware that there will be an amendment on this clause. And also\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000665\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002261720d2e-5b1d-4742-b4f0-30424316ccc1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022e0961f3b82044831be22d077193be500\u0022\u003ECHAIRPERSON (Barbara Kuriger)\u003C/span\u003E: The amendment has been tabled\u2014for clarity.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000666\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ef094bb1-be4f-48b8-bb53-52ce955a1c2d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022aaa9498430f947628c913a8df2858500\u0022\u003EJAMES MEAGER\u003C/span\u003E: The amendment has been tabled, that\u2019s fantastic. We can speak to the amendment about the extension, probably about six months beyond. I may not be able to contribute much more in this sense, but I just wanted to indicate that there are some quite crunchy issues towards the end of the debate, and I do hope to make a contribution later on if I am able to do so. With that, I\u2019ll sit and, hopefully, let the member take her call.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022d64de4c1-ef68-477e-9c50-db5cbdf99404\u0022 data-id=\u00221e73c4a44edb4d49890369723d44575b\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000667\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022d64de4c1-ef68-477e-9c50-db5cbdf99404\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00221e73c4a44edb4d49890369723d44575b\u0022\u003ETOM RUTHERFORD (National\u2014Bay of Plenty):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you very much, Madam Chair. I\u2019ll speak to the amendment, if that\u2019s OK with the member, and then open up to her feedback on why she has tabled the specific amendment and why she\u2019s making that change. I note, in the initial wording of the initial bill, it said the day after it received Royal assent, but the member has put forward an amendment in her name, and it says: clause 2, which is the commencement, replace \u201Con the day after Royal assent\u201D\u2014page 1, lines 5 and\u00A06\u2014with \u201Csix months after Royal assent\u201D. Now, I\u2019m really keen to understand why the member is bringing this amendment to the committee, changing it from \u201Cthe day after Royal assent\u201D to \u201Csix months after Royal assent\u201D.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000668\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022d64de4c1-ef68-477e-9c50-db5cbdf99404\u0022\u003EIs it because the member in charge of the bill has received feedback from those in the corrections area and those in the Corrections departments and those who would be actually delivering the implementation of this bill, and that the direct feedback from them has been: \u201CWe need to change the day that the bill comes into force because it needs to give us an opportunity to sort of upskill and get into a position that we can actually deliver the implementation.\u201D? Was the day after Royal assent not enough time for them to prepare those changes, even though there had been quite a significant lead-in time from when the bill was first drawn to where we are today with the committee of the whole House, and then where we\u2019ll be with the third reading and then, hopefully, it coming into play?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000669\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022d64de4c1-ef68-477e-9c50-db5cbdf99404\u0022\u003EI\u2019m really keen to understand the thought process behind why the member\u2019s tabled this amendment, and I\u2019d welcome her the opportunity to provide some clarity for us.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002239b9bac1-a992-4ccf-a473-9591aeb3a298\u0022 data-id=\u00225170d64fc6eb4b0abb6681795c3b1e02\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000670\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002239b9bac1-a992-4ccf-a473-9591aeb3a298\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00225170d64fc6eb4b0abb6681795c3b1e02\u0022\u003ERIMA NAKHLE (National\u2014Takanini):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Madam Chair. Please excuse my little mistakes, it\u2019s my first time in this chair. Look, I want to thank the two members for their contribution on this clause that we are now referencing, which is considering the commencement of the bill\u2014basically, for friends around the motu, essentially, when does this bill come into effect after, hopefully, we\u2019ve all voted for it in the third reading?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000671\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002239b9bac1-a992-4ccf-a473-9591aeb3a298\u0022\u003EThis is a bit of an interesting situation. Again, it\u2019s my first time doing this, so I\u2019m learning a lot. What I\u2019d like to say to my colleague Tom Rutherford is that the reason why I initiated this action of tabling this amendment is because, as I do, I was going over everything a final time\u2014I just wanted to make sure that we\u2019ve dotted our i\u2019s, so to speak, and something our t\u2019s\u2014and what I realised was, \u201COK, in the bill as it is, it says that it will come into effect on the day after Royal assent.\u201D Then I thought, \u201CAfter all the conversations we\u2019ve had about it in the Justice Committee and just some of the operational kind of movements that need to happen to implement these changes that we\u2019re making with this bill, would that be sufficient time?\u201D\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000672\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002239b9bac1-a992-4ccf-a473-9591aeb3a298\u0022\u003EFor those of you at home, this isn\u2019t law but, generally speaking, Royal assent is between about two to seven days after a bill has been passed. In thinking about and considering two to seven days afterwards, and considering the changes we want to make, and considering the conversations with Corrections throughout the select committee process as to some of the operational requirements, etc., that this bill would entail, I took the liberty of contacting Corrections and asking for further advice about this and, essentially, asking, \u201CLook, is it enough time\u2014the day after Royal assent?\u201D The answer that I received in no uncertain terms was that, no, it\u2019s not enough. Indeed, six months, perhaps even 12 months, would be a better time frame for Corrections to implement the changes of this bill, the Corrections (Victim Protection) Amendment Bill.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000673\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002239b9bac1-a992-4ccf-a473-9591aeb3a298\u0022\u003EI was glad that I asked the question, although it was at the eleventh hour. I\u2019m a little bit disappointed with myself that I didn\u2019t pick up on it earlier to ask the question directly within select committee.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000674\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c46de55f-b9e4-4c64-9ac6-877bd89c2fc5\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022ee016808931f4aeaac5f26b88b74bd23\u0022\u003EDr Tracey McLellan\u003C/span\u003E: Or listen to the people that raised it.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000675\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002239b9bac1-a992-4ccf-a473-9591aeb3a298\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022ee2d5290d6e146d890bea58e52e413a9\u0022\u003ERIMA NAKHLE\u003C/span\u003E: Oh, Dr Tracey McLellan is saying that Dr Webb perhaps raised it.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000676\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c46de55f-b9e4-4c64-9ac6-877bd89c2fc5\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00225482993432064a9fabe2b1bfa5882216\u0022\u003EDr Tracey McLellan\u003C/span\u003E: Yeah.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000677\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002239b9bac1-a992-4ccf-a473-9591aeb3a298\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022126087b9e03a4ca1a77c5390bf401cd9\u0022\u003ERIMA NAKHLE\u003C/span\u003E: Oh, OK. My memory doesn\u2019t serve me well in that situation, but I\u2019ll take Dr Webb\u2019s word for it. I\u2019m disappointed at myself none the less, but we\u2019ve brought it to the forefront and hence why I\u2019m tabling this amendment, my colleagues. Just given what Corrections said to me recently, I thought to myself, \u201COK, I\u2019m going to ask if I can table this amendment, and I really hope that we can get support for this.\u201D Again, I apologise for missing it in the select committee process, but it is essentially saying that the bill will come to effect six months after Royal assent.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000678\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002239b9bac1-a992-4ccf-a473-9591aeb3a298\u0022\u003ENow, as I mentioned in the in the casual conversation with Corrections, 12 months was also canvassed, but I would love if we can get this on the road ASAP. Since they gave me that time frame\u2014or they gave the time frame of between six and 12 months\u2014I made the decision to table this amendment with six months after Royal assent. Again, I\u2019m hoping that I can get the support of our colleagues across the Chamber just so that on an operational level, things can run much more smoothly. Thank you.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00223cc9806d-f7ef-4e23-a218-442f20bf8591\u0022 data-id=\u0022decc8f02df63449b9b9131e585ab11eb\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000679\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223cc9806d-f7ef-4e23-a218-442f20bf8591\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022decc8f02df63449b9b9131e585ab11eb\u0022\u003EDr LAWRENCE XU-NAN (Green):\u003C/span\u003E I move, That debate on this question now close.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca id=\u00226d5bb462266c41a8944c7b2f9afe76d4\u0022 name=\u0022division\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EA party vote was called for on the question, That debate on this question now close.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EAyes 49\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand Labour 34; Green Party of Aotearoa New Zealand 15.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENoes 68\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand National 49; ACT New Zealand 11; New Zealand First 8.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EMotion not agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002289809535-e289-43e8-ad08-668cf3046ffb\u0022 data-id=\u0022ce558dea9e98403eb074c4163cac3909\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000680\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002289809535-e289-43e8-ad08-668cf3046ffb\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022ce558dea9e98403eb074c4163cac3909\u0022\u003ECAMERON BREWER (National\u2014Upper Harbour):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000681\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002261720d2e-5b1d-4742-b4f0-30424316ccc1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002282830c8250e048a09c54fbec5468494f\u0022\u003ECHAIRPERSON (Barbara Kuriger)\u003C/span\u003E: It had better be a very good question on commencement.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000682\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002289809535-e289-43e8-ad08-668cf3046ffb\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00221757c960747b4e0eaf0fe041e7327d0c\u0022\u003ECAMERON BREWER\u003C/span\u003E: Talofa lava, Madam Chair, on this auspicious day. Can I just say this is the first time I\u2019ve taken a call on this, and, yes, I will be coming to clause 2 and the\u00A0amendment. I just want to pay tribute to the sponsor of the bill and the work that she\u2019s done in the Justice Committee and the role that she plays as a champion of victims. In fact, that\u2019s increasingly becoming her brand, so I\u2019m very pleased that our fellow member of the Justice Committee and fellow class of 2023 is now in the hot seat.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000683\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002289809535-e289-43e8-ad08-668cf3046ffb\u0022\u003EI just wanted to flesh out the commencement amendment around the idea of\u2014when the member in charge was in communication with Corrections, I wonder if some of their logic, and I put this to you, is the fact that six months gives you a new Budget year\u2014it gives you a new Budget year.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000684\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002298dbeffa-e059-49d5-8bbf-579cbaead9a3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002247319e2a74944236907bdef42fcb6df8\u0022\u003EHon Scott Simpson\u003C/span\u003E: Ah!\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000685\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002289809535-e289-43e8-ad08-668cf3046ffb\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022b8a539e336c34ab18669497045e2f4b6\u0022\u003ECAMERON BREWER\u003C/span\u003E: You know, if we\u2019re looking at where this third reading could be, a 30\u00A0June financial year, Mr Whip\u2014whether that six months not only gives the organisation time to get organised but it also gives them, potentially, the time to put forward the additional costs or organisational time or commitment and possibly put a pitch into the Minister saying, \u201CLook, we\u2019ve got this new piece of legislation. We need, within our existing operational budget and commitments and programme for 2024-25, a bit more time.\u201D I just wanted to flesh that out, because, as we know, our Minister of Corrections, the Hon Mark Mitchell, was very generous in his Vote Corrections.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000686\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002289809535-e289-43e8-ad08-668cf3046ffb\u0022\u003EI think, at some levels, there were record numbers going through as far as rehabilitation for remand prisoners, as far as a lot more beds being built at Waikeria and that, and as far as more corrections officers. So, when you have a look at the Bunsen burner that the Minister has put under Corrections and the expectations, they are rising accordingly, and we know that there are people queuing up, as they are in the Police, to join Corrections. I wonder, and I put it to the member, whether that six months just allows a little bit more time for the organisation of Corrections and the CEO to not only get their ducks in a row but to actually find any necessary budget.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000687\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002289809535-e289-43e8-ad08-668cf3046ffb\u0022\u003EI\u2019d actually put it to the member too, in her exploration of this: did Corrections say, or\u00A0have they said during the select committee process, which I might not have picked up on, that this would require more budget, or did they say that this would just require codifying what, in many cases, they may be doing in part already, but codifying that expectation for the sake of the comfort of the victims and the protection of the victims? Does that enable that piece of work to actually happen in this financial year, or do they need a new budget? Do they actually need more resources? What are the budget implications? I think that\u2019s very pertinent to this committee. We haven\u2019t covered that, and with the commencement of that, that could give Corrections and the Minister the time not only to set up their processes, a term we often hear in alignment with this bill, but also to put the resource behind it.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000688\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002289809535-e289-43e8-ad08-668cf3046ffb\u0022\u003EMy question to the sponsoring member is: what have they said is (1) the organisational impact of this if they would roll out\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000689\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002261720d2e-5b1d-4742-b4f0-30424316ccc1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022479e75235a29490093fcc8e0a49ecdbd\u0022\u003ECHAIRPERSON (Barbara Kuriger)\u003C/span\u003E: Related to the commencement still?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000690\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002289809535-e289-43e8-ad08-668cf3046ffb\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022bde278f267314ed6823a9f3cd935b354\u0022\u003ECAMERON BREWER\u003C/span\u003E: Yeah, relating to the operational impact of the commencement period being in seven days or a day after, compared to six months. And have we had any analysis from Corrections, from their chief financial officer, as to what the cost of this could be? I think, if there is a cost attached, that we need to see that, because that puts for a much stronger case for six months taking us to financial year 2025-26. Thank you.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022b2672720-3dfe-421a-af8c-20f00d44da3d\u0022 data-id=\u0022babe25eae6bc4c0c93b9d077784bb6e6\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000691\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b2672720-3dfe-421a-af8c-20f00d44da3d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022babe25eae6bc4c0c93b9d077784bb6e6\u0022\u003ETODD STEPHENSON (ACT):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Madam Chair. Rima Nakhle, I just first wanted to say congratulations on this bill and doing the committee of the whole House. It\u2019s actually one of my highlights of my week when I get to sit beside you in the Justice Committee, and I know you are very victim-centric. I was listening in my office when this amendment was tabled, so I rushed immediately down because, obviously, this is not something we\u2019ve had time to consider and it\u2019s not, obviously, something that was at the select committee. I suppose I\u2019m going to have to make a call on behalf of that. I\u2019m pretty confident I will be able to do that after we traverse all the issues around the commencement.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000692\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b2672720-3dfe-421a-af8c-20f00d44da3d\u0022\u003EIt\u2019s not the same as Mr Brewer\u2019s questions, but not dissimilar. I just wanted to test how far did you actually\u2014I know you\u2019ve said that you spoke to Corrections and they\u2019ve said you could have between six and 12 months, but, Rima Nakhle, I know you\u2019re very victim-centric, so I know you\u2019d like to get this in place as soon as possible. I really want to test: how hard did you push Corrections? Look, they are very hard-working people. They are very, very hard-working people at Corrections. They were obviously providing excellent advice on your bill, they\u2019re providing excellent advice in relation to my own bill, but sometimes they do need a bit of a push.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000693\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b2672720-3dfe-421a-af8c-20f00d44da3d\u0022\u003EI wanted to just test with you\u2014because I know you\u2019d like to get this protection for victims in as soon as possible, and I just want to understand how hard you pushed them\u2014could they have done it in three months? Again, six months is a little while, you know; we\u2019ll be through this Parliament, quite through this Parliament actually, by the time this bill comes into force. I really just want to ask, you know, how hard did you push them? Was it some of the considerations that Mr Brewer outlined, or is it truly operational?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000694\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b2672720-3dfe-421a-af8c-20f00d44da3d\u0022\u003EI suppose my other question is: if you give them the six months from when the bill is passed before it commences, have they given you assurances everything can be in place and that it actually will at that day be operational and protect victims in the way you want? Thank you.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002239b9bac1-a992-4ccf-a473-9591aeb3a298\u0022 data-id=\u0022e29aa42cd7ad4ad99b1d8571b0279e9d\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000695\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002239b9bac1-a992-4ccf-a473-9591aeb3a298\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022e29aa42cd7ad4ad99b1d8571b0279e9d\u0022\u003ERIMA NAKHLE (National\u2014Takanini):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you very much. Thank you to my colleagues Cameron Brewer and Todd Stephenson, first, for your very kind words\u2014thank you\u2014and also for the well-thought-out questions with respect to the amendment that I\u2019ve tabled. I\u2019d like to answer maybe a bit of to and fro, if that\u2019s OK.