"\u003C!DOCTYPE html\u003E\u003Chtml xmlns:xlink=\u0022http://www.w3.org/1999/xlink\u0022 xmlns:xsi=\u0022http://www.w3.org/2007/XMLSchema-instance\u0022 xmlns:mml=\u0022http://www.w3.org/1998/Math/MathML\u0022\u003E\n  \u003Chead\u003E\n    \u003CMETA http-equiv=\u0022Content-Type\u0022 content=\u0022text/html; charset=utf-16\u0022\u003E\n    \u003Cmeta name=\u0022viewport\u0022 content=\u0022width=device-width, initial-scale=1\u0022\u003E\n  \u003C/head\u003E\n  \u003Cbody style=\u0022font-family:sans-serif; font-size:100%;\u0022\u003E\n    \u003Cdiv class=\u0022HpsHansard\u0022\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000001\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsProceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u00229c674c375b9e4ec082d175b5c582844f\u0022\u003ETUESDAY, 17 DECEMBER 2024\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000003\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u00222ce557e86e434751b51dfba8fbf989a8\u0022\u003ETUESDAY, 17 DECEMBER 2024\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000002\u0022\u003EThe Speaker took the Chair at 2 p.m.\u003C/p\u003E\n    \u003C/div\u003E\n    \u003Cdiv class=\u0022HpsHansard\u0022\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000004\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsProceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u0022778d28799b9a4035af5e2f8000f673f2\u0022\u003EKarakia/Prayers\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000006\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u00228ba126bd7da54f9695d536efe50a2061\u0022\u003EKarakia/Prayers\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002261720d2e-5b1d-4742-b4f0-30424316ccc1\u0022 data-id=\u0022a8ee31b1d33d4d1cb97fefff8a36e012\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000005\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002261720d2e-5b1d-4742-b4f0-30424316ccc1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022a8ee31b1d33d4d1cb97fefff8a36e012\u0022\u003EBARBARA KURIGER (Deputy Speaker):\u003C/span\u003E Almighty God, we give thanks for the blessings which have been bestowed on us. Laying aside all personal interests, we acknowledge the King and pray for guidance in our deliberations, that we may conduct the affairs of this House with wisdom, justice, mercy, and humility for the welfare and peace of New Zealand. Amen.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n    \u003C/div\u003E\n    \u003Cdiv class=\u0022HpsHansard\u0022\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000007\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsProceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u0022c3b1dd6be51542308a0e8bbdc6000ef3\u0022\u003EPETITIONS, PAPERS, SELECT COMMITTEE REPORTS, AND INTRODUCTION OF BILLS\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000009\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u0022fc53de13124f4deb959a3b8794edb6dc\u0022\u003EPETITIONS, PAPERS, SELECT COMMITTEE REPORTS, AND INTRODUCTION OF BILLS\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022 data-id=\u00229fefc49edec74cfcbffcaadbe10466f8\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000008\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00229fefc49edec74cfcbffcaadbe10466f8\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Three petitions have been delivered to the Clerk for presentation.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022\u0022 data-id=\u00222b5325aea89a471e8d83bbb0c6b0453c\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000010\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00222b5325aea89a471e8d83bbb0c6b0453c\u0022\u003ECLERK\u003C/span\u003E:\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000011\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022\u0022\u003EPetition of Carlo Jaminola requesting that the House urge the Government to grant international qualified nurses (IQN) who have obtained their annual practicing certificate a 3-year open work visa, and limit the flow of IQN coming to New Zealand \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000012\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022\u0022\u003Epetition of Shinichi Yamada requesting that the House urge the Government to advocate that the Japanese Government stops running 12 nuclear reactors in the southern part of Japan\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000013\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022\u0022\u003Epetition of Maher Nazzal requesting that, on behalf of NZ All Out for Gaza, the House urge the Government to join South Africa\u2019s International Court of Justice case against Israel, sanction Israel and their supporters violating international law, recognise Palestinian statehood, and increase humanitarian aid funding to the United Nations Relief \u0026amp; Works Agency.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022 data-id=\u0022eaae65ef1b974681acdc5381b881c4fb\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000014\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022eaae65ef1b974681acdc5381b881c4fb\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Those petitions stand referred to the Petitions Committee. Ministers have delivered 13 papers.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022\u0022 data-id=\u00226841b373c5554a91a8c53a66823856e6\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000015\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00226841b373c5554a91a8c53a66823856e6\u0022\u003ECLERK\u003C/span\u003E: \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000016\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022\u0022\u003EGovernment responses on the:\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBItemSL1\u0022\u003Ereport of the Environment Committee on the petition of Hannah Blumhardt\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBItemSL1\u0022\u003Ereport of the Environment Committee on the petition of Lydia Chai\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBItemSL1\u0022\u003Epetition of Seiji Tonouchi\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000017\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022\u0022\u003E2023-24 annual reports:\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBItemSL1\u0022\u003ENetwork for Learning Limited\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBItemSL1\u0022\u003ENew Zealand Conservation Authority\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBItemSL1\u0022\u003EQueen Elizabeth the Second National Trust\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBItemSL1\u0022\u003EWhakaata M\u0101ori\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000018\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022\u0022\u003Eerratum to the New Zealand Film Commission annual report 2024\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000019\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022\u0022\u003E2024-2028 strategic intentions for the Social Investment Agency\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000020\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022\u0022\u003E2024-2028 statement of intent for Pharmac\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000021\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022\u0022\u003E2024-2025 amendment to the statement of performance expectations for the Electricity Authority\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000022\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022\u0022\u003Ereport to the Ministry for the Environment on New Zealand\u2019s first emissions reduction plan: Amendment 2024, and Our journey towards net zero: New Zealand\u2019s second emissions reduction plan 2026-30, and the Technical Annex.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022 data-id=\u00228beeca9541524f8eb140a3cf2acad88c\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000023\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00228beeca9541524f8eb140a3cf2acad88c\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: I present an optional protocol to the convention against torture report of the Ombudsman on examination of the Prisoners of Extreme Risk Unit under the Crimes of Torture Act 1989. Those papers are published under the authority of the House. Fifteen select committee reports have been delivered for presentation.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022\u0022 data-id=\u00228062f468744d4615b28fcde25c57ddf9\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000024\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00228062f468744d4615b28fcde25c57ddf9\u0022\u003ECLERK\u003C/span\u003E: \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000025\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022\u0022\u003EReports of the Environment Committee on the:\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBItemSL3\u0022\u003Epetition of Aaron Joyes \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBItemSL3\u0022\u003Epetition of Brigitte Sistig \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBItemSL3\u0022\u003Epetition of James Hita\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBItemSL3\u0022\u003Epetition of Niki Gladding\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBItemSL3\u0022\u003Ereport of the Parliamentary Commissioner for the Environment: Knowing what\u2019s out there: Regulating the environmental fate of chemicals\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBItemSL3\u0022\u003Ereport of the Parliamentary Commissioner for the Environment: Wellbeing budgets and the environment: A promised land?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBItemSL3\u0022\u003Ereport of the Parliamentary Commissioner for the Environment: Environmental reporting, research and investment: Do we know if we\u2019re making a difference? \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBItemSL3\u0022\u003Ereport of the Parliamentary Commissioner for the Environment: Estimate of environmental expenditure 2019/20: Method and results, October 2022\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBItemSL2\u0022\u003Ereports of the Justice Committee:\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBItemSL1\u0022\u003EDistrict Court (District Court Judges) Amendment Bill \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBItemSL1\u0022\u003Epetition of Josiah Tualamali\u2019i: Inquiry into solutions for youth justice\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBItemSL1\u0022\u003Epetition of Sunny Kaushal\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBItemSL1\u0022\u003Ereview briefing on the 2022-23 annual review of the Serious Fraud Office\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000026\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022\u0022\u003Ereports of the Petitions Committee:\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBItemSL1\u0022\u003Epetition of Epilepsy Waikato Charitable Trust \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBItemSL1\u0022\u003Epetition of Public Health Association New Zealand\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBItemSL1\u0022\u003Ereport of the Social Services and Community Committee on the petition of Joseph Griffen\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000027\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022\u0022\u003Ereports of the Transport and Infrastructure Committee: \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBItemSL1\u0022\u003ELand Transport (Drug Driving) Amendment Bill\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBItemSL1\u0022\u003Ereport of the Attorney-General under the New Zealand Bill of Rights Act 1990.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022 data-id=\u002289ba7254985347e186029660264e23c1\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000028\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002289ba7254985347e186029660264e23c1\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: The bills are set down for second reading. The Report of the Attorney-General, Reports of the Parliamentary Commissioner for the Environment, and the review briefings are set down for consideration. The Clerk\u2019s been informed of the introduction of a bill. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022\u0022 data-id=\u0022053fb9cbe8a841c7b69f2807cfb9b2f2\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000029\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022053fb9cbe8a841c7b69f2807cfb9b2f2\u0022\u003ECLERK\u003C/span\u003E: The Land Transport Management (Time of Use Charging) Amendment Bill, introduction.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n    \u003C/div\u003E\n    \u003Cdiv class=\u0022HpsHansard\u0022\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000030\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsProceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u0022dcb388fd28d74812aee875521d07208b\u0022\u003EUrgent Debates\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000031\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u0022f84bfa59f3314c5e8bf2ab2c9e8fadce\u0022\u003EHalf Year Economic and Fiscal Update 2024\u2014Release\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022 data-id=\u00225508cf3786c441798d414b120c43f548\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000032\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00225508cf3786c441798d414b120c43f548\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Members, I\u2019ve received a letter from the Hon Barbara Edmonds seeking to debate under Standing Order 399 the release of the Half Year Economic and Fiscal Update (HYEFU). Normally, urgent debate applications must be received an hour before the House sits. The Speaker has discretion to consider applications received after that time but before the House sits\u2014Standing Order 399 and Speakers\u2019 Ruling 215/1. The HYEFU was released at 1 p.m. and the application received shortly afterwards, so I\u2019ve considered it. This is a particular case of recent occurrence for which there is ministerial responsibility. While not every release of Budget information will give rise to an urgent debate, the application today warrants setting aside the business of the House. Therefore, after oral questions, I\u2019ll call on the Hon Barbara Edmonds to move that the House take note of a matter of urgent public importance.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n    \u003C/div\u003E\n    \u003Cdiv class=\u0022HpsHansard\u0022\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000033\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsProceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u00222f22135c302640b6a2765b0206650259\u0022\u003EOral Questions\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000034\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u00227ffa367a1edb4d41912d7570ef6e40f7\u0022\u003EQuestions to Ministers\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000035\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u0022e600af5b1e8245aa9ec01333c094ab7a\u0022\u003EQuestion No. 1\u2014Workplace Relations and Safety\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00228f20b644-642a-4c85-ade9-d5af32dc690b\u0022 data-id=\u0022f5e384f1caae4f578e6df370dec8258c\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000036\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00228f20b644-642a-4c85-ade9-d5af32dc690b\u0022\u003E1. \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022f5e384f1caae4f578e6df370dec8258c\u0022\u003ELAURA McCLURE (ACT)\u003C/span\u003E to the Minister for Workplace Relations and Safety: What recent announcements has she made in her workplace relations and safety portfolio?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002266f06e7e-afa8-457f-a105-048b86a13282\u0022 data-id=\u0022da7def9f15a840dda19db134362e1397\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000037\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002266f06e7e-afa8-457f-a105-048b86a13282\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022da7def9f15a840dda19db134362e1397\u0022\u003EHon BROOKE VAN VELDEN (Minister for Workplace Relations and Safety):\u003C/span\u003E This coalition Government has been working hard in the lead-up to Christmas and I\u2019m pleased to share it has been a busy month for my workplace relations and safety portfolio. Over the past month, I\u2019ve announced a high income threshold for unjustified dismissal personal grievances, the removal of remedies for personal grievances in cases where the employee contributed to the grievance, the reintroduction of wage deductions for partial strikes, I\u2019ve asked my officials to develop an hours-based accrual system for annual leave, and today I announced the new minimum wage rate for 2025 in order to give businesses certainty leading into the new year. Together, these changes will help rebalance the employment relations landscape. [Interruption]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000038\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022c58d7b22ce724eaa95ddcc7529615ea3\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Can you just stop for a minute. Now, that constant barrage across the House is not acceptable. Rare and reasonable was the deal. The Minister will continue.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000039\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002266f06e7e-afa8-457f-a105-048b86a13282\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002259aa47e454e0417d9377ae80d2f358f6\u0022\u003EHon BROOKE VAN VELDEN\u003C/span\u003E: Thank you. Together, these changes will help rebalance the employment relations landscape, make it easier to hire workers, and reduce compliance costs so that both workers and employers can focus on what they do best.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000040\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00228f20b644-642a-4c85-ade9-d5af32dc690b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00226a9155bb810548a49b6ab1890daf87f4\u0022\u003ELaura McClure\u003C/span\u003E: How will your announced changes affect employers?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000041\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002266f06e7e-afa8-457f-a105-048b86a13282\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022cde39c4c6bf744b3a7985b136b6e2e58\u0022\u003EHon BROOKE VAN VELDEN\u003C/span\u003E: I\u2019ve met a lot of employers up and down the country, and I know that these changes will be welcomed by many. Dealing with vexatious personal grievances can be extremely stressful for employers, who can find themselves facing large and unanticipated costs. An employer\u2019s own wellbeing and reputation can be harmed throughout the grievance process, yet for employers there is no recourse. Reintroducing wage deductions for partial strikes will be particularly welcomed by employers with workers in customer-serving industries, where it is often the public that suffer as a consequence of partial strikes. And employers have welcomed the decision I\u2019ve made to scrap the previous Government\u2019s approach to fixing the Holidays Act and pursue a much simpler and more workable path of an hours-based accrual to annual leave.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000042\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00228f20b644-642a-4c85-ade9-d5af32dc690b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002240142665af6d452a9fc1bc11eb986020\u0022\u003ELaura McClure\u003C/span\u003E: So how will your announced changes affect workers?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000043\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002266f06e7e-afa8-457f-a105-048b86a13282\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022153bc16182c34baaa25fbb760b59edb4\u0022\u003EHon BROOKE VAN VELDEN\u003C/span\u003E: These changes recognise and reward the hard-working, aspirational Kiwis out there who are doing their best to make a good living for themselves and the people they care about. The changes to personal grievances will improve workplace culture and morale. Many workers will be able to recall a time they\u2019ve had to work with a difficult\u2014[Interruption]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000044\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002250ce7183567d44c0bd70ebc06611dbcf\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: The Minister will just stop. I just spoke to the House about the constant barrage of interjections, none of which are reasonable, and they are certainly not rare. I point the House to Speaker\u2019s ruling 65/2 by Assistant Speaker Robertson and Speaker Wilson and suggest that that is the course that we\u2019re going to follow. The Minister can start the answer again.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000045\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002266f06e7e-afa8-457f-a105-048b86a13282\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00228109fd414c2841d3b659913cdb1a50a5\u0022\u003EHon BROOKE VAN VELDEN\u003C/span\u003E: These changes recognise and reward the hard-working, aspirational Kiwis out there who are doing their best to make a good living for themselves and the people they care about. The changes to personal grievances will improve workplace culture and morale. Many workers will be able to recall a time they\u2019ve had to work with a difficult employee or manager. This change is for workers who find it galling that the worst behaviour or mediocre performance receives a financial payout. An hours-based accrual system for annual leave will reduce the risk of underpayment that has plagued the current Holidays Act, and the 1.5 percent increase to the minimum wage rate that I\u2019ve announced today will make sure young people continue to have the opportunity to get their first job, enjoy their newfound sense of responsibility, and build those necessary life skills that will take them far in their career ahead.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000046\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002268d211b815f14ddfb3a9fd2e7ef6b46c\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Yeah, order is helped by Ministers being concise in their answers.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000047\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u00222eeefd7454874f6f89d0fb1b08d600b4\u0022\u003EQuestion No. 2\u2014Prime Minister\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022 data-id=\u00224f51cf7f7d2f4ed387e6e51055ce4b4e\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000048\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003E2. \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00224f51cf7f7d2f4ed387e6e51055ce4b4e\u0022\u003ERt Hon CHRIS HIPKINS (Leader of the Opposition)\u003C/span\u003E to the Prime Minister: Does he stand by all his Government\u2019s statements and actions? \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022ea31fdd3-90e9-47d7-92a4-20b6a3109eef\u0022 data-id=\u002295acd7a6721a4553bbf8a3380f3ae121\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000049\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ea31fdd3-90e9-47d7-92a4-20b6a3109eef\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002295acd7a6721a4553bbf8a3380f3ae121\u0022\u003ERt Hon CHRISTOPHER LUXON (Prime Minister):\u003C/span\u003E Yes, and especially our work to complete our latest quarterly action plan. In the last three months, we\u2019ve completed 42 actions designed to lift New Zealand\u2019s economic performance, restore law and order, and improve the public services that all of us rely upon. This quarter, that included a massive package of changes to the Resource Management Act designed to unlock growth and investment by slashing red tape for farmers and the primary sector, unlocking regionally and nationally significant projects through fast track\u2014it\u2019s still not too late for the other side to support it\u2014and introducing fresh changes designed to unleash investment, housing, energy infrastructure, and farmers. This Government is working hard to make sure that we deliver for New Zealanders, and I want to say thank you to all my hard-working Ministers and the officials, who have been up all day and night making sure we unleash fast track on New Zealand. [Interruption]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000050\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022cb701e19aca34a25be40e73a5297a808\u0022\u003ERt Hon Chris Hipkins\u003C/span\u003E: Supplementary question, Mr Speaker\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000051\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00226f45048531d24d16941193efd9060f55\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: No, just wait until your own side settles down. The Rt Hon Chris Hipkins. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000052\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00221208137cc2ce4981bf5b2e82b37342e0\u0022\u003ERt Hon Chris Hipkins\u003C/span\u003E: So who is correct, then: the Prime Minister, who says that his whole Government is relentlessly focused on his quarterly action plan, or his Deputy Prime Minister, who says\u2014and I quote\u2014\u201CI don\u2019t have this sort of dashboard crap that I see other people perform on and a 50-point plan, or a 100-point plan, or a quarter-year plan\u201D, and if Winston Peters thinks that his plans are crap, why should Kiwis think otherwise? \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000053\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ea31fdd3-90e9-47d7-92a4-20b6a3109eef\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a5300dca2054486abb139533ecc54414\u0022\u003ERt Hon CHRISTOPHER LUXON\u003C/span\u003E: Well, I just want to say what a fantastic Deputy Prime Minister we have, because not only did he complete his two actions in the quarter four action plan\u2014[Interruption]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000054\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002294bbcc58598444e98a10c917fc324902\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: No, hang on. Wait on. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000055\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ea31fdd3-90e9-47d7-92a4-20b6a3109eef\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00225c52e880a4d14c6c98e6456201533c8d\u0022\u003ERt Hon CHRISTOPHER LUXON\u003C/span\u003E: \u2014on the racing industry\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000056\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002284b4d39257f74a29921ca4b880ed401e\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Excuse me\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000057\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ea31fdd3-90e9-47d7-92a4-20b6a3109eef\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022d999f79f838a4125bbb17187913b30a1\u0022\u003ERt Hon CHRISTOPHER LUXON\u003C/span\u003E: \u2014and around knocking off\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000058\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022d96be856b5b24832990183c82641ec5f\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Prime Minister. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000059\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ea31fdd3-90e9-47d7-92a4-20b6a3109eef\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002262b1b5331a9e4baeba89f97f1976d1da\u0022\u003ERt Hon CHRISTOPHER LUXON\u003C/span\u003E: \u2014greyhounds; he did a brilliant job\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000060\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002295a914e39c244f30987656feaf4127c2\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Prime Minister. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000061\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ea31fdd3-90e9-47d7-92a4-20b6a3109eef\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002226a4707adae8426f88e08667c15101f2\u0022\u003ERt Hon CHRISTOPHER LUXON\u003C/span\u003E: Sorry. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000062\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00222059b2c6e5a446c7bd91a02cb4e8d344\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Reaction to something is fine, but keeping it on like that is not. Now, I\u2019d invite you to start again, but I don\u2019t want that reaction again, so pick up where you left off, please, Prime Minister. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000063\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ea31fdd3-90e9-47d7-92a4-20b6a3109eef\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00228cedd515d8894f27a75c75cb5ba1ae59\u0022\u003ERt Hon CHRISTOPHER LUXON\u003C/span\u003E: Well, as I was saying, the Deputy Prime Minister did an excellent job of completing his two actions of the 43 in the quarter four action plan, which were to help the racing industry get ahead, and also to make sure we deal with the greyhound industry, which he did very, very effectively and very, very well. And I think, if you asked the Deputy Prime Minister, he was referencing his previous experience working with the last Government. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000064\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00227d1516fe7ead455db58305b9154852c6\u0022\u003ERt Hon Chris Hipkins\u003C/span\u003E: Why has his Government agreed to increase the fees paid to directors of Government companies by between 39 percent and 104 percent while increasing the minimum wage by less than the rate of inflation? \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000065\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ea31fdd3-90e9-47d7-92a4-20b6a3109eef\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00228db4656488f94165830d4027c6d3a011\u0022\u003ERt Hon CHRISTOPHER LUXON\u003C/span\u003E: Well, if I take the last issue first, we have found a balance with a 1.5 percent increase to the minimum wage\u2014[Interruption]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000066\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00226db53e0eb52040ca98675568aa99ca81\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: No, sorry, this has got to stop or someone is leaving, or a number will be leaving. It\u2019s unbelievably bad. Prime Minister. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000067\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ea31fdd3-90e9-47d7-92a4-20b6a3109eef\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a5a91f743e48496ea458d42ac46a4fb4\u0022\u003ERt Hon CHRISTOPHER LUXON\u003C/span\u003E: Thank you, Mr Speaker. As I would talk to minimum wage, we\u2019ve proposed a 1.5 percent increase to the minimum wage. But this is also a Government that actually cares about low and middle income working New Zealanders. Unlike the other side, who failed to support tax relief for low and middle income workers, for the first time in 14 years this Government has delivered tax relief, inflation relief, and interest rate relief. Importantly, every quarter of this Government, wages have grown faster than prices, unlike the 13 quarters in a row under the previous administration. So we care about working New Zealanders, on this side. We\u2019re supporting them with FamilyBoost and supporting them with Working for Family credits and tax relief. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000068\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022cb47b550b4754a14942f8a3a4ef65926\u0022\u003ERt Hon Chris Hipkins\u003C/span\u003E: So why\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000069\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002261341ffe20b14468bf03d2dfa6f6a5d7\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: No, no\u2014hang on. There\u2019s a lot of people on your own side talking while you\u2019re starting. Just wait until the House is quiet, and the House\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000070\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002202ee7ac9197a4452980e25fb7416e294\u0022\u003ERt Hon Chris Hipkins\u003C/span\u003E: Point of order, Mr Speaker. If the Prime Minister actually addressed the questions that were asked, rather than giving a long speech about things unrelated to the question, there might be less interjection on this side of the House. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000071\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002290d55089855e43318ef1a893ff7a1fb4\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Well\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000072\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022bf36c23495e242859c369d7e1cebf429\u0022\u003ERt Hon Chris Hipkins\u003C/span\u003E: Order in the House goes both ways, Mr Speaker. If you\u2019d like order on this side, you might want to make sure that side is also complying with the rules. [Interruption]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000073\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002221d444e517c2420182b724d2c54bfd32\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Just a moment. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000074\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f44431ef-b505-4e94-9f57-a60b0a569bf7\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a346e99ea0394fed9aa60aa73ff1cd86\u0022\u003EHon Shane Jones\u003C/span\u003E: Three strikes. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000075\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022fdb48e5ea7ba48048d4cdb93c1d94463\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Excuse me. The member might like to reflect on his own question: \u201CDoes he stand by all the Government\u2019s statements and actions?\u201D That leaves it open to anything and any answer from that point. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000076\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022d9bdf1d27cd64f5c8e1364d17b695f72\u0022\u003ERt Hon Chris Hipkins\u003C/span\u003E: Point of order, Mr Speaker. That\u2019s a very new ruling; one that\u2019s not consistent with any\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000077\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022c5494e353b74447fba93a6e2c9a360b0\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: No, it\u2019s not a new ruling. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000078\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022e05952dcf9e84b41904dc9d0d2cc63d4\u0022\u003ERt Hon Chris Hipkins\u003C/span\u003E: \u2014other Speakers\u2019 rulings in the past. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000079\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00229024e9da3e1d4f7fa4f3fa70ecd5bda2\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: It\u2019s not a new ruling. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000080\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022eea43f2e83164b328626ff823ebaf9df\u0022\u003ERt Hon Chris Hipkins\u003C/span\u003E: A supplementary question that is quite specific is still a specific supplementary question. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000081\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a4db9fe0f0a94ce7be02368ef94d40c7\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Well, look, that might be the member\u2019s view, but I\u2019ve heard Speakers\u2014many Speakers\u2014talk about the open nature of that particular question, which is a feature of today\u2019s question time: \u201CDoes he stand by all his Government\u2019s statements and actions?\u201D That would assume that he can talk about anything that the Government has done: actions and statements. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000082\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002282b821dd124c4108ac6bdaabf9fd9104\u0022\u003ERt Hon Chris Hipkins\u003C/span\u003E: Well, point of order, Mr Speaker. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000083\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00223ad2a356af2c4132b3e2562dcbd01448\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: You\u2019re speaking to your point of order. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000084\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00224cb3d6233efa4e0ab2b89019cddf1ab1\u0022\u003ERt Hon Chris Hipkins\u003C/span\u003E: Yeah, a further point of order, Mr Speaker. If I place a more specific question to the Prime Minister at a future question time, will you ensure that it cannot be transferred to another Minister? \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000085\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022e771b9f6bc4c4479b391cdb912e3f229\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Well, unfortunately, the Standing Orders allow the Government to do that. The member is welcome to have his representatives on the Standing Orders Committee raise that, along with the other six matters that the Standing Orders Committee is currently dealing with for matters that are of contention in the House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000086\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022b4ef02b66877447ab7c8c592654a749d\u0022\u003ERt Hon Chris Hipkins\u003C/span\u003E: Well, a new point of order, Mr Speaker. You may be aware that the Standing Orders Committee has previously discussed whether questions should be specifically allocated to the Prime Minister and there should be a set number of those, and it was the National Party that blocked that.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000087\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022aa0f27fbdd8945fc8bdb14d4a0ec9dd1\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Well, I\u2019m sure that\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000088\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002257e41e9d-285b-4fb3-847d-a63820ae7137\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022cf834d9d5b4645c0b81d2ea493abe825\u0022\u003EHon Chris Bishop\u003C/span\u003E: That\u2019s not right\u2014that\u2019s just not right.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000089\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022649882d400c3440f872d09bd39a43f07\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Excuse me! Thank you. The Leader of the House is not immune to the prospect of being asked to leave. Don\u2019t speak whilst points of order are being taken. I\u2019m sure that the member will be aware of the convention\u2014which, apparently, are very, very important here\u2014that one Parliament is not bound by another. So I\u2019m sure that if the member\u2019s people brought that to the Standing Orders Committee, it would get a fair hearing.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000090\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002225030fb8c39641818fe4891268d43981\u0022\u003ERt Hon Chris Hipkins\u003C/span\u003E: Why is it that under his Government, minimum wage workers\u00A0have to tighten their belts with a real-terms pay cut while company directors get a 100 percent pay rise?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000091\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ea31fdd3-90e9-47d7-92a4-20b6a3109eef\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022d7fd6190fcff44a1bb3e0b7dbfa83348\u0022\u003ERt Hon CHRISTOPHER LUXON\u003C/span\u003E: As I said, we\u2019ve talked about minimum wage workers. There\u2019s a 1.5 percent increase, along with income tax relief, along with FamilyBoost, along with Working for Families credits. With respect to professional directors that we\u2019re asking to run some of our largest entities, they are not paid market rates, they won\u2019t still be, but it\u2019s actually acknowledging that we want to attract good people to make sure we have high-quality governance. I\u2019m sure the member would understand that, given the variety of messes that he left behind in the last Government. Good governance matters to deliver\u2014to deliver\u2014and get outcomes. [Interruption]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000092\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022d8d946115dfa4c25a70d6ba3d7a665af\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: I\u2019ll just make the point that that sort of response from the person answering the question does elicit a reaction, which I think is reasonable.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000093\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002266bb0c92f2b048dbaea6604fae0df500\u0022\u003ERt Hon Chris Hipkins\u003C/span\u003E: Thank you, Mr Speaker. Why are minimum wage earners having their pay cut in real terms, despite the cost of living crisis, while their power bills keep going up and the directors of Transpower, who are increasing the charges all New Zealand consumers face, get a pay increase of over 56 percent?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000094\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ea31fdd3-90e9-47d7-92a4-20b6a3109eef\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00227c81b313ad7b430b86eac39d6a8d6155\u0022\u003ERt Hon CHRISTOPHER LUXON\u003C/span\u003E: Well, I\u2019d just point to that member and say that this is a Government that has, for four quarters in a row, seen wages rise faster than prices\u2014total wages, right? So, if you think about that, under the previous administration, there were 13 quarters in a row where prices were greater than inflation. So real wages are increasing under this Government in our first 12 months. That\u2019s fantastic. You\u2019re in a situation where you see three rate cuts versus 12 rate rises\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000095\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00225f61a627c3d1448687b51e44f6dbfb92\u0022\u003ERt Hon Chris Hipkins\u003C/span\u003E: Point of order, Mr Speaker. Mr Speaker, there were admittedly two parts to that question: one concerned minimum wage workers; the other concerned directors of Transpower. I didn\u2019t ask about average wages; I asked about minimum wage workers and the directors of Transpower. The Prime Minister hasn\u2019t addressed either of those questions.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000096\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00220fa68c39542c42748615f6aaf309dedf\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Well, the Prime Minister was cut off in the middle of the answer\u2014although it was extremely long. What I would also suggest is that minimum wage is part of the average wage calculation. Prime Minister.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000097\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022bafa78064089456889f1f7708f126bf9\u0022\u003EHon David Seymour\u003C/span\u003E: Mr Speaker?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000098\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00229d5cdff3a8a54a2e83af16a7107aa6ac\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: The Prime Minister will finish the answer.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000099\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ea31fdd3-90e9-47d7-92a4-20b6a3109eef\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00229b15b63e08f34e30a40b957e50ced327\u0022\u003ERt Hon CHRISTOPHER LUXON\u003C/span\u003E: Thank you, Mr Speaker. As I\u2019ve said, we want to make sure that we get professional directors that are closer to market rates, not at market rates, to make sure that we have good governance of significant Government entities that need to deliver. That\u2019s what we\u2019re focused on.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000100\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022d0264a588a884d4d9912d914c9204363\u0022\u003ERt Hon Chris Hipkins\u003C/span\u003E: If KiwiRail did such a lousy job of managing the Interislander, why has he agreed to giving its directors a 90 percent pay increase while minimum wage workers go backwards?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000101\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ea31fdd3-90e9-47d7-92a4-20b6a3109eef\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002229e622588d7942c6b9adb199962fa4b9\u0022\u003ERt Hon CHRISTOPHER LUXON\u003C/span\u003E: Well, again, I won\u2019t get into the specifics of decisions of the board of KiwiRail around CEO pay, but what I will say is that we are determined to improve the quality of governance of our Government entities across New Zealand. It\u2019s really important. So all we\u2019re doing is we\u2019re not going to full market rates; we\u2019re just finding a pathway to make sure that we can actually attract good people to come on and do those very important roles.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000102\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002260054d6f4b584d0d8415d62d3eaf88c5\u0022\u003EHon David Seymour\u003C/span\u003E: Can the Prime Minister confirm that New Zealand\u2019s minimum wage at around 70 percent of the median wage is one of the highest in the developed world, and does he find it surprising that the Labour Party would like directors of public Government-owned companies to be paid a fraction of what private sector companies are\u00A0paid?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000103\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002297cb13809ff941fdba8f965154ad8d4c\u0022\u003ERt Hon Chris Hipkins\u003C/span\u003E: Point of order, Mr Speaker. Mr Speaker, today, you\u2019ve been very harsh on this side of the House in terms of our compliance with the Standing Orders. The minute David Seymour mentioned the Labour Party in his question, the question should have been ruled out of order. He has no responsibility for the Labour Party, and using a Government patsy question to attack the Opposition is completely out of order.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000104\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00228ac85d07d6b44409b631b335cbf016ac\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: You\u2019re quite right, and had it not been for the speed with which the member raced to his feet to take a point of order, I may well have ruled that way. I\u2019m doing so now. Leave that out; finish the question.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000105\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002281343639de4e44b3bf175fe53c689d2c\u0022\u003EHon David Seymour\u003C/span\u003E: Could I start again from the beginning, Mr Speaker?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000106\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022ad26783eba5f46d3ba3ab666876addbc\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Well, not if it\u2019s going to be the same question.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000107\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00224be99fe63f00433ba43f05dbb10b40e4\u0022\u003EHon David Seymour\u003C/span\u003E: It\u2019ll be a revised version.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000108\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00227c13ac20b017415abddb870d0e369149\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Well, a lot of revised versions cause trouble, but do your best.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000109\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002224d49ae9ae0546018e5763b61d204278\u0022\u003EHon David Seymour\u003C/span\u003E: This\u2019ll be designed to cause as little trouble as possible.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000110\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00227ac3aa6f87fc44278a30230a97fafe66\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Yeah, good.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000111\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00227fa5de7c07934f58980de34f47528242\u0022\u003EHon David Seymour\u003C/span\u003E: Does the Prime Minister\u2014[Interruption]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000112\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002286012fbd54e043048809d113b3cff8e8\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Hang on, he\u2019s asking a question.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000113\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00221b6288667d8641f395a424ed93513623\u0022\u003EHon David Seymour\u003C/span\u003E: Does the Prime Minister wish to confirm that the minimum wage in New Zealand, at around 70 percent of the median wage, is among the very highest in the developed world, and does he believe it important that publicly owned companies have directors that are remunerated at a rate that is comparable and perhaps almost competitive with the rates paid to directors of privately owned companies so they can be productive and efficient for the public?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000114\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ea31fdd3-90e9-47d7-92a4-20b6a3109eef\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022c99098a757d647d89a637008fe658593\u0022\u003ERt Hon CHRISTOPHER LUXON\u003C/span\u003E: In answer to both legs of that question, yes and\u00A0yes.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000115\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022219260fb3d8947b08cbeac46ab5c7f47\u0022\u003ERt Hon Chris Hipkins\u003C/span\u003E: Who\u2019s correct: Nicola Willis, who claims she has \u201Cdelivered\u201D new interisland ferries, despite not knowing who will build them, how much they\u2019ll cost, or who\u2019s going to pay for them; or Winston Peters, who said, \u201CThere are far more viable propositions that are yet to be considered.\u201D?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000116\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ea31fdd3-90e9-47d7-92a4-20b6a3109eef\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00227672e620ebc94d3b8516f484be56dd4e\u0022\u003ERt Hon CHRISTOPHER LUXON\u003C/span\u003E: Well, I am very proud of the value-for-money option that Nicola Willis has delivered, because it is a safe, reliable, resilient service that will be in operation in 2029: two rail-compatible ferries. But we have a new Minister for Rail and, given we\u2019ve got time to make the ultimate procurement decision, if he can improve on that: good luck.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000117\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221dbd2811-8e58-4ffb-848d-31c0eaa9690a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022dcfa864b7c824b37bf6aea0f2d4c8109\u0022\u003ERt Hon Chris Hipkins\u003C/span\u003E: Good to see them working so well together!\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000118\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022dfe9db9b07da4969817a174fe33c1e48\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Question number\u2014good, when everyone\u2019s ready.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000119\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cbr\u003E\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000120\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u0022d1aea1420abe4bd98a369ca00bf376e4\u0022\u003EQuestion No. 3\u2014Finance\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002294b52412-f97b-4bbd-8009-5dc49520f7f4\u0022 data-id=\u0022eadaef3c07e24c06b45c7bb8ab3d9563\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000121\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002294b52412-f97b-4bbd-8009-5dc49520f7f4\u0022\u003E3. \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022eadaef3c07e24c06b45c7bb8ab3d9563\u0022\u003ERYAN HAMILTON (National\u2014Hamilton East)\u003C/span\u003E to the Minister of Finance: What recent announcements has she made on Government finances?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022f12da0af-dc73-4870-8f77-1d50a75eb44c\u0022 data-id=\u00228e69cdce9a2e41cfa7dd8763795a827f\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000122\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f12da0af-dc73-4870-8f77-1d50a75eb44c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00228e69cdce9a2e41cfa7dd8763795a827f\u0022\u003EHon NICOLA WILLIS (Minister of Finance)\u003C/span\u003E: Earlier today, I released the Budget Policy Statement. At the same time, Treasury released its half-year update, which contains the latest set of forecasts. They tell a positive story about growth returning to the New Zealand economy, and they also highlight some challenges for the Government\u2019s books. Forecast provisions have made it more difficult to address the situation we inherited, a rapid increase in debt over the past five years, and an extended period of Budget deficits, but we are firmly committed to turning that around, and the books show we are headed in the right direction.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000123\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002294b52412-f97b-4bbd-8009-5dc49520f7f4\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022e24aaba1905f45e49dd7716431626d5c\u0022\u003ERyan Hamilton\u003C/span\u003E: What does the Budget Policy Statement say about Budget 2025?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000124\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f12da0af-dc73-4870-8f77-1d50a75eb44c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00228fb9b97881cf4d019c87ec0f5dfcfab1\u0022\u003EHon NICOLA WILLIS\u003C/span\u003E: The Budget Policy Statement sets four priorities for Budget\u00A02025: (1) lifting economic growth through measures to address New Zealand\u2019s long-term productivity challenges; (2) implementing a social investment approach to drive better results from the Government\u2019s investment in social services and thereby improve life outcomes for people with high needs; (3) keeping tight control of Government spending while funding a limited number of high-priority Government policy commitments and cost\u00A0pressures that cannot be met from reprioritisation; and (4) developing a sustainable pipeline of long-term infrastructure investment.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000125\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002294b52412-f97b-4bbd-8009-5dc49520f7f4\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022dd3cafdbb5144f1fb0ed8e02c63c729b\u0022\u003ERyan Hamilton\u003C/span\u003E: Why is improving productivity so important?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000126\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f12da0af-dc73-4870-8f77-1d50a75eb44c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002238d05a3b49cf47cb99743428e5819814\u0022\u003EHon NICOLA WILLIS\u003C/span\u003E: The Government\u2019s focus is not just on the fiscals; we are also focused resolutely on growth, and that must come from productivity improvements, not just from working more. The Government has a busy programme but is collectively aimed at improving productivity, from resource management reforms to overseas investment, to gene technology, to fast-track consenting, to labour market regulation, to education, to infrastructure, and so on, and that has a loop back to the fiscals. Additional growth of even a quarter of a percent of nominal GDP each year would boost tax revenue by $2\u00A0billion a year by the end of the forecast period. That\u2019s a win-win.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000127\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002294b52412-f97b-4bbd-8009-5dc49520f7f4\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002226424ae8eb804dcfb1b65efa6ead9c26\u0022\u003ERyan Hamilton\u003C/span\u003E: What alternative advice has she received about fiscal strategy?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000128\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f12da0af-dc73-4870-8f77-1d50a75eb44c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00225c9cb847685f4040a057b93d1461b946\u0022\u003EHon NICOLA WILLIS\u003C/span\u003E: I receive a lot of advice about fiscal strategy, much of it unsolicited. For example, I recently received a letter from 15 economists telling me to increase current and future Government spending. I noticed that several people who signed this letter telling me to spend more were advisers to the previous Minister of Finance, and two are currently on the Labour Party policy council. I wasn\u2019t surprised. I\u2019ve also heard advice from a person saying that the Budget surplus is a moot point and that a future Government that they could be finance Minister in would consider taking on more debt. This actually did surprise me, because it came from Barbara Edmonds.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000129\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u0022c9c76cdb523a42cf988fd1557d42a25b\u0022\u003EQuestion No. 4\u2014Prime Minister\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00220f7d126e-c18d-4466-9ebe-d424ae5c4bf6\u0022 data-id=\u00220f4b00a6274e41f2ba763a616592fc5b\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000130\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220f7d126e-c18d-4466-9ebe-d424ae5c4bf6\u0022\u003E4. \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00220f4b00a6274e41f2ba763a616592fc5b\u0022\u003ERAWIRI WAITITI (Co-Leader\u2014Te P\u0101ti M\u0101ori)\u003C/span\u003E to the Prime Minister: Does he stand by all his Government\u2019s statements and actions?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022ea31fdd3-90e9-47d7-92a4-20b6a3109eef\u0022 data-id=\u00227576cf22bb6a4b9b8809b8caac966be9\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000131\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ea31fdd3-90e9-47d7-92a4-20b6a3109eef\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00227576cf22bb6a4b9b8809b8caac966be9\u0022\u003ERt Hon CHRISTOPHER LUXON (Prime Minister):\u003C/span\u003E Yes, and especially today\u2019s announcement that we are taking further actions to keep Kiwis safe in emergency departments (EDs) this summer. If you visit, or work in, an ED, you deserve to feel safe. And over the holiday period, EDs can be particularly busy and stressful places. That\u2019s why we\u2019re building on last year\u2019s successful programme and ensuring more support is available to keep Kiwis safe: 20 hospitals will receive additional funding for security, and further funding will be available if there is a major incident or event that requires a greater security presence. Our Government\u2019s working hard at improving public services that all Kiwis can rely on, whether that\u2019s in the community or in an emergency department.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000132\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220f7d126e-c18d-4466-9ebe-d424ae5c4bf6\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022fc656089af8d4890ae89e5592ff1a33f\u0022\u003ERawiri Waititi\u003C/span\u003E: Will his Government\u2019s benefit sanctions help to put more kai on the table or less kai on the table this Christmas for the thousands of hungry tamariki in Aotearoa?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000133\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ea31fdd3-90e9-47d7-92a4-20b6a3109eef\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00221f1bae0238f94e25906c8b0fd634301c\u0022\u003ERt Hon CHRISTOPHER LUXON\u003C/span\u003E: Well, I\u2019m very proud of the traffic light system that our great Minister from the Ministry of Social Development has implemented, because what it means is a pretty simple requirement: show up and talk to your case manager, get a resume, and show up to your job interviews.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000134\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220f7d126e-c18d-4466-9ebe-d424ae5c4bf6\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022e34d242b5a3a4211b510846edcc353ea\u0022\u003ERawiri Waititi\u003C/span\u003E: Does he agree with the Child Poverty Action Group that his decision to put the wellbeing of landlords over the wellbeing of tamariki will put 20,000 more children into poverty by the time his term is up?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000135\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ea31fdd3-90e9-47d7-92a4-20b6a3109eef\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022f7a416be487648bf8f6168f2e5742bf2\u0022\u003ERt Hon CHRISTOPHER LUXON\u003C/span\u003E: What I\u2019m proud about is under Budget \u201824, with all the cost of living measures that this Government delivered for low and middle income New Zealanders, 17,000 children are going to be taken out of poverty\u2014compared to the last year of the Labour Government, where 23,000 more children were put in poverty.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000136\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220f7d126e-c18d-4466-9ebe-d424ae5c4bf6\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022c69de854af654cce9feb5596d26fa603\u0022\u003ERawiri Waititi\u003C/span\u003E: What does he say to Logan, a 7-year-old tamaiti who wrote to Santa asking for a burger to share with his mum for Christmas?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000137\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ea31fdd3-90e9-47d7-92a4-20b6a3109eef\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022815ef13a138441e689b6583bc5461c36\u0022\u003ERt Hon CHRISTOPHER LUXON\u003C/span\u003E: I acknowledge that across New Zealand, it\u2019s a pretty tough time. That\u2019s what happens when you don\u2019t run an economy well. If you care about low and middle income New Zealanders, you run the books well. You don\u2019t spend more, tax more, borrow more, and deliver less.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000138\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220f7d126e-c18d-4466-9ebe-d424ae5c4bf6\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002236a91d4570f747cd918cde8bf4a4b3cd\u0022\u003ERawiri Waititi\u003C/span\u003E: If I sold three houses and earned $769,500 in untaxed capital gains, how many burgers can I buy for Logan and his mum?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000139\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022465f30d4b8384dcbb6a82f3d66ff7ad4\u0022\u003ERt Hon Winston Peters\u003C/span\u003E: Point of order!\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000140\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002283c0b87562414497913ee1fc04e0aff9\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Well, the point I\u2019d make is that the Prime Minister cannot be expected to know the fluctuating price of burgers anywhere in the world, let alone New Zealand. The question is out of order.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000141\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220f7d126e-c18d-4466-9ebe-d424ae5c4bf6\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002265933c32c8a642c5b03c8190152df515\u0022\u003ERawiri Waititi\u003C/span\u003E: Does he believe that \u201CI earned that $769,500 through hard work\u201D or did I benefit from the increased demand of housing driven by his mega-landlord donors?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000142\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002281251b3b5623434883b742346adda374\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Now, that question\u2019s out of order too.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000143\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a0133685087f4920a5baa754f21d04d9\u0022\u003ERt Hon Winston Peters\u003C/span\u003E: Point of order, Mr Speaker. I do suggest that we\u2019re going to have to, some time between Christmas and New Year, do a familiarisation course for members of Parliament. That sort of question is outrageous in the extreme; it\u2019s hypothetical in the extreme and would not be accepted in any First World Parliament, let alone this one here that\u2019s been going since 1854. [Interruption]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000144\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00221f768c733bd64f79af7ea93180db43aa\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Excuse me. Who\u2019s speaking during a point of order?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000145\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00225fdc9675353e49ad9715ba1cd1624a2f\u0022\u003ERt Hon Winston Peters\u003C/span\u003E: The Marsden Point close-down merchant was speaking to me when I was talking.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000146\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00223c8a831268544742ad7dc51a14a46ba3\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Was that helpful?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000147\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002237a99b65-4919-4800-830d-3dd7c920d5cd\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002280feaff37a964d85ad8891417ba69d5e\u0022\u003EHon Dr Megan Woods\u003C/span\u003E: What was that?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000148\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022d890ca2ae59b451687850ce76bd5f314\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: In fact, I didn\u2019t hear it. I\u2019m sorry. The point was that the question is out of order and I\u2019d already ruled it out of order before the point of order.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000149\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220f7d126e-c18d-4466-9ebe-d424ae5c4bf6\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022bb5061b8e409426485935874f399ce9a\u0022\u003ERawiri Waititi\u003C/span\u003E: Has he read the book by Mary McHugh, How Not to Become a Crotchety Old Man?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000150\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022cc6a290877bd4b8d802603fa3758b75c\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Well, much as it might be of interest to the House to find out what the Prime Minister\u2019s personal reading materials are, I don\u2019t think it was necessary to give a demonstration of what the book was about.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000151\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u0022fdb8879c1f834b608d7d9623c370f07d\u0022\u003EQuestion No. 5\u2014Finance\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002261725fea-7d5e-4d1f-8fd3-e5779bb7a14d\u0022 data-id=\u0022c2c665153e3048d0b143737e79a04638\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000152\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002261725fea-7d5e-4d1f-8fd3-e5779bb7a14d\u0022\u003E5. \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022c2c665153e3048d0b143737e79a04638\u0022\u003EHon BARBARA EDMONDS (Labour\u2014Mana)\u003C/span\u003E to the Minister of Finance: Does she stand by all her statements and actions?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022f12da0af-dc73-4870-8f77-1d50a75eb44c\u0022 data-id=\u0022158d1da73af14aaabd99853d4027123f\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000153\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f12da0af-dc73-4870-8f77-1d50a75eb44c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022158d1da73af14aaabd99853d4027123f\u0022\u003EHon NICOLA WILLIS (Minister of Finance):\u003C/span\u003E In context, yes. I particularly stand by my statement to the effect that now more than ever is a time for disciplined Government spending and a focus on driving economic growth.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000154\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002261725fea-7d5e-4d1f-8fd3-e5779bb7a14d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002218242560b6884ab89e56767466964034\u0022\u003EHon Barbara Edmonds\u003C/span\u003E: Isn\u2019t it the case that the last time net core Crown debt was this high, which will peak at 46.5 percent of GDP, was in 1994?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000155\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f12da0af-dc73-4870-8f77-1d50a75eb44c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00221f5acc3fa11c4559bdda2911bb1b40d8\u0022\u003EHon NICOLA WILLIS\u003C/span\u003E: It is also the case that in the past five years, the last Labour Government added more than $100 billion to New Zealand\u2019s debt. And we, as a Government, are now saddled with the task of bending that debt curve back\u2014[Interruption]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000156\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022cac8c1b8b8ba43b6abee0af1485964b1\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Hold on! Just stop. Stop, thank you. You can\u2019t expect me to have any view on the quality of an answer if the noise is so loud it can\u2019t be heard. Now, that might be the intention, but it\u2019s not going to continue. Minister, begin answering the question\u2014answer the question again from the start. I am going to make it clearly a point that it is not inappropriate to mention matters of policy conducted by a previous Government.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000157\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f12da0af-dc73-4870-8f77-1d50a75eb44c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00225b671767d6d746e38b98c458c80bc90b\u0022\u003EHon NICOLA WILLIS\u003C/span\u003E: The context for New Zealand\u2019s debt position is that in recent years, more than a hundred billion dollars was added to debt, blowing it out as a proportion of GDP. It is the fiscal intention of this Government to see that debt curve curve down, and we have laid out a path to achieving it. I\u2019d also note that the member opposite is the very same member who told Radio New Zealand she doesn\u2019t think debt is a problem.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000158\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002261725fea-7d5e-4d1f-8fd3-e5779bb7a14d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002272efbe3e189a4b8aa6c0c6937875075d\u0022\u003EHon Barbara Edmonds\u003C/span\u003E: Isn\u2019t it the case that net core Crown debt will now be 3.5\u00A0percentage points higher than what was forecast in her Budget?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000159\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f12da0af-dc73-4870-8f77-1d50a75eb44c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002221350a54c8f34d3aa3e2a7ef3e31505e\u0022\u003EHon NICOLA WILLIS\u003C/span\u003E: As I have set out today in the Budget Policy Statement, it is the case that forecast revisions to New Zealand\u2019s GDP trajectory will have an effect on debt. That is why it is so important that the Government maintain a disciplined fiscal position with lower operating allowances than have been the case in recent years when the last Government blew spending out as a proportion of GDP, leaving our economy in a very challenged state. If that member wants to join those on this side of the House in the pursuit of fiscal discipline, I can only welcome it.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000160\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002261725fea-7d5e-4d1f-8fd3-e5779bb7a14d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002242a8be0dd5a54c8291f7cb24d1d5c6a2\u0022\u003EHon Barbara Edmonds\u003C/span\u003E: Isn\u2019t it the case that there will be $58.7 billion more debt, peaking at $235 billion, than what was forecast in her Budget only six months ago?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000161\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f12da0af-dc73-4870-8f77-1d50a75eb44c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022884fe8632f2e47a98b06eadbbb41a229\u0022\u003EHon NICOLA WILLIS\u003C/span\u003E: As I have laid out today in the Budget Policy Statement and as Treasury has laid out in the Half Year Economic and Fiscal Update, downward revisions to the fiscal forecasts have had an effect in two ways. One, the current recession is estimated to have started earlier and to be more protracted than had previously been forecast. And, two, there has been a downward revision to productivity forecasts. This does have an effect on debt. Now, this Government believes there is a place for debt, for borrowing for long-term infrastructure assets. We also believe it is very important to get debt down to a trajectory under 40 percent of GDP. Again, I note that if the member wishes to join us in that pursuit, that would be novel for her and her party\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000162\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022ab395c04868b4b23804e0cf059891b56\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: That\u2019s enough. That\u2019s enough\u2014you\u2019ve answered the question.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000163\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a1f7bbd1-b6ae-41c0-963b-dbe1251f5540\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002271c9d35f957d4b738d5b64f99e018ce9\u0022\u003EHon Kieran McAnulty\u003C/span\u003E: She knows what she\u2019s doing. No wonder you warn her.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000164\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022bf679c6511254b77a3910fae24f0ef78\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Listen, it\u2019s very hard to listen to an answer when you\u2019ve got a very, you know, resounding voice coming in one ear.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000165\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a1f7bbd1-b6ae-41c0-963b-dbe1251f5540\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00226aed09877e5c47799879e9e285cb0bfd\u0022\u003EHon Kieran McAnulty\u003C/span\u003E: Do you want me to talk to her?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000166\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00223202bfe4423b45ebb89785299c097371\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: If you wouldn\u2019t mind.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000167\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002261725fea-7d5e-4d1f-8fd3-e5779bb7a14d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00223ee41b40f6a642e28993efa8e2afca5d\u0022\u003EHon Barbara Edmonds\u003C/span\u003E: Will she take responsibility for the growth forecast being revised downwards since her Budget and predicted to be $20 billion smaller in 2028?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000168\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f12da0af-dc73-4870-8f77-1d50a75eb44c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00220437eabbc64846a6b3b522f6a2404008\u0022\u003EHon NICOLA WILLIS\u003C/span\u003E: I won\u2019t take responsibility for the mistakes of the last Government, but I will take responsibility for fixing it.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000169\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002261725fea-7d5e-4d1f-8fd3-e5779bb7a14d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00221c8f5d9cb0814351905ee699cd1676e2\u0022\u003EHon Barbara Edmonds\u003C/span\u003E: Does she plan on shifting any other goalposts to help reach her targets, like she has done with the definition of \u201COBEGAL\u201D and with child poverty targets?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000170\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f12da0af-dc73-4870-8f77-1d50a75eb44c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022f6b0055aae364e9c9572019e5e8b3dbd\u0022\u003EHon NICOLA WILLIS\u003C/span\u003E: I reject the characterisations of the member\u2019s question.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000171\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u00229f75f6ebe3de45b493d8b43282382d6c\u0022\u003EQuestion No. 6\u2014RMA Reform\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002230f9e8fe-eafb-4967-8d4d-306525ae2340\u0022 data-id=\u0022053b7b2d436f45a4a0e951420a7be105\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000172\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002230f9e8fe-eafb-4967-8d4d-306525ae2340\u0022\u003E6. \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022053b7b2d436f45a4a0e951420a7be105\u0022\u003EKATIE NIMON (National\u2014Napier)\u003C/span\u003E to the Minister responsible for RMA Reform: What progress has been made in meeting the commitment in the Government\u2019s Quarter Four Action Plan to \u201CPassing the Fast-track Approvals Bill to speed up delivery of regional and national projects of significance\u201D?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000173\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220f7d126e-c18d-4466-9ebe-d424ae5c4bf6\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022092b0fb1f3844db3b0ebb7842427a4cb\u0022\u003ERawiri Waititi\u003C/span\u003E: By getting rid of the Treaty.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000174\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002202b3b4ed03d84f259197dee36536b0e4\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Whoa\u2014just give him a minute. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002257e41e9d-285b-4fb3-847d-a63820ae7137\u0022 data-id=\u002205ef63bd99ad43159064fd3b921a34be\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000175\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002257e41e9d-285b-4fb3-847d-a63820ae7137\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002205ef63bd99ad43159064fd3b921a34be\u0022\u003EHon CHRIS BISHOP (Minister responsible for RMA Reform):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you very much. This afternoon, the Fast-track Approvals Bill will receive its third reading, fulfilling one of the actions in the Quarter Four Action Plan. The new system will be up and running in early February 2025, with listed projects able to apply directly to the Environmental Protection Authority for their substantive application process to begin. We\u2019ve long said it takes too long and it is too hard to consent things in this country. This Government is getting on with the job of fixing that through fast-track.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000176\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002230f9e8fe-eafb-4967-8d4d-306525ae2340\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022c77e63c7629f4972a41ee13ea470a5b2\u0022\u003EKatie Nimon\u003C/span\u003E: What positive feedback has he received on the Fast-track Approvals Bill? \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000177\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002257e41e9d-285b-4fb3-847d-a63820ae7137\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022e7555e7653ca47159e7de2de2bee40d4\u0022\u003EHon CHRIS BISHOP\u003C/span\u003E: It\u2019s been extraordinary going up and down the country. Anyone who\u2019s tried to get anything built in this country has been radicalised against our current consenting process. One constituent wrote to me to say, \u201CThe fast-track process is an excellent initiative for the right project. I agree it needs to be maintained.\u201D Another simply wrote, \u201CKeep up the excellent work. Protesters are only a minority.\u201D And, of course, it was interesting in the House last week to see Labour Party MPs both vote against the fast-track but spend much of the committee stage debate lauding various projects listed in the bill, most notably the Hope Bypass project down in Nelson, which is, of course, a road of national significance and a Government priority\u2014[Interruption]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000178\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00223fa3f8fb60ff4690a35132e984e8889f\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Sit down! \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000179\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227a76db18-baa4-41c1-b366-89e2c753a1e7\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00225a40a289317f4fa5b01cda0105bc8edb\u0022\u003EDebbie Ngarewa-Packer\u003C/span\u003E: You\u2019re a tangiweto!\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000180\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022b6f85be7e98d4df9a1676054040d1389\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: The member knows that those proceedings should not be brought into the House at this particular time. And I\u2019d say to the member on the end of the cross benches on the Opposition side that she needs to modify her contributions considerably in order to stay.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000181\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002230f9e8fe-eafb-4967-8d4d-306525ae2340\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022f06a33b4b53e45e39a117751c6027c4d\u0022\u003EKatie Nimon\u003C/span\u003E: Does the Minister expect to see economic growth benefits from the Fast-track Approvals Bill?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000182\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002257e41e9d-285b-4fb3-847d-a63820ae7137\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a4d7d12ca10542989d359b174e9909d0\u0022\u003EHon CHRIS BISHOP\u003C/span\u003E: Yes, we do. There\u2019s no doubt that the cost and time of consenting stifles economic growth: so much time and money spent on long costly processes. These 149\u00A0projects, the initial tranche, will help rebuild our struggling economy and kick-start growth around the country. If we want a brighter future for New Zealand, we have to stop giving in to a nimby, low-growth, status quo minority. We deserve a country with thriving infrastructure and world-class industry, where New Zealanders can live the lives they want to live without having to get sign-off from the local council for every single thing they do. Fast-track is about saying yes, when for too long we have said no.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000183\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002230f9e8fe-eafb-4967-8d4d-306525ae2340\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022380a345e147a4110960847220d9462a5\u0022\u003EKatie Nimon\u003C/span\u003E: Supplementary?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000184\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022679db1c8b5e142518d625384eeaa090a\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: And this will be a nice concise answer, I\u2019m sure. Ask the question.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000185\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002230f9e8fe-eafb-4967-8d4d-306525ae2340\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00223ed6bcae144549adb8c5114921222f5e\u0022\u003EKatie Nimon\u003C/span\u003E: Why is economic growth so important?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000186\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002257e41e9d-285b-4fb3-847d-a63820ae7137\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022f9fd8be7f66c41c889f9ee39b4d4fca6\u0022\u003EHon CHRIS BISHOP\u003C/span\u003E: Well, as members will have seen today, the Half Year Economic and Fiscal Update shows the Crown\u2019s financial position has deteriorated over the past six years, and I echo the views of the Minister of Finance, who has rightly noted that this reinforces the need to drive greater economic growth if we want better public services and more opportunities for young Kiwis. We are battling anaemic levels of economic growth. Our status as a First World country is not guaranteed. We should not take it for granted. If we want to be a growing economy that provides the revenue and the world-class opportunities New Zealanders need, we need growth. Fast-track is a way to deliver that, and that\u2019s why this Government is backing it.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000187\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002293a4cff95c824ea78da24f620955271d\u0022\u003ERt Hon Winston Peters\u003C/span\u003E: Can I ask the Minister as to whether he really thinks that he\u2019s given due credit to the Hon David Parker, who provided so much inspirational precedence for this legislation?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000188\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022eeeab671ca434cfba8309da581a2f95a\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: That would be a question asking the Minister to reflect on what might be considered a personal failing, so we\u2019ll move on now to Question No. 7.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000189\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u0022efac781fe45645b3ad7e28dc34d50bd4\u0022\u003EQuestion No. 7\u2014Prime Minister\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022dbaac12b-3efa-4d95-a08d-f0f637a48bab\u0022 data-id=\u00225b4e452fe9d644d59376b5f350cc9cf2\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000190\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dbaac12b-3efa-4d95-a08d-f0f637a48bab\u0022\u003E7. \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00225b4e452fe9d644d59376b5f350cc9cf2\u0022\u003ECHL\u00D6E SWARBRICK (Co-Leader\u2014Green)\u003C/span\u003E to the Prime Minister: E tautoko ana ia i ng\u0101 k\u014Drero me ng\u0101 mahi katoa a t\u014Dna K\u0101wanatanga?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000191\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dbaac12b-3efa-4d95-a08d-f0f637a48bab\u0022\u003E[Does he stand by all of his Government\u2019s statements and actions?]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022ea31fdd3-90e9-47d7-92a4-20b6a3109eef\u0022 data-id=\u0022d22ad79cfd6e4287999b2cb24ea28c5b\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000192\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ea31fdd3-90e9-47d7-92a4-20b6a3109eef\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022d22ad79cfd6e4287999b2cb24ea28c5b\u0022\u003ERt Hon CHRISTOPHER LUXON (Prime Minister):\u003C/span\u003E Yes.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000193\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dbaac12b-3efa-4d95-a08d-f0f637a48bab\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002242d6d06c38de4e0c8572521d07d340e9\u0022\u003EChl\u00F6e Swarbrick\u003C/span\u003E: Does the Prime Minister think that it is the job of his Government to decrease wealth inequality?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000194\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ea31fdd3-90e9-47d7-92a4-20b6a3109eef\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022dfb2ef4c2f0a491da44cf34bc2bd3eb8\u0022\u003ERt Hon CHRISTOPHER LUXON\u003C/span\u003E: Our Government\u2019s working incredibly hard to raise incomes, to provide economic growth, and to lower the cost of living.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000195\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dbaac12b-3efa-4d95-a08d-f0f637a48bab\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a6cc49088ad24a77951b3e17e45a41c8\u0022\u003EChl\u00F6e Swarbrick\u003C/span\u003E: Can the Prime Minister name one\u2014just one\u2014Government policy that will decrease inequality in this country?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000196\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ea31fdd3-90e9-47d7-92a4-20b6a3109eef\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002223fbb7939bc44ea8a401419613027b61\u0022\u003ERt Hon CHRISTOPHER LUXON\u003C/span\u003E: We have adjusted tax for low and middle income working New Zealanders. We have increased the Working for Families credits. We have also provided FamilyBoost for people dealing with expensive childcare. We have provided inflation, interest rate, rent stability, and also tax relief for low and middle income working New Zealanders.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000197\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dbaac12b-3efa-4d95-a08d-f0f637a48bab\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002216b56175f00c46c79a6b383ef4ccca1f\u0022\u003EChl\u00F6e Swarbrick\u003C/span\u003E: Does the Prime Minister believe that we have a fair tax system when the IRD told us all last year that the wealthiest 311 households in this country pay an effective tax rate less than half of that of the average New Zealander, and his Government has chosen to re-entrench those settings?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000198\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ea31fdd3-90e9-47d7-92a4-20b6a3109eef\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002261c60d9db9534eca8e487207ab4ca2c4\u0022\u003ERt Hon CHRISTOPHER LUXON\u003C/span\u003E: It\u2019s well established by Treasury that, you\u2019ve heard them say, we have a progressive tax system.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000199\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dbaac12b-3efa-4d95-a08d-f0f637a48bab\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022d688717ef92240fa97b21eb83e2f4e26\u0022\u003EChl\u00F6e Swarbrick\u003C/span\u003E: Did the Prime Minister also hear Treasury say that we would have a more productive economy if we were to implement a capital gains tax?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000200\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ea31fdd3-90e9-47d7-92a4-20b6a3109eef\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002299895f70cd824e74bc2d88aa69d5142c\u0022\u003ERt Hon CHRISTOPHER LUXON\u003C/span\u003E: I can tell you that would not be the case. That would be a wrecking ball through our economy, because we have been in recession for three years\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000201\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dbaac12b-3efa-4d95-a08d-f0f637a48bab\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00229927134e54934a9a9c436d48f736f571\u0022\u003EChl\u00F6e Swarbrick\u003C/span\u003E: The IMF! The OECD!\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000202\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002251f416043c804d98bf22f9d4d3c5e08a\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: No, sorry. The member\u2019s just asked a question. If she keeps on yelling out across the House like that, she won\u2019t be asking any more questions for the rest of the day, let alone participating. Let the answer come to a question you\u2019ve put so much time into asking.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000203\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dbaac12b-3efa-4d95-a08d-f0f637a48bab\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002264f80085eec94ff9adc5a92e825f6514\u0022\u003EChl\u00F6e Swarbrick\u003C/span\u003E: Sorry, point of order, Mr Speaker. That was the first time that I heckled the Prime Minister, that I offered a response to what the Prime Minister was saying. Are you saying now, as a Speaker\u2019s ruling, that I am not allowed to respond in the course of an answer being provided by the Prime Minister?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000204\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00229c614031f32b4779931c19c3066ef7a1\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: I\u2019m saying that you can find it in Speaker\u2019s Rulings on page 65\u2014and I think it\u2019s 2 or 3\u2014that you cannot sit in your seat and yell at people; it\u2019s not how it works. Does the member have another question?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000205\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dbaac12b-3efa-4d95-a08d-f0f637a48bab\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022220dcb4ee954437ca8a0b90d3456bd3b\u0022\u003EChl\u00F6e Swarbrick\u003C/span\u003E: How tough have the choices been for this Government to knowingly make decisions to enable the rich to get richer and the poor to get poorer in real terms?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000206\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ea31fdd3-90e9-47d7-92a4-20b6a3109eef\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022f96bb884911443fe8f6e4e32fc6e2d82\u0022\u003ERt Hon CHRISTOPHER LUXON\u003C/span\u003E: I absolutely reject the characterisation of that question. This is a Government that has been working incredibly hard to make sure that we rebuild an economy that helps low and middle income New Zealanders get ahead. That is the failing of the last Labour-Greens Government.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000207\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u002262027fc7c8ba4463a5cfc13f9953b7b2\u0022\u003EQuestion No. 8\u2014Health\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022b9dc1924-4df4-4d8f-91ec-8a0f29348308\u0022 data-id=\u0022edd47f4f688d4f5fb038a5291532b7f8\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000208\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b9dc1924-4df4-4d8f-91ec-8a0f29348308\u0022\u003E8. \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022edd47f4f688d4f5fb038a5291532b7f8\u0022\u003ETIM COSTLEY (National\u2014\u014Ctaki)\u003C/span\u003E to the Minister of Health: What recent statements has the Government made on keeping emergency departments safe this summer?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022861a1798-a396-4a6c-b9e2-7d2f15d4a001\u0022 data-id=\u002250bb24bb900b49c49a3dbfd622b308b7\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000209\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022861a1798-a396-4a6c-b9e2-7d2f15d4a001\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002250bb24bb900b49c49a3dbfd622b308b7\u0022\u003EHon Dr SHANE RETI (Minister of Health):\u003C/span\u003E At Wellington hospital this morning I reconfirmed the Government\u2019s commitment to keeping staff and patients safe in emergency departments (EDs) this summer. We know that EDs can be particularly busy and stressful places during the holiday period. That is why our Government is again taking extra safety steps to ease this by building on last year\u2019s successful programme and our additional commitment in Budget 2024. Over the summer, Health New Zealand will increase security in 20 mostly provincial hospitals across the country and have further surge capacity available if additional security is needed. We want to ensure that our ED staff stay safe this summer.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000210\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b9dc1924-4df4-4d8f-91ec-8a0f29348308\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00224f6540e6d0ba47298675967727f03eb2\u0022\u003ETim Costley\u003C/span\u003E: Why was it a priority for the Government to provide this uplift in emergency department security?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000211\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022861a1798-a396-4a6c-b9e2-7d2f15d4a001\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00227f0c3074bec942c99e9ba2116e3fbdf9\u0022\u003EHon Dr SHANE RETI\u003C/span\u003E: Violence or aggression against patients, visitors, and health workers won\u2019t be tolerated. Both staff and patients alike deserve to feel safe when they\u2019re working or visiting hospitals in their time of need. This initiative reinforces that. That is why we announced both fixed funding positions as well as a flexible funding package which allows Health New Zealand to surge security support across emergency departments when needed. This is particularly helpful during summer for the many events being held in regional and rural areas.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000212\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b9dc1924-4df4-4d8f-91ec-8a0f29348308\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002216b4130ceab94b6d8e50df6cde54cbf0\u0022\u003ETim Costley\u003C/span\u003E: What feedback has the Minister received on the importance of this initiative?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000213\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022861a1798-a396-4a6c-b9e2-7d2f15d4a001\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022c2f54356d470456dad96db1cb0bf1974\u0022\u003EHon Dr SHANE RETI\u003C/span\u003E: Since becoming the Minister of Health, I have travelled across the country, visiting both regional and rural hospitals to hear feedback from the front line. During these visits, both staff and patients have commented to me how important this initiative has been in ensuring that people feel safe when visiting or working in ED. That is why this initiative will provide 44 additional full-time security personnel across our eight high-priority EDs, a flexible funding package to surge security support when needed and further provisioning for 12 security trainers.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000214\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b9dc1924-4df4-4d8f-91ec-8a0f29348308\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002233868edb7dae41f8b7d6765e8ff8904d\u0022\u003ETim Costley\u003C/span\u003E: What other initiatives has the Government undertaken to improve our emergency departments? \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000215\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022861a1798-a396-4a6c-b9e2-7d2f15d4a001\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022d5e1f07911814f549c1d97abba53d668\u0022\u003EHon Dr SHANE RETI\u003C/span\u003E: Last week, we provided an update on our five key health targets. After years of deterioration, ED wait times remained relatively the same as they were the year before, whilst seeing roughly 18,000 more people presenting to our EDs. This is a particularly impressive achievement given our hospitals were tackling some of the highest rates of respiratory illness in almost a decade. However, there is still more work to be done to continue driving improvements in our ED wait times. That\u2019s why we have introduced initiatives like new acute-flow operational standards and invested in discharge and transit lounges. We are absolutely committed to improving health outcomes for all New Zealanders.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000216\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u0022efe5c558c7e54073bd0a4fdbc81b99db\u0022\u003EQuestion No. 9\u2014Health\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022aed260be-c954-464b-bb75-85579e53d05a\u0022 data-id=\u0022a09dd31158594f44ad9d427ee8691d87\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000217\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aed260be-c954-464b-bb75-85579e53d05a\u0022\u003E9. \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022a09dd31158594f44ad9d427ee8691d87\u0022\u003EHon Dr AYESHA VERRALL (Labour)\u003C/span\u003E to the Minister of Health: Does he stand by his refusal to be interviewed on cuts to information technology in hospitals on the ground that it is an operational matter; if so, can he guarantee that hospital care and data will be safe?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022861a1798-a396-4a6c-b9e2-7d2f15d4a001\u0022 data-id=\u00226404ddceea114cf59d027f04bb2a4146\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000218\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022861a1798-a396-4a6c-b9e2-7d2f15d4a001\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00226404ddceea114cf59d027f04bb2a4146\u0022\u003EHon Dr SHANE RETI (Minister of Health)\u003C/span\u003E: Yes. Health New Zealand is undergoing a reset process as a result of the troubled health reforms of previous years. Cost blowouts have meant that Health New Zealand needs to refocus on its core functions, which include providing the healthcare that New Zealanders need whilst living within its means. The health commissioner is leading this process with staff, with the aim of gathering feedback on proposals. It\u2019s important to note that no final decisions have been made. I\u2019ve been reassured by the commissioner that the reset is being undertaken in a careful and considered way, and it remains my expectation that hospitals and data will continue to be safe.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000219\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aed260be-c954-464b-bb75-85579e53d05a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a75a7ea5ca1941f5b1490b91d7b2e3fd\u0022\u003EHon Dr Ayesha Verrall\u003C/span\u003E: Does he stand by his statement in the House that redundancies for vital support staff at Health New Zealand are an operational matter as well, and, if so, what does he say to clinicians who are being tied up in admin rather than providing care?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000220\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022861a1798-a396-4a6c-b9e2-7d2f15d4a001\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022912358ffa6f2435ea85b968406a4ad9c\u0022\u003EHon Dr SHANE RETI\u003C/span\u003E: In response to the answer to the first arm of her question, yes, I stand by that statement.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000221\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aed260be-c954-464b-bb75-85579e53d05a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022ad2457efedda42bcbcc90e0b55e7cc64\u0022\u003EHon Dr Ayesha Verrall\u003C/span\u003E: Does he stand by his refusal to comment on the loss of face-to-face after-hours services in Porirua because it is an operational matter, and, if so, what\u00A0does he say to community members who want to know if they\u2019ll get the care they need?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000222\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022861a1798-a396-4a6c-b9e2-7d2f15d4a001\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022c4807e6e67df4bba9d8cbdc9fc61913f\u0022\u003EHon Dr SHANE RETI\u003C/span\u003E: In response to the first arm of that question, yes, it is well known that where technical or detailed operational matters are concerned, it is an operational matter for Health New Zealand.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000223\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aed260be-c954-464b-bb75-85579e53d05a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00221b5be9ef2f1d4cf995659f3ce4642476\u0022\u003EHon Dr Ayesha Verrall\u003C/span\u003E: Why is he evading questions on the operational realities of how New Zealanders are cared for in our health system and the consequences that stem from his direction to cut $1.4 billion in health spending?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000224\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022861a1798-a396-4a6c-b9e2-7d2f15d4a001\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022ca67cf68f66e4b4da70477266beb9f9e\u0022\u003EHon Dr SHANE RETI\u003C/span\u003E: I reject the assertions in that question and would point to the fact that we are trying to turn around the reset from the botched two years of health reforms that member was a part of.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000225\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aed260be-c954-464b-bb75-85579e53d05a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002268bddf473f5f4696b11c4cf75e1c7f75\u0022\u003EHon Dr Ayesha Verrall\u003C/span\u003E: Does he stand by his commitment to lower wait times for surgeries, or are operations now operational too?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000226\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022861a1798-a396-4a6c-b9e2-7d2f15d4a001\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00221c5aeb1521234300acb13c89e324fc50\u0022\u003EHon Dr SHANE RETI\u003C/span\u003E: Yes, I do stand by that commitment to lower the wait times for surgeries.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000227\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u0022b7db908bfa3b4347a844da8cbdce703d\u0022\u003EQuestion No. 10\u2014Local Government\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022d64de4c1-ef68-477e-9c50-db5cbdf99404\u0022 data-id=\u0022ecc01635bc9a4cb38c8cdab07968019d\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000228\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022d64de4c1-ef68-477e-9c50-db5cbdf99404\u0022\u003E10. \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022ecc01635bc9a4cb38c8cdab07968019d\u0022\u003ETOM RUTHERFORD (National\u2014Bay of Plenty)\u003C/span\u003E to the Minister of Local Government: What recent announcements has he made about getting councils back to basics?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002255d0b7a4-a2c9-4c38-9b77-475311a48a89\u0022 data-id=\u00229ca8e9e5c1fb4dd081c26402c4176f0d\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000229\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002255d0b7a4-a2c9-4c38-9b77-475311a48a89\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00229ca8e9e5c1fb4dd081c26402c4176f0d\u0022\u003EHon SIMEON BROWN (Minister of Local Government):\u003C/span\u003E Yesterday, the Prime Minister and I announced reforms to get councils back to basics to reduce pressure on rates, deliver core services, and modernise outdated rules to drive efficiency and cost savings. These measures include removing the four \u201Cwell-beings\u201D from the Local Government Act, benchmarking council performance to hold them accountable. Ratepayers deserve councils that focus on the basics, like fixing pipes, filling potholes, and delivering reliable services, rather than expensive nice-to-haves.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000230\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022d64de4c1-ef68-477e-9c50-db5cbdf99404\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002248f6cd1169cc41a7a51148fed39c261a\u0022\u003ETom Rutherford\u003C/span\u003E: Why is the Government removing the four \u201Cwell-beings\u201D from the Local Government Act?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000231\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002255d0b7a4-a2c9-4c38-9b77-475311a48a89\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022ed54ee91cd6741d3827805fd9a1f39f6\u0022\u003EHon SIMEON BROWN\u003C/span\u003E: The evidence shows that when the four \u201Cwell-beings\u201D were in legislation, rates increased approximately 2 percent more per year. Removing them sends a clear signal that councils must prioritise roads, rubbish, and reliable infrastructure. Ratepayers simply cannot afford excessive spending on nice-to-have projects or duplication of roles with central government. By focusing on core responsibilities, councils will reduce unnecessary financial burdens on their communities.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000232\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022d64de4c1-ef68-477e-9c50-db5cbdf99404\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022fcf48b2a61a14d729e42bdb1029a6778\u0022\u003ETom Rutherford\u003C/span\u003E: How will benchmarking improve council accountability?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000233\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002255d0b7a4-a2c9-4c38-9b77-475311a48a89\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00223ddc6a2012e84ba6a2c2a560020ac764\u0022\u003EHon SIMEON BROWN\u003C/span\u003E: Benchmarking is a crucial tool for improving transparency and accountability. The Department of Internal Affairs will publish an annual report on councils\u2019 performance, including key metrics such as rates, council debt, capital expenditure, balanced budgets, and road conditions. By providing ratepayers with clear information, these reports will empower communities to assess how well their councils are managing resources and delivering services in their local communities.