"\u003C!DOCTYPE html\u003E\u003Chtml xmlns:xlink=\u0022http://www.w3.org/1999/xlink\u0022 xmlns:xsi=\u0022http://www.w3.org/2007/XMLSchema-instance\u0022 xmlns:mml=\u0022http://www.w3.org/1998/Math/MathML\u0022\u003E\n  \u003Chead\u003E\n    \u003CMETA http-equiv=\u0022Content-Type\u0022 content=\u0022text/html; charset=utf-16\u0022\u003E\n    \u003Cmeta name=\u0022viewport\u0022 content=\u0022width=device-width, initial-scale=1\u0022\u003E\n  \u003C/head\u003E\n  \u003Cbody style=\u0022font-family:sans-serif; font-size:100%;\u0022\u003E\n    \u003Cdiv class=\u0022HpsHansard\u0022\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000000\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u002243c285b2e1b107b69c4d5270f9448bfa\u0022\u003EThursday, 12 March 2026\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000001\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022CharacterBold\u0022\u003EThe Speaker\u003C/span\u003E took the Chair at 2 p.m.\u003C/p\u003E\n    \u003C/div\u003E\n    \u003Cdiv class=\u0022HpsHansard\u0022\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000002\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsProceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u0022ca055bc3564dbebe0c3bc7ddb06d09a2\u0022\u003EStart of Sitting Day\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000003\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u0022919a77353ac8a965373bc3cd53cdc6dc\u0022\u003EKarakia/Prayers\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00224cf6752dabf34d0eb8ae92457823e4ba\u0022 data-id=\u00228bfb4c941b1eb23929e1659d0964016e\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000004\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00224cf6752dabf34d0eb8ae92457823e4ba\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00228bfb4c941b1eb23929e1659d0964016e\u0022\u003EBARBARA KURIGER (Deputy Speaker) (14:00)\u003C/span\u003E: Almighty God, we give thanks for the blessings which have been bestowed on us. Laying aside all personal interests, we acknowledge the King and pray for guidance in our deliberations, that we may conduct the affairs of this House with wisdom, justice, mercy, and humility for the welfare and the peace of New Zealand. Amen.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n    \u003C/div\u003E\n    \u003Cdiv class=\u0022HpsHansard\u0022\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000005\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsProceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u00228e493e0158349241d0cc1216851be68d\u0022\u003EPersonal Explanations\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000006\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u0022ff3307ad08a5696d46aaba489c999583\u0022\u003EQuestion No. 6 to Minister, 11 March 2026\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000007\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u0022cd74c37c748940e48b7871d05a2333a2\u0022\u003EAmended Answer to Oral Question\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002276109ca9c1c74181a1e2734802d7f46f\u0022 data-id=\u002217814356907639fa0ab7fc2496a749f2\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000008\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002276109ca9c1c74181a1e2734802d7f46f\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002217814356907639fa0ab7fc2496a749f2\u0022\u003EHon SIMEON BROWN (Minister of Health) (14:01)\u003C/span\u003E: Point of order. I seek leave to make a personal explanation to correct an answer to an oral question.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000009\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a2d138cbb839455d9754acbe91a75102\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022410673a62499ab28ee78cbbfb4428d3d\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Leave is sought for that purpose. Is there any objection? There appears to be none.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000010\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002276109ca9c1c74181a1e2734802d7f46f\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00227eceb7f2c0e0998e64d12a0f359f85a0\u0022\u003EHon SIMEON BROWN\u003C/span\u003E: In answer to question No. 6 yesterday, I said that vaccine mandates and workplace settings for the 12- to 17-year age group remained in place until late January 2022. This was based on written Ministry of Health advice which the ministry has since acknowledged was incorrect, as it related to booster mandates rather than the primary two-dose series. The correct position is that these mandates remained in place until 4 April 2022.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n    \u003C/div\u003E\n    \u003Cdiv class=\u0022HpsHansard\u0022\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000011\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsProceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u0022ce2efb6a7edda824b119e7167a098b9f\u0022\u003EBusiness of the House\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000012\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u0022ef62ec5bb309a3077547e24371e7debe\u0022\u003EBusiness Statement\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022a1901a44e88e40d095f26c06ebac9721\u0022 data-id=\u0022d0e13f4c94eec1fa1316f6c1e46e045c\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000013\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a1901a44e88e40d095f26c06ebac9721\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022d0e13f4c94eec1fa1316f6c1e46e045c\u0022\u003EHon LOUISE UPSTON (Deputy Leader of the House) (14:01)\u003C/span\u003E: Thank you, Mr Speaker. Today, the House will adjourn until Tuesday, 24 March. That week, the House will consider the Taxation (Annual Rates for 2024\u201325, Emergency Response, and Remedial Measures) Bill, the Local Government (Auckland Council) (Transport Governance) Amendment Bill, and the Antisocial Road Use Legislation Amendment Bill. On Wednesday, the general debate will be replaced by a debate on the Budget Policy Statement, and the hours of Wednesday will be extended into Thursday morning.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n    \u003C/div\u003E\n    \u003Cdiv class=\u0022HpsHansard\u0022\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000014\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsProceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u002204f8b8ca9a7b5bef05f47580d56a5f0e\u0022\u003EPresentation\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000015\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u00224da4c31bf5272bb8d4927b4f46a762ce\u0022\u003EPetitions\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022a2d138cbb839455d9754acbe91a75102\u0022 data-id=\u00221fe804cc6916c1768e82236a35eb7c17\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000016\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a2d138cbb839455d9754acbe91a75102\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00221fe804cc6916c1768e82236a35eb7c17\u0022\u003ESPEAKER (14:02)\u003C/span\u003E: A petition has been delivered to the Clerk for presentation.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000017\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002245292f6e5c3509921b4096d5fa27b858\u0022\u003ECLERK (14:02): \u003C/span\u003EPetition of Consumer New Zealand requesting that the House urge the relevant Minister to recommend regulations under the Civil Aviation Act that require airlines to tell passengers about their rights when their flights are disrupted.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000018\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a2d138cbb839455d9754acbe91a75102\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022e1c5a8d191201e4dcd53070e0c370852\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: That petition is referred to the Petitions Committee.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000019\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u00220ca2d32f9e9c254de4e67aa0325a61f3\u0022\u003EPapers\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022a2d138cbb839455d9754acbe91a75102\u0022 data-id=\u002242669327c8bcdb25fe06d97d56df347a\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000020\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a2d138cbb839455d9754acbe91a75102\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002242669327c8bcdb25fe06d97d56df347a\u0022\u003ESPEAKER (14:02)\u003C/span\u003E: I present the report of the Controller and Auditor-General entitled \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsCharacterItalics\u0022\u003EChatham Islands Council: Inquiry into sensitive expenditure and procurement\u003C/span\u003E, and that paper is published under the authority of the House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000021\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u002203aed143ff37fad73dcf16f6a2708a73\u0022\u003ESelect Committee Reports\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022a2d138cbb839455d9754acbe91a75102\u0022 data-id=\u00224e6b1e0ac5680b05d4af1fc310d422ce\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000022\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a2d138cbb839455d9754acbe91a75102\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00224e6b1e0ac5680b05d4af1fc310d422ce\u0022\u003ESPEAKER (14:03)\u003C/span\u003E: Four select committee reports have been delivered for presentation.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000023\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022e69e48a0a0f622324d99a8e60c222306\u0022\u003ECLERK (14:03): \u003C/span\u003EReports of the Social Services and Community Committee on the 2024-25 annual reviews of the:\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000024\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItemSL1\u0022\u003EMinistry of Housing and Urban Development\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000025\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItemSL1\u0022\u003EMinistry of Social Development\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000026\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItemSL1\u0022\u003ESocial Investment Agency, and\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000027\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItemSL1\u0022\u003ESport Integrity Commission.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000028\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a2d138cbb839455d9754acbe91a75102\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00225ba51f3df931b7e76b32d2e8be583277\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: No bills have been introduced.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n    \u003C/div\u003E\n    \u003Cdiv class=\u0022HpsHansard\u0022\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000029\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsProceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u0022d6ad11f554cb58ea0635ed8bf769fd28\u0022\u003EPoints of Order\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000030\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u00228f8dc3add65171600371ef3e7970e7f3\u0022\u003EOral Questions\u2014Ministerial Responsibility and Royal Commission INQUIRY into COVID-19\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002271d8acf3a6f0476999f9d03b4ae70e7d\u0022 data-id=\u002256e7c4f9573aa4f5d94fb2cb5179585d\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000031\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002271d8acf3a6f0476999f9d03b4ae70e7d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002256e7c4f9573aa4f5d94fb2cb5179585d\u0022\u003EHon SHANE JONES (Minister for Oceans and Fisheries) (14:03)\u003C/span\u003E: Point of order. Sir, Standing Order 390 deals with the conduct of members, the quality of questions, and I\u2019m seeking some guidance from you. The Rt Hon Winston Peters and a host of others addressed yesterday and the day before some very important issues related to the royal commission related to the COVID inquiry. Question time is an opportunity for us as members to test what falls within the responsibility of given Ministers. The Minister of Health has been given responsibility for the carriage of the royal commission and what responses may come from the Crown.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000032\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EI seek some guidance from you to the extent that question time can continually be used for us to go to the nub of this issue. Testing what officials have done, testing what former publicly elected Ministers may have done or not done is surely a constitutional right of us as members. Then why are we being closed down, yesterday and the day before, in terms of apparently eliciting opinions when opinions are very, very much permissible in terms of a Minister\u2019s responses if that Minister holds responsibility for something, which the Hon Simeon Brown does\u2014i.e., the royal commission?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000033\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENow, I know that the various Speakers\u2019 rulings are somewhat awkward, but Speakers\u2019 rulings, not the least of which 200/5 and onwards, make it absolutely clear that what my colleague was doing is within the Standing Orders and within Speakers\u2019 rulings.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000034\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENow, you are right to ensure that we don\u2019t stray too far from what Standing Order 390 requires, but, for a host of New Zealanders, whether or not their children may suffer long-term illness is something that we are entitled to inquire into. Can you provide some clarification, please?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022a2d138cbb839455d9754acbe91a75102\u0022 data-id=\u00228d88e1d1dd0fada958824f4f7dfc22eb\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000035\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a2d138cbb839455d9754acbe91a75102\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00228d88e1d1dd0fada958824f4f7dfc22eb\u0022\u003ESPEAKER (14:05)\u003C/span\u003E: Well, firstly, thank you for acknowledging that you consider that I was at least partially right, in your opinion. I did think, as I saw a question on the sheet today that I thought was going to go to this matter, that I should come to the House prepared to answer some of the questions that you have just outlined.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000036\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EYou\u2019re right to say that the purpose of question time is to scrutinise the current executive and hold it to account. For that reason, Ministers are required to answer in a way that addresses the question, if they can do so consistent with public interest. That is providing the question is consistent, itself, with the Standing Orders and Speakers\u2019 rulings.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000037\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENow, despite what you think, I didn\u2019t shut down questions yesterday; I simply said some questions could be worded better, and, indeed, they were. In considering the public interest, Ministers may address principles such as privacy or national security, but they should not use it in a way of avoiding scrutiny under Standing Order 396 and Speaker\u2019s ruling 199/6. It\u2019s for Ministers, not the Speaker, to judge the public interest\u2014Speaker\u2019s ruling 199/6. Consideration of public interest applies to answers to questions rather than to the asking of questions.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000038\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EThe primary condition in asking a question is ministerial responsibility. Ministers may only be asked about \u201Cpublic affairs [for] which [they] are officially connected, proceedings of the House or [matters] of administration for which [they are] responsible\u201D\u2014Standing Order 388. \u201CIf there is no ministerial responsibility, there can be no questions.\u201D\u2014Speaker\u2019s ruling 173/5; Ministers are not responsible to the House for the action of previous Governments or of political parties\u2014Speakers\u2019 rulings 178/3 and 178/4. \u201CIn respect of the activities of [a] previous Government, which the Minister has had to confront as a Minister \u2026 it is legitimate \u2026 to comment on those,\u201D\u2014Speakers\u2019 ruling 180/4. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000039\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EThe question would go to: how is the comment elicited by way of the question? That does not open the door to using questions from governing parties to attack other members, Speakers\u2019 ruling 181/3, or to bring parties not involved in the question into the answer\u2014Speaker\u2019s rulings 200/5 and 200/4. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000040\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EThe question that you started asking was: if there was public interest in this, how are we to get to the nub of the matter? I would have thought that was the purpose of selecting the royal commission itself and for having a royal commission report. How the Government deals with it may well be questioned.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002271d8acf3a6f0476999f9d03b4ae70e7d\u0022 data-id=\u002279841abf395533c5ec13e69dea332ca6\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000041\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002271d8acf3a6f0476999f9d03b4ae70e7d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002279841abf395533c5ec13e69dea332ca6\u0022\u003EHon SHANE JONES (Minister for Oceans and Fisheries) (14:09)\u003C/span\u003E: Point of order. Are you saying that Speaker\u2019s ruling 200/5 does not apply to us inquiring into how this Minister intends to account to New Zealanders for content in a royal commission report which raises extraordinarily dangerous questions about either negligence or wilful ignorance?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022a2d138cbb839455d9754acbe91a75102\u0022 data-id=\u0022aeb86f568e96542024aa090abe58dfc8\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000042\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a2d138cbb839455d9754acbe91a75102\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022aeb86f568e96542024aa090abe58dfc8\u0022\u003ESPEAKER (14:09)\u003C/span\u003E: No, I\u2019m not saying that. Speakers\u2019 ruling 205/5 says, \u201CMinisters should not commence an answer to a question with a political attack on the person asking the question.\u201D Now, that\u2019s not happened, as far as I know. The questions were asked from the Government side and answered from the Government side. \u201CThis is totally outside Standing Orders. (2)\u201D\u2014to follow that other course of action\u2014\u201C[It\u2019s] especially true of answers to written questions\u201D, and it goes on in that vein.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000043\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsContinued\u0022\u003EBut in the end, the Minister has responsibility for response to a royal commission. Questions can be asked about how he\u2019s going to respond to that. The question itself should not contain attacks on other members in the House. That\u2019s the longstanding practice here, not brought in by me but going back as far as 1929.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002271d8acf3a6f0476999f9d03b4ae70e7d\u0022 data-id=\u0022c0c596d59507d5b52b20436ed67f6c99\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000044\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002271d8acf3a6f0476999f9d03b4ae70e7d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022c0c596d59507d5b52b20436ed67f6c99\u0022\u003EHon SHANE JONES (Minister for Oceans and Fisheries) (14:10)\u003C/span\u003E: Point of order. Thank you for that response, but, inevitably, when my colleague is inquiring and testing the knowledge of the Minister\u2014and in his interactions, he\u2019s not only responsible to the House but to the public\u2014how do you imagine we are going to avoid a situation where we are commenting on the office holders who may have done wrong or who may have been called out by the commission in terms of not providing adequate information to assure New Zealanders that their children are not going to get ill? That\u2019s more than reasonable for a type of question.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022a2d138cbb839455d9754acbe91a75102\u0022 data-id=\u002219c19d5a70e8c15234fe8a56ab6df483\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000045\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a2d138cbb839455d9754acbe91a75102\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002219c19d5a70e8c15234fe8a56ab6df483\u0022\u003ESPEAKER (14:11)\u003C/span\u003E: Well, the question would be, then, to the Minister\u2014effectively, asking what the public can see for themselves by reading the royal commission report, and what does the commission say about these matters, but it cannot be an attack on the individual. That\u2019s the constraint that is put on questions for the ability for the executive to be scrutinised.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n    \u003C/div\u003E\n    \u003Cdiv class=\u0022HpsHansard\u0022\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000046\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsProceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u0022dad44f3d865ab4936e8ebb7190f9a30b\u0022\u003EOral Questions to Ministers\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000047\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u00229251b9e1369ed6b416661288f6985d2e\u0022\u003ESocial Development and Employment\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000048\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u00222557b73d39a627fc5c3e420f4e7a75bf\u0022\u003EQuestion No. 1\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022083a816abbb847f0a99aff178b1bbba2\u0022 data-id=\u0022da63c98cddf46cdc0a797879c320f120\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000049\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022083a816abbb847f0a99aff178b1bbba2\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022da63c98cddf46cdc0a797879c320f120\u0022\u003EHon CARMEL SEPULONI (Deputy Leader\u2014Labour) (14:11)\u003C/span\u003E to the \u003Cspan class=\u0022CharacterBold\u0022\u003EMinister for Social Development and Employment\u003C/span\u003E: How many more people are receiving the jobseeker support benefit today compared to when the Government took office in 2023?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022a1901a44e88e40d095f26c06ebac9721\u0022 data-id=\u0022001ae5b74feb0932e0d3a9dbaccb73ec\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000050\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a1901a44e88e40d095f26c06ebac9721\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022001ae5b74feb0932e0d3a9dbaccb73ec\u0022\u003EHon LOUISE UPSTON (Minister for Social Development and Employment) (14:11)\u003C/span\u003E: Labour left our Government with challenging economic conditions, with close to 190,000 people\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000051\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a2d138cbb839455d9754acbe91a75102\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022b67feca88e124952f9e91aba957df47d\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: There is a different way to start that answer, and I\u2019d suggest you use it.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000052\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a1901a44e88e40d095f26c06ebac9721\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022bb1af6f24c40dfd073d40e3afba62ee3\u0022\u003EHon LOUISE UPSTON\u003C/span\u003E: Point of order.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000053\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a2d138cbb839455d9754acbe91a75102\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a504df0fb31deae2adb891a42a0c00c9\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: I\u2019m not giving you instruction, but point of order, the Hon Louise Upston.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000054\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a1901a44e88e40d095f26c06ebac9721\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022f8296f0405901e3521c678967c11e779\u0022\u003EHon LOUISE UPSTON\u003C/span\u003E: Just in terms of the interchange that you had with the Hon Shane Jones, one of the points was the ability of a Minister to answer a question in terms of the context or the circumstances in which they came into office. So I would have thought that that answer that I had started was in order.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000055\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a2d138cbb839455d9754acbe91a75102\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022d84f85d0a7f9d23f63643bd88e465817\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Yes, I know you did; that\u2019s why you started it. But I think there is a different way of wording it.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000056\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b27d6090c07e47fb960e52f168ce01b3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022b988c8b574894878d414d48cdfc50b9d\u0022\u003EHon Kieran McAnulty\u003C/span\u003E: Speaking to the point of order, sir. Thank you, sir. This was a primary question on notice, and Speakers\u2019 rulings are quite clear that if a question is political in nature, then members should expect a political response. But when not only is it on notice but the content of the question is such that it is a very straightforward question asking for details that aren\u2019t political in nature, we should be able to expect a direct response without political content.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000057\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a2d138cbb839455d9754acbe91a75102\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002256f3a341f4c7d05c53f1a9e3001a2b25\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Well, I don\u2019t think you could run that there was political content there; I just thought that the Minister could have started talking about \u201CAt the start of our term, this was the position\u201D, rather than going straight to the mention of another party and the attack on it. The Hon Louise Upston.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000058\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a1901a44e88e40d095f26c06ebac9721\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022cbc7582a8206a21a2678af30bbe437c7\u0022\u003EHon LOUISE UPSTON\u003C/span\u003E: When our Government came into office, we faced incredibly challenging economic conditions, and at that point there were close to 190,000 people on jobseeker support. Those numbers have been steadily rising since 2022, which is before we took office. The COVID-19 royal commission inquiry has found the previous Government\u2019s increased spending drove up debt, inflation, and interest rates, which leads to higher unemployment. In an economic downturn, employment is always the last thing to come right, which is why the forecast has always been for the numbers to get worse before they get better. As of December, the quarterly figures show 223,500 people on jobseeker support, which is why our Government is focused on a more active welfare system to support people into work as conditions improve.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000059\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022083a816abbb847f0a99aff178b1bbba2\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022ebde820a00dab71f4db70aa70fb05708\u0022\u003EHon Carmel Sepuloni\u003C/span\u003E: Are we really seeing the \u201Cgreen shoots of economic recovery\u201D, as she claimed yesterday, when 7 percent of New Zealand\u2019s working-age population are now on jobseeker support\u2014a new record?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000060\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a1901a44e88e40d095f26c06ebac9721\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022282f3417dc8d49d06d689af1fb59700e\u0022\u003EHon LOUISE UPSTON\u003C/span\u003E: Yes. If you look at the New Zealand Institute of Economic Research report that came out in January this year, it shows that business confidence is at the highest it\u2019s been since 2014. What does higher business confidence do? That is when firms start employing again, hiring more staff, and paying higher wages. How do we reduce the number of people on the jobseeker benefit? When the economy is growing, firms have more confidence, and they are hiring more people.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000061\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022083a816abbb847f0a99aff178b1bbba2\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022ba3d511d8a22c68891fcbd9f76212872\u0022\u003EHon Carmel Sepuloni\u003C/span\u003E: Is it a sign of green shoots when the number of young people\u201418- to 24-year-olds\u2014on jobseeker has grown by 32 percent on her watch, as reported by Radio New Zealand?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000062\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a1901a44e88e40d095f26c06ebac9721\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002263cdf46cd6857167ec14749e6d1a5611\u0022\u003EHon LOUISE UPSTON\u003C/span\u003E: Mr Speaker, let me refer you to others: the ANZ Bank economists who say more people choosing to participate in the labour market is consistent\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000063\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022083a816abbb847f0a99aff178b1bbba2\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022b9fa7e438dd15301c2d95552789faaa8\u0022\u003EHon Carmel Sepuloni\u003C/span\u003E: No, ignoring the real stats.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000064\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a1901a44e88e40d095f26c06ebac9721\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00225867dc2e5fcebb823df6b2ea72e4ccea\u0022\u003EHon LOUISE UPSTON\u003C/span\u003E: \u2014with rising job opportunities. The previous Minister wants to hear stats; that\u2019s what I\u2019m talking about. The latest filled jobs data shows, for example, the strongest annual growth in the hospitality sector, with jobs\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000065\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223d52c571cdb246f6abf50a39de1a66f7\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a1318b7c0204092fa12ef4488bdb2ced\u0022\u003EGlen Bennett\u003C/span\u003E: How about those young people who are unemployed?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000066\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a1901a44e88e40d095f26c06ebac9721\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022606076de773ec2b26c3753371998838b\u0022\u003EHon LOUISE UPSTON\u003C/span\u003E: \u2014up to\u2014well, many of the young are working in hospitality; a 19 percent increase compared with the previous quarter. I think that\u2019s pretty good.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000067\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022083a816abbb847f0a99aff178b1bbba2\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002227a7a61df110a70211d62cbf9075081f\u0022\u003EHon Carmel Sepuloni\u003C/span\u003E: Is it a sign of green shoots when unemployment is at a 10-year high?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000068\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a1901a44e88e40d095f26c06ebac9721\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00220b4a653190c1c65ec2d0b8f0c5dc2846\u0022\u003EHon LOUISE UPSTON\u003C/span\u003E: Well, as I\u2019ve said, the incoming Government would have liked to have had a very different economic set of circumstances than we inherited, but, instead, what are we doing? We are dealing with those challenges. We have a much more active welfare system; we\u2019ve got 70,000 people in case management, some of those over the phone; and we have introduced a traffic light system so more people know what their obligations are, and 90 percent of those on the jobseeker benefit say that is helpful to them. We want to ensure New Zealanders are ready, as the economic conditions improve\u2014for them to grab those opportunities with two hands.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000069\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022083a816abbb847f0a99aff178b1bbba2\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002293e69c0a4ea861fb0ef6af116bf2283b\u0022\u003EHon Carmel Sepuloni\u003C/span\u003E: Was the Prime Minister wrong when he said in May last year that \u201CUnemployment is just almost peaking and about to come down.\u201D, given there are now more people on jobseeker support than at the height of COVID-19?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000070\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a1901a44e88e40d095f26c06ebac9721\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a0469fa5380a4932b3ea23a23d04e1d7\u0022\u003EHon LOUISE UPSTON\u003C/span\u003E: Well, as we know, the unemployment rate is where Treasury forecast it would be, and, as I accept, it is higher than anyone would like. For any individual who finds themselves without a job, it\u2019s incredibly difficult for them and their family. That is why our Government is absolutely focused on economic growth, on creating the conditions where businesses have more confidence to employ more staff. As I said, the New Zealand Institute of Economic Research report that came out in January says business confidence is at the highest rate since 2014. I think that\u2019s something to celebrate.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000071\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022083a816abbb847f0a99aff178b1bbba2\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00228ae97d0fab4a9b27336b06984b3f8ab4\u0022\u003EHon Carmel Sepuloni\u003C/span\u003E: Is it correct that she is currently missing her jobseeker reduction target by more than 83,000?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000072\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a1901a44e88e40d095f26c06ebac9721\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00226c705e10153a27efeb3c8231609ee9cf\u0022\u003EHon LOUISE UPSTON\u003C/span\u003E: As I said in answer to the primary question, jobseeker numbers were always going to get worse before they got better. Look, the number is higher than any of us would like. I\u2019m focused on ensuring that the welfare system is more active; that means more job seekers get more contact with the Ministry of Social Development to improve their chances of finding a job, and that\u2019s exactly what I\u2019ll continue my focus on.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000073\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022083a816abbb847f0a99aff178b1bbba2\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022412250cdc7400780eda9a31feb6f119f\u0022\u003EHon Carmel Sepuloni\u003C/span\u003E: Has Treasury advised her that, at best, she is going to miss her jobseeker reduction target by more than 60,000 people in 2030?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000074\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a1901a44e88e40d095f26c06ebac9721\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022588323dc057b486e74a697b5064782fe\u0022\u003EHon LOUISE UPSTON\u003C/span\u003E: Well, I remain optimistic that our economic plan is working, and, as I said, business confidence is the highest it\u2019s been since 2014. Will we get the target or not? We\u2019ll get close, and for every single one of those people coming off welfare into work, it makes an enormous difference for them, their families, and the communities, and that\u2019s what I\u2019ll continue to focus on.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000075\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022083a816abbb847f0a99aff178b1bbba2\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00224b2d8eb143ee2bfb33472efe59f970e9\u0022\u003EHon Carmel Sepuloni\u003C/span\u003E: When will she stop blaming the previous Government and instead admit that her Government\u2019s plan for growth is only growing unemployment, growing poverty, growing homelessness, and increasing numbers of Kiwis are having to move abroad for opportunities?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000076\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a1901a44e88e40d095f26c06ebac9721\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022230ab88907604130226f28a2734a3c17\u0022\u003EHon LOUISE UPSTON\u003C/span\u003E: Well, I actually give New Zealanders far more credit than that member does. When you think about more than 50 percent of the Government\u2019s spending during the years of COVID-19 having nothing to do with COVID-19, what does that sort of level of spending do? It drives up inflation, drives up interest rates, creates challenging economic conditions, creates challenging cost of living, and unemployment rises. We are focused on that, and that is why we have a far more active welfare system that is supporting New Zealanders. I am really proud that despite those challenges, 83,000 New Zealanders left welfare for a job, in the last year. That\u2019s something worth celebrating.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000077\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u00222de9c848b24d33d488ebec99a7e75ea8\u0022\u003ESocial Development and Employment\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000078\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u002242460dedffe00111af90a04cfd7ec40b\u0022\u003EQuestion No. 2\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002298c1995a3396432382c4b04f94f6462f\u0022 data-id=\u00226764ddd6eb6b423f41ae82a7c8363b74\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000079\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002298c1995a3396432382c4b04f94f6462f\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00226764ddd6eb6b423f41ae82a7c8363b74\u0022\u003ERICARDO MEN\u00C9NDEZ MARCH (Green) (14:20)\u003C/span\u003E to the \u003Cspan class=\u0022CharacterBold\u0022\u003EMinister for Social Development and Employment\u003C/span\u003E: Is she concerned about Treasury\u2019s advice that the Iran war energy price shock could increase inflation; if so, what impact, if any, does she expect this will have on the growing number of unemployed people needing welfare support?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022a1901a44e88e40d095f26c06ebac9721\u0022 data-id=\u00223e29b835b8e1a7474e5a78cffa0b17f0\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000080\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a1901a44e88e40d095f26c06ebac9721\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00223e29b835b8e1a7474e5a78cffa0b17f0\u0022\u003EHon LOUISE UPSTON (Minister for Social Development and Employment) (14:20)\u003C/span\u003E: I am concerned, as are all members of the Government, that the conflict in the Middle East could have an impact on the New Zealand economy and on New Zealanders. As the Minister of Finance has said, the economic impact of the conflict remains unclear, and the long-term implications for New Zealanders will depend on the duration and scale of the conflict. Right now, it is too soon to judge whether the impacts will last long enough to materially reduce levels of expected growth and employment in the New Zealand economy. That is why we have an active welfare system, and the Ministry of Social Development (MSD) continues to assist people who need welfare support.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000081\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002298c1995a3396432382c4b04f94f6462f\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022f8bf5819400efabfe02226f3d5fb1283\u0022\u003ERicardo Men\u00E9ndez March\u003C/span\u003E: Is she making any preparations for an increase in inflation that could lead to an increase in the number of people requiring welfare support as a result of the potentially prolonged Iran war?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000082\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a1901a44e88e40d095f26c06ebac9721\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022998de7e293cf6d0cfd7d260a31534c0e\u0022\u003EHon LOUISE UPSTON\u003C/span\u003E: As I said in the answer to my primary question, the economic impact of the conflict remains unknown, and that will depend on a number of factors, which includes the severity and duration of the conflict.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000083\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002298c1995a3396432382c4b04f94f6462f\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022b31ea3f0310634992bcbd1242401a2c2\u0022\u003ERicardo Men\u00E9ndez March\u003C/span\u003E: Has she introduced any bills that will leave the growing number of people requiring welfare support worse off?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000084\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a1901a44e88e40d095f26c06ebac9721\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002219b1ef6920e2992641c1cf7ed4da5794\u0022\u003EHon LOUISE UPSTON\u003C/span\u003E: What we are very committed to doing is ensuring that we have a fair welfare system that supports people in their time of need and treats people equally so that we don\u2019t have a system that takes two different groups of people receiving income and treats them differently.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000085\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002298c1995a3396432382c4b04f94f6462f\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00220eea53a41bd48cd2b19714713351b258\u0022\u003ERicardo Men\u00E9ndez March\u003C/span\u003E: Has that left people worse off?