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000696\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002239b9bac1-a992-4ccf-a473-9591aeb3a298\u0022\u003EI\u2019d like to say that I\u2019m not happy about this, Mr Stephenson. Again, I love myself, but there\u2019s a part of me that\u2019s quite frustrated that I didn\u2019t pick up, particularly\u2014but I don\u2019t have the experience that Dr Webb does. It\u2019s absolutely taught me a colossal lesson for the next one, not to just kind of overlook commencement dates, to really consider them the way that I considered the other clauses of this bill.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000697\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002239b9bac1-a992-4ccf-a473-9591aeb3a298\u0022\u003EI\u2019ll start off with your questions, actually, Mr Stephenson. In answer to how hard did I push, the honest answer is I didn\u2019t; as it\u2019s at the eleventh hour, I didn\u2019t have the chance to push hard. I asked the question and I was given that answer and I just thought, \u201CLook, well, between six and 12\u2014six is already kind of a big stretch as it is but I\u2019m going to table this amendment for six months.\u201D I\u2019m mindful that I did that with a kind of sadness in my heart, because I\u2019m mindful that we just kind of want to get these protections for victims under way as soon as possible. That\u2019s my answer, albeit brief, to your question, Mr Stephenson. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000698\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002239b9bac1-a992-4ccf-a473-9591aeb3a298\u0022\u003ETo your question, Mr Brewer\u2014Cameron Brewer\u2014well, there was a number of questions in your question\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000699\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002298dbeffa-e059-49d5-8bbf-579cbaead9a3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022ae4b1c5fe7464890a1c0b9f9def34527\u0022\u003EHon Scott Simpson\u003C/span\u003E: Contribution.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000700\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002239b9bac1-a992-4ccf-a473-9591aeb3a298\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022f2187c6943de49e3a1d417e309ad5265\u0022\u003ERIMA NAKHLE\u003C/span\u003E: Your contribution, that\u2019s the word\u2014\u201CContributing Cam\u201D. There were a number of questions, and again, to be honest, with respect to the new Budget year, that\u2019s a very good observation, one that I didn\u2019t feel needed consideration in this situation. I congratulate the member for always combining the fiscal situation with what we\u2019re looking at in terms of our Justice Committee.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000701\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002239b9bac1-a992-4ccf-a473-9591aeb3a298\u0022\u003EI do believe, on the little bit of information that I received, that Corrections believes that six months will be very helpful. After talking with the Corrections staff\u2014and I thank Dr Marian for all the feedback that she gave us and the patience she had with respect to my questions in select committee\u2014what I understood is that it\u2019s not a \u201CWe must wait six months\u201D, but the feedback I got was that it would be very helpful. As I said, considering a few things and making sure we just want to get it right from the foundation, that\u2019s why I decided to take that on board\u2014that six months would be very helpful\u2014and table this amendment where the bill will take effect six months after Royal assent. I hope that answers some of the questions for my colleagues.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00227a31ee40-34c3-42b0-9459-7a7e9c815d6a\u0022 data-id=\u0022a99bf64acdf04882a203f5df8d191ac6\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000702\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227a31ee40-34c3-42b0-9459-7a7e9c815d6a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022a99bf64acdf04882a203f5df8d191ac6\u0022\u003EKAHURANGI CARTER (Deputy Musterer\u2014Green):\u003C/span\u003E I move, That debate on this question now close.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000703\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227a31ee40-34c3-42b0-9459-7a7e9c815d6a\u0022\u003EMotion agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002261720d2e-5b1d-4742-b4f0-30424316ccc1\u0022 data-id=\u0022e9ddf8fe08444ccc810f41c603c4de8a\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000704\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002261720d2e-5b1d-4742-b4f0-30424316ccc1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022e9ddf8fe08444ccc810f41c603c4de8a\u0022\u003ECHAIRPERSON (Barbara Kuriger)\u003C/span\u003E: The question is that Rima Nakhle\u2019s tabled amendment to clause 2 be agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000705\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002261720d2e-5b1d-4742-b4f0-30424316ccc1\u0022\u003EAmendment agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000706\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002261720d2e-5b1d-4742-b4f0-30424316ccc1\u0022\u003EClause 2 as amended agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000707\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u0022116001e0f7fb4241ae606e990cc18d68\u0022\u003EClause 3  Principal Act \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002261720d2e-5b1d-4742-b4f0-30424316ccc1\u0022 data-id=\u0022e9abcadb50d74d9ab57b101d078a47cd\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000708\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002261720d2e-5b1d-4742-b4f0-30424316ccc1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022e9abcadb50d74d9ab57b101d078a47cd\u0022\u003ECHAIRPERSON (Barbara Kuriger)\u003C/span\u003E: Members, we now come to clause 3. Clause 3 is the debate on the principal Act. The question is that clause 3 stand part.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00223cc9806d-f7ef-4e23-a218-442f20bf8591\u0022 data-id=\u0022b18d0d985b174053add7ef8ac6775d5d\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000709\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223cc9806d-f7ef-4e23-a218-442f20bf8591\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022b18d0d985b174053add7ef8ac6775d5d\u0022\u003EDr LAWRENCE XU-NAN (Green):\u003C/span\u003E I move, That debate on this question now close.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca id=\u0022dc18c7e54d804c3380cf72c2fa7a251a\u0022 name=\u0022division\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EA party vote was called for on the question, That debate on this question now close.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EAyes 49\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand Labour 34; Green Party of Aotearoa New Zealand 15.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENoes 68\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand National 49; ACT New Zealand 11; New Zealand First 8.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EMotion not agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002298dbeffa-e059-49d5-8bbf-579cbaead9a3\u0022 data-id=\u0022178afd2fd14b4286b34d131020e067fb\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000710\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002298dbeffa-e059-49d5-8bbf-579cbaead9a3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022178afd2fd14b4286b34d131020e067fb\u0022\u003EHon SCOTT SIMPSON (Senior Whip\u2014National):\u003C/span\u003E Point of order, Madam Chair. I just, really, wanted to make a point that the member in the chair, Rima Nakhle, is a new member, on her first bill, and is clearly new at this process and the ability for her to engage is a new one. I seek your indulgence in just giving her a little bit of slack, in terms of rising to take a call, which she clearly intended to do before that last vote was taken. It\u2019s the intention of this side of the Chamber to continue allowing the member in charge of the bill to speak should she wish to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002261720d2e-5b1d-4742-b4f0-30424316ccc1\u0022 data-id=\u00226d02ca8715a748d4865b3155303b2156\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000711\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002261720d2e-5b1d-4742-b4f0-30424316ccc1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00226d02ca8715a748d4865b3155303b2156\u0022\u003ECHAIRPERSON (Barbara Kuriger)\u003C/span\u003E: Actually, in regard to that point of order, Mr Simpson, it wasn\u2019t actually clear that the member Rima Nakhle was getting to her feet in a hurry to take a call. There was some hesitation there, and in terms of the committee\u2014and this is not a criticism of the member, because the member is new in the chair\u2014if people want to vigorously take calls, that\u2019s what I should be seeing. I\u2019m not just saying that on behalf of the member, because there have been some other half-hearted people standing up for calls as well. Please, be decisive as a committee about what you want to do.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000712\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022d64de4c1-ef68-477e-9c50-db5cbdf99404\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002212748c98919c48489e53a016d0128032\u0022\u003ETom Rutherford\u003C/span\u003E: Madam Chair!\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000713\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002261720d2e-5b1d-4742-b4f0-30424316ccc1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002250ff68981a804d28ab48686615ae78fc\u0022\u003ECHAIRPERSON (Barbara Kuriger)\u003C/span\u003E: Tom Rutherford\u2014that was decisive.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022d64de4c1-ef68-477e-9c50-db5cbdf99404\u0022 data-id=\u0022236d296110634a91a8cd8ba406156fac\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000714\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022d64de4c1-ef68-477e-9c50-db5cbdf99404\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022236d296110634a91a8cd8ba406156fac\u0022\u003ETOM RUTHERFORD (National\u2014Bay of Plenty):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000715\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002261720d2e-5b1d-4742-b4f0-30424316ccc1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002272ee1c1811684025a2cb3e4abd9e004e\u0022\u003ECHAIRPERSON (Barbara Kuriger)\u003C/span\u003E: That was decisive.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000716\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022d64de4c1-ef68-477e-9c50-db5cbdf99404\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022c960ff36a33d4414bcc5ce0270f3f9ba\u0022\u003ETOM RUTHERFORD\u003C/span\u003E: Oh, Madam Chair, I\u2019ve never been doubted about my decisiveness, I\u2019ll tell you that. We\u2019ve gone through the first two clauses\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000717\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f5d71749-ae91-4af7-b2bd-77260398912a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022c29808d7bae3465f95382a9a98f65116\u0022\u003EHon David Parker\u003C/span\u003E: Is that a beard or is it not?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000718\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022d64de4c1-ef68-477e-9c50-db5cbdf99404\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022773ad38d6770445dae784c5714865436\u0022\u003ETOM RUTHERFORD\u003C/span\u003E: It is a beard, Mr Parker. Yes, it is a beard. Ha, ha! Touch\u00E9, though.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000719\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002261720d2e-5b1d-4742-b4f0-30424316ccc1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a135b0f040a94855b80ea0b3859aa179\u0022\u003ECHAIRPERSON (Barbara Kuriger)\u003C/span\u003E: Is that relevant? \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000720\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022d64de4c1-ef68-477e-9c50-db5cbdf99404\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022cce92042da0e47e0a156bc2cb8204ff3\u0022\u003ETOM RUTHERFORD\u003C/span\u003E: I\u2019m trying to remember when Mr Parker was relevant. But I\u2019ll come back to the bill.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000721\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022d64de4c1-ef68-477e-9c50-db5cbdf99404\u0022\u003EIn clause 1, we talked about the title; in clause 2, we talked about the commencement\u2014now, on to clause 3, talking about the principal Act, where this member\u2019s bill, which Rima Nakhle is shepherding through the House, is going to change the Corrections Act 2004. I\u2019m really keen to understand from the member: was there consideration given around whether there would be other changes made to other Acts that this would have direct impacts on, or was it only the Corrections Act 2004 where changes needed to be made to ensure victims in New Zealand were protected from those that committed the heinous crimes against them? I\u2019m really keen to understand from the member in the chair around whether it was only the Corrections Act 2004 that was the piece of legislation that needed to be amended, or was there any consideration given that other pieces of legislation, at the same time as this legislation was being brought in, needed to be amended as well?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000722\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022d64de4c1-ef68-477e-9c50-db5cbdf99404\u0022\u003EIf we think back\u2014and we\u2019ll talk about it in the subsequent clauses that are coming as well\u2014to those incredibly harrowing stories that we heard of victims who, in some cases, received over 100 phone calls from those that had perpetuated the heinous crimes on them from places like prison, was there any need to change other pieces of legislation to protect those victims? Or was it simply that amending just the Corrections Act 2004 would be enough to protect those victims, to ensure that they were given the right protection that they deserve and kept out of the line of sight and out of the point of contact of those who had perpetuated the crime? I\u2019m really keen to understand from the member: was it just the Corrections Act 2004 that needed to be changed to enable this bill to come into force or had other pieces of legislation been considered as well at the same time? I\u2019d welcome a response from the member.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002289809535-e289-43e8-ad08-668cf3046ffb\u0022 data-id=\u002252ce237ac087410b8648c0d9ec6a4a5c\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000723\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002289809535-e289-43e8-ad08-668cf3046ffb\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002252ce237ac087410b8648c0d9ec6a4a5c\u0022\u003ECAMERON BREWER (National\u2014Upper Harbour):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Madam Chair. My question follows on from Mr Rutherford\u2019s, just getting some clarification and maybe understanding as to what the sponsor\u2019s intent is here\u2014whether she gave thought to, or whether she\u2019s canvassed with Corrections or with the Minister of Corrections or with the chief executive of Corrections, that perhaps it\u2019s time, 20 years on from that Helen Clark Corrections Act 2004, which member Parker will remember well, that a stand-alone piece of legislation that, potentially, is headlined something like the \u201CVictims Protection and Priority Bill\u201D, as an omnibus bill, puts everything in and around victims, not only to improve their protection but also to prioritise their needs.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000724\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002289809535-e289-43e8-ad08-668cf3046ffb\u0022\u003EAs we know, this is pertinent, because we are a very victim-centric Government. That\u2019s what the National Party campaigned on, and that\u2019s what the public really responded to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000725\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002202df6cbfa84f45adabe2e19588132ea7\u0022\u003EHon Member\u003C/span\u003E: And ACT and New Zealand First.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000726\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002289809535-e289-43e8-ad08-668cf3046ffb\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022024c0843b93f4dae921a2881d14110fd\u0022\u003ECAMERON BREWER\u003C/span\u003E: They wanted us\u2014yeah, and ACT and New Zealand First. Admittedly, I wasn\u2019t running their campaign lines, but, yeah, that is a very good line.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000727\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00224ff02abef2064593b43f9c046468df0a\u0022\u003EHon Member\u003C/span\u003E: You sure?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000728\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002289809535-e289-43e8-ad08-668cf3046ffb\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022d5d8cc4fd9df4f5f8977ecc12910f0d7\u0022\u003ECAMERON BREWER\u003C/span\u003E: Increasingly, I might be. But, no\u2014ACT and New Zealand First, they also ran that: victim-centric, let\u2019s get the victims at the centre of the justice system rather than making apologies and excuses for the offenders. So, Madam Chair, I\u2019ll just put it, through you, that perhaps there has been that discussion\u2014or perhaps there could be or should be\u2014that maybe instead of ongoing repeals and ongoing amendments, at least to the main principal Act, the Corrections Act 2004, perhaps it\u2019s time for a \u201CVictims Protection and Priority Bill\u201D. I just wonder whether that would headline what this brand of this Government is doing and where our priorities lie.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000729\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002289809535-e289-43e8-ad08-668cf3046ffb\u0022\u003EI also wonder: look how much the landscape, the law and order landscape, the corrections landscape, the offender landscape, the seriousness of offence landscape\u2014just how much it\u2019s changed in 20 years. I\u2019d invite the member: in her mind, is this going to be an exercise where we just have ongoing repeals, like to the 1961 Crimes Act, for the next 40 years? Or does she see, potentially\u2014I don\u2019t know, maybe it\u2019s another member\u2019s bill, but it would have to have the muscle of the Government and Cabinet behind it. Does she see a future where we don\u2019t just keep tacking and deleting and crossing out and amending the principal Act of 2004, but we actually look, as a coalition Government that\u2019s focused on the victim first and foremost in the justice system\u2014and that means whether you\u2019re talking to justice Minister Paul Goldsmith, corrections and police Minister Mark Mitchell, associate police Minister Casey Costello, whether it\u2019s Nicole McKee as another associate justice Minister.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000730\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002289809535-e289-43e8-ad08-668cf3046ffb\u0022\u003EThese are people with real, lived experiences, and this is what, at a political level\u2014we\u00A0have an operational level, we have the justice cluster, but we\u2019ve actually got a real good cluster of people in and around those. And that\u2019s not all of them\u2014you know, you could put Louise Upston in there, too\u2014people with real lived experiences who might be getting to a place and might have talked to our member in charge here about perhaps the Corrections Act and perhaps a signature piece of work that might not be this term, but possibly next, that could be a wholesale, standalone piece of legislation, an omnibus bill that pulls all the victim stuff together. It could be named\u2014and you know, I\u2019m happy to take credit for the name\u2014the \u201CVictims Protection and Priority Bill\u201D. I just wonder if that\u2019s where this is heading, or if she\u2019s comfortable with just amending the principal Act at this point.