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000234\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022d64de4c1-ef68-477e-9c50-db5cbdf99404\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022d308691d9a384758897567590fffc99e\u0022\u003ETom Rutherford\u003C/span\u003E: When will the first benchmarking report on local councils be released?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000235\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002255d0b7a4-a2c9-4c38-9b77-475311a48a89\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00226ba5c2aadc8f4f8e8db078db59a558a0\u0022\u003EHon SIMEON BROWN\u003C/span\u003E: Good news: the first benchmarking report on local councils will be released in the middle of 2025, ahead of the 2025 local elections. This report will give hard-working ratepayers and residents across the country clear information about their council\u2019s financial performance prior to going to the polls in October 2025.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000236\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u002214053d69607f4dd8bcdf85f8cc32d6b2\u0022\u003EQuestion No. 11\u2014Prime Minister\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002246269786-ecb4-40e2-972a-e287c495bdec\u0022 data-id=\u00221abbc1e545cf4b93a9ada08b07c2d631\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000237\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002246269786-ecb4-40e2-972a-e287c495bdec\u0022\u003E11. \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00221abbc1e545cf4b93a9ada08b07c2d631\u0022\u003ELAN PHAM (Green)\u003C/span\u003E to the Prime Minister: E tautoko ana ia i ng\u0101 k\u014Drero me ng\u0101 mahi katoa a t\u014Dna K\u0101wanatanga?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000238\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002246269786-ecb4-40e2-972a-e287c495bdec\u0022\u003E[Does he stand by all of his Government\u2019s statements and actions?]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022ea31fdd3-90e9-47d7-92a4-20b6a3109eef\u0022 data-id=\u00222447061ced324aeea060365f4cc1fb19\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000239\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ea31fdd3-90e9-47d7-92a4-20b6a3109eef\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00222447061ced324aeea060365f4cc1fb19\u0022\u003ERt Hon CHRISTOPHER LUXON (Prime Minister):\u003C/span\u003E Sorry, I missed the translation. Can you repeat the question? I missed the translation.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000240\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002246269786-ecb4-40e2-972a-e287c495bdec\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022ddfd2cf727ba4dd1a4de5f4c19f69ce6\u0022\u003ELan Pham\u003C/span\u003E: E tautoko ana ia i ng\u0101 k\u014Drero me ng\u0101 mahi katoa a t\u014Dna K\u0101wanatanga?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000241\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002246269786-ecb4-40e2-972a-e287c495bdec\u0022\u003E[Does he stand by all of his Government\u2019s statements and actions?]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000242\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ea31fdd3-90e9-47d7-92a4-20b6a3109eef\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00224d745a2955734ed3ae5439bdf5e885c4\u0022\u003ERt Hon CHRISTOPHER LUXON\u003C/span\u003E: Yes.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000243\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002246269786-ecb4-40e2-972a-e287c495bdec\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00221facaba5a3f641b59f68a269f6e7df9a\u0022\u003ELan Pham\u003C/span\u003E: Can the Prime Minister confirm that no level of environmental protection will remain for public conservation covenants, outstanding natural landscapes, or water conservation orders under the Fast-track Approvals Bill?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000244\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ea31fdd3-90e9-47d7-92a4-20b6a3109eef\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00226f6eb09467984a12b651e72493bbf168\u0022\u003ERt Hon CHRISTOPHER LUXON\u003C/span\u003E: Well, that\u2019s not an accurate\u2014I reject the characterisation of that question. But what I\u2019d say to you is that I am incredibly proud of the fast-track legislation, and I really hope it\u2019s not too late for the Green Party to get on board, because we really do want to have a 30 percent increase in renewable energy projects across this country, we do really want to build 55,000 more houses, and we want to build up 180 kilometres of new roads.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000245\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002246269786-ecb4-40e2-972a-e287c495bdec\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022763d8b4ac4fa4ab8831682798e627655\u0022\u003ELan Pham\u003C/span\u003E: What would he say to the public concerned that some of the 149 project applications that his Cabinet approved under the fast-track process were required to disclose their track record of prior compliance and enforcement actions against them, and didn\u2019t?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000246\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ea31fdd3-90e9-47d7-92a4-20b6a3109eef\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022c4dd3761238343cbb716c2b4db271fd3\u0022\u003ERt Hon CHRISTOPHER LUXON\u003C/span\u003E: Again, I\u2019m not getting into the details of individual projects; there\u2019s an expert panel process that will manage that. But what I would say to that member is that the New Zealand public are actually sick of how long it takes to get things built in this country. There is no justification to take 19 months to build a three- to four-bedroom home that\u2019s 50 percent more expensive than the same home in Australia.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000247\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002246269786-ecb4-40e2-972a-e287c495bdec\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022e73d8be7ee194d0892a2edb32d13dc5c\u0022\u003ELan Pham\u003C/span\u003E: Supplementary?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000248\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022bf8a92b721334935b05bc3b9f5aa48a9\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Just wait for a moment. OK.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000249\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002246269786-ecb4-40e2-972a-e287c495bdec\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022835ecc4df7f948ed84b33e940249a8dc\u0022\u003ELan Pham\u003C/span\u003E: Did Cabinet consider whether the 149 applications contributed to regionally and nationally significant infrastructure, and, if so, what was the rationale for including projects that didn\u2019t even bother answering how they supported regional or nationally significant infrastructure?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000250\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ea31fdd3-90e9-47d7-92a4-20b6a3109eef\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00227b045e6d962246b6bc342f35e33ff9de\u0022\u003ERt Hon CHRISTOPHER LUXON\u003C/span\u003E: Again, we have a process where projects will go through an expert panel. But what I\u2019d say is these are projects of national and regional significance, and we make no apologies for making sure that we prioritise economic growth after three years of being in a recession, thanks to a Labour-Greens Government.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000251\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002246269786-ecb4-40e2-972a-e287c495bdec\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022bcbb4e3f72ce4992a842f6259ea1a5d2\u0022\u003ELan Pham\u003C/span\u003E: Will he commit to reconsidering projects included in the Fast-track Approvals Bill if the Auditor-General inquiry into Cabinet\u2019s handling of conflicts of interest finds the process was not managed appropriately?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000252\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ea31fdd3-90e9-47d7-92a4-20b6a3109eef\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002233fb0489ba334779a47a3a2c1a0ac132\u0022\u003ERt Hon CHRISTOPHER LUXON\u003C/span\u003E: A hypothetical question\u2014I\u2019m not answering it.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000253\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002246269786-ecb4-40e2-972a-e287c495bdec\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022e7908fcfb39244b89fd54d98a82ac61a\u0022\u003ELan Pham\u003C/span\u003E: Where does localism fit, when his Government won\u2019t give local councils the decency of a response in even acknowledging their opposition to the fast-track projects in their city, district, or region, when even their democratic plans will soon have no weight in protecting their communities and their environment?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000254\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ea31fdd3-90e9-47d7-92a4-20b6a3109eef\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00226ba13f29406148f6b6ddeaeaeae6dc4e\u0022\u003ERt Hon CHRISTOPHER LUXON\u003C/span\u003E: There is a way, through the expert panels, for them to make a contribution. But, again, this is a Government that is making no apologies for getting things built quicker, prioritising economic growth, and making sure we get things done. That is what this country needs and I can tell you people are excited about fast track coming to a town near them shortly.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000255\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u0022db011719192e450387cc8c7896e2bf70\u0022\u003EQuestion No. 12\u2014Rail\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002262ff759d-9586-405a-a6e6-208ad65adeb5\u0022 data-id=\u00224d7921d0eda84adaa4d63721dad4abd8\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000256\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002262ff759d-9586-405a-a6e6-208ad65adeb5\u0022\u003E12. \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00224d7921d0eda84adaa4d63721dad4abd8\u0022\u003ETANGI UTIKERE (Labour\u2014Palmerston North)\u003C/span\u003E to the Minister for Rail: Does he stand by his statement regarding any new Cook Strait ferries that \u201CRail-enabled ferries is part of our considerations, yes, and that is a no-brainer\u201D; if so, will he guarantee that the new ferries will be rail-enabled?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022 data-id=\u002248aba94725624b67a4ff7971f9e9c045\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000257\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002248aba94725624b67a4ff7971f9e9c045\u0022\u003ERt Hon WINSTON PETERS (Minister for Rail):\u003C/span\u003E Can I say to that member: I\u2019d have thought this is far more important to be question No. 12 today, but we get on with the answer. Nothing has been ruled in or out. We are looking at all the options\u2014the costs and benefits, and the pluses and minuses\u2014and we\u2019ll make decisions based on the best interests of our country. We are not going to make silly pledges before the work is done, and we can guarantee the member that we are not going to be asleep at the wheel like his colleagues were for the last three years.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000258\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002262ff759d-9586-405a-a6e6-208ad65adeb5\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00221398f9e9d11e45968bed1ffadd727dfc\u0022\u003ETangi Utikere\u003C/span\u003E: Was the Government advised that work on a new Picton wharf needed to begin this year, and, if so, what impact will any wharf and linkspan upgrades in Picton have on the ongoing operation of the rail-enabled Aratere ferry?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000259\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00226e546b751be04cfbbe48cfbab9f7aeda\u0022\u003ERt Hon WINSTON PETERS\u003C/span\u003E: Well, it\u2019s not a secret to anyone apart from that side of the House that the port of Picton needs to be rebuilt in the next few years regardless, and we\u2019re going to be looking at those plans as we find out from the experts what it might entail.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000260\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002262ff759d-9586-405a-a6e6-208ad65adeb5\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00227ba5df18d0774a8992dd3c8aa43b4c79\u0022\u003ETangi Utikere\u003C/span\u003E: Was the Government advised that the rail-enabled Aratere would need to be retired in 2025?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000261\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022ea4c4ea90f8647a3b5da24f34258ab97\u0022\u003ERt Hon WINSTON PETERS\u003C/span\u003E: Reality is that that was a scenario painted by the now disbanded ministerial advisory group, and the reality is that the decisions have not been taken by the Cabinet on that matter.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000262\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002262ff759d-9586-405a-a6e6-208ad65adeb5\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022ee208b806acb45a4bfa4970c80c1d76a\u0022\u003ETangi Utikere\u003C/span\u003E: Can he then guarantee that the Interislander\u2019s sole rail-enabled ferry, the Aratere, will be scheduled to continue operations until 2029?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000263\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00222d8245671bc54ecc94093242155d543a\u0022\u003ERt Hon WINSTON PETERS\u003C/span\u003E: What I can guarantee is that, having had a meeting early this morning with KiwiRail and MUNZ\u2014that\u2019s the Maritime Union\u2014at midday, and we\u2019re going to consult with everybody, and we\u2019re going to find out exactly what\u2019s going on and what went wrong. And then we\u2019ll come to this House and declare transparently\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000264\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c3a88c42-f60b-4cf9-8065-8bfb80a020eb\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022fcdb1b87f2264aca84861a77975ad905\u0022\u003EHon Carmel Sepuloni\u003C/span\u003E: Don\u2019t you know?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000265\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002235494defe6ff4be49a9a7c083be15eb5\u0022\u003ERt Hon WINSTON PETERS\u003C/span\u003E: No, no, we don\u2019t go off the top of our head like the previous Government. We get the information and we don\u2019t go from $401 million\u2014which is what I charged them with in May 2020\u2014to now, according to Treasury, $4\u00A0billion. That\u2019s inexcusable.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000266\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002262ff759d-9586-405a-a6e6-208ad65adeb5\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002235692f8162f74cd9b6429d280842466e\u0022\u003ETangi Utikere\u003C/span\u003E: Was the Government advised that the cheapest and most basic option for new Cook Strait ferries came in at $282 million each, which for two ferries would add up to more than the rail-enabled ferries contracted under iReX?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000267\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022802a0ea6b2fa4a87a6a233944d9d895a\u0022\u003ERt Hon WINSTON PETERS\u003C/span\u003E: What\u2019s amazing about that question is this: that we were talking about two ferries and we ended up with $4 billion on the account and no one over there is being responsible. We\u2019ll make one promise over here: we\u2019ll come in far, far, far less than that.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000268\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002262ff759d-9586-405a-a6e6-208ad65adeb5\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00224b59ff07c3c945c0be7a8764609b9b73\u0022\u003ETangi Utikere\u003C/span\u003E: Why did Nicola Willis miss the deadline for making a decision on ferries at the end of July this year, as recommended by her ministerial advisory group?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000269\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d49aeac-8adf-497b-9400-ab7bb077bb8d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00223fca85df5a4a421e8b56f75a0f8dc5af\u0022\u003ERt Hon WINSTON PETERS\u003C/span\u003E: Actually, ministerial advisory groups don\u2019t set deadlines for this Government. We\u2019re not run by the bureaucracy; we run the thing from Cabinet. And the Minister that you\u2019re talking about, the finance Minister, had a nightmare on her hands and I\u2019m deeply sympathetic with her predicament.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n    \u003C/div\u003E\n    \u003Cdiv class=\u0022HpsHansard\u0022\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000270\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsProceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u002248fabb1013024c72b7f261439e0beaa0\u0022\u003EUrgent Debates\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000271\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u00221e9c4fbef3f64d42bc9410e6c777c999\u0022\u003EHalf Year Economic and Fiscal Update 2024\u2014Release\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022 data-id=\u0022413c4bfa0dd247ac80e0d62af30888f9\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000272\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022413c4bfa0dd247ac80e0d62af30888f9\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: I call on the Hon Barbara Edmonds to move that the House take note of a matter of urgent public importance.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002261725fea-7d5e-4d1f-8fd3-e5779bb7a14d\u0022 data-id=\u00228da995e34d40498db3accda1a1139816\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000273\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002261725fea-7d5e-4d1f-8fd3-e5779bb7a14d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00228da995e34d40498db3accda1a1139816\u0022\u003EHon BARBARA EDMONDS (Labour\u2014Mana):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Mr Speaker. I move, That the House take note of a matter of urgent public importance.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000274\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002261725fea-7d5e-4d1f-8fd3-e5779bb7a14d\u0022\u003EThere was once a time in our country where a child who\u2019d lost their parent could rely on the State to provide a safety net so that they wouldn\u2019t fall through the cracks, where a child whose parents lost their jobs could turn up to the local WINZ and be treated with respect, have dignity, and be asked questions like \u201CHow can we help you get into work?\u201D There was once a time in this country where a Government would help their people get into their first home, and would continue to build social housing so that those who didn\u2019t have a home could have access to a roof over their heads. There was once a time in this country where evidence, science, and data would drive decisions by a Government\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000275\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002257e41e9d-285b-4fb3-847d-a63820ae7137\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00222687d8e5e5e44823bdfb6e15c81f98ac\u0022\u003EHon Chris Bishop\u003C/span\u003E: Point of order.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000276\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022f7a8fb4a7ede42d695ea619144e657af\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Point of order, the Hon Chris Hipkins.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000277\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002257e41e9d-285b-4fb3-847d-a63820ae7137\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002267b120a7d46b49a592dd343fec39e8dc\u0022\u003EHon Chris Bishop\u003C/span\u003E: Bishop.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000278\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002282d4790f93d243809071f04072fa3af4\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Bishop\u2014sorry. Yeah, OK, let\u2019s start again, shall we?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000279\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002257e41e9d-285b-4fb3-847d-a63820ae7137\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002201c31d36585141479efcab6a1137d1a5\u0022\u003EHon Chris Bishop\u003C/span\u003E: Mr Speaker, you have granted an urgent debate on the Government\u2019s Half Year Economic and Fiscal Update (HYEFU). We are now one minute into the speech of the member who requested the urgent debate, and we\u2019ve had a lot of talk about children, or one particular child, but the HYEFU has yet to be mentioned. So it\u2019s a bit strange that we\u2019re now enduring a general debate speech with two days left to go in the year, when we\u2019re meant to be having a debate about the HYEFU. We\u2019re prepared to debate it, but the member seems unprepared to actually address the issues.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000280\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022e2cd18debbd640f3b29bdd996d60526a\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Well, that I consider to be a pretty unhelpful point of order. I was watching the clock. The member will come to a point very, very quickly, but I suspect that she was setting up the points that she wants to make about the HYEFU, which is not unreasonable from someone who is getting to move a debate. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000281\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002261725fea-7d5e-4d1f-8fd3-e5779bb7a14d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022fdfede346aeb4e809837cd65f20f13e6\u0022\u003EHon BARBARA EDMONDS\u003C/span\u003E: Thank you, Mr Speaker. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000282\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002237a99b65-4919-4800-830d-3dd7c920d5cd\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00221ed89ea949f747e0a16bae9c86e40d70\u0022\u003EHon Dr Megan Woods\u003C/span\u003E: Economics is about people. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000283\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002261725fea-7d5e-4d1f-8fd3-e5779bb7a14d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002256b9cca02d9b427ab82896257e14aff1\u0022\u003EHon BARBARA EDMONDS\u003C/span\u003E: Because it\u2019s all about people. Every single number in the HYEFU is about decisions that impact people, that impact communities, that impact organisations, and that impact businesses in our country.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000284\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002261725fea-7d5e-4d1f-8fd3-e5779bb7a14d\u0022\u003EThere was once a time in our country where social service providers could depend on Government funding to serve communities that the Government could not reach. There was once a time where Oranga Tamariki service providers could care for vulnerable children because they knew that funding was coming down the line. They knew that when times were going to be tough, there would be a Government to serve them. There was once a time in our country where Governments made decisions, took responsibility for them, and paved a vision and a future for our country that served everyone, not just their mates in the tobacco companies, not just their mates who are landlords, not just their mates who are getting far higher remuneration than minimum-wage earners.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000285\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002261725fea-7d5e-4d1f-8fd3-e5779bb7a14d\u0022\u003EWith the release of the half-yearly fiscal update and the Budget Policy Statement, it\u2019s very clear that those days are over. Let me run the House through the numbers. Net core Crown debt will peak at 46.5 percent. Net core Crown debt will now be 3.5 percent higher than what was forecast in the Budget; $58.7 billion more debt, peaking at $235 billion, than what was forecast at Budget. The economy is shrinking. It is predicted to be $20\u00A0billion smaller in 2028. The $19 billion higher net core Crown debt will be higher than what was in the Minister of Finance\u2019s Budget.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000286\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002261725fea-7d5e-4d1f-8fd3-e5779bb7a14d\u0022\u003EIf it wasn\u2019t clear, I am pretty sure it is crystal clear now that this Government is borrowing for the groceries, is borrowing for tax cuts, and has made deliberate choices to make it hard on every single body except for their mates. They are giving with one hand, \u201CWith tax relief\u201D, the Minister will crow, but, on the other hand, they have reduced the subsidies for public transport funding. It\u2019s going to be more expensive for our kids\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000287\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f12da0af-dc73-4870-8f77-1d50a75eb44c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022104233ce64704c198f5b756749771f9e\u0022\u003EHon Nicola Willis\u003C/span\u003E: What\u2019s this got to do with the HYEFU?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000288\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002261725fea-7d5e-4d1f-8fd3-e5779bb7a14d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022abfb25193a854ab08c8e2695ad6585d3\u0022\u003EHon BARBARA EDMONDS\u003C/span\u003E: \u2014to catch the train or the bus. And the Minister of Finance is asking, \u201CWhat\u2019s the relevance of this?\u201D That\u2019s the problem. That is the problem. She is so removed from the connection of her decisions to people in our community, to the families who have to put their children on rail or buses, from the families who have to depend on their schools to pay for their lunches. For the ratepayers who depend on a Government to support them with water infrastructure, to spread out the debt across the generations to help them so that this generation is not crippled with that debt\u2014that is what fiscal prudency is about. But, again, that side of the House fails to connect that this document with numbers is all about people.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000289\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002261725fea-7d5e-4d1f-8fd3-e5779bb7a14d\u0022\u003ENow, I will hear the same spin I have heard for the last year from this Government. We will hear the same spin: \u201CWe inherited a mess.\u201D Well, you know what? We take responsibility for our spending that saved lives, that ensured families and employees stayed connected to their workers. We take responsibility for that, because 20,000 people did not die because of those decisions. We take responsibility for the infrastructure spend that we had to do, which I note many Government MPs across the House have been present at to either cut a ribbon or to put a shovel in the ground. And I get it, right\u2014I get it. I get that the infrastructure spending through COVID to fix fire stations across the country were needed. Fire stations help meet the needs of communities, so I welcomed those Government MPs last year when I was cutting the ribbon, because I knew the importance to the community, I knew the importance to people.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000290\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002261725fea-7d5e-4d1f-8fd3-e5779bb7a14d\u0022\u003EWhat really, really grates me is this particular sentence in the Budget Policy Statement, on page 3: \u201CSecond, savings will need to be found, beyond those already identified in the previous Budget.\u201D\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000291\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f12da0af-dc73-4870-8f77-1d50a75eb44c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022ed44d0a814904764bc18c6b8c2f1c29c\u0022\u003EHon Nicola Willis\u003C/span\u003E: Yes\u2014absolutely.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000292\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002261725fea-7d5e-4d1f-8fd3-e5779bb7a14d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002242f7a74d4e9c4a1890ff274263c1e656\u0022\u003EHon BARBARA EDMONDS\u003C/span\u003E: \u201CAnd third, with a small number of exceptions, government departments should expect to receive no additional funding in the Budget.\u201D And \u201CYes\u201D, the Minister of Finance says\u2014but it\u2019s choices. We told the Minister of Finance that the tax cuts were unaffordable. We told the Minister of Finance that that was absolutely irresponsible, but she still gave the tax cuts, she borrowed more for the tax cuts, and as a result she has taken away with the other hand. She has ripped away that relief by making it harder for families to access relief for early childhood education, by making it harder for families for public transport subsidies, by removing universal prescription fees, by ensuring that they\u2019re not putting downward pressure on rents, by giving tax breaks for landlords. This side of the House did have interest deductibility, but it was for the build of new houses. It was to incentivise the building of new houses.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000293\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002261725fea-7d5e-4d1f-8fd3-e5779bb7a14d\u0022\u003EWhat do we see from the other side of the House\u2014and this is what I need to warn New Zealanders of. Every single MP, when you go to your community, will need to go eye to eye with these social service providers who are dealing with more homeless people, who are dealing with more people who cannot make their everyday budget because of decisions made by this Government. Instead of helping those families being able to access their entitlements\u2014their entitlements\u2014this Government has just made it worse. Dashboards, performance indicators\u2014what about these people\u2019s entitlements? They\u2019ve lost their jobs. It\u2019s quite clear in HYEFU that this Government has no plan to help the economy grow, and that\u2019s why the numbers reflect that. That\u2019s why our economy is shrinking.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000294\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002261725fea-7d5e-4d1f-8fd3-e5779bb7a14d\u0022\u003ENo matter how much this Government likes to say productivity will get us out of here, I\u2019m still waiting for that plan. Has anyone seen that plan? Anyone seen that plan? Anyone seen the plan to build infrastructure? I\u2019ve seen plans for potholes\u2014I\u2019ve seen plans for potholes\u2014but what I haven\u2019t seen is a vision, a plan for our country. All we\u2019ve seen is cuts, but then handing out free relief to their mates\u2014taking away from everyday New Zealanders in order to pass the buck on to them another way.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000295\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002261725fea-7d5e-4d1f-8fd3-e5779bb7a14d\u0022\u003EWe are having more New Zealanders\u2014almost every five minutes\u2014leave this country because they don\u2019t see any hope. We are seeing grandchildren leaving this country because they will get paid better over the ditch. They will get better work conditions. They will have people that will fight for them. There will be infrastructure projects that are happening. Instead, we have 12,000 fewer construction sector workers because this Government, based on these numbers, based on more cuts to come, will not be building houses. They will not be helping to repair our schools that need repair. They will not be helping to ensure that our infrastructure and our construction sector workers stay here. You need that pipeline\u2014you cannot just wish a pipeline of builders, plumbers, and sparkies. That\u2019s why we are having net record migration from our green shores: because this Government is failing New Zealand, with no plan and no vision for the future.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022f12da0af-dc73-4870-8f77-1d50a75eb44c\u0022 data-id=\u0022040f7fb57d4f49f5be494f1f38fc0085\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000296\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f12da0af-dc73-4870-8f77-1d50a75eb44c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022040f7fb57d4f49f5be494f1f38fc0085\u0022\u003EHon NICOLA WILLIS (Minister of Finance):\u003C/span\u003E Well, for the first minute I wondered if that was going to be a leadership pitch, but judging by the faces opposite, that made them feel even glummer than they do when Chris Hipkins is asking questions. What that speech confirmed is that the Labour finance spokesperson is still labouring under the naive illusion that every spending whim can be met from the magic money tree at the bottom of the garden. Well, there is no magic money tree. There is the back pockets of working New Zealanders. While the last Government was happy to treat them like a bottomless ATM, running up the\u00A0credit card, there\u2019s now a fiscally disciplined team in charge. What that speech demonstrated is that the Labour Party members opposite have not yet taken pause to consider, \u201CHow should we differentiate ourselves from the spendthrift, debt-ratcheting lot that preceded us?\u201D Instead, what they are doing is saying, \u201CEverything is fine here.\u201D In fact, it\u2019s like The Lego Movie: \u201CEverything is awesome\u201D. \u201CIt\u2019s all fine\u2014nothing to do with us.\u201D\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000297\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f12da0af-dc73-4870-8f77-1d50a75eb44c\u0022\u003EWell, a few facts, because I like numbers\u2014I think that\u2019s good in a finance spokesperson. Here\u2019s the first one: net core Crown debt under the previous Government went from $57\u00A0billion to $175\u00A0billion; more than $100 billion added to debt in just five years under the past Government, going from 19.5 percent of GDP to over 40 percent of GDP. Here\u2019s another one: the operating balance\u2014the difference between what the Government was earning and spending\u2014was in deficit for five of the years they were in office. Here\u2019s the third thing: what was driving that? Well, spending was so lavish\u2014went up by more than 80 percent on things like light rail phantom projects that went nowhere, three waters reforms that nobody wanted, the idea for a pedestrian bridge over the harbour\u2014that operating Crown expenses went from under 30 percent of GDP, 27 percent, to more than 33 percent. And all of that spending, what did it do? It drove inflation to 7.2\u00A0percent, creating the worst cost of living crisis in a generation. What do we get from the finance spokesperson? She says we should have just carried on as we were.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000298\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f12da0af-dc73-4870-8f77-1d50a75eb44c\u0022\u003EWell, today, what I laid out is that this is a Government with a tough job on its hands. In the half-year update, we are truly seeing Labour\u2019s chickens coming home to roost. Now, we\u2019ve had a chapter in New Zealand political history where the Government\u2019s focus was continuously on how they could spend it\u2014how they could spend more and more and more and add more layers. Well, that chapter now needs to come to an elegant close as we open the chapter called \u201CHow do we earn it?\u201D What New Zealanders understand is that, if you want a nicer car, you need to earn more money. On this side of the House, we understand that. For New Zealand to have the public services that Kiwis deserve, for young people to have the opportunities that they need, for us to be able to have the growing incomes we all aspire to, we have to grow the long-term productivity of this economy. Today\u2019s books lay that very bare.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000299\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f12da0af-dc73-4870-8f77-1d50a75eb44c\u0022\u003ENow, I am a little confused by Labour\u2019s position. I want to take you through a few things. On the one hand, today, we had a focus on the fact that, yes, as a result of the deteriorating fiscal forecasts, we are expecting an uptick in debt as a proportion of GDP. That is something our Government takes very, very seriously. It is why we have instilled a disciplined fiscal stance with very tight operating allowances. It is why we are conducting the good business that small businesses, households, everyday New Zealanders do all the time, which is saying, \u201CWhat can I reprioritise to make sure my money is going to the most important things?\u201D As a Government, we\u2019re saying, \u201CWe want to invest in schools, in hospitals, in police.\u201D To do that responsibly, without creating a monster debt burden, we have to be prepared to look for savings.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000300\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f12da0af-dc73-4870-8f77-1d50a75eb44c\u0022\u003EBarbara Edmonds seems to think that we should just ignore debt. As recently as March\u2014just eight months ago, colleagues\u2014she told Radio New Zealand that a future Labour Government would consider taking on more debt. That\u2019s her solution. Just two weeks ago at the Labour Party conference, surrounded by her mates, she argued that surplus\u2014that is getting the books back into balance\u2014is a moot point. This kind of mixed position is very hard to take seriously. Of course, I actually feel for her, because what she\u2019s surrounded by is a group of people who wouldn\u2019t know how to run a business and a set of accounts if it rolled them over. Two members of her own party policy council recently burst into print, arguing that the way out of the Government\u2019s economic challenges is to spend more. That was their answer that, in fact, what needs to happen is to simply spend more. Well, when we look at the fiscal position that the Treasury updated today, what it does show is that that position has deteriorated significantly over the past six years. It turns out that the Labour Government\u2019s decision to go on a reckless spending spree has had pretty significant impacts on our economy.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000301\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f12da0af-dc73-4870-8f77-1d50a75eb44c\u0022\u003EI do want to highlight this for members, because we are going into Christmas and New Zealanders deserve some good cheer. Here I would tell you there is some good cheer in the documents that were released today that Barbara Edmonds is clearly yet to read. The first is this: the economy has reached a turning point. Inflation is back under control. And that matters to every New Zealander who has struggled with rising prices over these past three years. The Reserve Bank has begun reducing interest rates. That matters not just to every family with a mortgage, but it matters to the small businesses who are going to see more money flowing into their tills too as those families have a bit more to spend. What these books also show is that household spending and business activity is expected to lift.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000302\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f12da0af-dc73-4870-8f77-1d50a75eb44c\u0022\u003EAfter several years of growth jumping along the bottom, in and out of recession, we are now able to forecast confidently a sustained period of economic growth. I do care about what that means for GDP and I do care about what that means for debt to GDP and the operating balance and all of the measures which we\u2019ve accounted for in these books, but mostly why I care about it\u2014and this is the disconnect with the member opposite\u2014is because when you grow an economy more, you provide better opportunities for New Zealanders. Actually, that\u2019s where higher incomes come from, that\u2019s where better jobs come from. Higher employment comes with higher growth. If you look around the world, the countries with the best health systems, the countries with the best appointed classrooms, the countries that invest the most in science, are the very same countries that are the wealthiest.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000303\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f12da0af-dc73-4870-8f77-1d50a75eb44c\u0022\u003EThat is why, on this side of the House, we take so seriously our duty to take a range of measures to increase the productive capacity of the economy. There\u2019s no silver bullet. It\u2019s not all going to deliver tomorrow. Does that mean we shouldn\u2019t improve human capital by getting the basics back in our schools? No, it doesn\u2019t. It means it should have been done six years ago, and they didn\u2019t do it. We\u2019re going to continue our reforms to cut back the red tape that has weaponised too many of New Zealand\u2019s laws against progress, against development. We are on the side of getting things built and getting things done, and the fast-track legislation today proves just that.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000304\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f12da0af-dc73-4870-8f77-1d50a75eb44c\u0022\u003EWe are a Government that will get into 2024, when it comes to infrastructure delivery, partnering with the private sector, using modern funding and financing tools so that New Zealand can have the infrastructure needed for productive growth. We\u2019re going to get serious about the science system, about making it commercial, because, actually, we need to connect our economic growth objectives with a considerable investment that we make in science. We need to not just sell to ourselves and talk to ourselves about how to spend money. We need to connect with the world. We need to say yes to investment from those firms and countries who want to create good jobs and incomes here, and we need to trade with those countries too.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000305\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f12da0af-dc73-4870-8f77-1d50a75eb44c\u0022\u003EWhere we stand today is in a very stark place, because I recall, in my time in this Chamber, thoughtful debates where people talked about how to solve the problems. What we\u2019ve had from those opposite is simply wilful denial about the challenges New Zealand faces. Well, the good news is this: Kiwis are smart people. They elected a Government who they could trust to get on and solve it. We have laid out a path to get our books back in balance, to bend the debt curve down, and to do it while investing in essential services. And here\u2019s the thing: we\u2019ve closed the chapter that\u2019s all about spending more for spending\u2019s sake, and now we\u2019re getting on and earning it.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022dbaac12b-3efa-4d95-a08d-f0f637a48bab\u0022 data-id=\u0022e0850bcc4fd84e35a10321dd2324d6d8\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000306\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dbaac12b-3efa-4d95-a08d-f0f637a48bab\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022e0850bcc4fd84e35a10321dd2324d6d8\u0022\u003ECHL\u00D6E SWARBRICK (Co-Leader\u2014Green):\u003C/span\u003E E te M\u0101ngai, t\u0113n\u0101 koe. T\u0113n\u0101 koutou e te Whare. You cannot cut your way to prosperity, and here I just want to point out a few things from the Half Year Economic and Fiscal Update (HYEFU). The fiscal decisions of this Government and of this Minister of Finance have exacerbated the recession. The Reserve Bank initially indicated that we were facing just a light downturn, but now the growth numbers keep on getting worse. This time last year, HYEFU was projecting a 1.5\u00A0percent growth this year; now, the actual rate is minus 0.2 percent. Next year\u2019s growth, at the Budget in May, was projected to be 1.7 percent, but it\u2019s now projected to be 0.5\u00A0percent. That is because this Government is not even meeting its own rhetoric and metrics of economic\u00A0orthodoxy. The Government is cutting its spending from approximately 34\u00A0percent to 30\u00A0percent, but it knows that households and small businesses, and definitely not the oligopoly that we\u2019ve been taking about at the Finance and Expenditure Committee, are not going to fill that gap. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000307\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dbaac12b-3efa-4d95-a08d-f0f637a48bab\u0022\u003EGovernment decisions, decisions made by the politicians sitting on that side of the House, are diminishing the growth that they so love to talk about. They are diminishing productivity, and they are knowingly increasing inequality and climate-changing emissions\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000308\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022713ccc5b-7ff0-4fa5-ab58-4780620184fe\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022df9e08ebedd642068569bb8a27169109\u0022\u003EHon Simon Watts\u003C/span\u003E: Rubbish!\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000309\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dbaac12b-3efa-4d95-a08d-f0f637a48bab\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022aa5c230699fb41e8ae939bf2e0234478\u0022\u003ECHL\u00D6E SWARBRICK\u003C/span\u003E: \u2014which, Minister of Climate Change, will only make things worse for future generations. Treasury\u2019s forecasts have only massively deteriorated since the Government took power. In just one year, the Crown\u2019s forecast operating balance for 2025 has worsened by 50 percent, from a deficit of $6.6 billion to $9.9 billion. This is unprecedented outside of global financial crises, and it\u2019s self-inflicted because the Government has decided to contract its spending so much.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000310\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dbaac12b-3efa-4d95-a08d-f0f637a48bab\u0022\u003EHYEFU shows us what all of us know\u2014that is, that tax revenues have stalled due to unemployment, which Government decisions have exacerbated, and company failures and a deep recession; that the Government expenditure is climbing due to that unemployment and those company failures, and there is no evidence whatsoever, no plan that we are hearing from this Government, to get us out of that. This is the austerity playbook. It is to defund public services to failure, to watch them fail, point that out to the public, and then say, \u201CHey, we should privatise that.\u201D Mark my words: that is the next thing on the agenda. Treasury notes that the Government\u2019s planned road-building frenzy, which the Minister of Transport was crowing about in question time today, has no believable source of revenue other than to widen the deficit faster than Waka Kotahi can widen those lanes.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000311\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dbaac12b-3efa-4d95-a08d-f0f637a48bab\u0022\u003EWe heard just before, from the Minister of Finance, about how if you want a nicer car, you\u2019ve got to earn more money. I think the Minister, who was doling out to members of the Opposition some orthodox economic speaking notes, should in fact reflect on the fact that the economy is not a car. The economy is all of us, the stuff that we create, and the rules that we put in place in order to try and get certain outcomes, and what this HYEFU underscores is that we are setting up for a two-track economy\u2014that is, wage and salary earners, beneficiaries, and small businesses all going backwards. Meanwhile, the oligopolies\u2014that is, our banks, our supermarkets, and our gentailers\u2014will continue to compound their power and their profits under decisions made by this Government.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000312\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022dbaac12b-3efa-4d95-a08d-f0f637a48bab\u0022\u003EWe can have a better world. It is entirely within our grasp. In fact, all members of this Chamber know that, because all members of this Chamber were across the Inland Revenue Department report released last year which told us that the top 311 households in this country hold more wealth combined than the bottom 2.5 million New Zealanders. That is not an accident; that is a conscious decision made by politicians in this place to entrench a tax system that, we all know, sees those at the top pay an effective tax rate less than half that of the average New Zealander\u2014that is, our teachers, our nurses, our doctors, and those public servants at the front line, who are paying double the effective tax rate of the wealthiest. This landlord Government is laughing their way to the bank.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022 data-id=\u00228e18a5aa418148e59dda7388d5aab72e\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000313\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00228e18a5aa418148e59dda7388d5aab72e\u0022\u003EHon DAVID SEYMOUR (Associate Minister of Finance):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Mr Speaker. I want to talk about this Budget Policy Statement and Half Year Economic and Fiscal Update, but first, I just want to remark on a couple of comments I\u2019ve just heard from Chl\u00F6e Swarbrick.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000314\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003EShe said that this is an austerity Government that\u2019s spending so little money so that it can make businesses go broke and then point to the failure. Now, I just want to bring some facts into the debate. In the back of this document we\u2019re debating today, it says very clearly that in 2018, 2019, when Chl\u00F6e Swarbrick was on the Government benches, voting for every Budget, the Government spent 27 percent, 28 percent at max; today, in this statement, the Government is spending 33 percent of GDP. Only Chl\u00F6e Swarbrick can point to a Government that\u2019s spending five percentage points more of the economy than she was responsible for spending and then say that this is an austerity Government. What I\u2019d say to Chl\u00F6e Swarbrick is that a political career is a little bit like one of those polaroid photos: slowly, people see your true form. Chl\u00F6e Swarbrick is increasingly being found out for having great-sounding rhetoric, but when you look at even the most basic facts of what we\u2019re debating, she doesn\u2019t stack up.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000315\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003EI want to say to Barbara Edmonds, who stood up and said, \u201CThese numbers are about people\u2014these numbers are about people.\u201D Yes, we know that, Barbara Edmonds, but the fact that people are facing such a tough time at the moment is precisely because we had a Government that was happy to lock people down\u2014to lock people down in their homes, to stop them from seeing their loved ones, and she said, \u201COh, I\u2019m so proud of our spending that saved people\u2019s lives.\u201D Actually, the spending was made necessary by the excessive response to COVID. Here\u2019s the really interesting thing about that argument from Barbara Edmonds: the spending kept on going, even after COVID had ended. That is what this Government now faces. That is what we hear from the Opposition. I didn\u2019t want to spend the first half of my speech talking about the Opposition, but people need to see what the alternative actually is: people that are profligate and wasteful and put us in a position where, yes, Barbara Edmonds, real people are having hard choices going into Christmas because the predecessors spent it all.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000316\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003EI\u2019m proud to stand on this side of the House, where we don\u2019t sugarcoat it; we face up to the reality that these are tough times. These are tough times for the New Zealand economy. They are tougher, it\u2019s been revealed in these documents, than the Treasury had previously reported. They\u2019ve had to point out that the economic conditions five years ago were not as good as they were reporting back then. That is because we have a productivity problem in New Zealand. No matter how hard people work\u2014and we\u2019re some of the hardest-working people in the world\u2014people aren\u2019t getting the increase in productivity.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000317\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003EWhat are we going to do about it as a Government? Well, two things. We are going to reduce wasteful Government spending. I predict we\u2019re going to have to reduce it by around $6 billion and find ways to do stuff better and smarter. I know what the other guys will say; they\u2019ll say, \u201COh, well that means you\u2019re going to cut services.\u201D No, actually, spending money is not its own objective. Our objective is to deliver better and more efficient outcomes for less money, just like people in farms and firms and families have had to do while they were in Government, and continue to as we turn the economy around.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000318\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003EThe second thing we\u2019re going to do is we\u2019re going to reduce red tape and regulation so people can spend more time doing the things that make their lives better and allow them to provide for themselves and their loved ones, and less time in compliance and administration activity or being dissuaded from using their creativity whatsoever. That\u2019s what we have to do.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000319\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003EWe cannot afford to listen to the rhetoric, the empty and\u2014as I\u2019ve shown\u2014inaccurate rhetoric of the Opposition. We must confront the reality that this Government faces alongside New Zealanders and make our own operations more efficient in order that New Zealanders can see the Government taking a smaller slice means having more for themselves. The Government places less red tape and regulation on them so that New Zealanders can use their time and talents for the good of our nation and themselves and their families. Under those conditions, I\u2019m confident we will see a turn-around that will keep these people far away from any levers of power for a generation to come. Thank you, Mr Speaker.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022f44431ef-b505-4e94-9f57-a60b0a569bf7\u0022 data-id=\u0022441d19ca93204e4d8c75dd1d2ca7193c\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000320\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f44431ef-b505-4e94-9f57-a60b0a569bf7\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022441d19ca93204e4d8c75dd1d2ca7193c\u0022\u003EHon SHANE JONES (Associate Minister of Finance):\u003C/span\u003E The value of today is that the New Zealand public has been given access to data which reflects that Treasury itself realises it needs to do better. This is a revision of forecasts where Treasury itself says that it\u2019s had to go back and rework its own modelling, and this document says that those forecasts reflect nothing in terms of what this Government is doing to remedy and turn around the situation that the Government has inherited. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000321\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f44431ef-b505-4e94-9f57-a60b0a569bf7\u0022\u003EYes, you\u2019ll hear all sorts of strange, bizarre rationalisations from the cooker, lentil speakers from that side of the House. This has got nothing\u2014nothing\u2014to do with the changes that we are making because they are overdue. Go no further than page 8\u2014growth strategy. The growth strategy is necessary because we\u2019ve come out of a recession. We\u2019ve come out of a period of time where the Reserve Bank has maintained extraordinarily high interest rates to deal with the legacy that we inherited: too much money chasing too few goods.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000322\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f44431ef-b505-4e94-9f57-a60b0a569bf7\u0022\u003EIf you\u2019ve got any doubt as to whether or not the recipe we are pursuing viewing will or won\u2019t deliver, look no further than the massive growth in export income coming from the primary sector announced last week. Fisheries up. Horticulture up. Farming up. Forestry increasing. What does the other side of the House want us to do? They don\u2019t want a growth strategy. They want us to halt our regulatory green, brown, red tape - busting efforts, but unless we free the economy from the calcified rules and regulations we\u2019ve inherited, we will not see the growth.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000323\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f44431ef-b505-4e94-9f57-a60b0a569bf7\u0022\u003ESure, we are going through a struggler\u2019s gully dip, but then all Kiwis know that, because they\u2019re managing their own household budgets. No one believes the green soup, the cultural promises that have been put about by the Opposition. It is only by building confidence and certainty with new investment, which will flow and blow forward into our economy like leaves in an autumn storm, and the effect of the fast track will be like a storm\u2014blow away all the cobwebs of complacency, blow away all of the insects trying to eat and gorge upon our own ability to pay and govern ourselves with a surplus.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000324\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f44431ef-b505-4e94-9f57-a60b0a569bf7\u0022\u003EI say to you Kiwis, the reality is that this is a day of a turning day. We are confident that we have the policies, we have made the decisions\u2014yes, we do need to make an effort to take the public with us, but we\u2019re justifying why we\u2019re doing these things because it leads to economic surplus. The economic surplus is the only way the hospitals, the schools, the nurses will thrive. That will not take place unless we boost innovation, change the regulatory framework, and also invest in education. Strip out of our education all of these marginal issues to do with gender and such matters. Go back to science, go back to mathematics, go back to reading and writing, because that\u2019s where we\u2019ve got a deficit.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000325\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f44431ef-b505-4e94-9f57-a60b0a569bf7\u0022\u003EOf course, these are contestable ideas, but there are things that you cannot contest\u2014i.e., we have inherited a system where costs are consistently understated and risks are overstated. For those reasons, the recipe, the changes, and, indeed, the options that will be outlined later today inside the fast track\u2014and it\u2019s a tragedy that they won\u2019t vote for it, but they will all be present when the projects are opened. They will all stand and cuddle the workers when they have new jobs. They\u2019ll all stand and use the new infrastructure\u2014bridges, roads, new infrastructure that will define a new era of prosperity in regional New Zealand.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000326\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f44431ef-b505-4e94-9f57-a60b0a569bf7\u0022\u003EMy plea: New Zealanders, dismiss the empty promises, and, as I\u2019ve described earlier, the cooker, lentil Green thinking. Kia ora t\u0101tou. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00220f7d126e-c18d-4466-9ebe-d424ae5c4bf6\u0022 data-id=\u002269cc5c3b4fb140f786d35c2668fec00d\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000327\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220f7d126e-c18d-4466-9ebe-d424ae5c4bf6\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002269cc5c3b4fb140f786d35c2668fec00d\u0022\u003ERAWIRI WAITITI (Co-Leader\u2014Te P\u0101ti M\u0101ori):\u003C/span\u003E Well, we\u2019ve heard a lot of rhetoric coming from that side of the House\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000328\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227a76db18-baa4-41c1-b366-89e2c753a1e7\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a5869a934dfd46cfa326ec49a534d1af\u0022\u003EDebbie Ngarewa-Packer\u003C/span\u003E: Harry Potter.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000329\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220f7d126e-c18d-4466-9ebe-d424ae5c4bf6\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022aea511bb98f64345bd6c95e858a337ef\u0022\u003ERAWIRI WAITITI\u003C/span\u003E: \u2014and that was like listening to a Harry Potter movie, not that I\u2019ve watched many. I would suspect that\u2019s what it sounds like: \u201CThat we\u2019re doing the best we can for all of New Zealanders, and the growth strategy, but it\u2019s important to work now to create conditions for future growth!\u201D They talked about employment, but unemployment is up. It\u2019s the furthest up it\u2019s been in a generation, at 4.6 percent. For M\u0101ori, it\u2019s double that: 9 percent unemployment\u2014shame! Shame on you.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000330\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220f7d126e-c18d-4466-9ebe-d424ae5c4bf6\u0022\u003EM\u0101ori debt\u2014no surplus. There\u2019s more debt, no surplus. It\u2019s different Government, same story for M\u0101ori. This is what happens when you put a landlord who flips houses for profit in charge of the country. This is what happens. I\u2019ve got a bit lost with David Seymour\u2019s k\u014Drero. I know he\u2019s not lost because he\u2019s got an \u201Catlas\u201D. He\u2019s got an atlas to show him the way, and when you hear the rhetoric coming out of that side, they\u2019ve all got an atlas. You hear \u201Celite M\u0101ori\u201D, you hear all of that. All of that has been orchestrated by their atlas you use to ensure that you don\u2019t get lost when you\u2019re using the mother of right-wing think tanks\u2014when you\u2019ve got the mother of right-wing think tanks and the mother of the past chairperson of Atlas Network giving money, donating money to ACT. Dame Jenny Gibbs\u2014absolutely: $50,000. You can tell that they have an atlas that makes sure that they don\u2019t get lost, and lost in a way that continues their policies to benefit the 2\u00A0percent of the population that control 50 percent of this country\u2019s wealth. That is what we\u2019re dealing with.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000331\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220f7d126e-c18d-4466-9ebe-d424ae5c4bf6\u0022\u003EYou get $3 billion in tax cuts for landlords while more than 2 million people are earning less than $30,000 per year. You get a tax system that lets the richest New Zealanders get away with only paying 9.4 percent in tax while the rest pay 20 percent. You get a Prime Minister who makes $769,500 in untaxed capital gains while he cuts school lunches. Five more years of deficit means five more years of p\u014Dharatanga\u2014of austerity and pain for our people.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000332\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220f7d126e-c18d-4466-9ebe-d424ae5c4bf6\u0022\u003EThis Government is facilitating the biggest transfer of wealth in a generation from hard-working wh\u0101nau to property developers and landlords, all while putting our country in an economic hole. As people, they are ripping off the working class, the poor, and we\u2019ll have to dig ourselves out of this hole. Talk is cheap\u2014talk is cheap, unless you are the Minister of Finance. When you\u2019re the Minister of Finance, it costs $1 million an hour. That is how much this Government is borrowing to make up the services they cut. This Government can borrow billions for deficits of their own making, cut jobs of hard-working people, cuts to healthcare, and give landlords a free ride. Where is the investment? It isn\u2019t where it should be, in the future of our mokopuna.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000333\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220f7d126e-c18d-4466-9ebe-d424ae5c4bf6\u0022\u003EReal deficits are staring at us in the face: a housing crisis that leaves wh\u0101nau in garages, a health deficit that sends M\u0101ori to their graves early, an education deficit that is cutting funding to critical areas, an economic deficit of their own making; deficits that keep hard-working wh\u0101nau struggling and the wealthier getting richer.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000334\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220f7d126e-c18d-4466-9ebe-d424ae5c4bf6\u0022\u003EThe Half Year Economic and Fiscal Update paints a clear picture of the Government entrenched in the deficit and debt, yet blind to the realities that M\u0101ori communities face every single day. This Government has a choice: it can perpetuate the deficit for M\u0101ori or it can invest in us as the solution. It is time to invest in M\u0101ori-led solutions that uplift our wh\u0101nau. We know the answer: they lie in recognising the value of tikanga, rangatiratanga, and kotahitanga as foundational to a thriving Aotearoa. Our message is clear: there can be no fiscal wellbeing without M\u0101ori wellbeing. Deficits will not disappear until M\u0101ori are at the table. Thank you very much, kia ora t\u0101tou.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002237a99b65-4919-4800-830d-3dd7c920d5cd\u0022 data-id=\u0022f88db94427f64db4ac4b8495bbb38c72\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000335\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002237a99b65-4919-4800-830d-3dd7c920d5cd\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022f88db94427f64db4ac4b8495bbb38c72\u0022\u003EHon Dr MEGAN WOODS (Labour\u2014Wigram):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Mr Speaker. This debate started, within the first minute or so, with the Leader of the House calling a point of order and asking why our finance spokesperson in Labour was talking about people. I think there could be no greater moment in this debate that shows what this Government is about\u2014and it certainly is not about people. It is about the child that Barbara Edmonds was talking about. It is about that child and all the other children whose parents are coming into mine and colleagues\u2019 electorate offices who can\u2019t get into transitional housing. Some of them have major medical conditions, but they can\u2019t even get on the waiting list and they\u2019re living in their cars. When we see in this Half Year Economic and Fiscal Update that transitional housing has been removed as a risk, it tells a story of a Government that has given up on its people. Sure, the expenditure on motels has been reduced, but I can tell you, Mr Speaker\u2014and we have many, many cases\u2014they are living in their cars.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000336\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002237a99b65-4919-4800-830d-3dd7c920d5cd\u0022\u003EThen we had the Minister of Finance, who spent her time not only talking about the last Labour Government, but so bereft of vision and ideas, she was talking about the Labour Party Policy Council. Now, I haven\u2019t even resorted to talking about the Labour Party Policy Council in a speech I\u2019ve given in this House, but talking about our conference and our policy council, this is some serious inside bull that shows that that Minister has no vision and no plan for New Zealand.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000337\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002237a99b65-4919-4800-830d-3dd7c920d5cd\u0022\u003EThat is a great tragedy because this document that was delivered today tells a very grim story for New Zealand and it tells a grim story for the people of New Zealand. This is what this Government has to understand: economics is not something that sits outside the domain of people\u2019s everyday lives. This talks about rising unemployment\u2014this talks about unemployment rising further into 2025, more people and more families who cannot get by. This document talks about net core Crown debt peaking at its highest level since 1994. That tells a story about us having to spend more money on that borrowing rather than schools and hospitals and houses. This is about choices this Government has made. Let us not forget that they gave $2.9 billion in tax cuts at the last Budget, when faced with many of the forecasts that we\u2019re seeing continuing in this project.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000338\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002237a99b65-4919-4800-830d-3dd7c920d5cd\u0022\u003EDisturbingly, what it shows is the austere Budgets that are to come in the next two cycles. It confirms the operating allowances of $2.4 billion, but well over a billion dollars of that for Budget 2025 has already been committed. There is $700 million of unallocated operating allowance that remains to be allocated. This means all those things that the Government has yet to deliver on in its coalition agreements and in its manifestos stand next to no chance. We\u2019ve seen the cuts and we see dire warnings in this document that actually the Government is leaving optionality around further cuts\u2014they\u2019re saying, \u201CNo, at the moment, but we\u2019ll reassess and see what economic conditions look like in 2025.\u201D\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000339\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002237a99b65-4919-4800-830d-3dd7c920d5cd\u0022\u003EBe afraid, be very, very afraid, of Budget 2025 and what it is going to bring. It is going to bring more cuts. It certainly isn\u2019t going to bring more spending, and Minister Jones might like to reflect when he\u2019s talking about how great the spending decisions are that are outlined in this document, what the document says about his Regional Infrastructure Fund\u2014the fact that it may need to be adjusted, more money\u2014but Nicola Willis has given a clear message to the country today that she has prioritised tax cuts for landlords and tax breaks to tobacco companies over the fact that New Zealand needs more spending. That is what is coming home to roost. This is a Government that does not understand about that child; it does not understand about people. It is a Government that is failing New Zealanders at every turn.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022713ccc5b-7ff0-4fa5-ab58-4780620184fe\u0022 data-id=\u00224218d381265344bbb6c7867de6e4a02c\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000340\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022713ccc5b-7ff0-4fa5-ab58-4780620184fe\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00224218d381265344bbb6c7867de6e4a02c\u0022\u003EHon SIMON WATTS (Minister of Revenue):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you very much, Mr Speaker. What is clear is that New Zealand, like many other countries, has faced significant economic challenges in recent years. New Zealand businesses and New Zealand households are doing it very tough, and I think the reality is that New Zealand households already know that the results included in this Half Year Economic and Fiscal Update are the reality in which they already face. They see the challenges every day when they go into the supermarket; they see the impacts in their bank account. They see the impacts of what is a result of what has been inherited by this Government\u2014and that is, we have inherited a sick economy.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000341\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022713ccc5b-7ff0-4fa5-ab58-4780620184fe\u0022\u003EWhat this Government has been working very hard on, in only 12 months, is to write the prescription to dose the medicine to get this economy back on track, but the reality is, as we\u2019ve heard today, time and time again, the Opposition are in denial. They still deny that they are the problem and that their actions have led us to where we are today, but New Zealanders are not silly; New Zealanders understand why we are where we are today, and they put the trust in this side of the House to get them out of the ditch and get us back to where we need to be.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000342\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022713ccc5b-7ff0-4fa5-ab58-4780620184fe\u0022\u003ESlower growth in our economy has resulted in lower forecasts of tax revenue. As the Minister of Revenue, I see this very clearly. Revenue forecast, as a result of that constriction in our economy, is down $13 billion over the forecast period, peaking at around a $4 billion reduction per annum over that period. That is a significant reduction in revenue available to Government to fund the public services which we require. The likely comparative numbers around that are the Defence budget and the Police budget. Together, they do not even add up to $13 billion. That is the quantum of reduction of economic constriction as a result of decisions made by that prior Government.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000343\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022713ccc5b-7ff0-4fa5-ab58-4780620184fe\u0022\u003EWhat it also has shown in the Treasury forecast is that their over-optimistic assumptions in past forecasts have hidden some of the issues. I wish we had had this forecast when we came into Government. I wish that we could have had this perspective of what is the reality in our fiscal situation and what is only now coming to light as a result of over-optimistic assumptions in past forecasts being corrected. Revised economic forecasts affect the fiscal outlook, and the reality is that this fiscal outlook will continue to be challenging.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000344\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022713ccc5b-7ff0-4fa5-ab58-4780620184fe\u0022\u003EThe Half Year Economic and Fiscal Update reinforces the importance of the trajectory that this Government are leading, which is focused on fiscal discipline around expenditure, getting us back on track, living within our means, only spending what we can afford, and not indebting the future generations of debt that doesn\u2019t deliver anything new\u2014no new significant infrastructure on the increase in debt by that prior Government. That is absolutely disgraceful. And where is the apology? Where is the accountability for the debt that has been laden on future generations by that past Government?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000345\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022713ccc5b-7ff0-4fa5-ab58-4780620184fe\u0022\u003EThey are like crickets. They are crickets because they do not take accountability for their actions, and that is going to be on this side of the House to tidy up that mess, and by hell, we\u2019re going to do that. We are doing that relentlessly and we will continue to do that. Why? Because we understand the reality of hard-working Kiwis around this country. We\u2019re the first to make sure that we\u2019re going to be putting money back into their back pockets\u2014of hard-working Kiwis\u2014not taking it away, not thinking we know how to spend their money better than they do. That is the change in reality, and that is what we will continue. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000346\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022713ccc5b-7ff0-4fa5-ab58-4780620184fe\u0022\u003EWhat is positive to note is that the outlook going forward is going to be better. We know that the economic growth forecast for next year is increasing. We are at a turning point. We are in a turn-round, and the actions that this Government has taken, on this side of our House, are setting the foundations for a successful future in this country which will see increased economic growth, increased value, and increased benefits for hard-working Kiwis.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000347\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022713ccc5b-7ff0-4fa5-ab58-4780620184fe\u0022\u003EThis Government is proud of its contribution and we are proud of the efforts that we will be doing to get this country back on track.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002212d74f81-b1f7-4b51-9fb4-8f9481477192\u0022 data-id=\u002231999587dd854e3ca7f2a5e7482e15c1\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000348\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002212d74f81-b1f7-4b51-9fb4-8f9481477192\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002231999587dd854e3ca7f2a5e7482e15c1\u0022\u003EHon Dr DEBORAH RUSSELL (Labour):\u003C/span\u003E There is something quite revealing in this Half Year Economic and Fiscal Update (HYEFU). It\u2019s talking about the new risks to the Government\u2019s financial statements, the new fiscal risks. On page 67, these statements tell us that the Health New Zealand operating deficit is a risk. What does that tell you about the attitude of that Government? It says that people and their health are a risk, a real risk. Now, they\u2019re worried about the operating deficit in Health New Zealand\u2014a deficit that I might add was run up by some very clever accounting. They say, \u201CThere is a risk that the Crown may be required to provide further funding to support Health New Zealand\u201D. Colleagues, your health, my health, the health of our families, the health of those mums and dads and their children\u2014that Government regards it as a risk; not something that simply must be done but a risk, and that tells you their entire attitude.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000349\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002212d74f81-b1f7-4b51-9fb4-8f9481477192\u0022\u003EWhen we dig into this half-yearly economic and fiscal update, let me start with the sentence that sets the framework. It says, \u201CThe New Zealand economy is experiencing a prolonged period of flat activity.\u201D How is that getting expressed? Well, sitting on the page which has got the inflation data\u2014inflation that was starting to turn down when we were in Government\u2014it tells us that the Quarterly Survey of Business Opinion reports that firms\u00A0have a modest uptick in how they feel about the economy, but the fact is\u2014and I quote\u2014\u201Cfirms are as pessimistic about their current activity as they were during the global financial crisis.\u201D That is on that Government\u2019s watch. They are the Government now; they\u2019ve been there for a year\u2014\u201Cas pessimistic now as they were during the global financial crisis.\u201D Confidence is down. We know that unemployment is going up, but it has increased, it says, \u201Cat a slower-than-expected rate largely owing to more people exiting the [workforce].\u201D\u2014that\u00A0is people leaving New Zealand because of that Government, leaving the workforce and leaving New Zealand. It is a sad state that the economy is in.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000350\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002212d74f81-b1f7-4b51-9fb4-8f9481477192\u0022\u003EThere are all sorts of figures sitting here, but I want to talk to you about the Government\u2019s plan. Their major plan, which they have set out in these documents but have not particularly talked about, is they want to ensure that the economy grows through lifting economic growth to address New Zealand\u2019s long-term productivity challenge. Again, sitting in this document, how do we lift New Zealand\u2019s productivity? Well, we lift it through education, we lift it through science. In particular, we know that if we lift tertiary education, if we ensure that around about 80 percent of New Zealanders have a diploma or a degree, then productivity will lift, but, sitting in here, we can see the funding for tertiary education projected out over the next few years: it doesn\u2019t change at all. In fact, it stays at around about $5 billion. There is no investment in tertiary education.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000351\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002212d74f81-b1f7-4b51-9fb4-8f9481477192\u0022\u003ESitting in here, we can look and see the figures for science expenses. Now, that\u2019s where we get some of our innovation; that\u2019s where the new ideas come through. That\u2019s where our talented people are supported in order to do the science which from time to time generates the idea that brings great innovation to this economy. Science funding: it\u2019s flat or decreasing. In fact, the funding, of course, for Crown research institutes disappears, as we know it\u2019s going to, but there is no indication of what this Government is planning to spend on science. They talk a big talk about lifting productivity, but there is no actual substance there behind their game.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000352\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002212d74f81-b1f7-4b51-9fb4-8f9481477192\u0022\u003EI want to end by talking about their novel financial measure, OBEGAL\u2014operating balance before gains and losses. It\u2019s a standard measure. Alas, that standard measure did not show what the Government wanted, so they\u2019ve created a new measure called OBEGALx, which does give a measure that the Government likes. They have engaged in some more creative accounting. It sits in page 9 of the Budget Policy Statement. We can see that by the time the Government finally gets there, they cannot get OBEGAL, the standard accounting measure, over the line, but by creating OBEGALx they can claim a success. I suggest that the Government does this a little bit more. It could have \u201CDunedin Hospital X\u201D and claim that Dunedin Hospital has been built as promised. Perhaps they could have the \u201Cchild poverty targets X\u201D. They\u2019ve shifted those around so that they can claim that they can meet them. What about the \u201Cferries X\u201D? There\u2019s going to be an X there as well.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000353\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002212d74f81-b1f7-4b51-9fb4-8f9481477192\u0022\u003EThe half-yearly economic and fiscal update\u2014that\u2019s what HYEFU stands for, but I\u2019m going to say it stands for \u201CHow You Economically Fouled it Up\u201D.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002257e41e9d-285b-4fb3-847d-a63820ae7137\u0022 data-id=\u0022117b2dd7668d4290a29bacc6875a8570\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000354\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002257e41e9d-285b-4fb3-847d-a63820ae7137\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022117b2dd7668d4290a29bacc6875a8570\u0022\u003EHon CHRIS BISHOP (Associate Minister of Finance):\u003C/span\u003E It is interesting listening to members opposite, because, as various colleagues on this side of the House have pointed out, it is an extraordinary fiscal fantasyland that the Opposition live in. Having taken net core Crown debt from $57 billion\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000355\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002227535d92-0798-4e04-be80-9e91b53610e2\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022d9aff84e87b44ae3af58cf81f54c243e\u0022\u003EHon Rachel Brooking\u003C/span\u003E: We can remember wage subsidies.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000356\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002257e41e9d-285b-4fb3-847d-a63820ae7137\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00220e79c3de1f384901ace21da87a42dec4\u0022\u003EHon CHRIS BISHOP\u003C/span\u003E: \u2014listen up; this is your record\u2014to $175 billion in just five years, their solution is to borrow more, spend more, and tax more. It\u2019s like the last five, six, seven years just never happened. It is quite extraordinary. How do you come down here to the House, having stuffed the economy, having bequeathed to the incoming Government the Half Year Economic and Fiscal Update (HYEFU) and the Pre-election Economic and Fiscal Update, and the HYEFU that we\u2019re now talking about in this snap debate, and say with a straight face, \u201CDon\u2019t worry. We\u2019ve got the answer\u201D\u2014says Deborah Russell and Barbara Edmonds and all of the also-rans on the other side\u2014\u201CDon\u2019t worry about it. We\u2019ve got the answer. The answer is more debt. The answer is more spending and more tax.\u201D? It\u2019s like the last six years never happened. It is truly an extraordinary fiscal fantasyland that they live in.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000357\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002257e41e9d-285b-4fb3-847d-a63820ae7137\u0022\u003EThe operating balance was in deficit for five years, and now Barbara Edmonds stands up and says, \u201CNicola Willis is running deficits.\u201D Yep, we are running deficits, and we\u2019re determined to get back to surplus as quickly as we can. Barbara Edmonds stands up and says, \u201CWell, the Government is borrowing more. The Government is in debt. The Government is borrowing more.\u201D Yep, we are, because the last Government left us with this extraordinary spending track that we cannot turn around in one Budget alone. Barbara Edmonds says crazy things, like\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000358\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002294b52412-f97b-4bbd-8009-5dc49520f7f4\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022855ecd5394b04e2793bf60e23e48c1a5\u0022\u003ERyan Hamilton\u003C/span\u003E: She does.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000359\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002257e41e9d-285b-4fb3-847d-a63820ae7137\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a3db1379bc6e4188aae4ead88961f145\u0022\u003EHon CHRIS BISHOP\u003C/span\u003E: You haven\u2019t actually heard what I said, but I agree with you; she does. She says crazy things like, \u201CDebt is not the problem.\u201D Her entire question time today to Nicola Willis was to ask a series of questions about increases in debt\u2014after having said, earlier in the year, that debt is not a problem. Well, which is it? Is debt a problem that the Government can be lashed for or is debt something that we don\u2019t need to worry about? The Labour Party need to work out what their best line of attack on the Government is. Is it that we are borrowing too much or is it that we are not borrowing enough? They don\u2019t have their story straight.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000360\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002257e41e9d-285b-4fb3-847d-a63820ae7137\u0022\u003EWell, this Government has got its story straight. This Government\u2019s story is the economic and fiscal reality that we inherited, which is that years and years of high Government spending, much of it wasteful, has driven Government spending to record levels, such that we ran operating deficits for five of the last six years, debt blew out to 42 percent of GDP, and we\u2019ve got to get the country and the Government books back on track. That\u2019s not an easy task, and the HYEFU that we are talking about in this special debate makes that really clear. I thought it was interesting when Barbara Edmonds led off the debate, because I thought we were going to be talking about HYEFU, but actually we spent 90 seconds with a sob story. It was sort of like a year 10 debating speech that somehow made its way into Parliament. It was quite an extraordinary series of events.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000361\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002257e41e9d-285b-4fb3-847d-a63820ae7137\u0022\u003EWe\u2019ve got our story straight, which is that, at the end of the day, what matters? Fiscal discipline matters. Yep, you can keep spending and laying it on the credit card bill, but guess what; eventually the people who lent you money come calling and you have to show a credible path back to surplus. That is what this Government is focused on. That involves tough decisions. It\u2019s really easy in Opposition\u2014I\u2019ve been there\u2014to stand up and say things like, \u201CWe will rebuild the new Dunedin Hospital.\u201D OK. Well, to do that, you actually need to know how much it costs. The Opposition left us a project, with the new Dunedin Hospital, that started life as $1.2 billion and ended up on the thick end of $3 billion. It\u2019s a bit like with iReX\u2014iReX being another paradigmatic example. iReX sounded great when it was first posited: two new ferries for $700 million. Except, they forgot about the $3 billion on top of that to actually house the ferries.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000362\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002257e41e9d-285b-4fb3-847d-a63820ae7137\u0022\u003EGovernment involves tough decisions, and until the Labour Party Opposition get their heads around the fact that there is not a magic money tree at the end of the garden, they will continue to fail. And we are getting this Government\u2019s books back on track.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000363\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002257e41e9d-285b-4fb3-847d-a63820ae7137\u0022\u003EThe debate having concluded, the motion lapsed.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n    \u003C/div\u003E\n    \u003Cdiv class=\u0022HpsHansard\u0022\u003E\n      \u003Cp\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsProceedingHeading\u0022\u003EBills\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000364\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u0022adae0a203e444341bdcb9af448e11054\u0022\u003EFast-track Approvals Bill\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000365\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u0022f8ddcd259872403ea66ceab4e6c0ef4a\u0022\u003EThird Reading\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022f44431ef-b505-4e94-9f57-a60b0a569bf7\u0022 data-id=\u002259ff499a682f4a88a12561e00fed921b\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000366\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f44431ef-b505-4e94-9f57-a60b0a569bf7\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002259ff499a682f4a88a12561e00fed921b\u0022\u003EHon SHANE JONES (Minister for Regional Development) \u003C/span\u003Eon behalf of the Minister responsible for RMA Reform: I present a legislative statement on the Fast-track Approvals Bill.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000367\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002202e74c40-9529-4e15-adc2-c032eadc2205\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022f41662ca0aab40fa83286ae111d79849\u0022\u003EASSISTANT SPEAKER (Greg O\u2019Connor)\u003C/span\u003E: That legislative statement is published under the authority of the House and can be found on the Parliament website.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000368\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f44431ef-b505-4e94-9f57-a60b0a569bf7\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002276222f142cb449eab005bb6a5daac1cc\u0022\u003EHon SHANE JONES\u003C/span\u003E: I move, That the Fast-track Approvals Bill be now read a third\u00A0time.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000369\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f44431ef-b505-4e94-9f57-a60b0a569bf7\u0022\u003EThis is a speech that I will give with a level of seriousness because of the critical importance for the New Zealand public, to the affairs of this House, that this piece of legislation represents. This piece of legislation is built on an innovation that the Hon David Parker introduced during COVID, into this House, to fast track the consideration of proposals dedicated to boosting New Zealand\u2019s resilience. Our party, lost in political wilderness for three years, did a great deal of work as to how David Parker\u2019s efforts could be improved. With that recipe, we came forward and formed the Government, and that Government was formed with the party led by the Prime Minister, and the ACT Party.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000370\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f44431ef-b505-4e94-9f57-a60b0a569bf7\u0022\u003EA key feature of what our party negotiated was the inclusion into a parliamentary body of work called the \u201Cfast-track bill\u201D. In some respects, it ought to have been called the \u201COne-Stop Shop Bill\u201D, because the most important development contained in this bill is the attempt that it makes to conflate multiple consents into a singular process so that those New Zealand investors, those investors who are coming from overseas can join us in our efforts to boost not only our wealth but our resilience and can have confidence that there will be an outcome within a short and reasonable period of time.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000371\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f44431ef-b505-4e94-9f57-a60b0a569bf7\u0022\u003EWe now have, arguably, the most permissive regime to effect growth and development in Australasia. Perhaps, for some people in this Parliament, no higher praise could be recited other than the fact that President Trump in America, himself, has now promised to deliver a fast-track bill if you are willing to spend a billion dollars and turn around the greatest capitalist economy in the world. High praise that I will back myself.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000372\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f44431ef-b505-4e94-9f57-a60b0a569bf7\u0022\u003EI will now continue to acknowledge that a great deal of work was undertaken by the Civil Service. The Environment Committee put in a sterling effort. The people that submitted to the bill\u2014they supported their democratic entitlements to make applications; to have, through the submission process, the bill changed. And changed it was\u2014against what I campaigned for. The authority under this bill for applications to gain consents, to develop our resources, to build roads, to deliver energy will be made by an independent panel; an independent panel\u00A0that I\u2019m hopeful will have the quality of people that the independent assessment panel chaired\u00A0by a well-known lawyer\u2014David Tapsell\u2014undertook the analysis to deliver us the 149 projects that are in the Schedule.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000373\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f44431ef-b505-4e94-9f57-a60b0a569bf7\u0022\u003EIt was a very bleak day that, in a tawdry attempt to capture public attention, members on the other side of the House sought to stigmatise, demonise, and spread a whole host of mythology about applicants, including those who are going to improve the housing outcomes for New Zealand. On behalf of the sentient, respectful members of this House, I want to apologise to the people associated with projects on that list, including the Winton company, that they were dragged through muck, they were misrepresented, and they were subject to a host of demonising remarks that people who made those remarks will never mention such things outside of the House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000374\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f44431ef-b505-4e94-9f57-a60b0a569bf7\u0022\u003EOf course, one of the problems with this bill is it has attracted a great deal of dangerous rhetoric from the other side of the House. Applicants on the Schedule within this bill are now receiving letters from the M\u0101ori Party. The M\u0101ori Party is promising to strip any applicant of\u00A0their resource consent rights that they may achieve under this bill. Now we have the Venezuelan example here in New Zealand: that if you gave a legal, statutory consent, then you\u2019re going to be stripped of it in the event that the M\u0101ori Party forms part of an alternative Government. I can assure you that they have nothing to worry about, because the M\u0101ori Party won\u2019t be here at the next election. If the Serious Fraud Office doesn\u2019t drive them out, the people who voted them in will turn their backs on them, because this bill actually embeds genuine statutory engagement and participation rights for M\u0101oridom.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000375\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f44431ef-b505-4e94-9f57-a60b0a569bf7\u0022\u003EOf course, we will enrich our nation through the minerals sector. The minerals sector is about to get a great boost off the coast of Taranaki, as a consequence of this bill, where people will have a statutory entitlement to apply for a resource consent\u2014something that has been denied them through mythology, cultural fabrications, but science\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000376\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227a76db18-baa4-41c1-b366-89e2c753a1e7\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022391c774ebe8f48d5a3363ecdeb8a329d\u0022\u003EDebbie Ngarewa-Packer\u003C/span\u003E: No one supports you, Shane. No one supports seabed mining.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000377\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002202e74c40-9529-4e15-adc2-c032eadc2205\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022d6705cff0e4d4c15a782ff8a3cbba201\u0022\u003EASSISTANT SPEAKER (Greg O\u2019Connor)\u003C/span\u003E: Ms Ngarewa-Packer, there\u2019s a difference between interjections and a continual commentary, and you\u2019re certainly erring on the latter at the moment. Could you just tone it down a little bit, please.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000378\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f44431ef-b505-4e94-9f57-a60b0a569bf7\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022ef9b083c92f2418bb9328f83ebcc4d46\u0022\u003EHon SHANE JONES\u003C/span\u003E: Sir, there\u2019s a line out of the Bible, \u201CForgive them, they know not what they do.\u201D As I was saying\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000379\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002202e74c40-9529-4e15-adc2-c032eadc2205\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022088106afc0674c72a18e5d6459e9d299\u0022\u003EASSISTANT SPEAKER (Greg O\u2019Connor)\u003C/span\u003E: Well, there\u2019s a line out of the Bible: don\u2019t comment on what comes from the Chair\u2014or some equivalent of\u2014so just carry on, Mr Jones.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000380\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f44431ef-b505-4e94-9f57-a60b0a569bf7\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022537fc4f7bfc44b6f8a06556f6a27652b\u0022\u003EHon SHANE JONES\u003C/span\u003E: Ah, yes. Far for me to give you deified status, but I will take on board what you\u2019ve just said.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000381\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f44431ef-b505-4e94-9f57-a60b0a569bf7\u0022\u003EWhat have I covered off? I\u2019ve covered off that this is pro-development; this is pro-growth. Why are we doing it? We\u2019re doing it because the country needs an economic boost. It will\u00A0achieve economic surplus, jobs that will attract New Zealanders back to the Land of the Long White Cloud, certainty for investors, and where there are opportunities for people to participate, it will be limited to those who actually need to participate.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000382\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f44431ef-b505-4e94-9f57-a60b0a569bf7\u0022\u003EThose who have, in the past, weaponised environmental law, sought to use it for irrelevant purposes such as creating indigenous sovereignty movements inversely related to the wellbeing of New Zealanders or our economy\u2014they will be ruled completely out of court; they will be marginalised because their contribution will not enrich the country.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000383\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f44431ef-b505-4e94-9f57-a60b0a569bf7\u0022\u003ENow, on the question of \u201CWhere to from here?\u201D: shortly, the apparatus will be in place for the fast-track bill to be operationalised. As we go forward over the next 12 to 15 months, where there may be examples that in the operationalisation, this majestic piece of legislation needs further refinement, those opportunities will be seized, but they\u2019ll be driven by people who are investing their own time, their own money, and they have a desire to create wealth and an upgrade of the quality of life in New Zealand throughout the four winds.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000384\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f44431ef-b505-4e94-9f57-a60b0a569bf7\u0022\u003EI look forward to massive growth in the mining sector. In fact, it was only Friday that an additional $700 million is being invested into the mining sector, on the strength of this bill and, naturally, the quality of the mining Minister\u2019s advocacy. But humility requires me to not say much more about that.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000385\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f44431ef-b505-4e94-9f57-a60b0a569bf7\u0022\u003EWe\u2019ll also see water storage. We\u2019ll see the projects that have been hobbled, undermined, and marginalised through factors that don\u2019t belong in resource management law. Sadly, that side of the House has sought to elevate factors that are inversely related to economic growth and economic development. We are going to see the expansion not only of irrigation and water\u2014because unlike what blighted Hawke\u2019s Bay water development options, this bill gives a level of certainty because decisions will be made on the basis of economic rationalism, scientific certainty, and not fabricating tikanga M\u0101ori that lessens the status of M\u0101ori culture because it becomes weaponised in the part of ideology that is actually alien and foreign to all Kiwis who want to create an opportunity to boost the economy. The economy boost is coming through fast track.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002202e74c40-9529-4e15-adc2-c032eadc2205\u0022 data-id=\u002276b8a6312b39452391d921ad3800fb70\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000386\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002202e74c40-9529-4e15-adc2-c032eadc2205\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002276b8a6312b39452391d921ad3800fb70\u0022\u003EASSISTANT SPEAKER (Greg O\u2019Connor)\u003C/span\u003E: The question is that the motion be agreed to. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002227535d92-0798-4e04-be80-9e91b53610e2\u0022 data-id=\u0022a83a9cb05dba45e5b4956d75a71091ea\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000387\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002227535d92-0798-4e04-be80-9e91b53610e2\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022a83a9cb05dba45e5b4956d75a71091ea\u0022\u003EHon RACHEL BROOKING (Labour\u2014Dunedin):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Mr Speaker. I want to start what will be a serious speech about a very serious topic, which is the statement that the\u00A0Government members make over and over again that this bill was based on David Parker\u2019s fast track. Why I want to do that is to make the point to disagree with something that the Government members have been suggesting, which is that the Labour Party is anti-development and anti-housing. That is quite wrong\u2014we are neither of those things. We had the Spatial Planning Act and the Natural and Built Environment Act, which included a fast track, which will remain on the books for some time. There is no need for this fast-track bill, which totally overrides all of our environmental protections, and that is a key component\u2014a\u00A0key difference\u2014that I am going to talk about some more in a minute. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000388\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002227535d92-0798-4e04-be80-9e91b53610e2\u0022\u003EYou could argue, as the Minister for Regional Development has just said, that this bill should have been called the \u201COne-stop Shop Bill\u201D, and that is a significant difference from\u00A0David Parker\u2019s fast-track bills. That is not the aspect of this bill that we have been so deeply opposed to. What we in the Labour Party are deeply opposed to is the overriding of our environmental protections for a select few that have got their names on a list, and it\u2019s a disgrace. We have seen a terrible process with this bill. Yes, the bill did go to the select committee for six months, which is unusual for this Government, but then we came back and we reported back, and we didn\u2019t have that list of 149 projects. The Environment Committee had never seen that.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000389\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002227535d92-0798-4e04-be80-9e91b53610e2\u0022\u003EWe came back, and on the day\u2014in the afternoon\u2014that we were starting the committee debate on this bill, which is the debate where we get to ask serious questions and have, hopefully, useful commentary on the Hansard from the Ministers, that was the day that we saw a giant Amendment Paper, a Government Amendment Paper, on the bill. Many of the issues included in that giant amendment were never traversed by the Ministers in the chair. There were some specific questions that were answered, many specific questions were not, and there were no general statements on those changes. Then, when we were debating in the committee stage of the bill, the Minister had to put up a number of other amendments during the committee stage of the debate because that Amendment Paper 238, in Minister Bishop\u2019s name, was big and significant and there had not been enough rigour applied to it, and that just goes to show what nincompoops this Government are. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000390\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002227535d92-0798-4e04-be80-9e91b53610e2\u0022\u003EThere is no social licence for the projects included in this bill, which means that there is no certainty for them, and why there is no social licence is, as we\u2019ve just heard Minister Jones say that people like members of the community, environmental groups, neighbours that aren\u2019t adjoining, and iwi groups that don\u2019t have Treaty settlements have no input into these processes. There\u2019s that problem. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000391\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002227535d92-0798-4e04-be80-9e91b53610e2\u0022\u003EThen we know that the purpose of the bill doesn\u2019t refer to the environment or terms like\u00A0\u201Csustainable management\u201D, despite all the advice going to the Minister saying that that should be included. I\u2019ve just heard from the Minister Jones how he was being modest, or saying something about being modest in the minerals sector. Well, I was reminded the other\u00A0night that Straterra, the advocacy group for the minerals sector, submitted that they wanted an environmental clause included in that purpose of the bill. They don\u2019t want this bill\u00A0to override all of our environmental protections, because they know that when they go to their international investors and the like, and try and show that they have adhered to good environmental regulations, it will be impossible to do that under the fast track in that form, of course. They did also apply to be on that list of 149, which, in my view, is problematic. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000392\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002227535d92-0798-4e04-be80-9e91b53610e2\u0022\u003ENow, because there is no social licence, and because these projects are going across just because the Ministers agreed for them to be on the list, some of those projects will have large environmental effects and will really muck up the livelihoods of those around them. Not all of the projects\u2014of course, this is a cynical Government that makes sure that it puts projects on the list that they know will be popular, like some housing projects and some renewable energy projects. But then there is the coalmine in the kiwi habitat, the housing on flood plains, and who knows what else will come to pass, because, of course, new projects can be added? There will be protests, and that will lead to uncertainty, and my advice to applicants is to not use this process. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000393\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002227535d92-0798-4e04-be80-9e91b53610e2\u0022\u003EThen, of course, we\u2019ve had the debate\u2014we had the Clerk rule and the Speaker overturn him\u2014that those 149 projects listed in this bill are getting a private benefit. The Minister, or one of the Ministers, may say, \u201CWell, they not getting consents and they can be declined.\u201D That is true that they can be declined, but it\u2019s very unlikely that they will be declined once they\u2019re on this list because of how the bill is written\u2014that is, the primary focus of decision makers has to be on that purpose, which is to facilitate the projects\u2014and these applications can be for things that are prohibited under the Resource Management Act, which means that it is not possible to get a resource consent. An applicant can go from not being able to even get a consent because something is prohibited, to being able to get a consent, and that is a private gain. That is why these projects should have been included on private bills, and not in this Government\u2019s piece of legislation. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000394\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002227535d92-0798-4e04-be80-9e91b53610e2\u0022\u003EWe\u2019ve heard a lot about the zombie projects, which are those projects that have already been declined, and the Minister might say, \u201CWell, they can submit different proposals, proposals where the environmental effects have been modified.\u201D I put up an amendment so that that could be the case, but, like with all my other amendments, of course the Government voted against it, and then, since we were in the committee stage last week, we have had the delivery of some of the information about those applications for the 149 listed projects and\u00A0we can see from those that there is no change from what was applied for and what was declined in the past. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000395\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002227535d92-0798-4e04-be80-9e91b53610e2\u0022\u003EThat is a very real private benefit to those companies on that list. Those companies that have already been declined consent could not go ahead with their projects. Now, they have the opportunity to do that and it\u2019s highly likely that they will proceed in some form or other, and that is a disgrace. It\u2019s a disgrace to our public law system that donors to the Government can get themselves on to a list, and, hopefully, everybody can realise why that is dangerous and why it is that we have these conventions that Government bills can specify different groups of people, but not individuals and not individual companies. It is a disgrace. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000396\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002227535d92-0798-4e04-be80-9e91b53610e2\u0022\u003EWe of course\u2014and I\u2019ll talk about this in the next bill, as well\u2014have made bipartisan offers to talk with the Government, and they\u2019ve come to nothing. This is an extremely radical law. It\u2019s good that the ministerial decision-making was changed, and I thank those people who protested against the fast-track bill when it was in that form, but this is still radical law.  This is still law that changes our constitutional arrangements. It\u2019s bad for New Zealand\u2019s reputation. It\u2019s bad for democracy. It creates uncertainty. Any future Government that might look to review these consents that are granted that are going to harm the environment\u2014it\u2019s not on them; it\u2019s on this Government for producing such a horrendous Act that goes against so many of New Zealand\u2019s norms of fairness and having the same rules apply to everyone. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002246269786-ecb4-40e2-972a-e287c495bdec\u0022 data-id=\u0022835b523b454c4dbea55a6bc390908114\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000397\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002246269786-ecb4-40e2-972a-e287c495bdec\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022835b523b454c4dbea55a6bc390908114\u0022\u003ELAN PHAM (Green):\u003C/span\u003E T\u0113n\u0101 koe, Mr Speaker. It\u2019s with a heavy heart and disappointment and genuine dismay that I speak here today on this complete abomination of a fast-track bill bulldozing its final way through Parliament. My dismay is ultimately because it sets up this new legal framework that specifically, and very definitively, creates this process where private profit of the few can so brazenly trump our people and te taiao\u2014our environment.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000398\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002246269786-ecb4-40e2-972a-e287c495bdec\u0022\u003EIt was summed up really eloquently by the Parliamentary Commissioner for the Environment in their submission on the fast-track bill, and they described it as having one set of rules for everyone and then another set through fast track for \u201Cthe big end of town\u201D. It feels genuinely like this Government is in some sort of alternate universe to be here in 2024, when all the weight of science, of research, of evidence, of m\u0101tauranga\u2014our literal ways of knowing\u2014tell us that we\u2019re in trouble. It tells us that our environment is in trouble and we can\u2019t keep taking it for granted and exploiting it. Yet this Government is here today passing this destructive fast-track bill. How can it be that they have the access to every piece of information and evidence and experience in our communities and in this building and yet understand so very little?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000399\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002246269786-ecb4-40e2-972a-e287c495bdec\u0022\u003EIt\u2019s been really clear from the start that the public didn\u2019t want, and still don\u2019t want, this bill. Only 0.6 percent of submitters actually supported this bill. Over 27,000 people actually submitted, and almost 55,000 if we include petitions. We\u2019d had so many voices across the country saying they don\u2019t want these projects, some of which have already been declined by the courts because of their significant harm to either communities or the environment. I just wanted to elevate a snapshot of just a few of those voices and their very accurate descriptions of the bill.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000400\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002246269786-ecb4-40e2-972a-e287c495bdec\u0022\u003EThe first one: \u201CIt prioritises corporate interests over environmental and human protection.\u201D Too right it does, and yet somehow the Environment Committee actually strengthened, not weakened, this aspect in directing that decisions are made giving the greatest weight\u2014the greatest weight\u2014in the bill to the purpose of development at all costs now being made a reality today. Here\u2019s another submitter: \u201CIt dismantles decades of environmental safeguards, posing a grave risk to both people and the economy.\u201D Again, it is completely accurate, in that\u00A0this is a bill that relegates what we did once consider\u2014you know, our already pitiful state of environmental protections are now relegated to mere considerations under this bill and directed to be overridden by development.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000401\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002246269786-ecb4-40e2-972a-e287c495bdec\u0022\u003EIt\u2019s an unexpected and unwanted merry Christmas to Aotearoa where what were our environmental protections are now virtually non-existent. You could describe them as a threatened species on the verge of extinction, and that is unacceptable in 2024. Even in the committee of the whole House, the Minister wouldn\u2019t address the question of where environmental outcomes actually sit in this bill. There\u2019s no answer to that because no one wants to be put on the record in 2024 to admit that the environment is actually at the bottom.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000402\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002246269786-ecb4-40e2-972a-e287c495bdec\u0022\u003ETe Tai Kaha M\u0101ori collective, among so many others who submitted, brought up this bill\u2019s regard for Te Tiriti when they said \u201CDevelopment can be done sustainably and sound environmental management is good for economic development. The bill just does not provide a framework to strike the right balance. It disproportionately prioritises development over te taiao.\u201D Again, they\u2019re spot on. This bill violates M\u0101ori rights and Te Tiriti in failing to provide for the unique role of tangata whenua as kaitiaki. It completely fails to safeguard their ability to meaningfully and substantively engage in the exercise of tino rangatiratanga and mana whakahaere in their rohe.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000403\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002246269786-ecb4-40e2-972a-e287c495bdec\u0022\u003EIt\u2019s really hard to gauge from the select committee process and in this Chamber who from the Government side is actually listening or paying attention. I keep thinking if they knew what was really in this bill, if they knew the places and communities that would be put at serious risk by these projects, they would not be passing this bill. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000404\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002246269786-ecb4-40e2-972a-e287c495bdec\u0022\u003EI wanted to touch really briefly on two of these projects just to highlight why. Now, the first glaring example is the Waimate waste incineration plant. It\u2019s a disaster waiting to happen in terms of highlighting how serious these impacts on people and te taiao are. These plants\u00A0overseas, where they\u2019ve been in operation for a number of years, have been proven to be so harmful to people and the environment that a number of countries, particularly across the EU, are now decommissioning or banning them. Fonterra actually opposed a similar plant being proposed in Te Awamutu, due to staff welfare concerns. The council don\u2019t want it, Waihao r\u016Bnaka don\u2019t want it, the school doesn\u2019t want it, the local GP doesn\u2019t want it, the neighbouring farmers don\u2019t want it, and yet under fast track, here is a pathway to allow this project to happen.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000405\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002246269786-ecb4-40e2-972a-e287c495bdec\u0022\u003EWe\u2019ve got the Bendigo-Ophir open-cast goldmine by Santana, and this breaches the outstanding landscape provisions in the district plan. It crosses numerous conservation covenants. It threatens not only the water supply but the burgeoning wine industry that has taken hold not only in the valley but the wider Central Otago region. It\u2019s all at stake. It\u2019s all up for sale when we allow these pathways for private companies to benefit and override the good and wellbeing of everyone else.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000406\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002246269786-ecb4-40e2-972a-e287c495bdec\u0022\u003ENow, in both of these cases, the local council and mayor have made clear that they don\u2019t want these projects in their areas. How can this Government go on trumpeting about localism and then pass this bill that so comprehensively discards the wishes of community and their democratic rights in forming their district and regional plans? I am still yet to hear any rationale about why prohibited activities should still be eligible for approval under this bill.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000407\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002246269786-ecb4-40e2-972a-e287c495bdec\u0022\u003EThis is the level of recklessness in this bill. It\u2019s been unprecedented in the way it\u2019s actually threatened the integrity of this Parliament in going against the advice of the Clerks and the majority of our Speakers in this House. We want to make it really clear when it comes to Te P\u0101ti Kakariki that we will not let this happen. We want every company and every individual and every shareholder to know that, yes, this process is risky\u2014it risks all of our environment; it risks all of our local voice\u2014and we believe companies and shareholders that try to get approvals under this bill should bear that risk, not our communities.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000408\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002246269786-ecb4-40e2-972a-e287c495bdec\u0022\u003EWe absolutely commit to reviewing and potentially revoking every consent rammed through under this fast-track bill, because if these companies want to come and give so little disregard to Te Tiriti, to our democratic process, and to our environmental protections, then there is no security for them in that and they have no future here in Aotearoa\u2014and we make absolutely no apology for that. Fast track deserves to be consigned to the ashes of history, and Te P\u0101ti Kakariki oppose it every single step of the way.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022cfc7092e-b202-4acf-aa9c-8aebd551cc39\u0022 data-id=\u0022cf108c4d6bca4b31b96cfe174d1d8864\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000409\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cfc7092e-b202-4acf-aa9c-8aebd551cc39\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022cf108c4d6bca4b31b96cfe174d1d8864\u0022\u003ECAMERON LUXTON (ACT):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Mr Speaker. I rise to speak in support of the Fast-track Approvals Bill on behalf of the ACT Party. Growing productivity in this country is an important part of what this Government is trying to achieve so that we can get our country in a state of affairs economically where we can afford to pay for the \u201Cnice-to-haves\u201D.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000410\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cfc7092e-b202-4acf-aa9c-8aebd551cc39\u0022\u003EWe also want to be able to build stuff, and after the nincompoops on the other side created an obstruction economy, it\u2019s getting ever-harder to do that. We spend, according to the Infrastructure Commission, over $1.3 billion a year on consenting. That is a sunk cost that we cannot afford in a housing crisis, in a massive infrastructure deficit, and in a country where we are signing up to ambitious climate change targets.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000411\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cfc7092e-b202-4acf-aa9c-8aebd551cc39\u0022\u003EThis bill will be a one-stop shop to bring 10 Acts of Parliament into one to make it easier to consent, and I commend it to the House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002202e74c40-9529-4e15-adc2-c032eadc2205\u0022 data-id=\u002243254e38b0f74223bf94c938d080acfc\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000412\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002202e74c40-9529-4e15-adc2-c032eadc2205\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002243254e38b0f74223bf94c938d080acfc\u0022\u003EASSISTANT SPEAKER (Greg O\u2019Connor)\u003C/span\u003E: Just before we take the next speaker, I\u2019d invite the member\u2014there isn\u2019t a list of terms you can use to call the Opposition, but I just wonder whether it reflects well on him, some of the terms that he does use, but I\u2019ll leave that with him.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000413\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cfc7092e-b202-4acf-aa9c-8aebd551cc39\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00229f8f9079ef4d40de974f668b814b5eb4\u0022\u003ECameron Luxton\u003C/span\u003E: Point of order.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000414\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002202e74c40-9529-4e15-adc2-c032eadc2205\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022e87f2a0c9df94d929231cabd90fa581d\u0022\u003EASSISTANT SPEAKER (Greg O\u2019Connor)\u003C/span\u003E: No, no; it\u2019s just an observation, but I\u2019ll leave it to him to reflect on that himself.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00225665380b-62fd-4d75-85e0-0ed801a402e0\u0022 data-id=\u00226d01429742a5459d83be4719205505f2\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000415\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225665380b-62fd-4d75-85e0-0ed801a402e0\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00226d01429742a5459d83be4719205505f2\u0022\u003EMIKE BUTTERICK (National\u2014Wairarapa): \u003C/span\u003EThank you, Mr Speaker. This is a great bill, and this will get our infrastructure and our economy back on track. I\u2019m thrilled to commend it to the House. [Disturbance in public gallery]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002202e74c40-9529-4e15-adc2-c032eadc2205\u0022 data-id=\u0022ec0580f5cd704891a925b4d9b7dfeab2\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000416\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002202e74c40-9529-4e15-adc2-c032eadc2205\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022ec0580f5cd704891a925b4d9b7dfeab2\u0022\u003EASSISTANT SPEAKER (Greg O\u2019Connor)\u003C/span\u003E: Leave the House! Leave! No, no, don\u2019t do that, members\u2014don\u2019t interfere. [Disturbance in public gallery continues] Leave the House! All right. Thank you, House, for maintaining your composure. That was appreciated. No one here will have known that was going to happen. It doesn\u2019t do anyone any good when that happens. Thank you, we\u2019ll carry on. Who was the next speaker? It is Te P\u0101ti M\u0101ori\u2014Debbie Ngarewa-Packer.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00227a76db18-baa4-41c1-b366-89e2c753a1e7\u0022 data-id=\u0022f3db4af5889743408901a3a9fe1c8fe9\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000417\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227a76db18-baa4-41c1-b366-89e2c753a1e7\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022f3db4af5889743408901a3a9fe1c8fe9\u0022\u003EDEBBIE NGAREWA-PACKER (Co-Leader\u2014Te P\u0101ti M\u0101ori):\u003C/span\u003E T\u0113n\u0101 koe e te P\u012Bka. I guess they are part of the 83 percent that oppose this bill. This is what we need to remind ourselves: that that type of behaviour is felt very strongly in the communities that I represent and move along, because the fast-track bill, no matter how you want to call it\u2014I heard the Minister say, \u201COh, we should call it the \u2018One-stop Shop\u2019.\u201D Oh hell, no! This is what we would call the \u201CRam Raid Bill\u201D. It\u2019s a ram raid bill; it\u2019s going to bulldoze itself through our environments, bulldoze through the communities, bulldoze over those who passionately\u2014passionately\u2014don\u2019t want to see things happen in their communities.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000418\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227a76db18-baa4-41c1-b366-89e2c753a1e7\u0022\u003EThe Government has chosen to ignore them, using the terminology of economic development. Do not insult our intelligence. Do not insult those communities that live there and know their communities better than the Government ever will that this is what this bill is about. It is a shortcut. That\u2019s the concern that we can see out in the community: that there is a shortcut. It gives no effect to our role and our rights as tangata whenua and mana whenua. It gives no effect to Te Tiriti. It gives no effect to those who are here intergenerationally looking after our communities.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000419\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227a76db18-baa4-41c1-b366-89e2c753a1e7\u0022\u003EIn fact, what we\u2019ve seen unleashed is scathing attacks from the very Minister that started the k\u014Drero today: \u201CPixie-like hap\u016B, we\u2019re going to milk mother Earth of everything she has.\u201D The arrogance that has come out of this Government in thinking that there would be no consequences. I think there was another terminology\u2014and, again, it\u2019s not lost on any of us\u2014\u201Cexcessive wokeness\u201D. Well, isn\u2019t that interesting? There was never any excessive wokeness when we saw quarry connections to the Ministers and donors, because that is what this is. It is not lost on us what this is about. It is not lost on us that this has been directed very, very clearly by those who actually have an atlas to be able to show their way forward in Aotearoa\u2019s economy. The atlas has shown everyone really what it is that\u2019s at stake here. The arrogance in this bill has been unprecedented.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000420\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227a76db18-baa4-41c1-b366-89e2c753a1e7\u0022\u003EThe flaws\u2014and we\u2019ve seen this. I want to really talk about a couple of the other projects, because I\u2019m not here with a full 10 minutes, like those who actually only spoke for a minute. What we have here is a Government that has been allowed to bring back to life, to resurrect, to bring zombie projects back that every court in Aotearoa had said were not good enough\u2014their practices were not good enough. They could not meet the threshold that we require in\u00A0our highest environmental threshold. Again, I talk about Trans-Tasman Resources, who promised to bring $1 billion to Aotearoa\u2019s economy and, in fact, their promises were so bad, they had\u00A0to do a formal retraction to the Australian Stock Exchange. What the heck is that economic strategy? Four judges agreed\u2014four judges agreed\u2014on New Zealand\u2019s legal obligation in this threshold not only to Te Tiriti but to the international ocean law.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000421\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227a76db18-baa4-41c1-b366-89e2c753a1e7\u0022\u003EWhat we have here is a Government that\u2019s ignored it. They do not care that we are allowing seabed mining into our oceans. They do not care that the rest of the world is sitting there, shunning seabed mining. They do not care that no one in the communities\u2014including their own voters; including those who voted for the general seats in Whanganui, who have been sitting there, making that MP know very strongly what they think about it. We\u2019ve got Ministers with no experience prepared to gamble the safety of our ocean with an experimental sector that failed to meet any environmental thresholds\u2014again, I\u2019ll repeat\u2014not just in one court, not in two courts, not in three courts; in four courts. And we\u2019ve been expected to believe this Government\u2019s whole agenda is economic development. Rubbish!\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000422\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227a76db18-baa4-41c1-b366-89e2c753a1e7\u0022\u003EWhat we have here, sadly\u2014and I\u2019m going to say this again\u2014when we had a Minister say only a small group in Taranaki are against Trans-Tasman Resources seabed mining, that could not be more further from the truth. That is the arrogance that has been fabricated that we\u2019re all prepared to have to listen to. This whole analogy of economic anaemia\u2014economic anaemia. Well, what we\u2019ve seen is bloated greed\u2014bloated greed\u2014at the expense of our environments and then bloated greed at the expense of our communities, who they will never ever bother to go and see.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000423\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227a76db18-baa4-41c1-b366-89e2c753a1e7\u0022\u003EI think what we\u2019ve got to remember is that the saddest part about this bill\u2014it\u2019s the darkest part about this bill\u2014is that there is absolutely no accountability to the 83 percent who voted against it; to the communities in Taranaki that, through their own hard efforts, funded numerous courts, right up until the Supreme Court, who ruled against Trans-Tasman Resources\u2019 ability to be able to safely mine. They ruled, in effect, for the rule of caution for all generations of Aotearoa. This bill is a shameful disgrace and a slight on this Government, unsurprisingly.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022e29c400e-467a-4398-818d-270ef48b80cf\u0022 data-id=\u00223fc53902e7384219a8ab20ce15d5018c\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000424\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e29c400e-467a-4398-818d-270ef48b80cf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00223fc53902e7384219a8ab20ce15d5018c\u0022\u003ESTEVE ABEL (Green):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Mr Speaker. Across this country today, in multiple regions, there\u2019ll be people who care about the environment, people who care about the principles of Te Tiriti o Waitangi, and people who care about democracy who will be lamenting, who will be thinking, \u201CComing to my area soon is a rushed and fast-tracked project\u201D\u2014without the licence, without the consent of the local people; in fact, explicitly overriding the will and the wishes of the local people. That\u2019s what this fast-track bill does.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000425\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e29c400e-467a-4398-818d-270ef48b80cf\u0022\u003EFrom Trans-Tasman Resources in Taranaki, where the extraordinarily destructive seabed mining is scheduled to occur\u2014the people have resisted for over a decade. The local community, the local iwi, and the fishing industry themselves have resisted, and non-Government organisations. It has been kicked back by the Supreme Court. It has been kicked back by every consideration body in the country.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000426\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e29c400e-467a-4398-818d-270ef48b80cf\u0022\u003EThe Tukituki water project, the Ruataniwha Dam\u2014back from the dead\u2014the zombie project that the people of the Hawke\u2019s Bay stood up and resisted and opposed and that had no credibility; Bathurst coal extension on the West Coast of the South Island. The Waitaha Hydro Project, in the magnificent river of the West Coast of the South Island, was found to be so destructive and harmful for the environment that it was turned down and turned back. The significant impacts on the natural character of the area made it not worth it.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000427\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e29c400e-467a-4398-818d-270ef48b80cf\u0022\u003EThe OceanaGold project by Macraes in Otago, establishing a huge open-pit mine with a byproduct of cyanide tailings dams and a byproduct of arsenic contamination for generations to come\u2014because goldmining leaves a legacy for decades, in fact centuries, after the Aussie goldminers have packed up and gone home. You could call this the \u201CAussie Mining Fast-track Bill\u201D, because you think about Trans-Tasman Resources, you think about all these gold miners, you think about the Bathurst coalminers\u2014what this really does for Aotearoa New Zealand is override the principle that we care about the environment here, and it overrides the principle that the local people should have a say as to what happens in their area.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000428\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e29c400e-467a-4398-818d-270ef48b80cf\u0022\u003EAnd the poor people of Glenavy, in Waimate District, who overwhelmingly expressed their opposition to the waste incineration plant there\u2014overwhelmingly\u2014even the local council has expressed their opposition, and this Government approved the overseas sale. Minister Penk approved that, along with Minister Seymour, to be given to this company, which misled on what it was capable of doing, in terms of reducing carbon dioxide emissions to landfill. It was absolute bunkum what they pitched.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000429\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e29c400e-467a-4398-818d-270ef48b80cf\u0022\u003ETime and again in these projects, the Government has accepted the companies at their word and has permitted them into these projects without thorough evaluation. People throughout this country are lamenting today, and what a backwards step is represented by this fast-track legislation.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000430\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e29c400e-467a-4398-818d-270ef48b80cf\u0022\u003EThe Prime Minister wants to tell us that we should be supporting it because of the renewable energy projects, because of the housing projects. If this was a bill that sought to find a means to fast-track renewable energy projects or housing projects and took into account Te Tiriti o Waitangi and took into account the environment and the climate, the conversation would be very different. It would be a very different conversation, but this is an everything soup of whoever\u2019s next mate wanted to have a crack at doing some project that had been sent to bed and put down and said no to decades ago, years ago.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000431\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e29c400e-467a-4398-818d-270ef48b80cf\u0022\u003EThis is a very sad day, and that Macraes, that OceanaGold in Waih\u012B project\u2014this is the Freddy the Frog killer project. This is the one that will impact Archey\u2019s frog. Well, the people of this country are going to resist these projects in their areas, and we will stand with them in that resistance. We will stand with them, and the worst of these projects, as my colleague has said, shall be subject to re-evaluation in a new Government. We reserve the right to revoke and rescind the permits issued for them, because it is utterly inappropriate and undemocratic and unconstitutional the way that this fast-track bill is pushing through and forcing these projects through against the will and the interests of all New Zealanders.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002255d0b7a4-a2c9-4c38-9b77-475311a48a89\u0022 data-id=\u002241fbefb8b59349a5b8a4ef3e2b7120b4\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000432\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002255d0b7a4-a2c9-4c38-9b77-475311a48a89\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002241fbefb8b59349a5b8a4ef3e2b7120b4\u0022\u003EHon SIMEON BROWN (Minister for Energy):\u003C/span\u003E I stand in support of the Fast-track Approvals Bill, a bill which says yes to jobs, yes to opportunities, yes to energy security, yes to building the roads that are needed to unlock economic growth and opportunity, yes to houses, and yes to making sure that this country can actually deliver the opportunities which keep our children here in New Zealand. On the other side of the House, we see the people who say \u201CNo, no, no\u201D to all of those things, and the people of New Zealand will say no to them at the 2026 election.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022f5d71749-ae91-4af7-b2bd-77260398912a\u0022 data-id=\u0022fbd7563943a84a61b119c5908412f87e\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000433\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f5d71749-ae91-4af7-b2bd-77260398912a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022fbd7563943a84a61b119c5908412f87e\u0022\u003EHon DAVID PARKER (Labour):\u003C/span\u003E We heard it again at question time today, where the Government tried to masquerade this fast-track legislation behind the merits of the earlier versions. We\u2019ve had two prior versions of fast track. The first was the COVID response fast-track, and the second was embedded, on a permanent basis, through the Natural and Built Environment Act, which repealed the Resource Management Act and carried fast track for ever, but there are major differences between those forms of fast track and this one that is in this legislation. Some members have already covered it, but I\u2019m going to reiterate what I think are the important differences. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000434\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f5d71749-ae91-4af7-b2bd-77260398912a\u0022\u003EThe Opposition parties, including the Labour Party, have long acknowledged that there is a problem with excessive costs for consenting mid-size infrastructure, particularly\u2014not so much the larger infrastructure, but the mid-size and smaller infrastructure projects in New Zealand. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000435\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002255d0b7a4-a2c9-4c38-9b77-475311a48a89\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00225609745b7af849be929a566d618c2372\u0022\u003EHon Simeon Brown\u003C/span\u003E: Why did you say no to the Waitaha dam?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000436\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f5d71749-ae91-4af7-b2bd-77260398912a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00221f09cc20f23c4916952d2f6d66ff4de8\u0022\u003EHon DAVID PARKER\u003C/span\u003E: The cost and delay of consenting has been excessive, and we\u00A0in Government proved it through the Infrastructure Commission that we set up, and we remedied it, Mr Simeon Brown, through the legislation that we passed. More than 90\u00A0percent of the projects that went through that fast track were eventually consented. Less than 10 percent were declined, and they were declined for good reasons. That was achieved by focusing on the speed of the process, not by overriding the laws which govern the balance between development and environmental harm.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000437\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f5d71749-ae91-4af7-b2bd-77260398912a\u0022\u003EThere was no need to override the Resource Management Act. We, in our version of fast track, consented wind farms, solar farms\u2014the biggest solar farms ever to be built in New Zealand were consented under our fast track. We consented roads; we consented geothermal. In the next version, renewals of hydro were also able to be fast tracked, but not new hydro projects which for ever alter the environment of a river system that is dammed and inundated. We consented whole new towns. We consented thousands of building opportunities\u2014high rise, some new subdivisions. We consented factories. I think, for Simeon Brown, he\u2019ll also be aware that we consented roads. Not once did we have to override the Conservation Act or the Wildlife Act or the Resource Management Act or the historic places legislation, all of which are necessary.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000438\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f5d71749-ae91-4af7-b2bd-77260398912a\u0022\u003ENow, the Parliamentary Commissioner for the Environment, Simon Upton, a former National Party Minister for the Environment, who has held the highest ever office of a New Zealander in an environmental role overseas in that he was head of the OECD environment division, came to the Environment Committee and said that this legislation is worse than the National Development Act\u20141979, I think it was\u2014passed by Muldoon, and removed by the following Labour Government because it went too far.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000439\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f5d71749-ae91-4af7-b2bd-77260398912a\u0022\u003EHe said that legislation had more checks and balances than this, because that legislation meant that you had, for a large project, a thorough process that people could participate in. The contentious issues could be critiqued, they could be worked through, and a consent was either approved or declined at the end of it. Under this legislation, there is no environmental test to speak of, because the rules in the Conservation Act can be overridden and the Wildlife Act and the historic places legislation and the Resource Management Act, and that means that the environmental outcomes can be worse. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000440\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f5d71749-ae91-4af7-b2bd-77260398912a\u0022\u003EWhat does this mean in practice? We\u2019ve heard from other members that it means that things that couldn\u2019t be consented under the old regime now will be. What are they? They are things that will make New Zealand a worse place to be in. They will extend the life and extent of coalmines. Do many people in this House think that\u2019s a good idea that you should fast track more greenhouse gas emissions? The outgoing chair of the emissions agency, Rod Carr, said digging up more fossil fuels is a crime against humanity. Those are pretty strong words from the leader of our response on climate change, and he was right. That\u2019s what this bill does. It enables more fossil fuel extraction.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000441\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002255d0b7a4-a2c9-4c38-9b77-475311a48a89\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00223db16eeaacbd40f0b7b12fbffc630048\u0022\u003EHon Simeon Brown\u003C/span\u003E: The ban on oil and gas has crashed the energy market.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000442\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f5d71749-ae91-4af7-b2bd-77260398912a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022ff92740951b74e3f8ed31141845f19fd\u0022\u003EHon DAVID PARKER\u003C/span\u003E: While we hear Simeon Brown\u2014look, he\u2019s even worse on energy than he is on roads. This is the man that would double New Zealand\u2019s electricity price by importing liquefied natural gas (LNG). That was his response to a dry year this year\u2014a complete overreaction, just like we had with Nicola Willis on the ferries; head in the sand as to what are the long-term solutions to energy challenges, which involve backing up our intermittent renewables in a dry year. They do not involve importing LNG, which would double the price of electricity in a dry year. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000443\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f5d71749-ae91-4af7-b2bd-77260398912a\u0022\u003ENow, he\u2019s learnt that since, because he shut up on that particular dumb idea that he took to the country just months ago, because he was so embarrassed when he actually saw the advice as to what would be the effect on electricity prices. Those sorts of projects, dumb though they are, could be fast tracked under this legislation.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000444\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f5d71749-ae91-4af7-b2bd-77260398912a\u0022\u003EWhat else can be overridden? Do you know, we haven\u2019t got many rivers protected in New Zealand under water conservation orders, but every one of those water conservation orders is at risk now under this Government, because they would give themselves the right to override a water conservation order protecting an outstanding river, and they have to be an outstanding river to be protected in that way.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000445\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f5d71749-ae91-4af7-b2bd-77260398912a\u0022\u003EWhat\u2019s going to happen to some of the council costs? Under our fast track, we didn\u2019t override a plan. If a plan said you shouldn\u2019t subdivide in that particular area, you had to go through a plan change. You couldn\u2019t override it through a consent with the approval of a Minister saying, \u201COh, we know better. We\u2019re going to force those infrastructure costs upon a council by having an out-of-order subdivision over there, even though there are no libraries and pools and we\u2019re going to have to put in more libraries and pools and there aren\u2019t decent roads and there\u2019s no public transport for people to use. We\u2019re going to override that and we\u2019re going to have a subdivision over there.\u201D It\u2019s quite unprincipled and wrong and unnecessary, as we proved with our version of fast track, because plenty of subdivision opportunities were created under that legislation.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000446\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f5d71749-ae91-4af7-b2bd-77260398912a\u0022\u003EThis legislation is based on a false dichotomy. It says that you cannot have environmental protection and a clean environment. It\u2019s just wrong. If you do it right, you can have both, but you don\u2019t achieve that by having a development-only test in the legislation, enabling Ministers to override other legislation. You don\u2019t achieve that if the only people who can appear as of right are the people who are the applicant and the adjoining landowner. Under our legislation, Business New Zealand could appear, but so could the Environmental Defence Society, and, as a consequence, important information would be put before a decision-making panel before that decision was made. None of that information can be guaranteed to be required now and there is no environmental voice that is required by this legislation.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000447\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f5d71749-ae91-4af7-b2bd-77260398912a\u0022\u003EI think the former Minister for the Environment the Hon Simon Upton was right when he said that, if you\u2019re going to have these extraordinary override powers, you should reserve them for projects that are of a public benefit. Now, I agree with Chris Bishop that not all projects with a public benefit are necessarily owned by the Government or local government. I agree with that, but that\u2019s not what he was saying; he was saying that if there\u2019s a project for a public benefit, you should have these override powers on rare occasions. You do occasionally need them. Legislation already allows for them.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000448\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f5d71749-ae91-4af7-b2bd-77260398912a\u0022\u003ENational direction that is meant to protect the environment already has very wide exemptions for infrastructure, so you can put a road where necessary through a wetland or through an area which is a bird habitat if that\u2019s the only place that the road can go. There are already exceptions provided for that, similarly, in respect of other infrastructure. If the Government really thought we had a problem with being able to consent infrastructure under the existing regime, they should say \u201Cprojects with a public benefit\u201D, as opposed to a private benefit like a private subdivision or a mine\u2014that you should reserve it for those public infrastructure projects rather than conferring these overrides of environmental legislation to the private sector. That\u2019s what he thought. He didn\u2019t like this\u00A0legislation, but he said, \u201CIf you\u2019re going to have those override powers, limit their application.\u201D\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000449\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f5d71749-ae91-4af7-b2bd-77260398912a\u0022\u003EThe other thing is there are some projects that are just so big and contentious that the\u00A0public\u00A0will never be satisfied if there isn\u2019t a process that allows their voice to be heard, and there are sometimes contentious projects that none the less ought to be consented. You\u2019ll never settle down public disquiet if you exclude the people from the process, and that\u2019s one\u00A0of the things that the other fast-track thing didn\u2019t do. It didn\u2019t impose the will of Government in respect of those serious issues where there should be some public process prior to decisions being taken. This is far worse and different to the earlier versions of fast\u00A0track.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002257e41e9d-285b-4fb3-847d-a63820ae7137\u0022 data-id=\u0022cb6a7e207adf4d1d833a94e504e1c89e\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000450\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002257e41e9d-285b-4fb3-847d-a63820ae7137\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022cb6a7e207adf4d1d833a94e504e1c89e\u0022\u003EHon CHRIS BISHOP (Minister responsible for RMA Reform):\u003C/span\u003E It is great to be able to stand here for the third reading of the Fast-track Approvals Bill. I\u2019d like to start by saying thank you to the vast army of officials across the Public Service who have moved at pace over the last year or so to pull this together. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000451\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002257e41e9d-285b-4fb3-847d-a63820ae7137\u0022\u003EThe genesis of this bill has been traversed by the Hon Shane Jones in moving the third reading of this bill. It comes from the desire of the New Zealand First Party to build upon the\u00A0framework left by the Hon David Parker. I accept that he dislikes the comparison between\u00A0the COVID-19 fast-track legislation, but it is true in the most obvious sense that the COVID-19 fast-track legislation is the building block for this legislation. It is more expansive, it is more ambitious, the tests are different, some of the machinery is different\u2014that is true\u2014but the framework, the architecture is similar.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000452\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002257e41e9d-285b-4fb3-847d-a63820ae7137\u0022\u003ENew Zealand First came to us after the election and said, \u201CWe\u2019ve campaigned on this thing called a one-stop shop fast track. How do you feel about it?\u201D The National Party in coalition negotiations signed up to that. I was tasked, as the Minister responsible for RMA\u00A0Reform and as infrastructure Minister, with shepherding it into law, alongside my friend and colleague the Hon Shane Jones. It has been a herculean task. It has been a mammoth undertaking, and a horde of officials from across the Public Service have worked on this: the Ministry for the Environment; the Ministry of Business, Innovation and Employment; the Department of Conservation; the Infrastructure Commission; Crown Law; and the Ministry for Primary Industries. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000453\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002257e41e9d-285b-4fb3-847d-a63820ae7137\u0022\u003EAt one point, when we were having these late-evening meetings in my office, we had to go out and go to all the other offices on the sixth floor and pull together more chairs for the officials. Then it turned out there were more officials sitting on Zoom in the corner of the room overseeing everything on the TV screen. I have somewhat happy memories of those meetings. They were enjoyable meetings on one level, and there\u2019s been an enormous amount of work from across the Public Service, pulling this together. I want to start by saying thank\u00A0you.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000454\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002257e41e9d-285b-4fb3-847d-a63820ae7137\u0022\u003EIt is trite to say, but I\u2019ll say it anyway, that we have a problem in this country with how difficult it is to do things. I actually think there\u2019s broad consensus around the Parliament across that\u2014and that, at least, is progress, because, for quite a long time, that was denied. I actually think there\u2019s broad consensus that it\u2019s too hard to build houses, it\u2019s too hard to build renewable energy, it\u2019s too hard to get a mine consented, and it\u2019s too hard to get a quarry consented in this country\u2014and quarries are critical to the future of construction and infrastructure. It\u2019s too hard to get roads done. It\u2019s too hard to do almost anything. I actually think that the public understand that, and that\u2019s why it\u2019s critical that over the next two years and beyond, we nail resource management reform. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000455\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002257e41e9d-285b-4fb3-847d-a63820ae7137\u0022\u003EIf you go back, the Resource Management Act (RMA) 1991 has been a wrecking ball through the New Zealand economy, and you can directly trace the onset of our housing affordability crisis to the RMA 1991. It actually goes all the way back to the Town and Country Planning Act, but it was supercharged by the RMA 1991. There\u2019s a lot of extensive research about this now. Overly burdensome planning regulations have driven up the cost\u00A0of land and driven up the cost of housing. You can trace our infrastructure cost overruns and blowouts\u2014which actually is occurring under this Government and occurred under the last Government and the Government before that\u2014to the RMA 1991 because of overly punitive conditions, overly litigious court processes, endless debate about the word \u201Cavoid\u201D, endless hours and days and hundreds of millions of dollars spent in court debating singular words, and overly complex and elaborate tests that go all the way to the Supreme Court and beyond, to just build stuff.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000456\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002257e41e9d-285b-4fb3-847d-a63820ae7137\u0022\u003EThe East-West Link project, which members will have different views about, has gone all the way to the Supreme Court and beyond and is coming all the way back down again. It took 10 years to re-consent an existing geothermal power station that got built in the 1950s. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000457\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f5d71749-ae91-4af7-b2bd-77260398912a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00228230451b97c74792a5b118d0aa583360\u0022\u003EHon David Parker\u003C/span\u003E: That\u2019s decades ago, and their consent did not expire.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000458\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002257e41e9d-285b-4fb3-847d-a63820ae7137\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022711e009541004bd19300d7f3c0299749\u0022\u003EHon CHRIS BISHOP\u003C/span\u003E: No, it\u2019s only 15 years ago. Anyway, I\u2019m making a point about the consensus that is now there around difficulty.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000459\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002257e41e9d-285b-4fb3-847d-a63820ae7137\u0022\u003EFast track is a way of cutting through this and it is needed more than ever before because today, HYEFU\u2014the Half Year Economic and Fiscal Update\u2014revealed just how parlous the state of this country\u2019s economy is: anaemic levels of economic growth, a country that has been in recession, a country that is staring mountains and mountains of red ink in the face. Again, members will have a debate about who\u2019s responsible for that, but can we at least acknowledge the reality, which is that so much of our problems as a country could be addressed through economic growth: better health, better education, a better standard of living, better wages, inequality.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000460\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227a76db18-baa4-41c1-b366-89e2c753a1e7\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022576f534ecd4247eca3b8006544bc47bc\u0022\u003EDebbie Ngarewa-Packer\u003C/span\u003E: Regulations for renewable energy. You could have spent 100 days on that. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000461\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002257e41e9d-285b-4fb3-847d-a63820ae7137\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022cd928d720ca74f179a639fac908f2092\u0022\u003EHon CHRIS BISHOP\u003C/span\u003E: Mrs Ngarewa-Packer is ranting away, as she always does, but just not listening to the facts, which is that so many issues that she purports to care about could be solved through economic growth. That is the missing gap in the New Zealand economic story over the last 20 years. That is why we are 30 percent poorer than Australia, because for 30 years we have grown, on average, at a lower rate than they have. Productivity is part of that, and the RMA feeds into that. Fast track is about getting going on these projects and building a pipeline of projects.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000462\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002257e41e9d-285b-4fb3-847d-a63820ae7137\u0022\u003ECan I deal with this public-private distinction? It was really good to hear the Hon David Parker make a point about that. My argument right through the ongoing debate last week about whether there were private benefits in this bill was that the whole debate was facile and actually ridiculous, because we live in a mixed economy. There are public and private electricity generators; there are private deliverers of infrastructure. Many of our airports are privately owned, or some combination of private and public ownership. In the case of mixed-ownership companies, they\u2019re literally listed, and the Government owns 51 percent of them. The Wellington Electricity network is privately owned, for example; people think it\u2019s owned by the council, but it\u2019s not. It\u2019s owned by a foreign company based out of Hong Kong, from memory.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000463\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002257e41e9d-285b-4fb3-847d-a63820ae7137\u0022\u003EThe whole debate is facile, because what we are doing is recognising that, for infrastructure projects and projects of regional national significance, the ownership is, essentially, irrelevant to the question of the public benefit test. So, we are fast-tracking projects that have an ownership structure that is private. I was really disappointed to hear the defamatory remarks of Arena Williams during the debate on the committee stage\u2014remarks, I note, that she has not been prepared to repeat outside Parliament, which I think says it all, and remarks that were grossly disorderly in the sense that she was casting about\u00A0allegations that I think she will regret in time.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000464\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002257e41e9d-285b-4fb3-847d-a63820ae7137\u0022\u003EIt is true that there are private development projects fast tracked through this bill, and the reason for doing so is because of the public benefits that they accrue to the country. We need more houses. Most houses in New Zealand are built by the private sector; they are not built by the Government. We need more renewable energy. Some projects will be built by Meridian, but others will be built by the private sector. We need more mines in this country. Now, we used to own a State-owned coalmining company; we don\u2019t any more\u2014didn\u2019t work out that well. Most projects will be delivered by the private sector. We need more agriculture projects. We need more agriculture in this country, and there are a whole range of iwi projects involved in aquaculture, some of which are listed in the bill.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000465\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002257e41e9d-285b-4fb3-847d-a63820ae7137\u0022\u003EI point out again, as I did during the last debate, that in the COVID-19 fast-track piece of legislation, most of them were public projects, but a couple of them were private projects. We\u2019ve had this debate in the past. Can I finally finish with the disgraceful comments from the M\u0101ori Party\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000466\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227a76db18-baa4-41c1-b366-89e2c753a1e7\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022df85a3c390ab48c7b5bd3d48e55f6349\u0022\u003EDebbie Ngarewa-Packer\u003C/span\u003E: Te P\u0101ti M\u0101ori.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000467\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002257e41e9d-285b-4fb3-847d-a63820ae7137\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00228367fd51e75c4f5f9d0800f902060af5\u0022\u003EHon CHRIS BISHOP\u003C/span\u003E: \u2014Te P\u0101ti M\u0101ori\u2014essentially, trying to make New Zealand into a banana republic. This idea that the M\u0101ori Party or Te P\u0101ti M\u0101ori would\u2014I mean, firstly, the idea they\u2019d ever receive ministerial warrants is frankly fanciful, and we should all make sure that day never happens, because the idea of Debbie Ngarewa-Packer running anything in this Government fills me with dread. The idea that they will get into Government and cancel consents lawfully granted is, frankly, disgraceful, and I call upon the Labour Opposition to rule out such constitutional stupidity.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00223d42e8cf-544e-415d-892b-f4ef8014d80f\u0022 data-id=\u0022c5372de026704f9d99f0ab24aa06f66c\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000468\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d42e8cf-544e-415d-892b-f4ef8014d80f\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022c5372de026704f9d99f0ab24aa06f66c\u0022\u003EASSISTANT SPEAKER (Teanau Tuiono)\u003C/span\u003E: The member\u2019s time has expired.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022b464a62e-d900-452a-b842-e3cf4ccc6149\u0022 data-id=\u00227c7bb53abfd145708ab7d1861dfa7b09\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000469\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b464a62e-d900-452a-b842-e3cf4ccc6149\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00227c7bb53abfd145708ab7d1861dfa7b09\u0022\u003EARENA WILLIAMS (Labour\u2014Manurewa):\u003C/span\u003E The Hon Shane Jones used his speech, on behalf of the Minister responsible for RMA Reform, in this debate, to allege that I have dragged the name of Winton Land company through the muck, and so I would ask him and his ministerial colleagues in this last opportunity that they have before this bill passes to clarify for the House: how many millions will the Winton Land company make when this bill passes? What is the value of Winton\u2019s land before these projects made their way on to the 149-project list, compared to later in this week when this bill becomes law? What is the value of the land when the New Zealand Transport Agency will be required to buy land for a road\u2014land that was not valuable, rural land before this project was mooted, but the project has now been set down in legislation, and public money will go to buy that road\u2014land which was not valuable before but is valuable now?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000470\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b464a62e-d900-452a-b842-e3cf4ccc6149\u0022\u003EThe Ministers who have alleged that those comments are defamatory owe the House an explanation about what is untrue; about the value of private benefit that is going to this company because of this legislation, not only from the value of uplifts of the options that they own on the land but also from the public purse, going straight into the hands of developers who only owned an option on this land and don\u2019t in fact own the land at all. This is a disgrace. This is law that moves private benefit into private hands in a way which has never been done in New Zealand\u2019s legislative process. It should be struck out at this stage. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000471\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002227535d92-0798-4e04-be80-9e91b53610e2\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00224ea6a3f03e7a435d99c6d532462f973a\u0022\u003EHon Rachel Brooking\u003C/span\u003E: It\u2019s a constitutional embarrassment. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000472\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b464a62e-d900-452a-b842-e3cf4ccc6149\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022abb61da2b5bb4682ada49fc99171d264\u0022\u003EARENA WILLIAMS\u003C/span\u003E: None of these amendments should be allowed. It is a constitutional embarrassment, as my colleague the Hon Rachel Brooking has said. This is not how we should be making law in New Zealand, and this is not something that we should ever tolerate again in this way. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000473\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b464a62e-d900-452a-b842-e3cf4ccc6149\u0022\u003EThe Government has used the legislative process to force private development through with none of the normal checks and balances to ensure the public\u2019s interests are properly represented in this. People who live near these developments get to have a say, normally, in the way that these projects are rolled out, and I\u2019ll speak more generally to this: the Government is trying, here, to change our planning laws for the better but this is not how other countries we like to compare ourselves to do these kinds of changes.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000474\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b464a62e-d900-452a-b842-e3cf4ccc6149\u0022\u003EIn the last 10 years, we\u2019ve seen politicians and senior leaders take more accountability for the infrastructure projects that they are championing. Politicians in Australia, in the state of Victoria, getting out in front of their infrastructure projects, leading people along with them, winning the argument in people\u2019s hearts, convincing people that these are important projects and they should happen. This goes in the face of that; this is the opposite to that. This is about ramming through pet projects that people cannot possibly have faith in because they\u2019re a list of 149 projects that people don\u2019t get a look at. Not only was there no public scrutiny in these but this is to the benefit of some developers over others.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000475\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b464a62e-d900-452a-b842-e3cf4ccc6149\u0022\u003EI want to speak directly to supporters of the ACT Party, here: if you\u2019re not on this list, you have lost out. This is not liberalising planning laws, this is not about red-zoning everything for development, this is not about allowing mining everywhere that it could be done; this is about allowing some projects at the expense of others. Small-business owners and medium-sized business owners are losing out because of these projects where someone has more access than those supporters do.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000476\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b464a62e-d900-452a-b842-e3cf4ccc6149\u0022\u003EThis recognises that there are limitations on the kinds of developments that we can do in New Zealand but has prioritised people with the most political access over everybody else who wants to make some money and do some public good. If the Government was serious about this, they would have given serious consideration to exactly those projects where land for roads, land for schools, is now seriously valuable to those people on this list, and money will be changing hands from the public purse directly to private benefit as well. Those projects, above all, should have been struck out.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000477\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b464a62e-d900-452a-b842-e3cf4ccc6149\u0022\u003EI want to also say very briefly, since the Minister has thanked the public officials who have worked on this\u2014they have done a huge and gargantuan task, and it must feel good to get that off the plate before Christmas\u2014this bill tries to require the Public Service act in contravention of the Cabinet Manual, the Public Service Act, and their own procurement processes. We are telling Waka Kotaki and New Zealand Transport Agency officials that they must acquire land from a specific developer who has now benefited to the tune of tens of millions of dollars for the project that they were going to do at a much cheaper rate. Shame\u2014shame\u2014on asking public servants to spend New Zealand public money on schools, on roads which they would not have to have done, and should not have had to have done. This is a disgrace.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00222837c142-c937-468e-9984-bc646d066687\u0022 data-id=\u0022e1c8d2aeaceb4b0a9161918c59c41822\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000478\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00222837c142-c937-468e-9984-bc646d066687\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022e1c8d2aeaceb4b0a9161918c59c41822\u0022\u003EDr HAMISH CAMPBELL (National\u2014Ilam):\u003C/span\u003E The Fast-track Approvals Bill is a crucial step in unlocking New Zealand\u2019s potential. Whether it\u2019s housing or renewable energy or aquaculture, this bill aims to streamline the approval process for infrastructure and development projects which are of significant regional and national benefit. So, therefore, I commend this bill to the House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00221cd33f16-add4-4363-a2d4-f457841a5c4c\u0022 data-id=\u0022545aae347c6948b4976a581727c76309\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000479\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221cd33f16-add4-4363-a2d4-f457841a5c4c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022545aae347c6948b4976a581727c76309\u0022\u003EGLEN BENNETT (Labour):\u003C/span\u003E Democracy takes time. We heard in the select committee process, from not one but many submitters, that democracy takes time. This legislation, as\u00A0we have heard, as we have seen, as we continue to see just runs roughshod over our democracy. It does so many disservices to not only our democracy but to our environment, to our obligations and our responsibilities to Te Tiriti, to our engagement with local communities, right through to the court processes. We\u2019ve heard already this afternoon, in this debate, about zombie projects\u2014about projects that have been rejected, that suddenly, magically, who knows how, end up in Schedule 2 of the Fast-track Approvals Bill.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000480\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221cd33f16-add4-4363-a2d4-f457841a5c4c\u0022\u003ENow, more than 27,000 people submitted on this piece of legislation. Not all of them had the opportunity to speak to their submissions to the Environment Committee, which is, again, a shame and a challenge to our democracy. I want to quote from one of our submitters who made a very poignant statement around our democracy and the importance of it\u2014to ensure that as we move different laws and legislation through this House, we do right by people and we do right by our democracy. Ng\u0101 Rangahautira in their submission said, \u201CDemocracy is not exercised once every three years. A healthy democratic society allows for the frequent exercise of democratic rights when decisions are being made that affect the public, particularly in their own communities. This bill erases those opportunities for democratic consultation.\u201D\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000481\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221cd33f16-add4-4363-a2d4-f457841a5c4c\u0022\u003EThat\u2019s why this bill concerns me\u2014because it\u2019s not only running roughshod over lots of pieces of legislation and laws; but this comes into the very heart of democracy itself. Who is affected most when there is a new road, where there is a new energy project, when there is a new coalmine?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000482\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00222170b5bd-171f-4d9f-bfa6-cab72178f108\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a9b2bab0f99747008efaac71bb5b21ec\u0022\u003EJoseph Mooney\u003C/span\u003E: How are commissioners making a decision better?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000483\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022ec25f22f43d141bdbde1d93764e98a48\u0022\u003EHon Member\u003C/span\u003E: Ha, ha!\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000484\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221cd33f16-add4-4363-a2d4-f457841a5c4c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022ab063707a04c4100bc795e44ea595b5e\u0022\u003EGLEN BENNETT\u003C/span\u003E: It is those people who are closest to it that are the most affected. I\u2019m not sure why that\u2019s funny\u2014why we should laugh about the fact that those are affected, but they are. This piece of legislation is going to run roughshod over them. That is the challenge. In the previous fast-track legislation that the Hon David Parker had, there were checks and balances in place, and the environment, of course, was part\u2014was part\u2014of the purpose, so that had to be taken in consideration.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000485\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221cd33f16-add4-4363-a2d4-f457841a5c4c\u0022\u003ENow, I won\u2019t be able to quote every single Act of Parliament that is actually being ignored or run over the top of, but I can name a few for you this afternoon. We\u2019ve got the Crown Minerals Act 1991. We\u2019ve got the Wildlife Act 1953. We\u2019ve got the Reserves Act 1977. We\u2019ve got the Exclusive Economic Zone and Continental Shelf (Environmental Effects) Act\u00A02012. We\u2019ve got the Fisheries Act 1996. We\u2019ve got the Resource Management Act 1991. We\u2019ve got the Conservation Act 1987. We\u2019ve got the Freshwater Fisheries Regulations 1983.\u00A0We\u2019ve got the Heritage New Zealand Pouhere Taonga Act 2014. Of course, we\u2019ve got the Public Works Act 1981, and then there\u2019s the Treaty itself\u2014yeah, there\u2019s bits of it that it mentions in there, but it very much runs roughshod over that. Those are just some of the statutes that are being run over the top of in this space.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000486\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221cd33f16-add4-4363-a2d4-f457841a5c4c\u0022\u003EI am concerned that not only is it about the challenge to our democracy, not only is it a challenge to our environment, but it is a challenge to Te Tiriti itself. As a Te Tiriti partner, my responsibility is to stand up for the sake of my role and my responsibility as an ancestor who came here on the premise of what Te Tiriti offered to my people.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000487\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221cd33f16-add4-4363-a2d4-f457841a5c4c\u0022\u003EI continue on with another submission that was made. They said\u2014and I quote\u2014\u201CBy bypassing proper consultation processes and disregarding the protections guaranteed by Te Tiriti o Waitangi, it undermines the rights and interests of M\u0101ori and the conservation of sacred lands, including w\u0101hi tapu in public conservation areas.\u201D Now, that should alarm the\u00A0House, the fact that a submitter has considered and looked, and as we talked of in terms\u00A0of when we were in select committee and then through the committee of the whole House\u2014the fact that this legislation, that this bill, I assume, unless those on the Government side want to cross the floor with us this afternoon and vote it down, has the potential to run roughshod over our responsibilities to our democracy, to Te Tiriti, but also to sacred spaces, but also to our urup\u0101s\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000488\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00222170b5bd-171f-4d9f-bfa6-cab72178f108\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002213b006479e5b4e78b82f0d84a5ffcf92\u0022\u003EJoseph Mooney\u003C/span\u003E: Have you read the bill?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000489\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221cd33f16-add4-4363-a2d4-f457841a5c4c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002224f9a0b43fe94af4a68e7e55264b8237\u0022\u003EGLEN BENNETT\u003C/span\u003E: \u2014to our w\u0101hi tapu sites, to all those kind of spaces. Mr Mooney, I have read the bill. I\u2019ve been on the committee for the past six months, so I know it very\u00A0well and know the fact that you can\u2014sorry, you do not need to in terms of there\u2019s some responsibilities, but there\u2019s some \u201Cmays\u201D: they may have to do this; they may have to do that. We cannot support this bill. We are concerned.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000490\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221cd33f16-add4-4363-a2d4-f457841a5c4c\u0022\u003EI also want to raise\u2014again, through our select committee process that we went through\u2014another organisation\u2019s submission, and that was from the Insurance Council of New Zealand. The Insurance Council of New Zealand, in their written submission, made it very clear that\u2014and I quote\u2014\u201Cit is paramount that the Bill does not inadvertently provide a pathway for projects which expose communities to excessive financial and physical risk[s] of natural hazards.\u201D And this bill does.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000491\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221cd33f16-add4-4363-a2d4-f457841a5c4c\u0022\u003EThey go on to talk about \u201CDecision-makers should take a long term view that supports the broad availability of insurance by avoiding new development in high risk areas.\u201D And what does this bill do? What do some of those 149 projects do? They are definitely spaces where we probably should not be building new houses and new subdivisions. They go on and talk about\u2014this is the Insurance Council of New Zealand\u2014the Auckland Anniversary weekend weather event, they talk about Cyclone Gabrielle and the challenge that they had with 110,000 claims from those two events, with an estimated cost of $3.75 billion.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000492\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221cd33f16-add4-4363-a2d4-f457841a5c4c\u0022\u003ENow, the reason I bring up that number in their submission is because the events that they spoke to us about highlight that we must have a stronger focus on our land use, the development. As we look at the climate change adaptation\u2014the challenges that we have faced\u2014we are going to be responsible for more and more of this kind of activity, where houses and where properties are built in places that they should never be built in the first place, but this fast-track bill allows for them not to consider some of those spaces and to move on and allow those terrible things to happen.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000493\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221cd33f16-add4-4363-a2d4-f457841a5c4c\u0022\u003EOur world is burning, and this Government is just throwing more fuel on that fire. Whether it\u2019s this legislation, whether it\u2019s the Crown Minerals Amendment Bill and other legislation that they are trying to get through at pace, this is not good, not only for us today but for those into the future.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000494\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221cd33f16-add4-4363-a2d4-f457841a5c4c\u0022\u003EI want to reflect on what this means when we talk about zombie projects that have been brought back to life in this bill, when we talk about projects that the courts have rejected for the environmental challenges. My colleague and friend from Taranaki Debbie Ngarewa-Packer has also spoken about Trans-Tasman Resources and the challenge that there\u2019s a private company in this bill and all they\u2019re going to do is dig up and suck up all the sand off the bottom of our beautiful Taranaki ocean, and then the profits go over to Australia, where the company\u2019s from, and they jeopardise the fact that offshore wind is viable. But no\u2014no\u2014let\u2019s just throw them in the list. Let\u2019s just make sure that they\u2019re there so that they can\u2014they\u2019ve had their day in court, it hasn\u2019t gone well, and now we just throw this zombie project back on the list. To me, it\u2019s just despicable and terrible.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000495\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221cd33f16-add4-4363-a2d4-f457841a5c4c\u0022\u003EAs has been said, there\u2019s renewable energy projects in this bill, but it is just smoke and mirrors\u2014it is just smoke and mirrors\u2014in terms of what they are wanting to achieve.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000496\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221cd33f16-add4-4363-a2d4-f457841a5c4c\u0022\u003EIn closing, I want to remember the 30,000-plus people that walked down Queen Street back in June, who walked to protest against this bill and what it was going to do\u2014for the sake of nature, for the sake of our climate, and for the sake of democracy. We don\u2019t want to be fossil fools on this side of the House. We want a fast track, not like the trash that they talk about on the other side of the House\u2014nature doesn\u2019t need a speeding ticket. The final thing I would like to say is one of those billboards on that march was \u201CMake Aotearoa Green Again\u201D.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002230f9e8fe-eafb-4967-8d4d-306525ae2340\u0022 data-id=\u0022e5359e9c9ddd433faf7c931688d59ed8\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000497\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002230f9e8fe-eafb-4967-8d4d-306525ae2340\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022e5359e9c9ddd433faf7c931688d59ed8\u0022\u003EKATIE NIMON (National\u2014Napier):\u003C/span\u003E Do you know what is truly despicable? It\u2019s that members opposite talked about respecting Te Tiriti, but guess what! Last week, there was an Amendment Paper put forward to remove Mana Ahuriri from this bill. Mana Ahuriri, for those that don\u2019t know, are a Napier post-Treaty settlement group who want to develop their ancestral land for affordable housing, a business park, recreational ground, historical education, and the members opposite wanted to remove it. How is that for progress? Look, at the end of the day, this bill is progress for everybody. That is what we are doing. With that, I commend this bill to the House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca id=\u0022e564fe08639b4142abdf076c4bc8fdc2\u0022 name=\u0022division\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EA party vote was called for on the question, That the Fast-track Approvals Bill be now read a third time.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EAyes 68\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand National 49; ACT New Zealand 11; New Zealand First 8.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENoes 55\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand Labour 34; Green Party of Aotearoa New Zealand 15; Te P\u0101ti M\u0101ori 6.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EMotion agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000498\u0022\u003EBill read a third time.\u003C/p\u003E\n    \u003C/div\u003E\n    \u003Cdiv class=\u0022HpsHansard\u0022\u003E\n      \u003Cp\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsProceedingHeading\u0022\u003EBills\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000499\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u0022f55185f0bca5427e8c0f2f4ab8381d04\u0022\u003EResource Management (Consenting and Other System Changes) Amendment Bill\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000500\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u0022bbcde71f3bc840e780466e3bf56b608e\u0022\u003EFirst Reading\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002257e41e9d-285b-4fb3-847d-a63820ae7137\u0022 data-id=\u00223fa355c4e9c54bcf9c520307be4b5f3a\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000501\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002257e41e9d-285b-4fb3-847d-a63820ae7137\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00223fa355c4e9c54bcf9c520307be4b5f3a\u0022\u003EHon CHRIS BISHOP (Minister responsible for RMA Reform):\u003C/span\u003E I present a legislative statement for the Resource Management (Consenting and Other System Changes) Amendment Bill.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000502\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d42e8cf-544e-415d-892b-f4ef8014d80f\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00222f305babb4e14935b61f2b4847a29b3d\u0022\u003EASSISTANT SPEAKER (Teanau Tuiono)\u003C/span\u003E: That legislative statement is published under the authority of the House and can be found on the Parliament website.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000503\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002257e41e9d-285b-4fb3-847d-a63820ae7137\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002279f950a186ca4e418d66b87dfc669cd8\u0022\u003EHon CHRIS BISHOP\u003C/span\u003E: I move, That the Resource Management (Consenting and Other System Changes) Amendment Bill be now read a first time. I nominate the Environment Committee to consider the bill.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000504\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002257e41e9d-285b-4fb3-847d-a63820ae7137\u0022\u003EThis bill continues the coalition Government\u2019s commitment to reform the resource management system, to drive economic growth and increase productivity by making it easier to get things done in New Zealand. It follows on from fast track and our first resource management amendment bill, which passed into law in October.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000505\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002257e41e9d-285b-4fb3-847d-a63820ae7137\u0022\u003EThis bill is a precursor to full replacement of the Resource Management Act (RMA), but it makes important changes in the short term to make it quicker and simpler to consent renewable energy, boost housing supply, and reduce red tape for the primary sector. As I said, at length, in the last debate, the current RMA isn\u2019t working; it\u2019s a handbrake on growth for the country.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000506\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002257e41e9d-285b-4fb3-847d-a63820ae7137\u0022\u003EWe have taken a phased approach to RMA reform. Phase one, which was completed almost a year ago, was to repeal the previous Government\u2019s excessively complicated reforms. We\u2019re now in the middle of phase two: making improvements to the existing RMA, to cut red tape and green tape for primary industries and development in infrastructure, whilst maintaining environmental protections. These reforms will lay the groundwork for phase three: the long-term replacement for the RMA, with legislation based on the enjoyment of property rights.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000507\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002257e41e9d-285b-4fb3-847d-a63820ae7137\u0022\u003EThere are five major changes in this bill. This is quite a chunky and substantive bill; far more substantive than bill No. 1. The infrastructure and energy package in the bill gives effect to the Government\u2019s Electrify New Zealand reforms, which are all about making it easier to\u00A0get renewable energy built, as well as improving how ports run.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000508\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002257e41e9d-285b-4fb3-847d-a63820ae7137\u0022\u003EThere are key changes delivered through this bill\u2014councils must decide renewable energy generation consents within one year of application; consents for renewable energy generation will receive 35-year consents by default. The default lapse period for renewable energy consents and for infrastructure project designations will go from five years to 10\u00A0years. Ports will be\u00A0given \u201Crequiring authority status\u201D, and port coastal permits will be extended for another 20 years, to 2046. Designating authorities will no longer have to complete detailed assessments of alternatives when they are the sole landholder.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000509\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002257e41e9d-285b-4fb3-847d-a63820ae7137\u0022\u003EThe housing package is particularly important. It includes reforms to enable the first pillar of the Government\u2019s Going for Housing Growth policy. It will allow councils to opt out of the medium-density residential standards (MDRS), as well as providing councils with ways to make faster plan changes. It also provides for new intervention powers for the Minister for the Environment to ensure councils comply with national direction.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000510\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002257e41e9d-285b-4fb3-847d-a63820ae7137\u0022\u003EIn relation to the MDRS, the bill introduces a ratification vote for councils on the medium-density residential standards to decide whether to keep, change, or remove them, whilst also ensuring councils are providing for 30 years of housing growth. The quid pro quo of being allowed to opt out of the MDRS is that councils deliver 30 years of live-zoned housing growth.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000511\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002257e41e9d-285b-4fb3-847d-a63820ae7137\u0022\u003EThe bill also makes changes to the streamlined planning process and requires all plan changes that use this process\u2014including for the MDRS\u2014to establish an independent hearings panel (IHP). The bill empowers the Minister to appoint up to half the members of the IHP. The bill makes councils, rather than the Minister, the final decision maker, but it also provides the Minister for the Environment with new intervention powers to ensure compliance with national direction.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000512\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002257e41e9d-285b-4fb3-847d-a63820ae7137\u0022\u003EAll of that is quite complicated, sir; let me just give you a little bit of colour. Over the last few years, councils been going through this process to bring their plan changes into line with not only the MDRS but also the National Policy Statement on Urban Development (NPS-UD). I think everyone acknowledges that having the councils appeal to either the Minister responsible for RMA Reform or the Minister for the Environment is not a particularly great way to go about it. It\u2019s produced some quite good outcomes in some cases, but it is not really what you\u2019d like. The bill changes that and it means that councils are the final decision-makers.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000513\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002257e41e9d-285b-4fb3-847d-a63820ae7137\u0022\u003EHowever, it is also true to say that the independent hearings panel process has not been that great either. the bill provides for the Minister to appoint up to half the members of the IHP. To give effect to the Government\u2019s Going for Housing Growth policies, it is necessary to have greater intervention in the way in which councils complete the housing and business capacity assessments as per the NPS-UD, and there\u2019s a range of changes coming there as part\u00A0of the national direction package, which is not included in this bill but is coming next\u00A0year.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000514\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002257e41e9d-285b-4fb3-847d-a63820ae7137\u0022\u003EThe changes in the bill will allow councils to delist heritage buildings identified in the district plans in a faster way, using the streamlined planning process (SPP). At present, if councils wish to remove a building from the heritage list, they have to use a standard plan-making process. It\u2019s a very complicated process, very convoluted, it has many steps, takes a long time, and has quite broad rights of appeal. Under the changes introduced by this bill, councils will be able to apply to the Minister for the Environment for an SPP that is of appropriate scale to the issue being addressed, and the changes for housing and heritage will work in conjunction with national direction, as I say.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000515\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002257e41e9d-285b-4fb3-847d-a63820ae7137\u0022\u003EThe third series of changes is around the farming and primary sector package to unlock primary sector productivity. It reduces the regulatory overlap between the RMA and the Fisheries Act. It will provide for flexibility and certainty for marine farm consent processes. It will make farm plan certification more practical and cost-effective, as well as making sure resource consent applications for wood processing are decided within one year.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000516\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002257e41e9d-285b-4fb3-847d-a63820ae7137\u0022\u003EThere\u2019s a section in relation to emergency and natural hazards. The bill will make responses to natural hazards and emergencies more efficient and effective, as well as ensure that the planning system is not allowing inappropriate development in areas with significant natural hazard risk. The bill introduces a new regulation-making power to support emergency responses to assist with recovery, and clarifies and strengthens councils\u2019 ability to decline land-use consents or to apply appropriate conditions where there are significant risks of natural hazards, and, of course, we are working on a natural hazard national direction package, which, I think, has been quite widely welcomed by local government land, and that will be part of 2025 as well.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000517\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002257e41e9d-285b-4fb3-847d-a63820ae7137\u0022\u003EFinally, the bill introduces a series of sensible system improvements, which, I think, most people will welcome. There are higher fines for non-compliance. There are changes to how resource consent applications are dealt with. Fines for non-compliance with the RMA will be increased, and insurance that pays those fines will be banned. Councils will be able to recover more costs from those breaching the RMA, as well as consider compliance history during resource consent applications\u2014and there\u2019s a bit of debate around that, and during the fast-track process.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000518\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002257e41e9d-285b-4fb3-847d-a63820ae7137\u0022\u003EWe\u2019re also changing the discharge rules under section 70, to provide certainty and to align with changes to section 107 that were done through the Resource Management (Freshwater and Other Matters) Amendment Act 2024. There are minor changes to Department of Conservation (DOC) functions, to improve the management of discharges on the DOC estate and improve RMA compliance checks on offshore islands. The amount of further information a council can request from a consent applicant will be clarified so that it is not overly onerous. Applicants will be able to request to review consent conditions prior to a consent decision being issued, and councils will be able to return abandoned consent applications. These are system improvements\u2014is the easiest way to describe it.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000519\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002257e41e9d-285b-4fb3-847d-a63820ae7137\u0022\u003EI think it\u2019s worth noting that these changes are designed to work in conjunction with a whole series of changes we\u2019re making to national direction\u2014national policy statements and national environmental standards are next year. Much of the changes we are making are designed to port over into the new regime.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000520\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002257e41e9d-285b-4fb3-847d-a63820ae7137\u0022\u003EWe\u2019re acutely conscious that the Government is moving fast and we\u2019re making a lot of changes to resource management law, but we eventually want to settle on a system that is enduring and we eventually want to settle on a system that settles down, so that we can actually get on with implementation. As much as possible, we are taking a least-regrets approach to reform. As much as we can, the changes through this bill and the changes through the national direction, next year, we want to port across and transition into the new system to reduce the need for constant chopping and changing and constant council churn and flux. That is a difficult task, I\u2019ve got to be honest with the House. That is tricky, but if we can get it right, we can create a more enabling framework for everybody, and an enabling framework that also protects and upholds environmental protections and also sets environmental bottom lines. I think it is possible to do that.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000521\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002257e41e9d-285b-4fb3-847d-a63820ae7137\u0022\u003EI actually think there\u2019s more consensus across the Parliament, when it comes to resource management reform, than, perhaps, you would think from what we\u2019ve heard during the quite heated debate around fast track. I think most people are in favour of greater standardisation. I think most people are in favour of fewer plans, and most people are in favour of less litigation and more certainty, most people are in favour of an enabling framework and a spatial planning framework that makes it easier to plan, consent, and deliver infrastructure for the future. Most reasonable people are in favour of that, and that is the Government\u2019s goal as well.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000522\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002257e41e9d-285b-4fb3-847d-a63820ae7137\u0022\u003EA lot of 2025 is going to be about the delivery of national direction and building a framework that can set New Zealand up for growth and development whilst protecting the environment in the 2020s and beyond. Thank you.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00223d42e8cf-544e-415d-892b-f4ef8014d80f\u0022 data-id=\u00223ca769c951da4793a8184ae8b49db7b9\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000523\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d42e8cf-544e-415d-892b-f4ef8014d80f\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00223ca769c951da4793a8184ae8b49db7b9\u0022\u003EASSISTANT SPEAKER (Teanau Tuiono)\u003C/span\u003E: The question is that the motion be agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002227535d92-0798-4e04-be80-9e91b53610e2\u0022 data-id=\u00226fb15ddb0d844deab2e03b3e4e31ea95\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000524\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002227535d92-0798-4e04-be80-9e91b53610e2\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00226fb15ddb0d844deab2e03b3e4e31ea95\u0022\u003EHon RACHEL BROOKING (Labour\u2014Dunedin):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Mr Speaker. Hopefully I\u2019m a reasonable person, and the list that the Minister, the Hon Chris Bishop, just gave out, many of the things\u2014I cannot recite it verbatim, but they are things that I certainly agree with. We should move this system and the resource management system to the national instruments and away from a bespoke consent-by-consent issue. That is why, of course, we reformed the Resource Management Act (RMA) over a long period of time and had the Spatial Planning Act and the Natural and Built Environment Act. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000525\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002227535d92-0798-4e04-be80-9e91b53610e2\u0022\u003EBoth of those Acts were repealed last year\u2014last December\u2014and the Minister says with pride, \u201CLook at all the things we\u2019re doing.\u201D \u201CLook, we\u2019ve repealed this legislation that fixed the Resource Management Act, which, we all agree, doesn\u2019t work,\u201D he says. Then, in the next breath, he says, \u201COh, and we\u2019ve done this fast-track bill\u201D\u2014which will soon be signed into an Act\u2014\u201Cthat railroads over all of the environmental protections.\u201D I heard, in that list, that we do need to protect the environment, and that is not what the fast track does.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000526\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002227535d92-0798-4e04-be80-9e91b53610e2\u0022\u003ENow, I realise I am talking about a different bill\u2014I\u2019m talking about the Resource Management (Consenting and Other System Changes) Amendment Bill\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000527\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a202bee85999483e859febb225b8e8b1\u0022\u003EHon Member\u003C/span\u003E: Yeah, speak to that bill.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000528\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002227535d92-0798-4e04-be80-9e91b53610e2\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022127038a9eba54634abf38bbc743042bd\u0022\u003EHon RACHEL BROOKING\u003C/span\u003E: Whoever made the snarky little comment over there on the National side, I say to you that it\u2019s relevant, because if you were listening to your Minister, you would know that this is a set of different pieces of legislation to replace what we had done and what that Government has repealed.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000529\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002227535d92-0798-4e04-be80-9e91b53610e2\u0022\u003EI noted, when I was listening to the Minister and when I was listening to the Prime Minister in question time, that there is a lot of focus on checklists, and it might be that this piece of legislation\u2014this one in the House today\u2014is only here the week before Christmas to meet that checklist. We all know that we were only in the committee stage of that fast-track bill last week, for hours and hours and hours, because it was on that checklist, and we saw those amendments that came in at the very last minute. This is a very bad way to make laws, and it seems that the Prime Minister does not understand that fundamental need for laws to be scrutinised.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000530\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002227535d92-0798-4e04-be80-9e91b53610e2\u0022\u003ENow, this bill, as we\u2019ve heard the Minister say, covers a range of different issues. It is not a replacement for the RMA at all. It\u2019s not a Natural and Built Environment Act or a Spatial Planning Act or what he says might happen next year. It changes rules around fishing, with the Motiti decision. It could end up enabling more houses on green fields as the quid pro quo for not having the medium-density residential standards (MDRS). It is a backtrack on the MDRS. In the last term, National and Labour agreed to have these mixed-density residential zones provisions. This National Government is backtracking on that by not requiring councils to do it but making it optional. It makes all the other discussions\u2014and I\u2019m going to come to this soon\u2014on bipartisanship and working together very different when that is the record that we are dealing with.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000531\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002227535d92-0798-4e04-be80-9e91b53610e2\u0022\u003EThen, there is a change to section 70, and the Minister noted that that links in with that\u00A0out-of-scope, in my opinion, change to section 107 that came through the last RMA amendment bill a month or so ago\u2014a change that was not consulted on, that was not in the bill as introduced, but that some irrigators and others wanted and were able to submit on, but groups\u00A0like Forest \u0026amp; Bird were stopped from submitting on. There was a change to that section 107 that links with section 70 here, and there would have been an opportunity, if this Government was interested in good-faith proper processes, to have had that section 107 discussion here. They haven\u2019t done that.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000532\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002227535d92-0798-4e04-be80-9e91b53610e2\u0022\u003EThere are also changes to farm plan certification that may or may not be beneficial, and, of course, we\u2019ve heard that appeal rights for heritage decisions are going to be changed. It doesn\u2019t deal with the funding of public infrastructure, which is always the trickiest issue. It does also work on hazards compliance, emergency regulations, renewable energy, and ports. I will be asking officials for their advice on comparisons with the Natural and Build Environment Act, because it seems that some of those provisions have come from that.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000533\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002227535d92-0798-4e04-be80-9e91b53610e2\u0022\u003EOn that note, we will be supporting it to select committee, and we hope that the Ministers will ask their members to interrogate it and improve it.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022a6489ff5-e18c-4c19-958d-3cec5c52c0cc\u0022 data-id=\u0022a891e32fe0664f9ca0171e4c20533409\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000534\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a6489ff5-e18c-4c19-958d-3cec5c52c0cc\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022a891e32fe0664f9ca0171e4c20533409\u0022\u003ESCOTT WILLIS (Green):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Mr Speaker. This bill makes a wide suite of changes to the Resource Management Act (RMA) and, ironically, it wouldn\u2019t even have been needed, and actually isn\u2019t needed in this form if the Government hadn\u2019t embarked on a wholesale destruction of legislation through urgency; legislation like the Natural and Built Environment Act and the Spatial Planning Act. So, no, we won\u2019t support this bill, because it\u2019s poorly done and there are a number of provisions that just aren\u2019t consistent with Green Party policy.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000535\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a6489ff5-e18c-4c19-958d-3cec5c52c0cc\u0022\u003EFor example, we\u2019re sceptical about the Going for Housing Growth framework in this bill, which makes what was the wonderful and, temporarily, bipartisan medium-density residential standards optional. If we want smart and efficient cities, we need to prioritise building homes where the infrastructure already is. Mixed-use housing and enabling more housing and shops around strategic transport corridors is a good step towards building the density we need to bring our cities to life. However, disjointed greenfields development, and a transport policy that prioritises cars will see the status quo of sprawl continue.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000536\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a6489ff5-e18c-4c19-958d-3cec5c52c0cc\u0022\u003EWe literally can\u2019t afford more car-dependent sprawl, especially with the urgent need to reduce emissions.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000537\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002255d0b7a4-a2c9-4c38-9b77-475311a48a89\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002221db10ee584d4e028d0998663e6cdd03\u0022\u003EHon Simeon Brown\u003C/span\u003E: I hope you don\u2019t drive a car.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000538\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a6489ff5-e18c-4c19-958d-3cec5c52c0cc\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022b501c4f215b64632943aecf072128dd4\u0022\u003ESCOTT WILLIS\u003C/span\u003E: Sprawling suburbs will see the efficiency of our cities decline, and I wish I didn\u2019t need to drive a car. I wish we had trains and rail-enabled ferries, but that\u2019s not happening either. There is nothing stopping councils for zoning for fewer new homes under the Going for Housing Growth reforms than they would have been required to allow for under the medium-density residential standards if the medium-density residential standards required more than their contested 30-year targets. It\u2019s a lost opportunity, flooding urban land markets with supply, but it\u2019s a win for the nimbies in Epsom, and it will allow for discharges into polluted water bodies and override local decision-making.