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000086\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a1901a44e88e40d095f26c06ebac9721\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002229fba51cde7999bc2b9018c51b9b3793\u0022\u003EHon LOUISE UPSTON\u003C/span\u003E: No, because that is the practice that is under way at the moment. If somebody receives income in a block amount\u2014e.g., backdated ACC as a lump sum\u2014and if that means that they were then not entitled to some of the MSD assistance, they have to pay it back. That is no different from any other form of assistance through MSD. Where there is an overpayment, people pay it back.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000087\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002298c1995a3396432382c4b04f94f6462f\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a1d1006616e929f81d44e01e510a1d4c\u0022\u003ERicardo Men\u00E9ndez March\u003C/span\u003E: What does she say to people who have boarders, including disabled people, who are being, basically, left worse off as a result of bills that she has introduced and passed?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000088\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a1901a44e88e40d095f26c06ebac9721\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022147b393529c68248aaa3d5eb7671ffdf\u0022\u003EHon LOUISE UPSTON\u003C/span\u003E: The member is referring to a measure in Budget 2025, which, again, is about fairness. If people have income from boarders, it should be counted against any housing or income support they receive from taxpayers. We want a fair, transparent, and equal system where those who require support get it if they don\u2019t unnecessarily burden other taxpayers with support they shouldn\u2019t have access to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000089\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002298c1995a3396432382c4b04f94f6462f\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002258767d9566ccf271fb4ce1833b5a9a15\u0022\u003ERicardo Men\u00E9ndez March\u003C/span\u003E: Does she agree with economist Brad Olsen that \u201Cwe know that the number of jobs being advertised in the economy are still 25 percent lower than pre-pandemic\u201D, and, if so, how does she expect more beneficiaries to fill fewer jobs?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000090\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a1901a44e88e40d095f26c06ebac9721\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00220866576df012947be592389a95bbf09b\u0022\u003EHon LOUISE UPSTON\u003C/span\u003E: As I said in the answer to my previous question, what we are seeing with the New Zealand Institute of Economic Research is that business confidence is the highest it\u2019s been since 2014. Business confidence rising means businesses are taking on more staff. Those staff they have, they might be offering them more hours and increasing their pay. That is what helps us as a country turn the corner, and when employers are taking on more staff, that directly assists us with reducing the number of people on the jobseeker benefit. Initiatives like ChamberWorks, that we launched last week, connect MSD job seekers with the largest pool of employers across the country.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000091\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b3410b728cb84eb295c253e2648ca0c8\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022f76846833a02e397ca22ea2b886fc065\u0022\u003EScott Willis\u003C/span\u003E: Does she have concerns for people needing more advances to deal with the cost of fuel and bills, which will put them further into debt, and what does the Government intend to do about it?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000092\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a1901a44e88e40d095f26c06ebac9721\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022c27e66c1a312f844d51dcebfd36960a7\u0022\u003EHon LOUISE UPSTON\u003C/span\u003E: As I said, it is too early to see what the economic impact will be of the conflict. The welfare system is there to support people during a time of need, and they will continue to do that.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000093\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b3410b728cb84eb295c253e2648ca0c8\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a692fce55515dc40c9897f34cef77ad4\u0022\u003EScott Willis\u003C/span\u003E: What does she say to Presbyterian Support Otago social work team leader Jollene Warrington, who said, \u201CPeople are struggling with mental health and wellbeing due to the financial pressure of how to meet their basic needs.\u201D, and how will an extra liquefied natural gas levy on electricity affect those already being forced to choose between heating and eating?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000094\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a1901a44e88e40d095f26c06ebac9721\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022e53327be4a85567001eb79687ae08f25\u0022\u003EHon LOUISE UPSTON\u003C/span\u003E: Well, the policy that the member refers to is about lowering energy prices, but let me say this: our Government fully accepts that there are too many New Zealanders today who are finding it challenging, and the cost of living is challenging many families and households. That is why we will continue to focus on economic growth. That is why we know economic growth provides job opportunities, which means families and individuals can meet their requirements in a stronger way. We will not resile from our single focus on the cost of living and growing the economy.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000095\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u0022bf2be5425e23e7a7e0f64923c5e20b64\u0022\u003EStatistics\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000096\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u002296b7c14ac72fd9d00df11ad5775feff5\u0022\u003EQuestion No. 3\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002247a88a22498e4a208a43347635748943\u0022 data-id=\u0022f837664581b0413c28f6098d28476115\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000097\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002247a88a22498e4a208a43347635748943\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022f837664581b0413c28f6098d28476115\u0022\u003ET\u0100KUTA FERRIS (Te Tai Tonga) (14:26)\u003C/span\u003E to the \u003Cspan class=\u0022CharacterBold\u0022\u003EMinister of Statistics\u003C/span\u003E: Does he agree with analysis from Te K\u0101hui Raraunga that replacing the five-yearly census with administrative data, small-sample surveys, and targeted data collection \u201Cwill build in a bias that favours numerically dominant groups, and will further invisibilise some M\u0101ori individuals, wh\u0101nau, and communities\u201D? \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022673069789fe74d02ac517109c173ccbd\u0022 data-id=\u0022f033fec23d1001a188c387c070a8c39e\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000098\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022673069789fe74d02ac517109c173ccbd\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022f033fec23d1001a188c387c070a8c39e\u0022\u003EHon Dr SHANE RETI (Minister of Statistics) (14:26)\u003C/span\u003E: The traditional five-yearly survey model is no longer financially sustainable, operationally reliable, or able to produce timely, high-quality data. That is why the census is evolving to use administrative data first, which offers a more efficient, resilient, and responsive foundation for population statistics. I do acknowledge the concerns raised by Te K\u0101hui Raraunga; this Government takes these concerns seriously, and I also note that these concerns were not necessarily addressed by previous censuses. Stats New Zealand is confident in the use of integrated administrative data at counting the population even better than a full-field enumeration census. In implementing this, Stats New Zealand is committed to working with iwi M\u0101ori, including Te K\u0101hui Raraunga, on the design, planning, and implementation of the new census approach.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000099\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002247a88a22498e4a208a43347635748943\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022df9239cbe37ddccbe8d237f133d07a5e\u0022\u003ET\u0101kuta Ferris\u003C/span\u003E: Does the Minister accept that resource allocation, electoral boundaries, and democratic representation rely on accurate population data; if so, what guarantee can the Government give M\u0101ori that they will not be under-counted under the newly proposed system?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000100\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022673069789fe74d02ac517109c173ccbd\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00228f0d1386fa2dcf7640b225f5d58c7b87\u0022\u003EHon Dr SHANE RETI\u003C/span\u003E: In answer to the first arm of the question, yes. In answer to the second, I would note that in the enumerated 2023 Census, administrative data significantly improved the under-count in M\u0101ori descent.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000101\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002247a88a22498e4a208a43347635748943\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00222cca53099d2a75c27c89eb9dbcd833b2\u0022\u003ET\u0101kuta Ferris\u003C/span\u003E: Will the Minister commit to upholding M\u0101ori data sovereignty, as a right grounded in Te Tiriti o Waitangi, by working with M\u0101ori data experts to implement the M\u0101ori Data Governance Model co-designed with Government in 2023 for the protection and governance of M\u0101ori data?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000102\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022673069789fe74d02ac517109c173ccbd\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022b48b0988bcf9a3f1a81b69f06f06e11d\u0022\u003EHon Dr SHANE RETI\u003C/span\u003E: What I commit to is Stats New Zealand continuing to collaborate with iwi M\u0101ori on these matters, including Te K\u0101hui Raraunga and including 20 relationships that they have bilaterally with iwi M\u0101ori.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000103\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u0022635d425e049d6e29aed6e1cf8485a939\u0022\u003EM\u0101ori Development\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000104\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u00229f0245aad50df7722ad04f137a614812\u0022\u003EQuestion No. 4\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022e968c1334f0a40bfbd05d661e979ba38\u0022 data-id=\u002225b749a66ab6e7f0aeaa76897b5261bd\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000105\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e968c1334f0a40bfbd05d661e979ba38\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002225b749a66ab6e7f0aeaa76897b5261bd\u0022\u003EHon WILLIE JACKSON (Labour) (14:28)\u003C/span\u003E to the \u003Cspan class=\u0022CharacterBold\u0022\u003EMinister for M\u0101ori Development\u003C/span\u003E: Does the Minister stand by his Government\u2019s track record for M\u0101ori, and, if so, why?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00229d5b13d601794bb282d99453116ad395\u0022 data-id=\u00224a994b5c7f583dc04f89887e00aa22b9\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000106\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00229d5b13d601794bb282d99453116ad395\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00224a994b5c7f583dc04f89887e00aa22b9\u0022\u003EHon TAMA POTAKA (Minister for M\u0101ori Development) (14:28)\u003C/span\u003E: Yes, whether it\u2019s Minister Brown leading improved M\u0101ori two-year-old immunisation rates, from the terrible 64 percent it was in October 2023 to 68 percent now; or Minister Willis leading the tax relief for M\u0101ori that resulted in hundreds of millions of dollars remaining in M\u0101ori wh\u0101nau hands; or Minister Seymour overseeing a 12 percent increase in kids going to school since 2023; or Minister Jones eloquently articulating a geothermal strategy that will ignite investment in M\u0101ori land; or Minister Goldsmith cracking on with law and order policies that have reduced the 12-month levels of M\u0101ori victims of crime from 43,733 to 4,650. We don\u2019t speak from the podium of truth but from the crucible of outcomes. [\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsCharacterItalics\u0022\u003EInterruption\u003C/span\u003E]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000107\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a2d138cbb839455d9754acbe91a75102\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022f5120fc47af91aad690b6150d0423abc\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: The House is about to hear a question and the only person speaking or making noise will be the questioner.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000108\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e968c1334f0a40bfbd05d661e979ba38\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002242e0da514b88ec77967c131062b3056f\u0022\u003EHon Willie Jackson\u003C/span\u003E: Thank you, Mr Speaker. Does the Minister accept that his track record in terms of cutting M\u0101ori and targeted funding in areas like M\u0101ori housing, M\u0101ori broadcasting, and M\u0101ori trade training has resulted in a record 10-year high of M\u0101ori unemployment, and if not, why not?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000109\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00229d5b13d601794bb282d99453116ad395\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00227a9fbd5723eb671c37328318aebc96a3\u0022\u003EHon TAMA POTAKA\u003C/span\u003E: Yes, we have inherited the fiscal cliff of M\u0101ori broadcasting that the member who asked the question had left us, but we continue to support M\u0101ori broadcasting and, indeed, \u003Cspan lang=\u0022mi\u0022\u003Ete reo m\u0101horahora i roto i t\u0113nei Whare\u003C/span\u003E [\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsCharacterItalics\u0022\u003Ethe widespread language within this House\u003C/span\u003E.] And I am so stoked that 5,500 M\u0101ori have come off the jobseeker benefit in the quarter up to quarter 3, 2025, and the hundreds of homes\u2014[\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsCharacterItalics\u0022\u003EInterruption\u003C/span\u003E]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000110\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a2d138cbb839455d9754acbe91a75102\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002247a48c408be6b8eb47252e7af12c26b1\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Look, calling out a question is not acceptable. It\u2019s not an interjection; it\u2019s just a barrage. You\u2019ve got supplementary questions. If you need a question answered, then use your allocation to ask them.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000111\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00229d5b13d601794bb282d99453116ad395\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002264207ff740d3c4f2513233ddc1a9a8b3\u0022\u003EHon TAMA POTAKA\u003C/span\u003E: I will start my answer again, Mr Speaker. We unfortunately have inherited a fiscal cliff in M\u0101ori broadcasting left by the member opposite. We have seen nearly 5,500 M\u0101ori come off the jobseeker benefit in the quarter ending September 2025. We continue with a serious housing programme alongside, with, and for M\u0101ori, particularly in places like Hopuhopu, alongside Waikato-Tainui and their $35 million we committed to with Te Kauhanganui o Te Whakakitenga; the hundred homes that are being built up in Kaikohekohe right now by Te Hau Ora o Ng\u0101puhi; and, of course, those homes that are being finished on Haruru Falls Road by Ng\u0101ti Kahu ki Whangaroa; or indeed the homes that are being finished right now in Ohakune by my relations in Ng\u0101ti Rangi or maybe even those homes that are yet to be built but will be built by Willie Jackson\u2019s in-laws right now in Te Teko.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000112\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e968c1334f0a40bfbd05d661e979ba38\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002236b9fc6dfe58be38d829f291b27534eb\u0022\u003EHon Willie Jackson\u003C/span\u003E: What specific target has the Minister set to reduce M\u0101ori unemployment in this term, and when is he planning to see a reduction for M\u0101ori who are suffering under the Minister\u2019s policies?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000113\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a2d138cbb839455d9754acbe91a75102\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022d064f45ba01e523dfb1592da84d4734e\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: One of those questions can be answered.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000114\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00229d5b13d601794bb282d99453116ad395\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002271d28795b49a6a3c79506d5e7412ebbf\u0022\u003EHon TAMA POTAKA\u003C/span\u003E: Employment targets, of course, are the responsibility of the Minister for Social Development and Employment, and we have seen a number of projects that have been supported by this Government, whether in infrastructure, whether or not it\u2019s fusion technology, fusion energy, or whether it\u2019s housing, which have seen serious numbers of M\u0101ori being employed across the country. We have also seen a huge effort to ensure that those people that have got some significant challenges around mental health are supported, and I mihi out to Minister Matt Doocey, the Crusaders\u2019 champion, for his mahi.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000115\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e968c1334f0a40bfbd05d661e979ba38\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00221a344b88bc1a47607d085bfce59a72ce\u0022\u003EHon Willie Jackson\u003C/span\u003E: Does he agree with Tainui leader Tuku Morgan that the Government\u2019s track record for M\u0101ori communities has been marginalised and minimised with all the pieces of the legislation that has been demolished by this Government, and, if not, why not?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000116\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00229d5b13d601794bb282d99453116ad395\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00229ca6a81979667bb468783cd3a461f145\u0022\u003EHon TAMA POTAKA\u003C/span\u003E: I agree with Waikato-Tainui leader Tuku Morgan, who was effusive in his praise for this Government continuing the serious support of Te Matatini, the largest support ever for kapa haka in the history and herstory of this country; for the massive support that we gave Waikato-Tainui around housing in Hopuhopu\u2014I know many of the Opposition members have never been there; you might get there one day\u2014and, of course, for that coal stack that is now providing some energy resilience at the back end of R\u0101hui P\u014Dkeka. T\u0113n\u0101 t\u0101tou.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000117\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e968c1334f0a40bfbd05d661e979ba38\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00227bc43dfda46d4c8de9dff61470c7afee\u0022\u003EHon Willie Jackson\u003C/span\u003E: Does the Minister agree with Deputy Prime Minister David Seymour that Te Puni K\u014Dkiri should be absorbed into the ministry of arts, culture, and heritage; and can he reassure M\u0101ori that he will not let this happen?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000118\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00229d5b13d601794bb282d99453116ad395\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002258359cb3f73a81ce8fc49ace95864c6a\u0022\u003EHon TAMA POTAKA\u003C/span\u003E: I\u2019m not responsible for the comments of Minister Seymour, but maybe you should check the accuracy of those comments.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000119\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e968c1334f0a40bfbd05d661e979ba38\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022fce7447b6c25afcac7ba7d7791f4f93f\u0022\u003EHon Willie Jackson\u003C/span\u003E: They\u2019re pretty accurate. I\u2019m sure he\u2019ll confirm it. Thank you.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000120\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a2d138cbb839455d9754acbe91a75102\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002285eee4cb5b5df20af2def1e3a77a4096\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: That \u201Cpretty accurate\u201D comment is not appropriate when you\u2019re on your feet. You will just withdraw and apologise for that little outburst.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000121\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e968c1334f0a40bfbd05d661e979ba38\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00225706e28c774fae7a0d823fe41ff3ee9c\u0022\u003EHon Willie Jackson\u003C/span\u003E: I withdraw and apologise.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000122\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226e1ef2baa19e4b8b9dc9ee8604ae7dba\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002299b83c52a194430e69c78586d786463c\u0022\u003EHon David Seymour\u003C/span\u003E: Point of order. I don\u2019t believe I\u2019ve ever made those comments as Deputy Prime Minister.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000123\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a2d138cbb839455d9754acbe91a75102\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022eb1ead21bc668e6b992afdd30fb7b9b2\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Yeah, that\u2019s fine. OK.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000124\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e968c1334f0a40bfbd05d661e979ba38\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022e1185de89d1fe7cb20c1276deb00e051\u0022\u003EHon Willie Jackson\u003C/span\u003E: Does he accept that his track record has resulted in more M\u0101ori unemployed, double that of non-M\u0101ori, cuts to M\u0101ori-targeted initiatives, and Ministers undermining his own ministry; if not, why not?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000125\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00229d5b13d601794bb282d99453116ad395\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022ceb3fd8083bb0579205c985bd2c7356a\u0022\u003EHon TAMA POTAKA\u003C/span\u003E: Yes, my ministry is involved and responsible for advocating for the increased employment of M\u0101ori, but it wasn\u2019t too long ago under a Labour Government that the number of M\u0101ori unemployed was around 25 percent.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000126\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a2d138cbb839455d9754acbe91a75102\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022fe180d4555bcde0d8dc6abdc6a874a11\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Question No. 5\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000127\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002291c0e777ce3d4711ace36a15c7e22ffe\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022caaf481b10568e2e14aeaf14465679bd\u0022\u003EHon Paul Goldsmith\u003C/span\u003E: Supplementary.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000128\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a2d138cbb839455d9754acbe91a75102\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022654270fd87d5ec5213288af327e4327b\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Supplementary question, the Hon Paul Goldsmith, and no one else speaking.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000129\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002291c0e777ce3d4711ace36a15c7e22ffe\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00222cb059bb35f4dd3449f4900667e719fd\u0022\u003EHon Paul Goldsmith\u003C/span\u003E: Does he stand by this Government\u2019s track record for M\u0101ori arts and culture, and in particular the decision to continue to properly fund Te Matatini, which the previous Government had announced\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000130\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a2d138cbb839455d9754acbe91a75102\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002209877b224648d0adef4147adb3502895\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: No, no.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000131\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002291c0e777ce3d4711ace36a15c7e22ffe\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00228e291210d4ab4d7bc03f1adbf8b5150a\u0022\u003EHon Paul Goldsmith\u003C/span\u003E: \u2014but not properly funded?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000132\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00229d5b13d601794bb282d99453116ad395\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022bb4c05f227abfdd5285dc5e8b4acfed9\u0022\u003EHon TAMA POTAKA\u003C/span\u003E: Absolutely. I absolutely agree and stand by the record around supporting Te Matatini and a number of other arts, culture, and heritage matters that Minister Goldsmith\u2019s responsible for.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000133\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u00223168438013ae98dc24c0670fd7b01fd0\u0022\u003EJustice\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000134\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u0022da17cec80c8e8d3e873902a0bd43cb4e\u0022\u003EQuestion No. 5\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022cb40eb85aab340879622563050ab25fa\u0022 data-id=\u002298e2512938f9accc20ab25a582f7603d\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000135\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cb40eb85aab340879622563050ab25fa\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002298e2512938f9accc20ab25a582f7603d\u0022\u003ETOM RUTHERFORD (National\u2014Bay of Plenty) (14:35)\u003C/span\u003E to the \u003Cspan class=\u0022CharacterBold\u0022\u003EMinister of Justice\u003C/span\u003E: What progress has the Government made towards fixing the basics in law and order?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002291c0e777ce3d4711ace36a15c7e22ffe\u0022 data-id=\u00228d8abfa5d814a46275b85adce21a54f5\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000136\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002291c0e777ce3d4711ace36a15c7e22ffe\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00228d8abfa5d814a46275b85adce21a54f5\u0022\u003EHon PAUL GOLDSMITH (Minister of Justice) (14:35)\u003C/span\u003E: Great progress. Restoring law and order is a core focus of our plan to fix the basics. We banned gang patches, reintroduced tougher sentences for serious offending, and made stalking an illegal and imprisonable offence. Shortly, we will be introducing legislation to give police more tools to deal with disorderly behaviour in public places, and, today, the hard-working Justice Committee\u2019s begun hearing submitters on the Government\u2019s reform of the Crimes Act, which will further ensure criminals face real consequences for crime. The good news is that in two years, we\u2019ve made great progress, with 49,000 fewer victims of crime.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000137\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cb40eb85aab340879622563050ab25fa\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022dad48a23345322f90c42930f5b8e6a3a\u0022\u003ETom Rutherford\u003C/span\u003E: What does the Crimes Amendment Bill do?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000138\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002291c0e777ce3d4711ace36a15c7e22ffe\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022c4f332895a03e8fac72e02659907d10b\u0022\u003EHon PAUL GOLDSMITH\u003C/span\u003E: Well, that\u2019s a very good question. The reform of the Crimes Act includes a raft of changes, including new specific offences for assaulting first responders or prison officers; two new specific coward-punch offences; a new shoplifting infringement regime, as committed to in the National - New Zealand First coalition agreement, that gives effect to the Government\u2019s expansion of the citizen\u2019s arrest powers so business owners have an additional tool to protect their livelihoods; and, finally, it strengthens the trafficking and people smuggling rules to stop criminals using loopholes to evade real consequences for crime. I want to thank those who have submitted on this bill to the Justice Committee, particularly those who have shared their harrowing stories and experiences of being victims of crime. This Government\u2019s working to do something about it.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000139\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cb40eb85aab340879622563050ab25fa\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022c0b6a0b9788a398ff1f161f25da23320\u0022\u003ETom Rutherford\u003C/span\u003E: Why is the Government giving police an additional tool to address disorderly behaviour in our communities?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000140\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002291c0e777ce3d4711ace36a15c7e22ffe\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002297b08254bf7e686595e819173541142f\u0022\u003EHon PAUL GOLDSMITH\u003C/span\u003E: Because we want all New Zealanders to enjoy vibrant, welcoming, and safe town centres that are not blighted by disruption and disturbance. Fixing the basics in law and order means, in this case, reclaiming our streets so that those who live, work, and visit can enjoy these public places. We have many tools to help those in need, and there\u2019s always more work to do there, but we also need some tools to deal with disorderly behaviour and to reclaim our streets for the enjoyment of those who live there.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000141\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cb40eb85aab340879622563050ab25fa\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00220ec8d8d5a9fbff2add66d7338fd2e85a\u0022\u003ETom Rutherford\u003C/span\u003E: What update can he provide on the Government\u2019s initiative to clamp and seize vehicles of those with overdue court fines?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000142\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002291c0e777ce3d4711ace36a15c7e22ffe\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022b0d63c954d1811590508dcb1a4178a45\u0022\u003EHon PAUL GOLDSMITH\u003C/span\u003E: Well, real consequences for crime mean that people need to pay their fines if the courts have imposed them. The Government\u2019s initiative to clamp and seize cars of people not paying court fines has been highly successful, returning more than $700,000 and seizing 236 vehicles. Victims are always the priority of our justice system, and they should not be left out of pocket if they\u2019ve suffered harm or had their property damaged. Between July 2025 and February 2026, bailiffs scanned 147,000 number plates and identified 2,866 people with overdue court fines and reparations. Six hundred of those paid on the spot. Eighty vehicles have been sold at auction, another 20 will go under the hammer, and there\u2019s work on all the others.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000143\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u0022f048f7e1f96e8b353862f633ad696848\u0022\u003EHealth\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000144\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u0022a8a125ceba5b81e8a804ff42207b30ce\u0022\u003EQuestion No. 6\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022cf9e1eb91ef740868a26db659355f7e9\u0022 data-id=\u002221e672faa76225a654a9ef63e6ff1688\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000145\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cf9e1eb91ef740868a26db659355f7e9\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002221e672faa76225a654a9ef63e6ff1688\u0022\u003ERt Hon WINSTON PETERS (Leader\u2014NZ First) (14:38)\u003C/span\u003E to the \u003Cspan class=\u0022CharacterBold\u0022\u003EMinister of Health\u003C/span\u003E: Does he stand by all of his actions and statements?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002276109ca9c1c74181a1e2734802d7f46f\u0022 data-id=\u0022ab640795fe37f60e0b033ec7941692fc\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000146\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002276109ca9c1c74181a1e2734802d7f46f\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022ab640795fe37f60e0b033ec7941692fc\u0022\u003EHon SIMEON BROWN (Minister of Health) (14:39)\u003C/span\u003E: In the context in they were made, yes.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000147\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cf9e1eb91ef740868a26db659355f7e9\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022bb13b22a1b2a5e978f032d125bd6ddfc\u0022\u003ERt Hon Winston Peters\u003C/span\u003E: Does his statement regarding the Royal Commission of Inquiry and the concerns of the COVID-19 Vaccine Technical Advisory Group about a two-dose vaccine mandate for 12- to 17-year-olds, that is \u201CFormer Ministers were informed of those concerns\u201D?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000148\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002276109ca9c1c74181a1e2734802d7f46f\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002212c85cf6155db5c34260c12e3c3fabd3\u0022\u003EHon SIMEON BROWN\u003C/span\u003E: Yes.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000149\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cf9e1eb91ef740868a26db659355f7e9\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022dda5bc33dbb864202809af3a860210d0\u0022\u003ERt Hon Winston Peters\u003C/span\u003E: In the context of the inquiry, is the statement \u201CThe Vaccine Technical Advisory Group advice against two doses for 12- to 17-year-olds never went to Ministers, and the Royal Commissioner finds that.\u201D a fair representation of what the report says?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000150\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002276109ca9c1c74181a1e2734802d7f46f\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002201410e07a8453eb00ef34dff0b12ac6b\u0022\u003EHon SIMEON BROWN\u003C/span\u003E: The royal commission found that the Hon Chris Hipkins was informed of the COVID-19 Vaccine Technical Advisory Group\u2019s concerns in a briefing on 22 December 2021, and that this briefing was considered by the Hon Ayesha Verrall on 7 January 2022.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000151\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cf9e1eb91ef740868a26db659355f7e9\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00224853f5967ebcadb61ec921b77c31a04d\u0022\u003ERt Hon Winston Peters\u003C/span\u003E: Did the inquiry find that Ministers were aware of the technical advisory group\u2019s concerns about the risks of double dosing under-18-year-olds?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000152\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002276109ca9c1c74181a1e2734802d7f46f\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022f0675038fed70e724270d2ccd612228b\u0022\u003EHon SIMEON BROWN\u003C/span\u003E: The royal commission found that the briefing was received by the Hon Chris Hipkins on 22 December 2021, which raised concerns from the COVID-19 Vaccine Technical Advisory Group. It was considered by the Hon Ayesha Verrall on 7 January 2022. The royal commission also found that the Hon Ayesha Verrall made a comment on the specific advice related to the COVID-19 Vaccine Technical Advisory Group\u2019s concerns, and I\u2019m advised that this comment referenced data relating to safety concerns. [\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsCharacterItalics\u0022\u003EInterruption\u003C/span\u003E]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000153\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a2d138cbb839455d9754acbe91a75102\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00225bb1c3d3b9e246fa05869a0962e2f956\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: One speaker\u2014one person asking questions.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000154\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cf9e1eb91ef740868a26db659355f7e9\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022726cf19113ced3b88916bd9e9f3e9f0a\u0022\u003ERt Hon Winston Peters\u003C/span\u003E: Did the inquiry find that Ministers were informed of the concerns of the technical advisory group regarding risks to young people from double doses of vaccines; if so, what did the advice to Ministers say?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000155\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002276109ca9c1c74181a1e2734802d7f46f\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00228b8397b7fc3087faaaf7ac91277580c7\u0022\u003EHon SIMEON BROWN\u003C/span\u003E: The royal commission found that the Hon Chris Hipkins was informed of the COVID-19 Vaccine Technical Advisory Group\u2019s concerns in a briefing on 22 December 2021, and this briefing was considered by the Hon Dr Ayesha Verrall on 7 January 2022. The briefing stated in paragraph 23, \u201CIn November 2021, CV TAG has raised concerns about vaccine mandates requiring younger age groups (e.g. [those under] 18 years) to be fully vaccinated. Consideration should be given to permitting younger people who have had one dose to be permitted to work or undertake other activities covered by the mandate.\u201D\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000156\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cf9e1eb91ef740868a26db659355f7e9\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022bdebdffaef5c124c86c9921a33122138\u0022\u003ERt Hon Winston Peters\u003C/span\u003E: Why, after more than four years, has the Ministry of Health not published the 22 December 2021 briefing and kept it hidden, and why does this briefing not appear in the ministry\u2019s list of briefings provided to Minister Hipkins in December of 2021?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000157\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b27d6090c07e47fb960e52f168ce01b3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022735f1d54efa07fbb3bc32817234de539\u0022\u003EHon Kieran McAnulty\u003C/span\u003E: Point of order, sir. The suggestion that a ministry kept information hidden surely is an inference that shouldn\u2019t be allowed in a question.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000158\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a2d138cbb839455d9754acbe91a75102\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002235d281e0acf6cabfcd28466542e6321e\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Well, I didn\u2019t take it as an inference because the question started with the word \u201Cwhy\u201D. I think it\u2019s a simple inquiry.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000159\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002276109ca9c1c74181a1e2734802d7f46f\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022859dd43d33c6d98154543943cf7408ab\u0022\u003EHon SIMEON BROWN\u003C/span\u003E: Well, the royal commission found the briefing was provided to the Hon Chris Hipkins on 22 December 2021 and considered by the Hon Ayesha Verrall on 7 January 2022. I\u2019m not aware of why this briefing was not publicly released. That would be a question for the Ministry of Health or the Rt Hon Chris Hipkins.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000160\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cf9e1eb91ef740868a26db659355f7e9\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022b007ae4b004c48103eec8b399cc640c2\u0022\u003ERt Hon Winston Peters\u003C/span\u003E: What commitment can he give as Minister of Health that the impropriety described in the royal commission\u2019s inquiry regarding the forced administration of vaccines to children will not be repeated under his watch?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000161\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002276109ca9c1c74181a1e2734802d7f46f\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00220ad8f8c45a49b528467d4d0333e3f334\u0022\u003EHon SIMEON BROWN\u003C/span\u003E: Well, I have raised expectations with the Director-General of Health that advice is made sufficiently clear to both Ministers and the public. Equally, I understand that as a Minister, I\u2019m obligated to question advice as it is presented to me. Ultimately, improving immunisation rates is a key policy of this Government. That\u2019s why we have brought back the target on increasing immunisations for two-year-olds, and we need to ensure young New Zealanders have the best possible start to life. It is critically important that we have transparency about the information we have, in this regard.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000162\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u002285892c028c58fcd6f9c63e029f0b737a\u0022\u003EHealth\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000163\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u0022dda4b3908091391f14bacaaece8ad5a7\u0022\u003EQuestion No. 7\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002288978fb9592a4911a8e47eae04d164f3\u0022 data-id=\u0022cb61694904a9a62f5dbd00abadebca15\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000164\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002288978fb9592a4911a8e47eae04d164f3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022cb61694904a9a62f5dbd00abadebca15\u0022\u003EDr VANESSA WEENINK (National\u2014Banks Peninsula) (14:43)\u003C/span\u003E to the \u003Cspan class=\u0022CharacterBold\u0022\u003EMinister of Health\u003C/span\u003E: What recent announcements has he made about supporting first-year GP trainees?