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002239b9bac1-a992-4ccf-a473-9591aeb3a298\u0022 data-id=\u00221bd19729b0444fb6bb08190eb3af2647\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000731\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002239b9bac1-a992-4ccf-a473-9591aeb3a298\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00221bd19729b0444fb6bb08190eb3af2647\u0022\u003ERIMA NAKHLE (National\u2014Takanini):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, thank you, Madam Chair. Look, I want to thank my colleagues as well. Just being on this side of the kaupapa, it\u2019s really interesting what I can see. I guess what I\u2019m seeing is that, with most of us being newbies, we are quite overzealous about really debating every single clause of this bill. I appreciate the passion, but I think I need to say that, just from the get-go. In response to my colleagues Tom Rutherford and Cam Brewer\u2014and I hope that we can get a chance to listen to Mr\u00A0Stephenson\u2014with respect to clause 3, about the principal Act, the Corrections Act 2004, I don\u2019t have any commentary to make in terms of any changes there.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000732\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002239b9bac1-a992-4ccf-a473-9591aeb3a298\u0022\u003EI do want to tautoko Cam Brewer\u2014again, the philosophical conversations that you just had there. I don\u2019t want to take too much of our committee\u2019s time, because it\u2019s important that we consider the other clauses of this bill, if we may, but I think that\u2019s such a noble vision, a noble idea, Mr Brewer\u2014you know, time for a \u201CVictims Protection and Priority Bill\u201D. That\u2019s so interesting, because what you\u2019ve done is you\u2019ve considered the fact that, through this member\u2019s bill, which I\u2019m humbled is in my name and we\u2019re shepherding through the House as we speak, it\u2019s just brought about all these considerations of how we can make our legal system work better for our victims. How do we prioritise victims in the whakaaro that we display with respect to bills like this and, indeed, all the actions that we\u2019re doing in terms of protecting victims of crime and potential victims of crime, victims of intimidation? That comes, again, to that lack of a definition of \u201Cvictim\u201D.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000733\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002239b9bac1-a992-4ccf-a473-9591aeb3a298\u0022\u003EThank you, Mr Brewer, for your contribution with respect to victims\u2019 protection and whether we would consider something in the future. Hopefully\u2014I mean, it would be great to raise that with our Ministers. But that\u2019s a noble idea, and I\u2019d like to\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000734\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f7fc7ac3-5ce1-43ca-8cd6-dbb0941bf3ae\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00229226e4b8dc004a3c9a4cea9aeab1e1b6\u0022\u003EHon Dr Duncan Webb\u003C/span\u003E: Hypothetical.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000735\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002239b9bac1-a992-4ccf-a473-9591aeb3a298\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022693d79ddc346411ca3935ed705f7656a\u0022\u003ERIMA NAKHLE\u003C/span\u003E: It is hypothetical\u2014that\u2019s correct, Mr Webb\u2014but I\u2019d like to show appreciation for that hypothetical, noble thought.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000736\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002239b9bac1-a992-4ccf-a473-9591aeb3a298\u0022\u003ETo your question, Mr Rutherford, Tom Rutherford, my good friend\u2014was there any other legislation considered? Well, the fact is that being a member\u2019s bill, we really try to keep it tight, yeah? Potentially, there are other laws that could be affected if we allowed ourselves to expand the scope more than what it is. I mean, when you\u2019re talking about protection orders, I\u2019m sure that many of us in the House automatically think of the Family Violence Act 2018, where there\u2019s a big focus on protection orders there. When this bill was pulled from the ballot, I was conducting my own research, and I delved into the Crimes Act and a few other Acts\u2014just myself, making sure that I was covering all bases. For now, I don\u2019t have any other commentary or changes to suggest or thoughts about the principal Act.\u00A0I\u2019m happy, with the indulgence of the committee, for us to move to clause 4. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002261720d2e-5b1d-4742-b4f0-30424316ccc1\u0022 data-id=\u002298224f6cc6be4e7f9269decd8c061e6a\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000737\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002261720d2e-5b1d-4742-b4f0-30424316ccc1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002298224f6cc6be4e7f9269decd8c061e6a\u0022\u003ECHAIRPERSON (Barbara Kuriger)\u003C/span\u003E: Thank you. I just will make a note, too. Under the Standing Orders, I was getting pretty close to the point of saying to the members, the principal Act clause means a clause confined to stating that a bill amends an existing Act. I think it was getting pretty out there in terms of what\u2019s proposed on the Table in front of us.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000738\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002261720d2e-5b1d-4742-b4f0-30424316ccc1\u0022\u003EClause 3 agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000739\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u0022db470b2d5b084c51b3d3e964ab156d80\u0022\u003EClause 4Section 8 amended (Powers and functions of chief executive) \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000740\u0022\u003E\u003Cbr\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002261720d2e-5b1d-4742-b4f0-30424316ccc1\u0022 data-id=\u0022d10c7016e04e41308e153ac7dc30ee32\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000741\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002261720d2e-5b1d-4742-b4f0-30424316ccc1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022d10c7016e04e41308e153ac7dc30ee32\u0022\u003ECHAIRPERSON (Barbara Kuriger)\u003C/span\u003E: Members, we now come to clause 4. This is the debate on \u201CSection 8 amended (Powers and functions of chief executive)\u201D. The question is that clause 4 stand part.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00229188988b-e79b-4381-969a-982d0ebdb3ca\u0022 data-id=\u00222adaeec649c846caac80812c58f84c25\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000742\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00229188988b-e79b-4381-969a-982d0ebdb3ca\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00222adaeec649c846caac80812c58f84c25\u0022\u003EPAULO GARCIA (National\u2014New Lynn):\u003C/span\u003E Firstly, we want to recognise the member Rima Nakhle, also the rest of the Justice Committee on all sides of the Chamber. This bill has undergone an evolution from when it was first presented as written, and then to evolve into the form that it is in at the moment. Clause 4 is where everything happens and\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000743\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022d64de4c1-ef68-477e-9c50-db5cbdf99404\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022ce78f51c7ea1418c8d37bb0d7f3c93cf\u0022\u003ETom Rutherford\u003C/span\u003E: It\u2019s the substantial part.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000744\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00229188988b-e79b-4381-969a-982d0ebdb3ca\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00229801fab326d84025a0b5baf2d81823dd\u0022\u003EPAULO GARCIA\u003C/span\u003E: Yes, it is the substantial part, yes.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000745\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022d64de4c1-ef68-477e-9c50-db5cbdf99404\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00225000bb0939124bd7834e3e896a08d0b7\u0022\u003ETom Rutherford\u003C/span\u003E: I\u2019ve got plenty of material.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000746\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00229188988b-e79b-4381-969a-982d0ebdb3ca\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00221c81ad6a9c8c4eb1a7d24a6090df1cbb\u0022\u003EPAULO GARCIA\u003C/span\u003E: Yes.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000747\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002261720d2e-5b1d-4742-b4f0-30424316ccc1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022225b88560df344cc9cb89b43824f5e36\u0022\u003ECHAIRPERSON (Barbara Kuriger)\u003C/span\u003E: Congratulations, the member recognised the substantive part.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000748\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00229188988b-e79b-4381-969a-982d0ebdb3ca\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002280d74eb727504ec0894f03748f6bef09\u0022\u003EPAULO GARCIA\u003C/span\u003E: Yes, and I will just take a piece of that substance, and I would like to focus my contribution on where the contact or the communication comes from. We are discussing protecting victims of persons in the corrections system. The bill began by including persons who were under management of the corrections system, but who were otherwise in the community. There are approximately 25,000 people who are under management of Corrections, and they are in the community, and over 9,000 people who are in the corrections facilities.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000749\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00229188988b-e79b-4381-969a-982d0ebdb3ca\u0022\u003EThere was much discussion at the select committee level about who actually were the source of the unwanted communication or communication that was aimed at victims and people who originally were under protection orders. The question I have for our good friend Rima Nakhle is that she unpack for us, and for the people who may not have been in the\u00A0select committee process, what discussion and conversation we had in respect of the source of this unwanted communication. Why is it that, over time, the bill has evolved from including people under the management of the corrections system who are outside in the community to not including persons who are outside in the community\u2014persons who are under the management of the corrections system who are in the community?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000750\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00229188988b-e79b-4381-969a-982d0ebdb3ca\u0022\u003ECurrently, the bill\u2014having undergone some amendment in that space\u2014is now focused on actual prisoners, people who are incarcerated and managed in the corrections facilities. That\u2019s about 9,000-plus people in corrections. Just help us understand why is it that the bill was amended from when it was written to include people under the management of the corrections facilities, to exclude them eventually from the bill as it is now standing. Thank you, Madam Chair.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022d64de4c1-ef68-477e-9c50-db5cbdf99404\u0022 data-id=\u00226ca576834f5245f9b1cb82969f26384c\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000751\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022d64de4c1-ef68-477e-9c50-db5cbdf99404\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00226ca576834f5245f9b1cb82969f26384c\u0022\u003ETOM RUTHERFORD (National\u2014Bay of Plenty):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Madam Chair, and just before I dive into a couple of the questions I\u2019ve got, I just want to seek clarity from you as the Chair. I do note that the original bill had clauses 5 and 6, which have now subsequently been removed through the select committee stage. When is the appropriate time for me to talk about clauses 5 and 6, because there won\u2019t be a debate on clauses 5 and 6 with it being removed? Do you mind if I just give you an opportunity to seek advice on that and then\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000752\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002261720d2e-5b1d-4742-b4f0-30424316ccc1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022120dd17cc3584a649f5e3002cb785a6e\u0022\u003ECHAIRPERSON (Barbara Kuriger)\u003C/span\u003E: You ask your questions on this part and I\u2019ll come back to you.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000753\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022d64de4c1-ef68-477e-9c50-db5cbdf99404\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002275824297a46a406287d99f10e379910d\u0022\u003ETOM RUTHERFORD\u003C/span\u003E: OK, happily, Madam Chair\u2014you take as long as you would like.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000754\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002261720d2e-5b1d-4742-b4f0-30424316ccc1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a080236aa01d482d836aac40edc44c39\u0022\u003ECHAIRPERSON (Barbara Kuriger)\u003C/span\u003E: It won\u2019t take long.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000755\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022d64de4c1-ef68-477e-9c50-db5cbdf99404\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022e5d072f8dc764bd0b25e09e4566b901b\u0022\u003ETOM RUTHERFORD\u003C/span\u003E: Well, you indulge yourself on that front, Madam Chair. I want to speak to the member Rima Nakhle because clause 4 is the substantial part of the bill. We\u2019ve talked about the title, we\u2019ve talked about the commencement, we\u2019ve talked about the principal Act, and now we\u2019re actually talking about the part that we\u2019re actually going to be implementing to deliver the change that the member\u2019s looking to through the piece of legislation.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000756\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022d64de4c1-ef68-477e-9c50-db5cbdf99404\u0022\u003EThe first part is that, from when the bill was originally drafted until now, it has been substantially amended. At first, the bill captured all people under the supervision of Corrections. These are the people who are both within our prison facilities and corrections facilities in New Zealand and also those that are outside of our prison system as well\u2014that\u2019s a lot of people.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000757\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f7fc7ac3-5ce1-43ca-8cd6-dbb0941bf3ae\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022215daecbf6c14fbe93412906533cbfb1\u0022\u003EHon Dr Duncan Webb\u003C/span\u003E: Clause 4.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000758\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022d64de4c1-ef68-477e-9c50-db5cbdf99404\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022c38077e1277f457ba5a09edee8e44585\u0022\u003ETOM RUTHERFORD\u003C/span\u003E: Yeah, I\u2019m speaking to clause 4, Mr Webb.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000759\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f7fc7ac3-5ce1-43ca-8cd6-dbb0941bf3ae\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00220123a4dd7b39413990f7b1381a9677c0\u0022\u003EHon Dr Duncan Webb\u003C/span\u003E: Good\u2014you could have fooled me.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000760\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022d64de4c1-ef68-477e-9c50-db5cbdf99404\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002246bcd19e1fe243fea846b3fae3c712c0\u0022\u003ETOM RUTHERFORD\u003C/span\u003E: Well, you\u2019re welcome to come over and have a look and I\u2019ll show you.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000761\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022d64de4c1-ef68-477e-9c50-db5cbdf99404\u0022\u003ENow, through the select committee process, I believe the Justice Committee received feedback that said, actually, Corrections have advised that it would actually be impossible for Corrections to implement this requirement when it comes to those that are under their supervision in the community. If I\u2019m led to believe this is correct, that\u2019s nearly over 20,000 people. Why was the amendment made? The original intention of the bill was to have it apply to everybody, both within the prison and corrections facilities and also those who are out serving their sentences out in the community. Why has the legislation now been subsequently amended only to focus on those who are held within the corrections facilities? Was this any advice that the member in the select committee received as they considered the bill through the Justice Committee, or was this a decision that the member made after further thought, thinking about the legislation and the actual implementation of it and what that meant for the community?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000762\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022d64de4c1-ef68-477e-9c50-db5cbdf99404\u0022\u003EI\u2019ll invite the member to answer that question, and then, Madam Chair, if you wouldn\u2019t mind just clarifying.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000763\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002261720d2e-5b1d-4742-b4f0-30424316ccc1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022c8e1bc7672354de189f65aadc7efc12a\u0022\u003ECHAIRPERSON (Barbara Kuriger)\u003C/span\u003E: I will actually clarify before the member answers the questions. In the second reading, there was an opportunity to talk about what the\u00A0select committee did. The advice I received is that you can touch on the old clause 5\u2014that fits into these clauses\u2014but, basically, because the committee didn\u2019t go near clause 6, there\u2019s no real opportunity to talk about clause 6.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000764\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022d64de4c1-ef68-477e-9c50-db5cbdf99404\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022ecec322953b8409da376e75fcad20715\u0022\u003ETOM RUTHERFORD\u003C/span\u003E: Sorry, do you mind just repeating that? Because the committee didn\u2019t go back?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000765\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002261720d2e-5b1d-4742-b4f0-30424316ccc1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a0784f2b805e4a248b511cbe6d7fc206\u0022\u003ECHAIRPERSON (Barbara Kuriger)\u003C/span\u003E: Yeah\u2014yeah.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000766\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022d64de4c1-ef68-477e-9c50-db5cbdf99404\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00222d94734a1c954d2896379a086c6b7a9f\u0022\u003ETOM RUTHERFORD\u003C/span\u003E: OK, I understand.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000767\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002261720d2e-5b1d-4742-b4f0-30424316ccc1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002293a4fb8f14554979af3bfe66d311128d\u0022\u003ECHAIRPERSON (Barbara Kuriger)\u003C/span\u003E: So you can speak briefly about clause 5 as part of the clause that we\u2019re currently on.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000768\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022d64de4c1-ef68-477e-9c50-db5cbdf99404\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a0be079473384f2d9cad5afd2b2512a9\u0022\u003ETOM RUTHERFORD\u003C/span\u003E: OK, thank you.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022b2672720-3dfe-421a-af8c-20f00d44da3d\u0022 data-id=\u00221b0074b10da5455289e711609343790f\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000769\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b2672720-3dfe-421a-af8c-20f00d44da3d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00221b0074b10da5455289e711609343790f\u0022\u003ETODD STEPHENSON (ACT):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Madam Chair. Ms Nakhle, if you can just indulge me for a bit, as we do just work through clause 4. I\u2019m just interested in this amendment that was made around the chief executive and what they must take into consideration. It seems to me that, again, it\u2019s a fairly\u2014well, not substantial, but it\u2019s definitely a change from what was originally drafted. We\u2019ve got this term around \u201Cthe interests of victims\u201D\u2014\u201C(including, in particular, being free from unwanted contact with prisoners)\u201D.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000770\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b2672720-3dfe-421a-af8c-20f00d44da3d\u0022\u003EI really want to understand why that is important, why that was added, and, really, does that provide additional powers to the chief executive\u2014that\u2019s, obviously, of Corrections. Again, you\u2019ve actually got two people there: you\u2019ve got the Commissioner of Police empowered and also the chief executive of Corrections. Obviously, I\u2019m sure the chief executive of Corrections can delegate that power down, I suppose, to prison managers and people like that, so it can actually get further down in the system, close really to where those prisoners are being dealt with.