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000539\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a6489ff5-e18c-4c19-958d-3cec5c52c0cc\u0022\u003EAdditionally, this time frame limits the identification of options, the level of analysis, the collation and review of evidence, and engagement with industry, council, iwi, hap\u016B, and M\u0101ori and other stakeholders. It does not favour those communities the Government is elected to serve. We know, now, that this Government hates local decision-making, and even the area where I was looking for some positive\u2014and there is a little bit of positive, but it\u2019s pretty disappointing.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000540\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a6489ff5-e18c-4c19-958d-3cec5c52c0cc\u0022\u003EAs the regulatory impact statement (RIS) says, \u201Cconstraints imposed by the policy development process (ie the limited time available to undertake the analysis and the inability to conduct consultation with affected groups) have meant that the criteria cannot be fully met. In some cases, the evidence base is missing on which to form a clear understanding of the policy problem, and its causes, which limits the analysis of options to address them.\u201D\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000541\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a6489ff5-e18c-4c19-958d-3cec5c52c0cc\u0022\u003ETo be clear, we can support things like a 35-year default consent duration for renewable electricity generation, but oppose a 35-year default consent duration for long-lived infrastructure like gas pipelines. We\u2019re not convinced that doubling the lapse periods for renewables, up from five to 10 years, is helpful when we need to build renewables at pace and avoid land banking. Any positives in this bill have clearly been regurgitated from the Natural and Built Environment Act, which begs the question again: why throw out something really useful when it could have been amended and gained more support? \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000542\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a6489ff5-e18c-4c19-958d-3cec5c52c0cc\u0022\u003EWe understand that the RIS was prepared when several decisions from Government were\u00A0still to be made, such as the Government\u2019s direction on fresh water and the inclusion of\u00A0wood-processing projects. This is the problem with the Government\u2019s rushed lawmaking, something that legal experts, officials, and even a Cabinet Minister have warned against. It\u2019s bad, rushed lawmaking, like so much this Government does; like the failure to get law through because it\u2019s badly written.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000543\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a6489ff5-e18c-4c19-958d-3cec5c52c0cc\u0022\u003ENow, instead, what I\u2019d like to see\u2014what I think this Government could do\u2014is deliver the long-promised National Policy Statement for Renewable Electricity Generation, promised six months ago, and a natural environmental standard for smaller wind projects, something that was called for back in 2010. That\u2019s 14 years ago. I know many farmers who are waiting and waiting for this legislative change so they can build and host small wind farms.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00223d42e8cf-544e-415d-892b-f4ef8014d80f\u0022 data-id=\u0022b227affa5f7d4887a30d0f74974f2ad7\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000544\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d42e8cf-544e-415d-892b-f4ef8014d80f\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022b227affa5f7d4887a30d0f74974f2ad7\u0022\u003EASSISTANT SPEAKER (Teanau Tuiono)\u003C/span\u003E: The member\u2019s time has expired. Just before I take the next call, we did have a sharp shock and a bit of a shake there. It was very, very brief, and so if that does happen again, we will be ducking and covering. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00226cac9fcd-1934-4007-b10a-4b9d301a0af1\u0022 data-id=\u0022c8df02a99cba474c9f2fdd6d1437fab8\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000545\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226cac9fcd-1934-4007-b10a-4b9d301a0af1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022c8df02a99cba474c9f2fdd6d1437fab8\u0022\u003EHon ANDREW HOGGARD (Associate Minister for the Environment):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Mr Speaker. Look, I rise in support of this bill on behalf of the ACT Party. We certainly welcome advancement of our coalition commitment in this bill around the councils being able to have the choice of applying these medium-density residential standards. I\u2019m sure some of my colleagues will speak more on this through the select committee process and second and third readings. Obviously, my definition of \u201Cmedium density\u201D is being able to see two of my neighbours, so I\u2019m probably not the best person to speak to it.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000546\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226cac9fcd-1934-4007-b10a-4b9d301a0af1\u0022\u003EI do want to talk about the farm plans and the elements that relate to primary industries, though. We all know the benefits of farm plans. They enable farmers to be able to highlight the critical source areas on their farms, to be able to work out plans and procedures of how they can address that and work together as a community. These are important tools that will help our farmers drive better results to the environment.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000547\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226cac9fcd-1934-4007-b10a-4b9d301a0af1\u0022\u003ENow, what we\u2019re doing in this bill is ensuring that the plans that many farmers already have\u2014virtually every single dairy farmer already has a water management plan, every horticultural grower has one through the Good Agricultural Practice scheme, many sheep and beef farmers now have them through the FAP Plus process. This is about ensuring that peat farmers are not going to have to do a job twice. If there\u2019s one thing farmers hate, it\u2019s having to do something twice. They want to do something once and they want to do it right.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000548\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022471dee54-f59e-4497-b3d3-c39044ce7169\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022c2e1f5375b5e4520a31c294bd9661fc7\u0022\u003EHon Damien O\u2019Connor\u003C/span\u003E: They milk cows twice a day.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000549\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226cac9fcd-1934-4007-b10a-4b9d301a0af1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022dcc1f1af32bf4f08b26498f9a4256c3c\u0022\u003EHon ANDREW HOGGARD\u003C/span\u003E: We\u2019ve got the systems in place already and it\u2019s important that we use them. The member there is making a lot of noise. Previously, he was saying how he loved these plans and how the farm plans already provided what he wanted to have. Yet we had a system that wouldn\u2019t have allowed those, so we\u2019re fixing that. We\u2019re making what he tried to say was going to happen, actually happen. That\u2019s what we\u2019re doing in this plan. We\u2019re removing the duplication throughout this process and we\u2019ll obviously be looking at other things we can improve there.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000550\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226cac9fcd-1934-4007-b10a-4b9d301a0af1\u0022\u003EJust finally, this is all about providing certainty to farmers that it\u2019s going to be good operating going forward, that they\u2019ve got certainty to invest\u2014they know where the rules lie and they can invest well. That\u2019s so critical with section 70. That, combined with the section 107 rules, placed a huge degree of uncertainty, particularly for many farmers in the South Island, as to whether or not they could go ahead with their farming businesses. Would they be able to get consents? Can they invest for the future? Huge risks that were holding farmers back.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000551\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226cac9fcd-1934-4007-b10a-4b9d301a0af1\u0022\u003EBy providing this certainty, people know they can invest; they can make better productivity on their farms. I commend this bill to the House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00227dbfbd83-6770-4555-8477-85fa01511504\u0022 data-id=\u00220207acc1ba294f5e8641fa6db9b556af\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000552\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227dbfbd83-6770-4555-8477-85fa01511504\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00220207acc1ba294f5e8641fa6db9b556af\u0022\u003EANDY FOSTER (NZ First):\u003C/span\u003E Thanks, Mr Speaker. Look, I\u2019ve had 30-plus years of personal involvement in the Resource Management Act (RMA), and I\u2019ve seen it work really, really well and I\u2019ve seen it work really, really badly, as well. What almost everyone says is that it\u2019s become a triumph of process over outcomes, and it\u2019s become too unwieldy, and it\u2019s still not delivered adequately for the environment. Look, I chair the Transport and Infrastructure Committee and I\u2019ve also met with many businesses, iwi councils, etc., all around New Zealand, and almost without exception they are saying that the Resource Management Act is a barrier to development. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000553\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227dbfbd83-6770-4555-8477-85fa01511504\u0022\u003EThis Government is resolutely focused on making New Zealand\u2019s economy more productive. If we don\u2019t do that, then the things that the people on the opposite benches say that they care about\u2014we will not be able to afford them. We will not be able to afford the good quality social services, the health and education system, etc. We will not be able to afford the quality of life and the wages that we all aspire to. That is what this is all about. We often talk about an infrastructure deficit. The Infrastructure Commission\u2019s advice to the\u00A0Transport and Infrastructure Committee was that we invest about the right amount in infrastructure, but what we don\u2019t do is get value for it, and that is largely because of the processes that we get tangled up in.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000554\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227dbfbd83-6770-4555-8477-85fa01511504\u0022\u003ELook, there are four quick points that I wanted to make. The first one of them is the duration of some of these consents: re-consenting is a bane on our economy; the cost of it and the uncertainty of it is costing this country millions, even billions, of dollars a year.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000555\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227dbfbd83-6770-4555-8477-85fa01511504\u0022\u003ESecondly, the medium-density residential standards (MDRS)\u2014I had the joy of dealing with that at the council. What this does is it gets Government out of making the decision and allows local councils to make the decision with their community. We rely on them to do that professionally and competently and to engage with their community really, really well, and that is very, very important. The MDRS did not target growth close to services. It allowed it to be scattergunned all across urban areas. I think that is a really good move forward. The one plea I would make in this is that if we\u2019re going to require councils to meet 30 years of population growth, they need to know what 30 years of population growth looks like, because we are not replacing ourselves\u2014it is based on immigration, and we don\u2019t have a population strategy. That is something which belongs here, not with council.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000556\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227dbfbd83-6770-4555-8477-85fa01511504\u0022\u003EThird thing to mention is it simplifies the process for listing and de-listing heritage. Heritage is really, really important and I hope that that is done well and thoughtfully, and it\u2019s not just based on reckons.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000557\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227dbfbd83-6770-4555-8477-85fa01511504\u0022\u003EThe final thing I wanted to say is that it expands the councils\u2019 powers to manage natural hazards. This is really, really important\u2014the insurance industry will tell us to stop building dumb things in dumb places, because otherwise they will pull out of insuring. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000558\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221cd33f16-add4-4363-a2d4-f457841a5c4c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002292ae46bae5844208838a40197417987f\u0022\u003EGlen Bennett\u003C/span\u003E: Fast-track bill. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000559\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002227535d92-0798-4e04-be80-9e91b53610e2\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022bbd64212b6a94b2f9094df65203a20d6\u0022\u003EHon Rachel Brooking\u003C/span\u003E: Kill the fast-track bill. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000560\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227dbfbd83-6770-4555-8477-85fa01511504\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022bfd3773ef2224642aa0ef45f47ae05b1\u0022\u003EANDY FOSTER\u003C/span\u003E: That is really, really important\u2014and, yes, it might challenge that in some ways. Look, the other thing to say there is that if we had allowed councils more power, we probably would not have had the Christchurch red zone, and that has cost this country enormously. Building the right things in the right places is absolutely essential. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000561\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227dbfbd83-6770-4555-8477-85fa01511504\u0022\u003EI\u2019m looking forward to the submissions on this and I\u2019m sure they will assist the bill, going forward. I commend the bill to the House. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002287c850cf-18f6-4be0-935a-0e24e0a352ae\u0022 data-id=\u0022000bf6ef08ac4380929805333c922aaf\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000562\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002287c850cf-18f6-4be0-935a-0e24e0a352ae\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022000bf6ef08ac4380929805333c922aaf\u0022\u003ET\u0100KUTA FERRIS (Te P\u0101ti M\u0101ori\u2014Te Tai Tonga):\u003C/span\u003E T\u0113n\u0101 koe e te P\u012Bka. T\u0113n\u0101 hoki t\u0101tou. E t\u016B ake ana ahau ki te mihi ki ng\u0101 mahi huhua i oti nei i te iwi M\u0101ori i roto i ng\u0101 tau 30 neke atu, ki te whakakanohi i a ia me t\u014Dna mana i roto i ng\u0101 kawenga, i roto i ng\u0101 hapori, te whakawhanaketanga o t\u0113nei whenua. N\u0101ku an\u014D ng\u0101 k\u014Drero m\u014D te Kaunihera M\u0101ori o Aotearoa i waha i t\u0113r\u0101 tau ki mua ki te aroaro o t\u0113nei K\u0101wana i t\u0113nei taha i t\u0113r\u0101 w\u0101. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000563\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002287c850cf-18f6-4be0-935a-0e24e0a352ae\u0022\u003EKo T\u0101tai H\u0101kurei me te hunga r\u0101, a H\u014Dri, r\u0101tou i whakakanohi i te hiahia me te t\u016Bmanako o ng\u0101 tini marae o te motu, \u0101, aroha mai, kua hoki p\u0113nei mai t\u0101tou. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000564\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002287c850cf-18f6-4be0-935a-0e24e0a352ae\u0022\u003E[Thank you, Mr Speaker, and greetings to all of us. I stand to acknowledge the many endeavours that were completed by the M\u0101ori people in the last 30 years or more to represent themselves and their authority within the responsibilities, within the communities, and the development of this land. I myself spoke about the New Zealand M\u0101ori Council, who last year came before this Government on this side at that time. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000565\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002287c850cf-18f6-4be0-935a-0e24e0a352ae\u0022\u003ET\u0101tai H\u0101kurei and those people, H\u014Dri, they who represented the needs and hopes of the many marae of the nation, and, sadly, we\u2019ve come back to this.]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000566\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002287c850cf-18f6-4be0-935a-0e24e0a352ae\u0022\u003ETo groups such as the New Zealand M\u0101ori Council, Te Tai Kaha, Te Mana o te Wai\u2014groups that have poured years into already consulting and working with the Government themselves as the M\u0101ori, the tangata whenua Treaty partner, with the Government Treaty partner for the last five years\u2014sadly, we find ourselves here, back at the place where M\u0101ori rights are being stripped out of the Resource Management Act (RMA) quite bluntly. The RMA has served as a 30-year barrier to M\u0101ori fulfilment and achievement and exercising of their own rights inside their own rohe, in towns in their own rohe\u201430-year exclusion. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000567\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002287c850cf-18f6-4be0-935a-0e24e0a352ae\u0022\u003ESo, here we are, the Government are using renewable energy and housing projects as an excuse to continue to remove M\u0101ori rights and voices from the consenting process and to diminish M\u0101ori rights and interests in our whenua, our moana, our fresh water, our geothermal areas, everything. While we acknowledge the need for Aotearoa to transition to renewable energy, M\u0101ori need to part of this transition. We will no longer be sidelined, as we have been for the last 164 years. This side of the House, who are the Treaty partner\u2014the current Government\u2014need to take some deep consideration of their role as the Treaty partner in this House. The Ministry for the Environment admitted that the short time frame afforded to the bill prevented full engagement with te iwi M\u0101ori, and there\u2019s nothing new there. This is a consistent pattern. We\u2019ve been dealing with it through this whole first year. It\u2019s exhausting.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000568\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002287c850cf-18f6-4be0-935a-0e24e0a352ae\u0022\u003EThe Government have refused to engage with te iwi M\u0101ori, despite their own ministry identifying numerous Treaty breaches. Despite the fact that they themselves are the Tiriti partner, they seem to care nothing for it\u2014the very document that underpins the workings of this House. It will further reduce our already limited influence in the consenting process, as I\u2019ve said, for the last 30-plus years, particularly as it relates to sites of significance, or w\u0101hi tapu; the takutai moana, or fresh water; and te wai M\u0101ori, our coastal marine taonga. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000569\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002287c850cf-18f6-4be0-935a-0e24e0a352ae\u0022\u003ETe Tiriti o Waitangi said, \u201C\u014D r\u0101tou whenua, \u014D r\u0101tou moana, \u014D r\u0101tou k\u0101inga, \u014D r\u0101tou taonga katoa.\u201D [\u201Ctheir lands, their oceans, their estates, and all of their treasures.\u201D] I think you fullas should know that line inside out; I know you don\u2019t. Heoi an\u014D, without consent or consultation, this bill will make it impossible to recognise M\u0101ori rights in fresh water, geothermal rights\u2014all of the rights that I\u2019ve already mentioned that were enshrined in Te Tiriti o Waitangi. By the way, those rights weren\u2019t granted to us in Tiriti o Waitangi. They were pre-existing rights that Te Tiriti simply acknowledged. Te iwi M\u0101ori want renewable energy and we want more houses, but we cannot afford to lose more rights. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000570\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002287c850cf-18f6-4be0-935a-0e24e0a352ae\u0022\u003EAs has been voiced by this side of the House, doing away with ideas like te taiao, te mauri o te taiao\u2014\u201Cmumbo-jumbo\u201D, I think they called it down here. \u201CMumbo-jumbo\u201D\u2014I\u2019d put it down to a thousand-plus years of living in a place, watching it, using it, utilising it, dispensing it, observing it, and maintaining it for that long, but \u201Cmumbo-jumbo\u201D it\u2019s called over here. It\u2019s a little bit like the prayer that starts every sitting of this House\u2014mumbo-jumbo. Like that sceptre over there\u2014mumbo-jumbo. [Interruption] Oh, yes\u2014yes, yes. Go and think about it and come back. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000571\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002287c850cf-18f6-4be0-935a-0e24e0a352ae\u0022\u003EThirty years\u2019 worth of exclusion\u201430 years\u2019 worth of exclusion. Te mana o t\u0113nei Whare, k\u0101re au e paku, paku, paku whakaaro nui ki te mana o t\u0113nei Whare, te mana o t\u0113r\u0101 taha, me ng\u0101 t\u0101ngata e noho n\u0101, e kawe nei i ng\u0101 mahi a te K\u0101wanatanga. K\u016Bare rawa atu ki ng\u0101 tikanga o te Tiriti o Waitangi, te Tiriti o Waitangi n\u0101na koutou i whakaae kia noho mai ki t\u0113nei whenua, \u0101, ka riro i a koe t\u0113tahi mana m\u014D te toru tau. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000572\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002287c850cf-18f6-4be0-935a-0e24e0a352ae\u0022\u003EKia kaha, kia h\u0101neanea t\u014D noho m\u014D te rua tau. Ka mutu te rua tau, kua ngaro noa atu koutou. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000573\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002287c850cf-18f6-4be0-935a-0e24e0a352ae\u0022\u003EN\u014D reira, ka huri, ka hoki an\u014D ahau ki ng\u0101 k\u014Drero n\u0101ku i t\u012Bmata. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000574\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002287c850cf-18f6-4be0-935a-0e24e0a352ae\u0022\u003E[The authority of this House, I have not an iota, iota, iota of consideration for the authority of this House, the authority of that side, and the people seated there that are carrying out the activities of the Government. Entirely ignorant of the significance of the Treaty of Waitangi, the Treaty of Waitangi that allowed you to settle in this country, and you have received some power for three years. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000575\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002287c850cf-18f6-4be0-935a-0e24e0a352ae\u0022\u003EGo for it, sit comfortably for two years. After two years, you will be gone. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000576\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002287c850cf-18f6-4be0-935a-0e24e0a352ae\u0022\u003EAnd so I\u2019ll pivot, I\u2019ll come back to the statements that I myself initiated.]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000577\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002287c850cf-18f6-4be0-935a-0e24e0a352ae\u0022\u003EWe do not support the bill in the slightest. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002298dbeffa-e059-49d5-8bbf-579cbaead9a3\u0022 data-id=\u0022861db823d0a04da2bea4cb79f0bd122f\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000578\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002298dbeffa-e059-49d5-8bbf-579cbaead9a3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022861db823d0a04da2bea4cb79f0bd122f\u0022\u003EHon SCOTT SIMPSON (National\u2014Coromandel):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you very much, Mr Speaker. It\u2019s a pleasure to rise in support of this Resource Management (Consenting and Other System Changes) Amendment Bill in its first reading. I\u2019ll be chairing the select committee that the bill is going to. I\u2019m very much looking forward to the submissions that will be received, and I know that the committee will give very due and full consideration to all the submissions.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000579\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002298dbeffa-e059-49d5-8bbf-579cbaead9a3\u0022\u003EI want to just make the point in the House this afternoon that this bill is a part of the fix-it plan that we campaigned on as a Government, a coalition Government, just over 12 months ago. This time 12 months ago, we were busy repealing the previous administration\u2019s natural and built environment and spatial planning legislation because we knew that that would just further stymie and act as a further roadblock to getting the country growing and thriving, particularly in economic terms.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000580\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002298dbeffa-e059-49d5-8bbf-579cbaead9a3\u0022\u003EThis bill is intent on actually providing across five key themes: the first one being infrastructure and energy, the second one being housing growth, the third one being farming and the primary sector, the fourth one being natural hazards and emergencies, and the fifth one being systems improvements. It\u2019s a precursor to a significant rewrite of resource law in New Zealand that will come later in the term of this Parliament.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000581\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002298dbeffa-e059-49d5-8bbf-579cbaead9a3\u0022\u003EOn that note, then, I endorse the bill. I\u2019m looking forward to hearing what submitters have to say and to working with the select committee on it. Thank you.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022f5d71749-ae91-4af7-b2bd-77260398912a\u0022 data-id=\u0022504bff3b10dd487dbda1513f02d0cc70\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000582\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f5d71749-ae91-4af7-b2bd-77260398912a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022504bff3b10dd487dbda1513f02d0cc70\u0022\u003EHon DAVID PARKER (Labour):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you. As you will have heard from a prior speaker, Rachel Brooking, on behalf of the Labour Party, we are supporting this at first\u00A0reading to select committee. I would have some words of advice for the Government on this.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000583\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f5d71749-ae91-4af7-b2bd-77260398912a\u0022\u003EThere has been, now, too much to-ing and fro-ing on Resource Management Act (RMA) law and as a country we actually need to settle it. I have heard the Hon Chris Bishop say that he\u2019s up for that, to trying to reach an accommodation that everyone can live with; and I heard Te P\u0101ti M\u0101ori\u2019s disquiet with the legislation because they don\u2019t feel that their interests are properly protected or provided for in this legislation. I think the Hon Scott Simpson, when he chairs this select committee, will, I hope, apply his wisdom to the hearing of submissions so that some of these issues can be worked through in a way that everyone can live with them. Otherwise, we\u2019re actually going to continue the game of ping pong here in a way that\u2019s not very good.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000584\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f5d71749-ae91-4af7-b2bd-77260398912a\u0022\u003ENow, I heard the other side say that this is the key to unlocking the development potential of the country. It is relevant to that\u2014I\u2019m not denying its relevance\u2014but I do think that it\u2019s a little bit overstated that it\u2019s planning constraints that lie behind New Zealand\u2019s lack of productivity growth. Indeed, I don\u2019t really know of any planning constraints\u2014I know they\u2019re frustrating to the rural sector, on whom we rely for the vast bulk of our primary production exports, but I think there\u2019s some exaggerated claims as to that being what\u2019s held back productivity growth in New Zealand.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000585\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f5d71749-ae91-4af7-b2bd-77260398912a\u0022\u003EI\u2019ll mention a couple of areas that I think deserve serious consideration. Te P\u0101ti M\u0101ori are\u00A0concerned that their article 2 rights, in respect of what they still are left owning, are effectively frustrated by the existing planning legislation. The Natural and Build Environment Act\u2014which replaced the RMA; which the incoming Government repealed\u2014did delegate to M\u0101oridom the right to, for example, consent communal housing, papak\u0101inga, on M\u0101ori land. Now, I think those sorts of recognitions of tino rangatiratanga under article 2 should not be problematic for us as a country. I don\u2019t see why we should be politicising those issues.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000586\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f5d71749-ae91-4af7-b2bd-77260398912a\u0022\u003ESimilarly, if there is a geothermal resource which is sitting under M\u0101ori-owned land, I don\u2019t have a problem with that consent decision being delegated to the M\u0101ori owners of that land either. I think if the Government was willing to listen to those sorts of concerns from M\u0101oridom, some of these issues might be sorted out.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000587\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f5d71749-ae91-4af7-b2bd-77260398912a\u0022\u003ENow, I don\u2019t go so far as to say that any subset of the population should be able to take all decisions in respect of land\u2014even their own land, whether it\u2019s a private non-M\u0101ori owner or a private M\u0101ori owner. For example, I don\u2019t think we should follow the North American example of where you can consent a casino on people\u2019s land. I think that\u2019s bad law.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000588\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f5d71749-ae91-4af7-b2bd-77260398912a\u0022\u003EThat said, there are some good things in this legislation, and I\u2019ll run through them. It might surprise the Associate Minister for the Environment, the Hon Andrew Hoggard, but I agree with what\u2019s proposed here for farm plans. I think that having the audit and certification regimes trialled through farm industry organisations\u2014I know that\u2019s something that the Hon Damien O\u2019Connor wanted and he was frustrated that we hadn\u2019t landed that in a more simple form by the time we left office. I think that\u2019s good progress, but it should be in support of an objective, which is, where we have degraded waterways, their gradual improvement over time; and where they\u2019re in good condition, not allowing them to degrade further. If this, however, is accompanied by efforts to undermine the existing freshwater protection rules that we have under the RMA, that will be a step too far, in my opinion. There have been some criticisms of the Te Mana o te Wai framework, but surely as a mature society we can work through those differences and get somewhere where we land there.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000589\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f5d71749-ae91-4af7-b2bd-77260398912a\u0022\u003EI\u2019ve only got limited time. In respect of the flip-flop that we had from National on the medium-density zone\u2014which they agreed under Judith Collins through Chris Bishop and Nicola Willis, but then resiled from later\u2014my concern about this iteration is that if you don\u2019t internalise the inefficiency of improperly put infrastructure costs to the decision, you\u2019ll get to an economically wrong outcome and I hope the select committee looks at that as you do.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00223d42e8cf-544e-415d-892b-f4ef8014d80f\u0022 data-id=\u0022b8f17afc9e3d44fbb59a4edf48e96e1d\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000590\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d42e8cf-544e-415d-892b-f4ef8014d80f\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022b8f17afc9e3d44fbb59a4edf48e96e1d\u0022\u003EASSISTANT SPEAKER (Teanau Tuiono)\u003C/span\u003E: Members, the time has come for me to leave the Chair. The House will resume at 7.30 p.m.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000591\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d42e8cf-544e-415d-892b-f4ef8014d80f\u0022\u003ESitting suspended from 6.01 p.m. to 7.30 p.m.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00225665380b-62fd-4d75-85e0-0ed801a402e0\u0022 data-id=\u00225b311ead4b8d4af88ddf2f2bef84797e\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000592\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225665380b-62fd-4d75-85e0-0ed801a402e0\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00225b311ead4b8d4af88ddf2f2bef84797e\u0022\u003EMIKE BUTTERICK (National\u2014Wairarapa):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Madam Speaker. It\u2019s a pleasure to rise in support of this bill.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000593\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225665380b-62fd-4d75-85e0-0ed801a402e0\u0022\u003EThere\u2019s an old farming saying: \u201CEvery dog has its day\u201D. The Resource Management Act, as we know it, is well past its use-by date. Is it past its use-by date? Yes, it is. Does it need fixing? Yes, it does. Can we fix it? Yes, we will. Yes, we can, and, yes, we will, thank you. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000594\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225665380b-62fd-4d75-85e0-0ed801a402e0\u0022\u003EThis amendment bill seeks to, in amongst what it seeks to do, make it fit for purpose and to make it easier to consent for new infrastructure, renewable energy, and building houses. It is also enhancing some of the rules for clarification around some of the requirements within the farming sector. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000595\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225665380b-62fd-4d75-85e0-0ed801a402e0\u0022\u003EWe used to be a country that got stuff done, and then, all of a sudden, we weren\u2019t. This bill gets us back on the path to doing stuff, so what\u2019s not to like about that? I\u2019m more than happy to commend this bill to the House. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00221cd33f16-add4-4363-a2d4-f457841a5c4c\u0022 data-id=\u00224a609a50478443469461461b1b97e693\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000596\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221cd33f16-add4-4363-a2d4-f457841a5c4c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00224a609a50478443469461461b1b97e693\u0022\u003EGLEN BENNETT (Labour):\u003C/span\u003E The previous speaker, Mike Butterick, just talked about\u00A0the fact that the Resource Management Act (RMA) is broken and needs to be fixed, but I\u00A0would say that this legislation is more about tinkering than fixing anything. As was said from my colleagues earlier, we had a plan\u2014we developed a plan, we designed a plan\u2014and then, of course, the plan of the Natural and Built Environment Act and the Spatial Planning Act was canned this time last year. I know my colleague in the House, the Hon\u00A0Rachel Brooking, mentioned earlier that she wrote to the Minister responsible for RMA Reform to say, \u201CLook, we will work to find a way forward.\u201D, but, of course, there was no reply to that.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000597\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221cd33f16-add4-4363-a2d4-f457841a5c4c\u0022\u003EWe reluctantly, I guess, consider what is being proposed here this evening, and we see there are, obviously, good parts to it\u2014there are challenging parts, but also good parts. For us, we need to think critically about what we\u2019re doing since we\u2019re back, I guess, at square one in many ways, with the RMA. I mean, it is a struggle, because this does feel like tinkering, but, none the less, it is the bill that is in front of us.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000598\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221cd33f16-add4-4363-a2d4-f457841a5c4c\u0022\u003EAs I look through the legislation, there are some things that I think are OK. There are a few things that do disappoint me, though. Often in this House, particularly with this Government and particularly around RMA reform, there\u2019s calls for \u201CLet\u2019s work together, let\u2019s work in bipartisanship, let\u2019s do all that together.\u201D, and we did. It\u2019s hard to trust that process when we committed\u2014and I know that the Hon Judith Collins, David Parker, and Megan Woods stood on the podium together back in 2021 to announce and implement the medium-density residential standards plan, which, again, in this legislation, they\u2019re watering it down. They\u2019ve said, \u201CNo, we don\u2019t really like that any more.\u201D For us, it is a challenge when\u00A0we talk and want to be bipartisan but then it comes back to bite us.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000599\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221cd33f16-add4-4363-a2d4-f457841a5c4c\u0022\u003EAs I look at this legislation, I just want to bring the House\u2019s attention to a couple of things. One is around the emergency response and natural hazards, which, I think, in this day and age, we need to consider and we need to look at in terms of where we\u2019re at. You know, earlier in the afternoon I was speaking on the Fast-track Approvals Bill, opposing it as best I could, but in my speech on that legislation I talked about the Insurance Council of New Zealand and their concerns in terms of what is going on around climate and the challenges of climate change.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000600\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221cd33f16-add4-4363-a2d4-f457841a5c4c\u0022\u003EWith this bill, it does introduce new regulation-making powers for the Minister to respond to natural hazards and other emergencies and enable recovery efforts in affected areas. I think what the bill does, it\u2019s helpful in terms of outlining an assessment of natural hazards and risks that councils must then complete the assessment in terms of this, and when they want to grant land consent for an area subject to natural hazard risks.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000601\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221cd33f16-add4-4363-a2d4-f457841a5c4c\u0022\u003EI look at the agenda for today in terms of legislation that\u2019s being formed and being made, and I think it probably is important to have that in here, in light of the Fast-track Approvals Bill, to have this part of the policy in place, because there are some real challenges around consenting and our natural hazards in terms of where we are and where things are placed. I think, if this bill does provide an increased suite of tools that are going to help in terms of looking at our natural hazards, looking at what emergency events may arise and finding ways\u00A0to make better decisions and to be more effective, that is something that we can support, because we know that there are going to be more challenges, and in terms of when councils are looking at consenting, when they\u2019re looking at the areas for growth in terms of building houses, we\u2019ve got to find a way forward.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000602\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221cd33f16-add4-4363-a2d4-f457841a5c4c\u0022\u003EFinally, as a member of the Environment Committee, I would like to speak to my colleagues on the Environment Committee, as this bill will come to us. I will challenge myself and I will challenge my fellow committee members to really delve into this legislation\u2014to\u00A0interrogate it, to listen carefully to submitters who submit on it, to look carefully at the bill, at the challenges it poses, not just to go along with what is expected from the Ministers above them but to actually really look into this legislation to make sure that we\u00A0can bring this back to the House and have it in a far better condition than it is today, to really look at what is important in terms of going forward with this legislation. We commend this bill.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00222837c142-c937-468e-9984-bc646d066687\u0022 data-id=\u002208f9431019ba480495127334a7202542\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000603\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00222837c142-c937-468e-9984-bc646d066687\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002208f9431019ba480495127334a7202542\u0022\u003EDr HAMISH CAMPBELL (National\u2014Ilam):\u003C/span\u003E I rise in support of this Resource Management (Consenting and Other System Changes) Amendment Bill. I think everybody in this House agrees that our resource management system here in New Zealand is holding us back and the management of our resources is flawed. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000604\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00222837c142-c937-468e-9984-bc646d066687\u0022\u003EThis is part of our plan of reforming our resource management system. It has three phases. This bill is part two. Of course, we\u2019ve already gone through and repealed some of the unworkable legislation that had been put in place. This is really about targeted changes to the current resource management system and this will address some of the more necessary changes that we need to do to really drive economic growth and productivity.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000605\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00222837c142-c937-468e-9984-bc646d066687\u0022\u003EOf course, we\u2019ve already traversed this, as other speakers on this side of the House have talked about, making it easier to consent for new infrastructure, including renewable energy, building houses, and enhancing the primary sector. Therefore, I commend the bill to the House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000606\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00222837c142-c937-468e-9984-bc646d066687\u0022\u003EMotion agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000607\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00222837c142-c937-468e-9984-bc646d066687\u0022\u003EBill read a first time.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002261720d2e-5b1d-4742-b4f0-30424316ccc1\u0022 data-id=\u00224fe0ada64aaf46c09e1e790ef1ec01a1\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000608\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002261720d2e-5b1d-4742-b4f0-30424316ccc1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00224fe0ada64aaf46c09e1e790ef1ec01a1\u0022\u003EDEPUTY SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: The question is, That the Resource Management (Consenting and Other System Changes) Amendment Bill be considered by the Environment Committee.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000609\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002261720d2e-5b1d-4742-b4f0-30424316ccc1\u0022\u003EMotion agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000610\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002261720d2e-5b1d-4742-b4f0-30424316ccc1\u0022\u003EBill referred to the Environment Committee.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n    \u003C/div\u003E\n    \u003Cdiv class=\u0022HpsHansard\u0022\u003E\n      \u003Cp\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsProceedingHeading\u0022\u003EBills\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000611\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u00224c3f11b6b71440ac876c38cc9528a53b\u0022\u003EGene Technology Bill\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000612\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u002236473db8dd6e40c899e461b08b1d3848\u0022\u003EFirst Reading\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002285ec30d4-6394-433a-a12e-2c4def705dd0\u0022 data-id=\u0022ad5cdddd9e2549348a693754c1ecc5ec\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000613\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002285ec30d4-6394-433a-a12e-2c4def705dd0\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022ad5cdddd9e2549348a693754c1ecc5ec\u0022\u003EHon JUDITH COLLINS (Minister of Science, Innovation and Technology):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Madam Speaker. I present a legislative statement on the Gene Technology Bill.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002261720d2e-5b1d-4742-b4f0-30424316ccc1\u0022 data-id=\u0022d50ba83ff6e14d809f831d928e01e1c9\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000614\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002261720d2e-5b1d-4742-b4f0-30424316ccc1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022d50ba83ff6e14d809f831d928e01e1c9\u0022\u003EDEPUTY SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: That legislative statement is published under the authority of the House and can be found on the Parliament website.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000615\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002285ec30d4-6394-433a-a12e-2c4def705dd0\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00223d154f46f3b74a088b147b7c12b57a23\u0022\u003EHon JUDITH COLLINS\u003C/span\u003E: I move, That the Gene Technology Bill be now read a first time. I nominate the Health Committee to consider the bill.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000616\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002285ec30d4-6394-433a-a12e-2c4def705dd0\u0022\u003EWhat a great day for science. As part of the agreements with our coalition partners, New Zealand First and the ACT Party, this Government has committed to introducing dedicated legislation for gene technology. This bill is a result of that commitment and the commitment we made to the New Zealand public to bring our regulations for gene technology into the 21st century. Our current regulations for genetically modified organisms are some of the most backward looking in the world. New Zealand has lagged behind other countries, such as Australia, Canada, and England, which have safely embraced these technologies for the benefit of their people and their economies.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000617\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002285ec30d4-6394-433a-a12e-2c4def705dd0\u0022\u003EDespite gene technologies having been in use in New Zealand since the 1970s, the restrictive rules and time-consuming processes we have imposed on researchers have made testing and embracing innovation outside the lab all but impossible. But no more. This Government has listened to our research, primary industry, and medical communities and the frustrations that they have felt over many years. Today, New Zealand moves into the present with a safe enabling regulatory regime. The legislation will enable the sorts of innovation that will benefit New Zealand while effectively managing risks to the health and safety of people and the environment. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000618\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002285ec30d4-6394-433a-a12e-2c4def705dd0\u0022\u003EInstead of continuing to frustrate, we want to enable New Zealand\u2019s biotech ecosystem to attract and retain the brightest minds so that we can deliver solutions to the challenges New Zealand faces, such as climate change, such as increasing the productivity of our primary sector, such as conservation, such as human health\u2014potential cancer cures. From advances in health treatments in our hospitals to supporting our farmers to produce the best food in the world, the transformative path of innovation is key to our country\u2019s future and key to making New Zealanders\u2019 lives better.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000619\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002285ec30d4-6394-433a-a12e-2c4def705dd0\u0022\u003EThe key objective of this legislation is to proportionately regulate gene technologies. A one-size-fits-all approach is neither efficient nor appropriate for managing risks to the health and safety of people and the environment, and we have decades of experience, both here and abroad, to proportionately regulate gene technology. With a new regime, the Government is also taking a forward-looking and sensible approach to the regulation of innovative technologies like gene editing. Other countries around the world, from Australia to Japan to England, are safely embracing these very predictable technologies, and this new legislation will ensure we no longer lag behind. Rather than being apprehensive of innovation, we intend to regulate these more predictable technologies based on their most important factor\u2014that\u2019s their outcomes. Previous approaches have been akin to regulating electric cars more stringently because they are a new technology, whereas our approach will be logical, science-based, safe, and fair.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000620\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002285ec30d4-6394-433a-a12e-2c4def705dd0\u0022\u003EAs a small country, we need to be realistic about what we can achieve and where we can best rely on overseas expertise to deliver benefits for New Zealanders. Our gene technology regime will allow the recognition of comparable overseas gene technologies regulators, which will enable us to make better use of considerable expertise overseas and expand the number of medical therapies available to New Zealanders. This will also have the benefit of freeing up the time of our new regulator, enabling them and supporting their staff to concentrate on areas where their limited time is best spent. It will enhance the efficiency of the regime for researchers and developers of new beneficial applications.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000621\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002285ec30d4-6394-433a-a12e-2c4def705dd0\u0022\u003EThis Government is committed to creating a new regime that provides both transparent and understandable decisions from the new gene technology regulator and enables participation under a number of application types, so that the public can provide input. We believe an effective forum in which the public and users of the regime can express their views on these applications will be essential for public trust and building a more effective system over time. This will be enabled in a range of ways, from specific licence applications right through to the risk-tiering framework, which will underpin this new regime.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000622\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002285ec30d4-6394-433a-a12e-2c4def705dd0\u0022\u003EI want to take a moment to address some of the rhetoric I\u2019ve heard this year, so as to assure New Zealanders what this change means and what it doesn\u2019t. This change does not mean a free-for-all on genetic technologies in New Zealand. This change simply means that gene technologies have a pathway to regulatory assessment that is designed to ensure the public and environmental safety of New Zealand. This change does not mean that people have to use gene technologies. This change gives those who want to benefit from these technologies a regulatory approval method so that they can. They can opt in. They do not have to opt out. They\u2019d have to opt in in order to use them.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000623\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002285ec30d4-6394-433a-a12e-2c4def705dd0\u0022\u003EThis change does not mean we can no longer have organics or be GE-free. Genetically engineered products have been in New Zealand for years, in things such as soy milk. Other countries with a gene technology regime still have organic sectors. Think of the United States and Australia. The US is the largest organics producer in the world while also being the largest producer of genetically modified food. This change does not mean that we are opening up the floodgates to genetic engineering of all kinds\u2014just to be very clear on that point. I can assure you that the genetic engineering of human embryos will remain banned.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000624\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002285ec30d4-6394-433a-a12e-2c4def705dd0\u0022\u003EWhat this does mean for New Zealanders and their families is this: New Zealanders will have better access to more effective cancer treatments, such as CAR T-cell therapy\u2014if they\u00A0want to. Our farmers will have access to productivity tools and emissions-reduction technologies, helping them to meet their climate goals and get higher yields\u2014but only if they\u00A0want to. Our scientists will no longer be confined to petri dishes; instead, having a chance to get their amazing technology approved for use outside the lab, and the New Zealand economy reaping the benefits of that. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000625\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002285ec30d4-6394-433a-a12e-2c4def705dd0\u0022\u003EThink of genetically edited apples that take one year to grow, fruit, and produce, rather than the five to seven years of other apples. Think how useful that would have been after Cyclone Gabrielle decimated so much of the Hawke\u2019s Bay horticulture. I\u2019ve seen this in one of our labs in a Crown research institute already being done here, but they can\u2019t take it out the lab. We already have the science to do all of this, and these are the productivity tools. If we use them, they will save family businesses and they will save livelihoods. This is a wonderful day for science, and I encourage all New Zealanders to engage in what gene technology can do for them.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000626\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002285ec30d4-6394-433a-a12e-2c4def705dd0\u0022\u003EI would like to thank all the members and staff from around the House who engaged with myself and my office on these changes. As this bill progresses through the parliamentary process, I encourage all parties not to lose sight of the real aims of this new legislation. Increased productivity isn\u2019t just a number on a spreadsheet; it means more income for our hard-working farmers, horticulturalists, and support for our rural and provincial communities. Greater innovation isn\u2019t just another publication or science journal; it means more tools to address the big challenges of our age and provides greater opportunities to incentivise our researchers to stay.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000627\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002285ec30d4-6394-433a-a12e-2c4def705dd0\u0022\u003EA defining moment was the invention of the ability to precisely edit individual genes. The CRISPR process was announced in 2012, and it won the Nobel Prize in Chemistry in 2020. That changed everything, because it means that we\u2019re not splicing together genes from different species but that we\u2019re editing existing genes. And more medical therapies aren\u2019t just a nice to have; it means more effective and safe cancer treatments, and it means greater hope and quality of life for patients and their families.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000628\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002285ec30d4-6394-433a-a12e-2c4def705dd0\u0022\u003EI would also like to thank the staff at the Ministry of Business, Innovation and Employment for all the hard work they\u2019ve been doing, and also my own staff, who have worked so hard to bring this to the House. I commend this bill to the House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002261720d2e-5b1d-4742-b4f0-30424316ccc1\u0022 data-id=\u0022707e1283d78c4fac9d1cd80ae6b75f4e\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000629\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002261720d2e-5b1d-4742-b4f0-30424316ccc1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022707e1283d78c4fac9d1cd80ae6b75f4e\u0022\u003EDEPUTY SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: The question is that the motion be agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002212d74f81-b1f7-4b51-9fb4-8f9481477192\u0022 data-id=\u00225dfd0a9a2f1a441ab0a5c738913ad784\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000630\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002212d74f81-b1f7-4b51-9fb4-8f9481477192\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00225dfd0a9a2f1a441ab0a5c738913ad784\u0022\u003EHon Dr DEBORAH RUSSELL (Labour):\u003C/span\u003E This is a bill of gaps. The first gap is the gap between what the Minister says is happening and what is actually happening. The Minister says that we\u2019re bringing our rules into alignment with other countries and, in particular, Australia, but there\u2019s a critical difference. It lies in the space of non-regulated technologies and organisms.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000631\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002212d74f81-b1f7-4b51-9fb4-8f9481477192\u0022\u003EIt\u2019s a tricky, technical area, where I\u2019ve taken advice from experts. Those experts have told\u00A0me that we would allow non-regulation of SDN-2 processes, where other countries such as Australia allow non-regulation of only SDN-1 processes\u2014that\u2019s site-directed nucleases. Although it sounds like precision engineering, that\u2019s only in comparison with the old, mash-it-together techniques. The key point is that our rules would be much more permissive than\u00A0Australia\u2019s and, indeed, most countries\u2019 rules. Australia is in the process of changing its\u00A0rules, but it is consulting with the public on them. In the meantime, our proposed rules are not aligned with Australia or with other countries. We are way out ahead.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000632\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002212d74f81-b1f7-4b51-9fb4-8f9481477192\u0022\u003EThe second gap in this proposed legislation, unlike Australia, is that there has been no public consultation. There has been targeted consultation, but it has been conducted primarily with those who stand to benefit from the legislation. To their credit, officials have turned to researchers to fill the gap, but it is clear from the published research that most New Zealanders feel the need for much more information about genetic technologies and many have strongly nuanced views.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000633\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002212d74f81-b1f7-4b51-9fb4-8f9481477192\u0022\u003EOne study showed that when it comes to gene editing and genetic modification, 11\u00A0percent of M\u0101ori and 12 percent of non-M\u0101ori were strongly supportive, and 33\u00A0percent of M\u0101ori and 23 percent of non-M\u0101ori leaned supportive. It might be easy to interpret that\u00A0as showing a fair degree of support for the use of GMOs and gene editing, but when I contacted the authors of that study, they clarified that \u201CAlthough the leaning support of clusters\u2014both\u00A0M\u0101ori and non-M\u0101ori\u2014had a quantitative score that leaned closer towards support for these\u00A0new technologies, the open-ended responses found strong ambivalence\u201D\u2014and that\u2019s their original emphasis there\u2014\u201Cespecially among M\u0101ori due to the uncertainty respondents felt about benefits and risks. For example, the qualitative responses of those in the M\u0101ori leaning supportive cluster listed significantly more concerns than opportunities, with several apprehensions about unintended consequences, ethical breaches, and lack of adequate information to make considered opinions.\u201D\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000634\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002212d74f81-b1f7-4b51-9fb4-8f9481477192\u0022\u003EI am not convinced that New Zealanders support the widespread use of GMOs and gene technologies. Of course they support medical applications, but, as for wider uses, it\u2019s an open question and one that the Minister has not grappled with.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000635\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002212d74f81-b1f7-4b51-9fb4-8f9481477192\u0022\u003EThe third gap is the lack of any economic analysis, beyond some hand-waving about possible benefits. There are no numbers in the regulatory impact statement as published. Any numbers that might have been there have been redacted. Worryingly, in the regulatory impact statement, officials say that there are \u201Cunquantified costs to organic/non-GMO primary producers.\u201D The New Zealand Institute of Economic Research has quantified the possible costs and they estimate that the effect on our exports might be in the order of $10\u00A0billion to $20 billion a year. It\u2019s not just the organic producers who will be affected. All New Zealand producers benefit from our clean, green imagine\u2014an image that will be irreparably damaged if we do not get this legislation right.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000636\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002212d74f81-b1f7-4b51-9fb4-8f9481477192\u0022\u003EThe fourth gap is the exclusion of expertise. The regulator is required to set up a technical advisory committee, but that committee has no space for an ethicist. And while the regulator is also required to set up a M\u0101ori advisory committee, they are not required to consult that committee. I think that most of us in this House, like most New Zealanders, would support the use of GMO and gene editing techniques for medical applications. Indeed, Labour as a Government was working towards updating our rules for exactly that purpose. But this bill goes far further. It doesn\u2019t just liberalise our rules around genetic engineering; it takes us out in advance of other countries, and it does so with no public consultation, no analysis of the impact on trade, no certain role for tangata whenua, no ethics input. There simply are too many gaps in this bill.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022e29c400e-467a-4398-818d-270ef48b80cf\u0022 data-id=\u00222a495607bbee44098de95f31f7235ef2\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000637\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e29c400e-467a-4398-818d-270ef48b80cf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00222a495607bbee44098de95f31f7235ef2\u0022\u003ESTEVE ABEL (Green):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you very much, Madam Speaker. The ability to intervene directly in life at the genetic level is a powerful ability. That is why it must be done with precaution, with ethics, and with broader societal values and costs and benefits of the technology, including the economy, being taken into consideration, and in recognition of the fact that proprietary interests are the main player in the genetically engineered field.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000638\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e29c400e-467a-4398-818d-270ef48b80cf\u0022\u003EHere in New Zealand, we have a founding agreement that also affirms M\u0101ori have sovereignty over taonga and, thereby, protects indigenous species from proprietary ownership and modification without consent, and the important considerations of the Wai 262 claim and findings.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000639\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e29c400e-467a-4398-818d-270ef48b80cf\u0022\u003EGenetic medicine is not contentious and has always been supported by the Greens, from insulin through to vaccines, and so too is contained precision fermentation. The release of live, self-replicating organisms into the environment and agricultural systems is a different story.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000640\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e29c400e-467a-4398-818d-270ef48b80cf\u0022\u003EThis particular legislation is a reckless rush job of potentially monumental proportions, because it has failed to take into account those who are most impacted by this liberalisation of the current regime. It is extraordinary that this Government has not done a full economic analysis of the impact of this legislation, and the only one done by the New Zealand Institute of Economic Research finds a potential $10 billion to $20 billion cost of our existing value-added component to our primary production sector. That is an extraordinary cost to risk.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000641\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e29c400e-467a-4398-818d-270ef48b80cf\u0022\u003EWhat is more, when it is assessed as to the marginal costs and benefits of the package, in the regulatory impact statement it states, \u201CWhen GMOs are eventually released into the environment under the proposed regime, there will be additional costs to certify products as GMO free. In the Australian canola example, the additional certifications costs were estimated to be A$14.00 per tonne.\u201D Which is to say, the burden of remaining GMO-free\u2014as every current producer in this country is, whether you\u2019re an animal producer, a fruit or a vegetable producer, or a crop producer\u2014will now fall on those producers to prove their non-GMO status.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000642\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e29c400e-467a-4398-818d-270ef48b80cf\u0022\u003E\u201CIt is expected that additional costs to obtain\u201D\u2014is the word that is used\u2014\u201Cthis premium should be borne by those seeking to obtain value from it.\u201D Which is to say\u2014and farmers of New Zealand, you should hear this out\u2014you no longer are maintaining your current GE-free status, you in fact are having to pay the cost of obtaining it. This legislation, effectively, forfeits New Zealand\u2019s current non-GMO producer status at a cost of potentially tens of billions of dollars to the economy. What an extraordinarily reckless piece of legislation this is. One would hope that this was actually treated with true scientific rigour in assessment of the evidence.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000643\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e29c400e-467a-4398-818d-270ef48b80cf\u0022\u003EThe evidence of genetic engineering is that the hyperbolic claims made by the Luxon Government for what it can do are not borne out by what we\u2019ve seen in 30 years of commercial production of GE crops. New Zealand is not an outlier in having a rigorous regulatory regime. There are only actually 27 countries in the world that have commercial production of GE crops, out of 195 countries. Most of those countries are in the Americas and, of the four main commodity crops produced, 99 percentage of the global acreage is four crops: soy, maize, cotton, canola. They mostly end up as animal feed or as biofuels. There is no single product that has high commercial value that is sold as direct human food in the global market\u2014after 40 years of billions of dollars of investment in the United States and thousands of field trials. When the Government suggests that, somehow, us forfeiting our GMO-free status is going to get us some sort of high-value product, it just doesn\u2019t bear out with the evidence of what GE does.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000644\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e29c400e-467a-4398-818d-270ef48b80cf\u0022\u003EThe Minister of Science, Innovation and Technology talks about genetically engineering apples. Well, we currently have a potential 95 percent premium on New Zealand apples because they are GMO free, and there is no genetically engineered apple sold anywhere in the world that has extra commercial value\u2014in fact, I know don\u2019t know of any. Let\u2019s be clear that when we evaluate how best to use GE\u2014such as its amazing opportunities in medicine, which are not contentious\u2014the cost to New Zealand farmers of that forfeiture, whereby they will wear the burden, is a big cost. They should be screaming blue murder, frankly, for this Government being willing to sacrifice and risk the value of their primary production industry. Thank you, Madam Speaker.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002258eae615-ef83-4df5-bace-6749bdd312a8\u0022 data-id=\u0022e83d7081c14542ceba0e5f30b24a2b7d\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000645\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002258eae615-ef83-4df5-bace-6749bdd312a8\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022e83d7081c14542ceba0e5f30b24a2b7d\u0022\u003EDr PARMJEET PARMAR (ACT):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Madam Speaker, for the opportunity to take this call. I am so pleased to take this call. I know that a lot of hard work has gone into this issue to bring it to this stage, and I can attest to that.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000646\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002258eae615-ef83-4df5-bace-6749bdd312a8\u0022\u003EIt was in 2019 when I stood up as an Opposition member of Parliament and announced a policy which is, basically, reflected in this legislation. Then, in 2023, when the Hon David Seymour announced me as a candidate for the ACT Party at the ACT Party rally, I had the opportunity to deliver a speech, and in that speech I talked about this issue of profound significance: approaching genetic modification differently in New Zealand. I said that the Hazardous Substances and New Organisms Act (HSNO Act), which regulates genetic modification in New Zealand, is no longer fit for purpose. It was really pleasing to see that, a week after that, National reannounced a policy that is to change the approach towards genetic modification. Then it became part of our coalition agreement, and here we have this bill going through the first reading.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000647\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002258eae615-ef83-4df5-bace-6749bdd312a8\u0022\u003EThe examples that I used in my 2019 announcement are still valid. The examples I used were of HME ryegrass. This is high metabolisable energy ryegrass, developed by AgResearch. It was looking really promising, when they did all the tests at lab level, for reducing greenhouse gas emissions, but then they couldn\u2019t do field trials here in New Zealand. They could have, but they didn\u2019t want to go through all the hoops dealing with the HSNO Act, so they decided to go overseas to do those field trials.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000648\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002258eae615-ef83-4df5-bace-6749bdd312a8\u0022\u003EThe other example is of another Crown Research Institute, Plant and Food Research. They developed red-fleshed apples. This is an apple\u2014it is not just the skin that has red skin, but the flesh is also red. For any fruit, as we know, nutrition is important, but then the taste is important as well. The scientists couldn\u2019t taste that fruit here in New Zealand; they had to take that red-fleshed apple overseas to taste.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000649\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002258eae615-ef83-4df5-bace-6749bdd312a8\u0022\u003EWith these two examples, what we can see is that the time line for bringing these products to commercial level was pushed out not just by months but by years and years. That is the kind of delay that is happening in the work that is happening in our labs at the moment, and this work is of really high value. It\u2019s expensive as well, and we know that it\u2019s highly skilled people who do this kind of work. When this kind of work goes overseas, we also, knowingly and unknowingly, are losing a lot of skilled workers, going to other countries where they can take that work to the next level.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000650\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002258eae615-ef83-4df5-bace-6749bdd312a8\u0022\u003EIt\u2019s really important that we change this legislation and that the legislation is fit for purpose. We want to see that the legislation is not only working for the next 20 years. As we have seen, the past legislation, the HSNO Act, has worked for around 20 years, and already, from the last five to six years, I have been advocating for a change of this legislation. We want to see that this legislation actually works for longer, because this is a technology that is advancing really, really fast. That\u2019s why it\u2019s important that the legislation is not based on technique, but on risk. Regulation should be proportional to risk.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000651\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002258eae615-ef83-4df5-bace-6749bdd312a8\u0022\u003EThe other thing that is really important here is that we want to see that it\u2019s consistent legislation all through the country, because scientists need consistency. They need certainty. If different local bodies start making regulations at their level, approaching genetic modification differently, then it will cause confusion, which is happening at the moment. We want to stop that confusion happening as well.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000652\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002258eae615-ef83-4df5-bace-6749bdd312a8\u0022\u003EIt\u2019s really important to note that scientists out there are quite frustrated. They really want us to act on this and they want us to act on this really soon. I did a survey earlier this year. I surveyed scientists, those who are doing work in this field, and the responses that I received were quite amazing. I\u2019m hearing the kind of work that they are doing. This work is of really, really high value. I have said this before and I will say this again: we cannot continue to feel proud standing up and saying that we are GE-free, because that means we are still stuck in that trial-and-error method of selective breeding.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000653\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002258eae615-ef83-4df5-bace-6749bdd312a8\u0022\u003EJust to finish, it\u2019s really great to see that so many colleagues on this side will be supporting this bill and are in support of this change, this approach that we\u2019re changing towards genetic modification. In the start, when I started talking about this, I was advised not to use these two words: \u201Cgenetic modification\u201D; I was asked to use a different term. It\u2019s really good to see that now these two words, \u201Cgenetic modification\u201D, can be used the way they should be used. I commend this bill to the House. Thank you.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022bf71a65e-c9f0-4856-902f-1a15c4274e94\u0022 data-id=\u0022b1d9f2d75cfb46b8a3f964a1fdf7faa1\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000654\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bf71a65e-c9f0-4856-902f-1a15c4274e94\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022b1d9f2d75cfb46b8a3f964a1fdf7faa1\u0022\u003EHon MARK PATTERSON (Minister for Rural Communities):\u003C/span\u003E I rise on behalf of New Zealand First to also support this first reading of the Gene Technology Bill. This is a long-overdue update to the Hazardous Substances and New Organisms Act 1996. Science has moved on a long way, and this has been a third rail, I think, in New Zealand politics probably since the \u201CCorngate\u201D saga, so it is high time we had a look at this legislation.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000655\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bf71a65e-c9f0-4856-902f-1a15c4274e94\u0022\u003EEssentially, we are looking at liberalising the laws around gene technology, establishing a regulator. It is a three-tier system: a non-notifiable pathway, which is a fast track, if you like, for the lower-risk technologies; a notifiable pathway; and a licensed pathway. There is no doubt that there are more tools available for our scientists and the potential for significant and speedier advancements in technology, and we\u2019ve heard quite a bit of support, particularly in the medical space already here this evening.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000656\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bf71a65e-c9f0-4856-902f-1a15c4274e94\u0022\u003EOf course, this is a wide-ranging technology. It is a very broad category. It is a continuum\u2014from gene editing, the clustered regularly interspaced short palindromic repeats stuff, where you\u2019re, essentially, speeding up natural processes, right through to genetic modification and splicing different genes together. I note that it is a coalition agreement to \u201CLiberalise genetic engineering laws\u201D\u2014it does go on to say, \u201Cwhile ensuring strong protections for human health and the environment.\u201D\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000657\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bf71a65e-c9f0-4856-902f-1a15c4274e94\u0022\u003EI know this is going to be a very consequential select committee. This is a very complex area for which there is a wide variety of views. New Zealand First will be led by that select committee report. We must not trade away our GE-free competitive advantage lightly. We, essentially, have last-mover advantage to think very, very carefully about how we position ourselves in this space, particularly in food. We are a major food exporter. We must take the feedback of that sector, particularly our major exporters, extremely seriously. Fonterra has historically been very cautious on this technology. I understand their attitude has softened a bit of late, but it is those major exporters, particularly, that we must look to, to give some guidance. We must understand the trade-offs we are making. This is very much a risk-reward.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000658\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bf71a65e-c9f0-4856-902f-1a15c4274e94\u0022\u003EThe organic sector also, we do have some concerns around them. We must understand what the impacts are on them and what mechanisms are going to be available for them to continue on growing their sector.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000659\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bf71a65e-c9f0-4856-902f-1a15c4274e94\u0022\u003EConsumer sentiment is also a factor. We\u2019ve seen recently a methane inhibitor released in the UK, the Bovaer product, that has received major consumer pushback, and so there is often a difference between the enthusiasm of scientists for this technology, and consumers, and we must look to understand that. We have to be alert and humble enough to recognise that truism. We must also be compatible with our trading partners. There is no point getting too far ahead of ourselves in that regard. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000660\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bf71a65e-c9f0-4856-902f-1a15c4274e94\u0022\u003EOur GE regime is going to change. The live question is where we draw the line. We look forward to the select committee report, and New Zealand First will be closely scrutinising. Thank you.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00220ef5a38c-0ef7-4d68-8621-dcbb47077e6e\u0022 data-id=\u0022a015bc56156d4901b9bd63f92dec4e45\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000661\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220ef5a38c-0ef7-4d68-8621-dcbb47077e6e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022a015bc56156d4901b9bd63f92dec4e45\u0022\u003EHANA-RAWHITI MAIPI-CLARKE (Te P\u0101ti M\u0101ori\u2014Hauraki-Waikato):\u003C/span\u003E T\u0113n\u0101 r\u0101 koe, e te P\u012Bka. I\u2019ve got to say that this is one of the most complex, technical, and contentious bills\u2014potentially just as contentious as the Treaty principles bill. Why? This bill may not be about a treaty between two people, but it is a treaty between humankind and all living things, the environment, animals, and food. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000662\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220ef5a38c-0ef7-4d68-8621-dcbb47077e6e\u0022\u003EThis is a kaupapa that I\u2019m very passionate about. Before this political life, I was living the dream. I was a full-time gardener and a project manager where we created the first ever M\u0101ori organic community kai garden, in partnership with the Ministry for Primary Industries. We turned a once huge corn maze, which, honestly, just gave us hay fever, into a M\u0101ori supermarket, with lush, abundant, good, nutritious food for the local communities in my electorate. This is where I was introduced to the concept of what GE and GMO is, and the whakapapa of our kai. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000663\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220ef5a38c-0ef7-4d68-8621-dcbb47077e6e\u0022\u003EWhat is gene technology, to break it down for all the rangatahi watching right now? It is the science of changing or controlling the genes inside living things, like plants, animals, or even bacteria, to make them do things we want. Genes are like the instructions that tell living things how to grow, look, and work. With gene technology, scientists can add, remove, or change these instructions to improve health, make better crops, or even create new medicines. It\u2019s like editing a recipe to make it better, different, or, potentially, even worse. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000664\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220ef5a38c-0ef7-4d68-8621-dcbb47077e6e\u0022\u003EI, myself, have personally been a GE- and GMO-free advocate, and before I carry on, I\u2019d like to acknowledge the many different teams\u2014He Waka Kai Ora, Hua Para Kore, He Whenua Rongo, Koro Hiakai, and te Papawhakaritorito Charitable Trust\u2014for their continuous advocation and knowledge in this kaupapa. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000665\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220ef5a38c-0ef7-4d68-8621-dcbb47077e6e\u0022\u003EWhat are the pros and cons? Pros: improved crops, disease treatment, better nutrition, and medical advancement. Cons: environmental risks, health concerns, ethical issues, and cost and controls. In my eyes, GE in the right hands is great, but GE in the wrong hands is terrible. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000666\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220ef5a38c-0ef7-4d68-8621-dcbb47077e6e\u0022\u003EAotearoa New Zealand\u2019s current status on genetically modified organisms, otherwise known as GMOs, is that no fresh produce or meat is genetically modified and no GMOs are grown commercially. However, some processed foods may contain approved GMO ingredients that have been imported. With the introduction of this bill, that is about to completely change. J R Bruning from the Daily Telegraph NZ said, \u201CThe proposed deregulation of GMOs is so extreme that Judith Collins\u2019 current proposal would turn New Zealand from best practice, tightly regulated jurisdiction to one of the weakest in the western world.\u201D \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000667\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220ef5a38c-0ef7-4d68-8621-dcbb47077e6e\u0022\u003EThis bill is taking the lead from Australia and it acknowledges that we need to bring our legislation up to par with the international framework. However, proposed European legislation has stalled, and in Europe, deregulation exclusively concerns plants; while in New Zealand, deregulation would encompass plants, animals, and microbes. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000668\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220ef5a38c-0ef7-4d68-8621-dcbb47077e6e\u0022\u003EMy first policy release was an Aotearoa kai sovereignty policy. Some of the main points within this policy were to honour Wai 262 and to reject research and the commercialisation that is done without hap\u016B, iwi, and wh\u0101nau consent. Two unresolved issues raised in the Wai 262 claim remain outstanding, and it is the duty of this Parliament to honour the claim and bring the claim to conclusion: decisions about flora, fauna, and wider environment that are symbolic to M\u0101ori, and decisions about how education, culture, and heritage agencies support the transmission of M\u0101ori culture. We don\u2019t oppose the research and rangahau that can create massive benefits for humankind, but, as a nation, we must ensure that these checks and balances in our regulatory system framework are in a place that is robust enough to counter the potential risk factors. We have no idea of the long-term impacts into the future. We are literally going into the unknown, or, otherwise, opening a can of worms. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000669\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220ef5a38c-0ef7-4d68-8621-dcbb47077e6e\u0022\u003EAs M\u0101ori gardeners, me, Rawiri Waititi, Debbie Ngarewa-Packer, and Mariameno Kapa-Kingi have various seeds that were handed down from our ancestors, all the way from Hawaiki, which we still plant in our back yards today. This speaks volumes as to the way in which we protect our M\u0101ori intangible and tangible resources and taonga. I could have gone on longer, but\u2014[Time expired] \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022b978dee7-18cf-424c-8004-b165bda971ff\u0022 data-id=\u0022632e29b19ea84affa26404ffa77bba9d\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000670\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b978dee7-18cf-424c-8004-b165bda971ff\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022632e29b19ea84affa26404ffa77bba9d\u0022\u003ESAM UFFINDELL (National\u2014Tauranga):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Madam Speaker. This Government is ending the 30-year ban on gene technology outside the lab. There\u2019s a reason we\u2019re doing this: it\u2019s because we are going to tackle climate change. There is technology out there that we can use to tackle climate change, that we can use to help people get better from cancer, that we can use to boost productivity\u2014and at the current settings, we don\u2019t have the ability to do that. That\u2019s what we\u2019re going to. It\u2019s going to be a key source of science that has the potential to deliver enormous benefit to New Zealand, and we intend to utilise it.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000671\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b978dee7-18cf-424c-8004-b165bda971ff\u0022\u003ENow, there are people out there that are worried about the safeguards. Let me say to that: as the Minister has clearly articulated, there will be a regulator set up which will be established to oversee the use of gene technology in New Zealand. You don\u2019t have to utilise it if you don\u2019t want to, as Minister Collins said on a number of occasions.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000672\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b978dee7-18cf-424c-8004-b165bda971ff\u0022\u003EWe did hear a member opposite, I think, raise concerns about a lack of public consultation on the matter; there will be. It\u2019s called a select committee. I know the members of the Health Committee will do a very good job on that when it comes to us soon.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000673\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b978dee7-18cf-424c-8004-b165bda971ff\u0022\u003EWe are moving to deliver on our pre-election commitment to deliver gene technology and we are delivering on our coalition agreements with our partners. We are going to use technology, like gene technology, for the benefit of New Zealand. I commend this bill to the House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002226b88bf1-f634-40e7-8019-e75cc483ace7\u0022 data-id=\u0022c2f019291dc84b92a21acf22c4669e7f\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000674\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002226b88bf1-f634-40e7-8019-e75cc483ace7\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022c2f019291dc84b92a21acf22c4669e7f\u0022\u003EHon JO LUXTON (Labour):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Madam Speaker. I\u2019m pleased to take a call on this gene technology editing piece of legislation which unfortunately Labour at this stage cannot support going any further, and I\u2019d like to cover off the reasons as to why.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000675\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002226b88bf1-f634-40e7-8019-e75cc483ace7\u0022\u003EAs my colleague previously mentioned before, we can see the absolute benefits as far as medical research, etc., vaccines, and all of those things go, but where we have concern is partly around the consultation process, or lack thereof. The previous speaker, Sam Uffindell, talked about the fact that consultation will be happening as part of the select committee process, but I would argue that before something as big and complex as this is developed, there should be far wider consultation before it even gets to this stage; before the bill is even completely developed.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000676\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002226b88bf1-f634-40e7-8019-e75cc483ace7\u0022\u003EIn fact, there was some research done recently which showed 93 percent of the farmers that were surveyed thought it was important that there was widespread consultation with farmers. That has not happened. We know that there is a wide and diverse range of views as far as this particular subject goes, and I would argue that is particularly relevant as far as the horticultural sector goes. There is some real concern out there, within that sector, as to what this could mean for them.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000677\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002226b88bf1-f634-40e7-8019-e75cc483ace7\u0022\u003EIf we think about those that are growing organically, what happens if we have some sort of a crop or something that flowers and then contaminates a property nearby that is organic? Who pays for that happening? Will there be insurances taken out for those who are responsible for that in order for them to have to pay compensation? Is there going to be additional costs for those organic growers to have to go through and show that they continue to comply and be organic farmers?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000678\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002226b88bf1-f634-40e7-8019-e75cc483ace7\u0022\u003EI also want to touch on some of the information that we have seen in this regulatory impact statement (RIS), which is put together with advice for the Minister. There are a lot of concerns that were raised, particularly around the lack of being able to consult widely. They were only able to do some specific, targeted consultation, and I just think that that\u2019s really irresponsible when we\u2019re looking at a piece of legislation that means that our farmers and our growers and others are going to have to just put up with\u2014whether they choose it or not, it\u2019s going to be out there.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000679\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002226b88bf1-f634-40e7-8019-e75cc483ace7\u0022\u003EYes, I can understand and see the benefits as far as research and innovation goes. When we think about reducing our methane targets and all those kinds of things, I absolutely understand and get that, but the crux of the matter is\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000680\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bf71a65e-c9f0-4856-902f-1a15c4274e94\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022d9d31caa68164d4b897b81658037615c\u0022\u003EHon Mark Patterson\u003C/span\u003E: Support it to the select committee.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000681\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002226b88bf1-f634-40e7-8019-e75cc483ace7\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022ee4cf94bc3a34d6f988fa98a4082f20e\u0022\u003EHon JO LUXTON\u003C/span\u003E: \u2014that there is lack of consultation, Mr Patterson; lack of consultation from all those relevant in the sectors, and it should be done well before the select committee process, Mr Patterson.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000682\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b978dee7-18cf-424c-8004-b165bda971ff\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022b3c4028c723547ea9d3975e8b0b0bad2\u0022\u003ESam Uffindell\u003C/span\u003E: There was an election, as well.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000683\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002226b88bf1-f634-40e7-8019-e75cc483ace7\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00220a2f3860548c477ba1224a16bb463455\u0022\u003EHon JO LUXTON\u003C/span\u003E: The other thing\u2014that\u2019s not consultation on this particular piece of legislation. The consultation\u2014[Interruption]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000684\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002226b88bf1-f634-40e7-8019-e75cc483ace7\u0022\u003EOK, they talk about their election and their campaigning, and they campaigned on it, but you didn\u2019t campaign on the details, did you, Mr Uffindell? You didn\u2019t campaign on the details; you didn\u2019t campaign on the potential risks to our trade, which I know that my colleague the Hon Damien O\u2019Connor is going to speak to, because there are some serious implications.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000685\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002226b88bf1-f634-40e7-8019-e75cc483ace7\u0022\u003EThe one other thing that I would like to highlight is that they\u2019re going to establish a M\u0101ori advisory committee. As far as I can tell, this is simply tokenistic; absolutely tokenistic because, reading this RIS, they talk about: \u201CThe proposals alter the status quo by placing a duty [of] decision makers to manage adverse effects to M\u0101ori kaitiaki relationships with specific species, instead of requiring them to take into account Te Tiriti principles more generally. Given time and scope constraints, officials did not analyse a wide range of options on how to best protect M\u0101ori rights and interests.\u201D\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000686\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002226b88bf1-f634-40e7-8019-e75cc483ace7\u0022\u003EThey also gave different options to Ministers\u2014which they chose not to give M\u0101ori the opportunity to have decision making in this process. We do not support this.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00222837c142-c937-468e-9984-bc646d066687\u0022 data-id=\u00226d7b1ea6245143a3aa1fe3399c8ea89e\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000687\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00222837c142-c937-468e-9984-bc646d066687\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00226d7b1ea6245143a3aa1fe3399c8ea89e\u0022\u003EDr HAMISH CAMPBELL (National\u2014Ilam):\u003C/span\u003E It is a great day for science. I have spent my working life dedicated to scientific research, including using these genetic technologies, which, ultimately, is about improving the health outcomes of all New Zealanders and improving our quality of life. I\u2019m also an organic producer, so I understand people that are producing things organically, and the two aren\u2019t mutually exclusive; we can do both.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000688\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00222837c142-c937-468e-9984-bc646d066687\u0022\u003EThis bill is very important to unleash our medical research, our agricultural research, because this is not just about CAR T-cells and cancer treatments; it\u2019s also about environmental and economic outcomes for all New Zealanders. Therefore, I commend this bill to the House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022471dee54-f59e-4497-b3d3-c39044ce7169\u0022 data-id=\u0022a57cb295ee954748966909e158d039e8\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000689\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022471dee54-f59e-4497-b3d3-c39044ce7169\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022a57cb295ee954748966909e158d039e8\u0022\u003EHon DAMIEN O\u2019CONNOR (Labour):\u003C/span\u003E In 2023, a report was put out by Te Puna Whakaaronui which recommended that we have a conversation on GE regulation because we had fallen behind. At the same time, the Labour Government was looking at changes to GE regulations for medical purposes. The conversation has not occurred. What we have received in the House is a bill\u2014a bill that would have limited scope for change, that this Government is going to proceed with.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000690\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022471dee54-f59e-4497-b3d3-c39044ce7169\u0022\u003EThe question I have is: who paid money to bring this bill into this House? Who paid money to bring this bill into this House? There are officials up there, they\u2019ve done quite a lot of work. They\u2019ve been instructed by the Government to rush that work, and they\u2019ve written the report here\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000691\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002298dbeffa-e059-49d5-8bbf-579cbaead9a3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022d614a4b154bb4481ab0cb07b44d95f4a\u0022\u003EHon Scott Simpson\u003C/span\u003E: Point of order, Madam Speaker. I hesitated to interrupt the member on his feet, but to allege that money had transferred to bring a bill into this House is utterly unparliamentary and the member should stand, withdraw, and apologise.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000692\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002261720d2e-5b1d-4742-b4f0-30424316ccc1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00220b1eccc90e1944d4abfeb0a71ef08ac9\u0022\u003EDEPUTY SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: I think it was on the border, but the thing that was concerning me was bringing officials into the debate, which actually, the Hon Damien O\u2019Connor, I think, probably wasn\u2019t the wisest thing across that whole sentence.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000693\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022471dee54-f59e-4497-b3d3-c39044ce7169\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00227b45b04dbf314e08ab39015325947aaa\u0022\u003EHon DAMIEN O\u2019CONNOR\u003C/span\u003E: Can I just acknowledge it wasn\u2019t to discredit in any way the officials, but they\u2019ve done a report here of 131 pages, which is quite comprehensive, and you should read it. It sets up a regulator\u2014a person within the Environmental Protection Authority who is accountable only to the Minister\u2014only to the Minister. What piece of legislation of such significance would set up such a regime? \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000694\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022471dee54-f59e-4497-b3d3-c39044ce7169\u0022\u003EI\u2019ve gone through this in detail. I\u2019ll start off here\u2014[Interruption]\u2014with officials\u2019 advice that says\u2014they\u2019re very sensitive, aren\u2019t they, on this? Very sensitive, they are. \u201CWe are unable to comprehensively quantify these expected benefits as technology development is uncertain, there are few \u201Cready for market\u201D gene technologies in New Zealand currently and the make-up of New Zealand\u2019s food and fibre industry is distinct.\u201D The reality is that our economy depends on the production and the sale of the finest food and fibre in the world. Our economy depends upon it and the report quite clearly says that there is general enthusiasm and support for progress in medicine, but not in the food and fibre sectors, which is where a conversation needs to occur.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000695\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022471dee54-f59e-4497-b3d3-c39044ce7169\u0022\u003EI\u2019ll go through this again and quote here: \u201CCurrent understanding of the current and potential gene technology sector limited our ability to outline both benefits and potential impacts (and is in part a consequence of the existing regulatory constraints on the activity).\u201D They go on to say, \u201CThis scope limitation has meant [and] mean that we have not considered all potential options that may have effectively addressed key issues underlying\u201D. This has been rushed. There has been no conversation. In here, it once again says that there may not be the public licence to progress the very changes that this Government may want to see\u2014and indeed I want to see as well, but I want to see a cautious progress here.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000696\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022471dee54-f59e-4497-b3d3-c39044ce7169\u0022\u003ECan I go on to say from this report, which everyone should have, \u201CThe policy development process has been limited by a time line seeking to Cabinet approval of policy decisions to enable the introduction of a Bill into the House before the end of 2024, [in order to] enable the regime to be operational in 2025. This has compressed the analysis able to be undertaken in a highly complex area, and may mean options, impacts, and consequences were not (or \u2026 fully) considered.\u201D\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000697\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022471dee54-f59e-4497-b3d3-c39044ce7169\u0022\u003EThere has been little or no consideration of what the impacts of this might be on core parts of our economy. I\u2019ll go on to say that in assessing the so-called risk analysis, the question of whether trade in our markets should be taken into account, it has been rejected. It says here, \u201CThe expected eventual release into the environment of some GMOs would involve potential risks for trade and market access because trading partners may not accept exports that have been \u2018contaminated\u2019 by GMOs, incidentally or otherwise.\u201D\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000698\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022471dee54-f59e-4497-b3d3-c39044ce7169\u0022\u003EThis puts at risk our markets and the sale of all of our primary produce, and there has not been any proper consultation, proper consideration. Indeed, this bill prevents the consideration, on the basis of the recommendations in here, of those market access. This is potentially disastrous for trade. Labour will be not supporting this bill.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022d4f894dc-da63-4b45-9c2a-c07b41a65e64\u0022 data-id=\u00226fd69ce5552e4f62bfc216d5baf12f83\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000699\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022d4f894dc-da63-4b45-9c2a-c07b41a65e64\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00226fd69ce5552e4f62bfc216d5baf12f83\u0022\u003EDr VANESSA WEENINK (National\u2014Banks Peninsula):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Madam Speaker. It\u2019s an honour to be the final speaker in this debate on the first reading of the Gene Technology Bill. It\u2019s a great day for science, as many have said. This bill puts in place the regulatory enablement to allow the exciting advancements in potential in health research and biotech, in the plant and food sector, and especially in our Crown research institutes, like Scion. This is a great day. I commend the bill to the House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca id=\u0022b1eaf34d7f8d44eca94274636fbaf7da\u0022 name=\u0022division\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EA party vote was called for on the question, That the Gene Technology Bill be now read a first time.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EAyes 68\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand National 49; ACT New Zealand 11; New Zealand First 8.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENoes 55\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand Labour 34; Green Party of Aotearoa New Zealand 15; Te P\u0101ti M\u0101ori 6.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EMotion agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000700\u0022\u003EBill read a first time.\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000701\u0022\u003EThe result corrected after originally being announced as Ayes 68, Noes 53.\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca id=\u00225209f1a6a3cf41fdbf78183fb0a34bb9\u0022 name=\u0022division\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EThat the Gene Technology Bill be considered by the Health Committee.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EA party vote was called for on the question, That the motion be agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EAyes 68\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand National 49; ACT New Zealand 11; New Zealand First 8.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENoes 55\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand Labour 34; Green Party of Aotearoa New Zealand 15; Te P\u0101ti M\u0101ori 6.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EMotion agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000702\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002261720d2e-5b1d-4742-b4f0-30424316ccc1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a044944197704e65ac37c00de8774076\u0022\u003EDEPUTY SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: The question is, \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000703\u0022\u003EBill referred to the Health Committee.\u003C/p\u003E\n    \u003C/div\u003E\n    \u003Cdiv class=\u0022HpsHansard\u0022\u003E\n      \u003Cp\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsProceedingHeading\u0022\u003EBills\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000704\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u002266b28890efb544eba4f5d494d2a21c7c\u0022\u003ELocal Government (Water Services) Bill\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000705\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u0022ff6f7871c9ed4b7a83734d0b65a5046a\u0022\u003EFirst Reading\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002255d0b7a4-a2c9-4c38-9b77-475311a48a89\u0022 data-id=\u0022ecbc8e6ed3c7445caf6e6e82cd9b975c\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000706\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002255d0b7a4-a2c9-4c38-9b77-475311a48a89\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022ecbc8e6ed3c7445caf6e6e82cd9b975c\u0022\u003EHon SIMEON BROWN (Minister of Local Government):\u003C/span\u003E I present a legislative statement on the Local Government (Water Services) Bill.