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002276109ca9c1c74181a1e2734802d7f46f\u0022 data-id=\u00225510f8fa1942dec2bd5810ebe7a1e207\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000165\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002276109ca9c1c74181a1e2734802d7f46f\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00225510f8fa1942dec2bd5810ebe7a1e207\u0022\u003EHon SIMEON BROWN (Minister of Health) (14:44)\u003C/span\u003E: Well, this Government is making it easier for new doctors to choose general practice as their specialty by changing the way first-year GP trainees are employed. From next year, first-year GP trainees who are not already employed by a private practice will remain employed by Health New Zealand during their first year of training. This removes a longstanding barrier where doctors had to leave hospital employment when moving into GP training and risked losing employment conditions and continuity of service. By keeping them employed by Health New Zealand, we\u2019re making general practice a more attractive career path and strengthening the pipeline of GPs so more New Zealanders can access timely primary care.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000166\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002288978fb9592a4911a8e47eae04d164f3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022e88ecc17c507c57a9874f12e7a941694\u0022\u003EDr Vanessa Weenink\u003C/span\u003E: Why is it important to remove these barriers for doctors entering GP training?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000167\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002276109ca9c1c74181a1e2734802d7f46f\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022488387f32fed42d6e6145c8713427c79\u0022\u003EHon SIMEON BROWN\u003C/span\u003E: Primary care is the cornerstone of our health system, and if we want New Zealanders to be able to see a GP when they need one, we must make it easier and more attractive for doctors to train in general practice. Under the current system, some doctors face disruption to leave entitlements and employment conditions when moving from hospital training into general practice. Removing that barrier provides greater certainty and fairness for trainees and encourages more doctors to pursue careers as GPs. The sector has been calling out for this change since 2022. We heard their calls, and we have delivered.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000168\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002288978fb9592a4911a8e47eae04d164f3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00224b32e8652fea20c829f0eb6f1d9181f8\u0022\u003EDr Vanessa Weenink\u003C/span\u003E: What feedback has he received about this change?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000169\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002276109ca9c1c74181a1e2734802d7f46f\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002218a2fafd7dcecd0f0cf5ff37c5677fb5\u0022\u003EHon SIMEON BROWN\u003C/span\u003E: The feedback from across the sector has been very positive. The Royal New Zealand College of General Practitioners has welcomed the move, noting that it ensures GP trainees have the same pay and employment conditions as their peers, which helps keep the system fair and make general practice a more attractive option for young doctors. The New Zealand Resident Doctors\u2019 Association has also welcomed the announcement, describing the change as correcting a \u201Clongstanding anomaly\u201D for GP trainees. Initiatives such as this are all part of this Government\u2019s plan to fix the basics and build the future.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000170\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002288978fb9592a4911a8e47eae04d164f3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00223600ed5a4e1a777ea3bfb9500208a4fa\u0022\u003EDr Vanessa Weenink\u003C/span\u003E: What other steps is the Government taking to strengthen our GP workforce?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000171\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002276109ca9c1c74181a1e2734802d7f46f\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00225aa876866de775691074bd1048930ca4\u0022\u003EHon SIMEON BROWN\u003C/span\u003E: This Government is taking a comprehensive approach to growing our primary care workforce. That includes increasing medical training places across Auckland and Otago by 100 per year over the course of this Government; establishing a Waikato medical school, which will train an additional 120 doctors each year from 2028; funding 100 overseas trained doctors already living in New Zealand to begin work in GP practices over the next two years; funding up to 50 New Zealand\u00A0-\u00A0trained graduate doctors a year to train in primary care settings; and fully funding GP training fees for all three years of the programme, aligning it with other medical specialties. All of this is about building a stronger GP pipeline so New Zealanders can get the care they need when they need it.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000172\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u0022c0aa94b3f6cf4937807f07a84970fffa\u0022\u003EEconomic Growth\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000173\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u002285501406fb6416a74b47ea45d5ae10bc\u0022\u003EQuestion No. 8\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00220750364c2c1444d0ae00bced720f964e\u0022 data-id=\u00223002510922197e09b300a8b8c72edb80\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000174\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220750364c2c1444d0ae00bced720f964e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00223002510922197e09b300a8b8c72edb80\u0022\u003EHon GINNY ANDERSEN (Labour) (14:46)\u003C/span\u003E to the \u003Cspan class=\u0022CharacterBold\u0022\u003EMinister for Economic Growth\u003C/span\u003E: Do 32,000 fewer people in work compared to two years ago reflect a growing economy; if so, why?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00226b99476d584f47b19420b8154e6947dc\u0022 data-id=\u002216f02c98f0d6078b488e015f4606079a\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000175\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226b99476d584f47b19420b8154e6947dc\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002216f02c98f0d6078b488e015f4606079a\u0022\u003EHon NICOLA WILLIS (Minister for Economic Growth) (14:47)\u003C/span\u003E: No, but 15,000 more people in work compared to three months ago does.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000176\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022083a816abbb847f0a99aff178b1bbba2\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022f478ec3b65f123bb6267aa8eb1ef503b\u0022\u003EHon Carmel Sepuloni\u003C/span\u003E: Still can\u2019t do numbers.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000177\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a2d138cbb839455d9754acbe91a75102\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002258dd7a216c13137ad0f9ac82c1c8af82\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Hang on. One person\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000178\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226b99476d584f47b19420b8154e6947dc\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002209e36f785636c5a8cbb4fac8d57aee94\u0022\u003EHon NICOLA WILLIS\u003C/span\u003E: That\u2019d be Ginny who can\u2019t do numbers.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000179\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220750364c2c1444d0ae00bced720f964e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00220e80232710300c515d82cc2a72c2bbc2\u0022\u003EHon Ginny Andersen\u003C/span\u003E: OBEGALx.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000180\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a2d138cbb839455d9754acbe91a75102\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00223de3713d0e4c8e33c5da6c83ca4533cf\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: No, just ask your question.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000181\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220750364c2c1444d0ae00bced720f964e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022f79a56f1877a66d5668b608308a33016\u0022\u003EHon Ginny Andersen\u003C/span\u003E: Are the 350 jobs at risk from the Wattie\u2019s restructure a sign that the economy is growing?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000182\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226b99476d584f47b19420b8154e6947dc\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00220dd214f45380500d186d587c5891d911\u0022\u003EHon NICOLA WILLIS\u003C/span\u003E: I want to extend my sympathies to the Heinz-Wattie\u2019s team at this tough time, including employees currently being consulted with, as well as growers, suppliers, and the communities that support them. New Zealand\u2019s manufacturing industry has faced challenges for several years, and supply chain disruption and global tariffs, along with inflationary pressure, have created headwinds for export-driven businesses. Broadly speaking, I am receiving positive feedback from the wider manufacturing industry that sentiment is improving. In the latest ANZ Business Outlook survey, manufacturing is leading business confidence at 77 points. The latest BNZ-BusinessNZ Performance of Manufacturing Index also shows the sector expanding, with a reading of 55.2\u2014above the level that indicates overall growth.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000183\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220750364c2c1444d0ae00bced720f964e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002231863adbed3af35b7c825ea5bc98890d\u0022\u003EHon Ginny Andersen\u003C/span\u003E: What opportunities for growth are there for the 220 growers that supply produce for Wattie\u2019s?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000184\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226b99476d584f47b19420b8154e6947dc\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022b6a0cf03272eae95d94a6d82ee2bb5ad\u0022\u003EHon NICOLA WILLIS\u003C/span\u003E: Again, I want to acknowledge that this will be a period of significant uncertainty for those growers, who are some of the best in the world at what they do\u2014who grow food that is nutritious, and they do so in an efficient manner. There is global demand for the quality of food that New Zealand produces, and while I, again, acknowledge that this is an uncertain time for those suppliers, it is likely that there will still be demand for the products they produce.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000185\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220750364c2c1444d0ae00bced720f964e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00229fe8106fa397dc03d9e18067d837ec27\u0022\u003EHon Ginny Andersen\u003C/span\u003E: Is Wattie\u2019s closing its frozen vegetable supply going to improve grocery competition?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000186\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226b99476d584f47b19420b8154e6947dc\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002249b0cc05b6ea4d2a1209d46bc5120122\u0022\u003EHon NICOLA WILLIS\u003C/span\u003E: No.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000187\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220750364c2c1444d0ae00bced720f964e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00226c46358a6dcb684ca75704ab435b7c42\u0022\u003EHon Ginny Andersen\u003C/span\u003E: Is it a sign of growth when 17,000 people attend a jobs fair in Auckland, when only 100 employers were looking for workers?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000188\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226b99476d584f47b19420b8154e6947dc\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00224083ca1ab06f59ffde8eb827891e2480\u0022\u003EHon NICOLA WILLIS\u003C/span\u003E: Unlike that member, I say good on all of those people who went to that job fair; I say good on them for going out and looking for work. And I say to them, in the last three months, 15,000 more jobs were created, and we are doing everything we can to have an economy that supports more jobs being created. To every New Zealander who is taking the effort to go out and find more work: we\u2019re on your side. Go for it.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000189\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220750364c2c1444d0ae00bced720f964e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002289770504721e88a6f69b4210b9ea66d4\u0022\u003EHon Ginny Andersen\u003C/span\u003E: Is Wattie\u2019s closing just one more sign of her failing economic plan, which is causing more harm than good to New Zealand?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000190\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226b99476d584f47b19420b8154e6947dc\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022da6e49229c1730fc1ea58b1b6427a92b\u0022\u003EHon NICOLA WILLIS\u003C/span\u003E: No, and I\u2019d like to reprise a conversation I had with Kieran McAnulty on breakfast television this morning. When I asked him whether the Labour Party were proposing that they would subsidise the jobs at Heinz-Wattie\u2019s, he said that that was not the position. I asked him, indeed, what he thought the Government should be considering to support those workers, and he said that he had no proposals. I can tell you very clearly what our Government proposes. What we say is that this is a time to ensure that manufacturers do not face escalating costs in the regulatory burdens that they face. This is a time to ensure that farmers do not face excessive environmental and red tape, which gets in the way of their ability to produce. This is a time to ensure that they have electricity security, and we are making reforms to ensure electricity affordability. Our Government is ensuring that the underlying conditions in the economy support our manufacturing industries, and the numbers are in: they show that overall confidence in the manufacturing sector is the highest it has been in several years.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000191\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u002228457968b7c8d53802e4ae97b3b35b55\u0022\u003ETrade and Investment\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000192\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u00220c8421439dc7c4ea6352ac1a36507c26\u0022\u003EQuestion No. 9\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00226c562dc86e974914b8878595e580f138\u0022 data-id=\u0022810ad0c4ff57a586109f4daf9d4ccca4\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000193\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226c562dc86e974914b8878595e580f138\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022810ad0c4ff57a586109f4daf9d4ccca4\u0022\u003ECATHERINE WEDD (National\u2014Tukituki) (14:51)\u003C/span\u003E the \u003Cspan class=\u0022CharacterBold\u0022\u003EMinister for Trade and Investment\u003C/span\u003E: What work is the Government doing to underpin the growth of New Zealand\u2019s exports? \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022446ec2690c724b8189770c259d2e676a\u0022 data-id=\u0022533488f5d23ff14b6a98c3eedff3fa73\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000194\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022446ec2690c724b8189770c259d2e676a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022533488f5d23ff14b6a98c3eedff3fa73\u0022\u003EHon NICOLA GRIGG (Minister of State for Trade and Investment) (14:51)\u003C/span\u003E on behalf of the \u003Cspan class=\u0022CharacterBold\u0022\u003EMinister for Trade and Investment\u003C/span\u003E: I can say that New Zealand\u2019s export performance continues to strengthen. This growth is led by our primary industries, strong global demand for high-quality New Zealand products, and an active trade policy agenda. The latest Ministry for Primary Industries (MPI) forecasts show that food and fibre exports remain at historically high levels, with horticulture alone expected to reach $9.2\u00A0billion in revenue this year. This growth matters because it brings real money back into New Zealand. It supports jobs, it helps lift incomes, it funds public services, and it strengthens the economy for all New Zealanders. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000195\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226c562dc86e974914b8878595e580f138\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022eac21f9798c99d07abc4b7c4918e5241\u0022\u003ECatherine Wedd\u003C/span\u003E: Why are the primary industries so important to New Zealand\u2019s export success?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000196\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022446ec2690c724b8189770c259d2e676a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00227c346396afef57ae880c0c212cf7343a\u0022\u003EHon NICOLA GRIGG\u003C/span\u003E: Let me count the ways. The primary industries are indeed the backbone of New Zealand\u2019s export economy. They generate our largest export earnings, worth over $60 billion last year. They underpin employment right across the country, from farms and orchards to processors, exporters, and logistics businesses. The strength we\u2019ve seen across this export sector reflects New Zealand\u2019s reputation for safe, sustainable, high-quality products, which continues to resonate in global markets.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000197\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226c562dc86e974914b8878595e580f138\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022fc7df9bdb0e2cc8a4e264110e7cf35ed\u0022\u003ECatherine Wedd\u003C/span\u003E: How is the Government supporting exporters to grow trade and access new markets?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000198\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022446ec2690c724b8189770c259d2e676a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022eb8a24272241a8ffe82182ce23c02d67\u0022\u003EHon NICOLA GRIGG\u003C/span\u003E: As a Government, we\u2019re focused on opening doors for exporters and strengthening relationships with key trading partners, and that includes advancing trade agreements and reinforcing cooperation with like-minded economies. A good example of this was last week\u2019s announcement of an agricultural cooperation arrangement with Chile, which boosts closer collaboration between two exporting nations, reinforces our shared commitment to open, rules-based trade, and drives the primary sector\u2019s further success.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000199\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226c562dc86e974914b8878595e580f138\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022cdfe7996fc86d8edbc4d95bf64b8c64b\u0022\u003ECatherine Wedd\u003C/span\u003E: What else is the Government doing to support exporters at the moment?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000200\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022446ec2690c724b8189770c259d2e676a\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00227dca32f12c0430dcc73dd958e2b9a917\u0022\u003EHon NICOLA GRIGG\u003C/span\u003E: There are challenges arising from the current conflict in the Middle East. Agencies are meeting with sector bodies and exporters, including in our dairy, meat, horticulture, wine, and wood sectors. MPI is assisting primary sectors to manage any disruptions to consignments en route to that market. We\u2019re also working to provide information to importers and exporters. An exporters\u2019 webinar was hosted just last Friday by the Ministry of Foreign Affairs and Trade, New Zealand Trade and Enterprise, the Ministry of Business, Innovation and Employment, MPI, and the Ministry of Transport. It was attended by 850 exporters. The next webinar will be held next week, and I encourage any businesses or exporters concerned to register and attend.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000201\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u00227cf5b1601b25e26a1d6ad775fb747dfc\u0022\u003EPacific Peoples\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000202\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u0022080c6094289b0de2a678e52a3e7878a0\u0022\u003EQuestion No. 10\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022fd2c9c3aa7974099bfcaac8ea7452994\u0022 data-id=\u0022610d5d5424cf7d3d083933d9c3b494ec\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000203\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022fd2c9c3aa7974099bfcaac8ea7452994\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022610d5d5424cf7d3d083933d9c3b494ec\u0022\u003EHon JENNY SALESA (Labour\u2014Panmure-\u014Ct\u0101huhu) (14:54)\u003C/span\u003E to the \u003Cspan class=\u0022CharacterBold\u0022\u003EMinister for Pacific Peoples\u003C/span\u003E: Is he confident that the lives of Pasifika people in New Zealand have improved under this Government; if not, why not?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022673069789fe74d02ac517109c173ccbd\u0022 data-id=\u002250e5b314132143d2377f757d8d8671c7\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000204\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022673069789fe74d02ac517109c173ccbd\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002250e5b314132143d2377f757d8d8671c7\u0022\u003EHon Dr SHANE RETI (Minister for Pacific Peoples) (14:54)\u003C/span\u003E: Yes, this Government is committed to improving the lives of all New Zealanders, including our Pacific communities. That\u2019s why we\u2019ve taken strong steps to restore law and order, with 49,000 fewer victims of violent crime; ram raids are down 85 percent; and repeat youth offending is down 22 percent. We\u2019re improving health outcomes by lifting childhood immunisations to 82.6 percent, as well as delivering faster cancer treatments, shorter emergency department waits, and thousands more elective surgeries. We are seeing progress in education, with phonics proficiency lifting from 36 percent to 58 percent. The Government is fixing the basics and building a future for all Kiwis, including Pacific people.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000205\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022fd2c9c3aa7974099bfcaac8ea7452994\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022d5606664874fdb2f3b24aefdb8f5ccf8\u0022\u003EHon Jenny Salesa\u003C/span\u003E: Is he delivering the brighter future he promised Pasifika, when almost 10,000 more Pasifika children are living in hardship now, under his watch?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000206\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022673069789fe74d02ac517109c173ccbd\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00221ab803389a5c8982edafa055c26ddf26\u0022\u003EHon Dr SHANE RETI\u003C/span\u003E: There\u2019s an inverse relationship between hardship and warm, dry homes. I\u2019m very proud of the Our Whare Our Fale initiative, which, in Porirua, will deliver to 300 homes, of which more than a dozen I\u2019ve already enabled.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000207\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022fd2c9c3aa7974099bfcaac8ea7452994\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00223fbc555422e4eb170fe0bf380f5edb99\u0022\u003EHon Jenny Salesa\u003C/span\u003E: Is it a surprise that almost 10,000 more Pasifika children are in hardship when, under this Government, 13,000 more Pasifika are now unemployed?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000208\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022673069789fe74d02ac517109c173ccbd\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a0027f2c7d112651dad7e3719842d552\u0022\u003EHon Dr SHANE RETI\u003C/span\u003E: There are a number of initiatives we have for employment of Pacific people, including Tupu Aotearoa, Alo Vaka, and, indeed, just last week, I announced a new initiative for Pacific people, called Game On, a collaboration between the Game Developers Association, TupuToa, and The Cause Collective to give young Pasifika people experience in what is now nearly a billion-dollar gaming industry.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000209\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022fd2c9c3aa7974099bfcaac8ea7452994\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00227afc7af3ee9f6ad1bf3fa8bd8231f091\u0022\u003EHon Jenny Salesa\u003C/span\u003E: Is it a surprise that almost 10,000 more Pasifika children are in hardship, when, on his watch, one in four Pasifika youth are unemployed?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000210\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022673069789fe74d02ac517109c173ccbd\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002299f02956eb7def06a0d9210ac0b9349b\u0022\u003EHon Dr SHANE RETI\u003C/span\u003E: As I mentioned, I was very proud to announce, last week, up to 57 places for the Game On initiative, which will give them skills and the ability to contribute to the gaming industry and high-value employment.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000211\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022fd2c9c3aa7974099bfcaac8ea7452994\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a208423a4d54d3fc3fbdb40a1d2bc259\u0022\u003EHon Jenny Salesa\u003C/span\u003E: When he said just last week\u2014and I quote\u2014\u201CI believe it is important that there is a strong voice for Pacific peoples within government, both at a ministerial level and within the public service.\u201D, was he promising Pasifika that this Government would never abolish the Ministry for Pacific Peoples?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000212\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022673069789fe74d02ac517109c173ccbd\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022658e7cb0070aa282de55a2975f974ee1\u0022\u003EHon Dr SHANE RETI\u003C/span\u003E: We\u2019ve already made those statements. That will not happen in this term of Government.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000213\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022fd2c9c3aa7974099bfcaac8ea7452994\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002217f30a14ad3c5b8a5cba1802f7497f6c\u0022\u003EHon Jenny Salesa\u003C/span\u003E: When Pasifika unemployment has doubled under his watch, one in four Pasifika youth are unemployed, and almost one in three Pasifika children are living in poverty, how can he possibly claim to be delivering a bright future for Pasifika New Zealanders?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000214\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022673069789fe74d02ac517109c173ccbd\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00226322d6ca22a73ddc78fae80b9f248f33\u0022\u003EHon Dr SHANE RETI\u003C/span\u003E: I do acknowledge those concerns and have also demonstrated the actions that we\u2019re taking to address them.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000215\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u002212b3ae2f33d785b76892544171e5e20d\u0022\u003EPrime Minister\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000216\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u0022c9ad0bf0024ac286d5ea0b1b42e50512\u0022\u003EQuestion No. 11\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00221a30b7d60a03452cb9b736efc6896cdb\u0022 data-id=\u002268394bf7ddf073bef3f0b409bd29a138\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000217\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221a30b7d60a03452cb9b736efc6896cdb\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002268394bf7ddf073bef3f0b409bd29a138\u0022\u003EDr PARMJEET PARMAR (ACT) (14:57)\u003C/span\u003E to the \u003Cspan class=\u0022CharacterBold\u0022\u003EPrime Minister\u003C/span\u003E: Does he stand by all of the Government\u2019s statements and actions?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00226e1ef2baa19e4b8b9dc9ee8604ae7dba\u0022 data-id=\u0022090cd377a3843c356e17360916a5d2d9\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000218\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226e1ef2baa19e4b8b9dc9ee8604ae7dba\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022090cd377a3843c356e17360916a5d2d9\u0022\u003EHon DAVID SEYMOUR (Deputy Prime Minister) (14:57)\u003C/span\u003E on behalf of the \u003Cspan class=\u0022CharacterBold\u0022\u003EPrime Minister\u003C/span\u003E: Yes\u2014in particular, the Minister for Workplace Relations and Safety, Brooke van Velden, is leading one of the most significant and most needed legislative reform programmes of any Government in over two decades, including the repeal of the widely loathed Holidays Act 2003. The Holidays Act has been so needlessly complex that even Government departments with all their resources have struggled to pay their employees correctly, racking up hundreds of millions of dollars in liabilities along the way. You can only imagine what that has been like for small businesses trying to calculate employee pay over the holidays. The Employment Leave Bill, introduced this week, to be debated after question time, will reduce compliance costs for businesses and deliver clarity for employees\u2014something that people have been waiting for almost since the Holidays Act was passed on April Fools\u2019 Day in 2004. Unfortunately, Brooke van Velden was in intermediate school at the time, but she got here to fix it up just as quickly as she could. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000219\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221a30b7d60a03452cb9b736efc6896cdb\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00228c0f999352f5d7f75ae8571801497504\u0022\u003EDr Parmjeet Parmar\u003C/span\u003E: If passed into law, how will the Employment Leave Bill help New Zealand employers?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000220\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226e1ef2baa19e4b8b9dc9ee8604ae7dba\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002273e8cc76fdbeccad2d485c0c33278463\u0022\u003EHon DAVID SEYMOUR\u003C/span\u003E: On behalf of the Prime Minister, the Employment Leave Bill benefits businesses by saving them time and money when calculating their payroll obligations. Getting Holidays Act obligations wrong has been extremely costly for employers, many of whom have had to invest in sophisticated payroll software in the hope it will save them from future headaches. The Employment Leave Bill restores confidence for employers so they can focus on growing their business rather than second-guessing payroll calculations. These changes will free up employers to focus on what they do best: growing their business, serving their customers, and investing in their people.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000221\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221a30b7d60a03452cb9b736efc6896cdb\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00228bb0fee0dae58e5d003cd33a6717ba12\u0022\u003EDr Parmjeet Parmar\u003C/span\u003E: How else will the Employment Leave Bill support New Zealand businesses?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000222\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226e1ef2baa19e4b8b9dc9ee8604ae7dba\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00220735989df479014faf8b8b799058c95c\u0022\u003EHon DAVID SEYMOUR\u003C/span\u003E: It is going to also improve the sick leave system with a pro rata sick leave system. No longer will a part-time employee receive the same amount of sick leave as someone working full time. All employees will receive sick leave hours proportionate to their contracted hours.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000223\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022db2ea575110f43e6b325fc2758d0d15b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022581294f86cd3cf9e00c0b1e501a67996\u0022\u003EHon Dr Ayesha Verrall\u003C/span\u003E: If the Minister responsible was giving the answer, you wouldn\u2019t have to read.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000224\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226e1ef2baa19e4b8b9dc9ee8604ae7dba\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022b17279f9f18d359612fd79f76d84823b\u0022\u003EHon DAVID SEYMOUR\u003C/span\u003E: I see people from the Labour Party are now criticising me for celebrating the deputy leader of ACT\u2019s achievements in policy reform for New Zealand. They think it\u2019s somehow diminishing to praise her.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000225\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022083a816abbb847f0a99aff178b1bbba2\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00221935e5add61ef50bf5fe270c27d7a0d8\u0022\u003EHon Carmel Sepuloni\u003C/span\u003E: Let her speak for herself.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000226\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226e1ef2baa19e4b8b9dc9ee8604ae7dba\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022e4c4d51f411f3f0a73a7521a6069abff\u0022\u003EHon DAVID SEYMOUR\u003C/span\u003E: Well, actually, she did speak for herself. She did question No. 1 yesterday, and she\u2019s going to have a lot more to say. I can only imagine Carmel Sepuloni just wishes that her leader praised her, but unfortunately the poor guy is not resourceful enough.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000227\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226710095aa1204b3793448571c208ccd4\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002238b954be695a0f880de37d9abc843152\u0022\u003EHon Julie Anne Genter\u003C/span\u003E: Supplementary?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000228\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a2d138cbb839455d9754acbe91a75102\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022f47e8054a9023767b6bb9f9b1e71915e\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Sorry, just a moment. Those comments are not at all helpful.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000229\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226710095aa1204b3793448571c208ccd4\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022fa9446d04f3b7b7b054b71819952c8b1\u0022\u003EHon Julie Anne Genter\u003C/span\u003E: Does he accept that his Government\u2019s decision to cancel the new inter-island ferries that were meant to arrive this year will likely continue to cause disruptions to passengers and freight, when yet another mechanical fault has taken out one of the two remaining Interislander ferries this week?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000230\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226e1ef2baa19e4b8b9dc9ee8604ae7dba\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022500b2b0a656cf04934d1ca57185abdc2\u0022\u003EHon DAVID SEYMOUR\u003C/span\u003E: On behalf of the Prime Minister, no, I don\u2019t accept that, because there have been long-documented problems with the existing ferries. That does not mean that the unaffordable and unviable solution that the previous Government put in place was the best answer for New Zealand. Yes, the ferries break down from time to time. Now, I\u2019ve heard about politicians that bark at every car, but I\u2019ve never heard of one that barks at every ferry.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000231\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221a30b7d60a03452cb9b736efc6896cdb\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00229834d480bded609bbdd4c8a78af4b640\u0022\u003EDr Parmjeet Parmar\u003C/span\u003E: Is the business community keenly anticipating the Employment Leave Bill becoming law?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000232\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226e1ef2baa19e4b8b9dc9ee8604ae7dba\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00228dbb91d17b1291cffacb03ef913a2b94\u0022\u003EHon DAVID SEYMOUR\u003C/span\u003E: Yes. On behalf of the Prime Minister, the Employers and Manufacturers Association says the Employment Leave Bill \u201Cmarks a significant and long-overdue step towards fixing a Holidays Act that has frustrated employers and employees for more than a decade.\u201D They go on to say, \u201CSuccessive governments have acknowledged the problems, but this is the first time in years we\u2019ve seen meaningful progress\u201D. I also note the endorsement of Bronwyn Heenan, employment national practice group lawyer at the firm Simpson Grierson, who said this week she is pleased to see a focus in the bill on a move to an hours-based framework. She said, \u201CThe stated policy objective is to deliver greater simplicity, clarity and certainty for both employers and employees, while improving compliance outcomes across the labour market. We consider the Bill is a positive step forward in achieving this objective.\u201D This Government has listened to the people responsible for jobs and prosperity, and we\u2019re delivering common-sense reform that makes their lives easier and their goals more attainable.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000233\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00221a30b7d60a03452cb9b736efc6896cdb\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022971e0938fb1abe3ae22dbf885921c6fe\u0022\u003EDr Parmjeet Parmar\u003C/span\u003E: Has there been any other indication of support from the New Zealand business community for the Employment Leave Bill?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000234\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226e1ef2baa19e4b8b9dc9ee8604ae7dba\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022ec0bba5a5321fe153f134f39b4d523df\u0022\u003EHon DAVID SEYMOUR\u003C/span\u003E: Yes. I have spoken to people up and down the country who run small businesses, and they say we are under so much pressure, as New Zealanders are up and down the country. The question is, beyond talk and beyond rhetoric that we hear so often from the other side of the Chamber, what practical things are being done to improve the situation for us? When you tell them Brooke van Velden has moved the Holidays Act to an hours-based scheme with the new Employment Leave Bill, they get it immediately. It may not be all over the headlines, it may not be popular retail politics, but it is actually fixing something tangible that matters, and for that I think Brooke van Velden deserves all of our respect.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000235\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226710095aa1204b3793448571c208ccd4\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00229980502be928a5ae76384dd6d80001f2\u0022\u003EHon Julie Anne Genter\u003C/span\u003E: What is his response to Billy Clemens from Transporting New Zealand, who said, \u201CWe are really concerned that this incident just shows how vulnerable the Cook Strait connection is, particularly for that kind of high-priority freight which really can\u2019t be delayed.\u201D?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000236\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226e1ef2baa19e4b8b9dc9ee8604ae7dba\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022de48ead92be88d4a039c79ede4d870cf\u0022\u003EHon DAVID SEYMOUR\u003C/span\u003E: On behalf of the Prime Minister, I would say to Billy Clemens: be very careful how people may use your quotes for political advantage in Parliament.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000237\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226710095aa1204b3793448571c208ccd4\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a4689a4fb41710358992f8aac4edd423\u0022\u003EHon Julie Anne Genter\u003C/span\u003E: What action, if any, will his Government take to increase the resilience of the ability of freight and people to cross the Cook Strait, given it\u2019s three more years before we are going to get a replacement ferry?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000238\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226e1ef2baa19e4b8b9dc9ee8604ae7dba\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00222afc8e3902fe009eb5608d8832246640\u0022\u003EHon DAVID SEYMOUR\u003C/span\u003E: The answer is in the Minister\u2019s first supplementary answer in this series. The Government has created an affordable pathway to have rail-enabled ferries, with places that they can be loaded and unloaded at either end, that are actually viable and affordable. When the Opposition say, \u201COh, we already had ferries arriving.\u201D, maybe you did, but you didn\u2019t know how to fit them through the channel that they had to pass through, you didn\u2019t have the ports that they needed to load and unload, so you are pointing to a fantasy rather than a solution.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000239\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226710095aa1204b3793448571c208ccd4\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002216fef3fdecab50b348710dec1145cc8b\u0022\u003EHon Julie Anne Genter\u003C/span\u003E: Point of order, Mr Speaker. I appreciate that the Minister wants to deflect by making this a political debate but my question was about actions that will be taken immediately\u2014[\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsCharacterItalics\u0022\u003EInterruption\u003C/span\u003E]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000240\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a2d138cbb839455d9754acbe91a75102\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00223f1ccce0d47e426ed90dc847a15a3335\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: No, hang on. You know the rules. Points of order are heard in silence. Please start again.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000241\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226710095aa1204b3793448571c208ccd4\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002218c85d4df9ee725f2f842d6cb265e5cb\u0022\u003EHon Julie Anne Genter\u003C/span\u003E: The question, if he could answer on behalf\u2014\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000242\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a2d138cbb839455d9754acbe91a75102\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022026cc2aae22b0e4a10b2e05dc5829098\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: No, no. Start again.