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000771\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b2672720-3dfe-421a-af8c-20f00d44da3d\u0022\u003EI\u2019m very keen to understand from you why, really, that was put in\u2014amending that particular section\u2014and what is your understanding of taking into account the interests of victims? I think that\u2019s a very important clause, particularly given the entire motivation behind this bill. I\u2019m very interested to hear your comments on that.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000772\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022d64de4c1-ef68-477e-9c50-db5cbdf99404\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00221b6e4782d8b84d2e986e0b4ba70f508f\u0022\u003ETom Rutherford\u003C/span\u003E: Madam Chair?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002261720d2e-5b1d-4742-b4f0-30424316ccc1\u0022 data-id=\u00220a02a65b3aeb4da78e59017438c90e4d\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000773\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002261720d2e-5b1d-4742-b4f0-30424316ccc1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00220a02a65b3aeb4da78e59017438c90e4d\u0022\u003ECHAIRPERSON (Barbara Kuriger)\u003C/span\u003E: I call Rima Nakhle.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002239b9bac1-a992-4ccf-a473-9591aeb3a298\u0022 data-id=\u002265b9a0be6ffb47e39230cb38c1579f06\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000774\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002239b9bac1-a992-4ccf-a473-9591aeb3a298\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002265b9a0be6ffb47e39230cb38c1579f06\u0022\u003ERIMA NAKHLE (National\u2014Takanini):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Madam Chair. I\u2019m happy to sit down if this is a supplementary.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000775\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b9dc1924-4df4-4d8f-91ec-8a0f29348308\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00225ce008b0df8a470a8d957b074e2650fb\u0022\u003ETim Costley\u003C/span\u003E: Madam Chair?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002261720d2e-5b1d-4742-b4f0-30424316ccc1\u0022 data-id=\u0022bddf578fc5cc4c4f9abbb45dd7143b82\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000776\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002261720d2e-5b1d-4742-b4f0-30424316ccc1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022bddf578fc5cc4c4f9abbb45dd7143b82\u0022\u003ECHAIRPERSON (Barbara Kuriger)\u003C/span\u003E: Tom Rutherford was on his feet first\u2014sorry, Mr Costley.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022d64de4c1-ef68-477e-9c50-db5cbdf99404\u0022 data-id=\u0022698dff77b78f4f93a3b9c48f4d0d19b9\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000777\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022d64de4c1-ef68-477e-9c50-db5cbdf99404\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022698dff77b78f4f93a3b9c48f4d0d19b9\u0022\u003ETOM RUTHERFORD (National\u2014Bay of Plenty):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you very much, Madam Chair. I just wanted to flesh out a little bit more the earlier point I was making around the adjustments that were made, through the select committee process, around who the bill was actually applied to\u2014whether it was those both in corrections facilities or out in the community\u2014because there is a risk at play here that the intention of the legislation will apply to those in the corrections facilities, but that those out in the community can still have the opportunity to harass or contact or intimidate their victims, because they aren\u2019t serving their sentence within the corrections facilities.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000778\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022d64de4c1-ef68-477e-9c50-db5cbdf99404\u0022\u003EI want to understand the rationale from the member as to why Corrections made the suggestion to the select committee to adjust the legislation from everybody under the remit of Corrections to just those held in corrections facilities, which are substantial changes, because the number of people under supervision in the community is over 20,000. The targeting areas of the bill are actually being reduced down to just those held in our corrections facility. I\u2019m keen to flesh that out a little bit more, from the member in charge of the bill, Rima Nakhle, as to why that adjustment was made for just those in the corrections facilities versus those all encapsulated by corrections both in the community and also in our prison facilities.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022b9dc1924-4df4-4d8f-91ec-8a0f29348308\u0022 data-id=\u0022891832856ecb43a8a4b8f538143506ca\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000779\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b9dc1924-4df4-4d8f-91ec-8a0f29348308\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022891832856ecb43a8a4b8f538143506ca\u0022\u003ETIM COSTLEY (National\u2014\u014Ctaki):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Madam Chair. The area I\u2019d really like to delve into is the nexus between this bill and family law. We heard some insightful questions, I thought, earlier in this debate, that I\u2019ve been following very closely, looking at why it\u2019s only amending\u2014you know, the limitation of which Act get amended is very tight. I just wonder what consideration was given to where it might impact family law.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000780\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b9dc1924-4df4-4d8f-91ec-8a0f29348308\u0022\u003EThese can be very difficult, very serious, very challenging situations. Two parents involved and there\u2019s obviously a breakdown in the relationship that leads to one becoming the victim of the other, but still, we obviously want to consider the rights of the child and their wellbeing. There\u2019s been a lot of discussion traversed in this House about keeping them connected to their family, about how we honour what is best for the child. This is going to be a very complex issue to navigate, and obviously this gives\u2014the Commissioner of Police determines what conditions might be imposed. Now there is a preference towards unwanted contact, but, in the Venn diagram of these two things, there must be an overlap between what is the preference of the victim and what is the preference of any children, when they are present.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000781\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b9dc1924-4df4-4d8f-91ec-8a0f29348308\u0022\u003EIf we look through the lens of what Mr Rutherford\u2019s been talking about\u2014if that is expanded to those in the community as well as those that are incarcerated\u2014this actually becomes quite complex, because obviously, in this case, parents will still be involved with their children. It\u2019s not just a connection, but it\u2019s a physical connection. It\u2019s really important that we can navigate that in the interests of what is best for the child. I\u2019m just very mindful of family harm situations and the number of agencies involved\u2014the best way to navigate that. Obviously, we want to see the best outcome for the child.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000782\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b9dc1924-4df4-4d8f-91ec-8a0f29348308\u0022\u003EI just want to know, in terms of clause 4, when we look at that language about\u2014and I\u2019m specifically referring to clause 4A where it says, \u201CIn deciding which conditions \u2026 to impose, the chief executive or Commissioner of Police must take into account the interests of the victims (\u2026 in particular, being free from unwanted contact\u201D. Well, it might be unwanted by one parent, but how is that balanced with the desires of the child and what, perhaps, other agencies that could be involved in that situation are saying in the best interest of the child?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000783\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b9dc1924-4df4-4d8f-91ec-8a0f29348308\u0022\u003EI\u2019d be very keen to hear from the member how these things will be balanced, because there are a number of other Acts that would suddenly become intertwined, there are a number of considerations that would be involved, and I don\u2019t think, maybe, it\u2019s been considered. Maybe it is as simple as saying, \u201CWill we just leave that in the bailiwick of the Commissioner of Police and they will determine it\u201D, but I just don\u2019t see that specifically written and I just want to ensure that we are considering these things\u2014that it\u2019s been well traversed so that when this, hopefully, passes into law, we will be protecting the victims. That\u2019s obviously incredibly important, but I just want to make sure the rights of the children in a family harm situation are well protected. Thank you.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000784\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002261720d2e-5b1d-4742-b4f0-30424316ccc1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00229c869c267b2448498242d7dab11ecd80\u0022\u003ECHAIRPERSON (Barbara Kuriger)\u003C/span\u003E: I think just be careful with future contributions\u2014which should really be questions, not speeches\u2014that we\u2019re not going into traversing other bills other than the one that\u2019s in front of us.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002294b52412-f97b-4bbd-8009-5dc49520f7f4\u0022 data-id=\u00223802cdd353604f82b68d87f05ec65ab5\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000785\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002294b52412-f97b-4bbd-8009-5dc49520f7f4\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00223802cdd353604f82b68d87f05ec65ab5\u0022\u003ERYAN HAMILTON (National\u2014Hamilton East):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Madam Chair. Look, it\u2019s a pleasure to speak on this member\u2019s bill. I haven\u2019t been privy to much of the conversation and certainly not the work of the Justice Committee, but I just want to acknowledge the member Rima Nakhle for her work in getting to this point in the bill.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000786\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002294b52412-f97b-4bbd-8009-5dc49520f7f4\u0022\u003EMadam Chair, to your point, I do have some questions, and I guess just more for elucidation or clarification, if I may, for the member. At first, the bill, I appreciate, was capturing all prisoners outside of the scope and then obviously through the select committee process, which is good, but\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000787\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022d64de4c1-ef68-477e-9c50-db5cbdf99404\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022eab3542eb2d24286ae38c2965ecc2848\u0022\u003ETom Rutherford\u003C/span\u003E: Point of order. Sorry, I don\u2019t mean to interrupt my colleague, but I would just like the timer restarted to five minutes for his contribution, please.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000788\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002202e74c40-9529-4e15-adc2-c032eadc2205\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002214f876ae2e254e5b8f3f7ef8f6d98430\u0022\u003ECHAIRPERSON (Greg O\u2019Connor)\u003C/span\u003E: Sorry, it restarted or didn\u2019t restart?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000789\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022d64de4c1-ef68-477e-9c50-db5cbdf99404\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00229349cc7b4db74a8f8efef46b9de0b1c9\u0022\u003ETom Rutherford\u003C/span\u003E: It didn\u2019t start at all, sorry.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000790\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002202e74c40-9529-4e15-adc2-c032eadc2205\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002265d340460e424ae1b4088c2aefeb53f5\u0022\u003ECHAIRPERSON (Greg O\u2019Connor)\u003C/span\u003E: OK. Just a bit of a half-time changeover. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000791\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002294b52412-f97b-4bbd-8009-5dc49520f7f4\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00224e6ec627dd72432493adf69bae2baff3\u0022\u003ERYAN HAMILTON\u003C/span\u003E: Well, thank you, Mr Chair, and I just acknowledge my colleague Mr Rutherford for his astute observations. I don\u2019t know where we\u2019d be without you. I\u2019ll just find my rhythm.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000792\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002202e74c40-9529-4e15-adc2-c032eadc2205\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00224fc39b680733405683120db512f34c31\u0022\u003ECHAIRPERSON (Greg O\u2019Connor)\u003C/span\u003E: With Mr Rutherford being a very keen closer of motions on that side of the Chamber, I\u2019m pleased to see that he\u2019s wearing another hat tonight.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000793\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002294b52412-f97b-4bbd-8009-5dc49520f7f4\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00222af05176c6ce4a2fa50fdeb40feccf63\u0022\u003ERYAN HAMILTON\u003C/span\u003E: Yes. No, he\u2019s a man of many talents. For the member, I obviously appreciate that this bill was a little bit broader in the initial intention, but obviously quite a robust select committee process and through feedback and obviously through Corrections officials, you\u2019ve been able to narrow the scope of it, which is prudent. I just acknowledge the work of the team on that from both sides of the House\u2014obviously very good, very robust.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000794\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002294b52412-f97b-4bbd-8009-5dc49520f7f4\u0022\u003EJust in section 8 of the principal Act, after new section 8(1)(ja), inserted by clause 4, it talks about amending the powers and functions of the chief executive and it says, \u201Censuring that processes are established and maintained to inform visitors of prisoners and recipients of prisoner communications of measures that they can take if they do not want to be contacted by a prisoner\u201D. I just wonder if the member could perhaps clarify or expand on what some of those processes might be and also the measures. Obviously, probably the Justice Committee was privy to some of those things, but I certainly wasn\u2019t and certainly that would be helpful if she could elucidate on that.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000795\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002294b52412-f97b-4bbd-8009-5dc49520f7f4\u0022\u003EThen further down, I note in the commentary\u2014in the select committee report, obviously\u2014that, because we couldn\u2019t go broad with the bill, they were sending a report or a note that there\u2019d be safeguards available or that they hoped there\u2019d be safeguards available to protect the victims that fall beyond the scope of this bill in the broader community, so I look forward to seeing that.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000796\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002294b52412-f97b-4bbd-8009-5dc49520f7f4\u0022\u003EFurther, in replacement section 77(5A), inserted by clause 4A, there was a note here, \u201CIn deciding what conditions (if any) to impose, the chief executive or the Commissioner of Police must take into account the interests of victims (including\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000797\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002202e74c40-9529-4e15-adc2-c032eadc2205\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a974fe193e0d4e8b81505d8572ba6c91\u0022\u003ECHAIRPERSON (Greg O\u2019Connor)\u003C/span\u003E: We\u2019re just on clause 4, not clause 4A. Clause\u00A04A has its own clause.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000798\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002294b52412-f97b-4bbd-8009-5dc49520f7f4\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022864a75f54eaa456f8af471c332fc57ca\u0022\u003ERYAN HAMILTON\u003C/span\u003E: Oh, OK. Yep, thank you, Mr Chair. I\u2019ll go to the next one there, then.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000799\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002294b52412-f97b-4bbd-8009-5dc49520f7f4\u0022\u003EThere was a mention of why it was important to just focus on telephone calls. I just wondered, were there any other forms of harassment that were explored or why there was a sort of a narrowing of the text around that element of it? Then, also, \u201Ccontacts a person, or solicits anyone else to contact a person, who the prisoner knows or ought reasonably to know\u201D\u2014I know that\u2019s probably quite a pragmatic thing in a bill, and I suppose some of that drops down as the operationalisation through the corrections facility, but I wondered also if the member could expand on what some of those things might look like in terms of \u201Cought reasonably to know\u201D. Were there any comments through the select committee process of, you know, relationships or unintended, I suppose, methods of reaching the prisoner that might have then affected them and added to that sort of ongoing victimisation? I\u2019d be really interested in that. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000800\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002294b52412-f97b-4bbd-8009-5dc49520f7f4\u0022\u003EI guess the other element, just in closing, was including, in particular, being free from unwanted contact with the prisoners to take into account the interests of victims, including, in particular, being free from unwanted contact with prisoners. I wondered, again, just elucidation, expansion of what that might be in terms of the interests. If the member is able to do that, that would be terrific, but just once again, I congratulate the member and thank her for bringing this to the House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002239b9bac1-a992-4ccf-a473-9591aeb3a298\u0022 data-id=\u0022e028aeafcaca4743b0315089ac8ee51c\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000801\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002239b9bac1-a992-4ccf-a473-9591aeb3a298\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022e028aeafcaca4743b0315089ac8ee51c\u0022\u003ERIMA NAKHLE (National\u2014Takanini):\u003C/span\u003E My apologies, my colleague Cameron Brewer, but if you don\u2019t mind, I would like an opportunity to\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000802\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002202e74c40-9529-4e15-adc2-c032eadc2205\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00225d9aa24a0da94d5b8edaeaa05486982e\u0022\u003ECHAIRPERSON (Greg O\u2019Connor)\u003C/span\u003E: You can pull rank in this position.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000803\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002239b9bac1-a992-4ccf-a473-9591aeb3a298\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00225dac997ccddd4c1ab3a69f7f6b7b3026\u0022\u003ERIMA NAKHLE\u003C/span\u003E: Ah! Thanks for that\u2014welcome, Mr Chair. Now, if you don\u2019t mind, with the indulgence of my colleagues, I would like to just answer a few of the really astute questions that were raised. I thank the members for their interest. I also want to highlight what I highlighted just moments ago, that I\u2019m really appreciating the overzealousness of us\u00A0newbies, new class of 2023, but at this stage, maybe I\u2019ll just bring it back to the conversation about clause 4, if I may. I want to thank you, my friend Paulo Garcia, member for New Lynn. Thank you for your kind words and thank you for the contributions that you made during the select committee process on this member\u2019s bill, as you make other very sensible and thoughtful contributions for many of the other bills, the now 27 that we consider on the very hard-working Justice Committee.