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000707\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002261720d2e-5b1d-4742-b4f0-30424316ccc1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022369f1f27f64e4b72b9c0e4f2727e254d\u0022\u003EDEPUTY SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: That legislative statement is published under the authority of the House and can be found on the Parliament website.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000708\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002255d0b7a4-a2c9-4c38-9b77-475311a48a89\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002262c2d4935dc545e58763f67cad7358c0\u0022\u003EHon SIMEON BROWN\u003C/span\u003E: I move, That the Local Government (Water Services) Bill be now read a first time. I nominate the Finance and Expenditure Committee to consider the bill.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000709\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002255d0b7a4-a2c9-4c38-9b77-475311a48a89\u0022\u003EThis bill is the third part of this Government\u2019s work to deliver comprehensive reform of New Zealand\u2019s water service delivery. It gives councils a range of innovative new structures for the delivery of water services from which they can choose. The bill does not impose a one-size-fits-all solution. Councils and voters resoundingly rejected Labour\u2019s expensive and bureaucratic three waters approach, which wasted $1.2 billion, stripping local communities of control over their water assets while failing to address New Zealand\u2019s water infrastructure deficit. The bill gives councils flexibility, recognises that they know the needs of their communities best, and supports council-driven change. The bill also reduces the regulatory burden on councils by ensuring that regulation is proportionate and its costs do not outweigh its benefits. It also introduces economic regulation to local government water services.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000710\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002255d0b7a4-a2c9-4c38-9b77-475311a48a89\u0022\u003ELocal Water Done Well gives councils the tools they need to do the basics brilliantly. It provides appropriate accountability mechanisms for ratepayers and communities to be assured that water services are being delivered effectively in their local communities. These changes provide greater certainty and improved efficiency to benefit all New Zealanders. We know that Local Water Done Well works. We have delivered on our election promise to provide a financially sustainable model for Auckland under our Local Water Done Well plan. The plan, which has been unanimously supported and endorsed by Auckland Council\u2019s governing body, sees Aucklanders retain local control of water assets and avoid a 25.8 percent water rate hike, which would have been piled on to Aucklanders already struggling with a prolonged cost of living crisis.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000711\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002255d0b7a4-a2c9-4c38-9b77-475311a48a89\u0022\u003EWe fixed that issue. We did a deal with Auckland Council, and, while I\u2019ve heard commentary from other members of Parliament trying to say that they would have done a better job, the reality is that under their plan, they would have lumped another billion dollars of establishment costs on to their three water entities model. They would have had higher water rates increases in Auckland, causing further cost of living constraints and also limiting the capital expenditure on Auckland Watercare and the important work that they\u2019re doing in Auckland. This Government has fixed that issue because the last Government\u2019s approach did not stack up, which is why New Zealanders rejected it.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000712\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002255d0b7a4-a2c9-4c38-9b77-475311a48a89\u0022\u003EThis bill establishes a new central piece of legislation for the delivery of water services and amends several other Acts. I intend the bill will be split during this legislative process into a stand-alone Act and one that amends and repeals other pieces of legislation. As this is the third stage of the Local Water Done Well process, the bill is built on the foundation set in the Local Government (Water Services Preliminary Arrangements) Act 2024. This Act requires councils to prepare water service delivery plans by September 2025. The plans will lay out the current state of water services in their districts, which will show how councils will deliver water services in the future in a financially sustainable way and meet economic, environmental, and drinking water - quality standards.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000713\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002255d0b7a4-a2c9-4c38-9b77-475311a48a89\u0022\u003EThis bill provides the enduring settings for the delivery of local government water services. It will inform the development of councils\u2019 water service delivery plans, and I encourage councils to submit on the bill while they work through these plans. I\u2019m also going to be asking the Finance and Expenditure Committee to accept submissions from councils up till the end of February, so that councils can consider their submissions at their first meetings of the new year and have enough time to submit on this bill.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000714\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002255d0b7a4-a2c9-4c38-9b77-475311a48a89\u0022\u003EThe bill gives councils flexibility and discretion to determine the optimal structure for water service delivery arrangements that will work for their communities. It is not prescriptive but sets the requirements and parameters to guide council decision-making. The bill also establishes a new class of water service provider, water organisations based on existing council-controlled organisation (CCO) models. Councils can combine or establish solely owned water organisations, they can continue to provide water services in-house using the improved regulatory and service delivery settings in the bill, or they can come to other arrangements, including third party contracting or joint arrangements with other water service providers. A new model of water organisation owned by consumer trusts is also set out in the bill. This model is similar to energy trusts which own electricity distribution businesses, such as Entrust\u2019s ownership of Vector in Auckland. Councils can establish a consumer trust to act\u00A0in the interest of consumers, run by trustees elected through free and fair elections.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000715\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002255d0b7a4-a2c9-4c38-9b77-475311a48a89\u0022\u003EA series of core principles will apply to all water service providers, which includes financial sustainability, revenue sufficiency\u2014requiring that revenue from water services is only spent on water services\u2014and restrictions against privatisation. The streamlined consultation provisions provided by the preliminary arrangements Act, as a temporary measure to support councils in creating CCOs, carry across to this bill. These efficient consultation and decision-making processes will be a permanent feature.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000716\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002255d0b7a4-a2c9-4c38-9b77-475311a48a89\u0022\u003EThis bill will implement our new economic regulation regime, which will be overseen by the Commerce Commission, to ensure water revenue is ring-fenced for investment in water infrastructure and not diverted to other council pet projects. This will promote efficient, high-quality drinking- and waste-water services, with the ability to regulate stormwater services at a later date if necessary and, importantly, as I said, allow requiring councils to ring-fence that funding so that the money that\u2019s raised for water isn\u2019t spent on other things\u2014it\u2019s spent on water. What a novel idea, and a critical part of fixing the issues we\u2019re seeing up and down the country. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000717\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002255d0b7a4-a2c9-4c38-9b77-475311a48a89\u0022\u003EThe regulatory tools available to the commission will include information disclosure, revenue thresholds, and powers to monitor and enforce the requirement that revenue from regulated water services is spent on water services. The Commerce Commission will also have a role in consumer protection. It will monitor how consumers are treated by regulated suppliers through information disclosure. If issues exist, the commission will be able to issue guidelines to the suppliers, and a mandatory service quality code if necessary. The Minister of Commerce and Consumer Affairs may also recommend consumer protection regulations be made. The water services regulator will also be renamed the Water Services Authority, and the legislation will put the English name first.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000718\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002255d0b7a4-a2c9-4c38-9b77-475311a48a89\u0022\u003EThe bill reduces the regulatory burden of the drinking water quality regime. It ensures that the authority\u2019s regulatory approach is proportionate to the scale, complexity, and capability of the regulated suppliers. Low-risk, shared domestic suppliers are excluded from direct regulation under the Water Services Act for that reason\u2014an important thing for many\u00A0of our rural communities. The bill changes the operating principles of the authority, requiring it to consider the costs of regulatory compliance for suppliers. The authority must also work\u00A0proactively with suppliers and network operators. This is to ensure that compliance requirements take into account the risk profile and capacity of each supply.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000719\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002255d0b7a4-a2c9-4c38-9b77-475311a48a89\u0022\u003EThere\u2019s also a number of transitionary arrangements and exemptions for Watercare, which, as I said earlier, was financially separated from Auckland Council by the preliminary arrangements Act, making Auckland water services affordable, saving households about $899 million over four years while ensuring improved service quality and record infrastructure investment. This bill includes several exemptions for Watercare agreed with Auckland Council, recognising the work that is already well under way for Auckland.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000720\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002255d0b7a4-a2c9-4c38-9b77-475311a48a89\u0022\u003EIn conclusion, our Government is now delivering the enduring components of water services through our Local Water Done Well plan, giving local council the ability and the clarity it needs to invest in local infrastructure, while delivering economic regulation to minimise costs for ratepayers. This delivers on the coalition\u2019s promises that we took to the last election from the National Party, the ACT Party, and the New Zealand First Party to repeal Labour\u2019s disastrous and expensive co-governed, bureaucratic three waters approach and replace it with Local Water Done Well, which restores councils\u2019 ownership of their assets and allows councils to invest sustainably in their local infrastructure. I commend this bill to the House. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002261720d2e-5b1d-4742-b4f0-30424316ccc1\u0022 data-id=\u00225e7b2eec438b4bc2b21b8b6c6383568f\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000721\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002261720d2e-5b1d-4742-b4f0-30424316ccc1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00225e7b2eec438b4bc2b21b8b6c6383568f\u0022\u003EDEPUTY SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: The question is that the motion be agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022a1f7bbd1-b6ae-41c0-963b-dbe1251f5540\u0022 data-id=\u00229fefdec4dd764a7b8974a081379a1b28\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000722\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a1f7bbd1-b6ae-41c0-963b-dbe1251f5540\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00229fefdec4dd764a7b8974a081379a1b28\u0022\u003EHon KIERAN McANULTY (Labour):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Madam Speaker. This bill is a crock. It is an absolute disgrace\u2014a disgrace of a bill introduced by a disingenuous Minister. The reason I say that is that he stood up yet again in this House and promised New Zealanders that this bill would work: \u201CWe know that Local Water Done Well works and we have fixed the issue.\u201D That is not true, and he knows it\u2019s not true. This is what is so disgraceful about this entire process. This isn\u2019t a solution; this is a political PR exercise. This is the result of a Minister who promised the country that he would deliver a water services system that would be cheaper, knowing that it won\u2019t be. At no point throughout this entire process\u2014a process that concludes with this bill tonight\u2014has he ever produced numbers to demonstrate that it adds up.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000723\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e77494a0-1be1-432f-b492-fd160f4c119d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002252dde392d1394b209c728c1dacbf1110\u0022\u003EHon Peeni Henare\u003C/span\u003E: And he knows it.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000724\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a1f7bbd1-b6ae-41c0-963b-dbe1251f5540\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002286f81f5027484cfd8d6fb372f5e68324\u0022\u003EHon KIERAN McANULTY\u003C/span\u003E: He knows it doesn\u2019t. This is the thing that I find so egregious: he knows this won\u2019t work, and yet he stands up in the House tonight and promises, yet again, empty promises\u2014promises he never intends to keep; if he did, he\u2019d be able to prove it. Every time we have asked him to, he\u2019s deflected or denied; he\u2019s never provided evidence.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000725\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a1f7bbd1-b6ae-41c0-963b-dbe1251f5540\u0022\u003ELet\u2019s look at the facts. From councils\u2019 own numbers, over the next 30 years they need to spend $185 billion. If this proposal is set up against that figure, it doesn\u2019t add up. So they\u2019ve made up another figure. They haven\u2019t used $185 billion; they\u2019ve used the long-term plans\u2014only 10 years\u2019 worth of expenditure\u2014but they know that many of the large pieces of infrastructure are not included in those long-term plans. They know that, but they\u2019ve chosen to do it anyway. It is a fraction of that $185 billion. The only reason they\u2019ve done that is to try and make their system add up. It is dishonest and it will result in unaffordable bills that this Government is setting local councils up to take the fall.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000726\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a1f7bbd1-b6ae-41c0-963b-dbe1251f5540\u0022\u003EListen to their language: the Prime Minister turning up to the local government conference and saying that mayors and councillors need to stop doing dumb things, when up to 90 percent of council expenditure is spent on water and roads, as it is. They know that; they don\u2019t care. They know that there is disgruntlement in the community towards local councils as a whole, and they are manipulating that to suit their political agenda. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000727\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a1f7bbd1-b6ae-41c0-963b-dbe1251f5540\u0022\u003EI think it\u2019s disgraceful, because this is only going to make things worse, it\u2019s not going to fix the problem, and when that inevitably arises, what is this Government going to do? \u201CThat\u2019s the responsibility of local government.\u201D We\u2019ve heard that before. \u201CLocal government is accountable to their own communities.\u201D We\u2019ve heard that before. Why are they saying it? It\u2019s to wash their hands of any responsibility. But it is their responsibility, because this is a massive issue facing this country. It\u2019s not just the local government sector, this obscure thing\u00A0we can kick when we want to; it\u2019s ratepayers and it\u2019s renters, because when rates go up,\u00A0household income goes down. When rates go up, rents go down. That\u2019s what\u2019s going to happen.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000728\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a1f7bbd1-b6ae-41c0-963b-dbe1251f5540\u0022\u003EThis Government was elected, in part, because they promised that they would fix it. Tonight\u2019s bill is not a solution. This is going to lead to higher rates\u2014the credit rating agencies have said it. The credit rating agencies have said, because of this bill and because this Government repealed affordable water, councils\u2019 credit ratings will go down. That is a direct result of their policies, and it\u2019s out there in the public domain.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000729\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a1f7bbd1-b6ae-41c0-963b-dbe1251f5540\u0022\u003EThey don\u2019t care because they are looking New Zealanders in the eye and telling them that they have made it cheaper for them, but they haven\u2019t. I\u2019ll tell you who they have made it cheaper for: the Government\u2014that\u2019s all this is about. All this was about was getting a political issue off the table. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002261720d2e-5b1d-4742-b4f0-30424316ccc1\u0022 data-id=\u00228a8053f5b69e4805a0adc3d0c762d373\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000730\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002261720d2e-5b1d-4742-b4f0-30424316ccc1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00228a8053f5b69e4805a0adc3d0c762d373\u0022\u003EDEPUTY SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: The member\u2019s time has expired.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022a1f7bbd1-b6ae-41c0-963b-dbe1251f5540\u0022 data-id=\u0022934c3e5824a945f6b3165052d3898244\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000731\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a1f7bbd1-b6ae-41c0-963b-dbe1251f5540\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022934c3e5824a945f6b3165052d3898244\u0022\u003EHon KIERAN McANULTY (Labour):\u003C/span\u003E  Point of order, Madam Speaker. Ah, I apologise\u2014never mind!\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000732\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002261720d2e-5b1d-4742-b4f0-30424316ccc1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022b3900fe96fee42608b4330d34b66b92a\u0022\u003EDEPUTY SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Apology accepted.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002246269786-ecb4-40e2-972a-e287c495bdec\u0022 data-id=\u00229bb110d1843c4121b9ee1d6301427453\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000733\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002246269786-ecb4-40e2-972a-e287c495bdec\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00229bb110d1843c4121b9ee1d6301427453\u0022\u003ELAN PHAM (Green):\u003C/span\u003E T\u0113n\u0101 koe, Madam Speaker. Water matters to every single one of us, and I really get sick of stating the bleeding obvious like that, but, unfortunately, we forget. We forget how foundational water is to us as human beings and how foundational water is when it comes to a functional planet. We need progress so badly in this water services space, because these challenges that we have across Aotearoa are so very real and they\u2019re not going away without significant intervention\u2014but not progress like this; progress that takes us backwards rather than forwards.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000734\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002246269786-ecb4-40e2-972a-e287c495bdec\u0022\u003ESadly, Te P\u0101ti K\u0101k\u0101riki will not be supporting this bill tonight, and there\u2019s three initial reasons why. Firstly, the health of our people: we don\u2019t support the narrowing of the scope of who does and doesn\u2019t need to comply with the regulatory standards. Now, this is under the guise of reducing regulatory burden of the drinking-water quality regime, but the inequities when it comes to access to clean, healthy water and access to waste-water and stormwater networks that don\u2019t unnecessarily pollute our environment and ourselves is staggering.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000735\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002246269786-ecb4-40e2-972a-e287c495bdec\u0022\u003EI recall just over a year ago when T\u0101huna Queenstown was wrestling with its cryptosporidium outbreak. That absolutely got headlines and attention, and even international attention. We should all be well aware of the Havelock North tragedy that this country experienced, but what needs as much attention is the thousands of Kiwis who experience this rolling risk profile of ongoing boil-water notices and the like in places like Ward in Marlborough, in Waimate in South Canterbury, in places like Te Kao in Te Tai Tokerau, and so many other places where our people are throwing a dice every time they turn on the tap for a drink at their home, on marae, at their school, on their farm, at their place of work. We need strong protections when it comes to protection and regulation of these small and rural water supplies in place, particularly in light of the recent Ministry for\u00A0the Environment report on rural drinking water, which found concerning levels of E.\u00A0coli and nitrates in schools.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000736\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002246269786-ecb4-40e2-972a-e287c495bdec\u0022\u003ESecondly, the health of te taiao: it\u2019s incredibly disappointing that this Government is continuing to not recognise the importance of te mana o te wai in water services, considering\u00A0we literally cannot have human health improvements without the improvements of te taiao.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000737\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002246269786-ecb4-40e2-972a-e287c495bdec\u0022\u003EThirdly, if the Government\u2019s going to make any changes, especially foundational changes, to the governance and delivery of water services here in Aotearoa, then the Government actually needs to act like they live in Aotearoa, where Te Tiriti o Waitangi is our foundation. That means what some have called co-governance but what more appropriately is just called governance\u2014it\u2019s actually partnering with iwi and hap\u016B in appropriate governance over wai\u00A0and water service delivery.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000738\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002246269786-ecb4-40e2-972a-e287c495bdec\u0022\u003EI want to acknowledge our councils and councillors in the context of this bill. They\u2019ve had to spend the last few months tasked with the unenviable task of working out their water service delivery plans and talking about partnerships with councils around them in the absence of the full legislative framework, and it\u2019s made it hugely challenging, if not impossible, to actually meaningfully engage with communities and get their views. It\u2019s so important that they submit on this bill, and it\u2019s so important that they engage with their communities.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000739\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002246269786-ecb4-40e2-972a-e287c495bdec\u0022\u003EWe\u2019re really concerned about the plans to push the full cost of the regulators on to local communities. We just heard from Palmerston North City Council that they\u2019ve estimated that to be in the realm of $400,000 a year and, no doubt, much higher costs for smaller councils.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000740\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002246269786-ecb4-40e2-972a-e287c495bdec\u0022\u003EWe\u2019re really happy to see the protections against privatisation, but of course we want to make sure that these are really strong. Healthy drinking water is and should be recognised as a human right, and we want strong local voice and control at every stage of this bill ahead. Kia ora.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000741\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002246269786-ecb4-40e2-972a-e287c495bdec\u0022\u003EDebate interrupted.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n    \u003C/div\u003E\n    \u003Cdiv class=\u0022HpsHansard\u0022\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000742\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsProceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u00229948dfea27494ccd9d1513917e5afc29\u0022\u003EVoting\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000743\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u00228d88386604fe4d929e2d242ec629e85d\u0022\u003ECorrection\u2014Gene Technology Bill\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002261720d2e-5b1d-4742-b4f0-30424316ccc1\u0022 data-id=\u0022ab4868406fa54eb9b104d46274aec2e1\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000744\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002261720d2e-5b1d-4742-b4f0-30424316ccc1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022ab4868406fa54eb9b104d46274aec2e1\u0022\u003EDEPUTY SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Just before I take the next speaker, members, during the vote on the first reading of the Gene Technology Bill, the result was incorrectly recorded as Ayes 68, Noes 53. The correct result is Ayes 68, Noes 55. The record will be corrected accordingly.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n    \u003C/div\u003E\n    \u003Cdiv class=\u0022HpsHansard\u0022\u003E\n      \u003Cp\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsProceedingHeading\u0022\u003EBills\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000745\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u0022f7377878d3674a759ec3ffeabfe34e4c\u0022\u003ELocal Government (Water Services) Bill\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000746\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u0022ce6d1671c3dd4cc88039d77044704627\u0022\u003EFirst Reading\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000747\u0022\u003EDebate resumed.\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022cfc7092e-b202-4acf-aa9c-8aebd551cc39\u0022 data-id=\u0022b705aa67e1884677b2eb965a84ffd7bd\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000748\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cfc7092e-b202-4acf-aa9c-8aebd551cc39\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022b705aa67e1884677b2eb965a84ffd7bd\u0022\u003ECAMERON LUXTON (ACT):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Madam Speaker. I rise to speak on behalf of the ACT Party to the Local Government (Water Services) Bill, first reading. It\u2019s an important bill to set up a regulatory framework for water services delivery. It makes clear that councils need to provide an assets condition register and also a plan to show how they envision investing for long-term upgrades and maintenance and capital upgrades. The water services providers are natural monopolies and so having a strong and credible regulatory framework is vital.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00227dbfbd83-6770-4555-8477-85fa01511504\u0022 data-id=\u0022118c8619ba5841079e705cd49d797477\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000749\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227dbfbd83-6770-4555-8477-85fa01511504\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022118c8619ba5841079e705cd49d797477\u0022\u003EANDY FOSTER (NZ First):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Mr Speaker. Look, we all agree that more investment is needed in the three waters and that, actually, long term, that\u2019s been something which has been under-invested in by local government, but lest central government get too above itself, central government\u2019s asset management is even worse than local government\u2019s, so I think we\u2019ve got a job to do there.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000750\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227dbfbd83-6770-4555-8477-85fa01511504\u0022\u003EWe\u2019ve been lectured through the day, particularly during the Fast-track Approvals Bill, about not listening to submissions, and I\u2019d just like to remind people as I speak, about the number of submissions that there were on Labour\u2019s Water Services Entities Act, which we\u2019ve heard is so popular! There were 680 submissions in support of it, there were 160 neutral submissions, and 85,584 against\u201499 percent opposition. And did they listen? Did they what! No, they did not. They did not listen to the councils at all. It was one of the things that absolutely split local government. These guys do not want to listen to that\u2014it is an inconvenient truth for them.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000751\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227dbfbd83-6770-4555-8477-85fa01511504\u0022\u003ENot only have we been lectured on that, Labour\u2019s model was very, very expensive: $185\u00A0billion, they were talking about. They were too invasive. They went down, at one stage, to two households being managed by the State. It was ideological. We\u2019ve already heard about the co-governance arrangements which racially divided New Zealand. Even the courts\u2014even the courts\u2014when three brave councils went to court, found that it was appropriation without compensation. That is theft\u2014theft. That is what the last Government was indulging in, and that is what they should not have been doing.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000752\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002202e74c40-9529-4e15-adc2-c032eadc2205\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00228dec4f8243a3489e957a4ccfe11ece2b\u0022\u003EASSISTANT SPEAKER (Greg O\u2019Connor)\u003C/span\u003E: Now, time to go on to the modern bill\u2014you\u2019ve had an hour and a half.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000753\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227dbfbd83-6770-4555-8477-85fa01511504\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022b4ca4d4b1385498a83515d2c9252b45c\u0022\u003EANDY FOSTER\u003C/span\u003E: That\u2019s exactly what I was about to do. In comparison\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000754\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002202e74c40-9529-4e15-adc2-c032eadc2205\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00224f400a338791467c9be7fb5f026c46ab\u0022\u003EASSISTANT SPEAKER (Greg O\u2019Connor)\u003C/span\u003E: A minute and a half.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000755\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227dbfbd83-6770-4555-8477-85fa01511504\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00220722d883ce8441fcb3df3898719013fb\u0022\u003EANDY FOSTER\u003C/span\u003E: In comparison, this legislation leaves assets with the communities and the councils that have built them up over the last 150-odd years. It gives councils the choice over their delivery arrangements. It allows councils to set statements of expectation to guide the water entities. It is subject to the disciplines of the Commerce Commission and the Water Services Authority\u2014Taumata Arowai, which I think will be a very good discipline on them. And there is a lot of transparency requirement on them. It ring-fences finances, which I think is an excellent thing to do. It also clarifies one thing, which I don\u2019t think Labour ever actually managed to do, which is to allow water companies to charge for water services\u2014and also, I think, very pleasingly, to be able to charge for development contributions, which I think is a very, very sensible thing to do. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000756\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227dbfbd83-6770-4555-8477-85fa01511504\u0022\u003EIt allows for waste-water standards to be set by Order in Council. Labour was asking where does\u2014you know, how\u2019s this going to save money? That\u2019s one of the places it might well do that. It also allows, by Order in Council, national engineering standards, which I think will be very, very helpful to councils in saving money, and protect against privatisation. I look forward to the passage of this bill through the House and through the select committee. I commend this bill to the House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002227600399-0a88-4371-a784-b5a7bc7afc37\u0022 data-id=\u00228e5cbc7b7f6e43e2b4ec4ae18a867785\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000757\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002227600399-0a88-4371-a784-b5a7bc7afc37\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00228e5cbc7b7f6e43e2b4ec4ae18a867785\u0022\u003EMARIAMENO KAPA-KINGI (Te P\u0101ti M\u0101ori\u2014Te Tai Tokerau):\u003C/span\u003E Kia ora. T\u0113n\u0101 koe e te P\u012Bka. T\u0113n\u0101 t\u0101tou katoa. The context of this is, and I\u2019ve heard it referred to briefly in terms of the numbers, where I come from, Te Tai Tokerau, in a cute little place that Peeni and I know, which is Kae\u014D\u201425 years on boil-water notice in one tiny little place, in Kae\u014D. Te Kao\u2014no different; you have to either buy your water or boil it, and clearly this is what this bill ignores completely.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000758\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002227600399-0a88-4371-a784-b5a7bc7afc37\u0022\u003EThis, in my opening discussion, brace yourself\u2014M\u0101ori erasure, a theme extended into even water services. I know I can feel people prickling, but just hold on. The alienation of te iwi M\u0101ori from the Local Government (Water Services) Bill is merely a continuation of the infringements on the rights of tangata whenua under Te Tiriti o Waitangi, just to throw that in. The key difference between the previous reform\u2014and I\u2019ve got some experience in that, because 11 iwi across the Tai Tokerau tae mai i Waikato tae atu ki Te Reinga [Northland from Waikato, all the way through to Cape Reinga] combined under a body called Waipuna aa rangi in the three waters gig, and we thought, \u201CLet\u2019s give this a go. Let\u2019s do our best, because we are our own solutions.\u201D Well, that\u2019s been taken away and shut away, because good ideas that are designed and delivered by M\u0101ori clearly don\u2019t make the cut with this current Government. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000759\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002227600399-0a88-4371-a784-b5a7bc7afc37\u0022\u003EThe Government\u2019s current repeal replaces policy\u2014the previous reform recognised and provided for te iwi M\u0101ori. It does not in this bill\u2014it does not. In fact, it ignores it and puts it to the side, but we\u2019re kind of used to that. It\u2019s been a year of that. The ongoing Crown position that everyone owns the water is designed to extinguish the rights of tangata whenua. I don\u2019t know how many times you need to say this for the left side of the House to actually sink in and understand that at a very fundamental level. Clearly, if you don\u2019t have the capacity to do that, you simply can\u2019t get it, because you have an already always listening, an already always racist listening, which is to\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000760\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227dbfbd83-6770-4555-8477-85fa01511504\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022cc136da944b441538ad6417457c485ce\u0022\u003EAndy Foster\u003C/span\u003E: That\u2019s not racist\u2014everybody has the water.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000761\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002227600399-0a88-4371-a784-b5a7bc7afc37\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a39b9dbd9bd04987bb55d7d964963fb2\u0022\u003EMARIAMENO KAPA-KINGI\u003C/span\u003E: Well, you can\u2019t say that, can you? When you\u2019re a P\u0101keh\u0101 guy, you just can\u2019t say that, so let\u2019s move along. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000762\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002227600399-0a88-4371-a784-b5a7bc7afc37\u0022\u003ENowhere in this new bill\u2014nowhere in this new bill\u2014are council obligated to consult with te iwi M\u0101ori. Nowhere in this bill. For this reform to be successful, she says laughingly, negotiations between Government and hap\u016B and iwi have to occur. They have to happen, but they don\u2019t, not really. They might say, \u201COh, look, I\u2019ll choose that M\u0101ori or one that\u2019s part M\u0101ori. Let\u2019s choose the part M\u0101ori and let\u2019s talk to that bit and see what we get across the line.\u201D There might be people in this House that understand the concept of part M\u0101ori. It astounds me, whatever the hell that is or whatever that is\u2014sorry, Mr Speaker. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000763\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002227600399-0a88-4371-a784-b5a7bc7afc37\u0022\u003EThis is exactly what the Waitangi Tribunal recommended to our last Government during the establishment of three waters. The Crown should be working directly with hap\u016B and iwi to create a standard process for addressing M\u0101ori rights. I\u2019m not going to hold my breath and nor are the 100,000 people that visited recently to say you were utterly mucking up and let\u2019s think about this and try to have a decent and Treaty-based conversation, but that\u2019s unlikely to happen.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000764\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002227600399-0a88-4371-a784-b5a7bc7afc37\u0022\u003EFor the most part, local councils are expected to join or establish new water services entities labelled as council-controlled organisations who are funded by grants by the Government. For these organisations to secure funding from Government, they must have no link to council or council decision making. Try and figure that one out. What this means is that these organisations will, in part, be privatised and entirely separate entities from council. Be aware that this partial privatisation is the stepping stone for complete privatisation of water as a whole. The danger in this is that our water is then managed and owned not by ourselves but by companies and organisations who will likely lead the erosion of water as belonging to the people and instead will prioritise corporate interests over our welfare.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000765\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002227600399-0a88-4371-a784-b5a7bc7afc37\u0022\u003EOur position of the party is unequivocally in opposition to this bill. This Government can send their agenda of M\u0101ori erasure down the pipeline out of the three waters they intend to manage. Kia ora, Mr Speaker.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022094b0ff4-e404-451b-b4a9-ad12bd4dee56\u0022 data-id=\u00224d81b9aa1f5f4194ab53061578846a6a\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000766\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022094b0ff4-e404-451b-b4a9-ad12bd4dee56\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00224d81b9aa1f5f4194ab53061578846a6a\u0022\u003ESTUART SMITH (National\u2014Kaik\u014Dura):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Mr Speaker. It\u2019s a pleasure to speak on this bill. There\u2019s been quite a number of speeches tonight; some have actually been on the subject the bill is covering and quite a few have not.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000767\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022094b0ff4-e404-451b-b4a9-ad12bd4dee56\u0022\u003EI think the best feature of this bill is that it ring-fences the funding that is collected from rates for water services and ensures that those funds are spent on water services. The best example of that not happening is only a few metres away, out on the corner of Hill Street and\u00A0Molesworth Street, where there\u2019s yet another leak in the water pipes in, what is it, the only green council in New Zealand, which has the worst water services in New Zealand\u2014very poor management. This is a great bill, and I commend it with pleasure to the House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022b8550e1a-ed25-44a2-b0e2-b0a8d52a7a80\u0022 data-id=\u0022486cf2e83aa44421bbe09ed090690dad\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000768\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b8550e1a-ed25-44a2-b0e2-b0a8d52a7a80\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022486cf2e83aa44421bbe09ed090690dad\u0022\u003ERACHEL BOYACK (Labour\u2014Nelson):\u003C/span\u003E It\u2019s pretty clear that Stuart Smith, the previous speaker, hasn\u2019t talked to the mayors across the top of the South, because they are not happy with the arrangements that this Government has come forward with and I\u2019m going to talk to that.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000769\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b8550e1a-ed25-44a2-b0e2-b0a8d52a7a80\u0022\u003EPeople have been talking about the levies that are going to be paid to Taumata Arowai, which are greater than what would have been paid under Labour\u2019s plan. The primary amount of that money is going to actually go to the Commerce Commission for the regulation that they do of the water regulation system. We heard about Palmerston North having to pay $400,000 a year. In Nelson, it\u2019ll be $200,000 a year, and in Tasman, it\u2019ll be $350,000 a year.\u00A0Nelson Mayor Nick Smith even went on to say that the Government is overreaching with the proposed new levies.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000770\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b8550e1a-ed25-44a2-b0e2-b0a8d52a7a80\u0022\u003EWhat I\u2019ve heard from our local mayors across the top of the South is that it\u2019s yet another cost being put on to the\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000771\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a910e826-1964-4e6b-bdb6-958820a11514\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002226bb4a10833e42fe8a7bb64cab0b401d\u0022\u003EJamie Arbuckle\u003C/span\u003E: That\u2019s not right. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000772\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b8550e1a-ed25-44a2-b0e2-b0a8d52a7a80\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00222fef6cc7468b4d64960dd54b36d66157\u0022\u003ERACHEL BOYACK\u003C/span\u003E: Well, this is what\u2019s being reported in the media, so are you disagreeing with what the media reported?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000773\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b8550e1a-ed25-44a2-b0e2-b0a8d52a7a80\u0022\u003EThe mayors across the top of the South are deeply concerned about two things: one, the cost burden being passed on to them and therefore on to the ratepayers; and, secondly, the structural arrangements. It is an absolute cluster that we\u2019re going to have a water system set up and a structure set up in Nelson where Nelson and Tasman aren\u2019t working together. It\u2019s absolutely bizarre. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000774\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b8550e1a-ed25-44a2-b0e2-b0a8d52a7a80\u0022\u003EWhen you look at the shared services between Tasman and Nelson, the waste-water Bell Island treatment plant is jointly owned by Nelson and Tasman. It takes waste water from Nelson\u2014from Richmond, from Brightwater, from Wakefield, and M\u0101pua\u2014yet Nelson and Tasman aren\u2019t going to be working together on water even though they actually co-own assets together. It\u2019s utterly bonkers. Let alone that Tasman provides water to Nelson for the Whakat\u016B industrial estate, which I\u2019m really pleased the Labour Government put money into for the three waters systems to help protect it so that it doesn\u2019t get millions of dollars of damage during flooding\u2014one of those things we paid for. Tasman provides the water to that estate in Nelson as well as homes in Nelson South, where I live. Yet, somehow, we\u2019re not going to have a shared Nelson/Tasman water service. It\u2019s bizarre. Tasman\u2019s probably going to go with Marlborough and possibly going to go with Buller, so we\u2019ll have the top of the South but no Nelson.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000775\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b8550e1a-ed25-44a2-b0e2-b0a8d52a7a80\u0022\u003ENow, the advice that Nelson has received shows very clearly that by going alone they will end up paying more\u2014and myself as a Nelson ratepayer will end up paying more\u2014than under Labour\u2019s plan. That\u2019s the advice they\u2019ve got. They\u2019ve chosen to go alone instead of actually working together across the top of the South. I know that the Minister actually wants to see councils working together. Every other part of the country, we are seeing councils get into groups together because it brings down the cost to the ratepayer, especially when you have bizarre situations\u2014absolutely bizarre situations\u2014like Tasman providing services to Nelson, but, somehow, we\u2019re not going to work together.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000776\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b8550e1a-ed25-44a2-b0e2-b0a8d52a7a80\u0022\u003EThe Minister was very forthright about how he\u2019d saved everything for Auckland and cost Auckland all this money. He might have saved Auckland money, but money is going to be lumped on to the rest of the country\u2014the people in the provinces who are going to have smaller asset bases, greater amounts of debt, larger areas to cover, fewer people to actually pay for the water services. All of those small councils are going to end up paying significantly more than under Labour\u2019s plan. That\u2019s what all the evidence actually shows and the Minister\u2019s refusing to engage in that conversation.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000777\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b8550e1a-ed25-44a2-b0e2-b0a8d52a7a80\u0022\u003EFunnily enough, so much of what the Government is actually putting in place through all of the bills is comparable to what Labour did, but the missing piece\u2014the missing piece\u2014is the sheer number of councils you actually need to have in the room together to get the economies of scale so that you can make the investment you need. I think the cluster that is happening across the top of the South, where we\u2019re going to end up seeing\u2014who knows whether Buller and Tasman and Marlborough can even get together. If they don\u2019t, we\u2019re going to end up with four small councils all operating on their own and every ratepayer paying a significant amount of money without being able to sort out the nonsense, because they have to work together because they actually have shared ownership of assets.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000778\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b8550e1a-ed25-44a2-b0e2-b0a8d52a7a80\u0022\u003EFor the Government to think that somehow they\u2019ve come up with some magic solution that is better than Labour\u2019s plan, when the people in the top of the South are going to be paying significantly more money, is absolutely bonkers, and I do not commend this terrible bill to the House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022a00bf4f5-c63a-49a0-b0e1-d3b37311377b\u0022 data-id=\u002213fb1b3ce19640e68573beb5b8f9c9de\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000779\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a00bf4f5-c63a-49a0-b0e1-d3b37311377b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002213fb1b3ce19640e68573beb5b8f9c9de\u0022\u003ECATHERINE WEDD (National\u2014Tukituki):\u003C/span\u003E I rise to support the Local Government (Water Services) Bill. Look, it took the last Government six years and $1.2\u00A0billion to come up with an undemocratic, highly controversial, co-governance model. It has taken our Government 12 months to put water back in local ownership, have a democratic process, and come up with a regulatory framework that is going to work. It\u2019s outcomes, it\u2019s solutions, it\u2019s democratic, it\u2019s local ownership. I commend this bill to the House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002227535d92-0798-4e04-be80-9e91b53610e2\u0022 data-id=\u0022c6fa8fe880d546f7a9316ee2cbc1a175\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000780\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002227535d92-0798-4e04-be80-9e91b53610e2\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022c6fa8fe880d546f7a9316ee2cbc1a175\u0022\u003EHon RACHEL BROOKING (Labour\u2014Dunedin):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Mr Speaker. I am having some d\u00E9j\u00E0 vu from earlier times in the House today, where the Government members say, \u201COh, Labour did this review and it was all terrible, but aren\u2019t we great? We\u2019re so good at repealing things, and now we\u2019re going to replace them with something in the Resource Management Act space over and over and over and over again. We\u2019re going to do that and somehow it\u2019s going to work.\u201D Well, this does not fix any of the problems; all it does is cost ratepayers more in the longer term. It is shameful.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000781\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022d217764bd59245fc9e66a67e192b61dd\u0022\u003EHon Member\u003C/span\u003E: It\u2019s your favourite word.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000782\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002227535d92-0798-4e04-be80-9e91b53610e2\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022eb1f7e2e311748b1be87e4a118ed0212\u0022\u003EHon RACHEL BROOKING\u003C/span\u003E: Now, we know\u2014oh, I hear a Government member say that\u2019s my favourite word. It is my favourite word at the moment because what this Government is doing is shameful: going around telling councils, \u201COh, you can\u2019t do pet projects, but we\u2019re going to do every single pet project we want to do on our fast-track legislation.\u201D It is shameful.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000783\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002227535d92-0798-4e04-be80-9e91b53610e2\u0022\u003EOh, the Government members say \u201CWe\u2019re somehow going to magically fix the funding for water pipes and treatment stations.\u201D, and what happens? Nothing. All that this does is we know that there\u2019s a problem with balance sheet separation\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000784\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002261725fea-7d5e-4d1f-8fd3-e5779bb7a14d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022045575961d964b38895ff46d3f7b8dd2\u0022\u003EHon Barbara Edmonds\u003C/span\u003E: We knew that.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000785\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002227535d92-0798-4e04-be80-9e91b53610e2\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022b09cb026588644068bdba7b7c36e623e\u0022\u003EHon RACHEL BROOKING\u003C/span\u003E: We knew that. We\u2019ve known that for a long time. We know that economies of scale can be a good idea, as well.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000786\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002227535d92-0798-4e04-be80-9e91b53610e2\u0022\u003EAll that this Government is doing is saying, \u201COh, councils, you can look after that water infrastructure that you\u2019ve always been looking after and haven\u2019t been properly funded for and is degrading and is not maintained. We\u2019re not going to give you any of the tools, like balance sheet separation. So we know that the ratings agencies will downgrade you. We know that the money will cost you more. We know that all this will do is put more money on ratepayers.\u201D\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000787\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002227535d92-0798-4e04-be80-9e91b53610e2\u0022\u003EThen the Minister says, \u201COh, but we\u2019ve done a deal with Auckland.\u201D As if that solves the problem!\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000788\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002261725fea-7d5e-4d1f-8fd3-e5779bb7a14d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022058ad7c8692b4f5bb698d3682fa1b040\u0022\u003EHon Barbara Edmonds\u003C/span\u003E: What about Whang\u0101rei?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000789\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002227535d92-0798-4e04-be80-9e91b53610e2\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022fe6134afa5ff4537a67c5e3badd64cd8\u0022\u003EHon RACHEL BROOKING\u003C/span\u003E: \u201CWhat about Whang\u0101rei?\u201D, Barbara Edmonds says. What about Northland? These are very good questions, and they are not solved by letting Auckland, of course a very large and significant council with significant assets and very large interceptor pipes going in at the moment, which will hopefully decrease the runoff into the harbour\u2014these do not fix the problems of Northland; Northland with the low ratepayer base, Northland with a lot of problems that we all know about with their pipes and treatment stations, and have done for years and years. The Auckland deal doesn\u2019t fix any of that.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000790\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002227535d92-0798-4e04-be80-9e91b53610e2\u0022\u003EWe know that there\u2019s $185 billion needed over 30 years to upgrade our pipes and treatment stations. What has the Government done? Oh, the Government\u2019s looking at long-term plans, and what is the time frame for a long-term plan? Is it 30 years? No. Is it 20 years? No. It\u2019s 10\u00A0years. So, of course, the figures are different. That\u2019s all that this Government does: changes the target, changes the numbers. It doesn\u2019t fix the fundamental problem; instead maybe the Clutha council will go bankrupt. That is what this Government wants to call \u201Clocalism.\u201D\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000791\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002261725fea-7d5e-4d1f-8fd3-e5779bb7a14d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022c85c054973074a97b1f3eeeed1799e02\u0022\u003EHon Barbara Edmonds\u003C/span\u003E: Shameful.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000792\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002227535d92-0798-4e04-be80-9e91b53610e2\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002226f4795642e048c29ffb8aa7ff7c5a53\u0022\u003EHon RACHEL BROOKING\u003C/span\u003E: Shameful. Now, we\u2019ve also heard in a lot of speeches from Government members that somehow\u2014somehow\u2014this legislation is going to solve things because it\u2019s going to ring-fence money for pipes and that that is somehow going to fix councils\u2019 financial woes. Councils already spend about 90 percent of their money on pipes and treatment stations and roads. I don\u2019t think that even includes waste. These are not frivolous \u201Cnice-to-haves\u201D; this is the basic infrastructure. They are already spending all their money on that. There is no magical pipe-tree provided by this piece of legislation. It doesn\u2019t help anything. It doesn\u2019t help Northland.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000793\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e77494a0-1be1-432f-b492-fd160f4c119d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00227c660fff699549c992f05742b197794f\u0022\u003EHon Peeni Henare\u003C/span\u003E: It does nothing.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000794\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002227535d92-0798-4e04-be80-9e91b53610e2\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022dd03cfea7f6d4b67834a7b8de89fbd0b\u0022\u003EHon RACHEL BROOKING\u003C/span\u003E: \u201CIt does nothing.\u201D, as all of my colleagues are saying. This bill doesn\u2019t fix the problem and it will cost ratepayers more.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002294b52412-f97b-4bbd-8009-5dc49520f7f4\u0022 data-id=\u002266aced18511c427993657c111ecd8aa1\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000795\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002294b52412-f97b-4bbd-8009-5dc49520f7f4\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002266aced18511c427993657c111ecd8aa1\u0022\u003ERYAN HAMILTON (National\u2014Hamilton East):\u003C/span\u003E It\u2019s great to be one of the last speakers in the first reading of the third one of these bills\u2014the trilogy, if you will\u2014and, frankly, I think it\u2019s just time for me to get out of the way and let it flow. I commend the Local Government (Water Services) Bill to the House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca id=\u002273defdd2bb5e47cfa61a35b22cec6786\u0022 name=\u0022division\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EA party vote was called for on the question, That the Local Government (Water Services) Bill be now read a first time.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EAyes 68\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand National 49; ACT New Zealand 11; New Zealand First 8.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENoes 55\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand Labour 34; Green Party of Aotearoa New Zealand 15; Te P\u0101ti M\u0101ori 6.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EMotion agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000796\u0022\u003EBill read a first time.\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002202e74c40-9529-4e15-adc2-c032eadc2205\u0022 data-id=\u002297abc47d5af14b799f18311a054a1361\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000797\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002202e74c40-9529-4e15-adc2-c032eadc2205\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002297abc47d5af14b799f18311a054a1361\u0022\u003EASSISTANT SPEAKER (Greg O\u2019Connor)\u003C/span\u003E: The question is, That the Local Government (Water Services) Bill be considered by the Finance and Expenditure Committee.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000798\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002202e74c40-9529-4e15-adc2-c032eadc2205\u0022\u003EMotion agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000799\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002202e74c40-9529-4e15-adc2-c032eadc2205\u0022\u003EBill referred to the Finance and Expenditure Committee.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n    \u003C/div\u003E\n    \u003Cdiv class=\u0022HpsHansard\u0022\u003E\n      \u003Cp\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsProceedingHeading\u0022\u003EBills\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000800\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u00229a986eced1cd47118370a812674ffc8c\u0022\u003EOffshore Renewable Energy Bill\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000801\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u0022b1e3f50c30a5442795c6e9948f35ed99\u0022\u003EFirst Reading\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002255d0b7a4-a2c9-4c38-9b77-475311a48a89\u0022 data-id=\u00226350564211d640559c778a545fa3bfb0\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000802\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002255d0b7a4-a2c9-4c38-9b77-475311a48a89\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00226350564211d640559c778a545fa3bfb0\u0022\u003EHon SIMEON BROWN (Minister for Energy):\u003C/span\u003E I present a legislative statement on the Offshore Renewable Energy Bill.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000803\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002202e74c40-9529-4e15-adc2-c032eadc2205\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002230abcf093727485b8619b5dd90ed6c03\u0022\u003EASSISTANT SPEAKER (Greg O\u2019Connor)\u003C/span\u003E: That legislative statement is published under the authority of the House and can be found on the Parliament website.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000804\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002255d0b7a4-a2c9-4c38-9b77-475311a48a89\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022f8752f74f66d411b838d223c6ca741ec\u0022\u003EHon SIMEON BROWN\u003C/span\u003E: I move, That the Offshore Renewable Energy Bill be now\u00A0read a first time. I nominate the Transport and Infrastructure Committee to consider the bill.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000805\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002255d0b7a4-a2c9-4c38-9b77-475311a48a89\u0022\u003EThis bill delivers on a commitment to put a regulatory regime in place for offshore renewable energy as part of the Government\u2019s Electrify NZ plan. Offshore wind is the most developed offshore renewable energy technology, and New Zealand has world-class offshore wind resources, with some of the highest capacity factors in the world. New Zealand currently does not have a regulatory regime for offshore renewable energy, and this bill delivers that regulatory regime so that we can unlock the potential that offshore renewable energy has for New Zealand.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000806\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002255d0b7a4-a2c9-4c38-9b77-475311a48a89\u0022\u003EThis bill establishes new permitting regimes for all forms of offshore renewable energy, including wind, wave, and tidal. The permitting regime aims to provide greater certainty to potential developers to invest in offshore renewable energy developments and allows the selection of developments that best meet New Zealand\u2019s interests. The bill also provides for the management of risks to the Crown and the public. Establishing a regime is an important step that will give investors the confidence to construct generation assets to help power New Zealand\u2019s increasing electrified economy. This bill will help us do that.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000807\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002255d0b7a4-a2c9-4c38-9b77-475311a48a89\u0022\u003EThis bill introduces two dedicated offshore renewable energy permits\u2014first, feasibility permits, which will give developers greater certainty to undertake feasibility studies in specified areas. It will give the holder the right to apply for relevant resource and marine consents in that area and the exclusive ability to apply for a commercial permit to build and operate offshore renewable energy infrastructure in that area. Secondly, it allows for commercial permits. A commercial permit must be obtained before construction begins and provides assurance that the project is ready to progress to construction. It will complement the environmental consents and other approvals required to build and operate offshore renewable energy infrastructure.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000808\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002255d0b7a4-a2c9-4c38-9b77-475311a48a89\u0022\u003EThe bill limits the ability for developers to landbank certain areas\u2014not that it\u2019s necessarily land\u2014or impede other developments. Permits will have \u201Cuse it or lose it\u201D provisions, meaning that if a project fails to start or progress, the area can be made available to other developers. Feasibility permit applications will be assessed on a comparative basis and awarded to the projects that are most likely to deliver the most benefits for New Zealanders. Applicants will need to meet minimum eligibility thresholds and establish that they have the technical and financial capability to install, operate, maintain, and decommission the proposed infrastructure.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000809\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002255d0b7a4-a2c9-4c38-9b77-475311a48a89\u0022\u003EThe Minister for Energy will consider feasibility permit applications and must have regard to any significant risks to national security or public order posed by the applicants, the impact on Treaty settlements, the applicant\u2019s approach to managing existing rights and interests in the area, and the applicant\u2019s compliance record in New Zealand and internationally. Feasibility permit holders will be able to apply for commercial permits whenever they are ready to do so. The commercial permit process will provide assurance that the project is ready to progress to construction. The Minister for Energy will consider commercial permit applications and must have regard to readiness to carry out the proposed development, compliance with requirements in the legislation and conditions of the applicant\u2019s feasibility permit, and the applicant\u2019s ability to put in place an acceptable financial security arrangement.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000810\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002255d0b7a4-a2c9-4c38-9b77-475311a48a89\u0022\u003EIt is important that people can have their say on potential developments, and there will be an opportunity to do this before the Minister for Energy decides to grant feasibility permits. Feasibility permit applications will be publicly notified, and any person who wishes to make a submission will have a reasonable opportunity to do so. Applicants for feasibility and commercial permits will be required to consult with relevant iwi and hap\u016B ahead of submitting their applications. The Minister for Energy must also consult those iwi and hap\u016B before granting any permit. Provisions in the bill relating to upholding Treaty settlements and associated rights and interests will align with those in the fast-track approvals legislation which was passed earlier today.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000811\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002255d0b7a4-a2c9-4c38-9b77-475311a48a89\u0022\u003EWe want to ensure that offshore renewable energy infrastructure does not become a significant financial risk to the Crown. The bill requires all permit holders and owners of related transmission infrastructure to decommission their offshore renewable energy infrastructure at the end of its life. The bill also requires financial security arrangements to be put in place and maintained to cover the cost of the Crown in the event that permit holders or infrastructure owners fail to meet their obligations to decommission. This is consistent with standard practice internationally.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000812\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002255d0b7a4-a2c9-4c38-9b77-475311a48a89\u0022\u003EOther protections in the bill include the ability to have safety zones to protect the infrastructure and people from intentional or accidental harm.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000813\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002255d0b7a4-a2c9-4c38-9b77-475311a48a89\u0022\u003EThe bill enables the administration, monitoring, and enforcement of the regime, and it is intended that the Ministry of Business, Innovation and Employment undertake this role.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000814\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002255d0b7a4-a2c9-4c38-9b77-475311a48a89\u0022\u003EThe bill also includes a range of offences and penalties for breaches of the regime, ranging from $3,000 to $10 million fines through to permit revocation or imprisonment for a term not exceeding two years. Significant fines and penalties were considered necessary in certain circumstances to provide an effective deterrent, given the financial capability of likely permit holders.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000815\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002255d0b7a4-a2c9-4c38-9b77-475311a48a89\u0022\u003EThe bill includes regulation-making powers to set out procedural and implementation matters, such as additional matters that the Minister must have regard to when determining whether to grant a permit, and the provision of information. The powers include the ability to set fees and levies to recover the costs of the regulator, and I intend to progress feasibility and permit and cost recovery regulations at the same time as the bill progresses through the\u00A0House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000816\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002255d0b7a4-a2c9-4c38-9b77-475311a48a89\u0022\u003EThe policy proposals in this bill have been developed with input from industry and stakeholders, with two rounds of public consultation. Ultimately, no decisions by Cabinet had been made prior to this Government coming to power, and so this Government has had to make those decisions, draft the legislation, and now bring this legislation to the House. I\u2019m pleased that we\u2019ve been able to do that in our first year in Government\u2014to bring this legislation to the House so we can enable an offshore renewable energy regime here in New Zealand to unlock the significant potential that exists in our oceans surrounding our country, and, critically importantly, unlock that electricity which will help power our country and our economy out into the future; critically important to meeting our net zero 2050 target.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000817\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002255d0b7a4-a2c9-4c38-9b77-475311a48a89\u0022\u003EThe proposed regime borrows the best from more mature regimes, such as in the United Kingdom, the Netherlands, Denmark, and Australia, and is adapted to suit here in New Zealand. This Government is committed to enabling offshore renewable energy. It is intended for the offshore renewable energy regime to be in place by mid-2025, and the first feasibility permit application round to be opened in late 2025. I commend this bill to the House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002202e74c40-9529-4e15-adc2-c032eadc2205\u0022 data-id=\u00229b605cbe3f644a16b0e94f073960afdd\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000818\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002202e74c40-9529-4e15-adc2-c032eadc2205\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00229b605cbe3f644a16b0e94f073960afdd\u0022\u003EASSISTANT SPEAKER (Greg O\u2019Connor)\u003C/span\u003E: The question is that the motion be agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002237a99b65-4919-4800-830d-3dd7c920d5cd\u0022 data-id=\u0022572d827ecff840f88893b4c402b8aa80\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000819\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002237a99b65-4919-4800-830d-3dd7c920d5cd\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022572d827ecff840f88893b4c402b8aa80\u0022\u003EHon Dr MEGAN WOODS (Labour\u2014Wigram):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Mr Speaker. I\u2019m very pleased to take a call on the Offshore Renewable Energy Bill, and very pleased to see it come to the House. Labour will be supporting this bill. This is work that I think continues very much the work that was begun by our Government\u2014the two consultation rounds that the Minister referred to, of course, were consultation rounds that were initiated by our Government. It is pleasing to see that this work has appeared this year. The intention, of course, was to have a regulatory regime up and running this year, but it is pleasing to say that it has had some progress.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000820\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002237a99b65-4919-4800-830d-3dd7c920d5cd\u0022\u003EOne of the things that I will put on the table that Labour wants to see is some increased momentum around this work. We have already seen one significant international investor leave New Zealand\u2014partly because of lack of momentum, also because of decisions with the fast-track bill around competing interests. I\u2019m putting on the table that, while Labour supports the bill, we do think there is far more urgency that the Government could bring to this work. New Zealand undoubtedly has some of the best offshore wind resources in the world. I know, meeting with the Global Wind Energy Council, that they described the resources in New Zealand as some of the best that they have seen.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000821\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002237a99b65-4919-4800-830d-3dd7c920d5cd\u0022\u003EWhen we came to think about how it is that we would put together a consenting regime, we looked around the world for best examples. We looked to places like Scotland, who had put together a sophisticated regime that brought community in, and very much about how that engagement with community worked very well. One of the other things that we looked to was regimes where it had enabled the development\u2014not just the seabed banking of permits to block our competitors, as we\u2019ve seen in other jurisdictions such as Japan; how it is that we could facilitate not only the concept but the building of it.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000822\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002237a99b65-4919-4800-830d-3dd7c920d5cd\u0022\u003EFor us, there were several key points we looked at. What we will be looking at through the select committee stage of this legislation: one is around the pace\u2014what can we do to pick up the pace? We\u2019ve already lost momentum with this Government not progressing the work on the original time line. What can we do to pick that up? I\u2019m pleased to see that there is an attempt to have alignment with Australia. The reality is much of the international capital that will be attracted is looking for Australasian investment opportunities, so we will be looking to see how that alignment looks, not only with Australia but without, within the Asia-Pacific region.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000823\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002237a99b65-4919-4800-830d-3dd7c920d5cd\u0022\u003EOne of the critical components is \u201Cuse it or lose it\u201D clauses, and are these strong enough in not having loopholes? What we have seen in other jurisdictions such as Japan is someone will apply for permits without the intention of ever building offshore wind but in an attempt to block out competitors\u2014something we have to ensure our regime doesn\u2019t have. We need to see a benefit to New Zealand.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000824\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002237a99b65-4919-4800-830d-3dd7c920d5cd\u0022\u003EOne of the fundamental issues that has always sat at the core of this\u2014and what we cannot borrow from international regimes\u2014is getting our Treaty partnerships right. How is it that we\u2019re going to engage with mana whenua? What is the role for mana whenua? What are the opportunities in terms of the 21st century energy system that is different from a 20th century energy system\u2014oil and gas exploration, in particular\u2014that has seen an exploitative model where mana whenua have been a tick-box exercise, rather than commercial players sitting at the table and actually there being good commercial opportunities.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000825\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002237a99b65-4919-4800-830d-3dd7c920d5cd\u0022\u003EAt select committee, Labour will be ensuring that we have enduring provisions within this bill to make sure that we have this right, because what international capital coming to New Zealand realises is that\u2014I don\u2019t think this Government does\u2014unless you get this right, we will tie up offshore wind in the courts for years. This is an absolutely critical component. Yes, this is an absolutely critical component of us making sure that we can get it right. Other things we\u2019ll be looking at in select committee are the royalties regime; also price stabilisation, which we\u2019re seeing in other parts of the world; competing uses\u2014we\u2019ve already seen BlueFloat leave New Zealand shores because of decisions this Government has made. What are we doing in terms of planning to make sure that we\u2019re not crowding out renewable energy?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000826\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002237a99b65-4919-4800-830d-3dd7c920d5cd\u0022\u003EWhile we\u2019re supporting this and are pleased to support this bill to select committee, there are many areas\u2014it is a reasonably complex piece of legislation\u2014where we\u2019ll be seeking to work with the Government to make sure we have the best regime for New Zealand. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022a6489ff5-e18c-4c19-958d-3cec5c52c0cc\u0022 data-id=\u00228ef87bf4a6174fc9b7411276b7103cc1\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000827\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a6489ff5-e18c-4c19-958d-3cec5c52c0cc\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00228ef87bf4a6174fc9b7411276b7103cc1\u0022\u003ESCOTT WILLIS (Green):\u003C/span\u003E BlueFloat Energy may have sailed from our shores\u2014and we\u2019re still waiting for the National Policy Statement for Renewable Electricity Generation, which was due in June this year\u2014but finally, at last, here comes the Offshore Renewable Energy Bill.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000828\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a6489ff5-e18c-4c19-958d-3cec5c52c0cc\u0022\u003EWe do need legislation to govern the construction, operation, and decommissioning of offshore renewable energy developments, so we will support this bill to select committee because we want a rich and thoughtful examination of this bill. The irony\u2014the irony\u2014however, is that National\u2019s Electrify NZ plan is now so far off track, in no small measure due to reneging on the promise to increase demand by supplying 9,000 electric vehicle (EV) charging points, its failure to deliver the National Policy Statement for Renewable Electricity Generation in June, and its one-eyed fixation on fast-tracking coalmines, goldmines, and seabed mining.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000829\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a6489ff5-e18c-4c19-958d-3cec5c52c0cc\u0022\u003ESeabed mining is, of course, incompatible with offshore wind development, and that\u2019s why BlueFloat sailed away. Seabed mining will significantly disrupt the seafloor up to a depth of 11 metres. BlueFloat said offshore wind turbines and electrical cables could not be constructed in the same location as an active seabed mining operation, resulting in the unavailability of that zone for offshore wind generation for the duration of mining activities, and we\u2019ve seen a request to make those mining activities a 35-year existence. Copenhagen Infrastructure Partners, in partnership with the New Zealand Superannuation Fund, are still hanging on, but we don\u2019t know for how long. That\u2019s an early taste of the disaster that is the fast-track legislation, and it\u2019s no wonder that there are protests. Here in the House, it\u2019s no wonder that the multinationals are leaving.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000830\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a6489ff5-e18c-4c19-958d-3cec5c52c0cc\u0022\u003EMeanwhile, we in the Greens do have many questions about offshore wind and we want to have that conversation. Our priority is onshore wind and solar and geothermal simply because it is faster, cheaper, less resource intensive, and with fewer environmental impacts than offshore wind. It can also be located close to where there is demand and provides for ease of maintenance.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000831\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a6489ff5-e18c-4c19-958d-3cec5c52c0cc\u0022\u003EWhat we like in this bill, however, are the provisions around decommissioning, particularly the financial security obligations to ensure that the decommissioning of offshore renewable energy infrastructure occurs at the expense of the permit holder and owners of related transmission infrastructure.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000832\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a6489ff5-e18c-4c19-958d-3cec5c52c0cc\u0022\u003EThere are other positives such as safety zones. However, we do want to know how necessary this is and how it will be managed, as other offshore wind developments support local businesses, like boat operators and local guides, providing an alternative source of income and a diversified tourism offering. The two-stage permitting regime\u2014feasibility first, followed by, if appropriate, commercial permits\u2014is also a positive.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000833\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a6489ff5-e18c-4c19-958d-3cec5c52c0cc\u0022\u003EWhat needs greater clarity, however, is how Te Tiriti obligations will be met and what the process is to co-develop with M\u0101ori the national guidance and legislation. It appears that this legislation hasn\u2019t gone through this process and only intends to consult with M\u0101ori groups before granting any permit, and consultation is very different to co-development. Meanwhile, the regulatory impact statement notes that tangata whenua, iwi, and h\u0101pu have significant rights and interests in the marine area, including recognised customary interests, and cultural and economic interests, etc., and we want to see these interests upheld.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000834\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a6489ff5-e18c-4c19-958d-3cec5c52c0cc\u0022\u003EWe\u2019re also concerned that the existing Resource Management Act and Exclusive Economic Zone and Continental Shelf (Environmental Effects) Act consenting environmental assessment regimes are not robust or effective enough at protecting marine ecosystems or mammals. What about other technologies such as tidal generation? There are a number of questions.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000835\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a6489ff5-e18c-4c19-958d-3cec5c52c0cc\u0022\u003EThere\u2019s another big, big question that we want to see at select committee about port infrastructure to host offshore wind developments, and connecting offshore wind and energy to onshore connection points\u2014the question of \u201CWho pays?\u201D Will the taxpayer be expected to foot the bill or will they do it? In parallel, will we have a reinvention of the electricity market to provide longer-term hedge contracts?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000836\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a6489ff5-e18c-4c19-958d-3cec5c52c0cc\u0022\u003EWe will support this bill to select committee because we want a rich and thoughtful examination. Thank you.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00228f20b644-642a-4c85-ade9-d5af32dc690b\u0022 data-id=\u0022edb33feaf9514d17abff1d18b05598d1\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000837\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00228f20b644-642a-4c85-ade9-d5af32dc690b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022edb33feaf9514d17abff1d18b05598d1\u0022\u003ELAURA McCLURE (ACT):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Mr Speaker. The ACT Party supports this bill. We love innovation. The Offshore Renewable Energy Bill has got the right framework in place, including the construction, operation, and decommissioning. I commend this bill to the House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022a910e826-1964-4e6b-bdb6-958820a11514\u0022 data-id=\u00223b002212210c4febaf6307a54c2cfa75\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000838\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a910e826-1964-4e6b-bdb6-958820a11514\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00223b002212210c4febaf6307a54c2cfa75\u0022\u003EJAMIE ARBUCKLE (NZ First):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Mr Speaker. I rise on behalf of New Zealand First to support the Offshore Renewable Energy Bill. I had the opportunity, earlier in the year, to travel to Taranaki and have a look at the opportunity that offshore wind has the potential for in the New Zealand energy sector, and it is really exciting to see what could actually be done. This bill sets up the legislative way it can be governed. It\u2019s around the construction of the renewable wind, especially the turbines.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000839\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a910e826-1964-4e6b-bdb6-958820a11514\u0022\u003EWhen you look at how large some of those turbines are, and the effort that it would actually take to even put one of those into the water\u2014these are a scale that is huge. Just to learn about that\u2014the actual operation of the turbines and the decommissioning side of it as well\u2014is something that\u2019s really important and is taken care of in this bill. It\u2019s also about the investment and the potential developers out there\u2014actually giving them some certainty, and the investment that\u2019s required.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000840\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a910e826-1964-4e6b-bdb6-958820a11514\u0022\u003EThis bill gives that framework to put that in place. It is also about doubling renewable energy by 2050\u2014and that\u2019s the goal of this Government\u2014and this goes as another one of those options. It\u2019s only one part of that puzzle, the renewable energy sector, and especially the offshore wind. On that, I commend this bill to the House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00227a76db18-baa4-41c1-b366-89e2c753a1e7\u0022 data-id=\u00223535eef388564f4b9f987bf614c90393\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000841\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227a76db18-baa4-41c1-b366-89e2c753a1e7\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00223535eef388564f4b9f987bf614c90393\u0022\u003EDEBBIE NGAREWA-PACKER (Co-Leader\u2014Te P\u0101ti M\u0101ori):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you. In standing to speak to this bill, I guess it\u2019s one of those situations where we\u2019ve got more questions than answers and look forward to what it is that comes out of the select committee.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000842\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227a76db18-baa4-41c1-b366-89e2c753a1e7\u0022\u003EThe first question that we have is: what is the problem this particular bill is solving or resolving, and is it going to help address the energy security issue that we have in Aotearoa? Is it going to address significantly the energy and equity issue that we have in Aotearoa? Is there a benefit for Aotearoa, for our businesses, for our partnerships, and Te Tiriti claims and states? Or is it going to be, once again, offshore companies that are going to be helping to craft this bill and it\u2019s going to be designed to suit them more than anyone else, energy will be exported, the prices exported and controlled offshore? I guess the question as we were caucusing this was: what is it changing?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000843\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227a76db18-baa4-41c1-b366-89e2c753a1e7\u0022\u003EThe other part of it is: is it addressing the climate issues? Will it lower emissions? Is it going to put us forward truly, in using the full sense of the word \u201Crenewable\u201D, noting that turbines last approximately 15 to 17 years offshore, and that when they are devolved then it becomes, effectively, an urup\u0101 of turbines in our ocean\u2014and respecting that we did see the decommissioning clause. We live in Taranaki with the decommissioning and have, effectively, seen its failings and as taxpayers have had to pay millions of dollars for the clean-up of those failings.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000844\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227a76db18-baa4-41c1-b366-89e2c753a1e7\u0022\u003EIs this bill also going to look at business? I think the bill has made it really clear that it is going to be investor-led; investor-focused. That being the case, then, how do we make sure that those investors are our own? Unlike what we saw in the nationalisation of oil and minerals, the Crown Minerals Act\u2014that it\u2019s been really difficult for M\u0101ori, even for New Zealand companies, to be able to become part of the oil and mineral sector. I say that conservatively, because if we are going to go down this path, we first and foremost must look and think about our own nationhood.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000845\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227a76db18-baa4-41c1-b366-89e2c753a1e7\u0022\u003EOur own nationhood has a history, pre-nationalisation, and the recognition of tangata whenua\u2019s rights and the recognition as Wai claims 796 and 852 spoke about. If we go back to looking at some of the things that\u2014I think Margaret Wilson made a statement in 2000 that \u201CThe Government\u2019s reaffirmed policy that Crown minerals including petroleum are owned and managed in national interests will not be included in a lot of the Taranaki settlement claims.\u201D She did make a commitment, though, that the Government will explore ways to address the Crown\u2019s contemporary obligations to M\u0101ori under the Treaty with regard to natural resources.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000846\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227a76db18-baa4-41c1-b366-89e2c753a1e7\u0022\u003ENow, this is an opportunity for the nationhood and the wellbeing of Aotearoa to be discussed and realised with those Taranaki iwi that had to forgo the historical grievances in the Crown minerals space, and how that would indeed be put into effect in a way that is best for all of Aotearoa. I would welcome hearing some of this again, as I said, in the select committee stage. Are we looking to transition and do something radically different in the energy space for the betterment of all in New Zealand? Or are we going to open up for the corporate entities that have come in in the name of renewable energy, who will then take everything offshore and make it just as expensive for our businesses, for our communities, and our families to be able to live in Aotearoa?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000847\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227a76db18-baa4-41c1-b366-89e2c753a1e7\u0022\u003EThese are some of the questions that, with all honesty, we haven\u2019t landed with the answers in this bill because, unfortunately, we do have a cynical view of some of the ways that this Government has taken energy and big corporate bias. We\u2019ve seen the fast track today, third reading; we\u2019re seeing the Resource Management Act amendment first reading; we\u2019re seeing this particular bill\u2019s first reading, and nowhere are we seeing a different approach where, in fact, there is an opening up of what could be the protection of M\u0101ori, iwi, hap\u016B investments with this Government and for the protection of all citizens of Aotearoa to be able to afford to have good, sustainable energy options.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000848\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227a76db18-baa4-41c1-b366-89e2c753a1e7\u0022\u003EThose are some of the questions that we have that we look forward to in the next phase of this bill. Kia ora r\u0101.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002244967dc4-6cc7-4567-b8ef-cc3a9b354544\u0022 data-id=\u00221917f05700464715b945e63f5b841c4f\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000849\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002244967dc4-6cc7-4567-b8ef-cc3a9b354544\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00221917f05700464715b945e63f5b841c4f\u0022\u003EGRANT McCALLUM (National\u2014Northland):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Mr Speaker. I rise to support, and speak on, this very important bill. As part of our policy of electrifying New Zealand, we believe in getting on with doing things, which is what we\u2019re going to do. I commend this bill to the House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00221cd33f16-add4-4363-a2d4-f457841a5c4c\u0022 data-id=\u00229243a22c8a9340d49abb07e78506a7f4\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000850\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221cd33f16-add4-4363-a2d4-f457841a5c4c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00229243a22c8a9340d49abb07e78506a7f4\u0022\u003EGLEN BENNETT (Labour):\u003C/span\u003E It\u2019s good to be here this evening and contributing to this piece of legislation, which is well overdue. I want to reflect in terms of the process in recent years, and being the MP for New Plymouth at the time\u2014I really want to honour and thank the Hon Dr Megan Woods for her hard work in this space. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000851\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221cd33f16-add4-4363-a2d4-f457841a5c4c\u0022\u003EThe Minister for Energy, the Hon Simeon Brown, in his initial statement did comment in terms of the engagement of communities and the engagement of iwi\u2014and I believe that in terms of that process, it was done pre - last election and the work that we did. I really want to note that there was one particular day\u2014I want to thank the Hon Dr Megan Woods, who committed to a day sitting down with Ng\u0101 Iwi o Taranaki, the eight iwi representatives of our region, to sit and listen and engage around the energy space in Taranaki.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000852\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221cd33f16-add4-4363-a2d4-f457841a5c4c\u0022\u003EWhat was really telling from that hui was the fact that I heard loud and clear that, for 150 years, M\u0101ori had never been included or consulted on when it came to the resources that were being extracted from the whenua of Taranaki. It wasn\u2019t a gracious \u201CThank you so much, Minister, for listening to us.\u201D, but it was an acknowledgment of how we need to learn and we need to listen. I\u2019m glad but also cautious that this piece of legislation is looking in terms of ways that it actually does listen, it does engage with iwi, with hap\u016B, but also with communities.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000853\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221cd33f16-add4-4363-a2d4-f457841a5c4c\u0022\u003EAs we take this into select committee, I hope and ask of the members of the committee that they\u2019ll really prosecute and dig deep into the community engagement, dig deep into what it means to actually truly engage and consult with local iwi, whether it\u2019s in Taranaki or wherever it may be. We look at this legislation and it\u2019s around offshore renewable energy. It\u2019s not the \u201COffshore Wind Energy Bill\u201D; it\u2019s the Offshore Renewable Energy Bill, because we know there\u2019s more than just wind blowing out there and what is possible when it comes to wave technology, even solar panels and other forms. I think it is a good day for us to be moving, but I hoped and wished that we could have been here a little bit earlier.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000854\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221cd33f16-add4-4363-a2d4-f457841a5c4c\u0022\u003ENow, the regulatory framework for offshore renewable energy has been in the pipeline and it has been meandering and moving its way through, and it felt like it sort of stalled a little bit about a year ago. I\u2019m looking through the legislation that dropped this week and seeing that, yeah, work has been done and work needs to continue. The select committee process is the appropriate place. It\u2019s the workhorse of Parliament where it actually engages with experts, engages with community, engages with iwi, engages in all those spaces. I look forward to participating, hopefully, but also seeing the progress that the select committee has on this.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000855\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221cd33f16-add4-4363-a2d4-f457841a5c4c\u0022\u003EI do find it interesting that on the same day we passed the Fast-track Approvals Bill, which allows the option and the potential beginning of excavating and seabed mining off the South Taranaki coast\u2014on the very same day it passes\u2014we have this piece of legislation around the regulations for offshore renewable energy. I find it so fascinating, as has been said by previous speakers, the fact that BlueFloat has up and left the country because of the uncertainty not only of the regulatory regime; also the fact that the sweet spot for offshore wind, in particular, is in the same spot, and we have heard time and time again in this House that they are not compatible together; and the fact that we\u2019re allowing, on the one hand, a private business in a public piece of legislation to have the option of seabed mining and then, on the other hand, we\u2019re saying, \u201CHey, look, let\u2019s bring in this wonderful offshore energy regime that\u2019s going to change the world but they can\u2019t coexist together.\u201D The challenge for us is how we get this right to make sure that we can actually have options.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000856\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221cd33f16-add4-4363-a2d4-f457841a5c4c\u0022\u003EAs Scott Willis said earlier, this is about creating options for the future, that we have lots of consented onshore renewable energy projects. This is giving options with the potential of offshore, and this needs a robust and a very thorough select committee process.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022d64de4c1-ef68-477e-9c50-db5cbdf99404\u0022 data-id=\u0022b73a1f2deb4340d6a643d2e7b0d0d6e5\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000857\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022d64de4c1-ef68-477e-9c50-db5cbdf99404\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022b73a1f2deb4340d6a643d2e7b0d0d6e5\u0022\u003ETOM RUTHERFORD (National\u2014Bay of Plenty):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you very much, Mr Speaker. It gives me great pleasure to stand in support of the Offshore Renewable Energy Bill, which establishes a legislative regime to govern the construction, operation, and decommissioning of offshore renewable energy.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000858\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022d64de4c1-ef68-477e-9c50-db5cbdf99404\u0022\u003EAs a member of the Transport and Infrastructure Committee, I\u2019m looking forward to consultation and public submissions and ensuring that this is a practical piece of legislation for our country, moving forward. I commend this bill to the House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022b464a62e-d900-452a-b842-e3cf4ccc6149\u0022 data-id=\u00228d096e9c44fc4950aa2cd109a4cfde75\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000859\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b464a62e-d900-452a-b842-e3cf4ccc6149\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00228d096e9c44fc4950aa2cd109a4cfde75\u0022\u003EARENA WILLIAMS (Labour\u2014Manurewa):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Mr Speaker. It\u2019s a pleasure to take a short call on this bill, and I want to first acknowledge the Government\u2019s work in bringing the Offshore Renewable Energy Bill to the House. It\u2019s something to celebrate to be introducing a piece of legislation in which the intent is to establish a regulatory framework for offshore wind energy in New Zealand. That\u2019s a great thing because by 2030, this country has signed-up commitments which require us to have 100\u00A0percent renewables in our energy grid. That\u2019s achievable for New Zealand. That is possible. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000860\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b464a62e-d900-452a-b842-e3cf4ccc6149\u0022\u003EWe are a country rich in natural resources, especially our water. Our dams were built so many decades ago that now the cost of running them is negligible, and that energy should be cheap. It is the greenest in the world, and it\u2019s something New Zealanders should be proud of. Our offshore wind energy also provides us with so many significant opportunities not for only economic growth but for cheaper energy prices for consumers. That\u2019s something we can all agree on in this House, and this piece of legislation is a step towards that. It\u2019s something that we should be able to get around the table in the select committee room and really get into the detail about how to make this work for New Zealanders, because the Government has said that it\u2019s still committed to increasing the supply of affordable clean energy and to facilitating New Zealand\u2019s transition to net zero carbon emissions by 2050. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000861\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b464a62e-d900-452a-b842-e3cf4ccc6149\u0022\u003EWhat we need to make sure of is that pieces of legislation like this don\u2019t gloss over the fact that the Government is cutting many of the things which will help it to achieve those commitments. We need to hold it to these commitments in this piece of legislation, but things like lifting the oil and gas exploration ban fly in the face of that. Delaying agricultural emissions pricing for five years flies in the face of that. Promoting mining projects that have\u00A0already been considered and rejected flies in the face of that. Missing its own electric vehicle targets\u2014which it promised voters at the election\u2014flies in the face of that. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000862\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b464a62e-d900-452a-b842-e3cf4ccc6149\u0022\u003EWe need offshore wind to step into the gap that this Government has created with its policy choices, and New Zealand, as we know, is a signatory to the Paris Agreement. We have signed up to it not only for our domestic obligations under the Climate Change Response Act but also for our global obligations that our partners rely on us for and that our trade relationships rely on us for. The EU fair-trade agreement is a world-leading trade response. It\u2019s great for our agricultural sector. We need our trade partners in the EU to believe that New Zealand is still committed to our clean, green reputation, and here, on this side of the House, we are. I want to encourage Government members to find a way to expedite the process for this. This should be something that we can all agree needs to happen quickly and needs to happen well. Those two things can be done at once.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000863\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b464a62e-d900-452a-b842-e3cf4ccc6149\u0022\u003EThis legislation is expected to be passed in mid-2025, with the first permits being considered at the end of next year. We\u2019re going to make sure that there\u2019s no impediment to getting these projects built. Projects that would get in the way of an offshore wind energy project\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000864\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221cd33f16-add4-4363-a2d4-f457841a5c4c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a118bc6d7f784707923e41b3ff635913\u0022\u003EGlen Bennett\u003C/span\u003E: Tell us, Arena. What is it? \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000865\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b464a62e-d900-452a-b842-e3cf4ccc6149\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022572ffc8e838648da8bbeda0ed5401273\u0022\u003EARENA WILLIAMS\u003C/span\u003E: \u2014as Glen Bennett has mentioned, are deep-sea mining projects, which are directly in competition with the kind of space that these projects will need. It\u2019s incumbent on all of us to make sure that these projects\u2014these wind projects, which we all agree are needed\u2014are given priority within the regulatory framework. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000866\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b464a62e-d900-452a-b842-e3cf4ccc6149\u0022\u003EI\u2019ll tell you how that\u2019s done overseas. In Ireland, they are very committed to their offshore wind energy projects. In fact, they have legislation like this alongside ambitious capacity targets for how much wind should be generating in their energy grid. I think it\u2019s 5 megawatts that was set for their 2030 goal. That would mean a huge investment not only in Government but also through private development. If our Government truly believed in getting these projects off the ground, it needs to set targets in an energy plan, but where\u2019s the energy plan? It is not here. We do not have it, because the Government has not owned up to the fact that it needs a plan to transition to net zero. We need that plan and to be able to integrate offshore wind into it. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000867\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b464a62e-d900-452a-b842-e3cf4ccc6149\u0022\u003EIreland also has a comprehensive policy framework and a national strategy for offshore wind. That needs to sit alongside this legislation\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000868\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022f2dbd35891dc4c78b9639f60b5a09cee\u0022\u003EHon Member\u003C/span\u003E: Has Hipkins got a target on his back? What happened to working together? \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000869\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b464a62e-d900-452a-b842-e3cf4ccc6149\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022e22031529a124fe8bee62f8176642f4d\u0022\u003EARENA WILLIAMS\u003C/span\u003E: \u2014so that it\u2019s not merely window dressing, and I hear members on the other side saying, \u201CWeren\u2019t we working together?\u201D I\u2019m doing their homework for them.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000870\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b464a62e-d900-452a-b842-e3cf4ccc6149\u0022\u003EI can give them the national energy plan in Ireland, so they can study up and do their homework, so that they know how legislation like this can actually make a difference to New Zealand\u2019s commitments to climate change not only on the world stage but also domestically, so that New Zealanders now have cheaper energy and so that our children in the future have an environment that they can enjoy and have air that they can breathe. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000871\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b464a62e-d900-452a-b842-e3cf4ccc6149\u0022\u003EThis is incredibly important to everyone in this House. We need to hold the Government to the commitments that they say outside one side of their mouths, but they cut things that will really make a difference to it out the other. This must make a difference. This is all they\u2019ve got, so we\u2019re relying on it. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002231e14629-7251-4b68-9f90-22b71db0b1c1\u0022 data-id=\u00229005f29f5d604964940fe5e2b3fa1a60\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000872\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002231e14629-7251-4b68-9f90-22b71db0b1c1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00229005f29f5d604964940fe5e2b3fa1a60\u0022\u003EDAVID MacLEOD (National\u2014New Plymouth):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Mr Speaker. I\u2019m pleased to stand on this bill here, the Offshore Renewable Energy Bill, and it\u2019s hard to disagree with some of the comments made around the House. It\u2019s great to see that there is full support to move this through to the important stage that is the select committee stage.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000873\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002231e14629-7251-4b68-9f90-22b71db0b1c1\u0022\u003EI do just want to talk briefly about the importance of the energy trilemma, and that\u2019s the fact that we want secure energy, we want affordable energy, and we also want sustainable energy. We are blessed as a country with regard to the methods we can use to be able to generate sustainable energy, with solar, hydro, geothermal, and of course, this one here, with wind, not just onshore but now we\u2019re talking about offshore.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000874\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002231e14629-7251-4b68-9f90-22b71db0b1c1\u0022\u003EThe size of these units, as was mentioned by the member from New Zealand First, is immense. If you think about the blades, one blade off one of these units is over 100 metres long. It wouldn\u2019t fit in this room. They are huge. They\u2019re higher than the Sky Tower. If we\u2019re talking about 1 gigawatt, which is what is potentially proposed off the South Taranaki Bight, that\u2019s 70 of these units, spaced about two kilometres apart\u2014an immense amount of area consumed by the units, but generating a good amount of electricity and valuable electricity for New Zealand. I am happy to commend this bill to the House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000875\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002231e14629-7251-4b68-9f90-22b71db0b1c1\u0022\u003EMotion agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000876\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002231e14629-7251-4b68-9f90-22b71db0b1c1\u0022\u003EBill read a first time.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002202e74c40-9529-4e15-adc2-c032eadc2205\u0022 data-id=\u002235c393d9009c4087a7977f56d25684e5\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000877\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002202e74c40-9529-4e15-adc2-c032eadc2205\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002235c393d9009c4087a7977f56d25684e5\u0022\u003EASSISTANT SPEAKER (Greg O\u2019Connor)\u003C/span\u003E: The question is, That the Offshore Renewable Energy Bill be considered by the Transport and Infrastructure Committee.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000878\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002202e74c40-9529-4e15-adc2-c032eadc2205\u0022\u003EMotion agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000879\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002202e74c40-9529-4e15-adc2-c032eadc2205\u0022\u003EBill referred to the Transport and Infrastructure Committee.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n    \u003C/div\u003E\n    \u003Cdiv class=\u0022HpsHansard\u0022\u003E\n      \u003Cp\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsProceedingHeading\u0022\u003EBills\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000880\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u0022ac4bc0b289ef46b9a98588bbf49ecead\u0022\u003EBroadcasting (Repeal of Advertising Restrictions) Amendment Bill\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000881\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u0022a7326cc40def45fd8e221ea7183e8c6d\u0022\u003EFirst Reading\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002232601127-a1e9-4ba0-b6af-99865a84a209\u0022 data-id=\u0022bf8babf52eda426c9955bbe9e95304cd\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000882\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002232601127-a1e9-4ba0-b6af-99865a84a209\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022bf8babf52eda426c9955bbe9e95304cd\u0022\u003EHon TAMA POTAKA (Minister of Conservation)\u003C/span\u003E on behalf of the Minister for Media and Communications: I present a legislative statement\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000883\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f317ee7d-f040-44ec-8f2f-ad0a9f206d75\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00228e1e8f6a7bc24be18d1ca0a549a5de35\u0022\u003EHon Willie Jackson\u003C/span\u003E: Where\u2019s the Minister?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000884\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002202e74c40-9529-4e15-adc2-c032eadc2205\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00222dfd097fa9bd4cc488d8d4e3151d3012\u0022\u003EASSISTANT SPEAKER (Greg O\u2019Connor)\u003C/span\u003E: Enough\u2014enough.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000885\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002232601127-a1e9-4ba0-b6af-99865a84a209\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002221ead5138c124adb9e403811a302481e\u0022\u003EHon TAMA POTAKA\u003C/span\u003E: \u2014on the Broadcasting (Repeal of Advertising Restrictions) Amendment Bill.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000886\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002202e74c40-9529-4e15-adc2-c032eadc2205\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022d0ff744d6e8745e496679cc98c84104b\u0022\u003EASSISTANT SPEAKER (Greg O\u2019Connor)\u003C/span\u003E: That legislative statement is published under the authority of the House and can be found on the Parliament website.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000887\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002232601127-a1e9-4ba0-b6af-99865a84a209\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00225103cf6efbe04dc9956910305fcf24e9\u0022\u003EHon TAMA POTAKA\u003C/span\u003E: I move, That the Broadcasting (Repeal of Advertising Restrictions) Amendment Bill be now read a first time.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000888\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f317ee7d-f040-44ec-8f2f-ad0a9f206d75\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00228978d3d1e89942a1b750091040196931\u0022\u003EHon Willie Jackson\u003C/span\u003E: Where\u2019s the Minister?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000889\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002232601127-a1e9-4ba0-b6af-99865a84a209\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022e2b05f9192e24e7795bab2d1dcbb78b6\u0022\u003EHon TAMA POTAKA\u003C/span\u003E: I nominate the Economic Development, Science and Innovation Committee to consider the bill.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000890\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002232601127-a1e9-4ba0-b6af-99865a84a209\u0022\u003EThe Broadcasting (Repeal of Advertising Restrictions) Amendment Bill will remove advertising restrictions from section 81\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000891\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f317ee7d-f040-44ec-8f2f-ad0a9f206d75\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002274aab5cafc854cdfb229335b7054453c\u0022\u003EHon Willie Jackson\u003C/span\u003E: Where\u2019s the Minister?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000892\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002232601127-a1e9-4ba0-b6af-99865a84a209\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022f1b4865aebcf44bba4831fc54d71602b\u0022\u003EHon TAMA POTAKA\u003C/span\u003E: \u2014of the Broadcasting Act 1989, which currently prohibits broadcast television advertising\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000893\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002202e74c40-9529-4e15-adc2-c032eadc2205\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022181b21041fd54014addbd6b64eab70af\u0022\u003EASSISTANT SPEAKER (Greg O\u2019Connor)\u003C/span\u003E: The Hon Willie Jackson will stand, withdraw, and apologise. I warned you; you\u2019ve said it twice since.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000894\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f317ee7d-f040-44ec-8f2f-ad0a9f206d75\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022e438cbb32f17457bb4661ce9e59cc2fc\u0022\u003EHon Willie Jackson\u003C/span\u003E: OK, I withdraw and apologise, Mr Speaker.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000895\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002202e74c40-9529-4e15-adc2-c032eadc2205\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00221a009eb35dfe4b7b95ad74ddc968b74f\u0022\u003EASSISTANT SPEAKER (Greg O\u2019Connor)\u003C/span\u003E: Sorry, Mr Potaka\u2014continue.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000896\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002232601127-a1e9-4ba0-b6af-99865a84a209\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022327c67caa5574c1d8957b6c3df7afa2c\u0022\u003EHon TAMA POTAKA\u003C/span\u003E: Thank you, Mr Speaker. The Broadcasting (Repeal of Advertising Restrictions) Amendment Bill will remove advertising restrictions from section 81 of the Broadcasting Act 1989, which currently prohibits broadcast television advertising on Sunday and Anzac Day mornings between 6 a.m. and noon, and both television and radio broadcast advertising on Christmas Day, Good Friday, and Easter Sunday.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000897\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002232601127-a1e9-4ba0-b6af-99865a84a209\u0022\u003ESection 81 is no longer aligned with the ways in which audiences consume content. As technology and audiences continue to move away from traditional methods of viewing television shows and listening to radio programming, these restrictions have become increasingly redundant. In fact, New Zealand On Air data shows this year YouTube was the most popular platform in the country, reaching 44 percent of the population daily. The repeal will level the playing field by ensuring local media companies are not disadvantaged by restricted advertising times when global streaming platforms like YouTube are unregulated in this respect.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000898\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002232601127-a1e9-4ba0-b6af-99865a84a209\u0022\u003EIn a challenging economic environment for New Zealand media companies, section 81 is actively hindering broadcasters\u2019 ability to earn revenue from advertising. Industry estimates suggest that local media companies could earn approximately $6 million annually if the restrictions were removed. Lost opportunities for revenue are significant in the current tight financial context, where broadcasters are reducing their commissioning of local content.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000899\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002232601127-a1e9-4ba0-b6af-99865a84a209\u0022\u003EIn June, the Government outlined a range of actions it will take to better support New Zealand\u2019s media and content production sector. This delivers on a promise made in that announcement and comes as we assess how we will proceed with the proposed Fair Digital News Bargaining Bill.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000900\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002232601127-a1e9-4ba0-b6af-99865a84a209\u0022\u003EThe New Zealand media sector has been calling for this change for a long time. It is an anomaly that needs to be fixed, and I am pleased to be taking action to support the media sector. I therefore commend this bill to the House\u2014to this Whare.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002202e74c40-9529-4e15-adc2-c032eadc2205\u0022 data-id=\u002250d2842a47b64ee7ae6c39ad386b4fec\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000901\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002202e74c40-9529-4e15-adc2-c032eadc2205\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002250d2842a47b64ee7ae6c39ad386b4fec\u0022\u003EASSISTANT SPEAKER (Greg O\u2019Connor)\u003C/span\u003E: The question is that the motion be agreed.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022f317ee7d-f040-44ec-8f2f-ad0a9f206d75\u0022 data-id=\u002214fccd5dfd8342928da5dca2c33eb15e\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000902\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f317ee7d-f040-44ec-8f2f-ad0a9f206d75\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002214fccd5dfd8342928da5dca2c33eb15e\u0022\u003EHon WILLIE JACKSON (Labour):\u003C/span\u003E This is a sad, sad, sad night, having to stand up and support this bill. It\u2019s one of the saddest times of my political life, having to stand up and support a bill because Jenny Marcroft and New Zealand First have betrayed the coalition. And, of course, they have come across to the sensible side of the House, because we realise that any sort of p\u016Btea, any sort of dollars for our broadcasting media crew is something\u2014is something\u2014when you consider this coalition has decided to forget all about broadcasting and media, particularly the Minister of Conservation, who just sat down, who\u2019s let down M\u0101ori broadcasting, let down M\u0101ori Television, let down the M\u0101ori nation, let down his people, because he has not got one extra cent for M\u0101ori TV and for M\u0101ori broadcasting\u2014not one extra cent.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000903\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002201d46ccc9871462bafd1bd9d0f3bb9ba\u0022\u003EHon Member\u003C/span\u003E: You didn\u2019t either.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000904\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f317ee7d-f040-44ec-8f2f-ad0a9f206d75\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022e4485c8205074d26a7de11ddef771f3a\u0022\u003EHon WILLIE JACKSON\u003C/span\u003E: Look, I wouldn\u2019t talk too much, some of the people on the other side of the House. What did you get in Audrey Young\u2019s analysis? I think it was a \u201CD\u201D\u2014a \u201CD\u201D. And you got a \u201CC\u201D. Mr Meager got an \u201CA\u201D\u2014he\u2019s on fire; he\u2019s got an \u201CA\u201D. What did Tama Potaka get in the analysis? I\u2019d be quiet if I was you, because I\u2019ll come out with all the\u2014in fact, I\u2019ve got the assessment here of how all the first-year National MPs did, and it was bloody miserable, I tell you.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000905\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f317ee7d-f040-44ec-8f2f-ad0a9f206d75\u0022\u003EI\u2019ve got to say, coming back to this bill\u2014we need to stay on the subject\u2014we support this bill because it is a reshaping of the 1989 Act. It\u2019s a reshaping of that. We have to give our people in radio and TV a bit of an opportunity. It\u2019s not because we want to bombard them with advertising on Anzac Day, on Christmas Day. We get it\u2014we get it\u2014on Anzac Day, on Christmas Day, on holidays, those days should be sacrosanct. We get that, but we\u2019ve moved into 2024, New Zealand First, so tell your leader, \u201CI know you think you\u2019re doing a wonderful job, but we\u2019ve got a media setup that is dying\u2014that is dying\u2014and so we need some help.\u201D We don\u2019t need useless Ministers standing up and saying, \u201CWell, this is what we\u2019re going to do.\u201D; what we need is the digital bargaining bill. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000906\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f317ee7d-f040-44ec-8f2f-ad0a9f206d75\u0022\u003EWe need the digital bargaining bill; we don\u2019t need Mr Goldsmith buckling to the Googles and the\u2014no, no, no, we need him to stand up and show some fortitude, show some strength. Don\u2019t just be like these weak-kneed MPs over here. Grant, you got a \u201CB\u201D, eh? You got a \u201CC\u201D. What did you get, James? James got an \u201CA\u002B\u201D. Give James a clap. He\u2019s going to have a hell of a job on that Justice Committee. I can\u2019t wait to get on the Justice Committee to watch how James deals with some of our people; it\u2019s going to be fabulous. I\u2019m really looking forward to how James handles it, so is Rawiri Waititi. \u201CA\u002B\u201D\u2014what did Rawiri Waititi get?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000907\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220f7d126e-c18d-4466-9ebe-d424ae5c4bf6\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00221cea275609654e0eb62fed2bb742eaca\u0022\u003ERawiri Waititi\u003C/span\u003E: \u201CA\u002B\u201D!\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000908\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f317ee7d-f040-44ec-8f2f-ad0a9f206d75\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00223f7688454c2347cba17ff1655a59e68f\u0022\u003EHon WILLIE JACKSON\u003C/span\u003E: I don\u2019t think so. No, too many hakas\u2014too many hakas.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000909\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002202e74c40-9529-4e15-adc2-c032eadc2205\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00220420826f816b499ea7a14c2597b1b6d1\u0022\u003EASSISTANT SPEAKER (Greg O\u2019Connor)\u003C/span\u003E: Well, I hope you get back to the bill\u2014what everyone else got\u2014Mr Jackson. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000910\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f317ee7d-f040-44ec-8f2f-ad0a9f206d75\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022787f1e46591b46a0ad2589f98fde9ca4\u0022\u003EHon WILLIE JACKSON\u003C/span\u003E: Coming back to the bill. It\u2019s about revenue. The media has been doing it tough for a number of years, and the official forecasts in terms of the repeal of section 81 will provide an additional $6 million to the media sector. It\u2019s about modernising the Act. The media sector\u2019s currently operating under the Broadcasting Act of 1989.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000911\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f317ee7d-f040-44ec-8f2f-ad0a9f206d75\u0022\u003EWe get it, on this side. That\u2019s why we want to give, sadly, this useless coalition some support, because they\u2019ve been betrayed by New Zealand First. Minister Goldsmith\u2014yes, we\u2019ll help you, \u201CGoldie\u201D, yes, we\u2019ll help you, but why don\u2019t you help the broadcasting sector, you useless broadcasting Minister? Do something. Provide a plan. Do something. Help Tama\u00A0Potaka. Tama\u2019s getting smashed to pieces by all his relations. The M\u0101ori Party are threatening him in the House. He\u2019s a disgrace to the M\u0101ori\u2014but we love him on this side, me and Peeni. We\u2019ll look after him. Do something for the media. Do something for broadcasting, you useless National Party members. You\u2019re a disgrace, but we support the bill. Kia ora, Mr Speaker.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022e29c400e-467a-4398-818d-270ef48b80cf\u0022 data-id=\u0022db76227a58094d8bbee0179ded4422c5\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000912\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e29c400e-467a-4398-818d-270ef48b80cf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022db76227a58094d8bbee0179ded4422c5\u0022\u003ESTEVE ABEL (Green):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Mr Speaker. Well, it was entertaining, if a little unprincipled, but we appreciate it, Mr Jackson; we do appreciate it. For the sake of those who are seeking to see the progressive side of the House hold the line on principles of not further allowing the pernicious, constant infiltration and presence and, you know, pervasive presence of advertising in all parts of our lives and existence, we will be voting against this bill. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000913\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e29c400e-467a-4398-818d-270ef48b80cf\u0022\u003ELet\u2019s be clear: the current legislation restricts broadcast television advertising on\u00A0Sunday and Anzac mornings between 6 a.m. and noon, and both television and radio broadcast advertising on Christmas Day, Good Friday, and Easter Sunday. Is there nothing left; is there nothing left? I mean, most of us only ever watch TV on a Christmas Day, so why would we not at least protect the purity of the actual day? Out of some decency, why would we not keep it advertising-free if there is such\u2014and Willie Jackson\u2019s absolutely right: public broadcasting in this country is sorely in need of proper funding and investment. But this piddling sop to the need for funding public broadcasting and the advertising agency is not the way to do it; it\u2019s not the way to do it. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000914\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e29c400e-467a-4398-818d-270ef48b80cf\u0022\u003EBelieve it or not, one of my jobs shortly after leaving high school was that I worked in the advertising industry. I worked in the advertising industry and it always amazed me how, even after the 1987 share market crash, people would turn up and spend tens of thousands of dollars on advertising. Do you know why they spend all that money on it? It seems subtle to those of us in the community, but it actually has this very pervasive effect of working. Advertising sells products, many of which are products that we don\u2019t need to be convinced we should be consuming more of, like alcohol, like fizzy drinks.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000915\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e29c400e-467a-4398-818d-270ef48b80cf\u0022\u003ENow, the reason that the advertising industry is constantly pushing to have the right to be part of every single part of our lives is because it gets into our brains, it gets into our heads, it makes people buy products that they don\u2019t need and don\u2019t want and are not in our best interests. Let\u2019s be honest, I mean, who does not prefer a day of not having to see advertising?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000916\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b2672720-3dfe-421a-af8c-20f00d44da3d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022376be32ad3b44a33a8f591147007b438\u0022\u003ETodd Stephenson\u003C/span\u003E: Just turn it off.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000917\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e29c400e-467a-4398-818d-270ef48b80cf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00225b86ecdb869b467a82f5cd810911bea5\u0022\u003ESTEVE ABEL\u003C/span\u003E: Yeah, that\u2019s what we\u2019re voting for: we\u2019re voting for turning it off. We\u2019re voting for advertising not being put on those last few days of the year where advertising is currently restricted. We\u2019re voting to keep it that way\u2014that we will ensure, on Anzac Day of all days, there is no advertising. We actually let it be the day it should be, of honouring those who lost their lives in those brutal colonial, imperial wars of the First World War, and protecting the public holiday of Christmas Day; and for some who are Christian and sacred, Good Friday and Easter Sunday. They should have their right to have those days remain sacred and free of advertising. We will be voting against this. Thank you, Mr Speaker. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002202e74c40-9529-4e15-adc2-c032eadc2205\u0022 data-id=\u0022c6af9d476f5d454fb7472251250b8b92\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000918\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002202e74c40-9529-4e15-adc2-c032eadc2205\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022c6af9d476f5d454fb7472251250b8b92\u0022\u003EASSISTANT SPEAKER (Greg O\u2019Connor)\u003C/span\u003E: In accordance with the determination of the Business Committee, the House is suspended. I will resume the chair at 9 a.m. tomorrow for the extended sitting to consider members\u2019 orders of the day. Good night. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000919\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002202e74c40-9529-4e15-adc2-c032eadc2205\u0022\u003EDebate interrupted.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217195c102b302240f1ad80fd7d119936e4000920\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002202e74c40-9529-4e15-adc2-c032eadc2205\u0022\u003ESitting suspended from 9.58 p.m. to 9 a.m. (Wednesday)\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n    \u003C/div\u003E\n    \u003Cdiv class=\u0022HpsHansard\u0022\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000001\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsProceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u002220a9b79d8a5e473180502d018b4e2c2f\u0022\u003ETUESDAY, 17 DECEMBER 2024\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000002\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u002263cf81bd78af4ae7866bf0444011a30b\u0022\u003E(continued on Wednesday, 18 December 2024)\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n    \u003C/div\u003E\n    \u003Cdiv class=\u0022HpsHansard\u0022\u003E\n      \u003Cp\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsProceedingHeading\u0022\u003EBills\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000003\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u0022399dd57ea91745fcb6b739f8660bc113\u0022\u003ECrimes (Increased Penalties for Slavery Offences) Amendment Bill\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000004\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u00227bb7a8e57bb644499735d0b9d15862d8\u0022\u003EFirst Reading\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000005\u0022\u003EDebate resumed.\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002261720d2e-5b1d-4742-b4f0-30424316ccc1\u0022 data-id=\u00220cc5038061d140f2a9c47b43a85936f8\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000006\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002261720d2e-5b1d-4742-b4f0-30424316ccc1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00220cc5038061d140f2a9c47b43a85936f8\u0022\u003EDEPUTY SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Members, the House is resumed. We are on the first reading of the Crimes (Increased Penalties for Slavery Offences) Amendment Bill. We are up to call No. 2, the Hon Dr Duncan Webb.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022f7fc7ac3-5ce1-43ca-8cd6-dbb0941bf3ae\u0022 data-id=\u00220a476ec45e134f59958adb3577fb6489\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000007\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f7fc7ac3-5ce1-43ca-8cd6-dbb0941bf3ae\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00220a476ec45e134f59958adb3577fb6489\u0022\u003EHon Dr DUNCAN WEBB (Labour\u2014Christchurch Central):\u003C/span\u003E M\u014Drena, Madam Speaker. Thank you for that. We support this bill; I think that comes as no surprise. We don\u2019t like slavery and it\u2019s a pity in some ways that this bill only goes as far as it does, because what it really does is it looks at the slavery offences, and there\u2019s some that have been around for a while, some a little bit more recent, and it aligns their penalties\u2014all well and good. That\u2019s fine. It\u2019s just a bit of a pity that the Government hasn\u2019t taken on some of this work and looked at the problem of modern slavery, which we\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000008\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ef094bb1-be4f-48b8-bb53-52ce955a1c2d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022eaf4ddc79ba04a178e42659baebad9bd\u0022\u003EJames Meager\u003C/span\u003E: Oh, come on!\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000009\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f7fc7ac3-5ce1-43ca-8cd6-dbb0941bf3ae\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00220f3505ed74134f5785efa35d39a23e02\u0022\u003EHon Dr DUNCAN WEBB\u003C/span\u003E: Oh, well\u2014you know, we\u2019ve got a Minister for workplace relations who says she has other priorities, whilst in Gloriavale we\u2019ve got people who are, basically, in bonded servitude. That\u2019s the attitude of this Government. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000010\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f7fc7ac3-5ce1-43ca-8cd6-dbb0941bf3ae\u0022\u003EGood on the member. I understand members\u2019 bills in Government are a bit tricky because senior members don\u2019t like you to step on their turf. I have no doubt that Brooke van Velden wouldn\u2019t want the backbench members to be showing up her lack of attention to modern slavery, because she\u2019s got more important things to do, like giving workers a pay cut with a 1.5 percent minimum wage increase.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000011\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f7fc7ac3-5ce1-43ca-8cd6-dbb0941bf3ae\u0022\u003ELook, I\u2019ll stop there, because it\u2019s a perfectly reasonable bill. It does something which is a good little tidy-up. It\u2019s a common-sense change. Of course, we do want to set slavery apart as a really egregious crime, not one that you\u2019re three strikable for\u2014the ACT Party\u2019s three-strikes bill\u2014but nevertheless one of the most serious crimes that really you can imagine. Good on the member. I suspect it will get support around the House, and I see no reason to delay it on that process. Kia ora.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00223d42e8cf-544e-415d-892b-f4ef8014d80f\u0022 data-id=\u002270c6397e5a9e414b8637d493bc299dfd\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000012\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d42e8cf-544e-415d-892b-f4ef8014d80f\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002270c6397e5a9e414b8637d493bc299dfd\u0022\u003ETEANAU TUIONO (Green):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Madam Speaker. Dr Duncan Webb\u2019s suspicions are correct: there is support for this bill from the Green Party. Just to acknowledge, as a country we should always be opposing slavery. I mean, it seems like a fairly obvious thing that we should be doing: upholding human rights and fairness is something we should always encourage. I also do take the point that this bill doesn\u2019t go far enough, and I think the member acknowledged that in his first reading speech as well.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000013\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d42e8cf-544e-415d-892b-f4ef8014d80f\u0022\u003EThe bill itself amends sections 98 and 98AA of the Crimes Act. In that Act, there is some pretty heinous stuff in there. It deals with people under 18 in terms of sexual exploitation, removal of body parts, and engagement in forced labour\u2014it\u2019s terrible and heinous stuff. What this bill does is make sure that there is alignment for those penalties\u2014so, consistency. When we were thinking about this bill and looking through it, we couldn\u2019t see any reason why there was that inconsistency, so making sure we are consistent with our approach is incredibly, incredibly important.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000014\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d42e8cf-544e-415d-892b-f4ef8014d80f\u0022\u003EI do note that there were mentions in the member\u2019s first reading speech around there being companion legislation around modern slavery, which is incredibly important, because this is something that Parliament should actually have consensus on. I do take the point that the Minister for Workplace Relations and Safety didn\u2019t consider this a priority, even though, in 2022, the now Prime Minister and then Leader of the Opposition said he would march in the streets for modern-slavery legislation. There\u2019s been a lot of marching in the streets. I\u2019ve yet to see the Prime Minister out there joining us.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000015\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d42e8cf-544e-415d-892b-f4ef8014d80f\u0022\u003EI think it\u2019s important to note that there was actually work that was already being done by the previous Government. There was a working group that was looking at bringing modern-slavery legislation to the House, and all of a sudden it\u2019s not a priority\u2014it\u2019s not a priority for this Government. I do want to acknowledge the member Greg Fleming, who does see this as a priority, and I would continue to encourage him to work right across the House to bring in those more substantive pieces of legislation.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000016\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d42e8cf-544e-415d-892b-f4ef8014d80f\u0022\u003EI do want to acknowledge the work that has been happening in terms of getting that companion legislation together, and I was actually reading the report. Part of that companion legislation will bring in a number of different positions. One of them is around having an independent commissioner and getting a definition of actually what \u201Cmodern slavery\u201D is, because it\u2019s a bit bitsy\u2014here, there, and everywhere\u2014and so I think this is a good move forward.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000017\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d42e8cf-544e-415d-892b-f4ef8014d80f\u0022\u003EThere are some things I think we can do in the mid-term and short term about things that we can do to curtail exploitation, because this is what is at the heart of this type of legislation, or should be at the heart of this type of legislation. I think of, for example, migrant exploitation, de-coupling work visas, and offering amnesty for overstayers, because there is always the power imbalance, and the member previously mentioned workers at Gloriavale. It is all about making sure that you can balance that out so that people have those protections, so that when they find themselves in particular positions where they are vulnerable, there is\u00A0legislation to protect them, which we do not have at this particular point in time.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000018\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d42e8cf-544e-415d-892b-f4ef8014d80f\u0022\u003EThe Greens will be supporting this bill. I\u2019m looking forward to that more substantive work in terms of the companion legislation. Good luck to the member in convincing the rest of the Government parties, given that this, actually, in my mind, should have been a Government bill\u2014we should have had modern-slavery legislation that the whole House can support\u2014but acknowledging the initiative here to try to get something done through the backbenchers as a member\u2019s bill. On that note, I commend this bill to the House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022b2672720-3dfe-421a-af8c-20f00d44da3d\u0022 data-id=\u00223a3e24f44441405eb50e215a960f026f\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000019\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b2672720-3dfe-421a-af8c-20f00d44da3d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00223a3e24f44441405eb50e215a960f026f\u0022\u003ETODD STEPHENSON (ACT):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Madam Speaker. I rise on behalf of ACT to support\u2014we will be supporting it\u2014and also to talk to the Crimes (Increased Penalties for Slavery Offences) Amendment Bill.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000020\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b2672720-3dfe-421a-af8c-20f00d44da3d\u0022\u003EI want to acknowledge Mr Fleming for getting this bill drawn and getting it to the House and for having this first reading, at which it looks likely to pass, given the indications from the other members this morning. It\u2019s quite exciting to have your member\u2019s bill drawn. I\u2019ve had that myself, and I can assure Mr Fleming that his bill will be in good hands, as it is being referred to the Justice Committee\u2014that very hard-working committee that looks at issues like this. We will be very careful in our consideration of this and look forward to adding it to our very busy work agenda.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000021\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b2672720-3dfe-421a-af8c-20f00d44da3d\u0022\u003EThis is a simple but important bill, and I don\u2019t want to get mixed up with discussions on modern slavery, which are an entirely different topic from what this bill actually tries to address. In ACT, as I said, we\u2019re very happy to support this, because it is a simple but very effective and required bill. It is bringing New Zealand into line with other jurisdictions around its penalties for slavery offences, and I think it is good that this has been brought forward and that we are going to have support across the House to deal with this. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000022\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b2672720-3dfe-421a-af8c-20f00d44da3d\u0022\u003EIt is concerning when you actually have the US calling you out for your slavery offences not being top-notch and not where they need to be, and that was, obviously, done in 2001, when the Trafficking in Persons Report by the US State Department said we had dropped down to a tier 2 standard, and so we needed to do this to get our standards back up and aligned with our very important partners.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000023\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b2672720-3dfe-421a-af8c-20f00d44da3d\u0022\u003EActually, human trafficking and slavery isn\u2019t something that just happens in other places; actually, since 2015, there have been four human trafficking prosecutions in New Zealand, and a number of victims identified. It is important that our local laws do keep up with what is happening out there and making sure that we are aligned. The New Zealand Government actually does have some plans in this area to make sure that we are trying to stop slavery and people trafficking and things in this area, and so, obviously, we\u2019ve got a plan of action against forced labour, people trafficking, and slavery. That, obviously, has some key pillars, which Government agencies are working on.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000024\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b2672720-3dfe-421a-af8c-20f00d44da3d\u0022\u003EWe\u2019re also very active in the international community, cooperating with like-minded countries, including in the Indo-Pacific. We are in international forums, like the Bali Process on People Smuggling, Trafficking in Persons and Related Transnational Crimes, the Pacific Immigration Directors Conference, and the Migration 5 meetings. We are an active partner and participant in this area, and Mr Fleming\u2019s bill is actually good, to ensure that we are doing our part with our local Crimes Act, actually reflecting what it should and what other countries are doing.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000025\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b2672720-3dfe-421a-af8c-20f00d44da3d\u0022\u003EThe last point I would make is that ACT\u2014and, in fact, the Government\u2014has a law and order agenda, and I think it\u2019s good that this fits nicely into what we are doing in our broader law and order agenda. Other members across the House have already mentioned some of those things, like three strikes. Later this morning, we\u2019ll actually be talking about another bill around victims\u2019 rights. We are a victims\u2019 rights, principled Government, ensuring that victims\u2019 rights are placed at the forefront and actually ensuring that people are punished appropriately for the crimes they do against others. Again, I think Mr Fleming\u2019s bill very nicely fits into the Government\u2019s broader law and order agenda. We are very happy to support it, and I commend this bill to the House. Thank you.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022feb2e3ca-4ad3-4c7c-9958-b10d28c83bc8\u0022 data-id=\u0022562c29a16bc54ae98e5a94efca7ec981\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000026\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022feb2e3ca-4ad3-4c7c-9958-b10d28c83bc8\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022562c29a16bc54ae98e5a94efca7ec981\u0022\u003EHon CASEY COSTELLO (Associate Minister of Immigration):\u003C/span\u003E I rise on behalf of New Zealand First to speak in support of the Crimes (Increased Penalties for Slavery Offences) Amendment Bill. This is a necessary step to ensure that there is some consistency and clarity around our penalty requirements around this area of how we treat workers and those that are exploited.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000027\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022feb2e3ca-4ad3-4c7c-9958-b10d28c83bc8\u0022\u003ENew Zealand has had only a recent involvement with a conviction of slavery, and my knowledge of that case was quite intimate. I appreciate the challenges and difficulty we had bringing those charges of slavery. The reality is that slavery has been in existence as long as people have been living in societies, and it is a scourge on those societies, but we have to be realistic and practical in our approaches to deal with this issue. Fundamentally, we have to ensure we drive a level of consistency and priority in this area.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000028\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022feb2e3ca-4ad3-4c7c-9958-b10d28c83bc8\u0022\u003EI have been very pleased to announce the establishment of a ministerial advisory group looking at organised crime, because organised crime is a massive driver of slavery and exploitation across the world and in New Zealand. I have intimate experience of managing those investigations and dealing with the reality of what that looks like for workers in New\u00A0Zealand.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000029\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022feb2e3ca-4ad3-4c7c-9958-b10d28c83bc8\u0022\u003EThere is good legislation, there is good existing frameworks to work under, but what we have to do is deal with the practical priorities of how we investigate these offences. What is important is that we provide consistency of the penalties to ensure that we establish that one is not greater than the other, that slavery is considered an abhorrent offence, and this is one step to deal with that positioning of our legislation. Yes, as stated, there is lots of work to be done in this space; it\u2019s how we prioritise that workload. There are significant steps that are already under way in this space, and I commend this bill to the House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022ef094bb1-be4f-48b8-bb53-52ce955a1c2d\u0022 data-id=\u0022b974cc77e0f74adc814675e9061c98f2\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000030\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ef094bb1-be4f-48b8-bb53-52ce955a1c2d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022b974cc77e0f74adc814675e9061c98f2\u0022\u003EJAMES MEAGER (National\u2014Rangitata):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Madam Speaker. Look, it is a real honour to get up today and speak in support of Greg Fleming\u2019s bill\u2014my colleague Greg Fleming. It\u2019s quite disappointing that it took about 30 seconds this morning from the Opposition before they had a crack at Mr Fleming and at the current Government. I\u2019m not sure how short Dr Webb\u2019s memory is, but he was part of a Government that for three very, very, very long years had an absolute majority in this House and did absolutely zip about this issue. If we\u2019re going to get a lecture about why it took so long for certain Governments to prioritise certain bits of legislation and for the Leader of the Opposition to say he\u2019d march in the streets for this and then spend six years doing nothing about it, I\u2019m not going to take lessons from Dr Webb, 30 seconds into the morning, about what did or didn\u2019t happen last term of Government and what is or is not a priority this term of Government.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000031\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ef094bb1-be4f-48b8-bb53-52ce955a1c2d\u0022\u003EOf course, other members have mentioned about members\u2019 bills and said that this member\u2019s bill doesn\u2019t go far enough. Well, of course, those members have been around long enough to know how members\u2019 bills work, in particular how members\u2019 bills work when you\u2019re in Government. The goal of members\u2019 bills in Government is for backbenchers and for people who don\u2019t have the ability to put bills through Cabinet, like some of the members opposite who were in Cabinet\u2014or, actually, some of them didn\u2019t quite make it to Cabinet\u2014and who were Ministers in the previous Government and who had the chance to get bills like this on the legislative agenda but did not do it.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000032\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ef094bb1-be4f-48b8-bb53-52ce955a1c2d\u0022\u003EAll the lessons in the world from the members opposite about whether or not they prioritise this bill\u2014they should look at themselves first before they sling arrows at Mr Fleming. Mr Fleming has done a brilliant job bringing this bill forward and is actually, I understand, working very constructively with members of the Opposition on this bill and on other pieces of legislation to go further on this bill and to try and get cross-party consensus on it. It was incredibly disappointing that, 30 seconds into the morning, that consensus seems to be undermined by members who want to, at 9 o\u2019clock in the morning, have a crack at the Government. There you go; that\u2019s the standard that we\u2019re setting today ahead of a very, very long morning and long afternoon.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000033\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ef094bb1-be4f-48b8-bb53-52ce955a1c2d\u0022\u003EI am standing in support of the bill. The bill does one very simple thing: it increases and improves the penalty regime for what we call modern slavery offences. It\u2019s important because, as members have noted, there was a report in 2021\u2014not sure who was in Government at that point, but, in 2021, a report noticed that New Zealand dropped from being a tier 1 nation in this area to a tier 2 nation. At that point there should have been a wake-up call for the New Zealand Government about doing something in this area, but yet nothing was done. We do have to take some steps, and if we have to do it in Government or we have to do it as backbenchers, we will do so.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000034\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ef094bb1-be4f-48b8-bb53-52ce955a1c2d\u0022\u003EThis particular bill takes that first step, and it is about increasing the penalties in sections\u00A098 and 98AA about trafficking people\u2014about trafficking humans. Of course, human trafficking is one of the world\u2019s most insidious crimes, but it\u2019s also one of the fastest-growing crimes that is happening globally. Of course, these actors are becoming increasingly sophisticated as countries around the world get to grips with increasing global conflict and some of the issues around the increasing numbers of refugees coming in and out of different nations There are insidious actors and there are insidious operatives around the world who will take advantage of global instability and who will take advantage of incredibly vulnerable people and try and put out an offer of hope or an offer of a better life when, actually, what they\u2019re doing is they\u2019re trafficking these vulnerable people. We need to step up as a country, and Mr Fleming is taking the lead on this particular issue. He\u2019s also, I understand, working with members opposite about trying to improve the regime overall, so I do congratulate those of us who are willing to work together on this.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000035\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ef094bb1-be4f-48b8-bb53-52ce955a1c2d\u0022\u003EI wanted to also touch on the fact that one of the members did mention that the Leader of the Opposition said he\u2019d march in the streets for these kinds of issues. Well, that\u2019s all well and good, but we have a very special privilege in this House; we do have the ability to actually change the law. It\u2019s all well and good to stand there and march in the streets for a cause that you do or do not support, but, actually, we have a very unique ability to actually change the law. I think we should do the talking in this House and do the convincing in this House about what laws should or shouldn\u2019t change, rather than spend all our time outside marching for causes that we may well feel very strongly about. Then we get in the House, and we actually need to make those decisions about laws that we change. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000036\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ef094bb1-be4f-48b8-bb53-52ce955a1c2d\u0022\u003EWe have the ability to change the laws, so why spend all our time walking around outside, marching in the streets when we can actually sit in the House, put members\u2019 bills forward, work constructively across the backbench to try and get consensus around these issues, and actually change the law for the good, rather than have cheap little snipes at the Government backbench at 9 o\u2019clock in the morning just so that the members can pad these speeches out because they haven\u2019t done their reading from the notes overnight?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000037\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ef094bb1-be4f-48b8-bb53-52ce955a1c2d\u0022\u003EThis is a great bill. It\u2019s a good bill. It\u2019s going to be supported across the House. I will certainly be supporting it. Our side of the House will be supporting it. I hope that all members in the House will be supporting it throughout the morning.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022a503e324-3a0b-4efd-bf44-ec6740ec9a62\u0022 data-id=\u0022605999024236419aba832d4037f076cc\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000038\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a503e324-3a0b-4efd-bf44-ec6740ec9a62\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022605999024236419aba832d4037f076cc\u0022\u003ECAMILLA BELICH (Labour):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Madam Speaker. It is a pleasure to be able\u00A0to take a call on the Crimes (Increased Penalties for Slavery Offences) Amendment Bill. I wonder if I could just take the debate up a notch a wee bit. It is close to Christmas, we are\u00A0debating a bill that most people in this House agree with, and it is on a serious matter. It\u2019s with that in mind that I will make my comments today. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000039\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a503e324-3a0b-4efd-bf44-ec6740ec9a62\u0022\u003EThis bill is a good start into addressing some of the shortfalls that, I think, around the House, we can recognise and have not just in our law but also in our country in relation to our practices in relation to servitude and slavery. I want to start by acknowledging the people who first brought this idea to the House, and that was acknowledged by the member Greg Fleming, in whose name this bill is. Kaylee Hill and Alex Prendergast first went, I understand, to Nicola Grigg and brought this to her attention. It\u2019s always commendable when members of the public see an issue with the law, bring that to the attention of representatives, and then\u00A0see action as a result, and it\u2019s one of the reasons that I\u2019m in politics\u2014that type of way of changing problems and issues within society. I want to acknowledge them, and also Nicola Grigg and Greg Fleming, for bringing this particular bill. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000040\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a503e324-3a0b-4efd-bf44-ec6740ec9a62\u0022\u003EI think there was an acknowledgment from the member in his first reading speech that this bill didn\u2019t go far enough in two ways. The first way is foreshadowing some amendments that I understand he wishes to make, to make this more substantive. Obviously, we\u2019re not privy to exactly what they may be, and I understand that they will need Government support, like so many things that require change in this House. I wish the member the best of luck with that, and we\u2019d like to work constructively to ensure that practical, meaningful changes can be made to this bill, as well. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000041\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a503e324-3a0b-4efd-bf44-ec6740ec9a62\u0022\u003EAlso, it would be remiss of me not to mention the added need for increased measures in relation to modern slavery. There are a few tos and fros around the House on this, but the clear issue is that New Zealand is well behind in where it should be regarding modern-slavery reporting. We know this. That\u2019s why the Labour Government set up an excellent group to build consensus around this issue, and why we proposed legislation to bring this into the House and make this law, to make sure that our supply chains were free of the insidious crime that is slavery, no matter where it happens in the world.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000042\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f7fc7ac3-5ce1-43ca-8cd6-dbb0941bf3ae\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022fb46c1fa2f414f4fbac28b0904b1b7fc\u0022\u003EHon Dr Duncan Webb\u003C/span\u003E: What happened to that group? \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000043\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a503e324-3a0b-4efd-bf44-ec6740ec9a62\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00220f0ccf5e7ead482394f46c11a5eff271\u0022\u003ECAMILLA BELICH\u003C/span\u003E: Unfortunately, that group was disbanded, but we have tried to make sure that this issue is not lost from the agenda of this House or from the leaders of this House, and I think it is good to be reminded that the Prime Minister did state that he would march in the streets for modern slavery. I agree with the member James Meager when he said that we have a special role in this House in terms of debating and making laws, and my request to the Prime Minister would be to make good on that promise with his special role that he has in this House to work with parties across the House, the majority of whom, I think, want to see this legislation come forward. That would be my plea. This bill is a good start. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000044\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a503e324-3a0b-4efd-bf44-ec6740ec9a62\u0022\u003EBefore I conclude, I just wanted to mention something that many of us in this House\u2014myself, Duncan Webb, and James Meager\u2014have been looking at, which is Gloriavale, which is of concern to many of us in the House. It is concerning when we read of situations that may be very similar to what we are trying to prohibit here, happening in our own country. I think that more needs to be done in that area. That is another area where I do believe there needs to be cross-party support for an ongoing solution for those people in that community, working with people like the Gloriavale Leavers\u2019 Support Trust. It was great to be able, along with James Meager, to host them in the House recently and to hear of their concerns and to hear about what\u2019s happening currently. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000045\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a503e324-3a0b-4efd-bf44-ec6740ec9a62\u0022\u003EFor me, the key thing that I saw from that, in my workplace relations role\u2014and there are many other concerns in that community that leavers will articulate\u2014was hearing that six-year-olds are employees there. For me, that is not right, and it does mean we need to look at the work and the type of work and the nature of the work that happens in that community. I would implore the House, with my final comments, to see if we can find a way forward that\u00A0works for the people who are there, the people who have left their families, and, indeed, all of New Zealand so that we can be sure that no corner of this country is left without the human rights that they deserve. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002289809535-e289-43e8-ad08-668cf3046ffb\u0022 data-id=\u00222aa720691cf34e71848b4476bafcd0ab\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000046\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002289809535-e289-43e8-ad08-668cf3046ffb\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00222aa720691cf34e71848b4476bafcd0ab\u0022\u003ECAMERON BREWER (National\u2014Upper Harbour):\u003C/span\u003E It\u2019s great to hear the more conciliatory comments by the previous speaker, Camilla Belich, towards this bill, calling it a good start. I know the work she\u2019s done with the sponsor of the bill, Greg Fleming, even co-hosting, on the morning of his first reading on 20 November, a gathering of UNICEF young adults. I know that if there\u2019s anyone that\u2019s going to be able to get across the political aisle, it\u2019ll be Greg Fleming, the sponsor of this member\u2019s bill.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000047\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002289809535-e289-43e8-ad08-668cf3046ffb\u0022\u003EGreg comes to the House with a background steeped around working with young people, around working with M\u0101ori, around working with humanitarian causes and charitable organisations, so he is perfectly placed to strengthen up this bill, as has been indicated, through the select committee process, the Justice Committee process, in the coming months. I also note that this will be\u2014it might be the 28th or 29th Justice Committee\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000048\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ef094bb1-be4f-48b8-bb53-52ce955a1c2d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00229816063ac5c74177a1d3a8ca1e44eae0\u0022\u003EJames Meager\u003C/span\u003E: 29th.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000049\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002289809535-e289-43e8-ad08-668cf3046ffb\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a52b9fdb84d54f5cb0676752311af381\u0022\u003ECAMERON BREWER\u003C/span\u003E: 29th Justice Committee bill, and we look forward to processing the submissions.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000050\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002289809535-e289-43e8-ad08-668cf3046ffb\u0022\u003EI also note from earlier comments, particularly from the Green Party member, that this should have been a Government bill and that the Government\u2019s not taking it seriously and that a member\u2019s bill was not the right forum or right format. Well, as the chair of the Justice Committee, James Meager, just reminded us\u2014and there\u2019s been threats of marching in the street and everything else by the Opposition\u2014that they had six years and an absolute majority of 65 MPs. Now they wake up, one year into Opposition, and they\u2019re full of despair that our good member Greg Fleming is advancing this Crimes (Increased Penalties for Slavery Offences) Amendment Bill. They didn\u2019t manage it themselves when they had 65 MPs.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000051\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002289809535-e289-43e8-ad08-668cf3046ffb\u0022\u003EThey could have sorted it out in the caucus party; they didn\u2019t even need to pick up the phone to anyone in the House. They had absolutely every opportunity, and they let that one go, so thank you to Mr Greg Fleming. He hasn\u2019t managed, just yet, to convince Auckland Council to dredge the Onehunga lagoon\u2014I thought I\u2019d give that a plug in case Mayor Brown\u2019s watching\u2014but he has managed\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000052\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022dc4504ff0fd8400495864303c7895a6d\u0022\u003EHon Member\u003C/span\u003E: Highly unlikely.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000053\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002289809535-e289-43e8-ad08-668cf3046ffb\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00225c5f9008ffda47e9b3832ba4129b93ab\u0022\u003ECAMERON BREWER\u003C/span\u003E: He\u2019s going to do that\u2014he\u2019s going to do that. Mr Brown\u2019s going to do that. Mr Fleming has managed to get this member\u2019s bill into the biscuit tin and, even more importantly, drawn.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000054\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002289809535-e289-43e8-ad08-668cf3046ffb\u0022\u003EThat comes before the Justice Committee for interrogation and for submissions, and I invite anyone who takes an interest in the international context and legislative framework around modern-day slavery and human trafficking to have a look at this bill and front up to the Justice Committee and have their say, because we across the Justice Committee will be all ears. The member in charge of the bill, Greg Fleming, has indicated that he wants to strengthen up provisions around the prosecution and against previously used defences.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000055\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002289809535-e289-43e8-ad08-668cf3046ffb\u0022\u003EWe are thrilled that this has come, that this has been drawn, that the member who is responsible for it comes with the context that he is the right person to work across the aisle. He is the right person that comes with the lens into this Parliament, steeped in humanitarian causes and charitable organisations. He brings compassion to this Parliament and he will be the right person to shepherd this through the Justice Committee. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000056\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002289809535-e289-43e8-ad08-668cf3046ffb\u0022\u003EThe overall aim of the bill, for those who might have just tuned in to Parliament TV or Truth Radio\u2014this bill aims to achieve a cohesive penalty regime that is a step forward to achieving New Zealand\u2019s hard stance against human trafficking. This is all about toughening up, and as previous speakers have said, some might be surprised in the public that we\u2019re not as tough as we should be and we\u2019ve been sliding down the international scales. We can do a lot better, and this bill will get us there. I commend the bill.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022cbc37df2-57ae-4536-94ed-a2e39eecd585\u0022 data-id=\u0022bdf54feef1eb432693d8a41abc27f365\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000057\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cbc37df2-57ae-4536-94ed-a2e39eecd585\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022bdf54feef1eb432693d8a41abc27f365\u0022\u003EHon PHIL TWYFORD (Labour\u2014Te Atat\u016B):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Madam Speaker. We\u2019re happy to support this member\u2019s bill brought to the House by the liberal conscience of the National backbench. He\u2019s a kind of lonely ambassador, is Greg Fleming, sent out from the National caucus to try to make contact with the civilised world on behalf of his lost tribe, who are unkindly referred to as \u201Cthe Taliban\u201D and other uncharitable expressions. He is welcome to come and talk to the civilised world any time he likes, and we\u2019ll see what we can do to build consensus.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000058\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cbc37df2-57ae-4536-94ed-a2e39eecd585\u0022\u003EThis bill, as colleagues have already said, increases and aligns the penalties for slavery offences, and it\u2019s a modest but worthwhile technical bill and we\u2019re glad to support it. But, having said that, it\u2019s inevitable when a member brings a bill like this to the House\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000059\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227dbfbd83-6770-4555-8477-85fa01511504\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022e070087eda7d4b6eb45906c189ea21d3\u0022\u003EAndy Foster\u003C/span\u003E: But.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000060\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cbc37df2-57ae-4536-94ed-a2e39eecd585\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00225f2aaac770724b1991f57b4e5838b27b\u0022\u003EHon PHIL TWYFORD\u003C/span\u003E: \u2014yes, there is a \u201Cbut\u201D\u2014a modest technical bill, that it inevitably shines a torch light on the yawning absence of action by the Government on related matters. My colleagues have already talked about the Gloriavale issue, which desperately needs intervention by this Parliament and by the Government on the related issue of forced labour at Gloriavale. The celebrated quote from the Prime Minister that he would march in the streets for modern slavery\u2014not a threat from this side of the House to march in the streets; he said it. He wanted to march in the streets. What have we heard on modern slavery since then? Crickets\u2014crickets.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000061\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cbc37df2-57ae-4536-94ed-a2e39eecd585\u0022\u003EThere\u2019s a lot of appetite elsewhere in the House across a number of parties to see action on the global supply chains that sustain modern slavery at scale in the world today, and New Zealand needs to do its bit. I know that the liberal conscience of the national backbench would like to see action on this, and I just wish he could get enough of his colleagues in the caucus to take the issue seriously so that we could see some action.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000062\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cbc37df2-57ae-4536-94ed-a2e39eecd585\u0022\u003EThere\u2019s a third issue that this debate puts the spotlight on, and that is human trafficking. Now, we have a serious problem in this country with the exploitation of migrant labour. There are a number of cases recently that have come very close to human trafficking and quite possibly do meet the definition of \u201Chuman trafficking\u201D, which is the transport, the transit, the receiving of workers, often for forced labour or sexual exploitation, by fraud or coercion.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000063\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cbc37df2-57ae-4536-94ed-a2e39eecd585\u0022\u003EIf you accept that people are being fraudulently moved across State borders for the purpose of working here and then find themselves smack bang in the middle of extremely exploitative circumstances, we arguably have cases right now of human trafficking in New Zealand and\u00A0we need action on that. Unfortunately, what have we seen from the Minister who was very vocal on these questions when in the Opposition? We\u2019ve seen the cutting in half of the ability of exploited migrant workers to get an open work visa to try to regularise the situation or at least find another job. That\u2019s the single most significant thing that\u2019s been done\u2014a halving of their ability to get an open work visa for the time period.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000064\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cbc37df2-57ae-4536-94ed-a2e39eecd585\u0022\u003EYesterday, we saw the removal of the median wage requirement for migrant workers which, in one fell swoop, shifts vast amounts of money out of the pockets of migrant workers who come to New Zealand, in order to reduce the bottom line for employers. It will inevitably undermine the incentive for employers to hire local workers. It takes money out of the pockets of migrant workers and reduces their bargaining power.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000065\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cbc37df2-57ae-4536-94ed-a2e39eecd585\u0022\u003EWe do support this bill, but the other side shouldn\u2019t be defensive about these things. Just take it on the chin and get on with the job.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00221573c6f8-999b-434d-8bde-a47a586ee0f0\u0022 data-id=\u0022efbb74a22066406ea2527ef48b3d5097\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000066\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221573c6f8-999b-434d-8bde-a47a586ee0f0\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022efbb74a22066406ea2527ef48b3d5097\u0022\u003EGREG FLEMING (National\u2014Maungakiekie):\u003C/span\u003E Madam Speaker, thank you very much for this opportunity to close out this debate, my first member\u2019s bill. I do just want to acknowledge once again the original sponsor of this bill, the Hon Nicola Grigg, and as has been mentioned today by Todd Stephenson, it was a real honour to have this bill pulled out and then be able to guide it through.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000067\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221573c6f8-999b-434d-8bde-a47a586ee0f0\u0022\u003EOn that one, I do just want to acknowledge the importance of members\u2019 bills as part of our legislative process. I understand why there has been a lot of mention about my own leader\u2019s comments before we became Government about this, and I can assure you that he remains a strong advocate for this kind of legislation. The reality of it is that this bill is in play, and this is a legitimate way of attending to some of the deficiencies in our law. I\u2019m keen for us, as a Parliament, to run this process through, get as many changes as we possibly can through the select committee process, which is going to be chaired by my good friend and colleague James Meager. Thank you for your encouraging comments, and also to Cameron Brewer as well.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000068\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221573c6f8-999b-434d-8bde-a47a586ee0f0\u0022\u003EI\u2019m confident that, by the time we get to that end of the process, we will actually have a far more robust framework within section 98 of the Crimes Act, which is that area of our law that provides us with the ability to be able to seek out cases of domestic human trafficking and prosecute effectively. I would just encourage us, as a House, to not diminish the place of members\u2019 bills. There have also been some helpful comments and actually a great invitation there from Phil Twyford for me to strike out to new and undiscovered lands. I certainly intend\u00A0to do that. In fact, I\u2019m pleased to say that I\u2019ve already been doing that.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000069\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022658717ee752a4c40ab8dec3d3392dc17\u0022\u003EHon Member\u003C/span\u003E: Tell us when you find \u201CPlanet Labour\u201D.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000070\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221573c6f8-999b-434d-8bde-a47a586ee0f0\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022cd01160661494c558118707e7932be85\u0022\u003EGREG FLEMING\u003C/span\u003E: Ha, ha! And to that one, I do want to acknowledge my colleague and friend Camilla Belich for her thoughtful work in this area. She\u2019s laboured away in this area for a long time. I\u2019ve really enjoyed working with Camilla in these recent months as we\u2019ve continued to look at what might be possible in terms of companion legislation\u2014that\u2019s in the area of modern slavery and reporting, which Todd Stephenson mentioned. He drew a helpful distinction between that kind of legislation, that kind of work, and what this particular bill at hand does. The way that I would distinguish those, I think, most succinctly is to say that this current bill focuses on cases of domestic trafficking, of migrant exploitation.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000071\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221573c6f8-999b-434d-8bde-a47a586ee0f0\u0022\u003EA number of the members opposite have helpfully raised issues currently before us in New\u00A0Zealand. In fact, the Hon Casey Costello spoke of her experience in that area. I hadn\u2019t realised that, Minister, until I began my own research in this\u2014that this is part of your very wide work in this space. I\u2019m excited to hear of the working group you\u2019ve put together, and I\u2019m hopeful that this piece of legislation can contribute helpfully in that space as well. There\u2019s no doubt at all that we do need some changes in this country, particularly around section 98, and that\u2019s what this bill aims to do.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000072\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221573c6f8-999b-434d-8bde-a47a586ee0f0\u0022\u003EThen the companion legislation is the area of modern slavery reporting. To that extent, I\u2019ve been looking to build on the excellent work of the Modern Slavery Leadership Advisory Group, the research group that met for a couple of years. They and other groups, including World Vision, TEAR Fund New Zealand, and a host of other advocacy groups in New Zealand have done an enormous amount of helpful work looking at international jurisdictions. That is informing a piece of legislation that, hopefully, will be brought to the biscuit tin in the coming year.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000073\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221573c6f8-999b-434d-8bde-a47a586ee0f0\u0022\u003EWith that, I thank the House for their considered support of this bill. It does look like it\u2019s going to go through to the select committee, which I\u2019m very excited about. At that stage, there will be a raft of amendments brought to make that section 98 even more robust. To that extent, thank you to the House, and I commend this bill to it.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000074\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221573c6f8-999b-434d-8bde-a47a586ee0f0\u0022\u003EMotion agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000075\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221573c6f8-999b-434d-8bde-a47a586ee0f0\u0022\u003EBill read a first time.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002261720d2e-5b1d-4742-b4f0-30424316ccc1\u0022 data-id=\u0022f0a1019610c6442489fb313e6997dd19\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000076\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002261720d2e-5b1d-4742-b4f0-30424316ccc1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022f0a1019610c6442489fb313e6997dd19\u0022\u003EDEPUTY SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: The question is, That the Crimes (Increased Penalties for Slavery Offences) Amendment Bill be considered by the Justice Committee.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000077\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002261720d2e-5b1d-4742-b4f0-30424316ccc1\u0022\u003EMotion agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000078\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002261720d2e-5b1d-4742-b4f0-30424316ccc1\u0022\u003EBill referred to the Justice Committee.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n    \u003C/div\u003E\n    \u003Cdiv class=\u0022HpsHansard\u0022\u003E\n      \u003Cp\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsProceedingHeading\u0022\u003EBills\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000079\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u0022216afa5979b543ae9f530a6137146113\u0022\u003ECorrections (Victim Protection) Amendment Bill\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000080\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u0022e522d9a752f84d64b699aca3d322e5e3\u0022\u003EThird Reading\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002239b9bac1-a992-4ccf-a473-9591aeb3a298\u0022 data-id=\u00222db2fa75c7af446ca476b15f0c46af4d\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000081\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002239b9bac1-a992-4ccf-a473-9591aeb3a298\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00222db2fa75c7af446ca476b15f0c46af4d\u0022\u003ERIMA NAKHLE (National\u2014Takanini):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Madam Speaker. I move, That the Corrections (Victim Protection) Amendment Bill be now read a third time.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000082\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002239b9bac1-a992-4ccf-a473-9591aeb3a298\u0022\u003EWith your indulgence, Madam Speaker, may I first acknowledge my god-daughter, Ishara, whose 16th birthday is today, and her mother, my dear friend Manuja Samarasinha, who passed away a few months ago unexpectedly. Manuja was a staunch believer in women\u2019s empowerment through education, and she was here in this House earlier this year, two days before this bill was drawn from the ballot for my maiden speech. I would like to honour my dear friend, with your indulgence and the indulgence of the House, and wish my god-daughter, Ishara, a beautiful, blessed birthday.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000083\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002239b9bac1-a992-4ccf-a473-9591aeb3a298\u0022\u003EGood morning. Ata m\u0101rie, colleagues and those listening from beyond the walls of Parliament. It\u2019s an honour to stand here this morning as we debate my member\u2019s bill for the third and final time, the Corrections (Victim Protection) Amendment Bill. As I have mentioned previously, this bill was drawn from the ballot on the first day of February of this year, and although I was not involved in its inception, having inherited it from Minister Louise Upston after she took up her ministerial roles, I hope that the House and, most importantly, victims feel that I have cradled this bill and its kaupapa safely and effectively to this last parliamentary stage.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000084\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002239b9bac1-a992-4ccf-a473-9591aeb3a298\u0022\u003EWhat began as a desire to place an obligation on the Corrections chief executive and prison managers to make sure that victims of crime and parties to protection orders are not contacted by offenders under the supervision of Corrections, the bill went through a\u00A0metamorphosis of some kind in form, but the intention remained the same: to further protect victims of crime from unwanted contact by offenders responsible for the crimes and offences against them.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000085\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002239b9bac1-a992-4ccf-a473-9591aeb3a298\u0022\u003EThe transformation of this bill, from what it began as to what it is now, has been traversed extensively, particularly in my second reading speech. But, in summary, the main shift was from placing an obligation on Corrections to make sure that everyone in their protection, both within prisons and in the community, falls under this scope. The big shift we did is we took away the requirement for this obligation to fall upon those offenders that are in the community and confined it to those within prison. In a nutshell, the reason why we made this change, as I\u2019ve explained in my former speech, is because from an operational level, it would have been almost impossible for Corrections to monitor everyone that\u2019s out in the community\u2014that\u2019s over 26,000 people.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000086\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002239b9bac1-a992-4ccf-a473-9591aeb3a298\u0022\u003EAlthough it saddens me that we cannot offer more protection, or concrete protection\u2014for victims whose offenders are serving community sentences, for example\u2014it comforts me to acknowledge that our Government, with the support of the whole House so far, is progressing with our stalking bill, which, no doubt, will strengthen protection for victims as well.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000087\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002239b9bac1-a992-4ccf-a473-9591aeb3a298\u0022\u003EIn its final form, what this bill seeks to do is to add another layer of protection for victims of crime and those under whom protection orders are in place for\u2014another layer, if you will, of fortification around victims. This extra layer is in the form of a few pages. It\u2019s a short bill, but it\u2019s made up of the following proposed changes to the principal Act\u2014the principal Act being the Corrections Act 2004\u2014which has enjoyed the support of this House so far.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000088\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002239b9bac1-a992-4ccf-a473-9591aeb3a298\u0022\u003EEssentially, it\u2019s going to be placing an obligation on the chief executive of Corrections to implement processes to protect victims from unwanted contact. These processes will include informing visitors of prisoners, and those who receive prisoner communication, that there are measures they can take if they don\u2019t want to be contacted by a prisoner. Another change is that Corrections must\u2014not may, but must\u2014take into account the interests of victims, in particular being free from unwanted contact from prisoners when deciding what conditions to impose on prisoners regarding outgoing phone calls and outgoing mail. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000089\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002239b9bac1-a992-4ccf-a473-9591aeb3a298\u0022\u003EA key change with this bill is that we\u2019re introducing a new offence to the list of prisoner offences that fall under section 128 of the Corrections Act. This offence is, essentially, that where a prisoner contacts a person, or solicits another person to contact a person, who the prisoner knows or ought to have known reasonably doesn\u2019t want to be contacted, they will be guilty of a prisoner offence.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000090\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002239b9bac1-a992-4ccf-a473-9591aeb3a298\u0022\u003EI began this speech, as I have with my other speeches\u2014or maybe I didn\u2019t begin this speech\u2014by saying that it\u2019s an honour to rise and speak on this bill, but this honour is\u00A0underpinned with a quiet sadness, because the reality is that bills like this are actually desperately needed to protect victims from the mental and psychological torture of revictimisation. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000091\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002239b9bac1-a992-4ccf-a473-9591aeb3a298\u0022\u003ERevictimisation in the form of grossly inappropriate drawings of a perverse sexual nature being sent by mail to young girls by a serial rapist in jail as early as January of this year. This rapist is their father, and despite the Family Court ruling that this sick man was not to contact his daughters, he blatantly disregarded this and sent them drawing after drawing. They were revictimised with every drawing.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000092\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002239b9bac1-a992-4ccf-a473-9591aeb3a298\u0022\u003ERevictimisation in the form of a psychopathic sex attacker successfully sending letters from prison to his victim in 2019. This victim had suffered three days of repeated sexual assault and violence. I\u2019m getting goosebumps as I speak about this because this is real and this is happening in Aotearoa New Zealand. In her victim impact statement, the poor woman asked: \u201CHow is this possible? How is it possible that this can happen?\u201D, referring to the repeated contact and saying that \u201CNow, I never feel safe.\u201D This horrible ordeal revictimised her with every point of contact.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000093\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002239b9bac1-a992-4ccf-a473-9591aeb3a298\u0022\u003ERevictimisation in the form of a victim being subjected to over 100 phone calls made from within prison by the perpetrator of crimes against them in 2018. With every harrowing phone call, this victim was revictimised. Although the Corrections Act had some type of general references to protecting victims of crime, we needed to make it more specific, and that\u2019s what this bill does.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000094\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002239b9bac1-a992-4ccf-a473-9591aeb3a298\u0022\u003EOne would think, and rightfully presume, that when an offender is in jail, the victim will be free from the criminal\u2019s torment, at least while the perpetrator is behind bars, but these examples that I\u2019ve briefly outlined are only three out of an alarming plethora of examples of such cases, and it shows that this reasonable expectation is not being met in many circumstances\u2014again, hence why this amendment bill is needed.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000095\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002239b9bac1-a992-4ccf-a473-9591aeb3a298\u0022\u003EIf I may, I would like to extend my warm gratitude to every single individual connected in some way to the progress of this bill and the intention behind this bill. I\u2019d like to show my gratitude to the Hon Louise Upston for giving this bill renewed life after she was so moved by the number of horrible forms of contact by offenders to their victims from prison. I\u2019d like to thank the Hon Mark Mitchell, Minister of Corrections, for supporting the kaupapa behind these amendments; to the Corrections advisers who answered all my questions\u2014and there were many\u2014thoroughly and in earnest. My colleagues on the Justice Committee, and also my colleagues across the House, but especially our chair, James Meager, for all his patience with my queries.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000096\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002239b9bac1-a992-4ccf-a473-9591aeb3a298\u0022\u003EFinally, I\u2019d like to thank my mother, who, from a very young age, has encouraged me to see who the victims are and to stick up for them. With that, I\u2019d like to commend this bill to the House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002261720d2e-5b1d-4742-b4f0-30424316ccc1\u0022 data-id=\u00225f127d1f5102451d86c86861935a2570\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000097\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002261720d2e-5b1d-4742-b4f0-30424316ccc1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00225f127d1f5102451d86c86861935a2570\u0022\u003EDEPUTY SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: The question is that the motion be agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022c46de55f-b9e4-4c64-9ac6-877bd89c2fc5\u0022 data-id=\u00225419a3bbc2e0472ba8100dae708f0fb6\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000098\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c46de55f-b9e4-4c64-9ac6-877bd89c2fc5\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00225419a3bbc2e0472ba8100dae708f0fb6\u0022\u003EDr TRACEY McLELLAN (Labour):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Madam Speaker. I\u2019d like to start my contribution by acknowledging the member who has brought this bill to the House and has very tenaciously asked all of those questions and worked through the process, because things are never as simple as they seem and there\u2019s always something under the good that requires a little bit more thought or a little bit more pragmatism than what was anticipated. I do congratulate the member for working all her way through those things. I\u2019d also like to acknowledge the people who are victims of retraumatisation and the fact that we should, as a society, have the expectation that when someone commits an offence against us and they are imprisoned, that should be the end of the process and not the beginning of a whole new process and a whole new experience. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000099\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c46de55f-b9e4-4c64-9ac6-877bd89c2fc5\u0022\u003EThe bill, as has been said, doesn\u2019t address all of the offender communications because it just wasn\u2019t practical when you start to think about how you could do that, but it does do the ones it can do and it does limit those interactions from prison. I think that that is an absolute step in the right direction. In that sense it does, as members\u2019 bills should do, take a very specific and a very practical step and even modest progress is valuable when it affirms victims\u2019 rights to safety and to peace of mind. It does so primarily, as the member responsible for the bill herself said, by introducing a new offence under the prison discipline regime for\u00A0making unwanted contact, and it sends a signal therefore that harassment of victims won\u2019t be tolerated. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000100\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c46de55f-b9e4-4c64-9ac6-877bd89c2fc5\u0022\u003ETo achieve that practically, it does somewhat rely on victim education. It does somewhat rely on the recipient of prisoner communications being informed about the practical steps that they can do and what the Corrections department can do to help them understand how they can stop that unwanted contact. Whilst not perfect and whilst the onus is somewhat being on the victim, it is a step in the right direction, and it will be interesting to follow the progress of how this bill makes an impact in the Corrections system.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000101\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c46de55f-b9e4-4c64-9ac6-877bd89c2fc5\u0022\u003EIt also places an expectation, as was said, on the Department of Corrections, to actively consider the victims when they make the types of decisions that they make around communications. As you can imagine, it\u2019s not a simple linear and tidy package of decision making that has to be made when you\u2019re balancing people\u2019s rights to communicate with victims\u2019 rights to not receive some communication. Again, it will be interesting to see how that progresses, and the Department of Corrections will need to report on that as well. That provides us with that tool.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000102\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c46de55f-b9e4-4c64-9ac6-877bd89c2fc5\u0022\u003EIt\u2019s a practical step forward. It supports victims in managing their own safety. For that reason, we commend the member who has ushered this through, and support the bill.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00227a31ee40-34c3-42b0-9459-7a7e9c815d6a\u0022 data-id=\u0022276757b5fac546d58358b555680033be\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000103\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227a31ee40-34c3-42b0-9459-7a7e9c815d6a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022276757b5fac546d58358b555680033be\u0022\u003EKAHURANGI CARTER (Green):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Madam Speaker. T\u0113n\u0101 koutou e te Whare. I rise in support of the Corrections (Victim Protection) Amendment Bill. Like my colleagues previously, I want to mihi across the House, and of course to MP Rima Nakhle, for the work that has been done to get this bill to this stage. On our last day in the House for 2024, it feels fitting that we are passing a bill that has unanimous support across the House and will make a tangible and real difference to protection for survivors. This work is important work. This work will help protect people from retraumatisation. This is what it\u2019s all about.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000104\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227a31ee40-34c3-42b0-9459-7a7e9c815d6a\u0022\u003EAt the core of this bill is a vision for a world free from violence, from family violence, and from sexual violence. We shouldn\u2019t accept these issues as inevitable. To reach our goal of eliminating family and sexual violence, it is imperative that we have a survivor-centred approach to justice, one that protects survivors from further abuse, trauma, pain, and suffering. A survivor-focused approach means listening and learning, and that is actually what the Justice Committee did through the select committee process. We heard survivors, we heard those submitters, and we acted, and that is why, here at the Greens, we support this bill.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000105\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227a31ee40-34c3-42b0-9459-7a7e9c815d6a\u0022\u003EWhat is clear is that this Government is taking a fundamentally different approach to prevention. There have been some big changes in this bill since its first reading. After hearing from the Department of Corrections that the first iteration of this bill would be very difficult to implement operationally, the Justice Committee went back and did that mahi and really made those changes that mean that it will make a tangible difference and it will be implemented in a way that actually protects survivors.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000106\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227a31ee40-34c3-42b0-9459-7a7e9c815d6a\u0022\u003EWe know a survivor-centred approach to justice is fundamentally different from the tough-on-crime stance which this Government is dedicated to, and we welcome this bill as a protection for survivors. To have a truly survivor-centred approach to justice is the\u00A0key to eliminating family violence and sexual violence. We can\u2019t keep using punitive measures that are doomed to fail over and over again. The reality is prevention and rehabilitation is\u00A0not a priority for this Government, even though survivors are telling us this is what they\u00A0want.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000107\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227a31ee40-34c3-42b0-9459-7a7e9c815d6a\u0022\u003EIt\u2019s time to learn from our mistakes and be really bold and learn from people with lived experience. When it comes to family violence, it ends up being the justice system itself that can cause as much harm as the actual family violence. Generations of family violence survivors have told us that they regretted reporting abuse, as the justice system\u2019s response often left them feeling more harmed than the violence itself. This is a truly sobering reflection of the system\u2019s failures.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000108\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227a31ee40-34c3-42b0-9459-7a7e9c815d6a\u0022\u003EWe welcome this bill and the positive changes, and we know we need to transform the justice system to be survivor-centred, to focus on prevention and rehabilitation. We hear this from survivors, advocates, and experts, and it\u2019s time for us to continue in the true spirit of survivor-centred justice.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000109\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227a31ee40-34c3-42b0-9459-7a7e9c815d6a\u0022\u003EOn Sunday, the second action plan of Te Aorerekura was launched. This is a bold initiative shepherded in by the Hon Marama Davidson. This is an across-Government strategy which focuses on primary prevention. One of the key components to success is breaking down the barriers of Government agencies talking to each other and working together. And so that talking together and planning together and committing to prevention work is what is needed, and that is what we can do. This is an example of how we do that. The Greens strongly urge the Government to reprioritise Te Aorerekura and the vital system-wide changes needed, like resourcing front-line services who provide the support families need.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000110\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227a31ee40-34c3-42b0-9459-7a7e9c815d6a\u0022\u003EWhat is Te Aorerekura all about? It acknowledges the importance of prevention. It is an area that is chronically underfunded in New Zealand, and, sadly, this Government has decided to further\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000111\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002261720d2e-5b1d-4742-b4f0-30424316ccc1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022d925aea377914fd8b333ca8f71455a44\u0022\u003EDEPUTY SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: I don\u2019t want to be mean-spirited at the moment, but we\u2019re on the third reading of a bill\u2014and I accept that the members mentioned this as an important component, but I would really like the member to come back to this piece of legislation. Thank you.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000112\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227a31ee40-34c3-42b0-9459-7a7e9c815d6a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002201c753da5bea48bbace3873df0ce4f41\u0022\u003EKAHURANGI CARTER\u003C/span\u003E: Absolutely, Madam Speaker. Thank you. We want to see this commitment in the prevention space, and this bill is a step towards that because we are prioritising survivors and what survivors have asked for and something that actually will prevent them from retraumatisation. I do want to shout out to successful programmes like Te Whakaruruhau, Waitomo Papakainga, and Te Whare Ruruhau o Meri, where w\u0101hine and t\u0101ne are supported to break free from these cycles of violence.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000113\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227a31ee40-34c3-42b0-9459-7a7e9c815d6a\u0022\u003EThe Corrections (Victim Protection) Amendment Bill represents a big step towards a truly survivor-centred approach within our justice system. This bill protects survivors of family violence from unwanted contact, which is crucial to their healing journey. It is clear that a survivor-centred approach to justice is vital for the changes that we need to protect our future generations. If we genuinely want to transform our justice system and provide effective protection for survivors, we must ensure that prevention is prioritised. Let\u2019s keep moving forward and working together on this prevention and rehabilitation work. We support this bill.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022b2672720-3dfe-421a-af8c-20f00d44da3d\u0022 data-id=\u0022e57609e7f0e14422a2605ec7cecead9e\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000114\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b2672720-3dfe-421a-af8c-20f00d44da3d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022e57609e7f0e14422a2605ec7cecead9e\u0022\u003ETODD STEPHENSON (ACT):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Madam Speaker. I rise on behalf of ACT to speak on the Corrections (Victim Protection) Amendment Bill in this third reading.  Firstly, I want to pay tribute to Rima Nakhle, whose name this bill is in. Obviously, as she has outlined this morning, she did inherit this bill, but I don\u2019t think there could have been a better person to actually have inherited this bill. Ms Nakhle is a very hard-working member of the Justice Committee\u2014and, I am sure, of other parliamentary activities as well\u2014but I\u2019ve had a lot to do with her on the Justice Committee. She is a very victim and survivor-centric person, she\u2019s very intelligent, and she did an amazing job shepherding this bill through the select committee process, asking the right questions, always pushing for more and more.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000115\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b2672720-3dfe-421a-af8c-20f00d44da3d\u0022\u003EAs she said, the bill started off in one place, it developed\u2014you know, she would have had a regime that actually would have covered every person under Corrections supervision in all of New Zealand, but accepted that there was some impracticality to that, but did keep pushing. I want to talk about that a little bit later, about some of the things that I think we can do to follow up this bill, which looks set to pass. I want to say thank you to Rima for continuing to be the voice of victims and survivors, and I think we\u2019re going to deliver you a slightly early Christmas present this morning\u2014but, more importantly, we\u2019re actually going to deliver a Christmas present for victims and survivors in New Zealand.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000116\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b2672720-3dfe-421a-af8c-20f00d44da3d\u0022\u003EReally, as has been outlined, what this does is strengthen the protections in place for victims and survivors of crime who do not want to hear from the perpetrators of the crimes against them. Now, that\u2019s a pretty simple concept. If you have been subject to a crime\u2014often violent and often sexual offences\u2014and you do not want to hear from that person ever again, I think that that is something that you should have as a right, as a victim or a survivor. While there were some general protections in place, they were not adequate. That is clear, because, actually, Corrections worked and actually asked for a six-month implementation period because they wanted to make sure they had the proper processes and practices in place. They are clearly going to be strengthening what they do already.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000117\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b2672720-3dfe-421a-af8c-20f00d44da3d\u0022\u003EAnother important point which we did uncover\u2014and, I think, again, has been referred to this morning\u2014is there is some education that needs to be done, actually, for victims and survivors around their rights. We heard from Corrections about what they\u2019re going to put in place in relation to that. They will be trying to make sure, at contact points they have with victims and survivors, that they will be making their rights known to them, and the process when they do want to stop this unwanted contact.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000118\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b2672720-3dfe-421a-af8c-20f00d44da3d\u0022\u003EIt\u2019s also been touched on this morning that we do have, obviously, a family and sexual violence culture problem in New Zealand. It has been referred to that we had the second launch of the action plan on Sunday, and I do want to pay tribute both to the current Minister, the Hon Karen Chhour, and previous Ministers who have put that plan in place. I hope that we can actually have a discussion across the House about how we can deliver the things in that plan, because it is very important as a lot of those\u2014and, again, Ms Nakhle referred to some of the types of unwanted contact this morning\u2014are family and sexual violence cases.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000119\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b2672720-3dfe-421a-af8c-20f00d44da3d\u0022\u003EWe want to, obviously, stop this for as many victims and survivors of crime as possible. We need to be doing things at the prevention and punishment end, but also, obviously, in relation to victims\u2019 and survivors\u2019 rights. Again, I think the stalking law which we introduced last week is a part of that. One of the other interesting things which I know Ms Nakhle was slightly disappointed about was that we couldn\u2019t actually put a reporting aspect\u00A0into this bill. I think that was discussed at length, because it would actually force Corrections to report on what they had done, and the outcomes. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000120\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b2672720-3dfe-421a-af8c-20f00d44da3d\u0022\u003EOne of the great things about select committees and the annual review process is we do actually have Corrections in every year to our select committee. We discussed the opportunity to ask questions of Corrections about the implementation of this bill and what they\u2019re doing to protect victims\u2019 rights and survivors\u2019 rights. I look forward to that being a topic of discussion next year when the Corrections department comes in, and we can actually ask them some detailed questions about this regime, how it\u2019s going, and actually what the results have been. That is something that, again, is a great part of our parliamentary process and actually will allow us to follow up on Ms Nahkle\u2019s bill.