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000243\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226710095aa1204b3793448571c208ccd4\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022ca6fa8b987ec492250863a5f992a8e63\u0022\u003EHon Julie Anne Genter\u003C/span\u003E: Repeat the question or the point of order?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000244\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a2d138cbb839455d9754acbe91a75102\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002240415e2b0621f0044bfe10f5b90c43d6\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: The point of order. Don\u2019t push it.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000245\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226710095aa1204b3793448571c208ccd4\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a9f2fe635a5048867067523b6d611744\u0022\u003EHon Julie Anne Genter\u003C/span\u003E: OK. My question was about what action, if any, his Government will take to increase resilience now and for the next few years. The Minister didn\u2019t address that.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000246\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a2d138cbb839455d9754acbe91a75102\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022a50a4d2feb2bc23ff8ecd4018ef2d117\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: I think he most certainly addressed the question\u2014not as satisfactorily to the member\u2019s requirements, but certainly to mine.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000247\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226e1ef2baa19e4b8b9dc9ee8604ae7dba\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00227f56d58eb3c65a359eb382cbedf2fc83\u0022\u003EHon David Seymour\u003C/span\u003E: Give her another one!\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000248\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a2d138cbb839455d9754acbe91a75102\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002261a60f868c00a97a5020009184c6e357\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Question No. 12\u2014Dr Carlos Cheung.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000249\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226710095aa1204b3793448571c208ccd4\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022aec7fcd8d47ae4fc466e16b7af088bf2\u0022\u003EHon Julie Anne Genter\u003C/span\u003E: I seek leave to ask an additional supplementary question.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000250\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00220f0ea54aae966789c8442043d40c720c\u0022\u003EHon Members: \u003C/span\u003ENo!\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000251\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a2d138cbb839455d9754acbe91a75102\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00220aeb77b281b3908c5f04fd6e06169025\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Leave is sought for that purpose. Is there any objection? Yes, there is.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000252\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u00225b70f1e73dead334768b70d72b8b8247\u0022\u003ETransport\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000253\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u0022e17cb815f5936751c64861fdd4f96f7a\u0022\u003EQuestion No. 12\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022b618b847a57b4afb94b76eaea9e042a5\u0022 data-id=\u0022215a6f76756ad85b7ea8322ccdf558f4\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000254\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b618b847a57b4afb94b76eaea9e042a5\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022215a6f76756ad85b7ea8322ccdf558f4\u0022\u003EDr CARLOS CHEUNG (National\u2014Mt Roskill) (15:06)\u003C/span\u003E to the \u003Cspan class=\u0022CharacterBold\u0022\u003EAssociate Minister of Transport\u003C/span\u003E: What recent announcement has he made about coastal shipping?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00225459b3c0726d42c1b6d3cc94ec303baa\u0022 data-id=\u00228fc0a350bbbf53bbd2314c401e653a8d\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000255\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225459b3c0726d42c1b6d3cc94ec303baa\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00228fc0a350bbbf53bbd2314c401e653a8d\u0022\u003EHon JAMES MEAGER (Associate Minister of Transport) (15:06)\u003C/span\u003E: Thank you, Mr Speaker. Today, I\u2019ve announced the final project funded by the Government\u2019s $30 million Coastal Shipping Resilience Fund, which is a $400,000 investment towards a national digital platform to improve critical supply chain efficiency and coordination across our ports. This follows our recent commitment of $8.3 million to build the next generation of Kiwi seafarers by funding trainee places on ships. This support will significantly ease financial pressures on domestic vessel operators training the workforce of tomorrow. With a third of the workforce hitting retirement age within the next five years, it\u2019s essential that we build a homegrown supply of talent that will not only support coastal shipping but the wider maritime sector that underpins New Zealand\u2019s local and national economy. Our Government\u2019s investment will ensure that we can move our goods around the country, particularly in a time of crisis.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000256\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b618b847a57b4afb94b76eaea9e042a5\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00229a00031aa3c7c4b395a0c34e3aa5fcad\u0022\u003EDr Carlos Cheung\u003C/span\u003E: What announcements has he made about investments supporting disaster relief?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000257\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225459b3c0726d42c1b6d3cc94ec303baa\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022fc128b4207f4d586be1d2d6153d0f7b9\u0022\u003EHon JAMES MEAGER\u003C/span\u003E: As part of the Government\u2019s investment into coastal shipping, the \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsCharacterItalics\u0022\u003ERangitata\u003C/span\u003E vessel will receive $3 million from the fund to improve its ability to carry different types of cargo across a wider range of ports nationwide. Many of those who went through Cyclone Gabrielle will remember the \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsCharacterItalics\u0022\u003ERangitata\u003C/span\u003E as providing disaster relief during that time. This investment will fund a deck-mounted crane capable of loading and unloading bulk cargo to be operating by the year\u2019s end. This will mean the \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsCharacterItalics\u0022\u003ERangitata\u003C/span\u003E can transport a broader range of bulk items and operate without relying on port-side infrastructure and cranes\u2014facilities which may not be useable after a significant event.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000258\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b618b847a57b4afb94b76eaea9e042a5\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022561d9751197a181b70a2b273c8b5e678\u0022\u003EDr Carlos Cheung\u003C/span\u003E: What announcements has he made in the North Island?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000259\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225459b3c0726d42c1b6d3cc94ec303baa\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022ebb34fb3332c66de1b7e792bae2d1df3\u0022\u003EHon JAMES MEAGER\u003C/span\u003E: Good news for North Islanders: we\u2019ve made a significant investment into new container-handling equipment that has just arrived at Gisborne\u2019s Eastland Port, greeted by local MP Dana Kirkpatrick. This $5 million investment will unlock fresh economic opportunities for the Tair\u0101whiti region and will directly benefit local businesses, exporters, and industries by enabling the opportunity to ship containers outside of Gisborne. In Whanganui on Monday\u2014on the other side of the island\u2014alongside MP Carl Bates, I announced an $8 million co-investment into the procurement of a new crane dredging barge that will ensure vital supplies can be delivered to regional communities cut off by natural disasters and other major emergencies. The equipment\u2019s total cost is $12.9 million, with the remainder being co-funded by Northland-based marine construction company Johnson Bros Ltd. It will be operational in late 2027, and I\u2019d like to acknowledge local MPs Dana Kirkpatrick and Carl Bates for their ongoing advocacy for investment in coastal shipping resilience.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000260\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b618b847a57b4afb94b76eaea9e042a5\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00220c4d1998ecbd34a37df7be02c7286179\u0022\u003EDr Carlos Cheung\u003C/span\u003E: What investment has been made in the South Island?\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000261\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225459b3c0726d42c1b6d3cc94ec303baa\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00222b3bdd6efad4f7731f08b94c78476064\u0022\u003EHon JAMES MEAGER\u003C/span\u003E: As well as the superbly named \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsCharacterItalics\u0022\u003ERangitata\u003C/span\u003E vessel, the Government has committed $4.3 million for major upgrades to the Port of Greymouth and $1 million for a regional safety programme to be shared with Westport port. The upgrade will significantly increase the region\u2019s resilience when completed in early 2028. It will create a much-needed avenue for essential supplies and equipment to be delivered by sea in the event of a disaster which cuts off road and rail links. This investment, of course, has been championed by fantastic local MP Maureen Pugh, who has long been an advocate for the West Coast and for this project.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000262\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a2d138cbb839455d9754acbe91a75102\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002274667ddb31da0c45ab6bc582bb94c270\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: That concludes oral questions. We\u2019ll take 30 seconds while those who have to go to other business leave the House quietly and without conversation on the way.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n    \u003C/div\u003E\n    \u003Cdiv class=\u0022HpsHansard\u0022\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000263\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsProceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u002275ee7de4b3f9b3ffd346bc98e4c2d804\u0022\u003EBills\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000264\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u00225d6e13a163a0b2782090c339e811c7c1\u0022\u003ENg\u0101ti Ruapani mai Waikaremoana Claims Settlement Bill\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000265\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u00222402d12320754c9cc88a8d17f0074ad9\u0022\u003ELegislative Statement\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002291c0e777ce3d4711ace36a15c7e22ffe\u0022 data-id=\u0022a4be20089b1371903775643febe92c10\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000266\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002291c0e777ce3d4711ace36a15c7e22ffe\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022a4be20089b1371903775643febe92c10\u0022\u003EHon PAUL GOLDSMITH (Minister for Treaty of Waitangi Negotiations) (15:10)\u003C/span\u003E: I present a legislative statement on the Ng\u0101ti Ruapani mai Waikaremoana Claims Settlement Bill.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000267\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022a2d138cbb839455d9754acbe91a75102\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00225c477562c29d5e454c30754e09d56547\u0022\u003ESPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: The legislative statement is published under the authority of the House and can be found on the Parliament website.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000268\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u00228712e636829272c5ba31de1c42027b2b\u0022\u003EFirst Reading\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002291c0e777ce3d4711ace36a15c7e22ffe\u0022 data-id=\u0022f0b01256caa76b402358aa3074010f27\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000269\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002291c0e777ce3d4711ace36a15c7e22ffe\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022f0b01256caa76b402358aa3074010f27\u0022\u003EHon PAUL GOLDSMITH (Minister for Treaty of Waitangi Negotiations) (15:11)\u003C/span\u003E: I move, \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsCharacterItalics\u0022\u003EThat the Ng\u0101ti Ruapani mai Waikaremoana Claims Settlement Bill be now read a first time.\u003C/span\u003E I nominate the M\u0101ori Affairs Committee to consider the bill. At the appropriate time, I intend to move that the bill be reported to the House by 27\u00A0July 2026.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000270\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan lang=\u0022mi\u0022\u003ETihei mauri ora. E ng\u0101 rau rangatira o Ng\u0101ti Ruapani mai Waikaremoana, t\u0113n\u0101 koutou. Nei r\u0101 te mihi hoki ki ng\u0101 w\u0101hi o t\u014D koutou rohe; ko Panekire maunga; ko Waikaret\u0101heke awa; ko Waikaremoana hoki. E mihi ana. Piki mai kake mai ki Te Upoko o te Ika.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000271\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003E[\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsCharacterItalics\u0022\u003EThe breath of life. To the many chiefs of Ng\u0101ti Ruapani mai Waikaremoana, greetings. I also acknowledge the landmarks of your region: Panekire is the mountain, Waikaret\u0101heke is the river; and to Waikaremoana itself. I welcome you. Welcome to the head of the fish\u003C/span\u003E.]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000272\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EKia ora and welcome to the many members from Ng\u0101ti Ruapani mai Waikaremoana, making the journey here today and joining us here in Wellington, in this Chamber, for a significant milestone. We\u2019re moving quickly through the end stages of this settlement. It was only two weeks ago that we were up in T\u016Bai to sign the deed, and a wonderful day that was. I was there; I delivered the Crown apology on the shore of Lake Whakamarino, surrounded by the ngahere of Te Urewera. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000273\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EIt was particularly special to see the local tamariki splashing about in the lake\u2014including during the apology\u2014the members of the extended family and hap\u016B that were there, the sun shining, great food, and beautiful singing, and a robust challenge. It was a wonderful occasion, and I understand that the hap\u016B only had nine days to organise that ceremony, and they did a wonderful job.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000274\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EI\u2019d like to acknowledge the trustees and negotiators for their efforts in achieving this milestone. In particular, I want to acknowledge Kara Puketapu-Dentice, Te Ori Paki, Neuton Lambert, Nicky Kirikiri, Tina Wagner, Wes Turipa, and Tumanako Waiwai. I also want to pay my respects to Hemi Waiwai, who passed on before the negotiations concluded, and I acknowledge the emotions that many will be feeling today. This has been a long journey, and there are many that were part of that journey over the decades who are no longer here today, and we acknowledge them. I also acknowledge others who have contributed to the settlement, including Tamati Kruger, Kirsti Luke, Maea Rurehe, Lorna Taylor, Waireti Amai, Te Iwa Rangihau, and Paygan Johns, who helped. I also want to acknowledge the Crown team for their efforts over the years\u2014in particular, my predecessors as Minister for Treaty negotiations, the Hon Chris Finlayson and the Hon Andrew Little.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000275\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EToday\u2019s reading is an important milestone for Ng\u0101ti Ruapani in their settlement journey. While negotiations formally started in March 2020, Ng\u0101ti Ruapani have been seeking recognition and acknowledgement for generations. The first claim was laid in 1989, and we\u2019re very conscious of that long effor\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000276\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EThe settlement is grounded in the Crown\u2019s acknowledgment and apology for the many breaches of Te Tiriti o Waitangi / Treaty of Waitangi. It, in particular, refers to the Crown attacks on k\u0101inga, such as Te K\u014Dpane in 1886, in its use of the scorched earth policy over the years. It refers to the taking of the land at Onepoto in 1872 without compensation; the acquisition of 178,000 acres, in four southern blocks, after threatening to confiscate interests in this land; the failure to protect Ng\u0101ti Ruapani mai Waikaremoana from becoming, virtually, landless; pressuring Ng\u0101ti Ruapani into allowing their interests in the Waikaremoana block to be included in the Urewera consolidation scheme; and the failure to respect Ng\u0101ti Ruapani rangatiratanga by administrating the Waikaremoana lake bed, as if it were Crown property, for a long period of time. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000277\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EThe settlement package provides for financial and commercial redress of $24\u00A0million. It includes the transfer of shares in the Patunamu Forest Ltd and several commercial redress properties around South Waikaremoana. It includes two cultural redress properties totalling 50 hectares\u2014Turi-o Kahu and Kaitawa\u2014which have been carved out of the former Onepoto Conservation Area. The land is now unencumbered, giving the Ng\u0101ti Ruapani governance entity the option to use the land in whichever way it sees fit. The settlement will also restore traditional names to six places within the Ng\u0101ti Ruapani rohe, including the township of T\u016Bai.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000278\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EFinally, the settlement provides for the restoration of approximately 12,000\u00A0hectares of land into Te Urewera. For those who are not familiar, Te Urewera was established through the T\u016Bhoe settlement as a legal person and includes land previously known as Te Urewera National Park. The addition of land into Te Urewera recognises Ng\u0101ti Ruapani\u2019s wish to connect with the wider identity of Te Urewera and to protect the land by drawing it under the realm of Te Urewera. It also recognises the innate connection between Ng\u0101ti Ruapani and T\u016Bhoe.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000279\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EToday is about acknowledging the long and difficult journey it\u2019s taken to get here. It\u2019s true that no settlement can fully compensate for the loss and prejudice that the people of Ng\u0101ti Ruapani suffered. However, I believe this settlement lays a cultural and economic foundation for Ng\u0101ti Ruapani to strengthen their connection to their rohe and to grow their identity for future generations to come. This is the first reading of three to be had in this House, and I look forward to hosting you here again soon to support the passage of your legislation. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000280\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EI consider that the bill should proceed without delay to the M\u0101ori Affairs Committee. I commend the bill to the House. \u003Cspan lang=\u0022mi\u0022\u003EN\u014D reira, t\u0113n\u0101 koutou, t\u0113n\u0101 koutou, t\u0113n\u0101 t\u0101tou katoa.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022e968c1334f0a40bfbd05d661e979ba38\u0022 data-id=\u0022b03e21b207c7086df1b304291feb1888\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000281\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022e968c1334f0a40bfbd05d661e979ba38\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022b03e21b207c7086df1b304291feb1888\u0022\u003EHon WILLIE JACKSON (Labour) (15:18)\u003C/span\u003E: Thank you, Mr Speaker. \u003Cspan lang=\u0022mi\u0022\u003ETuatahi e mihi ana ki a koutou Ruapani i tae mai nei, i whakarangatira i te kaupapa i t\u0113nei w\u0101. T\u0113nei te mihi ki a koutou. Haere mai, haere mai, nau mai\u003C/span\u003E.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000282\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003E[\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsCharacterItalics\u0022\u003EFirstly, let me acknowledge Ruapani, who have gathered here to ennoble the occasion, I acknowledge you all. Welcome, welcome, welcome\u003C/span\u003E.]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000283\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EWell, for the first time in a number of weeks, I totally agree with everything that Minister Goldsmith said. That\u2019s what you get in these Treaty settlements, and it was well said. I think he said today at our p\u014D\u2019hiri that that\u2019s the beauty of these types of settlements. It does bring a unanimity in terms of the House. I want to thank the Minister for his work. You\u2019ll note that the Minister for M\u0101ori Development is here and he wasn\u2019t at the p\u014D\u2019hiri earlier today\u2014practising his answers for question time, I think was the reason he wasn\u2019t there\u2014so I\u2019ll give his apologies for him not being there. It\u2019s good to see him here too, because he, like us, is a huge supporter of this kaupapa. He has been an advocate for M\u0101ori in the past. I just want to make this point today because I heard some of this k\u014Drero today about the connection in terms of urban M\u0101ori and iwi\u2014particularly with Kara Puketapu being the chair. \u003Cspan lang=\u0022mi\u0022\u003EKei konei a Kara? Kia ora Kara, t\u0113n\u0101 koe\u003C/span\u003E. [\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsCharacterItalics\u0022\u003EIs Kara here? Greetings Kara.\u003C/span\u003E]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000284\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EI think that remains one of the biggest challenges for all of us in terms of iwi and urban and in terms of how we strengthen that connection. With respect to everyone who\u2019s here at this first reading, so many of our people are disenfranchised, so many of our people are not interested, and so many of our people are not speaking M\u0101ori or going to the marae or participating in terms of te ao M\u0101ori.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000285\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EI think with Treaty settlements we have to use them as an opportunity to bring our people back in: to bring our people back in in terms of their iwi, and to bring our people back in in terms of te ao M\u0101ori, to get them interested, to get them participating, particularly those\u2014and I know with Ruapani, there have been a lot of different arguments, as there are in terms of all Treaty settlements.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000286\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EI think that\u2019ll be the challenge: how do you activate someone in Lower Hutt, in Porirua? How do you activate these people? How do you get them interested in terms of going back to Ruapani\u2014$24 million\u2019s not going to get them interested; it\u2019s not enough, but it\u2019s a start? It\u2019s an opportunity, it\u2019s a start, and I don\u2019t think either side of the House would say that that type of p\u016Btea is anywhere enough, but what we always say with these types of kaupapa is that it\u2019s an opportunity that people like Tipene O\u2019Regan and Bob Mahuta saw before, too. The criticism was always that the p\u016Btea was only 2 percent or 1.5 percent of what a real settlement was worth.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000287\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EYou know, Ng\u0101i Tahu, for instance: the estimate was that that settlement was worth $16 billion to $18 billion; T\u0101 Tipene and them settled for $170 million, along with Sir Bob Mahuta in Tainui. People said it was peanuts, our activists said it was peanuts at the time, but look what they\u2019ve built with their peanuts\u2014look what Ng\u0101i Tahu\u2019s built; look what Tainui\u2019s built. I think that\u2019s the example for all tribes going forward: it doesn\u2019t matter what that p\u016Btea is in the end; it\u2019s an opportunity to activate our people, rangatahi\u2014get them involved in te ao M\u0101ori, get them involved in tikanga M\u0101ori, get them involved in the tribe, and you will see the fruits of the settlement. Because that\u2019s the problem with so many of the settlements: they\u2019re not big enough. They\u2019re not big enough where every single person in the tribe is going to get a cut, but there\u2019s enough there in terms of setting up a strategy, in terms of really getting our people involved in te ao M\u0101ori, and in terms of tikanga M\u0101ori.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000288\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ESo I wish you all the very best\u2014wish you all the very best. This is a good start. This is only the first reading, and we\u2019ll go through the process, but I think by the third reading, it\u2019d be good if we can get, you know, everyone down here and celebrating the chance and the opportunity to really make the settlement work. \u003Cspan lang=\u0022mi\u0022\u003EKia ora an\u014D t\u0101tou katoa\u003C/span\u003E.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002233a8db41ad0c4278b7eb829406824bb5\u0022 data-id=\u0022d34a576df14e0c4a82680c0dd9441350\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000289\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002233a8db41ad0c4278b7eb829406824bb5\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022d34a576df14e0c4a82680c0dd9441350\u0022\u003ESTEVE ABEL (Green) (15:23)\u003C/span\u003E: Thank you, Mr Speaker, and kia ora to Ng\u0101ti Ruapani mai Waikaremoana in the gallery today. Beyond the highfalutin idea of nationhood, there\u2019s a far more profound and important idea: it is the community of people. When people get up to do their daily round\u2014and maybe their job is one of drudgery, but they do it to put food on the table for their wh\u0101nau. Many of us through the country do that on a daily basis, but for some people, they carry in their ancestral memory the atrocities of war.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000290\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EWe have before us a document that I would urge not just my parliamentary colleagues but every New Zealander to read as a summary and an account of the repeated breaches of the most basic precepts of human decency against a people, Ng\u0101ti Ruapani mai Waikaremoana. The apology is thorough. It includes some of the worst atrocities, you might say, that we have read of in these settlements. It describes the Crown\u2019s attempt to dispose of and clear out Ruapani, a scorched-earth policy which resulted in the widespread destruction of k\u0101inga, p\u0101, cultivations, food stores, animals, w\u0101hi tapu, and taonga; widespread starvation and extensive loss of life; ruthless disregard for the survival of Ng\u0101ti Ruapani.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000291\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EReading those specific descriptions, I could not help but reflect on a contemporary definition, the characterisation of the intent to destroy, in part or whole, a people, which in 1946 garnered the term \u201Cgenocide\u201D. The intent to destroy, in whole or part, a people: this definition fits what we see described here that was done to your people.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000292\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EToday, Ng\u0101ti Ruapani come here to accept our tiny fragment of an offering so that they will do us the generosity of restoring the honour of the Crown. We as parliamentarians offer that humble apology and your forgiveness, because it is undeniable the wrongs the Crown did to your people. We also thank you, because in your act of accepting this deed of settlement, you are binding us together as a nation in a principle of rapprochement, a principle of us making amends for the harms done, that we may live in unity, because there cannot be cohesion or unity for our nation if there is not justice for M\u0101ori. That is the principle that is embodied in these Treaty settlements. Though it is not usual for us to make comment politically in these settlement processes, I would urge this Government in the strongest terms to resile from those Acts of this Parliament that have been passed now which cause division in our country, because they betray the principle of that founding agreement, Te Tiriti o Waitangi.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000293\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EHere today, we make some amends, and may this be the beginning of good for your people, Ng\u0101ti Ruapani mai Waikaremoana. Kia ora koutou.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022440a125e85954bae9f5d470b7551e4f3\u0022 data-id=\u00228dff7ca6989f9b0170cd20da8d16b0d3\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000294\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022440a125e85954bae9f5d470b7551e4f3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00228dff7ca6989f9b0170cd20da8d16b0d3\u0022\u003ECAMERON LUXTON (ACT) (15:28)\u003C/span\u003E: Thank you, Mr Speaker. T\u0113n\u0101 koe, Ng\u0101ti Ruapani mai Waikaremoana, who have made the journey down to listen to our speeches in this House today. I think reading through this deed of settlement gives weight to what Steve Abel has just pronounced in this House. Because of the actions of the past\u2014repeated immoral actions by the Crown\u2014your people have been scattered and are still trying to find their way home. You\u2019ve brought those who are connected today to a p\u014Dwhiri, which I wish I could\u2019ve made it to, but as this bill goes through the House, I would love to come to further ones for second and third readings. Your area, your rohe, is in a very, very important part of this country, and it is an important part of you\u2014protect it well, which I know you will. Thank you, Madam Speaker.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022d92a09db28c44070bbfdcc9f0e6f3cca\u0022 data-id=\u0022a7159ea1db3db5be35817cf0c87103d4\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000295\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022d92a09db28c44070bbfdcc9f0e6f3cca\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022a7159ea1db3db5be35817cf0c87103d4\u0022\u003EJENNY MARCROFT (NZ First) (15:29)\u003C/span\u003E: \u003Cspan lang=\u0022mi\u0022\u003EE te Pika, t\u0113n\u0101 koe. E ng\u0101 kaum\u0101tua me ng\u0101 kuia o Ng\u0101ti Ruapani mai Waikaremoana kua tae mai ki t\u0113nei Whare P\u0101remata, ki te tautoko te kaupapa o te rangi nei, t\u0113n\u0101 koutou katoa. E t\u016B ana ahau he uri n\u014D Te Tai Tokerau ki te mihi atu ki a koutou, ka nui aku mihi maioha ki a koutou. T\u0113n\u0101 koutou, t\u0113nei koutou, t\u0113n\u0101 koutou katoa. Ka mihi ahau hoki ki a t\u0101tou katoa kua huihui mai nei, t\u0113n\u0101 koutou, t\u0113n\u0101 koutou, t\u0113n\u0101 t\u0101tou katoa\u003C/span\u003E.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000296\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003E[\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsCharacterItalics\u0022\u003EGreetings to the Speaker. To the elders of Ng\u0101ti Ruapani mai Waikaremoana who have arrived here in Parliament in support of today\u2019s occasion, greetings to you. I stand here as a descendant of Tai Tokerau and greet you with much affection. Greetings to all. I would like to acknowledge everyone who has gathered here, I greet you thrice\u003C/span\u003E.]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000297\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EMy apologies to the gallery: the placement of my seat here\u2014I can\u2019t see unless I swing around away from the microphone, but I don\u2019t want to do that, so I\u2019ll look at you via the television screen.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000298\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EI begin my contribution on the Ng\u0101ti Ruapani mai Waikaremoana Claims Settlement Bill in support of this bill on behalf of New Zealand First. I begin my contribution by acknowledging the kaum\u0101tua and kuia who began the Ng\u0101ti Ruapani journey 40 years ago\u2014and I acknowledge Nina Buxton and Neuton Lambert\u2014and note that you are pleased that the journey to complete the settlement is almost over. Nearly there\u2014not far to go now. Kara Puketapu-Dentice, chair of Ng\u0101ti Ruapani mai Waikaremoana: greetings to you, also.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000299\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EThe documents that we see in the debate pack that we\u2019re given prior to our speeches on settlement bills are very grim reading, regardless of which Treaty settlement bill we\u2019re speaking to. But what I\u2019d like to do today is to acknowledge the beautiful part of the world you\u2019re from. My nieces, who whakapapa to Ng\u0101ti Ruapani, talk about Waikaremoana as the most serene place in all of New Zealand. They whakapapa to Ng\u0101ti Ruapani through Mauruuru Pango. Recently, Mariana was up in T\u016Bai, where she skipped around\u2014because she\u2019s very young and fit; she\u2019s a Touch Black. She walked up to Lake Waikareiti\u2014that\u2019s the smaller lake just above Waikaremoana, which can\u2019t be accessed by road; it\u2019s waewae access only. Her wh\u0101nau, they visit from time to time, and they speak so fondly and in such a heartfelt way of having their connection to this particular area through their whakapapa.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000300\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EWe are often shown photographs. We are envious, and we know that, at some point, we\u2019ve got to get ourselves down there to experience what can only be experienced by doing that in person. There\u2019s so many visitors and other New Zealanders who come to our country\u2014doing the walk around the lake is, of course, one of the great New Zealand walks. My cousin Mariana said to me that you don\u2019t live in Tuai for the modern amenities. She\u2019s training to be a doctor\u2014she\u2019ll be out as a doctor next year\u2014and she said it\u2019s an hour on the gravel to get to the closest hospital. She\u2019s recently spent a year at Wairoa Hospital. Also, the supermarket\u2019s a bit of a long way to go, but you actually live there to be connected to the whenua and to be the kaitiaki of it.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000301\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EAnd, I think, as a young person\u2014and this is to the point that Willie Jackson made in his contribution: how do you get the young people back home? It\u2019s that you be there looking after the place, so that when they come home, they are welcomed and they are able to learn who they are in that place. Having that ability to go back home\u2014if you haven\u2019t grown up there, it\u2019s really important that you can be embraced by the wh\u0101nau there and not judged for not being away and not having been connected until that time. That\u2019s something you can do to get them back, and I say that from my own experience of being disconnected from my Hokianga wh\u0101nau.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000302\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EI\u2019m going to leave my contribution there. I\u2019ll finish it just on the words that Kara Puketapu-Dentice noted, that they have much to do to rebuild over the generations ahead, but the settlement will enable them to focus on that rebuilding of their relationship with their whenua. They will be able to support their wh\u0101nau. They\u2019ll ensure that Waikaremoana continues to sustain future generations\u2014and it is about those generations that are so important. We can leave the past behind. We can draw a line in the sand and look towards the future, and I hope that blessing comes to all of you from Ng\u0101ti Ruapani. Thank you, Madam Speaker.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00223b11bafcf5b5427480393ffeef4fe6e8\u0022 data-id=\u002201b851fbcca722cae0e02e57e4e8789f\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000303\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223b11bafcf5b5427480393ffeef4fe6e8\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002201b851fbcca722cae0e02e57e4e8789f\u0022\u003EORIINI KAIPARA (Te P\u0101ti M\u0101ori\u2014T\u0101maki Makaurau) (15:34)\u003C/span\u003E: \u003Cspan lang=\u0022mi\u0022\u003EWaikaremoana, haere mai. Panekire maunga, tau mai. Huiarau, Manawar\u016B, nau mai, whakatau mai. Nanny Naina, te kuia m\u014Drehu, te maunga kanohi o Te Turuki Rangim\u0101rie kua riro ki te p\u014D. Tumanako, koutou. E te kuia, te pou a Ng\u0101ti Ruapani, i t\u0113nei r\u0101, nau mai, haere mai\u003C/span\u003E.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000304\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003E[\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsCharacterItalics\u0022\u003EWaikaremoana, welcome. Panekire mountain, welcome. Huiarau and Manawar\u016B, welcome. Nanny Naina, the matriarch, the face of Te Turuki Rangim\u0101rie who has since passed. Tumanako, greetings to you all. To the grand lady of Ng\u0101ti Ruapani, welcome, welcome\u003C/span\u003E.]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000305\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENg\u0101ti Ruapani mai Waikaremoana is among the last of the remaining claims to be settled in what has been a 40-year journey, where many hands have contributed to this great undertaking. That 40 years gave Ng\u0101ti Ruapani mai Waikaremoana the opportunity to watch, to listen, and to go through the experiences of others.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000306\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EThis is not a standard settlement, and despite the Crown\u2019s large natural grouping policy, the settlement is, in the view of hauk\u0101inga, a wh\u0101nau and hap\u016B settlement that restores the whakapapa connections between Ng\u0101ti Ruapani, T\u016Bhoe, and Te Urewera. The settlement empowers hauk\u0101inga, where decision making and authority is exercised in proximity to people and place affected by those decisions. In that sense, e te Whare, all iwi have their own parliaments. In the case of Ng\u0101ti Ruapani mai Waikaremoana, these are Te Poho o Hinekahukura, who stands at Te K\u016Bha T\u0101rewa Marae, and Te Poho-o-T\u016Bhoe P\u014Dtiki, who stands at Waimako Marae. Just as those who came before them, decision-making authority shall continue to emanate from these k\u0101inga.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000307\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENg\u0101ti Ruapani mai Waikaremoana, they know their issues\u2014\u003Cspan lang=\u0022mi\u0022\u003Ekei te m\u014Dhio r\u0101tou ki a r\u0101tou an\u014D\u003C/span\u003E. They know their issues and they are responsible for their issues, and they are determined to face those issues. To my parliamentary colleagues and to the institution of Parliament itself, the message from Ng\u0101ti Ruapani mai Waikaremoana is this: mana motuhake is not something the Crown can give. Mana motuhake, in relation to this Whare, to this House, is about getting out of the damn way. In another sense, mana motuhake is about the Crown knowing what it doesn\u2019t know, and by creating space to allow Ng\u0101ti Ruapani mai Waikaremoana to do what they need to do to rebuild their lives, their way. The Crown\u2019s role is to restore and maintain its honour and integrity. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000308\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ESometimes, the Crown often thinks that it is doing good things with good intentions as it continues to enable bad behaviour by those involved in the settlement process, which often creates more grievances. This process is supposed to resolve. The truth is this: our mokopuna reserve the final judgments on the honour and sincerity of both the Crown apology and its actions to restore its integrity in the future. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000309\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EBrought into the context of the present, the Crown cannot simply give from one hand and take from the other, as is the case with resource management reform, which may have the effect of completely undermining all settlements to date and in future. The Crown ruins its own mana by not being able to uphold its own agreements and settlement commitments. In this term of Parliament, we have heard from both Te Tari Whakatau and the Office of the Auditor-General, who drew attention to these issues. And as my brother Peeni Henare noted in his valedictory speech yesterday, we come from a people where your word is your bond. \u003Cspan lang=\u0022mi\u0022\u003EMana i te kupu, mana i te tapu o te kupu. Tapu i te mana\u003C/span\u003E.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000310\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003E[\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsCharacterItalics\u0022\u003EHonour your word, honour the sanctity of the word. Sanctity is authority\u003C/span\u003E.]