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000804\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002239b9bac1-a992-4ccf-a473-9591aeb3a298\u0022\u003EWhat I\u2019d like to highlight for the benefit of my colleagues across the Chamber but also for people listening from home\u2014and my husband, Roger\u2014is the reason why clause\u00A04 was substantially amended. There\u2019s many, many reasons that we unpacked here, and there\u2019s conversations that went back and forth with Corrections, with the advice that they gave and the questions that they answered, but, essentially, it comes down to this, if I may: essentially, it comes down to what was raised earlier\u2014that the number of people that are under the supervision of Corrections, if we consider the whole country, is over 20,000 people. That\u2019s people within prison, and that\u2019s\u2014do I have to lean over, by the way?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000805\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002202e74c40-9529-4e15-adc2-c032eadc2205\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00224fc8f998ac934ce1a2241b657ae56533\u0022\u003ECHAIRPERSON (Greg O\u2019Connor)\u003C/span\u003E: No, I think that\u2019s been picked up.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000806\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002239b9bac1-a992-4ccf-a473-9591aeb3a298\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00228f56fa0539494fdb9c65decb86ddfa51\u0022\u003ERIMA NAKHLE\u003C/span\u003E: I\u2019m supposed to be graceful! That means people within prison, and that means people that are out in the community, whether it\u2019s on in home detention, wearing an ankle bracelet, and things like that. That number is over 20,000.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000807\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002239b9bac1-a992-4ccf-a473-9591aeb3a298\u0022\u003EWhen we look at the number that\u2019s within prison, if we just start at the numbers of it all, those that are under the supervision of Corrections, confined to prisons per se, are just\u00A0over 9,000. The conversation with Corrections was that it\u2019s, essentially, almost impossible to oversee those that are out in the community: every single letter they send, every phone call they make, every SMS that they write\u2014you know, all those type of contacts\u2014every picture that they might send, every Facebook message, every Instagram and what have you. When we reflected as a committee on the complexities involved with overseeing the communications that take place, if Corrections was to oversee those that are out in the community, I had to acknowledge and accept that it is almost impossible at this stage in our lives. Hopefully in the future, it would be much easier to oversee, but at this stage, the simple answer is it\u2019s just too difficult.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000808\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002239b9bac1-a992-4ccf-a473-9591aeb3a298\u0022\u003EIf we allow ourselves to step away from this fervent desire to protect victims and just think about it on an operational and practical level, I think many of us can conclude, with some sadness, that it is actually not practical to put that obligation on the chief executive of\u00A0Corrections to make sure that everyone across the motu that is under the supervision of Corrections is being monitored with respect to the communications they make with victims of their crime. It\u2019s unfortunate, but that, essentially, is the answer, my friends.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000809\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002239b9bac1-a992-4ccf-a473-9591aeb3a298\u0022\u003EI\u2019m appreciative, Mr Rutherford, of your concern about what that means with respect to those that are out in the community, not within the confinement of prisons. Does it mean that they can just continue to\u2014in some situations, if they are so inclined\u2014harass and to contact unlawfully the victims of their crime, and do they, essentially, get away with it? May I say, if you allow me to be so straightforward in what I\u2019m about to say\u2014but first I\u2019m going to ask if I can have a bit of an extension of time.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000810\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002202e74c40-9529-4e15-adc2-c032eadc2205\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00222686fac837c144aeafd023aa4b9e0c14\u0022\u003ECHAIRPERSON (Greg O\u2019Connor)\u003C/span\u003E: Rima Nakhle.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000811\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002239b9bac1-a992-4ccf-a473-9591aeb3a298\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022445fa6d43122456285a95cc51af70baf\u0022\u003ERIMA NAKHLE\u003C/span\u003E: Thank you very much, Mr Chair. That question to my friend Mr Rutherford really, really troubled me. I had conversations with my husband, Roger. I had conversations with some friends in the Takanini community, especially people that have been subject to unsavoury behaviour, and their questions to me were: so what happens to those that are in the community? Can they just harass people? Can they just constantly make hundreds of calls to people and not actually be held accountable? Are they just going to get away with it? Now, they don\u2019t get away with it entirely, because they are under parole conditions for the most part, but we had to go back, and it caused me some angst. I\u2019m glad that my colleague Tom can feel that as well and can understand that concern about what this means with respect to those that are out in the community that are not in prisons?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000812\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002239b9bac1-a992-4ccf-a473-9591aeb3a298\u0022\u003EWhat I can say is that I\u2019m glad that, at least to a very bare minimum, we added something in the select committee final report saying that we hoped that that they were constantly being thought of. That\u2019s, essentially, the answer, if I was to put it down in a nutshell, my friends, and I\u2019m happy to expand further if need be.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000813\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227a31ee40-34c3-42b0-9459-7a7e9c815d6a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00226f98739b34a142558ef438f5a5ec9687\u0022\u003EKahurangi Carter\u003C/span\u003E: Mr Chair?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002202e74c40-9529-4e15-adc2-c032eadc2205\u0022 data-id=\u0022845f4203b32a4b42af99203725e12a56\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000814\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002202e74c40-9529-4e15-adc2-c032eadc2205\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022845f4203b32a4b42af99203725e12a56\u0022\u003ECHAIRPERSON (Greg O\u2019Connor)\u003C/span\u003E: Remind me\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000815\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227a31ee40-34c3-42b0-9459-7a7e9c815d6a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022fb787d27c48f45a9b3e7c86c452298d5\u0022\u003EKahurangi Carter\u003C/span\u003E: Kahurangi.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000816\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002202e74c40-9529-4e15-adc2-c032eadc2205\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002283cea10600a9490bbedc1794aafbf9c7\u0022\u003ECHAIRPERSON (Greg O\u2019Connor)\u003C/span\u003E: Kahurangi Carter.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00227a31ee40-34c3-42b0-9459-7a7e9c815d6a\u0022 data-id=\u0022e48be7f1755f42cab95ced31c76ae86a\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000817\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227a31ee40-34c3-42b0-9459-7a7e9c815d6a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022e48be7f1755f42cab95ced31c76ae86a\u0022\u003EKAHURANGI CARTER (Deputy Musterer\u2014Green):\u003C/span\u003E It\u2019s getting late, eh? I move, That debate on this question now close.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000818\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227a31ee40-34c3-42b0-9459-7a7e9c815d6a\u0022\u003EMotion agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000819\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227a31ee40-34c3-42b0-9459-7a7e9c815d6a\u0022\u003EClause 4 agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000820\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227a31ee40-34c3-42b0-9459-7a7e9c815d6a\u0022\u003EClause 4A agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000821\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227a31ee40-34c3-42b0-9459-7a7e9c815d6a\u0022\u003EClause 4B agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000822\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227a31ee40-34c3-42b0-9459-7a7e9c815d6a\u0022\u003EClause 4C agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000823\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227a31ee40-34c3-42b0-9459-7a7e9c815d6a\u0022\u003EBill to be reported with amendment.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000824\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227a31ee40-34c3-42b0-9459-7a7e9c815d6a\u0022\u003EHouse resumed.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002202e74c40-9529-4e15-adc2-c032eadc2205\u0022 data-id=\u00220862204571744a029129f15c2989f084\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000825\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002202e74c40-9529-4e15-adc2-c032eadc2205\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00220862204571744a029129f15c2989f084\u0022\u003ECHAIRPERSON (Greg O\u2019Connor)\u003C/span\u003E: Madam Speaker, the committee has considered the Corrections (Victim Protection) Amendment Bill and reports it with amendment. I move, That the report be adopted. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000826\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002202e74c40-9529-4e15-adc2-c032eadc2205\u0022\u003EMotion agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000827\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002202e74c40-9529-4e15-adc2-c032eadc2205\u0022\u003EReport adopted.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n    \u003C/div\u003E\n    \u003Cdiv class=\u0022HpsHansard\u0022\u003E\n      \u003Cp\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsProceedingHeading\u0022\u003EBills\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000828\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u0022966db409db0742168f0cd40bc2a13deb\u0022\u003EIncome Tax (Clean Transport FBT Exclusion) Amendment Bill\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000829\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u00221d6efc0e0630406c843f4bd2826b034b\u0022\u003EFirst Reading\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002258f935f1-6646-40ab-9d99-17029396850c\u0022 data-id=\u0022d83c8e9c1be5429c979f2b806daffee6\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000830\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002258f935f1-6646-40ab-9d99-17029396850c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022d83c8e9c1be5429c979f2b806daffee6\u0022\u003EHon JULIE ANNE GENTER (Green\u2014Rongotai):\u003C/span\u003E I move, That the Income Tax (Clean Transport FBT Exclusion) Amendment Bill be now read a first time. I nominate the Finance and Expenditure Committee to consider the bill.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000831\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002258f935f1-6646-40ab-9d99-17029396850c\u0022\u003EThank you, Mr Speaker. T\u0113n\u0101 koe, Mr Speaker. T\u0113n\u0101 koutou e te Whare. Right now on the other side of the world, the Conference of the Parties (COP)\u2014I\u2019m not sure which number it is\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000832\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00222c6d56e0faa4465180b60e4bf9d86987\u0022\u003EHon Members\u003C/span\u003E: 29.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000833\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002258f935f1-6646-40ab-9d99-17029396850c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00224b267593a2d34febb0c963d40d95738b\u0022\u003EHon JULIE ANNE GENTER\u003C/span\u003E: \u2014climate conference is happening\u201429. At the same\u00A0time, I\u2019ve just read a headline that says that scientists have determined that the 1.5\u00A0degrees of warming that was agreed to in Paris at COP 21 is already unattainable. It\u2019s been about nine years and we haven\u2019t seen the action that we needed in order to radically reduce carbon emissions to keep global heating below 1.5 degrees above industrial levels.\u00A0Of course, the Paris Agreement was one that the National Party signed Aotearoa New Zealand up to and have repeatedly asserted that they were committed to achieving those targets.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000834\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002258f935f1-6646-40ab-9d99-17029396850c\u0022\u003ENow, one of the things that we need to do\u2014one very small thing, it might seem, and this bill would help contribute to\u2014is increase the demand for electric vehicles, so I put this bill in the ballot. This is the first member\u2019s bill, in 13 years of being in this House of Parliament, that I have the pleasure of speaking to. I was quite lucky six years in to have a member\u2019s bill drawn, but then I was a Minister by the time it got to first reading, so I had to pass it on to a colleague. Then it took another six years for this bill to be drawn, so it\u2019s my first time speaking to a member\u2019s bill. It was one that I put in the ballot because I thought it might get the support of parties in the current Government. The reason I thought it might get support is because it\u2019s literally a policy that National had in their manifesto in 2020, not so long ago.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000835\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002258f935f1-6646-40ab-9d99-17029396850c\u0022\u003EWhat this bill does is it creates a temporary exemption for fringe benefit tax on electric vehicles. The rationale for this is that the majority of vehicles purchased in New Zealand are purchased by businesses\u2014that employers who have large fleets who provide their employees with vehicles could be incentivised quite easily to purchase electric vehicles if we created a temporary exemption of fringe benefit tax. Of course, we\u2019ve seen other exemptions of fringe benefit tax. There\u2019s an exemption for employer-provided car parks. Employer-provided car parks generate additional traffic trips, they have a whole host of unintended negative consequences, and yet they\u2019re exempt from fringe benefit tax. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000836\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002258f935f1-6646-40ab-9d99-17029396850c\u0022\u003EBecause of the distortion that\u2019s created by that exemption, we\u2019ve seen more exemptions put in, which is helpful because the commute to work trip is one of the biggest drivers of the morning and afternoon peak in traffic. If we have different incentives, if employers can provide different incentives, you can get shifts in behaviour. We saw an exemption brought in last term that the Green Party had campaigned on, which was an exemption for public transport passes, and then, at the very last minute, an amendment that I proposed to exempt bikes and electric bikes. That is actually creating an incentive and a kind of industry support for services to employers, like managing fleets of electric bikes. It\u2019s enabling people to access clean transportation. That\u2019s why this bill was put in place.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000837\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002258f935f1-6646-40ab-9d99-17029396850c\u0022\u003EI know it seems really boring and technical\u2014I feel that when I\u2019m giving this speech. It\u2019s hard to be really passionate about fringe benefit tax, isn\u2019t it? But here we are\u2014here we are. What happened was the Government said they\u2019re committed to the Paris targets and they\u2019re committed to reducing emissions. Transport is one of the largest sources of our carbon emissions, and the vast majority of our carbon emissions from transport are from private vehicles. If we\u2019re going to have any hope of decarbonising and there\u2019s no plan from the current Government to shift away from a very high reliance on private vehicles\u2014indeed, if anything, there are policies that are all about encouraging reliance on private vehicles and making it harder for people to use public transport. If we\u2019re going to reduce emissions, which this Government says they want to do, we need more electric vehicles.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000838\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002258f935f1-6646-40ab-9d99-17029396850c\u0022\u003EI just want to quote some supporters of this bill who I thought members opposite might be interested to hear. The Motor Industry Association (MIA) have provided this quote of support: \u201CThe MIA\u2019s support for this bill goes beyond the associated financial incentives. Our immediate concern is consumers\u2019 low uptake and continued hesitation in transitioning towards EVs. The supply of suitable vehicles is no longer a barrier to meeting carbon reduction targets\u2014consumer demand is. Achievement of future decarbonisation goals now hinges upon consumer demand. Continued consumer hesitation will directly impact carbon targets and our ability to achieve them.\u201D\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000839\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002258f935f1-6646-40ab-9d99-17029396850c\u0022\u003EThis bill is a targeted, strategic step towards strengthening demand for zero-emissions vehicles, which is essential for positioning New Zealand to meet its environmental commitments. It\u2019s been supported by a wide variety of automotive industry representatives, like the AA. In fact, when Simon Bridges was transport Minister\u2014if anyone remembers that; he\u2019s currently the chair of the New Zealand Transport Agency\u2014he had an electric vehicle advisory group who pushed for this policy. That was what they were campaigning on. That\u2019s why National then campaigned on it in 2020, but, sadly, it was dropped from their manifesto.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000840\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002258f935f1-6646-40ab-9d99-17029396850c\u0022\u003EHowever, it is not too late\u2014it is not too late. I ask all members here tonight to consider voting for this bill, simply to send it to select committee where it could be considered further; where we could hear from the public, from experts, and get advice from officials. Of course, we\u2019d have to hear from more than just IRD officials, because IRD officials, we all know, just love a very simple tax system and they\u2019re not a huge fan of exemptions. However, we are policy makers and we\u2019re here to get outcomes for New Zealanders. The OECD has repeatedly told New Zealand we\u2019re not using our tax system to get the environmental outcomes we want enough. This would be a simple way to get the outcomes we want.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000841\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002258f935f1-6646-40ab-9d99-17029396850c\u0022\u003ENow, this is not going to be very visible on television, unfortunately, but I did print a graph to show what happened with electric vehicle registrations in Aotearoa in 2024 after the Clean Car Discount was cancelled. There is a whole range of industry supporters like people who provide the charging infrastructure for electric vehicles. They\u2019re saying\u2014and a number of them, I know, will have emailed members in the last week or so\u2014that we need policy support from central government to increase the demand for electric vehicles. If we want the charging infrastructure, if we want the renewable generation, the single key driver of that is demand. How do we create the demand? We incentivise electric vehicles.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000842\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002258f935f1-6646-40ab-9d99-17029396850c\u0022\u003EI accept that members opposite, despite the success of the policy, were not in agreement with carrying on with the Clean Car Discount. The advantage of the Clean Car Discount was that it kept the incentives within the market of new vehicles coming to New Zealand. It meant that everybody who was bringing a new car into New Zealand\u2014whether it was a highly polluting vehicle or an EV\u2014somehow was playing a role in helping us reduce our emissions from those private vehicles. They have chosen to end that policy; however, there\u2019s nothing in its place. If anything, the road-user charges for battery electric vehicles are penalising electric vehicles now, because if someone has a hybrid vehicle, they pay half the cost per kilometre as a battery electric vehicle would, even though it\u2019s comparable damage to the road.