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000121\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b2672720-3dfe-421a-af8c-20f00d44da3d\u0022\u003EI also want to pay tribute to people who did submit to this bill. We did cover this in the second reading, but it\u2019s just worth calling out that we did have some submissions in relation to this bill. Some submitters had gone to a lot of effort. I noted the New Zealand Law Students\u2019 Association went to some effort and detail to actually go through the bill\u2014the improvements that they saw could be made\u2014and I want to thank groups like that that did actually look at the substance of the bill and make suggestions. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000122\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b2672720-3dfe-421a-af8c-20f00d44da3d\u0022\u003EI also want to just reference Victim Support, because they also did do a submission, and a really excellent submission. Again, a lot of the things that they put in their submission have been touched on this morning in the House, but there are four points in their submission that I do want to draw people\u2019s attention to, because they really outlined reasons why they were going to support this bill on behalf of victims and survivors.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000123\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b2672720-3dfe-421a-af8c-20f00d44da3d\u0022\u003EThe reasons they put forward were these: victims deserve to feel safe. This comes back to my earlier comments: if people have been the subject of a crime and they do not want to hear from the perpetrator of that crime, that should be their right, and they deserve to feel safe in getting on with their lives. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000124\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b2672720-3dfe-421a-af8c-20f00d44da3d\u0022\u003EThey deserve to be free from revictimization. We\u2019ve heard some comments this morning from across the House about the importance of dealing with revictimisation, and unwanted contact is a form of revictimisation. Again, we heard some quite traumatic examples of what can be communicated to people.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000125\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b2672720-3dfe-421a-af8c-20f00d44da3d\u0022\u003EVictims deserve to have autonomy. This comes, again, back to my point that if people make a decision about how they want to not hear from someone and get on with their lives, they should be able to do that, and actually regain control, particularly when it\u2019s a family violence case or sexual violence case\u2014actually having that autonomy and actually being able to take control over your life is very, very important.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000126\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b2672720-3dfe-421a-af8c-20f00d44da3d\u0022\u003EFourthly, they said this could help assist victims to move on. I think that is really, again, another key point. Someone who\u2019s been subject to a crime needs to decide how they want to move on and live their lives, and if that includes cutting someone off and cutting off contact from someone, they should be allowed to do that.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000127\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b2672720-3dfe-421a-af8c-20f00d44da3d\u0022\u003EAlso, Victim Support put forward a couple of other really helpful suggestions in their submission, which we dealt with. It has been touched on this morning, this idea of having prisoners and inmates using other prisoners and inmates to reach out to the people. Again, we\u2019ve heard how that will not be allowed either; so you can\u2019t ask someone else in your prison facility to do the contacting on your behalf, and if you\u2019re doing that, that will be an offence. They also talked about some process changes. I thought that their submission actually summed up really nicely what Rima Nakhle was trying to achieve in this bill.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000128\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b2672720-3dfe-421a-af8c-20f00d44da3d\u0022\u003EI do think this is an excellent piece of legislation, which, obviously, is being supported across the House, and is a very victim- and survivor-centric piece of work. I want to commend this bill to the House on behalf of ACT.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022feb2e3ca-4ad3-4c7c-9958-b10d28c83bc8\u0022 data-id=\u00222dfe0a1ff2fb4ebbbd13ecd24817d193\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000129\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022feb2e3ca-4ad3-4c7c-9958-b10d28c83bc8\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00222dfe0a1ff2fb4ebbbd13ecd24817d193\u0022\u003EHon CASEY COSTELLO (Associate Minister of Police):\u003C/span\u003E I rise on behalf of New Zealand First to speak on the third reading of the Corrections (Victim Protection) Amendment Bill. As others have done in the House, I would like to recognise the member Rima Nakhle for her compassionate, considered, and empathetic approach that she has taken to this bill. She has given credit, of course, to Minister Louise Upston, who first presented the bill, but I think it is her collaborative and empathetic approach to this bill that has enabled it to traverse the journey it has and bring it to this House. She is an individual who has tremendous warmth, and it is hard not to be caught up by her passion on this issue and her genuine concern for delivering positive outcomes. I thank her for the work that she\u2019s done to bring this to the House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000130\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022feb2e3ca-4ad3-4c7c-9958-b10d28c83bc8\u0022\u003EI\u2019d like to pause a little bit when we talk about the need for protection and recognise that a big component of this is about the power relationship. This is about offenders continuing to hold a power, control, through whatever means, over vulnerable people, and this communication is just one of the ways in which they influence. When they don\u2019t have the ability to be physically in control or physically intimidating or constraining their victims, then they use this as a method of continuing to share their influence and control over vulnerable victims. It is important when we talk about this need to reduce the impact on victims and affording better protections that the reality is there has to be a punitive measure in this space. We would love to be able to police by consent, we would love to be able to not have to lock anybody up because nobody makes bad decisions, but the reality is we owe these vulnerable people some degree of greater protection, and punitive impacts are a reality in this space.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000131\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022feb2e3ca-4ad3-4c7c-9958-b10d28c83bc8\u0022\u003EThere are opportunities, of course, to break the cycle, and I think that we have to be a bit more considered about the environment of corrections. I think the work that the member did through this process in working with Corrections was quite an eye-opener as to how much Corrections actually do deliver in terms of trying to break the cycle: to rehabilitate, to educate, to strengthen, to make a different pathway so that different decisions can be made. But that doesn\u2019t happen overnight, and the reality is these victims need protection all the time. As we work through that process of better education, of better housing, of better career opportunities, all of those things that will enable people to live better lives and reach their potential, that is not immediate. Therefore, these steps need to be taken to ensure that we have some assurance to victims.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000132\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022feb2e3ca-4ad3-4c7c-9958-b10d28c83bc8\u0022\u003EI\u2019d comment a little bit on observations that were made across the House about victims regretting reporting. From my experience, one of the biggest regrets that victims had was the fact that there was no punishment\u2014that they go through this enormous process that is incredibly terrifying and toll taking, and at the end of the day, the offender who has inflicted so much harm bears no consequence for that. That is part of those realities that we have to recognise\u2014that this system is flawed. It isn\u2019t perfect, but the point of putting victims first is ensuring that we can provide an assurance that, if they go through this process, they will be protected; that the person who is responsible for this harm is dealt with in a way that makes the process of reporting worthwhile. The greatest fear you have is that, once you\u2019ve gone through this and exposed it, this person either can show up on your doorstep the next day or can write letters or phone calls or send objectionable material.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000133\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022feb2e3ca-4ad3-4c7c-9958-b10d28c83bc8\u0022\u003EThe ways in which they can continue to create this influence is evident any time you meet with any organisation that\u2019s trying to reduce family violence and harm; the insidious way in which they can continue to invoke controls, whether it is through transactions into bank accounts, whether it\u2019s controlling money, whether it\u2019s sending text messages, sending other people to send messages. It is this ongoing level of control that this bill is serving to reduce.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000134\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022feb2e3ca-4ad3-4c7c-9958-b10d28c83bc8\u0022\u003ESo, yes, we do have a flawed system. Yes, there is lots of work to be done if we are to strengthen our societies, but fundamentally we have to reduce the number of victims, and when we have victims, we provide them assurance that they will be protected. This bill goes a long way to sending a very clear message that this Government is listening, that we understand the realities. There is lots of work to be done, but for this bill, on this day, we can say that we have taken one more step to ensuring that your voice is heard and we will put some wrap-around protections on you. Therefore, New Zealand First commends this bill to the House. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002202e74c40-9529-4e15-adc2-c032eadc2205\u0022 data-id=\u002239e42f0b6c9b415caecd7f4834e9d21d\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000135\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002202e74c40-9529-4e15-adc2-c032eadc2205\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002239e42f0b6c9b415caecd7f4834e9d21d\u0022\u003EASSISTANT SPEAKER (Greg O\u2019Connor)\u003C/span\u003E: This is a five-minute call\u2014Francisco Hernandez.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022fe342415-6351-4072-a17e-19dab2ef184d\u0022 data-id=\u002284ad9924120f45f4813d7af58fc2a1c7\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000136\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022fe342415-6351-4072-a17e-19dab2ef184d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002284ad9924120f45f4813d7af58fc2a1c7\u0022\u003EFRANCISCO HERNANDEZ (Green):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Mr Speaker. I want to begin by acknowledging and thanking the member Rima Nakhle for bringing this work forward, and I congratulate her.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000137\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022fe342415-6351-4072-a17e-19dab2ef184d\u0022\u003EI want to thank all members of the House as speeches in previous readings have shown unanimous support for this bill. It\u2019s a good reflection that on issues like this, like the greyhound bill, we can come together and actually do good things together, despite the sort of incentives that encourage conflict and partisanship. We are physically set up in opposition to each other, and that\u2019s a feature of the Westminster system, which actually comes into a bit of conflict, I guess, with one of the features of the mixed member proportional system, which is that different parties do have to work together on issues to try and achieve consensus. I think that\u2019s been one of the tensions across this Government, and it was a tension in previous Governments as well.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000138\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022fe342415-6351-4072-a17e-19dab2ef184d\u0022\u003EI also want to thank Minister Chhour and previous Ministers who worked in this space,\u00A0and I want to acknowledge the generous tribute that Todd Stephenson mentioned towards\u00A0previous Ministers, like Marama Davidson, on the work on Te Aorerekura. It\u2019s really important that this continues to be an issue that transcends partisan political boundaries.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000139\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022fe342415-6351-4072-a17e-19dab2ef184d\u0022\u003EI think my colleague Kahurangi Carter has already outlined the Green Party\u2019s position on this bill and why we\u2019re supporting it. This bill puts additional support towards victims so that there\u2019s a decreased chance of their being revictimised by perpetrators, and it does this in a way that is consistent with a victim- or survivor-centred approach that is inherent in that strategy. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000140\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022fe342415-6351-4072-a17e-19dab2ef184d\u0022\u003EI won\u2019t labour the point. Thank you to all members for their support. Thank you to Rima Nakhle for bringing this important work forward. I hope that we as a House can continue to work together on issues like this that transcend partisan party politics. Kia ora.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002244967dc4-6cc7-4567-b8ef-cc3a9b354544\u0022 data-id=\u002210ee5677ee6e40a0829ce0b89b1bead0\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000141\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002244967dc4-6cc7-4567-b8ef-cc3a9b354544\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002210ee5677ee6e40a0829ce0b89b1bead0\u0022\u003EGRANT McCALLUM (National\u2014Northland):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Mr Speaker. It\u2019s a great pleasure and privilege to rise to speak in the third reading of the Corrections (Victim Protection) Amendment Bill.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000142\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002244967dc4-6cc7-4567-b8ef-cc3a9b354544\u0022\u003EI particularly acknowledge my very good and hard-working colleague Rima Nakhle, the MP for Takanini. It\u2019s a real honour to get a member\u2019s bill drawn and to get to this point, where you\u2019re about to actually pass law. I think that\u2019s quite something. It\u2019s one of the privileges we get as MPs. I\u2019d like to also acknowledge her very supportive husband, Roger, who is here today. It\u2019s great to have that support. We know how much they support each other, so it\u2019s great to have you; I acknowledge you up here as well.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000143\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002244967dc4-6cc7-4567-b8ef-cc3a9b354544\u0022\u003ELook, I can\u2019t imagine actually being a victim and then being revictimised by someone who you thought you should be safe from, because they\u2019re in prison. In this day and age, we really have to make sure that people are given every chance to move on from being a victim, as much as they can, and deal with it. It must be such a traumatic experience, so to actually then allow for more protection for victims is outstanding, and it\u2019s a great reason for this bill.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000144\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002244967dc4-6cc7-4567-b8ef-cc3a9b354544\u0022\u003EIt actually fits in really well with what our Government is doing in the whole law and order space. It\u2019s putting a real focus on victims. We felt, in the past, that that balance had been lost, and we\u2019re bringing it back to a situation where victims are at the centre of the justice system, not the criminals themselves. It\u2019s going to make quite a difference for people, I think, to put an obligation on the CEO of Corrections to actually go the extra mile to make sure people aren\u2019t being revictimised while their perpetrator is in jail. I mean, it\u2019s obviously a challenge, because recently we\u2019ve seen pictures from within jail taken of people on smuggled phones and so forth, so it might just add that extra focus in that space, which I think will be a really good thing. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000145\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002244967dc4-6cc7-4567-b8ef-cc3a9b354544\u0022\u003EIn terms of the other aspects around helping the victims of crime, one of the things that we brought to the House recently is around the stalking situation. It all flows into that same area. For some who\u2019ve never been there, they might not necessarily understand it, but, by damn, it can be very traumatic for the individuals that are caught up in\u00A0 this situation, so I really think this will really make a difference for people.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000146\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002244967dc4-6cc7-4567-b8ef-cc3a9b354544\u0022\u003EI mean, it also fits in with all the other things. We\u2019re sending that message out there to say to the people who want to commit crime that we don\u2019t accept it; society does not accept it. We put a real focus in that space around the gangs and the work we\u2019ve done there and said to them, \u201CLook, don\u2019t wear gang patches.\u201D, because, actually, in many ways, when people go outside and they see gangs, they can feel traumatised by that if they were a victim of a gang crime. I think that sort of thing can really, really help in that space as well.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000147\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002244967dc4-6cc7-4567-b8ef-cc3a9b354544\u0022\u003EI think it\u2019s important to acknowledge, in this whole process with this bill, which was drawn, as Rima told us earlier on, on 1 February this year, just after the maiden speech\u2014gee, some people are lucky\u2014and then went through the process. The first reading was on 20 March and then submissions were open for a month from 6 April to 6 May, and they received 12 submissions. Clearly, I think we had better pay tribute to the very hard-working members of the Justice Committee. They seem to be always complaining about the amount of work they do. I really don\u2019t know what their problem is, actually.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000148\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ef094bb1-be4f-48b8-bb53-52ce955a1c2d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022646d11e36ec647d6a08e8821b0d52f30\u0022\u003EJames Meager\u003C/span\u003E: Love the work.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000149\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002244967dc4-6cc7-4567-b8ef-cc3a9b354544\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022f9d0c47684bd494590359b00cd8e5756\u0022\u003EGRANT McCALLUM\u003C/span\u003E: It\u2019s what we get paid to do, Mr Meager. I pay compliments to the chair\u2014he\u2019s done a good job of chairing it\u2014and the deputy chair, Jamie Arbuckle. We\u2019ve got the infamous Cameron Brewer over here, who\u2019s also on that select committee. He seems to spend all his life in this House, because the Justice Committee does seem to have a few bills in here. We\u2019ve also got Rima on that same select committee; Paulo Garcia, who can\u2019t be here at the moment. I acknowledge Todd Stephenson, who spoke earlier, and Ginny Andersen, who\u2019s on that select committee. And, of course, Duncan\u2014of course I\u2019ve got to acknowledge Duncan Webb.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000150\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aed260be-c954-464b-bb75-85579e53d05a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022346e7ca06e544c64baf91137890cbc44\u0022\u003EHon Dr Ayesha Verrall\u003C/span\u003E: Is this your Christmas card list?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000151\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002244967dc4-6cc7-4567-b8ef-cc3a9b354544\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002292cedc96cfe5476ba180d787aba73483\u0022\u003EGRANT McCALLUM\u003C/span\u003E: Ha, ha! Well, I\u2019m getting through it, yeah\u2014and Tracey McLellan and Tamatha and T\u0101kuta Ferris. I think it\u2019s really important that we acknowledge the hard work that\u2019s been done by people on that committee.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000152\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002244967dc4-6cc7-4567-b8ef-cc3a9b354544\u0022\u003EWith that, I really do commend this bill to the House. It\u2019s a great bill. It will make a real difference for victims in in our society, and I commend it to the House. Thank you.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022f7fc7ac3-5ce1-43ca-8cd6-dbb0941bf3ae\u0022 data-id=\u00223a75c474001443c0ac53e46b4062981e\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000153\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f7fc7ac3-5ce1-43ca-8cd6-dbb0941bf3ae\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00223a75c474001443c0ac53e46b4062981e\u0022\u003EHon Dr DUNCAN WEBB (Labour\u2014Christchurch Central):\u003C/span\u003E Kia ora, Mr Speaker, and thank you, Grant McCallum, for running through the members of the Justice Committee for the record there.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000154\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f7fc7ac3-5ce1-43ca-8cd6-dbb0941bf3ae\u0022\u003ELook, across the House we will not agree on all criminal justice policy and we fiercely disagree about large parts of it, but in terms of at least the theory of better support and appropriate support for victims and the reduction in the number of victims, we do agree\u2014absolutely agree\u2014and that\u2019s good. Congratulations to the member. She\u2019s going to see her bill passed today, and the bill has a good foundation in what is seeks to achieve.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000155\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f7fc7ac3-5ce1-43ca-8cd6-dbb0941bf3ae\u0022\u003EWhat it really does is it puts into law the processes that Corrections certainly endeavour to implement anyway, and that\u2019s a good thing, because Corrections should be required to protect victims from unwanted contact from offenders, indeed any offender. So, good on you. We do know that Corrections doesn\u2019t have a great record of doing what they\u2019re legally obliged to do. I hope the member will keep tabs on what\u2019s happening. I know we talked about having some record-keeping, but certainly I know, on this side of the House, we intend to ask some questions to make sure that they\u2019re keeping up.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000156\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f7fc7ac3-5ce1-43ca-8cd6-dbb0941bf3ae\u0022\u003EThis is part of a wider project, and the member just spoke about the stalking bill. Ginny Andersen put a stalking bill into the ballot and prompted the Government to accelerate work on stalking. That\u2019s also a really important aspect, and not unrelated to the current bill, which is about unwanted contact and, essentially, taking vulnerable people and revictimising them. In our last term, we tripled the amount of support for the victims\u2019 assistance scheme and doubled the level of funding for Victim Support.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000157\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f7fc7ac3-5ce1-43ca-8cd6-dbb0941bf3ae\u0022\u003EI\u2019ve spoken to Victim Support and they do struggle. They do a fantastic job with very limited resources, given the number of victims they do assist. I hope that not only will we put in law these existing practices for Corrections, but we\u2019ll also make sure that funding keeps up with demand in terms of victims.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000158\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f7fc7ac3-5ce1-43ca-8cd6-dbb0941bf3ae\u0022\u003EThat\u2019s probably all I really need to say. I congratulate the member. She is an advocate for victims. I\u2019m always happy to talk about how we can do better there in a cross-party way. Let\u2019s keep tabs on Corrections and make sure they live up to their promises. I know the officials worked hard and were very cooperative in making a workable piece of legislation, but what really matters is how it works on the ground, and we\u2019ll need to keep tabs on that. Let\u2019s continue to work together, both to reduce the number of victims\u2014how we do that, I think, we\u2019ll have some discussions about\u2014and in terms of supporting people who are victims, and making sure that we can give them the best path out of a pretty horrible situation is something we all agree on. Kia ora. Thank you, Mr Speaker.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002289809535-e289-43e8-ad08-668cf3046ffb\u0022 data-id=\u002220a32a6d757845e59a81cf26aa82bd6b\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000159\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002289809535-e289-43e8-ad08-668cf3046ffb\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002220a32a6d757845e59a81cf26aa82bd6b\u0022\u003ECAMERON BREWER (National\u2014Upper Harbour):\u003C/span\u003E It\u2019s great that members across the House are supporting this third reading of the Corrections (Victim Protection) Amendment Bill. Like others, I just want to acknowledge its sponsor, Rima Nakhle, and all the work that she continues to do around advocating for victims.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000160\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002289809535-e289-43e8-ad08-668cf3046ffb\u0022\u003EI just want to reflect on what she said in her second reading speech, as the sponsor: \u201CThis bill at its core is about victims. I don\u2019t shy away from the fact that victims and protecting victims plays a huge role in the course and the direction of my actions and my thoughts, especially having the privilege of being a member of Parliament.\u201D And, as Grant McCallum so eloquently said, that is one of the privileges of being a member of Parliament: the ability to actually submit legislation under one\u2019s name into the biscuit tin, into the members\u2019 ballot, and then for it to be drawn out\u2014a fantastic way for Rima Nakhle to finish up this year, particularly when you consider, I think, the first day of this year, she gave a fabulous maiden speech. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000161\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002289809535-e289-43e8-ad08-668cf3046ffb\u0022\u003EOn 1 February, her member\u2019s bill, this member\u2019s bill, was drawn from the ballot\u2014and so a great year for the member, and good news for the victims has just been added again today. The first reading was on 20 March. Just to go back on some of the process here: drawn on 1 February; first reading, 20\u00A0March; submissions between 6 April and 6 May. Twelve submissions were made.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000162\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002289809535-e289-43e8-ad08-668cf3046ffb\u0022\u003ERima Nakhle has also noted that she would have liked the restrictions around contact and protecting victims to have applied to people who are under the care of Corrections out in the community. I note that the Department of Corrections controls or supervises, looking at our committee report-back, 26,000 people in the community\u201426,000 people in the community that Corrections controls or supervises\u2014as well as approximately 9,500 prisoners serving sentences inside prisons.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000163\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002289809535-e289-43e8-ad08-668cf3046ffb\u0022\u003ENow, while this legislation doesn\u2019t extend directly to those who are serving their community sentences or under the supervision of Corrections, Ms Nakhle none the less made sure that the expectation was in the commentary of the select committee. I put it out\u2014page 2 of the select committee\u2019s report back\u2014the commentary: \u201CWe request that the relevant agencies continue to monitor the safeguards available to serve the protection of victims where offenders are serving community-based sentences, orders, and parole.\u201D\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000164\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002289809535-e289-43e8-ad08-668cf3046ffb\u0022\u003EThat message has been sent to Corrections. They have willingly listened and heard, and they will subsequently continue to monitor and to report back on the safeguards available to protect those victims where their offenders are serving community-based sentences. That is now in the select committee report. It hasn\u2019t quite been put into the statute, but what that means is that there is an expectation that, when Corrections comes through\u2014whether it\u2019s for Estimates or annual reviews, or for any presentations to the likes of the Justice Committee\u2014we can raise legitimately, and future Parliaments can raise, \u201CWhat are you doing to ensure that the safeguards available are protecting the victims of those offenders who remain in the community?\u201D That was a win\u2014that was definitely a win.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000165\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002289809535-e289-43e8-ad08-668cf3046ffb\u0022\u003EI think Ms Nakhle\u2014why don\u2019t we call her \u201CMrs Nakhle\u201D, because we\u2019ve got Mr Nakhle here, as has been noted: Roger Nakhle. I actually want just to digress a little bit, Mr Speaker, with your indulgence on the eve of the break-up for Christmas, that the Nakhle family understands the needs of the community, particularly pertaining to South Auckland, more than most. I want to acknowledge Rima and Roger\u2019s work in emergency and transitional housing. I also want to acknowledge Roger\u2019s family, Roger\u2019s parents, for the contribution that they have made\u2014and I\u2019m almost getting old enough to look back on last century\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000166\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ef094bb1-be4f-48b8-bb53-52ce955a1c2d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022acce62c706f84a179b78a9074c860f90\u0022\u003EJames Meager\u003C/span\u003E: No!\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000167\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002289809535-e289-43e8-ad08-668cf3046ffb\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002228bf232e2cb44372890d50c219cd45c1\u0022\u003ECAMERON BREWER\u003C/span\u003E: \u2014despite appearances, Mr Meager; I know that\u2019s what you\u2019re saying\u2014the contribution that they have made to the creation of Manukau City, now part of the Auckland Council area, that proud part of South Auckland, in building and creating that city and working alongside some greats, including Sir Barry Curtis. I want to acknowledge the Nakhle family, and to have that Nakhle name on this piece of legislation is very meaningful and very fitting. Congratulations.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000168\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002289809535-e289-43e8-ad08-668cf3046ffb\u0022\u003EAnother win that we mustn\u2019t overlook\u2014we\u2019ve got Corrections pinned down as far as ensuring the safeguards are available and monitored for those who are serving sentences outside of prison\u2014inside, as the statute now prescribes, Mrs Nakhle has ensured that \u201Cmust\u201D has replaced \u201Cmay\u201D. As we know in legislation, words count. \u201CMust\u201D now replaces \u201Cmay\u201D, which is a major, major victory for victims across New Zealand going forward. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000169\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002289809535-e289-43e8-ad08-668cf3046ffb\u0022\u003EIn saying that, if we look at new section 77(5A)\u2014\u201CIn deciding what conditions (if any) to impose, the chief executive or the Commissioner of Police must take into account the interests of victims\u201D\u2014Rima Nakhle has managed to get that word in. That\u2019s no easy task, to change statute from \u201Cmay\u201D to \u201Cmust\u201D\u2014the word \u201Cmust\u201D, \u201Cmust take into account\u201D, as opposed to \u201Cmay take into account the interests of victims\u201D. Subsequently, victims, their lawyers, their families, their friends, their loved ones, their supporters, and their wh\u0101nau can say, \u201CThey have to do this. They must do this. It\u2019s in the law of the land.\u201D Congratulations to Rima Nakhle on that.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000170\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002289809535-e289-43e8-ad08-668cf3046ffb\u0022\u003EAgain, for those that might have tuned in latterly and wondered what we\u2019re talking about, this bill, the Corrections (Victim Protection) Amendment Bill, aims to protect victims of crime and people under a protection order from unwanted contact from prisons. It amends the 2004 Corrections Act by creating an obligation. It\u2019s a \u201Cmust\u201D obligation; it\u2019s not a \u201Cmay\u201D obligation. We know that, in the Public Service, words count as to how they interpret legislation, too. \u201CMay\u201D is a lot different than \u201Cmust\u201D, and so \u201Cmust\u201D is now in the statute. That is a huge advancement for victims nationwide.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000171\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002289809535-e289-43e8-ad08-668cf3046ffb\u0022\u003EI just wind up on a sobering note: there are a lot of incidents that we can point to where victims have been terrorised by their offenders. I go back to one victim, that the New Zealand Herald repeated a few years ago, of an unprovoked, gratuitous, and prolonged severe beating, and their offender made 102 phone calls from prison to that victim\u2014to that victim\u2014in a desperate bid to prevent that victim from testifying against him. The victim\u2019s number was on an approved call list of recipients. In July of that year, the offender urged the victim repeatedly to evade police and to not testify. The victim subsequently started not turning up for trials and not turning up to court. It just prolonged it. He also got another inmate to call and terrorise the victim.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000172\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002289809535-e289-43e8-ad08-668cf3046ffb\u0022\u003EThere are some shocking, shocking cases of victims that have been traumatised by unwanted contact and calls from offenders from prison. This puts an obligation on the chief executives to do a lot better. They must now ensure protections are in place for victims. I commend the bill.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022471dee54-f59e-4497-b3d3-c39044ce7169\u0022 data-id=\u002241cd43e1b9e14f13a910bc88939fac5d\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000173\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022471dee54-f59e-4497-b3d3-c39044ce7169\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002241cd43e1b9e14f13a910bc88939fac5d\u0022\u003EHon DAMIEN O\u2019CONNOR (Labour):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Mr Speaker. While not being on the Justice Committee and not having been directly involved, I have, as the previous Minister of Corrections, some awareness of the situation. We are all in this House, of course, mindful of the need to protect victims across this country, and they come in many shapes and sizes and forms. In this bill, of course, they are obvious: they are people who do not want to be contacted. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000174\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022471dee54-f59e-4497-b3d3-c39044ce7169\u0022\u003EI\u2019d like to congratulate the member Rima Nakhle. Luck is useful in the biscuit tin, but it\u2019s good to have a bill pulled out that will make a difference. The effect of the bill and the changes made in the select committee have been well canvassed here.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000175\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022471dee54-f59e-4497-b3d3-c39044ce7169\u0022\u003EI\u2019d just like to add in another obligation that, as Minister, I had to remind the chief executive of at the time, and that is that of course the Department of Corrections have an obligation to protect society from people who might want to do us harm or who have caused harm to others, but there is also an obligation to have rehabilitation\u2014that is, to reduce reoffending. What we do know is that, without proper opportunities for rehabilitation while under the control of Corrections, the chances of reoffending and victimisation will continue, and while this order here in this piece of legislation clearly ups the obligation, I\u2019m not sure that we could say that it will prevent it without those offenders actually understanding why they shouldn\u2019t do this. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000176\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022471dee54-f59e-4497-b3d3-c39044ce7169\u0022\u003EI know that that might sound a little idealistic, but Corrections will have control over the prisoners, over people who are serving sentences, for only so long. Beyond that, ultimately, it\u2019s our ability to turn around the minds of those offenders, to have them understand how the offences occurred, and why they must change their ways. That is possible through proper sentencing and through proper custodial protection and oversight that prevents them, through this bill, contacting victims\u2014and we know that that\u2019s the right thing to do\u2014but, ultimately, long-term protection for those victims will only occur when rehabilitation has taken place or those offenders have understood the error of their ways. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000177\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022471dee54-f59e-4497-b3d3-c39044ce7169\u0022\u003EI\u2019ll just say congratulations to the member for her bill. As was said before by a previous speaker, changing \u201Cmay\u201D to \u201Cmust\u201D might seem like a somewhat insignificant change, but we know, as lawmakers in this House, that it does change the way that the law is implemented. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000178\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022471dee54-f59e-4497-b3d3-c39044ce7169\u0022\u003ELook, it\u2019s a good step forward. It will better protect those victims who don\u2019t want contact from the offender and they feel threatened by that for whatever reason, but also it is a reminder to the police and others who are implementing protection orders that they have to follow through on those things, as well. Victims won\u2019t be secure by this piece of legislation alone; it will require a cross-agency focus to protect the victims. I\u2019ll repeat once more that, actually, rehabilitation is ultimately the only long-term way of securing victims\u2019 rights, their security, and their peace of mind. I support\u2014as the Labour Party does, of course\u2014the passage of this bill through the House. Kia ora. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00222837c142-c937-468e-9984-bc646d066687\u0022 data-id=\u00226f2a90f659374676953340c8a7438623\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000179\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00222837c142-c937-468e-9984-bc646d066687\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00226f2a90f659374676953340c8a7438623\u0022\u003EDr HAMISH CAMPBELL (National\u2014Ilam):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Mr Speaker. I rise to speak in support of this great bill\u2014of course, the Corrections (Victim Protection) Amendment Bill\u2014in the third reading. Like many other speakers, I would like to acknowledge my great colleague Rima Nakhle for all her work in shepherding this bill through the House. It has already been talked about how wonderful a local MP she is with really great connections with the community and really understanding the needs of her community. I do want not just to acknowledge her work in the House but also acknowledge her work in her local electorate as well.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000180\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00222837c142-c937-468e-9984-bc646d066687\u0022\u003ERima talked to me and some of my colleagues last night about the purpose of this bill, and I think it really is very clear that this bill aims to protect the victims of crime and people under a protection order from unwanted contact from prisoners. It will amend the Corrections Act 2004 by creating an obligation on the chief executive to implement processes to protect victims from unwanted contact. Really, what I\u2019d add to that is I think this bill is really just a common-sense process for victims, because no one chooses to be a victim. A victim has no choice in that at all, and this bill, of course, seeks to prevent that repeated victimisation from perpetrators. I think we can all imagine the mental health effects that unwanted contact would have in retraumatising some of these victims.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000181\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00222837c142-c937-468e-9984-bc646d066687\u0022\u003EWe make no apologies about focusing on victims and their safety. Victims should be able to feel safe when the offenders are in prison. I do just want to kind of touch on some of the stories that we\u2019ve heard and that have been in the media. The New Zealand Herald, in the start of 2018, reported on a prisoner who contacted his victims 93 times to get her to change her stories. He was a paedophile who wrote to a victim, who was then in her 20s, from prison. The victim had just made the comment that that made her feel unsafe and dirty. I just want to acknowledge the effect that these sorts of events have. Of course, the National Party MP Louise Upston, at the time, said that it was sickening that the prisoner would be able to contact the victim, who would have been retraumatised. I think we can all imagine what impact that would have.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000182\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00222837c142-c937-468e-9984-bc646d066687\u0022\u003EA victim advocate Ruth Money said that, when victims are first contacted by prisoners, they were often shocked, then scared. I think the general public would probably be quite surprised that this bill isn\u2019t already part of our rules and regulations. I think probably most of the general public would think that, once someone\u2019s in prison, they wouldn\u2019t be able to contact their victims, but, unfortunately, that\u2019s not the case. We\u2019re lucky to have Rima to actually kind of fix that problem.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000183\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00222837c142-c937-468e-9984-bc646d066687\u0022\u003EOf course, one of the previous speakers spoke about a man that was contacted from jail more than 100 times to try and get the victim to not give evidence at his trial. That victim had been severely beaten. The beating had gone on for about 15 minutes in a whole series of punches and kicks that led to quite considerable damage and physical injury. Of course, that perpetrator was busy trying to really harass this victim to get them to not go to court. That ended up dragging that process out. Of course, we know that court proceedings, hopefully, can bring closure to some of these victims so they can move on with their lives, and if we don\u2019t have this measure in place, that will just drag that out. It\u2019s really just a basic intimidation tactic which we need to stamp out.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000184\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00222837c142-c937-468e-9984-bc646d066687\u0022\u003EI would also like to actually, just in the closing time that I have, reference our further proposed legislation changes to the crime legislation around stalking and harassment. That\u2019s gone through its first reading, and it\u2019s with the hard-working Justice Committee. I do believe this is one of 28 bills that they have considered this term\u2014the chairperson is indicating even higher\u2014and I just want to acknowledge all the hard work they do. Time\u2019s up, but I do just want to commend this bill to the House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022f5d71749-ae91-4af7-b2bd-77260398912a\u0022 data-id=\u00229e24f50e3d8b4728a0b07f15fabe6667\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000185\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f5d71749-ae91-4af7-b2bd-77260398912a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00229e24f50e3d8b4728a0b07f15fabe6667\u0022\u003EHon DAVID PARKER (Labour):\u003C/span\u003E As has been said by earlier speakers on behalf of the New Zealand Labour Party, we are supporting this bill. I congratulate Rima Nakhle for her work on it, and I have nothing further to add.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022ef094bb1-be4f-48b8-bb53-52ce955a1c2d\u0022 data-id=\u00221e7828e521f5456ea4c05c7be22c52af\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000186\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ef094bb1-be4f-48b8-bb53-52ce955a1c2d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00221e7828e521f5456ea4c05c7be22c52af\u0022\u003EJAMES MEAGER (National\u2014Rangitata):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you to Mr Parker for paving the way for a slightly long contribution towards the end of this debate. Look, Mr Speaker, with your indulgences, I\u2019d just like to start with a short public service announcement. I\u2019d just like to wish a big congratulations to a Miss Sophie Wedd for winning the Hawke\u2019s Bay tennis open under-16s competition. I\u2019m aware a relative of Miss Wedd is in the House today, but I don\u2019t want to have her have to ad hoc amend her potential speech in the next bill and put her under a bit of pressure, so I just wanted to wish Sophie a big congratulations from everyone in the House, I\u2019m sure.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000187\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ef094bb1-be4f-48b8-bb53-52ce955a1c2d\u0022\u003EWell, back to the bill at hand. It\u2019s been said many times today, and I\u2019ll say it again: a huge congratulations to, and I\u2019m very proud to support the bill in the name of, Mrs Rima Nakhle. Rima\u2014Mrs Nakhle; I can\u2019t refer to you by your first name. Mrs Nakhle is, I think, undoubtedly one of the strongest\u2014if not the strongest\u2014supporters and advocates of victims in this House. There was a comment mentioned before by Mrs Nakhle that the chair of the Justice Committee may have had a significant amount of patience with her queries throughout this process. I can reassure the member that her queries, compared to some other queries we receive on the Justice Committee, were incredibly polite and very straightforward to handle. I welcome those queries because they ended up producing a bill that\u2019s come to us now actually much stronger than what it was when it went into the select committee process.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000188\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ef094bb1-be4f-48b8-bb53-52ce955a1c2d\u0022\u003EI\u2019ll traverse some of the reasons why some people may think that the bill didn\u2019t achieve what it originally intended to set out to achieve in terms of protecting all victims of offences from all potential offenders in prison and in our community, but, actually, what\u2019s happened through Mrs Nakhle\u2019s dogged determination and advocacy is that we have a bill which has been significantly strengthened through three key provisions, which I\u2019ll touch on later on.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000189\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ef094bb1-be4f-48b8-bb53-52ce955a1c2d\u0022\u003EI want to move to the change from the bill as introduced to where we are now in terms of what we\u2019re going to be passing in the House over the next few minutes. The main change has been, of course, and members have touched on it, that the bill as introduced purported to try and prevent or place an obligation on Corrections to protect all victims of offences from any unwanted contacts from all individuals under the control or supervision of Corrections. We heard from Corrections throughout the process that, as much as they would be keen to do this and as much as they try to protect victims to the extent that they can, given that they monitor and supervise over 26,000 individuals in our community and over 9,000 inside the prison system, it is just the sad, sad reality of the state of our nation that we are not able to do that; we are not able to offer that protection.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000190\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ef094bb1-be4f-48b8-bb53-52ce955a1c2d\u0022\u003EWhat we can do through this bill, and one of the changes that has been made to this bill and advocated for by Mrs Nakhle, is to provide an obligation on Corrections to inform recipients of contact, or recipients of communication, from prisoners inside the prison system of their rights, of their ability to prevent unwanted contact. Actually, that change is going to make a significant difference. It provides the impetus for Corrections to do more of what they already do. Corrections already have the ability to limit contact\u2014unwanted contact\u2014by prisoners to victims, or to anyone, actually, whether that\u2019s mandated through the court or whether that is contacted to Corrections through non-contact orders. They have the ability, at the moment, to mark on outgoing mail some of the options for victims, in terms of, \u201CIf you do not wish to receive mail from this prisoner, please contact Corrections. We can place you on a non-contact list.\u201D\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000191\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ef094bb1-be4f-48b8-bb53-52ce955a1c2d\u0022\u003EWhat they don\u2019t do at the moment is do this through the telephone service. One of the changes that this bill will hopefully introduce, and one of the reasons why there needs to be some time for it to come into force, is that Corrections can look at what automated messages they can put in the telephone system so that, before calls are made, victims are made aware, or recipients of contact\u2014because it\u2019s not necessarily just the victims of offences; it may well be their relatives, it may well be people associated with those victims that prisoners are trying to reach. They will be made aware of the options that are available to them to prevent any future contact. That is a significant step and a significant improvement and enhancement to the legislation as introduced.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000192\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ef094bb1-be4f-48b8-bb53-52ce955a1c2d\u0022\u003EThe second thing that the legislation has done to strengthen it is to actually create a new offence of undertaking unwanted contact. Essentially, where a prisoner attempts to make contact or solicits contact with an individual who they know, or ought reasonably to know, does not wish to be contacted or has a non-contact order in place, that will be an offence under this Act. That is a significant step as well, because that creates, or that provides, some of the teeth, some of the muscle behind the bill so that Corrections actually has some way of enforcing some of these actions. We heard before of examples from many members in the House of hundreds and hundreds of communications by prisoners towards people who did not want them. Corrections, try as they may to put the systems and filters in place, had no ability to deter individuals inside the prison system from doing so.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000193\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ef094bb1-be4f-48b8-bb53-52ce955a1c2d\u0022\u003EIn fact, the departmental report is a very helpful read and is full of a very significant amount of information provided by Corrections as to the limits that they have on their ability to stop this kind of stuff from happening. I draw the House\u2019s attention to paragraphs 40 and 41 and 42 of the report, where Corrections themselves admit there are still instances where contact is occurring where it should not be, and where prisoners are able to bypass non-contact orders and use others outside of the system to have contact with their victims or with associates of victims. This new offence provision will not only put an obligation on Corrections to prevent that or create an offence for the individuals themselves, but to create that, too, for others who are being solicited to contact.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000194\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ef094bb1-be4f-48b8-bb53-52ce955a1c2d\u0022\u003EThe third thing the bill does to significantly strengthen it is it creates an obligation on Corrections to take into account the interests of victims when placing conditions on outgoing calls and outgoing communication. I think that\u2019s an important step to take.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000195\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ef094bb1-be4f-48b8-bb53-52ce955a1c2d\u0022\u003EAs we know, Mrs Nakhle is a strong advocate for victims. In fact, throughout the select committee process, it may\u2014if any member or any member of the public ever tuned into the public hearings part of our deliberations in our consideration of bills and you see Mrs Nakhle take a question, often those questions will be to challenge some of the assertions made by academics or made by experts or even made by community organisations about the impact of legislation on the justice system. Without a doubt, the vast majority, if not all, of those interjections are often focused, or indeed always focused, on considering whether or not that individual submitter had considered the rights of the victims and the interests of the victims when making those submissions. That may be uncomfortable for some people to see when submitters are challenged on some of their assertions, but I think Mrs Nakhle takes no trouble at all, and it does not bother her at all, to put her views forward and to make sure that the rights of victims are placed on the record as well.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000196\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ef094bb1-be4f-48b8-bb53-52ce955a1c2d\u0022\u003EPlacing this obligation to take victims interests into account will mean that when Corrections are placing conditions on outgoing communications and outgoing calls, they will be able to put the victims\u2019 interests into that. It may mean that they are a bit tougher and they are a bit stricter on what does leave the prison system.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000197\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ef094bb1-be4f-48b8-bb53-52ce955a1c2d\u0022\u003EI want to acknowledge the work of Corrections. When they worked through this bill with us, they were very upfront and very open about what they could or could not do. Again, I refer back to the departmental report. If members go towards the sort of question and answer section of the departmental report, you can see, in paragraph 106, that Corrections estimate they receive or process around about 400,000 pieces of mail every year. That\u2019s just physical mail. That indicates the type of challenges that they are undertaking. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000198\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ef094bb1-be4f-48b8-bb53-52ce955a1c2d\u0022\u003ENow, they open and screen every single piece of mail, and they do their best to make sure that that mail is appropriate and there is nothing in there which should be prevented from going through, in or out, but they do acknowledge that not all pieces of mail are actually counted in that figure, so the figure could indeed be higher. In terms of what Corrections can do at the moment, there are systems in place, but this bill will certainly go some way to providing extra impetus and extra encouragement and actual obligations on the corrections system to do so.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000199\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ef094bb1-be4f-48b8-bb53-52ce955a1c2d\u0022\u003EFinally, I will draw the House\u2019s attention, and the attention of all members of the public, to looking forward to what we can do to continue to improve how we approach the justice sector. We\u2019ve got a hearing, I think later on in March, with heads of departments of the justice sector in terms of the pipeline approach to the criminal justice system. Some of the problematic examples or issues we heard from Corrections as to why they may not be able to implement the full force of the bill have to do with simple things such as victims of protection orders. It turns out that there is no good system in place for Corrections to know who is or is not subject to a protection order. There were questions raised about whether or not the Government\u2019s digitisation process Te Au Reka would improve that. At the moment, there is a limited ability for that process to improve these issues.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000200\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ef094bb1-be4f-48b8-bb53-52ce955a1c2d\u0022\u003EThroughout that, I think there is something for all members of the House to turn their minds to as to how do we continue to improve the criminal justice system to make sure that there are fewer victims of crime. Of course, it\u2019s one thing for Corrections to be dealing with prisoners and offenders and the rights of victims in the prison system, but we\u2019ve got to look at what happens when those offenders are released in to the public, and of course the pipeline coming in.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000201\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ef094bb1-be4f-48b8-bb53-52ce955a1c2d\u0022\u003EWith that, I\u2019m very proud of my big sister Mrs Nakhle. She should be very proud of her support in the room. I know we won\u2019t be getting any texts from Mr Nakhle today because he\u2019s in the gallery\u2014he won\u2019t be able to. I commend Rima, I congratulate her, and I commend the bill to the House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00228ba11b3f-65ea-4f86-92e4-fe78ea522647\u0022 data-id=\u0022cdb61f4b3ef84bc1b23f18f4ca183489\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000202\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00228ba11b3f-65ea-4f86-92e4-fe78ea522647\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022cdb61f4b3ef84bc1b23f18f4ca183489\u0022\u003EDANA KIRKPATRICK (National\u2014East Coast):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Mr Speaker. Look, I just rise to take the last and final call on this auspicious day in the third reading of the bill for my colleague, the wonderful MP for Takanini, Rima Nakhle. It\u2019s a great day for victims of crime in New Zealand, thanks to the admirable and hard work that the member has done to bring this bill through the very long and enduring committee of the whole House stage and through the three readings and the Justice Committee.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000203\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00228ba11b3f-65ea-4f86-92e4-fe78ea522647\u0022\u003EIf there\u2019s anything we can do in New Zealand to protect and support our victims, we should do that. The work that Rima has done, or that the member for Takanini has done, with the support, of course, of her greatest supporter, Roger, in the gallery, is to be a loud voice and advocate for victims in New Zealand. We are absolutely proud of our colleague. We 100 percent support her and the work that she has done in this space, and I congratulate the member for her hard work and her admirable dedication to the cause.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000204\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00228ba11b3f-65ea-4f86-92e4-fe78ea522647\u0022\u003EIt is my absolute pleasure to be the last and final in this debate to commend the bill to the House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000205\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00228ba11b3f-65ea-4f86-92e4-fe78ea522647\u0022\u003EMotion agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000206\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00228ba11b3f-65ea-4f86-92e4-fe78ea522647\u0022\u003EBill read a third time.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n    \u003C/div\u003E\n    \u003Cdiv class=\u0022HpsHansard\u0022\u003E\n      \u003Cp\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsProceedingHeading\u0022\u003EBills\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000207\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u002276d6cbd7780049fab7c279b2111da251\u0022\u003EPae Ora (Healthy Futures) (3 Day Postnatal Stay) Amendment Bill\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000208\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u0022fa91959e6d974131b6404eb73f4fdb6a\u0022\u003EFirst Reading\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022a00bf4f5-c63a-49a0-b0e1-d3b37311377b\u0022 data-id=\u00225a5663743c7a422c859c3c14e9adf711\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000209\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a00bf4f5-c63a-49a0-b0e1-d3b37311377b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00225a5663743c7a422c859c3c14e9adf711\u0022\u003ECATHERINE WEDD (National\u2014Tukituki):\u003C/span\u003E I move that the Pae Ora (Healthy Futures) (3 Day Postnatal Stay) Amendment Bill be now read for a first time. I\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000210\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002202e74c40-9529-4e15-adc2-c032eadc2205\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a62336d08a7b4ea69d493daa8b2aa724\u0022\u003EASSISTANT SPEAKER (Greg O\u2019Connor)\u003C/span\u003E: Catherine Wedd.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000211\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a00bf4f5-c63a-49a0-b0e1-d3b37311377b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022801795aa2dd44ed78a5b383eb35351f8\u0022\u003ECATHERINE WEDD\u003C/span\u003E: Ha!\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000212\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002202e74c40-9529-4e15-adc2-c032eadc2205\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002219734a4b9cf04323a82a3a700de9679f\u0022\u003EASSISTANT SPEAKER (Greg O\u2019Connor)\u003C/span\u003E: There\u2019s a reason why\u2014the call is to alert those in the communications to who is speaking. That is why that\u2019s done. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000213\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a00bf4f5-c63a-49a0-b0e1-d3b37311377b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00223687cbc0934c4e31abadf315858f6380\u0022\u003ECATHERINE WEDD\u003C/span\u003E: Thank you, Mr Speaker. I move, That the Pae Ora (Healthy Futures) (3 Day Postnatal Stay) Amendment Bill be now read a first time. I nominate the Health Committee to consider the bill.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000214\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a00bf4f5-c63a-49a0-b0e1-d3b37311377b\u0022\u003EThe Pae Ora (Healthy Futures) (3 Day Postnatal Stay) Amendment Bill is about providing mums with greater protection and support after having a baby. This bill will enable them to receive a minimum of three days\u2019 post-natal care if they need it. It also requires the lead maternity carer to let the mother know that she is eligible to stay for 72 hours.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000215\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a00bf4f5-c63a-49a0-b0e1-d3b37311377b\u0022\u003EIn this first reading of the bill, I would like to acknowledge the Hon Louise Upston, who put this bill into the members\u2019 tin five years ago, following a petition and the advocacy of Chloe Wright, who worked hard to put the spotlight on post-natal care and highlight the insufficiencies with post-natal care in New Zealand. She was a fierce warrior advocate for post-natal care. The three-day post-natal stay bill happened with Chloe\u2019s advocacy. Chloe Wright stood up and said, \u201CMothers matter.\u201D She didn\u2019t just stand up and say, \u201CMothers matter.\u201D; she shouted it. Today, we stand up in this House and say, \u201CMothers matter.\u201D\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000216\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a00bf4f5-c63a-49a0-b0e1-d3b37311377b\u0022\u003EI am proud to stand up for this bill, because it will positively impact mothers and families across New Zealand. It will support and protect mums and families by helping us provide better post-natal support. One of the most stressful experiences for a new mum is making sure that you can care for your newborn baby while also processing all the information being given to you by your midwife and by your nurses. This bill will give mums more time to bond with their babies in those crucial first days. Women are currently not making informed choices about post-natal care, which is critical to ensure that mothers can form a loving attachment with their newborn baby. Women are currently entitled to up to 48 hours of funded in-patient post-natal care, but many don\u2019t realise this and are pressured to leave early. Giving mothers this extra time and extra flexibility will result in positive outcomes for mum, baby, and their family, with three days in a supportive environment and a dedicated facility, if they wish, to have this post-natal care provided.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000217\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a00bf4f5-c63a-49a0-b0e1-d3b37311377b\u0022\u003EAs a mother of four children myself, and having experienced a traumatic first birth, I understand how important those first few days are after having a baby. I want to make sure\u00A0that all new mothers can have access to the post-natal support that they need. The bill gives more choice. Every situation is different. Every birth is different, and the level of protection and support will differ in individual cases. As mums will know, it\u2019s so unpredictable what your experience is going to be like. This bill is about ensuring women have the access to essential post-natal care whatever their situation. Those first hours and days with your newborn baby are critical for the ongoing bond that you form with your baby. Mums should\u00A0have that time if they need it. Having a newborn baby is the most special moment of your life. A new mum will go through so much emotion as well as having to learn so\u00A0much about everything, when you know nothing, from breastfeeding, sleeping, changing nappies, wrapping babies, sterilising bottles, dealing with fatigue, expressing milk, bathing\u2014the list is endless; it can be so overwhelming.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000218\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a00bf4f5-c63a-49a0-b0e1-d3b37311377b\u0022\u003EOn this day exactly 14 years ago, I was about to give birth to my first child\u2014an anxious but exciting time for any new mum. The journey of having your first baby should be incredibly special and something you remember for ever. I remember finding out I was having a baby. We were just so thrilled and excited. I booked into the antenatal classes, and my husband and I planned our birth. We had our birth plan sorted with our midwife\u2014dim lights, a water bath, soothing music, and then the magical skin to skin. This was the\u00A0plan, so we certainly were not prepared for the reality of what actually happened. The\u00A0pain of those contractions, our baby getting stuck; doctors, specialists, nurses, all in the room; the horror, the emotion of not knowing whether you were going to survive or your baby was going to survive; the pain of waiting for your baby\u2019s first cry, the pain of having your baby whisked away off to SCBU, the special care baby unit; the emptiness you felt as a new mum\u2014exhausted, emotional, and without your baby. Then, not knowing our rights, we felt vulnerable and scared.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000219\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a00bf4f5-c63a-49a0-b0e1-d3b37311377b\u0022\u003EYou shouldn\u2019t have to fight the system. If it wasn\u2019t for our amazing midwife, our story could have been different. Thank you to our midwife for fighting in our corner. We stayed, we were cared for, and my baby girl turns 14 tomorrow, but the end story is not always a happy one. Thank you to all the amazing midwives who bring so many precious lives into our world every day. This bill is about providing a tool and legal rights for mums, midwives, and our families. A birth may have gone really well and a mum may be ready to leave hospital straight away, and that\u2019s their choice, but for many mums, they need extra support, especially those first-time mums who don\u2019t know any better. This bill requires the lead maternity carer to let the mother know what she is eligible for, because mums need to know that there is care available. Giving mums this extra time and extra flexibility will result in positive outcomes for mother, baby, and families.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000220\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a00bf4f5-c63a-49a0-b0e1-d3b37311377b\u0022\u003EThis bill is about standing up for parents who should have a right to enjoy one of the most\u00A0special moments of their life. This bill will give many mums better protection and support. I acknowledge that our health system is under pressure. I visited our maternity units, our midwives, and experts in the area of post-natal care, and I have listened: we need to improve. Workforce is also a big part of this: to provide this extra resourcing. It\u2019s pleasing to see our midwife shortage improving, with the most recent statistics from Health New Zealand showing we have an increase of 97 fulltime-equivalent midwives compared to this time last year. It\u2019s improved, but we acknowledge there is still a lot of work to do.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000221\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a00bf4f5-c63a-49a0-b0e1-d3b37311377b\u0022\u003EThis bill is about prioritising post-natal care and the funding available for it. Mums will never get that time back, and there is ongoing risk if we don\u2019t give new mums the support that they need. Already I\u2019ve been connecting with various women\u2019s, family, and birthing groups, as well as midwives and maternity units across the country. The bill is receiving a lot of support from many people across the motu who know we must do better in post-natal care. We must provide our mums and babies with better post-natal care.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000222\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a00bf4f5-c63a-49a0-b0e1-d3b37311377b\u0022\u003EHaving public select committee hearings will enable us to put the spotlight on post-natal\u00A0care in New Zealand, it will enable us to raise any concerns, and it will provide the opportunity for those who want to share their stories. I encourage people to submit to the Health Committee, and I look forward to these submissions as we work to improve post-natal care in New Zealand.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000223\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a00bf4f5-c63a-49a0-b0e1-d3b37311377b\u0022\u003EWe owe all mothers and babies across our country this opportunity. The first 1,000 days of a baby\u2019s life are critical; the first three days of a baby\u2019s life are fundamental. Today is about standing up for mothers and families across New Zealand and protecting and supporting our most vulnerable newborn babies. I commend this bill to the House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002261720d2e-5b1d-4742-b4f0-30424316ccc1\u0022 data-id=\u00224e55280be9494794bec8d4402263da70\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000224\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002261720d2e-5b1d-4742-b4f0-30424316ccc1\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00224e55280be9494794bec8d4402263da70\u0022\u003EDEPUTY SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: The question is that the motion be agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022aed260be-c954-464b-bb75-85579e53d05a\u0022 data-id=\u0022a74824f9e50c473c8ad514874e8a2fc3\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000225\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aed260be-c954-464b-bb75-85579e53d05a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022a74824f9e50c473c8ad514874e8a2fc3\u0022\u003EHon Dr AYESHA VERRALL (Labour):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Madam Speaker. Congratulations, the Pae Ora (Healthy Futures) (3 Day Postnatal Stay) Amendment Bill has been born from the ballot. Congratulations to the member. After a long gestation of five years, as has been noted, we get to debate this bill. Just like we happily greet any new arrival to the world with congratulations, the Labour Party will be supporting this bill. After all, who would not agree to care for new mothers?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000226\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aed260be-c954-464b-bb75-85579e53d05a\u0022\u003EI\u2019m lucky to have my remarks on this bill grounded in my experience delivering babies. I think I\u2019ve probably delivered about a hundred babies, most of them in my mother\u2019s country, the Maldives, where I entertained an early career ambition of being an obstetrician, but that was not to be and I became an infectious diseases doctor instead. It was certainly a privilege to see new people come into the world, many of them, as it happens in the Maldives, called Ayesha, but other wonderful babies who weren\u2019t called Ayesha as well.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000227\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aed260be-c954-464b-bb75-85579e53d05a\u0022\u003EI do think that while we all want to do our best for mothers and babies and families across New Zealand\u2014all of us from all sides of the House want to achieve that\u2014there are ways in which this bill might be described by a midwife as light for its gestational age, because our worry on this side of the House is that it does not go far enough to achieve its stated aim. As the member Catherine Wedd has already stated, this bill changes the 48-hour entitlement to a 72-hour entitlement. In a sense, we might ask: what is the problem we are trying to fix with this bill and is the fix achieved by changing the entitlement from 48 hours to 72? I would argue that it is not, because that entitlement is not being particularly effective in making sure that people receive the care they need as it is. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000228\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aed260be-c954-464b-bb75-85579e53d05a\u0022\u003EThe fact is that there is a wide range of care that people need. Some people do not want to stay in hospital for longer. Others need to stay for a very long time\u2014say, if they are recovering from a particularly traumatic birth, and, in that case, these entitlements are not actually helping them. The underlying issue is the resourcing of our hospitals. Some need three days, four days, five days, and some people need two weeks because of their particular circumstances.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000229\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aed260be-c954-464b-bb75-85579e53d05a\u0022\u003EI want to draw members\u2019 attention to section 93D, in clause 5, which says that Health New Zealand must resource this commitment. This seems to me to be the biggest problem with this bill and one that we intend to return to both at the select committee and should this bill pass. As members already noted, the existing commitment is not adequately resourced, and that creates a worry for us on this side of the House that passing this bill is a hollow gesture, intended to signal commitment to the issues that mothers and their babies face but not actually changing the reality for them.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000230\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aed260be-c954-464b-bb75-85579e53d05a\u0022\u003EEarlier this year, it was reported that there was a national shortage of 330 hospital midwives. Addressing that would be a way in which we could materially impact the situation for mothers and babies. There have been delays to midwife exams, which means that midwives\u2019 passage into the workforce has been delayed, and there\u2019s been no sign of the improvements to midwife bonding that has been promised by the Government.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000231\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aed260be-c954-464b-bb75-85579e53d05a\u0022\u003EI\u2019m particularly disappointed that the efforts many women\u2019s health advocates made in the\u00A0last term of Government to submit to the Women\u2019s Health Strategy appear to have been papered over by this Government. The last answer I received from the Minister responsible for women\u2019s health, Casey Costello, in relation to a question on what is being done to implement the Women\u2019s Health Strategy, said, \u201CWell, now we have a Government policy statement.\u201D Members may not know that the Government policy statement mostly relates to five targets that the Government has set, none of which cover maternity. That is troubling in terms of the Government\u2019s commitment to wider women\u2019s health initiatives.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000232\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aed260be-c954-464b-bb75-85579e53d05a\u0022\u003EWith respect to this bill and my concern that this does not make a material commitment to improving care for women, I want to illustrate that those sorts of changes are possible. Under Labour, we passed historic pay equity settlements that raised wages for midwives to improve their retention in the hospital workforce. We had graduate midwives starting on $76,000, and senior midwives on $153,000. We had a programme for improving retention in midwifery training, because midwives often have to be able to, during their training, attend at all hours, meaning they face additional costs. The Te Ara \u014D Hine programme was intended to reduce attrition by 30 percent. Sadly, there is no mention it of it in the workforce plan released by this Government last week.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000233\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aed260be-c954-464b-bb75-85579e53d05a\u0022\u003EI was proud of my colleague Carmel Sepuloni who, as the Minister for ACC, passed legislation to make sure women suffering birth injuries were able to have those injuries covered by ACC. What a practical way to improve the care that women can receive. We also funded maternal mental health initiatives, which I\u2019m sure many of us recognise is an under-recognised area where we could do a lot more.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000234\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aed260be-c954-464b-bb75-85579e53d05a\u0022\u003EThere are meaningful things that can be done to make sure that new mothers and their babies get the care they need, but, sadly, that is not achieved through this bill. Were we to look to the future I think we could come up with better plans than what\u2019s contained in this bill. We could look at other ways of achieving post-natal care. We could think about innovative service provision, because women have commitments outside of hospital as well that they want to return to, which drives them to leave hospital while they still need support. And we could implement the recommendations of the Perinatal and Maternal Mortality Review Committee, which, for a number of years, has pointed to gaps in the safety systems in the maternity care system. Sadly, all of those issues are unaddressed by this bill.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000235\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aed260be-c954-464b-bb75-85579e53d05a\u0022\u003EI want to just point to the importance of some of these practical issues in achieving care for women with a report just out today about changes at Whakat\u0101ne Hospital. There\u2019s an obstetric unit there that cares for 650 mothers a year, and that unit is staffed by an obstetrician, so it provides specialist care. That unit is being downgraded to a primary maternity service, which is valuable but, clearly, would not be suitable for those requiring specialist care, so 650 women each year are losing access to specialist care. This is part of the cuts that this Government has put on the health system where we\u2019ve seen hiring freezes and staffing being scaled back, and many clinicians tell us that in peripheral hospitals they\u2019re not even allowed to escalate their vacancies to the regional chief executives in order to get them addressed.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000236\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aed260be-c954-464b-bb75-85579e53d05a\u0022\u003EThere are a number of ways in which the care for mothers could be improved, but it seems very difficult in a context of cuts and austerity in our health system, and I fear that this bill will not do enough to make a difference. It\u2019s all very easy to say we want to pass a bill supporting mothers, but then to not be able to deliver the resources to do that fundamentally undermines the effort the House is making. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000237\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aed260be-c954-464b-bb75-85579e53d05a\u0022\u003EI just want to reflect that when we make these sorts of gestures when the reality of what\u2019s happening in our health system is so different, it does seem to undermine the commitment. Think about the fact that, in this city, women giving birth were told that they weren\u2019t even allowed toast after giving birth because of cost cutting at Health New Zealand. It is not possible to put a band-aid over\u2014[Interruption] Yeah, get upset. Get upset, because it\u2019s wrong. You may not like it but that is what\u2019s happening under your Government. That is what\u2019s happening.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000238\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022aed260be-c954-464b-bb75-85579e53d05a\u0022\u003EIt\u2019s all very easy to posture and pass a bill, but we need to have the resources so that women get what they need, whether it\u2019s toast or a smile, or, actually, care from a midwife who\u2019s qualified. Those things take resourcing, and this Government has cut, cut, cut in our health system. We will happily hold that Government to account for their kind words towards mothers today.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002246269786-ecb4-40e2-972a-e287c495bdec\u0022 data-id=\u0022c2032c84b96444e8b9258a741abe56fd\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000239\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002246269786-ecb4-40e2-972a-e287c495bdec\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022c2032c84b96444e8b9258a741abe56fd\u0022\u003ELAN PHAM (Green):\u003C/span\u003E T\u0113n\u0101 koe, Madam Speaker. I want to mihi to Catherine Wedd for bringing this bill to the House today\u2014and the work of many before her, who have been acknowledged. I want to acknowledge them too. This is a bill that Te P\u0101ti K\u0101k\u0101riki will be supporting through to select committee.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000240\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002246269786-ecb4-40e2-972a-e287c495bdec\u0022\u003ENow, some of us have challenging but overall positive birthing experiences and post-natal experiences and are so grateful for those, but, unfortunately, Australian research tells us that one in three mothers report their birth as being traumatic. In Aotearoa, this equates to 50 people per day, leaving birth traumatised: 4 to 6 percent of them meet clinical criteria for post-traumatic stress disorder (PTSD) as a consequence of their birth experience, and many more have symptoms of PTSD rather than a diagnosis. Koi T\u016B research in Aotearoa highlights that this kind of perinatal distress impacts not only the birthing parent\u00A0but the wider wh\u0101nau, including the baby. We know that suicide is, very sadly, the leading cause of maternal death in Aotearoa, and our M\u0101ori w\u0101hine are over-represented in these deaths.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000241\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002246269786-ecb4-40e2-972a-e287c495bdec\u0022\u003EWe\u2019ve heard from my colleague Ayesha Verrall how our support services and how our health system for parents and for wh\u0101nau are chronically strained. Often, it\u2019s only those with particularly high needs that actually gain the support that they need, meaning many, many miss out. And those who can afford private care might gain access to that care, but this, just simply, increases the inequities in our health system.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000242\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002246269786-ecb4-40e2-972a-e287c495bdec\u0022\u003EWhen we proceed with this bill to select committee, we want to make sure that it is truly\u00A0fit for purpose. It was great to hear Catherine Wedd acknowledge the importance of actual funding and investment in this space, because we want to make it as comprehensive as possible in keeping all of our very damning statistics and realities at the forefront of our\u00A0minds. We really don\u2019t want to see this three-day post-natal stay being seen as, basically, this hollow, purported silver bullet to real investment and improvement in maternal health\u00A0and wellbeing. Likely a lot of pressure will already be put on our already strained healthcare system to enable this three-day stay. We\u2019ve heard these horror stories about women not being able to gain access to a Milo and a cup of tea after giving birth, so we\u00A0don\u2019t want to basically put them in this system if they\u2019re not going to have a truly well-supported experience.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000243\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002246269786-ecb4-40e2-972a-e287c495bdec\u0022\u003EWhat we know as well, from the support that parents and wh\u0101nau need after their birthing experiences, is that it\u2019s so much more than just that first one to three days; it needs to be spread out from birth to five years, because, particularly if these parents are experiencing traumatic birthing incidences, they want to get out of there, they want to get out of hospital, and they want to get out of that system and back home, and it\u2019s really important that those follow-up services are there.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000244\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002246269786-ecb4-40e2-972a-e287c495bdec\u0022\u003EWe would also like to see, really specifically, a focus on the need for trauma-informed care, and this is particularly relevant in Aotearoa when we have really high rates of domestic violence and intimate-partner violence, as well as this ongoing trauma that we see in so many ways throughout our healthcare system as a result of colonisation and everything that\u2019s happened from that point.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000245\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002246269786-ecb4-40e2-972a-e287c495bdec\u0022\u003EUltimately, we know the best cure for something is prevention, and I want to shout out\u00A0to Kate from Birth Trauma Aotearoa for consistently reminding us of this. We know this bill won\u2019t have scope to fix everything, but, wherever possible, at every connection with the birthing parent and their wider wh\u0101nau, we want to focus on birth trauma prevention in the first instance. So, yes, we will be supporting this bill and look forward to genuine listening and adopting the needs of our wh\u0101nau. Thank you.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00228f20b644-642a-4c85-ade9-d5af32dc690b\u0022 data-id=\u0022e7ed22b649c246baa2fdb80ffbe71ef0\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000246\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00228f20b644-642a-4c85-ade9-d5af32dc690b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022e7ed22b649c246baa2fdb80ffbe71ef0\u0022\u003ELAURA McCLURE (ACT):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Mr Speaker. I rise in support of this bill\u2014I\u00A0think I\u2019ll preface with that. ACT will be supporting this bill through to the select committee. We do have a couple of concerns, which I\u2019ll talk about in a minute.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000247\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00228f20b644-642a-4c85-ade9-d5af32dc690b\u0022\u003EFirstly, I just want to thank the member Catherine Wedd and those that have come before her and all of the brave mothers out there that have been advocating for change in this space; not just for the change in their rights to stay in postnatal care if they want it but also the way in which that they\u2019re actually treated during their whole birth process and their time within the following period. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000248\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00228f20b644-642a-4c85-ade9-d5af32dc690b\u0022\u003EAs a few of the others have spoken a little bit about their personal experiences, I thought I\u2019d cover off my own. I\u2019ve had two beautiful children. My first child was born after almost 48 hours of labour, thrown into an emergency C-section at 3 a.m. in the morning. When he was born, I remember they held him up and I thought, \u201COh my goodness, who are you? I don\u2019t even recognise you.\u201D It was actually quite a terrifying feeling because everybody tells\u00A0you, \u201CYou\u2019ll see your baby, you\u2019ll meet your baby, and you\u2019ll feel that love and warmth, and you\u2019ll bond with them instantly\u201D. That was not true for me. I was exhausted. I was probably sick. I was tired and needed a good sleep. Then, the next day, all of those things started happening. Complete opposite with my daughter: when she was born, it was a planned C-section, so everything went hunky-dory. When they handed her to me, I got those initial feelings\u2014everything was fantastic. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000249\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00228f20b644-642a-4c85-ade9-d5af32dc690b\u0022\u003EI think what that highlights is that there are varying different levels of experiences. Everybody\u2019s birth is different. As Catherine mentioned, you can plan for all kinds of wonderful, excellent things and they may not go down that track at all. I think there is a really true reality in that, and our system has to be able to adapt. I know that it\u2019s challenging because it\u2019s really hard for a health system to know what a woman\u2019s needs will be at the actual time. I do want to say that I think that we do have a health system that is trying, but, of course, it\u2019s not adequate and it\u2019s not enough.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000250\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00228f20b644-642a-4c85-ade9-d5af32dc690b\u0022\u003EThose first few days with your baby, if you\u2019re a new mum, you need to know what to do and you need to feel comfortable and you need to have that care. I was talking with my colleague Cam Luxton, who said that, after quite a traumatic birth, his wife left the hospital after two hours and they were on their way. That is actually what they wanted to do. There are a lot of people that are out there that do feel like they want to be getting back into their home and they might have those supports in place. But what if you don\u2019t have those supports in place? Those are the people that I\u2019m really thinking about, or I\u2019m thinking about myself as a first-time mum with a baby that I hadn\u2019t bonded with. What if I had been put out after a few hours of giving birth? I mean, that is quite a horrifying thought. And the thing is, it actually happens.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000251\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00228f20b644-642a-4c85-ade9-d5af32dc690b\u0022\u003EThere are real stories of this happening; I\u2019ve got friends, I\u2019ve got wh\u0101nau in my family that have all experienced something along these lines. I wonder whether it\u2019s the fact that they didn\u2019t know they were eligible for those 48 hours of care or whether it\u2019s the overburdened health system just not having a bed or having a space at some of the post-natal care facilities. I think there\u2019s probably a bit of a combination of both of that. As a woman, you don\u2019t often know your rights. Like I said, after a long, extreme birth potentially, the last thing you\u2019re going to be thinking about is having a battle with a bunch of midwives or nurses in a hospital around whether you can stay or leave. I think making sure, with the 72 hours, that that is actually straight up given as an opportunity to families to take that up\u2014I think that will be a really important part of this legislation, just actually knowing your rights in the first place. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000252\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00228f20b644-642a-4c85-ade9-d5af32dc690b\u0022\u003ELike I mentioned before, we do have some concerns around the resourcing of this. How will we make sure we still have this care available? Maybe it actually could look like for the ones that want to go home, it could be something more like frequent visits in the home or something that\u2019s actually\u2014doesn\u2019t have to be within a facility as such. There could be other ideas and things that we can consider with this, but, in essence, we support this. I wish the member well on her journey through the rest of the House. Thank you.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022676b0bc5-331b-4818-b261-ecf892d0bf23\u0022 data-id=\u00225498f0a5160f4f21b7019b33f56818a4\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000253\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022676b0bc5-331b-4818-b261-ecf892d0bf23\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00225498f0a5160f4f21b7019b33f56818a4\u0022\u003EJENNY MARCROFT (NZ First):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Mr Speaker. It is truly a privilege to stand on behalf of New Zealand First in support of the Pae Ora (Healthy Futures) (3 Day Postnatal Stay) Amendment Bill. I\u2019d like to begin my contribution today by acknowledging the member in charge of this bill, Catherine Wedd. Congratulations to you. I\u2019m also acknowledging Louise Upston as well, and noting that you have begun your contribution today in the first reading talking about prioritising natal care and the funding for it. To the member in charge, it is good to hear that acknowledgment.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000254\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022676b0bc5-331b-4818-b261-ecf892d0bf23\u0022\u003EI\u2019d also like to just point out that when there is a new baby, many of the women in this House who have given birth acknowledge there can be this afterglow that happens upon the arrival of the beautiful baby. Unfortunately, today that afterglow in this House was popped by the Hon Dr Ayesha Verrall bringing down the mood and the tone of the House with some negative comments. I\u2019m going to lift that back up as we celebrate what is a small but significant amendment bill.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000255\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022676b0bc5-331b-4818-b261-ecf892d0bf23\u0022\u003EThis bill will increase, as the member outlined\u2014we\u2019ve already noticed an increase in the midwifery workforce. That is a very important step because it is those midwives who are critical to ensuring that the information about the extended stay from 48 to 72 hours\u2014they\u2019re the ones that will be helping to ensure women are informed that that will be their right. As the lead maternity carers, those women will be required to inform mothers of their eligibility to allow for the longer stays, if medically required.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000256\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022676b0bc5-331b-4818-b261-ecf892d0bf23\u0022\u003ENow, it would be remiss of me not to share my own personal birth story. However, I would like to avoid giving you any gory gynaecological details. Mark Patterson is clearly quivering at the potential of that, even though he is a farmer.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000257\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002251d93c8146c4441d99ec8fd4e733d6ba\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: You\u2019re very civil.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000258\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022676b0bc5-331b-4818-b261-ecf892d0bf23\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a519051599524f8cb1651e11623cfd28\u0022\u003EJENNY MARCROFT\u003C/span\u003E: One of the really amazing things that I experienced when I had my daughter was at the North Shore Hospital, as an older mum having that care, because I was totally unprepared. Did I have a maternity plan? No. Did I go to pre-natal classes, antenatal classes? No. I was far too busy working, holding down multiple jobs.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000259\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022676b0bc5-331b-4818-b261-ecf892d0bf23\u0022\u003EActually, when I had a code red emergency caesarean, I was totally unprepared. However, it all worked well because of the care that I was given by those at the North Shore maternity wing. Maybe I\u2019ve never even had the opportunity to publicly acknowledge them, but today I\u2019m able to do that 23 years later. The way that I was treated on that day\u2014incredible care. There were 13 other mothers giving birth on that day. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000260\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022676b0bc5-331b-4818-b261-ecf892d0bf23\u0022\u003EWhen my child was born, obviously, I had a caesarean. My daughter\u2019s father texted everybody. We\u2019d already agreed on the name. This is the only plan we had, what we were going to call our baby. We\u2019d agreed on a name. Next minute, he texts everybody, \u201CLily has arrived.\u201D However, that wasn\u2019t the name that we\u2019d agreed on, but Lily\u2019s stuck. So Lily she is, and Trinity, which was the name we agreed on, became her middle name.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000261\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022676b0bc5-331b-4818-b261-ecf892d0bf23\u0022\u003EWhile it\u2019s lovely to talk about our personal stories, and I look forward to hearing many more across the House as we continue through this reading, I would like to just note a couple of points about the bill, what it will amend. Clause 4 inserts a definition for in-patient post-natal care. New section 93A, inserted by clause 5, will establish the purpose of ensuring a minimum of 72 hours of in-patient post-natal care. New section 93B, inserted by clause 5, guarantees every mother and newborn a publicly funded 72-hour post-natal stay starting after delivery or on admission.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000262\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022676b0bc5-331b-4818-b261-ecf892d0bf23\u0022\u003EI would like to finish just on something a little poetical, because I think babies inspire that from us. It\u2019s part of the creativity that comes with a new life being born into the world. From one of my favourite authors, Khalil Gibran, just a small quote here, and it\u2019s been truncated: \u201CYour children are not your children. They are the sons and daughters of life\u2019s longing for itself. You are the bows from which your children as living arrows are sent forth.\u201D Thank you, Mr Speaker.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022a68928ea-9dd8-4a30-8e2c-a0f49dfc8bea\u0022 data-id=\u0022c408620b31754cc6946b27abdecf1d03\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000263\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a68928ea-9dd8-4a30-8e2c-a0f49dfc8bea\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022c408620b31754cc6946b27abdecf1d03\u0022\u003EHon LOUISE UPSTON (Minister for the Community and Voluntary Sector):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Mr Speaker. I\u2019m really delighted to stand in support of the first reading of the Pae Ora (Healthy Futures) (3 Day Postnatal Stay) Amendment Bill, which is in the name of my parliamentary colleague Catherine Wedd. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000264\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a68928ea-9dd8-4a30-8e2c-a0f49dfc8bea\u0022\u003EI wanted to just traverse the birth of this piece of policy, which we announced, as the National Party, on Mother\u2019s Day in 2019. It was a group of people called Mothers Matter who visited Parliament in 2018, and this group was meeting with every parliamentary caucus\u00A0to talk about the importance of the first 48 hours. The founder of Mothers Matter was, of course, the late Chloe Wright of the Wright Family Foundation. There were also Dame Lesley Max, Nathan Wallis, Dr Anil Sharma, and Tracy O\u2019Sullivan. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000265\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a68928ea-9dd8-4a30-8e2c-a0f49dfc8bea\u0022\u003EI remember sitting in the National Party caucus room as this group came and spoke to us about how important the first 48 hours are for post-natal care. They spoke about their very deep concerns about the fact that too many mothers were missing out because of the pressures that were applied and they felt they needed to leave early, and the group spoke about the dire impacts that that was having on mothers and babies. I remember reflecting in that discussion, and I came away thinking that if there was one thing the New Zealand health system should provide, it is care in that first 48 hours. If we are serious about the lives of our children, we should be investing in those first precious hours and days, so it was somewhat disturbing when they came to see us in 2018 that they said they had seen a deterioration in the access that new mothers had in those first 48 hours of care. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000266\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a68928ea-9dd8-4a30-8e2c-a0f49dfc8bea\u0022\u003EI know that there have been conversations about resourcing, but the thing that is really not OK is that with regard to the funding that was available for women who were entitled to\u2014and who are entitled to, to this very day\u201448 hours of post-natal care, decisions were being made so that that resource was taken away from them, and it\u2019s still happening today. That was the birth of this member\u2019s bill to increase it from 48 hours to 72 hours. I know that some\u00A0will say that, \u201CWell, it\u2019s still not enough.\u201D but it is a very important signal that the National Party sees as critical that investment in the first three days of a child\u2019s life and the mother having given birth as being critical. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000267\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a68928ea-9dd8-4a30-8e2c-a0f49dfc8bea\u0022\u003EThere are a couple of comments that I want to put on record, because there are a couple of things. When Mothers Matter came to us originally, too many women didn\u2019t understand that they were entitled to 48 hours. So, deliberately in this bill, there is a clear direction that mothers must know what they are entitled to. The second thing is that the funding must be ring-fenced so that those in charge in health resources in a hospital, in a DHB, or in Health New Zealand can\u2019t deprioritise mothers and babies, because that\u2019s exactly what\u2019s been happening. The ring-fencing of the funding for 72 hours then allows for mothers to know that they are ensured of having access to support. It is, of course, up to every mother and their family to make decisions and choices about what it is that works for them. If one mother chooses to go home after a day, that\u2019s fantastic, but the funding would be ring-fenced so that another mother who may need more support can get it, and those are the fundamentals of this piece of legislation. It is about mothers. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000268\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a68928ea-9dd8-4a30-8e2c-a0f49dfc8bea\u0022\u003EI\u2019m proud to lead a child and youth strategy where one of the three priorities is the first 2,000 days. This is a really important start, but it is definitely not the end of what we must do. In closing my address in support of this, I just want to put on the House\u2019s notice my recognition of the late Chloe Wright and the important work that she led. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002296f5f6b7-c116-477e-88a9-ea17aa616886\u0022 data-id=\u0022f36af4d04fcc4dc7ba5f866ce7c050c5\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000269\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002296f5f6b7-c116-477e-88a9-ea17aa616886\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022f36af4d04fcc4dc7ba5f866ce7c050c5\u0022\u003EINGRID LEARY (Labour\u2014Taieri):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Mr Speaker. I too would like to congratulate the member for having her bill drawn from the ballot and for what seems to be a well-intentioned bill, which, unfortunately, in the absence of proper resourcing will be window dressing. The reason I say that is we cannot look at something like new section 93D, which does enshrine women\u2019s entitlement to have the care resourced, when what we are seeing on the ground means that it is just very unlikely to happen in the current environment. I say that with the backdrop of what is happening in Whakat\u0101ne. My colleague the Hon Dr Ayesha Verrall referred to the story, today, about Whakat\u0101ne Hospital shortages meaning some mothers will have to give birth in Tauranga.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000270\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002296f5f6b7-c116-477e-88a9-ea17aa616886\u0022\u003EI would like to extrapolate on that because that is the situation that is being faced through midwifery shortages, which relate very directly to this bill. I have some more information because actually this crisis was known earlier in December, and it\u2019s a two-fold crisis. The first is that the availability of an obstetric and gynaecologist (O and G) specialist was dwindling to literally nothing most days, but probably more problematic for me is that the Te Whatu Ora Health New Zealand team knew about this and have not advised mothers. What was happening with rosters was there was no obstetric specialist on call as early as the first week of December. All that could be offered was primary maternity birth by midwives for low-risk babies and mothers. The last O and G locum finished that week in the week of 7 December. For the week of Christmas, coming up, which is next week, there is an O and G specialist on call only for Christmas Day and Boxing Day but no other days that week. Women were not informed, and there have been no advertisements for those positions.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000271\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002296f5f6b7-c116-477e-88a9-ea17aa616886\u0022\u003EI note that Dr Reti has not responded to questions from the media about it. We\u2019ve got Health New Zealand and the media saying that Whakat\u0101ne is committed to resuming secondary maternity services at the hospital as soon as possible, and then we\u2019ve got Dr Reti not responding. The reason it\u2019s related very directly to this bill is because it\u2019s all very well for Government members to make promises like new section 93D saying that women are entitled to resourcing, when the fact is that they are not even resourcing things properly now. It\u2019s important for the public to see the realities of the bill, a well-intentioned bill that intends to give women extended cover but that cannot happen, in fact, in the current climate, because of the front-line cuts that this Government is making. It is so poignant, so sadly poignant, that this bill has come to the House the same day that expectant mothers in Whakat\u0101ne are getting the news that they may have to go to Tauranga over Christmas\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000272\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00229634e377-7e76-4353-9662-fb444eb2ec9d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00223f3e81f9cd084a2fac73e877f7a0eed3\u0022\u003ECarl Bates\u003C/span\u003E: What did you do about it? Six years.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000273\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002296f5f6b7-c116-477e-88a9-ea17aa616886\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022f160902ae5a44513ae2e4d1764c53e37\u0022\u003EINGRID LEARY\u003C/span\u003E: \u2014and into the New Year because there is no resourcing. One of the members opposite has said, \u201CWhat are we going to do about it?\u201D\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000274\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00229634e377-7e76-4353-9662-fb444eb2ec9d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022d3b63f9a2d624b8995c2fccf18543ca5\u0022\u003ECarl Bates\u003C/span\u003E: No, I said, \u201CWhat did you do about it?\u201D\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000275\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002296f5f6b7-c116-477e-88a9-ea17aa616886\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00225d054958a2d8468184c35ef7f9e24353\u0022\u003EINGRID LEARY\u003C/span\u003E: Well, the Government promised, on the campaign trail, to allow qualified midwives to enter the country on a six-month temporary visa without a job offer to look for work and bring their immediate families with them. The policy included a relocation support scheme offering, to up to 1,000 qualified overseas nurses and midwives, relocation grants worth up to $10,000 each to support their move. That has not happened, and the Minister of Health, Dr Reti, is not answering those questions. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000276\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002296f5f6b7-c116-477e-88a9-ea17aa616886\u0022\u003ETo respond to the member opposite who asked, \u201CWhat has Labour done?\u201D, Labour introduced pay equity for midwives. That was a major move to incentivise people to stay in\u00A0the sector. We had programmes for retaining midwives, and we also, as my colleague pointed out, made a really significant change to the ACC rules, which meant that women who suffered birth injuries as a result of giving birth were entitled to ACC. That is world-leading legislation.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000277\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002296f5f6b7-c116-477e-88a9-ea17aa616886\u0022\u003EI do offer the member my congratulations, because I can see she\u2019s well intentioned. She\u2019s done a lot of work on this, and it\u2019s unfortunate for her that the Government members of her team, who are making front-line cuts and who are not providing adequate resource to Health New Zealand, are stymieing the potential impacts of this bill, which won\u2019t be realised until we see a health workforce that has more funding than just keeping the lights on.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00229634e377-7e76-4353-9662-fb444eb2ec9d\u0022 data-id=\u00229e5786af3d744be7bdb26ef1e9ea9804\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000278\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00229634e377-7e76-4353-9662-fb444eb2ec9d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00229e5786af3d744be7bdb26ef1e9ea9804\u0022\u003ECARL BATES (National\u2014Whanganui):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Mr Speaker. I, firstly, want to commend Catherine Wedd for bringing this to the House, for the work that she has put in during this year of Parliament to ensure that we have this bill here today and that it is supported by the Government benches. I also want to thank Catherine for her personal story, because I think it\u2019s stories that bring the value of these bills in this House alive. I\u2019m disappointed, though, that the k\u014Drero today, the conversation around this first reading, has dropped to the level of being about political points-winning. I do intend on coming back to that and making sure that mums, expectant mums, and parents thinking about having a child in the years to come know that they have this Government\u2019s back.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000279\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00229634e377-7e76-4353-9662-fb444eb2ec9d\u0022\u003EThis bill moves that 48-hour allowance, if you like, to 72 hours with a key part of this\u00A0being informing mothers that they have this right. There\u2019s been a lot of conversation during the course of this first reading about first-time mums and I suppose Catherine asked\u00A0me to\u00A0speak on the bill today to bring a dad\u2019s perspective to the conversation. I recently had the opportunity to visit Plunket Whanganui as part of their immunisation roll-out that\u00A0is\u00A0coming in the new year, and I had this bill and this speaking slot, so to speak, on my mind. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000280\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00229634e377-7e76-4353-9662-fb444eb2ec9d\u0022\u003EEvery birth for mothers and parents is different. In our household, when our first son was born in South Africa, Candice ended up in ICU, in high care, and then in bed rest for a\u00A0number of weeks, indeed a couple of months. I took on dad duties from day one. When our second son was born here in New Zealand, it all went pretty quickly, and I remember Candice saying to me that the nurse had just said, \u201COK, this is your second; you know what to do, you\u2019ll be right, and you can go home today.\u201D But, really, it wasn\u2019t Candice\u2019s second. She hadn\u2019t been in a position to have any of those first-time experiences that a first mum has in hospital, nor actually in the initial couple of weeks after the birth of our baby, and for a period of time there, she wasn\u2019t even allowed to see Angus when she was in ICU. If it hadn\u2019t been for my mum\u2014I suggest to all members of the House, if you ever come across her, do not enter a debate with her\u2014if she hadn\u2019t got up and had a bit of a fight with the medical staff, I think the story around Angus\u2019s birth would have been slightly different.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000281\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00229634e377-7e76-4353-9662-fb444eb2ec9d\u0022\u003EAnyhow, the point I\u2019m looking to make here is that only Candice knew in that moment what she needed and what was right for her. I think that having a nurse point out to her very clearly that she could have stayed in the hospital for 48 hours if she chose, indeed 72 hours under this new bill, would have made her much more comfortable and not feel like an imposition on the hospital in that moment. I\u2019m looking forward, under this bill, for that to be the case and for mums to know that they have the support of the healthcare system in that really important time should they need it.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000282\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00229634e377-7e76-4353-9662-fb444eb2ec9d\u0022\u003EThere\u2019s been some conversation this morning about the fact that this isn\u2019t funded, that the Government is cutting healthcare. That\u2019s just a complete misnomer. It\u2019s really important for every New Zealander to know that in this year\u2019s Budget, this Government put $16\u00A0billion into healthcare over the next three years. That\u2019s not a myth, that\u2019s not a dream, that\u2019s not some hairy idea; that is fact, and it\u2019s about time that the Labour Party, the Green Party, and Te P\u0101ti M\u0101ori recognise that the Government has put money into healthcare and not send scaremongering down the spines of these expectant mums and parents that are\u00A0looking forward to having their child in a hospital in this country. They should know, going into Christmas, that they have a Government that supports them. I commend this bill to the House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002212d74f81-b1f7-4b51-9fb4-8f9481477192\u0022 data-id=\u002247d68052e0314f3b9df4ecbe44041a93\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000283\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002212d74f81-b1f7-4b51-9fb4-8f9481477192\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002247d68052e0314f3b9df4ecbe44041a93\u0022\u003EHon Dr DEBORAH RUSSELL (Labour):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Mr Speaker. I certainly support the intent of this bill\u2014I don\u2019t think anyone denies that. My eldest daughter was born in Adelaide after a long and difficult labour. My daughter was what\u2019s called a \u201Cposterior presentation\u201D, which means a long and difficult labour. The nice thing about it, the baby comes out facing up instead of facing down. It means all the pressure is wrong, so it creates a long and difficult labour. It\u2019s sometimes called a \u201Cback labour\u201D because of the back pain. My brother, who\u2019s an anaesthetist, put it right for me. He said, \u201COh, we have a name for babies like that; they\u2019re called \u2018stargazers\u2019.\u201D My eldest was born as a little stargazer, but because of that long and difficult labour, I spent, I think, four days in hospital, and it was much needed. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000284\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002212d74f81-b1f7-4b51-9fb4-8f9481477192\u0022\u003EMy younger two daughters were born here in New Zealand, in Palmerston North Hospital\u2014a twin delivery. They too were both little stargazers\u2014bless them\u2014so another long and difficult delivery. Again, because it was a twin delivery, I had four days in the hospital with them, which I needed. There\u2019s an advantage to that, not just for women and babies who have had long and difficult labours, but, actually, for uncomplicated labours and deliveries as well. I don\u2019t know if anyone spoke on it, but that window of time in the hospital allows time for milk to come in, for a woman to be able to start towards establishing breastfeeding, to enable her to get assistance with it from lactation consultants and the like.\u00A0Those 72 hours can make a real difference, I think, not just in terms of recovery from birth but also in terms of establishing breastfeeding and establishing an ongoing bonding between mother and tiny new baby. It is really important.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000285\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002212d74f81-b1f7-4b51-9fb4-8f9481477192\u0022\u003EOn those grounds, we do support the intent of this bill\u2014who could not? It would be churlish to do so. What is difficult is the promise without the funding and the promise being made when we know that there is a shortage of midwives. The promise being made when we know that the health budget is under pressure. Contra to the previous speaker, Carl Bates, I want to direct his attention to the Half Year Economic and Fiscal Update. It\u2019s sitting on the Table in the House, so the member can consult it himself if he likes. I want to direct him to page 67, when it talks about specific risks, and it talks about the risks of the health system running a deficit\u2014a significant deficit.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000286\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002212d74f81-b1f7-4b51-9fb4-8f9481477192\u0022\u003ENow, it\u2019s a bit odd to talk about a deficit in healthcare when what it is caused by is Government choosing not to fund it. What I am seeking from the Government benches is any indication that the Government will choose to fund this promise\u2014this promise that we all agree with the intent of\u2014but a promise without any substance behind it is just fine words: lovely words, words that we all support, words that do support women and their babies, that do support new families, but hollow words, unless there is a commitment to funding as well. The Government are the people who sit on the Treasury benches\u2014the Government. They are the ones who can say whether or not something will be funded. It is time for the Government to put their money where their mouth is on this one. Will they actually fund this fine promise?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000287\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00225e5df97fd26945ccbe07c7ae0ea61baa\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Catherine Wedd\u2014five minutes in reply.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022a00bf4f5-c63a-49a0-b0e1-d3b37311377b\u0022 data-id=\u0022fb8f2aa02b8c4fa7adcbb01b0a8b77ab\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000288\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a00bf4f5-c63a-49a0-b0e1-d3b37311377b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022fb8f2aa02b8c4fa7adcbb01b0a8b77ab\u0022\u003ECATHERINE WEDD (National\u2014Tukituki):\u003C/span\u003E Look, it\u2019s wonderful to speak in reply to the debate that we\u2019ve just had on the first reading of this bill and it\u2019s wonderful to see cross-party support on this really important issue\u2014obviously, everyone recognising that mothers matter and how important the issue is of post-natal care in New Zealand. I want to thank all parties for their support today and their commitment to post-natal care in New Zealand. It does need improvement and this is critical to giving mums and families the protection and support that they need. It\u2019s not often that we all agree on an issue. I\u2019m very humbled and proud to see everyone agreeing today that post-natal care needs the spotlight, it needs to be fleshed out through the select committee process, and we need to ensure that we are protecting our mums, babies, and families.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000289\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a00bf4f5-c63a-49a0-b0e1-d3b37311377b\u0022\u003EThank you also to those around the House who have shared their personal stories today. We can all resonate with post-natal care. Whether we\u2019ve had a baby or whether we know someone who\u2019s had a baby, it really does impact us all. It\u2019s also good to recognise that some mums will not always have a good birth and that it is different in many situations for all. Just listening, obviously, to Deborah, then with obviously having twins; to Carl Bates, who also spoke about our other children\u2014the first birth, as Laura McClure also mentioned, can be very traumatic, but the next births that you have may go brilliantly.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000290\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a00bf4f5-c63a-49a0-b0e1-d3b37311377b\u0022\u003EI spoke, obviously, about my first very traumatic birth, but for numbers two, three, and four, they whizzed out very, very quickly and I almost actually had one of them in the car park of the hospital. That was certainly an interesting experience! Thankfully, I was able to make it into the hospital and have number three in the hospital just in the nick of time\u2014a 10-pound baby, I might add. Actually, all four of them were very healthy, large babies. I thank you for sharing all your personal stories from around the House today, because that certainly makes it real for us all.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000291\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a00bf4f5-c63a-49a0-b0e1-d3b37311377b\u0022\u003EI also want to just acknowledge some of the points that were raised around funding and resourcing. Of course, funding is very important and, as the Hon Louise Upston spoke about\u201472 hours and this being ring-fenced and ensuring that we have that set aside for those first three days for mums after they have had their babies. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000292\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a00bf4f5-c63a-49a0-b0e1-d3b37311377b\u0022\u003EI also just want to acknowledge that it\u2019s also about our midwifery workforce and this really does play a critical role. It was lovely to hear Jenny Marcroft acknowledge the North Shore Hospital and all the wonderful midwives that played a huge role in her journey in having her lovely Lily. I think, for all of us, our midwives out there just do an incredible, incredible job bringing joy into our world and helping us navigate that really challenging journey sometimes of having our children. It is a really, really special time and that bond that we form in those first few hours and those first few days with our babies is really, really critical. It\u2019s really fundamental. But, of course, we understand that there are pressures out there at the moment in the health system and with our midwives. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000293\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a00bf4f5-c63a-49a0-b0e1-d3b37311377b\u0022\u003EThis select committee process is also an opportunity where we can hear the stories; we can hear stories from mums, from fathers, from families, from midwives, from advocacy groups, and we certainly encourage these groups and people to come forward through this process, because it is an opportunity for us to put the spotlight on post-natal care in New Zealand. This is our chance to have better post-natal care in New Zealand. This bill is about protecting mums and families, because mothers matter. I commend this bill to the House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000294\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a00bf4f5-c63a-49a0-b0e1-d3b37311377b\u0022\u003EMotion agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000295\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a00bf4f5-c63a-49a0-b0e1-d3b37311377b\u0022\u003EBill read a first time.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022 data-id=\u00223f03ee10299b4dd38fe5d28e27805568\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000296\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00223f03ee10299b4dd38fe5d28e27805568\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: The question is, That the Pae Ora (Healthy Futures) (3 Day Postnatal Stay) Amendment Bill be considered by the Health Committee.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000297\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003EMotion agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000298\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003EBill referred to the Health Committee.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n    \u003C/div\u003E\n    \u003Cdiv class=\u0022HpsHansard\u0022\u003E\n      \u003Cp\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsProceedingHeading\u0022\u003EBills\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000299\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u002262b3931b6f294c69a03a02de2fd556ec\u0022\u003ERepeal of Good Friday and Easter Sunday as Restricted Trading Days (Shop Trading and Sale of Alcohol) Amendment Bill\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000300\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u0022a24b117e5c974241a4f3feb241d06d73\u0022\u003EFirst Reading\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022 data-id=\u0022b40b5e2566794279a9115d01828225b1\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000301\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e6b4dc55-3561-49a8-a871-ae005354ef90\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022b40b5e2566794279a9115d01828225b1\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Members, the Repeal of Good Friday and Easter Sunday as Restricted Trading Days (Shop Trading and Sale of Alcohol) Amendment Bill will be the subject of a personal vote at the end of the debate. [Interruption] Is there a problem going on over there? Members are welcome to seek the call to speak in favour of or against the bill. I\u2019ll aim to allocate the calls as closely as possible to the proportionality of membership of the House, but also to ensure that different sides of the debate receive a fair hearing. Members may wish to come to the Chair to indicate to the presiding officer that they\u2019ll be seeking a call.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022cfc7092e-b202-4acf-aa9c-8aebd551cc39\u0022 data-id=\u00225524b69101e44d7297014496be65a10a\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000302\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cfc7092e-b202-4acf-aa9c-8aebd551cc39\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00225524b69101e44d7297014496be65a10a\u0022\u003ECAMERON LUXTON (ACT):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Mr Speaker. I move, That the Repeal of Good Friday and Easter Sunday as Restricted Trading Days (Shop Trading and Sale of Alcohol) Amendment Bill be now read a first time. I nominate the Finance and Expenditure Committee to consider the bill.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000303\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cfc7092e-b202-4acf-aa9c-8aebd551cc39\u0022\u003ECan I first take the opportunity to thank all members from across the House who have engaged with me on this bill\u2014those who immediately saw this as a pro-customer, pro-worker, and pro-business policy, but also those members who have brought legitimate concerns and have been part of the discussion over the last year. I hope you find that I address some of those concerns in this speech. Can I also thank Chris Baillie, who brought this bill to a previous Parliament, and the stakeholders and staff who have been getting the word out about what we are trying to do here.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000304\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cfc7092e-b202-4acf-aa9c-8aebd551cc39\u0022\u003EThis bill seeks to enhance the enjoyment for all New Zealanders over the Easter weekend through a mix of simplification and choice. My bill does what it says on the tin: remove the\u00A0provisions in the Shop Trading Hours Act and Sale and Supply of Alcohol Act which restrict trading on Good Friday and Easter Sunday. There are four days making up our Easter weekend: Good Friday, Saturday, Easter Sunday, and Easter Monday. New Zealand has 12\u00A0public holidays: secular days, the hararei Matariki, and, importantly for those of us who are grateful to our heritage, Christian holidays, two of which fall, obviously, on Easter. To be clear to the House, my bill does not change a single one of these days from their position as public holidays in New Zealand. What it does seek to change are the restrictions on how New Zealanders choose to spend these days.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000305\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cfc7092e-b202-4acf-aa9c-8aebd551cc39\u0022\u003EI\u2019d like to briefly traverse the lay of the land for the different days of the Easter weekend. Good Friday is a public holiday and a restricted trading day. Saturday is just a normal Saturday. Easter Sunday is not just a public holiday but it is a restricted trading day. It is also a special day in our calendar, not just because of the Christian celebration of this Day of Resurrection but, in the law, it is also the only day of the year when a shop employee may use their discretion and refuse to work without having to provide a reason\u2014a discretion day. Easter Monday is a public holiday, with a long history dating back to before Mondayisation, to allow for an extended Easter holiday weekend. It is not a restricted trading day. In 2016, there was a change to the rules which allowed local councils to liberalise their trading policies. This has led to a hodgepodge of confusing rules throughout the country, which every year befuddle tourists and locals alike. With four days, with four different sets of rules, it is no wonder that this is a perennial issue and one which in a recent poll showed a majority of New Zealanders from all sides of this House support to see changed.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000306\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cfc7092e-b202-4acf-aa9c-8aebd551cc39\u0022\u003EI\u2019m incredibly grateful that this bill was drawn so early in my first term. In the months since, I have been around the country, as many in this House do, to different towns, and I\u2019ve heard different experiences. Some business owners have told me that, even though their local area has a liberalised trading policy, they find the prescribed rules so cumbersome that, despite being allowed to trade, they choose to remain closed rather than attempting to comply. These rules include having to supply a substantial meal if one wishes to enjoy a beverage, the definition of which is up for debate, or restrictions on the amount of time that friends and family can spend together at a venue before being moved on. I\u2019ve met restaurant and bar workers who say that, despite wanting to work on restricted days, they \u201Cdon\u2019t like having to treat my customers like children and tell them what they can and can\u2019t eat and drink and how long they can stay before they must leave\u201D. People are just trying to enjoy their Easter and, if our alcohol laws work the other 361\u00BD days of the year, why do we need a special rule on these days?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000307\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cfc7092e-b202-4acf-aa9c-8aebd551cc39\u0022\u003EI\u2019ve met employees who say that, because of the disjointed structure of the Easter holidays, rather than enjoying a four-day weekend with their family they were rostered to work on the Saturday, meaning this messes up the whole weekend for one day\u2019s pay, when it would be better to work the Friday or the Sunday and use a day in lieu to spend on extending other times of the year with their family in a way which is important to them. Many Kiwis have other days of the year which hold significance to them, when using a day in lieu would mean so much to them\u2014days like Diwali, Eid, or dates of importance to religious groups that have grown in these lands, like Ringat\u016B, R\u0101tana, or Pai M\u0101rire.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000308\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cfc7092e-b202-4acf-aa9c-8aebd551cc39\u0022\u003ERetail businesses tell me they would like the opportunity of a level playing field with online retailers, because online stores don\u2019t face the restrictions that brick and mortar ones do, who must also pay leases and rates for their stores. Warbirds Over Wanaka is an infamous example of a town whose rules were not aligned with the needs of the community and tourists who visited in the 2024 Warbirds Over Wanaka. Two New World supermarkets decided to open and cop the fine rather than leave the bulging tourist population unserved\u2014which brings me to the punishment. If a business owner was to trade on a restricted day, the law states that, upon conviction, they shall be liable for up to a $2,000 fine. I\u2019ve met business owners who have received this conviction and subsequent fine but felt that it was capriciously applied, as a business just up the road was able to trade without enforcement action taken.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000309\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cfc7092e-b202-4acf-aa9c-8aebd551cc39\u0022\u003ECentral government has meddled in this space. Government created a framework for local Easter trading policies which means businesses could make their case to the council to be allowed to trade in a specific area. The law requires councils to review these policies after five years. Now, when I went out and asked how many councils in New Zealand have these policies, I found out that last year five councils had their policy lapse without realising. This meant they allowed Easter trading in their area, which was not within the law. I don\u2019t blame these councils. Central government, rather than allowing Kiwis to make their own choices, created a halfway house. Central government should take this burden off councils and say, \u201CWe live in a default permissive country\u201D, and if you would like to restrict trade on your neighbours, this is where the philosophy of localism should live.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000310\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cfc7092e-b202-4acf-aa9c-8aebd551cc39\u0022\u003EI\u2019d like to clarify the worker protection in my bill, because it is an extremely important and core part of it. As I\u2019ve said, currently a worker may refuse to work on Easter Sunday. Their employer, if they would like them to work, must give written notice letting their employee know that they have the right to refuse to work, and that notice must be given no less than four weeks before Easter Sunday. I\u2019ve asked the Library, I\u2019ve asked people in the industry, I\u2019ve asked my fellow MPs: \u201CHave there been any cases or complaints where an employee feels they have been adversely treated because of exercising their right?\u201D Yet I have yet to hear back on any such case. I am confident that, by extending this provision\u2014their right to refuse to work\u2014to Good Friday we will create two discretion days in our calendar where all Kiwis can choose how they spend their time and in what way they would like to spend it.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000311\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cfc7092e-b202-4acf-aa9c-8aebd551cc39\u0022\u003EThere are legitimate concerns about alcohol. We know that many New Zealanders have a negative relationship with alcohol. It\u2019s been hard to find data on the following claim, but I\u2019ve been told that the average sale volume of alcohol doesn\u2019t change over Easter week. The restriction on the sale of alcohol over Easter weekend means that people who feel or are dependent on alcohol may, out of a sense of nervous preparation, over purchase and therefore have more alcohol in their homes, the most harmful place for it to be. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000312\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cfc7092e-b202-4acf-aa9c-8aebd551cc39\u0022\u003EFrom talking to people about my bill over the last nine months, I\u2019ve realised that there is a view which comes from a warm place in New Zealand history, one that remembers how we spent our holidays in the garden or at the beach or at the park or the lake\u2014somewhere wholesome in nature, akin to the quarter-acre paradise vision of New Zealand. New Zealand has changed a lot in recent decades. Along with the rest of the world, the quarter acre with a garden has become a subdivided section or a townhouse. We have seen screens become a ubiquitous part of our lives. I think the vision that if we close all shops and forms of commercial entertainment, Kiwis will be seen in their gardens or in their droves at the lakeshore is not necessarily the case. It may be true for some sectors of New Zealand, but many others, I fear, will see more children and even adults with their faces glued to screens. Because we have changed in the way Kiwis value and spend their time, I say a restaurant, a shop, an ice cream stand, a go-kart track, or a bit of mini putt is a legitimate way to get Kiwis out and enjoying themselves.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000313\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cfc7092e-b202-4acf-aa9c-8aebd551cc39\u0022\u003EIn closing, I\u2019d like to say that this bill does not remove anybody\u2019s rights. If you are a worker, your rights are extended. If you\u2019re a business owner, no one will be able to force you to open. If you enjoy a day off as a day off, you don\u2019t have to shop. If you want to visit a beach or a park, you can. If you want to spend your days in religious observance or attitude and by going to church, your rights are protected and enhanced. I ask my fellow members to use your conscience to vote this bill to select committee so that the views of New Zealanders can be heard. Thank you, Mr Speaker. I commend this bill to the House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002202e74c40-9529-4e15-adc2-c032eadc2205\u0022 data-id=\u0022b784f26d76cb45c28b30707318ff0a40\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000314\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002202e74c40-9529-4e15-adc2-c032eadc2205\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022b784f26d76cb45c28b30707318ff0a40\u0022\u003EASSISTANT SPEAKER (Greg O\u2019Connor)\u003C/span\u003E: The question is that the motion be agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022a503e324-3a0b-4efd-bf44-ec6740ec9a62\u0022 data-id=\u002289fe140d77a54b1a937b0bfae21387bb\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000315\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a503e324-3a0b-4efd-bf44-ec6740ec9a62\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002289fe140d77a54b1a937b0bfae21387bb\u0022\u003ECAMILLA BELICH (Labour):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Mr Speaker. I appreciate the ability to be able to take a call on what is a conscience issue, and I do so in my capacity as the Labour Party spokesperson on workplace relations and safety, as this bill falls into this general area.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000316\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a503e324-3a0b-4efd-bf44-ec6740ec9a62\u0022\u003EI want to start by respectfully saying to the member Cameron Luxton, who brought this bill in, that I thank him for the engagement that he has had around this bill, the passionate way he has advocated for this particular bill, and the respectful way he has engaged with certainly myself but, I\u2019m sure, with other members of the House as well. It\u2019s not easy to get a member\u2019s bill drawn from the ballot, and especially not one that you feel so passionately about as Cameron Luxton does, so thank you for your engagement on this. When we did engage on it, I did indicate to Cameron Luxton that I would seriously take his advocacy into account, and I have done. Unfortunately for the member, it\u2019s not a bill that we will be supporting in this instance, and I want to take the time, out of respect, to go through some of the reasons why that is.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000317\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a503e324-3a0b-4efd-bf44-ec6740ec9a62\u0022\u003EI think that it\u2019s very important to see the rights that people have in New Zealand in respect of work and the time that they have with their families in the context of an existing ability to spend that time together and to enjoy their life. I very much believe that people should have fair working conditions, but they should also be allowed the time for rest and relaxation as well, and although I appreciate this is a very small part of what forms holidays under this Act, I do think it\u2019s worth protecting in this instance\u2014not for the religious reasons that may cause some other members to oppose this bill; this is very much on the basis of protecting the rights of workers to be able to enjoy that time off and to not put additional pressure on them to work. I appreciate that the member did engage specifically with me on that issue, and my colleague Rachel Boyack has worked extensively in unions that work with supermarkets and has experience of that, so we\u2019ll be talking to that specific point. I appreciate that those examples were specifically sought, and Rachel Boyack will be able to speak to that.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000318\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a503e324-3a0b-4efd-bf44-ec6740ec9a62\u0022\u003EThis is not, from our perspective, to do with the religious nature of Easter. We do note that Easter goes over four days, and we are talking about two of those days of restrictions, so in terms of the balance of being able to trade, on an objective basis that seems, from our perspective, to be about right. Personally, I come from a family that has been religious in the past. I\u2019m not religious myself; my objection to this is not on the basis of wanting to practise my own religion on those days, although I would note that many secular families do celebrate Easter and do celebrate other religious holidays as a tradition as well, and those traditions can be held very dear, despite the lack of religious adherence to it.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000319\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a503e324-3a0b-4efd-bf44-ec6740ec9a62\u0022\u003EI\u2019m sorry to the member that our party will not be able to support his bill, in the sense that I do believe that, for him, it\u2019s a genuinely passionately held belief that this law should be changed. For us, also, it was in the context of looking at the other measures that have been brought in\u2014not by the member himself but by members of his party that, in our view, do take away from the rights of workers. Quite ironically, I suppose, in the very week or fortnight that this bill was coming up for hearing, we have heard the Minister from the member\u2019s party talk about a review of the Holidays Act. I have not heard, and I would like to hear, assurances from the Minister that that won\u2019t result in a loss of entitlements for people. I think that\u2019s, essentially, the main grain of our opposition to this bill: we don\u2019t want to see further rights of workers go backwards. We do know that this is a small, discrete area, but we do not think the flexibility of businesses are so significantly curtailed by these existing restrictions that this needs to be changed at this stage.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000320\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a503e324-3a0b-4efd-bf44-ec6740ec9a62\u0022\u003EIt is, I think, relevant to look at the wider context of what is happening at the moment. We have even seen, yesterday, the minimum wage be set at the smallest amount since the 1990s, so this is not a Government that is, in our view, delivering for workers. It\u2019s in that context that we also don\u2019t want to see any roll back further of the rights that workers enjoy to their time off with their family, and I think we\u2019re all thinking about time off with our families as we get ready for the holiday break now, and how precious that is to us. Although this is a small part of that, for us it is something small that we\u2019re willing to fight for, and that is the basis of the Labour Party\u2019s opposition to this bill. Thank you, Mr Speaker.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002202e74c40-9529-4e15-adc2-c032eadc2205\u0022 data-id=\u00224b46761a3ee0462aa8826e00946a5b78\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000321\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002202e74c40-9529-4e15-adc2-c032eadc2205\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00224b46761a3ee0462aa8826e00946a5b78\u0022\u003EASSISTANT SPEAKER (Greg O\u2019Connor)\u003C/span\u003E: Just before I take another call, for those who weren\u2019t in the House at the beginning, the Speaker in the Chair indicated that he was going to prepare a list, and he invited people to come to the Chair to, I suppose, argue for a place on that list. I do have a list in front of me. If anyone wants a call, feel free to approach me and I\u2019ll give you the name of a member of your party you may wish to negotiate with for that slot. Other than that, I currently have a list before me, so for those who have come to the House with other expectations, I\u2019m sorry; that\u2019s the way that it will now stand.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022b9dc1924-4df4-4d8f-91ec-8a0f29348308\u0022 data-id=\u0022c6c36f44aa594a8e8b764bdd34132f2d\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000322\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b9dc1924-4df4-4d8f-91ec-8a0f29348308\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022c6c36f44aa594a8e8b764bdd34132f2d\u0022\u003ETIM COSTLEY (National\u2014\u014Ctaki):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Mr Speaker. Ultimately, today, I am going to vote in favour of this bill. I don\u2019t know that I naturally feel in support of it, but I do think there are some genuine questions to be answered, and I want to see the bill go to select committee so these can be teased out and to give a broader number of people the opportunity to appear before the select committee to make submissions. I want to see people with the opportunity to come and appear before them and actually present their case. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000323\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b9dc1924-4df4-4d8f-91ec-8a0f29348308\u0022\u003ELook, my starting point is I like what the current rules achieve. I like that we have just a couple of days in New Zealand where families have an almost unobstructed opportunity to get together. It might not be the right mechanism that Government has to tell you that today you can\u2019t go to work and today you should spend time with your family, but I do think it\u2019s the right outcome, particularly because I feel like we\u2019ve seen a gradual breakdown of community and in some levels of family in New Zealand. I\u2019d like to see more of that. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000324\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b9dc1924-4df4-4d8f-91ec-8a0f29348308\u0022\u003EI do like what these rules achieve, but I do think there are questions that we need to answer\u2014for example, the tension between the public holiday being on the Monday and the no-trading day being on the Sunday. What this means is even if workers\u2014yes, it is true, they have their rights protected and under this member\u2019s bill that would also apply to Good Friday, but they don\u2019t have the backup of it being a public holiday. If they do work, they get time and a half or they get a day in lieu\u2014they have those other provisions in place. It does feel a little bit messy to me to have a public holiday Monday but the trading days on other days. I do hear the call from the other side that they want to ensure people have the freedom not to work. I know it\u2019s never quite that simple that everyone feels they\u2019re in a position to say no, but I do think this is an issue worth teasing out.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000325\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b9dc1924-4df4-4d8f-91ec-8a0f29348308\u0022\u003ENow, of course, one of the questions is: well, what\u2019s left? That leaves us with Anzac Day morning, that leaves us with Christmas Day\u2014and no one\u2019s suggesting we should touch Christmas\u2014but the question might be, \u201CWell, why not? What is the difference between Christmas and Easter?\u201D They both come from a faith perspective. They have both traditionally been days on which, if you look at the tikanga on which this modern New Zealand was founded, they were important days in the calendar, days where families came together, days where we didn\u2019t trade. When we went to Sunday trading some decades ago, obviously the protections for Sundays remained in place, and no one said we would take on Christmas, but if the position of those in favour of the bill is, \u201CWell, everyone should be free to choose whatever day they want.\u201D, why wouldn\u2019t the same apply to Christmas?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000326\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b9dc1924-4df4-4d8f-91ec-8a0f29348308\u0022\u003ENot for one minute am I advocating that this should apply to Christmas, but why are\u00A0we drawing a line there? The argument there would fall flat on itself. On the one hand, we\u2019re saying, \u201CWell, everyone should be free to choose, and if you want to work, if you want to open your business, you can\u201D, but then we\u2019re also saying, at the same time, \u201CBut not on Christmas, because we\u2019ve decided that day is too important.\u201D Actually, we do think it\u2019s OK that Governments sometimes will say, \u201CWell, there are days that are so important we\u2019re not going to touch them. We\u2019re not going to touch the morning of Anzac Day; we\u2019re not going to touch Christmas Day.\u201D But why Easter? I think there is a genuine question here, and I\u2019m sure the member in his reply will do it. I\u2019m happy to see this bill go to the select committee to tease out some of these questions. I don\u2019t think in its current form the bill answers all of\u00A0these, but I do think it\u2019s a question that more New Zealanders should be able to comment on as we ultimately decide the kind of country that we want to be living in.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000327\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b9dc1924-4df4-4d8f-91ec-8a0f29348308\u0022\u003ELook, from where I sit, it seems madness that when I went out with my family for dinner on Good Friday this year and we said, \u201CWell, let\u2019s go to this one place, let\u2019s get some garlic bread and have a drink.\u201D\u2014\u201CSorry, garlic bread is not enough to get a drink.\u201D \u201CWell, what if we have two garlic breads? Is that OK?\u201D\u2014\u201COh, not quite. Maybe if you had some fries as well.\u201D OK, so we went to the other place, and we just had an earlier dinner. Now, I don\u2019t think that\u2019s right. I don\u2019t think that can be the answer that we want to end up on. If the bar is open, then let them do what they do. If people want to have a meal, let them have a meal; if they want to have a drink, let them have a drink. If you really are worried about the length of that, you can look at earlier closing rates, but that should be determined at a local level.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000328\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b9dc1924-4df4-4d8f-91ec-8a0f29348308\u0022\u003EI do think there are some issues with the way it sits now, but I also want to see those couple of rare days we have in this country that are protected, that kind of drive to a great outcome of families together\u2014and I hold Christmas Day and Easter Sunday as being two really special days along with Anzac Day for me\u2014that I would like to see some protection around. But I think the alignment of the rules on trading, the rules on alcohol sale, on public holidays, needs to be looked at. No one is saying, \u201CWell, let\u2019s have an extra public holiday\u201D, because they don\u2019t want to suddenly take away the Monday day off. And why not? Well, because we want a day off. But, actually, that\u2019s what we\u2019re getting rid of here. I think there are some questions. I\u2019m going to support this bill to select committee to give people a chance to comment on those, and then I\u2019ll reassess from there.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00223d42e8cf-544e-415d-892b-f4ef8014d80f\u0022 data-id=\u002275f6b123b07d47bc850beca12921ebd5\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000329\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d42e8cf-544e-415d-892b-f4ef8014d80f\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002275f6b123b07d47bc850beca12921ebd5\u0022\u003ETEANAU TUIONO (Green):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Mr Speaker. Let me begin by acknowledging the member in charge of the bill, Cameron Luxton, who has been engaging right across the House and, of course, with different members of Parliament within the Green Party, and that that\u2019s a good thing. It\u2019s a good thing for members to be engaging on things that they are passionate about, and that certainly has resonated in the interactions that the member has had with people that I have talked to as well. I hope that that can continue, whether people agree or disagree.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000330\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d42e8cf-544e-415d-892b-f4ef8014d80f\u0022\u003EUnfortunately, in this case, I disagree. The reason for that is we need to really focus on getting that work-life balance right. It is important for us to uphold workers\u2019 rights\u2014that\u2019s important\u2014to secure an adequate income, to fair treatment and safety at work, and to be involved in workplace decision-making via workplace democracy and collective organising\u2014that stuff is important\u2014but, at the same time, we foster a working culture which recognises the fullness of people\u2019s lives and restores balance between paid work, voluntary and care work, and leisure time. We don\u2019t have that balance within our society. Too much of our time, as the member said previously, is being spent on devices and other\u00A0issues as well\u2014that we actually need to carve out that time. I take a different view because\u2014and this is not for religious reasons\u2014there are so few days that it should be about family, where it should be about community, and which should be about society that it would be unfortunate if this Parliament were to roll those back.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000331\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d42e8cf-544e-415d-892b-f4ef8014d80f\u0022\u003EI note that in the discussions that we\u2019ve had so far, the member talked about there being the right for workers to refuse to work on that day, and he went to some lengths to explain the extension of those rights within his member\u2019s bill. However, anybody that\u2019s worked, anybody that\u2019s had particularly low-paid jobs, will know that you don\u2019t want to get on the wrong side of the boss. There are these other pressures that play into place. Yes, you might have the ability to do something, to tell your boss, but who in reality would do that? There is a power imbalance which is not addressed in this bill, so I have concerns about that.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000332\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d42e8cf-544e-415d-892b-f4ef8014d80f\u0022\u003EThe issues that the member raises about extensions into other religious holidays or other cultural events of significance are important conversations to have. I hope that we will continue to have those conversations, because it\u2019s important to be able to have those conversations, but I can\u2019t see how that is addressed with this bill. I also agree with the point around the seeming advantages that online businesses have compared to brick and mortar businesses. I think that is also an important issue that needs to be addressed by the Parliament, but I also can\u2019t see that being addressed in particular with this bill. I do want to encourage the member to continue to engage in good faith. I think he has done that.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000333\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d42e8cf-544e-415d-892b-f4ef8014d80f\u0022\u003EI also see all of this within the context of what\u2019s been happening in the realm of workers\u2019 rights. There\u2019s been attempts to rein back the ability to strike. At the beginning of this Parliament, we had the 90-day trials come back and fair pay agreements were rolled back as well. Workers are under attack. Workers are feeling that this Government doesn\u2019t care about them. If we talk about the freedom to choose in terms of how you will work or not work within a particular workplace, it is also important to think about the freedom to organise, the freedom to not just choose who will have power over you\u2014because that\u2019s the problem\u2014but also the freedom to actually own and organise our own lives. This is a bill which is happening in the context where workers\u2019 rights are being rolled back. That context is why I cannot support this bill.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022b8550e1a-ed25-44a2-b0e2-b0a8d52a7a80\u0022 data-id=\u0022ecea2e30c15f406ba63180566562946b\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000334\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b8550e1a-ed25-44a2-b0e2-b0a8d52a7a80\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022ecea2e30c15f406ba63180566562946b\u0022\u003ERACHEL BOYACK (Labour\u2014Nelson):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Mr Speaker, for the opportunity to take a call on this bill. I won\u2019t be supporting this bill today, but I do want to acknowledge the member for having his bill pulled and for the engagement he\u2019s undertaken. I did just want to respond to some of the comments he made around pressure being placed on workers to work on Easter Sunday. I understand he did ask that question of my colleague Camilla Belich, but not directly of me and I do want to bring some of my experience to the\u00A0House today. I worked as a retail union organiser for six years. I represented workers at Countdown, now Woolworths; New World; Pak \u2019N Save; Farmers; Bunnings; Mitre 10; Kmart; and Cotton On\u2014large retailers\u2014and some small retailers in New Zealand.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000335\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b8550e1a-ed25-44a2-b0e2-b0a8d52a7a80\u0022\u003EI was representing those workers when the law changed in 2016. What happened was that, in Tasman, they originally voted No but have changed that to Yes; in Nelson, they have kept with no trading; and in Marlborough, they did make an immediate move to trade. One of the things that happened was the supermarkets in particular were particularly bad at following the law, which required a written notice to employees, which the Countdown supermarket in the heart of Blenheim did not do. They were required to have a process for employees to say they wanted to opt out, and, again, they didn\u2019t do that. As the organiser, I actually had to take it upon myself to set that system up. I had to create an opt-out form and give it all of my members, and they then provided it to the employer.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000336\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b8550e1a-ed25-44a2-b0e2-b0a8d52a7a80\u0022\u003EThere was a lot of subtle pressure placed on employees\u2014some of whom, like myself, have a Christian faith\u2014to work on Easter Sunday. I would say to fellow Christians\u2014and that\u2019s not the main reason I\u2019m opposing this bill\u2014that, arguably, for us Easter Sunday is far more important than Christmas Day in terms of our religious calendar. I do want to note that\u2014and I\u2019ve had representation made to me from Christians\u2014while, culturally in New Zealand, the practice is to spend engagement around Christmas, for those of us practising the Christian faith, Easter Sunday is a more significant day. That is not the main reason I\u2019m opposing this bill, though; it is based on my experience of that subtle pressure that\u2019s put on workers.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000337\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b8550e1a-ed25-44a2-b0e2-b0a8d52a7a80\u0022\u003EThe other thing is the member was incorrect in his first speech. Easter Sunday isn\u2019t a public holiday, and so workers are required to work on Easter Sunday\u2014they may make the choice to work on Easter Sunday\u2014unless they\u2019re covered by an agreement. Now, many retail workers are covered by a collective agreement that does put in place a time-and-a-half provision, but there are a lot of workers who work on that day and don\u2019t receive time and a half and don\u2019t receive a day in lieu and don\u2019t get those extra provisions that you would get for a public holiday\u2014so there is an anomaly in the law\u2014and without that, I absolutely could not support this. For workers to be working on a day that is of such significance in terms of being both a family day and a religious day and not receiving that extra support is something that I just personally could not support.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000338\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b8550e1a-ed25-44a2-b0e2-b0a8d52a7a80\u0022\u003EI want to talk a little bit about that subtle pressure. Absolutely you can write into the law that there are workers\u2019 protections. You can write that on a piece of paper, but how does it work in practice? Things are said like, \u201CThanks to all the team players who worked today.\u201D\u2014and guess who gets the promotion! It\u2019s probably the person who\u2019s willing to work the extra hours or work the days that people don\u2019t want.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000339\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b8550e1a-ed25-44a2-b0e2-b0a8d52a7a80\u0022\u003EWhat you end up having is subtle discrimination against people. We have a lot of Pasifika people, for example, who work in supermarkets. A number of them are of the Christian faith, and so they feel that pressure to go to work on a day that is of significance to them. I do take the point that there are people of other faiths in this country that don\u2019t\u00A0get that same protection. I\u2019m really happy to have a conversation about what that could look like\u2014that\u2019s something that is of interest to me\u2014but this bill does not cover any of that. It does not put any of those\u00A0conversations in place. It doesn\u2019t put any extra protections in place. I have seen in practice, over six years of working, people feeling pressured to work because someone\u2019s called in sick\u00A0and they\u2019re short-staffed that day. It happens all the time.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000340\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b8550e1a-ed25-44a2-b0e2-b0a8d52a7a80\u0022\u003EWorkers don\u2019t want to let their team mates down, they don\u2019t want to let their boss down, so they will often make those decisions when they would rather be spending time with their family, and for some of them, it will be going to church on that day. For me, this is an absolute no-go area, and I cannot support this bill.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022 data-id=\u002271606c5e76a44673bb62100ddb570103\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000341\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002271606c5e76a44673bb62100ddb570103\u0022\u003EHon DAVID SEYMOUR (Minister for Regulation):\u003C/span\u003E Mr Speaker, with your leave, I would like to make a very short contribution and split my time with Te P\u0101ti M\u0101ori, in order that they can speak\u2014having not been at the beginning of the debate, but wishing to speak, if that\u2019s OK with you.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000342\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002202e74c40-9529-4e15-adc2-c032eadc2205\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002233ed70cc8fbd4caeb35bc96a86262f7d\u0022\u003EASSISTANT SPEAKER (Greg O\u2019Connor)\u003C/span\u003E: That\u2019s fine and very magnanimous. Thank you, Mr Seymour.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000343\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022d242e96b2acd4215a219cdc83532b756\u0022\u003EHon DAVID SEYMOUR\u003C/span\u003E: Well, it is Christmas, Mr Speaker, and all people, in the spirit of Christ, deserve forgiveness from time to time. Can I begin my speech time from now?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000344\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003EI rise on behalf of myself, the people of Epsom, and the ACT Party, in support of this bill. The one thing I wanted to say to people of a Christian faith is that this is in no way an offence, an insult, or a slight. I myself am a baptised Presbyterian and someone who believes deeply in the roots of imago Dei, because they tell us that each person has an inherent dignity, being made in the image of God. That is the foundation of my beliefs and it is the foundation of our Western society based on liberalism and each person having equal rights. It also applies to each person who may not have faith and may have different views from yours. It applies to people who have a whole range of aspirations. Sometimes those aspirations are grand and profound, like becoming an astronaut or bringing about world peace. Other times the things that people really want are just to be able to conveniently buy what they need or want at the time that is convenient for them. I actually don\u2019t think that, if you believe in freedom and the dignity and rights of people to choose for themselves, you should discriminate between those large and small wants. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000345\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003EThe next question you should ask is: regardless, what harm does it do to allow a person to go to a shop, which is allowed to be open anyway? We hear that it\u2019s terrible for the employees\u2014to go to a shop that\u2019s allowed to be open anyway, such as a supermarket, and often is open anyway, and be able to buy a bottle of wine to share with their loved ones. People say, \u201COh, you should just get organised earlier.\u201D But why? There is no justification for restricting another person\u2019s freedom to transact with someone else that wants to be there, that wants to do it. They still get time and a half, because it doesn\u2019t change the Holidays Act. They still don\u2019t have to work, because of the Shop Trading Hours Act, but they can work\u2014they can choose to if they want to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000346\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227e22bb95-9afb-449c-bcd2-de9fd4f2277c\u0022\u003EReally, I find it astonishing that we\u2019re even debating something as simple and straightforward as this. Should we allow another person to pursue their dreams and hopes if it does not affect ours? The answer is we should send this bill to select committee so people can do precisely that.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00220ef5a38c-0ef7-4d68-8621-dcbb47077e6e\u0022 data-id=\u00221ef5cbe5ec2048dfa070522181a3386b\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000347\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220ef5a38c-0ef7-4d68-8621-dcbb47077e6e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00221ef5cbe5ec2048dfa070522181a3386b\u0022\u003EHANA-RAWHITI MAIPI-CLARKE (Te P\u0101ti M\u0101ori\u2014Hauraki-Waikato):\u003C/span\u003E T\u0113n\u0101 r\u0101 koe e te P\u012Bka, otir\u0101 t\u0113n\u0101 r\u0101 t\u0101tou e te Whare. I just want to mihi to the member and also his party in reaching out with their different staff on this certain bill, the Repeal of Good Friday\u00A0and Easter Sunday as Restricted Trading Days (Shop Trading and Sale of Alcohol) Amendment Bill. I also just want to provide a bit of clarification that with only five members in our party, it\u2019s pretty hard to get over the select committee process and this at the same time. That\u2019s why we\u2019re running around.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000348\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220ef5a38c-0ef7-4d68-8621-dcbb47077e6e\u0022\u003EThis bill would allow businesses to sell alcohol on Good Friday and Easter Sunday. It would also allow workers to refuse to work without justification on Good Friday and Easter Sunday. There are some good reasons to support this bill. Firstly, this would remove privilege that one religion has over other religions in Aotearoa. Currently, a Christian holiday can dictate a restriction on selling alcohol, but other cultures and belief systems are not afforded that same opportunity\u2014Matariki, for example.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000349\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220ef5a38c-0ef7-4d68-8621-dcbb47077e6e\u0022\u003EThe penalty for not complying with restricted-trading laws is a fine of $1,000. This means that some large businesses are able to pay the fine and sell alcohol anyway. This is unfair to small businesses. I also agree that people should be allowed to refuse to work without justification on Good Friday, but I also think that this right should be extended to all religions and cultural holidays.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000350\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220ef5a38c-0ef7-4d68-8621-dcbb47077e6e\u0022\u003EWhile I support certain aspects of this bill, in our Te P\u0101ti M\u0101ori value system, I cannot, in good conscience, vote in favour of increasing access to alcohol while it continues to harm our people. M\u0101ori suffer disproportionately from alcohol-related harm. Over one-third, 37 percent, of M\u0101ori men were classified as hazardous drinkers compared to 29\u00A0percent of European men. Between 2012 and 2016, the percentage of M\u0101ori women who were considered hazardous drinkers increased from 21 percent to 29 percent.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000351\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220ef5a38c-0ef7-4d68-8621-dcbb47077e6e\u0022\u003EAllowing the sale of alcohol on Good Friday and Easter Sunday will encourage drinking and worsen alcohol-related harm. The Government needs to restrict alcohol advertising and increase funding for alcohol harm reduction strategies before I can support a bill that increases to alcohol. T\u0113n\u0101 r\u0101 t\u0101tou e te Whare.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022b21beb09-9d9b-4414-9bb1-ddba249459d5\u0022 data-id=\u0022fbb1fd995aac4423826cdfa9de0adb71\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000352\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b21beb09-9d9b-4414-9bb1-ddba249459d5\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022fbb1fd995aac4423826cdfa9de0adb71\u0022\u003ETANYA UNKOVICH (NZ First):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Mr Speaker. I rise on behalf of New Zealand First to speak on this conscience vote. I will be personally not supporting it. I do want to thank the member Cameron Luxton for all of the work he has done, and he has done a lot of work in bringing this bill to the House. However, I would like to make some comments on why I personally will not be supporting this bill.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000353\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b21beb09-9d9b-4414-9bb1-ddba249459d5\u0022\u003EI would like to read a quote, if I may: \u201CPublic parks make no economic sense at all. We leave a whole lot of space unbuilt on and not capitalised in any way, but that is not the reason we have them. We have parks because they do us good. \u2026 They do not make economic sense but they do us good.\u201D \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000354\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b21beb09-9d9b-4414-9bb1-ddba249459d5\u0022\u003EThe point I want to make is families\u2014family togetherness, being connected with one another\u2014does us good. It does the family good, it does the community good, and when communities are united, then a country will be united, and at a time when New Zealand needs to be united, I can\u2019t think of a better time for us to encourage togetherness, family, and being together. That is one of the main reasons why I do not support this bill\u2014because I want to encourage family; I want to encourage people coming together again. I know the value of doing that.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000355\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b21beb09-9d9b-4414-9bb1-ddba249459d5\u0022\u003EThere are so many areas that I would like to speak on here, and many have already been mentioned, so I\u2019ll only speak on the ones that I feel are quite important. In one of the documents, the explanatory note starts by saying, \u201CThe bill seeks to remove an extra burden on businesses.\u201D I want to focus on the \u201Cburden\u201D that this might put on family; I want to focus on the burden that it might put on the entrepreneur who desperately wants a break. So many entrepreneurs, solopreneurs, have difficulty in giving themselves permission to have a rest, and they love the opportunity to just do nothing. I know that for many of the people I have spoken to in my previous career, that is one of the things that they find hardest to do\u2014to give themselves permission to stop. I want to think about the children\u2014the partners at home who would rather have their loved one at home on these special days.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000356\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b21beb09-9d9b-4414-9bb1-ddba249459d5\u0022\u003EAs a House, we often talk about mental health and the declining mental health in New Zealand. One of the big contributors to that is loneliness, alcohol. I have spoken to many non-governmental organisations who all say that the last thing they need is another day where someone who is suffering from mental illness can go out and easily get their fix\u2014\u201CThat is the last thing we need. We are struggling. We are at our wit\u2019s end trying to help people\u201D with what they called a \u201Cpandemic of loneliness.\u201D These holidays, Christmas, Easter, Good Friday, those long periods of time when one is struggling with their mental health, it is even harder during these times, because it is a reminder that they are alone, it is a reminder that they aren\u2019t part of a family unit any more, and it is so easy for them to go out there and run away from that.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000357\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b21beb09-9d9b-4414-9bb1-ddba249459d5\u0022\u003EI would also like to, in my time available, speak about the pressure that some workers do have. New Zealand First will always support the workers. I\u2019ve had many communications from families, many of them Christian, reminding me that, actually, 30 percent of the population in our last census were Christians. One father said that his two sons asked their\u00A0employer, \u201CThere is just one day of the week we don\u2019t want to be rostered on please, and it\u2019s a Sunday.\u201D However, they were told that if they didn\u2019t work on a Boxing Day, which was a Sunday, then they would lose their jobs. It does exist\u2014not all employers do that, but it\u00A0does exist that some take advantage of that power over relationships.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000358\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b21beb09-9d9b-4414-9bb1-ddba249459d5\u0022\u003EI really have spoken on most of the things that I would like to speak about, but, really, I think the big one is that I want to focus on family. This is one way that we can focus on family, by ensuring that we give them the permission to be together instead of giving them another reason to not be together and remain busy. Thank you, Mr Speaker.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002255d0b7a4-a2c9-4c38-9b77-475311a48a89\u0022 data-id=\u00228620897cf11946b7b473969e0559f5a7\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000359\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002255d0b7a4-a2c9-4c38-9b77-475311a48a89\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00228620897cf11946b7b473969e0559f5a7\u0022\u003EHon SIMEON BROWN (National\u2014Pakuranga):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Mr Speaker, for the opportunity to take a short call on the Repeal of Good Friday and Easter Sunday as Restricted Trading Days (Shop Trading and Sale of Alcohol) Amendment Bill. I just want to acknowledge on behalf of the National Party that this is a conscience vote. There will be people in this party voting for; there will be people in this party voting against. I think that one of the great things about the National Party is that we allow our members to be able to exercise their conscience and have their say. I will be using my conscience vote and voting against this bill for a number of reasons, but that represents, I think, a significant part of New Zealand which does support the National Party and the values that they hold, and they are representative of a huge number of New Zealanders.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000360\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002255d0b7a4-a2c9-4c38-9b77-475311a48a89\u0022\u003EFirstly, Easter is an incredibly important time in our calendar. Yes, I know that our country is changing, but, ultimately, we also have a history and a heritage of Christian values where we recognise Easter as being an incredibly important part of the calendar, and the rules and regulations around this day have come out of that history and heritage. Not only is that important to recognise but the important time that this provides for people to spend as a family has, I think, actually become how this day has become recognised, how Easter has become recognised, how Christmas has become recognised\u2014as important parts and foundational building blocks of what we have as a country. From my perspective, that is important. It\u2019s worth preserving. I\u2019m a conservative; we preserve things. That\u2019s, ultimately, one of the reasons why I\u2019m voting against this piece of legislation.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000361\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002255d0b7a4-a2c9-4c38-9b77-475311a48a89\u0022\u003ENow, I\u2019ve heard the arguments in favour around supporting choice and supporting businesses to be able to make choices and also individuals being able to make choices, and I appreciate those arguments, but I also would like to point out that there are many businesses, particularly small businesses in New Zealand, who ultimately have very limited choices. I consider a small business in my own electorate, which is a fruit and vegetable shop. It\u2019s a family run business. They open every single day that the supermarket is open, because they, ultimately, don\u2019t have a choice but to compete when they\u2019re in a small business, there are tight margins, and it\u2019s the family running the show. At the moment, they have 3\u00BD days of the year where they don\u2019t open their shop doors. Now, the issue here is we\u2019ve heard about workers\u2019 rights. Businesses like that will, ultimately, be forced into a position where they will be left with only 1\u00BD days of the year where they are able to actually have that time as a family. When we\u2019re talking about a family business, it\u2019s the parents and it\u2019s the children. Ultimately, that choice will be taken away from them if this legislation is able to be passed. Those are small businesses. Many thousands of small businesses, up and down the country, will be put in that position.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000362\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002255d0b7a4-a2c9-4c38-9b77-475311a48a89\u0022\u003EThe second point I\u2019d like to make is that councils do have discretion when it comes to the law already. Different communities have, for a long time, called for the ability to have that flexibility. The 2016 law changes have given councils the opportunity to be able to make different decisions in their communities around how they need to respond. We\u2019ve seen those areas in the country where there is high tourism respond in a way which supports them to be able to meet that need in their community. That allows local communities, through their council, to be able to make those decisions which best reflect the needs of their local community.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000363\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002255d0b7a4-a2c9-4c38-9b77-475311a48a89\u0022\u003EThe final point I want to make is just around the point of consistency, and this point was touched on by my colleague Tim Costley a little bit earlier in the debate. I put it to those who are supporting this bill: if you truly are going to support this bill, why is this not also the \u201CRepeal of Good Friday, Easter Sunday, Christmas Day, and Anzac Day Restriction on Trade Bill\u201D? If you\u2019re going to be consistent and say, \u201CWe\u2019re going to actually repeal the sales on those days.\u201D, you should be prepared to turn up to your electorate or to your community and say you\u2019re also prepared to take Christmas Day and Anzac Day away as well, because all of the same arguments which we\u2019ve heard from the speaker who spoke first\u2014all of those same arguments\u2014can be applied to those other two days too. He hasn\u2019t been prepared to come here and actually put a consistent argument to this House, which is what he should have done if that\u2019s actually what he believes. If that\u2019s what he actually believes, that\u2019s what he should have brought to this House. I say to those members who are considering voting in support of it: that is the consistent position. It\u2019s not a position I support, but that is a position that they should be considering.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00225ec01d23-b55e-45b9-a668-d3bf14212126\u0022 data-id=\u00228a5d9f54c0004598b8e4ae38976b08ae\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000364\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225ec01d23-b55e-45b9-a668-d3bf14212126\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00228a5d9f54c0004598b8e4ae38976b08ae\u0022\u003EHELEN WHITE (Labour\u2014Mt Albert):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Mr Speaker. I rise in quite an astonished state that I\u2019m going to be agreeing with Simeon Brown, and I do it because\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000365\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002255d0b7a4-a2c9-4c38-9b77-475311a48a89\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022db26859a74fb415f996807077e8f973e\u0022\u003EHon Simeon Brown\u003C/span\u003E: First time. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000366\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225ec01d23-b55e-45b9-a668-d3bf14212126\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002290d8a01988b046bd945f8c7aba78944d\u0022\u003EHELEN WHITE\u003C/span\u003E: There really is a first time for everything, and maybe it\u2019s a Christmas spirit issue. I wanted to take the tack, really, to emphasise the issue over the coercive power in this situation, which actually impacts not only on workers but also on business owners, as has been mentioned. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000367\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225ec01d23-b55e-45b9-a668-d3bf14212126\u0022\u003EI was interested to hear so many people comment on the nature of the statutory list of holidays as if they were bound to those very holidays and that there was no movement in those holidays for workers and employers. There is. If you look at section 44 of the Holidays Act, you\u2019ll find that workers can agree with their employers to move to holidays that are, in fact, more conducive to their own religion, etc. I have never seen that happen, and I was doing the job of employment law for a very long time. It doesn\u2019t happen, because people do not negotiate such things. The reality is that most workers are given a set of rules and they agree to them without question, and those rules tend to be the statutory list that we have. That\u2019s a really good demonstration of the lack of bargaining power that is in the average employment relationship. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000368\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225ec01d23-b55e-45b9-a668-d3bf14212126\u0022\u003EThese days that we have set are so minimal when you think about it. Yes, they\u2019re better than America\u2014there, they have 12 days\u2014but, actually, America has all these other different holidays. We get better annual leave than America, but we have actually very little rest time in this country, and employers too are dancing to the tune of the demand of consumers by having to open on those days because their competitors do. In a way, having these days that are a little bit sacred and where we close down our materialism actually protects everybody, and everybody gets a day off consumerism, which doesn\u2019t do them a scrap of harm. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000369\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225ec01d23-b55e-45b9-a668-d3bf14212126\u0022\u003ENow, I want to talk about the alcohol issue, because, again, the member bringing in this bill\u2014and I congratulate him for getting it to us in the ballot. He talked about the issue of the possibility that people who had a negative relationship\u2014I think he called it\u2014with alcohol would go and hoard alcohol. The research suggests that that\u2019s not actually the case, sir. What happens, when there is an issue with alcohol, is that an alcoholic will buy more alcohol if there is availability. If you have shop hours extended for alcohol sales, they will actually go and buy more alcohol at that time. It\u2019s a strangely opportunistic relationship that they have with alcohol. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000370\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225ec01d23-b55e-45b9-a668-d3bf14212126\u0022\u003EBy closing alcohol sales off in time, you actually do affect the ability of people to drink, and it doesn\u2019t affect just the person drinking; it affects their wh\u0101nau. These are days when things shut down and people have a day without the constant tapping in to alcohol as a solution to a problem and doing harm to their families. Now, it\u2019s not all over\u2014obviously, it\u2019s an extremely serious issue in this country. It\u2019s not all over for that family. They still have an alcoholic in their midst, and probably causing havoc, but it\u2019s a damned good start that we signal that it isn\u2019t constantly on tap. It isn\u2019t constantly the crutch to the way that we operate in our families. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000371\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225ec01d23-b55e-45b9-a668-d3bf14212126\u0022\u003EI, for one, am going to vote against this bill because I think it\u2019s incredibly important that we start to rebalance our lives, we start to take seriously our religions and respect the religions in our culture, we take seriously the power dynamic between workers and employers, and we take seriously the need for our smaller businesses to have a day off, too. Actually, they do not have to compete with others who are out there using labour which they have managed to persuade to stay in employment on those days\u2014they\u2019re not using them to undermine competitors who have shut up shop for the day and who want to spend it at the beach with their kids or in their churches. I will not be supporting this bill. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002202e74c40-9529-4e15-adc2-c032eadc2205\u0022 data-id=\u0022d0d137a79ae645d8a32643b806a2aad0\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000372\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002202e74c40-9529-4e15-adc2-c032eadc2205\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022d0d137a79ae645d8a32643b806a2aad0\u0022\u003EASSISTANT SPEAKER (Greg O\u2019Connor)\u003C/span\u003E: This is a 2\u00BD-minute split call. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00221573c6f8-999b-434d-8bde-a47a586ee0f0\u0022 data-id=\u00227a499e54c24e485bb18ef0446d89d838\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000373\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221573c6f8-999b-434d-8bde-a47a586ee0f0\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00227a499e54c24e485bb18ef0446d89d838\u0022\u003EGREG FLEMING (National\u2014Maungakiekie):\u003C/span\u003E For most of my life, I\u2019ve supported restricted trading hours on public holidays. I\u2019ve also implicitly supported restrictions on alcohol sales. I\u2019ve never really been pressed on my reasons, so a default \u201CWell, I think it\u2019s good to have a few days where we all unplugged from consumerism\u201D has sufficed. However, now I\u2019m a lawmaker and my opinions have real consequences. Hence, for several months, I\u2019ve been thinking deeply about this issue and I\u2019ve changed my mind. Here\u2019s why.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000374\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221573c6f8-999b-434d-8bde-a47a586ee0f0\u0022\u003EThere are two essential critiques of the proposed changes, and we\u2019ve heard them both\u00A0repeatedly here. The first one is about the protection for employees. To my mind, that has been well canvassed. The reality of it is that Easter Sunday is already unique in legislation in New Zealand. It\u2019s great for all people who consider that as an incredibly special day, like myself, and this bill extends that to Good Friday. These two days will literally be unique in employment law. For those people who say that we can\u2019t trust the law, then, as lawmakers, we have a deeper issue than the one before us. We need to trust the enforcement of our laws.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000375\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221573c6f8-999b-434d-8bde-a47a586ee0f0\u0022\u003EThe second critique is a version of the one I long held\u2014i.e., it\u2019s healthy to have a few days\u00A0each year where the shops are closed and alcohol is less available. Others also add that\u00A0it\u2019s important to honour Easter. As I tested my opinion, I reminded myself that law restricts human freedoms. This is a serious matter and thus must be well justified. To my understanding, those two justifications are: to protect people and our world from exploitation or harm, and to, secondly, maximise participation or access. I do not consider the Easter restrictions on trading and liquor meet either of those tests, particularly given the clear protection of employees as discussed. Enforcing rest time does not meet those tests.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000376\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221573c6f8-999b-434d-8bde-a47a586ee0f0\u0022\u003EFor many, shopping, or indeed working, is their fulfilling activity. On what basis should a Government tell them otherwise? Some argue that for people to have the right to shop, others must work, but as already explained, the protected choice of those workers is guaranteed. I am also mindful that while we forbid service workers to labour, there\u2019s no such prohibition for those in offices, including political. Others argue that people don\u2019t need to shop and or buy alcohol every day. That may be true, but, again, it\u2019s insufficient justification for Government restricting freedom of activity. We wouldn\u2019t stop trading and alcohol sales on every Sunday, nor would we legislate for Dry July.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000377\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221573c6f8-999b-434d-8bde-a47a586ee0f0\u0022\u003EI have the rest of my speech here; I\u2019m not going to get to it. I\u2019m very happy to send it out to any members who\u2019d be interested in reading it\u2014it\u2019s obviously going to be after the fact. I commend this bill to the House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00229634e377-7e76-4353-9662-fb444eb2ec9d\u0022 data-id=\u0022c2ed9c6934434c98be0832cf33017f30\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000378\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00229634e377-7e76-4353-9662-fb444eb2ec9d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022c2ed9c6934434c98be0832cf33017f30\u0022\u003ECARL BATES (National\u2014Whanganui):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Mr Speaker. I want to acknowledge the work of Cameron in this process. As the member knows, I rise to speak in opposition to the Repeal of Good Friday and Easter Sunday as Restricted Trading Days (Shop Trading and Sale of Alcohol) Amendment Bill. Very quickly, there are a few things I wish to touch on. Firstly, localism: if this House truly believes in the concept of localism, what is the\u00A0problem we\u2019re trying to solve? Forty-three of our local and regional councils currently have policies to localise their trading rules. The fact that some of those lapsed maybe indicates the underlying real view of New Zealand when it comes to this policy.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000379\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00229634e377-7e76-4353-9662-fb444eb2ec9d\u0022\u003ESecondly: employee rights. I acknowledge this bill could address the fact that employees are required to work on Easter Friday. This bill would mean that they could choose not to work on Easter Friday and Easter Sunday. However, the cost of that is removing the significance of these two days. I feel that this is then, simply, a slippery slope to Christmas and Easter. I remain very sceptical that employee protections provide real-world protection. They are good in theory, but, in this case, questionable in practice. The inconsistency of the argument related to Anzac and Christmas Day by allowing this bill to proceed, in my view, is a step towards those two things happening. Whether you are of the Christian faith or not, Easter has a special place in New Zealand\u2019s history, and this should be maintained. The online argument is also just not solid. Taking this to conclusion would require every retail store to open 24/7, 365 days a year. It\u2019s an abolitionist argument that does not hold.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000380\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00229634e377-7e76-4353-9662-fb444eb2ec9d\u0022\u003EMy colleague Carlos Cheung asked me to mention the concern regarding alcohol harm. Ultimately, the underlying intent is the recognition of these two days in our national calendar and the history that this has can\u2019t be ignored when considering alcohol sales on Easter Friday and Easter Sunday. I do not commend this bill to the House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000381\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002202e74c40-9529-4e15-adc2-c032eadc2205\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022d033cfa254c4451ebc69b07460cd31d0\u0022\u003EASSISTANT SPEAKER (Greg O\u2019Connor)\u003C/span\u003E: In reply, Cameron Luxton. Can I indicate there will be a vote at the conclusion of this speech.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022cfc7092e-b202-4acf-aa9c-8aebd551cc39\u0022 data-id=\u00224f4ab3c85d7d4d86b4ee1cfea23f749a\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000382\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cfc7092e-b202-4acf-aa9c-8aebd551cc39\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00224f4ab3c85d7d4d86b4ee1cfea23f749a\u0022\u003ECAMERON LUXTON (ACT):\u003C/span\u003E Thank you, Mr Speaker. I\u2019m going to try and make my reply brief so that members can get their conscience recorded and get off and enjoy the summer holidays.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000383\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cfc7092e-b202-4acf-aa9c-8aebd551cc39\u0022\u003EBriefly going quickly through it, Camilla Belich\u2014I deeply appreciated being able to engage with Camilla in the process. I did actually make a lot of overtures to the Labour Party as a whole, and specific members in the Labour Party, so it\u2019s unfortunate that Rachel Boyack either didn\u2019t receive that message or didn\u2019t reach back out with her concerns, because I would have liked to engage with her. Showing that the rules weren\u2019t followed, I think my colleague over here\u2014Greg Fleming, who gave a great speech about the way he\u2019s changed and evolved his thinking on this\u2014shows that as lawmakers we should be respecting the law, not just saying, \u201COK, someone\u2019s ignored the law, therefore the entire concept of governing through law is void.\u201D\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000384\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cfc7092e-b202-4acf-aa9c-8aebd551cc39\u0022\u003EThe question about not having time and a half on Saturday that Rachel Boyack also brought up, that is something that can be negotiated, but there will be time and a half pay on Good Friday, which is what my bill is seeking to change. It doesn\u2019t change Easter Sunday, which is currently the case.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000385\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cfc7092e-b202-4acf-aa9c-8aebd551cc39\u0022\u003EGoing through it\u2014Te P\u0101ti M\u0101ori, I\u2019m glad to hear that you\u2019ve thought deeply about this, and I appreciate that you have been engaging with me on this. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000386\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cfc7092e-b202-4acf-aa9c-8aebd551cc39\u0022\u003EI think that the idea that restricting the sale of alcohol, as the member from the Labour Party Helen White said, increases the harm works if you think about it as in just a quick grab off the shelf, but if you\u2019re thinking about it in a way that someone who has got alcohol-dependency issues may feel rather nervous that they\u2019re not going to have access to that and stock up, maybe by three dozen instead of two dozen for the weekend, the worst thing we can be doing is locking people in their homes with the alcohol which is causing them so much harm.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000387\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cfc7092e-b202-4acf-aa9c-8aebd551cc39\u0022\u003EThere were a couple of members who raised the slippery-slope argument that this is going to lead to the removal of Christmas and Anzac Day. The reason for bringing this bill isn\u2019t because of an attack of we just want to get rid of religious\u2014as I gave in my speech, I deeply hold respect for the founding religion of our country. This hasn\u2019t been a debate to try and extend the slippery slope out to include Anzac and Christmas; what it is doing is addressing the concerns that address the confusion throughout the country that New Zealanders experience every year. Nobody is confused about Christmas. No one is confused about Anzac Day. These are religious and secular days, and they should be treated with the respect that they deserve, in the same way that New Zealanders should be treated with the respect that they deserve and treated like adults over the Easter weekend.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000388\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cfc7092e-b202-4acf-aa9c-8aebd551cc39\u0022\u003EThe Greens\u2014we often hear that the Greens want a conscience vote in this House. Well, here\u2019s a chance to use it. It\u2019ll be interesting to see if, as the polling shows that 62 percent of their supporters, as with the Labour Party, support this change\u2014we\u2019ll be interested to see if 62 percent of their members exercise their conscience vote and represent their voters. I commend this bill to the House, and I thank you very much for the opportunity.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002202e74c40-9529-4e15-adc2-c032eadc2205\u0022 data-id=\u0022868b03ad52884f13a64488106eb70595\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000389\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002202e74c40-9529-4e15-adc2-c032eadc2205\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022868b03ad52884f13a64488106eb70595\u0022\u003EASSISTANT SPEAKER (Greg O\u2019Connor)\u003C/span\u003E: I\u2019ve determined that the subject of this vote will be treated as a conscience issue. In this case, I know that there are members who want a personal vote, and I am prepared to accept one.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca id=\u0022477eab230ad948b9a25e2c0cd1e92128\u0022 name=\u0022division\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EA personal vote was called for on the question, That the Repeal of Good Friday and Easter Sunday as Restricted Trading Days (Shop Trading and Sale of Alcohol) Amendment Bill be now read a first time.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EAyes 49\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cdiv class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\n        \u003Cdiv class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022\u003E\n          \u003Ctable\u003E\n            \u003Ctr\u003E\n              \u003Ctd\u003EAnderson\u003C/td\u003E\n              \u003Ctd\u003EGrigg (P)\u003C/td\u003E\n              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(P)\u003C/td\u003E\n              \u003Ctd\u003ESimpson\u003C/td\u003E\n              \u003Ctd\u003E\u003C/td\u003E\n            \u003C/tr\u003E\n            \u003Ctr\u003E\n              \u003Ctd\u003EFleming\u003C/td\u003E\n              \u003Ctd\u003EMcKee\u003C/td\u003E\n              \u003Ctd\u003ESmith (P)\u003C/td\u003E\n              \u003Ctd\u003E\u003C/td\u003E\n            \u003C/tr\u003E\n          \u003C/table\u003E\n        \u003C/div\u003E\n      \u003C/div\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENoes 74\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cdiv class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\n        \u003Cdiv class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022\u003E\n          \u003Ctable\u003E\n            \u003Ctr\u003E\n              \u003Ctd\u003EAbel (P)\u003C/td\u003E\n              \u003Ctd\u003EFoster\u003C/td\u003E\n              \u003Ctd\u003EMcLellan (P)\u003C/td\u003E\n              \u003Ctd\u003ESosene (P)\u003C/td\u003E\n            \u003C/tr\u003E\n            \u003Ctr\u003E\n              \u003Ctd\u003EAndersen (P)\u003C/td\u003E\n              \u003Ctd\u003EGarcia (P)\u003C/td\u003E\n              \u003Ctd\u003EMen\u00E9ndez March (P)\u003C/td\u003E\n              \u003Ctd\u003ESwarbrick (P)\u003C/td\u003E\n            \u003C/tr\u003E\n            \u003Ctr\u003E\n              \u003Ctd\u003EArbuckle\u003C/td\u003E\n              \u003Ctd\u003EGenter (P)\u003C/td\u003E\n              \u003Ctd\u003ENakhle (P)\u003C/td\u003E\n              \u003Ctd\u003ETangaere-Manuel (P)\u003C/td\u003E\n            \u003C/tr\u003E\n            \u003Ctr\u003E\n              \u003Ctd\u003EBates\u003C/td\u003E\n              \u003Ctd\u003EGoldsmith (P)\u003C/td\u003E\n              \u003Ctd\u003ENgarewa-Packer\u003C/td\u003E\n              \u003Ctd\u003ETinetti (P)\u003C/td\u003E\n            \u003C/tr\u003E\n            \u003Ctr\u003E\n              \u003Ctd\u003EBayly (P)\u003C/td\u003E\n              \u003Ctd\u003EHalbert (P)\u003C/td\u003E\n              \u003Ctd\u003EO\u2019Connor D\u003C/td\u003E\n              \u003Ctd\u003ETuiono (P)\u003C/td\u003E\n            \u003C/tr\u003E\n            \u003Ctr\u003E\n              \u003Ctd\u003EBelich\u003C/td\u003E\n              \u003Ctd\u003EHenare (P)\u003C/td\u003E\n              \u003Ctd\u003EO\u2019Connor G\u003C/td\u003E\n              \u003Ctd\u003ETwyford (P)\u003C/td\u003E\n            \u003C/tr\u003E\n            \u003Ctr\u003E\n              \u003Ctd\u003EBennett\u003C/td\u003E\n              \u003Ctd\u003EHernandez (P)\u003C/td\u003E\n              \u003Ctd\u003EParker (P)\u003C/td\u003E\n              \u003Ctd\u003EUnkovich (P)\u003C/td\u003E\n            \u003C/tr\u003E\n            \u003Ctr\u003E\n              \u003Ctd\u003EBoyack\u003C/td\u003E\n              \u003Ctd\u003EHipkins (P)\u003C/td\u003E\n              \u003Ctd\u003EPatterson\u003C/td\u003E\n              \u003Ctd\u003EUtikere (P)\u003C/td\u003E\n            \u003C/tr\u003E\n            \u003Ctr\u003E\n              \u003Ctd\u003EBrooking (P)\u003C/td\u003E\n              \u003Ctd\u003EJackson (P)\u003C/td\u003E\n              \u003Ctd\u003EPaul (P)\u003C/td\u003E\n              \u003Ctd\u003EVerrall (P)\u003C/td\u003E\n            \u003C/tr\u003E\n            \u003Ctr\u003E\n              \u003Ctd\u003EBrown\u003C/td\u003E\n              \u003Ctd\u003EJones (P)\u003C/td\u003E\n              \u003Ctd\u003EPeters (P)\u003C/td\u003E\n              \u003Ctd\u003EWade-Brown (P)\u003C/td\u003E\n            \u003C/tr\u003E\n            \u003Ctr\u003E\n              \u003Ctd\u003EBrownlee (P)\u003C/td\u003E\n              \u003Ctd\u003EKapa-Kingi\u003C/td\u003E\n              \u003Ctd\u003EPham\u003C/td\u003E\n              \u003Ctd\u003EWaititi \u003C/td\u003E\n            \u003C/tr\u003E\n            \u003Ctr\u003E\n              \u003Ctd\u003ECarter (P)\u003C/td\u003E\n              \u003Ctd\u003EKemp (P)\u003C/td\u003E\n              \u003Ctd\u003EPotaka (P)\u003C/td\u003E\n              \u003Ctd\u003EWebb (P)\u003C/td\u003E\n            \u003C/tr\u003E\n            \u003Ctr\u003E\n              \u003Ctd\u003ECheung\u003C/td\u003E\n              \u003Ctd\u003ELeary (P)\u003C/td\u003E\n              \u003Ctd\u003EPrime (P)\u003C/td\u003E\n              \u003Ctd\u003EWhite \u003C/td\u003E\n            \u003C/tr\u003E\n            \u003Ctr\u003E\n              \u003Ctd\u003ECostello (P)\u003C/td\u003E\n              \u003Ctd\u003ELu (P)\u003C/td\u003E\n              \u003Ctd\u003ERadhakrishnan (P)\u003C/td\u003E\n              \u003Ctd\u003EWilliams (P)\u003C/td\u003E\n            \u003C/tr\u003E\n            \u003Ctr\u003E\n              \u003Ctd\u003EDavidson M (P)\u003C/td\u003E\n              \u003Ctd\u003ELuxton J (P)\u003C/td\u003E\n              \u003Ctd\u003ERurawhe (P)\u003C/td\u003E\n              \u003Ctd\u003EWillis S (P)\u003C/td\u003E\n            \u003C/tr\u003E\n            \u003Ctr\u003E\n              \u003Ctd\u003EDavidson R (P)\u003C/td\u003E\n              \u003Ctd\u003ELyndon (P)\u003C/td\u003E\n              \u003Ctd\u003ERussell (P)\u003C/td\u003E\n              \u003Ctd\u003EWoods (P)\u003C/td\u003E\n            \u003C/tr\u003E\n            \u003Ctr\u003E\n              \u003Ctd\u003EDoyle (P)\u003C/td\u003E\n              \u003Ctd\u003EMaipi-Clarke\u003C/td\u003E\n              \u003Ctd\u003ESalesa (P)\u003C/td\u003E\n              \u003Ctd\u003EXu-Nan (P)\u003C/td\u003E\n            \u003C/tr\u003E\n            \u003Ctr\u003E\n              \u003Ctd\u003EEdmonds (P)\u003C/td\u003E\n              \u003Ctd\u003EMarcroft (P)\u003C/td\u003E\n              \u003Ctd\u003ESepuloni (P)\u003C/td\u003E\n              \u003Ctd\u003E\u003C/td\u003E\n            \u003C/tr\u003E\n            \u003Ctr\u003E\n              \u003Ctd\u003EFerris (P)\u003C/td\u003E\n              \u003Ctd\u003EMcAnulty (P)\u003C/td\u003E\n              \u003Ctd\u003ESimmonds (P)\u003C/td\u003E\n              \u003Ctd\u003E\u003C/td\u003E\n            \u003C/tr\u003E\n          \u003C/table\u003E\n        \u003C/div\u003E\n      \u003C/div\u003E\n      \u003Cp class=\u0022HpsDivision\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EMotion not agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002202e74c40-9529-4e15-adc2-c032eadc2205\u0022 data-id=\u00223b5734598e8741dcbc2253d5ba4b0bb7\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000390\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002202e74c40-9529-4e15-adc2-c032eadc2205\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00223b5734598e8741dcbc2253d5ba4b0bb7\u0022\u003EASSISTANT SPEAKER (Greg O\u2019Connor)\u003C/span\u003E: The House is adjourned until 2 p.m. Thank you, members.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000391\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002202e74c40-9529-4e15-adc2-c032eadc2205\u0022\u003EThe House adjourned at 1.21 p.m.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20241217138ee1488ad94ed39651236bcb922710000392\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002202e74c40-9529-4e15-adc2-c032eadc2205\u0022\u003E\u003Cbr\u003E\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n    \u003C/div\u003E\n  \u003C/body\u003E\n\u003C/html\u003E"