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000311\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EDo not let these words go vain: honour your word; honour the people. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000312\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EThe true hallmark of the settlement is not about the Crown\u2019s new relationship with Ng\u0101ti Ruapani mai Waikaremoana. It is about Ng\u0101ti Ruapani mai Waikaremoana\u2019s relationship with itself, with T\u016Bhoe, and with Te Urewera. And my final words: \u003Cspan lang=\u0022mi\u0022\u003Eko hea nei te ritenga m\u0101riri i kaha ai t\u014Dku hap\u016B a Ruapani? Ehara koa ko T\u016Bhoe e ara ake nei. E tautoko m\u0101rika ana Te P\u0101ti M\u0101ori i t\u0113nei take kia k\u014Dkiritia e t\u0101tou i roto i te Whare. Kei aku nui, kei aku rahi, e tau ana\u003C/span\u003E.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000313\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003E[\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsCharacterItalics\u0022\u003EWhere art the tranquil place where my sub-tribe Raupani may thrive? Indeed I am of T\u016Bhoe, who rises here. Te P\u0101ti M\u0101ori wholeheartedly supports advancing this in the House. To my esteemed ones, I now rest\u003C/span\u003E.]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022c96149a439844ecfa86967f9caf5f50d\u0022 data-id=\u00228891a7579385e363666ea78ec5fc2dba\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000314\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022c96149a439844ecfa86967f9caf5f50d\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00228891a7579385e363666ea78ec5fc2dba\u0022\u003EKATIE NIMON (National\u2014Napier) (15:39)\u003C/span\u003E: \u003Cspan lang=\u0022mi\u0022\u003EE ng\u0101 uri o Ng\u0101ti Ruapani mai Waikaremoana, t\u0113n\u0101 koutou, t\u0113n\u0101 koutou, t\u0113n\u0101 t\u0101tou katoa\u003C/span\u003E.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000315\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003E[\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsCharacterItalics\u0022\u003ETo the descendants of Ng\u0101ti Ruapani mai Waikaremoana, greetings once, twice, thrice\u003C/span\u003E.]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000316\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EToday, I rise to speak on the first reading of the Ng\u0101ti Ruapani mai Waikaremoana Claims Settlement Bill. At the outset, I just want to acknowledge Ng\u0101ti Ruapani and your endurance and commitment to this long process, and I know those who have spoken before me have acknowledged that as well. Although I was unable to attend the deed signing at T\u016Bai a couple of weeks ago, I watched the footage and was so amazed and impressed by the energy that you brought to something that really identifies and signifies something dark for your history, but special for your future. I met so many of you when Minister Tama Potaka and I went to Waikaremoana a couple of years ago, just ahead of the reopening of the lake walk. It was a really special time, and it was lovely to meet you then. It was lovely to see you all today at the \u003Cspan lang=\u0022mi\u0022\u003Emihi whakatau.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000317\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EAs a member of Parliament for the Napier electorate, I think it\u2019s my privilege today to talk about some of the connections between Ng\u0101ti Ruapani, Lake Waikaremoana, and all of the people that I represent in the Napier electorate. For those watching who don\u2019t know, the Napier electorate goes from parts of Hastings District all the way up to Tair\u0101whiti, taking in places like Motu and Matawai\u2014areas named after Ruapani\u2019s journey from Gisborne down to Waikaremoana. It\u2019s special for me to be able to be here and be part of this process, and I look forward to the second and third readings, because I know that I go out and engage with the people in the community who share this special place with you, and I hope that they see the importance of the land and these properties going back to their rightful guardians and all of the grievances being settled by the Crown. I acknowledge that many of you would be part of Ikaroa-R\u0101whiti, represented by Cushla Tangaere-Manuel, and the way that she and I work together in this area is something that I\u2019m very proud of.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000318\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ESome of the people watching Parliament TV at home don\u2019t necessarily know how Ng\u0101ti Ruapani\u2019s settlement differs from T\u016Bhoe\u2019s settlement in relation to Waikaremoana and Te Urewera. The relationship between Ng\u0101ti Ruapani and Waikaremoana stretches back many generations. The Ng\u0101ti Ruapani people descend from P\u0101oa the leader of the \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsCharacterItalics\u0022\u003EHorouta\u003C/span\u003E waka, which found land in T\u016Branganui in Tair\u0101whiti. The Waip\u0101oa River took its name from P\u0101oa, but Motu, Matawai, and Onepoto\u2014all places in the electorate\u2014were named by Ruapani on his journey to Waikaremoana, as I mentioned before. Something that really struck me as special is the naming of Waikaremoana as a result of a saying of Ruapani: \u201C\u003Cspan lang=\u0022mi\u0022\u003EK\u0101ti r\u0101 kua m\u0101k\u016B ng\u0101 rekereke i ng\u0101 wai karekare o t\u0113nei moana\u003C/span\u003E.\u201D\u2014\u201CIt is enough that my heels are made wet by the rippling waters of this sea.\u201D\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000319\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EThe landscapes referenced in this bill are not lines on a map; they are living places known intimately to many. A connection that I\u2019d like to make, for one example, is Camp Kaitawa\u2014a place that is being given back to its rightful people, rightful guardians, in Ng\u0101ti Ruapani. It\u2019s a camp that my brother and many of my friends went to when they were growing up\u2014a very special place to so many children throughout Hawke\u2019s Bay. While I was doing my research, I found a photo from 1976 of the children of Waiwhare, Otamauri, and Sherendon schools on a Nimon bus heading up to Camp Kaitawa\u2014some very, very special memories for all these kids in their beanies and homespuns. It\u2019s a place that is a treasure to so many.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000320\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EI want to say thank you for your patience; thank you for sharing the space with us; and thank you so much for what you will do to restore the community, to restore your hap\u016B to their rightful place, and what this is going to afford you to be able to do in terms of resettling your community and reconnecting so many with their whenua tipuna. Thank you for being here to be a part of this process. N\u014D reira, t\u0113n\u0101 koutou.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00227f988bc72b5e47b8856ba70e41dfbbaf\u0022 data-id=\u002208ef256600f8432e7565e3d795cb74b2\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000321\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00227f988bc72b5e47b8856ba70e41dfbbaf\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002208ef256600f8432e7565e3d795cb74b2\u0022\u003EGEORGIE DANSEY (Labour) (15:44)\u003C/span\u003E: Madam Speaker, I\u2019m honoured to rise to speak to the Ng\u0101ti Ruapani mai Waikaremoana Claims Settlement Bill today. I\u2019ll start by acknowledging the iwi and wh\u0101nau who have made the journey to the House; I commend you on your mahi for getting the bill this far. \u003Cspan lang=\u0022mi\u0022\u003EKia ora koutou to the rangatira and the mokopuna in the House. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000322\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EThe journey to get to the place we are now, receiving this bill for its first reading, I understand has been a very long one for Ng\u0101ti Ruapani: six years of negotiation, and now we have a long-awaited agreement that we will work through in this House. I hope that this bill acknowledges the past and looks towards a stronger future for your iwi. The journey from 2008, when the iwi came together for this settlement, speaks to the challenging relationship that iwi can have with the Crown and also speaks to the persistence of iwi, hap\u016B, and wh\u0101nau to right the wrongs of the past. Nothing can right the wrongs of the past. Nothing is enough to apologise for the actions of the Crown, which began, for Ng\u0101ti Ruapani mai Waikaremoana, in 1866. I hope this bill brings some closure to your people, and I commend the iwi for working with the Crown to work towards some redress for the harm caused. We know that that harm continues over successive generations. The first mentioned harm in the bill was the iwi not signing Te Tiriti o Waitangi and the Crown acknowledging the opportunity to do so. This was followed by the intense armed attacks in 1866.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000323\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EI visited the beautiful Urewera National Park and have had the privilege of camping by the lakeside. I remember clearly the really long gravel drive to get there and the multitudes of horses and pigs that I saw along the way, which of course added to the beauty of this incredible and unique whenua. I wanted to highlight that because one of the interesting parts of this settlement or this k\u014Drero and this journey, for me, was the continued attacks from the Crown through to 1954 when the Urewera National Park was established by the Crown without consulting the iwi. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000324\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EThe Crown continued to not consult about the expansion of the park in 1957, and the Crown treated Lake Waikaremoana like it was their own for decades, modifying water levels, causing environmental damage, and failing to compensate Ng\u0101ti Ruapani for the extensive use before 1967. The governance of the park severely restricted the iwi\u2019s ability to use and develop the resources of their land, and it speaks to many years of deprivation and disconnection from their whenua. I commend the iwi on their resolute connection to Waikaremoana through this time and acknowledge the socioeconomic deprivation and migration that were a result of the Crown\u2019s actions. Many people ended up living outside of their traditional lands, disconnected from their \u003Cspan lang=\u0022mi\u0022\u003Etikanga, t\u016Brangawaewae, and wh\u0101nau\u003C/span\u003E\u2014and of course from te reo M\u0101ori. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000325\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EI\u2019m very pleased to see that a key feature of this settlement is the return of Crown-owned lands into Te Urewera. This reflects the essential aspiration of Ng\u0101ti Ruapani to restore their connection with Te Urewera. Through the settlement, I hope that your people are able to come home. I acknowledge the comments of the Hon Willie Jackson around bringing your rangatahi home for them to learn their tikanga, learn their reo, and be immersed in your iwi as they should have been for all of these years. The iwi knows its people more than anyone else, and that must be acknowledged. I hope that this settlement offers some kind of closure for the people of Ng\u0101ti Ruapani. It is a great pleasure that I commend this bill to the House. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00229d5b13d601794bb282d99453116ad395\u0022 data-id=\u00227be8c8b4b3ca1473d45de3dba498dc08\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000326\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00229d5b13d601794bb282d99453116ad395\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00227be8c8b4b3ca1473d45de3dba498dc08\u0022\u003EHon TAMA POTAKA (Minister for M\u0101ori Crown Relations: Te Arawhiti) (15:49)\u003C/span\u003E: \u003Cspan lang=\u0022mi\u0022\u003ET\u0113n\u0101 koutou ng\u0101 whatukura me ng\u0101 m\u0101reikura o Ng\u0101ti Ruapani e koke nei ki t\u014D t\u0101tou ana o te r\u0101iona. Haramai te ara o te h\u014Diho, te huarahi matua 38, me \u014Dna k\u014Drero katoa. Kara, koutou ko t\u014D momo ko t\u014D k\u0101hui tira haere, e kawe nei i ng\u0101 whakaaro o ng\u0101 t\u012Bpuna m\u0101tua Rua-te-p\u016Bpuke, Hine-h\u0101kirirangi, me \u0113r\u0101 o t\u0101ua Kiwa me ng\u0101 k\u014Drero e p\u0101 ana ki ng\u0101 marae a Te K\u016Bh\u0101 a Te Waimako, t\u0113n\u0101 koutou. T\u0113n\u0101 koutou e kawe nei i ng\u0101 k\u014Drero e p\u0101 ana ki ng\u0101 mahi tahu i te whenua, ng\u0101 ahi whakap\u0113hi hoki i te tangata.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000327\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan lang=\u0022mi\u0022\u003EKi a m\u0101tou o Te Tai Hau\u0101uru, kua titiro ki \u0113nei \u0101huatanga raupatu i roto i te h\u012Btori me te her-tori o \u014D t\u0101tou m\u0101tua t\u012Bpuna. N\u014D reira koutou e kawe nei i ng\u0101 mahi whakataunga Tiriti, koinei te p\u0101nuitanga tuatahi, \u0101, kua riro hoki m\u0101ku e whakat\u016Bwatawata nei i ng\u0101 mahi a Metekoura. Me te m\u014Dhio hoki \u0101 t\u014Dn\u0101 w\u0101 ka hoki mai an\u014D koutou ki t\u014Dna k\u014Drero ki t\u014Dna p\u0101nuitanga tuarua. K\u0101ore au i te whakat\u014Droa i ng\u0101 k\u014Drero engari he t\u016B \u0101ta whakamihi i ng\u0101 take o te w\u0101 engari ki \u014D koutou mahi uaua, taumaha, i ng\u0101 rangi ka heke. Te whakahono hoki i te whenua ki roto i te Taitara o Te Urewera, \u0101, te whakakotahi nei i te kaupapa karanga, t\u0113n\u0101 koutou katoa.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000328\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003E[\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsCharacterItalics\u0022\u003EGreetings to the noble men and women of Ng\u0101ti Ruapani who have ventured here to our den of lions, who travelled by way of the horse track, State Highway 38, along with its stories. Kara, and those of your ilk, along with your band of leaders, who bear with you the wishes of the ancestors Rua-te-p\u016Bpuke, Hine-h\u0101kirirangi, and others, and you too Kiwa, who convey the stories of the marae of Te K\u016Bh\u0101 and Te Waimako, greetings to you all. I acknowledge that you bring with you the scorched earth stories, and the fires that oppressed the people. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000329\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsCharacterItalics\u0022\u003EMy people of Te Tai Hau\u0101uru have also witnessed this form of confiscation, and it is spoken of in the history and her-story of our ancestors. To the bearers of the Treaty settlement, this is the first reading, and it is my role to fortify the activities of Goldsmith. With the knowledge that in due course you will return here for the second reading, I will not drag on but I do wish to sincerely acknowledge the occasion, and the difficult and heavy burden that you will face in the future. To link the lands mentioned in the Te Urewera Title, and to bring together this huge undertaking, thank you all\u003C/span\u003E.]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00220750364c2c1444d0ae00bced720f964e\u0022 data-id=\u0022e323e130f1cb084350f75e92809c0639\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000330\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220750364c2c1444d0ae00bced720f964e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022e323e130f1cb084350f75e92809c0639\u0022\u003EHon GINNY ANDERSEN (Labour) (15:51)\u003C/span\u003E: \u003Cspan lang=\u0022mi\u0022\u003EKo te mihi tuatahi ki te Atua n\u0101na nei ng\u0101 mea katoa. Ko te mihi tuarua ki te Whare e t\u016B nei. Ka huri ki ng\u0101 mana whenua o Waikaremoana, Ng\u0101ti Ruapani mai Waikaremoana, t\u0113nei te mihi maioha ki a koutou. N\u014D reira t\u0113n\u0101 koutou, t\u0113n\u0101 koutou, t\u0113n\u0101 t\u0101tou katoa\u003C/span\u003E.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000331\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003E[\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsCharacterItalics\u0022\u003EMay I first acknowledge God, the creator of all things. Secondly, to the House that stands here. Let me turn my attention to the authorities of Waikaremoana, Ng\u0101ti Ruapani mai Waikaremoana, my sincere greetings to you all. I acknowledge you once, twice, and thrice\u003C/span\u003E.]\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000332\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EI rise today to support the first reading of the Ng\u0101ti Ruapani mai Waikaremoana Claims Settlement Bill. I\u2019d like to acknowledge, as others have done in this House, the long period of time and the long journey it takes to get to this point in the settlement journey. This bill gives effect to the deed of settlement that was signed on 25 February 2026 in Waikaremoana by the trustees of the Ng\u0101ti Ruapani mai Waikaremoana Trust, and it marks the formal recognition of one of the most complex and longstanding histories in Te Urewera.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000333\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EI\u2019d like to acknowledge all of those people who have participated along the way, and supported, to get to this point in time, and I\u2019d like to personally acknowledge Kara Puketapu-Dentice, not only for your work with your iwi, T\u016Bhoe, but also for your work in the Hutt Valley. You\u2019re well known as being a hard worker and a great person to work alongside, and it\u2019s nice to see you here today.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000334\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EThis bill sets out that Ng\u0101ti Ruapani mai Waikaremoana did not sign the Treaty of Waitangi, yet from the 1860s onwards, they faced some of the most severe breaches that the Crown could do under the Treaty of Waitangi. Those are acknowledged in this legislation, and it was also noted that, for decades, the Crown treated Lake Waikaremoana as its own, modifying the water levels, damaging the environments, and offering no compensation for the damage that they left. This left Ng\u0101ti Ruapani virtually landless after a period of time, and the social, cultural, and economic impacts of those actions shaped the generations to come. This legacy is clearly acknowledged, as it should be, in the Crown apology.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000335\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EUncle Willie has already outlined how Treaty settlements in general are a mere drop in the bucket. The $24 million provided here in financial redress is small\u2014tiny\u2014in comparison with what has been lost. But he also noted, rightly, that it does provide a seed to grow a future opportunity, a reason for reaching out. My own background and experience was in the Office of Treaty Settlements and the mandating, and to be able to see how iwi were required by the Crown to reach out and find all of their uri, to reach out and start the register and refresh that process of whakapapa verification and looking at all those things, and we saw how iwi grew as a result of the processes and the requirements that the Crown put on to iwi. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000336\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EOn the lighter side of that, and the upside of that, we saw many people engage further back with their iwi, and, as Uncle Willie pointed out, hopefully a revitalisation of young people who return home, who find out where they\u2019re from and who they\u2019re connected to, and to take pride in that\u2014to take pride in where they come from and to stand again where their ancestors once stood.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000337\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EI would like to acknowledge that the bill establishes a right of refusal for 185 years, ensuring longer-term opportunities for the iwi to build the land base. But in this, I also acknowledge that the negotiations have spanned decades. With the earlier involvement with the Ng\u0101i T\u016Bhoe settlement process, we know that there is a separate mandate being pursued, which was formalised back in 2019.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000338\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EThis settlement today reflects the perseverance that you have gone through. Even though there have been hurdles along the way, I acknowledge that you have reached a significant milestone here today, and with all the best wishes I have for your future going forward, I commend this bill to the House. Kia ora.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022cf22a832d14a4c99ab5dfd16e24446e5\u0022 data-id=\u002243ae7cad1a17e07fcdbeab091cf04b05\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000339\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cf22a832d14a4c99ab5dfd16e24446e5\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002243ae7cad1a17e07fcdbeab091cf04b05\u0022\u003ERIMA NAKHLE (National\u2014Takanini) (15:55)\u003C/span\u003E: Thank you, Madam Speaker. Madam Speaker, I would like to stand in support of this very special settlement bill, and I\u2019d like to welcome our guests to the House. Thank you for making your way here to Wellington.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000340\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EWhen we were at the mihi whakatau earlier today, you walked in and there were tears in a lot of your eyes, and I could feel and see the heaviness, the burden, that we spoke about briefly in the number of k\u014Drero that a few of you gave. It\u2019s a situation where no matter how many generations have passed, that beautiful bond that is whakapapa, that is blood, means that you feel the pain that your ancestors felt.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000341\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ESo as we embark on this journey, I look forward to learning more about the ancestors\u2019 experiences, your experiences, as our guests in the House, and we\u2019ll talk more about it in the second reading. But for now, I commend this bill to the House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000342\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EMotion agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000343\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EBill read a first time.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000344\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u0022c72bedb17418f1dcc89f68f36b889c07\u0022\u003EReferral to Select Committee\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002235984f61527b4059ae9284acf3c4076b\u0022 data-id=\u0022ad81274b4fee14a86a4b6ae753ed343a\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000345\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002235984f61527b4059ae9284acf3c4076b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022ad81274b4fee14a86a4b6ae753ed343a\u0022\u003EASSISTANT SPEAKER (Maureen Pugh) (15:57)\u003C/span\u003E: The question is, \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsCharacterItalics\u0022\u003EThat the Ng\u0101ti Ruapani mai Waikaremoana Claims Settlement Bill be considered by the M\u0101ori Affairs Committee\u003C/span\u003E.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000346\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EMotion agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000347\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EBill referred to the M\u0101ori Affairs Committee.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000348\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u00224e6d01d7c408d06f9dacb4e92f1f265c\u0022\u003EInstruction to Select Committee\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002291c0e777ce3d4711ace36a15c7e22ffe\u0022 data-id=\u002223975445bb9a43fa6d1603754287c6c5\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000349\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002291c0e777ce3d4711ace36a15c7e22ffe\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002223975445bb9a43fa6d1603754287c6c5\u0022\u003EHon PAUL GOLDSMITH (Minister for Treaty of Waitangi Negotiations) (15:57)\u003C/span\u003E: I move, \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsCharacterItalics\u0022\u003EThat the Ng\u0101ti Ruapani mai Waikaremoana Claims Settlement Bill be reported to the House by 27 July 2026\u003C/span\u003E.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000350\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EMotion agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000351\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsCharacterItalics\u0022\u003EWaiata\u2014\u201CEngari te t\u012Bt\u012B\u201D\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000352\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u00228077c24a5f1c2c4d25138e58bfcb1549\u0022\u003ELegislation Amendment Bill\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000353\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u002239ea759a8a968c8fb041cd6811f26155\u0022\u003EThird Reading\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00225459b3c0726d42c1b6d3cc94ec303baa\u0022 data-id=\u00223a8d0c148b0239c0965b2eaca01e5b7f\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000354\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225459b3c0726d42c1b6d3cc94ec303baa\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00223a8d0c148b0239c0965b2eaca01e5b7f\u0022\u003EHon JAMES MEAGER (Minister for Hunting and Fishing) (16:01)\u003C/span\u003E: on behalf of the \u003Cspan class=\u0022CharacterBold\u0022\u003EAttorney-General\u003C/span\u003E: I move, \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsCharacterItalics\u0022\u003EThat the Legislation Amendment Bill be now read a third time\u003C/span\u003E.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000355\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002235984f61527b4059ae9284acf3c4076b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022afee057a3c23617fac5907dbde1e3fdc\u0022\u003EASSISTANT SPEAKER (Maureen Pugh)\u003C/span\u003E: The question is that the motion be agreed to\u2014oh, after you\u2019ve finished.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000356\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00225459b3c0726d42c1b6d3cc94ec303baa\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00228d294d6530aeb4150c5cd0bed8edabc0\u0022\u003EHon JAMES MEAGER\u003C/span\u003E: Thank you, Madam Speaker. It was going to be a short-ish call, but not quite that short!\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000357\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EI want to start by outlining the purpose of this bill. The purpose of this bill is straightforward. It is to make legislation easier to find, to use, and to understand. An essential feature of the rule of law is that legislation is clear and accessible. That ensures that people, everyday Kiwis, can find the law and understand their rights and their obligations. This supports certainty and predictability of the law. It follows from the legal concept that everyone is presumed to know the law.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000358\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EHow can people be expected to know the law if they cannot find it? Secondary legislation published by departments, Crown entities, and a range of other bodies is not as accessible as it should be. Right now, that legislation\u2014which includes things like regulations, rules, and notices\u2014is published in all sorts of places. A Kiwi looking for secondary legislation may have to search through departmental websites, through the \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsCharacterItalics\u0022\u003EGazette\u003C/span\u003E, through newspapers, and even then they\u2019re not guaranteed to find it, as some of it is not published at all.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000359\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EThis fragmentation creates real challenges. It makes it harder for businesses and individuals to understand their obligations, it increases compliance costs, and it works against our goals for a modern digital Government. It also undermines effective parliamentary oversight.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000360\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EThis bill changes that. It requires agencies to publish their secondary legislation on websites in a consistent manner. It requires them to prepare and publish up-to-date consolidations. It requires them to maintain key information about each instrument so that users know which is the correct version and whether it is in force or not, and it requires them to find and republish their existing stock of legislation in accordance with the new requirements.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000361\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EThe most visible impact of these new requirements is the updated New Zealand Legislation website, which will, over time, provide access to all of this legislation and\u2014yes, folks\u2014more. On behalf of the Attorney-General, I\u2019m very excited to say that we have already switched over to the new version of the Legislation website. Thank you to everyone who signed up to the public demonstration of the website and, I\u2019m sure, the thousands of people who provided their feedback on it. Your support has shaped the final version to give us a website that can efficiently identify, index, and, in a modern world, link to agency-published legislation. Over time, and once agencies have done what this bill requires of them, the Legislation website will be a single point of access to all New Zealand legislation.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000362\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EThe bill also makes other amendments to the Legislation Act 2019 to ensure that it achieves its purpose. These include improved editorial powers to make legislative changes that are simple, up to date, and make it easier to find, use, and understand. It includes, for example, making it easier to more efficiently renumber legislation and get rid of all that \u201Cghastly\u201D section 59ZZB-type numbering.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000363\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EThis bill also changes the provisions for revision bills. The current form of revision was established in 2012. Parliament\u2019s intention for this process was to enable revision of New Zealand\u2019s legislation to be done \u201Cprogressively and systematically\u201D; however, the current requirements are so restrictive that in that time, since 2012, only two revision Acts have been enacted, with a third, the Valuers Bill, before the House at this moment. Two revision Acts in 14 years is not a sign of a progressive and systematic programme. That\u2019s why this bill expands the type of changes that may be progressed in a revision bill. The bill will enable revision bills to repair and maintain legislation being revised, as well as update the language and drafting style, while retaining strong safeguards. We look forward to the new revision programme taking shape in the next term of Parliament.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000364\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EThis bill and the new website are major milestones in work by successive Governments and successive parliaments to improve access to legislation. I\u2019m sure members of the House, legal professionals, the general public, and, of course, public law nerds are all looking forward to improved access to the law, and as I stand surrounded by a cohort of public law enthusiasts, I know they are as well.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000365\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EI also acknowledge that this effort to improve access to legislation has had near-unanimous support across the House, and I\u2019d like to recognise those who have been instrumental in bringing this bill to fruition. That includes the Hon Christopher Finlayson, who kick-started this work as Attorney-General under a previous National-led Government; the members of the powerful Regulations Review Committee, who have persistently inquired into the challenges of accessing secondary legislation, shedding light on this important issue; and I also want to acknowledge the hard-working and tireless Justice Committee for their thoughtful consideration of the bill, and those individuals and organisations who took time to make a submission. We thank you all for your efforts, and it is my pleasure, on behalf of the Attorney-General, to see this bill through its third and final reading.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000366\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002235984f61527b4059ae9284acf3c4076b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022cb3c25eff42a12dc2cfaa7c391f3d0cb\u0022\u003EASSISTANT SPEAKER (Maureen Pugh)\u003C/span\u003E: The question is that the motion be agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022b78723aefdc74b11a47482993ca56a74\u0022 data-id=\u00221049b5107eccc92c09b7eb9b544c19e0\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000367\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b78723aefdc74b11a47482993ca56a74\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00221049b5107eccc92c09b7eb9b544c19e0\u0022\u003EHon Dr DUNCAN WEBB (Labour\u2014Christchurch Central) (16:07)\u003C/span\u003E: Thank you, Madam Chair, and thanks to the Minister for those comments on this bill. It is an important bill that doesn\u2019t perhaps get the attention it deserves. It\u2019s certainly not a glamorous bill. Indeed, in my short stint\u2014I think it was 2017-18\u2014on the Regulations Review Committee, this wider legislation project was being considered by that committee, and on the Justice Committee, of course, this particular bill was considered. I do recall the concern that was voiced at the Regulations Review Committee when it was noted. Someone asked the question: \u201CHow many regulations are there to do with the dairy industry?\u201D, and the response was alarming, because the response wasn\u2019t a particular number; it was \u201CWe don\u2019t know.\u201D The idea that you can have a body of law that touches on a particular industry that you don\u2019t actually know where the regulations are or how many of them exist is deeply concerning.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000368\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EThis is the kind of legislation that we need to ensure that our legislative stock is kept in good order. Rather than having a Ministry for Regulation, what we need is just a good framework for revision, for consolidation, for organisation, and for storage. That\u2019s, essentially, what this bill does.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000369\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EWe do, though, have to make sure we strike the right balance, because we can lean too far in favour of administrative convenience and thereby undermine parliamentary oversight. Some of the things that go on\u2014we support this bill, and the reason we support this bill is we think the balance that\u2019s been struck is about right. But the ability to make editorial changes, for example, is one thing, so that if there are typographical errors in bills\u2014and, in fact, that\u2019s a relatively common practice\u2014the Parliamentary Counsel Office doesn\u2019t have to come back to Parliament to fix the grammar or the spelling or the fact that a particular word is clearly missing.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000370\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EThe Minister talked about revision bills and the fact that because of a cautious approach in the definition of a revision bill, they weren\u2019t perhaps used as much as they could be.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000371\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EThe concept of a revision bill is a bill which is, essentially, a modernisation. It\u2019s not actually a substantive change. At least, the original concept was that it was simply a modernisation. I think the original Valuers Act was in 1908. The idea of saying, \u201CWell, let\u2019s bring that into the modern era, change the pounds for dollars, change the perches for square metres, and modernise the language and put it in a framework that is a modern legislative framework.\u201D\u2014that makes perfect sense, but we now have a revision bill framework that is a bit more than that. It, in fact, says, \u201CLet\u2019s not just take it and put it in modern language, but let\u2019s, essentially, update the law.\u201D\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000372\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EIf you look at what it can do, for example, it can change monetary amounts. Now, that\u2019s not just changing pounds into dollars, but it can, for example\u2014and this is new\u2014increase a fine. I remember there were complaints recently that parking fines hadn\u2019t gone up for decades. It was cheaper to park and take a fine in a city council car park on the road than go into one of the rapacious commercial car parks and pay an hourly rate.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000373\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENow, I can understand that, but when we get into some other areas, having low scrutiny over what can be criminal penalties can be questioned. Also\u2014I talked about this in the committee of the whole House\u2014the idea that a revision bill can make amendments of unduly onerous or burdensome requirements, unnecessary compliance costs, and unnecessary costs of administering legislation is skating dangerously close to saying you can do substantive reforms through a revision bill. The safeguard is the certification of the bill where non-political actors have to certify that the bill is a revision bill, and they are the Chief Parliamentary Counsel and the chief executive of the administering agency. That gives me some comfort. The other thing to note, though, is that the revision bill still must go through this House. Ultimately, this House is the master of its own destiny. Whilst there have certainly been criticisms of the truncation of parliamentary procedure in this House, I would hope that if objections were raised that a bill that was presented as a revision bill was too substantive, then it would be given the full scrutiny that the House can, in fact, give it.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000374\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EThe other thing I\u2019d note\u2014and this came out of the select committee report, and it didn\u2019t come out in the committee of the whole House\u2014is that revision bills have a standing exemption on regulatory impact statements. Now, regulatory impact statements are an important document, whereby it\u2019s shown that there has been a good process and a thoughtful process in developing the bill. Now, revision bills were given a standing exemption because, fundamentally, they weren\u2019t changing anything. Now, because of this broadened scope, it is quite conceivable that there will be meaningful changes to the rights and obligations of citizens by virtue of a revision bill. The select committee\u2019s recommendation was that that standing exemption, essentially, be revoked. Now, it\u2019s still possible\u2014and I\u2019m pretty sure it\u2019s the Ministry for Regulation that does it\u2014to go to the Ministry for Regulation and say, \u201CLook, this is a bill that changes these things, but it doesn\u2019t quite meet the threshold for a regulatory impact statement at all.\u201D, or \u201CIt doesn\u2019t meet the threshold for a thorough-going regulatory impact statement; can we pare it back a bit?\u201D And you can have that conversation.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000375\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EIn the original conception of a revision bill, it was intended to be a Consumers Price Index (CPI) inflation adjustment for things that weren\u2019t penalties. You could see why that\u2019s kind of trivial, but, now, it doesn\u2019t have to be linked to CPI, so the Government could come in and say, \u201CWe\u2019re going to increase levies on\u201D\u2014name whatever you like\u2014\u201Ckiwifruit orchards.\u201D Of course, that has a massive impact on the growers of those kiwifruit and exporters, but they wouldn\u2019t have to do a regulatory impact statement and wouldn\u2019t actually be required to consult, because it\u2019s a revision bill. That\u2019s why we need to think about these things.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000376\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EThe other provisions are important as well, and that is\u2014[\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsTerm\u0022 style=\u0022font-style: italic\u0022\u003EBell rung\u003C/span\u003E] goodness; ha, ha!\u2014the requirement to present regulations to this House. Certainly, in the Regulations Review Committee, one of the longstanding gripes was that agencies would be developing rules and regulations, what have you, secondary legislation, and just wouldn\u2019t present it to the House. We wouldn\u2019t have the ability to scrutinise them, because it was just tucked away and no one ever told us it existed. It did reflect not just a poor procedure but, essentially, a poor understanding in those agencies that secondary legislation is delegated from this House and this House, ultimately, has authority over it.