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000843\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002258f935f1-6646-40ab-9d99-17029396850c\u0022\u003ESo it is time; we need a solution. That\u2019s why I put this very constructive bill in the ballot, because I thought, potentially, Government members, whatever party they might be in, might see the attractiveness of a bill that takes a tax off businesses and supports private cars.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000844\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227dbfbd83-6770-4555-8477-85fa01511504\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00220dca80971fd1473495b273d127c8c300\u0022\u003EAndy Foster\u003C/span\u003E: What about landlords?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000845\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002258f935f1-6646-40ab-9d99-17029396850c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00223865bd9f3bcb45ae873777106c6a5a0d\u0022\u003EHon JULIE ANNE GENTER\u003C/span\u003E: Well, oh, and some people are heckling me right now, as usual. I would love to respond to every heckle. Let me say: why is it that you\u2019re OK with tax breaks that don\u2019t reduce emissions, but you\u2019re not OK with tax breaks that do reduce emissions? That\u2019s my question for members opposite.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000846\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002258f935f1-6646-40ab-9d99-17029396850c\u0022\u003EThe whole point of the tax break is to get an outcome we want. Do we want more people who own property to keep buying up properties? No. Do we want to reduce emissions and incentivise the electric vehicle market and the electric vehicle charging infrastructure and the generation of renewable electricity? Yes. We should all want that. I would hope that all members, whether they\u2019re in the Government or not, will consider voting for this bill so we can take it to select committee and potentially find a solution we can all agree with.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002202e74c40-9529-4e15-adc2-c032eadc2205\u0022 data-id=\u00222e11434a643e4ce9a0235486463d5eb6\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000847\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002202e74c40-9529-4e15-adc2-c032eadc2205\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00222e11434a643e4ce9a0235486463d5eb6\u0022\u003EASSISTANT SPEAKER (Greg O\u2019Connor)\u003C/span\u003E: The question is that the motion be agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022094b0ff4-e404-451b-b4a9-ad12bd4dee56\u0022 data-id=\u002229fd09c6a24d45e2b3f1e283cd52a205\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000848\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022094b0ff4-e404-451b-b4a9-ad12bd4dee56\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002229fd09c6a24d45e2b3f1e283cd52a205\u0022\u003ESTUART SMITH (National\u2014Kaik\u014Dura):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you very much, Mr Speaker. It\u2019s a great pleasure to speak on the Income Tax (Clean Transport FBT Exclusion) Amendment Bill. I have to say, I\u2019m used to listening to Dr Deborah Russell, who\u2019s very knowledgeable on tax, actually, and very enthusiastic about it, and she\u2019s a great asset to the Finance and Expenditure Committee when it comes to tax. I\u2019ve now found another member of the Opposition who speaks enthusiastically about tax, so I\u2019ve learnt something tonight I didn\u2019t know tonight about the Hon Julie Anne Genter.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000849\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022094b0ff4-e404-451b-b4a9-ad12bd4dee56\u0022\u003EI will put the member out of her misery and say that we\u2019re actually not going to support this bill. It is a great thrill to have a bill drawn out of the ballot, and well done. Thirteen years and this is your first opportunity to speak to one, but at least you got your other one through\u2014or did it go through? Oh, that\u2019s a shame. Anyway, it is a great thrill to get a bill out and get it to the floor and to speak to it, but, ultimately, you have to have a bill that\u2019s going to be supported. The reason that we don\u2019t support it is, actually, we don\u2019t think it is necessary to have a fringe benefit tax to incentivise the uptake of electric vehicles (EVs).\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000850\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022094b0ff4-e404-451b-b4a9-ad12bd4dee56\u0022\u003EWe\u2019re in a period where we\u2019re in change and where electric vehicles may well overtake the internal combustion engine in the long run. We\u2019ve been in these sorts of periods before. I take you back, Mr Speaker\u2014not that you will remember it, of course; but the great horse manure crisis of 1894. This was a big thing around the world. Horse manure was making cities uninhabitable because the transport of the day was, of course, the horse. Cars did exist, just after that period in particular, but they were not being taken up at a fast enough rate to overtake the horses.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000851\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022094b0ff4-e404-451b-b4a9-ad12bd4dee56\u0022\u003EOf course, Mr Speaker, I know you\u2019ll be interested in this: the issue was all of the manure in the street, how do they clean it up? Well, of course, they had to have horses to clean it up, and that caused more manure, so it didn\u2019t really solve the problem. There was a story in The Times about it in 1894. In fact, there was a bit of an urban legend: it said in The Times\u2014allegedly\u2014\u201CIn 50 years, every street in London will be buried under 9\u00A0feet of manure.\u201D That actually was a myth; that\u2019s not what it said. In fact, in 1894 they were complaining about dust and mud rather than manure and dead horses in the street.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000852\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022094b0ff4-e404-451b-b4a9-ad12bd4dee56\u0022\u003EWhere am I going with this? Well, actually, in 1908, Mr Speaker, you\u2019ll be pleased to know, Henry Ford produced the first Model T that rolled off the production line where they had mass production, and he made vehicles affordable for the common person to buy. There were a lot of cars around\u2014in fact, there were electric lead-acid battery cars at that time. Anyway, the internal combustion engine won the day and it\u2019s still the primary means of road transport today. Of course, buses and electric trams also dealt with the horse manure issue, but people took up those vehicles because they made a decision that that technology was better than the existing technology. They weren\u2019t subsidised, they weren\u2019t taxed or didn\u2019t have tax incentives\u2014either a tax break or a tax on horses\u2014people made a technology decision.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000853\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022094b0ff4-e404-451b-b4a9-ad12bd4dee56\u0022\u003ENow, I give this speech as a person who owns an EV, and I own an EV that never got a subsidy. I own that EV\u2014well, actually, my wife does\u2014because we like that technology. It\u2019s a technology that we like, and it\u2019s a far better drive than an internal combustion engine. Unfortunately, we live in rural provincial New Zealand and an EV is not that practical for long distances and we do a lot of long distances, so we have a diesel vehicle. We didn\u2019t buy it to save emissions; we bought it because of the technology. Actually, I think we know what\u2019s happening in the world at the moment. I think there\u2019s going to be a lot more Chinese EVs that are very cheap and are hitting Europe about now and we will get them at some point anyway. They will be more than cost-competitive, so we don\u2019t need a fringe benefit tax for EV uptake.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000854\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022094b0ff4-e404-451b-b4a9-ad12bd4dee56\u0022\u003EWhat we do need is what we are doing, and that is building charging stations to ensure that people don\u2019t have range anxiety. I know that unless you have an EV, you don\u2019t know\u00A0what range anxiety is, because, believe me, Mr Speaker, you don\u2019t want to go below 20\u00A0percent left on your battery. That can run down very quickly. I can tell you, driving through the McKenzie country in an EV in a nor\u2019wester and watching the battery just drain away\u2014it\u2019s a long way to the next charging station. It\u2019s not a very nice experience.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000855\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022094b0ff4-e404-451b-b4a9-ad12bd4dee56\u0022\u003EThat aside, the member spoke a lot about emissions, but the reality is, and there\u2019s research to show this: you have to drive an EV for over 100,000 miles\u2014miles, not kilometres; miles\u2014until you get the benefit, in terms of emissions, of having an EV rather than an internal combustion engine vehicle, because of all the mining that\u2019s required for the materials to go into an EV. There\u2019s a lot of emissions that go into the manufacturing of that vehicle\u2014it\u2019s not a disputable fact.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000856\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022094b0ff4-e404-451b-b4a9-ad12bd4dee56\u0022\u003EI note the fringe benefit tax, also part of this bill, is to actually deem all double-cab utes as cars. I\u2019ll tell you why that is: because that will then make them not able to receive the fringe benefit tax. I know a former Prime Minister who has made her name helping Kamala Harris with her election campaign\u2014well, she didn\u2019t go that well, actually. Anyway, she talked about utes and being an \u201Cillegitimate\u201D ute, in that people were driving them around. Well, illegitimate utes cannot get fringe benefit tax.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000857\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022094b0ff4-e404-451b-b4a9-ad12bd4dee56\u0022\u003EThere are conditions on what can get a fringe benefit tax, and that is, one, a vehicle that prominently and permanently displays on its exterior the employer\u2019s identification\u2014so it must have that on it. It is not a car. It is not available for an employee\u2019s private use, \u201Cexcept for private use that is (a) travel to and from home that is necessary in, and a condition of, their employment; (b) or other travel in the course of their employment, during which travel arises incidentally to the business use.\u201D Everyone who owns, if this were to pass, a double-cab ute for their business\u2014like the tradies, the plumbers, the builders, all the electricians\u2014will not be eligible for a fringe benefit tax exemption, and that is hitting the productive sector of New Zealand. It\u2019s outrageous, and that is one of the main reasons why we will not be supporting this bill. I\u2019m\u2014with pleasure, actually\u2014opposing this bill.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002212d74f81-b1f7-4b51-9fb4-8f9481477192\u0022 data-id=\u0022ef7e0a620d8848e0883d4ea04eb95115\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000858\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002212d74f81-b1f7-4b51-9fb4-8f9481477192\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022ef7e0a620d8848e0883d4ea04eb95115\u0022\u003EHon Dr DEBORAH RUSSELL (Labour):\u003C/span\u003E I want to make probably about three or four points in relation to the Income Tax (Clean Transport FBT Exclusion) Amendment Bill. The Labour Party will be supporting this bill. Now, ordinarily, we would not take the step of looking at fringe benefit tax (FBT) exemption sew-ons for a very specific period. It\u2019s a sort of wrinkle in the tax Act that we would not ordinarily support, but we did want to support this one, and the reason is quite straightforward: there are currently no incentives around the uptake of electric vehicles (EVs) in New Zealand\u2014nothing since the Clean Car Discount was removed.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000859\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002212d74f81-b1f7-4b51-9fb4-8f9481477192\u0022\u003EWe think that this measure would encourage businesses to use electric vehicles, and, of course, once a business uses an electric vehicle and perhaps uses it for a few years and then it gets sold out into the second-hand fleet, it increases the supply of second-hand vehicles in the country in general. It would actually be a good measure in terms of trying to work hard on reducing our emissions. At present, there seem to be no measures being taken by the Government to reduce this country\u2019s emissions, and this would go some way towards doing that. It\u2019s a short-term incentive. I think it would be worth trying in the absence of any other measures designed to make it more financially viable for businesses to take up electric vehicles. That would be quite a straightforward thing to do.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000860\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002212d74f81-b1f7-4b51-9fb4-8f9481477192\u0022\u003ENow, the bill achieves this by adding an exclusion to section CX 6 of the Income Tax Act. What that particular section does\u2014section CX 6\u2014is it imposes fringe benefit tax on the private use of a vehicle which is supplied by an employer. But there are some exclusions: when the vehicle is used for an emergency, when it\u2019s used for a work trip that lasts more than 24 hours, and so on\u2014there are various exclusions. It would simply add an exclusion if the vehicle was an EV, and that seems like a pretty straightforward way to do it. That is how a change could be achieved, and I think it is worth a try.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000861\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002212d74f81-b1f7-4b51-9fb4-8f9481477192\u0022\u003EI do want to just take up something which the previous speaker, Stuart Smith, was talking about, and that is the other rule that is proposed in this bill around double-cab utes. Now, at the moment, if you\u2019ve got a vehicle that is designed exclusively or mainly to carry up to nine people, including the driver, that gets defined as a car, and cars get caught by the fringe benefit tax rules when they are supplied by an employer for an employee to use, right? That\u2019s fairly straightforward, but work-related vehicles fall out of the fringe benefit tax rules, and there\u2019s a little bit of an anomaly around double-cab utes. Even when someone is using a double-cab ute pretty much for personal purposes, it does seem that in the ways that the law is applied, many people seem to think that, because it\u2019s a double-cab ute, it is defined as a work-related vehicle and it falls outside of the FBT rules. This would just be a matter of clarifying what actually ought to be the practice.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000862\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002212d74f81-b1f7-4b51-9fb4-8f9481477192\u0022\u003EWe know from evidence from Inland Revenue and from Inland Revenue officers up and down the country that there are some areas where double-cab utes are treated as just being a work-related vehicle when in actual fact they are functioning as a car. This would just clarify the rules around that. If a person is using their double-cab ute for work-related purposes and they\u2019re only using it for work-related purposes, there\u2019s no problem. It\u2019s when they use that vehicle as a car for passenger transport\u2014for personal passenger transport\u2014that it becomes a different matter. It would simply clarify the rules. If a business wants to use a double-cab ute, go for it; that\u2019s absolutely fine. It\u2019s just a matter of where the benefit from that falls and whether it does form part of, I guess, an employee\u2019s remuneration. It would simply clarify that, and I think it\u2019s a valuable measure in itself, just clarifying that aspect of the FBT rules.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000863\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002212d74f81-b1f7-4b51-9fb4-8f9481477192\u0022\u003EHaving said all that, it\u2019s a shame to hear that this bill won\u2019t at least be supported to select committee, where we could have gone into some of the issues around fringe benefit tax. Our fringe benefit tax does need reviewing. There are some anomalies in the law. It is a complicated piece of legislation which could do with a wee bit of tidying up. It\u2019s a shame that the Government won\u2019t allow that to take place. In the Labour Party, our position is very clearly that, even though as a tax measure itself we might not support it, as a measure to reduce emissions we do. For that reason, we support this bill.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002262828428-6565-42b4-bd4d-fa3b12531f88\u0022 data-id=\u0022c9230e5e75e84e5cbfe3d8e6928daa81\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000864\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002262828428-6565-42b4-bd4d-fa3b12531f88\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022c9230e5e75e84e5cbfe3d8e6928daa81\u0022\u003ESIMON COURT (ACT):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Mr Speaker. Congratulations to the Hon Julie Anne Genter on having your bill drawn and having the opportunity to present to the House your case for why electric vehicles should be exempt from fringe benefit tax.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000865\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002258f935f1-6646-40ab-9d99-17029396850c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00221fd55c2e0a8b44439368636e74080cd9\u0022\u003EHon Julie Anne Genter\u003C/span\u003E: Temporarily. It\u2019s only a temporary\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000866\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002262828428-6565-42b4-bd4d-fa3b12531f88\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00222d87c6c5e427444aa5194d8635136a44\u0022\u003ESIMON COURT\u003C/span\u003E: And only temporarily, the member says, which doesn\u2019t add to the weight of evidence that she has presented. The evidence for the prosecution of this flawed case: electric vehicles (EVs) are so cheap and so plentiful that the Government needs to subsidise them with tax breaks in order to make them more plentiful and more available. That doesn\u2019t stack up.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000867\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002262828428-6565-42b4-bd4d-fa3b12531f88\u0022\u003ENow, the honourable member, I understand, is a transport planner\u2014and I\u2019ve had lots of wonderful conversations where we agree about transport planning and urban planning\u2014but this proposal is missing an economic support, because, when supply exceeds demand, that is evidence of customers expressing preference. It could also be evidence that suppliers have become so efficient at producing the goods at such a low price that, essentially, they\u2019ve flooded the market; they\u2019ve reached maximum capacity of what consumers of any product will absorb.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000868\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002262828428-6565-42b4-bd4d-fa3b12531f88\u0022\u003ETwo things will happen in that case: consumers might suddenly decide to switch preferences based on price, or it may very well be that the manufacturers of those products made a very poor choice in oversupplying the market, investing in plant and equipment that\u00A0turned out not to be able to achieve its rate of return. The New Zealand taxpayer should not be helping companies who have mal-invested, or helping consumers who have adequate choice at very low cost.