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000377\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EThe provisions which say that secondary legislation won\u2019t come into force unless it\u2019s properly published and presented are quite useful, because previously there was, essentially, no particular consequence for not properly presenting legislation. It\u2019s good to see that there\u2019s some teeth in this legislation as well. It\u2019s a really good example of the infrastructure around legislation, the concept of regulatory stewardship, and the fact that when it\u2019s done properly, we can agree pretty much across the House about how to do it.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000378\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EWe don\u2019t need a vanity ministry of David Seymour to do this sort of work, because regulatory quality is actually something we all agree upon and we can all work hard together on, and that\u2019s, in fact, what we\u2019re doing here today.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022bac3dcb6103a48d3bcead8563342a856\u0022 data-id=\u00222c3b649b03524e7de746a185fe233b6f\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000379\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022bac3dcb6103a48d3bcead8563342a856\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00222c3b649b03524e7de746a185fe233b6f\u0022\u003EDr LAWRENCE XU-NAN (Green) (16:17)\u003C/span\u003E: Thank you, Madam Speaker. I rise on behalf of the Green Party of Aotearoa New Zealand to speak on the Legislation Amendment Bill at its third reading. Before I begin, I\u2019d like to thank both of the Ministers who were in the chair during the committee of the whole House stage for a really engaging committee stage\u2014the Hon James Meager and the Hon Chris Penk.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000380\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EI think, to start with, in terms of the broader picture, like the previous speaker, the Hon Dr Duncan Webb, has mentioned, the legislative system of Aotearoa New Zealand can be complex. There are various kinds of bills. I think, even for all members of this House, we\u2019re learning every day about how our legislative process works and the peculiarities around our system; whether it is the difference between a private bill, a local bill, a private Act, a local Act, a revision bill, an omnibus bill, a Government bill, secondary legislation, primary legislation. It is something that is complex. I think, for most people of Aotearoa, people only really confront the legislative system when something goes to court. That\u2019s where a lot of people find the level of nuance and the level of complexity that is in our system.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000381\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EOne of the things that this bill hopes to address under a democratic system is\u2014well, there are a couple of things\u2014that New Zealand law and the New Zealand political system should be free and be accessible by all. I think that\u2019s a fundamental tenet of any democratic society. With that in mind, there are certain immediate improvements, and I acknowledge both the speakers before in terms of the work that has been done to get us to this place up until now. The digitisation and the improvement when it comes to the Legislation website and ability to consolidate secondary legislation into a single source as part of that website is a huge quality-of-life improvement in the ability for people to be able to access our legislation and also our secondary legislation more readily.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000382\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EFor over a hundred years, we have seen the use of secondary legislation and we\u2019ve seen how much secondary legislation is agency-drafted or agency-published, and that sometimes is hidden in the deep recesses within a particular agency or department, whether it\u2019s in a physical copy or on their website. Again, one of the quality of life improvements that this bill aims to do is to ensure that all of the pieces of secondary legislation have to meet the same consistency in standard in order for them to continue to take effect. That does have a shelf life to it, should a particular piece of secondary legislation not be up to standard, and that particular area in the bill, from memory, under the commencement date is five years, and so it\u2019s on the fifth anniversary of this particular bill. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000383\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EThese are some good changes, but I think that there are also some really interesting intricacies within this bill that continue on from existing conventions. One of them, if you look at clause 27 of this bill, is around the drafting of tax bills. Historically since the mid-1990s, the drafting of tax bills has been done by the Inland Revenue Department as opposed to being done by the Parliamentary Counsel Office, or PCO, as happens frequently within this bill. At that time, the recommendation to do that was given because the PCO did not have the capacity to be able to draft these bills, and also tax bills have a certain level of specificity and technical knowledge that is needed in their drafting. We did question during the committee stage whether that should be a system that is kept on, because from the submitters and, indeed, after conversations with both the PCO and also the Law Commission, there was this idea of whether that system should also be consolidated, but we have heard from the Minister that the system for Inland Revenue to draft their own tax bills is retained because of the technical knowledge and specificity that is required. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000384\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EI also want to pick up on clause 31, which is around editorial changes, and I\u2019ll come to the crux of one of the issues in terms of revision bills a little bit later. When we come to clause 31, one of the other improvements that is being made under this bill is around editorial changes and the level of confidentiality and specificity that comes with the editorial changes. Again, this is something that we\u2019re seeing consistently. For those who were here for part of a previous bill, the Statutes Amendment Bill, that bill did go through the Parliament where we were seeing minor changes being made to a whole collection of different Acts where some requirements were outdated and had not been updated for decades. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000385\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EThe ability for us to make those kinds of housekeeping changes to New Zealand legislation is a really important one, and the use of editorial amendments could also be considered as one of those ways for us to be able to make those sorts of changes. Indeed, as part of the Standing Orders review that\u2019s currently happening, one of the things we\u2019ve heard from submitters on that is that with the way that we maintain legislation in Aotearoa because of the requirements we have, Parliament is sovereign when it comes to primary legislation, and, therefore, only Parliament is able to make changes to that kind of legislation, but it is often not the priority of any Government to be able to make some of these minor changes if it\u2019s housekeeping or minor in nature. Indeed, in this House, other than the Statutes Amendment Bill, we have also seen a collection of other regulatory systems bills which also seek to do a similar thing. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000386\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EOne other interesting thing to note within this bill is an Amendment Paper that the Minister released, Amendment Paper 506, which does introduce, I guess, a level of uncertainty to this bill\u2014which in many places provides a level of certainty\u2014and that is to do with the fact that if a particular publication or publishing requirement isn\u2019t met when it comes to secondary legislation, the failure to comply does not invalidate the enactment or the effect of those pieces of secondary legislation. I want to point to some of the potential amendments from my colleague Vanushi Walters, who attempted to make some of these sensible changes to this particular clause, because the question that we were raising around that was if a piece of secondary legislation has not been published or has not been presented to the House but is effected, how would the public know that it has been effected? Again, the whole idea of having the Legislation Amendment Bill is for us to provide the most level of transparency and accessibility around our system to the New Zealand public. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000387\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EFinally, I do want to just touch on revision bills. Revision bills are the only reason that the Green Party of Aotearoa is not going to be supporting the Legislation Amendment Bill, and partially that is because under the current Government, there have been too many instances where we see the Standing Orders being abused and we\u2019re seeing the legislative process being abused to undermine the democratic process or the standard norm process that is expected from the legislative process. We are concerned that the expanded scope of revision bills under clause 37 would mean that it is much easier for any Government to push through amendments that are not minor in nature but that may, potentially, substantially change the nature or the purpose of a bill that is beyond what is the expected good legislative practice. Of course, there is always the safeguard under Standing Order 276 that revision bills can be amended to include this particular aspect, and we will be open to that, but, unfortunately, because the Standing Orders review has not caught up to the third reading of this bill, we cannot support it at this stage. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000388\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EFinally, it is important, like I said right at the beginning, that our legislation is transparent and is publicly accessible, and so we hope to see more of this. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022b064dd56673f4c1cb11c1242823abb92\u0022 data-id=\u002256a9a5d384ef5c27d774f7e430b3ddae\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000389\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b064dd56673f4c1cb11c1242823abb92\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002256a9a5d384ef5c27d774f7e430b3ddae\u0022\u003ELAURA McCLURE (ACT) (16:27)\u003C/span\u003E: Thank you, Madam Speaker. I rise in support of this piece of legislation. We\u2019re on the third reading now and so it has been well and truly traversed, but I think that modernising our legislation is always a good thing. To the Labour member\u2014who is now not sitting in the House\u2014who was discussing the Ministry for Regulation and saying that we don\u2019t need it because we are now having this kind of bill come forward to the House, I would say that there is still plenty of poor, bad regulation that has been out there for decades that we need to get through and we need to work on. I commend this bill to the House. Thank you.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002248ce26e54d83406399b875df20400dec\u0022 data-id=\u00221a12df3ace855d29c67578938bbc0f3a\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000390\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002248ce26e54d83406399b875df20400dec\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00221a12df3ace855d29c67578938bbc0f3a\u0022\u003EANDY FOSTER (NZ First) (16:28)\u003C/span\u003E: I rise on behalf of New Zealand First to take a brief call on this bill. I wasn\u2019t on the Justice Committee, but I do want to thank the Justice Committee. When you read through the document, I think that they did wonderful work, and I\u2019m glad it was them who was doing it.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000391\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsContinued\u0022\u003EI also want to thank Minister James Meager for the introduction because I thought that he laid out what the bill is all about, which is, essentially, making legislation and secondary legislation more accessible. What more could we want, and to hear that some parties are thinking of voting against it\u2014I do not comprehend that. I commend this bill to the House. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002298c1995a3396432382c4b04f94f6462f\u0022 data-id=\u0022b8a671a95124cc394ca98de873b64c19\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000392\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002298c1995a3396432382c4b04f94f6462f\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022b8a671a95124cc394ca98de873b64c19\u0022\u003ERICARDO MEN\u00C9NDEZ MARCH (Green) (16:28)\u003C/span\u003E: Thank you so much, Madam Speaker. I share the sentiments from previous speakers, and particularly my colleague Dr Lawrence Xu-Nan, that our lawmaking processes should be very accessible. In many ways, the Legislation Amendment Bill does help us go towards that, particularly in the quality of life updates, which my colleague noticed in his contributions, and particularly as we move into the digital age. We\u2019re making sure that with regard to our laws and how they\u2019re represented in secondary legislation and how they\u2019re represented digitally, they are more accessible. We\u2019re making sure that we\u2019re also creating a set of standards around that, and I note the contributions from the Hon Dr Duncan Webb in relation to the reality that we could set some of these standards in other forms, rather than in the Regulatory Standards Act.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000393\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EI do want to focus a bit on the concerns that we had in relation to the expanded scope of revision bills. This is important because, certainly at the Business Committee, this is something that we would be often potentially dealing with there. My colleague raises a really good point that, right now, we may be undergoing the Standing Orders review but there is no guarantee that changes will be made to accommodate, perhaps, methods to better scrutinise in the Chamber revision bills, despite this extended scope.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000394\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EI do want to talk a bit about Standing Order 276, as it relates to the provisions in the Legislation Amendment Bill for revision bills, to outline why we have concerns because of the way that Standing Order currently stands. Those two cannot be separated, in my view. The reason why we have concerns with the way it is currently written has to do with the fact that, so far at the moment, we would expect that these amendments should be minor in nature but the expanded scope could allow for that to be otherwise. A revision bill, in many ways, ends up having less time in the Chamber because of the way that Standing Order 276 lays things out. For example, there is no amendment or debate on the question for the first reading, so that creates a bit less scope for the unpacking in the debating chamber and for members of the public to hear the perspectives of different political parties if there is a view that perhaps these changes are not actually minor in nature. Additionally, there is no potential debate on whether the bill will be considered by a subject select committee nominated in the explanatory note of the bill. Also, following the presentation of the committee\u2019s final report on the bill, the Business Committee determines agreements for the passage of the bill.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000395\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EThis is particularly important because I think one of the things that the Green Party has often tested at the Business Committee has been the reality that, often, decisions in the Business Committee require near unanimity. What we know as MMP evolves is that near unanimity as a concept also relies on a first-past-the-post model, and if we move towards future parliaments where perhaps the distribution of political parties is not so much two parties holding near unanimity but a more diverse range of parties, for example, this also creates a different set of conditions.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000396\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EI think we would have liked the Standing Orders review to have happened first for us to deal with the potential consequences of this. I think that the way this Government has operated over the past few years leaves us with little trust that the provisions in the Legislation Amendment Bill won\u2019t be used to push for things that may not be considered minor or non-controversial, and I want to acknowledge that that is a subjective concept in and of itself. Things that may be minor and non-controversial for a political party in Government may not be felt in the exact same way by people in Opposition or by the constituents that we represent.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000397\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EI echo the sentiments of my colleagues Lawrence Xu-Nan and Celia Wade-Brown, who have also been following the proceedings of this bill. They are both addressing the things that we can really commend from this piece of legislation, but that one element, unfortunately, means that our vote cannot be in support of this bill. That does not take away from the merits of the other components that we do think are quality-of-life upgrades that help modernise our legislative processes and make them more accessible.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022cb40eb85aab340879622563050ab25fa\u0022 data-id=\u0022e3bef5147a4b4721b07d00509be707e5\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000398\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cb40eb85aab340879622563050ab25fa\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022e3bef5147a4b4721b07d00509be707e5\u0022\u003ETOM RUTHERFORD (National\u2014Bay of Plenty) (16:33)\u003C/span\u003E: I commend the bill to the House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00226f607d4079164946af0eb589f5753d1b\u0022 data-id=\u0022cf10cf58b55a3b7fa368ece6d83707fc\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000399\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226f607d4079164946af0eb589f5753d1b\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022cf10cf58b55a3b7fa368ece6d83707fc\u0022\u003EVANUSHI WALTERS (Labour) (16:33)\u003C/span\u003E: Thank you, Madam Speaker. I have no idea why the last member who spoke wouldn\u2019t want to take all the time in the world to speak about this wonderful and actually quite historic bill. I recommend to the member that he goes and visits the brand new website that is almost like Disneyland for law nerds. If you click on the secondary legislation tab, it says there are 19,744 documents that you can scroll though, but, of course, it\u2019s also just an extremely practical tool for people who are wanting to find out the regulations that are governing some very practical aspects of their life.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000400\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EI think that sometimes we do pass legislation in this House that has significant constitutional impact. I recall that, in the last term, we passed what was affectionately known as the SLAB\u2014or the Secondary Legislation Amendment Bill\u2014which was also extremely historic in this area. I wasn\u2019t in the House, but I think another moment was when the Human Rights Act was passed and it connected the Human Rights Act to the New Zealand Bill of Rights Act, which wasn\u2019t overly discussed at the time but has certainly had a huge impact on our constitutional make-up, and, certainly, so did the declaration of inconsistency or \u201CHalfway House Bill\u201D changes to the New Zealand Bill of Rights Act that happened last term as well.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000401\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EThis is one of those moments where we really are making a difference to access to legislation, ensuring that the law is known and knowable, and this was an issue that was discussed by the Regulations Review Committee last term but even well before then in 2014 when, I believe, there were two reviews done that identified a need for us to address this accessibility problem. This has been a long time coming, and in many ways, this is partially why I support the bill as it is, although I recommended some changes, which I will speak to. I think significant work has been done now, for over a decade: firstly, identifying the issue and, secondly, proposing the first solution, which was that the Parliamentary Counsel Office (PCO) would be responsible for publishing all secondary legislation. Now, here we are at the third phase where we realise that that isn\u2019t practical, but we\u2019ve still come up with a solution that allows access through the portal.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000402\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EThe work has certainly been done. Is it perfect? To be honest, I\u2019m not sure, and in terms of what my Green colleagues have argued today, I think they\u2019re quite correct. I will speak to revisions bills in a moment, but I would like to make the headline point that given the constitutional significance of this bill, it\u2019s one we ought to monitor. In terms of the use of revision bills in particular, we ought to monitor whether they are receiving sufficient scrutiny in the House, particularly if the Standing Orders Committee chooses not to invoke other procedural protections to ensure that those revision bills get committee stage scrutiny if there is concern about them.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000403\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EHowever, I do think that it is worth proceeding. One of the useful things of this bill\u2014I would almost describe it as its heart\u2014is in clause 20, which, effectively, says that secondary legislation doesn\u2019t commence until it complies with the requirements of the Act, which for the most part is publication. This is huge, because, in many ways, this was assumed and has resulted in a situation where much of the legislation that is effective in law is not in fact published.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000404\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EI did want to thank the multiple Ministers who were in the chair during a very robust committee of the whole House stage. I tabled two sets of amendments. I say two sets because they are actually two proposals with multiple options. The first one was about presentation to the House, so in the current state of affairs if you have secondary legislation that isn\u2019t presented to the House, it is still effective, and my proposal was that we allow a certain time period for it not to be presented but within which it must be presented. The point I was making is that you can make it short\u201410 days, you could make it 100 days\u2014but at least you would know that there was a requirement to present.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000405\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENow, the Minister in the chair responded, I thought, quite adequately to that. He said that if the secondary legislation doesn\u2019t commence until it\u2019s published, then that resolves that issue because the agencies will be very focused on ensuring that those rules apply so they will do their utmost to get it published as soon as possible.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000406\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EThe second issue was that if secondary legislation commences when it is published, if it falls off a website or falls off publication, the secondary legislation is still effective. It is still law, but members of the public may not be able to access it at all. Again, I proposed several different changes here\u2014that we could allow that to happen if it was an administrative error for a period of a number of days or weeks or even months but surely we should be looking for that error to be rectified, so putting some sort of timeline in.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000407\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EThe Minister in the chair at the time seemed amenable to that as something he might consider, but, unfortunately, despite the very sensible suggestion, both of those amendments were voted down. None the less, in this corner of this side of the House, we voted for the Minister\u2019s amendment because, again, our view was that the work has been done over several years\u2014over a decade now\u2014and this solves a massive gap in terms of the accessibility of legislation. We are happy to proceed with it, but, again, it does require review. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000408\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EI questioned, as well, whether we had the exemptions correct, in terms of what is exempt from publication or what is exempt from provision to the House, notice to the House. If one were to look at Schedule 2, there are a list of pieces of secondary legislation that have various exemptions attached to them. What I found interesting in this regard is that it is possible to have a piece of secondary legislation that is exempt from this allowance. That wasn\u2019t something that we discussed in detail, but, certainly, perhaps a matter for the Regulations Review Committee to consider when it is appropriate for a piece of secondary legislation to be exempt from disallowance. So, in effect, the House wouldn\u2019t have a way of instantly taking that off the books. Looking through the list, it\u2019s quite rare, but, in the list that I have in front of me, there\u2019s possibly about four examples or five examples of when that\u2019s the case. The exemptions that do apply seem, to me, to be quite sensible\u2014so it\u2019s where secondary legislation has little or no effect on the public, where there might be an emergency in place, or where early commencement is necessary.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000409\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENow, I questioned, again, the Minister whether we wanted to put a timeline on this. So if we were exempting the secondary legislation from publication, perhaps we should require that none the less it\u2019s published within a certain time frame. The assurance that was given to me was that most of these exemptions are temporary in nature. So it wouldn\u2019t hamper the process of the public eventually having access to, say, something that needed to be passed under emergency management; it would get there.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000410\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EOn revision bills, I would just make the point that I thought the select committee did a good job in proposing some language that brought down the scope of revision bills. So it is possible; we just didn\u2019t go quite as far as Green Party colleagues would have liked us to go. So, again, I would just say that it is something for us to monitor.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000411\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ECertainly, there were some submitters who recommended that there were aspects of the bill we would need to continue to monitor, and aspects that we\u2019ve chosen not to change that we should consider changing going forward. One of those suggestions came from the Law Society, who spoke to the fact that the IRD are empowered to draft their own tax legislation. That\u2019s quite unusual. It\u2019s a product of history from when the PCO didn\u2019t have sufficient capacity to be able to do that as well.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000412\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ESo there are clearly things that we will need to continue to monitor. But, overall, I\u2019m just delighted that we\u2019ve travelled this journey and are in a place where, at the press of a button, you can locate the secondary legislation that applies to your everyday problem, and I\u2019m sure the Regulations Review Committee will look forward to many more interactions from the public, as a result.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022297bc572c27f45308dffb067ca3e7915\u0022 data-id=\u00227cca77c50385f5a11b3c53c35f18ad7b\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000413\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022297bc572c27f45308dffb067ca3e7915\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00227cca77c50385f5a11b3c53c35f18ad7b\u0022\u003EDr HAMISH CAMPBELL (National\u2014Ilam) (16:43)\u003C/span\u003E: Excellent. It\u2019s with great pleasure that I rise to support this common-sense bill. So, therefore, I commend it to the House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00229f071e5323b640f383726a46f39e8187\u0022 data-id=\u00221e3f708c7d14de36bf2052cc0c4726af\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000414\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00229f071e5323b640f383726a46f39e8187\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00221e3f708c7d14de36bf2052cc0c4726af\u0022\u003EHon PHIL TWYFORD (Labour\u2014Te Atat\u016B) (16:43)\u003C/span\u003E: It was a great pleasure for him to rise, but a very short pleasure for the rest of us!\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000415\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b78723aefdc74b11a47482993ca56a74\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002227d8ba9dff01330227e2bb69942ddbf1\u0022\u003EHon Dr Duncan Webb\u003C/span\u003E: That\u2019s Hamish\u2019s pleasure!\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000416\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00229f071e5323b640f383726a46f39e8187\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002286590ca342477102135efee4c1f87a03\u0022\u003EHon PHIL TWYFORD\u003C/span\u003E: It\u2019s a very short pleasure.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000417\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EThis is good to see, the work that\u2019s been done on this bill, which I think everyone in the debate agrees is kind of an important and useful contribution to the stewardship of the country\u2019s laws.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000418\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EI want to say, first off, that the contributions from my colleagues Duncan Webb and Vanushi Walters, I thought, were first grade. Both of these members participated in the select committee process and all the prior stages of the bill going through the House, and they were thoroughly across the detail of the bill.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000419\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EIt\u2019s sad that other than the opening contribution by the Minister James Meager reading the notes prepared by officials, we haven\u2019t had a single other substantive contribution in this debate from the Government benches. I just think that\u2019s a shame, because, as other colleagues have shown, there are things to say about this bill.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000420\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EAccess to the law is an important part of the broader access to justice issue. It\u2019s one of the many parts of our lives that has been completely transformed in a positive way by the internet. I often think it\u2019s kind of amusing around the Parliament and various offices and meeting rooms that the old statute book is there as a kind of backdrop, it\u2019s there for decorative reasons, it\u2019s part of kind of like a period dressing of the room, if you like. I doubt whether anybody accesses the statute book in hardcopy these days\u2014I seriously do\u2014and that\u2019s because with the look-up functions, the internet is so perfectly suited to giving people instant and efficient access to large amounts of data like our laws.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000421\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EBut what\u2019s interesting, when you look at the story behind this bill, is that it\u2019s been quite a halting and circuitous process for the Parliament to actually get to the point, I think, of finding a sensible and efficient way of making, in this case, the country\u2019s secondary legislation available in a clear and transparent and accessible way to the public.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000422\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EI was fascinated to read that our secondary legislation is published by a plethora of different agencies\u2014central government and local government\u2014and that estimates range from around 7,500 to 20,000 current instruments published by around 120 Government, local government, and non-Government agencies. The fact is that with these laws, these by-laws, these regulations, these orders, these codes of practice, some are published, some are not\u2014who would know?\u2014and yet these bits of secondary law actually have a significant impact on the lives of New Zealanders.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000423\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ESo it\u2019s good to be supporting this bill in the House today. I, too, like Vanushi Walters, went and had a look at the New Zealand Legislation website, and it is promising. It\u2019s going to be a very efficient and user-friendly way to tap into those thousands of bits of secondary law, not through the, I think, misconceived centralised model which would have seen the poor old Parliamentary Counsel Office (PCO) crushed under the burden of having to be responsible for publishing all of the secondary law, but now this law is going to place an obligation on all of the publishing agencies. The 120 different agencies will be obliged to actually publish the secondary legislation that they are responsible for, and a number of other obligations, as well, in the way that that information is kept and published, and then PCO simply will provide internet links to all of those off that main website. I think that makes all of the sense in the world. So, in effect, the new New Zealand Legislation website becomes a single point of access.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000424\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EI was going to talk about some of the amendments that Vanushi Walters put up in the committee of the whole House stage that were never really properly replied to by the Minister in the chair, but, unfortunately, time has run out.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022cf22a832d14a4c99ab5dfd16e24446e5\u0022 data-id=\u0022ad3de1eba7a1c4fbf6233f5d558ffcf3\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000425\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cf22a832d14a4c99ab5dfd16e24446e5\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022ad3de1eba7a1c4fbf6233f5d558ffcf3\u0022\u003ERIMA NAKHLE (National\u2014Takanini) (16:49)\u003C/span\u003E: This bill can seem dry to the average listener\u2014like the Green Party members that voted against it\u2014but, in fact, it\u2019s actually transformative in the milieu of legislation. I am very happy to commend it to the House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002232632704a2594ee1b96e617d06beae80\u0022 data-id=\u0022cab6e2e94e2d02626bf026b7b388ee65\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000426\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002232632704a2594ee1b96e617d06beae80\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022cab6e2e94e2d02626bf026b7b388ee65\u0022\u003EHELEN WHITE (Labour\u2014Mt Albert) (16:49)\u003C/span\u003E: Madam Speaker, thank you very much for taking my call on this. I am in support of this piece of legislation. It reminded me\u2014does anybody remember when we were listening to \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsCharacterItalics\u0022\u003EThe Hitchhiker\u2019s Guide to the Galaxy\u003C/span\u003E and there was a piece of legislation that was very important? It was a regulation, and they were knocking down the person\u2019s house, and he was told that if he went to the basement, round the corner, down the stairs, etc., he would find a notice which told him that his house was being pulled down, and, in fact, things went a little bit strange there, and he ended up off the planet anyway, and the dolphins took over.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000427\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EThe point of that is that I think this legislation is something we live and breathe, but it is extremely disempowering when you don\u2019t know what the law is. It\u2019s incredibly important that we see the wood for the trees in this House, but we also allow people access to the branches of that tree, to the little things, because that\u2019s power in the hands of the people.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000428\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EThis is one of the things where technology is amazing and it will allow people who are not lawyers access to law and it will allow us to make things consistent. We will be able to, without the assistance of another person, go right down into that detail. I think that\u2019s going to be really important\u2014that we\u2019re publishing at that level.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000429\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EI wasn\u2019t on this committee. I have been on the Regulations Review Committee. I was deputy chair of that committee, and I was amazed at the work of it. It\u2019s a very, very important part of this institution, because it\u2019s constantly looking at legislation and it isn\u2019t, let\u2019s face it, down to the representatives in the House. We\u2019ve got to give absolute credit to the staff in this place who are so smart and will go through the detail and then will advise us. We get that overview because of the lack of the actual knowledge that they have. But what that committee does is it looks at consistency of law, etc. This piece of legislation might not be perfect. There probably are issues because there always will be such issues, but it\u2019s a damn sight better than what we\u2019ve had. We are going to be in this situation of really modernising, in some ways, whereas we\u2019ve really struggled before because of technology.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000430\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EI love the idea that Dr Webb talked about, about how there has been this attempt to have revision bills in the past and it hasn\u2019t quite worked. This piece of legislation looks at those revision bills again and it says, \u201COK, that was not a great success, because so few bills went through the process of modernisation. We\u2019re going to do that better, but we\u2019re also going to expand.\u201D I absolutely respect Dr Webb\u2019s fear and hesitancy and the note of this Parliament that there are risks with that that we go too far, that we open things too wide and there are risks in that. We don\u2019t want to be in a situation where that becomes something that is disempowering of people. I think, as he says, the balance is right here, and it can be looked at again if things go astray.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000431\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EI can see the risk, for example, of opening up from modernisation to a point where levies might be able to be increased. That could be a really onerous thing if it wasn\u2019t used wisely, that those levies could be looked at and put up and nobody would have oversight. But what I note about this piece of legislation is not only do we have oversight at a kind of bureaucratic level but we also get oversight. That\u2019s our job. We must always, as a House, take responsibility for the tabling of those things. It was an interesting story that Dr Webb told about how that has been something in the past where a department will create regulations and they won\u2019t quite make it to us. We\u2019ll never quite see them, because they\u2019re always in the works. That is a dangerous temptation.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000432\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EWhat I liked about this was that there was a fix in the legislation. There was a fix which said if you don\u2019t bring the legislation before this House, this secondary legislation, then it\u2019s not legal. I like that. That\u2019s sensible policy. We\u2019ll see how we go, because these things are difficult. But I think that that shows that the work of the officials and the select committee here has been studious and we\u2019ve come up with inventive solutions to problems which are real for ordinary people. So I\u2019m absolutely thrilled to see that kind of safeguarding.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000433\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EJust to be clear, what\u2019s going to happen there is: say there\u2019s a law with a penalty in it and the penalty goes up, then that secondary law can be changed like that, but it must go to the Chief Parliamentary Counsel and that person has to give it the tick-off, and then it must come to the House to be approved as part of the revision bill. So there is a definite check and balance in it.