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000869\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002262828428-6565-42b4-bd4d-fa3b12531f88\u0022\u003EThe previous Government gave hundreds of millions of taxpayer dollars to subsidise electric vehicles. They taxed tradies who needed to buy utes and vans, and large families who needed to buy larger vehicles, and they transferred that money to another group of consumers to subsidise the cost of their electric vehicles. That artificially stimulated demand which didn\u2019t exist without Government interference. Now, this coalition Government, the ACT Party included, campaigned to get rid of the ute tax and restore fairness into the vehicle market and for tradies, farmers, and people who need big family cars. We did that\u2014we delivered that in the first 100 days. We got rid of the ute tax; the ute tax is no more. Now there\u2019s a surplus of electric vehicles, and it\u2019s almost like we didn\u2019t need the tax. We didn\u2019t need the subsidy; the market has provided. That may be a surprise to the Green Party and members of the Labour Party apparently supporting this\u2014that free markets will supply as much stuff as you\u00A0want.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000870\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002262828428-6565-42b4-bd4d-fa3b12531f88\u0022\u003EI just want to give you an example about what\u2019s changed in the EV market in the last few years. The Hertz rental company in the past week has written off $2 billion of the residual value of its EV rental fleet because it turns out, after three years, they\u2019re worth next to nothing. Whereas a different type of a petrol or diesel vehicle with 100,000 kilometres and three years on the clock still has a significant\u2014maybe 40 or 50\u2014percent of its residual value, EVs have next to nothing. There is nothing that the Greens, Labour, and other socialist parties wouldn\u2019t subsidise in tax and get other people to pay for, but we can\u2019t make consumers choose things that they don\u2019t want. We can\u2019t. You can\u2019t subsidise rubbish, failing media companies by taxing successful ones, like Google, and handing them other people\u2019s money.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000871\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002262828428-6565-42b4-bd4d-fa3b12531f88\u0022\u003EA famed Wellington economist, a gentleman called Dr Eric Crampton\u2014some of you might have read his writings, Dr Eric Crampton from the New Zealand Initiative. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000872\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002253f86481-33c1-48b2-893b-c11cc0bd673d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022459f0c0cac0e4bd8829bb05f52102e03\u0022\u003EHon Paul Goldsmith\u003C/span\u003E: Expert on every topic.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000873\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002262828428-6565-42b4-bd4d-fa3b12531f88\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00224cf4e31270674d7a81c802783875a6c7\u0022\u003ESIMON COURT\u003C/span\u003E: He is an expert on so many topics. He\u2019s an expert on Wises maps. He made the point recently, on that wonderful social media channel X, that, you know, taken to the extreme, if we want to subsidise businesses that are failing, maybe we could tax Google Maps and give the money to Wises maps. It would sit dusty and unwanted in the service station. This bill is about as sensible as that. It won\u2019t work, but I want to offer hope for the member Julie Anne Genter, something that is so cheap that they\u2019ve been given away at cost. The market has already solved the problem for consumers and businesses; ACT will not support it. I\u2019m sorry.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00227dbfbd83-6770-4555-8477-85fa01511504\u0022 data-id=\u0022e4bcdf53edec454089dee97cf4d40982\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000874\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227dbfbd83-6770-4555-8477-85fa01511504\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022e4bcdf53edec454089dee97cf4d40982\u0022\u003EANDY FOSTER (NZ First):\u003C/span\u003E I want to congratulate the member for getting the bill drawn and, obviously, for the work that went into getting it to that stage. I do understand at face value the intention here, which is to try and get towards a cleaner fleet over time, and I understand the issues around saying that, look, over time, hopefully, electric vehicles (EVs) will become cheaper and, therefore, they will become more cost-competitive without some form of incentive. However, this looks like a back-door approach to doing exactly the Clean Car Discount twinned with \u201CLet\u2019s tax the utes.\u201D, which is what we got rid of earlier this term. It looks like having another crack at that. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000875\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227dbfbd83-6770-4555-8477-85fa01511504\u0022\u003EWhat are the problems with this bill? Well, first of all, there\u2019ll be a fiscal impact, and, actually, we don\u2019t know how big the fiscal impact will be, but my bet is that it will actually be bigger than the fiscal impact of the Clean Car Discount because, of course, the fringe benefit tax (FBT) applies every year. It\u2019s not just a one-off, but it will apply every year, and I\u2019ll come back to some numbers very shortly. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000876\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227dbfbd83-6770-4555-8477-85fa01511504\u0022\u003ESecondly, it proposes a tax rebate for people who have provided a vehicle. I do note that we get harangued by the other side of the House when we say that there is a group of people who have a legitimate business expense, and it seems an outrage to the other side of the House that we should, that that business expense should be deductible against the cost of providing a business. Of course, I\u2019m talking about people who are providing housing for other people\u2014i.e., mum and dad landlords and other landlords\u2014and yet we get harangued by the other side of the House, and here they want to provide a tax incentive, effectively, for somebody just to make it cheaper for them. I don\u2019t quite get the logic behind that; maybe there isn\u2019t any. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000877\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227dbfbd83-6770-4555-8477-85fa01511504\u0022\u003EThird, the bill would take from the less well-off and give to the more well-off, and I would have hoped that that side of the House might be talking about being for the Robin Hood approach. This is more the Sheriff of Nottingham approach, because what we know is that, disproportionately, EVs are in the wealthier parts of the country and they\u2019re in the urban parts of the country\u2014particularly Wellington and Auckland. The rural areas, for the reasons that Stuart Smith has espoused, have much lower numbers of EVs and also, of course, have lower incomes on the whole. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000878\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227dbfbd83-6770-4555-8477-85fa01511504\u0022\u003EThen, of course, EVs are much more expensive than ICE vehicles\u2014or internal combustion engine vehicles\u2014on the whole, and I did some quick maths. I tried to do the calculations on FBT because, of course, the higher the value of the vehicle, the higher the value of the FBT, or the FBT rebate in this case. By my calculations, for an $80,000 vehicle\u2014which is not stratospheric for an EV\u2014purchased in 2024, the FBT would be $8,888 this year, and then whatever it is in future years. If it\u2019s a $150,000 vehicle, the FBT will be $16,656. The more expensive the vehicle, the greater the rebate which is being proposed to be given in this bill. As I said, the bill would tend to support the wealthy in our wealthier cities. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000879\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227dbfbd83-6770-4555-8477-85fa01511504\u0022\u003EThe other thing is that we\u2019ve heard one or two comments that said that the bill specifically also has a little barb in the tail, and it\u2019s that barb which says that it specifically will make double-cab utes \u201Ccars\u201D for FBT purposes. Again, it\u2019s the same things that we had with the ute tax, and, of course, these double-cab utes are much more likely to actually be used for work vehicles. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000880\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227dbfbd83-6770-4555-8477-85fa01511504\u0022\u003ELook, we\u2019ve heard some comments made there about whether they are or are not work vehicles, but I\u2019m just drawing from the Deloitte report which Stuart Smith referred to. In terms of double-cab utes: \u201CInland Revenue\u2019s view in relation to double-cab utes is: \u2018This vehicle is designed equally for carrying people and for carrying goods. The front half of the ute comprises the cab which has two rows of seats for carrying people. The back half of the vehicle is the tray, which is used for carrying goods. This vehicle is not a car.\u2019\u00A0\u201D\u2014is the comment which is made there\u2014and, of course, this bill makes them a car. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000881\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227dbfbd83-6770-4555-8477-85fa01511504\u0022\u003EIn summary, the fiscal cost of this is unknown. I wouldn\u2019t be surprised if the Minister of Finance\u2014if it went anywhere\u2014said, \u201COh, hang on. I\u2019m going to veto that because of the cost of it.\u201D It will take from the poorer rural areas to give to the wealthier urban ones. It will penalise the people who use vehicles for work and give to those who do not, and, essentially, it tries to put back in a policy approach that this Government took out earlier this year. New Zealand First will not be supporting this bill, and I do not commend it to the House. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00220ef5a38c-0ef7-4d68-8621-dcbb47077e6e\u0022 data-id=\u0022a52220f59ec04616bcdbc8ede89ccecb\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000882\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220ef5a38c-0ef7-4d68-8621-dcbb47077e6e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022a52220f59ec04616bcdbc8ede89ccecb\u0022\u003EHANA-RAWHITI MAIPI-CLARKE (Te P\u0101ti M\u0101ori\u2014Hauraki-Waikato):\u003C/span\u003E T\u0113n\u0101 r\u0101 koe e te P\u012Bka, otir\u0101 t\u0113n\u0101 r\u0101 t\u0101tou e te Whare. E t\u016B ana hau ki te waha i ng\u0101 k\u014Drero m\u014D Te P\u0101ti M\u0101ori i te p\u014D nei, e mihi ana au ki te mema n\u0101na t\u0113nei pire, otir\u0101 ki Te P\u0101ti K\u0101kariki. E t\u016B ana hau ki te tautoko i t\u0113nei pire. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000883\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220ef5a38c-0ef7-4d68-8621-dcbb47077e6e\u0022\u003E[Thank you, Mr Speaker, and greetings to the whole House. I stand to speak on behalf of Te P\u0101ti M\u0101ori this evening. I would like to acknowledge the member who brought this bill forward, and also to the Green Party. I stand to support this bill.]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000884\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220ef5a38c-0ef7-4d68-8621-dcbb47077e6e\u0022\u003EI am glad to stand here to take a short call to support this bill and enter the discussion on this particular amendment, the Income Tax (Clean Transport FBT Exclusion) Amendment Bill, which will seek to ultimately improve electrical vehicle uptake through the removal of fringe benefit tax for five years from zero-emissions vehicles that are provided to staff as a part of their salary package. This is important as it is clear financial incentive for employers to purchase new electric vehicles as company cars. By extension, this bill will help support a transition towards cleaner transport options, lessening the impact of fossil fuels on the whenua.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000885\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220ef5a38c-0ef7-4d68-8621-dcbb47077e6e\u0022\u003EIn previous months, my colleagues stood and spoke on the road-user charge amendment bill, and I\u2019ll readdress a point made during those readings because it is important, especially for our wh\u0101nau and people who may wonder why amendments such as the one we discuss today impact our oranga.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000886\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220ef5a38c-0ef7-4d68-8621-dcbb47077e6e\u0022\u003EAt that point, we as M\u0101ori are often segregated from this type of discussion and this k\u014Drero, given that for us as M\u0101ori, it can be an everyday struggle to survive, to put food on the table, and to afford the basic necessities\u2014a particularly relevant issue in our current political climate; it is a struggle to keep a roof over our heads. Given these things, discussions on electric vehicles are far from reality at times, and the removal of fringe benefit tax are often so far away from our real-world life issues we are removed from these conversations.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000887\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220ef5a38c-0ef7-4d68-8621-dcbb47077e6e\u0022\u003EI stand here to affirm our place in this discussion, as my colleagues have done in previous weeks for M\u0101ori, to reassure our hapori that we are making our voices heard in every corner of this House, for every issue that may impact us, no matter how relevant it may be. As I stand before the changes that are to be made, this bill will encourage the uptake of electric vehicles and therefore reduce harm caused to our whenua by our heavy reliance on fossil fuels.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000888\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220ef5a38c-0ef7-4d68-8621-dcbb47077e6e\u0022\u003EFor M\u0101ori, the health of the whenua reflects the health of the people. Therefore, a reduction in harm to the whenua is ultimately a reduction in the harm to ourselves. Amendments such as the one discussed today will contribute\u2014even though it is minute\u2014to the betterment of the health of our people. I can therefore, with the best interest of our mokopuna yet to come, that this whenua will be taken care of and passed on to them. That is why Te P\u0101ti M\u0101ori is in support of this bill. T\u0113n\u0101 r\u0101 t\u0101tou e te Whare.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022b464a62e-d900-452a-b842-e3cf4ccc6149\u0022 data-id=\u00226a380c22251d4dcab4d7c9eee4d09dcb\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000889\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b464a62e-d900-452a-b842-e3cf4ccc6149\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00226a380c22251d4dcab4d7c9eee4d09dcb\u0022\u003EARENA WILLIAMS (Labour\u2014Manurewa):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Mr Speaker, for the opportunity to speak on this silly bill, this silly opportunity for the House to be having to say that this is not something that is worth going to first reading, but it is actually something that most people in this House would support. You would think that the National Party were taking every opportunity, right now, to show that they are listening to people in New Zealand who are looking for some leadership on climate action, some leadership from the National Party that they are still committed to meeting their Paris Agreement targets\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000890\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002294b52412-f97b-4bbd-8009-5dc49520f7f4\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00224812fe0bd2c04c54af9975c81193fe64\u0022\u003ERyan Hamilton\u003C/span\u003E: We are.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000891\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b464a62e-d900-452a-b842-e3cf4ccc6149\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a562331f1fa74551a46fe6af28a293e5\u0022\u003EARENA WILLIAMS\u003C/span\u003E: \u2014when, over and over and over again, they say, \u201CWe are.\u201D The Minister in the chair, the Hon Paul Goldsmith, says, \u201CWe are.\u201D Well, prove it then. Find something you can support, because the Government can\u2019t support the restrictions on mining. No, those are all back on. The Government can\u2019t support the policy that the prior Labour Government brought in to increase the uptake of electric vehicles (EVs). The Government can\u2019t support further funding for public transport and all of those good things in our cities that reduce emissions. What is it that speaks to ordinary New Zealanders who want a moderate Government to lead on its long-term vision for New Zealand? What is it that the National MPs will find to show people that they are listening to their concerns? \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000892\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b464a62e-d900-452a-b842-e3cf4ccc6149\u0022\u003EThe Hon Julie Anne Genter is an expert on transport policy. She\u2019s someone I\u2019ve learnt a lot from, and I commend her for this bill in her work on the Transport and Infrastructure Committee. She has served in the Labour Government as a transport expert, and this kind of sensible policy that steps us out to say, \u201CWell, it wasn\u2019t what I would do.\u201D It\u2019s not the comprehensive kind of policy that would implement the kind of transformational change that Labour and the Greens could achieve together, but it\u2019s something. It\u2019s something to make people\u2019s lives better. It\u2019s something to show New Zealand on the world stage and that there is a bit of vision left in this place. But, no, National have thrown that in the bin. For what? Some petty politics to show that they can\u2019t work with the Greens? You would think that there was some appetite there, at least at a political level, to show that they\u2019ve got some friends left on this side of the Parliament when they are in bed with one of the most divisive politicians of our generation. But, no, we\u2019re here denying even the ability of a select committee to look into what is a good and sensible and middle-of-the-road idea on climate change.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000893\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b464a62e-d900-452a-b842-e3cf4ccc6149\u0022\u003EWhat does that say to young people in this country who are looking to this Parliament to do something about the planet boiling\u2014literally boiling\u2014in its skin? That is the future that we are looking down the barrel of with a Government who finds that funny. We could be having a really useful discussion at a select committee level about the ways that we could incentivise uptake of EVs. National, at the election time, said that was a great idea. They said that they would be spending public money on it to support private ownership of EVs. You know, that\u2019s certainly not what I would do either. Where\u2019s that? Where\u2019s that on the agenda? Why aren\u2019t we debating that? It\u2019s certainly worth having a discussion about how we might incentivise people to get out of cars as well and into different public transport choices\u2014whether it\u2019s walking, cycling, buses\u2014but we\u2019re not having that debate either.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000894\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b464a62e-d900-452a-b842-e3cf4ccc6149\u0022\u003EWe are so far, in this Parliament right now, from the cares of ordinary New Zealanders and the things that will actually make their lives better. We are being distracted by this Government buying into a debate that is divisive out there on the forecourt of Parliament the other day, and we\u2019re not supporting these sensible ideas which would have advanced the debate. Even though this isn\u2019t what I would do, I would spend my time very happily working through this in a consensus-building way with people around the House who know more about this than I do.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000895\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b464a62e-d900-452a-b842-e3cf4ccc6149\u0022\u003EI would like to think that the New Zealand Parliament is well known around the world for the way that parliamentarians can get together and hash out ideas like this one and decide, based on the evidence, whether it is good. But we\u2019ve heard a jumble of hot reckons around the House tonight about why we won\u2019t be spending our time doing this, and it\u2019s a real shame. It\u2019s also a shame when we know the challenges that are facing this country long term about the kind of infrastructure that we need to prepare ourselves for the kind of change that we will face in my generation and in the generation of my children to adapt to climate change. That is a useful conversation for this Parliament to be having. That is what we should be doing. This bill\u2014open the door for it. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000896\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b464a62e-d900-452a-b842-e3cf4ccc6149\u0022\u003EThank you, Julie Anne Genter, for bringing it to this House. I\u2019m sorry that it won\u2019t be passing, but we support it.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022a00bf4f5-c63a-49a0-b0e1-d3b37311377b\u0022 data-id=\u0022442d0507f5a540a79e674ca189e7e522\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000897\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a00bf4f5-c63a-49a0-b0e1-d3b37311377b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022442d0507f5a540a79e674ca189e7e522\u0022\u003ECATHERINE WEDD (National\u2014Tukituki):\u003C/span\u003E I rise to oppose this bill. Look, I am going to touch on the member who has just spoken, Arena Williams, saying that we aren\u2019t taking climate change action; well, I\u2019ll tell you we are, on this side of the House, taking climate change action, because we are looking to double our renewable energy by 2050 and reduce emissions in New Zealand. I\u2019ll just give an example, actually, from today\u2014a visit that I paid to a wind farm opening in Hawke\u2019s Bay, the second-largest wind farm in New Zealand, where we switched it on: 41 turbines powering up 70,000 households and businesses across Hawke\u2019s Bay. Now, creating more renewable energy, using our water, our sun, and our wind\u2014our wind\u2014is how we are going to action climate change and how we\u2019re going to reduce our emissions.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000898\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a00bf4f5-c63a-49a0-b0e1-d3b37311377b\u0022\u003EIt\u2019s all very well to have those electric vehicles, but somehow we need to create the electricity to power those electric vehicles. The way we\u2019re going to do that is by building more renewable energy, more infrastructure, and getting it done faster. That is why we have the Fast-track Approvals Bill, because these farms are taking so long to consent. Just today, I was with the landowners and they were saying that it\u2019s taken 20 years to get this wind farm built\u201420 years; 2004 they started. Well, that is just absolutely senseless. If we want to build wind farms and solar farms, we need to get them consented fast and built. It only took two years to build this wind farm. That\u2019s the reality that we\u2019re facing, that is sensible policy, and that is how we are going to address climate change. I do not commend this bill to the House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002202e74c40-9529-4e15-adc2-c032eadc2205\u0022 data-id=\u002293e2cf1ae7524666b1cb97f8de12154d\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000899\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002202e74c40-9529-4e15-adc2-c032eadc2205\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002293e2cf1ae7524666b1cb97f8de12154d\u0022\u003EASSISTANT SPEAKER (Greg O\u2019Connor)\u003C/span\u003E: The Hon Julie Anne Genter in reply.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002258f935f1-6646-40ab-9d99-17029396850c\u0022 data-id=\u002252a48b2acc81444a955b588b3877cc52\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000900\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002258f935f1-6646-40ab-9d99-17029396850c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002252a48b2acc81444a955b588b3877cc52\u0022\u003EHon JULIE ANNE GENTER (Green\u2014Rongotai):\u003C/span\u003E Well, I think this debate has demonstrated very clearly, sadly, the dream of some sort of sensible, evidence-based discussion across parties that would result in some consensus around effective policies to achieve outcomes that are good for New Zealand, whether you believe in climate change or not. Now, I think it\u2019s pretty safe to say, based on the actions of the Government parties, that there are not many people on the Government benches who actually believe climate change is a real problem and one that we need to do anything about.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000901\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002258f935f1-6646-40ab-9d99-17029396850c\u0022\u003EEven if we didn\u2019t think climate change was a problem\u2014which is a completely ridiculous position to have after Cyclone Gabrielle and all the many events that have happened across the globe over the last few years\u2014switching to electric vehicles makes pure economic sense\u00A0for New Zealand. They use 40\u00A0percent less energy than fossil fuel vehicles and one of our largest imports is oil\u2014petrol and diesel\u2014to run our cars and trucks. Anything we can do to use less energy to move people and goods, and anything we can do to reduce the energy that we use from fossil fuels, actually is a productivity gain to New Zealand. We produce most of our electricity off clean, renewable sources here in New Zealand already, and therefore in New Zealand there\u2019s quite a significant reduction in fossil fuels from electric vehicles.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000902\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002258f935f1-6646-40ab-9d99-17029396850c\u0022\u003EEven if we didn\u2019t care about the carbon impact\u2014which we should\u2014it would make sense, and when we look at the countries in the world that have had large uptake, and Norway is the leader in this in electric vehicles, it\u2019s very clear how they did it. Norway is actually very comparable to New Zealand in many respects, because they have a lot of rural areas. They have some remote rural areas. They actually have a much more extreme climate than New Zealand, and they have a similar population, but they have, very clearly now, more electric vehicles than fossil fuel vehicles. They\u2019ve achieved it in a very rapid amount of time and it is first and foremost due to a substantial package of incentives developed to promote zero-emissions vehicles into the market. It was done through tax exemptions, because Norway has very large taxes on all the vehicles they import, and now they have much larger taxes on fossil fuel vehicles. The higher-emitting the vehicle, the higher the tax.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000903\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002258f935f1-6646-40ab-9d99-17029396850c\u0022\u003EThey also have farmers and tradies in Norway and yet somehow they have a tax incentive system for vehicles which has resulted in very, very high uptake of electric vehicles. This is very beneficial for many reasons. They also have high renewable electricity generation and so they get the same benefits of clean electricity powering their vehicles\u201440\u00A0percent energy reduction for moving people and goods by those vehicles, because they\u2019re electric, and you get cleaner air. It\u2019s just one of those situations\u2014like, there\u2019s a big reduction in particulate matter. There\u2019s no significant difference in resource depletion. We know there are all these benefits.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000904\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002258f935f1-6646-40ab-9d99-17029396850c\u0022\u003EThis bill was a policy that the National Party had in their manifesto in 2020. We\u2019ve got the Motor Industry Association and the New Zealand Automobile Association who previously promoted this policy. It\u2019s not like just a Green policy; it\u2019s actually one that is\u00A0widely supported across the industry and particularly people working in electric vehicle charging, because they know we need a rapid increase in demand for electric vehicles.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000905\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002258f935f1-6646-40ab-9d99-17029396850c\u0022\u003ENow, the case for Government intervention is very, very clear. Climate change is market failure, and I really have to emphasise this point. It is very, very clear for the people who are currently in charge of our Government. There is no awareness, no knowledge of the existential threat of climate change and the huge opportunities to get better outcomes for all New Zealanders through taking practical, evidence-based actions that would lead to a change in the vehicles we use, the way we get around, the way we build our homes. The way we do everything has to change and these dinosaurs on the other side of the House are actively taking us backwards in time in a way that\u2019s just going to cost us more. I say shame\u2014shame on this Government and their climate denialism.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca id=\u002222e00300136c4394883098877dada407\u0022 name=\u0022division\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EA party vote was called for on the question, That the Income Tax (Clean Transport FBT Exclusion) Amendment Bill be now read a first time.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EAyes 55\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand Labour 34; Green Party of Aotearoa New Zealand 15; Te P\u0101ti M\u0101ori\u00A06.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENoes 68\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand National 49; ACT New Zealand 11; New Zealand First 8.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EMotion not agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n    \u003C/div\u003E\n    \u003Cdiv class=\u0022HpsHansard\u0022\u003E\n      \u003Cp\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsProceedingHeading\u0022\u003EBills\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000906\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u002265979a918b0a4e9aa6b93ef4c66ef144\u0022\u003ECrimes (Increased Penalties for Slavery Offences) Amendment Bill\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000907\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u0022b748599e19544af58eabaeb74dd21e33\u0022\u003EFirst Reading\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00221573c6f8-999b-434d-8bde-a47a586ee0f0\u0022 data-id=\u0022fae4ed4d05714b48bb04e5b0b3b6e959\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000908\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221573c6f8-999b-434d-8bde-a47a586ee0f0\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022fae4ed4d05714b48bb04e5b0b3b6e959\u0022\u003EGREG FLEMING (National\u2014Maungakiekie):\u003C/span\u003E I move, That the Crimes (Increased Penalties for Slavery Offences) Amendment Bill be now read a first time. I nominate the Justice Committee to consider the bill.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000909\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221573c6f8-999b-434d-8bde-a47a586ee0f0\u0022\u003EI said from this seat, about three hours ago, that I like Wednesdays. It was in the context of speaking to the memorable and historic citizenship of Samoa bill, and I reflected on many things I like about Wednesdays, including the fact that I start and end with karakia. Another thing that I like about Wednesdays is that it\u2019s members\u2019 day, and I am hugely honoured to be standing here for the first time moving a bill. But, as exciting as this is for me, it\u2019s not nearly as exciting as it is for Kaylee Hill, who\u2019s in the gallery tonight\u2014and I\u2019ll be speaking more about her and her friend Alex Prendergast soon. They have waited 3\u00BD years for this day.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000910\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221573c6f8-999b-434d-8bde-a47a586ee0f0\u0022\u003EThis morning, my day began with co-hosting with my colleague Camilla Belich a gathering of UNICEF young adults. They were encouraging all of the members of this House on a number of issues, as were the World Vision ambassadors that I also had the\u00A0privilege of co-hosting four hours later on the steps of Parliament. Both of them, amongst other things, called for us as a Parliament to take serious action, more strong action, on human trafficking and on modern slavery. This bill is the first step, I hope, in that strengthening.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000911\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221573c6f8-999b-434d-8bde-a47a586ee0f0\u0022\u003EThe TIP report\u2014that is the Trafficking in Persons Report\u2014is an annual report, issued by the US Department of State, assessing countries\u2019 efforts to combat human trafficking, ranking them into tiers based on their compliance with international anti-trafficking standards. It provides detailed country summaries, including recommendations, while also serving as a tool for advocacy, accountability, and global awareness on human-trafficking issues. For 17 years, New Zealand was ranked a tier 1 country. However, in 2021, our country was downgraded to tier 2. The Government had failed to do enough to recognise and combat the growing issue while neglecting to meet our international obligations. We, therefore, need to urgently strengthen our approach to human trafficking. Now, the TIP report critiques us in three areas. The first one is that our country is currently failing to meet the prosecution requirements\u2014simply meaning that our Government has maintained, in the views of the TIP authors, inadequate anti-trafficking law enforcement efforts.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000912\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221573c6f8-999b-434d-8bde-a47a586ee0f0\u0022\u003ENow, this amendment bill that I\u2019m moving tonight began in 2021, the same year as New Zealand\u2019s downgrade, when two Rolleston high school students\u2014Alex Prendergast and Kaylee Hill\u2014approached their local MP, Nicola Grigg, as part of a school project that they had done when they had found an anomaly in section 98AA of the Crimes Act 1961. These are the areas of the Crimes Act under which the exploitation of labour\u2014that is to say, domestic human slavery\u2014would be prosecuted. They found, much to their surprise and certainly to everyone else that encountered it, that there was a discrepancy in there, whereby there was a harsher penalty available for international trafficking and human exploitation than there was domestic. Their bill proposed an alignment of those offences and of the available prosecution.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000913\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221573c6f8-999b-434d-8bde-a47a586ee0f0\u0022\u003EWhen I became an MP, it was my privilege to take that bill on, and I guess I was as surprised as anybody when it got pulled out of the biscuit tin earlier this year. On my first detailed reading of it, I realised that what we had here was not only an important piece of legislation in its own right but an opportunity to be able to do something far more significant in terms of addressing the deficiencies of our current laws as they pertain to human trafficking.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000914\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221573c6f8-999b-434d-8bde-a47a586ee0f0\u0022\u003EWhile this is an excellent starting point to meeting the recommendations made in the TIP report, it alone is not enough to reclaim our place in tier 1. Therefore, I and Kaylee have already drafted additional amendments to add to the current proposed bill, which will further address this country\u2019s currently inadequate anti-trafficking law enforcement efforts. These additional amendments will specifically address sections 98B, 98D, and 98E, and we\u2019re looking forward to working out the full detail of those.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000915\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221573c6f8-999b-434d-8bde-a47a586ee0f0\u0022\u003EWith an eye on the clock, I won\u2019t take the House\u2019s time up on this now. What I do want to do is pay credit to a number of new friends and colleagues who have provided fantastic input and counsel on this bill\u2014it was particularly on the amendments that we have in mind but also in some companion legislation that my colleague Camilla Belich and I have begun to co-author\u2014Rebekah Armstrong at World Vision; Natalia Szablewska, who\u2019s a professor in law and society; Keir Duncan, a solicitor at Meredith Connell; Rebecca Kingi, who is a trafficking-in-persons specialist and ESG initiatives lead at ANZ Bank; Jacob Parry, barrister and former Crown prosecutor and partner at Meredith Connell; Clayton Walker, Crown prosecutor and partner at Elvidge\u2019s, who is the office of the Crown solicitor at Napier; and Rebecca Thompson, Crown counsel at the Crown Law Office. Each of those people have put in a substantial amount of time in recent years and are enormously excited about the fact that this bill is under way this evening.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000916\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002202e74c40-9529-4e15-adc2-c032eadc2205\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022d65fe46d0b4241ed972c2b9f3a3e8e5b\u0022\u003EASSISTANT SPEAKER (Greg O\u2019Connor)\u003C/span\u003E: I\u2019ll just remind the member, the House can go until five past\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000917\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022158c7dc7577e44b19efcbe09025927da\u0022\u003EHon Member\u003C/span\u003E: You can take your full time.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000918\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002202e74c40-9529-4e15-adc2-c032eadc2205\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00222ff28d8e9c284f99a72165dd951fa241\u0022\u003EASSISTANT SPEAKER (Greg O\u2019Connor)\u003C/span\u003E: \u2014though you can take a full call.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000919\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221573c6f8-999b-434d-8bde-a47a586ee0f0\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022ce9bec30ac784f569efe11cfebce9c02\u0022\u003EGREG FLEMING\u003C/span\u003E: Oh, it\u2019s OK\u2014this bill will be running for several months, but thank you, Mr Speaker.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000920\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221573c6f8-999b-434d-8bde-a47a586ee0f0\u0022\u003EBecause this bill began with Kaylee and Alex, and because Kaylee has done so much research to date and continues to, I\u2019ve given her the final word, and so I quote: \u201CAs a country that prides itself on values of fairness, justice, and human dignity, we have a moral and legal obligation to not only meet but exceed our commitments to combating human trafficking. The reality is that human trafficking thrives in the shadows, and without a steadfast commitment to comprehensive prevention, protection, and prosecution efforts, vulnerable individuals will continue to suffer in silence without receiving adequate justice under our system. Our response to trafficking is not just a matter of international ranking or diplomatic standing; it is a reflection of our national identity. To ensure a future where all individuals are free from exploitation and harm, we must embrace the urgency of this issue, acting decisively and with compassion to fulfil our responsibility to not only our own citizens but our global community.\u201D I commend this bill to the House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002202e74c40-9529-4e15-adc2-c032eadc2205\u0022 data-id=\u0022bbc839f03338447a885031b51485056c\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000921\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002202e74c40-9529-4e15-adc2-c032eadc2205\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022bbc839f03338447a885031b51485056c\u0022\u003EASSISTANT SPEAKER (Greg O\u2019Connor)\u003C/span\u003E: This debate is interrupted and set down for resumption next sitting day. The House stands adjourned until 2\u00A0p.m. tomorrow.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000922\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002202e74c40-9529-4e15-adc2-c032eadc2205\u0022\u003EDebate interrupted.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000923\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002202e74c40-9529-4e15-adc2-c032eadc2205\u0022\u003EThe House adjourned at 9.59\u00A0p.m.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id2024112094b5904054264e8396119f0ec81f9fc8000924\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002202e74c40-9529-4e15-adc2-c032eadc2205\u0022\u003E\u003Cbr\u003E\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n    \u003C/div\u003E\n  \u003C/body\u003E\n\u003C/html\u003E"