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000434\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENow, I thought it was a very interesting point about the issue over regulatory impact statements because it\u2019s something I didn\u2019t even know about before I entered this House, that there were these regulatory impact statements. They\u2019re something that I think we all find incredibly helpful when we\u2019re in the House. We can go to the Table here and we can get a regulatory impact statement that\u2019s written dispassionately, and it gives us the oil. It tells us where there might be issues in the legislation. It\u2019s a wonderful check and balance.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000435\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ETraditionally, this revision legislation has been so minimal\u2014it\u2019s been things like typos\u2014that it hasn\u2019t been through that process. The point was made that this is an area where we might need to continue to think again, that we might need to use the process for asking for regulatory impact statements on things where we think there\u2019s a substantive change. This may be something that we need to look at more thoroughly once we have seen how the legislation pans out, because I find that one of the most useful tools. It is also available to the public: they are published, those regulatory impact statements. So I think that itself is something that\u2019s well worth us considering. Where\u2019s the line when we are allowing more substantive change? Because we do want to get things moving and we want things to keep up to date.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000436\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EActually, we were having a really interesting discussion in the House yesterday, about some legislation that we were getting before us in private bills and how wouldn\u2019t it be nice if we actually had a system where that kind of private bill didn\u2019t take up all our time, when, in fact, it might be dealt with in a system like this in a more expedited fashion that is respectful of the intentions of parties, etc. Maybe we could have a lighter touch with regard to those things.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000437\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EI see this piece of legislation, and I think this is important. It is really grassroots in terms of how it impacts on people, because they\u2019re the ones paying the fines, they\u2019re the ones actually having to deal with pieces of legislation. But it\u2019s important for us too that we\u2019re not wasting our time on these things and we can look at those things in that way. What I like is it\u2019s actually a bit creative and sometimes I don\u2019t think we see enough of that in this House. I also see this as perhaps the foreshadower of some legislation where we do this work in a way that\u2019s just efficient for everybody.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000438\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EI\u2019m really grateful for the work that I know has been done. This is a hard piece of work. There\u2019s a lot of work in here. We usually thank the select committees for their hard work, and I do, but on this occasion, I thank the technical people behind this piece of legislation, because there will have been some really hard discussions and some very disciplined, bright people making this happen, and I\u2019m grateful that they have. I hope, finally, that we review this legislation in the not-too-distant future so we can keep getting better at this sort of thing. Thank you. I commend the bill to the House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022b7cff05e64f346e68983b2fdbfba3ad8\u0022 data-id=\u0022b4972af45dec96bad778958080fefab4\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000439\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b7cff05e64f346e68983b2fdbfba3ad8\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022b4972af45dec96bad778958080fefab4\u0022\u003EDAN BIDOIS (National\u2014Northcote) (16:59)\u003C/span\u003E: This is a good bill. I commend it to the House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000440\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EA party vote was called for on the question, \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsCharacterItalics\u0022\u003EThat the Legislation Amendment Bill be now read a third time\u003C/span\u003E.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000441\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022CharacterBoldCentred\u0022\u003EAyes 108\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000442\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand National 49; New Zealand Labour 34; ACT New Zealand 11; New Zealand First 8; Te P\u0101ti M\u0101ori 5; Ferris.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000443\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022CharacterBoldCentred\u0022\u003ENoes 15\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000444\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EGreen Party of Aotearoa New Zealand 15. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000445\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EMotion agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000446\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EBill read a third time.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000447\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u0022541e80f274ab4588f37bbc352ea227ca\u0022\u003EEmployment Leave Bill\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000448\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u0022c2f47102a488fd618ee67cddbcc6aa93\u0022\u003ELegislative Statement\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00222204e041e14c40fcbec76cc14f0da486\u0022 data-id=\u0022c63dfb2b37f5b6a7082c1aecad0e1075\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000449\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00222204e041e14c40fcbec76cc14f0da486\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022c63dfb2b37f5b6a7082c1aecad0e1075\u0022\u003EHon BROOKE VAN VELDEN (Minister for Workplace Relations and Safety) (17:00)\u003C/span\u003E: I present a legislative statement on the Employment Leave Bill.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000450\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00224cf6752dabf34d0eb8ae92457823e4ba\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022f132039f6e75bb848c3f61aac63906d1\u0022\u003EDEPUTY SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: That legislative statement is published under the authority of the House and can be found on the Parliament website.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000451\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u002231dfb11d714821bdb81d0f56d38f6043\u0022\u003EFirst Reading\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00222204e041e14c40fcbec76cc14f0da486\u0022 data-id=\u00224a67a14200549f16171b24e892dac431\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000452\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00222204e041e14c40fcbec76cc14f0da486\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00224a67a14200549f16171b24e892dac431\u0022\u003EHon BROOKE VAN VELDEN (Minister for Workplace Relations and Safety) (17:01)\u003C/span\u003E: I move, \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsCharacterItalics\u0022\u003EThat the Employment Leave Bill be now read a first time\u003C/span\u003E. I nominate the Education and Workforce Committee to consider the bill. At the appropriate time, I intend to move that the bill be reported to the House by 13 July 2026. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000453\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EFor more than two decades, the Holidays Act 2003 has been a source of confusion. While it was created to cater for a wide range of working arrangements, it has been difficult to understand, challenging to apply, and costly to fix errors. The complexity of the Holidays Act has had real consequences. It has led to widespread non-compliance across both the public and private sectors, it has resulted in billions of dollars in remediation costs, and it has meant that many workers did not receive the pay they were entitled to, sometimes waiting years for payments to be made, and that is why this Government is acting.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000454\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EWe are repealing the Holidays Act and replacing it with a simpler, clearer, and more transparent framework, the Employment Leave Bill. This bill has a clear purpose. It simplifies how leave is earned and paid. It gives workers certainty about their entitlements, and it restores confidence for employers so they can focus on growing their businesses rather than second guessing payroll calculations. Because there are too many changes to cover today, I\u2019ll summarise the main changes.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000455\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EFirstly, this bill introduces an hours-based accrual system for both annual leave and sick leave. This means that leave will be earned, taken, and paid in hours. From day one, employees will earn both annual and sick leave in direct proportion to their standard hours of work\u2014no more wrestling with weeks and days, adjusting balances when hours of work change, or trying to define what constitutes a working week for a staff member with variable schedules. It also means no more waiting for six months to access sick leave or 12 months to access annual leave. For most people, though, leave entitlements will stay the same. What will change is how they are calculated. For example, an employee working 40 hours per week will earn the same amount of annual leave, but it will be expressed as 160 hours rather than four weeks. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000456\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EAnother change is how entitlements reflect changes in hours worked. At the moment, annual leave balances automatically scale to match the working week of the employee when they reduce or increase their hours. For example, if an employee increased their standard weekly hours of work, they, effectively, receive an increase in leave balance immediately without having to earn it. And if they reduce their hours, they, effectively, receive a reduction in their leave balance. Under the new system, accrued hours will be banked, meaning leave balances will reflect hours actually worked in the past rather than scaling when work patterns change. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000457\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EGone are the days of multiple confusing calculations for leave payments. Under the new system, the same hourly leave pay rate will be used for all leave types. It will be based on an employee\u2019s base wage for the day of leave. The aim here is simplicity. Employers and employees alike will know exactly what their minimum entitlements are. I want to stress that\u2014minimum entitlements. As minimum entitlements, employees and employers are also free to negotiate higher than the minimum in a way that suits both parties.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000458\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EAs for the sick leave system, the sick leave accrual rate will provide the hourly equivalent of 10 days\u2019 sick leave per year for an employee who works five days a week and the same hours every day. Unused sick leave can still be carried over up to a cap of 160 hours, which is the equivalent of the current 20 days. Of course, adopting hours-based accrual for sick leave will be a change for employees who work less than five days per week. No longer will a part-time employee receive the same amount of sick leave as someone working full-time. Instead, all employees will receive sick leave hours proportionate to their standard hours.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000459\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENext, the bill introduces a leave compensation payment. Workers with casual hours will be paid 12.5 percent of their ordinary hourly rate for every hour they work, instead of accruing annual and sick leave. For employers, this will remove the burden of tracking leave for casual hours, but for the workers themselves it will mean money in their hand now rather than uncertainty later.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000460\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EThe bill also fixes a very longstanding issue for parents. Under the new system, employees will earn annual leave throughout their parental leave, just as they do now. But when they return and take annual leave, it will be paid like any other annual leave would be, not at a reduced figure, which happens now. This will ensure the Act doesn\u2019t penalise parents for taking leave to care for a new child. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000461\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EThe bill also provides immediate access to bereavement and family violence leave from day one of employment.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000462\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EFinally, the bill improves transparency and flexibility. Pay statements will clearly show pay and leave balances, and workers will be able to cash out up to 25 percent of their annual leave in each 12-month period if they choose to do so. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000463\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EThere will also be a careful transition. Most employers will have 24 months to move to the new system. The schooling sector will have longer, recognising its payroll complexity, and historical underpayments will not be ignored. A statutory estimation method will provide a new option to help employers resolve them efficiently and fairly.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000464\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EIn summary, these reforms will make it easy to pay employees correctly for their leave. This will lower employer compliance costs and give employers and their workers confidence that payments are correct. I commend this bill to the House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000465\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00224cf6752dabf34d0eb8ae92457823e4ba\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00225d25df944165a049e3d0a8877063ac2e\u0022\u003EDEPUTY SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: The question is that the motion be agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022cc5df856d19845fdaba4418087cd3bba\u0022 data-id=\u0022e05018b344cc7ec87d4961e770faeb7f\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000466\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022cc5df856d19845fdaba4418087cd3bba\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022e05018b344cc7ec87d4961e770faeb7f\u0022\u003EHon JAN TINETTI (Labour) (17:07)\u003C/span\u003E: Thank you, Madam Speaker. I rise here today with a sort of split view on this bill, and I want to make that quite clear. There are some parts of this bill that I believe are doing the right thing, but there\u2019s a lot in this that I\u2019ve gone through, since it landed on Monday, with many employment lawyers showing that there\u2019s a lot of holes in the bill as well. That\u2019s the concern that I bring to this.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000467\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EI know, and I agree with the Minister, there has been confusion over the Holidays Act, but the Holidays Act also did offer a number of protections to employees. It\u2019s really important that those protections aren\u2019t lost and that no employee would be worse off, particularly with their holiday entitlements, when this bill becomes law.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000468\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EI want to go through, basically, where our concerns are as Labour and why we would not be giving certainty around this bill going forward, because, as I said, there are so many holes in it. I do acknowledge that for businesses, they do need to see some certainty around this. This is something that we were told constantly when we were doing tripartite work as a Government in this area, which involved business peak body groups and union peak body groups and the Government working on this. As the Minister will be aware, having a continued one-third of that work, or two-thirds\u2014Government and business\u2014that\u2019s not always an easy thing to get people in that room talking the same talk at the same time. That\u2019s why taking something complex and trying to make it simple doesn\u2019t always work for everyone, and that\u2019s what we\u2019re seeing with this bill as it sits here today.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000469\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EI believe that this piece of legislation is poorly written as it stands at the moment. We will be voting against it, but I know that it will be going to select committee, and I believe it can be fixed at select committee. I hope the Minister is open to those suggestions when it comes back from select committee with those ideas added or amendments that we will be making to it. As it stands at the moment, this bill undermines a significant portion of workers\u2019 rights in this country. I want to briefly talk about that, but I also put the invitation out there that I\u2019m happy to talk outside of this process as well, because I do want to get this right. I do see that there\u2019s value in us coming together as a Parliament to get it right.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000470\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EAs I said, a basic principle is that nobody should be worse off, and we see that there is a large contingent of the workforce that will be worse off after this. I have to say that I have had a lot of correspondence with employment lawyers and employment advocates in this space who are really concerned with what they\u2019re seeing and how they\u2019re reading the bill. They say quite clearly that if you\u2019re a standard worker, you probably won\u2019t notice any difference, but the world is changing so much that there are very few people that would call themselves standard workers who work standard hours at this point in time. It\u2019s changing so much. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000471\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EThe removal of holiday rights or entitlements from so-called casual workers and the way that that\u2019s been translated, as it is written in this bill, and the replacement with an allowance removes a whole lot of rights from those particular workers. It\u2019s not just a small number; it\u2019s a very large number of people that we see in that situation. The big concern we see, and the number of people that have contacted me and reached out to me see, is the very real fear that this will encourage casualisation of the workforce. Now, that\u2019s not something that any of us really want to see. It\u2019s not good for workers, it\u2019s not good for business, and it\u2019s not good for the economy. It is something that is a real fear from the way that this bill is written at the moment. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000472\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EThat\u2019s just one, and probably the biggest, problem, and in five minutes I don\u2019t have enough time, but I want to reiterate that I do want to get this right and I do want to sit down and have that conversation. Holidays aren\u2019t a luxury; they are a basic right. They do protect our workers, they do protect our businesses, and they do protect our families and our communities, because people need to take those real breaks. As I\u2019ve said, we\u2019re going to vote against this at this stage, but we do want to get it right, and we do want to work authentically with the Minister to get it right. Thank you.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00224cdfceb3207b43e8a21b346f9376ddc7\u0022 data-id=\u00221da05d439704ed05919fc9ea6e7dac16\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000473\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00224cdfceb3207b43e8a21b346f9376ddc7\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00221da05d439704ed05919fc9ea6e7dac16\u0022\u003ETEANAU TUIONO (Green) (17:13)\u003C/span\u003E: Kia ora, Madam Speaker. I rise on behalf of the Greens to talk on this Employment Leave Bill. Just to acknowledge what has been said: this is an issue, and the Holiday Act itself has had numerous problems. This is a beast of a bill; there are many, many pages here, and I want to acknowledge the enormous amount of work that will be required in order to get this over the line.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000474\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EBut acknowledging it and actually trusting that side to do the right thing are two different things. I look at this in the context of the attacks that they\u2019ve done on workers\u2019 rights\u2014the barrage of anti-worker legislation that has come through this House, whether it\u2019s cancelling 33 pay equity claims or squashing fair pay agreements. They\u2019re tinkering around with work safety as well, let alone the appalling and horrendous Employment Relations Amendment Act that came through the House just a couple of weeks ago. It says, to me, that that side of the House cares more about the Uber company than it does about the Uber drivers; it cares more about the mining company than it does about the workers; it always cares more about the multinational corporations than it does about New Zealanders. I think it\u2019s really important that we place that context in terms of the important work that actually needs to be done in this bill.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000475\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EIt is all of those things that paint the context of, I think, the suspicion that many workers have of this Government. Yes, these are issues that need to be sorted out. Everybody knows that the Holidays Act has got a lot of problems and a lot of issues around that, but in order for that to be carried through successfully, it requires trust. It requires trust, and that side has failed to provide the necessary trust to workers that they are going to have their best interests at heart as well. I do note that in the formation\u2014I\u2019ve been reading the regulatory impact statement and the various documents here\u2014of this bill, they didn\u2019t talk to workers. They talked to employers, they talked to everybody else, but they didn\u2019t talk to the unions at all\u2014the representatives of the people who will be most impacted by this bill.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000476\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EThe Greens, in terms of our workforce policy, think it\u2019s really important that we ensure that leave allowances enable working people to live fulfilling, balanced lives. That is something that this House should be doing; it should be making sure that we put people first, making sure that their workplaces are safe, and making sure that they can put food on the table and keep the lights on. There are a number of things that are going to be addressed with this legislation, and the Minister herself outlined that, around annual leave accrual, sick leave accrual, and bereavement and family violence leave. In the regulatory impact statement, there are a couple of options outlined about how best to do it, whether it could be on a week-by-week basis or on an hourly basis, and the Minister has chosen to do that via an hourly basis. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000477\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EIf there\u2019s one among a number of requests that I have for that side of the House, it\u2019s to make sure that we have a fulsome process so that when this bill goes to the Education and Workforce Committee, we allow everybody to have their say. I know that side don\u2019t like it when the unions show up in their different branches and their different sectors, but it is important that they are heard. They haven\u2019t been heard in the design of this document. I hope that members on the other side of the House take that to heart, because this will impact the leave requirements of those workers. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000478\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EAlso, one of the other things that I have noticed is that sometimes things will get a first reading, then we\u2019ll do the report back from the select committee, and then, all of a sudden, we\u2019re speeding through committee of the whole House and through the third reading. There could be big issues coming up out of this\u2014issues identified in the select committee process\u2014that, actually, we need to slow down on and we need to pause on. The Council of Trade Unions itself has said you haven\u2019t included workers within the design of this legislation. They did ask for a pause, and if that side of the House is not going to give that, then at least give it the full process. Let it go through the committee of the whole House, tease out any of the other very important issues, because, look at it, there\u2019s a lot there\u2014so much so that the Minister herself couldn\u2019t outline all of it in the 10-minute contribution that she had allocated to her. It does no one any service at all if we rush this through the House without giving it due scrutiny.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000479\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EThe Greens cannot support this bill in the House. We do not trust that side; they have to earn that trust, and they are failing to do that for workers.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000480\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00224cf6752dabf34d0eb8ae92457823e4ba\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u002219e89aec71f437036f26a23537a3a820\u0022\u003EDEPUTY SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: The member\u2019s time has expired.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002288978fb9592a4911a8e47eae04d164f3\u0022 data-id=\u00226dcfea73fa8dff8c3baf781bb16102cc\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000481\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002288978fb9592a4911a8e47eae04d164f3\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00226dcfea73fa8dff8c3baf781bb16102cc\u0022\u003EDr VANESSA WEENINK (National\u2014Banks Peninsula) (17:18)\u003C/span\u003E: Thank you, Madam Speaker. I\u2019m looking forward to seeing the Employment Leave Bill coming to the Education and Workforce Committee.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000482\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsContinued\u0022\u003EAs a previous business owner, I had the pain of having to deal with not only the financial fallout of having the wrong calculations made for holiday pay but also the incredible psychological impact that that actually had on the manager who had made some errors. For a lot of people, the confusion around the Holidays Act has been very disruptive, so I commend this bill to the House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00222c117f6511bc4b8fb6fdcf9c6133fb99\u0022 data-id=\u0022c291900ed7dc5d766be11161f4206aca\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000483\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00222c117f6511bc4b8fb6fdcf9c6133fb99\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022c291900ed7dc5d766be11161f4206aca\u0022\u003EDr DAVID WILSON (NZ First) (17:18)\u003C/span\u003E: I rise as New Zealand First\u2019s spokesperson for small business. This country has a long history\u2014in fact, I think we\u2019re the first in the world at tripartite relations working out workforce issues. We\u2019re very pleased that the Minister took some of our advice under consideration in the formation of this bill, the Employment Leave Bill. It\u2019s a long-overdue piece of legislation that finally brings common sense and practical reality to a system that\u2019s been broken for over two decades.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000484\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsContinued\u0022\u003EFor too long, the Holidays Act 2003 has been a bureaucratic nightmare for small business and a source of constant frustration for payroll providers. We see that there\u2019s a real balance here on both sides, employers and employees. We would like to see, through the select committee process, that all of these issues were surfaced. We do have a proud history for advocating for lower business compliance costs with clear, simple law to support that. This is a centre ground, common-sense solution that puts the productivity of New Zealand, and certainty of New Zealanders, first. We commend this bill to the House. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00223b11bafcf5b5427480393ffeef4fe6e8\u0022 data-id=\u002259ba7491cc9eb0b0e14ab00d1a7340e8\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000485\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00223b11bafcf5b5427480393ffeef4fe6e8\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u002259ba7491cc9eb0b0e14ab00d1a7340e8\u0022\u003EORIINI KAIPARA (Te P\u0101ti M\u0101ori\u2014T\u0101maki Makaurau) (17:20)\u003C/span\u003E: I rise on behalf of Te P\u0101ti M\u0101ori to oppose this bill, the Employment Leave Bill. Once again, this Government is telling the country that this is about simplification, about tidying up legislation, making payroll systems easier, and making life easier for employers. But when you strip away the bureaucratic language, the truth becomes very clear. The bill asks working people to give up more, while those in positions of power sit comfortably behind desks writing legislation based on statistics that suit their narrative. It is policy written from a theoretical box, by people who have never had to worry about losing a day\u2019s pay because they\u2019re sick, never had to choose between staying home to recover or going to work injured because the bills still need to be paid. Meanwhile, the engine room of this country\u2014the working class, the labouring class, the brown workforce of Aotearoa\u2014will carry the cost.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000486\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EWe need to be really honest about what this bill does. It reduces sick leave entitlements for many part-time workers. It removes leave accrual for workers receiving weekly ACC compensation. It changes the way holiday pay and leave entitlements are calculated, in ways that will reduce the benefits many workers currently rely on.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000487\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EWe must talk about who those workers are, because while the Minister for Workplace Relations and Safety may see numbers on a spreadsheet, we see real faces, real people behind those numbers. We see the shearers working through the sheds across rural Aotearoa. We see the freezing workers in the meatworks, the forestry crews on dangerous terrain, the construction labourers building our homes, the orchard and packhouse workers sustaining our horticulture sector. We see the cleaners, the hospital orderlies, the aged-care workers, the supermarket workers, and the security guards who keep our communities functioning. These are not abstract economic units. These are people\u2014people whose bodies absorb the physical cost of keeping this country running, and many of these workers are in casual, seasonal, and part-time work. That matters.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000488\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EM\u0101ori have an underutilisation rate of more than 20 percent, meaning more than one in five M\u0101ori workers are unemployed, underemployed, or unable to get the hours that they need, often through no fault of their own. Yet this bill proposes that if you work fewer hours, you should receive less sick leave. What kind of logic is that? You still get sick, you still get injured, and you still need to look after your kids and your wh\u0101nau. But under this bill, your entitlement to recover is reduced because your labour is deemed less economically valuable. That is not fairness; that is measuring the worth of a human being based on their productivity.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000489\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EThen, we come to ACC. Just last week, this Government clawed back millions from ACC recipients. Now, this bill punishes those same injured workers. If a forestry worker is injured on the job, if a construction labourer falls from scaffolding, if a freezing worker damages their back, while they\u2019re recovering from injuries sustained while contributing to our economy, their leave entitlements will stop accruing. The message is very clear and it\u2019s not a nice one. It says that if your body breaks while working for this country, you carry the cost.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000490\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EThis Government says it wants efficiency, but efficiency without justice is exploitation. Workers are not just entries in a payroll system. They are parents. They are aunties, uncles, caregivers, nieces, nephews, community leaders\u2014the foundation of our economy. When you weaken their ability to rest, to recover, and to care for their wh\u0101nau, you weaken the entire social fabric of Aotearoa. So I say this to the Minister responsible: before writing legislation from behind a desk, spend time in the shearing sheds, the forestry blocks, the packhouses, the construction sites, and the hospital cleaning crews working night shifts, because that is where the real impact of this bill will be felt. For fairness, for dignity, and for the protection of working wh\u0101nau, this House must reject this bill.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u002227d19573a8ba4d8283b17374978c8ea2\u0022 data-id=\u0022210781af463d0139b3ac7a74429f933e\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000491\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u002227d19573a8ba4d8283b17374978c8ea2\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022210781af463d0139b3ac7a74429f933e\u0022\u003EGRANT McCALLUM (National\u2014Northland) (17:25)\u003C/span\u003E: Thank you, Madam Speaker. I rise to take a call on the Employment Leave Bill. This review is long overdue and I commend it to the House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00220750364c2c1444d0ae00bced720f964e\u0022 data-id=\u0022f9d1f4ccd36d0e0cf37fabb16ca4605f\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000492\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220750364c2c1444d0ae00bced720f964e\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022f9d1f4ccd36d0e0cf37fabb16ca4605f\u0022\u003EHon GINNY ANDERSEN (Labour) (17:25)\u003C/span\u003E: Thank you very much, Madam Speaker. It seems like, under this Government, taking a holiday is a luxury that no New Zealander can afford to take any more, not only because they can\u2019t afford to take the holiday themselves but because the Government seems to think if they can\u2019t afford it, they\u2019ll take their leave.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000493\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EThis is a sad first reading. We stand for fair work, decent jobs, and people being able to live a good life here in New Zealand. These changes, along with all the other changes that this Minister for Workplace Relations and Safety has brought to the House, are a further erosion of workers\u2019 rights in New Zealand at a time when the cost of living is cutting more sharply than ever before.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000494\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EWhat this bill does\u2014let\u2019s run through what it does. Under the Employment Leave Bill, paid holidays for so-called casual workers are stripped away and replaced with a simple allowance. That means no guaranteed break. That means no real holidays and no time to be able to switch off with family. Workers who take on growing hours, people stepping up when workplaces are under-staffed when they are needed to, are not rewarded for that. They will never be able to build up the full holiday entitlement that they earn today, so it\u2019s a step backwards for those workers.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000495\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EOvertime hours won\u2019t be properly recognised. These are the extra shifts that nurses, retail workers, and hospitality workers take on to be able to pay the bills. This legislation says that those hours don\u2019t count towards holiday pay and being able to take leave.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000496\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EWorkers will lose the right to take leave in advance or ensure that two consecutive weeks off\u2014a basic protection that helps people rest; that helps people visit all their relatives who have gone to Australia; that helps you to recover, to avoid the burnout that we see in so many of our professions, whether they\u2019re teachers, whether they\u2019re nurses. In so many professions, we\u2019re seeing people being burnt out by having to work extra hours. Having that fundamental right to be able to take a break, to take a period of time of leave to connect with family, to connect with nature, to be able to have some time and recharge\u2014this bill is undermining those very fundamental rights.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000497\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EWe believe, in Labour, that holidays are not a luxury; they are a right. They protect the wellbeing of our workers, and they enable people to do an even better job when they come back and be even more productive because they\u2019ve had time to recharge.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000498\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EWe know that workers themselves do not support this legislation. There was a working group to look at this whole area, that had union members, that had a whole range of people, that was bipartisan and working towards an agreed approach forward. A lot of that work has not been included in this legislation. In fact, the New Zealand Council of Trade Unions, which represents over 360,000 New Zealand workers, has been unequivocal in their view that this legislation is unfair, it has been rushed, and it is actually harmful to workers\u2019 rights.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000499\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EThe Minister has been so focused on pushing this through rapidly that it has not been properly looked at. There are many gaps\u2014as my colleague the Hon Jan Tinetti pointed out in her speech\u2014many holes in this legislation, and workers themselves, the people who will be directly impacted by this legislation, have in fact not been consulted about the details. Vulnerable workers, we know, will risk losing pay and the ability to take two weeks of leave\u2014something so vital is weakened.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000500\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EWe already have, in New Zealand, some of the longest working hours in the developed world. We know that mental health and burnout are real factors in everyday people\u2019s lives, and this legislation is just going to add to the burden already on the hard-working Kiwi family being able to cope and live in New Zealand.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000501\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EIt seems like this Government actually wants to drive out New Zealanders; they want to drive them offshore by continually eroding workers\u2019 rights, by continually making it even harder to be able to pay the bills. At a time when there are so many pressures on being able to meet weekly payments, this is just another cut on the back of the workers of New Zealand.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000502\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EWe want fair work, we want decent jobs that pay a wage that\u2019s enough for people to have a good life here in New Zealand, and this is, sadly, not anything in the realm of doing that. It will make it harder for workers to get ahead.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000503\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EWe know that the Rt Hon Christopher Luxon campaigned hard on making the cost of living better for New Zealanders; this bill is just one of dozens that have made life even harder and worse for New Zealanders, and that\u2019s a sad thing for our country.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022ab32b09663ea48b199aa59e4d88f77e4\u0022 data-id=\u0022b3279a8eb9a5cd1937e3a4862263ce0d\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000504\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022ab32b09663ea48b199aa59e4d88f77e4\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022b3279a8eb9a5cd1937e3a4862263ce0d\u0022\u003ETIM COSTLEY (National\u2014\u014Ctaki) (17:30)\u003C/span\u003E: Well, Jan Tinetti stood there and said that she\u2019s interested to see if it can be improved at the select committee\u2014then support it. Send it to the select committee and give it a go. The Greens are scaremongering, saying it\u2019s not going to go through the committee of the whole House. That\u2019s absolutely ridiculous and absolutely untrue. I don\u2019t know what planet they\u2019re on. Let\u2019s just send it to committee. I commend it to the House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00229f071e5323b640f383726a46f39e8187\u0022 data-id=\u00223d3edcdef7d2995ac9a6a747c9bd8755\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000505\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00229f071e5323b640f383726a46f39e8187\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00223d3edcdef7d2995ac9a6a747c9bd8755\u0022\u003EHon PHIL TWYFORD (Labour\u2014Te Atat\u016B) (17:30)\u003C/span\u003E: First, something positive for the Minister\u2014make the most of this, Minister. Everyone acknowledges that the Holidays Act has been a mess for a long time. Successive Governments haven\u2019t grappled with it in the way that was needed, really, to come to terms with a very complex piece of legislation. It caused a massive headache, huge financial liability for the Government, and it needed to be sorted out. So kudos for having a crack.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000506\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENow normal transmission will be resumed. I\u2019m afraid to say it, but this Minister and this Government are the last people for so many New Zealanders to trust to do a job that\u2019s fair and even-handed in designing a piece of legislation like this. Our Green Party colleague Teanau Tuiono: he said it. The track record of this Government and this Minister has been to continually strip the rights of New Zealanders at work and to undermine their bargaining position.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000507\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EThe last time we were discussing an employment law bill in this House that the Minister brought, she was dismantling the personal grievance system that is fundamental to workers having access to justice at work, getting rid of the 30-day rule in the Employment Relations Act that allows for workers at a new job at a new worksite to experience some collective bargaining before they choose whether they want to be part of the union and part of the collective, a law that stripped away from contract workers the right to fairly have a process that would determine whether they are, in fact, a contractor or an employee. The list is very, very long, going right back to the demolition of fair pay agreements. So there is a huge trust problem for this Minister and this Government in dealing with an issue like reforming the Holidays Act.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000508\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EThere\u2019s something that I think is really, really important to politics and government in this country, and particularly in relation to laws that deal with employment relations, and I would cast this as a mainstream social democratic view of society and work and the economy. That is that it is a partnership that requires negotiation, a careful balancing of the rights and responsibilities in a way that actually allows our economy to work in the interests of both the owners of capital and the people who get up every day and work and contribute their labour to the generation of wealth. I think that someone like David Wilson understands this, but, unfortunately, this National-led coalition, and particularly the ACT Party and this Minister, do not believe in that. They have a one-sided and distorted approach that simply wants to rip the value that workers generate away from them, and they constantly want to tilt the playing field in favour of the owners of capital and employers.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000509\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EIf this bill is just one more piece of legislation that does that, then it won\u2019t last, because as soon as the Government changes, it\u2019ll be gone. It will not have the confidence and the support of society. So other comments that have been made by colleagues: yes, New Zealanders work longer and harder than almost anyone else in the OECD. That\u2019s the only way our productivity figures have kept their head above water. If this bill weakens the rights of New Zealanders to get access to time off, to leave, and to holidays, that will be doing them a terrible disservice\u2014we cannot afford that.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000510\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EBack to the trust issue: Sandra Grey from the Council of Trade Unions\u2014the preeminent organisation that represents workers and represents unions in this country\u2014has said that they have not been properly consulted in the development of this bill. If that\u2019s true, then I think that\u2019s a further nail in the coffin of this bill\u2019s credibility. She\u2019s calling on the Minister to step back and actually take another look at it and take time and consult properly on that. Jan Tinetti said that we will work at select committee genuinely to try and improve this, and we will. We will get into the detail with the Minister and the officials and we will do our job and we will hold the Minister to account and subject this bill to the scrutiny it deserves.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022b7cff05e64f346e68983b2fdbfba3ad8\u0022 data-id=\u0022ec1be75594423dffd2b90c821e3c4d28\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000511\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b7cff05e64f346e68983b2fdbfba3ad8\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022ec1be75594423dffd2b90c821e3c4d28\u0022\u003EDAN BIDOIS (National\u2014Northcote) (17:35)\u003C/span\u003E: Allow me to indulge this House for at least 30 seconds and begin by acknowledging the Minister. Well done to you, Minister, for having the courage to address these longstanding issues. Labour had six years and they didn\u2019t do it, so well done to you. I know there will be businesses right up and down New Zealand who will be celebrating these changes, regardless of the way\u2014in fact, I\u2019ve met the odd business owner in my electorate of Northcote that votes for Labour, and they were very happy with this piece of legislation. So I urge the other side to reverse their position, to support this bill to select committee, and do what\u2019s required to get this bill through the House so that hard-working Kiwi businesses can get ahead, and that workers get fairness\u2014it\u2019s all about fairness. So I commend this bill to the House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000512\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EA party vote was called for on the question, \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsCharacterItalics\u0022\u003EThat the Employment Leave Bill be now read a first time\u003C/span\u003E.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000513\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022CharacterBoldCentred\u0022\u003EAyes 68\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000514\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand National 49; ACT New Zealand 11; New Zealand First 8.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000515\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022CharacterBoldCentred\u0022\u003ENoes 55\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000516\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand Labour 34; Green Party of Aotearoa New Zealand 15; Te P\u0101ti M\u0101ori 5; Ferris.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000517\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EMotion agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000518\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EBill read a first time.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000519\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u00225b2f8d62347e1a75290ee524ab3a81a4\u0022\u003EReferral to Select Committee\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00224cf6752dabf34d0eb8ae92457823e4ba\u0022 data-id=\u0022c3a080f5023ab291ec9a06ba50fcf4a2\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000520\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00224cf6752dabf34d0eb8ae92457823e4ba\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022c3a080f5023ab291ec9a06ba50fcf4a2\u0022\u003EDEPUTY SPEAKER (17:37)\u003C/span\u003E: The question is, \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsCharacterItalics\u0022\u003EThat the Employment Leave Bill be considered by the Education and Workforce Committee\u003C/span\u003E.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000521\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EMotion agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000522\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EBill referred to the Education and Workforce Committee.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000523\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u0022004db4101402ab1ce5efe1efdccd88a9\u0022\u003EInstruction to Select Committee\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00222204e041e14c40fcbec76cc14f0da486\u0022 data-id=\u00222109da7ada567faec4d96fe89d82cd7a\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000524\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00222204e041e14c40fcbec76cc14f0da486\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00222109da7ada567faec4d96fe89d82cd7a\u0022\u003EHon BROOKE VAN VELDEN (Minister for Workplace Relations and Safety) (17:37)\u003C/span\u003E: I move, \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsCharacterItalics\u0022\u003EThat the Employment Leave Bill be reported to the House by 13 July 2026\u003C/span\u003E.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000525\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EA party vote was called for on the question, \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsCharacterItalics\u0022\u003EThat the Employment Leave Bill be reported to the House by 13 July 2026\u003C/span\u003E.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000526\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022CharacterBoldCentred\u0022\u003EAyes 68\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000527\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand National 49; ACT New Zealand 11; New Zealand First 8.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000528\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022CharacterBoldCentred\u0022\u003ENoes 55\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000529\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealand Labour 34; Green Party of Aotearoa New Zealand 15; Te P\u0101ti M\u0101ori 5; Ferris.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000530\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EMotion agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000531\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubjectHeading\u0022 id=\u0022268072cba317329263ceaf3f712af948\u0022\u003EPublic Finance Amendment Bill\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000532\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u002204647462fa8faae7ef9acdbf9a460134\u0022\u003ELegislative Statement\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022f537d6f7e9d0407792892b239af9ec7f\u0022 data-id=\u00221a60cc5af16a5d0fc11fffe58c8acd3c\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000533\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f537d6f7e9d0407792892b239af9ec7f\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00221a60cc5af16a5d0fc11fffe58c8acd3c\u0022\u003EHon SCOTT SIMPSON (Minister of Commerce and Consumer Affairs) (17:38)\u003C/span\u003E: on behalf of the \u003Cspan class=\u0022CharacterBold\u0022\u003EMinister of Finance\u003C/span\u003E: I seek leave to present a legislative statement on the Public Finance Amendment Bill.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000534\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00224cf6752dabf34d0eb8ae92457823e4ba\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022c4dafb6a9a600478b998177423f12e73\u0022\u003EDEPUTY SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Leave is sought for that purpose. Is there any objection? There appears to be none. That legislative statement is published under the authority of the House and can be found on the Parliament website.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000535\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsSubproceedingHeading\u0022 id=\u0022ef3dccf813fc9c848b4440bcae2b12ab\u0022\u003EThird Reading\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022f537d6f7e9d0407792892b239af9ec7f\u0022 data-id=\u00227c9b70c763a4ce0c989631c475407fa1\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000536\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022f537d6f7e9d0407792892b239af9ec7f\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u00227c9b70c763a4ce0c989631c475407fa1\u0022\u003EHon SCOTT SIMPSON (Minister of Commerce and Consumer Affairs) (17:39)\u003C/span\u003E: on behalf of the \u003Cspan class=\u0022CharacterBold\u0022\u003EMinister of Finance\u003C/span\u003E: I move, \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsCharacterItalics\u0022\u003EThat the Public Finance Amendment Bill be now read a third time\u003C/span\u003E.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000537\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENew Zealanders rightly expect Governments to manage public finances carefully, transparently, and responsibly. This bill strengthens the framework that supports that expectation by making targeted improvements to the Public Finance Act. Members across the House have engaged closely with the bill, reflecting the importance of the Public Finance Act to the functioning of our public finance system. During the committee of the whole House process, there was particular interest in the bill\u2019s smaller, more technical provisions.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000538\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EWhile these amendments may appear minor, they serve an important purpose. They clarify that the operation of the Act reduces ambiguity and removes unnecessary administrative steps. Taken together, these changes help ensure the Act operates more clearly and efficiently in practice. I would like to thank members for their very careful consideration of these provisions.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000539\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EThere were also several more substantive elements of the bill that attracted constructive engagement from across the House\u2014for example, the change to the timing of the Pre-election Economic and Fiscal Update was broadly welcomed. Moving the publication window five working days earlier better reflects the increasing use of advance voting and provides voters and commentators with more time to understand the fiscal and economic content in which election commitments are being made.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000540\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ESimilarly, the introduction of a requirement to publish a tax expenditure statement alongside the Budget was generally recognised as a useful transparency measure. This will improve visibility of policy-motivated tax concessions and exemptions, and help to ensure that foregone revenue receives the same level of scrutiny as direct spending.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000541\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EMembers also engaged with the provisions allowing Governments to express their fiscal strategy using alternative fiscal indicators. These amendments recognise the practical reality that successive Governments have sometimes used variables that better communicate fiscal strategy in particular circumstances while maintaining transparency and ensuring that those variables remain clearly linked to the Act\u2019s existing statutory framework.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000542\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EI also want to briefly acknowledge one area of the bill where there was more debate amongst members regarding the removal of the wellbeing requirements from the Act. This bill is about getting back to basics. These changes restore flexibility and ensure the focus of the Public Finance Act is on public finance. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000543\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ESome members queried why these changes are being progressed now, given the ongoing inquiry into performance reporting. The answer is actually straightforward. The amendments in this bill deal with issues and opportunities that are already clear and where action can be taken immediately. Further work, including on performance reporting and infrastructure planning will continue, but this legislation ensures the Act is working clearly and effectively in the meantime.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000544\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ESo, in closing, this bill represents an important step in strengthening fiscal transparency and responsibility. I\u2019m confident that it will contribute to sound fiscal management for New Zealand. I commend this bill to the House.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000545\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00224cf6752dabf34d0eb8ae92457823e4ba\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022fafa1735a73eb49f7ca83d10c2744235\u0022\u003EDEPUTY SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: The question is that the motion be agreed to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u0022b13aa8ffbae34ee4972a7ab313f6b300\u0022 data-id=\u0022dd643e052968a27be258fc43a8188a98\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000546\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u0022b13aa8ffbae34ee4972a7ab313f6b300\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022dd643e052968a27be258fc43a8188a98\u0022\u003EHon Dr DEBORAH RUSSELL (Labour) (17:43)\u003C/span\u003E: We cannot support this bill. It\u2019s very straightforward: we cannot.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000547\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ELet me just talk a little bit about some of the more minor matters that the previous speaker mentioned, talking in terms of some of the technical changes in the Public Finance Act, but those aren\u2019t a problem; whether or not they\u2019ll achieve what the Minister wanted, whatever\u2014they don\u2019t change a great deal.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000548\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EIt\u2019s the substantive changes that really worry us. Let me deal with one of them first, with the use of alternative fiscal indicators. That\u2019s a cover for the Minister introducing her new measure of operating balance before gains and losses, excluding ACC revenue and expenses, so she could fudge what she was doing over these years, given that this Minister, instead of coming in and restoring New Zealand\u2019s finances, as she promised, has actually spent more than was spent by the previous Government, has added more to debt, and is going in the wrong direction. It\u2019s very frustrating that in order to justify that, she has introduced these alternative fiscal indicators and used them to cover up her own mistakes.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000549\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EBut the real problem we have with this bill, the real reason as to why we are so deeply opposed to it, is because it removes wellbeing budgeting from what the Government is required to report on. It says that the Government is no longer required to report on the wellbeing of New Zealanders.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000550\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ELook, here\u2019s why it is important that we contribute, that we try to measure overall wellbeing. When we get the annual Budget every year, when we get the financial statements, when we get the projections, people read the words in a narrative, they read the stories. They try to understand what the Government is doing, not through the bare numbers on the page but through the goals that the Government is setting for itself in terms of how New Zealanders will be better off\u2014and I don\u2019t mean better off in terms of the dollars and cents, although obviously they are important, but New Zealanders being better off in terms of being able to live a life well lived with choices well chosen because they are choices that enrich a person\u2019s life. That\u2019s what wellbeing budgeting is about.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000551\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EThe thing is that there\u2019s a whole field of economic work around wellbeing. It\u2019s worth reminding members on that side of the House that when gross domestic product was first introduced as an economic measure, it was deeply contested\u2014no one understood what it was about; it didn\u2019t seem to carry any economic weight. It took a long time of it being used and being understood and being deployed in Government accounting and in Government budgeting for people to grasp why it was worth considering. But, even then, gross domestic product is a deeply contested measure.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000552\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EThat\u2019s something that one of the more revered former members of this House worked on when she was here: Dame Professor Dr Marilyn Waring, who came into this House and realised, when she was on what was then, I think, the Public Finance Committee\u2014the equivalent of today\u2019s Finance and Expenditure Committee\u2014in terms of what Government was accounting for, that there were great and enormous gaps in what was being accounted, stuff that just didn\u2019t make it into the Government\u2019s books but what mattered. Famously, she found that women\u2019s work didn\u2019t register in the Government\u2019s accounting for what was going on. The hours and hours, the work of childcare that women do, the huge amounts of housework that women do\u2014we\u2019re talking back in the 1970s, so there were different social structures in place. One of the things that Dame Professor Dr Marilyn Waring set out to do was to include some of those measures in the public finance statements. The easiest way to do it is to fix the measure of gross domestic product. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000553\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EAs she left this House, she went on to do really significant work worldwide in that space\u2014her famous book, \u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsCharacterItalics\u0022\u003ECounting for Nothing\u003C/span\u003E. I think it\u2019s got particular relevance right at the moment, not just in terms of the wellbeing budgeting, which has now gone from this bill, but in terms of what happened last year around pay equity. Now, I really do want to talk about this because we\u2019ve just had the report from the People\u2019s Select Committee looking into what went on around the removal of pay equity, which helped the Government to balance its books\u2014well, it hasn\u2019t, actually, because they\u2019re still using their spurious measures.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000554\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EThe People\u2019s Select Committee talked about the value of women\u2014in fact, people\u2014being paid well. The value is not just the dollars and cents in the back of their pockets. It says how, in terms of labour market experience and economics\u2014now, I just want to point out that this particular select committee, the People\u2019s Select Committee, was chaired by Dame Professor Marilyn Waring. Looking at the labour market experience and economics, she says that there\u2019s a whole set of findings that drew on submitters\u2019 lived experiences to show how the structure of New Zealand\u2019s labour market systematically undervalues and underpays work in publicly funded female-dominated sectors such as health, disability support, and education. It talks about the impacts that has on the lives that people live, the stress it creates, the stretch on family budgets, the inability to be able to pay for children\u2019s wider activities. Now, those are the sorts of things that are captured by wellbeing budgeting, but now it\u2019s not being measured.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000555\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EThe thing about having that wellbeing budgeting in place was it ensured that Government Ministers thought about those matters, that they thought about the wider consequences of their plans, that it wasn\u2019t just in terms of dollars and cents. Now, I know, Madam Speaker\u2014and I\u2019m sure you know too and people who\u2019ve sat in this House for many years\u2014that Government Ministers of course consider those things. The point about the wellbeing budgeting was it required Government Ministers to do it in systematic ways and to report on it, and that enables New Zealanders to understand much, much better what Governments are trying to achieve for them.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000556\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EI guess I find it really disturbing that this work on wellbeing budgeting has just been set aside. Now, as it turns out, Treasury has a series of living standards indicators which we\u2019ll keep on measuring. So we still have that information available to us, but it\u2019s not secured.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000557\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EIf I give an analogy here\u2014and it\u2019s something that the Minister lauded herself on in terms of this bill\u2014let\u2019s go to the tax expenditure statement. The Minister made a great deal of the fact that from now on, in the annual Budgets, the annual financial statements, we\u2019re going to require a tax expenditure statement. Now, that\u2019s where there are special rules in the tax system that create reductions in revenue and expenditure that particularly favour one group of people or create a special category of rules. The bloodstock write-down rates are a classic example of an item that appears in the tax expenditure statement. The thing is, I know that those bloodstock write-down rules appear in a tax expenditure statement, because Inland Revenue has been preparing and presenting a tax expenditure statement for many, many years. There was no need to legislate for it to be presented and prepared, but the Minister thought it was necessary; she said, \u201CThe information\u2019s there, but I\u2019m going to make sure we report on it.\u201D That was exactly the logic for the wellbeing budgeting. The information was there, but we were going to make sure we report on it and make sure that we worked towards it. So it seems the logic goes in one direction for the tax expenditure statement and the other direction for the wellbeing budgeting.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000558\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EIt\u2019s a sad day. That work on wellbeing budgeting, it was world-leading. It had a long way to go, just like the development of GDP as a figure that\u2019s used in budgeting and in understanding a country\u2019s finances took a great deal of time to work on as a measure, to solidify it, to really understand how it worked\u2014it took repeated efforts\u2014wellbeing budgeting was starting. It needed work. It was going to get that work. We were at the start of a journey, not the end. And now it\u2019s been stopped. What a wretched day.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\u003Ca name=\u0022member\u0022 data-type=\u0022article\u0022 data-memberid=\u00226710095aa1204b3793448571c208ccd4\u0022 data-id=\u0022fc739df892de170e434f6ffad8f0c5bf\u0022\u003E\u003C/a\u003E\u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000559\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226710095aa1204b3793448571c208ccd4\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsByToc\u0022 id=\u0022fc739df892de170e434f6ffad8f0c5bf\u0022\u003EHon JULIE ANNE GENTER (Green\u2014Rongotai) (17:53)\u003C/span\u003E: T\u0113n\u0101 koe, Madam Speaker. T\u0113n\u0101 koutou e te Whare. So there\u2019s some very minor amendments in this bill that actually could be a good thing, and I\u2019ll talk about those first\u2014that is, introducing more specific disclosure requirements for the statement of specific fiscal risks. So Treasury has to provide an estimate of the fiscal impact of each specific fiscal risk. This is something we\u2019re broadly supportive of. Indeed, my colleague and co-leader Chl\u00F6e Swarbrick has been doing a lot of work to get the Treasury and the Government to quantify the fiscal risk of not meeting our climate obligations, for example, because, if we started accounting for that, we might understand that there is a cost to it.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000560\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EAnother example of fiscal risk would be in the roads of so-called national significance, which we now know, thanks to the report in the National Infrastructure Plan, that a whole bunch of them are totally un-fundable and the Government has no plan to pay for them. If their plan is to sign up to public-private partnerships and lock in future Governments to paying back exorbitant loans at extra-high interest rates, that will have to be disclosed. So at least we would understand the fiscal risks and, hopefully, we would understand the risks of not maintaining our assets and our infrastructure. That\u2019s been a major problem over decades. I know the member Simon Court will agree with me that we need to get much better at asset management and asset registers.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000561\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EPresumably, what happened with the under-investment in our health assets\u2014for example, in the National Infrastructure Plan\u2014is we see that we\u2019re going to have a need for more hospitals, more healthcare; our hospitals are in a shocking state. That specific fiscal risk I don\u2019t think was accurately on Treasury\u2019s books. It\u2019s possible that some of the classical tools that were used to constrain Government spending, like the capital charge for district health boards, actually discouraged them from making capital investments where they were meant to. So I think that is a sensible change.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000562\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EOverall, we\u2019re not going to support the bill, largely for the same reasons that the Labour member spoke to, which are that it is kind of like a silly vice-signalling move to repeal the wellbeing objectives from the Public Finance Act. I think all New Zealanders know that Government\u2019s not spending or saving money just for the sake of it; the whole point of what we\u2019re doing here together\u2014whether it\u2019s at a local government level or central government level\u2014is trying to invest in things that we can all benefit from. Many people\u2014I\u2019d say most people in New Zealand\u2014actually want to leave this place in a better state for future generations. That\u2019s not something that is accounted for in the Government books at all.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000563\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ESo you could have, supposedly, Government balancing the books, but, at the same time, we\u2019ve got a huge social deficit. We have a very large, unacceptable number\u2014I mean, really, any number is too many\u2014of children living in poverty. That\u2019s a social deficit. It\u2019s going to cost us in the long term as a society if we don\u2019t address that. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000564\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EWe have an environmental deficit, we\u2019re losing biodiversity rapidly in most parts of the country outside of Wellington, where life is coming back thanks to a concerted effort. Our soil health is not good in a lot of places, and our freshwater quality is even worse. We have issues with our marine environment, overfishing, bottom trawling, and then the issue of all our urban development not having adequate wastewater treatment facilities, which are now failing as well.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000565\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ESo we\u2019ve got all these deficits. I think the whole concept, even if it wasn\u2019t perfectly executed\u2014and I would argue that there would be better ways to approach it\u2014if we don\u2019t measure something, we\u2019re not going to be able to take action on it. It\u2019s not just what the Government is spending; we\u2019re not counting these huge liabilities we have in the future. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000566\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EThe Hon Dr Deborah Russell mentioned that pay equity is a perfect example of that. So we know that female-dominated professions that do really vitally important caring work that enables our society to thrive have been systematically undervalued over decades. We thought all the parties in the House, except the ACT Party, were supporting moves to change that in 2020 when we put a new process into the Equal Pay Act to help people achieve pay equity. That\u2019s about making sure people are being paid and valued properly for the important work they do, like being early childhood teachers, like being nurses or midwives. We know that those professions were undervalued because of sex-based discrimination. The only way we\u2019re going to solve that is by having an evidence-based approach to solving it. The law change that we made in 2020 was supported by Business New Zealand and the unions and Government and, indeed, by the National Party. But once they got into Government, it was just inconvenient, because the truth is we haven\u2019t been paying those professions enough, and they are mostly publicly funded. \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000567\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ESo what does that mean? If we want to have enough aged-care workers, if we want to have enough disability carers, if we want to have enough early childhood teachers\u2014and all of those things, I think, are very, very important for New Zealand to function as a society\u2014then we\u2019re going to have to pay them more, otherwise they\u2019re all going to leave and go to Australia. The Government unceremoniously took at least $16 billion away from people in those professions and said, \u201CSorry, you\u2019re not worth it. We\u2019re going to spend that money in other ways.\u201D \u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000568\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EThe whole idea that is prevalent on the Government side of the benches and right-wing - thinking people is that somehow Government spending is always bad, and private sector is always good. But there are a lot of really important public sector things that will not be met by the private market, and if we want to address it, we have to invest in it. In order to do that, we need to have a revenue strategy to make sure\u2014and, happily, there are lots of tools out there to have a fairer revenue strategy that would raise more revenue. We are in the bottom half of the OECD for raising revenue through taxation.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000569\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ESo we are not taxing the wealthy enough at all, and that is eroding other people\u2019s living standards. It\u2019s actually a transfer of wealth from ordinary working people\u2014Pasifika people, M\u0101ori people, women\u2014who do the less-desirable jobs, the harder jobs, the ones who get up in the middle of the night to deliver babies or who are wiping the bums of elderly and disabled, who are cleaners, who are the admin and clerical workers that enable our hospitals to function. They\u2019re doing that work and we have a transfer of wealth from all of their hard work\u2014the ones looking after our tamariki in the early childhood education centres\u2014to the wealthiest people. That\u2019s what our tax system is currently allowing, and it\u2019s actually really bad for growth. If we actually wanted economic growth, we would want to ensure that the benefits of all the work going on in society were more fairly shared and not trapped by a smaller and smaller number of people who own all the assets and who Government and the ordinary public are now indebted to.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000570\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003ENow, I know this is a very confusing, difficult topic for members opposite, because they think they know everything\u2014especially Minister of Finance Nicola Willis. We can tell every time she talks to us, she thinks she knows everything\u2014you know, her debating experience and her English literature degree mean that she understands everything about the economy! But, actually, she really doesn\u2019t. She doesn\u2019t understand the first thing. She\u2019s just here to make excuses for every bad decision that her Government has made. We need to hold her to account. She\u2019s the reason we don\u2019t have brand-new ferries arriving that would be fuel-efficient, that would actually enable freight and people to keep moving across the Cook Strait, which is now being disrupted\u2014supply chains disrupted today, next week, and probably for the next three years. She\u2019s the reason why 33 claims that had been worked on for years\u2014while she and Brooke van Velden and ACT and the coalition of bros, who are quite happy to subjugate everyone else, are the reason why people are going to continue to be underpaid in essential professions.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000571\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220838e5f9bac748d2a59aea595e5226a0\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022cc2cea65f63629872bd13a56bd1f8e63\u0022\u003ESimon Court\u003C/span\u003E: This is good. This is good content for us.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000572\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226710095aa1204b3793448571c208ccd4\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00223c8d5f3a2c261d0cedbe61ed89677479\u0022\u003EHon JULIE ANNE GENTER\u003C/span\u003E: It is; it\u2019s good, because ordinary people are waking up to the fact that this Government is acting in the interests of its rich mates and some ideologues\u2014and, in the case of New Zealand First, some conspiracy theory \u201Ccookers\u201D\u2014and not acting in the interests of all New Zealanders, the long-term interests, making sure the firefighters get the equipment they need to work. They\u2019re doing this because they don\u2019t understand; or they\u2019re beholden to donors; I don\u2019t know what it is. Maybe they\u2019re just incompetent. But, luckily, we have an election later this year and we can choose something much more sensible and long term.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000573\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00220838e5f9bac748d2a59aea595e5226a0\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022364332e82c42bd79266d9623f98960b9\u0022\u003ESimon Court\u003C/span\u003E: Madam Speaker, point of order. Madam Speaker, that member has imputed that some members of the House on the Government side are beholden to donors, which suggests that we cannot be trusted to make independent decisions. I would just ask that you\u2019d suggest that member withdraw and apologise. It\u2019s unacceptable.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000574\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00224cf6752dabf34d0eb8ae92457823e4ba\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u00227cfb43b6f77d0bdc9bdc289b101a81fe\u0022\u003EDEPUTY SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: Look, I know that\u2019s a statement that we don\u2019t make in the House, but there were a lot of \u201Cmaybes\u201D going on there. I don\u2019t think there was any actual accusation. So we just need to be careful about how we say it, and I think the member probably framed it in a way that she got away with it this time. So she has six seconds left if she has anything else she wishes to further say.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000575\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00226710095aa1204b3793448571c208ccd4\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022741106e9d57a01b2fe73d5438d4abacf\u0022\u003EHon JULIE ANNE GENTER\u003C/span\u003E: I look forward to changing the Government later this year, to one that cares about our people.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000576\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsNormal\u0022 id=\u00224cf6752dabf34d0eb8ae92457823e4ba\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsBy\u0022 id=\u0022d2066a2a207504647685efeef6761baf\u0022\u003EDEPUTY SPEAKER\u003C/span\u003E: This debate is interrupted and is set down for resumption next sitting day. The House is adjourned until 2 p.m. on Tuesday, 24 March 2025.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000577\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003EDebate interrupted.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n      \u003Cp id=\u0022id20260312846e8195fe900ded60000578\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022HpsItem\u0022\u003E\u003Cspan class=\u0022CharacterBoldCentred\u0022\u003EThe House adjourned at 6.04 p.m.\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/span\u003E\u003C/p\u003E\n    \u003C/div\u003E\n  \u003C/body\u003E\n\u003C/html\u003E"